# AMD Ryzen Threadripper Owners Club - 1950X | 1920X | 1900X



## Particle

If you own an AMD Threadripper processor, by all means make it known by *sending me a private message* with your processor and motherboard models.

*AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X*
Cores: 16
Threads: 32
Base Clock: 3.4 GHz
Turbo Clock: 4.0 GHz
XFR Clock: 4.2 GHz
Cache: 41.5 MiB
Memory Channels: 4
ECC Support: Yes
PCIe 3.0: 64 lanes
TDP: 180 watts
Code Name: Whitehaven
Launch Date: 2017-08-10
Launch MSRP: $999

*AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1920X*
Cores: 12
Threads: 24
Base Clock: 3.5 GHz
Turbo Clock: 4.0 GHz
XFR Clock: 4.2 GHz
Cache: 39.125 MiB
Memory Channels: 4
ECC Support: Yes
PCIe 3.0: 64 lanes
TDP: 180 watts
Code Name: Whitehaven
Launch Date: 2017-08-10
Launch MSRP: $799

*AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1900X*
Cores: 8
Threads: 16
Base Clock: 3.8 GHz
Turbo Clock: 4.0 GHz
XFR Clock: 4.2 GHz
Cache: 20.75 MiB
Memory Channels: 4
ECC Support: Yes
PCIe 3.0: 64 lanes
TDP: 180 watts
Code Name: Whitehaven
Launch Date: 2017-08-31
Launch MSRP: $549

Note: I apologize for the stupid formatting used in the table below, but the forum software change has munged my ability to continue to use the old table format.

*Owners List*
*Owner........... CPU..... Motherboard.................... Date.....*
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Particle..........1950X....MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2017-08-17
Solarion..........1950X....MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2017-08-17
springs113........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-08-17
ht_addict.........1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2017-08-17
----------------------------------------------------------------------
farcodev..........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-08-17
lifeisshort117....1920X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-08-18
ChronoBodi........1950X....MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2017-08-26
DeviousAddict.....1920X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2017-08-27
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fantasy...........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-08-28
ajc9988...........1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2017-08-28
Metuz.............1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-08-29
FlanK3r...........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-08-29
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sandbo............1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2017-08-30
joeybuddy96.......1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2017-09-01
dburd48778........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-09-04
deadspeedv........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-09-07
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Machiyariko.......1900X....ASUS Prime X399-A................2017-09-09
HeliosDoubleSix...1950X....MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2017-09-10
J-S-Q.............1920X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2017-09-11
Ronsanut..........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-09-14
----------------------------------------------------------------------
slipsand..........1900X....MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2017-09-14
Bm514.............1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2017-09-16
Simmons572........1900X....ASUS Prime X399-A................2017-09-22
Emkq..............1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-09-25
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Atomicat..........1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2017-09-25
Turok916..........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-10-07
ITAngel...........1920X....ASRock X399 Professional Gaming..2017-10-12
oxijex............1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2017-10-15
----------------------------------------------------------------------
sleeper119........1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2017-10-26
Sphere07..........1950X....MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2017-10-30
johnzpa...........1900X....ASUS Prime X399-A................2017-11-19
ohms..............1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-11-25
----------------------------------------------------------------------
delerious.........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-11-25
mypickaxe.........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-11-28
4Strings..........1900X....ASUS Prime X399-A................2017-11-29
Dominican.........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-12-01
----------------------------------------------------------------------
illirio...........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2017-12-08
Ricky Bobby.......1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2017-12-20
BMG238............1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2017-12-27
OrionBG...........1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2018-01-18
----------------------------------------------------------------------
KyadCK............1950X....Gigabyte X399 Designare..........2018-01-31
Arne Saknussemm...1920X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2018-02-15
alienalvan........1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2018-02-28
blaket6199........1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2018-03-02
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Archea47..........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2018-03-18
cbehrend..........1950X....ASUS Prime X399-A................2018-04-24
Yamie.............1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2018-05-22
bozfish...........1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2018-06-09
----------------------------------------------------------------------
papadoc...........1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2018-06-21
EnderValentine....1950X....ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2018-06-28
jepz..............1920X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2018-07-09
OsmiumOC..........1950X....ASUS ROG Strix X399-E Gaming.....2018-07-18
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Offler............1900X....ASRock X399M Taichi..............2018-09-01
ridn3y............1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7.....2018-09-05
tman480...........1900X....ASRock X399 Professional Gaming..2018-11-26
venura............1920X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2018-12-05
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Quadrixx..........1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Extreme......2019-01-15
NovaExclusives....2990WX...MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2019-01-24
TheMadHerbalist...1950X....Gigabyte X399 Aorus Extreme......2019-01-25
Andy Fox..........1950X....ASRock X399 Professional Gaming..2019-08-07
----------------------------------------------------------------------
HuggyBear.........1950X....MSI MEG X399 Creation............2019-08-14
Mektor............1950X....ASRock X399 Taichi...............2019-08-14
Mag the Ripper....2990WX...ASUS X399 ROG Zenith Extreme.....2019-09-06
Particle..........2990WX...MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon AC....2019-11-09


*Air Coolers (Dedicated Designs)*
*Brand......... Model.............. Size............. MSRP* 
-----------------------------------------------------------
Arctic.........Freezer 33 TR........120 mm PWM........ 48..
Cooler Master..MA621P...............120 mm P/P PWM.... 65..
Noctua.........NH-U14S TR4-SP3......140 mm PWM........ 80..
Noctua.........NH-U12S TR4-SP3......120 mm PWM........ 70..
Noctua.........NH-U9 TR4-SP3........92 mm P/P PWM......70..
X2.............Eclipse Advanced 992 120 mm PWM........ 45..


*Socket TR4 Motherboards*
Brand...... Model....................... MSRP. Now.. Year
---------------------------------------------------------
ASRock......X399 Professional Gaming.....440.. 440...2017
ASRock......X399 Taichi..................340.. 350...2017
ASRock......X399M Taichi.................340.. 340...2017
ASUS........Prime X399-A.................350.. 300...2017
ASUS........ROG Strix X399-E Gaming......399.. 350...2017
ASUS........X399 ROG Zenith Extreme......550.. 500...2017
Gigabyte....X399 Aorus Extreme...........450.. 430...2018
Gigabyte....X399 Aorus Gaming 7..........390.. 360...2017
Gigabyte....X399 Designare EX............400.. 397...2018
MSI.........MEG X399 Creation............500.. EOL...2018
MSI.........X399 Gaming Pro Carbon AC....350.. 340...2017
MSI.........X399 SLI Plus................320.. 320...2018
​


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## Dyson Poindexter

Looking forward to seeing some builds!


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## ht_addict

Just picked up my 1950x. Ordered my EKWB CPU Block. Waiting on motherboard to come to local dealer. Then I'll post pics of my build.

Motherboard is in, CPU installed. Just need my waterblock.


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## KingBob77

Just got the email yesterday from Newegg that my 1920X has been shipped along with the MSI X399 motherboard. Figured since I am now a Threadripper owner it was time to join Overclock.net... can't wait to try overclocking on this thing.


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## DrakkarCA1980

ThreadRipper 1950X _initially_ was a nightmare for me... This is somewhat long - but if you like reading a good real life computer story - read it. If you guy's want the pictures... I'll dig up the pictures.. But to me it's like seeing a murder scene. I want to look away, I have no interest in seeing it...

I got my 1950X a few days ago and have it in a temporary case for 'proving' (making sure theres no defective parts). The CPU installation was a nightmare, bloody nightmare and I almost began to cry - i did the unthinkable, the unimaginable. I patiently got things ready on the motherboard and CPU (I wore medical grade gloves so I didn't even get fingerprints on anything, I was paranoid)... I have high intensity LED light mast overhead blaring at full power and taking photos of every step. As I slid the CPU into the bracket very slowly - one of the sides of the orange cartridge thing was not fully in place inside the metal lip of the bracket. Gently, slowly slid it in further... Then the CPU fell through... and smashed a patch of the pins on the LGA socket and bent them...







... I jumped up and started telling myself 'no no no no no no'.... when I saw the smashed patch of pins... I turned away and almost started balling







not looking at the motherboard on my desk I took so much patient time to prepare... I watched all the YouTube videos, and read all the websites explaining how to do this properly. I didn't rush anything. This was a $500 motherboard I just destroyed. Never saw 1 day of use. My bloodpressure started to rise fast, and I was flushed with anxiety. I was so ashamed of myself.

I build small circuit boards (mainly FM radio's) as a hobby and working with ultra fine connections has crossed me a few times so I own a 2000x microscope for this with a live HD camera hooked into my monitor... I knew what I had to do... The unsullied motherboard, will be sullied - I was going to bend all the pins back and attempt the unthinkable. When the CPU fell, upon impact the inertia drug the CPU into a patch of pins and inverted several.My initial fear was bending them back would break them off. The pins are too small to see with the naked eye normally because of the rows and rows causes optical illusions with your eyes eveuntally. Under the scope the pins individually look like your arm from the elbow to your hand. Imagine holding an apple out in front of you with your hand out flat. From your elbow to the hand is each pin and at the top (the palm) of each one is a rounded dollop to make contact with the CPU. Take that same hand now, and put it to your face with your had over your mouth. That's how bent many pins were.

Over the period of a couple hours and PAINSTAKINGLY bent each pin SLOWLY under the scope, each bend I expected the contact point to snap off. There so fragile. A few were bent SIDEWAYS. I found the best tool ultimately was a toothpick. Somewhat too big at time's, it was soft enough to absorb any hard edges but not leave any residue, and also did not scratch the contacts. The sideways bends I did a gentle tug-tug-tug against the pin as to not bend it too much. Nothing broke! I was down to the last, and worst bent pin - all was looking good so far and the pin's metal did not fatigue as I thought it would - they were a lot more resilient than I expected! Feeling the tautness and flexibility of the metal I believe it to be gold plated nickel. I was still wearing gloves and would frequently (gently) graze my finger along the pins in the direction that they lead (so I didnt bend anymore!) and I could feel a few rough bumps. I pushed down gently until the bumps were out. Now this last pin.. Honestly I was shaking... I didn't want to bend it, I could barely see the proper angle because of the light reflecting back into the scope was casting shadows. I had to re-assess the bend over and over... It was horrible. It looked like your arm and your making a fist, and aim your fist at your face like your going to punch your own face. The hand of the pin was bent completely back, the arm was inverted and warped... Remember the proper angle was like your holding and apple with a flat palm out in front of you. The palm would be the part that contacted the CPU.

I didn't pay for this motherboard or CPU - it was a gift from my significant other who is going on a family trip to Europe. I had a lot of problems with my i7 4930K and the Asus Sabertooth x79 developed in 2011 it was currently living in. They (the significant other) heard me rant here and there about it and decided to get me my dream PC for staying behind and watching the puppies and chickens we own. I had so many problems with that motherboard. Asus abandon it with a BETA BIOS that never fully worked and you had to reset the bios frequently to get it going like an old VW Bug. It worked when you did a certain thing to it every time and you had to keep doing that but you were sick and fed up with the random chance that it didn't want to work with you on any particular day.

The LAST Pin...
I was having such a hard time seeing proper angles, rotating the motherboard around on my desk to see the exact bend. I needed to see this because if I had a chance to bend it back - it would be only one opportunity to bend it. If I bent it too much I would need to bend this pin back and fatigue it more - it would surely break. I spent about 10 minutes examining this last little bastard. Every possible angle it could move with opposing angular force. With that toothpick... I nudged it gently here, gently there. The last swipe over the top to bend the flat top back! DONE! I pressed my finger against the top of the patch of pins again and stroke them feeling for height irregularities - some felt a little too high... I pressed down with my finger just enough to balance out the pins that were too high and it felt right. Putting the board under the scope again I looked..... It was nearly flawless! No broken pins and all rows had the same distance between each other, nothing was off canter.

Putting the CPU back in the carriage, sliding it in and feeling the bump that it was placed correctly I laid it down. Then tightened each screw a little around the clock, never tightening a single screw all the way on the first try. Little by little the ThreadRipper 1950X was torqued into place..... The time was to power it up and see .... I preyed to God this worked because I didn't know what I was going to do... I pressed the power button, light's lit up on the motherboard, no errors on the LED readout... My monitor turned on showing the Gigabyte Aorus Eagle logo on the Gaming 7 motherboard. Thank you God! Thank you! I yelled. I couldn't believe it... I did it. Everything seems to always fail for me, always.. But today, this time, right now... It worked.

Typing this on 8-18-2017 @ 12:13AM here in Redding, California this was 3 days ago. As patient and careful as I was. As slow and gentle as I could be - MISTAKES STILL HAPPEN. Nobody is perfect. _This is my ThreadRipper story_ and I won't ever forget it







. Its running great! I've OC'ed all cores stable at 1.25v to 3.8GHz (this is temporary I plan on leaving it stock ... for now!).

In the end it just stresses the resilience of the AMD platform and why we need to continue supporting it. Intel may still have faster CPU's for $8,000 but these little firecrackers and their motherboards are in it for the long haul. Gigabyte won a new long-term-customer.

My Hardware:
CPU: AMD ThreadRipper 1950X
Mobo: Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7
RAM: G.Skill DDR4 2400 RGB 32GB (8x4 quad channel)
GPU: Two Sapphire Nitro+ 8GB RX480's (crossfire)

EDIT: UPDATE
Today is the 10 day anniversary of my installation! I am happy to announce it's still kicking butt and overclocking great! I've tortured this CPU with PRIME95 and other software to see if any thermal changes causes adverse problems and I haven't had any. Also - the LGA socket protector CANNOT be left in when the CPU is installed because it's installed literally in the bracket the CPU needs to go inside.

I attached the image of the last pin. Look at it zoomed in. Every pin around that one was also bent (at least 6 of them).


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## Particle

I liked your installation story. My first thought after doing my own installation this week was, "A non-trivial number of people are going to destroy this socket."

In my case, I had inserted the cartridge into the carrier frame, removed the protector over the socket, and then went to close the carrier frame. It was when I was maybe half an inch away from fully closing the frame that I noticed, "Hmm, that doesn't look quite right. The hole in the orange cartridge barely clears screw #1. Is it not supposed to be centered?" As it turned out, the cartridge was still about an eighth of an inch from being fully inserted but at that point had presented enough resistance that it had _felt_ fully inserted. I had to force the cartridge down to the bottom of the frame. After doing so I was nervous about powering the thing on since there isn't any way to really see that the package is aligned correctly unlike previous LGA sockets. For all I knew the cartridge could be slightly misaligned and have just mashed the entire socket full of pins when I tightened the mounting screws.

When I powered it on, the POST reporter flashed through tons and tons of codes but after 20 seconds or so I still had no video. It seemed like the POST reporter was looping through a long sequence with the same codes appearing over and over. Disappointed, I turned it off. I did happen to notice that right as I did so, my monitor went from amber power saving to green active mode--and then it stuck there. Had the system truly given it a video signal at the last moment? Had the monitor just kicked on when the system turned off due to a power saving detection glitch? That would be plausible since voltages on the cable could have fluctuated when powering down. I've certainly seen it before on old monitors like the one I was using when using old display methods like I was--usually VGA, though I was using DVI. I tried again. After about 5-10 seconds, the monitor kicked on and the system was happily going through POST.

I wasn't thrilled with the TR4 socket installation experience.

On a side note: Your story I think illustrates why the installation video from MSI that I watched showed them inserting the processor cartridge _before_ removing the socket pin cover. I don't remember if I did it in that order or not, but knowing what I do now and having read your own story I would strongly advise anyone to do the installation in that order.


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## Solarion

..


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## tarot

Well i am up and running all AMD all DAY









1950x kellyrippa
32 gig Gskill flarex 3200c14
asrock Taichi x399
Corsair H115i cooler with twin EK Varder 2K fans(only spinning at 1k most of the time)
grizzly kryonaut BIG HUGE BLOB on the Z method
Corsair RM1000(bulletproof PSU
XFX Vega 64 8 gig
corsair 750 case
Samsung evo 850 500 gig ssd
couple of mechanicals and a blu ray drive.

that's it.
My build story is easy, all things arrived stripped the Baymax asus and 1800x out.
installed the cpu to the board(and i have to say it is the easiest cpu i have ever done.
3 2 1 pop pull levers pop up and pop out cartridge
place threadripper cartridge in push in till click lower down and push gently till clicks.
turn screw one till it bites.
push and turn screw 2 till it bites push turn screw 3 till it bites

torque screw one torque screw 2 torque screw 3.

big blob on Z throw the cooler on and tighten in pattern make sure it is as even as you can.

throw the rest of the gear in fire it up
first boot straight into bios.
set fans up set ram to xmp/doscp

reboot
windows download and setup drivers and download latest bios
reboot to bios flash bios reboot reset up ram and fans.

enjoy









some pics.










some 3dmark and vega results with comparisons and some rough power and temp readings for the vega.
Quote:


> [/81/86 max temp
> 270watts
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/2236031/spy/2235732
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13384371/fs/13383862
> 
> 83 degees
> 257 watts
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13384411/fs/13383895
> 83 degrees
> 277 watts
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/sd/4781045/sd/4780989
> 
> 231 watts
> 78 deg
> 
> ps vs bal vs turbo
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/sd/4781051/sd/4781045/sd/4780989
> 
> 66 degrees
> 250 watts
> 
> overclocked 1680 and 1000 on ram
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/2236134/spy/2236031
> 
> temp 90deg
> 282 watts QUOTE]


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## Solarion

..


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## ocvn

4G, 1.325V... testing with bykski block, ambient 25


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## Solarion

..


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## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Sweet! Was wondering how that block would stack up. What's your loop setup look like? ...rad, pump, fans?


Monsta 480 push-pull 8 fans 1500 rpm > pump D5 +resevor > block.


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## springs113

Just a sneak...using the 503 beta bios on the rog.


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## LiquidHaus

What's up guys.

Figured since I haven't joined an owners club in a while, the Threadripper club would be the one to join up with since this product is huge in every way.

I'll let some photos do the talking but I also have some info to hand out.

As my system currently sits, I was able to achieve a stable overclock on my 1920X at 4.1ghz at 1.33v.

On the Asus Zenith Extreme, I set the CPU power delivery settings from Standard, to Optimized, also with a 110% power rating for VRM and CPU.

This occasionally bumps the 1.33v to 1.35v, to which I've seen it occasionally bump up to during burn in tests. It's actually the voltage it was at in the screenshot I took.

For cooling, I normally run a full custom loop for most systems I build for myself, reviews, and other people. But with the lack of waterblocks available to the market, I had to resort to making what I had, work.

I had a Corsair H110i GT with a dead pump sitting around and I figured I could rip it apart and build it into my custom loop. Unfortunately the impeller within the AIO head is also the seal, so it literally cut my flow in half, but with two D5 pumps, it's still more than sufficient.

Being that the H110i GT head isn't an Asetek style mount, I had to improvise. With info I gathered from Tom's Hardware, I found out that the cooler mounting threads on the TR bracket are M3.5. A very strange thread size and one you can't normally find at a hardware store. Luckily, the RC car manufacturer HPI has a screw set that is perfect for this situation.

Utilizing some corner braces that I got at Home Depot, I was able to use those by cutting them at the corner, and using the flat parts of the brace as a bridge from the AIO bracket, to the TR bracket.

The mount is perfect, and so is the thermal paste spread over the IHS. I would even go as far as saying it's better than the current Asetek round style paste spread.

Factoring in the +27c offset, under full load with 4.1ghz at 1.33-1.35v, temps sit at around 45c.

Absolutely fantastic. The 1920X is a beast and in my opinion, the best bang for your buck out of the three SKUs.

Okay! Now it is photo dump time.









(then I got my actual camera out)










If you guys have any questions, let me know and I'll be happy to answer them as best I can.


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## springs113

If you update the bios to the 503 beta, the offset values are fixed. my cpu generally idles around 35c with an ambient of around 27c. This is using a Corsair h100i v2.


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## DrakkarCA1980

You are exactly right - I should have *never* removed the cap first ...but... There was a sticker on the CPU cap that says to 'Slide out the external cap before sliding in the carrier frame with CPU' Im looking at it now. I took this as though I should remove this cap







I believe my i7 2011 socket you placed the CPU in and as you lower the latch the cap automatically pop's out. Either way the pins are exposed as well on the intel too. I have the picture of the devil pin (the last one)... I was looking at it and how the hell I got it un-bent, a miracle... I attached the pictures of the moment just before the CPU fell down - and the picture of the last pin.




edit: misspelled i7 as 17


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## springs113

I may have a bad board again, first was bent pins second maybe memory slot. I can't get a post using 4 dimm slots at all. I rushed order 2 dif speeds n manufacturer of replacement ram but won't know til Sunday if it's my board. I hope not.


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## Solarion

..


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## DrakkarCA1980

Were you able to get into UEFI BIOS at all? I had ram problems initially too and my ram was JDEC compliant (2400MHz). If so, does it show the correct amount of ram? Have you tested each stick individually to eliminate bad ram as an issue? I know all x399 board makers are going to be rushing some hot fix bios's - Gigbyte just released one for the Aorus Gaming 7 to fix ram speeds defaulting to 2133. My BIOS would reset itself to stock values whenever I set it to use the XMP profile - that got fixed about 4 days ago. For your _initial_ setup make sure you keep FAST BOOT off. Your likely going to be rebooting a lot and going into the bios quite a bit. On other platforms ive seen vanishing ram when changing video cards ect. where half a bank would just not work. Resetting the BIOS with the jumper will force the BIOS to retrain itself and recognize ram that may have been overlooked. This was a glitch on Asus bio's for a bit that was related to fast boot. Just a thought.


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## Jbravo33

havent had a ton of time to play around and im temporarily on a 120 aio... yikes. so far


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## trippinonprozac

Great work guys! Whatching with great interest! Want to see some 3dmark benchmarks overclocked!

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


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## farcodev

First bench with my Aorus / 1950X @3.7Ghz. I'm pretty noob so I just put the multiplier @ 3.7Ghz + 1.25 VCORE
I just found strange that my VID is @ 1.55V since my VCORE is 1.236V








HWiNFO64 display the same thing



With AIDA64 - Stress Test, I'm a pretty happy camper, especially when I see my 3930K @ 4.2Ghz thermal enveloppe for comparison


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## Solarion

..


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## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Vcore reporting seems to hop around a lot with lower settings on the MSI Carbon as well...though I don't recall seeing 1.55v...that'd have gotten my attention. Probably something to do with AMD's SenseMI implementation. The goofy VID fluctuations seem to go away above 3.7Ghz...at least on my setup.


Yeah I didn't liked it much.
Anyway in the end I will not OC it, it's good enough for me as it is. 140-160W more @ 3.7Ghz for a bump in processing...

But interesting CPU for sure.


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## DaNiJ3L

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Well i am up and running all AMD all DAY
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1950x kellyrippa
> 32 gig Gskill flarex 3200c14
> asrock Taichi x399
> Corsair H115i cooler with twin EK Varder 2K fans(only spinning at 1k most of the time)
> grizzly kryonaut BIG HUGE BLOB on the Z method
> Corsair RM1000(bulletproof PSU
> XFX Vega 64 8 gig
> corsair 750 case
> Samsung evo 850 500 gig ssd
> couple of mechanicals and a blu ray drive.
> 
> ]


hey man. any chance you could boot linux live cd and get us IOMMU groups on that board?

here is how to do it if unsure:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVMF#Enabling_IOMMU

tyvm in advance.


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## GuitarFreak

I'm waiting for my EK block to come in, then I can finally get it up and running!



The installation process was definitely a bit more difficult than I thought it would be. I couldn't get the #1 screw to catch when screwing it in, and it took a lot more pressure than I thought it would take to get it in. Screwed it in about a quarter turn, then the same thing with the #2 and #3 screws. Took a ton of force to get them to start threading in. All worked out in the end though, but it made me nervous when I was doing it!


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## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaNiJ3L*
> 
> hey man. any chance you could boot linux live cd and get us IOMMU groups on that board?
> 
> here is how to do it if unsure:
> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVMF#Enabling_IOMMU
> 
> tyvm in advance.


i,ll give it a shot but it has been a while sine i touched Linux









and for those overclocking voltages llc levels and temps please(along with cooling)

as for the ek vaders....no so far they have only got to 1300 and not loud at all if i decide to stretch its legs more i am pretty sure they will really crank up.
and at the momenti have the vega 64 with blower...when that cranks full it is a good 50 decibals so yeha


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaNiJ3L*
> 
> hey man. any chance you could boot linux live cd and get us IOMMU groups on that board?
> 
> here is how to do it if unsure:
> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVMF#Enabling_IOMMU
> 
> tyvm in advance.


tried knoppix 7.2 but it came up with a kernal panic things o then tried partmagic which loaded did the first one got this
Quote:


> [email protected]:~# dmesg|grep -e DMAR -e IOMMU
> [ 0.917781] AMD-Vi: IOMMU performance counters supported
> [ 0.918168] AMD-Vi: IOMMU performance counters supported
> [ 0.932062] AMD-Vi: Found IOMMU at 0000:00:00.2 cap 0x40
> [ 0.932537] AMD-Vi: Found IOMMU at 0000:40:00.2 cap 0x40
> [email protected]:~#


no idea what it means but hey i,m trying








and the next one
Quote:


> [email protected]:~# for d in /sys/kernel/iommu_groups/*/devices/*; do
> > n=${d#*/iommu_groups/*}; n=${n%%/*}
> > printf 'IOMMU Group %s ' "$n"
> > lspci -nns "${d##*/}"
> > done;
> IOMMU Group 0 00:01.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 10 01:00.0 USB controller [0c03]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43ba] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 01:00.1 SATA controller [0106]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43b6] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 01:00.2 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43b1] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 02:00.0 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43b4] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 02:04.0 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43b4] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 02:05.0 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43b4] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 02:06.0 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43b4] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 02:07.0 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:43b4] (rev 02)
> IOMMU Group 10 04:00.0 Ethernet controller [0200]: Intel Corporation I211 Gigabit Network Connection [8086:1539] (rev 03)
> IOMMU Group 10 05:00.0 Network controller [0280]: Intel Corporation Device [8086:24fb] (rev 10)
> IOMMU Group 10 06:00.0 Ethernet controller [0200]: Intel Corporation I211 Gigabit Network Connection [8086:1539] (rev 03)
> IOMMU Group 11 40:01.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 12 40:01.3 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1453]
> IOMMU Group 13 40:02.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 14 40:03.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 15 40:04.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 16 40:07.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 16 40:07.1 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1454]
> IOMMU Group 16 44:00.0 Non-Essential Instrumentation [1300]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:145a]
> IOMMU Group 16 44:00.2 Encryption controller [1080]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1456]
> IOMMU Group 16 44:00.3 USB controller [0c03]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:145c]
> IOMMU Group 17 40:08.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 17 40:08.1 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1454]
> IOMMU Group 17 45:00.0 Non-Essential Instrumentation [1300]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1455]
> IOMMU Group 17 45:00.2 SATA controller [0106]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH SATA Controller [AHCI mode] [1022:7901] (rev 51)
> IOMMU Group 18 41:00.0 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1470] (rev c1)
> IOMMU Group 19 42:00.0 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1471]
> IOMMU Group 1 00:01.1 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1453]
> IOMMU Group 20 43:00.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Device [1002:687f] (rev c1)
> IOMMU Group 21 43:00.1 Audio device [0403]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Device [1002:aaf8]
> IOMMU Group 2 00:02.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 3 00:03.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 4 00:04.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 5 00:07.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 5 00:07.1 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1454]
> IOMMU Group 5 08:00.0 Non-Essential Instrumentation [1300]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:145a]
> IOMMU Group 5 08:00.2 Encryption controller [1080]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1456]
> IOMMU Group 5 08:00.3 USB controller [0c03]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:145c]
> IOMMU Group 6 00:08.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1452]
> IOMMU Group 6 00:08.1 PCI bridge [0604]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1454]
> IOMMU Group 6 09:00.0 Non-Essential Instrumentation [1300]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1455]
> IOMMU Group 6 09:00.2 SATA controller [0106]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH SATA Controller [AHCI mode] [1022:7901] (rev 51)
> IOMMU Group 6 09:00.3 Audio device [0403]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1457]
> IOMMU Group 7 00:14.0 SMBus [0c05]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH SMBus Controller [1022:790b] (rev 59)
> IOMMU Group 7 00:14.3 ISA bridge [0601]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH LPC Bridge [1022:790e] (rev 51)
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1460]
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.1 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1461]
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.2 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1462]
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.3 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1463]
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.4 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1464]
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.5 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1465]
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.6 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1466]
> IOMMU Group 8 00:18.7 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1467]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.0 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1460]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.1 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1461]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.2 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1462]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.3 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1463]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.4 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1464]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.5 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1465]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.6 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1466]
> IOMMU Group 9 00:19.7 Host bridge [0600]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Device [1022:1467]


----------



## Nicklas0912

@lifeisshort117

Can you do some Firestike/Timespy on 4.1Ghz?


----------



## DaNiJ3L

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> tried knoppix 7.2 but it came up with a kernal panic things o then tried partmagic which loaded did the first one got this
> no idea what it means but hey i,m trying
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and the next one


tyvm. this is what I was looking for.


----------



## tarot

i have a question in regards to NUMA/UMA i know you can change it in ryzen master but is there a way to do it in the bios and if so where the hell is it







i looked high and low and still none the wiser...i would prefer not not install ryzen master as not big on software tweaks prefer the nuts down method


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i have a question in regards to NUMA/UMA i know you can change it in ryzen master but is there a way to do it in the bios and if so where the hell is it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i looked high and low and still none the wiser...i would prefer not not install ryzen master as not big on software tweaks prefer the nuts down method


I haven't seen any option for that in the AORUS' bios


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i have a question in regards to NUMA/UMA i know you can change it in ryzen master but is there a way to do it in the bios and if so where the hell is it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i looked high and low and still none the wiser...i would prefer not not install ryzen master as not big on software tweaks prefer the nuts down method


It should say something about memory mode. They call it other names though. Distributed is code for UMA and Local is code for NUMA.


----------



## springs113

Maybe amd asked for it to be removed...according to the asus reps over in the zeniths thread, that is what happened.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Just ordered my 1920x build, should have it up and running over the weekend.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Possibly. I don't see any options for changing it in the MSI Carbon BIOS either. A bit of a shame, NUMA really takes a bite out of the latency situation on the 1950x. With 64GB of RAM installed I may well run in local mode 24/7 as the hit on the few high end programs(video editing mostly) seems to be relatively minor. Seems like when you set local mode in ryzen master the setting survives reboots at least. Not sure what sets it back to distributed mode, but at some point it ends up getting switched back...perhaps fiddling with BIOS settings?
> Nice! Which motherboard did you choose?


Got a combo deal on the MSI Gaming Pro Carbon


----------



## farcodev

I received finally the Zenith.
Time to test the old apps and (slowly) transfer and test the stuff from the X79 to the X399.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Just ordered my 1920x build, should have it up and running over the weekend.


Fun weeks ahead.


----------



## springs113

Is it weird that I'm as excited for everyone here making the jump/upgrading to TR as much as I am for myself?
It's always fun to do a new build but for some odd reason this build have me feeling like this is my first build ever.

What is the highest OC reported so far by a regular user?


----------



## farcodev

Nothing weird for the geeks we are








It's a new platform, new tech and for one time it's not Intel (nothing against it, I was pretty satisfied with the 3930K but a bit of diversity of product is fun). So yeah, it's entertaining.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> What is the highest OC reported so far by a regular user?


I think it's 4.1Ghz, someone posted that.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> Nothing weird for the geeks we are
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a new platform, new tech and for one time it's not Intel (nothing against it, I was pretty satisfied with the 3930K but a bit of diversity of product is fun). So yeah, it's entertaining.
> I think it's 4.1Ghz, someone posted that.


Thanks lol, yes every build in my house is all Intel. From the q6600 to my latest 5930k. Nice change of scenery. Now just waiting for my new boards arrival(2moro). I've not been lucky with Asus this go around, hopefully 3rd times a charm.


----------



## The Stilt

How the hell are people cooling these, when there are exactly zero compatible coolers available for the platform (outside those POS Asetek AIOs)?

What a piece of junk


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Stilt*
> 
> How the hell are people cooling these, when there are exactly zero compatible coolers available for the platform (outside those POS Asetek AIOs)?
> 
> What a piece of junk


i found my processor to run quite cool (h100i v2). I didn't stress test or anything but on average use, it was relatively surprising how cool it ran.


----------



## hebrewbacon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Stilt*
> 
> How the hell are people cooling these, when there are exactly zero compatible coolers available for the platform (outside those POS Asetek AIOs)?
> 
> What a piece of junk


This is why I'm waiting for a TR specific waterblock to release before buying.
I think a lot of people are using existing AIOs like the Thermaltake 360 AIO with decent results. Most of them fall flat when you start overclocking though.


----------



## The Stilt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> i found my processor to run quite cool (h100i v2). I didn't stress test or anything but on average use, it was relatively surprising how cool it ran.


They're relatively fine at stock, however you can't do much overclocking on them while keeping the temperatures at sane levels. Especially on Ryzen, which has extremely steep power curve beyond ~ 3.5GHz. The Asetek blocks are anything but optimal for TR.


----------



## springs113

Understandable, which is why I have an EK block on order. I also will pick up a secondary one as well maybe Swiftechs SKF or the Heatkiller block. Ryzen is plenty fast even at stock. Clock for clock it is basically the same as Kaby.


----------



## nycgtr

I have mine on a h100v2 don't even want to try to oc it. The tubes feel warm as hell just on stock and idle. I's idling at about 45-47c.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Stilt*
> 
> How the hell are people cooling these, when there are exactly zero compatible coolers available for the platform (outside those POS Asetek AIOs)?
> 
> What a piece of junk


Not so junk and POS, it works well with a H100i v2... Temperatures are even better than my [email protected] with a H100...


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> Not so junk and POS, it works well with a H100i v2... Temperatures are even better than my [email protected] with a H100...


Hey I'm also upgrading from the x79 as well and curious to hear your experience once things are up and working? Coming from the rampage IV black edition + 4960X

I want this for OBS more than anything lol


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Hey I'm also upgrading from the x79 as well and curious to hear your experience once things are up and working? Coming from the rampage IV black edition + 4960X
> 
> I want this for OBS more than anything lol


No problems. I already tested up a bit + OC a bit with the AORUS and it's needless to say that's a powerhouse (in all the meaning of the term







).
But It's cool to see that, even at stock, how faster it is in MP but also in SP (about 15% more IPC than the [email protected]).

And I'm impressed by the temperatures. They can seem to be high for some people but for me they are damn good compared to X79. In Summer like now, with about 24-27 degrees room temperature, I have 38-43 degrees on the cores of the Intel @ Idle.
At full charge on 6 cores I'm very near of the TJMax, which is always a bit "stressing". At 4.0Ghz it is less wild. So I had to hold my horses in full load like Blender raytracing. It's why I waited for an upgrade to a 7920x and then, TR came. Good move-Bad move, well ... I don't regret it.

With the TR it's funny to see it reaching 75 degrees and stay stable (when OC at @3.7Ghz) and about 65 not OC, all that with 100% stress use.
Of course that count that I have some Noctua industrial 3000RPM on the memory slots and some mini Kaze on the VRM (I took this "cultural custom" since the X79).

Yeah the AIO aren't so elite vs a custom loop, but this new tech of CPU do a good job with them, for a 16 cores / 180W TDP.









I'm eager to start to finally setup a "production" Win 10 (I just received the Zenith about 4hrs ago and I'm working at home..), other than a benching one, and install Blender and Maya to compare vs the 3930 and laughing.
I seen also the test of a Youtuber with Sony Vegas Pro, and it used all the cores of this big baby, crunching the HD video in no time.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> No problems. I already tested up a bit + OC a bit with the AORUS and it's needless to say that's a powerhouse (in all the meaning of the term
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ).
> But It's cool to see that, even at stock, how faster it is in MP but also in SP (about 15% more IPC than the [email protected]).
> 
> And I'm impressed by the temperatures. They can seem to be high for some people but for me they are damn good compared to X79. In Summer like now, with about 24-27 degrees room temperature, I have 38-43 degrees on the cores of the Intel @ Idle.
> At full charge on 6 cores I'm very near of the TJMax, which is always a bit "stressing". At 4.0Ghz it is less wild. So I had to hold my horses in full load like Blender raytracing. It's why I waited for an upgrade to a 7920x and then, TR came. Good move-Bad move, well ... I don't regret it.
> 
> With the TR it's funny to see it reaching 75 degrees and stay stable (when OC at @3.7Ghz) and about 65 not OC, all that with 100% stress use.
> Of course that count that I have some Noctua industrial 3000RPM on the memory slots and some mini Kaze on the VRM (I took this "cultural custom" since the X79).
> 
> Yeah the AIO aren't so elite vs a custom loop, but this new tech of CPU do a good job with them, for a 16 cores / 180W TDP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm eager to start to finally setup a "production" Win 10 (I just received the Zenith about 4hrs ago and I'm working at home..), other than a benching one, and install Blender and Maya to compare vs the 3930 and laughing.
> I seen also the test of a Youtuber with Sony Vegas Pro, and it used all the cores of this big baby, crunching the HD video in no time.


Nice, I was in the same boat too, waiting on the 79xx series, but after seeing it couldn't be delidded and reading up on TR I was pretty much sold. I was heavily debating on the Auros/Asrock ( fatalty) since the zenith only had 6 sata ports and I'm using 7 on my older asus, and granted I'd be adding an M.2 to boot as well. I don't think I'll have room for a sata expansion card to put in so hopefully they make something for the u2 slot that could hook up 1-2 sata drives, but thats just wishful thinking on my end.

I run my old 4960x @ 4.5ghz on all cores and 64gb ram @ 2133. HOPING to get 64gb w/ this and still hit 4.0 on all cores ( won't even bother attempting 4.1+ since I"m hearing its possible to hit 128gb @ 3066, I figured 64 would be enough given only 1 dimm per controller vs 2, hopefully we'll see improvements as we go.

I see ur testing a lot of boards, definitely let us know ur findings between the Auros and the Zenith.

I'm glad to hear Vegas takes advantage of this as I do a lot of speed paints, not to mention hearing great things on OBS as far as cpu compression goes.

Bonus if I can still game like I did on my 4960 then I can't ask for much more lol.


----------



## mouacyk

I hope some of you owners test out kvm with gpu pass-through gaming and heavy code compilations. Thanks.


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Nice, I was in the same boat too, waiting on the 79xx series, but after seeing it couldn't be delidded and reading up on TR I was pretty much sold. I was heavily debating on the Auros/Asrock ( fatalty) since the zenith only had 6 sata ports and I'm using 7 on my older asus, and granted I'd be adding an M.2 to boot as well. I don't think I'll have room for a sata expansion card to put in so hopefully they make something for the u2 slot that could hook up 1-2 sata drives, but thats just wishful thinking on my end.
> 
> I run my old 4960x @ 4.5ghz on all cores and 64gb ram @ 2133. HOPING to get 64gb w/ this and still hit 4.0 on all cores ( won't even bother attempting 4.1+ since I"m hearing its possible to hit 128gb @ 3066, I figured 64 would be enough given only 1 dimm per controller vs 2, hopefully we'll see improvements as we go.
> 
> I see ur testing a lot of boards, definitely let us know ur findings between the Auros and the Zenith.
> 
> I'm glad to hear Vegas takes advantage of this as I do a lot of speed paints, not to mention hearing great things on OBS as far as cpu compression goes.
> 
> Bonus if I can still game like I did on my 4960 then I can't ask for much more lol.


I have now two boards only because I was a bit too much impatient and the Zenith was in backorder by the time. I should have to wait but anyway I wasted some $. I'm lucky that dividends compensated this silly and costly move from my part...

Yeah I will tell, I just hope that the bios menu are better set than for the AORUS. Not that the AORUS is bad, and yeah I know that's a new platform and BIOS, but, they could have at least disabled the IOMMU... That could have spared me 2 days that I wasted... And I wasn't alone in the same case.

I took it because the Zenith seems more complete and the 10g is a nice addition. I never had a ROG until now. It's a premium, but I will not upgrade for the next 7-10 years.

For gaming, I don't think you'll see a difference, in the bad way.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> I have now two boards only because I was a bit too much impatient and the Zenith was in backorder by the time. I should have to wait but anyway I wasted some $. I'm lucky that dividends compensated this silly and costly move from my part...
> 
> Yeah I will tell, I just hope that the bios menu are better set than for the AORUS. Not that the AORUS is bad, and yeah I know that's a new platform and BIOS, but, they could have at least disabled the IOMMU... That could have spared me 2 days that I wasted... And I wasn't alone in the same case.
> 
> I took it because the Zenith seems more complete and the 10g is a nice addition. I never had a ROG until now. It's a premium, but I will not upgrade for the next 7-10 years.
> 
> For gaming, I don't think you'll see a difference, in the bad way.


To note on that, I was able to override my complaint on sata ports w/ this baby. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816118223&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC-_-pla-_-Server+-+Accessories-_-N82E16816118223&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7-a6psjr1QIVBm5-Ch0E4AWlEAQYASABEgKkq_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Since its u.2 -> sata breakout ( as well as sas if u have it ) I could essentially hit more. I only actually needed 7 slots anyways and this would keep me from having to get rid of something and convert it to usb3.

Definitely adding an m.2 though. Guess I'll do my order today, your comment was the push I needed honestly.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> And I'm impressed by the temperatures. They can seem to be high for some people but for me they are damn good compared to X79. In Summer like now, with about 24-27 degrees room temperature, I have 38-43 degrees on the cores of the Intel @ Idle.
> At full charge on 6 cores I'm very near of the TJMax, which is always a bit "stressing". At 4.0Ghz it is less wild. So I had to hold my horses in full load like Blender raytracing. It's why I waited for an upgrade to a 7920x and then, TR came. Good move-Bad move, well ... I don't regret it.
> 
> With the TR it's funny to see it reaching 75 degrees and stay stable (when OC at @3.7Ghz) and about 65 not OC, all that with 100% stress use.
> Of course that count that I have some Noctua industrial 3000RPM on the memory slots and some mini Kaze on the VRM (I took this "cultural custom" since the X79).
> 
> Yeah the AIO aren't so elite vs a custom loop, but this new tech of CPU do a good job with them, for a 16 cores / 180W TDP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Hi,

would you mind telling what the actual wattage pulled off at 3.7ghz overclock where it resulted in 75c on your H100 v2?

Thanks


----------



## cletus-cassidy

I'm putting together a custom loop for a 1950X with the EK TR Block (+ two 360 rads plus a 280) and a 1080 TI with EK block.

I have 3/8-1/2" (13/10mm) ID/OD tubing and compression fittings on hand from a prior build and was going to use use that. I know with past tests there has been minimal difference between smaller and larger diameter tubing in PC water cooling temps. Any reason to think that has changed with Threadripper where larger tubing would provide a substantial performance impact based on volume?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I'm putting together a custom loop for a 1950X with the EK TR Block (+ two 360 rads plus a 280) and a 1080 TI with EK block.
> 
> I have 3/8-1/2" (13/10mm) ID/OD tubing and compression fittings on hand from a prior build and was going to use use that. I know with past tests there has been minimal difference between smaller and larger diameter tubing in PC water cooling temps. Any reason to think that has changed with Threadripper where larger tubing would provide a substantial performance impact based on volume?


No


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I'm putting together a custom loop for a 1950X with the EK TR Block (+ two 360 rads plus a 280) and a 1080 TI with EK block.
> 
> I have 3/8-1/2" (13/10mm) ID/OD tubing and compression fittings on hand from a prior build and was going to use use that. I know with past tests there has been minimal difference between smaller and larger diameter tubing in PC water cooling temps. Any reason to think that has changed with Threadripper where larger tubing would provide a substantial performance impact based on volume?


Tubing doesnt affect your performance as the net mass flowrate is decided by the pump, thinner tubing just effectively make the fluid goes faster in the tubing itself. The actual fluid speed in your radiator/heatsink is depended upon the entry diameter of those device and thicker tubing would not change it. The thing I can think of that tubing might affect its adding additional headloss depending on thickness but it negligible for the most par in this case I think. Unless your tubing is designed to transfer heat, it is completely irrelevant for the most part.


----------



## hebrewbacon

Yeah like the other posters have said, tubing size makes 0 difference. Other factors are more important like radiators, fans, ambient temperature etc


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Stilt*
> 
> How the hell are people cooling these, when there are exactly zero compatible coolers available for the platform (outside those POS Asetek AIOs)?
> 
> What a piece of junk


h115i highest temp stock here for the 1950x is 65 degrees overclocked to 3.9 hit 75
i would not exactly call that junk and have not even tweaked the vaders yet









i,ll be giving 4g a whirl today


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> To note on that, I was able to override my complaint on sata ports w/ this baby. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816118223&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC-_-pla-_-Server+-+Accessories-_-N82E16816118223&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7-a6psjr1QIVBm5-Ch0E4AWlEAQYASABEgKkq_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
> 
> Since its u.2 -> sata breakout ( as well as sas if u have it ) I could essentially hit more. I only actually needed 7 slots anyways and this would keep me from having to get rid of something and convert it to usb3.
> 
> Definitely adding an m.2 though. Guess I'll do my order today, your comment was the push I needed honestly.


Yeah the U2 connector is a server / SAS oriented stuff. It's a good move and really a pro thing on the motherboards that have it.

It's why it is silly when they call these motherboards "gamer", they are more server class than anything.
It reminds me the 90's with the word "multimedia" served for any marketing crap








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> would you mind telling what the actual wattage pulled off at 3.7ghz overclock where it resulted in 75c on your H100 v2?
> 
> Thanks


It was 320/330W on the package with 1.25V VCORE and 1.55V VID, if I remember well (the AORUS is repackaged now, I will setup the Zenith in about 1hr)

Just excuse me because I'm not great with O/C, so I just changed the multi at x37 and VCORE at 1.25. No LLC change or anything has been done.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Tubing doesnt affect your performance as the net mass flowrate is decided by the pump, thinner tubing just effectively make the fluid goes faster in the tubing itself. The actual fluid speed in your radiator/heatsink is depended upon the entry diameter of those device and thicker tubing would not change it. The thing I can think of that tubing might affect its adding additional headloss depending on thickness but it negligible for the most par in this case I think. Unless your tubing is designed to transfer heat, it is completely irrelevant for the most part.


My sense as well but glad that is the consensus view. I'm going to have a ton of rad capacity because I had three rads laying around (EK XE 360, Nemesis GTS 360 and Nemesis GTS 280) so should have some good headroom for my OC. Will report back once I have it up and running.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## The Stilt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> h115i highest temp stock here for the 1950x is 65 degrees overclocked to 3.9 hit 75
> i would not exactly call that junk and have not even tweaked the vaders yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i,ll be giving 4g a whirl today


The maximum temperature for 1950X is 68°C or 95°C tCTL.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Stilt*
> 
> The maximum temperature for 1950X is 68°C or 95°C tCTL.


well in that case i would call it high then








3.9 i had it set to 1.35 llc5 or low or off in the asrock bios

i will redo the overclock with 1.3 and see if it works as for temps running krieg this is as high as it got stock


i,ll run the same test once i overclock but as a general rule with the current setup i have not seen over 55 tdie so far


----------



## tarot

ok 4g at 1.3 in the bios llc auto

topped out at 65 degrees tdie going by the official figures close to the ragged edge i guess but zero throttling zero issues.

i will play around with and see what happens might be able to drop the voltage a bit but until i can figure out how to get a cheapish water-cooling setup that will also do the vega...i, m sticking with this. Although the fans are still not ramping past 1300 so i have an extra 700 rpm to play with







might have to put it in another room though ...









stock 55 degrees does not worry me in the slightest











quick firestrike test
https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/21722187

skydiver comparison stock vs 4g
https://www.3dmark.com/compare/sd/4786957/sd/4786080

sorry meant to add highest temps after those 2 test was 54 tdie

passmark


----------



## TheGovernment

I got my notification that my block shipped from EK yesterday. I liked the packaging so much I put it in my new build lol


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> I got my notification that my block shipped from EK yesterday. I liked the packaging so much I put it in my new build lol


that looks awesome









i had a quick look at the ek blocks...i, m not water-cooling guy but doesn't it look like one of the normal blocks with a bigger cold plate? i would have thought a bigger block with bigger channels would have been better?


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok 4g at 1.3 in the bios llc auto
> 
> topped out at 65 degrees tdie going by the official figures close to the ragged edge i guess but zero throttling zero issues.
> 
> i will play around with and see what happens might be able to drop the voltage a bit but until i can figure out how to get a cheapish water-cooling setup that will also do the vega...i, m sticking with this. Although the fans are still not ramping past 1300 so i have an extra 700 rpm to play with
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> might have to put it in another room though ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> stock 55 degrees does not worry me in the slightest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> quick firestrike test
> https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/21722187
> 
> skydiver comparison stock vs 4g
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/sd/4786957/sd/4786080
> 
> sorry meant to add highest temps after those 2 test was 54 tdie


Damn nice.... I'm debating on canceling my order and waiting on Silicon lottery now, given u got a really good chip @ those voltages....


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## tarot

i haven't fined tuned the voltages yet so it *may* go lower


----------



## LunaP

Yeah I"m just gonna let newegg ship, that way if somehow I miss the good chips @ SL I won't be SoL on getting a chip lol, but if I luck out then I can return the newegg one anyways.


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> that looks awesome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i had a quick look at the ek blocks...i, m not water-cooling guy but doesn't it look like one of the normal blocks with a bigger cold plate? i would have thought a bigger block with bigger channels would have been better?


Ya it does look like that. I guess we will see in the next few weeks if it makes much difference vs one that had channels going the entire length of the block. I'm going to bet it doesn't but I'm waiting for the monoblock anyways. When they come out for the Zenith, I will be ditching this block.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Funny, I came up with those same settings. Passed cinebench and a few other quick tests, but then crashed and burned on an Aida 64 benchmark report. Raytracing seems to get the temps up pretty good.


i hate you







you had to say raytracing didn't you
loaded up corona and she locked up







now it may have been the vega i,ll test that later and temp was only 62 and no restart just locked screen so further testing needed.

if anything i was sure the blender test would cause it to go loopy...


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Hey don't kill the messenger bud! I threw out a few settings that looked fine for awhile too. Apparently raytracing FPU maths iz hard...who knew. lol


one issue i seem to have struck going back to stock corona is acting up it is a little slower...a second maybe but the total raytracing no longer shows up it comes up as 6 when i submit...rally weird.

but i will definitely keep that and other like povray done as my oc tests now.


----------



## farcodev

I pretty like the Zenith, even if there are ton of options that are sometime exotic to me.
I finally reached a stable 24/24 365 OC @ 3.7Ghz with the RAM @ 2666Mhz. I searched because I tried to use my memory at 3200Mhz but had failures after failures.

Thanks to cheedle, I have more infos on the state of memory and for now it will be my setup.

here are three screenshots:




Now, I need to install a second SSD and test some applications (like the VMs) before thinking about switching.
The platform also stay young, so waiting a bios update will not hurt


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> I pretty like the Zenith, even if there are ton of options that are sometime exotic to me.
> I finally reached a stable 24/24 365 OC @ 3.7Ghz with the RAM @ 2666Mhz. I searched because I tried to use my memory at 3200Mhz but had failures after failures.
> 
> Thanks to cheedle, I have more infos on the state of memory and for now it will be my setup.
> 
> here are three screenshots:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, I need to install a second SSD and test some applications (like the VMs) before thinking about switching.
> The platform also stay young, so waiting a bios update will not hurt


Grats are u running the latest bios ( released yesterday I think ) Raja posted a link in the thread if not ( for the x399 Zenith thread, which increases mem stability/compatibility.


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Grats are u running the latest bios ( released yesterday I think ) Raja posted a link in the thread if not ( for the x399 Zenith thread, which increases mem stability/compatibility.


Some people have problems with it, and I prefer to wait for an official update of the bios.

Here a render result of a bench Blender (the famous BMW one):



On the 3930K: 9min 55sec 78


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> This cpu is actually for server


Its actually for consumer <3


----------



## mouacyk

I'm liking all these batch numbers being >=25 week of 2017.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> for consumer who wants to build a server at home lol


there are many options dw


----------



## tarot

what voltage settings did you use for 3.7 was it just auto?


----------



## rdr09

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> for consumer who wants to build a server at home lol


Yes! Server and playing W3 . . .



Might not be enuf.


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> what voltage settings did you use for 3.7 was it just auto?


VCore @ 1.25 with power delivery settings from Standard to Optimized, as well as throughput from 100% to 110%
For these two I followed what lifeisshort117did here

Also, at the contrary of the AORUS, with the Zenith the VIDs are more in line with VCORE, even before these settings.


----------



## ocvn

Testing Aorus now. Bios much better than MSI. OC my ram 16 x 4 3000 gskill tridentz without any problems ( MSI can not). So at the moment beside few minor problems, i recommend AOrus over MSI x399.


----------



## LunaP

I'm surprised at how quiet forums have been as of late, also is anything going on w/ OCN? I can't find any information on this but everynight around 10pm till like 6am in the morning the site goes down saying its being updated, this has been going on for over a month now so just curious if changes are actually being made or if its just their host?


----------



## Particle

Still waiting for heatsinks. Not a single one is available for purchase yet. *twiddles thumbs*


----------



## GuitarFreak

I pre-ordered the EK block on the 15th, but it apparently won't ship out until the 29th now. A little disappointed with that.


----------



## maddmarlowe

Hi everyone! I'm new here. I joined because I just built a 1950x rig, and am getting really poor performace from my CPU. Built a bunch of computers in the past, so this is not a new thing for me. Not sure if I am missing something in settings...or I just got a crap cpu...please any suggestions or help is welcome!

CINEBENCH
2738

PASSMARK
15865

Geekbench
single 4064 multi 18999

Windows 7 Pro
1950x
MSI X399 Carbon
MSI 1080ti Duke OC
32gb gskill 2400
corsair 115i water cooler
seasonic 850 watt

Even OC to 3.9 I can barely squeeze out 19000 on passmark.

I really hope I am just stupid and missed something. I really don't want to have to send it back :-(

HELP!


----------



## nycgtr

2400 might be an issue there. Your cine bench is really only 200-300 points off from bone stock.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Your R15 score is below even stock settings. There's something wrong with your software, suggest you check for bugs stealing clock cycles. If none, then re-install. I haven't tried passmark yet, and I haven't tried threadripper on windows 7 either(ryzen master needs windows 10), but 7 shouldn't be that far behind.


I'm almost 99% certain its the Ram speed. Since multiple tests have shown under 3k drops performance significantly ( on reddit ) 2996 is the minimum people want to go for ( if running 128gb that is which doesn't fit for this ), as TR likes high speed RAM.

Are you running in XMP or stock?


----------



## maddmarlowe

xmp is set to 2400, when set to 2133 passmark is about 14900

I appreciate any and all suggestions!

Thanks!


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## hebrewbacon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddmarlowe*
> 
> Hi everyone! I'm new here. I joined because I just built a 1950x rig, and am getting really poor performace from my CPU. Built a bunch of computers in the past, so this is not a new thing for me. Not sure if I am missing something in settings...or I just got a crap cpu...please any suggestions or help is welcome!
> 
> Windows 7 Pro
> 1950x
> MSI X399 Carbon
> MSI 1080ti Duke OC
> 32gb gskill 2400
> corsair 115i water cooler
> seasonic 850 watt
> 
> Even OC to 3.9 I can barely squeeze out 19000 on passmark.
> 
> I really hope I am just stupid and missed something. I really don't want to have to send it back :-(
> 
> HELP!


Any particular reason why you are still using windows 7? Wonder if it's due to some optimizations missing in 7?


----------



## nycgtr

So I spent 10 mins ocing. Since I've been waiting for a block but couldn't help myself lol. 4.05 with 1.35v stable. Need a block like yesterday.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> So I spent 10 mins ocing. Since I've been waiting for a block but couldn't help myself lol. 4.05 with 1.35v stable. Need a block like yesterday.


thats w/ the 128gb @ 3200?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> thats w/ the 128gb @ 3200?


With 64. I took a set out as it was in the other machine prior. I am running 4x16 atm. Temps are kinda not so great. Goes to 80c with load. Need a block.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> With 64. I took a set out as it was in the other machine prior. I am running 4x16 atm. Temps are kinda not so great. Goes to 80c with load. Need a block.


You recommend the 3600 or the 3200 for this? Gonna start w/ a 4x 16 for starters then get another kit later once mem stability goes up.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddmarlowe*
> 
> Hi everyone! I'm new here. I joined because I just built a 1950x rig, and am getting really poor performace from my CPU. Built a bunch of computers in the past, so this is not a new thing for me. Not sure if I am missing something in settings...or I just got a crap cpu...please any suggestions or help is welcome!
> 
> CINEBENCH
> 2738
> 
> PASSMARK
> 15865
> 
> Geekbench
> single 4064 multi 18999
> 
> Windows 7 Pro
> 1950x
> MSI X399 Carbon
> MSI 1080ti Duke OC
> 32gb gskill 2400
> corsair 115i water cooler
> seasonic 850 watt
> 
> Even OC to 3.9 I can barely squeeze out 19000 on passmark.
> 
> I really hope I am just stupid and missed something. I really don't want to have to send it back :-(
> 
> HELP!
> 
> ]


set power to performance to start with my guess is the cores are not getting used(also where is that thing for passmark don't remember ever seeing that)

also have hwinfo running when you do the benches maybe log it and see whats dropping off.

for reference thsis mine stock
https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/3788019

geekbench 3 i get 58 k in multi
in cb 15 2920 all day long.

passmark i just ran it (my memory scores are low but i have had that issue since the 1800x for some reason i think its OS issue but yeah.)

also i find little to no difference with numa vs uma especially in games so i leave on distributed.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> You recommend the 3600 or the 3200 for this? Gonna start w/ a 4x 16 for starters then get another kit later once mem stability goes up.


Well, it's been shown that past 3000 your gains are minimal for ryzen. Unless your a benchmark queen I don't see the benefit tbh. Current ram prices it's too much extra for too little gain imo. Stick to samsung stuff seems to work well even if not B die.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Well, it's been shown that past 3000 your gains are minimal for ryzen. Unless your a benchmark queen I don't see the benefit tbh. Current ram prices it's too much extra for too little gain imo. Stick to samsung stuff seems to work well even if not B die.


Yeah but I'm using threadripper, which is much diff than how ryzen was handling it, I don't mind paying for more I'm just looking to get best for now since I'll be ordering a 2nd pack later.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Yeah but I'm using threadripper, which is much diff than how ryzen was handling it, I don't mind paying for more I'm just looking to get best for now since I'll be ordering a 2nd pack later.


It's not so much ryzen and threadripper. It's about the infinity fabric and memory speed. In which point the case ram speed effects are most likely still similar. I have 3200 cl 16 and 128gbs of it. Now when ryzen first launched some were able to get their exact kits running at 3200 while I couldn't for life until the 4 agesa dropped and manually trying every procdot ohm. So goes to show it varies by cpu as well. While threadripper has a more mature agesa I would not be surprised to see similar quirks. That being said it's your money and up to you how you wanna spend it. All i know is right now the 3 kits I do own are more than DOUBLE or flat out double of what I paid for them in mid 2016 on every retailer. If you really need the ram today then get it but if your just getting it now to have extra ram sitting unused then that's a different story.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> It's not so much ryzen and threadripper. It's about the infinity fabric and memory speed. In which point the case ram speed effects are most likely still similar. I have 3200 cl 16 and 128gbs of it. Now when ryzen first launched some were able to get their exact kits running at 3200 while I couldn't for life until the 4 agesa dropped and manually trying every procdot ohm. So goes to show it varies by cpu as well. While threadripper has a more mature agesa I would not be surprised to see similar quirks. That being said it's your money and up to you how you wanna spend it. All i know is right now the 3 kits I do own are more than DOUBLE or flat out double of what I paid for them in mid 2016 on every retailer. If you really need the ram today then get it but if your just getting it now to have extra ram sitting unused then that's a different story.


I'm only asking if theres a diff, since I'll be encoding/streaming. That's all, I don't know if I'll need the 3600 over the 3200 since I've never journey'd above 2133, thats why I'm asking here for input.

Also if anyone can recommend a front panel 5 1/4" for 3.1 (gen 1 & 2 ) so I can hook it up to my front panel connector on my zenith, I'd greatly appreciate it. Since I own a Caselabs TH10 theres no replacement part for it so I need to go aftermarket.

Found these at least for anyone curious.

http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pw-ic01nh45/

http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pw-ic2dah85/

other than that doesn't look like anything exists yet.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> I'm only asking if theres a diff, since I'll be encoding/streaming. That's all, I don't know if I'll need the 3600 over the 3200 since I've never journey'd above 2133, thats why I'm asking here for input.
> 
> Also if anyone can recommend a front panel 5 1/4" for 3.1 (gen 1 & 2 ) so I can hook it up to my front panel connector on my zenith, I'd greatly appreciate it. Since I own a Caselabs TH10 theres no replacement part for it so I need to go aftermarket.
> 
> Found these at least for anyone curious.
> 
> http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pw-ic01nh45/
> 
> http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pw-ic2dah85/
> 
> other than that doesn't look like anything exists yet.


yeah there is a place in australia selling the 85 lian li but they want 85 bucks and it has to be ordered and they have no idea how long it would take....amazing how people release connectors without adapters ;0

as for ram in my opinion anything over some low latency 3200 is a diminishing return i have 2 sets of the g skill flarex 3200 c14 and it will do 3466 but the performance difference is negligible.
plus the flarex x plugged in xmp and done


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> I'm only asking if theres a diff, since I'll be encoding/streaming. That's all, I don't know if I'll need the 3600 over the 3200 since I've never journey'd above 2133, thats why I'm asking here for input.
> 
> Also if anyone can recommend a front panel 5 1/4" for 3.1 (gen 1 & 2 ) so I can hook it up to my front panel connector on my zenith, I'd greatly appreciate it. Since I own a Caselabs TH10 theres no replacement part for it so I need to go aftermarket.
> 
> Found these at least for anyone curious.
> 
> http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pw-ic01nh45/
> 
> http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pw-ic2dah85/
> 
> other than that doesn't look like anything exists yet.


Here is where I discuss memory a bit:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1635296/amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread/220#post_26301785
http://www.overclock.net/t/1635296/amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread/230#post_26302216

Later today, I'll take a look and see what other 16GB dimms are on the QVLs
ASROCK QVL
3200+ 16GB DIMMs:
F4-3400C16Q-64GTZ

2933
F4-3000C15D-32GTZ
F4-3200C15D-32GTZR
F4-3333C16D-32GTZSK
F4-3866C18D-32GTZR
F4-3200C14D-32GTZR
HX430C15PB3K4/64
HX430C15PB3K2/32

3000
TFWD416G3000C16CBK

Zenith
3000 QVL (highest for 16GB DIMMS)
CMD32GX4M2B3000C15(Ver5.39)(XMP)
CMK32GX4M2B3000C15(Ver4.31)(XMP)
CMK64GX4M4B3000C15(Ver4.31)(XMP)
F4-3000C14Q2-128GVK(XMP)
F4-3000C14Q2-128GVRD
F4-3000C14Q2-128GVKD
HX430C15PB3K4/64(XMP)
A lot of TEAM DIMMs. Also remember, Asus tests as plug and play XMP use, not how Asrock does, so other, faster DIMMs may achieve these speeds, but you will have to play with the timings to get stable.

As to need, benches so far have shown 2933 and 3200 to give solid performance and uplift to the Infinity Fabric (IF) on the chips. There can be a 4%-10% boost on the ram speed. But NO ONE has shown 3600 reviewed and you see a shelf occur with diminishing returns on the latency reduction on the IF as the speed increases (after all, you can only reduce it so much). So, considering you are going for 128GB eventually, I'd mostly say focus on 2933 to 3200 with tight timings. Considering the difficulty in reaching 3600 on this gen with those DIMMs, you'll spend a fortune without a guarantee. But also, 3200 is much better than 2133-2400, so anywhere in that range (2933-3200) should give you solid performance, even if on the higher side of the 16GB DIMMs (or starting to get there; although there is a 3866 listed on the Asrock board).

I've got nothing on the panel and didn't go through the QVL list of either the MSI or Giga boards yet, but this should start painting a picture. You may want to buy above what your goal speed is, but don't go crazy as the fastest isn't even guaranteed to run at your target speed in some cases. Asrock is the only one that tested with rated speeds higher than what they got to work reported in the list. All other vendors list only what worked at the XMP on the chip. But it may act as a guide, especially if you see overlap between the list (which I didn't see any direct overlap except the Hyper X DIMMs).

Do you need the ram for editing or are you also going to run a ram disk at times?

Edit: sources - http://dlcdnet.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/socketTR4/ROG_ZENITH_EXTREME/ROG_Zenith_Extreme_Memory_QVL_2133-3466.pdf?_ga=2.201942033.1481692463.1503576518-165661080.1502746641
http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X399%20Taichi/index.us.asp#Memory


----------



## Particle

Noctua's heatsinks are now available through Newegg.

140 mm / $80 / NH-U14S TR4-SP3
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=13C-0005-00140

120 mm / $70 / NH-U12S TR4-SP3
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=13C-0005-00141

92 mm / $70 / NH-U9 TR4-SP3
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=13C-0005-00142


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## gtbtk

Not sure if anyone here has seen this Threadripper waterblock from Bykski. They are one of the largest manufacturers of watercooling gear in China. I think that they may OEM some of the EK GPU water blocks as well.

The blocks are selling for $US60-$65

https://world.taobao.com/item/556505222010.htm

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bykski-A-Ryzen-Th-X-CPU-Water-Cooling-Block-for-AMD-Ryzen-Threadripper/32824914061.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.9.6Jtevn&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_3_10152_10065_10151_10068_10307_5400018_10137_10060_10155_10154_10333_10056_10334_10335_10055_10054_10059_10332_100031_10099_10103_10102_5410018_5430018_10052_10053_10142_10107_10050_10051_5370018_10326_10084_10083_10080_5390018_10082_10081_10110_10111_10112_10113_10114_10179_10312_10313_10314_10315_10078_10079_5420018_10073,searchweb201603_15,ppcSwitch_5&btsid=da42f14c-840f-4b0f-943a-80822608e722&algo_expid=b9d278bb-4968-472b-8179-13a0e1af9937-1&algo_pvid=b9d278bb-4968-472b-8179-13a0e1af9937


----------



## nycgtr

Yea i saw that. I had a chance for a relative to bring me one last week without world shipping but I wanted to go with a more well known maker.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Yea i saw that. I had a chance for a relative to bring me one last week without world shipping but I wanted to go with a more well known maker.


That's funny.

The biggest manufacturer of a a waterblock product range with a domestic market of 1.3Billion people. Pretty sure Bykski is more well known than EKWB.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> That's funny.
> 
> The biggest manufacturer of a a waterblock product range with a domestic market of 1.3Billion people. Pretty sure Bykski is more well known than EKWB.


Chinese people don't like to buy things made in china? This isnt exactly news lol. Either way I've owned a byski block out of curiosity off amazon. I don't know it just feels a bit risky to me. I wouldn't even know where to point a finger if I had a problem lol.


----------



## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> That's funny.
> 
> The biggest manufacturer of a a waterblock product range with a domestic market of 1.3Billion people. Pretty sure Bykski is more well known than EKWB.











run it 7 days already. manage 67 celcius in prime 95 vs XSPC 4G (75 celcius) in their review.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Nice. ...but I think we both know it doesn't mean much without voltages and other cooling system components being equal.
> 
> My only issue with the bykski block is that it doesn't look like the micro channels cover the entire die area...and also that the cold plate doesn't appear to cover the entire IHS. I have one of those issues with the EK block as well btw. ...oh and there's entirely too many dashes in the name. lol A-Ryzen-th-X? What-the-actual eff.


I bought the EK block it arrives tmr. I simply bit the bullet as I am literally tired of waiting lol. I will go heatkiller when it's available and not all the way from Germany. I was shooting for xspc but I have a neo block and the acrylic is kinda hmm thin and the mount screws are a turnoff. Although it's held up fine. Rest of my gear is EK so I guess it will match at least. It's a shame I had to support EK on this block with my wallet. It's great to know now that I own like 4 supremacys that look identical.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I bought the EK block it arrives tmr. I simply bit the bullet as I am literally tired of waiting lol. I will go heatkiller when it's available and not all the way from Germany. I was shooting for xspc but I have a neo block and the acrylic is kinda hmm thin and the mount screws are a turnoff. Although it's held up fine. Rest of my gear is EK so I guess it will match at least. It's a shame I had to support EK on this block with my wallet. It's great to know now that I own like 4 supremacys that look identical.


You really should compare the coverage on the blocks. Raystorm is way better this round.
https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/08/20/threadripper_at_4ghz_xspc_raystorm_waterblock/1




If you look, the screws on the EK plate are on the IHS, the Raystorm has them outside of it. It also looks like the fins cover more area of the dies. Just saying.


----------



## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Nice. ...but I think we both know it doesn't mean much without voltages and other cooling system components being equal.
> 
> My only issue with the bykski block is that it doesn't look like the micro channels cover the entire die area...and also that the cold plate doesn't appear to cover the entire IHS. I have one of those issues with the EK block as well btw. ...oh and there's entirely too many dashes in the name. lol A-Ryzen-th-X? What-the-actual eff.


Cold plate more bigger than IHS







confirmed when i take it out to change the mobo from MSI to Gigabyte.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Hey all:

Got the hardware on my new 1920X build together and leak-tested the watercooling. Weird problem with Windows though. I'm trying to install a fresh copy from OEM DVD and the machine just hangs at the blue logo after booting. Can't get past it even after letting it wait for 20+ minutes.

I know the system works at least somewhat because I'm using a Samsung NVM drive from a Ryzen build and that booted into Windows. I want to do a clean install, so I made a new partition on the drive as I thought that might be the reason the Windows DVD is hanging at the logo screen.

I thought it might be a ram issue, so I'm went from 4 sticks to 2 sticks but still the same problem.

Here are my system specs

Threadripper 1920X
x399 Taichi (all at default)
32 GB (4x8) G.Skill Ripjaws V CL14 DDR4 3200 RAM
EK CPU waterblock
RX 460 (for testing)

Any ideas?


----------



## Solarion

,,


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Hey all:
> 
> Got the hardware on my new 1920X build together and leak-tested the watercooling. Weird problem with Windows though. I'm trying to install a fresh copy from OEM DVD and the machine just hangs at the blue logo after booting. Can't get past it even after letting it wait for 20+ minutes.
> 
> I know the system works at least somewhat because I'm using a Samsung NVM drive from a Ryzen build and that booted into Windows. I want to do a clean install, so I made a new partition on the drive as I thought that might be the reason the Windows DVD is hanging at the logo screen.
> 
> I thought it might be a ram issue, so I'm went from 4 sticks to 2 sticks but still the same problem.
> 
> Here are my system specs
> 
> Threadripper 1920X
> x399 Taichi (all at default)
> 32 GB (4x8) G.Skill Ripjaws V CL14 DDR4 3200 RAM
> EK CPU waterblock
> RX 460 (for testing)
> 
> Any ideas?


It is probably hanging on driver initialization. Can you create a USB drive with a new downloaded version and try it?


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> It is probably hanging on driver initialization. Can you create a USB drive with a new downloaded version and try it?


Good idea. Need to see if I even have a USB with 4GB of space. Would creating a new DVD accomplish the same thing?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> You really should compare the coverage on the blocks. Raystorm is way better this round.
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/08/20/threadripper_at_4ghz_xspc_raystorm_waterblock/1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you look, the screws on the EK plate are on the IHS, the Raystorm has them outside of it. It also looks like the fins cover more area of the dies. Just saying.


Yea i am aware of that. I watched the hardocp video and the video on the EK block. I am aware its smaller by like 14mm on the cold plate. The screws are on the IHS area as well for EK. However, I don't feel actual performance will vary that much. It was more aesthetics to me that I did not want to go the EK route.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> You caved. lol That's why I borrowed a crap block from a friend...I knew the POS AIO was going to force me to do something drastic...like buy a block I didn't want.
> Nice. Yeah, the more info the better.


Yeah I was considering on ghetto strapping a block on in the mean time but meh. Its 80 bucks not a big deal. I'll just replace it in a month or so when the heatkiller blocks are readily available.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Good idea. Need to see if I even have a USB with 4GB of space. Would creating a new DVD accomplish the same thing?


Probably so long as it is the most recent download. Otherwise, you need to use DISM or NTLite to inject the drivers directly into both the boot WIM and the install WIM. I don't know if they have resolved needing the Samsung NVMe driver at the point of asking for the drive or not yet, so having that to the side on stand-by would be smart.


----------



## mouacyk

Where are my Linux distribution compilers and 8-seat GPU-passthrough VM enthusiasts? Report!


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Hey all:
> 
> Got the hardware on my new 1920X build together and leak-tested the watercooling. Weird problem with Windows though. I'm trying to install a fresh copy from OEM DVD and the machine just hangs at the blue logo after booting. Can't get past it even after letting it wait for 20+ minutes.
> 
> I know the system works at least somewhat because I'm using a Samsung NVM drive from a Ryzen build and that booted into Windows. I want to do a clean install, so I made a new partition on the drive as I thought that might be the reason the Windows DVD is hanging at the logo screen.
> 
> I thought it might be a ram issue, so I'm went from 4 sticks to 2 sticks but still the same problem.
> 
> Here are my system specs
> 
> Threadripper 1920X
> x399 Taichi (all at default)
> 32 GB (4x8) G.Skill Ripjaws V CL14 DDR4 3200 RAM
> EK CPU waterblock
> RX 460 (for testing)
> 
> Any ideas?


I would try reducing memory speed for installation and see what happens. Run at something boring like 2133. Worst case: You can do a fresh install on your Ryzen hardware, run sysprep and tell it to prep for an out of box experience, and move the SSD over. It's essentially still a clean install at that point since the OOBE prep kills all of the driver and HAL table stuff such that it's ready to be put on anything. Even skipping that step, modern versions of Windows usually survive just fine being moved. The only downside about not running OOBE is that you end up with a lot of leftover registry and driver cruft from the original system's hardware which can cause problems occasionally.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Probably so long as it is the most recent download. Otherwise, you need to use DISM or NTLite to inject the drivers directly into both the boot WIM and the install WIM. I don't know if they have resolved needing the Samsung NVMe driver at the point of asking for the drive or not yet, so having that to the side on stand-by would be smart.


Found a 4GB+ USB and getting a newer version of Windows did it. Thanks and repped.


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> Where are my Linux distribution compilers and 8-seat GPU-passthrough VM enthusiasts? Report!


You should look @ Phoronix. I don't know if he tested compilation on TR yet, but he did it with the Ryzen


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Here is where I discuss memory a bit:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1635296/amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread/220#post_26301785
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1635296/amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread/230#post_26302216
> 
> Later today, I'll take a look and see what other 16GB dimms are on the QVLs
> ASROCK QVL
> 3200+ 16GB DIMMs:
> F4-3400C16Q-64GTZ
> 
> 2933
> F4-3000C15D-32GTZ
> F4-3200C15D-32GTZR
> F4-3333C16D-32GTZSK
> F4-3866C18D-32GTZR
> F4-3200C14D-32GTZR
> HX430C15PB3K4/64
> HX430C15PB3K2/32
> 
> 3000
> TFWD416G3000C16CBK
> 
> Zenith
> 3000 QVL (highest for 16GB DIMMS)
> CMD32GX4M2B3000C15(Ver5.39)(XMP)
> CMK32GX4M2B3000C15(Ver4.31)(XMP)
> CMK64GX4M4B3000C15(Ver4.31)(XMP)
> F4-3000C14Q2-128GVK(XMP)
> F4-3000C14Q2-128GVRD
> F4-3000C14Q2-128GVKD
> HX430C15PB3K4/64(XMP)
> A lot of TEAM DIMMs. Also remember, Asus tests as plug and play XMP use, not how Asrock does, so other, faster DIMMs may achieve these speeds, but you will have to play with the timings to get stable.
> 
> As to need, benches so far have shown 2933 and 3200 to give solid performance and uplift to the Infinity Fabric (IF) on the chips. There can be a 4%-10% boost on the ram speed. But NO ONE has shown 3600 reviewed and you see a shelf occur with diminishing returns on the latency reduction on the IF as the speed increases (after all, you can only reduce it so much). So, considering you are going for 128GB eventually, I'd mostly say focus on 2933 to 3200 with tight timings. Considering the difficulty in reaching 3600 on this gen with those DIMMs, you'll spend a fortune without a guarantee. But also, 3200 is much better than 2133-2400, so anywhere in that range (2933-3200) should give you solid performance, even if on the higher side of the 16GB DIMMs (or starting to get there; although there is a 3866 listed on the Asrock board).
> 
> I've got nothing on the panel and didn't go through the QVL list of either the MSI or Giga boards yet, but this should start painting a picture. You may want to buy above what your goal speed is, but don't go crazy as the fastest isn't even guaranteed to run at your target speed in some cases. Asrock is the only one that tested with rated speeds higher than what they got to work reported in the list. All other vendors list only what worked at the XMP on the chip. But it may act as a guide, especially if you see overlap between the list (which I didn't see any direct overlap except the Hyper X DIMMs).
> 
> Do you need the ram for editing or are you also going to run a ram disk at times?
> 
> Edit: sources - http://dlcdnet.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/socketTR4/ROG_ZENITH_EXTREME/ROG_Zenith_Extreme_Memory_QVL_2133-3466.pdf?_ga=2.201942033.1481692463.1503576518-165661080.1502746641
> http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X399%20Taichi/index.us.asp#Memory


No ram disk,

Main scenarios, OBS -> streaming @ 5800kbps using slowest mode on cpu while gaming and or drawing. During sessions will also be recording to a local file for highest quality for rendering later.
Rendering videos @ 1440p/1080p ( 4k later on probably)
3D renders, animation etc ( Maya until school teaches other wise or I move on to other things)

64gb is the lowest I can go since my canvas' can get upwards to 26gb in mem usage alone or higher.
Yes I do leave 100+ tabs open in Chrome and at least 30+ in FF, I like my convenience vs having to close and open all the time.

Games will be running while streaming/drawing since OBS can do PiP which great.

I'm surprised Asus hasn't achieved 3200 yet on their QV **edit*** n/m saw ur 2nd link

Also to follow up on the RGB g skill comment from Solarion( I think it was ) the LED's weren't causing it , it was just the software for gskill conflicting w/ the aurora software, the fix was to uninstall the gskill one and let the board handle it.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> No ram disk,
> 
> Main scenarios, OBS -> streaming @ 5800kbps using slowest mode on cpu while gaming and or drawing. During sessions will also be recording to a local file for highest quality for rendering later.
> Rendering videos @ 1440p/1080p ( 4k later on probably)
> 3D renders, animation etc ( Maya until school teaches other wise or I move on to other things)
> 
> 64gb is the lowest I can go since my canvas' can get upwards to 26gb in mem usage alone or higher.
> Yes I do leave 100+ tabs open in Chrome and at least 30+ in FF, I like my convenience vs having to close and open all the time.
> 
> Games will be running while streaming/drawing since OBS can do PiP which great.
> 
> I'm surprised Asus hasn't achieved 3200 yet on their QV **edit*** n/m saw ur 2nd link
> 
> Also to follow up on the RGB g skill comment from Solarion( I think it was ) the LED's weren't causing it , it was just the software for gskill conflicting w/ the aurora software, the fix was to uninstall the gskill one and let the board handle it.


Sounds about right. And we went through the tab whore thing a long while ago (I'm with you there, except I usually have 100+ in Chrome and 200-300+ in FF for work, plus excel and word and Adobe Acrobat).

But, I just posted the ram for the DS for you to give an idea an what may be needed. Right now, I'm starting with 32GB and getting 32GB later.

BTW, add me to the list of owners. Just ordered the top binned from SL.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Hey guys need a quick tip. I have 4 memory sticks. What dimms do I use or does it matter. First time I have seen no color coding on the dimms


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Hey guys need a quick tip. I have 4 memory sticks. What dimms do I use or does it matter. First time I have seen no color coding on the dimms


Board would help to know...


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Sounds about right. And we went through the tab whore thing a long while ago (I'm with you there, except I usually have 100+ in Chrome and 200-300+ in FF for work, plus excel and word and Adobe Acrobat).
> 
> But, I just posted the ram for the DS for you to give an idea an what may be needed. Right now, I'm starting with 32GB and getting 32GB later.
> 
> *BTW, add me to the list of owners. Just ordered the top binned from SL*.


Damn you got the 3.9 @ 1.325 one? lol I'm tempted to try my luck to see what my chip yields.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Board would help to know...


MSI gaming pro


----------



## LunaP

Hmm 3000 as u said seems to be the highest, Idky Asus is so far behind the other mobo mfc's for once.

Almost tempted on the 128gb 3000 but none of them seem to be Samsung B.

Looking at the 64gb kits supported now ( which 0 are listed over 2800)


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Damn you got the 3.9 @ 1.325 one? lol I'm tempted to try my luck to see what my chip yields.


3.95 and yep! Glad to see the strap used in the binning this round in 25mhz increments. Also, this was tested with AIO, so a waterblock with 480 seems needed for 4+. But we'll see what I can do. Now, get me the board reviews on 3600MHz memory! LOL!

I feel you there. Try shooting a PM to SL to see when they think that it will be back in stock (considering if you didn't buy it in the first minute or two, it was gone). You might get a better idea on whether to wait or try your luck.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> 3.95 and yep! Glad to see the strap used in the binning this round in 25mhz increments. Also, this was tested with AIO, so a waterblock with 480 seems needed for 4+. But we'll see what I can do. Now, get me the board reviews on 3600MHz memory! LOL!
> 
> I feel you there. Try shooting a PM to SL to see when they think that it will be back in stock (considering if you didn't buy it in the first minute or two, it was gone). You might get a better idea on whether to wait or try your luck.


Not like I can do anything anyways till XSPC releases their damn block, I'd gladly take one to test out and show results ( though my rigs probably overkill and wouldn't give much data anyways ) but its still decked out.

Hoping new USB Gen 2 type connector cables get released soon since Lian PC is the only one that literally sells it atm, all the others use sataexpress for front panel support, and since mines still a 4x usb 3.0 it sucks. I'd love if case labs released a 3.1 gen 1 at least, for now I'll just buy a 5 1/4" front bay for usb 3.1 and hook it in that way since I still have 2 spots available.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> MSI x399 gaming pro


The two outermost and two in from those on each side (A2, B2, C2, D2). Leave the slots closest to the CPU open. Make sense?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Hmm 3000 as u said seems to be the highest, Idky Asus is so far behind the other mobo mfc's for once.
> 
> Almost tempted on the 128gb 3000 but none of them seem to be Samsung B.
> 
> Looking at the 64gb kits supported now ( which 0 are listed over 2800)


Asus has been like that since z170. Asrock was the only 4266 and 4133 board at first with the OC formula, then Asus came up with the M8I (impact) later to compete on it. You had MSI do fairly well on that chipset also on memory, but Asus was king on performance benches, even if not on memory. So....


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Not like I can do anything anyways till XSPC releases their damn block, I'd gladly take one to test out and show results ( though my rigs probably overkill and wouldn't give much data anyways ) but its still decked out.
> 
> Hoping new USB Gen 2 type connector cables get released soon since Lian PC is the only one that literally sells it atm, all the others use sataexpress for front panel support, and since mines still a 4x usb 3.0 it sucks. I'd love if case labs released a 3.1 gen 1 at least, for now I'll just buy a 5 1/4" front bay for usb 3.1 and hook it in that way since I still have 2 spots available.


I hear ya there. So far XSPC has sold me if I don't get a monoblock. But, since I have time on that, I'll wait on my MB decision until I get more ram insight.

And I hear ya. I need to upgrade my connectors as well, but that is lower on my list of priorities on expenditures at the moment.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> The two outermost and two in from those on each side (A2, B2, C2, D2). Leave the slots closest to the CPU open. Make sense?
> Asus has been like that since z170. Asrock was the only 4266 and 4133 board at first with the OC formula, then Asus came up with the M8I (impact) later to compete on it. You had MSI do fairly well on that chipset also on memory, but Asus was king on performance benches, even if not on memory. So....


Sorry man doesn't make sense. Let's assume:

12345678

Are you telling me : 1 2 7 8 ?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> ...and those are surely single rank dimms.


yes SR and Samsung b die


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Sorry man doesn't make sense. Let's assume:
> 
> 12345678
> 
> Are you telling me : 1 2 7 8 ?


1 3 6 8
So nothing in 2 4 5 7
4 and 5 are the closest ones to the TR4 socket on either side.

Edit: so 1234 CPU 5678

Edit 2: https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X399-GAMING-PRO-CARBON-AC.html#down-manual
the order is listed on manual page 5 of the PDF


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> 1 3 6 8
> So nothing in 2 4 5 7
> 4 and 5 are the closest ones to the TR4 socket on either side.
> 
> Edit: so 1234 CPU 5678
> 
> Edit 2: https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X399-GAMING-PRO-CARBON-AC.html#down-manual
> the order is listed on manual page 5 of the PDF


Excellent, thanks for the mapping.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Excellent, thanks for the mapping.


Glad I could help!


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Glad I could help!


Mm theres a 3.9ghz @ 1.3v atm


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Hey guys need a quick tip. I have 4 memory sticks. What dimms do I use or does it matter. First time I have seen no color coding on the dimms


further away from the cpu socket the better so populate the outside 2 either side then miss one and populate the next, should be a diagram in the manual


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ocvn*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> run it 7 days already. manage 67 celcius in prime 95 vs XSPC 4G (75 celcius) in their review.


what is the rest of your setup radiator pump fans.
and what settings for the threadripper are you basing that on
same speed same voltage same ram speed...

just asking for apples to apples as i still do not think they set that block up right simply by looking at the TIM coverage....there was none









as an example with a H1151 i was getting around 70 degrees at 4G with 1.35 volts and that is not with the Varders running more than 60 percent....so either those blocks and the expensive cooling setup make zero sense to me for no gain


----------



## Solarion

,,


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Mm theres a 3.9ghz @ 1.3v atm


That does look decent and is only $100 over stock chip. The .025mV to reach 500MHz, although seeming small, isn't insignificant either considering this is a 16-core chip. As to the voltage and speed mentioned by tarot, Solarion's point on everyone having a different idea of stable is very pertinent. SL went from just ROG realbench to also using P95 and a host of other programs for stability testing at the voltage rating, meaning it may be above what is needed for your uses or what was done under his stability testing (we all have our blend to find stable for lower voltage). Also, on each stepping of voltage, it doesn't mean it doesn't perform better than that, just that it fit in the category of hitting a specific speed under all tested conditions with a specific voltage.

The question on getting one step down I cannot answer for you. I can tell you all reviewers did not put it through its paces on running it overnight on this and that test, etc. They did a down and dirty OC, which is fine, but isn't what you do for deploying in daily hardware where crashes are inexcusable (so a bench stable). Then again, if a large amount fell into the second tier down, playing the lotto makes sense. So, kind of hard to tell.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> MSI gaming pro


That is the same board I have. As I recall, it was silkscreened in text right on the motherboard which slots it wanted you to use first.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> I don't think we've really seen what a proper loop will do with Threadripper in a review yet. Everyone has a different idea of what the word "stable" means as well as different ideas about what acceptable noise levels are. We need one reviewer with multiple cooling options on the exact same hardware testing different configs at equal loads/ambient temps...otherwise results are not comparable. There are just too many variables. Agree though, kinda wish HardOCP had redone that test with better TIM coverage...that didn't look right...nevermind that AMD recommends that TIM application for Threadripper. lol Think AMD just recommends that method for Asetek style AIO coolers...not for massive water blocks.
> 
> Also to be fair an H115i runs around $140ish if I'm not mistaken...plus it doesn't come with Vardar fans, so while still cheaper than a decent custom loop, it's not exactly an insignificant investment. More time has to pass to get some water blocks out into the wild. Come on water block building doodz! lol


yep the h115i hereis $180 plus $30 for the 2 2k Varder fans so $210
problem is a good 280 radiator is around 100 here add 140 for the block 25 for tubing 25 for liquid and 75 i think for a pump and say 30 for the 2 fans earlier.
so you are looking at quite a lot more and a lot of fart assing oh and the compression fittings 9 each so add 60 to that...

if the block can't do a significant bit better than what i have(which by the way stress testing at stocking nets me between 55/60 absolute max with fans at about 60 percent.

then i do not see the point(apart from overclocked results)

but as stated no one has done a proper review yet so i, m happy to wait.

ninja edit

forgot to mention i also have a vega 64 i would like to cool so i am guessing a 280 rad is not going to cool both..so again not sure how to proceed


----------



## cheddle

Can someone with Nvidia GPUs on x399 run PerformanceMark 2dmark for me?

my system is... somewhat rubbish to use


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> Can someone with Nvidia GPUs on x399 run PerformanceMark 2dmark for me?
> 
> my system is... somewhat rubbish to use


sorry can't help with NVidia but which version are you running,
Quote:


> i would suggest anyone running the older version update to the new one
> V9.0 Build 1016 - 11th/August/2017
> •Updated system information library with some changes; ◦Added temperature offsets for Ryzen ThreadRipper chipsets
> ◦Added support for obtaining CPU info for Skylake-X chipset
> ◦Fixed bug with measuring base/turbo speeds
> ◦Fixed a bug where temperature average was not calculated for systems with multiple CPUs


i,m going to run the new one and see if there are any major chnages


----------



## Solarion

,,


----------



## tarot

yes it does pretty well
except in the new version of passmark which is gimped completely
says it takes the offsets into account it doesn't my chip is NOT idling at 59 degrees thankyou very much








and my 2d scores were as bad as the ones above and the cpu scores were hideous as well.

even the memory and 3d scores were way off...the whole thing reaks...as if my system is only 20 percent faster than a 6700k...please

that software has hit the bin as useless....to make sure i wasn't dreaming loaded up corona 1.3 and same scores(teeny bit lower) 1.14 minutes
best i scored on that was the 3.9 overclock 1.03

so yeah it isn't your card it is the software screwing up find a slightly older version of passmark v9 and try again


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> yes it does pretty well
> except in the new version of passmark which is gimped completely
> says it takes the offsets into account it doesn't my chip is NOT idling at 59 degrees thankyou very much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and my 2d scores were as bad as the ones above and the cpu scores were hideous as well.
> 
> even the memory and 3d scores were way off...the whole thing reaks...as if my system is only 20 percent faster than a 6700k...please
> 
> that software has hit the bin as useless....to make sure i wasn't dreaming loaded up corona 1.3 and same scores(teeny bit lower) 1.14 minutes
> best i scored on that was the 3.9 overclock 1.03
> 
> so yeah it isn't your card it is the software screwing up find a slightly older version of passmark v9 and try again


I would agree however my experience of using windows matches my passmark results EXACTLY. using windows is a sluggish mess...


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> I would agree however my experience of using windows matches my passmark results EXACTLY. using windows is a sluggish mess...


actually right this second i agree...something has happened in the last day or two...for some reason my physics score in firestrike tanked and my cb15 result is down 100 points...that and realbench acting up and then passmark..
not the cpu i, m sure of that, i just clocked it up to 3900 1.3v llc3 which by the way very stable and temps topped out at 65 degrees s happy with that BUT the perfoance is down there as well.

i thought maybe it had stopped boosting as much but with a flat 3900 it shouldn't.

windows or video card drivers...and can't see the latter if your on NVidia can't affect two systems different video cards the same way.

i hate this voodoo crap


----------



## tarot

ok
voodoo done
fixed it.

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13447716/fs/13447495

on the left is the fixed version on the right is the not fixed please note physics scores.

same goes for cb15 and cpuz bench all back to normal.

now i could just tell you or i could make a competition out of it







whoever guesses what i did and what caused it gets one of my spare humble bundle games


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok
> voodoo done
> fixed it.
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13447716/fs/13447495
> 
> on the left is the fixed version on the right is the not fixed please note physics scores.
> 
> same goes for cb15 and cpuz bench all back to normal.
> 
> now i could just tell you or i could make a competition out of it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> whoever guesses what i did and what caused it gets one of my spare humble bundle games


It was the NUMA/UMA settings...


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> It was the NUMA/UMA settings...


buzzzzzz

nice try but back of the line


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok
> voodoo done
> fixed it.
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13447716/fs/13447495
> 
> on the left is the fixed version on the right is the not fixed please note physics scores.
> 
> same goes for cb15 and cpuz bench all back to normal.
> 
> now i could just tell you or i could make a competition out of it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> whoever guesses what i did and what caused it gets one of my spare humble bundle games


I'll trade you my first born for that information...

But I'll play along... was it power settings?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> I'll trade you my first born for that information...
> 
> But I'll play along... was it power settings?


again nice try but no (,ll pm you the trick) but first i,m going to try fartmark again


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> again nice try but no (,ll pm you the trick) but first i,m going to try fartmark again


Will this affect other things or just benchmarks? If the latter then I'm good.


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> again nice try but no (,ll pm you the trick) but first i,m going to try fartmark again


Sweeet. I'll keep it a secret until your game is done

Was it pcie gen settings?


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> again nice try but no (,ll pm you the trick) but first i,m going to try fartmark again


Starting to think gaming mode.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Will this affect other things or just benchmarks? If the latter then I'm good.


If it is effecting benchmarks that much, it will likely effect other things. But, the game must go on (for the fun, I'm sure it will be revealed eventually).


----------



## tarot

i will reveal it and yes it affects everything including simple movement in windows lag opening apps slow games.
fartmark with the fix.

i will give you a hint though it is simple and if you owned a ryzen before you probably did it(but i found there is a trick to do the trick properly chedle knows







) but hwbot hates it









i,ll be retrying the 3900 settings soon and see how that was affected


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i will reveal it and yes it affects everything including simple movement in windows lag opening apps slow games.
> fartmark with the fix.
> 
> i will give you a hint though it is simple and if you owned a ryzen before you probably did it(but i found there is a trick to do the trick properly chedle knows
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) but hwbot hates it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i,ll be retrying the 3900 settings soon and see how that was affected


I haven't owned it, but have followed it. Maybe H*** (forgot the clock name, brain fart) then...

Edit: HPET


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> I haven't owned it, but have followed it. Maybe H*** (forgot the clock name, brain fart) then...
> 
> Edit: HPET


and we have a winner









Quote:


> cmd admin
> 
> to enable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock true
> 
> to disable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock false
> 
> bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock


to test run the last one if it errors it is off if it says complete it was on
what i did to get it to stick is run the last one
then run the false one
then run the last again.

with these realbench results they are flakey image is always an issue on my system from the good old 1800x days







and the last score heavy multi is usually better it seems to get stuck unloading the video now and then.
takeaway for me is the high handbrake fps (which i do a lot)


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> and we have a winner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to test run the last one if it errors it is off if it says complete it was on
> what i did to get it to stick is run the last one
> then run the false one
> then run the last again.
> 
> with these realbench results they are flakey image is always an issue on my system from the good old 1800x days
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and the last score heavy multi is usually better it seems to get stuck unloading the video now and then.
> takeaway for me is the high handbrake fps (which i do a lot)


So off the bat make sure its always on? I'm completely new to AMD since the last one I owned was a K6-2


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> and we have a winner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to test run the last one if it errors it is off if it says complete it was on
> what i did to get it to stick is run the last one
> then run the false one
> then run the last again.
> 
> with these realbench results they are flakey image is always an issue on my system from the good old 1800x days
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and the last score heavy multi is usually better it seems to get stuck unloading the video now and then.
> takeaway for me is the high handbrake fps (which i do a lot)


I've played with HEPT a bit while benching different systems, so I hear ya. Didn't know it got stuck at times with Ryzen (good to know though).

And nice run.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> That's funny.
> 
> The biggest manufacturer of a a waterblock product range with a domestic market of 1.3Billion people. Pretty sure Bykski is more well known than EKWB.
> 
> 
> 
> Chinese people don't like to buy things made in china? This isnt exactly news lol. Either way I've owned a byski block out of curiosity off amazon. I don't know it just feels a bit risky to me. I wouldn't even know where to point a finger if I had a problem lol.
Click to expand...

Mate I live in China. I promise you that they do.

The existance of these water blocks may well be news to new TR owners. Additionally, the cost of the block is half that of an EK unit that may also be of interest to people on a tighter budget who still wan a custom loop.

Having said that, I am not recommending them as a must have or even trying to convince people that they should get one. I only posted it as a public service announcement. I don't know how well they perform and I have never used one

I was responding to you saying you wanted a well known brand. I was pointing out that Bykski was actually more well known than EKWB. Handling RMAs is a valid point, but you didn't say that before.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> I don't think we've really seen what a proper loop will do with Threadripper in a review yet. Everyone has a different idea of what the word "stable" means as well as different ideas about what acceptable noise levels are. We need one reviewer with multiple cooling options on the exact same hardware testing different configs at equal loads/ambient temps...otherwise results are not comparable. There are just too many variables. Agree though, kinda wish HardOCP had redone that test with better TIM coverage...that didn't look right...nevermind that AMD recommends that TIM application for Threadripper. lol Think AMD just recommends that method for Asetek style AIO coolers...not for massive water blocks.
> 
> Also to be fair an H115i runs around $140ish if I'm not mistaken...plus it doesn't come with Vardar fans, so while still cheaper than a decent custom loop, it's not exactly an insignificant investment. More time has to pass to get some water blocks out into the wild. Come on water block building doodz! lol
> 
> 
> 
> yep the h115i hereis $180 plus $30 for the 2 2k Varder fans so $210
> problem is a good 280 radiator is around 100 here add 140 for the block 25 for tubing 25 for liquid and 75 i think for a pump and say 30 for the 2 fans earlier.
> so you are looking at quite a lot more and a lot of fart assing oh and the compression fittings 9 each so add 60 to that...
> 
> if the block can't do a significant bit better than what i have(which by the way stress testing at stocking nets me between 55/60 absolute max with fans at about 60 percent.
> 
> then i do not see the point(apart from overclocked results)
> 
> but as stated no one has done a proper review yet so i, m happy to wait.
> 
> ninja edit
> 
> forgot to mention i also have a vega 64 i would like to cool so i am guessing a 280 rad is not going to cool both..so again not sure how to proceed
Click to expand...

Vardars are no better at cooling than the Corsair SP fans. At least at 12v

https://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/cases_cooling/kaby_lake_7700k_5ghz_aio_cooler_mega_test/4


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> So off the bat make sure its always on? I'm completely new to AMD since the last one I owned was a K6-2


no male sure HPET is always off.
at least that is what i have done since the 1800x the windows scheduler is totally screwed up that's one of the reason they mad it so ryzen master would work without HPET


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Vardars are no better at cooling than the Corsair SP fans. At least at 12v
> 
> https://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/cases_cooling/kaby_lake_7700k_5ghz_aio_cooler_mega_test/4


not n my system
with the 1800x and the stock h110 fans it was 48 decibels and 65 degrees with the varder 1600 rpm fans it was 60 degrees and 30 decibels
same goes for this h115i the stock fans need to ramp up a lot more to push the same air through.

that's on my system no idea how it would go on a scabby lake









now if they both the 2k vaders and the sp corsair stock fans hit max speed then again i like the vaders more because it is more of a grumble than a shrieking housewife who just checked the bank statement after you bought the computer gear


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Vardars are no better at cooling than the Corsair SP fans. At least at 12v
> 
> https://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/cases_cooling/kaby_lake_7700k_5ghz_aio_cooler_mega_test/4
> 
> 
> 
> not n my system
> with the 1800x and the stock h110 fans it was 48 decibels and 65 degrees with the varder 1600 rpm fans it was 60 degrees and 30 decibels
> same goes for this h115i the stock fans need to ramp up a lot more to push the same air through.
> 
> that's on my system no idea how it would go on a scabby lake
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now if they both the 2k vaders and the sp corsair stock fans hit max speed then again i like the vaders more because it is more of a grumble than a shrieking housewife who just checked the bank statement after you bought the computer gear
Click to expand...

noise may well be the difference.

A heat source is a heat source. 7700K generates more heat than threadripper seems to.


----------



## tarot

agree to disagree but here's some results from my TR 1950x at 3900 1.3v llc3
take note of the temps and the fan speeds as well as the power usage.
seems to add i would say what 80 watts over standard.

couple of the results may say fixed that means hpet off

also note the comparison with skydiver my vega vs theres and a 7900x overclocked to 4.8(imagine the heat that puts off







)

Quote:


> https://valid.x86.fr/g6wnbx
> 
> 3.9 25082017fixed
> https://valid.x86.fr/q1nz8m
> 
> firestrike
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13449692
> 
> skydiver
> http://www.3dmark.com/sd/4789834
> 
> comparison
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/sd/4788591/sd/4789834#
> 
> geek4
> https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/3798159
> 
> geek4 compute
> 
> https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/compute/1047234


----------



## dodgethis

Let me join the club!

Waiting for the weekend so that I can make the transplant from my current rig. I have already boot tested the mobo and RAM in the shop with my Cryorig A40 AIO.





Now waiting for my EKWB waterblock!


----------



## tarot

welcome to the club









ok little more news of 3900 land
still very stable BUT i do think better cooling will be needed









i ramped the fans up to 90 percent over 65 adjusted a couple of the lower ones, for most tests 65/68 degrees BUT then someone mentioned ycruncher....that thing sucks








78 degrees while doing a 2.5billion run(got 1.33 though and stable) but 78 is a bit to warm for my liking 68 i can live with.
as for the fans even at 1800 they did not go over 45 decibels and a pleasant noise at that as opposed to the stock corsair ones.

for a comparison i run the same ycruncher test at stock got 1.44 but temps maxed out at 58 and the fans only got to 1200 so very quiet.

now knowing the chip is capable i believe i shall save up for some extreme water cooling type setup...just have to figure out what to buy









oh sorry and 3900= 275 watts whee stock=177 watts at least that's what i,m reading unless i need to add node o and node 1 together?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Mate I live in China. I promise you that they do.
> 
> The existance of these water blocks may well be news to new TR owners. Additionally, the cost of the block is half that of an EK unit that may also be of interest to people on a tighter budget who still wan a custom loop.
> 
> Having said that, I am not recommending them as a must have or even trying to convince people that they should get one. I only posted it as a public service announcement. I don't know how well they perform and I have never used one
> 
> I was responding to you saying you wanted a well known brand. I was pointing out that Bykski was actually more well known than EKWB. Handling RMAs is a valid point, but you didn't say that before.


So this thing on taobao is about 60 usd before shipping and on Ebay its 79 best offer. The EK block is 77 USD. So it's not half, I am sure I could use the chinese version of tabao and get it for less than 60 USD however, plus shipping plus time to get it to me. I wouldn't say its half. I willing to try their stuff in the future but I saw their US store is lauching so we will see. Just like I trust barrow now when I didn't before. However, having barrow and bitspower fittings in my drawer there is still a difference, as much as people like to say it's just a rebrand.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Alright well I am up and running and outside of a ridiculous Win10 start menu bug that I simply cant get around everything is running well. Havent started benching anything but did get my ram up to 3466 (given 3400) wasn't an option.

So people what are the thoughts on ocing )somewhat apprehensive until I can get an appropriate cooling solutions), with a boost clock of over 4.0ghz I cant see there being a realistic performance difference. Thoughts?


----------



## farcodev

I pushed mine @3.9Ghz just to see, since the PC is pretty stable at my current config of 3.7Ghz / 2666Mhz RAM (until one day I can OC it at 3200)
I kept the same VCORE of 1.25V
All is well and stable too, of course the temp have bumped a bit but I'm OK with the result.

No GPU test since I run only a old GT240 until I swap the one from the X79 on the TR.
So here during the AIDA64 stress test:


And the rest:


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## nycgtr

EK block owners. Anyone swap the top on their threadripper block? I honesty don't see why it cant be swapped. Aside from the sticker relocate I don't see how it's any different. Imma try it when I get home tonight just want to see if anyone has already.


----------



## ajc9988

So, chipset drivers released yesterday:
http://support.amd.com/en-us/download/chipset?os=Windows+10+-+64


----------



## Medusa666

Do you guys experience any troubles with this new CPU and setup?

I built a new PC last month, Ryzen 7, Flare X memory, X370 motherboard, all the right stuff. I was super careful when I put everything togheter, used ESD-protection mat and gloves etc. So far, I had mostly troubles, not big enough to really bother, but enough to be annoying and making me want to sell everything.

I'm looking to Threadripper, but I'm afraid it will be same thing all over, so also considering Intel X299, even though I dislike Intel as a company and a brand.

What to do, luxury problems


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Do you guys experience any troubles with this new CPU and setup?
> 
> I built a new PC last month, Ryzen 7, Flare X memory, X370 motherboard, but I had mostly troubles, not big enough to really bother, but enough to be annoying and making me want to sell everything.
> 
> I'm looking to Threadripper, but I'm afraid it will be same thing all over, so also considering Intel X299, even though I dislike Intel as a company and a brand.
> 
> What to do, luxury problems


I was on the ryzen launch beta testers group lol. Seriously ryzen 7 was such a beta test for threadripper to an extent. I had the board commit suicide. Freezes, random crashes. Memory issues etc. Those problems were gone by the time I got out of it. I jumped into a 7900x setup for a bit and sold that off to a buddy on threadripper launch. First boot was like NIGHT AND DAY compared to ryzen. My ram actually ran at DOCP without me doing anything. The whole flarex was such a gimmick imo. It was just ram that played nicer at the time, not even 100% running at rated speeds. I've had no crashes, no freezes nothing. Now memory support isnt going to be like intel but if your needs require more lanes and cores then go for it. But the ryzen 7 platform is pretty stable now.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Do you guys experience any troubles with this new CPU and setup?
> 
> I built a new PC last month, Ryzen 7, Flare X memory, X370 motherboard, all the right stuff. I was super careful when I put everything togheter, used ESD-protection mat and gloves etc. So far, I had mostly troubles, not big enough to really bother, but enough to be annoying and making me want to sell everything.
> 
> I'm looking to Threadripper, but I'm afraid it will be same thing all over, so also considering Intel X299, even though I dislike Intel as a company and a brand.
> 
> What to do, luxury problems


I honestly had no issues outside of a well know Win10 start menu bug. My only headache was putting my memory up to rated speed and that literally took 2 tries.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Do you guys experience any troubles with this new CPU and setup?
> 
> I built a new PC last month, Ryzen 7, Flare X memory, X370 motherboard, all the right stuff. I was super careful when I put everything togheter, used ESD-protection mat and gloves etc. So far, I had mostly troubles, not big enough to really bother, but enough to be annoying and making me want to sell everything.
> 
> I'm looking to Threadripper, but I'm afraid it will be same thing all over, so also considering Intel X299, even though I dislike Intel as a company and a brand.
> 
> What to do, luxury problems


I've had no platform level issues of any kind with my 1700X system. With heatsinks just now becoming available and water cooling not something I wanted to waste money on, I haven't had a chance to use the 1950X enough to know if it is problematic in any way.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Do you guys experience any troubles with this new CPU and setup?
> 
> I built a new PC last month, Ryzen 7, Flare X memory, X370 motherboard, all the right stuff. I was super careful when I put everything togheter, used ESD-protection mat and gloves etc. So far, I had mostly troubles, not big enough to really bother, but enough to be annoying and making me want to sell everything.
> 
> I'm looking to Threadripper, but I'm afraid it will be same thing all over, so also considering Intel X299, even though I dislike Intel as a company and a brand.
> 
> What to do, luxury problems


fo starters i had a 1800x on launch day with ax370 Baymax the only issue had was ram
went through three sets to find the right one and it was the flare x 3200...xmp done that was it after that zero issues.
as long as you get the right ram from the start here you also will have zero issues with threadripper at least i haven't (i got another set of flarex and golden









the only issue is the heat and that is honestly to be expected who here is coming from a big intel like the 6950 clocked up how hot did they get?

if you want to dip your toes wait a few days get a asrock taichi...the cheapest board and the best







and a 1900x (the 8 core ripper) which will be the cheapest and take it from there but get the right ram.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> I pushed mine @3.9Ghz just to see, since the PC is pretty stable at my current config of 3.7Ghz / 2666Mhz RAM (until one day I can OC it at 3200)
> I kept the same VCORE of 1.25V
> All is well and stable too, of course the temp have bumped a bit but I'm OK with the result.
> 
> No GPU test since I run only a old GT240 until I swap the one from the X79 on the TR.
> So here during the AIDA64 stress test:


do me a favour and run corona 1.3
maybe realbench because i am afeared that 1.25 won't cut it with a full load.
plus your temps seem incredibly low.(what llc did you use?)

i might try 1.25 and see how i go


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Tarifas

Need a clarification, if anyone knows, does TR have 2 IMCs, you know, one per die connected through IF?


----------



## hebrewbacon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Looks like the MSI x399 sold out at the egg, but it's actually the cheapest pathway to threadripper goodness...though that and the also worthy Taichi combos are virtually the same price.


I was able the grab the last Taichi at my Microcenter yesterday







Considering the fact that the Taichi has confirmed support of DDR4-3600 and awesome features it might be the king. Unless you want all the features of the zenith.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tarifas*
> 
> Need a clarification, if anyone knows, does TR have 2 IMCs, you know, one per die connected through IF?


Yes. Each die has its own IMC. That is why NUMA applies. To get to the other memory, it traces from mirroring core on other die, then out to memory if needed on the ram controlled by the other die.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hebrewbacon*
> 
> I was able the grab the last Taichi at my Microcenter yesterday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Considering the fact that the Taichi has confirmed support of DDR4-3600 and awesome features it might be the king. Unless you want all the features of the zenith.


Don't count out Giga! They also have QVL of 3600, except the ram they have on that list is XMP 3600, whereas the ram that does 3600 on the Taichi QVL is all XMP of 3733 or above. Also, it sucks down the most energy and scores slightly better on the Guru3d review, whereas the Taichi and the Zenith trade blows. Also, Giga will get a monoblock, Asrock will not. Both are good boards. Just saying.

Source: http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asrock_x399_taichi_review,14.html


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Don't count out Giga! They also have QVL of 3600, except the ram they have on that list is XMP 3600, whereas the ram that does 3600 on the Taichi QVL is all XMP of 3733 or above. Also, it sucks down the most energy and scores slightly better on the Guru3d review, whereas the Taichi and the Zenith trade blows. Also, Giga will get a monoblock, Asrock will not. Both are good boards. Just saying.
> 
> Source: http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asrock_x399_taichi_review,14.html


there is zero wrong with the 4 boards (except giga and msi have had a few issues especially with hard drives it seems but i believe they are fixed)
my reasoning was price/features and the taichi beat all of them
dual 1g nics
lots of shiny usb3 and usb 2
some of the heaviest vrm heatsinks i have seen outside a Sherman tank...and my vrm temps are very good i think.

very subtle leds (although i do miss the baymax's light show







)

as for ram i haven't bothered with 3466 yet on the flarex but i,m guessing it should work and probably give me the same results it did on the 1800x ....naff all nothing









now as for the above 3900 @ 1.25 volts
he is on to something.

i have been doing a bunch of tests on mine at 1.25 and so far nothing i throw at it causes issues and @1.25 uses 30 odd less watts and runs cooler.
@1.3 ycruncher 2.5b was getting to 79 degrees with the fans ramped to around 1600 rpm
@1.25 same bench is 69 degrees with the fans at 1200 rpm (pretty much silent)

so there ya go...4g at 1.25 will be my next test.

and for those wanting to stress test the latest ycruncher so far has pushed this ahrder than anything else i have thrown at it


----------



## Kriant

I think I am also caving in and getting an EK block. Got a hold of XSPC - they have a delay and the block is now coming out early September. I'll still prly go with XSPC once they release, but I need something now, as my 1950x and Zenith are just sitting here on my table, looking at me...asking to be installed....


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> That's stinky news about XSPC, but watercool's progress looks sexy as all get out and I'd likely wait to see what they come up with anyway. Really surprised more haven't just snagged a cheapy generic block and glued it on threadripper one way or another to get by till the real blocks show up. Cheeseball blocks can be had for < $20 or you can massacre an AIO...dropping $80+ for a not optimal EK block does not compute for me. As ever ymmv.


Problem is with both watercool and XSPC - tentative lunches can be moved and my 30 day return window is ticking. I don't have any cheap AIO's lying around to massacre - so that's kinda a no deal. I don't think EK's block is truly sub-optimal, chances are it will still perform farily well, def not as good as XSPC's or watercool, but I can always upgrade to those when they release (if performance difference will warrant it) or for the heck of it on New Years or around that time, lol.


----------



## LunaP

I read somewhere that AMD didn't release details to the vendors till the last minute which is why the WB market is so damn behind.


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> I read somewhere that AMD didn't release details to the vendors till the last minute which is why the WB market is so damn behind.


I wouldn't be surprised one bit if that's true


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> Gaming with 1950X is ...pretty bad...


Errr it has been reviewed to death - 1950x or 1920x for gaming is not the best option, not sure what's the point yet another review that shows the same? =)


----------



## nycgtr

So I installed the EK block today. The cpu is on it's own loop to a 360 gts. Ambient of 28c. Hits 70c max on load @ 1.35v 4.05ghz. 4.1 is a no no at 1.35.


----------



## ChronoBodi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> ThreadRipper 1950X _initially_ was a nightmare for me... This is somewhat long - but if you like reading a good real life computer story - read it. If you guy's want the pictures... I'll dig up the pictures.. But to me it's like seeing a murder scene. I want to look away, I have no interest in seeing it...
> 
> I got my 1950X a few days ago and have it in a temporary case for 'proving' (making sure theres no defective parts). The CPU installation was a nightmare, bloody nightmare and I almost began to cry - i did the unthinkable, the unimaginable. I patiently got things ready on the motherboard and CPU (I wore medical grade gloves so I didn't even get fingerprints on anything, I was paranoid)... I have high intensity LED light mast overhead blaring at full power and taking photos of every step. As I slid the CPU into the bracket very slowly - one of the sides of the orange cartridge thing was not fully in place inside the metal lip of the bracket. Gently, slowly slid it in further... Then the CPU fell through... and smashed a patch of the pins on the LGA socket and bent them...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... I jumped up and started telling myself 'no no no no no no'.... when I saw the smashed patch of pins... I turned away and almost started balling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not looking at the motherboard on my desk I took so much patient time to prepare... I watched all the YouTube videos, and read all the websites explaining how to do this properly. I didn't rush anything. This was a $500 motherboard I just destroyed. Never saw 1 day of use. My bloodpressure started to rise fast, and I was flushed with anxiety. I was so ashamed of myself.
> 
> I build small circuit boards (mainly FM radio's) as a hobby and working with ultra fine connections has crossed me a few times so I own a 2000x microscope for this with a live HD camera hooked into my monitor... I knew what I had to do... The unsullied motherboard, will be sullied - I was going to bend all the pins back and attempt the unthinkable. When the CPU fell, upon impact the inertia drug the CPU into a patch of pins and inverted several.My initial fear was bending them back would break them off. The pins are too small to see with the naked eye normally because of the rows and rows causes optical illusions with your eyes eveuntally. Under the scope the pins individually look like your arm from the elbow to your hand. Imagine holding an apple out in front of you with your hand out flat. From your elbow to the hand is each pin and at the top (the palm) of each one is a rounded dollop to make contact with the CPU. Take that same hand now, and put it to your face with your had over your mouth. That's how bent many pins were.
> 
> Over the period of a couple hours and PAINSTAKINGLY bent each pin SLOWLY under the scope, each bend I expected the contact point to snap off. There so fragile. A few were bent SIDEWAYS. I found the best tool ultimately was a toothpick. Somewhat too big at time's, it was soft enough to absorb any hard edges but not leave any residue, and also did not scratch the contacts. The sideways bends I did a gentle tug-tug-tug against the pin as to not bend it too much. Nothing broke! I was down to the last, and worst bent pin - all was looking good so far and the pin's metal did not fatigue as I thought it would - they were a lot more resilient than I expected! Feeling the tautness and flexibility of the metal I believe it to be gold plated nickel. I was still wearing gloves and would frequently (gently) graze my finger along the pins in the direction that they lead (so I didnt bend anymore!) and I could feel a few rough bumps. I pushed down gently until the bumps were out. Now this last pin.. Honestly I was shaking... I didn't want to bend it, I could barely see the proper angle because of the light reflecting back into the scope was casting shadows. I had to re-assess the bend over and over... It was horrible. It looked like your arm and your making a fist, and aim your fist at your face like your going to punch your own face. The hand of the pin was bent completely back, the arm was inverted and warped... Remember the proper angle was like your holding and apple with a flat palm out in front of you. The palm would be the part that contacted the CPU.
> 
> I didn't pay for this motherboard or CPU - it was a gift from my significant other who is going on a family trip to Europe. I had a lot of problems with my i7 4930K and the Asus Sabertooth x79 developed in 2011 it was currently living in. They (the significant other) heard me rant here and there about it and decided to get me my dream PC for staying behind and watching the puppies and chickens we own. I had so many problems with that motherboard. Asus abandon it with a BETA BIOS that never fully worked and you had to reset the bios frequently to get it going like an old VW Bug. It worked when you did a certain thing to it every time and you had to keep doing that but you were sick and fed up with the random chance that it didn't want to work with you on any particular day.
> 
> The LAST Pin...
> I was having such a hard time seeing proper angles, rotating the motherboard around on my desk to see the exact bend. I needed to see this because if I had a chance to bend it back - it would be only one opportunity to bend it. If I bent it too much I would need to bend this pin back and fatigue it more - it would surely break. I spent about 10 minutes examining this last little bastard. Every possible angle it could move with opposing angular force. With that toothpick... I nudged it gently here, gently there. The last swipe over the top to bend the flat top back! DONE! I pressed my finger against the top of the patch of pins again and stroke them feeling for height irregularities - some felt a little too high... I pressed down with my finger just enough to balance out the pins that were too high and it felt right. Putting the board under the scope again I looked..... It was nearly flawless! No broken pins and all rows had the same distance between each other, nothing was off canter.
> 
> Putting the CPU back in the carriage, sliding it in and feeling the bump that it was placed correctly I laid it down. Then tightened each screw a little around the clock, never tightening a single screw all the way on the first try. Little by little the ThreadRipper 1950X was torqued into place..... The time was to power it up and see .... I preyed to God this worked because I didn't know what I was going to do... I pressed the power button, light's lit up on the motherboard, no errors on the LED readout... My monitor turned on showing the Gigabyte Aorus Eagle logo on the Gaming 7 motherboard. Thank you God! Thank you! I yelled. I couldn't believe it... I did it. Everything seems to always fail for me, always.. But today, this time, right now... It worked.
> 
> Typing this on 8-18-2017 @ 12:13AM here in Redding, California this was 3 days ago. As patient and careful as I was. As slow and gentle as I could be - MISTAKES STILL HAPPEN. Nobody is perfect. _This is my ThreadRipper story_ and I won't ever forget it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Its running great! I've OC'ed all cores stable at 1.25v to 3.8GHz (this is temporary I plan on leaving it stock ... for now!).
> 
> In the end it just stresses the resilience of the AMD platform and why we need to continue supporting it. Intel may still have faster CPU's for $8,000 but these little firecrackers and their motherboards are in it for the long haul. Gigabyte won a new long-term-customer.
> 
> My Hardware:
> CPU: AMD ThreadRipper 1950X
> Mobo: Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7
> RAM: G.Skill DDR4 2400 RGB 32GB (8x4 quad channel)
> GPU: Two Sapphire Nitro+ 8GB RX480's (crossfire)


dude, post this to hardOCP, they claim they can't fix the pins on Threadripper. Holy balls man!


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> Gaming with 1950X is ...pretty bad...


Honestly, every single one of those results are perfectly playable, even though they are lower at 1080p... Anything over 1440p is gpu limited and therefore, making any gaming lead the 7900 had moot, until much faster gpus come available.... And from the looks of it, that will be a while...


----------



## ChronoBodi

Quick pics


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Mate I live in China. I promise you that they do.
> 
> The existance of these water blocks may well be news to new TR owners. Additionally, the cost of the block is half that of an EK unit that may also be of interest to people on a tighter budget who still wan a custom loop.
> 
> Having said that, I am not recommending them as a must have or even trying to convince people that they should get one. I only posted it as a public service announcement. I don't know how well they perform and I have never used one
> 
> I was responding to you saying you wanted a well known brand. I was pointing out that Bykski was actually more well known than EKWB. Handling RMAs is a valid point, but you didn't say that before.
> 
> 
> 
> So this thing on taobao is about 60 usd before shipping and on Ebay its 79 best offer. The EK block is 77 USD. So it's not half, I am sure I could use the chinese version of tabao and get it for less than 60 USD however, plus shipping plus time to get it to me. I wouldn't say its half. I willing to try their stuff in the future but I saw their US store is lauching so we will see. Just like I trust barrow now when I didn't before. However, having barrow and bitspower fittings in my drawer there is still a difference, as much as people like to say it's just a rebrand.
Click to expand...

I though I read somewhere that the EK block was over $100. I am not arguing about relative performance of the two. I don't have any data either way.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

I attached some pictures on the post. I don't have a picture of the large patch of pins that were bent but just the last and most difficult pin. Initially they were all bent up, but the last one bent up and backwards. Several pins twisted or shifted slightly - there were just many that were off and you could feel it with your finger grazing down the rows. Initially when dropped, the CPU bounced slightly after it landed, and much closer to the center of the socket there were 4 that were bent too. If they bend down, like you push the pin down hard and it goes flat - thats much easier to fix I found because you can gently pull it upwards and feel with your finger if it was the right height. When they invert backwards or twist.... damn... it takes at least 10 min per pin - and you need to be soooo patient. If someone didnt have a microscope or tool to look closely then their screwed. I have a diopter lens (like a jewelers eye loupe) that I mostly used on top of my reading glasses lol. Thanks for the comment!

Tools needed to fix bent pins:
-precision picks or a _toothpick_
-Ultra fine tweezers
-Something to magnify the pins


----------



## rdr09

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> The video shows that 1950x is behind at the same rate over 20% no matter 1080 or 1440. It is horrible. This becomes only makes sense for someone doing pure match research or extreme 3d graphic design at home but not gaming at all.


Higher fps does not necessarily mean smoother game play. Although this yt only tested one game, i've seen two other vids that compared, not this but ryzen, to intel and same thing. Slower but smoother.


----------



## rdr09

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> if we are talking about ryzen 4 cores vs intel 2 cores 4 threads then yes at some points in the game ryzen 3 with 4 cores would be smoother and the minimum 1% stats can shows that
> but come on we are talk about crazy many threads cpu in this post, and you can see threadripper is crazy behind no matter average fps, minimum 1% fps.


Nope. One was Broadwell. I was playing W3 and i saw it was using all cores of my cpu as well as all its threads. If i hit Windows record - boom my fps drops.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> Gaming with 1950X is ...pretty bad...


Yet it says otherwise lol? actually no I'm not gonna feed this lol.


----------



## tarot

you need to read more reviews and for the record i get 7900 in timespy with a vega 64 and 70/90 fps in doom @ultra settings with the same vega and smooth as butter.
i have no issues with games.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> It is not just not the best, it is extremely behind just like Bulldozer, it is just another Bulldozer with better marketing.


and this statement are you serious... obviously you are not or maybe have not been able to read anything.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> The video shows that 1950x is behind at the same rate over 20% no matter 1080 or 1440. It is horrible. This becomes only makes sense for someone doing pure match research or extreme 3d graphic design at home but not gaming at all.


and this as stated i am faster than a 7900x in timespy with the same video card stock overclocked i stomp it.

https://hothardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-threadripper-processor-review?page=7

where's the crazy?
http://www.pcgamer.com/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1950x-1920x-review/

have another.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> you need to read more reviews and for the record i get 7900 in timespy with a vega 64 and 70/90 fps in doom @ultra settings with the same vega and smooth as butter.
> i have no issues with games.
> and this statement are you serious... obviously you are not or maybe have not been able to read anything.
> and this as stated i am faster than a 7900x in timespy with the same video card stock overclocked i stomp it.
> 
> https://hothardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-threadripper-processor-review?page=7
> 
> where's the crazy?
> http://www.pcgamer.com/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1950x-1920x-review/
> 
> have another.


He's been trolling other threads claiming things before even seeing reviews, thats why I stopped myself, its not worth it.


----------



## rdr09

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> How many cores in your Broadwell?


Broadwell-E. Lets take it to pm instead of cluttering the thread. You're new to OCN and this is really not normally practiced.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> I dont know why you think I troll, I just express the youtube review result and you can clearly see that 1950x is over 20% lower fps in games in average.


People these days watch some youtube videos and think they know everything sigh lol. That 20% is highly case specific. More importantly 1800x, 6700k, 7900x, 1950x owner here. I cant tell a difference for my life. So quit while your ahead.


----------



## Prophet4NO1

Started ordering parts for my Threadripper rebuild. For now just mobo, ram, and CPU. Also new water block. Keep going back and forth on the 1950x and 1920x. It's only $200. For now I will reuse the rest of my rig. Will be nice to get off this old X79 platform.


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> So I installed the EK block today. The cpu is on it's own loop to a 360 gts. Ambient of 28c. Hits 70c max on load @ 1.35v 4.05ghz. 4.1 is a no no at 1.35.


So, are you satisfied with your EK block for the time being? Also, which one did you get? Plexi? Acetal? nickel-coated brass? (reason I am asking is I am truly wondering if the fins area remained 100% unchanged from standard supremacy evo)


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> So, are you satisfied with your EK block for the time being? Also, which one did you get? Plexi? Acetal? nickel-coated brass? (reason I am asking is I am truly wondering if the fins area remained 100% unchanged from standard supremacy evo)


It's a nice 20c drop from the h100. I couldn't run it oc for long without throttle at full load before. I was running stock and manual low voltage prior to the block. Does a decent job. I can only compare it to the h100v2. I'll get the heatkiller when it's out.


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> So, are you satisfied with your EK block for the time being? Also, which one did you get? Plexi? Acetal? nickel-coated brass? (reason I am asking is I am truly wondering if the fins area remained 100% unchanged from standard supremacy evo)


I got my nickel block a few days ago. It's pretty good. temps are around 25c idle and between 55-60c full load. Works great.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> I got my nickel block a few days ago. It's pretty good. temps are around 25c idle and between 55-60c full load. Works great.


Stock/OC? 1920x/1950x?


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Prophet4NO1*
> 
> Started ordering parts for my Threadripper rebuild. For now just mobo, ram, and CPU. Also new water block. Keep going back and forth on the 1950x and 1920x. It's only $200. For now I will reuse the rest of my rig. Will be nice to get off this old X79 platform.


Same here, price difference is not THAT big, but if it means increased heat I might just go for 1920x. It just seems like a more sensible choice, but FOMO is talking to me and it would be nice to just get the best thing right away instead of regretting it later.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ChronoBodi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> if we are talking about ryzen 4 cores vs intel 2 cores 4 threads then yes at some points in the game ryzen 3 with 4 cores would be smoother and the minimum 1% stats can shows that
> but come on we are talk about crazy many threads cpu in this post, and you can see threadripper is crazy behind no matter average fps, minimum 1% fps.
> Originally Posted by iphone8 View Post
> 
> It is not just not the best, it is extremely behind just like Bulldozer, it is just another Bulldozer with better marketing.




IPhone8, don't waste your time. You claim bulldozer ipc for ryzen, yet this is not the case at all.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Blasphemy. Everybody knows zen's single threaded performance is total dog vomit that nobody ever should be forced to endure.
> 
> Charts that show the truth about how the differences in single/lightly threaded applications are marginal at best, particularly between competing HEDT platforms, should obviously be ignored in favor of anecdotal "evidence" and unsubstantiated "feelings".


dudes name is iPhone.... no more to say really(i feed a troll once a day as a humanitarian effort)

also from memory the 1900x is getting released on the 28th...might be worth waiting to see what that brings t the table also i have noticed here intel dropped the 7900x to $1399 to undercut the TR by $40 but now the TR is $1399 so yeah suck it








which means in a weak *maybe another notch* dropping off the price
so anyone on the fence really may want to wait for the first week of next month even if you don't want an amd setup i,m pretty sure inhell will do a little trimming(cause they sure as **** aren't bringing any innovation







)


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> It's a nice 20c drop from the h100. I couldn't run it oc for long without throttle at full load before. I was running stock and manual low voltage prior to the block. Does a decent job. I can only compare it to the h100v2. I'll get the heatkiller when it's out.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> I got my nickel block a few days ago. It's pretty good. temps are around 25c idle and between 55-60c full load. Works great.


Thanks guys!

I caved in and ordered full nickel block.


----------



## Beatnutz

I've got 3 GPU's (2 x 980 Ti, 1 1080 Ti). A bit nervous about the heat increase in an already hot system between 1920X and 1950X. Trying to keep it as low as possible so I don't have to listen to the annoying sound of fans/pumps). Been trying to find some charts on the heat difference but no cigar. Does anybody have any info?


----------



## ChronoBodi

I get like 65C loads with the TT 360mm aio on stock.

If you're gonna really oc this thing, go custom loop.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> I get like 65C loads with the TT 360mm aio on stock.
> 
> If you're gonna really oc this thing, go custom loop.


Already on it (sorry if that wasn't clear). Not really planning on OC'ing it either if that means temps above 70c for me. But would rather see temps around 60c tops. Just not sure if I should go 1950x or 1920x. If the temp difference is negligible then 1950x it is.


----------



## Kriant

Btw, does anyone have any experience with Byski blocks?


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ChronoBodi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Already on it (sorry if that wasn't clear). Not really planning on OC'ing it either if that means temps above 70c for me. But would rather see temps around 60c tops. Just not sure if I should go 1950x or 1920x. If the temp difference is negligible then 1950x it is.


It's negligable, they both do the same temps at stock, 1920x by keeping a higher base clock all cores and 1950x by moar cores.

https://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/luke-hill/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1950x-16c32t-1920x-12c24t-cpu-review/9/


----------



## nycgtr

The 1950x pumps out a lot of heat Oced. Unlike ryzen where I barely felt warm air, the air coming from the rad idle is quite warm lol.


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> The 1950x pumps out a lot of heat Oced. Unlike ryzen where I barely felt warm air, the air coming from the rad idle is quite warm lol.


How much rad space did you dedicate for your 1950x?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> How much rad space did you dedicate for your 1950x?


360 gts for just cpu. Hooked up to a d5.


----------



## springs113

This was exactly how I put it and the wife caved.


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> 360 gts for just cpu. Hooked up to a d5.


So 360 and supremacy evo block keeps an oc threadripper from throttling?

I am just thinking if I need/want to add another rad to my loop (currently will have a 1080 nova and a 360 gts cooling threadripper and one 1080ti). Doesn't soubd like I'll need to add more rad space


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> So 360 and supremacy evo block keeps an oc threadripper from throttling?
> 
> I am just thinking if I need/want to add another rad to my loop (currently will have a 1080 nova and a 360 gts cooling threadripper and one 1080ti). Doesn't soubd like I'll need to add more rad space


I have 2 loops one with a 480 and a 360 cooling 2 titan xps and 1 loop with a 360 cooling 1950x.



ML120s all around except sp 120s at the bottom rad. Running them around 850 rpm. As I like watercooling to be silent. I do have the fans set to the cpu temp to ramp up but never past 1300 as that becomes noisy. I haven't read it stock with the block as I had my OC profile ready to go once the block hit I am running at 4.05ghz and 1.35v.

My ambient is kinda high usually near 30 until winter. Even then the heating is ridiculous lol. My pc is far from a window so it pretty much sucks in 28-30c air. I don't have a temp sensor on the cpu loop atm so I can't tell you the water temp. Shooting a laser at it gives me 36c, not the most accurate but good enough. I am idling around 38-40, load stays 69-70.

I have a 480 that I was gonna fit on top for the cpu but that makes it hard to fill the reservoirs. I do have a fill bottle but I prefer the old funnel.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> That will surely depend on voltage required to maintain stability on said overclock as well as ambient temps. 1.4+ volts fully loaded are going to be tough to handle even for some custom loops to maintain. The heat goes up really quickly when you start putting serious volts through threadripper.


Yea i agree. If i was going for 4.1 I would most likely add a rad. However, I don't find it that necessary to go for 4.1 My tasks require cores, io and ram. Cpu clock speeds don't help me much and I game at 4k so not needed.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I've got 3 GPU's (2 x 980 Ti, 1 1080 Ti). A bit nervous about the heat increase in an already hot system between 1920X and 1950X. Trying to keep it as low as possible so I don't have to listen to the annoying sound of fans/pumps). Been trying to find some charts on the heat difference but no cigar. Does anybody have any info?


I got 2x 1080ti's and 1x 980ti so I'll let you know how mine fairs. Guess I'll grab the nickel block


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> I got 2x 1080ti's and 1x 980ti so I'll let you know how mine fairs. Guess I'll grab the nickel block


Gonna need at least 3 rads for that without noises. Ran a dual cpu loop before with 3 gpus. HOT HOT HOT lol.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Gonna need at least 3 rads for that without noises. Ran a dual cpu loop before with 3 gpus. HOT HOT HOT lol.


Its goin in my current rig, which is 4x 480 rads @60, so should be good, 32 AP15 fans in push pull for some overkill fun @70% so pretty quiet.


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> I got my nickel block a few days ago. It's pretty good. temps are around 25c idle and between 55-60c full load. Works great.


Thats a 1920x at 4.0 with 1.33v stressed for 2 hours.


----------



## maddmarlowe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> set power to performance to start with my guess is the cores are not getting used(also where is that thing for passmark don't remember ever seeing that)
> 
> also have hwinfo running when you do the benches maybe log it and see whats dropping off.
> 
> for reference thsis mine stock
> https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/3788019
> 
> geekbench 3 i get 58 k in multi
> in cb 15 2920 all day long.
> 
> passmark i just ran it (my memory scores are low but i have had that issue since the 1800x for some reason i think its OS issue but yeah.)
> 
> also i find little to no difference with numa vs uma especially in games so i leave on distributed.


Thank you so much for taking the time to help. Honestly I have had nothing but problems with this build and am at a loss.

I really need some help here!

Possible culprits:

*-RAM is too slow*

I tested my ram at 2400 and 2133, I tested each individual stick, and together. Others have tested their ram at 2133, their 1950x scores are significantly better than mine at stock speeds. I also ran diagnostics and both sticks came back fine.

*-Windows 7 Pro is not optimized*

I bought a brand new Samsung 960 Evo m.2 nvme 500gb, bought windows 10 pro, did a clean install, all scores were very similar. So I ran disk performance and diagnostics, 2300mb read and 1900mb write. In comparison I was running windows 7 pro on a 950 pro M.2 256gb nvme, that ssd also tested fine and benched similarly.
*
-BIOS*

I noticed my MSI x399 carbon ac motherboard was running bios 1.2, so I successfully updated to 1.3 which supposedly added support for threadripper... now the scores are actually worse. Not sure how that's possible. I have not had any problems loading BIOS, not even once, the motherboard seems to be running exactly as its supposed to.

*-Drives*

I have removed all of my other drives except boot, and it tested flawless. I even relocated the drive to other m.2 slots. I moved the graphics card slot because I read that some of the m.2 drive slots and pcie slots were grouped together on the same bus, no difference whatsoever.

*-graphics card*

this is a brand new msi 1080ti duke, it benchmarks well. Great scores across the board out of the box with no additional OC applied. I couldn't detect any irregularities.

*-ryzen master*

I can confirm that all cores are active, the temperature is stable. creator mode runs all 16 cores and 32 threads. Gaming mode runs 8 cores and 16 threads.

*hwinfo*

I ran logs during every single benchmark, zero errors. Beyond errors I'm not exactly sure what I'm looking for?

*-Benchmarks*

Creator Mode

PASSMARK - I see that not too many people take this bench seriously, however it does record all scores and allows you to measure against other threadrippers, mine scored the ABSOLUTE WORST of every single 1950x cpu ever tested, 13000 this is not good, I have an i7 6800k and get 14000 out of that cpu. See attached image, it shows my cpu at the very bottom of the scale.



GEEKBENCH 3 (32-bit) http://browser.geekbench.com/geekbench3/8434745

GEEKBENCH 4 (64-bit) https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/3813585

CINEBENCH R15 average score is 2790cb

Gaming mode

PASSMARK - cant even break 13000



GEEKBENCH 3 (32-bit) http://browser.geekbench.com/geekbench3/8434772

GEEKBENCH 4 (64-bit) https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/3814123

CINEBENCH R15 average score is 1600

AM I DOING SOMETHING WRONG?

ARE THESE BENCHMARK CORRECT?

LOL!


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> Thats a 1920x at 3.9 with 1.325v stressed for 2 hours.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> That sounds like a pretty good result. Would be interesting to see how much moar heat a 1950x would generate at same volts/clocks though it seems likely that 1950s will generally require a bit more voltage to stabilize at 4Ghz since it usually does take a bit more when you move up in core count. What's your pump/rad/fan setup look like for that build?


I've still got a bunch of work to do to it, just got it up and running 2 days ago, trying to stabilize everything.
It's a x9, 2 x 480 rads top with 8 vadar fans Exhaust plus 1 exhaust topside and one extra bottom under the midplate ). 2 x 200mm fans up front and 2 x 120mm fans mobo side bottom intake. EK 140 D5 pump/res combo, 1080ti with ek block and the nickel TR block.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> I've still got a bunch of work to do to it, just got it up and running 2 days ago, trying to stabilize everything.
> It's a x9, 2 x 480 rads top with 8 vadar fans Exhaust plus 1 exhaust topside and one extra bottom under the midplate ). 2 x 200mm fans up front and 2 x 120mm fans mobo side bottom intake. EK 140 D5 pump/res combo, 1080ti with ek block and the nickel TR block.


So it looks like we will have a similar setup after I buy the rest of my setup. I've got the X9 as well and planned on 2x480 Nemesis Black Ice GTX, but may put in a third. I'll probably get Vardar fans for the second and third rads, but one is going to have the Noctua iPPC 3000 fans (I already have six, what it buying two more).


----------



## tarot

ok so for the less intelligent of use...me... can someone run down what i would need to cool a 1950x and a dingle vega 64

blocks i know one for the TR and one for the vega.

what i,m confused on is what else...1 rad per device running off the same pump? or 2 pumps and how is it plumbed...

my case can take 2 280 rads pretty easily or a 140 in the rear like i had with the fury x.

hints...shopping list


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So it looks like we will have a similar setup after I buy the rest of my setup. I've got the X9 as well and planned on 2x480 Nemesis Black Ice GTX, but may put in a third. I'll probably get Vardar fans for the second and third rads, but one is going to have the Noctua iPPC 3000 fans (I already have six, what it buying two more).


As much as I would love to see the third rad, it won't make any difference in temps. There is more than enough radspace for dual 1080tis and a highly overclocked 1950x. I had another 480 I hooked up outside the case in the loop when I was testing , the temps were exactly the same, so I went with 2 rads instead.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Its goin in my current rig, which is 4x 480 rads @60, so should be good, 32 AP15 fans in push pull for some overkill fun @70% so pretty quiet.


Dang thats a pretty crazy setup. I think you will be fine







. I'm only on 420 + 360. It's rare that I'm blasting my 3 GPU's at the same time though so hopefully temps will be managable. Gotta make up my mind about 1920 vs. 1950 today though so I can order it tonight.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Depends on how much you want to spend and how much room you have. If you want to go with separate loops you can do that or you can try it with two rads on one loop. The latter would be my choice if you're just trying to cool one CPU and one GPU...and of course you can change it later if you like.
> 
> As far as how to plumb the thing, all that really matter is that the reservoir is higher up than the pump. It's also nice if the drain is at the lowest point and there's some form of bleeder valve at the highest point, but the world doesn't end if you can't make those things happen. The order in which you connect the principle components of your loop doesn't make a bunch of difference in the grand scheme, so just connect them in the most efficient manner. Usually that's pump ---> GPU ---> CPU ---> Rad ---> Res ---> Pump. Obviously if you have two rads to connect then that will splice in there wherever it's most convenient. If your rads are in front and up top then maybe the front mounted rad gets spliced in between the top radiator and the reservoir.
> 
> As far as the shopping list goes, figure two compresion fittings for each component and then add a few more fittings for good measure...something always comes up and you end up needing a couple moar. Depending on whether your pump has two outputs or one, you may need a tee and you'll also need a drain valve and a cap for the valve. Plus obviously you need tubing.


so a separate res and a pump or the all in one ones...does that make a lot of difference?
i,ll look into pricing etc but what i was thinking is a 280 and maybe a 140 rad on the rear or would that not be enough.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> so a separate res and a pump or the all in one ones...does that make a lot of difference?
> i,ll look into pricing etc but what i was thinking is a 280 and maybe a 140 rad on the rear or would that not be enough.


Separate or all in one doesn't matter. It's more a matter of how you lay it out. Some prefer to have pumps hidden, but that also means you need a lot of space (mounting them in two places will need extra space) and also plan it out in detail since you need to route extra tubing. An all in one solution is better until you know more about running a custom loop and actually have need for them to be seperate (if ever). Rad space sounds sufficient if it is only for the CPU. The thing with custom loops is that you always change and make them better, so in that case, if you can, get bigger rads from the get go. You will want to upgrade them anyway later







. And ALWAYS get way more fittings than you need. You'll use them


----------



## tarot

thanks for that gives me a bit to ponder especially the cost..


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> As much as I would love to see the third rad, it won't make any difference in temps. There is more than enough radspace for dual 1080tis and a highly overclocked 1950x. I had another 480 I hooked up outside the case in the loop when I was testing , the temps were exactly the same, so I went with 2 rads instead.


I'm currently looking at future expansion, also, as well as the sound of operation. TBH, I didn't expect it to give more headroom. But that does tell me save the money until I expand above two cards.

To the water cooling noobs (not meaning it derisively), water can only transfer so much heat. After the loop equalizes, you get a delta T of water temp over ambient. You can add more fans and rads, but that will NOT add much cooling capacity when you reach a certain point (law of diminishing returns where the cost of adding more has little to no effect on delta T, thereby not providing ANY extra headroom for overclocking). But that is not to say there is zero reason. With the extra space, you can potentially run all fans at lower speeds to reduce noise, or you could have future plans for additional components. But pay attention to the nuance here! Also, adding another rad increases resistance in the loop, which can necessitate a second pump. There is a lot more to this, but wanted to make sure those that didn't know understand the convo.

Thanks for that testing!


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> So I installed the EK block today. The cpu is on it's own loop to a 360 gts. Ambient of 28c. Hits 70c max on load @ 1.35v 4.05ghz. 4.1 is a no no at 1.35.


I have a 1920X with an EK block on a custom loop to an XE 360 and GTS 360 and I'm hitting 73 degrees on Prime95 full load at 4.1 GHz with 1.35 Vcore. Based on your numbers on a 1950X plus a single radiator maybe I need to remount? Or could Prime just be throwing off that much more heat?


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I have a 1920X with an EK block on a custom loop to an XE 360 and GTS 360 and I'm hitting 73 degrees on Prime95 full load at 4.1 GHz with 1.35 Vcore. Based on your numbers on a 1950X plus a single radiator maybe I need to remount? Or could Prime just be throwing off that much more heat?


Honestly, that doesn't even sound that bad for that OC. What happens if you go down to 3.9/4GHz? Do you roughly get the same temps as the other users here? Otherwise, it could be a lot of things. You can try to reseat the cpu and apply new TIM (don't even have to empty your liquid to do this). Could also be hot air circulating in the case which would add heat, and then the rad fans would suck that hot air in and not cool the rad properly. But yes, Prime95 can really make your CPU sweat.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Medusa666

Considering getting the ASUS ROG Zenith, is it *THE* motherboard for Threadripper?


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Considering getting the ASUS ROG Zenith, is it *THE* motherboard for Threadripper?


Depends on your needs. There is no THE motherboard yet. It has few SATA connections, does have an extra PCIe slot (trust me, that was a huge thing for me), has BIOS issues (all do to some extent currently), loses to Giga in a couple MB roundups on a lot of places, while trading blows with the Taichi, etc. Also, you are paying a premium for a 10G LAN card, which if your network doesn't support it, you are wasting money on it. Etc. So weigh your needs first. How many graphics cards do you plan? What are your needs on fan and pump connections? What are you planning for storage? etc. Is it compatible with what you want to cool? Support? Etc.

Don't jump in fully on someone giving a yes or no here! Do some research or wait for more roundups. Otherwise, you may overpay. There is good and bad with each board at the moment. No one board stomps all others (yet). Also, BIOS/UEFI are still being honed.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## LunaP

One of the bigger things for me on teh asus is the Overclock profiler settings allowing you to back up your arduous timings/settings that you put a lot of time into tweaking . I'm reading that the asrock doesn't support that atm, unsure about the others.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> One of the bigger things for me on teh asus is the Overclock profiler settings allowing you to back up your arduous timings/settings that you put a lot of time into tweaking . I'm reading that the asrock doesn't support that atm, unsure about the others.


Where did you read that at? When I asked @Chew, he mentioned they did: http://www.overclock.net/t/1635296/amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread/300#post_26305797
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> I had intended to include part numbers, but it was late/early. These are the specific plumbing parts I chose, mostly due to bang for buck, prior positive experience, and/or positive feedback.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01DXSO5RY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s02?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> 
> The fittings you choose will have a significant impact on both the build cost and overall satisfaction with the project. These are relatively cheap, but have yet to fail me. They're also ridiculously easy to use and don't even require tools...though I use titanium office shears to cut soft tubing squarely and a pair of rubberized gloves to provide enough gripping power to tighten the fittings completely. They're not going anywhere and I'd put the chances of a leak over time at roughly zero...provided the tubing is cut squarely(this is crucial). The world will end and/or the tubing will dissolve before these things come off on their own.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CSTLCDA/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01H0KWY06/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01LFRBGZE/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01D8BE652/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> 
> If your radiators are new, then your first tubing install is likely to get trashed as flux from the radiators stains the tubing over time. In short, I wouldn't spend a bundle on tubing initially as it will probably get stained and/or you'll change something and cut it to ribbons anyway. Also get more tubing than you think you'll need, because you need some for fill and drain duties.


This is why you should have some trash tubing and flush the rads before EVER being put into service. Some even recommend the Mayhem kit for this: https://mayhems.co.uk/cleaning/mayhems-blitz-cleaning-system/

You still need throw away tubing for that and the flushing (I saw one where a person bought a cheap pump related to a pool for $35 or so, then just used that with a 5 gallon bucket and a paper filter to flush contaminates.




 (not the original video I watched on it, but you get the point)


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## buffalofloyd

Are we expecting AIO liquid coolers specifically designed for Threadripper in the near future? Just curious because I was looking to possibly get into this platform but currently all the AIO coolers are to small for ideal cooling and some overclocking.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## buffalofloyd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> VERY soon. lol
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=enermax+tr4&ignorear=0&N=-1&isNodeId=1


Jeez, that was fast lol. Thank you!


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Absolutely, I just prefer to do it all at once. So the loop was sitting there leak testing, burping, and de-fluxing at the same time. When moar block options become available and I rebuild the loop, I'll either switch to PETG or replace the tubing when swapping out the water block. No biggie, but if I'd spent a bunch on tubing and was unaware of the flux issue I'd be less pleased.


I hear you. But there are a lot of new people to water cooling in this thread, so wanted to give other ideas on how this can be accomplished is all. It's good to give options so that they can fit the best way for them to their budget and situation. There isn't just one way to do it, and it took me lots of research before finding my own methodology. But, more information the better, right? (So long as the information is good and true!).


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> One of the bigger things for me on teh asus is the Overclock profiler settings allowing you to back up your arduous timings/settings that you put a lot of time into tweaking . I'm reading that the asrock doesn't support that atm, unsure about the others.


he taichi has the same system except asus you can save as a text file that's the only difference.

i already have 5 profiles saved to usb









thanks for all the info and insight i, m going to wait till a few blocks come out and get at least one review before throwing down a pile of cash and time









one thing though is it an issue to mount the res/pump or just the res outside on the back of the case(i know it sounds stupid but i want to after 20 years use the tubing holes







)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Considering getting the ASUS ROG Zenith, is it *THE* motherboard for Threadripper?


i don't think so i had the asus x370 Baymax and it was a glorious board but not perfect and took around 7 bioses to get right









the taichi i have on the other hand just works out of the box with one bios upgrade to 130 and done.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> one thing though is it an issue to mount the res/pump or just the res outside on the back of the case(i know it sounds stupid but i want to after 20 years use the tubing holes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


It's not an issue, you just need to check your hose length, length of loop, and make sure you have enough head pressure for the extra distance traveled. As long as you do it right, there should be no problem whatsoever.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Where did you read that at? When I asked @Chew, he mentioned they did: http://www.overclock.net/t/1635296/amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread/300#post_26305797
> This is why you should have some trash tubing and flush the rads before EVER being put into service. Some even recommend the Mayhem kit for this: https://mayhems.co.uk/cleaning/mayhems-blitz-cleaning-system/
> 
> You still need throw away tubing for that and the flushing (I saw one where a person bought a cheap pump related to a pool for $35 or so, then just used that with a 5 gallon bucket and a paper filter to flush contaminates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (not the original video I watched on it, but you get the point)


i,m guessing that is like descaler or whatever.
i,ll keep it mind, you can see why some people never get into it or just give up after time









one thing...is it worth it...i get ok temps on this not perfect for platform h115i what sort of *better* could i expect based on what we have been talking about....you know super roughly or what figures does anyone have with a custom setup


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i,m guessing that is like descaler or whatever.
> i,ll keep it mind, you can see why some people never get into it or just give up after time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> one thing...is it worth it...i get ok temps on this not perfect for platform h115i what sort of *better* could i expect based on what we have been talking about....you know super roughly or what figures does anyone have with a custom setup


When done right, you are getting a higher flow rate (gallons per minute), which acts as more area contacting the cold plate surface. By increasing the surface contact, more heat can be transferred to the water, thereby providing better heat distribution. Radiator quality also varies. Most AIO use aluminum rads, which means that it is less efficient transferring the heat to the metal in the rads, thereby providing less ability to cool. You can use whatever fans you want on the rads, so that is kind of moot. This means, so long as you pick the right components, you can get deltas compared to AIO from 5C+ (it can be higher, just depends on the loop and components, I'm just using approx. min. if done right, whereas the max can be higher). What this does is lower the temp delta of the water in the loop as compared to the ambient temperature of the air that passes through the radiator. Because you are using air, you will only be able to bring water temp close to the temp of the ambient air, with diminishing returns past a certain point (where adding surface area has less effect on the cooling coefficient to bring the water temp to ambient).

That is a descaler, and using the pond pump or similar is to try and flush the scale, etc., from the loop so little particles do not clog the fins on your blocks.

Edit: the cleaner is also very acid, meant to eat away rust and will interact with any flux left as well.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> When done right, you are getting a higher flow rate (gallons per minute), which acts as more area contacting the cold plate surface. By increasing the surface contact, more heat can be transferred to the water, thereby providing better heat distribution. Radiator quality also varies. Most AIO use aluminum rads, which means that it is less efficient transferring the heat to the metal in the rads, thereby providing less ability to cool. You can use whatever fans you want on the rads, so that is kind of moot. This means, so long as you pick the right components, you can get deltas compared to AIO from 5C+ (it can be higher, just depends on the loop and components, I'm just using approx. min. if done right, whereas the max can be higher). What this does is lower the temp delta of the water in the loop as compared to the ambient temperature of the air that passes through the radiator. Because you are using air, you will only be able to bring water temp close to the temp of the ambient air, with diminishing returns past a certain point (where adding surface area has less effect on the cooling coefficient to bring the water temp to ambient).
> 
> That is a descaler, and using the pond pump or similar is to try and flush the scale, etc., from the loop so little particles do not clog the fins on your blocks.
> 
> Edit: the cleaner is also very acid, meant to eat away rust and will interact with any flux left as well.


cool that explains a lot thanks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> A couple guys have posted results with EK blocks. Suggest you look into those. Sounds like 4Ghz @ 1.35ish should be do-able with a decent block...where that's probably too much voltage(heat) for an AIO long term depending on ambient temps of course.
> 
> Asetek style AIO blocks will generally lack the contact surface to remove heat quickly enough from threadripper and also lack the pump pressure to allow you to expand the cooling capicity beyond a 360mm radiator even if you are willing to mutilate the thing to do so.


i,ll have a search around but since i,m getting [email protected] i am pretty confident 4 will be doable lower than 1.35 so that will help less power = less heat







definatelty found that to be the case going from 1.3 to 1.25 30 odd watts in mine was like 10 degrees i,m sure the watts were a bit more but that's what i saw


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Honestly, that doesn't even sound that bad for that OC. What happens if you go down to 3.9/4GHz? Do you roughly get the same temps as the other users here? Otherwise, it could be a lot of things. You can try to reseat the cpu and apply new TIM (don't even have to empty your liquid to do this). Could also be hot air circulating in the case which would add heat, and then the rad fans would suck that hot air in and not cool the rad properly. But yes, Prime95 can really make your CPU sweat.


It's in the high 60's if I drop to 3.9 and around 70 at 4.0. So maybe I'm as good as I'm going to get. My second 360 rad (the GTS) sits on the top of my case pushing air out, so it's definitely getting warmer air but I've run that configuration in other machines with little problem. The XE 360 sits in my Thermatake X71 case's lower compartment and is pulling cold air through the rad.

What are others using to generate "load" temps? I know Prime is hotter than most.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> It's in the high 60's if I drop to 3.9 and around 70 at 4.0. So maybe I'm as good as I'm going to get. My second 360 rad (the GTS) sits on the top of my case pushing air out, so it's definitely getting warmer air but I've run that configuration in other machines with little problem. The XE 360 sits in my Thermatake X71 case's lower compartment and is pulling cold air through the rad.
> 
> What are others using to generate "load" temps? I know Prime is hotter than most.


AIDA64 stress test, BurnInTest, OCCT, and a couple others are out there. ROG realbench on loop or other benchmarks on loop also have been used. You may run some in conjunction, if not fully loading the CPU. There are many ways to generate load.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Sure...I have similar results, but everyone's results will vary based on silicon quality and ambient temps. Maybe 1.35v is necessary for 4.1Ghz then, but eventually you'll reach the limit of what an AIO can handle under load and that limit will be lower than what a well designed and installed custom loop is capable of dissipating. Maybe the roughly double cost premium isn't worth it to some, but that's up to them.


oh i fully agree with that as i said .5 drags me up 10 degrees my hope is investing a bucket of cash will at least halve that


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> It's in the high 60's if I drop to 3.9 and around 70 at 4.0. So maybe I'm as good as I'm going to get. My second 360 rad (the GTS) sits on the top of my case pushing air out, so it's definitely getting warmer air but I've run that configuration in other machines with little problem. The XE 360 sits in my Thermatake X71 case's lower compartment and is pulling cold air through the rad.
> 
> What are others using to generate "load" temps? I know Prime is hotter than most.


i have found so far ibt avx or worse still ycruncher 2.5n or more will toast a piece of concrete to perfection....corona 1.3 is a good quick test same as the blender benches so i start there and cb15 and then move on to hand wrenching tests...at some point though those tests become redundant if that sort of app is not what your using. For me handbrake is my primary one at the moment trying t back up my 3000 dvds







i also have 30 or so HD dvds that i,m backing up and they can generate some heat over a good period of time.....i, m about to test the TR on one now to compare it to the 1800x @3.9 i have high hopes







as compared to my 4.5 6700k which is set handbrake ....go away come back later machine.

ok my first mistake is the choice of HDdvd...mr beans holiday and why...there are 5 audios and after 10 minutes of loading live previews....i,m still looking for someone actually speaking friggen English









now its running and a good bit faster than the overclocked 1800x so i,m happy


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i have found so far ibt avx or worse still ycruncher 2.5n or more will toast a piece of concrete to perfection....corona 1.3 is a good quick test same as the blender benches so i start there and cb15 and then move on to hand wrenching tests...at some point though those tests become redundant if that sort of app is not what your using. For me handbrake is my primary one at the moment trying t back up my 3000 dvds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also have 30 or so HD dvds that i,m backing up and they can generate some heat over a good period of time.....i, m about to test the TR on one now to compare it to the 1800x @3.9 i have high hopes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as compared to my 4.5 6700k which is set handbrake ....go away come back later machine.
> 
> ok my first mistake is the choice of HDdvd...mr beans holiday and why...there are 5 audios and after 10 minutes of loading live previews....i,m still looking for someone actually speaking friggen English
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now its running and a good bit faster than the overclocked 1800x so i,m happy


Why are you encoding/transcoding instead of remuxing? space???


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Kriant

Soooooooo a tad off-topic. But what do you guys think in general of Swiftech? ( I know they are also working on a block for TR)


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Why are you encoding/transcoding instead of remuxing? space???


honestly...no idea







space is an issue but feel free to explain remuxing though







the way i do it is just the way i have always done it but always open to suggestions

and as for 265 vs 264 i did both with the same settings and 264 was a little bigger encoded ALOT faster and looked better than 265 so i stuck with 264.

sorry and to add to that handbrake has soooo many different options...


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> With the right settings h.265 has roughly the same quality as h.264 while taking up half the space and bandwidth. Youtubers and people with huge video archives tend to prefer h.265 despite the resources needed for conversion and playback.
> 
> Re-muxing = stripping the crap you don't want/need...essentially re-packaging. It's a ton faster, being limited by only I/O speeds.


can you through me some examples articles i can have a squiz over.
i would look myself but the threadripper is so slow with more than one window open


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Suffice it to say that the way macroblocks are handled has changed significantly. This guy does a decent job of explaining some of the changes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's a metric tonne of data available...but some of the h.265 data may be being made less overt by it's "alias" HEVC. I'd google it for you, but I already have one waterfox window AND some chrome stuff open...I'm afraid my CPU will melt. lol


i get it now thanks





this shows me side by side and the difference is pretty huge i,ll start playing with 265 now see how it does....now is intel coded better for 265 because most reviews you see it beats the amd in 265..


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i have found so far ibt avx or worse still ycruncher 2.5n or more will toast a piece of concrete to perfection....corona 1.3 is a good quick test same as the blender benches so i start there and cb15 and then move on to hand wrenching tests...at some point though those tests become redundant if that sort of app is not what your using. For me handbrake is my primary one at the moment trying t back up my 3000 dvds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also have 30 or so HD dvds that i,m backing up and they can generate some heat over a good period of time.....i, m about to test the TR on one now to compare it to the 1800x @3.9 i have high hopes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as compared to my 4.5 6700k which is set handbrake ....go away come back later machine.
> 
> ok my first mistake is the choice of HDdvd...mr beans holiday and why...there are 5 audios and after 10 minutes of loading live previews....i,m still looking for someone actually speaking friggen English
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now its running and a good bit faster than the overclocked 1800x so i,m happy


I have been running RealBench stress test for several hours and never topped 60 degrees, so I'm thinking my loop is keeping up with my TR. Prime just ran than much hotter. Seems like the EK block is doing ok for me.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I have been running RealBench stress test for several hours and never topped 60 degrees, so I'm thinking my loop is keeping up with my TR. Prime just ran than much hotter. Seems like the EK block is doing ok for me.


awesome is that at stock?

try ycruncher 2.5b or 25b cant remember which







that scared me
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> It's a case of waiting for software to be optimized for moar cores. Handbrake doesn't use 16 cores and even premiere doesn't scale all that well beyond 10 cores. I just arrange to do thing concurrently.
> 
> IF you really want to see what HEVC can do, take a huge h.264 file(blu ray), squish it to fit DVD-5 h.264, and DVD-5 via h.265. Only one of those won't look like vomit. Well, okay AVC won't look like vomit...but the HEVC version will kill.


i,m trying a preset matroska 265 preset and damn its slow







50ffps i,m used to 250/300








plus yes it seems to be not utilising the cores anywhere near what the 264 preset did.

i can also tell that by power usage 264=320watts node 0 plus node 1 and 265 = 291 watts node0+1


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> honestly...no idea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> space is an issue but feel free to explain remuxing though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the way i do it is just the way i have always done it but always open to suggestions
> 
> and as for 265 vs 264 i did both with the same settings and 264 was a little bigger encoded ALOT faster and looked better than 265 so i stuck with 264.
> 
> sorry and to add to that handbrake has soooo many different options...


What it is is taking the wrapper off, but keeping the raw data the same, no conversion. It just switches the wrapper. You basically find the playlist, plug it into a demux program and save the files to a scratch folder. Then you use the raw data there and use another program to then put it inside the MKV wrapper. It takes like 10 minutes total for an entire BD-50 disc. There is no loss in quality because the raw data is identical. It is just a new wrapper for the data to let other programs play the content.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> Soooooooo a tad off-topic. But what do you guys think in general of Swiftech? ( I know they are also working on a block for TR)


So, I've heard mixed, but have considered their pumps (am considering the MCP35X2 as a simple, all in one pump (two pumps, one casing) to have the head pressure without worry while simplifying any worry of two pumps. If doing two loops, then two pumps needed. But I don't see the reason except for style. Some want to buffer, but I believe the loop should be able to handle all components under load simultaneously. This means it doesn't matter if a single loop or not and to increase the rads if it cannot satisfy that criteria.

Edit: also, remuxing is sometimes referred to as passthrough. If you have that option, try it.


----------



## Beatnutz

I opted for the 1950X and MSI X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC in the end. Can't wait for it to arrive but the water blocks are sold out everywhere in Europe it seems. Can't find a singe store with them in stock (UK, GER, BE, NL). So now it will be a VERY long wait. Typical.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> awesome is that at stock?


No this is still OC'd at 4.1GHz @ 1.35 vcore. Prime95 Small FFTs gets to ~73 but RealBench never went over 60.

Interestingly, when I did a custom Prime95 test to include RAM it makes Ryzen Master crash but nothing else. Not sure if that is an CPU OC instability sign or what? I'm not overclocking memory at the moment. Small FFTs on Prime went 8 hours without a problem.


----------



## cheddle

My particular 1950x sample is a poor overclocker :-( 1.52v to get 4.1ghz stable...

Kinda expected that based on my stock performance. the XFR cores are running 1.51v stock and only boosting to 4050mhz :-( not the 4200mhz possible.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> What it is is taking the wrapper off, but keeping the raw data the same, no conversion. It just switches the wrapper. You basically find the playlist, plug it into a demux program and save the files to a scratch folder. Then you use the raw data there and use another program to then put it inside the MKV wrapper. It takes like 10 minutes total for an entire BD-50 disc. There is no loss in quality because the raw data is identical. It is just a new wrapper for the data to let other programs play the content.
> So, I've heard mixed, but have considered their pumps (am considering the MCP35X2 as a simple, all in one pump (two pumps, one casing) to have the head pressure without worry while simplifying any worry of two pumps. If doing two loops, then two pumps needed. But I don't see the reason except for style. Some want to buffer, but I believe the loop should be able to handle all components under load simultaneously. This means it doesn't matter if a single loop or not and to increase the rads if it cannot satisfy that criteria.
> 
> Edit: also, remuxing is sometimes referred to as passthrough. If you have that option, try it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Well don't get too envious...carnage up there is on a 1920x. 1.35v to stabilize a 1950x @ 4.1 would be pretty great though. Perhaps when more blocks become available.


Always nice when someone recognizes the genesis of a username.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Beatnutz

Just out of curiosity. What are you guys using your TR for?

I'll use it for Houdini simulations, and it will also come in handy when I render Houdini simulations in C4D (it takes ages to process massive files for every frame rendered).


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Just out of curiosity. What are you guys using your TR for?
> 
> I'll use it for Houdini simulations, and it will also come in handy when I render Houdini simulations in C4D (it takes ages to process massive files for every frame rendered).


Gaming lol. I'll does a good job. You will always get the people whining that it's not for gaming but it does a good job, I have no regrets. Mine 1920x will boost to 4.2 no problem. I'm just waiting or different ram before I go all cover over 4.0.


----------



## happyluckbox

I use it for Piosolver-
It solves the game of poker from preflop, flop, turn, and river for multiple bet and raise sizes. Basically it allows you to input ranges for the preflop raiser and the caller, and using these ranges it will extrapolate the best play (for both players) for every scenario using game theoretically optimal play (GTO). The longer the solver runs for, the closer to a nash equilibrium strategy it gets for both players. (where either player can do nothing further to exploit their respective villian, and if he were to deviate from pio's strategy he can then be exploited and lose ev)

You can imagine the computations can be rather long/intensive, given how massive the game tree can actually get.

Just to give you an idea, theres 1326 possible combinations of hands you can be dealt preflop, and there are 22100 different flops in poker (of which 1755 are strategicaly relevant). This doesnt even begin to look at multiple bet/raise sizes for different hands, or different runouts for turns and rivers for each of those actions. The amount of ram it takes to solve from some situations from preflop can be mind boggling, which is why I went for a 128gb ddr threadripper build









I play poker as a profession so exploring gto strategy begins to get useful for me at the stakes I play at. I have days where i win or lose an entire threadripper setup or more, so I think investing 5-6k in TR build was a wise choice long
term









(I also intend to play games occasionally, and its always nice to have some justification to sate my computer hobby







)


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Just out of curiosity. What are you guys using your TR for?
> 
> I'll use it for Houdini simulations, and it will also come in handy when I render Houdini simulations in C4D (it takes ages to process massive files for every frame rendered).


Playing games, benchmarks and tweaking! It's interesting to explore the characteristics of a dual die CPU - work out where it's limitations are and what weaknesses it has.

Justification was; SLI 1080ti's want more than 8x/8x pcie so an AM4 wouldn't do and I'm fundamentally opposed to intentionally gimped products so I didn't really want any x299 based product. I almost went for a 6950x but I have been really happy with my media PC using an r7 1700 so figured I'd try a 1920x, then the price difference was close enough that paying for a 'whole extra quad core worth of CPU' made sense.

Plus the box was reeeeally cool


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Just out of curiosity. What are you guys using your TR for?
> 
> I'll use it for Houdini simulations, and it will also come in handy when I render Houdini simulations in C4D (it takes ages to process massive files for every frame rendered).


I just use it for daily computing. It's a mixed workload of gaming, compressing, compiling, and encoding. It probably spends 99% of its time at idle just like any other normal desktop. It's fast when it needs to be though. As an example, I did a FLAC to FLAC conversion of an entire album this last weekend in 2 seconds which was nice. Every single track has its own core. Kernel compilation was slower than it was on my 1700X though which is curious. I'm wondering if make can't distribute work to that many threads.


----------



## Fantasy

Here it is. You can add me to the list. Super excited. It's time to replace my 3930K.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Still waiting on my gskill F4-3600C16D-16GVK to work on my Aorus X399 board. Despite being on its QVL list, XMP doesn't work on it yet.








I am still stuck on 2133 atm.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Still waiting on my gskill F4-3600C16D-16GVK to work on my Aorus X399 board. Despite being on its QVL list, XMP doesn't work on it yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am still stuck on 2133 atm.


Set your own timings. That's one of the more friendly ram sticks for the platform.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Set your own timings. That's one of the more friendly ram sticks for the platform.


Yeah, that is what I am about to do lol. I am not so fond of doing memory tweaks so I was trying to avoid that.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Yeah, that is what I am about to do lol. I am not so fond of doing memory tweaks so I was trying to avoid that.


I prefer doing it myself. I have a 3200 16cl kit that runs at cl 14 just fine.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Yeah, that is what I am about to do lol. I am not so fond of doing memory tweaks so I was trying to avoid that.


I'm still stuck on ddr3, but it was easy to key it in.... worked like a charm.. I even have 2400mhz working with the old piledriver architecture and I hear it's much easier with Ryzen based cpu's


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Still waiting on my gskill F4-3600C16D-16GVK to work on my Aorus X399 board. Despite being on its QVL list, XMP doesn't work on it yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am still stuck on 2133 atm.


I have this exact kit in the post to me right now to replace my d-die kit

My mate has the same b-die kit can he can push 3600mhz on his 1700 and 1700x (3700mhz~ is his max)

The trick is to set DOCE, leave everything as is and increase your SOC voltage to a manual setting of 1.25v - if that dosnt work you might need to try 1.3-1.325v *note that some say SOC over 1.25v is unsafe however I read that Gigabyte boards will set SOC to 1.35v as soon as you enable DOCE so take that as you will*

You could also try changing the 'start dram volts' to something like 1.5-1.6v to help it train.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Nice. I'd be curious to hear what kind of memory speed/timings you end up with. I too have a 64Gb vengeance kit, but on the MSI Carbon. So far 2933Mhz and 14-14-14-34 has provided the best results...higher speeds won't post.


I'm actually pretty nervous. I'm worried this kit won't post at all or will post at 2600MHz or lower. I'm hoping for the best. Out of curiosity, are you running 8GBx8 or 16GBX4? My kit is 16GBX4.


----------



## ajc9988

So, my Silicon Lottery chip arrived today. I already have the 4133 Trident Z (which on Intel platform I run at [email protected]; F4-4133C19D-16GTZKW x2). The Asrock Taichi will be here Thursday. I'll use the AIO for awhile, so no good numbers until the custom loop is built.


----------



## Kpjoslee

After some memory tweaking, managed 16-15-15-35 3333mhz on my kit so far. Anything higher freq or lower timing won't post. I will deal with it until new bios comes along.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## cheddle

crosspost from the silicon lottery therad but thought I would add here as well:
Quote:


> Id like to chime in and add that binning threadripper ABSOLUTLEY MATTERS
> 
> my mates 1950x can run 3dmark @ 4.2ghz 1.45v vcore
> my own 1950x can run 3dmark @ 4.1ghz @ 1.55v vcore
> 
> I cant get 4150mhz 3dmark stable, even as high as 1.63v vcore
> 
> Both using Zenith Extreme. Both using custom loops with EK waterblocks.
> 
> Thats quite a difference in silicon given that they are 'top 5% of ryzen dies' so paying for a good bin isnt a crazy idea ;-)


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Is anyone else playing around with pstates yet? Would love to keep my voltage down a bit when not on load, but my Taichi board doesn't want to downshift from my pstate0 even with custom settings for pstate1 and pstate2. Maybe it's not enabled for Threadripper yet?


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Is anyone else playing around with pstates yet? Would love to keep my voltage down a bit when not on load, but my Taichi board doesn't want to downshift from my pstate0 even with custom settings for pstate1 and pstate2. Maybe it's not enabled for Threadripper yet?


@chew - got a question (my board won't be here until Thurs).


----------



## Kpjoslee

Getting idle temp bouncing aroud 39-45-sometimes to 50 is not a pleasant sight lol. Need to get new cooler with full IHS coverage, Asetek based cooler simply doesn't work well with Threadripper.


----------



## TheGovernment

i have 32 gigs of corsair 3200 LED ram. Wouldn't post with 32 gigs at all. ended took out 16 gigs and it runs for now. There is no amount of tweaking that would let all 32 gigs boot, even at stock. I'm waiting for the new Gskill flarex 32 gig kits to be available now.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> i have 32 gigs of corsair 3200 LED ram. Wouldn't post with 32 gigs at all. ended took out 16 gigs and it runs for now. There is no amount of tweaking that would let all 32 gigs boot, even at stock. I'm waiting for the new Gskill flarex 32 gig kits to be available now.


Consider the Ripjaws F4-3200C14D-16GVK kit. I have two of these kits for a total of 32GB (8GB*4) running at 3.73 ghz CL16 in Quad Channel. It's the same stats (and likely the same silicon) as the Flare X.


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Consider the Ripjaws F4-3200C14D-16GVK kit. I have two of these kits for a total of 32GB (8GB*4) running at 3.73 ghz CL16 in Quad Channel. It's the same stats (and likely the same silicon) as the Flare X.


i did when I found out I was having memory issues but the cheapest I can find it is 244$ CDN each kit. That will be around $560 taxes in for 32 gig.... Thats freaking crazy lol. I'd like to get a matched 32 gig kit but if it ends up taking forever, thats likely the route I will take ( I'm also not sure if I want the 3600 kits yet lol)


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Consider the Ripjaws F4-3200C14D-16GVK kit. I have two of these kits for a total of 32GB (8GB*4) running at 3.73 ghz CL16 in Quad Channel. It's the same stats (and likely the same silicon) as the Flare X.


Glad to hear. That is a lower binned version of my ram kit. So I may be right up there with you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> i did when I found out I was having memory issues but the cheapest I can find it is 244$ CDN each kit. That will be around $560 taxes in for 32 gig.... Thats freaking crazy lol. I'd like to get a matched 32 gig kit but if it ends up taking forever, thats likely the route I will take ( I'm also not sure if I want the 3600 kits yet lol)


4133 Trident Z G.Skill Samsung B-die costs about $220. So for $440, you may not be able to do the QVL list for XMP, but you have good ram to play with!


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Glad to hear. That is a lower binned version of my ram kit. So I may be right up there with you.
> 4133 Trident Z G.Skill Samsung B-die costs about $220. So for $440, you may not be able to do the QVL list for XMP, but you have good ram to play with!


I'm still debating on the 3600 though I have my 3200 kit sitting here in the box, next to my boxed cpu and mother board / m.2 all I need is a damn water block. Also gonna have one HELL of a time fitting the 980ti in the asus board, given that the 16x slots are separated, the 980ti is a couple cm shorter than the 1080ti's so I have to really finaggle the bridge to get it to work and even then it really futz's w/ the cards. I don't wanna snap anything, so curious if there's and flexible extendible water bridges available? I'm using 90 degree adapters + the cup link adapters to bind them together atm.


----------



## tarot

just a little play today
tried 4g @1.3 and [email protected] both llc 3

also got realbench to behave...not sure how but hey the scores are pretty much where i would expect.

takeway for me is the temps were not hideous but it did need more power...i think 1.4 would do 4.1 ok and 1.35 would do 4g
as 3900 is pretty easy at 1.25

i am waiting for more blocks and gear to eb available before throwing in extra cash...i can live with 3900








41001.35
https://valid.x86.fr/pd84ej

[I


----------



## Gilles3000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Vardars are no better at cooling than the Corsair SP fans. At least at 12v
> 
> https://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/cases_cooling/kaby_lake_7700k_5ghz_aio_cooler_mega_test/4


That's one awful way to review fans, here are some proper tests.

Purely looking at performance, the Vardars are already significantly better.(in this graph higher is better)


When considering noise, the SP120's fall behind even further.(In this graph lower is better)


And the vardars are much more reliable, as they use double ball bearings compared to the cheap sleeve bearings in the SP's
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> noise may well be the difference.
> 
> A heat source is a heat source. 7700K generates more heat than threadripper seems to.


Heat isn't te same as temperature. While the 7700K runs hot, it doesn't put out a lot of heat. Threadripper actually puts out almost double as much heat as the 7700K.


----------



## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> just a little play today
> tried 4g @1.3 and [email protected] both llc 3
> 
> also got realbench to behave...not sure how but hey the scores are pretty much where i would expect.
> 
> takeway for me is the temps were not hideous but it did need more power...i think 1.4 would do 4.1 ok and 1.35 would do 4g
> as 3900 is pretty easy at 1.25
> 
> i am waiting for more blocks and gear to eb available before throwing in extra cash...i can live with 3900
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 41001.35
> https://valid.x86.fr/pd84ej
> 
> [I


[email protected]@ 71.5 t-die. I think you will be similar as my cpu max out at 4GHz for fully stable occt/prime95.


----------



## Metuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Consider the Ripjaws F4-3200C14D-16GVK kit. I have two of these kits for a total of 32GB (8GB*4) running at 3.73 ghz CL16 in Quad Channel. It's the same stats (and likely the same silicon) as the Flare X.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> i have 32 gigs of corsair 3200 LED ram. Wouldn't post with 32 gigs at all. ended took out 16 gigs and it runs for now. There is no amount of tweaking that would let all 32 gigs boot, even at stock. I'm waiting for the new Gskill flarex 32 gig kits to be available now.


I got my 8x8 GB Corsair 3400 RGB memory running at 2933MHz, and 3200MHz with only 4 modules, on my Asus Zenith. But again I was never able to run all 8 modules on my i7 at more than 3000MHz.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Is anyone else playing around with pstates yet? Would love to keep my voltage down a bit when not on load, but my Taichi board doesn't want to downshift from my pstate0 even with custom settings for pstate1 and pstate2. Maybe it's not enabled for Threadripper yet?


I tried setting a custom P0 state. That is how I had been overclocking my 1700X, so I figured I'd do the same with my 1950X. Unfortunately, it wouldn't even do 3.8 GHz at the default VID like that so I gave up. I'll revisit it later most likely. I don't know if the problem is just bad firmware on the MSI X399 I have, if the ASUS I used with the 1700X was giving it more than stock VID even when set there, or if my 1950X is just really bad. I didn't have any issues with being stuck at P0 though. That should be up to the operating system's frequency daemon generally.


----------



## farcodev

I had to come back to 3.7GHz (with 1.25VCORE), 3.9 with only 1.25V was a bit to few and it freezed at the start of the first Blender render I tried.

I don't want to push voltage too high, so finally 3.7 will stay my 24/24 365 frequency. I'm happy with it anyway.

Temp @ this frequency stay OK (67.5 degrees with 100% full cores used) and the PC is fully stable
















Pushing it higher, requires definately a custom loop


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> I'm still debating on the 3600 though I have my 3200 kit sitting here in the box, next to my boxed cpu and mother board / m.2 all I need is a damn water block. Also gonna have one HELL of a time fitting the 980ti in the asus board, given that the 16x slots are separated, the 980ti is a couple cm shorter than the 1080ti's so I have to really finaggle the bridge to get it to work and even then it really futz's w/ the cards. I don't wanna snap anything, so curious if there's and flexible extendible water bridges available? I'm using 90 degree adapters + the cup link adapters to bind them together atm.


I actually do not, unfortunately. Sorry...


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## SavantStrike

Has anyone here ordered the tr4 adapter from Swiftech?

Chew mentioned he was looking to order it on the vrm thread.

I ordered mine 9 days ago when it looked like they were in stock and haven't heard a peep out of swiftech.

I really don't like the EK but may not have much of a choice. 4 1080 ti's under water would look stupid next to a 1920x on a CLC.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> There's a 3200Mhz 4x16Gb kit for sale at Amazon for $393 if anyone's still shopping. It's prime members only, but that's a free trial.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Vengeance-64GB-Intel-CMU64GX4M4C3200C16B/dp/B01LXJDEOA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1504027433&sr=8-1&keywords=CMU64GX4M4C3200C16B
> 
> Looks like there's only a few left at that price.


I LITERALLY GOT THE LAST ONE. THANK YOU! Tried to buy another it said out of stock right after I did 1 click buy on the first set.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I LITERALLY GOT THE LAST ONE. THANK YOU! Tried to buy another it said out of stock right after I did 1 click buy on the first set.


Jesus, are those Samsung B or hynix? and here I just blew 750 on the Trident 3200 variant (rgb ) Reeeeeeeee


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Jesus, are those Samsung B or hynix? and here I just blew 750 on the Trident 3200 variant (rgb ) Reeeeeeeee


It's samsung same as the 16 cl tridents. Not B die but E or D I forgot but works well with ryzen.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> It's samsung same as the 16 cl tridents. Not B die but E or D I forgot but works well with ryzen.


Ahhhh mine are teh 14's though...hmm I coulda sworn those were the B dies as well, are D/E better or roughly the same? I've never been a fan of corsair but at that price ( in the event it comes back ) its pretty good.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Ahhhh mine are teh 14's though...hmm I coulda sworn those were the B dies as well, are D/E better or roughly the same? I've never been a fan of corsair but at that price ( in the event it comes back ) its pretty good.


Yea me too but they aren't. The will run at 14-14-14-34 no problems though up to 3000 in my experience.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Yea me too but they aren't. The will run at 14-14-14-34 no problems though up to 3000 in my experience.


flippin livid atm then, that reddit/qvl list site lied to me then..... Someone from another thread reported having the same ones and running 3200 fine......god damnit.

Opening up a return now.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> flippin livid atm then, that reddit/qvl list site lied to me then..... Someone from another thread reported having the same ones and running 3200 fine......god damnit.
> 
> Opening up a return now.


NO DUDE I was referring to the set I copped lol. Not the ones you bought. If you bought the CL 14 bdie you shouldnt have an issue doing 3200.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Unless they're different than the red led kit of the same ilk(unlikely) they're SK Hynix. They'll do 14-14-14-34-1T if you put the volts to them.
> 
> Amazon has been doing crazy fire sales on those discontinued vengeance led kits for a few weeks now. I thought the deal I snagged on the red ones($419) a couple weeks ago was good. lol So now I'm heading for some crazy combination of red/blue led ram...but 128Gb for < $800?!? Uh yeah...don't care what color they are.


I am almost certain they are samsungs. They volts and timings are exactly the same as the samsung tridents I have.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> NO DUDE I was referring to the set I copped lol. Not the ones you bought. If you bought the CL 14 bdie you shouldnt have an issue doing 3200.


I think the confusion was your response to mine then, since you mentioned that the corsairs were the same as the trident 16s, so I asked if the 14s I had were Samsung B dies as well and you said no lol.

Either way bullet dodged, and good to know.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> If they are then they changed them in the last week or two. The spreader clip comes off easily, so I peeled one back to have a peek...and that was before I even downloaded thaiphoon to grab the whole timing chart.


Hmm interesting. I guess I will see how they play out. I was under the impression that these would be samsungs.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Nope, but for the price I think they're a screaming buy. I usually discount the likelihood that anything with varied primary timings are sammy, though I realize there are a few exceptions among samsung E-die chips. 16-18-18-36 seemed un-samsung like when I looked into them. At the time I didn't realize they'd be as happy as they are at 14-14-14-34, so that was a nice surprise. It also means you could theoretically mix them with Samsung b-die dimms and run those primary timings and auto sub timings. That should work at least up to the speed limit of the Hynix chips on whatever AGESA code we're on at the time.


Yeah I can run the trident Z 16-18-18-36 at 14-34 no problem up to 3000. It will boot @ 3200 too just not stable. This was on the beta agesa in april or whatever on ryzen 7.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Ahhhh mine are teh 14's though...hmm I coulda sworn those were the B dies as well, are D/E better or roughly the same? I've never been a fan of corsair but at that price ( in the event it comes back ) its pretty good.


You got the B-dies. They do better than D or E-dies (E does descent though, so shouldn't be complained about). For corsair, I bought them one time on laptop for DDR3. My G.Skill and Kingston HyperX both reached [email protected], my corsair couldn't do that and spit errors silently (corrupted my OS at the OC). Funny enough, the HyperX had slower timings than the G.Skill, but outperformed them on benches and other tasks....


----------



## SavantStrike

So, for what it's worth I've been through three sets of corsair memory in the past two weeks.

The 4x8Gb vengeance RGB kit from the QVL did fine at rated speed and XMP (3ghz). MSI's mystic light screwed up the leds though (it could only address half of the RAM). It was Hynix memory and worked, which I thought was impressive with zero tweaking required. I RMA'd it in favor of something non-RGB. I wish I had kept it.

Then I bought a 4x8 vengeance LED kit rated for 3466. Even though it was Samsung E die I couldn't even get my machine to post at 3ghz with ultra loose timings, let alone any higher. Hynix may actually be better than E die, at least in my experience. I also discovered at this juncture that the MSI x399 carbon has a very sparse BIOS. It has a setting to reset the CMOS on boot errors, but none of the friendly features for a bad over clock I've had on Asus and Asrock BIOSes. Resetting the CMOS repeatedly got really old..

I went to my local micro center and found a 4x8 Vengeance RGB kit that was also 3466, however I was confident it was b die since I got to open the kit before buying iy. I haven't pushed the kit to it's limits but at the 3333mhz xmp profile it booted fine. XMP... No tweaking required at all.

I'm still scratching my head about the e die.


----------



## FlanK3r

Welcome me in the club







, 1950X


__
https://flic.kr/p/Ydii5T



__
https://flic.kr/p/WWArvj



__
https://flic.kr/p/XXcswC


And motherboard

__
https://flic.kr/p/XBfpuh


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ocvn*
> 
> [email protected]@ 71.5 t-die. I think you will be similar as my cpu max out at 4GHz for fully stable occt/prime95.


at what volts llc level and what cooling.
remember i am on a h115i at the moment and the fans only at 60 percent


----------



## gtbtk

Has anyone tried simulating a 1900X with a 2+2+2+2 core configuration to see how if performs in graphics benchmarks with quad channel memory in UMA and NUMA modes with an all core overclock?

If so, I am particularly curious to know how it goes in a firestrike benchmark. Anyone got anything to post?


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Has anyone tried simulating a 1900X with a 2+2+2+2 core configuration to see how if performs in graphics benchmarks with quad channel memory in UMA and NUMA modes with an all core overclock?
> 
> If so, I am particularly curious to know how it goes in a firestrike benchmark. Anyone got anything to post?


they are all different 1950x =2x 1800x 1920x = 2x 1600x and the 1900x = 2 1500x
that's the way i have been reading it so speed wise look to the 1500x.

should be out pretty soon anyway


----------



## jarble

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> There's a 3200Mhz 4x16Gb kit for sale at Amazon for $393 if anyone's still shopping. It's prime members only, but that's a free trial.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Vengeance-64GB-Intel-CMU64GX4M4C3200C16B/dp/B01LXJDEOA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1504027433&sr=8-1&keywords=CMU64GX4M4C3200C16B
> 
> Looks like there's only a few left at that price.
> 
> Edit: ...and they're gone. lol That was a silly cheap price for quad channel 64Gb goodness.


Gods I wish I had seen this in time


----------



## Particle

While you guys are talking fast memory kits, I'm over here with ECC DDR4-2400. =) Multi-bit ECC works which makes me happy. It came at a premium though with 4 x 8 GiB costing $326.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> While you guys are talking fast memory kits, I'm over here with ECC DDR4-2400. =) Multi-bit ECC works which makes me happy. It came at a premium though with 4 x 8 GiB costing $326.


pfft my gskill flarex 3200's cost me $600 Australian that is the most i have ever spent on ram ever made my pie hole tighten hitting the buy button but i,m happy with plug and play easy









i have tried corsair e die 3200 kits in my ryzen and that never made it past 2666 and team extreme 3600 16/18/18 kit that never made it past 2933 and that was Samsung b die but i could never get it to work at 3200 so not all B die is equal in my eyes.

but the way i see it is rma hasn't dropped in price in the last few years...i sold the corsair 3200's for 50 dollars more than i pid for them and they still got them 30 dollars cheaper than the stores










all i need to do is work out how to cool everything....i,m toying with a 420 rad up top and a 140 rad in the back for the video card that way everything fits but is this enough on the same loop or do i shell out for a split system for the video card and the cpu....the idea of spending like 700 bucks on cooling and not getting a big cooling boost is again a but clenching experience for me


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> pfft my gskill flarex 3200's cost me $600 Australian that is the most i have ever spent on ram ever made my pie hole tighten hitting the buy button but i,m happy with plug and play easy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have tried corsair e die 3200 kits in my ryzen and that never made it past 2666 and team extreme 3600 16/18/18 kit that never made it past 2933 and that was Samsung b die but i could never get it to work at 3200 so not all B die is equal in my eyes.
> 
> but the way i see it is rma hasn't dropped in price in the last few years...i sold the corsair 3200's for 50 dollars more than i pid for them and they still got them 30 dollars cheaper than the stores
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all i need to do is work out how to cool everything....i,m toying with a 420 rad up top and a 140 rad in the back for the video card that way everything fits but is this enough on the same loop or do i shell out for a split system for the video card and the cpu....the idea of spending like 700 bucks on cooling and not getting a big cooling boost is again a but clenching experience for me


im interested to hear how you go with the Flare X - in my eyes all b-die should get the same results. with lower 'bins' requiring more DRAM voltage to acheive the same speeds as the higher 'bins'.

I got 3200cl16cr2 on my d-die 4x8gb kit - but i was getting the odd memory error so it wasnt stable. ive since had to drop it back to 2800mhz to get perfect error free memory at 1.25v soc votlage


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> pfft my gskill flarex 3200's cost me $600 Australian that is the most i have ever spent on ram ever made my pie hole tighten hitting the buy button but i,m happy with plug and play easy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have tried corsair e die 3200 kits in my ryzen and that never made it past 2666 and team extreme 3600 16/18/18 kit that never made it past 2933 and that was Samsung b die but i could never get it to work at 3200 so not all B die is equal in my eyes.
> 
> but the way i see it is rma hasn't dropped in price in the last few years...i sold the corsair 3200's for 50 dollars more than i pid for them and they still got them 30 dollars cheaper than the stores
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all i need to do is work out how to cool everything....i,m toying with a 420 rad up top and a 140 rad in the back for the video card that way everything fits but is this enough on the same loop or do i shell out for a split system for the video card and the cpu....the idea of spending like 700 bucks on cooling and not getting a big cooling boost is again a but clenching experience for me


A premium meaning standard 2400 versus what I paid for 2400 ECC. It was about a 50% increase for that speed grade.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solarion*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Has anyone tried simulating a 1900X with a 2+2+2+2 core configuration to see how if performs in graphics benchmarks with quad channel memory in UMA and NUMA modes with an all core overclock?
> 
> If so, I am particularly curious to know how it goes in a firestrike benchmark. Anyone got anything to post?
> 
> 
> 
> Threadripper only uses two dies...so that core configuration is not possible...the 1900x will be 4+4.
> 
> Two of the apparent dies under the IHS are just slugs/spacers and not active as per AMD guidance.
Click to expand...

I Know that it uses two dies. However, the entire threadripper chip uses four CCX modules across two dies.

1950X is using 4+4 and 4+4 cores and 1920X 3+3 and 3+3 cores. The 1900X is supposed to be using 2+2 and 2+2.

The bios will allow you do to configure each Zen 8 core die either 4+0 or 2+2. The latter setup is representative of how AMD have configured half of a 1900X


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Has anyone tried simulating a 1900X with a 2+2+2+2 core configuration to see how if performs in graphics benchmarks with quad channel memory in UMA and NUMA modes with an all core overclock?
> 
> If so, I am particularly curious to know how it goes in a firestrike benchmark. Anyone got anything to post?
> 
> 
> 
> they are all different 1950x =2x 1800x 1920x = 2x 1600x and the 1900x = 2 1500x
> that's the way i have been reading it so speed wise look to the 1500x.
> 
> should be out pretty soon anyway
Click to expand...

A 1500X is exactly half of a 1900x and is configured to use two cores on each CCX module on the single Zen die to allow it to continue to have the 16GB L3 Cache. Problem is that you cannot cut a GPU in half so it cannot be indicative of the performance of a 1900X which is an 8 core, quad channel memory chip.

That quad channel memory potentially has major implications for gaming performance compared to an 1800x and I am curious to see if the UMA/NUMA division of the dies will negate the benefits of the quad channel memory.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> A premium meaning standard 2400 versus what I paid for 2400 ECC. It was about a 50% increase for that speed grade.


sorry yes i know what you mean







i worded that wrong.
ecc will always be slower and more expensive because it is enterprise gear...but in my opinion a lot of enterprise gear just isn't worth it(i get the need for ecc just would never get it myself


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> A 1500X is exactly half of a 1900x and is configured to use two cores on each CCX module on the single Zen die to allow it to continue to have the 16GB L3 Cache. Problem is that you cannot cut a GPU in half so it cannot be indicative of the performance of a 1900X which is an 8 core, quad channel memory chip.
> 
> That quad channel memory potentially has major implications for gaming performance compared to an 1800x and I am curious to see if the UMA/NUMA division of the dies will negate the benefits of the quad channel memory.


my guess is it will but also in my limited testing of numa vs uma i had no real benefits to speak of just performance drops in the multithreaded apps and once in games you hit above 1080 it all goes down the drain to level.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> im interested to hear how you go with the Flare X - in my eyes all b-die should get the same results. with lower 'bins' requiring more DRAM voltage to achieve the same speeds as the higher 'bins'.
> 
> I got 3200cl16cr2 on my d-die 4x8gb kit - but i was getting the odd memory error so it wasnt stable. ive since had to drop it back to 2800mhz to get perfect error free memory at 1.25v soc votlage


well setup hci memtest before i left....doing 32 of these things is not easy.

as you will notice it failed once at 135 percent and it ran for an hour and a half
memory in my opinion did get a touch warm and that was on a normal running system with email and AV etc running so maybe room to tweak but i,m not overly concerned.

I would be interested to see others results with there ram as well


----------



## LunaP

God damn, edit button people LOL.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> A 1500X is exactly half of a 1900x and is configured to use two cores on each CCX module on the single Zen die to allow it to continue to have the 16GB L3 Cache. Problem is that you cannot cut a GPU in half so it cannot be indicative of the performance of a 1900X which is an 8 core, quad channel memory chip.
> 
> That quad channel memory potentially has major implications for gaming performance compared to an 1800x and I am curious to see if the UMA/NUMA division of the dies will negate the benefits of the quad channel memory.
> 
> 
> 
> my guess is it will but also in my limited testing of numa vs uma i had no real benefits to speak of just performance drops in the multithreaded apps and once in games you hit above 1080 it all goes down the drain to level.
Click to expand...

Problem is caused by the higher memory latency combined with 16 threads of the R7 chips impacting on throughput. Particularly when the GPU us also competing for access doing its DMA access to system memory and the cache. It creates long queues for the threads waiting for access to the memory through the controller. The higher the latency, the longer each thread has to wait in the queue.

As the thread has to wait its turn, each CPU core sits idle waiting for its memory read or write and reduces the performance. That is why R7 Gaming performance is lacking in many games. The 1600X performs at similar levels to the R7 chips in those gaming benchmarks because it only has 12 threads that can access the dual channel memory controller. There are not enough threads to create the same length queues so the available cores to not sit idle as much.

The 1950X has exactly the same 16 threads to dual channel memory controller challenge that the R7 chips have. Each Die has its own dual channel controller. There is also the chips additional challenge of the additional latency if threads have to switch between dies.

Quad channel memory cuts the thread to memory controller ratio in 1/2 as well as cutting the DMA memory access load from the GPU in half. Less load means shorter or no queues. That means there is potential for better performance IF the inter CCX tread switching latency does not negate the benefits of the reduced load on the two memory controllers.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Problem is caused by the higher memory latency combined with 16 threads of the R7 chips impacting on throughput. Particularly when the GPU us also competing for access doing its DMA access to system memory and the cache. It creates long queues for the threads waiting for access to the memory through the controller. The higher the latency, the longer each thread has to wait in the queue.
> 
> As the thread has to wait its turn, each CPU core sits idle waiting for its memory read or write and reduces the performance. That is why R7 Gaming performance is lacking in many games. The 1600X performs at similar levels to the R7 chips in those gaming benchmarks because it only has 12 threads that can access the dual channel memory controller. There are not enough threads to create the same length queues so the available cores to not sit idle as much.
> 
> The 1950X has exactly the same 16 threads to dual channel memory controller challenge that the R7 chips have. Each Die has its own dual channel controller. There is also the chips additional challenge of the additional latency if threads have to switch between dies.
> 
> Quad channel memory cuts the thread to memory controller ratio in 1/2 as well as cutting the DMA memory access load from the GPU in half. Less load means shorter or no queues. That means there is potential for better performance IF the inter CCX tread switching latency does not negate the benefits of the reduced load on the two memory controllers.


i get all that i really do and i understand the mechanics of it...but in real life...my real life it does not make that much of a difference except to hobble the cpu in other things.
i have done testing and it just doesn't add up to worth it to switch to gamers mode or local for 5 fps and that is really what that was netting me.

i will try it again though see how gamers mode goes for more than the games i usually play but again...for me it is not a holy grail sort of thing.
means i have to install ryzen master again...urgh


----------



## tarot

ok lets begin
gamer vs creators mode

gamer vs creator
https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13491201/fs/13491088

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/2301822/spy/2301749

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13491238/fs/13491137

should be easy to figure out which is which...just look at the physics score.
gamers mode = slower

now games
ROTR
4k ultra settings vega 64 turbo mode no differences no tweaks same settings for both only difference is gamer v creator

gamers mode

MP avg 56 min 34 max 82
Syria avg 41 min 29 max 47.9
geo valley avg 39.7 min 33 max 47

avg score
46

creators mode

MP avg 57 min 28 max 104
Syria avg 40.7 min 32 max 48
geo valley avg 39 min 33 max 47 (no not a typo they are the same)

avg score
46 (same score)

shadows of mordor

gamers mode

avg 61
max 78
min 46

creators mode

avg 65
max 86
min 46

and there you go performs actually for the most part worse than creators mode.


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> well setup hci memtest before i left....doing 32 of these things is not easy.
> 
> as you will notice it failed once at 135 percent and it ran for an hour and a half
> memory in my opinion did get a touch warm and that was on a normal running system with email and AV etc running so maybe room to tweak but i,m not overly concerned.
> 
> I would be interested to see others results with there ram as well


lol. not wrong... I used HCI testing for my validaiton as well. as mentioned 2800mhz made it to 200% error free. but higher than that was a problem.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Problem is caused by the higher memory latency combined with 16 threads of the R7 chips impacting on throughput. Particularly when the GPU us also competing for access doing its DMA access to system memory and the cache. It creates long queues for the threads waiting for access to the memory through the controller. The higher the latency, the longer each thread has to wait in the queue.
> 
> As the thread has to wait its turn, each CPU core sits idle waiting for its memory read or write and reduces the performance. That is why R7 Gaming performance is lacking in many games. The 1600X performs at similar levels to the R7 chips in those gaming benchmarks because it only has 12 threads that can access the dual channel memory controller. There are not enough threads to create the same length queues so the available cores to not sit idle as much.
> 
> The 1950X has exactly the same 16 threads to dual channel memory controller challenge that the R7 chips have. Each Die has its own dual channel controller. There is also the chips additional challenge of the additional latency if threads have to switch between dies.
> 
> Quad channel memory cuts the thread to memory controller ratio in 1/2 as well as cutting the DMA memory access load from the GPU in half. Less load means shorter or no queues. That means there is potential for better performance IF the inter CCX tread switching latency does not negate the benefits of the reduced load on the two memory controllers.


Agree with all of this. I have done some testing and found its real world impact to be... slim.

ive actually turned off SMT so each thread gets more cache dedicated to it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> *snip*


my own results testing SMT ON/OFF, local/distributed, overclocked/stock - im testing at 4k/8k using SLI 1080ti's so the GPU's should be used as 'maximally' as possible and I have attempted to highlight any configuration that is able to do this better.

I need more time to complete them and to test game mode and I have some 3600mhz ram on the way


----------



## happyluckbox

Currently running 128gb of tridentz ram, clocked at 2933mhz
14-14-14-34

(ram originally rated for 3200mhz 15-15-15-35 )

Going to try dropping the latency down further. If i try increasing the mhz at all however, it starts dropping worker threads in p95. So far pretty happy with 128gb of ram at 2933 tho!


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Problem is caused by the higher memory latency combined with 16 threads of the R7 chips impacting on throughput. Particularly when the GPU us also competing for access doing its DMA access to system memory and the cache. It creates long queues for the threads waiting for access to the memory through the controller. The higher the latency, the longer each thread has to wait in the queue.
> 
> As the thread has to wait its turn, each CPU core sits idle waiting for its memory read or write and reduces the performance. That is why R7 Gaming performance is lacking in many games. The 1600X performs at similar levels to the R7 chips in those gaming benchmarks because it only has 12 threads that can access the dual channel memory controller. There are not enough threads to create the same length queues so the available cores to not sit idle as much.
> 
> The 1950X has exactly the same 16 threads to dual channel memory controller challenge that the R7 chips have. Each Die has its own dual channel controller. There is also the chips additional challenge of the additional latency if threads have to switch between dies.
> 
> Quad channel memory cuts the thread to memory controller ratio in 1/2 as well as cutting the DMA memory access load from the GPU in half. Less load means shorter or no queues. That means there is potential for better performance IF the inter CCX tread switching latency does not negate the benefits of the reduced load on the two memory controllers.
> 
> 
> 
> i get all that i really do and i understand the mechanics of it...but in real life...my real life it does not make that much of a difference except to hobble the cpu in other things.
> i have done testing and it just doesn't add up to worth it to switch to gamers mode or local for 5 fps and that is really what that was netting me.
> 
> i will try it again though see how gamers mode goes for more than the games i usually play but again...for me it is not a holy grail sort of thing.
> means i have to install ryzen master again...urgh
Click to expand...

I am not talking about gaming mode. That is basically turning off one of the dies and emulating a 1800X using the AMD software as far as I can tell.

I am talking about simulating a 1900X that you should be able to do in the bios by disabling cores, Similar to the controversial Linus Video that simulated the 1600X before the R5 launch.


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Currently running 128gb of tridentz ram, clocked at 2933mhz
> 14-14-14-34
> 
> (ram originally rated for 3200mhz 15-15-15-35 )
> 
> Going to try dropping the latency down further. If i try increasing the mhz at all however, it starts dropping worker threads in p95. So far pretty happy with 128gb of ram at 2933 tho!


Have you tried increasing SOC voltage?


----------



## happyluckbox

How much would you recommend? Its hard to get 128gigs of ram stable so I was pretty happy with 2933mhz, but if I could get it higher......


----------



## Beatnutz

Trying to install my EK Supremacy Threadripper right now. The two bottom screws went in just fine, the two top ones (facing the top of the MB) we're really hard to scew in, and also didnt need a lot of spins to reach the end. Anyone else had this? I'm not feeling too confident this has been mounted correctly.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> How much would you recommend? Its hard to get 128gigs of ram stable so I was pretty happy with 2933mhz, but if I could get it higher......


Any OC on your CPU by chance? I'm sitting ona 64gb kit but still on the fence for 128gb, but waiting to hear from others since I'm kinda burned out from the EAS.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Trying to install my EK Supremacy Threadripper right now. The two bottom screws went in just fine, the two top ones (facing the top of the MB) we're really hard to scew in, and also didnt need a lot of spins to reach the end. Anyone else had this? I'm not feeling too confident this has been mounted correctly.


This is terrible. Just noticed what is wrong. Seems like the two top screws are too close to each other. Even if I try tightening them at the same time one of them will get stuck pretty much immediately and won't go down any further.

I'm off to a great start.


----------



## happyluckbox

Yes, im overclocked at 3.9ghz, 2.28vcore (2 notches over stock) +turbo load line calibration, so about 3.5vcore at load

4ghz though is pretty much impossible without custom loop.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Yes, im overclocked at 3.9ghz, 2.28vcore (2 notches over stock) +turbo load line calibration, so about 3.5vcore at load
> 
> 4ghz though is pretty much impossible without custom loop.


Ahhhhh @ajc I'm soooo tempted now!


----------



## happyluckbox

I actually use it to make money. Already explained in this thread. I believe it has paid itself off already a couple times over.

I would imagine there's a decent chunk of people who bought this who are professionals in their respective fields who need this for its brute force computation.

If people are buying this to play games or as a hobby though I wouldnt judge. Hell for me its a little bit of both


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Ahhhhh @ajc I'm soooo tempted now!


I know you are! You'll get there (whether you wait to get the other set or get it now)! I can't wait for next week or so when the XSPC blocks go on sale! Granted, it will probably be closer to the end of September before my custom loop is up and running....


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Trying to install my EK Supremacy Threadripper right now. The two bottom screws went in just fine, the two top ones (facing the top of the MB) we're really hard to scew in, and also didnt need a lot of spins to reach the end. Anyone else had this? I'm not feeling too confident this has been mounted correctly.


check and confirm that the cold plate screws are fully screwed in...

apart from that mine was easy to screw but didnt really take many turns to get on. I was easily able to 'bottom out' the screws and in fact I felt it should have had more mounting pressure.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> check and confirm that the cold plate screws are fully screwed in...
> 
> apart from that mine was easy to screw but didnt really take many turns to get on. I was easily able to 'bottom out' the screws and in fact I felt it should have had more mounting pressure.


Same experience for me. Screws went in easily but not a ton of turns.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> sorry yes i know what you mean
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i worded that wrong.
> ecc will always be slower and more expensive because it is enterprise gear...but in my opinion a lot of enterprise gear just isn't worth it(i get the need for ecc just would never get it myself


The unfortunate part is that unbuffered ECC memory isn't even enterprise gear. You could call it workstation memory as opposed to desktop memory or server memory since it has ECC but isn't registered/buffered. The consequence is that there is less of it made than either of the other two and it tends to be the most expensive type.

Frankly, I'd like to see everything but registered ECC memory dropped. It's not like one extra memory chip is terribly expensive these days like it was in the 80s and early 90s. If it were the only memory type, you can bet that there would be higher speed grades to service the desktop segment. Being registered would alleviate the problem with having lots of memory slots as well. Suddenly it's a much easier engineering problem.

As for needing ECC, it's more about being able to eliminate an entire class of failures by adding a single inexpensive chip to each module. It also makes attacks like rowhammer more difficult. It really should be the standard like it was in the early days of computing. Parity memory used to be quite common for a while until users started wanting massive memory arrays since their computers were getting fast enough to do interesting things.


----------



## Solarion

..


----------



## Beatnutz

Finally got the water block in place. My god .. had to go with pliers to get the screws in. It was a nightmare.
Took this picture just before I attached the last tube and started the bleed session.


----------



## springs113

[/quote]
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Finally got the water block in place. My god .. had to go with pliers to get the screws in. It was a nightmare.
> Took this picture just before I attached the last tube and started the bleed session.
> 
> That looks epic...what's your system specs?


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> apart from that mine was easy to screw but didnt really take many turns to get on. I was easily able to 'bottom out' the screws and in fact I felt it should have had more mounting pressure.


Like a child, it must be said--read your second paragraph without any reference.

But on a serious not, you guys are experiencing the mounting issues most likely what XSPC found right before going to market, which caused the delays. Still better than the Asus socket mount issue I read about in the Anand forums!


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Like a child, it must be said--read your second paragraph without any reference.
> 
> But on a serious not, you guys are experiencing the mounting issues most likely what XSPC found right before going to market, which caused the delays. Still better than the Asus socket mount issue I read about in the Anand forums!


Do you have a source for the XSPC delay issues?

I just spoke to someone at Swiftech and found out why my order was delayed. The TR4 adapter kits had problems during testing and they won't be in stock until next week... It sounded like fitment issues.

A lot of figment issues going around with this socket.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Do you have a source for the XSPC delay issues?
> 
> I just spoke to someone at Swiftech and found out why my order was delayed. The TR4 adapter kits had problems during testing and they won't be in stock until next week... It sounded like fitment issues.
> 
> A lot of figment issues going around with this socket.


XSPC posted on here and they made a post on their facebook.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Do you have a source for the XSPC delay issues?
> 
> I just spoke to someone at Swiftech and found out why my order was delayed. The TR4 adapter kits had problems during testing and they won't be in stock until next week... It sounded like fitment issues.
> 
> A lot of figment issues going around with this socket.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1636425/xspc-raystorm-neo-amd-str4-threadripper/90#post_26312058


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> That looks epic...what's your system specs?


MSI 1080TI FE, 2 x PALIT 980TI Super Jetstream
Corsair Ax1500i
Threadripper 1950X
MSI X399 Gaming Pro Carbon
3 x SanDisk Ultra II 500GB SATA SSD's
4TB Seagate Barracuda HDD
32GB Corsair Vengeance LED white 3000mhz
420mm rad on top, 360mm rad in front
2 EKWB DDC pumps

The case is a Be Quiet Dark base 900 Pro. Don't like it very much though.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> MSI 1080TI FE, 2 x PALIT 980TI Super Jetstream
> Corsair Ax1500i
> Threadripper 1950X
> MSI X399 Gaming Pro Carbon
> 3 x SanDisk Ultra II 500GB SATA SSD's
> 4TB Seagate Barracuda HDD
> 32GB Corsair Vengeance LED white 3000mhz
> 420mm rad on top, 360mm rad in front
> 2 EKWB DDC pumps
> 
> The case is a Be Quiet Dark base 900 Pro. Don't like it very much though.


killer specs, why the diff gpu cards? Why you don't like the case?


----------



## Fantasy

I just ordered the Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3. It's temporary until I can afford to get my custom water loop from EK. Hopefully, next month unless my car decides to break down again.



Also, I think this is the case that I'm going with for this build. Thermaltake 900


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> killer specs, why the diff gpu cards? Why you don't like the case?


I do GPU renders so it doesn't matter if they are different. So I'm pretty much saving old cards as I move up. Got a fourth slot now with the new MB









The Dark Base Pro 900 case is sold as a full tower case with endless posibilities and "perfect for water cooling" with rad space everywhere. In reality the inside of the case is a massive waste of space where noise dampening takes up a big chunk of space at the top and bottom. Cable management is terrible. Rad space is a joke. You are supposed to be able to fit a 360 in the bottom. Let me know if you see any possibilites of that







. As you can see on the top I had to ditch one of the 140mm fans and squeeze in a 120mm fan. Otherwise I would not have been able to have a rad there either. I was properly pissed off when I installed the case. So as a result I now have a rad in my desk drawer that I cant use since I planned to have it in the bottom.

I complained about it on the Be Quiet forum, but not a single reply.

I came from Phaneks, and I made a huge mistake leaving them. Polar opposites when it comes to the joy of installing the case. If they release a new version (with a bigger glas) of the Enthoo Primo I'm going to grab that.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I do GPU renders so it doesn't matter if they are different. So I'm pretty much saving old cards as I move up. Got a fourth slot now with the new MB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Dark Base Pro 900 case is sold as a full tower case with endless posibilities and "perfect for water cooling" with rad space everywhere. In reality the inside of the case is a massive waste of space where noise dampening takes up a big chunk of space at the top and bottom. Cable management is terrible. Rad space is a joke. You are supposed to be able to fit a 360 in the bottom. Let me know if you see any possibilites of that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . As you can see on the top I had to ditch one of the 140mm fans and squeeze in a 120mm fan. Otherwise I would not have been able to have a rad there either. I was properly pissed off when I installed the case. So as a result I now have a rad in my desk drawer that I cant use since I planned to have it in the bottom.
> 
> I complained about it on the Be Quiet forum, but not a single reply.
> 
> I came from Phaneks, and I made a huge mistake leaving them. Polar opposites when it comes to the joy of installing the case. If they release a new version (with a bigger glas) of the Enthoo Primo I'm going to grab that.


Make your own







Or buy one from Mnpctech. Below is my ghetto attempt.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I just ordered the Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3. It's temporary until I can afford to get my custom water loop from EK. Hopefully, next month unless my car decides to break down again.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, I think this is the case that I'm going with for this build. Thermaltake 900


I used thermaltake cases back in the armor days, and earlier this year I built a p5. Erm what can I say outside never again? Improper threading, crap riser cable(knew this coming in but 2 doas) just not a good product. If your willing to deal with frustration then go ahead.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I used thermaltake cases back in the armor days, and earlier this year I built a p5. Erm what can I say outside never again? Improper threading, crap riser cable(knew this coming in but 2 doas) just not a good product. If your willing to deal with frustration then go ahead.


Any other recommendations? I want a case that would fit at least two 360 rads or more.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Any other recommendations? I want a case that would fit at least two 360 rads or more.


You can always go case labs. I know the price is steeper but obviously sizing isn't an issue since you were willing to buy the tower. Not many mega towers left. Due to the modular nature of case labs cases you can always scale up or down. Or there's always the 900D which is massive rad space.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> You can always go case labs. I know the price is steeper but obviously sizing isn't an issue since you were willing to buy the tower. Not many mega towers left. Due to the modular nature of case labs cases you can always scale up or down. Or there's always the 900D which is massive rad space.


oh man, I totally forgot about the 900D. I have always wanted that case. Yeah, I think the 900D is good enough. case labs is a bit out of my price range, plus I bet shipping alone will cost as much as the case itself. I live in Dubai so shipping is an issue.

I just looked up the 900D it's around $367 here. That is reasonable.

Alright then. 900D it is.

thanks


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> oh man, I totally forgot about the 900D. I have always wanted that case. Yeah, I think the 900D is good enough. case labs is a bit out of my price range, plus I bet shipping alone will cost as much as the case itself. I live in Dubai so shipping is an issue.
> 
> I just looked up the 900D it's around $367 here. That is reasonable.
> 
> Alright then. 900D it is.
> 
> thanks


----------



## YroPro

No issues with my Core X9 case.

My new Lian Li DK-5 fits a 480 and 3 360s.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I do GPU renders so it doesn't matter if they are different. So I'm pretty much saving old cards as I move up. Got a fourth slot now with the new MB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Dark Base Pro 900 case is sold as a full tower case with endless posibilities and "perfect for water cooling" with rad space everywhere. In reality the inside of the case is a massive waste of space where noise dampening takes up a big chunk of space at the top and bottom. Cable management is terrible. Rad space is a joke. You are supposed to be able to fit a 360 in the bottom. Let me know if you see any possibilites of that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . As you can see on the top I had to ditch one of the 140mm fans and squeeze in a 120mm fan. Otherwise I would not have been able to have a rad there either. I was properly pissed off when I installed the case. So as a result I now have a rad in my desk drawer that I cant use since I planned to have it in the bottom.
> 
> I complained about it on the Be Quiet forum, but not a single reply.
> 
> I came from Phaneks, and I made a huge mistake leaving them. Polar opposites when it comes to the joy of installing the case. If they release a new version (with a bigger glas) of the Enthoo Primo I'm going to grab that.


They did and it's called the elite lol. Other than the glass issue why didn't you go with the primo? The minute i saw the darkbase 900 i knew it wasn't for me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Any other recommendations? I want a case that would fit at least two 360 rads or more.


price wise the thermaltake view 71, lian li pc-011 can.


----------



## Sandbo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> ThreadRipper 1950X _initially_ was a nightmare for me... This is somewhat long - but if you like reading a good real life computer story - read it. If you guy's want the pictures... I'll dig up the pictures.. But to me it's like seeing a murder scene. I want to look away, I have no interest in seeing it...
> ...........


I am very sorry to hear this.

While I didn't have any accident (lucky enough), I found the exact same step, sliding the CPU into the socket extremely tricky.
I also wore nitrile gloves (I work in a cleanroom), and got everything more than ready. When I was doing the above step, I think I missed the slot 3 times.
I started to sweat, and pause to think about what could be wrong, went through a few video tutorials, finally got it.

Seriously, the MB manufacturers must put a protective cover on the socket, it is just too easy for this to happen.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I just ordered the Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3. It's temporary until I can afford to get my custom water loop from EK. Hopefully, next month unless my car decides to break down again.


That is the same heatsink I'm using. Frankly, I'm going to be surprised if that doesn't keep your processor at a reasonable temperature unless you plan to overvolt.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I do GPU renders so it doesn't matter if they are different. So I'm pretty much saving old cards as I move up. Got a fourth slot now with the new MB


Curious which programs you see utilize that best? My main render's are Vegas, and maya atm since adobe suite is still pretty hosed on things. OBS I can't count since its not geared for that AS much.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Any other recommendations? I want a case that would fit at least two 360 rads or more.


Thermaltake x71. I have a two 360s and a 280 and you can fit more.


----------



## LunaP

@ajc do we have an OCN / TR4/Ryzen Discord?

I know NBR had one ( for everything ) but figured I'd ask.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> @ajc do we have an OCN / TR4/Ryzen Discord?
> 
> I know NBR had one ( for everything ) but figured I'd ask.


Nah, I'm just exhausted today. Been up most the night finishing a project while having a cold and dealing with my headaches (literally, I have long lived headaches almost every day of the month, the meds just take the edge off).

But I am excited to get my Taichi in tomorrow (usually gets here before noon with this carrier). So, I'll test it a bit with my AIO until my other project is done by mid-Sept. I definitely think its time for a nap, but soon I have to go eat some steak with my parents....


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Hmm interesting. I guess I will see how they play out. I was under the impression that these would be samsungs.


So i got those corsair sticks in today. Guess I got lucky?



They are sammy bdie.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> That is the same heatsink I'm using. Frankly, I'm going to be surprised if that doesn't keep your processor at a reasonable temperature unless you plan to overvolt.


I'm not planning on doing any major OC until I get my water loop. The Noctua will more than good enough for stock and minor OC.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Thermaltake x71. I have a two 360s and a 280 and you can fit more.


ooh man. So many choices. I don't know which one to get. The 900D and core X71 seem really great but I feel like they are a bit small.The Thermaltake 900 is absolutely massive but only support 1x560 rad and 1x420 rad. The 900D and X71, on the other hand, support more rads even though they are smaller than the Thermaltake 900.

eeehhh....

my choices are

Corsair 900D
Thermaltake Core X71
Thermaltake 900
View 71 Tempered Glass Edition, which looks absolutely gorgeous.
LIAN LI PC-O11


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> So i got those corsair sticks in today. Guess I got lucky?
> 
> 
> 
> They are sammy bdie.


Nice. looks great.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Nah, I'm just exhausted today. Been up most the night finishing a project while having a cold and dealing with my headaches (literally, I have long lived headaches almost every day of the month, the meds just take the edge off).
> 
> But I am excited to get my Taichi in tomorrow (usually gets here before noon with this carrier). So, I'll test it a bit with my AIO until my other project is done by mid-Sept. I definitely think its time for a nap, but soon I have to go eat some steak with my parents....


Wait wut post are u responding to ? LOL was asking about discord XD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> So i got those corsair sticks in today. Guess I got lucky?
> 
> 
> 
> They are sammy bdie.


Damn lucky! I think I'm gonna send my 64gb kit back and just pull the trigger and go for it https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232562

I'm getting the feeling that I should be able to still hit 3.9-4.0 while keeping these @ 3000-3200 especially w/ the way AGESA has been updated and asus has been updating things.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Wait wut post are u responding to ? LOL was asking about discord XD
> Damn lucky! I think I'm gonna send my 64gb kit back and just pull the trigger and go for it https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232562
> 
> I'm getting the feeling that I should be able to still hit 3.9-4.0 while keeping these @ 3000-3200 especially w/ the way AGESA has been updated and asus has been updating things.


I am running on the beta agesa from a week ago. Not sure of the number. Mix matching B die and E die lol. I can run 3000mhz with 8 sticks.

Running the 4 sticks of vengeance I just got. I can push 3333 1t 16cl at most. Tightening of timmings or any further is a fail to train. XMP works fine though. I haven't tried with more voltage. Kinda not worth the hassle for me.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Wait wut post are u responding to ? LOL was asking about discord XD
> Damn lucky! I think I'm gonna send my 64gb kit back and just pull the trigger and go for it https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232562
> 
> I'm getting the feeling that I should be able to still hit 3.9-4.0 while keeping these @ 3000-3200 especially w/ the way AGESA has been updated and asus has been updating things.


I must just be too exhausted at the moment. I was thinking discord as in non-harmonious, not jiving, disagreement, etc. (literal definitions; I do too much copy editing). Were you talking about voice and text chat? or am I just completely lost in lala land at the moment? lol!


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> I must just be too exhausted at the moment. I was thinking discord as in non-harmonious, not jiving, disagreement, etc. (literal definitions; I do too much copy editing). Were you talking about voice and text chat? or am I just completely lost in lala land at the moment? lol!


yes the discord chat xD, do we have one? If not would be kinda neat, its definitely helpful on the NBR side.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I am running on the beta agesa from a week ago. Not sure of the number. Mix matching B die and E die lol. I can run 3000mhz with 8 sticks


is that .06 beta?

Gonna initiate my return on newegg soon as I find a kit of these in stock , and or another 64gb though I'd be saving 100-200$ if I found a 128gb kit unless its on sale.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Ahhhhh @ajc I'm soooo tempted now!


umm
am i reading those voltages right.... maybe a few numbers mixed up or you use it to cook steak


----------



## Kriant

http://www.swiftech.com/apogee-skf-tr4-heirloom-series.aspx



Swiftech just started their pre-orders on their Threadripper Apogee SKF block.


----------



## SavantStrike

Man that Apogee block looks nice...

I'm concerned it might be a restrictive block though. Still waiting on reviews for the regular apogee heirloom.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> yes the discord chat xD, do we have one? If not would be kinda neat, its definitely helpful on the NBR side.
> is that .06 beta?
> 
> Gonna initiate my return on newegg soon as I find a kit of these in stock , and or another 64gb though I'd be saving 100-200$ if I found a 128gb kit unless its on sale.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> yes the discord chat xD, do we have one? If not would be kinda neat, its definitely helpful on the NBR side.
> is that .06 beta?
> 
> Gonna initiate my return on newegg soon as I find a kit of these in stock , and or another 64gb though I'd be saving 100-200$ if I found a 128gb kit unless its on sale.


the beta on the website 0504. Btw I don't think the RGB works properly for ram unless it's been fixed for ryzen.


----------



## Kriant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Man that Apogee block looks nice...
> 
> I'm concerned it might be a restrictive block though. Still waiting on reviews for the regular apogee heirloom.


I've decided to go with it. Canceled my EK block order. I have a good feeling about it.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> yes the discord chat xD, do we have one? If not would be kinda neat, its definitely helpful on the NBR side.
> is that .06 beta?
> 
> Gonna initiate my return on newegg soon as I find a kit of these in stock , and or another 64gb though I'd be saving 100-200$ if I found a 128gb kit unless its on sale.


I actually do not know. Wish I did... And that would be nice!


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i get all that i really do and i understand the mechanics of it...but in real life...my real life it does not make that much of a difference except to hobble the cpu in other things.
> i have done testing and it just doesn't add up to worth it to switch to gamers mode or local for 5 fps and that is really what that was netting me.
> 
> i will try it again though see how gamers mode goes for more than the games i usually play but again...for me it is not a holy grail sort of thing.
> means i have to install ryzen master again...urgh


I am not a huge gamer. I also do not have a personal need for 16 cores/32 threads either but I recognize that there are genuine use cases where the 16 core CPUs do bring a genuine benefit.

The 1900X has the potential to be something that I am interested in if it doesn't hobble itself the way the R7 chips do with only having dual channel memory. I can't tell if the inter die fabric is going to take away the benefits that the quad memory channels provide until someone tests it and up until now no-one has. There is also potential to shed further light on improving the R7 performance as well with discoveries made by the different uses here as well. Maybe the reviews will start coming out later today but the internet has been pretty silent about the 1900X though post the initial announcement.

With regards Zen in general, My view is that the GTX1070 level card is about the level where performance starts being degraded. Soon there will be a GTX2070 or Navi that runs at the level of a 1080TI or more with GTX2080 increasing performance even further. If the AMD CPUs are already being hobbled by the current high level GPUs because of design flaws or because of some undiscovered setting it will only get worse when the next gen GPUs arrive. Combined that with the fact that more applications are getting improved GPU acceleration and the loads being placed on GPUs will get more, not less on the coming years exacerbating the issue that we are seeing in those areas now.

Game benchmarks are telling to me of so much more than just how fast the game itself runs. It tells me how the CPU and memory subsystems are is handling a particular types of single user-centric workloads and how the hardware will behave in other situations where elements of that type of workload also apply. That is something the most people here have not been able to appreciate. It has shown though, that even AMD themselves have not known exactly what the problems have been and are struggling to identify them just as we are. It does not mean to say that the Zen based CPUs are bad for everything though. They are really good in certain situations.


----------



## Beatnutz

Hey guys, I'm having some serious issues with my cpu.

I am running it on stock settings, did not change a thing in the BIOS except updating to the latest version. Also running the latest chipset drivers in Win10. I can do benchmark tests just fine, no problem. Cinebench works fine and Prime95 is also not giving me any issues. But as soon as I try to render something in Houdini or Cinema 4D it will crash my computer. Not a blue screen, or a restart. But a hard crash to black and I can't even power off my computer by forcing it (pressing and holding the power button). I have to pull the plug out.

I figured it was some conflicting drivers or whatever so I did a clean install of Win10 but I'm getting the same issue still.

I've tried checking the power consumption before it crashes but it looks perfectly fine.

Any ideas??? tnx

Meanwhile I'll try finding other software that can crash it


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Hey guys, I'm having some serious issues with my cpu.
> 
> I am running it on stock settings, did not change a thing in the BIOS except updating to the latest version. Also running the latest chipset drivers in Win10. I can do benchmark tests just fine, no problem. Cinebench works fine and Prime95 is also not giving me any issues. But as soon as I try to render something in Houdini or Cinema 4D it will crash my computer. Not a blue screen, or a restart. But a hard crash to black and I can't even power off my computer by forcing it (pressing and holding the power button). I have to pull the plug out.
> 
> I figured it was some conflicting drivers or whatever so I did a clean install of Win10 but I'm getting the same issue still.
> 
> I've tried checking the power consumption before it crashes but it looks perfectly fine.
> 
> Any ideas??? tnx
> 
> Meanwhile I'll try finding other software that can crash it


are those apps using the video cards to render or the cpu? don't use them don't know








https://www.maxon.net/en/news/maxon-news/article/hotfix-providing-ryzen-support-now-available-for-cinema-4d-and-bodypaint-3d-r18/

could it be something like this or the hotfix for NVidia (in regards to cinema 4d)
other than that some change in the bios may have altered something that is triggering a crash as you did a clean install (unless you used the same drivers you updated to in which case try and roll them back)

what i would do is roll back the bios and try with the latest drivers if it fixes it it is a bios issue if it doesn't try the new bios and roll back the drivers(or vice versa of course)

i myself have only had one lockup and that was corona 1.3 bench and that was due to low voltages.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> are those apps using the video cards to render or the cpu? don't use them don't know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.maxon.net/en/news/maxon-news/article/hotfix-providing-ryzen-support-now-available-for-cinema-4d-and-bodypaint-3d-r18/
> 
> could it be something like this or the hotfix for NVidia (in regards to cinema 4d)
> other than that some change in the bios may have altered something that is triggering a crash as you did a clean install (unless you used the same drivers you updated to in which case try and roll them back)
> 
> what i would do is roll back the bios and try with the latest drivers if it fixes it it is a bios issue if it doesn't try the new bios and roll back the drivers(or vice versa of course)
> 
> i myself have only had one lockup and that was corona 1.3 bench and that was due to low voltages.


I'm using that version of Cinema4D (it wouldn't even start before). Houdini is pure CPU though, and gives me the same crash so don't think it is GPU related.

I had the same crash before the clean install, and after. Running the BIOS on default settings (cleared CMOS). I'll see if I can roll back my BIOS.

Can it be RAM related? If my sticks arent fully compatible? Shouldn't even boot up then but u never know.


----------



## Beatnutz

For some reason I'm hitting 4000MHz on stock settings ... not sure if it is related or why I'm even getting those speeds.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I'm using that version of Cinema4D (it wouldn't even start before). Houdini is pure CPU though, and gives me the same crash so don't think it is GPU related.
> 
> I had the same crash before the clean install, and after. Running the BIOS on default settings (cleared CMOS). I'll see if I can roll back my BIOS.
> 
> Can it be RAM related? If my sticks arent fully compatible? Shouldn't even boot up then but u never know.


that's a good point but if it passed cinebench and prime 95 i really don't see how.
you could try hci memtest on it but loading up 32 instances is a pain









as a test maybe disable 2 of the video cards if they are running sli might be something there...again doubt it.

until you find someone else running those 2 things it's just guess work and elimination.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> For some reason I'm hitting 4000MHz on stock settings ... not sure if it is related or why I'm even getting those speeds.


looks like you have it set to balanced mode try high power or the ryzen balanced plan.

also xfr will boost these up to 4.2 and 3.7 on load(usually around 3500 on full load)

it could be it is trying to boost but not enough juice because of the plan.

also can you run the latest hwinfo that will tell you the tdie and tctl temps and a lot more info, it would be useful.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> looks like you have it set to balanced mode try high power or the ryzen balanced plan.
> 
> also xfr will boost these up to 4.2 and 3.7 on load(usually around 3500 on full load)
> 
> it could be it is trying to boost but not enough juice because of the plan.
> 
> also can you run the latest hwinfo that will tell you the tdie and tctl temps and a lot more info, it would be useful.


You might be on to something. I switched to 'game mode' and I could render without a problem. The LED display on my motherboard says 'D3' now which means 'some architectual protocols are not available'.

I think I have to reach out to MSI. Which I know will be a pain in the ass, the first 30 mails will be about random **** util they've gone a full circle and ask me the same things again. Been there, done that :/


----------



## Beatnutz

So I changed the power setting to 'power saver' and it seems to work! 'High Performance' was greyed out though. Could not apply it for some reason.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> So I changed the power setting to 'power saver' and it seems to work! 'High Performance' was greyed out though. Could not apply it for some reason.


ok that's weird. to get the ryzen balanced mode you need to install it from the video card drivers, i don't think its in the ryzen drivers package.
and why performance is gryed out is very strange in itself.

if it screws up you can change the balanced plan by changing max cpu 100% min cpu 100% and core parking to 100% that is basically high performance.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> You might be on to something. I switched to 'game mode' and I could render without a problem. The LED display on my motherboard says 'D3' now which means 'some architectual protocols are not available'.
> 
> I think I have to reach out to MSI. Which I know will be a pain in the ass, the first 30 mails will be about random **** util they've gone a full circle and ask me the same things again. Been there, done that :/


another thing that could be is have you plugged all the power into the board mine for example has a 8 pin and a 4 pin eatx power some like the asus have 2 8 pin plugs


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> another thing that could be is have you plugged all the power into the board mine for example has a 8 pin and a 4 pin eatx power some like the asus have 2 8 pin plugs


It crashed again after a few successful attempts.

The MSI board has the 24pin and two 8 pins plus a 6 pin PCIE. I plugged them all in. Not sure which one to pull out though?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> It crashed again after a few successful attempts.
> 
> The MSI board has the 24pin and two 8 pins plus a 6 pin PCIE. I plugged them all in. Not sure which one to pull out though?


well i t should all plugged in especially if you have 3 video cards so that won't be it unless it is not drawing enough juice.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> well i t should all plugged in especially if you have 3 video cards so that won't be it unless it is not drawing enough juice.


I unplugged two of the GPU's just to be sure.

I'm running on the Ryzen Balanced Mode now and it works a lot better. But still crashes every now and then during long simulations. High Performance doesn't work very well at all.

So now I'm out of ideas.


----------



## Paprika

Anyone else using Corsair Vengeance RGB ram?
Can't go higher than 2666mhz no matter what. Simply won't post.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I unplugged two of the GPU's just to be sure.
> 
> I'm running on the Ryzen Balanced Mode now and it works a lot better. But still crashes every now and then during long simulations. High Performance doesn't work very well at all.
> 
> So now I'm out of ideas.


ok i just thought of something it might be...what was you score in cinebench.

if it was lowish and normal usage you find it sluggish turn of hpet (usually the deletevalue command by itself works if it doesn't do that one then the false one.

thast about the last of my knowledge for now without researching the apps more
Quote:


> [/cmd admin
> 
> to enable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock true
> 
> to disable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock false
> 
> bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclockQUOTE]


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok i just thought of something it might be...what was you score in cinebench.
> 
> if it was lowish and normal usage you find it sluggish turn of hpet (usually the deletevalue command by itself works if it doesn't do that one then the false one.
> 
> thast about the last of my knowledge for now without researching the apps more
> 
> to enable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock true
> 
> to disable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock false
> 
> bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformcloc


I had 2700-something in Cinebench which is a little bit low, but not too bad. Seen scores mostly around 3000 on stock.

Another guy asked me to turn off 'core performance boost' in the MSI BIOS which has been known to fix these crashes. So it seems MSI specific. Trying it out right now and so far so good.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I had 2700-something in Cinebench which is a little bit low, but not too bad. Seen scores mostly around 3000 on stock.
> 
> Another guy asked me to turn off 'core performance boost' in the MSI BIOS which has been known to fix these crashes. So it seems MSI specific. Trying it out right now and so far so good.


Yeah so I can confirm that disabling 'core performance boost' worked. Finally a solution! Thanks for your help man, much appreciated.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> Anyone else using Corsair Vengeance RGB ram?
> Can't go higher than 2666mhz no matter what. Simply won't post.


I am.

I posted earlier about my experience. I went through two kits until the third was stable.

Are you hynix, or Samsung. If you're Samsung are you on b die or e die?


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I am.
> 
> I posted earlier about my experience. I went through two kits until the third was stable.
> 
> Are you hynix, or Samsung. If you're Samsung are you on b die or e die?


What's the easiest way to check? Version 4.31 so afaik it should be Hynix.
This is my second kit due to one of the lightbars on my first kit going haywire. Still no improvement.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> Anyone else using Corsair Vengeance RGB ram?
> Can't go higher than 2666mhz no matter what. Simply won't post.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> Anyone else using Corsair Vengeance RGB ram?
> Can't go higher than 2666mhz no matter what. Simply won't post.


Which vengence LED ram do you have. I have 2 kits cl15 3000 and cl16 3200. One is hynix other is samsung bdie. I can run both at rated speeds. However, you have to manually set the ohms on the cl 15 3000 kit.


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Which vengence LED ram do you have. I have 2 kits cl15 3000 and cl16 3200. One is hynix other is samsung bdie. I can run both at rated speeds. However, you have to manually set the ohms on the cl 15 3000 kit.


32GB 3000 cl15
So far I've only tried 60 ohm, any recommendations?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> 32GB 3000 cl15
> So far I've only tried 60 ohm, any recommendations?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> 32GB 3000 cl15
> So far I've only tried 60 ohm, any recommendations?


Hmm I ran it with 60 as well. Tried upping your dram boot voltage? What timings are you running at.


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Hmm I ran it with 60 as well. Tried upping your dram boot voltage? What timings are you running at.


Upped to 1.45v, 60ohm, stock timings so far.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> Upped to 1.45v, 60ohm, stock timings so far.


Odd I don't recall being able to run at an odd Cl.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Yeah so I can confirm that disabling 'core performance boost' worked. Finally a solution! Thanks for your help man, much appreciated.


That isn't much of a solution though if your boost states aren't stable at stock. I would suggest turning CPB back on but setting your LLC setting higher. You might be getting more voltage sag than your processor can tolerate at high boost states. It would seem to fit your problem's description. You were less unstable in power saver mode for instance which just tells Windows to be less aggressive with using boost states. You're stable with boost entirely disabled.


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Odd I don't recall being able to run at an odd Cl.


It's weird though, 2666 needs absolutely no tweaking to work.
But the second I add even a single mhz it won't boot.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> It's weird though, 2666 needs absolutely no tweaking to work.
> But the second I add even a single mhz it won't boot.


Try different timings and see if you can get a higher mhz. Also how many sticks is this?


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Try different timings and see if you can get a higher mhz. Also how many sticks is this?


Haven't come that far due to having to quickly RMA my set with a broken lightbar.

4 sticks. So 4x8GB.


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> It's weird though, 2666 needs absolutely no tweaking to work.
> But the second I add even a single mhz it won't boot.


It's the same for me with the G.Skill 8*8Gb 3200, I can only use them @ 2666Mhz for now.
If it is above this value, it boots after 3 restart but it put the bios message like; your memory settings failed, enter the BIOS to change them.

Anyway no time for me to tweak anymore, I switch my X79 production to the TR this weekend.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> umm
> am i reading those voltages right.... maybe a few numbers mixed up or you use it to cook steak


Wait wut? I was talking about adding ram, or was it something on a site description? What are you referring to? xD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> the beta on the website 0504. Btw I don't think the RGB works properly for ram unless it's been fixed for ryzen.


Works fine if you don't install the RGB software (gskill) and just leave it to the bios, which I plan to just leave the ram at its defaults = rainbow, no issues reported from the ROG forums.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Wait wut? I was talking about adding ram, or was it something on a site description? What are you referring to? xD
> Works fine if you don't install the RGB software (gskill) and just leave it to the bios, which I plan to just leave the ram at its defaults = rainbow, no issues reported from the ROG forums.


Yea I knew it would light up just saying for color changes etc.


----------



## Sandbo

New to the club, hello!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> It's the same for me with the G.Skill 8*8Gb 3200, I can only use them @ 2666Mhz for now.
> If it is above this value, it boots after 3 restart but it put the bios message like; your memory settings failed, enter the BIOS to change them.
> 
> Anyway no time for me to tweak anymore, I switch my X79 production to the TR this weekend.


What I have heard is that having 2 sticks of RAM in the same channel (DIMM-A1 and DIMM-A2 both occupied) will increase capacitance, which then slows things down a lot.
With Asrock X399 Taichi, I can run quad channel G.Skill 3200 C14 16GB*4 without any tweaking in BIOS. But I am worried if I increase the volume it will suffer from speed.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> That isn't much of a solution though if your boost states aren't stable at stock. I would suggest turning CPB back on but setting your LLC setting higher. You might be getting more voltage sag than your processor can tolerate at high boost states. It would seem to fit your problem's description. You were less unstable in power saver mode for instance which just tells Windows to be less aggressive with using boost states. You're stable with boost entirely disabled.


tnx! I'll check that out once I'm done rendering stuff


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> Wait wut? I was talking about adding ram, or was it something on a site description? What are you referring to? xD
> Works fine if you don't install the RGB software (gskill) and just leave it to the bios, which I plan to just leave the ram at its defaults = rainbow, no issues reported from the ROG forums.


sorry i thought he was talking about cpu volts and they all looked out of whack


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Yeah so I can confirm that disabling 'core performance boost' worked. Finally a solution! Thanks for your help man, much appreciated.


did you try disabling HPET


----------



## happyluckbox

Are you guys able to run command rate 2? I have the gigabyte aorus x399, and even though i hard set the option to 2T, cpuz and hwinfo still showing im at 1T....


----------



## YroPro

Hey guys, I know none of these are really for gaming, I just like being excessive.

Anyways, any thoughts on the 1900x possibly being better for gaming than the 1920x/1950x? It has a higher base and less cores, so I thought that it might overclock higher.

Anyone here know more about this than me and want to chime in?

Cooling isn't going to be an issue either way, I have 3 360mms and a 480 rad for whichever I end up with.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YroPro*
> 
> Hey guys, I know none of these are really for gaming, I just like being excessive.
> 
> Anyways, any thoughts on the 1900x possibly being better for gaming than the 1920x/1950x? It has a higher base and less cores, so I thought that it might overclock higher.
> 
> Anyone here know more about this than me and want to chime in?
> 
> Cooling isn't going to be an issue either way, I have 3 360mms and a 480 rad for whichever I end up with.


I think a 1800x is going to be better. Your looking at a 2 die latency either way with any threadripper.


----------



## YroPro

Well, I already got a Zenith Mobo and EK waterblock for TR. And I might end up needing all of the PCIE lanes.

I only have two WB 1080 Tis right now, but it'll be replaced with SLI WB whatever volta is, as well as some NVME drives. And either an audio card, RAID controller, or 10GB NIC. Haven't decided yet.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YroPro*
> 
> Hey guys, I know none of these are really for gaming, I just like being excessive.
> 
> Anyways, any thoughts on the 1900x possibly being better for gaming than the 1920x/1950x? It has a higher base and less cores, so I thought that it might overclock higher.
> 
> Anyone here know more about this than me and want to chime in?
> 
> Cooling isn't going to be an issue either way, I have 3 360mms and a 480 rad for whichever I end up with.


The 1900x although clocked higher according to AMD is a tad bit slower. I would probably assume they're correct too because the 1900x may have more CCXs which in turn would produce more latency.
Correct me if I'm wrong anyone.

Edit: i maybe wrong, the setup is 4-0-4-0 diagonally. If i read and understood it correctly 2ccx total which should make it a tad bit faster. Maybe I'm tired(may have read the slides incorrectly), I've been up since 1am est.


----------



## jarcsp

Hi Guys, I'm new here, basically I got my system up un running yesterday and I'm having a strange issue with my Gigabyte Aorus X399.... The radiator fans behaviour is strange.. If I power on the PC then they will work as expected (they will use the settings applied in Bios fan curves) but if I reboot they will go 100% until next power off.

The other issue that I was facing is that from time to time the first boot drive (Samsung Nvme 950 pro) gets blanked and the MB doesn't boot due to no boot drive found, a quick power down fixes the issue.
I already updated bios to latest one and seems to be the same.

By any chance anyone is having similar issues and might have a clue what's going on?

Other than that I'm really happy with the setup.

Cheers.


----------



## nycgtr

Thinking I need to check my block placement. Anyone running on a block can give me your ambient temp and cpu temps and voltage?

Ambient of 27c atm. 1950x @ 4.0 with a +.175 offset around 1.312v on load sits at 41c on avg and loads at a peak of 75c. Seems a bit high.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Are you guys able to run command rate 2? I have the gigabyte aorus x399, and even though i hard set the option to 2T, cpuz and hwinfo still showing im at 1T....


it will be like the ryzen with geardown enabled 2t= 1.5t and shows up as 1t in hwinfro if you disable geardown and force 2t it should show 2t..at least from memory that is how it was.

http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/amd-to-release-nvme-raid-support-september-25th.html

not sure if anyone has touched on this yet the nvme raid support September 25.

now...since i actually don't own 1 nvme card of little relevance to me right now but some people seem pretty excited...doesn't it cost money on the x299 platform to do this...or is that something else i,m thinking of.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Thinking I need to check my block placement. Anyone running on a block can give me your ambient temp and cpu temps and voltage?
> 
> Ambient of 27c atm. 1950x @ 4.0 with a +.175 offset around 1.312v on load sits at 41c on avg and loads at a peak of 75c. Seems a bit high.


mine at 3900 1.25 llc3 ambient temp here is around 18c i guess
idle around 27/28 with a few little things running and after a 5 loop of cinebench tops out at 62
now
if i ran ycruncher or prime that would be different so kind of depends on your definition of *peak*








that's with a h115i and 2 varders running around 1100rpm


----------



## LunaP

Can we just remove the Multi/edit button since people are to damn lazy to begin w/ to care? I mean if rules don't matter then hey, w/e but at least change it.


----------



## ajc9988

So far, temps in the high 50s and [email protected]@LLC level 1 with 3200 CL14 gives me 3286-3308 on cinebench. I dialed in a 3600 CL16 without a problem, but until I have time to play with it, it's performance is somewhat close for cinebench. I'll have more playing in a couple weeks.


----------



## Beatnutz

Wow, both of my pumps stopped working yesterday. Has never happened before. Good thing I wasn't listening to music and that I have a flow meter. MSI is continuing to impress me.

They worked fine after booting up again, but now I'm going to keep an extra eye on them.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So far, temps in the high 50s and [email protected]@LLC level 1 with 3200 CL14 gives me 3286-3308 on cinebench. I dialed in a 3600 CL16 without a problem, but until I have time to play with it, it's performance is somewhat close for cinebench. I'll have more playing in a couple weeks.


Ambient temp 23c, idling at 46c, and haven't seen temps above 60c during load yet. Temps seem a bit high, I do have 3 GPU's though but still. Gonna pull the power from two of my GPU's to see if that changes much or if there is something else going on.

I'm also at 3.8Ghz 1.2V. Can't get my ram over 3000Mhz though. Cinebench score 2972


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> Just picked up my 1950x. Ordered my EKWB CPU Block. Waiting on motherboard to come to local dealer. Then I'll post pics of my build.
> 
> Motherboard is in, CPU installed. Just need my waterblock.


Finally got the system put together. Now its time to do a fresh Win10 install.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> How much $ for your new desktop?


So far I have spent the following:-
Corsair Vengence RGB DDR4 C16 3333MHz 64 GB ___ $679.99
Asus ROG Zenith Extreme ______________________ $549.99
Threadripper 1950X ___________________________ $999.99
Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 ______________________ $79.99
Shipping to Dubai _____________________________ $72.75
________________Total________________________ *$2382.71*

This is phase one of my build since I don't have more money to spend.

That's all I have spent so far. I have my old GTX 970 that I will be using, plus I have a Corsair RM850x PSU and I have an Evo 500GB SSD and 12TB (3TB x 4) worth of drives from my old build.

Next phase will be in either in December 2017 or January 2018. I will get my EK water loop. CPU blocks + GPU blocks for either a 1080TI or I might wait for Volta seeing that Vega is garbage. I will also get a 1TB Samsung pro NVME drive plus two 10TB drives and a 4k 144Hz monitor to replace my LG 4k 60Hz.


----------



## Particle

I find it interesting that virtually everyone opted to go for the 16 core instead of the 12 core model.

I'm not sure I'm fond of this new world in which we find ourselves where SKUs are separated by core count instead of just speed grades. There is no provision for the classic mentality of purchasing a lesser SKU and overclocking it to be the equal of the higher SKU you really wanted since frequency was the only difference. If you want 8 cores, 12 cores, or 16 cores, you just have to pay for the one you want given there is only a single SKU of each core count.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I find it interesting that virtually everyone opted to go for the 16 core instead of the 12 core model.
> 
> I'm not sure I'm fond of this new world in which we find ourselves where SKUs are separated by core count instead of just speed grades. There is no provision for the classic mentality of purchasing a lesser SKU and overclocking it to be the equal of the higher SKU you really wanted since frequency was the only difference. If you want 8 cores, 12 cores, or 16 cores, you just have to pay for the one you want given there is only a single SKU of each core count.


I think part of the reason why people don't do that anymore or at least don't do with Ryzen is because Ryzen is really not a great overclocker at all. The highest speed you can get with Ryzen is 4.2 if you are really lucky.

So I don't think the 12 core will ever match the 16 Cores. Then again, I could be wrong.

Speaking for myself personally, I don't mind getting a lower sku if the price is good and can actually overclock as good as the high-end sku.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I think part of the reason why people don't do that anymore or at least don't do with Ryzen is because Ryzen is really not a great overclocker at all. The highest speed you can get with Ryzen is 4.2 if you are really lucky.
> 
> So I don't think the 12 core will ever match the 16 Cores. Then again, I could be wrong.


That isn't quite what I meant. I was meaning to point out that you can't overclock cores into existence. It used to be that all that separated different SKUs in the good old days was frequency and luck.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I find it interesting that virtually everyone opted to go for the 16 core instead of the 12 core model.
> 
> I'm not sure I'm fond of this new world in which we find ourselves where SKUs are separated by core count instead of just speed grades. There is no provision for the classic mentality of purchasing a lesser SKU and overclocking it to be the equal of the higher SKU you really wanted since frequency was the only difference. If you want 8 cores, 12 cores, or 16 cores, you just have to pay for the one you want given there is only a single SKU of each core count.


12 core is 100 too much in my books. 200 for 4 more threads is a no brainer. Hell that's like adding a i7 hedt apparently for 200.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> That isn't quite what I meant. I was meaning to point out that you can't overclock cores into existence. It used to be that all that separated different SKUs in the good old days was frequency and luck.


ooh my bad. I read your post too fast and misunderstood what you meant!


----------



## islandgam3r

*Hey Guys, I'm about to pull trigger on the 1920X $799.99 on Newegg. Have a question, is $800 12core a better buy that the $550 8-core 1900X that just came out?? Give me your theories. My upcoming build is going be for Content Creation, Editing, streaming, Possible VM setup in the future with some decent gaming. Which one should I get?? See my current part List below

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/XpKMhq*


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *islandgam3r*
> 
> *Hey Guys, I'm about to pull trigger on the 1920X $799.99 on Newegg. Have a question, is $800 12core a better buy that the $550 8-core 1900X that just came out?? Give me your theories. My upcoming build is going be for Content Creation, Editing, streaming, Possible VM setup in the future with some decent gaming. Which one should I get?? See my current part List below
> 
> https://pcpartpicker.com/list/XpKMhq*


Both of those chips are a bit overpriced to me. With the 1900x your paying for the platform not the core count chip. I would go with the 1920x over the 1900x. The 1900x is a very hard sell in my eyes.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Both of those chips are a bit overpriced to me. With the 1900x your paying for the platform not the core count chip. I would go with the 1920x over the 1900x. The 1900x is a very hard sell in my eyes.


It actually depends on your needs. If you need memory bandwidth (with less concern about latency), but don't need high core count, it makes perfect sense. Also, look how well the current quad core chips perform, of which you are getting two on one PCB. So, I wouldn't say it is a hard sell, especially if you are doing graphics intense processing and use more than one graphics card.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> It actually depends on your needs. If you need memory bandwidth (with less concern about latency), but don't need high core count, it makes perfect sense. Also, look how well the current quad core chips perform, of which you are getting two on one PCB. So, I wouldn't say it is a hard sell, especially if you are doing graphics intense processing and use more than one graphics card.


For the price of 1 1900x and a board. I could build 2 1800x cpu and board bundles at microcenter. Which is why it makes no sense to me. From a productivity sense.


----------



## islandgam3r

Thx for input so far everyone, keep'em coming =) I am Still deciding on GPU choice. maybe XFire AIB/Custom Vega 56s/64s??? Or SLI 1080s??? OR I could save some money and get Single 1080ti....not sure which route to go Since Vegas so far have been "Meh" in performance. Waiting to see if Sapphire or ASUS custom Vegas are desirable performance wise...hmmmm


----------



## Beatnutz

Hey guys, I'm a bit confused. My Cinebench scores are a bit strange. As soon as I touch ram speed I get lower points. U have any ideas?

Corsair VENGEANCE® LED 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 DRAM 3000MHz C15

1950x @ 3.4GHz, DDR4 @ 2133Mhz - 2931pt
*1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 2133Mhz - 3164pt*
1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 2800Mhz (manual) - 2939pt
1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 3000Mhz (XMP2) - 2972pt
1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 3066Mhz (XMP1) - 2948pt


----------



## Gilles3000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *islandgam3r*
> 
> Hey Guys, I'm about to pull trigger on the 1920X $799.99 on Newegg. Have a question, is $800 12core a better buy that the $550 8-core 1900X that just came out?? Give me your theories. My upcoming build is going be for Content Creation, Editing, streaming, Possible VM setup in the future with some decent gaming. Which one should I get?? See my current part List below
> https://pcpartpicker.com/list/XpKMhq[/B]


I'd personally get the 12 core, might as well if you're going to invest in threadripper.

I'd change a few things about your build though.

Those RGB RAM kits have been nothing but a nightmare on ryzen, I'd avoid them.
Instead of spending tons on RGB fans, why not get some decent normal fans with those Phanteks RGB frames (Your case already comes with 2).
Are you sure you want to spend $150 on a CLC? I'd either spend half that one something like the NH-U14S TR4-SP3 or move up to a custom loop.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *islandgam3r*
> 
> Thx for input so far everyone, keep'em coming =) I am Still deciding on GPU choice. maybe XFire AIB/Custom Vega 56s/64s??? Or SLI 1080s??? OR I could save some money and get Single 1080ti....not sure which route to go Since Vegas so far have been "Meh" in performance. Waiting to see if Sapphire or ASUS custom Vegas are desirable performance wise...hmmmm


I'd always go with the best single GPU you can get first so you can get the best performance before having to deal with SLI/Xfire, which is the 1080Ti currently.

Here's your build with the changes I made(Saves you about $150):
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

*CPU:* AMD - Threadripper 1920X 3.5GHz 12-Core Processor ($789.89 @ B&H)
*CPU Cooler:* Noctua - NH-U14S TR4-SP3 140.2 CFM CPU Cooler ($79.90)
*Motherboard:* ASRock - X399 Taichi ATX TR4 Motherboard ($333.98 @ Newegg)
*Memory:* G.Skill - Trident Z 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($371.99 @ Newegg)
*Video Card:* Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($754.88 @ OutletPC)
*Case Fan:* Phanteks - PH-F140MP 68.1 CFM 140mm Fan ($17.88 @ OutletPC)
*Case Fan:* Phanteks - PH-F140HP II 68.1 CFM 140mm Fan ($14.99 @ Newegg)
*Case Accessory:* NZXT - Hue+ LED Controller ($46.99 @ NCIX US)
*Other:* Phanteks Enthoo Pro M SE with 2 x Halos RGB Fan Frames, Integrated RGB lighting, Tempered Glass Side Panel - Black/White interior ($123.98 @ Newegg)
*Other:* Phanteks PH-FF140RGBP Halos RGB Fan Frame - High density LEDs, RGB, ($9.99 @ Newegg)
*Total:* $2544.47


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilles3000*
> 
> I'd personally get the 12 core, might as well if you're going to invest in threadripper.
> 
> I'd change a few things about your build though.
> 
> Those RGB RAM kits have been nothing but a nightmare on ryzen, I'd avoid them.
> Instead of spending tons on RGB fans, why not get some decent normal fans with those Phanteks RGB frames (Your case already comes with 2).
> Are you sure you want to spend $150 on a CLC? I'd either spend half that one something like the NH-U14S TR4-SP3 or move up to a custom loop.
> I'd always go with the best single GPU you can get first so you can get the best performance before having to deal with SLI/Xfire, which is the 1080Ti currently.
> 
> Here's your build with the changes I made(Saves you about $150):
> PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
> 
> *CPU:* AMD - Threadripper 1920X 3.5GHz 12-Core Processor ($789.89 @ B&H)
> *CPU Cooler:* Noctua - NH-U14S TR4-SP3 140.2 CFM CPU Cooler ($79.90)
> *Motherboard:* ASRock - X399 Taichi ATX TR4 Motherboard ($333.98 @ Newegg)
> *Memory:* G.Skill - Trident Z 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($371.99 @ Newegg)
> *Video Card:* Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($754.88 @ OutletPC)
> *Case Fan:* Phanteks - PH-F140MP 68.1 CFM 140mm Fan ($17.88 @ OutletPC)
> *Case Fan:* Phanteks - PH-F140HP II 68.1 CFM 140mm Fan ($14.99 @ Newegg)
> *Case Accessory:* NZXT - Hue+ LED Controller ($46.99 @ NCIX US)
> *Other:* Phanteks Enthoo Pro M SE with 2 x Halos RGB Fan Frames, Integrated RGB lighting, Tempered Glass Side Panel - Black/White interior ($123.98 @ Newegg)
> *Other:* Phanteks PH-FF140RGBP Halos RGB Fan Frame - High density LEDs, RGB, ($9.99 @ Newegg)
> *Total:* $2544.47


RGB with noctua







He wants that 99% of builds I see look lol. Seriously though I don't know the performance of that enermax tr4 kit but I think it will do better than the noctua.


----------



## Gilles3000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> RGB with noctua
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Seriously though I don't know the performance of that enermax tr4 kit but I think it will do better than the noctua.


Already thought of that, that's why I included a nice white fan for it that will show up wonderfully under RGB









Performance wise, I think the Noctua will do fine at stock and even with mild OC's and more than likely be quieter. For some more serious overclocks the Enermax TR4 will probably do better, but will also be less reliable and more than likely louder.

Imo, the only way to properly cool OC'd Threadripper atm is with a custom loop. At least until EK or Swiftech make a proper AIO (*Not CLC*) for threadripper.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilles3000*
> 
> Already thought of that, that's why I included a nice white fan for it that will show up wonderfully under RGB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Performance wise, I think the Noctua will do fine at stock and even with mild OC's and more than likely be quieter. For some more serious overclocks the Enermax TR4 will probably do better, but will also be less reliable and more than likely louder.
> 
> Imo, the only way to properly cool OC'd Threadripper atm is with a custom loop. At least until EK or Swiftech make a proper AIO (*Not CLC*) for threadripper.


I agree the chip gets hot with an OC. I got an ek block with a 360 gts on mine. On the h100v2 I had in the time waiting on a block that thing was struggling.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I agree the chip gets hot with an OC. I got an ek block with a 360 gts on mine. On the h100v2 I had in the time waiting on a block that thing was struggling.


What temps are you getting on the 360 GTS + EK Block? I ask because I have the same radiator on a EK D5 with an additional EK XE 360 rad with just the EK CPU block. I'm eventually adding a 1080ti plus another 280 GTS rad I had sitting around, but in the meantime I thought with just the CPU and two 360 rads I would have the headroom to run whatever I want and never even touch 60 degrees with my ambient of 22 degrees.

Here is what I'm seeing:

CPU: 1920X
VCore: 1.34625
OC: 4.1GHz

Idle: 28-30 degrees
Prime95 Small FFT: ~73 degrees
Prime95 Blend: ~63-65 degrees
Aida64: ~65 degrees
RealBench: ~60 degrees

I think my custom loop is operating correctly and that I have the EK block seated properly. I also should have great flow because only the EK block at the moment plus the two rads, so I'm wondering if the EK block is that big of a bottleneck here on heat or if I'm missing something.


----------



## nycgtr

I may need to check the seating of my ek block as I think my temps should be about better. I have a d5, 360 gts and ek block in the CPU loop. My ambient of 27-28 is giving me 40-42c idle and a load max of about 70c. Extensive load may see 75c. This is with a 1950x 4ghz 1.32v max on an offset voltage.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Hey guys, I'm a bit confused. My Cinebench scores are a bit strange. As soon as I touch ram speed I get lower points. U have any ideas?
> 
> Corsair VENGEANCE® LED 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 DRAM 3000MHz C15
> 
> 1950x @ 3.4GHz, DDR4 @ 2133Mhz - 2931pt
> *1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 2133Mhz - 3164pt*
> 1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 2800Mhz (manual) - 2939pt
> 1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 3000Mhz (XMP2) - 2972pt
> 1950x @ 3.8GHz, DDR4 @ 3066Mhz (XMP1) - 2948pt


Sorry for bumping this. Still trying to solve this but no cigar.

I'm only OC'ing by setting the multiplier and vcore. Nothing else.


----------



## Bloodthirsty91

Hi guys! I'm new here but I've been reading you since a month. I'm building a dual loop water-cooled TR 1950x rig with 2 gtx 1080 ftw that I plan to overclock to the best I can. I'm still waiting for the 128gb ram kit and 1600w power supply to get here. I'll be building in a caselabs magnum sma8. I'll br vlogging my progress over and I'll post more picks and info on the current part list soon!
I cleaned/tested/flushed both rads/pumps with a ghetto loop already and everythings seems fine for now! Heres some pictures


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I may need to check the seating of my ek block as I think my temps should be about better. I have a d5, 360 gts and ek block in the CPU loop. My ambient of 27-28 is giving me 40-42c idle and a load max of about 70c. Extensive load may see 75c. This is with a 1950x 4ghz 1.32v max on an offset voltage.


Maybe I should be reseating my block, since your temps are very close to mine with (less than) half the radiator power and 4 extra cores. Maybe that extra vcore makes up for it but I don't think so.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Maybe I should be reseating my block, since your temps are very close to mine with (less than) half the radiator power and 4 extra cores. Maybe that extra vcore makes up for it but I don't think so.


I was looking at the sparse comments from others on temps and I think for me the 1.32v max that I am getting on an offset my idle temp is a few degrees high. I need to take a volt meter to confirm that voltage I see in hardwareinfo. I am not saying I am having bad temps but I feel it's 5 degrees too high.


----------



## Beatnutz

@Bloodthirsty91: Seems like a fun build! Enjoy and good luck!


----------



## Gilles3000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bloodthirsty91*
> 
> Hi guys! I'm new here but I've been reading you since a month. I'm building a dual loop water-cooled TR 1950x rig with 2 gtx 1080 ftw that I plan to overclock to the best I can. I'm still waiting for the 128gb ram kit and 1600w power supply to get here. I'll be building in a caselabs magnum sma8. I'll br vlogging my progress over and I'll post more picks and info on the current part list soon!
> I cleaned/tested/flushed both rads/pumps with a ghetto loop already and everythings seems fine for now! Heres some pictures


Looks like a pretty cool build, are you running the dual loops for looks (2 different color fluids) or performance?


----------



## islandgam3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilles3000*
> 
> I'd personally get the 12 core, might as well if you're going to invest in threadripper.
> 
> I'd change a few things about your build though.
> 
> Those RGB RAM kits have been nothing but a nightmare on ryzen, I'd avoid them.
> Instead of spending tons on RGB fans, why not get some decent normal fans with those Phanteks RGB frames (Your case already comes with 2).
> Are you sure you want to spend $150 on a CLC? I'd either spend half that one something like the NH-U14S TR4-SP3 or move up to a custom loop.
> I'd always go with the best single GPU you can get first so you can get the best performance before having to deal with SLI/Xfire, which is the 1080Ti currently.
> 
> Here's your build with the changes I made(Saves you about $150):
> PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
> 
> *CPU:* AMD - Threadripper 1920X 3.5GHz 12-Core Processor ($789.89 @ B&H)
> *CPU Cooler:* Noctua - NH-U14S TR4-SP3 140.2 CFM CPU Cooler ($79.90)
> *Motherboard:* ASRock - X399 Taichi ATX TR4 Motherboard ($333.98 @ Newegg)
> *Memory:* G.Skill - Trident Z 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($371.99 @ Newegg)
> *Video Card:* Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($754.88 @ OutletPC)
> *Case Fan:* Phanteks - PH-F140MP 68.1 CFM 140mm Fan ($17.88 @ OutletPC)
> *Case Fan:* Phanteks - PH-F140HP II 68.1 CFM 140mm Fan ($14.99 @ Newegg)
> *Case Accessory:* NZXT - Hue+ LED Controller ($46.99 @ NCIX US)
> *Other:* Phanteks Enthoo Pro M SE with 2 x Halos RGB Fan Frames, Integrated RGB lighting, Tempered Glass Side Panel - Black/White interior ($123.98 @ Newegg)
> *Other:* Phanteks PH-FF140RGBP Halos RGB Fan Frame - High density LEDs, RGB, ($9.99 @ Newegg)
> *Total:* $2544.47



Thx for your input, the CLC got good reviews and temps so far from what I seen but the CLC is only kind of a place holder or backup mind you until waterblocks from the brand I want is released. But I have every intention to do custom cooling instead of CLC.

As far as the RGB RAM is concerned yea, I heard the nightmares about this brand with compat issues with Ryzen, so I am aware but most of those issues are with the CL16 mainly, the ones I have are CL14, and to be honest...i RLY hope they go on sale because I think that 400$ is wayy to much for a 32GB quad kit, if the 3000MHz variant goes on sale 1st, I will switch it to that, not rly going tell diff between a 200MHz bump in realtime. I am also tempted to get the 3000 HyperX Preds which are CL15 and like 70$ cheaper than Gskill minus the RGB of course since they are all black, so that is on my radar too, only reason i was considering the RGB in general was to match the theme I was going with (Black/Purple w/Green Accents) that is SOLE reason, not rly trying to make my case look like a disco club

Don't too much mind the RGB fans also only reason I got it was for the theme again + the fact that I was considering Hue+


----------



## islandgam3r

CAN'T WAIT TILL THIS WATERBLOCK COMES OUT!!! This is the one I am w8ting for or the Black variant.....can't pull trigger on my 1920X part list until it is available...was suppose to be in August as per wat XSPC said, but it isn't here yet...=(

http://www.xs-pc.com/waterblocks-cpu-amd/raystorm-neo-amd-str4-chrome


----------



## Bloodthirsty91

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilles3000*
> 
> Looks like a pretty cool build, are you running the dual loops for looks (2 different color fluids) or performance?


For performance of course! This is what this build is aimed at, I'm going with a 480 for the 1950x only and a 560 for the two gpus, plus 3x120 front intake , 1x120 rear outtake and 2x140 bottom outtake. I'll use this pc for cpu and gpu rendering and I'll prolly upgrade for 4 way gpu on the next gtx gen. This is also aimed at the futur xpu (cpu+gpus) rendering technologie.


----------



## Gilles3000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bloodthirsty91*
> 
> For performance of course! This is what this build is aimed at, I'm going with a 480 for the 1950x only and a 560 for the two gpus, plus 3x120 front intake , 1x120 rear outtake and 2x140 bottom outtake. I'll use this pc for cpu and gpu rendering and I'll prolly upgrade for 4 way gpu on the next gtx gen. This is also aimed at the futur xpu (cpu+gpus) rendering technologie.


I know it might sound odd, but a single loop usually performs better than a dual one, and if you're using 2 pumps it gives you the added benefit of redundancy and increased head pressure.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilles3000*
> 
> I know it might sound odd, but a single loop usually performs better than a dual one, and if you're using 2 pumps it gives you the added benefit of redundancy and increased head pressure.


Was just about to say the same. No performance gains in having two loops as far as I know. Also it adds a lot of extra tubing. The upside is that it is easier to control if you should have heat problems, and also you don't need to empty the whole system if you need to change components etc.


----------



## nycgtr

Dual loop here. It's just easier for heat and noise management.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Sorry for bumping this. Still trying to solve this but no cigar.
> 
> I'm only OC'ing by setting the multiplier and vcore. Nothing else.


that is a bit weird but if the ram is having issues past 2133 it may actually be erroring i would try doing a memtest at the higher speeds and see if it fails.

your 3.8 result looks about right my 3.9 results with 3200 ram is 3265 and 159 single thread.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilles3000*
> 
> I know it might sound odd, but a single loop usually performs better than a dual one, and if you're using 2 pumps it gives you the added benefit of redundancy and increased head pressure.


i have no real idea at all about custom watercooling but having 2 loops would seem to be a better way as you are not cooling more than one thing even if you have extra pumps and rads you are still pushing hotter water around aren't you?
i admit to knowing nothing







just a question.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> What temps are you getting on the 360 GTS + EK Block? I ask because I have the same radiator on a EK D5 with an additional EK XE 360 rad with just the EK CPU block. I'm eventually adding a 1080ti plus another 280 GTS rad I had sitting around, but in the meantime I thought with just the CPU and two 360 rads I would have the headroom to run whatever I want and never even touch 60 degrees with my ambient of 22 degrees.
> 
> Here is what I'm seeing:
> 
> CPU: 1920X
> VCore: 1.34625
> OC: 4.1GHz
> 
> Idle: 28-30 degrees
> Prime95 Small FFT: ~73 degrees
> Prime95 Blend: ~63-65 degrees
> Aida64: ~65 degrees
> RealBench: ~60 degrees
> 
> I think my custom loop is operating correctly and that I have the EK block seated properly. I also should have great flow because only the EK block at the moment plus the two rads, so I'm wondering if the EK block is that big of a bottleneck here on heat or if I'm missing something.


ok
cpu : 1950x
VCore: 1.25 llc 3 (equals around 1.244 on ull load)
OC: 339 GHz

idle 25/28 (it is could up here though so 10 to 15 degrees ambient maybe 20 in the case)
prime small ffts: 79 degrees was the hottest i saw but only ran it for 10 minutes...that stress test is really stressfull..
prime blend : 58 - 68 degrees

aida don't own it
realbench: after 3 loops i think it was peaked at 71 but generally hung around the 65 mark.

now again this is with a h115i and 2 2k varder fans running at a max of 1500rpm

so in my honest opinion a 1920x with more vlts and 200 MHz more should be pushing more heat but with 4 less cores/8 less threads i don't know


----------



## cheddle

Ill get some samsung b-die next week. I hope to get that a little higher 

the volt wall is sooo steep on my chip - using a single cinebench pass as 'validation':

volts required for 3900 mhz: 1.231v
volts required for 3650 mhz: 1.3v
volts required for 4000 mhz: 1.375v
volts required for 4050 mhz: 1.44v


----------



## GuitarFreak

Got the EK block on, temps are pretty decent. Only managed to get 3.9GHz at 1.35v though, couldn't get 4GHz stable without hitting a thermal wall, needed ~1.39v. Topping out at 64c right now.


----------



## Bloodthirsty91

Yeah I go for dual loop because it's easier to manage temp and noise. Also, I want to keep my gpus at good temps and TR temp can get rlly hot so I wouldnt mix their cooling fluids. On the magnum sma8 it's rlly easy to isolate the two loops, you have one rad in the lower compartiment pulling and pushing air without mixing air with motherboard/ center area. And then you got a top rad pushing the cpu hot air up, who is fed with cold air by the front intake. I'll be adding some custom mods to improve the cooling potential further, more info on that soon!


----------



## Bloodthirsty91

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GuitarFreak*
> 
> 
> 
> Got the EK block on, temps are pretty decent. Only managed to get 3.9GHz at 1.35v though, couldn't get 4GHz stable without hitting a thermal wall, needed ~1.39v. Topping out at 64c right now.


Pretty decent temps and overclock man good job! May I ask what rad are you using ?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> Ill get some samsung b-die next week. I hope to get that a little higher
> 
> the volt wall is sooo steep on my chip - using a single cinebench pass as 'validation':
> 
> volts required for 3900 mhz: 1.231v
> volts required for 3650 mhz: 1.3v
> volts required for 4000 mhz: 1.375v
> volts required for 4050 mhz: 1.44v


i am assuming you mean 3950....







otherwise you have a big problem








now my chip did a few benches at 4g at 1.3 llc3 or 2 can't remember but 1.3v but hitched on corona 1.3 so pretty much the teetering edge









what LLC were you using for that?
in other news.
http://wccftech.com/amd-cpu-sales-overtake-intel-first-time-decade-germanys-largest-e-tailer/

i know it is more ryzen based news but look at the threadripper 1950x v 7900x sales... got to give amd a bit of a clap







bit weird not more 1920x's were sold though value wise i would put them over the 1950x in a purely dollar for performance war


----------



## GuitarFreak

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bloodthirsty91*
> 
> Pretty decent temps and overclock man good job! May I ask what rad are you using ?


Thanks! I have an EK-CoolStream XE 360.


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i am assuming you mean 3950....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> otherwise you have a big problem
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now my chip did a few benches at 4g at 1.3 llc3 or 2 can't remember but 1.3v but hitched on corona 1.3 so pretty much the teetering edge
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what LLC were you using for that?
> in other news.
> http://wccftech.com/amd-cpu-sales-overtake-intel-first-time-decade-germanys-largest-e-tailer/
> 
> i know it is more ryzen based news but look at the threadripper 1950x v 7900x sales... got to give amd a bit of a clap
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bit weird not more 1920x's were sold though value wise i would put them over the 1950x in a purely dollar for performance war


Yeah lol. 3950 haha.

I'm using LLC AUTO.

I have temps from my runs as well. I'm keeping below 69c Tdie


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bloodthirsty91*
> 
> Yeah I go for dual loop because it's easier to manage temp and noise.


Don't wanna shoot your build down but I don't think it is less noisy either I'm afraid. Running dual pumps in one loop is the most quiet option imho. More fans spread out in one loop would also be quieter. But like I said, it's way better to manage two instead of one when it comes to problems etc. Also I think it looks quite nice with two loops.

That being said, I wish I ran two loops in my build. Something is generating heat (have had the problem since before Threadripper) and I have not been able to localize the problem.


----------



## Paprika

Anyone having issues with cinebench locking up after a few tries, or do I just have to throw more voltage at the cpu?

Also, every crash that happens my q-fan profile goes to hell and won't respond anymore, so I have to reset CMOS and reload my profiles etc. Annoying as hell.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> that is a bit weird but if the ram is having issues past 2133 it may actually be erroring i would try doing a memtest at the higher speeds and see if it fails.
> 
> your 3.8 result looks about right my 3.9 results with 3200 ram is 3265 and 159 single thread.


I'll do memtests and see if something comes up. tnx!


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> Anyone having issues with cinebench locking up after a few tries, or do I just have to throw more voltage at the cpu?
> 
> Also, every crash that happens my q-fan profile goes to hell and won't respond anymore, so I have to reset CMOS and reload my profiles etc. Annoying as hell.


I've had Cinebench freeze the computer several times, mostly on the first try though.

Which MB are u on? MSI X399 seems to drop profiles sometimes. I can still load them, but it only fills in a very few of the settings that was in it and not everything. Extremely annoying.


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I've had Cinebench freeze the computer several times, mostly on the first try though.
> 
> Which MB are u on? MSI X399 seems to drop profiles sometimes. I can still load them, but it only fills in a very few of the settings that was in it and not everything. Extremely annoying.


Zenith.


----------



## springs113

Dual loops is the way to go if you have the space and money. I have the sma8 (dual loop). I ran my my tubing so that they never interfere with each other or block any component. I can service my cpu/gpu anytime individually without ever messing with the other loop. You can also identify issues easier in regards to heat.

Anyone here with the zenith, installed the ai suite and WiFi drivers having freezing/stuttering issues?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> Anyone having issues with cinebench locking up after a few tries, or do I just have to throw more voltage at the cpu?
> 
> Also, every crash that happens my q-fan profile goes to hell and won't respond anymore, so I have to reset CMOS and reload my profiles etc. Annoying as hell.


You can put to auto volts as long as your oc isnt crazy, then run cinebench see if it completes fine over and over. At that time take a volt meter and measure what voltage your cpu is pulling from the board. Then use that voltage.


----------



## happyluckbox

Ok, spent all night fixing/tuning my overclock.

Currently at 3.9ghz with a 1950x
and 3066mhz with 14-14-14-30 128gb gskill tridentz (not sure if b die, anyway to check? Originally came in 15-15-15-35 latency)

Hitting 3kmhz with all 8 dimms filled to the max was fairly difficult, and i havent tested cold booting yet. Unfortunatelty i wasnt able to find any settings for cold boot ddr voltage in the gigabyte bios... fingers crossed


----------



## Testier

Whats the rough average voltage for hitting 4ghz?

Can owners possibly input their data below? I wonder what is the standard deviation for these voltages.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Sorry for bumping this. Still trying to solve this but no cigar.
> 
> I'm only OC'ing by setting the multiplier and vcore. Nothing else.


When you OC the ram (presumably with 1.35v vdimm as well) yuo end up with less watts going to the cpu package, ending up with lower core boost. My testings showed 3700 all core boost with 1.2 vdimm and 3400 all core boost with 1.35 vdimm. You can observe the watts with something like hwinfo - 1.2 vdimm allowed 180 watts to the cpu package but 1.35 vdimm only allowed 150 watts.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> When you OC the ram (presumably with 1.35v vdimm as well) yuo end up with less watts going to the cpu package, ending up with lower core boost. My testings showed 3700 all core boost with 1.2 vdimm and 3400 all core boost with 1.35 vdimm. You can observe the watts with something like hwinfo - 1.2 vdimm allowed 180 watts to the cpu package but 1.35 vdimm only allowed 150 watts.


that's interesting by all core boost what are you using to test that.
in mine cb15 the all core boost is negligible it will sit around 3400 sometimes to 3.5.6 but generally 3.4
but running something that does not 100 per cent load the cores it will go straight to 3700 and boost to 4.1 at times never lower.

so what are you basing this on and what speed is the ram not overclocked in your testing


----------



## jarble

Newegg sale got me







1950x is on its way. I am still waiting on the new heatkiller block but I figured I can get everything else plumbed up while I await the block.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jarble*
> 
> Newegg sale got me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1950x is on its way. I am still waiting on the new heatkiller block but I figured I can get everything else plumbed up while I await the block.


what was the sale? mine was just 50$ off if purchased with the zenith.


----------



## jarble

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> what was the sale? mine was just 50$ off if purchased with the zenith.


Zenith still had the discount plus ram was marked down ($520 for 64GB) , not crazy low like the amazon sale but enough to push me to commitment. I am excited for the build I have been wanting to refresh my platform for a while


----------



## ajc9988

Who wants to hear a joke? Intel is using their new interface to make multi-die chips! LMAO! Especially after the way they said that design was inferior and the fanboys repeated it.

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/gpu_displays/intel_discusses_emib_technology_-_multi-die_cpus_incoming/1


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Whats the rough average voltage for hitting 4ghz?
> 
> Can owners possibly input their data below? I wonder what is the standard deviation for these voltages.


clock volts
3900 1.231
3950 1.3
4000 1.375
4050 1.44

Validation for this is a single pass of Cinebench R15.

My 'daily' setting is 4025mhz 1.406v with SMT off.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> When you OC the ram (presumably with 1.35v vdimm as well) yuo end up with less watts going to the cpu package, ending up with lower core boost. My testings showed 3700 all core boost with 1.2 vdimm and 3400 all core boost with 1.35 vdimm. You can observe the watts with something like hwinfo - 1.2 vdimm allowed 180 watts to the cpu package but 1.35 vdimm only allowed 150 watts.


This has not been my experience with the Gigabyte Gaming 7 mobo. I have 32GB of 2400Mhz ram that I OC'ed to 3066Mhz with a voltage of 1.36v. I ran prime 95 and grabbed some numbers for you off my favorite tool - HWInfo64







. I'm getting 179watts to the CPU still. The RAM has a separate dedicated VRM & phase on most motherboards. It's possible your manufacturer implemented a hard limit on both VRM banks which is odd... Generally wattage limits are motherboard specific. Possibly with upcoming BIOS updates this may be lifted.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Whats the rough average voltage for hitting 4ghz? Can owners possibly input their data below? I wonder what is the standard deviation for these voltages.


I am stable at 4GHz with my 1950X using *1.365v* with a *load line calibration of +25%* and a *CPU phase response time of +75%*. On the Gigabyte x399 Gaming 7 mobo which has a pretty buff VRM/Phase control. PPL keep saying its not a good OC'ing mobo but its only bested by the ASUS (with slightly better chokes & mosfet's). The true voltage the CPU is asking for is realistically 1.41v, but I like a tiny amount of vdroop rather than overshoot and let the LLC balance the little extra it needs. I am seeing a lot of people just plugging voltages/frequencies into their boards and hitting go - this can be dangerous. I have an intel OC'ing background and some thing's that were not a big deal on (for instance) my old x79 platform are much more important now (My i7 4930k @ 4.6GHz only had a TDP of 165 watts). Keep an eye on your CPU's VRM temps. x399 gets hot, at 4GHz I was seeing 289 watts TDP on my board. Have an extra fan? - might be a good idea to give it a little air. I've seen a guy trying to hit 4.1GHz all the while his CPU's VRM is bumping 100c! These chips are different motherboard-to-motherboard but the absolute operating maximum is generally between 85c-110c.

Now with my OC I have a 360mm radiator (fractal design Celsius s36) and was floating around ~78c (push only configuration) running cinebench over and over and over to the point of insanity. I noticed something interesting on this platform that when I attempt to OC in the UEFI, that the state of the CPU is completely changed when opening up AMD Ryzen Master (Ryzen Master was useless then). I could not get a good OC using the UEFI on this darn mobo bu the Ryzen Master handled the OC beautifully. Now Im speaking for the Gigabyte only - you CAN set the LLC (load line calibration), and VRM response time but if you start messing with multipliers and voltages the CPU reacts strange and I get really weird readouts (voltages and frequencies are all wrong). Just FYI


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> I am stable at 4GHz with my 1950X using *1.365v* with a *load line calibration of +25%* and a *CPU phase response time of +75%*. On the Gigabyte x399 Gaming 7 mobo which has a pretty buff VRM/Phase control. PPL keep saying its not a good OC'ing mobo but its only bested by the ASUS (with slightly better chokes & mosfet's). The true voltage the CPU is asking for is realistically 1.41v, but I like a tiny amount of vdroop rather than overshoot and let the LLC balance the little extra it needs. I am seeing a lot of people just plugging voltages/frequencies into their boards and hitting go - this can be dangerous. I have an intel OC'ing background and some thing's that were not a big deal on (for instance) my old x79 platform are much more important now (My i7 4930k @ 4.6GHz only had a TDP of 165 watts). Keep an eye on your CPU's VRM temps. x399 gets hot, at 4GHz I was seeing 289 watts TDP on my board. Have an extra fan? - might be a good idea to give it a little air. I've seen a guy trying to hit 4.1GHz all the while his CPU's VRM is bumping 100c! These chips are different motherboard-to-motherboard but the absolute operating maximum is generally between 85c-110c.
> 
> Now with my OC I have a 360mm radiator (fractal design Celsius s36) and was floating around ~78c (push only configuration) running cinebench over and over and over to the point of insanity. I noticed something interesting on this platform that when I attempt to OC in the UEFI, that the state of the CPU is completely changed when opening up AMD Ryzen Master (Ryzen Master was useless then). I could not get a good OC using the UEFI on this darn mobo bu the Ryzen Master handled the OC beautifully. Now Im speaking for the Gigabyte only - you CAN set the LLC (load line calibration), and VRM response time but if you start messing with multipliers and voltages the CPU reacts strange and I get really weird readouts (voltages and frequencies are all wrong). Just FYI


Gigabyte uses the IR 3556 and everyone else uses IR 3555. It differs by 10A. Voltage controller wise, I think everyone uses a IR32501. ASUS uses their own but I think its a rebranded IR 32501. Realistically, VRM isnt going to matter as much. I cant find any information on the peak efficiency of IR VRMs so I assume 80ish%. It really isnt that bad I dont think unless you above 350w. A 8 phase setup is very good and a 10 phase setup like MSI is going overboard but thats we like around here right?

Temperature wise, IR dont get you temp vs efficiency or temp vs max amp curve so... I think not going past 85c is a good idea. Passive heatsink wise, fins are good if spacing are well optimized so I dont think active cooling really is needed imo.
Thank you for the voltage data and also thanks to the user above. It seems 1.4v is reasonable for 4ghz.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

You know, as far as cooling goes - if you don't OC the 1950X stays pretty darn cool. I bought a 360mm radiator and I don't plan on leaving the OC on, but at stock clocks/voltages 360mm radiator was way overkill honestly. I was _scared_ initially that this chip was going to have horrible temps but realistically it internally manages the clocks/voltages so efficiently it has temps slightly lower than my i7 4930k did. Im idling now (OC still enabled) at 30c! My i7 idled around 33 with a similar radiator. Either way I agree 85 is for me is a little too high. My personal preference is to stay under 75c for 24/7.

You are exactly right about the 1.4v. Just be careful that the load line is not set to something like extreme or whatever your mobo has. Setting the voltage to 1.4 (I cant stress this enough)... and having LLC up high as well will put you past 1.5v or more if your not paying attention.


----------



## Kpjoslee

I am using gigabyte x399. However, temp reading is total wreck on bios. I am getting correct temp on hwmonitor and coretemp... anyone know why?


----------



## tarot

i have dropped mine back to stock fr now.
got to 28 degrees in the room around 30 degrees in the case and the poor little corsair struggled a little on full loads.
as for stock handbrake h265 720 fast encodes of my disks is still very fast around average of 150fps and about 7 minutes per 40 minute episode while topping out at 60 degrees.

So until i figure out how to actually water-cool something properly and come up with the extra funds i,ll stick to this in this heat.









i still do not get the radiator has this connection some stupid imperial number and the hose is this and the barbs are that....makes my head hurt









as for heat....try very very hard to not go over 75 for any length of time, the chips seem to not give a rats ass as i saw doing prime small ffts and it sitting on 78 just tra la laing along without throttling but it makes me nervous









i think 60 to 65 is really where it should be aimed for and that's what i will be doing.

now my next question on another forum someone has setup 8x corsair 3200 ram 4 does 3200 8 stuck at 2800 which it think feels about right does anyone else have 8 sticks at 3200 or am i correct in thinking the load is too much and 2666 is the norm anything over would be gravy?


----------



## dburd48778

Quote:


> I am using gigabyte x399. However, temp reading is total wreck on bios. I am getting correct temp on hwmonitor and coretemp... anyone know why?


My temps in bios were jumping around from 26c-54c before updating to newest bios. I'm on zenith extreme though, maybe check for gigabyte bios updates?


----------



## ssateneth

Can we look forward to changing RAM refresh interval at all (tREFI)? Should be able to shave off another 4ns latency from RAM and get a little throughput bump too.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dburd48778*
> 
> My temps in bios were jumping around from 26c-54c before updating to newest bios. I'm on zenith extreme though, maybe check for gigabyte bios updates?


Well, I am on latest bios. I doubt it is a problem with sensors since I am getting correct temps on coretemp and HWmonitor. I went through 3 bios so far still has the problem and i had that problem since day 1.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

Yeah the *F1* (version) BIOS that came on the mobo was absolute garbage. So just to _double check_ you have the *F2k* BIOS for the Gigabyte x399 Aorus Gaming 7 - right? The auto update tool for the Gigabyte mobo wont see the new BIOS on the website automatically (glitch), your going to need to manually check for updates on the motherboards support page until its fixed.

I own the Gigabyte x399 too and haven't seen temps like yours. My first instinct is to do a BIOS reset, then load the fail safe defaults. This is just to clear any problems with the BIOS getting the IRQ assignments for the sensors (I doubt though this is a problem). When concerns me is if the fan controller software for Gigabyte (SIV) will throttle down all your fans when your under a workload. Speaking of which - how do the sensors look in the Gigabyte SIV?
Edit: added 2 pictures of UEFI



I just took a couple screen shots of mine with the *F2k* bios.


----------



## VoytekBE

I'm really curious what temps I'm gonna be running with the EK block.
I'm still in the process of finishing my build but I'm going to be running a 1950X on a Zenith Extreme with dual DDC Elite pumps, XE360 push, XE240 push/pull and SE360 push.
The loop is also cooling dual 1080ti's.

First AMD build since my thunderbird 1,4ghz









I'm in dubio about my memory choice though. I would really like dual quad chan with 8x8Gb but the Trident Z's are actually optimised for intel.
I've sent an email to Gskill and they told me they would be releasing TR optimized mem sets for the TR4 platform within 2 weeks so I'm probably gonna sit this one out till then as they advised me to 'downclock' their 3200mhz kits to around 29xx.

What memory configs is everyone here running? New contributor to the forum but been reading for a while now


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> When you OC the ram (presumably with 1.35v vdimm as well) yuo end up with less watts going to the cpu package, ending up with lower core boost. My testings showed 3700 all core boost with 1.2 vdimm and 3400 all core boost with 1.35 vdimm. You can observe the watts with something like hwinfo - 1.2 vdimm allowed 180 watts to the cpu package but 1.35 vdimm only allowed 150 watts.


So last time I was dumb enough not to check in on my OC in Windows, just BIOS (first set the OC, then reboot and go in to BIOS to see if it is still there).

I noticed a few days ago that even though BIOS will tell me I'm at 3.8Ghz and ram at 3000Mhz, once I go in to Windows my CPU is actually back at stock. I've tried multiple speeds and XMP's but nothing seems to work. Only 2133Mhz.

It might have something to do with what you are telling me, I'll have to check this tonight.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> Yeah the *F1* (version) BIOS that came on the mobo was absolute garbage. So just to _double check_ you have the *F2k* BIOS for the Gigabyte x399 Aorus Gaming 7 - right? The auto update tool for the Gigabyte mobo wont see the new BIOS on the website automatically (glitch), your going to need to manually check for updates on the motherboards support page until its fixed.
> 
> I own the Gigabyte x399 too and haven't seen temps like yours. My first instinct is to do a BIOS reset, then load the fail safe defaults. This is just to clear any problems with the BIOS getting the IRQ assignments for the sensors (I doubt though this is a problem). When concerns me is if the fan controller software for Gigabyte (SIV) will throttle down all your fans when your under a workload. Speaking of which - how do the sensors look in the Gigabyte SIV?
> Edit: added 2 pictures of UEFI
> 
> 
> 
> I just took a couple screen shots of mine with the *F2k* bios.


Well, i can't access any of the features on SIV. They are all grayed out.



I am on official F2 bios btw.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Well, i can't access any of the features on SIV. They are all grayed out.
> 
> 
> 
> I am on official F2 bios btw.


OK that tells me you don't have the AMD chipset drivers installed and they released updates since our mobo came out. If you _already have_ installed the AMD chipset drivers then that's a whole different issue. Without the drivers windows is in a _somewhat_ compatibility mode talking to your hardware.

Go here: http://support.amd.com/en-us/download fill in the values (Chipset > AMD Socket TR4 > Windows 10 64bit... I assume) you want the chipset drivers - it'll show the RAIDXpert utility as well, just skip that... The current AMD TR4 chipset driver is 17.30 and it works a lot better than the previous one.

The driver will show you the current version you have installed (if any) - if it shows 'Current Version 17.30' then Im at a loss LOL short of re-installing the software suite (that came on the CD).

*On a side note*: I had some really weird issues when I first got windows up and running and I couldn't tell if it was RAM,CPU or mobo - even after all the appropriate drivers were installed. I downloaded the _AMD RYZEN MASTER_ program and did a reset on the CPU (its an option at the top of the program that says reset). It flips the CPU back to normal and removes all the over clocks and custom modes. Apparently my CPU was in a custom profile creator mode and it was causing things to not work well. After I did the reset everything ran smoother. I guess it was a technical hiccup or something. Just a thought. If you google *AMD RYZEN MASTER* its on AMD's site and just get the one for threadripper.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> OK that tells me you don't have the AMD chipset drivers installed and they released updates since our mobo came out. If you _already have_ installed the AMD chipset drivers then that's a whole different issue. Without the drivers windows is in a _somewhat_ compatibility mode talking to your hardware.
> 
> Go here: http://support.amd.com/en-us/download fill in the values (Chipset > AMD Socket TR4 > Windows 10 64bit... I assume) you want the chipset drivers - it'll show the RAIDXpert utility as well, just skip that... The current AMD TR4 chipset driver is 17.30 and it works a lot better than the previous one.
> 
> The driver will show you the current version you have installed (if any) - if it shows 'Current Version 17.30' then Im at a loss LOL short of re-installing the software suite (that came on the CD).
> 
> *On a side note*: I had some really weird issues when I first got windows up and running and I couldn't tell if it was RAM,CPU or mobo - even after all the appropriate drivers were installed. I downloaded the _AMD RYZEN MASTER_ program and did a reset on the CPU (its an option at the top of the program that says reset). It flips the CPU back to normal and removes all the over clocks and custom modes. Apparently my CPU was in a custom profile creator mode and it was causing things to not work well. After I did the reset everything ran smoother. I guess it was a technical hiccup or something. Just a thought. If you google *AMD RYZEN MASTER* its on AMD's site and just get the one for threadripper.


Well, I already have 17.3 installed, and been using Ryzen Master. It is kind of a odd issue. Smart fan control doesn't seem to work either. I have 2 noctua cpu fans connected on cpu_fan but PWM is not enabled. I have nothing connected on sys_fan 4, but pwm is enabled there instead. Along with temp reading problem, smart fan is totally messed up atm.


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jarble*
> 
> Zenith still had the discount plus ram was marked down ($520 for 64GB) , not crazy low like the amazon sale but enough to push me to commitment. I am excited for the build I have been wanting to refresh my platform for a while


which Ram kit? I got my 64gb for 780$ if its close to the same I might see if they'll just undo the diff vs shipping back cuz thats a lot of savings lol.


----------



## jarble

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LunaP*
> 
> which Ram kit? I got my 64gb for 780$ if its close to the same I might see if they'll just undo the diff vs shipping back cuz thats a lot of savings lol.


Sent you a pm


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Well, i can't access any of the features on SIV. They are all grayed out.
> 
> 
> 
> I am on official F2 bios btw.


Download SIV from Gigabytes website, not though the app centre.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Gigabyte uses the IR 3556 and everyone else uses IR 3555. It differs by 10A. Voltage controller wise, I think everyone uses a IR32501. ASUS uses their own but I think its a rebranded IR 32501. Realistically, VRM isnt going to matter as much. I cant find any information on the peak efficiency of IR VRMs so I assume 80ish%. It really isnt that bad I dont think unless you above 350w. A 8 phase setup is very good and a 10 phase setup like MSI is going overboard but thats we like around here right?
> 
> Temperature wise, IR dont get you temp vs efficiency or temp vs max amp curve so... I think not going past 85c is a good idea. Passive heatsink wise, fins are good if spacing are well optimized so I dont think active cooling really is needed imo.
> Thank you for the voltage data and also thanks to the user above. It seems 1.4v is reasonable for 4ghz.


Modern voltage regulator designs are in excess of 90% efficient. Somewhere around 94-95% iirc.


----------



## Fantasy

Ok, I have a problem. My TR4 socket screw number one will not go in. I turn it and I turn it and it doesn't well.... screw in. It does screw in without the cpu inside the socket but it does not screw when I install the CPU.

Also, screw number 2 and 3 were fully unscrewed when I got my motherboard. Only screw number one was screwed in.

I don't know if these pictures are helpful in any way.


----------



## Fantasy

I cannot believe how much pressure I had to put on the socket to make the screw go in. That was so stressful. But, its finally in.

I love the Ryzen screwdriver, it won't allow idiots like me to over tension the screws and strip the threads or worse pop it off altogether.










Well, here she is. Mounted and ready, only thing left is to get the cooler. I have to wait until 15th September to get my Noctua.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Ok, I have a problem. My TR4 socket screw number one will not go in. I turn it and I turn it and it doesn't well.... screw in. It does screw in without the cpu inside the socket but it does not screw when I install the CPU.
> 
> Also, screw number 2 and 3 were fully unscrewed when I got my motherboard. Only screw number one was screwed in.
> 
> I don't know if these pictures are helpful in any way.


Yeah, this is a common problem. Most people (including me) solve it by attaching screw 2 & 3 first. But not too much, just so it catches on. And then do 1, 2 and 3.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> Seem like he doesnt know what he is doing so he doesnt reply.


OR he feels that he doesn't owe you an explanation and went about his day.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Yeah, this is a common problem. Most people (including me) solve it by attaching screw 2 & 3 first. But not too much, just so it catches on. And then do 1, 2 and 3.


ooh, good to know. I guess there are bound to be some problems with a new platform. Cheers


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I love the Ryzen screwdriver, it won't allow idiots like me to over tension the screws and strip the threads or worse pop it off altogether.


I didn't even know it was a torquing screwdriver until I read about it later. I went back and tightened some more, but not knowing how it was supposed to work continued adding force expecting it to ratchet-slip. The irony is that I went from definitely not over-torquing the screws to definitely yes over-torquing the screws entirely because I found out the driver was set to slip at a certain "perfect" point.


----------



## cheddle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I cannot believe how much pressure I had to put on the socket to make the screw go in. That was so stressful. But, its finally in.
> 
> I love the Ryzen screwdriver, it won't allow idiots like me to over tension the screws and strip the threads or worse pop it off altogether.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, here she is. Mounted and ready, only thing left is to get the cooler. I have to wait until 15th September to get my Noctua.


I had a similar experience on my ZE! I have installed TR on three boards. two ZE and one aurous. only my ZE was scarey bad to get the thread to bite on.


----------



## 3DIF

What would be a good choice for 64GB memory? Looking only at performance and not at the price.


----------



## BulletBait

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cheddle*
> 
> I had a similar experience on my ZE! I have installed TR on three boards. two ZE and one aurous. only my ZE was scarey bad to get the thread to bite on.


Me too. I posted about it on the 10th in that TR sights thread and in my build log. I pulled it out of the socket like 5 times I was so skurred. Of course I've never dealt with an LGA platform so I didn't know what to expect either.

Side note: I'm so jelly of everyone who's running theirs. I'm still waiting on a real block to be released and not a half arsed version. Hopefully Watercool follows through with their design and it releases Wednesday.


----------



## BulletBait

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> Do you just buy this because it is top edge tech but you dont need that many cores and threads at all?


I have the potential to use this many in my analysis software. I just didn't want to buy Intel and I didn't want to pay the server premium or have a locked chip (throws out opteron). So... Was stuck on an 8350 for 5 years.

Edit: Others have many use cases for it whether that be the thread count of TR specifically or the PCIe count of X399 in general.


----------



## LunaP

As long as this gives me better performance than my 4960X I couldn't ask for anything else.


----------



## BulletBait

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> What analysis do u do?


Astrophysics and Astronomy image and radio reduction and analysis. Mostly IRAF, IRIS, AIPS, SAOImage, FV, SEXtractor, STSDAS, XIMAGE, but other programs pulled from HEASARC and ATNF depending on what I'm doing.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I didn't even know it was a torquing screwdriver until I read about it later. I went back and tightened some more, but not knowing how it was supposed to work continued adding force expecting it to ratchet-slip. The irony is that I went from definitely not over-torquing the screws to definitely yes over-torquing the screws entirely because I found out the driver was set to slip at a certain "perfect" point.


haha















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> Do you just buy this because it is top edge tech but you dont need that many cores and threads at all?


I got the 1950X because it is top of the line but also because I am a graphics/engine programmer and I run a Linux virtual machine and an android emulator and an OSX VM to test my game engine in and I need every bit of horse power I can get my hands on. Also, I'm insane, so there is that.


----------



## BulletBait

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iphone8*
> 
> Work or habbit?


Professional hobby?









It's going to be used in my doctorate thesis eventually when I get over myself and go back to school... again. What I mean by 'get over myself' is the urge to punch everyone under the age of 25 in the face. Of course, that's what happens when you actually go and live a life outside of the babysitters for 6 years and try to go back with a bunch of idiots who've had nothing but babysitters their whole lives.

It's honestly too bad NASA, UKSA, or ESA don't take data submissions. Plus, I personally think their citizen science programs suck. Just have people look at pictures, but again, don't take raw data or follow up analysis submissions.


----------



## VoytekBE

Anyone considering cooling the 1950X with a waterchiller?

I really wonder if you can get much higher OC's without having to insulate your whole case up somewhere in the regions of 4,3 - 4,4 ghz.
If you can get the water at around 15°Celcius it should be interesting or am I expecting too much?

Still in doubt what I'm going to do as I have 3 rads atm in my new case ready for my TR build. EK360, EK240 and SE360.
I'll be able to run 4,0-4,1ish without too much noise but the idea of hitting 4,4, perhaps 4,5 if I'm really lucky is really tempting.


----------



## bummerboy

finally got my hands on a build
asus zenith extreme
tr1950x
gskill 3200c16 4x8GB
cm masterliquid 240

not the best parts for ram/cooler but this will do for now

any bios settings to share for zenith? and going through prime95 stress on default settings for now, managed about 8hours and then windows freeze


----------



## BulletBait

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VoytekBE*
> 
> Anyone considering cooling the 1950X with a waterchiller?
> 
> I really wonder if you can get much higher OC's without having to insulate your whole case up somewhere in the regions of 4,3 - 4,4 ghz.
> If you can get the water at around 15°Celcius it should be interesting or am I expecting too much?
> 
> Still in doubt what I'm going to do as I have 3 rads atm in my new case ready for my TR build. EK360, EK240 and SE360.
> I'll be able to run 4,0-4,1ish without too much noise but the idea of hitting 4,4, perhaps 4,5 if I'm really lucky is really tempting.


I thought about it. Two things stopped me though, didn't want to drop another $500 (Hailea) - $1500 (Koolance) into something that's already near breaking my wallet at $6K. Second is I live in an apartment and those things are loud and I can't just drill holes through walls or put it in an attic.

I think you have to go lower, like extreme sub-ambient to break whatever Zen's inherent barriers are though. I don't think an extra couple °c will help too much. Personal thoughts though. Anyone in the Ryzen owners thread do it?


----------



## Erland82

I dont need a heater in my room anymore with this thing running at 4ghz


----------



## Fantasy

I have a question. I'm running 4 x 3TB drives in raid 5 on my Intel x79 chipset using my old Rampage IV Extreme. If I move that raid to my new Zenith board, will it work? I don't think it will. Also, does the Zenith not support raid 5 ??!!!!

Also, let's say I do move it and it does not work, will it destroy my raid? or can I just put it back into my old PC and it will run fine again?


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I have a question. I'm running 4 x 3TB drives in raid 5 on my Intel x79 chipset using my old Rampage IV Extreme. If I move that raid to my new Zenith board, will it work? I don't think it will. Also, does the Zenith not support raid 5 ??!!!!
> 
> Also, let's say I do move it and it does not work, will it destroy my raid? or can I just put it back into my old PC and it will run fine again?


If you're using Intel Matrix RAID, no, it's not going to work. No, it won't destroy your data unless you do something to it that overwrites data on the disks.

The proper thing to do in a case like yours is to export your data to something like external drives temporarily. Borrow them if you have to. Reform the array on your new controller and then copy it back. If you care about your data, you should purchase a real RAID controller anyway. It keeps your array portable, faster, and more reliable than any software-based, baked-in solution will.

Poor man's entry-level high performance RAID card and BBU: https://www.ebay.com/itm/372052319247

Add a bracket and fanout cables.


----------



## DVLux

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> If you're using Intel Matrix RAID, no, it's not going to work. No, it won't destroy your data unless you do something to it that overwrites data on the disks.
> 
> The proper thing to do in a case like yours is to export your data to something like external drives temporarily. Borrow them if you have to. Reform the array on your new controller and then copy it back. If you care about your data, you should purchase a real RAID controller anyway. It keeps your array portable, faster, and more reliable than any software-based, baked-in solution will.
> 
> Poor man's entry-level high performance RAID card and BBU: https://www.ebay.com/itm/372052319247
> 
> Add a bracket and fanout cables.


A RAID card ties your RAID array to the same chip on the card. Hardly more "portable".

Intel RAID can, usually, be transferred to a new Intel motherboard without problem. I'm assuming you could do the same if it was a native AMD RAID implementation, as well.

Pretty sure AMD doesn't support RAID 5, though, on the native SATA ports. So he'll need a RAID card anyhow. :V


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> A RAID card ties your RAID array to the same chip on the card. Hardly more "portable".
> 
> Intel RAID can, usually, be transferred to a new Intel motherboard without problem. I'm assuming you could do the same if it was a native AMD RAID implementation, as well.
> 
> Pretty sure AMD doesn't support RAID 5, though, on the native SATA ports. So he'll need a RAID card anyhow. :V


And I'm pretty sure you have to pay $300-400 extra for raid 5 on Intel, and $100 for raid 10, which comes with AMD (regarding the latter). This combined with the reduction on some platforms (asus) to only two sata ports. So...


----------



## DVLux

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> And I'm pretty sure you have to pay $300-400 extra for raid 5 on Intel, and $100 for raid 10, which comes with AMD (regarding the latter). This combined with the reduction on some platforms (asus) to only two sata ports. So...


What are you smoking...?







Intel RAID has always been "free" with a proper motherboard/CPU.

Intel RAID is _not_ the same thing as vROC.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> What are you smoking...?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Intel RAID has always been "free" with a proper motherboard/CPU.
> 
> Intel RAID is _not_ the same thing as vROC.


"But if you want to enable RAID 1, RAID 5, or other RAID schemes with redundancy to protect your data, you have to buy this Intel key to enable it." http://www.pcworld.com/article/3199104/storage/intels-core-i9-and-x299-enable-crazy-raid-configurations-for-a-price.html

" For RAID 5, there's a more expensive key (we heard both $199 and $299 are possible)." http://techreport.com/news/32020/computex-2017-intel-unleashes-nvme-raid-for-x299

So do some research before you speak!


----------



## DVLux

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> "But if you want to enable RAID 1, RAID 5, or other RAID schemes with redundancy to protect your data, you have to buy this Intel key to enable it." http://www.pcworld.com/article/3199104/storage/intels-core-i9-and-x299-enable-crazy-raid-configurations-for-a-price.html
> 
> " For RAID 5, there's a more expensive key (we heard both $199 and $299 are possible)." http://techreport.com/news/32020/computex-2017-intel-unleashes-nvme-raid-for-x299
> 
> So do some research before you speak!


How about you do your own research, and stop jumping on every train you see?

http://www.pcworld.com/article/3201187/computers/intel-core-i9-review.html

"Even more controversial than PCIe rationing is Intel's VROC, or Virtual RAID on CPU. It's a nifty feature on Skylake-X that allows a user to configure up to 20 NVMe PCIe drives in RAID into a single bootable partition.

The problem? Intel apparently intends to charge more money for the feature. Details haven't been released, but vendors at Computex told us they believed RAID 0 would be free, RAID 1 would cost $99, and RAID 5 and RAID 10 could cost $299. Once you've ponied up the cash, you get a hardware dongle that unlocks the feature."

They are *clearly* talking about vROC in both your links

Intel RAID is *not* vROC.


----------



## Dotachin

Do you guys have databases on your home rigs or something? Why do you need real time raid? Not redundancy I hope. Why not just snapshot raid?


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> How about you do your own research, and stop jumping on every train you see?
> 
> http://www.pcworld.com/article/3201187/computers/intel-core-i9-review.html
> 
> "Even more controversial than PCIe rationing is Intel's VROC, or Virtual RAID on CPU. It's a nifty feature on Skylake-X that allows a user to configure up to 20 NVMe PCIe drives in RAID into a single bootable partition.
> 
> The problem? Intel apparently intends to charge more money for the feature. Details haven't been released, but vendors at Computex told us they believed RAID 0 would be free, RAID 1 would cost $99, and RAID 5 and RAID 10 could cost $299. Once you've ponied up the cash, you get a hardware dongle that unlocks the feature."
> 
> They are *clearly* talking about vROC in your first link.
> 
> Intel RAID is *not* vROC.


LMAO! You still must PAY to use features of your hardware. It is market stratification in order to milk consumers. Here's this new feature. You want it? Pay $100-300 more for it. Doesn't matter your hardware is capable of it, pay us. Otherwise, buy a Xeon at a drastically INFLATED cost.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Do you guys have databases on your home rigs or something? Why do you need real time raid? Not redundancy I hope. Why not just snapshot raid?


So, raid 5, 6, and 7 have good redundancy while adding on time for it. It is much more robust and resilient, though. Raid 10 gives you the speed of 0, but the redundancy of 1. This can be helpful when doing all sorts of media editing. You do not want to lose your work for clients. The X299 and X399 platforms are being used as workstations, and yes, some people work from home offices to do this work. Because of this, which raid can effect the amount of time on the project and moving data around. So this is why it is important to some people.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So, raid 5, 6, and 7 have good redundancy while adding on time for it. It is much more robust and resilient, though. Raid 10 gives you the speed of 0, but the redundancy of 1. This can be helpful when doing all sorts of media editing. You do not want to lose your work for clients. The X299 and X399 platforms are being used as workstations, and yes, some people work from home offices to do this work. Because of this, which raid can effect the amount of time on the project and moving data around. So this is why it is important to some people.


Moving data around is fine but why in real time though? raid card broken? need that same chip hope it's still in the market at decent price? HDD broken? again same size/model or dust.

Why not flexraid? you can set redundancy as high as you want.
http://www.flexraid.com/faq-items/what-is-raid-over-file-system/


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> A RAID card ties your RAID array to the same chip on the card. Hardly more "portable".
> 
> Intel RAID can, usually, be transferred to a new Intel motherboard without problem. I'm assuming you could do the same if it was a native AMD RAID implementation, as well.
> 
> Pretty sure AMD doesn't support RAID 5, though, on the native SATA ports. So he'll need a RAID card anyhow. :V


lolwut? You'd be able to move that card from any system to any other system. That is the very definition of more portable. You could also change to just about any other LSI-based RAID controller (read: virtually everything) and your array would still work.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> If you're using Intel Matrix RAID, no, it's not going to work. No, it won't destroy your data unless you do something to it that overwrites data on the disks.
> 
> The proper thing to do in a case like yours is to export your data to something like external drives temporarily. Borrow them if you have to. Reform the array on your new controller and then copy it back. If you care about your data, you should purchase a real RAID controller anyway. It keeps your array portable, faster, and more reliable than any software-based, baked-in solution will.
> 
> Poor man's entry-level high performance RAID card and BBU: https://www.ebay.com/itm/372052319247
> 
> Add a bracket and fanout cables.


I see. uuhhh, I have to buy an 8TB+ drive to move my data. That sucks. oh well. alright thanks.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> A RAID card ties your RAID array to the same chip on the card. Hardly more "portable".
> 
> Intel RAID can, usually, be transferred to a new Intel motherboard without problem. I'm assuming you could do the same if it was a native AMD RAID implementation, as well.
> 
> Pretty sure AMD doesn't support RAID 5, though, on the native SATA ports. So he'll need a RAID card anyhow. :V


That depends on the RAID card. The LSI cards I used a few years back before going to all SSDs alowed for drives to be interchangeable between cards, even between different card models.


----------



## bummerboy

get another 3x6TB to put in your new build
use windows storage space and create a pool and then create a parity volume
3 is all you need for raid5 AKA parity. windows storage space can be easily migrated, and with ryzen, the cpu overhead is insignificant

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I have a question. I'm running 4 x 3TB drives in raid 5 on my Intel x79 chipset using my old Rampage IV Extreme. If I move that raid to my new Zenith board, will it work? I don't think it will. Also, does the Zenith not support raid 5 ??!!!!
> 
> Also, let's say I do move it and it does not work, will it destroy my raid? or can I just put it back into my old PC and it will run fine again?


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Do you guys have databases on your home rigs or something? Why do you need real time raid? Not redundancy I hope. Why not just snapshot raid?


I edit 8k video, NVMe Raid will help improve my productivity in that respect.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> I edit 8k video, NVMe Raid will help improve my productivity in that respect.


NVMe Raid 0 for video production makes total sense








The other guys were talking about redundancy though; which is why I assumed storage.


----------



## SavantStrike

It spears swiftech has just charged my credit card for the apogee adapter bracket I ordered. Bykski just sent me an email that a shipping label has been created for my tr4 water block as eel.

I should be able to get into a custom loop the weekend after next as planned. I would say this weekend but I'm best man at a wedding.

Now I just have to decide if I should try for an heirloom from swiftech or see what heatkiller has to offer on Wednesday. And XSPC has the raystorm neo dropping any day soon as well. No reviews on any of this gear yet at all.


----------



## mumford

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> NVMe Raid 0 for video production makes total sense
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The other guys were talking about redundancy though; which is why I assumed storage.


actually I think Raid 1 (for saving files) makes sense for pretty much any work related stuffs, even just word processing. Also, I think Sata SSD Raid 1 is fast enough for this situation. NVMe Raid 1 is probably not needed.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> I edit 8k video, NVMe Raid will help improve my productivity in that respect.


Then look into raid 10. All the benefits of raid 0 (sometimes slightly faster), but with raid 1 backup of the raid 0, which allows for recovery in the event of corruption or failure. Makes way more sense!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> It spears swiftech has just charged my credit card for the apogee adapter bracket I ordered. Bykski just sent me an email that a shipping label has been created for my tr4 water block as eel.
> 
> I should be able to get into a custom loop the weekend after next as planned. I would say this weekend but I'm best man at a wedding.
> 
> Now I just have to decide if I should try for an heirloom from swiftech or see what heatkiller has to offer on Wednesday. And XSPC has the raystorm neo dropping any day soon as well. No reviews on any of this gear yet at all.


Neo pre-orders went live today.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Then look into raid 10. All the benefits of raid 0 (sometimes slightly faster), but with raid 1 backup of the raid 0, which allows for recovery in the event of corruption or failure. Makes way more sense!


I only have three M.2 slots on the mobo and one is already taken up for a boot drive.

The NVMe raid 0 set up will just be a working drive, all the files will be transferred to onsite and offsite backups at the end of the day anyway.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> I only have three M.2 slots on the mobo and one is already taken up for a boot drive.
> 
> The NVMe raid 0 set up will just be a working drive, all the files will be transferred to onsite and offsite backups at the end of the day anyway.


Fair enough. Just wanted to give options. They also now have 16 lane PCIe NVMe raid cards utilizing 4 NVMe drives, if that tickles your fancy.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> I only have three M.2 slots on the mobo and one is already taken up for a boot drive.
> 
> The NVMe raid 0 set up will just be a working drive, all the files will be transferred to onsite and offsite backups at the end of the day anyway.


This is the best solution imo. Just copy the files when they're "cold". No need for real time raid if what you look for is redundancy of files that are not edited all the time. If the copied files don't fit in a single drive, copy some in one drive and the rest in another one (I think this is what snpashot raids are about).


----------



## mumford

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> This is the best solution imo. Just copy the files when they're "cold". No need for real time raid if what you look for is redundancy of files that are not edited all the time. If the copied files don't fit in a single drive, copy some in one drive and the rest in another one (I think this is what snpashot raids are about).


There are a few similar but yet slightly different programs

[1]
http://www.snapraid.it, with MergeFS

https://zackreed.me/mergerfs-another-good-option-to-pool-your-snapraid-disks/

[2]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rsync,

and of course there is always

[3]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZFS (I do find it to be overkilled in home usage)

Which one to use really depends on what one's workflow is like.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Then look into raid 10. All the benefits of raid 0 (sometimes slightly faster), but with raid 1 backup of the raid 0, which allows for recovery in the event of corruption or failure. Makes way more sense!
> Neo pre-orders went live today.


From which distributor?

It could just be my crappy connection at work but I can't find it.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mumford*
> 
> There are a few similar but yet slightly different programs
> 
> [1]
> http://www.snapraid.it, with MergeFS
> 
> https://zackreed.me/mergerfs-another-good-option-to-pool-your-snapraid-disks/
> 
> [2]
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rsync,
> 
> and of course there is always
> 
> [3]
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZFS (I do find it to be overkilled in home usage)
> 
> Which one to use really depends on what one's workflow is like.


I'm eyeing this one RAID-F
http://www.flexraid.com/faq-items/what-is-raid-over-file-system/
just $40 lifetime license

edit: $60 with storage pooling

edit 2: back on topic I would like to point out there still isn't any review of the 1900x


----------



## amigafan2003

I just use https://www.freefilesync.org/ for my backups.


----------



## mumford

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> I'm eyeing this one RAID-F
> http://www.flexraid.com/faq-items/what-is-raid-over-file-system/
> just $40 lifetime license
> 
> edit: $60 with storage pooling


sounds very similar to MergeFS and SnapRaid. I like it for media storage as I really don't care if my Game of Thrones S07E06 is lost, as I don't rewatch TV shows and I can always re-download media.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> ThreadRipper 1950X _initially_ was a nightmare for me... This is somewhat long - but if you like reading a good real life computer story - read it. If you guy's want the pictures... I'll dig up the pictures.. But to me it's like seeing a murder scene. I want to look away, I have no interest in seeing it...
> 
> I got my 1950X a few days ago and have it in a temporary case for 'proving' (making sure theres no defective parts). The CPU installation was a nightmare, bloody nightmare and I almost began to cry - i did the unthinkable, the unimaginable. I patiently got things ready on the motherboard and CPU (I wore medical grade gloves so I didn't even get fingerprints on anything, I was paranoid)... I have high intensity LED light mast overhead blaring at full power and taking photos of every step. As I slid the CPU into the bracket very slowly - one of the sides of the orange cartridge thing was not fully in place inside the metal lip of the bracket. Gently, slowly slid it in further... Then the CPU fell through... and smashed a patch of the pins on the LGA socket and bent them...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... I jumped up and started telling myself 'no no no no no no'.... when I saw the smashed patch of pins... I turned away and almost started balling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not looking at the motherboard on my desk I took so much patient time to prepare... I watched all the YouTube videos, and read all the websites explaining how to do this properly. I didn't rush anything. This was a $500 motherboard I just destroyed. Never saw 1 day of use. My bloodpressure started to rise fast, and I was flushed with anxiety. I was so ashamed of myself.
> 
> I build small circuit boards (mainly FM radio's) as a hobby and working with ultra fine connections has crossed me a few times so I own a 2000x microscope for this with a live HD camera hooked into my monitor... I knew what I had to do... The unsullied motherboard, will be sullied - I was going to bend all the pins back and attempt the unthinkable. When the CPU fell, upon impact the inertia drug the CPU into a patch of pins and inverted several.My initial fear was bending them back would break them off. The pins are too small to see with the naked eye normally because of the rows and rows causes optical illusions with your eyes eveuntally. Under the scope the pins individually look like your arm from the elbow to your hand. Imagine holding an apple out in front of you with your hand out flat. From your elbow to the hand is each pin and at the top (the palm) of each one is a rounded dollop to make contact with the CPU. Take that same hand now, and put it to your face with your had over your mouth. That's how bent many pins were.
> 
> Over the period of a couple hours and PAINSTAKINGLY bent each pin SLOWLY under the scope, each bend I expected the contact point to snap off. There so fragile. A few were bent SIDEWAYS. I found the best tool ultimately was a toothpick. Somewhat too big at time's, it was soft enough to absorb any hard edges but not leave any residue, and also did not scratch the contacts. The sideways bends I did a gentle tug-tug-tug against the pin as to not bend it too much. Nothing broke! I was down to the last, and worst bent pin - all was looking good so far and the pin's metal did not fatigue as I thought it would - they were a lot more resilient than I expected! Feeling the tautness and flexibility of the metal I believe it to be gold plated nickel. I was still wearing gloves and would frequently (gently) graze my finger along the pins in the direction that they lead (so I didnt bend anymore!) and I could feel a few rough bumps. I pushed down gently until the bumps were out. Now this last pin.. Honestly I was shaking... I didn't want to bend it, I could barely see the proper angle because of the light reflecting back into the scope was casting shadows. I had to re-assess the bend over and over... It was horrible. It looked like your arm and your making a fist, and aim your fist at your face like your going to punch your own face. The hand of the pin was bent completely back, the arm was inverted and warped... Remember the proper angle was like your holding and apple with a flat palm out in front of you. The palm would be the part that contacted the CPU.
> 
> I didn't pay for this motherboard or CPU - it was a gift from my significant other who is going on a family trip to Europe. I had a lot of problems with my i7 4930K and the Asus Sabertooth x79 developed in 2011 it was currently living in. They (the significant other) heard me rant here and there about it and decided to get me my dream PC for staying behind and watching the puppies and chickens we own. I had so many problems with that motherboard. Asus abandon it with a BETA BIOS that never fully worked and you had to reset the bios frequently to get it going like an old VW Bug. It worked when you did a certain thing to it every time and you had to keep doing that but you were sick and fed up with the random chance that it didn't want to work with you on any particular day.
> 
> The LAST Pin...
> I was having such a hard time seeing proper angles, rotating the motherboard around on my desk to see the exact bend. I needed to see this because if I had a chance to bend it back - it would be only one opportunity to bend it. If I bent it too much I would need to bend this pin back and fatigue it more - it would surely break. I spent about 10 minutes examining this last little bastard. Every possible angle it could move with opposing angular force. With that toothpick... I nudged it gently here, gently there. The last swipe over the top to bend the flat top back! DONE! I pressed my finger against the top of the patch of pins again and stroke them feeling for height irregularities - some felt a little too high... I pressed down with my finger just enough to balance out the pins that were too high and it felt right. Putting the board under the scope again I looked..... It was nearly flawless! No broken pins and all rows had the same distance between each other, nothing was off canter.
> 
> Putting the CPU back in the carriage, sliding it in and feeling the bump that it was placed correctly I laid it down. Then tightened each screw a little around the clock, never tightening a single screw all the way on the first try. Little by little the ThreadRipper 1950X was torqued into place..... The time was to power it up and see .... I preyed to God this worked because I didn't know what I was going to do... I pressed the power button, light's lit up on the motherboard, no errors on the LED readout... My monitor turned on showing the Gigabyte Aorus Eagle logo on the Gaming 7 motherboard. Thank you God! Thank you! I yelled. I couldn't believe it... I did it. Everything seems to always fail for me, always.. But today, this time, right now... It worked.
> 
> Typing this on 8-18-2017 @ 12:13AM here in Redding, California this was 3 days ago. As patient and careful as I was. As slow and gentle as I could be - MISTAKES STILL HAPPEN. Nobody is perfect. _This is my ThreadRipper story_ and I won't ever forget it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Its running great! I've OC'ed all cores stable at 1.25v to 3.8GHz (this is temporary I plan on leaving it stock ... for now!).
> 
> In the end it just stresses the resilience of the AMD platform and why we need to continue supporting it. Intel may still have faster CPU's for $8,000 but these little firecrackers and their motherboards are in it for the long haul. Gigabyte won a new long-term-customer.
> 
> My Hardware:
> CPU: AMD ThreadRipper 1950X
> Mobo: Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7
> RAM: G.Skill DDR4 2400 RGB 32GB (8x4 quad channel)
> GPU: Two Sapphire Nitro+ 8GB RX480's (crossfire)
> 
> EDIT: UPDATE
> Today is the 10 day anniversary of my installation! I am happy to announce it's still kicking butt and overclocking great! I've tortured this CPU with PRIME95 and other software to see if any thermal changes causes adverse problems and I haven't had any. Also - the LGA socket protector CANNOT be left in when the CPU is installed because it's installed literally in the bracket the CPU needs to go inside.
> 
> I attached the image of the last pin. Look at it zoomed in. Every pin around that one was also bent (at least 6 of them).


Doesnt this motherboard socket come with its plastic cover? And has anyone here attempted to install the cpu without the orange plastic guide....the old fashioned way?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ocvn*
> 
> 
> 
> 4G, 1.325V... testing with bykski block, ambient 25


Looks Like that bykski block is very good and you getting 20 C less than EK's hybryd block


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I see. uuhhh, I have to buy an 8TB+ drive to move my data. That sucks. oh well. alright thanks.


You don't have to buy an expensive high-capacity disk. You could use smaller disks unless your data consists of a single 8 TiB file or something silly. 2-3 TB stuff is cheap as chips. If you lived around here, you could borrow some of mine. I have hard cases full of disks like that. heh


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Just out of curiosity. What are you guys using your TR for?
> 
> I'll use it for Houdini simulations, and it will also come in handy when I render Houdini simulations in C4D (it takes ages to process massive files for every frame rendered).


Hey Beatnutz!!

I dont own a x399 system yet, and still on x79 with xeons.
I , Like I assume You, am scrolling don this forum, to get good information about the binning of these chips to see if people can easily get 4.0 ghz on CL14 3200 and faster speeds, with decent temperatures_(anything under 60C), or if the true average reasonable OC with reasonable Voltage and heat, is 3.8.

That being said I am waiting for release of WS Asus x399 mother boards as My intention is to run 6 gpus and raid 1 or 10...that being said while I envy all the owners here of the 1950X , I will take advantage of the wait to see if the 32 core version of TR will be released( as I strongly suspect it will) or go for EPYC or TD 8core and wait for the 7nm due next year supporting PCIe Gen 4...MY only fear is that WS Motherboards will be released only at the end of the year in Tandem with PCIe 4.0...this Implies waiting for VOLTA to stack up new graphics investments.

That Being Said I work on Maya, Houdini and 3ds Vray, Iray, Mental Ray, Nuke...so yeah I will definitely enjoy the horse power of the CPU for mega tasking, and GPU for rendering.
I was honestly waiting for skylake for 2 years now, and wanted to run a 8gpu sever on dual xeons, but seeing the massive cache and Pcie lanes that amd now offers, it is a no brainer for Me, I'll go deep into AMD system diligently and take advantage of HBM3 Gpus in time that. I think like this it will be good enough system for at least 5 years and get all of its amortization tax/workflow worth.

To all the rest who might be reading this post I would be extremely grateful if You ran Vray benchmark, and post Your CL, clocks and results here, as it is a better benchmark for these CPUs than C4d(but still a wonderful suite btw)

Nice to see a CG artist on here,,,,what are You into VFX for movies?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I do GPU renders so it doesn't matter if they are different. So I'm pretty much saving old cards as I move up. Got a fourth slot now with the new MB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Dark Base Pro 900 case is sold as a full tower case with endless posibilities and "perfect for water cooling" with rad space everywhere. In reality the inside of the case is a massive waste of space where noise dampening takes up a big chunk of space at the top and bottom. Cable management is terrible. Rad space is a joke. You are supposed to be able to fit a 360 in the bottom. Let me know if you see any possibilites of that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . As you can see on the top I had to ditch one of the 140mm fans and squeeze in a 120mm fan. Otherwise I would not have been able to have a rad there either. I was properly pissed off when I installed the case. So as a result I now have a rad in my desk drawer that I cant use since I planned to have it in the bottom.
> 
> I complained about it on the Be Quiet forum, but not a single reply.
> 
> I came from Phaneks, and I made a huge mistake leaving them. Polar opposites when it comes to the joy of installing the case. If they release a new version (with a bigger glas) of the Enthoo Primo I'm going to grab that.







I really know how You feel, if You do not wish to make external waterboxes, then PC cases around are pretty much either huge with wasted space where u dont want it, or badly made....The link above is a new Thermaltake view 71 TG case...I think with little tinker and a drill and washers, You could fit on top and front 2 xspc 360x180 45 mm thick radiators, that should be more than enough to cool 180 tdp of the cpu and 4 gpus at full load, while I use 540x180 EK 30mm radiators, as I didnt know Xspc made those, I strongly recommend them as they have an additional port, on the other side of the radiator, that will reduce Your tubing exposure to the warm air of the case, and You will be able to run low RPM noiseless fans(just make sure You make the rear IO fan intake instead of outtake so You get good positive pressure in the case so You wont get dust in it (as it is almost an open chassis), ..I use EKs Vardars 180mm at full speed, and I cant hear them even if I put My ear 5 CM next to the 6 of them , You will be able to run them preferably only in pull which is more than enough.....that being said You could also add an extra 180x180 at the bottom of that case, or maybe even another 360, if You use custom modded server PSUs, instead of a superflower 2k watt PSU.
My best advice unless You live in a really cold country, is to completely get rid of radiators inside the case, and decouple them outside, to a nearby room via a hole in the wall because You will either need to run AC almost all year round or Your ambient will get very hot very fast, once You add that 4th gpu..You have two DDC pumps so they will should manage the head pressure, if You dont exceed 8/9 meters Ioop.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Yeah, this is a common problem. Most people (including me) solve it by attaching screw 2 & 3 first. But not too much, just so it catches on. And then do 1, 2 and 3.


yes that is a common problem across the board...see what i did there...puns...
there should be a bit of a sticky









put carriage in tray
close and clip down
tighten screw 2 till it catches screw 3 till it catches then screw down screw one/two/three

just to test this when i first built it i did that three times in that order worked every times and you do not need a lot of pressure.(that's on a asrock taichi as well by the way.)


----------



## LunaP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> How about you do your own research, and stop jumping on every train you see?
> 
> http://www.pcworld.com/article/3201187/computers/intel-core-i9-review.html
> 
> "Even more controversial than PCIe rationing is Intel's VROC, or Virtual RAID on CPU. It's a nifty feature on Skylake-X that allows a user to configure up to 20 NVMe PCIe drives in RAID into a single bootable partition.
> 
> The problem? Intel apparently intends to charge more money for the feature. Details haven't been released, but vendors at Computex told us they believed RAID 0 would be free, RAID 1 would cost $99, and RAID 5 and RAID 10 could cost $299. Once you've ponied up the cash, you get a hardware dongle that unlocks the feature."
> 
> They are *clearly* talking about vROC in both your links
> 
> Intel RAID is *not* vROC.


Could you just at least try to learn from people before pretending to know what you're talking about, I mean teh troll faces are just your intent of showing that you have 0 idea of what your'e talking about btu just doing it for the reaction its clear, but please stop spamming the thread with your trash at least, people are trying to pass on information here, not teach you the basics of what pcs are and how things work, there are plenty of threads for that since you seem so hesitant to ask, please exit your tsundere mode and either ask the quesitons you wanna know or just stop w/ the charade, THANKS - the community <3

**edit n/m I forgot I can block people, makes it much easier to read the thread when trash isn't flooding the spaces in between it.


----------



## e7balt

I was able to finally complete my new Threadripper 1950X system last Wednesday when my ASUS Prime X399-A motherboard arrived. I'm running 64 GB of Corsair Dominator Platinum DDR 4 (XMP 3000) memory (currently set to run at 2930), a Gigabyte GTX 1080 Ti Waterforce Waterblock edition, and am running a custom loop with the EK Threadripper block with a 420mm radiator. This past weekend I experimented with overclocking the chip. I was able to get it to run stable at 4.0 Ghz but when all cores are active I was hitting around 80 degrees C which seems a bit too high to comfortably maintain for long periods of time. Based on my experimentation I was not able to keep it stable unless I ran with a CPU voltage setting of at least 1.38. For now I have reverted back to stock clocks. Overall I'm very happy with the system so far.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *e7balt*
> 
> I was able to finally complete my new Threadripper 1950X system last Wednesday when my ASUS Prime X399-A motherboard arrived. I'm running 64 GB of Corsair Dominator Platinum DDR 4 (XMP 3000) memory (currently set to run at 2930), a Gigabyte GTX 1080 Ti Waterforce Waterblock edition, and am running a custom loop with the EK Threadripper block with a 420mm radiator. This past weekend I experimented with overclocking the chip. I was able to get it to run stable at 4.0 Ghz but when all cores are active I was hitting around 80 degrees C which seems a bit too high to comfortably maintain for long periods of time. Based on my experimentation I was not able to keep it stable unless I ran with a CPU voltage setting of at least 1.38. For now I have reverted back to stock clocks. Overall I'm very happy with the system so far.


is that 80 tdie or tctl if that is tdie then yes that is high for that setup considering my h115i with 1400 rpm fans only hit 78 degree doing prime 95 small fft's

and if it is tdie thanks you just saved me a few hundred bucks









check the thermal paste coverage to start with my preferred method is godzilla blob on the Z using thermal grizzly kryonaut.
again my preferred









as for the raid debate i am not or ever have really been a fan of raid especially raid 1 slow performance and more times than i can count the data was screwed up by a single drive failure i prefer raid 0 and a good back(i just image a lot







)
but again that's me and my personal preference. As soon as they release the nvme raid option i will grab 2 drives and try it out.


----------



## e7balt

It was 80 tdie. It is possible I did not get good coverage with the thermal compound. I used a good size blob at the center as well as an X pattern. Used all of the grizzly compound included with the EK block. However, I suppose that might not have been enough compound.


----------



## ajc9988

Performance-PCs


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

The plastic cover is not what you think - It slides in to where the CPU goes in that middle metal bracket. Its not something you can leave on when you do your install. The plastic protector must come out before you do the CPU install - period. They say to use the orange carriage for proper alignment. There's a warning in the manual about taking the orange part off and to NEVER install the CPU without it. I think the CPU cold miss-align when the bracket comes down.

Let me just reiterate this. Where the CPU slides in is where the protector is and it comes up and out before the CPU goes in and down. I WISH the protector was part of the socket and was a part that came out lastly (after you slide your CPU in). It's just not possible. If you let's say take the protector out but then put it on top of the CPU socket to use it as a protector still - it would just slide around and might bump and bend some pins still. The metal bracket aligns everything.


----------



## AlphaC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *https://www.forbes.com/sites/antonyleather/2017/09/05/amd-ryzen-threadripper-the-fascinating-story-behind-the-processor-that-beat-intel/2/#612b4e111270*
> They thought I was crazy, but what was really great is that they were passionate about the project. I've never actually told anyone this, but Threadripper never had a business plan - that might raise some eyebrows, but we were building it because we knew it was awesome, because we could and to make it best product we could, even the name had to be big. - Senior Vice President and General Manager Jim Anderson
> 
> Forbes: So, were Ryzen and EPYC the only two processors planned?
> 
> John Taylor:
> 
> That's correct. The existence of the EPYC server CPU enabled us to create Ryzen Threadripper, but Threadripper was not part of the original 2017 AMD product roadmap. That only included the Ryzen 3, 5 and 7 ranges of 4, 6 and 8-core CPUs, plus versions of EPYC ranging from eight to 32 cores. Interestingly, some of the original team behind Threadripper joined AMD from the press, with a critical and appreciative eye for PC hardware from years of reviewing a wide range of products. This perspective was core to creating the Threadripper concept and product definition. It is very much a CPU made by enthusiasts, for enthusiasts. The story behind it hasn't really been told before as we announced and launched Threadripper this summer in a very short period of time. Before May 2017, no one knew it existed, and by August it was in people's hands, but it's a very good example of the company AMD is today.
> 
> *Threadripper timeline:*
> 
> 2014 - 2015: Work began on Threadripper concept, mostly in the initial team's spare time and without a dedicated business plan
> 
> 2016: The team presented the idea to Jim Anderson just before the Computex tradeshow who had joined from Intel the previous year. Loved the idea so much the launch timeline was cut to 18 months to be the same year as Ryzen and EPYC.
> 
> May 2017: AMD officially announces Threadripper, which comes mostly as a surprise to the press.
> 
> August 2017: Threadripper goes retail


Apparently Threadripper is a EPYC spinoff that was never truly intended to hit market.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlphaC*
> 
> Apparently Threadripper is a EPYC spinoff that was never truly intended to hit market.


and i am happy they did







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> To all the rest who might be reading this post I would be extremely grateful if You ran Vray benchmark, and post Your CL, clocks and results here, as it is a better benchmark for these CPUs than C4d(but still a wonderful suite btw)
> 
> Nice to see a CG artist on here,,,,what are You into VFX for movies?


i will be happy to just installed a Samsung 960 evo nvme drive so doing a little house cleaning.
and how nice of Microsoft to de activate all my office programmes because i changed a friggen hard drive :0 luckily telephone support still work s

ok caveat the things in the pic were running at the same time.


and now one without anything else running(not a huge difference which in my opinion is good







)


now can someone tell me why i spend 300 bucks on this drive...so far i,m not really seeing a huge improvement over my 850 evo ssd but then have not done a huge amount yet (any tips for tweaking the drive?)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *e7balt*
> 
> It was 80 tdie. It is possible I did not get good coverage with the thermal compound. I used a good size blob at the center as well as an X pattern. Used all of the grizzly compound included with the EK block. However, I suppose that might not have been enough compound.


you may have used too much it is a pretty finicky thing i seems...i managed to i believe do it just right, mine was say....7 mm by 4 mm and about 3mm high on the Z nothing else.

does anyone else have the hybrid block?

and a quick RB run with the new nvme...seems it is good for something


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlphaC*
> 
> Apparently Threadripper is a EPYC spinoff that was never truly intended to hit market.


I'm happy too they did. I don't regret this upgrade from the 3930K


----------



## Erland82

Almost done 1950x build. Running at 4ghz at 1,39 vcore (1,412 reported during load)
Cpu temps under 63c prime 95 load testing. But i had to add 2 fans blowing at the vrm`s, front and back of the m-board. (Need a monoblock for more vcore)
G.skill 3600mhz c15 ,at 3466 cl 14.
3460+/- cinebench score.
1 1080ti fe gpu, waiting for a new psu and one more 1080ti.
Happy so far.


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Erland82*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Almost done 1950x build. Running at 4ghz at 1,39 vcore (1,412 reported during load)
> Cpu temps under 63c prime 95 load testing. But i had to add 2 fans blowing at the vrm`s, front and back of the m-board. (Need a monoblock for more vcore)
> Memory at 3466 cl 14. G.skill 3460+/- cinebench score.
> 1 1080ti fe gpu, waiting for a new psu and one more 1080ti.
> Happy so far.


now that's a big baby







pretty cool!


----------



## amigafan2003

Best I've managed so far


----------



## DVLux

So, how about some memory benchmarks/overclocking results?







It's the one thing I don't think I've seen in this thread.


----------



## amigafan2003

Sure










11006 Timespy https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2315065
25576 Firestrike Standard https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512359
7768 Firestrike Ultra https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512598


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Sure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 11006 Timespy https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512359
> 25576 Firestrike Standard https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512598
> 7768 Firestrike Ultra https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2315065


Sweet mercy!

TR has some earth shattering performance there. It's pretty clear it started life as a server platform.


----------



## farcodev

No overclock for my RAM (for now), so it sux... a bit


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Sweet mercy!
> 
> TR has some earth shattering performance there. It's pretty clear it started life as a server platform.


Yeah, checkout the Firestrike CPU score


----------



## amigafan2003

22:43s.

If anyone else feels brave enough to have a go, file is @ https://download.blender.org/demo/test/benchmark.zip


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> now that's a big baby
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pretty cool!


is that prime 95 blend or small ffts if its blend try the other one







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Sure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 11006 Timespy https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2315065
> 25576 Firestrike Standard https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512359
> 7768 Firestrike Ultra https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512598


your links are ass about tit







but some very impressive scores
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> 
> 22:43s.
> 
> If anyone else feels brave enough to have a go, file is @ https://download.blender.org/demo/test/benchmark.zip


i,ll give it a shot if you give the vray one a shot (mine came in at i think 15th for the cpu







)


----------



## Particle

I'll run the benchmark when I get home, but my results are going to seem really fast. Blender runs like 50% faster under Linux than it does Windows for some reason.


----------



## amigafan2003

VRAY - 38s



http://imgur.com/XO2yjDM


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> VRAY - 38s
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/XO2yjDM


that's impressive shaved 3 seconds off me







i sort of wonder if the gpu has anything to do with the cpu test...doubt it but hey


----------



## Particle

I tried to run that blender file, but my computer made a snapping sound and shut down about 10 seconds into it. Blender wasn't even using much CPU time yet. It works again now, but I'm not sure I want to try it again. Nothing is overclocked and I'm running a Seasonic 1000 watt PSU, so power shouldn't be an issue.


----------



## tarot

ok here you go 28 minutes not the best











just goes to show what 200 MHz and faster ram can do
mine is 3900 and 3200 on the ram 4 sticks
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I tried to run that blender file, but my computer made a snapping sound and shut down about 10 seconds into it. Blender wasn't even using much CPU time yet. It works again now, but I'm not sure I want to try it again. Nothing is overclocked and I'm running a Seasonic 1000 watt PSU, so power shouldn't be an issue.


generally that is the cpu overheating power supply not having enough juice or a few other things blender can be a very viscous little monster especially larger renders like this


----------



## SavantStrike

Another CPU block announced.. The phanteks glacier c399a. There sure are a lot of water blocks out there given no one can get their hands on one.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok here you go 28 minutes not the best
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just goes to show what 200 MHz and faster ram can do
> mine is 3900 and 3200 on the ram 4 sticks
> generally that is the cpu overheating power supply not having enough juice or a few other things blender can be a very viscous little monster especially larger renders like this


It hadn't even started the CPU intensive part of the render yet. I'm not sure what happened.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I tried to run that blender file, but my computer made a snapping sound and shut down about 10 seconds into it. Blender wasn't even using much CPU time yet. It works again now, but I'm not sure I want to try it again. Nothing is overclocked and I'm running a Seasonic 1000 watt PSU, so power shouldn't be an issue.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> It hadn't even started the CPU intensive part of the render yet. I'm not sure what happened.


personaly i would lean towards the power supply or the supply of power to the cpu.
make sure all the 4/8 pins are in yadda yadda but the sound reminds me of a psu tripping


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> personaly i would lean towards the power supply or the supply of power to the cpu.
> make sure all the 4/8 pins are in yadda yadda but the sound reminds me of a psu tripping


I would generally agree, but this is a high quality power supply with a massive amount of headroom. It handled an overclocked 9590 just fine. Now suddenly a stock 1950X is too much? Doesn't add up. That said, I only have one 8-pin attached. I'll see if I can go find the second one.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I would generally agree, but this is a high quality power supply with a massive amount of headroom. It handled an overclocked 9590 just fine. Now suddenly a stock 1950X is too much? Doesn't add up. That said, I only have one 8-pin attached. I'll see if I can go find the second one.


and there you have it







plug it in i will guarantee it will work(no guarantees are valid







)
the taichi only has a 8 and a 4 pin but it works fine i think 8/8 is overkill but a single connecter will just overload everything.
again i am no genius so anyone else with a bigger brain than me feel free to chime in


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> and there you have it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> plug it in i will guarantee it will work(no guarantees are valid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> the taichi only has a 8 and a 4 pin but it works fine i think 8/8 is overkill but a single connecter will just overload everything.
> again i am no genius so anyone else with a bigger brain than me feel free to chime in


Pretty sure threadripper draws more underload than 9590 by 20 or so, even more if you were to OC it.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> and there you have it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> plug it in i will guarantee it will work(no guarantees are valid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> the taichi only has a 8 and a 4 pin but it works fine i think 8/8 is overkill but a single connecter will just overload everything.
> again i am no genius so anyone else with a bigger brain than me feel free to chime in


I found the second cable and plugged it in, but I just had the same thing happen to me. Blender was running and then suddenly a click followed by no video. The lights and fans stay on. The reset button brought it right back. The thermals were 33C CPU and 35C motherboard, so nothing is even getting warm.

Prime95 torture test runs fine and Blender is killing my system before it even gets to the multithreaded tile renderer part when it does kill my system. I was able to run probably three times without the click/crash and all three times Blender suddenly exited about 5 seconds into the tiled renderer part. Something isn't happy, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's this MSI motherboard. I'm still scarred somewhat by the MSI K9A2 Platinum debacle where the VRM exploded running a stock or slightly overclocked Phenom as I recall.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I found the second cable and plugged it in, but I just had the same thing happen to me. Blender was running and then suddenly a click followed by no video. The lights and fans stay on. The reset button brought it right back. The thermals were 33C CPU and 35C motherboard, so nothing is even getting warm.
> 
> Prime95 torture test runs fine and Blender is killing my system before it even gets to the multithreaded tile renderer part when it does kill my system. I was able to run probably three times without the click/crash and all three times Blender suddenly exited about 5 seconds into the tiled renderer part. Something isn't happy, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's this MSI motherboard. I'm still scarred somewhat by the MSI K9A2 Platinum debacle where the VRM exploded running a stock or slightly overclocked Phenom as I recall.


that is a bit of a weird one. I was just thinking the video card then but that makes less sense. i don't remember any kind of load on my video card while running blender


----------



## mrrevit

Hello all.

I was one of the lucky ones who was able to place an order with Newegg for a Enermax TR4 360 cooler.

After installation my system does run stable at 4.0 using Asus Zenith Extreme motherboard and Gskill DDR4 3200 14 latency at 1.35V.

I was able to overclock the system to 4.1 but had freezing issues when using 3DS max Arnold render engine and cinebench 15.

At 4.0 highest value so far was 3423. At 4.1 I hit 3452.

Has anyone been able to run 1950x at 4.1 in a stable configuration? If so can you give use your secret haha.







By the way this is my first build. It will be used for rendering.

John


----------



## Beatnutz

@Particle

Sounds like the issue I had when rendering in Houdini and Cinema 4D somewhere in the beginning of this thread.

I suspect u are on MSI X399? Turn off 'core performance boost' in BIOS. Done.


----------



## Erland82

3dmark Timespy 1 gpu topp 100 on my first day with oc testing.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrrevit*
> 
> Hello all.
> 
> I was one of the lucky ones who was able to place an order with Newegg for a Enermax TR4 360 cooler.
> 
> After installation my system does run stable at 4.0 using Asus Zenith Extreme motherboard and Gskill DDR4 3200 14 latency at 1.35V.
> 
> I was able to overclock the system to 4.1 but had freezing issues when using 3DS max Arnold render engine and cinebench 15.
> 
> At 4.0 highest value so far was 3423. At 4.1 I hit 3452.
> 
> Has anyone been able to run 1950x at 4.1 in a stable configuration? If so can you give use your secret haha.
> 
> By the way this is my first build. It will be used for rendering.
> 
> John


do not have a zenith and i was able to hit 4g at 1.35 but not stable what voltages llc levels are you using and more importantly...
how does the cooler go







give us some deats









oh also make sure all the power plugs are in i think that board ahs 2 8 pin eps i can't make out in the pic if they are both connected(i,m assuming they are)


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> do not have a zenith and i was able to hit 4g at 1.35 but not stable what voltages llc levels are you using and more importantly...
> how does the cooler go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> give us some deats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh also make sure all the power plugs are in i think that board ahs 2 8 pin eps i can't make out in the pic if they are both connected(i,m assuming they are)


What LLC are you running?


----------



## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok here you go 28 minutes not the best
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just goes to show what 200 MHz and faster ram can do
> mine is 3900 and 3200 on the ram 4 sticks
> generally that is the cpu overheating power supply not having enough juice or a few other things blender can be a very viscous little monster especially larger renders like this




Check your setting. I am 4G with 3200 Ram and result 22:48s also


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrrevit*
> 
> Has anyone been able to run 1950x at 4.1 in a stable configuration? If so can you give use your secret haha.


Easy, just set 1.465v vcore and off you go


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> @Particle
> 
> Sounds like the issue I had when rendering in Houdini and Cinema 4D somewhere in the beginning of this thread.
> 
> I suspect u are on MSI X399? Turn off 'core performance boost' in BIOS. Done.


I am on the MSI, yes. If CPB is making it crash, I have to suspect it's a VRM issue. I'll try it and if that fixes it, I'll mess with LLC. I'd think Prime95 would trigger it though if that were the case.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I am on the MSI, yes. If CPB is making it crash, I have to suspect it's a VRM issue. I'll try it and if that fixes it, I'll mess with LLC. I'd think Prime95 would trigger it though if that were the case.


Yeah but it sounds identical to what a lot of people are experiencing in renderers. I pushed my CPU a lot in stress tests and benchmarks. It would never fail unless I tried rendering things (not even Cinebench would crash, but Cinema4D would). Not sure what is triggering it but it seems like MSI are aware of it. They told me to wait for the next BIOS update.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Yeah but it sounds identical to what a lot of people are experiencing in renderers. I pushed my CPU a lot in stress tests and benchmarks. It would never fail unless I tried rendering things (not even Cinebench would crash, but Cinema4D would). Not sure what is triggering it but it seems like MSI are aware of it. They told me to wait for the next BIOS update.


While cinebench is a common benchmark so people understand a cpu capability from its numbers, it is a pretty crappy benchmark, because it makes very little or no use of L3 cache, this is why You get cinebench running but when rendering on C4d with full render engine You crash........Chaos group has released a new Vray benchmark, which is for free, and I really hope that it will become the reference benchmark in the future rather than Cinebench...ALSO because Cinebench basically cant handle anymore the massive amount of cores and compute power that is now available on the market, it is not a good benchmark and if You are really using powerful CPUS or tons of cores You will get very inconsistent results with over 10% variations most of the times, not that every one runs 128 plus threads but we are getting there definitely even for HEDT next year, and cinebench wont be good for precise benchmarks anymore then...so for threadripper it is very possible that even if the benchmarks might end similar or worse compared to intel soon to come CPUs, in real life scenarios when rendering heavy duty, Ryzen might out perform much more Intel, that what the cinebench differences actually show..though I think maybe for RT on the GPU higher clicked Intel might give better results on GPU render time.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrrevit*
> 
> Hello all.
> 
> I was one of the lucky ones who was able to place an order with Newegg for a Enermax TR4 360 cooler.
> 
> After installation my system does run stable at 4.0 using Asus Zenith Extreme motherboard and Gskill DDR4 3200 14 latency at 1.35V.
> 
> I was able to overclock the system to 4.1 but had freezing issues when using 3DS max Arnold render engine and cinebench 15.
> 
> At 4.0 highest value so far was 3423. At 4.1 I hit 3452.
> 
> Has anyone been able to run 1950x at 4.1 in a stable configuration? If so can you give use your secret haha.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By the way this is my first build. It will be used for rendering.
> 
> John


Very promising......While i think BIOS updates will help a lot for memory speed, I know Threadripper is very much heat sensitive, in theory, the cpu can overclock as good as its cooling will be, and Ive heard an AMD statement that TR has a lot of OC headroom, if You can cool it well enough.....overall I think TR is a cpu capable of 3700ish scores on cinebench for most users once the bios and decent engineered cooling blocks gets into the market...but I would not run this cpu over 70 c unless You change every couple of years...and You dont mind the socket looking pins degrading and looking like a dirty over after a few months.
You can also try to stick a heat sink on the socket backplate, i am sure it will help cooling a ton.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Very promising......While i think BIOS updates will help a lot for memory speed, I know Threadripper is very much heat sensitive, in theory, the cpu can overclock as good as its cooling will be, and Ive heard an AMD statement that TR has a lot of OC headroom, if You can cool it well enough.....overall I think TR is a cpu capable of 3700ish scores on cinebench for most users once the bios and decent engineered cooling blocks gets into the market...but I would not run this cpu over 70 c unless You change every couple of years...and You dont mind the socket looking pins degrading and looking like a dirty over after a few months.
> You can also try to stick a heat sink on the socket backplate, i am sure it will help cooling a ton.


Have AMD even published official temperature and voltage specifications for Threadripper. I'd like to know what the numbers are before cranking up the voltage.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> While cinebench is a common benchmark so people understand a cpu capability from its numbers, it is a pretty crappy benchmark, because it makes very little or no use of L3 cache, this is why You get cinebench running but when rendering on C4d with full render engine You crash........Chaos group has released a new Vray benchmark, which is for free, and I really hope that it will become the reference benchmark in the future rather than Cinebench...ALSO because Cinebench basically cant handle anymore the massive amount of cores and compute power that is now available on the market, it is not a good benchmark and if You are really using powerful CPUS or tons of cores You will get very inconsistent results with over 10% variations most of the times, not that every one runs 128 plus threads but we are getting there definitely even for HEDT next year, and cinebench wont be good for precise benchmarks anymore then...so for threadripper it is very possible that even if the benchmarks might end similar or worse compared to intel soon to come CPUs, in real life scenarios when rendering heavy duty, Ryzen might out perform much more Intel, that what the cinebench differences actually show..though I think maybe for RT on the GPU higher clicked Intel might give better results on GPU render time.


Actually, I read that article stating it couldn't keep up with Intel's massive core chips, but if you look closely, it was only after Intel updated something that the 20% wild swings in scores occurred. This actually suggests it isn't the program, but Intel trying to game the benchmark, that is the real issue. It wasn't seen on AMD.

Meanwhile, if your getting more than a 20-60 point variance on TR between runs, your OC isn't stable. It is a very repeatable test with a decently low margin of error, unless you are not doing it right on TR.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> While cinebench is a common benchmark so people understand a cpu capability from its numbers, it is a pretty crappy benchmark, because it makes very little or no use of L3 cache, this is why You get cinebench running but when rendering on C4d with full render engine You crash........Chaos group has released a new Vray benchmark, which is for free, and I really hope that it will become the reference benchmark in the future rather than Cinebench...ALSO because Cinebench basically cant handle anymore the massive amount of cores and compute power that is now available on the market, it is not a good benchmark and if You are really using powerful CPUS or tons of cores You will get very inconsistent results with over 10% variations most of the times, not that every one runs 128 plus threads but we are getting there definitely even for HEDT next year, and cinebench wont be good for precise benchmarks anymore then...so for threadripper it is very possible that even if the benchmarks might end similar or worse compared to intel soon to come CPUs, in real life scenarios when rendering heavy duty, Ryzen might out perform much more Intel, that what the cinebench differences actually show..though I think maybe for RT on the GPU higher clicked Intel might give better results on GPU render time.


Thanks for the insights. Interesting! I'll do some VRAY benchmarking too.

I wonder though what it is in the renderers that make MSI X399 boards crash? So far I know of C4D, Houdini and Blender but I wouldn't be surprised if Maya, 3DS Max, Octane standalone etc have the same issues. Any ideas?


----------



## mrrevit

@amigafan2003

I tried 1.465V and it worked well on cinebench at 4.1.

I hit a new high score of 3519 holy moly.

I retested on 3DS max and the system still froze.

I'm back at 4.0 :-(


----------



## mrrevit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> What LLC are you running?


I'm running LLC using auto settings.

Out of curiosity I did test LLC to level 1 and level 8.

Both values still froze on Cinebench.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Have AMD even published official temperature and voltage specifications for Threadripper. I'd like to know what the numbers are before cranking up the voltage.


Please double check, but If I remember correctly AMD recommend not to exceed 70C....My personal recommendation is to aim at 55ish C for Your working/house environment....the cpu works great even without overclock, as long as the memory gets its latency as low as possible...also I think have heard that 4 RAM sticks work faster and better than 2 and than 8..Id focus for now on the ram speed, and then keep a good eye on monoblocks that will come in the market,....phanteks has just released TR4 water block, and seeing from the pictures it has much taller fins, and much bigger top block tank, so I think that might reduce temps under load and on the socket maybe even by 10C.....

OC3D TV You tube, has made actually a very good review on that zenith motherboard, and He has gone in depth probing temps on all the MB components...what is evident is that the socket plate and back plate get extremely hot, so with a HIGH capacity water block in theory it should reduce that heat going on the socket and thus reduce temps on long heavy duty runs.

As I understand You like Me do a lot of render work and sometimes We render animation frames for days keeping the workstation on at full load, so to Us cooling and silence is a big priority, while if You do You tube videos or game streaming Keeping Your system at load for 3 4 6 hours is not a big deal...I occasionally have working sessions lasting 14 hours where Im definitely mega tasking even if not rendering, and You will agree with me that keeping the AC on at max speed noise dust , You arrive at the head of the day that You feel like a bulldozer has ran over Your head, even in the quietest and coolest environment, that heat and that dust will always need to go somewhere.

As for numbers what I would do is to check out silicon lottery from time to time, so You will see what TR chips they offer with what voltages achieved, that is a great reference point to know the quality of Your CPU.

https://siliconlottery.com/collections/all

8pack from OClockers Uk, says that in general TR with august bios, would be stable at 3.8 with acceptable parameters(temps voltage wise) that seems a lil conservative to Me, but I guess they have to stay conservative when selling to people.

My best estimated guess is that 4.2 with a good chip stable and not too hot is possible on this CPU for some lucky ones, but seeing over 70C with EK and XSPC waterblocks at 4.0 Ghz, is on the other hand not so promising as well...We need to keep in mind that AMD TR4 can come in a 32 core version, so seeing only 16 cores getting this hot matters a lot. And Im pretty sure AMD will indeed release 32 core Threadripper and put the lid on Intel coffin, cause Intel has nothing that can compete with that , not even their 10 thousand dollar server CPU.
Also AMD by tradition has never locked their server CPUs, opterons have been overclockable, if I am not mistaken, so You know, if there will be an ASUS single/dual socket EPYC motherboard that can support overclocking, that will also be a nice one to see

I think traditional waterblocks alone are just not enough for these new generation computers, I think they need much more advanced blocks that what was in the past with Intel monopoly...possibly the socket brackets themselves becoming a water block cold plate one day...would be nice to see ASUS take this approach.

So yeah TR4 is cooling dependent, once BIOS will be refined.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Sure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 11006 Timespy https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2315065
> 25576 Firestrike Standard https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512359
> 7768 Firestrike Ultra https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512598


I assume that is in NUMA (Local) mode? Could you please also do the same benchmarks in UMA mode as well so we can have a point of comparison (The 8 core gaming mode may be educational to add to the comparison as well)?.

Thanks in advance


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrrevit*
> 
> @amigafan2003
> 
> I tried 1.465V and it worked well on cinebench at 4.1.
> 
> I hit a new high score of 3519 holy moly.
> 
> I retested on 3DS max and the system still froze.
> 
> I'm back at 4.0 :-(


So I'm in the same boat as you.. 4.0 GHZ I'm stable for renderings and simulations with FumeFX and Vray and what not.. At 1.325v ... I try to get to 4.1 and I can manage sometimes to get threw the benchmark but I'm up at 1.4x volts which it gets running quite hot in that area. I was able to get 1.35v and 4.05ghz stable.. Will test a bit further. But my score was 3300 on Cinebench



Vray Benchmark Utility is another good one to run and I got 40.49 seconds on the CPU rendering part.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Thanks for the insights. Interesting! I'll do some VRAY benchmarking too.
> 
> I wonder though what it is in the renderers that make MSI X399 boards crash? So far I know of C4D, Houdini and Blender but I wouldn't be surprised if Maya, 3DS Max, Octane standalone etc have the same issues. Any ideas?


I have no idea what so ever im not a hardcore overclocker savvy like many others here, and all boards can crash..while I would buy ASUS all the time, MSI makes fantastic MBs, however what I can say is that yesterday I helped out a guy who was still running page file sys cached instead of having his RAM do the job, as a result he would get corrupted meshes in his MAYA scene...so if I had to guess it is a Memory issue that causes these crashes, probably the cpu doesnt know what do do once it gets some errors from the ram and this causes the system to crash...But keep in Mind that AMD crash is not like intel where u see a blue screen, AMD crash is total black screen, so maybe You can try a run increasing voltage a tad and see if that solves the issue, and if it does and You have too much voltage then You will know You have a chip that cant overclock so much without giving it nuclear class ''radiation''


----------



## ChronoBodi

Um, what's the Core Performance Boost? Is that disabling XFR on a stock 1950x?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> So I'm in the same boat as you.. 4.0 GHZ I'm stable for renderings and simulations with FumeFX and Vray and what not.. At 1.325v ... I try to get to 4.1 and I can manage sometimes to get threw the benchmark but I'm up at 1.4x volts which it gets running quite hot in that area. I was able to get 1.35v and 4.05ghz stable.. Will test a bit further. But my score was 3300 on Cinebench
> 
> 
> 
> Vray Benchmark Utility is another good one to run and I got 40.49 seconds on the CPU rendering part.


40 seconds is good on VRay and thanks for sharing....do You mind Me asking, what temps, what MB ,on what water block and what CPU radiator You have?


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> 40 seconds is good on VRay and thanks for sharing....do You mind Me asking, what temps, what MB ,on what water block and what CPU radiator You have?


I will run it again to see what my temps were.. The software I'm using shows multiple temps and I'm not sure which one is really the main focus. As far as the build, its a Arous 7 Gigabyte board, EK waterblock, and custom cooling. Large radiators as well.


----------



## happyluckbox

How are you guys getting 4ghz stable with only 1.35 volts? Is that under load? Do you mind me asking what LLC and vsoc you are using? & your RAM?

I also have the aorus board, details please


----------



## amigafan2003

For 4ghz I use 1.325v vcore (under load it's 1.3v in hwinfo), 1.02v SOC, Standard LLC for vcore and SOC. This peaks temps at 74c in Prime 95 (small ffts) and 78c on the VRMs. OC confirmed stable with an 8hr Aida64 stress test and 10 hr Prime run (I know some will argue that isn't enough to confirm stable, but I've found that to be adequate in the past). Mem speed is 3466 16-18-18-18-36-75 @ 1.5vdimm. 1000% coverage on HCIMemtest.

Some observations, it will run 4.1ghz @ 1.425v vcore but temps reach 85c on Prime 95 where the cpu starts thermal throttling. It's perfectly fine for rendering in Blender and Handbrake etc though where temps don't exceed 80c. It will also boot and bench with 3600 ram at the same timings as above, but I can't get it beyond 130% HCImemtest coverage. I can't get it to crash in "daily" use at this mem speed though, including a 1 hr Blender render (the longest project I have) or a 2hr Adobe Premier/AE render workflow. I wonder if big coverage on HCImemtest is a bit overkill for TR?


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> 40 seconds is good on VRay and thanks for sharing....do You mind Me asking, what temps, what MB ,on what water block and what CPU radiator You have?


Here is a quick take on a full render I'm doing in 3dsmax of a ArchInteriors piece from Evermotion. So far super stable and its been rendering for about 4 minutes. Looks like about 69-70C it peaks at with this setup.


----------



## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> How are you guys getting 4ghz stable with only 1.35 volts? Is that under load? Do you mind me asking what LLC and vsoc you are using? & your RAM?
> 
> I also have the aorus board, details please


I am Aorus also. LLC Turbo, fixed 1.35 for ddr4 3200. If DF ram 2133, i need 1.3V only. My stable test is 1h smallFFt, 1h blend, 4h occt large data set.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> Here is a quick take on a full render I'm doing in 3dsmax of a ArchInteriors piece from Evermotion. So far super stable and its been rendering for about 4 minutes. Looks like about 69-70C it peaks at with this setup.


its promising at 69C considering that You are using 1st EK iteration of TR4 waterblock, make me hope that temps just below 60C might be possible, but anything below 70C id sign on.


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> For 4ghz I use 1.325v vcore (under load it's 1.3v in hwinfo), 1.02v SOC, Standard LLC for vcore and SOC. This peaks temps at 74c in Prime 95 (small ffts) and 78c on the VRMs. OC confirmed stable with an 8hr Aida64 stress test and 10 hr Prime run (I know some will argue that isn't enough to confirm stable, but I've found that to be adequate in the past). Mem speed is 3466 16-18-18-18-36-75 @ 1.5vdimm. 1000% coverage on HCIMemtest.
> 
> Some observations, it will run 4.1ghz @ 1.425v vcore but temps reach 85c on Prime 95 where the cpu starts thermal throttling. It's perfectly fine for rendering in Blender and Handbrake etc though where temps don't exceed 80c. It will also boot and bench with 3600 ram at the same timings as above, but I can't get it beyond 130% HCImemtest coverage. I can't get it to crash in "daily" use at this mem speed though, including a 1 hr Blender render (the longest project I have) or a 2hr Adobe Premier/AE render workflow. I wonder if big coverage on HCImemtest is a bit overkill for TR?


I never really played with memory overclocking my setup right now is just running XMP on auto at 2666mhz ... I could probably squeeze a little performance out of this if I did get it overclocked but I don't even know where to begin.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> For 4ghz I use 1.325v vcore (under load it's 1.3v in hwinfo), 1.02v SOC, Standard LLC for vcore and SOC. This peaks temps at 74c in Prime 95 (small ffts) and 78c on the VRMs. OC confirmed stable with an 8hr Aida64 stress test and 10 hr Prime run (I know some will argue that isn't enough to confirm stable, but I've found that to be adequate in the past). Mem speed is 3466 16-18-18-18-36-75 @ 1.5vdimm. 1000% coverage on HCIMemtest.
> 
> Some observations, it will run 4.1ghz @ 1.425v vcore but temps reach 85c on Prime 95 where the cpu starts thermal throttling. It's perfectly fine for rendering in Blender and Handbrake etc though where temps don't exceed 80c. It will also boot and bench with 3600 ram at the same timings as above, but I can't get it beyond 130% HCImemtest coverage. I can't get it to crash in "daily" use at this mem speed though, including a 1 hr Blender render (the longest project I have) or a 2hr Adobe Premier/AE render workflow. I wonder if big coverage on HCImemtest is a bit overkill for TR?


Looks Like You won the silicon lotto

look here

https://siliconlottery.com/collections/all/products/1950x395g


----------



## ajc9988

Speaking of which, SL is back in stock of chips doing [email protected] I know I've been loving mine, just wanted to shout out...
https://siliconlottery.com/collections/lga-4094/products/1950x395g


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Speaking of which, SL is back in stock of chips doing [email protected] I know I've been loving mine, just wanted to shout out...
> https://siliconlottery.com/collections/lga-4094/products/1950x395g


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Speaking of which, SL is back in stock of chips doing [email protected] I know I've been loving mine, just wanted to shout out...
> https://siliconlottery.com/collections/lga-4094/products/1950x395g


Hmm what is the average oc? Seeing from what I read among other users, that seems just a bit better than average and hardly worth a premium but I may be wrong. I bought 4 on launch. 2 of which I have and 1 does [email protected] 1.35 and the other does 4ghz @ 1.35. Any higher on either requires a huge voltage increase. The 3rd one my buddy has does 4 @ a tad under 1.4. Seems lots of people are getting 4s under the 1.4 mark. IMO something like 4.1 under 1.4 would be an actual chip worth paying extra for.


----------



## Paprika

From what I've gathered my chip needs 1.375 with llc2 for 4.0,but the kraken x52 can't cool it well enough for me to bother with prime just yet. Hopefully it can do 4.1 without balls to the walls voltage.


----------



## amigafan2003

Seems about right - 1.35v plus or minus 0.025v for 4 ghz and 1.25v for 3.9ghz. 4.1ghz often needs well north of 1.4v, common voltage wall after 4.05ghz.

FYI, I've benched superpi at 4.3ghz, so individual cores are certainly capable, I suspect it's the package holding higher all core clocks back.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Hmm what is the average oc? Seeing from what I read among other users, that seems just a bit better than average and hardly worth a premium but I may be wrong. I bought 4 on launch. 2 of which I have and 1 does [email protected] 1.35 and the other does 4ghz @ 1.35. Any higher on either requires a huge voltage increase. The 3rd one my buddy has does 4 @ a tad under 1.4. Seems lots of people are getting 4s under the 1.4 mark. IMO something like 4.1 under 1.4 would be an actual chip worth paying extra for.


1) not all validation is the same. This means what people are using is not necessarily the same as what was found stable using SL's testing
2) These are broad categories, going up 25mV and testing at 50MHz higher. This does not mean the chips in that category cannot do better than the voltage listed, just that this is the floor (so buying the top binned chips can actually exceed the performance listed, it just will not be less performance or need more voltage than that listed under those same conditions)

After I build my custom loop, I'll do a test drive for highest clock at what voltage, with my own validation and optimizations, and then can tell you exactly what type of chip I have. But SL changed the criteria from realbench to using multiple stress tests over different time periods to then provide higher assurance of performance with the stated clock and voltage.

Now, I don't mean to impugn your abilities at all (and I don't), but considering how quickly the top tier sold out versus the second tier, it would stand to reason that SL had a larger sample size and found more in the different tiers. Now, without the data by percent in each category, we do not know where it sits, but these are things to consider.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ocvn*
> 
> 
> 
> Check your setting. I am 4G with 3200 Ram and result 22:48s also


hey...what settings exactly... how much ram do you have to be running 2t? i have 32 gig if you have more that might explain some of it
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Actually, I read that article stating it couldn't keep up with Intel's massive core chips, but if you look closely, it was only after Intel updated something that the 20% wild swings in scores occurred. This actually suggests it isn't the program, but Intel trying to game the benchmark, that is the real issue. It wasn't seen on AMD.
> 
> Meanwhile, if your getting more than a 20-60 point variance on TR between runs, your OC isn't stable. It is a very repeatable test with a decently low margin of error, unless you are not doing it right on TR.


nope totally disagree...i can make that benchmark fly all round the place by simply opening a window or closing it . it like 3dmark is *onlY8 a reference guide too many variables can screw it up.
if you want stagnant results try that vray one or corona 1.3 i have tested those till i,m blue in the face and the variance on them is very small(corona is a little more susceptible to outside influences but not as much as cb15)
Quote:


> [/
> Please double check, but If I remember correctly AMD recommend not to exceed 70CQUOTE]
> 
> actually it is 68 degrees tdie 95 tctl.
> that is the recommended i have found the cutoff is around 105 degrees tctl(give or take)
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> What LLC are you running?
> 
> 
> 
> on the taichi LLC 3
> 
> to give an idea at full load the chips is at 1.244 volts or 1.25 normal so pretty low droop and pretty even across the board
Click to expand...


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Looks Like You won the silicon lotto
> 
> look here
> 
> https://siliconlottery.com/collections/all/products/1950x395g


well then i am happy mine is [email protected]

might go try 3.95 at the same voltage and see what happens.

and another thing i, m a little confused about is the 3.8 chip on that site is $30 US less than retail?
i would understand selling at retail for a bit of a dud chip but not under...


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> hey...what settings exactly... how much ram do you have to be running 2t? i have 32 gig if you have more that might explain some of it
> nope totally disagree...i can make that benchmark fly all round the place by simply opening a window or closing it . it like 3dmark is *onlY8 a reference guide too many variables can screw it up.
> if you want stagnant results try that vray one or corona 1.3 i have tested those till i,m blue in the face and the variance on them is very small(corona is a little more susceptible to outside influences but not as much as cb15)
> on the taichi LLC 3
> 
> to give an idea at full load the chips is at 1.244 volts or 1.25 normal so pretty low droop and pretty even across the board


So you literally admit to changing testing conditions and getting different results? Do you understand that under the same conditions, not opening a window, etc., you get roughly the same result, within 1-2%. If you don't, you are experiencing a background process interfering, a throttle event, or something else to cause the variance. In fact, if you see no variance when trying to do other tasks in the other benchmark, then it is literally either not working it hard enough or some other reason! That makes me consider it less, even though I planned on trying it. You literally need sensitivity to outside influence to show it fully working! Do you not get that?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So you literally admit to changing testing conditions and getting different results? Do you understand that under the same conditions, not opening a window, etc., you get roughly the same result, within 1-2%. If you don't, you are experiencing a background process interfering, a throttle event, or something else to cause the variance. In fact, if you see no variance when trying to do other tasks in the other benchmark, then it is literally either not working it hard enough or some other reason! That makes me consider it less, even though I planned on trying it. You literally need sensitivity to outside influence to show it fully working! Do you not get that?


what i admit is that vray does not alter the result based on background processes but the others do.
cinebench also if you run it 5 times you will get 3 or so different results sometimes a few points sometimes 50 or more points and it is not to do with a stable overclock....some process starts up and screws it up without touching anything else.

i, m not saying anything is perfect i am just saying so far vray and corona have given me more even results,

as an example( and for the vray gpu totally blows my theory out of the water because that score is totally out of whack)
3950 1.25 llc3
all tests were done with the other applications open but of course not running at the same time.

now if you look upt a few you will see my vray test with me copying piles of data to other drives and the change is 1 second on the benchmark.
if i did that with cinebench i can guarantee you that results would be int he 100's of point slower.....so yes maybe one is more sensitive to background stuff but does that make it a better test than one that isn't?

realbench is another example the results for that in a 4 run loop can be totally and utterly different doing absolutely nothing on the computer...does it make it a bad benchmark...no...but it does not make it an accurate one and the same goes to firestrike and other tests.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> what i admit is that vray does not alter the result based on background processes but the others do.
> cinebench also if you run it 5 times you will get 3 or so different results sometimes a few points sometimes 50 or more points and it is not to do with a stable overclock....some process starts up and screws it up without touching anything else.
> 
> i, m not saying anything is perfect i am just saying so far vray and corona have given me more even results,
> 
> as an example( and for the vray gpu totally blows my theory out of the water because that score is totally out of whack)
> 3950 1.25 llc3
> all tests were done with the other applications open but of course not running at the same time.
> 
> now if you look upt a few you will see my vray test with me copying piles of data to other drives and the change is 1 second on the benchmark.
> if i did that with cinebench i can guarantee you that results would be int he 100's of point slower.....so yes maybe one is more sensitive to background stuff but does that make it a better test than one that isn't?
> 
> realbench is another example the results for that in a 4 run loop can be totally and utterly different doing absolutely nothing on the computer...does it make it a bad benchmark...no...but it does not make it an accurate one and the same goes to firestrike and other tests.


I see it the opposite. The variation actually helps in fine-grained tuning the way a bench not altered by other processes doesn't. Sure, the other can be more real life, but that doesn't necessarily mean it can be used beyond the bench to tune.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> I see it the opposite. The variation actually helps in fine-grained tuning the way a bench not altered by other processes doesn't. Sure, the other can be more real life, but that doesn't necessarily mean it can be used beyond the bench to tune.


and i fully understand your point of view.
mine is simply to compare real life running systems is impossible.
websites that do reviews for example most of the times do not post the full setup or just have a basic windows install with absolutely nothing else and that annoys the crap out of me...sure it makes it easier to create baselines but it isn't real world testing.

i went looking for nvme benches before i got this 960 evo 500 gig....90 percent of them were tested on empty drives blank nothing on them...who in the hell spends hundreds of dollars for a blank drive









one site i have noticed mostly video card though is babeltechreviews

http://www.babeltechreviews.com/vega-64-unleashed-27-games-tested-using-liquid-cooled-edition-vs-gtx-1080-gtx-1080-ti/view-all/

as an example. they spell out most of all they do including the control panel, this is sorely lacking in even some of the bigger sites.

that is wy i go to forums to see real life running systems running the hardware.

anyway that's my opinion








as for fine graining it can help but as i have said no 2 systems are the same so what works for one won't work for the other.

here's a few more results including pass mark.
i rely a lot on real bench to show me if something is a bit off or to test a an overclock....the heavy multitasking and encoding can bring the machine down pretty quick and a bad ram clock can murder the image editing (at least on my system in my testing)


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Yeah but it sounds identical to what a lot of people are experiencing in renderers. I pushed my CPU a lot in stress tests and benchmarks. It would never fail unless I tried rendering things (not even Cinebench would crash, but Cinema4D would). Not sure what is triggering it but it seems like MSI are aware of it. They told me to wait for the next BIOS update.


No improvement with turbo disabled. I ran memtest for nearly a day also with no errors. I'm using ECC memory anyway, so that is even less likely. I'm running the original release firmware because the newer version causes my machine to fail to complete POST, so I guess I'll have to just wait.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> and i fully understand your point of view.
> mine is simply to compare real life running systems is impossible.
> websites that do reviews for example most of the times do not post the full setup or just have a basic windows install with absolutely nothing else and that annoys the crap out of me...sure it makes it easier to create baselines but it isn't real world testing.
> 
> i went looking for nvme benches before i got this 960 evo 500 gig....90 percent of them were tested on empty drives blank nothing on them...who in the hell spends hundreds of dollars for a blank drive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> one site i have noticed mostly video card though is babeltechreviews
> 
> http://www.babeltechreviews.com/vega-64-unleashed-27-games-tested-using-liquid-cooled-edition-vs-gtx-1080-gtx-1080-ti/view-all/
> 
> as an example. they spell out most of all they do including the control panel, this is sorely lacking in even some of the bigger sites.
> 
> that is wy i go to forums to see real life running systems running the hardware.
> 
> anyway that's my opinion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as for fine graining it can help but as i have said no 2 systems are the same so what works for one won't work for the other.
> 
> here's a few more results including pass mark.
> i rely a lot on real bench to show me if something is a bit off or to test a an overclock....the heavy multitasking and encoding can bring the machine down pretty quick and a bad ram clock can murder the image editing (at least on my system in my testing)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


This is why I do a mix when tuning, just to be sure I get the optimal performance (maximal in one bench might be sub-optimal in another). It is to find the best blend of performance at tasks for what I do... Realbench I don't use as much, but planned on using more. It's just my validation already takes so damn long!!!


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*


Damn, your opencl score is high!


----------



## happyluckbox

I mean, its been opened already I would imagine? How else would they test it.

I'd much rather pay
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> well then i am happy mine is [email protected]
> 
> might go try 3.95 at the same voltage and see what happens.
> 
> and another thing i, m a little confused about is the 3.8 chip on that site is $30 US less than retail?
> i would understand selling at retail for a bit of a dud chip but not under...


I mean, its been opened already I would imagine? How else would they test it?

I'd much rather pay $30 more for an unopened 1950x with a very good chance of OC higher than 3.8ghz


----------



## hebrewbacon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Seems about right - 1.35v plus or minus 0.025v for 4 ghz and 1.25v for 3.9ghz. 4.1ghz often needs well north of 1.4v, common voltage wall after 4.05ghz.
> 
> FYI, I've benched superpi at 4.3ghz, so individual cores are certainly capable, I suspect it's the package holding higher all core clocks back.


I actually have mine running at 4.1 @ 1.381V and had it successfully pass Aida64 for about 6hrs and prime95 about the same. Memory is 3466 16-16-16-36. I got the GSkill 3600 CL16 memory but it introduces a lot of instability if I try running it at 3600.


----------



## mrrevit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> So I'm in the same boat as you.. 4.0 GHZ I'm stable for renderings and simulations with FumeFX and Vray and what not.. At 1.325v ... I try to get to 4.1 and I can manage sometimes to get threw the benchmark but I'm up at 1.4x volts which it gets running quite hot in that area. I was able to get 1.35v and 4.05ghz stable.. Will test a bit further. But my score was 3300 on Cinebench
> 
> 
> 
> Vray Benchmark Utility is another good one to run and I got 40.49 seconds on the CPU rendering part.


I downloaded Vray Benchmark Utility and was able to pull out a 39 second score at 4.1 ghz at 1.46875 volts.

The system is stable but my fans are all at full speed which makes my 100 sq ft room loud.

I did another attempt to run 3DS max using Arnold render engine and the system still froze.

I ran another test overclocked at 4.0 with voltage set to AUTO. I scored 40 seconds using Vray Benchmark Utility. I lowered my external fans to NORMAL mode and set my CPU to FULL SPEED and radiator fan to TURBO mode. I set my power plan back to BALANCED mode.

O well I think 4.0 is the sweet spot.


----------



## Djreversal

so I'm upgrading my 1080's to 1080 TI's .... My question for you, is no matter what I get I'm going to put EK water blocks on to just fit into my system and replace my current water cooled setup.... What I'm wondering is there any benefit to getting a like Founders editions vs one of the fancy overclock cards if I'm going to strip it and water cool it?? basically they should get pretty close to each other with overclocking correct?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> so I'm upgrading my 1080's to 1080 TI's .... My question for you, is no matter what I get I'm going to put EK water blocks on to just fit into my system and replace my current water cooled setup.... What I'm wondering is there any benefit to getting a like Founders editions vs one of the fancy overclock cards if I'm going to strip it and water cool it?? basically they should get pretty close to each other with overclocking correct?


Same as long as temps under control.


----------



## farcodev

Just for giggles, I've setup a VM just to test new versions of environments of development. I put 8 "cores" / 8gb RAM. I couldn't resist to do a benchmark and here I go









I just virtualized my "old" 3930K performance (at least for the CPU, the OpenGL bench smell well the VM gfx power)









I really love this new setup

NB: under VMWare 12.5.x and OGL is 28.65fps (sorry, bad photo focus)


----------



## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> hey...what settings exactly... how much ram do you have to be running 2t? i have 32 gig if you have more that might explain some of it


4x16GB RAM. however i dont think it make a big gap like 6 mins. Check your clock thortling during the test or not:thumb:


----------



## doyll

I tried a few searches but didn't find anything. Could someone please measure Threadripper and tell me how big the IHS surface area is?


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> I tried a few searches but didn't find anything. Could someone please measure Threadripper and tell me how big the IHS surface area is?


This is the only one I remember





edit: sorry you meant ihs.

"Threadripper feels different: It's huge, with the top of the IHS measuring at 68x51mm, and significantly wider on one axi"
http://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3013-amd-threadripper-thermalpaste-application-methods-benchmarked


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> This is the only one I remember
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit: sorry you meant ihs.
> 
> "Threadripper feels different: It's huge, with the top of the IHS measuring at 68x51mm, and significantly wider on one axi"
> http://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3013-amd-threadripper-thermalpaste-application-methods-benchmarked


Thanks. I've watched video and read article but they do not give measurements of IHS anywhere I could find. I was hoping someone with a digital micrometer could measure their IHS. I know the Asetek base is 53mm in diameter and I've scaled it's micro-fin area to about 30.8 x 26.54mm +/-1mm .. and I've scaled several images of IHS to be about 68 x 50.5 mm +/-1mm and I'm waiting for an old H80 to arrive to disassemble and take actual measurements of it's micro-fin area.

FYI, Bykski has a Threadripper waterblock that looks promising. Kyle Bennet posted about his.

Noctua has a couple of air coolers with large bases out too. Here is NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 compared to Floe Riing RGB 360
and here is NH-U140S-TR4-SP3 and normal NH-U14S showing TR4 version with bigger base running 10.5-11c cooler than normal base.


----------



## Particle

I'm using the NH-U14S myself with great results. I'm not overclocking because either my chip is a dud or the MSI board sucks at overclocking. Hard to say which so far. It wasn't even stable at 3.8 GHz with the default VID, unlike my 1700X which did 3.9 sans overvolt.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I'm using the NH-U14S myself with great results. I'm not overclocking because either my chip is a dud or the MSI board sucks at overclocking. Hard to say which so far. It wasn't even stable at 3.8 GHz with the default VID, unlike my 1700X which did 3.9 sans overvolt.


Yeah, the big base on NH-U14S makes it a real beast of an air cooler. Phanteks is not offering free TR4 mounts for their coolers but no big base cooler yet. I know Thermalright and Cryorig are working on it, but nothing yet.


----------



## Paprika

40 multiplier, 1.375V, LLC2, phases @ extreme and 2666mhz ram.
Perfectly stable for 20-ish runs in CB R15, but crashes after about 30 seconds into small FFTs in P95.
Need to crank the voltage a tiny bit, but need that there Watercool Heatkiller waterblock first.


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> Yeah, the big base on NH-U14S makes it a real beast of an air cooler. Phanteks is not offering free TR4 mounts for their coolers but no big base cooler yet. I know Thermalright and Cryorig are working on it, but nothing yet.


NH-U14S has issues on Asus Zenith Extreme, the PCI-E 1 is too close to socket, computer base article.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> Um, what's the Core Performance Boost? Is that disabling XFR on a stock 1950x?


Yep, Precision boost and XFR. With it off on a 1950X I got max ~3.4GHz.


----------



## happyluckbox

mt


----------



## e7balt

Given the high overclock temps I was experiencing (up to 83 degrees C) I decided to try removing the EK Threadripper block and check the thermal paste coverage. It seems like the coverage could have been better.




I cleaned the block and the CPU, then reapplied thermal paste by manually spreading it on the CPU using a card. I'm getting much better temps at load now. Overclocked to 4.0 Ghz and stable. Temps now are around 65 to 70 degrees C under full load. I'm still not happy with my fan configuration, still playing with the speed and configuration of the case fans and the Vardar 140 fans attached to the radiator. Right now the Vardar fans are pulling air through the radiator into the case. I might try reversing them so they are pushing air through the radiator and out of the case.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ocvn*
> 
> 4x16GB RAM. however i dont think it make a big gap like 6 mins. Check your clock thortling during the test or not:thumb:


hey been a bit busy ripping my dvd collection.
funny thing 2/3rds into gooseberry the computer locked up no restart no blue screen just a hard lock.
temps were not great 72 degrees and around 100 on tctl so it may have been an issue.
there was zero throttling up until that point so that's not the issue.

back to the weird thing...maybe its me but should that bench take 5 minutes..yes 5 minutes till it actually starts rendering.

i can't see the text that well on the 4k screen but it seemed to be syncing or initialising with little to no cpu power BUT 100 percent usage then the render actually started.
anyway apart form that one bench i am stills table at 3950 i have ripped 30 dvds since yesterday for an average of 300fps (around 9 minutes for a 2 hour movie) x264 no subs and the little quality slider on 23 so the size stays down but the qualities good.

i tried 265 and it takes twice as long is not much smaller and the quality was washed out crap







(probably my settings but hey i, m happy) and every now and then seeing 500fps is quite a sight.

so my best guess is i am not throwing *quite enough* juice into the chip for hard crore renders over a long period but for what i,m doing its fine and it keeps the temps down

also not sure if anyone has seen this the 1900x review.( thst through translate so if you speak zee germena feel free.
results look pretty much what i expected the 7820 is a better chip bu the platform is still behind









https://translate.google.com.au/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=https://www.computerbase.de/2017-09/ryzen-threadripper-1900x-core-i7-7820x-cpu-test/2/&prev=search


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hebrewbacon*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Seems about right - 1.35v plus or minus 0.025v for 4 ghz and 1.25v for 3.9ghz. 4.1ghz often needs well north of 1.4v, common voltage wall after 4.05ghz.
> 
> FYI, I've benched superpi at 4.3ghz, so individual cores are certainly capable, I suspect it's the package holding higher all core clocks back.
> 
> 
> 
> I actually have mine running at 4.1 @ 1.381V and had it successfully pass Aida64 for about 6hrs and prime95 about the same. Memory is 3466 16-16-16-36. I got the GSkill 3600 CL16 memory but it introduces a lot of instability if I try running it at 3600.
Click to expand...

You may find that you get more stable and better performance with lower latency if you run your kit at 3200 c14


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> so I'm upgrading my 1080's to 1080 TI's .... My question for you, is no matter what I get I'm going to put EK water blocks on to just fit into my system and replace my current water cooled setup.... What I'm wondering is there any benefit to getting a like Founders editions vs one of the fancy overclock cards if I'm going to strip it and water cool it?? basically they should get pretty close to each other with overclocking correct?


Any card that uses the reference PCB will be the easiest to find water blocks for if you are not fixed on EKWB.

If you have decided on EK as the water block provider then look to see what cards they are supporting and make your decision from there. I would suggest that in any card that you are looking at. Find the one you like and research what other models of that card use the same PCB and buy the cheapest one in the range. The expensive cards are priced that way because of the complexity of the cooler and the clock speed that the bios sets on the card by default. You are water cooling so the cooler is irrelevant and you can always flash the higher end model bios to the card yourself to get the faster default clocks.

A great example is the MSI Armour 1080TI. It is one of the cheapest 1080TI cards around, the stock cooler is rubbish and under specced for the GPU but you will remove that anyway. Importantly though it uses the same PCB as the Gaming X range of cards which is a good base board with a good VRM. Asus does the similar things with their range of cards, as I am sure the others do as well.


----------



## Machiyariko

Finally got my 1900x installed and up and running.

I'm using the ASUS Prime X399-A and an EVGA 280 AIO.

After 30 minutes of messing around I got to 4.2 all core and 3600 on the memory.
Temps are in the low 50s during some quick Cinebench and Superposition runs.

I'll post some overclocking screenshots tomorrow but here are a few shots of the chip from earlier in the day.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *e7balt*
> 
> Given the high overclock temps I was experiencing (up to 83 degrees C) I decided to try removing the EK Threadripper block and check the thermal paste coverage. It seems like the coverage could have been better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cleaned the block and the CPU, then reapplied thermal paste by manually spreading it on the CPU using a card. I'm getting much better temps at load now. Overclocked to 4.0 Ghz and stable. Temps now are around 65 to 70 degrees C under full load. I'm still not happy with my fan configuration, still playing with the speed and configuration of the case fans and the Vardar 140 fans attached to the radiator. Right now the Vardar fans are pulling air through the radiator into the case. I might try reversing them so they are pushing air through the radiator and out of the case.


These types of fans are most efficient Pushing air through the radiator rather than pulling air. The the aerodynamic qualities of static pressure blades are designed to push air through restrictive pathway rather then draw from a partial vacuum

Also water loop radiators will run slightly more efficiently if they are drawing cold air from outside the case as an intake as opposed to running them as an exhaust. You might find you get better performance sandwiching the fans between the case and the rad and using it as an intake


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> Finally got my 1900x installed and up and running.
> 
> I'm using the ASUS Prime X399-A and an EVGA 280 AIO.
> 
> After 30 minutes of messing around I got to 4.2 all core and 3600 on the memory.
> Temps are in the low 50s during some quick Cinebench and Superposition runs.
> 
> I'll post some overclocking screenshots tomorrow but here are a few shots of the chip from earlier in the day.


I am looking forward to seeing how it goes. What voltage did you need to get the 4.2Ghz?

Have you managed to work out if it is using two cores on four CCX modules or is it running 4 cores on two CCX modules?


----------



## Machiyariko

I am pretty sure it is running 4 cores on 2 CCX modules.
I think that Gamers Nexus confirmed this.

I have the voltage on auto and it's about 1.45.

Here are some screenshots because I can't sleep with this machine sitting here not being overclocked all night...
The memory timings are on auto and are terrible. I'm going to try and adjust them a little next, as well as work on the voltages.

More to come.


----------



## happyluckbox

So um yeah. Newegg has the liqtech tr4 in stock. Get it while its good. Just ordered mine


----------



## Machiyariko

Last update for the night.
I manually set the voltage to 1.35 and it's looking pretty good.
I also tightened the timings on the memory.

Not too bad for a few hours work.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> These types of fans are most efficient Pushing air through the radiator rather than pulling air. The the aerodynamic qualities of static pressure blades are designed to push air through restrictive pathway rather then draw from a partial vacuum
> 
> Also water loop radiators will run slightly more efficiently if they are drawing cold air from outside the case as an intake as opposed to running them as an exhaust. You might find you get better performance sandwiching the fans between the case and the rad and using it as an intake


In my experience most fans benefit from approximately 8mm spacer between fan and radiator in push mode and 10-12 mm spacer on pull mode.
This increases performance and lowers noise levels, especially in pull mode. I think this is because the fan motor mounting frame offsets the fan impeller in house so it only has 1-2 mm clearance on intake side of fan but 6-8 mm on exhaust side of fan.

Edit: If anyone can measure the IHS and let me know it's size it would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> I am pretty sure it is running 4 cores on 2 CCX modules.
> I think that Gamers Nexus confirmed this.
> 
> I have the voltage on auto and it's about 1.45.
> 
> Here are some screenshots because I can't sleep with this machine sitting here not being overclocked all night...
> The memory timings are on auto and are terrible. I'm going to try and adjust them a little next, as well as work on the voltages.
> 
> More to come.


I know Gamers nexus said that it was 4+4 but there has also been places that were adamant it was 2+2+2+2 and that has always made not a lot of sense to me.

4 cores with 2 CCX modules certainly makes the most sense from a memory latency perspective and The 16MB L3 Cache matches up with only 2 CCX being in use.

What cooler are you running and what temps are you getting with both the auto and manual voltage? 4.2Ghz at 1.35 bodes well though.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> These types of fans are most efficient Pushing air through the radiator rather than pulling air. The the aerodynamic qualities of static pressure blades are designed to push air through restrictive pathway rather then draw from a partial vacuum
> 
> Also water loop radiators will run slightly more efficiently if they are drawing cold air from outside the case as an intake as opposed to running them as an exhaust. You might find you get better performance sandwiching the fans between the case and the rad and using it as an intake
> 
> 
> 
> In my experience most fans benefit from approximately 8mm spacer between fan and radiator in push mode and 10-12 mm spacer on pull mode.
> This increases performance and lowers noise levels, especially in pull mode. I think this is because the fan motor mounting frame offsets the fan impeller in house so it only has 1-2 mm clearance on intake side of fan but 6-8 mm on exhaust side of fan.
> 
> Edit: If anyone can measure the IHS and let me know it's size it would be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

Yes spacers do help. You may well be right about the offset. A spacer also helps alleviate the dead spot caused by the fan hub

IHS is 68x51mm


----------



## Joeteck

The people in this thread are very fortunate to be able to buy a piece of history. AMD making a huge breakthrough with having the best value CPU @ 16 cores. I am a proud owner of the 1950x CPU!

I am very impressed with my 1950x. Not sure if this is allowed, but I have created 15 YouTube video's related to the 1950x Threadripper.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLfI2QxLGIrRRPLEMfMV97Eb7geosoMQHT

Especially the one on how to fix the Windows 10 install crash bug.


----------



## happyluckbox

so i see a ton of guides saying 1.35ish vcore max for stable 24/7 overclock.

My question is, is this referring to vcore set in bios and while cpu is at idle?

Because I see all these people hitting 4ghz+ by running vcore at 1.30-1.35,but then setting llc to level 3 or higher, in effect making their actual vcore under load 1.4-1.45.

So is this safe? Because if thats what you guys are actually doing to reach 4ghz+ then I need to try it out. This whole time I firgured people meant safe vcore 1.35 at LOAD already factoring in llc


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> so i see a ton of guides saying 1.35ish vcore max for stable 24/7 overclock.
> 
> My question is, is this referring to vcore set in bios and while cpu is at idle?
> 
> Because I see all these people hitting 4ghz+ by running vcore at 1.30-1.35,but then setting llc to level 3 or higher, in effect making their actual vcore under load 1.4-1.45.
> 
> So is this safe? Because if thats what you guys are actually doing to reach 4ghz+ then I need to try it out. This whole time I firgured people meant safe vcore 1.35 at LOAD already factoring in llc


If the corecomplexes etc are the "best of the best" from Ryzen, I'd say up to 1.4v could be seen as "safe" if you have sufficient cooling. I'd rather have a higher vcore and no/auto llc if anything.

Also, finally managed to get 2800Mhz stable on my 32GB 3000Mhz Vengeance RGB kit. Just needed to up the ProCODT to 68.5ohm.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Yes spacers do help. You may well be right about the offset. A spacer also helps alleviate the dead spot caused by the fan hub
> 
> IHS is 68x51mm


Thanks! +rep I had scaled it at 67-69 x 50.5-51.5 mm so not to far off.









Now to find out what the CPU dies and spacers size and placement are and I'll have all the measurement data needed for cooler base sizing.

I took the bottom off of an Asetek H80 (maybe H80i).
Copper base measures to be 53mm.
'O'-ring at widest parts of circle about 48mm, & about 40.5mm where it loops in round screw mounting holes.
Micro-fin are is about 30.6 x 25.4mm.


In my opinion that is not big enough to do a good job of drawing heat from Thjreadripper's CPU dies. I don't know the exact size if dies or their spacing, but I'm guessing it has to be bigger than a 53mm diameter base will cover .. and that is entire Aseteck base, not even the are inside of seal .. and micro-fin area is only a small portion of that.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> If the corecomplexes etc are the "best of the best" from Ryzen, I'd say up to 1.4v could be seen as "safe" if you have sufficient cooling. I'd rather have a higher vcore and no/auto llc if anything.
> 
> Also, finally managed to get 2800Mhz stable on my 32GB 3000Mhz Vengeance RGB kit. Just needed to up the ProCODT to 68.5ohm.


Wait what? this seems contradictory to everything ive read. I thought you wanted to have as low vcore as possible, and to have llc set to a high level to compensate. that way, you get voltage when you need it, and at idle your voltage is reduced?

Is using a higher base vcore more stable or something?


----------



## ocvn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joeteck*
> 
> The people in this thread are very fortunate to be able to buy a piece of history. AMD making a huge breakthrough with having the best value CPU @ 16 cores. I am a proud owner of the 1950x CPU!
> 
> I am very impressed with my 1950x. Not sure if this is allowed, but I have created 15 YouTube video's related to the 1950x Threadripper.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLfI2QxLGIrRRPLEMfMV97Eb7geosoMQHT
> 
> Especially the one on how to fix the Windows 10 install crash bug.


GG release F3d beta bios which fixing the install 10 crash bug, check their website:thumb:


----------



## Joeteck

I got 3168 with my 1950x stock voltages @ 3.741Ghz


----------



## Joeteck

No need, just turn off IOMMU, which is probably what they did and called the BIOS a new name.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I know Gamers nexus said that it was 4+4 but there has also been places that were adamant it was 2+2+2+2 and that has always made not a lot of sense to me.
> 
> 4 cores with 2 CCX modules certainly makes the most sense from a memory latency perspective and The 16MB L3 Cache matches up with only 2 CCX being in use.
> 
> What cooler are you running and what temps are you getting with both the auto and manual voltage? 4.2Ghz at 1.35 bodes well though.


TR only has two etched dies in it, so 2+2+2+2 isn't even an option. It's 4+4 or bust.


----------



## Machiyariko

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I know Gamers nexus said that it was 4+4 but there has also been places that were adamant it was 2+2+2+2 and that has always made not a lot of sense to me.
> 
> 4 cores with 2 CCX modules certainly makes the most sense from a memory latency perspective and The 16MB L3 Cache matches up with only 2 CCX being in use.
> 
> What cooler are you running and what temps are you getting with both the auto and manual voltage? 4.2Ghz at 1.35 bodes well though.


I am using the EVGA 280 CLC with stock fans.
The auto voltage seems to work a little better than the 1.35 that I had set. The temps are unaffected by the change.
The temps are around 30c idle and 54c load with during a CB15 run. 25c ambient according to my case inlet probe.
I'm pretty sure these numbers may be wrong as that seems pretty low.
I'm going to look into it some more.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> Thanks! +rep I had scaled it at 67-69 x 50.5-51.5 mm so not to far off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now to find out what the CPU dies and spacers size and placement are and I'll have all the measurement data needed for cooler base sizing.
> 
> I took the bottom off of an Asetek H80 (maybe H80i).
> Copper base measures to be 53mm.
> 'O'-ring at widest parts of circle about 48mm, & about 40.5mm where it loops in round screw mounting holes.
> Micro-fin are is about 3.6 x 25.4mm.
> 
> In my opinion that is not big enough to do a good job of drawing heat from Thjreadripper's CPU dies. I don't know the exact size if dies or their spacing, but I'm guessing it has to be bigger than a 53mm diameter base will cover .. and that is entire Aseteck base, not even the are inside of seal .. and micro-fin area is only a small portion of that.


no you are right they are too small BUT they do work as i have shown with my h115i

at stock settings it cools it just fine even running prime 95 small ffts...i do not hit 70 degrees
overclocked a whole other kettle of fish...i hit 78 degrees pretty quick at 4g 1.3 volts only ran it for 20 minutes did not like the temps








but
normal running on anything but huge renders it was still stable.
now at 3950 1.25 llc3 so at full load 1.244v it passes everything except gooseberry (so far) i have yet to test it on prime 95 ffts because i am pretty sure it will fail due to not quite enough juice BUT i ahev ripped nearly 30 dvds from my collection since yesterday and temps are not going past 62 and that is with other thing si a m doing at the same time.

so while not *ideal* especially overclocked i is workable.
i did notice especially on the gamers nexus video... that the position of the fins(micro channels i think they are called) matter quite a bit....mine are line up from the bottom to the top so they make the best contact but maybe some of the asetek are oriented differently and that could make a big difference.(my opinion not base don empirical evidence







)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joeteck*
> 
> The people in this thread are very fortunate to be able to buy a piece of history. AMD making a huge breakthrough with having the best value CPU @ 16 cores. I am a proud owner of the 1950x CPU!
> 
> I am very impressed with my 1950x. Not sure if this is allowed, but I have created 15 YouTube video's related to the 1950x Threadripper.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLfI2QxLGIrRRPLEMfMV97Eb7geosoMQHT
> 
> Especially the one on how to fix the Windows 10 install crash bug.


thanks for those i will have a look through them.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I know Gamers nexus said that it was 4+4 but there has also been places that were adamant it was 2+2+2+2 and that has always made not a lot of sense to me.
> 
> 4 cores with 2 CCX modules certainly makes the most sense from a memory latency perspective and The 16MB L3 Cache matches up with only 2 CCX being in use.
> 
> What cooler are you running and what temps are you getting with both the auto and manual voltage? 4.2Ghz at 1.35 bodes well though.


well done the other dude first actual real setup i have seen.

now back to this ccx stuff...what actual software will show this...
from what i am seeing it is behaving very much like a 1800x in the only review i have seen... a little quicker because of the quad channel ram.. a little slower in others.

this is translated so feel free to learn german.

https://translate.google.com.au/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=https://www.computerbase.de/2017-09/ryzen-threadripper-1900x-core-i7-7820x-cpu-test/2/&prev=search


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ocvn*
> 
> 4x16GB RAM. however i dont think it make a big gap like 6 mins. Check your clock thortling during the test or not:thumb:


ok ran it again at 3950 1.3v and it passed.
but really don't want to do that again till i sort out better cooling.
never throttled never died BUT 77 degrees is scary.

now one thing is max memory says 6911 meg or 7 gig....how much does yours show using(i,ll hunt for your pic and look)


now in saying all that watched a video review of the new tr4 enemax 360 and apart from not liking the guy or him throwing the block at the rad, with his volts and clocks the temps make more sense, only problem is his idea of testing was 3 runs of cb15 and prime 95 blend.

what i would suggest is waterboard the thing with this friggen goosebury blend....honestly i was going to call the UN and have it banned as a weapon of mass destruction







nothing so far has taxed the system more than that bench.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> what i would suggest is waterboard the thing with this friggen goosebury blend....honestly i was going to call the UN and have it banned as a weapon of mass destruction
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nothing so far has taxed the system more than that bench.


Well, I run renders like that alot (and 6+ hour Premiere/AE workflows) so that's going to be my 1950x's life


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Well, I run renders like that alot (and 6+ hour Premiere/AE workflows) so that's going to be my 1950x's life


and more power to you








until i get the cooling sorted this is the last run of that evil bastard i do BUT i did it(seems my version of blender o setup or something was bjorked)

feel free to ignore the fact i was sitting around 80 degrees...again...scary BUT 23.15 so i,m happy


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> no you are right they are too small BUT they do work as i have shown with my h115i
> 
> at stock settings it cools it just fine even running prime 95 small ffts...i do not hit 70 degrees
> overclocked a whole other kettle of fish...i hit 78 degrees pretty quick at 4g 1.3 volts only ran it for 20 minutes did not like the temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but
> normal running on anything but huge renders it was still stable.
> now at 3950 1.25 llc3 so at full load 1.244v it passes everything except gooseberry (so far) i have yet to test it on prime 95 ffts because i am pretty sure it will fail due to not quite enough juice BUT i ahev ripped nearly 30 dvds from my collection since yesterday and temps are not going past 62 and that is with other thing si a m doing at the same time.
> 
> so while not *ideal* especially overclocked i is workable.
> i did notice especially on the gamers nexus video... that the position of the fins(micro channels i think they are called) matter quite a bit....mine are line up from the bottom to the top so they make the best contact but maybe some of the asetek are oriented differently and that could make a big difference.(my opinion not base don empirical evidence
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


GamersNexus did an A/B comparison test of new NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 and non-TR4 and found 10.5-11c difference
Quote:


> Testing was fairly straight-forward in this one - we're not reviewing the cooler today, just looking at coldplate A/B performance.
> 
> TR 1950X CPU fixed to 34x multiplier, 1.243 Vcore fixed voltage
> ASUS Zenith Extreme X399 motherboard
> 32GB GSkill Trident Z RGB 3200MHz
> GTX 1080 Ti FTW3
> Thermaltake Toughpower 1200W
> Test NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 vs NH-U14S
> 
> http://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3029-quick-ab-test-impact-tr4-coldplate-size-with-noctua


Comparing the Asetek base to approx 39x43mm size of normal NH-U14S I think it is a reasonable guess to say Asetek base will be about 10c warmer than a full cover waterblock of similar design will be. I think 10c difference will translate into a significant difference in overclock with temps safe for 24/7 use.

I think AMD made a big mistake by backing Asetek CLCs for Threadripper instead of requiring a full cover block, but that's only my opinion.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I know Gamers nexus said that it was 4+4 but there has also been places that were adamant it was 2+2+2+2 and that has always made not a lot of sense to me.
> 
> 4 cores with 2 CCX modules certainly makes the most sense from a memory latency perspective and The 16MB L3 Cache matches up with only 2 CCX being in use.
> 
> What cooler are you running and what temps are you getting with both the auto and manual voltage? 4.2Ghz at 1.35 bodes well though.
> 
> 
> 
> TR only has two etched dies in it, so 2+2+2+2 isn't even an option. It's 4+4 or bust.
Click to expand...

Sure it is. I was speaking in terms of core distribution across CCX modules, not dies

You have two x 4 core CCX modules on each die, if the die is fully populated like on a 1950X. AMD have a choice of enabling 4 cores and the associated 8GB L3 Cache on a single CCX on each of the dies or 2 cores on two CCX modules and disabling half the L3 cache for each CCX module on each die.

The reason that I ask is that to me, running the 4 cores on a single CCX makes more sense because of the reduced latency switching threads within the same ccx module, however, with the launch of the 4 core Ryzen R5 chips, they were adamant that those chips were using two cores from each CCX module. I am trying to determine if sanity has prevailed at AMD or not.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Yes spacers do help. You may well be right about the offset. A spacer also helps alleviate the dead spot caused by the fan hub
> 
> IHS is 68x51mm
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! +rep I had scaled it at 67-69 x 50.5-51.5 mm so not to far off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now to find out what the CPU dies and spacers size and placement are and I'll have all the measurement data needed for cooler base sizing.
> 
> I took the bottom off of an Asetek H80 (maybe H80i).
> Copper base measures to be 53mm.
> 'O'-ring at widest parts of circle about 48mm, & about 40.5mm where it loops in round screw mounting holes.
> Micro-fin are is about 3.6 x 25.4mm.
> 
> In my opinion that is not big enough to do a good job of drawing heat from Thjreadripper's CPU dies. I don't know the exact size if dies or their spacing, but I'm guessing it has to be bigger than a 53mm diameter base will cover .. and that is entire Aseteck base, not even the are inside of seal .. and micro-fin area is only a small portion of that.
Click to expand...

I can tell you now that the gen 5 asetek coolers are supported by AMD and the Threadripper chips come with a mounting bracket for the Asetek coolers. They do work best if the entire copper base of the waterblock is covered in thermal paste instead of the factory applied paste.

The copper base does not cover the entire heat spreader. It does cover the area of the heatspreader that is in contact with the dies though so they will cool the chip to the point where it is usable but likely to be a part cause in limiting the overclock potential of the chips.

These Asetek AIO coolers are a compromise to fill an interim need for coolers that will be quickly surpassed with made for TR4 specific coolers coming to market, a full cover block has been demonstrated to be significantly more efficient.

The new Noctua Air coolers that are specifically designed for TR4 cover the entire IHS and work significantly better than the older ones that were designed for the smaller IHS chips.

Enermax has produced a new model AIO that the block covers the TR4 size IHS. That is the only one that I am aware of so far. From what I have seen here, the few people that have bought them are not complaining but I have yet to see any reviews either. If you want an AIO and are not planning on building a custom loop soon, the Enermax models are probably the best choice at the moment. http://www.enermax.com/home.php?fn=eng/product_a1&lv0=109&lv1=118

The new custom Waterblocks that are TR4 specific, from places like EKWB, Bykski, XSPC are much better at cooling the chips than the older smaller versions


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> no you are right they are too small BUT they do work as i have shown with my h115i
> 
> at stock settings it cools it just fine even running prime 95 small ffts...i do not hit 70 degrees
> overclocked a whole other kettle of fish...i hit 78 degrees pretty quick at 4g 1.3 volts only ran it for 20 minutes did not like the temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but
> normal running on anything but huge renders it was still stable.
> now at 3950 1.25 llc3 so at full load 1.244v it passes everything except gooseberry (so far) i have yet to test it on prime 95 ffts because i am pretty sure it will fail due to not quite enough juice BUT i ahev ripped nearly 30 dvds from my collection since yesterday and temps are not going past 62 and that is with other thing si a m doing at the same time.
> 
> so while not *ideal* especially overclocked i is workable.
> i did notice especially on the gamers nexus video... that the position of the fins(micro channels i think they are called) matter quite a bit....mine are line up from the bottom to the top so they make the best contact but maybe some of the asetek are oriented differently and that could make a big difference.(my opinion not base don empirical evidence
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> GamersNexus did an A/B comparison test of new NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 and non-TR4 and found 10.5-11c difference
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Testing was fairly straight-forward in this one - we're not reviewing the cooler today, just looking at coldplate A/B performance.
> 
> TR 1950X CPU fixed to 34x multiplier, 1.243 Vcore fixed voltage
> ASUS Zenith Extreme X399 motherboard
> 32GB GSkill Trident Z RGB 3200MHz
> GTX 1080 Ti FTW3
> Thermaltake Toughpower 1200W
> Test NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 vs NH-U14S
> 
> http://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3029-quick-ab-test-impact-tr4-coldplate-size-with-noctua
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Comparing the Asetek base to approx 39x43mm size of normal NH-U14S I think it is a reasonable guess to say Asetek base will be about 10c warmer than a full cover waterblock of similar design will be. I think 10c difference will translate into a significant difference in overclock with temps safe for 24/7 use.
> 
> I think AMD made a big mistake by backing Asetek CLCs for Threadripper instead of requiring a full cover block, but that's only my opinion.
Click to expand...

As a stop gap measure, I really don't think that they had a choice short of supplying their own AIO coolers with the CPU. That extra $100 per CPU would have priced themselves out of the market


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I can tell you now that the gen 5 asetek coolers are supported by AMD and the Threadripper chips come with a mounting bracket for the Asetek coolers. They do work best if the entire copper base of the waterblock is covered in thermal paste instead of the factory applied paste.
> 
> The copper base does not cover the entire heat spreader. It does cover the area of the heatspreader that is in contact with the dies though so they will cool the chip to the point where it is usable but likely to be a part cause in limiting the overclock potential of the chips.
> 
> These Asetek AIO coolers are a compromise to fill an interim need for coolers that will be quickly surpassed with made for TR4 specific coolers coming to market, a full cover block has been demonstrated to be significantly more efficient.
> 
> The new Noctua Air coolers that are specifically designed for TR4 cover the entire IHS and work significantly better than the older ones that were designed for the smaller IHS chips.
> 
> Enermax has produced a new model AIO that the block covers the TR4 size IHS. That is the only one that I am aware of so far. From what I have seen here, the few people that have bought them are not complaining but I have yet to see any reviews either. If you want an AIO and are not planning on building a custom loop soon, the Enermax models are probably the best choice at the moment. http://www.enermax.com/home.php?fn=eng/product_a1&lv0=109&lv1=118
> 
> The new custom Waterblocks that are TR4 specific, from places like EKWB, Bykski, XSPC are much better at cooling the chips than the older smaller versions


I'm not sure what you are trying to say. Much of what you posted is in my post you quoted.

Asetek Gen 5 are little different than Gen 1, 2, 3 or 4.

I agree Asetek CLCs (and other CLCs or top tier air coolers with nothing more than a TR4 SP3 mount) will cool similar to what you are experiencing. My point is the a full cover base like NH-U14S-TR4-SP3, NH-U12S-TR4-SP3 & NH-U9 TR4-SP3 were announced 2 August 2017 and are at least as good or better options then Asetek.

I agree the new waterblocks now showing up for use are much better options, but obviously were not available even a few weeks ago.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> As a stop gap measure, I really don't think that they had a choice short of supplying their own AIO coolers with the CPU. That extra $100 per CPU would have priced themselves out of the market


I agree that it is stop gap measure, but the cost of this stop gap CLC is more than NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 is .. My point being I have seen nothing from Asetek or AMD that in any way indicates it is a stop gap measure that we all know it is, and that to me makes it kind of a sneaky way to sell product.









but even as a stop gap Asetek base is imaginal at best .. I think proven by NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 being 10.5-11c cooler than normal cc42x44mm contact base NH-U14S .. Asetek is 53mm diameter with cc30.6x25.4mm fin area .. smaller than 42x44mm Noctua base.

Here are measurements of TR4 dies in black with Asetek overlay in green


Bits of trivia about when TR4-SP3 mounts and coolers were announced:

Noctua announded TR4-SP3 coolers 2 August 2017
Phanteks announced TR4-SP3 mount upgrade September 6th, 2017, but so far nothing on their websites about it.

Same day they announced Glacier C399a block for Threadripper 6 September 2017.
Swiftech has TR4 mounts too 11 August 2017.
So it's not like Asetek is only fish in the pond so to speak








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> As a stop gap measure, I really don't think that they had a choice short of supplying their own AIO coolers with the CPU. That extra $100 per CPU would have priced themselves out of the market


As shown above, several other options have been available for some time .. even more now.


----------



## amigafan2003

Ooof


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> 
> 22:43s.
> 
> If anyone else feels brave enough to have a go, file is @ https://download.blender.org/demo/test/benchmark.zip


Here's mine (@3.7Ghz / 1.25V / 2666Mhz DRAM) 29:22.86


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Ooof


Damn O damn


----------



## pmc25

What I don't understand about that Computerbase look at the 1900X is that it's using almost as much power as a 1920X under load.

Way more than an 1800X.

I don't see how this can be, given very similar clocks.

Is it really feeding the dummy dies with juice?

Also should be mentioned that they only used DDR4-2666 .. which is a huge handicap for Ryzen. At 3200-3600 for both it and the Intel platform, I suspect the 1900X would have been a lot faster in games than it appeared.

One more thing ... the Windows scheduler and / or Windows software still using 'genuine Intel' identifiers still seems to be a potential problem for AMD.

The 1900X beats the 7820X even in Uniengine Heaven under Linux (and everything else).


----------



## Particle

I don't know if anyone is doing the Ryzen Blender benchmark anymore, but this is my run. CPU and RAM are both at stock frequencies. I'm running 32 GB of DDR4-2400 ECC/U.

13.04 seconds


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I don't know if anyone is doing the Ryzen Blender benchmark anymore, but this is my run. CPU and RAM are both at stock frequencies. I'm running 32 GB of DDR4-2400 ECC/U.
> 
> 13.04 seconds


Is that the proper file - 150 samples?


----------



## The L33t

The "only" problem with the Enermax TR AIO is their warranty (two years over here) compared to NZXT 6 years and corsair 5 I think.

But bigger still is the lack of any insurance/policy regarding leaks... I for one can't find any info.

The chances are few for leaks but they do happen, as far as corsair and nzxt I know where they stand.

I hope more players design a solution for TR other than Enermax...


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> The "only" problem with the Enermax TR AIO is their warranty (two years over here) compared to NZXT 6 years and corsair 5 I think.
> 
> But bigger still is the lack of any insurance/policy regarding leaks... I for one can't find any info.
> 
> The chances are few for leaks but they do happen, as far as corsair and nzxt I know where they stand.
> 
> I hope more players design a solution for TR other than Enermax...


'You know where they stand' .. what does that mean? Does it mean you've read somewhere that they will replace damaged components? I know what consumer rights in EU and USA are and also know Corsair only does what is required by law. Their warranty even says that in all capital letters. I also know of several people who had water damage from their CLCs and how much hell they had to go through to get enough money to replace damaged components .. and the money they did get was at best only enough tobuy similar used componentss at most, usually not even that much.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> 'You know where they stand' .. what does that mean? Does it mean you've read somewhere that they will replace damaged components? I know what consumer rights in EU and USA are and also know Corsair only does what is required by law. Their warranty even says that in all capital letters. I also know of several people who had water damage from their CLCs and how much hell they had to go through to get enough money to replace damaged components .. and the money they did get was at best only enough tobuy similar used componentss at most, usually not even that much.


I mean both have stated publicly their policies regarding leaks. You say Corsair only does what the law says, yet their warranty is well above the minimum for both EU and certainly the US.

Even if they fight you a bit, or as you say, make it hard, one thing is clear, both have more than doubled the warranty you have in the Enermax and the asetek pumps are not what anyone can call... Reliable. They fail quite frequently.

No brand is perfect, I have no illusions about that now that corsair exchanged owners.. It might even be worst, but you do know cases where the issues where resolved, so, you also know here they stand. How difficult they are etc.. That is something you take into account when purchasing something, as do I.

And what I know is Enermax could do with a longer warranty period at the very least.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> I mean both have stated publicly their policies regarding leaks. You say Corsair only does what the law says, yet their warranty is well above the minimum for both EU and certainly the US.
> 
> Even if they fight you a bit, or as you say, make it hard, one thing is clear, both have more than doubled the warranty you have in the Enermax and the asetek pumps are not what anyone can call... Reliable. They fail quite frequently.
> 
> No brand is perfect, I have no illusions about that now that corsair exchanged owners.. It might even be worst, but you do know cases where the issues where resolved, so, you also know here they stand. How difficult they are etc.. That is something you take into account when purchasing something, as do I.
> 
> And what I know is Enermax could do with a longer warranty period at the very least.


Quote direct from Corsair warranty complete with capital letters:
Quote:


> *Limitation of Liability*
> CORSAIR SHALL NOT BE LIABLE FOR ANY SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL, INDIRECT, OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES WHATSOEVER, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO LOSS OF PROFITS, REVENUE, OR DATA (WHETHER DIRECT OR INDIRECT) OR COMMERCIAL LOSS FOR BREACH OF ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTY ON YOUR PRODUCT EVEN IF CORSAIR HAS BEEN ADVISED PREVIOUSLY OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES. Some local laws do not allow the exclusion or limitation of special, indirect, incidental or consequential damages, so this limitation or exclusion may not apply in your jurisdiction.


The last sentence contradicts your claim of 'their warranty is well above the minimum' required by law.
You can read it for yourself, just open the below link:
http://www.corsair.com/en-gb/support/warranty


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> Quote direct from Corsair warranty complete with capital letters:
> You can read it for yourself, just open the below link:
> http://www.corsair.com/en-gb/support/warranty
> http://www.corsair.com/en-gb/support/warranty


I have read all of this and the same goes for NZXT(much of the same). That is why I used the word "stated". Meaning reps and actual cases, resolved I may add.

Like I said. I know where they stand (good and bad), I named two brands I know *exactly* how those issues where handled. And it is always a case by case involving some investigation of course.

And again, like I said, I could not find any info (good or bad) about Enermax regarding this, nothing, nada... Maybe they never had a leak? Maybe they did but it was not public in anyway... Who knows.. That is exactly what I meant. No history.

Other than that you cannot argue the longer warrant period. It just is. And that is standing behind your product don't you think? I've seen quite a few replacements after two years on Corsair units.. That my friend would not be possible with an Enermax.

I will argue this no further. Let's just all be happy to have options, I for one choose NZXT, taking their history into account and the way they deal with issues like these and customers in general. Just like I would with an EVGA for that matter. Great customer service.
Quote:


> The last sentence contradicts your claim of 'their warranty is well above the minimum' required by law.


And no contradiction at all regarding those brands going above what their obligations are. Over here in my country they have to give me two years only. I have 6. Since 6 is more than 2...no contradiction.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> Quote direct from Corsair warranty complete with capital letters:
> The last sentence contradicts your claim of 'their warranty is well above the minimum' required by law.
> You can read it for yourself, just open the below link:
> http://www.corsair.com/en-gb/support/warranty


Per the final sentence, that waiver does not apply to EU countries. You appear to be in the UK though, which supposedly is to leave the EU, so if that happens, it's now unclear what will be the case for the UK market in 2019.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> I have read all of this and the same goes for NZXT(much of the same). That is why I used the word "stated". Meaning reps and actual cases, resolved I may add.
> 
> Like I said. I know where they stand (good and bad), I named two brands I know *exactly* how those issues where handled. And it is always a case by case involving some investigation of course.
> 
> And again, like I said, I could not find any info (good or bad) about Enermax regarding this, nothing, nada... Maybe they never had a leak? Maybe they did but it was not public in anyway... Who knows.. That is exactly what I meant. No history.
> 
> Other than that you cannot argue the longer warrant period. It just is. And that is standing behind your product don't you think? I've seen quite a few replacements after two years on Corsair units.. That my friend would not be possible with an Enermax.
> 
> I will argue this no further. Let's just all be happy to have options, I for one choose NZXT, taking their history into account and the way they deal with issues like these and customers in general. Just like I would with an EVGA for that matter. Great customer service.


No argument at all. Longer warranty periods do not mean better quality or longer life expectancy. It's not about 'standing behind their product' but about getting customers to think product is better by getting them to believe it will last longer with a longer warranty. Many Corsail CLC owners with 2+ year old CLCs don't bother to RMA them .. They simply buy a new cooler and move on .. and that is what companies count on to beat the odds with long warranty not being used by owners will not use it.









You might find this asetek OEM link of interest
http://www.asetek.com/oems/where-to-buy/

And this gamersnexus link too
http://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/2122-who-actually-makes-liquid-coolers-oems


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Per the final sentence, that waiver does not apply to EU countries. You appear to be in the UK though, which supposedly is to leave the EU, so if that happens, it's now unclear what will be the case for the UK market in 2019.


True. Just as an example, where I live (Portugal) the minimum for electronic consumer goods is two years, AND, if such product is replaced during warranty, the new(or refur) product had two full years of warranty. Some brands like Apple tried and argued the warranty would only be the remaining period from the original product.. Like it said, tried. They had no luck. Law is law.

The warranty shall be the remainder only when the product is repaired and not substituted. If the main board is changed (imei / serial) that is considered a new product.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Per the final sentence, that waiver does not apply to EU countries. You appear to be in the UK though, which supposedly is to leave the EU, so if that happens, it's now unclear what will be the case for the UK market in 2019.


Last sentence is there because EU and USA law requires them to say local law overrides any statement they make.
Every other cooler company have to abide by the same law.









Edit: UK has similar comsumer protection laws not just EU Consumer protection laws.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> No argument at all. Longer warranty periods do not mean better quality or longer life expectancy. It's not about 'standing behind their product' but about getting customers to think product is better by getting them to believe it will last longer with a longer warranty. Many Corsail CLC owners with 2+ year old CLCs don't bother to RMA them .. They simply buy a new cooler and move on .. and that is what companies count on to beat the odds with long warranty not being used by owners will not use it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You might find this asetek OEM link of interest
> http://www.asetek.com/oems/where-to-buy/
> 
> And this gamersnexus link too
> http://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/2122-who-actually-makes-liquid-coolers-oems


Well you certainly have the right to interpret their longer warranty as you want. But facts are facts. It is longer. I do prefer having more, specially if, as you say, it does not mean it is better in any way. It might be worst.. So you better have that longer warranty lol.

Like founders edition cards, all made exactly the same, in the same factory(PNY most times is the oem for nvidia), just packed in different brands boxes... Yet.. Some brands do give you longer warranty. I take advantage of that. Evga for example.

I find it funny you think folks just trow away AIOs costing 150 eur and buy new when they had the possibility of Exchange under warranty(2+ years). Seriously. I would find that true of 10eur item.. 150? Nop, not a chance.

I know asetek full well, for many many years. But thanks for charing the links anyway.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> Well you certainly have the right to interpret their longer warranty as you want. But facts are facts. It is longer. I do prefer having more, specially if, as you say, it does not mean it is better in any way. It might be worst.. So you better have that longer warranty lol.
> 
> Like founders edition cards, all made exactly the same, in the same. Factory, just packaging in different brands boxed... Yet.. Some brands do give you longer warranty. I take advantage of that. Evga for example.
> 
> I find it funny you think folks just trow away AIOs costing 150 eur and buy new when they had the possibility of Exchange under warranty(2+ years). Seriously. I would find that true of 10eur item.. 150? Nop, nor a chance.
> 
> I know asetek full well, for many many years. But thanks for charing the links anyway.


I see people with failing 2-4 year old Corsair coolers posting up quite often on different forums who bought a new cooler (usually air) and threw their CLC in the bin. I know one guy who beat his 5 month old Gigabyte 500 Euro cooler to bits instead of returning it. Dumb I know, but it's the truth.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Is that the proper file - 150 samples?


It is. I had to check since I had just run it the way it came from AMD's website, and it does appear to be set to 150 samples per pixel.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> I see people with failing 2-4 year old Corsair coolers posting up quite often on different forums who bought a new cooler (usually air) and threw their CLC in the bin. I know one guy who beat his 5 month old Gigabyte 500 Euro cooler to bits instead of returning it. Dumb I know, but it's the truth.


That I can understand. Some folks do not realize a good air cooler will be cheaper and last longer wile being just as efficient as the AIOs. Only after the AIO fails and gives them a headache, but those folks are opting not to rma the AIO because they give up on the concept.

Even then I do not think it is justified(smart). I would rma and then sell the new part.. If warranty is still valid anyway. With money to spare on a shiny new air cooler and some spare maybe.

We all know that guy. Unfortunately.


----------



## deadspeedv

I have an annoying thing that happens with my ROG Zenith Extreme. In the BIOS I changed my chassis fan to manual so it only starts spinning up after CPU hits 35C otherwise it is too loud if I leave it on overnight (sleep in the same room). Every time I shutdown the PC upon power up it will automatically change my BIOS fan setting for Chassis Fan 1 from any setting (Either manual or silent) back to Standard speed. It won't hold the manual setting for the Chassis fan, but it does for the CPU fan.

So every startup I have to go into the BIOS and change it back to manual. Fast Boot is disabled


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I don't know if anyone is doing the Ryzen Blender benchmark anymore, but this is my run. CPU and RAM are both at stock frequencies. I'm running 32 GB of DDR4-2400 ECC/U.
> 
> 13.04 seconds


yep 12.36 seconds

3900 and 3200 on the ram 4x gskill flarex stock xmp


i also did a gooseberry at 3900(which by the way i,m sticking with as it gives 5 degrees less and is stable at 1.25







) and it was i think 15 seconds slower.

sorry forgot ran a povray 3.7 test (now i am not sure if i did it right or the way others do i just loaded it and ran benchmark all cpus...didn't load a scene or change anything)
the reason for this is the recent review of the 7820x by thinkcomputers where they compare it to a 1700 ryzen....a stock 1700 ryzen....on what planet apart from core count are they the same.

https://www.thinkcomputers.org/intel-core-i7-7820x-8-core-processor-review/

over here a 7820x is 799 a 1700 is 419
the cheapest 2066 is 399 the cheapest x370 board is 209 (and it isn't a hideous board.
plus you need quad ram for the 7820x.. i mean...really...

anyway povray 39.93 seconds (i think







)


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

Hi, I'm new here ( first PC build also ) and flailing around a bit with a Ryzen Threadripper 1950X in a X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC (MS-7B09)

Doing Cinema 4D rendering and it consistently crashes after a while, and by crash I mean shutdowns instantly and LED's show error code '00' on the board. Sometimes it feels like it shutdowns instantly as I start a render or open a scene, but usually it justrenders away for any length of time before shutting down randomly, and it feels like no other software causes this but need to do more tests.

I have a feeling this is RAM related as stocks of RAM were limited I didnt get exactly the RAM I was hoping for and maybe it isnt so well supported / overkill

I have reset CMOS so all default timings no XMP

The RAM is G.Skill Trident Z 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4 PC4-28800C17 3600MHz Quad Channel Kit (F4-3600C17Q-64GTZKW)
I believe it should be Samung B-Die

And after CMOS reset it defaults to 2133mhz CAS latency 15, Write Row Delat 15, Row precharge delay 15, Row Cycle Time 51, RAS Active TIme 36, CPU on Die Termination 53.3 Ohms, Read Row Colum Delay 15, CAS Write Latency 11

Everything is running lovely and cool ( peaking at about 53 c during C4D ) also big radiator is doing it's job beyond expectations

One other random harmless? thing when opening AMD Ryzen Master exe it shows debug code 'd3' on motherboard

I have had the debug code 'C0' show up a ton on restart, also right after changing any BIOS settings, it seemed to stop doing that after I did CMOS Reset a few times in a row and with the power off, but could just be a red herring - yup 'C0' happened again now after entering BIOS and leaving

I did memtest for a few hours and it looked like it was going to pass ok about 70% thru, will run again later, I turned the monitor off before going to bed and turning it back on resulted in an error code '63' I think, same happens if I turn display off and on during BIOS screen.

Sidenote the Intel wifi / bluetooth PCI card that is bundled was seeminly making 'C0' errors on boot more common like every other reboot, and the CPU Fail Light comes on mobo

It seems to only shutdown during C4D rendering ( with Vray ), Prime and Memtest have not caused the issue, this C4D render peaks at about 7.5gb of system mem use.

I have tried removing 2 of rightmost sticks, and with just the one leftmost in, and just now trying with a different one by itself in another slot ( far right ) now.. so far so good...Edit nope it crashed also, just reading manual and well this motherboard is covered in bloody lights so didn't notice I think a red light was on for DRAM error 'indicates DRAM is not detected or fail', might have just bee nthe CPU Fail light though..

So far this is a beautiful and extremely fast paperweight, my plan next is bench some more with other programs see if it is only C4D/Vray, then get different RAM to test with, and maybe.... and I really dont want to, try reseating the CPU, motherboard and take it all apart and back toegther -_-

Edit: trying with core boost disabled, I will returns with results

Rest of the spec: Corsair HX1200i, Nvidia 980 TI, Windows 10, M.2 Samsung Boot drive, Enermax Liqtech 360 AIO, Entho Evolv ATX

RAM details:
DIMM # 1
SMBus address 0x53
Memory type DDR4
Module format UDIMM
Manufacturer (ID) G.Skill (7F7F7F7FCD000000000000)
Size 16384 MBytes
Max bandwidth DDR4-2132 (1066 MHz)
Part number F4-3600C17-16GTZKW
Nominal Voltage 1.20 Volts
EPP no
XMP yes
XMP revision 2.0
AMP no1066*
JEDEC timings table CL-tRCD-tRP-tRAS-tRC @ frequency
JEDEC #1 10.0-10-10-24-34 @ 727 MHz
JEDEC #2 11.0-11-11-27-38 @ 800 MHz
JEDEC #3 12.0-12-12-29-41 @ 872 MHz
JEDEC #4 13.0-14-14-32-45 @ 945 MHz
JEDEC #5 14.0-14-14-34-48 @ 1018 MHz
JEDEC #6 15.0-15-15-36-50 @ 1066 MHz
JEDEC #7 16.0-15-15-36-50 @ 1066 MHz
XMP profile XMP-3602
Specification DDR4-3602
Voltage level 1.350 Volts
Min Cycle time 0.555 ns (1801 MHz)
Max CL 17.0
Min tRP 10.45 ns
Min tRCD 10.45 ns
Min tRAS 21.56 ns
Min tRC 32.06 ns
Min tRRD 3.50 ns
XMP timings table CL-tRCD-tRP-tRAS-tRC-CR @ frequency (voltage)
XMP #1 17.0-19-19-39-58-n.a @ 1801 MHz (1.350 Volts)

Other temps:

Hardware monitor Nuvoton NCT6795
Voltage 2 3.34 Volts [0xD1] (AVCC)
Voltage 3 3.26 Volts [0xCC] (+3.3V)
Voltage 7 1.20 Volts [0x4B] (DRAM CH_C/D)
Voltage 8 1.26 Volts [0x9D] (CPU VCORE)
Voltage 9 1.20 Volts [0x4B] (DRAM CH_A/B)
Voltage 10 12.19 Volts [0x7F] (+12V)
Voltage 11 5.00 Volts [0x7D] (+5V)
Voltage 13 0.86 Volts [0x6C] (VDD SOC)
Temperature 0 39 degC (102 degF) [0x27] (SYSTIN)
Temperature 1 63 degC (145 degF) [0x7E] (TMPIN1)
Temperature 3 40 degC (104 degF) [0x28] (TMPIN3)
Temperature 5 42 degC (107 degF) [0x2A] (TMPIN5)
Temperature 6 39 degC (102 degF) [0x27] (TMPIN6)
Temperature 7 51 degC (123 degF) [0x4E] (CPUTIN)
Fan 0 2766 RPM [0xACE] (SYSFANIN)
Fan 1 513 RPM [0x201] (CPUFANIN)
Fan 3 771 RPM [0x303] (AUXFANIN1)

Hardware monitor DIMM
Temperature 0 38 degC (100 degF) [0xC264] (core)

Hardware monitor Hardware monitor ID=0x1B1C1C00
Voltage 0 230.00 Volts [0xF9CC] (Input)
Voltage 1 12.14 Volts [0xD309] (+12V)
Voltage 2 5.00 Volts [0xD140] (+5V)
Voltage 3 3.28 Volts [0xD0D2] (+3.3V)
Current 0 13.00 Amps [0xF034] (+12V)
Current 1 5.69 Amps [0xE05B] (+5V)
Current 2 1.88 Amps [0xE01E] (+3.3V)
Power 0 157.83 W (+12V)
Power 1 28.44 W (+5V)
Power 2 6.15 W (+3.3V)
Power 3 192.42 W (Power Out)
Power 4 211.12 W (Power In)
Temperature 0 55 degC (130 degF) [0xF0DA] (TMPIN0)
Temperature 1 41 degC (106 degF) [0xF0A5] (TMPIN1)
Fan 0 0 RPM [0x1000] (FANIN0)
Level 0 91 pc (Efficiency)
Register space WIN32 HID

CPU:
Temperature 0 51 degC (124 degF) (Package (Node 0))
Temperature 1 48 degC (118 degF) (Package (Node 1))
Voltage 0 1.25 Volts (VID)
Voltage 1 0.84 Volts (CPU VDD (Node 0))
Voltage 2 1.25 Volts (CPU VDD (Node 1))
Power 00 138.85 W (Package)


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> Hi, I'm new here ( first PC build also ) and flailing around a bit with a Ryzen Threadripper 1950X in a X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC (MS-7B09)
> 
> Doing Cinema 4D rendering and it consistently crashes after a while, and by crash I mean shutdowns instantly and LED's show error code '00' on the board. Sometimes it feels like it shutdowns instantly as I start a render or open a scene, but usually it justrenders away for any length of time before shutting down randomly, and it feels like no other software causes this but need to do more tests.


Unfortunately, you appear to be the latest new member to be inducted into the prestigious club of people who can't run intensive rendering applications using that motherboard model without crashing. I too am a member. MSI is supposedly working on it and expects to fix it with firmware.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> Hi, I'm new here ( first PC build also ) and flailing around a bit with a Ryzen Threadripper 1950X in a X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC (MS-7B09)
> 
> Doing Cinema 4D rendering and it consistently crashes after a while, and by crash I mean shutdowns instantly and LED's show error code '00' on the board. Sometimes it feels like it shutdowns instantly as I start a render or open a scene, but usually it justrenders away for any length of time before shutting down randomly, and it feels like no other software causes this but need to do more tests.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Unfortunately, you appear to be the latest new member to be inducted into the prestigious club of people who can't run intensive rendering applications using that motherboard model without crashing. I too am a member. MSI is supposedly working on it and expects to fix it with firmware.


Try beta BIOS 1.52. I too experienced 00 black screen crashes (turning off core performance boost 'fixed' it but that meant no overclocking at all then). Beware that 1.52 is beta though. While I can run heavy overclocks now without 00 crashes, I cannot change settings in the overclock tab of the BIOS once new settings have been set and saved as the bios "freezes" on that tab once opened on subsequent boots and the PC must be reset/power cycled to get out of it (basically you can only set overclock settings once then have to cmos clear/reset to change overclock settings again)

Can find .152 here, post #5 https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=291117.0


----------



## Machiyariko

After trying everything under the sun it looks like 4.3 is out of the questions for my 1900X.
I can get into Windows but can't do anything else.

I can however run 4.2 with 3733 memory.

We'll see if I can get the timings down and get this thing 100% stable.

More updates in the next few days.

https://valid.x86.fr/a2v521


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Try beta BIOS 1.52. I too experienced 00 black screen crashes (turning off core performance boost 'fixed' it but that meant no overclocking at all then). Beware that 1.52 is beta though. While I can run heavy overclocks now without 00 crashes, I cannot change settings in the overclock tab of the BIOS once new settings have been set and saved as the bios "freezes" on that tab once opened on subsequent boots and the PC must be reset/power cycled to get out of it (basically you can only set overclock settings once then have to cmos clear/reset to change overclock settings again)
> 
> Can find .152 here, post #5 https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=291117.0


I'd be happy with running my CPU at stock frequencies. Even turning off CPB at stock doesn't make me stable with Blender.


----------



## wahdangun

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> After trying everything under the sun it looks like 4.3 is out of the questions for my 1900X.
> I can get into Windows but can't do anything else.
> 
> I can however run 4.2 with 3733 memory.
> 
> We'll see if I can get the timings down and get this thing 100% stable.
> 
> More updates in the next few days.
> 
> https://valid.x86.fr/a2v521


can u test with different ram speed ??

i want to know the impact of ram speed.

and maybe some games ??


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> Hi, I'm new here ( first PC build also ) and flailing around a bit with a Ryzen Threadripper 1950X in a X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC (MS-7B09)
> 
> Doing Cinema 4D rendering and it consistently crashes after a while, and by crash I mean shutdowns instantly and LED's show error code '00' on the board. Sometimes it feels like it shutdowns instantly as I start a render or open a scene, but usually it justrenders away for any length of time before shutting down randomly, and it feels like no other software causes this but need to do more tests.
> 
> I have a feeling this is RAM related as stocks of RAM were limited I didnt get exactly the RAM I was hoping for and maybe it isnt so well supported / overkill
> 
> I have reset CMOS so all default timings no XMP
> 
> The RAM is G.Skill Trident Z 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4 PC4-28800C17 3600MHz Quad Channel Kit (F4-3600C17Q-64GTZKW)
> I believe it should be Samung B-Die
> 
> And after CMOS reset it defaults to 2133mhz CAS latency 15, Write Row Delat 15, Row precharge delay 15, Row Cycle Time 51, RAS Active TIme 36, CPU on Die Termination 53.3 Ohms, Read Row Colum Delay 15, CAS Write Latency 11
> 
> Everything is running lovely and cool ( peaking at about 53 c during C4D ) also big radiator is doing it's job beyond expectations
> 
> One other random harmless? thing when opening AMD Ryzen Master exe it shows debug code 'd3' on motherboard
> 
> I have had the debug code 'C0' show up a ton on restart, also right after changing any BIOS settings, it seemed to stop doing that after I did CMOS Reset a few times in a row and with the power off, but could just be a red herring - yup 'C0' happened again now after entering BIOS and leaving
> 
> I did memtest for a few hours and it looked like it was going to pass ok about 70% thru, will run again later, I turned the monitor off before going to bed and turning it back on resulted in an error code '63' I think, same happens if I turn display off and on during BIOS screen.
> 
> Sidenote the Intel wifi / bluetooth PCI card that is bundled was seeminly making 'C0' errors on boot more common like every other reboot, and the CPU Fail Light comes on mobo
> 
> It seems to only shutdown during C4D rendering ( with Vray ), Prime and Memtest have not caused the issue, this C4D render peaks at about 7.5gb of system mem use.
> 
> I have tried removing 2 of rightmost sticks, and with just the one leftmost in, and just now trying with a different one by itself in another slot ( far right ) now.. so far so good...Edit nope it crashed also, just reading manual and well this motherboard is covered in bloody lights so didn't notice I think a red light was on for DRAM error 'indicates DRAM is not detected or fail', might have just bee nthe CPU Fail light though..
> 
> So far this is a beautiful and extremely fast paperweight, my plan next is bench some more with other programs see if it is only C4D/Vray, then get different RAM to test with, and maybe.... and I really dont want to, try reseating the CPU, motherboard and take it all apart and back toegther -_-
> 
> Edit: trying with core boost disabled, I will returns with results
> 
> Rest of the spec: Corsair HX1200i, Nvidia 980 TI, Windows 10, M.2 Samsung Boot drive, Enermax Liqtech 360 AIO, Entho Evolv ATX
> 
> RAM details:
> DIMM # 1
> SMBus address 0x53
> Memory type DDR4
> Module format UDIMM
> Manufacturer (ID) G.Skill (7F7F7F7FCD000000000000)
> Size 16384 MBytes
> Max bandwidth DDR4-2132 (1066 MHz)
> Part number F4-3600C17-16GTZKW
> Nominal Voltage 1.20 Volts
> EPP no
> XMP yes
> XMP revision 2.0
> AMP no1066*
> JEDEC timings table CL-tRCD-tRP-tRAS-tRC @ frequency
> JEDEC #1 10.0-10-10-24-34 @ 727 MHz
> JEDEC #2 11.0-11-11-27-38 @ 800 MHz
> JEDEC #3 12.0-12-12-29-41 @ 872 MHz
> JEDEC #4 13.0-14-14-32-45 @ 945 MHz
> JEDEC #5 14.0-14-14-34-48 @ 1018 MHz
> JEDEC #6 15.0-15-15-36-50 @ 1066 MHz
> JEDEC #7 16.0-15-15-36-50 @ 1066 MHz
> XMP profile XMP-3602
> Specification DDR4-3602
> Voltage level 1.350 Volts
> Min Cycle time 0.555 ns (1801 MHz)
> Max CL 17.0
> Min tRP 10.45 ns
> Min tRCD 10.45 ns
> Min tRAS 21.56 ns
> Min tRC 32.06 ns
> Min tRRD 3.50 ns
> XMP timings table CL-tRCD-tRP-tRAS-tRC-CR @ frequency (voltage)
> XMP #1 17.0-19-19-39-58-n.a @ 1801 MHz (1.350 Volts)
> 
> Other temps:
> 
> Hardware monitor Nuvoton NCT6795
> Voltage 2 3.34 Volts [0xD1] (AVCC)
> Voltage 3 3.26 Volts [0xCC] (+3.3V)
> Voltage 7 1.20 Volts [0x4B] (DRAM CH_C/D)
> Voltage 8 1.26 Volts [0x9D] (CPU VCORE)
> Voltage 9 1.20 Volts [0x4B] (DRAM CH_A/B)
> Voltage 10 12.19 Volts [0x7F] (+12V)
> Voltage 11 5.00 Volts [0x7D] (+5V)
> Voltage 13 0.86 Volts [0x6C] (VDD SOC)
> Temperature 0 39 degC (102 degF) [0x27] (SYSTIN)
> Temperature 1 63 degC (145 degF) [0x7E] (TMPIN1)
> Temperature 3 40 degC (104 degF) [0x28] (TMPIN3)
> Temperature 5 42 degC (107 degF) [0x2A] (TMPIN5)
> Temperature 6 39 degC (102 degF) [0x27] (TMPIN6)
> Temperature 7 51 degC (123 degF) [0x4E] (CPUTIN)
> Fan 0 2766 RPM [0xACE] (SYSFANIN)
> Fan 1 513 RPM [0x201] (CPUFANIN)
> Fan 3 771 RPM [0x303] (AUXFANIN1)
> 
> Hardware monitor DIMM
> Temperature 0 38 degC (100 degF) [0xC264] (core)
> 
> Hardware monitor Hardware monitor ID=0x1B1C1C00
> Voltage 0 230.00 Volts [0xF9CC] (Input)
> Voltage 1 12.14 Volts [0xD309] (+12V)
> Voltage 2 5.00 Volts [0xD140] (+5V)
> Voltage 3 3.28 Volts [0xD0D2] (+3.3V)
> Current 0 13.00 Amps [0xF034] (+12V)
> Current 1 5.69 Amps [0xE05B] (+5V)
> Current 2 1.88 Amps [0xE01E] (+3.3V)
> Power 0 157.83 W (+12V)
> Power 1 28.44 W (+5V)
> Power 2 6.15 W (+3.3V)
> Power 3 192.42 W (Power Out)
> Power 4 211.12 W (Power In)
> Temperature 0 55 degC (130 degF) [0xF0DA] (TMPIN0)
> Temperature 1 41 degC (106 degF) [0xF0A5] (TMPIN1)
> Fan 0 0 RPM [0x1000] (FANIN0)
> Level 0 91 pc (Efficiency)
> Register space WIN32 HID
> 
> CPU:
> Temperature 0 51 degC (124 degF) (Package (Node 0))
> Temperature 1 48 degC (118 degF) (Package (Node 1))
> Voltage 0 1.25 Volts (VID)
> Voltage 1 0.84 Volts (CPU VDD (Node 0))
> Voltage 2 1.25 Volts (CPU VDD (Node 1))
> Power 00 138.85 W (Package)






that ram is probably Samsung b die BUT i had team extreme 3600(also Samsung b die) with similar timings and that stuff never went over 2933(my daughter has it now)

make sure the ram is in the outside slots either side
try 2933 1.35 volts on the ram and 14 14 14 or 16 16 16 auto the rest.
also try geardown disabled and force 2T that helped a little with my ram BUT on a ryzen system.

if the computer is actually shutting down i am more inclined to think power issue, all the plugs in 2 x 8 pin or whatever(not going to question the psu since my rm1000 handles this setup without a sweat)
so check the cables.
now i can do that gooseberry blender and the vray bench on mine and it isn't an issue BUT i had to change versions of blender to get gooseberry running right, the installed version took 6 minutes to sync or whatever till it actually started rendering.

another thing you could do is load up the latest hwinfo and start a log before you begin rendering and hopefully it will save the log to check out.


----------



## J-S-Q

Hi all,

I have a 1920X with a Gigabyte Aorus 7. I'm a relative novice at overclocking and I only know the basics&#8230;.

I'm using HWiNFO64 to monitor temperatures/voltages etc. Am I right in thinking that CPU (Tdie) is the most important temperature indicator? And that under heavy load I probably want this under 70c?

Currently I have my 1920X running at 4.0GHz. I've left the voltage CPU VCore on AUTO in my BIOS and everything seems to run nicely. 5 minutes of AIDA64 Stress Test gives a maximum CPU (Tdie) temperature of 68.6c.

HWiNFO64 shows a maximum VCore of 1.284v. This seems quite low from what I've read. Have I got lucky with a good CPU? Or am I misunderstanding how to monitor VCore correctly?

Thanks.


----------



## Poloasis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *J-S-Q*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I have a 1920X with a Gigabyte Aorus 7. I'm a relative novice at overclocking and I only know the basics&#8230;.
> 
> I'm using HWiNFO64 to monitor temperatures/voltages etc. Am I right in thinking that CPU (Tdie) is the most important temperature indicator? And that under heavy load I probably want this under 70c?
> 
> Currently I have my 1920X running at 4.0GHz. I've left the voltage CPU VCore on AUTO in my BIOS and everything seems to run nicely. 5 minutes of AIDA64 Stress Test gives a maximum CPU (Tdie) temperature of 68.6c.
> 
> HWiNFO64 shows a maximum VCore of 1.284v. This seems quite low from what I've read. Have I got lucky with a good CPU? Or am I misunderstanding how to monitor VCore correctly?
> 
> Thanks.


From what I understand and seeing over the Net Tdie is not a real temp monitoring Tcltk is. Also different BIOS will show different temp and voltage monitoring.


----------



## Poloasis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Easy, just set 1.465v vcore and off you go


1.450 is highest you'll want to go on the 1950x. Anything higher than that is asking for trouble.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> What I don't understand about that Computerbase look at the 1900X is that it's using almost as much power as a 1920X under load.
> 
> Way more than an 1800X.
> 
> I don't see how this can be, given very similar clocks.
> 
> Is it really feeding the dummy dies with juice?


Does anyone have any idea what's going on?


----------



## Particle

I don't know the answer, but I know that the answer to "Is it really feeding the dummy dies with juice?" is definitely no.


----------



## J-S-Q

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Poloasis*
> 
> From what I understand and seeing over the Net Tdie is not a real temp monitoring Tcltk is. Also different BIOS will show different temp and voltage monitoring.


I can't see Tcltk in HWinfo. There is Tctl, which is always 27c higher than Tdie and from what I've read in one or two places, Tdie is the correct one to be looking at.

Can anyone else advise on this? Tdie seems to follow exactly the same temperature shown in the AMD Ryzen Master app.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Does anyone have any idea what's going on?


Those lanes need feeding I guess.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I don't know the answer, but I know that the answer to "Is it really feeding the dummy dies with juice?" is definitely no.


Are you absolutely sure? I know it shouldn't be, but perhaps there's something wrong with the BIOS / micro code.



Seems very strange indeed ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> Those lanes need feeding I guess.


That's CPU power, not mobo + CPU. No way the additional lanes for the PCIe controller on the CPU take anywhere near that much.


----------



## amigafan2003

It's just feeding it more power to maintain higher boost/xfr clocks.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> It's just feeding it more power to maintain higher boost/xfr clocks.


I don't buy that, given the enormous delta, and tiny delta to the 1950X under full multicore load.


----------



## Machiyariko

I'll post some screenshots tonight of my power consumption but it really does look like the 1900x uses 180-200+ watts under load.
I'll hook up my power angel and see the wall power usage at idle and load for some extra data.

The strange thing for me is the low temps even under very high core voltage.

With a 23c ambient I am only seeing 40c Idle and no more than 65c even when at 1.55v.
The auto voltage for a 4.2 overclock is 1.45 and there I see 30c idle and 54c load.

My EVGA 280 CLC cant be THAT good.


----------



## ssateneth

I maintain that Tdie is the 'true' tmperature and Tctl is some artificial temperature for the purpose of more aggressive fan curve since its always exactly 27C higher than Tdie. Also for a soldered CPU, Tdie more closely reflects the temperatures I except for a custom liquid loop. I mean a 40C higher temperature than coolant of a custom liquid loop jsut for -idling- on -stock- speeds with a big fat IHS that is soldered -and- more die surface area makes zero sense.

Also need to keep in mind if you aren't running overclock settings and just doing 'stock' speeds (using AMD XFR technology to boost past stock speeds), the VID shown is just a number. There is stuff going on inside the CPU to monitor and control voltage, current, package power, frequencies, the whole 9 yards, and applies a hidden negative offset to VID on the fly. 1.5v VID during XFR isnt truely 1.5v. It may be close, or it may be significantly lower. I recommend reading stilt's article on Ryzen to get a better understanding.

People also saying "my X can't be cooling that good" might be coming from toothpaste intel CPUs. Also need to remember we are dealing with a MCM CPU and not a monolithic design. You are spreading out the heat into a greater area instead of concentrating in 1 spot.

I can draw about 380 watts and for a dual die design with an IHS twice as big as 2011-v3, the temperature difference feels about right. It's not going to wick away all the heat instantly, but it's still going to reduce temperatures based on the reduction of how concentrated the heat energy is. If you put 20 watts through a flat surface the size of your hand and put your hand on it, it'll get warm or hot, but it won't burn you (so long as you keep your hand on it). If you put that same energy through a soldering iron tip, it'll cook the skin on your hand and even melt metal.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> I don't buy that, given the enormous delta, and tiny delta to the 1950X under full multicore load.


The circuit for managing boost/XFR is pretty smart. It will attempt to boost up to maximum clocks as long as temperature and power consumption allows. If you apply a computational load that requires a lot of current (power), then it's very likely you will touch on maximum package power limit, which is 180 watts. If you don't set the CPU into bypass mode by overclocking it, Boost and XFR will work around the 180 watt limit. With only 8 cores, a 1900X may find it difficult to reach this limit, while a 1920X can easier reach this limit, as will a 1950X, so there may be a larger power delta between a 1900X and 1920X/1950X simply because under stock boost/XFR scenarios, a 1900X won't be able to pull that much power.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Are you absolutely sure? I know it shouldn't be, but perhaps there's something wrong with the BIOS / micro code.
> 
> 
> 
> Seems very strange indeed ...
> That's CPU power, not mobo + CPU. No way the additional lanes for the PCIe controller on the CPU take anywhere near that much.


Absolutely certain. Now, if your question were "Are the disabled cores being properly power gated?" That I wouldn't be able to state an answer to.


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

Thanks s much ssateneth, Particle, BIOS 1.52 worked!!! no more shutdowns! and even the C0 errors stopped

Managing some overclocks now-ish gets a bit too hot for my liking so probably wont bother in the long run as the XFR that is disabled when OC'd is just too damn handy, and stability is super important

Standard clock speed results in 61c tdie temp when heavy load, so overclocking quickly gets it 70-74c say at 3950mhz 1.35-1.4v which just just seems... unwise to me and that is with a Liqtech 360 AIO at a very noisy fan level. Maybe someone has different numbers but I am getting the impression anything above 60c for long periods is a bit on the wild side?, at 74c the tctl ( as made up as it is ) is poking around 100c and after that I think is instant shutdown territory, unless you are lucky and can stay truly stable at lower volts, not just a few runs of Cinebench :-D

Quote:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Try beta BIOS 1.52. I too experienced 00 black screen crashes (turning off core performance boost 'fixed' it but that meant no overclocking at all then). Beware that 1.52 is beta though. While I can run heavy overclocks now without 00 crashes, I cannot change settings in the overclock tab of the BIOS once new settings have been set and saved as the bios "freezes" on that tab once opened on subsequent boots and the PC must be reset/power cycled to get out of it (basically you can only set overclock settings once then have to cmos clear/reset to change overclock settings again)
> 
> Can find .152 here, post #5 https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=291117.0


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> Thanks s much ssateneth, Particle, BIOS 1.52 worked!!! no more shutdowns! and even the C0 errors stopped
> 
> Managing some overclocks now-ish gets a bit too hot for my liking so probably wont bother in the long run as the XFR that is disabled when OC'd is just too damn handy, and stability is super important
> 
> Standard clock speed results in 61c tdie temp when heavy load, so overclocking quickly gets it 70-74c say at 3950mhz 1.35-1.4v which just just seems... unwise to me and that is with a Liqtech 360 AIO at a very noisy fan level. Maybe someone has different numbers but I am getting the impression anything above 60c for long periods is a bit on the wild side?, at 74c the tctl ( as made up as it is ) is poking around 100c and after that I think is instant shutdown territory, unless you are lucky and can stay truly stable at lower volts, not just a few runs of Cinebench :-D


that temp under load seems a tad high.

when i get a chance i,ll throw mine back to stock and check.
and what are you using to get the loaded temp?
so far that evil bastard gooseberry has shown the highest temps on mine bar maybe prime 95 small ffts.

5 loops of of cb15 overclocked to 3900 only give me 61 degrees and thats on a h115i with should not be cooling better than that enermax.

also congrats on sorting it out









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Are you absolutely sure? I know it shouldn't be, but perhaps there's something wrong with the BIOS / micro code.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seems very strange indeed ...
> That's CPU power, not mobo + CPU. No way the additional lanes for the PCIe controller on the CPU take anywhere near that much.


i agree it does not make any sense at all but it cannot be the other dies because they are just slugs.
problem is a apart from one other guy here i don't know of any other reviews at all.

i,ll see if i can hunt down some more and not simulated


----------



## happyluckbox

Anybody know what the stock voltage on the 1950x is? Cant find info on this anywhere


----------



## Machiyariko

Here is a Blender run with the Ryzen file @ 150.
21.44 Seconds



Temps
25c Ambient


From my Kill A Watt
121w Idle
291w Blender Load

170w From Idle to load, Sure looks like its pulling 180W+ when overclocked.

The strangest part is that When Ryzen Master is running the Idle temps are 33c and without it they are 22c according to HWMon.
HWInfo also shows pretty much the same temps.
22c is below my ambient...


Something weird is going on here for sure.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> Here is a Blender run with the Ryzen file @ 150.
> 21.44 Seconds
> 
> 
> 
> Temps
> 25c Ambient
> 
> 
> From my Kill A Watt
> 121w Idle
> 291w Blender Load
> 
> 170w From Idle to load, Sure looks like its pulling 180W+ when overclocked.
> 
> The strangest part is that When Ryzen Master is running the Idle temps are 33c and without it they are 22c according to HWMon.
> HWInfo also shows pretty much the same temps.
> 22c is below my ambient...
> 
> 
> Something weird is going on here for sure.






try 3240 hwinfo
my idle low temps at the moment are 30 degrees and it is around 22 or so in here.
plus if the temps were say 10 degrees out my chip when it hit 78 would be 88 and it definitely would have shut down or throttled and it didn't.

also your score is about 1 second faster than my 1800x with the ram at 3466 and 4gig so yeah pans out performance wise.

if you are feeling really brave....run gooseberry blender listed up a bit. i would be VERY interested in how it did at that and what the power draw was


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Anybody know what the stock voltage on the 1950x is? Cant find info on this anywhere


a few reviews have it listed under load it should be around 1.125


----------



## Machiyariko

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> try 3240 hwinfo
> my idle low temps at the moment are 30 degrees and it is around 22 or so in here.
> plus if the temps were say 10 degrees out my chip when it hit 78 would be 88 and it definitely would have shut down or throttled and it didn't.
> 
> also your score is about 1 second faster than my 1800x with the ram at 3466 and 4gig so yeah pans out performance wise.
> 
> if you are feeling really brave....run gooseberry blender listed up a bit. i would be VERY interested in how it did at that and what the power draw was


My temps look the same as before with the new version.


I ran another Superposition with my new settings of 4.2 and 3600.


I just downloaded the gooseberry file and will run it now...


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> My temps look the same as before with the new version.
> 
> 
> I ran another Superposition with my new settings of 4.2 and 3600.
> 
> 
> I just downloaded the gooseberry file and will run it now...






ok but make sure you draw a pentagram snd sacrifice a goat first...it is a mean benchmark


----------



## chew*

1st place single fury X timespy

Was not even trying card clocks better and hbm is good for 600+


----------



## Machiyariko

Running it now and posting from my phone while I wait.

Max temps are 57c Tdie.
It's hovering around 50c as we are rendering now.
Max watts from the wall are about 270w.

This might take a while...


----------



## happyluckbox

So it looks like I've got a few options for a stable 24/7 overclock.
a. 1.243 vcore and llc set to turbo which gives me roughly 1.25ish vcore at idle, and 1.35 vcore at load
b 1.325 vcore and llc set to normal, which gives me roughly 1.325 vcore at idle and 1.35 vcore at load

It seems to me there's no benefit to having higher vcore at idle, and its better to run with a large offset so I should go with option A?


----------



## Machiyariko

The worst part about that benchmark is when it crashed 99% through the test.
The second run went through without a hitch.
Temps were fine, never hitting 60C Tdie with a 22c ambient.
45:57
Specs are in my Sig,


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> The worst part about that benchmark is when it crashed 99% through the test.
> The second run went through without a hitch.
> Temps were fine, never hitting 60C Tdie with a 22c ambient.
> 45:57
> Specs are in my Sig,


now all we need is a 1800x to run it )overclocked of course







)
and a7820x or a 7900x

for comparison the best i got at 3950 was 23 minutes i think maybe a few more second...its up there somewhere.

one other thing on yours did it take ages like 5 or so minutes till it actually started to render?
mine did so i grabbed the 2.79 version didn't install it just opened it and opened the file from there that seemed to fix it.


----------



## Machiyariko

Yeah mine took a few minutes before it rendered.
I just downloaded 2.79 and I'll see how it goes.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> 1st place single fury X timespy
> 
> Was not even trying card clocks better and hbm is good for 600+


i have to say that cpu score is pretty glorious best i have so far at 3950 is 10973


----------



## Machiyariko

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> now all we need is a 1800x to run it )overclocked of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> and a7820x or a 7900x
> 
> for comparison the best i got at 3950 was 23 minutes i think maybe a few more second...its up there somewhere.
> 
> one other thing on yours did it take ages like 5 or so minutes till it actually started to render?
> mine did so i grabbed the 2.79 version didn't install it just opened it and opened the file from there that seemed to fix it.


2.79 did not seem to fix it for me. It still took 4 minutes before it started to render.

Here is a set of Gooseberry tests that PCper did:
https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-7-1800X-Review-Now-and-Zen/Media-Encoding-and-Rendering



I'll do the math for everyone:
I'm guessing that all of these scores are at stock settings

1800X - 55 minutes
7700K - 75.5 minutes
7600K - 117 minutes
6700k - 79 minutes
6950X - 43 minutes
6900k - 49.5 minutes
6800k - 67.5 minutes
1900X @4.2 - 46 minutes

Maybe I'll do a stock run for fun one of these days.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i have to say that cpu score is pretty glorious best i have so far at 3950 is 10973


Kill HT....timespy uses 14 cores max.

Your probably getting nailed with threads...which are worth 50% of core ipc.

Basically you will see a large jump just by killing HT ( 1k )...same with vantage cpu test.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Kill HT....timespy uses 14 cores max.
> 
> Your probably getting nailed with threads...which are worth 50% of core ipc.
> 
> Basically you will see a large jump just by killing HT ( 1k )...same with vantage cpu test.


thanks i,ll give that a go but the idea of killing cores or ht off to improve performance just proves to me devs are lazy asses and need to come into this century









as for ht killing cores etc i have tried that on games game mode v creator mode etc and in games stuff all nothing in it.

oh wait....core parking...yeah let me go try that old chestnut that worked before









well that did squat (works on firestrike but not timespy.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I mean, its been opened already I would imagine? How else would they test it.
> 
> I'd much rather pay
> I mean, its been opened already I would imagine? How else would they test it?
> 
> I'd much rather pay $30 more for an unopened 1950x with a very good chance of OC higher than 3.8ghz


I
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So it looks like I've got a few options for a stable 24/7 overclock.
> a. 1.243 vcore and llc set to turbo which gives me roughly 1.25ish vcore at idle, and 1.35 vcore at load
> b 1.325 vcore and llc set to normal, which gives me roughly 1.325 vcore at idle and 1.35 vcore at load
> 
> It seems to me there's no benefit to having higher vcore at idle, and its better to run with a large offset so I should go with option A?


Definitely option A.

All that extra voltage at idle is harder on the chip, and it should be bad for idle power consumption.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> 2.79 did not seem to fix it for me. It still took 4 minutes before it started to render.
> 
> Here is a set of Gooseberry tests that PCper did:
> https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-7-1800X-Review-Now-and-Zen/Media-Encoding-and-Rendering
> 
> I'll do the math for everyone:
> I'm guessing that all of these scores are at stock settings
> 
> 1800X - 55 minutes
> 7700K - 75.5 minutes
> 7600K - 117 minutes
> 6700k - 79 minutes
> 6950X - 43 minutes
> 6900k - 49.5 minutes
> 6800k - 67.5 minutes
> 1900X @4.2 - 46 minutes
> 
> Maybe I'll do a stock run for fun one of these days.


Or alternatively, in terms of relative performance:

Code:



Code:


Model   Seconds  Relative
------------------------
1800X   3297.1   213%
7700K   4529.9   155%
7600K   7016.2   100%
6700K   4725.5   148%
6950X   2579.4   272%
6900K   2969.5   236%
6800K   4054.3   173%


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> All that extra voltage at idle is harder on the chip, and it should be bad for idle power consumption.


I'd personally just go with the static voltage, granted the cooling is sufficient.


----------



## Djreversal

so the more and more I read about this architecture.. It seems memory has a significant impact on benchmarks and performance. So when I built this new setup, I used the memory setup from my 5960x build.. it is a 64gb Ripjaw 4 2666mhz setup. I recently came across the new gskill ram "specifically for the ryzen" architecture. They have a handful of variety but my questions for you is, are the tighter timings better then the higher MHz? also, they only offer 32GB packages.. Would it be bad to purchase 2 of those and run the 64gb setup? Just don't want to run into headaches but I cant get my Ram over 2666mhz no matter what I do, I was just able to get the timings a bit tighter with a bit more voltage.

Which of the following would you choose?? I was thinking the 3200 with the tight timings.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> so the more and more I read about this architecture.. It seems memory has a significant impact on benchmarks and performance. So when I built this new setup, I used the memory setup from my 5960x build.. it is a 64gb Ripjaw 4 2666mhz setup. I recently came across the new gskill ram "specifically for the ryzen" architecture. They have a handful of variety but my questions for you is, are the tighter timings better then the higher MHz? also, they only offer 32GB packages.. Would it be bad to purchase 2 of those and run the 64gb setup? Just don't want to run into headaches but I cant get my Ram over 2666mhz no matter what I do, I was just able to get the timings a bit tighter with a bit more voltage.
> 
> Which of the following would you choose?? I was thinking the 3200 with the tight timings.


Benefits past 3200 are minimal at best. I'd aim for lower cl and 3200.


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Benefits past 3200 are minimal at best. I'd aim for lower cl and 3200.


yea my thoughts exactly.. ok and getting 2 32gb kits shouldn't be too much of an issue correct?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> yea my thoughts exactly.. ok and getting 2 32gb kits shouldn't be too much of an issue correct?


Just get 1 64 kit. With 8 sticks to run 3200 right now your gambling with the bios and your cpu ability. Maybe later on it wouldn't be an issue.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> yea my thoughts exactly.. ok and getting 2 32gb kits shouldn't be too much of an issue correct?


If you find those flare X share the link lol


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Just get 1 64 kit. With 8 sticks to run 3200 right now your gambling with the bios and your cpu ability. Maybe later on it wouldn't be an issue.


They only offer 32GB kits with this specific ram... they have a 128GB kit but its the lowest speed one.


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Just get 1 64 kit. With 8 sticks to run 3200 right now your gambling with the bios and your cpu ability. Maybe later on it wouldn't be an issue.


You rock a GTR?? and from new York??? I used to have a 1300hp one that I sold. out here on long island.


----------



## chew*

In that render test. Someone should try 1950x same clocks HT off.

It should be exactly 25% faster than the 1900x.

I do not need more than 1800x worth of threads so going up to 1950x and just using real cores offers a decent boost in everthing i test.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> You rock a GTR?? and from new York??? I used to have a 1300hp one that I sold. out here on long island.


I sold my gtr a couple years back. Got rid of it after I moved back from cali. You don't need to get a flare X kit. Any 14cl 3200 will do as it will be all samsung b die. Infact you don't even need b die to hit 3200 either.


----------



## Djreversal

did a few more benchmarks.. was able to get 4.1ghz stable.. during the testing even tho my max temp shows 71c I never saw over 68.. I think they happened earlier on when I was doing other tests that temp showed up.





HW info Screen shot - https://i.imgur.com/Hm4hG8w.png


----------



## Simmons572

Hey folks, I am planning on buying into TR within the next couple weeks. My plan is to get the following hardware:

1900x
Asus Prime x399-A
G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) - F4-3200C15Q-32GTZSW
I was looking through the Memory compatibility list, and I can't find this specific kit on the list. Will there be any negative repercussions for using this kit? I really just want the silver/white 4x8GB RAM, for aesthetic.


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Benefits past 3200 are minimal at best. I'd aim for lower cl and 3200.


what do u think of something like this

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232347&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC-_-pla-_-Memory+%28Desktop+Memory%29-_-N82E16820232347&gclid=Cj0KCQjwi97NBRD1ARIsAPXVWWDYlBKqFUsmgO2rISGOhVqcxFW2Px9J7lTVSqFw0Ah8vJVtGt0F_3saAgUUEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> what do u think of something like this
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232347&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC-_-pla-_-Memory+%28Desktop+Memory%29-_-N82E16820232347&gclid=Cj0KCQjwi97NBRD1ARIsAPXVWWDYlBKqFUsmgO2rISGOhVqcxFW2Px9J7lTVSqFw0Ah8vJVtGt0F_3saAgUUEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds


Honestly for now get a 4 stick set for 64. Prices aren't very different and you will have a lot easier of a time running rated.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> Hey folks, I am planning on buying into TR within the next couple weeks. My plan is to get the following hardware:
> 
> 1900x
> Asus Prime x399-A
> G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) - F4-3200C15Q-32GTZSW
> I was looking through the Memory compatibility list, and I can't find this specific kit on the list. Will there be any negative repercussions for using this kit? I really just want the silver/white 4x8GB RAM, for aesthetic.


I'd stay away from buying odd cl hynix.


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Honestly for now get a 4 stick set for 64. Prices aren't very different and you will have a lot easier of a time running rated.


I remember back in the day used to have a rule to have 1 dimm per core.. I guess that doesn't really matter any more... it wont have issues only having 4 sticks vs 8 sticks at the same 64gb? like same performance and all?


----------



## Simmons572

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> Hey folks, I am planning on buying into TR within the next couple weeks. My plan is to get the following hardware:
> 
> 1900x
> Asus Prime x399-A
> G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) - F4-3200C15Q-32GTZSW
> I was looking through the Memory compatibility list, and I can't find this specific kit on the list. Will there be any negative repercussions for using this kit? I really just want the silver/white 4x8GB RAM, for aesthetic.
> 
> 
> 
> I'd stay away from buying odd cl hynix.
Click to expand...

Would this be a better option then? https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232320
Timings: 16-18-18-38

And if not, would you help me find one of the Silver/White Trident Z kits that would lead to the most stability?


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> did a few more benchmarks.. was able to get 4.1ghz stable.. during the testing even tho my max temp shows 71c I never saw over 68.. I think they happened earlier on when I was doing other tests that temp showed up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HW info Screen shot - https://i.imgur.com/Hm4hG8w.png


Your scores seem "off" for 4.1 much less 4.0. Properly tuned without throttling I see 3500 on average.


----------



## chew*

This particular setup I am using is doing wonders with Fury X....

Another #1 spot stolen.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> Would this be a better option then? https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232320
> Timings: 16-18-18-38
> 
> And if not, would you help me find one of the Silver/White Trident Z kits that would lead to the most stability?


That looks to be E die. I think the newer rgb ones might be hynix. The set you have linked I own a set of it but in a different color and it is E die and runs 3200 rated in x399 and x370 with docp.


----------



## Simmons572

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> That looks to be E die. I think the newer rgb ones might be hynix. The set you have linked I own a set of it but in a different color and it is E die and runs 3200 rated in x399 and x370 with docp.


Roger that. I am not interested in the RGB kits, so I will stick with this one. Thanks for the info mate


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

5 Loops of cb15 is a super poor stress test as it finishes so damn quick on this CPU! better off using Prime95, the AIO is slow to heat up also, with machine cool that would just spike temperature and instantly fall back down before you had a chance to hit render again.

I'm just playing with the Ryze Master Application and MSI Command Center for fan profiles, no BIOS trickery as I have no idea what I am doing

Standard clock speed 1950X after running Prime95 for a few minutes gets to 65c Tdie, 92 Tctl with Liqtech 360 running at 50% fan speed ( shows as 1180 rpm and audibly is a calm blowing sound ), the default Fan profiles with this MSI Carbon Mobo are no use and it is impossible hard to get it balanced! Also the design of the Enthoo Evolv case is not letting enough air out of the top of the case I feel.

Managed to get it balanced aroun 67c at 65% fan speed / 1660 rpm ( quite noisy but tolerable ) 3900mhz 1.325v fun how slight increase in V and is suddenly has no hope of keeping up with temp swelling, but can take a few minutes to react due to the liquid. No idea if it is 100% stable yet will leave it running if that is ok then I can try increase the clock speed keeping the volts the same... if I have the radiator hanging out the case it gets about 4-6c cooler

I say this and then suddenly it decided to climb to 72c probably after sliding radiator back in case -_- DESIGN FLAW seems even having the door a little open or closed changes things so cant seem to feed it enough air in

Ok with the case closed I'm getting 68c at 1.275v - then as soon as I say open Chrome or do anything else back up it climbs to 70c so down to 1.2626v I go... so sensetive! so that is perfectly stable, I open C4D and render and instant crash! so down to 3800mhz I go and it is actually stable for hours rendering now 3800mhz 1.2875v

For curious entire system pulls 420w at 1.325v and about 350w at 1.2625v 65% fan speed 65-70c

I can't really find any definitive info on what is a good and safe Tdie or Tctcl temp for long periods, other than my own experience that Tctl of 100 is about to shutdown, I see various reviews of Tdie hovering around 60c at full load which indicates something is wrong for me, I applied plenty of thermal compound ( Arctic Silver 5 ) going with better to have a bit too much than too little

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> Thanks s much ssateneth, Particle, BIOS 1.52 worked!!! no more shutdowns! and even the C0 errors stopped
> 
> Managing some overclocks now-ish gets a bit too hot for my liking so probably wont bother in the long run as the XFR that is disabled when OC'd is just too damn handy, and stability is super important
> 
> Standard clock speed results in 61c tdie temp when heavy load, so overclocking quickly gets it 70-74c say at 3950mhz 1.35-1.4v which just just seems... unwise to me and that is with a Liqtech 360 AIO at a very noisy fan level. Maybe someone has different numbers but I am getting the impression anything above 60c for long periods is a bit on the wild side?, at 74c the tctl ( as made up as it is ) is poking around 100c and after that I think is instant shutdown territory, unless you are lucky and can stay truly stable at lower volts, not just a few runs of Cinebench :-D


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> that temp under load seems a tad high.
> 
> when i get a chance i,ll throw mine back to stock and check.
> and what are you using to get the loaded temp?
> so far that evil bastard gooseberry has shown the highest temps on mine bar maybe prime 95 small ffts.
> 
> 5 loops of of cb15 overclocked to 3900 only give me 61 degrees and thats on a h115i with should not be cooling better than that enermax.
> 
> also congrats on sorting it out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i agree it does not make any sense at all but it cannot be the other dies because they are just slugs.
> problem is a apart from one other guy here i don't know of any other reviews at all.
> 
> i,ll see if i can hunt down some more and not simulated


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> I remember back in the day used to have a rule to have 1 dimm per core.. I guess that doesn't really matter any more... it wont have issues only having 4 sticks vs 8 sticks at the same 64gb? like same performance and all?


No performance difference, in fact it might perform better as 4 sticks will be less stress on the IMC so might be able to run the memory faster/tighter.


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Your scores seem "off" for 4.1 much less 4.0. Properly tuned without throttling I see 3500 on average.


not sure how "Good" my overclock is.. at 4070 its stable and makes it threw all the tests and temps are good, 4.1 it runs too hot so I backed it down. I haven't really changed anything besides voltage and multiplyer... so I'm not sure if theres anything else that could be holding it back.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> I can't really find any definitive info on what is a good and safe Tdie or Tctcl temp for long periods, other than my own experience that Tctl of 100 is about to shutdown, I see various reviews of Tdie hovering around 60c at full load which indicates something is wrong for me, I applied plenty of thermal compound ( Arctic Silver 5 ) going with better to have a bit too much than too little


Over 100tctl is fine but ignore tctl, it's only useful for oems running stock heatsink and fans. I'm going to talk solely about tdie temps here, as that's the only temp we need to be looking at or concerned with. Threadripper will start to throttle at 85c, so you need to keep it under that at least for performance reasons. It's TjMax (i.e. when the PC shuts down) is 95c. Now, you wont find AMD or anyone else recommending a "max safe temp" other than those two. So you can look at the throttle limit as a "soft" max temp, and the Tjmax as a "hard" max temp.

However, over the years, us overclockers have accumulated knowledge and common observations. You'll find many recommending you run at 10c below the throttle limit, for three reasons:-

1: To avoid hitting any performance limiting factors (i.e. when the cpu throttles, its speed is lower)*.
2: To preserve the life of the processors. The hotter compenents run at, the quicker they degrade. As overclockers we typically run our processors at higher voltage which can itself degrade cpus faster. To offset this, we are typically more conservative with regards to temperature.
3: Perhaps the most important, overclockers have noticed (and it's no different for TR in my experience), that as the throttling temp limit is approached, overclock stability degrades.

TLDR:

A: You can't get to a dangerous temperature anyway as the pc will shut down at 95c to prevent damage.
B: Performance will degrade if you exceed 85c*.
C: Overclock stability degrades as you approach 85c.

Takling all the above into consideration, 75c max long term is a good figure to aim for if you want a good balance of longevity, performance and stability.

*All the above assumes you have NOT disabled PROCHOT. If you have disabled PROCHOT the cpu will NOT throttle at 85c. It will still however shut down if temps reach 95c. Disabling PROCHOT is good for quick "bleeding edge" bench runs.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> This particular setup I am using is doing wonders with Fury X....
> 
> Another #1 spot stolen.


Ooooof - nice cpu score!


----------



## gtbtk

You may find this video interesting. The particular cores that a Thread Ripper CPU chooses to run a games on can have a performance impact up to about 25%

If you use CPU affinity settings to manage what cpu cores the game runs on, you can avoid having to use the AMD Gaming node or NUMA settings that impact rendering workloads while getting similar performance benefits for gaming.

These Chips have two PCIe controllers, one on each die. If the Game runs on the cores that are resident on the die that the GPU is not installed to, the performance is reduced by about 25%.






While you can manually set the affinity under Windows, there is no method of saving the affinity or automatically applying the affinity settings except for writing command line launch scripts for each and every game and building it into a short cut.

There are a number of handy utilities such as Process Lasso or Process Manager can be used to manage permanent application affinity settings on an application by application basis.

Links to both utilities below

Process Lasso https://bitsum.com/ or

Processmanager http://www.bill2-software.com/processmanager/


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

Ok, 75c on the Tdie, so around 102 Tctl, good to know as I have seen it stable for hours at say 60 and then just dart to 70 on a whim so setting the goal to 75 gives it room to dart north to 85 where it just throttle, I was getting more crashes as it got to higher tempos but then I might have needed more voltage, which kinda feels funny as that makes it even hotter  but in a better way, any better tools you recommend for controlling the fan curves as the MSI command enter is woeful, this is the best I can do with it ( image attached ), which looks ridiculous but seems to work as it wont let you fine tune enough to get it right IMO and seemingly ignores what I ask it to do anyway.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Over 100tctl is fine but ignore tctl, it's only useful for oems running stock heatsink and fans. I'm going to talk solely about tdie temps here, as that's the only temp we need to be looking at or concerned with. Threadripper will start to throttle at 85c, so you need to keep it under that at least for performance reasons. It's TjMax (i.e. when the PC shuts down) is 95c. Now, you wont find AMD or anyone else recommending a "max safe temp" other than those two. So you can look at the throttle limit as a "soft" max temp, and the Tjmax as a "hard" max temp.
> 
> However, over the years, us overclockers have accumulated knowledge and common observations. You'll find many recommending you run at 10c below the throttle limit, for three reasons:-
> 
> 1: To avoid hitting any performance limiting factors (i.e. when the cpu throttles, its speed is lower)*.
> 2: To preserve the life of the processors. The hotter compenents run at, the quicker they degrade. As overclockers we typically run our processors at higher voltage which can itself degrade cpus faster. To offset this, we are typically more conservative with regards to temperature.
> 3: Perhaps the most important, overclockers have noticed (and it's no different for TR in my experience), that as the throttling temp limit is approached, overclock stability degrades.
> 
> TLDR:
> 
> A: You can't get to a dangerous temperature anyway as the pc will shut down at 95c to prevent damage.
> B: Performance will degrade if you exceed 85c*.
> C: Overclock stability degrades as you approach 85c.
> 
> Takling all the above into consideration, 75c max long term is a good figure to aim for if you want a good balance of longevity, performance and stability.
> 
> *All the above assumes you have NOT disabled PROCHOT. If you have disabled PROCHOT the cpu will NOT throttle at 85c. It will still however shut down if temps reach 95c. Disabling PROCHOT is good for quick "bleeding edge" bench runs.


----------



## chew*

Concerning temps...as I see a ton of speculation with 0 concrete hard specs from AMD. The stilts comment on XS concerning temps.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Stilt;5260844*
> ComputerBase tested the whole Noctua TR4 line-up.
> A long story short: They suck (barely sufficient at stock).
> 
> They kept a stock 1950X 0.2 - 4.9 degree C below the rated tDieMax (68 degree C).
> 
> https://www.computerbase.de/2017-08/noctua-nh-u14s-u12s-u9-tr4-test/
> 
> The whole launch of Threadripper has been pretty disgraceful.
> It's been over three weeks since the launch and you can't even purchase a proper cooler for the CPU.
> The only thing you can get is one of the 20+ Asetek AIO variants, or one of the few water blocks which require a custom loop.
> Enermax Liqtech TR4 AIOs were initially supposed to become available in the beginning of september, however now the european retailers have a new ETA set to the end of october.


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

It is very frustrating the lack of cooling options beyond adaptions but then 4months ago no one knew this chip existed, so I guess we could blame them for being so nimble 
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Concerning temps...as I see a ton of speculation with 0 concrete hard specs from AMD. The stilts comment on XS concerning temps.


----------



## J-S-Q

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Over 100tctl is fine but ignore tctl, it's only useful for oems running stock heatsink and fans. I'm going to talk solely about tdie temps here, as that's the only temp we need to be looking at or concerned with. Threadripper will start to throttle at 85c, so you need to keep it under that at least for performance reasons. It's TjMax (i.e. when the PC shuts down) is 95c. *Now, you wont find AMD or anyone else recommending a "max safe temp" other than those two.* So you can look at the throttle limit as a "soft" max temp, and the Tjmax as a "hard" max temp.


It does say 'Max Temps: 68c' on the AMD website.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *J-S-Q*
> 
> It does say 'Max Temps: 68c' on the AMD website.


Which is why I pointed out that score in cb sub 3500 @ 4.1 looked off. You might not catch it throttling in software....but the score he posted says otherwise.

Just like all the throttled back scores we saw pre launch leaked.

I did not leak anything...but i knew the scores were "off" because i experienced it myself till i got temps in check.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> I'd personally just go with the static voltage, granted the cooling is sufficient.


Why?


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> You may find this video interesting. The particular cores that a Thread Ripper CPU chooses to run a games on can have a performance impact up to about 25%
> 
> If you use CPU affinity settings to manage what cpu cores the game runs on, you can avoid having to use the AMD Gaming node or NUMA settings that impact rendering workloads while getting similar performance benefits for gaming.
> 
> These Chips have two PCIe controllers, one on each die. If the Game runs on the cores that are resident on the die that the GPU is not installed to, the performance is reduced by about 25%.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While you can manually set the affinity under Windows, there is no method of saving the affinity or automatically applying the affinity settings except for writing command line launch scripts for each and every game and building it into a short cut.
> 
> There are a number of handy utilities such as Process Lasso or Process Manager can be used to manage permanent application affinity settings on an application by application basis.
> 
> Links to both utilities below
> 
> Process Lasso https://bitsum.com/ or
> 
> Processmanager http://www.bill2-software.com/processmanager/






ok after looking at that and if i am reading it right affinity with just the even cores gives the best result but in that one game and i,m not really seeing 25 percent between all cores and that ...there is a marked difference but i would like to see more games (like chew and his timespy would be a good example)

i will grab one or so of those tools and give it a whirl.


----------



## chew*

I can say at minimum...keep games off threads. Threads are 50% of core ipc.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Which is why I pointed out that score in cb sub 3500 @ 4.1 looked off. You might not catch it throttling in software....but the score he posted says otherwise.
> 
> Just like all the throttled back scores we saw pre launch leaked.
> 
> I did not leak anything...but i knew the scores were "off" because i experienced it myself till i got temps in check.


unless you tweak up hwinfo to report faster yes you may miss some throttling but the best bet is run it once then run it 5 more times once the fluid has heated up if you see a marked decline then yes it may be throttling.

same thing happens to my video card in 3dmark...if you have an air cooled vega try the stress test guaranteed to fail







all due to throttling.


----------



## chew*

Yep. Ryzen 7 can do it to. I have been using 290xs and fury x's for awhile now. I can just tell when somethings throttling nowadays since i am so used to the symptoms.


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Why?


Don't really trust automatic voltage tweaking, even llc. Would just rather know the limits of my chip and run it at static voltage and clocks, regardless of load. However, only if I can cool it sufficiently.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I don't know the answer, but I know that the answer to "Is it really feeding the dummy dies with juice?" is definitely no.
> 
> 
> 
> Are you absolutely sure? I know it shouldn't be, but perhaps there's something wrong with the BIOS / micro code.
> 
> 
> 
> Seems very strange indeed ...
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> Those lanes need feeding I guess.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's CPU power, not mobo + CPU. No way the additional lanes for the PCIe controller on the CPU take anywhere near that much.
Click to expand...

It would appear that the Infinity fabric and transferring data across it is the thing that seems to be rather power hungry. The Ryzen chips are reasonable power effiicient

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> You may find this video interesting. The particular cores that a Thread Ripper CPU chooses to run a games on can have a performance impact up to about 25%
> 
> If you use CPU affinity settings to manage what cpu cores the game runs on, you can avoid having to use the AMD Gaming node or NUMA settings that impact rendering workloads while getting similar performance benefits for gaming.
> 
> These Chips have two PCIe controllers, one on each die. If the Game runs on the cores that are resident on the die that the GPU is not installed to, the performance is reduced by about 25%.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While you can manually set the affinity under Windows, there is no method of saving the affinity or automatically applying the affinity settings except for writing command line launch scripts for each and every game and building it into a short cut.
> 
> There are a number of handy utilities such as Process Lasso or Process Manager can be used to manage permanent application affinity settings on an application by application basis.
> 
> Links to both utilities below
> 
> Process Lasso https://bitsum.com/ or
> 
> Processmanager http://www.bill2-software.com/processmanager/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ok after looking at that and if i am reading it right affinity with just the even cores gives the best result but in that one game and i,m not really seeing 25 percent between all cores and that ...there is a marked difference but i would like to see more games (like chew and his timespy would be a good example)
> 
> i will grab one or so of those tools and give it a whirl.
Click to expand...

Not quite. Remember that there are only 16 physical cpu cores. The secondary SMT threads are making use of the idle time being left available from the primary thread having to wait for memory and disk IO, user input etc. The 2nd thread running on a core will always have less performance than a primary thread. The numbering scheme reported by the operating system is more for ease of use. Threads will be allocated to unused physical cores first before the secondary treads are allocated by the scheduler. The OS allocates an even and an odd cpu number to each physical core for the purposes of user friendlyness and reporting to the user. If the core is idle, then the primary thread will be allocated to the core with the even number as it is the first in line for thread allocation, After all the physical cores have been allocated a primary thready the secondary threads will then be allocated to the odd numbered CPUs. But, if the Even CPU thread finishes, the odd numbered CPU will become the primary thread, it is only because the even "CPUs" tend to get a head start on the tread allocation that it appears that they are stronger.

As you know, Threadripper provides 64 PCIe lanes. Each Die has a controller that provides 32 lanes each. With a single graphics card installed, you are accessing x16 Lanes and have a situation where half the available threadripper cores access the Graphics card pretty much directly because they are on the same die and the cores on the other die have to send data over the Infinity Fabric to get to the physical graphics card connection and have to deal with the additional 100ns latency that the routing over the infinity fabric entails.

From looking at the reviews, there are some games that can benefit from the low latency that you can access by manually managing the affinity for those games, there are others that seem to benefit more from the higher memory bandwidth that running threads on both dies can give you. It shows that Thread ripper benefits from CPU affinity management for various workloads and it can be done without the need to hamper productivity workloads in favor of games or require a reboot the way the AMD Wattman software currently forces you to do when it disables cores with a bcdedit efi modification in "Gaming mode".


----------



## shredded

Curious, has anyone seen the epyc die shot? Amd just posted it on fb 
Source


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> It would appear that the Infinity fabric and transferring data across it is the thing that seems to be rather power hungry. The Ryzen chips are reasonable power effiicient
> Not quite. Remember that there are only 16 physical cpu cores. The secondary SMT threads are making use of the idle time being left available from the primary thread having to wait for memory and disk IO, user input etc. The 2nd thread running on a core will always have less performance than a primary thread. The numbering scheme reported by the operating system is more for ease of use. Threads will be allocated to unused physical cores first before the secondary treads are allocated by the scheduler. The OS allocates an even and an odd cpu number to each physical core for the purposes of user friendlyness and reporting to the user. If the core is idle, then the primary thread will be allocated to the core with the even number as it is the first in line for thread allocation, After all the physical cores have been allocated a primary thready the secondary threads will then be allocated to the odd numbered CPUs. But, if the Even CPU thread finishes, the odd numbered CPU will become the primary thread, it is only because the even "CPUs" tend to get a head start on the tread allocation that it appears that they are stronger.
> 
> As you know, Threadripper provides 64 PCIe lanes. Each Die has a controller that provides 32 lanes each. With a single graphics card installed, you are accessing x16 Lanes and have a situation where half the available threadripper cores access the Graphics card pretty much directly because they are on the same die and the cores on the other die have to send data over the Infinity Fabric to get to the physical graphics card connection and have to deal with the additional 100ns latency that the routing over the infinity fabric entails.
> 
> From looking at the reviews, there are some games that can benefit from the low latency that you can access by manually managing the affinity for those games, there are others that seem to benefit more from the higher memory bandwidth that running threads on both dies can give you. It shows that Thread ripper benefits from CPU affinity management for various workloads and it can be done without the need to hamper productivity workloads in favor of games or require a reboot the way the AMD Wattman software currently forces you to do when it disables cores with a bcdedit efi modification in "Gaming mode".






i agree with everything you said and understand half of it








but
always a but with me...i have actually tested games and even loaded the results here...somewhere...and using gamers mode did nothing literally nothing to improve performance on the games i play...i have no interest in gtav so that's a mute point for me but i do play ROTR and doom and actually doom suffered in game mode.

one game that that had a bout 5 fps boost but was a stutter mess was shadows of mordor where in normal mode it was butter.
i understand the latency issues with the pcie lanes but in my testing so far it does not seem to be an issue...maybe because i only have 1 card maybe with sli/crossfire it would be a much more pronounced issue.

but when i get a chance i will do some more testing just waiting on my second hand car costing watercooling to arrive.


----------



## Aenra

Don't own a TR, so excuse any ignorance 

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I can say at minimum...keep games off threads. Threads are 50% of core ipc.


And in regard to NUMA vs UMA?

(if this has been covered, by all means ignore me)

Also, regarding the GPU/die lane.. any way to know in advance which is which? Without the manual testing i mean.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> i agree with everything you said and understand half of it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but
> always a but with me...i have actually tested games and even loaded the results here...somewhere...and using gamers mode did nothing literally nothing to improve performance on the games i play...i have no interest in gtav so that's a mute point for me but i do play ROTR and doom and actually doom suffered in game mode.
> 
> one game that that had a bout 5 fps boost but was a stutter mess was shadows of mordor where in normal mode it was butter.
> i understand the latency issues with the pcie lanes but in my testing so far it does not seem to be an issue...maybe because i only have 1 card maybe with sli/crossfire it would be a much more pronounced issue.
> 
> but when i get a chance i will do some more testing just waiting on my second hand car costing watercooling to arrive.


Every application behaves differently. Looking at reviews, Battlefield 1 seems to love lots of cores and only gets a tiny boost with Local memory mode. Other games seem to get big differences in performance so it is one of those things that, at least until it is better understood, is going to require a little trial and error testing to see what happens. Benchmarks from around the internet all indicate that ROTR does benefit from the NUMA mode setting and that the 1920x and 1950x both perform about the same. That indicates to me that the ROTR code is limited in the number of threads it can access. The problem with all the reviews and the AMD marketing material is that they all do a terrible job explaining what the PC is doing if you change from UMA to NUMA mode. Everything I have read is a contradictory confused mess. I am still not completely clear if NUMA mode is also the same as Game Mode running 8c/16th or if NUMA mode is still running 16c/32t.

I was the one who requested that the YouTuber do the tests in the video. In a previous video of his, he was testing War Thunder with SMT on and off. I noticed that War thunder was only using about 6 threads but every time it ran the 6th thread was always the highest number CPU as shown by the afterburner CPU utilization %. It made no difference if SMT was on or off. When SMT was on, I was seeing the first 5 or 6 CPUs with moderate activity CPU7 to CPU30 at basically 0% and CPU 31 at 100% utilization. I do not know if games always run on the last available core is common situation on Thread ripper or not. For applications that run a number of different processes with only one process that communicates with the Graphics card and the physics threads not being absolutely time critical, there could be performance benefits running the game across cores on both dies as long as the GPU associated process runs on the die that also connects the local PCIe controller to the GPU.

The problem with the AMD "solution" of game mode is that it disables the cores on one of the dies at boot time so they are not available at all if you want to render or do some other thing that can make use of the 32 threads. Setting the affinity to the appropriate cores should be able to solve the performance problems by keeping the cores that communicate with the GPU and memory controller all on the same die without the compromising the rendering/productivity ability of the CPU


----------



## Fantasy

Alright, my cooler finally arrived. I installed it but had a problem. Because the cooler is so massive, it blocked the first PCI-E slot. I couldn't insert my graphics card in it. Which really sucks. So major disclaimer to anyone who is going to buy the Noctua NH-U14S-TR4-SP3 and has an Asus Zenith Extreme, you won't be able to insert your graphics card or anything for that matter in the PCI-E slot closest to the CPU. Even though the cooler has a cool feature where you can offset it by 0, 3 or 6mm, it was not enough to clear the PCI-E slot for me. So I had to install my GPU in the third slot.

The second problem I ran into is with my motherboard which kept giving me a B2 VGA BIOS code. I had to restart my board multiple times to get it to boot. I think I fixed the issue by going into the BIOS and disabling CSM and only allowing UEFI mode.

As for my memory, I was surprised it booted at 3033MHz. If I try to boot at 3200MHz it won't post. I will play with the voltages later to see how far I can push this 64GB kit.

Also, I noticed my CPU voltage going up to 1.5V which is insane. I don't know what is the deal with that. I think max voltage is 1.38? I'm not sure. I have to look that up.

Right now I'm just waiting for windows 10 ISO to download from MS website and to install it on my machine.

Also, I can't afford to buy a case for my system




























so it's open bench for now. I going to have to make sure no liquids or food is around it









here are some pics. sorry for the **** camera work. I'm horrible with cameras.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I am still not completely clear if NUMA mode is also the same as Game Mode running 8c/16th or if NUMA mode is still running 16c/32t.


Game Mode is:

- "Legacy Compatibility Mode" enabled= one die enabled, SMT is ON, 8c/16t, memory on "local"=NUMA

Creator Mode is:

- "Legacy Compatibility Mode" disabled= both dies enabled, SMT is ON, 16c/32t, memory is "distributed"=UMA


----------



## futr_vision

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Ok, spent all night fixing/tuning my overclock.
> 
> Currently at 3.9ghz with a 1950x
> and 3066mhz with 14-14-14-30 128gb gskill tridentz (not sure if b die, anyway to check? Originally came in 15-15-15-35 latency)
> 
> Hitting 3kmhz with all 8 dimms filled to the max was fairly difficult, and i havent tested cold booting yet. Unfortunatelty i wasnt able to find any settings for cold boot ddr voltage in the gigabyte bios... fingers crossed


How's this working out for you? i'm about to order my Threadripper 1950X and the ASRock X399 Taichi and I'm looking for memory. I'm thinking that 64GB(4x16) 3200 CL14 is a good place to start and gives me room to expand.


----------



## futr_vision

Question on RAM. I'm getting a Thredripper 1950X and a ASRock X399 Taichi. I'll be doing a little gaming but nothing crazy. My main push on this system is going to be creative work, machine learning and some crypto mining(both CPU and GPU). I'm looking for RAM at this point(and a video card but that is another question). While I have typically run 16GB or 32GB I am thinking of starting this one off with 65GB(4x16). From everything I've read it looks like my best performance is going to be had running at around 3200 even though the board can supposedly handle 3600+ . Also looks like CL 14 would be another thing to look for. Another thing would be Samsung's B Die . That alone seems to indicate one of these two kits might be my best bet(I know there is also an RGB kit but I don't need superfluous features)

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232208&cm_re=F4-3200C14Q-64GTZ-_-20-232-208-_-Product

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232349&ignorebbr=1&cm_re=F4-3200C14Q-64GTZSW-_-20-232-349-_-Product

Would this be the way to go?


----------



## hebrewbacon

.


----------



## crion

Hi,
1950x owner and in progressing with a new fanless build based on Calyos NSG S0 (fanlessfan.com).

The RAM question seems to be the hardest one for TR4 owners as we not only have to go for Samsung B-Die but also the layout is important.

Is there a general consensus what pertains the highest potential for highest stable RAM clock speed?

64GB:
4x Double Ranked 16GB DIMM @3600MHz
vs.
8x Single Ranked 8GB DIMM @3600MHz

My target is 64GB @3600MHz and ordered:
G.Skill TridentZ RGB DDR4-3600 C17 QC - 64GB F4-3600C17Q-64GTZR
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232576&cm_re=F4-3600C17Q-64GTZR-_-20-232-576-_-Product

Reference, Samsung B-Die RAM compiled list:
https://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f13/die-ultimate-hardwareluxx-samsung-8gb-b-die-liste-alle-hersteller-01-09-17-a-1161530-print.html


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> And in regard to NUMA vs UMA?
> (if this has been covered, by all means ignore me)
> 
> Also, regarding the GPU/die lane.. any way to know in advance which is which? Without the manual testing i mean.


Ignore it. Its been proven that just letting it pull memory acess normally is fine in 99% of games


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crion*
> 
> Hi,
> 1950x owner and in progressing with a new fanless build based on Calyos NSG S0 (fanlessfan.com).
> 
> The RAM question seems to be the hardest one for TR4 owners as we not only have to go for Samsung B-Die but also the layout is important.
> 
> Is there a general consensus what pertains the highest potential for highest stable RAM clock speed?
> 
> 64GB:
> 4x Double Ranked 16GB DIMM @3600MHz
> vs.
> 8x Single Ranked 8GB DIMM @3600MHz
> 
> My target is 64GB @3600MHz and ordered:
> G.Skill TridentZ RGB DDR4-3600 C17 QC - 64GB F4-3600C17Q-64GTZR
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232576&cm_re=F4-3600C17Q-64GTZR-_-20-232-576-_-Product
> 
> Reference, Samsung B-Die RAM compiled list:
> https://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f13/die-ultimate-hardwareluxx-samsung-8gb-b-die-liste-alle-hersteller-01-09-17-a-1161530-print.html


Your target should be 32gb @ 3600.

Dual rank is not magically better on tr. Its the same dies just better binned. 3200 is realistic for dr.


----------



## futr_vision

Why not 64GB? I'm aiming for 64GB with the possibility of adding another 64GB in the future.


----------



## chew*

If the target is 3600 your going to need either a ton of luck or a huge wallet to bin chips.

In ryzen chips 3200 DR is common and when populating all dimms with DR 3066 is common. Higher is the rarity.

The other option is SR....but chances of getting 8 SR sticks ( for 64gb ) that clock well and a good imc is slim.

Best chance is 32gb 4x8gb configs.


----------



## crion

Checking the Fatal1ty X399 memory QVL I can see

http://www.asrock.com/MB/AMD/Fatal1ty%20X399%20Professional%20Gaming/index.us.asp#Memory

The highest confirmed QVL with 4pcs working only in dual channel on 16GB DS so far is this kit:
Type Speed↓ Size Module Chip Part No SS/DS Single Channel Dual Channel Triple Channel Quad Channel OC
DDR4 3333 16GB Corsair CMK64GX4M4B3333C16R ver:4.31 DS 2pcs 4pcs v

The highest QVL of real Quad channel SR 8GB so far is:
DDR4 3000 8GB ADATA AX4U300038G16-BRS SS v v

The highest QVL of real Quad channel DR 16GB so far is:
DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:4.31 DS 2pcs v v
DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:5.30 DS 2pcs v v
DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:3.32 DS 2pcs v v
DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:3.31 DS 2pcs v v

Threadripper has probably more in common with the EPYC platform rather than the Ryzen(?), if that is a good thing I guess we will find out as we try out new things. Is Corsair working better than G.Skill on this board? I guess time will tell.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crion*
> 
> Checking the Fatal1ty X399 memory QVL I can see
> 
> http://www.asrock.com/MB/AMD/Fatal1ty%20X399%20Professional%20Gaming/index.us.asp#Memory
> 
> The highest confirmed QVL with 4pcs working only in dual channel on 16GB DS so far is this kit:
> Type Speed↓ Size Module Chip Part No SS/DS Single Channel Dual Channel Triple Channel Quad Channel OC
> DDR4 3333 16GB Corsair CMK64GX4M4B3333C16R ver:4.31 DS 2pcs 4pcs v
> 
> The highest QVL of real Quad channel SR 8GB so far is:
> DDR4 3000 8GB ADATA AX4U300038G16-BRS SS v v
> 
> The highest QVL of real Quad channel DR 16GB so far is:
> DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:4.31 DS 2pcs v v
> DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:5.30 DS 2pcs v v
> DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:3.32 DS 2pcs v v
> DDR4 3000 16GB Corsair CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 ver:3.31 DS 2pcs v v
> 
> Threadripper has probably more in common with the EPYC platform rather than the Ryzen(?), if that is a good thing I guess we will find out as we try out new things. Is Corsair working better than G.Skill on this board? I guess time will tell.


I ignore QVLs and just test myself.


----------



## Fantasy

Wow, I can't believe how lucky I got. My ram has Samsung B-die.

Anyways, right now I'm running my 64GB kit RAM at 16-16-16-39-72-1T @ 3066 @ 1.3v. I'm also running my CPU on all 16 cores at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750V but it goes up to 1.375V under full load. My SOC is at 1.25v.



Quick question. Does anyone feel like their system is a bit choppy? I feel like my system is not running smooth at all. Things like the task manager take at least a full 1.5 seconds to open and things generally are laggy and choppy even at 4GHz. If I run my system in Game mode things improve a lot but there is still a bit of choppiness.


----------



## chew*

Nope. Mine is smooth as a babies behind but...i am not reaching for the stars and am prime stable and temperature stable ( no throttling ) @ 3.8 1.2v ht off.


----------



## Fantasy

uuh this is so frustrating, I can't figure out why my system is so laggy.


----------



## Djreversal

just curious... on these benchmarks... would me having 2 4k monitors on at the same time cause and slow down??? like should I power one of them down??


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Wow, I can't believe how lucky I got. My ram has Samsung B-die.
> 
> Anyways, right now I'm running my 64GB kit RAM at 16-16-16-39-72-1T @ 3066 @ 1.3v. I'm also running my CPU on all 16 cores at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750V but it goes up to 1.375V under full load. My SOC is at 1.25v.
> 
> 
> 
> Quick question. Does anyone feel like their system is a bit choppy? I feel like my system is not running smooth at all. Things like the task manager take at least a full 1.5 seconds to open and things generally are laggy and choppy even at 4GHz. If I run my system in Game mode things improve a lot but there is still a bit of choppiness.






kill off hpet
problem will be fixed.

you can get away usually with the last code but i do false then deletevalue then false to check.
Quote:


> [/cmd admin
> 
> to enable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock true
> 
> to disable HPET - bcdedit /set useplatformclock false
> 
> bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclockQUOTE]
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I ignore QVLs and just test myself.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what ram is that?
> 
> i still haven't tuned my flarex yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> stock benches to come with big spoiler because there are a lot.(reason is i, m getting a huge box of water-cooling stuff so i want to see if just cooling better helps card and chip then clocking up)
> 
> all tests done dead stock stock volts xmp on the ram no tweaks.
> only thing done is the vega is a little overclocked and the ram is at 1030.
> 
> benefits are a lot lower temps and power draw while really not loosing a lot of performance. Gooseberry blender is a good example.
> other tests were ROTR
> freesync by the way takes 5fps off the scores in 1080p and 4k.
> all settings very high as in maxed and fxaa
> 4k
> 
> MP:41
> Syria:43.8
> GV:41.6
> overall:49.12
> 
> 1080p
> mp:164
> Syria:115
> gv:105
> overall:129
> 1080p by the way looks like ass
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...


----------



## happyluckbox

Just got the Liqtech TR-4 cooler installed on my threadripper rig, running 3.9ghz 1.35v. Before I was running the Kraken x52 and p95 blend would put me around 87degrees. With the Liqtech TR-4 I'm now sitting at a 68max. Thats almost a 20 degree difference. I cant believe how much the full cover IHS block and upgrading from a 240 to a 360 rad helped!


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> kill off hpet
> problem will be fixed.


Are you kidding me... holy.... that made a huge difference. Thanks !

does AMD hardware not have HPET support?


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Just got the Liqtech TR-4 cooler installed on my threadripper rig, running 3.9ghz 1.35v. Before I was running the Kraken x52 and p95 blend would put me around 87degrees. With the Liqtech TR-4 I'm now sitting at a 68max. Thats almost a 20 degree difference. I cant believe how much the full cover IHS block and upgrading from a 240 to a 360 rad helped!


So an aio is matching custom loops with double thick 360/480 rads in push pull configs?

You live in alaska?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Are you kidding me... holy.... that made a huge difference. Thanks !
> 
> does AMD hardware not have HPET support?


they do just seems Microsoft doesn't









just remember you won't be entering any hwbot compass as they seem to require hpet to be on.

I'm sure it will get fixed sooner or later but hey.

my watercooling gear arrives tomorrow so if you see a nuke going off down south....i screwed up and lost my shizz







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> So an aio is matching custom loops with double thick 360/480 rads in push pull configs?
> 
> You live in alaska?


to give a little context my h115i while at 3950 and 1.3 volts was pulling 78 degrees tdie doing prime 95 small ffts and the same temps maybe a tiny bit more for gooseberry.
stock clocks as i showed in the shots didn't get passed 50 degrees(fans at around 1300 rpm not very loud considering i have 5 women and 3 dogs...hell a Harley isn't loud i guess









oh and no i don't live in Alaska but i do live in the mountains and the last few weeks its around 10 degrees in here Celsius. Not that Fahrenheit crap


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> they do just seems Microsoft doesn't
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just remember you won't be entering any hwbot compass as they seem to require hpet to be on.
> 
> I'm sure it will get fixed sooner or later but hey.
> 
> my watercooling gear arrives tomorrow so if you see a nuke going off down south....i screwed up and lost my shizz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to give a little context my h115i while at 3950 and 1.3 volts was pulling 78 degrees tdie doing prime 95 small ffts and the same temps maybe a tiny bit more for gooseberry.
> stock clocks as i showed in the shots didn't get passed 50 degrees(fans at around 1300 rpm not very loud considering i have 5 women and 3 dogs...hell a Harley isn't loud i guess


----------



## chew*

Is that like hours so loop reaches saturation or quick tests?

Asking as I need a hassle free solution for a buddy.

A 3x120 rad pump tlined fillport with a waterblock will be to much hassle for him.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> So an aio is matching custom loops with double thick 360/480 rads in push pull configs?
> 
> You live in alaska?


No haha, I live in cali. The liqtech tr-4 shouldnt really be at any disadvantage vs a full custom loop, assuming same rad size and fans, since it has a full coverage block. The liqtech tr-4 was custom made for the threadripper, its not a crappy asetec cooler
(btw I am using push/pullconfig)


----------



## Fantasy

well while disabling HPET gave me a huge performance boost, games and now either crashing altogether or stuttering a lot. Also, windows is acting weird, and I think I'm starting to see artifacts on my desktop. :/

I'm going to try and re-enabling HPET and see if that fixes my current issues.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> So an aio is matching custom loops with double thick 360/480 rads in push pull configs?
> 
> You live in alaska?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Is that like hours so loop reaches saturation or quick tests?
> 
> Asking as I need a hassle free solution for a buddy.
> 
> A 3x120 rad pump tlined fillport with a waterblock will be to much hassle for him.







have a look at that smarter than me people.

that is pretty much what i,m doing but i have only grabbed a single 420 rad for now(in the hope if it isn't enough to cool the threadripper and the vega) i can add another either 140 mm at back or a 240 up front.
as it is i have drained every cent i have so far









as for the video ignoring the really annoying voice...much like every youtube i have ever watched







it seems to be a good setup but is that a 240 and a 360?

and temps wise with the 1080ti in the loop....it seems to me to be pretty good...


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> well while disabling HPET gave me a huge performance boost, games and now either crashing altogether or stuttering a lot. Also, windows is acting weird, and I think I'm starting to see artifacts on my desktop. :/
> 
> I'm going to try and re-enabling HPET and see if that fixes my current issues.


never had aproblem here with those issues.
zero games crash the only game that gives me issues is dirt rally which won't even start unless i kill off some coresIknown issue it seems)
as for weird windows...the only thing that happens to mine is when overclocked windows reports as 3400 and not the overclocked speed and power profiles are broken(doesn't show min max etc, stock clocks it all works.

could have something to do with the video card you have?


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> never had aproblem here with those issues.
> zero games crash the only game that gives me issues is dirt rally which won't even start unless i kill off some coresIknown issue it seems)
> as for weird windows...the only thing that happens to mine is when overclocked windows reports as 3400 and not the overclocked speed and power profiles are broken(doesn't show min max etc, stock clocks it all works.
> 
> could have something to do with the video card you have?


I don't know what the hell is going on. Every couple of minutes my screen goes completely black for a second then back to normal. When I open an application I can't clock on the window or use any software. If i click on the window of any software I click on the desktop instead. Weird bugs all around. My system froze three times. My nvidia drive does not like whatever is happening. Windows is randomly logging me off and when I log back on my nvidia drive doesn't work anymore and I can't see my nvidia control panel. Then two minute's later nvidia driver decides to work and my PC locks up after hearing the sound of a new device was found played by windows. that is ofc my nvidia card was found.

After enabling HPET everything went back to normal. But things are really not normal. I'm going to try install the insider build of windows 10 and see if that helps. If not i'm going to try windows 8.1 or 7.

I have my 970 installed in the third PCI-E slot because my cooler is blocking my first PCI-E slot. My first and third PCI-E are weird to x16. That is why I have my card in the third slot. I don't know if that is causing all these issues.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have a look at that smarter than me people.
> 
> that is pretty much what i,m doing but i have only grabbed a single 420 rad for now(in the hope if it isn't enough to cool the threadripper and the vega) i can add another either 140 mm at back or a 240 up front.
> as it is i have drained every cent i have so far
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as for the video ignoring the really annoying voice...much like every youtube i have ever watched
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it seems to be a good setup but is that a 240 and a 360?
> 
> and temps wise with the 1080ti in the loop....it seems to me to be pretty good...


I just watched that video and an enermax video.

First one...man that guy really likes ek fittings...

The ek block is just there old one adapted to fit.

Rather buy something with a coldplate tuned for.

Second one guy hit 69c also on enermax. I guess for my buddy its an option.

For my own setup id rather not ride the fine line @ amds rated max.

I am in the midst of revamping my system anyway.

Mocking stuff up measuring and going bigger and more radiators.

TR plus 2 Fury x tosses some heat.

Since vegas over priced went dual fury x which is faster...plus vega xfire support is a big ? mark atm.


----------



## Fantasy

well, it's official. Windows 10 is garbage.

Just installed windows 8.1 as far as I can tell, my system is as smooth as butter. Going to install few games and see if things are really better.

[edit]
I can actually pick what updates I want to install. man... windows 10 really blows.... I totally forgot about this.


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> well, it's official. Windows 10 is garbage.
> 
> Just installed windows 8.1 as far as I can tell, my system is as smooth as butter. Going to install few games and see if things are really better.


I'm still running Windows 7 for same reasons. Does everything I want with no problems.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doyll*
> 
> I'm still running Windows 7 for same reasons. Does everything I want with no problems.


You know how when you have been missing something's for so long that you don't really know that you are missing it until you go back to it and be like, Jesus Christ. how have I been living like this all along. This is me right now. My cpu usage went from 20% to 1%.

DUDE, MY INTERNET IS FASTER....
well its not really but my web pages load so much faster. jesus...... MICROSOFT


----------



## doyll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> You know how when you have been missing something's for so long that you don't really know that you are missing it until you go back to it and be like, Jesus Christ. how have I been living like this all along. This is me right now. My cpu usage went from 20% to 1%.
> 
> DUDE, MY INTERNET IS FASTER....
> well its not really but my web pages load so much faster. jesus...... MICROSOFT


I used XP for years after 7 came out for same reasons you just discribed. XP used a fraction of CPU compared to 7. Never tried 8 because I was told 7 was just as good and better in many ways. No idea when I might try10.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I don't know what the hell is going on. Every couple of minutes my screen goes completely black for a second then back to normal. When I open an application I can't clock on the window or use any software. If i click on the window of any software I click on the desktop instead. Weird bugs all around. My system froze three times. My nvidia drive does not like whatever is happening. Windows is randomly logging me off and when I log back on my nvidia drive doesn't work anymore and I can't see my nvidia control panel. Then two minute's later nvidia driver decides to work and my PC locks up after hearing the sound of a new device was found played by windows. that is ofc my nvidia card was found.
> 
> After enabling HPET everything went back to normal. But things are really not normal. I'm going to try install the insider build of windows 10 and see if that helps. If not i'm going to try windows 8.1 or 7.
> 
> I have my 970 installed in the third PCI-E slot because my cooler is blocking my first PCI-E slot. My first and third PCI-E are weird to x16. That is why I have my card in the third slot. I don't know if that is causing all these issues.


well
first thing i would do is circle the computer in mountain ash light a few candles and look up the Winchesters in the phone book...cause that thing is just cursed









i have never seen that sort of behaviour and honestly i would consider a can of petrol and a match(mind you i just watched IT on the weekend







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I just watched that video and an enermax video.
> 
> First one...man that guy really likes ek fittings...
> 
> The ek block is just there old one adapted to fit.
> 
> Rather buy something with a coldplate tuned for.
> 
> Second one guy hit 69c also on enermax. I guess for my buddy its an option.
> 
> For my own setup id rather not ride the fine line @ amds rated max.
> 
> I am in the midst of revamping my system anyway.
> 
> Mocking stuff up measuring and going bigger and more radiators.
> 
> TR plus 2 Fury x tosses some heat.
> 
> Since vegas over priced went dual fury x which is faster...plus vega xfire support is a big ? mark atm.


i agree on the block and wasn't going to get one i was going to try the xspc which seems a lot better suited (plus a few other that are coming out) but that's the issue...they are all *coming out* i figure 89 bucks (here in the land of pay more for geography) is an ok figure to gamble on and if a better one comes out and i,m sure it will i can swap it and sell the ek off.

as for fury x's sold mine







loved the card and the stock water cooling on it was fine but it was hamstrung and i couldn't ring more out of it...plus i got the vega for a *reasonable* price compared to a 1080 and it meant i didn't have t touch anything green









the thing that put me off the enermax is it it isn't available here and there are no real local distributors and even if there were it would be 250 plus which just not seem like value to me.
so i decided to go whole hog.

the only issue i have with the asetek coolers is ambient temps....when it gets to 40 degrees here i can see it severely struggling even at stock and there would be no way increase the cooling efficiency...at least with a custom loop you can add radiators or pumps or whatever.

that is what i am telling myself to justify the cost anyway


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> Roger that. I am not interested in the RGB kits, so I will stick with this one. Thanks for the info mate


This is the set I got for my 1950x/Taichi but looks like it is sold out.









https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232348

Edit: 2x8GB sets are available if two of those were ordered.


----------



## Simmons572

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> Roger that. I am not interested in the RGB kits, so I will stick with this one. Thanks for the info mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the set I got for my 1950x/Taichi but looks like it is sold out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232348
> 
> Edit: 2x8GB sets are available if two of those were ordered.
Click to expand...

I saw that as well, but man the pricing on these RAM kits are ridiculous.







Glad you managed to get a couple of the 2x8 Kits.

In other news, I just finished purchasing the rest of my gear. All of the water cooling gear is in the mail, and I _should_ have all my parts by Monday








That is, minus the XSPC block.

Speaking of that, I reached out to XSPC and PPC about the status of the waterblocks, and the estimated ship time.

According to XSPC, the blocks have already shipped to PPC, and are somewhere in the limbo that is USPS. (or some other carrier, they didn't specify who they shipped with)
According to PPC, the blocks will ship shortly after they are received. Fortunately, PPC is operational again, and shipping supposedly will resume today.

Hopefully this means that we will see the blocks shipped out within the next couple days


----------



## happyluckbox

Ok guys i honestly have no idea how or why, but ever since I upgraded to the liqtech tr4 from the kraken x52, ive been able to push my overclock from 3.9ghz to 4ghz. AND ITS ROCK STABLE SO FAR!! I'm not even needing to use nearly as much voltage as I was before. (Before I needed 1.42 volts to even get it to be stable for 5 minutes of stress testing.

Now I can run it at 1.39vcore and so far I'm passing every stability test with flying colors. Yes my temps dropped by about 15-18c, but I had no idea that it would result in such a huge stability boost with lower vcore to boot.

EDIT: Ok now this is just weird. I decided to drop my voltage way back to original voltage for 3.9ghz, (1.35vcore) and im still looking stable!!
This is insane. How can a new cooler make this much difference? Could perhaps the even pressure applied by the full cover waterblock be somehow applying even pressure for the pins to contact the cpu, whereas before I had intermittent contact?


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Ok guys i honestly have no idea how or why, but ever since I upgraded to the liqtech tr4 from the kraken x52, ive been able to push my overclock from 3.9ghz to 4ghz. AND ITS ROCK STABLE SO FAR!! I'm not even needing to use nearly as much voltage as I was before. (Before I needed 1.42 volts to even get it to be stable for 5 minutes of stress testing.
> 
> Now I can run it at 1.39vcore and so far I'm passing every stability test with flying colors. Yes my temps dropped by about 15-18c, but I had no idea that it would result in such a huge stability boost with lower vcore to boot.
> 
> EDIT: Ok now this is just weird. I decided to drop my voltage way back to original voltage for 3.9ghz, (1.35vcore) and im still looking stable!!
> This is insane. How can a new cooler make this much difference? Could perhaps the even pressure applied by the full cover waterblock be somehow applying even pressure for the pins to contact the cpu, whereas before I *had intermittent contact?*


This or overvolting causing too much heat I would think. I would go with poor contact due to that large temp drop.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> well
> first thing i would do is circle the computer in mountain ash light a few candles and look up the Winchesters in the phone book...cause that thing is just cursed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have never seen that sort of behaviour and honestly i would consider a can of petrol and a match(mind you i just watched IT on the weekend
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i agree on the block and wasn't going to get one i was going to try the xspc which seems a lot better suited (plus a few other that are coming out) but that's the issue...they are all *coming out* i figure 89 bucks (here in the land of pay more for geography) is an ok figure to gamble on and if a better one comes out and i,m sure it will i can swap it and sell the ek off.
> 
> as for fury x's sold mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> loved the card and the stock water cooling on it was fine but it was hamstrung and i couldn't ring more out of it...plus i got the vega for a *reasonable* price compared to a 1080 and it meant i didn't have t touch anything green
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the thing that put me off the enermax is it it isn't available here and there are no real local distributors and even if there were it would be 250 plus which just not seem like value to me.
> so i decided to go whole hog.
> 
> the only issue i have with the asetek coolers is ambient temps....when it gets to 40 degrees here i can see it severely struggling even at stock and there would be no way increase the cooling efficiency...at least with a custom loop you can add radiators or pumps or whatever.
> 
> that is what i am telling myself to justify the cost anyway


hahahaha
















ok. Here is I have done today. geez, this is going to be a long one.

So the Windows 10 creator update (Build 1703) is absolutely garabge. My CPU usage was 20% at idle with all 32 threads running. My PC was lagging like hell in the desktop and things took ages to open. I then moved to windows 8.1 and holy moly everything was perfect except for the fact that AMD does not support 8.1 for their chipset driver. When I try to install the chipset drivers on 8.1 I would get a message that says "No compatible graphics card was found" or something along these lines. I was able to make it work eventually by setting the Setup to compatibility mode for Windows 7 and run it as administrator. That worked fine but my power plane refused to install. So I was like... moving down to Windows 7. I burned windows 7 on a USB and booted it up but my PC froze on the Windows 7 screen that says "starting windows", I couldn't even install windows 7. I tried everything, nothing worked. I can't put my system in CSM mode because my motherboard will give me a "B2 VGA BIOS" error so I had to stay in UEFI mode. So back to windows 10. This time I installed Windows 10 anniversary update (Build 1511) and hold and behold, all my problems from build 1703 were gone. My system was running as smooth as windows 8.1. Now the next step is to figure out how to make sure Microsoft won't push 1703 to me on Windows Update. With that figured out, everything seems to be perfect. I still haven't tested any games yet. I will do that in few minutes but so far, the system is running better than ever. I wonder if I should disable HPET. I think not for now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Ok guys i honestly have no idea how or why, but ever since I upgraded to the liqtech tr4 from the kraken x52, ive been able to push my overclock from 3.9ghz to 4ghz. AND ITS ROCK STABLE SO FAR!! I'm not even needing to use nearly as much voltage as I was before. (Before I needed 1.42 volts to even get it to be stable for 5 minutes of stress testing.
> 
> Now I can run it at 1.39vcore and so far I'm passing every stability test with flying colors. Yes my temps dropped by about 15-18c, but I had no idea that it would result in such a huge stability boost with lower vcore to boot.


I'm honestly not surprised. Congrats









wait a second. 1.42v to get to 3.9GHz??? WHAT !!! That is a lot.

I don't know if I have a good chip or not, but my cpu is currently at 4.0GHz stable at 1.33750v but it does go up to 1.365v every once and a while. temps are 65C on full load.


----------



## chew*

These chips should be run .100 under r7.

1.4 is like benching volts.

1.3 is like 24/7


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> hahahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ok. Here is I have done today. geez, this is going to be a long one.
> 
> So the Windows 10 creator update (Build 1703) is absolutely garabge. My CPU usage was 20% at idle with all 32 threads running. My PC was lagging like hell in the desktop and things took ages to open. I then moved to windows 8.1 and holy moly everything was perfect except for the fact that AMD does not support 8.1 for their chipset driver. When I try to install the chipset drivers on 8.1 I would get a message that says "No compatible graphics card was found" or something along these lines. I was able to make it work eventually by setting the Setup to compatibility mode for Windows 7 and run it as administrator. That worked fine but my power plane refused to install. So I was like... moving down to Windows 7. I burned windows 7 on a USB and booted it up but my PC froze on the Windows 7 screen that says "starting windows", I couldn't even install windows 7. I tried everything, nothing worked. I can't put my system in CSM mode because my motherboard will give me a "B2 VGA BIOS" error so I had to stay in UEFI mode. So back to windows 10. This time I installed Windows 10 anniversary update (Build 1511) and hold and behold, all my problems from build 1703 were gone. My system was running as smooth as windows 8.1. Now the next step is to figure out how to make sure Microsoft won't push 1703 to me on Windows Update. With that figured out, everything seems to be perfect. I still haven't tested any games yet. I will do that in few minutes but so far, the system is running better than ever. I wonder if I should disable HPET. I think not for now.
> I'm honestly not surprised. Congrats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wait a second. 1.42v to get to 3.9GHz??? WHAT !!! That is a lot.
> 
> I don't know if I have a good chip or not, but my cpu is currently at 4.0GHz stable at 1.33750v but it does go up to 1.365v every once and a while. temps are 65C on full load.


nono i meant 1.42 for 4ghz before the liqtech


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> well, it's official. Windows 10 is garbage.
> 
> Just installed windows 8.1 as far as I can tell, my system is as smooth as butter. Going to install few games and see if things are really better.
> 
> [edit]
> I can actually pick what updates I want to install. man... windows 10 really blows.... I totally forgot about this.


IMO Microsoft have loaded so much spyware and telemetry into W10, at the expense of basic support, development and function that it's now borked beyond Vista levels.

I'd highly recommend to anyone that they downgrade to 7.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> These chips should be run .100 under r7.
> 
> 1.4 is like benching volts.
> 
> 1.3 is like 24/7


i agree with try to run at lower volts my hard target will be 1.4 my want high target will be 1.3
i was running 3.9 @1.25 super stable even gooseberry...that bastard...but going to 4g things start to go sideways pretty quick, it is a pretty huge leap in juice needed but again that is trying it with a aio cooler.

now i will see how it goes volt wise with some cooler water.

as for volts v heat...its electricity and it hates heat takes more power to do a task if it is hot than cold there are fancy big words but i don't know them









just be careful because if you comp heats up....it may need more juice and therefore not be stable anymore









what stress tests are you trying


----------



## DVLux

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> I'd highly recommend to anyone that they downgrade to 7.


Why you would try to run Threadripper on Windows 7 is beyond me... Do you like gimping your hardware?


----------



## ssateneth

Running 4.2GHz @ 1.475v. All powersaving seems to be working. Don't have any temperature issues, highest Tdie i have on 16 thread load so far was 60.5C. No core speed declocking on load. I once pushed it extremely hard with some 32 thread FMA load. It did not crash or anything, but I did get some 550MHz throttles, so some current or temperature throttling going on. Not sure what LLC to run though, just on auto for now.


----------



## chew*

550 is throttle point #2 aka severe throttle...it means you were running freaking hot. It can only be acchieved by insanely high temps so 60c apparently is not your real temps.

Mild throttle is hard to catch but it down clocks by .25x until it sees temps it wants to see internally...it can actually drop below stock multi.

I can only advise. Hard to crash from an overclock when your 300% below stock


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> Why you would try to run Threadripper on Windows 7 is beyond me... Do you like gimping your hardware?


How is that gimping? The dual boot Ryzens I've seen all perform much better under W7 than W10.

If you believe the scheduler in W10 is significantly better than Zen-patched 7, then I have a bridge to sell you.


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

My freshly installed system on a 960 EVO M.2 ( 3200mb/sec read speeds ) feels like total slow [email protected]$ #@$!

Windows has always been garbage but I am really feeling it now, As the other person mentioned, changed the HPET seems to have improved things... but I am still hunting around trying to permanently disable all the background stuff like realtime virus protection which not only kicks in randomly bringing entire machine to knees but turns itself back on if disabled because according to MSFT they own my computer and merely allow me to use it sometimes.Other junk like some right click context menu extensions for odrive were slowing menu down by several seconds! full time job keeping PC de-cluttered

It takes the MSI Mystic Light control panel about 15 seconds to open ( anyone know how to have it set the lights on boot but not open the UI? )

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Wow, I can't believe how lucky I got. My ram has Samsung B-die.
> 
> Anyways, right now I'm running my 64GB kit RAM at 16-16-16-39-72-1T @ 3066 @ 1.3v. I'm also running my CPU on all 16 cores at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750V but it goes up to 1.375V under full load. My SOC is at 1.25v.
> 
> 
> 
> Quick question. Does anyone feel like their system is a bit choppy? I feel like my system is not running smooth at all. Things like the task manager take at least a full 1.5 seconds to open and things generally are laggy and choppy even at 4GHz. If I run my system in Game mode things improve a lot but there is still a bit of choppiness.


----------



## happyluckbox

Do you guys think it would be a good idea to utilize all this extra pci e bandwidth and purchase a few more samsung evo 960 pros to put into raid 0?

From what i've read the benefits are negligible if you dont have the pci e bandwidth... but since were threadripped....


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> My freshly installed system on a 960 EVO M.2 ( 3200mb/sec read speeds ) feels like total slow [email protected]$ #@$!
> 
> Windows has always been garbage but I am really feeling it now, As the other person mentioned, changed the HPET seems to have improved things... but I am still hunting around trying to permanently disable all the background stuff like realtime virus protection which not only kicks in randomly bringing entire machine to knees but turns itself back on if disabled because according to MSFT they own my computer and merely allow me to use it sometimes.Other junk like some right click context menu extensions for odrive were slowing menu down by several seconds! full time job keeping PC de-cluttered
> 
> It takes the MSI Mystic Light control panel about 15 seconds to open ( anyone know how to have it set the lights on boot but not open the UI? )


Read below or read tldr.
TLDR install windows 10 build 1511.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> hahahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ok. Here is I have done today. geez, this is going to be a long one.
> 
> So the Windows 10 creator update (Build 1703) is absolutely garabge. My CPU usage was 20% at idle with all 32 threads running. My PC was lagging like hell in the desktop and things took ages to open. I then moved to windows 8.1 and holy moly everything was perfect except for the fact that AMD does not support 8.1 for their chipset driver. When I try to install the chipset drivers on 8.1 I would get a message that says "No compatible graphics card was found" or something along these lines. I was able to make it work eventually by setting the Setup to compatibility mode for Windows 7 and run it as administrator. That worked fine but my power plane refused to install. So I was like... moving down to Windows 7. I burned windows 7 on a USB and booted it up but my PC froze on the Windows 7 screen that says "starting windows", I couldn't even install windows 7. I tried everything, nothing worked. I can't put my system in CSM mode because my motherboard will give me a "B2 VGA BIOS" error so I had to stay in UEFI mode. So back to windows 10. This time I installed Windows 10 anniversary update (Build 1511) and hold and behold, all my problems from build 1703 were gone. My system was running as smooth as windows 8.1. Now the next step is to figure out how to make sure Microsoft won't push 1703 to me on Windows Update. With that figured out, everything seems to be perfect. I still haven't tested any games yet. I will do that in few minutes but so far, the system is running better than ever. I wonder if I should disable HPET. I think not for now.
> I'm honestly not surprised. Congrats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wait a second. 1.42v to get to 3.9GHz??? WHAT !!! That is a lot.
> 
> I don't know if I have a good chip or not, but my cpu is currently at 4.0GHz stable at 1.33750v but it does go up to 1.365v every once and a while. temps are 65C on full load.


----------



## robtorbay

Sup all! Just say hey to the owner club members! Just finished putting together my system with the 1900x at the center. Loving the chip so far!


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robtorbay*
> 
> Sup all! Just say hey to the owner club members! Just finished putting together my system with the 1900x at the center. Loving the chip so far!


ok so you are now the second most important person in the world because you are the second person i have seen with one








so go back a page or two look at my benches and run them for us








also a nice list of specs and speeds would be good....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Do you guys think it would be a good idea to utilize all this extra pci e bandwidth and purchase a few more samsung evo 960 pros to put into raid 0?
> 
> From what i've read the benefits are negligible if you don't have the pci e bandwidth... but since were threadripped....


right now i don't know as i only have one drive BUT on the 25th they are releasing a bios/driver to enable nvme bootable raid so once that's done and i have some funds i will be trying it.

now you have all seen my benches my windows is

Version 10.0.15063 Build 15063
and that is upgraded from windows 7....to windows 8 then 8.1 then upgraded to 10 and all the ones between
i have literally the dirtiest system on the planet







the last clean install was windows 7 pro.
with hpet off i do not suffer any of the issues mentioned with avast running and all the cappy services windows has(apart from the internet issues that is just windows 10 and there are tweaks for that just never really bothered)

so i would make sure you have the latest chipset drivers and bios to start with.
also things like moving the page file static size etc etc (mine now sits on my old ssd drive because i do not really mind if it starts to wear down)

make sure you also set the ram up right there are million different settings that can screw with windows geardown gear up enable group bank swap etc etc(the asus ch6 thread here has a load of info that seems to still hold for these chips)

now my problem.
opened the boxes : check
now what








attaching the compression fittings how tight should the be...do you use pliers or the hose... i,m worried i am going to have them too loose and leak or too tight and thread it.

and what is the best way of doing this....rip the computer apart throw the block on the video card...figure out the layout then hose length put it all in...flush it then test it (without the computer on of course)

can you tell i have never done one before


----------



## Simmons572

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *robtorbay*
> 
> Sup all! Just say hey to the owner club members! Just finished putting together my system with the 1900x at the center. Loving the chip so far!
> 
> 
> 
> ok so you are now the second most important person in the world because you are the second person i have seen with one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so go back a page or two look at my benches and run them for us
Click to expand...

I guess I will be #3. Mine should be here on Saturday









Of course, my build's on hold until the XSPC block arrives, but at least I will have all of my other components by Monday


----------



## slipsand

Hey guys. Guess I'm #3 on the 1900x list.

Cooler Master Master Case 5
MSI X399 Gaming Pro Carbon
AMD Threadripper 1900X
+ Fractal Design Celsius S24
16GB 4x4 DDR4 3600 G Skill Ripjaws V CL17 (The two other sets following are for benching)
+ 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3200 Corsair Vengeance CL16
+ 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3600 G Skill Trident Z CL16
MSI 1080 8GB Armor OC
WD Black M.2 256GB SSD
Crucial M550 512GB x2
WD Black 1TB HDD
EVGA 850W Bronze

Got the ripjaws to boot at 3600 twice then it corrupted the M.2 running it at 3200 right now. Sending back the Corsair and Trident unless someone wants to buy them off me. Want to run the Ripjaws until a better set comes out.

Gaming mode is awesome. Missed the AMD life. Huge improvement over my i7 2600k @4.8ghz

Already I am assuming I need to do the HDET fix?

Anyone know what the MSI BIOS memory frequency tweaks are for?

And how come my multi is locked in BIOS? Is that a 1900x thing? Yes I already have the latest MSI BIOS


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *slipsand*
> 
> Hey guys. Guess I'm #3 on the 1900x list.
> 
> Cooler Master Master Case 5
> MSI X399 Gaming Pro Carbon
> AMD Threadripper 1900X
> + Fractal Design Celsius S24
> 16GB 4x4 DDR4 3600 G Skill Ripjaws V CL17 (The two other sets following are for benching)
> + 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3200 Corsair Vengeance CL16
> + 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3600 G Skill Trident Z CL16
> MSI 1080 8GB Armor OC
> WD Black M.2 256GB SSD
> Crucial M550 512GB x2
> WD Black 1TB HDD
> EVGA 850W Bronze
> 
> Got the ripjaws to boot at 3600 twice then it corrupted the M.2 running it at 3200 right now. Sending back the Corsair and Trident unless someone wants to buy them off me. Want to run the Ripjaws until a better set comes out.
> 
> Gaming mode is awesome. Missed the AMD life. Huge improvement over my i7 2600k @4.8ghz
> 
> Already I am assuming I need to do the HDET fix?
> 
> Anyone know what the MSI BIOS memory frequency tweaks are for?
> 
> And how come my multi is locked in BIOS? Is that a 1900x thing? Yes I already have the latest MSI BIOS


actually since yous is running you get third simmons gets bumped to 4th









never heard of a locked multi but i don't have an msi board so can't really comment on that.
as for the HPET fix that's up to you....doesn't seem to affect everyone but it doesn't hurt to test it out.

do a cb15 bench and a few other like blender and games with hpet on
then turn it off reboot rinse and repeat and see how you go.

i would love to see some results.
(by the way as you can tell i,m stalling ripping this thing apart







i need to order a drain valve...


----------



## slipsand

Two pre-existing game benches:

PUBG and BF1

All rx580 tests were on Medium settings to be playable on 1080p
All 1080 tests are on Ultra settings 1080p
All 1900x tests are in Game Mode (4 cores, local memory dist, legacy comp, extreme soft, smt enabled) @ 3.9Ghz 45C idle 64C Load

NO TESTS WERE SIMULATED ALL REAL TIME RANDOM SCENARIOS

Sorry for the lack of a sweet graph but running essentials only right now.

Average frame rates:
2600k (rx5808gb) 1900x (rx5808gb) 1900x (1080)
PUBG - 35fps 45fps 64fps
BF1 - 74fps 98fps 121fps

As you can see a huge jump from the 1080. A large game play difference in response and NO stuttering due to the processor switch.








Mostly interested in the upcoming RAM support in future BIOS updates. Sorry for the lack of being specific on the DRAM frequency question. There is an option on MSI BIOS for "DRAM CH_A/B / CH_C/D Switching Frequency" "Sets the PWM working speed to stabilize DRAM voltage and minimize ripple range."

My guess is this is MSI's advertised RAM stability. Not a fan. Will booger with this another day and see what kind of speed increases we can get. Has a disclaimer saying it will increase MOSFET temps.


----------



## happyluckbox

Is the nvme bootable raid just for your mobo or for all ryzen threadrippers?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Is the nvme bootable raid just for your mobo or for all ryzen threadrippers?


all x399 boards
https://www.techpowerup.com/236644/amd-to-enable-nvme-raid-on-x399-threadripper-platform

so it will also be another thing that sets it apart from the ryzen x370 b350 setups.

so if that is something you want then the 1900x looks a little better again


----------



## Simmons572

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *slipsand*
> 
> Hey guys. Guess I'm #3 on the 1900x list.
> 
> Cooler Master Master Case 5
> MSI X399 Gaming Pro Carbon
> AMD Threadripper 1900X
> + Fractal Design Celsius S24
> 16GB 4x4 DDR4 3600 G Skill Ripjaws V CL17 (The two other sets following are for benching)
> + 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3200 Corsair Vengeance CL16
> + 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3600 G Skill Trident Z CL16
> MSI 1080 8GB Armor OC
> WD Black M.2 256GB SSD
> Crucial M550 512GB x2
> WD Black 1TB HDD
> EVGA 850W Bronze


Grrrr ya beat me too it

















I hope ya get those bugs worked out mate








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> actually since yous is running you get third simmons gets bumped to 4th


----------



## happyluckbox

You think there will be any noticeable real world difference with raid0 and full pci lane bandwidth?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> You think there will be any noticeable real world difference with raid0 and full pci lane bandwidth?


i honestly can't tell you i haven't raided anything in ages








all i can say is there is a marked improvement going from a ssd to the nvme s long as you keep it cool overheating throttles the drive quite a bit.
in real world it feels faster apps open faster etc in benches it is quite a bit faster especially rendering and image work.

whether raided will give that sort of thing i don't know. All i can say is for about 300 bucks here and a 1 gig raid drive...i,ll do it







it means i can throw more games and other things to the drive to get the benefit.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> all x399 boards
> https://www.techpowerup.com/236644/amd-to-enable-nvme-raid-on-x399-threadripper-platform
> 
> so it will also be another thing that sets it apart from the ryzen x370 b350 setups.
> 
> so if that is something you want then the 1900x looks a little better again


I assume this will drop with AGESA 1.0.0.7, or 2.0.0.7 as I think it will be called for TR4.

Since there are supposed to be more RAM and performance improvements, I wonder if the new hand binned G.Skill CL19 4600 and 4800 DDR4 kits will do 3600 at CL12, or CL14 at 3800.

Though I guess they'll cost a fortune as so few chips will do 4600 / 4800 CL19-19-19, or equivalently low timing lower speeds, and probably also why there's been such an extended period between announcement and availability.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i honestly can't tell you i haven't raided anything in ages
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all i can say is there is a marked improvement going from a ssd to the nvme s long as you keep it cool overheating throttles the drive quite a bit.
> in real world it feels faster apps open faster etc in benches it is quite a bit faster especially rendering and image work.
> 
> whether raided will give that sort of thing i don't know. All i can say is for about 300 bucks here and a 1 gig raid drive...i,ll do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it means i can throw more games and other things to the drive to get the benefit.


Hmmm, I've been wondering if i should relocate my m.2 samsung pro. I have 3 slots available to me. One directly under the gfx card, one next to the chipset (with a big integrated heat sink though) and one under the unused second pcie x16 slot.

Its currently sitting under the big heatsink near the chipset, but maybe i should put it under the unused pci slot...


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> I assume this will drop with AGESA 1.0.0.7, or 2.0.0.7 as I think it will be called for TR4.
> 
> Since there are supposed to be more RAM and performance improvements, I wonder if the new hand binned G.Skill CL19 4600 and 4800 DDR4 kits will do 3600 at CL12, or CL14 at 3800.
> 
> Though I guess they'll cost a fortune as so few chips will do 4600 / 4800 CL19-19-19, or equivalently low timing lower speeds, and probably also why there's been such an extended period between announcement and availability.


not sure but on the gigabyte site
Quote:


> (Updated 8/4/17)
> 
> X399 AORUS Gaming 7: F2E
> 
> Change log:
> 
> •Improved 128GB memory support
> •Updated AGESA to 1.0.0.3 Patch 3


so going by that its 1.0.0.3 now asrock released a bios 1.50 with the same sort improvement and helps with ryzen master.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Hmmm, I've been wondering if i should relocate my m.2 samsung pro. I have 3 slots available to me. One directly under the gfx card, one next to the chipset (with a big integrated heat sink though) and one under the unused second pcie x16 slot.
> 
> Its currently sitting under the big heatsink near the chipset, but maybe i should put it under the unused pci slot...


open up the latest hwinfo it should give you the temps of the drives that's where i would start.
mine is sitting right under the video card and it does get a bit warm but not to bad, that should change when i get off my fat ass and put the block on


----------



## ChronoBodi

Well, what a load of crap. the m.2 is bottlenecked for no reason on the MSI X399 mobo. Baaaahhhhh.

I had to go make an official post on MSI forums to get their attention.

How the heck is my 950 pro running at half speed?



Oh also, it confuses the Sata SSD crucial m500 to be in the m.2 slot 1, when its really a XP941 there.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> Well, what a load of crap. the m.2 is bottlenecked for no reason on the MSI X399 mobo. Baaaahhhhh.
> 
> I had to go make an official post on MSI forums to get their attention.
> 
> How the heck is my 950 pro running at half speed?
> 
> 
> 
> Oh also, it confuses the Sata SSD crucial m500 to be in the m.2 slot 1, when its really a XP941 there.


I am receiving two 960 EVO's today. Will install them in the weekend and see if I get the same thing with my MSI X399.

To be honest, I'm quite fed up with this POS product. Have already contacted the store I bought it from about returning it and getting a different MB from a different manufacturer. Just waiting to hear back from them about their policy regarding overpriced mobos that barely work by default.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> Well, what a load of crap. the m.2 is bottlenecked for no reason on the MSI X399 mobo. Baaaahhhhh.
> 
> I had to go make an official post on MSI forums to get their attention.
> 
> How the heck is my 950 pro running at half speed?
> 
> 
> 
> Oh also, it confuses the Sata SSD crucial m500 to be in the m.2 slot 1, when its really a XP941 there.






ok grabbed version 3 and ran it on my 960 evo

my results look about right i think.

did you install the Samsung driver....i for some reason had to do that twice to make it work right

sorry i,m on a taichi so maybe not as relevant


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I am still not completely clear if NUMA mode is also the same as Game Mode running 8c/16th or if NUMA mode is still running 16c/32t.
> 
> 
> 
> Game Mode is:
> 
> - "Legacy Compatibility Mode" enabled= one die enabled, SMT is ON, 8c/16t, memory on "local"=NUMA
> 
> Creator Mode is:
> 
> - "Legacy Compatibility Mode" disabled= both dies enabled, SMT is ON, 16c/32t, memory is "distributed"=UMA
Click to expand...

I guessed that was the case. All the AMD utility is using applying a BCDedit command to disable the Cores in the 2nd die at boot time.

Then the CPU affinity discovery that I have made is something that you definitely should be looking at. You can create a application affinity masks with utilities like Process lasso so that you can game and only use a subset of the threads on the first die and encode/stream or create content with all 32 threads without the need to sacrifice performance or having to reboot between tasks.


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

Samsung Evo 970 1TB for me on MSI Carbon Mobo is getting about 1600mb write 2500mb read in ATTO


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> not sure but on the gigabyte site
> so going by that its 1.0.0.3 now asrock released a bios 1.50 with the same sort improvement and helps with ryzen master.
> open up the latest hwinfo it should give you the temps of the drives that's where i would start.
> mine is sitting right under the video card and it does get a bit warm but not to bad, that should change when i get off my fat ass and put the block on


Ah, right. Thought they were using the same nomenclature for TR4 AGESA as AM4. Evidently not.

Either way, will be interesting to see what these new nose-bleed DDR4 kits can do timings wise at speeds that Zen can run.


----------



## Fantasy

Ok, after formatting my PC for the sixth time in the past two days, I have finally traced where all my problems are coming from. I thought all my problems were only coming from windows 10 build 1703 (which is still garbage btw). While that is still true there is another culprit, *Asus AI Suite 3*. This worthless excuse of a software is the cause of all my problems. Even if I uninstall it, it wouldn't matter. it's like a virus that takes over my PC. So beware everyone, if your computer is lagging, frame rate spiking in games, slow to open applications and you have *Asus Suite 3* installed, then I would suggest doing a clean install of windows and make sure not to install this thing.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Don't own a TR, so excuse any ignorance
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I can say at minimum...keep games off threads. Threads are 50% of core ipc.
> 
> 
> 
> And in regard to NUMA vs UMA?
> 
> (if this has been covered, by all means ignore me)
> 
> Also, regarding the GPU/die lane.. any way to know in advance which is which? Without the manual testing i mean.
Click to expand...

Threadripper is a large package that contains two silicon dies that each have 8 CPU cores that run two threads each (SMT), a pcie controller that supplies 32 pcie lanes and a dual channel memory controller. The 1st x16 PCIe slot that the graphics card is usually installed to is directly wired to the PCIe controller on the Die that contains the CPU cores that the OS labels as CPU0 - CPU15.

To improve gaming, the AMD software will allow you to run all 32 threads at once in what they called UMA or distributed mode. Alternatively they have a setting called Gaming mode or NUMA mode that disables the CPU cores on the second die. As the CPU threads want to access the local memory controller it eliminates cross fabric traffic as no threads run on the second die. Although the PCIE controller and memory controller on the 2nd die is still available for use if say you have a dual GPU setup or an NVME drive that connects to the second die PCIE controller.


----------



## chew*

That may be so...anand tested it alot and came to same conclusion for 99% games.

Screw amds settings.

Kill ht be done with it.

It also does not change the fact that

Core = 100%.ipc

Thread = 50% ipc of core.

This is where 50% of the problem lies...you dont want your game on a thread.

Ive tested single and 2x vgas.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Wow, I can't believe how lucky I got. My ram has Samsung B-die.
> 
> Anyways, right now I'm running my 64GB kit RAM at 16-16-16-39-72-1T @ 3066 @ 1.3v. I'm also running my CPU on all 16 cores at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750V but it goes up to 1.375V under full load. My SOC is at 1.25v.
> 
> 
> 
> Quick question. Does anyone feel like their system is a bit choppy? I feel like my system is not running smooth at all. Things like the task manager take at least a full 1.5 seconds to open and things generally are laggy and choppy even at 4GHz. If I run my system in Game mode things improve a lot but there is still a bit of choppiness.


By any chance are you running an m.2 system drive?

Could I suggest that you try installing the drive in different M.2 slots and seeing if there is any improvement? It is possible that the slot you chose is connecting the drive to the 2nd die with CPU16-cpu31 so every time the kernel threads do a disk access it is having to pull the data over the Infinity fabric before it can access the data. An M.2 slot that connects the drive to the first die PCIe controller will eliminate that extra latency the trip across the Infinity Fabric creates.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> By any chance are you running an m.2 system drive?
> 
> Could I suggest that you try installing the drive in different M.2 slots and seeing if there is any improvement? It is possible that the slot you chose is connecting the drive to the 2nd die with CPU16-cpu31 so every time the kernel threads do a disk access it is having to pull the data over the Infinity fabric before it can access the data. An M.2 slot that connects the drive to the first die PCIe controller will eliminate that extra latency the trip across the Infinity Fabric creates.


No, I'm running my old Intel 330 180GB SSD from 2011.I'm planning on getting a 1TB 960 pro nvme next month. Anyways, read my post above. All my problems were caused by Asus AI suite 3.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> That may be so...anand tested it alot and came to same conclusion for 99% games.
> 
> Screw amds settings.
> 
> Kill ht be done with it.
> 
> It also does not change the fact that
> 
> Core = 100%.ipc
> 
> Thread = 50% ipc of core


even with SMT turned off, they are still threads running on CPU cores.

In any CPU running SMT or hyperthreading, the extra threads make use of the idle time the cpu has as the primary thread running on it has to wait for things like memory IO access. The higher latency memory of Zen means more idle time for each primary thread and allows the secondary threads have more access time to the core than an intel system with the lower latency memory gets.

Generally speaking, a cpu that can run two threads per core will only improve performance by about 25% making a 4 core CPU perform more like a 5 core CPU or a 16 core CPU act more like a 20 core CPU.

You do get benefits in situations where you have low priority jobs running in the background such as the processing required for windows to download an update in the background. The non time critical jobs work really well if they are relegated to secondary threads because time to complete the job doesn't matter in the same way a benchmark job needs its threads finished ASAP.

For just about any regular workload, 16 cores/32 threads is more than any one job is ever likely to use. A chip like that benefits many workloads all running at the same time. Where you will see an impact is if you are trying to run 32 high performance threads in say prime95 all at the same time, half the threads will not get the same share of CPU time as the other half. If a parallel processed job has to wait for everything to finish before moving on to the next step, the SMT threads can/will hurt performance.

Turning off SMT can help alleviate some of those unique issues in benchmark like loads but you do throw away 25% of your processing performance as the background tasks still need to find somewhere to run and that can only be at the expense of your main application.

You would be better served leaving SMT turned on and still having access to that extra 25% processing capacity and using CPU affinity masks to limit those jobs negatively effected to only access 1 thread per core or, in the case of gaming, only access threads that are on the first die. That still leaves the power of an extra "quad core" like CPU in the 16 secondary threads available for all the background things to run on without interfering with your primary task.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> By any chance are you running an m.2 system drive?
> 
> Could I suggest that you try installing the drive in different M.2 slots and seeing if there is any improvement? It is possible that the slot you chose is connecting the drive to the 2nd die with CPU16-cpu31 so every time the kernel threads do a disk access it is having to pull the data over the Infinity fabric before it can access the data. An M.2 slot that connects the drive to the first die PCIe controller will eliminate that extra latency the trip across the Infinity Fabric creates.
> 
> 
> 
> No, I'm running my old Intel 330 180GB SSD from 2011.I'm planning on getting a 1TB 960 pro nvme next month. Anyways, read my post above. All my problems were caused by Asus AI suite 3.
Click to expand...

Good old AI suite. I know that AI suite 2 will reduce firestrike scores by about 500 points on an i7 sandy bridge rig with a 1070. It surprises me that it impacts a TR system quite so much


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> Well, what a load of crap. the m.2 is bottlenecked for no reason on the MSI X399 mobo. Baaaahhhhh.
> 
> I had to go make an official post on MSI forums to get their attention.
> 
> How the heck is my 950 pro running at half speed?
> 
> 
> 
> Oh also, it confuses the Sata SSD crucial m500 to be in the m.2 slot 1, when its really a XP941 there.


Try installing the M.2 in a different slot. You may be surprised and see a performance improvement


----------



## daffy.duck

Nevermind


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> Well, what a load of crap. the m.2 is bottlenecked for no reason on the MSI X399 mobo. Baaaahhhhh.
> 
> I had to go make an official post on MSI forums to get their attention.
> 
> How the heck is my 950 pro running at half speed?


I'm not really sure what you mean since those results are in line with how fast a 950 Pro is. What were you expecting?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> You think there will be any noticeable real world difference with raid0 and full pci lane bandwidth?


It depends on what you're doing with it. Load times, no benefit. Certain types of content creation or analysis, yes.

I've got two 1TB 960 pros in a software volume on the OS. It hasn't changed lost times for games or Audio encoding times for me, just given me a 2TB volume.


----------



## Wishmaker

Unlock your chips gents








Surely some of you have extra cores there ready to rumble!

http://www.overclock.net/t/1638246/der8auer-debunks-the-threadripper-dummy-die-message


----------



## robtorbay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *slipsand*
> 
> Hey guys. Guess I'm #3 on the 1900x list.
> 
> Cooler Master Master Case 5
> MSI X399 Gaming Pro Carbon
> AMD Threadripper 1900X
> + Fractal Design Celsius S24
> 16GB 4x4 DDR4 3600 G Skill Ripjaws V CL17 (The two other sets following are for benching)
> + 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3200 Corsair Vengeance CL16
> + 16 GB 2x8 DDR4 3600 G Skill Trident Z CL16
> MSI 1080 8GB Armor OC
> WD Black M.2 256GB SSD
> Crucial M550 512GB x2
> WD Black 1TB HDD
> EVGA 850W Bronze
> 
> Got the ripjaws to boot at 3600 twice then it corrupted the M.2 running it at 3200 right now. Sending back the Corsair and Trident unless someone wants to buy them off me. Want to run the Ripjaws until a better set comes out.
> 
> Gaming mode is awesome. Missed the AMD life. Huge improvement over my i7 2600k @4.8ghz
> 
> Already I am assuming I need to do the HDET fix?
> 
> Anyone know what the MSI BIOS memory frequency tweaks are for?
> 
> And how come my multi is locked in BIOS? Is that a 1900x thing? Yes I already have the latest MSI BIOS


Nice looking system, ill post my detaled specs and a 3D Mark Run shortly! How have you made out with OCing the chip? With minimal effort it seems to hit 4.0 no issues @ 1.35.... I hear there are some people getting 4.1 - 4.2... going to see what that is all about now shortly lol!


----------



## deadspeedv

Guess I will post my specs as well

Before: Intel Core i7 920 (C0 stepping) + HD5970 - Haven't upgraded since 2009 so decided to splurg a little

After - Used mainly for gaming, multimedia and creating VM's for my research at university (hence the threadripper):

AMD Threadripper 1950X @ 3.945GHz
ASUS ROG Zenith Extreme Motherboard
Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 Ti AORUS Xtreme Edition 11GB @ 2050/6020
Corsair Dominator Platinum CMD32GX4M4B3200C16 32GB (4x8GB) DDR4
Corsair Hydro Series H115i
Corsair HX1000i Power Supply
Samsung 960 PRO NVMe M.2 512GB SSD
+ 500GB OCZ SDD + 2x4TB + 1x3TB + 2x2TB
ASUS Xonar Essence STX Sound Card
ASUS AC-88 Dual Band AC3100 PCIe Wireless Card
Lian Li PCX2000 Case

Razer Blackwidow Ultimate 2016 Stealth Edition Keyboard
EVGA TorQ X10 Carbon Gaming Mouse
Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 32ohm Headphones + Zalman Clip on Mic

BenQ XL2410T 120Hz Monitor
Dell Ultrasharp U2410 IPS Monitor (thinking of getting a 4K soon)


----------



## ajc9988

loop sequence:
Two MCP50X DDC pumps in sequence -> CPU Block -> VRM1 -> VRM2 -> Rad1 with 8 iPPC 3000 -> GPU1 -> Rad 2 with 4 Vardars -> rad 3 with 4 Vardars -> res -> pumps. Nice clean loops. The reason to stick Rad1 there is not to cool the liquid, just so that the tube goes almost straight up as the tube from VRM1 goes from the north most hole to the west most hole on the VRM2, with the East (or right) most hole sitting under the right most hole with the rad positioned for inlet and outlet at the back of the machine. This then drops from the outlet to the VGA card. You use gravity to keep the majority of the line out of sight going from the graphics card to the inlet on the Rad 2 (my window is on the right to see the CPU side), then dropping the outlet tube directly down to the top hole of Rad3. This then goes from the bottom to the bottom of the photon res 170mm. From there, it goes to the bottom second hole of the res. There will also be a drain T right after the second pump.

To fill, unmount the res and lay system on its side. Connect hoses to the T valve and the res top (that is why the m20 to g1/4", plus a 90 deg. rotary, to a compression fitting, tube, compression fitting, to female to female g1/4" fitting to either a cap or a g1/4" to M20 with cap; drain port is a Tvalve to ball valve with plug when not in use). With both the ball valve open and the drain port open, both with hoses suspended above the system and res oriented coming above the case, add fluid until you can't add anymore. This should allow it to run from Rad3 (lowest point), up through rad 1 before starting to hit issues, allowing for the majority to be filled before a pump is turned on to cycle. At the point the limit is reached, save a little room at the top of the res, close up the res and drain lines, and remove the drain line from the ball valve off of the T line. Stand the case up and mount the res, putting the add line up through the top of the case. Now it is time to cycle the pump 1 to push the air through the system, adding liquid as needed to the res. Repeat as necessary, then the normal tipping, etc. to work out air bubbles.

Thoughts on the process?


----------



## ChronoBodi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I'm not really sure what you mean since those results are in line with how fast a 950 Pro is. What were you expecting?


950 pro is 2500 mb/s reads.
And 1500 mb/s writes.

It can do the writes, but does less than half the reads.

Its in the m.2 slot.

This is purely a BI0s issue with the m.2 slots.


----------



## Beatnutz

Just installed two new m.2. drives (960 EVO) on the MSI X399 with the latest BIOS. Everything is working fine. Benchmark reports top speeds on both. I'm using the two lowest m.2. slots.


----------



## robtorbay

System Specs:

AMD Threadripper 1900x @ 4.1ghz
Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7 x399
Corsair Dominator 16gb quad kit (4gb*4)
Nvidia 980ti Hybrid xSLI
Samsung M.2 256gb HDD
2tb 7200 rpm HDD
Thermaltake Water 3.0 Riing 240
Rosewill 1200w 80+ Platinum PSU

Benchmarks:

Cinebench r15: 1796
3dMark Timespy: 8 719
CPUZ: 5142


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> even with SMT turned off, they are still threads running on CPU cores.
> 
> In any CPU running SMT or hyperthreading, the extra threads make use of the idle time the cpu has as the primary thread running on it has to wait for things like memory IO access. The higher latency memory of Zen means more idle time for each primary thread and allows the secondary threads have more access time to the core than an intel system with the lower latency memory gets.
> 
> Generally speaking, a cpu that can run two threads per core will only improve performance by about 25% making a 4 core CPU perform more like a 5 core CPU or a 16 core CPU act more like a 20 core CPU.
> 
> You do get benefits in situations where you have low priority jobs running in the background such as the processing required for windows to download an update in the background. The non time critical jobs work really well if they are relegated to secondary threads because time to complete the job doesn't matter in the same way a benchmark job needs its threads finished ASAP.
> 
> For just about any regular workload, 16 cores/32 threads is more than any one job is ever likely to use. A chip like that benefits many workloads all running at the same time. Where you will see an impact is if you are trying to run 32 high performance threads in say prime95 all at the same time, half the threads will not get the same share of CPU time as the other half. If a parallel processed job has to wait for everything to finish before moving on to the next step, the SMT threads can/will hurt performance.
> 
> Turning off SMT can help alleviate some of those unique issues in benchmark like loads but you do throw away 25% of your processing performance as the background tasks still need to find somewhere to run and that can only be at the expense of your main application.
> 
> You would be better served leaving SMT turned on and still having access to that extra 25% processing capacity and using CPU affinity masks to limit those jobs negatively effected to only access 1 thread per core or, in the case of gaming, only access threads that are on the first die. That still leaves the power of an extra "quad core" like CPU in the 16 secondary threads available for all the background things to run on without interfering with your primary task.


For my use 8 cores is alot.

16 is overkill. Threads are slow.

Cores are fast.

Cross communication can be mitigated by config and tuning thread performance can not be mitigated.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I don't know the answer, but I know that the answer to "Is it really feeding the dummy dies with juice?" is definitely no.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Are you absolutely sure? I know it shouldn't be, but perhaps there's something wrong with the BIOS / micro code.


Given Der8auer's discovery that, as such, there are no dummy dies, this looks like it could in fact be happening ...


----------



## ChronoBodi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Just installed two new m.2. drives (960 EVO) on the MSI X399 with the latest BIOS. Everything is working fine. Benchmark reports top speeds on both. I'm using the two lowest m.2. slots.


How?


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> How?


What do u mean?


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Good old AI suite. I know that AI suite 2 will reduce firestrike scores by about 500 points on an i7 sandy bridge rig with a 1070. It surprises me that it impacts a TR system quite so much


yeah, it is insane how much AI suite affected my particular setup. ooh well.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> 950 pro is 2500 mb/s reads.
> And 1500 mb/s writes.
> 
> It can do the writes, but does less than half the reads.
> 
> Its in the m.2 slot.
> 
> This is purely a BI0s issue with the m.2 slots.


I would encourage you to check out some launch reviews of the 950 Pro. Some reviewers saw as low as 1300 MB/s sequential read. Some reviewers saw as fast as 2500 MB/s. Those tests would have been performed before the X399 platform existed, so whatever problem there is I wouldn't say it started with the MSI X399 board.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Given Der8auer's discovery that, as such, there are no dummy dies, this looks like it could in fact be happening ...


It's possible, but I would still have to assume that those dies are fully power gated unless we find some evidence to suggest otherwise. It would make more logical sense as we know the TDP of TR is about double that of the single-die product. If we had four dies all using power, we'd not see a simple doubling. We also don't know if all TRs are built that way.


----------



## ChronoBodi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> What do u mean?


My 950 pro can write to 1500 mb/s, but the reads are capped at 1300mb/s, well short of the 2500 mb/s reads.

Urs just works fine on the same mobo.

I am super confused.

For the record, the same exact 950 Pro did 2500 MB/s reads on Gigabyte Phoenix SLI X99.

So whatever is going on, the SSD probably hates this board or whatever.


----------



## ajc9988

- review of the Taichi


----------



## julesfrompulp

This is my first build and overclock attempt. I'm running a 1950X, Zenith mobo, 64 gb 3200 ram, Enermax TR4 240 cooler. I'm overclocking to 3.8 and getting these temps after 15 minutes using Prime95. They seem high to me. Any help would be great.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> even with SMT turned off, they are still threads running on CPU cores.
> 
> In any CPU running SMT or hyperthreading, the extra threads make use of the idle time the cpu has as the primary thread running on it has to wait for things like memory IO access. The higher latency memory of Zen means more idle time for each primary thread and allows the secondary threads have more access time to the core than an intel system with the lower latency memory gets.
> 
> Generally speaking, a cpu that can run two threads per core will only improve performance by about 25% making a 4 core CPU perform more like a 5 core CPU or a 16 core CPU act more like a 20 core CPU.
> 
> You do get benefits in situations where you have low priority jobs running in the background such as the processing required for windows to download an update in the background. The non time critical jobs work really well if they are relegated to secondary threads because time to complete the job doesn't matter in the same way a benchmark job needs its threads finished ASAP.
> 
> For just about any regular workload, 16 cores/32 threads is more than any one job is ever likely to use. A chip like that benefits many workloads all running at the same time. Where you will see an impact is if you are trying to run 32 high performance threads in say prime95 all at the same time, half the threads will not get the same share of CPU time as the other half. If a parallel processed job has to wait for everything to finish before moving on to the next step, the SMT threads can/will hurt performance.
> 
> Turning off SMT can help alleviate some of those unique issues in benchmark like loads but you do throw away 25% of your processing performance as the background tasks still need to find somewhere to run and that can only be at the expense of your main application.
> 
> You would be better served leaving SMT turned on and still having access to that extra 25% processing capacity and using CPU affinity masks to limit those jobs negatively effected to only access 1 thread per core or, in the case of gaming, only access threads that are on the first die. That still leaves the power of an extra "quad core" like CPU in the 16 secondary threads available for all the background things to run on without interfering with your primary task.
> 
> 
> 
> For my use 8 cores is alot.
> 
> 16 is overkill. Threads are slow.
> 
> Cores are fast.
> 
> Cross communication can be mitigated by config and tuning thread performance can not be mitigated.
Click to expand...

No doubt. I cannot justify the need for a 16 core CPU for my needs either. But these chips are not made for regular single user day to day computing. they are for those people running multiple VMs, streaming while encoding while gaming etc.

Threads are the basic job unit that runs on a CPU core, not only the units of work you stopped by disabling SMT. Every process that runs on a computer has threads that do the work for that process. With SMT turned off you are still running threads, only a maximum 16 at a time of them instead of 32. The only difference is that the ones you turned off were the ones that got to use the leftover capacity of the CPU, rather then getting first dibs and taking as much as they could use.

There is nothing intrinsically wrong with disabling SMT. You are just leaving the CPU cores sitting idle for about 25% more time than it would otherwise. Not really an issue if you don't have enough compute workload to use all 16 of primary threads that you are still running on the CPU.

Managing CPU affinity for different workloads is managing available compute resources to get the most efficient performance results from the resources available. Its not a form of overclocking that changes the number of instructions per clock each CPU core is capable of. Unlike Intel chips or any other chips that we have had experience with before, TR has effectively got a split personality due to the dual dies. For the first time in a single socket computer, you end up with a situation where half the cores have high performing, low latency connectivity to the GPU and the other half do not.

In this instance, It is not about tuning the threads or even the CPU cores themselves but more about how you use the existing resources for best effect.


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

No expert here but that looks high to me, I am keeping mine around 70-74c Tdie on full load by having a custom fan profile that ramps the Liqtech ( 360 ) up rapidly around the temps I want, bit of a fiddle but at my fans are at least 60% at full load and it darts up now and then randomly as it fluctuates, more if your volts are higher to maintain stability, I think the general consensus has been that 84 it starts thermal throttling so you can have it that high but then what happens if 84 is your base line and then the sun comes out, sudden spike for whatever reason ( mines suddenly leaps about and the water cant react quickly enough to compensate for sudden activity from stand still ) or your GPU runs hot and then suddenly you are climbing into a throttled zone right before it shuts itself down on you, also higher temps means more instability without more volts which makes it even hotter ;-)

Seems the method at is most basic is raise the volts raises temperature but increases stability, get that as high as you can ( within reason ) along with a fan curve that can maintain it without being offensively noisy over long periods and doesn't just keep getting hotter and hotter unable to dissipate, then with the vlts/heat as high as you can manage, raise the clock speed bit by bit testing for longer periods to see if it has become unstable
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *julesfrompulp*
> 
> 
> 
> This is my first build and overclock attempt. I'm running a 1950X, Zenith mobo, 64 gb 3200 ram, Enermax TR4 240 cooler. I'm overclocking to 3.8 and getting these temps after 15 minutes using Prime95. They seem high to me. Any help would be great.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wishmaker*
> 
> Unlock your chips gents
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Surely some of you have extra cores there ready to rumble!
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1638246/der8auer-debunks-the-threadripper-dummy-die-message


i have not looked at the video but before i do i will predict they are simply dead dies.
why would they do that...
if you put slugs in they would react differently to the heat produced by the live ones and produce hot or cold spots because of the different materials.
if you use the same dies even if they are dead its the same material.

ok watched the video and my standpoint is they are dead dies and they are there to even things out etc BUT wht he said about a 32 core chip in the future makes sense...intel are going to bring out the big gun which will have more cores than the 1950x but then amd can snigger and go...hey look








thatand the fact that we know it was a pet project from the epyc engineers all makes sense....so i will say you will not be able to unlock them BUT in the future there may be a 32 core chip

well that's my take on it anyway so they are were right and they are just slugs (i am ready to be wrong once i watch the video though







)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Good old AI suite. I know that AI suite 2 will reduce firestrike scores by about 500 points on an i7 sandy bridge rig with a 1070. It surprises me that it impacts a TR system quite so much






yah funny that i still have left over aisuite 2 from years ago i,m still trying to remove(crap application)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> By any chance are you running an m.2 system drive?
> 
> Could I suggest that you try installing the drive in different M.2 slots and seeing if there is any improvement? It is possible that the slot you chose is connecting the drive to the 2nd die with CPU16-cpu31 so every time the kernel threads do a disk access it is having to pull the data over the Infinity fabric before it can access the data. An M.2 slot that connects the drive to the first die PCIe controller will eliminate that extra latency the trip across the Infinity Fabric creates.






interesting point BUT how exactly do you tell which runs off which(i,m sure it is in a diagram or some software to do it but i have no idea







)

as for mine in the taichi its in the front lower slot near the backpane and my results seem fine.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> My 950 pro can write to 1500 mb/s, but the reads are capped at 1300mb/s, well short of the 2500 mb/s reads.
> 
> Urs just works fine on the same mobo.
> 
> I am super confused.
> 
> For the record, the same exact 950 Pro did 2500 MB/s reads on Gigabyte Phoenix SLI X99.
> 
> So whatever is going on, the SSD probably hates this board or whatever.






did you reinstall the Samsung controller software? as i said before i needed to do that twice to get mine to read correctly.
i do not believe unless you have screwed around with pcie speed like above 104 bus that it could be an issue.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *slipsand*
> 
> Two pre-existing game benches:
> 
> PUBG and BF1
> 
> All rx580 tests were on Medium settings to be playable on 1080p
> All 1080 tests are on Ultra settings 1080p
> All 1900x tests are in Game Mode (4 cores, local memory dist, legacy comp, extreme soft, smt enabled) @ 3.9Ghz 45C idle 64C Load
> 
> NO TESTS WERE SIMULATED ALL REAL TIME RANDOM SCENARIOS
> 
> Sorry for the lack of a sweet graph but running essentials only right now.
> 
> Average frame rates:
> 2600k (rx5808gb) 1900x (rx5808gb) 1900x (1080)
> PUBG - 35fps 45fps 64fps
> BF1 - 74fps 98fps 121fps
> 
> As you can see a huge jump from the 1080. A large game play difference in response and NO stuttering due to the processor switch.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mostly interested in the upcoming RAM support in future BIOS updates. Sorry for the lack of being specific on the DRAM frequency question. There is an option on MSI BIOS for "DRAM CH_A/B / CH_C/D Switching Frequency" "Sets the PWM working speed to stabilize DRAM voltage and minimize ripple range."
> 
> My guess is this is MSI's advertised RAM stability. Not a fan. Will booger with this another day and see what kind of speed increases we can get. Has a disclaimer saying it will increase MOSFET temps.


can you run that in creator mode for me just the 1080 results would do.
i want to see what sort of difference it makes....i really need to get PUBG










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *julesfrompulp*
> 
> 
> 
> This is my first build and overclock attempt. I'm running a 1950X, Zenith mobo, 64 gb 3200 ram, Enermax TR4 240 cooler. I'm overclocking to 3.8 and getting these temps after 15 minutes using Prime95. They seem high to me. Any help would be great.






if that is prime 95 small ffts then it is high but not out of the ballpark at 3900 with my h115 i was hitting 78 but if that is prime 95 blend then yes its about 20 degrees too high i would check the thermal paste make sure you got good coverage, it should be covering the entire bottom of the aio block including the screws.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> loop sequence:
> Two MCP50X DDC pumps in sequence -> CPU Block -> VRM1 -> VRM2 -> Rad1 with 8 iPPC 3000 -> GPU1 -> Rad 2 with 4 Vardars -> rad 3 with 4 Vardars -> res -> pumps. Nice clean loops. The reason to stick Rad1 there is not to cool the liquid, just so that the tube goes almost straight up as the tube from VRM1 goes from the north most hole to the west most hole on the VRM2, with the East (or right) most hole sitting under the right most hole with the rad positioned for inlet and outlet at the back of the machine. This then drops from the outlet to the VGA card. You use gravity to keep the majority of the line out of sight going from the graphics card to the inlet on the Rad 2 (my window is on the right to see the CPU side), then dropping the outlet tube directly down to the top hole of Rad3. This then goes from the bottom to the bottom of the photon res 170mm. From there, it goes to the bottom second hole of the res. There will also be a drain T right after the second pump.
> 
> To fill, unmount the res and lay system on its side. Connect hoses to the T valve and the res top (that is why the m20 to g1/4", plus a 90 deg. rotary, to a compression fitting, tube, compression fitting, to female to female g1/4" fitting to either a cap or a g1/4" to M20 with cap; drain port is a Tvalve to ball valve with plug when not in use). With both the ball valve open and the drain port open, both with hoses suspended above the system and res oriented coming above the case, add fluid until you can't add anymore. This should allow it to run from Rad3 (lowest point), up through rad 1 before starting to hit issues, allowing for the majority to be filled before a pump is turned on to cycle. At the point the limit is reached, save a little room at the top of the res, close up the res and drain lines, and remove the drain line from the ball valve off of the T line. Stand the case up and mount the res, putting the add line up through the top of the case. Now it is time to cycle the pump 1 to push the air through the system, adding liquid as needed to the res. Repeat as necessary, then the normal tipping, etc. to work out air bubbles.
> 
> Thoughts on the process?






i would love to comment but being a loop newbie i have no idea BUT i would love to see a diagram or picture of that setup so i can get it straight in my head.
from my short study of loops if you have a lot of resistance and real-estate a pump with good head flow is needed so if you have 2 pumps i,m not sure it would work...but again novice <===
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robtorbay*
> 
> System Specs:
> 
> AMD Threadripper 1900x @ 4.1ghz
> Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7 x399
> Corsair Dominator 16gb quad kit (4gb*4)
> Nvidia 980ti Hybrid xSLI
> Samsung M.2 256gb HDD
> 2tb 7200 rpm HDD
> Thermaltake Water 3.0 Riing 240
> Rosewill 1200w 80+ Platinum PSU
> 
> Benchmarks:
> 
> Cinebench r15: 1796
> 3dMark Timespy: 8 719
> CPUZ: 5142


ok that looks about right to me at 4.1 cb15 is roughly the same if not a little lower than a 1800x...so the extra fluff does have a bit of a penalty in that.
what's the cpu score for timespy? or is that the cpu score?

and any idea on power figures maybe throw up a screen shot of hwinfo with the power outputs while running cb15








thatnks for the effort


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> i would love to comment but being a loop newbie i have no idea BUT i would love to see a diagram or picture of that setup so i can get it straight in my head.
> from my short study of loops if you have a lot of resistance and real-estate a pump with good head flow is needed so if you have 2 pumps i,m not sure it would work...but again novice <===


https://martinsliquidlab.wordpress.com/2011/04/26/pump-setup-series-vs-parallel/2/

That should help you understand about pumps in series, with a measure of head pressure, flowrate, etc.

Edit 2: also, this is in a TT Core X9 cube. Window on the right side of the case to view the CPU side, res mounted on that side in the front wall, goes to the pumps mounted on the floor, then CPU, VRM1 and 2, has 2x480s in the top, one 480 in the bottom left side. The shelf the MB sits on is flat and in the middle of the case, so you see the side facing. Now use imagination to trace.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> https://martinsliquidlab.wordpress.com/2011/04/26/pump-setup-series-vs-parallel/2/
> 
> That should help you understand about pumps in series, with a measure of head pressure, flowrate, etc.
> 
> Edit 2: also, this is in a TT Core X9 cube. Window on the right side of the case to view the CPU side, res mounted on that side in the front wall, goes to the pumps mounted on the floor, then CPU, VRM1 and 2, has 2x480s in the top, one 480 in the bottom left side. The shelf the MB sits on is flat and in the middle of the case, so you see the side facing. Now use imagination to trace.


thanks that makes sense but would they need to be close to the same performance? or i guess not if you ahd the better pump behind it would help the weaker pump in front....
definitely something i can look at going forward









what about putting the pump further down the loop like after a radiator..would that help the flow in a long loop with more radiators as oppose to one straight after the other?


----------



## chew*

The only time you would ever not run in series is when you have a hardware device that runs really cool and another device that runs extremely hot.

example 2600k sandy vs 2x 290x in my loop I separated them.

With TR no worries it will run hot like vega or 1080Ti.

I'm doing a dual pump. here's how i'm setting it up.

Pump rad vgas rad pump rad cpu rad.

One at the top one at the bottom.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> thanks that makes sense but would they need to be close to the same performance? or i guess not if you ahd the better pump behind it would help the weaker pump in front....
> definitely something i can look at going forward
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what about putting the pump further down the loop like after a radiator..would that help the flow in a long loop with more radiators as oppose to one straight after the other?


So, you have to remember, it is cumulative pressure in the loop. Yes, putting it later can effect a bit after a restrictive portion of loop, but really, it won't be significant enough if you don't have the space, which I do not.

So, my shopping list includes the VRM plates (still shopping on best option for Taichi), an XSPC photon 170mm res only, 2xMCP50X DDC pumps ran in series one after the other (the turbulence can shorten your pumps life spans), an XSPC Raystorm Neo Black Chrome, an EK 780 Classy block compatible with my 980 Ti Classy, 3xHardwarelabs Nemesis Black Ice 480gtx, 29xcompression fittings, 9x90 degree rotary angle fitting, 1x45 degree rotary angle fitting, and primo chill advanced LRT tubing. All fittings are XSPC black chrome, except for a Bitspower rotary T black shine (their equivalent to black chrome) used immediately after the outlet of the second pump, with the XSPC ball valve in black chrome as a drain for the system. I have a fill tube added to the Photon res (170mm), which is an m20 to g1/4" fitting to 90 degree fitting, to compression fitting, tube to compression fitting to g1/4 female to female, to either a cap or a g1/4 to m20 with cap. Thinking of just leaving it with a cap so that being mounted in the top only requires screwing in a compression fitting for topping off the res without having to pour over the system directly..

Edit: Just relized I already described the fill port in prior post. Sorry about that. Horrible headache and I get to fixate on things (aspects of OCD) sometimes. I recently went through my loop visualizing, which is why the number of 90 degree ports increased from 4 to 9. I've run the thought through what could be needed and am also considering whether or not to have a water temp sensor in the beast. Should not be necessary at all, though.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So, you have to remember, it is cumulative pressure in the loop. Yes, putting it later can effect a bit after a restrictive portion of loop, but really, it won't be significant enough if you don't have the space, which I do not.
> 
> So, my shopping list includes the VRM plates (still shopping on best option for Taichi), an XSPC photon 170mm res only, 2xMCP50X DDC pumps ran in series one after the other (the turbulence can shorten your pumps life spans), an XSPC Raystorm Neo Black Chrome, an EK 780 Classy block compatible with my 980 Ti Classy, 3xHardwarelabs Nemesis Black Ice 480gtx, 29xcompression fittings, 9x90 degree rotary angle fitting, 1x45 degree rotary angle fitting, and primo chill advanced LRT tubing. All fittings are XSPC black chrome, except for a Bitspower rotary T black shine (their equivalent to black chrome) used immediately after the outlet of the second pump, with the XSPC ball valve in black chrome as a drain for the system. I have a fill tube added to the Photon res (170mm), which is an m20 to g1/4" fitting to 90 degree fitting, to compression fitting, tube to compression fitting to g1/4 female to female, to either a cap or a g1/4 to m20 with cap. Thinking of just leaving it with a cap so that being mounted in the top only requires screwing in a compression fitting for topping off the res without having to pour over the system directly..
> 
> Edit: Just relized I already described the fill port in prior post. Sorry about that. Horrible headache and I get to fixate on things (aspects of OCD) sometimes. I recently went through my loop visualizing, which is why the number of 90 degree ports increased from 4 to 9. I've run the thought through what could be needed and am also considering whether or not to have a water temp sensor in the beast. Should not be necessary at all, though.






that's a lot of money







but i can't see anything bar a nuclear reactor overheating that thing.
i tried to get the primochill but it was out of stock same for the xspc storm block...benefits of living in the ass end of the world








so to add a pump...i have a res/pump... all i really need to do is buy a pump and hook it up(that sounds pretty easy and simple...he says staring at a box full of crap...)
thanks for the info



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> The only time you would ever not run in series is when you have a hardware device that runs really cool and another device that runs extremely hot.
> 
> example 2600k sandy vs 2x 290x in my loop I separated them.
> 
> With TR no worries it will run hot like vega or 1080Ti.
> 
> I'm doing a dual pump. here's how i'm setting it up.
> 
> Pump rad vgas rad pump rad cpu rad.
> 
> One at the top one at the bottom.






thanks that makes a lot of sense

how important is the more radiators though i mean real estate in the case is pretty good but 480's are way out the best i could add is a 140 at back and a 280 at front...how much difference does more radiators make in the real world (sorry just weighing up cost/benefit)
and what about mounting the radiator outside the case... apart from increased resistance because of tube length blah blah how bad would that be?

thanks for the info as well.


----------



## chew*

Rule of thumb is if you can feel heat ( hot air ) coming out of radiator you need more radiator. Should be warm air but not hot.

Mine is 360 to 120 to 120 to 240 so basically a 360 + 480.

If you can fit double thick and sacrifice push pull its a tad better performance but louder usually.


----------



## tarot

ok makes sense but what you mean by the radiator is when the gear is under full load?
and the double thick are you referring to the fat ass radiators just push and thin using push pull?
wouldn't push pull be louder?


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok makes sense but what you mean by the radiator is when the gear is under full load?
> and the double thick are you referring to the fat ass radiators just push and thin using push pull?
> wouldn't push pull be louder?


Yep full load.

Advantage of push pull = lower rpm necessary.

Double thick push or pull = more rpm.

Advantage is twice the cooling capacity and more volume in the same overall space.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yep full load.
> 
> Advantage of push pull = lower rpm necessary.
> 
> Double thick push or pull = more rpm.
> 
> Advantage is twice the cooling capacity and more volume in the same overall space.


ok i get it....fat ass fins more resistance needs more rpm to push through.

so the varders i got should suite this setup pretty well.
thanks

now back to it where are all the 1900x results people









oh i forgot chew you have a dual fury x crossfire setup don't you?

how are you finding crossfire vs say the ryzen setup or intel...better worse much the same?


----------



## chew*

Its not bad i have a 2 290x 1060/1350 stock clocks setup.

And then just the vanilla 2 x fury x's setup.

I did notice fire strike went up single fury x on x399 platform vs x370 which seemed odd but maybe not...

Was c6h 8c/16t vs taichi 16c

14k x370 15k x399


----------



## Djreversal

So I got my new 1080 Ti's today and my Trident Z 3600mhz RGB ram, installed them and reran a few benchmarks.. scores jumped about 3200 points compared to my 1080's... I did install the XOC bios but I'm not sure if theres anything further I have to do to be able to get a bit more voltage out of it.. The cards just stop at 2050, anything higher I cant complete a benchmark. But at 2050 it never crashes no matter what I run. here was my score.

https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13635486


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Its not bad i have a 2 290x 1060/1350 stock clocks setup.
> 
> And then just the vanilla 2 x fury x's setup.
> 
> I did notice fire strike went up single fury x on x399 platform vs x370 which seemed odd but maybe not...
> 
> Was c6h 8c/16t vs taichi 16c
> 
> 14k x370 15k x399


probably physics dragging it UP
but yeah my fury x scores vs this were quite a bit more.
https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13286307/fs/13383862#

just to give an idea of vega v fury x (the fury x is not overclocked much just 50 and the memory is stock.
the threadripper was stock but the 1800x was 3900
its whether the extra pcie lanes you get a re worth the extra :0 it is the big selling point on the platform


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> So I got my new 1080 Ti's today and my Trident Z 3600mhz RGB ram, installed them and reran a few benchmarks.. scores jumped about 3200 points compared to my 1080's... I did install the XOC bios but I'm not sure if theres anything further I have to do to be able to get a bit more voltage out of it.. The cards just stop at 2050, anything higher I cant complete a benchmark. But at 2050 it never crashes no matter what I run. here was my score.
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13635486


https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13635486/fs/13567374#

sorry can't help on NVidia...never touch the stuff myself









but have a look at my stock TR vs yours i am assuming your sis overclocked?
have a look at the physics score...
you would think yours static at 4065 should murder mine in that test...but no its the other way around.


----------



## Simmons572

First batch of parts came in today!

My build log has some content now, so check it out if you all are interested.


----------



## Djreversal

yea people have said this to me a couple times.. I have no idea what would be causing the slower speeds or issues.. should I back it down a bit?


----------



## Particle

Random note: I ran 7z's benchmark on my desktop and on a Pentium 233 MMX. My 1950X's decompression score is apparently equivalent to 850 Pentium 233 MMX CPUs.


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13635486/fs/13567374#
> 
> sorry can't help on NVidia...never touch the stuff myself
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but have a look at my stock TR vs yours i am assuming your sis overclocked?
> have a look at the physics score...
> you would think yours static at 4065 should murder mine in that test...but no its the other way around.


made a few tweaks within windows on a couple things... got a nice bump on my score.

https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13635674


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djreversal*
> 
> made a few tweaks within windows on a couple things... got a nice bump on my score.
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13635674


i think it may be the lower memory speed that brings down the physics score compared to mine that is
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Random note: I ran 7z's benchmark on my desktop and on a Pentium 233 MMX. My 1950X's decompression score is apparently equivalent to 850 Pentium 233 MMX CPUs.


that's hilarious








more considering i owned one of those


----------



## chew*

no clue if its good ran it back to back to back.

This is pretty much why I said screw it on vega and just grabbed a second fury x


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Random note: I ran 7z's benchmark on my desktop and on a Pentium 233 MMX. My 1950X's decompression score is apparently equivalent to 850 Pentium 233 MMX CPUs.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> no clue if its good ran it back to back to back.
> 
> This is pretty much why I said screw it on vega and just grabbed a second fury x






i get it... that is why before i grabbed a fury x nano and crossfired them.
problem was quite a bit of juice needed and it was only useful in games that used the crossfire...and there were quite a few that didn't so i gave up on it (my daughter has it now







)

money wise your set up is cheaper if you got the cards cheap...if you got them at retail (i paid $949 for my first fury x and $500 for the nano) then not so much.

doom is a prime example where crossfire actually dragged the game down from one card.
and there lies the conundrum...one of the x399's biggest selling points massive pcie lanes...is not that useful when it comes to sli/crossfire simply because of the games









as for the vega...as soon as its on water i, m expecting good things









here's my best results so far
fs 1.1
http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13567320

fs extreme (this is older not tweaked so i can squeeze a better score than this)

http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13395442

fs ultra(cpu is oc to 3950 for this)

http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13567374


----------



## chew*

Card 1 free, Card 2 $350 bundled with a x370 taichi couple 512gb ssds 2tb mech HD.

waterblocks are going to run me $300 however.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Card 1 free, Card 2 $350 bundled with a x370 taichi couple 512gb ssds 2tb mech HD.
> 
> waterblocks are going to run me $300 however.


Hey, check out PPCS, coupon code *****irma12 (12%). Runs until Monday


----------



## chew*

Yah i think thats where i am getting them. 2 swiftech backplates 2 aquacomputer black/nickel.

It censored what you said lol.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah i think thats where i am getting them. 2 swiftech backplates 2 aquacomputer black/nickel.


Nice. I'm going to use the backplate that came with my 980 ti classy most likely. Had to buy a used block (the one compatible is a 780 classy according to EK). Could you measure the screw placing for the mosfet cooler if your board isn't screwed down yet? Just seeing if I have to disassemble just to check the screw placement to find a compatible VRM block (would also need measurement of the screw offset, etc.). If not, cool. I'll do it in the morning.

I know more for show than practicality, but want to run it cool and have plenty of rad potential (3x480 Black Ice GTX).


----------



## Djreversal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i think it may be the lower memory speed that brings down the physics score compared to mine that is
> that's hilarious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> more considering i owned one of those


u know i setup my memory for 3600 thinking it would take and on boot up it defaulted to 2166.. i just set it up for 3200 and got it to hold and run..

made #75 on the hall of fame.. which is nice

https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13636118


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Rule of thumb is if you can feel heat ( hot air ) coming out of radiator you need more radiator. Should be warm air but not hot.


My top 420mm is about +42c towards the front of the case, and around +30c at the front. I find it a bit weird. Thought they should be the same all over? Worth mentioning is also that I had heat problems before I got the 420mm and nothing really changed when I installed it. So not sure more rad is what is needed.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChronoBodi*
> 
> My 950 pro can write to 1500 mb/s, but the reads are capped at 1300mb/s, well short of the 2500 mb/s reads.
> 
> Urs just works fine on the same mobo.
> 
> I am super confused.
> 
> For the record, the same exact 950 Pro did 2500 MB/s reads on Gigabyte Phoenix SLI X99.
> 
> So whatever is going on, the SSD probably hates this board or whatever.


No sorry I take that back, Samsung tool said everything was fine. Did some work, rebooted a few times and tinkered with other things. Then I did some more tests with other benchmark tools (and with Samsung Magician) and they would all tell me what I already knew.



I've requested an RMA for the MSI X399 and got it approved already. Looks like I'll be sending this one back next week and be done with it. Not really looking
forward to taking the whole loop apart, thats pretty much all that is holding me back.

So which board will it be? Which one has the least amount of problems?


----------



## chew*

Well thats lame...cant order blocks unless i ship to a business that i registered my prepaid visa to...

That is just silly. I do it so i dont get spam mail at house and so i never put my real account info on the net...

I order off newegg,frozen cpu, swiftech just fine with same card...


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> No sorry I take that back, Samsung tool said everything was fine. Did some work, rebooted a few times and tinkered with other things. Then I did some more tests with other benchmark tools (and with Samsung Magician) and they would all tell me what I already knew.
> 
> 
> 
> I've requested an RMA for the MSI X399 and got it approved already. Looks like I'll be sending this one back next week and be done with it. Not really looking
> forward to taking the whole loop apart, thats pretty much all that is holding me back.
> 
> So which board will it be? Which one has the least amount of problems?






well my vote is for the taichi







i, m biased....i have zero issues, that and it is the cheapest board in the stack.


----------



## chew*

Problem solved...i just said screw it and used amazon...made out way better..


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> well my vote is for the taichi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i, m biased....i have zero issues, that and it is the cheapest board in the stack.


Yeah OC3D seem to like it too but mentions heat issues in his review. My system is already toasty so this is a bit of of a concern.


----------



## chew*

Just the top sink runs a bit warm.

Not omg hot but warm enough to suggest a fan on it for 24/7 load usage.

If your already toasty....heres a question...do you hd speeds go up if you shove a fan on your m2 drive?

They throttle to...fricken all new stuff throttles lol..


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Yeah OC3D seem to like it too but mentions heat issues in his review. My system is already toasty so this is a bit of of a concern.


mine doesn't get to hot i,m not sure exactly what he is referring to, the vrm especially even overclocked running prime were not in my opinion hot.
have a look at any of my posted picks most have hwinfo running (although usually not the vrm temps)

now mind ai ran those with a few other things in the background


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Problem solved...i just said screw it and used amazon...made out way better..


too bad your not down under....first time i have ever said that in regards to hardware purchases









https://www.ple.com.au/Products/620006/XSPC-Razor-Fury-X-AMD-GPU-Waterblock

that's aussie dollars so probably 5 bucks US









if it fit a nano i might of got one for the daughter(but from memory different layout)


----------



## chris89

Can we see an AIDA64 Cpu Memory Benchmark? I would like to see the scores.


----------



## gupsterg

@chew*

Swiftech on webshop got crazy price for ref Fury/X PCB blocks.


----------



## Bm514

Just finished building this rig I previously had a 7700K @ 5.1 delided mainly for Gaming and I was doing my audio Production/Rendering And light video editing on that machine ... The performance was ok but not the greatest ... Then I heard about Threadripper I was initially going to do an x299 Overkill build but I got discouraged by the Vrms temps I knew EK was going to release monoblocks for x299 but I scrapped that plan and went with AMD ... My expectations are totally fulfilled I regret nothing (besides the current state of my bank account XD)

Here are some pics





P.S that 3-way SLI bridge is a temporary fix until I receive my Zotac 0 slot bridge

Specs:

GIGABYTE X399 AORUS Gaming 7
AMD RYZEN Threadripper 1950X
G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 32GB DDR4 3200
GTX 1080Tis SLI
Corsair HX1000i
Custom Loop


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> Just finished building this rig I previously had a 7700K @ 5.1 delided mainly for Gaming and I was doing my audio Production/Rendering And light video editing on that machine ... The performance was ok but not the greatest ... Then I heard about Threadripper I was initially going to do an x299 Overkill build but I got discouraged by the Vrms temps I knew EK was going to release monoblocks for x299 but I scrapped that plan and went with AMD ... My expectations are totally fulfilled I regret nothing (besides the current state of my bank account XD)
> 
> Here are some pics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S that 3-way SLI bridge is a temporary fix until I receive my Zotac 0 slot bridge
> 
> Specs:
> 
> GIGABYTE X399 AORUS Gaming 7
> AMD RYZEN Threadripper 1950X
> G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 32GB DDR4 3200
> GTX 1080Tis SLI
> Corsair HX1000i
> Custom Loop






that's some glorious lighting








what size are those radiators...i think they are bigger than my cars








and is that an ek block? what sort of temps are you getting


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> that's some glorious lighting
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what size are those radiators...I think they are bigger than my cars
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and is that an EK block? what sort of temps are you getting


Hahhahah!!! Thx Man !!!









what size are those radiators...I think they are bigger than my cars







: They are 70mm
is that an EK block? : Yes Threadripper Edition

Temps: idle 28ish Load: 58 keep in mind there is 2 1080tis Maxed out on that loop and the CPU is at @ 4.0 1.385 V


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> well my vote is for the taichi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i, m biased....i have zero issues, that and it is the cheapest board in the stack.


I just got my Taichi back from Newegg after RMA. 1st an M.2 port died over night after like 1 day after getting it. Came back to a message about not having a a Disk to boot into. Moved m.2 ports and it fired up. Random locks, double boots, and went down hill fast before it no longer booted. Same parts now work on new motherboard. We'll see how this one works.


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> I just got my Taichi back from Newegg after RMA. 1st an M.2 port died over night after like 1 day after getting it. Came back to a message about not having a a Disk to boot into. Moved m.2 ports and it fired up. Random locks, double boots, and went down hill fast before it no longer booted. Same parts now work on the new motherboard. We'll see how this one works.


Hopefully, everything will be fine I've never Owned an ASRock But I've read so many good reviews ... on the other hand, i am actually very pleasantly surprised with Aorus/Gigabyte Had Zero issues With the x399 Gaming 7


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> I just got my Taichi back from Newegg after RMA. 1st an M.2 port died over night after like 1 day after getting it. Came back to a message about not having a a Disk to boot into. Moved m.2 ports and it fired up. Random locks, double boots, and went down hill fast before it no longer booted. Same parts now work on new motherboard. We'll see how this one works.


well that's one all any tiebreakers?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> Hahhahah!!! Thx Man !!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what size are those radiators...I think they are bigger than my cars
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : They are 70mm
> is that an EK block? : Yes Threadripper Edition
> 
> Temps: idle 28ish Load: 58 keep in mind there is 2 1080tis Maxed out on that loop and the CPU is at @ 4.0 1.385 V


that looks pretty good to me what sort of load do you base that on?


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> well that's one all any tiebreakers?
> that looks pretty good to me what sort of load do you base that on?


Aida64 Stability test


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> well that's one all any tiebreakers?
> that looks pretty good to me what sort of load do you base that on?


I'm sure the issue my board had would be in the minority. A company wouldn't stay in business with constant RMAs like that.


----------



## Beatnutz

-delted-

my bad, forgot the multiplier


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Even with SMT turned off, they are still threads running on CPU cores.
> 
> ...
> 
> You would be better served leaving SMT turned on.


First of all thanks for taking the time to explain.

You got any opinion you want to share regarding SMT and HPET? I mean the QueryPerformanceCounter should be affected/affect in turn the thread usage and timing, right?

(am wondering if the 'issues' mentioned here and elsewhere are perhaps related to the switches found in Game and Creator mode)


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Even with SMT turned off, they are still threads running on CPU cores.
> 
> ...
> 
> You would be better served leaving SMT turned on.
> 
> 
> 
> First of all thanks for taking the time to explain.
> 
> You got any opinion you want to share regarding SMT and HPET? I mean the QueryPerformanceCounter should be affected/affect in turn the thread usage and timing, right?
> 
> (am wondering if the 'issues' mentioned here and elsewhere are perhaps related to the switches found in Game and Creator mode)
Click to expand...

SMT is one of those things that benefits some workloads and hinders others so there is no correct answer. The best answer is to enable it, run the things you like to do and see how it performs. then try it again with SMT disabled. Personally I would start with leaving it enabled to get the benefits from the extra performance available and look for ways to manage those applications that are hindered by smt. Many games benefit from affinity mapping the application to cores only on the first die for example. A plex server, for example should be happy to run anywhere so that could be set to only run on 4 threads on the second die then it can never impact performance of the games on the first 8 cores.

Windows 10 does not enable HPET by default. when Ryzen first came out there was a need to enable it that I believe has since gone away. Realbench requires it to be enabled. again, like SMT, try both and see which one works better in your environment. Not the convenient bottled answer many would like I know, but every environment is different.

The thing with Ryzen and now threadripper is that it is basically a new experience for just about everyone here that is almost but not quite like what we were used to before. No-one really has any experience with a 16 Core desktop machine and there are no applications that have been written to only support 16 core CPUs, they are all written with support for 2 or 4 core machines in mind. I really don't think anyone should be surprised to find that tweakimg helps


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I've requested an RMA for the MSI X399 and got it approved already. Looks like I'll be sending this one back next week and be done with it. Not really looking
> forward to taking the whole loop apart, thats pretty much all that is holding me back.
> 
> So which board will it be? Which one has the least amount of problems?


How does a person RMA something that isn't defective? That just isn't right. What you should have done is just return it and accept the restocking fee.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> How does a person RMA something that isn't defective? That just isn't right. What you should have done is just return it and accept the restocking fee.


Depends what you mean with 'defective'? M.2 drives running at 2/3 of the speed, constant crashing on stock settings (forget OC). LED displays malfunctioning, Ram only works in 2133Mhz etc.

I think its a far cry from working properly. It's a €400 motherboard and I don't expect to be their beta tester for that kind of price tag.

Not sure who I am hurting. It's not like MSI is a poor little child. And they sell this crap to me, I don't think I owe them anything.


----------



## Aenra

While pretty basic, it escapes a lot of people, so to reiterate:

Boot NVMEs will always, always run slower than theoretically capable of; always.

You want it to read/write at its advertized specs, you make sure it's a slave drive.

TLDR as long as Samsung Magician says that a) everything is O.K. (has an indication for conflicts / hardware issues) and b) it's seen as PCIe 3.0x4, you're probably* fine.

Just in case; maybe there really is an issue, don't know, but just in case.

* There are always variations. Chipset to chipset, the very same drive's speeds will differ; likewise between motherboards, some may have lower writes but higher randoms or vice versa.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> How does a person RMA something that isn't defective? That just isn't right. What you should have done is just return it and accept the restocking fee.


People do it all the time. Just check out a maxwell GPU owners thread. People RMA cause it has a 'low' ASIC scores or because it doesn't get to 1500mhz. A speed well over advertised stock.


----------



## Nizzen

My threadripper server:

Asrock Fatality pro + 1950x
G.skill 3200 c15
Ek water
Areca hw raid 28 ports


----------



## chew*

Yah it may be throttling...he said he is running toasty...


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah it may be throttling...he said he is running toasty...


Yeah I'll keep an eye on the m.2 temps. I've been running the benchmark after idling so the temps so case/CPU temps should have been under 40c


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> While pretty basic, it escapes a lot of people, so to reiterate:
> 
> Boot NVMEs will _always_, always run slower than theoretically capable of; always.
> You want it to read/write at its advertized specs, you make sure it's a slave drive.
> 
> TLDR as long as Samsung Magician says that a) everything is O.K. (has an indication for conflicts / hardware issues) and b) it's seen as PCIe 3.0x4, you're probably* fine.
> Just in case; maybe there really is an issue, don't know, but just in case.
> 
> * There are always variations. Chipset to chipset, the very same drive's speeds will differ; likewise between motherboards, some may have lower writes but higher randoms or vice versa.


I get that it doesn't max out.. but 2gb/s read is not what I'm supposed to be getting. 2.9gb/s or even a little bit higher is certainly not unheard of for the 960 EVO. Without running it as slave. But yeah it might be throttling so gonna keep an eye on it in a few.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> @chew*
> 
> Swiftech on webshop got crazy price for ref Fury/X PCB blocks.


You the man gups.

Amazon pulled same billing addy crap. Woke up to email this morning.

Ordered a pair from swiftech instead.

Saved $100. Temps may suffer a tad but i"m sure it will beat stock.

Thanks.


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> While pretty basic, it escapes a lot of people, so to reiterate:
> 
> Boot NVMEs will always, always run slower than theoretically capable of; always.
> You want it to read/write at its advertized specs, you make sure it's a slave drive.
> 
> TLDR as long as Samsung Magician says that a) everything is O.K. (has an indication for conflicts / hardware issues) and b) it's seen as PCIe 3.0x4, you're probably* fine.
> Just in case; maybe there really is an issue, don't know, but just in case.
> 
> * There are always variations. Chipset to chipset, the very same drive's speeds will differ; likewise between motherboards, some may have lower writes but higher randoms or vice versa.
> 
> 
> 
> I get that it doesn't max out.. but 2gb/s read is not what I'm supposed to be getting
Click to expand...

Ooh but it is. I get about 2,200 on my bootable Samsung 960 Pro, less sometimes ^^

(it runs at 3,498 as slave, tested, lol; same physical slot too, same drivers, nothing changed)


----------



## slipsand

So this happened today.

Reversed the fans on the radiator to a push instead of a pull. Helping cool the VRM.
Bumped the switching freq to 500Khz, Disabled spread spectrum, Enhanced over current protection.

3600Mhz @ 4.0Ghz

All auto voltages...still can't change anything on this board for some reason. Any other 1900x guys running into this?

XMP still fails to boot.


----------



## slipsand

Here is some better quality.


----------



## chew*

Somethings way off like you dropped a channel.

Reads are like 80k plus @ 3200.


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *slipsand*
> 
> 
> 
> Here is some better quality.


Do you have a Youtube Channel? It would be awesome to see some gameplay... Like a Walkthrough of a game... How about .. hmm idk? Anything.

Can you use the full version? here's a key if u want it.. haha

Copy & past this simple text file into the directory... I wanna see complete results plus AIDA GPGPU Test GPU & CPU.









pkey.zip 3k .zip file


Rename These To .ZIP .... Checkmark "File Extensions" in "View" tab in windows.

aida-winrar-part1.zip 5000k .zip file


aida-winrar-part2.zip 5000k .zip file


aida-winrar-part3.zip 5000k .zip file


aida-winrar-part4.zip 1995k .zip file


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> People do it all the time. Just check out a maxwell GPU owners thread. People RMA cause it has a 'low' ASIC scores or because it doesn't get to 1500mhz. A speed well over advertised stock.


Absolutely pathetic. What an astounding sense of entitlement such people have.


----------



## chris89

Here's my CPU Queen... Can the threadripper break 100,000 points?



Here's CPU Cache Memory @ Symmetrical Multi Processing Mode @ Higher Power Efficiency (Power Savings) (Lose about 5-10GB/s memory bandwidth).


----------



## slipsand

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Somethings way off like you dropped a channel.
> 
> Reads are like 80k plus @ 3200.


That is in game mode. When in Creator mode I'm still in low 65ks


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris89*
> 
> Here's my CPU Queen... Can the threadripper break 100,000 points?
> 
> Here's CPU Cache Memory @ Symmetrical Multi Processing Mode @ Higher Power Efficiency (Power Savings) (Lose about 5-10GB/s memory bandwidth).


Far beyond 100k.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *slipsand*
> 
> All auto voltages...still can't change anything on this board for some reason. Any other 1900x guys running into this?


What board?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> No sorry I take that back, Samsung tool said everything was fine. Did some work, rebooted a few times and tinkered with other things. Then I did some more tests with other benchmark tools (and with Samsung Magician) and they would all tell me what I already knew.
> 
> 
> 
> I've requested an RMA for the MSI X399 and got it approved already. Looks like I'll be sending this one back next week and be done with it. Not really looking
> forward to taking the whole loop apart, thats pretty much all that is holding me back.
> 
> So which board will it be? Which one has the least amount of problems?


Taichi.

Great VRMs and even better price.

Mine has performed well with two 960 EVOs and a RD400. The RD400 is coming out in favor of another 960 EVO. I'm going to take advantage of RAID 0 when AMD releases the enhancements on the 25th.

For what it's worth, I had the Carbon and returned it in favor of the Taichi. Best decision I've made on a motherboard in years. The Carbon was twitchy and had a comparatively crude BIOS. I'm done with MSI motherboards for another 5 or 10 years...


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

Yah not been happy with the MSI Carbon one bit, did you get to use with the none public 1.52 BIOS, that makes it functional for me as before that entirely unusable, the board should be pulled from sale till the 1.5 is out IMO.

As to if the update to 1.5 is enough to make me feel any better about it... ask me again once the bruises have healed from wasting days of my life with it's nonsense.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Taichi.
> 
> Great VRMs and even better price.
> 
> Mine has performed well with two 960 EVOs and a RD400. The RD400 is coming out in favor of another 960 EVO. I'm going to take advantage of RAID 0 when AMD releases the enhancements on the 25th.
> 
> For what it's worth, I had the Carbon and returned it in favor of the Taichi. Best decision I've made on a motherboard in years. The Carbon was twitchy and had a comparatively crude BIOS. I'm done with MSI motherboards for another 5 or 10 years...


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

What is a good temp to keep the VRM at at heavy load, I saw it jump to 100c when stressing Prime Small FFT at 3.9ghz which seems a bit nuts, and under normal 3D rendering load it sticks around 97c perhaps as this MSI Carbon has less of a heat sink than the rest -_- and really wont be at full load 24/7 365 either

Thought about turning fans round also for that sake too!, experiment time! science! I presume by reverse you had to reposition them and not some magical setting somewhere to flip?

On top of this, maybe another MSI mobo issue, the temps sometimes vanish entirely for the VRM, and end up with stupid figures like -100 and 350c, ( using none public 1.5 BIOS atm )



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *slipsand*
> 
> 
> 
> So this happened today.
> 
> Reversed the fans on the radiator to a push instead of a pull. Helping cool the VRM.
> Bumped the switching freq to 500Khz, Disabled spread spectrum, Enhanced over current protection.
> 
> 3600Mhz @ 4.0Ghz
> 
> All auto voltages...still can't change anything on this board for some reason. Any other 1900x guys running into this?
> 
> XMP still fails to boot.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Ooh but it is. I get about 2,200 on my bootable Samsung 960 Pro, less sometimes ^^
> (it runs at 3,498 as slave, tested, lol; same physical slot too, same drivers, nothing changed)






here you go just ran it on my bootable 960 evo

now they look about right considering the drive and whats on it (also the other things going on in the background like AV email IE etc.



here's the 850 evo as a data drive...and i take back what i said before there is a 10 percent difference in speed so about 10 percent penalty for running drive as os...not a 33 percent drop

now as an aside if you look at the second pic...in hwinfo i have 2 drive temps under the 960 evo which is real and 93 degrees? crap would melt..







also at what point does throttling start(those temps were while i was running the atto bench and it does not *appear* to be throttling


----------



## Nizzen

Threadripper platform is a scam! Can't get 3466 or 3600mhz memory stable. 1950x + Asrock Fatality pro. Using g.skill 4266 x4 sticks.









I managed to get 3600 memory stable on Ryzen 1800x on Asrock fatality pro gaming.


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> What is a good temp to keep the VRM at at heavy load, I saw it jump to 100c when stressing Prime Small FFT at 3.9ghz which seems a bit nuts, and under normal 3D rendering load it sticks around 97c perhaps as this MSI Carbon has less of a heat sink than the rest -_- and really wont be at full load 24/7 365 either
> 
> Thought about turning fans round also for that sake too!, experiment time! science! I presume by reverse you had to reposition them and not some magical setting somewhere to flip?
> 
> On top of this, maybe another MSI mobo issue, the temps sometimes vanish entirely for the VRM, and end up with stupid figures like -100 and 350c, ( using none public 1.5 BIOS atm )


I would revist the VRM cooling... What's your board? Post picture? I can help.

Download very latest beta HWInfo64 because I think you have sensor errors for sure.


----------



## crion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> Threadripper platform is a scam! Can't get 3466 or 3600mhz memory stable. 1950x + Asrock Fatality pro. Using g.skill 4266 x4 sticks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I managed to get 3600 memory stable on Ryzen 1800x on Asrock fatality pro gaming.


Those are higher voltage DIMM's 1.4V right?
Not the same sticks you used on the 1800x build, correct?


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> What is a good temp to keep the VRM at at heavy load, I saw it jump to 100c when stressing Prime Small FFT at 3.9ghz which seems a bit nuts, and under normal 3D rendering load it sticks around 97c perhaps as this MSI Carbon has less of a heat sink than the rest -_- and really wont be at full load 24/7 365 either
> 
> Thought about turning fans round also for that sake too!, experiment time! science! I presume by reverse you had to reposition them and not some magical setting somewhere to flip?
> 
> On top of this, maybe another MSI mobo issue, the temps sometimes vanish entirely for the VRM, and end up with stupid figures like -100 and 350c, ( using none public 1.5 BIOS atm )


not sure what it is supposed to be but here mine at stock running small ffts


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crion*
> 
> Those are higher voltage DIMM's 1.4V right?
> Not the same sticks you used on the 1800x build, correct?


Same sticks


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> Threadripper platform is a scam. Can't get 3466 or 3600mhz memory stable. 1950x + Asrock Fatality pro. Using g.skill 4266 x4 sticks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I managed to get 3600 memory stable on Ryzen 1800x on Asrock fatality pro gaming.


How do you figure the platform is a "scam" considering the specifications clearly state that 2666 is the highest supported speed grade for memory? Anything beyond that is ymmv.


----------



## chew*

Its more about cpu then platform for imc...and now you need double golden eggs vs one golden egg.

Many have tested a few chips and can still not get true stability @ 3600 at respectable timings worth running on R7.

If you got a golden chip that was stable consider yourself lucky.

I can boot my 399 taichi fine @ 16-16-16 3600....even run benches. Far from what i call stable and @ 16-16-16....fairly pointless. Just a number in the performance area..


----------



## tarot

that and the difference between low latency 3200 and higher latency 3600 is pretty much a poofteenth of nothing in the real world.

just wanted to throw in some pics from the asrock thread because i,m sort of proud of corona









please note the number 1







also the 7960x score...only 2 seconds in it.(i,m guessing that is stock but hey









and vrm temps ignore tdie temps this is still on the h115i so it definitely struggles.

also note vrm temps at 4g (for the vrm want to knows)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## DVLux

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> that and the difference between low latency 3200 and higher latency 3600 is pretty much a poofteenth of nothing in the real world.


The difference between 3200 and 3600 has more impact on TR than a measly 100MHz on the CPU. I can guarantee you that.


----------



## chew*

The difference between 14-14-14 3200 to 3600 14-14-14 would be significant.......

the difference from 14-14-14 3200 to crap timings 3600 is not worth the effort.

If anything going for 12-12-12 3200/3333 would prove far more beneficial.

its not called cross core speed issues.

its called cross core latency issues.

None of the above will change the fact that the platform and memory has nothing to do with attainable speeds however.

90% of it is the cpu if the board/memory is up to the task which sounds like yours is.

infinity fabric can not do 3600 on 2 dies...then you can not do 3600.


----------



## DVLux

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> The difference between 14-14-14 3200 to 3600 14-14-14 would be significant.......
> 
> the difference from 14-14-14 3200 to crap timings 3600 is not worth the effort.
> 
> If anything going for 12-12-12 3200/3333 would prove far more beneficial.
> 
> its not called cross core speed issues.
> 
> its called cross core latency issues.


Define "Crap" timings, please.

These aren't the Phenom days where CL is of superior importance. As far as I can tell, anyhow. (The amount of Threadripper Memory Benchmarks/Latency Tests is borderline non-existant.)


----------



## chew*

PI 32m says lower latency vs speed wins around the 3200-3400 range. higher and looser scores get worse....

CB does not really scale beyond tight 3333-3400 ( 14-14-14 )

worth a few points ( literally ) at 14-14-14 if you overvolt the crap out of your ram @ 3600 but no where realistic for 24/7.

looser scores go down, I could go on but its pretty much already been proven.....

Also if we get really technical and look at timing tables c16 3600 gets thrashed pretty hard by c14 3200 but even then still not optimal, 3200 c12 would be more beneficial.

16-16-16 3600 = my definition of crap.

maybe if we could pull that down to 15-14-14 I might roll with it....


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Ooh but it is. I get about 2,200 on my bootable Samsung 960 Pro, less sometimes ^^
> (it runs at 3,498 as slave, tested, lol; same physical slot too, same drivers, nothing changed)


Yeah I hear ya, just find it hard to believe seeing as there are lots who get 2.5/gbs-3.0/gbs in 'read' with the 960 EVO, even on boot drives.
2.0/gbs feels completely off. But maybe I'm wrong.


----------



## chew*

here's an example......

I can hit that same CB score @ 3200-3400.

I spent a ton of time comparing latency vs speed. Everest is about the only place its beneficial.........





literally 4 points in CB is within margin of error and within run tolerance per run......run again it goes down run again it goes up.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DVLux*
> 
> The difference between 3200 and 3600 has more impact on TR than a measly 100MHz on the CPU. I can guarantee you that.


i am happy to be proved wrong
infinity fabric loves faster lower latency memory...to a point same went for the ryzen.
what i am saying there is a big diminishing return once you pass say 3333 at low latency.
i, m pretty sure mine will do 3333 14 14 14 so i will do a few tests.
i believe real bench image test would be a good one or rendering so i will try those.

but i still believe if you can get your chip to 4.1 stable and the ram to a minimum of 3200 14 14 14 that would be around the top of the pile in most real life scenarios.

but again....happy to be proven wrong.

heres a few benches TR at stock memory at 3333 14 14 14 (3466 would not boot at 14 so i would need to loosen the timings)

now even at 3333 it is not stable 14 14 14 i would probably need to throw it to 14 15 15 and tweak a few more things for that but.

the results without hwinfo in them are 3200 14 13 13
make of all this as you will just remember the memory was not stable so the results are probably off (it would be better if someone with 3466 3333 setup correctly threw their hand in the ring










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## crion

Would it be naive to think that I could get an expensive set of say G.Skill DDR4-4000 F4-4000C18Q2-64GTZR CL18-19-19-39 4×8 GB or 8x8 GB and run it at 3200 12 12 12?

Right now I have an order for
G.Skill TridentZ RGB DDR4-3600 C17 QC - 64GB (F4-3600C17Q-64GTZR)

That will probably get me 3GHz with 4 sticks and maybe 3200 with 2 sticks? but slow timings, atleast for TR4/Ryzen?

For me in sweden it looks that the best availability is with Corsair and G.Skill, should I look further? What is the smart thing to do here if the endgame for me is 64GB RAM and not suboptimal timings. I guess I'm asking you to look into the crystal skull here a bit but maybe there is something logical we can see already?

One other thing, is it true that the current TR4 UEFI only lets us set even CAS timings like 12, 14, 16, 18 and not 13, 15, 17 when @3000MHz+

I will probably go with ASRock Fatal1ty X399 for its built in 10Gbit ethernet apart from good quality and BIOS development team?


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

MSI Gaming Pro Carbon running none public 1.5.2 BIOS, using latest HWINFO 5.57-3240, the stats from the Mobo are totally borked showing 3 million watts at the moment with 870c

Sometimes it takes forever to show the Sensor Status window and then the 2 sections for Mobo ( MXSI 399 Gaming Pro Carbon Ac ( MS-7B09 ) (IF35201)) are completely absent

I have been disabling HPET, and before the 1.5.2 BIOS things were a real mess of random error codes, so desperately waiting for MSI to get $H!% together and fix this disgrace with a public BIOS update.

Below images taken in morning after just booting so running cold ( room is 20c )







And just up volted to 1.3v and ran Prime95 Small FFT:



And still at 1.3v running 3D rendering:



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris89*
> 
> I would revist the VRM cooling... What's your board? Post picture? I can help.
> 
> Download very latest beta HWInfo64 because I think you have sensor errors for sure.


----------



## mmonnin

Anyone have problems with warm boots? My 1950x and Taichi will not reboot . It needs to be powered off for several minutes before coming back up. BIOS updated and all stock settings. It goes to black screens under about any kind of load. It does like a double post each start now. Fans spin for a second then all lights go out then starts up again. I just ran Memtest over night single threaded. It locked previously in SMP. I've already RMAd the board. I'm afraid its the $1k CPU.

Edit: Seems to be the EVGA 850 P2 PSU. Swapped it unto another PC and it shut off as well and BIOS said there was a surge before starting.


----------



## mrryzen

Hello everyone, so it's finally time for me to join the glorious Threadripper Master R... i mean Owners Club.
I've spent the whole previous day reading this rather massive thread trying to figure out my new build that I'd like to order in a couple of days.

A note about myself and what I'm going to use this build for might be useful, as I have a couple of questions that I'm hoping that someone could answer in this thread.
So, I haven't build a regular PC in like 10 years or so, as for the last 5 years I was using a rather not-so-powerful laptop with i5-3210M and a GTX 660M (so this build should be a massive upgrade for me), and looking at this thread I've started to thing that going heavy overclocking might not be a good idea just for now. TBH, I haven't messed around with any heavy overclocking in the past, so I'm assuming I should start without getting my hopes up for squeezing as much performance as it gets. I haven't done any watercooled build either, and according to some guys here AIO coolers (maybe except for Thermaltake TR4 which is not available in my country yet) might not be worth their price for now (I guess more TR4 specific AIOs should show up really soon), so I think going with Noctua's TR4 specific is also a better choice for me.
As for my rig's purpose - I'm a full time programmer working 100% remote from home, mostly webdev/webapps related, but from time to time I like to mess around with some C++ and other low-level languages (well, at least lower level than webdev) apps building. My main OS is Linux, not Windows (but just to be clear, I'll still use Windows, most likely just for the games), not sure if this matter much in these days though. The secondary purpose of this build will be gaming, I'm targeting [email protected], maybe upgrading to [email protected] in the future when new monitors show up (and Volta/Navi or dual Pascal builds can handle it). I was considering full AMD build, but honestly, Vega seems to be far behind Nvidia's offerings. Wait for Navi I guess...
I currently don't own a 4k display, but I'm going to get it with my next paycheck (or I could do this this month if there's a possibility to save some money on this build).

So, as for my build, here's what I've picked so far.

As for the prices, I live in Poland. Current exchange rates and taxes are:
~4.28PLN = 1EUR
~3.58PLN = 1USD
Polish VAT rate: 23%

I guess posting links to the polish stores won't matter much, but I'll do it anyway in case someone might want to check other pieces' prices or some fellow Pole wants to use my list to create their own:

AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X @ x-kom.pl for 4 599,00 PLN (~1 075 EUR / 1 285 USD)
ASRock X399 TAICHI @ x-kom.pl for 1 629,00 PLN (~381 EUR / ~455 USD)
ASUS GeForce GTX 1080Ti Strix ROG 11GB GDDR5X (ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI-11G-GAMING) @ x-kom.pl for 3 529,00 PLN (~825 EUR / ~986 USD)
G.SKILL 4x8GB 3200MHz Flare X Black Ryzen CL14 (2x2x8192) (two sets of 2x8GB) (F4-3200C14D-16GFX) @ x-kom.pl for 1 838,00 PLN (~430 EUR / ~513 USD)
EVGA 1000W SuperNOVA G3 80 PLUS Gold (220-G3-1000-X2) @ x-kom.pl for 999,00 PLN (~ 233 EUR / ~ 279 USD)
Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 @ proline.pl for 339,00 PLN (~79 EUR / ~94 USD)
Plextor SSD 1TB M.2 PCIe PX-1T8PeG w/H.S. @ morele.net for 1459,00 PLN (~341 EUR / ~407 USD)
Thermaltake Core X71 (CA-1F8-00M1WN-00) @ morele.net for 607,95 PLN (~ 142 EUR / ~ 170 USD)
(Alternatively) Thermaltake Core X71 Tempered Glass Edition (CA-1F8-00M1WN-02) morele.net for 711,43 PLN (~ 166 EUR / ~ 199 USD)
Total (PLN): 14999,95 PLN / 15103,43 PLN (depending on case variant)
Total (EUR): ~ 3506 EUR / ~ 3530 EUR
Total (USD): ~ 4189 USD / ~ 4218 USD

Now, a couple of questions regarding this build:

Considering that I've never actually overclocked or tuned timings on RAMs, are the sticks that I've chosen a good or a bad pick, in terms of compatibility (according to reddit's listing, this should be Samsung's B-die), potential overclocking (is it even possible to achieve higher clocks on these or similar sticks, lets say aiming at 3600Mhz max?) and pricing (I know RAM prices are currently quite crazy, so honestly I have no idea if these ones are even a good pick)? If there are better options, I could check if they are available in polish stores.
Looking back at my usecases for this rig, I've started wondering if I really need 1950x. I mean, I'm pretty sure I won't utilize it to the max, as I'm not into video editing or some hardcode CPU simulations as some ppl here. Maybe 1920x would be a better pick, considering it has nearly the same performance in games (1-5FPS difference?), and I'm planning to upgrade in the next 2-3 years when AMD releases their 7nm process CPUs (if they are any good)?
As you can see, I've chosen 1000W PSU, which I'm pretty sure at this moment is a huge overkill. But... I'm considering buying a second GPU in the future (that depends on Volta/Navi performance boost). Will this be enough or is it still an overkill?
I've chosen NVMe SSD, but I'm not sure if I actually need that sort of performance for that price (and I know there are theoretically more performant Samsung's NVMe SSDs, but they are also sometimes 2x more expensive). In my current laptop, I have a Transcend SSD370 256GB (TS256GMSA370) connected through mSATA slot in my laptop. According to their specification, my SSD is a couple of times slower (theoretically of course), but I really cannot complain about it's speed. Again, I'm not into video editing, and it seems most people who do that sort of things are really into measuring their drives performance. I won't do any of that, so maybe I should buy a regular SSD which should be cheaper? On the other hand, Crucial MX300 1TB (which seems to be recommended by some benchmarking sites, not sure if it's any good) is only 270PLN (~63 EUR / ~75 USD) cheaper, so maybe I'm overthinking this?
Another question about picked SSD - the one I've picked is an M.2 format, while there's also a PCIe one, that is almost 100 EUR more expensive. I assume PCIe is more performant, so is the price difference really worth it?
As far as I can see, the case I've chosen has 3 fans (2x front, 1x back). Should I consider buying more (or replace "stock" fans) fans to keep the rig cool, or should these be just enough?
I was also considering buying some regular HDD drive(s), but I think I can wait with that a little longer (1TB should be more than enough for now), plus I was considering going NAS (or custom NAS) in the future so it's not a big deal right now.
I know this post looks like "build me a rig" one, but I hope I'm not violating any rules of this thread or this forum (but if I am, could this be moved to an appropriate thread if there's one already?). I really hope you guys could "rate this setup" and tell me if it's any good or a complete piece of crap (before I smash that "Purchase" button, or buttons), and I guess I'll be joining this little club for real in the comming days.


----------



## Aenra

@tarot no offense, but you need to stop the following two things:

- mixing apples and oranges.

i) comparing different drives with one another and reaching conclusions.

ii) confusing/mixing your HDD's temps (which are your fault, mine gets to 27C and that's under load.. where do you have it mounted? Why?) with a motherboard's "potential" to drive said HDD; most especially when said HDD (your NVMe) is notorious for reaching high temps and subsequently throttling. What have you done to ameliorate that, prior to shifting the blame to something else? In this case, the mobo?

You do not have the data to do a clean, proper comparison and yet that's exactly what you going.. or rather, insist on doing, let's be honest.

- mixing desires with facts.

I have used the very same (physically, the actual, same unit) NVMe on 3 chipsets as of now. In all 3, it reaches advertized speeds as a slave, about a K less as a boot. Now maybe, some very specific, ultra-good mobo would lower the gap to say .800 or .700; maybe. The fact however remains.

Anyway, can only say the same thing so many times, so.. feel free to RMA your mobo. And as stated, no offense meant.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> MSI Gaming Pro Carbon running none public 1.5.2 BIOS, using latest HWINFO 5.57-3240, the stats from the Mobo are totally borked showing 3 million watts at the moment with 870c
> 
> Sometimes it takes forever to show the Sensor Status window and then the 2 sections for Mobo ( MXSI 399 Gaming Pro Carbon Ac ( MS-7B09 ) (IF35201)) are completely absent
> 
> I have been disabling HPET, and before the 1.5.2 BIOS things were a real mess of random error codes, so desperately waiting for MSI to get $H!% together and fix this disgrace with a public BIOS update


MSI did release 7B09v15 about one week ago and it came after the 1.52 beta, but I'm not sure which is technically newer. I've not tried it yet to see if it fixes my Blender crash.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrryzen*
> 
> Hello everyone, so it's finally time for me to join the glorious Threadripper Master R... i mean Owners Club.
> I've spent the whole previous day reading this rather massive thread trying to figure out my new build that I'd like to order in a couple of days.


Linux does seem to play well with Threadripper. I'm a Debian 9 user and have no complaints there. I don't think overclocking is particularly important with a CPU like the 1950X. It's certainly reasonable to try though if you're optimizing for multithreaded applications. Any application lightweight enough to have not been multithreaded isn't going to see a gain since XFR is already pushing single core workloads to 4.2 GHz. The silicon can't be reliably expected to go beyond that it seems like, so the only real benefit you might expect is to keep in the 4.0-4.2 GHz frequency band more solidly than XFR would keep you there. Any application heavyweight enough to have been multithreaded will already be seeing very good performance. If you do choose to overclock, you'll see the most benefit in applications like these since the uplift is multiplied across a large number of cores. Locked to 4.0 GHz you'd certainly be better off for things like video encoding, compression, and compiling (if your compiler is threaded).

With respect to the questions in your list:
- I don't mess with memory overclocking so I can't help you there. I'm on the other end of the spectrum where I've opted for ECC memory which means I'm running at lower speeds. I'm running four Kingston 8 GiB DDR4-2400 ECC UDIMMs. DDR4 ECC memory tops at 2400 MT/s currently.
- You shouldn't think of it in black and white terms of need or not need. It's fine just to want. I would say the 1950X is a better value than the 1920X. You're already $800 in at that point, so why not get the full product for $200 more?
- A quality 1000 watt power supply should be sufficient unless you intend to overclock. Expect your CPU to consume and dissipate 300 watts or more if you start overvolting and overclocking it. GPUs vary widely, but they too consume a lot of power if you start overvolting. I don't really look at power supplies that aren't Seasonic, but I assume you researched and found that the eVGA is good according to Jonnyguru and the like?
- NVMe disks are nice. The biggest benefit isn't the bandwidth but the reduction in latency versus disks that use the AHCI protocol. Using a Samsung 950 Pro, I've noticed a benefit when doing kernel compilations. Just extracting the myriad of source files means there is a lot of small file IO going on.
- M.2 slots *are* PCIe. There is no reason to choose a card form factor unless you just want to or if the disk can use more than 4 lanes of PCIe (which is what M.2 offers).
- Personally, I would suggest replacing any fans that don't at least have fluid dynamic bearings (or one of the related variants) with Noctua fans. If what it comes with says Antec, throw it away no matter what it is. If what it comes with says sleeve bearing, rifle bearing, ball bearing, or any of the physical contact bearing methods then throw them away and replace them with Noctuas. I personally like to have through-flow in my cases where air ingresses through the front and egresses through the back and top. I like to have both a top exhaust and rear exhaust.
- If you do want hard drives in the future, consider Toshiba. Avoid Seagate.


----------



## mrryzen

Thanks for your response Particle.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> - A quality 1000 watt power supply should be sufficient unless you intend to overclock. Expect your CPU to consume and dissipate 300 watts or more if you start overvolting and overclocking it. GPUs vary widely, but they too consume a lot of power if you start overvolting. I don't really look at power supplies that aren't Seasonic, but I assume you researched and found that the eVGA is good according to Jonnyguru and the like?


Never heard of that guy, this one (or a similar one from EVGA) was recommended by polish site PurePC, and since they are in general quite reputable I haven't really questioned their "judgement". An alternative for that EVGA was a Corsair PSU I think. If you have any suggestions in a similar price range, I'm all ears.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> - Personally, I would suggest replacing any fans that don't at least have fluid dynamic bearings (or one of the related variants) with Noctua fans. If what it comes with says Antec, throw it away no matter what it is. If what it comes with says sleeve bearing, rifle bearing, ball bearing, or any of the physical contact bearing methods then throw them away and replace them with Noctuas. I personally like to have through-flow in my cases where air ingresses through the front and egresses through the back and top. I like to have both a top exhaust and rear exhaust.


From what I've managed to find on Thermaltake's specification page, the two frontpanel fans are Riing 14 LED Blue (so Hydraulic Bearing), and the rear one should be 12cm TurboFan (Sleeve Bearing).
I'm not really convinced that this is the best case that I could've pick (I think someone it this thread have it), and since I'm not really into all the RGB stuff, I'm open to other recommendations (again, in the same price range, and my main concern is mostly thermal design, look & feel comes next).


----------



## Bm514

Prices Seems a bit high even in usd


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> PI 32m says lower latency vs speed wins around the 3200-3400 range. higher and looser scores get worse....
> 
> CB does not really scale beyond tight 3333-3400 ( 14-14-14 )
> 
> worth a few points ( literally ) at 14-14-14 if you overvolt the crap out of your ram @ 3600 but no where realistic for 24/7.
> 
> looser scores go down, I could go on but its pretty much already been proven.....
> 
> Also if we get really technical and look at timing tables c16 3600 gets thrashed pretty hard by c14 3200 but even then still not optimal, 3200 c12 would be more beneficial.
> 
> 16-16-16 3600 = my definition of crap.
> 
> maybe if we could pull that down to 15-14-14 I might roll with it....


That's why I'm interested in the new G.Skill DDR4-4800 ... if they ever find enough chips to put in that bin to put it up for sale.

I suspect 13-13-13 3600 would be perfectly do-able.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrryzen*
> 
> Snip.


I think you're overpaying for both the Taichi and the 1950X.

1950X can be had for as low as €915 in Italy, and €956 in Germany.

https://www.idealo.de/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/5670059_-ryzen-threadripper-1950x-box-wof-sockel-tr4-14nm-yd195xa8aewof-amd.html - See bottom left for panel with international prices.

Taichi can be had for around €350 in Germany at the moment. For some reason the search isn't showing Italian results at the moment, but they were recently available for €325.

https://www.idealo.de/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/5561438_-x399-taichi-asrock.html

Poland is almost always cheaper or as cheap as Western Europe for PC parts. I'd suggest you either look a bit harder, or buy from abroad if you really can't find cheaper. That 1950X is way over the odds.


----------



## Nizzen

Can someone please post all the subtimings for g.skill 3200 c14 or 3600 c15 kit?

Using 4266 x4 g.skill, and only changed the first timings cl14-14-14-14-34 and trfc to 535









Gamemode VS creator mode VS creator mode mem access local:


----------



## mrryzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> I think you're overpaying for both the Taichi and the 1950X.
> 
> 1950X can be had for as low as €915 in Italy, and €956 in Germany.


I'm aware that it's cheaper on German Amazon, even when you add the VAT difference between Germany (19%) & Poland (23%) as you still have to pay it (at least on Amazon, never bought anything from abroad). Even with the express shipping, it's ~ 50 EUR cheaper, so I was considering buying it there.

As for the Taichi (at least on Amazon), the only shop that ships it to Poland has a pricetag of 500+ euro which is insane.

Polish prices might be still high as both TR & it's boards are new products, and our retailers like to rip us off on every new product that comes from abroad. Besides, I've never heard anyone in Poland saying that we have the lowest prices of electronics, but I guess it's from your perspective (as our currency is generally not a very "strong" one).

Edit: I must say that Italian prices are looking very nice, and I'm actually kind of puzzled why this is the case.


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> Can someone please post all the subtimings for g.skill 3200 c14 or 3600 c15 kit?
> 
> Using 4266 x4 g.skill, and only changed the first timings cl14-14-14-14-34 and trfc to 535
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gamemode VS creator mode VS creator mode mem access local:


http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13651008

22.place @ Hall of fame 3dmark Physics score with only 4ghz


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Anyone have problems with warm boots? My 1950x and Taichi will not reboot . It needs to be powered off for several minutes before coming back up. BIOS updated and all stock settings. It goes to black screens under about any kind of load. It does like a double post each start now. Fans spin for a second then all lights go out then starts up again. I just ran Memtest over night single threaded. It locked previously in SMP. I've already RMAd the board. I'm afraid its the $1k CPU.
> 
> Edit: Seems to be the EVGA 850 P2 PSU. Swapped it unto another PC and it shut off as well and BIOS said there was a purge before starting.


Reseat your CPU, and dont screw 1 > 2 > 3. do quarter turn 1 > quarter turn 2 > quarter turn 3 > repeat. I had C0 on warm reboot (wouldnt post) and whe ni reseated, problem went away permanently


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13651008
> 
> 22.place @ Hall of fame 3dmark Physics score with only 4ghz


Looks like I grabbed #15. Don't understand how you get 3600MHz ram even operating. for me, anything higher than 3066 is no-post with beeps. SoC voltage doesn't matter, ram voltage doesn't matter.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Reseat your CPU, and dont screw 1 > 2 > 3. do quarter turn 1 > quarter turn 2 > quarter turn 3 > repeat. I had C0 on warm reboot (wouldnt post) and whe ni reseated, problem went away permanently


Had the same warm boot problem with two board so it's been done already. I basically did it that way.. Got 1 attached then tightened the others some before going all the way by AMDs recommendation. PSU has to go back 1st though. I later remembered I was using it on another computer and it randomly shut off as well. Now that I've found out it was the PSU I'm not going to put it into a $2k+ computer.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> @tarot no offense, but you need to stop the following two things:
> 
> - mixing apples and oranges.


I think this one was for me and not Tarot? I'm a bit confused, I never said many of these things but anyway:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> i) comparing different drives with one another and reaching conclusions.


I've only compared 960 EVO's. The other ones are not relevant to me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> ii) confusing/mixing your HDD's temps (which are _your_ fault, mine gets to 27C and that's under load.. where do you have it mounted? Why?) with a motherboard's "potential" to drive said HDD; most especially when said HDD (your NVMe) is notorious for reaching high temps and subsequently throttling. What have you done to ameliorate that, prior to shifting the blame to something else? In this case, the mobo?


I never posted my m.2. drive temps so not sure what you are talking about, but I've seen +48c max during load/tests. Should be well below throttle temps. I have mine mounted between the GPU's. Not a great position but I don't have any other options with this mobo.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> I have used the very same (physically, the actual, same unit) NVMe on 3 chipsets as of now. In all 3, it reaches advertized speeds as a slave, about a K less as a boot. Now maybe, some very specific, ultra-good mobo would lower the gap to say .800 or .700; maybe. The fact however remains.
> 
> Anyway, can only say the same thing so many times, so.. feel free to RMA your mobo. And as stated, no offense meant.


I've had lots of issues with my mobo. Not just the m.2. speed. I'm on a custom loop so it's not like I'm dying to disassemble it for the smallest of reasons and send the mobo off and get it replaced, quite the contrary.

No offense taken.


----------



## robtorbay

Alright stupid question.... so I have managed to get my 1900x to clock stable at 4.1 no issues. But god dam this ram if I cant get it to post over 3200mhz.

Here is a score for firestrike ultra with the details of the most recent stable test: https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/22213241?

Mobo is a Gigabyte x399 and the ram is Corsair Domanator 3000mhz kit 16gb (4*4)

I have tried to manually clock as well as enable the xmp and edit the profile and still nothing over 3200mhz.

Also, maybe I am an idiot and missing the box you tick, but is anyone else using a gigabyte x399 mobo and unable to change the bus speeds (i.e. the bus is set to 100mhz and cant be edited)?

glad to see so many peeps chatting about the x399 platform.... loving it I have to say!


----------



## Machiyariko

I have some Corsair dominators as well at they look to be pretty tightly binned.
My 3600 rated sticks will only go to 3733. So maybe your chips are maxed out as it is.

I have a 1900x as well and I'm wondering what type of cooking solution you are using and what temps are you getting?
Ambient, idle and properly loaded temps would be appreciated.

Feel free to ask more questions and I'll be glad to lend a hand.
I have my 1900x at 4.2 with 3600 memory and it wasn't too hard so hopefully we can get you there too.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I think this one was for me and not Tarot? I'm a bit confused, I never said many of these things but anyway:
> I've only compared 960 EVO's. The other ones are not relevant to me.
> I never posted my m.2. drive temps so not sure what you are talking about, but I've seen +48c max during load/tests. Should be well below throttle temps. I have mine mounted between the GPU's. Not a great position but I don't have any other options with this mobo.
> I've had lots of issues with my mobo. Not just the m.2. speed. I'm on a custom loop so it's not like I'm dying to disassemble it for the smallest of reasons and send the mobo off and get it replaced, quite the contrary.
> 
> No offense taken.


(i get it with the apples oranges thing...you are referring to me saying how my 850 evo performed a bit better than when it ws an OS drive, what i mean twas THAT drive i was not in any way referring to the 960 evo. So if that confused you sorry about that, but i am not redoing it so i can test the 960 evo as a data drive







)
yeah ok lets start again
who here is running a nvme drive as an OS drive?
what scores are you getting ?
who here is running the drive as a non os drive and just a data drive(not a slave as that hasn't existed in 10 years)? and what scores are you getting
what drive temps are you getting for what position on the motherboard.

how's that?

as for the questions regarding temps i read them off hwinfo as shown in the screen shot i do not know if they are correct or which of the 2 listed is the one i should be worried about but yes i do believe they are too hot and do throttle but by how much i am not sure.

as for where is the card it is directly under the video card.
why
because the video card is in slot 2 due to some limitations for slot 1
the nvme is there because...thats where the slot is or i can got back a bit and shove it directly under the blower fan for the video card...which would be worse, there are no very good positions for that drive.

oh and no offense taken i have rhino skin







and always open to suggestions








as for your response you may need to clarify it a little


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Anyone have problems with warm boots? My 1950x and Taichi will not reboot . It needs to be powered off for several minutes before coming back up. BIOS updated and all stock settings. It goes to black screens under about any kind of load. It does like a double post each start now. Fans spin for a second then all lights go out then starts up again. I just ran Memtest over night single threaded. It locked previously in SMP. I've already RMAd the board. I'm afraid its the $1k CPU.
> 
> Edit: Seems to be the EVGA 850 P2 PSU. Swapped it unto another PC and it shut off as well and BIOS said there was a purge before starting.


it will be your ram dollars to donuts.
throw the ram back to 2133 stock(unless you have in which case remove all bar one tick) and see if it does it.

throw in a taiphoon burner report on the ram here so we can see what you have.

memory has gotten a lot better but it is still for the most part a fiddle








the only way i have found to run without any issues is the gskill 3200 flarex it was spotless on the 1800x and so far 4 stick on the 1950x (overclocking is another issue i will work on later







)[


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



quote name="Nizzen" url="/t/1636550/amd-ryzen-threadripper-owners-club-1950x-1920x-1900x/1050_50#post_26344614"]
http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13651008



22.place @ Hall of fame 3dmark Physics score with only 4ghz







[/quote]

so that was you....still have no idea how you got such a high physics score... mine tapped out around 28153 from memory.

what speed was your ram? were you running gamers mode? did you sacrifice a goat...


----------



## robtorbay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> I have some Corsair dominators as well at they look to be pretty tightly binned.
> My 3600 rated sticks will only go to 3733. So maybe your chips are maxed out as it is.
> 
> I have a 1900x as well and I'm wondering what type of cooking solution you are using and what temps are you getting?
> Ambient, idle and properly loaded temps would be appreciated.
> 
> Feel free to ask more questions and I'll be glad to lend a hand.
> I have my 1900x at 4.2 with 3600 memory and it wasn't too hard so hopefully we can get you there too.


Thanks for the replay! Good to know on the ram, when I order the kit in I was stoked to see them hit 3200 but I was hoping I would get closer to 3400







There was a pretty good sale on the kit when I got it so I figured I would take the gamble and see how they fared.

Currently rocking a Thermaltake Water 3.0 Riing 240 solution for keeping it chill. Temps seem decent to me so far. Idle kicks it at 34 ish and under load in games its solid at 60/61.

Based on the reviews I see these chips are settling around the 4.0 mark so I was stoked to see that I was able to get 4.1 easy peasy.

I have played with the chip and moved around the 4.2 mark with voltages up to 1.37 but I cant get it to stabilize. Given the temps and performance at 4.1 is steller I am cool with what it achieved! I was really hoping that I could do a BLK OC but this mobo seems to have that locked up tight


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> it will be your ram dollars to donuts.
> throw the ram back to 2133 stock(unless you have in which case remove all bar one tick) and see if it does it.
> 
> throw in a taiphoon burner report on the ram here so we can see what you have.
> 
> memory has gotten a lot better but it is still for the most part a fiddle
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the only way i have found to run without any issues is the gskill 3200 flarex it was spotless on the 1800x and so far 4 stick on the 1950x (overclocking is another issue i will work on later
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )[
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> quote name="Nizzen" url="/t/1636550/amd-ryzen-threadripper-owners-club-1950x-1920x-1900x/1050_50#post_26344614"]
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13651008
> 
> 
> 
> 22.place @ Hall of fame 3dmark Physics score with only 4ghz


See the edit. It's the PSU.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13651008
> 
> 22.place @ Hall of fame 3dmark Physics score with only 4ghz


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> See the edit. It's the PSU.


sorry so many posts so much stuff


----------



## Machiyariko

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> (i get it with the apples oranges thing...you are referring to me saying how my 850 evo performed a bit better than when it ws an OS drive, what i mean twas THAT drive i was not in any way referring to the 960 evo. So if that confused you sorry about that, but i am not redoing it so i can test the 960 evo as a data drive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> yeah ok lets start again
> who here is running a nvme drive as an OS drive?
> what scores are you getting ?
> who here is running the drive as a non os drive and just a data drive(not a slave as that hasn't existed in 10 years)? and what scores are you getting
> what drive temps are you getting for what position on the motherboard.
> 
> how's that?


OS Drive Results with Temps:


Secondary Drive:


My M.2 drive is mounted next to the memory and has a heatsink and a front case fan blowing on it gently.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Machiyariko*
> 
> OS Drive Results with Temps:
> 
> 
> Secondary Drive:
> 
> 
> My M.2 drive is mounted next to the memory and has a heat sink and a front case fan blowing on it gently.






cool thanks that's what we need to see.

now i went a little further and used a bunch of tests (atto seems to match up with yours) but crystal disk mark is a tad different)
and my temps seem similar to yours if you ignore the massive 100 degree one(which i still do not know what that is reading.
and to me the lack of variation means i do not *think* it is throttling although it is warm.Then again looking at the results...maybe it is a bit but not a lot.

mine is where i said and has zero air going over apart from the hot air from the video card.


----------



## MarkPost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> cool thanks that's what we need to see.
> 
> now i went a little further and used a bunch of tests (atto seems to match up with yours) but crystal disk mark is a tad different)
> and my temps seem similar to yours if you ignore the massive 100 degree one(which i still do not know what that is reading.
> and to me the lack of variation means i do not *think* it is throttling although it is warm.Then again looking at the results...maybe it is a bit but not a lot.
> 
> mine is where i said and has zero air going over apart from the hot air from the video card.


Temps are high. I Installed an EK M.2 heatsink https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-m-2-nvme-heatsink-black and works really well:

-Max drive temperatura: 66 -> 53
-Max drive temperature 2: 101 -> 73

BEFORE:


AFTER:


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MarkPost*
> 
> Temps are high. I Installed an EK M.2 heatsink https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-m-2-nvme-heatsink-black and works really well:
> 
> -Max drive temperatura: 66 -> 53
> -Max drive temperature 2: 101 -> 73
> 
> BEFORE:
> 
> 
> AFTER:






thanks i,ll add that to my shopping list








interesting results on the ryzen though the read speeds are a lot higher but write speeds are lower.

and the read speeds look more consistent with the hotter drive (although that could be anything i guess in the background)


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/13651008
> 
> 22.place @ Hall of fame 3dmark Physics score with only 4ghz


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> Can someone please post all the subtimings for g.skill 3200 c14 or 3600 c15 kit?
> 
> Using 4266 x4 g.skill, and only changed the first timings cl14-14-14-14-34 and trfc to 535
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gamemode VS creator mode VS creator mode mem access local:


Insanity. Can you run a GPGPU Test in Tools? Your CPU Cache Memory is insanity... almost 100GB/s memory with nearly 2TB/s L1 is insanity. 2x as powerful as my Dual Xeon X5650 system with 24 threads and Hexa-Channel DDR3-1333 @ 3,066Mhz per core on 24 threads. Just 1,088GB/s (1.088TB/s L1 Copy). I'm up to like 45GB/s memory.

Got a VEGA 64? That system needs something epic like even a Vega 56 flashed to Vega 64. Cool Dude.









My system at the moment is dual x5650's 24 threads 3.066ghz boost all 24 threads, 48gb ram hexa-channel & liteon 128gb ssd $30 with a marvell 88se9230 hyperduo with a 1tb sata III. Dual AMD Radeon RX 480's Visiontek reference blowers with RX 580 Bios & both 8GB models. It's no where near a Ryzen 1700 & Vega though or 1950x & Vega.


----------



## MarkPost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> thanks i,ll add that to my shopping list
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> interesting results on the ryzen though the read speeds are a lot higher but write speeds are lower.
> 
> and the read speeds look more consistent with the hotter drive (although that could be anything i guess in the background)


You are welcome! yeah may be due to some background stuff or something like that









btw there is a nickel color version too, a little more expensive though https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-m-2-nvme-heatsink-nickel


----------



## InsideJob

Hey everyone,
I'm not a threadripper owner myself but my cousin is, and he makes youtube videos. He seems to have scored the jackpot with the silicon lottery with his chip with over 4ghz stable. I'll share his video on it here.


----------



## chew*

Love to see prime 95 blend 90% ram allocated before i agree to stable.

Im stable at 5.0 i can make a video showing no stability tests and claim it.

Get the idea?


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Love to see prime 95 blend 90% ram allocated before i agree to stable.
> 
> Im stable at 5.0 i can make a video showing no stability tests and claim it.
> 
> Get the idea?


Prime95 AVX and Blender for me at this point


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Prime95 AVX and Blender for me at this point


We go back aways particle. I know you test stability legit


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Love to see prime 95 blend 90% ram allocated before i agree to stable.
> 
> Im stable at 5.0 i can make a video showing no stability tests and claim it.
> 
> Get the idea?


I'd just run IntelBurnTest .. as much Ram as you ask & 128 threads & 10-20 runs... I would say is 100% stable.


----------



## chew*

Everyone has there preference.

Prime blend the way i do it hammers imc. Drops threads if unstable mem/imc. Crashes if unstable core. You can also go full custom and target weaknesses once you learn them...like 896k is brutal to imc...12k is brutal to cores/vrm..

Ibt does not tbh plus its a pulse stress not a constant stress and IBT = Intel....

Even so i toss heaven in the mix to stress pci lanes gpu and sound while running prime with 90% ram.

This way i can nail down artifacts and sound crackling all at the same time....which i have seen in the past even though " prime " stable.

Anyway...point of post above was i can run about anything i toss at it at over 4.1....but i am not claiming stable because quite frankly it is not.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Everyone has there preference.
> 
> Prime blend the way i do it hammers imc. Drops threads if unstable mem/imc. Crashes if unstable core. You can also go full custom and target weaknesses once you learn them...like 896k is brutal to imc...12k is brutal to cores/vrm..
> 
> Ibt does not tbh plus its a pulse stress not a constant stress and IBT = Intel....
> 
> Even so i toss heaven in the mix to stress pci lanes gpu and sound while running prime with 90% ram.
> 
> This way i can nail down artifacts and sound crackling all at the same time....which i have seen in the past even though " prime " stable.
> 
> Anyway...point of post above was i can run about anything i toss at it at over 4.1....but i am not claiming stable because quite frankly it is not.


I usually don't saturate PCIE lanes at the same time I do P95 runs. That's a good idea, I'll have to try that when im to that point.

Something I like to do is cut power to the fans on the rad(s) while running prime. Letting the chip get toasty shows anomalies that can get overlooked when benching.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InsideJob*
> 
> Hey everyone,
> I'm not a threadripper owner myself but my cousin is, and he makes youtube videos. He seems to have scored the jackpot with the silicon lottery with his chip with over 4ghz stable. I'll share his video on it here.


I warched a vid of his last week. ismt he running 1.5vcore w llc on extreme under load or something insanely high like that?

pretty sure i could get 4.1 stable w 1.5vcore too, prolly last a year or less tho lol

i like his vids tho


----------



## chew*

My TR rig has been hijacked via teamviewer by a buddy for some realworld use by someone who can actually use it.

About to find out how stable my tuning really is











Sitting @ a very mild 3.8 oc with 1.2v tuned with 64gb 4x16 dr @ 3200 c14.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> My TR rig has been hijacked via teamviewer by a buddy for some realworld use by someone who can actually use it.
> 
> About to find out how stable my tuning really is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sitting @ a very mild 3.8 oc with 1.2v tuned with 64gb 4x16 dr @ 3200 c14.


Very similar to mine: [email protected] and 32GB 4x8GB sr @ 3200 c14. I'll be tuning it further once my orders come in. I've got all the fans, it is the rest I'm waiting on (and still waiting to hear on my pre-ordered XSPC block).


----------



## Aenra

Since the poster above mentioned it;

Can you really run Intel Burn Test with a TR/R7? Never even crossed my mind it's possible. I know the arguments against relying on IBT, forget those, just.. weird if it's so tbh 

(would have expected it to refuse even installing, at best to crash instantly)


----------



## InsideJob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I warched a vid of his last week. ismt he running 1.5vcore w llc on extreme under load or something insanely high like that?
> 
> pretty sure i could get 4.1 stable w 1.5vcore too, prolly last a year or less tho lol
> 
> i like his vids tho


He runs it at 1.4v with LLC at medium from what I saw last. Just trying to help him get a bit more exposure


----------



## chew*

It installs and runs yes.


----------



## tps3443

Im looking at returning to AMD, after 10 years of running only intel processors.

im pretty much dead set on getting a 1950X, and a X399 motherboard. Setting it to 4Ghz, running (4) graphics cards in SLI, or quad fire.

Now that 64 PCI E lanes are available, and 16 cores.. ive always wanted to run 4 cards. Its overkill, doesnt scale properly, has issues and sometimes does not work. Jayz2cents tried (3) way gtx 1080's, it didnt work at all. But everyone on youtube is loving (4) way sli gtx 1080's with great scaling.

Anyone experience 3 or 4 cards on the new threadripper platform? With a, 1900X/1920X/or 1950X?

Id run (4) vega 56's. Or (2) Pro Duo 2017 models.


----------



## chew*

Well first you may want to look into vega support as atm multicard is not supported.

Can not comment on pro duo. Do not have them nor even know if you can still buy them.

I do have 2 fury x however. Seem to work great...right now they are being used for real world compute by a buddy so i will relay his opions when he is done.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

G.skill Trident Z RGB @ 2400MHz CL15

PSA I've noticed in the BIOS under memory controller (for Gigabyte x399) there are several options for the ram interleaving DIE/Channel - I come form an intel background and these are some exotic settings for me. DIE I max out around 34GBps, Channel I hit around 71GBps. Google is worthless on this as I have searched all over. But does anyone have a moderately detailed explanation as to the difference? My assumption with channel is that it combines the entire bank into a single massive 256bit wide array. With DIE it splits the bank into two 128bit arrays.. This is a guess but theres no detail I can find.


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

I thought nVidia stopped supporting anything more than 2 way Sli with the 1080. They originally gave people an unlock key (or something) to allow it to go 4 way but stopped providing those. Honestly I've been running SLi and crossfire for years and it would be a complete waste of money today. 1080Ti all the way or Vega depending on your budget. AMD & nVidia want to get away from multi GPU altogether and theres many videos discussing this on YouTube - its gotten to be too much of a headache for both companies and scaling depends on the game developer and effort put into supporting this.

Keep an eye on AdoredTV and RedGamingTech on YouTube. Also there is not 64 lanes - 4 are used for the south bridge (or whatever) so technically its 60, and most if not all x399 boards have two x16 PCIe, and the rest are x8. The rest of the PCIe lanes are used for other devices such as the m.2, & network interfaces depending on board. My Gigabyte and the Asus have three m.2 slots @ x4 lanes each.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Im looking at returning to AMD, after 10 years of running only intel processors.
> 
> im pretty much dead set on getting a 1950X, and a X399 motherboard. Setting it to 4Ghz, running (4) graphics cards in SLI, or quad fire.
> 
> Now that 64 PCI E lanes are available, and 16 cores.. ive always wanted to run 4 cards. Its overkill, doesnt scale properly, has issues and sometimes does not work. Jayz2cents tried (3) way gtx 1080's, it didnt work at all. But everyone on youtube is loving (4) way sli gtx 1080's with great scaling.
> 
> Anyone experience 3 or 4 cards on the new threadripper platform? With a, 1900X/1920X/or 1950X?
> 
> Id run (4) vega 56's. Or (2) Pro Duo 2017 models.


You'd need to go for 4 furies until AMD adds multi GPU to Vega.

I might gave 4 way 1080 SLI data this weekend, it depends on when I get my build completed. It's not officially supported beyond two way.. I've got tasks that can use the extra horsepower over the officially supported 2 way SLI. I do think that 2 way multi GPU still has merit for 4k and above resolutions. For VR high profile games on the unreal engine will most likely have it, but none of the other titles do yet.

I highly recommend you pull the trigger on the 1950x. Sweet platform that steps all over my x79


----------



## joeybuddy96

My rig: Threadripper 1950x, Gaming 7 x399, G.SKILL TridentZ 128GB (8 x 16GB) DDR4 3600 F4-3600C17Q-64GTZKK, Noctua U14S, Win10 Home x64, 960 Pro NVMe, 780 Ti Classified lol.
I don't know what system monitoring software to use. CPU-Z is not the best software in the world. I assume most people already have a favorite, but here's a list of alternate picks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System_monitor I tried using Gigabyte's EasyTune, but it ended up locking my PC up in Windows; I don't recommend setting it to apply a configuration on Windows launch. The reason I'm interested in system monitoring is that my RAM isn't in the compatible unit list for the Gaming 7 yet. It's designed for Intel systems to begin with. I'll probably eventually get around to emailing Gigabyte about it--I chose them over their competitors for their responsiveness to this kind of thing. I really don't want to revisit the dark days of ASUS and ASRock customer support. MSI can be bad too. It's just my anecdotal personal experience though, ymmv. I wouldn't normally care whether or not it is listed as compatible, as long as it works, but it doesn't work at 3600 yet. I've gotten it up to 2666 MHz, I think. See, I don't know for sure unless I have something to verify it with. I'm encountering really long boot times. It's about 30 seconds from the time I hit the power button to the time I land on my desktop. I'm rather underwhelmed with my TR experience thus far. Hopefully once I get the RAM up to spec things will start looking better.


----------



## DVLux

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> PSA I've noticed in the BIOS under memory controller (for Gigabyte x399) there are several options for the ram interleaving DIE/Channel - I come form an intel background and these are some exotic settings for me. DIE I max out around 34GBps, Channel I hit around 71GBps. Google is worthless on this as I have searched all over. But does anyone have a moderately detailed explanation as to the difference? My assumption with channel is that it combines the entire bank into a single massive 256bit wide array. With DIE it splits the bank into two 128bit arrays.. This is a guess but theres no detail I can find.


I am pretty sure that alters the NUMA/UMA mode.

At least, from what I gather from past posts in this thread... Could just read the manual, too.


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Im looking at returning to AMD, after 10 years of running only intel processors.
> 
> im pretty much dead set on getting a 1950X, and a X399 motherboard. Setting it to 4Ghz, running (4) graphics cards in SLI, or quad fire.
> 
> Now that 64 PCI E lanes are available, and 16 cores.. ive always wanted to run 4 cards. Its overkill, doesnt scale properly, has issues and sometimes does not work. Jayz2cents tried (3) way gtx 1080's, it didnt work at all. But everyone on youtube is loving (4) way sli gtx 1080's with great scaling.
> 
> Anyone experience 3 or 4 cards on the new threadripper platform? With a, 1900X/1920X/or 1950X?
> 
> Id run (4) vega 56's. Or (2) Pro Duo 2017 models.


Crossfire on the latest 17.9.1 drivers without the suite, just the inf in the device manager. I have excellent performance. Just need a single VEGA FE though, gotta have the 16GB HBM.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> You'd need to go for 4 furies until AMD adds multi GPU to Vega.
> 
> I might gave 4 way 1080 SLI data this weekend, it depends on when I get my build completed. It's not officially supported beyond two way.. I've got tasks that can use the extra horsepower over the officially supported 2 way SLI. I do think that 2 way multi GPU still has merit for 4k and above resolutions. For VR high profile games on the unreal engine will most likely have it, but none of the other titles do yet.
> 
> I highly recommend you pull the trigger on the 1950x. Sweet platform that steps all over my x79


I wanna go full on AMD, if I do.

1950X, X399 Zenith

(1) to (4) Vega 56 or vega 64 cards.

The new Radeon Pro Duo for 2017 looks interesting too. It is (2) RX580's sandwhiched with 32GB OF DDR5. For only $999 its not a bad deal. The right software, and this card is a beast. Cant wait to see reviews. And some 4K data.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris89*
> 
> Crossfire on the latest 17.9.1 drivers without the suite, just the inf in the device manager. I have excellent performance. Just need a single VEGA FE though, gotta have the 16GB HBM.


Check out the Radeon Pro duo 2017 only $999.


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> I wanna go full on AMD, if I do.
> 
> 1950X, X399 Zenith
> 
> (1) to (4) Vega 56 or vega 64 cards.
> 
> The new Radeon Pro Duo for 2017 looks interesting too. It is (2) RX580's sandwhiched with 32GB OF DDR5. For only $999 its not a bad deal. The right software, and this card is a beast. Cant wait to see reviews. And some 4K data.


Sweet dude, cool your mention that card







hahaha no one has said anything about it.

Yeah I think VEGA FE is better bet. The 32GB Pro Duo has 224GB/s so 448GB/s... maybe clock to 240GB/s 480GB/s. Single VEGA is 483GB/s.

Yeah I want a VEGA 56 & flash it to 64. If only were 249.99


----------



## tps3443

A good deal on a used i7 6950X @4.4Ghz, and the (12) core 7920X new for$1199 still leave me making a tough decision.

Ive been a Intel sheep for so long... its as if im brainwashed ?..

I want to make the right choice. There all great chips. And power houses.

Since I do game, the 6950X shows better ipc than even the 7900X in fps.. But threadripper, does its duty in the heavy lifting department.

Theres something about buying the 1950X, its powerful. Its a middle finger cpu, for the whole industry. I feel like ive gotta support amd..


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Check out the Radeon Pro duo 2017 only $999.


Nice I think this guy has one ... hasn't said anything about it though... I think it was in a thread .. maybe this one or the Vega thread...

Maybe we can convince @Kyozon http://www.overclock.net/u/531084/kyozon : To show off his Polaris Pro Duo?!?


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> A good deal on a used i7 6950X @4.4Ghz, and the (12) core 7920X new for$1199 still leave me making a tough decision.
> 
> Ive been a Intel sheep for so long... its as if im brainwashed ?..
> 
> I want to make the right choice. There all great chips. And power houses.
> 
> Since I do game, the 6950X shows better ipc than even the 7900X in fps.. But threadripper, does its duty in the heavy lifting department.
> 
> Theres something about buying the 1950X, its powerful. Its a middle finger cpu, for the whole industry. I feel like ive gotta support amd..


Me too... I think I can only afford Ryzen 1700 @ 4Ghz maybe 4.5Ghz... Still better than my Dual 3.06ghz Xeon X5650 24-thread Rig with 48GB Ram & Crossfire 8GB RX480s


----------



## Bm514

keep in mind my 7820x blows away my 1950x in poorly optimized games by about 10 to 50 fps (PUBG) ... but in optimized games no difference at all ... now if your workload involves multithreaded friendly apps you should go for the 1950x or if you want to make it in 3Dmark Hall of fame ... with 4 1080tis the 1950x has a very impressive physics score


----------



## chris89

What about 5K ? VEGA FE .. probably 4-5-8-16k gaming .. the AMD chip would shine.

Sweet system dude! lucky


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris89*
> 
> Me too... I think I can only afford Ryzen 1700 @ 4Ghz maybe 4.5Ghz... Still better than my Dual 3.06ghz Xeon X5650 24-thread Rig with 48GB Ram & Crossfire 8GB RX480s


Oh im having to sell some things to build this rig. Heck, at this point i may even get a 1900X.

I wish the Ryzen 7, 1700's and 1800's were LGA like 1900X. And then id buy one asap. I love to carry around my shinny new cpus in my pocket, so pins are out for me lol.

Im always wayy over budget building a system, and i over think it.. And when it comes down to ordering, i cant pull the trigger on certain components. For example, i really want to get a 1950X, i sold my Xeon 1680 V2 and x79 board to get it. But, ill probably order a 1900X, or if im lucky a 1920X. Still a great cpu! Wish I could sell a kidney.

Is anyone not satisfied with threadripper?

Im so eager to see multi gpu. Performance on the NEW X399 platform. AMD, and LGA. Who would have thought?

Think lga was a big part of the popularity and sales numbers?


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris89*
> 
> What about 5K ? VEGA FE .. probably 4-5-8-16k gaming .. the AMD chip would shine.
> 
> Sweet system dude! lucky


5K very playable with a single Vega 64, or even a water cooled overclocked vega 56.

I know theres a guy on youtube with a 1800X @ 4GHZ, and (4) GTX 1080s, he gets like 90-135fps in BF1 at 5K ultra everything, and it is scaled to 8K.

This shows multi gpu power, i was amazed.


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> You the man gups.
> 
> Amazon pulled same billing addy crap. Woke up to email this morning.
> 
> Ordered a pair from swiftech instead.
> 
> Saved $100. Temps may suffer a tad but i"m sure it will beat stock.
> 
> Thanks.


NP







.

Nice bench results







.

Well got the WC done on TR, lacked a 90° fitting to do shorter hose between front rad and pump/res. Plan on next drain/refill to sort.




Airflow was restricted by stock door/setup on DB9, made mesh panel







. As WC setup been all new experience just got pump/fan profile correct yesterday to have quiet setup with max ~60°C tDIE on stock 1950X with Y-Cruncher, ~23°C room temp. Got RAM to 3466MHz The Stilt preset.

Getting together baseline benches then do some core OC.

EK ZMT was sweet IMO. Barrow fittings good, got from uk ebayer Mizu Cooling for decent price without waiting for post time from far east.

Using just distilled with Mayhems XT1 clear (~20% mix), which is based on Ethylene Glycol. Concentrate was going dirt cheap on their webshop as EOL item.

The MagiCool G2 Slim 360mm rads been good in my limited experience of WC. Especially on price/performance.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Since the poster above mentioned it;
> 
> Can you really run Intel Burn Test with a TR/R7? Never even crossed my mind it's possible. I know the arguments against relying on IBT, forget those, just.. weird if it's so tbh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (would have expected it to refuse even installing, at best to crash instantly)


Not tried on TR yet. Ryzen I used a lot, so do others. Use custom with ~90% RAM on rig, then it is appropriate stress test IMO. Using preset like high/lower is pointless.

In the AMD Vishera owners thread OP is IBT AVX. It's basically LinPack, in about it is mentioned for AMD as well.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Well first you may want to look into vega support as atm multicard is not supported.
> 
> Can not comment on pro duo. Do not have them nor even know if you can still buy them.
> 
> I do have 2 fury x however. Seem to work great...right now they are being used for real world compute by a buddy so i will relay his opions when he is done.


Im talking about the NEW 2017 Pro duo, not last years model, though the 2016 version is faster it is limited to only 4GB of memory.

I know that when developers design as game there given a option for nvidia or AMD to optimize multi GPU support, or the developer can do it. AMD and Nvidia have simply revoked the ability and burden of having to optimize more than 2 or 3 cards for nvidia, and amd.

This doesnt mean its NOT supported. It just means,hey.. were not going to optimize more than 2 cards for your game (Nvidia) and 3 cards for (AMD).

Everyone seems to think that 3 and 4 gpu's has been dropped all together. I thought the same thing. It was never recommended to begin with, and sometimes never scaled properly, or even worked.

But quad SLI does live on and, so does quad crossfire. Wheather it scales or not is amother story. But when it does its amazing.

AMD will officially support (3) or less cards after that your on your own. And 4 card support, well its, you get what you get. Its up to either microsoft, or the game developer for optimization.

Nvidia will officially support (2) or less cards. And after that you require a key, it will work but you get what you get.


----------



## gupsterg

Currently in driver for VEGA you can't enable CF. Things like [email protected] that don't need CF enabled in driver for multi GPU would work for VEGA AFAIK.


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Oh im having to sell some things to build this rig. Heck, at this point i may even get a 1900X.
> 
> I wish the Ryzen 7, 1700's and 1800's were LGA like 1900X. And then id buy one asap. I love to carry around my shiny new cpus in my pocket, so pins are out for me lol.
> 
> I'm always way over budget building a system, and I over think it. And when it comes down to ordering, I cant pull the trigger on certain components. For example, I really want to get a 1950X, I sold my Xeon 1680 V2 and x79 board to get it. But, ill probably order a 1900X, or if I'm lucky a 1920X. Still a great CPU! Wish I could sell a kidney.
> 
> Is anyone not satisfied with threadripper?
> 
> I'm so eager to see multi GPU. Performance on the NEW X399 platform. AMD, and LGA. Who would have thought?
> 
> Think lga was a big part of the popularity and sales numbers?


1900x is the smartest move right now until zen2


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> NP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Nice bench results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Well got the WC done on TR, lacked a 90° fitting to do shorter hose between front rad and pump/res. Plan on next drain/refill to sort.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Airflow was restricted by stock door/setup on DB9, made mesh panel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . As WC setup been all new experience just got pump/fan profile correct yesterday to have quiet setup with max ~60°C tDIE on stock 1950X with Y-Cruncher, ~23°C room temp. Got RAM to 3466MHz The Stilt preset.
> 
> Getting together baseline benches then do some core OC.
> 
> EK ZMT was sweet IMO. Barrow fittings good, got from uk ebayer Mizu Cooling for decent price without waiting for post time from far east.
> 
> Using just distilled with Mayhems XT1 clear (~20% mix), which is based on Ethylene Glycol. Concentrate was going dirt cheap on their webshop as EOL item.
> 
> The MagiCool G2 Slim 360mm rads been good in my limited experience of WC. Especially on price/performance.
> Not tried on TR yet. Ryzen I used a lot, so do others. Use custom with ~90% RAM on rig, then it is appropriate stress test IMO. Using preset like high/lower is pointless.
> 
> In the AMD Vishera owners thread OP is IBT AVX. It's basically LinPack, in about it is mentioned for AMD as well.


Wait till you get quad channel performance is night and day


----------



## gupsterg

@Bm514

Sweet rig you have







, nerd porn at it's best







.

Yeah have my eye on another set of F4-3200C14D-16GTZ to use







. Sicness has nabbed 3466MHz on quad channel with The Stilt preset using 2 kits of F4-3200C14D-16GFX, link.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> A good deal on a used i7 6950X @4.4Ghz, and the (12) core 7920X new for$1199 still leave me making a tough decision.
> 
> Ive been a Intel sheep for so long... its as if im brainwashed ?..
> 
> I want to make the right choice. There all great chips. And power houses.
> 
> Since I do game, the 6950X shows better ipc than even the 7900X in fps.. But threadripper, does its duty in the heavy lifting department.
> 
> Theres something about buying the 1950X, its powerful. Its a middle finger cpu, for the whole industry. I feel like ive gotta support amd..


You can count on all the Intel platforms being dead on arrival though.

TR4 is likely to see Zen3.


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> @Bm514
> 
> Sweet rig you have
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , nerd porn at it's best
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah have my eye on another set of F4-3200C14D-16GTZ to use
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Sickness has nabbed 3466MHz on quad channel with The Stilt preset using 2 kits of F4-3200C14D-16GFX, link.


Thx man







(that rig is a W.I.P will go Hexgear and petg soon) I did the same I have 2 kits of f4-3200c14d RGB anything past 3200mhz I consider unstable ... I mean it boots but it will eventually give you BSOD .... at 3200 its fine until they optimize bioses eventually


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DrakkarCA1980*
> 
> 
> 
> G.skill Trident Z RGB @ 2400MHz CL15
> 
> PSA I've noticed in the BIOS under memory controller (for Gigabyte x399) there are several options for the ram interleaving DIE/Channel - I come form an intel background and these are some exotic settings for me. DIE I max out around 34GBps, Channel I hit around 71GBps. Google is worthless on this as I have searched all over. But does anyone have a moderately detailed explanation as to the difference? My assumption with channel is that it combines the entire bank into a single massive 256bit wide array. With DIE it splits the bank into two 128bit arrays.. This is a guess but theres no detail I can find.


Like DVLux, my assumption is that the setting switches between UMA and NUMA memory modes. I'm not sure why firmware makers feel like they have to relabel everything. It just makes everything more confusing for people who understand what is going on. Remember that the way TR is built, it is effectively a two-way or four-way SMP system depending on which aspect you're talking about.

In case you're not familiar with what those two modes really mean for you: NUMA (the NU stands for "non-uniform") is a memory architecture that essentially does what its name implies. Each socket controls, allocates, and uses its own memory array for processes running on it. Operating systems that are NUMA aware will generally start a program on whichever NUMA node is least allocated or by some other means pick one. Once started there, its threads will preferentially (or in some cases exclusively) execute there. The benefit is that you never have to hop between sockets to fetch data from memory unless there is insufficient memory available on the node the program is executing on. Under those conditions the memory from the other socket will be used. Many lightly threaded applications see a performance uplift from this. It does, however, mean that your program is not using the other socket's memory controller concurrently with its own.

It depends on how sensitive the workload is to memory latency as opposed to memory bandwidth, however. UMA is the opposite of the previous approach. All of the memory is combined into a single wide array so that there is maximum spread over all of the channels and available to any given application. Applications benefiting more from bandwidth than latency will like this, but they have to execute on a significant number of cores to see the full benefit with a processor like Ryzen. In either case a single threaded process cannot access all available memory channels concurrently.


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

Just testing Samsung 960 Evo 1TB SSD M.2 - not specifically TR related but may be of interest

Once the temp hits about 65c-ish it throttles and I have not seen it go above 70c, which happens after about a minute of full use, though it doesn't drop speed by much and it cools down pretty quick once use ceases, I was expected some drammatic slow down, but nope.. seems like no big deal here, at least with no GPU, CPU warming the ambient up also. What affects the speed far more is being the boot partition at least in this synthetic tests of ATTO

Read speeds are crippled to the same as write when testing on the boot partition, splitting the SSD into 2 partitions and the secondary performs just fine!

I am using the MSI gaming Carbon mobo which has its silly little Heat shields that I am pretty sure just make them hotter :-D And I am using bottom slot in a 24c room.

Samsung SSD 960 EVO 1TB - Hot ( 64c - 70c ) secondary partition:


Samsung SSD 960 EVO 1TB - Cold secondary partition


Samsung SSD 960 EVO 1TB - Cold boot partition


----------



## DrakkarCA1980

Perfect! If I knew it was UMA/NUMA my Google searches would have been more specific. I found an engineers video on Epyc which is similar to Threadripper with this and my mind was blown. In AMD Ryzen Masterwhere we can switch between Gaming/Crator mode I believe this is exactly what it's primarily doing with the Distributed/Local memory access mode. Biggest issue I see is that were going to be juggling programs that benefit from one or another until software catches up to this hardware and is more consistent.


----------



## Aenra

Just saw Tom's Hardware 1950X review.. and as usually, stopped reading before i was even done with the first page, lol

The idiots label "disabling one die" as "Local" mode.. they mix memory modes with dies and cores and proceed to "test" for our benefit anyway. Amazed as always. Such thorougness, such preparation.

( the irony of course is that people like them get their toys for free and never mind what they do with them, whereas the rest of us need purchase them, lol.. gotta love this 'market' )


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Just saw Tom's Hardware 1950X review.. and as usually, stopped reading before i was even done with the first page, lol
> 
> The idiots label "disabling one die" as "Local" mode.. they mix memory modes with dies and cores and proceed to "test" for our benefit anyway. Amazed as always. Such thorougness, such preparation.
> 
> ( the irony of course is that people like them get their toys for free and never mind what they do with them, whereas the rest of us need purchase them, lol.. gotta love this 'market' )


The American office did this.

Stuff done by their German office is usually very thorough.


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> Thx man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (that rig is a W.I.P will go Hexgear and petg soon) I did the same I have 2 kits of f4-3200c14d RGB anything past 3200mhz I consider unstable ... I mean it boots but it will eventually give you BSOD .... at 3200 its fine until they optimize bioses eventually


For 3466MHz I need ProcODT 60 ohms and CAD Bus 30 30 30 30 or else it is an issue. For some odd reason I couldn't get 3333MHz tighten RAM setup working







. I got 3200MHz or 3466MHz, may revisit 3333MHz again.

Sicness found on his HW it was easy to snag 3466MHz 4x 8GB, he did very little from what I'm aware. So as always our experience could differ even if HW is very similar. The Flare X besides heat spreader use the same PCB/IC as stated by author of Thaiphoon Burner. So my RAM kit and his are pretty much same, then we got same mobo/CPU.

RAM setup of 3466MHz with CPU stock passed 5000%+ in HCI Memtest and then reruns of Y-Cruncher, P95, RB Stress mode, x264 encoding.

Started on some CPU core OC today, currently upto 3.9GHz, just gonna see what I get with 1.3V VCORE as max.

Did RB Stress mode first.



Then some P95 blend.





Will let it run for a few more hours before changing P95 setup. Currently using v28.1, may try v29.2 build 4, IIRC last time I used on Ryzen the latter had lower temps.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> A good deal on a used i7 6950X @4.4Ghz, and the (12) core 7920X new for$1199 still leave me making a tough decision.
> 
> Ive been a Intel sheep for so long... its as if im brainwashed ?..
> 
> I want to make the right choice. There all great chips. And power houses.
> 
> Since I do game, the 6950X shows better ipc than even the 7900X in fps.. But threadripper, does its duty in the heavy lifting department.
> 
> Theres something about buying the 1950X, its powerful. Its a middle finger cpu, for the whole industry. I feel like ive gotta support amd..


That's the reason I went threadripper. Industry change. I felt AMD deserved to be rewarded for an excellent design.

For games, the frame rate difference is negligible, and new titles will take advantage of more cores. It's a more future proof architecture and it truly is faster for multi threaded applications


----------



## tps3443

Its just annoying X99 is already here and gone. I feel like they made X79 last a very long while. I feel bad for the guys who bought a brand new 6950X, and now its cinebench R15 score is trumped by a AMD 1900X (8) core thread ripper. Or even intels very own 7820X 8 core..

Its terrible, I know AMD will optimize there very own cpu overtime. And the mothetboard will last years most likley.


----------



## tps3443

Whats the fastest memory you can run on Zenith X399? The cpu can handle 4000?


----------



## Caldito

Hey, Threadripper owners, I am planning to jump the wagon and has been doing some research for a multi propurse Workstation/Virtualization/Gaming Machine.

I would like to have some feedback regarding my build and if you see any problem with it. My goal is to reach at least a 4 Ghz Overclock so i would be fitting a LiqTech TR4 360 water cooler and a Case that can fit that cooler.

Thanks a lot!

AMD - Threadripper 1950X 3.4GHz 16-Core Processor
Asus - ROG ZENITH EXTREME EATX TR4 Motherboard
G.Skill - Trident Z RGB 64GB (4 x 16GB) DDR4-3600 Memory
Samsung - 960 Pro 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive
Western Digital - Red Pro 8TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive x 2
EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB FTW3 GAMING iCX Video Card (2-Way SLI) x 2
Pioneer - BDR-211UBK Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer
Phanteks - Enthoo Luxe Tempered Glass (Black) ATX Full Tower Case
Enermax - LiqTech TR4 360 102.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler
Corsair - AX1200i 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply
Corsair - HD120 RGB 3-Pack w/Controller 54.4 CFM 120mm Fans
Corsair - HD140 RGB 74.0 CFM 140mm Fan x 3

Kingwin KW525-3U3CR Multi-Function Super Speed USB 3.0 Hub w/ Card Reader Includes 1 USB 3.1 Port + 1 ESATA Port.
NZXT Internal USB Hub Controller, Black (AC-IUSBH-M1)
Asus TPM-M R2.0 14-1 Pin TPM Module

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/caldoso/saved/#view=YNzNNG


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caldito*
> 
> Hey, Threadripper owners, I am planning to jump the wagon and has been doing some research for a multi propurse Workstation/Virtualization/Gaming Machine.
> 
> I would like to have some feedback regarding my build and if you see any problem with it. My goal is to reach at least a 4 Ghz Overclock so i would be fitting a LiqTech TR4 360 water cooler and a Case that can fit that cooler.
> 
> Thanks a lot!
> 
> AMD - Threadripper 1950X 3.4GHz 16-Core Processor
> Asus - ROG ZENITH EXTREME EATX TR4 Motherboard
> G.Skill - Trident Z RGB 64GB (4 x 16GB) DDR4-3600 Memory
> Samsung - 960 Pro 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive
> Western Digital - Red Pro 8TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive x 2
> EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB FTW3 GAMING iCX Video Card (2-Way SLI) x 2
> Pioneer - BDR-211UBK Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer
> Phanteks - Enthoo Luxe Tempered Glass (Black) ATX Full Tower Case
> Enermax - LiqTech TR4 360 102.2 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler
> Corsair - AX1200i 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply
> Corsair - HD120 RGB 3-Pack w/Controller 54.4 CFM 120mm Fans
> Corsair - HD140 RGB 74.0 CFM 140mm Fan x 3
> 
> Kingwin KW525-3U3CR Multi-Function Super Speed USB 3.0 Hub w/ Card Reader Includes 1 USB 3.1 Port + 1 ESATA Port.
> NZXT Internal USB Hub Controller, Black (AC-IUSBH-M1)
> Asus TPM-M R2.0 14-1 Pin TPM Module
> 
> https://pcpartpicker.com/user/caldoso/saved/#view=YNzNNG


A beast lol. Id consider just (2) 1080 non ti's the performance is great, and or (2) vega 56's. After new drivers and optimization i think vega 56 will easily surpass my gtx 1080.


----------



## Fantasy

Is VDDSOC the memory controller?


----------



## Particle

Multiple GPUs are essentially useless at this point for gaming. You'd be best served by a single powerful GPU, and I'd suggest staying away from halo products.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Multiple GPUs are essentially useless at this point for gaming. You'd be best served by a single powerful GPU, and I'd suggest staying away from halo products.


That's dependent on the person and their own budget. I have 2 titan pascals. I don't even have time to game majority of the time. I gotta do work arounds for sli as well at times. However, currently I am playing Hellblade @ 4k maxed out and that wasn't possible without sli to even hit 60 fps locked. To each their own. It works when it does and it's nice to have the cost is irrelevant for me. So I wouldn't rule it out just because it's not the golden days anymore of multi gpu.


----------



## chew*

My multi gpu setup works just fine except for 1 batman game which sucked so bad that steam gave users who bought it every batman game prior to it.

Win 10 may not work so good because its up to the devs for xfire.

Win 7 however is flawless and with over 50 games in my libraries...only one does not benefit from multicard...

Can not vouch for more than 2way or nv...but my amd experience paired with the right settings and monitor has been exceptional...

Key things are vsync, throttling tearing all semi related.

A freesync 144 hz panel is a necessity to counter and quite honestly solve all those issues.

Without vsync you get tearing...with it you get card throttle ( not utiliyzing card clock 100% )

Freesync solves this.

Watercooling solves the rest.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> Just testing Samsung 960 Evo 1TB SSD M.2 - not specifically TR related but may be of interest
> 
> Once the temp hits about 65c-ish it throttles and I have not seen it go above 70c, which happens after about a minute of full use, though it doesn't drop speed by much and it cools down pretty quick once use ceases, I was expected some drammatic slow down, but nope.. seems like no big deal here, at least with no GPU, CPU warming the ambient up also. What affects the speed far more is being the boot partition at least in this synthetic tests of ATTO
> 
> Read speeds are crippled to the same as write when testing on the boot partition, splitting the SSD into 2 partitions and the secondary performs just fine!
> 
> I am using the MSI gaming Carbon mobo which has its silly little Heat shields that I am pretty sure just make them hotter :-D And I am using bottom slot in a 24c room.
> 
> Samsung SSD 960 EVO 1TB - Hot ( 64c - 70c ) secondary partition:
> 
> 
> Samsung SSD 960 EVO 1TB - Cold secondary partition
> 
> 
> Samsung SSD 960 EVO 1TB - Cold boot partition






see this is a bit weird.

have a look at my results that is a 960 evo 500 gig drive and it is the OS no partitions...just the os drive.

my write speeds are lower but my read speeds are better(drive gets warm but never really sits to far above 60 for long i am grabbing a cooler for it though







)

i believe the 1Tb version is faster than the 500 anyway so that explains the writes i guess. But why is your drive slower than mine in the reads and by quite a margin.

it could be throttling but that does not explain the difference in boot vs secondary partition


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> That's dependent on the person and their own budget. I have 2 titan pascals. I don't even have time to game majority of the time. I gotta do work arounds for sli as well at times. However, currently I am playing Hellblade @ 4k maxed out and that wasn't possible without sli to even hit 60 fps locked. To each their own. It works when it does and it's nice to have the cost is irrelevant for me. So I wouldn't rule it out just because it's not the golden days anymore of multi gpu.


if you have the money and the room then yes as long as the game uses it...but for me there were quite a few that just did not stack up whne i threw my fury nano and fury x together mainly doom in Vulcan was actually slower, and same for a few others.

there is a case for it but there is also a case for the fastest single gpu as well.
one area i think is well worth doing is double up on mid range cards like two vega 56's tweaked and cooled would be a force to reckon with in the games that it scaled well in









i just wish the devs would come to the party on this and utilising more cores on the cpu...they will as these things are becoming more mainstream but how long it takes who knows








same can be said for ram....now everyone is on DDR4 the ram makers will start making an effort like gskill has to make ram for everyone not just intel.

and on ram









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> For 3466MHz I need ProcODT 60 ohms and CAD Bus 30 30 30 30 or else it is an issue. For some odd reason I couldn't get 3333MHz tighten RAM setup working
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I got 3200MHz or 3466MHz, may revisit 3333MHz again.
> 
> Sicness found on his HW it was easy to snag 3466MHz 4x 8GB, he did very little from what I'm aware. So as always our experience could differ even if HW is very similar. The Flare X besides heat spreader use the same PCB/IC as stated by author of Thaiphoon Burner. So my RAM kit and his are pretty much same, then we got same mobo/CPU.
> 
> RAM setup of 3466MHz with CPU stock passed 5000%+ in HCI Memtest and then reruns of Y-Cruncher, P95, RB Stress mode, x264 encoding.
> 
> Started on some CPU core OC today, currently upto 3.9GHz, just gonna see what I get with 1.3V VCORE as max.
> 
> Did RB Stress mode first.
> 
> 
> 
> Then some P95 blend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will let it run for a few more hours before changing P95 setup. Currently using v28.1, may try v29.2 build 4, IIRC last time I used on Ryzen the latter had lower temps.






any chance you could throw in a text version of your ram settings so i can give them a shot


----------



## tps3443

Its amazing, 1 guys sli setup doesnt work. And the next guy is loving it.

AMD is still going to support (3) way crossfire officially. So, im going to try 3 or 4 cards. Ill let them mine away or something if it doesnt work.

But, ive got faith in AMD, sometimes xfire would scale 110% hows this possible?

Im using gpus for professional workloads, And gaming.

Cant wait to see vega 56/64 cross fire reviews on a 1900/20/50X x399 platform.


----------



## chew*

There is no crossfire on vega to date or did you miss that part?

Why do you think there were no reviews in xfire @ launch on any platform









If vega x fired i would not have bothered with 2 fury x...


----------



## Caldito

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Multiple GPUs are essentially useless at this point for gaming. You'd be best served by a single powerful GPU, and I'd suggest staying away from halo products.


Thanks for the feedback, I might to start with a single 1080ti and see.

Anybody has a comment regarding the case+cooling? any recomendation regarding that?


----------



## chew*

Anyone running a 128gb setup successfully and affordably ecc or non ecc @ around 2666?

My buddy ran out of memory on my system.


----------



## happyluckbox

So strange....

Today I tried for the first time "extreme" llc on my threadripper 1950x (I always had it set to turbo which is the second highest level).

With llc set to turbo, I was able to set vcore to 1.29 in bios, and overclock to 4ghz. Vcore under load ended up being 1.4v and 100% stable. Any less voltage would result in crash.

Now with llc set to extreme, I am able to set vcore to 1.25 in bios, and overclock to 4ghz. Vcore under load now is peaking at 1.35v, and I am 100% stable!!

Does higher llc do something that also helps stabilize machines pushing higher overclock? I thought for sure it would crash at any moment when I saw my load vcore was only 1.35v!


----------



## Makara

Hi guys, my turn









It has been a bit more than 2 weeks and I'm 100% satisfied.

For LED greatness :

 





 

1950X @ 3.8 on Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7 ; didn't touch vcore yet.

RAM (G.skill Trident Z RGB 3600 16-16-16-36) :



Idle Temp & Watt consumption :



Prime 95 Temp & Watt consumption :



Prime 95 & HWiNFO64 :


----------



## vgabex

Dear 1950X owners,

There's a new 3d rendering benchmark here: http://www.kraytracing.com/kray3benchmark2017/

It is based on the upcoming Kray 3 rendering engine for Lightwave3D.
I'm working with these softwares, and I'd like to know, how 1950X performs in this application before I upgrade.

I have an i7-5960X @ 4.3GHz, and a Ryzen 7 1700 @ 3.7GHz config.
Under Cinebench, they score exactly the same, around 1600 points.
But in this test, Ryzen seems about 10-15% slower than the i7!

Would someone be so kind to run the benchmark on an 1950X config?
It's only 1-2 minute to run and upload the score to the online database (please add the @ ...GHz to your description), but it would be a great help for me.

Thank you very much!


----------



## mrryzen

Just received my Noctua NH-U14S TR4 (CPU still not ordered, waiting for GPU availability in store), but it seems there are at least 4 bent fins on the rad (one of them is 45 degrees bent).

Should I return it and demand a new one, or it doesn't matter at all?


----------



## chew*

spent some time with imc and ram tonight.

different chip but hits about the same clocks with a tad better imc but runs warmer.

CPU score looks good but 3600 ram even with latency @ 14-14-14 did absolutely nothing for FPS over 3200 tight.....


----------



## Makara

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vgabex*
> 
> Would someone be so kind to run the benchmark on an 1950X config?
> It's only 1-2 minute to run and upload the score to the online database (please add the @ ...GHz to your description), but it would be a great help for me.
> 
> Thank you very much!


Done









https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&score=8008&rand=1Y2JKYE&os=Windows&endian=LE&compiler=VisualC+14.0&threads=32&buswidth=64&hash=aed2c8a513483ca00a7901bba0137afe&description=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor

9th place with 8008


----------



## vgabex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Makara*
> 
> Done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&score=8008&rand=1Y2JKYE&os=Windows&endian=LE&compiler=VisualC+14.0&threads=32&buswidth=64&hash=aed2c8a513483ca00a7901bba0137afe&description=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor
> 
> 9th place with 8008


Thanks!

It's so amazing, that a properly overclocked 1950X is only 30% slower than a Dual Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2699 v4 monster.......







$ vs $$$$$$


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> spent some time with imc and ram tonight.
> 
> different chip but hits about the same clocks with a tad better imc but runs warmer.
> 
> CPU score looks good but 3600 ram even with latency @ 14-14-14 did absolutely nothing for FPS over 3200 tight.....


How tight was 3200? CL12?


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> any chance you could throw in a text version of your ram settings so i can give them a shot


NP







.



Spoiler: The Stilt 3466MHz Preset Single Rank B Die



DRAM CAS# Latency [15]
DRAM CAS# Latency [15]
DRAM RAS# to CAS# Read Delay [15]
DRAM RAS# to CAS# Write Delay [15]
DRAM RAS# PRE Time [15]
DRAM RAS# ACT Time [35]
Trc [54]
TrrdS [6]
TrrdL [9]
Tfaw [36]
TwtrS [4]
TwtrL [12]
Twr [12]
Trcpage [Auto]
TrdrdScl [2]
TwrwrScl [2]
Trfc [333]
Trfc2 [Auto]
Trfc4 [Auto]
Tcwl [14]
Trtp [8]
Trdwr [Auto]
Twrrd [3]
TwrwrSc [1]
TwrwrSd [7]
TwrwrDd [7]
TrdrdSc [1]
TrdrdSd [5]
TrdrdDd [5]
Tcke [6]
ProcODT [60 ohm] ***
Cmd2T [1T]
Gear Down Mode [Disabled] (This is not part of preset, but you need GDM off for odd CL to not be rounded by AMD code)
Power Down Enable [Disabled] ***
RttNom [Auto]
RttWr [Auto]
RttPark [Auto]
MemAddrCmdSetup [Auto]
MemCsOdtSetup [Auto]
MemCkeSetup [Auto]
MemCadBusClkDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***
MemCadBusAddrCmdDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***
MemCadBusCsOdtDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***
MemCadBusCkeDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***

SOC: 1.1V ***
VDIMM: 1.4V

*Note:* * items are not part of preset, but what I was using for my CPU/RAM combo.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> NP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: The Stilt 3466MHz Preset Single Rank B Die
> 
> 
> 
> DRAM CAS# Latency [15]
> DRAM CAS# Latency [15]
> DRAM RAS# to CAS# Read Delay [15]
> DRAM RAS# to CAS# Write Delay [15]
> DRAM RAS# PRE Time [15]
> DRAM RAS# ACT Time [35]
> Trc [54]
> TrrdS [6]
> TrrdL [9]
> Tfaw [36]
> TwtrS [4]
> TwtrL [12]
> Twr [12]
> Trcpage [Auto]
> TrdrdScl [2]
> TwrwrScl [2]
> Trfc [333]
> Trfc2 [Auto]
> Trfc4 [Auto]
> Tcwl [14]
> Trtp [8]
> Trdwr [Auto]
> Twrrd [3]
> TwrwrSc [1]
> TwrwrSd [7]
> TwrwrDd [7]
> TrdrdSc [1]
> TrdrdSd [5]
> TrdrdDd [5]
> Tcke [6]
> ProcODT [60 ohm] ***
> Cmd2T [1T]
> Gear Down Mode [Disabled] (This is not part of preset, but you need GDM off for odd CL to not be rounded by AMD code)
> Power Down Enable [Disabled] ***
> RttNom [Auto]
> RttWr [Auto]
> RttPark [Auto]
> MemAddrCmdSetup [Auto]
> MemCsOdtSetup [Auto]
> MemCkeSetup [Auto]
> MemCadBusClkDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***
> MemCadBusAddrCmdDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***
> MemCadBusCsOdtDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***
> MemCadBusCkeDrvStren [30.0 Ohm] ***
> 
> SOC: 1.1V ***
> VDIMM: 1.4V
> 
> *Note:* * items are not part of preset, but what I was using for my CPU/RAM combo.






awesome thanks for that i,ll give it a go.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> spent some time with imc and ram tonight.
> 
> different chip but hits about the same clocks with a tad better imc but runs warmer.
> 
> CPU score looks good but 3600 ram even with latency @ 14-14-14 did absolutely nothing for FPS over 3200 tight.....






told ya so









real games should see a boost but i really can't see anything bar older version of 3dmark or skydiver etc benefit past 3200 with good timings.

now
run corona 1.3 or this new one above and change the memory i,m pretty sure they are benefitting from it changing to 14 13 13 scored me top spot in corona (well for a day or so







i,ll get it back...


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Makara*
> 
> Hi guys, my turn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It has been a bit more than 2 weeks and I'm 100% satisfied.
> 
> For LED greatness :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1950X @ 3.8 on Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7 ; didn't touch vcore yet.
> 
> RAM (G.skill Trident Z RGB 3600 16-16-16-36) :
> 
> 
> 
> Idle Temp & Watt consumption :
> 
> 
> 
> Prime 95 Temp & Watt consumption :
> 
> 
> 
> Prime 95 & HWiNFO64 :
> 
> [/quote





]

looks good.
is that hooked up to a 480 radiator and only the threadripper in the loop?

temps look very good at load be interesting to see that thing at 4g with a bit more juice


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vgabex*
> 
> Dear 1950X owners,
> 
> There's a new 3d rendering benchmark here: http://www.kraytracing.com/kray3benchmark2017/
> 
> It is based on the upcoming Kray 3 rendering engine for Lightwave3D.
> I'm working with these softwares, and I'd like to know, how 1950X performs in this application before I upgrade.
> 
> I have an i7-5960X @ 4.3GHz, and a Ryzen 7 1700 @ 3.7GHz config.
> Under Cinebench, they score exactly the same, around 1600 points.
> But in this test, Ryzen seems about 10-15% slower than the i7!
> 
> Would someone be so kind to run the benchmark on an 1950X config?
> It's only 1-2 minute to run and upload the score to the online database (please add the @ ...GHz to your description), but it would be a great help for me.
> 
> Thank you very much!






done
https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&score=7339&rand=1GD3HOV&os=Windows&endian=LE&compiler=VisualC+14.0&threads=32&buswidth=64&hash=c91eff6620efc62e7a0dd2a6a99dd3eb&description=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor

stock ram at 3200 14 13 13

11th place (my guess is 9th place is at least 4g









ok 4g result same ram settings 10th place bumped the other score to 12th









https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&score=8192&rand=5U5614&os=Windows&endian=LE&compiler=VisualC+14.0&threads=32&buswidth=64&hash=fb5619e89bf9d99440763d8fe9af1c12&description=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor


----------



## Makara

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> looks good.
> is that hooked up to a 480 radiator and only the threadripper in the loop?
> 
> temps look very good at load be interesting to see that thing at 4g with a bit more juice


It's on a 560 Radiator with 4 EK-Vardar EVO 140ER fans only the CPU in the loop yeah









I may add another loop for the Graphic Card only in the future as the case is build for 2 separate loops.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> That's dependent on the person and their own budget. I have 2 titan pascals. I don't even have time to game majority of the time. I gotta do work arounds for sli as well at times. However, currently I am playing Hellblade @ 4k maxed out and that wasn't possible without sli to even hit 60 fps locked. To each their own. It works when it does and it's nice to have the cost is irrelevant for me. So I wouldn't rule it out just because it's not the golden days anymore of multi gpu.


If you have infinite money, you're an exception and that's fine. I don't generally assume that to be the case when giving advice to people though since for most of us there is some degree of significance to the benefit we're receiving in return for our expenditure.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> My multi gpu setup works just fine except for 1 batman game which sucked so bad that steam gave users who bought it every batman game prior to it.
> 
> Win 10 may not work so good because its up to the devs for xfire.
> 
> Win 7 however is flawless and with over 50 games in my libraries...only one does not benefit from multicard...
> 
> Can not vouch for more than 2way or nv...but my amd experience paired with the right settings and monitor has been exceptional...
> 
> Key things are vsync, throttling tearing all semi related.
> 
> A freesync 144 hz panel is a necessity to counter and quite honestly solve all those issues.
> 
> Without vsync you get tearing...with it you get card throttle ( not utiliyzing card clock 100% )
> 
> Freesync solves this.
> 
> Watercooling solves the rest.


All I know is that I never had any real success with four different generations of crossfire. I had multiple GPUs from the 4000 (quad 4850), 5000 (dual 5850), 6000 (quad 6970), and 7000 (dual 270X) families. Never were the gains consistent and beneficial in the games I played. In those seemingly few situations where my framerate did actually increase versus a single GPU, frame timing issues meant there was no perceivable improvement to fluidity. It was odd getting 50-60 fps in Battlefield games for instance where the video was still choppy (pacing I mean--I don't care about screen tearing) and laggy (ie mouse movements are frustrating) enough to feel the same as when I was getting 25-30 fps on a single card. I was just throwing away money both on hardware and power for no real benefit. I saw enough other people give reports of similar experiences throughout the years to eventually give up on multi-GPU. I had held out hope for half a decade with the ever-present carrot of "it'll work perfectly on the next generation of hardware or the next major driver update, just you wait" never coming to pass.

That's my take on multi-GPU at least. Your experiences have been different from the sound of it, and I'm glad it has worked well for you in the past. I'm not sure how common that is. It's certainly not something I'd recommend to people who don't fully appreciate the potential pain they're signing up for. That is especially the case now where developer support has been on the decline for years and the future looks to be one where traditional multi-GPU on both sides will eventually cease to exist. Things may change once the major engine developers implement agnostic multi-GPU utilization on DX12 and Vulkan code paths, but I've been burned too many times by the promises of future technologies to make recommendations based on it.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I think this one was for me and not Tarot? I'm a bit confused, I never said many of these things but anyway:
> I've only compared 960 EVO's. The other ones are not relevant to me.
> I never posted my m.2. drive temps so not sure what you are talking about, but I've seen +48c max during load/tests. Should be well below throttle temps. I have mine mounted between the GPU's. Not a great position but I don't have any other options with this mobo.
> I've had lots of issues with my mobo. Not just the m.2. speed. I'm on a custom loop so it's not like I'm dying to disassemble it for the smallest of reasons and send the mobo off and get it replaced, quite the contrary.
> 
> No offense taken.
> 
> 
> 
> (i get it with the apples oranges thing...you are referring to me saying how my 850 evo performed a bit better than when it ws an OS drive, what i mean twas THAT drive i was not in any way referring to the 960 evo. So if that confused you sorry about that, but i am not redoing it so i can test the 960 evo as a data drive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> yeah ok lets start again
> who here is running a nvme drive as an OS drive?
> what scores are you getting ?
> who here is running the drive as a non os drive and just a data drive(not a slave as that hasn't existed in 10 years)? and what scores are you getting
> what drive temps are you getting for what position on the motherboard.
> 
> how's that?
> 
> as for the questions regarding temps i read them off hwinfo as shown in the screen shot i do not know if they are correct or which of the 2 listed is the one i should be worried about but yes i do believe they are too hot and do throttle but by how much i am not sure.
> 
> as for where is the card it is directly under the video card.
> why
> because the video card is in slot 2 due to some limitations for slot 1
> the nvme is there because...thats where the slot is or i can got back a bit and shove it directly under the blower fan for the video card...which would be worse, there are no very good positions for that drive.
> 
> oh and no offense taken i have rhino skin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and always open to suggestions
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as for your response you may need to clarify it a little
Click to expand...

Just a FYI. gaming performance us dependent on what cores the game runs on and what slot the GPU is install in. The first x16 slot connects to the PCIE controller that is located on die 0 and is supported locally by CPU 0 - CPU15 on an 1950X, CPU0-cpu11 on 1920X and CPU0-CPU7 on 1900X (as reported by the windows performance monitor). In UWA mode, Assuming that the GPU is in slot 1, setting the affinity for the game to the lower range CPUs or changing to game mode improves game performance because the graphics traffic does not have to travel across the Infinity Fabric and incur the additional latency penalty.

In case you are still mystified. A Thread ripper package has two silicon blocks on board called a dies. In each die on a 1950X, there are 8 of the 16 physical cores, a dual channel memory controller and a PCIe controller that supplies the system with 32 lanes of PCIe. The two dies together give you the stated specs that AMD publishes about the chips. Any time something on one die needs to access something on or connected to the other die, there is an additional latency penalty incurred because of the time it takes for the data to travel between the dies. Best performance comes from managing the workload, limiting the amount of cross die traffic like switching threads, accessing memory on the other memory controller or using the graphics card that is connected to the other die. You will get best performance if you ensure that as many discrete jobs as possible are connected locally to the memory and PCIe devices that it is using.

Multithreaded applications parallelize workloads by typically having a main thread that controls everything and worker threads that do piece work. It is then the job of the main thread to combine all the pieces back together at the end to provide the full end result.

I understand that these x399 boards have 4 slots and if running four GPUs will run at x16, x8 x16 x8 as the slots move away from the socket. I understand that the 2nd slot is only x8. If slot 1 is obstructed by a cooler, I suggest that you move the GPU to slot 3 which should support all x16 lanes but will connect locally to the 2nd die and the high numbered CPU cores. If your only GPU is installed in that 3rd slot, setting affinity (affinity means telling windows to run an application on a particular CPU core or cores) for games to CPU16-CPU31 should provide you with the best performance.

As an extension to that comment above. The different m.2 sockets on x399 will also be connected to the different PCIe controllers on both dies. They will not all be to the same controller so that means that the performance for boot drives will depend on what m.2 slot you are using. If you selected a slot that connects to the PCIe controller that is not local to the die that the operating system threads are running on, your performance will be reduced any time the system or drivers try to access the drive as there is the extra latency incurred by travelling over the between die fabric before it gets to the connected PCIe controller. I am not sure if the manual details what PCIe controller supports what m.2 socket. It should recommend the best slot to use for boot drives somewhere. If it doesn't say anything, you can do some simple trial and error tests to identify which controller you have connected the drive to. Install it in a different slot and see if it performs differently than the one it is in now.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Im looking at returning to AMD, after 10 years of running only intel processors.
> 
> im pretty much dead set on getting a 1950X, and a X399 motherboard. Setting it to 4Ghz, running (4) graphics cards in SLI, or quad fire.
> 
> Now that 64 PCI E lanes are available, and 16 cores.. ive always wanted to run 4 cards. Its overkill, doesnt scale properly, has issues and sometimes does not work. Jayz2cents tried (3) way gtx 1080's, it didnt work at all. But everyone on youtube is loving (4) way sli gtx 1080's with great scaling.
> 
> Anyone experience 3 or 4 cards on the new threadripper platform? With a, 1900X/1920X/or 1950X?
> 
> Id run (4) vega 56's. Or (2) Pro Duo 2017 models.


If you use Nvidia Inspector for Nvidia cards, you can manually set tri or quad SLI profiles for any game. Jay did not do that, he just plugged it in and ran the game without creating the sli profile. I don't have any recent AMD gpu experience so I don't know how you can adjust crossfire profiles.


----------



## HeliosDoubleSix

Any software designed to test latency?

Just running ATTO with 512B transfer size and when targeting secondary partition I get 36773 Write 38687 Read on CPU 31, and 39936 / 41088 on CPU 0, so like a 6% bump with tiny files, but almost no relative diff with larger transfers

This is when using bottom most M.2 on MSI Gaming Carbon Mobo

For completeness the boot partition on CPU 0 gets 36899/40320

So seems like diff is negligible, seems like any latency issues really only trouble GPU's

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Just a FYI. gaming performance us dependent on what cores the game runs on and what slot the GPU is install in. The first x16 slot connects to the PCIE controller that is located on die 0 and is supported locally by CPU 0 - CPU15 on an 1950X, CPU0-cpu11 on 1920X and CPU0-CPU7 on 1900X (as reported by the windows performance monitor). In UWA mode, Assuming that the GPU is in slot 1, setting the affinity for the game to the lower range CPUs or changing to game mode improves game performance because the graphics traffic does not have to travel across the Infinity Fabric and incur the additional latency penalty.
> 
> In case you are still mystified. A Thread ripper package has two silicon blocks on board called a dies. In each die on a 1950X, there are 8 of the 16 physical cores, a dual channel memory controller and a PCIe controller that supplies the system with 32 lanes of PCIe. The two dies together give you the stated specs that AMD publishes about the chips. Any time something on one die needs to access something on or connected to the other die, there is an additional latency penalty incurred because of the time it takes for the data to travel between the dies. Best performance comes from managing the workload, limiting the amount of cross die traffic like switching threads, accessing memory on the other memory controller or using the graphics card that is connected to the other die. You will get best performance if you ensure that as many discrete jobs as possible are connected locally to the memory and PCIe devices that it is using.
> 
> Multithreaded applications parallelize workloads by typically having a main thread that controls everything and worker threads that do piece work. It is then the job of the main thread to combine all the pieces back together at the end to provide the full end result.
> 
> I understand that these x399 boards have 4 slots and if running four GPUs will run at x16, x8 x16 x8 as the slots move away from the socket. I understand that the 2nd slot is only x8. If slot 1 is obstructed by a cooler, I suggest that you move the GPU to slot 3 which should support all x16 lanes but will connect locally to the 2nd die and the high numbered CPU cores. If your only GPU is installed in that 3rd slot, setting affinity (affinity means telling windows to run an application on a particular CPU core or cores) for games to CPU16-CPU31 should provide you with the best performance.
> 
> As an extension to that comment above. The different m.2 sockets on x399 will also be connected to the different PCIe controllers on both dies. They will not all be to the same controller so that means that the performance for boot drives will depend on what m.2 slot you are using. If you selected a slot that connects to the PCIe controller that is not local to the die that the operating system threads are running on, your performance will be reduced any time the system or drivers try to access the drive as there is the extra latency incurred by travelling over the between die fabric before it gets to the connected PCIe controller. I am not sure if the manual details what PCIe controller supports what m.2 socket. It should recommend the best slot to use for boot drives somewhere. If it doesn't say anything, you can do some simple trial and error tests to identify which controller you have connected the drive to. Install it in a different slot and see if it performs differently than the one it is in now.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> How tight was 3200? CL12?


3200 was c14 on DR prime stable settings.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Makara*
> 
> It's on a 560 Radiator with 4 EK-Vardar EVO 140ER fans only the CPU in the loop yeah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may add another loop for the Graphic Card only in the future as the case is build for 2 separate loops.






nice looks like i may need to do the same thing not long down the track, i have a feeling what i have won't cope to well.

for the gpu discussion.
my card is in the 2nd slot.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> If you have infinite money, you're an exception and that's fine. I don't generally assume that to be the case when giving advice to people though since for most of us there is some degree of significance to the benefit we're receiving in return for our expenditure.
> All I know is that I never had any real success with four different generations of crossfire. I had multiple GPUs from the 4000 (quad 4850), 5000 (dual 5850), 6000 (quad 6970), and 7000 (dual 270X) families. Never were the gains consistent and beneficial in the games I played. In those seemingly few situations where my framerate did actually increase versus a single GPU, frame timing issues meant there was no perceivable improvement to fluidity. It was odd getting 50-60 fps in Battlefield games for instance where the video was still choppy (pacing I mean--I don't care about screen tearing) and laggy (ie mouse movements are frustrating) enough to feel the same as when I was getting 25-30 fps on a single card. I was just throwing away money both on hardware and power for no real benefit. I saw enough other people give reports of similar experiences throughout the years to eventually give up on multi-GPU. I had held out hope for half a decade with the ever-present carrot of "it'll work perfectly on the next generation of hardware or the next major driver update, just you wait" never coming to pass.
> 
> That's my take on multi-GPU at least. Your experiences have been different from the sound of it, and I'm glad it has worked well for you in the past. I'm not sure how common that is. It's certainly not something I'd recommend to people who don't fully appreciate the potential pain they're signing up for. That is especially the case now where developer support has been on the decline for years and the future looks to be one where traditional multi-GPU on both sides will eventually cease to exist. Things may change once the major engine developers implement agnostic multi-GPU utilization on DX12 and Vulkan code paths, but I've been burned too many times by the promises of future technologies to make recommendations based on it.


I dealt with a lot of the problems that you are referring to or I believe you are referring to.

First step was plenty of power.

Second issue was tearing which vsync solved but then created an issue with not hitting full clocks ( artificial throttle ) which resulted in lower frame rates.

At that point I went and grabbed a 144 hz freesync panel which in turn allowed me to get the cards back to full clocks while solving the tearing issue as well but then created another problem.

Thermal throttling which in turn resulted in lower clocks reducing frame rates. At that point I water cooled both cards 290x with full covers that had great gpu/vrm temps.

At that point all issues were solved except for the fact that I had a 4gb memory limitation and I could only ask so much from the cards texture wise.

Fury x is no different and responds the same way with HBM being more forgiving in the eye candy department since 4gb hbm is equal to about 6gb gddr5.

As far as drivers go I have had 0 issues but of course I am not an early adopter and like OS I only use for the most part hardware that has matured.

I had 2 270x on air fyi. the memory limitation vastly ruins the x fire experience and is a rather significant bottleneck.

On a side note as despite the overall score being what only matters to most I would like to point out that despite the full dual 16x and higher core count and rather well tuned system I have yet to catch my game test results on this platform vs x370.

Basically put if you ditched x370 solely to game on x399 you made a poor decision.

If you grabbed x399 to build a workstation that is "good enough" to game on and can be an all in one system you made the right decision.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I dealt with a lot of the problems that you are referring to or I believe you are referring to.
> 
> First step was plenty of power.
> 
> Second issue was tearing which vsync solved but then created an issue with not hitting full clocks ( artificial throttle ) which resulted in lower frame rates.
> 
> At that point I went and grabbed a 144 hz freesync panel which in turn allowed me to get the cards back to full clocks while solving the tearing issue as well but then created another problem.
> 
> Thermal throttling which in turn resulted in lower clocks reducing frame rates. At that point I water cooled both cards 290x with full covers that had great gpu/vrm temps.
> 
> At that point all issues were solved except for the fact that I had a 4gb memory limitation and I could only ask so much from the cards texture wise.
> 
> Fury x is no different and responds the same way with HBM being more forgiving in the eye candy department since 4gb hbm is equal to about 6gb gddr5.
> 
> As far as drivers go I have had 0 issues but of course I am not an early adopter and like OS I only use for the most part hardware that has matured.
> 
> I had 2 270x on air fyi. the memory limitation vastly ruins the x fire experience and is a rather significant bottleneck.
> 
> On a side note as despite the overall score being what only matters to most I would like to point out that despite the full dual 16x and higher core count and rather well tuned system I have yet to catch my game test results on this platform vs x370.
> 
> Basically put if you ditched x370 solely to game on x399 you made a poor decision.
> 
> If you grabbed x399 to build a workstation that is "good enough" to game on and can be an all in one system you made the right decision.


Texture memory certainly is a limiting factor. Something I've found that a lot of people don't appreciate is that memory demands are even higher when using multiple cards than when using a single card. A game that fits in and uses 95% of the onboard memory with a single card is going to be rather unhappy when not just one card but suddenly two cards have to page to system memory if it runs on a 2-way setup with identical settings. It leads to a choppy/stuttery experience.

The two main problems I had though I don't think you've touched on. Perhaps they aren't issues you ran into yourself. The first was crossfire support in the games I was interested in. Maybe half of my games would even utilize multiple cards, if that. The period of time when I got into crossfire was around when engines started utilizing deferred rendering techniques which at that time (not sure if still) were wholly incompatible with the technology. The second was frame pacing. In the half of my games where both GPUs would be used, maybe half of those titles would see a framerate uplift but feel no smoother than they would with a single card. 40 fps would feel just like 20 fps. The remaining quarter I'd split into equal parts working-as-advertised and working-but-at-low-scaling-factors of like 1.2 to 1.5.

I've not tried crossfire since retiring my pair of 270X cards though. I went to an 8 GiB 390 when those launched. It's what I'm still using, though I'm waiting for Vega cards to become available at MSRP. I'm not in a hurry on that one since I'm using Debian as my OS these days and the kernel has no display support for Vega yet. AMD is in the middle of a complete rewrite of the display management code and it's looking to be a month or two away before display output is supported. It's required for Vega and beyond with the legacy display manager still being available for prior releases.


----------



## chew*

As i expected. Even with good water...

https://www.pcper.com/news/cases-and-cooling/more-threadripper-waterblocks-including-unfamiliar-name

Not buying the enermax load temps of 69c @ 4.0 with an aio when the reality is not even a real setup can tame TR @ amds spec of 68c in worst case scenarios @ 1.4v


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vgabex*
> 
> Dear 1950X owners,
> 
> There's a new 3d rendering benchmark here: http://www.kraytracing.com/kray3benchmark2017/
> 
> It is based on the upcoming Kray 3 rendering engine for Lightwave3D.
> I'm working with these softwares, and I'd like to know, how 1950X performs in this application before I upgrade.
> 
> I have an i7-5960X @ 4.3GHz, and a Ryzen 7 1700 @ 3.7GHz config.
> Under Cinebench, they score exactly the same, around 1600 points.
> But in this test, Ryzen seems about 10-15% slower than the i7!
> 
> Would someone be so kind to run the benchmark on an 1950X config?
> It's only 1-2 minute to run and upload the score to the online database (please add the @ ...GHz to your description), but it would be a great help for me.
> 
> Thank you very much!


https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=67&lang=en 10th place @ 4.0


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Anyone running a 128gb setup successfully and affordably ecc or non ecc @ around 2666?
> 
> My buddy ran out of memory on my system.


I've seen reports of this particular samsung model (*M391A2k43BB1*-CRC) having samsung b-die chips in them (and according to the spec), a guy on reddit is using this 2400 CL17 ECC modules overclocked to 2933-16-16-16-36-1T


__
https://www.reddit.com/r/6ze285/overclocking_ecc_memory_for_threadripper/%5B/URL
 that's 128GB GSkill tridentz 3600Mhz c17 at 3066 mhz. Stable it seems.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=67&lang=en 10th place @ 4.0


I decided what the heck... I ran it on my old FX rig... got 43rd place... surprisingly in front of some pretty good Intel chips lol... guess this old beast still has some umph in it... rofl... I seriously wish I could join the ranks of you threadripper owners.. but alas the $$ isn't there.
https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&score=2093&rand=ZTCH19&os=Windows&endian=LE&compiler=VisualC+14.0&threads=8&buswidth=64&hash=49979559d8af423abea4ad254c1c5396&description=AMD+FX%28tm%29-9590+Eight-Core+Processor&benchpage=1


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=67&lang=en 10th place @ 4.0


catch up dude that was so last minute...you got bumped by scarecrow and you bumped me to 12th


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> catch up dude that was so last minute...you got bumped by scarecrow and you bumped me to 12th


Loool Hold your horses let me do this test again @ 4.2Ghz


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> I've seen reports of this particular samsung model (*M391A2k43BB1*-CRC) having samsung b-die chips in them (and according to the spec), a guy on reddit is using this 2400 CL17 ECC modules overclocked to 2933-16-16-16-36-1T
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/6ze285/overclocking_ecc_memory_for_threadripper/%5B/URL
> that's 128GB GSkill tridentz 3600Mhz c17 at 3066 mhz. Stable it seems.


Can not see any details on my phone except that pic is titled 16gbx4 @ 3066 which 3200 is more than possible @ 14-14-14 with 16gx4.

Also I take hci with a grain of salt without cpu stress in the mix not that 3066 is not possible in fact its very realistic.

Key point is this is a real mission critical system likewise it needs to be tested as such. My way seems to work as other than running out of memory it ran flawlessly.

The samsung they linked on reddit is ecc bdie 2400 its like $200 per stick.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> Loool Hold your horses let me do this test again @ 4.2Ghz


and they are off......
i also noticed scarecrows at 4.1 was lower than yours i really think memory plays a part in this bench.

shame it isn't a longer one like gooseberry is to weed out the suicide runners









still waiting for someone to bump me off number 2 in corona 1.3


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> catch up dude that was so last minute...you got bumped by scarecrow and you bumped me to 12th


Boomchakalaka









https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=70&lang=en


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> Boomchakalaka
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=70&lang=en


dammit dammit dammit









tried 4.1 went up to 1.38(offset llc2)
no dice crashes half way through my guess is i need a few more turns of the wheel not really wanting to do that on the h115i
and now i have ordered even more parts for the water cooling ....i decided to do 2 loops one for the vega and one for the threadripper....going to be a tight squeeze but i, m pretty sure with a dremmel hammer and lve it will all fit









as a matter of interest what settings are you using for 4.15 voltages etc?

i,m using pstates and offset voltages got to 4 pretty stable with only 1.3 volts but i wouldn't call it ultra stable.

and using the balanced power plan it happily drops to 2199 most of the time and the ramp up seems pretty good as well.


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> dammit dammit dammit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tried 4.1 went up to 1.38(offset llc2)
> no dice crashes half way through my guess is I need a few more turns of the wheel not really wanting to do that on the h115i
> and now I have ordered even more parts for the water cooling ....I decided to do 2 loops one for the vega and one for the threadripper....going to be a tight squeeze but I, m pretty sure with a dremmel hammer and I've it will all fit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as a matter of interest, what settings are you using for 4.15 voltages etc?
> 
> I,m using pstates and offset voltages got to 4 pretty stable with only 1.3 volts but I wouldn't call it ultra stable.
> 
> and using the balanced power plan it happily drops to 2199 most of the time and the ramp up seems pretty good as well.


4.0 1.28xxx I turned pstates off so it's always @ 4.0 and for 4.15 I went all the way to 1.375 ... I don't think balanced mode is a good idea for threadripper


----------



## TheScarecow

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> 4.0 1.28xxx I turned pstates off so it's always @ 4.0 and for 4.15 I went all the way to 1.375 ... I don't think balanced mode is a good idea for threadripper


Hi there









https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=71&lang=en


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> Hi there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=71&lang=en


Oh really it's like that .... gimme 2 sec


----------



## chew*

Im going to whip out 3733 ram clocks on you guys lol.


----------



## TheScarecow

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Im going to whip out 3733 ram clocks on you guys lol.


your going to need to come out with the big guns to beat me now








7th position 8916
https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=72&lang=en


----------



## chew*

You sure you want to issue that challenge? My system lives right next to -40c bolt on goodness


----------



## Bm514

What voltage ⚡ Scarecow

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk


----------



## TheScarecow

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> What voltage ⚡ Scarecow
> 
> Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk


1.437v teps dont go over 65c on the Tdie, still yet to bring that voltage down further to see how low it can go and still be stable or if its Prime95 stable (only just got the whole system up and working last night)


----------



## TheScarecow

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> You sure you want to issue that challenge? My system lives right next to -40c bolt on goodness


Mate I wanna see what -40c will get from one of these beasts so bring it on







also do you know where I can find good info on doing ram timings for TR? im at 14-14-14-36 with no sub timings touched


----------



## chew*

All depends on board type of dimms SR or DR Ic brand etc etc but there a ton of guides.

In order for me to bolt up the phase change I need a medium in between cpu to maintain ram clocks.

to cold imc takes a huge dive but who knows TR may run hot enough for me not to use a spacer.

I will run this real quick to see how it scales ram clocks latency or neither.


----------



## TheScarecow

Damn I've fallen to 8th spot now because of the dude at the top with his Xeon(R) CPU E5-2699 v4 doing a 2nd run, cant compete with 88 cores lol


----------



## chris89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> Damn I've fallen to 8th spot now because of the dude at the top with his Xeon(R) CPU E5-2699 v4 doing a 2nd run, cant compete with 88 cores lol


Do you have the results of yours and his e5-2699 v4s?


----------



## chew*

guys better have more power than that lol, I can still OC cpu


----------



## TheScarecow

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> guys better have more power than that lol, I can still OC cpu


Can you post your memory sub timings?


----------



## chew*

Give me a few....busy killing 48 thread scores


----------



## chew*

Ok any other requests or can I go back to debugging a motherboards bios to make it perform even better?









fyi you can pull that in to 1T CR....I was being lazy and loaded my Dual Rank profile configuration


----------



## Particle

MSI X399 FW 1.50 doesn't seem to fix the Blender stability problem unfortunately. It dies during the render. Maybe when 1.60 hits we'll get whatever fixes it supposedly in beta 1.52. MSI ignored my support request last week.


----------



## chew*

Sorry about that Particle,

MSi and Gigabyte are acting weird lately or at least weird towards me as far as bios input.
It was not like that in the past but that is the past and this is now.
I gave up after infrequent correspondence via email.

Asus has plenty of help so really does not need it.

Asrock does not seem to mind the help and are in contact daily.


----------



## joeybuddy96

I'm up to 2933 MHz stable on the Aorus. I've left everything at auto except for the RAM voltage (1.35V) and disabling IOMMU. I've been able to boot into Win10 at 3066 Mhz, but I get BSODs and calculation errors. I've got the same 3600MHz TridentZ 128GB that the reddit guy was using. I don't have any system monitoring software still. Is there a deciphering guide for the Aorus Gaming 7's UEFI? The pop-up descriptors in-UEFI are vague and useless. Firestrike demo crashed the first time I ran it. It showed the 1950x going up to 4.16506 GHz, but that must just be from the boost; I think I have it set to like 3.5GHz base. If someone else ran it after their OC, it would probably show something higher than 4.1GHz. I ran it again with OHM setting my 780Ti Classy's fan to 100% and got a combined score of 5045 (23.47fps).


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Ok any other requests or can I go back to debugging a motherboards bios to make it perform even better?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> fyi you can pull that in to 1T CR....I was being lazy and loaded my Dual Rank profile configuration






yep faster low latency definitely helps it seems (i,m still third though it seems in corona...to scared to check it again.

i,m just getting a few pics and videos on how to hack my 750d to fit a ek 420 up top...looking good so far.
then i,ll fiddle with ram


----------



## Paprika

Still won't boot above 2800mhz for me, regardless of how loose fittings, voltage, procodt, 1/2T etc.
Shame due to the Corsair vengeance RGB 3000Mhz 32GB kit being fairly expensive. Might need to swap ram.


----------



## gupsterg

That probably isn't Samsung B Die. It's pretty much a requirement on Ryzen/ThreadRipper to get higher clocks / more tweak ability.

Use Thaiphoon Burner to get info on what RAM IC it is. Then look around for shares of settings of same RAM IC to see what settings people use. You'll still probably need to spend some time on perfecting the settings for your own rig.


----------



## Nizzen

Why people buy any other memory to Ryzen/threadripper than Samsung b die, is wierd to me









Buy cheap, buy twice/trouble


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> Why people buy any other memory to Ryzen/threadripper than Samsung b die, is wierd to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buy cheap, buy twice/trouble


E die works just fine. I got 8 sticks of trident e die that run 3200 no probs on x399 and x370.


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> E die works just fine. I got 8 sticks of trident e die that run 3200 no probs on x399 and x370.


Nice









I run 3600 mhz on 1950x and 1800x. 3600c15 kits


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> MSi and Gigabyte are acting weird lately or at least weird towards me as far as bios input.


Assuming you're capable of replying to this..

Any issues with the Gigabyte 399 7 you'd care to tell us about? Am just about to pull the trigger on one 

(and/or whether you'd care to recommend a board in general)


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Assuming you're capable of replying to this..
> Any issues with the Gigabyte 399 7 you'd care to tell us about? Am just about to pull the trigger on one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (and/or whether you'd care to recommend a board in general)


well it's a great board no issues so far for me ... running @ 4.1Ghz Ram @ 3200Mhz ... 24/7 36hour Aida64 Stable


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> E die works just fine. I got 8 sticks of trident e die that run 3200 no probs on x399 and x370.


As a caveat, I ran a 3466 MHz E die kit on my x399 Carbon and it just plain wouldn't boot unless the RAM was under 3GHZ. B die had no issues.

The carbon was crappy though. I returned it - a wise move given the issues users continue to have with it. You're on a Zenith, so my E die might have worked for you.


----------



## Aenra

Question about the 399(s) aside, got some bad news for those few that rushed; as always, never rush 

Vega Crossfire incoming!

(i know it's out of topic, but since it was discussed..)

https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/amd-enables-vega-crossfire-with-upcoming-17-9-2-drivers-over-80-scaling.237211/


----------



## chew*

Ehh even if they do enable it it will be quite awhile before its mature.

Honestly they had to do it as its the only way to beat 1080ti.


----------



## Aenra

I know... but now i'm tempted ^^

Two sapphire 64s air, flash them as liquid, full loop, with a 1950X at 4.++++

Just because, lol

(men and their toys)


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> Damn I've fallen to 8th spot now because of the dude at the top with his Xeon(R) CPU E5-2699 v4 doing a 2nd run, cant compete with 88 cores lol


This is where EPYC comes in.

I wouldn't mind having a multi EPYC system...


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> This is where EPYC comes in.
> 
> I wouldn't mind having a multi EPYC system...


Correction.

This is where ln2 comes in


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Assuming you're capable of replying to this..
> Any issues with the Gigabyte 399 7 you'd care to tell us about? Am just about to pull the trigger on one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (and/or whether you'd care to recommend a board in general)


Other than you need sunglasses on failed OC or when you first post the board none that i have heard of.

It seems the taichi is faster clock per clock according to the above kraymark benching and other various benchmarks i have tested.

For me its not about how high you can oc but how it performs at a given clock.

I will not push asrock to loosen board tuning up to hit higher speeds. If anything i will push them to tighten up performance.

Seems its working as 4.0 is beating 4.2


----------



## TheScarecow

At this stage I think its more the issue that 4.2ghz with ram that has **** timings gets hamstrung to allow for 4Ghz with tight ram to over take it, since updating my BIOS to the most recent version on the Zenith my scores have gone backwards so I need to start from stratch RE OC'ing this

@chew* is it better to find the max limit of what your ram can OC to then bring your CPU OC up to keep ram stable at the max OC or is it better to find the best stable OC for the CPU then bring your ram up as high as it can go?


----------



## chew*

I always chase a balance of performance.

Always have.

Faster speed is not always faster performance.

4.2 may be tripping up due to a bottleneck.

Up to the individual to recognize these bottlenecks and tune there system accordingly.

I have no hands on with zenith but i know c6h ran looser to hit higher.

Vendors can fine tune agesa to go either direction.

Tight ship or loose goose.

Best i can say is run a barrage of bench marks tuned to opposite extremes. See which fits your use case best.


----------



## TheScarecow

haha figured you would say that







and yeah I have been so out of the loop RE OC'ing for years ( last system was a I7 4770k at 4.4ghz and stock ram) so digging into BIOS setups and workign out what all the vaules mena and how to do ram sub timing is completly new to me


----------



## chew*

Amd has a good guide that i think gupsterg has linked somewhere.

Its a good place to start before you go full mental.

Best to learn and understand how and why and the basic rules vs depending on others imo.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vgabex*
> 
> Dear 1950X owners,
> 
> There's a new 3d rendering benchmark here: http://www.kraytracing.com/kray3benchmark2017/
> 
> It is based on the upcoming Kray 3 rendering engine for Lightwave3D.
> I'm working with these softwares, and I'd like to know, how 1950X performs in this application before I upgrade.
> 
> I have an i7-5960X @ 4.3GHz, and a Ryzen 7 1700 @ 3.7GHz config.
> Under Cinebench, they score exactly the same, around 1600 points.
> But in this test, Ryzen seems about 10-15% slower than the i7!
> 
> Would someone be so kind to run the benchmark on an 1950X config?
> It's only 1-2 minute to run and upload the score to the online database (please add the @ ...GHz to your description), but it would be a great help for me.
> 
> Thank you very much!


Here you go, 128gb of ram clocked at 3060mhz:
https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&publicid=87&lang=en#publicid


----------



## alucardis666

So what's the fastest we've seen a 1950X hit? getting mine to 4.0ghz was a breeze.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> So what's the fastest we've seen a 1950X hit? getting mine to 4.0ghz was a breeze.


5.4 ish on ln2...


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> 5.4 ish on ln2...


Lol. 24/7 usecases and with a Kraken X62


----------



## chew*

You said the fastest not the fastest realistic lol


----------



## happyluckbox

So, who else is running 128 gb of ram here? Post up your specs and your overclock!

Threadripper 1950x 3.9ghz
Tridentz 128gb 3060mhz 14-14-14-30 2T

I can run 4ghz, but it requires me to jump from 1.368vcore peak under load to 1.41 vcore peak under load.
Temps go up about 10 degrees across the board from cpu to mosfets and the northbridge.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So, who else is running 128 gb of ram here? Post up your specs and your overclock!
> 
> Threadripper 1950x 3.9ghz
> Tridentz 128gb 3060mhz 14-14-14-30 2T
> 
> I can run 4ghz, but it requires me to jump from 1.368vcore peak under load to 1.41 vcore peak under load.
> Temps go up about 10 degrees across the board from cpu to mosfets and the northbridge.


not many it would seem chew was looking for some 128 gigers for info








i,m assuming the ram is nice and stable?
and because you are using all the imc all the time







your overclocks would naturally be a little harder to get to and use more juice than say someone like me running 32 gig and only 4 sticks.

in other news...that kraybench escalated pretty quick one of my scores got bumped to 29th









nice to see amd scrambling up the charts again









ok just for ****s and giggles

https://www.kraytracing.com/kraybench/?b&score=8192&rand=5U5614&os=Windows&endian=LE&compiler=VisualC+14.0&threads=32&buswidth=64&hash=fb5619e89bf9d99440763d8fe9af1c12&description=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor

have a look at 23rd 24th 25th 26th the last one is mine stock 3200 14 13 13 the next on of mine is 3466 15 15 15 and the other one seems to be stock but at 3600 16 but exactly the same score...exactly









just i think give a good ide of memory scaling if you can get 3466 14 14 i think it will soar on past 3600.

pretty cool


----------



## Beatnutz

I decided to rebuild my system. My rads are getting too hot (I've measured +47c on my top rad).

Switching the case out and gonna fill it with 420mm top, 360mm front, 240mm side, 420mm other side. Hopefully this will be sufficient to keep my system below 60c at all times at 3.8Ghz. Not sure what to expect honestly.

It's only my 3th new case in a year. Hope this is the last one for a long time!







..


----------



## Gilles3000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I decided to rebuild my system. My rads are getting too hot (I've measured +47c on my top rad).
> 
> Switching the case out and gonna fill it with 420mm top, 360mm front, 240mm side, 420mm other side. Hopefully this will be sufficient to keep my system below 60c at all times at 3.8Ghz. Not sure what to expect honestly.
> 
> It's only my 3th new case in a year. Hope this is the last one for a long time!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..


What's your cooling setup now?


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilles3000*
> 
> What's your cooling setup now?


The most recent photo is from when I was building the current setup.



420mm rad on top, 360 front. Two 120mm fans in the bottom, and one 140mm blowing air in under the top rad. I've tried different setups with all blowing air in, out and in between but when the GPUs start to work it just gets too hot. Space is very cramped too which I can imagine messes with the air flow.

Pumps are running at 3.2LPM at all times which isn't an issue since the case is very quiet. The 900D is not a quiet case but hoping to run them at slower speeds with the new setup.


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I decided to rebuild my system. My rads are getting too hot (I've measured +47c on my top rad).
> 
> Switching the case out and gonna fill it with 420mm top, 360mm front, 240mm side, 420mm other side. Hopefully, this will be sufficient to keep my system below 60c at all times at 3.8Ghz. Not sure what to expect honestly.
> 
> It's only my 3rd new case in a year. Hope this is the last one for a long time!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..


4th case this year and I'm planning to get Hex-Gear R80


----------



## ssateneth

4225 @ 1.425v for the moment


----------



## Bm514

mine won't run any bench at 4.2Ghz @ 1.465 volts


----------



## happyluckbox

you guys are actually 100% stable and ok with the high temps running 4.0 ghz+ 1.4v+ 24/7 on say p95 small ftt?

I find that 4.0 ghz is stable and temps are acceptable for Aida 64 and p95 medium to large ftt, but small ftt runs way too hot and crashes system.

is this still considered stable if I can pass Aida 64 but can't pass an hour of small ftt? A lot of people say small ftt puts unrealistic stress anyways....


----------



## Bm514

somehow i am stable 1.29V @ 4.0Ghz Max temp 58 (Custom loop Ek Wb)


----------



## chew*

The lack of prime stable screenies pretty much answers that question. There are none because they are not stable nor can they tame temps @68c with 1.4v+

1.3v is realistic and tameable.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> The lack of prime stable screenies pretty much answers that question. There are none because they are not stable nor can they tame temps @68c with 1.4v+
> 
> 1.3v is realistic and tameable.


yeah I'd like to see some of these 4.0+ghz 1.4v+ oveclocks post some p95 small ftt (8k-8k with >90% ram load) stable overclocks with temps included. pretty sure nobody will get a stable run of more than 4 hours...


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> yeah I'd like to see some of these 4.0+ghz 1.4v+ oveclocks post some p95 small ftt (8k-8k with >90% ram load) stable overclocks with temps included. pretty sure nobody will get a stable run of more than 4 hours...


Hard ocp did a write up on a byski and xspc block on xspcs flagship double thick 480 rad.

Long story short 75-76c @ 1.4xx peak temps in prime 95

So basically if not 68c or less not a voltage I would run for 24/7 mission critical.

Thx for posting by the way i was guesstimating 3066 for 128g but unsure.

We already ran out of mem with 64g on a project which btw eats all 32 threads and is seeing temps like prime after hours of running.

Basically if you use the system the way it was intended...prime is realistic.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Agree with Chew.

I'm Prime95 Small FFT stable at 4.1 ghz and 1.35 vcore, but I'm on a 1920X with customer water (two 360 rads + EK block and nothing else on the loop). My temps hit 72-75 after 45 min, so I have a hard time believing 1950X with higher vcore and lesser cooling stay under 60 let alone 70.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Agree with Chew.
> 
> I'm Prime95 Small FFT stable at 4.1 ghz and 1.35 vcore, but I'm on a 1920X with customer water (two 360 rads + EK block and nothing else on the loop). My temps hit 72-75 after 45 min, so I have a hard time believing 1950X with higher vcore and lesser cooling stay under 60 let alone 70.


Hah guys are running just an enermax aio and 4125 @ 1.40v on 1950x and only hitting 69c.

If you believe that i have this great car to sell you as well


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Hah guys are running just an enermax aio and 4125 @ 1.40v on 1950x and only hitting 69c.
> 
> If you believe that i have this great car to sell you as well


Yep. Even on Aida64 or Blend I'm still in the mid 60's and that is with 720mm of top tier rad capacity cooling only the CPU.

As a side note, I don't have proof for this yet, but I think the EK TR4 block is my bottleneck at the moment, at least under load. Meaning even if I add more rad space I won't see significantly lower load temps.


----------



## czin125

https://www.gskill.com/en/press/view/g-skill-releases-amd-compatible-trident-z-rgb-kits
New RGB ram for Threadripper ( they stopped using the flare X design I guess? )


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Yep. Even on Aida64 or Blend I'm still in the mid 60's and that is with 720mm of top tier rad capacity cooling only the CPU.
> 
> As a side note, I don't have proof for this yet, but I think the EK TR4 block is my bottleneck at the moment, at least under load. Meaning even if I add more rad space I won't see significantly lower load temps.


My ek TR4 Block is A1 With 1 360 and 1 240 ... What pump & what TIM are you using ?


----------



## Simmons572

I'm ready to be added to the club!



This is the current state of my build. Once I get the XSPC waterblock, I will clean this up quite a bit.









Specs:

Threadripper 1900x
Asus X399-A Prime
G.Skill - Trident Z 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200
Asus 980 ti Matrix

I also installed the reservoir in the rear of the case, in preparation for the loop. More pics in my build log if you all are interested!


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Correction.
> 
> This is where ln2 comes in


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> yeah I'd like to see some of these 4.0+ghz 1.4v+ oveclocks post some p95 small ftt (8k-8k with >90% ram load) stable overclocks with temps included. pretty sure nobody will get a stable run of more than 4 hours...


A few of us probably could









But 1.4 is pretty excessive for this chip. Unless it's a suicide run I don't think I want to run mine that high 24x7 without phase change or something of that nature.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *czin125*
> 
> https://www.gskill.com/en/press/view/g-skill-releases-amd-compatible-trident-z-rgb-kits
> New RGB ram for Threadripper ( they stopped using the flare X design I guess? )


Just a way to charge another 10-20 dollars extra for the same ram. Don't fall for it.


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Just a way to charge another 10-20 dollars extra for the same ram. Don't fall for it.


totally agree


----------



## Particle

I did some tests with firmware 1.50. It doesn't seem to be a hardware issue.

Stock settings: Blender crash
Stock settings, LLC set higher: Blender crash
Stock settings, turbo disabled: Blender crash
Stock settings, turbo disabled, SMT disabled: Blender crash
Stock settings, turbo disabled, SMT disabled, max multiplier set to 22 (2.20 GHz): Blender crash

It's always about 3-5 seconds into the tile based renderer part where it happens.


----------



## sandysuk

I've got the MSI and not had an issue with blender render, not that I know what I am doing with the software.

Anyway, Hello, newb here.

1900x @ 4.1
GSkill RGB 3600 CL16 Samsung B @ 3466 14-15-15-30-51-1T
MSI x399 on 1.5


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> My ek TR4 Block is A1 With 1 360 and 1 240 ... What pump & what TIM are you using ?


Using a D5 PWM at full speed and Artic MX-4.

What temps are you seeing P95 small ffts?


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> I've got the MSI and not had an issue with blender render, not that I know what I am doing with the software.
> 
> Anyway, Hello, newb here.
> 
> 1900x @ 4.1
> GSkill RGB 3600 CL16 Samsung B @ 3466 14-15-15-30-51-1T
> MSI x399 on 1.5


Not knowing where the issues lies exactly, I'm not sure if the 1900X is affected. You can try it though if you'd like. I can do the Ryzen demo for instance without any incident, but the production demo causes Blender to crash every time.

https://download.blender.org/demo/test/benchmark.zip


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Using a D5 PWM at full speed and Artic MX-4.
> 
> What temps are you seeing P95 small ffts?


I find that Prime 95 Is a bit unrealistic of a load I use aida64 Cpu Fpu and Cache I get a Max Of 66 after 36 Hours


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I did some tests with firmware 1.50. It doesn't seem to be a hardware issue.
> 
> Stock settings: Blender crash
> Stock settings, LLC set higher: Blender crash
> Stock settings, turbo disabled: Blender crash
> Stock settings, turbo disabled, SMT disabled: Blender crash
> Stock settings, turbo disabled, SMT disabled, max multiplier set to 22 (2.20 GHz): Blender crash
> 
> It's always about 3-5 seconds into the tile based renderer part where it happens.


i do not know if it related but i was getting crashes and slow times on blender so i grabbed whatever was the latest, uninstalled the old one and simply ran blender from the folder without installing and no more issues...again not sure if its the same thing.
blender-2.79-rc2-windows64

is the one i grabbed


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> I'm ready to be added to the club!
> 
> 
> 
> This is the current state of my build. Once I get the XSPC waterblock, I will clean this up quite a bit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Specs:
> 
> Threadripper 1900x
> Asus X399-A Prime
> G.Skill - Trident Z 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200
> Asus 980 ti Matrix
> 
> I also installed the reservoir in the rear of the case, in preparation for the loop. More pics in my build log if you all are interested!






noice
now go run the kraytace bench for us (links in the thread somewhere







)seems there is only a 1900x with dual channel ram i,m dying to see what benefits quad gives...if any








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> I find that Prime 95 Is a bit unrealistic of a load I use aida64 Cpu Fpu and Cache I get a Max Of 66 after 36 Hours


i find none of them by themselves are any real good especially artificial ones what chew does seems the most vicious method i basically start with cb15 cpuz bench then real bench 2.54 and move up fro there with the rendering benches i generally leave gooseberry till last as that's nasty









if that all goes well i will fire up prime 95 and the other waterboarding tests.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> I find that Prime 95 Is a bit unrealistic of a load I use aida64 Cpu Fpu and Cache I get a Max Of 66 after 36 Hours


It depends what you use your computer for. I use mine to solve some pretty complex stuff, and even though my chip is aida64 stable, it crashes in the solving software I use. So I rely on P95 to find my stable point


----------



## chew*

We are using aegis photoscan professional. It uses gpu cpu and mem and thrashes it hard non stop. A project can take days.

Thus we stress test mission critical.

2 days in then a crash is 2 days of lost work.

Like i said. For those that bought TR with the full intent to use it as it was intended...I do not realistically see 1.4v and higher as a 24/7 voltage

We have crashed trying p states and letting cpu go up down...which it does a whole hell of alot of running this.
Solution just run a fixxed OC.

We have crashed due to hitting a mem limit. Simple solution add 64gb more.

Fyi the memory needed for this project costs more than TR.

Anyway to each his own we all play our roles. Mine is tuning mission critical systems and I need to roll with what I know is reliable not what I think is reliable.

Fyi @ 1.2v @ 3.8 i am seeing 5c less than prime 95 and only 3c from AMD specced safe range









Im on a swiftech h220x2 with a apogeee drive x2.

Fans are not stock...quite loud and annoying.

Copper rad vs alum on crap aio...plenty of pump power and a very large surface area on coldplate over dies.

We can improve temps...i am willing to bet with an aio we can not however.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> We are using aegis photoscan professional. It uses gpu cpu and mem and thrashes it hard non stop. A project can take days.
> 
> Thus we stress test mission critical.
> 
> 2 days in then a crash is 2 days of lost work.
> 
> Like i said. For those that bought TR with the full intent to use it as it was intended...I do not realistically see 1.4v and higher as a 24/7 voltage.


+1 I dont much like having lost a full days work of solving myself. Especially since I run my computer hard almost 24/7. On top of that, having 1.4v+ and 70c+ constantly will likely result in degradation of the chip as time goes on. Reliability is key for me.

For people who game or are just enthusiasts, I guess you can run it as high as you want for bragging rights, since gaming will never stress your computer hard. At the end of the day, failing p95 probably doesnt mean much if you are not a content producer using cpu intensive software.


----------



## The L33t

You should probably be running ECC then.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> You should probably be running ECC then.


Probably should....but ecc is A. More expensive.

B. Specced for 2400.

C much slower and ryzen needs the higher speed to hit the performance we want.

If your anal at tuning and stress testing ecc is not needed...just run a stable tune...

This is the benefit of TR. Getting server grade performance without server grade parts that have some flexibility with clocks and tuning.


----------



## The L33t

Understandable, yet you can overclock ECC ram on this platform like some already do while retaining it's function of error correction.

But yeah, you cannot really escape it's price, specially now days... crazy pricing.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> Understandable, yet you can overclock ECC ram on this platform like some already do while retaining it's function of error correction.
> 
> But yeah, you cannot really escape it's price, specially now days... crazy pricing.


Yah i went and looked at prices and did some research.

I was like wow...might as well just stick with the b die 3400 16-16-16 bin...at least I know it works and what expectations to have from it.

The saving grace is we are in 64gb @ around $500 range due to my bargain hunting.

Even if we pay full price we are ahead of the game on another 64gb.

Thx to gupsterg i am another $200 ahead of game on waterblocks for fury x's but thats just my personal system.

This system will be running quadros or at least i think thats what he is loading in it.

We are just using mine to tax psu, board, pci lanes for now.

Got about another week to get it dialed in perfect before it goes from demo use to full 24/7 use.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Hard ocp did a write up on a byski and xspc block on xspcs flagship double thick 480 rad.
> 
> Long story short 75-76c @ 1.4xx peak temps in prime 95
> 
> So basically if not 68c or less not a voltage I would run for 24/7 mission critical.
> 
> Thx for posting by the way i was guesstimating 3066 for 128g but unsure.
> 
> We already ran out of mem with 64g on a project which btw eats all 32 threads and is seeing temps like prime after hours of running.
> 
> Basically if you use the system the way it was intended...prime is realistic.


Which Prime test do you run and how long?


----------



## chew*

Version 29.1

24 hour passes.

Tick blend then custom then enter in a mb value.

Iirc i had to drop to 54000mb when looping heaven or I ran out of memory and app crashed due to lack of memory.

I highly suggest if looping heaven creating a custom fan curve as the gpu can get toasty in 24 hr passes.

I leave sound on an up. If it starts to crackle its a sign of instability.

Run windowed but it wont stress multi gpu setups..but gives you ability to monitor everything.

Still not a perfect test but its damn close.

Combined with heaven you want about 89% memory use in task manager at start...it will creep up as it runs.

Will have to play with it based on amount of ram installed.

Black screen of death = more vcore.

Frozen on destop = to hot.

Drop threads ( cpu utilization drops from 100% ) core drops out of prime = imc/ memory if really unstable alot will drop out followed by a windows has encountered ertors blue screen of memory instability death.

Anyway hope this helps.

Edit. Common failure points.

8k core unstable
12k core unstable

Etc etc low ks = core

512k imc/mem unstable
896k imc/mem unstable

Etc etc high Ks = imc/mem

You can cutom target iterations later to verify you solved an error later on and just loop a specific iteration.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Version 29.1
> 
> 24 hour passes.
> 
> Tick blend then custom then enter in a mb value.
> 
> Iirc i had to drop to 54000mb when looping heaven or I ran out of memory and app crashed due to lack of memory.
> 
> I highly suggest if looping heaven creating a custom fan curve as the gpu can get toasty in 24 hr passes.
> 
> I leave sound on an up. If it starts to crackle its a sign of instability.
> 
> Run windowed but it wont stress multi gpu setups..but gives you ability to monitor everything.
> 
> Still not a perfect test but its damn close.
> 
> Combined with heaven you want about 89% memory use in task manager at start...it will creep up as it runs.
> 
> Will have to play with it based on amount of ram installed.
> 
> Black screen of death = more vcore.
> 
> Frozen on destop = to hot.
> 
> Drop threads ( cpu utilization drops from 100% ) core drops out of prime = imc/ memory if really unstable alot will drop out followed by a windows has encountered ertors blue screen of memory instability death.
> 
> Anyway hope this helps.
> 
> Edit. Common failure points.
> 
> 8k core unstable
> 12k core unstable
> 
> Etc etc low ks = core
> 
> 512k imc/mem unstable
> 896k imc/mem unstable
> 
> Etc etc high Ks = imc/mem
> 
> You can cutom target iterations later to verify you solved an error later on and just loop a specific iteration.


i just want to add one thing to this in my testing i never get black screen BUT i do get frozen desktop and it is because i have not given it enough juice, every single time.
tested this ad infinitum and the results are always the same, temps are not an issue but voltage is.

as for the dropped threads i agree with that to a point in regards to my tests....if it is not *quite there* it will throttle usage but not speed in my case giving results all over the place but unless i have not given it anywhere near enough juice it will not crash, and when it does crash it is always a locked screen.
with this setup the only time ever i have had a blue screen is when i did a clean install of the crimson drivers and didn't immediately on reboot redo the chipset drivers and tried other usb3 drivers.
other than that neve had a blue screen.

but as has been said over and over every machine is different some run product a anti virus or security some run none and use windows defender or nothing at all some have version a video card drivers etc etc etc.

also now i remember what else you run







and is there a case where say prime fails but heaven goes on or heaven locks up prime keeps going?

and lastly in regards to the AIO scenario i have a h115i and i am going on record as saying it is a brilliant cooler matched up with 2k varder fans (running 1.5k though) and while it was cool here could happily and stably run 4G @ 1.35 only super hard apps would push it past 70
but and its a big Kardashian but.
as soon as it hit 30 degrees in this room the efficiency just is not there the surface area is just not quite enough to pull the heat away, the enermax probably would do a better job but i seriously do not think on a 30 plus day it will keep up even with the bigger plate.

to put all this in to context i live in the mountains and in summer it can hit 40/45 degrees up here when that happens i can see this falling over pretty quick.

the only safe (and i use that term loosely) is a tuned up custom loop and i am so hoping what i have gotten will do the job.

so as an experiment load up your clocks ambient room temp cooling and temp results idle(normal windows) and load whatever app that is.

lets see what the deltas are.

i,ll start
stock clocks 3200 am
ambient 30 degrees (oh by the way that is with the aircon on...turn it off it will be 36 in here)
idle (few windows open etc) 35
load (quick couple of cb15 just in case it falls on its sword) 54

h115i ek varder 2k fans @1.5k

i will post this then run nasty scary tests for a real full load


----------



## chew*

heaven will crackle sound first then appcrash or throttle fps depending on if its plaform or vga. which you can usually find by reading error reports in windows. etc driver crash.

here is some real world use of threadripper by someone that actually can use threadripper......I know I can't so I got someone who can.

65C in the real world on water @ 3.8 1.2v.

Obviously we plan on improving the water setup so we can try 1.3v and whatever we can get stable around there.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> heaven will crackle sound first then appcrash or throttle fps depending on if its plaform or vga. which you can usually find by reading error reports in windows. etc driver crash.
> 
> here is some real world use of threadripper by someone that actually can use threadripper......I know I can't so I got someone who can.
> 
> 65C in the real world on water @ 3.8 1.2v.






you know...you are absolutely right and it did









first time crashed prime in like 3 seconds
changed the ram settings
prime runs fine heaven explodes.
that and the temps went throw the roof (well very quickly to 68 and eventually a hard lock screen.

ok so i, m doing this right prime 95 blend/custom up the ram to 54000
and have heaven looping.
oh and did i mention how much i hate you...i was happy before floating around in the matrix...then you and your red dress come in and screw it up for me









rant ended...ok when i run those 2 things what should i expect to happen (i read above the bad stuff) should it just loop smooth and churdle on?

addendum
i,m a friggen moron

putting 54000 for me would be a really bad thing since i only have 32 gig of ram

friggen hot weather,,,,

lets try that all again...shall we


----------



## chew*

Should just chug away and still be able to skype check forums do odds and ends.


----------



## chew*

Here is real world use of memory.....no crashes.....riding the fine line here.....really need that 128gb.....


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Not knowing where the issues lies exactly, I'm not sure if the 1900X is affected. You can try it though if you'd like. I can do the Ryzen demo for instance without any incident, but the production demo causes Blender to crash every time.
> 
> https://download.blender.org/demo/test/benchmark.zip


I've ran that benchmark, got bored at 20mins, looks like it's going to run for twice that time, not very quick, I've read that 1700X owner is doing 28mins mine looks double that.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> noice
> now go run the kraytace bench for us (links in the thread somewhere
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )seems there is only a 1900x with dual channel ram i,m dying to see what benefits quad gives...if any


They are my results on that benchmark, I'd be interested to see the impact of Quad too, hopefully after I RMA my defective RAM I can run the same settings with 32Gb.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

So I have just ordered my new build. Luckily I only needed the Mobo,CPU and RAM.

I like many ordered the following.

1. Asus Zenith Extreme

2. Threadripper 1950X

3. 32GB Corsair DDR4 3600Mhz

Very much looking forward to getting this build up and running and then moving onto the OC. Admittedly a massive noob at AMD Overclocking as I have been in the Intel camp for a long while...but no more ! Once I get build I will get some pictures and see what temps are like with my Corsair H115i AIO and Grizzly Kryonaut TIM.


----------



## Kryton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> So I have just ordered my new build. Luckily I only needed the Mobo,CPU and RAM.
> 
> I like many ordered the following.
> 
> 1. Asus Zenith Extreme
> 2. Threadripper 1950X
> 3. 32GB Corsair DDR4 3600Mhz
> 
> Very much looking forward to getting this build up and running and then moving onto the OC. Admittedly a massive noob at AMD Overclocking as I have been in the Intel camp for a long while...but no more ! Once I get build I will get some pictures and see what temps are like with my Corsair H115i AIO and Grizzly Kryonaut TIM.


I believe once you get into it you'll love it.
It's been said the TR's have a massive wattage draw and I'm not doubting it at all - Hopefully your current PSU will be up to task but if not, you know what to do.


----------



## happyluckbox

So I'd really like to somehow get 3200 mhz stable on my threadripper 1950x system. Currently, I'm running 128gbs of gskill tridentz currently at 3060mhz 14-14-14-34 2T.
I know its already really good for 128gbs of ram, but I feel like getting to 3200mhz would be a real accomplishment. I've been able to post using cldo_vddp at 950mv, but it's really unstable. (instantly drops worker threads in p95) Any ideas on what is the best voltage I can increase to target the IMC (im guessing this is the weakpoint?) Also, as I understand it, the IMC is built into threadripper and not the motherboard correct? Or is this feat simply not possible, and if that's the case, will future agesa updates help, or is the IMC hardware simply being stressed to the maximum?


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So I'd really like to somehow get 3200 mhz stable on my threadripper 1950x system. Currently, I'm running 128gbs of gskill tridentz currently at 3060mhz 14-14-14-34 2T.
> I know its already really good for 128gbs of ram, but I feel like getting to 3200mhz would be a real accomplishment. I've been able to post using cldo_vddp at 950mv, but it's really unstable. (instantly drops worker threads in p95) Any ideas on what is the best voltage I can increase to target the IMC (im guessing this is the weakpoint?) Also, as I understand it, the IMC is built into threadripper and not the motherboard correct? Or is this feat simply not possible, and if that's the case, will future agesa updates help, or is the IMC hardware simply being stressed to the maximum?


Do you have one 128GB kit or 2x64GB kits?

Combining kits is sometimes trouble. More trouble with 32+ memory.


----------



## gupsterg

@chew*

I'd concur I'm seeing the same thing with P95 concerning what test set is used. +rep for info







.

I have also found P95 handy to boost x cores by using x threads, when using CPU stock and testing RAM tweaks. Again some other stress tests 'we' may use don't allow that kind of testing.

So P95 is defo part of my test regime.

@happyluckbox

Are you changing CLDO_VDDP as you have memory hole at frequency or just because?

Dunno about TR but would assume same as Ryzen. 950mV was stock CLDO_VDDP for Ryzen on C6H.

ProcODT helps with post as well as OS stabilty for RAM. CAD Bus is another set of parameters that will help stabilise RAM in OS.

So I'd meddle with those besides SOC/VDIMM/Timings.

Using GearDown Mode has helped some on Ryzen, so another setting to try.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeliosDoubleSix*
> 
> Any software designed to test latency?
> 
> Just running ATTO with 512B transfer size and when targeting secondary partition I get 36773 Write 38687 Read on CPU 31, and 39936 / 41088 on CPU 0, so like a 6% bump with tiny files, but almost no relative diff with larger transfers
> 
> This is when using bottom most M.2 on MSI Gaming Carbon Mobo
> 
> For completeness the boot partition on CPU 0 gets 36899/40320
> 
> So seems like diff is negligible, seems like any latency issues really only trouble GPU's
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Just a FYI. gaming performance us dependent on what cores the game runs on and what slot the GPU is install in. The first x16 slot connects to the PCIE controller that is located on die 0 and is supported locally by CPU 0 - CPU15 on an 1950X, CPU0-cpu11 on 1920X and CPU0-CPU7 on 1900X (as reported by the windows performance monitor). In UWA mode, Assuming that the GPU is in slot 1, setting the affinity for the game to the lower range CPUs or changing to game mode improves game performance because the graphics traffic does not have to travel across the Infinity Fabric and incur the additional latency penalty.
> 
> In case you are still mystified. A Thread ripper package has two silicon blocks on board called a dies. In each die on a 1950X, there are 8 of the 16 physical cores, a dual channel memory controller and a PCIe controller that supplies the system with 32 lanes of PCIe. The two dies together give you the stated specs that AMD publishes about the chips. Any time something on one die needs to access something on or connected to the other die, there is an additional latency penalty incurred because of the time it takes for the data to travel between the dies. Best performance comes from managing the workload, limiting the amount of cross die traffic like switching threads, accessing memory on the other memory controller or using the graphics card that is connected to the other die. You will get best performance if you ensure that as many discrete jobs as possible are connected locally to the memory and PCIe devices that it is using.
> 
> Multithreaded applications parallelize workloads by typically having a main thread that controls everything and worker threads that do piece work. It is then the job of the main thread to combine all the pieces back together at the end to provide the full end result.
> 
> I understand that these x399 boards have 4 slots and if running four GPUs will run at x16, x8 x16 x8 as the slots move away from the socket. I understand that the 2nd slot is only x8. If slot 1 is obstructed by a cooler, I suggest that you move the GPU to slot 3 which should support all x16 lanes but will connect locally to the 2nd die and the high numbered CPU cores. If your only GPU is installed in that 3rd slot, setting affinity (affinity means telling windows to run an application on a particular CPU core or cores) for games to CPU16-CPU31 should provide you with the best performance.
> 
> As an extension to that comment above. The different m.2 sockets on x399 will also be connected to the different PCIe controllers on both dies. They will not all be to the same controller so that means that the performance for boot drives will depend on what m.2 slot you are using. If you selected a slot that connects to the PCIe controller that is not local to the die that the operating system threads are running on, your performance will be reduced any time the system or drivers try to access the drive as there is the extra latency incurred by travelling over the between die fabric before it gets to the connected PCIe controller. I am not sure if the manual details what PCIe controller supports what m.2 socket. It should recommend the best slot to use for boot drives somewhere. If it doesn't say anything, you can do some simple trial and error tests to identify which controller you have connected the drive to. Install it in a different slot and see if it performs differently than the one it is in now.
Click to expand...

aida64 will do latency tests. Not sure if it has been updated to properly support TR as yet.

SISandra has many cache and memory latency tests

The Intel memory latency checker should also work, that will report on numa nodes and cache to cache latencies as well.

https://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/intelr-memory-latency-checker


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So I'd really like to somehow get 3200 mhz stable on my threadripper 1950x system. Currently, I'm running 128gbs of gskill tridentz currently at 3060mhz 14-14-14-34 2T.
> I know its already really good for 128gbs of ram, but I feel like getting to 3200mhz would be a real accomplishment. I've been able to post using cldo_vddp at 950mv, but it's really unstable. (instantly drops worker threads in p95) Any ideas on what is the best voltage I can increase to target the IMC (im guessing this is the weakpoint?) Also, as I understand it, the IMC is built into threadripper and not the motherboard correct? Or is this feat simply not possible, and if that's the case, will future agesa updates help, or is the IMC hardware simply being stressed to the maximum?


Its all about the fabric once you go crazy with dual rank and capacity.

the ram is capable.

I have yet to figure out how to make the fabric better than it is.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kryton*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> So I have just ordered my new build. Luckily I only needed the Mobo,CPU and RAM.
> 
> I like many ordered the following.
> 
> 1. Asus Zenith Extreme
> 2. Threadripper 1950X
> 3. 32GB Corsair DDR4 3600Mhz
> 
> Very much looking forward to getting this build up and running and then moving onto the OC. Admittedly a massive noob at AMD Overclocking as I have been in the Intel camp for a long while...but no more ! Once I get build I will get some pictures and see what temps are like with my Corsair H115i AIO and Grizzly Kryonaut TIM.
> 
> 
> 
> I believe once you get into it you'll love it.
> It's been said the TR's have a massive wattage draw and I'm not doubting it at all - Hopefully your current PSU will be up to task but if not, you know what to do.
Click to expand...

Yeah I don't doubt it bud.

My PSU will be fine. I have the Antec 1300Watt Platinum, never skimp on the PSU...it is more than I need but more is better in this case.


----------



## robtorbay

Anyone here have a Gigabyte x399 mobo and know how to enable BLK overclocking? My BLK speeds are locked at 100... can't edit the setting!

Thanks!


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> I've ran that benchmark, got bored at 20mins, looks like it's going to run for twice that time, not very quick, I've read that 1700X owner is doing 28mins mine looks double that.


Interesting result that it doesn't have an issue for you. For the record though, a 1950X should take mid-20s, so a 1700X owner claiming essentially the same is unlikely to be giving an accurate account.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> somehow i am stable 1.29V @ 4.0Ghz Max temp 58 (Custom loop Ek Wb)


which board?


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robtorbay*
> 
> Anyone here have a Gigabyte x399 mobo and know how to enable BLK overclocking? My BLK speeds are locked at 100... can't edit the setting!
> 
> Thanks!


Currently no support for bclk overclocking on x399


----------



## Bm514

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> somehow i am stable 1.29V @ 4.0Ghz Max temp 58 (Custom loop Ek Wb)
> 
> 
> 
> which board?
Click to expand...

X399 aorus gaming 7

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk


----------



## robtorbay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Currently no support for bclk overclocking on x399


Thanks for the reply, I was assuming this was the case but when I seen the new x399 mobo from ASUS I which states it has full BLK OC I was thinking maybe a bios update to come.

Cheers!


----------



## robtorbay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bm514*
> 
> X399 aorus gaming 7
> 
> Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk


Using the same MOBO @ 1.35 sitting at 4.1 with max temps of 61 under load. Pretty impressed to be honest!


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robtorbay*
> 
> Using the same MOBO @ 1.35 sitting at 4.1 with max temps of 61 under load. Pretty impressed to be honest!


On a 1950x?


----------



## robtorbay

1900x, sorry forgot to add that detail in. 3


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> @chew*
> 
> I'd concur I'm seeing the same thing with P95 concerning what test set is used. +rep for info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> I have also found P95 handy to boost x cores by using x threads, when using CPU stock and testing RAM tweaks. Again some other stress tests 'we' may use don't allow that kind of testing.
> 
> So P95 is defo part of my test regime.
> 
> @happyluckbox
> 
> Are you changing CLDO_VDDP as you have memory hole at frequency or just because?
> 
> Dunno about TR but would assume same as Ryzen. 950mV was stock CLDO_VDDP for Ryzen on C6H.
> 
> ProcODT helps with post as well as OS stabilty for RAM. CAD Bus is another set of parameters that will help stabilise RAM in OS.
> 
> So I'd meddle with those besides SOC/VDIMM/Timings.
> 
> Using GearDown Mode has helped some on Ryzen, so another setting to try.


Yes I have to change cldo_vddp otherwise it wont post at 3200mhz.

I currently have proc odt at 66, I tried other numbers but none seemed to stabilize it. I will try messing with cad bus. Gear down mode I have it set to disabled so that I can run 2T command rate.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Interesting result that it doesn't have an issue for you. For the record though, a 1950X should take mid-20s, so a 1700X owner claiming essentially the same is unlikely to be giving an accurate account.


sorry is that the gooseberry blender one...evil bastard...my best was 23 minutes i think its up here somewhere BUT i need to kill my blender installa nd run the 2.79 version form the folder/open the demo and run it that way (same for the other blenders as well)

also in other news 3dmark sucks








it updated and screwed me up what i thought was a cpu issue with a lockup was it's stupide system info crashing and that was because it could not update to the new one and thought it was the old one so i had to go through a backup get the old msi file to uninstall and reinstall (works now though) so yet again software makes me doubt my cpu....stupid 3dmark.

oh and as for the CHEW challenge i threw up a gauntlet on another forum see how many psychos are out there ready for waterboarding the cpu


----------



## Aenra

I just want to know what requires 26 days for 16 cores to complete, that's all i need to know


----------



## outofmyheadyo

What is the point of the threadripper 1900X?
Wouldnt it just more reasonable to buy the 1700/1800x?


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> What is the point of the threadripper 1900X?
> Wouldnt it just more reasonable to buy the 1700/1800x?


Not really my old system was a z77 with PLX chip running 3x GPUs, NVMe SSDs and raided SSDs etc, modern non HEDT platforms from Intel/AMD don't have the lanes for that unless I pay over 400quid for the odd z270 board that has PLX, when you are faced with that a cheap TR system with all the lanes covers all bases.

The only downside to TR is that its single core performance isn't that strong but I have been able to match my 4.7Ghz Ivy Bridge with TR @ 4.1, so I've not lost anything and gained a better system with more cores into the bargain, added to that AMD have discussed an upgrade path, Intel tends to obselete platforms very quickly, a couple of years in I brokem my system and couldn't find replacement bits without buying second hand.

That said I would probably have bought Intels low end chip on their HEDT platform for performance in games as it is the better chip but they chose rather stupidly to give it 16 lanes or something odd and of course when you hear the next chip down the pipe will need yet another chipset you question whether I want to buy another dead end platform.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> What is the point of the threadripper 1900X?
> Wouldnt it just more reasonable to buy the 1700/1800x?


PCI-E lanes and quad channel. Supposedly better chip binning. There is a 2p socket EPYC 8c as well.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> PCI-E lanes and quad channel. Supposedly better chip binning. There is a 2p socket EPYC 8c as well.


watching this thread and others I've seen more people hit 4.2ghz on the 1900x than the 1800x.... also what he said above ^ about the pcie lanes and memory being quad channel


----------



## outofmyheadyo

What are you guys testing your 4.2ghz overclocks with ? For some reason siliconlottery only sells 3.95ghz 1950x not even 4ghz.


----------



## sandysuk

Outside of overclocking, if you just ran the stock, the 1900x has faster base and faster boost clocks, it also boosts more cores than the 1800x

for my 1900x 4.2 needs quite a bit of voltage, 4.1 is the sweet spot.


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Outside of overclocking, if you just ran the stock, the 1900x has faster base and faster boost clocks, it also boosts more cores than the 1800x


Indeed







, but I think there is a case where the boosting isn't gonna happen as we would think.

Stock 1950X does not do 3.7GHz on all cores, even under WC on CineBench 15.



It does ~3.5xGHz, I believe it hits power limit. A 1800X will do 3.7GHz all cores.

Threadripper does do more cores as ~4.0GHz/+ but that's only 1 real core and 1 SMT per node = 4 threads max, see third screenie in this post. To me it seems unless an app specifically choose to use each CPU, just for 2 threads each, you're unlikely to benefit from extra boosting.

I would believe a 1900X also exhibits same behavior, due to how it is, link.

1800X can do 1 real and 1 SMT ~3.9GHz/+ and I believe you are more likely to benefit from boosting on R7.


----------



## sandysuk

1900x is 3.8Ghz base/4.0 boost, I can't test mine to confirm for a few days as I have just shipped my RAM back but I'm sure my 1900x was doing 3.9 all core and boost upto over 4Ghz without any messing from me.

base of 1950x is 3.4Ghz so its not surprising it drops.

Might be some default core boosting in the MSI BIOS as I didn't get much of a boost in benchmark performance when I locked it all to 4Ghz.


----------



## gupsterg

No worries not disputing your info







. More saw wanting to see some test info







, as there is lack of info when I was looking around







.

When I read reviews of TR 1950X and it highlighted 4 threads of say 4GHz+ I was like WOW cool. When I then went and tested it and find I need to have threads on differing CPU nodes I was like WOOT







.

When you have your rig up and running again I'd be interested in testing as I did in previously linked post using Statuscore.

Again just looking for real user experience as sometimes reviews, etc don't have what we may want to know







.

Thanks in advance and will appreciate your time in testing and sharing, cheers







.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> Indeed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , but I think there is a case where the boosting isn't gonna happen as we would think.
> 
> Stock 1950X does not do 3.7GHz on all cores, even under WC on CineBench 15.
> 
> 
> 
> It does ~3.5xGHz, I believe it hits power limit. A 1800X will do 3.7GHz all cores.
> 
> Threadripper does do more cores as ~4.0GHz/+ but that's only 1 real core and 1 SMT per node = 4 threads max, see third screenie in this post. To me it seems unless an app specifically choose to use each CPU, just for 2 threads each, you're unlikely to benefit from extra boosting.
> 
> I would believe a 1900X also exhibits same behavior, due to how it is, link.





1800X can do 1 real and 1 SMT ~3.9GHz/+ and I believe you are more likely to benefit from boosting on R7.

have a rep for that shot you just showed me the boost is better if you keep it say 50 degrees or so mine will alternate quite a bit.
as for the boosting it can help in games and things like 3d mark....your physics will be a bit lower but the games like the 4.1 a lot. so unless you get up to 4g and don't do a lot of all core work stock is fine just keep it cool.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> No worries not disputing your info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . More saw wanting to see some test info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , as there is lack of info when I was looking around
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> When I read reviews of TR 1950X and it highlighted 4 threads of say 4GHz+ I was like WOW cool. When I then went and tested it and find I need to have threads on differing CPU nodes I was like WOOT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> When you have your rig up and running again I'd be interested in testing as I did in previously linked post using Statuscore.
> 
> Again just looking for real user experience as sometimes reviews, etc don't have what we may want to know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Thanks in advance and will appreciate your time in testing and sharing, cheers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .





here you go mine seems lower but again you do not seem to be going past 50 degrees whereas i am.... so yeah i,m still guessing its a temperature thing.


----------



## SavantStrike

90 percebt sustained load and 50-52c on the chip. Bykski did a decent job. I'm not sure I can't drop that anther degree or two with a new TIM application.

Waterboarding and p95 torture tests to come. I'll make sure the boilers grinding and load up all 4 1080 TIs at the same time. Good thing I'm on a 20 amp outlet, and good thing I'm on a 1920x or I wouldn't have enough PSU.


----------



## Particle

For the record folks, "real" is very imprecise and sort of misleading terminology when referring to execution paths on an SMT enabled processor. Each physical core presents as two (or more) logical cores, and all of those logical cores for any given physical core (which we usually refer to as threads) are completely equal to each other. They all just feed the pipeline in that particular core.


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Each physical core presents as two (or more) logical cores


Care to elaborate on "more"?


----------



## chris89




----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Care to elaborate on "more"?


SMT designs don't have to be two-way. It's just a duplication of front ends on cores that work to cooperatively keep the pipeline as full as possible. Three or four is just as valid as two. Some big iron designs use more. The POWER8 for instance features 8 threads per core.


----------



## tarot

ok just a quick follow up on nvme drives.
got a whole pile of watercooling gear but daughters new baby is here so i have been shoved downstairs so cooling will have to wait a little








but did get the EK nvme heat sink and managed to wrangle that on.

before



after (also please note the drive 2 temps did actually hit 82 at what stage in i thinks atto234 but i reset hwinfo)



as you can see a bit of performance gained and temps dropped quite a bit...23 degrees on drive 2 to be exact so well worth the 18 bucks i think


----------



## gupsterg

@Particle

+rep







.

Thank you for info in real / SMT







. I guess where I read info about this was essentially dumbed down to make sense to how people commonly refer to this aspect







. I shall endeavor to improve my method of post when discussing this aspect







.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> here you go mine seems lower but again you do not seem to be going past 50 degrees whereas i am.... so yeah i,m still guessing its a temperature thing.


+rep for taking time to test and share







.

Your temps are pretty much the same as mine







. For that instance in time, when you took the screenie your tDIE is ~54.6C for node 0, node 1 is not in screenshot.

I was at ~55C







.



What we must be seeing is core variance on clockability. I did test each core separately I'll try and find that data or repeat test it. Be interesting to see your test data when you have time







.


----------



## Z-O-M-B-I-E

Hi, I want to build a new system on the TR4 platform instead of the old AM3 + (FX-8350). The choice fell on the 1900X processor.

I need advice on which motherboard to choose, as well as RAM.

At the moment I'm leaning towards Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7, is it good?

And there are questions about RAM. As I understand one of the best for Ryzen is GSkill? And what is the optimal frequency? 3200, 3600?

I would like to hear your opinions and advice.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z-O-M-B-I-E*
> 
> Hi, I want to build a new system on the TR4 platform instead of the old AM3 + (FX-8350). The choice fell on the 1900X processor.
> 
> I need advice on which motherboard to choose, as well as RAM.
> 
> At the moment I'm leaning towards Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7, is it good?
> 
> And there are questions about RAM. As I understand one of the best for Ryzen is GSkill? And what is the optimal frequency? 3200, 3600?
> 
> I would like to hear your opinions and advice.


Anything based on Samsung K4A8G085WB chips should work nicely. Commonly referred to as "B die" for the last digit in that model number. There is a list

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/62vp2g/clearing_up_any_samsung_bdie_confusion_eg_on/
. Ymmv with regards to stable memory frequencies, and I understand that the benefit trails off after the 3200 speed grade. It's up to you for how much cost that last few percent is worth to you. I've not heard much on that particular motherboard, so I can't comment with respect to that component.


----------



## gupsterg

@Z-O-M-B-I-E

If you can find F4-3600C15D-16GTZ that is the best bin IMO. Next best is F4-3200C14D-16GTZ. These are 2x 8GB kits, single rank and sided and Samsung B die, what Ryzen/ThreadRipper favors.

This thread has IC info. From member shares and info from The Stilt, on Ryzen/ThreadRipper 4x 8GB SR SS can be easier to tame for higher speed / tweaks than dual rank / double sided RAM 16GB dimms.

Again YMMV which ever way you roll, but best bet is 1st highlighted.

Like Particle said after 3200MHz 'data fabric' bottle neck has been solved and latency comes into play. The Stilt and Chew have shown data to support this, AMD also has an article on community site.

The Stilt's data is in OP of the Ryzen thread in my signature, Is RAM MHz King? section. I have to add Chew data, this can be found in Ryzen owners thread.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> Interesting result that it doesn't have an issue for you. For the record though, a 1950X should take mid-20s, so a 1700X owner claiming essentially the same is unlikely to be giving an accurate account.
> 
> 
> 
> sorry is that the gooseberry blender one...evil bastard...my best was 23 minutes i think its up here somewhere BUT i need to kill my blender installa nd run the 2.79 version form the folder/open the demo and run it that way (same for the other blenders as well)
> 
> also in other news 3dmark sucks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it updated and screwed me up what i thought was a cpu issue with a lockup was it's stupide system info crashing and that was because it could not update to the new one and thought it was the old one so i had to go through a backup get the old msi file to uninstall and reinstall (works now though) so yet again software makes me doubt my cpu....stupid 3dmark.
> 
> oh and as for the CHEW challenge i threw up a gauntlet on another forum see how many psychos are out there ready for waterboarding the cpu
Click to expand...

If you install 3dmark and then install the 3dmark VR benchmark afterwards, it seems to screw things up with sysinfo. you can uninstall sysinfo and then reinstall using the msi file in the application directory and that can often fix the problem.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> If you install 3dmark and then install the 3dmark VR benchmark afterwards, it seems to screw things up with sysinfo. you can uninstall sysinfo and then reinstall using the msi file in the application directory and that can often fix the problem.






hi thanks for that but in my case it was because i have a steam version as well for some reason







and it updated and removed the 620 msi file so i had to grab an older copy from a backup.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> @Particle
> 
> +rep
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Thank you for info in real / SMT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I guess where I read info about this was essentially dumbed down to make sense to how people commonly refer to this aspect
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I shall endeavor to improve my method of post when discussing this aspect
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> +rep for taking time to test and share
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Your temps are pretty much the same as mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . For that instance in time, when you took the screenie your tDIE is ~54.6C for node 0, node 1 is not in screenshot.
> 
> I was at ~55C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> What we must be seeing is core variance on clockability. I did test each core separately I'll try and find that data or repeat test it. Be interesting to see your test data when you have time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .






ok have a csv with a run using all chips if you want it









Capture_0001.csv 572k .csv file


----------



## Z-O-M-B-I-E

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> @Z-O-M-B-I-E
> 
> If you can find F4-3600C15D-16GTZ that is the best bin IMO. Next best is F4-3200C14D-16GTZ. These are 2x 8GB kits, single rank and sided and Samsung B die, what Ryzen/ThreadRipper favors.
> 
> This thread has IC info. From member shares and info from The Stilt, on Ryzen/ThreadRipper 4x 8GB SR SS can be easier to tame for higher speed / tweaks than dual rank / double sided RAM 16GB dimms.
> 
> Again YMMV which ever way you roll, but best bet is 1st highlighted.
> 
> Like Particle said after 3200MHz 'data fabric' bottle neck has been solved and latency comes into play. The Stilt and Chew have shown data to support this, AMD also has an article on community site.
> 
> The Stilt's data is in OP of the Ryzen thread in my signature, Is RAM MHz King? section. I have to add Chew data, this can be found in Ryzen owners thread.


I want to take a 4x8GB (32Gb) kit. I find F4-3200C14Q-32GTZ and F4-3600C16Q-32GTZR, what will be better? (С15 no have)


----------



## gupsterg

I'd go for F4-3200C14Q-32GTZ, AFAIK would be better than 3600C16.

AFAIK F4-3200C14Q-32GTZ is basically 2 kits of F4-3200C14D-16GTZ.

Depending on which Ryzen CPU sample I used on same board/UEFI/RAM kit I could get ~3500MHz in dual channel with the F4-3200C14D-16GTZ.

ThreadRipper when run in quad channel is two Ryzen memory controllers doing dual channel to give quad channel.

I reckon you'll have good chance of 3333MHz tight and 3466MHz nice timings.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok have a csv with a run using all chips if you want it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Capture_0001.csv 572k .csv file


+rep and thank you







.


----------



## Z-O-M-B-I-E

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> I'd go for F4-3200C14Q-32GTZ, AFAIK would be better than 3600C16.
> 
> AFAIK F4-3200C14Q-32GTZ is basically 2 kits of F4-3200C14D-16GTZ.
> 
> Depending on which Ryzen CPU sample I used on same board/UEFI/RAM kit I could get ~3500MHz in dual channel with the F4-3200C14D-16GTZ.
> 
> ThreadRipper when run in quad channel is two Ryzen memory controllers doing dual channel to give quad channel.
> 
> I reckon you'll have good chance of 3333MHz tight and 3466MHz nice timings.
> +rep and thank you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Thank you. The question about the motherboard is still relevant.


----------



## gupsterg

Sorry I can not comment on that







.

I'm sucker for ASUS boards







, mainly down to liking the UEFI options they have







, besides HW. I have not owned a non ASUS board since 2007, prior that DFI and Abit, others I forget.


----------



## chris89

I was doing some research and I found out the AIDA GPGPU PCIe Memory Read/ Write was on the PCIe slot... The smaller part of the PCIe slot.

It uses +5V & Ground To power the GPU Memory Read Write from the system memory, yet the voltage regulator supplying the power to those pins, overheats only reaching like 70% of the slot Capacity regularly. 30% more or less is being lost from that PCIe slot VRM location. I could cool that specific VRM that supplies the 5 volts to the Memory Read/ Write Pins, but I think it's limited even to the PCIe Specification.

I think that if I solder a red wire to the +5v & Ground directly to the PSU's +5v & Ground, it could completely DeLimit, the PCIe bus entirely.

These slots at PCIe 2.0 is 8GB/s per slot x16 rated by the VRM memory read/write... PCIe 3.0 is rated 16GB/s per slot rated by the "VRM" key word, VRM. Bypass the VRM entirely & delimit the PCIe bus memory read/write & I'm sure FPS would go through the roof.

I'll test this sometime soon.


----------



## TahoeDust

What would you guys say the average max stable overclock for the 1950x?...Ghz and voltage?


----------



## happyluckbox

3.9-4.0ghz 1.35-1.4v


----------



## TrixX

Anyone been using Corsair Dominator RAM for their ThreadRippers?

http://www.corsair.com/en-us/dominator-platinum-series-64gb-4-x-16gb-ddr4-dram-2800mhz-c14-memory-kit-cmd64gx4m4b2800c14#

Kinda looking at getting that kit for mine, just not sure about whether it'll be fully compatible or not. The C14 suggests B-Die, but I haven't seen it appear on the Reddit compatibility thread, however that covers mostly G.Skill anyway. Kinda stuck with Corsair though for choice


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z-O-M-B-I-E*
> 
> Hi, I want to build a new system on the TR4 platform instead of the old AM3 + (FX-8350). The choice fell on the 1900X processor.
> 
> I need advice on which motherboard to choose, as well as RAM.
> 
> At the moment I'm leaning towards Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7, is it good?
> 
> And there are questions about RAM. As I understand one of the best for Ryzen is GSkill? And what is the optimal frequency? 3200, 3600?
> 
> I would like to hear your opinions and advice.


Gups answered the ram.

As far as motherboard i will plead no contest and will not suggest any brand over another even more so since i am working with a company.

I will say. Buy based on features that fits your use best and do not pay extra for features you will not use.

@ gups. My fury x blocks/backplates arrived. Much better quality than I thought it would be even @ msrp. At the 50% off killer deal.... Now if only I had the time to work on my pc.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Gups answered the ram.
> 
> As far as motherboard i will plead no contest and will not suggest any brand over another even more so since i am working with a company.
> 
> I will say. Buy based on features that fits your use best and do not pay extra for features you will not use.
> 
> @ gups. My fury x blocks/backplates arrived. Much better quality than I thought it would be even @ msrp. At the 50% off killer deal.... Now if only I had the time to work on my pc.






i work for no one...except the new granddaughter that is








and i heartily recommend the asrock taichi.
i have literally had zero issues from day one.
the vrms are in my opinion cool
the nvme drive i have now i put a heatsink on it seems to be performing pretty damn good.
i can overclock easily only let down by my cooling (Frankenstein project in the works...who needs a rad IN a case anyway









but honestly it has been pretty much flawless ram and cpu and video card wise.
THAT and here in the southern states of price gouge(read australia) it can be had for $499 which is a good $120 less than any other board.
I would happily buy another one(if i was rich) which i, m not









p.s i know what the thread is but has anyone compared the new other guy chip yet







i have not stopped giggling all day especially the overclocked power draw...how the tides have turned









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Anyone been using Corsair Dominator RAM for their ThreadRippers?
> 
> http://www.corsair.com/en-us/dominator-platinum-series-64gb-4-x-16gb-ddr4-dram-2800mhz-c14-memory-kit-cmd64gx4m4b2800c14#
> 
> Kinda looking at getting that kit for mine, just not sure about whether it'll be fully compatible or not. The C14 suggests B-Die, but I haven't seen it appear on the Reddit compatibility thread, however that covers mostly G.Skill anyway. Kinda stuck with Corsair though for choice


after my last run with corsair and ryzen i,m steering clear of them till they all sort there intel mess out.

going by the specs 16 gig chips running 14 would probably be b die but that's not a guarantee i had team extreme b die ram and it well sucked...
my guess would be they are higher binned 2400 sticks so 2666 at 14 should work i would search for the model and put the words suck or threadripper in there and see what pops up








but the timings are 14 16 16 so no idea


----------



## TrixX

The funniest part about the team blue release is that all but a few of the reviews are apologist, oh they couldn't have done it without such a high cost/power draw, it's ok the CPU's pull 25W more than spec because of the core count, yada yada yada. Sorry but if it was team red and out of spec they would have been confirming burnt down houses by now. The tech press is quite sickening at the moment.

Anyway back to logic









My biggest issue is that to go G.Skill it's a roughly $300 AUD extra cost currently for the similar spec RAM. Incredibly frustrating really though I don't trust some of the Corsair kits they have labelled as ThreadRipper supported, every damn one is an X99 kit...

Gah so frustrating!!! Tempted to get it and refund it if it fails, though with the latest bios updates it should play ball.


----------



## sandysuk

I bought on what was cheap and what had what I wanted port wise so for me that was the MSI X399, seems a nice board, I plugged everything in and it just worked what else can I say, I was considering the Taichi but it seemed popular and was constantly out of stock and 20-30quid more expensive, so took a punt on the MSI and have been happy.

Memory wise I couldn't say, I bought some Gskill C16 3600, fired up out of the box at its rated speed on 3600 but stress testing found it wasn't stable, best I could manage was CL14 3466, which actually doesn't seem too shabby looking around, seems the limitation is not motherboard related, anything over 2666 is considered overclocking on this platform.


----------



## royfrosty

Anybody using the 1900x with Asus Zenith?

Im not able to overclock it at all. The moment i raise the multiplier to 39 @ 1.37v/1.39v/1.42v. My Samsung CF791 monitor kept flickering till the screen blackout at windows screen.

Specs:

1900x
Gskill TridentZ rgb 2400mhz 4x8gb kit
1080ti FE
Samsung 950 pro

I have not oc the rams.


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> @ gups. My fury x blocks/backplates arrived. Much better quality than I thought it would be even @ msrp. At the 50% off killer deal.... Now if only I had the time to work on my pc.


Sweet







. I reckon they'll be within few degrees of other offerings but at this price vastly greater price/performance







.

The Komodo don't use a jetplate as I've seen on some other blocks. Xtremerigs had them in 290X and 980 WB block round ups. Flow is probably not as directed over fins, as what difference no idea as noob on WC experience







.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *royfrosty*
> 
> Anybody using the 1900x with Asus Zenith?
> 
> Im not able to overclock it at all. The moment i raise the multiplier to 39 @ 1.37v/1.39v/1.42v. My Samsung CF791 monitor kept flickering till the screen blackout at windows screen.
> 
> Specs:
> 
> 1900x
> Gskill TridentZ rgb 2400mhz 4x8gb kit
> 1080ti FE
> Samsung 950 pro
> 
> I have not oc the rams.


Are you using latest UEFI?

Latest UEFI is 0603 and OLED FW v1.00.13 within this thread.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> As far as motherboard i will plead no contest and will not suggest any brand over another even more so since i am working with a company.


Of course, of course...

On a totally different subject... which color do you like the most today: grey or white?


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> If you install 3dmark and then install the 3dmark VR benchmark afterwards, it seems to screw things up with sysinfo. you can uninstall sysinfo and then reinstall using the msi file in the application directory and that can often fix the problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hi thanks for that but in my case it was because i have a steam version as well for some reason
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and it updated and removed the 620 msi file so i had to grab an older copy from a backup.
Click to expand...

Mine is the steam version as well. The sysinfo MSI is in the \program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\3dmark directory, not the futuremark directory


----------



## gupsterg

I have steam version of 3DM, but use the key in standalone version.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> I have steam version of 3DM, but use the key in standalone version.


as far as I can tell they are identical except for the default installation directory


----------



## royfrosty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> Are you using latest UEFI?
> 
> Latest UEFI is 0603 and OLED FW v1.00.13 within this thread.


Hi there, i have not updated to 0603 yet. Didnt find them in the support page. Im currently on 0503. Will update it soon tomorrow when im home.

Thanks and i will get back in the thread provided.


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> as far as I can tell they are identical except for the default installation directory


I didn't follow fully what you guys have been discussing, my bad







.

From these recent posts I thought you guys are trying to stop a update that steam may force. So I thought I'd state steam version key from app work with standalone.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *royfrosty*
> 
> Hi there, i have not updated to 0603 yet. Didnt find them in the support page. Im currently on 0503. Will update it soon tomorrow when im home.
> 
> Thanks and i will get back in the thread provided.


NP







.

You'll find latest UEFI in linked thread or ROG forum for ZE. It takes a while before latest appear on ASUS support product page.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Of course, of course...
> 
> On a totally different subject... which color do you like the most today: grey or white?


For gaming specifically white.

@ gups.

290 was a fail for swifty. The flow was not directed over vrm. On fury x it is and the flow pattern looks just as good as the aqua computer option.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> For gaming specifically white.


My, my, what a surprise!
You really struck me as a grey gear kind of guy.
White stripes it is then, +rep


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> My, my, what a surprise!
> You really struck me as a grey gear kind of guy.
> White stripes it is then, +rep


Game tests in all benches so far lean towards x370s favor. Soon as my boards back from TW im downcoring a 1950x to 1900x and doing a battle royale. Taichi on Taichi 8 core on a 8 core which platform does what better.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Game tests in all benches so far lean towards x370s favor. Soon as my boards back from TW im downcoring a 1950x to 1900x and doing a battle royale. Taichi on Taichi 8 core on a 8 core which platform does what better.


Ohhhh *that* white.
For me it's not all about current performance, TR will last me far longer (but for more money). The bottleneck at 4k is in the GPUs anyway.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Mine is the steam version as well. The sysinfo MSI is in the \program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\3dmark directory, not the futuremark directory






hi yes i know and it removed the original 620 file so uninstall etc was impossible (it was trying to run 2 versions)
doesn't matter all sorted.


----------



## chew*

Gups.

The right cavity is vrm cooling area.

The fin density is a tad thicker but looks less likely to clog.

Unlike my aqua computer 290x which has a split pass for core/vrm this is a forced pass after core.



Not sure if i really need the backplates. Description/details online were vague for fury x.

Apparently not many companies made them as the stock backplate fits and can be used.

@ $10 per backplate however who cares.

Fyi for Asrock users I thought I might point this out.

Going to report it as an issue to Asrock.



As you can see cards with a rather thick backplate hit the I/O shroud.

It gets even worse if I install the swifty backplate.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Gups.
> 
> The right cavity is vrm cooling area.
> 
> The fin density is a tad thicker but looks less likely to clog.
> 
> Unlike my aqua computer 290x which has a split pass for core/vrm this is a forced pass after core.
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure if i really need the backplates. Description/details online were vague for fury x.
> 
> Apparently not many companies made them as the stock backplate fits and can be used.
> 
> @ $10 per backplate however who cares.
> 
> Fyi for Asrock users I thought I might point this out.
> 
> Going to report it as an issue to Asrock.
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see cards with a rather thick backplate hit the I/O shroud.
> 
> It gets even worse if I install the swifty backplate.






that's one of the reasons i threw it in slot 2 (i only have the one)
the other is it is a tad too close to the other gear for me(being a long card)

now i know the manual says 16 then 8 then 16
but single card it runs at x16 don't suppose any crossfire/sli guys can test that theory say whack a card in 2 and 4 and see what they say?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> that's one of the reasons i threw it in slot 2 (i only have the one)
> the other is it is a tad too close to the other gear for me(being a long card)
> 
> now i know the manual says 16 then 8 then 16
> but single card it runs at x16 don't suppose any crossfire/sli guys can test that theory say whack a card in 2 and 4 and see what they say?


Slots 2 and 4 should work fine. I can't tell you for sure though as I'm using all 4


----------



## chew*

Electrically they are wired for 16x slots 1/3.

Electrically slots 2/4 are 8x.

Performance wise however in personal testing gen 3 vs 2 or 1 plays a bigger role performance wise then the difference from 16x/8x.


----------



## SavantStrike

While I'm still waiting on _any_ full cover block aside from the EK, my Bykski block seems to be doing quite nicely.

This is after a lot of heat soak. I've got all 4 1080 TI's mining at full throttle (300W+ per card), and the chip running in place FFT's on Prime95. This loop is a serial loop, so every bit of heat I generate will end up hitting the CPU if the rads don't remove it first.

At stock clocks I max out at 63C in this configuration, and the room is _very_ uncomfortable as there are a few other machines also running in here 24x7 too







. Maybe if I was on a 1950X instead of a 1920X, temps would be hotter, but I don't think they would given what I'm running for radiators and fans.

I'm not quite at the limit of my power supply yet. I really miss my AX1500i but I needed the 1600P2 I traded it for to make this all work. I think I can crack 3.8 or 3.9ghz without running into trouble. Beyond that, any testing I do is not for 24x7 load. I do want to see if I can get to the HardOCP numbers, or if more pump (I'm running an MCP50x in addition to a PWM D5) and more radiator will keep me at 70C or below at or around 250-300W of load.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Electrically they are wired for 16x slots 1/3.
> 
> Electrically slots 2/4 are 8x.
> 
> Performance wise however in personal testing gen 3 vs 2 or 1 plays a bigger role performance wise then the difference from 16x/8x.


if that is the case why doe sit show as 16x then.


----------



## mrryzen

Ok, two days late (as I've assembled my build's "internals" on Monday, still waiting for the chassis) but I can finally and officially join the Threadripper (1920x in my case, I didn't manage to change my order to 1950x in time) owners club!

Noctua's cooler came back to me (again with 3 plates on the rad bent, but this time I simply bent them back as I didn't want to waste any more time, CPU and other stuff came to me on Friday even though I've specifically said I want them on Monday), assembled all the parts and voila, works without a problem. The XMP profile on my Flare X sticks works just fine as well, so at least I know all that money didn't go to waste. As soon as I'll have some more free time I'll try to OC it, see how far I can get with air cooling (and I'm curious about my chip, did I win or lose the silicon lottery).

I've seen that some ppl had problems with screw no. 1 on some boards (the ones with Foxcon-produced CPU slot I believe? so it's not Taichi specific). In my case, screw no. 1 (on the opposite side of the hinges) was fine, but... screws no. 2 and 3 are totally ****ed - I couldn't screw them at all, they were unscrewed when I first took out the board from the package. I'm slightly worried about this (should I be in a long run?), but I guess the cooler put additional pressure to that place as it works fine (no crashes in two days, but I must admit I haven't run like 24h stability test).

As for the temperatures with Noctuas NH-U14S (single fan for now, I'll attach the second one later), I'm not sure if they are any good. In Ryzen Masters I've seen them oscillating between 30 - 40C (Tdie) at idle or with some minor loads. The fan seems loud, but it's still not in the case so that might change. As for load temps, after a couple of Cinebench runs (score ~2400, I've seen better scores at stock in benchmarks so there might be a problem somewhere) were between 57-60 (max recorded was 63.3). After 10 minutes of AIDA64's stability test, max temp. was 64.0 (most of the time it stayed in range between 63.0 and 63.7C). As I said, will OC this beast once I have more time. I know I probably won't get far with air cooling, but I'm planning to replace it with X399 specific AIO once it's available here in Poland.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrryzen*
> 
> Ok, two days late (as I've assembled my build's "internals" on Monday, still waiting for the chassis) but I can finally and officially join the Threadripper (1920x in my case, I didn't manage to change my order to 1950x in time) owners club!
> 
> Noctua's cooler came back to me (again with 3 plates on the rad bent, but this time I simply bent them back as I didn't want to waste any more time, CPU and other stuff came to me on Friday even though I've specifically said I want them on Monday), assembled all the parts and voila, works without a problem. The XMP profile on my Flare X sticks works just fine as well, so at least I know all that money didn't go to waste. As soon as I'll have some more free time I'll try to OC it, see how far I can get with air cooling (and I'm curious about my chip, did I win or lose the silicon lottery).
> 
> I've seen that some ppl had problems with screw no. 1 on some boards (the ones with Foxcon-produced CPU slot I believe? so it's not Taichi specific). In my case, screw no. 1 (on the opposite side of the hinges) was fine, but... screws no. 2 and 3 are totally ****ed - I couldn't screw them at all, they were unscrewed when I first took out the board from the package. I'm slightly worried about this (should I be in a long run?), but I guess the cooler put additional pressure to that place as it works fine (no crashes in two days, but I must admit I haven't run like 24h stability test).
> 
> As for the temperatures with Noctuas NH-U14S (single fan for now, I'll attach the second one later), I'm not sure if they are any good. In Ryzen Masters I've seen them oscillating between 30 - 40C (Tdie) at idle or with some minor loads. The fan seems loud, but it's still not in the case so that might change. As for load temps, after a couple of Cinebench runs (score ~2400, I've seen better scores at stock in benchmarks so there might be a problem somewhere) were between 57-60 (max recorded was 63.3). After 10 minutes of AIDA64's stability test, max temp. was 64.0 (most of the time it stayed in range between 63.0 and 63.7C). As I said, will OC this beast once I have more time. I know I probably won't get far with air cooling, but I'm planning to replace it with X399 specific AIO once it's available here in Poland.


Those temps are quite good if you can keep them for an endurance test.

I've got a 1920x on a custom loop and 63C is the temp of my CPU under a torture test at stock settings. Just look a few posts up for screenshots if you want to see them


----------



## chew*

As many of you may well know I am not a fan of high speeds and loose timings.....but since DR is such a pita I figured I would throw a bone to those who insist on banging there head against a wall.

Here is a baseline and as far as I have gotten getting DR over the 3200 wall.......it does not insta fail and drop threads in prime so it's a heck of a starting baseline for you.

What timings you can not see in RTC are included in the Aida 64 tab...they are fairly important.



Actually I pulled some timings in for you guys, once again its a start no clue how stable I will let this cook while I get some sleep......


----------



## crion

Thanks chew, would you say that 8 SR (8x8GB) is easier to work with than 4 DR (4x16GB)? If you value low timings..


----------



## happyluckbox

There's a formula somewhere out there for timings vs frequency. But I also believe that for threadripper, 3200mhz is the sweet spot before diminishing returns starts to hit? I sure wish I could get my 128gb kit to run at 3200 mhz, but it instantly drops threads in p95 :/

Have to settle for 3060mhz 14cas, still quite good tho!


----------



## enigma97

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> There's a formula somewhere out there for timings vs frequency. But I also believe that for threadripper, 3200mhz is the sweet spot before diminishing returns starts to hit? I sure wish I could get my 128gb kit to run at 3200 mhz, but it instantly drops threads in p95 :/
> 
> Have to settle for 3060mhz 14cas, still quite good tho!


Same experience as you, happyluckbox. I am using Asus ROG Zenith Extreme thou.

Regards.


----------



## mrryzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Those temps are quite good if you can keep them for an endurance test.
> 
> I've got a 1920x on a custom loop and 63C is the temp of my CPU under a torture test at stock settings. Just look a few posts up for screenshots if you want to see them


Bad news (for me of course) - seems like both AIDA's stability test & Prime95 (RAM intensive) crash after about 90 minutes of benchmarking (hardware failure, not a hard OS reset). In case of Prime95, I've seen only a few of the worker threads to stop their jobs, while the others kept going further (probably because there were less stress on the CPU overall?).

Weird, because CPU temps did not exceed 65C. Should I try with lower RAM speed, or does it mean there's something wrong with my chip (it's on stock speeds)?


----------



## chew*

thread drops = unstable mem/imc that's why you see them in my screens to show they are not dropping.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> as far as I can tell they are identical except for the default installation directory
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't follow fully what you guys have been discussing, my bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> From these recent posts I thought you guys are trying to stop a update that steam may force. So I thought I'd state steam version key from app work with standalone.
Click to expand...

No, he was having a problem with a broken sysinfo installation


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crion*
> 
> Thanks chew, would you say that 8 SR (8x8GB) is easier to work with than 4 DR (4x16GB)? If you value low timings..


Way easier with SR.

I am still pulling in the timings but stressing it longer each time.

Aida is reporting faster performance but aida is not the end all for measuring performance on Ryzen imo.


----------



## rpjkw11

I do a lot of CAD work using AutoDesk. I'm using an i7 4770K which ain't going the job well enough. I want more cores! Everything I've read indicates TR 1950x is the way to go without serious money thoughts. $2K for an i9 7980K is not out of the question except I would feel like the biggest SUCKER on earth. So screw Intel. TR 1950x looks to me the best move I can make for my wants and needs. My only point of unhappiness is I like to overclock and the TR just ain't gonna satisfy those desires. No big deal, though. TR should deliver the speed and performance I want/need for AutoDesk. Anything is most likely better.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rpjkw11*
> 
> I do a lot of CAD work using AutoDesk. I'm using an i7 4770K which ain't going the job well enough. I want more cores! Everything I've read indicates TR 1950x is the way to go without serious money thoughts. $2K for an i9 7980K is not out of the question except I would feel like the biggest SUCKER on earth. So screw Intel. TR 1950x looks to me the best move I can make for my wants and needs. My only point of unhappiness is I like to overclock and the TR just ain't gonna satisfy those desires. No big deal, though. TR should deliver the speed and performance I want/need for AutoDesk. Anything is most likely better.


Is AutoCAD heavily multithreaded?


----------



## rpjkw11

Not terribly so, except how I use it. I usually have several projects loaded/running at the same time and that slows things enough to irritate me. I will, also, plead guilty to wanting to upgrade.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> No worries not disputing your info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . More saw wanting to see some test info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , as there is lack of info when I was looking around
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> When I read reviews of TR 1950X and it highlighted 4 threads of say 4GHz+ I was like WOW cool. When I then went and tested it and find I need to have threads on differing CPU nodes I was like WOOT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> When you have your rig up and running again I'd be interested in testing as I did in previously linked post using Statuscore.
> 
> Again just looking for real user experience as sometimes reviews, etc don't have what we may want to know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Thanks in advance and will appreciate your time in testing and sharing, cheers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


OK had a little play with status core. all core under cinebench is 3.9 with default setup, I can sort of see this pattern where highest boost single core is 4.1, 2 cores 40.5x, 3-6 cores 40-40.5x on the two boosted cores and anything after that everythimg is 39x,



EDIT Again - I realise I wasn't being clever LOL, the actual speeds are 2 cores at 4.1 and the rest at 3.9, Doh, I was looking at the big numbers







Removed most of my waffle


----------



## Aenra

Semi-off topic, but once again my sincere thanks to @chew* @gupsterg and Stilt (whose user name i cannot tag for some reason..).

You guys have been a major help. Much obliged 

For anyone wondering, just so you can see the kind of quality info they have given us, compare their findings with this:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/11857/memory-scaling-on-ryzen-7-with-team-groups-night-hawk-rgb

Miles and miles apart; and above. So my thanks once again.


----------



## sandysuk

Seems my last post has been withheld for moderation, probably all the corrections as I was finding out stuff.









On my 1900X it seems that I do have 2 cores/4 threads boost, how fast they boost seems to depend on which threads, 9-16 typically faster than 1-8, boost is higher for 2 threads than 4. but after than its all about the base which is 3.9 it seems on this board, some crafty MSI overclocking perhaps, it is all at auto in my BIOS apart from mem speed at 3466. Or I guess XFR is just happy with my temps?


----------



## cargograph

Hey guys!

I would like to build a system with a 1950x and 4 GTX 1080TI. Does any of you have any recommendations on hardware, experiences or examples of existing builds like that?

I would really appreciate it. I will use it for GPU rendering.

Thank you very much!


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cargograph*
> 
> Hey guys!
> 
> I would like to build a system with a 1950x and 4 GTX 1080TI. Does any of you have any recommendations on hardware, experiences or examples of existing builds like that?
> 
> I would really appreciate it. I will use it for GPU rendering.
> 
> Thank you very much!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cargograph*
> 
> Hey guys!
> 
> I would like to build a system with a 1950x and 4 GTX 1080TI. Does any of you have any recommendations on hardware, experiences or examples of existing builds like that?
> 
> I would really appreciate it. I will use it for GPU rendering.
> 
> Thank you very much!


I need to start my build log this weekend, but I've got a quad 1080 TI setup with a 1920X.

You are going to need to go with blower style cards, or put them under a custom loop just to get them to fit. Custom loop is the only way too keep them from throttling, and threadripper chips respond well to custom loops too.

It probably goes without saying you need a beefy power supply. At stock 4 1080 TI's and a 1950x draw 1180 watts sustained under load. If you open up the power limits on the cards (which you should as it is free performance with GPU boost) you are looking at 1380 to 1450 watts. A 1500 watt power supply will let you run all of the components flat out for long rendering sessions. A 1600 watt unit will allow you to give the CPU a moderate over clock.

I used Gigabyte's watetforce wb extreme cards. They worked out to be considerably cheaper than buying cards and blocks separately (150-300 dollars depending on which cards and which blocks). The Gigabyte PCB is also one of the best. The MSI gaming X EK and EVGA hydro copper cards would also be good choices but they are both harder to get your hands on. The ROG Poseidon is too big (and also a hybrid that runs warmer) and the Zotac Arctic storm has inefficient VRMs which will drive power consumption up across 4 cards.

The Gigabyte card uses an unknown water block. This is the one downside to the Gigabyte card. You can't buy an off the shelf flow bridge for it, so you'll need to use fittings. I used swiftech medium length adjustable fittings and am very happy with the results. You'll either need to assemble all 4 cards together and drop them in as one unit, or take the port assemblis off the cards and install them one by one. I tested both methods and the individual assembly is easier but takes longer. You'll need to remove the Aorus stickers to do this, but they aren't tamper stickers, so a hobby knife and some patience will yield a result that's undetectable if you need to make a warranty claim. You can also use a different brand of adjustable fittings, this makes installation a breeze but will require extra leak testing (the Swiftech fittings have a really elaborate design with a brass compression ring in addition to av o ring, really good design).

Configuration wise once you get everything plumbed up, everything should just work, or at least it did on my Taichi board.

Here is a pic. Let my know if you want more data or help with loop design and selection.


----------



## tarot

ok got my loop done.
now here is the caveat i, m a new grandad and for the last week its been granddaughter duty(plus the daughter lives here anyway so no escape)

anyway...i call it Franken Deadpool








there are reasons i did it this way.
number one was pure fear (never done a custom loop and scared crapless it would explode and destroy everything(so i leak tested and bled for a day







)

second really was space...what i have in my case is what i want in my case.
i di not want to go removing cages and drives and blah blah

but really the main reason is because i wanted to







and minimise risk.

so yeah have at it i can take it









oh and the temp of the chip does make a difference in performance and cooling is worth it even at stock.

I haven't overclocked yet i, m too busy staring at it waiting for a drop of liquid









the fans are push through from inside the case by the way i know not the best but this house is dusty and i figure that will help keep them a bit leaner in the long run.
one question because of the dumbass way i built it where would you put the drain valves.

oh and also for the last day i have been ripping my dvd collection non stop never hit 60 and often hitting 400fps


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## cargograph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I need to start my build log this weekend, but I've got a quad 1080 TI setup with a 1920X.
> 
> You are going to need to go with blower style cards, or put them under a custom loop just to get them to fit. Custom loop is the only way too keep them from throttling, and threadripper chips respond well to custom loops too.
> 
> It probably goes without saying you need a beefy power supply. At stock 4 1080 TI's and a 1950x draw 1180 watts sustained under load. If you open up the power limits on the cards (which you should as it is free performance with GPU boost) you are looking at 1380 to 1450 watts. A 1500 watt power supply will let you run all of the components flat out for long rendering sessions. A 1600 watt unit will allow you to give the CPU a moderate over clock.
> 
> I used Gigabyte's watetforce wb extreme cards. They worked out to be considerably cheaper than buying cards and blocks separately (150-300 dollars depending on which cards and which blocks). The Gigabyte PCB is also one of the best. The MSI gaming X EK and EVGA hydro copper cards would also be good choices but they are both harder to get your hands on. The ROG Poseidon is too big (and also a hybrid that runs warmer) and the Zotac Arctic storm has inefficient VRMs which will drive power consumption up across 4 cards.
> 
> The Gigabyte card uses an unknown water block. This is the one downside to the Gigabyte card. You can't buy an off the shelf flow bridge for it, so you'll need to use fittings. I used swiftech medium length adjustable fittings and am very happy with the results. You'll either need to assemble all 4 cards together and drop them in as one unit, or take the port assemblis off the cards and install them one by one. I tested both methods and the individual assembly is easier but takes longer. You'll need to remove the Aorus stickers to do this, but they aren't tamper stickers, so a hobby knife and some patience will yield a result that's undetectable if you need to make a warranty claim. You can also use a different brand of adjustable fittings, this makes installation a breeze but will require extra leak testing (the Swiftech fittings have a really elaborate design with a brass compression ring in addition to av o ring, really good design).
> 
> Configuration wise once you get everything plumbed up, everything should just work, or at least it did on my Taichi board.
> 
> Here is a pic. Let my know if you want more data or help with loop design and selection.


Wow man! Thanks a lot for your response. This was somewhat overwhelming. I have never build a computer with a liquid cooling system. I am seriously considering the EVGA HYBRID cards.

Let me see how it goes hehe


----------



## cargograph

I think I am going with a setup like this:

MB Asus Zenith Extreme
Case Phanteks Enthoo Primo XL ATX
CPU Threadripper 1950x
CPU Cooling Corsair H100i v2
64 GB Corsair Vengeance 4x16 GB 3200
4 EVGA GTX 1080 TI CG2 Hybrid ( is the FTW3 bigger and more difficult to fit in place? )
Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2 SSD

What do you think? Do you think this would work? I don't want to get completely into liquid since I am not very
experienced in it.

Thanks a lot!


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I need to start my build log this weekend, but I've got a quad 1080 TI setup with a 1920X.
> 
> You are going to need to go with blower style cards, or put them under a custom loop just to get them to fit. Custom loop is the only way too keep them from throttling, and threadripper chips respond well to custom loops too.
> 
> It probably goes without saying you need a beefy power supply. At stock 4 1080 TI's and a 1950x draw 1180 watts sustained under load. If you open up the power limits on the cards (which you should as it is free performance with GPU boost) you are looking at 1380 to 1450 watts. A 1500 watt power supply will let you run all of the components flat out for long rendering sessions. A 1600 watt unit will allow you to give the CPU a moderate over clock.
> 
> I used Gigabyte's watetforce wb extreme cards. They worked out to be considerably cheaper than buying cards and blocks separately (150-300 dollars depending on which cards and which blocks). The Gigabyte PCB is also one of the best. The MSI gaming X EK and EVGA hydro copper cards would also be good choices but they are both harder to get your hands on. The ROG Poseidon is too big (and also a hybrid that runs warmer) and the Zotac Arctic storm has inefficient VRMs which will drive power consumption up across 4 cards.
> 
> The Gigabyte card uses an unknown water block. This is the one downside to the Gigabyte card. You can't buy an off the shelf flow bridge for it, so you'll need to use fittings. I used swiftech medium length adjustable fittings and am very happy with the results. You'll either need to assemble all 4 cards together and drop them in as one unit, or take the port assemblis off the cards and install them one by one. I tested both methods and the individual assembly is easier but takes longer. You'll need to remove the Aorus stickers to do this, but they aren't tamper stickers, so a hobby knife and some patience will yield a result that's undetectable if you need to make a warranty claim. You can also use a different brand of adjustable fittings, this makes installation a breeze but will require extra leak testing (the Swiftech fittings have a really elaborate design with a brass compression ring in addition to av o ring, really good design).
> 
> Configuration wise once you get everything plumbed up, everything should just work, or at least it did on my Taichi board.
> 
> Here is a pic. Let my know if you want more data or help with loop design and selection.


There seems to be some confusion there. Is that a 1920X or 1950X system?


----------



## cargograph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> There seems to be some confusion there. Is that a 1920X or 1950X system?


I am going to build with a 1950x but he was using as example his build with the 1920x


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok got my loop done.
> now here is the caveat i, m a new grandad and for the last week its been granddaughter duty(plus the daughter lives here anyway so no escape)
> 
> anyway...i call it Franken Deadpool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> there are reasons i did it this way.
> number one was pure fear (never done a custom loop and scared crapless it would explode and destroy everything(so i leak tested and bled for a day
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> second really was space...what i have in my case is what i want in my case.
> i di not want to go removing cages and drives and blah blah
> 
> but really the main reason is because i wanted to
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and minimise risk.
> 
> so yeah have at it i can take it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh and the temp of the chip does make a difference in performance and cooling is worth it even at stock.
> 
> I haven't overclocked yet i, m too busy staring at it waiting for a drop of liquid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the fans are push through from inside the case by the way i know not the best but this house is dusty and i figure that will help keep them a bit leaner in the long run.
> one question because of the dumbass way i built it where would you put the drain valves.
> 
> oh and also for the last day i have been ripping my dvd collection non stop never hit 60 and often hitting 400fps
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Some like it in the case some like it out. No worries.

You might hate me for this however.

Did you run the loop with vinegar added then drain it after a day?

It's common practice for us water guys to do this on even a brand new loop to deflux the system for best possible temps and debris removal.

Distilled water is non conductive on day 1 startup so a leak is no big deal. Even if you add copper or silver sulfate its not enough to be a problem.

Black hoses spray tinted or plasti dipped or smoke black acrylic and black hoses are your friend as well as copper/silver sulfate in the fight against algae

I am an in the case guy mostly because I find the need to drag it somewhere far from home on occasion.

Here is my take on the 750D.

Of course I am mid build so components are being swapped out case is being trimmed still and the swiftech aios are being swapped for newer swiftech sealed units with bigger pumps an res/built into radiator ( not exposed to light )

The bottom xspc rad is a double thick.

It goes 3x120 to 1x120 to dual gpu to double thick 1x120 to 2x120 to cpu or vice versa flow wise which may prove to be better getting heat from gpus out of case first.


----------



## happyluckbox

I think with 4 cards you have to use custom loop, the hybrid card's fan blower will choke for air stacked on each other.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Some like it in the case some like it out. No worries.
> 
> You might hate me for this however.
> 
> Did you run the loop with vinegar added then drain it after a day?
> 
> It's common practice for us water guys to do this on even a brand new loop to deflux the system for best possible temps and debris removal.
> 
> Distilled water is non conductive on day 1 startup so a leak is no big deal. Even if you add copper or silver sulfate its not enough to be a problem.
> 
> Black hoses spray tinted or plasti dipped or smoke black acrylic and black hoses are your friend as well as copper/silver sulfate in the fight against algae
> 
> I am an in the case guy mostly because I find the need to drag it somewhere far from home on occasion.
> 
> Here is my take on the 750D.
> 
> Of course I am mid build so components are being swapped out case is being trimmed still and the swiftech aios are being swapped for newer swiftech sealed units with bigger pumps an res/built into radiator ( not exposed to light )
> 
> The bottom xspc rad is a double thick.
> 
> It goes 3x120 to 1x120 to dual gpu to double thick 1x120 to 2x120 to cpu or vice versa flow wise which may prove to be better getting heat from gpus out of case first.






i hate no one...well this very second the babys asleep








i see your point and i could have done that but in my eyes that leads to triple points of failure near very expensive gear







and until i am confident i can do this right i am talking the less risk approach(in my opinion that is.

also
a radiator is called that because it radiates







so there is heat coming off every radiator in a case regardless of the fans(again this is just the way i see it based on working on cars and bikes) so to enclose a heat source to me seems counter intuitive. (again my non learned opinion)
as for the wash out vinegar thing yes i did a wash out and i ran all the pumps and blocks etc with distilled water for a few hours on a bench first as i have read and looked at videos in regards to the crud, but in saying that there was zero in there i was really surprised (well if it was there it was so small it it didn't show up in the coffee filter.

as for mine it goes no whee and if i have to drag it it's easy enough to pick up so that's not an issue.

one issue i do have is the cheaper pump doesn't have a fill hole on top so i am going to need to get one of those to help bleed it a little the top one is fine did that today and it helped a little.

next step is after a week i,m going to pull the cpu block and see if the thermal paste is right (i believe i may have gone a little hulk smash on it so maybe i will try the spread method next.

anyway so far i, m pretty happy with it







and although expensive it has been an interesting thing to do.


----------



## chew*

The idea is to get the majority of heat out which in my case will be the dual gpus so my focus will be those blowing air out of case, the cpu ( not TR just Ryzen ) will not dump much heat and it will be no worse than my ambient which are already the suck.

cars is kinda a bad analogy they dump hot air onto the engine









Anyway moving some warm air around in case is no different than say a non ref card and a air heatsink as long as you try to exhaust out the major offenders.

In my case I have 2 240 overlapping the front rad and will have a 120 mm underneath so the warm air will be mixed with cool air thus the air the hits the exhaust rad will not really be that hot.

Also a little science. warmer air is easier to move than colder air


----------



## robtorbay

When I did my build I opted with a set of EVGA Hybrid cards over the custom loop for the cost savings.

The Hybrid cards seem to work well, haven't had any issues with heat and they overclock pretty nicely.


----------



## robtorbay

I have seen several posts here about dissipating heat with the new TR setups. I did a little research before setting up the build and opted for an open case (Thermaltake Core P5) with AIO cooling solutions.

With the P5 there are a set of brackets you can get which allow for AIO solutions to be installed in the case and they are cheap as heck (like $25 bucks). I also opted for an SLI setup which was the main reason for looking into heat in the case.

Again, hybrid cards came in handy for keeping the temps low! Overall my 1900x @ 4.1, 1.35v hits 60 degrees solid under load and my cards as below 58 degrees OCed.

Setup details:

TR 1900x @ 4.1, 1.35v
Nvidia 980ti Hybrid in SLI (+100 on the core and 525 on the memory)


----------



## VoytekBE

So I've been holding off buying memory for my TR setup but as it is now finally completed, the only thing I'm missing is memory for my Zenith extreme board.

Does anyone have any recommendation for a memory kit?

I would prefer to run dual quad channel 3200mhz< and I'm planning on OCing but I have no clue what memory to go for.

What is everyone here running?

Would like 64Gb as I'm combining workstation loads with gaming. 32Gb would be too close for my current load so I'm looking into going for 64gb. If 128Gb is the only option, I'll consider that aswell even though it's overkill.

Is it better to choose a 4-dimm kit rather than 8-dimm if I'm going to OC?
I would prefer the look of 8-dimm kits but that's pretty obvious I guess











With the current design and all the glass might even consider an RGB kit.

Could really use some advice here.


----------



## TrixX

Check the memory QVL for kits available for your system.

There's a few 8x8GB and 8x16GB kits out there that are QVL approved though 3200MHz is likely a bit high to be aiming for with current BIOS. I think I've see a few boards doing that but not many.

https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/ROG-ZENITH-EXTREME/HelpDesk_QVL/


----------



## VoytekBE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Check the memory QVL for kits available for your system.
> 
> There's a few 8x8GB and 8x16GB kits out there that are QVL approved though 3200MHz is likely a bit high to be aiming for with current BIOS. I think I've see a few boards doing that but not many.
> 
> https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/ROG-ZENITH-EXTREME/HelpDesk_QVL/


The Gskill and Corsair kits on the QVL are only 2133mhz. I would prefer to base myself on hands-on experience from members here as many of you are using Zenith Extreme boards.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VoytekBE*
> 
> The Gskill and Corsair kits on the QVL are only 2133mhz. I would prefer to base myself on hands-on experience from members here as many of you are using Zenith Extreme boards.


There's 3 G.Skill 3000MHz kits with 128GB in the QVL. There's 19 pages and they are in Memory speed order


----------



## crion

I really struggled with deciding on the memory as well. But this is what I ended up with, like you I don't mind RGB when I'm in the mood for it.

These are QVL:ed @3600 on the ASRock Fatal1ty in dual channel mode, but one guy here uses them and got em running at CL14 3600 which is pretty impressive in a Quad on the ASRock Fatal1ty board.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232497&cm_re=trident_z_4266_rgb-_-20-232-497-_-Product

I ordered 4 kits. I know that it's "better" to order quads or octa kits, but I'm not paying 100's more dollars for that.


----------



## sandysuk

I have a set of those sticks and whilst I can run them @3600, it doesn't pass 800% memtest and that's in dual channel







but I haven't successfully got anything to run 3600 in my MSI board past that level of checking, 3200 is no bother, my lower latency 3600 sticks ZRGBs run faster with less voltage than the 4266.

Hopefully you'll be luckier than me.


----------



## Beatnutz

I've been offline for a little bit because of my new build. It took much longer than first anticipated. But it has been fun!

Temps were just too high with my previous setup and case so I ordered a Corsair 900D and a 480mm rad. I did a lot of heat tests that I logged before deinstalling it so quite curious to see the temperature differences.



480mm rad on top
360mm in front
420mm rad in the bottom (not mounted when I took the picture).
I also wanted to mount a 240mm rad in the bottom but I decided against it since I'm doing soft tubing and it wouldn't use the space efficiently enough.

I'm also going to make a midplate to separate the bottom compartment from the top. I decided to test run the system for a week or so before emptying the loop and putting that in. Just to be sure that everything works. Will also do some testing on the heat difference with and without midplate. Should see some good results there I'm guessing.

I am currently bleeding the system so it is up and running. Will do the first temp tests tonight.

_* the excess length of the tube from the res down to the first radiator is intentional. When the midplate is mounted it will be stretched so the extra length is needed._


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VoytekBE*
> 
> So I've been holding off buying memory for my TR setup but as it is now finally completed, the only thing I'm missing is memory for my Zenith extreme board.
> 
> Does anyone have any recommendation for a memory kit?
> 
> I would prefer to run dual quad channel 3200mhz< and I'm planning on OCing but I have no clue what memory to go for.
> 
> What is everyone here running?
> 
> Would like 64Gb as I'm combining workstation loads with gaming. 32Gb would be too close for my current load so I'm looking into going for 64gb. If 128Gb is the only option, I'll consider that aswell even though it's overkill.
> 
> Is it better to choose a 4-dimm kit rather than 8-dimm if I'm going to OC?
> I would prefer the look of 8-dimm kits but that's pretty obvious I guess
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With the current design and all the glass might even consider an RGB kit.
> 
> Could really use some advice here.


First of all, your 8-pin EPS/CPU cables look like they're actually for GPUs. Those have to be changed asap.
4-dimm kit will more than likely yield better clockspeeds.

Scout out some Samsung B-Die, this thread is gold for good kits.


----------



## Beatnutz

There, it's up and running. Very happy with it, only missing the midplate and stretching those tubes.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cargograph*
> 
> I think I am going with a setup like this:
> 
> MB Asus Zenith Extreme
> Case Phanteks Enthoo Primo XL ATX
> CPU Threadripper 1950x
> CPU Cooling Corsair H100i v2
> 64 GB Corsair Vengeance 4x16 GB 3200
> 4 EVGA GTX 1080 TI CG2 Hybrid ( is the FTW3 bigger and more difficult to fit in place? )
> Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2 SSD
> 
> What do you think? Do you think this would work? I don't want to get completely into liquid since I am not very
> experienced in it.
> 
> Thanks a lot!


Components are good except for the RAM (more on that below). The CLCs are going to be problematic. I recommend two 1080 TI's if you want to use a CLC.

You don't have enough fan slots in the right places for 4 hybrids plus a 240mm clc. It will result in hoses crossed and clcs positioned with radiators below their blocks. You can end up with a slug of air that kills one of the CLCs. 9 times out of ten you'll get away with it, but that tenth time will bite you. I killed an h100i v2 that way. That said you can do it, but be prepared to replace a CLC in the next 2-3 years.

If you do go the CLC route, I think you can get away with the FTW2 hybrids. They are taller, but not in a spot that should matter as the radiators are the same size.

I would still encourage you to consider custom loop for quad 1080 TI's and Threadripper. It's more work, but the cost is similar and you'll be happier with the results. You can't really take advantage of the over clocking on the Zenith with a CLC.

The RAM you picked is good, but if you get a Hynix kit you will probably be unable to run it at full speed. Corsair does not specify which revision of the kit you get so the only way to be sure is buying it at a brick and mortar, and even then you might get E-die Samsung (ask me how I know this lol). The C14 G Skill kits all use Samsung B-die so they might be worth looking in to.


----------



## webhito

Been lurking this thread for a while now and I see a lot of you are using custom loops and watercooling, is air cooling just not plausible?


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *webhito*
> 
> Been lurking this thread for a while now and I see a lot of you are using custom loops and watercooling, is air cooling just not plausible?


Perfectly OK with the Noctua TR4 stuff as long as you do not intend on OC. The Noctua coolers are on par or better than most asetek AIO...

Don't get me wrong OC is perfectly possible on air as is with the AIO asetek stuff, but if you intend on taxing the cpu for long periods and or stress testing... Things get toasty.


----------



## webhito

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> Perfectly OK with the Noctua TR4 stuff as long as you do not intend on OC. The Noctua coolers are on par or better than most asetek AIO...
> 
> Don't get me wrong OC is perfectly possible on air as is with the AIO asetek stuff, but if you intend on taxing the cpu for long periods and or stress testing... Things get toasty.


Thanks for the reply, I dislike water, too much hassle, too much risk imo, but I have barely seen anybody with air cooling so I assumed that it just was not possible.


----------



## chew*

As far as cooling goes this is a cheap solution which may be improved upon.

Its a swiftech h220x 2 with an apogee drive x2 with TR mounts. Up for debate as I lose the second pump but a TR specific block may improve temps slightly (3-5c).

I would suggest not believing the magical 69C load temps on any aio @ 1.4v stable 4.1g ocs on 1950x cpu's unless they provide stress tests for hours with accurate temp software like the below included shot









Anyway I have been fine tuning this 3333 with 4x16g DR setup over the past week among my busy work schedule.

1T is unstable 2T is stable so I finally opted to enable geardown and utilize the effective 1.5 CR that comes with leaving geardown enabled.

There may be some timings that can be pulled in still but not much. You need to use DR dims to understand this as its a totally different ballgame from Single Rank sticks.

I have also attempted to use CL 15 and even at 2933 or 3200 CL 15 with geardown disabled is refusing post. According to Asrock this is agesa limited which sucks as cl 15 might make this profile useful.

While impressive that DR can exceed 3200 I find it rather pointless.

Currently as it stands I see no point since 3200 will do 14 CL.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *webhito*
> 
> Thanks for the reply, I dislike water, too much hassle, too much risk imo, but I have barely seen anybody with air cooling so I assumed that it just was not possible.


I have a 1950x at 3.6GHz with a 360 AIO at low 60s crunching BOINC at 100%. It can do higher clocks and still stay in the 60s with 100% load. I just got it setup the other day and haven't had time to OC it. But yeah, don't expect 4.1GHz with an AIO that doesn't completely cover the die.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *webhito*
> 
> Been lurking this thread for a while now and I see a lot of you are using custom loops and watercooling, is air cooling just not plausible?


Hassle yes, but its fun hassle







. Risk is pretty much zero as long as you check your fittings (takes a minute or two) that they are still tight at least once every month and change your liquid 1-2 times per year. I can recommend it if you should struggle with temps or find the noise annoying.


----------



## webhito

Thanks for all the insight =).


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *webhito*
> 
> Thanks for the reply, I dislike water, too much hassle, too much risk imo, but I have barely seen anybody with air cooling so I assumed that it just was not possible.


Watercooling is a challenge and thats what makes it fun. Since I did watercooling, I'll never go back. So much quieter once you do GPU's as well. Only once I had a leak which took out my GPU. Luckily I was able to RMA the card. Currently I have my 1950x cooled by Dual Predator 360's and my FuryX's on their own loop cooled by a EKWB 360 Rad and Bay Resevoir.


----------



## webhito

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> Watercooling is a challenge and thats what makes it fun. Since I did watercooling, I'll never go back. So much quieter once you do GPU's as well. Only once I had a leak which took out my GPU. Luckily I was able to RMA the card. Currently I have my 1950x cooled by Dual Predator 360's and my FuryX's on their own loop cooled by a EKWB 360 Rad and Bay Resevoir.


Oh, I just don't like putting water close to so much money lol. I already had a custom built system, cpu/gpu cooled with 2 rads and a d5 pump, but one morning I randomly woke up with a few drops of water on my gpu backplate, plus, the temperature difference I was getting with my d15 was around 5C, so it was definitely not worth it, at least not for me. And ever since I have never wanted to go down that road again.


----------



## robtorbay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *webhito*
> 
> Oh, I just don't like putting water close to so much money lol. I already had a custom built system, cpu/gpu cooled with 2 rads and a d5 pump, but one morning I randomly woke up with a few drops of water on my gpu backplate, plus, the temperature difference I was getting with my d15 was around 5C, so it was definitely not worth it, at least not for me. And ever since I have never wanted to go down that road again.


I have thought about going custom loop, but honestly I agree putting water that close to so much dosh is not a good feeling. I have been running AIO solutions for the past few years without issue! I love AIO because you can get the liquid benefits without the risk for the most part.


----------



## hebrewbacon

I've been watercooling for 5 years now and have never had it leak after I did the initial leak testing when you set up your loop. The only times I've had leaks were during leak testing which were almost always due to bad orings. My TR and 1080Ti are under water and on 24/7 and I'm not least bit worried about leaks.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robtorbay*
> 
> I have thought about going custom loop, but honestly I agree putting water that close to so much dosh is not a good feeling. I have been running AIO solutions for the past few years without issue! I love AIO because you can get the liquid benefits without the risk for the most part.


there's a decent chance they can leak as well. It is the nature of the beast. Running air cooled is just as bad, great kills quick too.


----------



## chew*

Glycol is conductive. Glycol is used in aio for corrosive reasons.

Simply put they use copper coldplates and aluminum radiators and crappy pumps because quite simply they are cheap alternatives designed to make money in a throwaway society.

In the case of an aio leak your 100% chance to be conductive.

In the case of a failed pump your 100% likely to not know due to lack of being able to visually inspect flow and cause dmg due to simply not enough copper to soak up the energy before temps skyrocket.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hebrewbacon*
> 
> I've been watercooling for 5 years now and have never had it leak after I did the initial leak testing when you set up your loop. The only times I've had leaks were during leak testing which were almost always due to bad orings. My TR and 1080Ti are under water and on 24/7 and I'm not least bit worried about leaks.


I just had one yesterday when testing the loop. Classic o-ring issue. It had slid not even a millimeter in one small bend in one of the GPU terminal. Insanely annoying but it proves again, whenever there is a leak it is most likely your fault. And always do test runs. I usually just do 30-60 minutes, after that I consider it safe.


----------



## Beatnutz

I've now done some testing with the extra 480mm radiator added and a new much bigger case. I have yet to be able to get a stable OC at 3.8GHz and/or change my ram speed. I'm only using the multiplier, but any tips would be welcomed.

I do my reading with HWiNFO64 and CPU #0 Node #0. Not sure if that is the correct one, or it should be node #1?

If anybody is interested, here is the outcome of the average score out of 3 tests:
(I have 3 GPU's in the system, so temps will naturally be a little bit higher).

*Prime95 v26.6*
Small FFTs - 10 minutes

*Be Quiet! Darkbase 900 PRO*
420mm, 360mm rads
3.4GHz @ 1.119V, DDR4 @ 2144MHz - stock
Fans topping out at 780RPM

*Ambient:* 23.2c, *Idle temp:* 40.9c (delta 17.7c), *Load temp:* 64.8c (delta 41.6c)

*Corsair Obsidian 900D*
480mm, 420mm, 360mm rads
3.4GHz @ 1.119V, DDR4 @ 2144MHz - stock
Fans topping out at 780RPM

*Ambient:* 24.4c, *Idle temp:* 32.8c (delta 8.4c), *Load temp:* 53.3c (delta 28.9c)


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I've been offline for a little bit because of my new build. It took much longer than first anticipated. But it has been fun!
> 
> Temps were just too high with my previous setup and case so I ordered a Corsair 900D and a 480mm rad. I did a lot of heat tests that I logged before deinstalling it so quite curious to see the temperature differences.
> 
> 
> 
> 480mm rad on top
> 360mm in front
> 420mm rad in the bottom (not mounted when I took the picture).
> I also wanted to mount a 240mm rad in the bottom but I decided against it since I'm doing soft tubing and it wouldn't use the space efficiently enough.
> 
> I'm also going to make a midplate to separate the bottom compartment from the top. I decided to test run the system for a week or so before emptying the loop and putting that in. Just to be sure that everything works. Will also do some testing on the heat difference with and without midplate. Should see some good results there I'm guessing.
> 
> I am currently bleeding the system so it is up and running. Will do the first temp tests tonight.
> 
> _* the excess length of the tube from the res down to the first radiator is intentional. When the midplate is mounted it will be stretched so the extra length is needed._


This hottie


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> This hottie


+1. Awesome.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *farcodev*
> 
> This hottie


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> +1. Awesome.


cheers!


----------



## chew*

Well this is interesting.

Keep in mind this is one of the better IMC chips I have tested among all Ryzen chips I have.



Oh and for those that may be interested. This is what the coldplate looks like that I am using with only a 2x120 rad.


----------



## Bloodthirsty91

Hey guys! I have been really busy with work and school since I completed my build. Everything is running pretty smooth for now at 3.9ghz. temps dont go over 65 and idle temp is bellow 30 degrees. Ram is 128GB overclocked to 2933. both gpus are really cold even under full load. I have a great time in houdini, vue xstream, world machine, zbrush and c4d/octane!


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bloodthirsty91*
> 
> Hey guys! I have been really busy with work and school since I completed my build. Everything is running pretty smooth for now at 3.9ghz. temps dont go over 65 and idle temp is bellow 30 degrees. Ram is 128GB overclocked to 2933. both gpus are really cold even under full load. I have a great time in houdini, vue xstream, world machine, zbrush and c4d/octane!


Nice build! Also a Houdini, Octane & C4D user here!


----------



## crion

@chew, nice one with DR mem, was it 4x16GB 3200MHz @14,13,13? Impressive and probably very nice performing.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> First of all, your 8-pin EPS/CPU cables look like they're actually for GPUs. Those have to be changed asap.
> 4-dimm kit will more than likely yield better clockspeeds.
> 
> Scout out some Samsung B-Die, this thread is gold for good kits.


They're keyed differently and wired differently. If they plug in, they're the right kind.


----------



## cargograph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robtorbay*
> 
> When I did my build I opted with a set of EVGA Hybrid cards over the custom loop for the cost savings.
> 
> The Hybrid cards seem to work well, haven't had any issues with heat and they overclock pretty nicely.


How many cards did you have in your set? What motherboard did you use ?

I am very close to maybe not go for threadripper. I have been reading super bad things about the Zenith Extreme motherboard. Any of you have experienced issues with it


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I've now done some testing with the extra 480mm radiator added and a new much bigger case. I have yet to be able to get a stable OC at 3.8GHz and/or change my ram speed. I'm only using the multiplier, but any tips would be welcomed.
> 
> I do my reading with HWiNFO64 and CPU #0 Node #0. Not sure if that is the correct one, or it should be node #1?
> 
> If anybody is interested, here is the outcome of the average score out of 3 tests:
> (I have 3 GPU's in the system, so temps will naturally be a little bit higher).
> 
> *Prime95 v26.6*
> Small FFTs - 10 minutes
> 
> *Be Quiet! Darkbase 900 PRO*
> 420mm, 360mm rads
> 3.4GHz @ 1.119V, DDR4 @ 2144MHz - stock
> Fans topping out at 780RPM
> 
> *Ambient:* 23.2c, *Idle temp:* 40.9c (delta 17.7c), *Load temp:* 64.8c (delta 41.6c)
> 
> *Corsair Obsidian 900D*
> 480mm, 420mm, 360mm rads
> 3.4GHz @ 1.119V, DDR4 @ 2144MHz - stock
> Fans topping out at 780RPM
> 
> *Ambient:* 24.4c, *Idle temp:* 32.8c (delta 8.4c), *Load temp:* 53.3c (delta 28.9c)






i,ll test mine in a second with small ffts, i just rebuild it ...again...cause i am a moron








but maybe i, m not.

this water-cooling crap is so confusing









now what i found was after looking at the 30th video is i had the loop all wrong.
or did i....
i basically had the radiator going to the outlet on the cpu block same goes for the video

now i have swapped it all around and the pump>cpu inlet cpu outlet >radiator>pump inlet

same sort of deal with the gpu and its little loop.

does that look right? i keep looking at other builds and it confuses me more like yours....is that pump>graphics>cpu>radiator?

with those three cards doesn't the water get super hot?

also another random question...after redoing all the pipes i of course leak tested and bled it for an hour or 2 but temps just seemed off and performance was a bit lower(due to slightly higher temps) it seems to have settled down a bit...the question is does it take time for a loop to...like...bed in?

ok guess it did (now mind i only started the encode a minute or so before i took the shot)
but 23 minutes small ffts topped at 50 degrees and just sat there even after i started the handbrake encode.
that is all at stock mind you with the ram at 3200.
but still seems ok to me.

sorry also ambient is around 20 degrees in here idles around 28 that's with a 420 mm radiators the fans are at about 1000/1100 ek block and ek pump/res(on top of the case as per franken deadpool photos







)


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> does that look right? i keep looking at other builds and it confuses me more like yours....is that pump>graphics>cpu>radiator?
> 
> with those three cards doesn't the water get super hot?
> 
> also another random question...after redoing all the pipes i of course leak tested and bled it for an hour or 2 but temps just seemed off and performance was a bit lower(due to slightly higher temps) it seems to have settled down a bit...the question is does it take time for a loop to...like...bed in?


Don't worry about loop order. It has minimal effect to temps, if any. As long as you use the correct in/out on the gpu terminal, cpu and pump.

Yes it gets hot with 3 GPU's hence the amount of rad space







I don't use all three at the same time that often though.

2 hours is not enough to bleed the system properly. I don't waste time bleeding more than an hour or so though. Your loop will work fine its just not going to cool your system properly until all of bubbles are gone. Unless you are benchmarking temps just leave it be and it will settle in after a few days of use. If want to speed up the process tilt your case in different directions and switch your pump speed between max and low a few times. Your system is bled when you can't hear any bubbles.

Good luck!


----------



## Nautilus

Guys, I'm near the Marietta/Atlanta Micro Center and need urgent Threadripper memory advice. There are limited stock of ram here, could you take a look and pick 3200Mhz 4x8GB ram for me? I don't want to end up with incompatible ram and having to run it 2133 or 2400Mhz only.

Could you look it up for me? --> http://www.microcenter.com

I haven't decided on the mobo yet. Best memory compatibility could be a defining factor.

Thanks


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Don't worry about loop order. It has minimal effect to temps, if any. As long as you use the correct in/out on the gpu terminal, cpu and pump.
> 
> Yes it gets hot with 3 GPU's hence the amount of rad space
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't use all three at the same time that often though.
> 
> 2 hours is not enough to bleed the system properly. I don't waste time bleeding more than an hour or so though. Your loop will work fine its just not going to cool your system properly until all of bubbles are gone. Unless you are benchmarking temps just leave it be and it will settle in after a few days of use. If want to speed up the process tilt your case in different directions and switch your pump speed between max and low a few times. Your system is bled when you can't hear any bubbles.
> 
> Good luck!






cool thanks i have been doing that and opening it up for a second to release pressure and air on both pumps and that seems to be doing the trick







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nautilus*
> 
> Guys, I'm near the Marietta/Atlanta Micro Center and need urgent Threadripper memory advice. There are limited stock of ram here, could you take a look and pick 3200Mhz 4x8GB ram for me? I don't want to end up with incompatible ram and having to run it 2133 or 2400Mhz only.
> 
> Could you look it up for me? --> http://www.microcenter.com
> 
> I haven't decided on the mobo yet. Best memory compatibility could be a defining factor.
> 
> Thanks


looking at it i would say none of them.

if i had to gamble i would try them

http://www.microcenter.com/product/481738/16GB_2_x_8GB_DDR4-3200_PC4-25600_CL16_Dual_Channel_Desktop_Memory_Kit

or these.

http://www.microcenter.com/product/470250/16GB_2_X_8GB_Tactical_DDR4-3000_PC4-24000_UDIMM_Desktop_Memory_Kit

but compatability wise most boards are the same the taichi seems to be pretty easy with ram and its the cheapest board


----------



## Nautilus

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> if i had to gamble i would try them
> 
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/481738/16GB_2_x_8GB_DDR4-3200_PC4-25600_CL16_Dual_Channel_Desktop_Memory_Kit
> 
> or these.
> 
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/470250/16GB_2_X_8GB_Tactical_DDR4-3000_PC4-24000_UDIMM_Desktop_Memory_Kit
> 
> but compatability wise most boards are the same the taichi seems to be pretty easy with ram and its the cheapest board


Thanks but these are 2x16GB kits, I want quad channel


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nautilus*
> 
> Thanks but these are 2x16GB kits, I want quad channel


hey sort of meant by 2 kits :0 looked at the quad channel kits didn't much like the look of any of them even the 3466 corsair would be hit and miss and a 100 odd more.

as long as the 2 kits are near the same dates of manufacture...they should be ok i have 2 separate kits of gskill flarex and they are fine


----------



## Nautilus

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> hey sort of meant by 2 kits :0 looked at the quad channel kits didn't much like the look of any of them even the 3466 corsair would be hit and miss and a 100 odd more.
> 
> as long as the 2 kits are near the same dates of manufacture...they should be ok i have 2 separate kits of gskill flarex and they are fine


but a 16gb stick is dual rank and running 4x dual rank ram will certainly cripple already weak ryzen memory controller. i have yet to see a ryzen user who can run 4x16gb ram over 2400mhz.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nautilus*
> 
> but a 16gb stick is dual rank and running 4x dual rank ram will certainly cripple already weak ryzen memory controller. i have yet to see a ryzen user who can run 4x16gb ram over 2400mhz.


sorry i thought the ones i linked were 8 gig sticks 16 gig kits....


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nautilus*
> 
> Guys, I'm near the Marietta/Atlanta Micro Center and need urgent Threadripper memory advice. There are limited stock of ram here, could you take a look and pick 3200Mhz 4x8GB ram for me? I don't want to end up with incompatible ram and having to run it 2133 or 2400Mhz only.
> 
> Could you look it up for me? --> http://www.microcenter.com
> 
> I haven't decided on the mobo yet. Best memory compatibility could be a defining factor.
> 
> Thanks


Get the absolute fastest corsair kit you can find, and ask the store associate to open the kit to verify which version it is. They don't put the revision on the outside of the package which is stupid. Either way, you'll at least get Samsung. The 3333 and 3466 kits are all either B-Die or E-Die so far I believe.

I bought a 32GB 4x4 RGB kit that is B-Die. My 3333 Red led kit was E-Die (and I returned it because it was not nearly as good). 3333 is slow enough that E-Die worked. 3466 is really freaking fast, and probably all B-Die. I'll pull the rev number tomorrow (It's not on the box, so you have to look at one of the DIMMS lol).

If I could buy my RAM again, I'd just buy 3200mhz cas14 Gskill DIMMS (flarex or RGB or whatever, it doesn't matter) and call it a day. I prefer G Skill over corsair, and those are virtually guaranteed to be B-Die at the best blend of speed/timings on the market. The 3333mhz corsair kit was what I bought first, then I happened to be at a micro center and saw the 3466 kit and took a gamble since the associate let me see the revision on the sticks.


----------



## chew*

Should
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nautilus*
> 
> but a 16gb stick is dual rank and running 4x dual rank ram will certainly cripple already weak ryzen memory controller. i have yet to see a ryzen user who can run 4x16gb ram over 2400mhz.


Should look closer then. Ive showed 4x16g @ 3200-3333.

Fyi my kits were bought @ microcenter and are b die.

They do not list them online for some reason...but they are 3400 16-16-16.

I prefer to buy higher bin and tighten up.

Seems to run good so far @ 14-13-13 3200

its not really 4x 16g like on R7, you have 2 dies each with there own bank of memory so its just like having 2x16gb on R7.

128gb will be when the imc takes a hit.


----------



## cargograph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Should
> Should look closer then. Ive showed 4x16g @ 3200-3333.
> 
> Fyi my kits were bought @ microcenter and are b die.
> 
> They do not list them online for some reason...but they are 3400 16-16-16.
> 
> I prefer to buy higher bin and tighten up.
> 
> Seems to run good so far @ 14-13-13 3200
> 
> its not really 4x 16g like on R7, you have 2 dies each with there own bank of memory so its just like having 2x16gb on R7.
> 
> 128gb will be when the imc takes a hit.


What exact model is your kit? Thanks for the info, I thought there were not any 16 GB B Die


----------



## chew*

Any 16gb stick rated 3200 14-14-14 or 3400 16-16-16 are going to be B die.

There is one other kit iirc is 3000 14-14-14 but It could be Samsung but not necessarily always b die...could be e die

I have been focusing on DR for the most part because it is harder to get running right etc people need more help and imo for the intended purpose of platform probably the choice many will make.

even @ 64gb we have run out of memory doing prosumer type tasks.


----------



## TrixX

It's quite interesting that Corsair are doubling down on not releasing Die information at the moment as they change it up a lot instead of keep it uniform for their kits. Also allows them to lead with B-Die on a good kit and then switch to E-Die or Hynix when they want to scalp. Bloody annoying really and couldn't get a straight answer out of them for anything when communicating with them.


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nautilus*
> 
> but a 16gb stick is dual rank and running 4x dual rank ram will certainly cripple already weak ryzen memory controller. i have yet to see a ryzen user who can run 4x16gb ram over 2400mhz.


My Corsair LPX 4x16G run at 3200mhz. Though no OC headroom beyond that.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nautilus*
> 
> I don't want to end up with incompatible ram and having to run it 2133 or 2400Mhz only.


I'm running my Corsair 3000Mhz at 2133Mhz. Can't go up any further. I was hoping this was a mobo issue and would be patched in the future. So this just means my ram is incompatible?


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I'm running my Corsair 3000Mhz at 2133Mhz. Can't go up any further. I was hoping this was a mobo issue and would be patched in the future. So this just means my ram is incompatible?


Can run 2666 without any modifications, 2800 is rock stable with manual timings, voltage and procodt. Anything above is insta-crash.
3000Mhz Vengeance RGB


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Paprika*
> 
> Can run 2666 without any modifications, 2800 is rock stable with manual timings, voltage and procodt. Anything above is insta-crash.
> 3000Mhz Vengeance RGB


Nice, would u mind sharing your settings for 2800?


----------



## 3DIF

Finally got my Threadripper build finished. Running stable at 4 ghz at 1.375v. I have 64GB non RGB Trident Z 3200c14 but can only get them running at cl14-14-14-34 3066 at 1.45v . Getting a Cinebench score of 3440. Does this all sound acceptable or is my memory underperforming?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> It's quite interesting that Corsair are doubling down on not releasing Die information at the moment as they change it up a lot instead of keep it uniform for their kits. Also allows them to lead with B-Die on a good kit and then switch to E-Die or Hynix when they want to scalp. Bloody annoying really and couldn't get a straight answer out of them for anything when communicating with them.


Their behavior in the issue has forced me to go back to G Skill the next time I buy RAM. I bought my last Corsair kit because I was physically in a microcenter store and got to see the modules before I bought them. I had to return two other Corsair kits before that to get something that actually worked.

G Skill on the other hand doesn't seem to be sending cherry picked early rev kits to reviewers then switching them out later.


----------



## happyluckbox

So any more tips/advice on the max temp this chip can sustain, say at 1.4v under load? AMD says 68c - seems odd considering ryzen is 95.

My chip was holding 4ghz stable at 1.38 volts under load 68c. (set to 1.275 in bios with extreme llc) But for whatever reason, it seems to be unstable now.

Looks like i can either increase voltage to 1.4-1.41 (1.3 in bios with extreme llc) to try to get stability back or drop down a bit. This results in temps of 70 under synthetic bench load. More like 66 using real life software. Safe?


----------



## Simmons572

Just finished my watercooled 1900x build log!
More photos here


----------



## chew*

Waterboarding new 64gb 4x16g Dual Rank tune.





Now lets see those enermax temps after 24 hours of prime @ 4.1 with 1.4v


----------



## ajc9988

So, EK has decided to put out a monoblock for the X399 Taichi! This is the first monoblock for an Asrock board, so if you like monoblocks, show the appreciation of adding Asrock to the list of boards they will make custom blocks for! I already bought my XSPC block, but may buy this and test my custom solution versus a monoblock to compare the temps....

My XSPC block arrives Monday, so should have numbers for the group by Friday, although full stable is scheduled for later...https://www.ekwb.com/configurator/step1_complist?mb_mbs=2685


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Now lets see those enermax temps after 24 hours of prime @ 4.1 with 1.4v


Well, my enermax has temps around 70c running at 4ghz 1.4v.

A TON better than my kraken x52, but yeah I had to turn the overclock down to 3.95ghz at 1.35v. My chip just requires too big a jump from 3.95 to 4.0, and its on the ragged edge of stability.


----------



## chew*

Has temps and prime 95 temps after well over 24 hours apples/oranges.

If I am going to install one in a system thats running a mission critical app gets within 3c of prime 95 temps I want to see load temps after at least an hour of prime....although a day would be preferred.....system runs 24/7.....

This is one of the lighter load projects......


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So, EK has decided to put out a monoblock for the X399 Taichi! This is the first monoblock for an Asrock board


And hopefully not the last, this was a much needed addition.

While primarily a Gigabyte customer, there'd been times when an ASRock mobo made better sense to me, except lack of a monoblock for said mobos gave me pause; looking at how the 'trend' evolves, with VRMs, ambient temps and their importance thereof, i do not find me mistaken in this.

Hope a lot of folks buy these, make it profitable for EK to continue this.

Unrelated to EK and on a more general level, i look at pics here and i see a different 'trend'.

Airflow.. no offense, but for some of you, a better case/better orientation/overall thinking would have served you far better (temps-wise) than your current custom loop. I can assure you a good 360 AIO is more than sufficient for a 4.0-ish GHz TR4 running at full load. Assuming you've got chassis, fans and airflow right


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Unrelated to EK and on a more general level, i look at pics here and i see a different 'trend'.
> Airflow.. no offense, but for some of you, a better case/better orientation/overall thinking would have served you far better (temps-wise) than your current custom loop. I can assure you a good 360 AIO is more than sufficient for a 4.0-ish GHz TR4 running at full load. _Assuming_ you've got chassis, fans and airflow right


I think if you tested a 1950x you would be wrong.

I am not in a case btw and my fans are set on kill and they are not stock fans.

I also have a copper radiator not some crap alum or crap pump in fact I have 2 pumps...

if my temps are damn near 68c ( amd stated max ) at just 1.2v and 3.8 this is a no brainer for me......the enermax hype train is exactly that hype until proven otherwise in some load testing till its heat saturated.

Don't believe all I say fine.......I'm fairly certain just the lines alone have more volume of water than 3 enermax units, its 2.5x the radiator then factor in its actually copper.......oh look its not in a case......

https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/09/08/amd_ryzen_threadripper_waterblock_comparison_1/

But I should believe enermax units can do 70c loaded @ 1.4v and 4 gig right?


----------



## Aenra

(in the hope this is to remain a discussion rather than devolve into a confrontation, which is not my intention)

1. copper vs aluminum is relative; could name you copper rads of a very well known and respected PC water cooling company that cost twice as much as another famous brand's aluminum ones.. and perform significantly worse nonetheless, copper notwithstanding; while material quality is most definitely a factor, the above (proven fact) goes to show that the sum will always be greater than its parts.. ergo "that depends".

2. i have seen the hardocp article;

i) frankly i stopped reading when i saw that they were using their own hand-made bracket ( ... ), a practice very common throughout their posts/videos, going back in time. Good for them to enjoy their DIY, but hardly a basis for facts i can take to the bank; just me, opinions are welcome to differ. If they lacked a bracket (which they did), all they had to do was wait until they got a proper one 

ii) methodology, consistency and most of all real life-resembling conditions are a must (again, for me). None of these have been applied (or if they have, they sure failed to highlight them) in said article.

3. i did not mention enermax, nor would i even if i had one; which i quite honestly do not.

4. user-dependent; your conditions are not everyone's. This goes for:

- workloads (99.9% of us have zero, nada, zilch of a need for Prime and/or its 'testing' [never mind i'm the only one that will admit this, boys like their numbers])

- room/workspace ambients (the higher your ambients, the bigger your deltas unless you really know your stuff)

- preferences (i don't want an excellent delta over ambient, it's a bonus but not a must)

- conditions (how much/often i work on my PC, do i have other equopment near it, etc)

.. And the list goes on. One cannot take the 1% to define what the remaining 99 should opt for. I used the word "sufficient" for a reason 

5. i mentioned a combination of a) chassis, b) airflow and c) fans. All the AIOs, all of them, come with.. moderately.. inappropriate stock fans..

Fans therefore signify both those meant for the airflow and those meant for the rad (not just in quality, but also in config; ie push-pull). Should all three criteria be met, yes, i stand by my statement. Even with a TR4, an AIO is sufficient. Even for for an overclocker. If having repeated it twice already didn't make it obvious, yes, i agree that the boundaries are stricter, yes, more care is needed. Does not invalidate the fact that a good number of people need resort to custom loops because they fail to grasp/take care of the basics; TR4 users included.

Just my opinion, as formed by measured empirical facts (my own and only my own; as mentioned, opinions are welcome to differ).


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> But I should believe enermax units can do 70c loaded @ 1.4v and 4 gig right?


Raises hand*** I have a 1950x and an enermax liqtech tr-4 and I promise the liqtech 360 aio does indeed keep my cpu at 70c through aida 64 at 1.4v PEAK under load.

I dont run it at those settings though, because my chip isnt an amazing overclocker.... I ended up going with 3.95ghz for 1.35v PEAK at load for a much cooler 63c.

all stress testing done via piosolver and/or aida 64.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So, EK has decided to put out a monoblock for the X399 Taichi! This is the first monoblock for an Asrock board, so if you like monoblocks, show the appreciation of adding Asrock to the list of boards they will make custom blocks for! I already bought my XSPC block, but may buy this and test my custom solution versus a monoblock to compare the temps....
> 
> My XSPC block arrives Monday, so should have numbers for the group by Friday, although full stable is scheduled for later...https://www.ekwb.com/configurator/step1_complist?mb_mbs=2685


It still says they have no plans to create a mono block when I go to their site. Is there a press release for this?

Edit: I see it now, I must've been blind.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> It still says they have no plans to create a mono block when I go to their site. Is there a press release for this?
> 
> Edit: I see it now, I must've been blind.


Cool. I've been checking on the configurator for all boards for awhile now. This was the last one to fall, and only came after I posted it on Facebook on an HWBot post, followed by HWBot tagging both EK and Asrock to ask why. Then, in less than a week, this is on the website. Says a lot on the power of the enthusiast market!


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Cool. I've been checking on the configurator for all boards for awhile now. This was the last one to fall, and only came after I posted it on Facebook on an HWBot post, followed by HWBot tagging both EK and Asrock to ask why. Then, in less than a week, this is on the website. Says a lot on the power of the enthusiast market!


Any sense on whether the monoblock will have a larger cooling block for the CPU (and not just a larger cold plate) as opposed to their TR4 CPU water block?


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Any sense on whether the monoblock will have a larger cooling block for the CPU (and not just a larger cold plate) as opposed to their TR4 CPU water block?


This is a good question and no certain answer. Considering that was a criticism of the CPU block, there is a good chance, especially since monoblocks have to be designed specifically for the MB they are used on. The CPU block was a rush to market, with EK beating most others by a longshot with Bykski not having enough of a name outside of the Asia-Pacific. So scaling their already existing design made sense for that grab. With monoblocks, you can take your time. So...


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> This is a good question and no certain answer. Considering that was a criticism of the CPU block, there is a good chance, especially since monoblocks have to be designed specifically for the MB they are used on. The CPU block was a rush to market, with EK beating most others by a longshot with Bykski not having enough of a name outside of the Asia-Pacific. So scaling their already existing design made sense for that grab. With monoblocks, you can take your time. So...


Definitely follow that thought process and hopeful. I have the current EK TR4 cpu water block and was waiting for the watercool heatkiller as I don't think I *need * vrm cooling on my Taichi. That said, I'm now tempted....


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> (in the hope this is to remain a discussion rather than devolve into a confrontation, which is _not_ my intention)
> 
> 1. copper vs aluminum is relative; could name you copper rads of a very well known and respected PC water cooling company that cost twice as much as another famous brand's aluminum ones.. and perform significantly worse nonetheless, copper notwithstanding; while material quality is most definitely a factor, the above (proven fact) goes to show that the sum will always be greater than its parts.. ergo "that depends".
> 
> 2. i have seen the hardocp article;
> i) frankly i stopped reading when i saw that they were using their own hand-made bracket ( ... ), a practice very common throughout their posts/videos, going back in time. Good for them to enjoy their DIY, but hardly a basis for facts i can take to the bank; just me, opinions are welcome to differ. If they lacked a bracket (which they did), all they had to do was wait until they got a proper one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ii) methodology, consistency and most of all real life-resembling conditions are a must (again, for me). None of these have been applied (or if they have, they sure failed to highlight them) in said article.
> 
> 3. i did not mention enermax, nor would i even if i had one; which i quite honestly do not.
> 
> 4. user-dependent; your conditions are not everyone's. This goes for:
> - workloads (99.9% of us have zero, nada, zilch of a need for Prime and/or its 'testing' [never mind i'm the only one that will admit this, boys like their numbers])
> - room/workspace ambients (the higher your ambients, the bigger your deltas unless you really know your stuff)
> - preferences (i don't want an excellent delta over ambient, it's a bonus but not a must)
> - conditions (how much/often i work on my PC, do i have other equopment near it, etc)
> .. And the list goes on. One cannot take the 1% to define what the remaining 99 should opt for. I used the word "sufficient" for a reason
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5. i mentioned a combination of a) chassis, b) airflow and c) fans. All the AIOs, all of them, come with.. moderately.. inappropriate stock fans..
> Fans therefore signify _both_ those meant for the airflow _and_ those meant for the rad (not just in quality, but also in config; ie push-pull). Should all three criteria be met, yes, i stand by my statement. Even with a TR4, an AIO is sufficient. Even for for an overclocker. If having repeated it twice already didn't make it obvious, yes, i agree that the boundaries are stricter, yes, more care is needed. Does not invalidate the fact that a good number of people need resort to custom loops because they fail to grasp/take care of the basics; TR4 users included.
> 
> Just my opinion, as formed by measured empirical facts (my own and only my own; as mentioned, opinions are welcome to differ).


It is just a discussion.

I read further. They tested a bykski with included proper mounts to it was 1c worse than xspc.

One could say prime is unrealistic but in my case its not.

Its a delta of 3c from what we are running realworld.

Ill run aida 64 and compare temp delta next.

I find it odd nobody will run prime on the enermax even for just an hour and post results.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> It is just a discussion.
> 
> I read further. They tested a bykski with included proper mounts to it was 1c worse than xspc.
> 
> One could say prime is unrealistic but in my case its not.
> 
> Its a delta of 3c from what we are running realworld.
> 
> Ill run aida 64 and compare temp delta next.
> 
> I find it odd nobody will run prime on the enermax even for just an hour and post results.


sure ill do it for you.


----------



## chew*

Appreciated. I can't just throw money at parts if i am unsure they can/can't do job for the customer.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Appreciated. I can't just throw money at parts if i am unsure they can/can't do job for the customer.


any settings in particular you want? i was thinking just leave it on blend and ill paste hwmonitor's temps monitored

im currently running 1.38vcore peak at load 3.95ghz


----------



## chew*

Just blend/custom ticked change ram amount to 90% 32gb is like 26000 mb

First 30 min will nail 8k and 12k that way. Which will nail you to about 95% of peak temps. Iirc 22k nailed like 2c higher.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Appreciated. I can't just throw money at parts if i am unsure they can/can't do job for the customer.


any settings in particular you want?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Just blend/custom ticked change ram amount to 90% 32gb is like 26000 mb
> 
> First 30 min will nail 8k and 12k that way. Which will nail you to about 95% of peak temps. Iirc 22k nailed like 2c higher.


Gotcha, i'm running 128gb of ram so I always tick off 120gb or so. Prime is also only about 4c delta from what my software demands.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

This seems as good a place as any to jump in. I've been following these discussions with interest over the past month, and willing to run tests or post results.

I'm not sure what your needs are, chew, but we may have similar goals. My build was a performance math rig, for deep learning, optimization problems, and software such as Matlab, Mathematica, SAS, SQL Server running in VM's doing a lot of swapping of files. Stability at the highest possible speed was crucial, since the rig would be left for many hours unattended while it crunched away.

Components:

CPU: 1950x
PSU: Corsair RM1000X
MB: Asrock Fatality (setup), Taichi (tested); ASUS Zenith Extreme (tested)
MEMORY: 8 x 8GB GSkill TridentZ (F4-3200C16Q-32GTZR) CL16-18-18-38
COOLING: Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 (setup), Corsair H115 (tested), Fractal Design Celsius S36 (tested)
GPU: Asus Strix 1080 Ti (okay, okay, so a bit of gaming and VR, too)
CASE: Corsair 570X (white)

Case is setup with rad in front set to intake, two fans in top for exhaust, and one in back for exhaust. Fan curves in BIOS were shifted to left so maximum RPM reached at 65C. Enermax block connected to CPU_OPT and locked at highest RPM, since it is a pump. Rad fans connected to CPU fan connector.

The Enermax cooling was maintaining 71C during a 4 hour run of Prime95 small FFts. Voltage 1.375. 4 Ghz. Back to back Cinebench runs 6-10 times without issue. Now I'd like to try my hand at P-states.

I'm familiar with overclocking, but new to the Ryzen platform and BIOS options. So I have a few questions:

1) The Asrock BIOS has TWO places where CPU voltage can be changed. "CPU Voltage" and "VCore voltage". The first only allows numerical entry, while the second has offset and fixed options. Asrock reports that the first is internal voltage, and second external, and that the second one will take precedence if both changed.

Is there a "best practice" answer here, or does it matter? I've noticed that if I set desired voltage using offset via the second option, HWINFO64 shows one CPU "node" at that voltage, and the other at .850 volts. Nothing I can do seems to change this behavior. Am I doing something wrong, and is the other "node" supposed to have higher voltage?

1b). Also, board seems to over volt when only Fixed voltage is changed at the second entry. Directly entering 1.35 mV and hardware reports were jumping in the 1.5 range. So I used only offset afterward.

2) Does LLC actually do anything on the Asrock boards? When I check my voltages at idle vs. load, they drop about 3-5% on load, and have the exact same values no matter what LLC is chosen. The reason I ask is that I seem to remember the Hardware Overclocker youtube page saying that LLC overvolted a lot on Asrock boards, but forum member chew measured voltage at the board and showed that it didn't. This was an X370 chipset, but still.

3) chew, do you advise any more extreme tests than Prime95 Small FFT and Y Cruncher for several hours?

Thanks for any thoughts.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> 1. copper vs aluminum is relative; could name you copper rads of a very well known and respected PC water cooling company that cost twice as much as another famous brand's aluminum ones.. and perform significantly worse nonetheless, copper notwithstanding; while material quality is most definitely a factor, the above (proven fact) goes to show that the sum will always be greater than its parts.. ergo "that depends".


Design is a factor, but people don't even understand the material choice question very well. Copper is a better thermal conductor than aluminum, but aluminum is a better thermal radiator than is copper. The best designs mix both metals and use them as appropriate.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So any more tips/advice on the max temp this chip can sustain, say at 1.4v under load? AMD says 68c - seems odd considering ryzen is 95.
> 
> My chip was holding 4ghz stable at 1.38 volts under load 68c. (set to 1.275 in bios with extreme llc) But for whatever reason, it seems to be unstable now.
> 
> Looks like i can either increase voltage to 1.4-1.41 (1.3 in bios with extreme llc) to try to get stability back or drop down a bit. This results in temps of 70 under synthetic bench load. More like 66 using real life software. Safe?


Could the Ryzen number of 95 be the Tctl that BIOSes tend to default to use? It works out, since the delta with 68 is 27.

It looks like we have very similar builds, aside from the motherboard used. Interesting that LLC changes things for you under load, as I couldn't get anything to budge on an Asrock Fatality board. I could be looking in the wrong place, though.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> This seems as good a place as any to jump in. I've been following these discussions with interest over the past month, and willing to run tests or post results.
> 
> I'm not sure what your needs are, chew, but we may have similar goals. My build was a performance math rig, for deep learning, optimization problems, and software such as Matlab, Mathematica, SAS, SQL Server running in VM's doing a lot of swapping of files. Stability at the highest possible speed was crucial, since the rig would be left for many hours unattended while it crunched away.
> 
> Components:
> 
> CPU: 1950x
> PSU: Corsair RM1000X
> MB: Asrock Fatality (setup), Taichi (tested); ASUS Zenith Extreme (tested)
> MEMORY: 8 x 8GB GSkill TridentZ (F4-3200C16Q-32GTZR) CL16-18-18-38
> COOLING: Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 (setup), Corsair H115 (tested), Fractal Design Celsius S36 (tested)
> GPU: Asus Strix 1080 Ti (okay, okay, so a bit of gaming and VR, too)
> CASE: Corsair 570X (white)
> 
> Case is setup with rad in front set to intake, two fans in top for exhaust, and one in back for exhaust. Fan curves in BIOS were shifted to left so maximum RPM reached at 65C. Enermax block connected to CPU_OPT and locked at highest RPM, since it is a pump. Rad fans connected to CPU fan connector.
> 
> The Enermax cooling was maintaining 71C during a 4 hour run of Prime95 small FFts. Voltage 1.375. 4 Ghz. Back to back Cinebench runs 6-10 times without issue. Now I'd like to try my hand at P-states.
> 
> I'm familiar with overclocking, but new to the Ryzen platform and BIOS options. So I have a few questions:
> 
> 1) The Asrock BIOS has TWO places where CPU voltage can be changed. "CPU Voltage" and "VCore voltage". The first only allows numerical entry, while the second has offset and fixed options. Asrock reports that the first is internal voltage, and second external, and that the second one will take precedence if both changed.
> 
> Is there a "best practice" answer here, or does it matter? I've noticed that if I set desired voltage using offset via the second option, HWINFO64 shows one CPU "node" at that voltage, and the other at .850 volts. Nothing I can do seems to change this behavior. Am I doing something wrong, and is the other "node" supposed to have higher voltage?
> 
> 1b). Also, board seems to over volt when only Fixed voltage is changed at the second entry. Directly entering 1.35 mV and hardware reports were jumping in the 1.5 range. So I used only offset afterward.
> 
> 2) Does LLC actually do anything on the Asrock boards? When I check my voltages at idle vs. load, they drop about 3-5% on load, and have the exact same values no matter what LLC is chosen. The reason I ask is that I seem to remember the Hardware Overclocker youtube page saying that LLC overvolted a lot on Asrock boards, but forum member chew measured voltage at the board and showed that it didn't. This was an X370 chipset, but still.
> 
> 3) chew, do you advise any more extreme tests than Prime95 Small FFT and Y Cruncher for several hours?
> 
> Thanks for any thoughts.


vcore is one of the 2 circled the lower I have seen go up to 1.216 the upper droops to 1.194. yet to confirm which is correct but its about where I like it either way.

the other voltage reading 1.025v is just hw monitor not reporting right so I crossed it out.

Thats with LLC 3.

you can set voltage top bottom or both I am seeing no difference @ 1.2

I tested pstates, I was not impressed with reliability running a low power state and letting them bounce. photoscan app actually crashed because of it but all stress tests were fine. I imagine since stress tests were not bouncing is why we never crashed so I went back to high performance plan and was crash free in our app.

Pretty much the rest of hw monitor can be ignored although vdimm looks right as well as 1.8 PLL which I undervolt as the board overshoots by .50 ( set at 1.75 in bios )

So far the only way I can really get the Asrock board to act stupid is with 2 fury x installed in both x16 slots although I need to do a heck of a lot more testing to determine what is going on as I'm willing to bet money its less of a vendor issue and more of a Threadripper problem.


----------



## happyluckbox

Here you go chew, I had to remove the front glass panel from my case for this test (Corsair 570x) because it restricts so much intake airflow and wouldn't really be representative of the liqtech tr-4's potential, add like 4-5c with the panel on. Of course, when I run my software, I leave the front panel on since this doesn't matter as much since 4-5c is exactly how much cooler my software runs vs p95 delta.

Ambient temps are room temp 72-74F, daytime.

P95 1 HOUR STRESS TEST w LiqTech TR-4 AIO Liquid cooler. Threadripper 1950x 1.38vcore peak at load, 3.95ghz. (1.25vcore in bios with turbo llc)

Start


10 mins in


20 mins in


End 1 hour


Note my minimum temps which get down to 28c which is 82f, or only 10f higher than ambient. Amazing aio cooler overall. The quality and performance of a full custom loop for only $150 in an easy to install AIO format. 5 star product.

-if anything the most concerning thing to me is my northbridge temperature. I even stuck a fan on there and it goes up to almost 90c in one of the pics!

All right, back to solving poker!


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bloodthirsty91*
> 
> Hey guys! I have been really busy with work and school since I completed my build. Everything is running pretty smooth for now at 3.9ghz. temps dont go over 65 and idle temp is bellow 30 degrees. Ram is 128GB overclocked to 2933. both gpus are really cold even under full load. I have a great time in houdini, vue xstream, world machine, zbrush and c4d/octane!


Damn, it has something of steampunk with these colors!







sweet build!


----------



## farcodev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> 
> 
> Just finished my watercooled 1900x build log!
> More photos here


Damn, all your builds rocks beside my ol' HAF-X, Post-it Board Edition


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Here you go chew, I had to remove the front glass panel from my case for this test (Corsair 570x) because it restricts so much intake airflow and wouldn't really be representative of the liqtech tr-4's potential, add like 4-5c with the panel on.
> Ambient temps are room temp 72-74F, daytime.
> 
> P95 1 HOUR STRESS TEST w LiqTech TR-4 AIO Liquid cooler. Threadripper 1950x 1.38vcore peak at load, 3.95ghz. (1.25vcore in bios with turbo llc)
> 
> Start
> 
> 8k 10 mins in
> 
> 
> 
> 12k 20 mins in
> 
> 
> End 1 hour






sorry dude but i cannot read any of those pictures way to small...oh wait the last one is i can read the rest









ok that's the ragged edge there what fan speeds is that?

here are a few i have done so far at 4.1 4g llc3(so raeds around 1.38 i guess full load









i am yet to do prime.. what did you do the chew waterboard via the cia test or just prime small ffts?


----------



## chew*

Ok so 69c with fans @ 2300 it looks like.

Have to see if noise is an issue for him. Pretty sure its being used as VM so may not be a problem.

@ tarot.

You did not kick my butt yet?

I ran a barrage of tests starting with custom prime. Plus our military app aida now i figure i will let it run memtest to solve a disagreement with asrock in an effort to solve the issue I noted with 2 cards.

They feel prime does not stress ram so whatever. I will send them my 31 hour prime custom run and 24 hours of memtest.

Then i will show multicard drama after.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> sorry dude but i cannot read any of those pictures way to small...oh wait the last one is i can read the rest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ok that's the ragged edge there what fan speeds is that?


I had the same problem, and finally saw the "+Original" button on the right side. It loads the pics in original resolution for reading.

I'm going to try a series of tests tonight, to work out this node #0 #1 thing with Hwinfo, as well as the Vcore settings in bios.

tarot, did you set your voltage to 1.4 in the BIOS entry that allowed fixed/offset (the second box), or in the area near the top labeled CPU Voltage? (the first box). Based on your HWINFO output, I'm guessing the first one.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Ok so 69c with fans @ 2300 it looks like.
> 
> Have to see if noise is an issue for him. Pretty sure its being used as VM so may not be a problem.


Nope, It's my home computer. Noise isn't really an issue, the nice thing about the corsair 570x is the case is fully glass so it keeps fan noise suppressed. I mean you can hear it at full load, but its not overly annoying, and I sleep in the same room as it.

Just have to use fan profiles to set the fan curve on the enermax fans at idle to something like 40% and you wont hear them until you load up the cpu.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> sorry dude but i cannot read any of those pictures way to small...oh wait the last one is i can read the rest


Just right click the photos and click open in new tab, then you can magnify with left click.

My resolution is pretty high so thats the reason for the blurriness unless you zoom in haha

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok that's the ragged edge there what fan speeds is that?


Do you mean ragged edge as in temperature? I still feel like AMD's 68c max is pretty conservative. Could be wrong though.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Nope, It's my home computer. Noise isn't really an issue, the nice thing about the corsair 570x is the case is fully glass so it keeps fan noise suppressed.
> 
> Just have to use fan profiles to set the fan curve on the enermax fans at idle to something like 40% and you wont hear them until you load up the cpu.


Im shoving it in a 450d that i moved out of. For him to use water and be headache free dust must not be an issue. The 450D is a clean case.

My m4e/2600k looks new still due to lack of dust.

I moved to a 750D. Need to solve the bottom of case dust issue while im building it. Crazy the 450D has a bottom full cover filter....750....does not, just psu.

Some decisions companies make are outright silly...


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Nope, It's my home computer. Noise isn't really an issue, the nice thing about the corsair 570x is the case is fully glass so it keeps fan noise suppressed. I mean you can hear it at full load, but its not overly annoying, and I sleep in the same room as it.
> 
> Just have to use fan profiles to set the fan curve on the enermax fans at idle to something like 40% and you wont hear them until you load up the cpu.


I have similar temps on a 1920X at 4.1ghz @ 1.35vcore and a whole lot more rad space (2X 360 mm and 1X 280 mm). I'm using the EK block. Wondering if I should reapply TIM or if my temps make sense. Thoughts?


----------



## chew*

Whats yourfan speed. Hards is barely audible as I imagine they tested under acceptable noise lvl rpm as a requirement


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok that's the ragged edge there what fan speeds is that?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I have similar temps on a 1920X at 4.1ghz @ 1.35vcore and a whole lot more rad space (2X 360 mm and 1X 280 mm). I'm using the EK block. Wondering if I should reapply TIM or if my temps make sense. Thoughts?


I've always been pretty liberal with my application of TIM. With Threadripper moreso due to it's large surface area. The way I applied it was drew a square around the perimeter (not all the way at the edge, but fairly close). I made sure to get a nice solid amount at each of the 4 corners, and then lather some on in the middle and spread it as best as I could using the tip of the tube. (sexual references aside lol) Try to make it like spreading butter on bread. You could probably use a credit card to help with this.

The only other thing I could say is that I believe the EK block is inferior to the liqtech AIO block? From what I understand, the EK block did not have its internal fin density enlarged to utilize the larger surface area of the threadripper chip. They simply expanded the coldplate underneath. So I'd say your bottleneck exists at either the TIM level or waterblock. I'd pull it off and check to see how good of a spread you got. (Remember any corners that the TIM failed to spread to means potentially lost thermal transfer surface area) I'd rather have more TIM than less.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Whats yourfan speed. Hards is barely audible as I imagine they tested under acceptable noise lvl rpm as a requirement


1400 rpm. So you are saying it's because he is running at 2300 rpm?


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I've always been pretty liberal with my application of TIM. With Threadripper moreso due to it's large surface area. The way I applied it was drew a square around the perimeter (not all the way at the edge, but fairly close). I made sure to get a nice solid amount at each of the 4 corners, and then lather some on in the middle and spread it as best as I could using the tip of the tube. (sexual references aside lol) Try to make it like spreading butter on bread. You could probably use a credit card to help with this.
> 
> The only other thing I could say is that I believe the EK block is inferior to the liqtech AIO block? From what I understand, the EK block did not have its internal fin density enlarged to utilize the larger surface area of the threadripper chip. They simply expanded the coldplate underneath. So I'd say your bottleneck exists at either the TIM level or waterblock. I'd pull it off and check to see how good of a spread you got. (Remember any corners that the TIM failed to spread to means potentially lost thermal transfer surface area) I'd rather have more TIM than less.


I could see that. Trying to decide if it's worth reapplying as I will basically have to drain my loop.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Just right click the photos and click open in new tab, then you can magnify with left click.
> 
> My resolution is pretty high so thats the reason for the blurriness unless you zoom in haha
> Do you mean ragged edge as in temperature? I still feel like AMD's 68c max is pretty conservative. Could be wrong though.






yes that's what i mean AND by that i mean keep it under 60 and you get free performance.
i have seen this since going from the h115i to this same speeds same everything and higher scores.

as for tim...yeah well...

i tried prime 95 small ffts on the 4.1 1.4v and nope....all the nopes
shot straight to 78 30 seconds later 80 and lock up.
now seems weird since very single test i did passed and the temps were not all that bad but as soon as i loaded that son of satans motherless goat....boom









so i decided my hulk sized blob of TIM was wrong ripped it all apart and did a nice even thinnish later of kryonaut and now...stock mind you so far till i, m sure its ok, and temps are down a good 5 degrees straight of the bat.

if you think the tim is too thick grab the tubes the reservoir etc if it school and the temps say 60 odd then something ain't right, that's when i decided to sort it.

i will test 4.1 again later then drop to 3.9 1.3 or 1.35 and do tests on that.

oh and chew i moved the video card to the third slot....zero difference in benches nadda. but it looks happy there so i will leave it


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> 1400 rpm. So you are saying it's because he is running at 2300 rpm?


Rpm always plays a roll.

I will say the EK was a rush job and i would not consider it as a TR specific block.

So many things play a roll in water cooling.

To single loop or not to. If dual loop which gets fresh air which gets warm air.

So many factors to consider.

In the case of TR cpu/vga or dual vga multi rad loop your kinda screwed they both run warm. Simple logic however cpu always runs gpus only run in games.

I would intake side cpu.

As far as seperate loops or individual...depends on alot.

Reliability/failsafe and optimal temps as well as clutter and ease of install/uninstall are all factors.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Rpm always plays a roll.
> 
> I will say the EK was a rush job and i would not consider it as a TR specific block.
> 
> So many things play a roll in water cooling.
> 
> To single loop or not to. If dual loop which gets fresh air which gets warm air.
> 
> So many factors to consider.
> 
> In the case of TR cpu/vga or dual vga multi rad loop your kinda screwed they both run warm. Simple logic however cpu always runs gpus only run in games.
> 
> I would intake side cpu.
> 
> As far as seperate loops or individual...depends on alot.
> 
> Reliability/failsafe and optimal temps as well as clutter and ease of install/uninstall are all factors.


Ease of uninstall is something I only partially considered. My loop can be drained via my external disconnects, but I should have put disconnects on my CPU block. I could have tested my apogee with the tr4 bracket kit, and I'm really considering the EK mono block. I'd like something to keep the VRMs frosty and it'll probably be decent. I'm pretty sure my Bykski is better than the current EK TR4 block though.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> keep it under 60 and you get free performance.


What do you mean?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Rpm always plays a roll.
> 
> I will say the EK was a rush job and i would not consider it as a TR specific block.
> 
> So many things play a roll in water cooling.
> 
> To single loop or not to. If dual loop which gets fresh air which gets warm air.
> 
> So many factors to consider.
> 
> In the case of TR cpu/vga or dual vga multi rad loop your kinda screwed they both run warm. Simple logic however cpu always runs gpus only run in games.
> 
> I would intake side cpu.
> 
> As far as seperate loops or individual...depends on alot.
> 
> Reliability/failsafe and optimal temps as well as clutter and ease of install/uninstall are all factors.


Don't think it was rushed just don't think they cared. According to them it was ready as of december last year just not mass reproduced yet.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Don't think it was rushed just don't think they cared. According to them it was ready as of december last year just not mass reproduced yet.


They spent 9 months sitting on that design? If they had made the fin area bigger they would've captured the entire market (or nearly the entire market) for TR4 water blocks.


----------



## chew*

Operation satisfy Asrock that my custom prime stable is actually memtest stable and that I test *AMD* certain ways for a reason.

I guess I will let it cook overnight maybe it will get to 2000%


----------



## Beatnutz

I see a lot of negativity against the EK block in this thread since pretty much the start of it, but no real facts. Just opinions. Do u guys know if anybody has done comparisons between TR blocks yet? I'd be very in seeing the results.


----------



## chew*

Oh its a fact that its a modified to fit only coldplate.

They did nothing to modify the cooling aspect of their existing coldplate.

Its not really negativity just pointing out the obvious.

A TR specific block thats coldplate was tuned previously for a single central die is kind of well dissapointing.


----------



## tarot

i agree it is not the best but it does do the job up to a point.
if i had access to the spec block or a better one i would have grabbed that but i didn't so this is what i have for now.

as soon as some come available i will loo into swapping.
i have changed the plate backed up about 20 disks today and so far the temps look good at stock so i will try 4.1 again nd see what happens if that is to evil i,ll drop back to 3.9 at 1.3 and see how that goes.

as for comparisons the only one i have seen so far is the hardocp one. and that was the bytski one i think.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Oh its a fact that its a modified to fit only coldplate.
> 
> They did nothing to modify the cooling aspect of their existing coldplate.
> 
> Its not really negativity just pointing out the obvious.
> 
> A TR specific block thats coldplate was tuned previously for a single central die is kind of well dissapointing.


My question wasnt specifically targeted to you.. just a general observation on the thread.

I'm sure you are right, but I'm more curious about the actual cooling performance and the difference between a rushed cpu block and the ones coming out now.


----------



## chew*

Ahh just figured I would offer insight.

Well someone pointed out it was not rushed and was ready 9 months ago.

Maybe with AMD's status 9 months ago EK was not confident in AMD/sales?

Its a plausible explanation and could explain the minimal investment.


----------



## happyluckbox

I mean, look at at how much money EK made by being the first company to have a waterblock for TR. It was smart on their part.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I see a lot of negativity against the EK block in this thread since pretty much the start of it, but no real facts. Just opinions. Do u guys know if anybody has done comparisons between TR blocks yet? I'd be very in seeing the results.


None of the manufacturers have had a lot of luck sourcing reviewers with a TR platform to test on. That said HardOCP reached out for a sample and EK refused unless [H] linked to EK's press releases. Kyle refused and there are no hard numbers for any of the EK blocks.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I mean, look at at how much money EK made by being the first company to have a waterblock for TR. It was smart on their part.


This. It's exactly why they did it.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> This. It's exactly why they did it.


Smart is questionable here. Smart in my books would have been to have a solution tailored to TR4 so you got the best coverage from the press and reviewers as well as being the first block on the market. It would have been a risk, but with the way Ryzen went they had 3 months to prepare.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I mean, look at at how much money EK made by being the first company to have a waterblock for TR. It was smart on their part.


They were first to market, but they are seen as a potential compromise with the design they chose. There are more then a few people on OCN alone who bought the EK block just to have something, all the while intending to swap it for another vendors block as soon as a competitor had a product.

If we could get objective testing done, it's possible that the EK block could place within a degree or two of the competition. I'm still having trouble understanding why there aren't more review outlets willing to do this.


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> They were first to market, but they are seen as a potential compromise with the design they chose. There are more then a few people on OCN alone who bought the EK block just to have something, all the while intending to swap it for another vendors block as soon as a competitor had a product.
> 
> If we could get objective testing done, it's possible that the EK block could place within a degree or two of the competition. I'm still having trouble understanding why there aren't more review outlets willing to do this.


I got the first batch of TR EK waterblock. It cools the TR very good, so I'm happy







4.1ghz. No I'm not playing Prime95 all day long, but I'm folding NACL. [email protected]


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Smart is questionable here. Smart in my books would have been to have a solution tailored to TR4 so you got the best coverage from the press and reviewers as well as being the first block on the market. It would have been a risk, but with the way Ryzen went they had 3 months to prepare.


Never said anything about it being "smart," "right" or anything else. But the fact remains they had the first and only solution for a number of months giving them first mover advantage. They can now release a higher performance competitor if they choose to in the form of a monoblock or a revised TR4 block. I don't love it as a customer, but I can see why they took this approach as a business.


----------



## TrixX

I can see it too, but I tend to think longer term as to what would give the best reception from the customers too as then you get stronger word of mouth, you don't get the oh I'll buy that and then get something better mentality surrounding ones products as well. But hey it is what it is.


----------



## chew*

I may grab the bykski block to conduct a test on a swiftech h320x2.

Curious how it will stack up vs say an enermax @ similar fan speeds.

If it ends up being decent...

http://www.swiftech.com/mcr-x20-drive-rev3.aspx

This plus a bykski = poor mans upgradeable loop.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> This. It's exactly why they did it.


Of course... thats the smart way of doing it. But it doesn't mean that their product is worse than any other.

I'm quite happy with the temps on mine. But it is hard to know until we see any real comparisons. I'll stick with the EK block until proven it is more than 1-3c difference to others.


----------



## springs113

Ease of installation should also be considered too. I like the EK block, my temps are great, all people really care about are the looks...there's no descerning evidence showing that it performs poorly either.


----------



## ht_addict

using a EKWB TR waterblock I can game just fine for hours on end at stock speeds. I'm not one for stress testing to see the max I can push it. Lets be realistic here. We are talking 2 cores and pumping increased volts to get this CPU to run 4GHz+ is going to generate heat that any waterblock is going to have a tough time removing. I think Rad size and number used is going to Play a bigger roll. You can removed from the cpu via coldplate but if you can't dissipate from the fluid cooling fast enough, doesnt matter how big the block is. Here's 30min of Realbench cooled by Dual Predator 360's


----------



## chew*

We do not know that yet.

We do however know the coldplates design.

We do know threadrippers design.

We also know that a TR tuned block is not as effective on R7 thanks to hardocp.

One can draw an educated conclusion that its the same vice versa.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Of course... thats the smart way of doing it. But it doesn't mean that their product is worse than any other.
> 
> I'm quite happy with the temps on mine. But it is hard to know until we see any real comparisons. I'll stick with the EK block until proven it is more than 1-3c difference to others.


Honestly if its only 1c-3c me personally I would not switch.


----------



## happyluckbox

What kinda temps are you guys gettjng with ek blocks? From what ive seen its worse than liqtech tr4?


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> What kinda temps are you guys gettjng with ek blocks? From what ive seen its worse than liqtech tr4?


I hit 70 degrees after an hour of blended prime95 on my 1920X running at 4.1 ghz with 1.35 vcore. I'm trying to decide if it's the block or if I have a bad TIM application.


----------



## chew*

Out of all of us I will say I am probably using the worst paste.

I will also say out of all of us I swap cpus/boards around like people change underwear so its a cost issue.

This is what I am using.

Zinc based GC electronics $8.00 a tube 1 fluid oz.

Artic mx2 65grams $26 a tube.

A gelid gc extreme tossed in just to show size compare...

Fyi the mx2 = 2-3c better than the zinc based.

Likewise due to quantity I have been able to perfect application/mounting.


----------



## Particle

The cap on my syringe of PK3 was stuck so hard the last time I used it that by the time I applied enough torque to twist the locking cap off it had broken the stem.


----------



## chew*

For such a large quantity the stem is fragile on that big syringe. I dropped it. Snapped right off.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

I'm seeing some interesting divergence over here when I drop in a different motherboard with the same setup.

Literally unplugging, pulling out the Asrock Fatality, and dropping in the Asus Zenith, results in temps being about 10 degrees cooler at stock. I recall the OC3D review of the Taichi said it "ran hot", but I didn't think I'd see this much of a difference. I'm going to try a fresh SSD install for testing, to avoid motherboard driver conflicts.


----------



## chew*

Well its possible the taichi works harder thus runs hotter especially if you consider some result patterns.

Like the kraybench results where 4.0 on taichi beat 4.2 on zenith.

3500 cb is doable @ 4.0 on taichi. I have seen far less on others equal speed....bench skewing aside
( performance bias )


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> What kinda temps are you guys gettjng with ek blocks? From what ive seen its worse than liqtech tr4?


My highest recorded temp on 3.4GHz x34 multiplier is 53.1c with an ambient of 24.3c. But I also have 3 GPU's in my setup. Also not running default fan curves (I have mine on very low setting so they don't annoy me). Going to do a few tests later with everything on default.


----------



## Aenra

Personally speaking?

https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3681&XTCsid=ov091psmgnrk95p4euqpm401oft6vgjc

- I don't trust a company that ships out 193784656382 units with the wrong orientation on them (bykski, or whatever they're called).

- I have no desire to support RGB lightzzz111!!1! craze products (XSPC). If there's one thing that's ruined this market, that's children and their pwetty lightz; not endorsing, not supporting that, ever.

- I definitely don't want to use a 2011-3 dimensions copper fin plate with an extended base just so i can pretend it was made for TRs (EKWB).

Have used other products of aqua's thus far, very happy customer, zero complaints personally. I'd actually recommend the 'Vision' line, but those go around 200 euros, so..

Don't order one just because i said so however.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Personally speaking?
> 
> https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3681&XTCsid=ov091psmgnrk95p4euqpm401oft6vgjc
> 
> - I don't trust a company that ships out 193784656382 units with the wrong orientation on them (bykski, or whatever they're called).
> - I have no desire to support RGB lightzzz111!!1! craze products (XSPC). If there's one thing that's ruined this market, that's children and their pwetty lightz; not endorsing, not supporting that, ever.
> - I definitely don't want to use a 2011-3 dimensions copper fin plate with an extended base just so i can pretend it was made for TRs (EKWB).
> 
> Have used other products of aqua's thus far, very happy customer, zero complaints personally. I'd actually recommend the 'Vision' line, but those go around 200 euros, so..
> 
> Don't order one just because i said so however.


I never understood the hate for LEDs that can be turned off.

Is the cryos actually available now? It was a compelling option if heatkiller falls through, although I haven't seen it in use very often on other platforms let alone TR4.


----------



## chew*

The hate for LEDs is more wires or more work.

I have to sit there and disassemble a waterblock break out soldering iron desolder contacts just to remove that crap from swiftech h220 x2 waterblocks just so the wires are not dangling around that I never intend to use.

I have contemplated working out hard mods to kill the RGB via a jumper for the aorus boards by gigabyte just to save users eyes in the event of a failed overclock.

I am going to start an anti RBG revolution







millennials be warned.


----------



## Simmons572

In regards to the RGB LEDs that come with the XSPC block, the LEDs are just mounted to the side of the block. You have to install the LEDs yourself, if you want to use them.










I don't believe that the addition of the LEDs is really that big of a deal, and shouldn't really add or detract any value from the block itself.

IMO, the block looks great and performs great as well. However, I will admit that I am biased, now that I am an owner of this block.


----------



## mmonnin

I don't want to install extra software just to turn off LEDs and it adds more expense. Even if its a small material expense the design, manufacturing, etc adds a little bit.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I am going to start an anti RBG revolution
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> millennials be warned.


I'd be happy with a plain classic green PCB and no cosmetic frills other than a useful and clear silkscreen for any and all headers or jumpers of significance. I also wouldn't mind double thick FR4 and 2 oz copper layers as standard.


----------



## SavantStrike

IDK. The only time the LED thing matters is in a windowed case or open chassis IMO. The open chassis is a utilitarian design that really doesn't fit with LEDS, so I can understand the hate there.

Every time I ever installed a window in a case (I still remember when they didn't come with windows) I added lighting, though I didn't go full supernova.

Gigabyte is probably a good example of the full supernova phenomenon. Their motherboards are getting ugly. I'd rather they work on their BIOS then their LED software.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> IDK. The only time the LED thing matters is in a windowed case or open chassis IMO. The open chassis is a utilitarian design that really doesn't fit with LEDS, so I can understand the hate there.


I like light in my case. I only do white lights, and I want them there because it allows me to see that everything is running properly in the loop. Ever since I spotted some drops of liquid on my PSU I want to have the case lit. I could care less about what it looks like since my wife is not impressed at all and she is the only one that sees it.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> IDK. The only time the LED thing matters is in a windowed case or open chassis IMO. The open chassis is a utilitarian design that really doesn't fit with LEDS, so I can understand the hate there.
> 
> Every time I ever installed a window in a case (I still remember when they didn't come with windows) I added lighting, though I didn't go full supernova.
> 
> Gigabyte is probably a good example of the full supernova phenomenon. Their motherboards are getting ugly. I'd rather they work on their BIOS then their LED software.


Fan openings are basically big windows when the fan is spinning. In a dark room light bleeds out of any small opening.


----------



## chew*

My light blew in my lab one night. I saw power button lit on my gaming 5 hit the reset and clr cmos I knew were next to it and fired it up to find my replacement bulbs in room. True story.

Other than that. Its annoying.


----------



## chew*

Ok I guess I can move on to real stability tests again and sort out this dual VGA crap if its still there after I flash.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I like light in my case. I only do white lights, and I want them there because it allows me to see that everything is running properly in the loop. Ever since I spotted some drops of liquid on my PSU I want to have the case lit. I could care less about what it looks like since my wife is not impressed at all and she is the only one that sees it.


I used to run red lights exclusively. Right now with RGB RAM running it like like someone puked a rainbow inside my case. I would really like to program the RAM so it's only red, but not until the tools get more stable.

My wife isn't impressed either. I'm pretty sure she thinks I'm crazy.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Fan openings are basically big windows when the fan is spinning. In a dark room light bleeds out of any small opening.


It's been a while since I've sat in the dark while using my workstation, but my HTPC has zero LEDS, not even a power light. You've got a point here. It's a repurposed x79 board with no lights on it, and I was irritated when I installed an EVGA 1070 with bright white lights. I turned them off in software, but if I had been in Linux, that wouldn't have been an option. Now I'm irritated again. I should'nt need Windows to turn off lights.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> My light blew in my lab one night. I saw power button lit on my gaming 5 hit the reset and clr cmos I knew were next to it and fired it up to find my replacement bulbs in room. True story.
> 
> Other than that. Its annoying.


That's really hilarious and completely believable. I do sometimes wondere who is picking their components based on lighting. I went with a Taichi, which is probably the best board on the market for TR alongside the Fatal1ty. There were reviews that knocked both of those boards for their lack of lighting, which is something I still don't undertake as they have headers for RGB strips and a 10 foot piece of 5050 is all of ten bucks.


----------



## Beatnutz

Hey I asked this question before but never got a reply. Some things in HWiNFO are displayed twice. Temps differ quite a bit, so which one is the one to look at?


----------



## chew*

Both T die are your temps. 2 dies 2 temps.

Blocks with split flow over die will have even temps.

Blocks with traditional flow pattern for a central core will have mismatched temps on TR.

Mount can effect this more.

Your top right temps are vcore fets.

The bottom right is soc fets.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> What kinda temps are you guys gettjng with ek blocks? From what ive seen its worse than liqtech tr4?


So far I usually idle around 27c and hit no more than 55c when gaming or benching.


----------



## Obsidience

Hi all,

Long time lurker here. My first overclock was a Cyrix 166 in highschool, I attempted to o/c to 200 and smoked the bastard. I've been hooked since then LOL. That being said, I would say I'm not an avid overclocker, maybe once every 3-5 years or so.

So I've read this entire thread from start to finish in the last week or so, my components had been sitting for weeks until I got the bandwidth to assemble them last week:


Corsair Air 540 (case from previous build, I should have gotten a larger one but oh well)
ThreadRipper 1950X
Asus Rog Zenith Extreme
EKWB Extreme 360 kit with nickel ThreadRipper waterblock (yeah I wished they'd done better too)
Samsung 960 Pro 512MB
Asus Turbo GTX 1080
G.skill TridentZ 2x F4-3200C14D-16GTZ (32GB but I'd like to go to 64GB if the price on this kit drops)
Vardar Evo fans throughout
So first off, I'm somewhat old-school. I always lap my AMD procs, I disable turbo boost and c-states and run 100% all the time. Also I overclock memory and cpu separately and test with Prime95 blend and Memtest86 24hrs+. I'm not a big fan of water cooling, many of my recent builds used Noctuas or other high end air so this is my first semi custom loop. I used a very thin later of Arctic Silver 5 using finger spread method. Also more context, I have an 69C air conditioned server room in my house and this PC will be sitting in it. I use Cat6 cabling for HDMI (HDBaseT) and USB extenders to my office. So I'm not going for pretty or quiet as I'm not gonna see the PC or hear it.

Here's some pics:









I've been logging my overclocking progress here:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1t_gGE7fetb7bkc_6W5AVv8guexIRo-4rZqLRSJqsjpc/edit?usp=sharing

Story short, I was able to get the memory clocked from stock 3200 to 3333 very *easily* using one of the b die presets. Was memtestx86 stable for 5 runs (will do more later). I was able to get the processor "idle" stable in windows at 4.2Ghz and then began the process of clocking down and reducing voltage while testing Prime95. The small FFTs / FFT really kick it's @ss. I was fighting tooth and nail to keep 4.1ghz but that was a nogo and now I'm fighting for 4ghz.

Like others I'm really questioning some of these "I'm at 4.2" posts. In my mind you aren't stable unless you can torture test the CPU to it's limit, even if that limit is not "realistic" or real world. When I do a new PC build I take weeks to confirm it's completely stable before installing and using it full time.

I'm really am pushing this CPU hard to try to keep it at 4Ghz. My vcore is 1.45 and LLC at level 5, my last run of Prime95 got through about 16hrs before crashing and the vcore was registering up to 1.526v and 89C (26C ambient). So even at 16hrs I still don't think of this as stable so I'm still tweaking.

I'd love for some input and advice, anything I can do to bring the temps or voltage down through the BIOS. I'm going to read the Rog Zenith O/C Support thread next (86 pages!).

Thanks!


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obsidience*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Long time lurker here. My first overclock was a Cyrix 166 in highschool, I attempted to o/c to 200 and smoked the bastard. I've been hooked since then LOL. That being said, I would say I'm not an avid overclocker, maybe once every 3-5 years or so.
> 
> So I've read this entire thread from start to finish in the last week or so, my components had been sitting for weeks until I got the bandwidth to assemble them last week:
> 
> 
> Corsair Air 540 (case from previous build, I should have gotten a larger one but oh well)
> ThreadRipper 1950X
> Asus Rog Zenith Extreme
> EKWB Extreme 360 kit with nickel ThreadRipper waterblock (yeah I wished they'd done better too)
> Samsung 960 Pro 512MB
> Asus Turbo GTX 1080
> G.skill TridentZ 2x F4-3200C14D-16GTZ (32GB but I'd like to go to 64GB if the price on this kit drops)
> Vardar Evo fans throughout
> So first off, I'm somewhat old-school. I always lap my AMD procs, I disable turbo boost and c-states and run 100% all the time. Also I overclock memory and cpu separately and test with Prime95 blend and Memtest86 24hrs+. I'm not a big fan of water cooling, many of my recent builds used Noctuas or other high end air so this is my first semi custom loop. I used a very thin later of Arctic Silver 5 using finger spread method. Also more context, I have an 69C air conditioned server room in my house and this PC will be sitting in it. I use Cat6 cabling for HDMI (HDBaseT) and USB extenders to my office. So I'm not going for pretty or quiet as I'm not gonna see the PC or hear it.
> 
> Here's some pics:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been logging my overclocking progress here:
> 
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1t_gGE7fetb7bkc_6W5AVv8guexIRo-4rZqLRSJqsjpc/edit?usp=sharing
> 
> Story short, I was able to get the memory clocked from stock 3200 to 3333 very *easily* using one of the b die presets. Was memtestx86 stable for 5 runs (will do more later). I was able to get the processor "idle" stable in windows at 4.2Ghz and then began the process of clocking down and reducing voltage while testing Prime95. The small FFTs / FFT really kick it's @ss. I was fighting tooth and nail to keep 4.1ghz but that was a nogo and now I'm fighting for 4ghz.
> 
> Like others I'm really questioning some of these "I'm at 4.2" posts. In my mind you aren't stable unless you can torture test the CPU to it's limit, even if that limit is not "realistic" or real world. When I do a new PC build I take weeks to confirm it's completely stable before installing and using it full time.
> 
> I'm really am pushing this CPU hard to try to keep it at 4Ghz. My vcore is 1.45 and LLC at level 5, my last run of Prime95 got through about 16hrs before crashing and the vcore was registering up to 1.526v and 89C (26C ambient). So even at 16hrs I still don't think of this as stable so I'm still tweaking.
> 
> I'd love for some input and advice, anything I can do to bring the temps or voltage down through the BIOS. I'm going to read the Rog Zenith O/C Support thread next (86 pages!).
> 
> Thanks!


Ummm turn that vcore down. 1.5 is the dead zone, and 89c is going to accelerate it's death. My threadripper was also damn near impossible to hit 4ghz with, (1.4vcore peak). At the end of the day I settled for a much more comfortable 3.95ghz at 1.35vcore peak. Temps also dropped from 70-72 by about 8-10 degrees. At the end of the day 4 ghz is just a number in your mind, and the difference between 3.95 or 3.9 is pretty negligible. Pretty sure the majority of people who say they are 4.1ghz+ stable are actually not stable, or running voltages/temps so high that they avoid p95 and other torture tests and claim to be stable.

Also, from what I understand, cpu chips have a bell curve of efficiency, where at a certain point the required voltage to keep it stable goes through the roof. The goal is to try to land inside the bell curve right before it becomes difficult to overclock/unstable. All chips vary, but from what I've seen most Threadripper 1950x is much happier at 3.9ish ghz.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obsidience*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Long time lurker here. My first overclock was a Cyrix 166 in highschool, I attempted to o/c to 200 and smoked the bastard. I've been hooked since then LOL. That being said, I would say I'm not an avid overclocker, maybe once every 3-5 years or so.
> 
> So I've read this entire thread from start to finish in the last week or so, my components had been sitting for weeks until I got the bandwidth to assemble them last week:
> 
> 
> Corsair Air 540 (case from previous build, I should have gotten a larger one but oh well)
> ThreadRipper 1950X
> Asus Rog Zenith Extreme
> EKWB Extreme 360 kit with nickel ThreadRipper waterblock (yeah I wished they'd done better too)
> Samsung 960 Pro 512MB
> Asus Turbo GTX 1080
> G.skill TridentZ 2x F4-3200C14D-16GTZ (32GB but I'd like to go to 64GB if the price on this kit drops)
> Vardar Evo fans throughout
> So first off, I'm somewhat old-school. I always lap my AMD procs, I disable turbo boost and c-states and run 100% all the time. Also I overclock memory and cpu separately and test with Prime95 blend and Memtest86 24hrs+. I'm not a big fan of water cooling, many of my recent builds used Noctuas or other high end air so this is my first semi custom loop. I used a very thin later of Arctic Silver 5 using finger spread method. Also more context, I have an 69C air conditioned server room in my house and this PC will be sitting in it. I use Cat6 cabling for HDMI (HDBaseT) and USB extenders to my office. So I'm not going for pretty or quiet as I'm not gonna see the PC or hear it.


How flat is the TR compared to some other CPUs you've lapped? I've done it before but not on a 1k CPU.


----------



## Obsidience

Thanks happyluckbox, I guess ego is pretty heavily involved here. I know this is pushing it hard but I'm OK with going to it's thermal and voltage limits. If it dies I'll (relunctantly) buy another so I'm still pushing for 4ghz stable but I've only been at this for a day now so I'll need more time before I give up...

I did the same with my last FX-8350 @ 4.95Ghz, I pushed it to the very limits and the sucker was rock solid for many years.

Take care!


----------



## Obsidience

Hey mmonnin,

Well every time I lap I do the pickup test where you put the heatsink on it and pick it up by purely suction. Unfortunately I didn't do this for this proc because the EK waterblocks have the screw holes over the HS. Also I didn't go to all of the copper, I felt it was too risky and it was taking a long time to complete (3+ hours)

Nonetheless I'm sure this is one of my better "lappings", the thing is so big it's pretty hard to roll the edges and the orange bracket helped a bit but I was worried about wearing that down with all the movement since it needs to be installed on the mobo precisely. It always gains me a few degrees and helps reduce the silicon lottery.


----------



## crion

This is the current mockup of the Calyos NSG S0 multi-purpose CPU block. We do not know yet how the surface area will look, just that it will be copper. TR4 compatible. CPU TDP fanless with radiator only will be about 180w.

3 x 120 fans is nicely slotable below the radiator if you want to overclock. Check my sig if you want to see the look of the massive radiators for this 2-Phase Cooling project started on kickstarter and now on http://fanlessfan.com


----------



## Erland82

Aaaaashiiiiiit.....:S


----------



## rdr09

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Erland82*
> 
> 
> Aaaaashiiiiiit.....:S


Oh, that is just sad. Not Vive ready.


----------



## Erland82

The software recognize its an AMD cpu, so almost certainly its not powerful enough


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Both T die are your temps. 2 dies 2 temps.
> 
> Blocks with split flow over die will have even temps.
> 
> Blocks with traditional flow pattern for a central core will have mismatched temps on TR.
> 
> Mount can effect this more.
> 
> Your top right temps are vcore fets.
> 
> The bottom right is soc fets.


Ah nice, thanks for clearing that up.


----------



## Erland82

I can not get my 1950x stable at 4,1 without going bananas with vcore. ---> 1,5 v+
At 4ghz, im at 1,415 vcore.
My max "safe" stable oc is 4,07 with 1,465 vcore. I also set 1,45vcore in R.Master to get stable "high" cpu vid. (10h prime 95 stable)
I cannot get any oc prime 95 stable over 4ghz without using R.master.
Im on the Zenith. Minimum LLC.


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Erland82*
> 
> I can not get my 1950x stable at 4,1 without going bananas with vcore. ---> 1,5 v+
> At 4ghz, im at 1,415 vcore.
> My max "safe" stable oc is 4,07 with 1,465 vcore. I also set 1,45vcore in R.Master to get stable "high" cpu vid. (10h prime 95 stable)
> I cannot get any oc prime 95 stable over 4ghz without using R.master.
> Im on the Zenith. Minimum LLC.


If you want ovet 4ghz, buy Intel LOL

Do you need 4.1 ghz? Better to try 3600mhz memory. I running 4ghz on 1950x and 3600mhz memory


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Erland82*
> 
> I can not get my 1950x stable at 4,1 without going bananas with vcore. ---> 1,5 v+
> At 4ghz, im at 1,415 vcore.
> My max "safe" stable oc is 4,07 with 1,465 vcore. I also set 1,45vcore in R.Master to get stable "high" cpu vid. (10h prime 95 stable)
> I cannot get any oc prime 95 stable over 4ghz without using R.master.
> Im on the Zenith. Minimum LLC.


I would not sweat it man.

I can do this to even on a 2x120mm rad and a block that is not intended for TR....and I can do it with dual rank because I'm to lazy to toss bench sticks in, I can also do it without CB bias because quite frankly Asrock is always fast and does not need it.



This however is the reality of things in the real world under real world use. Temps are a huge factor......keep it under 68C


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Erland82*
> 
> 
> Aaaaashiiiiiit.....:S





what in the holy hell are you using to cool that for those temps









i have a osvr sitting in a box i packed up months ago...i could not be assed getting it out right now









also for your vive maybe it is like dirt rally where it chucks a fit with more than blh blah cores...maybe try and limit the cores before you start it see if that works


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obsidience*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Long time lurker here. My first overclock was a Cyrix 166 in highschool, I attempted to o/c to 200 and smoked the bastard. I've been hooked since then LOL. That being said, I would say I'm not an avid overclocker, maybe once every 3-5 years or so.
> 
> So I've read this entire thread from start to finish in the last week or so, my components had been sitting for weeks until I got the bandwidth to assemble them last week:
> 
> 
> Corsair Air 540 (case from previous build, I should have gotten a larger one but oh well)
> ThreadRipper 1950X
> Asus Rog Zenith Extreme
> EKWB Extreme 360 kit with nickel ThreadRipper waterblock (yeah I wished they'd done better too)
> Samsung 960 Pro 512MB
> Asus Turbo GTX 1080
> G.skill TridentZ 2x F4-3200C14D-16GTZ (32GB but I'd like to go to 64GB if the price on this kit drops)
> Vardar Evo fans throughout
> So first off, I'm somewhat old-school. I always lap my AMD procs, I disable turbo boost and c-states and run 100% all the time. Also I overclock memory and cpu separately and test with Prime95 blend and Memtest86 24hrs+. I'm not a big fan of water cooling, many of my recent builds used Noctuas or other high end air so this is my first semi custom loop. I used a very thin later of Arctic Silver 5 using finger spread method. Also more context, I have an 69C air conditioned server room in my house and this PC will be sitting in it. I use Cat6 cabling for HDMI (HDBaseT) and USB extenders to my office. So I'm not going for pretty or quiet as I'm not gonna see the PC or hear it.
> 
> Here's some pics:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been logging my overclocking progress here:
> 
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1t_gGE7fetb7bkc_6W5AVv8guexIRo-4rZqLRSJqsjpc/edit?usp=sharing
> 
> Story short, I was able to get the memory clocked from stock 3200 to 3333 very *easily* using one of the b die presets. Was memtestx86 stable for 5 runs (will do more later). I was able to get the processor "idle" stable in windows at 4.2Ghz and then began the process of clocking down and reducing voltage while testing Prime95. The small FFTs / FFT really kick it's @ss. I was fighting tooth and nail to keep 4.1ghz but that was a nogo and now I'm fighting for 4ghz.
> 
> Like others I'm really questioning some of these "I'm at 4.2" posts. In my mind you aren't stable unless you can torture test the CPU to it's limit, even if that limit is not "realistic" or real world. When I do a new PC build I take weeks to confirm it's completely stable before installing and using it full time.
> 
> I'm really am pushing this CPU hard to try to keep it at 4Ghz. My vcore is 1.45 and LLC at level 5, my last run of Prime95 got through about 16hrs before crashing and the vcore was registering up to 1.526v and 89C (26C ambient). So even at 16hrs I still don't think of this as stable so I'm still tweaking.
> 
> I'd love for some input and advice, anything I can do to bring the temps or voltage down through the BIOS. I'm going to read the Rog Zenith O/C Support thread next (86 pages!).
> 
> Thanks!






problem is i can't talk for that board...from my x370 Baymax time the asus is a bit of a pin to dial in but nice and solid once you do.
one thing it seems to like to do is screw around with all the voltages.

now are you trying p states or straight clock.
try p states
set 4 g in p state 1 and leave the rest alone do not touch the voltage in pstate either just the frequency
go back change vcore to offset and try...crap what was it... 0.175 i think (there is a video with the dude doing it but just be careful and work out the right one







)

reboot back to bios check the voltage.
leave llc on auto or 2 going above that will overvolt like a ...well you know.

this is how i clocked my 1800x and it worked really well with the ryzen power profile.

i can't see it being to much difference(also i have done a pstate overclock on this 1950x and taichi but i am still working out cooling)



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> What kinda temps are you guys gettjng with ek blocks? From what ive seen its worse than liqtech tr4?






ok have a gander.
one ek 420 ce radiator and some fast moving pump











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## crion

@Nizzen Are you still running the [Trident Z RGB] F4-4266C19D-16GTZR (19 19 19 39) @3600 14 14 14 4 DIMM's on the X399 Fatal1ty?

Is it prime95/memory ihc stable?

I have 8 DIMM's(64GB) F4-4266C19D-16GTZR ordered for my Fatal1ty. Hopefully I can get it stable nicely and with lower timings than 4xDIMM DR(64GB).


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Personally speaking?
> 
> https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3681&XTCsid=ov091psmgnrk95p4euqpm401oft6vgjc
> 
> - I don't trust a company that ships out 193784656382 units with the wrong orientation on them (bykski, or whatever they're called).
> - I have no desire to support RGB lightzzz111!!1! craze products (XSPC). If there's one thing that's ruined this market, that's children and their pwetty lightz; not endorsing, not supporting that, ever.
> - I definitely don't want to use a 2011-3 dimensions copper fin plate with an extended base just so i can pretend it was made for TRs (EKWB).
> 
> Have used other products of aqua's thus far, very happy customer, zero complaints personally. I'd actually recommend the 'Vision' line, but those go around 200 euros, so..
> 
> Don't order one just because i said so however.






umm
that particular one the coldplate seems to eb about the same size as the ek block i have.

and
https://www.techpowerup.com/237157/aqua-computer-intros-cuplex-kryos-next-tr4-water-block-for-ryzen-threadripper

according to this they are not going to make a bigger one.
i mean i might be wrong but looking at that then looking at mine the distances seem the same between the mounts and the block itself.
i can't seem to find any data sheet on it either with actual dimensions


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Shoggy
> 
> Bytales said:
> 
> Is there going to be a Version with their LCD on the CPU waterblock ? The massive Socket would have made for a perfect solution implementing such a Thing !
> 
> The news is a bit misleading since it sounds we only have these two blocks. Of course you can get ALL kryos NEXT variants for TR4. By the way: these are the normal blocks and only the mounting accessory is different.
> 
> We had plans to manufacture a revised version (no stupid enlargement) for Threadripper but we also have an eye on its sales volume and it clearly tells us that it is not worth the effort at the moment.
> Posted on Sep 20th 2017, 14:07


you heard it from a rep @ aquacomputer. Just a normal block. markets soft.


----------



## ht_addict

Anyone us Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut?


----------



## sandysuk

I use the Phanteks block, bloomin' massive



Can't comment too much on performance yet I have not go my loop or cooling setup properly built, but even in its current state temps seem good, though it hits 70 after a few hours of priming at 4.175

Does a great job of collecting air in the top corner of the block, I suppose in some blocks you wouldn't see it to be able to sort it.


----------



## crion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> Anyone us Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut?


I plan to, both on TR4 and Vega64. I have a GTX 680 to practise on


----------



## Aenra

Regarding my RGB lightzzz (11!!11!) statement.. While chew* nailed it (and he did, his explanation should have sufficed for everyone), let me add a secondary factor:

The subjective/the aesthetic and what it means when it's taken into account :

This here is science. Science. Numbers. Ergo function first, form last. When we start catering to people (of all ages, my 'children' term was metaphorical) looking for form over function? We start building and designing with form over function. That's the wrong way round. This isn't Italian clotheware, this is transistors and capacitors and resistors and topologies.

We have that in so so many products out there; some may be incapable of noticing it, but it's already there and it has a cost, be it a performance one, a monetary one, or usually both.

That's why i have an issue with this. I can understand why proponents of the whole 'chassis ON my desk, pwetty lightzzz on and bubbles cascading!!11' camp may feel slighted, but again, this is science.

There's only the numbers here. Just the numbers.

When an entire industry shifts such a central mentality so as to accommodate the surface, the superficial, yes, i do mind. Apologies if that offends, but again, this is only, only, about numbers.

(which is also why, to respond to the forum mod participating, i do not endorse such efforts; even when the RGBs can be turned off, such as in the XSPC block discussed here. Because the more they are purchased, the more manufacturers will look into producing them, ergo the more this wrong mentality will solidify further; and it shouldn't)

I know this is off topic, so my apologies 

Edit: As far as the aqua blocks go, i have seen the statement quoted here, yes; what was not quoted here was the question: "will there be LCD blocks for TR4s?". I'm not sure if, given the context, "size" refered to what we care about, or to upper surface where the LCD would be mounted.. Also, have a look at the inside, looks proper to me:





Considering how the bottom does not protrude (relatively to the top), i thought they did it the 'right' way.

For comparison, just so you understand me, the EKWB equivalent:



Lastly, aqua does an have LCD (Vision) blocks by now, so i'm not sure how much weight i'd put on that earlier statement anyway.. if anyone knows i'm wrong, please correct me.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> I use the Phanteks block, bloomin' massive
> 
> 
> 
> Can't comment too much on performance yet I have not go my loop or cooling setup properly built, but even in its current state temps seem good, though it hits 70 after a few hours of priming at 4.175
> 
> Does a great job of collecting air in the top corner of the block, I suppose in some blocks you wouldn't see it to be able to sort it.


4.175. What's your vcore and your CPU?

Beat on that thing as hard as you can. There aren't any results yet for the phanteks.


----------



## sandysuk

Will do, I've not been focusing on CPU (1900X) so take that speed with pinch of salt, it was a quick test (couple of hours







) at ~1.425, have been focussing on getting my RAM to work faster, giving up on that today, will turn to cpu proper once I have wired in all my fans to the rads etc. I have been trying to do it staged and so only have CPU in loop at the moment but that has the unfortunate side effect of fluid going so fast even at lowest pump speed I'm pumping air around the system due to resevior which then collects nicely in the CPU cooler, so its half full of air, I've been using a clothes peg on the tubing to try and slow it down







I need to get some GPUs in, normally run 3x in same loop but I can't make my mind up on what I want to replace my 290s with.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Will do, I've not been focusing on CPU (1900X) so take that speed with pinch of salt, it was a quick test (couple of hours
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) at ~1.425, have been focussing on getting my RAM to work faster, giving up on that today, will turn to cpu proper once I have wired in all my fans to the rads etc. I have been trying to do it staged and so only have CPU in loop at the moment but that has the unfortunate side effect of fluid going so fast even at lowest pump speed I'm pumping air around the system due to resevior which then collects nicely in the CPU cooler, so its half full of air, I've been using a clothes peg on the tubing to try and slow it down
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need to get some GPUs in, normally run 3x in same loop but I can't make my mind up on what I want to replace my 290s with.


Cool, I'd recommend an all AMD system but the prices are thwarting that right now. I'd also steer away from dual cards atm. Price aside 1080ti though.


----------



## TrixX

I did see and interesting review comparing ThreadRipper and Intel's X299 mega CPU's against each other, however in an odd turn they also compared the Vega 64 LC vs the 1080Ti and found that the Vega worked MUCH better on TR4 than the 1080Ti by comparison.

If you can get hold of a Vega64 for close to MSRP with a TR4 CPU you will get a better ROI IMO.


----------



## naddie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *futr_vision*
> 
> Question on RAM. I'm getting a Thredripper 1950X and a ASRock X399 Taichi. I'll be doing a little gaming but nothing crazy. My main push on this system is going to be creative work, machine learning and some crypto mining(both CPU and GPU). I'm looking for RAM at this point(and a video card but that is another question). While I have typically run 16GB or 32GB I am thinking of starting this one off with 65GB(4x16). From everything I've read it looks like my best performance is going to be had running at around 3200 even though the board can supposedly handle 3600+ . Also looks like CL 14 would be another thing to look for. Another thing would be Samsung's B Die . That alone seems to indicate one of these two kits might be my best bet(I know there is also an RGB kit but I don't need superfluous features)
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232208&cm_re=F4-3200C14Q-64GTZ-_-20-232-208-_-Product
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232349&ignorebbr=1&cm_re=F4-3200C14Q-64GTZSW-_-20-232-349-_-Product
> 
> Would this be the way to go?


I know you posted a while ago, but I didn't see any response to you. Like you, I didn't find any info about these kits and interoperability with X399/TR4 so I bought these for my Asus ROG Zenith Extreme and 1950X on hope and dreams. Thankfully, they work as spec'd, no drama.

FYI, F4-3200C14Q-64GTZ and F4-3200C14Q-64GTZSW is the same, just different colors (GTZ = red, GTZSW = white).

If your mobo allows for XMP (for Asus, they call it D.O.C.P.) just use it.

Now, I still had to tweak mine a bit. For some reason, even with D.O.C.P., command rate was auto set to 2T even though the memory can do 1T. Also Bank Cycle Time (tRC) was automatically detected as 72 clocks, even though SPD says it can do 48. I tighten those timings as spec'd by SPD (1T and 48 clocks respectively) and I was still good - passed 24 hours mem stress test.

I also game and mine coins on downtime. So far the longest I go without rebooting is 14 days straight (mining when not actively using the PC so it's always stressed). For the times I do, it's for Windows Updates.

Tip: If you're going for a AIO cooler, get the Enermax Liqtech TR4 240 or 360 (depending on what your case allows). I originally had the NZXT Kraken X62, and the Enermax easily outperforms it by as much as 10c fully loaded (and OC'd at 3.8 GHz). I actually brought it back down to 3.7 GHz to hit between 60-67c 24x7 fully loaded (again, mining on down time).


----------



## naddie

Does anyone have any case suggestions?

I currently have the NZXT S340 Elite in white. I love the aesthetics, but front air flow is very restrictive. It only allows for air to come from the top and bottom. Oh, and you can still fit an EATX mobo in there if you remove the wiring management cover/bar. I currently have to remove the front panel when I anticipate heavy loads to keep temps down. Basically I leave it off now just because it's not worth the trouble but it looks ugly without the front cover (which sucks because I bought it for the aesthetics and people said it wasn't restrictive).

Right now with a 3.7 GHz OC, it can get as high as 73c with cover on, and about 63c with the cover off. I would like to get to 3.8 or 3.9 GHz but I think temps are limiting me.

I love the Fractal Design Meshify C, but it doesn't look like I can shoehorn an EATX mobo into it (I have the Asus Zenith Extreme), and it doesn't even come in white. It's not as clean looking either, but I'll give up the clean front face for better cooling.

Any suggestions for white cases with a clean front like the S340 Elite? I was looking for something with full TG side panel and air intake from all around the sides, not just the top and bottom slits so I can still have a nice clean and flat front face panel.

Current system:

Asus ROG Zenith Extreme X399 EATX mobo
Ryzen TR 1950X
Enermax Liqtech TR4 240
2x EVGA 1080 Ti SLI

Yeah, that thing is a space heater.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naddie*
> 
> Tip: If you're going for a AIO cooler, get the Enermax Liqtech TR4 240 or 360 (depending on what your case allows). I originally had the NZXT Kraken X62, and the Enermax easily outperforms it by as much as 10c fully loaded (and OC'd at 3.8 GHz). I actually brought it back down to 3.7 GHz to hit between 60-67c 24x7 fully loaded (again, mining on down time).


I don't know about the 360, as I've never used one and it's only recently released, but IMO the Arctic Cooling Liquid Freezer 120 / 240 are the best on the market at those sizes. They use practically silent, low static pressure fans (lower rpm and lower static pressure than the competition) and equal or beat all the major names. They're also extremely cheap for what they are, though they offer nothing in the way of frills or monitoring.

If the 360 is similar, I suspect with upgraded fans it would beat the Enermax quite handsomely.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> I don't know about the 360, as I've never used one and it's only recently released, but IMO the Arctic Cooling Liquid Freezer 120 / 240 are the best on the market at those sizes. They use practically silent, low static pressure fans (lower rpm and lower static pressure than the competition) and equal or beat all the major names. They're also extremely cheap for what they are, though they offer nothing in the way of frills or monitoring.
> 
> If the 360 is similar, I suspect with upgraded fans it would beat the Enermax quite handsomely.


The Arctic freezer models are Asetek rebrands. The cold plate is just too small given the size of threadripper. They all work, but not well.

The Enermax should beat the Arctic and every other Asetek design on the market. It is the gold standard for cooling TR aside from a custom loop.


----------



## MarkPost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naddie*
> 
> Does anyone have any case suggestions?
> 
> I currently have the NZXT S340 Elite in white. I love the aesthetics, but front air flow is very restrictive. It only allows for air to come from the top and bottom. Oh, and you can still fit an EATX mobo in there if you remove the wiring management cover/bar. I currently have to remove the front panel when I anticipate heavy loads to keep temps down. Basically I leave it off now just because it's not worth the trouble but it looks ugly without the front cover (which sucks because I bought it for the aesthetics and people said it wasn't restrictive).
> 
> Right now with a 3.7 GHz OC, it can get as high as 73c with cover on, and about 63c with the cover off. I would like to get to 3.8 or 3.9 GHz but I think temps are limiting me.
> 
> I love the Fractal Design Meshify C, but it doesn't look like I can shoehorn an EATX mobo into it (I have the Asus Zenith Extreme), and it doesn't even come in white. It's not as clean looking either, but I'll give up the clean front face for better cooling.
> 
> Any suggestions for white cases with a clean front like the S340 Elite? I was looking for something with full TG side panel and air intake from all around the sides, not just the top and bottom slits so I can still have a nice clean and flat front face panel.
> 
> Current system:
> 
> Asus ROG Zenith Extreme X399 EATX mobo
> Ryzen TR 1950X
> Enermax Liqtech TR4 240
> 2x EVGA 1080 Ti SLI
> 
> Yeah, that thing is a space heater.


well for great air folow, Corsair air series are great, I own a 740 and love it









no white version for 740, but there is a 540 white version: https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Carbide-Windowed-Performance-Computer/dp/B00H8JLM94/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1507133913&sr=8-4&keywords=air+540


----------



## alucardis666

Guess my 4.0Ghz @ 1.25V is a pretty good chip then?


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> The Arctic freezer models are Asetek rebrands. The cold plate is just too small given the size of threadripper. They all work, but not well.
> 
> The Enermax should beat the Arctic and every other Asetek design on the market. It is the gold standard for cooling TR aside from a custom loop.


I've only compared it to Corsair, but it's bigger, though perhaps not as large as the Enermax.

The radiator is also far higher spec than most, including the Enermax AFAIK.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Guess my 4.0Ghz @ 1.25V is a pretty good chip then?


That's a 1950X?

That might be good for 4.2 at under 1.4V with the right cooling.


----------



## RoBiK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naddie*
> 
> Does anyone have any case suggestions?


Parvum L1.0


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RoBiK*
> 
> Parvum L1.0


+1
Got one myself, soon to be utilized fully in terms of radiators etc.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> I've only compared it to Corsair, but it's bigger, though perhaps not as large as the Enermax.
> 
> The radiator is also far higher spec than most, including the Enermax AFAIK.


Maybe it appears bigger? There are a few revisions of the Asetek design, with most of the variation between resellers being plastic/cosmetic. Some use a thicker radiator (helpful). Arctic does offer thicker rads, but more radiator surface area only works if the heat is effectively removed from the CPU. Unless they screwed up royally Enermax should have this one beat.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Maybe it appears bigger? There are a few revisions of the Asetek design, with most of the variation between resellers being plastic/cosmetic. Some use a thicker radiator (helpful). Arctic does offer thicker rads, but more radiator surface area only works if the heat is effectively removed from the CPU. Unless they screwed up royally Enermax should have this one beat.


Rad thickness on the comparable 240s is only about 65% that of the Arctic, so I'm not sure about that. Perhaps the cold plate and pump are that much better though?

Unfortunately, there has been no reputable group testing of AIOs for ages. Almost all the grouped results are of historic tests which they don't redo when they do the new product.

The Arctic 120 cools my 3770K @4.8Ghz to nearly 10C cooler than the H100i V2 (at max) ... though admittedly the Corsair products are hardly a gold standard for AIOs these days.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Rad thickness on the comparable 240s is only about 65% that of the Arctic, so I'm not sure about that. Perhaps the cold plate and pump are that much better though?
> 
> Unfortunately, there has been no reputable group testing of AIOs for ages. Almost all the grouped results are of historic tests which they don't redo when they do the new product.
> 
> The Arctic 120 cools my 3770K @4.8Ghz to nearly 10C cooler than the H100i V2 (at max) ... though admittedly the Corsair products are hardly a gold standard for AIOs these days.


Cold plate and pump are Asetek standard, so they should be identical. If Arctic has a 38mm deep radiator they will be better due to more surface area, but otherwise they are all quite similar.


----------



## naddie

Does it have a cold plate sized specifically for the TR4? That was the main reason I went for the Enermax. Not much of a choice when I was shopping for AIOs.


----------



## futr_vision

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naddie*
> 
> I know you posted a while ago, but I didn't see any response to you. Like you, I didn't find any info about these kits and interoperability with X399/TR4 so I bought these for my Asus ROG Zenith Extreme and 1950X on hope and dreams. Thankfully, they work as spec'd, no drama.
> 
> FYI, F4-3200C14Q-64GTZ and F4-3200C14Q-64GTZSW is the same, just different colors (GTZ = red, GTZSW = white).
> 
> If your mobo allows for XMP (for Asus, they call it D.O.C.P.) just use it.
> 
> Now, I still had to tweak mine a bit. For some reason, even with D.O.C.P., command rate was auto set to 2T even though the memory can do 1T. Also Bank Cycle Time (tRC) was automatically detected as 72 clocks, even though SPD says it can do 48. I tighten those timings as spec'd by SPD (1T and 48 clocks respectively) and I was still good - passed 24 hours mem stress test.
> 
> I also game and mine coins on downtime. So far the longest I go without rebooting is 14 days straight (mining when not actively using the PC so it's always stressed). For the times I do, it's for Windows Updates.
> 
> Tip: If you're going for a AIO cooler, get the Enermax Liqtech TR4 240 or 360 (depending on what your case allows). I originally had the NZXT Kraken X62, and the Enermax easily outperforms it by as much as 10c fully loaded (and OC'd at 3.8 GHz). I actually brought it back down to 3.7 GHz to hit between 60-67c 24x7 fully loaded (again, mining on down time).


Thanks for the info. I ended up with this memory but haven't tested yet because I didn't have a cooler.

https://www.neweggbusiness.com/product/product.aspx?item=9b-20-232-208

I did get a stand-in cooler today. The Noctua NH-U14S. It's only temporary until the Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 comes back in stock....somewhere. When I talked to Enermax in late Spetember they said shipments are going out the beginning of October. Sometime in the next week or so we should start seeing them again.

Went with a Vega 56 for GPU


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> I use the Phanteks block, bloomin' massive
> 
> 
> 
> Can't comment too much on performance yet I have not go my loop or cooling setup properly built, but even in its current state temps seem good, though it hits 70 after a few hours of priming at 4.175
> 
> Does a great job of collecting air in the top corner of the block, I suppose in some blocks you wouldn't see it to be able to sort it.


Got any more pics of that block. Would like to see some close ups. It actually does not look half bad functionally speaking.


----------



## naddie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *futr_vision*
> 
> Thanks for the info. I ended up with this memory but haven't tested yet because I didn't have a cooler.
> 
> https://www.neweggbusiness.com/product/product.aspx?item=9b-20-232-208
> 
> I did get a stand-in cooler today. The Noctua NH-U14S. It's only temporary until the Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 comes back in stock....somewhere. When I talked to Enermax in late Spetember they said shipments are going out the beginning of October. Sometime in the next week or so we should start seeing them again.
> 
> Went with a Vega 56 for GPU


Cool. i hope you have an easy time with the memory as I did.

I also have the Noctua HSF for TR4, but I got the 120mm version. It's for backup in case my AIO goes south. Always good to have a backup plan.

I used it when I returned the Kraken X62 and was waiting for Enermax stock. It did OK, but I'm sure my case didn't help. I was missing a front case fan because I had to return the Kraken AIO cooler, and only have a single 120 mm fan laying around.

Even with the stand-in HSF, you should be able to use the memory to the best of it's abilities.


----------



## Erland82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> what in the holy hell are you using to cool that for those temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have a osvr sitting in a box i packed up months ago...i could not be assed getting it out right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also for your vive maybe it is like dirt rally where it chucks a fit with more than blh blah cores...maybe try and limit the cores before you start it see if that works
> 
> problem is i can't talk for that board...from my x370 Baymax time the asus is a bit of a pin to dial in but nice and solid once you do.
> one thing it seems to like to do is screw around with all the voltages.
> 
> now are you trying p states or straight clock.
> try p states
> set 4 g in p state 1 and leave the rest alone do not touch the voltage in pstate either just the frequency
> go back change vcore to offset and try...crap what was it... 0.175 i think (there is a video with the dude doing it but just be careful and work out the right one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> reboot back to bios check the voltage.
> leave llc on auto or 2 going above that will overvolt like a ...well you know.
> will try to test with p states next.
> 
> this is how i clocked my 1800x and it worked really well with the ryzen power profile.
> 
> i can't see it being to much difference(also i have done a pstate overclock on this 1950x and taichi but i am still working out cooling)
> 
> 
> ok have a gander.
> one ek 420 ce radiator and some fast moving pump
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I have an Ek tr4 wb, d5 pump and a 480 rad in the Thermaltake core P5. I Also have a heatsink on the "backplate" of the cpu socket with a fan blowing on it.
I also spread the thermal paste all over the cpu before mounting the wb, that made a big difference vs the recommended way.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Got any more pics of that block. Would like to see some close ups. It actually does not look half bad functionally speaking.


If you want something specific I can do it but Phanteks website seems to have decent photos.

https://www.phanteksusa.com/products/phanteks-glacier-series-c399a-amd-tr4-cpu-block


----------



## chew*

Was trying to see if they were diverting a split flow for balanced temps like bykski and xspc is doing.

It fairly crucial in the design so that one die is not heating the other die up before it exits.

Other than that it looks decent.


----------



## sandysuk

Watching temps in hwbot the dies track at the same temp, to be honest I didn't even look at it in that much detail beyond 'ooo shiny







' just bought the first full TR block I find in stock.


----------



## chew*

Lol

I can get this swiftech within .2 to .5c but running full load there is still a little variance.

Just the way the inlet hits and the outlet exits and which core it hits first.

Keep in mind I have no clue what this block was tuned for. I know it was not TR thats about all I know.



Keep in mind we are probably trying to cool the dies with the outside traffic. AMD would have chose to use those 2 for best performance imo.

Orientation is wrong ( flip it clockwise for the way it sits in our cases ) but in this pic...top right and bottom left.

Technically there is no TR tuned block so to speak if this is the case.

Blocks are tuned for epyc ( some of them )...but work on TR.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> If you want something specific I can do it but Phanteks website seems to have decent photos.
> 
> https://www.phanteksusa.com/products/phanteks-glacier-series-c399a-amd-tr4-cpu-block


Found it on newegg buying.


----------



## sandysuk

overclockers.co.uk


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> I did see and interesting review comparing ThreadRipper and Intel's X299 mega CPU's against each other, however in an odd turn they also compared the Vega 64 LC vs the 1080Ti and found that the Vega worked MUCH better on TR4 than the 1080Ti by comparison.
> 
> If you can get hold of a Vega64 for close to MSRP with a TR4 CPU you will get a better ROI IMO.


Any links for those reviews? That's certainly an interesting, and somewhat mind-boggling result. As if somehow the Vega card and TR4 wink at each other and try a little bit harder to perform?

Only thing I can see is some non-independence in drivers, or undocumented aspects of Vega that TR4 waves its mighty arms, and magically unlocks?

Someone send me a Vega 64 and I promise to do a bench against a 1080 ti.


----------



## chew*

I noticed the same with fury x. Its basically vega with less ram and clocks.

Does extremely well. Not really surprising. AMD probably tests inhouse mainly with there own hardware thus optimizes for there own hardware.


----------



## Dotachin

Looking around Amazon for 4x8GB ram, found plenty of high speed Corsair Vengeance kits around $360ish. Is it safe to assume they use Samsung B-Die at 3400 C16?

If not, I would really appreciate some help with the specific models:
CMU32GX4M4C3466C16 ($350 with white leds, perfect for a Taichi)
CMK32GX4M4B3733C17R ($390, temporarily out of stock)

Backups:
CMU32GX4M4C3466C16R $370
CMK32GX4M4C3400C16 $345
CMU32GX4M4C3400C16R $360
And a Crusial Ballistix Elite one just in case at $372 BLE4K8G4D34AEEAK


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Looking around Amazon for 4x8GB ram, found plenty of high speed Corsair Vengeance kits around $360ish. Is it safe to assume they use Samsung B-Die at 3400 C16?
> 
> If not, I would really appreciate some help with the specific models:
> CMU32GX4M4C3466C16 ($350 with white leds, perfect for a Taichi)
> CMK32GX4M4B3733C17R ($390, temporarily out of stock)
> 
> Backups:
> CMU32GX4M4C3466C16R $370
> CMK32GX4M4C3400C16 $345
> CMU32GX4M4C3400C16R $360
> And a Crusial Ballistix Elite one just in case at $372 BLE4K8G4D34AEEAK


Chances of B die @ cl16 is a lottery. I got a vengence kit 3200 thats b die but I was fairly shocked. However, non b-die works fine and people need to stop freaking out about it.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Chances of B die @ cl16 is a lottery. I got a vengence kit 3200 thats b die but I was fairly shocked. However, non b-die works fine and people need to stop freaking out about it.


Install 8x16gb of anything but samsung.

You pick it. Samsung not allowed.

Lmk how that works out for you









http://www.overclock.net/t/1638140/asrock-x399-taichi-fatality-overclocking-and-unofficial-support/60#post_26369033

No post impossible to run = freak out after I dunno $1300 spent


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Chances of B die @ cl16 is a lottery. I got a vengence kit 3200 thats b die but I was fairly shocked. However, non b-die works fine and people need to stop freaking out about it.


Yes at 3200 I agree but those are all 3400+ c16 kits


----------



## chew*

Here is breakdown.

Ignore CL. 16-16-16 = bdie

16-17-17 or looser is not.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Here is breakdown.
> 
> Ignore CL. 16-16-16 = bdie
> 
> 16-17-17 or looser is not.


Thanks for your input @chew*, I know you're an expert here. However in this case it seems I can prove you wrong.
I found this

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/62vp2g/clearing_up_any_samsung_bdie_confusion_eg_on/
 (it's not at all complete though) and it would seem the CMU32GX4M4C3400C16R is B-die despite being 16-18-18-36









Late edit: CMK32GX4M4B3733C17R is B-die as well by this list


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Thanks for your input @chew*, I know you're an expert here. However in this case it seems I can prove you wrong.
> I found this
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/62vp2g/clearing_up_any_samsung_bdie_confusion_eg_on/
> (it's not at all complete though) and it would seem the CMU32GX4M4C3400C16R is B-die despite being 16-18-18-36


Be sure to verify version. Thats a risky buy. 5.xx = micron if that helps.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> Any links for those reviews? That's certainly an interesting, and somewhat mind-boggling result. As if somehow the Vega card and TR4 wink at each other and try a little bit harder to perform?
> 
> Only thing I can see is some non-independence in drivers, or undocumented aspects of Vega that TR4 waves its mighty arms, and magically unlocks?
> 
> Someone send me a Vega 64 and I promise to do a bench against a 1080 ti.


Well I could do that, but I won't I need my card









Looking for the review I saw, could be HardwareCanucks or Paul's Hardware, can't quite remember after the hundreds of Ryzen/ThreadRipper/7980XE/7960X tests I've watched recently!

I'll post it when I find it.

Was a very very intriguing result as the Vega was going toe to toe with the 1080Ti with the big CPU's.

EDIT: Found it








Turns out to be Hardware Unboxed


----------



## chew*

Well this is certainly interesting but a long way left to go.


----------



## cargograph

I want to put 4 Graphic cards in the PCIE slots, do you know if this one would fit?

EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB SC2 Video Card

Or do you know of any model that would work? Or maybe using a specific motherboard? I was thinking in the Zenith but I am not sure.

Also, do you think this RAM is B-Die?

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232205

Thanks a lot guys!


----------



## chew*

Thats definitely b die.

I can fit 2 fury x side by side in taichi....but you need to pull the I/O cover as it hits thick backplate cards in slot 1.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Well this is certainly interesting but a long way left to go.


looks like the settings I run on mine, though I have the 8Gb sticks it will prime/memtest at 3466 all day but the blooming thing wouldn't cold boot that speed, had to drop back to 3333.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Chances of B die @ cl16 is a lottery. I got a vengence kit 3200 thats b die but I was fairly shocked. However, non b-die works fine and people need to stop freaking out about it.


I had trouble getting Samsung E Die to even post. B die is really good stuff. I went through a grand worth of RAM before I could hit 3200. I should've just bought G Skill. Fortunately I was able to return my mistakes.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cargograph*
> 
> I want to put 4 Graphic cards in the PCIE slots, do you know if this one would fit?
> 
> EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB SC2 Video Card


If you are going to water cool them (with 4 you'd need too) I would look out for ones with single slot ability, typically the ones with blower cooler and no DVI they will fit no problem with a single slot bracket, I am sure EVGA actually have them one one of their models

Doing this would allow you to still use 1x slots etc.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> looks like the settings I run on mine, though I have the 8Gb sticks it will prime/memtest at 3466 all day but the blooming thing wouldn't cold boot that speed, had to drop back to 3333.


8 gig sticks are fairly easy.

This is a pretty big deal seeing as they are Dual Rank....

For the majority over 3200 won't even post much less cold boot.

Until you use a set you can not appreciate the effort involved that people put in to tuning them.

fyi I am only @ 1.38v.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cargograph*
> 
> I want to put 4 Graphic cards in the PCIE slots, do you know if this one would fit?
> 
> EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB SC2 Video Card
> 
> Or do you know of any model that would work? Or maybe using a specific motherboard? I was thinking in the Zenith but I am not sure.
> 
> Also, do you think this RAM is B-Die?
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232205
> 
> Thanks a lot guys!


The SC2 is a 2 slot card, so it will fit. Unless you've got a crap tom of airflow you'll throttle with 4 of them, so you will need full cover water blocks at which point the black is a better choice (the extra hraders on the sc2 are incompatible with fe bocks).

Go Gigabyte (or EVGA hydro copper or MSI EK if you can find then). Or just go Gigabyte. They seem to bin the water force wb cards pretty well.


Excuse the mess. I use 1/2 ID and I like to cut my tubing long enough to make things easily serviceable.


----------



## happyluckbox

So is there an actual difference in performance between say 14cas 3200mhz samsung b die and 15cas 3200mhz that is also samsung b die?


----------



## chew*

No but DR at same settings as single rank = faster.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> No but DR at same settings as single rank = faster.


I'm probably wrong, but based on the reddit list posted earlier I thought B-die (Gskill included) is single rank only?
Listed dual rank sets are all Samsung D, E or S die. Are them better than B die?
Edit: they also seem to be 4gb sticks, not 8gb nevermind


----------



## Simmons572

Sup folks. I am looking to start doing some benching/stress testing on my 1900x. Currently my CPU is clocked at 4.1 GHz @ 1.3v.

Aside from cinebench, what softwares would you all recommend? Also, what is a target score that I should be shooting for with the 1900x?

Any help is appreciated


----------



## sandysuk

Prime95 will certain put it under some load @4.2 I cannot contain the long term temperature load, I'm just managing to contain 4.1 at 68 degrees with reasonable fans speeds, I thought it might do better than that having less cores than a 1950x but not yet, I've still got some work to do on acceptable LLC though as I have see up to 1.47v.

Course wether Prime represents a realistic load for a gaming machine is another matter but I'd imagine it would similarly load under encoding.

Not sure what everyone else uses. Regarding CB score not sure what is good, not many have a 1900x, I am at 176/1851, which is OK, sort of, looks OK for Ryzen, in the ball park with a similarly clocked 1800x but is only couple of points faster than my ivybridge i5 in single core that I have upgraded from









Not seen any reviews for comparison so here are some numbers, be interesting to see if you fare better.

CPUZ here


Some 3dmark CPU tests

TimeSpy
Firestrike

KrayBench 4920


----------



## crion

I took advantage of a pricedrop and snatched a G.Skill F4-4200C19Q2-64GTZSW 8x8 kit instead. No pretty RGB but they look awesome anyways. Will play around with the timings, but it feels good to have a complete set if RMA is needed or whatever.

PSU Arrived today, EVGA 1600W T2, unbelievably heavy package!


----------



## boldenc

Could someone confirm if the Corsair RGB 3600MHz C18 is using Samsung B-Die ?


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boldenc*
> 
> Could someone confirm if the Corsair RGB 3600MHz C18 is using Samsung B-Die ?


Which one?

you can try here:

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/62vp2g/clearing_up_any_samsung_bdie_confusion_eg_on/%5B/URL


----------



## boldenc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Which one?
> 
> you can try here:
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/62vp2g/clearing_up_any_samsung_bdie_confusion_eg_on/%5B/URL


CMR32GX4M4C3600C18


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boldenc*
> 
> CMR32GX4M4C3600C18


They are B-die by the hardwareluxx link in my other post, but nothing is certain until you buy.


----------



## chew*

4x16g DR @ 14-13-13-28 3333 1.38v


----------



## Leijido

Please delete or move this post if not allowed or not in the right section.

Will a 1900x overclocked be better for 5k resolution gaming with two 1080 TIs in sli than a 8700k overclocked? I know more pcie lanes will help even if a little bit for sli but can it beat the 8700k for sure at 5k? Thanks for the help and sorry if this is not the right place to ask.


----------



## chew*

I would say due to lack of 4k gaming reviews that until someone tests platforms not cpus for high res gaming I would wait.


----------



## Leijido

Thanks, will be waiting


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> Sup folks. I am looking to start doing some benching/stress testing on my 1900x. Currently my CPU is clocked at 4.1 GHz @ 1.3v.
> 
> Aside from cinebench, what softwares would you all recommend? Also, what is a target score that I should be shooting for with the 1900x?
> 
> Any help is appreciated





kraybench
corona 1.3
cpuz bench
kreig extreme math

realbench 2.54
3dmark skydiver
wprime

all good and all easy to read and easy to see performance gains...plus they are generally consistent results like wprime i can run 10 times and generally get the same score in a sitting change one thing the bench results alter but consistently.

realbench is hit and miss i generally run the image bench by itself to warm it up then do a 2 or 3 run loop (be careful if you have the speakers up dooof dooof music is not for everyone







)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leijido*
> 
> Please delete or move this post if not allowed or not in the right section.
> 
> Will a 1900x overclocked be better for 5k resolution gaming with two 1080 TIs in sli than a 8700k overclocked? I know more pcie lanes will help even if a little bit for sli but can it beat the 8700k for sure at 5k? Thanks for the help and sorry if this is not the right place to ask.


read the reviews.

i have seen i think 6 reviews and every single one of them have different results...some have the 8700k eating the amd chips others have them on parity with say the 1700x and 1800x in most things
but
in games it wins hands down...no real need to overclock it unless you are short a space heater in the house or hate trees and want to use all the power









sorry they aren't as bad as the 79xx series but still not great.

also think long and hard...the 8700k is on the 370 chipset you HAVE to get a 370 board and you are limited to dual channel and 16 pcie lanes so sli is 16x 8x and bugger off if you want a bunch of nvme drives









revamped old platform...and in a year guess what intel will do.... yeah that's right new cpu...but...you will eed a new board.

sorry but i have no interest in changing boards every 5 minutes...

now
the amd x399 and the x370 have been pretty much guaranteed for 3 years..so when zen 2 drops etc...buy new chip insert new chip (well bios update first







) enjoy

plus 64 pcie lanes etc etc etc oh bootable nvme raid if that floats your boat as well...oh and quad channel

now also the 1900x is faster than the 1800x it might not be huge but it is there plus they overclock better AND over here in the land of taxes a 1900x is 749 a 8700k is 549 so only really 200 more and the motherboards of coarse are a bit dearer but ones like the taichi here is $499 the z370's start at 229 and then skyrocket.

so about 400 more in total for the platform.

but the question is will it be faster in gaming
short answer is yes quite easily UNLESS you play at 4k and above....then the difference drops.

http://www.techradar.com/reviews/intel-core-i7-8700k

just an example not the best one









if i find a sli based one i will throw it in.


----------



## Leijido

@tarot: Thank you, very helpful. I guess I'll wait for the sli benchmarks just to ease my ocd like thoughts lol. It will be for 2880p gaming with sli.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leijido*
> 
> Please delete or move this post if not allowed or not in the right section.
> 
> Will a 1900x overclocked be better for 5k resolution gaming with two 1080 TIs in sli than a 8700k overclocked? I know more pcie lanes will help even if a little bit for sli but can it beat the 8700k for sure at 5k? Thanks for the help and sorry if this is not the right place to ask.


I was torn on this myself I went for 1900x, my reasoning was that it gave me the a platform with some expandability for a reasonable price. It's not been as easy to configure for performance as my Intel setups, but you'll enjoy it if you like tinkering, if you just want it to be quick out of the box buy Intel.

The 1900X performs well but Intel chips are better for gaming, if that is your sole focus then 8700k should be considered, but in addition, the 7700k is also a better chip for gaming than a 1900X, one of these paired with a board with PLX chip, like Asrock z270 Supercarrier will run your GPUs fines with minimal overhead from the PLX switch, I used to run 3 cards in a z77 with PLX and it flew along, system used to be in the 3dmark hall of fame back in the day despite not having one of the fancy pants HEDT platforms, so it won't limit much.

Depends on how you feel about buy an already dead platform, no new chips coming out on it.

I'm sure z370 boards with PLX will appear eventually.

At higher resolutions CPU has less of an impact so you won't feel hard done by either way to be honest.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leijido*
> 
> Please delete or move this post if not allowed or not in the right section.
> 
> Will a 1900x overclocked be better for 5k resolution gaming with two 1080 TIs in sli than a 8700k overclocked? I know more pcie lanes will help even if a little bit for sli but can it beat the 8700k for sure at 5k? Thanks for the help and sorry if this is not the right place to ask.


At 4K, a 1900X OC'd is likely to be anywhere between 99% as fast to ~103% (faster) as a 8700k at 5Ghz across a broad range of games, depending on what memory you manage to get running on it. 5K I can't imagine it not being either par or faster.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leijido*
> 
> @tarot: Thank you, very helpful. I guess I'll wait for the sli benchmarks just to ease my ocd like thoughts lol. It will be for 2880p gaming with sli.


Good luck with those. Very few places will do those.

Though something to consider, 1080Ti's are the current king, no doubt. However for a TR4 system it seems there is a distinct improvement in parity with Vega vs 1080Ti. In some tests there was only a couple of percent in it and often the lows were better with Vega. Vega does support mGPU now too (though we hope the next driver improves compatibility).

The Hardware Unboxed bench testing of the 7980XE and 7960X vs the 1950X and 1920X using both Nvidia and AMD GPU's was quite enlightening. Seeing as AMD's mGPU setup is usually more effective than Nvidia's SLI it certainly bears consideration as an option.


----------



## Leijido

Thanks everyone for the replies. I would still rather prefer native 16x/16x pcie rather than plx but I will mull it over some more. Gaming will be the only thing so I still don't know if getting 1900x only for gaming will be wasting its full potential.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leijido*
> 
> Thanks everyone for the replies. I would still rather prefer native 16x/16x pcie rather than plx but I will mull it over some more. Gaming will be the only thing so I still don't know if getting 1900x only for gaming will be wasting its full potential.


Not at all. Of the TR4 chips it's the one suited to high end gaming rather than media creation while gaming









It's literally designed to be a high binned version of the 1800X allowing more overclocking headroom (though not by much) and the full suite of 64 PCI-E lanes plus the obvious M.2 slots, quad channel ram up to 1TB of the stuff (there's not even availble DIMM's to get that much in there yet!). So yeah it's the ultimate for Gaming in the AMD range, but you do pay a wee bit extra for the product vs an overclocked 1700. Though of course there's less of a Silicon Lottery risk with the 1900X too.


----------



## TheScarecow

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Good luck with those. Very few places will do those.
> 
> Though something to consider, 1080Ti's are the current king, no doubt. However for a TR4 system it seems there is a distinct improvement in parity with Vega vs 1080Ti. In some tests there was only a couple of percent in it and often the lows were better with Vega. Vega does support mGPU now too (though we hope the next driver improves compatibility).
> 
> The Hardware Unboxed bench testing of the 7980XE and 7960X vs the 1950X and 1920X using both Nvidia and AMD GPU's was quite enlightening. Seeing as AMD's mGPU setup is usually more effective than Nvidia's SLI it certainly bears consideration as an option.


If someone is wanting to game at 4k it makes zero sense to buy a vega gpu, hell even at the 1080 level it makes zero sense to buy a vega. Only the most blinded of AMD fan boys cant see how much of a giant wet steaming fart of a card it is.

And as someone who has a balls to the wall 1950x at 4.2ghz and sli 1080tis.....get a 8700k overclock it to 5-5.2ghz and sli 1080tis or titans as that will be a much superior gaming experience then anything AMD has to offer


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> If someone is wanting to game at 4k it makes zero sense to buy a vega gpu, hell even at the 1080 level it makes zero sense to buy a vega. Only the most blinded of AMD fan boys cant see how much of a giant wet steaming fart of a card it is.
> 
> And as someone who has a balls to the wall 1950x at 4.2ghz and sli 1080tis.....get a 8700k overclock it to 5-5.2ghz and sli 1080tis or titans as that will be a much superior gaming experience then anything AMD has to offer


Having used both companies parts quite a lot over the last few years, there's a few reasons I choose to go AMD over Nvidia, but hey each to their own.

As for Vega being a steaming wet fart, well that's your opinion. I'm perfectly happy with mine got it for less than a GTX1070 and getting performance above a 1080. It's not quite a Ti, but I'm going to wait to see what I can get from it watercooled. Some of them have been utter crap though, I was quite lucky I think, whereas my mate got the same one at the same time from the same vendor and can barely undervolt the thing and can't overclock it at all.

SLI 1080 Ti's are great, but then again only in supported titles, just like mGPU Vega's. So if considering dual cards both are fine for 4K or 5K performance, with the caveat that you get a good pair of Vega's. Get a duff one and you'll be tearing hair out









Oh and I wouldn't get the 8700K for dual cards, especially if you plan to use more than 1 M.2 SSD. 16 PCI-E lanes just aren't enough any more.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> 4x16g DR @ 14-13-13-28 3333 1.38v


Wow DR above 3000? is it B-die or D/E? I still got a couple weeks left to decide


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> If someone is wanting to game at 4k it makes zero sense to buy a vega gpu, hell even at the 1080 level it makes zero sense to buy a vega. Only the most blinded of AMD fan boys cant see how much of a giant wet steaming fart of a card it is.
> 
> And as someone who has a balls to the wall 1950x at 4.2ghz and sli 1080tis.....get a 8700k overclock it to 5-5.2ghz and sli 1080tis or titans as that will be a much superior gaming experience then anything AMD has to offer


I game at 1440p and Vega is well equipped to handle that and im write certain of the 1080 can do 4k, Vega shouldn't have a problem. As far as Vega being a crap card for gaming my 2 rigs begs to differ, it is also buttery smooth, which leads me to believe that AMD knew what they were doing when they did the Vega tour. Nothing like playing on a choppy system. I have both Vega cards setup on "competing" platforms, x99 and x399... my experience on both system leads me to believe Vega is smoother on the full AMD platform. My fps are higher on the Intel based system but smoothness on the AMD is definitely greater.

Perception is a helluva thing but isn't that what it's all about, how one feel as the end user?

All the eye candy does not need to be on at 4k, as that resolution itself sharpens your overall picture.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> If someone is wanting to game at 4k it makes zero sense to buy a vega gpu, hell even at the 1080 level it makes zero sense to buy a vega. Only the most blinded of AMD fan boys cant see how much of a giant wet steaming fart of a card it is.
> 
> And as someone who has a balls to the wall 1950x at 4.2ghz and sli 1080tis.....get a 8700k overclock it to 5-5.2ghz and sli 1080tis or titans as that will be a much superior gaming experience then anything AMD has to offer


Complete nonsense re: CPU choice at 4K or 5K.

Also, if you're at 4K or 5K, it's fairly safe to assume that AA is redundant, in which case, you're removing the main drag on Vega's performance - non-shader based AA.

Once you get rid of SSAA or MSAA, Vega is extremely quick. It does outperform the 1080Ti in a good number of games even at 1920x1080 when both cards have AA disabled.

Also, as the linked Youtube video hints at, and more people are discovering, the AMD display driver seems to significantly prefer Zen processors in both DX11 and DX12 titles. Ashes Vulkan seems to be the same. So an all AMD rig appears to have its benefits.

If you're going to crank up the SSAA or MSAA at 1920x1080, or 2560x1440, then sure, an 8700k with a 1080Ti is probably going to perform much better.


----------



## sandysuk

The linked youtube is done at 1080p, it's not performing too badly but as the res go up I think it struggle, for example, Vega is better than 1080Ti in Forza 7 by a significant amount but it loose that advantage at 4k and the Ti claws back and is quicker than Vega, most likely because 8Gb is not enough VRAM for high res, don't think you'd want to use Vega on 4k/5k with only 8Gb VRAM, also just because you are at 4k doesn't mean AA is not required, sure if you have one of those silly 28" 4k screens where you don't get the real estate benefits of 4k due to dpi scaling maybe but I am gaming on 43" screen I use for CAD with zero dpi scaling as I have bigger pixels and and lots of lovely real estate so little bit of AA doesn't hurt.

Who games at 1080p, blimey even my phone does a higher resolution for games these days


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> The linked youtube is done at 1080p, Vega is better than 1080Tin Forza 7 by a significant amount but it loose that advantage at 4k and the Ti claws back and is quicker than Vega, most likely because 8Gb is not enough VRAM for high res, don't think you'd want to use Vega on 4k/5k with only 8Gb VRAM, also just because you are at 4k doesn't mean AA is not required, sure if you have one of those silly 28" 4k screens where you don't get the real estate benefits of 4k due to dpi scaling maybe but I am gaming on 43" screen I use for CAD with zero dpi scaling as I have bigger pixels and and lots of lovely real estate so little bit of AA doesn't hurt.
> 
> Who games at 1080p, blimey even my phone does a higher resolution for games these days


Actually Forza is a very very interesting anomaly. Something is messing with the 1080Ti at the lower end resolutions and some may say even being CPU bottlenecked, though I don't think it's the CPU, I think it's a driver level issue holding it back.

Vega is very capable against the Ti in higher resolutions and if going mGPU though it's only just been activated on Vega I would prefer an AMD setup to an Nvidia SLI setup any day. Both have their issues and personal bias is coming through there as both would do the job at 5K admirably.


----------



## sandysuk

I'm not anti AMD GPUs, I'm coming from 3x290s after a long run of SLI systems and have been very happy with them, apart from having to game in my underpants due to the heat my system kicked out







I am even running a 480 temporarily whilst I do this new TR build as I can't decide what to put in the case GPU wise, I just haven't found a compelling case for Vega, it just doesn't seem strong enough for the dough.

Would love to see some SLI/crossfile back to back 4k reviews, that would help, they are just not around.


----------



## TrixX

Well if I can get another Vega I'll chuck out an mGPU review of it









Don't have the dough for dual 1080 Ti's to test by comparison, unless I can convince MSI or EVGA to send me some for testing


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> If someone is wanting to game at 4k it makes zero sense to buy a vega gpu, hell even at the 1080 level it makes zero sense to buy a vega. Only the most blinded of AMD fan boys cant see how much of a giant wet steaming fart of a card it is.
> 
> And as someone who has a balls to the wall 1950x at 4.2ghz and sli 1080tis.....get a 8700k overclock it to 5-5.2ghz and sli 1080tis or titans as that will be a much superior gaming experience then anything AMD has to offer


At higher resolutions the IPC advantage of single threaded performance becomes less important. I bought a 1920X because I was tired of Intel not moving the ball forwards performance wise for serious computing. I'm pretty confident they would not have released Coffee Lake when they did if Zen wasn't competitive (because lets face it the FX series was pretty terrible for games, I had one for fun and I'm glad I was on a 4930K for my main machine).


----------



## ajc9988

So angry right now. Had to buy a used waterblock for a 980 Ti Classy. Got to leak testing the build this morning. The block holds water when sitting still, but leaks like a sieve once you turn on a pump. I've contacted EK to ask if they have a seal I can purchase, since I am the second or later owner of the block. But setbacks SUCK!!!


----------



## Leijido

Thanks again for the replies, everyone. I will still try to wait for 8700k sli benchmarks even if they're not for 4k/5k. As for vega, I think it's definitely a contender for runner up best gpu but was still a little disappointed when it couldn't completely match 1080 ti at 4k when it launched even though I knew it wouldn't when the price for vega was announced.


----------



## chew*

So this benchmark is interesting.

It scales with timings and memory speed and or does not ( unstable/to aggressive/just flat out bad timing combos = penalty. Scores drop so you don't get a cookie for suicide crap thank god )

Anyway here is some testing I did and its rather progressive gains.

The one 3333 DR run was not tuned as well as the 3466 SR (4x8gb) therefore it lost.

fwiw I have not really sat down and tuned SR to much on system so I am sure I can beat DR 3333 with 3466 SR.

Anyway I thought it was a really cool bench in the fact that it definitely shows the benefits from fabric/memory speeds providing you keep latency equal. I'm fairly certain loose 3466 and even 3600 will lose as the benchmark absolutely benefits from tighter timings as well as speed.


----------



## sandysuk

what benchmark is it?


----------



## chew*

Corona 1.3

Takes 1 min to run. Trying to break sub 1 minute @ a fixed 4.0 cpu speed.

I can beat it at 4.1 but i am testing it like I would compete in a low clock challenge to see gains from everything but cpu speed.


----------



## ChronoBodi

so 28GB/s reads is a thing with Raid 0 960 NVMEs.... a lot of them on TR.


----------



## crion

@ChronoBodi yes, going with 3x nVME's in RAID 0 on my X399 build. But ofcourse a bit tempting with more.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Ok I guess I can move on to real stability tests again and sort out this dual VGA crap if its still there after I flash.


Just something to consider in looking at your dual VGA issues.

The Taichi boards, all x399 as far as I am aware, are arranged x16 x8 x16 x8. The TR chips have two PCIE controllers providing 32 lanes each, one on each die.

I am not sure if you are doing this or not but while it may appear that using the two x16 slots is the best approach for performance, you are in fact, connecting the two cards to two separate PCIe Controllers that are doing the crossfiore communication via a connection over the Infinity fabric interconnects which adds an extra 100ns in latency every time there is a data transfer between the two cards. I suspect that you will have a better experience both performance and stability wise if you use the first x16 and x8 slots for the two graphics cards.


----------



## crion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Just something to consider in looking at your dual VGA issues.
> 
> The Taichi boards, all x399 as far as I am aware, are arranged x16 x8 x16 x8. The TR chips have two PCIE controllers providing 32 lanes each, one on each die.
> 
> I am not sure if you are doing this or not but while it may appear that using the two x16 slots is the best approach for performance, you are in fact, connecting the two cards to two separate PCIe Controllers that are doing the crossfiore communication via a connection over the Infinity fabric interconnects which adds an extra 100ns in latency every time there is a data transfer between the two cards. I suspect that you will have a better experience both performance and stability wise if you use the first x16 and x8 slots for the two graphics cards.


Interesting! and This we will have to benchmark!









I'm also going dual mgpu with Vega 64 in 2018.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Just something to consider in looking at your dual VGA issues.
> 
> The Taichi boards, all x399 as far as I am aware, are arranged x16 x8 x16 x8. The TR chips have two PCIE controllers providing 32 lanes each, one on each die.
> 
> I am not sure if you are doing this or not but while it may appear that using the two x16 slots is the best approach for performance, you are in fact, connecting the two cards to two separate PCIe Controllers that are doing the crossfiore communication via a connection over the Infinity fabric interconnects which adds an extra 100ns in latency every time there is a data transfer between the two cards. I suspect that you will have a better experience both performance and stability wise if you use the first x16 and x8 slots for the two graphics cards.


Tested same issue.

The issue is not in 3d its in desktop.

My 3d runs fine in both 16x slots. In fact i took timespy records with my fury x in single and dual card.

When you figure out why mouse/system locks up/frees up 10-15 secs later on desktop though with dual fury x vgas lmk.

I have 0 issues extracting performance from platform quite the contrary. I have 0 issues with a single fury x.. I have 0 issues with stability.

What i have appears to some conflict driver wise as uninstalling chipset drivers makes the dual fury x desktop issue 90% worse.


----------



## Aby67

SLI is end of life

Once Pcie 4.0 motherboards will surface the market, anytime from now to CES in January, or with RYzen 2 launch.
I would NOT spend a dime on Intel CPUs at all, as these last released are the last CPUs that can offer just a tad more performance because of the very small L3 cache size, allowing them to clock higher and setting higher tdp.
You need to understand that Intel cpus that currently around are just re branded old CPUs with different settings, and it is basically impossible for Intel to squeeze any more performance out of these overall Sandy bridge derivatives.
They wil shrink the process, with tons of headaches and the chips will cost ****loads of money to make and their profits will dramatically reduce even further, while AMD will instead exponentially increase performance, performance per watt while keeping the same price tags.
This will go on as I said until PCIe 5.0 in 2020 2021.
With the increased bandwidth AMD will make even bigger performance leaps.
AS for the GTX 1080ti, it is overall a good GPU, but no where close to what Nvidia GPUs wil be able to deliver on HBM2 or even and way cheaper HBM3.
You can be sure that with HBM2 the performance increases at least by double compared to gddr5x.
So...bottom line
Not worth buying AMD at this point NOR NVIDIA NOR for the next 4 years INTEL.
You would be wise to wait February march to get new pcie gen 4 motherboard with AMD ryzen 2 and new generation memory Nvidia graphics which will be capable to run ANY 4k title on one single gpu and 144Hz 1440 VR headsets minimum frame rates.
As for those idiots who call out for AMD fan boys...they better understand how stupid they are into making such remarks, when you can basically stack up tons of compotuers on AMD platforms, compared to Intel obsolete ecosystem.
I wish to add on top, that CInebech is not a real benchmark,while it can be used as a reference, for these kind of multicore CPus, as it doesnt make use of L3 Cache the benchmark is really synthetic and useless....
In CInebench intel 7980XE shows 30% better score than the AMD 1950X, but in the real world scenario eg using Vray benchmark the gap is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay less than 10%...and it will likely become even or beat intel as Ram memory drivers get released month on month......Eventually Amd cpus will run at a certain point 4266 Mhz memory with superlow latency, as Samsung refines their manufacturing process and binning...and Intel will not benefit much of the higher clocked memory, as a matter of fact, on windows 10 it is likely that Intel will suffer from faster ram or higher bandwidths.
To end I would like to say that Intel is seriously in a very dangerous position and UNLESS they do pull out a magnificent stunt in 2021, this will be a company that will close down or file for bankruptcy by then..with the latter being the most likely outcome because of special interest in the company and share holders.
If You hold Intel stocks, You might want to consider to abandon ship, because it is sinking and very fast indeed and at this point only a miracle will save it.

OVERCLOCKING is great, but even on a 1900X cpu *** do you need it for gaming in 4k ?! If U cant run a game on a single gpu in 4k at 60fps, get a better gpu or just buy a smaller monitor, it is not that overclocking will allow you to game better....it is not that You get a massive NOTICEABLE difference in performance...this overlcocking thing can be true for crappy 4 core cpus like the 7700K...not for server grade CPUs that can run at consumer grade clocks.
While overclocking can be a time saver for those who run systems 24/7 for massive workloads, overclocking for gaming is pretty much at end of life as well a sin 90 120 days from now it wont be necessary at all,if gaming is your scope.
Another thing to consider is that photorealism is the next big thing in the gaming industry, and the dominant theme in 2018 for triple A titles, so game developers will anyhow drop developing for faster clocks and instead code for more threads . more and more.
So OVERCLOCKING will be as it has always been something more relevant to servers and workstations....and if You think that severs aren't overclocked....well You have been living a dream Neo!


----------



## crion

Interesting remarks @Aby67 but I haven't heard PCIE v4 to be released even in 2018, maybe in late Q4 possibly? Where do you get this faster release date from MB makers? Just AMD or both?


----------



## Aby67

I am actually surprised that Threadripper was launched on Pcie3.0 motherboards..this is why I have not bough too many AMD x399 systems, just 3.
PCIE 4.0 is due any moment..and both Intel and AMD will use it....that being said...You need to keep in Mind that Intel has done nothing more than releasing what they wanted to release next year, now because of the AMD nightmare they are facing, in low end consumer mid range high end and server business.
So as a result You will be seeing AMD release PCIe gen 4 systems much earlier than Intel, as Intel wont be able to come out with something new before next summer.
It is also very likely that AMD is binning 32 OR MORE Threadripper cpus already on 12nm PCie gen 4......and I think they will launch these earlier next year..I think around april when typically Nvidia launches their Titan GPUs after march xx80 series.
I think what will be launched late in 2018 is instead AMD vega on hbm3, and that will then force Nvidia to launch ti versions of all xx60 and up line up on hbm3 as well.
With pcie gen 4 u wil be able to run multiple gpus working as one together...so in theory if the game developer enables and codes for utilization of more gpus just as it does for more threads, you could run 4 eg GTX 1160 gpus obliterating the performance od titan xp in sli.
I also think that those titles who have a big legacy, like battlefield and so on, will be coded to take advantage of different brand and model of gpus on dx 12 and windows 10 so to keep these old themed games alive a year or two more.
But I dont have doubts that overclocking of HEDT at least s over with, not that you wont be able to do it, but it is really unnecessary already.
ALSO VR, while it is a great flop and not a big money maker for game developers making them reluctant to make VR games, the goal of VR is to reach the 240Hx at 16k resolution, which is the threshold for which it is impossible to tell VR from reallife...so I expect next year for VIVE and Oculus to release 144HZ 1440 HMDs......Nvidia desperately needs those to come into teh market to justify people buying their 2018 GPUs, cause at this moment upgrading gpus, unless You rendering with them, to 2018 versions is totally overkill for gaming on display.
THIS IS WHY YOU HEAR THIS RUMOR OF GDDR5 memory becoming really expensive....its all BS, so for nvidia to sell all their founder edition stocks of 10xx series gpus before march.
NEVER forget, Nvidia, sells the least quality they can ALWAYS!
YOU SHOULD NOT BUY A 1070Ti...it is a massive ripoff, because it will never match the the doubling of performance for the same price that 2018 GPU will offer....and NVIDIA knows well that AMD wil come with a threadripper like stunt for GPUs as well next year


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> If someone is wanting to game at 4k it makes zero sense to buy a vega gpu, hell even at the 1080 level it makes zero sense to buy a vega. Only the most blinded of AMD fan boys cant see how much of a giant wet steaming fart of a card it is.
> 
> And as someone who has a balls to the wall 1950x at 4.2ghz and sli 1080tis.....get a 8700k overclock it to 5-5.2ghz and sli 1080tis or titans as that will be a much superior gaming experience then anything AMD has to offer


umm nah
i game at 4k have for a year or so and before the vega it was a fury x and guess what...works fine








i don't play the crappy title like gtav well because i don't like them







i play doom and i am happily pulling between 70 and 90fps ultra settings at 4k.
would i care if it was 100...well no







diablo3 anywhere between 90 and 150 fps there are a few frame dumps but that is some quirk i am working on now









rotr is around 50 fps low but still no issues at all nice and smooth.

so i have no regrets paying 400 less than a 1080TI and not having to give those green toads a cent of my money but then everyone knows i, m a amd zealot and have not had a NVidia card since my 8800gts whenever the hell that was and i have not purchased an NVidia card for any other system in the same time frame...i really really do not like them









so did i cut off my nose to spite my face...probably...but i can still smell the roses i just look weird










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> So this benchmark is interesting.
> 
> It scales with timings and memory speed and or does not ( unstable/to aggressive/just flat out bad timing combos = penalty. Scores drop so you don't get a cookie for suicide crap thank god )
> 
> Anyway here is some testing I did and its rather progressive gains.
> 
> The one 3333 DR run was not tuned as well as the 3466 SR (4x8gb) therefore it lost.
> 
> fwiw I have not really sat down and tuned SR to much on system so I am sure I can beat DR 3333 with 3466 SR.
> 
> Anyway I thought it was a really cool bench in the fact that it definitely shows the benefits from fabric/memory speeds providing you keep latency equal. I'm fairly certain loose 3466 and even 3600 will lose as the benchmark absolutely benefits from tighter timings as well as speed.






yes i have noticed that and stop hogging all the top spots ya bastard









this is an ongoing war for me and chew









i threw my veg in slot 2...8x electrically i can see that i know that.
but
it runs at 16x and all software shows that and all performance benchmarks i tried showed that so yeah.

try slot 2 and 3 and see what you get i,m dying to see other cards like the nvidias and see if they get the same results i do.





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Just something to consider in looking at your dual VGA issues.
> 
> The Taichi boards, all x399 as far as I am aware, are arranged x16 x8 x16 x8. The TR chips have two PCIE controllers providing 32 lanes each, one on each die.
> 
> I am not sure if you are doing this or not but while it may appear that using the two x16 slots is the best approach for performance, you are in fact, connecting the two cards to two separate PCIe Controllers that are doing the crossfiore communication via a connection over the Infinity fabric interconnects which adds an extra 100ns in latency every time there is a data transfer between the two cards. I suspect that you will have a better experience both performance and stability wise if you use the first x16 and x8 slots for the two graphics cards.


----------



## Leijido

@Aby67: Interesting read but I just need to see some 8700k sli benchmarks compared to 1900x lol


----------



## Kriant

Welcome me to the club. Finally got everything assembled. I was waiting for over a month and a half for a waterblock after purchasing 1950x and zenith, and after Swiftech missed both mid September ETA on their Apogee SKF TR4 and and end of September ETA, I've ended up buying xspc block and just booted everything.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leijido*
> 
> @Aby67: Interesting read but I just need to see some 8700k sli benchmarks compared to 1900x lol


There will be no advantage whatsoever for the 8700k above 2560x1440.

Also, it's a dead platform with the Z370 being replaced in Q1 '18 with Coffee Lake mk.2 or what ever it's called. Which will then be replaced again in Q4 '18 or Q1-Q2 '19 with Cannonlake. Which will then probably be replaced with a refresh 6-9 months later. Which will then be replaced by Ice Lake in 2020.

TR4 / AM4 will get replaced in 2020 at the earliest.


----------



## Leijido

@pmc25: I want to agree since I saw 8700k 4k benchmarks and its fps count in games were identical to other cpus but still haven't seen sli benches


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leijido*
> 
> @pmc25: I want to agree since I saw 8700k 4k benchmarks and its fps count in games were identical to other cpus but still haven't seen sli benches


The few games that will benefit from more cores, will favour the 1900X, as multi GPU makes things a little less GPU bound. The others the frame rate will be virtually identical.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> There will be no advantage whatsoever for the 8700k above 2560x1440.
> 
> Also, it's a dead platform with the Z370 being replaced in Q1 '18 with Coffee Lake mk.2 or what ever it's called. Which will then be replaced again in Q4 '18 or Q1-Q2 '19 with Cannonlake. Which will then probably be replaced with a refresh 6-9 months later. Which will then be replaced by Ice Lake in 2020.
> 
> TR4 / AM4 will get replaced in 2020 at the earliest.


It doesn't matter that it's not being replaced really if AMD can't deliver an improved drop in device, history has shown that whilst AM3 etc lasted a while there was buggerall new stuff to put in it that didn't offer up a decent bump in performance, if the next Ryzen chip only offers a 5-10% bump, it is no more exciting than anything Intel release and it may as well be dead, fingers crossed that is not the case, I would love to drop in a new chip without RAM/Board replacement.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> It doesn't matter that it's not being replaced really if AMD can't deliver an improved drop in device, history has shown that whilst AM3 etc lasted a while there was buggerall new stuff to put in it that didn't offer up a decent bump in performance, if the next Ryzen chip only offers a 5-10% bump, it is no more exciting than anything Intel release and it may as well be dead, fingers crossed that is not the case, I would love to drop in a new chip without RAM/Board replacement.


What?

A 10% improvement on Ryzen wouldn't be exciting? Are you mad? That's exactly what Ryzen+ is meant to be, plus likely improvements to IF and IMC.

The 7nm Ryzen 2 (either late '18 or early '19) will be on is a dedicated high performance process, not the modified mobile process that GF (Samsung) 14nmFF LPP is (and 12nmFF LP will be). It's supposed to hit go past the 5Ghz barrier. EUV should extend that significantly.

Intel have nothing really until Ice Lake at the earliest.


----------



## chew*

If they got a 10% improvement on the next release I would be surprised.

What they need is better imc/better clock speeds.

That alone is free performance then maintain that for the next node with an ipc improvement and tweak (if possible ) unlink IF for starters. Its not the ram that is not capable and tbh its not just the IF either. Do not confuse IF with IMC...because simply put...remember deneb?

North bridge unlinked from memory but still a memory clock ceiling...

The good thing is...AMD knows this and Ryzen basically is server parts tweaked for desktop.

If AMD wants a part of that server market they need to improve in these areas....just happens if they do it will benefit us on desktop tuned variants as well.

Unlinking IF opens up doors for more skus as well. Selling skus at guaranteed IF speeds.


----------



## tarot

the takeaway i,m getting from this conversation is there is a fight on....for the first time in years








all good for us unless the intel lemmings make it so all the other lemmings just buy intel because its better at games or some other lame ass reason.

the only issue with the x370 x399 chipsets is IF the pcie 4 comes in i,m guessing that WILL require new boards which would be a pain in the ass.

if you want to play the 8700k comparison start with the motherboard and chipset (you know the one you HAVE to buy.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/asus-rog-maximus-x-hero-review,1.html

https://www.pccasegear.com/products/40495/asus-z370-rog-maximus-x-hero-motherboard

now compare features to the most expensive x370 board(well no actually that's the extreme at 579 but thi is a more even comparison)

https://www.pccasegear.com/products/38094/asus-rog-crosshair-vi-hero-motherboard

so yeah the 120 dollar less board has more features (same boat in regards to sli etc but 16x 8x vs 8x 8x on the intel.

so the z370 is just a pumped up 270 which is a pumped up 170

in my opinion coming from old or slow or both the 8700k is enticing but i still see it suffering the same heat an power issues of its brothers that and it is a dead end. that is already tweaked to death and the more companies that go...wait...what amd have a chip or 2 now...cool we will start coding for them too....will mean amd will get better.

well that and the 8700k is 549 and the 1800x is 629 now only a 80 dollar difference.... but the 1700 is 140 cheaper and has a half reasonable cooler and clocks as well as the rest...and lets face you will overclock it







then waters get muddier and muddier.

anyway rant ended


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> What?
> 
> A 10% improvement on Ryzen wouldn't be exciting? Are you mad? That's exactly what Ryzen+ is meant to be, plus likely improvements to IF and IMC.
> 
> The 7nm Ryzen 2 (either late '18 or early '19) will be on is a dedicated high performance process, not the modified mobile process that GF (Samsung) 14nmFF LPP is (and 12nmFF LP will be). It's supposed to hit go past the 5Ghz barrier. EUV should extend that significantly.
> 
> Intel have nothing really until Ice Lake at the earliest.


Assume there will be a TR4 2nd gen as well?


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Assume there will be a TR4 2nd gen as well?


Potentially. They may just wait for Zen 2 for a TR4 refresh. We'll see next year as info surrounding a 12nm TR is mostly rumour as it stands.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If they got a 10% improvement on the next release I would be surprised.
> 
> What they need is better imc/better clock speeds.
> 
> That alone is free performance then maintain that for the next node with an ipc improvement and tweak (if possible ) unlink IF for starters. Its not the ram that is not capable and tbh its not just the IF either. Do not confuse IF with IMC...because simply put...remember deneb?
> 
> North bridge unlinked from memory but still a memory clock ceiling...
> 
> The good thing is...AMD knows this and Ryzen basically is server parts tweaked for desktop.
> 
> If AMD wants a part of that server market they need to improve in these areas....just happens if they do it will benefit us on desktop tuned variants as well.
> 
> Unlinking IF opens up doors for more skus as well. Selling skus at guaranteed IF speeds.


1) Highly unlikely they unlink IF any time soon IMO.

2) Higher clock and IMC / IF improvements are exactly what Zen+ is likely to be, provided it appears.

3) EPYC is already hugely superior to Intel's server chips. Don't think they need too much work there.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Potentially. They may just wait for Zen 2 for a TR4 refresh. We'll see next year as info surrounding a 12nm TR is mostly rumour as it stands.


It probably depends on 2 things. 1) How soon Zen2 comes. If it is Q3 or Q4 I suspect they don't bother with 12nm TR. 2) Whether they do 24 / 20 core TR before the end of this year; if they do, I find it hard to imagine they supersede it so quickly.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cargograph*
> 
> I want to put 4 Graphic cards in the PCIE slots, do you know if this one would fit?
> 
> EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB SC2 Video Card
> 
> Or do you know of any model that would work? Or maybe using a specific motherboard? I was thinking in the Zenith but I am not sure.
> 
> Also, do you think this RAM is B-Die?
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232205
> 
> Thanks a lot guys!


I imagine them releasing a higher core count product only after a die shrink. They can't go higher than 16 cores without having a CCX with no direct memory channels. They could do it, Intel is going mesh architectire too, but AMD would catch a lot of heat from Intel marketing.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I imagine them releasing a higher core count product only after a die shrink. They can't go higher than 16 cores without having a CCX with no direct memory channels. They could do it, Intel is going mesh architectire too, but AMD would catch a lot of heat from Intel marketing.


Interesting, that would mean that for a huge core TR4 it would be possible to have 16c/32t with 4c per CCX active with all four active. Scaling all the way to 32c/64t. Could be expensive


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Interesting, that would mean that for a huge core TR4 it would be possible to have 16c/32t with 4c per CCX active with all four active. Scaling all the way to 32c/64t. Could be expensive


No more expensive than an i9 lol. I think the window of opportunity has closed on 24/32c 44/64t TR at least for this year. Unfortunate as it would've allowed AMD to keep the multi threaded HEDT performance crown. Fortunate in that I'm not sure how they could have kept single threaded performance okay on such a platform without drastic measures (power consumption for all core 3-3.5ghz would have been massive).

If AMD was going to do this they should've allowed for 8 channel memory like EPYC, or gone to 1 memory channel per CCX, which would have some latency penalties for all but really heavily threaded apps.

With the architecture AMD settled on, any cores above 16 would require all memory access occur across Infinity Fabric to neighboring CCX modules, assuming the boards are even electrically compatible with chips that have more than two active CCX modules. Performance would be spotty, with the higher core parts losing to lower core parts in some work loads.

There was no middle ground where AMD could go above 16 cores without either making the platform more expensive or hurting performance.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> No more expensive than an i9 lol. I think the window of opportunity has closed on 24/32c 44/64t TR at least for this year. Unfortunate as it would've allowed AMD to keep the multi threaded HEDT performance crown. Fortunate in that I'm not sure how they could have kept single threaded performance okay on such a platform without drastic measures (power consumption for all core 3-3.5ghz would have been massive).
> 
> If AMD was going to do this they should've allowed for 8 channel memory like EPYC, or gone to 1 memory channel per CCX, which would have some latency penalties for all but really heavily threaded apps.
> 
> With the architecture AMD settled on, any cores above 16 would require all memory access occur across Infinity Fabric to neighboring CCX modules, assuming the boards are even electrically compatible with chips that have more than two active CCX modules. Performance would be spotty, with the higher core parts losing to lower core parts in some work loads.
> 
> There was no middle ground where AMD could go above 16 cores without either making the platform more expensive or hurting performance.


Oh indeed, I totally get why they didn't and I'm glad they didn't rise to Intel's pissing contest. I hope they actually wait for Zen 2 to release the next TR CPU and expand the platform then. It's makes sense IMO.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Oh indeed, I totally get why they didn't and I'm glad they didn't rise to Intel's pissing contest. I hope they actually wait for Zen 2 to release the next TR CPU and expand the platform then. It's makes sense IMO.


I'm hoping for a zen+ refresh for drop in performance upgrades. If zen2 is ddr5 then unless it has two IMC's, my shiny x399 board is a stranded platform.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I'm hoping for a zen+ refresh for drop in performance upgrades. If zen2 is ddr5 then unless it has two IMC's, my shiny x399 board is a stranded platform.


That's a very good point. I hadn't factored DDR5 in. Though knowing AMD is supporting AM4 through to Zen 2 I would have thought that DDR5 would be held over to the AM5 platform, wonder if that goes for TR4 too...


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I'm hoping for a zen+ refresh for drop in performance upgrades. If zen2 is ddr5 then unless it has two IMC's, my shiny x399 board is a stranded platform.


Zen 2 is somewhere between Q3 '18 and Q1 '19. DDR5 is 2020 ... if not 2021.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I'm hoping for a zen+ refresh for drop in performance upgrades. If zen2 is ddr5 then unless it has two IMC's, my shiny x399 board is a stranded platform.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> That's a very good point. I hadn't factored DDR5 in. Though knowing AMD is supporting AM4 through to Zen 2 I would have thought that DDR5 would be held over to the AM5 platform, wonder if that goes for TR4 too...


So, to clear some speculation, DDR5 specs are finalized by JEDEC next summer, 2018. The GloFo 7nm process will support DDR4 and DDR5. DDR5 will primarily be for servers to start, only then, a year or two after, finding its way into consumer products, as seen with DDR4 adoption, most of which took place 3-4 years after publication

JEDEC published the standard for DDR4 around 2012. In 2013-14, Intel added support on HEDT platform on DIMM slots that could use either standard. But mainstream chips did not get DDR4 until August 2015 with the release of Skylake, which is around three years after the announcement!

So, DDR5 is a non-issue, as PCIe 4.0 is likely a non-issue, as MBs with it will roll out in late Q4 and into H1 of 2018. This shortened lifespan needs contrasted with the publication announced date for PCIe 5.0, which is Q1 2019. Considering it is at minimum 3 months, but usually 6-9 months for incorporation of the new PCIe standard, I would say don't worry about the MB until mid- to late-2019, as this makes the most sense for an upgrade to get PCIe 5.0 plus a possible inclusion of a dual standard DIMM slot to support DDR5, if ready. That places these boards as being more aimed, depending on release of Zen 2 processors, which I estimate Q4 2018 into the H1 of 2019, toward the next generation Zen 3, which is closer to 2020 time frame.

So, I hope this clarifies the issues from a historical and industry standpoint.

@pmc25 - although Su hinted at potentially having some 7nm products ready for Q3, and that tapeout for certain 7nm products will occur in Q4 of 2017, I still side with caution, thereby saying Q4 is likely. Now, Tweaktown published an article saying that AMD may announce Navi at Siggraph next summer. If so, with the news that some contracts have been moved to TSMC, I'd say graphics may appear first on 7nm around Q3. But, if they don't have consumer cards ready, that will only be commercial cards. Meanwhile, GloFo does not start volume production on 7nm until H2 of 2018, so we must keep that in mind. Now, AMD is one of the partners using the early developer's kit from GloFo, so they will be first in line, most likely. But we have to keep in mind potential delays.

Personally, I would guess no 12nm refresh for TR or Epyc, instead trying to find what yields are and moving TR and Epyc up, similar to how Intel may do the server and HEDT markets with Ice lake. If this is true, then we could see a huge head to head fight on our hands!


----------



## mmonnin

^^^This


----------



## dodgethis

I just got another 32GB (2x16) of RAM to go along with my current 32GB. I immediately noticed that the system was snappier and I was getting less drops in framerates when gaming. I am not entirely sure if this is due to the system in running quad channel or it's the additional RAM doing its job?


----------



## RoBiK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dodgethis*
> 
> I just got another 32GB (2x16) of RAM to go along with my current 32GB. I immediately noticed that the system was snappier and I was getting less drops in framerates when gaming. I am not entirely sure if this is due to the system in running quad channel or it's the additional RAM doing its job?


I doubt the amount of ram was the bottleneck, going from 2 channels to 4 on the other hand is a big boost for sure - you doubled your RAM bandwidth.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dodgethis*
> 
> I just got another 32GB (2x16) of RAM to go along with my current 32GB. I immediately noticed that the system was snappier and I was getting less drops in framerates when gaming. I am not entirely sure if this is due to the system in running quad channel or it's the additional RAM doing its job?


The quad channel memory makes a huge difference for TR. Even if you don't need the insane memory bandwidth, you end up with dual channel to each CCX.


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dodgethis*
> 
> I just got another 32GB (2x16) of RAM to go along with my current 32GB. I immediately noticed that the system was snappier and I was getting less drops in framerates when gaming. I am not entirely sure if this is due to the system in running quad channel or it's the additional RAM doing its job?


Going to Quad for sure will help more than the 64GB. I just sold of my Corsair LPX 4x16GB 3200mhz sticks, making a nice profit to go along with it. I picked up some GSkill 4x8G 3600mhz RGB. First off the LED offers a nice effect to my setup, and I can run them at 14-15-15-36-1T @1.45v.


----------



## Aenra

- Why bother about PCIe 4.0 or 5.0 if all you do (as per your remarks) is gaming or everyday normal stuff? PCIe 2.0 to 3.0 and you barely get a few FPS.. PCIe 3.0 x8 to 3.0 x16 and you get.. nothing. Same thing, lol. How about NVMes? Is there a single, just a one, piece of software out there that really, trully, takes advantage of 3,500MBs/sec? Of the kind -we- use mind.. don't strive hard to find the exception only so as to contradict the rule. Where's your glorious benefit?

Do you ('you' as in figuratively mind, not attacking anyone in specific) buy stuff just so you can say you bought the newest, coolest and trendiest?

I mean it's your right and i respect your dedication/hobby (i used to do just that myself), but when one reaches such a level, one is not looking at numbers and facts anymore. Worth to keep that in mind before posting your "opinion" for a prospective buyer to read.

- I do not know why a PC owner would game at 4k, but it's their eyes and they have every right to go blind; opticians need to make a living too. But for everyone else (still the vast majority in fact) gaming at 1080 or 1440p, is there really a difference between 120 and 132 fps? NO.

So for 12, 8, 5, 13 FPS you have *zero* use for, how much more would you pay? And to put this aside for a second, when said difference is of *no* actual consequence to you, empirically, how and when do you use it as a criteria... and why?

- Gave rep to the poster having mentioned this, but cutting down on the L3 just so you can clock a silicon a tad higher does not mean better; i can assure it actually means worse. Yet here we are, with current round of "Ryzen killers".. tiring; and although not new, disappointing. People are people.. /sheep sound

If you have money to waste and the desire to do that (complexes, boredom, a bad phase, compensating) all good. You earned it, you got taxed for it, go nuts and enjoy it.

For everyone else (and this includes the well-off by the way, this isn't just about wallet), logic need enter the picture. Right now the picture says 'pay less, get more than you really need'. Been waiting a long time for this. And we're finally here again 

Edit: One thing i can definitely say about TRs is that they perform wonderfully with SMT off; on my 6900k and a 7900X at work, i still get 'bumps' when multi-threading is disabled. Got so used to them, had forgotten they remain an issue, something Intel never fixed. Nothing like that on the TR. Pick the software of your choice, limit it to 5 or 6 cores, disable multi and try it on both, see for yourself. Very evident with internet browsers too, doesn't have to be something too taxing


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> If you want something specific I can do it but Phanteks website seems to have decent photos.
> 
> https://www.phanteksusa.com/products/phanteks-glacier-series-c399a-amd-tr4-cpu-block


Any update on your temps? Your like the one guy who has this block


----------



## sandysuk

I've spent too much time farting about with memory and playing games to mess about with the cooler but to be honest any info I give you wouldn't be scientific as I have no frame of reference.

The final bits for my system should arrive this week, so hopefully I can start to finish it off and have a look, but I could only say what works for me with the specific bits in my loop, YMMV.


----------



## tarot

got a bit of an update on mine
4g 1.3v llc3 taichi board
3200 ram 14 13 13 1.39v



now that is small ffts i did not run it for long but it seemed to stabilise around 70 degrees which is a lot better than 80 degrees boom











so the ek block is not *ideal* and i think a better block would definitely net me some better temps i,m just not sure by how much.

oh that's on a 420 rad 3 fans push and 2 pulling through to push a 280 that is doing my vega







i would post a pic...but i,m not


----------



## Obsidience

Really nice tarot, if I had those voltages and temps I'd be pushing for 4.1 or 4.2. What TIM application method did you use? I see a lot of videos/articles recommending a large dot but I did my usual very thin coating of Arctic Silver over the entire heat spreader.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> I've spent too much time farting about with memory and playing games to mess about with the cooler but to be honest any info I give you wouldn't be scientific as I have no frame of reference.
> 
> The final bits for my system should arrive this week, so hopefully I can start to finish it off and have a look, but I could only say what works for me with the specific bits in my loop, YMMV.


I really really really like the block look but the inner design worries me. Any chance you can just do a quick run of prime small and give your ambient temp?


----------



## sandysuk

I've no problem doing it but it's not going to tell you anything, I watercool not for OC performance but for noise performance, having a consistent DIN rather than fans ramping up and down, as such I am only running a couple of 120mm fans at 800rpm and I have a 1900x I am not sure how its power consumption relates to 1950x, I'm running it at out of the box setting bar RAM speeds and SOC voltage, as the Turbo and XFR clks seem good enough to just go with, not enough extra out of the chip to warrant the extra volts for 4.2 all core or the extra noise I'd need to contain it in a closed case, anyway, fully loaded small FFTs for 30mins in 24C room the cores are running between 3.85-3.9 and running at 64C.

When my system is finished I will have also sorts of sensor plugged in as well as more fans for a bit of OC fun but I'm in not rush







Gran turismo is out in a bit, I may be going dark


----------



## ssateneth

when XFR increases volts, don't worry about it. It's safe. That is default behavior. AMD wouldn't have the CPU do that if it wasn't safe. Besides, when XFR is being used, it will still respect the total package power limit of 180 watts, which is very easy to handle with TR.


----------



## chew*

I have the phateks coming. I will nail it with an OC on 1950x.

Looks like the best plate acrylic is cheap so can be modified as needed.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I really really really like the block look but the inner design worries me. Any chance you can just do a quick run of prime small and give your ambient temp?






short answer...i,m not sure.
i tried hulk blob first you know cover the entire Z with kryonaut and that sort of worked but did not cover everything.

now that's on the h115i as you can see it pushed more to the top so if i had put the dot a bit lower with a full cover block it should have covered the lot.

sorry you asked ambient...now that confuses me a little do you mena motherboard temp in which case around 30 degrees when i did that
or outside temp near the case in which case that was around 25 degrees(but it has been very muggy here and my temp sensor sucks







)



now being a doofus i forgot to take a pick when i did the even spread BUT i can tell you that in the middle where the hotspot is it was a bit thinner so if i had to guess (i,m out of kryonaut so not doing it again







) a even spread with a dot in the middle should do it....but mileage will vary of course.

the way i did it for that was a little thicker in the middle but pretty even across the whole core.

as for 4.1 i,m not sure about that i have tried 4.1 1.4 and it passed but got super hot i have not tried it since redoing it all.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> I've no problem doing it but it's not going to tell you anything, I watercool not for OC performance but for noise performance, having a consistent DIN rather than fans ramping up and down, as such I am only running a couple of 120mm fans at 800rpm and I have a 1900x I am not sure how its power consumption relates to 1950x, I'm running it at out of the box setting bar RAM speeds and SOC voltage, as the Turbo and XFR clks seem good enough to just go with, not enough extra out of the chip to warrant the extra volts for 4.2 all core or the extra noise I'd need to contain it in a closed case, anyway, fully loaded small FFTs for 30mins in 24C room the cores are running between 3.85-3.9 and running at 64C.
> 
> When my system is finished I will have also sorts of sensor plugged in as well as more fans for a bit of OC fun but I'm in not rush
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gran turismo is out in a bit, I may be going dark






ok here is how you tell at stock...if it is running cool enough and stable it will boost more and more often on stock mine now happily boosts to 4.15 for a lot longer and the benches are better without changing a thing this tells me it is cooling better and keeping it in the sweet spot.

so when you test it do 3 or 4 wprime 1024s and watch (or log) hwinfo if its good you should pretty much get the same score all the time and the boost will be better...even games and firestrike should improve.

so yeah i agree the difference for me between overclocked to 4 or even 4.1 is not really a big thing but the temps are way lower.

things like cinebench and other render apps that do not fully load the cores but sit at say 3.7 and the odd 4.1 should actually do pretty close to a straight 4.0.

games especially as we know are coded by intel monkeys and want single threaded speed so therefore in games....same deal but cooler.

the other thing to note is when the clocks hit 4.1 odd at stock look at the volts and the temps it hits...that gives a pretty good idea of what temps you are going to get overclocked (of course on super long 4gig runs it will heat up more but its a good reference in my opinion.

the other thing i noticed is the cooler you keep it the less volts it need to peak at 4.1 odd
on the h115i it would go over 1.5 quite often now at stock it barely hits 1.45.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Just something to consider in looking at your dual VGA issues.
> 
> The Taichi boards, all x399 as far as I am aware, are arranged x16 x8 x16 x8. The TR chips have two PCIE controllers providing 32 lanes each, one on each die.
> 
> I am not sure if you are doing this or not but while it may appear that using the two x16 slots is the best approach for performance, you are in fact, connecting the two cards to two separate PCIe Controllers that are doing the crossfiore communication via a connection over the Infinity fabric interconnects which adds an extra 100ns in latency every time there is a data transfer between the two cards. I suspect that you will have a better experience both performance and stability wise if you use the first x16 and x8 slots for the two graphics cards.
> 
> 
> 
> Tested same issue.
> 
> The issue is not in 3d its in desktop.
> 
> My 3d runs fine in both 16x slots. In fact i took timespy records with my fury x in single and dual card.
> 
> When you figure out why mouse/system locks up/frees up 10-15 secs later on desktop though with dual fury x vgas lmk.
> 
> I have 0 issues extracting performance from platform quite the contrary. I have 0 issues with a single fury x.. I have 0 issues with stability.
> 
> What i have appears to some conflict driver wise as uninstalling chipset drivers makes the dual fury x desktop issue 90% worse.
Click to expand...

What is the mouse connected to?

There seems to be some bugs with the XHCI driver that is running the USB 3.0 stack provided by the CPU. The bugs seem to revolve around S4 and S3 state the bug can cause system hangs, usb device not recognized and can cause BSOD 1A id the chips runs S4 with USB devices connected.

If you are running a USB mouse, It may be worth avoiding the CPU connected USB ports and use a chipset connected port instead for the time being.


----------



## chew*

I will give it a shot. Seems odd it rears its head with dual vga installed.

May also explain my 78 post code issue when i spam delete to get into bios


----------



## chew*

I have the byski coming now as well.

Needed a second cheap block for the test rig and something to compare the phanteks against.

Since we know byski is off by 1c from xspc...


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I have the byski coming now as well.
> 
> Needed a second cheap block for the test rig and something to compare the phanteks against.
> 
> Since we know byski is off by 1c from xspc...


but is it.
the way i see it test 2 blocks on one system you get that result test the same 2 blocks on say a bigger system with more flow...results may be wildly different...(only speaking from the noob seats here







)
so i would really like to see a few more tests before throwing down even more cash








as for the hitching i got that when hpet was on(and for some reason over the last week it decided to reactivate itself ...turned it off problems gone.

but of course your problem seems a little different


----------



## sandysuk

Can't see that the plate and where the water is will make a great deal of difference between blocks, the plates will all act as heat speaders regardless and results will all be in the noise really 1-2C.

But it will be great to see a comparison to know, one way or another.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> ok here is how you tell at stock...if it is running cool enough and stable it will boost more and more often on stock mine now happily boosts to 4.15 for a lot longer and the benches are better without changing a thing this tells me it is cooling better and keeping it in the sweet spot.
> 
> so when you test it do 3 or 4 wprime 1024s and watch (or log) hwinfo if its good you should pretty much get the same score all the time and the boost will be better...even games and firestrike should improve.
> 
> so yeah i agree the difference for me between overclocked to 4 or even 4.1 is not really a big thing but the temps are way lower.


Yup, pretty much my experience, I can run 4.2 @ 1.45, but with all cores loaded the temps are barely containable, and when checking out performance in many games and benchmarks it seems to only be a marginal improvement, stock in gaming mine is doing over 3.9Ghz, the 4 thread XFR boosts to 4.175 on the whole, HWINFO has shown 4.2 on the odd occasion but it is rare.

As someone who is predominantly gaming I reckon my chip is best left to its own devices, nice low temps, games not yet threading heavily it should be performing well and doing max XFR most of the time, I will see I guess.

Of course I am held back by an RX480 at the mo, might all change with a 1080Ti going in this week.


----------



## chew*

From what I can tell the phanteks does have a small issue that looks easy to fix and actually its 2 issues I can kill in one simple modification.

One of those issues you mentioned ( air in block )

big radiator can be countered by insane fan speeds.

the point of bigger = less noise and more capacity to run with less noise longer.

I am 100% sure a block will change my current temps.

I know exactly how my current block does and exactly how its designed and exactly how it flows.

For TR its pretty bad in many aspects.

Here's a basic draw up of how it is "expected" to work. basically the pump has a suction side which is the hot side. Its supposed to suck water in from the corner mounted inlet through a high pin density surrounded by a low resistance channel completely surrounding pin array.

Great for a central mounted core.



As far as my problem it seems to be gone now not plugged into the KB/Mouse port.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*
> 
> If someone is wanting to game at 4k it makes zero sense to buy a vega gpu, hell even at the 1080 level it makes zero sense to buy a vega. Only the most blinded of AMD fan boys cant see how much of a giant wet steaming fart of a card it is.
> 
> And as someone who has a balls to the wall 1950x at 4.2ghz and sli 1080tis.....get a 8700k overclock it to 5-5.2ghz and sli 1080tis or titans as that will be a much superior gaming experience then anything AMD has to offer
> 
> 
> 
> umm nah
> i game at 4k have for a year or so and before the vega it was a fury x and guess what...works fine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i don't play the crappy title like gtav well because i don't like them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i play doom and i am happily pulling between 70 and 90fps ultra settings at 4k.
> would i care if it was 100...well no
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> diablo3 anywhere between 90 and 150 fps there are a few frame dumps but that is some quirk i am working on now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rotr is around 50 fps low but still no issues at all nice and smooth.
> 
> so i have no regrets paying 400 less than a 1080TI and not having to give those green toads a cent of my money but then everyone knows i, m a amd zealot and have not had a NVidia card since my 8800gts whenever the hell that was and i have not purchased an NVidia card for any other system in the same time frame...i really really do not like them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so did i cut off my nose to spite my face...probably...but i can still smell the roses i just look weird
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> So this benchmark is interesting.
> 
> It scales with timings and memory speed and or does not ( unstable/to aggressive/just flat out bad timing combos = penalty. Scores drop so you don't get a cookie for suicide crap thank god )
> 
> Anyway here is some testing I did and its rather progressive gains.
> 
> The one 3333 DR run was not tuned as well as the 3466 SR (4x8gb) therefore it lost.
> 
> fwiw I have not really sat down and tuned SR to much on system so I am sure I can beat DR 3333 with 3466 SR.
> 
> Anyway I thought it was a really cool bench in the fact that it definitely shows the benefits from fabric/memory speeds providing you keep latency equal. I'm fairly certain loose 3466 and even 3600 will lose as the benchmark absolutely benefits from tighter timings as well as speed.
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yes i have noticed that and stop hogging all the top spots ya bastard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this is an ongoing war for me and chew
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i threw my veg in slot 2...8x electrically i can see that i know that.
> but
> it runs at 16x and all software shows that and all performance benchmarks i tried showed that so yeah.
> 
> try slot 2 and 3 and see what you get i,m dying to see other cards like the nvidias and see if they get the same results i do.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Just something to consider in looking at your dual VGA issues.
> 
> The Taichi boards, all x399 as far as I am aware, are arranged x16 x8 x16 x8. The TR chips have two PCIE controllers providing 32 lanes each, one on each die.
> 
> I am not sure if you are doing this or not but while it may appear that using the two x16 slots is the best approach for performance, you are in fact, connecting the two cards to two separate PCIe Controllers that are doing the crossfiore communication via a connection over the Infinity fabric interconnects which adds an extra 100ns in latency every time there is a data transfer between the two cards. I suspect that you will have a better experience both performance and stability wise if you use the first x16 and x8 slots for the two graphics cards.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

All the 4 main pcie slots on x399 are supposedly wired for x16 with 2 slots each wired to the controller in each die. The controller on each die only has 24 lanes available to split between each of its allocated slots. the remaining x8 for each die's controller are used for the the direct connected nvme drives, the chipset etc

It has always been described as x16 to the first slot and x8 to the second. That is true if you use the first slot, but it would seem that the pcie controller switches are smart enough to ignore an empty first slot in the group and direct the maximum number of lanes to the second slot if it can use them.

Learn something new every day.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> From what I can tell the phanteks does have a small issue that looks easy to fix and actually its 2 issues I can kill in one simple modification.
> 
> One of those issues you mentioned ( air in block )
> 
> big radiator can be countered by insane fan speeds.
> 
> the point of bigger = less noise and more capacity to run with less noise longer.
> 
> I am 100% sure a block will change my current temps.
> 
> I know exactly how my current block does and exactly how its designed and exactly how it flows.
> 
> For TR its pretty bad in many aspects.
> 
> Here's a basic draw up of how it is "expected" to work. basically the pump has a suction side which is the hot side. Its supposed to suck water in from the corner mounted inlet through a high pin density surrounded by a low resistance channel completely surrounding pin array.
> 
> Great for a central mounted core.
> 
> 
> 
> As far as my problem it seems to be gone now not plugged into the KB/Mouse port.


Cool, glad I could help


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> All the 4 main pcie slots on x399 are supposedly wired for x16 with 2 slots each wired to the controller in each die. The controller on each die only has 24 lanes available to split between each of its allocated slots. the remaining x8 for each die's controller are used for the the direct connected nvme drives, the chipset etc
> 
> It has always been described as x16 to the first slot and x8 to the second. That is true if you use the first slot, but it would seem that the pcie controller switches are smart enough to ignore an empty first slot in the group and direct the maximum number of lanes to the second slot if it can use them.
> 
> Learn something new every day.


Kind of hard to be 'wired for x16' without all the pins being soldered. They are 16x, 8x, 16x, 8x electrically. 16x physical slot.


----------



## chew*

If it looks like a duck. Quacks like a duck.

Before some says it because they just look at screenshots.

78c @ 3.9 2300 rpm 50+ db.

Vs

74c @ 4.0 1600 rpm

Neither are in AMDs max of 68c.

If anyone has hopes of 4.0 @ 68c with tolerable fan noise its a good sample that can do it @ 1.30-1.35v

https://m.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/04/enermax_liqtech_tr4_aio_liquid_cpu_coolers_review


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If it looks like a duck. Quacks like a duck.
> 
> Before some says it because they just look at screenshots.
> 
> 78c @ 3.9 2300 rpm 50+ db.
> 
> Vs
> 
> 74c @ 4.0 1600 rpm
> 
> Neither are in AMDs max of 68c.
> 
> If anyone has hopes of 4.0 @ 68c with tolerable fan noise its a good sample that can do it @ 1.30-1.35v
> 
> https://m.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/04/enermax_liqtech_tr4_aio_liquid_cpu_coolers_review


Can you provide some info on the 68c max. I don't recall reading it anywhere.


----------



## chew*

Its only on AMDs site.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If it looks like a duck. Quacks like a duck.
> 
> Before some says it because they just look at screenshots.
> 
> 78c @ 3.9 2300 rpm 50+ db.
> 
> Vs
> 
> 74c @ 4.0 1600 rpm
> 
> Neither are in AMDs max of 68c.
> 
> If anyone has hopes of 4.0 @ 68c with tolerable fan noise its a good sample that can do it @ 1.30-1.35v
> 
> https://m.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/04/enermax_liqtech_tr4_aio_liquid_cpu_coolers_review


This is why my build will have 3x480s, not because of "extra cooling capacity", rather to run the fans lower so that I have a better experience. Because I am waiting on replacement O-rings, I ordered some fittings to expand the loop/add features (such as a fill/bleed port between the rads at the top of the machine).

But 8xNoctua iPPC-3000 on one, then 4xEK-Vardar 2000 F4-120ER on the other two rads, with one EK-Vardar FF4 2500 140mm fan to blow on the bottom side of the MB. If I ran all at full boar, it would be INSANELY LOUD, especially with the double pump in series, but that should be quiet the way I plan on doing the build.

For the pumps, I'm looking at setting the curve between 35%-70% as you don't need more than that with two pumps. Then, it will be setting the Noctua to CPU temp, look for a reasonable noise level, then set that as the top. Repeat with the GPU and the MB temps for the other two rads. Then, adjust as needed on speed if all are pushed to the level I set at the same time. Of course, this is to find my daily driver. When it comes to number chasing....


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Its only on AMDs site.


Wonder why it's so low. Isn't that only for precision boost though?


----------



## chew*

Dont think so although if it is. Think about it cpb jacks it to 3.7 with a 4.2.

Why bother for 3.8 at that point.

I know stock single core cpb was actually better than my 3.8 oc


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Kind of hard to be 'wired for x16' without all the pins being soldered. They are 16x, 8x, 16x, 8x electrically. 16x physical slot.





i know....right...but it ain't i am running x16 8gigelpixeltexels a second
every single test and piece of software says i am regardless of the slot (by the way i jammed it all up in slot 1 now....snug but fits








now
put 2 cards in that would change it think slot 1 and 2 it would go 16/8 but 1 and 3 should go 16/16

don't ask me i only work here











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If it looks like a duck. Quacks like a duck.
> 
> Before some says it because they just look at screenshots.
> 
> 78c @ 3.9 2300 rpm 50+ db.
> 
> Vs
> 
> 74c @ 4.0 1600 rpm
> 
> Neither are in AMDs max of 68c.
> 
> If anyone has hopes of 4.0 @ 68c with tolerable fan noise its a good sample that can do it @ 1.30-1.35v
> 
> https://m.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/04/enermax_liqtech_tr4_aio_liquid_cpu_coolers_review









well i think i am as close as i am going to get i can ramp the fans up to 2000 if i want BUT that does not make that much of a difference and at the present with 5 fans right in my ear it is ...wait let me check....41 DB right on the fans it is around 50

full speed maybe 50 but like i said doesn't drop it much.

that's ambient air temp outside the case around 25 degrees (but feels more like 28 30 very muggy here) motherboard temp 31 degrees. and that's small ffts the black site waterboard test.

now...if you want a quick and dirty black site test(not as nasty though)....try timespy extreme...that cpu test cranked mine up to 60

as for the 68 degrees that's the suggested and as i have said before it is what you want to aim for...go over and performance will suffer till you get to 80 degrees then the computer will flip you the bird drop the mike and be OUT


----------



## chew*

Its not 16x its your vga reporting wrong when in x8 slot.

Just shove in x8 do a bugreport for tech power up. Send it. They will fix it.

Physically impossible no matter how many lanes the cpu supports.


----------



## nycgtr

Just wanna throw this in here. I swapped to the xspc block from EK's tr block and my load temps in prime 95 small ftf dropped 15c. I resat that dumb EK block many times and spread the tim with a card, did the screws as well. I'll be replacing the block on my other TR build as well.


----------



## happyluckbox

Having issues maintaining stability at 3.95ghz. It was rock solid before, and now is starting to sputter using aida64. (67-68c max load)
1.25 vcore in bios, 1.368 peak at load. Extreme LLC. 128gb gskill at 3060mhz 14-14-14-30 2T. Custom secondary timings.

Anybody else having issues with stability loss over time? Not sure what the reason could be. Can't imagine degradation could be that fast, considering the build is barely a few months old.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> All the 4 main pcie slots on x399 are supposedly wired for x16 with 2 slots each wired to the controller in each die. The controller on each die only has 24 lanes available to split between each of its allocated slots. the remaining x8 for each die's controller are used for the the direct connected nvme drives, the chipset etc
> 
> It has always been described as x16 to the first slot and x8 to the second. That is true if you use the first slot, but it would seem that the pcie controller switches are smart enough to ignore an empty first slot in the group and direct the maximum number of lanes to the second slot if it can use them.
> 
> Learn something new every day.
> 
> 
> 
> Kind of hard to be 'wired for x16' without all the pins being soldered. They are 16x, 8x, 16x, 8x electrically. 16x physical slot.
Click to expand...

Oh learn something else new.

I'm sure that I have seen some reviews that said they were wired x16 for all slots. They were obviously wrong. Just goes to show that GPU-Z is not actually as real time/hardware lookup as people maybe assume it is. If the connectors are physically not there then GPU-Z is telling you fibs


----------



## Obsidience

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Just wanna throw this in here. I swapped to the xspc block from EK's tr block and my load temps in prime 95 small ftf dropped 15c. I resat that dumb EK block many times and spread the tim with a card, did the screws as well. I'll be replacing the block on my other TR build as well.






Damnit EK!


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Oh learn something else new.
> 
> I'm sure that I have seen some reviews that said they were wired x16 for all slots. They were obviously wrong. Just goes to show that GPU-Z is not actually as real time/hardware lookup as people maybe assume it is. If the connectors are physically not there then GPU-Z is telling you fibs


No, you have not seen that









All tr mb is 16-8-16-8 atm. My x399 asrock fatality pro is the same


----------



## tarot

i give in... guess it must have been running even though all th benches proved otherwise







(this fight i believe will never end







)
back to me...i will grab a xspc block when they show up here and see 15 degrees would be the difference between 4 and 4.2 for me i think.

now onto the hardocp review of hedt i just read.
all good i guess but they did benches with crystal diskmark seq read and write....problem is i can't find in the article WHICH of the 2 they ran just seq or seq qt32 t1 as there is a big difference.

heres my drives

evo 960 nvme


850 evo


8 tb Seagate


now looking at them i,m pretty happy with it but if the seq scores are what they ran then mine suck









here's the review.

https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/10/amd_vs_intel_hedt_platform_showdown_editorial/2

well?


----------



## chew*

Tarot i think the point your missing is gpu-z reads data. All other software reads the same data.

If the driver or bios has a bug its going to report the same thing regardless.

I have tested the 8x slots and showed you that indeed my fury x were running 8x in an 8x slot.

Vega is not special it just has a bug.

It can not magically conjure electrical connections that do not exist.

Not to mention 8x vs 16x means peanuts single card. Can not measure the difference.

Gen 1 to Gen 3 matters. That is about all that is easily measurable.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Tarot i think the point your missing is gpu-z reads data. All other software reads the same data.
> 
> If the driver or bios has a bug its going to report the same thing regardless.
> 
> I have tested the 8x slots and showed you that indeed my fury x were running 8x in an 8x slot.
> 
> Vega is not special it just has a bug.
> 
> It can not magically conjure electrical connections that do not exist.
> 
> Not to mention 8x vs 16x means peanuts single card. Can not measure the difference.
> 
> Gen 1 to Gen 3 matters. That is about all that is easily measurable.


no i get it i really do and i believe you it cannot be x16 in in a 8 slot everything points to it being a software read error.
i, m stubborn and taking the piss









the only point i am making is the benchmarks sow zero difference with my card in either slot performance wise there is nothing zero no difference at all.
so lets let that dog lie now shall we i concede completely that the card in slot 2 and 4 cannot run x16 in any x399 board









now can we get down to the drive performance i mentioned and where do i get a xspc block this EK one is starting to bother me.

or i may have an air bubble i missed still not cracking 68 but it seems to be edging closer









time to shop and rip apart a loop again ....my wife is going to be very mad









oh also i know this is the threadripper section.... but i am feeling lonely in the top 100 timespy extreme cpu hall of fame







so far i managed 15th then a massive wall of 7980x's







i have to say the top scorers there are massive scores and it is a really nasty test


----------



## TrixX

Well time to be added to the 1950X Owners Club methinks








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> no i get it i really do and i believe you it cannot be x16 in in a 8 slot everything points to it being a software read error.
> i, m stubborn and taking the piss
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the only point i am making is the benchmarks sow zero difference with my card in either slot performance wise there is nothing zero no difference at all.
> so lets let that dog lie now shall we i concede completely that the card in slot 2 and 4 cannot run x16 in any x399 board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now can we get down to the drive performance i mentioned and where do i get a xspc block this EK one is starting to bother me.
> 
> or i may have an air bubble i missed still not cracking 68 but it seems to be edging closer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> time to shop and rip apart a loop again ....my wife is going to be very mad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh also i know this is the threadripper section.... but i am feeling lonely in the top 100 timespy extreme cpu hall of fame
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so far i managed 15th then a massive wall of 7980x's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have to say the top scorers there are massive scores and it is a really nasty test


It highlights that in 8x mode the card isn't using all the bandwidth so doesn't hit the 8x limit. None of the current cards do. mGPU may on the other hand and dual GPU cards are likely to do so too.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Just wanna throw this in here. I swapped to the xspc block from EK's tr block and my load temps in prime 95 small ftf dropped 15c. I resat that dumb EK block many times and spread the tim with a card, did the screws as well. I'll be replacing the block on my other TR build as well.


What are your current temps?


----------



## Kriant

Does anyone know if Zenith's LLC settings are working? (I've asked the same Q on the dedicated Zenith thread, but got no answer).

I seem to have the same vcore under load regardless of the LLC setting. (latest bios). I'm aiming at 4ghz fully stable. I can pass OCCT/Aida/Gaming but Prime95 small FFT freezes on me. Bios settings: 1.4v manual, which nets 1.344 under load (which gives me about 40 mins of Prime before system hangs), everything else is on auto. I was looking to decrease idle vcore to 1.38 and decrease vdroop to 1.36ish, but as soon as I employ any LLC settings at 1.4vcore idle I get 1.331vcore under load, regardless of LLC setting I choose. Has anyone experiences anything similar?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> What are your current temps?


Under ambient of 27C. Water temp 31c on idle. 250ML Res-> D5 pump speed 4 with EK rev top -> EK TR -> 360 HWLABS GTS -> Reservoir Fans 3x120mm Corsair ML120 Paste: AS5 spread on with a spreading tool.
Cpu @ 1.35V 4ghz Cpu soc 0.9v

EK TR
Idle temp 33-36c. Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 85 after about 6mins
Aida 64 goes to 80c
XSPC Neo

Idle temp 31-34c Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 68 after 15mins.
Aida 64 reaches 66c and settles.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Under ambient of 27C. Water temp 31c on idle. 250ML Res-> D5 pump speed 4 with EK rev top -> EK TR -> 360 HWLABS GTS -> Reservoir Fans 3x120mm Corsair ML120 Paste: AS5 spread on with a spreading tool.
> Cpu @ 1.35V 4ghz Cpu soc 0.9v
> 
> EK TR
> Idle temp 33-36c. Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 85 after about 6mins
> Aida 64 goes to 80c
> XSPC Neo
> 
> Idle temp 31-34c Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 68 after 15mins.
> Aida 64 reaches 66c and settles.


So much for the EK mono block. Those temps are terrible.

I'm still on my Bykski which is about a degree off from the XSPC according to HardOCP. I'm on the fence about switching. I'd like to know how well Bitspower does when they release their monoblocks, and if they plan on doing the Taichi.


----------



## happyluckbox

That is nice to know that even a full custom xspc waterblock is about the same as the $150 liqtech tr4 aio in terms of performance.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> That is nice to know that even a full custom xspc waterblock is about the same as the $150 liqtech tr4 aio in terms of performance.


I read that review and no buddy it's not but feel free to use one. They had to back down on their overclock.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Under ambient of 27C. Water temp 31c on idle. 250ML Res-> D5 pump speed 4 with EK rev top -> EK TR -> 360 HWLABS GTS -> Reservoir Fans 3x120mm Corsair ML120 Paste: AS5 spread on with a spreading tool.
> Cpu @ 1.35V 4ghz Cpu soc 0.9v
> 
> EK TR
> Idle temp 33-36c. Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 85 after about 6mins
> Aida 64 goes to 80c
> XSPC Neo
> 
> Idle temp 31-34c Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 68 after 15mins.
> Aida 64 reaches 66c and settles.


im running at 4ghz and I idle between 27-33, ambient of around 25-27c. Stress testing don't see me passing 52.3c so far, with my vega64 looped in not passing around 43c(hotspot 62c). I'm using TG kryonaut and loving it. 1 480 nemesis gts, 360 nemesis gts, and ut60 AlphaCool.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> im running at 4ghz and I idle between 27-33, ambient of around 25-27c. Stress testing don't see me passing 52.3c so far, with my vega64 looped in not passing around 43c(hotspot 62c). I'm using TG kryonaut and loving it. 1 480 nemesis gts, 360 nemesis gts, and ut60 AlphaCool.


Voltage and CPU model please.

Oh, and what are you using for a stress test.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I read that review and no buddy it's not but feel free to use one. They had to back down on their overclock.


? I posted my p95 full blend results in this thread earlier utilizing the liqtech tr4, and I also topped out around the same temps. So while I've provided empirical evidence, you've read articles? When my northbridge/vrms are reaching 89c, and the liqtech keeps me at 69c I think the liqtech is clearly providing insanely good performance, perhaps within 1-2c (margin of error) of the xspc custom block, and definitely superior to the EK block.

Here's the post again (Right click the photos and open in new tab and maginify with left click):
http://www.overclock.net/t/1636550/amd-ryzen-threadripper-owners-club-1950x-1920x-1900x/1400_100#post_26371039


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> ? I posted my p95 full blend results in this thread earlier utilizing the liqtech tr4, and I also topped out around the same temps. So while I've provided empirical evidence, you've read articles? When my northbridge/vrms are reaching 89c, and the liqtech keeps me at 69c I think the liqtech is clearly providing insanely good performance, perhaps within 1-2c (margin of error) of the xspc custom block, and definitely superior to the EK block.
> 
> Here's the post again (Right click the photos and open in new tab and maginify with left click):
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1636550/amd-ryzen-threadripper-owners-club-1950x-1920x-1900x/1400_100#post_26371039


You need to test the exact same cpu with various coolers on identical setup.

That just covers data for one cpu and block.

Hard tested theres which seems to be a not so great chip.

There is a difference.


----------



## springs113

Not
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Voltage and CPU model please.
> 
> Oh, and what are you using for a stress test.


not home now to give exact voltages but iirc my cpu was around 1.367v reading I've used prime, timespy, firestrike, superposition, heaven, valley, and realbench. Zenith, 1950x, 32gb trident cas14, 512gb 960 pro, Vega 64 powered by season if titanium 1000w.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> So much for the EK mono block. Those temps are terrible.
> 
> I'm still on my Bykski which is about a degree off from the XSPC according to HardOCP. I'm on the fence about switching. I'd like to know how well Bitspower does when they release their monoblocks, and if they plan on doing the Taichi.


It's a shame EK rushed out the X299 based block.

It's rare that their blocks (or radiators) are not best in class, often by several degrees.

If they bring out a monoblock, it will have to be designed specifically for X399 ... X299 is too dissimilar.

What I want to see is EK produce AsRock Taichi monoblocks for both AM4 and TR4.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> It's a shame EK rushed out the X299 based block.
> 
> It's rare that their blocks (or radiators) are not best in class, often by several degrees.
> 
> If they bring out a monoblock, it will have to be designed specifically for X399 ... X299 is too dissimilar.
> 
> What I want to see is EK produce AsRock Taichi monoblocks for both AM4 and TR4.


There appear to be plans for an X399 Taichi monoblock. EK may dial those plans back given the reception the TR4 block received.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> ? I posted my p95 full blend results in this thread earlier utilizing the liqtech tr4, and I also topped out around the same temps. So while I've provided empirical evidence, you've read articles? When my northbridge/vrms are reaching 89c, and the liqtech keeps me at 69c I think the liqtech is clearly providing insanely good performance, perhaps within 1-2c (margin of error) of the xspc custom block, and definitely superior to the EK block.
> 
> Here's the post again (Right click the photos and open in new tab and maginify with left click):
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1636550/amd-ryzen-threadripper-owners-club-1950x-1920x-1900x/1400_100#post_26371039






i ahd a lovely long response till i clicked on your link
prime 95 blend is diluted hipster coffee you ust run the prince of darkness version prime 95 small ffts and or blender bench gooseberry
both of those will heat up and continue to heat up the cpu hell i got those scores with a h115i i was getting mid 50 prime blend, not saying for an aio cooler for this platform it is not the best but it is not the same as a custom loop.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> Not
> not home now to give exact voltages but iirc my cpu was around 1.367v reading I've used prime, timespy, firestrike, superposition, heaven, valley, and realbench. Zenith, 1950x, 32gb trident cas14, 512gb 960 pro, Vega 64 powered by season if titanium 1000w.






first is that a EEEEK block or the xspc one? and 3 rads?
pics or it didn't happen








do me a favour run 3 tests 3 screenshots using hwinfo.
timespy extreme(if of course you have it otherwise timespy will do in a pinch)

prime 95 v2.91 or above small ffts for at least 10 minutes.

and blender gooseberry bench (or a biggish blender render) that gives it time to warm up

i do not want prime 95 and heaven running at the same time because that heats up everything and would show the full system load BUT i would prefer to see how each component heats up the rig









also anything unity driven like superpostition heaven etc will not crank up the gpu enough o do that you need a full on game with everything turned up.

not that i don't doubt you its just 52 is just way to low even with that setup and especially with a vega looped in as that bastard gets hella hot...i know











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> Does anyone know if Zenith's LLC settings are working? (I've asked the same Q on the dedicated Zenith thread, but got no answer).
> 
> I seem to have the same vcore under load regardless of the LLC setting. (latest bios). I'm aiming at 4ghz fully stable. I can pass OCCT/Aida/Gaming but Prime95 small FFT freezes on me. Bios settings: 1.4v manual, which nets 1.344 under load (which gives me about 40 mins of Prime before system hangs), everything else is on auto. I was looking to decrease idle vcore to 1.38 and decrease vdroop to 1.36ish, but as soon as I employ any LLC settings at 1.4vcore idle I get 1.331vcore under load, regardless of LLC setting I choose. Has anyone experiences anything similar?






if it is the same as the ryzen board then probably not the best on mine if i chose 5 it overvolted 3 was around the middle ground 1 2 or auto undervolted but not a lot.
also if i were you i would try pstates (worked a lot better on my ryzen setup than manual) and seems to work on this just fine.
taichi dial in 0.1875 offset pstate for 4gig llc 3 and that's what i get 1.3 to 1.312 full load.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Under ambient of 27C. Water temp 31c on idle. 250ML Res-> D5 pump speed 4 with EK rev top -> EK TR -> 360 HWLABS GTS -> Reservoir Fans 3x120mm Corsair ML120 Paste: AS5 spread on with a spreading tool.
> Cpu @ 1.35V 4ghz Cpu soc 0.9v
> 
> EK TR
> Idle temp 33-36c. Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 85 after about 6mins
> Aida 64 goes to 80c
> XSPC Neo
> 
> Idle temp 31-34c Prime 95 small ftf Load goes to 68 after 15mins.
> Aida 64 reaches 66c and settles.






see that bothers me that you get the same primce of darkness temps as me with the EEEK block BUT if you were getting those abysmal temps before AND it dropped that much just by changing the block...then maybe i should see a good 8 degree drop so maybe i will shell out








also...now that you have it cooler try dropping the voltage a smidge i think you will find it is stable at 1.3/1.32 now and therefore even less temp


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> i ahd a lovely long response till i clicked on your link
> prime 95 blend is diluted hipster coffee you ust run the prince of darkness version prime 95 small ffts and or blender bench gooseberry
> both of those will heat up and continue to heat up the cpu hell i got those scores with a h115i i was getting mid 50 prime blend, not saying for an aio cooler for this platform it is not the best but it is not the same as a custom loop.
> 
> first is that a EEEEK block or the xspc one? and 3 rads?
> pics or it didn't happen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> do me a favour run 3 tests 3 screenshots using hwinfo.
> timespy extreme(if of course you have it otherwise timespy will do in a pinch)
> 
> prime 95 v2.91 or above small ffts for at least 10 minutes.
> 
> and blender gooseberry bench (or a biggish blender render) that gives it time to warm up
> 
> i do not want prime 95 and heaven running at the same time because that heats up everything and would show the full system load BUT i would prefer to see how each component heats up the rig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also anything unity driven like superpostition heaven etc will not crank up the gpu enough o do that you need a full on game with everything turned up.
> 
> not that i don't doubt you its just 52 is just way to low even with that setup and especially with a vega looped in as that bastard gets hella hot...i know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it is the same as the ryzen board then probably not the best on mine if i chose 5 it overvolted 3 was around the middle ground 1 2 or auto undervolted but not a lot.
> also if i were you i would try pstates (worked a lot better on my ryzen setup than manual) and seems to work on this just fine.
> taichi dial in 0.1875 offset pstate for 4gig llc 3 and that's what i get 1.3 to 1.312 full load.
> 
> see that bothers me that you get the same primce of darkness temps as me with the EEEK block BUT if you were getting those abysmal temps before AND it dropped that much just by changing the block...then maybe i should see a good 8 degree drop so maybe i will shell out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also...now that you have it cooler try dropping the voltage a smidge i think you will find it is stable at 1.3/1.32 now and therefore even less temp


I don't just have 1 of the EK tr trash I unfortunately have 2. I can't do 4ghz with 1.31/1.32 with either 1950x. So yeah the temps are horrific if I want 4ghz. At that point I don't mind just buying the block and then selling off the EK ones. I'll take a loss it's worth it. I am slowly stepping away form EK I have way too much of their stuff which is a shame on my end.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> There appear to be plans for an X399 Taichi monoblock. EK may dial those plans back given the reception the TR4 block received.


They know perfectly well why it was badly received, and given the difference between how exhaustively engineered their products usually are, it's deserved.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> i ahd a lovely long response till i clicked on your link
> prime 95 blend is diluted hipster coffee you ust run the prince of darkness version prime 95 small ffts and or blender bench gooseberry
> both of those will heat up and continue to heat up the cpu hell i got those scores with a h115i i was getting mid 50 prime blend, not saying for an aio cooler for this platform it is not the best but it is not the same as a custom loop.
> 
> first is that a EEEEK block or the xspc one? and 3 rads?
> pics or it didn't happen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> do me a favour run 3 tests 3 screenshots using hwinfo.
> timespy extreme(if of course you have it otherwise timespy will do in a pinch)
> 
> prime 95 v2.91 or above small ffts for at least 10 minutes.
> 
> and blender gooseberry bench (or a biggish blender render) that gives it time to warm up
> 
> i do not want prime 95 and heaven running at the same time because that heats up everything and would show the full system load BUT i would prefer to see how each component heats up the rig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also anything unity driven like superpostition heaven etc will not crank up the gpu enough o do that you need a full on game with everything turned up.
> 
> not that i don't doubt you its just 52 is just way to low even with that setup and especially with a vega looped in as that bastard gets hella hot...i know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it is the same as the ryzen board then probably not the best on mine if i chose 5 it overvolted 3 was around the middle ground 1 2 or auto undervolted but not a lot.
> also if i were you i would try pstates (worked a lot better on my ryzen setup than manual) and seems to work on this just fine.
> taichi dial in 0.1875 offset pstate for 4gig llc 3 and that's what i get 1.3 to 1.312 full load.
> 
> see that bothers me that you get the same primce of darkness temps as me with the EEEK block BUT if you were getting those abysmal temps before AND it dropped that much just by changing the block...then maybe i should see a good 8 degree drop so maybe i will shell out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also...now that you have it cooler try dropping the voltage a smidge i think you will find it is stable at 1.3/1.32 now and therefore even less temp


no need for me to lie, I gain nothing from it. I'm not home atm but when I get an actual chance to sit down I will. Both my Vegas are cool, unmolded as well in fact this one maybe the hotter of the two. My hot spot for the sapphire one is at most 10-12c higher than the hbm and core where the one seated with my 1950x runs about 15-22c higher than the core/ hbm. I don't run on "uber mode, standard is just fine for my resolution(1440p). I'm using the EK blocks for both gpu/cpu in a Phanteks Elite case, using the stock 14cm fans that came with the case along with 9 ML120s. I have great air flow, my components are cool to the touch for the most part.


----------



## ITAngel

Hi everyone! I wanted to share my current setup with the club.

*CPU*: AMD Threadripper 1920X
*COOLER*: Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3
*RAM*: Corsair Vengeance RGB 3000Mhz 32GB 4x8
*MOBO*: ASRock Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming
*VIDEO*: GALAX GTX 1070 HOF 8GB (LE Bios)
*CASE*: Phanteks Enthoo EVOLV (2x Corsair ML140 Pro LED Fans Intake Setup)
*HDD*: 3TB Seagate 5400rpm
*SSD*: SAMSUNG 850 EVO 2.5" 500GB SATA III 3-D Vertical
*PSU*: EVGA SuperNOVA 750 B1
*KEYBOARD* & MOUSE: Logitech G710 & Logitech G9/G600
*AUDIO*: Focusrite Scarlett 2i2
*MONITORS*:2x HP OMEN 25" FHD 144Hz

If you have any questions please let me know.


----------



## TrixX

I should probably do the same as IT Angel

*CPU*: AMD Threadripper 1950X
*COOLER*: Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3
*RAM*: Corsair Dominator 3200Mhz 32GB 4x8
*MOBO*: ASUS ROG ZENITH EXTREME (very shouty Mobo name!)
*VIDEO*: HIS Radeon RX Vega64 w/LC MSI BIOS 8774
*CASE*: In-Win 909 Black
*HDD*: 4x Storage HD's mostly 3TB WD Green's (to be replaced ASAP!)
*SSD*: 2x SAMSUNG 850 EVO 2.5" 500GB
*PSU*: Corsair AX1200i
*KEYBOARD* & MOUSE: Roccat RYOS MKPro & Swiftpoint Z Mouse (backup Logitech G502 and Corsair Sabre)
*AUDIO*: Creative Soundblaster X AE-5
*MONITORS*:2x Samsung BX2450's (Soon to be 2x Samsung C32HG70's)


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> It's a shame EK rushed out the X299 based block.
> 
> It's rare that their blocks (or radiators) are not best in class, often by several degrees.
> 
> If they bring out a monoblock, it will have to be designed specifically for X399 ... X299 is too dissimilar.
> 
> What I want to see is EK produce AsRock Taichi monoblocks for both AM4 and TR4.


I would argue on the point of best in class. I've seen they always do well and are toward the top of the spectrum, but there are only so many companies out there. But, sometimes, they are the only choice.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> There appear to be plans for an X399 Taichi monoblock. EK may dial those plans back given the reception the TR4 block received.


I don't think so. They have already teased the Zenith block, and through persistence in calling them out, agreed to an Asrock monoblock. If you look through EK's product stack, they really haven't made monoblocks for Asrock, but announced MSI and Asus TR monoblocks around the same time. They then added Giga. It took over a month after that to decide to do an Asrock block, which they did an informal poll asking which first on facebook: an Asrock X399 or 299 monoblock for Taichi. When I saw it, the X399 predominated the comments. So, if they design the X399 from the ground up, with the extra fin coverage, then things may change. But, they need to broadcast the changes to purchasers.

On a side note, they then added Asrock x370 monoblocks recently, IIRC (or have at least shown pictures), and for Z270 boards (they really under-served Asrock).

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> They know perfectly well why it was badly received, and given the difference between how exhaustively engineered their products usually are, it's deserved.


I definitely agree and don't imagine they would change nothing with the extra two months or more to develop....


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> I would argue on the point of best in class. I've seen they always do well and are toward the top of the spectrum, but there are only so many companies out there. But, sometimes, they are the only choice.
> I don't think so. They have already teased the Zenith block, and through persistence in calling them out, agreed to an Asrock monoblock. If you look through EK's product stack, they really haven't made monoblocks for Asrock, but announced MSI and Asus TR monoblocks around the same time. They then added Giga. It took over a month after that to decide to do an Asrock block, which they did an informal poll asking which first on facebook: an Asrock X399 or 299 monoblock for Taichi. When I saw it, the X399 predominated the comments. So, if they design the X399 from the ground up, with the extra fin coverage, then things may change. But, they need to broadcast the changes to purchasers.
> 
> On a side note, they then added Asrock x370 monoblocks recently, IIRC (or have at least shown pictures), and for Z270 boards (they really under-served Asrock).
> I definitely agree and don't imagine they would change nothing with the extra two months or more to develop....


Maybe the x370 blocks will sell better then. As far as mono blocks for the asrock X399 platforms (Taichi and by extension Fatal1ty), they have a potential turd on their hands, so I hope they don't judge market interest for future AMD HEDT platforms (or Asrock boards) by this.

When Bykski beats you by 10C, you've got a problem.


----------



## nycgtr

EK has become so bigheaded over the last 3 years that I doubt they put much of any effort into their products. Their mono blocks LOOK THE SAME with THE EXACT SAME design since x99. Doesn't matter chnipset it looks the same. It is beyond lazy. I took the supremacy evo TR apart and found essentially a supremacy evo that was be default rotated 90 degrees. The jetplate was pretty much the exact same as before. They could of just sold people a bigger cold plate and a mount. All they did was maker a bigger cold plate and a mount bracket. I hate to say it too it feels cheap as hell comapred to the regular supremacy evo. It's feel is close to that of the MX series.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

I’m in the same boat with EK block. New Heatkiller TR4 should be out in next two weeks or so.


----------



## ht_addict

So I replaced my thermal paste with some Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut. First off when I took of the waterblock I was shocked at how badly the thermal that came with the EKWB block didn't spread when I tightend down the screws. I had placed the compound over all 4 cores but didn't spread thinking the pressure would have done it for me. I was never able to hit 4GHz stable and temps would sky rocket. After applying the Conductonaut and mounting the waterblock, temps are down big time and I'm running Prime95 at 4Ghz with settings of VCore: Normal, Offest: 300mv and LLC Standard. I also ran RealBench for 15min and Cinebench. Both did not crash as they have done in the past. See attached for temps. I know 15min is not enough, you have to run these stress tests for hours. Maybe I will, probably I won't run them for that long. Since what I have right now is a 4Ghz stable run on 3 stress/benchmarks that couldn't get before.


----------



## Obsidience

ht-addict, what temps (idle/load) were you seeing before and after reapplying? I think my EK kit came with Kryonaut and when I tried to use it - it would not spread very well so I ended up using AS5 and hand spreading to a very very thin layer over the entire chip and also inside the screw holes of the water block. I'm beginning to question my methods. Also I did lap my 1950x which is why I use this method because usually the heatspreader on AMD chips are slightly concave - which I feel is why the dot method is usually preferred.


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obsidience*
> 
> ht-addict, what temps (idle/load) were you seeing before and after reapplying? I think my EK kit came with Kryonaut and when I tried to use it - it would not spread very well so I ended up using AS5 and hand spreading to a very very thin layer over the entire chip and also inside the screw holes of the water block. I'm beginning to question my methods. Also I did lap my 1950x which is why I use this method because usually the heatspreader on AMD chips are slightly concave - which I feel is why the dot method is usually preferred.


 If I remember at 3.9Ghz I was getting 33oC+ at idle. From the picture above I was at 25.8oC at one point though at 4GHz


----------



## springs113

How are you guys applying your thermal paste. I did the x method then placed a dot in the center-top/center-bottom of the x. My temps are great, TG kryonaut used.


----------



## Obsidience

That's pretty good, what about running small FFTs? Mine is idling at 27.7 at 3.95Ghz. Not sure what I'm going to do, I was really hoping for 4Ghz or higher so I feel a bit let down by the EK block.


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> How are you guys applying your thermal paste. I did the x method then placed a dot in the center-top/center-bottom of the x. My temps are great, TG kryonaut used.


 I watched several videos and went with 4dots over each core using kryonaut that came with waterblock. What are your temps and speed?


----------



## ht_addict

> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Obsidience*
> 
> That's pretty good, what about running small FFTs? Mine is idling at 27.7 at 3.95Ghz. Not sure what I'm going to do, I was really hoping for 4Ghz or higher so I feel a bit let down by the EK block.
Click to expand...

I ran the Custom test with min/max FFT of 96, taken from https://overclocking.guide/gigabyte-threadripper-overclocking-guide. Max temp was 80oC


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> I watched several videos and went with 4dots over each core using kryonaut that came with waterblock. What are your temps and speed?


I think gamers nexus video is the best when addressing what method to use. I'm running 4ghz and my max temp so far id's 52c. My case is well ventilated and ambient temp is usually between 25-27c. The latter is generally worse case scenario as I hate the heat and I live in a centrally conditioned home.


----------



## chew*

52C in what? cpu-z?

no one is getting 52c loaded at 4 gig unless they run 60C ambients or blow an AC duct through there radiator running through prime 95 for a day...

52C is unheard of on R7 for load temps @ 4.0 in stress tests and that is just one die in normal ambients.


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> 52C in what? cpu-z?
> 
> no one is getting 52c loaded at 4 gig unless they run 60C ambients or blow an AC duct through there radiator running through prime 95 for a day...
> 
> 52C is unheard of on R7 for load temps @ 4.0 in stress tests and that is just one die in normal ambients.


like I told a previous poster, I gain nothing from lying. Last time I was home, I ran my tests and got my results period. This is the main reason why I don't post on forums... because I guess if it's not the norm then one must be lying... I've encountered issues no one here heard of before with this setup but i guess i was lying then huh?


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> like I told a previous poster, I gain nothing from lying. Last time I was home, I ran my tests and got my results period. This is the main reason why I don't post on forums... because I guess if it's not the norm then one must be lying... I've encountered issues no one here heard of before with this setup but i guess i was lying then huh?


You will find the need to say nothing in order to back up your claims if you do this.

My block sucks but in all honesty I doubt that I will ever hit 52C no matter what I do aside from shoving my radiator out the window in the cold even if I change out my block to a decent one at the voltage required to actually do a real 4 gig stable.

My peaks are 68-70c btw even though the screen was showing 62c.

peak is what matters.

FYI R7 8 cores 58C is a common 4 gig temp on quality water cooling setups









One could rationally expect 68C easily with double the cpu's ( 1950x ) @ 4gig under one IHS under rational cooling conditions and fan noise however so far what has been proven is 75C under those conditions.


----------



## springs113

Well good for you. I'm not here to gloat about anything, im happy with my system and you should be too with your own. I don't need validation from you nor anyone...believe What you want... I'm content with my results.


----------



## chew*

yes yes I am gloating about a 3.8 OC when turbo does 3.7









Your clearly not content bud or you would not be gloating about unrealistic temps at unrealistic speeds on a block that everyone is having regrets about due to temps exceeding that of competitiors by a rather large margin.


----------



## springs113

Ill address you this one last time... good luck with your pc endeavors, my PCs do what I need them to do and are clocked where I want them to clock and run the way I need them to run... if you're upset at me for winning the silicon lottery them shame on you. Now go enjoy your pc, as I will with mine when I get home.


----------



## chew*

Sorry but I go into jerk mode when I smell BS/misleading info or a sponsored lackey/manufacturer.

simply put. Put up or um well you know the saying.


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obsidience*
> 
> That's pretty good, what about running small FFTs? Mine is idling at 27.7 at 3.95Ghz. Not sure what I'm going to do, I was really hoping for 4Ghz or higher so I feel a bit let down by the EK block.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *springs113*
> 
> Ill address you this one last time... good luck with your pc endeavors, my PCs do what I need them to do and are clocked where I want them to clock and run the way I need them to run... if you're upset at me for winning the silicon lottery them shame on you. Now go enjoy your pc, as I will with mine when I get home.


I have too agree with everyone else is saying. Run your stress tests, take a screen shot and post. You may have won the silicon lottery, but there is no way it runs that cool at 4Ghz during Prime95 or even Realbench. Gaming sure. When I first got my TR, I had it looped in with my FuryX's being cooled by 3-360mm Rads and couldnt hit those temps. And my Fury's were hitting temps I never seen before because of being in the loop. Now the TR is cooled by Dual Predator 360's running in series with better tim and I still can't hit your temps and thats with my house sitting at 21-22oC now that fall has kicked in. Just post and be the hero.


----------



## robtorbay

Well I likewise had to give this a go and I am nowhere near these temps...... lets see those screens!


----------



## VoytekBE

I still haven't been able to get a mem kit for my build. Seems like the TZRX kits for Gskill, RGB, are delayed till december









What Trident Z RGB kits are you guys running and at what speeds? I just need memory so if I can get a decent set, prefer 8 dimm instead of 4 with 64Gb I would be a happy camper.

Just don't want to run at ridiculous low speeds.

edit: https://www.alternate.be/html/product/information/page.html?articleId=1353801&channel_code=40&s2m_product_id=IFIG5U2J&utm_source=tweakers.net

The Vengeance RGB 4x8 PC3200 kits are supported by Threadripper so it seems.
Would it possible to just buy 2 of these kits and run these?
Anything >=3000mhz is fine for me. Just don't want to go below 3ghz with memory.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VoytekBE*
> 
> I still haven't been able to get a mem kit for my build. Seems like the TZRX kits for Gskill, RGB, are delayed till december
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What Trident Z RGB kits are you guys running and at what speeds? I just need memory so if I can get a decent set, prefer 8 dimm instead of 4 with 64Gb I would be a happy camper.
> 
> Just don't want to run at ridiculous low speeds.
> 
> edit: https://www.alternate.be/html/product/information/page.html?articleId=1353801&channel_code=40&s2m_product_id=IFIG5U2J&utm_source=tweakers.net
> 
> The Vengeance RGB 4x8 PC3200 kits are supported by Threadripper so it seems.
> Would it possible to just buy 2 of these kits and run these?
> Anything >=3000mhz is fine for me. Just don't want to go below 3ghz with memory.


Don't get the RGB ram craze. Any samsung b or e die 3200 ram kit will work fine and there are loads of that across brands.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VoytekBE*
> 
> I still haven't been able to get a mem kit for my build. Seems like the TZRX kits for Gskill, RGB, are delayed till december
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What Trident Z RGB kits are you guys running and at what speeds? I just need memory so if I can get a decent set, prefer 8 dimm instead of 4 with 64Gb I would be a happy camper.
> 
> Just don't want to run at ridiculous low speeds.
> 
> edit: https://www.alternate.be/html/product/information/page.html?articleId=1353801&channel_code=40&s2m_product_id=IFIG5U2J&utm_source=tweakers.net
> 
> The Vengeance RGB 4x8 PC3200 kits are supported by Threadripper so it seems.
> Would it possible to just buy 2 of these kits and run these?
> Anything >=3000mhz is fine for me. Just don't want to go below 3ghz with memory.


Don't buy the vengeance RGB kits. At 3200 they do hynix sometimes.

Buy a 4 DIMM kit instead of 8 DIMMS. 8 DIMMS is going to require you drop clocks. The FlareX 64GB 3200 C14 kit from G Skill should be B die unless something has changed.


----------



## MarkPost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VoytekBE*
> 
> I still haven't been able to get a mem kit for my build. Seems like the TZRX kits for Gskill, RGB, are delayed till december
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What Trident Z RGB kits are you guys running and at what speeds? I just need memory so if I can get a decent set, prefer 8 dimm instead of 4 with 64Gb I would be a happy camper.
> 
> Just don't want to run at ridiculous low speeds.
> 
> edit: https://www.alternate.be/html/product/information/page.html?articleId=1353801&channel_code=40&s2m_product_id=IFIG5U2J&utm_source=tweakers.net
> 
> The Vengeance RGB 4x8 PC3200 kits are supported by Threadripper so it seems.
> Would it possible to just buy 2 of these kits and run these?
> Anything >=3000mhz is fine for me. Just don't want to go below 3ghz with memory.


If you want RGB, these https://www.alternate.be/Corsair/32-GB-DDR4-3466-Quad-Kit-Werkgeheugen/html/product/1349028?lk=8301

I have 2x8 Corsair RGB 3466 and they are Samsung b-die, so this 4x8 should be Samsung too


----------



## ht_addict

I got the Gskill 2x8G 3600 RGB and they work great. They are Samsung B die


----------



## tarot

tell you what to make everything even taking prime off the table...still not a big fan of it anyway.
everyone run gooseberry blender bench post results and hwinfo temps.
also what cooling and what is in a loop.
to get things started i will throw in a older one @3.95 with the h115i


so lets have it kids i will rerun it with the new setup at 4 gig


----------



## TrixX

Here's my run so far:



Running 4GHz @ 1.35v with 3200MHz C16 E-Die Corsair Memory using Stilt's 3333MHz timings as a basis.

Surprised it stayed steady at 63.5C for the entire run. Using a Noctua U14S currently as waterblock is yet to arrive.


----------



## tarot

did 2 one stock one at 4g 1.3v llc3
60 degrees gets tot hat and just stays there just like prime 95 small ffts(which i am sad to say is far more waterboardie it seems so i,ll have my crow with chilli sauce thanks







)
also notice your scores are higher but you also have your ram tuned better than me mine is just 3200 14 13 13 so yeah ram does matter when you blend









also sorry what cooling is that
mine is simple a EEEEK block EEEK 420 rad and 3 varder fans at 1300(by the way 38 decibel where i sit and 45 one inch from the fans so in no way loud to me)

vega is on a separate loop


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> did 2 one stock one at 4g 1.3v llc3
> 60 degrees gets tot hat and just stays there just like prime 95 small ffts(which i am sad to say is far more waterboardie it seems so i,ll have my crow with chilli sauce thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> also notice your scores are higher but you also have your ram tuned better than me mine is just 3200 14 13 13 so yeah ram does matter when you blend


My Memory is set to 16 16 16 16 30 56 plus most of Stilt's other timings for the other editables on his 3333MHz DR test. Only two exceptions in there as it wouldn't boot with those. Stilt's also runs C14 but mine doesn't like to go that low as yet. Maybe after more testing, but unlikely as it's E-Die not B-Die.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> also sorry what cooling is that
> mine is simple a EEEEK block EEEK 420 rad and 3 varder fans at 1300(by the way 38 decibel where i sit and 45 one inch from the fans so in no way loud to me)
> 
> vega is on a separate loop


Noctua U14S with the stock Noctua paste that comes with it for initial testing purposes. Got Kryonaut and Conductonaut to test later too though the latter is likely to be waterblock testing only due to the amount required for the IHS! So currently full Air based setup. Stock blower on the Vega64 and 3 Noctua Industrial 3000 PWM Fans that aren't really getting over 1500RPM.


----------



## chew*

1.2v @ 3.8 my tight memory tune @3200

h220x2+ apogee drive x2 TR mounts = 61C

Right on your heels with 200 MHz less cpu tarot, kick that thing into high gear









Bykski tests Sunday maybe.....block is a day late.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> 1.2v @ 3.8 my tight memory tune @3200
> 
> h220x2+ apogee drive x2 TR mounts = 61C
> 
> Right on your heels with 200 MHz less cpu tarot, kick that thing into high gear
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bykski tests Sunday maybe.....block is a day late.






yep actual actual proof would have liked to see more of the hwinfo though









but if you look the difference between stock and 4g is not that much 23 odd vs 25 odd mine really needs better tuning







one thing though is trixxes really good score and the temps for air i think are very impressive...or maybe mine just sucks.

need more data







where are the xspc blocks...i,m sure at least 2 people have them.

there i one setting in the taichi bios i,m not sure on its a performance metric one auto power/performance i have it set to performance i might try auto on that.

also forgot to ask what version of blender are you using i,m using 2.79 rel candidate or something 2.78 was a bit sketchy for me


----------



## TrixX

What was interesting was that my 4.1GHz (@1.38125v) score for Cinebench was only 20 points better...

So dropped back to 4.0GHz at 1.3v for the moment. Was about 60 odd points higher in CB with 1.35v at 4.0GHz though.

Using Blender 2.79 here too.

LOL at Chew hiding the temp data


----------



## sandysuk

You guys with your 23 min runs, I left mine running it was 44mins







my 1900x stock hit a max of 59C so with an all core overclock she is going to be toasty.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> You guys with your 23 min runs, I left mine running it was 44mins
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my 1900x stock hit a max of 59C so with an all core overclock she is going to be toasty.


With XFR it's going to get toasty anyway, the autovoltages are insane easily boosting to 1.48v vcore, dropping it to 1.3 gains a lot of that extra heat reduction. Going to do a comparison test in a min with vcore 1.3v @4.0GHz compared to my 1.35v @4.0GHz above.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Loving my TR 1950X Build with Quad Channel setup, so sweet. Not overclocking until my Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 AIO arrives, personally for me its a full coverage cooler or bust ! Luckily new stock has arrived in EU so not lomg now.

Now to purchase 6x Noctua NF F12 Industrial fans in push pull config for the RAD. Wont be subtle but temps should be vastly better.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Loving my TR 1950X Build with Quad Channel setup, so sweet. Not overclocking until my Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 AIO arrives, personally for me its a full coverage cooler or bust ! Luckily new stock has arrived in EU so not lomg now.
> 
> Now to purchase 6x Noctua NF F12 Industrial fans in push pull config for the RAD. Wont be subtle but temps should be vastly better.


Well in my current air cooled setup, I was just doing a 4.0GHz Gooseberry render @1.30v and it was under 60C with a ~20c ambient. Was going hard until it crashed when the media machine started running Blacklist off it too









Upped the vcore to 1.3125v for the next run though gotta wait until Blacklist is finished to run it!

System is in an In-Win 909 with 2 AF14's and an NF12 (all 3K RPM versions) and the single CPU fan U14S. None of the fans needed to spin up much from their minimal 700RPM states other than the CPU fan.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Nice setup, those are the type of temps I am hoping for or better.

I have the CM MasterCase 5 pro. 2x NF A14 3000RPM fans to top exhaust and another for the rear exhaust, so plenty of exhaust and with the front 6x NF F12 3000 RPM I should have good airflow, gotta keep those VRMs cool too.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> yep actual actual proof would have liked to see more of the hwinfo though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but if you look the difference between stock and 4g is not that much 23 odd vs 25 odd mine really needs better tuning
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> one thing though is trixxes really good score and the temps for air i think are very impressive...or maybe mine just sucks.
> 
> need more data
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where are the xspc blocks...i,m sure at least 2 people have them.
> 
> there i one setting in the taichi bios i,m not sure on its a performance metric one auto power/performance i have it set to performance i might try auto on that.
> 
> also forgot to ask what version of blender are you using i,m using 2.79 rel candidate or something 2.78 was a bit sketchy for me


Hold your horses. I got the O-rings for the GPU block yesterday evening, but won't get the final fittings until Monday or Tuesday. Then comes at least a modicum of tuning before I beat your scores!


----------



## springs113

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Well in my current air cooled setup, I was just doing a 4.0GHz Gooseberry render @1.30v and it was under 60C with a ~20c ambient. Was going hard until it crashed when the media machine started running Blacklist off it too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Upped the vcore to 1.3125v for the next run though gotta wait until Blacklist is finished to run it!
> 
> System is in an In-Win 909 with 2 AF14's and an NF12 (all 3K RPM versions) and the single CPU fan U14S. None of the fans needed to spin up much from their minimal 700RPM states other than the CPU fan.


Nice temps, some ppl can't seem to understand that every silicone is not the same, I guess your temps are too low too. You will get attacked for lying because your results are not part of the norm.


----------



## chew*

Dude seriously. This bench is not loading cpu at all tbh. I can drop vcore and run lower than prime and pass as well.

Temps are 10c lower than a stress test.

Add 10c then your claims = 20c less.

Stop digging a deeper hole.

Dream on.

@ trix. Cpu temps not covered. Node0/1 temps matched.


----------



## TrixX

Well did another run as I was trying to reduce vCore a bit, though made a slight mistake thinking the BIOS had saved my LLC settings but it ignored them after the first crash and ended up resulting in a few more crashes. When I set LLC to 5 and 1.35 on vCore it was incredibly aggressive on the LLC and ran the entire test at 1.417v. Interesting that the temps weren't incredibly high though the wattage was actually slightly less than the first run.

Anyway this run was nuts time wise, but far over the voltage that I would be happy with.



Next run will be at 1.33725v with LLC at 2 instead of 5. I know that my first run was smooth at 1.344v so aiming to get down a little on that.


----------



## chew*

Mail came.

Now off to my busy day...I need to mail stuff on top of a bunch of other things on my to do list.


----------



## ITAngel

I run 4x8 32GB Vengeance RGB 3000Mhz and the system auto clock up to 4.1Ghz without any issues. This is on a 1920X Threadripper cpu.


----------



## tps3443

Hey guys,im looking at a Silicon Lottery 1950X. These are the pretty much the best quality TR chips you can find.

3.95Ghz W/ 1.325v.."Thermal Limit"

These chips are tested for ABSOLUTE stabillity, using avx, and y cruncher and things like that. They are Limited by cooling.

Im going for a XSPC ray storm neo block. And (2) 420mm rads, D5 pump top, and Photon 170 reservoir. Ive already got all of these components.

I know 4.1 to 4.2 is attainable. With more voltage. But what is the maximum memory speeds I can expect on Threadripper 1950X at 4.1Ghz? Or 4.2Ghz?

Im looking at FlareX memory, is 2933Mhz enough? Ive seen reports of 3500Mhz ddr4 at 4.2Ghz on Threadripper.


----------



## chew*

Silicon lottery does not bin imc. Welcome to the "lottery" desription in there site name.

2400-2666 = guaranteed based on memory config by AMD.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Silicon lottery does not bin imc. Welcome to the "lottery" desription in there site name.
> 
> 2400-2666 = guaranteed based on memory config by AMD.


This. For instance it looks like my CPU outranks all those "binned" CPU's at SL









Looks like I won that lottery









BTW Chew that Corona 1.3 leaderboard is stacked in your memory's favour! I can't compete with my E-Die at that level unfortunately. Snagged 18th fastest ThreadRipper for the moment with C16 E-Die so pretty happy.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> This. For instance it looks like my CPU outranks all those "binned" CPU's at SL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like I won that lottery
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW Chew that Corona 1.3 leaderboard is stacked in your memory's favour! I can't compete with my E-Die at that level unfortunately. Snagged 18th fastest ThreadRipper for the moment with C16 E-Die so pretty happy.


People think that just because they are sold as 3.95's thats all they do lol..If you ask why its $1,200 youll get it and they are actually good samples.

Just about any threadripper can run 4Ghz @ 1.325v with fast memory. Although,

Playing games, benchmarking yep its stable, I think? Its until you start loading heavy stuff thats pulling 540 watts just the cpu and they crash.

They are absolute stable from SL. They overclock to 4.3Ghz for benching, I have yet to see a better threadripper cpu.

He test these with a H100. In order to really push for maximum stabillity drawing over 500 watts, you run out of thermal headroom.

So what does all this mean? They will run 4.2Ghz with around 1.415+v

I bought a Silicon lottery 6600K before it was rated as 4.8Ghz model. Well, I ran it at 5.1Ghz on water. Ive asked alot of questions about his current 1950X processors. And from what I understand alot of guys at 4Ghz are not even stable..they just think it is.

I wonder if the silicon will get better as time goes on. Kinda like early 5960X could hit 4.4 maybe 4.5.

And the J series 5960X built the latest and last silicon could easily do 4.3 stock voltage on air, and 4.8 on water.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> People think that just because they are sold as 3.95's thats all they do lol..
> 
> I wouldnt be so sure. Just about any threadripper can run 4Ghz @ 1.3v with fast memory.
> 
> Playing games, benchmarking yep its stable, I think? Its until you start loading heavy stuff thats pulling 540 watts and they crash.
> 
> They are absolute stable from SL. They overclock to 4.3Ghz and will benchmark at that. I have yet to see a better threadripper cpu.
> 
> He test these with a H100. In order to really push for maximum stabillity drawing over 500 watts, you run out of thermal headroom.


H100, that's going to be unable to deal with 500W of thermals...

Seriously...

I'm not pushing for wattages that high yet because I know my system won't cope. U14S is good for a 4-4.1GHz gaming, but not heavy testing.

When I get my water block on it I'll test up higher with high wattage programs. Not going to run out of thermal headroom for no damn reason, already pulling just shy of 300W in Blender Gooseberry which is pushing my U14S close to it's limits.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> H100, that's going to be unable to deal with 500W of thermals...
> 
> Seriously...
> 
> I'm not pushing for wattages that high yet because I know my system won't cope. U14S is good for a 4-4.1GHz gaming, but not heavy testing.
> 
> When I get my water block on it I'll test up higher with high wattage programs. Not going to run out of thermal headroom for no damn reason, already pulling just shy of 300W in Blender Gooseberry which is pushing my U14S close to it's limits.


Thats a rediculously fast setup. I was going to get a ek block, until I saw the XSPC Ray storm sTR4 edition.

Hoping to get 4.2ghz stable with (2) 420mm Primochill slim rads. Heck I may even just get a retail binned sample on newegg, and take my chances.

Hard to beleive im building a AMD x399 rig. Theres just no competition for the money.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MarkPost*
> 
> If you want RGB, these https://www.alternate.be/Corsair/32-GB-DDR4-3466-Quad-Kit-Werkgeheugen/html/product/1349028?lk=8301
> 
> I have 2x8 Corsair RGB 3466 and they are Samsung b-die, so this 4x8 should be Samsung too


The 3466 kits from corsair might be E Die


----------



## tps3443

G.skill sells Flare X kits. They are all Samsung B Die.

Ranging from 128GB Cas 14 2933mhz, to 3600mhz 32gb kit.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Hold your horses. I got the O-rings for the GPU block yesterday evening, but won't get the final fittings until Monday or Tuesday. Then comes at least a modicum of tuning before I beat your scores!






actually not why i threw this comp up







my main reason is it is an easily to replicate (and pretty consistent)and in my opinion reliable real life way to test performance and cooling performance.
i want to see how everyone's machine handles it...but saying that did a few more runs


----------



## tps3443

Threadripper 1950X (16) core is only $899 in store @ Micro! Just amazing!

1920X is $749
1900X was $489, now $499.

If you buy motherboard with the cpu, its another $30 cheaper.

$869 for a 1950X.. jeez

I could buy a 1950X, buy a 1900X. Give my brother the 1900X. And it would still be cheaper by $331 than a 7960X


----------



## MarkPost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> The 3466 kits from corsair might be E Die


According to Thaiphoon, mine is B Die


----------



## Beatnutz

Build is completely done now. Very happy with it and I'm looking forward to not building anything for a while now and just enjoy the computer instead









Have a peek at the gallery here


http://imgur.com/rDAL3


----------



## Bm514

Petg update

Before :



After :


pteg ftw


----------



## MarkPost

Nice builds guys


----------



## ITAngel

So I think i was reading the temp on the Threadripper completely wrong. I take it that the true CPU temp is the one listed on HWiNFO64 as CPU (Tdie) correct and not the CPU (Tctl)?


----------



## ht_addict

I expected the rendering time to be faster when I changed the memory settings?


----------



## Obsidience

ITAngel, yes you want TDIE which should be 27C lower than TCL.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obsidience*
> 
> ITAngel, yes you want TDIE which should be 27C lower than TCL.


Thank you for confirming that. I just realized the actual temps on my system are way lower than what I mention on the thread early a day or two before. Here I am thinking the temps were to high and nope as actually very low.









Thanks again! 1+


----------



## chew*




----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**


That's one ugly block. I hope the phanteks does well lol...


----------



## chew*

Yah its not the prettiest but gained 100mhz running 3.9 @ 1.25v now with fans @ 50% (barely audible versus previous 100% aka annoying) on just a little h220x2 that I never "cleaned"

Basically 25% of the radiator HardOcp used

Hits 73c peak in prime 95 now at above settings.

Hits 64c peak in the aegis photoscan pro which is the intended use for this rig.

This is all on artic mx2 $26.00 for 65 grams...plenty to experiment with mounting applications.

Im fairly certain block could benefit from lapping as well.

Phanteks should be here Monday.

So far the bykski is beating my apogee drive x2 with ease.


----------



## TheScarecow

My 1950x was from SL was the top one and it will do games and cinibench at 4.2ghz but will have prime workers fail over time so they do bring the goods for what you pay for


----------



## TheScarecow

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Phanteks should be here Monday.
> 
> So far the bykski is beating my apogee drive x2 with ease.


Cant wait to see what the phanteks one will do, no happy with the EK block i have atm


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah its not the prettiest but gained 100mhz running 3.9 @ 1.25v now with fans @ 50% (barely audible versus previous 100% aka annoying) on just a little h220x2 that I never "cleaned"
> 
> Basically 25% of the radiator HardOcp used
> 
> Hits 73c peak in prime 95 now at above settings.
> 
> Hits 64c peak in the aegis photoscan pro which is the intended use for this rig.
> 
> This is all on artic mx2 $26.00 for 65 grams...plenty to experiment with mounting applications.
> 
> Im fairly certain block could benefit from lapping as well.
> 
> Phanteks should be here Monday.
> 
> So far the bykski is beating my apogee drive x2 with ease.


Looks pretty good. Not sure I'm into the effort required to lap though, plus then I'd have to lap the CPU too...


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Looks pretty good. Not sure I'm into the effort required to lap though, plus then I'd have to lap the CPU too...


You only have to lap the Bykski because of the rough finish. I don't think I'd want to lap a TR chip either though. Too big.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> You only have to lap the Bykski because of the rough finish. I don't think I'd want to lap a TR chip either though. Too big.


Ah that explains that. Probably won't need to do that on Swiftech's when it arrives...


----------



## chew*

Yah tr is flat no need.

Bykski needs to be flat its a tad rough.

Mine looks worse than what hardocp showed.

The swiftech should perform well with a 30/50x pump. Doubt it will need lapping.


----------



## ITAngel

The noctua cooler on my system had my cpu at 29.3C while I was developing a game and running a video course. Room temperature was 70F. This was under creative mode. Funny thing only one fan on the cooler which I plan to order a second fan soon.


----------



## chew*

Im fairly certain reviews put the noctua under severe load @ stock and it failed to keep in the 68c tdie department.

It going to be tough under severe load for any typical aio ( swiftechs included ) or air no matter what block you use to keep in that AMD safe zone.

Also cooler appears to clock better with less.

My ambients are not controlled. Was 72c last night when i ran.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah tr is flat no need.
> 
> Bykski needs to be flat its a tad rough.
> 
> Mine looks worse than what hardocp showed.
> 
> The swiftech should perform well with a 30/50x pump. Doubt it will need lapping.


Got an EK D5 Pump/Res combo so should be capable of handling the 360 Rad, 240 Rad and both blocks. If not I can add a second pump.

Though doing more testing and found the BIOS really doesn't like repeated changes. Fan profiles kept being forgotten until a reset of the BIOS. Quite worrying when they don't spin up to cool stuff!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> The noctua cooler on my system had my cpu at 29.3C while I was developing a game and running a video course. Room temperature was 70F. This was under creative mode. Funny thing only one fan on the cooler which I plan to order a second fan soon.


The U14S is good, but not compared to a proper loop. Doing the Gooseberry render brings mine close to the limit of it's thermal dissipation capacity, hence not running prime until under water.


----------



## chew*

This taichi is interesting.

Fan curve 5 i can not change rpm but i can change temp.

The profiles seem to stick regardless of it not being able to "read" the iris controllers rpm.

Ive got some really horrible antec fans from an aio on it ( h220x )right now. They do 3k full speed.

With my profile they are 1500 barely audible and @ 73c ramp to full speed.

I can only get them to ramp up in prime.

I plan to add another rad in loop but since I have data already with this setup I am just swapping blocks out to see what they can do with the bare minimum.

I can swap pumps in and out on it (h220x2) to. Currently its the mcp30 non x pump. Its interesting to see the changes even limiting it to just a 2x120mm rad.


----------



## crion

Octa slot Memory showed up!

G.Skill F4-4200C19Q2-64GTZSW
19-19-19-39

Hoping to get some nice timings from these ones.


----------



## oxijex

Has anyone had good Experience with the EK Full Nickel TR Block ?


----------



## Sgt Bilko

Here's mine:





Specs as the same as my sig rig:
Threadripper 1950x with EK Block
AORUS X399 Gaming 7
32GB G.SKILL TridentZ RGB 3333 14-14-14-34-1T
Sapphire RX Vega 64 with EK Block


----------



## Spyder233

I'm running the Nickel Block on a 1950X, with the plexi front. I am at 4Ghz with 1.35 Vcore. Idol temps are 25C and at full load under Prime, I peak at 56C. but average is about 53C. Here is my loop. res > 360 XPSC > EK CPU Block > 360 XPSC > 2x EVGA 1080 TI Elites with EK Water Blocks > 240 EPSC > Res. the loop has 2 D5 Pumps. With 3 hours of 100% load on CPU and GPU's, Water temp peaks a 33C. Ambient room temp is 24C and at idol the water temp is at 26C. I ran it for a bit with only 1 360 rad, while I was burning in the GPUs. It peaked to 60C under full load for the same amount of time. I hope this helps a little.


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> I'm running the Nickel Block on a 1950X, with the plexi front. I am at 4Ghz with 1.35 Vcore. Idol temps are 25C and at full load under Prime, I peak at 56C. but average is about 53C. Here is my loop. res > 360 XPSC > EK CPU Block > 360 XPSC > 2x EVGA 1080 TI Elites with EK Water Blocks > 240 EPSC > Res. the loop has 2 D5 Pumps. With 3 hours of 100% load on CPU and GPU's, Water temp peaks a 33C. Ambient room temp is 24C and at idol the water temp is at 26C. I ran it for a bit with only 1 360 rad, while I was burning in the GPUs. It peaked to 60C under full load for the same amount of time. I hope this helps a little.


That is pretty good. Welcome to the forum btw







When you say that you peaked to 60C under full load with the one rad, are you talking about the CPU under full load?


----------



## Spyder233

yes, just the CPU. I believe the average was around 56C


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> yes, just the CPU. I believe the average was around 56C


Based on that it sounds like just a 360 could cool an overclocked 1950X and a pair of 1080tis







Of course, I'm assuming there would be no load on the GPUs, to hit only 60C.


----------



## oxijex

Spyder what TIM did you use and how did you apply it... im using Conductonaut and my temps just skyrocket with anything over stock... i idle really low and can start benching 4ghz at 1.2v but the temp just keeps climbing..


----------



## Spyder233

I used Cooler Master Mastercel Maker. it seemed to get good reviews. I made sure it covered the whole cpu. I even took the block off after a day to make sure it spread evenly.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I expected the rendering time to be faster when I changed the memory settings?





i think you will find the tighter setup is not all that stable it may pass piles of tests but blender seems to root out the evil ones









and generally it will be slower to compensate, at least in my testing that's what i have found
look at trixx compared t me his times are a bit quicker but his timings are a lot looser but i think he also has more ram...
i mean we are talking in the 10's of seconds here but yeah.

also in my case as i have said before i have a very old very dirty operating system and until the day comes that i HAVE to nuke it i won't.
now i, m not sure i have not really done it in ages but ahs anyone tried doing these benches in safe more or ugly ass windows xp mode











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**






i caved...i am doing a job so the extra cash has gone to a xspc block...BUT i have still not seen another review apart from the slightly lean hardocp one...i mean really...where are they ....reviewers can't afford them?

should be here by the end of the week so i will try 4.1 4.2 and see how this one holds up under a lot more volts and stress then i can compare











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah its not the prettiest but gained 100mhz running 3.9 @ 1.25v now with fans @ 50% (barely audible versus previous 100% aka annoying) on just a little h220x2 that I never "cleaned"
> 
> Basically 25% of the radiator HardOcp used
> 
> Hits 73c peak in prime 95 now at above settings.
> 
> Hits 64c peak in the aegis photoscan pro which is the intended use for this rig.
> 
> This is all on artic mx2 $26.00 for 65 grams...plenty to experiment with mounting applications.
> 
> Im fairly certain block could benefit from lapping as well.
> 
> Phanteks should be here Monday.
> 
> So far the bykski is beating my apogee drive x2 with ease.






i don't have those fancy shmansy photo type apps but is that prime your homeland security waterboarding version you mentioned before (prime blend loads of ram etc)?

i will give that a whirl again but i still hate prime


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> i think you will find the tighter setup is not all that stable it may pass piles of tests but blender seems to root out the evil ones
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and generally it will be slower to compensate, at least in my testing that's what i have found
> look at trixx compared t me his times are a bit quicker but his timings are a lot looser but i think he also has more ram...
> i mean we are talking in the 10's of seconds here but yeah.
> 
> also in my case as i have said before i have a very old very dirty operating system and until the day comes that i HAVE to nuke it i won't.
> now i, m not sure i have not really done it in ages but ahs anyone tried doing these benches in safe more or ugly ass windows xp mode


32GB here so nothing special RAM wise. Timings might be looser, not sure what you are running atm.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> 32GB here so nothing special RAM wise. Timings might be looser, not sure what you are running atm.






there goes that theory







mine is just flarex 3200 14 13 13 so nothing drastically brilliant or tuned that well.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> there goes that theory
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mine is just flarex 3200 14 13 13 so nothing drastically brilliant or tuned that well.


Though a fair bit better on the timings


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> I'm running the Nickel Block on a 1950X, with the plexi front. I am at 4Ghz with 1.35 Vcore. Idol temps are 25C and at full load under Prime, I peak at 56C. but average is about 53C. Here is my loop. res > 360 XPSC > EK CPU Block > 360 XPSC > 2x EVGA 1080 TI Elites with EK Water Blocks > 240 EPSC > Res. the loop has 2 D5 Pumps. With 3 hours of 100% load on CPU and GPU's, Water temp peaks a 33C. Ambient room temp is 24C and at idol the water temp is at 26C. I ran it for a bit with only 1 360 rad, while I was burning in the GPUs. It peaked to 60C under full load for the same amount of time. I hope this helps a little.


Any pictures of your setup? How about a posting of HWinfo while doing your stress testing? can you take you GPU's outta the loop and put on there own you'll notice a drop in their temps. My FuryX's peaked the same till I got them on there own loop.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> I'm running the Nickel Block on a 1950X, with the plexi front. I am at 4Ghz with 1.35 Vcore. Idol temps are 25C and at full load under Prime, I peak at 56C. but average is about 53C. Here is my loop. res > 360 XPSC > EK CPU Block > 360 XPSC > 2x EVGA 1080 TI Elites with EK Water Blocks > 240 EPSC > Res. the loop has 2 D5 Pumps. With 3 hours of 100% load on CPU and GPU's, Water temp peaks a 33C. Ambient room temp is 24C and at idol the water temp is at 26C. I ran it for a bit with only 1 360 rad, while I was burning in the GPUs. It peaked to 60C under full load for the same amount of time. I hope this helps a little.


I find these numbers somewhat confusing for 1.35v on the cpu. I could replicate your ambient and with similar water temps, I cannot get that low of a cpu temp unless i was running maybe 1.2xx voltage.


----------



## ajc9988

Quick question, has anyone tried using a single GPU in the second full x16 slot on the taichi board. Because of some of my mods, the primary slot is block and I really don't want to pull out the dremel this morning to try and make it fit. Just need to know if this MB has issues if the first slot isn't populated. Thanks.


----------



## tlblight

I have a little question about 1900x, with watercooling what clocks are most getting with overclocking? Just saw a YouTube video that had one at 4.3...


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tlblight*
> 
> I have a little question about 1900x, with watercooling what clocks are most getting with overclocking? Just saw a YouTube video that had one at 4.3...


Personally I couldn't get mine to run beyond 4.1 with reasonable voltage, 4.2 is hard to cool, but I haven't tried too hard, it runs all core @ 3.9 out the box and when gaming spends a fair amount of time at 4.1-4.175 on XFR, the temp and voltage for all core 4.2 just doesn't seem worth the effort and actually even the bump in clock speed from 3.9 all core to 4.1 all core doesn't really make a lot of difference to my frame rates either with GPU limits so have just left it stock.

Getting much more performance overclocking the 1080Tis than the measly CPU bump, guess I did not win the silicon lottery with this one, although, it did clock better before I tweaked the RAM and went QC, so may relate to that.

Oh and of course, forgot the obvious, Doh, there are GPUs in my loop now, so perhaps I don't have enough cooling, that is the obvious killer thinking about it







before those I could run 4.2 for hours but would hover at low 70s which apparently is too much, seems a lot of reviewers are happy running much higher temps.

A firestrike run of my stock CPU vs overclocked CPU, hardly seems worth the bother.

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/2555297/spy/2535979


----------



## Spyder233

This is what I have:

Corsair 900D Case
Silverstone 1500 Watt Power Supply
AMD Threadripper 1950X
ASUS Zenith Extreme - running the 0801 Bios @4GHz and vcore set to 1.35
2 x Samsung 960 Pro m.2 in Raid 0 - That was fun
G.SKILL TridentZ RGB 14Cas 4x16 running at 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35
2 x EVGA GTX 1080 ti FTW3 Elites - at GPU clock @ 2050 and Mem clock @ 6106

Water Cooling

XSPC reservoir w/2 x D5 Pumps >
XSPC 360 Radiator>
Outbound Temp Sensor>
EK CPU Water Block>
XSPC 360 Radiator>
2x EK 1080 ti Water Blocks>
Inbound Temp Sensor
XSPC 240 Radiator>
Back to Reservoir

I run a single loop because it easy. I have run 2 loops in the past.

Here are some pics of the rig.








I am working on it today, but I ran Prime Small FFT for about an hour.

Here it is at idol





Here it is at load for 55 minutes





This is what I am seeing. I can run it later for longer. This is only the CPU under load as well.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> This is what I have:
> 
> Corsair 900D Case
> Silverstone 1500 Watt Power Supply
> AMD Threadripper 1950X
> ASUS Zenith Extreme - running the 0801 Bios @4GHz and vcore set to 1.35
> 2 x Samsung 960 Pro m.2 in Raid 0 - That was fun
> G.SKILL TridentZ RGB 14Cas 4x16 running at 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35
> 2 x EVGA GTX 1080 ti FTW3 Elites - at GPU clock @ 2050 and Mem clock @ 6106
> 
> Water Cooling
> 
> XSPC reservoir w/2 x D5 Pumps >
> XSPC 360 Radiator>
> Outbound Temp Sensor>
> EK CPU Water Block>
> XSPC 360 Radiator>
> 2x EK 1080 ti Water Blocks>
> Inbound Temp Sensor
> XSPC 240 Radiator>
> Back to Reservoir
> 
> I run a single loop because it easy. I have run 2 loops in the past.
> 
> Here are some pics of the rig.
> 
> I am working on it today, but I ran Prime Small FFT for about an hour.
> 
> Here it is at idol
> 
> Here it is at load for 55 minutes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is what I am seeing. I can run it later for longer. This is only the CPU under load as well.


These temps in prime is lower than everyone else has on water thus far by about 10c minimum. What version bios and did you mess with sensemi? Can you use hwinfo instead. I don't think your getting accurate reporting. WIth that kinda voltage 57c after an hour of prime is in my opinion not possible on regular water.

Also, maybe I never paid attention but seeing cpu temp lower than water temp kinda doesn't make sense to me as a minimum.


----------



## chew*

Now it makes sense. These guys are reading motherboard cpu temps...

Not Tdie....

Ok so my temps in prime are 45c if we use that mobo sensor...but guess what...its wrong.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Now it makes sense. These guys are reading motherboard cpu temps...
> 
> Not Tdie....
> 
> Ok so my temps in prime are 45c if we use that mobo sensor...but guess what...its wrong.


Yea I've noticed that sensor is dramatically lower and it also gets stuck at a set temperature. I don't use it but I did notice it.


----------



## chew*

Yep only hwinfo and ryzen master are correct temps for cpu Tdie

Everything else is bunk.

Mystery solved.


----------



## jamesomega

Hey everyone! I've got a weird disabled/locked core problem with my 1950x / msi x399 on win10 x64. After applying the Game Mode profile through Ryzen Master, my system wouldn't post and required the CMOS to be cleared, but after loading BIOS (7B09v15) defaults and confirming that it saw all 16 cores, it's now stuck in a 4C/8T mode with Memory Access mode set to Local. Applying the Creator Mode profile in Ryzen Master does nothing after reboot.

So far, I've tried uninstalling all AMD chipset software and re-flashing my BIOS but the results are the same. i don't want to have to reinstall windows again but I feel like that might be my only option. Has anyone else run into this issue yet on an MSI x399 motherboard? There doesn't appear to be an obvious Enable All Cores or Memory Access mode options in their BIOS and messing with their Downcore control just results in black screens and more CMOS clearing.

In the future, if I can get my 16C/32T count back, I've heard that using Process Lasso to allocate cores to legacy game exe's to prevent 20+ core crashes is a lot easier than dealing with reboots.

Thanks in advance if anyone's got any ideas on what else I can try!


----------



## sandysuk

Do you let ryzen master load back up again after the reboot?

Anyway core disabling is on the first OC page near by where you can set clock rate in BIOS, try a clr cmos and a load optimized defaults.

distributed local switch is on the OC page under Advance DRAM -> memory interleaving, channel is local and Auto does distributed.


----------



## jamesomega

Thanks, I'll check out the memory settings. Core disabling/downcore control doesn't have an 8+8 option for the 1950X. I've only set it to 3+3 but it wouldn't boot past post code 01 and required CMOS clearing. The MSI x399 also has warm reboot problems and locks up on C0 so I have to power cycle for any BIOS setting changes and flashing. I'm not sure if my settings are saving because of that. Ryzen Master also doesn't load up after the reboot and requires manual launching, but when it opens it still only shows 4C/8T as Current.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yep only hwinfo and ryzen master are correct temps for cpu Tdie
> 
> Everything else is bunk.
> 
> Mystery solved.


This was driving me crazy as well.


----------



## Spyder233

Yes they seem to be exactly the same for me as well.


----------



## Spyder233

I have no reason to lie to you. I don't know what to tell you, other than my loop water temps cap at 31C and I seem to be able to maintain these temps indefinitely. It's been running prime now for an hour and a half.


----------



## happyluckbox

So it seems my 1950x is a bit of a dud, requiring 1.4v (peak at load) to reach 4.0ghz, however the IMC on my 1950x is quite good, allowing me to undervolt vsoc to .9v and run 128gb of 14cas gskill ram at 3060mhz. (I'm actually more stable with lower vsoc)

Do you guys think this is safe? Seems like AMD said max safe vcore for this chip is around 1.375v at load, I'm thinking 1.4v shouldn't be too high? Temps top out at 67c.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamesomega*
> 
> Thanks, I'll check out the memory settings. Core disabling/downcore control doesn't have an 8+8 option for the 1950X. I've only set it to 3+3 but it wouldn't boot past post code 01 and required CMOS clearing. The MSI x399 also has warm reboot problems and locks up on C0 so I have to power cycle for any BIOS setting changes and flashing. I'm not sure if my settings are saving because of that. Ryzen Master also doesn't load up after the reboot and requires manual launching, but when it opens it still only shows 4C/8T as Current.


I only get cold boot issues on fast aggressive ram settings, never warm boot issues, set your ram to defaults, 2133 everything autio it should boot with out looping. Set core to Auto and see if you can get past your core problems


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> I have no reason to lie to you. I don't know what to tell you, other than my loop water temps cap at 31C and I seem to be able to maintain these temps indefinitely. It's been running prime now for an hour and a half.


I am not saying you are just saying the data seems to be not plausible. Your temps for 1 hr prime is similar to what I get on stock with the EK block. I haven't tested with the xspc block for stock. Your tcl with the offset however very much matches what my EK Block would hit on 1.35v running prime. I have 2 1950x one on the zenith and one a gaming 7 and both had EK blocks and they were getting pretty much identical temps running prime. One being a p5 case open, and the other in my primo.


----------



## Spyder233

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I am not saying you are just saying the data seems to be not plausible. Your temps for 1 hr prime is similar to what I get on stock with the EK block. I haven't tested with the xspc block for stock. Your tcl with the offset however very much matches what my EK Block would hit on 1.35v running prime. I have 2 1950x one on the zenith and one a gaming 7 and both had EK blocks and they were getting pretty much identical temps running prime. One being a p5 case open, and the other in my primo.


Got it. The CPU has been under prime for the last 2 hours and I just added in my two GPUs with two sessions of Heaven. So they are maxed out too. I'm going run them for a couple of hours and I will let you know, where the CPU ends up temp wise. The water temp has risen 3C though.


----------



## Dotachin

Any reviews of the Apogee SKF-TR4 out there?


----------



## happyluckbox

Here's another 1 hour p95 blend stability test. Threadripper 1950x 4.0ghz with 128gb 14cas Gskill Tridentz. The cooler I'm using is the liqtech tr-4 360mm AIO.
(my resolution is very high, so open the screenshots in a new tab and magnify with left click)





HWinfo recorded 1.4128 max vcore, while HWmonitor recorded 1.428 max vcore briefly.
Extreme llc, 1.283 vcore in bios, vsoc undervolted to .9v
315 watts of heat being dumped
My Voltage regulators are reaching 94c and yet the liqtech tr-4 kept my cpu at 72c peak temp.
Most of the time I'm averaging a much more comfortable 67c/1.38vcore on my cpu though.


----------



## Spyder233

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I am not saying you are just saying the data seems to be not plausible. Your temps for 1 hr prime is similar to what I get on stock with the EK block. I haven't tested with the xspc block for stock. Your tcl with the offset however very much matches what my EK Block would hit on 1.35v running prime. I have 2 1950x one on the zenith and one a gaming 7 and both had EK blocks and they were getting pretty much identical temps running prime. One being a p5 case open, and the other in my primo.


Nycgtr, What does your loop consist of? Is it the same on both your rigs. I am running EK blocks on everything CPU and GPUs. I run XSPC Radiators and Reservoir. With 2xD5 pumps in series. The radiators are 2.5" thick as well. Also, do you have temp gauges on your water as it flows into you CPU. I have been at full load for a while now. Both CPU under Prime and GPUs in SLI maxed out. My water temps into my CPU have stabilized at 34C. I played with the flow a bit and when I decreased the pump speed, my temps spiked. This is where it is at right now.


----------



## chew*

Maybe the EK needs high head pressure like the swiftechs.

The swiftech top of the line blocks are meh on an mcp 30 but shine on a mcp50x.

Thx for posting up tdie/RM.

@ Happyluckbox im getting those temps on a swiftech 2x120 aio and a bykski @ normal fan speeds(1500rpm = quiet).

Add that to the QC issues i have read on the enermax not really impressed.

Think i will order a 50x to toss on my h220 see if that changes anything then i will up the anty and try my h320x2.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Quick question, has anyone tried using a single GPU in the second full x16 slot on the taichi board. Because of some of my mods, the primary slot is block and I really don't want to pull out the dremel this morning to try and make it fit. Just need to know if this MB has issues if the first slot isn't populated. Thanks.[/quote





]

nope i have run my vega in slot 1 2 and 3 and there is zero difference in performance between them(right now i have it jammed into one...cosy but it fits, the backplate is right up on the cover but again no issues

that is similar temps to me (my small ffts with the same voltage are a bit higher though and my vcore is a little lower 1.3 in the bios 1.312 under load for 4g) with just a 420 and a separate loop for the vega.
so looking at the setup you run the pump to the radiator then the cpu? looked at a few setups and videos and they run the pump/res to the cpu or to the video card then to the radiator...honestly which is better this is all so confusing








nice setup by the way


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> This is what I have:
> 
> Corsair 900D Case
> Silverstone 1500 Watt Power Supply
> AMD Threadripper 1950X
> ASUS Zenith Extreme - running the 0801 Bios @4GHz and vcore set to 1.35
> 2 x Samsung 960 Pro m.2 in Raid 0 - That was fun
> G.SKILL TridentZ RGB 14Cas 4x16 running at 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35
> 2 x EVGA GTX 1080 ti FTW3 Elites - at GPU clock @ 2050 and Mem clock @ 6106
> 
> Water Cooling
> 
> XSPC reservoir w/2 x D5 Pumps >
> XSPC 360 Radiator>
> Outbound Temp Sensor>
> EK CPU Water Block>
> XSPC 360 Radiator>
> 2x EK 1080 ti Water Blocks>
> Inbound Temp Sensor
> XSPC 240 Radiator>
> Back to Reservoir
> 
> I run a single loop because it easy. I have run 2 loops in the past.
> 
> Here are some pics of the rig.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am working on it today, but I ran Prime Small FFT for about an hour.
> 
> Here it is at idol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here it is at load for 55 minutes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is what I am seeing. I can run it later for longer. This is only the CPU under load as well.






i,m really not sure what i am looking at

if you set voltages say 1.3 and put the right amount of LLC they should not jump around period a droop here and there yeah but not like that.
the vrms especially the 94 degrees is also a tad warm hotter they get less stable you get.
grab the latest hwinfo and include tctl and tdie figures to give a better idea.

plus if that is JUST prime blend those temps are high on blend i would be a lot happier around 50 degrees because small ffts or chews homeland security waterboarding blend with heaven would easily dump another 20 degrees on top.
and if those fan speed are right they are pretty quick near the edge so nowhere to go really.

first thing i would do...and this is just me is go back to stock...dead stock with maybe xmp.

do a prime 95 blend run for 10 15 minutes to get an idea if the temps stabilise or continue to rise.

then go into the bios go to zen cpu and change the first pstate say something reasonable like 3.8(only the cpu speed setting do NOT touch the other 2)
go back to advanced change vcore to offset and add an offset(only do this from stock do NOT do it if the cpu is overclocked it seems to screw up the voltages)
i,m not sure what offset to put but say 0.16 to start tohat should net you areound 1.28 i think(there are plenty of sites and ryzen overclocking that should have more accurate figures)

now for LLCV i,m not sure how the gigabyte works but i would not use extreme that is just going to overvolt pick the lowest one and go up a notch or 2 say 1 is stock try 3.

save the settings to a usb and bios
reboot
rerun tests (after you load hwinfo or the bios to see what voltage was applied if it is too high immediately change it)

see what you get if that works and your happy go up one more notch.

you are aiming for around 60 degrees prime blend with that cooler...lower would be better but 60 will be ok for now.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Here's another 1 hour p95 blend stability test. Threadripper 1950x 4.0ghz with 128gb 14cas Gskill Tridentz. The cooler I'm using is the liqtech tr-4 360mm AIO.
> (my resolution is very high, so open the screenshots in a new tab and magnify with left click)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HWinfo recorded 1.4128 max vcore, while HWmonitor recorded 1.428 max vcore briefly.
> Extreme llc, 1.283 vcore in bios, vsoc undervolted to .9v
> 315 watts of heat being dumped
> My Voltage regulators are reaching 94c and yet the liqtech tr-4 kept my cpu at 72c peak temp.
> Most of the time I'm averaging a much more comfortable 67c/1.38vcore on my cpu though.






now for consistency i would like to see whatever the latest hwinfo is and tctl and tdie those seem to be the only real reliable ones (ryzen master seems around the same but i just don't like the app and the extra overhead.

now...xspc users....give us a rundown how is it working.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> Got it. The CPU has been under prime for the last 2 hours and I just added in my two GPUs with two sessions of Heaven. So they are maxed out too. I'm going run them for a couple of hours and I will let you know, where the CPU ends up temp wise. The water temp has risen 3C though.






missed that one by prime what do you mean
prime blend
small ffts
ultimate waterboard chew style.









and again i love the setup


----------



## chew*

Blend is large and small ffts. Both do little to stress imc hoever thus blend custom ram allocation.

Takes longer to hit a 22k heatmaker but it produces the same heat as a small fft 22k because...its the same damn thing.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Blend is large and small ffts. Both do little to stress imc hoever thus blend custom ram allocation.
> 
> Takes longer to hit a 22k heatmaker but it produces the same heat as a small fft 22k because...its the same damn thing.


ok fair enough so how long does it take to ramp up to small fts type violence.

i,m assuming a long time so running it for half an hour on blend is going to do squat

what was the ram allocation you use for 32 gig i refuse to search i,m to old








oh you also mentioned the fan setup on the taichi is a bit weird i agree.
i can set what i want i have it to around 1k for the fans at the moment and when they hit 50 degrees cpu temp i ram them up and againa t 60 BUT they don't really ramp up quickly they need to have the same temp threshold for quite a while before they will which is a bit of a bother but again even at 1500 rpm these fans are not that loud at 1k they are pretty much silent.

i,m testing that now with boring prime 95


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> Nycgtr, What does your loop consist of? Is it the same on both your rigs. I am running EK blocks on everything CPU and GPUs. I run XSPC Radiators and Reservoir. With 2xD5 pumps in series. The radiators are 2.5" thick as well. Also, do you have temp gauges on your water as it flows into you CPU. I have been at full load for a while now. Both CPU under Prime and GPUs in SLI maxed out. My water temps into my CPU have stabilized at 34C. I played with the flow a bit and when I decreased the pump speed, my temps spiked. This is where it is at right now.


THe primo has 2 loops

1 loop running the cpu

250ml res -> ek d5 revo top with a swiftech d5 speed control set to 4 -> cpu block -> hwlabs 360 gts -> res I have a temp sensor going from the oulet of the pump it reads 30-32c on avg.
250ml res -> ek d5 mod top with a ek d5 -> 360 gts -> 480 PE -> titan pascal 1 -> titan pascal 2-> res I have a temp sensor going from outlet to first rad it reads 29-31c on avg.

Second system

P5

200 res -> ek d5 pump revo -> titan pascal -> cpu block -> 480 PE-> res


----------



## tarot

ok decided to try 3466 with gupsterg via stilts times(i think that's his name







)

some good some meh so again no massive differences.
temps are a bit higher as it is a bit warmer in here....guess i will see what happens with the xspc block.

now i have another question

i have this pump for the cpu
https://www.pccasegear.com/products/33665/ek-xres-140-ddc-3-2-pwm-elite-pump-reservoir-combo
it is sata power connected with a wire for pwm
i ran out of connectors so just running off power.
what's the chance the pump is not running at full speed with just power connected...i know its running i can see that but i,m a bit worried its at half or whatever and that's one reason i get higher than i thought temps.


----------



## glenenglish

Am new user. have a CCX clocking question.

reason for going TR1950 is that I run multiple heavy programs simultaneously in the course of design .

Like :
FPGA compile 4 cores full smoke 10-25 minutes
simultaneously with :

FPGA VHDL simulation - hard, single core.

simultaneously with PCB / schematic redraws, edits

and everything else

With TR1950 I can lassoo and isolate a CCX for the FPGA compile, a CCX for the VHDL sim, a CCX for PCB
and then leave the system with a CCX for everything else

Thus keeping the caches not too polluted.

Now the question - can I run one of the CCXs at full smoke, or even super speed - leaving the others to get along at stock speed to deal with thermals ?

My current system is a dual channel 4690k 32GB DDR3 1600 3.5- 4.2 GHz . I figure the TR will be about same speed with the TR running 3.8 gigs on the fpga complile, but of course EVERYTHING grinds to a halt if I try to do multiple things while the FPGA compilers is thinking intensely. (Vivado). the GUI jams, almost.

informed comments please ?

glen.


----------



## Spyder233

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> THe primo has 2 loops
> 
> 1 loop running the cpu
> 
> 250ml res -> ek d5 revo top with a swiftech d5 speed control set to 4 -> cpu block -> hwlabs 360 gts -> res I have a temp sensor going from the oulet of the pump it reads 30-32c on avg.
> 250ml res -> ek d5 mod top with a ek d5 -> 360 gts -> 480 PE -> titan pascal 1 -> titan pascal 2-> res I have a temp sensor going from outlet to first rad it reads 29-31c on avg.
> 
> Second system
> 
> P5
> 
> 200 res -> ek d5 pump revo -> titan pascal -> cpu block -> 480 PE-> res


When I ran 1 360 radiator on the CPU, while I was testing out the GPUs before adding the water blocks. Mine peaked at 63-64C. I wonder if the rest is that I run 2 D5s in series. When I slowed my D5s down, my temps did spike by 3-4C. Just speculating at this point.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spyder233*
> 
> When I ran 1 360 radiator on the CPU, while I was testing out the GPUs before adding the water blocks. Mine peaked at 63-64C. I wonder if the rest is that I run 2 D5s in series. When I slowed my D5s down, my temps did spike by 3-4C. Just speculating at this point.


Adjusting the speed on the d5 in the cpu loop doesn't effect my temps. I could throw everything in 1 big loop, but the rad is not heating nor the water temp under load to make me feel its surface area. I see others with similar temps to mine so I am not too concerned. The only thing I can think of this point is the as5 that's on there but I have that on my gpus as well and they are fine. However, on the other 1950x system I used the noctua paste and it's similar as well.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Adjusting the speed on the d5 in the cpu loop doesn't effect my temps. I could throw everything in 1 big loop, but the rad is not heating nor the water temp under load to make me feel its surface area. I see others with similar temps to mine so I am not too concerned. The only thing I can think of this point is the as5 that's on there but I have that on my gpus as well and they are fine. However, on the other 1950x system I used the noctua paste and it's similar as well.


At the risk of beating this to death, I'm seeing the same thing as you NYCGTR (except I have a 1920X). I have a ton of rad capacity (2 360's and one 280) for the CPU and one 1080 TI. But I had the 1920X on just the two 360's for testing earlier, and in both cases saw high temps. The only conclusion I can come to is that the CPU block itself is the bottleneck.

That said, I'm confused. I thought you had switched to the XSPC block and seen significantly lower temps. I had thought about purchasing one of those too, but want to make sure it's worth my effort.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> At the risk of beating this to death, I'm seeing the same thing as you NYCGTR (except I have a 1920X). I have a ton of rad capacity (2 360's and one 280) for the CPU and one 1080 TI. But I had the 1920X on just the two 360's for testing earlier, and in both cases saw high temps. The only conclusion I can come to is that the CPU block itself is the bottleneck.
> 
> That said, I'm confused. I thought you had switched to the XSPC block and seen significantly lower temps. I had thought about purchasing one of those too, but want to make sure it's worth my effort.


I was throttling under the EK block @ 1.35v. I would hit 85c and begin to throttle on clocks. With the XSPC block with the same bios settings I am capping out around 70c max. The EK block was fine at stock clock and kept me under 60c. However, OCed it falls apart horribly.


----------



## Turok916

Guys, quick question if i set up my vcore (fix) does the 1950x engage xfr ? i have to test yet (not at home) but im considering fix my vcore to avoid vcore peaks already in other thread the comment was not to worry but if the cpu is going to engange xfr i will prefer to fix the vcore.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I was throttling under the EK block @ 1.35v. I would hit 85c and begin to throttle on clocks. With the XSPC block with the same bios settings I am capping out around 70c max. The EK block was fine at stock clock and kept me under 60c. However, OCed it falls apart horribly.


Thanks -- That's my sense as well. My EK block keeps things below 30 degrees at idle, even at 1.35v vcore. It's under heavy load that it struggles, so it feels like a bottleneck.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Quick question, has anyone tried using a single GPU in the second full x16 slot on the taichi board. Because of some of my mods, the primary slot is block and I really don't want to pull out the dremel this morning to try and make it fit. Just need to know if this MB has issues if the first slot isn't populated. Thanks.


I haven't run a single GPU in the second slot but my 4 way SLI setup works fine. The x8 slot isn't a bottleneck and the GPU is detected.

Is there a reason you don't want to use slot 3? It's a full x16 slot.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I haven't run a single GPU in the second slot but my 4 way SLI setup works fine. The x8 slot isn't a bottleneck and the GPU is detected.
> 
> Is there a reason you don't want to use slot 3? It's a full x16 slot.


Some boards give hardly any room between the RAM to the GPU. GPU Backplates may touch.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Thanks -- That's my sense as well. My EK block keeps things below 30 degrees at idle, even at 1.35v vcore. It's under heavy load that it struggles, so it feels like a bottleneck.


I have some soft tubing laying around and their respective fittings. I could do a block for block video. Just my free time at home is limited lol.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I have some soft tubing laying around and their respective fittings. I could do a block for block video. Just my free time at home is limited lol.


But your sense is the XSPC is worth ~10-15 degrees under load @ 1.35v?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> But your sense is the XSPC is worth ~10-15 degrees under load @ 1.35v?


In my current experience in prime 95 small its about 10-11. Same volts same clocks same loop.


----------



## Bartouille

Does this ram seem ok for 1950x?

https://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232191 (X2)

Even though 16gb feels kind of unbalanced for 1950x, I don't really need more than that for now. Plus RAM prices are ridiculous.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Some boards give hardly any room between the RAM to the GPU. GPU Backplates may touch.


For slot 1. Slot 3 is wide open.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Does this ram seem ok for 1950x?
> 
> https://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232191 (X2)
> 
> Even though 16gb feels kind of unbalanced for 1950x, I don't really need more than that for now. Plus RAM prices are ridiculous.


3733. That's really fast RAM for TR. I don't have any experience with that kit but it's probably b die at that speed.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> For slot 1. Slot 3 is wide open.
> 3733. That's really fast RAM for TR. I don't have any experience with that kit but it's probably b die at that speed.


The question was about slot 1...


----------



## Bartouille

Yeah, it definitely won't run at 3733mhz on TR, but this is guaranteed b-die. All the kits I can find on newegg.ca that use 4gb sticks have c16+ for 3200mhz+. And 3200mhz c16 isn't guaranteed b-die. Hope this kit can run 3200 at c14.


----------



## Fantasy

Alright, I'm running my b-die (Corsair CMR64GX4M4C3333C16) 64GB RAM @ 3033 @ 13-13-13-30-40-2T @ 1.44V stable. No matter what I do, I can't seem to run it at 3200MHz stable.









As for my 1950X I'm running it at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750V with level 4 LLC. Max voltage I have seen it get to is 1.380V.
My VDDSOC is @ 1.20V.

All this is being cooled by the Noctua NH U14S TR4-SP3. Max temps is around 70C.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Alright, I'm running my b-die (Corsair CMR64GX4M4C3333C16) 64GB RAM @ 3033 @ 13-13-13-30-40-2T @ 1.44V stable. No matter what I do, I can't seem to run it at 3200MHz stable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for my 1950X I'm running it at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750V with level 4 LLC. Max voltage I have seen it get to is 1.380V.
> My VDDSOC is @ 1.20V.
> 
> All this is being cooled by the Noctua NH U14S TR4-SP3. Max temps is around 70C.


Are you fully stable p95 with that? Looks like you got a good cpu, but poor IMC. I got the opposite haha, 4ghz requires 1.41v peak but I can run 3060mem with 128gb of ram

Also about the memory, have you tried disabling gear down mode and setting command rate to 2T?


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Are you fully stable p95 with that? Looks like you got a good cpu, but poor IMC. I got the opposite haha, 4ghz requires 1.41v peak but I can run 3060mem with 128gb of ram


Yeah, I ran it for eight hours, everything is stable. I was hoping to get at least 3200MHz. But I guess my IMC is not that great. Maybe a new BIOS update would allow me to get to 3200? Idk. will see.

VDDSOC is the IMC voltage, right?


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Here's another 1 hour p95 blend stability test. Threadripper 1950x 4.0ghz with 128gb 14cas Gskill Tridentz. The cooler I'm using is the liqtech tr-4 360mm AIO.
> (my resolution is very high, so open the screenshots in a new tab and magnify with left click)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HWinfo recorded 1.4128 max vcore, while HWmonitor recorded 1.428 max vcore briefly.
> Extreme llc, 1.283 vcore in bios, vsoc undervolted to .9v
> 315 watts of heat being dumped
> My Voltage regulators are reaching 94c and yet the liqtech tr-4 kept my cpu at 72c peak temp.
> Most of the time I'm averaging a much more comfortable 67c/1.38vcore on my cpu though.


Holy VRM temps !!! You should add a fan to cool them down. I know VRMs can take upto 110C+ but still.

My VRM on full load never go above 50C.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Holy VRM temps !!! You should add a fan to cool them down. I know VRMs can take upto 110C+ but still.
> 
> My VRM on full load never go above 50C.


I second this. Average temps of 70+ and peak temps of 90+ are not good. Thats hard duty on a motherboard unless those are benchmark only temps.


----------



## chew*

Ok I came up with a way to test pump pressure as apples as apples as possible.

http://www.swiftech.com/h320x2.aspx

3x120mm mcp 30D pump built in res

http://www.swiftech.com/mcr-x20-drive-rev3.aspx

3x120mm mcp35x pump built in res

will steal fans from my h320 x2

the MCP 30D is not even listed but I am guessing it would fall under the 350 pump data.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Ok I came up with a way to test pump pressure as apples as apples as possible.
> 
> http://www.swiftech.com/h320x2.aspx
> 
> 3x120mm mcp 30D pump built in res
> 
> http://www.swiftech.com/mcr-x20-drive-rev3.aspx
> 
> 3x120mm mcp35x pump built in res
> 
> will steal fans from my h320 x2
> 
> the MCP 30D is not even listed but I am guessing it would fall under the 350 pump data.


How about that c399a? Any good?

TY


----------



## chew*

it was supposed to be here yesterday.

No clue whats going on. Aaron ordered had it shipped to my house.

Meanwhile I had planned on grabbing that swiftech setup anyway for my 750D to replace a h320 x2 I want to move to bench table.

kill 2 birds one stone.

My goal is just to figure out the cheapest least amount of rad/fan noise setup to tame these things at a reasonable oc/voltage.

I am sure there is a recipe just need to figure it out.

My drive II in hindsight actually had decent temps for what it was and that was with the 35x on the suction side mcp30D push side but its the totally wrong block for application so next up is a 35x push and maybe I will order a housing steal the drive II 35x and series it.

Currently on the MCP30D it takes a day or so for the pump to force air out of block so it might benefit from the pressure, I introduced air into the system to inspect the flow rate and it was not that impressive no fault of the block as the flow pattern looks decent ( a modified plate may help if biased on the outer edges versus center ), think its just the pump. My 3ft run of norprene for bench area ( 6ft total with 3ft inlet 3 ft outlet may be the culprit )


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Yeah, I ran it for eight hours, everything is stable. I was hoping to get at least 3200MHz. But I guess my IMC is not that great. Maybe a new BIOS update would allow me to get to 3200? Idk. will see.
> 
> VDDSOC is the IMC voltage, right?


i would think it is more the motherboard/bios that is dictating this and the ram itself i had a set of team extreme 3600 it IS Samsung b die but it will not go over 2933 on a 1800x/1600x or this TR i believe it is more that they are made/tuned for intel i think you will find once the companies other than gskill get off their asses and start tuning for amd that a lot of this mess will go away.

the aegesa code and bios can only do so much in my opinion the best bet is get a tuned amd kit pricier but then again all ram has gone through the roof. my 3200 flarex kit originally cost me 280 2 weeks before that it was 230 and now its 320 and the same goes for all ddr4 including intel based ones.
supply and demand...demand is up supply drops prices go up.

so if you want to run that kit at 3200 i would suggest you dig really deep into the timings look for others with that exact ram and see what timings they run.

also the soc voltage in my opinion is too high ....go to high with that and it actually hurts stability try dropping to 1.15 or 1.1 and see how you go.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Ok I came up with a way to test pump pressure as apples as apples as possible.
> 
> http://www.swiftech.com/h320x2.aspx
> 
> 3x120mm mcp 30D pump built in res
> 
> http://www.swiftech.com/mcr-x20-drive-rev3.aspx
> 
> 3x120mm mcp35x pump built in res
> 
> will steal fans from my h320 x2
> 
> the MCP 30D is not even listed but I am guessing it would fall under the 350 pump data.






i am a little lost ...is that just a review of those samples with the results? if that's the case my pump i listed above says head p[pressure is 5.2 assuming full speed i guess and that would be related to the figures on the left?

so what am i getting from that table? the green line is the best one because flow is better?


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Adjusting the speed on the d5 in the cpu loop doesn't effect my temps. I could throw everything in 1 big loop, but the rad is not heating nor the water temp under load to make me feel its surface area. I see others with similar temps to mine so I am not too concerned. The only thing I can think of this point is the as5 that's on there but I have that on my gpus as well and they are fine. However, on the other 1950x system I used the noctua paste and it's similar as well.






ok so when the radiator pump etc does not heat up that much it really has to be the block constricting flow right? because that is what is happening tom y 1950x
but
the gpu a vega space heating nuclear inferno....the radiator i had a a140mm and the tubes pump got very very hot meaning good flow...change dto a 280 and its a lot better now temps are down 20 odd degrees and the radiator etc is nowhere near as hot ith the sae flow through the tubes.
so therefore the radiator size was the issue (i think) so if i was to throw in the 140 as well since its spare would that make that much of a difference or not bother?

i am missing my AIO now throw on block screw in turn on


----------



## chew*

Size plays a roll Im 100% sure if i go to my 320 my temps drop 3c. Size is not all though. Size changes your volume (time to reach peak and overall avg) and fan speed needs....but under pumping can negate that if there is something restrictive in loop. over pumping can move water to fast through radiator for the heat to exchange. There is a happy medium enter PWM control.

I am not missing aio.

Turn on 1 year later dead board/cpu failed pump.

Swiftech turn on 7 years later = works.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Size plays a roll Im 100% sure if i go to my 320 my temps drop 3c. Size is not all though. Size changes your volume (time to reach peak and overall avg) and fan speed needs....but under pumping can negate that if there is something restrictive in loop. over pumping can move water to fast through radiator for the heat to exchange. There is a happy medium enter PWM control.
> 
> I am not missing aio.
> 
> Turn on 1 year later dead board/cpu failed pump.
> 
> Swiftech turn on 7 years later = works.






just being lazy








i have a 5 year old h110 here that still works so ner










ok so maybe my pump is too fast? that would lead to the radiator being cool but why the pipes...oh wait....if the water is moving over the block to fast it can't pick up the heat...i get it.

ok well i am going to try and find another pwm header on this dopy board and see what altering the pump speed does.
thanks


----------



## jamesomega

My 2400 DD4 defaults seem to be running fine but the C0 shutdown/reboot issue is an MSI firmware problem that they have yet to fix. After doing a bunch of BIOS adjustments and an unnecessary windows restore it turns out my locked 4C/8T problem was easily fixed by going into msconfig, clicking the Boot tab, clicking the "Advanced options..." button and un-ticking the "Number of processors" box. After applying and rebooting I've got my 16C/32T count back.

Instead of using Ryzen Master for enabling/disabling cores, I'm just going to use Process Lasso and set manual core affinity for my "legacy" games that crash from seeing 20+ cores. I might lose a few FPS here or there but it sure beats needing to reboot in order to play something.

Thanks again for your help!


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Holy VRM temps !!! You should add a fan to cool them down. I know VRMs can take upto 110C+ but still.
> 
> My VRM on full load never go above 50C.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Are you fully stable p95 with that? Looks like you got a good cpu, but poor IMC. I got the opposite haha, 4ghz requires 1.41v peak but I can run 3060mem with 128gb of ram


Already added spot fans to the vrms. This is pretty much bench only temps. When i use it for solving, it gets to around 75c- so stll pretty hot but its the best i can manage


----------



## tarot

ok the xspc block came
damn its big
i had to load it on a trolly









i,m assuming the inlet is the one with the arrow pointing to it....
and should i bother with the leds?


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## The L33t

The inlet is the one that connects to the center channel.


----------



## ITAngel

I order my EK Block Today from Ebay got an amazing deal on one. Waiting for it to get here Friday or Monday. Then getting some other hardware to get this loop going. =P


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> The inlet is the one that connects to the center channel.


that would be the one with the arrow and under it seems to have a channel going to the center I guess.

just trying to get the w10 fall update happy then I,ll rip this thing apart...again...


----------



## crion

Is the concensus that EK block is fine for stock speeds but XSPC block needed for serious OC’s?


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crion*
> 
> Is the concensus that EK block is fine for stock speeds but XSPC block needed for serious OC's?


I really wouldn't bother with the EK one, until they come out with a proper design.

If you don't want to pay a little more for the XSPC one, then get the Bykski (it's barely behind the XSPC in performance) and is also cheaper than the EK one.

If the market had perfect knowledge, EK would sell zero TR4 blocks.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crion*
> 
> Is the concensus that EK block is fine for stock speeds but XSPC block needed for serious OC's?


Its overpriced and under delivers. The XSPC block costs less and is about 10C cooler according to some posters on the forum.


----------



## happyluckbox

The xspc block performs about 2c better than the liqtech tr-4 right?


----------



## ITAngel

Is it better to have the Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 Liquid Cooler over the EK block custom water cooling setup? Just curious,


----------



## pmc25

No. But you're much better with either the Bykski or XSPC.

Jury is out on the Phanteks, but I don't *THINK* the plate is as big as the Bykski or XSPC (someone correct me if I'm wrong)? I suspect it will perform somewhere in the middle of the XSPC/Bykski and the EK.

EK make some great products. In fact, the majority of their products.

But this is not one of them.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> No. But you're much better with either the Bykski or XSPC.
> 
> Jury is out on the Phanteks, but I don't *THINK* the plate is as big as the Bykski or XSPC (someone correct me if I'm wrong)? I suspect it will perform somewhere in the middle of the XSPC/Bykski and the EK.
> 
> EK make some great products. In fact, the majority of their products.
> 
> But this is not one of them.


I see, i was looking at those as well but I guess for $57 dollars I can't complain. lol


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I see, i was looking at those as well but I guess for $57 dollars I can't complain. lol


The Bykski is 65 shipped. I wish I had bought the RGB version as I'd be done until a mono block was available. As it is, within a degree of the top dog is pretty good.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Is it better to have the Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 Liquid Cooler over the EK block custom water cooling setup? Just curious,


From what I've seen the liqtech aio outperforms the EK. It's only 2c off the XSPC from an article I read.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I see, i was looking at those as well but I guess for $57 dollars I can't complain. lol


If you got it that cheap, it probably means it's already being cleared because they're EOL'ing it, because people have realised it isn't good enough.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> If you got it that cheap, it probably means it's already being cleared because they're EOL'ing it, because people have realised it isn't good enough.


its 65 direct from bisky USA.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> If you got it that cheap, it probably means it's already being cleared because they're EOL'ing it, because people have realised it isn't good enough.


what you mean EOL'ing it? By the way are you guys trying to OC your chip because that is not my plan for going water.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> If you got it that cheap, it probably means it's already being cleared because they're EOL'ing it, because people have realised it isn't good enough.


Probably used from someone who didn't like it.

EK just announced the mono block for the Asus boards today. It's acrylic so you can see the really small cooling engine in all of its [non] glory. This appears to be all EK is going to do for TR4.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Probably used from someone who didn't like it.
> 
> EK just announced the mono block for the Asus boards today. It's acrylic so you can see the really small cooling engine in all of its [non] glory. This appears to be all EK is going to do for TR4.


Nice!, well I have a AsRock fatal1ty x370 professional gaming motherboard and I like the clean look of the block I got. XD I mean if it keeps my system cooled and fans on low settings while I do work on the system. That is all i care since I am not after benchmark numbers or top OC numbers.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> its 65 direct from bisky USA.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> what you mean EOL'ing it? By the way are you guys trying to OC your chip because that is not my plan for going water.


He got a cheap EK block. Not Bykski.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Nice!, well I have a AsRock fatal1ty x370 professional gaming motherboard and I like the clean look of the block I got. XD I mean if it keeps my system cooled and fans on low settings while I do work on the system. That is all i care since I am not after benchmark numbers or top OC numbers.


The top EK X370 is probably the best performing X370 product, as most of their blocks are.

The EK X399 block is essentially an X299 rebrand, and even their monoblock seems to be the same. It's totally unsuitable for TR4 as the coldplate and cooling channels are nowhere near big enough.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> He got a cheap EK block. Not Bykski.
> The top EK X370 is probably the best performing X370 product, as most of their blocks are.
> 
> The EK X399 block is essentially an X299 rebrand, and even their monoblock seems to be the same. It's totally unsuitable for TR4 as the coldplate and cooling channels are nowhere near big enough.


So what would you recommend? Get a Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 AIO Liquid CPU Cooler instead? I mean if is not going to work for what I want it for which is cooler temps with lower fan noise level. I need to do that because I do recording and don't want the sound of loud fans being picked up via my condenser mic. The Noctua cooler is nice but once I did a test rendering Blender it seems the temps were going a bit to high for my like. I manage to make it so the temps are lower but now the front fans are to loud. lol


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> So what would you recommend? Get a Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 AIO Liquid CPU Cooler instead? I mean if is not going to work for what I want it for which is cooler temps with lower fan noise level. I need to do that because I do recording and don't want the sound of loud fans being picked up via my condenser mic. The Noctua cooler is nice but once I did a test rendering Blender it seems the temps were going a bit to high for my like. I manage to make it so the temps are lower but now the front fans are to loud. lol


If your gonna do a custom loop get the xspc, elsewise just get the enermax. I dont think the enermax performs worse than the EK tr tbh.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> He got a cheap EK block. Not Bykski.
> The top EK X370 is probably the best performing X370 product, as most of their blocks are.
> 
> The EK X399 block is essentially an X299 rebrand, and even their monoblock seems to be the same. It's totally unsuitable for TR4 as the coldplate and cooling channels are nowhere near big enough.


I have the EK block, the XSPC block and I bought the monoblock. From the pictures the monoblock plate looks bigger but I won't know till I get it. I expect it to perform better than the regular tr4 based off my assumptions but I would not expect it to outdo the xspc block. Only time will tell.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> If your gonna do a custom loop get the xspc, elsewise just get the enermax. I dont think the enermax performs worse than the EK tr tbh.


What kind of warranty does Enermax has if their cooler break and leaks all over my hardware? Is why I stay away from aio. Lol


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> What kind of warranty does Enermax has if their cooler break and leaks all over my hardware? Is why I stay away from aio. Lol


Never owned anything from enermax. I can't say bad or good.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> If your gonna do a custom loop get the xspc, elsewise just get the enermax. I dont think the enermax performs worse than the EK tr tbh.
> 
> 
> 
> What kind of warranty does Enermax has if their cooler break and leaks all over my hardware? Is why I stay away from aio. Lol
Click to expand...

 I have got one on order, I have mainly used Corsair AIO and never had any leak problems, obviously touch wood I wont have any leak issues with the Enermax but im confident it should be fine.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> I have got one on order, I have mainly used Corsair AIO and never had any leak problems, obviously touch wood I wont have any leak issues with the Enermax but im confident it should be fine.


Oh i see, nice. I like the idea of something simple, straight forward and don't have to worry so much about it. However; seeing post online about people with aio on Corsair and destroying their system plus taking forever to RMA and get stuff replace. It just made it so that I can't road that direction even if I wanted to. At least if it breaks on a custom loop, it was my fault and no one else. lol







However when I started building loops I felt comfortable working on them that I knew what to check for and such. This is why I jumped on the opportunity to grab that block asap but it will still cost me a bit more over getting an AIO. lol


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> I have got one on order, I have mainly used Corsair AIO and never had any leak problems, obviously touch wood I wont have any leak issues with the Enermax but im confident it should be fine.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh i see, nice. I like the idea of something simple, straight forward and don't have to worry so much about it. However; seeing post online about people with aio on Corsair and destroying their system plus taking forever to RMA and get stuff replace. It just made it so that I can't road that direction even if I wanted to. At least if it breaks on a custom loop, it was my fault and no one else. lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> However when I started building loops I felt comfortable working on them that I knew what to check for and such. This is why I jumped on the opportunity to grab that block asap but it will still cost me a bit more over getting an AIO. lol
Click to expand...

I certainly understand why some prefer custom loops withe regards to customisation and sometimes better performance, thought I think there is just as much chance as a custom loop springing a leak as an AIO. I feel the risk is potentially the same. I have done custom loops in the past but in all honesty I no longer wanted the hassle nor the maintenance responsibility, call it lazy but I just prefer the ease of AIO coolers these days and as long as you are using decent fans for your RAD and an appropriate TIM, it should perform well.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> I certainly understand why some prefer custom loops withe regards to customisation and sometimes better performance, thought I think there is just as much chance as a custom loop springing a leak as an AIO. I feel the risk is potentially the same. I have done custom loops in the past but in all honesty I no longer wanted the hassle nor the maintenance responsibility, call it lazy but I just prefer the ease of AIO coolers these days and as long as you are using decent fans for your RAD and an appropriate TIM, it should perform well.


That makes sense, I would like to do that as long as I know if something happen that Enermax will take care of it. =P


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> From what I've seen the liqtech aio outperforms the EK. It's only 2c off the XSPC from an article I read.


If we ignore the fact that they could only run 3.9 on liqtec vs 4.0 on xspc with there what appears to be crappy chip

Sure then it was only a few degrees.

Base mass helps counter transition.

Base mass is something aio lack. They also lack the ability to be forward compatible. They also lack the ability to add or replace pumps or series pumps.

Simply put they are made for a throwaway society. Something that real water cooling guys do not do.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> He got a cheap EK block. Not Bykski.
> The top EK X370 is probably the best performing X370 product, as most of their blocks are.
> 
> The EK X399 block is essentially an X299 rebrand, and even their monoblock seems to be the same. It's totally unsuitable for TR4 as the coldplate and cooling channels are nowhere near big enough.


I've run both the X399 EK block and the XSPC block - no difference in temps between them.

The cold plate on both blocks cover the entire heat spreader.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If we ignore the fact that they could only run 3.9 on liqtec vs 4.0 on xspc with there what appears to be crappy chip
> 
> Sure then it was only a few degrees.
> 
> Base mass helps counter transition.
> 
> Base mass is something aio lack. They also lack the ability to be forward compatible. They also lack the ability to add or replace pumps or series pumps.
> 
> Simply put they are made for a throwaway society. Something that real water cooling guys do not do.


Makes sense, is one reason i was thinking would be cool to have that flexibility to add and remove parts as needed.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If we ignore the fact that they could only run 3.9 on liqtec vs 4.0 on xspc with there what appears to be crappy chip
> 
> Sure then it was only a few degrees.
> 
> Base mass helps counter transition.
> 
> Base mass is something aio lack. They also lack the ability to be forward compatible. They also lack the ability to add or replace pumps or series pumps.
> 
> Simply put they are made for a throwaway society. Something that real water cooling guys do not do.


I wouldn't casually discard any loop I've gone to the trouble of building, so you could be in to something.

The AIO units really only have advantages in some small form factor builds and for OEM builds where the user can't be trusted to properly fill a shipped system, and wants to claim they bought a water cooled machine. The convenience seems to be a selling point as in some cases I've seen better resale value on AIO units.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> I've run both the X399 EK block and the XSPC block - no difference in temps between them.
> 
> The cold plate on both blocks cover the entire heat spreader.


Coldplate is not the issue. Ihs coverage is not all. Heat exchanger over dies = the complaint


----------



## chew*

Just tossing this out there. Swiftech h320 x2 fits a ton of applications. Yes the xl block sucks compared to real blocks but not compared to throwaway aio.

Its $169.99

Bykski is $65.

How much does an aio cost to fit a multitude of applications and then how much does a TR tuned aio cost.

Fast forward 5 years from now...ijust buy another block.

You buy another AIO.

Or lets just talk present. Go x299 go cool that cpu @ 5gig with your sealed unalterable aio


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If we ignore the fact that they could only run 3.9 on liqtec vs 4.0 on xspc with there what appears to be crappy chip
> 
> Sure then it was only a few degrees.
> 
> Base mass helps counter transition.
> 
> Base mass is something aio lack. They also lack the ability to be forward compatible. They also lack the ability to add or replace pumps or series pumps.
> 
> Simply put they are made for a throwaway society. Something that real water cooling guys do not do.


I did real water cooling years ago. It's not for everybody and alot of people sometimes simply prefer the simplicity and plug and p lay of an AIO. Liqtech delivers on that front.

Btw, it turns out my chip was not such a dud afterall, this whole time I was over using LLC to overclock my chip. On top of that, I was using the freaking OUTDATED version of p95, which was running SIGNIFICANTLY HOTTER than the updated version now that supports ryzen fft. Since downloading the new p95, and using base vcore to overclock, I've been able to get far lower temperatures, with much more stable high overclocks.

Before I was struggling to maintain 3.95ghz at 1.39vcore, and temps were running into 72-73c range.
Now I'm hitting 4.025ghz, at 1.38vcore, and temps are at 67-68c. I may even shoot for 4.05ghz.

Once I figure out my final overclock, I'll post a new p95 blend 1 hour test run on the liqtech tr-4, with temps/voltage/etc


----------



## chew*

29.1 and newer covers ryzen. Our real world apps are within 3c of prime peak temps.

Older prime versions prior to 29.1 were easier to pass and passed with higher clocks and less heat if anything due to lack of avx512 so no clue what you were seeing.

If you hit the lottery and have a 4.05 basically if had had real water cooling you potentially have a 4.15 gig chip @ 2c or better less temps.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> 29.1 and newer covers ryzen. Our real world apps are within 3c of prime peak temps.
> 
> Older prime versions prior to 29.1 were easier to pass and passed with higher clocks and less heat if anything due to lack of avx512 so no clue what you were seeing.
> 
> If you hit the lottery and have a 4.05 basically if had had real water cooling you potentially have a 4.15 gig chip @ 2c or better less temps.


Not sure either, but you can see the temps I was hitting in some of my old screenshots. For example, my Voltage Regulators were reaching 94c. It's not the case anymore with the latest version of p95 that I got yesterday. (VRMs hover around 65-75c now) Maybe it has something to do with the large amount of ram I load up (120gb). As for real world apps, my poker solver often detects instabilities before p95 can and crashes. With the latest version of p95, my software now runs about the same temps as p95 too. So I'd say my apps are extremely demanding on hardware.

As for "real water cooling" I'm not sure why you don't think the liqtech tr-4 isn't a contender. It may not be a full custom built setup, but it's not a crappy asetec brand either. The radiator/fins are made of high grade materials (check out jayz 2 cents review on it, the fins are very hard to bend.) The coldplate completely covers the IHS, even the fans and radiator have rubber insulation to guard against vibrations. Being 2c off from a top of the line water block that costs nearly as much as the AIO itself really shows just how high quality the liqtech is, and when considering price and ease of installation, it's a no brainer. Of course, for many people (myself included in the past) the joy of watercooling comes from building/expanding/personalizing your own loop. But as far as performance tit for tat, 2c delta is barely statistically significant.

2c also shouldn't make break or break 3.9ghz -> 4.0ghz. That's the one part I found odd about that article. There's so many variables, it seems odd to pin it down to a 2c difference. With that in mind, I would be pretty surprised if switching to say the xspc custom block would suddenly allow me to overclock an extra 100 mhz from 4.05 to 4.15. That seems like an extremely tall order that a 2c difference alone cannot overcome.

Anyways, I'm running a 4.025ghz p95 1 hour blend test right now. Will post results soon. So far very promising! Although I'm not sure if I want to try for 4.05ghz, as that will require ~ 1.4vcore at peak


----------



## chew*

The temps that you get are what you get for your chip.

The temps hardocp get is what they get for there chip.

The temps i get are what i get for my chip.

It will vary but the laws of avg are leaning towards most chips run hot.

Only way to compare temps is to test on the identical parts with various cooling.

Based on hards results I would imagine liqtec comes in where my drive II results are.

Interestingly enough
I observed exactly what they did...unstable at same temps versus another block. I think the issue here is transitional temps possibly do to base mass or the lack there of which is the case for my drive II versus the bykski or phanteks.

By all means btw i am not suggesting the xspc...i think its pricey same opinion we share...120 for xspc...$65 for bykski...delta of 1c...for almost double. No thanks.

Little tip btw. Run auto and note peak voltage for peak boost. Do not exceed it and you will find the chips happy max voltage. Its unique to individual chip due to default vid/binning.

My chip peaks @ 1.44 for example. Its max happy place is 1.424 higher actually lowers my max clock potential which appears to be 4.1 in stressful benchmarks like corona for example. That is on the byski though...prior on the apogee drive II not possible.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Little tip btw. Run auto and note peak voltage for peak boost. Do not exceed it and you will find the chips happy max voltage. Its unique to individual chip due to default vid/binning.
> 
> My chip peaks @ 1.44 for example. Its max happy place is 1.424 higher actually lowers my max clock potential which appears to be 4.1 in stressful benchmarks like corona for example. That is on the byski though...prior on the apogee drive II not possible.


That seems awfully high. I remember running auto just to check the voltage and I saw it go up to 1.5. I was like nope not leaving it on auto lol.

What vcore do you get at peak load?


----------



## chew*

Fairly low.

This chips default vid is 1.125 which denotes its most likely a leaker.

Only takes 1.25v for 3.9 but its a volcano to tame heat wise.

Probably be good on ln2...not so fun on water.

I think the other one runs cooler but this one has a better imc.

I will know more soon once i break out the big guns rad/pump wise but basically trying to find the bare min cost/space wise to tame heat atm.


----------



## chew*

Fyi. Those on Asus with incredible temps no one else can hit









Whats that saying? If its to good to be true?

Until i see those magical temps on giga,msi,asrock or any other vendor I would say the below is very plausible for sub 60c oc temps...especially @ 4.0 on 1950x.

https://community.amd.com/thread/219430


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Coldplate is not the issue. Ihs coverage is not all. Heat exchanger over dies = the complaint


But a baseless complaint as in my testing (which included 3 remounts on each block), there was no performance difference between the XSPC block and the EK block.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> But a baseless complaint as in my testing (which included 3 remounts on each block), there was no performance difference between the XSPC block and the EK block.


What's your voltage and oc. Push your chip to the limit at 1.35-1.4v under full stress you will see the difference quite dramatically. I can say at stock operation theres almost 0 difference. Once you start pushing your oc the EK falls apart. I have 2 xspc 2 ek blocks on 2 diff systems it's not a reseat etc whatever.


----------



## ITAngel

Does Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 AIO Liquid CPU Cooler, Support 500W+TDP warranty cover any damage done to your system like Corsair does?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> But a baseless complaint as in my testing (which included 3 remounts on each block), there was no performance difference between the XSPC block and the EK block.


What was your testing methodology?

You are the first person I've seen that indicated they performed identically. Others have seen a huge delta. It would be helpful to know what is different.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> But a baseless complaint as in my testing (which included 3 remounts on each block), there was no performance difference between the XSPC block and the EK block.


I have tested 3 blocks and i can see differences between how all 3 react and temps they reach.

2 totally drastic designs and 0 difference i find highly unlikely.


----------



## twitchyzero

what are the chances TR4 will see an unlocked 32c/64t for $1500-1800 before it goes EOL in a few years?


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> what are the chances TR4 will see an unlocked 32c/64t for $1500-1800 before it goes EOL in a few years?


Maybe for Zen+ or Zen 2, doubt it'd be for Zen. It's not efficient enough to get high clock speeds and keep power draw down.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Maybe for Zen+ or Zen 2, doubt it'd be for Zen. It's not efficient enough to get high clock speeds and keep power draw down.


The process isn't small enough rather to keep the price in that range. Double the cores is at least double the price at the same node.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> what are the chances TR4 will see an unlocked 32c/64t for $1500-1800 before it goes EOL in a few years?


Physically impossible atm on current boards. It lacks the memory channels and would have to lose NUMA at the very least in this socket with current dimm slot options and even then the 3/4 dies are wired for channels 3/4 which does not exist on these boards.

At best they could rewire boards to accommodate 1 dimm channel (2 slots per die) without changing the size/layout.but by changing the trace layout drastically.

No matter how you cut it...it would not be a drop in upgrade.


----------



## twitchyzero

so the existing X399 mobos can't support die 3 and 4 if they weren't dummies?

happy with my 1950x...just fantasizing about what's possible or not

I should stick my old asus x1950 pro 256MB graphics card in it for the lols


----------



## happyluckbox

having some issues getting 4.025 ghz stable. Requiring 1.392v peak at load (1.38v average at load). P95 Blend 95% mem load seems to be failing around 20-30 minutes in on fft length 480k and 560k. Doesn't this generally indicate a memory issue on the larger fft?

Do you guys think 1.4v peak and 1.392v average at load with ~66c is too much for long term usage?


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> What was your testing methodology?
> 
> You are the first person I've seen that indicated they performed identically. Others have seen a huge delta. It would be helpful to know what is different.


3 mounts each block, star pattern for TIM (full 1g tube of Kryonaut each mount), then run AIDA64 stability test for 10 mins, record max temp at default clocks/voltages and 1.4v / 4.1ghz.


----------



## happyluckbox

Getting hardware failures around length 480k and 560k
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> 3 mounts each block, star pattern for TIM (full 1g tube of Kryonaut each mount), then run AIDA64 stability test for 10 mins, record max temp at default clocks/voltages and 1.4v / 4.1ghz.


Aida64 for 10 minutes? That's hardly enough to call something stable or record any valuable data regarding temps.

There's programs out there that stress your computer way harder than aida64 can, and I've often had my solving software crash and detect instabilities even when aida64 said it was stable for 1 hour.

Use p95 and run 1 hour blend 95% ram usage.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> having some issues getting 4.025 ghz stable. Requiring 1.392v peak at load (1.38v average at load). P95 Blend 95% mem load seems to be failing around 20-30 minutes in on fft length 480k and 560k. Doesn't this generally indicate a memory issue on the larger fft?
> 
> Do you guys think 1.4v peak and 1.392v average at load with ~66c is too much for long term usage?


Genetally speaking yes. Higher clock core chasing can come at a cost. Sacrifice some ram speed.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Getting hardware failures around length 480k and 560k
> Aida64 for 10 minutes? That's hardly enough to call something stable or record any valuable data regarding temps.
> 
> There's programs out there that stress your computer way harder than aida64 can, and I've often had my solving software crash and detect instabilities even when aida64 said it was stable for 1 hour.
> 
> Use p95 and run 1 hour blend 95% ram usage.


Who said anything about stability testing? That was max temp testing. I've noticed that max temps are seen within 10 mins. For example, i I run it for 2 hours, the max temp never exceeds the temp reached at the 10 min mark. 10 mins of Aida64 is plenty enough to heatsoak the rads/vrms/board etc.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Who said anything about stability testing? That was max temp testing. I've noticed that max temps are seen within 10 mins. For example, i I run it for 2 hours, the max temp never exceeds the temp reached at the 10 min mark. 10 mins of Aida64 is plenty enough to heatsoak the rads/vrms/board etc.


prime 95 small will give u more heat in 3 mins then what aida64 will give you in 10. I hope you arent going off the aida temp either cuz thats socket temp it's reading on the latest version not tdie.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Who said anything about stability testing? That was max temp testing. I've noticed that max temps are seen within 10 mins. For example, i I run it for 2 hours, the max temp never exceeds the temp reached at the 10 min mark. 10 mins of Aida64 is plenty enough to heatsoak the rads/vrms/board etc.


Ive run aida for 24 hours. It does not max out temps like prime.

Gooseberry in blender does a better job than aida for max temps.

You can skip all that crap run a 20k 22k or 24k iteration and get right to the source of volcano heat in prime. In 6 hour runs it hits 22k twice iirc. Temps on the 6 hour 22k never exceed the initial 22k since it hits the 22k about 30 mins in which by then has heat soaked everything.

Thats where I am getting my main temp comparison from which stands as follows.

Mcp30d 2x120 slim rad artic mx2 130 grams and declining fast each mount.

Bykski 67.3
Phanteks 68.5
Swifty Drive x2 ( mcp35x integrated ) 70c.

All mounted 3 times or more.

Based on results in many many benchmarks and rankings either the asrock I am using is gods gift to TR ( i highly doubt that albeit it is a solid board ) or many are throttling and I am not. (More than likely)


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Genetally speaking yes. Higher clock core chasing can come at a cost. Sacrifice some ram speed.


I'm playing with some secondary ram timings right now. For some reason I can't set tcwl equal to cas or cas-1. I can only set it to 10 or 12 but not 13 or 14.
(My Cas is 14). Which would you use? And any thoughts on why i can't follow the tcwl rule? I was using 10 before, now stability testing on 12.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Who said anything about stability testing? That was max temp testing. I've noticed that max temps are seen within 10 mins. For example, i I run it for 2 hours, the max temp never exceeds the temp reached at the 10 min mark. 10 mins of Aida64 is plenty enough to heatsoak the rads/vrms/board etc.


p95 small ftt will give you way higher temps and a much more realistic load depending on your usage. If you are just gaming then aida64 is fine, but if you intend to use threadripper the way it was meant to be used (content creation, research calculation, etc) then you will want to use p95. You will probably notice temp differences between the ek block and xspc block if you pushed the cpu to the limits the way p95 does.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Who said anything about stability testing? That was max temp testing. I've noticed that max temps are seen within 10 mins. For example, i I run it for 2 hours, the max temp never exceeds the temp reached at the 10 min mark. 10 mins of Aida64 is plenty enough to heatsoak the rads/vrms/board etc.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> prime 95 small will give u more heat in 3 mins then what aida64 will give you in 10. I hope you arent going off the aida temp either cuz thats socket temp it's reading on the latest version not tdie.


Yes, prime95 gives 3c higher temps than Aida64, but I don't like Prime95 due to it's tendency to lock the system rather "soft" crashing like Aida64.

Regardless, it doesn't matter if using Aida64 or Prime95 for the purposes of testing the potential capability of a block to remove heat, as long as the testing methodology is consistent between blocks.

And lol at "using threadripper the way it's meant to be used". How about full workflow Premier Pro and After Effects coupled with 3DSMax modelling for import into Unreal 4 and Unity? I rarely game on it, except for testing the games I create. My stabiilty testing isn't with synthetic apps, it's with 3 hr 3DSMax renders and 5 hour PremierExports


----------



## chew*

Which board are you on happy?

I know my asrock hates odd twcl but if cl14 it can set twcl14.

Generally speaking avoid odds.

My board also hates geardown disabled.

An optimal twcl would be like c15 Cl with Twcl 14 but...that would be great with 3333 or better which on our DR setups 3200 is like asking alot already.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Yes, prime95 gives 3c higher temps than Aida64, but I don't like Prime95 due to it's tendency to lock the system rather "soft" crashing like Aida64.
> 
> Regardless, it doesn't matter if using Aida64 or Prime95 for the purposes of testing the potential capability of a block to remove heat, as long as the testing methodology is consistent between blocks.
> 
> And lol at "using threadripper the way it's meant to be used". How about full workflow Premier Pro and After Effects coupled with 3DSMax modelling for import into Unreal 4 and Unity? I rarely game on it, except for testing the games I create. My stabiilty testing isn't with synthetic apps, it's with 3 hr 3DSMax renders and 5 hour PremierExports


Premier pro and 3dsmax hardly scale efficiently with high core count. Those are not going to be proof of 100% of stability or high peak temps. If the 2 blocks perform the same to you then you havent pushed the cpu to max clock with safe voltages. If i ran the two blocks on a low oc or stock I wouldn't see much a difference either. I never even noticed I'd throttle on the EK block until I started testing with Prime 95.


----------



## chew*

I had to go 3 deep stability test wise to dial this rig in for the app its running.

Hci prime aida.

Now its a crashless 24/7 champ.

Im just trying to extract more clocks from it now via cooling without performance robbing throttle.

If i can get it to 3950 with temp headroom gonna call it done. 3950 all core is roughly equal to the single core sporadic boost in most apps.

Mt is up way up but ST is still trailing stock just a tad.

When aegis photoscan pro or whatever its called builds mesh it slaughters random single cores and ramps up the ram usage to well over 64gb...

This is this cpus weakness so I need to compensate for it.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Premier pro and 3dsmax hardly scale efficiently with high core count. Those are not going to be proof of 100% of stability or high peak temps. If the 2 blocks perform the same to you then you havent pushed the cpu to max clock with safe voltages. If i ran the two blocks on a low oc or stock I wouldn't see much a difference either. I never even noticed I'd throttle on the EK block until I started testing with Prime 95.


Scales really well when you export from Premier, After Effects and render output in 3DSMax all at the same time ;-) That workload generates the same heat as Prime95 small fft's.

FYI, I can pass Prime95 for 8 hrs @ 4.1ghz / 1.4v but 3DSMax, Premier and Blender all fail on big renders.

As I said, I don't use synthetics to test stability, I use the machine for how it's going to be used and dial in the required stability for that.

This discussion is still superfluous to my original statement that there is no performance difference between the XSPC and EK block.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Yes, prime95 gives 3c higher temps than Aida64, but I don't like Prime95 due to it's tendency to lock the system rather "soft" crashing like Aida64.
> 
> Regardless, it doesn't matter if using Aida64 or Prime95 for the purposes of testing the potential capability of a block to remove heat, as long as the testing methodology is consistent between blocks.
> 
> And lol at "using threadripper the way it's meant to be used". How about full workflow Premier Pro and After Effects coupled with 3DSMax modelling for import into Unreal 4 and Unity? I rarely game on it, except for testing the games I create. My stabiilty testing isn't with synthetic apps, it's with 3 hr 3DSMax renders and 5 hour PremierExports


You are basically claiming that both blocks perform identically without pushing them to their thermal limit. It's like saying a prius and a lamborghini can both reach 70mph.

I too don't notice a much of a difference between my old kraken x62 and my new liqtech tr-4 when using aida64. The difference becomes much more prevalent (10c diference) in p95.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Which board are you on happy?
> 
> I know my asrock hates odd twcl but if cl14 it can set twcl14.
> 
> Generally speaking avoid odds.
> 
> My board also hates geardown disabled.
> 
> An optimal twcl would be like c15 Cl with Twcl 14 but...that would be great with 3333 or better which on our DR setups 3200 is like asking alot already.


I'm on a gigabyte aorus. So, do you recommend I run tcwl 10 or 12? I can't run 14, board won't post. My tcas is 14.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I too don't notice a much of a difference between my old kraken x62 and my new liqtech tr-4 when using aida64. The difference becomes much more prevalent (10c diference) in p95.


I don't see a 10c difference between Aida64 and Prime95 small FFT's - 3c is the most I've seen.

If you're seeing 10c difference between them, then I'd suggest it's your block that has issues.

There was a bigger difference between the two when Haswell was around, but not now with Ryzen and avx offests on Intel.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> I don't see a 10c difference between Aida64 and Prime95 small FFT's - 3c is the most I've seen.


Well you are comparing 2 custom water cooling blocks, I was comparing an asetec 240mm that didn't cover the entire IHS vs the liqtech tr-4


----------



## twitchyzero

those with Liqtech cooler
is the Enermax LED logo flickering for you guys? My one week old 360 has that problem thinking only 1 of the EPV 8-pin was disconnected but I temps are fine...plugged in both 8-pin and still have the problem. How's their customer support?


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> You are basically claiming that both blocks perform identically without pushing them to their thermal limit. It's like saying a prius and a lamborghini can both reach 70mph.
> 
> I too don't notice a much of a difference between my old kraken x62 and my new liqtech tr-4 when using aida64. The difference becomes much more prevalent (10c diference) in p95.


While I agree with you, let's take it easy on him. We're all gathering these learnings together.

I'm running the EK block right now with high temps (and 1000 mm of rad space) on my 1920X and getting very high temps on a 4.1ghz OC @ 1.35v. I've just ordered the XSPC block and will add my numbers into the mix once I get a chance to test it. Pretty certain the EK block is my bottleneck but excited to find out for sure.


----------



## happyluckbox

*LIQTECH TR-4 PERFORMANCE AT 4.0GHZ UPDATE*

All right, I had to settle for 4.0ghz because 4.025 was requiring 1.4v to get stable.
Here are my new updated temps using the latest version of p95 with ryzen FFTs. Also, utilizing more base voltage and less LLC. My bios settings are 1.293v and normal (level 1) llc.

My temps fell by about 5c, and my maximum stable overclock jumped from 3.95ghz to 4.0ghz! So happy with my chip, guess it wasn't a dud afterall!

Cooling: liqtech tr-4 aio.

Right click on image to open new tab, and left click to magnify.



My old overclock was 73c peak, at 1.38v peak @ 3.95ghz.

My new overclock is 66c peak, at 1.38v peak, @ 4.0ghz.

Also, my voltage regulator temps fell by 14c from 94c to 80c. Something was very wrong with that old version of p95 I was using.

This is the actual performance of the liqtech tr-4. I find it to be simply amazing. Basically on par with the best custom cooling solutions out there imo.


----------



## jugs

A few questions to those of you with the Asrock X399 Taichi and Linux, have you guys got any sensors working? The it87 module doesn't seem to find any devices?

Regarding pstate OC, in the BIOS it is all greyed out and unselectable, how can I enable pstate OC? Thanks.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> those with Liqtech cooler
> is the Enermax LED logo flickering for you guys? My one week old 360 has that problem thinking only 1 of the EPV 8-pin was disconnected but I temps are fine...plugged in both 8-pin and still have the problem. How's their customer support?


I've found the enermax light to show pump speed. The faster the pump is running the more luminous the led. Your pump could be experiencing issues too.

Their customer support is fantastic, one of my fans was beginning to make some noise, I contacted them and they are shipping me a brand new fan. Took only 1 day! Make sure to contact them via their usa/canada site, if you are in the us/canada.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jugs*
> 
> A few questions to those of you with the Asrock X399 Taichi and Linux, have you guys got any sensors working? The it87 module doesn't seem to find any devices?
> 
> Regarding pstate OC, in the BIOS it is all greyed out and unselectable, how can I enable pstate OC? Thanks.


Iirc avanced/cbs/customized.


----------



## jugs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Iirc avanced/cbs/customized.


Yeah that's the menu

Advanced\AMD CBS\Zen Common OPtions\Custom Pstates\Accept

All the custom Pstates are greyed out and unchangable.

Oh I think I got it, need to set OC Mode to "Customized." Thank you!


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jugs*
> 
> Yeah that's the menu
> 
> Advanced\AMD CBS\Zen Common OPtions\Custom Pstates\Accept
> 
> All the custom Pstates are greyed out and unchangable.
> 
> Oh I think I got it, need to set OC Mode to "Customized." Thank you!






yes I found that out set customized. and away you go
I only do pstate 0 and only change the speed use offset in advanced menu to adjust the voltage.

do that run balanced power in windows or whatever linux uses and it will run perfectly.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> I've run both the X399 EK block and the XSPC block - no difference in temps between them.
> 
> The cold plate on both blocks cover the entire heat spreader.






as of right this second I am agreeing with you I ahd the eeeeeeek block and now the xspc and so far little to no difference BUT I seem to have gotten the mother of all micro air bubbles..I did the eeeek block 3 times got rid of any air in an hour or so not having to do much.
so far I have spent nearly a day trying to bleed this bastard and only just getting there.

now if I set the pump to 1234 rpm nice and clear and loses around 5 degrees even at full whack but nice and clear as soon as I go full spec 4455rpm boom bubbles the wonder bastard BUT temps drop 5 degrees.

now I am basing my same as the eeeek block on these figures so in reality it should be 5 to 10 degrees cooler than the other block.

so yeah any tips on getting rid of them apart from shaking moving cycling pump praying and killing goats...I,m out of goats.

so in conclusion I genuinely have no problem with the eeeeeeek block on my current setup with current settings but as the other guy said ngtr whatever if you go above 1.3 to say 1.4 then the story would be a lot different. ( I have not bothered with that yet and won't till this is cleared up.

I will say though it is very nicely built easy to install and looks damn good with the red leds







go red team









now as for AIO I will say it again my h115i was a very nice setup with varder fans and if you were running stock you would have no issues BUT you would not get the same boost/lower power draw as you would with say the enermax with the full cover or a custom loop.

I have found more performance with the same settings using better gear it is as simple as that.

the h115i at stock would boost 4.05/4.1 but go up to and a little over 1.5 volts to do it
with the custom loop either block really it would only use 1.45 maximum and boost to 4.15 and close to 4.2


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jugs*
> 
> Yeah that's the menu
> 
> Advanced\AMD CBS\Zen Common OPtions\Custom Pstates\Accept
> 
> All the custom Pstates are greyed out and unchangable.
> 
> Oh I think I got it, need to set OC Mode to "Customized." Thank you!


Yep you got it it.

Np glad i could help.


----------



## ITAngel

Is that Enermax Cooler better than the predators 360? If you have the EVO TR4 cooler?


----------



## tarot

ok update...got rid of most if not all the bubbles (still have the lingering feeling there are a few left)
but there's the updated results and I will admit the xspc baked beans and spaghetti block is quite a bit better than the EK block if you are pushing more load or heat or volts into it. My other results are in another post for reference all tests done with exactly the same settings including fan settings.
with the exception that in the new ones the fans are more likely to ramp up when it hits 60 so a couple of hundred rpm more.
this is done with a ek 420 CE radiator a EK-XRES 140 DDC 3.2 PWM Elite running full tilt 4500rpm and 3 3k Vardar fans running between 1200 and 1500 (at 1500 1 metre away the Db is 42 and at 1200 38)
also note I have another rad stacked on top with 2 fans pulling through that one to a 280 for video card so weird setup







as well as of course 2 pumps sitting on top so not the best setup for airflow.

also also note I have redone these tests quite a few times including gooseberry with the same results not much deviation at all.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## chew*

So my lap job for the bykski is on hold for the moment.

My lapping station ( wifes glass top kitchen table ) is erm off limits at least while she is home.

Need to verify her work schedule


----------



## tarot

tried 4.1 at 1.35 ish volts and all worked fine passed tests etc but in super hard loads got a tad warm at 71 degrees and 1.325 was fien but all the hard loads so drawing board a we go









still cruisin at 4g though might try dropping the volts a teeny bit there and see how I go.

I have to say gooseberry is a hard task master 4.1 lower volts passed everything except that locked up a third into it.

nice to be closer to the top in corona 1.3 though


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> tried 4.1 at 1.35 ish volts and all worked fine passed tests etc but in super hard loads got a tad warm at 71 degrees and 1.325 was fien but all the hard loads so drawing board a we go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> still cruisin at 4g though might try dropping the volts a teeny bit there and see how I go.
> 
> I have to say gooseberry is a hard task master 4.1 lower volts passed everything except that locked up a third into it.
> 
> nice to be closer to the top in corona 1.3 though


Bugger I can't do 4.1 on my current cooler


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Bugger I can't do 4.1 on my current cooler


here you go a few results.
some are 1.35v some are 1.325 I think..houdl be in the shot 1.35 passed everything but heat for me was an issue


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> here you go a few results.
> some are 1.35v some are 1.325 I think..houdl be in the shot 1.35 passed everything but heat for me was an issue
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


See, this kinda confirms my testing, you get a max of 68.3c Cinenbench @ 4.1ghz - 1.35v on the XSPC block and I get 69.4c at the same settings but with only a 3x120mm rad plus a 2x80mm (so 5% less total rad area).


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> See, this kinda confirms my testing, you get a max of 68.3c Cinenbench @ 4.1ghz - 1.35v on the XSPC block and I get 69.4c at the same settings but with only a 3x120mm rad plus a 2x80mm (so 5% less total rad area).






also forgot to mention that was the fourth cinebench run in a row so I heated it up first so for a real test run it four times straight after and take the last setting.
I'm not sure what the 2x80's mean though.

also is yours 3 120 mm rads in line so one then another then another? isn't that going to cool differently that one 420?
so not a real apples to apples comparison but I get your point.

try gooseberry and see what you get that will bring on the heat a lot more than cinebench does.

I didn't do a goose run but I will tomorrow.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Hey guys,

Out of interest what are you setting your SOC Voltage to for 4Ghz/4.1 ? Also, is disabling Overclocking Enhancement in the BIOS a good idea ? I feel full manual is the bette rway to go.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> also forgot to mention that was the fourth cinebench run in a row so I heated it up first so for a real test run it four times straight after and take the last setting.
> I'm not sure what the 2x80's mean though.
> 
> also is yours 3 120 mm rads in line so one then another then another? isn't that going to cool differently that one 420?
> so not a real apples to apples comparison but I get your point.
> 
> try gooseberry and see what you get that will bring on the heat a lot more than cinebench does.
> 
> I didn't do a goose run but I will tomorrow.


Yeah, that temp was the max of 5 runs.

Gooseberry run - max temp 67.5c:-










If you're getting high temps in Gooseberry you might be suffering from heat soak or saturating your loops cooling potential - what's your water temp?


----------



## amigafan2003

To add:

My rad setup is 240mm > 120mm > 160mm. 160mm rad is a double 80mm. A double 80mm rad has 12.5% less cooling area than a single 120mm rad.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Yeah, that temp was the max of 5 runs.
> 
> Gooseberry run - max temp 67.5c:-
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you're getting high temps in Gooseberry you might be suffering from heat soak or saturating your loops cooling potential - what's your water temp?






cool
here's mine this morning.
as for water temp I have no sensor for that but by grabbing a tube







not that hot and checking the pump res also not hot.

so your rads are bout the same size but in sequence...therefore cooling differently than a single rad (at least that's what we did with rads and oil coolers on bikes a larger primamry then a secondary to suck more heat out cooled better than a massive rad.





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> Out of interest what are you setting your SOC Voltage to for 4Ghz/4.1 ? Also, is disabling Overclocking Enhancement in the BIOS a good idea ? I feel full manual is the bette rway to go.






my soc is stock







I also do not touch any of the other things with pstates (even though running high performance sort of cancels that crap out







) and never had an issue or a difference in the amount I could overclock. That was a bit different with my ryzen 1800x and ASUS baymax but that's a totally different board with different quirks.

I will have to check the actual voltage as this version of hwinfo is not listing the heading.

so after all that I decided to stick to 4025 at 1.3 llc3
gives the best temps and performance balance for me...for now..


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> Out of interest what are you setting your SOC Voltage to for 4Ghz/4.1 ? Also, is disabling Overclocking Enhancement in the BIOS a good idea ? I feel full manual is the bette rway to go.


I always turn off OC enhancement settings. They usually equate to hidden voltage somewhere. I'm on a 1920X, so I might be having an easier time of things than on a 1950X, but here's what I'm running.

I'm at 4.075 with RAM at 3466 (SR B Die). DDR and vtddr bumped up + .005V CPU at 1.275. LLC level 3. So far prime stable, and stable while beating on 4 GPUs. I can't crack 4.1 without more core voltage, haven't tried yet.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crion*
> 
> 
> 
> Octa slot Memory showed up!
> 
> G.Skill F4-4200C19Q2-64GTZSW
> 19-19-19-39
> 
> Hoping to get some nice timings from these ones.


I'm not sure what timings you are expecting, but the memory Fabric on Ryzen is the limiting factor to memory clocks, not memory speed or timings. Beyond 3200mhz, any faster memory will not give you ANYTHING.

I know the looks of one of those GSkill 128GB kits, as well as their price. All I can say is I hope you can later use them in something where they can perform to specs. X399 memory limits are the architecture, not the memory.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I did real water cooling years ago. It's not for everybody and alot of people sometimes simply prefer the simplicity and plug and p lay of an AIO. Liqtech delivers on that front.
> 
> Btw, it turns out my chip was not such a dud afterall, this whole time I was over using LLC to overclock my chip. On top of that, I was using the freaking OUTDATED version of p95, which was running SIGNIFICANTLY HOTTER than the updated version now that supports ryzen fft. Since downloading the new p95, and using base vcore to overclock, I've been able to get far lower temperatures, with much more stable high overclocks.
> 
> Before I was struggling to maintain 3.95ghz at 1.39vcore, and temps were running into 72-73c range.
> Now I'm hitting 4.025ghz, at 1.38vcore, and temps are at 67-68c. I may even shoot for 4.05ghz.
> 
> Once I figure out my final overclock, I'll post a new p95 blend 1 hour test run on the liqtech tr-4, with temps/voltage/etc


I also have the Liqtech TR4 - 360, and it does an amazing job, over and above all the other AIOs (see recent Gamers Nexus comparison). I really don't think one can make this definitive line in the sand where any sort of stable long-term OC to 4.0ghz on TR must absolutely, 100% always involve a custom water loop. In fact, that would be an awfully circumstantial result, don't you think? That the major cutoff of 4.0 stable just happens to be the threshold of pure custom water cooling?

Right now, I'm 4.0 stable with the Liqtech TR4 360, set on intake with three exhausts out of a Corsair 570x case. No problems with any benches, even the dreaded Prime95 Small FFT.

However, I did complicate this situation when I added a second 1080 Ti. Temps are a few degrees higher, and when pressed (deep learning routines in Linux) it disrupts the airflow on the inside. Might that mess up the Prime95 results? Eh, possibly. But the TR4 is definitely one of the winning cooling solutions for TR, and yes, even though its one on those AIO's that the plebes use.


----------



## BLOWNCO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> I also have the Liqtech TR4 - 360, and it does an amazing job, over and above all the other AIOs (see recent Gamers Nexus comparison). I really don't think one can make this definitive line in the sand where any sort of stable long-term OC to 4.0ghz on TR must absolutely, 100% always involve a custom water loop. In fact, that would be an awfully circumstantial result, don't you think? That the major cutoff of 4.0 stable just happens to be the threshold of pure custom water cooling?
> 
> Right now, I'm 4.0 stable with the Liqtech TR4 360, set on intake with three exhausts out of a Corsair 570x case. No problems with any benches, even the dreaded Prime95 Small FFT.
> 
> However, I did complicate this situation when I added a second 1080 Ti. Temps are a few degrees higher, and when pressed (deep learning routines in Linux) it disrupts the airflow on the inside. Might that mess up the Prime95 results? Eh, possibly. But the TR4 is definitely one of the winning cooling solutions for TR, and yes, even though its one on those AIO's that the plebes use.


What temps are you seeing?


----------



## Hydroplane

The entire Threadripper lineup is on sale at Newegg right now:

1900X $500
1920X $750
1950X $880


----------



## awaybreaktoday

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hydroplane*
> 
> The entire Threadripper lineup is on sale at Newegg right now:
> 
> 1900X $500
> 1920X $750
> 1950X $880


Wait for threadripper black friday deals....


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *awaybreaktoday*
> 
> Wait for threadripper black friday deals....


Not sure if I'm that patient lol
Looks like prices were cut on the whole Ryzen lineup too

I wonder if the 8700K and 7980XE will still be out of stock by Black Friday... lol


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hydroplane*
> 
> Not sure if I'm that patient lol
> Looks like prices were cut on the whole Ryzen lineup too
> 
> I wonder if the 8700K and 7980XE will still be out of stock by Black Friday... lol


THIS. I've been raging for a week. Seriously, 7980XE out of stock... as if anyone really needs that part. Er, uh, except me of course.









Actually, on a more serious note, it got me to thinking the other day, how useful are all the Youtube tech guys, in terms of reality? At least with Coffee Lake, we saw about 3000 previews, reviews, overviews, underviews, comparisons, etc., of chips and motherboards that NO ONE could feasibly purchase. Even Amazon's pre-orders were cancelled. At some point, the tech guys are serving no purpose.

Now mind you, prices going down on Threadripper make it tempting to buy another one, slap it on another Zenith Extreme, split up the 128gb, and connect the 10G network card as an interlink for some distributed rendering / coding.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BLOWNCO*
> 
> What temps are you seeing?


I was at 71, if memory serves. Taking the front glass off the 570X brought it down a few degrees. That was mounting the Liqtech up front, and using the blinky RGB fans all for exhaust. One 1080ti did okay in that case torture testing for hours, but a Vega FE liquid-cooled gave off enough heat after install that I knew it would be trouble. Jesus those things are frying pans.

I now have the SLI 1080 ti setup in a jerry-rigged Caselabs SMA8. Interestingly, had to replace the power supply. A Corsair R1000X wasn't even turning on, even after I bought it flowers and dinner. Drop in an EVGA 1600 Ti, which is certainly overkill on this thing, and yay. The plan was to kit out the storage and cooling on the system in a Caselabs THW10, but I fear that ungodly wait everyone is complaining about. I broke down and bought the Thermaltake WP200 clone. Yeah, its not Caselabs, and has some things I don't want, but its here now when I need it.


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> THIS. I've been raging for a week. Seriously, 7980XE out of stock... as if anyone really needs that part. Er, uh, except me of course.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, on a more serious note, it got me to thinking the other day, how useful are all the Youtube tech guys, in terms of reality? At least with Coffee Lake, we saw about 3000 previews, reviews, overviews, underviews, comparisons, etc., of chips and motherboards that NO ONE could feasibly purchase. Even Amazon's pre-orders were cancelled. At some point, the tech guys are serving no purpose.
> 
> Now mind you, prices going down on Threadripper make it tempting to buy another one, slap it on another Zenith Extreme, split up the 128gb, and connect the 10G network card as an interlink for some distributed rendering / coding.


I agree. Wouldn't say it upsets me much, but if Intel can't be bothered to make enough chips, I guess they do not want my business. For now, I'm going to set up my case/watercooling and buy the cpu+mobo last. Might take a couple weeks, so we'll see. I want the best and don't mind paying for it... but the 1950X is the best chip that *anyone can actually buy right now.* Plus it isn't held together with bird crap lol


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> I was at 71, if memory serves. Taking the front glass off the 570X brought it down a few degrees. That was mounting the Liqtech up front, and using the blinky RGB fans all for exhaust. One 1080ti did okay in that case torture testing for hours, but a Vega FE liquid-cooled gave off enough heat after install that I knew it would be trouble. Jesus those things are frying pans.
> 
> I now have the SLI 1080 ti setup in a jerry-rigged Caselabs SMA8. Interestingly, had to replace the power supply. A Corsair R1000X wasn't even turning on, even after I bought it flowers and dinner. Drop in an EVGA 1600 Ti, which is certainly overkill on this thing, and yay. The plan was to kit out the storage and cooling on the system in a Caselabs THW10, but I fear that ungodly wait everyone is complaining about. I broke down and bought the Thermaltake WP200 clone. Yeah, its not Caselabs, and has some things I don't want, but its here now when I need it.


What is an EVGA 1600 Ti? Is that a GPU or a PSU?


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hydroplane*
> 
> What is an EVGA 1600 Ti? Is that a GPU or a PSU?


Haha, it does look like that, doesn't it! I meant Titanium rating.









Its this:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAD6H5ED0800&ignorebbr=1


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> Haha, it does look like that, doesn't it! I meant Titanium rating.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its this:
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAD6H5ED0800&ignorebbr=1


I really like the 1600 T2, without 3-4 way GPU configurations there's no real point in one, but it's just cool. 1080ti SLI with an overclocked 7980XE would still probably only need 1000W-1200W.

$531 though, that is a ripoff price, it was $440 on Ebay the other day.

Newegg has a promo code for the 1900X so now it's down to $480. Free shipping, no sales tax! Very tempting. Still $90 more than I can get the 1800X for, though. And $180 more than a 1700 which when overclocked would perform pretty much the same, maybe down 100-200 MHz.


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hydroplane*
> 
> I really like the 1600 T2, without 3-4 way GPU configurations there's no real point in one, but it's just cool. 1080ti SLI with an overclocked 7980XE would still probably only need 1000W-1200W.
> 
> $531 though, that is a ripoff price, it was $440 on Ebay the other day.
> 
> Newegg has a promo code for the 1900X so now it's down to $480. Free shipping, no sales tax! Very tempting. Still $90 more than I can get the 1800X for, though. And $180 more than a 1700 which when overclocked would perform pretty much the same, maybe down 100-200 MHz.


I believe the stepping favors the 1800X, but the real differences you'll see are going to be from the PCI lanes and what you do with them. The 1900x would let you throw a few GPU's, NVME RAID, etc. into the mix. If you think that's in your future, it may be worth the extra up front for the chip and the hefty premium for the motherboard.

My wheels are still turning on this dual threadripper idea. That's dangerous.


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hydroplane*
> 
> I really like the 1600 T2, without 3-4 way GPU configurations there's no real point in one, but it's just cool. 1080ti SLI with an overclocked 7980XE would still probably only need 1000W-1200W.
> 
> $531 though, that is a ripoff price, it was $440 on Ebay the other day.
> 
> Newegg has a promo code for the 1900X so now it's down to $480. Free shipping, no sales tax! Very tempting. Still $90 more than I can get the 1800X for, though. And $180 more than a 1700 which when overclocked would perform pretty much the same, maybe down 100-200 MHz.


My system with 7980xe @ 4700mhz and 2x1080ti is drawing ~900w fom the wall in BF 1 multiplayer. 3440x1440 ultra.


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> I believe the stepping favors the 1800X, but the real differences you'll see are going to be from the PCI lanes and what you do with them. The 1900x would let you throw a few GPU's, NVME RAID, etc. into the mix. If you think that's in your future, it may be worth the extra up front for the chip and the hefty premium for the motherboard.
> 
> My wheels are still turning on this dual threadripper idea. That's dangerous.


I could run 1080ti SLI x16/x16 plus two NVMe drives at x4/x4, one for Windows 10, the other for Linux, on Threadripper. With Ryzen I'd be limited to x8/x8 and I think one SSD, so it's something to consider.


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> My system with 7980xe @ 4700mhz and 2x1080ti is drawing ~900w fom the wall in BF 1 multiplayer. 3440x1440 ultra.


Do you have an overclock on those 1080 TIs? Sounds like a 1200W would be a good idea.

I see you also have a Little Devil case, very cool. Literally just ordered an all white PC-V7 a few minutes ago. $260 from FrozenCPU


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> While I agree with you, let's take it easy on him. We're all gathering these learnings together.
> 
> I'm running the EK block right now with high temps (and 1000 mm of rad space) on my 1920X and getting very high temps on a 4.1ghz OC @ 1.35v. I've just ordered the XSPC block and will add my numbers into the mix once I get a chance to test it. Pretty certain the EK block is my bottleneck but excited to find out for sure.


I swapped out my EK water block for the XSPC and...disappointing. My temps are much higher at the moment. With the EK block I hit around 72-74 max in Small FFTs. WIth the new block I'm quickly over 80. I'm still bleeding some small bubbles out, but I suspect I'm at 95% of the performance I'm going to get. Any input on how much improvement I might see from bleeding for a while or should I assume I mounted / applied TIM wrong?


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I swapped out my EK water block for the XSPC and...disappointing. My temps are much higher at the moment. With the EK block I hit around 72-74 max in Small FFTs. WIth the new block I'm quickly over 80. I'm still bleeding some small bubbles out, but I suspect I'm at 95% of the performance I'm going to get. Any input on how much improvement I might see from bleeding for a while or should I assume I mounted / applied TIM wrong?


Idle temps are higher too. They were 26-28 degrees with the EK block and 31-32 degrees now with the XSPC.

For TIM, I used the credit card spread plus blob in the middle suggested by the XSPC instructions.


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hydroplane*
> 
> Do you have an overclock on those 1080 TIs? Sounds like a 1200W would be a good idea.
> 
> I see you also have a Little Devil case, very cool. Literally just ordered an all white PC-V7 a few minutes ago. $260 from FrozenCPU


stock gpu


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I swapped out my EK water block for the XSPC and...disappointing. My temps are much higher at the moment. With the EK block I hit around 72-74 max in Small FFTs. WIth the new block I'm quickly over 80. I'm still bleeding some small bubbles out, but I suspect I'm at 95% of the performance I'm going to get. Any input on how much improvement I might see from bleeding for a while or should I assume I mounted / applied TIM wrong?


Thanks for posting this. I was one of the folks waiting with an EK block in hand, ready to return it for XSPC. I'm actually hoping things improve for you, and I'll have a reason to exchange it.









Until then, I'm still rolling along on Enermax 360, as a small stack of brand new and unused expensive water cooling equipment grows.


----------



## GosuPl

Hello. I have X399 Zenith + TR 1950X, and tested few days. SLI on this CPU is crap, on 1440p i have almost 100% weaker performance than on main 6950X biuld with 2x TXP, and second 7900X biuld with 2x TXP.

[email protected] + 3.5 uncore + mem 3200 CL15.15.15 T1
[email protected] + 3.3 mesh + mem 3600 Cl15.15.15 T1
TR [email protected] + mem 3472 CL15.15.15 T1

And 2x TITAN X [email protected]/11000 LC

I trying everything, NUMA/UMA, disabled/enabled PCI-E etc.
I have newest bios, and drivers. And still, ony not bad (still no decent) SLI scalling in 4k. 1440p works worse than single GPU...Almost on every game, every time.

But for be honest, TR 1950X is few Ryzens in single IHS, so...This should "work" like this ? Any suggestions?


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> Hello. I have X399 Zenith + TR 1950X, and tested few days. SLI on this CPU is crap, on 1440p i have almost 100% weaker performance than on main 6950X biuld with 2x TXP, and second 7900X biuld with 2x TXP.
> 
> [email protected] + 3.5 uncore + mem 3200 CL15.15.15 T1
> [email protected] + 3.3 mesh + mem 3600 Cl15.15.15 T1
> TR [email protected] + mem 3472 CL15.15.15 T1
> 
> And 2x TITAN X [email protected]/11000 LC
> 
> I trying everything, NUMA/UMA, disabled/enabled PCI-E etc.
> I have newest bios, and drivers. And still, ony not bad (still no decent) SLI scalling in 4k. 1440p works worse than single GPU...Almost on every game, every time.
> 
> But for be honest, TR 1950X is few Ryzens in single IHS, so...This should "work" like this ? Any suggestions?


My first suggestion is to investigate based on your last comment. What are people getting with that config on Ryzen? Otherwise, the poor performance you are seeing could be platform related, and not isolated to the CPU.

I have SLI on Zenith 1950x, but 1080 ti, not titans. Is 3472 your memory speed?


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> Thanks for posting this. I was one of the folks waiting with an EK block in hand, ready to return it for XSPC. I'm actually hoping things improve for you, and I'll have a reason to exchange it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Until then, I'm still rolling along on Enermax 360, as a small stack of brand new and unused expensive water cooling equipment grows.


I've just remounted with the five points method. Slightly better temps in Small FFTs but still slightly worse than the EK block.


----------



## GosuPl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> My first suggestion is to investigate based on your last comment. What are people getting with that config on Ryzen? Otherwise, the poor performance you are seeing could be platform related, and not isolated to the CPU.
> 
> I have SLI on Zenith 1950x, but 1080 ti, not titans.


Can you run 3D mark and share score?

I make compare for my TR biuld and my 6950X/7900X + former 5930K biuld.

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13920234/fs/12544339/fs/13792726/fs/13730509

Something is wrong, or just this CPU have HUGEEE bottlenekcs, i think is it. Good CPU for work, but very poor for SLI cofigs and gaming.

GPU test one, 100 fps below compare to Intels CPU's


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> Can you run 3D mark and share score?
> 
> I make compare for my TR biuld and my 6950X/7900X + former 5930K biuld.
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13920234/fs/12544339/fs/13792726/fs/13730509
> 
> Something is wrong, or just this CPU have HUGEEE bottlenekcs, i think is it. Good CPU for work, but very poor for SLI cofigs and gaming.
> 
> GPU test one, 100 fps below compare to Intels CPU's


Sure, will post in a bit. In the midst of RAID benches.


----------



## GosuPl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> Sure, will post in a bit. In the midst of RAID benches.


Thx


----------



## Flaxen Hegemony

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> Thx


lol, I got 18887 on Firestrike. Thats at stock 3.4ghz on TR, but OC shouldn't do much. I use this rig mainly as a workstation, but if I'm reading online benches correctly, 18887 for SLI 1080 ti is bloody AWFUL.

Ah well, something to play with later.

EDIT: Apparently, that's WORSE THAN ONE?!!?


----------



## BLOWNCO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hydroplane*
> 
> The entire Threadripper lineup is on sale at Newegg right now:
> 
> 1900X $500
> 1920X $750
> 1950X $880


damn i just bought a 1950x like 2 weeks ago


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Flaxen Hegemony*
> 
> lol, I got 18887 on Firestrike. Thats at stock 3.4ghz on TR, but OC shouldn't do much. I use this rig mainly as a workstation, but if I'm reading online benches correctly, 18887 for SLI 1080 ti is bloody AWFUL.
> 
> Ah well, something to play with later.
> 
> EDIT: Apparently, that's WORSE THAN ONE?!!?


It is worse than one - that's 980ti level - I get 25576 with one 1080ti.

https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512359

Have you installed the AMD Crimson ReLive drivers?


----------



## GosuPl

TR Have problems with SLI, so even in games on 1440p SLI works worse than single GPU. On 6950X i have great scalling.

On TR 1950X, SLI scalling it decent (still not good) on 4k and above only. This CPU have poor IPC and it just "glued" Ryzens ;-)


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> It is worse than one - that's 980ti level - I get 25576 with one 1080ti.
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/fs/13512359
> 
> Have you installed the AMD Crimson ReLive drivers?


Yup, i'm at 23557 with a 1900x, I've not tried SLI yet, will do soon.


----------



## GosuPl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheScarecow*


https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13704641/fs/13792726

Ok, same CPU bottleneck like on my setup with TR

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13704641/fs/13792726

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13792726/fs/13918846

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13918846/fs/13704641

Above 100 fps worse GPU test compared 6950X vs TR 1950X

Thx for sharing your score. So, TR just perform like this









I sell this platform and upgrade X99 ASUS Rampage Edition 10 + 6950X on X299 ASUS Rampage VI Extreme + i9 7960X soon. SLI performance and GPU scalling is very important to me. TR 1950X is great CPU for video editing etc. But unfortunnaly poor for gaming and SLI.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13704641/fs/13792726
> 
> Ok, same CPU bottleneck like on my setup with TR
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13704641/fs/13792726
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13792726/fs/13918846
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/13918846/fs/13704641
> 
> Above 100 fps worse GPU test compared 6950X vs TR 1950X
> 
> Thx for sharing your score. So, TR just perform like this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sell this platform and upgrade X99 ASUS Rampage Edition 10 + 6950X on X299 ASUS Rampage VI Extreme + i9 7960X soon. SLI performance and GPU scalling is very important to me. TR 1950X is great CPU for video editing etc. But unfortunnaly poor for gaming and SLI.






yep at lower res with older games all the amds get a bit of a caning BUT they are not pathetic like in days of yore...well a few months ago









and then there is updated games

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/2555506/spy/2525508
where the threadripper actually beats it in graphics score but of course not cpu score...and that's a 2k chip overclocked

so yeah swings and roundabouts.
I have zero idea why in the older lower res benches the scaling is so crap what makes that score funny is he is using a an enermax aio to grab 4222 on that threadripper...I,m dying to see what temps that was or the volts he needed


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I swapped out my EK water block for the XSPC and...disappointing. My temps are much higher at the moment. With the EK block I hit around 72-74 max in Small FFTs. WIth the new block I'm quickly over 80. I'm still bleeding some small bubbles out, but I suspect I'm at 95% of the performance I'm going to get. Any input on how much improvement I might see from bleeding for a while or should I assume I mounted / applied TIM wrong?


dude...what cabin are you in we are in the same boat







well not exactly my temps are no where near as bad as yours BUT I am still trying to get rid of the bubbles...it has to be the block churning it up as I never had the issue with the EEEEK block.

to give you an idea this is after I THOUGHT I had it bled but the bubbles returned...hasn't affected it to much but still not as good as it could be.
oh that's at 4 gig by the way with 1.3 v I,ll run it again today and see how much it changed at 4.1 1.35 I was getting I think 72

also forgot I did the credit card swipe and dot BUT I am using kryonaut BUT I ran out so it is the worse paste job ever splotches everywhere so I do not think application is the biggest issue.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> TR Have problems with SLI, so even in games on 1440p SLI works worse than single GPU. On 6950X i have great scalling.
> 
> On TR 1950X, SLI scalling it decent (still not good) on 4k and above only. This CPU have poor IPC and it just "glued" Ryzens ;-)


If you are testing in Futuremark products like Timespy or Firestrike it's that they don't utilise the ThreadRipper architecture properly so scaling in Timespy or Firestrike is epicly bad.

SLI works ok in games that support it however. If you want high Firestrike scores, grab an Intel 7960X and overclock the tits off it along with a good Vega64 or 1080Ti/Titan Xp (not saying the Vega is in the same ballpark...). As the 7960X will give awesome physics results in those tests compared to ThreadRipper due to poor optimisation for ThreadRipper.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> If you are testing in Futuremark products like Timespy or Firestrike it's that they don't utilise the ThreadRipper architecture properly so scaling in Timespy or Firestrike is epicly bad.
> 
> SLI works ok in games that support it however. If you want high Firestrike scores, grab an Intel 7960X and overclock the tits off it along with a good Vega64 or 1080Ti/Titan Xp (not saying the Vega is in the same ballpark...). As the 7960X will give awesome physics results in those tests compared to ThreadRipper due to poor optimisation for ThreadRipper.


you need more data here is an older one I found and I do not see any major difference

https://hothardware.com/reviews/amd-threadripper-1950x-performance-preview?page=2






have a video vs an overclocked 7700k pretty much the be all end-all till the 8700k popped up.

I haven't looked at the video yet so yeah







I,ll be back

ok I,m back and I watched I have no idea if most of them are correct I know the cinebench ones are







so if anyone has a sli setup throw in the scores because if that s correct I do not see a problem


----------



## ITAngel

So I been at home running some test on my system using AIDA64. So my temps are 29C idle up to 57C on Stability Test 20mins+ plus AVG Temp was 54C. Do you think with those kind of temps are really need water cooling? This is with a room at 72F. I have like 2 water cooling paths to take and trying to decide which route to take. Range of course for those are $200-300 just to cool the CPU and have anyways between 1x 360mm rad or 2x 240mm rads.









Forgot to mention that Voltages Min: 0.720V / Max: 1.472V


----------



## happyluckbox

Seeing Max Temps of 67c-68c and vcore of 1.38-1.392v at load. Is this sustainable long term? Temps are staying below amd's recommended specifications, but vcore is a touch higher than amd says is safe.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> dude...what cabin are you in we are in the same boat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well not exactly my temps are no where near as bad as yours BUT I am still trying to get rid of the bubbles...it has to be the block churning it up as I never had the issue with the EEEEK block.
> 
> to give you an idea this is after I THOUGHT I had it bled but the bubbles returned...hasn't affected it to much but still not as good as it could be.
> oh that's at 4 gig by the way with 1.3 v I,ll run it again today and see how much it changed at 4.1 1.35 I was getting I think 72
> 
> also forgot I did the credit card swipe and dot BUT I am using kryonaut BUT I ran out so it is the worse paste job ever splotches everywhere so I do not think application is the biggest issue.


I tried three different remounts (and different TIMs) of the XSPC block and got the same temps. I switched back to the EK block today and my temps immediately decreased by 5 degrees idle and 10-20 degrees under load (depending on test). Nothing else changed in my custom loop at all. Guess I'm waiting for the Heatkiller block.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I tried three different remounts (and different TIMs) of the XSPC block and got the same temps. I switched back to the EK block today and my temps immediately decreased by 5 degrees idle and 10-20 degrees under load (depending on test). Nothing else changed in my custom loop at all. Guess I'm waiting for the Heatkiller block.


Wow! that is good to know. My block is getting in today and hopefully the remaining of the loop setup this week or early next week.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Wow! that is good to know. My block is getting in today and hopefully the remaining of the loop setup this week or early next week.


It's the opposite of NYCGTR's result, so conflicting data points. Perhaps I had a bad block but I couldn't get it to give me a good result.

Which block have you ordered?


----------



## awaybreaktoday

Major price cut on Threadripper going live on most sites today.. UK pricing for threadripper 1950X now £771-£809, are AMD preparing for new Threadripper CPU launch?


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> It's the opposite of NYCGTR's result, so conflicting data points. Perhaps I had a bad block but I couldn't get it to give me a good result.
> 
> Which block have you ordered?


I order the EK-Supremacy EVO Threadripper Edition Nickel Acetal water block.


----------



## happyluckbox

So when does threadripper begin to thermal throttle? at 68c, or at 69c? And how much is clock speed reduced by, and for how long? I'm trying to monitor via cpuz, but not noticing any reduction in clock speed at either 68 or 69c.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So when does threadripper begin to thermal throttle? at 68c, or at 69c? And how much is clock speed reduced by, and for how long? I'm trying to monitor via cpuz, but not noticing any reduction in clock speed at either 68 or 69c.


Starts to throttle at 78c tdie. I don't know how long orhow hard it throttles and I don't let it get that far anymore.


----------



## chew*

Throttles soft @ 93ish twtl or whatever the upper temps are..

There are like 3 throttle points.

1 will downclock below your set oc.

1 will downclock under base frequency.

Hardthrottle will drop to 550mhz.

Easiest way to catch first signs is scores start dropping

Most of the time stage 1 throttle can not be measured in monitoring software.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Starts to throttle at 78c tdie. I don't know how long orhow hard it throttles and I don't let it get that far anymore.


Wait, from what I've been reading the throttling starts around 68c...

Do you have a source for that 78c throttle?


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Throttles soft @ 93ish twtl or whatever the upper temps are..
> 
> There are like 3 throttle points.
> 
> 1 will downclock below your set oc.
> 
> 1 will downclock under base frequency.
> 
> Hardthrottle will drop to 550mhz.
> 
> Easiest way to catch first signs is scores start dropping
> 
> Most of the time stage 1 throttle can not be measured in monitoring software.


So stage 1 throttle kicks in at 93 tctl, which is 66 tdie. That is quite a bit lower than AMD's stated 68c.


----------



## happyluckbox

Anybody know how to disable llc or at least bring it down to a lower value? Using either Auto or Normal still results in a massive offset, going from 1.32v idle to 1.38v load.
My mobo has the following settings: Auto, normal, standard, low, medium, high, turbo, extreme.

There doesn't seem to be a way to disable it, so I'd like to get the lowest LLC offset possible. I just want to have my load vcore = idle vcore.


----------



## chew*

93ish as I only have 1 board cant confirm on all. 93ish could be 95 actual but it happens before software can see 95c. Make sense?

Like i said and i call this soft throttle it is near impossible to catch in monitoring especially oced.

Benchmarks catch it based on result.

Based on my results in many bencharks that I have run that many others have run much higher than me.

I am not throttling. Others are.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Starts to throttle at 78c tdie. I don't know how long orhow hard it throttles and I don't let it get that far anymore.


Actually, I got that wrong.

Going back through my own testing results my 1950x and 1920x both start to throttle at 85c tdie


----------



## chew*

85 is like 105 that is the point where it can actually be seen in monitoring and right before hard throttle which is followed by shutdown if it still can not reduce temps.

Scores tell more than monitoring. If score gets worse higher...its rather simple to figure out.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> 85 is like 105 that is the point where it can actually be seen in monitoring and right before hard throttle which is followed by shutdown if it still can not reduce temps.
> 
> Scores tell more than monitoring. If score gets worse higher...its rather simple to figure out.


Yeah, my scores stay consistent until 85c

EDIT:-

Ahh, I always have PROCHOT disabled, so that might explain the differences I see.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So stage 1 throttle kicks in at 93 tctl, which is 66 tdie. That is quite a bit lower than AMD's stated 68c.


all depends lots of variables one board may report temps a little off from another
fro me another over 80 will hard throttle and lockup generally.
anything over say 75 will cause core usage to drop on full loads leading to lower scores so watch for that.
it is a lot easier to see the effects running it stock.
a soft throttle as I call it is the boost is lower and needs more power to do it
boost 40.5/4.1 needs 1.51
drop the temps and it becomes 4.1 to 4.15
needing 1.42 to do it
simply by keeping it under 68 (on the taichi)
and this is something I can replicate
get up[ in the 70's and it will start to really throttle the closer to 80 you get and at stock hit 85 and it should shut down.

mine does it around 80 but it could peak to 85 and I miss it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Anybody know how to disable llc or at least bring it down to a lower value? Using either Auto or Normal still results in a massive offset, going from 1.32v idle to 1.38v load.
> My mobo has the following settings: Auto, normal, standard, low, medium, high, turbo, extreme.
> 
> There doesn't seem to be a way to disable it, so I'd like to get the lowest LLC offset possible. I just want to have my load vcore = idle vcore.


your board and I think the asus the llc seems to be broken (don't quote me I just remember reading it somewhere or maybe a review)
check for an update bios if there is not one try standard low etc and see if any of those work....a lot of boards do things differently on this taichi 5 is the loosest and one is the extreme for me 3 is a happy setting I set 1.3 and that is pretty much what I get (1.312 idle small load and 1.306 full load) so far it seems to be the best llc out of the ryzen type boards I have had.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I tried three different remounts (and different TIMs) of the XSPC block and got the same temps. I switched back to the EK block today and my temps immediately decreased by 5 degrees idle and 10-20 degrees under load (depending on test). Nothing else changed in my custom loop at all. Guess I'm waiting for the Heatkiller block.






yeah I just don't know honestly, I have managed to get a few more out draining a bit and replacing with new fluid and shaking it like a piñata







and still temps are ok as you can see.


----------



## djnsmith7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *awaybreaktoday*
> 
> Major price cut on Threadripper going live on most sites today.. UK pricing for threadripper 1950X now £771-£809, are AMD preparing for new Threadripper CPU launch?


It looks like the prices did drop on all 3 TR's on Amazon. Hope this trend continues.


----------



## chew*

Well this came as no surprise. It was highly biased center and certainly was not full contact at dies when I started.

Pic below was about halfway mark.



Not a super mirror finish. Me personally i think super polished finish is counter productive. Need voids/small scratches.


----------



## JUANNY

Can we expect a better than or equal type of threadripper sales for next month black friday


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Well this came as no surprise. It was highly biased center and certainly was not full contact at dies when I started.
> 
> Pic below was about halfway mark.
> 
> 
> 
> Not a super mirror finish. Me personally i think super polished finish is counter productive. Need voids/small scratches.


I really should've lapped mine...

What is the temperature improvement like?


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Well this came as no surprise. It was highly biased center and certainly was not full contact at dies when I started.
> 
> Pic below was about halfway mark.
> 
> 
> 
> Not a super mirror finish. Me personally i think super polished finish is counter productive. Need voids/small scratches.


Makes me want to lap my liqtech tr-4 and see if I can get better temps.

Are you lapping your cpu too?


----------



## chew*

Not my cpu installed atm so no.

Maybe mine I will.

I will be lapping the Phanteks however as I was asked to make sure its flat.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I really should've lapped mine...
> 
> What is the temperature improvement like?


No clue yet its leak testing on a h320 x2 that has been freshly cleaned.

Should be substantial gains regardless.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Well this came as no surprise. It was highly biased center and certainly was not full contact at dies when I started.
> 
> Pic below was about halfway mark.
> 
> 
> 
> Not a super mirror finish. Me personally i think super polished finish is counter productive. Need voids/small scratches.






well that is just crap









the ek and the xspc to me felt pretty damn flat so I did not bother lapping for now...but since the ek is out I might as well give a go and see what's what.

how do you lap yours?
grits etc

I am also just testing this block at stock settings and as I thought it seems fine...sort of overkill really









super quick prime 95 293 small ffts only 10 minutes so far but you get the point


----------



## chew*

I knew for a fact the byski was bad so 400 wet w/dish soap. Final was a quick run on 1500 wet w/dish soap.

Probably start with 800 on the phanteks to get an idea of where its at. Hard to tell looks flat.

A nice 1/4" or thicker glass top table helps ensure your lapping on a flat surface.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I knew for a fact the byski was bad so 400 wet w/dish soap. Final was a quick run on 1500 wet w/dish soap.
> 
> Probably start with 800 on the phanteks to get an idea of where its at. Hard to tell looks flat.
> 
> A nice 1/4" or thicker glass top table helps ensure your lapping on a flat surface.






cool thanks I,ll give that a whirl(pun intended) on the ek later.


----------



## djnsmith7

I'll be up front and admit that I did not read this entire thread. If this topic has been covered at length, then that's my bad and I'll go backtrack and be more thorough in my search.

I read a comment or two in this thread about the EK Monoblock / CPU block combo for the Asus Zenith Extreme board not providing full coverage on the IHS. You can see in the image from EK's website that it does not.

I reached out to EK to see what they had to say about it, and this was the meat & potatoes of their response: "There is no need for the whole IHS to be covered by the water block, since the monoblock already covers the most crucial parts that need to be cooled. The monoblock was tested when applied to the TR4 chip, so there should be no fear of the monoblock not cooling the TR4 completely since it was also tested by our R&D guys and it worked perfectly."

I don't know what the conditions were when EK tested this product, but I know I'll be OC'ng the heck out of the chip and those comments about not needing full coverage to account for massive heat production sort of leaves me scratching my head.

I'm curious what you folks think about this.


----------



## Paprika

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djnsmith7*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be up front and admit that I did not read this entire thread. If this topic has been covered at length, then that's my bad and I'll go backtrack and be more thorough in my search.
> 
> I read a comment or two in this thread about the EK Monoblock / CPU block combo for the Asus Zenith Extreme board not providing full coverage on the IHS. You can see in the image from EK's website that it does not.
> 
> I reached out to EK to see what they had to say about it, and this was the meat & potatoes of their response: "There is no need for the whole IHS to be covered by the water block, since the monoblock already covers the most crucial parts that need to be cooled. The monoblock was tested when applied to the TR4 chip, so there should be no fear of the monoblock not cooling the TR4 completely since it was also tested by our R&D guys and it worked perfectly."
> 
> I don't know what the conditions were when EK tested this product, but I know I'll be OC'ng the heck out of the chip (and plan to delid) and those comments about not needing full coverage to account for massive heat production sort of leaves me scratching my head.
> 
> I'm curious what you folks think about this.


I'm sure there's somewhat of a minimal difference between "almost fully covered" and fully covered, but it seems some other manufacturers don't quite agree.


That's what Watercool is doing. Left is their normal Heatkiller block, right is the TR4. They've done an abundance of testing, even ditching earlier designs due to them not fulfilling the performance goals.
TLDR wait for the Heatkiller results I'd say.


----------



## Dyson Poindexter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djnsmith7*
> 
> (and plan to delid)


Now this I want to see.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djnsmith7*
> 
> I know I'll be OC'ng the heck out of the chip (and plan to delid)


Why delid? The dies are soldered and Der8auer already delidded two as the first died in delidding...


----------



## happyluckbox

Sigh, so my rig is fully p95 stable at 1.35vcore, aida64stable, but no matter what I do, I cant get it stable in my solving software. Already incrrased vcore from 1.35 to 1.4 and the software still crashes. ***ffff


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Sigh, so my rig is fully p95 stable at 1.35vcore, aida64stable, but no matter what I do, I cant get it stable in my solving software. Already incrrased vcore from 1.35 to 1.4 and the software still crashes. ***ffff


If that is small fft try custom blend with 90% ram allocated and hci.

If drop a thread or toss an error suspect imc/mem.

Your on 64 gb DR like me its rather harsh on cpu.

The other thing we ran into was a pstate 3.8 oc with a low idle speed for whatever reason our app would crash like that but prime would not.

Basically it did not like clocks jumping around.


----------



## ITAngel

I got the *EK-Supremacy EVO Threadripper Edition - Nickel* block yesterday and decided to take it apart to check it and see how is build.











Enjoy!


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If that is small fft try custom blend with 90% ram allocated and hci.
> 
> If drop a thread or toss an error suspect imc/mem.
> 
> Your on 64 gb DR like me its rather harsh on cpu.
> 
> The other thing we ran into was a pstate 3.8 oc with a low idle speed for whatever reason our app would crash like that but prime would not.
> 
> Basically it did not like clocks jumping around.






yep seems the ramp up is not fast enough I can run 4gig on balanced fine but if I use anything that really ups and downs the cores it will cause issues.

what I would suggest happy Gilmore is try it at dead stock not even xmp the lowest denominator
then up the ram
try again
if that works try balanced and high performance power settings
if both of those are ok try a very mild overclock say 3.7 with minimal volt increase (pstate or manual)
if that works move up from there but forget every stress test except your program because in the end THAT is what matters(what is it by the way?


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Sigh, so my rig is fully p95 stable at 1.35vcore, aida64stable, but no matter what I do, I cant get it stable in my solving software. Already incrrased vcore from 1.35 to 1.4 and the software still crashes. ***ffff






also just as a though what sort of vdroop are you getting AND when overclocked do you turn off the usual's like core enhancements etc etc any of those could trip it over the edge

in other news...ny friggen bubbles are back







driving me isnsane....I,m getting veryu close to picking this 30 kilo monster upside down and shaking it to death


----------



## winkizuma

I'm debating between EK and XSPC block for my 1950x. I've never watercooled before can anyone make a suggestion. I currently rocking a kraken x52 from my previous build...yea I know its not enough.

I've used the EK configurator to help me get started and pick out parts that I need. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *winkizuma*
> 
> I'm debating between EK and XSPC block for my 1950x. I've never watercooled before can anyone make a suggestion. I currently rocking a kraken x52 from my previous build...yea I know its not enough.
> 
> I've used the EK configurator to help me get started and pick out parts that I need. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


If you want crappier quality and higher temps go with EK fittings and the tr block. If you want better quality fittings and better temps go with the xspc block and fittings.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> If you want crappier quality and higher temps go with EK fittings and the tr block. If you want better quality fittings and better temps go with the xspc block and fittings.


I have been finding a lot of contradiction on which cooler is best when it comes to the block. So personally I can't say ek suck when I see sometime beating the other coolers from other reviewers. Just my two cents.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I have been finding a lot of contradiction on which cooler is best when it comes to the block. So personally I can't say ek suck when I see sometime beating the other coolers from other reviewers. Just my two cents.


The one thing you need to watch out for is the board they are on. The ASUS apparently can bug temps not only that but sense mi skew can be manipulated to show better than possible temps.

50C unless they were on a 8 core 1900x is laughable. in my case you can just look at my fury X water temps, my idle temps should never be below my gpu's water temps.


----------



## winkizuma

Are there any review or benchmarks to show the difference?


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> The one thing you need to watch out for is the board they are on. The ASUS apparently can bug temps not only that but sense mi skew can be manipulated to show better than possible temps.
> 
> 50C unless they were on a 8 core 1900x is laughable. in my case you can just look at my fury X water temps, my idle temps should never be below my gpu's water temps.


I agree on what you are saying and it makes perfect sense. I am just saying that most reviews I am seeing all over the board is on an ASUS. It would be interesting once I can get my loop going on my AsRock to see what it will report. Of course I will share and test anything needed to help the community in here however; keep in mind I am not overclocking. Most of the people reporting these temps are overclocking and everyone setting is different. For example nycgtr can be seeing those crazy temps were one cooler is more favorable than the other due to how they are performing but I feel is so early to even say one is better than the other. Is good to guide people but I have spend several days debating if i want to go all the way EK or not until I watch so many videos and put me in the 50/50 ratio. lol


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I have been finding a lot of contradiction on which cooler is best when it comes to the block. So personally I can't say ek suck when I see sometime beating the other coolers from other reviewers. Just my two cents.


User experience will pretty much tell you all you need to know. I am not the only one on here with both blocks. Infact I have more than1 of each and the temps don't lie. I swap the block and instantly I am no longer throttling or hitting the 80s in prime. There's nothing contradicting about that. The ek block is good for stock operation or a very mild oc, outside of that it's crap plain and simple. If I only had 1 Ek block then sure maybe blame a bad block, but I have 2 well had 2 since I sold one. Diff board, diff 1950x same results of a temp drop just by swapping the block. I have the monoblock on order and I am sure it will be not as good as the XSPC as well. If you had both blocks in your possession it would be hard to believe that they would offer similar performance.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> User experience will pretty much tell you all you need to know. I am not the only one on here with both blocks. Infact I have more than1 of each and the temps don't lie. I swap the block and instantly I am no longer throttling or hitting the 80s in prime. There's nothing contradicting about that. The ek block is good for stock operation or a very mild oc, outside of that it's crap plain and simple. If I only had 1 Ek block then sure maybe blame a bad block, but I have 2 well had 2 since I sold one. Diff board, diff 1950x same results of a temp drop just by swapping the block. I have the monoblock on order and I am sure it will be not as good as the XSPC as well. If you had both blocks in your possession it would be hard to believe that they would offer similar performance.


I see were you are coming from with that, and would be interesting to see what the monoblock will provide as far as a comparison to the other 3 blocks. I guess with me I have no idea what kind of setup or OC level you are running so I can't compare my system with your. But maybe that level of cooling and performance makes more sense for those who already overclock to a higher degree.

Curious have you done a stock test between all of them, and a mid oc , finally a high oc to see how much those numbers fluctuate? I am simply curious about it if you have or not to kind of get an idea. Because of these coolers and such cost me so much I am pretty much broke to try get a second cooler to test. I need to get a GPU cooler next if I don't end up selling my Galax GTX 1070 Hall of Fame Edition. If I get to the point to buy a block for it from ebay then would be interesting how much the temps will change. Also note I am only going to run for now a single EK 360 PE rad until I can get a 240 rad to at to the front of the case.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I see were you are coming from with that, and would be interesting to see what the monoblock will provide as far as a comparison to the other 3 blocks. I guess with me I have no idea what kind of setup or OC level you are running so I can't compare my system with your. But maybe that level of cooling and performance makes more sense for those who already overclock to a higher degree.
> 
> Curious have you done a stock test between all of them, and a mid oc , finally a high oc to see how much those numbers fluctuate? I am simply curious about it if you have or not to kind of get an idea. Because of these coolers and such cost me so much I am pretty much broke to try get a second cooler to test. I need to get a GPU cooler next if I don't end up selling my Galax GTX 1070 Hall of Fame Edition. If I get to the point to buy a block for it from ebay then would be interesting how much the temps will change. Also note I am only going to run for now a single EK 360 PE rad until I can get a 240 rad to at to the front of the case.


I ran both stock and I had a max load of 58-60c, very marginal between the 2 blocks. After 1.3v the EK goes bye bye. As for the rest of the loop, at my time of testing both loops were EK revo top, d5, 250ML res, one loop with a 480 and one with a 360. However, the temp was the same. At first I refused to believe it was the block, I took it apart twice, remounted it 3 times, changed paste, and I went back to just distilled from nano coolant think maybe it was a bad mayhems batch or something.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I ran both stock and I had a max load of 58-60c, very marginal between the 2 blocks. After 1.3v the EK goes bye bye. As for the rest of the loop, at my time of testing both loops were EK revo top, d5, 250ML res, one loop with a 480 and one with a 360. However, the temp was the same.


I see very interesting, and crazy because those temps I get with just my Noctua cooler if we are talking about the tDIE and not the other one.







Note I have not run p95 though, just AIDA64.


----------



## winkizuma

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> User experience will pretty much tell you all you need to know. I am not the only one on here with both blocks. Infact I have more than1 of each and the temps don't lie. I swap the block and instantly I am no longer throttling or hitting the 80s in prime. There's nothing contradicting about that. The ek block is good for stock operation or a very mild oc, outside of that it's crap plain and simple. If I only had 1 Ek block then sure maybe blame a bad block, but I have 2 well had 2 since I sold one. Diff board, diff 1950x same results of a temp drop just by swapping the block. I have the monoblock on order and I am sure it will be not as good as the XSPC as well. If you had both blocks in your possession it would be hard to believe that they would offer similar performance.


Thanks for the info. I too saw the monoblock from EK and was thinking about getting that.

What I really want is just the best performance, so right now I am leaning to the XSPC. I don't plan on overclocking it to the max but having that option would be nice. Maybe I'll wait and I"ll have more options. As of right now though I see more info and reviews for EK and that why I mentioned them.

And like I said this will be my first custom loop. So I would like to have a good foundation. I am only looking to water cool the CPU down the line I'll probably do the GPU.

Thanks all.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *winkizuma*
> 
> I'm debating between EK and XSPC block for my 1950x. I've never watercooled before can anyone make a suggestion. I currently rocking a kraken x52 from my previous build...yea I know its not enough.
> 
> I've used the EK configurator to help me get started and pick out parts that I need. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


Even the Bykski block beats the EK block. When I bought mine I thought it was a cheap stop gap until a full cover option, instead I had best in class performance (XSPC hadn't released yet). Get the XSPC, the EK isn't worth it.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *winkizuma*
> 
> Thanks for the info. I too saw the monoblock from EK and was thinking about getting that.
> 
> What I really want is just the best performance, so right now I am leaning to the XSPC. I don't plan on overclocking it to the max but having that option would be nice. Maybe I'll wait and I"ll have more options. As of right now though I see more info and reviews for EK and that why I mentioned them.
> 
> And like I said this will be my first custom loop. So I would like to have a good foundation. I am only looking to water cool the CPU down the line I'll probably do the GPU.
> 
> Thanks all.


Forget the EK config, it's a decent start but not as helpful as it appears to be.

Rad: HARDWARE LABS GTS (dont buy anything else)
Pump: D5
Reservoir and pump top: Singularity d5 top and reservoir. No other combination will give you as much flexibility with ports as this setup. The amount of ports is insane.
Fittings: Barrow, xspc, bitspower.


----------



## ITAngel

You know I believe you guys are right and there are better coolers out there for these monsters of a cpu. But for someone on a budget like me I am force to get what I can, specially when the price I get the items are within reasons. Wish I could do a high end custom build with only the best parts but that is not realistic for me. Since my Music takes a lot of money along with my computer hobbies. lol

To nycgtr thanks for share all that information. Is always useful to have these discussion with people who provide feedback and info back to those questioning. Not someone wanting to flame burn others.







1+


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> You know I believe you guys are right and there are better coolers out there for these monsters of a cpu. But for someone on a budget like me I am force to get what I can, specially when the price I get the items are within reasons. Wish I could do a high end custom build with only the best parts but that is not realistic for me. Since my Music takes a lot of money along with my computer hobbies. lol nycgtr thanks for share all that information. Is always useful to have these discussion with people who provide feedback and info back to those questioning. Not someone wanting to flame burn others.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1+


For the price you paid for the EK block it isn't bad, I paid the 80 plus ship on two of them so I ate the full trauma twice lol. The EK block is better than any AIO and imo would be similar to the enermax. It's just not as good as the competition for the money. The xspc is a 19 dollar difference retail to retail pricing but you also get rgb leds and a rgb led controller, the Ek just gives you a block. I can see that ek made some changes to the top as the holes are in different position, but honestly they could of sold an upgrade kit with the bigger cold plate and bracket and gotten the same results with the evo. I am sure someone else can test that at some point. I do have the reg supremacy evo block but I'm not tearing my loop down over and over lol.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> For the price you paid for the EK block it isn't bad, I paid the 80 plus ship on two of them so I ate the full trauma twice lol. The EK block is better than any AIO and imo would be similar to the enermax. It's just not as good as the competition for the money. The xspc is a 19 dollar difference retail to retail pricing but you also get rgb leds and a rgb led controller, the Ek just gives you a block. I can see that ek made some changes to the top as the holes are in different position, but honestly they could of sold an upgrade kit with the bigger cold plate and bracket and gotten the same results with the evo. I am sure someone else can test that at some point. I do have the reg supremacy evo block but I'm not tearing my loop down over and over lol.


I see, is the one I posted the new one with the changes or the old one? Here


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I see, is the one I posted the new one with the changes or the old one? Here


I am talking about the TR block from EK. If you ever owned the regular supremacy evo for multiple sockets. You will notice the cooling engine is the same and the included jetplate with the TR block is essnetialy the same as one of the jetplates in the original supremacy kit. What they've done is rotate the default positing by 90 degrees, increased the cold plate BUT NOT the fin area as that's STILL the same as the regular supremacy. So the only thing that's changed is the length of the cold plate and default rotation and the mount bracket for the block. This is why I am saying if you took the mount bracket and the cold plate from the EK EVO TR and used it on the original evo supremacy it would result in the same performance.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I am talking about the TR block from EK. If you ever owned the regular supremacy evo for multiple sockets. You will notice the cooling engine is the same and the included jetplate with the TR block is essnetialy the same as one of the jetplates in the original supremacy kit. What they've done is rotate the default positing by 90 degrees, increased the cold plate BUT NOT the fin area as that's STILL the same as the regular supremacy. So the only thing that's changed is the length of the cold plate and default rotation and the mount bracket for the block. This is why I am saying if you took the mount bracket and the cold plate from the EK EVO TR and used it on the original evo supremacy it would result in the same performance.


Ohhhh... I see what you mean and yes I did owned the X99 block at the time and seem to look pretty similar. Maybe I will sale it and get one of the other ones eventually. I could use RGB to give me free FPS on my games. lol









On a side note has anyone run Threadripper on Windows 7 64bit?


----------



## chew*

So just going to throw this out there.

Whats changed

Lapped Byski.
Installed a 3x120 h320x2 vs my h220x2
Installed my swiftech fans in pull. ( 1800 peak speed iirc "its quiet" )http://www.swiftech.com/Helix120-PWM-1.aspx

Very thin layer of paste and I have remounted numerous times it really does not matter as long as you get full coverage it will squeeze out the excess.....

As you can see temps have not improved really maybe worse so that could be a clue or ambients or tolerable fan levels.. The clue being same pump bigger rad = less flow rate.

Note my gpu liquid temp which is equal to 80F. It's 76F in my house right now. No magical lower than possible temps ( cpu lower at idle than actual water ) here and I can not nor do I have the option to skew or get bugged temps like the ASUS guys.

24K brings probably the hottest temps so screenshot of peak was after that ran.

Last test will be when the new swiftech unit I ordered arrives which has double the flow rate of my existing setup.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> So just going to throw this out there.
> 
> Whats changed
> 
> Lapped Byski.
> Installed a 3x120 h320x2 vs my h220x2
> Installed my swiftech fans in pull. ( 1800 peak speed iirc "its quiet" )http://www.swiftech.com/Helix120-PWM-1.aspx
> 
> Very thin layer of paste and I have remounted numerous times it really does not matter as long as you get full coverage it will squeeze out the excess.....
> 
> As you can see temps have not improved really maybe worse so that could be a clue or ambients. The clue being same pump bigger rad = less flow rate.
> 
> Note my gpu liquid temp which is equal to 80F. It's 76F in my house right now. No magical lower than possible temps ( cpu lower at idle than actual water ) here and I can not nor do I have the option to skew or get bugged temps like the ASUS guys.
> 
> 24K brings probably the hottest temps so screenshot of peak was after that ran.
> 
> Last test will be when the new swiftech unit I ordered arrives which has double the flow rate of my existing setup.


Very interesting, what kind of motherboard are you running?


----------



## chew*

Taichi.

Bigger rad slower fans should balance out versus smaller rad higher fans which is what I had before.

The main purpose for watercooling is lower temps lower noise.....so anything loud is well pointless and belongs in a data center.

Ive checked various things, hopefully its flow rates.

Oh and here are some size ref shots of phanteks and cooling engine.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> User experience will pretty much tell you all you need to know. I am not the only one on here with both blocks. Infact I have more than1 of each and the temps don't lie. I swap the block and instantly I am no longer throttling or hitting the 80s in prime. There's nothing contradicting about that. The ek block is good for stock operation or a very mild oc, outside of that it's crap plain and simple. If I only had 1 Ek block then sure maybe blame a bad block, but I have 2 well had 2 since I sold one. Diff board, diff 1950x same results of a temp drop just by swapping the block. I have the monoblock on order and I am sure it will be not as good as the XSPC as well. If you had both blocks in your possession it would be hard to believe that they would offer similar performance.


I actually had the exact opposite experience. The XSPC block led to 80+ degree temps on P95 where the EK block keeps me in the 60s. It's possible I had a bad bad block but I remounted it three different times and got the same results. Not saying the EL block is great but it got me much better temps in the exact same loop. Going to buy the new hearkiller when available and hope that gets me lower temps.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> For the price you paid for the EK block it isn't bad, I paid the 80 plus ship on two of them so I ate the full trauma twice lol. The EK block is better than any AIO and imo would be similar to the enermax. It's just not as good as the competition for the money. The xspc is a 19 dollar difference retail to retail pricing but you also get rgb leds and a rgb led controller, the Ek just gives you a block. I can see that ek made some changes to the top as the holes are in different position, but honestly they could of sold an upgrade kit with the bigger cold plate and bracket and gotten the same results with the evo. I am sure someone else can test that at some point. I do have the reg supremacy evo block but I'm not tearing my loop down over and over lol.






yeah no
not here the xspc is $129 and the ek block is $89
that is not a small difference unless you mean the full nickel one that was very close in price.

as for results I have a lot of them up with a few more to load on my little farty review.

http://www.bluetarot.com/hardware/uncategorized/amd-threadripper-1950x-review/

there are a few things I need to add and tidy up but it gives an idea.
if you see anything I really need to add or tidy up yell at me I have little to no feelings and rhino skin









but for me I agree that anything under 1.3 and the ek block worked fine on the same setup(oh and yeah if my Frankenstein upside down fruit cake build can do it a real one should be much better







)

but throw 1.35 at it and 4.1 and yes you start creeping close to or over 80 and that's all she wrote.
now for you...yeah you with the xspc....did you notice a huge amount of air in the system(it is probably because I'm upside down miss jane but the ek never did it)

so it is really confusing me, does not seem to hinder it to much but I feel I am missing out.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> You know I believe you guys are right and there are better coolers out there for these monsters of a cpu. But for someone on a budget like me I am force to get what I can, specially when the price I get the items are within reasons. Wish I could do a high end custom build with only the best parts but that is not realistic for me. Since my Music takes a lot of money along with my computer hobbies. lol
> 
> To nycgtr thanks for share all that information. Is always useful to have these discussion with people who provide feedback and info back to those questioning. Not someone wanting to flame burn others.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1+






as for you







this is my first custom loop I,m an aio guy from years ago and never felt the need but I do now.

if you want to start off go find a cheap 420 a nice pump a bunch of tubes and a block and have at it







if it doesn't fit in the case who gives a crap throw it outside...mine likes it









once it is up and running you can always add another rad or a better pump or a better block but honestly any reasonable custom loop with any of the blocks will cool this thing at stock and keep it under 60 (I have added the stock part of my review with all the pictures...how's 50 degrees prime 95 293 small ffts...and my setup is stupid








now that's the xspc block but I am pretty sure the temps were pretty close with the ek I will go hunt them down.

just looked...I have zero screenies with the ek stock







I just went straight to 3900









ok found one prime 95 stock and the temps at stock are pretty much the same as the xspc BUT the fans were higher



and on the xspc at stock the voltages were lower (not me it decided that )


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I actually had the exact opposite experience. The XSPC block led to 80+ degree temps on P95 where the EK block keeps me in the 60s. It's possible I had a bad bad block but I remounted it three different times and got the same results. Not saying the EL block is great but it got me much better temps in the exact same loop. Going to buy the new hearkiller when available and hope that gets me lower temps.


Check the mounting posts. On the 2 I had it took a bit of wiggling to get the block to sit flat. Not a fan of the mount system XSPC used. Otherwise you may have gotten a bad block. I've had 3 in my possession 2 for me and 1 I ordered for a friend. The first one had some qc issues with the coating so you might have an issue elsewhere.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> yeah no
> not here the xspc is $129 and the ek block is $89
> that is not a small difference unless you mean the full nickel one that was very close in price.
> 
> as for results I have a lot of them up with a few more to load on my little farty review.
> 
> http://www.bluetarot.com/hardware/uncategorized/amd-threadripper-1950x-review/
> 
> there are a few things I need to add and tidy up but it gives an idea.
> if you see anything I really need to add or tidy up yell at me I have little to no feelings and rhino skin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but for me I agree that anything under 1.3 and the ek block worked fine on the same setup(oh and yeah if my Frankenstein upside down fruit cake build can do it a real one should be much better
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> but throw 1.35 at it and 4.1 and yes you start creeping close to or over 80 and that's all she wrote.
> now for you...yeah you with the xspc....did you notice a huge amount of air in the system(it is probably because I'm upside down miss jane but the ek never did it)
> 
> so it is really confusing me, does not seem to hinder it to much but I feel I am missing out.
> 
> as for you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this is my first custom loop I,m an aio guy from years ago and never felt the need but I do now.
> 
> if you want to start off go find a cheap 420 a nice pump a bunch of tubes and a block and have at it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it doesn't fit in the case who gives a crap throw it outside...mine likes it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> once it is up and running you can always add another rad or a better pump or a better block but honestly any reasonable custom loop with any of the blocks will cool this thing at stock and keep it under 60 (I have added the stock part of my review with all the pictures...how's 50 degrees prime 95 293 small ffts...and my setup is stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now that's the xspc block but I am pretty sure the temps were pretty close with the ek I will go hunt them down.
> 
> just looked...I have zero screenies with the ek stock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just went straight to 3900
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ok found one prime 95 stock and the temps at stock are pretty much the same as the xspc BUT the fans were higher
> 
> 
> 
> and on the xspc at stock the voltages were lower (not me it decided that )


Well I am not sure where you are located but in the US it's 99 on amazon/ebay etc. Newegg seems to have a markup on it of 119. The EK is 79 from EK direct or PPC and on Amazon. As for air in the loop, I did get an about 5mm wide air bubble both times I installed the block and when I drained the loop another time. It cleared up for me after a few power cycles on the pump, air bubble in a block is common on first assembly or complete drain.


----------



## amigafan2003

Ok, just tried a friends brand new XSPC block as the variability detailed in this thread was winding me up.

At stock and 4.1ghz / 1.4v - exactly the same temps as my EK block. I really don't know why people are seeing different performance figures - that's two EK blocks (one plexi, one acetal) and two XSPC blocks tested and no difference in perf between any of them either at stock or any voltage upto 1.4v (haven't tried higher volts - don't want to either).


----------



## djnsmith7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Why delid? The dies are soldered and Der8auer already delidded two as the first died in delidding...


Great question. Just making sure you were awake.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Ok, just tried a friends brand new XSPC block as the variability detailed in this thread was winding me up.
> 
> At stock and 4.1ghz / 1.4v - exactly the same temps as my EK block. I really don't know why people are seeing different performance figures - that's two EK blocks (one plexi, one acetal) and two XSPC blocks tested and no difference in perf between any of them either at stock or any voltage upto 1.4v (haven't tried higher volts - don't want to either).


Pretty much what I would expect, can't imagine there are huge jumps unless something changes like flow or rads.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djnsmith7*
> 
> Great question. Just making sure you were awake.


Woah good, you had me worried there


----------



## djnsmith7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Woah good, you had me worried there


Yea, that was my bad.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Ok, just tried a friends brand new XSPC block as the variability detailed in this thread was winding me up.
> 
> At stock and 4.1ghz / 1.4v - exactly the same temps as my EK block. I really don't know why people are seeing different performance figures - that's two EK blocks (one plexi, one acetal) and two XSPC blocks tested and no difference in perf between any of them either at stock or any voltage upto 1.4v (haven't tried higher volts - don't want to either).


What are you using too create the steady state load for the tests?


----------



## amigafan2003

5 timespy runs to get the water temp up (as that loads the gfx card as well as that's in the same loop) then a Gooseberry run.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> 5 timespy runs to get the water temp up (as that loads the gfx card as well as that's in the same loop) then a Gooseberry run.


Try a longer test - the XSPC will pull ahead over a longer time period. If you try P95 you'll see a difference.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Check the mounting posts. On the 2 I had it took a bit of wiggling to get the block to sit flat. Not a fan of the mount system XSPC used. Otherwise you may have gotten a bad block. I've had 3 in my possession 2 for me and 1 I ordered for a friend. The first one had some qc issues with the coating so you might have an issue elsewhere.
> Well I am not sure where you are located but in the US it's 99 on amazon/ebay etc. Newegg seems to have a markup on it of 119. The EK is 79 from EK direct or PPC and on Amazon. As for air in the loop, I did get an about 5mm wide air bubble both times I installed the block and when I drained the loop another time. It cleared up for me after a few power cycles on the pump, air bubble in a block is common on first assembly or complete drain.






Australia...you know the ass end of the world









https://staticice.com.au/cgi-bin/search.cgi?q=xspc+raystorm+neo&spos=1
that's pretty much it for us for that block

and the ek block

https://staticice.com.au/cgi-bin/search.cgi?q=ek+threadripper&spos=1

we can of course import etc etc but that all comes down to trumpchange rates etc








that and the fact...I like to be able to be close or at least in the same country as the item I buy so when I feel the need to turn green I can do it locally









I figured out the bleed, I was looking at it form a car/bike/brake point of view so I tried something new.
I have a fill port on top so I whacked ina compression fitting and a small length of pipe then cycled the pump
checked the level cycled and then put a tiny bit of distilled water in then cycled again
and on and on and on








this seems to have worked and its all clear now thanks









as for the xspc yes you do actually have to watch the screws I thought I had it screwed in tight but checking a day after using hulk strength it actually was a little loose on the lower two posts.

but all in all I,m happy with it and wish I had gotten it first (again not saying the ek is a *bad* block its just not as good....or red and shiny







)


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Try a longer test - the XSPC will pull ahead over a longer time period. If you try P95 you'll see a difference.


yeah see again apples to oranges in regards to me.
I have a rad a pump a cpu one loop each so my figures will vary from your figures.

IF you only did super intensive cpu stuff and left the cards idling you still need to push the water through more hoops and extra heat.
maybe
because I am just whaking through the one small loop my figures are different as the loop is less restrictive...if the loop is restrictive maybe that favours the ek block
I have no I freakin dea









all I can say is the ek block does not cool on my system as well as the xspc does given the exact same criteria IF you are running above stock AND abocve 1.3 volts but saying that the cooldown on the xspc is better as well.

so yeah again...if you have an ek block and the temps are good and you are happy...be happy if you have not GOT a block and your ina country where you can buy things cheap...unlike me... and the pricing is similar go for the xspc or whatever other ones are sexy now.

I threw in my figures.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

I am interested in seeing where other are regarding Vcore and Soc Voltage when acheiving 4.1Ghz, What are you guys running at ?


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Try a longer test - the XSPC will pull ahead over a longer time period.


Longer than 40 mins? Do you mean it will get colder over time?????????
Quote:


> If you try P95 you'll see a difference.


Also tried P95 small FFT's - no difference again. Max temps are reached around 7 mins in, so running it longer doesn't produce any higher temps.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If that is small fft try custom blend with 90% ram allocated and hci.
> 
> If drop a thread or toss an error suspect imc/mem.
> 
> Your on 64 gb DR like me its rather harsh on cpu.
> 
> The other thing we ran into was a pstate 3.8 oc with a low idle speed for whatever reason our app would crash like that but prime would not.
> 
> Basically it did not like clocks jumping around.


I haven't touched p-state overclocking, all overclocking was done by increasimg bclck. Coolnquiet and everything else is turned off.
I think my clockspeed is stable, but using this software, my vcore bounces around alot from 1.32 - 1.38v

Like I said, tried increasing vcore by .05, still no effect...


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> I am interested in seeing where other are regarding Vcore and Soc Voltage when acheiving 4.1Ghz, What are you guys running at ?


4.1 is 1.35 llc3 on the taichi
that is pstates with offset voltage.
pictures are in the link I posted


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I haven't touched p-state overclocking, all overclocking was done by increasimg bclck. Coolnquiet and everything else is turned off.
> I think my clockspeed is stable, but using this software, my vcore bounces around alot from 1.32 - 1.38v
> 
> Like I said, tried increasing vcore by .05, still no effect...


get off bclk that will also screw with the 64 pcie lanes









http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/overclocking-amd-ryzen,review-33883-3.html

that's ryzen but the same holds true here.

try pstates or just basic simple manual set to 40 set voltage to XXX llc to XXX and be done

if your on a asus board I can't suggest anything in regards to voltage as the llc from what I read is pretty screwed up.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> get off bclk that will also screw with the 64 pcie lanes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/overclocking-amd-ryzen,review-33883-3.html
> 
> that's ryzen but the same holds true here.
> 
> try pstates or just basic simple manual set to 40 set voltage to XXX llc to XXX and be done
> 
> if your on a asus board I can't suggest anything in regards to voltage as the llc from what I read is pretty screwed up.


Sorry I meant i'm using the multiplier not base clock.

Anybody else got any tips on how I can stabilize my solving software? It typically bounces between 1.32 and 1.38vcore frequently under 65-90% load. Synthetic testing with p95 and aida64 fail to catch any instabilities...


----------



## chew*

Did you try HCI Like I said?


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Did you try HCI Like I said?


I agree. If it's passing small ffts in Prime but failing in software (especially scientific apps) then it points to a mem issue.


----------



## Beatnutz

I finally have a stable OC on my 1950X @ 3.8Ghz, 1.150v and ram at 3000MHz.

After 10 minutes in Prime95 v5.58 I top out at +61c which is OK, but the top listed VRAM temps in my screenshot seem really hot at +99c max. Or should I just read the lower one?


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Did you try HCI Like I said?


I will give that a shot but the main issue with hci iirc was that it was unable to stress more than 64gb of ram for the free version last i checked.

Also, don't mem issues generally manifest as the app crashing and not the entire computer locking up?


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> I am interested in seeing where other are regarding Vcore and Soc Voltage when acheiving 4.1Ghz, What are you guys running at ?
> 
> 
> 
> 4.1 is 1.35 llc3 on the taichi
> that is pstates with offset voltage.
> pictures are in the link I posted
Click to expand...

Nice, Noob question what are Pstates ? Not played with those yet.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> I finally have a stable OC on my 1950X @ 3.8Ghz, 1.150v and ram at 3000MHz.
> 
> After 10 minutes in Prime95 v5.58 I top out at +61c which is OK, but the top listed VRAM temps in my screenshot seem really hot at +99c max. Or should I just read the lower one?


Those seem high. Do you have airflow on the RAM?


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Those seem high. Do you have airflow on the RAM?


Only air that is being sucked out. I could switch the top fans on the rad to blow air in to the case instead but would rather not dump hot air in to the case.

I could try to change direction of the back fan but it will barely hit the VRM's but it might supply it with enough fresh air anyway.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

4.1Ghz seems to be difficult for me to obtain. Realbench is failing at VCore 1.37v still with 1.35 on Soc with a LLC of 8 (Zenith Extreme)

Anyone else have suggestions ?


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I will give that a shot but the main issue with hci iirc was that it was unable to stress more than 64gb of ram for the free version last i checked.
> 
> Also, don't mem issues generally manifest as the app crashing and not the entire computer locking up?


Nah that would be if you ran out maybe. Imc can definitely lock screen though.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Only air that is being sucked out. I could switch the top fans on the rad to blow air in to the case instead but would rather not dump hot air in to the case.
> 
> I could try to change direction of the back fan but it will barely hit the VRM's but it might supply it with enough fresh air anyway.


Reversing the back fan might help more than you think. I've got mine that way and my RAM doesn't get hot at all. 750D so similar case layout minus the basement.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Those seem high. Do you have airflow on the RAM?
> 
> 
> 
> Only air that is being sucked out. I could switch the top fans on the rad to blow air in to the case instead but would rather not dump hot air in to the case.
> 
> I could try to change direction of the back fan but it will barely hit the VRM's but it might supply it with enough fresh air anyway.
Click to expand...

I have just switched my 2x 140mm top fans from exhaust to intake to blow cool air onto the motherboard VRM's to help them out a little with a rear 140mm exhaust.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Nah that would be if you ran out maybe. Imc can definitely lock screen though.


So it seems that 3.975 ghz doesn't lock screen, but 4.0 will lock it after an hour or less. Any settings I should try changing to stabilize this? Already tried increasing and decreasing vsoc, no changes.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> 4.1Ghz seems to be difficult for me to obtain. Realbench is failing at VCore 1.37v still with 1.35 on Soc with a LLC of 8 (Zenith Extreme)
> 
> Anyone else have suggestions ?






1.35 on soc... stop that crap right now








1.2 is the hard limit on soc go over at your peril(as Scooby do would say)

turn off core enhancements
try 1.1 on soc
lvl8 on the asus didn't even know it had that







try level 1 or 2
dial in 1.35vcore test boot
run cpuz bench as a quick and dirty bench
if it passes try realbench 2.54
if it fails try 1.38
my guess is firstly the soc is way to high.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Nice, Noob question what are Pstates ? Not played with those yet.






power states
you know how chips go up and down in speed and voltage that Is what pstates are.

if you look around you should find a guide on how to do pstates they are the same method as on the ryzen
but one thing only change the speed in the first top psate not the voltage
change the voltage in advanced to offset and work out what you need.

if you do pstates though boot to stock settings first or the offset will be wrong.

at a quick thing 0.235 is about 1.35 on the 1950x but I would start off at like .01875 4 gig (A0) then work up from there once you know what the voltage is.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> So it seems that 3.975 ghz doesn't lock screen, but 4.0 will lock it after an hour or less. Any settings I should try changing to stabilize this? Already tried increasing and decreasing vsoc, no changes.


Try less or more vddp ( not cldo vddp ).

Use .02 increments. Its that sensitive.

Can also try pll up or down. Less = less heat.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Those seem high. Do you have airflow on the RAM?


The only 99C i see in the screenshot is the max temperature of the CPU VRM. I have an MSI board and its VRM sensors are extremely glitchy to me, wouldnt rely on them except for the most consistent readings it gives out. Even the asrock board that I have, while showing more consistent values, sometimes throws random values under high loads.

I don't see any RAM temperature sensors there. RAM temperature is probably ok since I have zero fans in my system and the most extreme temperature I've seen is 61C on the hottest module during an RAM overvolt experiment while running HCI memtest. (your hwinfo should show 1 temperature sensor for each ram module, if they even have temp sensors)


----------



## ChronoBodi

So apparently, all the PCI-E SSDs works at full speed on my TR rig, just don't use ATTO DISK, not the most accurate SSD benching program.

Also installed a 1TB SM961, works at full speed too.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Try less or more vddp ( not cldo vddp ).
> 
> Use .02 increments. Its that sensitive.
> 
> Can also try pll up or down. Less = less heat.


So i'm on the gigabyte board. Is vddp the one that's generally set to 1/2 of ram voltage? I currently have that set to 1/2 + one notch higher.

Also which one is pll?


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Try less or more vddp ( not cldo vddp ).
> 
> Use .02 increments. Its that sensitive.
> 
> Can also try pll up or down. Less = less heat.


What is VDDP default? Seems to be 0.9 on my asrock board.

@happyluckbox, it's not a RAM voltage. I looked up pictures of gigabyte BIOS. VDDP is probably "CPU SOC SB Voltage" and PLL is probably "CPU VDD18". chew* can confirm probably though. Heres a picture.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> What is VDDP default? Seems to be 0.9 on my asrock board.
> 
> @happyluckbox, it's not a RAM voltage. I looked up pictures of gigabyte BIOS. VDDP is probably "CPU SOC SB Voltage" and PLL is probably "CPU VDD18". chew* can confirm probably though. Heres a picture.


Did some cross referencing and I believe that CPU VDD18 is likely PLL. I undervolted it from 1.82 to 1.76, and am running another stability test.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> 4.1Ghz seems to be difficult for me to obtain. Realbench is failing at VCore 1.37v still with 1.35 on Soc with a LLC of 8 (Zenith Extreme)
> 
> Anyone else have suggestions ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.35 on soc... stop that crap right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.2 is the hard limit on soc go over at your peril(as Scooby do would say)
> 
> turn off core enhancements
> try 1.1 on soc
> lvl8 on the asus didn't even know it had that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> try level 1 or 2
> dial in 1.35vcore test boot
> run cpuz bench as a quick and dirty bench
> if it passes try realbench 2.54
> if it fails try 1.38
> my guess is firstly the soc is way to high.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Nice, Noob question what are Pstates ? Not played with those yet.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> power states
> you know how chips go up and down in speed and voltage that Is what pstates are.
> 
> if you look around you should find a guide on how to do pstates they are the same method as on the ryzen
> but one thing only change the speed in the first top psate not the voltage
> change the voltage in advanced to offset and work out what you need.
> 
> if you do pstates though boot to stock settings first or the offset will be wrong.
> 
> at a quick thing 0.235 is about 1.35 on the 1950x but I would start off at like .01875 4 gig (A0) then work up from there once you know what the voltage is.
Click to expand...

Cheers bud,

Odd thing is the internet did me an injustice as I definately saw a reputable source state 1.35 for SOC, I definitely didnt confuse that with VCORE. Anyway I will try those settings later for sure


----------



## TheGovernment

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Cheers bud,
> 
> Odd thing is the internet did me an injustice as I definately saw a reputable source state 1.35 for SOC, I definitely didnt confuse that with VCORE. Anyway I will try those settings later for sure


1.35 soc is what I use as well. It was reported on multiple sites as fine.


----------



## amigafan2003

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> 1.35 soc is what I use as well. It was reported on multiple sites as fine.


Any links? Because I've only ever seen 1.2v stated as the max, even from Asus reps.


----------



## Hydroplane

Still $880 for the 1950X on Newegg... definitely considering pulling the trigger.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amigafan2003*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *TheGovernment*
> 
> 1.35 soc is what I use as well. It was reported on multiple sites as fine.
> 
> 
> 
> Any links? Because I've only ever seen 1.2v stated as the max, even from Asus reps.
Click to expand...

Here: https://overclocking.guide/gigabyte-threadripper-overclocking-guide/

However my stability has increased massively by taking it to 1.1v


----------



## chew*

Based on the cb scores I would take that guide with a grain of salt.

3.9 = 3400 4.0 = 3500 4.1 = 3600

Lower denotes poor tuning imo/ cooling/throttle.

I can do there 4.1 results ( 3350 ) @ 3.8 just for reference and thats also @ 3200 like the testing claims.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Based on the cb scores I would take that guide with a grain of salt.
> 
> 3.9 = 3400 4.0 = 3500 4.1 = 3600
> 
> Lower denotes poor tuning imo/ cooling/throttle.
> 
> I can do there 4.1 results ( 3350 ) @ 3.8 just for reference and thats also @ 3200 like the testing claims.


how much would you charge to share settings? only getting 3497 @ realtime prio, 4.1. RAM @ 3333, about 80% tuned timings (though some rules violated, will fix later). UMA vs NUMA doesnt seem to make a difference (though >100000MB/sec in read, write, and copy AIDA on NUMA). We have the same board so should be straightforward.

could chip being too cold pose an issue? Coolant is 2 degrees C right now.


----------



## chew*

was not cold was not hot. was in spec temps wise.

3.8 gets me 3350s... between the 3.8 and 4.1 you can guess what my scores do @ 3.9 and 4.0

I'm on taichi. settings are posted in the taichi x399 thread.



Here I found a crappy 4 gig run.....even that broke 3500


----------



## ssateneth

Managed to get 3600 @ 4.1 on the dot, using some copypasta from the asrock thread. But it needed 3333 on RAM, 1T and GDM off to achieve. A lot of my timings were already the same or super close, but the BGS and BGSA settings are significant changes (and took a while to find! asrock put them in a better spot already!).

I can probably get a teeny bit further from here. Chip is much more capable than 4.1, can see 4200, 4250, maybe play with 4300 at low coolants.


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Managed to get 3600 @ 4.1 on the dot, using some copypasta from the asrock thread. But it needed 3333 on RAM, 1T and GDM off to achieve. A lot of my timings were already the same or super close, but the BGS and BGSA settings are significant changes (and took a while to find! asrock put them in a better spot already!).
> 
> I can probably get a teeny bit further from here. Chip is much more capable than 4.1, can see 4200, 4250, maybe play with 4300 at low coolants.


3626 CB, that's incredible. At the stock all core boost of 3.6 with all your other settings the same, you'd probably score around 3200.

(3.6/4.1)*3626 = 3184. It wouldn't perfectly scale like that, but just an estimate.

Tweaktown got a cb score of exactly 3184 for their 7960X (which also runs all cores at 3.6), so you've basically equaled the IPC of Intel. Not to mention the stock vs. stock performance of an $1800 chip. And the 7980XE which scores 3342 would only be 5% faster









Will be looking forward to seeing your chip hit 4.2-4.3, at that voltage looks like it's got room to grow.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Managed to get 3600 @ 4.1 on the dot, using some copypasta from the asrock thread. But it needed 3333 on RAM, 1T and GDM off to achieve. A lot of my timings were already the same or super close, but the BGS and BGSA settings are significant changes (and took a while to find! asrock put them in a better spot already!).
> 
> I can probably get a teeny bit further from here. Chip is much more capable than 4.1, can see 4200, 4250, maybe play with 4300 at low coolants.


Glad the settings worked and actually boosted performance for you


----------



## ssateneth

On the topic of pushing my chip, I figured I should check what the voltage curve is like for this CPU at high frequencies. I'm running LinX 0.8.0 w/ AMD patch for now, which seems to reliably pick up instability (looks like i'll need to work on 3333 RAM speed later since 3333 causes slightly different residuals every now and then, but not big enough to cause LiNX to think there was an error).

So I started with 4.1GHz @ 1.3v with no LLC (maximum vdroop, goes down to about 1.23v under severe load) and, well, it's not throwing any errors at all; this chip is completely content at low voltage. I plan on getting a full curve done from 4.1 onwards at 25MHz steps.

LinX is super good at causing power consumption. I've NEVER seen power go that high before. I normally idle around 140 watts. I did a run with 4.2GHz @ 1.5v and strong LLC, power at the wall shot up to -730- watts!





















I thought that would only be seen on the intel 7980XE. Just have to use the right application it seems. (BTW it did not crash or shut off, just kept on churning forwards. Die temp hit 80C with 3C coolant used, so the heat is definately there)


----------



## chew*

You will find as I did on phase change Ryzen scales more with cold then voltage.

My r5 1400 does 4050 on water 4300 on phase no touching volts. More volts actually makes it less stable.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> You will find as I did on phase change Ryzen scales more with cold then voltage.
> 
> My r5 1400 does 4050 on water 4300 on phase no touching volts. More volts actually makes it less stable.


Neat, thanks for the info. Maybe this little tidbit explains why my chip hates RAM voltage higher than 1.37 BIOS.


----------



## chew*

Some chips hate high vdimm and cold can aggravate the fabric.

-35 is enough to downgrade many a chips imc to 2666.


----------



## YonnyMestampo

4.175Ghz


This was at 4.2Ghz

1.43V in bios with load line calibration at 1. 1.45V in Windows.


----------



## YonnyMestampo

Let me do this properly. XD


----------



## YonnyMestampo

Now with tight vcore because I found the CPU to be limited by clock, no matter what voltage I use it won't be stable above 4.150Ghz.



Max temps 67ºc
Min temps 27ºc
Max vcore 1.408

By the way, this is with the Enermax Liqtech TR4 360.

I also have a Corsair H110i GTX that can't cope with the 1950x even at stock clocks. The cold plate isn't big enough for this socket.
The CPU throttles just after one minute testing at around 83 to 86ºc.
Since I have the Enermax TR4 temps are completely under control, I could go as high as I want with voltage and it won't go above 75ºc even at 1.46v which is too much for these clocks. Because I found the best to leave it at 1.4v and 4.150Ghz.


----------



## YonnyMestampo

This is at 3.4Ghz and 0.632v for 24/7 use, silent mode on the fans. You barely hear there is a monster CPU inside.



Whenever I anticipate I need to render large projects I just go into the 4.150Ghz profile in the bios and that's it.


----------



## nycgtr

So i found this quite surprising. I am using the XSPC block in a dedicated cpu loop. I was getting 72 @ 4ghz and 1.329 volt after running prime small for an hour. I was using a 360 gts for this loop, I swapped it to a 480 gts the increase of 120mm netted me a 4c drop running prime small for the same time period in the same conditions and fan curve. Didn't expect such a change as I thought anything past a 360 wasn't going to do much outside of margin of error.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Try less or more vddp ( not cldo vddp ).
> 
> Use .02 increments. Its that sensitive.
> 
> Can also try pll up or down. Less = less heat.


Chew, do you know which one is vddp? Is it the cpu soc sb voltage for gigabyte in the picture posted earlier?

Alreadt tried undervolting and overvolting pll down to 1.7 and up to 1.9 with no effect.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Chew, do you know which one is vddp? Is it the cpu soc sb voltage for gigabyte in the picture posted earlier?
> 
> Alreadt tried undervolting and overvolting pll down to 1.7 and up to 1.9 with no effect.


"CPU SOC SB Voltage"


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YonnyMestampo*
> 
> Now with tight vcore because I found the CPU to be limited by clock, no matter what voltage I use it won't be stable above 4.150Ghz.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Max temps 67ºc
> Min temps 27ºc
> Max vcore 1.408
> 
> By the way, this is with the Enermax Liqtech TR4 360.
> 
> I also have a Corsair H110i GTX that can't cope with the 1950x even at stock clocks. The cold plate isn't big enough for this socket.
> The CPU throttles just after one minute testing at around 83 to 86ºc.
> Since I have the Enermax TR4 temps are completely under control, I could go as high as I want with voltage and it won't go above 75ºc even at 1.46v which is too much for these clocks. Because I found the best to leave it at 1.4v and 4.150Ghz.


Hows this for air cooling













Unfortunately ambient's too high to do a Gooseberry run with current settings


----------



## Hydroplane

3500+ at 4 GHz, nice


----------



## ASDIC

Hello, i have a question.

why my 1950X stays at 3.5 Ghz and dosent boost to 4.0-4.1.
Under load max temps are 55 C with Noctua U14S cooler and excellent airflow. Do i need to actiavte something on the Ryzen Master ? or through BIOS ? Cinebench score is 2988. I got my system 2 days ago and i jsut noticed.
Mother board is ASUS ROG X399-E.

i used HWinfo for 45mins and max frequency was 3.5 Ghz under load.

Any clues ?


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ASDIC*
> 
> Hello, i have a question.
> 
> why my 1950X stays at 3.5 Ghz and dosent boost to 4.0-4.1.
> Under load max temps are 55 C with Noctua U14S cooler and excellent airflow. Do i need to actiavte something on the Ryzen Master ? or through BIOS ? Cinebench score is 2988. I got my system 2 days ago and i jsut noticed.
> Mother board is ASUS ROG X399-E.
> 
> i used HWinfo for 45mins and max frequency was 3.5 Ghz under load.
> 
> Any clues ?


First check you've updated the BIOS to the latest 801 BIOS and the Aura Firmware to 1.00.13.

In the BIOS you need to activate the two enhanced frequency options to allow the full XFR range. The other issue is if you set a static Voltage for the CPU, it will not use XFR as it doesn't have voltage control any longer.


----------



## nycgtr

Pretty much backed my claims as they stated in their review.

https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/30/ek_supremacy_evo_threadripper_tr4_waterblock_review


----------



## chew*

Nice. Its always good to see blocks tested on same cpu and same setup.

Brings light to whats really going on...

Same when testing vrm. You can easily influence results with a lower leakage part...

Now we know.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Pretty much backed my claims as they stated in their review.
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/30/ek_supremacy_evo_threadripper_tr4_waterblock_review


Bits power or nothing for mono blocks on TR4 then.

Still waiting on if they make one for the Taichi. Hopefully they do.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Pretty much backed my claims as they stated in their review.
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/30/ek_supremacy_evo_threadripper_tr4_waterblock_review


If your in contact with kyle still tell him i will loan out a lapped bykski as imo the machining on it was rather poor. Fairly certain it will do better.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> If your in contact with kyle still tell him i will loan out a lapped bykski as imo the machining on it was rather poor. Fairly certain it will do better.


I can try to. Do you have any contact info I should refer him to?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Bits power or nothing for mono blocks on TR4 then.
> 
> Still waiting on if they make one for the Taichi. Hopefully they do.


Their msi one just dropped so might be in the works. However, I've yet to see clear pictures of their cold plate fin layout but the size doesn't appear that large either.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Their msi one just dropped so might be in the works. However, I've yet to see clear pictures of their cold plate fin layout but the size doesn't appear that large either.


Yeah, but somehow I feel like I'm more inclined to give bp a chance. I should probably just lap my byski block and add my own MOSFET block and call it a day though.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Pretty much backed my claims as they stated in their review.
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/30/ek_supremacy_evo_threadripper_tr4_waterblock_review


Nice nycgtr!, well I think i still going to be running the EK one because for one I pay less than any of those blocks, two it looks nice to me and three I am not planning to OC my CPU at all so I have no used for high performance block. I am trying to keep the system cold and quiet as much as possible.







. The XSPC looks nice and won't mind trying it out but I think if EK really notice how bad is causing their block not to cool wheel. They may release a new version of that center piece to put on the same bracket I believe.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Nice nycgtr!, well I think i still going to be running the EK one because for one I pay less than any of those blocks, two it looks nice to me and three I am not planning to OC my CPU at all so I have no used for high performance block. I am trying to keep the system cold and quiet as much as possible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . The XSPC looks nice and won't mind trying it out but I think if EK really notice how bad is causing their block not to cool wheel. They may release a new version of that center piece to put on the same bracket I believe.


Maybe but that would be admitting fault to their original so who knows. I don't know if they'd be wiling to ship a replacement plate to owners as that hurts the bottom line but would help their reputation. The EK mindshare is strong but they do need to be held to a standard they set themselves. See as their monoblock has the same plate don't think they care that much.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Maybe but that would be admitting fault to their original so who knows. I don't know if they'd be wiling to ship a replacement plate to owners as that hurts the bottom line but would help their reputation. The EK mindshare is strong but they do need to be held to a standard they set themselves. See as their monoblock has the same plate don't think they care that much.


All of this is telling me I must not have had good contact, which is odd because I installed three different times. Will try again and double-check the posts on my Taichi.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> All of this is telling me I must not have had good contact, which is odd because I installed three different times. Will try again and double-check the posts on my Taichi.


are you talking about the xspc block? There may be some qa issues. I had one block where the finish was bad so I sent it back. On another block it went down a little awkward onto the mounting posts, I had to loosen all 4 posts just to get it on, then re-tighten.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Maybe but that would be admitting fault to their original so who knows. I don't know if they'd be wiling to ship a replacement plate to owners as that hurts the bottom line but would help their reputation. The EK mindshare is strong but they do need to be held to a standard they set themselves. See as their monoblock has the same plate don't think they care that much.


All I know is that EK customer service was amazing helping me with some issues back then with a D5 pump. I at the moment stand by their side since I had always had really good advice, support, and help from their HQ or EK Hardware Reps in this forum. I guess once I have the parts here on Friday, this weekend I can work in putting it all together and doing a few test to see if I can live with it or not since I am not overclocking like everyone else. I plan to run stock for a good while.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> are you talking about the xspc block? There may be some qa issues. I had one block where the finish was bad so I sent it back. On another block it went down a little awkward onto the mounting posts, I had to loosen all 4 posts just to get it on, then re-tighten.


Yes, sorry. I had terrible temps using the XSPC block and better using the EK block. I also couldn't get the block to slide down the rails when they were on and had to wiggle it all over. I found after I reinstalled the EK block that the XSPC mounting posts were loose, so wondering if that was the problem? Thermal material definitely made contact on the chip, but temps skyrocketed on Small FFTs.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Yes, sorry. I had terrible temps using the XSPC block and better using the EK block. I also couldn't get the block to slide down the rails when they were on and had to wiggle it all over. I found after I reinstalled the EK block that the XSPC mounting posts were loose, so wondering if that was the problem? Thermal material definitely made contact on the chip, but temps skyrocketed on Small FFTs.


Sounds like not complete contact.


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Pretty much backed my claims as they stated in their review.
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/30/ek_supremacy_evo_threadripper_tr4_waterblock_review


yeah but
they are using 1.439 to get 4 gig
that has to be the worse chip I have ever seen to need that much juice.
so unless the tests are exactly the same as in run the same voltages they do then it is not an even test (not their testing I mean putting that against other testing from other people)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Nice nycgtr!, well I think i still going to be running the EK one because for one I pay less than any of those blocks, two it looks nice to me and three I am not planning to OC my CPU at all so I have no used for high performance block. I am trying to keep the system cold and quiet as much as possible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . The XSPC looks nice and won't mind trying it out but I think if EK really notice how bad is causing their block not to cool wheel. They may release a new version of that center piece to put on the same bracket I believe.


if you are look at the review and the fat they turned it sideways (which I had no idea you could do







)
might be worth a little thermal paste to do stock test and then sideways test, does not make a lot of sense why its better but hey if it can cool that chip using enough juice to light a stadium with sideways being better then yeah why not.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Pretty much backed my claims as they stated in their review.
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/10/30/ek_supremacy_evo_threadripper_tr4_waterblock_review


what voltage did you use for your big temps?

as for the radiator you have seen my results with a 420 so with the xspc I think more rad the merrier it seems to push through faster than the ek did(it *felt* restricted)


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> yeah but
> they are using 1.439 to get 4 gig
> that has to be the worse chip I have ever seen to need that much juice.
> so unless the tests are exactly the same as in run the same voltages they do then it is not an even test (not their testing I mean putting that against other testing from other people)
> if you are look at the review and the fat they turned it sideways (which I had no idea you could do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> might be worth a little thermal paste to do stock test and then sideways test, does not make a lot of sense why its better but hey if it can cool that chip using enough juice to light a stadium with sideways being better then yeah why not.
> what voltage did you use for your big temps?
> 
> as for the radiator you have seen my results with a 420 so with the xspc I think more rad the merrier it seems to push through faster than the ek did(it *felt* restricted)


I updated the rad for the cpu to a 480 this weekend. Did seem to drop a few degrees on the water temp. It does dump more heat into the loop than ek for sure. I was using 1.329 on one and the 1.35v on the other.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I updated the rad for the cpu to a 480 this weekend. Did seem to drop a few degrees on the water temp. It does dump more heat into the loop than ek for sure. I was using 1.329 on one and the 1.35v on the other.






yeah your settings are much closer to mine than hard ocp.
mine are 1.3 for 4gig and 1.35 for 4.1 so in my opinion huge volts= HUGE temp gains.
but would a bigger rad helped your ek? no idea I have only had the one rad so I,m not much use there


----------



## happyluckbox

So I'm trying to run HCI Memtest, but I'm having an issue. So for some reason each instance can only allocate a maximum of 2667mb of ram. Since I have 128gb of ram, this means I would have to run ~ 40-44 instances of HCI memtest to cover 90-99% of my ram.

But since the 1950x only has 32 threads, will this be a problem?


----------



## chew*

Just run the max allowed with 32 threads.


----------



## gtbtk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> Oh learn something else new.
> 
> I'm sure that I have seen some reviews that said they were wired x16 for all slots. They were obviously wrong. Just goes to show that GPU-Z is not actually as real time/hardware lookup as people maybe assume it is. If the connectors are physically not there then GPU-Z is telling you fibs
> 
> 
> 
> No, you have not seen that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All tr mb is 16-8-16-8 atm. My x399 asrock fatality pro is the same
Click to expand...

I accept that I was wrong.

I remember it was in the dialog of one of the video reviews that I saw. The review was wrong or only referring to the size of the slots and I misunderstood the remark. Sorry for the misinformation


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gtbtk*
> 
> I accept that I was wrong.
> 
> I remember it was in the dialog of one of the video reviews that I saw. The review was wrong or only referring to the size of the slots and I misunderstood the remark. Sorry for the misinformation


I was wondering the same thing, since I wanted a motherboard where I could put GPUs in different places and always run 16/16. All X399 mobos have two x16 slots, the rest x8. You can tell if you look at a picture of the back of the mobo, the x16 slots are longer:


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Just run the max allowed with 32 threads.


Restarting my computer somehow allowed me to run 3104mb per thread. Currently running 32 threads at 3104mb, for roughly 102/120gb of ram used. The computer is running very slow/unresponsively. It this normal?

Also, is it ok to run more than 32 threads in order to get up to 95%+ of ram usage?


----------



## chew*

No dont exceed actual threads.

Sluggish normal.

Be prepared going to take a day or so for 2000%


----------



## ssateneth

So, running some linpack stuff to get a voltage curve going. Dont think I was as thorough with 4100 and 4125, could probably redo it tomorrow. No LLC used.

4100MHz - 1.2875v
4125MHz - 1.3125v
4150MHz - 1.3875v
4175MHz - 1.4125v
4200MHz - 1.45v

I noticed that if RAM wasnt completely stable, I would get very large differences in residuals (in the order of 12 magnitudes). Otherwise CPU instability had some minor rounding errors (Very small difference in residuals, such as 1.527754e-009 vs 1.456600e-009, not enough for LinX to think there was an error), or just a flat out CPU lockup.

Have to say, power consumption at these speeds and voltage is scary. On 4200 @ 1.45v (Droop to 1.375v), CPU package power went from ~47 watts to over 420 watts (though die temperature is still comfortable at 70.8C peak). Limiting part at this point seems to be VRM. It peaked to 99C with gratuitous airflow. Power at the wall goes from 140 watts idle to 630 watts load.

Anywho, a 4200MHz shot. 3678 cb score.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> yeah your settings are much closer to mine than hard ocp.
> mine are 1.3 for 4gig and 1.35 for 4.1 so in my opinion huge volts= HUGE temp gains.
> but would a bigger rad helped your ek? no idea I have only had the one rad so I,m not much use there


Well i had a 360 attached to it on 1 build and 480 on another. That's more than enough imo. I still have the plexi one in possession. I will do a test with it when I take my board out for the monoblock.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> No dont exceed actual threads.
> 
> Sluggish normal.
> 
> Be prepared going to take a day or so for 2000%


Why not? Is it more prone to erroring if you exceed? I just want to replicate my solving software, which often runs 95% of ram.

Without exceeding 32 threads I can only get about 75% of ram loaded ~ 100/128gb


----------



## chew*

Out of curiousity....our program is dumb exceeds 64gb ram and pukes. Fails task but app does not crash.

Sure your not just spiking and running out?

No clue how windows or app would allow that.... Its just silly dumb.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Out of curiousity....our program is dumb exceeds 64gb ram and pukes. Fails task but app does not crash.


Wait what? Out of curiosity?... I don't understand what you are trying to say.

I was wondering why exceeding 32 threads is bad.


----------



## chew*

Its the same as running wprime with 20 threads or 40. It does not hit the cpu right scores lower thus less stress.

I was brainstorming....peak out ram useage apps crash...its as simple as that. Why winblows or an app could or would allow that to happen is beyond me....but it clearly happens with our setup.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> yeah but
> they are using 1.439 to get 4 gig
> that has to be the worse chip I have ever seen to need that much juice.
> so unless the tests are exactly the same as in run the same voltages they do then it is not an even test (not their testing I mean putting that against other testing from other people)
> if you are look at the review and the fat they turned it sideways (which I had no idea you could do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> might be worth a little thermal paste to do stock test and then sideways test, does not make a lot of sense why its better but hey if it can cool that chip using enough juice to light a stadium with sideways being better then yeah why not.
> what voltage did you use for your big temps?
> 
> as for the radiator you have seen my results with a 420 so with the xspc I think more rad the merrier it seems to push through faster than the ek did(it *felt* restricted)


The bad chips are the best to test stuff on...allows you to hit breaking points temps wise power draw wise.

The key is to keep testbed identical with only 1 variable changed and nothing else...

Once you change a variable you need to go back and redo it all over...for instance now i am playing with rad/pump variables on a specific block that I already have data on.

Once i see a change for better...all 4 blocks I have get retested on that same cpu and mobo setup on same pump/rad.

What joe gets on his ek or john gets on his xspc or jack gets on his enermax means squat...neither john, joe jack have my cpu and each cpu is unique silicon.

The only way john jack or joe become relevant to equasion is when they shove there block on my testbed.


----------



## Bartouille

Just started testing my 1950x, temps look ok? Keep in mind this is a 120mm aio


----------



## ssateneth

you're only running stock speeds, looks fine to me.


----------



## Bartouille

Yeah. I think it's gonna remain stock until I get a better cooling solution.


----------



## ssateneth

@chew have you figured out how to get TR to work with pstates consistently? Since I got my clock speeds dialed in, I wanted to see if I could get some (meager) power savings set in. While there is room for 8 pstates, it doesn't seem to respect some of the lower pstates that I've set, or i've set them incorrectly. I'm getting some really weird core multipliers like 33.6 and 31.2. The ratio steps seem to be 42 > 39 > 36 > 33.6 > 31.2 with voltages only going 1.45 > 1.2 > 1.1 and thats it. The voltages seem respected somewhat. I can't remember exactly the setup I made, but it was something like 42 > 39 > 36 > 32 > 26 > 20 > 16 > 12 with voltages 1.45 > 1.2 > 1.1 > 1 > 0.85 > 0.75 > 0.65 > 0.6. I left alone the core voltage up top and the core voltage towards the bottom of OC tweaker.

Downclocking doesn't occur until I mess with windows power plan minimum CPU speed too, even if it was set correctly on on a prior reboot.

Anyways, I do say meager since the savings really do seem minimal going from 140 watts idle @ wall to 135 in the CPU's new, but bugged (?) idling state. Seems most of the CPU power is being used by the SoC which remains constant unless there is a lot of RAM read/write.


----------



## chew*

Alot of programs did not like the clocks bouncing around.


----------



## ssateneth

Mm, righto. I'll probably just leave it alone then and go full bore all the time. After all, not like I'm shooting this chip with 1.65v 24/7


----------



## chew*

I think i used 1.70 on an 1800x and beyond that it got really mad at me and that was @ -190.

That particular chip just no likey voltage I guess


----------



## happyluckbox

So it seems I am getting some errors on HCI memtest afterall. Just running 32 threads as you suggested, and I'll usually get 1 error or two around 1 hour in. This must be the reason for the crashes in the solving software I am using.

I think some of it may stem from the fact that I cannot set TCWL equal to CAS on the aorus 7 board. I can only set it to either 10 or 12....


----------



## chew*

Its certainly a possibility.

I hit this rig for a day(2000%) before i was satisfied.

More curiousity....if you pull 4 dimms does the twcl issue go away?


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Its certainly a possibility.
> 
> I hit this rig for a day(2000%) before i was satisfied.
> 
> More curiousity....if you pull 4 dimms does the twcl issue go away?


Haven't really tried. Running 64gb isn't really an option, as solving poker hands takes a massive amount of ram to analayze all the different bet sizes, ranges, runouts, etc. Having 128gb of ram gives me alot of flexibility that 64gb cannot.

I'm pretty sure downclocking the ram from 3060mhz to 2933mhz will solve the issue. Alternatively, I could also downclock cpu from 4.0 to 3.975 or 3.95, and that may help. (Seems to help alot in my software.)

Currently setting all my secondary timings to auto, see if that helps.


----------



## Sphere07

I am finally a member.

Yay


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Have to say, power consumption at these speeds and voltage is scary. On 4200 @ 1.45v (Droop to 1.375v), CPU package power went from ~47 watts to over 420 watts (though die temperature is still comfortable at 70.8C peak). Limiting part at this point seems to be VRM. It peaked to 99C with gratuitous airflow. Power at the wall goes from 140 watts idle to 630 watts load.


Nice memory bandwidth scores, can't quite match that with mine despite nigh on identical timings, I guess that is the SR DR difference. I guess the Taichi made no further headway with 3466 over the MSI?

I seem to pull quite a lot of power with my 1900X too, see temps similar to others too, you'd think it would be half a 1950X but that doesn't seem to be the case, its still quite high powerwise and I noticed once I added another highly clocked 1080Ti my machine would no longer pull high CPU overclock when stress testing, need to get my watt meter on it to check but I suspect my 1Kw Enermax PSU isn't cutting it.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Nice memory bandwidth scores, can't quite match that with mine despite nigh on identical timings, I guess that is the SR DR difference. I guess the Taichi made no further headway with 3466 over the MSI?
> 
> I seem to pull quite a lot of power with my 1900X too, see temps similar to others too, you'd think it would be half a 1950X but that doesn't seem to be the case, its still quite high powerwise and I noticed once I added another highly clocked 1080Ti my machine would no longer pull high CPU overclock when stress testing, need to get my watt meter on it to check but I suspect my 1Kw Enermax PSU isn't cutting it.


I am thinking of adding a second 1080 TI to my 1920X system and I also have a 1K Watt PSU (EVGA G3). Really hoping I don't need to buy a bigger one. Anyone else have a similar setup?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I am thinking of adding a second 1080 TI to my 1920X system and I also have a 1K Watt PSU (EVGA G3). Really hoping I don't need to buy a bigger one. Anyone else have a similar setup?


1920x with quad 1080 ti. I've found the 1920 can pull 220 ish watts at 4.075, and each GPU can pull 310-325W. With two cards that's 875W + Mobo, RAM and pumps. Unless you're shunt modded or on an XOC BIOS you should be fine.

I'm on a EVGA 1600 P2 and I run at 1260w GPU + 140W CPU + another 100 ish for the rest of the system while mining. If a larger PSU had been available I would have chosen it, but I didn't have a 220V UPS and didn't have space for 2 PSUs. As it is the PSU isn't objectionably hot and seems fine. I still miss my AX1500i but these Super flower evga units are solid.


----------



## sandysuk

It's all assumption from me at the mo, just an observation that I could no longer hold 4.2 stable with two GPUs in, loading it all up, more than it would hit in games to be honest, as cores wouldn't be loaded so hard, these Ti are clocked at 2.1Ghz and TR chip needs 1.46 for 4.2 which is quite high, along with 1.2SOC and 1.45 on the RAM @3466.

So it is all a bit tweaked.

I do have a watt meter though, I just need to remember where I've put it.

I would hope it is fine but if GPUs can pull 330w TDP and the chip is doing over its 180w TDP which I imagine it would then add in some for the board board and drives, there may not be a lot or margin.

My Tis are power limited at the moment and need a more aggressive BIOS, so more powah out of them at some point


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> It's all assumption from me at the mo, just an observation that I could no longer hold 4.2 stable with two GPUs in, loading it all up, more than it would hit in games to be honest, now these are clocked at 2.1Ghz with and my chip needs 1.46 for 4.2 which is quite high, along with 1.2SOC and 1.45 on the RAM @3466.
> 
> So it is all a bit tweaked.
> 
> I do have a watt meter though, I just need to remember where I left put it.
> 
> I would hope it is fine but if GPUs can pull 330w TDP and the chip is doing over its 180w TDP add in some for the board board and drives, there may not be a lot or margin.
> 
> My Tis are power limited at the moment and need a more aggressive BIOS, so more powah


I'm at 1.28-1.29 at 4.075 on my 1920x. Power consumption goes up exponentially with voltage so you could easily be in 250-300W territory on your CPU. You might want to consider a bigger PSU sooner rather than later.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Their msi one just dropped so might be in the works. However, I've yet to see clear pictures of their cold plate fin layout but the size doesn't appear that large either.


MSI X399 mono block??? Where?

I tried searching but can't find anything. You have a link? tnx!


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> MSI X399 mono block??? Where?
> 
> I tried searching but can't find anything. You have a link? tnx!


https://www.bitspower.com/html/product/pro_show.php?products_id=5415


----------



## SavantStrike

I wonder when the taichi version will become available, and if anyone here will try it. I don't have time to tear down my loop to try it if it doesn't turn out well.


----------



## Bartouille

lmao I buy 4x4gb 3733mhz to make sure it's b-die and I get d-die.







Hope I can get 3200 at least.

Edit: nvm looks like it's E-die. Also it's two dual channel kits.


----------



## Beatnutz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> https://www.bitspower.com/html/product/pro_show.php?products_id=5415


Tnx!

Wow thats great. I am SO getting it.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Beatnutz*
> 
> Tnx!
> 
> Wow thats great. I am SO getting it.


Post temps when you do. I'm still on the fence.


----------



## happyluckbox

Well, this sucks. HCI still giving me 1 or 2 errors after an hour with 128gb of ram oc'd to 3060mhz.

Even with all secondary timings set to auto. May have to set it to 2933mhz.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I'm at 1.28-1.29 at 4.075 on my 1920x. Power consumption goes up exponentially with voltage so you could easily be in 250-300W territory on your CPU. You might want to consider a bigger PSU sooner rather than later.


Dug out my meter, its not so bad for now, i probably can't push for much more.

Measured @ Wall socket, PSU is 90-91% efficient above 200w around 84% sub 200w.

Rounded to nearest 5w due to fluctuating. just some simple tests with Timespy Stress tests and prime. 1900X + 1080Ti SLI

Idle, 125w
Prime, 290w, Stock.
Prime, 360w, 4.175 @1.45
TimeS, 680w, all stock
TimeS, 775w, OC'd GPUs 2050/6
8T Prime+TimeS. 900w OC'd GPU and CPU

So it's quite power efficient really, my 290s would see me over 1k with much less performance.


----------



## Bartouille

Started overclocking a bit but I can't do much with this asetek 570lc as I'm already awfully close to 68c max. Is it the end of the world if you go above 68c? Seems like such a low limit... Where is this sensor placed? I know AMD always had way lower cpu temp limit than Intel, I just find it strange that on Intel you can go to 100c and on this 68c is max.









Mem is still 2133 haven't played with that just yet.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Started overclocking a bit but I can't do much with this asetek 570lc as I'm already awfully close to 68c max. Is it the end of the world if you go above 68c? Seems like such a low limit... Where is this sensor placed? I know AMD always had way lower cpu temp limit than Intel, I just find it strange that on Intel you can go to 100c and on this 68c is max.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mem is still 2133 haven't played with that just yet.


Just the nature of the beast. I have a very strong cooling solution so its difficult for me to get that high on temperatures. I've gotten to 85C Tdie though and not had a problem. (yeah thats 113C Tctl, but thats a useless number to me







)


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Just the nature of the beast. I have a very strong cooling solution so its difficult for me to get that high on temperatures. I've gotten to 85C Tdie though and not had a problem. (yeah thats 113C Tctl, but thats a useless number to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Good to know. Would also be nice to know why pretty much all ryzen cpu have 95c max and threadripper has 68c max. If I had to guess it's probably some measure to not melt aio pumps or something, kinda like 75c max on 295x2 vs 290x 95c max...


----------



## Hydroplane

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Dug out my meter, its not so bad for now, i probably can't push for much more.
> 
> Measured @ Wall socket, PSU is 90-91% efficient above 200w around 84% sub 200w.
> 
> Rounded to nearest 5w due to fluctuating. just some simple tests with Timespy Stress tests and prime. 1900X + 1080Ti SLI
> 
> Idle, 125w
> Prime, 290w, Stock.
> Prime, 360w, 4.175 @1.45
> TimeS, 680w, all stock
> TimeS, 775w, OC'd GPUs 2050/6
> 8T Prime+TimeS. 900w OC'd GPU and CPU
> 
> So it's quite power efficient really, my 290s would see me over 1k with much less performance.


That's a lot of juice for a 1900X lol. Nice clock speed though, getting that close to 4.2 is tough. I wonder if the 1900X is the best clocking of the Ryzen/Threadripper lineup.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Good to know. Would also be nice to know why pretty much all ryzen cpu have 95c max and threadripper has 68c max. If I had to guess it's probably some measure to not melt aio pumps or something, kinda like 75c max on 295x2 vs 290x 95c max...


Tctl has an artificial number added to it for threadripper (27), and X series Ryzen (was it 20 or 17?) in order to better accomodate XFR and fan curve. Tdie is derived from Tctl and has the artificial number removed


----------



## nycgtr

Heads up for those interested the in bitspower blocks out and ones that are coming. The fin array is 42mmx30mm.


----------



## chew*

Just thought I would share this info.

There is a correlation between pump power and stability even though temps are above 68C.

On my swiftech h320x I was locking up screen.

Now I am on a MCR 320 Drive rev 3 and can run prime even @ 4.0 no lockups.

For the most part the only difference between the 2 is less reservoir on the drive but way more head pressure and pump power.

So basically do not skimp on the pump and maybe even series them.

3x120 slim is still not enough for TR btw not if the goal is sub 68c..

This is on the bykski block so don't be afraid to feed it pump power.


----------



## Bartouille

Started playing around with memory, looks promising. Just a dirty oc with auto timings, very surprised it even booted.



I was running hci earlier with 3600mhz and it just froze, no errors tho. But I'm playing around with cpu oc too so it could be that...


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Started playing around with memory, looks promising. Just a dirty oc with auto timings, very surprised it even booted.
> 
> 
> 
> I was running hci earlier with 3600mhz and it just froze, no errors tho. But I'm playing around with cpu oc too so it could be that...


infinity fabric or IMC for sure. Even if you have RAM binned for 3600+, you can get RAM errors popping up or freezes like you encountered. Takes some playing around to figure out what the CPU is good for.


----------



## chew*

scores went up with the head pressure









Much easier to crack 3500 now do not even need mem speed up.



temps are not great but slim 3x120........

But its passing and no longer locking up. Needs more radiator and that's about it.

So a good pump like d5 or mcp 35x T lined Bykski and a double thick 3x120 = poor mans closed loop.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> scores went up with the head pressure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Much easier to crack 3500 now do not even need mem speed up.
> 
> 
> 
> temps are not great but slim 3x120........
> 
> But its passing and no longer locking up. Needs more radiator and that's about it.
> 
> So a good pump like d5 or mcp 35x T lined Bykski and a double thick 3x120 = poor mans closed loop.


This is interesting. I have a single 480 gts on the cpu loop now did see a minor improvement. Figured I might turn my dual loop to a single series loop to take advantage of all the rads in my build,


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Heads up for those interested the in bitspower blocks out and ones that are coming. The fin array is 42mmx30mm.


HardOCP showed 32.5x32.5 for the EK. So the EK has 1056.25 sq mm of fin area and the bits power has 1260 sq mm. The bits power has 20 percent more fin surface area.

More importantly than raw surface area, the bits power isn't square. The rectangular fin area means it should cover the dies. The 7 degree difference between the XSPC and the EK was too much, but this bits power could end up either splitting the difference or possibility competing with the Bykski. I'll get rough fin area data on the Bykski when I get home.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> HardOCP showed 32.5x32.5 for the EK. So the EK has 1056.25 sq mm of fin area and the bits power has 1260 sq mm. The bits power has 20 percent more fin surface area.
> 
> More importantly than raw surface area, the bits power isn't square. The rectangular fin area means it should cover the dies. The 7 degree difference between the XSPC and the EK was too much, but this bits power could end up either splitting the difference or possibility competing with the Bykski. I'll get rough fin area data on the Bykski when I get home.


7 is for the sideways mount which you can't do with the monoblock. It's 10 in normal intended layout. Maybe the monoblock is better by a bit but no one knows for now.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> infinity fabric or IMC for sure. Even if you have RAM binned for 3600+, you can get RAM errors popping up or freezes like you encountered. Takes some playing around to figure out what the CPU is good for.


Yeah I ended up backing off from 3600mhz. I'm already at 1.1v SOC and I tried increasing MEMVTT to 0.7v. Also tried 1.4v DRAM even though ram is rated at 3733mhz 17-19-19-39 1.35v and bios auto timings are looser than that. I think I'll settle with 3466mhz which seems to be working fine and start tightening those timings.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> 7 is for the sideways mount which you can't do with the monoblock. It's 10 in normal intended layout. Maybe the monoblock is better by a bit but no one knows for now.


Covering the active CPU dies should mean it's much better. It's got a lot of potential, especially when one factors in the nice cool MOSFET temps. For the users that have 90C+ MOSFETs getting those temps down should drop socket temps by a degree or two.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Just out of interest, is there a way to disable LLC or is it simply ''Auto'' I was hesitant to use LLC on SOC just incase it pushed it too far. I also have my memory stable at 3200Mhz, but with loose timings, what would be a good timing set to start from ?


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Just out of interest, is there a way to disable LLC or is it simply ''Auto'' I was hesitant to use LLC on SOC just incase it pushed it too far. I also have my memory stable at 3200Mhz, but with loose timings, what would be a good timing set to start from ?






set it to 4 or 5 (that's cpu at least I,m sure it should be the same for the rest)
on 3 I get a teeny boost on 4 or 5 it will be pretty even but 5 will droop a little)



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Good to know. Would also be nice to know why pretty much all ryzen cpu have 95c max and threadripper has 68c max. If I had to guess it's probably some measure to not melt aio pumps or something, kinda like 75c max on 295x2 vs 290x 95c max...






same 95 tctl = 68 tdie and it is the same for the ryzen, if you keep it under 68 all is golden above that you will start to see a degredation in performance. I saw the same thing on the 1800x I had.
get it to 78 degrees and you will be skating on thing ice and I believe 85 is bye bye land (tdie that is ignore tctl its stupid







)



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> scores went up with the head pressure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Much easier to crack 3500 now do not even need mem speed up.
> 
> 
> 
> temps are not great but slim 3x120........
> 
> But its passing and no longer locking up. Needs more radiator and that's about it.
> 
> So a good pump like d5 or mcp 35x T lined Bykski and a double thick 3x120 = poor mans closed loop.






those temps are pretty huge but you are putting a lot of juice in that thing for 4 gig.
more juice would also explain in part why your scores are higher I,m giving up a little performance for a lot of heat









might try cranking this setup up to the same 1.36 and see what difference it makes


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Just out of interest, is there a way to disable LLC or is it simply ''Auto'' I was hesitant to use LLC on SOC just incase it pushed it too far. I also have my memory stable at 3200Mhz, but with loose timings, what would be a good timing set to start from ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> set it to 4 or 5 (that's cpu at least I,m sure it should be the same for the rest)
> on 3 I get a teeny boost on 4 or 5 it will be pretty even but 5 will droop a little)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the insight, I am currently using LLC2 For the CPU and so far so good, but if I see issues I will raise it a level. As for SOC back on the standard Ryzens I saw people posting that LLC on the SOC had killed there mobo, one could argue they used the wrong LLC but I saw it a few times, guess it made me nervous so I disabled it on SOC for now.


----------



## Tonza

Ordered 1950X + ASUS ROG Zenith Extreme + 32GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB 3200mhz CL14 quad kit, cooling will be handled with Enermax liqtech 360 TR4, should be nice upgrade over 5820K which has served very well for years







(i need more cores for my editing work, and i game at 3440x1440, so the CPU will be very good for everything i do). Will post some results when i get the machine running, wonder if my seasonic P660W platinum will be okay.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tonza*
> 
> Ordered 1950X + ASUS ROG Zenith Extreme + 32GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB 3200mhz CL14 quad kit, cooling will be handled with Enermax liqtech 360 TR4, should be nice upgrade over 5820K which has served very well for years
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (i need more cores for my editing work, and i game at 3440x1440, so the CPU will be very good for everything i do). Will post some results when i get the machine running, wonder if my seasonic P660W platinum will be okay.


Nice build, your PSU However I would keep an Eye on. TR pulls a fair few watts especially when overclocked. That combined with the rest of the system and you GPU's may require an upgrade.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tonza*
> 
> Ordered 1950X + ASUS ROG Zenith Extreme + 32GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB 3200mhz CL14 quad kit, cooling will be handled with Enermax liqtech 360 TR4, should be nice upgrade over 5820K which has served very well for years
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (i need more cores for my editing work, and i game at 3440x1440, so the CPU will be very good for everything i do). Will post some results when i get the machine running, wonder if my seasonic P660W platinum will be okay.


You need a new powersupply lol.


----------



## Tonza

Im pretty sure overclocked 1950X and 1080ti will not be a problem for 660W platinum unit (which can withstand like nearly 800W load) in gaming atleast, but if the CPU and GPU is stressed 100% both, then it will be on edge of its limits, i am buying new one (was thinking 850W seasonic platinum or EVGA 850W gold), but cant get the PSU same time as rest of the parts.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tonza*
> 
> Im pretty sure overclocked 1950X and 1080ti will not be a problem for 660W platinum unit (which can withstand like nearly 800W load) in gaming atleast, but if the CPU and GPU is stressed 100% both, then it will be on edge of its limits, i am buying new one (was thinking 850W seasonic platinum or EVGA 850W gold), but cant get the PSU same time as rest of the parts.










You be surprised lol. I wouldn't want to be overloading my psu anyway if it did survive the load. Never cheap out on the psu my friend. My 5960x titan xp sli was pulling way over 1k with a mild oc. Which I found quite shocking. My Tr system is pulling more. But I got 1600 watt so I dont worry.


----------



## ITAngel

Are the CORSAIR Enthusiast Series PSU good? I am checking this for a friend however I am thinking of picking up the following PSU myself.

1. EVGA - SuperNOVA 850W G2
2. EVGA - SuperNOVA 850W G3
3. CORSAIR - RMi Series 850W
4. CORSAIR - HXi Series 850W

or

I may look at other units outside of those 3 listed.


----------



## The L33t

They are good but personally I would go for a Seasonic Prime series. Look it up.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> They are good but personally I would go for a Seasonic Prime series. Look it up.


would this one be okay?

https://www.amazon.com/Seasonic-Flagship-SSR-850PD-Platinum-Modular/dp/B01MT60QZO/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1509572981&sr=8-5&keywords=Seasonic+Prime+series


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> would this one be okay?
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Seasonic-Flagship-SSR-850PD-Platinum-Modular/dp/B01MT60QZO/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1509572981&sr=8-5&keywords=Seasonic+Prime+series


Yep, more than OK.

I have an 1000w gold, was quite the deal at the time and the extra 2% efficiency the platinum had was not worth the extra cost so I went with the gold prime model.

Review here: https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/08/23/seasonic_prime_1000w_gold_power_supply_review/


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> Yep, more than OK.
> 
> I have an 1000w gold, was quite the deal at the time and the extra 2% efficiency the platinum had was not worth the extra cost so I went with the gold prime model.
> 
> Review here: https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/08/23/seasonic_prime_1000w_gold_power_supply_review/


Nice! I guess my main thing is do I need 850 or 1000watt or can a 750 handle my system with water cooling?


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tonza*
> 
> Im pretty sure overclocked 1950X and 1080ti will not be a problem for 660W platinum unit (which can withstand like nearly 800W load) in gaming atleast, but if the CPU and GPU is stressed 100% both, then it will be on edge of its limits, i am buying new one (was thinking 850W seasonic platinum or EVGA 850W gold), but cant get the PSU same time as rest of the parts.


Pulling 500W+ with 3.9GHz on 1950X is easy. Add in a gfx card that boosts towards 400W under load and you have 900W system load...


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Nice! I guess my main thing is do I need 850 or 1000watt or can a 750 handle my system with water cooling?


Really depends on how far you will push your system. An overclocked 1920x pushed to its limits (overclocked) can reach 300w+ alone, your 1070 should be around 180w +/-. Add the remaining components and Id say you near 600/650W @ at the wall. So your PSU would suffice, now...most would not recommend you run a psu near it's limits. And take into account any future changes you make... if you had a vega card I would say upgrade the PSU now.... or an overclocked 1080ti.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L33tBastard*
> 
> Really depends on how far you will push your system. An overclocked 1920x pushed to its limits (overclocked) can reach 300w+ alone, your 1070 should be around 180w +/-. Add the remaining components and Id say you near 600/650W @ at the wall. So your PSU would suffice, now...most would not recommend you run a psu near it's limits. And take into account any future changes you make... if you had a vega card I would say upgrade the PSU now.... or an overclocked 1080ti.


I see good to know, for now my plan is not to OC since my CPU on auto hit 4.1Ghz and my GPU on auto hits 2.1Ghz. So no need to OC at the moment which give me time to grab a nice PSU on a deal date.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I see good to know, for now my plan is not to OC since my CPU on auto hit 4.1Ghz and my GPU on auto hits 2.1Ghz. So no need to OC at the moment which give me time to grab a nice PSU on a deal date.


These cpu at stock voltages are quite tame for such beasts... they only get mad hungry when you start pushing those voltages past 1.3v. So you are more than fine for now, no need for a PSU upgrade.

But if you can grab a deal on one of those primes...they are amazing for what they cost and stand by the warranty they have, 12 years..., Black Friday is incoming







by the way.


----------



## chew*

3.9 is the break even performance mark where it actually matches the single threaded random turbo scores and well exceeds the stock multithreaded performance.

All of our chips hit 4.1 to 4.2 for an instant....none sustain it however.

My suggestion. Is pay more attention to performance and way less to clock speed.

Fyi I can pull 400 watt with just 3.9 and under 1.30v.

Leaky chips run hot and eat more power.


----------



## pmc25

__ https://www.facebook.com/watercool/posts/1590915560965968



New Watercool TR4 blocks. Possibly a new king in town.

Re: the Bitspower & EK monoblocks for TR4 ... is there much use, given that the proximity of RAM slots on both sides prevent them from covering many components?


----------



## TheShowX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddmarlowe*
> 
> Hi everyone! I'm new here. I joined because I just built a 1950x rig, and am getting really poor performace from my CPU. Built a bunch of computers in the past, so this is not a new thing for me. Not sure if I am missing something in settings...or I just got a crap cpu...please any suggestions or help is welcome!
> 
> CINEBENCH
> 2738
> 
> PASSMARK
> 15865
> 
> Geekbench
> single 4064 multi 18999
> 
> Windows 7 Pro
> 1950x
> MSI X399 Carbon
> MSI 1080ti Duke OC
> 32gb gskill 2400
> corsair 115i water cooler
> seasonic 850 watt
> 
> Even OC to 3.9 I can barely squeeze out 19000 on passmark.
> 
> I really hope I am just stupid and missed something. I really don't want to have to send it back :-(
> 
> HELP!


How did you get win 7 on it. I slipstream the usb files for it on my laptop and used a usb but my ports still turn off


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Tonza*
> 
> Im pretty sure overclocked 1950X and 1080ti will not be a problem for 660W platinum unit (which can withstand like nearly 800W load) in gaming atleast, but if the CPU and GPU is stressed 100% both, then it will be on edge of its limits, i am buying new one (was thinking 850W seasonic platinum or EVGA 850W gold), but cant get the PSU same time as rest of the parts.
> 
> 
> 
> Pulling 500W+ with 3.9GHz on 1950X is easy. Add in a gfx card that boosts towards 400W under load and you have 900W system load...
Click to expand...

This...I have a 1300Watt PSU which I am now going to sell for a 1600Watt to give me extra breating room.

I have the 1950X at 4.1Ghz at 1.4v combined with 1080Ti in SLI.


----------



## happyluckbox

Really? I can't seem to break 330watts (hwinfo) on my 1950x.

Running at 4.0ghz around 1.38vcore peak.

How are you guys pulling 500watts especially at only 3.90ghz? What monitoring software are you using? I'm looking at hwinfo watts on total cpu package. Hovers around 270-330watts for me...


----------



## chew*

My peak last night @ 3.9 1.275 vcore was 409w during prime blend custom which is still running when I left.

@ 4.0 1.375 yesterday it was considerably higher.

4.0 is just to much of a chore to tame heatwise on a slim swiftech rad ( swiftechs a tad behind the curve rad performance wise but i like there innovation in other areas ).


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> My peak last night @ 3.9 1.275 vcore was 409w during prime blend custom which is still running when I left.
> 
> @ 4.0 1.375 yesterday it was considerably higher.
> 
> 4.0 is just to much of a chore to tame heatwise on a slim swiftech rad ( swiftechs a tad behind the curve rad performance wise but i like there innovation in other areas ).


Something must be really different with my threadripper 1950x then.

P95blend never breaks 330watts total package according to hwinfo...


----------



## rdr09

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Something must be really different with my threadripper 1950x then.
> 
> P95blend never breaks 330watts total package according to hwinfo...


My R5 1600 system shows 95W in HWINFO when running Cine15. Tripplite shows 153W. The monitor is on another UPS.

Edit: CPU + SoC Power 125W, Gpu GTX 1050 is 35W. Guess the total matches the UPS reading.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tonza*
> 
> Im pretty sure overclocked 1950X and 1080ti will not be a problem for 660W platinum unit (which can withstand like nearly 800W load) in gaming atleast, but if the CPU and GPU is stressed 100% both, then it will be on edge of its limits, i am buying new one (was thinking 850W seasonic platinum or EVGA 850W gold), but cant get the PSU same time as rest of the parts.


Never exceed rated power even on an excellent unit. It's a bad design and is hard on the entire system.

Your 1080 TI can easily draw 300-400 watts depending on the model. Your CPU can draw 300-350W with a moderate OC. That leaves no headroom for the HEDT motherboard.

750W is the smallest you should go for your system if you want to OC.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> My peak last night @ 3.9 1.275 vcore was 409w during prime blend custom which is still running when I left.
> 
> @ 4.0 1.375 yesterday it was considerably higher.
> 
> 4.0 is just to much of a chore to tame heatwise on a slim swiftech rad ( swiftechs a tad behind the curve rad performance wise but i like there innovation in other areas ).


During what phase of blend did you see those numbers? Also what version of P95? Personally I'm using 29.3 and with small fft the maximum I saw was around 220w at 1.2v, which results in about 1.144v after droop. That's at 3800mhz core and mem at 3466mhz. Going from 2133mhz to 3466mhz on mem added almost 40w for me.

If there is anything harder than small fft in prime 95 let me know. I'm starting to believe there is because everytime I run something that uses all the threads I get power numbers very close to my prime95. This was never the case on my 4770k, small fft power usage was always far beyond every other app (except maybe LINPACK







).


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Really? I can't seem to break 330watts (hwinfo) on my 1950x.
> 
> Running at 4.0ghz around 1.38vcore peak.
> 
> How are you guys pulling 500watts especially at only 3.90ghz? What monitoring software are you using? I'm looking at hwinfo watts on total cpu package. Hovers around 270-330watts for me...


My package only hits ~298W, however total system draw at the same time was ~470W. Add in a gfx card that can pull 300-400W on it's own (yes the1080Ti's can) and you have 800W+ system draw if you engage CPU and GPU's concurrently at 100%. Obviously thats a high ceiling and unlikely to be hit regularly, but it's a theoretical maximum that needs to be accounted for. SLI that and you are looking at 1200W+ too...

I'm running a Vega64 and that thing likes wattage. A lot. Single card under load sends my system up to 600-700W at the PSU. Core of the gfx card is around 290-340W depending on scene load. add another 40-60W for the rest of the card and boom 400W in highest scene. So 800W for Crossfire plus a CPU that eats wattage for breakfast, though not as much as a 7980XE


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> During what phase of blend did you see those numbers? Also what version of P95? Personally I'm using 29.3 and with small fft the maximum I saw was around 220w at 1.2v, which results in about 1.144v after droop. That's at 3800mhz core and mem at 3466mhz. Going from 2133mhz to 3466mhz on mem added almost 40w for me.
> 
> If there is anything harder than small fft in prime 95 let me know. I'm starting to believe there is because everytime I run something that uses all the threads I get power numbers very close to my prime95. This was never the case on my 4770k, small fft power usage was always far beyond every other app (except maybe LINPACK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ).


Im doing custom blends with 90% ish of ram allocated. No problems with 29.2 build 4


----------



## Bartouille

Best I can do so far with 3466MHz. Any other relevant timings other than tCL, tRCD, tRP, tRAS, tRC, tRDRDSCL, tWRWRSCL and tRFC? RAM is E-Die, tRCD and tRP kinda suck but that's as low as they will go.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> 
> 
> Best I can do so far with 3466MHz. Any other relevant timings other than tCL, tRCD, tRP, tRAS, tRC, tRDRDSCL, tWRWRSCL and tRFC? RAM is E-Die, tRCD and tRP kinda suck but that's as low as they will go.


Does it freeze at all during any activity? RAM errors? Used any ram error detecting program? (HCI, GSAT, memtest86 bootable USB [not memtest86+]). If not, what voltage sliders did you use? I'd like to do some copypasta to get 3466 working reliably on my board/chip.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Does it freeze at all during any activity? RAM errors? Used any ram error detecting program? (HCI, GSAT, memtest86 bootable USB [not memtest86+]). If not, what voltage sliders did you use? I'd like to do some copypasta to get 3466 working reliably on my board/chip.


Yeah I've ran HCI Memtest for about 150% no errors. 400mb per instance x 32 (I only have 16gb). SOC is on auto which seems to be 1.1v, DRAM is at 1.4v. Booting 3466 was never a problem for me, but to get it stable on HCI I have to use 2T or leave GDM at ON. ProcODT is at 60 Ohm. 3600MHz on the other hand boot loops a couple times and freezes during HCI, so it think this is a problem on the CPU side.

I'm gonna play with 3200 now. I saw you got 100mb/s on all read, write and copy with a very good latency, that's insane.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Yeah I've ran HCI Memtest for about 150% no errors. 400mb per instance x 32 (I only have 16gb). SOC is on auto which seems to be 1.1v, DRAM is at 1.4v. Booting 3466 was never a problem for me, but to get it stable on HCI I have to use 2T or leave GDM at ON. ProcODT is at 60 Ohm. 3600MHz on the other hand boot loops a couple times and freezes during HCI, so it think this is a problem on the CPU side.
> 
> I'm gonna play with 3200 now. I saw you got 100mb/s on all read, write and copy with a very good latency, that's insane.


I thought GDM = OFF is more stable and allows you to run 2T?


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> I thought GDM = OFF is more stable and allows you to run 2T?


Both GDM at off with 2T, or GDM at ON work for me. However GDM at off with 1T doesn't. Boots but HCI detects errors. I see a lot of folks running 1T without a problem tho, maybe it's easy on b-die. Still doesn't hurt to try 2T if it allows you to clock higher.

Are you able to boot at 3466mhz? If not it's probably a cpu related voltage thing. I think auto timings are already very loose. You might want to play with CLDO_VDDP, I haven't tried it yet but I probably will when I retry 3600mhz.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Both GDM at off with 2T, or GDM at ON work for me. However GDM at off with 1T doesn't. Boots but HCI detects errors. I see a lot of folks running 1T without a problem tho, maybe it's easy on b-die. Still doesn't hurt to try 2T if it allows you to clock higher.
> 
> Are you able to boot at 3466mhz? If not it's probably a cpu related voltage thing. I think auto timings are already very loose. You might want to play with CLDO_VDDP, I haven't tried it yet but I probably will when I retry 3600mhz.


haven't tried, as I am running 128gb of ram. I was able to get 4 sticks to boot at 3333mhz though.

Currently trying to stabilize 3060mhz at what I THOUGHT was stable, but turns out hci memtest is detecting 1-2 errors every hour or so.

I've tried just about everything and I can't seem to make the errors go away









At this point I'm about to give in and drop down to 2933mhz









Doesn't look like there's much information out there with regards to other users who have 128gb of ram either. It's unfortunate but I guess that most threadripper users are using their rig more casually and didn't need to go ham on ram like I did.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> haven't tried, as I am running 128gb of ram. I was able to get 4 sticks to boot at 3333mhz though.
> 
> Currently trying to stabilize 3060mhz at what I THOUGHT was stable, but turns out hci memtest is detecting 1-2 errors every hour or so.
> 
> I've tried just about everything and I can't seem to make the errors go away
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At this point I'm about to give in and drop down to 2933mhz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Doesn't look like there's much information out there with regards to other users who have 128gb of ram either. It's unfortunate but I guess that most threadripper users are using their rig more casually and didn't need to go ham on ram like I did.


Yeah ignore the 3466mhz part, I thought you were ssateneth.









Getting 128gb to clock high is probably very difficult. I wouldn't worry too much about it since you can compensate by lowering the timings. 2933MHz isn't too far off 3200Mhz anyway.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Yeah ignore the 3466mhz part, I thought you were ssateneth.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Getting 128gb to clock high is probably very difficult. I wouldn't worry too much about it since you can compensate by lowering the timings. 2933MHz isn't too far off 3200Mhz anyway.


Haven't tried tightening timings. Good idea. Would be nice if I can get down to cas 12 lol. wonder if I can get the tertiary timings down as well.


----------



## chew*




----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**






nicenudie shot of......


----------



## chew*

Deepcool TR waterblock


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Deepcool TR waterblock


An aio waterblock that out does EK lol. We really need to get some people with more high exposure to jump on this. Seeing as the monoblock which is crap is sold out. Yes I did buy one to bash it lol (somewhere in the hands of DHL right now)


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> An aio waterblock that out does EK lol. We really need to get some people with more high exposure to jump on this. Seeing as the monoblock which is crap is sold out. Yes I did buy one to bash it lol (somewhere in the hands of DHL right now)


I have a new Heatkiller TR block en route to add to the data mix....


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I have a new Heatkiller TR block en route to add to the data mix....


I Will be getting the heat killer as well. Bitspower did fix the shipping cost for me so I most likely going to get their monoblock as well.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I Will be getting the heat killer as well. Bitspower did fix the shipping cost for me so I most likely going to get their monoblock as well.


I got the all copper version, but they just announced this one today: Link


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> I got the all copper version, but they just announced this one today: Link


Looks like the bykski flip flopped using my diagram I made to naturally force air out.


----------



## chew*

heres my power draw and temps over the course of a couple days of prime


----------



## ITAngel

Well my build is done and using the system the way I wanted to use it is a much quiter system for sure. Temps were Min=24C, Max=44C, AVG=28C and that is with fans low on quiet standard mode. Is freaking quite compare to before. I have not tested anything major yet which I will do in the next few days if I am not busy with on-call.







Also note I am not overclocking this is all on auto mode default setup with the exception of curve fans. Only the CPU is water cooled not the GPU. Will post pictures tomorrow.


----------



## Kriant

Got contacted by Swiftech a few days back. They finally remembered that I've sent them multiple emails about my order....2 months later. Anyway, I'm getting the Apogee SKF TR block, so I guess I'll mess with it over the Thanksgiving, or next week, if I receive it by then and time permits.


----------



## ITAngel

Here is my current setup, did it last night. So far impress with the performance of the system.


----------



## trnewb

Is anybody overclocking their CPU with only one of the 8-pin EATX power connectors in use (Asus ROG Zenith Extreme)? I've got a Be Quiet! Straight Power 10 rated for 700W with only one of those connectors and the BIOS stops any attempt at booting if e.g. the 4Ghz overclocking profile is selected. I'am not planning on running any benchmarks/stress-tests while overclocked, but wanted to measure if compile times in Visual Studio (UE4) would benefit from constant 4 GHz vs 3.4 GHz + XFR.

On XFR (owning a 1950X): how often do your non-overclocked TR's hit 4.2 GHz - if they hit it at all? Highest I've reached where 4.19 Ghz while browsing overclock.net














While compiling a small-ish Visual Studio C++ project for ~40 seconds I see 1-3 cores hit 60-90% utilization but with clock speeds of around 3.6-3.7 Ghz. I thought XFR would boost clock speed of up to 4 cores to 4.2 GHz if the other 12 cores basically idle? The CPU temperature hovers around 30-40 degrees Celsius while compiling.

For fun I did the lighing build for zen garden in UE4 (see pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Unreal-Engine-4-16-CPU-Comparison-Skylake-X-Kaby-Lake-X-Broadwell-E-Skylake-Ryzen-7-984/) and the CPU destroyed everything from that link


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trnewb*
> 
> Is anybody overclocking their CPU with only one of the 8-pin EATX power connectors in use (Asus ROG Zenith Extreme)? I've got a Be Quiet! Straight Power 10 rated for 700W with only one of those connectors and the BIOS stops any attempt at booting if e.g. the 4Ghz overclocking profile is selected. I'am not planning on running any benchmarks/stress-tests while overclocked, but wanted to measure if compile times in Visual Studio (UE4) would benefit from constant 4 GHz vs 3.4 GHz + XFR.
> 
> On XFR (owning a 1950X): how often do your non-overclocked TR's hit 4.2 GHz - if they hit it at all? Highest I've reached where 4.19 Ghz while browsing overclock.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While compiling a small-ish Visual Studio C++ project for ~40 seconds I see 1-3 cores hit 60-90% utilization but with clock speeds of around 3.6-3.7 Ghz. I thought XFR would boost clock speed of up to 4 cores to 4.2 GHz if the other 12 cores basically idle? The CPU temperature hovers around 30-40 degrees Celsius while compiling.
> 
> For fun I did the lighing build for zen garden in UE4 (see pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Unreal-Engine-4-16-CPU-Comparison-Skylake-X-Kaby-Lake-X-Broadwell-E-Skylake-Ryzen-7-984/) and the CPU destroyed everything from that link


I am not sure about overclocking with just a single connector, I won't do it unless I have both CPU connectors to insure I have enough power going into it.







The only one I won't mind not having unless I have 2+ cards is the 6pin for the VGA on the motherboard. I believe worse case running only one connector is higher OC stability? Maybe?


----------



## chew*

Im not sure about ASUS but I know the Asrocks are unstable IMC wise without the 4 pin.

I could be wrong but I believe the 4 pin supplies power to SOC vrm explicitly and the 8 pin powers the vcore vrm on the Asrocks.

Btw last night I tested a 1200 model cpu on a noctua 120 mm air cooler...

Pretty much overkill and a half for a little 4c cpu. @ 1.40v with 4.0 oc with fan on high it hits 64c loaded.

Keep that in perspective before you believe anything sub 60c loaded overclocked on TR @ realistic ambients...a single die with no ht and 4 cores killed runs 64c....you can bet your azz TR water or not is going to run hotter.


----------



## trnewb

I did some furter testing and it seems like XFR isn't working as I've expected it to work. I would've thought that the following workload would be perfect for XFR 4.2:



Tiny wave of buyers remorse just hit me; then I remembered the gimped PCIE lane count and need for a RAID key on the X299 platform. Can't have everything it seems...

Thanks for your replies. Seems like a new PSU just made it's way onto the shopping list and I need to look into overclocking this beast.

EDIT: Ok, so overclocking with only one 8-pin 12V and the ROG Zenith 4 GHz profile works for my compilation example. Though for baking light (while OC'ed) on all 16 cores in Unreal Engine 4 I better wait for the new PSU before I fry the mainboard


----------



## chew*

It kind of bounces around alot. Seems to be hit or miss app dependant. Cb will actually try to use it but many apps will not thus why the push for about 3.9 which is about break even point.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trnewb*
> 
> I did some furter testing and it seems like XFR isn't working as I've expected it to work. I would've thought that the following workload would be perfect for XFR 4.2:
> 
> 
> 
> Tiny wave of buyers remorse just hit me; then I remembered the gimped PCIE lane count and need for a RAID key on the X299 platform. Can't have everything it seems...
> 
> Thanks for your replies. Seems like a new PSU just made it's way onto the shopping list and I need to look into overclocking this beast.
> 
> EDIT: Ok, so overclocking with only one 8-pin 12V and the ROG Zenith 4 GHz profile works for my compilation example. Though for baking light (while OC'ed) on all 16 cores in Unreal Engine 4 I better wait for the new PSU before I fry the mainboard





again it comes down to cooling and power delivery
don't feed it juice it ain't gonna perform run it to hot same thing.

I have to redo my whole epic folder after a screwup in transfers so when its done I,ll download 50 more gig of crap and do a lighting run for you at 4.025 gig and one at stock to see what xfr I get(other apps when I was running stock would be 3.67 and 4.15/4.2 , keep it under 68 or better yet close to 60 and you will squeeze the best out of it.

I,ll get back to you when I,m done.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trnewb*
> 
> Is anybody overclocking their CPU with only one of the 8-pin EATX power connectors in use (Asus ROG Zenith Extreme)? I've got a Be Quiet! Straight Power 10 rated for 700W with only one of those connectors and the BIOS stops any attempt at booting if e.g. the 4Ghz overclocking profile is selected. I'am not planning on running any benchmarks/stress-tests while overclocked, but wanted to measure if compile times in Visual Studio (UE4) would benefit from constant 4 GHz vs 3.4 GHz + XFR.
> 
> On XFR (owning a 1950X): how often do your non-overclocked TR's hit 4.2 GHz - if they hit it at all? Highest I've reached where 4.19 Ghz while browsing overclock.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While compiling a small-ish Visual Studio C++ project for ~40 seconds I see 1-3 cores hit 60-90% utilization but with clock speeds of around 3.6-3.7 Ghz. I thought XFR would boost clock speed of up to 4 cores to 4.2 GHz if the other 12 cores basically idle? The CPU temperature hovers around 30-40 degrees Celsius while compiling.
> 
> For fun I did the lighing build for zen garden in UE4 (see pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Unreal-Engine-4-16-CPU-Comparison-Skylake-X-Kaby-Lake-X-Broadwell-E-Skylake-Ryzen-7-984/) and the CPU destroyed everything from that link






ok only got the 4.15 editor at the moment still downloading 4.18 but opened epic garden and did a production lighting build

80 seconds but it came up with map errors...may be that I have a different editor than they used.
I will redo it when I get 4.18
nearly 100 percent usage and topped out at 55 degrees tdie @ 4.025 3466 15 15 15 ram
looking at that review...well yeah...see ya later








I,ll do some of the lower quality ones and do a package 64 as well.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Sanity check question that's been bugging me for a while. I have vcore set as 1.35v in the BIOS and HWInfo and CPU-Z are showing around 1.345v with vdroop. However, Ryzen Master is showing 1.55v which matches the CPU VID reported in HWInfo.

I'm good trusting CPU-Z and HWInfo @ 1.35v and not Ryzen Master @ 1.55v, right? I'm on a Taichi with 1920X. Thanks in advance.


----------



## chew*

Yah thats normal on taichi/fatality.

Basically on taichi we said screw amd and allowed full user control/voltage override over AMDs voltage. RM/hwinfo just does not realize this.

Only time it will be correct is @ defaults and not oced.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah thats normal on taichi/fatality.
> 
> Basically on taichi we said screw amd and allowed full user control/voltage override over AMDs voltage. RM/hwinfo just does not realize this.
> 
> Only time it will be correct is @ defaults and not oced.


Roger that. Many thanks sir.


----------



## Hydroplane

1950X back down to $880 on Newegg for the next two days... had it been that price yesterday I may not have been a 7980XE owner lol


----------



## Tonza

Put together yesterday 1950X, 32GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200mhz CL14, ASUS Zenith extreme build... Jesus was a chore, first when i started removing my intel X99 parts from Phanteks Enthoo Evolv, i noticed that the Zenith mobo probably wont fit (because the phanteks has some sort of "curve" on the cable management slots, and yes the mobo did not fit, was like 0,5cm too wide)... Anyway, needed to dremel the curved part off, no biggie, cannot be seen and i can sleep well at nights without thinking it







.... Got the system together and was first startup time, endless boot loop, fans spinning like in server room, rgb lights blinking, was a spectacular show... Was fighting against this for 30mins, until i tried the memory in black slots instead of grey, then it worked (never have had this kind of issue on any build)...

Anyway after all the hassle, updated drivers + bios, and went straight for overclocking, 1.35V first and 4ghz seems to be rock solid stable in my usage, tried 1.3V and that was stable too (Autopano Video Pro, 12x 4K video stitch, 100% CPU usage across all 16 cores / 32 threads), this particular program crahes system instantly (atleast my previous 5820K if OC was not stable). Tried also little bit of gaming and Cinebench, everything was fine. Maximum temp was 52C with Liqtech 360 TR4 (6x Corsair ML120´s as fans) when it was 1.35V, did not even check 1.3V temps, anyway happy with the setup, need to rip it more after i get back from work, so nice to fiddle with this monster setup (had last time AMD when Phenom II x6 was a thing) ;0. Only thing what bothers me is the Enermax cooler, its pump makes weird noises.


----------



## chew*

Phanteks


----------



## Aby67

Uhm
Looks like that the 1980XE is made for mathematics savvy.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Per Jakob from Watercool, the new Heatkiller TR4 CPU block's fin array "covers approx 35x55mm. The cooling structure itself comes from the Heatkiller IV block, with a slotwidth of 0.2mm."

How does that stack up against the EK and the XSPC blocks?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Per Jakob from Watercool, the new Heatkiller TR4 CPU block's fin array "covers approx 35x55mm. The cooling structure itself comes from the Heatkiller IV block, with a slotwidth of 0.2mm."
> 
> How does that stack up against the EK and the XSPC blocks?


Similar to the xspc. The ek is not even worth talking about.


----------



## chew*

TR is not as flat as some may think...





Picture on wall...in reflection.


----------



## SavantStrike

@chew*

Did you do before and after numbers on the Bykski block? I'm not sure I'm going to lap my CPU (real CPUs have curves right) but if you picked up a degree or two on the Bykski, that might be worth considering.


----------



## nycgtr

PSA:



Seems they at least they can acknowledge.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> @chew*
> 
> Did you do before and after numbers on the Bykski block? I'm not sure I'm going to lap my CPU (real CPUs have curves right) but if you picked up a degree or two on the Bykski, that might be worth considering.


I would highly suggest not voiding warranty on a $1k cpu.

I gained something just lapping the bykski but mine was pretty bad to start with. It was clear without lapping that mine was far from flat.

Mine were free so no warranty is covered so I figured what the hell lets see how flat ihs is. Worst case i kill it and use other one. So far it seems fine. Unsure of what I gained but i have data from previous prime run to compare avg temp against.

This is this particular systems last run on the bykski unless the phanteks impairs stability @ 3.9 on this chip.

After that I toss in a case and ship to my buddy then move onto my personal rig (fatality/1950,1920,1900x chips and 4x8gb 3600 )


----------



## SavantStrike

Didn't they deny the issue a week or so ago? The trust just isn't there at this point IMO.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Didn't they deny the issue a week or so ago? The trust just isn't there at this point IMO.


Well I got them saying they are looking into. It's really the community now that needs to keep the pressure going. The monoblock looks incredible just the performance sigh.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> PSA:
> 
> 
> 
> Seems they at least they can acknowledge.


That's a start.

I have high hopes for the Heatkiller block. Jakob mentioned they are sending (or maybe already have sent) a sample to HardOCP for review so we should have some direct comparisons to XSPC and EK.


----------



## chew*

Im more interested in results vs bykski since its identical in one way but different in many ways.

I prefer the black model...pondered plastdipping the bykski a few times already...


----------



## chew*

Fwiw btw ive gained about 2-3c changing from zinc white to mx2 (5kw). Another 2-3 lapping block. Another 2-3c lapping cpu. Another 2-3c with pump head pressure.

Sure more can be gained via radiator size/volume and better paste.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Fwiw btw ive gained about 2-3c changing from zinc white to mx2 (5kw). Another 2-3 lapping block. Another 2-3c lapping cpu. Another 2-3c with pump head pressure.
> 
> Sure more can be gained via radiator size/volume and better paste.


I've got all of those except the lapped CPU and block. I wish I had lapped my block as I could've directly compared my numbers to yours if I had.

What's the hottest VRM temp you've seen on your Taichi? I'm still toying with the idea of a universal MOSFET block over the VRMs and just letting the side heatsink stay bare (it's not cooling anything significant). I figure I'll upgrade the CPU block while I'm at it.


----------



## chew*

I got a small enermax fan silenx? Blowing on it. I can not hear it over the rad fans or pump. Highest is 70c in very warm prime load conditions. I do not feel it is much of a concern to waterblock it.

The phanteks is on now and guess what.

Its matching the bykski now and possibly beating it by a degree it seems.

Willing to bet the pump made all the difference for that block.

Heres basically how i am running prime 95.



Will likely shift it all into a case tomorrow. Test 1 last time. Hoping there is room to add one more 120mm rad. Have an EK and XSPC splitfin laying around collecting dust.


----------



## SavantStrike

70C really doesn't need water does it. I haven't broken 65C in all of my testing so far, so why do I feel like things won't be complete if my VRMs aren't under water. Hmmm.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> 70C really doesn't need water does it. I haven't broken 65C in all of my testing so far, so why do I feel like things won't be complete if my VRMs aren't under water. Hmmm.


I do not know what motherboard You are using, but 70C is hot.......sooner or later You will see the socket pins get cooked and the CPU in time will not clock at same high speeds as it used to when it was new.
70C is not catastrophic temp, but expect to lose around 30ish % less performance in 3 years from now. Another issue You might incur and this is why I mentioned about Your motherboard is that those VRMs will degrade in time if they run hot for extended periods of time.
A lot depends on the workloads You are going to be having Your PC engaged in,,,,if it is a once in a while 3 4 hour gaming session then its very light workload so not a big deal, but if You rendering for eg days in a row at full load with cache fully loaded then yeah,,,You will wanna have that whole CPU area very cool.
To be honest, I am waiting for a workstation class motherboard to jump into x399, but and I DO HATE TO SAY IT, i will this time opt to add a chiller....
I just really done with all the dust and hot room temps and CPU degradation and having to clean up stuff.
Ill just build system that is water cooled and requires no fans at all in the case...though it will require a lot of tinkering I must admit


----------



## chew*

A chiller full time use on this socket is just a recipe for disaster.

This coming from someone who has spent more time sub 0 on pcs than @ ambient in his entire life.

70c is hardly a concern especially for a board with no electrolytic caps anywhere near vrm. 70c peak is even less of a concern when its under prime loads only and 59c is the avg...

The socket pins nor cpu will not and have not showed any signs of concern...this from someone who has run prime 80% of the time the system is on since launch and before launch.

This is not clarkdale...

If you have had socket issues in the past and water chilled. Guess what...you just figured out your problem. Its called condensation.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> A chiller full time use on this socket is just a recipe for disaster.
> 
> This coming from someone who has spent more time sub 0 on pcs than @ ambient in his entire life.
> 
> 70c is hardly a concern especially for a board with no electrolytic caps anywhere near vrm.
> 
> The socket pins nor cpu will not and have not showed any signs of concern...this from someone who has run prime 80% of the time the system is on.
> 
> This is not clarkdale...
> 
> If you have had socket issues in the past and water chilled. Guess what...you just figured out your problem. Its called condensation.


Never used chillers before..I run dual 150 tdp xeons...I am actually thinking to stick a big Watercool Morah rad inside a big tank, and run the chiller to cool the water in the tank, only when under load to keep water temps at ambient..this should avoid dust issues.
Im Currently using two external EK 540 x180 rads and with Vardar fans at 100 % runs totally silent even if you stick your ear 1 inch near to them...im just done with dust and fans in the case.


----------



## chew*

I ran a virtually dust free setup in a Corsair 450D for about 7 years on water.

I now have a 750D but will need to be creative as apparently the higher end model skimps on bottom mounted dust screens.

A good case should easily manage dust however, I completely understand where you are coming from on that side of things.

Seems the companies are more concerned with RGB than just simple functionality these days.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> I do not know what motherboard You are using, but 70C is hot.......sooner or later You will see the socket pins get cooked and the CPU in time will not clock at same high speeds as it used to when it was new.
> 70C is not catastrophic temp, but expect to lose around 30ish % less performance in 3 years from now. Another issue You might incur and this is why I mentioned about Your motherboard is that those VRMs will degrade in time if they run hot for extended periods of time.
> A lot depends on the workloads You are going to be having Your PC engaged in,,,,if it is a once in a while 3 4 hour gaming session then its very light workload so not a big deal, but if You rendering for eg days in a row at full load with cache fully loaded then yeah,,,You will wanna have that whole CPU area very cool.
> To be honest, I am waiting for a workstation class motherboard to jump into x399, but and I DO HATE TO SAY IT, i will this time opt to add a chiller....
> I just really done with all the dust and hot room temps and CPU degradation and having to clean up stuff.
> Ill just build system that is water cooled and requires no fans at all in the case...though it will require a lot of tinkering I must admit


I was talking about 70C VRM temps, although in this case my CPU sees somewhere between 55-65C 24x7 load.

I can't get temps much lower without some kind of phase change or TEC. I wouldn't want to even try and seal the TR4 socket against condensation given how big it is either. I recommend you start with water that keeps you above dew point.

For reference this is what I'm using for cooling. Not including the 360+240mm internal rads, I'm running 9 Delta AFB1212H fans on that rad, and it could probably work for a small 4 cylinder engine. I needed to use aluminum u channel reinforcement to keep from bowing the case. Maybe I'll get around to a build log one of these days.


----------



## chew*

That is slightly bigger than my 3x120


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I was talking about 70C VRM temps, although in this case my CPU sees somewhere between 55-65C 24x7 load.
> 
> I can't get temps much lower without some kind of phase change or TEC. I wouldn't want to even try and seal the TR4 socket against condensation given how big it is either. I recommend you start with water that keeps you above dew point.
> 
> For reference this is what I'm using for cooling. Not including the 360+240mm internal rads, I'm running 9 Delta AFB1212H fans on that rad, and it could probably work for a small 4 cylinder engine. I needed to use aluminum u channel reinforcement to keep from bowing the case. Maybe I'll get around to a build log one of these days.


55 65 c at load its very good...I wish to add to what Chew stated above, that yeah there is not one single Computer case in the whole market that is engineered properly for decent workloads and made with true quality.
And no matter how hard We try at the end of the day radiators outside the case in a water box or any set up that is external is always million times better.
I do nto think in al honesty that Ill ever place a radiator inside a case ever again in MY live.


----------



## chew*

Bykski for Days



Phanteks for 4 hours and was bleeding air out of block still.



Basically the results will probably be identical and ambients are playing a roll here and I am cooling capacity limited at this point.

Most notable changes were the pump and lapping the blocks. I would say the Phanteks benefitted more from the mcp35x pump than the bykski but both saw gains.

Next up comparison will be my apogee drive X2 on the same pump rad setup ( so basically series mcp 35x ) versus the byski with series mcp 35x but on another CPU so a totally new set of data will need to be collected.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Bykski for Days
> 
> 
> 
> Phanteks for 4 hours and was bleeding air out of block still.
> 
> 
> 
> Basically the results will probably be identical and ambients are playing a roll here and I am cooling capacity limited at this point.
> 
> Most notable changes were the pump and lapping the block.


holy ****...You running 64 Gb or ram at those low timings? are You using 4 or 8 sticks? and do you think You got lucky?..
Can You kindly post what ram model You using and run and post a Vray benchmark maybe?!

https://www.chaosgroup.com/vray/benchmark

Id like to go for 3600mhz but would be good to know how it worked for You if u using dual quad channel ram


----------



## chew*

it's 4x16g and I am extremely well versed @ memory tuning however there is a bit of luck required on Ryzen.

The luck factor dictates more so what speed can be run not so much how well you can tune the timings.

Got a link to benchmark where I do not need an account?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> it's 4x16g and I am extremely well versed @ memory tuning however there is a bit of luck required on Ryzen.
> 
> The luck factor dictates more so what speed can be run not so much how well you can tune the timings.


that would be Gskill rated at 17 cas?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> I ran a virtually dust free setup in a Corsair 450D for about 7 years on water.
> 
> I now have a 750D but will need to be creative as apparently the higher end model skimps on bottom mounted dust screens.
> 
> A good case should easily manage dust however, I completely understand where you are coming from on that side of things.
> 
> Seems the companies are more concerned with RGB than just simple functionality these days.


I bought the DEMCflex kit for my 750D. It was 60 bucks but came with custom fitted filters for everything, even the little ventilated area over the rear fan. I dont have injection molding equipment so I guess 60 bucks is fair ish.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> That is slightly bigger than my 3x120


I should've lapped my block to see what performance is like with twin pumps and a lot of radiator surface area. I should've also done the 1950X instead of the 1920, but I didn't need it and it wasn't cheap at release.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> 55 65 c at load its very good...I wish to add to what Chew stated above, that yeah there is not one single Computer case in the whole market that is engineered properly for decent workloads and made with true quality.
> And no matter how hard We try at the end of the day radiators outside the case in a water box or any set up that is external is always million times better.
> I do nto think in al honesty that Ill ever place a radiator inside a case ever again in MY live.


Yeah. I always end up modding any case I own. There are some cases that can handle 4x480mm rads these days, but they are the size of filing cabinets and look funny.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I bought the DEMCflex kit for my 750D. It was 60 bucks but came with custom fitted filters for everything, even the little ventilated area over the rear fan. I dont have injection molding equipment so I guess 60 bucks is fair ish.
> I should've lapped my block to see what performance is like with twin pumps and a lot of radiator surface area. I should've also done the 1950X instead of the 1920, but I didn't need it and it wasn't cheap at release.
> Yeah. I always end up modding any case I own. There are some cases that can handle 4x480mm rads these days, but they are the size of filing cabinets and look funny.


I really do not understand why they do not manufacture cases that can hold dual 360x180 rads, that would be more than enough for qaud gpu set up, with any overclocked HEDT CPU


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> that would be Gskill rated at 17 cas?




Fwiw I am dominating Kray bench and Corona benchmark rankings. That app looks to be similar so I imagine this rig will do well in it.

This system was tuned by me for someone for photo rendering and will be heading there soon.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**


I am not sure I follow You well...I understand that there is o accountability and that people can talk BS a lot, but are You saying that You got lucky with the MB, of those Gskills will do those timings and if they do not its a ram die lotto or a MB issue?


----------



## chew*

No it has less to do with motherboard aside from a working bios. The ram was both from microcenter totally different manufacture dates and packaging in fact one set was returned ( open box buy ).

The cpu is the biggest factor speed wise because infinity fabric is linked to memory speed and must be run in sync.

Large density DR dims and higher than 3200 is a miracle chip.....in fact 3200 is fairly tough.

You definitely need to avoid BSers as well especially with mem speed/timings on Ryzen and actual stability.....

Lucky for you I am not one of the Bsers.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> No it has less to do with motherboard aside from a working bios. The ram was both from microcenter totally different manufacture dates and packaging in fact one set was returned ( open box buy ).
> 
> The cpu is the biggest factor speed wise because infinity fabric is linked to memory speed and must be run in sync.
> 
> Large density DR dims and higher than 3200 is a miracle chip.....in fact 3200 is fairly tough.
> 
> You definitely need to avoid BSers as well especially with mem speed/timings on Ryzen and actual stability.....
> 
> Lucky for you I am not one of the Bsers.


So You think B dies are all a bunch of crap talk?!...I hope AMD will improve memory latency as they promised.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> So You think B dies are all a bunch of crap talk?!...I hope AMD will improve memory latency as they promised.


Nope B die is definitely a crucial part of the recipe.These sticks are B die.

I know for a fact that DR Hynix is a major issue on TR still and will require more work agesa wise to work @ acceptable levels.

I pointed that out long ago before Ryzen launched. In fact I predicted Ryzen having difficulty with DR dimms before I even had pre lauch hardware in hand. My specialty has always been dealing with AMDs imc and I just know the trend. I also knew that it would favor a certain IC. Always has and most likely always will.


----------



## sandysuk

@chew* So the Phanteks block is not looking **** then? Did you mod it at all? What should I be looking at for a flow rate target, I have never really pushed my pump as its quite silent, but I can put upto 24V through it, I normally run at 9-10ish.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Nope B die is definitely a crucial part of the recipe.These sticks are B die.
> 
> I pointed that out long ago before Ryzen launched. In fact I predicted Ryzen having difficulty with DR dimms before I even had pre lauch hardware in hand. My specialty has always been dealing with AMDs imc and I just know the trend.


SO I guess would be best to wait for gen 2 7nm EPYC or TR, hopefully supporting PCIe 4.0.
I have always been an Intel xeon client...AMD zen to Me today means finally, having to let go of Intel and their suppository chip year on year upgrades at crazy prices..when I first heard of Skylake Xeon CPus specs even before knowing anything about EPYC and Threadripper, it was already a massive disappointment, so few PCIe lanes and still on 14 nm..at least now all of a sudden You have a Xeon W like I9 chip sold at less than 2000 dollars that although has a crappy cache can clock at over 4.5 Ghz...
But I would take memory latency issues one hundred times with all those pcie lanes rather than buying Intel once more....it has become a matter of principle at this point..I just cant stand them Milking for money..same for Nvidia but at least by moving to smaller lithography they doubled the performance they didnt over do it as Intel does....now teh same for Nvidia we will need to wait ages before they start selling the good stuff, worth upgrading


----------



## chew*

Just lapped it although it was no where near as bad as the bykski, the cpu required far more work lapping wise. It does require good head pressure apparently however,.

I would just wait to see hardocp results. He has a D5 pump so will be interesting to see what kyle comes up with.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Just lapped it although it was no where near as bad as the bykski, the cpu required far more work lapping wise. It does require good head pressure apparently however,.
> 
> I would just wait to see hardocp results. He has a D5 pump so will be interesting to see what kyle comes up with.


wouldnt a DDC pump be better for head pressure?!


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> wouldnt a DDC pump be better for head pressure?!


Technically they offer more static pressure at the same flow, but a D5 at full speed can produce more overall flow. The flow is what determines heat transfer.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> SO I guess would be best to wait for gen 2 7nm EPYC or TR, hopefully supporting PCIe 4.0.
> I have always been an Intel xeon client...AMD zen to Me today means finally, having to let go of Intel and their suppository chip year on year upgrades at crazy prices..when I first heard of Skylake Xeon CPus specs even before knowing anything about EPYC and Threadripper, it was already a massive disappointment, so few PCIe lanes and still on 14 nm..at least now all of a sudden You have a Xeon W like I9 chip sold at less than 2000 dollars that although has a crappy cache can clock at over 4.5 Ghz...
> But I would take memory latency issues one hundred times with all those pcie lanes rather than buying Intel once more....it has become a matter of principle at this point..I just cant stand them Milking for money..same for Nvidia but at least by moving to smaller lithography they doubled the performance they didnt over do it as Intel does....now teh same for Nvidia we will need to wait ages before they start selling the good stuff, worth upgrading


Zen+ will probably be on the TR4 socket at some point with upgraded memory controller. Even with the current controller b die at 2600-2800 on TR is competitive with all but the top 2-3 Intel skus, and there are some who have crammed 128GB of b die on a TR board and gotten 2933. Why wait for a new chip, TR is here now and it's awesome.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Technically they offer more static pressure at the same flow, but a D5 at full speed can produce more overall flow. The flow is what determines heat transfer.
> Zen+ will probably be on the TR4 socket at some point with upgraded memory controller. Even with the current controller b die at 2600-2800 on TR is competitive with all but the top 2-3 Intel skus, and there are some who have crammed 128GB of b die on a TR board and gotten 2933. Why wait for a new chip, TR is here now and it's awesome.


I want to abandon dual socket to single for 6 gpu config.
TR is extremely attractive, but I have learned from experience, to always wait for second iteration of a new architecture.
I have no idea how pcie 4 will work in the sense if u will need a new motherboard, or just a new cpu...as for now thee is no x399 motherboard i can load 6 gpus on anyhow..so for the meanwhile i stick on this channel to learn all about this hardware from you guys.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> I want to abandon dual socket to single for 6 gpu config.
> TR is extremely attractive, but I have learned from experience, to always wait for second iteration of a new architecture.
> I have no idea how pcie 4 will work in the sense if u will need a new motherboard, or just a new cpu...as for now thee is no x399 motherboard i can load 6 gpus on anyhow..so for the meanwhile i stick on this channel to learn all about this hardware from you guys.


6 GPU boards are quite rare in general these days. You'd think boards would be cheaper without extra plx chips but instead they seem to be 4 GPU boards at the same price as their 6-7 slot counterparts of yesteryear with plx chips for more lanes.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> 6 GPU boards are quite rare in general these days. You'd think boards would be cheaper without extra plx chips but instead they seem to be 4 GPU boards at the same price as their 6-7 slot counterparts of yesteryear with plx chips for more lanes.


Well, amd ceo did say they working on a 6 gpu workstation, similar to nvidia dgx, but i find it hard to beleve that asus wont make a x399 ws motherboard...unless i dont know....Intel has payed them off as it happened in the past, with the intel scandals...it would be madness if there wasnt one x399 or EPYC WS motherboard made by asus, in that case id go for the 32 core cpu, as I suspect those are unlocked as old opterons, but maybe @Chew would know something more tangible than me regarding this matter.


----------



## Simmons572

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Well, amd ceo did say they working on a 6 gpu workstation, similar to nvidia dgx, but i find it hard to beleve that asus wont make a x399 ws motherboard...unless i dont know....Intel has payed them off as it happened in the past, with the intel scandals...it would be madness if there wasnt one made by asus.


I could see Supermicro putting together an EE-ATX board to support something like that. This sounds like a project right up their ally.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> I could see Supermicro putting together an EE-ATX board to support something like that. This sounds like a project right up their ally.


I hope it will be Asus Eatx/CEB with state of the art VRms as usual...Imagine...just imagine.....6 gpus running on pcie gen 4 wired 16x, raid 10 m.2 and dual 10 Gbit ethernet....the monalisa of single socket motherboards!


----------



## TrixX

Spoiler: Pics!








Swiftech TR4 Heirloom edition has arrived. Fin area seems to be around 44mm x 38mm from a rough guestimate with a ruler









Full copper block too will take a few more pics later.


----------



## dodgethis

I'm getting microstutters with my rig (1950x and Zenith Extreme running the latest AMD rivers) while Windows is doing the auto-wallpaper cycle thing. Is anyone getting this?

I googled and it seems that others who updated their Intel chipset drivers got the same issue.


----------



## Tonza

Fiddled yesterday with my 1950X and Zenith Extreme, memory is 3200mhz CL14 G.skill Trident Z RGB. Guess i won in lottery, but 4.1Ghz seems to be stable in everything i do @ 1.35V (no i dont count Prime95 in this one, since it is an very unrealistic load). The OC survived 12x 4K video stitching in Autopano Video Pro (with several other corrections in the program), it makes use of every single core and thread on the ripper at 100% load (this program crashes instantly if OC is not stable), also the OC survived 4 hours Destiny session with 2 friends (which is pretty sensitive game to OC aswell). Using Enermax Liqtech 360 TR4 /w Corsair ML120s in P&P in modded Phanteks Enthoo Evolv (top panel cut so air flows nicely), maximum temperature was like 52C in Autopano Video Pro.

Dat Cinebench ;o



Love the system, blazing fast in everything, even gaming is awesome since i dont care about high hz and peasant 1080p resolutions.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> No it has less to do with motherboard aside from a working bios. The ram was both from microcenter totally different manufacture dates and packaging in fact one set was returned ( open box buy ).
> 
> The cpu is the biggest factor speed wise because infinity fabric is linked to memory speed and must be run in sync.
> 
> Large density DR dims and higher than 3200 is a miracle chip.....in fact 3200 is fairly tough.
> 
> You definitely need to avoid BSers as well especially with mem speed/timings on Ryzen and actual stability.....
> Lucky for you I am not one of the Bsers.


Well, I was running [email protected] 18 18 19 38 (this was usually a decent range between this and 42 during the tightening process) 420 SR stable without errors until the 1.0.0.4 AGESA update yesterday. Now, I can only get CL16 stable at 3600. DISCLAIMER: I'm using 4133 Trident Z 19-21-21 ram sticks. But, I believe people are over-tightening certain timings because of what they see the sticks set at on stock and XMP. I COULD NEVER get those timings for the ras to cas read and write delay anywhere near 2 above the CL, needless to say equal. Also, tFAW is HUGE on getting a speed boost, but if you over-tighten it... People are having unrealistic expectations on what the timings should look like, as my timings LOOK NOTHING LIKE THESE SETS ON MY 6700K!

I'm moving back and tightening it at 3466 now because I cannot get [email protected] on the new bios.

BTW, what do you know about what was changed in the AGESA 1.0.0.4/bios 1.80 for Asrock?


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dodgethis*
> 
> I'm getting microstutters with my rig (1950x and Zenith Extreme running the latest AMD rivers) while Windows is doing the auto-wallpaper cycle thing. Is anyone getting this?
> 
> I googled and it seems that others who updated their Intel chipset drivers got the same issue.






I,m going to say my standard fallback turn off hpet







assuming it is on, I have had updates that decided it would turn it back on and only knew because of the hitches and crap that goes with it.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Pics!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Swiftech TR4 Heirloom edition has arrived. Fin area seems to be around 44mm x 38mm from a rough guestimate with a ruler
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Full copper block too will take a few more pics later.






I,m not sure but the xspc fin area looks bigger than that but I never measured it wil be interesting to get some results though










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tonza*
> 
> Fiddled yesterday with my 1950X and Zenith Extreme, memory is 3200mhz CL14 G.skill Trident Z RGB. Guess i won in lottery, but 4.1Ghz seems to be stable in everything i do @ 1.35V (no i dont count Prime95 in this one, since it is an very unrealistic load). The OC survived 12x 4K video stitching in Autopano Video Pro (with several other corrections in the program), it makes use of every single core and thread on the ripper at 100% load (this program crashes instantly if OC is not stable), also the OC survived 4 hours Destiny session with 2 friends (which is pretty sensitive game to OC aswell). Using Enermax Liqtech 360 TR4 /w Corsair ML120s in P&P in modded Phanteks Enthoo Evolv (top panel cut so air flows nicely), maximum temperature was like 52C in Autopano Video Pro.
> 
> Dat Cinebench ;o
> 
> 
> 
> Love the system, blazing fast in everything, even gaming is awesome since i dont care about high hz and peasant 1080p resolutions.






nice result mine does about the same 1.5 for 4.1 what llc or droop do you get and what temps when it is being crushed?



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Well, I was running [email protected] 18 18 19 38 (this was usually a decent range between this and 42 during the tightening process) 420 SR stable without errors until the 1.0.0.4 AGESA update yesterday. Now, I can only get CL16 stable at 3600. DISCLAIMER: I'm using 4133 Trident Z 19-21-21 ram sticks. But, I believe people are over-tightening certain timings because of what they see the sticks set at on stock and XMP. I COULD NEVER get those timings for the ras to cas read and write delay anywhere near 2 above the CL, needless to say equal. Also, tFAW is HUGE on getting a speed boost, but if you over-tighten it... People are having unrealistic expectations on what the timings should look like, as my timings LOOK NOTHING LIKE THESE SETS ON MY 6700K!
> 
> I'm moving back and tightening it at 3466 now because I cannot get [email protected] on the new bios.
> 
> BTW, what do you know about what was changed in the AGESA 1.0.0.4/bios 1.80 for Asrock?






nothing apart from it works well on mine so far and it *seems the 1004 is memory upgrade really especially larger sets like 64 and 128.

all I know is my old 1.50 overclock works fine and my flarex happily runs [email protected] and some insane timings and 3466 @14

I got them from someone who did a pile of tests between 3200 and 3466 and the 3333 were the fastest I copied it word for word and it works.(sorry not sure where I found it except on these forums in a memory stability thread)


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> I,m not sure but the xspc fin area looks bigger than that but I never measured it wil be interesting to get some results though


I think the XSPC does have a larger fin area, the density of the fins on the Swiftech Block is pretty impressive though. I think the XSPC will give better overall cooling, but I'm looking forward to seeing how this compares


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> I think the XSPC does have a larger fin area, the density of the fins on the Swiftech Block is pretty impressive though. I think the XSPC will give better overall cooling, but I'm looking forward to seeing how this compares





yeah unfortunately I would have to buy from them doesn't seem to be a reseller down here and 107 US plus the filthy amount they will want for shipping will bring it in close to 200 for me...shame because it is a sexy looking thing


----------



## TrixX

Yeah I got mine for total $178 AUD so it's not all that bad. Shipping was about $35.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> nothing apart from it works well on mine so far and it *seems the 1004 is memory upgrade really especially larger sets like 64 and 128.
> 
> all I know is my old 1.50 overclock works fine and my flarex happily runs [email protected] and some insane timings and 3466 @14
> 
> I got them from someone who did a pile of tests between 3200 and 3466 and the 3333 were the fastest I copied it word for word and it works.(sorry not sure where I found it except on these forums in a memory stability thread)


Yeah, about that, I really couldn't care about someone else's timings. If the chips and relative similarities are not enough, it won't work (although can be used as a guide).

For 3600, my AIDA score is 85000 read, 98900 write, and just under 8700 copy with 78.7ns latency. My new 3466 timings give 82700 read, 97600 write, and 85900 copy with an 80.8 latency. So I'm doing alright with my timings from what I can tell.

What are your scores on that with your current timings? Or what is your SPi32m and wprime scores? My SPi32m at 4.05MHz was 9m35.801 with the ram at 3600, while it is now 9m36.7xx with the 3466 timings. Meanwhile, my wprimes are, for 32m, floating in the 2.7-2.8s area and, for 1024m, the 42.9-43.1 range.

So I think it will be alright. Still needs some work and I still intend on trying 3333 and 3200 to see if I can get better results on the timings, but that is a project for another day. As I said, most people look at my timings and scoff, but it gets the job done. Check the one's I've posted on HWBot if you don't believe me, although I need to upload some screenshots still, the majority should be there.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Yeah, about that, I really couldn't care about someone else's timings. If the chips and relative similarities are not enough, it won't work (although can be used as a guide).
> 
> For 3600, my AIDA score is 85000 read, 98900 write, and just under 8700 copy with 78.7ns latency. My new 3466 timings give 82700 read, 97600 write, and 85900 copy with an 80.8 latency. So I'm doing alright with my timings from what I can tell.
> 
> What are your scores on that with your current timings? Or what is your SPi32m and wprime scores? My SPi32m at 4.05MHz was 9m35.801 with the ram at 3600, while it is now 9m36.7xx with the 3466 timings. Meanwhile, my wprimes are, for 32m, floating in the 2.7-2.8s area and, for 1024m, the 42.9-43.1 range.
> 
> So I think it will be alright. Still needs some work and I still intend on trying 3333 and 3200 to see if I can get better results on the timings, but that is a project for another day. As I said, most people look at my timings and scoff, but it gets the job done. Check the one's I've posted on HWBot if you don't believe me, although I need to upload some screenshots still, the majority should be there.






oh no I get that there is literally no such things as apples to apples with any 2 computers...one cat fart can make it change.

never bothered with super pi none of my computers like it at all ever.
wprime though.

just did a quick run of the three benches I start with


----------



## VoytekBE

Just received my memory so I can finally complete my build.

I was holding off until I got my hands on the TZRX version of the Trident Z RGB memory. Had to order it on Newegg in the US but it was delivered today. Very surprised as I live in Europe, Belgium. I think they have a European warehouse or something.

F4-2933C14Q2-64GTZRX , 64Gb 8 dimm kit at 29333 with 14 timings.


----------



## ajc9988




----------



## chew*

Hards phanteks review is up. Looks like he confirmed my results. Bykski type performance.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*


Very nice...do You think You got lucky with the Ram and CPu? and could you kindly say Your temps and cooling set up?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Hards phanteks review is up. Looks like he confirmed my results. Bykski type performance.


Uhm, would be nice to see some temps at loads eg with a Vray benchmark






here this guys is getting 68c @4Ghz Oc with 26 C ambient.


----------



## ajc9988

tm5.zip 22k .zip file

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Very nice...do You think You got lucky with the Ram and CPu? and could you kindly say Your temps and cooling set up?


Ram - I'm using two different sets of 2x8GB 4133 Trident Z that came out BEFORE Ryzen, needless to say TR. It's nothing special. If you notice, I'm using CL14 18-18-19-42. Most won't try the next three being more than two looser than the CL, which is ridiculous. Seriously.

As to CPU, it is an SL chip from the [email protected] group from the first chips bought and sold and looks to be where it would be in the group that is now sold in the [email protected] group.

I still need to reseat the CPU block, but I have an XSPC block, two universal VRM blocks, 3x480 rads, 2xMCP50X water pumps, 8 Vardar predator fans (f4-120er), 1 vardar 140 blowing at the back of the board, and a 980 ti classy that doesn't go above 34C under load even when at OC limits with the stock bios. (edit: I forgot to mention 8xNoctua iPPC3000 fans as well).

With the last bios on my Taichi board, I had it so that CB 15 would end up around 68.5C. As I said, I need to reseat the CPU block but haven't torn down to do so yet. Voltage after 4050 starts to jump into the 1.3-1.35 range, so heat starts going up significantly. With the new bios, I'm seeing closer to 72C from CB 15.

So your questions are complicated to answer. Nothing has to do with luck. I bought a binned chip and lucked out on IMC. My ram are rated for way higher, but the main part of getting those speeds is to figure out the timings and whether it can find a boot solution.

To rule out voltage, I set the SOC at 1.2, set both channels of ram to 1.5V, then set things to auto and a CL to see what the machine found for a boot solution. I then used RTC to find what timings and plugged in the next two and saw if it booted. Then the fourth and fifth timings. After these are custom set and it is booting still, without kicking errors (tested with testmem5.0; see attached), then I start with tightening down the timings or adding other timings to being set instead of auto because it effects one of my set timings. Repeat. Once I have them set with no errors there, I also incorporate using SPi32M, wprime, and CB15 to see how the timings effect the performance at those tasks as well as AIDA64. Sometimes, even though it doesn't kick errors, it is better for a timing to be slightly looser rather than the absolute tightest you can get it without errors (also some settings are windows of performance and too tight literally screws everything up). Obviously, you want the tREFI and tREFIx9 as high as possible, but I didn't see the timing for that in this bios (taichi). When I used these same sticks on my ASUS z170 board, I noticed when I maxed out tREFI, I was getting bit flips, whereas backing it off slightly solved that problem entirely.

So it isn't anything about luck! It is about understanding and working with the hardware you have (dance with the one you brought/bought, if you catch my drift). Learn what the hardware you have can do, then do it and do it to the best of your ability. If you don't have the ability, start researching and learning how to get better. It really is that easy. I noticed some have better than me (I'm up there just behind Sgt. Bilko and Hannibal L3ktor on HWBot), but I am reaching the end of what I can do before I can find the time to drain the loop and reseat things, which means making changes as well for my convenience and mind.

Also, I have ram fans, so my dimms never really got hotter than 34C, even with 1.5V. Also, after you find the timings, you then have to do a reverse OC - lower the ram and SOC voltage until it effects performance or stability, then set it right above it. ALSO - DO NOT STARVE YOUR SYSTEM OF VOLTAGE. You can sometimes remove too much voltage and it will still be stable, but you get worse scores due to not having enough watts pumping. Although, going too high creates more heat and limits you that way. So....


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> tm5.zip 22k .zip file
> 
> Ram - I'm using two different sets of 2x8GB 4133 Trident Z that came out BEFORE Ryzen, needless to say TR. It's nothing special. If you notice, I'm using CL14 18-18-19-42. Most won't try the next three being more than two looser than the CL, which is ridiculous. Seriously.
> 
> As to CPU, it is an SL chip from the [email protected] group from the first chips bought and sold and looks to be where it would be in the group that is now sold in the [email protected] group.
> 
> I still need to reseat the CPU block, but I have an XSPC block, two universal VRM blocks, 3x480 rads, 2xMCP50X water pumps, 8 Vardar predator fans (f4-120er), 1 vardar 140 blowing at the back of the board, and a 980 ti classy that doesn't go above 34C under load even when at OC limits with the stock bios. (edit: I forgot to mention 8xNoctua iPPC3000 fans as well).
> 
> With the last bios on my Taichi board, I had it so that CB 15 would end up around 68.5C. As I said, I need to reseat the CPU block but haven't torn down to do so yet. Voltage after 4050 starts to jump into the 1.3-1.35 range, so heat starts going up significantly. With the new bios, I'm seeing closer to 72C from CB 15.
> 
> So your questions are complicated to answer. Nothing has to do with luck. I bought a binned chip and lucked out on IMC. My ram are rated for way higher, but the main part of getting those speeds is to figure out the timings and whether it can find a boot solution.
> 
> To rule out voltage, I set the SOC at 1.2, set both channels of ram to 1.5V, then set things to auto and a CL to see what the machine found for a boot solution. I then used RTC to find what timings and plugged in the next two and saw if it booted. Then the fourth and fifth timings. After these are custom set and it is booting still, without kicking errors (tested with testmem5.0; see attached), then I start with tightening down the timings or adding other timings to being set instead of auto because it effects one of my set timings. Repeat. Once I have them set with no errors there, I also incorporate using SPi32M, wprime, and CB15 to see how the timings effect the performance at those tasks as well as AIDA64. Sometimes, even though it doesn't kick errors, it is better for a timing to be slightly looser rather than the absolute tightest you can get it without errors (also some settings are windows of performance and too tight literally screws everything up). Obviously, you want the tREFI and tREFIx9 as high as possible, but I didn't see the timing for that in this bios (taichi). When I used these same sticks on my ASUS z170 board, I noticed when I maxed out tREFI, I was getting bit flips, whereas backing it off slightly solved that problem entirely.
> 
> So it isn't anything about luck! It is about understanding and working with the hardware you have (dance with the one you brought/bought, if you catch my drift). Learn what the hardware you have can do, then do it and do it to the best of your ability. If you don't have the ability, start researching and learning how to get better. It really is that easy. I noticed some have better than me (I'm up there just behind Sgt. Bilko and Hannibal L3ktor on HWBot), but I am reaching the end of what I can do before I can find the time to drain the loop and reseat things, which means making changes as well for my convenience and mind.
> 
> Also, I have ram fans, so my dimms never really got hotter than 34C, even with 1.5V. Also, after you find the timings, you then have to do a reverse OC - lower the ram and SOC voltage until it effects performance or stability, then set it right above it. ALSO - DO NOT STARVE YOUR SYSTEM OF VOLTAGE. You can sometimes remove too much voltage and it will still be stable, but you get worse scores due to not having enough watts pumping. Although, going too high creates more heat and limits you that way. So....


Thank You so much for the very detailed reply...I saw SL is now offering 4.0Ghz TR chips, so definitely worth the extra money.....scoring 3550 on Cinebench from a stock 3050, is a massive performance gain on real render applications....I also think that definitely these CPUs need very good power supplies like top tier Pla/Titanium EVGA Leadex or Silverstone to get those VRms and CPu working really well and stable.
Ill want to see the follow up with the ram, when u done that...and could You kindly run a Vray benchmark please, to see true performance differences from the 1980XE?
Cinebench makes almost no use of L3 cache, making it kind of a sloppy benchmark

https://www.chaosgroup.com/vray/benchmark
https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Thank You so much for the very detailed reply...I saw SL is now offering 4.0Ghz TR chips, so definitely worth the extra money.....scoring 3550 on Cinebench from a stock 3050, is a massive performance gain on real render applications....I also think that definitely these CPUs need very good power supplies like top tier Pla/Titanium EVGA Leadex or Silverstone to get those VRms and CPu working really well and stable.
> Ill want to see the follow up with the ram, when u done that...and could You kindly run a Vray benchmark please, to see true performance differences from the 1980XE?
> Cinebench makes almost no use of L3 cache, making it kind of a sloppy benchmark
> 
> https://www.chaosgroup.com/vray/benchmark
> https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu


So, had to increase voltage to 1.2875, but only raised temps to 75C. Here are the pics you are looking for.




You can see my CPU pulled a max of 428W according to HWinfo, which is the current version of HWinfo.

Also, as I said, I need to reseat my CPU block, which should lower temps some.

https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu/details?hw=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor+x32%2C+GeForce+GTX+980+Ti+6144MB&id=7206

Power supply wasn't what I meant there, although a good one is needed. I run a 1600W EVGA SuperNOVA T2.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> So, had to increase voltage to 1.2875, but only raised temps to 75C. Here are the pics you are looking for.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can see my CPU pulled a max of 428W according to HWinfo, which is the current version of HWinfo.
> 
> Also, as I said, I need to reseat my CPU block, which should lower temps some.
> 
> https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu/details?hw=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor+x32%2C+GeForce+GTX+980+Ti+6144MB&id=7206
> 
> Power supply wasn't what I meant there, although a good one is needed. I run a 1600W EVGA SuperNOVA T2.


sweet, thanks a lot
https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu/details?hw=Intel%28R%29+Core%28TM%29+i9-7980XE+CPU+%40+2.60GHz+x36%2C+TITAN+X+%28Pascal%29+12288MB+x2&id=7206
this kinda proves that gap from the intel chip is less than what cinebench results show....and the wattage is dramatically less than intel.
Hope you will get those temps lower .


----------



## tarot

heres 4050 3333 tried 3466 same timings..not pretty
https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu/details?hw=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor+x32%2C+gfx900+8176MB&id=7215


----------



## TrixX

Got an awesome Swiftech Shot to share


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> heres 4050 3333 tried 3466 same timings..not pretty
> https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu/details?hw=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor+x32%2C+gfx900+8176MB&id=7215


39 seconds is a respectable result, and if i see well you also got very decent timings on the ram...I suppose those who get better results in this benchmark probably manage to run 3600mhz with very low timings, or maybe have a better power delivery of some kind or who knows get way above 4.05 OC.....only few months ago You could have dreamed of these numbers and if you wanted them it meant dual socket xeons at over 4000dollars only for the cpus.
It is odd to me that AMD is not releasing 24 and 32 core versions of TR and put a lid on Intels coffin. It would be a massive marketing mistake on AMD behalf not taking advantage of their Zen supremacy in this moment.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> heres 4050 3333 tried 3466 same timings..not pretty
> https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu/details?hw=AMD+Ryzen+Threadripper+1950X+16-Core+Processor+x32%2C+gfx900+8176MB&id=7215


BTW You got a dramatic better result on the GPU benchmark...is it with same gpu or You got a new one?


----------



## ajc9988

So I am 0.89 seconds off of @chew 's top score now. https://corona-renderer.com/benchmark/cpu/1950x


----------



## TrixX

Wish I had some B-Die to go after Chew's score, currently my RAM is holding me back.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Wish I had some B-Die to go after Chew's score, currently my RAM is holding me back.


I do have B-die SR ram, but here are the timings used for them:


----------



## happyluckbox

Abybody know how to add ryzen timing checker to windows antivirus whitelist? Everytime I try to load it- it errors out due to AV.

Here's my timings for 2933mhz 128gb of ram 14cas.




I can boot and pass p95, aida64, and even game af 3060mhz, but every hour or so I get an error code from hci memtest. My research software also crashes as a result.

Was hoping sonebody could offsr me some advice.
(As for tcwl, I was only able to set it at 12 or 10, chose 12 since it is closer to 14.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> 39 seconds is a respectable result, and if i see well you also got very decent timings on the ram...I suppose those who get better results in this benchmark probably manage to run 3600mhz with very low timings, or maybe have a better power delivery of some kind or who knows get way above 4.05 OC.....only few months ago You could have dreamed of these numbers and if you wanted them it meant dual socket xeons at over 4000dollars only for the cpus.
> It is odd to me that AMD is not releasing 24 and 32 core versions of TR and put a lid on Intels coffin. It would be a massive marketing mistake on AMD behalf not taking advantage of their Zen supremacy in this moment.






they will release it..but I think they are holding off and doing the waiting game as in wait till Apollo creed gets cocky and complacent draw em in *hit me hit me..that the best ya got* then blammo









or waiting for zen 2 etc to bother with it.
I am happy with my results so far and happy with the temps, waiting for some summer heat 30's and above to decide if its a success or not










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> BTW You got a dramatic better result on the GPU benchmark...is it with same gpu or You got a new one?






vega 64 so I think its the same one, basing off the other scores it is better tuned power wise and the latter drivers helped as well. only 10 plus seconds better dramatic would have been 1 minutes







)


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> 
> So I am 0.89 seconds off of @chew 's top score now. https://corona-renderer.com/benchmark/cpu/1950x





same sort of setup even to the board but still can't crack that high...got close but still not I must be missing something somewhere.
just keep fiddling









as for rtc turn off shields for a minute then run or add it to the exception list in the control panel of whatever software you use


----------



## ajc9988

Go to this post and download Testmem5. Run it. If you have any errors, you aren't stable. http://www.overclock.net/t/1636550/amd-ryzen-threadripper-owners-club-1950x-1920x-1900x/2240#post_26439865

You have to run with admin privileges. If you are getting BSODs, either one of your voltage settings is wrong OR your memory timings are wrong. Considering you did general stress testing andd are not giving us anything else, first run that program OR memtest86+, as I'm not sure of your experience qualifying memory OC with P95. TM5 runs 7-10min and between 3 runs will catch 95-99% of errors. That makes it great when tuning because it is FAST compared to other methods. You still need to qualify the memory with other tests after to catch the errors that it doesn't, but it saves an hour of P95 for each ram setting, couple hours of windows memtest, 6-8 hours of memtest86+, etc. The one you mentioned I've never used. So...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Abybody know how to add ryzen timing checker to windows antivirus whitelist? Everytime I try to load it- it errors out due to AV.
> 
> Here's my timings for 2933mhz 128gb of ram 14cas.
> 
> I can boot and pass p95, aida64, and even game af 3060mhz, but every hour or so I get an error code from hci memtest. My research software also crashes as a result.
> 
> Was hoping sonebody could offsr me some advice.
> (As for tcwl, I was only able to set it at 12 or 10, chose 12 since it is closer to 14.


----------



## chew*

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> Well, I was running [email protected] 18 18 19 38 (this was usually a decent range between this and 42 during the tightening process) 420 SR stable without errors until the 1.0.0.4 AGESA update yesterday. Now, I can only get CL16 stable at 3600. DISCLAIMER: I'm using 4133 Trident Z 19-21-21 ram sticks. But, I believe people are over-tightening certain timings because of what they see the sticks set at on stock and XMP. I COULD NEVER get those timings for the ras to cas read and write delay anywhere near 2 above the CL, needless to say equal. Also, tFAW is HUGE on getting a speed boost, but if you over-tighten it... People are having unrealistic expectations on what the timings should look like, as my timings LOOK NOTHING LIKE THESE SETS ON MY 6700K!
> 
> I'm moving back and tightening it at 3466 now because I cannot get [email protected] on the new bios.
> 
> BTW, what do you know about what was changed in the AGESA 1.0.0.4/bios 1.80 for Asrock?


Agesa update so nothing from asrock...all AMD.

From last convo with AMD pre 1004 they were working on hynix DR compatibility so memory changes.


----------



## tarot

now s I decided to do a few benches in safe mode no network with some interesting results.

wprime scored a second better on the big one but the small one went from 3.3 to 2.3

and corona puts me up to 795xxx which is getting close to the top basically 2/300 points more.

so question is what exactly is pulling me back


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Agesa update so nothing from asrock...all AMD.
> 
> From last convo with AMD pre 1004 they were working on hynix DR compatibility so memory changes.


funny, because apps that uncover agesa version (AIDA64, CPU-Z) still say 1.0.0.3 agesa.


----------



## Bartouille

Has anyone made a tool to start multiple instances of HCI Memtest (free version)? I'll probably make one otherwise since it's getting pretty annoying to do by hand.


----------



## sandysuk

its in the faq in the ryzen memory thread, either do a batch file or buy the full version.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> they will release it..but I think they are holding off and doing the waiting game as in wait till Apollo creed gets cocky and complacent draw em in *hit me hit me..that the best ya got* then blammo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or waiting for zen 2 etc to bother with it.
> I am happy with my results so far and happy with the temps, waiting for some summer heat 30's and above to decide if its a success or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vega 64 so I think its the same one, basing off the other scores it is better tuned power wise and the latter drivers helped as well. only 10 plus seconds better dramatic would have been 1 minutes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


If they will go for TR 32 core or even 64 cores on ZENII they it will be in the summer, so if there will be a 32 core version it must be announced in January along with all their new AM4 line up, that of course unless they have been binning 7nm 64 core chips all along without telling anyone.

As for the GPU increase in performance 10 seconds is a lot! ...though please do not take any offense but 2 minutes and 12 seconds is really a very poor benchmark for a GPU, I get 1 minute 13 seconds on My old 2013 Crappy octacore Dell workstation with a 980ti that I now keep at home......I dont think You are into GPU rendering, but if You are , and I hate to say it, cause i really dont like Ngridia, as a company, it would be better to abandon the AMD GPU ship asap...that being said AMD gpus are fantastic at everything else, including gaming and especially in CAD and 3d modeling in general view port performance...there must be something with cuda that makes Nvidias GPUs work so much better than Open CL in raytracing


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> its in the faq in the ryzen memory thread, either do a batch file or buy the full version.


Batch file requires pro version which costs 5$ AFAIK.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> If they will go for TR 32 core or even 64 cores on ZENII they it will be in the summer, so if there will be a 32 core version it must be announced in January along with all their new AM4 line up, that of course unless they have been binning 7nm 64 core chips all along without telling anyone.
> 
> As for the GPU increase in performance 10 seconds is a lot! ...though please do not take any offense but 2 minutes and 12 seconds is really a very poor benchmark for a GPU, I get 1 minute 13 seconds on My old 2013 Crappy octacore Dell workstation with a 980ti that I now keep at home......I dont think You are into GPU rendering, but if You are , and I hate to say it, cause i really dont like Ngridia, as a company, it would be better to abandon the AMD GPU ship asap...that being said AMD gpus are fantastic at everything else, including gaming and especially in CAD and 3d modeling in general view port performance...there must be something with cuda that makes Nvidias GPUs work so much better than Open CL in raytracing






oh no I take no offence at all I know they suck at that bench as a matter of curiosity what do you get in realbench 2.54 especially the opencl part







the last score I ran was 183000 which from what I see throws me in front of the titan xp pascal.
so sort of come down to the benchmark I guess.
how about blender bmw gpu bench I haven't run that yet might see how it goes.

oh and no not gpu rendering at all so I,m good there.

ok got it to work a little quicker than the cpu one(temps on the cpu please not in this room the ambient is around 28 an humid)

so yeah my guess is opencl in blender for amd also inhales donkey rounds








I swear I,ll find one bench amd wins..i swear


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> oh no I take no offence at all I know they suck at that bench as a matter of curiosity what do you get in realbench 2.54 especially the opencl part
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the last score I ran was 183000 which from what I see throws me in front of the titan xp pascal.
> so sort of come down to the benchmark I guess.
> how about blender bmw gpu bench I haven't run that yet might see how it goes.
> 
> oh and no not gpu rendering at all so I,m good there.
> 
> ok got it to work a little quicker than the cpu one(temps on the cpu please not in this room the ambient is around 28 an humid)
> 
> so yeah my guess is opencl in blender for amd also inhales donkey rounds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I swear I,ll find one bench amd wins..i swear


CPU:Intel Xeon E5 2687W - Speed:1197.1 MHz - Multi:12.0 - Bus:99.8 MHz

RAM:798.1 MHz (1:12) - 32694 MBytesGB - 11-11-11-28-1T MB:0Y56T3 - FW: - Desktop
OS:Windows 7 Professional GPU1:NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980 Ti

Image Editing 108,559 Time:49.0793
Encoding 82,093 Time:64.9013
OpenCL 99,671 KSamples/sec: 18359
Heavy Multitasking 74,842 Time:101.975
System Score 91,291

As explained this is an old system I keep at home and I think the the CPu is quite degraded as it has ran some time on Dell awful air cooling that would hit over TJ max during renders.
Now I watercool it and I ran the test on balanced mode with a 150 Mhz OC and 500 Mhz memory clock on the GPU..
the xeon chip is not OCd and ran the test at 3.4 Ghz on all cores
Two things to consider
First thing is that for a 980 TI Nvidia card the Open CL run wasnt bad at all, while AMD notoriously obliterate Nvidia in Compute Open CL stuff in certain applications...so it a Titan scores only 180 vs 99k i scored something is off or the Titan card is a piece of junk, maybe because this Open CL benchmark makes use of double precision, and it it does then the GP100 results would be very interesting to see. to see how the vega 64 stacks against it.
Second thing is cache, in the heavy multitasking run, as MY CPU has a discreet nice 20Mb of cache it didnt hit over 30% usage in this test, which would make it very interesting to see how the Intel Xtreme CPus might perform agaisnt the TR ones here, if the multi tasking was much more a super mega one.

Sorry If I dont run blender but I honestly dont feel to install it....take no offense Blender users,,,Blender is a fantastic suite, and cycles a fantastic renderer.


----------



## Aby67

P.s. Sorry I fi extent My reply, but I actually was thinking about this real benchmark, and I think that the heavy multitasking benchmark is a joke possible made in the past for intel dual core cpus or tops crappy I5s/old i7s.
To me Heavy Multitasking means running Maya with VRay at full load on 3/4 gpus while Im on photoshop have tv streaming on the computer, and unreal engine or Second Life or project Sansar or Unreal Engine open and running, while I am screen sharing on skype an maybe checking My revit renders....so I think yeah realbench heavy multitasking benchmark is a joke to sell crap to consumers.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> P.s. Sorry I fi extent My reply, but I actually was thinking about this real benchmark, and I think that the heavy multitasking benchmark is a joke possible made in the past for intel dual core cpus or tops crappy I5s/old i7s.
> To me Heavy Multitasking means running Maya with VRay at full load on 3/4 gpus while Im on photoshop have tv streaming on the computer, and unreal engine or Second Life or project Sansar or Unreal Engine open and running, while I am screen sharing on skype an maybe checking My revit renders....so I think yeah realbench heavy multitasking benchmark is a joke to sell crap to consumers.





no no tell us what you really think








I agree the benchmark is not in any way indicative of a systems performance BUT if using the same benchmark across platforms it can give an indication of performance or performance downfalls.

this is 4100 and 3466 with loose ish timings.



now go grab the results from the rog and look at the 7980's

and here is a 1800x at 4g I think and 3466 ram and a fury x


now opencl that's 135k

vray must be very cuda luvin









anyway neither here nor there.
I use all of them for stability tests and tweaking so they all have a part not one more than the other.

a good bench I found probably around here somewhere is kriegs math cpu benchmark that hammers it pretty hard but then again still not real life.

none of these benches are corona vray all just one thing I mean if you were using this program I am sure there are much more intensive renders or different ones that would behave totally different to the ones in the demo...

so where does that leave everyone.

anyway enough ranting back to work


----------



## Aby67

I think that the biggest problem is that there is too much and too many people bench marking for gaming and small load stuff like video encoding especially with these You tubers and Internet reviewers.
I feel to throw up when I see gaming benchmarks on 1080p with the excuse that the resolution is necessary to understand the CPU performance for the HPC market....to Me Ipc mean as much as toilet paper when i hear about it in gaming benchmarks...cant they just say that the higher clocked CPus with smaller cache will reduce the GPU latencies, rather than talking IPC BS?!
I asked You to kindly make a Vray benchmark because in My opinion for CG stuff that is the only benchmark that matters, and there is a reason for that, I use Vray a lot...but it is definitely a way more advanced benchmark that cinebench for reasons too long to post here

So to cut the long story short, there is not one single You tuber nor a Single reviewer that have a set of decent benchmarks set for HPC systems, We end up getting tons of crap in a big giant crappy soup.
What I think instead matters is that people ask around to colleagues and forums like these, as We did now, compare, question, and be open minded and build a system that suits abundantly ones workloads needs.
I wish to emphasize the importance of questioning stuff because We the buyers get tons of **** thrown at us by all these so called reviewers......


----------



## Nizzen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> I think that the biggest problem is that there is too much and too many people bench marking for gaming and small load stuff like video encoding especially with these You tubers and Internet reviewers.
> I feel to throw up when I see gaming benchmarks on 1080p with the excuse that the resolution is necessary to understand the CPU performance for the HPC market....to Me Ipc mean as much as toilet paper when i hear about it in gaming benchmarks...cant they just say that the higher clocked CPus with smaller cache will reduce the GPU latencies, rather than talking IPC BS?!
> I asked You to kindly make a Vray benchmark because in My opinion for CG stuff that is the only benchmark that matters, and there is a reason for that, I use Vray a lot...but it is definitely a way more advanced benchmark that cinebench for reasons too long to post here
> 
> So to cut the long story short, there is not one single You tuber nor a Single reviewer that have a set of decent benchmarks set for HPC systems, We end up getting tons of crap in a big giant crappy soup.
> What I think instead matters is that people ask around to colleagues and forums like these, as We did now, compare, question, and be open minded and build a system that suits abundantly ones workloads needs.
> I wish to emphasize the importance of questioning stuff because We the buyers get tons of **** thrown at us by all these so called reviewers......


Is there a Vray benchmark that everyone can run for comparing?







Is realbench Vray benchmark, and will Vray use the all cputhreads available?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nizzen*
> 
> Is there a Vray benchmark that everyone can run for comparing?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is realbench Vray benchmark, and will Vray use the all cputhreads available?


Vray Benchmark is free and available to any one.
Vray is a very popular and possibly among the best featured renderers in the market.....if You are not into Cg most of the CGI stuff You seen on Games of thrones is done with this renderer.
This benchmark has just been become available recently so it is not popular among consumers but for those who work with graphics CPus GPUs and all that crap it is kind of a hardware bible in this moment, because in Vray being possibly the most used among professionals...there are two other renderers that have great prestige among pros and one is Maxwell render and Arnold render....Also Pixars renderman is very important renderer because of its architecture and features although it is not so popular.

When You run a Vray benchmark and the login their website to publish You results, You can be very well sure that the benchmarks You see there are done by serious people with very serious machines...EPYC cpus where benchmarked on there even before they were in the market and I suspect TR as well...You will also get a very good idea of GPU performance in the HPC arena by looking at results...as an example You can see the Nvidia GP100 performing twice as fast as the Titan Xp , this definitely proves that even if Nvidia kept the same silicon and just add HBM2 You would get precisely if not more than twice the performance of current Nvidia Gpus...Yiu can se how TR performs for real as good and in many case s better thanDUal xeons...You can see that the 7980XE is not so much faster overclocked than the 30/35% differences against Threadripper You instead see with cinebench ...so yeah its a state of teh art benchmark.

Real bench is a benchmark provided by Asus, it runs different benchmarks, and I think its an obsolete benchmark but if You are into video streaming it could be a nice tool to try.
Yes Vray will use as many cores You throw at it and it will load them at 100% and it will stay consistent in the benchmark even if u was to run 4 cpus and hundreds of cores...something that Cinebench is incapable of...I do however recommend C4d if you ever wanted to try out CG stuff and 3d modeling or rendering its a very nice suite.


----------



## xkm1948

Thinking of building a TR based workstation for bioinformatics build. Asking the guru here regarding the max RAM size. I see AMD claimed TR can support ECC RAM. Does it mean it is able to support more than 128GB RAM? My work application requires lots of ram, would be nice to know whether X399 + TR are good for such situations.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Thinking of building a TR based workstation for bioinformatics build. Asking the guru here regarding the max RAM size. I see AMD claimed TR can support ECC RAM. Does it mean it is able to support more than 128GB RAM? My work application requires lots of ram, would be nice to know whether X399 + TR are good for such situations.


samsung just released this

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/samsung-64gb-pc4-19200-ddr4-2400mhz-ecc-reg-memory

though I would opt for unbuffered ECC memory which would run faster than registered... TR should run quad channel, u could likely run up to 512 Gb ...but then you need a motherboard that can support ecc memory....im not sure if current threadripper motherboards can....You could get a EPYC single socket WS gygabyte motherboard and use up to 2 terabyte of ram
http://b2b.gigabyte.com/Server-Motherboard/MZ31-AR0-rev-10#ov

if u can afford all that ram then get a 32 core Epyc, which would perform as good as a threadripper if not slightly more

crucial and others have ram that can run at 2666mhz....i would check if samsung has that speed as will and the look if they are B die, as u could possibly overclock with stability the ram in workstation server grade motherboards ...I also believe that EPYC should be unlocked to overclock as all opterons have been in the past, but I dont own one and have not yet managed to find someone that uses one that checked this......it ia hard to know BIOS for these boards and if You can play around at least with BLCK as that is the way to overclock xeons


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Thinking of building a TR based workstation for bioinformatics build. Asking the guru here regarding the max RAM size. I see AMD claimed TR can support ECC RAM. Does it mean it is able to support more than 128GB RAM? My work application requires lots of ram, would be nice to know whether X399 + TR are good for such situations.


I'm no Chew, but I'll do what I can to answer.

First, TR can use unbuffered ECC, NOT REGISTERED!!! Only Epyc can use registered ECC!

Second, most motherboards have listed 128GB max memory, so I would be hesitant at anyone telling you for sure above that can be used. Future MBs, such as a workstation board, may be able to get around this, but mentioning at current MBs out there.

Now, next year sometime, a 3200 ECC has been rumored. If true, could change some things up.

Third, EPYC is always an option, with the single chips being quite potent. It would guarantee what you are looking for. If you want me to look up some of the single processor Epyc rigs, I could for you. Also, STH
(https://www.servethehome.com/) has great reviews of EPYC performance.

If there is anything else, let me know. Meanwhile, hopefully anyone else with info on this chimes in, or @chew.


----------



## xkm1948

Wanted to stay off actual server grade components simply due to the high cost. Thank you for the suggestions! I was wondering between X299 and X399. Looks like I need to wait for a X399 workstation board that may have proper ECC RAM support.


----------



## Aby67

@xkm1948

I agree with ajc9988...if u wanna use threadripper you should wait for a WS class motherboard, and you can choose if unbuffered ECC is safe enough for you, i would not feel ok with running ecc on gaming boards personally....especially on a new platform
But if that 3200 mhz rumor is true and you really looking at spending 5/10000 dollars in ram memory you might really wanna hold tight with what you got now and commit maybe 1 year from now


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Wanted to stay off actual server grade components simply due to the high cost. Thank you for the suggestions! I was wondering between X299 and X399. Looks like I need to wait for a X399 workstation board that may have proper ECC RAM support.


Im just waiting for WS motherboard same as You but for 6 gpu configurations and yeah Id like that ECC ram......in 8 years im on ecc systems i never had a single crash ever , and i often run 100% loads for days occasionally over a week


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Wanted to stay off actual server grade components simply due to the high cost. Thank you for the suggestions! I was wondering between X299 and X399. Looks like I need to wait for a X399 workstation board that may have proper ECC RAM support.


xkm1948 fancy finding you here!









I believe Threadripper will do more than 128gb, I saw a launch video claiming 256gb, and I think 512gb might be in the picture, and this review claims up to 2TB! https://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/luke-hill/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1950x-16c32t-1920x-12c24t-cpu-review/

Intel side appears to have motherboards in place for X299 512gb registered DIMM, so maybe we're playing a touch of catch up motherboard wise on the AMD Threadripper memory space.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Wanted to stay off actual server grade components simply due to the high cost. Thank you for the suggestions! I was wondering between X299 and X399. Looks like I need to wait for a X399 workstation board that may have proper ECC RAM support.


I recommend EPYC over threadripper. Go look up 7281s.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> xkm1948 fancy finding you here!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe Threadripper will do more than 128gb, I saw a launch video claiming 256gb, and I think 512gb might be in the picture, and this review claims up to 2TB! https://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/luke-hill/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1950x-16c32t-1920x-12c24t-cpu-review/
> 
> Intel side appears to have motherboards in place for X299 512gb registered DIMM, so maybe we're playing a touch of catch up motherboard wise on the AMD Threadripper memory space.


The difference is ECC only works on X299 Xeon, not HEDT, if memory serves. So it isn't exactly catch up, as the HEDT chips cannot even use unbuffered ECC memory on Intel side. Just wanted to clarify that.









https://ark.intel.com/products/126699/Intel-Core-i9-7980XE-Extreme-Edition-Processor-24_75M-Cache-up-to-4_20-GHz

Edit: "They will require a new chipset, the C422 chipset, and despite the common LGA2066 socket, the Xeon-W will not work with the consumer X299 chipset (reaffirming the split we see with the E3-1200 v5/v6 series which require the C236 chipset and will not work with the Z170 chipset). As a result, we are likely to see most of the major motherboard manufacturers pump out at least one version of an enterprise board to cover this market."
https://www.anandtech.com/show/11775/intel-launches-xeon-w-cpus-for-workstations

Meanwhile, they mention UDIMM support on that page. So contradictory info from Intel's page, but a limit of 128GB UDIMM. So more digging is needed.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> The difference is ECC only works on X299 Xeon, not HEDT, if memory serves. So it isn't exactly catch up, as the HEDT chips cannot even use unbuffered ECC memory on Intel side. Just wanted to clarify that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://ark.intel.com/products/126699/Intel-Core-i9-7980XE-Extreme-Edition-Processor-24_75M-Cache-up-to-4_20-GHz
> 
> Edit: "They will require a new chipset, the C422 chipset, and despite the common LGA2066 socket, the Xeon-W will not work with the consumer X299 chipset (reaffirming the split we see with the E3-1200 v5/v6 series which require the C236 chipset and will not work with the Z170 chipset). As a result, we are likely to see most of the major motherboard manufacturers pump out at least one version of an enterprise board to cover this market."
> https://www.anandtech.com/show/11775/intel-launches-xeon-w-cpus-for-workstations
> 
> So, it looks like it isn't X299 at all you were looking at, meaning Intel is behind on the support and that AMD is the only HEDT platform with any ECC support.


Gigabyte Aorus X299 Gaming 9 states it supports 512gb with Registered DIMM. That's about as deep into it as I got, I mis-quoted the spec. Good catch!

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813145013&ignorebbr=1


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> Gigabyte Aorus X299 Gaming 9 states it supports 512gb with Registered DIMM. That's about as deep into it as I got, I mis-quoted the spec. Good catch!
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813145013&ignorebbr=1


No problem. Intel has been spotty on giving specs and good info due to the extra competition from AMD this round. Definitely a moving target on trying to get the information right. Especially because this is the generation Intel planned to make a clean break between the HEDT and Xeon markets, that way to upsale people on server chips. That MB spec mentioning that when the 7980XE cannot support it is curious, like they may allow Xeons onto X299, which wasn't Intel's original plan. Definitely something I need to dig deeper on (as it could be a sign of more backtracking due to competition).


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajc9988*
> 
> No problem. Intel has been spotty on giving specs and good info due to the extra competition from AMD this round. Definitely a moving target on trying to get the information right. Especially because this is the generation Intel planned to make a clean break between the HEDT and Xeon markets, that way to upsale people on server chips. That MB spec mentioning that when the 7980XE cannot support it is curious, like they may allow Xeons onto X299, which wasn't Intel's original plan. Definitely something I need to dig deeper on (as it could be a sign of more backtracking due to competition).


I actually reserved that motherboard and an i9 at Microcenter, but when I got there bought the Threadripper









I couldn't resist building my first all AMD system. I've been an ATI/AMD GPU fan forever.


----------



## ajc9988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> I actually reserved that motherboard and an i9 at Microcenter, but when I got there bought the Threadripper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I couldn't resist building my first all AMD system. I've been an ATI/AMD GPU fan forever.


I hear you. My college PC was an AMD XP 3200+. So it felt good coming back after so long.

Also, they do list 3 corsair 32GB RDIMMs on the memory compatibility list as verified while only showing the HEDT chips on the CPU list. So I'm a little bit puzzled, unless they are saying you can use it, but not the ECC benefit of it, or I don't know what's up.
http://www.gigabyte.us/Motherboard/X299-AORUS-Gaming-9-rev-10#support-doc


----------



## fhpchris

How fast can you guys run on an AIO?

I can pass wprime 1024 and Cinebench at 4100+

Is 3500+ at 4ghz any good? I did test my RAM stability, but not at 4ghz/1.35v.
I pull ~413 watts total from the wall under cinebench load at 4ghz/1.35v.





I am going to go custom water, but I am waiting for you guys to test all the blocks for me!


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fhpchris*
> 
> How fast can you guys run on an AIO?
> 
> I can pass wprime 1024 and Cinebench at 4100+
> 
> Is 3500+ at 4ghz any good? I did test my RAM stability, but not at 4ghz/1.35v.
> I pull ~413 watts total from the wall under cinebench load at 4ghz/1.35v.
> 
> I am going to go custom water, but I am waiting for you guys to test all the blocks for me!


Well 3500+ at 4GHz is about right with good mem timings which you seem to have. I got around 3503 for the most part with my highest at 4GHz being 3547 once I got the Waterblock on. 4.1GHz managed 3572 but not in an optimal system config. Will need to re-bench that when I get another test OS setup.


----------



## linedesigner

A newbie is here. And excuse me if i ask a simple question but im stuck at this problem. Im trying to render a big scene with vray on 3dsmax, but it turns signal not found at my monitors but the leds are on while its rendering like nearly 5 mins or so. I didnt make any o/c. I use the computer in default options. And here is my specification of my pc:

MSI X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC
AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X
NZXT Kraken x62 (280mm) RGB 02 RL-KRX62-02
GSKILL F4-3600C17D-16GTZR G.SKILL Trident Z RGB DDR4-3600Mhz C17 16GB (2x8GB) DUAL
SAMSUNG MZ-V6E500BW 960 EVO 500GB
ASUS ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI

I can see benchmarks but i cant see a long render final image when i try to use 3dsmax big scene.What do u prefer to me to solve this issue.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *linedesigner*
> 
> A newbie is here. And excuse me if i ask a simple question but im stuck at this problem. Im trying to render a big scene with vray on 3dsmax, but it turns signal not found at my monitors but the leds are on while its rendering like nearly 5 mins or so. I didnt make any o/c. I use the computer in default options. And here is my specification of my pc:
> 
> MSI X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC
> AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X
> NZXT Kraken x62 (280mm) RGB 02 RL-KRX62-02
> GSKILL F4-3600C17D-16GTZR G.SKILL Trident Z RGB DDR4-3600Mhz C17 16GB (2x8GB) DUAL
> SAMSUNG MZ-V6E500BW 960 EVO 500GB
> ASUS ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI
> 
> I can see benchmarks but i cant see a long render final image when i try to use 3dsmax big scene.What do u prefer to me to solve this issue.


I am not sure precisely about what signal You are talking about........You might want to turn EMBREE off and see what happens...Embree is Intel proprietary IP, and IM not sure what instructions it is based on, so It might not work with AMD(I dont think so but You never know)...
Is the render working? is it showing the progress in the Vray frame buffer?...are You using only the CPu or the gpu too? is Your DP or HDMI cable too long connecting the monitor to the GPU?....this looks more a GPU related issue than a CPU one


----------



## linedesigner

Its a working scene i had rendered on my old laptop many times. But it seems there is a cpu voltage problem. Coz a friend of mine found that computer voltage goes lower when the scene rendering, when the pc is on idle it seems 1.36 but when the rendering is on some minutes later the cpu voltage seems 1.042 or so than the black screen come up. I just use cpu for rendering and i can see vray frame buffer the first prepass seems ok but when the render startup than some minutes later the monitors has no signal.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Wanted to stay off actual server grade components simply due to the high cost. Thank you for the suggestions! I was wondering between X299 and X399. Looks like I need to wait for a X399 workstation board that may have proper ECC RAM support.


Asrock supports unbuffered ECC on the Taichi and the Fatal1ty x399 boards. I haven't tested it but it's officially supported.


----------



## linedesigner

i think i solve my problem. I think the msi boost app did it. I re-install all msi apps and install just amd chipset drivers and turn the power management type as amd threadripper. And i install amd ryzen master now i use 1.225 volt for 3.6 mhz and everything is fine... There is no problem while rendering...


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *linedesigner*
> 
> A newbie is here. And excuse me if i ask a simple question but im stuck at this problem. Im trying to render a big scene with vray on 3dsmax, but it turns signal not found at my monitors but the leds are on while its rendering like nearly 5 mins or so. I didnt make any o/c. I use the computer in default options. And here is my specification of my pc:
> 
> MSI X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC
> AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X
> NZXT Kraken x62 (280mm) RGB 02 RL-KRX62-02
> GSKILL F4-3600C17D-16GTZR G.SKILL Trident Z RGB DDR4-3600Mhz C17 16GB (2x8GB) DUAL
> SAMSUNG MZ-V6E500BW 960 EVO 500GB
> ASUS ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI
> 
> I can see benchmarks but i cant see a long render final image when i try to use 3dsmax big scene.What do u prefer to me to solve this issue.


It's MSI fault. Try to locate beta BIOS 1.62 (its the latest that doesnt have POST beep bug). Black screen on 100% multithread load is known issue, and 90% likely fixed with that BIOS (or slightly previous one). It's not jsut that program, people were reporting it with winrar too, even with stock speeds, and only disabling "core performance boost" "fixes" it, but it comes with a huge price in that it completely disables any normal boost frequencies, and all overclocks are disabled.

i would recommend returning the board if you can and getting a different brand. MSI did a poor job on threadripper.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *linedesigner*
> 
> Its a working scene i had rendered on my old laptop many times. But it seems there is a cpu voltage problem. Coz a friend of mine found that computer voltage goes lower when the scene rendering, when the pc is on idle it seems 1.36 but when the rendering is on some minutes later the cpu voltage seems 1.042 or so than the black screen come up. I just use cpu for rendering and i can see vray frame buffer the first prepass seems ok but when the render startup than some minutes later the monitors has no signal.


it is normal and good for cpu voltage to go lower when under load, but you might want to change or check if load line calibration is set in auto...LLC....or try maximum level 2....if u go higher the CPU voltage will overshoot and it will damage the CPu so stay safe in auto or LLC level 2..if it wont work ask for help again here


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> it is normal and good for cpu voltage to go lower when under load, but you might want to change or check if load line calibration is set in auto...LLC....or try maximum level 2....if u go higher the CPU voltage will overshoot and it will damage the CPu so stay safe in auto or LLC level 2..if it wont work ask for help again here


that depends on the board on the taichi I have llc 3 and it pretty much stays stable droops from 1.312 to 1.3 at most but asus is weird and anything above llc2 will shoot up(shouldn't go up that much unless you are using llc 5 though)

best bet is find the voltage that works and the llc that keeps it as stable as possibble


----------



## sandysuk

false
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> i would recommend returning the board if you can and getting a different brand. MSI did a poor job on threadripper.


Perhaps a bit harsh, been quite pleased with my x399 Carbon, perhaps another board could get me further overclock but I'll give it some credit as its been rock solid.


----------



## winkizuma

Alright so I just ordered my parts for a custom loop. I have a Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS ordered and will be cooling the 1950x only. Will adding a 280mm radiator lower the temps by a significant amount say 7C or more? Or will it just be about 2~5C?

Custom Loop list:
XSPC Raystorm Neo
XSPC Special Edition D5 Photon Reservoir/Pump Combo V2 270mm
Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS
Barrow fittings/Tubing

Currently PC
Threadrippper 1950x
Asus Zenith Extreme
EVGA GTX 1080Ti FTW3
64GB of Gskill Trident Z
EVGA Supernova 850 Watt PSU Platinum
NZXT Kraken x52
Corsair 570x Case

I might get the Phanteks c399a instead of the XSPC, HardOCP had a great review on it. The Raystorm beat it by only 1 degree. The internal design of the block is outdated but I do like how it looks.

I also might water cool the GPU later on and if I do I will definitely add the 280.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> that depends on the board on the taichi I have llc 3 and it pretty much stays stable droops from 1.312 to 1.3 at most but asus is weird and anything above llc2 will shoot up(shouldn't go up that much unless you are using llc 5 though)
> 
> best bet is find the voltage that works and the llc that keeps it as stable as possibble


Tarot
Itis impossible for us users to measure overshoots and any measurements that would momentarily go above flat....Threadripper recommended voltage is 1.35 volts...so on any motherboard LLc yes changes, but I will not advise numbers above 2, also because as an example on ASUS CH6 anything above LLC2 will indeed damage the cpu....this guys renders on Vray, which will load the CPU at 100% indeed on all 16 threads making use of all the available cache, and he might do so dozens of times every day, for all the years HE will keep this computer till HE gets a new one


----------



## chew*

Yah need an Occiloscope to really catch any spikes. I settled at 1.275 llc 3 for 3.9 mission critical 24/7 on my buddies build. It droops a tad and has leeway for spikes that can not be seen via my DMM. That thing will be in use for years to come so best to play it safe.

No clue what other chip can do yet. Waiting for a vrm sink from asrock for my fatality x399 ES board.

Also been slammed lately....no pc time.


----------



## fhpchris

Quote:


> Alright so I just ordered my parts for a custom loop. I have a Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS ordered and will be cooling the 1950x only. Will adding a 280mm radiator lower the temps by a significant amount say 7C or more? Or will it just be about 2~5C?
> 
> Custom Loop list:
> XSPC Raystorm Neo
> XSPC Special Edition D5 Photon Reservoir/Pump Combo V2 270mm
> Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS
> Barrow fittings/Tubing
> 
> Currently PC
> Threadrippper 1950x
> Asus Zenith Extreme
> EVGA GTX 1080Ti FTW3
> 64GB of Gskill Trident Z
> EVGA Supernova 850 Watt PSU Platinum
> NZXT Kraken x52
> Corsair 570x Case
> 
> I might get the Phanteks c399a instead of the XSPC, HardOCP had a great review on it. The Raystorm beat it by only 1 degree. The internal design of the block is outdated but I do like how it looks.
> 
> I also might water cool the GPU later on and if I do I will definitely add the 280.


I think it depends greatly on what fans/fanspeed you intend to use as well as the core voltage and frequency.

I really have the same question. I can run a 50-60mm rad push pull, and a 240 Nemesis GTS, but I want to also cool one or two 1080ti. I think I really need to upgrade to a case that I can run 3 or more 480 or 560 radiators.... something like a Caselabs case.

Does anyone here have 1080ti SLI + 4ghz+ threadripper?


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah need an Occiloscope to really catch any spikes. I settled at 1.275 llc 3 for 3.9 mission critical 24/7 on my buddies build. It droops a tad and has leeway for spikes that can not be seen via my DMM. That thing will be in use for years to come so best to play it safe.
> 
> No clue what other chip can do yet. Waiting for a vrm sink from asrock for my fatality x399 ES board.
> 
> Also been slammed lately....no pc time.






I noticed the same thing that's why I used llc 3 but the asus boards are a bit different auto 1 and 2 are ok but above that it will overvolt a lot.
so it comes down to the board.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *winkizuma*
> 
> Alright so I just ordered my parts for a custom loop. I have a Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS ordered and will be cooling the 1950x only. Will adding a 280mm radiator lower the temps by a significant amount say 7C or more? Or will it just be about 2~5C?
> 
> Custom Loop list:
> XSPC Raystorm Neo
> XSPC Special Edition D5 Photon Reservoir/Pump Combo V2 270mm
> Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS
> Barrow fittings/Tubing
> 
> Currently PC
> Threadrippper 1950x
> Asus Zenith Extreme
> EVGA GTX 1080Ti FTW3
> 64GB of Gskill Trident Z
> EVGA Supernova 850 Watt PSU Platinum
> NZXT Kraken x52
> Corsair 570x Case
> 
> I might get the Phanteks c399a instead of the XSPC, HardOCP had a great review on it. The Raystorm beat it by only 1 degree. The internal design of the block is outdated but I do like how it looks.
> 
> I also might water cool the GPU later on and if I do I will definitely add the 280.






note also the voltage they put through for that 1.43 is a huge amount for 4 gig mine is 1.3 for 4.05 so the tests they have I would consider a worse case scenario based on a pretty dull chip.
for me here I can't seem to find one (except on there global site which gives me a price of $448 dollars...but that is exp post... yeah...no.

I did a little hunt for other reviews on the phanteks and came across this...not overly informative but I laughed my ass off














the comment on head pressure was interesting though


----------



## xkm1948

Any one with TR and 128GB RAM running perfectly? Last time I searched around there were none, at least on ASUS boards


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fhpchris*
> 
> I think it depends greatly on what fans/fanspeed you intend to use as well as the core voltage and frequency.
> 
> I really have the same question. I can run a 50-60mm rad push pull, and a 240 Nemesis GTS, but I want to also cool one or two 1080ti. I think I really need to upgrade to a case that I can run 3 or more 480 or 560 radiators.... something like a Caselabs case.
> 
> Does anyone here have 1080ti SLI + 4ghz+ threadripper?


titan pascal sli here with 4ghz threadripper. I have a 480 just for the cpu lol. I would say threadripper needs a 360 on it's own. As for the gpus a 360 worth of space will do, preferably a 480.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fhpchris*
> 
> I think it depends greatly on what fans/fanspeed you intend to use as well as the core voltage and frequency.
> 
> I really have the same question. I can run a 50-60mm rad push pull, and a 240 Nemesis GTS, but I want to also cool one or two 1080ti. I think I really need to upgrade to a case that I can run 3 or more 480 or 560 radiators.... something like a Caselabs case.
> 
> Does anyone here have 1080ti SLI + 4ghz+ threadripper?


4 way 1080 TI SLI with a 1920X at 4.075ghz.

I've got an alphacool UT45 360mm in the roof of my chassis and an XSPC EX240 in the front (it was lying around). They help but aren't enough to tame this beast. I have a Phobya G-Changer Xtreme Nova 1080 60mm radiator bolted to the side (that's a mouthful to say). Going by fan placement I'd want 4 480's, and it would be quieter than what I have right now. It would also be a lot bigger and weigh even more. Those caselabs cases are monsters.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chew**
> 
> Yah need an Occiloscope to really catch any spikes. I settled at 1.275 llc 3 for 3.9 mission critical 24/7 on my buddies build. It droops a tad and has leeway for spikes that can not be seen via my DMM. That thing will be in use for years to come so best to play it safe.
> 
> No clue what other chip can do yet. Waiting for a vrm sink from asrock for my fatality x399 ES board.
> 
> Also been slammed lately....no pc time.


3.9 at that voltage is pretty awesome, Your friend better put a nice big pizza on top of that big beer he owes you.....HE must have awesome temps as well...nice call!


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *winkizuma*
> 
> Alright so I just ordered my parts for a custom loop. I have a Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS ordered and will be cooling the 1950x only. Will adding a 280mm radiator lower the temps by a significant amount say 7C or more? Or will it just be about 2~5C?
> 
> Custom Loop list:
> XSPC Raystorm Neo
> XSPC Special Edition D5 Photon Reservoir/Pump Combo V2 270mm
> Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS
> Barrow fittings/Tubing
> 
> Currently PC
> Threadrippper 1950x
> Asus Zenith Extreme
> EVGA GTX 1080Ti FTW3
> 64GB of Gskill Trident Z
> EVGA Supernova 850 Watt PSU Platinum
> NZXT Kraken x52
> Corsair 570x Case
> 
> I might get the Phanteks c399a instead of the XSPC, HardOCP had a great review on it. The Raystorm beat it by only 1 degree. The internal design of the block is outdated but I do like how it looks.
> 
> I also might water cool the GPU later on and if I do I will definitely add the 280.


You have a very nice PSU, but You are really choked on it if You will go full load on the CPU and GPU...if u just gaming its fine, but forget adding more GPUS or anything else to this build...as for lowering temps, You will NOT lower temps most likely but you will at least keep them from going higher and stabilize faster....if You want lower temps, You might start with opting to make an external water box rather than mounting radiators inside any case...You might have opted for the enermax AIO as for a entry level build like the one You aiming at.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *winkizuma*
> 
> Alright so I just ordered my parts for a custom loop. I have a Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS ordered and will be cooling the 1950x only. Will adding a 280mm radiator lower the temps by a significant amount say 7C or more? Or will it just be about 2~5C?
> 
> Custom Loop list:
> XSPC Raystorm Neo
> XSPC Special Edition D5 Photon Reservoir/Pump Combo V2 270mm
> Black Ice Nemesis 360GTS
> Barrow fittings/Tubing
> 
> Currently PC
> Threadrippper 1950x
> Asus Zenith Extreme
> EVGA GTX 1080Ti FTW3
> 64GB of Gskill Trident Z
> EVGA Supernova 850 Watt PSU Platinum
> NZXT Kraken x52
> Corsair 570x Case
> 
> I might get the Phanteks c399a instead of the XSPC, HardOCP had a great review on it. The Raystorm beat it by only 1 degree. The internal design of the block is outdated but I do like how it looks.
> 
> I also might water cool the GPU later on and if I do I will definitely add the 280.


Nice system. I think that's a good PSU size for this system. Unless you go for custom loop, your chip will max at 275-300W and your TI could Max at 330-375. Plenty of headroom to keep you under 800W with a unit rated for high temps like the supernova.


----------



## a1b2c3d4x399

Has anybody here had any luck installing Windows 7 on Threadripper-based systems?

I have tried to no avail and I'm not exactly sure what I'm doing wrong. Installing Windows 7 on Skylake/Kaby Lake systems is very straightforward, but it's a nightmare on Threadripper-based systems.

In case anybody is wondering:

yes, I've updated the ISO with USB 3.1 Gen 1 and NVMe drivers
yes, I've disabled secure boot
yes, it's UEFI-compatible (Windows 7 Professional SP1 x64)
I'm using AHCI
I'm using XHCI hand-off as well as legacy USB support
PC Specs:

AMD Threadripper 1950X
MSI X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC
8x16GB Crucial Ballistix DDR4 2400 MHz RAM
1TB SAMSUNG 960 PRO PCI-E NVMe SSD
2x1TB SAMSUNG 850 EVO SATA SSD
6TB + 8TB Hitachi Deskstar NAS SATA HDD
GIGABYTE Aorus GeForce GTX 1080 Ti
I don't think anything in my setup is incompatible with Windows 7, so I'm not exactly sure what's stopping it. The specific error says something along the lines of "0xc000000d - The boot selection failed because a required device is inaccessible."

Any insights would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Any one with TR and 128GB RAM running perfectly? Last time I searched around there were none, at least on ASUS boards


Yes I am. Its harder to stabilize but you should be able to hit 2933mhz on memory.


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Yes I am. Its harder to stabilize but you should be able to hit 2933mhz on memory.


Not planning to overclock much if at all. The build will be strictly for a workstation so gaming performance is no concern. I would be happy even if it is 128GB at DDR4-2666, or hell even 2400!


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *a1b2c3d4x399*
> 
> Has anybody here had any luck installing Windows 7 on Threadripper-based systems?
> 
> I have tried to no avail and I'm not exactly sure what I'm doing wrong. Installing Windows 7 on Skylake/Kaby Lake systems is very straightforward, but it's a nightmare on Threadripper-based systems.
> 
> In case anybody is wondering:
> 
> yes, I've updated the ISO with USB 3.1 Gen 1 and NVMe drivers
> yes, I've disabled secure boot
> yes, it's UEFI-compatible (Windows 7 Professional SP1 x64)
> I'm using AHCI
> I'm using XHCI hand-off as well as legacy USB support
> PC Specs:
> 
> AMD Threadripper 1950X
> MSI X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC
> 8x16GB Crucial Ballistix DDR4 2400 MHz RAM
> 1TB SAMSUNG 960 PRO PCI-E NVMe SSD
> 2x1TB SAMSUNG 850 EVO SATA SSD
> 6TB + 8TB Hitachi Deskstar NAS SATA HDD
> GIGABYTE Aorus GeForce GTX 1080 Ti
> I don't think anything in my setup is incompatible with Windows 7, so I'm not exactly sure what's stopping it. The specific error says something along the lines of "0xc000000d - The boot selection failed because a required device is inaccessible."
> 
> Any insights would be greatly appreciated.


It installed just fine for me on my Zenith Extreme once I loaded the USB drivers. Your board seems to have a PS/2 port so you're in luck. Try with a regular Windows 7 ISO on a PS/2 keyboard. If it doesn't work it probably has something to do with NVMe. That error makes me think you may have loaded the drivers incorrectly.

Note: Windows 7 ISO should load just fine regardless if you loaded the drivers into it or not. Mouse/keyboard will not work obviously if you don't have the USB drivers. If you get errors on the stock Windows 7 ISO it might be some other problem.


----------



## fhpchris

Quote:


> Originally Posted by a1b2c3d4x399 View Post
> 
> Has anybody here had any luck installing Windows 7 on Threadripper-based systems?
> 
> I have tried to no avail and I'm not exactly sure what I'm doing wrong. Installing Windows 7 on Skylake/Kaby Lake systems is very straightforward, but it's a nightmare on Threadripper-based systems.
> 
> In case anybody is wondering:
> yes, I've updated the ISO with USB 3.1 Gen 1 and NVMe drivers
> yes, I've disabled secure boot
> yes, it's UEFI-compatible (Windows 7 Professional SP1 x64)
> I'm using AHCI
> I'm using XHCI hand-off as well as legacy USB support
> 
> PC Specs:
> AMD Threadripper 1950X
> MSI X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC
> 8x16GB Crucial Ballistix DDR4 2400 MHz RAM
> 1TB SAMSUNG 960 PRO PCI-E NVMe SSD
> 2x1TB SAMSUNG 850 EVO SATA SSD
> 6TB + 8TB Hitachi Deskstar NAS SATA HDD
> GIGABYTE Aorus GeForce GTX 1080 Ti
> 
> I don't think anything in my setup is incompatible with Windows 7, so I'm not exactly sure what's stopping it. The specific error says something along the lines of "0xc000000d - The boot selection failed because a required device is inaccessible."
> 
> Any insights would be greatly appreciated.


I have a MSI Gaming Pro Carbon as well as my Zenith Extreme, and I had a similar issue with windows 10 and a BSOD during the install. I guess the network drivers that were included caused my issues. If I didn't set up networking and went right into windows, I could install the right driver and be ok.

I do not know if it is some other issue, but the board is really decent as long as you have airflow over the VRM.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Not planning to overclock much if at all. The build will be strictly for a workstation so gaming performance is no concern. I would be happy even if it is 128GB at DDR4-2666, or hell even 2400!


Just make sure u get samsung B die and u should be good!


----------



## a1b2c3d4x399

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fhpchris*
> 
> I have a MSI Gaming Pro Carbon as well as my Zenith Extreme, and I had a similar issue with windows 10 and a BSOD during the install. I guess the network drivers that were included caused my issues. If I didn't set up networking and went right into windows, I could install the right driver and be ok.
> 
> I do not know if it is some other issue, but the board is really decent as long as you have airflow over the VRM.


Windows 10 installed without a problem on this rig. The only issue I had when I first started it up was that the Windows 10 installation USB wouldn't load, but I managed to fix that by disabling IOMMU.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> It installed just fine for me on my Zenith Extreme once I loaded the USB drivers. Your board seems to have a PS/2 port so you're in luck. Try with a regular Windows 7 ISO on a PS/2 keyboard. If it doesn't work it probably has something to do with NVMe. That error makes me think you may have loaded the drivers incorrectly.
> 
> Note: Windows 7 ISO should load just fine regardless if you loaded the drivers into it or not. Mouse/keyboard will not work obviously if you don't have the USB drivers. If you get errors on the stock Windows 7 ISO it might be some other problem.


I've used my 960 PRO on my Windows 7 Kaby Lake system just fine, so I don't see why it's not working here.

Maybe Windows 7 just isn't compatible with Threadripper.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *a1b2c3d4x399*
> 
> I've used my 960 PRO on my Windows 7 Kaby Lake system just fine, so I don't see why it's not working here.
> 
> Maybe Windows 7 just isn't compatible with Threadripper.


Can you at least get to the first installation menu on a stock Windows 7 iso?


----------



## xkm1948

Thank you!

Which X399 motherboard would you recommend? I figure it is best to ask the owners of TR platform here. Looking for best stability and RAM support.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Thank you!
> 
> Which X399 motherboard would you recommend? I figure it is best to ask the owners of TR platform here. Looking for best stability and RAM support.


I think the overall consensus is that the zenith extreme is best, but priciest. I went with the gigabyte aorus for rgb


----------



## TrixX

Outside the Zenith, the MSI Carbon is really good.


----------



## Aby67

The GPu will use 20 amps, but the cpu im afraid will pull most likely 50% more than what you say at full load.


----------



## crion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Thank you!
> 
> Which X399 motherboard would you recommend? I figure it is best to ask the owners of TR platform here. Looking for best stability and RAM support.


The X399 ASRock Taichi is solid with good RAM support and well priced. If you still want 10GBit LAN then Fatal1ty edition gets you there.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Outside the Zenith, the MSI Carbon is really good.


I disagree. Mine was buggy when I got it. It has a reset CMOS button on the back panel that I had to use all the time as it wouldn't ever come back from a failed oc. RAM tweaking was impossible as a result of this - I had to spend all day tweaking and resetting CMOS. There were other users who had trouble loading all cores in blender for the first several weeks until a BIOS update, and they were weeks late on NVME raid support.

I dropped my carbon for a Taichi. Night and day difference.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Thank you!
> 
> Which X399 motherboard would you recommend? I figure it is best to ask the owners of TR platform here. Looking for best stability and RAM support.


If price is no object the Zenith. Best of everything. If price to performance is important the Taichi. If you want price to performance with 10 gig Ethernet onboard, the Fatal1ty.

The Taichi and Fatal1ty are identical except for the extra 10gb Ethernet and their color scheme, and they both have sweet VRMs that can keep pace with the Zenith.


----------



## nycgtr

I checked out the asrock one recently, the fatility and I like it. I'd advise against the x399 gaming 7, I have it and the vrms get stupid hot without a fan pointing at it. I'd give the asrock a go if board size issue is a problem or the zenith is just too costly. EATX size locks you into a full tower without modding.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I checked out the asrock one recently, the fatility and I like it. I'd advise against the x399 gaming 7, I have it and the vrms get stupid hot without a fan pointing at it. I'd give the asrock a go if board size issue is a problem or the zenith is just too costly. EATX size locks you into a full tower without modding.


EATX has the same screw layout as ATX. It should mount just fine even if EATX is not supported as long as nothing is on the way.







Just gotta be careful not to bend motherboard when plugging 24 pin.


----------



## nycgtr

That's the i
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> EATX has the same screw layout as ATX. It should mount just fine even if EATX is not supported as long as nothing is on the way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just gotta be careful not to bend motherboard when plugging 24 pin.


the width is the issue. Some cases such as the evolv will take eatx but not ones as wide as the zenith without cutting


----------



## linedesigner

Is it logical if i update my msi x399 mainboard firmware from 1.5 to V1.63 beta version? which is : https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=290931.0 at this link?


----------



## sandysuk

Without a readme to know what has been implemented/fixed I'll stay with what works, I would like the raid bios but I'll wait.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> That's the i
> the width is the issue. Some cases such as the evolv will take eatx but not ones as wide as the zenith without cutting


This is the reason I decided to go with the AsRock since I have an Evolv case and I didn't want to sell it or anything. I really like the Evolv case one of my favorite cases and would had hated to part from it.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I checked out the asrock one recently, the fatility and I like it. I'd advise against the x399 gaming 7, I have it and the vrms get stupid hot without a fan pointing at it. I'd give the asrock a go if board size issue is a problem or the zenith is just too costly. EATX size locks you into a full tower without modding.


The Gigabyte board had the least robust VRMs on TR4, and a killer Nic instead of an Intel nic. Maybe the designaire fixed some of these problems but the Asus and Asrock offerings were so good who really cares.

Other than the BIOS and front panel USB 3.1, are there any features on the Asus that you missed on the Fatal1ty?


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> The Gigabyte board had the least robust VRMs on TR4, and a killer Nic instead of an Intel nic. Maybe the designaire fixed some of these problems but the Asus and Asrock offerings were so good who really cares.
> 
> Other than the BIOS and front panel USB 3.1, are there any features on the Asus that you missed on the Fatal1ty?


I bought the asus mainly because I figured if one board was going to have the most support and least issues out the box was the asus rog. I would of gone with the asrcok in the main otherwise. I don't like the asrock design but that's minor. Also, at the time I considered monoblocks and let's face it asus will get a monoblock before anyone else. I'd go with the asrock if there were restrictions to getting the zenith. I am happy with the zenith.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> This is the reason I decided to go with the AsRock since I have an Evolv case and I didn't want to sell it or anything. I really like the Evolv case one of my favorite cases and would had hated to part from it.


You can make the zenith fit. You just gotta break out the dremel. Example below.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> You can make the zenith fit. You just gotta break out the dremel. Example below.


Nice Work! Looks amazing in there. I personally didn't want to do any case cutting this time around so I was looking mainly for plug and play kind of setup.







If i ever need to upgrade the board later on I will but I don't think i will need to since the AsRock is running great.


----------



## Laudio

Hello Everyone
I have read many information here in this great forum but I am confuse in some way and if you don't mind I would like to ask for some questions.
I came from intel so this will be a great jump for me I think.
Right now I have:
Intel Core i7 3770k socket 1155 LGA
Asus Maximus V formula
16GB ddr3 Gskill trident 2400
Noctua NH-D15
Samsung 840 EVO SSD de 250 GB
Wester digital 500GB
Cooler Master CM Storm Stryker White Window
OCZ ZX850 80 Plus Gold 850W Modular
Asus GTX 660TI 2GB
Windows 10 X64
I am going to buy 2 new computers 1 for me and 1 for my wife and this is the setup.
I would say also that she we use many hours a day ours computer so I look for the way to have something between silence, powerfull and low cost on electricity. Also during the day we use both computers on 3 displays at the same time but when the night comes we usually play games.
Important. For us is not important RGB leds color we wanta practical computer so plese be free so suggest anything you thing it would be suit for us.

AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X Box sTR4
G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB DDR4 32GB DDR4 3200MHz 4x8gb F4-3200C14Q-32GTZR
Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7 AMD X399 ATX or ROG STRIX X399-E GAMING TR4 CPNT - or Asus x399 de a
Noctua NH-U14S tr4-sp3
ASUS ROG STRIX GTX 1080 TI OC 11GB or Gigabyte AORUS GeForce GTX 1080 Ti Xtreme Edition 11GB
Samsung 960 PRO NVMe M.2 512GB
be quiet! DARK POWER PRO 11 1200W
be quiet! Dark Base Pro 900

For now I have 2 questions:
I have seen some people who don't care to have 3200mhz or 2400mhz, they prefer to have 128gb instead 64 of 32gb. I thought that It´s better to have 3200mhz with a low CL, of course they must ne B-die Samsung. The question is&#8230; why?

The other one is should I look for a better refrigeration of CPU? Or they spend to much electricity? Noctua seems to be great too.

Please be free to suggest me everything you think, I have to under control the cost of the computers but now every year we buy a new one.
Thank you very much in advance.


----------



## Aenra

@Laudio

- RAM is.. RAM. Get as much as you need, not one gig more. God's honest truth. What may be confusing is that for reasons unrelated to what you're probably asking about, people choose to install more modules and of higher densities so as to take advantage of the bandwidth benefit. The truth is that barring applications you'd already be aware of (you'd be using them), said benefit is only good for one thing: looking at the big numbers and feeling better. Zero real life/empirical benefit. Just theoretical caps of what your PC could do; but does and will not.

Frequency and timings do matter and in multiple ways, but you seem to have grasped that already, so yeah, you focus on those 

- As to cooling, unless you plan on overclocking a Noctua beast air cooler (or equivalent) is just fine. If you do plan on OCing, you'd need at least a 360 AIO (AIO as in a "ready-made" all-in-one watercooling unit). If you plan on like really OCing, then you need a custom water loop. Plenty of info on temps available in the thread, read.

On a general level, remember what this site is about, remember what this entails and as such, how to filter the info you find available here. Hope that helps.


----------



## Laudio

false
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> @Laudio
> 
> - RAM is.. RAM. Get as much as you need, not one gig more. God's honest truth. What may be confusing is that for reasons unrelated to what you're probably asking about, people choose to install more modules and of higher densities so as to take advantage of the bandwidth benefit. The truth is that barring applications you'd already be aware of (you'd be using them), said benefit is only good for one thing: looking at the big numbers and feeling better. Zero real life/empirical benefit. Just theoretical caps of what your PC _could_ do; but does and will not.
> 
> Frequency and timings do matter and in multiple ways, but you seem to have grasped that already, so yeah, you focus on those
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - As to cooling, unless you plan on overclocking a Noctua beast air cooler (or equivalent) is just fine. If you do plan on OCing, you'd need at least a 360 AIO (AIO as in a "ready-made" all-in-one watercooling unit). If you plan on like _really_ OCing, then you need a custom water loop. Plenty of info on temps available in the thread, read.
> 
> On a general level, remember what this site is about, remember what this entails and as such, how to filter the info you find available here. Hope that helps.


Thank you for your answer.

About memory definitely i will buy G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB DDR4 32GB DDR4 3200MHz 4x8gb F4-3200C14Q-32GTZR (I have to know how to chech if stiks of memory have de good ones B-die´s)

And talking about coling.. well honestly my idea is to make a little bit of OC maybe not as much as my i7 which is 3.5ghz and i have set on 4.7ghz but if Turbo Clock: 4.0 GHz maybe around 4.3....but no more of 4.5... do you think Noctua NH-U14S tr4-sp3 would be enogh? and if not, what limit i should not trought.

Thank you very much.


----------



## ITAngel

Can you run TR4 and Vega64 on a single EK Stream PE 360? Of course stock setting. Thanks!


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Laudio*
> 
> false
> Thank you for your answer.
> 
> About memory definitely i will buy G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB DDR4 32GB DDR4 3200MHz 4x8gb F4-3200C14Q-32GTZR (I have to know how to chech if stiks of memory have de good ones B-die´s)
> 
> And talking about coling.. well honestly my idea is to make a little bit of OC maybe not as much as my i7 which is 3.5ghz and i have set on 4.7ghz but if Turbo Clock: 4.0 GHz maybe around 4.3....but no more of 4.5... do you think Noctua NH-U14S tr4-sp3 would be enogh? and if not, what limit i should not trought.
> 
> Thank you very much.


I didn't try that kit, but I did try 3 G.Skill kits, two from that generation memory line up (3600 & 4000) and didn't have much luck with them. The 3600 kit was very close to being stable though, but lost XMP on every reboot (stable otherwise, passed Aida64 stress, etc), so I bet the 3200 will be fine. The 4000 kit was on my Gigabyte Aorus x399 Gaming 7 QVL when downgraded to 3600, but it wasn't working out. I then tried a Corsair Dominator Platinum 8 stick kit on my QVL (for 8 sticks), DDR4-3200, but it couldn't pass Aida64 and I experienced lock ups too.

I was about to order a G.Skill RGB kit made for AMD, fastest available at this time is 2933 and only in 8 stick kits. I don't need 8 sticks, and not at $200 more than the DDR4-3200 Dominators

I bought Corsair Vengeance RGB DDR4-3200 CL16. Newegg advertised this kit as X399 compatible, bought it, it's working great: https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820236199

Posted some tech info on Gigabyte forum: http://forum.gigabyte.us/thread/2633/corsair-vengence-ddr4-3200-compatible

5th kit is a charm?


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I checked out the asrock one recently, the fatility and I like it. I'd advise against the x399 gaming 7, I have it and the vrms get stupid hot without a fan pointing at it. I'd give the asrock a go if board size issue is a problem or the zenith is just too costly. EATX size locks you into a full tower without modding.


What temps are you talking about? I've had no issue with my Aorus x399 Gaming 7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Can you run TR4 and Vega64 on a single EK Stream PE 360? Of course stock setting. Thanks!


Would not recommend it. I had my 1950X and FuryX's on the same loop and temps were not where i wanted them to be. Now I have them on their own loops and temps are much better


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> What temps are you talking about? I've had no issue with my Aorus x399 Gaming 7


I also have a Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7. When I run Aida64 stress test the highest I see my VRM hit is 52c.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> What temps are you talking about? I've had no issue with my Aorus x399 Gaming 7
> Would not recommend it. I had my 1950X and FuryX's on the same loop and temps were not where i wanted them to be. Now I have them on their own loops and temps are much better


I see, I have also another 240mm rad will that help with the 360mm rad or should I just get a secondary pump for the GPU? If so, what size Rad will work? Does a 240mm for the gpu is more than enough?


----------



## Memmento Mori

Just for info, are there planed any other mobos for TR or ust what atm is? any rumors? Im a bit dissapointed that MSI has just 2 mobos for TR









ty for any info









MM


----------



## AlphaC

Just found this memory based comparison...

Everyone using Threadripper 1950X as workstation should be running faster than 2666MHz DDR4









http://bbs.ntpcb.com/read.php?tid-94825.html

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Memmento Mori*
> 
> Just for info, are there planed any other mobos for TR or ust what atm is? any rumors? Im a bit dissapointed that MSI has just mobos for TR
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ty for any info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MM


http://www.overclock.net/t/1635296/amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread

Designare EX


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Laudio*
> 
> Hello Everyone
> I have read many information here in this great forum but I am confuse in some way and if you don't mind I would like to ask for some questions.
> I came from intel so this will be a great jump for me I think.
> Right now I have:
> Intel Core i7 3770k socket 1155 LGA
> Asus Maximus V formula
> 16GB ddr3 Gskill trident 2400
> Noctua NH-D15
> Samsung 840 EVO SSD de 250 GB
> Wester digital 500GB
> Cooler Master CM Storm Stryker White Window
> OCZ ZX850 80 Plus Gold 850W Modular
> Asus GTX 660TI 2GB
> Windows 10 X64
> I am going to buy 2 new computers 1 for me and 1 for my wife and this is the setup.
> I would say also that she we use many hours a day ours computer so I look for the way to have something between silence, powerfull and low cost on electricity. Also during the day we use both computers on 3 displays at the same time but when the night comes we usually play games.
> Important. For us is not important RGB leds color we wanta practical computer so plese be free so suggest anything you thing it would be suit for us.
> 
> AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X Box sTR4
> G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB DDR4 32GB DDR4 3200MHz 4x8gb F4-3200C14Q-32GTZR
> Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7 AMD X399 ATX or ROG STRIX X399-E GAMING TR4 CPNT - or Asus x399 de a
> Noctua NH-U14S tr4-sp3
> ASUS ROG STRIX GTX 1080 TI OC 11GB or Gigabyte AORUS GeForce GTX 1080 Ti Xtreme Edition 11GB
> Samsung 960 PRO NVMe M.2 512GB
> be quiet! DARK POWER PRO 11 1200W
> be quiet! Dark Base Pro 900
> 
> For now I have 2 questions:
> I have seen some people who don't care to have 3200mhz or 2400mhz, they prefer to have 128gb instead 64 of 32gb. I thought that It´s better to have 3200mhz with a low CL, of course they must ne B-die Samsung. The question is&#8230; why?
> 
> The other one is should I look for a better refrigeration of CPU? Or they spend to much electricity? Noctua seems to be great too.
> 
> Please be free to suggest me everything you think, I have to under control the cost of the computers but now every year we buy a new one.
> Thank you very much in advance.






if that gskill is around the same price as the gskill 3200 flarex get the flarex it seems to be pretty much bulletproof(at leastmine seems to be







)

as for cooling the cooler it is the less juice you will use at stock so I would suggest a good aio like the enermax(or if you can get one cheap a corsair h115i also works well for something that's not made for theses chips, I had pretty good results with mine.
so cooler is more efficient and in my opinion better.

I like the ahrd drive but I,m a cheapass an got the 960 evo which so far is working really well for me for a bit cheaper.

motherboards...I,m a big fan of the asrock taichi it has caused me zero issues so far not saying any other board is better or worse just saying I love mine(especially again seeing it is over here the cheapest one.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> I also have a Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7. When I run Aida64 stress test the highest I see my VRM hit is 52c.


Try prime 95. I get up to 90 here unless there's a fan on it. Zenith gets to mid 70s. without a fan on it or the little fan spinning


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Try prime 95. I get up to 90 here unless there's a fan on it. Zenith gets to mid 70s. without a fan on it or the little fan spinning


Corsair 780T case.

Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7

Prime95: VRM got up to 55c.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> Corsair 780T case.
> 
> Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7
> 
> Prime95: VRM got up to 55c.


You'd have lower vrm temps than my water cooled vrms if that was possible.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> You'd have lower vrm temps than my water cooled vrms if that was possible.


I kick off Prime95 and watch my temps....

CPU hits around 66c +/-
VRM 55c and it takes a while to get to 55c.

This is being reported by AIDA64 sensors.

EDIT: Re-ran and used Corsair Link to monitor VRM temp = 66c


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> I kick off Prime95 and watch my temps....
> 
> CPU hits around 66c +/-
> VRM 55c and it takes a while to get to 55c.
> 
> This is being reported by AIDA64 sensors.
> 
> EDIT: Re-ran and used Corsair Link to monitor VRM temp = 66c


Use hwinfo and see.


----------



## Dotachin

Does anyone have any issues formatting sata drives?

Trying to set my 1TB SSD as MBR NTFS and Disk Manager freezes, Mini Tool Partition Wizard says success instantly but leaves the drive unformatted.
The drive works just fine in my Sandy Bridge system.

I have the latest chipset drivers, is there a sata AMD driver around?
(OS is in a pcie nvme thankfully)


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Use hwinfo and see.


So, yeah my first temp appears accurate? Temps actually started going down after peaking at 54c...

Am I reading this right?


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Does anyone have any issues formatting sata drives?
> 
> Trying to set my 1TB SSD as MBR NTFS and Disk Manager freezes, Mini Tool Partition Wizard says success instantly but leaves the drive unformatted.
> The drive works just fine in my Sandy Bridge system.
> 
> I have the latest chipset drivers, is there a sata AMD driver around?
> (OS is in a pcie nvme thankfully)


I used to use Mini Tool, until last night. It kept crashing my system trying to copy a disk...
It might be an AMD thing? I was able to use it to copy the C: drive just fine, but that's a reboot operation, this drive copy was in Windows and just simply crashed every time after perhaps an hour...

Just use Windows to partition and format, disk management. There's nothing special about what you're doing that needs a Mini Tool from the sounds of it.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> I used to use Mini Tool, until last night. It kept crashing my system trying to copy a disk...
> It might be an AMD thing? I was able to use it to copy the C: drive just fine, but that's a reboot operation, this drive copy was in Windows and just simply crashed every time after perhaps an hour...
> 
> Just use Windows to partition and format, disk management. There's nothing special about what you're doing that needs a Mini Tool from the sounds of it.


Yeah, I only downloaded the mini tool after the third-time disk manager crashed.
I really think it's a driver issue, sometimes Windows takes forever to load if I leave the drive plugged (sometimes it never does). It feels like it sees it but can't read or write even at 1mbs.
I have a sata Blu-ray drive that works fine though.
Wondering if anyone else had the problem.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> So, yeah my first temp appears accurate? Temps actually started going down after peaking at 54c...
> 
> Am I reading this right?


How long have you ran prime for? Try leaving it for 15 minutes. 54 is about the peak I get with a monoblock attached to a 480 rad.


----------



## mmonnin

GN did a tear-down of the Liqtech. Nice big ol' fin area.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> How long have you ran prime for? Try leaving it for 15 minutes. 54 is about the peak I get with a monoblock attached to a 480 rad.


Look at the timer in the PIC.

15 minutes, and temps started going down lol.

Corsair H110i GTX for CPU cooling with Corsair 780T case with airflow FTW.

2 Front 140 fans venting into case.
1 Bottom 120 fan venting into case
1 Rear 140 fan venting out of case
2 Radiator 140 fans venting out of top case

Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7
Threadripper 1950x
Corsair 780T case
Corsair 1500i PSU
Corsair Vengeance RGB DDR4-3200 CL16

Cool









I was worried about VRM temps on this mobo, but not so much anymore.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> Look at the timer in the PIC.
> 
> 15 minutes, and temps started going down lol.
> 
> Corsair H110i GTX for CPU cooling with Corsair 780T case with airflow FTW.
> 
> 2 Front 140 fans venting into case.
> 1 Bottom 120 fan venting into case
> 1 Rear 140 fan venting out of case
> 2 Radiator 140 fans venting out of top case
> 
> Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7
> Threadripper 1950x
> Corsair 780T case
> Corsair 1500i PSU
> Corsair Vengeance RGB DDR4-3200 CL16
> 
> Cool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was worried about VRM temps on this mobo, but not so much anymore.


I realized why your temps are so low. Your not overclocked. Your pulling 100 watt less on the package vs overclocked.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I realized why your temps are so low. Your not overclocked. Your pulling 100 watt less on the package vs overclocked.


True. All I care about is XMP.

I'm glad my cooling solution is up to that at full load


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> True. All I care about is XMP.
> 
> I'm glad my cooling solution is up to that at full load


Yeah running at XMP will satisfy most of ones needs, though i think overclocking for a 15% increase in performance can come in handy in day to day workload scenarios, eg, when you want to render VRay RT on the GPus in interiors scenes where the CPU takes more time to load the whole render....those few seconds gained from the overclock can be welcome in such cases.....I think if You need more performance on the long term You are then better of daisy chaining more machines......I just cant wait for the 32 cores variant as it will be very interesting to double the performance on a single socket solution that can definitely outrun even some good GPus in compute performance.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Yeah running at XMP will satisfy most of ones needs, though i think overclocking for a 15% increase in performance can come in handy in day to day workload scenarios, eg, when you want to render VRay RT on the GPus in interiors scenes where the CPU takes more time to load the whole render....those few seconds gained from the overclock can be welcome in such cases.....I think if You need more performance on the long term You are then better of daisy chaining more machines......I just cant wait for the 32 cores variant as it will be very interesting to double the performance on a single socket solution that can definitely outrun even some good GPus in compute performance.


We always want more!

Wasn't too long ago I had only a 6 core 5930


----------



## trnewb

Double post. Sorry.


----------



## trnewb

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> GN did a tear-down of the Liqtech. Nice big ol' fin area.


Lol even AIO's now have way bigger fin areas and than EK's Threadripper waterblock.

Anybody ordered Watercool's Heatkiller for Threadripper yet? Waiting for the nickel version and wondering about the performance @ 4 Ghz...


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> We always want more!
> 
> Wasn't too long ago I had only a 6 core 5930


Yeah Humans are predators, as a result as You say we always want more, but I think that overall Overclocking, give you yes more but not that much more....I think that what matters is to get more by manufacturers offering new products that will double the performance every 12 18 months, more than overlcocking, and I can ony be grateful for AMD taking us out of this INtel charlatans business model...which by the way they are still practicing as all their new line of CPUs, yes performs better because of higher clocks thanks to smaller cache, but they could have done this all the way back to 2013/14


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trnewb*
> 
> Lol even AIO's now have way bigger fin areas and than EK's Threadripper waterblock.
> 
> Anybody ordered Watercool's Heatkiller for Threadripper yet? Waiting for the nickel version and wondering about the performance @ 4 Ghz...


Threadripper needs very tall fins spread all over the IHS, EK blocks are not only junk because of the Intel old design , but also because of the low quality acrylic they use...YOU CANNOT USE ACRYLIC FOR HEDT/HPC Cpus...Just imagine if Nasa used acrylic for their hardware in the space shuttle or a freaking satellite....or Amazon servers with acrylic tops...the world could be without internet the day after.


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> YOU CANNOT USE ACRYLIC FOR HEDT/HPC Cpus...Just imagine if Nasa used acrylic for their hardware in the space shuttle or a freaking satellite....or Amazon servers with acrylic tops...the world could be without internet the day after.


Complete and utter nonsense.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Complete and utter nonsense.


It is not nonsense, Acrylic is a very delicate material and worse with water, you will surely get all the waterblocks clogged with the plastic sooner or later, and possibly cripple also the pumps efficiency, acrylic as all plastic has also great issues with osmosis...plastic in general is a very bad material if it has to deal with water unless treated with epoxy and even then, if not painted properly with special paints keen to different degrees of corrosion depending on circumstances. Long sotry short , if You want Your cooling loops to be clean dont use plastic especially delicate as and malleable and rough as acrylic


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> It is not nonsense, Acrylic is a very delicate material and worse with water, you will surely get all the waterblocks clogged with the plastic sooner or later, and possibly cripple also the pumps efficiency, acrylic as all plastic has also great issues with osmosis...plastic in general is a very bad material if it has to deal with water unless treated with epoxy and even then, if not painted properly with special paints keen to different degrees of corrosion depending on circumstances. Long sotry short , if You want Your cooling loops to be clean dont use plastic especially delicate as and malleable and rough as acrylic


So did I ended up grabbing the wrong block for my Vega card? I got the one that had acrylic. Maybe I should have gotten the all black one that was all metal.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> So did I ended up grabbing the wrong block for my Vega card? I got the one that had acrylic. Maybe I should have gotten the all black one that was all metal.


I think when given a choice best to avoid plastic, but it is understandable that it some people want to see the water or the colour in the loop....XSPC a has moved to special glass for the 1080ti block , while glass still scratches a lot with water, it is not as bad as plastic....if You like that block just clean it once in a while eg every 6 months.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> I think when given a choice best to avoid plastic, but it is understandable that it some people want to see the water or the colour in the loop....XSPC a has moved to special glass for the 1080ti block , while glass still scratches a lot with water, it is not as bad as plastic....if You like that block just clean it once in a while eg every 6 months.


Yea I mean my loop is base of dark rubber tube but I may go hard tube next year. I open the packaged but have not installed the block. So I still have maybe a change to get it replaced if anything.









On a side note anyone recommend a hard tube tool kit that I can order online?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Yea I mean my loop is base of dark rubber tube but I may go hard tube next year. I open the packaged but have not installed the block. So I still have maybe a change to get it replaced if anything.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note anyone recommend a hard tube tool kit that I can order online?


I have those EK Rubber tubes, i bought them because i wanted some tubes that can be more strong than regular ones as I use a big external waterbox for cooling...when i first received them i really had to wash them a lot in water cause they are really dirty out of the box...back them i suspected that i would get the lop become a mess very fast..to my surprise it didnt, bu tif u go all copper hard tubing awesome solution because these tubes i got take a very long time to cool down as they retain a lot of heat, for along time.....as for the block go with what you fancy, but think of maintenace..I prefer all copper blocks because they dissipate passively heat so the loop cools down faster when u stop loads....its little things but to me even if u can get 1 C lower temps it matters...im that kind of freak for this kind of things...You dont need to


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Does anyone have any issues formatting sata drives?
> 
> Trying to set my 1TB SSD as MBR NTFS and Disk Manager freezes, Mini Tool Partition Wizard says success instantly but leaves the drive unformatted.
> The drive works just fine in my Sandy Bridge system.
> 
> I have the latest chipset drivers, is there a sata AMD driver around?
> (OS is in a pcie nvme thankfully)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Yeah, I only downloaded the mini tool after the third-time disk manager crashed.
> I really think it's a driver issue, sometimes Windows takes forever to load if I leave the drive plugged (sometimes it never does). It feels like it sees it but can't read or write even at 1mbs.
> I have a sata Blu-ray drive that works fine though.
> Wondering if anyone else had the problem.


update: I downloaded and installed AMD SATA Controller version 1.3.1.276 (date 03/19/2015) . But when I go to Device Manager to update the ssd controller, the only one shown is a Microsoft one from 2006. I'm certain this controller is the problem. I can't pick up the AMD one even when booted to the "enable unsigned controllers" mode in Windows 10. Not even in test mode, it just doesn't pick up amdsata.inf as a valid controller for a drive.

If I take the ssd and put it in a USB case and plug it in it works flawlessly









@chew* Do you know anything about a properly signed AMD Sata driver?

ps: would anyone with a sata ssd/hdd go to device manager and tell me which driver are you using, please? Thanks









Ps2 when I say controller I mean driver. Translation problem xD


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> GN did a tear-down of the Liqtech. Nice big ol' fin area.


Good to know, I have the 360 variant of that cooler and I can tell you it performs great.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> So did I ended up grabbing the wrong block for my Vega card? I got the one that had acrylic. Maybe I should have gotten the all black one that was all metal.


Acrylic is fine as long as you keep it under 50C, with lower being better. Remember that the cooling engine itself is copper or nickel plated copper, so GPU teps can go as high as they want.

The only way to get acrylic to 50C is with water temps of 50C, at which point die temps would probably be 80C on the GPU. You won't have that problem so you should be fine.

There are people on this forum with 10+ year old acrylic blocks that still function and look good. Just flush your loop once a year and you'll be fine as long as you use a decent biocide (corrosion inhibitor too if you want to keep your nickel and copper shiny).


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> update: I downloaded and installed AMD SATA Controller version 1.3.1.276 (date 03/19/2015) . But when I go to Device Manager to update the ssd controller, the only one shown is a Microsoft one from 2006. I'm certain this controller is the problem. I can't pick up the AMD one even when booted to the "enable unsigned controllers" mode in Windows 10. Not even in test mode, it just doesn't pick up amdsata.inf as a valid controller for a drive.
> 
> If I take the ssd and put it in a USB case and plug it in it works flawlessly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @chew* Do you know anything about a properly signed AMD Sata driver?
> 
> ps: would anyone with a sata ssd/hdd go to device manager and tell me which driver are you using, please? Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ps2 when I say controller I mean driver. Translation problem xD






if you mean the standard ahci controller Microsoft 10.0.16299.15

I have tried amd ones t=and they go pear shaped in 5 seconds.
as for the ssd and nvme I sue the latest Samsung ones haven't had an issue with any drive or the blu ray (since that is what I,m using to back up my 4k worth of dvds I would hope not


----------



## Aby67

Guys it apparently seems confirmed..... EPYC on 7nm 64 cores 256Mb cache and freaking 3200Mhz ECC memory...all on 128 PCIe GEN 4

Looks like that at AMD they have been working hard on the memory controller and Samsung having Aces up their RAM sleeves.

8 months from now it will become an epyc year for Threadripper





Motherboard manufacturers on x399 better put their **** together just as some water cooling components manufacturing companies by then, I dont wanna make names Asu..coughs s coughs coughs E...coughs K.

Any educated idea on likely Clock and Ram speeds for a 32 Core 7nm TR?


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> if you mean the standard ahci controller Microsoft 10.0.16299.15
> 
> I have tried amd ones t=and they go pear shaped in 5 seconds.
> as for the ssd and nvme I sue the latest Samsung ones haven't had an issue with any drive or the blu ray (since that is what I,m using to back up my 4k worth of dvds I would hope not


Ty I just solved it minutes ago.
I tried so many things idk what did the trick (turned out the AMD driver was to be installed over the default one under ATA/ATAPI IDE branch in device manager [unchecking the "show only compatible" box], but that alone didn't fix it I had to update the firmware of the Crucial SSD and to do that succesfuly I had to remove the drive from my ICY DOCK 6 x 2.5 SSD cage and plug it directly to the mobo for some reason otherwise it failed to update. Anyway I was finally able to format the drive and just copied some files to it and evrything is finally ready in the build







Now to dowload some games

ps yeah idk if it was their fault but I won't be buying Crucial SSDs for a while


----------



## Fantasy

Man, this is super frustrating. I have been trying to get my RAM to 3200MHz stable and I just can't. I have been trying for a month now and nothing. No timing or voltage will let me get my ram stable above 3033MHz.

I think I really have a crappy IMC.

This is as far as I have gotten to a 24/7 stable OC.

I have a 64GB kit with Samsung B-die. Corsair CMR64GX4M4C3333C16 VENGEANCE RGB 64GB DDR4 3333 (PC4-26600)

My SOC voltage is 1.1v.
My DRAM voltage is 1.4v
My VTT DDR voltage is 0.7v


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Man, this is super frustrating. I have been trying to get my RAM to 3200MHz stable and I just can't. I have been trying for a month now and nothing. No timing or voltage will let me get my ram stable above 3033MHz.
> 
> I think I really have a crappy IMC.
> 
> This is as far as I have gotten to a 24/7 stable OC.
> 
> I have a 64GB kit with Samsung B-die. Corsair CMR64GX4M4C3333C16 VENGEANCE RGB 64GB DDR4 3333 (PC4-26600)
> 
> My SOC voltage is 1.1v.
> My DRAM voltage is 1.4v
> My VTT DDR voltage is 0.7v


you saying you cant run 3333 even starting with 20 20 20 40?


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> you saying you cant run 3333 even starting with 20 20 20 40?


I can boot 3200 and sometimes 3333. But I can't get to be stable. The second I run a memory stress test I get a bunch of errors. I tried 3200 @ 16 16 16 16 50 75 and couldn't get that stable. Even with 1.5v on memory. I have been playing with the timings for weeks and nothing is stable above 3033MHz.

I never tried 3333 20 20 20 40 though


----------



## sandysuk

What about higher SOC, I need ~1.2 for mine and if I don't cool the ram I will get memory error eventually even though it doesn't go much over 60C.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> I can boot 3200 and sometimes 3333. But I can't get to be stable. The second I run a memory stress test I get a bunch of errors. I tried 3200 @ 16 16 16 16 50 75 and couldn't get that stable. Even with 1.5v on memory. I have been playing with the timings for weeks and nothing is stable above 3033MHz.
> 
> I never tried 3333 20 20 20 40 though





first be very careful with soc too much is not a good thing








also I noticed geardown disabled try enabled and 2T you have 4 16 gig sticks they are not going to be easy.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> first be very careful with soc too much is not a good thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also I noticed geardown disabled try enabled and 2T you have 4 16 gig sticks they are not going to be easy.


geardown enabled overrides any command rate you set. 1T, 2T, makes no difference. It's something like a 1.5T


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> if I don't cool the ram I will get memory error eventually even though it doesn't go much over 60C.


Not sure if i'm reading this right, but if what you're saying is that your actual RAM modules reach 60c?

Forget about OCing and start focusing on airflow; all the way to a better chassis if need be.

I torture my DDR4s, i mean literally torture.. voltages, workloads, time (read: days without stop) running said workloads; and this at capacities beyond 32 gigs. I have never seen them above 34Cs and that was during the summer, which trust you me, is warmer than most other countries' summers.


----------



## sandysuk

Less about the case air flow and more about the environmental temperature and noise requirements. My machine is quieter at maximum performance when gaming than my PS4, despite so much packed in the case.

I'd like it to be even more silent ideally but can't see and OC'd TR, 1080Tis etc going passive. I would like to find a quieter pump though, so recommendations for the strong silent type would be nice, of course the coil whine on the Tis isn't going anywhere







without that it would be a lot better under load.

My min temps are 27-30C after switch on and idle not doing anything. The coldest thing in my system is my SSDs at 25C.


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Less about the case air flow and more about the environmental temperature and noise requirements.


If you say so; keep enjoying those 60Cs 

(as you just pointed out after all, you appear to know best)


----------



## JUANNY

Heya all I have a quick question. Just bought the Asrock Fatality Pro Gaming X399 and gskill F4-2933C14Q-64GFX. I have it running stable at 3200 cl14. I set the ddr ram voltage to 1.45 and VDDCR_SOC_S5 TO 1.2V. Is the VDDCR_SOC_S5 the correct setting for the theadripper IMC.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JUANNY*
> 
> Heya all I have a quick question. Just bought the Asrock Fatality Pro Gaming X399 and gskill F4-2933C14Q-64GFX. I have it running stable at 3200 cl14. I set the ddr ram voltage to 1.45 and VDDCR_SOC_S5 TO 1.2V. Is the VDDCR_SOC_S5 the correct setting for the theadripper IMC.


I'm no expert, but that sounds high for DDR ram voltage. I use XMP on my Corsair Vengeance RGB DDR4-3200 CL16 on my Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7 and just checked AIDA64, DDR ram voltage is 1.368v/1.380v on auto.


----------



## Dotachin

1950X for $699 at Micro Center

1920X $499


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> 1950X for $699 at Micro Center
> 
> 1920X $499


You kidding me right now. 1950X is $699. I got it for 1k... should have waited.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> What about higher SOC, I need ~1.2 for mine and if I don't cool the ram I will get memory error eventually even though it doesn't go much over 60C.


I honestly haven't found any difference from increasing my SOC voltage. I went all the way up to 1.3v and it didn't make any difference.
Right now it is set to 1.0v
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> first be very careful with soc too much is not a good thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also I noticed geardown disabled try enabled and 2T you have 4 16 gig sticks they are not going to be easy.


I will try enabling geardown and see if that helps.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> You kidding me right now. 1950X is $699. I got it for 1k... should have waited.
> I honestly haven't found any difference from increasing my SOC voltage. I went all the way up to 1.3v and it didn't make any difference.
> Right now it is set to 1.0v
> I will try enabling geardown and see if that helps.






geardown disabled is needed for odd timings on ram like cl15 for example and if you have it enabled 1t=1.5 but 2t should equal 2t.

as for the 699...I refuse to walk 15000 kilometers to get a discount







that is only walk in price from what I have read.

as for soc 1.2 is the ragged edge and should not be needed 1.4/1.1 should be what works but different sticks different setups etc...I just would not go that high on the soc


----------



## thermophile

:removed:


----------



## Ithanul

Hello all,

Got a 1900X here that got off a fellow OCNer.
Trying to get Linux Mint 18.2 to install. I installed Mint before on a 1090T and FX8120 system before. Not sure what is up, but the installer fails right when grub2 files are to be installed.
The installer stats that 'grub-efi-amd64-signed' package failed into /traget/.

Anyone here have experience with getting a Linux distro to play ball on a TR system?

Some more info, installing on a Intel SSD 180GB. Original had a duel boot W7 and Mint Mate 18 on it. Did a full erase already on these.


----------



## Aby67

Despite tons of sales of the 1950x , and prices having gown down significantly for over a month, and now these sales, makes me definitely understand , that all retailers wanna totalle clear their threadripper stocks by xmas......this can only mean that a new threadripper is due much earlier than the summer........i could guess a 32core but on 12nm process that can overclock above 4.6 ghz


----------



## mmonnin

Ubuntu 17.04 and .10 install fine for me


----------



## superstition222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> What is the point of the threadripper 1900X?


There really isn't much of one. Even at $350 (Micro Center's current pricing), it doesn't make much sense. $150 more gets a 1920X and a 1700X is $229.

I was hoping that the quad channel RAM would do more. But, really, the 1900X seems to have very little appeal, unlike the 1920X. If a person is going to spend that kind of money on a CPU, board, and cooling, the 1920X and 1950X are the only models that make any sense.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> Ubuntu 17.04 and .10 install fine for me


I think I found some answers while researching around a bit more.
Maybe have to do a efi boot partition on this SSD to get the install to work.

Found the issue...the stupid Mint OS needed Internet connection for package downloads. Ugh, seems I need to get around to learning to make a custom complete ISO for installs.

Anyway, some thread goodie show.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superstition222*
> 
> There really isn't much of one. Even at $350 (Micro Center's current pricing), it doesn't make much sense. $150 more gets a 1920X and a 1700X is $229.
> 
> I was hoping that the quad channel RAM would do more. But, really, the 1900X seems to have very little appeal, unlike the 1920X. If a person is going to spend that kind of money on a CPU, board, and cooling, the 1920X and 1950X are the only models that make any sense.


i dont agree....if they made a 4/6 core threadripper,it would be worth for the pcie lanes, yes is not big deal of money difference, but if there was a 32 core at 2000 dollars for sure the 1900x would sell a lot especially to those like me who use many gpus rather than the cpu ......the problem with the 1900x and 1920 not selling much now or almost at all is only because they have not yes made a freaking 7 pcie 16 slots ws motherboard yet........the very moment ASUS releases boar like that threadripper sales will increase 8 times more in all their lines of cpus.....as a matter of fact ive been ranting quite a lot about ASUS not having such motherboard as first release above the zenith....making fancy gaming motherboards with leds and plastic is not something any true AMD client on x399 cares for nor looks for as it neither offers performance , nor speed, nor cooling and especially impossible to use all the 64 pcie lanes including the tons of 2.0 ones, there is ot one asus board raid 1 0 ready, nor with dual 10 Gbit ethernet (on the motherboard itself)....they are all nice cute motherboards but if we compare them to what these cpus are capable of honestly ASUS Gygabit MSI Asrock , they all just made crappy motherboards worse than junk , that must be because they got doped engineers and project managers that come to the office between a golf game and the other, to check if they met minimum sales rather than selling more and better and meeting clients minimum expectation.......i couldnt care less if pathetic you tubers whose biggest task on a computer is to render a 4 k video in 8 minutes, say about x399 motherboards, they couldnt give jack crap, they know nothing and they dont even know what a minority they are compared to CG artist VFX artist engineers, architects, VR AR developers etcetc...I dont even wanna mention game developers .

Trust me a even 4 core threadripper if it has a WS motherboard it would sell like bread


----------



## Dominican

i got 1950x amazon for 799 anyway doing overkill build.


----------



## Dotachin

Got the 1900X just because I don't need to spend more until the 7nm models pop up.

Using XSPC block, quick overclock to 4.0Ghz/1.35v - 3200xmp ram.
Idles at 26ºC,"normal" load temps are 50ºC, +1hr prime95 smallFFT goes up to 64ºC (VRMs go up to 49ºC with a 80mm fan). Water idle vs prime load delta is like 2-3ºC.
Had serious doubts about the block when I installed it but it seems I don't have to remount.
Will go for 4.2 and tune the volts when I have time.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Got the 1900X just because I don't need to spend more until the 7nm models pop up.
> 
> Using XSPC block, quick overclock to 4.0Ghz/1.35v - 3200xmp ram.
> Idles at 26ºC,"normal" load temps are 50ºC, +1hr prime95 smallFFT goes up to 64ºC (VRMs go up to 49ºC with a 80mm fan). Water idle vs prime load delta is like 2-3ºC.
> Had serious doubts about the block when I installed it but it seems I don't have to remount.
> Will go for 4.2 and tune the volts when I have time.


Iwas thinking to do the same an jump in with a 1900x till 7nm is out in 8/9 months...only problem with that, is that 7nm will come supporting pcie 4.0, so i dont think current motherboards neither will be able to take advantage of all that bandwidth nor the new memory controllers and the faster or new gen ram and cpu clocks.

Ive seen how hbm2 doubles the performance so much on nvidia gpus for them to need nvlink...but with pcie gen4, either on gddr6 or hbm3, there wont be need for nvlink or sli if one games, as you will have all the necessary bandwidth to run as many gpus you want or who knows even mcm ones, for stuff like games just the same as for rendering or computation.

very nice temps, many will envy those!


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Iwas thinking to do the same an jump in with a 1900x till 7nm is out in 8/9 months...only problem with that, is that 7nm will come supporting pcie 4.0, so i dont think current motherboards neither will be able to take advantage of all that bandwidth nor the new memory controllers and the faster or new gen ram and cpu clocks.


Even Intel had Sandy Bridge mobos that supported pcie 3.0 when Ivy Bridge launched. And afaik the imc is in the CPU as well.
Anyway we will see when the time comes.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dotachin*
> 
> Even Intel had Sandy Bridge mobos that supported pcie 3.0 when Ivy Bridge launched. And afaik the imc is in the CPU as well.
> Anyway we will see when the time comes.


Yeh but these current mobos are all rated pcie gen 3...i also wonder if on dual socket amd cpud, if they will need all those pcielanes for infinity fabric interconnect...could we maybe see 94 pcie lanes dedicated to gpu?!


----------



## Ithanul

Wooh! Finally got the 1900X going.

Now, lets see if it can out do my 5960X at crunching some work units.


----------



## pmc25

Picked up a 1920X for $550 in the US.

X399 Taichi for ~€300 in the EU and 2 x G.Skill Flare X 3200Mhz CL14 2*8GB for ~€380 (couldn't get the US NewEgg deals for either unfortunately).

Very curious to see how these will perform, once I receive them and have time to put them together.

I'm assuming that the BIOS changes X370 and B350 boards are seeing will shortly be ported to X399 (since it was purportedly a total rewrite of the RAM related code)?


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Picked up a 1920X for $550 in the US.


Link please!
I been telling myself if a 1920X goes below 600. I sell this 1900X off and get the 1920X. I need all the cores I can get for BOINC.


----------



## ohms

I picked up my 1950X a few days ago along with a Zenith Extreme and 32GB (8GBx4) TridentZ DDR4 3200 CL14.

Here is my CPU-Z validation; overclocked to 4GHz

https://valid.x86.fr/26l683

And here she is before I dropped her in


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> Link please!
> I been telling myself if a 1920X goes below 600. I sell this 1900X off and get the 1920X. I need all the cores I can get for BOINC.


Micro Center was doing them in-store only, for $499 (then plus state tax when picking up). Friend picked one up for me.

http://www.microcenter.com/product/485930/Ryzen_Threadripper_1920X_35_GHz_12_Core_TR4_Boxed_Processor

You'll need to select which ever store(s) that you can reach locally, to check for stock. Some have stock, some don't.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Micro Center was doing them in-store only, for $499 (then plus state tax when picking up). Friend picked one up for me.
> 
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/485930/Ryzen_Threadripper_1920X_35_GHz_12_Core_TR4_Boxed_Processor
> 
> You'll need to select which ever store(s) that you can reach locally, to check for stock. Some have stock, some don't.


Crap.....the nearest one for me is six hours away.


----------



## mmonnin

1920x is sold out by me. What about Mr Baggins in GA?


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> 1920x is sold out by me. What about Mr Baggins in GA?


Yeah, I may PM him. Though, I thought he no longer works there last I saw posted?

Maybe I can give him a sweet deal considering he likes my dragon drawings.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ohms*
> 
> I picked up my 1950X a few days ago along with a Zenith Extreme and 32GB (8GBx4) TridentZ DDR4 3200 CL14.
> 
> Here is my CPU-Z validation; overclocked to 4GHz
> 
> https://valid.x86.fr/26l683
> 
> And here she is before I dropped her in





to give an idea of what you can do.
https://valid.x86.fr/2vdu0i
https://valid.x86.fr/2vdu0i

pstates 4050 1.3v llc3

I think it is not reading the volts right in cpuz as I have high performance and even doing the bench it stayed at 06

that's perfectly stable all day (still waiting for summer though and will probably drop back to stock 30 plus degrees here







)

as for the sales if I had the money I would build another 1950x in a heartbeat.


----------



## Undermoose

MicroCenter totally hooked me up!

I bought my 1950x + Gigabyte Aorus X399 gaming 7 about 3 weeks ago, for $899 + $389 +Tax.

They honored the price protection "in store" for the Black Friday bundle cost (my CPU mobo combo $1010.00 on sale) by discounting other Black Friday purchases.

MicroCenter.com rocks.


----------



## TrixX

Does anyone know what the IHS material is for ThreadRipper? Got some Liquid Metal here and was thinking of giving it a test with my waterblock...


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Does anyone know what the IHS material is for ThreadRipper? Got some Liquid Metal here and was thinking of giving it a test with my waterblock...


Any IHS on ANY CPU of ANY brand of ANY year for ANY application is made of ONLY AND SOLELY COPPER, until one day they will be replaced by Pyrolitic graphene which has 4 times the capacity to dissipate heat than copper


----------



## pmc25

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> one day they will be replaced by Pyrolitic graphene which has 4 times the capacity to dissipate heat than copper


Very unlikely.

Copper may be replaced, but not with that. The metal (copper) IHS serves two purposes. One, to protect the delicate transistors underneath. Two, to dissipate heat from them.

Pyrolitic graphene / graphite would only be suitable for the latter. It's highly flexible, so would certainly not be suitable for the former.

As a replacement for thermal grease / pads / liquid metal? Absolutely, once cheap enough.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pmc25*
> 
> Very unlikely.
> 
> Copper may be replaced, but not with that. The metal (copper) IHS serves two purposes. One, to protect the delicate transistors underneath. Two, to dissipate heat from them.
> 
> Pyrolitic graphene / graphite would only be suitable for the latter. It's highly flexible, so would certainly not be suitable for the former.


FOr IHS and heat sinks it is rather fragile than flexible, so it is more a cost thing at this moment as they would need to manufacture a frame for it to sustain the pressure of the heat sink....but with carbin nantubes any thign can be done so sooner or later we wil see these solutions hit the market....btw this material is already used for this purpose on satellites and anything that goes in space.


----------



## Krazie316

Got my system up and running though it's incomplete. I have 2 reservoirs because I'm going to have a dual loop one for the 2 graphics cards (gotta buy the second card later). For now I've linked both reservoirs to the single loop that's in the system. I also plan on switching to pastel red coolant when I add the second loop.

What sucks is I drilled some of the holes into the mid plate crooked from the reservoirs (as you would see in pictures I did NOT post LOL. I'll have to order a new mid plate from CaseLabs. Maybe I'll see if Jayz2Cents can do it if it's not too expensive. He has the proper tools to do it and his business is like over the hill from me I believe.

The basement fans are unplugged because they aren't cooling anything yet. There's no radiator down there since there is no second loop (yet). I will also be doing rigid tubing when I add the GPU waterblocks and all that later on. My sons put finger prints all over the window and there are micro scratches galore. I either want to replace the window or do a tempered glass mod so i can clean it with normal glass cleaners and paper towels (rather than micro fiber cloths and acrylic cleaners)
























Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


----------



## Bartouille

3600MHz looking stable on 0801 bios.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 3600MHz looking stable on 0801 bios.


Hey there...im not sure I understand...You starting the overclock process or this is your finals? the timings are way off even above defaults of 20 20 20 20 36 wen u start the whole OC procedure and gradually go lower.....

Just asking.. if thats a final would have been much faster to go for a simple 3200MhZ 14 CL pack.

Cant see well but seems your CPU is at stock speeds


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Hey there...im not sure I understand...You starting the overclock process or this is your finals? the timings are way off even above defaults of 20 20 20 20 36 wen u start the whole OC procedure and gradually go lower.....
> 
> Just asking.. if thats a final would have been much faster to go for a simple 3200MhZ 14 CL pack.
> 
> Cant see well but seems your CPU is at stock speeds


Yeah these are just auto timings. I didn't optimized them yet, just seeing if 3600MHz works. So far it looks promising. Not entirely sure if this is due to 0801 bios or the fact I increased SOC voltage since I couldn't stabilize 3600MHz previously. Going to stress test over night. Hopefully it passes and then I can tighten those timings (C15 is probably doable as my stable oc is 3466MHz C14 1.4v, maybe C14 but that's probably going to require over 1.4v vdimm).


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Yeah these are just auto timings. I didn't optimized them yet, just seeing if 3600MHz works. So far it looks promising. Not entirely sure if this is due to 0801 bios or the fact I increased SOC voltage since I couldn't stabilize 3600MHz previously. Going to stress test over night. Hopefully it passes and then I can tighten those timings (C15 is probably doable as my stable oc is 3466MHz C14 1.4v, maybe C14 but that's probably going to require over 1.4v vdimm).


C14 would be a dream result......if u got an awesome set of ram you might pull it off with 15 14 14 with a respectable CPU OC...but it is all up to your CPU memory controller.


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Any IHS on ANY CPU of ANY brand of ANY year for ANY application is made of ONLY AND SOLELY COPPER, until one day they will be replaced by Pyrolitic graphene which has 4 times the capacity to dissipate heat than copper


Thanks, abrupt but accurate response









At least I'm not going to worry about using Conductonaut now.


----------



## number9dream

Hi,

Has anyone used CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 succesfully? I was intending to use that for my threadripper 1950x 128 gb build (Asrock x399 taichi as motherboard), but I saw some people having trouble getting it to post with all 8 sticks connected.

Should I just go with the (more expensive) option corsair lists as threadripper supported - CMK128GX4M8Z2933C16?

Sorry if this is the wrong thread to ask in, I'm having a hard time finding any concrete info about what actually works... The first memory listed is on the QVL list for the motherboard, but not on Corsair's list of threadripper supported memories, and vice versa.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *number9dream*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Has anyone used CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 succesfully? I was intending to use that for my threadripper 1950x 128 gb build (Asrock x399 taichi as motherboard), but I saw some people having trouble getting it to post with all 8 sticks connected.
> 
> Should I just go with the (more expensive) option corsair lists as threadripper supported - CMK128GX4M8Z2933C16?
> 
> Sorry if this is the wrong thread to ask in, I'm having a hard time finding any concrete info about what actually works... The first memory listed is on the QVL list for the motherboard, but not on Corsair's list of threadripper supported memories, and vice versa.


Wouldn't use QVL as that important. Per your question I believe 3000c16 will just run at 2933.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *number9dream*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Has anyone used CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 succesfully? I was intending to use that for my threadripper 1950x 128 gb build (Asrock x399 taichi as motherboard), but I saw some people having trouble getting it to post with all 8 sticks connected.
> 
> Should I just go with the (more expensive) option corsair lists as threadripper supported - CMK128GX4M8Z2933C16?
> 
> Sorry if this is the wrong thread to ask in, I'm having a hard time finding any concrete info about what actually works... The first memory listed is on the QVL list for the motherboard, but not on Corsair's list of threadripper supported memories, and vice versa.


mine posted just fine with 8 sticks full. but i had 8x4 gigs. it may be a size issue more than a dimmslot issue


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *number9dream*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Has anyone used CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 succesfully? I was intending to use that for my threadripper 1950x 128 gb build (Asrock x399 taichi as motherboard), but I saw some people having trouble getting it to post with all 8 sticks connected.
> 
> Should I just go with the (more expensive) option corsair lists as threadripper supported - CMK128GX4M8Z2933C16?
> 
> Sorry if this is the wrong thread to ask in, I'm having a hard time finding any concrete info about what actually works... The first memory listed is on the QVL list for the motherboard, but not on Corsair's list of threadripper supported memories, and vice versa.


I think You are looking to not spend too much on ram......a lot depends on Your CPU memory controller.....some Threadripper come with a good one some come with a very bad one, to the extent that no matter what size rame it wont post even with only 4 sticks,,,some who had this issue had their CPU replaced by honest retailers.

If Your CPU has an average Memory controller, I would recommend going with 3200Mhz CL14, as You should get to post fairly easily and achieve 14 13 13 13 timings easily.....that is a respectable speed and as You know ram speed is everything on AMD CPUs

[Trident Z] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZ
[Trident Z RGB] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZR
[Trident Z] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZSW
When fine tuning Your RAM use this video as a guide for the settings, and understanding the overal what the F...ck, is going on ram logic on AMD motherboards.






if You will wan to overclock Your CPU, then You will need to understand LLC (Load Line Calibration) so not to damage Your CPU and get decent performance and longevity out of it.

This VIdeo will teach You all You need to know about LLC and what it means.






This being said You should be able to get Your CPU to overclock at 4.0 G and ram at 320014 CL with basic few clicks as most do, in most You tube fast TR OC videos...just make sure that You will NEVER exceed the recommended CPU 1/35 voltage when doing so....
Once You see if that works as it should do, You will know that You have a healthy ram kit and a healthy CPU and You can go in the BIOS again and fine tune all the settings manually, to make profiles eg like:
1 STOCK CPU...ram 3200 CL 14 14 14
2 STOCK CPU....ram 3200 CL 14 13 13 (it will be unlikely you can get that speed but You can try, that because You have 8 sticks of ram)
3 OC CPU 4/4.1 Ghz max 1.35 V ram 3200 CL 14 14 14
4 Same as above You see if You can go CL 14 13 13

If You see that You cannot achieve even CL 16 as slowest, then call whoever You bought Your cpu from and see if You can have it replaced because it has a bad memory controller.

Make sure You do have a state of the art PSU titanium Sesonic or EVGA or Silverstone or Superflower Leadex, because PSU matter a lot when it comes to stability and no one ever talks about this....I would avoid corsair PSU as they are over rated and even miners try to avoid them.
Hope this helped to get Your 128 Gb of ram rolling properly.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *number9dream*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Has anyone used CMK128GX4M8B3000C16 succesfully? I was intending to use that for my threadripper 1950x 128 gb build (Asrock x399 taichi as motherboard), but I saw some people having trouble getting it to post with all 8 sticks connected.
> 
> Should I just go with the (more expensive) option corsair lists as threadripper supported - CMK128GX4M8Z2933C16?
> 
> Sorry if this is the wrong thread to ask in, I'm having a hard time finding any concrete info about what actually works... The first memory listed is on the QVL list for the motherboard, but not on Corsair's list of threadripper supported memories, and vice versa.


P.S. when installing Your ram install it in the order the sticks are in the box, few people know this but, the order the sticks are packed in is the order that they get to work when installed on the MB.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> P.S. when installing Your ram install it in the order the sticks are in the box, few people know this but, the order the sticks are packed in is the order that they get to work when installed on the MB.


one thing iwant to know, is why the timings on g.s,kill are all better than the timings on corsair?


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> one thing iwant to know, is why the timings on g.s,kill are all better than the timings on corsair?


Are you sure it's better?

I had 4x8gb Corsair Vengeance RGB DDR4-3200 CL16 (AMD compatible as listed on Newegg) and returned them for 4x8gb GSkill TridentZ RGB DDR4-3200 CL14 (AMD compatible kit), benchmarked them via AIDA64 and the GSkill was just a bit faster, but 3DMark Time Spy benched lower on the GSkill. Both benchmarks were very close.

I exchanged them because:

1. Corsair Link is being very difficult on my X399 rig, though I do have Corsair PSU & AIO cooler. The ram worked well.
2. GSkill's RGB is cool, though their software is reportedly buggy, I read that my Gigabyte Aorus software will be able to control them soon on the GSkill forum. I hope that's true.
3. I wanted to see if CL14 really is better than CL16 ram. I don't see a major difference.

I wonder which kit has the most overhead for OC'ing, DDR4-3200 AMD compatible ram: 4x32gb GSkill CL14 or Corsair CL16


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> I think You are looking to not spend too much on ram......a lot depends on Your CPU memory controller.....some Threadripper come with a good one some come with a very bad one, to the extent that no matter what size rame it wont post even with only 4 sticks,,,some who had this issue had their CPU replaced by honest retailers.
> 
> If Your CPU has an average Memory controller, I would recommend going with 3200Mhz CL14, as You should get to post fairly easily and achieve 14 13 13 13 timings easily.....that is a respectable speed and as You know ram speed is everything on AMD CPUs
> 
> [Trident Z] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZ
> [Trident Z RGB] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZR
> [Trident Z] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZSW
> When fine tuning Your RAM use this video as a guide for the settings, and understanding the overal what the F...ck, is going on ram logic on AMD motherboards.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if You will wan to overclock Your CPU, then You will need to understand LLC (Load Line Calibration) so not to damage Your CPU and get decent performance and longevity out of it.
> 
> This VIdeo will teach You all You need to know about LLC and what it means.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This being said You should be able to get Your CPU to overclock at 4.0 G and ram at 320014 CL with basic few clicks as most do, in most You tube fast TR OC videos...just make sure that You will NEVER exceed the recommended CPU 1/35 voltage when doing so....
> Once You see if that works as it should do, You will know that You have a healthy ram kit and a healthy CPU and You can go in the BIOS again and fine tune all the settings manually, to make profiles eg like:
> 1 STOCK CPU...ram 3200 CL 14 14 14
> 2 STOCK CPU....ram 3200 CL 14 13 13 (it will be unlikely you can get that speed but You can try, that because You have 8 sticks of ram)
> 3 OC CPU 4/4.1 Ghz max 1.35 V ram 3200 CL 14 14 14
> 4 Same as above You see if You can go CL 14 13 13
> 
> If You see that You cannot achieve even CL 16 as slowest, then call whoever You bought Your cpu from and see if You can have it replaced because it has a bad memory controller.
> 
> Make sure You do have a state of the art PSU titanium Sesonic or EVGA or Silverstone or Superflower Leadex, because PSU matter a lot when it comes to stability and no one ever talks about this....I would avoid corsair PSU as they are over rated and even miners try to avoid them.
> Hope this helped to get Your 128 Gb of ram rolling properly.


This is all you need for 4x8gb DDR4-3200 CL14:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232650

Worked flawlessly XMP for my Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7 X399.

This also worked XMP 4x8gb DDR4-3200 CL16:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820236199

I noticed very little difference in performance between the two.

GSkill performed better in AIDA64 test, Corsair performed better in 3DMark's Time Spy.

GSkill: https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2797279

Corsair: https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2751588

Go with what the memory manufacturer says will work. Motherboard makers want to sell motherboards, memory makers want to sell memory, so it is more likely the memory maker knows best. That's been my experience with 6 different kits and my Threadripper system. The motherboard maker's QVL didn't work, but the ram maker's did. We're talking higher clocked ram here though, 3200mhz+


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> This is all you need for 4x8gb DDR4-3200 CL14:
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232650
> 
> Worked flawlessly XMP for my Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7 X399.
> 
> This also worked XMP 4x8gb DDR4-3200 CL16:
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820236199
> 
> I noticed very little difference in performance between the two.
> ,
> GSkill performed better in AIDA64 test, Corsair performed better in 3DMark's Time Spy.


am i the only one left who hates RGB? where can i find the non rgb gskills?
-_-


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> am i the only one left who hates RGB? where can i find the non rgb gskills?
> -_-


You know what I like doing with RGB?

I like setting it to one color and leaving it there.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> You know what I like doing with RGB?
> 
> I like setting it to one color and leaving it there.


i have a logitech g703, and once my mouse hits 80~% the color randomly jump around to different colors and i have the RGB turned off... admittedly i wouldnt mind if it would all stay one color.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> one thing iwant to know, is why the timings on g.s,kill are all better than the timings on corsair?


I have no idea when it comes for the same die used in both brands...maybe corsair wants to be conservative, or most likely they dont have the resources to check the sticks and pair them with other similar sticks......I do not wish to talk bad about corsair...but I think Gskill is possibly a out of the box better choice.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> am i the only one left who hates RGB? where can i find the non rgb gskills?
> -_-


Nope, I don't care for the LEDs either (plus, I run my computers with the sides off. Rather not have a light show). But, since most stuff comes with the lights I either find a way to turn the crap off/disconnect the LEDs power or have some fun with a permanent black marker.









There are non-RGB GSkill kits. I have some in my 5960X computer. Only some light comes off the stupid red LEDs in the 1080Ti's cooler.


----------



## number9dream

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> I think You are looking to not spend too much on ram......a lot depends on Your CPU memory controller.....some Threadripper come with a good one some come with a very bad one, to the extent that no matter what size rame it wont post even with only 4 sticks,,,some who had this issue had their CPU replaced by honest retailers.
> 
> If Your CPU has an average Memory controller, I would recommend going with 3200Mhz CL14, as You should get to post fairly easily and achieve 14 13 13 13 timings easily.....that is a respectable speed and as You know ram speed is everything on AMD CPUs
> 
> [Trident Z] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZ
> [Trident Z RGB] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZR
> [Trident Z] F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZSW
> When fine tuning Your RAM use this video as a guide for the settings, and understanding the overal what the F...ck, is going on ram logic on AMD motherboards.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if You will wan to overclock Your CPU, then You will need to understand LLC (Load Line Calibration) so not to damage Your CPU and get decent performance and longevity out of it.
> 
> This VIdeo will teach You all You need to know about LLC and what it means.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This being said You should be able to get Your CPU to overclock at 4.0 G and ram at 320014 CL with basic few clicks as most do, in most You tube fast TR OC videos...just make sure that You will NEVER exceed the recommended CPU 1/35 voltage when doing so....
> Once You see if that works as it should do, You will know that You have a healthy ram kit and a healthy CPU and You can go in the BIOS again and fine tune all the settings manually, to make profiles eg like:
> 1 STOCK CPU...ram 3200 CL 14 14 14
> 2 STOCK CPU....ram 3200 CL 14 13 13 (it will be unlikely you can get that speed but You can try, that because You have 8 sticks of ram)
> 3 OC CPU 4/4.1 Ghz max 1.35 V ram 3200 CL 14 14 14
> 4 Same as above You see if You can go CL 14 13 13
> 
> If You see that You cannot achieve even CL 16 as slowest, then call whoever You bought Your cpu from and see if You can have it replaced because it has a bad memory controller.
> 
> Make sure You do have a state of the art PSU titanium Sesonic or EVGA or Silverstone or Superflower Leadex, because PSU matter a lot when it comes to stability and no one ever talks about this....I would avoid corsair PSU as they are over rated and even miners try to avoid them.
> Hope this helped to get Your 128 Gb of ram rolling properly.


Wow that's a lot of info...! I hope I don't need to use most of that since I'll have the build built for me by someone (would rather not mess up something this expensive hehe). But very good to know for the future, ty.

This is the first I've heard of a poor controller on TR... I'm currently on vacation and was thinking of picking up TR while I'm here (waaaaaay cheaper than back home for me), but if there's a big risk of getting an unusuable copy that seems dangerous.

I really don't need absolute max performance as the work I'll be doing is mostly limited by memory (i.e being able to load a huge amount of data is more important than the speed), so as long as it runs I am happy in the short term (will no doubt want to get the max out of it eventually).


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> Nope, I don't care for the LEDs either (plus, I run my computers with the sides off. Rather not have a light show). But, since most stuff comes with the lights I either find a way to turn the crap off/disconnect the LEDs power or have some fun with a permanent black marker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are non-RGB GSkill kits. I have some in my 5960X computer. Only some light comes off the stupid red LEDs in the 1080Ti's cooler.


WE ALL DETEST RGB LEDS THAT MAKE COMPUTErS LOOK LIKE CHINESE YO YOs of THE 70's...here is not need for tons of RGB all over the place, i think motherboards today should come with full high quality metal armor, with leds as an optional...
seeing leds on the face of the board on the pcie, heat sinks and all that crap is poor design bad taste and totally not helping with making each of these components neither durable, cooling, or functional in any way...the opposite, hey just make boards cheap and low quality...it is about time that Motherboard manufacturers moved away from plastics and acrylic and move on into futuristic and quality functional motherboard designs..starting from full PCB isolation/sealing from ambient, or even integrating the armour design to watercool even the socket backplates , all the rear of the PCB , VRMs chipsets and so on, clean sooth and no crazy childish graphics on them as they do now.
A Motherboard should not try to look like NOR WORK as a lamborghini with a xmas tree in it, but something out of a space age year 3000 movie.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *number9dream*
> 
> Wow that's a lot of info...! I hope I don't need to use most of that since I'll have the build built for me by someone (would rather not mess up something this expensive hehe). But very good to know for the future, ty.
> 
> This is the first I've heard of a poor controller on TR... I'm currently on vacation and was thinking of picking up TR while I'm here (waaaaaay cheaper than back home for me), but if there's a big risk of getting an unusuable copy that seems dangerous.
> 
> I really don't need absolute max performance as the work I'll be doing is mostly limited by memory (i.e being able to load a huge amount of data is more important than the speed), so as long as it runs I am happy in the short term (will no doubt want to get the max out of it eventually).


TR doesnt have a poor memory controller, but some CPUs have a better one than others and some occasionally have a veyr bad one, this is why Threadripper is binned a lot.
Most of users that cant get rm to specified speeds blame the motherboard or the ram sticks but it is simply the limit of that memory controller in their CPU...this of curse does NOT mean that a ram pack or a motherboard cant come out of factory already broken...but if all sticks run properly and Your CPU is seated properly in the socket and You cannot get the timings that Your RAM IS rated at, it is because of the CPU controller.
I saw a video of a guy who could get only 3 ram sticks to work, and changed the ram twice, until they found out the memory controller on the CPU was defective, once he had the CPU replaced his ram worked perfectly...this is why you should buy from trustworthy retailers so to make Your warranty worth the money You drop .

P.S. It might be a lot of info for You, but it is important to know these things, even if You will not overclock, so for You to understand how each component works and what the BIOS does..it will help You to debug issues, and it will make sure You dont destroy Your CPu or degrade it or have it live a tenth of its life expectancy


----------



## number9dream

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> TR doesnt have a poor memory controller, but some CPUs have a better one than others and some occasionally have a veyr bad one, this is why Threadripper is binned a lot.
> Most of users that cant get rm to specified speeds blame the motherboard or the ram sticks but it is simply the limit of that memory controller in their CPU...this of curse does NOT mean that a ram pack or a motherboard cant come out of factory already broken...but if all sticks run properly and Your CPU is seated properly in the socket and You cannot get the timings that Your RAM IS rated at, it is because of the CPU controller.
> I saw a video of a guy who could get only 3 ram sticks to work, and changed the ram twice, until they found out the memory controller on the CPU was defective, once he had the CPU replaced his ram worked perfectly...this is why you should buy from trustworthy retailers so to make Your warranty worth the money You drop .
> 
> P.S. It might be a lot of info for You, but it is important to know these things, even if You will not overclock, so for You to understand how each component works and what the BIOS does..it will help You to debug issues, and it will make sure You dont destroy Your CPu or degrade it or have it live a tenth of its life expectancy


Oh I didn't mean a lot of info was bad - just the opposite, the more info the better! Just gonna take me a while to digest it all but I appreciate it a lot


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *number9dream*
> 
> Oh I didn't mean a lot of info was bad - just the opposite, the more info the better! Just gonna take me a while to digest it all but I appreciate it a lot


i never remember memory being this hard back with ddr2/3 its crazy how things change lol


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> i never remember memory being this hard back with ddr2/3 its crazy how things change lol


LOL then you don't remember the QX9770 on the Asus Rampage Extreme. I couldn't find the thread, but I do believe eletrical engineers were enthusiasts on it.

Never again, XMP please.


----------



## TheBloodEagle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Guys it apparently seems confirmed..... EPYC on 7nm 64 cores 256Mb cache and freaking 3200Mhz ECC memory...all on 128 PCIe GEN 4
> 
> Looks like that at AMD they have been working hard on the memory controller and Samsung having Aces up their RAM sleeves.
> 
> 8 months from now it will become an epyc year for Threadripper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Motherboard manufacturers on x399 better put their **** together just as some water cooling components manufacturing companies by then, I dont wanna make names Asu..coughs s coughs coughs E...coughs K.
> 
> Any educated idea on likely Clock and Ram speeds for a 32 Core 7nm TR?


Is it really confirmed? I'm excited as hell.The JEDEC spec for ECC has been 3200MHz for sometime now. That's a much better "baseline" for TR & EPYC considering the scaling. I've always believed RAM speed mattered either way for years. I'm waiting on building a two node setup for my homelab. The release of mobos and chips seems to be have been quite slow though for current gen; only 5 or 6 mobos so far and no chips on sale, at least to the public. So I assume the Zen+ refresh will take a long time again for EPYC releases to the public.

I emailed Crucial also and practically begged them to come out with a black PCB ECC kit, since none exist and they sent me a good message about understanding the want for aesthetics and performance for workstations, etc and are sending it to their team to discuss. I'm crossing my fingers.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheBloodEagle*
> 
> Is it really confirmed? I'm excited as hell.The JEDEC spec for ECC has been 3200MHz for sometime now. That's a much better "baseline" for TR & EPYC considering the scaling. I've always believed RAM speed mattered either way for years. I'm waiting on building a two node setup for my homelab. The release of mobos and chips seems to be have been quite slow though for current gen; only 5 or 6 mobos so far and no chips on sale, at least to the public. So I assume the Zen+ refresh will take a long time again for EPYC releases to the public.
> 
> I emailed Crucial also and practically begged them to come out with a black PCB ECC kit, since none exist and they sent me a good message about understanding the want for aesthetics and performance for workstations, etc and are sending it to their team to discuss. I'm crossing my fingers.


Yes...the source that posted this in a twitter account is a french guy, that has never missed out once or made any wrong predictions.
And it makes sense when you go for 7nm from 14.
The base clock should be at *least* 20 higher too

AS for the RAM, I love crucial ECC , but Samsung ECC ram will dominate at 3200 Mhz ECC


----------



## FlanK3r

A little higher, AIO cooling


__
https://flic.kr/p/DNbAMm


----------



## Dominican

i have a problem where after i boot up all the light come on but power supply and video card fans stop moving ?


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dominican*
> 
> i have a problem where after i boot up all the light come on but power supply and video card fans stop moving ?


That can be normal until there is enough load on either to get them hot enough for the fans to spin up. Do they spin once they receive some load?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlanK3r*
> 
> A little higher, AIO cooling
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/DNbAMm


That is an impressive overclock, do You have a SL CPU?

What Voltage and tempts are You getting ?! I assume You are on the enermax AIO?

Can You kindly run a Vray Bench

https://www.chaosgroup.com/vray/benchmark

https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu

What ram are You using and how come You dont have 14CL?(just trying to figure if You do have a 14CL ram but the CPU memory controller cant achieve those speeds on Your CPU)

thanks


----------



## Particle

It looks like the Blender team made a change in their current development branch. The issue that was causing Blender to crash or the system at large to crash appears to have been solved by it. I was finally able to render the big production benchmark without Blender catching on fire and falling over as a result.


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superstition222*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> What is the point of the threadripper 1900X?
> 
> 
> 
> There really isn't much of one. Even at $350 (Micro Center's current pricing), it doesn't make much sense. $150 more gets a 1920X and a 1700X is $229.
> 
> I was hoping that the quad channel RAM would do more. But, really, the 1900X seems to have very little appeal, unlike the 1920X. If a person is going to spend that kind of money on a CPU, board, and cooling, the 1920X and 1950X are the only models that make any sense.
Click to expand...

Some people are building workstations for more memory and more PCIe lanes. More cores aren't necessarily doing anything for them. Even some gamers want x16/x16 SLI and Crossfire, and they definitely are not getting that on non-HEDT platforms.

The 1900X is quite appealing when you compare the entire system to something such as the Intel 7800X.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> Some people are building workstations for more memory and more PCIe lanes. More cores aren't necessarily doing anything for them. Even some gamers want x16/x16 SLI and Crossfire, and they definitely are not getting that on non-HEDT platforms.
> 
> The 1900X is quite appealing when you compare the entire system to something such as the Intel 7800X.


if the 1900x came out on release i would have gotten that instead of my 1920x but liek theyre saying at the pricepoints now, it doesnt make much sense.


----------



## AlphaC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> Some people are building workstations for more memory and more PCIe lanes. More cores aren't necessarily doing anything for them. Even some gamers want x16/x16 SLI and Crossfire, and they definitely are not getting that on non-HEDT platforms.
> 
> The 1900X is quite appealing when you compare the entire system to something such as the Intel 7800X.


i7-7800X is pointless now. There's no PCI-e lane advantage.

Want faster clockspeeds? get i7-8700k.

Want more cores? get TR 1920X / TR 1950X

If 9th generation mainstream i7s are 8 core, even the i7-7820X will be pointless.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlphaC*
> 
> i7-7800X is pointless now. There's no PCI-e lane advantage.
> 
> Want faster clockspeeds? get i7-8700k.
> 
> Want more cores? get TR 1920X / TR 1950X


what if all i want is a cute gf who wont walk out on me? not an option? ill just get a tr :/


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> what if all i want is a cute gf who wont walk out on me? not an option? ill just get a tr :/


You obviously aren't a married man lol.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> You obviously aren't a married man lol.


only to my 1920x


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> only to my 1920x


I married to my 1950x but my mistress 7980xe is a pricey but sexy piece


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> I married to my 1950x but my mistress 7980xe is a pricey but sexy piece


sacrilege!


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlphaC*
> 
> i7-7800X is pointless now. There's no PCI-e lane advantage.
> 
> Want faster clockspeeds? get i7-8700k.
> 
> Want more cores? get TR 1920X / TR 1950X
> 
> If 9th generation mainstream i7s are 8 core, even the i7-7820X will be pointless.


Faster clocks speed will matter nothing as developers seeing that massive amount of cache that AMD can suport will start developing their applications taking advantage of all that cache...that is games included.....
That being said core count availability has doubled thanks to AMD, so game developers and even at adobe, they will finally be able to upgrade all their software to take advantage of this......so back to clock speeds they will matter less than cores in less than a year.,,,unless you are running old stuff of course that day.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Faster clocks speed will matter nothing as developers seeing that massive amount of cache that AMD can suport will start developing their applications taking advantage of all that cache...that is games included.....
> That being said core count availability has doubled thanks to AMD, so game developers and even at adobe, they will finally be able to upgrade all their software to take advantage of this......so back to clock speeds they will matter less than cores in less than a year.,,,unless you are running old stuff of course that day.


this is what im excited for.


----------



## Dominican

what is CODE F9????

Code F9
Check CPU

i have a problem here guys after booting up getting CODE F9 everything light up after 10 sec power supply and video card fan stop..

first time i was installing bios update that pc shutdown after that never been able to boot to bios

any idea ?


----------



## done12many2

Looking for some help from XSPC Neo owners. I'm currently running an EK waterblock on my 1950x as it was all that was available at my time of purchase from Micro Center. I have since ordered the XSPC Neo and I'm wondering if either port can be used as inlet/outlet? I've downloaded the manual from their website, but it doesn't actually clarify this in any way. I did notice that there was an arrow next to one of the ports, but I'm not sure what that means. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## mypickaxe

The arrow indicates "ingress" meaning "enter." So, that would be your inlet.

Example:

https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/08/20/threadripper_at_4ghz_xspc_raystorm_waterblock

Note they indicate the markings on the tubing are incorrect. As they have the right side showing "out" and it is incorrect, the inlet is indeed on the side with the arrow. They noted they checked for correct in/out ports.

FWIW, I ordered the EK block and then changed my mind and ordered the XSPC Raystorm Neo (should be here by tomorrow.) I tried to get EK to cancel the order. Their customer service is horrible.


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *mmonnin*
> 
> 
> 
> Good to know, I have the 360 variant of that cooler and I can tell you it performs great.
Click to expand...

I can concur - I picked one up yesterday (at a local Fry's) to have as a spare, and for bench testing while I wait on my custom loop parts for the Threadripper build. It is surprisingly effective for a CLC.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> The arrow indicates "Ingress" meaning "enter." So, that would be your inlet.
> 
> Example:
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/08/20/threadripper_at_4ghz_xspc_raystorm_waterblock
> 
> Note they indicate the markings on the tubing are incorrect. As they have the right side showing "out" and it is incorrect, the inlet is indeed on the side with the arrow. They noted they checked for correct in/out ports.
> 
> FWIW, I ordered the EK block and then changed my mind and ordered the XSPC Raystorm Neo (should be here by tomorrow.) I tried to get EK to cancel the order, but those jerks shipped it *after* I sent them the email. Their customer service is horrible.


Thanks for the clarification. +1









Am I seeing things with those pictures in the link that you provided, or can the block be mounted upside down to accommodate flow in either direction? Maybe they just disassembled and rotated the mounted plate? If so, that would be great as I would rather mount my block upside down than reconfigure the loop.

Absolutely agree about EK these days. I contacted them approximately one year ago about some warranty issues and their advice was to deal with the retailer. While I understand that they were probably trying to spare me the shipping expense, they didn't even offer to take care of the problem.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> Thanks for the clarification. +1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Am I seeing things with those pictures in the link that you provided, or can the block be mounted upside down to accommodate flow in either direction? Maybe they just disassembled and rotated the mounted plate? If so, that would be great as I would rather mount my block upside down than reconfigure the loop.
> 
> Absolutely agree about EK these days. I contacted them approximately one year ago about some warranty issues and their advice was to deal with the retailer. While I understand that they were probably trying to spare me the shipping expense, they didn't even offer to take care of the problem.





yes you can just spin it around mine is upside down with the arrow on the right and that is inlet just makes xspc look Russian









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dominican*
> 
> what is CODE F9????
> 
> Code F9
> Check CPU
> 
> i have a problem here guys after booting up getting CODE F9 everything light up after 10 sec power supply and video card fan stop..
> 
> first time i was installing bios update that pc shutdown after that never been able to boot to bios
> 
> any idea ?






if you can try a bios flashback depending on the board I do not believe you need to get into bios to do it.

if it was working before that is...if not maybe a dodgy mount


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> yes you can just spin it around mine is upside down with the arrow on the right and that is inlet just makes xspc look Russian


Nice and thanks man. That'll save a fair bit of work.


----------



## sandysuk

Trying to eke every last bit out of my memory with a bit of bclk overclocking but when I do so the PCI express controller drops to PCIE2 rather than PCIE3, is there a way in hardware or software to turn PCIE3.0 back on once I up the base clock on x399 or is that down to whatever MSI implement in the BIOS? Seems a shame I can't even overclock base clock by 2Mhz without it dropping down to 2.

Granted not much needs the bandwidth but having just built an NVMe Raid array I'm reluctant to drop down from 6Gb to 3Gb transfers.


----------



## Particle

For anyone who has ever been curious about ECC with Threadripper, I can verify that it does indeed both detect and correct when enabled. I'll tell my story below for anyone who is interested in what I was doing when it became clear.

My 1950X system has 4x8 GB of unbuffered ECC DDR4-2400 memory installed. I run both Debian and Windows. Debian is set up with an MBR bootloader on one disk and Windows is set up with an EFI bootloader on a different disk. Every time I start Windows to play games, it breaks Debian's MBR bootloader. I decided a few days ago to do a test reinstall of Debian with an EFI bootloader to see if that would stop Windows from doing bad things. I could imagine Windows naively disabling MBR bootloaders when it starts up as an EFI system as a sort of means to ensure the boot process doesn't get borked on a regular system.

Before doing the test reinstall I wanted to have a full backup so that I could restore to the point before I reinstalled if it didn't work. I have a USB stick with a minimal Debian installation already on it that I use for fixing my bootloader after every time I've been in Windows, so I decided to use that stick to perform my backup. This would allow me to take an image of my entire disk with no worries with regard to the system writing to its own disk during the backup and potentially breaking anything.

I made a full disk image and compressed it on the fly, storing it to my network file server. I forgot to auto-renew my Kerberos ticket, so at some point after the backup completed it started throwing errors. The backup itself seemed to be complete though. Even so, I made a second full backup since I had to go to work anyway and had no reason not to. Once I got home, I did a test extraction of the first backup and let it decompress the first 250 GB or so before cancelling. It never fails and I was eager to continue, so I decided to go ahead and extract it back to my real disk.

The extraction failed at like 465 GB. "That is concerning, but no worries. I have a second copy," I thought. I extracted it to my real disk. The extraction failed at about 125 GB. A series of test extractions followed, and what I found was that it didn't appear to be a network IO issue nor a decompression issue. The failure points were the same each time in each file. I went ahead and tried booting from my disk after extracting the 465 GB copy again since I only use the first few dozen gigabytes of my disk, but the disk was still messed up. It couldn't fully boot.

Giving up, I did a fresh install of Debian over the top of my broken restore. Now, I had just noticed before this whole endeavor that I could see that ECC was enabled by checking dmesg for EDAC events. With this recently acquired knowledge, I checked my fresh system's log. Nothing. The 4.9 kernel that Debian 9 comes with must simply be too old to know how to turn on ECC memory for Threadripper. I installed the 4.14 kernel that I had been using before the reinstall and bingo, the EDAC messages were present again. My USB stick uses the stock 4.9 kernel, so I had apparently made my backups without ECC being enabled.

Kernel 4.15.0-rc1 had been released and I needed it to fix my monitor anyway since I am on a Vega 64 GPU now. I compiled the 4.15 kernel, installed it, and rebooted. I noticed during the reboot that the dmesg log had noted two ECC correction events during that kernel compile. A few days prior--about a day before this whole adventure began--I had bumped my memory speed up from 2400 to 2667 as a test to see if my memory had any headroom in it. Everything had seemed fine in the light testing I had done initially. It appears that my memory isn't fully stable at 2667 though.

So there you have it. Memory errors apparently broke my backup. With ECC known to be enabled, I was even able to see corrected error events with overclocked memory.

---

Epilogue: I had also made a full backup of all the files from my system disk (just not a disk _image_) which was verified to be intact, so this isn't entirely a sad story. File backups are less convenient than being able to simply return a disk to its exact prior state, but they do get the job done. I'm back online now with no data loss.


----------



## FlanK3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> That is an impressive overclock, do You have a SL CPU?
> 
> What Voltage and tempts are You getting ?! I assume You are on the enermax AIO?
> 
> Can You kindly run a Vray Bench
> 
> https://www.chaosgroup.com/vray/benchmark
> 
> https://benchmark.chaosgroup.com/cpu
> 
> What ram are You using and how come You dont have 14CL?(just trying to figure if You do have a 14CL ram but the CPU memory controller cant achieve those speeds on Your CPU)
> 
> thanks


I used 1.425V in BIOS with LLC3. VSOC 1.15V.
Temps are OK, of course, this clock is only for some benchmarks, not for 24/7. And my RAM are HyperX Predator Hynix chips (cl is 15-16, not 14)  I will try Vray at Friday, but Im thinking, it will be harder than Cinebench, so lower clocks...We will see







But 4100 MHz is stable and load temps with Enermax AIO up to 87 C TCTL


----------



## mypickaxe

Getting my Threadripper 1950X build on...

Still waiting on the Intel Optane 900p which will become my new boot drive. My DDR4 is Corsair Dominator Platinum 2800 running at 2666. I tried to get the machine to post on the latest UEFI with all sticks populated at 3200, 3000 and 2800, but no dice.



Cooling the CPU with the Enermax Liqtech 360 OC TR4. It's doing a heck of a job for a CLC. Put the stock cooler back on my MSI GTX 1080 Ti. Forgot it is 2.5 slots! I'll be putting the block back on later.

I'm loving this Zenith Extreme motherboard. I haven't spent much time with the Aura software, but I plan to configure it to something subdued such as white while on and perhaps "Starry Night" while in sleep mode.



For now my custom loop is on ice as I flush and prep it for a new system. Waiting on a Case Labs Bullet BH8 to house my former X99 / 5930K system. I'm going to use that build as a storage server & 4K video capture machine. I'll move my Samsung 950 Pro (installed in the Angelbird Wings Px1 adapter) over to the X99 system, along with a couple each of SATA SSDs and SATA hard drives.


----------



## tarot

Thought I would post this here as well just in case









Asrock have the official 2.0 bios for the fat yo and the taichi

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X399%20Taichi/index.asp#BIOS

thanks to lo forward facing dog for the heads up








Quote:


> [/1.Sync the H/W Monitor and Dr.Debug code Temp source to Tctl.
> 2.Update AmdPackageString to "ThreadRipperPI-SP3r2-1.0.0.4"
> 3.Enhance SATA type M.2 compatibility.
> 4.Include "BT On/Off" item for Bluetooth control.QUOTE]
> 
> I haven't tried it yet as I am happy where I am but I will get around to it


----------



## The L33t

Asrock seems to be the only company actually interested in supporting it's x399 platform. All others are lacking big time.


----------



## ITAngel

So I finally got fustrated today and decided to run the 360mm rad EK PE with the Vega64 Air card but I put an EK block to it. Change some of the fans around on my Phanteks Enthoo Evolv case and with everything closed. I can run my games which were running a bit hot with the following temps.

Room: 70F
GPU: Min 23C / Max 43C
CPU: Min 51.5C / Max 59.8C (Game Mode)

I have a feeling that the CPU block may still have some bubbles that need to come out. I know last time I did the loop it look a bit for it all to come out and get in place. Now that I add a GPU into the loop may run a little hotter than normal but I will do a better test in a few days.


----------



## jwalters1123

So I got my 1950X from microcenter on black Friday for $699, which almost made me jizz my pants. I ordered a Asus Zenith MOBO, and am waiting for my water loop parts to show up, along with everything else.... so I couldn't wait to open the processor box and check it out, in my rush to check it out, my barbaric hands accidentally cracked the orange cartridge which I thought was useless. Come to find out I need it for the install... it's cracked on the side, I could possibly super glue it, but I don't know if it's possible to get a replacement or if I'm just screwed. Any thoughts or recommendations?


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jwalters1123*
> 
> So I got my 1950X from microcenter on black Friday for $699, which almost made me jizz my pants. I ordered a Asus Zenith MOBO, and am waiting for my water loop parts to show up, along with everything else.... so I couldn't wait to open the processor box and check it out, in my rush to check it out, my barbaric hands accidentally cracked the orange cartridge which I thought was useless. Come to find out I need it for the install... it's cracked on the side, I could possibly super glue it, but I don't know if it's possible to get a replacement or if I'm just screwed. Any thoughts or recommendations?


It a holder for the CPU that slides into the retention mechanism on the motherboard. I'd make sure to get a new one so that all of the 4k+ pins line up right.


----------



## x7007

how I connect the cpu 1950x to gigabyte x399 aurous 7.. please help I can't for the crying world connect the 1 screw when cpu is connected. without cpu it connects connects. also 2 and 3 only connect with certain degree and not top straight which is the issue with 1 because you need to connect is top straight without any degree but it doesn't please help, I sat 2 days and I still can't...

Amazon can send replacement but I'll need to pay for both deliveries from me and to me because I live in Israel.

and if the new has the same issue....

I already thought to pull this orange thing out. I am so mad..


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jwalters1123*
> 
> So I got my 1950X from microcenter on black Friday for $699, which almost made me jizz my pants. I ordered a Asus Zenith MOBO, and am waiting for my water loop parts to show up, along with everything else.... so I couldn't wait to open the processor box and check it out, in my rush to check it out, my barbaric hands accidentally cracked the orange cartridge which I thought was useless. Come to find out I need it for the install... it's cracked on the side, I could possibly super glue it, but I don't know if it's possible to get a replacement or if I'm just screwed. Any thoughts or recommendations?


HAHA You so funny with that jizzzzzzzz thing...
congratulations.

You dont necessarily need that orange bracket, You can remove it if You see it will not slide in properly, and place the CPU as is in the socket...You will just be very but not very super very careful that the CPU will not slip from Your fingers and bend some pin...I think that without the socket might be a just few degrees even cooler than with the plastic bracket as it can have more space for hot air to escape into the chassis faster, and this might possibly get the socket back plate maybe a couple of degrees less hot(just an educated guess nothing proven).

cheers!

p.s. if You find bugs in Your MOBO You can get latest beta BIOS here and post bugs there as well

http://www.overclock.net/t/1642825/asus-x399-the-rog-zenith-extreme-a-complaint-bug-tracking-thread


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jwalters1123*
> 
> So I got my 1950X from microcenter on black Friday for $699, which almost made me jizz my pants. I ordered a Asus Zenith MOBO, and am waiting for my water loop parts to show up, along with everything else.... so I couldn't wait to open the processor box and check it out, in my rush to check it out, my barbaric hands accidentally cracked the orange cartridge which I thought was useless. Come to find out I need it for the install... it's cracked on the side, I could possibly super glue it, but I don't know if it's possible to get a replacement or if I'm just screwed. Any thoughts or recommendations?


The orange shim is required for pin alignment. You might get away with repairing it, but essentially you've done the LGA equivalent of mashing the pins in. You're unlikely to get a replacement for free given that you've manually destroyed part of the processor. It wasn't a manufacturing defect. I don't remember how they attach or know if you can get just a replacement shim.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> how I connect the cpu 1950x to gigabyte x399 aurous 7.. please help I can't for the crying world connect the 1 screw when cpu is connected. without cpu it connects connects. also 2 and 3 only connect with certain degree and not top straight which is the issue with 1 because you need to connect is top straight without any degree but it doesn't please help, I sat 2 days and I still can't...
> 
> Amazon can send replacement but I'll need to pay for both deliveries from me and to me because I live in Israel.
> 
> and if the new has the same issue....
> 
> I already thought to pull this orange thing out. I am so mad..


Hi
1 check that Your CPU and its plastic orange holder are sliding completely inside the mounting bracket and click before you push down both the CPU bracket and the socket bracket on top.
2 A lot of people have had this issue, so what they do is force a lot for the screw 1 to just catch half or a quarter r=turn then go to 2 and 3 ake another quarter half turn and then screw down 1 2 3 in order all the way.

3 You can remove the orange plastic and put the CPU directly into the socket..*BUT BE VERY CAREFUL IT IS A BIG HEAVY CPU< if it slips from Your fingers you WILL BEND THE SOCKET PINS* and that can become very expensive to fix if it is bad!

If you are going to use force as most did, make sure you use a flat hard surface and use a rubber pad like mouse pad so that You dont bend the motherboard when applying so much pressure, cause u can crack something there as well


----------



## jwalters1123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> The orange shim is required for pin alignment. You might get away with repairing it, but essentially you've done the LGA equivalent of mashing the pins in. You're unlikely to get a replacement for free given that you've manually destroyed part of the processor. It wasn't a manufacturing defect. I don't remember how they attach or know if you can get just a replacement shim.


Yeah, I don't know if I can get a new shim or not, I just submitted a question to the customer support at amd. Although I bought the processor at microcenter, and thankfully bought the added protection. so I should just be able to take it back up there and get a new one.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlanK3r*
> 
> I used 1.425V in BIOS with LLC3. VSOC 1.15V.
> Temps are OK, of course, this clock is only for some benchmarks, not for 24/7. And my RAM are HyperX Predator Hynix chips (cl is 15-16, not 14)  I will try Vray at Friday, but Im thinking, it will be harder than Cinebench, so lower clocks...We will see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But 4100 MHz is stable and load temps with Enermax AIO up to 87 C TCTL


Its pretty hot temps...Im looking forward into seeing VRay benchmark at 4300 Mhz, if the ram will forgive You should possibly get the best 1950x benchmark there.

Looking forward to see the result!

cheers


----------



## jwalters1123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> HAHA You so funny with that jizzzzzzzz thing...
> congratulations.
> 
> You dont necessarily need that orange bracket, You can remove it if You see it will not slide in properly, and place the CPU as is in the socket...You will just be very but not very super very careful that the CPU will not slip from Your fingers and bend some pin...I think that without the socket might be a just few degrees even cooler than with the plastic bracket as it can have more space for hot air to escape into the chassis faster, and this might possibly get the socket back plate maybe a couple of degrees less hot(just an educated guess nothing proven).
> 
> cheers!
> 
> p.s. if You find bugs in Your MOBO You can get latest beta BIOS here and post bugs there as well
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1642825/asus-x399-the-rog-zenith-extreme-a-complaint-bug-tracking-thread


Thanks, since I bought the added protection from Microcenter, I should just be able to exchange it for a new one... I really don't want to bend any pins or have it not seated correctly. The only problem is I want to build this weekend and microcenter doesn't have anymore 1950x's in stock. But thanks for the advice!


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Hi
> 1 check that Your CPU and its plastic orange holder are sliding completely inside the mounting bracket and click before you push down both the CPU bracket and the socket bracket on top.
> 2 A lot of people have had this issue, so what they do is force a lot for the screw 1 to just catch half or a quarter r=turn then go to 2 and 3 ake another quarter half turn and then screw down 1 2 3 in order all the way.
> 
> 3 You can remove the orange plastic and put the CPU directly into the socket..*BUT BE VERY CAREFUL IT IS A BIG HEAVY CPU< if it slips from Your fingers you WILL BEND THE SOCKET PINS* and that can become very expensive to fix if it is bad!
> 
> If you are going to use force as most did, make sure you use a flat hard surface and use a rubber pad like mouse pad so that You dont bend the motherboard when applying so much pressure, cause u can crack something there as well


how much force can I do?

because it's so uncomfortable with this screw driver.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jwalters1123*
> 
> Thanks, since I bought the added protection from Microcenter, I should just be able to exchange it for a new one... I really don't want to bend any pins or have it not seated correctly. The only problem is I want to build this weekend and microcenter doesn't have anymore 1950x's in stock. But thanks for the advice!


It will seat correctly , it is just the risk of being clumsy and bending pins.

anyhow happy jizzzes!


----------



## jwalters1123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> It will seat correctly , it is just the risk of being clumsy and bending pins.
> 
> anyhow happy jizzzes!


Do you recon it's possible to jerryrig the busted bracket install the chip and remove the bracket before I screw it down?


----------



## Simmons572

IIRC, I was following a build log where the user installed the 1950x without the bracket, just because he didn't like the color lol.

If you are careful, you should have no issues installing the CPU by itself.


----------



## mmonnin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jwalters1123*
> 
> Do you recon it's possible to jerryrig the busted bracket install the chip and remove the bracket before I screw it down?


No the orange bracket can't be removed from the motherboards retention mechanism. It slides in. Just watch some Threadripper unboxing videos on youtube.


----------



## jwalters1123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Simmons572*
> 
> IIRC, I was following a build log where the user installed the 1950x without the bracket, just because he didn't like the color lol.
> 
> If you are careful, you should have no issues installing the CPU by itself.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> how much force can I do?
> 
> because it's so uncomfortable with this screw driver.


If You feel uncomfortable call Your retailer and change the board....the socket bracket will have either Lotes written on it or Foxconn...i think it is the Foxconn that have this issue, but then there is peoplr with Foxconn that never had this issue


----------



## jwalters1123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jwalters1123*


I don't really like the color either, thanks so much for the info. Btw, you got a ling for that build log?


----------



## Causality1978

"my barbaric hands accidentally cracked the orange cartridge" now you are barbaric agent orange with military junta

What is the impact on performance 1950x in the use of speed ddram? I have some 2133ddr4 64gb kit and new 1950x . still no mobo
Can somebody post result in cinebench , config : 1950x + 2133mhz and 1950x with faster mem.kit s ..3200
Becouse ddr ram 4 is now crazy expensive, but i dont want spend another 450 e for 3300mhz 32 gb memory kit if performance is small diff..
thank you.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Causality1978*
> 
> "my barbaric hands accidentally cracked the orange cartridge" now you are barbaric agent orange with military junta
> 
> What is the impact on performance 1950x in the use of speed ddram? I have some 2133ddr4 64gb kit and new 1950x . still no mobo
> Can somebody post result in cinebench , config : 1950x + 2133mhz and 1950x with faster mem.kit s ..3200
> Because ddr ram 4 is now crazy expensive, but i dont want spend another 450 e for 3300mhz 32 gb memory kit if performance is small diff..
> thank you.


The impact is considerable but also the type even more.... best for AMD is Samsung B ram...but if i were you i would keep your 2133hoping it will boot, and buy new gen samsung in spring....Samsung is releasing server memory 3200Mhz ECC, so im confident that they will have new Ram coming , with better latencies and performance...You need to keep in Mind that AMD CPUs are basically AMD design manufactured by Samsung...so Samsung will go hard core heavy in ram innovation just as they doing with Znand, to get AMD and Samsung lead over Intel across all platforms and segments by 2019.


----------



## Particle

I'm keeping an eye out for that 3200 MT/s unregistered ECC DDR4 memory. If the price is reasonable, I'll be discarding my existing 2400 MT/s memory for it.


----------



## ITAngel

I think I am going to sell off the Phanteks Evolv and get something that will allow me to run both rads like the Corsair 740 or 600C. Hate not being able to run the 240 with the 360 on my loop because the tubings will not work or fan placement without going hard tubing which i am not ready for that yet.







What you guys think a good high air flow case for the TR4 and Vega 64 setup that will allow a 360mm rad and a 240mm rad at the same time?


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I'm keeping an eye out for that 3200 MT/s unregistered ECC DDR4 memory. If the price is reasonable, I'll be discarding my existing 2400 MT/s memory for it.


I think at thins point in 2017, is best to ''call it a day'' and wait till new announcements from both Amd and Samsung and Nvidia from February to march.

Each of these companies have ready to launch technology that can deliver 150 to 200% more performance that what We have now..they could sell it tomorrow morning, or decide to release iterations little by little according to what competition does and how sales go.

What sells like bread in this moment and there is demand for is.

1 much faster memory, for cpu gpu and storage
2 x399 and Ryzen
3 Nvidia 1080 ti and 1060 (1070ti was a complete flop and 1070 and 1080 not selling)
4 Intel mainstream 6 core dellidded cpus

what is not selling is

1 1800x 1900x, 1920x
in order for these products to sell, I expect a 12 mid iteration of the 1800x that will overclock till.4.7/8 ghz
for 1900x and 1920x you need motherboard with 7 pcie lanes 16 3 minimum wired x16, this should boost x399 sales 7/800%

2 ram above 3400 3600 and high capacity
enough said ...there will be for sure big memory modules coming capable of very low latencies and hyper clocks, samsung will go all in on this asap.

3 2 terabyte m.2 ssd....again samsung will definitely increase capacity thus making 1 2 terabyte more affordable by making current line legacy with a new faster line.

4 Intel HEDT and Xeons, are selling 20 % than what they sold before, so they are definitely gonna reduce prices not by reducing prices directly, but they will increase core count on mainstream cpus...i estimate up to 12 cores..so we might see an equivalent of the 8700k with 12 cores sold below 500 dollars

5 Nvidia will for sure sell a 2060 and a 2060 TI the latter basically a re branding of the 1070 ti, all the other gpus on volta will be on gddrx5 and not gddr6 with only the Titan on hbm2 and they will not be pcie 4 ready.

6 Amd will launch vega on 12 nm still on hbm2 and not pcie 4 ready on all the line of gpus, and hbm3 pcie 4 in the summer on the top tier only.

this is what i expect available on shelves in march...its only 3 4 month from now.....not worth looking into buying hardware anymore until then, except maybe for x399 `WS motherboards

that being said 3200Mhz ECC ram is definitely orgasmic!


----------



## x7007

how to remove the intel thing on the cooler from the h115i? I can't unplug it... do I need force? which side do I turn it? those guides are bs pff. should I put my own thermal paste? aratic 5 or mx 4 or 2? I dont have much of aractic 5 I don't think it will be enough. I have enough of mx2


----------



## mypickaxe

New boot drive for my Threadripper system is installed. Its older, bigger and (shockingly) more expensive brother is looking dated in comparison.



If you're wondering, yes...the Optane drive runs at Ludicrous Speed


----------



## rdr09

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I think I am going to sell off the Phanteks Evolv and get something that will allow me to run both rads like the Corsair 740 or 600C. Hate not being able to run the 240 with the 360 on my loop because the tubings will not work or fan placement without going hard tubing which i am not ready for that yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What you guys think a good high air flow case for the TR4 and Vega 64 setup that will allow a 360mm rad and a 240mm rad at the same time?


The 740 should coz my 540 does. Thin 240 up top and thick 360 up front. Had to rig pump and res at the back of motherboard, though.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> New boot drive for my Threadripper system is installed. Its older, bigger and (shockingly) more expensive brother is looking dated in comparison.
> 
> 
> 
> If you're wondering, yes...the Optane drive runs at Ludicrous Speed


Lol.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rdr09*
> 
> The 740 should coz my 540 does. Thin 240 up top and thick 360 up front. Had to rig pump and res at the back of motherboard, though.
> Lol.


Oh yea I did that with my old 540 when I started doing water cooling stuff.







Lets say that case got a few good drills to make it work. Hahahaha


----------



## ITAngel

For those wondering can you run a Threadripper like the 1920X and a Vega64 Air card in a EK water loop cool with a 360mm Rad PE series. Yes you can, but keep in mind I have no overclocked my system and the CPU is running stock setup in game mode. The Graphic Card running in Balanced mode in a Phanteks Enthoo Evolv case with no mods. After hours of playing in a room with temps of that started at 64F to 70F. Here are the results;

CPU Temps
CPU Node #0: Min: 25.9C / Max: 62.4C / Avg: 42.7C
CPU Node #1: Min: 18.3C / Max: 42.9C / Avg: 32.2C

GPU Temps: Min 17C / Max: 51C / Avg 32.7C

Motherboard Fan controls were on Tctrl Priority with Fan Curve for quietness operation.
Pump control were on Tctrl Priority with Fan Curve for quietness operation.

I hope that helps for people wondering if you can run a CPU and GPU together with a single 360mm rad. I have a 240 to install but I plan to move into a different case to make that happen just not right at this moment.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> For those wondering can you run a Threadripper like the 1920X and a Vega64 Air card in a EK water loop cool with a 360mm Rad PE series. Yes you can, but keep in mind I have no overclocked my system and the CPU is running stock setup in game mode. The Graphic Card running in Balanced mode in a Phanteks Enthoo Evolv case with no mods. After hours of playing in a room with temps of that started at 64F to 70F. Here are the results;
> 
> CPU Temps
> CPU Node #0: Min: 25.9C / Max: 62.4C / Avg: 42.7C
> CPU Node #1: Min: 18.3C / Max: 42.9C / Avg: 32.2C
> 
> GPU Temps: Min 17C / Max: 51C / Avg 32.7C
> 
> Motherboard Fan controls were on Tctrl Priority with Fan Curve for quietness operation.
> Pump control were on Tctrl Priority with Fan Curve for quietness operation.
> 
> I hope that helps for people wondering if you can run a CPU and GPU together with a single 360mm rad. I have a 240 to install but I plan to move into a different case to make that happen just not right at this moment.


It would be relevant to know what the load on the CPU is.
You are playing what game?!
Is it taking advantage of multi threading, eg Like Arma 3 where u got half of the threads engaged with one or more using XFR??

What GPU are You using? are You running 4k or 1080p?

Your CPU load would likely be less than 20% and if You have at least a 980 ti GPU load less than 50% on Game like Arma3 on 4k.

Gaming is not an intensive task for a computer and any of its components, if You are not using mainstream old Intel Hardware.

Your post is a good thing,and I support and encourage You to do more of the same, but it can be helpful if you state game name and display specifications as the other hardware...as the topic is cooling FPS is not important, so no need to post that , but all teh rest matters.

It will also matter to knwo what other apps You use, while gaming, do yo use team speak, do you have overwolf turned on, are You watching you tube videos at the same time? are you skypeing with someone at the same time or screen sharing?

Did You try also streaming while gaming?! or loading stuff on You tube or encoding?

The more information You give the more it will be helpful.
Looking forward for more results and il give You a REP for the effort and intent. thanks


----------



## twitchyzero

OK my gripe with mobo retail boxes is they don't come tamper-proof seals

my Gigabyte Designares board from Newegg came with very faint scratches on the metal bracket that has the 3-2-1 text. not worried about the rusted screw because the RoG Zenith Extreme also had it

did I get a used item?

I didn't try running it yet.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> It would be relevant to know what the load on the CPU is.
> You are playing what game?!
> Is it taking advantage of multi threading, eg Like Arma 3 where u got half of the threads engaged with one or more using XFR??
> 
> What GPU are You using? are You running 4k or 1080p?
> 
> Your CPU load would likely be less than 20% and if You have at least a 980 ti GPU load less than 50% on Game like Arma3 on 4k.
> 
> Gaming is not an intensive task for a computer and any of its components, if You are not using mainstream old Intel Hardware.
> 
> Your post is a good thing,and I support and encourage You to do more of the same, but it can be helpful if you state game name and display specifications as the other hardware...as the topic is cooling FPS is not important, so no need to post that , but all teh rest matters.
> 
> It will also matter to knwo what other apps You use, while gaming, do yo use team speak, do you have overwolf turned on, are You watching you tube videos at the same time? are you skypeing with someone at the same time or screen sharing?
> 
> Did You try also streaming while gaming?! or loading stuff on You tube or encoding?
> 
> The more information You give the more it will be helpful.
> Looking forward for more results and il give You a REP for the effort and intent. thanks


Makes sense what you are asking about. I will do a better recoding of all that data. We'll I can tell you that I run dual monitors omen 1920 x 1080 @ 120Hz. Also the games were Overwatch competitive mode so mic chat. Plus I also was call of duty infinite warfare. Had browser open doing research and talking via messager. Had 4 monitor software for the PC.

I will record next time cpu load and run game such as players battle ground unknown. Also I will keep you guys posted


----------



## Heidi

Good People...

Look at my sig...
QUestion...
Ryzen 1700 (prospect of Ryzen 2 next year then shifting 1700 for other purposes)
Threadripper (marry for it...)
Or...forget all above n keep kissing existing...

Thanks...


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> QUestion...


Neither; wait for Zen+ to show up (sometime in 2018, suposedly sooner than later), upgrade then with a Zen+ 8core.

Threadripper sounds exciting, but unless you honestly, really, trully, but trully have a need for 16 cores, you'll better off with their 'mainstream' variants; slightly, but noticeably so; plus, you'll have saved money you had no need to spend in the first place.

* the above since you're asking now, December of 2017.. you really will be better off waiting this out.

** also, 'Zen 2' as you put it is a couple of years off. What we're getting within 2018 is Zen+, think Intel's tick-tock for a comparison.


----------



## Heidi

Thanks for advice...this is correlation to my thinking as well...but...
At this very moment I have option to sell out my i7 5960x for a really good price...and I am also in doubt that I will need 16 cores, well I would like it however will I use it, it is another story...
Yet one thing keep me leaning toward 1950X...mining...coz I am using those two Vega's for it n together will give me nice opportunity to maximize platform wise...still have great machine for everything else besides mining...


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> QUestion...
> 
> 
> 
> Neither; wait for Zen+ to show up (sometime in 2018, suposedly sooner than later), upgrade then with a Zen+ 8core.
> 
> Threadripper sounds exciting, but unless you honestly, really, trully, but trully have a need for 16 cores, you'll better off with their 'mainstream' variants; slightly, but noticeably so; plus, you'll have saved money you had no need to spend in the first place.
> 
> * the above since you're asking now, December of 2017.. you really will be better off waiting this out.
> ** also, 'Zen 2' as you put it is a couple of years off. What we're getting within 2018 is Zen+, think Intel's tick-tock for a comparison.
Click to expand...

They don't have enough PCIe lanes. That's why I went with Threadripper. Plus all the extra cores and expanded RAM support, among other things, for whenever the price comes back down into more reasonable territory.


----------



## Heidi

Yes...this is pretty much my point of view...more flexibility with RAM capacity plus true 16+16 PCIe...not that I will gain anything but at least I am not losing the bit...
Still...
ATMO TR is at A$1149...while the whole platform is significantly more expensive for approximately double performance...hmm, still confused and undecided...


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> They don't have enough PCIe lanes. That's why I went with Threadripper. Plus all the extra cores and expanded RAM support, among other things, for whenever the price comes back down into more reasonable territory.


If by 'expanded RAM support' you mean bandwidth as shown in AIDA, i won't be the one to break the news to you.

Agreed on the lanes, technically speaking; but in practice? On AM4 platform, you have your NVMe mount, you have your 3.0x16 GPU slot and another two remaining; one for sound card/random reader, one for an internet/x-connect card. Exactly what more would one need?

( if you say multiple GPUs.. mea culpa dude; there isn't a single game out there that ever made, or makes now, multiple GPUs a must. As for miners, i couldn't care less about, but even if someone else did, really? A 500ish bucks mobo plus a 1100ish CPU just so you can run your GPUs? Moronic at best. You can buy a used 4core and a mining board for a third of the price, have even more GPUs running on it. So either way you put it.. ^^ )

Anyway, just an opinion, to each their own needless to say. Toys are a man's best friend, so go for it


----------



## ht_addict

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Makes sense what you are asking about. I will do a better recoding of all that data. We'll I can tell you that I run dual monitors omen 1920 x 1080 @ 120Hz. Also the games were Overwatch competitive mode so mic chat. Plus I also was call of duty infinite warfare. Had browser open doing research and talking via messager. Had 4 monitor software for the PC.
> 
> I will record next time cpu load and run game such as players battle ground unknown. Also I will keep you guys posted


 Save yourself the time and enjoy your setup. I had my 1950x and Dual FuryX in the same loop. Saw same temps when gaming at 4k or running Benchmarks. This was with Dual Predator 360's in series and an extra 360 rad in my loop. Don't expect any better when you add your 240. Personally I went to separate loops.


----------



## Heidi

Aenra, just to explain myself...the rig I am about to build isn't for mining only...it is to mine while I am not home or while I am doing nothing using capabilities to regain some cash if anyhow possible...apparently TR shows some muscles in mining while my two Vega's 64 are very well established in that area anyway...so why not use it if possible and available!
The question about upgrading or perhaps sidegrading from my i7 5960x is more from practical perspective...X99 is dead end...while neither R7 nor TR looking death in the eyes any time soon!
So, I had on my minds two options, going TR, full blast, together on Gigabyte X399 Designare or 1700 plugged into ROG X370 Extreme...
By look at the subject 1700 seems more flexible yet shorter on the capabilities...as mentioned, I do have 40 lane CPU and just love the fact of having 16x16...despite knowing that performance hit is 5% at most, if ever experienced...
This was the sole reason why I asked you guys, as being experienced owners for some clues...thanks!!


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> OK my gripe with mobo retail boxes is they don't come tamper-proof seals
> 
> my Gigabyte Designares board from Newegg came with very faint scratches on the metal bracket that has the 3-2-1 text. not worried about the rusted screw because the RoG Zenith Extreme also had it
> 
> did I get a used item?
> 
> I didn't try running it yet.


Yu rpoly got that used becuase previocu client couldnt manage to screw in the socket bracket


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> Good People...
> 
> Look at my sig...
> QUestion...
> Ryzen 1700 (prospect of Ryzen 2 next year then shifting 1700 for other purposes)
> Threadripper (marry for it...)
> Or...forget all above n keep kissing existing...
> 
> Thanks...


There is no reason to upgrade unless it will support PCIE Gen 4 at this point.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> Aenra, just to explain myself...the rig I am about to build isn't for mining only...it is to mine while I am not home or while I am doing nothing using capabilities to regain some cash if anyhow possible...apparently TR shows some muscles in mining while my two Vega's 64 are very well established in that area anyway...so why not use it if possible and available!
> The question about upgrading or perhaps sidegrading from my i7 5960x is more from practical perspective...X99 is dead end...while neither R7 nor TR looking death in the eyes any time soon!
> So, I had on my minds two options, going TR, full blast, together on Gigabyte X399 Designare or 1700 plugged into ROG X370 Extreme...
> By look at the subject 1700 seems more flexible yet shorter on the capabilities...as mentioned, I do have 40 lane CPU and just love the fact of having 16x16...despite knowing that performance hit is 5% at most, if ever experienced...
> This was the sole reason why I asked you guys, as being experienced owners for some clues...thanks!!


I would wait PCIE4, maybe They will come for Ryzen refresh and surely for 7nm threadripper this summer....its only 8 months away...but if they do a Ryzen 7 refresh on 12 Nm , that implies nice clocks above 4.5 ghz so that is in February and very appealing


----------



## Heidi

Thanks Aby67...shouldn't existing boards support PCIe 4.0, I mean it is only electrical wiring in there, everything else will bi in the CPU anyway...and because of that update I thought of going 1700 only...which later will end up in updated server...


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> OK my gripe with mobo retail boxes is they don't come tamper-proof seals
> 
> my Gigabyte Designares board from Newegg came with very faint scratches on the metal bracket that has the 3-2-1 text. not worried about the rusted screw because the RoG Zenith Extreme also had it
> 
> did I get a used item?
> 
> I didn't try running it yet.


I've often griped about my gear from Newegg appearing to be returns when it's sold as new. As just one example, I bought an X79 motherboard from them once that had paste and a couple of fingerprints on the socket retention mechanism. "New" my butt.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> Aenra, just to explain myself...the rig I am about to build isn't for mining only...it is to mine while I am not home or while I am doing nothing using capabilities to regain some cash if anyhow possible...apparently TR shows some muscles in mining while my two Vega's 64 are very well established in that area anyway...so why not use it if possible and available!
> The question about upgrading or perhaps sidegrading from my i7 5960x is more from practical perspective...X99 is dead end...while neither R7 nor TR looking death in the eyes any time soon!
> So, I had on my minds two options, going TR, full blast, together on Gigabyte X399 Designare or 1700 plugged into ROG X370 Extreme...
> By look at the subject 1700 seems more flexible yet shorter on the capabilities...as mentioned, I do have 40 lane CPU and just love the fact of having 16x16...despite knowing that performance hit is 5% at most, if ever experienced...
> This was the sole reason why I asked you guys, as being experienced owners for some clues...thanks!!


I mine on a threadripper









I upgraded my x79 based workstation to an x399 platform. I could've probably been fine with x370 (built one of those too to replace an old 990fx HTPC).

For monero, the 1700X I have peaks at around 550-600 h/s at 80W. Moving to the HEDT, my 1920X peaks at nearly 1200h/s at 140W. Minimum hash rates are 300h/s and 1075H/s respectively. The 1920x I have clocks well - 4050 at just shy of 1.3V with 3466 quad channel RAM. It's more fun to over clock than the 1700X I have.

The thing is the entire threadripper platform costs more, so from a purely mining standpoint it doesn't make sense. You go TR for the extra pcie lanes and memory bandwidth. The lanes are very nice, but not necessary with dual GPUs unless you want more than one NVME drive.

If you go threadripper, you might consider the 1920X with the taichi board. You'll be happier with the VRMs on the Asrock board, and the 1920 is close to the 1950 for mining (which it should be as the cache is pretty much identical).


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I mine on a threadripper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I upgraded my x79 based workstation to an x399 platform. I could've probably been fine with x370 (built one of those too to replace an old 990fx HTPC).
> 
> For monero, the 1700X I have peaks at around 550-600 h/s at 80W. Moving to the HEDT, my 1920X peaks at nearly 1200h/s at 140W. Minimum hash rates are 300h/s and 1075H/s respectively. The 1920x I have clocks well - 4050 at just shy of 1.3V with 3466 quad channel RAM. It's more fun to over clock than the 1700X I have.
> 
> The thing is the entire threadripper platform costs more, so from a purely mining standpoint it doesn't make sense. You go TR for the extra pcie lanes and memory bandwidth. The lanes are very nice, but not necessary with dual GPUs unless you want more than one NVME drive.
> 
> If you go threadripper, you might consider the 1920X with the taichi board. You'll be happier with the VRMs on the Asrock board, and the 1920 is close to the 1950 for mining (which it should be as the cache is pretty much identical).


You should NOT purchase anything ONLINE that is computer electronics, unless it is directly from the manufacturer ..(example Crucial)....But there are some online retailers with whom You can talk directly to the sales person who will take Your order on the phone or like performance PCs read special comments or instructions.
I can understand that it is not easy to find a retailer every where but a lil long drive just to go and talk with the person in front of you tell him you do not want repacked stuff. and in case of thread ripper explicitly ask to set up your CPU and ram memory so to check that the memory controller of the CPU can run the rated Ram speeds and latency, because if the CPU or the motherboard cannot support the rated speed of the ram both You and the retailer are entitled to return the CPU or motherboard, because on or both is not working properly......another example is that The cpu will not manage the memory on the right side or left side, that entitles you to get a new CPU, if you cant run 128 Gb or ram the same.
Going to a retailer and paying the 60 extra bucks to do a simple install warrants that He will deliver You all the components running at their rated specifications and if they are not willing to do this then simply go to someone else that is serious in their job and will do his job professionally and not like a crook.

When You receive a package from new egg that you are certain that it was not now You should immediately return it and get a total refund and then place a new order after Your money back.

Another thing is that if You are sending back eg a motherboard for them to check if it is broken put a string with a seal in one of the corner holes, and take pictures of the motherboard while You are packing it to ship with the socket pins well zoommed and include copies of the pictures in the package you returning, You want to make as many pictures in detail as possible so to make sure that whatever they will send You back if it is Your original it comes back in mint condition, and if something is broken they cannot bend some socket pins to make an excuse that You are liable.

Yes it is a total pain in the ass, but via various forums since ever you read incredible stories of retailers of even ASUS representatives destroying Your board so to say that You are not covered by warranty.
Another good practice is to NEVER buy electronics before xmas, wait February as February is the worse month ever for any business especially electronics ,You get better deals and You dont get retailers dumping down Your throat whatever they can till You suffocate.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ht_addict*
> 
> Save yourself the time and enjoy your setup. I had my 1950x and Dual FuryX in the same loop. Saw same temps when gaming at 4k or running Benchmarks. This was with Dual Predator 360's in series and an extra 360 rad in my loop. Don't expect any better when you add your 240. Personally I went to separate loops.


Hey thanks for the tip. I have a second pump coming with some more fittings, just need to grab one more res and I can put the GPU on its own loop in the 240mm rad eventually but not on this case. I have to change cases to make this happen.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Hey thanks for the tip. I have a second pump coming with some more fittings, just need to grab one more res and I can put the GPU on its own loop in the 240mm rad eventually but not on this case. I have to change cases to make this happen.


Try them in series first anyways. With a dedicated 240mm GPU loop you might for that a big serial loop performs better, especially for the GPU.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Try them in series first anyways. With a dedicated 240mm GPU loop you might for that a big serial loop performs better, especially for the GPU.


So try adding the 240mm to the current loop and see how it perform first is what you mean?

I may have to do this setup here on the picture below. Note this is not my case.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> So try adding the 240mm to the current loop and see how it perform first is what you mean?


Exactly.

Unless you have huge rads,a single large loop can often perform better than two smaller ones. Unless you max both CPU and GPU at the same time, either of them gets the equivalent of one large radiator. If you do max them both out at the same time, then you still get maximum heat dissipation.

Dual loops look cool with hard line and multiple fluid colors, and let you prioritize temps of individual components. A single loop lets you maximize radiator surface area with less pumps (or the same number of pumps at a lower speed with added redundancy) and less loop complexity.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> Thanks for advice...this is correlation to my thinking as well...but...
> At this very moment I have option to sell out my i7 5960x for a really good price...and I am also in doubt that I will need 16 cores, well I would like it however will I use it, it is another story...
> Yet one thing keep me leaning toward 1950X...mining...coz I am using those two Vega's for it n together will give me nice opportunity to maximize platform wise...still have great machine for everything else besides mining...


As someone who has both a 1900X and a 5960X. Wait out for Zen+ or Zen 2. The 5960X still holds up, considering you already have that chip. At most you get the updated goodies and more pcie lanes on TR. But, for a upgrade, I would consider it more a side grade for updated features.
If you not really using all the cores, drop down to a mainstream line to save some extra cash for other hardware.


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> The thing is the entire threadripper platform costs more, so from a purely mining standpoint it doesn't make sense. You go TR for the extra pcie lanes and memory bandwidth. The lanes are very nice, but not necessary with dual GPUs unless you want more than one NVME drive.


If someone is gaming at high resolutions with 1080 Ti SLI, x8/x8 isn't going to cut it for maximum GPU utilization & frame rate. The SLI lanes don't matter trope is a myth.


----------



## twitchyzero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> Yu rpoly got that used becuase previocu client couldnt manage to screw in the socket bracket


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Particle*
> 
> I've often griped about my gear from Newegg appearing to be returns when it's sold as new. As just one example, I bought an X79 motherboard from them once that had paste and a couple of fingerprints on the socket retention mechanism. "New" my butt.


not surprised at Newegg doing that

but the Designare is basically new to market...having someone trying it out, return it and then have it shipped to me in basically a month is probably not likely

the rest of the packaging/board is flawless...i will test it out and if it's fine i'll keep it.

Just annoyed the boxes dont come with tampered seals so we can't know for sure.


----------



## Heidi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I mine on a threadripper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I upgraded my x79 based workstation to an x399 platform. I could've probably been fine with x370 (built one of those too to replace an old 990fx HTPC).
> 
> For monero, the 1700X I have peaks at around 550-600 h/s at 80W. Moving to the HEDT, my 1920X peaks at nearly 1200h/s at 140W. Minimum hash rates are 300h/s and 1075H/s respectively. The 1920x I have clocks well - 4050 at just shy of 1.3V with 3466 quad channel RAM. It's more fun to over clock than the 1700X I have.
> 
> The thing is the entire threadripper platform costs more, so from a purely mining standpoint it doesn't make sense. You go TR for the extra pcie lanes and memory bandwidth. The lanes are very nice, but not necessary with dual GPUs unless you want more than one NVME drive.
> 
> If you go threadripper, you might consider the 1920X with the taichi board. You'll be happier with the VRMs on the Asrock board, and the 1920 is close to the 1950 for mining (which it should be as the cache is pretty much identical).


Thanks...
This is exactly what I had on my minds...
I am into XMR as well, but, this rig will be mining rig ONLY when idle...meaning, I have nothing to do on it...then mine...if I do something to do, then I want as powerful machine as possible of course...
Problem with me is, I do not like disabled anything...if it is to be 16 cores, let it be that way...if it is to be 16PCIe...let it be that way...
If mining option is on the table, only mining, I will be having one of my Z87-97 boards populated with GPU's...but I do not want mining only rig at this stage...I need machine to do everything and do it properly...
THanks for that info....I expect about 1200 from 1950X and already getting 19-1950 from each of the Vega's...together that will be 5000 hashes which is not bad at all...Vega;s using about 160W each...so 320+140...sounds very efficient...


----------



## Heidi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> As someone who has both a 1900X and a 5960X. Wait out for Zen+ or Zen 2. The 5960X still holds up, considering you already have that chip. At most you get the updated goodies and more pcie lanes on TR. But, for a upgrade, I would consider it more a side grade for updated features.
> If you not really using all the cores, drop down to a mainstream line to save some extra cash for other hardware.


Thanks...
That was also in my consideration, as you can see I am in doubt about it...
My original focus was on TR...ever since gets out...for obvious reason.
But last few days I am thinking about downscaling it to, perhaps 1700, which will be in use as interim CPU until Zen+ is released(with intention of using 1700 in my server upgrade due to the 65W TDP later)...as mentioned, 5960X could be sold for good dosh as I have buyer...
Obviously, I know what my 5960X is capable of, so regardless of performance, TR will be always kind of sidegrade with performance boost for me until all bugs are ironed out...


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> For those wondering can you run a Threadripper like the 1920X and a Vega64 Air card in a EK water loop cool with a 360mm Rad PE series. Yes you can, but keep in mind I have no overclocked my system and the CPU is running stock setup in game mode. The Graphic Card running in Balanced mode in a Phanteks Enthoo Evolv case with no mods. After hours of playing in a room with temps of that started at 64F to 70F. Here are the results;
> 
> CPU Temps
> CPU Node #0: Min: 25.9C / Max: 62.4C / Avg: 42.7C
> CPU Node #1: Min: 18.3C / Max: 42.9C / Avg: 32.2C
> 
> GPU Temps: Min 17C / Max: 51C / Avg 32.7C
> 
> Motherboard Fan controls were on Tctrl Priority with Fan Curve for quietness operation.
> Pump control were on Tctrl Priority with Fan Curve for quietness operation.
> 
> I hope that helps for people wondering if you can run a CPU and GPU together with a single 360mm rad. I have a 240 to install but I plan to move into a different case to make that happen just not right at this moment.






I was looking for that
what is the ambient temp in the room?
my vega on a single loop has a lot of trouble when its 32 degrees in here..but I think its the piss weak pump I,m using.


----------



## philip1000rr

Quote:


> Trying to eke every last bit out of my memory with a bit of bclk overclocking but when I do so the PCI express controller drops to PCIE2 rather than PCIE3, is there a way in hardware or software to turn PCIE3.0 back on once I up the base clock on x399 or is that down to whatever MSI implement in the BIOS? Seems a shame I can't even overclock base clock by 2Mhz without it dropping down to 2.
> 
> Granted not much needs the bandwidth but having just built an NVMe Raid array I'm reluctant to drop down from 6Gb to 3Gb transfers.


Man, the base clock effects just about everything on the motherboard. This includes the PCIe bus. And the PCIe bus does not like to have it's clock raised. The PCIe bus has very tight timing and signaling requirements, and it seems like its not happy with the new bclk setting. The reason your board is dropping down to PCIe gen 2 speeds is because the links are probably failing during link training during POST, so the BIOS drops them back to more relaxed Gen 2.0 speeds so the links can be established. This isn't something you can 'just force', it's degrading to gen 2 because you've made it unstable at gen 3 with that base clock bump.

Typically you only play with bclk when you are trying to overclock a CPU with a locked multiplier. But Threadripper isn't locked, so there shouldn't be a real reason to mess with it here.

Why are you upping your bclk to increase memory transfer speed? Why not adjust the memory speed multiplier and timing directly instead of moving the base clock?


----------



## philip1000rr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> Thanks Aby67...shouldn't existing boards support PCIe 4.0, I mean it is only electrical wiring in there, everything else will bi in the CPU anyway...and because of that update I thought of going 1700 only...which later will end up in updated server...


Unfortunately it's not that simple. The PCIe controller in the CPU is what drives the bus, yes, but high speed data signaling isn't as simple as laying down some wires and calling it a day. PCIe gen 4 signal integrity is a nightmare and boards designed for gen 3.0 will not support it. The PCB material itself will have to change to an ultra low loss material in many cases, but even designs that don't require exotic substrates will still be subject to new routing rules, stricter impedance matching and other realities of high speed diff pairs. Expect Gen 4 support to require new board designs.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> Thanks Aby67...shouldn't existing boards support PCIe 4.0, I mean it is only electrical wiring in there, everything else will bi in the CPU anyway...and because of that update I thought of going 1700 only...which later will end up in updated server...


Dear Heidi...for some reason didnt see Your post as it was not quoted......I am not sure how the physical PCIe 4.0 slots work nor the m.2 or usb....but You cant take as an example USB3.0, while You can run 2.0 stuff on it and viceversa there is something likely in the wires that is different, very much like HDMi and other stuff, sometimes Gold is necessary like it happens for hdmi 1.2.

So while i cannot know the precise technicalities, I can be pretty certain that current motherboards simply do not have the materials that are rated and needed to run PCIe gen 4 bandwidths...on a motherboards you see lot of stuff soldered on it its hundreds of tiny pieces that cost from less than a cent ,in some cases over 10 dollars a piece, so those that deal with bandwidth, will certainly need to be different....for what i know maybe even the socket or the VRms might need to be completely different...i just do not know.
Pcie gen 4 will revolutionize a lot of stuff, and AMD products have a design and features that specifically can take advantage of more bandwidth.

An example is gaming, companies Like nvidia are pushing AI and deep learning a lot because they knwo very well, that current GPUs for gaming do not need any upgrading at all, maybe they might need more memory but as for performance, You do not need more.....now the thing with PCIe gen 4 is that because of so much more bandwidth You wont need sli anymore, game developers the few that still code for it will not need to code for it anymore....so a game can with pcie 4 buy for example 4 5 6 gtx 1050 and obliterate dual titan Xp in performance for a fraction of the cost, at the same time they can also most likely access memory on ram or hard drives there are many possibilities...god knows how much stuff will change because of this.
After almost a decade of Intel sandbagging the whole computing industry, one day from the other AMD has brought quadruplicating compute power accessible to anyone at accessible prices, and this performance will easily duplicate year on year till 2020, this is unless at AMD they see that Intel is so far behind and so much in trouble that they can deliver intermediate lithography as they announced they will do for Ryzen 3 5 7 with 12nm lithography, so we will see AMD mainstream CPs hitting and competing with entry level x299 Intel products...as those CPUs will likely run at 4.5/8 Ghz maybe with XFR hitting 5 Ghz.....12/20 % overclock speed will be at hand for those who will buy a eg Ryzen 7 2800x, the same will be for some of their GPUs......so unless You really are into HPC for a gamer it will be paradise.

Another advantage of PCIe4 and soon to come also PCIe 5, is the bandwidth and latency to Display port and HDMI, so VR or AR headsets as an example will be able to run bigger resolutions at faster clocks....the goldielock threshold for VR is 16k X16k resolution running at 244Hz...I dont know if PCIe Gen 5 will be good enough for that but I think We would need around 60 teraflops in single precision GPU power to achieve that , and We are not actually so far from it......
I end by saying two things one is my personal estimate , which is that I forecast that by 2025 there wil no be Hollywood actors or superstars any more, they will all be replaced by virtual 3D characters, just as You saw in Game of thrones dragons YOu will see Virtual Humans, We seen a hint in last star wars episodes.
The second thing is....do not listen to famous You tubers if You need to make choices on hardware, they all tend to say this GPU or that CPU is a monster all the time...I will be very frank , when threadripper came out I was NOT impressed at all...I have been waiting for Intel to come out with a Threadripper CPU 2 years ago, yes I am happy AMD is kicking ass, and I am happy there is EPYC and Threadripper...I Will be satisfied though when I Will see the 7nm Release and if We will see the big surprise of doubling the PCIe lanes...because they announced doubling the cores, quadruplicating the Cache.....and I am certain that at Samsung they are pushing the best they can to get ZEN2 double the PCIE lanes, because it means for them doubling the sales on storage and RAM..if this happens for ME it mean being able to run 12 GPUs on a single socket...just perfect!

So be patient because there is still tons of new stuff hitting the market after CES this January and more in march from NVIdia, June for Nvidia top tier GPUs, and EPYC an Threadripper 2..also if AMD will be bale to push vega 2 to push very fast We will see Nvidia forced to use HBM2 or even 3 before schedule...just this memory with current Nvidia GPUs would double the performance from one day to the other.
It is going to be a veeeeeery interesting next 8 months, dont jump on old stuff, You would regret it, and all retailers are tempting us a lot by taking prices down a lot across everything, because they want to have their whole stocks empty by January cause they knwo they aint gonna sell all this stuff they are selling now, 45 days from now.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philip1000rr*
> 
> Unfortunately it's not that simple. The PCIe controller in the CPU is what drives the bus, yes, but high speed data signaling isn't as simple as laying down some wires and calling it a day. PCIe gen 4 signal integrity is a nightmare and boards designed for gen 3.0 will not support it. The PCB material itself will have to change to an ultra low loss material in many cases, but even designs that don't require exotic substrates will still be subject to new routing rules, stricter impedance matching and other realities of high speed diff pairs. Expect Gen 4 support to require new board designs.


Thanks for the exhaustive insight...I gave You a REP for it.....I agree on new board designs...and aside, I wouldn't be surprised if there was a new gen format by 2019, for this as ATX form factor, basically has no more space left, nor CEB and EEB has been pretty much too small for a couple of years already ......I wonder if all components will start becoming much much smaller...and I hope it will not cost a fortune to Us that day


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aby67*
> 
> You should NOT purchase anything ONLINE that is computer electronics, unless it is directly from the manufacturer ..(example Crucial)....But there are some online retailers with whom You can talk directly to the sales person who will take Your order on the phone or like performance PCs read special comments or instructions.
> I can understand that it is not easy to find a retailer every where but a lil long drive just to go and talk with the person in front of you tell him you do not want repacked stuff. and in case of thread ripper explicitly ask to set up your CPU and ram memory so to check that the memory controller of the CPU can run the rated Ram speeds and latency, because if the CPU or the motherboard cannot support the rated speed of the ram both You and the retailer are entitled to return the CPU or motherboard, because on or both is not working properly......another example is that The cpu will not manage the memory on the right side or left side, that entitles you to get a new CPU, if you cant run 128 Gb or ram the same.
> Going to a retailer and paying the 60 extra bucks to do a simple install warrants that He will deliver You all the components running at their rated specifications and if they are not willing to do this then simply go to someone else that is serious in their job and will do his job professionally and not like a crook.
> 
> When You receive a package from new egg that you are certain that it was not now You should immediately return it and get a total refund and then place a new order after Your money back.
> 
> Another thing is that if You are sending back eg a motherboard for them to check if it is broken put a string with a seal in one of the corner holes, and take pictures of the motherboard while You are packing it to ship with the socket pins well zoommed and include copies of the pictures in the package you returning, You want to make as many pictures in detail as possible so to make sure that whatever they will send You back if it is Your original it comes back in mint condition, and if something is broken they cannot bend some socket pins to make an excuse that You are liable.
> 
> Yes it is a total pain in the ass, but via various forums since ever you read incredible stories of retailers of even ASUS representatives destroying Your board so to say that You are not covered by warranty.
> Another good practice is to NEVER buy electronics before xmas, wait February as February is the worse month ever for any business especially electronics ,You get better deals and You dont get retailers dumping down Your throat whatever they can till You suffocate.


I buy my motherboards / CPU's from Microcenter for that reason. Specifically the motherboard, but they have the best prices on CPU/Mobo combo too generally even with tax.
I've found using online retailers for motherboards to be highly risky, and have wound up in adversarial situations.
Unless there is a specific reason to use Newegg (which I love), or Amazon, for a motherboard, I'll always use Microcenter or direct from a manufacturer.


----------



## x7007

How can I install from intel Raid0 to Amd raid 0? it only boot my ssd from ahci properly even without reinstall


----------



## Kriant

Does anyone experience at random times a freeze of sorts where no errors pop up by it seems that some programs like certain games and Opera web browser become unresponsive for a second?

My system passed a gauntlet of torture tests just fine, and I had the same thing earlier this year with Ryzen 1800x in Ghost Recon Wildlands. I know it's kinda of a vague description of the issue, but any tips?


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> How can I install from intel Raid0 to Amd raid 0? it only boot my ssd from ahci properly even without reinstall


Reinstall the OS using F6 boot option to load AMD driver during install.

There is no other way I'm aware of. I just went through this myself.


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> Does anyone experience at random times a freeze of sorts where no errors pop up by it seems that some programs like certain games and Opera web browser become unresponsive for a second?
> 
> My system passed a gauntlet of torture tests just fine, and I had the same thing earlier this year with Ryzen 1800x in Ghost Recon Wildlands. I know it's kinda of a vague description of the issue, but any tips?


I had that before I installed the AMD sata driver.
Go to Device Manager and check under ATA/ATAPI IDE driver. If you have the Microsoft one it's probably that, manually update it to AMD version 1.3.1.277 (uncheck the "show compatible" box). If you install the AMD one but don't uninstall the Microsoft one, it won't solve it.


----------



## ITAngel

Got my second rad in and temps on the GPU and CPU are great.







I will provide more info later on once I run a few more test.



Played for a few hours Overwatch and room temp was 73F and GPU temps were Min:25C and Max: 41C on Turbo in Wattman. CPU Temps were Min: 30 and Max: 51C. Had only F-Stream, Wattman, CPUID HWMonitor on and browser with Discord chat client, Twitch (not streaming) open.


----------



## lowdog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> Got my second rad in and temps on the GPU and CPU are great.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will provide more info later on once I run a few more test.
> 
> 
> 
> Played for a few hours Overwatch and room temp was 73F and GPU temps were Min:25C and Max: 41C on Turbo in Wattman. CPU Temps were Min: 30 and Max: 51C. Had only F-Stream, Wattman, CPUID HWMonitor on and browser with Doscord chat client, Twitch (not screaming) open.


Isn't the top port the inlet on the EK Threadripper block and the left port the inlet on the EK Vega block?????????????......how you got it all flowing??

Also the EK TR4 block apparently performs better by around 6C + when the block is orientated 45 degrees clockwise with the inlet on the right and outlet on the left....according to Kyle's testing at HARDOCP.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lowdog*
> 
> Isn't the top port the inlet on the EK Threadripper block and the left port the inlet on the EK Vega block?????????????......how you got it all flowing??


His flow is Pump > GPU > CPU > Top Rad > Front Rad > back to Pump.

You don't literally have to use the top left as an inlet port. You just need to ensure that in/out are on opposite sides.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lowdog*
> 
> Also the EK TR4 block apparently performs better by around 6C + when the block is orientated 45 degrees clockwise with the inlet on the right and outlet on the left....according to Kyle's testing at HARDOCP.


Not sure how you rotate a TR4 or any block 45°, but if you meant 90°, you still can't do that. Rotating a normal (non TR4) EK Supremacy EVO with a square baseplate works and allows you to change the orientation of the water channels in relations to the CPU by 90°, but the EK TR4 block has a rectangular baseplate allowing for better coverage of the Threadripper CPUs. Long way of saying you can't.


----------



## RoBiK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> His flow is Pump > GPU > CPU > Top Rad > Front Rad > back to Pump.
> 
> You don't literally have to use the top left as an inlet port. You just need to ensure that in/out are on opposite sides.
> Not sure how you rotate a TR4 or any block 45°, but if you meant 90°, you still can't do that. Rotating a normal (non TR4) EK Supremacy EVO with a square baseplate works and allows you to change the orientation of the water channels in relations to the CPU by 90°, but the EK TR4 block has a rectangular baseplate allowing for better coverage of the Threadripper CPUs. Long way of saying you can rotate the water channels 90° with the EK TR4 block.


He probably ment to say to rotate the top by 90 degrees, not the whole block.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RoBiK*
> 
> He probably ment to say to rotate the top by 90 degrees, not the whole block.


I get that, but he mentioned Kyle @ HardOCP, which is to say that he was to that he was talking about a goofy mount (rotating the water channels' relationship to the CPU by 90°). Additionally, you can't just rotate the top 90° to the baseplate. Well, technically you could, but your jet plate would then run parallel to the water channels in the base and that's now how it works.

Basically, it doesn't matter if he meant rotate the whole block by 90°, just the baseplate by 90°, or just the top by 90°. They would all be wrong.


----------



## Aenra

Will dare repeat this.. do not read that site for crying out loud.. they do whatever they want, go DIY methodology (always have, they just love doing their thing [aka we know better]), purposefully eschewing the peripherals/accesories shipping with the products they review and yet proceed to "inform" us about what's best and why. Even though what they tested is not what you'll be using; i mean.. need one really say more?


----------



## Undermoose

Hey folks,

Would love some feedback on the VRM X399 thread, or maybe this applies to Threadripper more because it is something I noticed on the PCIe bus.

On my XMP OC rig I've been mining Monero, and aside from air cooled GPU temps, with xmr-stak dual VEGA64 & Threadripper 1950x mining, my hotspot on my Gigabyte X399 Aorus gaming 7 motherboard is PCIe. PCIe hits 63c, while VRM is 47c, and CPU 58c.

Not entirely surprising since PCIe doesn't go through the chipset, but how do you cool PCIe chips on an X399 mobo.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Question for anyone who has NVMe RAID0 up and running. I'm looking for my ultimate setup to be two 1TB Samsung 960 EVO's as the RAID0 Windows boot drive, along with an SATA hard drive for media and an optical drive.

I've managed to get the RAID array up and running but have a question with the SATA HD and optical drive. In Advanced/Storage Configuration I've changed the "SATA Mode" to RAID from AHCI per AMD instructions.

My question: Will changing this setting impact my SATA non-RAID hard drive and optical drive? Do I also need to create separate non-RAID array for the hard drive or will Windows recognize it without setting up an array in the UEPI? Or, after my RAID0 array is up and running post installation, do I switch it back to AHCI?

Other relevant specs:
-X399 Taichi
-1920X OC at 4.1ghz @1.35v


----------



## sandysuk

It doesn't make a lot of difference, Once you have raid installed you can change the driver of the device to use non AMD raid controller, I did this when switching between AMD Raid and Windows software RAID to see performance differences.

My system NVMe is not on the AMD Raid controller and using Samsung Nvme controller.

A couple of 960s should work well I use PM961s which are a lower specced OEM variant of that drive.


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> Question for anyone who has NVMe RAID0 up and running. I'm looking for my ultimate setup to be two 1TB Samsung 960 EVO's as the RAID0 Windows boot drive, along with an SATA hard drive for media and an optical drive.
> 
> I've managed to get the RAID array up and running but have a question with the SATA HD and optical drive. In Advanced/Storage Configuration I've changed the "SATA Mode" to RAID from AHCI per AMD instructions.
> 
> My question: Will changing this setting impact my SATA non-RAID hard drive and optical drive? Do I also need to create separate non-RAID array for the hard drive or will Windows recognize it without setting up an array in the UEPI? Or, after my RAID0 array is up and running post installation, do I switch it back to AHCI?
> 
> Other relevant specs:
> -X399 Taichi
> -1920X OC at 4.1ghz @1.35v


I'm fairly certain the controller views non-RAID devices as single drive RAID devices when you change the mode from AHCI to RAID. It's not until you initialize the device and add it to a new RAID set that it becomes part of an "actual" RAID volume. I've done this on the Asus board and it works fine.


----------



## lowdog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RoBiK*
> 
> He probably ment to say to rotate the top by 90 degrees, not the whole block.


Yeah 90 degrees is correct so the fins in the cold plate run diagonally.

Also instructions from EK in regard to the Vega block specifically state the left port in the input....why I have no idea unless it's to do with the way the inside of the cold plate is supposed to function optimally.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> I'm fairly certain the controller views non-RAID devices as single drive RAID devices when you change the mode from AHCI to RAID. It's not until you initialize the device and add it to a new RAID set that it becomes part of an "actual" RAID volume. I've done this on the Asus board and it works fine.


Thanks for this. So to clarify, to get my setup (Raid drive plus stand-alone hard drive) I should just leave it at "RAID" setting in SATA Mode?


----------



## sandysuk

Yes leave it in SATA RAID


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Yes leave it in SATA RAID


Thanks! Repped.


----------



## sandysuk

I'll be interested in your results with 960s, whilst it should be a bit quicker, i'd like to see what some one else's numbers are like.

I compared AMD RAID0 speeds with my Windows RAID0 using same drives in same slots slots but Samsung NVMe driver rather than AMD Raid driver, AMD RAID seems a touch slower, not that I can feel it, but see it in reported benchmark numbers. Crystal diskmark 6, Atto and AS SSD

AMD RAID benches


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Windows RAID benches, same drives, same slots etc.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Windows software raid appears faster, Interesting.

Just wondering if your AMD RAID array puts in comparable numbers and whether it was just my AMD RAID array that was the problem, it was chronically slow when install at boot, transfers been two arrays would croak, each array ran fine independantly but transferring between would end up slower than a spinner, very weird.

Once I took the drives off of the AMD driver they ran fine, or when I installed the AMD RAID array within windows it was fine but the F6 driver seem to kill it, of course could also be my Windows install USB was pre creators update and perhaps these drivers were supposed to be for a specific version to work right?


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lowdog*
> 
> Isn't the top port the inlet on the EK Threadripper block and the left port the inlet on the EK Vega block?????????????......how you got it all flowing??
> 
> Also the EK TR4 block apparently performs better by around 6C + when the block is orientated 45 degrees clockwise with the inlet on the right and outlet on the left....according to Kyle's testing at HARDOCP.


I don't know what you mean it seems to be working perfectly find with me and to what I have expected to be. Keep in mind this is on a case that is air restricted no mods done to improve air flow and all this is done with fully closed case. I will play for a bit tonight and take a few screen shots to provide it here so I am not sure what others are experiencing.









Update! Room temp was 72 during gaming.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ITAngel*
> 
> I don't know what you mean it seems to be working perfectly find with me and to what I have expected to be. Keep in mind this is on a case that is air restricted no mods done to improve air flow and all this is done with fully closed case. I will play for a bit tonight and take a few screen shots to provide it here so I am not sure what others are experiencing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Update! Room temp was 72 during gaming.


Seems like you are running in game mode,only half the cores (six) are actually active.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> I'll be interested in your results with 960s, whilst it should be a bit quicker, i'd like to see what some one else's numbers are like.
> 
> I compared AMD RAID0 speeds with my Windows RAID0 using same drives in same slots slots but Samsung NVMe driver rather than AMD Raid driver, AMD RAID seems a touch slower, not that I can feel it, but see it in reported benchmark numbers. Crystal diskmark 6, Atto and AS SSD
> 
> AMD RAID benches
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windows RAID benches, same drives, same slots etc.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windows software raid appears faster, Interesting.
> 
> Just wondering if your AMD RAID array puts in comparable numbers and whether it was just my AMD RAID array that was the problem, it was chronically slow when install at boot, transfers been two arrays would croak, each array ran fine independantly but transferring between would end up slower than a spinner, very weird.
> 
> Once I took the drives off of the AMD driver they ran fine, or when I installed the AMD RAID array within windows it was fine but the F6 driver seem to kill it, of course could also be my Windows install USB was pre creators update and perhaps these drivers were supposed to be for a specific version to work right?


PM me and I will run the same numbers for you later this week. When I installed AMD chipset drivers it blew up my bootable drive (I get the BSOD upon booting). so I have to start over. I also have slow load time at the bios screen every time I boot. Could use some advice on how you got past the slow booting.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The L33t*
> 
> Seems like you are running in game mode,only half the cores (six) are actually active.


Yea is were I feel runs great for most games but I will be doing some work under creative mode this week and I can check the temps there.


----------



## x7007

What should be suppose the MAX CPU TEMP , or CPU Tctl or CPU Tdie for 1950x with Corsair H115i ? I didn't replace the Thermal Paste, I used the one it comes with it.

with overclock to 4.0 + 1.340-1.350 Voltage the temp are really going high to

CPU Tctl 103c +
CPU Tdie 75c+

AMD Ryzen Master shows 76c + but I stop it before it reaches higher.

I have Arctic MX -2 or Arctic Silver 5 but very little bit, and Arctic MX-4 I think I have more of MX-2 , would replacing the Thermal Paste would help enough ?

that's when using prime95 Small FFT test 32 cores .

Is there something I can do to be able to reach 4.0 with stable Temp ??


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> What should be suppose the MAX CPU TEMP , or CPU Tctl or CPU Tdie for 1950x with Corsair H115i ? I didn't replace the Thermal Paste, I used the one it comes with it.
> 
> with overclock to 4.0 + 1.340-1.350 Voltage the temp are really going high to
> 
> CPU Tctl 103c +
> CPU Tdie 75c+
> 
> AMD Ryzen Master shows 76c + but I stop it before it reaches higher.
> 
> I have Arctic MX -2 or Arctic Silver 5 but very little bit, and Arctic MX-4 I think I have more of MX-2 , would replacing the Thermal Paste would help enough ?
> 
> that's when using prime95 Small FFT test 32 cores .
> 
> Is there something I can do to be able to reach 4.0 with stable Temp ??


Not with an H115i unfortunately - the cold plate is too small. 4.0 at 1.33+ is in custom loop territory as TR doesn't like sustained loads at high temps (70-75C plus tdie).

You might be able to get away with an enermax liquitech tr4 with noisy aftermarket fans if a custom loop isn't in the cards. A swiftech H220-x with an XSPC or Bykski TR4 block would be AIO-esque but work better. Another option is one of the new EK Units with a non-ek block, but I don't know how good they are yet without reviews.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Not with an H115i unfortunately - the cold plate is too small. 4.0 at 1.33+ is in custom loop territory as TR doesn't like sustained loads at high temps (70-75C plus tdie).
> 
> You might be able to get away with an enermax liquitech tr4 with noisy aftermarket fans if a custom loop isn't in the cards. A swiftech H220-x with an XSPC or Bykski TR4 block would be AIO-esque but work better. Another option is one of the new EK Units with a non-ek block, but I don't know how good they are yet without reviews.


Thermaltake 380mm won't be good also?
there are more aio, none will hold it?

Even on stock 3.4 and 1.270-1.290 the TEMP reaches to 67 on the Rayzen Master and Tctl reaches 94c . Do I need to put new Thermal Paste ? or something else going on.

Does anyone else test Prime95 with Small FFT, what are your temps? because Blend doesn't use much power like Small FFT and it's fine with Blend.

EDIT : Ha , I forgot I use image to reinstall windows and I didn't set Corsair Link to Performance after I restored it.. so that's why I remember I have higher Temp now. even on IDLE or LOAD without Oc ..

So I connected Corsair USB Cable again , installed Corsair Link and it was Balanced, changed it to Performance.

Even after I did all this it seems that I can't reach the same temp as when I first connect it. at the first time I ran Blend and it reached max to 55 or so . now it's passes 60+ even on performance. I think the Stock thermal paste must degraded , because I forgot to connect the Pump SATA power couple of times and it reached 70c so I think the Thermal Paste melted or something. I think repasted should fix the issue because it can't be something else. could it ?


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Not with an H115i unfortunately - the cold plate is too small. 4.0 at 1.33+ is in custom loop territory as TR doesn't like sustained loads at high temps (70-75C plus tdie).
> 
> You might be able to get away with an enermax liquitech tr4 with noisy aftermarket fans if a custom loop isn't in the cards. A swiftech H220-x with an XSPC or Bykski TR4 block would be AIO-esque but work better. Another option is one of the new EK Units with a non-ek block, but I don't know how good they are yet without reviews.


since i dont care too much about the noise, any specific aftermarket fan recommendations for the liquitech 240?


----------



## happyluckbox

Get the liqtech 360 for the tr1950x


----------



## x7007

Can anyone tell me why at first when I did Blend in prime95 I had max 55 c in Ryzen Master , and after that It went up to 70c + ?

Also I've repasted and now it's still 61.75c and not 55c when I first built the system and ran a test. can someone explain ?

What is your Ryzen Master Temp when you do prime95 Blend test and Small FFT , please someone , please please.

It takes almost ages to get fast answer so I can continue testing. it's simple test of barely 1 min !

For now it seems it worked the new Thermal Paste MX-4, using 4.0 Ghz it reaches 55c-57 in Blend test. very very slowly, not jumping to it like crazy. Stays 54.88c-55c very very steady.

I think when I didn't connect the Radiator SATA power supply like 3 times ,and they cpu reached 70c it really melt the Thermal Paste ......


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> Can anyone tell me why at first when I did Blend in prime95 I had max 55 c in Ryzen Master , and after that It went up to 70c + ?
> 
> Also I've repasted and now it's still 61.75c and not 55c when I first built the system and ran a test. can someone explain ?
> 
> *What is your Ryzen Master Temp when you do prime95 Blend test and Small FFT , please someone , please please.*
> 
> It takes almost ages to get fast answer so I can continue testing. it's simple test of barely 1 min !


Something obviously changed in either what you were comparing or how you were testing.

I just ran 2 Prime95 tests today. 1 large FFTs and 1 small FFTs.

Here are my temps at 4 GHz with 1.352v to 1.373v. I run memory at 3600 MHz c15-15-15 1T (2000%+ HCI stable)

Comparing temps between our setups isn't very relevant as conditions are completely different.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> Something obviously changed in either what you were comparing or how you were testing.
> 
> I just ran 2 Prime95 tests today. 1 large FFTs and 1 small FFTs.
> 
> Here are my temps at 4 GHz with 1.352v to 1.373v. I run memory at 3600 MHz c15-15-15 1T (2000%+ HCI stable)
> 
> Comparing temps between our setups isn't very relevant as conditions are completely different.


For me Small FFT reaching 99.6c CPU Tctl ...... :XX I don't understand what is the issue

Why can't this Corsair H115i 4Ghz 80c or something.... why it's reaching 97c

I connected the Fans to the motherboard and not the H115i radiator. is that ok ? maybe that's the issue ? I connected the CPU FAN to the mobo to CPU Fan. the others are connected to System Fan 1 and System Pump Fan 1


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> For me Small FFT reaching 99.6c CPU Tctl ...... :XX I don't understand what is the issue
> 
> Why can't this Corsair H115i 4Ghz 80c or something.... why it's reaching 97c
> 
> I connected the Fans to the motherboard and not the H115i radiator. is that ok ? maybe that's the issue ? I connected the CPU FAN to the mobo to CPU Fan. the others are connected to System Fan 1 and System Pump Fan 1


I have to be honest man. You're being too demanding of that H115i. As previously stated by others, you are not getting full coverage of the CPU with the H115i waterblock and the 280 rad is a little on the small size for what you are trying to do.

Either upgrade your cooling or reduce your overclock.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> I have to be honest man. You're being too demanding of that H115i. As previously stated by others, you are not getting full coverage of the CPU with the H115i waterblock and the 240 rad is a little on the small size for what you are trying to do.
> 
> Either upgrade your cooling or reduce your overclock.


Which AIO can sustain this overclock ? there are so many

NZXT , EK , Evga , ThermalTake , Enermax Liqtech TR4 360

Which AIO ?

Which one is the best ? and the next after it if you have a list

http://www.amd.com/en/thermal-solutions-threadripper


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> Which AIO can sustain this overclock ? there are so many
> 
> NZXT , EK , Evga , ThermalTake , Enermax Liqtech TR4 360
> 
> Which AIO ?


If I were going to use an AIO, it would be the Enermax, but that doesn't mean that it can definitely sustain your overclock. There are a number of variables that factor into that. Memory performance and ambient temps to name a couple.

Most people aren't really pushing their memory. If they don't push memory hard, they can probably get away with higher clocks. Faster memory = more work produced by CPU. More work = more heat.

Ambient temps are self-explanatory.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> If I were going to use an AIO, it would be the Enermax, but that doesn't mean that it can definitely sustain your overclock. There are a number of variables that factor into that. Memory performance and ambient temps to name a couple.
> 
> Most people aren't really pushing their memory. If they don't push memory hard, they can probably get away with higher clocks. Faster memory = more work produced by CPU. More work = more heat.
> 
> Ambient temps are self-explanatory.


I'm using FlareX QUAD Gskill 3200 Mhz 14-14-14 . Ambient will obviously change , now it's cold, It will be insane when it's hotter.


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cletus-cassidy*
> 
> PM me and I will run the same numbers for you later this week. When I installed AMD chipset drivers it blew up my bootable drive (I get the BSOD upon booting). so I have to start over. I also have slow load time at the bios screen every time I boot. Could use some advice on how you got past the slow booting.


Slow boot is unavoidable with the raid controller, it has to do drive discovery and settup across all ports, in Ahci mode it doesn't need to do all that but of course you don't get bootable raid.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> Which AIO can sustain this overclock ? there are so many
> 
> NZXT , EK , Evga , ThermalTake , Enermax Liqtech TR4 360
> 
> Which AIO ?
> 
> Which one is the best ? and the next after it if you have a list
> 
> http://www.amd.com/en/thermal-solutions-threadripper


Almost all of them are asetek based. Even the 360mm units have the same small cold plate and same small pump. Only the enermax liquitech unit is different. If you go for the swiftech or EK expandable options you'll have a better time of things
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thermophile*
> 
> since i dont care too much about the noise, any specific aftermarket fan recommendations for the liquitech 240?


The legendary delta afb1212sh if you want standard profile. 113cfm of fury at 46.5db. I'll need to pull the part number for the quieter 38mm deep counterpart (those are amazing). They have a range of fans some of which are more reasonable than others (with the sh I mentioned on the unreasonable end).

The deltas ramp down to low PWM speeds with only moderate motor noise. It yields a machine that can dissipate serious TDP when push comes to shove but is pretty tolerable when you aren't benching.

Once you go industrial you never go back.


----------



## thermophile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> The legendary delta afb1212sh if you want standard profile. 113cfm of fury at 46.5db. I'll need to pull the part number for the quieter 38mm deep counterpart (those are amazing). They have a range of fans some of which are more reasonable than others (with the sh I mentioned on the unreasonable end).
> 
> The deltas ramp down to low PWM speeds with only moderate motor noise. It yields a machine that can dissipate serious TDP when push comes to shove but is pretty tolerable when you aren't benching.
> 
> Once you go industrial you never go back..


links?


----------



## x7007

How can I get the 1950x without overclocking to reach the Turbo mode 3.9 Ghz ? because it always stays at 3.4 and only 1 Core is 3.7 Ghz. can anyone explain it ?


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> How can I get the 1950x without overclocking to reach the Turbo mode 3.9 Ghz ? because it always stays at 3.4 and only 1 Core is 3.7 Ghz. can anyone explain it ?


I believe AMD Ryzen Master is one method, but I don't tinker much with it.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> I believe AMD Ryzen Master is one method, but I don't tinker much with it.


hm
http://images.hardwarecanucks.com/image//skymtl/CPU/THREADRIPPER/THREADRIPPER-77.jpg


----------



## xkm1948

Alright TR owners. What would you say is the most stable TR4 motherboard as of right now for a long term stability first workstation build?


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Alright TR owners. What would you say is the most stable TR4 motherboard as of right now for a long term stability first workstation build?


Probably the Taichi from ASRock. The Zenith is good but still requires BIOS fixes. I avoid Gigabyte's finicky stuff. MSI's got a bit of a hot cold response to their Pro Carbon.


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Probably the Taichi from ASRock. The Zenith is good but still requires BIOS fixes. I avoid Gigabyte's finicky stuff. MSI's got a bit of a hot cold response to their Pro Carbon.


And I assume the Taichi can handle 128GB RAM just fine?

Also for a long term stability first, no overclocking build, would the Noctua heatsink be better?


----------



## The L33t

The taichi can indeed handle 128gb. But do check the QVL.

An air cooler like the noctua will indeed provide more than enough cooling capability even more so since your not going to overclock. And it will absolutely be more reliable than any AIO can ever be.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Alright TR owners. What would you say is the most stable TR4 motherboard as of right now for a long term stability first workstation build?





another vote for the taichi...mine is solid and I,m not gentle








also vrm temps for em are very good seems some of the other boards struggle in that area.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> How can I get the 1950x without overclocking to reach the Turbo mode 3.9 Ghz ? because it always stays at 3.4 and only 1 Core is 3.7 Ghz. can anyone explain it ?






getting to hot. prtty much as simple as that XFR boost etc is really reliant on heat.
clean it and put better heatpste on it and cove the entire coldplate on the h115i I managed to get good temps that way and I used 2k EK varder fans but not at full tilit.

now don't quote me because my pics are a mess but that was done on a h115i and 2 varders BUT ambient would only have been 20 degrees C none of this F rubbish








ambient temps at least for me makes a pretty big difference. But as you can see 37 and 41 for most of the time and the temps are under 60....os rule of thumb keep it under 60


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Alright TR owners. What would you say is the most stable TR4 motherboard as of right now for a long term stability first workstation build?


Taichi looks like a great board I know on the OCuk forum there are Issus with the Taichi and VM software so may not be the option depending on what you are doing with your workstation.

thread with VM infos

been pretty happy with my MSI board but can't say if it works with this VM scenario


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Alright TR owners. What would you say is the most stable TR4 motherboard as of right now for a long term stability first workstation build?


I been super happy with the ASRock X399 Fatal1ty Gaming. No issues that I can report as of yet.


----------



## x7007

Do you guys use bcdedit /disabledynamicTick Yes command ?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> another vote for the taichi...mine is solid and I,m not gentle
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also vrm temps for em are very good seems some of the other boards struggle in that area.
> 
> getting to hot. prtty much as simple as that XFR boost etc is really reliant on heat.
> clean it and put better heatpste on it and cove the entire coldplate on the h115i I managed to get good temps that way and I used 2k EK varder fans but not at full tilit.
> 
> now don't quote me because my pics are a mess but that was done on a h115i and 2 varders BUT ambient would only have been 20 degrees C none of this F rubbish
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ambient temps at least for me makes a pretty big difference. But as you can see 37 and 41 for most of the time and the temps are under 60....os rule of thumb keep it under 60


Do Prime 95 test Small FFT
then show the temps


----------



## lowdog

Some guy who calls himself "The stilt" on the internet and who is alleged to know a bit about Ryzen/Threadripper cpu's recommends this for stability testing;

"IMO >= 30min of Prime95 v28.10 with following settings should be set as the criteria:

Torture test > Custom > Min FFT size = 128, Max FFT size = 128, Run FFTs in-place ticked."

Those above setting will definately weed out an overclock tha may seem stable but is in factt teetering on the Ragged edge of stability.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Alright TR owners. What would you say is the most stable TR4 motherboard as of right now for a long term stability first workstation build?


Gigabyte X399 Aorus Gaming 7 working great for me.

XMP settings, for faster ram compatible with X399, I found G.Skill's QVL to work while Gigabyte's QVL did not. I ended up with G.Skill TridentZ RGB 4x8gb DDR4-3200 (AMD compatible ram from G.Skill's QVL). I think you'd be fine using G.Skill's QVL to find a 128gb kit for the Gigabyte boards, just don't use Gigabyte's QVL for anything over 2933mhz and expect XMP to work. For refecence, at the time of this post Gigabyte's support list is dated 10/31/2017.

Lots of nice boards out there, perhaps Gigabyte isn't everyone's first pick, but on XMP settings, air cooled, I can't get the VRM to go higher than 52c stress testing it. I read in a review, something about Gigabyte's VRM being more electrically efficient, while lacking some OC potential, but for an air cool implementation this might be the ideal.

Yeah I'm a Gigabyte fan at the moment, and love the motherboard's built in m.2 heat sinks on the Aorus Gaming 7.


----------



## Hurtman

Tell me please, after overcklocking and loading of Windows begins to lag, and video cards for some time are loaded for 100% what can be?
(Asus Zenith Extreme + 1950x)


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hurtman*
> 
> Tell me please, after overcklocking and loading of Windows begins to lag, and video cards for some time are loaded for 100% what can be?
> (Asus Zenith Extreme + 1950x)


If you have AISUITE installed, remove it.

But you may have an unstable overclock if this only happens with overclock.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hurtman*
> 
> Tell me please, after overcklocking and loading of Windows begins to lag, and video cards for some time are loaded for 100% what can be?
> (Asus Zenith Extreme + 1950x)


I thought I was the only one, but maybe it's not the same problem.

On OS startup, when it get to the desktop, responsiveness of the screen stops for a second, 3 times, one right after the other, and it 'catches up' after each freeze. It sometimes does that when opening a video or opening a picture too, and usually get microstutters when playing a video, like a stutter every 30 sec or so (maybe a quarter second long). The sound never freezes, just the video does.


----------



## Hurtman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> I thought I was the only one, but maybe it's not the same problem.
> 
> On OS startup, when it get to the desktop, responsiveness of the screen stops for a second, 3 times, one right after the other, and it 'catches up' after each freeze. It sometimes does that when opening a video or opening a picture too, and usually get microstutters when playing a video, like a stutter every 30 sec or so (maybe a quarter second long). The sound never freezes, just the video does.


Exactly !!!
If i overcklock in Ryzen Master, then there are no problems


----------



## awaybreaktoday

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> I thought I was the only one, but maybe it's not the same problem.
> 
> On OS startup, when it get to the desktop, responsiveness of the screen stops for a second, 3 times, one right after the other, and it 'catches up' after each freeze. It sometimes does that when opening a video or opening a picture too, and usually get microstutters when playing a video, like a stutter every 30 sec or so (maybe a quarter second long). The sound never freezes, just the video does.


Do you have HPET enabled in windows? Also did you install the ASRock A-Tuning utility?


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *awaybreaktoday*
> 
> Do you have HPET enabled in windows? Also did you install the ASRock A-Tuning utility?


HPET is not enabled.

C:\Windows\system32>bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock
An error occurred while attempting to delete the specified data element.
Element not found.

a-tuning has never been installed on this OS install. it always crashed before on previous OS installs,


----------



## awaybreaktoday

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> HPET is not enabled.
> 
> C:\Windows\system32>bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock
> An error occurred while attempting to delete the specified data element.
> Element not found.
> 
> a-tuning has never been installed on this OS install. it always crashed before on previous OS installs,


Can you run latancymon


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> Do you guys use bcdedit /disabledynamicTick Yes command ?
> Do Prime 95 test Small FFT
> then show the temps





\

short run 17 minutes but I can garauntee you the temps won't go up much I have never put that much I don't put that much stock in prime never have...3 hours constant dvd encoding on the other hand I do and the temps are similar maybe a bit higher but not much.

I,ll swap back to my overclock later and do it again.
also ambient in the room is about 25 degrees throw it up to 30/35 which it gets and I will test again


----------



## Tamalero

Greetings people!

Proud owner of Threadripper 1950X here joining the club.

Specs:

AMD Threadripper 1950X
Asus Prime X399-A
Corsair Domminator Platinum x 4 (3000CL15 @ 2933 CL16)
ATI-AMD HD 5450 1GB (temporally until I move my Gigabyte 1070 G1 Gaming)
Corsair MP500 250Gb M.2.
Seasonic Prime Titanium 750W
Noctua TR4SP3 with dual 140mm fan.

Question of the day, would this 3.9Ghz at 1.1875V (100% stable prime95, aida and cinebench) be a good chip?


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> \
> 
> short run 17 minutes but I can garauntee you the temps won't go up much I have never put that much I don't put that much stock in prime never have...3 hours constant dvd encoding on the other hand I do and the temps are similar maybe a bit higher but not much.
> 
> I,ll swap back to my overclock later and do it again.
> also ambient in the room is about 25 degrees throw it up to 30/35 which it gets and I will test again


How are your temps so low ?? did your lower your voltage or something ? because my cpu voltage is auto.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> \
> 
> short run 17 minutes but I can garauntee you the temps won't go up much I have never put that much I don't put that much stock in prime never have...3 hours constant dvd encoding on the other hand I do and the temps are similar maybe a bit higher but not much.
> 
> I,ll swap back to my overclock later and do it again.
> also ambient in the room is about 25 degrees throw it up to 30/35 which it gets and I will test again


Your package and CPU power levels are low in your HWinfo64 screenshot indicating that a lighter load is being placed on that CPU. This in turns lowers your temps and so on.

What test did you run and were any changes made?

Nevermind. You ran it stock.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> How are your temps so low ?? did your lower your voltage or something ? because my cpu voltage is auto.





yes that's stock but I swapped to my 4050 clock and that is screwed up at the moment nasty temps and a lockup.
then again it is 29 degrees in here now so that didn't help.

I believe my ram settings are a bit iffy so I,m going to try 4050 but with xmp(as that does not seem to affect performance that much)

but of course you all made me paranoid so I stripped the block off and redid the thermal paste....half a tube of grizzly kryonaut mind you :0 and low and behold....nothing ...the same







so next time I won't listen









now when it is chilly here say 20 degrees or less prime 95 is a doddle and I can keep it to around 62 degrees but of course add 8/10 degrees....you add 8/10 degrees.

once I bed it in I,ll run it all again.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> Your package and CPU power levels are low in your HWinfo64 screenshot indicating that a lighter load is being placed on that CPU. This in turns lowers your temps and so on.
> 
> What test did you run and were any changes made?
> 
> Nevermind. You ran it stock.






here you go a couple of older ones at 4030

but not prime as I have said I don't play prime or encode prime or render prime












I,m still a little iffy my rm 1000 psu is up to it so I,ll have to check that out as well


----------



## noanoa

Not sure if I am posting this in the right section but if not pls let me know, anyway, I upgraded to a 1950x and a asus x399 prime motherboard about 3 weeks ago and after some initial issues with not so good performance I currently have it up and running with decent benchmark results.

I only have one issue with the memory, my pc was put together by the store where i got my pc from, originally I had choosed hyperx memory which I found back on the qvl list of my motherboard. The pc builder phoned me to say they couldn't get my system to boot with the memory I selected and they suggested a corsair vengeance kit of 4x8GB (http://www.corsair.com/en-us/vengeance-lpx-32gb-4x8gb-ddr4-dram-3200mhz-c16-memory-kit-black-cmk32gx4m4b3200c16) and those did work.

Since I got the pc I have issues with the overal responsiveness, programs open slower eventhough I use 960 evo's and general use like navigating in the menu system is always with a small delay. My older i7 4790k is a lot more responsive.
I allready uninstalled ai suite, disabled and deleted useplatformclock which helped a lot performance wise but the lag remains.

I did notice now that the pc builder did not install the 4 memory dimms acc to the manufacturers recommondation to have them in a quad channel configuration, my pc builder ignored their recommondations and just put all 4 dimms next to eachother on the right side of the processor.

I have xmp enabled in the bios and the memory runs at 3200mhz but I"m getting a quite low score of 2300 in a passmark memory test, when I install the dimms like is suggested (starting with one dimm at a time) I can get 3 dimms installed and the system still boots but with the 4th dim the pc shuts down after 2 seconds and gets in a constant system reboot and shutdown again.

I have a feeling my issues might be either motherboard, processor or memory related but I was thinking of returning the pc to the builder asking them to make sure it will boot with a quad channel configuration which probably will mean other type of memory. The only thing I fear is that I might not be able again to get the memory up to it's 3200mhz speed again if I read how many people are having issues with that.

Would the difference in performance between a dual and quad channel memory config be worth it or should I be glad that I can get it running at 3200mhz?


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> Not sure if I am posting this in the right section but if not pls let me know, anyway, I upgraded to a 1950x and a asus x399 prime motherboard about 3 weeks ago and after some initial issues with not so good performance I currently have it up and running with decent benchmark results.
> 
> I only have one issue with the memory, my pc was put together by the store where i got my pc from, originally I had choosed hyperx memory which I found back on the qvl list of my motherboard. The pc builder phoned me to say they couldn't get my system to boot with the memory I selected and they suggested a corsair vengeance kit of 4x8GB (http://www.corsair.com/en-us/vengeance-lpx-32gb-4x8gb-ddr4-dram-3200mhz-c16-memory-kit-black-cmk32gx4m4b3200c16) and those did work.
> 
> Since I got the pc I have issues with the overal responsiveness, programs open slower eventhough I use 960 evo's and general use like navigating in the menu system is always with a small delay. My older i7 4790k is a lot more responsive.
> I allready uninstalled ai suite, disabled and deleted useplatformclock which helped a lot performance wise but the lag remains.
> 
> I did notice now that the pc builder did not install the 4 memory dimms acc to the manufacturers recommondation to have them in a quad channel configuration, my pc builder ignored their recommondations and just put all 4 dimms next to eachother on the right side of the processor.
> 
> I have xmp enabled in the bios and the memory runs at 3200mhz but I"m getting a quite low score of 2300 in a passmark memory test, when I install the dimms like is suggested (starting with one dimm at a time) I can get 3 dimms installed and the system still boots but with the 4th dim the pc shuts down after 2 seconds and gets in a constant system reboot and shutdown again.
> 
> I have a feeling my issues might be either motherboard, processor or memory related but I was thinking of returning the pc to the builder asking them to make sure it will boot with a quad channel configuration which probably will mean other type of memory. The only thing I fear is that I might not be able again to get the memory up to it's 3200mhz speed again if I read how many people are having issues with that.
> 
> Would the difference in performance between a dual and quad channel memory config be worth it or should I be glad that I can get it running at 3200mhz?


Question:

Is your system running at full speed as per your memory? With these kind of memories(hynix) it usually defaults to 2400Mhz on dual or 2133 on quad. Which is VERY SLOW.

And honestly, you really need to change the memory position. You pretty much are starving the other dual memory channel. You're probably running at dual channel one side than quad channel double side. (you're pretty much starving the other zeppelin core)

The X399 PRime has SILVER slots in each side, those are for running dual and quad channel mode.

Also did you disabled HPET in Windows ? It causes issues in most muticore systems (including mouse lag, stuttering..etc..).


----------



## noanoa

Thx for your answer, yes I disabled hpet using "bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock" which had a big impact on some benchmark scrores. My memory is running at 3200mhz after enabling xmp in the bios.

I also reseated the memory modules acc to the asus recommendations like it is mentioned in their userguide but the pc keeps crashing when I install the 4th module, it keeps rebooting every 2 seconds.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> Thx for your answer, yes I disabled hpet using "bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock" which had a big impact on some benchmark scrores. My memory is running at 3200mhz after enabling xmp in the bios.
> 
> I also reseated the memory modules acc to the asus recommendations like it is mentioned in their userguide but the pc keeps crashing when I install the 4th module, it keeps rebooting every 2 seconds.


It reboots in the 14-15 Stage in your LEDS right?

Imho, You need to either relax your settings or lower your memory speed to 2933 CL16.

I havent been able to boot anything faster than 2933 CL16 myself.

So I think this is a limit by the current AGESA on non Samsung memory. I hope the new incoming AGESA update fixes these issues.


----------



## noanoa

The reboot happens quite abrupt right after I start up the system, I am seeing some numbers appearing on the led indicator but it changes so fast I don't even can see what it states just before it reboots, I haven't thought about trying to install the modules at a lower memoryspeed, will try to reinstall but disable xmp and see what happens, thanks for the input!


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> The reboot happens quite abrupt right after I start up the system, I am seeing some numbers appearing on the led indicator but it changes so fast I don't even can see what it states just before it reboots, I haven't thought about trying to install the modules at a lower memoryspeed, will try to reinstall but disable xmp and see what happens, thanks for the input!


Actually, run the XMP settings (D.O.C.P I think) and then change the frequency manually to 2933 of the memory. Save and try again.

Also you could use your cellphone camera in high 60fps mode and video your motherboard posting, then you can check frame by frame the codes displayed.

In my case, the memory diagnostic led always went from code 14 , then to 15 for a few seconds, then reboot (first LED, aka DRAM led in the mobo also turned on)..

The Leds: bottom pci for diagnostic led code system, top right (next to the right memory slots, between the power connectors) for the boot phase leds.


----------



## noanoa

I changed the mem freq to a lower nr, even switched all to default settings in the bios with memory running at 2133mhz but it kept crashing, now I saw the led error code it ended with and that was 15. I managed to add 3 sticks but each time when the 4th was added it refuses to boot.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> I changed the mem freq to a lower nr, even switched all to default settings in the bios with memory running at 2133mhz but it kept crashing, now I saw the led error code it ended with and that was 15. I managed to add 3 sticks but each time when the 4th was added it refuses to boot.


Is it always the same module failing when you add it?
Can you try to add it as second module and see if it crashes (Ie, swap modules to see if that module is bad)

Have you also tried using the black slots too just in case to see ?

There is something I tried when my ram was not detected correctly.


Add 1 module, boot to bios, save, shutdown.
Add 1 module (you have dual channel now), boot to bios, save, shutdown.
Add 2 modules (now you have 4 modules) boot to bios, save, shutdown.

That way my memory was finally set to CL16 by bios and was able to boot.
Before I could not boot the 4 slots, even at 2133 memory speeds.
I think it has to do with the "auto memory training".

If you have bad luck, the motherboard memory slot might be damaged (hence why I suggest using the black slots too)


----------



## noanoa

No, I get the same result if I swap modules in that 1 failing slot, the modules seem fine because when I run them all 4 on the right side only I see all memory running at 3200mhz. I also tried to install them one by one like you said but while adding the last 2 dimms it gave err code 15 again at different mem speeds. I think I will have to bring it back to the pc builder, since this seems to be a hardware problem I"ll leave it up to them to get the modules installed like it is suggested by the manufacturer.

This threadripper pc has been my most frustrating ever, the amount of hours I wasted getting it up to speed and now dealing with these memory issues will have me think twice if I ever will get a amd platform again.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> No, I get the same result if I swap modules in that 1 failing slot, the modules seem fine because when I run them all 4 on the right side only I see all memory running at 3200mhz. I also tried to install them one by one like you said but while adding the last 2 dimms it gave err code 15 again at different mem speeds. I think I will have to bring it back to the pc builder, since this seems to be a hardware problem I"ll leave it up to them to get the modules installed like it is suggested by the manufacturer.


Did you tried to do my suggestion of resetting bios, set all memory in (4 dimms in the correct silver slots).. get to bios, select your XMP settings, then change your memory speed manually?

Try 2400, then save and reboot, if it works, get to bios again and increase to 2666, then to 2933.

Because it almost feels like one of the sides of your threadripper isnt even working properly..


----------



## noanoa

Yes, but as soon as I pop in a module in that first silver slot the system doesn't boot with err 15 and I can't even get into the bios untill I remove that one module again.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> Yes, but as soon as I pop in a module in that first silver slot the system doesn't boot with err 15 and I can't even get into the bios untill I remove that one module again.


At this point its clear your motherboard is damaged imho.
bad luck! D:


----------



## noanoa

Yeah, something is not right for sure, I tried one last time but I just gave up, I allready send a mail to the pc store asking when I can bring the pc in. Good thing I still have my older pc







Anyway, thx a lot for your help, much appreciated!


----------



## x7007

Do you disable HPET In the bios also ? and bcdedit /set DisableDynamicTick Yes ?

did anyone check that ?


----------



## noanoa

I did run: bcdedit /set useplatformclock false and then bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock

This did have a significant impact on some benchmarkscores, in the bios though I couldn't find it back.

bcdedit /set DisableDynamicTick is a command that is not being recognised though?


----------



## illirio

I am running Threadripper 1950X at 3900 GHz with 1.3V voltage (this is the highest frequency when my system is stable enough to complete blender BMW render). I've done some stress-testing and I started mild - overnight AIDA64 CPU only load, but at some point I am experiencing a weird bug - at some point the CPU diode temperature starts to rise while other temperatures (CPU, VRAM, Chipset) are stable. Where should I look for the hits regarding what is going on (see the attached html file for the AIDA54 log file, temperature increase starts around 4:46PM).
My setup is Threadripper 1950X (3.9GHz 1.3V), 128GB 2666MHz Corsair platinum dominator, ASUS ROG Zenith Extreme, Liqtech TR4 360, for the case I am using Corsair Obsidian 750D airflow edition.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> At this point its clear your motherboard is damaged imho.
> bad luck! D:


Agree, I have a X399 ASUS Prime with quad channel RAM (had no issues since first boot up and 24/7 [email protected]/BOINC crunching). Definitely sounds like the one he has issues with the RAM slots.


----------



## noanoa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> Agree, I have a X399 ASUS Prime with quad channel RAM


Can I ask what the exact reference is for the memory you have used? Just in case my computerstore has issues finding compatible memory I can point them into the right direction, thanks!


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> Can I ask what the exact reference is for the memory you have used? Just in case my computerstore has issues finding compatible memory I can point them into the right direction, thanks!


Your best bet are those G.skill memories with 3200 speeds and CL14 timings. almost all of them are B die from samsung single rank.
Which seem to play way better with AMD's IMC than any other type.

But lets be honest, your issue seems the motherboard ram slots, not the memory itself.


----------



## noanoa

Lets hope it's 'only' that


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> I did run: bcdedit /set useplatformclock false and then bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock
> 
> This did have a significant impact on some benchmarkscores, in the bios though I couldn't find it back.
> 
> bcdedit /set DisableDynamicTick is a command that is not being recognised though?






make sure you do yes or no at the end


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> make sure you do yes or no at the end


no one uses that setting? tested ? saw improvement, anything?


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> Can I ask what the exact reference is for the memory you have used? Just in case my computerstore has issues finding compatible memory I can point them into the right direction, thanks!


O boy, you have to give me a bit of time to look. Ok, this the RAM in mine: CMD16GX4M4B3600C18
And no, I am not running at 3600MHz with this four sticks. Think I tune them down to 3200MHz (still need to go back and do more tuning, did a bit of dirty tune on them).

Though, they not GSkill RAM, the sticks are Corsair Dominator that came with the deal of trading for this chip, board, and RAM off a peep on a forum board (though, right now I am doing another trade deal for an i9 - I got a bad habit







).


----------



## noanoa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> make sure you do yes or no at the end


Ah yes, that did it, not sure though what it does as I don't see any change in my pc behaviour.


----------



## noanoa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> O boy, you have to give me a bit of time to look. Ok, this the RAM in mine: CMD16GX4M4B3600C18


Thanks a lot for your time to check, like Tamalero suggested my issue is most likely a faulty motherboard but I like to keep my options open







You never know if they might run into memory issues again with a new board and with my current memory so I at least can give them a suggestion. Thanks again!


----------



## Tamalero

Anyone knows any update on the new firmwares for the X399 platform motherboards?
I know a lot of Ryzen platforms already got the new AGESA.


----------



## The L33t

AGESA for Threadripper is on version 1.0.0.4 and ASRock has both their x399 motherboards updated on that version for a couple of weeks.

Asus released yesterday a beta BIOS based on the updated AGESA too for the Zenith, but it is in the early stages... Most issues still present from earlier versions. Issues not AGESA related for the most part it seems.


----------



## THUMPer1

What should I do with a Gigabyte x399 Designare? I already have a ryzen system, and the rest of the x399 platform is a little too expensive for me right now. Plus the fact I wouldn't utilize it.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *THUMPer1*
> 
> What should I do with a Gigabyte x399 Designare? I already have a ryzen system, and the rest of the x399 platform is a little too expensive for me right now. Plus the fact I wouldn't utilize it.


Then why do you have it?


----------



## THUMPer1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Then why do you have it?


I won it in a contest.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *THUMPer1*
> 
> I won it in a contest.


Then sell it? Personally I never enter contests for items I have no use or intended use for. Give the chance to someone who would actually use it or could need it. Then again not many are like me on that front.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *THUMPer1*
> 
> What should I do with a Gigabyte x399 Designare? I already have a ryzen system, and the rest of the x399 platform is a little too expensive for me right now. Plus the fact I wouldn't utilize it.


Or just sell the Ryzen and get a Threadripper when its on discount.

You get a longer life of your product than Ryzen.


----------



## betam4x

So, I've been trying to get the chip to 4.2 GHz, but there is a hard throttle back to 550MHz when Prime95 runs. Do you guys have any idea what this could be? The only thing peculiar I noticed was that the Core VID (NOT VCore...) listings in HWInfo seem to cap at 1.4V when under load. They never go above that, and that seems to coincide with the throttling. If the CPU load backs off slightly, the voltage decreases to 1.392V and then the chip jumps back to full speed. This 'hard cap' prevents me from validating faster speeds. It seems like the chip wants more voltage, but for whatever reason it doesn't receive it. VRMs and temps are WELL within normal ranges during this time.

By the way, the Enermax 360 does a great job with 4.1GHz operation and below on my chip. Even Prime95 'small' settings push it to a max of 71 degrees under 4.1 ghz (1.35V) and 65C under 4.0 GHz (1.25V...used to be 1.2V and 63C before that last MSI bios)

EDIT: I'm wondering if it's a power delivery issue. disabling cores allows the remaining cores to move past the 1.4V and the throttling no longer occurs.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> So, I've been trying to get the chip to 4.2 GHz, but there is a hard throttle back to 550MHz when Prime95 runs. Do you guys have any idea what this could be? The only thing peculiar I noticed was that the Core VID (NOT VCore...) listings in HWInfo seem to cap at 1.4V when under load. They never go above that, and that seems to coincide with the throttling. If the CPU load backs off slightly, the voltage decreases to 1.392V and then the chip jumps back to full speed. This 'hard cap' prevents me from validating faster speeds. It seems like the chip wants more voltage, but for whatever reason it doesn't receive it. VRMs and temps are WELL within normal ranges during this time.
> 
> By the way, the Enermax 360 does a great job with 4.1GHz operation and below on my chip. Even Prime95 'small' settings push it to a max of 71 degrees under 4.1 ghz (1.35V) and 65C under 4.0 GHz (1.25V...used to be 1.2V and 63C before that last MSI bios)
> 
> EDIT: I'm wondering if it's a power delivery issue. disabling cores allows the remaining cores to move past the 1.4V and the throttling no longer occurs.


Hu.. Isnt the maximum temps of Threadripper 69C Tcore? (aka 90 Tjunction) ?

My threadripper locks down on prime when reaches 72C. Perhaps its a thermal throttle?


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> So, I've been trying to get the chip to 4.2 GHz, but there is a hard throttle back to 550MHz when Prime95 runs. Do you guys have any idea what this could be? The only thing peculiar I noticed was that the Core VID (NOT VCore...) listings in HWInfo seem to cap at 1.4V when under load. They never go above that, and that seems to coincide with the throttling. If the CPU load backs off slightly, the voltage decreases to 1.392V and then the chip jumps back to full speed. This 'hard cap' prevents me from validating faster speeds. It seems like the chip wants more voltage, but for whatever reason it doesn't receive it. VRMs and temps are WELL within normal ranges during this time.
> 
> By the way, the Enermax 360 does a great job with 4.1GHz operation and below on my chip. Even Prime95 'small' settings push it to a max of 71 degrees under 4.1 ghz (1.35V) and 65C under 4.0 GHz (1.25V...used to be 1.2V and 63C before that last MSI bios)
> 
> EDIT: I'm wondering if it's a power delivery issue. disabling cores allows the remaining cores to move past the 1.4V and the throttling no longer occurs.


My MSI board had a 550MHz issue, but I only had that for about a day, not sure what I did to fix it. Likely a power limit or VRM thermal limit. Unlock the limits and put fans where applicable. I'm now on an asrock board and I can push the chip to 90C Tdie no problem. No throttling at all, just have to watch VRM temperatures since I didnt splurge on a monoblock.

BTW, enermax AIO.... yeah, its very good. But where can I get a standalone block of the enermax? Does it exist? Would like an enermax-style block that actually works.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Hu.. Isnt the maximum temps of Threadripper 69C Tcore? (aka 90 Tjunction) ?
> 
> My threadripper locks down on prime when reaches 72C. Perhaps its a thermal throttle?


"maximum" recommended temperature is 95C Tctl (68C Tdie) But feh, i say crank that sumbish. non-X ryzen doesnt have any Tctl alteration shenanigans so it magically allows higher actual die temperature? the Tctl alteration for X-series ryzen (+17C) and threadripper (+27C) is mostly to manipulate more aggressive fan curve and adjust XFR boosts differently.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Hu.. Isnt the maximum temps of Threadripper 69C Tcore? (aka 90 Tjunction) ?
> 
> My threadripper locks down on prime when reaches 72C. Perhaps its a thermal throttle?


Sounds like you have other issues at play. To my knowledge, Threadripper does not magically thermal throttle at anything below at least 87C. In my case, this wouldn't even apply, since it was throttling when the chip was at 27C. I'm going to poke through BIOS settings sometime and see if there is something blocking it there.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> My MSI board had a 550MHz issue, but I only had that for about a day, not sure what I did to fix it. Likely a power limit or VRM thermal limit. Unlock the limits and put fans where applicable. I'm now on an asrock board and I can push the chip to 90C Tdie no problem. No throttling at all, just have to watch VRM temperatures since I didnt splurge on a monoblock.
> 
> BTW, enermax AIO.... yeah, its very good. But where can I get a standalone block of the enermax? Does it exist? Would like an enermax-style block that actually works.


If I could still return this board I would. It is absolute crap. Avoid anything with 'x399' and 'MSI' in the same name. I purchased pretty close to launch, so I'm well outside the return window and the thought of buying another $350-$500 motherboard makes me cringe. I'll review things once Pinnacle Ridge drops.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> Sounds like you have other issues at play. To my knowledge, Threadripper does not magically thermal throttle at anything below at least 87C. In my case, this wouldn't even apply, since it was throttling when the chip was at 27C. I'm going to poke through BIOS settings sometime and see if there is something blocking it there.


Are we talking Tcore temps or Tjuction temps?


----------



## betam4x

I've had a bit more time to play with
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> So, I've been trying to get the chip to 4.2 GHz, but there is a hard throttle back to 550MHz when Prime95 runs. Do you guys have any idea what this could be? The only thing peculiar I noticed was that the Core VID (NOT VCore...) listings in HWInfo seem to cap at 1.4V when under load. They never go above that, and that seems to coincide with the throttling. If the CPU load backs off slightly, the voltage decreases to 1.392V and then the chip jumps back to full speed. This 'hard cap' prevents me from validating faster speeds. It seems like the chip wants more voltage, but for whatever reason it doesn't receive it. VRMs and temps are WELL within normal ranges during this time.
> 
> By the way, the Enermax 360 does a great job with 4.1GHz operation and below on my chip. Even Prime95 'small' settings push it to a max of 71 degrees under 4.1 ghz (1.35V) and 65C under 4.0 GHz (1.25V...used to be 1.2V and 63C before that last MSI bios)
> 
> EDIT: I'm wondering if it's a power delivery issue. disabling cores allows the remaining cores to move past the 1.4V and the throttling no longer occurs.


So I've had a bit more time to diagnose this issue. This is not a CPU issue at all. My Threadripper can actually hit 4.2 - 4.3 GHz at 1.375-1.45V. The issue is a motherboard power delivery issue. *MSI X399 Motherboards appear to be unable to power all 16 cores at 4.2GHz + and with a core voltage of 1.4V+* Attempting to do this will actually lead to throttling, or if you crank up other voltages, it will actually cause the board itself to hard lock to the point where you can't even hold the power button to turn the power off (all the graphics cards and everything connected to the board instantly shuts off). I can easily disable 4 cores and suddenly the issue goes away.

I know I've already said it, but stay away from MSI boards. I will be ditching this one if/when AMD rolls out a Pinnacle Ridge Threadripper.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> If I could still return this board I would. It is absolute crap. Avoid anything with 'x399' and 'MSI' in the same name. I purchased pretty close to launch, so I'm well outside the return window and the thought of buying another $350-$500 motherboard makes me cringe. I'll review things once Pinnacle Ridge drops.


I ended up selling my MSI x399 on ebay for $285. I had some watchers and plenty of views but no buys until I put "or best offer". Ended up going to some guy in Australia. Hope he doesn't return it


----------



## tarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> I ended up selling my MSI x399 on ebay for $285. I had some watchers and plenty of views but no buys until I put "or best offer". Ended up going to some guy in Australia. Hope he doesn't return it


well it wasn't me







not a fan of the msi boards...no experience myself with them but a lot of people seem to complain plus the taichi was sooo much cheaper









and yes I ahev seen the 72 degree lock on my 1950x but I have also see it go to 78 without issue.

68 degrees and below is the sweet spot and thone I am trying to keep it under especially stock....boosts so much better when cooler.


----------



## Undermoose

FYI,

AMD NVMe raid now appears to fully support Windows 10: https://support.amd.com/en-us/download/chipset?os=Windows+10+-+64

Here's what I did to convert to NVMe raid without reinstalling Windows: http://forum.gigabyte.us/thread/2903/nvme-chipset-drivers-working-windows


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> well it wasn't me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not a fan of the msi boards...no experience myself with them but a lot of people seem to complain plus the taichi was sooo much cheaper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and yes I ahev seen the 72 degree lock on my 1950x but I have also see it go to 78 without issue.
> 
> 68 degrees and below is the sweet spot and thone I am trying to keep it under especially stock....boosts so much better when cooler.


Leaving it at stock is almost pointless for me. I would like to see the CPU reduce power to save energy, but 4GHz for 16 cores @ 1.225V is amazing.


----------



## JUANNY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> Leaving it at stock is almost pointless for me. I would like to see the CPU reduce power to save energy, but 4GHz for 16 cores @ 1.225V is amazing.


That is a sweet voltage for 4.o gig. In my rig the 1950x requires 1.3375 volts for the same OC but turns into a volcano with heat.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> Leaving it at stock is almost pointless for me. I would like to see the CPU reduce power to save energy, but 4GHz for 16 cores @ 1.225V is amazing.


Have you tried to use ZenStates? works really nice to keep the cpu going downclock for normal everyday performance.

And that voltage level is amazing, I need to go for 1.25V to reach 4.1
I'm currently running 39.25X at 1.19375V


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JUANNY*
> 
> That is a sweet voltage for 4.o gig. In my rig the 1950x requires 1.3375 volts for the same OC but turns into a volcano with heat.


It sounds to me like you aren't using LLC. With Threadripper you really do need to use LLC to keep the voltages (and heat) down when you overclock.


----------



## cletus-cassidy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Have you tried to use ZenStates? works really nice to keep the cpu going downclock for normal everyday performance.
> 
> And that voltage level is amazing, I need to go for 1.25V to reach 4.1
> I'm currently running 39.25X at 1.19375V


1.25 is pretty amazing for 4.1. Takes me 1.345 to get there on a 1920X.


----------



## JUANNY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> It sounds to me like you aren't using LLC. With Threadripper you really do need to use LLC to keep the voltages (and heat) down when you overclock.


Im using p-state OC to 4 Ghz-base voltage of 1.125v +.2125v offset LLC 3 The heat level when testing stability with prime95 topped off at 79c but at least thats the worst case scenario. Nothing else that I do creates that level of heat torture. Felling good with the 4 [email protected] memory overclock of 64 gb flare x at cl14 stable


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JUANNY*
> 
> Im using p-state OC to 4 Ghz-base voltage of 1.125v +.2125v offset LLC 3 The heat level when testing stability with prime95 topped off at 79c but at least thats the worst case scenario. Nothing else that I do creates that level of heat torture. Felling good with the 4 [email protected] memory overclock of 64 gb flare x at cl14 stable


I always wonder how you guys get past the 75C.

I always lock up at around 75C regardless of what voltage.
I can go happily up to 70C and no issue, but 75C.. and lock.
Makes me wonder if my motherboard has a trigger to shutdown or lockdown on these temps.


----------



## JUANNY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> I always wonder how you guys get past the 75C.
> 
> I always lock up at around 75C regardless of what voltage.
> I can go happily up to 70C and no issue, but 75C.. and lock.
> Makes me wonder if my motherboard has a trigger to shutdown or lockdown on these temps.


Is not just the cpu temp that has to be monitored when testing the stability or lack thereof. If your MB has the supported sensors then you also have to see what the cpu voltage regulator modules (VRM) temps are at especially when youre applying a decent level of cpu load line calibration. When those temps get close to or exceed 100c-125c stabilty and motherboard reliabilty suffer. In my case since I have a decent memory OC I also monitor DIMM temps since I experienced memory stabilty issues once memory temps exceeded bout 52c. Since I invested in memory cooling fans from gskill it has not been an issue for me.


----------



## JUANNY

The other thing I just thought about in reference to threadripper and something AMD mentioned at some point is that generally temps above 68c can produce instabilities within the processor when at heavy loads. Ive been lucky in the sense that during my OC trials Ive seen temps get to about 86c when I saw my 1950x start to thermal throttle to lower clocks because of temps. So like the silicon lottery it might be a matter of getting lucky with a cpu that can tolerate higher temps without locking up tho you should never run a cpu that hot.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JUANNY*
> 
> Is not just the cpu temp that has to be monitored when testing the stability or lack thereof. If your MB has the supported sensors then you also have to see what the cpu voltage regulator modules (VRM) temps are at especially when youre applying a decent level of cpu load line calibration. When those temps get close to or exceed 100c-125c stabilty and motherboard reliabilty suffer. In my case since I have a decent memory OC I also monitor DIMM temps since I experienced memory stabilty issues once memory temps exceeded bout 52c. Since I invested in memory cooling fans from gskill it has not been an issue for me.


Will have to check the memories because the VRMS never went past 80C in my 1.35V tests.


----------



## JavajiveDK

Well, joining the club, just Got my 1920x and zenith board Running, Really impressed so far. WC still needs a bit of work, snd missing a 2ndary ssd, but its a work in progress.


----------



## NuffC3d

Hi guys, I'm currently putting together a part list for a computer I'm making to run some high peformance poker software called PioSolver and I'm going with the Threadripper 1950x as my processor but I've been reading a lot of negative things about memory issues with motherboards. I was told that the MSI - X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC ATX TR4 Motherboard memory issues were fixed, is this corrrect? Also, would y'all select the MSI motherboard over the ASRock - Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming ATX TR4 Motherboard?
I will link my parts list below so you can see what I have selected and what motherboard would be best and which motherboards are currently working with the threadripper.

Parts List: https://pcpartpicker.com/user/NuffC3d/saved/


----------



## Aenra

/rhetorical on

Socket after socket, MSI is a letdown is a letdown.

Letdown after letdown, it ---still--- sells its motherboards at a higher price than ---any--- of its competitors.

Because somehow, worse must also cost more.

And what do we do?

Ask in forums about the new, newer MSI motherboard!

Anyone see what i did here?

/rhetorical off

/initiate standby


----------



## sandysuk

Memory issues are chip related, there is not a lot the board can do to counter AMDs Ryzen memory controller.

People seem to have issues with the MSI board and whilst I have heard a few people switch I haven't heard that they have got significantly better stability out of memory or overclocks with the change to another board or I might have switched myself. board seems good to me, it has been rock solid.

Only issue I have now is that the bclk overclocking is dropping PCIe from 3 to 2, again though with this controller all on chip, it's probably not a board issue.

I could get a couple of 100 Mhz out of RAM with a faster bus but in real terms it won't make the greatest deal and I certainly won't accept a PCIe bandwidth drop for it when running NVMe in Raid0, its just my efforts to get every last drop out of the system.









If I was to wind back in time armed with my current boards knowledge would I buy it again, probably not, that is not too damn the board, just the Taichi and Zenith seem to be much quicker with the updates, and I have had to watch on jealously as I wait for MSI to catch up







Still its a fine board and they get there eventually.


----------



## The L33t

And you have one great benefit of going MSI on TR4, you have a garanteed LOTES socket.

At least you won't find much issues related to installation.... One less problem. And this problem has many correlations,some have had issues they are directly relatable to the installation and cpu seating.... Instability, memory detection and all sorts of issues.

The feedback on he MSI board for TR4 is actually quite good because of this too. The BIOS issues are being addressed in a steady manner it seems.

I don't know about other platforms or board, but the carbon seems like a good solid option.


----------



## Aenra

This reminds me of the recent "the Zenith 399 isn't bad.. you're just not an enthusiast" quote.

I wonder why 

Anyway, to each their own and my sincere apologies for breaking my own rule and giving brand advice. No one to blame, lol


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NuffC3d*
> 
> Hi guys, I'm currently putting together a part list for a computer I'm making to run some high peformance poker software called PioSolver and I'm going with the Threadripper 1950x as my processor but I've been reading a lot of negative things about memory issues with motherboards. I was told that the MSI - X399 GAMING PRO CARBON AC ATX TR4 Motherboard memory issues were fixed, is this corrrect? Also, would y'all select the MSI motherboard over the ASRock - Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming ATX TR4 Motherboard?
> I will link my parts list below so you can see what I have selected and what motherboard would be best and which motherboards are currently working with the threadripper.
> 
> Parts List: https://pcpartpicker.com/user/NuffC3d/saved/


I hated my gaming pro carbon so much. Unstable, unimaginative piece of crap. I had to reset CMOS every time an OC failed.

My taichi is awesome.


----------



## 4Strings

Just finished my 1900X build in my trusty Silverstone FT02.




Ran into some issues with my Asus Prime X399-A where some of the rear USB ports weren't working. So I returned the board to Newegg and bought the same model from Micro Center. Everything work fine on the new board, but ironically the defective had a Lotes socket while the new one has a Foxconn...
While it is harder to get the screws to catch on the Foxconn socket, I didn't find that it requires _that_ much force, and personally it feels like the Foxconn holds the chip down better than the Lotes. Just my opinion though, and maybe I was just lucky and got a better than average Foxconn socket.


----------



## The L33t

The problems with the Foxcon socket are related to tolerances and that is why some find it OK while others have a really bad time. The screws being a tad shorter making it difficult to thread at first does not help.

Not all Foxcon users find it problematic, I'd say most are OK actually... since the Foxcon socket is the most used version by vendors (probably due to availability).

AMD should improve the next iteration of this socket making a new revision to the mount system while maintaining compatibility. Lots of negative feedback on this platform is directly related to this.


----------



## 4Strings

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The L33t*
> 
> The problems with the Foxcon socket are related to tolerances and that is why some find it OK while others have a really bad time. The screws being a tad shorter making it difficult to thread at first does not help.
> 
> Not all Foxcon users find it problematic, I'd say most are OK actually... since the Foxcon socket is the most used version by vendors (probably due to availability).
> 
> AMD should improve the next iteration of this socket making a new revision to the mount system while maintaining compatibility. Lots of negative feedback on this platform is directly related to this.


It's definitely harder than the drop-and-lock of other AMD chips (and Intel chips too, I suppose).

But I think that really the only thing that needs to be changed is to require that the screws be a minimum length, no?


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4Strings*
> 
> It's definitely harder than the drop-and-lock of other AMD chips (and Intel chips too, I suppose).
> But I think that really the only thing that needs to be changed is to require that the screws be a minimum length, no?


It would definitely make it a lot easier for sure.

Personalty I'd prefer a system that would not rely on a hinge for the final step, instead the final part would be 100% free and would align in all 4 corners plus a middle point on both sides length wise. The fastening pin points would be guaranteed higher too.

But that's just me.They do have plenty of engineers


----------



## jeffdzign

Hi guys !

I cam here to take some information about Adobe experience and Theadripper ?

As i looking to build a new higt end machine for my 3D and render worloads, but i'm looking for good overall perf, mostly for the 2D part of my work (50-50%).

Unfortunetly i read some bad experience on Adobe soft frome some people, principaly on AE and Premiere but as well in Photoshop and with the Wacom tablet reaction.
I see some fix solution with the HPET but i dont know how is the real worl experience still.

So i would apriciate to have some feedback of experience with people that run a TR 1950x.

How does your days a days experience with that softwars : Photoshop, Illustrator, Corel Painter, Zbrush, C4D, After Effect, graphic tablet drivers and workflow ?

Have you hade to fix and parameter the system first to gate the full stability for all the soft and the overall performances?

I see many raw benchmark, but reading for true experience that not matching with why i expect.

Thanks!

Jeff


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Memory issues are chip related, there is not a lot the board can do to counter AMDs Ryzen memory controller.


funny. I use MSI board, can only get 2933 stable, anything higher BSOD or nopost, max speed I can POST barely at is 3200. I switch to asrock taichi, runs 3333 all day, and I can POST as high as 3600.


----------



## ssateneth

So I took (way too much) time to install Win7 on Threadripper. Man, I gotta tell you, Win7 definately lacks support, but you can make it work if you don't mind some sacrifices, though I've -just- got it working reliably enough. Maybe someone out there has more experience and knows how to fix some of the issues.

Main reason why I wanted to roll back from Win10 to Win7 is to try to get rid of the horrendous video stuttering. It's best explained by the mouse cursor freezing (and everything else onscreen) for about a second. This happened 3 times in a row on Win10 OS startup after desktop showed, and happens 1 time when opening certain programs (Windows photo viewer as an example), and video playback stutters often too, a small fraction of a second a few times a minute. Sound never drops out, it's just video that acts up.

Well, Win7... My first issue I came across was you cannot boot Win7 in EFI mode at all. Even when patching in the efi boot file to the installation media (grab \windows\boot\efi\bootmgfw.efi on an installed win7 and slap it to \efi\boot\bootx64.efi to the installation media), the UEFI sees it, but attempting to boot from it says The boot selection failed because a required device is inaccessible (This is not something the UEFI says, but the EFI bootloader from the install media). Doing a regular boot works though. Of course this is with secure boot disabled (Secure boot is incompatible with Win7 IIRC), and I had to enable CSM.

The other issue is PCI.SYS Stop code D1 BSOD's. Even with AMD PCI drivers installed/slipstreamed, I get these BSODs. (fun fact, AMD PCI driver is just a null driver anyways). I was only able to get around the random, but often, BSOD's by setting PCI-E speeds from Auto to Gen2, so theres a speed hit there.

The OS startup speed is pretty slow too, slower than my X99 platform that's gone now. It sits at a part of the startup sequence for a good 30 seconds before the windows logo animates and shows up (before the switching to logon/desktop screen)

And the whole stutter thing? It's not fixed either







. The 3-stutter doesn't always happen on startup now, but if it doesn't, it does happen when I open a photo, or some other program (related to 3d acceleration?). Video playback stuttering isn't fixed either. Video playback stuttering had to do with subtitles. Bad program coding.

Does anyone else have this stuttering issue? Any ideas to fix it? I'm close to jumping ship to intel; this stuttering thing is REALLY bothering me.

ATX 24pin and 8pin and 4pin CPU power plugs are plugged. Power supply is a seasonic 1250w so it's not power related.


----------



## sandysuk

Never had a stutter with win10, do you have the stutter when the system is freshly installed, pre drivers, what type of video are you watching for it too happen? I'm certainly fine with youtube and Netflix, I shouldn't have to dissimilar a system really.

does it happen in both memory modes


----------



## Hurtman

Guys, at somebody it turned out to receive stability on higher frequencies (3466,3600) with a set of G.Skill Flare X 3200 cl14 (4x8)?
My system 1950x ROG Zenith Extreme


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sandysuk*
> 
> Never had a stutter with win10, do you have the stutter when the system is freshly installed, pre drivers, what type of video are you watching for it too happen? I'm certainly fine with youtube and Netflix, I shouldn't have to dissimilar a system really.
> 
> does it happen in both memory modes


The video stuttering had to do with subtitles and has been remedied. Still, the desktop stutters are annoying on their own. Happens with OC settings w/ local mode, and stock settings w/ distributed mode. It's likely something starting and asking for acceleration but it takes time for acceleration to start (yo, we heard you wanted to go fast, so slow down)

Hurtman, not sure what you're asking. Ryzen memory speeds aren't as capable as intel. 3200 is about average speeds you can get. Anything higher requires silicon lottery luck and a lot of work tweaking to get stable.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jeffdzign*
> 
> Hi guys !
> 
> I cam here to take some information about Adobe experience and Theadripper ?
> 
> As i looking to build a new higt end machine for my 3D and render worloads, but i'm looking for good overall perf, mostly for the 2D part of my work (50-50%).
> 
> Unfortunetly i read some bad experience on Adobe soft frome some people, principaly on AE and Premiere but as well in Photoshop and with the Wacom tablet reaction.
> I see some fix solution with the HPET but i dont know how is the real worl experience still.
> 
> So i would apriciate to have some feedback of experience with people that run a TR 1950x.
> 
> How does your days a days experience with that softwars : Photoshop, Illustrator, Corel Painter, Zbrush, C4D, After Effect, graphic tablet drivers and workflow ?
> 
> Have you hade to fix and parameter the system first to gate the full stability for all the soft and the overall performances?
> 
> I see many raw benchmark, but reading for true experience that not matching with why i expect.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Jeff


I got a 1950X Oced to 3.9 using Zenstates and 32GB ram running at 2933 with a Wacom Intous 4.

My experiences so far..

Photoshop, DXoptics and Vegas are incredibly fluid and fast. Specially VEGAS.
But there seems to be some issues with the Wacom driver on my 1950X and drawing programs.
There is some stuttering(Ie the wacom stutters that happens every 15 seconds or so. the thing like freezes for half a second but enough to disrupt your drawing process). I do not know if its because of Wacom, the 1950X or because I was watching a movie with hardware acceleration (DXVO)

Also the difference with HPET on and HPET off is NIGHT AND DAY.
With HPET on, your computer will be extremely laggy, like you were mining or running full benches on all cores.
turn HPET off and the responsiveness of Windows turns back to what it should be.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Photoshop, DXoptics and Vegas are incredibly fluid and fast. Specially VEGAS.
> But there seems to be some issues with the Wacom driver on my 1950X and drawing programs.
> There is some stuttering(Ie the wacom stutters that happens every 15 seconds or so. the thing like freezes for half a second but enough to disrupt your drawing process). I do not know if its because of Wacom, the 1950X or because I was watching a movie with hardware acceleration (DXVO)


Darn, that is not good to hear. I was planning to try my Wacom out on my TR system. Wonder if that behavior will still show up considering I am running a Linux OS?


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> Darn, that is not good to hear. I was planning to try my Wacom out on my TR system. Wonder if that behavior will still show up considering I am running a Linux OS?


Cant say honestly.. but remember that Wacom drivers have a looong history of bugging heavily by themselves.
When it was doing the stuttering, I rebooted and the problem was solved.. then the other time my wacom drivers were not loaded and my table was not fully detected (even if it worked like it was a touch device, rebooting solved the issue).. stuff like that.

And then my Wacom is old (Wacom Intous 4 classic).

You might get better service if you have newer tablets for sure
Because I had some similar issues with some driver sets with my old intel machine.
.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Cant say honestly.. but remember that Wacom drivers have a looong history of bugging heavily by themselves.
> When it was doing the stuttering, I rebooted and the problem was solved.. then the other time my wacom drivers were not loaded and my table was not fully detected (even if it worked like it was a touch device, rebooting solved the issue).. stuff like that.
> 
> And then my Wacom is old (Wacom Intous 4 classic).
> 
> You might get better service if you have newer tablets for sure
> Because I had some similar issues with some driver sets with my old intel machine.
> .






I would suggest checking the usb ports what it is plugged into and the drivers used they can definitely get twitchy especially if the allow windows toi urn off device setting is on.
also which port you use some react better to input devices that others.


----------



## Undermoose

My water cooled rig is starting to take shape. Waiting on delivery of the 2 Vega64 EK water blocks for the final build and leak testing.

Gigabyte Auros X399 Gaming 7
Threadripper 1950x
CPU block: Watercool Heatkiller IV Plexi/Nickel
Dual Gigabyte Vega64
GPU block: EK Plexi/Nickel
Radiator Hardwarelabs Black Ice Nemesis GTR 560
EK SBay 5.25 dual DDC pump/reservoir & EK fittings
Soft tubing: Primochill Crystal Clear
Mayhen UV Blue coolant
Spinning disks, SSD, & NVMe
Case: Thermaltake W100
PSU: Corsair AX1500i
Memory: G.Skill AMD DDR4-3200

11 EK Vardar EVO ER 140mm fans 500-2000rpm with auto stop. There are 6 intake fans and 5 exhaust fans, the goal being positive pressure event if the fans all run slow. The power draw is approx. .35A per fan, so amazingly there are enough headers to let the motherboard control the fans using a Y splitter per header.
CPU & CPU Opt (4 radiator fans), Sys Fan 1 (rear fan), Sys Fan 2 & 3 (4 side fans), Sys Fan 4 (2 front fans), Sys Fan 5 & 6 Pump (dual DDC pumps).

Here's the present state of the build. I'll follow up once it's complete You can see the mounted radiator, CPU block, reservoir, and fittings if you look close.

Lots more to do, it's a big project and only doing soft tubing! This is my first custom water cooled rig. The GPU water blocks should arrive this Friday.


----------



## Aenra

Am a big fan of Gigabyte mobos myself; where appliccable, they are my first and only choice. But for this socket? You want to OC a Threadripper and go pick the one mobo that lacks external bclk clock? Why...?

(on a semi-serious note, minus 9000 rep for owning that Caselabs rip off, lol.. its price may be sweat compared to the real thing, but each piece purchased is one less source of income for a small family business. Not good)

But personal views aside, hope you enjoy your new setup


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Am a big fan of Gigabyte mobos myself; where appliccable, they are my first and only choice. But for this socket? You want to OC a Threadripper and go pick the _one_ mobo that lacks external bclk clock? Why...?
> 
> (on a semi-serious note, minus 9000 rep for owning that Caselabs rip off, lol.. its price may be sweat compared to the real thing, but each piece purchased is one less source of income for a small family business. Not good)
> 
> But personal views aside, hope you enjoy your new setup


Air cooling came before the water cooling idea







, but I'm using it to mine Monero, not OC specifically.

Gigabyte has a lot of fan headers and nice NVMe heat shields. When the next gen motherboards come out I'll consider replacing the motherboard and finishing the loop.

I bought the case before I knew about the Thermalfake issue, and got a sweet deal for $146 plus tax brand new. That said, external looks are one thing, this case is far from a Case Labs in fit & finish. Can't compare the two, and anyone who looks past the lipstick knows that. I'm a fan of steel cases though and like this case.

As for each piece purchased taking from Caselabs, nope, had I not found this case cheap I'd have bought the Corsair 900D. Caselabs are nice, but too pricey.


----------



## Dominican

How hot is 1950X at 4.0 ghz to 4.5 ???????


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dominican*
> 
> How hot is 1950X at 4.0 ghz to 4.5 ???????


You'll want a 360 or 480MM radiator on a custom loop to get it to it's fullest potential. At that point, somewhere beween 55-70C under a torture test.

4.5ghz is going to require LN2 or phase change. There are stability issues over 4.1-4.2.


----------



## Hurtman

3.95 LinX Passed ok,4.0 not passed ((


----------



## 4Strings

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> So I took (way too much) time to install Win7 on Threadripper. Man, I gotta tell you, Win7 definately lacks support, but you can make it work if you don't mind some sacrifices, though I've -just- got it working reliably enough. Maybe someone out there has more experience and knows how to fix some of the issues.
> 
> Main reason why I wanted to roll back from Win10 to Win7 is to try to get rid of the horrendous video stuttering. It's best explained by the mouse cursor freezing (and everything else onscreen) for about a second. This happened 3 times in a row on Win10 OS startup after desktop showed, and happens 1 time when opening certain programs (Windows photo viewer as an example), and video playback stutters often too, a small fraction of a second a few times a minute. Sound never drops out, it's just video that acts up.
> 
> Well, Win7... My first issue I came across was you cannot boot Win7 in EFI mode at all. Even when patching in the efi boot file to the installation media (grab \windows\boot\efi\bootmgfw.efi on an installed win7 and slap it to \efi\boot\bootx64.efi to the installation media), the UEFI sees it, but attempting to boot from it says The boot selection failed because a required device is inaccessible (This is not something the UEFI says, but the EFI bootloader from the install media). Doing a regular boot works though. Of course this is with secure boot disabled (Secure boot is incompatible with Win7 IIRC), and I had to enable CSM.
> 
> The other issue is PCI.SYS Stop code D1 BSOD's. Even with AMD PCI drivers installed/slipstreamed, I get these BSODs. (fun fact, AMD PCI driver is just a null driver anyways). I was only able to get around the random, but often, BSOD's by setting PCI-E speeds from Auto to Gen2, so theres a speed hit there.
> 
> The OS startup speed is pretty slow too, slower than my X99 platform that's gone now. It sits at a part of the startup sequence for a good 30 seconds before the windows logo animates and shows up (before the switching to logon/desktop screen)
> 
> And the whole stutter thing? It's not fixed either
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . The 3-stutter doesn't always happen on startup now, but if it doesn't, it does happen when I open a photo, or some other program (related to 3d acceleration?). Video playback stuttering isn't fixed either. Video playback stuttering had to do with subtitles. Bad program coding.
> 
> Does anyone else have this stuttering issue? Any ideas to fix it? I'm close to jumping ship to intel; this stuttering thing is REALLY bothering me.
> 
> ATX 24pin and 8pin and 4pin CPU power plugs are plugged. Power supply is a seasonic 1250w so it's not power related.


I think the slow boot times might be hard-coded into the CPU by AMD and are not caused by any one motherboard manufacturer or some other hardware incompatibility.

My system takes about 31 seconds in the BIOS (30.7 on last boot according to Task Manager) before the Windows boot logo starts (1900X, Prime X399-A, Win10Pro), even with post time set to 0 sec. in the BIOS. That's compared to ~9 seconds on my old FX8350/C5FZ build.

I haven't done any research into the matter as it doesn't bother me too much (though it is a bit annoying), but since you're seeing similarly slow boot times I'm thinking it might be chip-related and not board/memory/storage-related.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4Strings*
> 
> I think the slow boot times might be hard-coded into the CPU by AMD and are not caused by any one motherboard manufacturer or some other hardware incompatibility.
> 
> My system takes about 31 seconds in the BIOS (30.7 on last boot according to Task Manager) before the Windows boot logo starts (1900X, Prime X399-A, Win10Pro), even with post time set to 0 sec. in the BIOS. That's compared to ~9 seconds on my old FX8350/C5FZ build.
> 
> I haven't done any research into the matter as it doesn't bother me _too_ much (though it is a bit annoying), but since you're seeing similarly slow boot times I'm thinking it might be chip-related and not board/memory/storage-related.


my bios startup takes only 16.6 from last restart.

I am not sure why you guys have this high startup. maybe you use the internal lan and internal sound card and also usb devices like hdd connected? I am using only usb sound card the gsx 1000 and solarflare pcie x4 networkcard I also have pcie asus strix dlx raid for my 5.1. also using secure boot with guard boot disabled, this thing screws everything even remote control like teamviewer and mstsc. maybe you have csm enabled and you use Raid setting in bios and not ahci?


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Cant say honestly.. but remember that Wacom drivers have a looong history of bugging heavily by themselves.
> When it was doing the stuttering, I rebooted and the problem was solved.. then the other time my wacom drivers were not loaded and my table was not fully detected (even if it worked like it was a touch device, rebooting solved the issue).. stuff like that.
> 
> And then my Wacom is old (Wacom Intous 4 classic).
> 
> You might get better service if you have newer tablets for sure
> Because I had some similar issues with some driver sets with my old intel machine.
> .


I have a newer one of the smaller Wacom tablets and a big Wacom Cintiq (no room to setup that one atm). I probably give the small one a go this weekend and see how things go for it.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dominican*
> 
> How hot is 1950X at 4.0 ghz to 4.5 ???????


As others said, you wont get to 4.5 Ghz unless you use crazy voltages and proper heavy cooling.

4.1 at 1.35V gets me to 78C and higher at 100% prime on Noctua 14 TR air cooler with room temps of 25Celsius.

ID say anything past 4.1 requires more than air cooling.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> I have a newer one of the smaller Wacom tablets and a big Wacom Cintiq (no room to setup that one atm). I probably give the small one a go this weekend and see how things go for it.


Lots of luck!
On my side..

I haven't had issues today. So yeah, Drvers.. meh..


----------



## x7007

Do you guys enable amd cpu ftpm ? do we need it if we don't use bitlocker and such ?

Do we need to install the AMD PSP 3.0 Driver ? because AMD let you disable this in bios with the newest AGESA update.

Because I'm not sure if it causing some DPC Latency jumps , I didn't have it enabled before and the DPC was fine.

That using Windows 10 .


----------



## sandysuk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> The video stuttering had to do with subtitles and has been remedied. Still, the desktop stutters are annoying on their own. Happens with OC settings w/ local mode, and stock settings w/ distributed mode. It's likely something starting and asking for acceleration but it takes time for acceleration to start (yo, we heard you wanted to go fast, so slow down


What steps are required to replcate a stutter, or someway of capturing it, I'll have a go, my system feels slicker than any I have built, I've been well impressed even if it is only marginally quicker than my old CPU in single thread.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> The video stuttering had to do with subtitles and has been remedied. Still, the desktop stutters are annoying on their own. Happens with OC settings w/ local mode, and stock settings w/ distributed mode. It's likely something starting and asking for acceleration but it takes time for acceleration to start (yo, we heard you wanted to go fast, so slow down)
> 
> Hurtman, not sure what you're asking. Ryzen memory speeds aren't as capable as intel. 3200 is about average speeds you can get. Anything higher requires silicon lottery luck and a lot of work tweaking to get stable.


You sure you disabled HPET in Windows?
You have to disable then remove the HPET entry in the Windows boot (msconfig) option.

I had horrible stuttering and I was as well thinking it was unstable memory and overclock.

But then completely disabled HPET and was flying again. Windows became instantly responsible.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> You sure you disabled HPET in Windows?
> You have to disable then remove the HPET entry in the Windows boot (msconfig) option.
> 
> I had horrible stuttering and I was as well thinking it was unstable memory and overclock.
> 
> But then completely disabled HPET and was flying again. Windows became instantly responsible.


I always make sure HPET is off ever since I got like 30% more fps in arma 3.


----------



## Hurtman

Tell me please what maximum safe voltage on DRAMM can be exposed (24/7)


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hurtman*
> 
> Tell me please what maximum safe voltage on DRAMM can be exposed (24/7)


For DDR4: 1.5v


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> So, I've been trying to get the chip to 4.2 GHz, but there is a hard throttle back to 550MHz when Prime95 runs. Do you guys have any idea what this could be? The only thing peculiar I noticed was that the Core VID (NOT VCore...) listings in HWInfo seem to cap at 1.4V when under load. They never go above that, and that seems to coincide with the throttling. If the CPU load backs off slightly, the voltage decreases to 1.392V and then the chip jumps back to full speed. This 'hard cap' prevents me from validating faster speeds. It seems like the chip wants more voltage, but for whatever reason it doesn't receive it. VRMs and temps are WELL within normal ranges during this time.
> 
> By the way, the Enermax 360 does a great job with 4.1GHz operation and below on my chip. Even Prime95 'small' settings push it to a max of 71 degrees under 4.1 ghz (1.35V) and 65C under 4.0 GHz (1.25V...used to be 1.2V and 63C before that last MSI bios)
> 
> EDIT: I'm wondering if it's a power delivery issue. disabling cores allows the remaining cores to move past the 1.4V and the throttling no longer occurs.


Don't know if you resolved this or not but every BIOS in any overclocking-friendly board I've seen has a setting like "CPU Power Limit" or similar. Setting this higher (whatever the maximum is) should resolve your issue and allow your CPU to hit the normal temp-limited or voltage-limited overclock speeds.


----------



## Hurtman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> For DDR4: 1.5v


I read that such a voltage for the last Intel (coffe lake) are safe
For the Ryzen/Threadripper controller also?


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> Don't know if you resolved this or not but every BIOS in any overclocking-friendly board I've seen has a setting like "CPU Power Limit" or similar. Setting this higher (whatever the maximum is) should resolve your issue and allow your CPU to hit the normal temp-limited or voltage-limited overclock speeds.


That was the first thing I tried, either the setting is broken in the board or changing it was not sufficient.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> As others said, you wont get to 4.5 Ghz unless you use crazy voltages and proper heavy cooling.
> 
> 4.1 at 1.35V gets me to 78C and higher at 100% prime on Noctua 14 TR air cooler with room temps of 25Celsius.
> 
> ID say anything past 4.1 requires more than air cooling.
> Lots of luck!
> On my side..
> 
> I haven't had issues today. So yeah, Drvers.. meh..


I can just about get into Windows @ 4.3 1.45V. I imagine you'd have to push 1.5V for it to boot into Windows...which would kill your chip pretty quick. I've had loads of luck with 4.25GHz though...despite the throttling issue mentioned earlier. Prime95 is the only thing that causes it. Cinebench doesn't throttle.

However, yes, 4.5 GHz is out of the question. If this could do 4.5 GHz it would beat out even a 5 GHz 8700k. As it is, I get amazing benchmark results @ 4.25...


----------



## Tamalero

Hey guys, I finally managed to boot at the rated speed of my Memory.. now question..

Are these speed rates and latencies ok?

It worries that I'm getting above 90ns for the memory.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Hey guys, I finally managed to boot at the rated speed of my Memory.. now question..
> 
> Are these speed rates and latencies ok?
> 
> It worries that I'm getting above 90ns for the memory.


I have like 88 ns Latency on the AIDA memory test, it's like between Xeon cpu , so I think we are good.. we can lower it but the latency is high because the Creators mode , if you change to Game mode I think it will lower a lot.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> I have like 88 ns Latency on the AIDA memory test, it's like between Xeon cpu , so I think we are good.. we can lower it but the latency is high because the Creators mode , if you change to Game mode I think it will lower a lot.


What about the write read and copy speeds? do they look ok?

Not many examples of Threadrippers, most of the AIDA64 screenshots online are of Ryzens.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> What about the write read and copy speeds? do they look ok?
> 
> Not many examples of Threadrippers, most of the AIDA64 screenshots online are of Ryzens.


Here



Overclocked to 3.7 Ghz , Gear Down Auto , Power Disabled


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> Here
> 
> 
> 
> Overclocked to 3.7 Ghz , Gear Down Auto , Power Disabled


Thanks man! appreciated!

your ram is definitively faster!

Gear down also disabled, 1T mode, power mode in auto.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> Thanks man! appreciated!
> 
> your ram is definitively faster!
> 
> Gear down also disabled, 1T mode, power mode in auto.


Did anyone after long time using Gear Down Auto/Enabled had some weird crashes ? I had one time Memory Management BSOD , and then some Computer freeze. I'm not sure it's from this, but it just started not long ago. like 2 times.

I've found you another picture to compare


----------



## Undermoose

This looks like I could put a thermal pad between my Gigabyte x399 Aorus Gaming 7 & Heatkiller IV and provide some heat transfer from the VRM to the water cooling system. I might give this a shot.



Yeah, defective bolt, replacment on its way from Watercool.de.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> Did anyone after long time using Gear Down Auto/Enabled had some weird crashes ? I had one time Memory Management BSOD , and then some Computer freeze. I'm not sure it's from this, but it just started not long ago. like 2 times.
> 
> I've found you another picture to compare


All my crashes were when trying to set CL15 (stock XMP) with and without geardown. So I dont think I've had issues with Geardown myself. (X399 Asus Prime)


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> This looks like I could put a thermal pad between my Gigabyte x399 Aorus Gaming 7 & Heatkiller IV and provide some heat transfer from the VRM to the water cooling system. I might give this a shot.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, defective bolt, replacment on its way from Watercool.de.


Man you went dual Vega?? That is a sight for sore eyes.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Man you went dual Vega?? That is a sight for sore eyes.


Hey man,

I did it to build an AMD rig, but I'd have done it anyway. Why the sarcastic emote? Heh.


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> Hey man,
> 
> I did it to build an AMD rig, but I'd have done it anyway. Why the sarcastic emote? Heh.


Because VEGA. Man why would you waste money on those hot turds? Not for gaming I assume?


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> Hey man,
> 
> I did it to build an AMD rig, but I'd have done it anyway. Why the sarcastic emote? Heh.
> 
> 
> 
> Because VEGA. Man why would you waste money on those hot turds? Not for gaming I assume?
Click to expand...

Grow up. The 56 and 64 sit comfortably in between the 1070 and 1080. You're basically saying anything less than a 1080 Ti is garbage.

Hence...grow up.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> Grow up. The 56 and 64 sit comfortably in between the 1070 and 1080. You're basically saying anything less than a 1080 Ti is garbage.
> 
> Hence...grow up.


We need amd to sell gpus and we need competition at the same time, it feels unless you have a specific need for a vega card it's hard to say yeah it's worth the cost compared to the competition. Launch prices were funny with the bundles then didn't seem to appealing either. With 1080s being the same price as vega 64 or less with the sales going on around that time. Even now I could pick up a 1080 easily for less so he has a point in why would you buy that over a 1080 at the same time we need AMD to sell gpus. Sadly AMD doesn't have the margin to drop the price like nv can.

GPU market is a pain in the butt atm on the higher end.


----------



## Aby67

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> Grow up. The 56 and 64 sit comfortably in between the 1070 and 1080. You're basically saying anything less than a 1080 Ti is garbage.
> 
> Hence...grow up.


While i support Your post 1 million percent, I think personally that all gpus in are still big pieces of garbage as 8k 144hz gaming today should have been a mainstream thing, just as 16kx16k 244hx VR

The funny thing is that by the time PCI 4 will enter the market hopefully next years there is GPU technology with memory technology that could saturate abundantly pce 5.0.
so yeah the vega stuff stacks up very sweet against Nvidia unfortunately AMD has not had decent node for so long, that we are all buying 1080tis thinking of them as a big deal while they they truly don't cost more than 10 dollars shipped to Nvidia.

PEOl do not understand that Manufacturers shrink dyes only to pack more crap to sell to us on less wafers at higher prices with pathetic performance gains year on year...we had 4 years of kepler or lets call it kepwell, so dont be surprised if you get 5 more years of Pascolta.

Buying AMD is the only reasonable choice to make Nvidia for giving less for more, unless you are a cuda addict and there no cure for that until IBM will release their first organic mainstream computer and send all of these companies to rot in hell once and for all, together with all their solder pipes and medieval silicon...

oh yeah lets also mention PCI SIG, cant wait they rot in hell as well for not having pcie 6.0 in 2018 instead of 4 that is already not enough today


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Because VEGA. Man why would you waste money on those hot turds? Not for gaming I assume?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Because VEGA. Man why would you waste money on those hot turds? Not for gaming I assume?


Monero Mining rig. Plus a single card would drive my 49" Samsung (3840x1080) monitor without breaking a sweat.

Why would I spend more $$$? I got my 2x Gigabyte Vega64 when they were on sale in October for $549 each.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> Grow up. The 56 and 64 sit comfortably in between the 1070 and 1080. You're basically saying anything less than a 1080 Ti is garbage.
> 
> Hence...grow up.


Vega are better than Nvidia for certain types of crypto mining.


----------



## xkm1948

I see. Yeah that was good pricefor Vega64 then. Current pricing? Hell no.

Mine the living **** out of those Vega man!


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> I see. Yeah that was good pricefor Vega64 then. Current pricing? Hell no.
> 
> Mine the living **** out of those Vega man!


Just put the EK water blocks on them last night


----------



## x7007

Can someone with Gigabyte x399 tell me even if you have High Precision event timer disabled in the bios in Advanced > Power menu UEFI bios . if it still be seeing in Device Manager in windows in System Devices ?


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> Can someone with Gigabyte x399 tell me even if you have High Precision event timer disabled in the bios in Advanced > Power menu UEFI bios . if it still be seeing in Device Manager in windows in System Devices ?


I have it disabled in the UEFI bios.

I see it in Windows system devices.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> I have it disabled in the UEFI bios.
> 
> I see it in Windows system devices.


Thanks! weird that it doesn't disable it..


----------



## Undermoose

It's alive!

Liquid cooled dual Vega64 & Threadripper 1950x.

EK GPU water blocks.
Watercool Heatkiller IV CPU water block.
Hardwarelabs Black Ice Nemesis 560GTR
11 EK Vardar 140 EVO ER 500-2000rpm fans.
Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7 controlling all fans on quiet mode.

Leak test was good.

Only tested for 15 minutes, Mining Monero GPUs stay mid 40's, Threadripper hit 52c.

Final coolant isn't in place yet, running pimochill sysprep for 24 hours first. Flushed radiator Xmas day with Mayhem Blitz part1.

Still missing one Heatkiller IV Watercool.de CPU bolt too, en route from Germany. I won't push it, but temps for regular use are fine with 2 diagnal bolts in place.




Idle Temps


10 minute+ stress test temps


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> It's alive!
> 
> Liquid cooled dual Vega64 & Threadripper 1950x.
> 
> EK GPU water blocks.
> Watercool Heatkiller IV CPU water block.
> Hardwarelabs Black Ice Nemesis 560GTR
> 11 EK Vardar 140 EVO ER 500-2000rpm fans.
> Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7 controlling all fans on quiet mode.
> 
> Leak test was good.
> 
> Only tested for 15 minutes, Mining Monero GPUs stay mid 40's, Threadripper hit 52c.
> 
> Final coolant isn't in place yet, running pimochill sysprep for 24 hours first. Flushed radiator Xmas day with Mayhem Blitz part1.
> 
> Still missing one Heatkiller IV Watercool.de CPU bolt too, en route from Germany. I won't push it, but temps for regular use are fine with 2 diagnal bolts in place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Idle Temps
> 
> 
> 10 minute+ stress test temps






that does look pretty is that with everything at stock?


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> that does look pretty is that with everything at stock?


I keep it blue, but the color cycle was easier to get a pic of. Mayhem UV Blue liquid tomorrow!

Yeah stock everything at present. I just finished it and haven't tweaked yet for mining crypto.

Thanks!


----------



## TrixX

Nice Undermoose, same basic config as me, though using Swiftech block and EK rads. I'm going to go Primochill Vue for the liquid when I can though. Availability is a bit low...


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TrixX*
> 
> Nice Undermoose, same basic config as me, though using Swiftech block and EK rads. I'm going to go Primochill Vue for the liquid when I can though. Availability is a bit low...


Interesting liquid. I original bought Mayhem Arora, however was warned that it's for show use only and will clog and needs flushing after 1-2 weeks. Does this fluid have similar drop out issues?


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> Interesting liquid. I original bought Mayhem Arora, however was warned that it's for show use only and will clog and needs flushing after 1-2 weeks. Does this fluid have similar drop out issues?


Check out our PrimoChill VUE Coolant Users Club


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> Interesting liquid. I original bought Mayhem Arora, however was warned that it's for show use only and will clog and needs flushing after 1-2 weeks. Does this fluid have similar drop out issues?


From what I've seen it's the opposite and doesn't leave a bad residue either. Has a tendency to clean the metal it comes into contact with too.


----------



## Undermoose

Mayhem UV Blue added & run overnight, fluid topped off today, hoses arranged for pictures and she's done! (for now).






Forgot to turn on the memory LEDs



And with White LEDs



EK SBAY dual Pump/Reservoir
EK Fittings
EK GPU Blocks
EK Vardar 140ER case fans
Watercool.de CPU block
Hardwarelabs Black Ice Nemesis 560 GTR
Primochill crystal clear tubing.

Happy New Year everyone!


----------



## ITAngel

Nice Undermoose!, Happy New Years to you too.


----------



## skline00

Thank you for the pictures Undermoose.

SOLID rig.


----------



## elkwood

Very Impressive setup !! I just picked up a 1950x to go with my 1920x that i already have.
Should have my system up by next weekend. Just waiting on a few more parts.


----------



## noanoa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> Thanks a lot for your time to check, like Tamalero suggested my issue is most likely a faulty motherboard but I like to keep my options open
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You never know if they might run into memory issues again with a new board and with my current memory so I at least can give them a suggestion. Thanks again!


Just to give an update to my reported "lag" issues I had with my 1950x and the fact that the system refused to boot in a quad channel memory config, only dual channel worked, I just received the pc back from the pc builder and it appeared the bios was corrupt, after they flashed the bios with the same latest version that was installed the system did boot in a quad channel memory config and my "lag" issue is also gone, good start of the new year


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noanoa*
> 
> Just to give an update to my reported "lag" issues I had with my 1950x and the fact that the system refused to boot in a quad channel memory config, only dual channel worked, I just received the pc back from the pc builder and it appeared the bios was corrupt, after they flashed the bios with the same latest version that was installed the system did boot in a quad channel memory config and my "lag" issue is also gone, good start of the new year


Glad you got your system working as intended!


----------



## alucardis666

Anyone rocking a 1950X beyond 4.0Ghz?


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Anyone rocking a 1950X beyond 4.0Ghz?


Plenty. I run 4.2GHz, though pulled back to 4.175GHz for heavy multithread stability.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Plenty. I run 4.2GHz, though pulled back to 4.175GHz for heavy multithread stability.


Out if curiosity, what does your 1950x score in Cinebench at 4.2 GHz?


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Anyone rocking a 1950X beyond 4.0Ghz?


I tried for testing purposes.

While it was stable for normal operations, on prime and hardcore burnings.. the temps went outside the tolerance for me (noctua air).
So went lower to 3.925Ghz at 1.2V for 24/7


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> Out if curiosity, what does your 1950x score in Cinebench at 4.2 GHz?


Depends on how well-tuned your RAM is. Should get more than 3600 @ 4.1GHz. I got 3678 @ 4.2


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Depends on how well-tuned your RAM is.


Absolutely agree.[/quote]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Should get more than 3600 @ 4.1GHz. I got 3678 @ 4.2


Nice score. Our CPUs are outputting the same work with slightly different approaches.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Anyone rocking a 1950X beyond 4.0Ghz?


Given the same cooling, memory and setup configuration, all of these chips are going to clock very similarly provided stability with all are verified in the same manner.

Some folks choose to run 3.9 to 4.0 with tighter memory, while others choose 4.1 to 4.2 with more relaxed memory. In the end, the performance output is about the same between them all once tweaked to their stable limits.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> Absolutely agree.


Nice score. Our CPUs are outputting the same work with slightly different approaches.

Given the same cooling, memory and setup configuration, all of these chips are going to clock very similarly provided stability with all are verified in the same manner.

Some folks choose to run 3.9 to 4.0 with tighter memory, while others choose 4.1 to 4.2 with more relaxed memory. In the end, the performance output is about the same between them all once tweaked to their stable limits.[/quote]

Thanks for the insight, I can hit 4.1 but 4.2 isn't worth the voltage bump for my chip. Now if only I could get my Ram to run at it's rated speed and clocks again.


----------



## Fantasy

Well this disappointing, my 1950X is no longer stable at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750v with level 4 llc. I can't even get it to be stable at 1.4v with level 8 llc. Right now I can get my cpu stable at 3.95Ghz @ 1.35v with level 4 llc. Max temps with CPU, FPU, and cache stress test with AIDA64 is 71c.

This is really disappointing.


----------



## happyluckbox

It probably wasnt
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Well this disappointing, my 1950X is no longer stable at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750v with level 4 llc. I can't even get it to be stable at 1.4v with level 8 llc. Right now I can get my cpu stable at 3.95Ghz @ 1.35v with level 4 llc. Max temps with CPU, FPU, and cache stress test with AIDA64 is 71c.
> 
> This is really disappointing.


It probably wasnt stable in the first place. Very few people here are actually stable at 4.0 ghz with a 1950x.

To actually be stable it should survive every stess test and workload imaginable for days if not weeks. That includes p95, linpack, cinebench, video rendering, hci memtest, researcg/solving apps that fully load up ram, etc.

Most people here run aida64 for an hour and think they are stable at whatever highest clock they can push, only to find out weeks or months later, random instabilities.

Push your cpu as high as you can go and actually use it for different workloads day in and night out. Then drop down by .25 or .5 ghz for buffer. Only then can you truly find your chips stable point.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> It probably wasnt
> It probably wasnt stable in the first place. Very few people here are actually stable at 4.0 ghz with a 1950x.
> 
> To actually be stable it should survive every stess test and workload imaginable for days if not weeks. That includes p95, linpack, cinebench, video rendering, hci memtest, researcg/solving apps that fully load up ram, etc.
> 
> Most people here run aida64 for an hour and think they are stable at whatever highest clock they can push, only to find out weeks or months later, random instabilities.
> 
> Push your cpu as high as you can go and actually use it for different workloads day in and night out. Then drop down by .25 or .5 ghz for buffer. Only then can you truly find your chips stable point.


Couldn't agree more. +1

While I believe that anyone's OC only needs to be as stable as that individual needs it to be, comparing OC results is useless without stressing/validating overclocks in the exact same manner. This makes it literally impossible for any legitimate comparisons of clock speeds.

Reporting high clocks means very little to me unless they tell the whole story.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> It probably wasnt
> It probably wasnt stable in the first place. Very few people here are actually stable at 4.0 ghz with a 1950x.
> 
> To actually be stable it should survive every stess test and workload imaginable for days if not weeks. That includes p95, linpack, cinebench, video rendering, hci memtest, researcg/solving apps that fully load up ram, etc.
> 
> Most people here run aida64 for an hour and think they are stable at whatever highest clock they can push, only to find out weeks or months later, random instabilities.
> 
> Push your cpu as high as you can go and actually use it for different workloads day in and night out. Then drop down by .25 or .5 ghz for buffer. Only then can you truly find your chips stable point.


You're probably right.


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fantasy*
> 
> Well this disappointing, my 1950X is no longer stable at 4.0GHz @ 1.33750v with level 4 llc. I can't even get it to be stable at 1.4v with level 8 llc. Right now I can get my cpu stable at 3.95Ghz @ 1.35v with level 4 llc. Max temps with CPU, FPU, and cache stress test with AIDA64 is 71c.
> 
> This is really disappointing.


Degradation happens. You overclock and you will definitely always degrade your processor.


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Degradation happens. You overclock and you will definitely always degrade your processor.


Was about to mention this, if it passed whatever test he put it through and it now doesn't.. no, that's not because "Aida" *, that's almost certainly because he got it degraded.

Will disagree on the 'always' part however. It's in fact very rare; barring extreme over-voltage, crap mobo or an severe case of bad luck, the chances of it occuring are very low. Albeit still there 

* I keep saying this, just because the cool kids do it, it doesn't mean so should we. Do you need, really need something like Prime? Do you even know? Because if you don't, by all means cease hammering your CPU to bits; or suggesting to others they use it for that matter. Just no need. That aside, degradation is a risk we all take when we push silicone. If the poster was unaware, not AMD's fault.


----------



## happyluckbox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Was about to mention this, if it passed whatever test he put it through and it now doesn't.. no, that's not because "Aida" *, that's almost certainly because he got it degraded.
> Will disagree on the 'always' part however. It's in fact very rare; barring extreme over-voltage, crap mobo or an severe case of bad luck, the chances of it occuring are very low. Albeit still there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * I keep saying this, just because the cool kids do it, it doesn't mean so should we. Do you _need_, really need something like Prime? Do you even know? Because if you don't, by all means cease hammering your CPU to bits; or suggesting to others they use it for that matter. Just no need. That aside, degradation is a risk we all take when we push silicone. If the poster was unaware, not AMD's fault.


Depends on your workoad. I use my threadripper 1950x for research/solving poker. It stresses it to within a few degrees of p95. So p95 has been a good stability test for my needs. Even p95, however, wasn't able to fully detect instabilities that my solving software did.

At the end of the day, I prefer my entire system, with all 16 cores and 128gb of ram I run to be 100% stable because I purchased a threadripper 1950x for solving poker. Others prefer having a 4.1ghz+ 1950x that is only stable in cinebench for a few runs. Which basically means they aren't fully 16 core max ram stable, but probably stable enough for gaming.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Was about to mention this, if it passed whatever test he put it through and it now doesn't.. no, that's not because "Aida" *, that's almost certainly because he got it degraded.
> Will disagree on the 'always' part however. It's in fact very rare; barring extreme over-voltage, crap mobo or an severe case of bad luck, the chances of it occuring are very low. Albeit still there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * I keep saying this, just because the cool kids do it, it doesn't mean so should we. Do you _need_, really need something like Prime? Do you even know? Because if you don't, by all means cease hammering your CPU to bits; or suggesting to others they use it for that matter. Just no need. That aside, degradation is a risk we all take when we push silicone. If the poster was unaware, not AMD's fault.


I suppose motherboard quality will have a huge impact in this case.
The whole LOTES vs FOXCONN could lead to small short circuits and other issues.
Also pin quality.

I remember linus had his 1920X connectors start to turn brown or darker but his 1950X and 1900X were fine.

Never knew what difference was, other than he tested them in different mobos and had each cpu more on a specified mobo than the rest (aka final build).


----------



## Aenra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *happyluckbox*
> 
> Depends on your workoad


Precisely, hence my saying easy on the commenting (each case is individual) and easy on the suggestions. For most people frequenting this forum, something like full AVX torture on Prime is absolutely needless. For a select few it may obviously be a necessity, but shallow-natured "lol, AIDA" generalisations are, well, uninformed shall we say? 

Basic human trait (unfortunately far as i'm concerned).. they see someone else doing it, they go do it as well. Because they saw someone else doing it.

@Tamalero to be frank, within the context of motherboards (not generally speaking, about mobos specifically), the whole 'pin quality' concept is a myth. Ignore marketing/hype-induced terminology.

As to the socket variation, a bit of research goes a long way. Most cases this actually was an issue, all it would have taken to ameliorate the chances of something going awry was a bit of manual screwing by the customer prior to chip insertion. Hardly Einstein levels now is it.

When i said mobo, i meant in terms of regulation. That's what matters, that's what you cannot fix.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> @Tamalero
> all it would have taken to ameliorate the chances of something going awry was a bit of manual screwing by the customer prior to chip insertion. Hardly Einstein levels now is it.


Disagree, as Jay 2 cents did show, in some cases not even full force with a screw could make the damn socket settle in. And you could damage your board and CPU trying that much force.

Still, there must be something going on to make the connectors of the back of the TR chips to turn brown. I dont think they spontaneously can turn brown for nothing.


----------



## Aenra

To get back on topic, @Fantasy if you have indeed degraded your CPU, you shouldn't be increasing your voltage, you're only gonna make it worse and exponentially so.

You mentioned an original voltage of 1.33750v, fail and then a consequent bump up to 1.35v with an even higher LLC. Do *not* increase your voltage in these situations. Lower it down (by a lot, there's no good number anyone can give you in such a scenario) and see what your highest frequency can be.

* i'd start by keeping it at a 1.3v, but even that is too close to your original 1.33, so.. i know it's bad, but when it happens, be informed it only deteriorates from there. At faster rates too. Could be months or weeks, chance is it's gonna need lowering yet again. Push it less now, have it last longer.

(sorry to be the one to pass the bad news btw, but i hadn't seen your voltages the first time i replied)


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> Was about to mention this, if it passed whatever test he put it through and it now doesn't.. no, that's not because "Aida" *, *that's almost certainly because he got it degraded.*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> To get back to topic, @Fantasy
> if you have indeed degraded your CPU, you shouldn't be increasing your voltage, you're only gonna make it worse and exponentially so.
> You mentioned an original voltage of 1.33750v, fail and then a consequent bump up to 1.35v with an even higher LLC. Do *not* increase your voltage in these situations. Lower it down (by a lot, there's no good number anyone can give you in such a scenario) and see what your highest frequency can be.


I think there are lot more questions to be asked about his verification of stability before we assume that his chip has suddenly degraded. Conditions then versus conditions now.

Other operating conditions may have contributed to a change in OC stability and to simply assume that his chip degraded is a mistake. Better to peel the onion before jumping the gun.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> I think there are lot more questions to be asked about his verification of stability before we assume that his chip has suddenly degraded. Conditions then versus conditions now.
> 
> Other operating conditions may have contributed to a change in OC stability and to simply assume that his chip degraded is a mistake. Better to peel the onion before jumping the gun.


I agree!.

IMHO.. considering the numerous reports of changing something as basic like the Bios.. has huge impact in overclocking ceiling.

I seen a lot of people saying that the latest version of AGESA/BIOS combinations also reduces their OC ceiling, and made their then tested OCs fail with the new versions. Even after putting higher voltages.


----------



## Aenra

My initial post was in reply to Fantasy's problem, which having once had it myself, sucks. Money out the window. If some third party got offended for interjecting with random info.. i'll live with that.

* saw your edit 

Like i said, it looks like it, but who knows; he should lower his voltages anyway, because if it is, he's killing it as we speak by having raised them further. Again though, you are correct, may simply be something else.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> To get back on topic, @Fantasy
> if you have indeed degraded your CPU, you shouldn't be increasing your voltage, you're only gonna make it worse and exponentially so.
> You mentioned an original voltage of 1.33750v, fail and then a consequent bump up to 1.35v with an even higher LLC. Do *not* increase your voltage in these situations. Lower it down (by a lot, there's no good number anyone can give you in such a scenario) and see what your highest frequency can be.
> 
> * i'd start by keeping it at a 1.3v, but even that is too close to your original 1.33, so.. i know it's bad, but when it happens, be informed it only deteriorates from there. At faster rates too. Could be months or weeks, chance is it's gonna need lowering yet again. Push it less now, have it last longer.
> (sorry to be the one to pass the bad news btw, but i hadn't seen your voltages the first time i replied)


I don't think I degraded my CPU. I think my PC wasn't stable in the first place. Usually, when I overclock my system, I like to do that over the span of a year. I know that sounds insane. A full year of overclocking!

I don't like to run prime or AIDIA64 stress tests. What I usually do is try and find the highest clock with the voltage I'm comfortable with and do ten runs of Cinebench. If that is stable then that is a good first step. Next I use my PC for the next month or so. If I notice any problems like apps crashing I will adjust my frequency or voltage accordingly. It's true that if I run AIDIA64 or prime for 8+ hours I can get my PC stable in less than a week, but I really hate making my CPU go through that.

As of right now, I ran AIDIA64 for 10 mintues and my PC passed. That is good enough and from the looks of it my system is pretty much stable in my eyes.

Most of my work deals with compiling code and rendering things.That will use all my 16 cores to 100% usage for 2 - 5 min. So in an 8 hour work day, my CPU is almost always at 100% for around 3 - 4 hours. If I notice any weird behaviors or any crashes I will report back.

Right now I'm running my 1950X @ 3.95GHz @ 1.35v with level 4 LLC with 1.2v SOC @ Level 3 LLC.
My 64GB ram is running at 3200MHz @ 1.45v @ CL16-16-16-30-50-2T.

I'm running the latest BIOS as or writing this, it is 0902.

I absoutly love my 1950X I was just hoping to hit 4.0GHz. I guess that isn't going to happen with a voltage I'm comfortable with.


----------



## Aenra

Don't think it's crazy, no; a bit.. unorthodox perhaps, but it's your system, so your rules


----------



## Medusa666

I just got my 1950X a few days ago, and I'm using the Enermax 240 TR4 AIO to cool it togheter with 2x Noctua NF-F12 fans on it. I'm seeing temps as high as 71c on stock while gaming, is this normal? What would be considered maximum temps in HWmonitor and CoreTemp?

The case have extremely restricted airflow and above the radiator is bottom mounted as exhaust, with a RX Vega 64 aftermarket cooler blowing out hot air inside the case above it, so that contributes to the high temps, but is 71c safe for 1950X?

If needed I can go and buy higher RPM fans for the radiator.

Thankful for any replies.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> I just got my 1950X a few days ago, and I'm using the Enermax 240 TR4 AIO to cool it togheter with 2x Noctua NF-F12 fans on it. I'm seeing temps as high as 71c on stock while gaming, is this normal? What would be considered maximum temps in HWmonitor and CoreTemp?
> 
> The case have extremely restricted airflow and above the radiator is bottom mounted as exhaust, with a RX Vega 64 aftermarket cooler blowing out hot air inside the case above it, so that contributes to the high temps, but is 71c safe for 1950X?
> 
> If needed I can go and buy higher RPM fans for the radiator.
> 
> Thankful for any replies.


71c Tdie temp or Tctl?

If that's Tdie, it's pretty high if you are stock considering you're talking about a gaming load.


----------



## Medusa666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> 71c Tdie temp or Tctl?
> 
> If that's Tdie, it's pretty high if you are stock considering you're talking about a gaming load.


I use HWmonitor, the temps for the CPU are listed as "Package (Node0)" and "Package (Node1)".

It shows the same in Ryzen Master utility.

Any ideas?



Thanks for your reply sir.


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> I just got my 1950X a few days ago, and I'm using the Enermax 240 TR4 AIO to cool it togheter with 2x Noctua NF-F12 fans on it. I'm seeing temps as high as 71c on stock while gaming, is this normal? What would be considered maximum temps in HWmonitor and CoreTemp?
> 
> The case have extremely restricted airflow and above the radiator is bottom mounted as exhaust, with a RX Vega 64 aftermarket cooler blowing out hot air inside the case above it, so that contributes to the high temps, but is 71c safe for 1950X?
> 
> If needed I can go and buy higher RPM fans for the radiator.
> 
> Thankful for any replies.


In a normal situation, with a good case with good airflow, no that is not normal. In your situation it likely is normal.

A 240 radiator (especially an AIO radiator) is weak for Threadripper anyway (yes the Liqtech has a good block for TR4, but it's still weak). With your restricted airflow and blowing warm air through the radiator, the situation is worse.

Better fans will help, but you really need to find a way to get cooler air through the radiator. Reversing the fans to suck cool outside air into the case would be a good start. You would need to find another way to exhaust the warm air out of the case.


----------



## Medusa666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> In a normal situation, with a good case with good airflow, no that is not normal. In your situation it likely is normal.
> 
> A 240 radiator (especially an AIO radiator) is weak for Threadripper anyway (yes the Liqtech has a good block for TR4, but it's still weak). With your restricted airflow and blowing warm air through the radiator, the situation is worse.
> 
> Better fans will help, but you really need to find a way to get cooler air through the radiator. Reversing the fans to suck cool outside air into the case would be a good start. You would need to find another way to exhaust the warm air out of the case.


I can place a fan in front of the case, blowing fresh air in a tunnel between the radiator fans and the GPU fans, I could also do as you suggest and reverse the fans instead, so they suck air in, but I can't place them in the bottom, the radiator has to be attached to the bottom and the fans on top of the rad, so I wonder how effective it will be.

I'l post some pictures of the build, here you go, I got the Enermax 240 TR4 radiator bottom mounted with 2x Noctua NF-F-12 fans, max RPM is 1400 for them. In the front I got an Enermax SP fan maximum RPM 2300, and that blows air in between the GPU and the rad-fans. The GPU is an RX Vega 64 Nitro+ downvolted, but the GPU reached 65-74c during load.

The fans on the rad is pushing air out of the chassi ATM, as stated before. Clearance between case and desk is minimal.


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> I can place a fan in front of the case, blowing fresh air in a tunnel between the radiator fans and the GPU fans, I could also do as you suggest and reverse the fans instead, so they suck air in, but I can't place them in the bottom, the radiator has to be attached to the bottom and the fans on top of the rad, so I wonder how effective it will be.
> 
> I'l post some pictures of the build, here you go, I got the Enermax 240 TR4 radiator bottom mounted with 2x Noctua NF-F-12 fans, max RPM is 1400 for them. In the front I got an Enermax SP fan maximum RPM 2300, and that blows air in between the GPU and the rad-fans. The GPU is an RX Vega 64 Nitro+ downvolted, but the GPU reached 65-74c during load.
> 
> The fans on the rad is pushing air out of the chassi ATM, as stated before. Clearance between case and desk is minimal.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


For most fans, there is almost no difference between push and pull. Not sure if there is a difference with the Noctuas. Might as well test it and see.

Your GPU fans and AIO fans are working against each other right now, both trying to get air from the same place. Reversing the AIO fans should help this by blowing air into the GPU fans, reducing both CPU and GPU temps.

Might have to put the case on a couple of books or something, to get more airflow with the reversed fans.


----------



## Medusa666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> For most fans, there is almost no difference between push and pull. Not sure if there is a difference with the Noctuas. Might as well test it and see.
> 
> Your GPU fans and AIO fans are working against each other right now, both trying to get air from the same place. Reversing the AIO fans should help this by blowing air into the GPU fans, reducing both CPU and GPU temps.
> 
> Might have to put the case on a couple of books or something, to get more airflow with the reversed fans.


I have ordered 3x Noctua Industrial PPC 120mm 3000RPM, two for the radiator and one for the front, hopefully this togheter with reversing radiator fans will make a huge difference.

Is there any limit on the 1950X temp anyway, is 71c "dangerous"?

Thanks for your feedback.


----------



## elkwood

Hi this is a pic of my 1920x using Hwinfo64. If u notice u have 2 different temps listed. The first is Tctl
and the second being tdie. TCTL is just tdie +27c which is done that way to scare the hell out of
folks







... ok not just for aggressive fan curves.

If the temps u are reporting are the tctl then u are fine. If its the TDIE u are very high. I believe
that ryzen master shows the tdie temps. If i where u i get Hwinfo64 and run it. Gives a much better
picture of what is going on with your system.


----------



## Tamalero

Just FYI guys.. New bios update for Asus Prime X399 is now available in ASUS's website.

https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/PRIME-X399-A/HelpDesk_BIOS/


----------



## Medusa666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elkwood*
> 
> 
> 
> Hi this is a pic of my 1920x using Hwinfo64. If u notice u have 2 different temps listed. The first is Tctl
> and the second being tdie. TCTL is just tdie +27c which is done that way to scare the hell out of
> folks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... ok not just for aggressive fan curves.
> 
> If the temps u are reporting are the tctl then u are fine. If its the TDIE u are very high. I believe
> that ryzen master shows the tdie temps. If i where u i get Hwinfo64 and run it. Gives a much better
> picture of what is going on with your system.


I really appreciate that you posted this screenshot and gave me the name of the program, I have downloaded and installed it and I find it superior to HWmonitor, thank you!

Furthermore I did what you guys suggested earlier and I reversed the flow of the radiator fans, my temps are now normal and during a gaming session equal to the ones who earlier gave me 70-71c, I now got a maximum of 49c for the Tdie CPU temp, so everything is perfect, I even added a dust filter in the bottom of the chassi.

I did not need the Noctua Industrial PPC fans, so I removed my order for them, the Enermax cooler stock fans are great and pretty silent.

All in all I'm really happy, thanks for the help!


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> I really appreciate that you posted this screenshot and gave me the name of the program, I have downloaded and installed it and I find it superior to HWmonitor, thank you!
> 
> Furthermore I did what you guys suggested earlier and I reversed the flow of the radiator fans, my temps are now normal and during a gaming session equal to the ones who earlier gave me 70-71c, I now got a maximum of 49c for the Tdie CPU temp, so everything is perfect, I even added a dust filter in the bottom of the chassi.
> 
> I did not need the Noctua Industrial PPC fans, so I removed my order for them, the Enermax cooler stock fans are great and pretty silent.
> 
> All in all I'm really happy, thanks for the help!


There is always the possibility that not even the industrial fans would have helped.
Radiators have a limit on how much heat they can "transfer". And most AIO have very cheap radiators.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> There is always the possibility that not even the industrial fans would have helped.
> Radiators have a limit on how much heat they can "transfer". And most AIO have very cheap radiators.


I only seen AIOs useful on GPUs. CPUs, not so much.


----------



## crion

Hi, Did anyone get 8x8GB DIMM running higher than 2933MHz?

I run at cas14 atm but cas12 was fully bootable but not tested fully for stability yet.

But RAM speed seems kind of stuck @2933MHz with 8 single rank DIMMs?
Now ofcourse I can venture into lower timings and all but what is your expierence


----------



## xkm1948

Alright so the build is happening. It would be a dedicated Threadripper build for a collarbrator's lab. The machine will be located inside a molecular genetics lab.

Here is the final build list, most parts will be sourced from Micro center.

CPU: 1950X
Cooler: Enermax TR4 280 OR Noctua U14S
MoBo: Asrock X399 Taichi
RAM:Corsair Vengeance LPX 64GB 2666
Storage: Crucial MX500 2TB
GPU: EVGA 1030
Case: Generic ATX case
PSU: Seasonic Focus 750Watt

Does this config looks OK? Would Taichi X399 be able to handle at least 4*16GB RAM? This system will not be overclocked at all.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Alright so the build is happening. It would be a dedicated Threadripper build for a collarbrator's lab. The machine will be located inside a molecular genetics lab.
> 
> Here is the final build list, most parts will be sourced from Micro center.
> 
> CPU: 1950X
> Cooler: Enermax TR4 280 OR Noctua U14S
> MoBo: Asrock X399 Taichi
> RAM:Corsair Vengeance LPX 64GB 2666
> Storage: Crucial MX500 2TB
> GPU: EVGA 1030
> Case: Generic ATX case
> PSU: Seasonic Focus 750Watt
> 
> Does this config looks OK? Would Taichi X399 be able to handle at least 4*16GB RAM? This system will not be overclocked at all.


I'm not a fan of that corsair ram, though if you're not going for any oc 2666 is okay. What type of work is this? ECC RAM might be good, or it might be unnecessary.


----------



## Undermoose

I'd lean towards a platinum kit, but have found GSkill's configurator to be spot on with kit compatibility. Can always return ram to Microcenter though, and have used Vengeance ram. Corsair RGB for x399 have been working well in my friend's x399 Gigabyte Designare. I think you can get 2933mhz kits up to 128gb, but since you're getting 16gb memory I am thinking that might be your game plan. I'd definitely use GSkill's configurator go 128gb compatibilty if so.


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Undermoose*
> 
> I'd lean towards a platinum kit, but have found GSkill's configurator to be spot on with kit compatibility. Can always return ram to Microcenter though, and have used Vengeance ram. Corsair RGB for x399 have been working well in my friend's x399 Gigabyte Designare. I think you can get 2933mhz kits up to 128gb, but since you're getting 16gb memory I am thinking that might be your game plan. I'd definitely use GSkill's configurator go 128gb compatibilty if so.


We are going for 64GB (16GB *4) simply due to the insane pricing of DRAM right now. Also we will be shopping for everything at Micro center so hopefully they will have more options there.

So X399 Taichi is pretty good I assume? What do I need to watch out for in terms of flashing BIOS? Does the X399 have flashback support like the X99?


----------



## Dotachin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> We are going for 64GB (16GB *4) simply due to the insane pricing of DRAM right now. Also we will be shopping for everything at Micro center so hopefully they will have more options there.
> 
> So X399 Taichi is pretty good I assume? What do I need to watch out for in terms of flashing BIOS? Does the X399 have flashback support like the X99?


Last time I checked Micro Center didn't have many ram kit options.

Taichi is good, and it does support flashback.


----------



## Undermoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> We are going for 64GB (16GB *4) simply due to the insane pricing of DRAM right now. Also we will be shopping for everything at Micro center so hopefully they will have more options there.
> 
> So X399 Taichi is pretty good I assume? What do I need to watch out for in terms of flashing BIOS? Does the X399 have flashback support like the X99?


I'd still suggest you use the GSkill configurator and review what's on their compatibility list. I've tried many x399 kits on an x399 motherboard's QVL that simply do not work, yet every kit on GSkill's compatibility list did.

Buy it wherever you want. You have been warned.


----------



## Undermoose

I think Microcenter is the best place to put your $$$ into a system, if they have what you need.


----------



## theafrosamurai

Hi, I was reading through a few posts of the last few pages. I'm thinking of making a threadripper upgrade but the problem is I have 32 gb of Corsair 3200mhz Led ram already in my current system. I hear good things about the Taichi board but my ram isn't on their QVL list. Will it even boot up? At what speed will I have to run at if I get the Taichi board or am I better off trying to sell the ram and buy something compatible?


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theafrosamurai*
> 
> Hi, I was reading through a few posts of the last few pages. I'm thinking of making a threadripper upgrade but the problem is I have 32 gb of Corsair 3200mhz Led ram already in my current system. I hear good things about the Taichi board but my ram isn't on their QVL list. Will it even boot up? At what speed will I have to run at if I get the Taichi board or am I better off trying to sell the ram and buy something compatible?


I run Corsair 32gig memory at that speed on my board.

I am personally not familiar with the Taichi board though.


----------



## theafrosamurai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> I run Corsair 32gig memory at that speed on my board.
> 
> I am personally not familiar with the Taichi board though.


When I was at my local Micro Center we found my ram to be compatible with the MSI board but I don't know much about it, do you like it?


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theafrosamurai*
> 
> When I was at my local Micro Center we found my ram to be compatible with the MSI board but I don't know much about it, do you like it?


I dont personally get too hung up on mobos honestly and never have, I have always considered it to be an auxiliary component. Though I will say I have never had a problem with this board, the only negative I have experienced is that I dont personally care for their software suite.


----------



## Medusa666

Is Meltdown and Spectre affecting Threadripper in any significant way? Can we expect performance loss?

Anyone know?


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Is Meltdown and Spectre affecting Threadripper in any significant way? Can we expect performance loss?
> 
> Anyone know?


Meltdown *is not applicable* on the Zen architecture.

Spectre variant 1 is, while variant 2 is not demonstrated for now but probably also applicable.

No significant performance loss will be had from patching Spectre (SO) already being distributed.

Microcode fixing is only being tested and distributed now but not expected to be significant. Needs testing...

The performance loss (on Intel side) is really due to Meltdown stuff, again, not applicable to AMD.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> We are going for 64GB (16GB *4) simply due to the insane pricing of DRAM right now. Also we will be shopping for everything at Micro center so hopefully they will have more options there.
> 
> So X399 Taichi is pretty good I assume? What do I need to watch out for in terms of flashing BIOS? Does the X399 have flashback support like the X99?






yes it has bios flashback port up top like the asus as for flashing throw it on a usb or even the hard drive go into the bios and flash.
before you do that though load defaults...not that that would be a huge issue its just the way I do it.
as for the taichi overall I love it to death...it has not given me any issues at all since day one.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theafrosamurai*
> 
> Hi, I was reading through a few posts of the last few pages. I'm thinking of making a threadripper upgrade but the problem is I have 32 gb of Corsair 3200mhz Led ram already in my current system. I hear good things about the Taichi board but my ram isn't on their QVL list. Will it even boot up? At what speed will I have to run at if I get the Taichi board or am I better off trying to sell the ram and buy something compatible?






I have had very little luck with corsair ram that's why I went with the 3200 flarex stuff...it simply just works and overclocks but other gskill ram works as well.

I would suggest hunting around these forums there are a few threads specifically about ram.

rule of thumb Samsung b die works e die sort of works but generally won't run the rated speed.

if you can try and grab the corsair ram that is 2400 and cas 14 that ram *may* work but you won't get any overclocking...search around here and see what everyone has and what setting they use it will save you a lot of trouble later.


----------



## Medusa666

Anyone here who uses the Enermax TR4 AIO cooler for their Threadripper?

If yes, can you tell me if I should run the pump at maximum speed constantly in BIOS, or if I should use PWM signal so that the pump speed varies?

Right now I have it set to "Full speed" 24/7.

Thankful for any insights.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Medusa666*
> 
> Anyone here who uses the Enermax TR4 AIO cooler for their Threadripper?
> 
> If yes, can you tell me if I should run the pump at maximum speed constantly in BIOS, or if I should use PWM signal so that the pump speed varies?
> 
> Right now I have it set to "Full speed" 24/7.
> 
> Thankful for any insights.


I just ordered it yesterday from amazon. can you tell me how it is compare to Corsair H115i? is it 100% better? because the corsair can't keep it as cool as I want and it's noisy on load.. and with your question use PWM. that's the best from what I read. you don't need full speed on IDLE and while you sleep..


----------



## CaliLife17

So I was going to go with x299 and an 1980XE/1960X at the end of last year, but after the X299 platform issues people are having, the poor temps on the CPU and high power draw for the 80XE/60x I decided to take a look at the 1950X and I am pretty much sold on jumping over to X399. I like also that they are going to keep using TR4, So when Threadripper 2 and X499 later this year I will plan on upgrading the CPU and maybe Motherboard.

My Current build I was thinking is:

- 1950X
- Asus Zenith Extreme
- G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB 3600mhz CAS16 [F4-3600C16Q-32GTZR] (Seems to be the only 32GB 3600mhz Samsung B-Die kits) [Cant find any non RGB versions, except for white color non RGB on newegg]

Rest I am going to port over from my 5960X build, but had a couple of questions.

1.) From my research it seems that the best CPU block so far has been the Heatkiller IV Threadripper. Looks like XSPC Raystorm Neo comes in a close second. Is there any other blocks that top these. I am planning on going with the Heatkiller IV
2.) What type of voltage is needing for people to get a 3.9-4.1ghz OC
3.) The ram in said to be for the Intel platform, and G.Skill did say they had a specific Threadripper edition coming out of that ram (just adds a X to end of model #) but they are nowhere to be seen. Checking Asus Zenith QVL and G.Skill QVL for that board it is not listed. Anyone have any luck with this ram on their Zenith Extreme?
4.) What are the chances that I can actually hit and sustain 3600mhz on the ram at 1.35V
5.) Any specific TIM shown to work better with Threadripper? I have normally used GC-Extreme on my CPUs as was just going to plan on using it again here.

Been on Intel for a long time so anything else I should know before I switch over?









EDIT: Also what TIM method have been people been using for this chip since its such a large Heatsink? Looking at some youtubes video it seems either a very large blob or the 5 dot X method seems to be the 2 that have worked best.


----------



## x7007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> So I was going to go with x299 and an 1980XE/1960X at the end of last year, but after the X299 platform issues people are having, the poor temps on the CPU and high power draw for the 80XE/60x I decided to take a look at the 1950X and I am pretty much sold on jumping over to X399. I like also that they are going to keep using TR4, So when Threadripper 2 and X499 later this year I will plan on upgrading the CPU and maybe Motherboard.
> 
> My Current build I was thinking is:
> 
> - 1950X
> - Asus Zenith Extreme
> - G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB 3600mhz CAS16 [F4-3600C16Q-32GTZR] (Seems to be the only 32GB 3600mhz Samsung B-Die kits) [Cant find any non RGB versions, except for white color non RGB on newegg]
> 
> Rest I am going to port over from my 5960X build, but had a couple of questions.
> 
> 1.) From my research it seems that the best CPU block so far has been the Heatkiller IV Threadripper. Looks like XSPC Raystorm Neo comes in a close second. Is there any other blocks that top these. I am planning on going with the Heatkiller IV
> 2.) What type of voltage is needing for people to get a 3.9-4.1ghz OC
> 3.) The ram in said to be for the Intel platform, and G.Skill did say they had a specific Threadripper edition coming out of that ram (just adds a X to end of model #) but they are nowhere to be seen. Checking Asus Zenith QVL and G.Skill QVL for that board it is not listed. Anyone have any luck with this ram on their Zenith Extreme?
> 4.) What are the chances that I can actually hit and sustain 3600mhz on the ram at 1.35V
> 5.) Any specific TIM shown to work better with Threadripper? I have normally used GC-Extreme on my CPUs as was just going to plan on using it again here.
> 
> Been on Intel for a long time so anything else I should know before I switch over?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Also what TIM method have been people been using for this chip since its such a large Heatsink? Looking at some youtubes video it seems either a very large blob or the 5 dot X method seems to be the 2 that have worked best.


too bad this heatsink is only for custom water cooling.

also wanted to know which is the best TIM to use and also the best way. noctua tim is good enough? aratic 5 and aratic mx 2 and 4?


----------



## Medusa666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> I just ordered it yesterday from amazon. can you tell me how it is compare to Corsair H115i? is it 100% better? because the corsair can't keep it as cool as I want and it's noisy on load.. and with your question use PWM. that's the best from what I read. you don't need full speed on IDLE and while you sleep..


No idea how it compares to the Corsair ,but it keeps my 1950X very cool, maximum of 56c in a small case : )

One thing bothers me though, the maximum RPM it reaches in BIOS with full speed is only 2750 RPM, but the pump is rated for 3000 RPM, is it faulty? Anyone know?

Would be great if someone else could check what RPM they get on their Enermax TR4 pumps.

Edit; I found the spec sheet for the pump, it clearly says RPM can be 3000 +-10%, that means that 2750 is within the spec range.


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> 1.) From my research it seems that the best CPU block so far has been the Heatkiller IV Threadripper. Looks like XSPC Raystorm Neo comes in a close second. Is there any other blocks that top these. I am planning on going with the Heatkiller IV
> 5.) Any specific TIM shown to work better with Threadripper? I have normally used GC-Extreme on my CPUs as was just going to plan on using it again here.
> 
> EDIT: Also what TIM method have been people been using for this chip since its such a large Heatsink? Looking at some youtubes video it seems either a very large blob or the 5 dot X method seems to be the 2 that have worked best.


1. You've seen reviews that I haven't been able to find then. HardOCP hasn't done their Heatkiller IV TR4 review, and the Raystorm Neo TR4 is their best-ranking TR block. Got links to the Heatkiller reviews?
5. Use whatever TIM you normally use.

HardOCP found the best method was putting a thin layer over the entire IHS and then putting five dots on top of that. That's what I would use.


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x7007*
> 
> I just ordered it yesterday from amazon. can you tell me how it is compare to Corsair H115i? is it 100% better? because the corsair can't keep it as cool as I want and it's noisy on load.. and with your question use PWM. that's the best from what I read. you don't need full speed on IDLE and while you sleep..


The Enermax TR4 AIO cooler supposed to be way better than the Corsair H115i because it has a much bigger surface on the block and is a 360mm rad design just for TR4.


----------



## CaliLife17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> 1. You've seen reviews that I haven't been able to find then. HardOCP hasn't done their Heatkiller IV TR4 review, and the Raystorm Neo TR4 is their best-ranking TR block. Got links to the Heatkiller reviews?
> 5. Use whatever TIM you normally use.
> 
> HardOCP found the best method was putting a thin layer over the entire IHS and then putting five dots on top of that. That's what I would use.


On the official heatkiller club thread here on overclock.net, there were a couple of people that tested it end of last year I think it was who had an XSPC block. It wasn't anything officially done, and I haven't seen anything from media on reviews.


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> So I was going to go with x299 and an 1980XE/1960X at the end of last year, but after the X299 platform issues people are having, the poor temps on the CPU and high power draw for the 80XE/60x I decided to take a look at the 1950X and I am pretty much sold on jumping over to X399. I like also that they are going to keep using TR4, So when Threadripper 2 and X499 later this year I will plan on upgrading the CPU and maybe Motherboard.
> 
> My Current build I was thinking is:
> 
> - 1950X
> - Asus Zenith Extreme
> - G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB 3600mhz CAS16 [F4-3600C16Q-32GTZR] (Seems to be the only 32GB 3600mhz Samsung B-Die kits) [Cant find any non RGB versions, except for white color non RGB on newegg]
> 
> Rest I am going to port over from my 5960X build, but had a couple of questions.
> 
> 1.) From my research it seems that the best CPU block so far has been the Heatkiller IV Threadripper. Looks like XSPC Raystorm Neo comes in a close second. Is there any other blocks that top these. I am planning on going with the Heatkiller IV
> 2.) What type of voltage is needing for people to get a 3.9-4.1ghz OC
> 3.) The ram in said to be for the Intel platform, and G.Skill did say they had a specific Threadripper edition coming out of that ram (just adds a X to end of model #) but they are nowhere to be seen. Checking Asus Zenith QVL and G.Skill QVL for that board it is not listed. Anyone have any luck with this ram on their Zenith Extreme?
> 4.) What are the chances that I can actually hit and sustain 3600mhz on the ram at 1.35V
> 5.) Any specific TIM shown to work better with Threadripper? I have normally used GC-Extreme on my CPUs as was just going to plan on using it again here.
> 
> Been on Intel for a long time so anything else I should know before I switch over?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Also what TIM method have been people been using for this chip since its such a large Heatsink? Looking at some youtubes video it seems either a very large blob or the 5 dot X method seems to be the 2 that have worked best.


1. Block choices are on the money.
2. I use ~1.3V for 3.9GHz, due to having bought EK block at launch (







) I have not ventured past 3.9GHz







.
3. Thoughts on QVL in this post. Flare X vs other G.Skill see this post. F4-3600C16Q-32GTZR would be made up of F4-3600C16-8GTZR (ref this thread), which would be single sided, single rank, Samsung B die, which Ryzen/ThreadRipper luvs.
4. IMO slim if stability tested thoroughly.
5. AS5 here, spread by plastic card.


----------



## elkwood

I have both blocks the xspc and the heatkiller. The heatkiller is currently installed on a 1920x running 4.175g and it working very well.

The xspc is currently on my 1950x at 3.90g its hard to compare the systems in temps since the 1950x is a fresh build with a 420/480 rad supporting 3 1080ti's. Where as the 1920x has a 420/280 rad setup with 2 1080 ti in the loop and its been churning along for a bit. I got all the air worked out of the loop.

The 1950x is a new build less then a wk old and the loop still got air in it.

I am using prolima pk-1 for my paste. The biggest thing for me with the tr4 is getting a good mate between HS and ISH . I had issues with the Heatkiller the first few times i stuck it on the chip. Most of that i put down to the really cold ambient temp in the room at the time. The last time i stuck the paste on i heated it up before applying

Don't think u can go wrong with either blks. Ill be very interested to see how the Heatkiller does when Klye finally gets one to test.


----------



## CaliLife17

Well Ordered the Heatkillker IV today so we will see how it goes. Have plenty of rad space to cool TR so anxious to see temps. Now just have to wait for it to get all the way over to California

What are peoples opinion on the Asus Zenith Extreme vs the Asrock Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming? I have always had Asus Extreme Intel boards, so was naturally planning on just going Asus for TR, but have read some people saying Asrock board performance wise might be ahead of Zenith. Seems the Zenith though is the only one with active cooling on the VRM heat pipe section, so that could help the Asus board.

Also, is it worth it to water cool the VRM's for X399? It seems not too many people have but also there isn't a lot of options yet out for that (Watercool has a VRM block for the Zenith).


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> So I was going to go with x299 and an 1980XE/1960X at the end of last year, but after the X299 platform issues people are having, the poor temps on the CPU and high power draw for the 80XE/60x I decided to take a look at the 1950X and I am pretty much sold on jumping over to X399. I like also that they are going to keep using TR4, So when Threadripper 2 and X499 later this year I will plan on upgrading the CPU and maybe Motherboard.
> 
> My Current build I was thinking is:
> 
> - 1950X
> - Asus Zenith Extreme
> - G.Skill Trident Z RGB 32GB 3600mhz CAS16 [F4-3600C16Q-32GTZR] (Seems to be the only 32GB 3600mhz Samsung B-Die kits) [Cant find any non RGB versions, except for white color non RGB on newegg]
> 
> Rest I am going to port over from my 5960X build, but had a couple of questions.
> 
> 1.) From my research it seems that the best CPU block so far has been the Heatkiller IV Threadripper. Looks like XSPC Raystorm Neo comes in a close second. Is there any other blocks that top these. I am planning on going with the Heatkiller IV
> 2.) What type of voltage is needing for people to get a 3.9-4.1ghz OC
> 3.) The ram in said to be for the Intel platform, and G.Skill did say they had a specific Threadripper edition coming out of that ram (just adds a X to end of model #) but they are nowhere to be seen. Checking Asus Zenith QVL and G.Skill QVL for that board it is not listed. Anyone have any luck with this ram on their Zenith Extreme?
> 4.) What are the chances that I can actually hit and sustain 3600mhz on the ram at 1.35V
> 5.) Any specific TIM shown to work better with Threadripper? I have normally used GC-Extreme on my CPUs as was just going to plan on using it again here.
> 
> Been on Intel for a long time so anything else I should know before I switch over?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Also what TIM method have been people been using for this chip since its such a large Heatsink? Looking at some youtubes video it seems either a very large blob or the 5 dot X method seems to be the 2 that have worked best.






here is my little write up
http://www.bluetarot.com/hardware/hdwrerev/cpurev/amd-threadripper-1950x-review/

currently I have it in a x71 case and it is quitter and cooler and a lot neater









I have for the cpu 1 420 ek ce rad and 3 2k Vardar fans spinning at around 1200 they ramp to 1500 when it hits 70

if you look in the Thermaltake post there are some before and after results.

I use 1.3 v llc on a taichi for 4.05 stable and 3333 on the ram gskill flare x if you have the chance and it is not to dear it is very good ram for these and ryzens.

idle with an ambient of 23 is now 27 degrees and load under 68 degrees depending on the load when it gets hot here though like 35 ambient those temps do get close or over 70.
this is also with a xspc block and a fast ek pump.

as for applying the tim I did the spread and dot method as well but with grizzly kryonaut (not the easiest thing to do







)

but so far regardless of the temps here and it has been hitting 44 degrees Celsius I have not had to drop my clocks.


----------



## trnewb

I wonder how
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> 
> here is my little write up
> http://www.bluetarot.com/hardware/hdwrerev/cpurev/amd-threadripper-1950x-review/
> 
> currently I have it in a x71 case and it is quitter and cooler and a lot neater
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have for the cpu 1 420 ek ce rad and 3 2k Vardar fans spinning at around 1200 they ramp to 1500 when it hits 70
> 
> if you look in the Thermaltake post there are some before and after results.
> 
> I use 1.3 v llc on a taichi for 4.05 stable and 3333 on the ram gskill flare x if you have the chance and it is not to dear it is very good ram for these and ryzens.
> 
> idle with an ambient of 23 is now 27 degrees and load under 68 degrees depending on the load when it gets hot here though like 35 ambient those temps do get close or over 70.
> this is also with a xspc block and a fast ek pump.
> 
> as for applying the tim I did the spread and dot method as well but with grizzly kryonaut (not the easiest thing to do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> but so far regardless of the temps here and it has been hitting 44 degrees Celsius I have not had to drop my clocks.


What are your typical water temperature deltas while idle/under load?


----------



## Heidi

I just snapped...bought me 1950x and Asrock Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming...delivery next Tuesday...


----------



## ITAngel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> I just snapped...bought me 1950x and Asrock Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming...delivery next Tuesday...


Congrats!

I have the 1920X with the Asrock Fatal1ty X399 and love the combo works greta.


----------



## Heidi

Very interested in some hints and practices about this board...seems like kind of underdog, taking into account underlying technology shall be one of a kind, but obviously that Fatal1ty is sort of bad symbol that Asrock shall be abandoning it altogether...
So, basically, which BIOS shall be my prime focus on...and, of course, cooling...I ma looking forward the only readily available air, Noctua NH-U14....AIO isn't high on my priority list at this moment, since I do not have really great experience with majority of them not to mention that many different brands passed my hands...


----------



## OrionBG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> Well Ordered the Heatkillker IV today so we will see how it goes. Have plenty of rad space to cool TR so anxious to see temps. Now just have to wait for it to get all the way over to California
> 
> What are peoples opinion on the Asus Zenith Extreme vs the Asrock Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming? I have always had Asus Extreme Intel boards, so was naturally planning on just going Asus for TR, but have read some people saying Asrock board performance wise might be ahead of Zenith. Seems the Zenith though is the only one with active cooling on the VRM heat pipe section, so that could help the Asus board.
> 
> Also, is it worth it to water cool the VRM's for X399? It seems not too many people have but also there isn't a lot of options yet out for that (Watercool has a VRM block for the Zenith).


Initially I was looking at the ASUS board too but I found out the hard way that almost all the new ASUS boards are having the same issue so I purchased the Asrock Taichi.
The ASUS boards (and not only they) are using a ITE IO chip that has a fault. the reported voltages are all off, different RAM modules are receiving different voltages and there are issues with the Fan control. I've read cases of water pumps being turned off by the boards at will and you find out when the system shuts off due to overheating. ASUS knows about it but they can't/won't do anything as it is a hardware issue and not fixable by bios. You can go and check the Crosshair 6 Hero X370 thread here on the forums and you will see how "loved" that board is (the ASUS X399 lineup is using the same ITE chip)... The Asrock and MSI boards are mostly using Nuvoton IO chips so they are ok...


----------



## crion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heidi*
> 
> Very interested in some hints and practices about this board...seems like kind of underdog, taking into account underlying technology shall be one of a kind, but obviously that Fatal1ty is sort of bad symbol that Asrock shall be abandoning it altogether...
> So, basically, which BIOS shall be my prime focus on...and, of course, cooling...I ma looking forward the only readily available air, Noctua NH-U14....AIO isn't high on my priority list at this moment, since I do not have really great experience with majority of them not to mention that many different brands passed my hands...


I run the Noctua U14S on Fatal1ty X399 board.
It's very nice and stable. I do use conductonaut though. I do run 8 sticks of b-die single rank RAM so not venturing above 2933MHz. Will get the timings down eventually, cas14 works splendid, will check out the stability of cas12 next (boots up atleast)


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OrionBG*
> 
> Initially I was looking at the ASUS board too but I found out the hard way that almost all the new ASUS boards are having the same issue so I purchased the Asrock Taichi.
> The ASUS boards (and not only they) are using a ITE IO chip that has a fault. the reported voltages are all off, different RAM modules are receiving different voltages and there are issues with the Fan control. I've read cases of water pumps being turned off by the boards at will and you find out when the system shuts off due to overheating. ASUS knows about it but they can't/won't do anything as it is a hardware issue and not fixable by bios. You can go and check the Crosshair 6 Hero X370 thread here on the forums and you will see how "loved" that board is (the ASUS X399 lineup is using the same ITE chip)... The Asrock and MSI boards are mostly using Nuvoton IO chips so they are ok...


I have the C6H and the ZE and I do "love" them







.

On C6H very early on ~Mar 17 I experienced fan issue as HWiNFO access method to SuperIO Chip needed changing, after that plain sailing. I do a lot of hours of usage.

The ZE I have had since launch, 2-3 times I have had PWM crap out. Out of those times twice or so I induced it by running AIDA64, it's access method to monitoring causes the issue AFAIK. For the past month or so my rig has had very little down time. This is past 24hrs+ worth of logs (I'd sort by timestamp to see better "picture"), no issue on this front.


----------



## OrionBG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> I have the C6H and the ZE and I do "love" them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> On C6H very early on ~Mar 17 I experienced fan issue as HWiNFO access method to SuperIO Chip needed changing, after that plain sailing. I do a lot of hours of usage.
> 
> The ZE I have had since launch, 2-3 times I have had PWM crap out. Out of those times twice or so I induced it by running AIDA64, it's access method to monitoring causes the issue AFAIK. For the past month or so my rig has had very little down time. This is past 24hrs+ worth of logs (I'd sort by timestamp to see better "picture"), no issue on this front.


Oh well, there should be some people that don't have issues. I just don't want to risk it again with ASUS.
My point of view is the the following: In my eyes, the Crosshair 6 Hero was the best overclocking board for X370. The best of the best even. Or at least I thought so and it was advertised as such.
The reality unfortunately is quite different. Super IO chip does not report the real temps (need an offset that is different by board), The Fan control has issues, the different RAM slots get different voltages (some times exceeding safe values),
I believe that such issues/instabilities or whatever they are, shouldn't be present in "the best Ryzen motherboard" especially with ASUS'es history of the ROG line.
Yes, Ryzen is a new platform but still none of the mentioned issues have anything to do with the platform.
So I am not going to trust ASUS again soon. The ZE has the same Super IO chip and the same people that have designed the C6H have designed the ZE.

Once again this is only my view on the matter. Everybody is free to chose, like, dislike whatever they want.

Oh and the Asrock x399 Taichi is with a LOTES socket







(at least the one I've purchased)

One last thought on the matter: When deciding that component to purchase, don't look only the reviews! Check the forums. "The truth is out there..."


----------



## gupsterg

Many do not understand at all what was going on with C6H. I had 3x R7 1700 which had no offset and 2x R7 1800X which have offset, as per *AMD*.

Initially ASUS used a setting in UEFI to manipulate tCTL, this was to make it seem realistic to X CPU owners. Later this was stopped. The SuperIO chip read tCTL and showed it as CPU temperature as well in HWINFO. This did for some early UEFIs have again odd behaviour on X CPU, but solved in later.

On the C6H there was only 1x DRAM voltage shown for all slots in monitoring. I recall *no one* actually measuring DRAM voltage with a DMM at phases. So I do not know where you have come across this notion that RAM slots were getting incorrect voltages.

This is a R7 1700, on a UEFI ~3mths in after launch, ~11hrs usage, do you see an issue in monitoring?



This is a R7 1800X, ~4mths in after launch, ~7hrs usage.



Now DRAM was 1.375V in UEFI why is min and max off? please read section *Super IO Chip (ITE IT8665E) voltage read back granularity on C6H* in OP here. Now you see the *average* figure in HWINFO for DRAM that matches perfectly with what was set in UEFI. Temps people could have early on opted to use sense mi skew off (again is a section in OP), many X CPU owners didn't seem to want to do this, dunno why, I know I did use it with it off.

*You could only tell people so many times what to do*, many just looked at SW monitoring and were not aware of granularity, etc. Only a day or so ago I was explaining to a member how to use monitoring better, link.

The same granularity exists on *ASUS ZE*, so both reported DRAM voltages, for a small swing, just be adjusting by larger 21.8mV. Then I would not be surprised if HWINFO does do some rounding of figures, which could make it seem more out to a user.



I use C6H to control all my fans and am on air cooling. I use ZE to control all fans/pump based on loop temp. Both cases I OC/setup things via UEFI. As stated C6H only early on had issue for me and updates by Mumak/Elmor solved. ZE has only had 2-3 times issue with PWM in several months of use and lot's of hours back to back. Some of my testing of profiles can be over the course of 2days+.


----------



## OrionBG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> Many do not understand at all what was going on with C6H. I had 3x R7 1700 which had no offset and 2x R7 1800X which have offset, as per *AMD*.
> 
> Initially ASUS used a setting in UEFI to manipulate tCTL, this was to make it seem realistic to X CPU owners. Later this was stopped. The SuperIO chip read tCTL and showed it as CPU temperature as well in HWINFO. This did for some early UEFIs have again odd behaviour on X CPU, but solved in later.
> 
> On the C6H there was only 1x DRAM voltage shown for all slots in monitoring. I recall *no one* actually measuring DRAM voltage with a DMM at phases. So I do not know where you have come across this notion that RAM slots were getting incorrect voltages.
> 
> This is a R7 1700, on a UEFI ~3mths in after launch, ~11hrs usage, do you see an issue in monitoring?
> 
> 
> 
> This is a R7 1800X, ~4mths in after launch, ~7hrs usage.
> 
> 
> 
> Now DRAM was 1.375V in UEFI why is min and max off? please read section *Super IO Chip (ITE IT8665E) voltage read back granularity on C6H* in OP here. Now you see the *average* figure in HWINFO for DRAM that matches perfectly with what was set in UEFI. Temps people could have early on opted to use sense mi skew off (again is a section in OP), many X CPU owners didn't seem to want to do this, dunno why, I know I did use it with it off.
> 
> *You could only tell people so many times what to do*, many just looked at SW monitoring and were not aware of granularity, etc. Only a day or so ago I was explaining to a member how to use monitoring better, link.
> 
> The same granularity exists on *ASUS ZE*, so both reported DRAM voltages, for a small swing, just be adjusting by larger 21.8mV. Then I would not be surprised if HWINFO does do some rounding of figures, which could make it seem more out to a user.
> 
> 
> 
> I use C6H to control all my fans and am on air cooling. I use ZE to control all fans/pump based on loop temp. Both cases I OC/setup things via UEFI. As stated C6H only early on had issue for me and updates by Mumak/Elmor solved. ZE has only had 2-3 times issue with PWM in several months of use and lot's of hours back to back. Some of my testing of profiles can be over the course of 2days+.


I'm not talking about the temperature offset at at all! It is known that the X CPUs have offset. Mine was not an X (1700) the problem is completely different!
Regarding the DRAM voltages, read the thread again! There was a person that did measure everything.
But again, I'm not trying to convince anybody. I just shared my experience, my findings and my thoughts on the matter.


----------



## gupsterg

Please in C6H thread post link to information on this DRAM voltage difference between slots, so we don't derail this thread







. I shall have search in C6H thread, but as am glued to that thread from launch, I do not recall this and have not experienced this on mine.

Please read above I had R7 1700 and R7 1800X, more than one and used on various UEFIs on same board. I have plenty of screenies/logs besides info posted above. I shall not reply concerning C6H here, so please post in other thread







.


----------



## OrionBG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gupsterg*
> 
> Please in C6H thread post link to information on this DRAM voltage difference between slots, so we don't derail this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I shall have search in C6H thread, but as am glued to that thread from launch, I do not recall this and have not experienced this on mine.
> 
> Please read above I had R7 1700 and R7 1800X, more than one and used on various UEFIs on same board. I have plenty of screenies/logs besides info posted above. I shall not reply concerning C6H here, so please post in other thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Oh, don't worry, I also don't want to dwell on old things. I have a new system to build with my 1950X and the Taichi so no more C6H for me. I'm freeeee


----------



## betam4x

I'm looking into getting rid of my MSI board. I will probably ebay it. What I want to know is this:

1) On your boards, can you push your chip to 4.2 GHz (1.4275V for me, though I haven't tweaked LLC yet) and run Prime95 without your board throttling.
2) For the extreme overclockers, have you been able to push your chip to 1.55V without issues with the board not being able to handle it? (mine shuts down when the chip requests that much voltage)
3) Any boards on the latest Threadripper AGESA yet? (1.0.0.5 I believe?)
4) Is your board receiving frequent BIOS updates/good support?

I REALLY wanted to wait for the Threadripper refresh, but I've been dying to benchmark at 4.45 GHz... At the very least I'd like to run 4.2 stable. I thought the MSI boards were supposed to have the best VRMs, but this sounds like an issue elsewhere. I don't think it's my power supply, it's 850 watts, because even with 100% load at 4.1 GHz the PC is pulling around 500 watts from the wall, and that's including 2 25" IPS monitors and a cable modem/router along with a charging macbook and some other misc gadgets.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> I'm looking into getting rid of my MSI board. I will probably ebay it. What I want to know is this:
> 
> 1) On your boards, can you push your chip to 4.2 GHz (1.4275V for me, though I haven't tweaked LLC yet) and run Prime95 without your board throttling.
> 2) For the extreme overclockers, have you been able to push your chip to 1.55V without issues with the board not being able to handle it? (mine shuts down when the chip requests that much voltage)
> 3) Any boards on the latest Threadripper AGESA yet? (1.0.0.5 I believe?)
> 4) Is your board receiving frequent BIOS updates/good support?
> 
> I REALLY wanted to wait for the Threadripper refresh, but I've been dying to benchmark at 4.45 GHz... At the very least I'd like to run 4.2 stable. I thought the MSI boards were supposed to have the best VRMs, but this sounds like an issue elsewhere. I don't think it's my power supply, it's 850 watts, because even with 100% load at 4.1 GHz the PC is pulling around 500 watts from the wall, and that's including 2 25" IPS monitors and a cable modem/router along with a charging macbook and some other misc gadgets.


ROFL funniest tr post I've read to date. Please show me a ss of someone running 4.2 on regular cooling or watercooling. 4.0 is pretty much the max for everyone with the minor expcetion of a few unless your on ln2 buddy. Also, that's a lot of voltage your pumping into your cpu.


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> I'm looking into getting rid of my MSI board. I will probably ebay it. What I want to know is this:
> 
> 1) On your boards, can you push your chip to 4.2 GHz (1.4275V for me, though I haven't tweaked LLC yet) and run Prime95 without your board throttling.
> 2) For the extreme overclockers, have you been able to push your chip to 1.55V without issues with the board not being able to handle it? (mine shuts down when the chip requests that much voltage)
> 3) Any boards on the latest Threadripper AGESA yet? (1.0.0.5 I believe?)
> 4) Is your board receiving frequent BIOS updates/good support?
> 
> I REALLY wanted to wait for the Threadripper refresh, but I've been dying to benchmark at 4.45 GHz... At the very least I'd like to run 4.2 stable. I thought the MSI boards were supposed to have the best VRMs, but this sounds like an issue elsewhere. I don't think it's my power supply, it's 850 watts, because even with 100% load at 4.1 GHz the PC is pulling around 500 watts from the wall, and that's including 2 25" IPS monitors and a cable modem/router along with a charging macbook and some other misc gadgets.


To seriously attempt what you're asking, you need liquid-cooled VRM. Do you have that? You probably still won't get there, but anything near that high needs the extra cooling.

Bitspower makes a monoblock for the MSI Carbon. That would help immensely. It's what I plan on getting when I order the parts for my new system in a couple of weeks.


----------



## CaliLife17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> To seriously attempt what you're asking, you need liquid-cooled VRM. Do you have that? You probably still won't get there, but anything near that high needs the extra cooling.
> 
> Bitspower makes a monoblock for the MSI Carbon. That would help immensely. It's what I plan on getting when I order the parts for my new system in a couple of weeks.


I have been debating if I should get a Waterblock for the VRMs. At what point/OC do you think it should be needed? I am either going to get the Asus ZE or Asrock X399 Fatality. Probably won't try and push chip past 3.9-4.1 and don't plan on going crazy on Voltage.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> I have been debating if I should get a Waterblock for the VRMs. At what point/OC do you think it should be needed? I am either going to get the Asus ZE or Asrock X399 Fatality. Probably won't try and push chip past 3.9-4.1 and don't plan on going crazy on Voltage.


4.1 would be lucky. If you want to live with more a modest voltage 3.9 seems to be where your gonna be. As for the vrms unless your pulling a very heavy load constantly, as long as you have airflow over the vrm you will be fine.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> To seriously attempt what you're asking, you need liquid-cooled VRM. Do you have that? You probably still won't get there, but anything near that high needs the extra cooling.
> 
> Bitspower makes a monoblock for the MSI Carbon. That would help immensely. It's what I plan on getting when I order the parts for my new system in a couple of weeks.


That and a miracle. Actually a miracle is more likely to happen than a truly Prime95 stable 4.2 GHz with ambient cooling.

There are plenty of focused and specific ways to run Prime95 just for the sake of saying "it ran Prime95", but if one truly lets it do its thing without crippling it, 4.2 won't be Prime95 stable with or without water on the VRM.


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> I have been debating if I should get a Waterblock for the VRMs. At what point/OC do you think it should be needed? I am either going to get the Asus ZE or Asrock X399 Fatality. Probably won't try and push chip past 3.9-4.1 and don't plan on going crazy on Voltage.


I'm going with it mainly because some reviews have shown the MSI board's VRM running hotter than other boards. Even if I wasn't getting the MSI board, I would still want water-cooled VRMs because having fans pointed at the VRMs is a pain in the butt. My rad fans will be below the VRM level on a 60mm rad so they won't help.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> ROFL funniest tr post I've read to date. Please show me a ss of someone running 4.2 on regular cooling or watercooling. 4.0 is pretty much the max for everyone with the minor expcetion of a few unless your on ln2 buddy. Also, that's a lot of voltage your pumping into your cpu.


My chip does Prime95 all day at 4.1 and 1.35V. Learn about things like LLC before you go spouting off such nonsense. 4.2 SHOULD be stable and I am about to find out as I discovered why Prime 95 is throttling.

EDIT: android auto correct butchered my post.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> To seriously attempt what you're asking, you need liquid-cooled VRM. Do you have that? You probably still won't get there, but anything near that high needs the extra cooling.
> 
> Bitspower makes a monoblock for the MSI Carbon. That would help immensely. It's what I plan on getting when I order the parts for my new system in a couple of weeks.


I found what the issue is. It is apparently a BIOS bug combined with an oversight on my part. I noticed that when the VRMs hit 70C the CPU starts to throttle. MSI has 2 settings in the BIOS that control this behavior, but of course, neither of them work. I didn't notice the VRM temps because hwinfo shows 2 banks of sensors and one of them is -20 degrees. The other issue WA due to a new case, there was no airflow on the VRMs at all. I am installing 2 fans when I get home to see if that improves things.

Edit: the settings in question are a setting to expand the VRM tolerance and a setting for VRM temperature protection. This setting goes from 100 degrees to 112 degrees.


----------



## gupsterg

Spoiler: Rig










Spoiler: P95 v29.3B1 12K 12K in place, room ambient ~22C.



*CPU stock*



PState 0 OC 3.8GHz 1.256V



Stock VRM cooling, I would expect quite a bit higher than ~78°C if I was at [email protected]


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> I noticed that when the VRMs hit 70C the CPU starts to throttle.


Wow ... that's a REALLY low throttle temp. X299 VRM can typically get to 105ºC before they tell the CPU to throttle, and I figured X399 VRM would be similar.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> Edit: the settings in question are a setting to expand the VRM tolerance and a setting for VRM temperature protection. This setting goes from 100 degrees to 112 degrees.


Great. I might have to reconsider my board choice then. I was counting on settings like these to see how high an OC I could get.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *done12many2*
> 
> That and a miracle. Actually a miracle is more likely to happen than a truly Prime95 stable 4.2 GHz with ambient cooling.
> 
> There are plenty of focused and specific ways to run Prime95 just for the sake of saying "it ran Prime95", but if one truly lets it do its thing without crippling it, 4.2 won't be Prime95 stable with or without water on the VRM.


The enermax 360 is an amazing cooler. I have it in push/pull config and it hits low to mid 70s with all cores loaded 100%. I haven't been able to Prime 95 it yet due to throttling. My chip also boots at 4.3, but due to the issues mentioned I can't test for stability. It is stable at 4.3 with 12 cores though.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> The enermax 360 is an amazing cooler. I have it in push/pull config and it hits low to mid 70s with all cores loaded 100%. I haven't been able to Prime 95 it yet due to throttling. My chip also boots at 4.3, but due to the issues mentioned I can't test for stability. It is stable at 4.3 with 12 cores though.


Long story short, without having a full unthrottled clockspeed, you can only speculate to stably at 4.2.

Phantom throttling, which occurs on x299 platform can also give an impression of stability at higher clocks even though it's not really running at the desired clock. With Skylake-X, too may people thought (some still do) that they had a legit 5 GHz OC without the need for a delid due to the fact that Prime95 ran for hours on end. Unfortunately, P95 wasn't running at the clock/performance level they thought so thier claims were incorrect.

I have certain situations where I use Prime95, but other than that, it's just another tool that can give misleading results in the wrong hands.

On the Intel side of the house, folks just love to disable AVX in Prime95, but don't always mention that when they call it "P95 stable". Big difference between full P95 and what I'd call crippled P95. Either that or they run an AVX offset, but claim their non-AVX clock. Example: 5GHz with an AVX offset of 3, which would result in a 4.7GHz clockspeed under P95 with active AVX.

Funny enough, we don't have to disable AVX in Prime95 or run an offset with TR because AMD sorta did that for us with the less than stellar AVX performance of Ryzen. Less effecient AVX = less power/heat and in turn less performance.

Long story short, it's probably best to claim 4.2 "Prime95 stable" when it's actually been verified that 4.2 is Prime95 stable across all cores.


----------



## betam4x

So, after installing the fans to provide airflow over the VRMs, VRM temps are in the 40-50C range. However, the CPU is still throttling. This confirms this is NOT a cooling issue. I can back the core count down (which lowers total power output) and boot and run prime95 all day at 4.2 or 4.3 GHz (though 4.3 requires high voltages). I also don't have this issue at 4.1 GHz unless I raise the vcore If I raise the vcore for 4.1, then it starts to throttle for some unknown reason. FYI 4.1 GHz is rock solid stable at 1.325 or 1.35 with a proper LLC setting and I can run Prime95 all day. Under 4.2, I get expected benchmark results, but Prime95 causes it to throttle. This is infuriating because the chip *seams* stable, but I can't really test with Prime95 with it throttling. Cinebench doesn't throttle either. FYI I get a 3636 Cinebench score









I have OCP Expander set to enabled, VRM Temp protection set to 125 (just for troubleshooting), and another setting for EDC throttling set to reduce throttling.


----------



## betam4x

This is for the guy that told me I'd be 'lucky' to get 4.1. 4.1 GHz at 1.35







It actually gets bumped up to 1.36 due to the LLC setting. A couple months ago I ran Prime95 all weekend and didn't get a single error. The chip also can do blender renders of classroom and bmw @ 4.2. However, it throttles on Prime95...so odd...


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> This is for the guy that told me I'd be 'lucky' to get 4.1. 4.1 GHz at 1.35
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It actually gets bumped up to 1.36 due to the LLC setting. A couple months ago I ran Prime95 all weekend and didn't get a single error. The chip also can do blender renders of classroom and bmw @ 4.2. However, it throttles on Prime95...so odd...


When it throttles what is the VRM temp?


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The L33t*
> 
> When it throttles what is the VRM temp?


This last time it was 40C. It doesn't throttle the whole chip either, random cores slow down to 550, then jump back to the desired speed. I can make it happen at ANY speed just by bumping up the VCore. So if I set it to 3.8 and then raise the VCore to 1.475 it will start throttling. I've double checked all the settings to make sure that there isn't some safety feature in place. Everything is set up properly.


----------



## betam4x

In case you guys were curious, this is CPU-Z at 4.25 GHz


----------



## betam4x

Ok, one more gem then I'll stop, I promise. I am posting this from a quad core 4.4 GHz Threadripper 1950x. The voltage is obscenely high because I can't remember the actual voltage I used to boot. If I enable more than 4 cores the system shuts off when any type of load is placed on the chip. I believe it's the motherboard.

EDIT: Having those fans on the VRMs did help me in one way: I can now boot at 4.4 GHz on all 16 cores. However, the annoying throttling issue is more pronounsed due to the increased power draw.


----------



## nycgtr

Read a few more posts up if you can do 4.1 @ 1.35v prime95 all day then you have the best TR ever on this forum. With that said reality says your goals of much higher is far fetched.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Read a few more posts up if you can do 4.1 @ 1.35v prime95 all day then you have the best TR ever on this forum. With that said reality says your goals of much higher is far fetched.


Are you just here to troll this thread? I don't consider an overclock to be successful unless Prime95 can run for 24 hours without an error. I've had Threadripper since launch, and I ran it for an entire weekend the second I overclocked it to 4.1 GHz. Considering that Threadripper is VALIDATED at 4.1 GHz (since it can potentially BOOST to that clock during normal operation) there is no reason why any chip shouldn't operate at that speed to begin with unless the user does not know what they are doing.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> Are you just here to troll this thread? I don't consider an overclock to be successful unless Prime95 can run for 24 hours without an error. I've had Threadripper since launch, and I ran it for an entire weekend the second I overclocked it to 4.1 GHz. Considering that Threadripper is VALIDATED at 4.1 GHz (since it can potentially BOOST to that clock during normal operation) there is no reason why any chip shouldn't operate at that speed to begin with unless the user does not know what they are doing.


I had bought 4 1950xs on launch. I have been on this thread since day 1. If you dont realize 4.1 @ 1.35v is golden already your dreaming sky high. I can hit 4.0 stable prime 95 with 1.325v and outta the 4 chips I did have (only 2 now) that was the best one outta the bunch. Can I hit 4.1 yes but the voltage it takes is not going to help it's life span. Infact that chip that was doing 4 @ 1.325v already seems a bit more voltage now to achieve 4.0. The voltage jump of even .05mhz on ryzen/threadripper can be so high that it's just not feasible for stability. If your wondering so much about vrm cooling to improve your clocks, I do have my vms watercooled and no it does not increase my max possible overclock. However, the chip will not throttle after pro longed prime 95 as it would in a normal case with normal airflow. Why don't you go pm the guys at silicon lottery or just go check their site if you think my 4 chip sample and the average clocks shown in this thread isn't enough. I am sure they oced a lot more chips than you or me.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Your new here. I have bought 4 1950xs on launch. I have been on this thread since day 1. If you dont realize 4.1 @ 1.35v is golden already your dreaming sky high. I can hit 4.0 stable prime 95 with 1.325v and outta the 4 chips I did have (only 2 now) that was the best one outta the bunch. Can I hit 4.1 yes but the voltage it takes is not going to help it's life span. Infact that chip that was doing 4 @ 1.325v already seems a bit more voltage now to achieve 4.0. The voltage jump of even .05mhz on ryzen/threadripper can be so high that it's just not feasible for stability. If your wondering so much about vrm cooling to improve your clocks, I do have my vms watercooled and no it does not increase my max possible overclock. However, the chip will not throttle after pro longed prime 95 as it would in a normal case with normal airflow. Why don't you go pm the guys at silicon lottery or just go check their site if you think my 4 chip sample and the average clocks shown in this thread isn't enough. I am sure they oced a lot more chips than you or me.


...or maybe you are new to overclocking? Did you tweak LLC? Did you look into other factors that may be limiting your overclock? People have been able to get the 1950X to 5.2 GHz on LN2. The process itself is rated for 4.5. With XFR, the 1950x is capable of boosting to 4.2. That means AMD has deemed the CPU to be stable at 4.2. Provided your thermals are fine, your CPU will boost to 4.2 on 1-2 threaded tasks if you remove the overclock. This isn't something I'm making up, each and every single 1950x is capable of 4.2 GHz operation. I'm not making this **** up, if your CPU weren't capable of 4.1-4.2 GHz, your machine would hard lock any time it boosted to that speed. My chip isn't "golden" by any stretch of the word. This MSI board is a **** board, it has a buggy bios and other issues, but it has all the needed settings to properly overclock a chip. I've been in PC hardware for decades and I've been overclocking for an eternity. I know what I'm talking about. Oh and I'm only "new" to posting at this board, I usually only "lurk" because I'm a member of enough communities.

EDIT: If I came off rather strong, my apologies. I just take offense to the language you used in your posts. Try tweaking your LLC settings. I PROMISE you'll see better results. I had a guy who swore up and down his 1950X wouldn't do 4 GHz at under 1.325V, so I walked with him through playing with the LLC settings and we got him down to 1.2V.


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> ...or maybe you are new to overclocking? Did you tweak LLC? Did you look into other factors that may be limiting your overclock? People have been able to get the 1950X to 5.2 GHz on LN2. The process itself is rated for 4.5. With XFR, the 1950x is capable of boosting to 4.2. That means AMD has deemed the CPU to be stable at 4.2. Provided your thermals are fine, your CPU will boost to 4.2 on 1-2 threaded tasks if you remove the overclock. This isn't something I'm making up, each and every single 1950x is capable of 4.2 GHz operation. I'm not making this **** up, if your CPU weren't capable of 4.1-4.2 GHz, your machine would hard lock any time it boosted to that speed. My chip isn't "golden" by any stretch of the word. This MSI board is a **** board, it has a buggy bios and other issues, but it has all the needed settings to properly overclock a chip. I've been in PC hardware for decades and I've been overclocking for an eternity. I know what I'm talking about. Oh and I'm only "new" to posting at this board, I usually only "lurk" because I'm a member of enough communities.


Ofc I have. If you;ve been lurking for a while you would realize what I am saying. Just wait for the other responses if you don't think your doing much better than avg. 4.2 is not feasible across all cores on the majority of 1950x with ambient cooling. XFR boost is not across all cores. It's 2 cores per 8 core die.


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> ...or maybe you are new to overclocking? Did you tweak LLC? Did you look into other factors that may be limiting your overclock? People have been able to get the 1950X to 5.2 GHz on LN2. The process itself is rated for 4.5. With XFR, the 1950x is capable of boosting to 4.2. That means AMD has deemed the CPU to be stable at 4.2. Provided your thermals are fine, your CPU will boost to 4.2 on 1-2 threaded tasks if you remove the overclock. This isn't something I'm making up, each and every single 1950x is capable of 4.2 GHz operation. I'm not making this **** up, if your CPU weren't capable of 4.1-4.2 GHz, your machine would hard lock any time it boosted to that speed. My chip isn't "golden" by any stretch of the word. This MSI board is a **** board, it has a buggy bios and other issues, but it has all the needed settings to properly overclock a chip. I've been in PC hardware for decades and I've been overclocking for an eternity. I know what I'm talking about. Oh and I'm only "new" to posting at this board, I usually only "lurk" because I'm a member of enough communities.


Truthfully, you do sound as if you lack a lot of first hand experience with this stuff. I don't say that to insult you, but some of the stuff you're saying is a dead give away.

You've repeatedly mentioned LLC as if it something new. Everyone here is very aware of the value in tweaking LLC. The way in which you bring it up is odd.

Comparing LN2 performance along with any other kind of sub ambient cooling performance is useless when working with ambient cooling. New guys do that stuff. It's a very well known fact that a great deal of chips that do great on ambient, completely suck with sub ambient. That's to say a golden ambient chip in no ways guarantees a golden sub ambient chip and vice versa.

Moving on to XFR. What a chip is rated to boost to with 1 or a few cores has absolutely nothing to do with what it's capable of doing across all cores simaltaneously. All that means is that when there's enough thermal overhead, 1 or a few cores are capable of running at higher clocks. When you run all cores at the higher clocks, that thermal overhead disappears. Just because AMD says that 1 or a few cores can run up to 4.2 doesn't mean that there's any chance that you'll get them all to at the same time. Once again, new guys say this type of stuff. I used to do it myself, so I'm not hating, but merely pointed out the obvious to you.

It could also be that you're applying Intel logic to an AMD chip. With current day Intel Extreme chips, it's very common to be able to run all cores at the same speed as the max rated Turbo 3.0 speed, but that doesn't apply to Threadripper.

Bottom line is, you've done a lot of talking about 4.1 and 4.2 stable overclocks with a board that you describe as junk, but you've yet to demonstrate or show any of it. Cinebench and CPUz mean absolutely nothing to this group with regards to stability. If we were using Cinebench as some form of metric, my chip beats yours by a good bit there, but I still wouldn't call mine 4.1 to 4.2 Prime95 stable. I'm not that bold.

@nycgtr simply called bullcrap on your statement. There's nothing wrong with doing that especially when someone makes a bold claim, but spends the rest of the time tap dancing around proving it by providing irrelevant facts.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> Ok, one more gem then I'll stop, I promise. I am posting this from a quad core 4.4 GHz Threadripper 1950x. The voltage is obscenely high because I can't remember the actual voltage I used to boot. If I enable more than 4 cores the system shuts off when any type of load is placed on the chip. I believe it's the motherboard.
> 
> EDIT: Having those fans on the VRMs did help me in one way: I can now boot at 4.4 GHz on all 16 cores. However, the annoying throttling issue is more pronounsed due to the increased power draw.


Please get down from the ledge - that chip is going to die at that voltage with high LLC.

You think you did what no one else could and all it took was disabling 75 percent of the CPU and feeding it voltages that would give someone using LN2 cause for concern. LLC isn't a magic talisman - it feeds the chip even more voltage under load to counteract vdroop. It might hit 1.6 if you get really lucky.

Every multi core chip will hit higher speeds with cores disabled, and clocks are higher with memory channels disabled, yet that's not how they get used because it makes them slower.

Try 4.2 with all cores enabled and quad channel memory at 3200+, it's a much more accurate representation of whether or not you've got a golden sample.


----------



## betam4x

You fail to see the point of my post. Base/boost clocks are set by AMD based on the TDP of the chip, as is (possibly) XFR. The chips are rated by AMD at 4.2 Ghz operation, but they are not clocked at 4.2 Ghz because that would make Threadripper cross the 180 watt TDP and the chip would be more difficult to cool.

Yes, I shout LLC all the time, because it's a mistake so many people make, even experienced overclockers.

As far as Prime95, I do not feel the need to prove to anyone what my chip does or does not run at. I did not ask you for proof of any claim you made, nor did I ask for proof for any of his claims. I came here asking for help with a motherboard throttling issue and he chose to essentially call me a liar. I do not care what he or you think, I know what my chip runs at and what it's capabilities are. I also have had my hands on enough 1950X chips to know that his claims are ludicrous at best.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> You fail to see the point of my post. Base/boost clocks are set by AMD based on the TDP of the chip, as is (possibly) XFR. The chips are rated by AMD at 4.2 Ghz operation, but they are not clocked at 4.2 Ghz because that would make Threadripper cross the 180 watt TDP and the chip would be more difficult to cool.
> 
> Yes, I shout LLC all the time, because it's a mistake so many people make, even experienced overclockers.
> 
> As far as Prime95, I do not feel the need to prove to anyone what my chip does or does not run at. I did not ask you for proof of any claim you made, nor did I ask for proof for any of his claims. I came here asking for help with a motherboard throttling issue and he chose to essentially call me a liar. I do not care what he or you think, I know what my chip runs at and what it's capabilities are. I also have had my hands on enough 1950X chips to know that his claims are ludicrous at best.


I didn't ask for proof of anything, nor did I mention prime95. I never called you a liar either.

None of the TR4 CPUs are rated at 4.2ghz all core. This long after launch, it's become clear this isn't just a thermal issue. If you challenge that assertion and you want your hypothesis to be taken seriously, then you will need to provide data to explain how countless tests with empirical data are wrong.

Right now from where I'm sitting I see a lot of chest pounding and self-aggandisement.

If you've got the secret sauce then by all means share. I wouldn't mind running at 4.2+


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> I didn't ask for proof of anything, nor did I mention prime95. I never called you a liar either.
> 
> None of the TR4 CPUs are rated at 4.2ghz all core. This long after launch, it's become clear this isn't just a thermal issue. If you challenge that assertion and you want your hypothesis to be taken seriously, then you will need to provide data to explain how countless tests with empirical data are wrong.
> 
> Right now from where I'm sitting I see a lot of chest pounding and self-aggandisement.
> 
> If you've got the secret sauce then by all means share. I wouldn't mind running at 4.2+


LOL LLC wasn't pushed for that particular clock, do you think I'm nuts?









The chip won't die from short stints at 1.5V, though longer stints WILL degrade the chip (and pretty rapidly). I've had the chip at 1.625V and it does not have an issue. If it dies, meh, I'll buy another.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> LOL LLC wasn't pushed for that particular clock, do you think I'm nuts?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The chip won't die from short stints at 1.5V, though longer stints WILL degrade the chip (and pretty rapidly). I've had the chip at 1.625V and it does not have an issue. If it dies, meh, I'll buy another.


If they weren't rated for 4.2 GHz, then AMD would not allow them to do 200 MHz XFR, or they would limit the boost to 3.9 in order to prevent them from hitting 4.2 GHz. After all, if a chip is going to have problems when it hits 4.2 GHz, that means that users are going to complain.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> If they weren't rated for 4.2 GHz, then AMD would not allow them to do 200 MHz XFR, or they would limit the boost to 3.9 in order to prevent them from hitting 4.2 GHz. After all, if a chip is going to have problems when it hits 4.2 GHz, that means that users are going to complain.


4.2GHz on a single core is not the same as 4.2GHz on all cores. 1950X is not rated at 4.2GHz. if it was it would run at that frequency on all cores.

Anyway, it doesn't matter because as far as I can see you won't be convinced by anyone. So my question here is, what exactly do you want? Because arguing for argument sake is not a good use of everyone's time. I'm sure everyone would rather do something else than sit and here and argue with your point.

So I ask again, what do you want?


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> LOL LLC wasn't pushed for that particular clock, do you think I'm nuts?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The chip won't die from short stints at 1.5V, though longer stints WILL degrade the chip (and pretty rapidly). I've had the chip at 1.625V and it does not have an issue. If it dies, meh, I'll buy another.


Didn't you just invalidate your own claims here - help me understand.

If the voltage required to reach just south of 4.4 is too high to keep the chip there safely with 75 percent of the cores disabled, how is this even a valid use case?


----------



## xkm1948

Going to Micro center now to get 1950X and a X399. Have a quick question, does AsRock X399 Taichi use Foxconn socket or Lotus socket? Really don't wanna deal with the problematic Foxconn socket.


----------



## elkwood

Both my x399 asrocks tachis have had the foxconn socket. My understanding is that asrocks can have either.

The foxconn can be a pain but both of mine where doable without to much issue. I just started all three
of the screws before i fully tightened any of them.

P.s i think u can pull the flap up and see which socket u have.Its got one of the Velcro front
flaps on the box so it shows off the board if u lift it up.


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elkwood*
> 
> Both my x399 asrocks tachis have had the foxconn socket. My understanding is that asrocks can have either.
> 
> The foxconn can be a pain but both of mine where doable without to much issue. I just started all three
> of the screws before i fully tightened any of them.
> 
> P.s i think u can pull the flap up and see which socket u have.Its got one of the Velcro front
> flaps on the box so it shows off the board if u lift it up.


Awesome! What other boards would people recommend?


----------



## done12many2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Awesome! What other boards would people recommend?


Unfortunately, I can't recommend the Asus Zenith Extreme with a clean conscience. I really like the board because of all of it's features, but it does have some pretty well-known issues with simple fan control being one of them. Something so basic can be disastrous at times. Check the Asus ZE thread and you'll see what I mean. I've managed to figure out a solution to all of the issues I have, but it's not supposed to work that way. Things should just work as intended.


----------



## Particle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Going to Micro center now to get 1950X and a X399. Have a quick question, does AsRock X399 Taichi use Foxconn socket or Lotus socket? Really don't wanna deal with the problematic Foxconn socket.


That board uses a Lotes socket. (btw--not "Lotus")


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Awesome! What other boards would people recommend?


I'm going with the MSI Carbon board, mainly because it's one of the two boards that has a monoblock available (the other is the Zenith). My understanding is that MSI only uses the Lotes socket. ASRock boards can have either socket.


----------



## The L33t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Going to Micro center now to get 1950X and a X399. Have a quick question, does AsRock X399 Taichi use Foxconn socket or Lotus socket? Really don't wanna deal with the problematic Foxconn socket.


Asrock uses both. (as does ASUS)

If you really want a LOTES socket you have two options;

Buy MSI. They use LOTES exclusively.
Buy locally and request conformation of LOTES on the current stock, alternatively if some online vendors may also accept your request if you ask them to check current stock before purchase.


----------



## xkm1948

I am assuming that even Foxconn sockets are not defective, right?


----------



## gupsterg

I got Foxconn on ASUS ZE, non issue for me TBH.


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> I am assuming that even Foxconn sockets are not defective, right?


Can be more difficult to get the three screws tightened. Sometimes, excessive force is required.

Some would call that defective.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> I'm going with the MSI Carbon board, mainly because it's one of the two boards that has a monoblock available (the other is the Zenith). My understanding is that MSI only uses the Lotes socket. ASRock boards can have either socket.


While that may sound appealing to you, let me explain MSI's BIOS/UEFI release history.

1) The last release completely broke fan profiles, including the default ones...for many if not all users. It also made it so that the CMOS reset switch on the back of the board didn't reset RAM timings, so if you wanted to fix THAT you had to unplug a tiny little plug on the board (edit: that apparently goes to the battery, at least that's what it seems to be labelled as. As an added bonus the actual clear CMOS jumper didn't fix this...I don't want to know...).

2) The release before that had issues where changing options too frequency would eventually cause corruption and the settings would get reset to default or the system would fail to boot until you pushed the CMOS reset switch.

3) The release before THAT you could click things in the UI and they would update in the UI, but the settings would not actually be applied. For example, if you clicked on the voltage, and changed it without pressing enter, the value would show up in the UI as the value you selected, but the OLD setting would still persist (unless you pressed enter) Note that even with the current release this is still the case sometimes. The setting may or may not take...it's pretty random, but it was really bad a couple releases ago.

There were other things as well, those are just the ones off the top of my head. The hardware itself is solid, however the software is crap.


----------



## xkm1948

Also should I be installing the RyZen balanced power plan for this as well? Or like what the hell should I install in terms of chipset driver and etc. oh god I have not used an AMD CPU for a long time. Need uour wisdom!

AFAIK i should flashback latest BIOS first. Then enable XMP. Install chipset driver and Nvidia driver for GPU. Right? Anything I missed?


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SavantStrike*
> 
> Didn't you just invalidate your own claims here - help me understand.
> 
> If the voltage required to reach just south of 4.4 is too high to keep the chip there safely with 75 percent of the cores disabled, how is this even a valid use case?


I wasn't overclocking for stable 24/7 every day use. I already run at 4.1 for that. I was overclocking to understand how the zen architecture handles higher clockspeeds. Some very intriguing things happen at higher clocks, and I was trying to better understand things. Sorry I got caught up with work.


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Also should I be installing the RyZen balanced power plan for this as well? Or like what the hell should I install in terms of chipset driver and etc. oh god I have not used an AMD CPU for a long time. Need uour wisdom!
> 
> AFAIK i should flashback latest BIOS first. Then enable XMP. Install chipset driver and Nvidia driver for GPU. Right? Anything I missed?


If you are on Windows 10, you probably don't need to install the chipset drivers, but you do need to install the Ryzen balanced power plan.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> Can be more difficult to get the three screws tightened. Sometimes, excessive force is required.
> 
> Some would call that defective.


They didn't fix that yet??


----------



## gupsterg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Also should I be installing the RyZen balanced power plan for this as well? Or like what the hell should I install in terms of chipset driver and etc. oh god I have not used an AMD CPU for a long time. Need uour wisdom!
> 
> AFAIK i should flashback latest BIOS first. Then enable XMP. Install chipset driver and Nvidia driver for GPU. Right? Anything I missed?


I would do BIOS update first, as usually boards straight out of box may not have latest one.

Ryzen power plan I have not used it. I use Balanced, mod as I want, do a registry edit for core parking, etc.

I use chipset driver from AMD site, you'll be _au fait_ with it as an AMD GPU owner. Then I install GPU driver, etc.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> If you are on Windows 10, you probably don't need to install the chipset drivers, but you do need to install the Ryzen balanced power plan.
> They didn't fix that yet??


If I remember correctly, the falls's creator update pretty much merged the ryzen balanced plan with the balanced default window plans.

Still, for me.. the ryzen's balanced's 90% load level is way too high. I settled down to 65%. I do not want it to be boosted wasting power when its not needed.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Awesome! What other boards would people recommend?





asrock x399 taichi or fatality if you can get the latter cheap(otherwise the extra network is not worth it)
zero issues for me and by the way 4.05 1.3 llc3 3333 ram all day every day even in this stinking hot summer ambient temp in an air conditioned room 30 outside 35/40 and that is in the mountains.

new case and faster pump has helped keep it under control.

4.1 is the gold standard 4.2 is the platinum above that and your brother is the pope getting favors for you









but I can easily grab 4.1 and do that all day long with a teeny bump in voltage but I don't want to







half the time I just feel like going back to stock as this thing at stock is a monster and uses a ton less juice and produces a lot less heat.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> This is for the guy that told me I'd be 'lucky' to get 4.1. 4.1 GHz at 1.35
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It actually gets bumped up to 1.36 due to the LLC setting. A couple months ago I ran Prime95 all weekend and didn't get a single error. The chip also can do blender renders of classroom and bmw @ 4.2. However, it throttles on Prime95...so odd...





now junior I must have missed it but what is the ambient temp there (and yes by the way ambient temp makes a very big difference to these things)
as I said I live in the mountains and it is often 10 to 15 degrees and that will shave off ...10 to 15 degrees and be the difference between a good overclock and a bad one especially the vrms.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> If you are on Windows 10, you probably don't need to install the chipset drivers, but you do need to install the Ryzen balanced power plan.
> They didn't fix that yet??






yes install the chipset drivers 17.40 is the latest and that was updated the other day with a single new driver for pci.
without the chipset drivers I was getting subpar usb and drive performance with them all good.


----------



## betam4x

4.2 @ 1.4 (LLC3). Appears to be rock solid stable except that Prime95 550 Mhz bug. I switched out to running in blend mode and will check it in the morning. It has been running for 14 minutes now without throttling, but errors take a lot longer to show up, or may not at all. I also haven't tried IBT yet,but a video encode did not throttle the chip, nor did the CPU-Z stress test (but it doesn't try very hard.) All frustrating. I may reach out to MSI to see if they have any thoughts. The last time I did they promptly sent back a beta bios
that fixed the fan profile bug I was experiencing.


----------



## ttwwrr

Hello! Is it normal voltage on stock 1950x? board asrock taichi(bios 2.0). First pic. Idle second load. I worry that the voltage reaches 1.5


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ttwwrr*
> 
> Hello! Is it normal voltage on stock 1950x? board asrock taichi(bios 2.0). First pic. Idle second load. I worry that the voltage reaches 1.5





in short yes it depends on how hot the cpu is and what xfr it reaches.
yours is getting close to 4.2 so it will use more juice, I have found the cooler it is the less voltage it uses (not a lot but it is still there at least in the tests I did.

so yeah don't worry about it it will only be a couple of core boosting so should not crank up a lot of heat and generally it isn't a long time thing.


----------



## ttwwrr

Thank you, for answer. I worry not about temp of cpu, read that the max safe voltage for threadripper is 1.45 for short time not for 24/7 use . if my indicators are normal then I will be calm. on 1700x I fix voltage on 1.32 with 3.8 mhg and calm, but on 1950x I do not want to fix voltage because I loose boost 4,2 which need me for work


----------



## ttwwrr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tarot*
> 
> in short yes it depends on how hot the cpu is and what xfr it reaches.
> yours is getting close to 4.2 so it will use more juice, I have found the cooler it is the less voltage it uses (not a lot but it is still there at least in the tests I did.
> 
> so yeah don't worry about it it will only be a couple of core boosting so should not crank up a lot of heat and generally it isn't a long time thing.


Thank you, for answer. I worry not about temp of cpu, read that the max safe voltage for threadripper is 1.45 for short time not for 24/7 use . if my indicators are normal then I will be calm. on 1700x I fix voltage on 1.32 with 3.8 mhg and calm, but on 1950x I do not want to fix voltage because I loose boost 4,2 which need me for work


----------



## xkm1948

Ended up getting a MSI X399 Gaming Pro (with Lotes socket) and 1950X. Apparently they don't have X399 Taichi available. Will post some pictures later. Gonna build the system in lab tomorrow. May have loads of questions for you guys!


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ttwwrr*
> 
> Thank you, for answer. I worry not about temp of cpu, read that the max safe voltage for threadripper is 1.45 for short time not for 24/7 use . if my indicators are normal then I will be calm. on 1700x I fix voltage on 1.32 with 3.8 mhg and calm, but on 1950x I do not want to fix voltage because I loose boost 4,2 which need me for work


The actual max safe temperature according to AMD is 1.35V, though they (or someone?) stated 1.4 is fine with a decent cooler. 1.45 and above will rapidly degrade the CPU. Indeed, I have already suffered a bit of degradation on my chip.


----------



## webhito

Hey gents!

Got a quick question for you, some here have suggested grabing a board with the lotes socket over the foxconn, is this only due to the way the screws work or is there some other quality reasons as well?


----------



## xkm1948

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *webhito*
> 
> Hey gents!
> 
> Got a quick question for you, some here have suggested grabing a board with the lotes socket over the foxconn, is this only due to the way the screws work or is there some other quality reasons as well?


I browsed all the board at Micro center. Only the MSI and ASUS ZE have Lotes socket. Since people told me to avoid ASUS ZE I just went with MSI.

Probably just the socket thread in I think


----------



## webhito

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> I browsed all the board at Micro center. Only the MSI and ASUS ZE have Lotes socket. Since people told me to avoid ASUS ZE I just went with MSI.
> 
> Probably just the socket thread in I think


Hopefully, I can probably deal with the thread issue, I already ordered a Designare and can't cancel it, msi doesn't really convince me and the zenith won't fit in my case anyways.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *betam4x*
> 
> The actual max safe temperature according to AMD is 1.35V, though they (or someone?) stated 1.4 is fine with a decent cooler. 1.45 and above will rapidly degrade the CPU. Indeed, I have already suffered a bit of degradation on my chip.


1.35V.. safe.. temps?
what?


----------



## webhito

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> 1.35V.. safe.. temps?
> what?


Probably the Vodka speaking.


----------



## tarot

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> 1.35V.. safe.. temps?
> what?






I kind of think he meant voltage







safe temp is 68 degrees tdie you can happily go to say 75 but your skating on thin ice long term.


----------



## MNMadman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xkm1948*
> 
> Ended up getting a MSI X399 Gaming Pro (with Lotes socket) and 1950X. Apparently they don't have X399 Taichi available. Will post some pictures later. Gonna build the system in lab tomorrow. May have loads of questions for you guys!


Make sure you keep us updated. I think I'm going with the Taichi now, but I want to hear if you have any issues with the latest MSI BIOS like have been mentioned. I have to wait until my MicroCenter gets the TR CPUs back in stock anyway.


----------



## SavantStrike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MNMadman*
> 
> Make sure you keep us updated. I think I'm going with the Taichi now, but I want to hear if you have any issues with the latest MSI BIOS like have been mentioned. I have to wait until my MicroCenter gets the TR CPUs back in stock anyway.


I returned my MSI board within a week of getting it. I had to work a tiny bit harder to get the foxconn socket to work on my taichi (all three screws partially tightened first).


----------



## betam4x

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *webhito*
> 
> Probably the Vodka speaking.


Hah, no, its this damn LG keyboard autocorrect. Drives me nuts and I need to disable it. It corrects stuff based on typing history, so for instance, one time I typed Ghz and then went back and inserted a 4 behind it. Now every time I type Ghz it corrects to 4Ghz. Also, vodka? I wish...on the road...


----------



## ssateneth

I don't know where you are getting these voltages from, stating its from AMD, but I can assure you, its pretty hard to push too much voltage through TR. After all, under stock operation, automatic XFR boosts often push 1.4-1.5v through individual cores (Check VID and VRM voltages with your favorite monitoring program)


----------



## xkm1948

Well our TR build hit a snag right away. I did not know that most X399 motherboard requires 2 EPS12 for power. We had a Seasonic Focus 650 which only had one. Oh well, ordered another EVGA and hopefully this new one would work better.


----------



## trnewb

At least on the Zenith you can just use one CPU power connection, though I wouldn't overclock such a setup.


----------



## nycgtr

Derbauer just proved there no such thing as the bs dummy dies.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Derbauer just proved there no such thing as the bs dummy dies.


So are you saying that threadripper is pretty much a full epyc die with lasered or disabled chips?

Last video I seen showed different "connectors" in the chip itself between TR and EPYC. Someone mentioned these differences are pretty much a mirror of EPYC pcb.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> So are you saying that threadripper is pretty much a full epyc die with lasered or disabled chips?
> 
> Last video I seen showed different "connectors" in the chip itself between TR and EPYC.


Threadripper has 4 Ryzen dies, absolutely confirmed. There are 2 functional ones, and 2 dead ones. There is no known way to activate the dead ones, and even if were possible, 99% likely they are damaged in some way. Mostly for structural support.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Threadripper has 4 Ryzen dies, absolutely confirmed. There are 2 functional ones, and 2 dead ones. There is no known way to activate the dead ones, and even if were possible, 99% likely they are damaged in some way. Mostly for structural support.


Desbauer new video says after opening a few TR's and EPYCs that they are pretty much identical except for some minimal differences.
Note that my hearing isnt perfect so I cant be 100% sure.

Check the video:


----------



## nycgtr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> Threadripper has 4 Ryzen dies, absolutely confirmed. There are 2 functional ones, and 2 dead ones. There is no known way to activate the dead ones, and even if were possible, 99% likely they are damaged in some way. Mostly for structural support.


Go watch the video.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nycgtr*
> 
> Go watch the video.


I already knew about all 4 dies having transistors. I never said they didn't have transistors.
I watched it the video. It just sounds like speculation to me about 32c. right now, current TR chips cannot be enabled to be 32c. Maybe AMD has some supah secret shenanigans to do it internally, maybe not. It's all secret intellectual property.

Anyways, this whole speculation of TR vs EPYC and conspiracy theory of AMD lying to us is pointless. Wait for the next gen to come out. There's nothing more to be said IMO.


----------



## Tamalero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssateneth*
> 
> I already knew about all 4 dies having transistors. I never said they didn't have transistors.
> I watched it the video. It just sounds like speculation to me about 32c. right now, current TR chips cannot be enabled to be 32c. Maybe AMD has some supah secret shenanigans to do it internally, maybe not. It's all secret intellectual property.
> 
> Anyways, this whole speculation of TR vs EPYC and conspiracy theory of AMD lying to us is pointless. Wait for the next gen to come out. There's nothing more to be said IMO.


The point is that AMD said many times that they were empty dummy cores, when they in reality are not.. they maybe defectiva or not. but they are still full blown processed dies.
Hell, they could be low level cores that didn't perform to either epyc requirements or Threadripper level dies.

While AMD might have their reasons but Pretty much said two things (aka they are empty dummy cores and that threadripper werent epycs).


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I'm considering the 1950x for my new custom watercooled build. Coming from Intel what kind of OC's can be expected and what are the best OCing x399 boards? I know these chips don't OC as well as Intel chips but I'd like to have my expectations set properly.


----------



## OrionBG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I'm considering the 1950x for my new custom watercooled build. Coming from Intel what kind of OC's can be expected and what are the best OCing x399 boards? I know these chips don't OC as well as Intel chips but I'd like to have my expectations set properly.


Usually 1950x can do 4GHz on all cores. Up to 4.1 - 4.2GHz if you have won the silicon lottery. You may get a couple of hundreds MHz more if you disable most of the cores... Regarding boards, I personally got the AsRock x399 Taichi...


----------



## TrixX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> The point is that AMD said many times that they were empty dummy cores, when they in reality are not.. they maybe defectiva or not. but they are still full blown processed dies.
> Hell, they could be low level cores that didn't perform to either epyc requirements or Threadripper level dies.
> 
> While AMD might have their reasons but Pretty much said two things (aka they are empty dummy cores and that threadripper werent epycs).


An empty dummy core could technically just be a failed CCX so it's actually irrelevant whether it has transistors in it or not. If it's just being used for structural integrity, it doesn't matter either way and it's not a lie to say it's a empty dummy core.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Those of you OCing your 1950x's, what's the true story with temperatures? AMD lists max temp as 68C. Is that really what's considered "safe?" Seems low to me.


----------



## Undermoose

*Temp range*



PuffinMyLye said:


> Those of you OCing your 1950x's, what's the true story with temperatures? AMD lists max temp as 68C. Is that really what's considered "safe?" Seems low to me.


68c is where precision boost cuts off. It is the number to keep under generally speaking.

It's tough to find the upper limits specs, but I believe I saw 80c as upper safe limit for daily use, and 95c thermal shut down.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Undermoose said:


> 68c is where precision boost cuts off. It is the number to keep under generally speaking.
> 
> It's tough to find the upper limits specs, but I believe I saw 80c as upper safe limit for daily use, and 95c thermal shut down.


Is Precision a configurable setting (ie. can be turned off)? If so, wouldn't one want to for OCing purposes?


----------



## Tamalero

TrixX said:


> Quote:Originally Posted by *Tamalero*
> 
> The point is that AMD said many times that they were empty dummy cores, when they in reality are not.. they maybe defectiva or not. but they are still full blown processed dies.
> Hell, they could be low level cores that didn't perform to either epyc requirements or Threadripper level dies.
> 
> While AMD might have their reasons but Pretty much said two things (aka they are empty dummy cores and that threadripper werent epycs).
> 
> An empty dummy core could technically just be a failed CCX so it's actually irrelevant whether it has transistors in it or not. If it's just being used for structural integrity, it doesn't matter either way and it's not a lie to say it's a empty dummy core.


Seems the new "upgrade" took the newest posts with it.

Anyway. You still aren't getting the point. Some people said AMD lied because they explicitly said the products are completely different and incompatible with each other.
And that the threadripper other dies were "empty".

Specifics and such. Sounds like a strawman argument but the verbiage is kinda the difference.

Regardless, makes you wonder if there is the possibility of higher cores Threadrippers in the future.


----------



## mmonnin

Tamalero said:


> Seems the new "upgrade" took the newest posts with it.
> 
> Anyway. You still aren't getting the point. Some people said AMD lied because they explicitly said the products are completely different and incompatible with each other.
> And that the threadripper other dies were "empty".
> 
> Specifics and such. Sounds like a strawman argument but the verbiage is kinda the difference.
> 
> Regardless, makes you wonder if there is the possibility of higher cores Threadrippers in the future.


Higher core counts would require a new package design (maybe not pinout)since each core on a die talks with the same core on other die. So more trace lines. If AMD is going to do that so soon after initial release for Zen+/2 as some have speculated then why not make TR4 it's own package w/o the dead die. If its out the window a year or two later why not make it simpler in the 1st place. IMO small improvements for Zen+ then only more die would come with a major process node shrink.


----------



## ussoldier_1984

How is the performance on the 1950 lets say against the current 1800x I have in my rig right now?


----------



## SavantStrike

ussoldier_1984 said:


> How is the performance on the 1950 lets say against the current 1800x I have in my rig right now?


As much as double if you've got a 16+ thread workload or you're memory bandwidth limited. Otherwise IPC is pretty much identical.


----------



## gupsterg

ussoldier_1984 said:


> How is the performance on the 1950 lets say against the current 1800x I have in my rig right now?
> 
> 
> SavantStrike said:
> 
> 
> 
> As much as double if you've got a 16+ thread workload or you're memory bandwidth limited. Otherwise IPC is pretty much identical.
Click to expand...

PB/XFR differs on Threadripper vs Ryzen. Only way I see the higher count PB/XFR is if threads are on differing CPU node.


----------



## SavantStrike

gupsterg said:


> PB/XFR differs on Threadripper vs Ryzen. Only way I see the higher count PB/XFR is if threads are on differing CPU node.


Yeah, that does make an apples to apples comparison difficult. My broad oversimplification was too broad (and simple)!

Assuming locked equal clock speeds, the TR chip will scale proportionally compared to ryzen in heavily threaded workloads. 
That's if the mesh architecture doesn't cause a latency penalty, and ignoring that most problems don't scale linearly with more cores.

I'd go TR any day of the week, but it's quite possibly a waste for many use cases if the extra cores aren't used.


----------



## Heidi

As announced...it is here...it is real...it's starting getting into the shape...


----------



## xkm1948

The lab workstation build for bioinformatics complete. For now we will settle with 64GB of RAM. 

Honestly I am surprised by how good Threadripper is handling XMP. I just enabled XMP on the Corsair RAM, which is not even B-die, and it booted at 2666 16-18-18-35 1T first try. I was really not expecting it to go so well.

This platform will not be overclocked at all.


----------



## Heidi

I got two sets of RAM, 8 sticks of G.Skill 2666c15 and HyperX Predator 2800c14...I am little bit worried how they will cope here...


----------



## MNMadman

Heidi said:


> I got two sets of RAM, 8 sticks of G.Skill 2666c15 and HyperX Predator 2800c14...I am little bit worried how they will cope here...


The lower-speed RAM kits tend to work pretty well, so you shouldn't have a problem with either one. 3000 and higher kits that aren't Samsung B die tend to be the problem children.


----------



## ht_addict

Just received my new Watercool Heatkiller IV. It's replacing my trusted EKWB Threadripper block that has held up just fine cooling my 1950x at 4GHz while playing Wolfenstein and TitanFall 2 for hours on end. Hopefully have it installed in my system by tomorrow. It's a beautiful, heavy piece of cooling.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

ht_addict said:


> Just received my new Watercool Heatkiller IV. It's replacing my trusted EKWB Threadripper block that has held up just fine cooling my 1950x at 4GHz while playing Wolfenstein and TitanFall 2 for hours on end. Hopefully have it installed in my system by tomorrow. It's a beautiful, heavy piece of cooling.


I'm quite curious to see what results you get. That's the same block (but in Nickel) that I'm looking at.


----------



## Tamalero

Hey guys, 

Any of you have seen any difference in the new AMD drivers for Threadripper chipset?


----------



## gupsterg

ussoldier_1984 said:


> How is the performance on the 1950 lets say against the current 1800x I have in my rig right now?
> 
> 
> 
> SavantStrike said:
> 
> 
> 
> As much as double if you've got a 16+ thread workload or you're memory bandwidth limited. Otherwise IPC is pretty much identical.
> 
> 
> 
> gupsterg said:
> 
> 
> 
> PB/XFR differs on Threadripper vs Ryzen. Only way I see the higher count PB/XFR is if threads are on differing CPU node.
> 
> 
> 
> SavantStrike said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, that does make an apples to apples comparison difficult. My broad oversimplification was too broad (and simple)!
> 
> Assuming locked equal clock speeds, the TR chip will scale proportionally compared to ryzen in heavily threaded workloads.
> That's if the mesh architecture doesn't cause a latency penalty, and ignoring that most problems don't scale linearly with more cores.
> 
> I'd go TR any day of the week, but it's quite possibly a waste for many use cases if the extra cores aren't used.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Indeed  .



Tamalero said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Any of you have seen any difference in the new AMD drivers for Threadripper chipset?


None noted in normal usage.


----------



## tarot

Heidi said:


> I got two sets of RAM, 8 sticks of G.Skill 2666c15 and HyperX Predator 2800c14...I am little bit worried how they will cope here...


I would suggest you try a couple of sticks first then manually set it to 2400 c14 (the rest I would leave a bit loose) set the ram voltage to 1.35 and reboot if it loads ok and maybe do a quick memtest add the other sticks and see if ti boots.
loading 8 sticks can be a bit of a chore under normal circumstances built a mixed bag could get ugly real quick 

also did you have any issues loading the cpu into the carriage or screwing it down (being a foxcon I would be interested to see if they have gotten better)


----------



## tarot

Tamalero said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Any of you have seen any difference in the new AMD drivers for Threadripper chipset?


there is one file different but honestly I can't remember what it was...pci....something but in terms of usage I have not noticed anything.


----------



## Heidi

tarot said:


> I would suggest you try a couple of sticks first then manually set it to 2400 c14 (the rest I would leave a bit loose) set the ram voltage to 1.35 and reboot if it loads ok and maybe do a quick memtest add the other sticks and see if ti boots.
> loading 8 sticks can be a bit of a chore under normal circumstances built a mixed bag could get ugly real quick
> 
> also did you have any issues loading the cpu into the carriage or screwing it down (being a foxcon I would be interested to see if they have gotten better)


Thanks for guide...
OK..
I am testing the thing and I am so impressed with it!
This thing is light years ahead of what I had, and still have under my desk!
RAM works at 2666c14 1.35V flawlessly...however I still haven't touch any other settings as by what I can see in the BIOS is stunning array of options!
Since I have two Vega 64, the other one is still engaged in my old Intel setup...I, honestly can't wait for a moment to relieve it from there...this is so much better machine!
Also, briefly I did tried to push it to 2933 and hit the wall straight away, but it is with XMP profile turned on.
This RAM can go way over 3200 and give me a time it'll be settled there no question asked! Well...unless some other devil show up it's ugly face....
Nevertheless, I am impressed...


----------



## Sanmayce

Threadripper owners, please post a screenshot of 7-zip scores (32MB) and CPU-Z (CPU+memory), either here or to http://www.overclock.net/forum/410-...t-mips-screenshots-7-zip-built-benchmark.html


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Anyone in here using the Asus ROG Zenith Extreme board that can comment on any issues with the 10Gb NIC? I'm considering this board and need 10Gb to work without issues.


----------



## mumford

Well, I can confirm that Solarflare 10G Nic with SFP+ works flawlessly. I have not tried the Asus bundled 10G nic, however.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

mumford said:


> Well, I can confirm that Solarflare 10G Nic with SFP+ works flawlessly. I have not tried the Asus bundled 10G nic, however.


Yea I need the onboard copper 10GbE card to work as my workstation only has copper to it. It's a big reason why I'm looking at the Zenith. The boards with onboard USB3.1 headers and 10Gb networking are few and far between.


----------



## SavantStrike

PuffinMyLye said:


> Yea I need the onboard copper 10GbE card to work as my workstation only has copper to it. It's a big reason why I'm looking at the Zenith. The boards with onboard USB3.1 headers and 10Gb networking are few and far between.


The 10gb nic isn't onboard on the zenith, just a pack in. Only the Asrock fatality has onboard 10gb, but it doesn't have front panel 3.1 gen2 (just 3.0 which could be made to do 3.1 gen1).


----------



## Tamalero

Sanmayce said:


> Threadripper owners, please post a screenshot of 7-zip scores (32MB) and CPU-Z (CPU+memory), either here or to http://www.overclock.net/forum/410-...t-mips-screenshots-7-zip-built-benchmark.html


Just replied on that thread.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

SavantStrike said:


> The 10gb nic isn't onboard on the zenith, just a pack in. Only the Asrock fatality has onboard 10gb, but it doesn't have front panel 3.1 gen2 (just 3.0 which could be made to do 3.1 gen1).


Right, sorry I meant bundled with, not onboard. But yea, if there was another x399 board with a USB 3.1 Gen2 header I'd consider that as well. Just can't find them.


----------



## SavantStrike

PuffinMyLye said:


> Right, sorry I meant bundled with, not onboard. But yea, if there was another x399 board with a USB 3.1 Gen2 header I'd consider that as well. Just can't find them.


The gaming pro carbon I think... But I had that board and hated it with a passion. The front USB is USB 3.1 though I don't remember if it was only gen 1.


----------



## Heidi

Testing, testing...1...2...3...
So far so good, even this is just to find out limits of my configuration I have found really great stability!
Obviously, it is a long way to the top...


----------



## Heidi

BTW, the Noctua NH-U14s really does it's job nicely...the top temp experienced so far is at about 46 degrees...or something is seriously wrong with Ryzen Master...


----------



## OrionBG

Heidi said:


> BTW, the Noctua NH-U14s really does it's job nicely...the top temp experienced so far is at about 46 degrees...or something is seriously wrong with Ryzen Master...


Definitely there is something wrong! It is impossible to have the 1950X (or most of the modern CPUs for that matter) at full load and 46C on an air cooler, even if it is a Noctua...


----------



## Heidi

And, sort of final stage of primary testing for now...Hynix MFR (HyperX 2800c14) at 3200 16-16-16-39 1.35V...
Not claiming any stability, but so far it is mining already 28hrs with no errors...
Over the weekend I will test it for stability...hope this will hold, but it looks too good to be true...


----------



## Tasm

Is anyone experiencing heavy stuttering when gaming with TR?

I mean, even if your frames are high (+100 fps) the games are not fluid!

Anyone? 

My previous 1700 were doing much better at games, i had no stuttering at all.


----------



## v-snejok

Guys, help me overclock the Threadripper 1950x
I have enermax liqtech tr4 360 for cooling and motherboard asus zenith extreme, but I have very hot temperatures ... at @ 4.0 voltage 1.35 I have over 80 degrees.. My PC just went down during the test ...
Then I tried on @ 3.9 and voltage 1.275 - my temperature was up to 72 degrees in 10 minutes of test prime95...
I want 4.0 frequency to reach, but with voltage even 1.35 I have a system fail during render, and very high temps..
How in tests they manage to overclock with much lower temperatures?

Are there some temperature statistics about 1950x + enermax liqtech tr4 360? I want to compare my result with others


----------



## Tamalero

v-snejok said:


> Guys, help me overclock the Threadripper 1950x
> I have enermax liqtech tr4 360 for cooling and motherboard asus zenith extreme, but I have very hot temperatures ... at @ 4.0 voltage 1.35 I have over 80 degrees.. My PC just went down during the test ...
> Then I tried on @ 3.9 and voltage 1.275 - my temperature was up to 72 degrees in 10 minutes of test prime95...
> I want 4.0 frequency to reach, but with voltage even 1.35 I have a system fail during render, and very high temps..
> How in tests they manage to overclock with much lower temperatures?
> 
> Are there some temperature statistics about 1950x + enermax liqtech tr4 360? I want to compare my result with others



You need to be careful with certain platforms(as in motherboards).

There are well known bugs in certain bios versions where the fans and pump headers just stop working properly and thus stops the fans and pumps for no reason at all.
You could have that bug.

The other side could be.. that you did not seat (or apply the thermal paste correctly) of your Enermax.

Also, that AIOs arent that great for TR.. most AIOs have very cheap and thin radiators.



Tasm said:


> Is anyone experiencing heavy stuttering when gaming with TR?
> 
> I mean, even if your frames are high (+100 fps) the games are not fluid!
> 
> Anyone?
> 
> My previous 1700 were doing much better at games, i had no stuttering at all.



You did turn off the HPET platform clock right?

Also, the stuttering usually happens when the game spawns a new thread and Windows decides to allocate this to the other die across infinity fabric.
Try setting the affinity manually to one CC.


----------



## v-snejok

Tamalero said:


> You need to be careful with certain platforms(as in motherboards).
> 
> There are well known bugs in certain bios versions where the fans and pump headers just stop working properly and thus stops the fans and pumps for no reason at all.
> You could have that bug.
> 
> The other side could be.. that you did not seat (or apply the thermal paste correctly) of your Enermax.
> 
> Also, that AIOs arent that great for TR.. most AIOs have very cheap and thin radiators.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You did turn off the HPET platform clock right?
> 
> Also, the stuttering usually happens when the game spawns a new thread and Windows decides to allocate this to the other die across infinity fabric.
> Try setting the affinity manually to one CC.


How I can turn HPET off? And what it will gives?
If I will take off water pump and mount it again, I need to use new thermal paste?


----------



## v-snejok

v-snejok said:


> How I can turn HPET off? And what it will gives?
> If I will take off water pump and mount it again, I need to use new thermal paste?


Sorry, didnt see that about hpet it was not to me.
also what temperatures I should get normally with enermax tr4 360 for 1.275voltage and 1.35?


----------



## Tamalero

v-snejok said:


> How I can turn HPET off? And what it will gives?
> If I will take off water pump and mount it again, I need to use new thermal paste?


for HPET:

Open CMD as an administrator

run: bcdedit /enum

if you see 'useplatformclock' set to true then run thats your problem

I ran: bcdedit /set useplatformclock false

bcdedit /deletevalue useplatformclock


This should reduce the stuttering.
Other way to remove stuttering is to force a game to use a single CC (either from thread 0 to 15 or 16 to 31)

For thermalpaste, Cant say I'm no expert.. but I always read that its recommended that you apply new one.

The 5 point trick worked for me. (also mind the paste quality, some cheap pastes can be veeery bad). I use the default noctua one that came with my TR cooler. Which seems to be in the top tier.

*edit*

Hard to say about the temps.
The temps vary way too much on a multitude of settings.
From Vcore voltages to IMC voltages, type of thermal paste, method applied, silicon lottery, motherbord and quality of vrms, type of cooling system, your pc box size and type AND ambient temperatures.


----------



## MNMadman

v-snejok said:


> also what temperatures I should get normally with enermax tr4 360 for 1.275voltage and 1.35?


There is no database on what voltages get what temps. The best resource is the online reviews. But even then, it will also depend on whether you got a "good" chip or a "bad" chip - also known as the silicon lottery.


----------



## nycgtr

So EK is teasing a revised threadripper block. So the rest of us that bought the initial garbage just get to deal with it? lol


----------



## The L33t

nycgtr said:


> So EK is teasing a revised threadripper block. So the rest of us that bought the initial garbage just get to deal with it? lol


They will be sending upgrade parts to current owners. They said as much on Facebook. They will announce it soon.


----------



## nycgtr

The L33t said:


> They will be sending upgrade parts to current owners. They said as much on Facebook. They will announce it soon.


only if you bought it directly from EK apparently.


----------



## The L33t

nycgtr said:


> only if you bought it directly from EK apparently.


I'd say if you have a respectable dealer, they will be able to request such parts from EK on your behalf.


----------



## Tasm

Tamalero said:


> You need to be careful with certain platforms(as in motherboards).
> 
> There are well known bugs in certain bios versions where the fans and pump headers just stop working properly and thus stops the fans and pumps for no reason at all.
> You could have that bug.
> 
> The other side could be.. that you did not seat (or apply the thermal paste correctly) of your Enermax.
> 
> Also, that AIOs arent that great for TR.. most AIOs have very cheap and thin radiators.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You did turn off the HPET platform clock right?
> 
> Also, the stuttering usually happens when the game spawns a new thread and Windows decides to allocate this to the other die across infinity fabric.
> Try setting the affinity manually to one CC.


Yes, HPET is turned off.

What i really want to know is if this is a general ISSUE with TR or if i have some problem that needs to be sorted.

Because, i get it in every single game. Stuttering is always present.

I guess i wasnt supposed to happen this way, right?

ANYONE having the same issue or your TR systems are doing fine?


----------



## nycgtr

The L33t said:


> I'd say if you have a respectable dealer, they will be able to request such parts from EK on your behalf.


Well i got the mono directly from them and 2 from PPCS.


----------



## Dotachin

Tasm said:


> Yes, HPET is turned off.
> 
> What i really want to know is if this is a general ISSUE with TR or if i have some problem that needs to be sorted.
> 
> Because, i get it in every single game. Stuttering is always present.
> 
> I guess i wasnt supposed to happen this way, right?
> 
> ANYONE having the same issue or your TR systems are doing fine?


Is it only in games? are the games installed in a SATA drive? If they are, it may be the microsoft default sata driver (if you have a pcie nvme drive try one game on it to verify).


----------



## Tamalero

Tasm said:


> Yes, HPET is turned off.
> 
> What i really want to know is if this is a general ISSUE with TR or if i have some problem that needs to be sorted.
> 
> Because, i get it in every single game. Stuttering is always present.
> 
> I guess i wasnt supposed to happen this way, right?
> 
> ANYONE having the same issue or your TR systems are doing fine?


Try running the game, then setting the affinity to the first 15 cores.

then continue playing and see if the stuttering continues.

Note that AMD has a well known issue with AMD gpus that stutter in Opengl games. Because supposedly the driver doesn't multithread the calls to the gpu while Nvidia does.


----------



## OrionBG

Almost done


----------



## x7007

I bought the Enermax Liqtech for 1950x .. Insane cooling , way better than Corsair 115i .. I can do now 4.0 Ghz with 1.280-V and it is so stable . for now it's very cold and the ambient is low . but it still around 69-70 on FULL PRime95 load.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Looking for RAM to round out my TR 1950x build. Any recommendations? Preferably ones that come in black, black/white, or black/silver color combos.

TridentZ 3200?


----------



## mumford

PuffinMyLye said:


> Looking for RAM to round out my TR 1950x build. Any recommendations? Preferably ones that come in black, black/white, or black/silver color combos.


G. Skill Trident-Z, 3200 c14 or faster.

I have this set, running at 3466 c14 @ 1.40V

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232593


----------



## MNMadman

In order of preference:
1. Flare X (specifically for AMD and is $60 cheaper at NewEgg)
2. Trident Z "X" meant specifically for AMD (F4-3200C14Q-32GTZRX)
3. Regular Trident Z

The GTZRX is what I bought because the Flare X was out of stock.


----------



## gupsterg

F4-3200C14D-16GTZ was non issue on ZE, max reached 3466MHz C15 1T with 1.39V.

F4-3200C14D-32GVK has been "plug'n'play" for 3200MHz using The Stilt 3333MHz Fast timings, which are tighter than XMP for this RAM kit. Passed ~75hrs of back to back testing in HCI/P95/Y-Crunching/[email protected]/Bionic/RealBench. I changed nothing other than set VDIMM 1.35V SOC 1.05V and loaded the timings preset. Taking a break from testing further tweaks.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

MNMadman said:


> In order of preference:
> 1. Flare X (specifically for AMD and is $60 cheaper at NewEgg)
> 2. Trident Z "X" meant specifically for AMD (F4-3200C14Q-32GTZRX)
> 3. Regular Trident Z
> 
> The GTZRX is what I bought because the Flare X was out of stock.


They only come in RGB? I don't feel like paying the premium for that when I won't use it.


----------



## MNMadman

PuffinMyLye said:


> They only come in RGB? I don't feel like paying the premium for that when I won't use it.


Flare X has no RGB and is cheaper. It's in stock now but wasn't when I bought my RAM.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

MNMadman said:


> Flare X has no RGB and is cheaper. It's in stock now but wasn't when I bought my RAM.


Yea I might go for that. Too bad it only comes in black but I can make that work.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

MNMadman said:


> Flare X has no RGB and is cheaper. It's in stock now but wasn't when I bought my RAM.



Where do you see this in stock in 16GB modules?


----------



## MNMadman

PuffinMyLye said:


> Where do you see this in stock in 16GB modules?


Sorry, I was assuming a 4x8GB kit.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

MNMadman said:


> Sorry, I was assuming a 4x8GB kit.



Oh ok np. I want to be able to upgrade to 128gb in the future.


----------



## gupsterg

PuffinMyLye said:


> Oh ok np. I want to be able to upgrade to 128gb in the future.


IIRC one of your initial questions was regarding "OC expectation" of platform. With that density of RAM you would reach lower RAM MHz. Due to the relationship of RAM MHz and Infinity Fabric you could lose some performance in some situations IMO. IIRC TR refresh is in 2H of this year, perhaps then would be better time to go for build.


----------



## dillpickles

Hey all,

I'm wondering if you can help me keep my temps down, or at least alleviate my concerns about the temps I'm getting. Machine in question is here: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/LZKjjc

The relevant parts in question are the Ernamax 360, the 1950x, and the rog zenith extreme. 

I built this guy for a work/render machine, this is my 2nd build, but my first with any AIO cooling. I make motion graphics and primarily use after effects and cinema 4d for work. For after effects, this guy works great, and under full cpu load during render I rarely hit above 62 C (Tdie). However, under full load with C4D, I've seen temps of 74 C (Tdie) after about a half hour of continous rendering. The real tricky thing is I'm not overclocked that much, only 3.6 ghz. I've seen people getting temps with 4.1 ghz overclocks of 60 degrees in cinebench, so I'm wondering if I've ****ed something up, or if I really did just get a lemon in the CPU lottery. 

Things I know

- The waterpump power connector is plugged into my CPU fan (because of that short cord), but that seems to be getting fine RPMs
- All my fans are running properly (no bent blades or anything)
- Thermal paste application is good, I used Arctic Silver 5 and with the X covered most of the cpu.

Any thoughts to help me get my temps down, or should I not even worry about it? The whole offset and 68 C max safe temp thing from AMD has me very confused. There will definitely be continous, 24 hour long renders in this machines future, so stability is my main goal. I'd love to push that overclock a few more mhz too, but I'd rather go for longevity than anything else. 

I’ve seen 6 fan set-ups on radiators, and maybe that is the solution, just more air flowing over everything?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

gupsterg said:


> IIRC one of your initial questions was regarding "OC expectation" of platform. With that density of RAM you would reach lower RAM MHz. Due to the relationship of RAM MHz and Infinity Fabric you could lose some performance in some situations IMO. IIRC TR refresh is in 2H of this year, perhaps then would be better time to go for build.



Yes I'm aware that I'll have to settle for a lower OC with a higher RAM density, but I'm willing to make that sacrifice in the future if the need arises. I don't need more than 64GB right now but I can see that happening in the future.

I've considered waiting for the TR refresh but it's likely it ill be 6+ months before they are available to consumers and I'm not interested in waiting. I learned a long time ago that it's rarely smart to wait on a specific component because there is always a new release of some component around the corner. The new TR release will likely be accompanied by a new MoBo chipset which will likely have it's own bugs.

Besides my CaseLabs case will be here 4 weeks...can't have it sitting all lonely .


----------



## gupsterg

I reckon then it's time to get ordering and building .


----------



## PuffinMyLye

gupsterg said:


> I reckon then it's time to get ordering and building .


Yup! Already have the PSU and I'm picking up the 1950x today from MicroCenter. Gonna make a gametime decision between the ASRock Taichi and MSI Gaming Pro Carbon (since it has USB 3.1 Gen 2 header). I'll be totally fine with a simple 4.0-4.1GHz OC with my custom water loop.

Gonna have to start a build log I think :thumb:.


----------



## gupsterg

Sweet  , if it was between those 2 boards I'd take the Taichi.


----------



## MNMadman

gupsterg said:


> Sweet  , if it was between those 2 boards I'd take the Taichi.


Yeah, I was going to go with the Carbon board but members who had them recommended against them (they switched from the Carbon to other boards). I will be getting a Taichi for my Heatripper Threadkiller build late next week.


----------



## gupsterg

MNMadman said:


> Yeah, I was going to go with the Carbon board but members who had them recommended against them (they switched from the Carbon to other boards). I will be getting a Taichi for my Heatripper Threadkiller build late next week.


Sweet  , like VRM sink design. Compared with AM4 version they made silkscreen not white, which I like, plus added the onboard power/reset switch. Only real gripe I've had is it lacks allowing connecting a temp sensor IIRC. So you can't use loop temp for fan profile. Gigabyte boards have that, besides ASUS offerings. I guess many WC users might be on Aquaero or something else ...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Alright. Picked up my 1950x from Microcenter tonight and decided to go with the Taichi board on the spot (last one in stock). My buikd is officially underway now. Guess I need to start a build log .


----------



## Tamalero

PuffinMyLye said:


> Alright. Picked up my 1950x from Microcenter tonight and decided to go with the Taichi board on the spot (last one in stock). My buikd is officially underway now. Guess I need to start a build log .


Lots of luck man!

Once you get to render 3d, videos or process photos.. you will be in love with threadripper!


----------



## OrionBG

PuffinMyLye said:


> Alright. Picked up my 1950x from Microcenter tonight and decided to go with the Taichi board on the spot (last one in stock). My buikd is officially underway now. Guess I need to start a build log .


Nice!Very best of luck with your build.
Mine is complete and I have been leak-testing it since last night (8:40am here now) I hope that I'll boot it for the first time tonight... I just hope I'll not go blind at that moment  The sheer amount of RGB stuff is astronomical  3x LL140, 5x HD120, 1x HD140, 3x Addressable RGB strips, custom RGB lighting for the CPU and the GPU blocks. Two Corsair controllers are going to be managing (almost) everything...
That cable hiding plate on the back of the Cooler Master H500P case is a godsend...


----------



## Martin778

What's the expected RAM speed on Threadripper and Zenith Extreme combined with good B-Dies?

Currently listing my X299 rig for sale. RAM ran at 4000 C16 but selling because of Meltdown/Spectre circus.


----------



## v-snejok

dillpickles said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I'm wondering if you can help me keep my temps down, or at least alleviate my concerns about the temps I'm getting. Machine in question is here: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/LZKjjc
> 
> The relevant parts in question are the Ernamax 360, the 1950x, and the rog zenith extreme.
> 
> I built this guy for a work/render machine, this is my 2nd build, but my first with any AIO cooling. I make motion graphics and primarily use after effects and cinema 4d for work. For after effects, this guy works great, and under full cpu load during render I rarely hit above 62 C (Tdie). However, under full load with C4D, I've seen temps of 74 C (Tdie) after about a half hour of continous rendering. The real tricky thing is I'm not overclocked that much, only 3.6 ghz. I've seen people getting temps with 4.1 ghz overclocks of 60 degrees in cinebench, so I'm wondering if I've ****ed something up, or if I really did just get a lemon in the CPU lottery.
> 
> Things I know
> 
> - The waterpump power connector is plugged into my CPU fan (because of that short cord), but that seems to be getting fine RPMs
> - All my fans are running properly (no bent blades or anything)
> - Thermal paste application is good, I used Arctic Silver 5 and with the X covered most of the cpu.
> 
> Any thoughts to help me get my temps down, or should I not even worry about it? The whole offset and 68 C max safe temp thing from AMD has me very confused. There will definitely be continous, 24 hour long renders in this machines future, so stability is my main goal. I'd love to push that overclock a few more mhz too, but I'd rather go for longevity than anything else.
> 
> I’ve seen 6 fan set-ups on radiators, and maybe that is the solution, just more air flowing over everything?


At which voltage do you have such temperatures?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

OrionBG said:


> Nice!Very best of luck with your build.
> Mine is complete and I have been leak-testing it since last night (8:40am here now) I hope that I'll boot it for the first time tonight... I just hope I'll not go blind at that moment  The sheer amount of RGB stuff is astronomical  3x LL140, 5x HD120, 1x HD140, 3x Addressable RGB strips, custom RGB lighting for the CPU and the GPU blocks. Two Corsair controllers are going to be managing (almost) everything...
> That cable hiding plate on the back of the Cooler Master H500P case is a godsend...


Whoa that's a lot indeed haha.

No RGB for me. I'm a minimalist. Going for a white, black, chome build with just a few LED case lights to display all the goodness :thumb:.


----------



## KyadCK

And joined. 1950X on a x399 Designare with 8x8GB running at 2933 16-18-18 because ram predated TR's existence, woo. At least my max temps are 45C since I haven't OC'd yet.

Minimalist I am not, but White/Silver/Black I can agree with. :specool:


----------



## Tamalero

KyadCK said:


> And joined. 1950X on a x399 Designare with 8x8GB running at 2933 16-18-18 because ram predated TR's existence, woo. At least my max temps are 45C since I haven't OC'd yet.
> 
> Minimalist I am not, but White/Silver/Black I can agree with. :specool:



Thats a very well organized and clean build!


----------



## KyadCK

Tamalero said:


> Thats a very well organized and clean build!


Heh, thanks, I literally spend 5 hours rebuilding it last night. 

Also, know what sucks? Spreading liquid metal paste on the 14 acre farm known as Threadripper. It actually took a full 15 minutes to get it on there acceptably.


----------



## dillpickles

1.3v


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Build Log has begun for those interested.

http://www.overclock.net/forum/1808...ff-s-punisher-ii-sma8-threadripper-style.html


----------



## OrionBG

It's ALIVEEEE!!! 

Sorry for the picture quality but my phone's camera is ****ty...


----------



## The L33t

KyadCK said:


> And joined. 1950X on a x399 Designare with 8x8GB running at 2933 16-18-18 because ram predated TR's existence, woo. At least my max temps are 45C since I haven't OC'd yet.
> 
> Minimalist I am not, but White/Silver/Black I can agree with. :specool:


That "all silver" build would look even better with a Headkiller full copper/nickel block.


----------



## gtbtk

For some time there has been a general assumption that Windows 7 is faster on zen based CPUs than Windows 10.

It seems that Windows 10, at least now on an 1950X, may actually be a bit faster. I thought that this was interesting.


----------



## Tamalero

gtbtk said:


> For some time there has been a general assumption that Windows 7 is faster on zen based CPUs than Windows 10.
> 
> It seems that Windows 10, at least now on an 1950X, may actually be a bit faster. I thought that this was interesting.
> 
> https://youtu.be/8pCFf4vQfUA


Could this be also blamed on drivers?


----------



## SwitchFX

For video cards or the drivers MS is holding back on Ryzen and newer Intel processors due to W7 being "vintage"?


----------



## gtbtk

Tamalero said:


> Could this be also blamed on drivers?


It is quite possible that the windows 10 improvements have come with a bit more maturity for the Ryzen\TR platforms


----------



## gtbtk

SwitchFX said:


> For video cards or the drivers MS is holding back on Ryzen and newer Intel processors due to W7 being "vintage"?


6 months or so ago, Win 7 installations on Ryzen were measurably faster in benchmarks. I dont think this is unexpected. MS is no longer supporting win 7


----------



## Simmons572

KyadCK said:


> And joined. 1950X on a x399 Designare with 8x8GB running at 2933 16-18-18 because ram predated TR's existence, woo. At least my max temps are 45C since I haven't OC'd yet.
> 
> Minimalist I am not, but White/Silver/Black I can agree with. :specool:


Great looking build mate! 

Correct me if I am wrong, but are your front fans exhausting our the front?


----------



## ht_addict

Anyone have their 1950x at 4Ghz and memory at 3600mhz?


----------



## xkm1948

Maybe a stupid question. The workstation I built will not be overclocked. Should I still install RyZen Master?


----------



## Minotaurtoo

xkm1948 said:


> Maybe a stupid question. The workstation I built will not be overclocked. Should I still install RyZen Master?


I would say no... I don't use it anyway even when overclocking...


----------



## MNMadman

xkm1948 said:


> Maybe a stupid question. The workstation I built will not be overclocked. Should I still install RyZen Master?


I will not be using it on my new 1950X build. Other monitoring tools will be used instead.


----------



## OrionBG

xkm1948 said:


> Maybe a stupid question. The workstation I built will not be overclocked. Should I still install RyZen Master?


I wouldn't recommend it unless you will be playing games. The only useful thing in Ryzen Master is the ability to switch to Game Mode and back to Creative Mode (or whatever the name was).



ht_addict said:


> Anyone have their 1950x at 4Ghz and memory at 3600mhz?


Mine is at 4GHz, but with 3200Mhz RAM (4 sticks x 16GB). The only thing I did was to enable the XMP profile.


----------



## Heidi

Guys...I am using 4k monitor....40" of it...but Ryzen Master shows fonts like to be seen right from the next seat to the Starman...how can I rectify that?


----------



## Martin778

Put together my 1950X + X399 Fatal1ty rig yesterday, the 7920X and Apex went back to their original boxes. 
So far so good, loaded XMP, set CPU to 4.0 1.35V - runs rock stable. 

The temps are amazing, I'm using an Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 and TG Kryonaut.


----------



## OrionBG

Martin778 said:


> Put together my 1950X + X399 Fatal1ty rig yesterday, the 7920X and Apex went back to their original boxes.
> So far so good, loaded XMP, set CPU to 4.0 1.35V - runs rock stable.
> 
> The temps are amazing, I'm using an Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 and TG Kryonaut.


Can you share some temps after lets say 30 minutes of Prime or something else that uses AVX?


----------



## KyadCK

Simmons572 said:


> Great looking build mate!
> 
> Correct me if I am wrong, but are your front fans exhausting our the front?


Thank you! 

Yup, and the rear out the back. All the radiators are intakes, so 4x120mm in, 3x140mm out when I bother to leave the door on.


----------



## Simmons572

KyadCK said:


> Thank you!
> 
> Yup, and the rear out the back. All the radiators are intakes, so 4x120mm in, 3x140mm out when I bother to leave the door on.


Ah, understood! That's a lot more balanced then what I was thinking.


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> Maybe a stupid question. The workstation I built will not be overclocked. Should I still install RyZen Master?


I dont think you need it, unless you plan on changing core options and memory modes for compatibility purposes.

if you wanted monitoring, there is better software around.


----------



## ht_addict

OrionBG said:


> Can you share some temps after lets say 30 minutes of Prime or something else that uses AVX?


Who cares about Prime or AVX. Run Cinebench, Realbench or other software that mimics daily use of the CPU. Who sits at the screen for hours on end watching Prime95 run. I personally play games or bench.


----------



## OrionBG

ht_addict said:


> Who cares about Prime or AVX. Run Cinebench, Realbench or other software that mimics daily use of the CPU. Who sits at the screen for hours on end watching Prime95 run. I personally play games or bench.


Actually it is quite important!
To saturate a water cooler and see how it actually performs, you need sustained heat for at least 30 minutes so that the system can equalize. The best way to pump some hear is a stress test that uses AVX instructions. Many programs are using AVX these days, Handbrake for instance... Also, not many people are buying Threadripper systems to only play games on them...
Regarding Cinebench and Realbench... CB15 usually is over before my fans even have the time to spin up. Realbench is a little bit longer but still not taxing enough to heat up the water cooler to its max.
For instance, my custom loop that consists of 240 and 360 45mm rads and cools both my CPU and GPU, keeps them quite cool under normal use and in trivial things like CB15 the CPU gets around 60C - 64C, but prime heats it to 71C - 73C. As you can see this is almost 10C difference and I have a lot of rad surface.
Here is one quite real life scenario: Rendering a 3D video with Handbrake... Those can take hours to complete depending on the complexity and length of the video... (and this is a lot more probable workload scenario for a Threadripper system than playing games)

I just wanted to know how those Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 units perform...


----------



## betam4x

*Threadripper Fun*

So I found out why my CPU was throttling to 550 MHz...I'll get to that soon, first, let me show you this, and NO before you ask, the CPU did not actually reach the 6.133 GHz/sec speed...At least I hope not. lol. Still pretty hilarious, because Each time I do it, I get an obscene max clock speed....more info on my particular problem in my next post.


----------



## betam4x

So, I had posted earlier that my CPU has having throttling issues. Half the cores would throttle to 550 MHz when voltages reached a certain point. It didn't make any sense whatsoever, because the voltages in question could be as low as 1.4375V. Clock speed was independent, temps weren't even close to what could be considered hot, etc.. I could set the VCORE to 1.4375 and the clock speed to 3.4 GHz and still get throttled. I was getting rather annoyed, and at one point I accidentally got the problem to go away. I could not remember how to reproduce this, but then I stumbled onto something rather interesting. First, I installed Ryzen master (I was on a new Windows install, and since MSI has actually made their BIOS half usable, I never bothered with Ryzen master after that)...then I was poking around in settings and found a setting for disabling PROCHOT. Now some of you may know about PROCHOT, especially if you've used certain Intel CPUs. On some Intel platforms, if a CPU issues PROCHOT, you will experience what is known as microthrottling. I.e. your CPU throttles, but it does so fast you won't notice...and a faster overclock may *appear* to succeed when it actually does not. On my particular MSI board and threadripper however, PROCHOT acts differently. The temps change too fast for HWInfo to read, the CPU issues PROCHOT (probably on a per ccx or per-die basis based on my research) and half the cores throttle to 550 MHz. If this was all there was to it, that would be great, but I've been doing a bit more digging, and I suspect that prochot actually plays a role in base/boost speeds on a normally clocked threadripper. If you try to disable PROCHOT on a system that isn't overclocked, you'll find that it tells you you can't...what's even more interesting is this:

1) With a fixed clockspeed like 4.0 GHz @ 1.25V, I can run any benchmark I want, I can even run prime95. No throttling. Results are the same. Temps stay well within normal operating ranges.
2) If I keep the clockspeed/voltages the same, but disable the PROCHOT signal, benchmark results stay the same, but temps warm up quicker and eventually end up getting higher than stock....so just what the hell is going on here? Is this an MSI bug?

I don't claim to be a master overclocker, but I DO know how to overclock a chip. I've had my 2600k at 5 GHz for years, and I know my way around BIOS settings, etc. I'm also a developer and I'm attempting to work on software based PState overclocking. However, I've not really seen any input like this. Anyone have any idea?

Oh and one more thing. If I don't disable PROCHOT, the system is stable as hell for 99% of all workloads, and benchmarks do NOT suffer. However, if I disable PROCHOT, certain benchmarks crash the system. I thought that maybe without throttling, the chip was overheating, but I found a balance point where the chip would heat up just below the thermal lockup point (I'll have to find out where that was later, after all my experimentation I had to take my machine apart to fix a fan issue) and there weren't any differences in the benchmark results. This tells me that there isn't any microthrottling going on, and I can actually provide this....raising clock speeds without disabling PROCHOT will cause benchmarks to complete faster. Disabling prochot will not make the benchmarks complete any faster.

I am open to any thoughts here, as I've said, I'm not an enthusiast. The interesting thing to me is that all those folks that claimed to be getting threadripper to 5+ ghz using LN2 may actually be getting fooled by PROCHOT. With PROCHOT enabled, CPU-Z, for example, does NOT throttle. The CPU-Z benchmark does NOT take all cores to 100% either. If one has an MSI X399 carbon board, the easiest way to tell if the system is being affected is to open up hwinfo64, lower the polling speeds to minimum (don't forget to click the set button) and then run Prime95 on the maximum heat settings. If you are affected, your minimums will drop to 550 MHz. I've tracked this across 4 different BIOS versions. Oh, and for what it's worth, there is nothing wrong with NOT disabling PROCHOT unless you are are the type to regularly load all 32 threads to 100%. You can push your chip as high as your want and you'll still get better performance....even in Cinebench.

I'm welcome to any thoughts, just please, no more flaming. It seems like some folks on here are closed minded and don't want new members. IMO if all you can do is attack someone personally, the mods should politely remove you until you can calm down. We all visit this forum for the same reasons.

EDIT: And to be clear, it's **** like this that is why i bring up the importance of LLC, etc. LLC, depending on it's level and the board, can heat up the VRMs or the CPUs, so it all ends up being a balancing act. It all comes into play. Out of all the research I did, even speaking with some of the top overclockers in the world, NOBODY knew why my board was throttling. Thanks to figuring out this little tidbit, I've been able to inch my clocks upwards. Once I'm done tinkering I'm going to give you guys the end result, and if you'd like, I can even do a video.

EDIT: Oh and I have various reasons for thinking thaat AMD is using prochot to control Precision boost (namely because it behaves exactly as I expect it to on my board...throttles when a certain die is too high, and then there is the whole offset temp thing...). If that's the case, it's a very poor way of handling things. I hear that Precision boost 2.0 is a gem...let's hope so. If this is the case, the 2xxx series of desktop processors could end up being significantly faster than the first gen zen chips even if the IPC gains aren't that great.


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> So, I had posted earlier that my CPU has having throttling issues. ...



Just a random thought here... It may be possible that at some point with that high voltage (1.4375V), the CPUs Power limit (TDP) is reached (or the VRM power limit) and the system is killing one of the CCXes to get back in the max TDP allowed. On the AsRock Taichi there is even a switch that disables the PROCHOT and according to the manual this allows higher overclock...


----------



## Minotaurtoo

OrionBG said:


> Just a random thought here... It may be possible that at some point with that high voltage (1.4375V), the CPUs Power limit (TDP) is reached (or the VRM power limit) and the system is killing one of the CCXes to get back in the max TDP allowed. On the AsRock Taichi there is even a switch that disables the PROCHOT and according to the manual this allows higher overclock...


I've actually wondered about this before with Ryzen... on my 1700 system in particular... but so far I've seen no throttling on it...ever actually... even when pushing it well past double the tdp... but it does sound like a power limit problem to me... I had an issue like that before on a MSI board with one of the old FX 8150's I overclocked... up to 1.4v all was good... past that it would start throttling under load even though temps were grand everywhere.... eventually the vrm's on that board literally burnt... went to ASUS boards and haven't had either issue since... to be fair though it was a cheap MSI board.


----------



## nycgtr

Apparently I get my new EK cold plate on monday. The revised version. Will post pics and hopefully results as taking that rig apart is painful


----------



## gupsterg

betam4x said:


> So I found out why my CPU was throttling to 550 MHz...I'll get to that soon, first, let me show you this, and NO before you ask, the CPU did not actually reach the 6.133 GHz/sec speed...At least I hope not. lol. Still pretty hilarious, because Each time I do it, I get an obscene max clock speed....more info on my particular problem in my next post.


Ryzen/Threadripper does not have HW for accurate BCLK measurement, see either one of below links and set HWINFO correctly.

i) in OP of this thread, section The base-clock (BCLK) > Readings of BCLK in monitoring SW
ii) in OP of this thread, section Known issues/Workarounds > Readings of BCLK in monitoring SW



nycgtr said:


> Apparently I get my new EK cold plate on monday. The revised version. Will post pics and hopefully results as taking that rig apart is painful


Sweet, this is for EK Monoblock? are they giving FOC to EK standard TR block owners as well?


----------



## nycgtr

gupsterg said:


> Ryzen/Threadripper does not have HW for accurate BCLK measurement, see either one of below links and set HWINFO correctly.
> 
> i) in OP of this thread, section The base-clock (BCLK) > Readings of BCLK in monitoring SW
> ii) in OP of this thread, section Known issues/Workarounds > Readings of BCLK in monitoring SW
> 
> 
> 
> Sweet, this is for EK Monoblock? are they giving FOC to EK standard TR block owners as well?


it's the same plate on the block and mono.


----------



## gupsterg

nycgtr said:


> it's the same plate on the block and mono.


Yes aware of that from:-

i) comparing images.
ii) your video on YT comparing both.

All I wish to know is did they give updated cold plate to you as you have monoblock or as standard block owner?

As you know I have standard block, if they gave to you as standard block owner then it's worth my time raising a ticket with them, otherwise I'll let it go as I have the Bykski A-Ryzen-ThV2-X winging it's way from China to UK  .


----------



## nycgtr

gupsterg said:


> Yes aware of that from:-
> 
> i) comparing images.
> ii) your video on YT comparing both.
> 
> All I wish to know is did they give updated cold plate to you as you have monoblock or as standard block owner?
> 
> As you know I have standard block, if they gave to you as standard block owner then it's worth my time raising a ticket with them, otherwise I'll let it go as I have the Bykski A-Ryzen-ThV2-X winging it's way from China to UK  .


Anyone who purchased a tr block from EKWB direct before nov 28 I think it is. They shipped it to me using free post/ but ended up being express for reasons I don't know lol. IF you purchased it elsewhere, like PPCS you can contact their rma department and see what they can do. They might be able to get them from EK


----------



## gupsterg

nycgtr said:


> Anyone who purchased a tr block from EKWB direct before nov 28 I think it is. They shipped it to me using free post/ but ended up being express for reasons I don't know lol. IF you purchased it elsewhere, like PPCS you can contact their rma department and see what they can do. They might be able to get them from EK


Thanks for info, I'm in the UK, I pre-ordered with OCuk on 21/08/17 and received 06/09/17. I doubt OCuk would do anything, I'll drop EK an email as HW rep on OCN hasn't given me an update when I asked on forum several days ago.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> So, I had posted earlier that my CPU has having throttling issues. Half the cores would throttle to 550 MHz when voltages reached a certain point. It didn't make any sense whatsoever, because the voltages in question could be as low as 1.4375V. Clock speed was independent, temps weren't even close to what could be considered hot, etc.. I could set the VCORE to 1.4375 and the clock speed to 3.4 GHz and still get throttled. I was getting rather annoyed, and at one point I accidentally got the problem to go away. I could not remember how to reproduce this, but then I stumbled onto something rather interesting. First, I installed Ryzen master (I was on a new Windows install, and since MSI has actually made their BIOS half usable, I never bothered with Ryzen master after that)...then I was poking around in settings and found a setting for disabling PROCHOT. Now some of you may know about PROCHOT, especially if you've used certain Intel CPUs. On some Intel platforms, if a CPU issues PROCHOT, you will experience what is known as microthrottling. I.e. your CPU throttles, but it does so fast you won't notice...and a faster overclock may *appear* to succeed when it actually does not. On my particular MSI board and threadripper however, PROCHOT acts differently. The temps change too fast for HWInfo to read, the CPU issues PROCHOT (probably on a per ccx or per-die basis based on my research) and half the cores throttle to 550 MHz. If this was all there was to it, that would be great, but I've been doing a bit more digging, and I suspect that prochot actually plays a role in base/boost speeds on a normally clocked threadripper. If you try to disable PROCHOT on a system that isn't overclocked, you'll find that it tells you you can't...what's even more interesting is this:
> 
> 1) With a fixed clockspeed like 4.0 GHz @ 1.25V, I can run any benchmark I want, I can even run prime95. No throttling. Results are the same. Temps stay well within normal operating ranges.
> 2) If I keep the clockspeed/voltages the same, but disable the PROCHOT signal, benchmark results stay the same, but temps warm up quicker and eventually end up getting higher than stock....so just what the hell is going on here? Is this an MSI bug?
> 
> I don't claim to be a master overclocker, but I DO know how to overclock a chip. I've had my 2600k at 5 GHz for years, and I know my way around BIOS settings, etc. I'm also a developer and I'm attempting to work on software based PState overclocking. However, I've not really seen any input like this. Anyone have any idea?
> 
> Oh and one more thing. If I don't disable PROCHOT, the system is stable as hell for 99% of all workloads, and benchmarks do NOT suffer. However, if I disable PROCHOT, certain benchmarks crash the system. I thought that maybe without throttling, the chip was overheating, but I found a balance point where the chip would heat up just below the thermal lockup point (I'll have to find out where that was later, after all my experimentation I had to take my machine apart to fix a fan issue) and there weren't any differences in the benchmark results. This tells me that there isn't any microthrottling going on, and I can actually provide this....raising clock speeds without disabling PROCHOT will cause benchmarks to complete faster. Disabling prochot will not make the benchmarks complete any faster.
> 
> I am open to any thoughts here, as I've said, I'm not an enthusiast. The interesting thing to me is that all those folks that claimed to be getting threadripper to 5+ ghz using LN2 may actually be getting fooled by PROCHOT. With PROCHOT enabled, CPU-Z, for example, does NOT throttle. The CPU-Z benchmark does NOT take all cores to 100% either. If one has an MSI X399 carbon board, the easiest way to tell if the system is being affected is to open up hwinfo64, lower the polling speeds to minimum (don't forget to click the set button) and then run Prime95 on the maximum heat settings. If you are affected, your minimums will drop to 550 MHz. I've tracked this across 4 different BIOS versions. Oh, and for what it's worth, there is nothing wrong with NOT disabling PROCHOT unless you are are the type to regularly load all 32 threads to 100%. You can push your chip as high as your want and you'll still get better performance....even in Cinebench.
> 
> I'm welcome to any thoughts, just please, no more flaming. It seems like some folks on here are closed minded and don't want new members. IMO if all you can do is attack someone personally, the mods should politely remove you until you can calm down. We all visit this forum for the same reasons.
> 
> EDIT: And to be clear, it's **** like this that is why i bring up the importance of LLC, etc. LLC, depending on it's level and the board, can heat up the VRMs or the CPUs, so it all ends up being a balancing act. It all comes into play. Out of all the research I did, even speaking with some of the top overclockers in the world, NOBODY knew why my board was throttling. Thanks to figuring out this little tidbit, I've been able to inch my clocks upwards. Once I'm done tinkering I'm going to give you guys the end result, and if you'd like, I can even do a video.
> 
> EDIT: Oh and I have various reasons for thinking thaat AMD is using prochot to control Precision boost (namely because it behaves exactly as I expect it to on my board...throttles when a certain die is too high, and then there is the whole offset temp thing...). If that's the case, it's a very poor way of handling things. I hear that Precision boost 2.0 is a gem...let's hope so. If this is the case, the 2xxx series of desktop processors could end up being significantly faster than the first gen zen chips even if the IPC gains aren't that great.


1.4V is pretty high, not sure why you claim "very low".
You should only need like 1.35V to reach 4Ghz or even less.

And no surprise its throttling. What are your tdie temps? or you were testing the max voltage your chip could handle?



Remember, you're talking about 16 CORES.. that need a huge amount of power (200+watts), the VRMS do get hot indeed.. in some mobos.. blistering hot...


----------



## ht_addict

OrionBG said:


> Actually it is quite important!
> To saturate a water cooler and see how it actually performs, you need sustained heat for at least 30 minutes so that the system can equalize. The best way to pump some hear is a stress test that uses AVX instructions. Many programs are using AVX these days, Handbrake for instance... Also, not many people are buying Threadripper systems to only play games on them...
> Regarding Cinebench and Realbench... CB15 usually is over before my fans even have the time to spin up. Realbench is a little bit longer but still not taxing enough to heat up the water cooler to its max.
> For instance, my custom loop that consists of 240 and 360 45mm rads and cools both my CPU and GPU, keeps them quite cool under normal use and in trivial things like CB15 the CPU gets around 60C - 64C, but prime heats it to 71C - 73C. As you can see this is almost 10C difference and I have a lot of rad surface.
> Here is one quite real life scenario: Rendering a 3D video with Handbrake... Those can take hours to complete depending on the complexity and length of the video... (and this is a lot more probable workload scenario for a Threadripper system than playing games)
> 
> I just wanted to know how those Enermax Liqtech TR4 360 units perform...


I understand Prime95 causes increased heat into the system, but as I mentioned, Prime95 is not a true indication of everyday use of our systems. It's like driving my car at the red line for hours on end and seeing what happens, yet I don't drive my car that way on a daily basis. And I'm pretty sure most people who use their computer for important work aren't overclocking. Have you tried that Gooseberry rendering benchmark? What kind ofvtemperagures do you get?


----------



## Tamalero

ht_addict said:


> I understand Prime95 causes increased heat into the system, but as I mentioned, Prime95 is not a true indication of everyday use of our systems. It's like driving my car at the red line for hours on end and seeing what happens, yet I don't drive my car that way on a daily basis.  And I'm pretty sure most people who use their computer for important work aren't overclocking. Have you tried that Gooseberry rendering benchmark? What kind ofvtemperagures do you get?


Pretty that is not the point of testing using PRIME and other torture tools.

They are used to test the MAXIMUM and WORST conditions possible for the processor.. a truly test of stability and survival.

If they pass the worst of worst conditions, they can breeze normal loads.

Sometimes even if you "test" stability using normal benches or tests.. another load could hit a bad spot in the processor, ram.. imc..etc.. and make it crash thus the settings were NOT stable.


----------



## ht_addict

Tamalero said:


> Pretty that is not the point of testing using PRIME and other torture tools.
> 
> They are used to test the MAXIMUM and WORST conditions possible for the processor.. a truly test of stability and survival.
> 
> If they pass the worst of worst conditions, they can breeze normal loads.
> 
> Sometimes even if you "test" stability using normal benches or tests.. another load could hit a bad spot in the processor, ram.. imc..etc.. and make it crash thus the settings were NOT stable.


And I can run Prime and pass then crash using something else to test. Also running Prime isn't just taxing the CPU, it taxes the components of the motherboard. Unless you can remove them from the equation we can't say for certain the instability of a CPU is from the CPU alone or the motherboard unable to keep things stable.


----------



## Tamalero

ht_addict said:


> And I can run Prime and pass then crash using something else to test.


Like what?



ht_addict said:


> Also running Prime isn't just taxing the CPU, it taxes the components of the motherboard. Unless you can remove them from the equation we can't say for certain the instability of a CPU is from the CPU alone or the motherboard unable to keep things stable.


Isnt that the point of using it as a tool to test overclocking?
Like I said before, torture tools = test the worst case scenario.

Some games and some benches do not even load the cpu or ram fully.

Interesting how a defacto torture tool is suddenly a "no no". Something that I started to notice in this forum.


----------



## gtbtk

OrionBG said:


> I wouldn't recommend it unless you will be playing games. The only useful thing in Ryzen Master is the ability to switch to Game Mode and back to Creative Mode (or whatever the name was).
> 
> 
> 
> Mine is at 4GHz, but with 3200Mhz RAM (4 sticks x 16GB). The only thing I did was to enable the XMP profile.


Rather than Game, Uma and Numa modes that lock you in to one or the other at any given time, You would be much better served running a process manager application that can be used to set CPU affinity rules for each of your applications. After you have configured the rules for an application, the utility automatically applies those rules to the application every time you run it making it set and forget. 

Actively Managing Threads does give good performance befits for those applications that prefer SMT off or ensuring games run their threads as close to the PCIe Controller that is connected to the GPU in use as possible. You can tailor its behavior to work around the quirks of each of the applications you have and run them in similar environments to the AMD "Modes" all without having to reboot or run software that is digging around in your EFI Boot partition. For games, you could set the CPU affinity for the game executable to only use the primary cores on die0 for example while setting the rules for handbrake to access all cores when you are rendering a video. The tool can also be used for managing process priority as well if you want. Handy if you are crazy about Cinebench r15 benchmarks.

This is a simple to use and rock solid utility that can be run as a portable application without the need to install anything. https://www.bill2-software.com/processmanager/download-en.shtml. The first run will be in French but click the options button and you can change it to English easily.

Process Lasso is another one that does basically the same thing with a few extras and a little more polish but it is a commercial, paid app.


----------



## ht_addict

Tamalero said:


> Like what?
> 
> 
> 
> Isnt that the point of using it as a tool to test overclocking?
> Like I said before, torture tools = test the worst case scenario.
> 
> Some games and some benches do not even load the cpu or ram fully.
> 
> Interesting how a defacto torture tool is suddenly a "no no". Something that I started to notice in this forum.


You said it when you mentioned torture. People are using a tool that does not truly represent what we use our systems for on a daily basis. Not to mention you can't rule out the external factors(motherboard compenents, RAM, etc). Anyone of those could make the CPU unstable. Doesn't mean the CPU's unstable. That's why I prefer Realbench, Gooseberry, 3DMark or just straight gaming.


----------



## betam4x

ht_addict said:


> You said it when you mentioned torture. People are using a tool that does not truly represent what we use our systems for on a daily basis. Not to mention you can't rule out the external factors(motherboard compenents, RAM, etc). Anyone of those could make the CPU unstable. Doesn't mean the CPU's unstable. That's why I prefer Realbench, Gooseberry, 3DMark or just straight gaming.


I logged in and saw this comment. Prime95 is absolutely essential for testing. It's not about 'torturing' the CPU or checking that the temps stay in line. It's about ensuring that the CPU is functioning correctly. If the CPU calculates an incorrect prime, that means the CPU is not functioning correctly. That doesn't just mean it won't function correctly under load, it also means that it will occasionally not function correctly at idle. This means that you could end up with anything from corrupt data to incorrect results on complex applications. I always recommend running an entire suite of tests before claiming any CPU is stable. Yes, keeping the CPU is hard to do (especially something like threadripper), but it is not impossible, and your future self will thank you.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

ht_addict said:


> You said it when you mentioned torture. People are using a tool that does not truly represent what we use our systems for on a daily basis. Not to mention you can't rule out the external factors(motherboard compenents, RAM, etc). Anyone of those could make the CPU unstable. Doesn't mean the CPU's unstable. That's why I prefer Realbench, Gooseberry, 3DMark or just straight gaming.


stability is somewhat of a pipe dream... nothing is ever truly stable as any cpu/ram/ssd has an expected error rate even at stock... that's why servers are so over built and have ecc ram... so that being said stability is relative to what you desire... for most of us we like to be sure that our system can handle pretty much anything that can be thrown at it... gaming and benchmarks are NOT good methods to test for stability... underlying errors that don't necessarily show on the surface can actually cause your OS to slowly degrade and over time become non-functional... that being said, any given torture test does NOT adequately test all possible areas of instability either... 

Conclusion... torture tests alone are not going to give you a complete picture as to whether or not you are stable... but it is better than benchmarks as it will test those "external factors" you mention... those are important... over time software and games become more demanding and there is an ever increasing load on hardware... testing by games and benchmarks only will not adequately test if you system can remain stable under prolonged heavy loads... vrm's, ram, thermals and all have to be able to keep up for the system to be stable... that is why torture tests must be a part of stability testing. 

If you don't want to torture test, that's your business... personally I don't care... I've been guilty of running bench only stable systems before.... I could bench my 8150 years ago at 5 ghz, and play games just fine on it... but one day it was doing a big OS update and burnt the vrm's out on the board... lesson learned. if I had torture tested and watched the vrm temps as I do now, I'd known I had an issue before that happened... 

We are just trying to help, not attack you for what you are doing... but we know what can happen, we have been there, we have seen it... just trying to help that is all.

I recommend IBT/AVX (veryhigh 20runs), OCCT (linepack test is my fav), Prime 95 (custom set to 3/4 of ram capacity) and memtest.... running all of those along with doing benchmarks and game tests should provide an adequate test to see if you pc can hold up for the long haul.

If all you want is to play games and get the best bench scores, and don't care if your OS/data gets corrupted, then by all means ignore this... otherwise you may want to reconsider.


----------



## betam4x

So as a recap, overclocking this chip to 4.2 GHz has been a cooling issue. However, it's not a 'cooler' cooling issue. Components in the CPU appear to be heating up so fast that PROCHOT gets sent to the board, and then either an individual CCX or an entire die gets throttled to 550Mhz (caveat below). This MSI board has bios options to allow you disable entire dies or individual CCXes (except you can't choose which ones to disable unfortunately). With that in mind I am currently stress testing 1 die for stability, and tweaking my LLC settings, etc. Next steps:

1) I ordered 6 Noctua 3000 RPM fans from Amazon. They will be here monday. When I get the fans, i'm going to set them to full speeds. Why? I want to see if a couple degrees lower keeps PROCHOT from getting fired off. These fans will also help me with future fun, like my upcoming 4.4GHz benchmarks (without prime95 validation unfortunately, to hit 4.4GHz at THAT level of stability the CPU needs a ridiculous 1.625V as far as I can tell)

2) In the meantime, I'm tuning the 4.2 GHz/voltage limit/LLC settings a bit more The goal is to tweak power settings to the point where the CPU is at it's lowest possible temp while not raising the VCORE too much (I'm fine with 1.425V for 4.2, but I may be able to do better...)

3) After the single die settings, I want to enable 12 cores across 2 dies in 6+6 configuration and try the test with the config I am using for the single die configuration and see if PROCHOT fires off.

4) When I get the fans, I'll turn them up to 100% and see if they can cool quickly enough. If that happens, I will end up with a stable 4.2 with all cores with no throttling...oh and after that comes 4.3.

That being said, there is a lot AMD can do here to improve thermal performance, and I'm not talking about die shrinks. I hope that the 12nm refresh resolves some of these issues. Based on my extensive testing of this chip, it has a very primitive way of dealing with high voltages, temps, etc. in general and I believe that so much more can be done...even without changing the node to begin with.


----------



## ht_addict

betam4x said:


> I logged in and saw this comment. Prime95 is absolutely essential for testing. It's not about 'torturing' the CPU or checking that the temps stay in line. It's about ensuring that the CPU is functioning correctly. If the CPU calculates an incorrect prime, that means the CPU is not functioning correctly. That doesn't just mean it won't function correctly under load, it also means that it will occasionally not function correctly at idle. This means that you could end up with anything from corrupt data to incorrect results on complex applications. I always recommend running an entire suite of tests before claiming any CPU is stable. Yes, keeping the CPU is hard to do (especially something like threadripper), but it is not impossible, and your future self will thank you.


But you are torturing the CPU and you are sending temperatures to levels we don't see on day to day operations. On Prime my Threadripper can take upwards of 1.4v+ to maintain 4Ghz and be stable, yet at 1.3625v can be stable on Realbench, Gooseberry, benchmarks or gaming and day to day use, while crashing in Prime95. I even scan my disks weekly to ensure no issues. None found.


----------



## betam4x

ht_addict said:


> But you are torturing the CPU and you are sending temperatures to levels we don't see on day to day operations. On Prime my Threadripper can take upwards of 1.4v+ to maintain 4Ghz and be stable, yet at 1.3625v can be stable on Realbench, Gooseberry, benchmarks or gaming and day to day use, while crashing in Prime95. I even scan my disks weekly to ensure no issues. None found.


Oh I don't mean disk corruption. I mean DATA corruption. Scanning your disk won't uncover that. Prime95 issues don't pop up because the system is under load, prime95 issues pop up because the system isn't operating correctly. Placing it under load and doing it as fast as possibly simply ensures that errors are found in a timely manner. Instead of taking 3 weeks to find out the hard way that your CPU isn't working properly, it lets you find out in 24 or less. Edit: and I'll also add that if you ever ended up with some type of virus or something that used your CPU for something like XMR mining...and it happened only when you weren't using your computer, you could end up with full CPU load and quickly cook your CPU. It's better to make sure you have proper cooling to begin with. A simple 240mm AIO works just fine for cooling that voltage even under Prime95.


----------



## Tamalero

ht_addict said:


> You said it when you mentioned torture. People are using a tool that does not truly represent what we use our systems for on a daily basis. Not to mention you can't rule out the external factors(motherboard compenents, RAM, etc). Anyone of those could make the CPU unstable. Doesn't mean the CPU's unstable. That's why I prefer Realbench, Gooseberry, 3DMark or just straight gaming.


You're contradicting yourself.

3d mark and gaming also puts the strain on the motherboard, ram and graphic cards.

Also, I didnt said PRIME alone for testing. You're suddenly focusing exclusively on PRIME.




betam4x said:


> Oh I don't mean disk corruption. I mean DATA corruption. Scanning your disk won't uncover that. Prime95 issues don't pop up because the system is under load, prime95 issues pop up because the system isn't operating correctly. Placing it under load and doing it as fast as possibly simply ensures that errors are found in a timely manner. Instead of taking 3 weeks to find out the hard way that your CPU isn't working properly, it lets you find out in 24 or less. Edit: and I'll also add that if you ever ended up with some type of virus or something that used your CPU for something like XMR mining...and it happened only when you weren't using your computer, you could end up with full CPU load and quickly cook your CPU. It's better to make sure you have proper cooling to begin with. A simple 240mm AIO works just fine for cooling that voltage even under Prime95.




Agree.




ht_addict said:


> But you are torturing the CPU and you are sending temperatures to levels we don't see on day to day operations. On Prime my Threadripper can take upwards of 1.4v+ to maintain 4Ghz and be stable, yet at 1.3625v can be stable on Realbench, Gooseberry, benchmarks or gaming and day to day use, while crashing in Prime95. I even scan my disks weekly to ensure no issues. None found.



You're again missing the point. You're not testing the "day to day" operations. You're testing the worst of the worst cases (thats the definition of a torture test). If a computer passes these kind of torture tests, it shows that there is a level of stability. Both good for testing if a system crashes and you need to dial back a bit or if you need better cooling solutions for your system.

Technically machines like the threadripper arent for casual everyday "gaming". They are workhorses. Gaming will not stress it very well compared to play, stream and have some rendering done in the background in the other CCX AT SAME TIME.
IF your system crashes with Prime, it will CRASH if youre doing such crossload type workload that uses 100% of the cpu to the max.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

he'll figure it out in time... when windows starts having random blue screens and drivers start crashing... let him go and learn on his own... 

for the record, I don't have threadripper, I am on a 1700 clocked to 3.9... it will run 4ghz through benchmarks at the same volts it takes to get 3.9 stable... but I made complete turd out of my temporary OS install playing with various overclocks and ram timings... once I found what was stable then I reinstalled windows and such... it only took 3 days of testing out stuff to bork up windows pretty bad lol... and all I did was test clocks! guess it was all the reboots on unstable clocks

one quick question... I asked this in the 1700(x)/1800(x) owners club and got a huge array of answers, does anyone know for sure what the max safe voltage is for 24/7 running... I'm looking to keep this rig for at least till the 7nm versions come out. currently I'm running 1.4v for 3.9 and temps are good, on full custom loop... even testing 4ghz at 1.48 it never got to 70C


----------



## ht_addict

Tamalero said:


> You're contradicting yourself.
> 
> 3d mark and gaming also puts the strain on the motherboard, ram and graphic cards.
> 
> Also, I didnt said PRIME alone for testing. You're suddenly focusing exclusively on PRIME.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agree.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're again missing the point. You're not testing the "day to day" operations. You're testing the worst of the worst cases (thats the definition of a torture test). If a computer passes these kind of torture tests, it shows that there is a level of stability. Both good for testing if a system crashes and you need to dial back a bit or if you need better cooling solutions for your system.
> 
> Technically machines like the threadripper arent for casual everyday "gaming". They are workhorses. Gaming will not stress it very well compared to play, stream and have some rendering done in the background in the other CCX AT SAME TIME.
> IF your system crashes with Prime, it will CRASH if youre doing such crossload type workload that uses 100% of the cpu to the max.


Actually I'm not contradicting myself. Prime max's out the cores at 100%. This causes the system to put strain on the components of the motherboard feeding it. Any one of those components can falter feeding the CPU and you get instability. When it comes to benchmarks or other more day to day realistic tests, they fluctuate the CPU load. This puts less strain on the motherboard components than Prime would. Less likely that mothetboard components come in too play when testing. People want to mess with their CPU burning it with Prime. Enjoy.


----------



## ht_addict

Minotaurtoo said:


> he'll figure it out in time... when windows starts having random blue screens and drivers start crashing... let him go and learn on his own...
> 
> for the record, I don't have threadripper, I am on a 1700 clocked to 3.9... it will run 4ghz through benchmarks at the same volts it takes to get 3.9 stable... but I made complete turd out of my temporary OS install playing with various overclocks and ram timings... once I found what was stable then I reinstalled windows and such... it only took 3 days of testing out stuff to bork up windows pretty bad lol... and all I did was test clocks! guess it was all the reboots on unstable clocks
> 
> one quick question... I asked this in the 1700(x)/1800(x) owners club and got a huge array of answers, does anyone know for sure what the max safe voltage is for 24/7 running... I'm looking to keep this rig for at least till the 7nm versions come out. currently I'm running 1.4v for 3.9 and temps are good, on full custom loop... even testing 4ghz at 1.48 it never got to 70C


Windows can bork itself up with or without overclocking. Rather take my chances with that than running my CPU full out, taking it to its thermal limits, maybe degrading it with Prime95.


----------



## Tamalero

ht_addict said:


> Actually I'm not contradicting myself. Prime max's out the cores at 100%. This causes the system to put strain on the components of the motherboard feeding it. Any one of those components can falter feeding the CPU and you get instability. When it comes to benchmarks or other more day to day realistic tests, they fluctuate the CPU load. This puts less strain on the motherboard components than Prime would. Less likely that mothetboard components come in too play when testing. People want to mess with their CPU burning it with Prime. Enjoy.


Again, read the whole thing not small bits.. you're not getting the point.

You know what, nevermind.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

ht_addict said:


> Windows can bork itself up with or without overclocking. Rather take my chances with that than running my CPU full out, taking it to its thermal limits, maybe degrading it with Prime95.


never had it bork itself up on its own...always either me, bad hardware or a virus... and never had prime degrade windows or my hardware.... but its your choice... you've been told the facts, you choose your path.. no worries. just know we have been there done that and know the potential issues... if you choose to ignore it, you will either get lucky or learn the hard way.... 

here's wishing you good luck :thumb:


----------



## Minotaurtoo

here is something you should consider running if your cpu can't pass prime at the voltage you are using... this simply scans for issues with windows core files. when I was testing on a temp OS install this revealed nearly 70 errors that had occurred over 3 days of trying various OC settings... I think it was really the memory timings that caused it more than cpu, but still this is a good tool to use.

open command prompt using administrative privileges and type in sfc/scannow if it finds no errors, then you may in fact be stable enough... for now... but keep a check on it, run this every week or so and if you start seeing errors, consider that you might actually need to re-evaluate your OC


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> You're contradicting yourself.
> 
> 3d mark and gaming also puts the strain on the motherboard, ram and graphic cards.
> 
> Also, I didnt said PRIME alone for testing. You're suddenly focusing exclusively on PRIME.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agree.
> 
> Technically machines like the threadripper arent for casual everyday "gaming". They are workhorses. Gaming will not stress it very well compared to play, stream and have some rendering done in the background in the other CCX AT SAME TIME.
> IF your system crashes with Prime, it will CRASH if youre doing such crossload type workload that uses 100% of the cpu to the max.


 
I was focusing on Prime because it involves a ton of math and quickly finds any issues that occur. If you know all the crap I run for stability purposes it would blow your mind. For example, 3DMark benchmarks may have an error or two, but that might be a tiny ltitle corrupt triangle you'll never notice, and it won't affect things at all. The overall point here is if you believe that overclocking your machine to X.XX and only running simple benchmarks means it's stable, you are WRONG. COMPLETELY wrong. I can actually prove this to you. Overclock your 1950x to 4.2 ghz and apply just enough voltage to get it to the desktop...then try running simple like prime95...it may complete 1-2 runs, it may even be good for a cinebench runs...but try something a bit more complex (like something that stresses the FPU) and suddenly you have a system lock. That's why those of us that actually know what we are doing throw about a billion different tests at the CPU. If the CPU is malfunctioning, we need to know about it. That means that the overclock failed (either due to lack of voltage, high temps, or maybe the CPU cannot simply handle it). Once again, it's NOT STRESS TESTING THE SYSTEM. It's running the system under load to find the errors in 24 hours vs 2 weeks. If you knew anything about software development, you could easily reproduce this. All it takes is one floating point number to be off to **** up something...and I don't even mean something you'd notice. I have an 80 gb hard drive that had some pics on it. It wasn't plugged in for years. Thanks to that, around 25% of the pics had bitrot and were corrupted or wouldn't open. Me personally? I overclock and do crazy **** because I can. I have the budget, I love technology, and I love seeing what it can do. I dig deeper than many. I understand the nuances of different architectures, etc. Say whatever you want of me, but when you claim that 'you don't run Prime95 because it's a waste of time' that tells me you are ignorant, and I hope to god you don't hit a point where a needed file isn't corrupt... (even word documents are zipped these days). There is a science to all of this, and I don't claim to know it all, but I AM an engineer, and I enjoy learning how **** works. Ignoring people like me is the reason why 70% of all home routers have security vulnerabilities in them...but to each his own. Now it's time to move on.

I almost have 4.2 stable without throttling, I suspect the Noctuas will push me beyond, we'll see.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> You're contradicting yourself.
> 
> 3d mark and gaming also puts the strain on the motherboard, ram and graphic cards.
> 
> Also, I didnt said PRIME alone for testing. You're suddenly focusing exclusively on PRIME.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agree.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're again missing the point. You're not testing the "day to day" operations. You're testing the worst of the worst cases (thats the definition of a torture test). If a computer passes these kind of torture tests, it shows that there is a level of stability. Both good for testing if a system crashes and you need to dial back a bit or if you need better cooling solutions for your system.
> 
> Technically machines like the threadripper arent for casual everyday "gaming". They are workhorses. Gaming will not stress it very well compared to play, stream and have some rendering done in the background in the other CCX AT SAME TIME.
> IF your system crashes with Prime, it will CRASH if youre doing such crossload type workload that uses 100% of the cpu to the max.


I almost missed the point about gaming. I'm a developer, and I'm currently working on a game engine that utilizes threadripper to it's fullest extent. Never say never. This is rapidly turning into a commercial product, and right now our official stance is: Coffee Lake 6 core will run the game at medium settings, older AMD CPUs and dual/quad core systems will not be supported except maybe the 7700k. It's going to be a fun ass game that combines survival with an advanced quest system. The game is actually CPU dependent. The 1080ti ight get a few more FPS than a 1080 than Vega, but we are focusing heavily on the simulation aspects of a living, breathing world.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

betam4x said:


> I almost missed the point about gaming. I'm a developer, and I'm currently working on a game engine that utilizes threadripper to it's fullest extent. Never say never. This is rapidly turning into a commercial product, and right now our official stance is: Coffee Lake 6 core will run the game at medium settings, older AMD CPUs and dual/quad core systems will not be supported except maybe the 7700k. It's going to be a fun ass game that combines survival with an advanced quest system. The game is actually CPU dependent. The 1080ti ight get a few more FPS than a 1080 than Vega, but we are focusing heavily on the simulation aspects of a living, breathing world.


sounds like a good game... I assume then that a properly clocked Ryzen 1700 will do well... I hope : )


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> I was focusing on Prime because it involves a ton of math and quickly finds any issues that occur. If you know all the crap I run for stability purposes it would blow your mind. For example, 3DMark benchmarks may have an error or two, but that might be a tiny ltitle corrupt triangle you'll never notice, and it won't affect things at all. The overall point here is if you believe that overclocking your machine to X.XX and only running simple benchmarks means it's stable, you are WRONG. COMPLETELY wrong. I can actually prove this to you. Overclock your 1950x to 4.2 ghz and apply just enough voltage to get it to the desktop...then try running simple like prime95...it may complete 1-2 runs, it may even be good for a cinebench runs...but try something a bit more complex (like something that stresses the FPU) and suddenly you have a system lock. That's why those of us that actually know what we are doing throw about a billion different tests at the CPU. If the CPU is malfunctioning, we need to know about it. That means that the overclock failed (either due to lack of voltage, high temps, or maybe the CPU cannot simply handle it). Once again, it's NOT STRESS TESTING THE SYSTEM. It's running the system under load to find the errors in 24 hours vs 2 weeks. If you knew anything about software development, you could easily reproduce this. All it takes is one floating point number to be off to **** up something...and I don't even mean something you'd notice. I have an 80 gb hard drive that had some pics on it. It wasn't plugged in for years. Thanks to that, around 25% of the pics had bitrot and were corrupted or wouldn't open. Me personally? I overclock and do crazy **** because I can. I have the budget, I love technology, and I love seeing what it can do. I dig deeper than many. I understand the nuances of different architectures, etc. Say whatever you want of me, but when you claim that 'you don't run Prime95 because it's a waste of time' that tells me you are ignorant, and I hope to god you don't hit a point where a needed file isn't corrupt... (even word documents are zipped these days). There is a science to all of this, and I don't claim to know it all, but I AM an engineer, and I enjoy learning how **** works. Ignoring people like me is the reason why 70% of all home routers have security vulnerabilities in them...but to each his own. Now it's time to move on.
> 
> I almost have 4.2 stable without throttling, I suspect the Noctuas will push me beyond, we'll see.


I must be a bit confused but, why are you replying to me about that? Check the quotes because I only was agreeing with you. The other segments of the text was for the other person who dismissed prime and other torture tests.

I'm the one that keeps mentioning how Prime can be useful for certain tests, the other person insisted that programs like 3dmark and "every day applications" are enough to test the reliability and stability of a system (which I disagreed).



betam4x said:


> I almost missed the point about gaming. I'm a developer, and I'm currently working on a game engine that utilizes threadripper to it's fullest extent. Never say never. This is rapidly turning into a commercial product, and right now our official stance is: Coffee Lake 6 core will run the game at medium settings, older AMD CPUs and dual/quad core systems will not be supported except maybe the 7700k. It's going to be a fun ass game that combines survival with an advanced quest system. The game is actually CPU dependent. The 1080ti ight get a few more FPS than a 1080 than Vega, but we are focusing heavily on the simulation aspects of a living, breathing world.


Can you say which game is it?

Its good to see games finally using more and more cores.
I actually was surprised that.. (despite the buggyness and the horrible disparate method of testing) the Final Fantasy PC port was using all my threadripper cores (only 2 to 4 cores to above 90% levels and the rest around 20%).


----------



## ht_addict

betam4x said:


> I was focusing on Prime because it involves a ton of math and quickly finds any issues that occur. If you know all the crap I run for stability purposes it would blow your mind. For example, 3DMark benchmarks may have an error or two, but that might be a tiny ltitle corrupt triangle you'll never notice, and it won't affect things at all. The overall point here is if you believe that overclocking your machine to X.XX and only running simple benchmarks means it's stable, you are WRONG. COMPLETELY wrong. I can actually prove this to you. Overclock your 1950x to 4.2 ghz and apply just enough voltage to get it to the desktop...then try running simple like prime95...it may complete 1-2 runs, it may even be good for a cinebench runs...but try something a bit more complex (like something that stresses the FPU) and suddenly you have a system lock. That's why those of us that actually know what we are doing throw about a billion different tests at the CPU. If the CPU is malfunctioning, we need to know about it. That means that the overclock failed (either due to lack of voltage, high temps, or maybe the CPU cannot simply handle it). Once again, it's NOT STRESS TESTING THE SYSTEM. It's running the system under load to find the errors in 24 hours vs 2 weeks. If you knew anything about software development, you could easily reproduce this. All it takes is one floating point number to be off to **** up something...and I don't even mean something you'd notice. I have an 80 gb hard drive that had some pics on it. It wasn't plugged in for years. Thanks to that, around 25% of the pics had bitrot and were corrupted or wouldn't open. Me personally? I overclock and do crazy **** because I can. I have the budget, I love technology, and I love seeing what it can do. I dig deeper than many. I understand the nuances of different architectures, etc. Say whatever you want of me, but when you claim that 'you don't run Prime95 because it's a waste of time' that tells me you are ignorant, and I hope to god you don't hit a point where a needed file isn't corrupt... (even word documents are zipped these days). There is a science to all of this, and I don't claim to know it all, but I AM an engineer, and I enjoy learning how **** works. Ignoring people like me is the reason why 70% of all home routers have security vulnerabilities in them...but to each his own. Now it's time to move on.
> 
> I almost have 4.2 stable without throttling, I suspect the Noctuas will push me beyond, we'll see.


When you can prove to me that a CPU running Prime 95 is unstable at a given clock due to the "CPU" itself being the faulty part. Get back to me. Then maybe I'll give a rats arse that you spend all your time and budget to see how far you can push you system before it crashes. I'll enjoy my time playing a game of COD, Wolfenstein, TitanFall 2 at a stable 4Ghz on my 1950x @ 1.3625v


----------



## ht_addict

betam4x said:


> I almost missed the point about gaming. I'm a developer, and I'm currently working on a game engine that utilizes threadripper to it's fullest extent. Never say never. This is rapidly turning into a commercial product, and right now our official stance is: Coffee Lake 6 core will run the game at medium settings, older AMD CPUs and dual/quad core systems will not be supported except maybe the 7700k. It's going to be a fun ass game that combines survival with an advanced quest system. The game is actually CPU dependent. The 1080ti ight get a few more FPS than a 1080 than Vega, but we are focusing heavily on the simulation aspects of a living, breathing world.


When's the ETA? Is it a game that's been announced?


----------



## Minotaurtoo

ht_addict said:


> When you can prove to me that a CPU running Prime 95 is unstable at a given clock due to the "CPU" itself being the faulty part. Get back to me. Then maybe I'll give a rats arse that you spend all your time and budget to see how far you can push you system before it crashes. I'll enjoy my time playing a game of COD, Wolfenstein, TitanFall 2 at a stable 4Ghz on my 1950x @ 1.3625v


one question... why does it matter whats unstable so much... if any part is/can cause(ing) instability then it can be a problem if you should ever reach the point where your system stays under full load for a long duration (30 minutes or more)


----------



## gupsterg

ht_addict said:


> When you can prove to me that a CPU running Prime 95 is unstable at a given clock due to the "CPU" itself being the faulty part. Get back to me. Then maybe I'll give a rats arse that you spend all your time and budget to see how far you can push you system before it crashes. I'll enjoy my time playing a game of COD, Wolfenstein, TitanFall 2 at a stable 4Ghz on my 1950x @ 1.3625v


I can respect your opinion, but also disagree. I guess your happy doing what you do and others doing what they do. To me all it means is when I see share from another that does not use the same processes of testing as I do, that it may not be relevant data for me.


----------



## ht_addict

Minotaurtoo said:


> one question... why does it matter whats unstable so much... if any part is/can cause(ing) instability then it can be a problem if you should ever reach the point where your system stays under full load for a long duration (30 minutes or more)


Simply put. If you can't isolate the underlying factor(CPU, VRM, Cooling, Power Supply, memory etc) that is causing the instability, we can not say our CPU's are stable or not under Prime95 at a given speed. People want to max out the load on their system, generating excess heat and stress on components, all the power to them. No pun intended.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

ht_addict said:


> Simply put. If you can't isolate the underlying factor(CPU, VRM, Cooling, Power Supply, memory etc) that is causing the instability, we can not say our CPU's are stable or not under Prime95 at a given speed. People want to max out the load on their system, generating excess heat and stress on components, all the power to them. No pun intended.


actually I've been pretty good at isolating whats causing it... may take some time... but it can be done... its why I put fans in specific locations like I do... 

I find hot spots first off and eliminate them by directing airflow or modding the cooling.... then once all temps are under control I start "tuning" it in... when I overclock I'm not just pushing up the volts and multipliers I first push up the ram leaving the cpu at stock till it goes unstable... then back down and do memtests.... ( I have in the past pushed the cpu up first and that is fine... it's just that ram testing with a overclocked cpu can warm a room up quite a bit lol)

then I check the vrm's by ramping up the voltage on the cpu core to watch temps and see if they can hold.. if no issues there, then I go back to stock volts and push the core clocks up and up and up till it craps out then up the volts/clocks in alternation till I find the max that it can sustain under constant load and remain stable and keep temps under control... 

power supply is rarely the source of instability, but to test it is pretty easy... cpu test alone passes and gpu test alone passes, but cpu and gpu test together fails would indicate bad psu

The SOC is usually tested as the ram is tested so if the memtest passes the SOC is good usually...anyway this is the basic...very basic methodology for eliminating all sources of instability... 

I'm not trying to pick on you really, but it seems to me that you are too focused on a number and not focused enough on ensuring that your system will not fail due to data corruption over time... if your cpu or any other part isn't holding up properly you will have errors introduced into whatever data is being saved to disk and over time this can cause a multitude of problems. 

I don't just overclock, I tune as well... that's why clock for clock I manage better performance on average compared to the average overclocker... I wish I had a threadripper to play with, but just couldn't afford the setup... but this 1700 I've managed to get a daily running clock that hits right near 1800 cb points and on Userbench is in the 100th percentile of all bench's of this cpu... I don't play around and I'm not trying to fool people... just trying to help... check out the bench here... http://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/7010343

here is a thread where I was testing out this cheap motherboard and you can see that at 3.92ghz I managed a 1790 in cb15 and at 4.02 managed 1830+ I run daily at the 3.92 because I want stability and that score along with all others were higher than just pushing 4ghz on the cores.... http://www.overclock.net/forum/11-a...otherboard-review-doesn-t-suck-after-all.html 

unfortunately I lost most of my cb15 test scores from before I did most of my tuning, but there is a little graphic showing where I had a 3.8 clock beating a 3.9 clock... all because I found a cute little option in the bios called performance bias... surprisingly that helped in games and many other things as well... really didn't expect that... 

here is snippit showing stock and a few of my first overclocking runs on cb15... notice how a 3.8 is beating out the 3.9 first attempt...


----------



## Tamalero

Minotaurtoo said:


> actually I've been pretty good at isolating whats causing it... may take some time... but it can be done... its why I put fans in specific locations like I do...
> 
> I find hot spots first off and eliminate them by directing airflow or modding the cooling.... then once all temps are under control I start "tuning" it in... when I overclock I'm not just pushing up the volts and multipliers I first push up the ram leaving the cpu at stock till it goes unstable... then back down and do memtests.... ( I have in the past pushed the cpu up first and that is fine... it's just that ram testing with a overclocked cpu can warm a room up quite a bit lol)
> 
> then I check the vrm's by ramping up the voltage on the cpu core to watch temps and see if they can hold.. if no issues there, then I go back to stock volts and push the core clocks up and up and up till it craps out then up the volts/clocks in alternation till I find the max that it can sustain under constant load and remain stable and keep temps under control...
> 
> power supply is rarely the source of instability, but to test it is pretty easy... cpu test alone passes and gpu test alone passes, but cpu and gpu test together fails would indicate bad psu
> 
> The SOC is usually tested as the ram is tested so if the memtest passes the SOC is good usually...anyway this is the basic...very basic methodology for eliminating all sources of instability...
> 
> I'm not trying to pick on you really, but it seems to me that you are too focused on a number and not focused enough on ensuring that your system will not fail due to data corruption over time... if your cpu or any other part isn't holding up properly you will have errors introduced into whatever data is being saved to disk and over time this can cause a multitude of problems.
> 
> I don't just overclock, I tune as well... that's why clock for clock I manage better performance on average compared to the average overclocker... I wish I had a threadripper to play with, but just couldn't afford the setup... but this 1700 I've managed to get a daily running clock that hits right near 1800 cb points and on Userbench is in the 100th percentile of all bench's of this cpu... I don't play around and I'm not trying to fool people... just trying to help... check out the bench here... http://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/7010343
> 
> here is a thread where I was testing out this cheap motherboard and you can see that at 3.92ghz I managed a 1790 in cb15 and at 4.02 managed 1830+ I run daily at the 3.92 because I want stability and that score along with all others were higher than just pushing 4ghz on the cores.... http://www.overclock.net/forum/11-a...otherboard-review-doesn-t-suck-after-all.html
> 
> unfortunately I lost most of my cb15 test scores from before I did most of my tuning, but there is a little graphic showing where I had a 3.8 clock beating a 3.9 clock... all because I found a cute little option in the bios called performance bias... surprisingly that helped in games and many other things as well... really didn't expect that...
> 
> here is snippit showing stock and a few of my first overclocking runs on cb15... notice how a 3.8 is beating out the 3.9 first attempt...


Hear hear!

What baffles me is that he mentioned benchmarks like 3dmark for his stability tests. when these kind of tests also stress (just not at the max) all components equally.
Whatever he does he will be stressing the motherboard VRMS and power lines. Yet his main complain is the same "if you run prime you're not really stressing the cpu alone".

The point as always been trying to find the nonstable point then you can go into troubleshooting which part is which!.

As many experts say, if your system cant pass a true torture test, its not stable. You might be fine for a game or two.. but once you stress your system by doing many things (like I said, rendering, while playing or processing a ton of stuff, its going to crash.. and if you do critical stuff, you're going to get corrupted data in the long end!)


----------



## nycgtr

Came in today. From what I gather all the components of the cooling engine has been changed. Will post results.


----------



## MNMadman

nycgtr said:


> Came in today. From what I gather all the components of the cooling engine has been changed. Will post results.


You can already tell that the fin area is quite a bit different than the original. It appears to be larger, taking up almost the entire plate. Plus the insert and jet plates are way different. Should be more effective and hopefully competitive with the other TR4 blocks. In other words, it is now what it should have been from the beginning. I look forward to the results.

My first Watercool shipment arrived today with a matching set of Acrylic Nickel-Black blocks (TR4 and TXp), Tube 150, D5-Vario, and some mounting stuff. Ordered a MO-RA3 late last week so it'll likely be a while before I get that (first shipment took three weeks). Still have yet to order the CPU and mainboard -- waiting for my state tax refund or my next paycheck, whichever comes first. Whee!

Edit: I just realized that's the upgrade kit for a monoblock and not the regular TR4 block. That plate looks small for a monoblock. Does that attach to another plate for contact with the VRM or something?


----------



## nycgtr

Installed the kit. Limited testing. We are looking at about an 8c drop from before. While it's still 5-6 degrees away from a xspc block or heatkiller. For your average daily use it is sufficient if you wanted a MB. If you wanted the best cpu and vrm cooling get the heatkiller combo.


----------



## Tamalero

nycgtr said:


> Installed the kit. Limited testing. We are looking at about an 8c drop from before. While it's still 5-6 degrees away from a xspc block or heatkiller. For your average daily use it is sufficient if you wanted a MB. If you wanted the best cpu and vrm cooling get the heatkiller combo.


Hows the price difference between these 3?


----------



## nycgtr

Tamalero said:


> Hows the price difference between these 3?


IN uSD
The xspc block cost me 89, the phantkes 99, the EK mono 158 USD to my door from EK direct, the Heatkiller and VRM combo was 180?? ( 40ish of it was shipping though)


----------



## ht_addict

nycgtr said:


> Came in today. From what I gather all the components of the cooling engine has been changed. Will post results.


So will EKWB replace the cooling plate on the Threadripoer CPU block?


----------



## nycgtr

ht_addict said:


> So will EKWB replace the cooling plate on the Threadripoer CPU block?


I have no idea. I would try to swap it onto my regular TR supremacy evo but the cooling engine would totally block the outlet. It is possible with a different cooling engine that the new cold plate and 2 jetplates would work. Then again just my guess and I am not a pro on fluid dynamics. 

Come to think of it I could of tried with just the coldplate onto the regular supremacy block but tbh I didn't have the time to do so and its already in my loop now and my loop is painful to dissemble to say the least.


----------



## OrionBG

Hey guys,
I'm possibly having a dumb moment but I can't understand something.
I'm trying to find the lowest stable voltage my 1950x will run at 4.0GHz and I'm confused by what I'm getting from HWinfo64
There are 16 Core VIDs that while the CPU is idle are pretty much the same as the Vcore reading and what I have set in the BIOS.
The problem is that the moment I force the CPU to full load, all VIDs go about 50mV down while my Vcore reading is still showing what it should.
Which is the correct reading in HWinfo64 and what the f**k are those VIDs there for? Are the VID values real of just showing the price of the bananas in western Tanzania during a drought, while the CPU is OCed...
Also why would those VID values go down during load (and more importantly why exactly 50mV) and not vice versa... (LLC settings do not have any effect on the VIDs)




THANKS!


----------



## ssateneth

The VID is only part of the equation as far as actual voltage received by the CPU. The part where the VID lowering under load is 100% NORMAL. This is called voltage droop and this has been put into the power delivery system by design for all modern CPUs. The reason being is to avoid large transient voltage spikes. What are transients?

A transient is a very very tiny amount of time. In relation to voltage and loads, a transient voltage spike is a sudden large increase or decrease in voltage that can only be detected with an oscilloscope; they will not show up in any software voltage readout or hardware voltage readout with a multimeter. The way a transient voltage spike occurs is like this. Imagine a setup where you have a powerful CPU at 1.35 volts, it's probably very overclocked, and teetering on the edge of stability, and it makes every attempt not to deviate from this (This can be caused by using Load Line Calibration, or LLC, which is a misunderstood option that most people set). The CPU sits there idling at 1.35v and it's fine. You put a sudden load on it like Prime95, then the voltage will IMMEDIATELY dip down to, say, 1.27v (Remember, this part is not detectable without an oscilloscope) before jumping back up to 1.35v, all in an instant's time. This is a transient voltage spike and occurs due to physics. You then remove the load and it spikes to 1.43v for another instant before backing down to 1.35v (also another transient). Due to the voltage drop at the start, maybe your PC crashes, so you pump up the voltage to counter instability, so now it's set to 1.43v. Now in the same scenario, it'll dip down to 1.35v for a moment on starting the load before jumping back up to the set 1.43v, but when the load goes away, it'll spike up to 1.51v for a moment. This can be damaging to a CPU and is EXACTLY why voltage droop exists.

So in the same scenario, we turn off load line calibration, or LLC, and run the same 1.43v. This is the part you'll see in your current situation. It'll idle at say 1.42v or thereabouts (Vdroop never goes away entirely). You put on your stress test, it spikes down to 1.35v via oscilliscope, but then stays there via software readouts. Your CPU is being perfectly tame, no crashes because the set voltage was increased and it was already fine at 1.35V with LLC on in general use. So now you remove the load, it spikes up to 1.43v, then settles back to around 1.42v. In effect, the voltage spikes have been removed.

Now, as far as your specific situation goes, VID is primarily what the CPU is asking for (If it is not being overclocked, it may do some internal power gating to reduce per-core voltages so individual core voltages may go down a lot during idle). If you have any sort of LLC enabled, your VRM (voltage regulation module) may send higher voltages (which is the case with my motherboard). Some motherboards have different voltage sensors in different spots. Your VRM may have a sensor of it's own, and the motherboard may have yet another one of its own close by. In the end, it comes down to sleuthing which one is the correct one (In my case, VRM sensors shows the real voltage, and motherboard picks up on that).


----------



## betam4x

ssateneth said:


> The VID is only part of the equation as far as actual voltage received by the CPU. The part where the VID lowering under load is 100% NORMAL. This is called voltage droop and this has been put into the power delivery system by design for all modern CPUs. The reason being is to avoid large transient voltage spikes. What are transients?
> 
> A transient is a very very tiny amount of time. In relation to voltage and loads, a transient voltage spike is a sudden large increase or decrease in voltage that can only be detected with an oscilloscope; they will not show up in any software voltage readout or hardware voltage readout with a multimeter. The way a transient voltage spike occurs is like this. Imagine a setup where you have a powerful CPU at 1.35 volts, it's probably very overclocked, and teetering on the edge of stability, and it makes every attempt not to deviate from this (This can be caused by using Load Line Calibration, or LLC, which is a misunderstood option that most people set). The CPU sits there idling at 1.35v and it's fine. You put a sudden load on it like Prime95, then the voltage will IMMEDIATELY dip down to, say, 1.27v (Remember, this part is not detectable without an oscilloscope) before jumping back up to 1.35v, all in an instant's time. This is a transient voltage spike and occurs due to physics. You then remove the load and it spikes to 1.43v for another instant before backing down to 1.35v (also another transient). Due to the voltage drop at the start, maybe your PC crashes, so you pump up the voltage to counter instability, so now it's set to 1.43v. Now in the same scenario, it'll dip down to 1.35v for a moment on starting the load before jumping back up to the set 1.43v, but when the load goes away, it'll spike up to 1.51v for a moment. This can be damaging to a CPU and is EXACTLY why voltage droop exists.
> 
> So in the same scenario, we turn off load line calibration, or LLC, and run the same 1.43v. This is the part you'll see in your current situation. It'll idle at say 1.42v or thereabouts (Vdroop never goes away entirely). You put on your stress test, it spikes down to 1.35v via oscilliscope, but then stays there via software readouts. Your CPU is being perfectly tame, no crashes because the set voltage was increased and it was already fine at 1.35V with LLC on in general use. So now you remove the load, it spikes up to 1.43v, then settles back to around 1.42v. In effect, the voltage spikes have been removed.
> 
> Now, as far as your specific situation goes, VID is primarily what the CPU is asking for (If it is not being overclocked, it may do some internal power gating to reduce per-core voltages so individual core voltages may go down a lot during idle). If you have any sort of LLC enabled, your VRM (voltage regulation module) may send higher voltages (which is the case with my motherboard). Some motherboards have different voltage sensors in different spots. Your VRM may have a sensor of it's own, and the motherboard may have yet another one of its own close by. In the end, it comes down to sleuthing which one is the correct one (In my case, VRM sensors shows the real voltage, and motherboard picks up on that).


You sir, are the best. Thanks for informing everyone of this. I knew a bit about this, but this just reinforces and improves my knowledge. I'm just wondering what the actual voltage limit of the chip is. I've seen older chips run at much higher voltages for years. That's why I temporarily increased my voltage to 1.625V, to see how high I could take the chip. I can afford to replace the chip, so I wasn't worried about frying it. However, I've seen what a 4.4 GHz 8 core Threadripper can do (16 cores wasn't stable enough and that was the 1.625V that I tried...I did run a a few benchmarks, but I lost the document on the when the blender benchmark froze the system...and I'm done abusing the chip) 

I think AMD has a TON of legroom if they can improve voltage curve. People keep saying that Ryzen has the same IPC as the i7 4xxx series. However, based on my testing, Ryzen appears to scale almost exponentially with clock speed and memory speeds. I'm willing to bet a 5 GHz Ryzen with decent RAM and the tweaks (improved memory latency, etc.) they are doing with 12nm would beat a 5 GHz 8700k in pretty much any benchmark. The question is: Can they get the clockspeed up. At any rate, Threadripper is the best chip I have ever owned. I wanted something different when I upgraded from my 2600k, and I chose Threadripper because it had 16 cores. I do a ton multitasking, development, video encoding, etc. It does all this, and for most of it, it does it silently with no fans spinning. I no longer find myself waiting on certain tasks that even took a while on a 7700k. Things just work. 

I have been working on a game for a while, but I may pause for a bit and work on a benchmark that shows what potential there is with core scaling when done right.


----------



## Tamalero

ssateneth said:


> The VID is only part of the equation as far as actual voltage received by the CPU. The part where the VID lowering under load is 100% NORMAL. This is called voltage droop and this has been put into the power delivery system by design for all modern CPUs. The reason being is to avoid large transient voltage spikes. What are transients?
> 
> A transient is a very very tiny amount of time. In relation to voltage and loads, a transient voltage spike is a sudden large increase or decrease in voltage that can only be detected with an oscilloscope; they will not show up in any software voltage readout or hardware voltage readout with a multimeter. The way a transient voltage spike occurs is like this. Imagine a setup where you have a powerful CPU at 1.35 volts, it's probably very overclocked, and teetering on the edge of stability, and it makes every attempt not to deviate from this (This can be caused by using Load Line Calibration, or LLC, which is a misunderstood option that most people set). The CPU sits there idling at 1.35v and it's fine. You put a sudden load on it like Prime95, then the voltage will IMMEDIATELY dip down to, say, 1.27v (Remember, this part is not detectable without an oscilloscope) before jumping back up to 1.35v, all in an instant's time. This is a transient voltage spike and occurs due to physics. You then remove the load and it spikes to 1.43v for another instant before backing down to 1.35v (also another transient). Due to the voltage drop at the start, maybe your PC crashes, so you pump up the voltage to counter instability, so now it's set to 1.43v. Now in the same scenario, it'll dip down to 1.35v for a moment on starting the load before jumping back up to the set 1.43v, but when the load goes away, it'll spike up to 1.51v for a moment. This can be damaging to a CPU and is EXACTLY why voltage droop exists.
> 
> So in the same scenario, we turn off load line calibration, or LLC, and run the same 1.43v. This is the part you'll see in your current situation. It'll idle at say 1.42v or thereabouts (Vdroop never goes away entirely). You put on your stress test, it spikes down to 1.35v via oscilliscope, but then stays there via software readouts. Your CPU is being perfectly tame, no crashes because the set voltage was increased and it was already fine at 1.35V with LLC on in general use. So now you remove the load, it spikes up to 1.43v, then settles back to around 1.42v. In effect, the voltage spikes have been removed.
> 
> Now, as far as your specific situation goes, VID is primarily what the CPU is asking for (If it is not being overclocked, it may do some internal power gating to reduce per-core voltages so individual core voltages may go down a lot during idle). If you have any sort of LLC enabled, your VRM (voltage regulation module) may send higher voltages (which is the case with my motherboard). Some motherboards have different voltage sensors in different spots. Your VRM may have a sensor of it's own, and the motherboard may have yet another one of its own close by. In the end, it comes down to sleuthing which one is the correct one (In my case, VRM sensors shows the real voltage, and motherboard picks up on that).


How the hell you give preps and likes now? I do not see any button to vote your explanation.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

Hello all!

Recent convert to AMD here...TR deserved the attention! Put together a Zenith Extreme and 1920X.

I was going to go for a 1950X but hearing Zen+ versions and 2nd gen were coming and not having the experience...aaaand finding a 1920X for a bit over 500 euros on Amazon France...I went with a 1920X....for now

It's up and running great!


----------



## betam4x

Arne Saknussemm said:


> Hello all!
> 
> Recent convert to AMD here...TR deserved the attention! Put together a Zenith Extreme and 1920X.
> 
> I was going to go for a 1950X but hearing Zen+ versions and 2nd gen were coming and not having the experience...aaaand finding a 1920X for a bit over 500 euros on Amazon France...I went with a 1920X....for now
> 
> It's up and running great!


Nothing wrong with a 1920X. Part of me wondered if I should downgrade my 1950x to 12 cores to get to 4.3 GHz  but nah, I regularly load my system when doing video encoding, etc. So 4.1 @ 16 (1.325V) it is. I hope AMD delivers one hell of a chip with the 2950x. The very fact they brought it up makes me wonder if they have something special up their sleeve. Cooling is a problem with this chip, but with a revamped boost algorithm they could make the 2950X the best chip ever made. From what I've discovered, a lot of the current gen's issues are power delivery related. 2 cores scale higher than 4 cores, etc. (though my chip has a ceiling of 4.45 ghz @ 2 cores. It will NOT hit 4.5.) If they can get the voltage curve nailed, They could potentially get the single core boost up to 4.7 or even higher, etc. I guess we'll see


----------



## OrionBG

ssateneth said:


> The VID is only part of the equation as far as actual voltage received by the CPU. The part where the VID lowering under load is 100% NORMAL. This is called voltage droop and this has been put into the power delivery system by design for all modern CPUs. The reason being is to avoid large transient voltage spikes. What are transients?
> 
> A transient is a very very tiny amount of time. In relation to voltage and loads, a transient voltage spike is a sudden large increase or decrease in voltage that can only be detected with an oscilloscope; they will not show up in any software voltage readout or hardware voltage readout with a multimeter. The way a transient voltage spike occurs is like this. Imagine a setup where you have a powerful CPU at 1.35 volts, it's probably very overclocked, and teetering on the edge of stability, and it makes every attempt not to deviate from this (This can be caused by using Load Line Calibration, or LLC, which is a misunderstood option that most people set). The CPU sits there idling at 1.35v and it's fine. You put a sudden load on it like Prime95, then the voltage will IMMEDIATELY dip down to, say, 1.27v (Remember, this part is not detectable without an oscilloscope) before jumping back up to 1.35v, all in an instant's time. This is a transient voltage spike and occurs due to physics. You then remove the load and it spikes to 1.43v for another instant before backing down to 1.35v (also another transient). Due to the voltage drop at the start, maybe your PC crashes, so you pump up the voltage to counter instability, so now it's set to 1.43v. Now in the same scenario, it'll dip down to 1.35v for a moment on starting the load before jumping back up to the set 1.43v, but when the load goes away, it'll spike up to 1.51v for a moment. This can be damaging to a CPU and is EXACTLY why voltage droop exists.
> 
> So in the same scenario, we turn off load line calibration, or LLC, and run the same 1.43v. This is the part you'll see in your current situation. It'll idle at say 1.42v or thereabouts (Vdroop never goes away entirely). You put on your stress test, it spikes down to 1.35v via oscilliscope, but then stays there via software readouts. Your CPU is being perfectly tame, no crashes because the set voltage was increased and it was already fine at 1.35V with LLC on in general use. So now you remove the load, it spikes up to 1.43v, then settles back to around 1.42v. In effect, the voltage spikes have been removed.
> 
> Now, as far as your specific situation goes, VID is primarily what the CPU is asking for (If it is not being overclocked, it may do some internal power gating to reduce per-core voltages so individual core voltages may go down a lot during idle). If you have any sort of LLC enabled, your VRM (voltage regulation module) may send higher voltages (which is the case with my motherboard). Some motherboards have different voltage sensors in different spots. Your VRM may have a sensor of it's own, and the motherboard may have yet another one of its own close by. In the end, it comes down to sleuthing which one is the correct one (In my case, VRM sensors shows the real voltage, and motherboard picks up on that).


Thanks for the explanation!!!
So basically, on the Taichi (and probably all other boards) with the chip overclocked to 4GHz (done by just manually selecting 40x multiplier and putting 1.35V Vcore, no p state/offset mambojambo) the VIDs are non functional and what I need to look at is the Vcore, correct?


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> Thanks for the explanation!!!
> So basically, on the Taichi (and probably all other boards) with the chip overclocked to 4GHz (done by just manually selecting 40x multiplier and putting 1.35V Vcore, no p state/offset mambojambo) the VIDs are non functional and what I need to look at is the Vcore, correct?


Does the Taichi not have LLC settings? That's why LLC exists: To combat vdroop. You just don't want a high LLC along with a high VCore. That's how I can get away with 1.25V (used to be 1.225...but I've abused this chip) with 4 GHz. I use an LLC setting that compensates for the vdroop.

EDIT: Here is an article that talks a bit about it, though, like most of MSI's stuff, it's half-assed: https://www.msi.com/blog/why-llc-is-your-friend-when-overclocking

EDIT #2: Oh and just an FYI, LLC is not a set and forget type of issue. Balance needs to be done. You would think a high-ish LLC would allow for a more stable overclock, but with current gen boards, sometimes a lower LLC can allow for a higher overclock. It's all about balancing power delivery on your board. On my board, it appears that I can only push 272 watts through the VRMs, etc. and anything above that will cause issues. So backing down the LLC while upping the vcore actually helps because I can get very close to that 272 watts without going over.... Still wishing for 4.3 though. I can do it, but not stable.


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> Does the Taichi not have LLC settings? That's why LLC exists: To combat vdroop. You just don't want a high LLC along with a high VCore. That's how I can get away with 1.25V (used to be 1.225...but I've abused this chip) with 4 GHz. I use an LLC setting that compensates for the vdroop.
> 
> EDIT: Here is an article that talks a bit about it, though, like most of MSI's stuff, it's half-assed: https://www.msi.com/blog/why-llc-is-your-friend-when-overclocking
> 
> EDIT #2: Oh and just an FYI, LLC is not a set and forget type of issue. Balance needs to be done. You would think a high-ish LLC would allow for a more stable overclock, but with current gen boards, sometimes a lower LLC can allow for a higher overclock. It's all about balancing power delivery on your board. On my board, it appears that I can only push 272 watts through the VRMs, etc. and anything above that will cause issues. So backing down the LLC while upping the vcore actually helps because I can get very close to that 272 watts without going over.... Still wishing for 4.3 though. I can do it, but not stable.


I've tried different LLC settings but none of them have any effect on the VID voltages. There is a small effect on the Vcore but for me at least, the Vcore have been quite stable and does not deviate from idle to load. 
Also my CPU feels quite OK with consuming 300W (and a bit more some times) during full load with AVX (Prime, IntelBurn test...)
The fact of the matter is that (at least for me) with the CPU set to 4GHz, Vcore set to 1.35V and everything else running stock, the VIDs are about 1.35V during idle and then all go down exactly 50mV down to 1.3V during full load (while Vcore is still at about 1.35V) So basically I wanted to know if the cores are really getting 50mV less during load (all the time, not just a drop for a moment of something) or these are just what the CPU thing it is getting but in reality it gets the 1.35V Vcore voltage. (this repeats even at lover Vcore. If I set the Vcore to 1.3V the VIDs are going to 1.25V at load, If Vcore is 1.25V the VIDs go to 1.2V during load and so on)
Just too many voltages in those modern CPUs... An overclocking nightmare...
Yesterday I did some tests and anything lower than 1.35V Vcore will hang the system after several minutes of IntelBurn Test... (to be fair I have still to tested if 1.35V is stable, but at least for the time being, the system works properly) Will do more testing...
Another problem is that it seems my custom loop cant handle all that heat from the CPU... !?!? I have a 360 45mm rad and a 240 45mm rad, the 360 is in push pull even and the amount of hot air coming out of them is quite substantial. So there is a lot of heat transfer being done and still I need more... Currently the CPU temp goes to 81C with the fans blowing at max and during IntelBurn Test or Prime...


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> Another problem is that it seems my custom loop cant handle all that heat from the CPU... !?!? I have a 360 45mm rad and a 240 45mm rad, the 360 is in push pull even and the amount of hot air coming out of them is quite substantial. So there is a lot of heat transfer being done and still I need more... Currently the CPU temp goes to 81C with the fans blowing at max and during IntelBurn Test or Prime...


Anything with AVX instructions (certain versions of Prime and IBT included) is going to really max out your CPU. That should be the hottest it ever gets, and for that 81°C isn't terrible. Does your loop include the GPU?

How are your rads positioned, and are the fans intake or exhaust? If either is exhausting air, it is less effective because the air going through the rad is already warmed from the components.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Anything with AVX instructions (certain versions of Prime and IBT included) is going to really max out your CPU. That should be the hottest it ever gets, and for that 81°C isn't terrible. Does your loop include the GPU?
> 
> How are your rads positioned, and are the fans intake or exhaust? If either is exhausting air, it is less effective because the air going through the rad is already warmed from the components.


Yes, my loop includes the GPU but the funny part is that while I'm cooking the CPU, the GPU stays at 25C to 27C (21C ambient) so the liquid temperature should be OK.
The 360 rad is on the front and there are 6 fans on it in push/pull as intake. The 240 is on the top and has two fans that push air and exhaust it out the case. There is also one 140mm fan on the back also exhausting air.
I know it is not ideal and I'll be making some changes at some point...
And yes, I know this will be the hottest it ever gets but I'm probably just getting a little paranoid when it gets over 80C...


----------



## ssateneth

OrionBG said:


> Another problem is that it seems my custom loop cant handle all that heat from the CPU... !?!? I have a 360 45mm rad and a 240 45mm rad, the 360 is in push pull even and the amount of hot air coming out of them is quite substantial. So there is a lot of heat transfer being done and still I need more... Currently the CPU temp goes to 81C with the fans blowing at max and during IntelBurn Test or Prime...


Which temperature sensor are you reading for this 81C? Tctl is wrong, Tdie is true CPU temperature.


----------



## OrionBG

ssateneth said:


> Which temperature sensor are you reading for this 81C? Tctl is wrong, Tdie is true CPU temperature.


Tdie... Is there a person here that is still doing that mistake with the Tctl reading?


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Tdie... Is there a person here that is still doing that mistake with the Tctl reading?


This is something that baffles me, because my computer always locks down at temps higher than 70C tdie and shuts down.

I've upped the voltage to put away the issue of instability. but I fear its the VRM temps that shutdown the mobo.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> This is something that baffles me, because my computer always locks down at temps higher than 70C tdie and shuts down.
> 
> I've upped the voltage to put away the issue of instability. but I fear its the VRM temps that shutdown the mobo.


Turn off PROCHOT in Ryzen master 

It's probably your board throttling though.


----------



## betam4x

You know, I REALLY wish Adobe apps were better at threading. Here is a pic of my task manager performing OCR on a 3k page document.

EDIT: And yes, I have my 1950X running at 12 cores/24 threads, it allowed me to get to 4.3 stable and I figured it would speed up the convert a bit.

EDIT #2: What I meant to say in a previous post was 270 amps, not watts.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> This is something that baffles me, because my computer always locks down at temps higher than 70C tdie and shuts down.
> 
> I've upped the voltage to put away the issue of instability. but I fear its the VRM temps that shutdown the mobo.


I think it depends on the board, VRMs, and temps. My CPU can do up to 87C without 'seemingly' throttling (that is each 25 mhz gain means faster benchmarks.

Enabling prochot causes all kinds of wierd **** to happen on my board though.

Either way, my board throttles at something like 270amps. This causes CPUs to throttle. I really do believe this board could perform so much faster if MSI would fix all the BIOS issues. Some of the options don't even appear to do anything.


----------



## betam4x

*Why LLC matters, especially with threadripper.*

The first picture is my highest, most aggressive LLC (mode 1) at a voltage of 1.35V @ 4.1 GHz. I could have gone slightly lower, but I wanted a cushion. Take note of the CPU temp along with the VRM temp. The following picture is with the least aggressive LLC setting (mode 8 on my board). Much higher vcore, but look at the temps of the VRMs and the CPU.

http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=87281


http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=87297


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> Turn off PROCHOT in Ryzen master
> 
> It's probably your board throttling though.


Doesn't PROCHOT protect me from overheating and burning my processor?



betam4x said:


> I think it depends on the board, VRMs, and temps. My CPU can do up to 87C without 'seemingly' throttling (that is each 25 mhz gain means faster benchmarks.
> 
> Enabling prochot causes all kinds of wierd **** to happen on my board though.
> 
> Either way, my board throttles at something like 270amps. This causes CPUs to throttle. I really do believe this board could perform so much faster if MSI would fix all the BIOS issues. Some of the options don't even appear to do anything.


I see, so PROCHOT has varying behavior depending on the mobo...


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> The first picture is my highest, most aggressive LLC (mode 1) at a voltage of 1.35V @ 4.1 GHz. I could have gone slightly lower, but I wanted a cushion. Take note of the CPU temp along with the VRM temp. The following picture is with the least aggressive LLC setting (mode 8 on my board). Much higher vcore, but look at the temps of the VRMs and the CPU.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=87281
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=87297


How are the LLC levels of your represented? I mean tightest to loosest setting, is it Level 1 the tightest or the loosest?
Also are these temps with the same load and if yes... HOW??? This is more than 30C difference... 



Tamalero said:


> Doesn't PROCHOT protect me from overheating and burning my processor?
> 
> 
> 
> I see, so PROCHOT has varying behavior depending on the mobo...


On the Taichi there are at least two different PROCHOT settings. One for the VRMs and one for the CPU. The VRMs one is controlled by a physical switch near the upper edge of the MB. By default is ON and it said in the User Manual that for more serious overclocking I can disable it so I did. If I'm not mistaken I've also disabled the CPU PROCHOT in the BIOS (not 100% sure but I think I did).
After all, we are overclocking so the risk comes with the job  If you are careful there should not be any issues.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> How are the LLC levels of your represented? I mean tightest to loosest setting, is it Level 1 the tightest or the loosest?
> Also are these temps with the same load and if yes... HOW??? This is more than 30C difference...
> 
> 
> 
> On the Taichi there are at least two different PROCHOT settings. One for the VRMs and one for the CPU. The VRMs one is controlled by a physical switch near the upper edge of the MB. By default is ON and it said in the User Manual that for more serious overclocking I can disable it so I did. If I'm not mistaken I've also disabled the CPU PROCHOT in the BIOS (not 100% sure but I think I did).
> After all, we are overclocking so the risk comes with the job  If you are careful there should not be any issues.


Just reviewed my X399 PRIME (from ASUS) bios.. no mention of PROCHOT anywhere in the usual settings (aka VRM, overclocker, advanced settings).
I will be digging at the processor specific ones later on.. ASUS really did a mess with the organization of this bios.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Ok I'm getting close to finally ordering RAM for my 1950x system. Will these work with my 1950x and ASRock Taichi board? I need 64GB in 16GB modules (need to be able to upgrade to 128GB in the future).

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232376


----------



## OrionBG

PuffinMyLye said:


> Ok I'm getting close to finally ordering RAM for my 1950x system. Will these work with my 1950x and ASRock Taichi board? I need 64GB in 16GB modules (need to be able to upgrade to 128GB in the future).
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232376


These G.Skill kits should work without much problems. The only issue you might have with them (depending on your luck) is if they will work ta 3200MHz or at a lower speed. 16GB modules are dual rank if I'm not mistaken and ZEN does not like dual rank very much. With 8 sticks (128GB) I'm almost 100% sure they will not work at 3200MHz... Again depending on your luck and possible future BIOS Updates.
To summarize, there are possibly the best RAM modules for Ryzen CPUs but even with them, there are some limitations...


----------



## ht_addict

PuffinMyLye said:


> Ok I'm getting close to finally ordering RAM for my 1950x system. Will these work with my 1950x and ASRock Taichi board? I need 64GB in 16GB modules (need to be able to upgrade to 128GB in the future).
> 
> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232376


Used them on my Gigabyte X399. Now I use the 4*8GB 3600mhz version


----------



## PuffinMyLye

ht_addict said:


> Used them on my Gigabyte X399. Now I use the 4*8GB 3600mhz version



I see. What speed were you able to run them at?


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

I have a question for you TR owners.

I have a 1920X on a Zenith Extreme and on 3 different BIOS (0804 0902 0019) neither P-state OC nor offset voltage allows the voltage to downclock at idle.

Stock everything works as normal and manual OC everything works as you'd expect.

Anyone else seen this behaviour from their system?


----------



## Djreversal

has anyone got over 4.1ghz on a 1950x yet??? i couldnt get it when i first built my system right away.. Not sure if things have come along since then.


----------



## MNMadman

Djreversal said:


> has anyone got over 4.1ghz on a 1950x yet??? i couldnt get it when i first built my system right away.. Not sure if things have come along since then.


I've seen the occasional person claiming 4.125 GHz or thereabouts.

I've seen one person claiming 4.2-4.3 Ghz when they disable half or more of the cores.

Mine does 4 GHz at around 1.35v but I haven't determined the stability or tried to go higher yet as I'm still waiting on my MO-RA3 radiator. It's currently being cooled by an Enermax LiqTech 280 which is doing better than I thought it would.


----------



## Tamalero

Djreversal said:


> has anyone got over 4.1ghz on a 1950x yet??? i couldnt get it when i first built my system right away.. Not sure if things have come along since then.


Did, but could not pass heavy rendering or prime because of thermal issues.
4.1 Ghz for me is 1.35V.
Which is way above what my big noctua can handle.

So I guess it doesn't count.


----------



## kadok34

Hi!!

..... my english very bad....

i need to know if it is posible to install an 1950x cpu without the "orange carrier frame" ???

and how to do correctly ????

is urgent!!! .......... please help!!!!

Thanks!!!


----------



## OrionBG

kadok34 said:


> Hi!!
> 
> ..... my english very bad....
> 
> i need to know if it is posible to install an 1950x cpu without the "orange carrier frame" ???
> 
> and how to do correctly ????
> 
> is urgent!!! .......... please help!!!!
> 
> Thanks!!!


Yes, you can.
How? Very Carefully! Like Intel LGA CPU are installed.
Just have in mind that the possibility for something to go wrong is times higher than normal without the carrier frame.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

First off, I can't see why you would do this...but assuming you have done something... eccentric shall we say

I presume you remove the orange holding frame from the cpu and check to see if you have to remove black carrier frame from socket (though this might not be necessary)...then carefully place cpu...and close carrier frame and socket

Edit...looking at photos...black carrier frame is outside socket area so just place cpu carefully...as has been said.

You wont find a guide or video for this since it's not the recommended install method.


----------



## kadok34

OrionBG said:


> Yes, you can.
> How? Very Carefully! Like Intel LGA CPU are installed.
> Just have in mind that the possibility for something to go wrong is times higher than normal without the carrier frame.





Arne Saknussemm said:


> First off, I can't see why you would do this...but assuming you have done something... eccentric shall we say
> 
> I presume you remove the orange holding frame from the cpu and check to see if you have to remove black carrier frame from socket (though this might not be necessary)...then carefully place cpu...and close carrier frame and socket





Perfect!!

Thanks for your answers!


----------



## betam4x

Djreversal said:


> has anyone got over 4.1ghz on a 1950x yet??? i couldnt get it when i first built my system right away.. Not sure if things have come along since then.


I can get 4.2 pretty easily and 4.3 with a bit higher voltage, buttesting it for stability is the issue. Let me explain to you why:

MSI boards (or maybe the 1950X chip itself?) have a 272 amp power limit. Apparently the second this limit gets reached, PROCHOT gets sent and the board throttles the chip to 550 MHz. If you disable PROCHOT (you can do it in Ryzen Master settings, I've yet to see a board with an option to turn it off in BIOS), but it still won't exceed 272 amps and the chip will start error-ing out due to not getting enough power. This isn't a 4.2 GHz issue either, I can reproduce at lower clock speeds...as low as 3.7 or 3.8 if I max out LLC while keeping the VCORE high enough (something you should never do btw, so don't). I can disable a die and do prime95 without issue, and I can enable both dies, but with 4+4 configuratioon or 6+6 configuration and run prime95 without issue, but having all 16 cores at full load at 4.2 GHz pulls too much power.

If you want to find out what your chip is really capable of and you have a 1950x, back it down to 12 or 8 cores and play with the clock speed, LLC, and voltage settings. You will be surprised.

EDIT: And before you mention that it might be a cooling issue, it isn't. At least not in the traditional sense. I have 6 3k RPM Noctua fans keeping my 360 degree rad cool, and they keep the CPU under 68 (usually around 65 or 66) degrees running Prime95 at the 'hot' settings' at 4.1 GHz. polling the CPU temp as fast as possible under 4.2 shows it doesn't even hit 60.


----------



## MNMadman

The Taichi board has PROCHOT disable in BIOS, and a MOS PROCHOT (which I think is for VRM HOT) disable as a physical switch on the board. I have both disabled and I've had my VRM hit 111°C (before I put direct airflow on them) -- and that was just in RealBench. It would have gone higher in Prime.


----------



## gupsterg

Highest I've seen as VRM is ~97°C, ASUS ZE stock VRM fan. Room ambient ~24°C, 3.95GHz @ 1.325V, ~2.5hrs run of P95 v29.4B8 (Custom 8K 4096K 26000MB), screenie link.



Arne Saknussemm said:


> Hello all!
> 
> Recent convert to AMD here...TR deserved the attention! Put together a Zenith Extreme and 1920X.
> 
> I was going to go for a 1950X but hearing Zen+ versions and 2nd gen were coming and not having the experience...aaaand finding a 1920X for a bit over 500 euros on Amazon France...I went with a 1920X....for now
> 
> It's up and running great!


Welcome to the RED Rebellion Arne! :thumb: .


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

gupsterg said:


> Welcome to the RED Rebellion Arne! :thumb: .


Cheers gupsterg|! That makes it official


----------



## Tamalero

Arne Saknussemm said:


> Cheers gupsterg|! That makes it official


I can say that you will surely love this RED thing called Threadripper.

The joys of rendering 4k video faster than real time... editing hundred of photos and the only limitation will be you in speed (my computer, a corei5 6600k used to freeze for a few seconds when handling a ton of photos). Now processes the photos (with all filters) faster than I can send them to process.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> The Taichi board has PROCHOT disable in BIOS, and a MOS PROCHOT (which I think is for VRM HOT) disable as a physical switch on the board. I have both disabled and I've had my VRM hit 111°C (before I put direct airflow on them) -- and that was just in RealBench. It would have gone higher in Prime.


The MSI board lets you control max VRM temps, and it also has something called a VRM OCP expander or some nonesense. I suspect the temp settings work, but the expander does not. Needless to say, If I spent as much time tinkering with this board/CPU as I did working on something productive...I'd probably be president or something right now. Currently testing LLC settings at various clockspeeds, since MSI's LLC settings are completely inversed and I'm STILL trying to get 4.2 or maybe even 4.3 to work without throttling. The entire issue is that it is not black and white. I haven't given up though damn it!


----------



## MNMadman

Arne Saknussemm said:


> I have a question for you TR owners.
> 
> I have a 1920X on a Zenith Extreme and on 3 different BIOS (0804 0902 0019) neither P-state OC nor offset voltage allows the voltage to downclock at idle.
> 
> Stock everything works as normal and manual OC everything works as you'd expect.
> 
> Anyone else seen this behaviour from their system?


Just tried P-State OC for the first time on *Heatripper Threadkiller* Lite* and it is working as expected. It down-clocks and down-volts when not loaded and jumps up in both clocks and volts when loaded.

*Note: The Lite version doesn't have the custom loop installed -- just an Enermax LiqTech 280 AIO for now.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

Tamalero said:


> I can say that you will surely love this RED thing called Threadripper.
> 
> The joys of rendering 4k video faster than real time... editing hundred of photos and the only limitation will be you in speed (my computer, a corei5 6600k used to freeze for a few seconds when handling a ton of photos). Now processes the photos (with all filters) faster than I can send them to process.


Yeah, it's a beast alright I am enjoying it so far...a couple of teething problems here but I'll sort those...looking forward to working with it...hope AMD can continue the momentum!



MNMadman said:


> Just tried P-State OC for the first time on *Heatripper Threadkiller* Lite* and it is working as expected. It down-clocks and down-volts when not loaded and jumps up in both clocks and volts when loaded.
> 
> *Note: The Lite version doesn't have the custom loop installed -- just an Enermax LiqTech 280 AIO for now.


Thanks MNMadman! righto seems like I have a board with BIOS problems...no biggie...Amazon will swap that out tomorrow


----------



## Tamalero

Arne Saknussemm said:


> Thanks MNMadman! righto seems like I have a board with BIOS problems...no biggie...Amazon will swap that out tomorrow


What a shame? no updates or the updates didnt fix the issues you were having?


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

Tamalero said:


> What a shame? no updates or the updates didnt fix the issues you were having?


Hey Tamalero...no..can't seem to fix some strangeness here...outside chance it's CPU but I have to suspect the board/BIOS here...BIOS flashback doesn't fix it...I'm hoping new board is 100% tomorrow

It's weird because for stock operation everything runs fine...but for some things the BIOS is definitely not reacting as it should...I thought they might be BIOS quirks but no one else is having problems so best to swap stuff out...not put me off the platform though...these things happen sometimes


----------



## joeybuddy96

I've been getting about 350H/s with Minergate set to XMR. That comes out to about $0.33/day. I'm not factoring in energy costs. At this rate, my 1950x will pay for itself in a mere 8.21 years. Is there a virtual currency that will earn at a higher rate?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

joeybuddy96 said:


> I've been getting about 350H/s with Minergate set to XMR. That comes out to about $0.33/day. I'm not factoring in energy costs. At this rate, my 1950x will pay for itself in a mere 8.21 years. Is there a virtual currency that will earn at a higher rate?



Checkout Aeon.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

Well...big apology to ASUS for doubting their marvelous motherboard...

New MB same behaviour...but now offset works...must be some weird CPU thing...anyone know if BIOS loads up to CPU?...

But this CPU is so good...3600MHz RAM and 4.1GHz at 1.325v that I'm going to run it stock or manual OC for the times I want/need to....and continue investigating...

Maybe agesa 1.0.0.5 will sort it...


----------



## Tamalero

joeybuddy96 said:


> I've been getting about 350H/s with Minergate set to XMR. That comes out to about $0.33/day. I'm not factoring in energy costs. At this rate, my 1950x will pay for itself in a mere 8.21 years. Is there a virtual currency that will earn at a higher rate?


supposedly any cryptonight based miners do good with threadripper.

I tried Monero myself. getting 1200-1300 Kh/s


----------



## Tamalero

Its my imagination or the this forum thread is dead?
I keep getting notifications but no updates.


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> Its my imagination or the this forum thread is dead?
> I keep getting notifications but no updates.


Maybe your notifications are going haywire... I have not seen any notifications for this thread since your last post on 22nd.


----------



## x7007

My Enermax LiqTech TR4 360mm Pump is broken I think . I can't even do 3.4 normal prime 95 full load without reaching 89c and I stop it ..

I feel that one of the pipes is hot. the fans are working terribly fast than before. 

What can I do ??


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

x7007 said:


> What can I do ??


Not much else you can do...RMA the cooler. Those are classic symptoms of a defective cooler. No point damaging CPU running prime on a deficient cooler...

There are times when a small leak can let air into the loop and block flow that way so give it a careful inspection...


----------



## x7007

Arne Saknussemm said:


> Not much else you can do...RMA the cooler. Those are classic symptoms of a defective cooler. No point damaging CPU running prime on a deficient cooler...
> 
> There are times when a small leak can let air into the loop and block flow that way so give it a careful inspection...



What do you mean with the air,, how can I check ? how can I fix ?


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

Sorry x7007 you can't fix an AIO...you have to remove the cooler and send it back to where you bought it from. Or get in contact with manufacturer...depends on warranty conditions...

When you remove it you can check for signs of leaks but maybe it's just the pump has broken.


----------



## x7007

Arne Saknussemm said:


> Sorry x7007 you can't fix an AIO...you have to remove the cooler and send it back to where you bought it from. Or get in contact with manufacturer...depends on warranty conditions...
> 
> When you remove it you can check for signs of leaks but maybe it's just the pump has broken.


But even so if only the pump it's still connected to the other parts. Will I need to send them including the fans ? because it's connected to the big 360mm radiator.. I can't disconnect the pump from the big 360mm radiator.

I messaged both Amazon and Enermax. will amazon help me with that or only Enermax ? How they expect me to send it to them... it's so expensive delivery, it cost me just to get it 60$ delivery ........ now I need to pay another 50-60$ again ! .,,... I feel so CRAP.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

When did you buy it? The normal thing with Amazon is they will send you a prepaid shipping label...at least here in Europe...States might be different. You will have to return the whole cooler...all the contents of the original purchase.


----------



## x7007

Arne Saknussemm said:


> When did you buy it? The normal thing with Amazon is they will send you a prepaid shipping label...at least here in Europe...States might be different. You will have to return the whole cooler...all the contents of the original purchase.


I bought it at Delivered Jan 16, 2018 but it actually delivered to me like 7 days later . because I live in Israel and it was delivered to USA address that delivered it to me.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

You will have to return it to US address and they will have to return it to Amazon. One of the drawbacks of doing things this way. Not sure it's worth it with all the postage expense?


----------



## x7007

Arne Saknussemm said:


> You will have to return it to US address and they will have to return it to Amazon. One of the drawbacks of doing things this way. Not sure it's worth it with all the postage expense?



What other thing can I do ? ... that's the thing , all I want is to go somewhere hand it in and wait for a replacement. what would someone do if he doesn't have any other cooler replacement ? I still have my Corsair i115 to use when I won't have the Enermax.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

You would have to buy locally for that. I'm not sure any local retailer will take it...does it have an international warranty?

I'm not sure the H115i will mount on threadripper


----------



## x7007

Arne Saknussemm said:


> You would have to buy locally for that. I'm not sure any local retailer will take it...does it have an international warranty?
> 
> I'm not sure the H115i will mount on threadripper


You mean buy another one ? they don't sell it at all in Israel . the i115 fit but doesn't cool as good as Enermax .


----------



## chris89

I'm testing encoding using H265 HEVC on Radeon RX560 upscaling a 1920x1080 movie to 3840x2160 64Mbps 23.97fps with edge enhancement & color enhancement

CyberLink Power Director 16 Ultra

Its "This is 40" & its 2 hr 17 min long & to encode takes almost 3 hrs on dual x5675 xeon 24 threads... How long does it take on Ryzen?


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> But even so if only the pump it's still connected to the other parts. Will I need to send them including the fans ? because it's connected to the big 360mm radiator.. I can't disconnect the pump from the big 360mm radiator.
> 
> I messaged both Amazon and Enermax. will amazon help me with that or only Enermax ? How they expect me to send it to them... it's so expensive delivery, it cost me just to get it 60$ delivery ........ now I need to pay another 50-60$ again ! .,,... I feel so CRAP.


AIOS are full kits, that means the pump, cooler, radiator and fans are of the same kit.

And since you bought it with Amazon, you should contact Amazon, and only if they refuse you (since they have limited responsibility in terms of days) enermax should be able to help.

As for what you say, it seems like your pump is not pumping the water correctly.


----------



## Tamalero

chris89 said:


> I'm testing encoding using H265 HEVC on Radeon RX560 upscaling a 1920x1080 movie to 3840x2160 64Mbps 23.97fps with edge enhancement & color enhancement
> 
> CyberLink Power Director 16 Ultra
> 
> Its "This is 40" & its 2 hr 17 min long & to encode takes almost 3 hrs on dual x5675 xeon 24 threads... How long does it take on Ryzen?


Does cyberlink scale well on all cores? I know that some of the rendering options in VEGAS does not use all threads.

But I presume you will get at least 40% increase in performance compared to that old westmere core (plus the frequency difference if you use a 1950X or EPYC)

*edit*
I hope you post your findings!


----------



## chris89

Yeah CyberLink Power Director 16 Ultra has amazing thread usage... I think it can hit on unlimited threads.. This on the CPU alone.. Since the RX560 had a 4k HEVC H265 bitrate limit 4.2Mbps & it looks bad... but CPU Encode only has amazing perfect flawless quality...

*Yeah bro! I was thinking this task here would also put a dual EPYC Dual 128 thread rig to shame I'm sure... This kind of stuff needs Quad-Socket EPYC with 256 threads & then we'll see some solid numbers haha*

GPU encode gives a weird pulsing quality that looks poor & can encode it at 24 fps basically & encode it in 2 1/2 hours

CPU encode gives perfectly flawless quality that looks supreme but encodes like 12 hours for 2 1/2 hour video from 1080p to 4k with color & edge enhancement at 100% (sharper at 4k upscale)

This is upscaling it to 3840x2160 HEVC H265 MP4 10Mbps 23.97 on High Profile & Optimize Quality & audio 384kbps

It's gonna take ages but its cool to see... I wonder if the Ryzen can get this same thing done in 2 1/2 hours or less?


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> AIOS are full kits, that means the pump, cooler, radiator and fans are of the same kit.
> 
> And since you bought it with Amazon, you should contact Amazon, and only if they refuse you (since they have limited responsibility in terms of days) enermax should be able to help.
> 
> As for what you say, it seems like your pump is not pumping the water correctly.


Ye I talked to amazon , they agree to make exception because of the time and they agree to make another exception to send replacement while I wait for it and when it arrives I will send them the broken one. but I will need to send one time for delivering it to them. I won't be charged for them delivering the replacement to me.

So it's like I paid 151$ for enermax + 60$ delivery the first time , and now another 60$-70$ to send the item to them . like I paid 271$ for one item..... seriously I could buy like 4 noctuas for TR4 + 2nd fan for them.

Talk about crappy enermax warranty , I also talked to them while I talked to amazon waiting to hear maybe they will help me more... but no . they want to send only to USA and I will need to pay 60$ just to send to them. then WAIT till it arrive, then they will send to the USA delivery service I use and I will need to pay another 60-70$ just for it to arrive to me.. so I chose the amazon way.


The replacement unit can only be shipped to USA or CANADA shipping address. 
More detail warranty/RMA information please visit the links www.enermaxusa.com 

**************************************************************************************************
Please kindly provide following information for warranty verification purpose.

· Full name & contact phone number

· USA Return Shipping address

· Model number & serial number


After we receive this information it will go under RMA procedure and we will send you return instructions on how to return your RMA.

Please note that we ship the replacement unit (Shipping is covered by us) after we have received the defective unit. Customer is responsible for shipping cost returning RMA product to LEPATEK. .


Please note, Cannot disassemble and/or modification of any component. Otherwise Warranty is subject to void. WARRANTY VOID IF ANY LABEL / SCREW ARE REMOVED OR BROKEN.




Currently I bought the Noctua U14S TR4 , and now Prime95 full load is 82.5C max for 20 min or so ... not the best.. the Enermax did 70c max. I'll add a second fan hopefully it will help.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

That's pretty decent of Amazon :thumb: Hope the new one is quick to arrive...


----------



## x7007

Arne Saknussemm said:


> That's pretty decent of Amazon :thumb: Hope the new one is quick to arrive...



Any idea why I'm getting 82.5 4.0 1.3V with prime 95 B8 ? while on reviews they get 60-65C ?

I don't understand why I have 15C more. I did the Noctua recommended way .


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

Without ambient temperature it's impossible to make a comparison


----------



## x7007

Arne Saknussemm said:


> Without ambient temperature it's impossible to make a comparison


My ambient temp is 18c between this . so you say for him it could be lower like 8c ?


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> My ambient temp is 18c between this . so you say for him it could be lower like 8c ?


Check out the temps of the VRMS too. They can produce a lot of heat and can be pretty close to your heatsinks/fans.
In the other side.. perhaps the cooler is not well seated or with too few/too much thermal paste?

Also your case can be the culprit too.


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

x7007 said:


> My ambient temp is 18c between this . so you say for him it could be lower like 8c ?


I doubt it but if the review does not state the ambient temp then ignore the review...that is basic information...

Your temp sounds about what I would expect or maybe a little high for 1.3v... sure..maybe reseat with not too much thermal paste...

Just make sure you are comparing like with like....same Stress test...same number of fans....same ambient....not inside case vs on a test bench etc etc


----------



## MNMadman

x7007 said:


> Any idea why I'm getting 82.5 4.0 1.3V with prime 95 B8 ? while on reviews they get 60-65C ?
> 
> I don't understand why I have 15C more. I did the Noctua recommended way .


They likely use an earlier version of Prime95 that doesn't include AVX instructions. The newer versions do have that and it works the CPU much harder.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> They likely use an earlier version of Prime95 that doesn't include AVX instructions. The newer versions do have that and it works the CPU much harder.


It can depend on the cooling setup. It also depends heavily on your vdroop. I had a couple screenshots I thought I had posted earlier, 1 with an lower voltage and an LLC setting of 1, and another with a higher voltage with LLC8. The LLC8 (least aggressive) version ran much cooler than LLC1. I'll try and show some tests as an example later tonight.


----------



## x7007

MNMadman said:


> They likely use an earlier version of Prime95 that doesn't include AVX instructions. The newer versions do have that and it works the CPU much harder.


You sure there weren't AVX support ?



betam4x said:


> It can depend on the cooling setup. It also depends heavily on your vdroop. I had a couple screenshots I thought I had posted earlier, 1 with an lower voltage and an LLC setting of 1, and another with a higher voltage with LLC8. The LLC8 (least aggressive) version ran much cooler than LLC1. I'll try and show some tests as an example later tonight.


I am using LLC Auto . should I change it ? the voltage doesn't go above 1.296 or so. I mean it's barely 1.3


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> It can depend on the cooling setup. It also depends heavily on your vdroop. I had a couple screenshots I thought I had posted earlier, 1 with an lower voltage and an LLC setting of 1, and another with a higher voltage with LLC8. The LLC8 (least aggressive) version ran much cooler than LLC1. I'll try and show some tests as an example later tonight.


I tried the same thing on my Taichi board and didn't have the same results at all. The higher voltage with lower LLC still had higher temps on the VRM. And I did verify that the voltage was drooping more in HWinfo. I only did a couple of quick tests though.

I will do more once I have it properly cooled.


----------



## MNMadman

x7007 said:


> You sure there weren't AVX support ?


No, but reviewers/testers for websites usually stick with the same versions of programs and testing procedures to remain consistent. They likely haven't changed versions in a long time.


----------



## betam4x

x7007 said:


> You sure there weren't AVX support ?



Didn't they used to have a way to disable this? I can't find it. Regardless, I ran an LLC test, but it looks like MSI changed and/or broke LLC settings with the last BIOS. Will have to look more closely.


----------



## alienalvan

*New to TR1950X*

Hi guys,

Just get my new mobo & CPU yesterday & tested to see whether it boot or not, taken a few shots & also providing some details of my purchase experience for an used X399 mobo.

CPU: AMD Threadripper 1950X (New)
MOBO: Gigabyte X399 Gaming 7 (Used)
PSU: Corsair AX1200 (Used)
GPU: Gainward GTX1080Ti 11G x 2 (New)
RAM: Team - Night Hawk RGB 16GB x 4 (New)
CASE: Cougar Panzer (New)
FANS: ID-Cooling SF-12025RGB x 6 (New)
RADS: Magicool 240mm + 360mm (New)
COOLER: Byski Threadripper Water Block & Full GPU Block x 2 (New)

1. After received my cpu & mobo found out that there's dented cpu legging so i have to fix it myself & make it work.
2. Some loose track screw for the M.2 slots but manage to unscrew it using some rubber bends tweak around.
3. Mobo was place in the original packing without any anti static plastic causing the box shred by the mobo pins & stick onto the mobo

Will try to show some build log once all goods are receive, stay tune.


----------



## Tamalero

alienalvan said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> Just get my new mobo & CPU yesterday & tested to see whether it boot or not, taken a few shots & also providing some details of my purchase experience for an used X399 mobo.
> 
> CPU: AMD Threadripper 1950X (New)
> MOBO: Gigabyte X399 Gaming 7 (Used)
> PSU: Corsair AX1200 (Used)
> GPU: Gainward GTX1080Ti 11G x 2 (New)
> RAM: Team - Night Hawk RGB 16GB x 4 (New)
> CASE: Cougar Panzer (New)
> FANS: ID-Cooling SF-12025RGB x 6 (New)
> RADS: Magicool 240mm + 360mm (New)
> COOLER: Byski Threadripper Water Block & Full GPU Block x 2 (New)
> 
> 1. After received my cpu & mobo found out that there's dented cpu legging so i have to fix it myself & make it work.
> 2. Some loose track screw for the M.2 slots but manage to unscrew it using some rubber bends tweak around.
> 3. Mobo was place in the original packing without any anti static plastic causing the box shred by the mobo pins & stick onto the mobo
> 
> Will try to show some build log once all goods are receive, stay tune.


nice nudes!


----------



## betam4x

alienalvan said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> Just get my new mobo & CPU yesterday & tested to see whether it boot or not, taken a few shots & also providing some details of my purchase experience for an used X399 mobo.
> 
> CPU: AMD Threadripper 1950X (New)
> MOBO: Gigabyte X399 Gaming 7 (Used)
> PSU: Corsair AX1200 (Used)
> GPU: Gainward GTX1080Ti 11G x 2 (New)
> RAM: Team - Night Hawk RGB 16GB x 4 (New)
> CASE: Cougar Panzer (New)
> FANS: ID-Cooling SF-12025RGB x 6 (New)
> RADS: Magicool 240mm + 360mm (New)
> COOLER: Byski Threadripper Water Block & Full GPU Block x 2 (New)
> 
> 1. After received my cpu & mobo found out that there's dented cpu legging so i have to fix it myself & make it work.
> 2. Some loose track screw for the M.2 slots but manage to unscrew it using some rubber bends tweak around.
> 3. Mobo was place in the original packing without any anti static plastic causing the box shred by the mobo pins & stick onto the mobo
> 
> Will try to show some build log once all goods are receive, stay tune.


I'm interested in RAM speeds and latencies. Although I've been happy with my CL16 DDR4 3200 RAM thus far, I've been wanting to go to 64 GB for a while, but I don't want to lose speed as a result.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> I tried the same thing on my Taichi board and didn't have the same results at all. The higher voltage with lower LLC still had higher temps on the VRM. And I did verify that the voltage was drooping more in HWinfo. I only did a couple of quick tests though.
> 
> I will do more once I have it properly cooled.


LLC options are different on each board. They may also sometimes be broken. I suspect (with limited knowledge of the matter) that every manufacturer is given a core set of options, and they are left to their own devices as to whether they implement them or how.


----------



## x7007

Yes you are correct with the prime95 AVX

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-3268884/version-prime95-realistic.html

It feel like 100% they didn't use AVX . I need to find review that uses newest prime95. why for the love of god they don't write the version on the to name of the window ?? and why don't reviews said what version.... they have the hands to write all the review but not software version.. without pictures all I know they can use windows XP .


----------



## betam4x

Does anyone have any idea what CLDO_VDDP voltage, CPU 1P8 Voltage, and VDD SoC voltages are supposed to correspond to? These are the only settings I haven't touched yet, and Googling hasn't helped.


----------



## MNMadman

VDD_SoC Voltage: Helps with RAM overclocking (even running at XMP settings) and general stability when overclocking the CPU. You want to keep it as low as possible while still remaining stable, just like the CPU voltage. Can go up to 1.2v or so safely. Commonly run around 1.1v with 3200 RAM and 4GHz CPU overclock.

CPU 1P8 Voltage: Don't know for sure, but if I had to guess I would say it's likely the 1.8v CPU input voltage. Sometimes raising this can help with overclocks. Mine's at 1.85v by default.

No idea what CLDO_VDDP is.


----------



## tarot

CLDO_VDDP 
half ram voltage so set 1.35 then half that...if I remember correctly and probably don't its the ram boot voltage?
it is important to have it 1/2 of set voltage.

as for LLC on the taichi board its upside down miss Jane so 1 is off 5 is high so 5 gives bigger droop mine at the moment is on 4 as I upped mine to 1.331 for 4.05 it was stable for everything except prime 95 at 1.312 llc 3 but just to be safe  din't affect temps or power usage much anyway.

as for temps I have found with this and my vega ambient is very important when its 18C here (mountains I can happily clock what I want bench to the wazoo but when its 27 and above things start to fall down (temp wise it is still stable and still under 70 for the cpu and 65 for the vega) but it really kicks the temps up.

so if the review site does not state the ambient then the reading are redundant. Well in my opinion anyway


----------



## Arne Saknussemm

From here https://community.amd.com/community/gaming/blog/2017/05/25/community-update-4-lets-talk-dram


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> VDD_SoC Voltage: Helps with RAM overclocking (even running at XMP settings) and general stability when overclocking the CPU. You want to keep it as low as possible while still remaining stable, just like the CPU voltage. Can go up to 1.2v or so safely. Commonly run around 1.1v with 3200 RAM and 4GHz CPU overclock.
> 
> CPU 1P8 Voltage: Don't know for sure, but if I had to guess I would say it's likely the 1.8v CPU input voltage. Sometimes raising this can help with overclocks. Mine's at 1.85v by default.
> 
> No idea what CLDO_VDDP is.


Yeah, thanks, MSI's settings are frustrating. I actually read somewhere that the VDD_SoC voltage wasn't actually the SoC voltage, it probably is though. Not that any of that matters, this board actually has GREAT RAM compatibility. When I first built this build back in August, I opted for cheaper Corsair DDR4 3200 LPX RAM due to Samsung prices at the time. I plugged all 4 sticks in, booted the system, selected XMP profile 2 for 3200CL16, and it worked great.

I'm just trying to understand some of MSI's greek with regards to the rest of the voltages. Their help/manual is useless. "This setting adjusts the CPU 1P8 voltage" is an example what it says. I was just looking to see if any of those values could help with getting past 4.1 ghz. I can do 4.2 GHz and not have throttling or crashing in all but stress tests. However, prime95 throttles, and if I disable PROCHOT, i get test failures, but I suspect it's another component, not the CPU, that is causing the issue. 4.1 GHz appears to be a hard wall. I thought maybe it might be a power supply +12 rail limitation, but according to the specs, nearly all the available juice is reserved for +12 volts. I find if very hard to believe that the voltage curve scales smoothly until 4.1, especially when people are able to hit 5 ghz using LN2 (though that's not my goal.) I'm wondering if it's a socket/power delivery limitation that just can't be overcome. 8 cores (4+0) does fine @ 4.2 and can run prime95 all day long. However, I hit the problem again after 4.3 GHz, (and 4.3 takes me over 1.45V anyway).

None of this matters much anyway, soon the 2950X will be out, and it looks like we'll probably have a boost of 4.3 or 4.4 GHz. At that point, I'll upgrade to a new motherboard and CPU and ebay this one. I DO wish review sites would pay closer attention to BIOS settings and whether they work. MSI has never had a bug free BIOS, yet I've seen certain reviewers give it great reviews. When fan profiles don't work, why would you give that board a good review? (The fan profile issue was present in 1.6, MSI has it's own method for measuring CPU temps, and that method was reporting a temp of 0C at idle and the actual load would be an offset from that, causing fan profiles to work incorrectly.) 1.7 has it's own issues (like failed overclocks causing warm reboots to stop working, and some settings in the BIOS not working at all, etc.)


----------



## betam4x

The following post will document my attempts to push my 1950X past 4.1 GHz. I will be testing 4.2 GHz using Prime95 with the default 'small' settings. I may dig in later and disable FMA3, AVX, etc, but for now, defaults. Note that VRM Mins/Maxes are my observations, Those sensors get a TON of erroneous readings, -104.5C for a min? 312C for a max? lol.

Settings:
Hyperthreading off
Opcache disabled
Spread Spectrum Disabled
SVM disabled
IOMMU Disabled
Memory still set to DDR4 3200
LLC is set to 4
OCP/VRM Expander set to enabled.
PROCHOT not touched in Ryzen master. I will be using the BIOS for all changes.

Quad Core (2+0) - 4.2 GHz - VCORE 1.35 GHz - All 4 cores show a VID of 1.337 V - Temps are Tdie: 58C Max so far, VRM Temps are 56-58C. 15 minutes of Prime 95, no issues, in the interest of time I'm going to call it at 15 minutes. Errors have happened from previous experience after 10 minutes, but I don't think I've ever seen one after 15. Note the VCore. 

Six Core (3+0) - 4.2 GHz - VCORE 1.375 - All 6 cores show a VID of 1.356 under load. Interesting. Tdie temp so far is 64C, VRMs ar around 58.0C with the usual nonsense readings for min/max. Still no throttling, testing in progress. (1.35 failed, I could have bumped voltages just a tiny bit, but I figured I would do a quarter volt at a time, I also know I said I wouldn't use Ryzen Master, but if this test still fails, I'll reboot and use BIOS instead). Calling it on the 6 core, Everything is passing and Prime95 has been running for about 15 minutes. Since 6 cores isn't my end result, I'm not pursuing further.

Eight Cores(4+0) - VCore 1.4, Vid 1.375 under load for all cores, no throttling. Max temp, 68.5, but average temp was 67.9. A bit high, but a more aggressive fan curve could fix that along with LLC tweaks possibly. SUCCESS! The next test is a bit more tricky. 12 cores is a 3+3 configuration. We'll see what happens. I also let this test run a bit longer this time and everything is still passing.

12 Cores: (3+3) - Had to bump the VCore to 1.45, however, So far so good. CPU temps are a bit warm. Top temp was 73.5, and VRM temps are up to 87C. CPU Core Current almost 200 amps at this point. 272 amps is where i started getting throttling. So far, no throttling at 12 cores, all tests are passing as well. Going all out now.

16 cores throttle to 550 MHz. If I disable PROCHOT, they do not throttle, but power delivery shoots through the roof. At 1.45V the CPU is pulling nearly 400 watts itself. In addition, the other components in my system are pulling another 300 watts. That means 700-750 watts from an 850 watt PS. In addition, CPU temps at 4.2 GHz were around 90C. I would need a much more powerful cooling solution and a much more powerful power supply to continue testing. 12 cores worked great though, and 4 cores I can take to 4.4 GHz without issue. Hopefully the 2950X won't have this OC hard wall. If anyone else has managed to hit 4.2 GHz, feel free to let me know. I figured I would try this fun little project to kill some time.


----------



## Randa71

Hi guys.
i own a 1950X on a Asus Prime X399A. I would like to know which is standard SOC voltage applied by the motherboard for ddr4 2400 or ddr4 2666. I ask because on the C6H and a 1700X with ddr4 2400 VSOC was automatically set to 1.050V. With DDR4 2133 VSOC was automatically set to 0.9V. With Threadripper it's the same?


----------



## MNMadman

SOC shouldn't be that high for only 2400 or 2666 RAM.

Also, there is no real "standard" SOC voltage. There is Auto, but that is variable, just like the Auto CPU voltage. However, you shouldn't need 1.05v SOC unless you have 3000 or 3200 RAM.

You want the SOC voltage to be as low as possible while still being stable, just like CPU voltage. I would start with 0.9v SOC and see if it's stable. If so, try going lower and test stability again. If it's not stable go higher and test again.


----------



## betam4x

Randa71 said:


> Hi guys.
> i own a 1950X on a Asus Prime X399A. I would like to know which is standard SOC voltage applied by the motherboard for ddr4 2400 or ddr4 2666. I ask because on the C6H and a 1700X with ddr4 2400 VSOC was automatically set to 1.050V. With DDR4 2133 VSOC was automatically set to 0.9V. With Threadripper it's the same?


I would just leave it on auto. With with my board, I've never had to manually change RAM settings, and I run Hynix DDR4 3200CL16, and I don't believe the RAM was on the QVL at the time. Threadripper tends to tolerate RAM better than Ryzen. Though I would recommend DDR4 3200+ if you can afford it.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> I would just leave it on auto. With with my board, I've never had to manually change RAM settings, and I run Hynix DDR4 3200CL16, and I don't believe the RAM was on the QVL at the time. Threadripper tends to tolerate RAM better than Ryzen. Though I would recommend DDR4 3200+ if you can afford it.


Mine goes over 1.2v SOC when left on Auto. I'm currently running it manually at 1.1v with complete stability and will be trying to get it lower.


----------



## Tamalero

MNMadman said:


> Mine goes over 1.2v SOC when left on Auto. I'm currently running it manually at 1.1v with complete stability and will be trying to get it lower.


Isnt 1.2V beyond the recommended maximum?

Reminds me how my threadripper ondefault pushes 1.55V for tiny amounts of time when going 4.2GHZ XFR.
Was not exactly happy with that.


----------



## Gaww

Hello. I'm building a PC with ASRock X399 Taichi and TR 1920x (or mayyyybe 1950x) and am looking for the best and stable 64GB RAM. Has anyone built a similar machine and can share his thoughts? I'd really appreciate it. Thanks in advance!


----------



## OrionBG

Gaww said:


> Hello. I'm building a PC with ASRock X399 Taichi and TR 1920x (or mayyyybe 1950x) and am looking for the best and stable 64GB RAM. Has anyone built a similar machine and can share his thoughts? I'd really appreciate it. Thanks in advance!


I would suggest the G.Skill TridentZ or FlareX series of RAM. 3200MHz and CAS14 (worst case CAS16).
Those are using Samsung B dies and according to AMD those dies are the best for Ryzen.
Also have in mind that using only 4 DIMMs is a lot better idea than populating all 8 slots so in your case look for 16GB modules and be sure to check the QVL list for the X399 Taichi on AsRock's website.


----------



## Gaww

OrionBG said:


> I would suggest the G.Skill TridentZ or FlareX series of RAM. 3200MHz and CAS14 (worst case CAS16).
> Those are using Samsung B dies and according to AMD those dies are the best for Ryzen.
> Also have in mind that using only 4 DIMMs is a lot better idea than populating all 8 slots so in your case look for 16GB modules and be sure to check the QVL list for the X399 Taichi on AsRock's website.



This is what I found on their website: https://gyazo.com/57acec4b6457df2111513da0ec1b36bc
It looks like the fastest I can go with four 16GB modules is 2400Mhz


----------



## MNMadman

Gaww said:


> This is what I found on their website: https://gyazo.com/57acec4b6457df2111513da0ec1b36bc
> It looks like the fastest I can go with four 16GB modules is 2400Mhz


Either 4x 16GB sticks or 8x 8GB sticks will be more difficult to overclock (yes, running at XMP is overclocking) so you may not get the rated speed, but you'll likely be able to get higher than 2400.

You will have the best chance with G.Skill Trident Z or Trident Z "X" (specifically Threadripper compatible) or Flare X (specifically AMD compatible) RAM.

I personally use this F4-3200C14Q-32GTZRX kit which is the Trident Z "X" type. You could get two of those for 8x 8GB sticks.

Otherwise, here is a selection I would recommend: Newegg RAM shopping list. There are 4x 8GB kits (you would need to get two), 4x 16GB kits, and 8x 8GB kits on the list.


----------



## betam4x

Gaww said:


> This is what I found on their website: https://gyazo.com/57acec4b6457df2111513da0ec1b36bc
> It looks like the fastest I can go with four 16GB modules is 2400Mhz


Yeah, stay away from the 16 gb sticks until the next chipset comes out. That's why I suffered and went with 4 8gb sticks. RAM speeds matter for Ryzen.

EDIT: Scratch that, there are a number of 16 GB sticks that operate in full quad channel, and there is 1 kit that does 8 DIMMs at 2933. Looks like they updated the QVL.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Either 4x 16GB sticks or 8x 8GB sticks will be more difficult to overclock (yes, running at XMP is overclocking) so you may not get the rated speed, but you'll likely be able to get higher than 2400.
> 
> You will have the best chance with G.Skill Trident Z or Trident Z "X" (specifically Threadripper compatible) or Flare X (specifically AMD compatible) RAM.
> 
> I personally use this F4-3200C14Q-32GTZRX kit which is the Trident Z "X" type. You could get two of those for 8x 8GB sticks.
> 
> Otherwise, here is a selection I would recommend: Newegg RAM shopping list. There are 4x 8GB kits (you would need to get two), 4x 16GB kits, and 8x 8GB kits on the list.


Check out your board's QVL for https://www.gskill.com/en/product/f4-3200c16q2-128gtzky (don't use the QVL on that site, it's out of date)


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Isnt 1.2V beyond the recommended maximum?
> 
> Reminds me how my threadripper ondefault pushes 1.55V for tiny amounts of time when going 4.2GHZ XFR.
> Was not exactly happy with that.


1.2V is for the SoC

The max recommended safe voltage for Threadripper is 1.35V according to AMD. The only other statement AMD has made regarding safe voltages is that voltages 1.45 and above can cause the chip to degrade if used for an extended period of time. Pay no attention to XFR voltages. Your chip is fine and operating within normal limits. I've had my chip as high as 1.675V for 3 hours and 1.575 for 24 hours....I did receive some possible slight degradation, but it also could have been a result of me not running prime95 and other apps long enough. I don't recommend doing that though, there is not a cooler on the planet that can keep that chip cool at 1.675V/4.5 GHz.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> 1.2V is for the SoC
> 
> The max recommended safe voltage for Threadripper is 1.35V according to AMD. The only other statement AMD has made regarding safe voltages is that voltages 1.45 and above can cause the chip to degrade if used for an extended period of time. Pay no attention to XFR voltages. Your chip is fine and operating within normal limits. I've had my chip as high as 1.675V for 3 hours and 1.575 for 24 hours....I did receive some possible slight degradation, but it also could have been a result of me not running prime95 and other apps long enough. I don't recommend doing that though, there is not a cooler on the planet that can keep that chip cool at 1.675V/4.5 GHz.


Sorry for not being clear, my first line of my post was indeed talking about the SOC (aka max voltage for SOC is 1.2V) but for Threadripper VCORE is 1.35V as you said.

I'm happily at 3.925Ghz at 1.22V right now ( no idea why after updating my X399 prime bios I suddenly required both more SOC voltage and VCORE to get stable (was 1.20V now 1.22V for core)


----------



## alienalvan

*All parts has arrived!*

Finally fully received all my storage & water blocks! Ready to start work!


----------



## Tamalero

alienalvan said:


> Finally fully received all my storage & water blocks! Ready to start work!


Nice!

What fan are those btw?


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> Nice!
> 
> What fan are those btw?


According to the writing on them, ID-COOLING http://www.idcooling.com/index.php


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> According to the writing on them, ID-COOLING http://www.idcooling.com/index.php


You have good eye, I tried looking at the bigger image and cant make up the letters lol.


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> You have good eye, I tried looking at the bigger image and cant make up the letters lol.


 I'm just used to looking at bad quality pictures... My Xiaomi Mi Max is a wonderful phone/phablet but the camera sucks a lot...


----------



## alienalvan

Tamalero said:


> Nice!
> 
> What fan are those btw?


Those are DF-12025-RGB-TRIO that cost me around S$14 per piece, the lightning & air pressure is quite good compare with the previous model I've.

http://www.idcooling.com/Product/detail/id/127/name/DF-12025-RGB-TRIO


----------



## alienalvan

OrionBG said:


> I'm just used to looking at bad quality pictures... My Xiaomi Mi Max is a wonderful phone/phablet but the camera sucks a lot...


Sorry for the lousy quality pictures


----------



## betam4x

I'm rather curious how storage latency is affected by NVME raid. Seems like having 4 cards would increase latency by a considerable amount.


----------



## betam4x

CPU 1P8 voltage is REALLY interesting on my board. It appears to help with overclocks. I was able to get 6 cores @ 4.35 GHz somewhat stable at 1.375V?!?!?! Without messing with it, that required 1.575V for the same config. I still don't understand it though. Going to analyze it using heinfo64 unless someone besides me knows more about it than I.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> CPU 1P8 voltage is REALLY interesting on my board. It appears to help with overclocks. I was able to get 6 cores @ 4.35 GHz somewhat stable at 1.375V?!?!?! Without messing with it, that required 1.575V for the same config. I still don't understand it though. Going to analyze it using heinfo64 unless someone besides me knows more about it than I.


The 1.8v CPU Input voltage on X299 does help with overclocking. They recommend up to 2.1v for higher overclocks on liquid cooling in the ASRock OC Formula thread. Don't know if that high limit applies to X399/Threadripper though.

My Taichi board's Auto setting gives 1.84v.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> The 1.8v CPU Input voltage on X299 does help with overclocking. They recommend up to 2.1v for higher overclocks on liquid cooling in the ASRock OC Formula thread. Don't know if that high limit applies to X399/Threadripper though.
> 
> My Taichi board's Auto setting gives 1.84v.


Yeah, my auto setting is 1.8 as well. I wonder if there is a disadvantage to raising it though. I did notice slightly warmer temps. Didn't have much time to play with it. Work and all that. However it was interesting.


----------



## GaudyGhost

*TR 128Gb ECC.. first tests*

I just completed my first AMD build, a Threadripper 1950x with 128 GB ECC RAM. I haven't worked out storage yet, but this is my build:

CPU: AMD Threadripper 1950X
RAM: 2 sets of 4x16 GB Crucial unbuffered DDR4-2400, for at total of 128 GB
Motherboard: ASRock x399 Taichi
Cooling: Noctua NH-U14S-SP3, with an extra fan, Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut liquid metal (I used the entire tube minus a few drops), CoolerMaster Trooper case.
Graphics: EVGA GTX 1070, MSI Radeon RX470 (for use in separate virtual machines)

So far:
RAM automatically ran at 2400 Mhz in spite of having all 8 slots filled (AMD only promises up to 1866)
Prime 95 Blend for ~12 hours and temps stayed under 64C, mostly staying between 56 abd 52C (I don't have an air thermometer, but it is quite cool in the room, I'd guess around 16-19C). I stopped it and it hadn't crashed yet.
Memtest running right now, it says it's doing ECC injection tests, so I guess that means ECC is working?
So far it has completed one pass with no errors.

Anyway, maybe I'll post some proper benchmarks if I get around to it.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> CPU 1P8 voltage is REALLY interesting on my board. It appears to help with overclocks. I was able to get 6 cores @ 4.35 GHz somewhat stable at 1.375V?!?!?! Without messing with it, that required 1.575V for the same config. I still don't understand it though. Going to analyze it using heinfo64 unless someone besides me knows more about it than I.


I started experimenting with the CPU Input voltage last night.

Previously I could get all-core 4.05GHz stable at 1.4v. I increased the CPU Input to 1.85v in the setting (1.888v in BIOS monitor and HWiNFO64), and I was able to verify eight-hour Y-Cruncher stability at 4.1GHz for all cores using 1.4v. Going to try for higher at that voltage.

I have found that Y-Cruncher gives errors where Prime95 v294b8 and RealBench v2.56 don't, so I test with that first now and just run the others for S&G.


----------



## MNMadman

GaudyGhost said:


> ASUS x399 Taichi


*Laser Gaze of Annoyance aimed at GaudyGhost* Something's wrong here...

Nice system though. Good to know the ECC is actually working even though I'll never use it.


----------



## GaudyGhost

LOL I can't believe I wrote ASUS instead of ASRock. I must have been really tired.


----------



## x7007

What do I need to change if I can't pass 4.1 Ghz overclock with 1950x ? it freezes as soon as I start Prime95 .

4.0 Ghz everything on Auto . expect Offset cpu voltage which is 0.22500 or something , for 3.9 I used 0.18500 . works fine. Temps are 58 or so using Enermax Liqtech 360mm

When my Enermax pump stopped working properly and I replaced it for noctua TR4 edition I couldn't do 4.0 also , so it seems to be heat issue ? it is always the same freeze, the computer just freezes , that's all.

What can cause the freeze ?


----------



## MNMadman

x7007 said:


> What do I need to change if I can't pass 4.1 Ghz overclock with 1950x ? it freezes as soon as I start Prime95 .
> 
> 4.0 Ghz everything on Auto . expect Offset cpu voltage which is 0.22500 or something , for 3.9 I used 0.18500 . works fine. Temps are 58 or so using Enermax Liqtech 360mm
> 
> When my Enermax pump stopped working properly and I replaced it for noctua TR4 edition I couldn't do 4.0 also , so it seems to be heat issue ? it is always the same freeze, the computer just freezes , that's all.
> 
> What can cause the freeze ?


Over 4.0GHz is extremely rare unless you are willing to really push the voltage. 0.22500 is not enough. I have to do 0.27500 (1.4v). But even then, a lot of chips simply cannot do it.

The average all-core overclock is 3.8GHz so getting higher than that is a bonus. You can already see that you are hitting a voltage wall -- 0.18500 for 3.9GHz but 0.22500 for 4.0GHz.

You could try increasing the CPU Input voltage from 1.8v, but we don't know the long-term effects of this on Threadripper. It does appear to increase the overclocking capabilities, but it also adds heat. I wouldn't necessarily try it unless you are willing to replace your chip sooner rather than later.


----------



## x7007

MNMadman said:


> Over 4.0GHz is extremely rare unless you are willing to really push the voltage. 0.22500 is not enough. I have to do 0.27500 (1.4v). But even then, a lot of chips simply cannot do it.
> 
> The average all-core overclock is 3.8GHz so getting higher than that is a bonus. You can already see that you are hitting a voltage wall -- 0.18500 for 3.9GHz but 0.22500 for 4.0GHz.
> 
> You could try increasing the CPU Input voltage from 1.8v, but we don't know the long-term effects of this on Threadripper. It does appear to increase the overclocking capabilities, but it also adds heat. I wouldn't necessarily try it unless you are willing to replace your chip sooner rather than later.


I'm sorry I meant 0.12500 , and the 3.8Ghz is 0.1185 . I mean this is very low compare to you for 4.0 Ghz already . I think I got very lucky chip it can do 4.0 at 1.2960 Voltage that's what the CPUZ says at least. Is this CPU Voltage is the only thing I need to boost ? if I go 8 Cores would I be able to do more ? I mean usually games won't use 8 , but some of them 6 , but using half of the cores should give me a boost with overclock so I get more FPS using higher GHZ per core. cause there is big different in some games by just cpu Ghz compare to 4.0 to 4.5


----------



## betam4x

x7007 said:


> I'm sorry I meant 0.12500 , and the 3.8Ghz is 0.1185 . I mean this is very low compare to you for 4.0 Ghz already . I think I got very lucky chip it can do 4.0 at 1.2960 Voltage that's what the CPUZ says at least. Is this CPU Voltage is the only thing I need to boost ? if I go 8 Cores would I be able to do more ? I mean usually games won't use 8 , but some of them 6 , but using half of the cores should give me a boost with overclock so I get more FPS using higher GHZ per core. cause there is big different in some games by just cpu Ghz compare to 4.0 to 4.5


For Threadripper AMD States (from their own site):
Max Recommended Operating Temp: 68C

As far as VCore, for Ryzen, according kitguru:

"Default voltage for manual tuning should start at around 1.3625V, according to AMD. Users should be fine pushing to 1.40V with a decent CPU cooler and up to 1.45V with a high-end dual-tower heatsink or dual-fan AIO radiator. At 1.45V, however, AMD suggests that processor longevity could be affected according to their models."

According to Tom's hardware:

"[AMD] suggests you stick with a 1.35V ceiling if you want your chip to last. Although core voltages in excess of 1.45V are considered sustainable, they'll have a more pronounced effect on longevity."

Given that, I understand that the ceiling is 1.45V VCore and the max operating temp should be 68C. Above that and you will eventually degrade the chip. That being said, it depends on what you use the chip for and how long you want it to last. If you are only going to keep the chip for a year and then upgrade, feel free to push it a bit further. I've had it at 1.55V, but it is VERY difficulty to cool (and my PS can't handle 16 cores at that VCore). I've had my personal chip at 1.675V (Disclaimer: Don't try this at home) without any noticeable effects. If you want to keep the chip for 5 years, stick with a 1.35V VCore, and keep the temps within spec.

Your motherboard selection can also drastically affect overclocks...so can BIOS updates.


----------



## Tamalero

GaudyGhost said:


> LOL I can't believe I wrote ASUS instead of ASRock. I must have been really tired.


Isnt ASROCK a division of ASUSTEK?

So technically you are correct?


----------



## GaudyGhost

Tamalero said:


> Isnt ASROCK a division of ASUSTEK?
> 
> So technically you are correct?


I have no idea. What I do know is that I'm on my 4th pass with Memtest86, and still no errors, and that makes me very happy.


----------



## x7007

betam4x said:


> For Threadripper AMD States (from their own site):
> Max Recommended Operating Temp: 68C
> 
> As far as VCore, for Ryzen, according kitguru:
> 
> "Default voltage for manual tuning should start at around 1.3625V, according to AMD. Users should be fine pushing to 1.40V with a decent CPU cooler and up to 1.45V with a high-end dual-tower heatsink or dual-fan AIO radiator. At 1.45V, however, AMD suggests that processor longevity could be affected according to their models."
> 
> According to Tom's hardware:
> 
> "[AMD] suggests you stick with a 1.35V ceiling if you want your chip to last. Although core voltages in excess of 1.45V are considered sustainable, they'll have a more pronounced effect on longevity."
> 
> Given that, I understand that the ceiling is 1.45V VCore and the max operating temp should be 68C. Above that and you will eventually degrade the chip. That being said, it depends on what you use the chip for and how long you want it to last. If you are only going to keep the chip for a year and then upgrade, feel free to push it a bit further. I've had it at 1.55V, but it is VERY difficulty to cool (and my PS can't handle 16 cores at that VCore). I've had my personal chip at 1.675V (Disclaimer: Don't try this at home) without any noticeable effects. If you want to keep the chip for 5 years, stick with a 1.35V VCore, and keep the temps within spec.
> 
> Your motherboard selection can also drastically affect overclocks...so can BIOS updates.


What happens when I pass the 68c ? I had Noctua TR4 cooling and I passed beyond it. you talk about the tctl or tcdie C ? if I go 1.3500 then it will be enough for 4.1 , the Vcore is the only thing I need to keep in mind or there is other voltage causing the freeze ? I reach to 61c+ at 4.0 but with Prime95 + AVX full 16+16 , I mean I will never have a game that will use , and I am mainly gaming + mining . and mining is not using HT . So I just want to reach at least 4.2 prime95 not freezing . cause I'm not sure what causing the freezing . If prime95 freeze in 2 sec that means it's not stable, but if I give more voltage and it still freeze what could it be ?

Also did anyone saw this ?

https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/...-guidelines-how-to-kill-cpu-with-safe-voltage

Also this is why I want 4.2 

https://www.gamersnexus.net/hwreviews/3015-amd-threadripper-1950x-1920x-review/page-2


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> What happens when I pass the 68c ? I had Noctua TR4 cooling and I passed beyond it. you talk about the tctl or tcdie C ? if I go 1.3500 then it will be enough for 4.1 , the Vcore is the only thing I need to keep in mind or there is other voltage causing the freeze ? I reach to 61c+ at 4.0 but with Prime95 + AVX full 16+16 , I mean I will never have a game that will use , and I am mainly gaming + mining . and mining is not using HT . So I just want to reach at least 4.2 prime95 not freezing . cause I'm not sure what causing the freezing . If prime95 freeze in 2 sec that means it's not stable, but if I give more voltage and it still freeze what could it be ?
> 
> Also did anyone saw this ?
> 
> https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/...-guidelines-how-to-kill-cpu-with-safe-voltage
> 
> Also this is why I want 4.2
> 
> https://www.gamersnexus.net/hwreviews/3015-amd-threadripper-1950x-1920x-review/page-2


For my little experiences I've had.

There seems to be a "critical" point when you go beyond 70C of temps.
In my case, the cpu requires a small bump of voltage to regain stability.

For example.. 

Let's say that I'm going for 3.95Ghz at 1.20V

It is 100% stable if I'm using A/C cranked to the max in my room (as temps in my hometown are on average above 30C ambient). With AC to max and running PRIME or similar tool, the temps reach AT MOST 65C and never crash or freeze.

now.. turn off the A/C.. run the same test, my machine freezes as soon it reaches 70C.
Increasing the voltage to 1.22V stabilizes it again but makes the temp go a little higher still. (75C tdie because of the increased voltage).


As for temps going above 68C...
I know many people mentioned in reddit that the cpu starts throttling once it reaches 80C TDie and pulling power back (forcing the cores to 500Mhz or something like that, and lowering voltage to the minimums).


----------



## Atomicat

MNMadman said:


> Over 4.0GHz is extremely rare unless you are willing to really push the voltage. 0.22500 is not enough. I have to do 0.27500 (1.4v). But even then, a lot of chips simply cannot do it.
> 
> The average all-core overclock is 3.8GHz so getting higher than that is a bonus. You can already see that you are hitting a voltage wall -- 0.18500 for 3.9GHz but 0.22500 for 4.0GHz.
> 
> You could try increasing the CPU Input voltage from 1.8v, but we don't know the long-term effects of this on Threadripper. It does appear to increase the overclocking capabilities, but it also adds heat. I wouldn't necessarily try it unless you are willing to replace your chip sooner rather than later.


Music to my ears! Good to hear it confirmed. I'm running at 4.0 on 1.3125 volts and that's just for padding, it'll do fine on 1.3 even. I can run fine at 4.1 on a couple notches below 1.35 and have hit 4.2, but not interested in pushing it. What I'm more interested in is learning what the hell those thirty odd new pages of bios settings will do. Biggest mystery is memory speed vs performance. I can get read/write over 100 GB/s but this rarely translates into any boost in performance. 

http://valid.x86.fr/ixijy9


----------



## OrionBG

Atomicat said:


> Music to my ears! Good to hear it confirmed. I'm running at 4.0 on 1.3125 volts and that's just for padding, it'll do fine on 1.3 even. I can run fine at 4.1 on a couple notches below 1.35 and have hit 4.2, but not interested in pushing it. What I'm more interested in is learning what the hell those thirty odd new pages of bios settings will do. Biggest mystery is memory speed vs performance. I can get read/write over 100 GB/s but this rarely translates into any boost in performance.
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/ixijy9


Have you run Prime95 with those settings for at least an hour?


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> Have you run Prime95 with those settings for at least an hour?


That's not an overclock unless you can get Prime95 'small' settings and multiple other burn-in tests to pass without failure.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> For my little experiences I've had.
> 
> There seems to be a "critical" point when you go beyond 70C of temps.
> In my case, the cpu requires a small bump of voltage to regain stability.
> 
> For example..
> 
> Let's say that I'm going for 3.95Ghz at 1.20V
> 
> It is 100% stable if I'm using A/C cranked to the max in my room (as temps in my hometown are on average above 30C ambient). With AC to max and running PRIME or similar tool, the temps reach AT MOST 65C and never crash or freeze.
> 
> now.. turn off the A/C.. run the same test, my machine freezes as soon it reaches 70C.
> Increasing the voltage to 1.22V stabilizes it again but makes the temp go a little higher still. (75C tdie because of the increased voltage).
> 
> 
> As for temps going above 68C...
> I know many people mentioned in reddit that the cpu starts throttling once it reaches 80C TDie and pulling power back (forcing the cores to 500Mhz or something like that, and lowering voltage to the minimums).


I've gotten above 80 TDie without throttling, I suspect what people are seeing is a CPU Power Package limit. At around 272 amps I start getting the infamous 550 MHz throttle. At this point, my my cores are below 60C, so I suspect that's what prevents people from hitting high overclocks. I bet if the LN2 folks tried prime95, they'd see throttling as well. I can still use 4.2 GHz every day, but certain workloads that cause that power limit to be hit will cause throttling to start happening.

EDIT: I can make a video showing this behavior as well. Using Small FFTs will cause the max to be hit, but lowering the core count or changing to In Place Large FFTs will not. This happens at ANY clock speed if the CPU is pulling too much currrent. This also limits overclocking potential unless you are willing to lower the core count.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> I've gotten above 80 TDie without throttling, I suspect what people are seeing is a CPU Power Package limit. At around 272 amps I start getting the infamous 550 MHz throttle. At this point, my my cores are below 60C, so I suspect that's what prevents people from hitting high overclocks. I bet if the LN2 folks tried prime95, they'd see throttling as well. I can still use 4.2 GHz every day, but certain workloads that cause that power limit to be hit will cause throttling to start happening.
> 
> EDIT: I can make a video showing this behavior as well. Using Small FFTs will cause the max to be hit, but lowering the core count or changing to In Place Large FFTs will not. This happens at ANY clock speed if the CPU is pulling too much currrent. This also limits overclocking potential unless you are willing to lower the core count.


Interesting, then what is the limit before the cpu goes into throttle mode? I dont think it will kept going until it burns. I know PROCHOT sends the signal to the motherboards.

But is it controlled by the cpu or the motherboard based on their respective specified configuration on temps?


----------



## betam4x

Responded to an old post.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Interesting, then what is the limit before the cpu goes into throttle mode? I dont think it will kept going until it burns. I know PROCHOT sends the signal to the motherboards.
> 
> I don't think there is a thermal limit for throttling, unless the CPU is doing micro-throttling. I've never seen Threadripper throttle from temp, only lock up if it gets too hot.
> 
> Also, I'm testing 8 cores of my 1950X @ 4.2 - 1.45 V, so far prime95 is passing, no throttling either (since it's only using 1 die...(4+0)), but the temps are a bit warm. Upper 70C...so I'm wondering if I need to take a look at my enermax. Supposedly it's rated for 500 watts. I am using third party fans, but these fans should have better performance, not worse. Also going to restart the test under a slightly lower voltage. It's just frustrating that I can't get all 16 cores to work., although I doubt the enermax could keep them all cool anyway. at this rate. I need a test bench case...but the 2950X will be here in 4 months or so....Also I have yet to see any custom loops outperform the enermax 360 unless they have more radiator space...properly tweaking my system gets me low 60s at 4.1 @ load under prime 95. Also, here is 15 minutes at prime95, 4.2 GHz, 1.45V VCore, LLC3. EDIT: It is also pretty warm in my office, so that could be affecting temps. Ambient temp is probably upper 70F.
> 
> Oh and edit #2: Testing at 1.4375 now, so far no failures, guess we'll find out. No wonder XFR on the 1900x was 4.2.
> 
> Edit #3: 8 Cores does fine at 4.2 @ 1.425 on prime 95. Left it on over night without issue. Yet 12 cores locks and requires 1.45V to be stable under prime95. If you ignore Prime95, 1.4375 is "stable" in the sense that things don't crash and the machine doesn't lock. I think I'll stick to 4.1 @ 16 for now knowing that. 4.1 @ 1.35 works perfect.


----------



## 4Strings

betam4x said:


> Tamalero said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting, then what is the limit before the cpu goes into throttle mode? I dont think it will kept going until it burns. I know PROCHOT sends the signal to the motherboards.
> 
> I don't think there is a thermal limit for throttling, unless the CPU is doing micro-throttling. I've never seen Threadripper throttle from temp, only lock up if it gets too hot.
> 
> Also, I'm testing 8 cores of my 1950X @ 4.2 - 1.45 V, so far prime95 is passing, no throttling either (since it's only using 1 die...(4+0)), but the temps are a bit warm. Upper 70C...so I'm wondering if I need to take a look at my enermax. Supposedly it's rated for 500 watts. I am using third party fans, but these fans should have better performance, not worse. Also going to restart the test under a slightly lower voltage. It's just frustrating that I can't get all 16 cores to work., although I doubt the enermax could keep them all cool anyway. at this rate. I need a test bench case...but the 2950X will be here in 4 months or so....Also I have yet to see any custom loops outperform the enermax 360 unless they have more radiator space...properly tweaking my system gets me low 60s at 4.1 @ load under prime 95. Also, here is 15 minutes at prime95, 4.2 GHz, 1.45V VCore, LLC3. EDIT: It is also pretty warm in my office, so that could be affecting temps. Ambient temp is probably upper 70F.
> 
> Oh and edit #2: Testing at 1.4375 now, so far no failures, guess we'll find out. No wonder XFR on the 1900x was 4.2.
> 
> Edit #3: 8 Cores does fine at 4.2 @ 1.425 on prime 95. Left it on over night without issue. Yet 12 cores locks and requires 1.45V to be stable under prime95. If you ignore Prime95, 1.4375 is "stable" in the sense that things don't crash and the machine doesn't lock. I think I'll stick to 4.1 @ 16 for now knowing that. 4.1 @ 1.35 works perfect.
> 
> 
> 
> Nice temps! I can't seem to get that low on my 1900X with the same cooler... ~85C at 1.325V... What fans are you using and what's the noise level like at full load?
Click to expand...


----------



## FuriousReload

4Strings said:


> betam4x said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice temps! I can't seem to get that low on my 1900X with the same cooler... ~85C at 1.325V... What fans are you using and what's the noise level like at full load?
> 
> 
> 
> My 1900X runs 4.1 @ 1.335v and at load runs at 65C. I use a custom loop though, with my GPU first to get the coldest temps, than to my 1900X. I have an AX280 rad and also a AX420 rad with Noctua fans running at a lower speed (I wanna say 750 RPMS)
> 
> Have you tried re-applying your thermal paste?
Click to expand...


----------



## SavantStrike

betam4x said:


> Tamalero said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting, then what is the limit before the cpu goes into throttle mode? I dont think it will kept going until it burns. I know PROCHOT sends the signal to the motherboards.
> 
> I don't think there is a thermal limit for throttling, unless the CPU is doing micro-throttling. I've never seen Threadripper throttle from temp, only lock up if it gets too hot.
> 
> Also, I'm testing 8 cores of my 1950X @ 4.2 - 1.45 V, so far prime95 is passing, no throttling either (since it's only using 1 die...(4+0)), but the temps are a bit warm. Upper 70C...so I'm wondering if I need to take a look at my enermax. Supposedly it's rated for 500 watts. I am using third party fans, but these fans should have better performance, not worse. Also going to restart the test under a slightly lower voltage. It's just frustrating that I can't get all 16 cores to work., although I doubt the enermax could keep them all cool anyway. at this rate. I need a test bench case...but the 2950X will be here in 4 months or so....Also I have yet to see any custom loops outperform the enermax 360 unless they have more radiator space...properly tweaking my system gets me low 60s at 4.1 @ load under prime 95. Also, here is 15 minutes at prime95, 4.2 GHz, 1.45V VCore, LLC3. EDIT: It is also pretty warm in my office, so that could be affecting temps. Ambient temp is probably upper 70F.
> 
> Oh and edit #2: Testing at 1.4375 now, so far no failures, guess we'll find out. No wonder XFR on the 1900x was 4.2.
> 
> Edit #3: 8 Cores does fine at 4.2 @ 1.425 on prime 95. Left it on over night without issue. Yet 12 cores locks and requires 1.45V to be stable under prime95. If you ignore Prime95, 1.4375 is "stable" in the sense that things don't crash and the machine doesn't lock. I think I'll stick to 4.1 @ 16 for now knowing that. 4.1 @ 1.35 works perfect.
> 
> 
> 
> 108.5C?
> 
> You may want to back it down a bit. The silicon in TR doesn't like that kind of hammering.
Click to expand...


----------



## x7007

betam4x said:


> Tamalero said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting, then what is the limit before the cpu goes into throttle mode? I dont think it will kept going until it burns. I know PROCHOT sends the signal to the motherboards.
> 
> I don't think there is a thermal limit for throttling, unless the CPU is doing micro-throttling. I've never seen Threadripper throttle from temp, only lock up if it gets too hot.
> 
> Also, I'm testing 8 cores of my 1950X @ 4.2 - 1.45 V, so far prime95 is passing, no throttling either (since it's only using 1 die...(4+0)), but the temps are a bit warm. Upper 70C...so I'm wondering if I need to take a look at my enermax. Supposedly it's rated for 500 watts. I am using third party fans, but these fans should have better performance, not worse. Also going to restart the test under a slightly lower voltage. It's just frustrating that I can't get all 16 cores to work., although I doubt the enermax could keep them all cool anyway. at this rate. I need a test bench case...but the 2950X will be here in 4 months or so....Also I have yet to see any custom loops outperform the enermax 360 unless they have more radiator space...properly tweaking my system gets me low 60s at 4.1 @ load under prime 95. Also, here is 15 minutes at prime95, 4.2 GHz, 1.45V VCore, LLC3. EDIT: It is also pretty warm in my office, so that could be affecting temps. Ambient temp is probably upper 70F.
> 
> Oh and edit #2: Testing at 1.4375 now, so far no failures, guess we'll find out. No wonder XFR on the 1900x was 4.2.
> 
> Edit #3: 8 Cores does fine at 4.2 @ 1.425 on prime 95. Left it on over night without issue. Yet 12 cores locks and requires 1.45V to be stable under prime95. If you ignore Prime95, 1.4375 is "stable" in the sense that things don't crash and the machine doesn't lock. I think I'll stick to 4.1 @ 16 for now knowing that. 4.1 @ 1.35 works perfect.
> 
> 
> 
> For me the 1950x can't XFR to 4.2 2 Cores or 4 Cores . I don't understand how it works . I cancel the overclock and it just max to 3.7 or 4.0 but not 4.2 .
> 
> For GAMING it is worth to use 8 Cores + HT @ 4.2 for Gaming , the improvement is big . that's why I want 4.2 , We won't use 16+HT FULL LOAD on them while gaming anyway , so if prime95 doesn't pass and freeze , would gaming also ? I mean gaming will barely touch it. so the question is what makes it freeze, the super load Watt , heat which I don't see it reaching too high to 80+ . I will try 1.45 when I'm home. I think if we game there won't be issue 16+HT @ 4.2 right ? could you test if for gaming if it works fine ?
Click to expand...


----------



## MNMadman

x7007 said:


> For me the 1950x can't XFR to 4.2 2 Cores or 4 Cores . I don't understand how it works . I cancel the overclock and it just max to 3.7 or 4.0 but not 4.2


Do you have Core Performance Boost (Taichi BIOS; in your BIOS it might be called something different) enabled? You may have to do that manually after shutting off your overclock. Literally the first boot after that my 1950X XFRs to 4.2GHz on up to four cores. It'll do it just browsing the web. After playing a game every single one of my cores will have seen 4.2GHz because the XFR switches between them.


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> For me the 1950x can't XFR to 4.2 2 Cores or 4 Cores . I don't understand how it works . I cancel the overclock and it just max to 3.7 or 4.0 but not 4.2 .
> 
> For GAMING it is worth to use 8 Cores + HT @ 4.2 for Gaming , the improvement is big . that's why I want 4.2 , We won't use 16+HT FULL LOAD on them while gaming anyway , so if prime95 doesn't pass and freeze , would gaming also ? I mean gaming will barely touch it. so the question is what makes it freeze, the super load Watt , heat which I don't see it reaching too high to 80+ . I will try 1.45 when I'm home. I think if we game there won't be issue 16+HT @ 4.2 right ? could you test if for gaming if it works fine ?


Could be again limitations of power by the motherboard?

I have no trouble seeing my cores go to 4.2Ghz on XFR when running stock. And an all cores turbo at 3.7Ghz on stock.

But then, In my case.. XFR at 4.2Ghz seems to need like 1.45V or more for short periods


----------



## x7007

MNMadman said:


> Do you have Core Performance Boost (Taichi BIOS; in your BIOS it might be called something different) enabled? You may have to do that manually after shutting off your overclock. Literally the first boot after that my 1950X XFRs to 4.2GHz on up to four cores. It'll do it just browsing the web. After playing a game every single one of my cores will have seen 4.2GHz because the XFR switches between them.



Can you post a pic that shows it ? in Ryzen Master or other program ?

I had the Core Performance on Auto .

What else do I need to have ? 

Cpu Vcore on Auto ?
CPU Ratio on Auto or 34 ?

Anything else ?


----------



## MNMadman

x7007 said:


> Can you post a pic that shows it ? in Ryzen Master or other program ?
> 
> I had the Core Performance on Auto .
> 
> What else do I need to have ?
> 
> Cpu Vcore on Auto ?
> CPU Ratio on Auto or 34 ?
> 
> Anything else ?


I no longer have mine set for stock, so no. And no I won't revert it to give you a pic. Mine just works and yours should too.

Put your settings back to stock and you should immediately see it.


----------



## ozlay

Are there any temp differences between running 8 Cores and HT or running 16 Cores without HT?


----------



## x7007

So I tested at least for now at 4.1 I need 1.2625 Voltage to work fine . maybe can go one lower , but not sure . it's so hot now the cpu reach 80c at least .


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> So I tested at least for now at 4.1 I need 1.2625 Voltage to work fine . maybe can go one lower , but not sure . it's so hot now the cpu reach 80c at least .


4.1 at 1.26 volts? that insanely good I think. I think I need like.. 1.35V to reach 4.1Ghz 16cores.. but the heat is insane too.


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> So I tested at least for now at 4.1 I need 1.2625 Voltage to work fine . maybe can go one lower , but not sure . it's so hot now the cpu reach 80c at least .


One hour (at least) of Prime95 screenshot or it didn't happen!


----------



## x7007

OrionBG said:


> One hour (at least) of Prime95 screenshot or it didn't happen!



It's a problem , because I have everything connected to UPS and it is going beyond 1000 watt , so the UPS alarms me . I can't run it for too long. but as for gaming it will never reach it. I'll just use it like this till I get new UPS.


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> It's a problem , because I have everything connected to UPS and it is going beyond 1000 watt , so the UPS alarms me . I can't run it for too long. but as for gaming it will never reach it. I'll just use it like this till I get new UPS.


So, your UPS is then useless?

Why you dont get another and split the load? thats what I do. Never put all the eggs in a single basket.
Specially when you're maxing the single basket.


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> So, your UPS is then useless?
> 
> Why you dont get another and split the load? thats what I do. Never put all the eggs in a single basket.
> Specially when you're maxing the single basket.



First it's not useless because I get to 1000 watt with those things when on 100% LOAD PRIME95 

Also using 16+16 with 1.412 @ 4.1 and doing prime95 takes more than 350-400 watt as you must already know using HWINFO64.

On normal gaming it is reaching 600-750 including GPU FULL Load 100%

LG OLED55C TV - Takes about 200-300 watt
All my Pc Parts that on my signature .
Modem + Linksys E3000 + Switch + Router Mikrotick Computer with AMD FX8350 + Linux mini computer All takes about 250 watt . , the FX8350 takes 180 watt alone but included with the 250

The reason I have all this connected so I can keep my device 100% state so they won't die because of stupid electric outage . because I already had scenario that my 480GTX HDMI burned and also my Philips 8004 TV Digital output burned also at the same time.


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> First it's not useless because I get to 1000 watt with those things when on 100% LOAD PRIME95
> 
> Also using 16+16 with 1.412 @ 4.1 and doing prime95 takes more than 350-400 watt as you must already know using HWINFO64.
> 
> On normal gaming it is reaching 600-750 including GPU FULL Load 100%
> 
> LG OLED55C TV - Takes about 200-300 watt
> All my Pc Parts that on my signature .
> Modem + Linksys E3000 + Switch + Router Mikrotick Computer with AMD FX8350 + Linux mini computer All takes about 250 watt . , the FX8350 takes 180 watt alone but included with the 250
> 
> The reason I have all this connected so I can keep my device 100% state so they won't die because of stupid electric outage . because I already had scenario that my 480GTX HDMI burned and also my Philips 8004 TV Digital output burned also at the same time.


Using these figures, you're already going beyond the 1000 watt load limit.
Any power outage will still cause your USP to fail with these loads (your gaming plus the routers, pc parts, and screen)

Hence why I wonder why you haven't tried to split the load.


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> ...
> Also using 16+16 with 1.412 @ 4.1 and doing prime95 takes more than 350-400 watt as you must already know using HWINFO64.
> ...


Wait a moment! Previously, you said that you are running at 4.1GHz with 1.2625V and now it is 1.412V... Which one is it? I asked for Prime because of the 1.2625V you mentioned at first. If you are running at 1.412V, than no need for Prime... I can believe this voltage more than the 1.2625V...


----------



## x7007

OrionBG said:


> Wait a moment! Previously, you said that you are running at 4.1GHz with 1.2625V and now it is 1.412V... Which one is it? I asked for Prime because of the 1.2625V you mentioned at first. If you are running at 1.412V, than no need for Prime... I can believe this voltage more than the 1.2625V...


It's offset numbers. I use 1.2625 which is actually 1.425 on load.


----------



## MNMadman

Found out that (like in the Gamers Nexus Threadripper video) my games seem to like 12 cores more than 16 cores. Currently stress-testing 12 cores at 4.1GHz -- actually 4.141GHz due to 101MHz BLCK -- using +0.25000v (1.375v). Still trying to find the lowest stable voltage.

Apparently I should have saved myself a couple hundred dollars and bought a 1920X from the start.


----------



## Tamalero

MNMadman said:


> Found out that (like in the Gamers Nexus Threadripper video) my games seem to like 12 cores more than 16 cores. Currently stress-testing 12 cores at 4.1GHz -- actually 4.141GHz due to 101MHz BLCK -- using +0.25000v (1.375v). Still trying to find the lowest stable voltage.
> 
> Apparently I should have saved myself a couple hundred dollars and bought a 1920X from the start.


But.. what if.. your games will prefer 10 cores of the 12 core Threadripper? 
Would you downgrade to the 8 core?


----------



## MNMadman

Tamalero said:


> But.. what if.. your games will prefer 10 cores of the 12 core Threadripper?
> Would you downgrade to the 8 core?


lol

Already tried my 16-core in 8-core mode. No go ... worse performance all around.

Edit: Even tried 12-core and 16-core with SMT disabled -- worse performance. 12-core with SMT enabled seems to be a good spot for my system.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> lol
> 
> Already tried my 16-core in 8-core mode. No go ... worse performance all around.
> 
> Edit: Even tried 12-core and 16-core with SMT disabled -- worse performance. 12-core with SMT enabled seems to be a good spot for my system.


Yeah, one thing that most people (especially Intel fans) don't realize is that Threadripper CAN be faster, even at gaming, simply because the operating system itself has typically over 100 processes and thousands of threads. Threadripper to me feels so much smoother in 16 core mode than 8 or 4 core mode.

At any rate, has anyone ever had XFR boost to 4.2 GHz? Mine doesn't even hit 4.1 GHz (tops out at 4074 mhz and hasn't gone higher since the day I got it). I thought that XFR was supposed to be +200 MHz?


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> At any rate, has anyone ever had XFR boost to 4.2 GHz? Mine doesn't even hit 4.1 GHz (tops out at 4074 mhz and hasn't gone higher since the day I got it). I thought that XFR was supposed to be +200 MHz?


My XFR hit 4.2GHz quite often when I reverted back to stock settings a couple of days ago. It was actually 4.242GHz as I keep my BCLK at 101MHz. Even when just web browsing I would see up to four cores go to top speed. Before I switched my overclock back on, HWiNFO64 showed that all of the cores had hit 4242MHz at some point.

You have to remember to enable Core Performance Boost (or whatever it's called in your BIOS).


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> Yeah, one thing that most people (especially Intel fans) don't realize is that Threadripper CAN be faster, even at gaming, simply because the operating system itself has typically over 100 processes and thousands of threads. Threadripper to me feels so much smoother in 16 core mode than 8 or 4 core mode.
> 
> At any rate, has anyone ever had XFR boost to 4.2 GHz? Mine doesn't even hit 4.1 GHz (tops out at 4074 mhz and hasn't gone higher since the day I got it). I thought that XFR was supposed to be +200 MHz?


Mine did constantly.. requiring around 1.42 to 1.5V on vcore according to HWinfo.
1950X on a X399 Prime and a SEASONIC 750W Titanium PRIME


----------



## 4Strings

For some reason my 1900X locks up at any voltage above 1.3625... Regardless of clock speed... Really weird...


----------



## SavantStrike

MNMadman said:


> Found out that (like in the Gamers Nexus Threadripper video) my games seem to like 12 cores more than 16 cores. Currently stress-testing 12 cores at 4.1GHz -- actually 4.141GHz due to 101MHz BLCK -- using +0.25000v (1.375v). Still trying to find the lowest stable voltage.
> 
> Apparently I should have saved myself a couple hundred dollars and bought a 1920X from the start.


I bought the 1920 because the 1950 was a grand at the time and i was planning on eventually upgrading to the refreshed chip. My chip has handled 3466mhz RAM with XMP timings and 4.025 with 1.3V. I am left wondering if I would be better waiting for zen 2 cores instead of Zen + cores.


----------



## betam4x

Yeah i think it's this motherboard. First, I get 8-12 cores boosting into the 4.0-4.124 range (with the rest at 3.7GHz). This is stock settings. It's not thermals as an issue. 27C too hot? I mean, I don't know if I can really complain or not. Gives me better benchmarks than stock 1950x.

Going to flash back to an older BIOS tonight to see if it still happens.


----------



## betam4x

4Strings said:


> For some reason my 1900X locks up at any voltage above 1.3625... Regardless of clock speed... Really weird...


Under load? Or at idle? If under load, you need to tweak LLC settings. You are getting too much vdroop, causing the CPU to lock. Also, if your CPU works fine at stock, that's further proof that you need to tweak LLC. If it locks at stock settings, it's defective and needs an RMA.


----------



## 4Strings

betam4x said:


> Under load? Or at idle? If under load, you need to tweak LLC settings. You are getting too much vdroop, causing the CPU to lock. Also, if your CPU works fine at stock, that's further proof that you need to tweak LLC. If it locks at stock settings, it's defective and needs an RMA.


At load (thankfully!). I've already had to deal with a bad motherboard, I don't think I could handle a bad CPU too... 

Where should I look for LLC settings? I'm running a Prime X399, but just a general location is fine.
Never mind. Didn't realize that LLC is Load Line Calibration... 
THANKS!


----------



## betam4x

betam4x said:


> Yeah i think it's this motherboard. First, I get 8-12 cores boosting into the 4.0-4.124 range (with the rest at 3.7GHz). This is stock settings. It's not thermals as an issue. 27C too hot? I mean, I don't know if I can really complain or not. Gives me better benchmarks than stock 1950x.
> 
> Going to flash back to an older BIOS tonight to see if it still happens.


I didn't flash to an older bios, I had HWInfo open for a couple hours and it never hit 4.2. Left it open overnight and apparently every core hit 4.2 at some point. Precision boost is so random...


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> I didn't flash to an older bios, I had HWInfo open for a couple hours and it never hit 4.2. Left it open overnight and apparently every core hit 4.2 at some point. Precision boost is so random...


I took the overclock off again for some hours last night just to test. And I saw that it wasn't hitting 42x multiplier as often as the last time. It most often hit 41.25x (showing as 41.3x) and 41.5x, hit 41.75x (showing as 41.8x) less often and hit 42x rarely.

The "intelligence" of PB/XFR seems to be working against it. Instead of being an "if under max load with four cores or less, set the multiplier to 42x for those cores" situation, it is being held back by all of the variables. In our systems, it has plenty of temperature headroom and power headroom so it should boost to 42x far more often than it is.

Seems like PB2 might work better so maybe TR Gen2 will hit max clocks more often.


----------



## x7007

What happens if I accidentally gave the cpu 1.5 for almost 15 hrs ???? it was accidentally and I didn't check.. it can't run now with 1.280 voltage 4.0 anymore , it just freezes .... it needs now almost 1.350 just to run 4.0 and I am not sure if it still stable..... it freezes when I do prime95 +AVX for the moment. 

In Hwinfo64 it says the voltage is 1.237 Average , Maximum is 1.250 , is that ok for 4.0 ?? I'm afraid that I toasted the cpu because somehow I gave it 1.570 Voltage !!  hrs because I didn't check ! is my CPU still ok ??? the only problem is that I need more voltage now ?? or maybe it was stable at all at the start if I gave it a long Prime95 run ?


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> What happens if I accidentally gave the cpu 1.5 for almost 15 hrs ???? it was accidentally and I didn't check.. it can't run now with 1.280 voltage 4.0 anymore , it just freezes .... it needs now almost 1.350 just to run 4.0 and I am not sure if it still stable..... it freezes when I do prime95 +AVX for the moment.
> 
> In Hwinfo64 it says the voltage is 1.237 Average , Maximum is 1.250 , is that ok for 4.0 ?? I'm afraid that I toasted the cpu because somehow I gave it 1.570 Voltage !! hrs because I didn't check ! is my CPU still ok ??? the only problem is that I need more voltage now ?? or maybe it was stable at all at the start if I gave it a long Prime95 run ?


What about the temps? because 1.5V continously seems brutal unless you had an enthusiast level custom loop.


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> What about the temps? because 1.5V continously seems brutal unless you had an enthusiast level custom loop.


I think it throttle a bit so it reached 85 c and load was 75%-85% and not 100% so it wasn't really working full clock


----------



## 4Strings

x7007 said:


> I think it throttle a bit so it reached 85 c and load was 75%-85% and not 100% so it wasn't really working full clock


Some of the cores (about 4 if you were running at 75%) probably failed P95 and weren't running. The CPU might have also downclocked to 550MHz because it was pulling too much current... That might have saved your chip.


----------



## x7007

4Strings said:


> Some of the cores (about 4 if you were running at 75%) probably failed P95 and weren't running. The CPU might have also downclocked to 550MHz because it was pulling too much current... That might have saved your chip.


ok , good information . it did downclock to 600 or 660 mhz I can't remember it happened for a sec in ryzen master . but above that do you think something was changed or damaged if I can't run the same voltage I ran it before ? or I saw people supposed to ran 4.0 @ 1.350 and I still run it at 1.290 . before it was like 1.260 . so what could have changed ?


----------



## MNMadman

Anybody who uses HWiNFO64...

What's the biggest difference you've seen between the Tdie temps for CPU 0 Node 0 and CPU 0 Node 1?

Mine's 6ºC under stress test load since I've started paying attention to it. Node 0 is the hotter one.


----------



## betam4x

x7007 said:


> ok , good information . it did downclock to 600 or 660 mhz I can't remember it happened for a sec in ryzen master . but above that do you think something was changed or damaged if I can't run the same voltage I ran it before ? or I saw people supposed to ran 4.0 @ 1.350 and I still run it at 1.290 . before it was like 1.260 . so what could have changed ?


No, more like 10 of my cores throttling at 550 mhz. Also, my chip still performed just fine regardless. It's a power delivery issue. I'm more than happy to fry my Threadripper, but from what I understand, it's nothing to do with killing your chip. AMD placed artificial limits on the chip itself. I can still boost 8 cores of my TR at 4.4 GHz, there is just a 272 amp limiit....hell my record is 4.7 ghz on water cooling. At that point it spanks coffee lake....and don't get me wrong, I invest in intel and AMD. However, at the end of the day, are your ducks in a row?


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Anybody who uses HWiNFO64...
> 
> What's the biggest difference you've seen between the Tdie temps for CPU 0 Node 0 and CPU 0 Node 1?
> 
> Mine's 6ºC under stress test load since I've started paying attention to it. Node 0 is the hotter one.


mine are usually the same, maybe 1-2 degrees off. If all your cores are under load and it is 6 degrees off, maybe consider re-applying thermal paste?


----------



## betam4x

Does anyone know of any review sites that pit Threadripper and the 8700k head to head in benchmarks. Same RAM speeds (something like DDR4 3200CL14), same amount of RAM, same graphics cards (Preferably a 1080ti) and on the highest details? Maybe with the 8700k overclocked to 5 GHz and the Threadripper overclocked to 4.1 GHz? I've yet to see a comparison like that, and in my comparisons, Threadripper walks all over most games except maybe a few oddball ones.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> Does anyone know of any review sites that pit Threadripper and the 8700k head to head in benchmarks. Same RAM speeds (something like DDR4 3200CL14), same amount of RAM, same graphics cards (Preferably a 1080ti) and on the highest details? Maybe with the 8700k overclocked to 5 GHz and the Threadripper overclocked to 4.1 GHz? I've yet to see a comparison like that, and in my comparisons, Threadripper walks all over most games except maybe a few oddball ones.


I have yet to see a review in which Threadripper beat 8700K in more than one or two games, whether overclocked or not.


----------



## SavantStrike

betam4x said:


> Does anyone know of any review sites that pit Threadripper and the 8700k head to head in benchmarks. Same RAM speeds (something like DDR4 3200CL14), same amount of RAM, same graphics cards (Preferably a 1080ti) and on the highest details? Maybe with the 8700k overclocked to 5 GHz and the Threadripper overclocked to 4.1 GHz? I've yet to see a comparison like that, and in my comparisons, Threadripper walks all over most games except maybe a few oddball ones.


The 8700K will win almost every time, but at higher resolutions the gap closes significantly. Threadripper is a good platform for compute applications that will also run any game out there, but it's not going to be a benching platform for games.


----------



## OrionBG

Guys, Is any of you running your GPU (for any reason) on the third PCIe16x Slot? The one that is also full 16x?
If yes, is everything OK and is there any difference with using the GPU on the first PCIe16x slot?


----------



## SavantStrike

OrionBG said:


> Guys, Is any of you running your GPU (for any reason) on the third PCIe16x Slot? The one that is also full 16x?
> If yes, is everything OK and is there any difference with using the GPU on the first PCIe16x slot?


Quad SLI if that counts. Seems to work fine.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Guys, Is any of you running your GPU (for any reason) on the third PCIe16x Slot? The one that is also full 16x?
> If yes, is everything OK and is there any difference with using the GPU on the first PCIe16x slot?


No trouble other than some silly behavior with my memory.
Having my monitors turned on while my Prime X399 is booting, will lead to a few memory training cycles.
No monitors turned on during the first seconds after pressing the power button = normal boot

So I wonder if the third slot of my prime is actually handled by the other threadripper die and gets affected by the power draw.


----------



## SavantStrike

Tamalero said:


> No trouble other than some silly behavior with my memory.
> Having my monitors turned on while my Prime X399 is booting, will lead to a few memory training cycles.
> No monitors turned on during the first seconds after pressing the power button = normal boot
> 
> So I wonder if the third slot of my prime is actually handled by the other threadripper die and gets affected by the power draw.


The other slots are on a different CCX. It shouldn't matter though as both die packages are active at boot since half of the RAM is on each package.


----------



## Tamalero

SavantStrike said:


> The other slots are on a different CCX. It shouldn't matter though as both die packages are active at boot since half of the RAM is on each package.


Never said that the other package isnt active. I'm talking about the possibility of voltage drops that could make one CCX unstable in the memory department (hence the insistence of the motherboard to go into a memory training cycle)

Its very rare and changes..
Sometimes I could go weeks with not a single memory training cycle, everything booting normally.


----------



## betam4x

I've had a couple games where threadripper has beaten the 8700k. If you set memory mode to local and overclock to 4.1 or 4.2 (if your board supports it) You'll see that it does compete competitively. If I had easy access to an 8700k I would do a head to head.

Also, in AnandTech bench, you can view some results of stock competition: https://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/2025?vs=1932 in which they trade blows. However, I have a few issues with those tests. Namely, I have a 1080ti, so I can't reproduce. Also, the tomb raider and rocket league tests are suspiciously low. In the tomb raider tests that I've done, I get nearly double the FPS of the GTX 1080ti review here: https://www.anandtech.com/show/11180/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-review/5 as well as in bench. Now I know they released a patch and all, but it didn't double the performance.

The whole Ryzen vs Intel review thing irks me because initial reviews used slow memory, early, buggy AGESA, and had hardware differences. Threadripper (and presumably Ryzen) scales VERY well, and even single core games can benefit from this scaling. 

Another thing, as you can see in this screenshot, my current machine has 100 processes and 1637 threads. Those processes/threads have to be split among cores. The less cores there are, the slower IPC is going to be for a given workload. Hypothetical scenario, if you have 20 processes under a 5% load, and 1 process under an 80% load, you've just slowed down your coffee lake by 30%, however the effective IPC reduction is just 11.25%.

I didn't just buy this chip for gaming, I do productivity (video stuff, VMs, development, etc.) as well, but every site I've seen has painted Ryzen and Threadripper in a poor light. Once I make it through surgery, I'm going to buy Intel's latest and greatest, AMD's latest and greatest, along with the 2950x if it's out, and I'm going to run some reproducible benchmarks so that we can all get a good idea of where everything lands.

However, to get started, look at this: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-coffee-lake-i7-8700k-cpu,5252-4.html They don't include threadripper in the results here. Why? Because it beats the 8700k @ 4.9 .
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-coffee-lake-i7-8700k-cpu,5252-5.html Civ 6 AI test? At 4.1 GHz My threadripper scored 12.9. Handly beating the 8700k @ 4.9. The graphics test was much faster as well....however once again these reviewers aren't using a 1080ti. Why would you not use the best GPU when testing CPU performance?

Just a bit of a rant here, now back to your regularly scheduled program.


----------



## Dominican

Using 1950X when using Creator Mode Only Show 8 Core Not 16 how fix this ???


----------



## Tamalero

Dominican said:


> Using 1950X when using Creator Mode Only Show 8 Core Not 16 how fix this ???


Enable the cores?

Check in ryzenmaster if you have disabled cores set.


----------



## Dominican

Tamalero said:


> Enable the cores?
> 
> Check in ryzenmaster if you have disabled cores set.


 I check I don't here screen shot


----------



## MNMadman

Dominican said:


> I check I don't here screen shot


That screenshot shows you have eight cores disabled.

You need to set "Cores Disabled" to 0.


----------



## Dominican

MNMadman said:


> That screenshot shows you have eight cores disabled.
> 
> You need to set "Cores Disabled" to 0.


 you right and did not have memory control Select as well thanks info ... by way how do you get Memory Access Mode on ?


----------



## Tamalero

Dominican said:


> you right and did not have memory control Select as well thanks info ... by way how do you get Memory Access Mode on ?


stetting everything on AUTO in the bios, which is technically not recommended for RAM imho.


----------



## ssateneth

SavantStrike said:


> betam4x said:
> 
> 
> 
> 108.5C?
> 
> You may want to back it down a bit. The silicon in TR doesn't like that kind of hammering.
> 
> 
> 
> you are looking at tctl, which reports 27c higher than actual temperatures (this is well documented and well known) on threadripper. tdie is real temperature.
Click to expand...


----------



## RyanRC

*Help me choose memory for Zenith Extreme sTR4 & 1950x build.*

Hello all. 

I am looking do a new build around using the Zenith Extreme sTR4 and a 1950x ripper and have got most of it planned out, but the choice for the amount, speed, version and even brand of memory is just making my head spin.

I will admit its been quite a few years since I did this kind of thing so while I know a bit of what to do (hey my last build has lasted 12 years), some of the new stuff that is out there and its lingo is taking sometime to learn, but even more surprising is how much the cost of memory has become!!!

At any rate, at first as I had always been a get as much memory as you can as despite what everyone says now someday it might be needed and plus by then what you have will probably not be around to be matched kind of guy, I was looking at the Corsair CMK128GX4M8Z2933C16 kit which maxes out the Extreme at 128g, but then I saw its max speed is only 2933...but even more so it's basically in the $1,700 plus cost range! 

Essentially this is almost doubling the cost of the build so if I could find something cheaper that will make this more of a reality.

So perhaps some may disagree with these ideas, I was thinking of something more in the native 3000 to 3200 speed range, and hopefully at least 64g?

Having said that I would really like what ever that is, is something I could down the road buy the same and perhaps get it to 128g if that ever became the need, (again can scoff but 12 years ago everyone said 8 and not 16 is all that was needed, but I just bumped my current rig to that and even then it did not change that much).

Anyway, would also mention as I am going to be using one of the Corsair Commander PRO units as well as a Corsair HXi 1000w (PS) and Corsair 750D Air case, I was looking at the RGB or LED line as it can interact with that all for the purposes of monitoring not for any lighting and hopefully I can use that to completely shut any of that off or do something with it in a mim as possible thing as I do not want any. 

So if anyone has any suggestions I would greatly appreciate hearing them.


Thanks greatly for any help in advance.


----------



## Tamalero

RyanRC said:


> Hello all.
> 
> I am looking do a new build around using the Zenith Extreme sTR4 and a 1950x ripper and have got most of it planned out, but the choice for the amount, speed, version and even brand of memory is just making my head spin.
> 
> I will admit its been quite a few years since I did this kind of thing so while I know a bit of what to do (hey my last build has lasted 12 years), some of the new stuff that is out there and its lingo is taking sometime to learn, but even more surprising is how much the cost of memory has become!!!
> 
> At any rate, at first as I had always been a get as much memory as you can as despite what everyone says now someday it might be needed and plus by then what you have will probably not be around to be matched kind of guy, I was looking at the Corsair CMK128GX4M8Z2933C16 kit which maxes out the Extreme at 128g, but then I saw its max speed is only 2933...but even more so it's basically in the $1,700 plus cost range!
> 
> Essentially this is almost doubling the cost of the build so if I could find something cheaper that will make this more of a reality.
> 
> So perhaps some may disagree with these ideas, I was thinking of something more in the native 3000 to 3200 speed range, and hopefully at least 64g?
> 
> Having said that I would really like what ever that is, is something I could down the road buy the same and perhaps get it to 128g if that ever became the need, (again can scoff but 12 years ago everyone said 8 and not 16 is all that was needed, but I just bumped my current rig to that and even then it did not change that much).
> 
> Anyway, would also mention as I am going to be using one of the Corsair Commander PRO units as well as a Corsair HXi 1000w (PS) and Corsair 750D Air case, I was looking at the RGB or LED line as it can interact with that all for the purposes of monitoring not for any lighting and hopefully I can use that to completely shut any of that off or do something with it in a mim as possible thing as I do not want any.
> 
> So if anyone has any suggestions I would greatly appreciate hearing them.
> 
> 
> Thanks greatly for any help in advance.


Do not trust corsair.
They change memory providers on each revision of the same models.

Example, the Platinum series had Samsung Bdie in version 4.2 .. current version 5.1 to 5.3 are Hynix.

And trust me, I had a ton of trouble getting my Hynix memories to rated speeds.


----------



## TrixX

Seconded on the Corsair issue. Mine refuse to run 3200MHz stable, have to run at 2933MHz and they need stupid voltage to get to 16/16/16, normally they are set to 16/18/18...

Saving the modules for an Intel test build I'm making though so not 100% useless. Just 99% currently


----------



## RyanRC

I am fine with not going with Corsair if they are an issue.

Mainly was hoping to also use the monitoring system of the Commander Pro to keep tabs on it (although I have not idea exactly what it does, but was hoping it does something), but that is not the main reason I am buying that so if the mem I get doesn't work with it to control it, its OK. Would also say in general I have used them in the past and they have worked fine.

But I would rather go with what works over what doesn't so I am open to any suggestions.

Mainly I would really like to stay though somewhere in the 3000 to 3200 range and 64g, but in just 4 of the 8 slots so hopefully I could add more of the same down the road.

In a question to that end and perhaps this is not the place and I am waiting for a 24 wait time for a reg to an Asus forum for this MB.

But in general when I see a approval of groups of memory, if lets say its showing 16 or 32 or 64 out of just say 2-4 sticks of that type, does that mean I can just add more of that to fill up the remaining slots, or for some reason will it only work with the gig and stick configuration it has in the QVL lists?

I know that's probably a question that could need a lot more info, but am just asking for the most general case.


----------



## TrixX

Any of the C14 G.Skill Trident Z kits should do the job just fine. I know they have a 64GB 4 Dimm kit that works with TR4 too.


----------



## Somebuudy

Hello all. I just managed to build my first proper PC and I need a little bit of help with the OC. Currently the issue is I was trying to stress test it with Aida64 (all tests but the GPU and the HDD on) and it always freezes at some point no matter what. The last time it froze after 2 hours. There are no BSoD or a restart or the program crashing... Just a freeze. I've been digging through all sorts of Bios settings and nothing seems to make the system stable even though it isn't going hot at all. I also really would love to OC the RAM but that proves to be futile as well.

Currently I'm running the 1950x I have @ 4.0 @ 1.435 (or the closest) to get to that 2h limit. The CPU indicator on the Zenith Extreme mobo shows 46C at it's highest. I'm running a G.Skill 64GB (4x16) 3600 17C kit @ 2933 at the moment. If I run that at higher frequency the stress test freezes even quicker. If I run the CPU at a lower voltage it freezes quicker as well. I can't boot the RAM @ 3600 no matter what (the PC restarts a couple of times and reverts it to the stock 2133). I'd love to be able to have a stable 4.0 OC and a 3200MHz Ram but I can't seem to get there. Any suggestions? So far I've used these two videos as starting points, trying out both types of settings:

Video 1






as well as the guru3d article about OC-ing and some reddit posts + this thread but it all got me so far.

I should be able to get higher than 1.435 with ease considering the loop I managed to build but I'm not sure if this will solve the issue considering how others go to 4.2 with the voltage cranked up that high. Maybe I'm missing something... or should I just give up on the Aida64 stress test and just call it a day (I want to be able to OC the CPU first before I OC the 2 GPUS). Stability would be the main thing here as I will be streaming and doing video editing.


----------



## RyanRC

TrixX said:


> Any of the C14 G.Skill Trident Z kits should do the job just fine. I know they have a 64GB 4 Dimm kit that works with TR4 too.


Thanks for the help.

In checking G.Skill and am just going by their info per their QVL, I see only one kit that has 4 sticks to make up 64g and its only a 2400, plus its CL15.

Then for all the other 64g kits that are in the 3000 to 3200 range and are CL4, they are made up 8 sticks.

Plus those are like $1,000 a kit and as mentioned would not allow me to go 128 someday without a full swap out.

Oddly they do sell one kit that is already 128g, and is almost 3000 (2933) but is CL16 and also for the one and only review on Newegg for this kit it was tried by someone in the Extreme and it failed miserably.

Also it's right back at that number of $1,700 plus, so is not helping in that department.

Would be great if these sold these in a 64 kit, but I don't think they do.


Having said all that would be happy to hear of any success stories of anyone getting something of the specs I am looking for working on a Extreme that is not any QVL.

Thanks


----------



## Tamalero

Somebuudy said:


> Hello all. I just managed to build my first proper PC and I need a little bit of help with the OC. Currently the issue is I was trying to stress test it with Aida64 (all tests but the GPU and the HDD on) and it always freezes at some point no matter what. The last time it froze after 2 hours. There are no BSoD or a restart or the program crashing... Just a freeze. I've been digging through all sorts of Bios settings and nothing seems to make the system stable even though it isn't going hot at all. I also really would love to OC the RAM but that proves to be futile as well.
> 
> Currently I'm running the 1950x I have @ 4.0 @ 1.435 (or the closest) to get to that 2h limit. The CPU indicator on the Zenith Extreme mobo shows 46C at it's highest. I'm running a G.Skill 64GB (4x16) 3600 17C kit @ 2933 at the moment. If I run that at higher frequency the stress test freezes even quicker. If I run the CPU at a lower voltage it freezes quicker as well. I can't boot the RAM @ 3600 no matter what (the PC restarts a couple of times and reverts it to the stock 2133). I'd love to be able to have a stable 4.0 OC and a 3200MHz Ram but I can't seem to get there. Any suggestions? So far I've used these two videos as starting points, trying out both types of settings:
> 
> Video 1
> 
> Video 2
> 
> as well as the guru3d article about OC-ing and some reddit posts + this thread but it all got me so far.
> 
> I should be able to get higher than 1.435 with ease considering the loop I managed to build but I'm not sure if this will solve the issue considering how others go to 4.2 with the voltage cranked up that high. Maybe I'm missing something... or should I just give up on the Aida64 stress test and just call it a day (I want to be able to OC the CPU first before I OC the 2 GPUS). Stability would be the main thing here as I will be streaming and doing video editing.


Do you really need that high voltage to reach 4Ghz?

I only need 1.35V for 4.1 stable.

Also, did you tweak the other voltages like VSOC and ram voltages?
I had to up the vsoc and ram voltages to get my threadripper solid.
Its a balance act, not just the VCORE.


----------



## Somebuudy

Well... It reaches it with ease on a lower voltage but it doesn't stay stable technically. Every time I offset the VCore it goes higher on the AIDA stress test. I tried the VSOC to 1.2 but I turned it to auto last time it froze. I was thinking... Maybe I should default everything and start again by keeping the RAM @ 2133 at the start. Do an overnight stress test on the CPU @ 4.0 or something and after that increase the frequency on the RAM but maybe as you said if I dabble with the other voltages it might run better.


----------



## xkm1948

How do you guys update your chipset driver? I had a APU system before and uninstalling old system driver bricked my system due to the removal of all USB drivers. For these X399 platforms do you just update over exisiting driver? Or should you uninstall old ones first?


----------



## MNMadman

xkm1948 said:


> How do you guys update your chipset driver? I had a APU system before and uninstalling old system driver bricked my system due to the removal of all USB drivers. For these X399 platforms do you just update over exisiting driver? Or should you uninstall old ones first?


For any chipset change, I always do a clean install. Updates for the same chipset simply get installed over the previous.

Less problems that way.


----------



## betam4x

Somebuudy said:


> Well... It reaches it with ease on a lower voltage but it doesn't stay stable technically. Every time I offset the VCore it goes higher on the AIDA stress test. I tried the VSOC to 1.2 but I turned it to auto last time it froze. I was thinking... Maybe I should default everything and start again by keeping the RAM @ 2133 at the start. Do an overnight stress test on the CPU @ 4.0 or something and after that increase the frequency on the RAM but maybe as you said if I dabble with the other voltages it might run better.


This is a classic sign of not playing with LLC settings to combat vdroop. First, set the VCore to 1.35V. Then find the LLC (load line calibration) settings and set it somewhere mid level. Run Prime95 with Small FFTs and note the voltages when idle vs under load. I typically try to find the setting that keeps idle and load VCOREs as close together as possible. After that, reduce voltages by 0.25V and run prime95 Small FFTs until at least 5 tests complete without error. Repeat until you start hitting errors, then bump up voltages by a quarter of a volt to a half of a volt. Then run all the stress tests you want. You should be rock solid stable by then.


----------



## Dominican

has anybody been doing streaming with 1950x ? I Been getting Under 100 FPS With 1080 TI.............

when you doing streaming do you used ryzen master if yes what are your setting 

there is no way streaming 1080P 60 FPS CPU GOES %100 LOAD .............


----------



## Tamalero

Dominican said:


> has anybody been doing streaming with 1950x ? I Been getting Under 100 FPS With 1080 TI.............
> 
> when you doing streaming do you used ryzen master if yes what are your setting
> 
> there is no way streaming 1080P 60 FPS CPU GOES %100 LOAD .............



It could if you disabled some cores.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I just fired up my TR1950x build for the first time since setting up my watercooling loop. I'm just running straight distilled water in my CPU loop at the moment to test temps. I'm getting an idle temp of 26C without any configuration what-so-ever to my ASRock x399 Taichi. Is this a safe temp to continue? Rather not have to pull my build apart after installing my coolant.


----------



## Tamalero

PuffinMyLye said:


> I just fired up my TR1950x build for the first time since setting up my watercooling loop. I'm just running straight distilled water in my CPU loop at the moment to test temps. I'm getting an idle temp of 26C without any configuration what-so-ever to my ASRock x399 Taichi. Is this a safe temp to continue? Rather not have to pull my build apart after installing my coolant.


26C is better than my actual room temperature. I do not see why would you worry.
anything above 60C and THEN you should start worrying.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Tamalero said:


> 26C is better than my actual room temperature. I do not see why would you worry.
> anything above 60C and THEN you should start worrying.



Running Prime95 right now on stock stettings I'm getting temps of 48C. This is with my fans at 600RPM (less than half their rated speed).


----------



## Tamalero

PuffinMyLye said:


> Running Prime95 right now on stock stettings I'm getting temps of 48C. This is with my fans at 600RPM (less than half their rated speed).


On stock these temps looks a bit high, my Noctua with double fans (the big one) gets me around 49C on prime and 50 rendering at stock.. and 60C oced to 3.95Ghz


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Tamalero said:


> PuffinMyLye said:
> 
> 
> 
> Running Prime95 right now on stock stettings I'm getting temps of 48C. This is with my fans at 600RPM (less than half their rated speed).
> 
> 
> 
> On stock these temps looks a bit high, my Noctua with double fans (the big one) gets me around 49C on prime and 50 rendering at stock.. and 60C oced to 4.95Ghz??
Click to expand...


You have a Threadripper OC'd to 4.95GHz.


----------



## MNMadman

PuffinMyLye said:


> You have a Threadripper OC'd to 4.95GHz.


I've seen Windows Task Manager falsely report my 1950X's speed at that. _Really_ wish it were true.


----------



## Tamalero

PuffinMyLye said:


> You have a Threadripper OC'd to 4.95GHz.


Omg, I didnt noticed I had a 4 when it was supposed to be a 3.

My Threadripper is at 3.95Ghz. (aka 100 x 39.5X) not 4.95 as I incorrectly wrote above.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> I've seen Windows Task Manager falsely report my 1950X's speed at that. _Really_ wish it were true.


Yeah, would kick Intel's ass all over town!


----------



## x7007

If I have the gigabyte X399 , how much do I put on the SOC ? I have many SOC settings, I am not sure if to put Manual or Dynamic SOC

I don't understand why I have high temps with Offset 1.6235 @ 4.0 . Using Enermax TR4 Liqtech 360mm.... Could that be the Pump died again or Thermal Paste? Aida Stress Test fails everytime with 1.500 offset which is like 1.320-340 , Is that voltage issue or heat issue or SOC voltage issue ? Temps reaching about 79 c


----------



## michelvw

Tamalero said:


> 26C is better than my actual room temperature. I do not see why would you worry.
> anything above 60C and THEN you should start worrying.


Erm I have my 1950X on an MSI X399 board overclocked to around 4gHz...But when I render Cinebench my CPU goes to around 65degrees celcius with the Noctua TR15 cooler.
Vray render of 15mins tops off at 80° celcius stable, doesn't go above that value - actually even with longer render times it doesn't go above 80°C.
As per your reaction I assume these are unsafe temps? What could the cause? Help would be appreciated!


----------



## x7007

Does the 1950x needs much VCORE @ 4.0 or I just need to give more SOC ?? because it becomes more stable if I give more VCORE but fail after longer time... what can this be ?? TEMP is 79 C .. I can't go lower than that with this VCORE 1.368-1.380.

What can I possibly do ?


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> Does the 1950x needs much VCORE @ 4.0 or I just need to give more SOC ?? because it becomes more stable if I give more VCORE but fail after longer time... what can this be ?? TEMP is 79 C .. I can't go lower than that with this VCORE 1.368-1.380.
> 
> What can I possibly do ?


At 1.35V, custom loop with possibly the best TR4 water block (the XSPC Raystorm NEO) at 4GHz, I'm getting about 73C to 75C, so with an AIO like your Enermax and the voltage you run it at, these I think are normal temperatures. After all I'm going through 2 radiators (360 and a 240) and a real D5 pump running at max speed.
If you can't do lower voltage and be stable, just accept the fact that you have lost the silicon lottery. Also, check your pump speed and also higher the fans speed if possible.


----------



## OrionBG

michelvw said:


> Erm I have my 1950X on an MSI X399 board overclocked to around 4gHz...But when I render Cinebench my CPU goes to around 65degrees celcius with the Noctua TR15 cooler.
> Vray render of 15mins tops off at 80° celcius stable, doesn't go above that value - actually even with longer render times it doesn't go above 80°C.
> As per your reaction I assume these are unsafe temps? What could the cause? Help would be appreciated!


The Noctua TR15 has not been designed for overclocking but for cooling the stock Threadripper chips. Most probably Vray is using some AVX instructions and Cinebench isn't. This is why the temperature is higher. And yes, 80C is not the best temperature in the world... 65C to 70C is acceptable but more is not so good, especially during a longer periods of time. I would suggest to either not overclock the chip when you run Vray or get a good AIO like the Enermax TR4 360mm cooler...


----------



## x7007

OrionBG said:


> At 1.35V, custom loop with possibly the best TR4 water block (the XSPC Raystorm NEO) at 4GHz, I'm getting about 73C to 75C, so with an AIO like your Enermax and the voltage you run it at, these I think are normal temperatures. After all I'm going through 2 radiators (360 and a 240) and a real D5 pump running at max speed.
> If you can't do lower voltage and be stable, just accept the fact that you have lost the silicon lottery. Also, check your pump speed and also higher the fans speed if possible.



The thing is that it worked fine with low voltage before I gave it accidentally 1.570 Voltage , I think , I'm not sure. since then it could do 4.0 Ghz @ 1.290 max voltage . now it want at least 1.380 for 4.0 Ghz. or maybe something with the SOC which was always on AUTO.


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> The thing is that it worked fine with low voltage before I gave it accidentally 1.570 Voltage , I think , I'm not sure. since then it could do 4.0 Ghz @ 1.290 max voltage . now it want at least 1.380 for 4.0 Ghz. or maybe something with the SOC which was always on AUTO.


It is quite possible that you baked the CPU and the transistor connections inside the silicon have degraded slightly... 1.57v is way too much voltage vor that chip.
You can test with a little bump of the SOC voltage but if it doesn't help then you are most probably out of luck...


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> If I have the gigabyte X399 , how much do I put on the SOC ? I have many SOC settings, I am not sure if to put Manual or Dynamic SOC
> 
> I don't understand why I have high temps with Offset 1.6235 @ 4.0 . Using Enermax TR4 Liqtech 360mm.... Could that be the Pump died again or Thermal Paste? Aida Stress Test fails everytime with 1.500 offset which is like 1.320-340 , Is that voltage issue or heat issue or SOC voltage issue ? Temps reaching about 79 c


Your SOC depends on your type of ram and if you won the lottery both in the memory AND in the cpu.

I've seen people in various places claiming stability for as low as 0.9 VSOC.
I had to pump higher than 1.0 to get stable with my hynix memories.

Note that there are other options that you need to tweak as well. 

The problem is, the naming and wording might be a bit different between motherboards. Even if the resulting options are the same.


Also others mentioned that the main problem with Ryzen and threadripper is the voltage drop.. which causes instability. There are a few options that mitigate this.

@gupsterg in my case.. has helped me lots to guide me where to find the information I need or tips.

*edit*
Oh, I now remember that you actually gave a huge voltage spike for a few hours to your processor.
I agree that it might have degraded already.. hence why you cant get stable OC.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Your SOC depends on your type of ram and if you won the lottery both in the memory AND in the cpu.
> 
> I've seen people in various places claiming stability for as low as 0.9 VSOC.
> I had to pump higher than 1.0 to get stable with my hynix memories.
> 
> Note that there are other options that you need to tweak as well.
> 
> The problem is, the naming and wording might be a bit different between motherboards. Even if the resulting options are the same.
> 
> 
> Also others mentioned that the main problem with Ryzen and threadripper is the voltage drop.. which causes instability. There are a few options that mitigate this.
> 
> @gupsterg in my case.. has helped me lots to guide me where to find the information I need or tips.
> 
> *edit*
> Oh, I now remember that you actually gave a huge voltage spike for a few hours to your processor.
> I agree that it might have degraded already.. hence why you cant get stable OC.


Running Hynix @ 0.86V for SoC here. Corsair LPX DDR4 3200, CL16, 4 x 8 GB sticks.

EDIT: Oh and I believe the sticks are running @ 1.2V as well. These things don't overclock at all though.


----------



## x7007

But there are 2 kinds of SOC , memory and Cpu , which one did you say need 2.0 ? because usually the cpu on auto get 1.50 I think. I gave it 0.00500 offset more.


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> It is quite possible that you baked the CPU and the transistor connections inside the silicon have degraded slightly... 1.57v is way too much voltage vor that chip.
> You can test with a little bump of the SOC voltage but if it doesn't help then you are most probably out of luck...


He would have had to have had it at that voltage for quite a while.  My chip degraded, but that was days of me tinkering just to see what Threadripper can do. It still does 4.0 @ 1.275 though, it used to be around 1.2V for 4.0. I've since stopped overclocking though. The machine is silent and only uses around 100 watts of power browsing the web, listening to music, etc. (since P-States are finally working on this board, it goes from around 1850MHz up to 4.2 GHz as needed). Still wish it could go a bit lower on the minimum speeds. You don't really need much speed if you are watching a hardware accelerated video, browsing the web, or idling at the desktop.


----------



## x7007

betam4x said:


> OrionBG said:
> 
> 
> 
> It is quite possible that you baked the CPU and the transistor connections inside the silicon have degraded slightly... 1.57v is way too much voltage vor that chip.
> You can test with a little bump of the SOC voltage but if it doesn't help then you are most probably out of luck...
> 
> 
> 
> He would have had to have had it at that voltage for quite a while. /forum/images/smilies/smile.gif My chip degraded, but that was days of me tinkering just to see what Threadripper can do. It still does 4.0 @ 1.275 though, it used to be around 1.2V for 4.0. I've since stopped overclocking though. The machine is silent and only uses around 100 watts of power browsing the web, listening to music, etc. (since P-States are finally working on this board, it goes from around 1850MHz up to 4.2 GHz as needed). Still wish it could go a bit lower on the minimum speeds. You don't really need much speed if you are watching a hardware accelerated video, browsing the web, or idling at the desktop.
Click to expand...

 Do you know why I can't use 1.290 anymore at 4.0 and need 1.380 ?


----------



## Minotaurtoo

x7007 said:


> Do you know why I can't use 1.290 anymore at 4.0 and need 1.380 ?


assuming your temps are under control, I'd say degradation is the culprit, but without more information it'd be hard to pin down... made any changes lately.. bios update and such?

on another note, I don't own threadripper, but I follow this thread and all this degradation talk is a bit scary... wondering if I need to back off my 1700 now...


----------



## betam4x

Minotaurtoo said:


> assuming your temps are under control, I'd say degradation is the culprit, but without more information it'd be hard to pin down... made any changes lately.. bios update and such?
> 
> on another note, I don't own threadripper, but I follow this thread and all this degradation talk is a bit scary... wondering if I need to back off my 1700 now...


More than likely, he just needs to tweak his LLC settings. Keeping LLC on auto isn't good for overclocking. It causes you to need to pump more voltage in to keep things stable. For example, if I left LLC on auto, my chip would need 1.375V or somewhere around there to do 4.0. However, by correctly setting the LLC, I get away with a much lower voltage.

Also, anything below 1.425V is definitely fine though I'd try to stay at 1.35 or below, within AMD's spec. 1.425-1.45 is pushing it, and I wouldn't run the chip beyond that. MSI boards can't even handle that much for the 1950X anyway. My chips throttle above 1.425 in prime95 unless I turn off PROCHOT.


----------



## Sphere07

betam4x said:


> More than likely, he just needs to tweak his LLC settings. Keeping LLC on auto isn't good for overclocking. It causes you to need to pump more voltage in to keep things stable. For example, if I left LLC on auto, my chip would need 1.375V or somewhere around there to do 4.0. However, by correctly setting the LLC, I get away with a much lower voltage.
> 
> Also, anything below 1.425V is definitely fine though I'd try to stay at 1.35 or below, within AMD's spec. 1.425-1.45 is pushing it, and I wouldn't run the chip beyond that. MSI boards can't even handle that much for the 1950X anyway. My chips throttle above 1.425 in prime95 unless I turn off PROCHOT.


^

All off this.

If you don't do LLC control, you're going to have to bump up voltages, and that's not a smart move. Auto is only useful if you are running stock settings and don't want to bother.


----------



## Kriant

Soooo, after using TR for close to 9 months, what is the consensus on "max safe vcore"? I am sporting 1950x @ 3975mhz @ 1.37v and LLC on auto - goes up to 1.417 with offset under load. This seems to be both realbench stable and prime95 small FFT 8h test stable.

I want to get to 4.0ghz really bad, because 4.0 is the magic number and 25mhz will infinitely boost by productivity (I am sure of it). 

Hence my question about max safe stable.

Thanks.


----------



## nycgtr

Kriant said:


> Soooo, after using TR for close to 9 months, what is the consensus on "max safe vcore"? I am sporting 1950x @ 3975mhz @ 1.37v and LLC on auto - goes up to 1.417 with offset under load. This seems to be both realbench stable and prime95 small FFT 8h test stable.
> 
> I want to get to 4.0ghz really bad, because 4.0 is the magic number and 25mhz will infinitely boost by productivity (I am sure of it).
> 
> Hence my question about max safe stable.
> 
> Thanks.


According to AMD it's like under 1.35v and under 68c.


----------



## Kriant

nycgtr said:


> According to AMD it's like under 1.35v and under 68c.


Well, I got the under 68c part even when under prime95 full load. I saw 1.35v before - is that "max recommended" or "max safe"? I know Intel has that duality going in their tech sheets for example. But I couldn't find a definitive answer with my google-fu skills.


----------



## nycgtr

Kriant said:


> Well, I got the under 68c part even when under prime95 full load. I saw 1.35v before - is that "max recommended" or "max safe"? I know Intel has that duality going in their tech sheets for example. But I couldn't find a definitive answer with my google-fu skills.


Every chip is different, there is no technically safe when overclocking. If your running a sane daily voltage, bad degradation won't come before you sell off the platform. You might need some more volt to hit the same clocks. I use to need 1.32 to hit 4ghz now I need 1.35. Just the way it is. I think anything under 1.4 is fine for daily.


----------



## middleclock

mmonnin said:


> Ubuntu 17.04 and .10 install fine for me


Which threadripper based motherboard do you use that is fully compatible with ubuntu?


----------



## mmonnin

middleclock said:


> Which threadripper based motherboard do you use that is fully compatible with ubuntu?


Asrock Taichi. Linux installs fine on that.


----------



## middleclock

Thank you. Just to double check, do you mean this one:

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X399 Taichi/index.us.asp

Do you happen to know which motherboards for X299 and Z370 are fully compatible with Ubuntu?


----------



## mmonnin

middleclock said:


> Thank you. Just to double check, do you mean this one:
> 
> https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X399 Taichi/index.us.asp
> 
> Do you happen to know which motherboards for X299 and Z370 are fully compatible with Ubuntu?


Yes, that one.


----------



## betam4x

Kriant said:


> Soooo, after using TR for close to 9 months, what is the consensus on "max safe vcore"? I am sporting 1950x @ 3975mhz @ 1.37v and LLC on auto - goes up to 1.417 with offset under load. This seems to be both realbench stable and prime95 small FFT 8h test stable.
> 
> I want to get to 4.0ghz really bad, because 4.0 is the magic number and 25mhz will infinitely boost by productivity (I am sure of it).
> 
> Hence my question about max safe stable.
> 
> Thanks.


You HAVE to tweak the LLC. Many chips can do 4.0 at 1.2-1.275V @ 4.0 with the correct LLC. My chip degraded quite a bit from pushing voltages and that's not something you want to have happen. I went from 1.2V to 1.275 for 4.0 just because I kept playing around in the 1.475-1.675 range and higher clocks.

On a side note:

I got my chip to 4.3-4.4 GHz and ran benches on it, even got it to 4.5 and ran CPU-Z, it beat the 7980xe in both single and multicore easily (516 single core or something like that, multicore I can't remember)...running anything else made it crash. I don't really care much because I'm ebaying this platform (along with the board and the RAM) the second the 2950x comes out and it still does 4.0 @ 1.275. Right now I'm running @ stock with AMD C&Q enabled and min processor state set to 0%. I get speeds anywhere from 1.95GHz to 4.2 GHz depending on what I'm doing. I only OC when gaming for a while. Luckily I can still do 4.1 @ 1.35.

Anyone else going to get the 2950x when it comes out? I am doing a completely new build. Not happy with the MSI motherboard and I want Samsung memory instead of Hynix, so I figure I'll do a full upgrade, even if clocks only receive a marginal boost. I hope they have VRMs with full on heatsinks like some of the x470 boards. I also hope the chips overclock better.


----------



## MNMadman

Kriant said:


> Soooo, after using TR for close to 9 months, what is the consensus on "max safe vcore"? I am sporting 1950x @ 3975mhz @ 1.37v and LLC on auto - goes up to 1.417 with offset under load. This seems to be both realbench stable and prime95 small FFT 8h test stable.
> 
> I want to get to 4.0ghz really bad, because 4.0 is the magic number and 25mhz will infinitely boost by productivity (I am sure of it).
> 
> Hence my question about max safe stable.
> 
> Thanks.


I'm not as radical as @betam4x though I do push a bit farther than most when overclocking. I also don't keep my systems for long -- the longest I've had a system is 26 months.

I agree with @nycgtr that 1.4v is a "safe" daily driver voltage for most Threadripper overclockers using ambient cooling (assuming you can control the CPU and VRM heat) though I would consider 1.425v as the maximum for my own system.

I test stability with three main programs:
RealBench v2.56 with the full amount of RAM selected for eight hours.
Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset for eight hours.
Y-Cruncher default stress test for eight hours.

If it doesn't pass all, it's not stable. I noticed with *Heatripper Threadkiller* that streaming TV shows while stress testing with Y-Cruncher will stutter/pause if the voltage isn't high enough, so I do that now as well when I change speed or voltage.

For your system, I would suggest trying for a lower voltage with CPU LLC at Level 3 or even Level 2. Are you using P-State overclocking or just doing it through the regular overclocking BIOS page?


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> Anyone else going to get the 2950x when it comes out? I am doing a completely new build. Not happy with the MSI motherboard and I want Samsung memory instead of Hynix, so I figure I'll do a full upgrade, even if clocks only receive a marginal boost. I hope they have VRMs with full on heatsinks like some of the x470 boards. I also hope the chips overclock better.


I'm considering it. If I do, I will likely keep the rest of my system the same as I already have Sammy-B memory and a board I'm happy with. I did have two VRM MOSFETs with no cooling for the first week due to bad QA (the factory thermal pad was too short), so I may get a new board too just as a precaution.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> I'm not as radical as @betam4x though I do push a bit farther than most when overclocking. I also don't keep my systems for long -- the longest I've had a system is 26 months.
> 
> I agree with @nycgtr that 1.4v is a "safe" daily driver voltage for most Threadripper overclockers using ambient cooling (assuming you can control the CPU and VRM heat) though I would consider 1.425v as the maximum for my own system.
> 
> I test stability with three main programs:
> RealBench v2.56 with the full amount of RAM selected for eight hours.
> Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset for eight hours.
> Y-Cruncher default stress test for eight hours.
> 
> If it doesn't pass all, it's not stable. I noticed with *Heatripper Threadkiller* that streaming TV shows while stress testing with Y-Cruncher will stutter/pause if the voltage isn't high enough, so I do that now as well when I change speed or voltage.
> 
> For your system, I would suggest trying for a lower voltage with CPU LLC at Level 3 or even Level 2. Are you using P-State overclocking or just doing it through the regular overclocking BIOS page?


My chip would require 1.375-1.4 if I didn't change LLC to 3 (no vdroop). With LLC at 3 (1 is highest on my board, ugh, 3 keeps vcore the same no matter what), I can drop it down to 1.2xx. I would say that's a pretty drastic improvement.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> My chip would require 1.375-1.4 if I didn't change LLC to 3 (no vdroop). With LLC at 3 (1 is highest on my board, ugh, 3 keeps vcore the same no matter what), I can drop it down to 1.2xx. I would say that's a pretty drastic improvement.


Mine still has vdroop at Level 3, just not as much as on Auto. It's nowhere near 0.1v of vdroop though, even on Auto. What board are you using?


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Mine still has vdroop at Level 3, just not as much as on Auto. It's nowhere near 0.1v of vdroop though, even on Auto. What board are you using?


MSI, the LLC settings are inversed on mine, with 1 being the highest and 10 being the lowest. Level 3 results in no vdroop at all, which I don't see any drawbacks to. Level 1 actually adds voltage under load, which is rather odd. Let's fry some chips! I guess some overclockers may have a need for it. It could be useful for lower idle voltages as well. However, I find this board handles LLC very poorly on 'auto'. Can't wait for x499 to probably go for asrock or something else.


----------



## Kriant

nycgtr said:


> Every chip is different, there is no technically safe when overclocking. If your running a sane daily voltage, bad degradation won't come before you sell off the platform. You might need some more volt to hit the same clocks. I use to need 1.32 to hit 4ghz now I need 1.35. Just the way it is. I think anything under 1.4 is fine for daily.



Then I got to wonder - did I epically lost in the silicon lottery; or 4.0 ghz and 4.1 ghz users with low vcore test their system only with cinebench for stability. P95 requires 1.439v under load on my chip to run stable (stable in my book = 3 random time tests for 4h each, followed by 8h of realbench). Cinebench, gaming, realbench - all require somewhat less, but I don't and can't consider that stable.


----------



## Tamalero

Kriant said:


> Then I got to wonder - did I epically lost in the silicon lottery; or 4.0 ghz and 4.1 ghz users with low vcore test their system only with cinebench for stability. P95 requires 1.439v under load on my chip to run stable (stable in my book = 3 random time tests for 4h each, followed by 8h of realbench). Cinebench, gaming, realbench - all require somewhat less, but I don't and can't consider that stable.


When you say you need 1.43.. You mean your cpu normally stutters with any lower voltage ? freezes? BSODS? or just spits errors?

As others have mentioned here, could be a combination of things. Not just the cpu.
What memories, what voltages of the other options..etc..etc.. :>


----------



## Kriant

Tamalero said:


> When you say you need 1.43.. You mean your cpu normally stutters with any lower voltage ? freezes? BSODS? or just spits errors?
> 
> As others have mentioned here, could be a combination of things. Not just the cpu.
> What memories, what voltages of the other options..etc..etc.. :>


Well, Memory Voltage and VSOC don't play a big enough of a roll when you test your CPU only via P95 small FFT. because p95 only uses cpu memory in that instance. Besides, I can run 24h of HCI memtest without issues. I can run Cinebench, realbench, AIDA, OCCT etc without issues at 40 ghz. It's Prime 95 small FFT that I consider the ultimate CPU stability test. It doesn't stutter, it freezes completely. I have played with LLC's to no avail, and I am 100% stable at 3.975ghz, with +0.2215 offest, which nets me 1.35v idle, 1.37v in gaming; 1.395v under all stress test, except prime95, and 1.417v under prime 95. but anything past that requires a huge vcore bump.

Freezes.

Here's the thing:
It seems that in order to get 4+ hours prime stable at 4.0ghz I need around 1.439v at least.

I know it's not memory, because 1) hci memtest showed no issues after a 24h run. 2) prime95 small fft doesn't really test memory, it pretty much isolates cpu.

I am pretty sure that VSOC mostly plays role in stability whenever you test CPU + Memory, and trying to achieve memory stability. I am pretty sure that it's role in P95 small fft is pretty low. Anyway, I have it at 1.14.

I can run realbench and other "easier" tasks for hours without errors at 4.0ghz, it's just prime that kills it for me.

It's not a temperature issue either. I have a 1080 rad and a 360 rad in a loop with threadripper and 1080ti, it provides enough cooling for both.


----------



## Tamalero

Kriant said:


> Well, Memory Voltage and VSOC don't play a big enough of a roll when you test your CPU only via P95 small FFT. because p95 only uses cpu memory in that instance. Besides, I can run 24h of HCI memtest without issues. I can run Cinebench, realbench, AIDA, OCCT etc without issues at 40 ghz. It's Prime 95 small FFT that I consider the ultimate CPU stability test. It doesn't stutter, it freezes completely. I have played with LLC's to no avail, and I am 100% stable at 3.975ghz, with +0.2215 offest, which nets me 1.35v idle, 1.37v in gaming; 1.395v under all stress test, except prime95, and 1.417v under prime 95. but anything past that requires a huge vcore bump.
> 
> Freezes.
> 
> Here's the thing:
> It seems that in order to get 4+ hours prime stable at 4.0ghz I need around 1.439v at least.
> 
> I know it's not memory, because 1) hci memtest showed no issues after a 24h run. 2) prime95 small fft doesn't really test memory, it pretty much isolates cpu.
> 
> I am pretty sure that VSOC mostly plays role in stability whenever you test CPU + Memory, and trying to achieve memory stability. I am pretty sure that it's role in P95 small fft is pretty low. Anyway, I have it at 1.14.
> 
> I can run realbench and other "easier" tasks for hours without errors at 4.0ghz, it's just prime that kills it for me.
> 
> It's not a temperature issue either. I have a 1080 rad and a 360 rad in a loop with threadripper and 1080ti, it provides enough cooling for both.


Actually, my system froze constantly AFTER reaching 70C when running ONLY cinebench.

After a lot of fiddling, I raised the VSOC by a little and then became rock solid afterwards.

Hence my suggestion.


----------



## betam4x

Kriant said:


> Well, Memory Voltage and VSOC don't play a big enough of a roll when you test your CPU only via P95 small FFT. because p95 only uses cpu memory in that instance. Besides, I can run 24h of HCI memtest without issues. I can run Cinebench, realbench, AIDA, OCCT etc without issues at 40 ghz. It's Prime 95 small FFT that I consider the ultimate CPU stability test. It doesn't stutter, it freezes completely. I have played with LLC's to no avail, and I am 100% stable at 3.975ghz, with +0.2215 offest, which nets me 1.35v idle, 1.37v in gaming; 1.395v under all stress test, except prime95, and 1.417v under prime 95. but anything past that requires a huge vcore bump.
> 
> Freezes.
> 
> Here's the thing:
> It seems that in order to get 4+ hours prime stable at 4.0ghz I need around 1.439v at least.
> 
> I know it's not memory, because 1) hci memtest showed no issues after a 24h run. 2) prime95 small fft doesn't really test memory, it pretty much isolates cpu.
> 
> I am pretty sure that VSOC mostly plays role in stability whenever you test CPU + Memory, and trying to achieve memory stability. I am pretty sure that it's role in P95 small fft is pretty low. Anyway, I have it at 1.14.
> 
> I can run realbench and other "easier" tasks for hours without errors at 4.0ghz, it's just prime that kills it for me.
> 
> It's not a temperature issue either. I have a 1080 rad and a 360 rad in a loop with threadripper and 1080ti, it provides enough cooling for both.


You have me wondering if it is one of microsoft's recent patches or something else. I too have been having similar issues with Prime95 as of today. I used a proven, documented voltage that worked fine before with my overclock (I OC when I want to game) and Prime95 locks up after about 30 seconds. No test errors or anything. I have never had that issue before, and haven't been abusing my chip at all recently. Going to troubleshoot more tonight and try other stress tests. I thought maybe it was corrupt CMOS, but I cleared that...though I might short the jumper just to be safe.

In the past I ran 1.225V for more than 24 hours at 4.0GHz. I also had no issues running other stress tests as well. That is not a high enough voltage to cause degredation. I also noticed that my SOC voltages and memory voltages have increased. Something very odd is going on with this system. I have it back at stock for now, I'll try the CMOS jumper reset, and just hope and pray that the 2950X rolls out. I might also try an older bios version. or try RMAing the board.

EDIT: As an example, I used to be able to run 8 cores at 4.3 GHz at 1.425V. I prime 95 stressed tested them for 20 minutes without issue. Now the machine won't even get to POST with those same settings. This all seemingly happened overnight. The machine was ASLEEP at night. It did install Windows updates at one point.

The ONLY thing I did change was I moved my NVME drive to another slot along with my GPU and wifi card. I did this to help accommodate the heat.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Actually, my system froze constantly AFTER reaching 70C when running ONLY cinebench.
> 
> After a lot of fiddling, I raised the VSOC by a little and then became rock solid afterwards.
> 
> Hence my suggestion.


What board did you have again?


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> What board did you have again?


Asus PRIME X399


----------



## adam3234

Kriant said:


> Then I got to wonder - did I epically lost in the silicon lottery; or 4.0 ghz and 4.1 ghz users with low vcore test their system only with cinebench for stability. P95 requires 1.439v under load on my chip to run stable (stable in my book = 3 random time tests for 4h each, followed by 8h of realbench). Cinebench, gaming, realbench - all require somewhat less, but I don't and can't consider that stable.


Stable in my book is 4 passes of MemTest86 and 24 hours Prime 95(version 29.4) Blend followed by 24 hours of Prime 95(version 29.4) Large FFT then followed by 24 hours of Prime 95(version 29.4) Small FFT. My 1950x failed after 10 hours on the P95 Small FFT using 1.375 vcore (LLC auto) @ 4Ghz and I was't willing to test with higher voltages (because the cpu was hitting 84 degrees tdie using Noctua NH-U14S TR4 with 26 degree ambient) so I tested it with 3.95 Ghz and it passed so I settle at 3.95 Ghz for daily usage. Even at 3.95 Ghz the temps hit 81-84 degrees tdie when I did the test Small FFT test but it never thermal throttled, what was suppose to be the temperature these cpus thermal throttle at?


----------



## OrionBG

adam3234 said:


> Stable in my book is 4 passes of MemTest86 and 24 hours Prime 95(version 29.4) Blend followed by 24 hours of Prime 95(version 29.4) Large FFT then followed by 24 hours of Prime 95(version 29.4) Small FFT. My 1950x failed after 10 hours on the P95 Small FFT using 1.375 vcore (LLC auto) @ 4Ghz and I was't willing to test with higher voltages (because the cpu was hitting 84 degrees tdie using Noctua NH-U14S TR4 with 26 degree ambient) so I tested it with 3.95 Ghz and it passed so I settle at 3.95 Ghz for daily usage. Even at 3.95 Ghz the temps hit 81-84 degrees tdie when I did the test Small FFT test but it never thermal throttled, what was suppose to be the temperature these cpus thermal throttle at?


Ouh...Keyyy... That procedure may be a little too much but yeah, I would say that if a system passes all of that, it is stable!


----------



## adam3234

OrionBG said:


> Ouh...Keyyy... That procedure may be a little too much but yeah, I would say that if a system passes all of that, it is stable!


I do question whether the P95 Blend test is necessary or not and how useful is it really? It maybe useful for seeing how good the PSU handles different loads...honestly I have no idea. I only added that test as part of my procedure just to be sure I've got everything covered and so that I can be satisfied the system is indeed P95 stable. The other tests I know are necessary for a truly stable system. In the past I've had Memtest86 do OK on the first pass but start picking up errors on subsequent passes. In my experience 4 passes seem to be enough to pick up any memory issues. The P95 Large FFT test was necessary for hitting the IMC hard and the Small FFT for hitting the CPU cores hard. I do P95 tests for 24 hours because I've seen P95 tests failing after 10+ hours.


----------



## Kriant

My second attempt with my chip for 4.0ghz ended up being a failure. However, I did tighten my 3.975ghz overclock and lowered idle vcore by .02v, which I think is fairly nice. This time around, I went with 4-4-4 approach for testing. Tested P95 Small FFT at 3 different times, 3 different boots, for 4 hours each. Followed up with gaming and Realbench testing. 

I've also aimed to push my 4x16gb ram to 3333mhz, and while I can boot and even play video games, I quickly error through the stratosphere in HCI memtest, but, managed to pass a quick 2h run of Realbench o_0. Now, I do have to note that I am going the weird way of selecting DOCP @ 3200mhz, rebooting, and then selecting 3333mhz strap and then messing with timings and voltage. Once a 3-day weekend comes along I might re-look at this from completely manual angle. Right now I am testing 3200mhz @ 14-14-14-28-1T geardown disabled, settings.


----------



## gnome_mo

Anyone here had issues while rendering?

When trying to batch render my model, v-ray frame buffer freezes at some percentage of the first image (20%, 45%....etc). Actually the whole PC freezes, even time is stuck at whenever it occurred. 
I haven't done any OC-ing, except setting memory frequency to 3200 in BIOS. RAM in on my qualified vendors list, I've checked. 

PC is:
-AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X 16 Core-CPU 
-ASUS® PRIME X399-A
-32 GB-Corsair VENGEANCE DDR4 3200 MHz (4 x 8 GB)
-11GB ASUS ROG STRIX GEFORCE GTX 1080 Ti 
-M.2 256 GB-SAMSUNG PM961 M.2, PCIe NVMe

While rendering:
-CPU Temp: 56-60°C
-Only 9 gigs RAM used

I've tried: 
-Running memcheck - works fine, no errors
-Setting process affinity in task manager (turned 1 core off) - seems to help a bit
-Updating BIOS and all other drivers (chipset, GPU, LAN, even audio) - it crashed again but resumed rendering after reboot - like it was set to sleep or hibernate.

Funny thing is , I threw everything at it last night: rendering while working in ArchiCAD, Photoshop, Lumion... all the resource hogs, nothing, not at least unstable. I turn on batch rendering, go to sleep, it crashes half an hour later. 
I'm at my wits end, have a project on a deadline and damn thing keeps crashing.


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> Anyone here had issues while rendering?
> 
> When trying to batch render my model, v-ray frame buffer freezes at some percentage of the first image (20%, 45%....etc). Actually the whole PC freezes, even time is stuck at whenever it occurred.
> I haven't done any OC-ing, except setting memory frequency to 3200 in BIOS. RAM in on my qualified vendors list, I've checked.
> 
> PC is:
> -AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X 16 Core-CPU
> -ASUS® PRIME X399-A
> -32 GB-Corsair VENGEANCE DDR4 3200 MHz (4 x 8 GB)
> -11GB ASUS ROG STRIX GEFORCE GTX 1080 Ti
> -M.2 256 GB-SAMSUNG PM961 M.2, PCIe NVMe
> 
> While rendering:
> -CPU Temp: 56-60°C
> -Only 9 gigs RAM used
> 
> I've tried:
> -Running memcheck - works fine, no errors
> -Setting process affinity in task manager (turned 1 core off) - seems to help a bit
> -Updating BIOS and all other drivers (chipset, GPU, LAN, even audio) - it crashed again but resumed rendering after reboot - like it was set to sleep or hibernate.
> 
> Funny thing is , I threw everything at it last night: rendering while working in ArchiCAD, Photoshop, Lumion... all the resource hogs, nothing, not at least unstable. I turn on batch rendering, go to sleep, it crashes half an hour later.
> I'm at my wits end, have a project on a deadline and damn thing keeps crashing.


How did you OC your RAM, did you use XMP/DOCP or did you manually entered the memory timings?
If you are short on time I suggest you lower your RAM frequency down to 2133Mhz otherwise put in the safest overclocking voltages that are known to Threadripper i.e set SOC voltage to 1.1(don't go past 1.2), set DRAM voltage to 1.35(this should be what your RAM uses and use the memory timing suggested by your RAM). Just to be very sure your system is stable I suggest you raise the vcore voltage up to 1.35 volts even if you are not over clocking your CPU. You can work on tightening up your system after you've finished your project.

Good luck.


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> How did you OC your RAM, did you use XMP/DOCP or did you manually entered the memory timings?
> If you are short on time I suggest you lower your RAM frequency down to 2133Mhz otherwise put in the safest overclocking voltages that are known to Threadripper i.e set SOC voltage to 1.1(don't go past 1.2), set DRAM voltage to 1.35(this should be what your RAM uses and use the memory timing suggested by your RAM). Just to be very sure your system is stable I suggest you raise the vcore voltage up to 1.35 volts even if you are not over clocking your CPU. You can work on tightening up your system after you've finished your project.
> 
> Good luck.



I've used DOCP method. 
Thank you so much for the advice, I'm gonna try that first, as you said time is the issue, I'm gonna find more permanent solution later.
There are more recent chipset drivers on AMD support page, 18.10b, but download doesn't finish, it gets to about 19Mb out of 65, then stops. I also sent email to them about that. 
In the meantime, default mem frequency and voltages you mentioned. 

Thanks again!


----------



## gnome_mo

Ok, this keeps getting worse and worse. 
I've loaded optimized defaults in BIOS, but...

First hint was Low Cinebench score, about 1600. 
Then low V-ray bench score. 
Then I checked in Speccy, HWMonitor, task manager..

Turns out, my system only sees half cores. Every monitor there is says the same thing, 8 cores 16 threads.

What the F should I do?


----------



## MNMadman

gnome_mo said:


> I've used DOCP method.
> Thank you so much for the advice, I'm gonna try that first, as you said time is the issue, I'm gonna find more permanent solution later.
> There are more recent chipset drivers on AMD support page, 18.10b, but download doesn't finish, it gets to about 19Mb out of 65, then stops. I also sent email to them about that.
> In the meantime, default mem frequency and voltages you mentioned.
> 
> Thanks again!


Do NOT over-volt your CPU. 1.35v tends to be good for 4.0GHz overclock on all but the worst Threadripper chips and is in no way necessary for stability at default speed.

Reset your BIOS to defaults. Set the CPU speed manually to 3.4GHz (default all-core speed) and the CPU voltage to 1.125v (default voltage). Then set the RAM speed to 2133 and the RAM voltage to 1.2v. Leave RAM timings at Auto. Set SOC voltage to 0.9v. Set the CPU LLC and SOC LLC to Auto.

Those settings should be stable for anything you can throw at the system, as they are the defaults for everything.


----------



## MNMadman

gnome_mo said:


> Ok, this keeps getting worse and worse.
> I've loaded optimized defaults in BIOS, but...
> 
> First hint was Low Cinebench score, about 1600.
> Then low V-ray bench score.
> Then I checked in Speccy, HWMonitor, task manager..
> 
> Turns out, my system only sees half cores. Every monitor there is says the same thing, 8 cores 16 threads.
> 
> What the F should I do?


If you're using Ryzen Master software, make sure it's in Creator Mode and that Disable Cores is set to 0. If you're not using Ryzen Master, make sure Downcore Control (or similar) is set to Auto in the BIOS.


----------



## gnome_mo

MNMadman said:


> If you're using Ryzen Master software, make sure it's in Creator Mode and that Disable Cores is set to 0. If you're not using Ryzen Master, make sure Downcore Control (or similar) is set to Auto in the BIOS.


Reseting Ryzen Master did it. 
Everything is default now, lets see if it freezes again. 
Thanks for the advice guys


----------



## adam3234

MNMadman said:


> Do NOT over-volt your CPU. 1.35v tends to be good for 4.0GHz overclock on all but the worst Threadripper chips and is in no way necessary for stability at default speed.
> 
> Reset your BIOS to defaults. Set the CPU speed manually to 3.4GHz (default all-core speed) and the CPU voltage to 1.125v (default voltage). Then set the RAM speed to 2133 and the RAM voltage to 1.2v. Leave RAM timings at Auto. Set SOC voltage to 0.9v. Set the CPU LLC and SOC LLC to Auto.
> 
> Those settings should be stable for anything you can throw at the system, as they are the defaults for everything.


1.35 vcore probably isn't necessary for the cpu at default speed but I recommended so it reduces the chances vcore being the problem plus safe vcore for threadripper is 1.35 to 1.45 volts. The other settings I recommended may seem too much for running defaults as well but the whole idea is to provide the cpu with the max settings that are still within safe limits to ensure stability. I actually recommended gnome_mo tried the defaults settings first (i.e. set RAM speed back to 2133 Mhz) otherwise if gnome_mo really wanted to try RAM at 3200 Mhz then go for the max safe settings I recommended.


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> 1.35 vcore probably isn't necessary for the cpu at default speed but I recommended so it reduces the chances vcore being the problem plus safe vcore for threadripper is 1.35 to 1.45 volts. The other settings I recommended may seem too much for running defaults as well but the whole idea is to provide the cpu with the max settings that are still within safe limits to ensure stability. I actually recommended gnome_mo tried the defaults settings first (i.e. set RAM speed back to 2133 Mhz) otherwise if gnome_mo really wanted to try RAM at 3200 Mhz then go for the max safe settings I recommended.


I definitely didn't buy 3200 ram to leave it at 2133, but in the interest of time saving until I finish this project, it will have to do (for now). Then I will try Adams voltages to try to get it to run @3200.


Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


----------



## OrionBG

gnome_mo said:


> I definitely didn't buy 3200 ram to leave it at 2133, but in the interest of time saving until I finish this project, it will have to do (for now). Then I will try Adams voltages to try to get it to run @3200.
> 
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


That Corsair Vengeance RAM might just not be the best choice for a Threadripper. I've heard that Corsair tend to change DRAM chips quite often during the model's life and you might just gotten RAM that is not using Samsung B dies.


----------



## gnome_mo

OrionBG said:


> That Corsair Vengeance RAM might just not be the best choice for a Threadripper. I've heard that Corsair tend to change DRAM chips quite often during the model's life and you might just gotten RAM that is not using Samsung B dies.


Is there a way to check?

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


----------



## OrionBG

gnome_mo said:


> Is there a way to check?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


Yep. LINK download the freeware version, run it (Windows defender may cry, tell it to go f... itself  )
On the main window there will be many buttons. Click READ and select one of the DIMMs from list. It will read the DIMM SPD and give all the information for that particular module.
BTW the free version or the app can't write anything to the SPD so it is completely safe.


----------



## gnome_mo

OrionBG said:


> Yep. LINK download the freeware version, run it (Windows defender may cry, tell it to go f... itself  )
> On the main window there will be many buttons. Click READ and select one of the DIMMs from list. It will read the DIMM SPD and give all the information for that particular module.
> BTW the free version or the app can't write anything to the SPD so it is completely safe.


Hahahah Widows does that ...a lot 
I'll try as soon as I get home from work. 
On a more positive note... PC didn't freeze this night! For the first time. Three more apartments to go and I'll get some more breathing room to try to fix this.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


----------



## OrionBG

gnome_mo said:


> Hahahah Widows does that ...a lot
> I'll try as soon as I get home from work.
> On a more positive note... PC didn't freeze this night! For the first time. Three more apartments to go and I'll get some more breathing room to try to fix this.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


So... if your system is stable at 2133MHz most probably the RAM is the problem (and by "problem" I don't mean there is something wrong with it. It's just that the ZEN based CPUs are sensitive to different DRAM chips and the play nice only with Samsung b based DIMMs)... Try 2933MHz most Samsung d (not b) die based DIMMs and Hynix die based DIMMs will do 2933MHz on a current Threadripper system. (by current, I mean with latest BIOS as of April 2018)


----------



## gnome_mo

OrionBG said:


> So... if your system is stable at 2133MHz most probably the RAM is the problem (and by "problem" I don't mean there is something wrong with it. It's just that the ZEN based CPUs are sensitive to different DRAM chips and the play nice only with Samsung b based DIMMs)... Try 2933MHz most Samsung d (not b) die based DIMMs and Hynix die based DIMMs will do 2933MHz on a current Threadripper system. (by current, I mean with latest BIOS as of April 2018)


Would it be worth it to complain to PC Specialist about this? They sold me this rig a month ago, Corsair Vengeance is on QVL and yet it doesn't work as advertised. Could have saved a hundred € if I had known this earlier.


----------



## OrionBG

gnome_mo said:


> Would it be worth it to complain to PC Specialist about this? They sold me this rig a month ago, Corsair Vengeance is on QVL and yet it doesn't work as advertised. Could have saved a couple hundred € if I had known this earlier.


You can always try. The problem is that your DIMMs may work perfectly fine on an Intel based system, or there may be some instability in one of the modules, or it may be just a compatibility issue that constitutes itself only in certain scenarios, or .... There are many possible reasons and the main problem is that all of those "high speed" DIMMs (everything above 2400MHz) are actually overclocked by the factory modules. 
But if as you say they are QVLed for your board, then you can complain or ask them to at least test with some different DIMM modules like G.Skill TridentZ or SniperX to see how the system will behave after a night of rendering.


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> Would it be worth it to complain to PC Specialist about this? They sold me this rig a month ago, Corsair Vengeance is on QVL and yet it doesn't work as advertised. Could have saved a hundred € if I had known this earlier.


Was your rig advertised to operate at 3200 Mhz RAM? If they told you that your rig can operate at 3200 Mhz with everything else set on default as you have tested then you should definitely complain because that's false advertisement. However if they didn't specify it then as OrionBG mention, you can always try. For DDR4 memory anything above 2133 Mhz is an over clock(not 2400 Mhz) so speeds above 2133 Mhz is not guaranteed.


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> Was your rig advertised to operate at 3200 Mhz RAM? If they told you that your rig can operate at 3200 Mhz with everything else set on default as you have tested then you should definitely complain because that's false advertisement. However if they didn't specify it then as OrionBG mention, you can always try. For DDR4 memory anything above 2133 Mhz is an over clock(not 2400 Mhz) so speeds above 2133 Mhz is not guaranteed.


There is PC Configurator on their page in which (for Threadripper) you can choose only Corsair RAM, with varying frequencies (and of course prices). I chose 3200. 
They were supposed to assemble, install system, drivers, update them and run stress test for 24-48h. 

Orion, here are Typhoon results (of course its Hynix - my luck)

Prepared by Thaiphoon Burner Super Blaster
-------------------------------------------------------------
MEMORY MODULE
-------------------------------------------------------------
Manufacturer : Corsair
Series : Not determined
Part Number : CM4X8GD3200C16K4
Serial Number : 00000000h
JEDEC DIMM Label : 8GB 1Rx8 PC4-2133P-UA0-10
Architecture : DDR4 SDRAM UDIMM
Speed Grade : DDR4-2133P downbin
Capacity : 8 GB (8 components)
Organization : 1024M x64 (1 rank)
Register Manufacturer : N/A
Register Model : N/A
Manufacturing Date : Undefined
Manufacturing Location : Taiwan
Revision / Raw Card : 0000h / A0 (8 layers)
-------------------------------------------------------------
DRAM COMPONENTS
-------------------------------------------------------------
Manufacturer : Hynix
Part Number : H5AN8G8N?FR-TFC
Package : Standard Monolithic 78-ball FBGA
Die Density / Count : 8 Gb / 1 die
Composition : 1024M x8 (64M x8 x 16 banks)
Clock Frequency : 1067 MHz (0,938 ns)
Minimum Timing Delays : 15-15-15-36-50
Read Latencies Supported : 16T, 15T, 14T, 13T, 12T, 11T, 10T...
Supply Voltage : 1,20 V
XMP Certified : 1600 MHz / 16-18-18-36-54 / 1,35 V
XMP Extreme : Not programmed
SPD Revision : 1.0 / January 2014
XMP Revision : 2.0 / December 2013
-------------------------------------------------------------
SOURCE SPD DUMP
-------------------------------------------------------------
000 23 10 0C 02 85 21 00 08 00 00 00 03 01 03 00 00
010 00 00 08 0C FC 03 00 00 6C 6C 71 11 08 74 F0 0A
020 20 08 00 05 00 A8 1E 2B 2B 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
030 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 16 36 16 36
040 16 36 16 36 00 00 2B 0C 2B 0C 2B 0C 2B 0C 00 00
050 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
060 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
070 00 00 00 00 00 ED B5 CF 00 C0 00 00 00 C2 ED 51
080 11 11 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
090 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
0A0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
0B0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
0C0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
0D0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
0E0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
0F0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 B6 58
100 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
110 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
120 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
130 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
140 02 9E 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 43 4D 34 58 38 47 44
150 33 32 30 30 43 31 36 4B 34 20 20 20 20 00 80 AD
160 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
170 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
180 0C 4A 05 20 00 00 00 00 00 A3 00 00 05 FC 3F 04
190 00 50 5A 5A 10 B3 0E E8 0A 18 08 F8 04 00 B0 1E
1A0 2D 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 FB F6 F6 F6 F6 F6 00
1B0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
1C0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
1D0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
1E0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
1F0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00


----------



## Tamalero

gnome_mo said:


> Is there a way to check?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk



Search your model here: https://www.hardwareluxx.de/communi...liste-alle-hersteller-18-04-18-a-1161530.html


And use Thaiphoon Burner ( http://www.softnology.biz/ )


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> There is PC Configurator on their page in which (for Threadripper) you can choose only Corsair RAM, with varying frequencies (and of course prices). I chose 3200.
> They were supposed to assemble, install system, drivers, update them and run stress test for 24-48h.
> 
> ...


hmm...giving the option of choosing 3200 Mhz RAM modules is not the same as advertising the rig will work at 3200 Mhz for the RAM. But I think you should still give complaining a go. Don't get too disappointed if they don't refund or replace you RAM with Samsung B-die modules. The gain from overclocking RAM on Threadripper is no where near as high or as important as people are making it out to be even if the infinity fabric speed is tied to RAM speed. When running Cinebench R15 with CPU at 4 Ghz and RAM at 2133 Mhz the highest score I got is 3364, lowest score I got is 3316 and the average score (out of 100 test) I got is 3347.78. When running Cinebench R15 with CPU at 4 Ghz and RAM at 2933 Mhz the highest score I got was 3473, the lowest score I got was 3431 and the average score (out of 100 test) was 3460.22. The average gain going from 2133 Mhz to 2933 Mhz was only about 3.2%. I don't think you'll be gaining much more than I did if you went from 2133 Mhz to 3200 Mhz. I don't have numbers for running RAM at 3200 Mhz because I'm using 128 GB of RAM and at that density 2933 Mhz is that max Threadripper can sustain (at least from all the posts I read from the internet).

If it comes to it and you do have to run your RAM at 2133 Mhz, it might make you feel better to know that I'm in the same position. I bought 128 GB (8 x 16 GB) GB of G.Skill Trident Z RGB 3600 Mhz RAM but after countless hours of testing and internet research, I concluded that 2933 Mhz (far cry from 3600 or 3200 Mhz) was the most I can get from 128 GB of RAM. My system at CPU=4 Ghz, RAM=2933 Mhz completed 4 passes of MemTest86 and Prime 95 ( version 29.4) Blend but failed on Prime 95 Large FFT. To get my system to pass Prime 95 Large FFT I had to up vcore( i think it was from 1.35 to 1.365) and lower the RAM to 2800 Mhz (timings use were 14-14-14-28-42 T1). I decided to set the RAM back to 2133 Mhz for the Prime 95 Small FFT test so that if the test fails I would know it's most likely vcore problem and not the SOC or DRAM (Small FFT doesn't test RAM much) but the the test failed so I lowered my CPU to 3.95 Ghz then that passed. But for my Threadripper to pass 24 hours of P95 Small FFT using 3.95 Ghz, I needed 1.375 vcore which caused the CPU to go up to 84 degrees tdie consuming up to about 310 watts. The CPU cooler I'm using is a Noctua nh-u14s tr4-sp3 which is only rated from 180 watts tdp with some slight over clocking. At that power consumption and temperature, I decided that was the limit I am willing to push my Threadripper to so I did't bother trying to run P95 Small FFT with 2933 Mhz RAM (which would of added about 30 more watts) or upping vcore to get CPU stable at 4 Ghz so 3.95 Mhz CPU and 2133 Mhz RAM was what I settled with for now. If someone designs a better air cooler than the Noctua ones then maybe I'll have another look at over clocking the CPU and RAM but for now I'm satisfied that my system is stable. I'm aware liquid coolers like the Enermax ones are rated for 500 watt overclocking but I hate the idea of liquid coolers (Murphy's Law).


----------



## Tamalero

adam3234 said:


> hmm...giving the option of choosing 3200 Mhz RAM modules is not the same as advertising the rig will work at 3200 Mhz for the RAM. But I think you should still give complaining a go. Don't get too disappointed if they don't refund or replace you RAM with Samsung B-die modules. The gain from overclocking RAM on Threadripper is no where near as high or as important as people are making it out to be even if the infinity fabric speed is tied to RAM speed. When running Cinebench R15 with CPU at 4 Ghz and RAM at 2133 Mhz the highest score I got is 3364, lowest score I got is 3316 and the average score (out of 100 test) I got is 3347.78. When running Cinebench R15 with CPU at 4 Ghz and RAM at 2933 Mhz the highest score I got was 3473, the lowest score I got was 3431 and the average score (out of 100 test) was 3460.22. The average gain going from 2133 Mhz to 2933 Mhz was only about 3.2%. I don't think you'll be gaining much more than I did if you went from 2133 Mhz to 3200 Mhz. I don't have numbers for running RAM at 3200 Mhz because I'm using 128 GB of RAM and at that density 2933 Mhz is that max Threadripper can sustain (at least from all the posts I read from the internet).


Maybe not cinebench, but many reviews shows you can get up to a 10% (5% average I guess) uplift by just using high speeds memories plus tight timings.

I bet that the difference is even higher for Threadripper at least in the gaming segment.


https://community.amd.com/community...emory-oc-showdown-frequency-vs-memory-timings


----------



## OrionBG

gnome_mo said:


> There is PC Configurator on their page in which (for Threadripper) you can choose only Corsair RAM, with varying frequencies (and of course prices). I chose 3200.
> They were supposed to assemble, install system, drivers, update them and run stress test for 24-48h.
> 
> Orion, here are Typhoon results (of course its Hynix - my luck)
> 
> ...


Yeah... That is not good. This is a perfectly good for an Intel based systems, but the worst possible choice for ZEN based CPUs...
Actually it is almost a miracle you are almost stable at 3200MHz with those modules!
If possible just ask them to replace those Corsair sticks with another kit that uses Samsung b dies like those G.Skill kits (mine are two kits of 2x8GB 3200MHz CAS14 TridentZ RGB)
With your current kit you may be stable at 2933MHz...
Unfortunately, many system builders are still not too familiar with the Threadripper platform and some times they deduct things based on past experiences with Intel systems. ZEN based systems thou do have their specifics...


----------



## adam3234

Tamalero said:


> Maybe not cinebench, but many reviews shows you can get up to a 10% (5% average I guess) uplift by just using high speeds memories plus tight timings.
> 
> I bet that the difference is even higher for Threadripper at least in the gaming segment.


Yep, I've just checked out that video and for Ashes of The Singularity he got a gain of of about 17% going from 2666 Mhz to 3466 Mhz. Good point, it does depend on the workload and for some applications like gaming, low latency makes a lot of differences.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Yeah... That is not good. This is a perfectly good for an Intel based systems, but the worst possible choice for ZEN based CPUs...
> Actually it is almost a miracle you are almost stable at 3200MHz with those modules!
> If possible just ask them to replace those Corsair sticks with another kit that uses Samsung b dies like those G.Skill kits (mine are two kits of 2x8GB 3200MHz CAS14 TridentZ RGB)
> With your current kit you may be stable at 2933MHz...
> Unfortunately, many system builders are still not too familiar with the Threadripper platform and some times they deduct things based on past experiences with Intel systems. ZEN based systems thou do have their specifics...


Even B die Corsairs are lower binned than G.skill I think.


Example, B die Corsairs are at 3600 CL18 and higher.

Gskill are on CL16


----------



## gnome_mo

I wrote them an e-mail, and they replied this below. So far so good, they are not washing their hands and they admit it should run at declarated speed.


_Thanks for getting in touch.
I am sorry to hear that you are experiencing issues with your system.


Do you get any error messages or bluescreens after the crash?

For your current issues can you forward through your minidump files so we can look at the bluescreens?
• Open a File Explorer.
• Local Disk C (Windows or OS disk).
• Windows.
• Minidump.
• Copy the latest 5 – 10 files to your desktop and attach to an email to me.

The four sticks of RAM we built into your System are 3200 MHz, so they should run at that speed.
As a first step I’d like you to run following tests so we can make sure they actually do run at the given speed.

https://www.hwinfo.com/download.php

An example of how the results look like is this, please find the Memory RAM on the marked, right hand side. (image)
If we can assist you any further then please do not hesitate to contact us.
Many Thanks,
PC Specialist_


----------



## gnome_mo

Does it make a lot of difference while rendering? 
I'm a bit ashamed to say, but I haven't played a game on PC since 2008 (some Need for Speed, I guess) 
All I do is CAD, modeling, rendering, a bit Photoshop.


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> Even B die Corsairs are lower binned than G.skill I think.
> 
> 
> Example, B die Corsairs are at 3600 CL18 and higher.
> 
> Gskill are on CL16


Its possible... I have not had the "pleasure" of working with Corsair Memory modules.
To be fair the only reason I chose the G.Skill TridentZ RGB stricks was the RGB part  I just liked their implementation better and I got lucky I guess.

*gnome_mo*, at least to my knowledge, nobody have been able to run Hynix die based RAM on any ZEN based CPUs (Ryzen, Threadripper) at 3200MHz stable. (in earlier BIOS revisions, those RAM modules we not even booting at more than 2400MHz) They are just not working properly together. Those guys will lose a lot of your time (and theirs) looking for a faulty RAM when there is nothing wrong with the RAM or the System. It is just a compatibility issue that (again at least to my knowledge) is unsolvable. If you want 3200MHz RAM speed (and possibly a little more) on a ZEN based system, you need Samsung b die based RAM modules. Also, to answer your last question, ZEN is highly affected by RAM speed as the Infinity fabric (the internal bus in the CPU connecting everything) runs at the same speed of the RAM. The faster the RAM, everything in the CPU happens faster. 
One more thing, lower CAS value RAM is better. CAS14 3200MHz RAM will perform better than CAS16 3200MHz RAM.


----------



## gnome_mo

I'm aware why it's not working, I just wasn't aware that my RAM was in fact Hynix, since it was on QVL. But that's Corsair for you. To be fair, my only option at PCSpecialist was Corsair, only at different speeds. Why it had to be PCSpecialist, that's a long story.
I'm just trying to get the best out of ****ty situation. If they can replace my sticks or refund them, great. If not, there's always option to sell them to someone running Intel based system and get G.Skill or something else with samsung b-dies.


----------



## OrionBG

gnome_mo said:


> I'm aware why it's not working, I just wasn't aware that my RAM was in fact Hynix, since it was on QVL. But that's Corsair for you. To be fair, my only option at PCSpecialist was Corsair, only at different speeds. Why it had to be PCSpecialist, that's a long story.
> I'm just trying to get the best out of ****ty situation. If they can replace my sticks or refund them, great. If not, there's always option to sell them to someone running Intel based system and get G.Skill or something else with samsung b-dies.


Absolutely. Those sticks will probably work perfect on an Intel system. Hope they will be able to help you same way.


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> Does it make a lot of difference while rendering?


I'm curious about that too, could you please take note of how faster your system is rendering now with 2133 Mhz RAM and then later when you get your system operating with 3200 Mhz RAM take note of how fast it renders and tell us the difference.




gnome_mo said:


> I'm a bit ashamed to say, but I haven't played a game on PC since 2008 (some Need for Speed, I guess)
> All I do is CAD, modeling, rendering, a bit Photoshop.


I don't think most people who bought threadripper, bought it with gaming as it's primary reason. I bought it for mostly software development reasons.


----------



## gnome_mo

Yes, I will, I'll run benchmarks again, as well as real world project as to see is it really worth it to stress about the speed.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


----------



## Tamalero

gnome_mo said:


> Does it make a lot of difference while rendering?
> I'm a bit ashamed to say, but I haven't played a game on PC since 2008 (some Need for Speed, I guess)
> All I do is CAD, modeling, rendering, a bit Photoshop.


It depends on the program as well. Some do see a BIG difference in rendering on high speed ram and low latency than standard DDR4 spec ram.
Others see a minimal (less than 3% benefit) and prefer raw clock speeds than ram speed.


The consensus seems to be :

Gaming -> benefits of latency more, sweet spots are 3200CL14 or 3466 CL14-CL15
Compressing, data chunking -> Ram RAW speed (sweet spot is 3600 or above)
Rendering or video editing -> combination of low latency and raw speed. 3200CL14 seems the sweet spot.

https://imgur.com/a/HOMtz#aSRZc0G


----------



## gnome_mo

Tamalero said:


> It depends on the program as well. Some do see a BIG difference in rendering on high speed ram and low latency than standard DDR4 spec ram.
> Others see a minimal (less than 3% benefit) and prefer raw clock speeds than ram speed.
> 
> 
> The consensus seems to be :
> 
> Gaming -> benefits of latency more, sweet spots are 3200CL14 or 3466 CL14-CL15
> Compressing, data chunking -> Ram RAW speed (sweet spot is 3600 or above)
> Rendering or video editing -> combination of low latency and raw speed. 3200CL14 seems the sweet spot.
> 
> https://imgur.com/a/HOMtz#aSRZc0G


Well, I've got that 3200 part right, CL14 not so much 

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


----------



## Tamalero

gnome_mo said:


> Well, I've got that 3200 part right, CL14 not so much
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


CL14 is the "main" timings information (Which identify RAS, CAS, etc..)

Samsung Bdies are always CL14 at 3200, CL16 at 3600. 
Samsung other dies are CL17 and CL18 at 3600

Hynix have crappy 3200 at CL16 or CL18.



Other differentiation is: some g.skill that have a higher tier rams, where all the timings are "flat" and low ( like 14-14-14-36 ) vs Corsairs or lower binned gskill modelss (which can be 14-16-16-48 or 18-19-19-96. etc...)

Thats what I've seen when searching around.


The high tier rams usually can be overclocked waaaay more than the lower binned ones or non b die ones... or have the tightest timings razor sharp timings for gaming (like the "new gold standard" of 3466 CL14)



In the other hand, I'm annoyed that the only ram available in my country, was crappy Corsair Domminator with Hynix chips.
Should have imported the more expensive G.skill ones and saved a lot of frustration for my threadripper.

Emulating differences: Threadripper






check the comments.
Very nice improvement..


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> CL14 is the "main" timings information (Which identify RAS, CAS, etc..)
> 
> Samsung Bdies are always CL14 at 3200, CL16 at 3600.
> Samsung other dies are CL17 and CL18 at 3600
> 
> Hynix have crappy 3200 at CL16 or CL18.
> 
> 
> 
> Other differentiation is: some g.skill that have a higher tier rams, where all the timings are "flat" and low ( like 14-14-14-36 ) vs Corsairs or lower binned gskill modelss (which can be 14-16-16-48 or 18-19-19-96. etc...)
> 
> Thats what I've seen when searching around.
> 
> 
> The high tier rams usually can be overclocked waaaay more than the lower binned ones or non b die ones... or have the tightest timings razor sharp timings for gaming (like the "new gold standard" of 3466 CL14)
> 
> 
> 
> In the other hand, I'm annoyed that the only ram available in my country, was crappy Corsair Domminator with Hynix chips.
> Should have imported the more expensive G.skill ones and saved a lot of frustration for my threadripper.
> 
> Emulating differences: Threadripper
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jng6O23TnD4&feature=em-comments
> 
> check the comments.
> Very nice improvement..


Well, Hynix is slower, yes, but I wouldn't say it's bad. I can't complain about the performance of my system much. I'm running Hynix MFR DDR4 3200CL16 and my machine is 'fast enough'. I'm unsure of what type of difference I will get with CL14, but I'll find out in July when I upgrade to next gen.


----------



## betam4x

I installed Ryzen Master 1.3.x on my Threadripper machine and I'm noticing some VERY interesting core clock behavioral changes. I've not done a BIOS update and I assumed that all that new XFR and precision boost stuff was just for the 2nd gen Ryzen...I have AMD C&Q turned on, so that could be why I'm seeing what I'm seeing (Every single one of my cores are boosting to different levels independently). Going to try gaming or something and see if maybe it's just C&Q.

EDIT: So, with C&Q enabled, cores can all clock independently of each other, but that's only for power savings. The second you apply load, it goes back to regular boost behavior. I had every single core running at a different frequency at at a couple points. This sounds like something that AMD could fix in older chips with a simple BIOS or microcode update. If I can have a single chip at 1850 MHz then why can't I have a single chip at 4.0 GHz similar to Ryzen 2xxx? Why can't they disable the lookup table of the Ryzen 1xxx series and use the new boost behavior instead? I heard something about AMD doing something for 1xxx series chips at one point, but I don't recall if it required the new chipset or not.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> I installed Ryzen Master 1.3.x on my Threadripper machine and I'm noticing some VERY interesting core clock behavioral changes. I've not done a BIOS update and I assumed that all that new XFR and precision boost stuff was just for the 2nd gen Ryzen...I have AMD C&Q turned on, so that could be why I'm seeing what I'm seeing (Every single one of my cores are boosting to different levels independently). Going to try gaming or something and see if maybe it's just C&Q.
> 
> EDIT: So, with C&Q enabled, cores can all clock independently of each other, but that's only for power savings. The second you apply load, it goes back to regular boost behavior. I had every single core running at a different frequency at at a couple points. This sounds like something that AMD could fix in older chips with a simple BIOS or microcode update. If I can have a single chip at 1850 MHz then why can't I have a single chip at 4.0 GHz similar to Ryzen 2xxx? Why can't they disable the lookup table of the Ryzen 1xxx series and use the new boost behavior instead? I heard something about AMD doing something for 1xxx series chips at one point, but I don't recall if it required the new chipset or not.


Yeah mine has done that with stock settings since I build *Heatripper Threadkiller* in February. While gaming it would have different top boost multipliers of 41.25-42.00 on four cores depending on the load and core, and the rest of the semi-loaded cores would be at 37.00 multiplier while any unloaded ones would be at 33.00-34.00 multiplier. I immediately updated the BIOS to v2.00 even before I installed the CPU, so I don't know what it would have done with previous BIOS versions.

I currently have it manually overclocked to 3939MHz using fixed 1.21250v with fixed 1.00000v SOC and CPU/SOC LLC at Level 2 (Level 1 is no droop or the least amount -- haven't actually tested it). I'm still trying to find the lowest possible stable voltage for each multiplier and this is it for 39x. It was previously 1.35000v for 40x but I haven't tried it that high in a couple of weeks. 0.13750v is a big bump for 100MHz so I'm going to see if it's actually necessary.

At one point I had it at 1.36875v for 4141MHz on all 16 cores with SMT turned off, so I could always go back to that.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Yeah mine has done that with stock settings since I build *Heatripper Threadkiller* in February. While gaming it would have different top boost multipliers of 41.25-42.00 on four cores depending on the load and core, and the rest of the semi-loaded cores would be at 37.00 multiplier while any unloaded ones would be at 33.00-34.00 multiplier. I immediately updated the BIOS to v2.00 even before I installed the CPU, so I don't know what it would have done with previous BIOS versions.
> 
> I currently have it manually overclocked to 3939MHz using fixed 1.21250v with fixed 1.00000v SOC and CPU/SOC LLC at Level 2 (Level 1 is no droop or the least amount -- haven't actually tested it). I'm still trying to find the lowest possible stable voltage for each multiplier and this is it for 39x. It was previously 1.35000v for 40x but I haven't tried it that high in a couple of weeks. 0.13750v is a big bump for 100MHz so I'm going to see if it's actually necessary.
> 
> At one point I had it at 1.36875v for 4141MHz on all 16 cores with SMT turned off, so I could always go back to that.


I guess my issue is that we shouldn't have to deal with that. AMD should push board manufacturers to update the BIOS and/or microcode to follow the Ryzen 2xxx series (my MSI board hasn't had a new release since before christmas). AMD isn't Intel. I'm sure they are hoping for Ryzen 1xxx users to upgrade to 2xxx, but this whole thing appears to be completely software based. Enabling C&Q tells me that much. If C&Q can control core speeds independently, then a BIOS update that enables an +offset would be easy to implement. They could do for Ryzen 1 what they did for Ryzen+. As I've long suspected, Ryzen 2xxx appears to be just better quality binning. All of the stuff that makes it faster is software (either BIOS or Microcode). AMD would gain loyalty pretty fast if they bring this stuff to Ryzen 1xxx. For example, if the 1950x is rated from 3.4-4.0/4.2 (with XFR) and all it takes is a firmware update to change how cores turbo up/down (which is obvious given C&Q behavior), giving this 'bonus' performance upgrade to end users of Ryzen 1xxx series would be an absolute slap in the face to Intel. While Intel is having to push meltdown patches to slow chips down, AMD could be speeding up last gen chips for free. Most Ryzen users (except people like me and certain others of course) aren't going to upgrade to 2xxx anyway. They aren't changing the operating specs of the chips, just improving the turbo algorithm. For instance, I rarely see Cinebench boost to 4.0+ why? It's either dual core or all core boost, and it appears to be random. Yet with C&Q enabled and a decent power profile set, I can see a single core boost to 3.7-4.0 while the others remain at anywhere from 1.8-2.2 GHz. That tells me the tech is there, and given the randomness of the speed, there is no lookup table for that. Why not update the microcode and/or EFI/BIOS to allow for an option to set headroom, and boost individual cores up to rated TDP and/or speed (or even better, a user defined speed with a warning that reminds users that overclocking will void the warranty). My TR can do 4.5 GHz on a single CCX. AMD claims that they are allowing single CCX overclocking for the 2xxx series, but I can manually do that on 1xxx. Looking at everything from an engineering standpoint, I also suspect that Ryzen 2xxx are just better binned cores (maybe even Threadripper cores) with a new AGESA and/or UEFI. AMD didn't even take full advantage of the "12nm" process. That makes things more suspect. This is a respin from last year, just with better software backing it up. 

AMD won me over for the first time since the Athlon 64 when Threadripper was launched, I have no issue with upgrading to the 29xx, but I'm starting to see smoke and mirrors here, and it's leaving me questioning if I made the right choice jumping back to AMD. The entire 2xxx release sounds like a software upgrade vs a hardware upgrade and if that's the case, I may find myself jumping back to Intel pretty soon. If AMD wants to keep my business they HAVE to provide real value. I'm a software engineer and I'm seeing right through this release. When I can set my 1950X to 4.2 or 4.3 GHz @ 8 cores, tighten the memory timings a bit, switch to dual channel, and get the exact same results that 2700x users get...that tells me it's all a game of smoke and mirrors. Unless the 2950x is a hell of a chip, I will no longer be purchasing it. I may consider a competitive Intel offering instead...and I don't take that lightly. I've owned Cyrix, AMD, and Intel chips since the 386. I've owned Intel chips since the 8088. I'm no loyalist or fanboy. I just want a balance of performance/value. Absent that I'll shoot for performance above all else.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

betam4x said:


> I guess my issue is that we shouldn't have to deal with that. AMD should push board manufacturers to update the BIOS and/or microcode to follow the Ryzen 2xxx series (my MSI board hasn't had a new release since before christmas). AMD isn't Intel. I'm sure they are hoping for Ryzen 1xxx users to upgrade to 2xxx, but this whole thing appears to be completely software based. Enabling C&Q tells me that much. If C&Q can control core speeds independently, then a BIOS update that enables an +offset would be easy to implement. They could do for Ryzen 1 what they did for Ryzen+. As I've long suspected, Ryzen 2xxx appears to be just better quality binning. All of the stuff that makes it faster is software (either BIOS or Microcode). AMD would gain loyalty pretty fast if they bring this stuff to Ryzen 1xxx. For example, if the 1950x is rated from 3.4-4.0/4.2 (with XFR) and all it takes is a firmware update to change how cores turbo up/down (which is obvious given C&Q behavior), giving this 'bonus' performance upgrade to end users of Ryzen 1xxx series would be an absolute slap in the face to Intel. While Intel is having to push meltdown patches to slow chips down, AMD could be speeding up last gen chips for free. Most Ryzen users (except people like me and certain others of course) aren't going to upgrade to 2xxx anyway. They aren't changing the operating specs of the chips, just improving the turbo algorithm. For instance, I rarely see Cinebench boost to 4.0+ why? It's either dual core or all core boost, and it appears to be random. Yet with C&Q enabled and a decent power profile set, I can see a single core boost to 3.7-4.0 while the others remain at anywhere from 1.8-2.2 GHz. That tells me the tech is there, and given the randomness of the speed, there is no lookup table for that. Why not update the microcode and/or EFI/BIOS to allow for an option to set headroom, and boost individual cores up to rated TDP and/or speed (or even better, a user defined speed with a warning that reminds users that overclocking will void the warranty). My TR can do 4.5 GHz on a single CCX. AMD claims that they are allowing single CCX overclocking for the 2xxx series, but I can manually do that on 1xxx. Looking at everything from an engineering standpoint, I also suspect that Ryzen 2xxx are just better binned cores (maybe even Threadripper cores) with a new AGESA and/or UEFI. AMD didn't even take full advantage of the "12nm" process. That makes things more suspect. This is a respin from last year, just with better software backing it up.
> 
> AMD won me over for the first time since the Athlon 64 when Threadripper was launched, I have no issue with upgrading to the 29xx, but I'm starting to see smoke and mirrors here, and it's leaving me questioning if I made the right choice jumping back to AMD. The entire 2xxx release sounds like a software upgrade vs a hardware upgrade and if that's the case, I may find myself jumping back to Intel pretty soon. If AMD wants to keep my business they HAVE to provide real value. I'm a software engineer and I'm seeing right through this release. When I can set my 1950X to 4.2 or 4.3 GHz @ 8 cores, tighten the memory timings a bit, switch to dual channel, and get the exact same results that 2700x users get...that tells me it's all a game of smoke and mirrors. Unless the 2950x is a hell of a chip, I will no longer be purchasing it.* I may consider a competitive Intel offering instead*...and I don't take that lightly. I've owned Cyrix, AMD, and Intel chips since the 386. I've owned Intel chips since the 8088. I'm no loyalist or fanboy. I just want a balance of performance/value. Absent that I'll shoot for performance above all else.


There is literally nothing intel offers in the high end range that is competitive if price vs performance is the metric used... 

I get what you are saying though...as far as you hitting 4.3ghz, keep in mind threadripper is the best of the best of the best cores for Ryzen 1st gen. My 1700 is the garbage heap basically... I can't get over 3.925ghz stable for nothing, even at 1.48v 4ghz is bench stable only... believe my I've tried all the tricks... I did manage to get bench scores up way above what they should be clock per clock by doing what you said... at 4ghz I got 1822 in cinebench vs mid 1700's with just clocks speed adjustment... 

I'm getting a 2700x today and I'm going to see if I can do similar adjustments to it and get higher than just clock increase scores... if you want me to try certain things to see if the cores act as you expect I'll give it a try... but I think a lot of it is as you say software based...


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> I'm curious about that too, could you please take note of how faster your system is rendering now with 2133 Mhz RAM and then later when you get your system operating with 3200 Mhz RAM take note of how fast it renders and tell us the difference.


Ok, I have an update. 
Last thing I did was reset bios to default values, reboot, install latest chipset drivers from AMD (18.10), reboot into bios, set D.O.C.P. to 3200, boot into windows. 
I have been rendering for the last 24h without freeze. I cannot say faster or slower than before since I'm batch rendering different scenes. 
However, I did run V-ray benchmark and got 45 secs, exactly the same as before, and Cinebench with the result of 3002, 1 point better than before.
So, I don't know what to say, if the benchmarks are correct, there's no need to hassle with the RAM frequencies in my line of work.

If somebody also has 32 gigs of DDR4 running at 3200mHz, I would be interested to know their result, and also differences between our systems. 
At v-ray results page, I see results varying from 37-55 seconds (with TR 1950x - same as me) and that seems to me like very big difference low--->high.


----------



## Tamalero

gnome_mo said:


> Ok, I have an update.
> Last thing I did was reset bios to default values, reboot, install latest chipset drivers from AMD (18.10), reboot into bios, set D.O.C.P. to 3200, boot into windows.
> I have been rendering for the last 24h without freeze. I cannot say faster or slower than before since I'm batch rendering different scenes.
> However, I did run V-ray benchmark and got 45 secs, exactly the same as before, and Cinebench with the result of 3002, 1 point better than before.
> So, I don't know what to say, if the benchmarks are correct, there's no need to hassle with the RAM frequencies in my line of work.
> 
> If somebody also has 32 gigs of DDR4 running at 3200mHz, I would be interested to know their result, and also differences between our systems.
> At v-ray results page, I see results varying from 37-55 seconds (with TR 1950x - same as me) and that seems to me like very big difference low--->high.


Have you tried other tools just to confirm (like Blender)?


----------



## gnome_mo

Tamalero said:


> Have you tried other tools just to confirm (like Blender)?


No, don't use it. Otherwise it's irrelevant to me since I render mainly in V-ray. For everything else I do, my old i5 would suffice.


----------



## MNMadman

Was doing some testing (Titanfall 2, my most-played game at the moment) with disabling one die and trying dual-channel memory mode...

1. System wouldn't boot at all with four sticks in dual-channel mode.
2. Couldn't get a G.Skill 3600C16 2x8GB kit stable even with 1.45v memory and 1.3v SOC.
3. G.Skill 3200C14 2x8GB (half of my 4x8GB kit) gave about the same FPS numbers I had with both dies enabled and quad-channel memory, but the game was nowhere near as smooth. Lots of little hitches and jerkiness.

Tested AIDA64 cache & memory...

1. Quad-channel got 92ns latency.
2. Dual-channel got 65ns latency.

Evidently Titanfall 2 isn't latency-sensitive. Going to test my other games with one die disabled and using quad-channel memory.


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> Ok, I have an update.
> Last thing I did was reset bios to default values, reboot, install latest chipset drivers from AMD (18.10), reboot into bios, set D.O.C.P. to 3200, boot into windows.
> I have been rendering for the last 24h without freeze. I cannot say faster or slower than before since I'm batch rendering different scenes.
> However, I did run V-ray benchmark and got 45 secs, exactly the same as before, and Cinebench with the result of 3002, 1 point better than before.
> So, I don't know what to say, if the benchmarks are correct, there's no need to hassle with the RAM frequencies in my line of work.
> 
> If somebody also has 32 gigs of DDR4 running at 3200mHz, I would be interested to know their result, and also differences between our systems.
> At v-ray results page, I see results varying from 37-55 seconds (with TR 1950x - same as me) and that seems to me like very big difference low--->high.


Looks like updating the AMD chipset drivers fixed the problem. Yeah, it does look like overclocking your RAM isn't worth the hassle for what you're using Threadripper for however overclocking the CPU to about 4 Ghz will give you about 10% increase in multithreaded performance so you may like to try that if you want some extra performance or just want to know the limits of what you can get for your money's worth.


----------



## betam4x

Has anyoneon an x399 platform received a UEFI update since last year? MSI's last official release was mid December, and no beta patches have been found either.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> Has anyoneon an x399 platform received a UEFI update since last year? MSI's last official release was mid December, and no beta patches have been found either.


I'm on a Zenith Extreme and the last update was 902 released in December as well.


----------



## MNMadman

ASRock's last update was at the end of November for all except X399M Taichi (wasn't available then).


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> Has anyoneon an x399 platform received a UEFI update since last year? MSI's last official release was mid December, and no beta patches have been found either.


The PRIME X399 got 3 updates after new year.. but most were for minor things and enabling NVME raid. Nothing else.

Last patch was in 2018/03, I guess we got lucky patch wise?

Also, isnt the ASUS Zenith the one getting the most updates?


----------



## adam3234

Tamalero said:


> The PRIME X399 got 3 updates after new year.. but most were for minor things and enabling NVME raid. Nothing else.
> 
> Last patch was in 2018/03, I guess we got lucky patch wise?
> 
> Also, isnt the ASUS Zenith the one getting the most updates?


Last official Zenith Extreme bios update was 27th December see https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/ROG-ZENITH-EXTREME/HelpDesk_BIOS/


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> Looks like updating the AMD chipset drivers fixed the problem. Yeah, it does look like overclocking your RAM isn't worth the hassle for what you're using Threadripper for however overclocking the CPU to about 4 Ghz will give you about 10% increase in multithreaded performance so you may like to try that if you want some extra performance or just want to know the limits of what you can get for your money's worth.


Nah, I live in a fairly hot climate, so for me, it just isn't worth it. Besides, this is my main and only rig and longevity has to come first, since this cost me half on my yearly paycheck.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


----------



## betam4x

gnome_mo said:


> Nah, I live in a fairly hot climate, so for me, it just isn't worth it. Besides, this is my main and only rig and longevity has to come first, since this cost me half on my yearly paycheck.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


I do as well, (TN), but I just run a portable A/C unit in my home office


----------



## betam4x

Yeah, looks like we are all on hold or they have given up on us and moved on. I was wondering about the Spectre fixes, etc. AMD stated that some fixes required microcode updates.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Was doing some testing (Titanfall 2, my most-played game at the moment) with disabling one die and trying dual-channel memory mode...
> 
> 1. System wouldn't boot at all with four sticks in dual-channel mode.
> 2. Couldn't get a G.Skill 3600C16 2x8GB kit stable even with 1.45v memory and 1.3v SOC.
> 3. G.Skill 3200C14 2x8GB (half of my 4x8GB kit) gave about the same FPS numbers I had with both dies enabled and quad-channel memory, but the game was nowhere near as smooth. Lots of little hitches and jerkiness.
> 
> Tested AIDA64 cache & memory...
> 
> 1. Quad-channel got 92ns latency.
> 2. Dual-channel got 65ns latency.
> 
> Evidently Titanfall 2 isn't latency-sensitive. Going to test my other games with one die disabled and using quad-channel memory.


Are you talking about NUMA vs UMA? In order to go dual channel in my machine I have to physically remove 2 DIMMs. Otherwise, setting memory to 'channel' mode in BIOS or choosing 'local' mode will give you those results, but with all the bandwidth of quad channel. That's why 'distributed' mode is nearly useless. I have yet to see an application that runs slower in 'local' mode.

EDIT: and local mode gave pretty decent speedups for most of the games I play. Also, I pulled 2 dimms, set things to 'channel' mode, verified in CPU-Z I was in dual channel mode, disabled 8 cores, and OCed to 4.3 GHz and I was dead on with the 2700X and even beat it in some cases. The only cases where I was slower was the Civ6 AI test for whatever reason. I expect that's due to my memory being Hynix MFR CL16, but cannot confirm. That's why I think that the 2700X are just better quality cores (read: threadripper cores) with a software upgrade and the lower end offerings are regular 'Ryzen' cores with a software upgrade. They didn't even go full on 12nm according to Anandtech's article.

EDIT: Not to say that a 2950X wouldn't be an improvement. Some have already reported getting DDR 4000 to work on the 2700X. Can you imagine having DDR4 4000 @ CL12 for Threadripper? Holy balls....that'd be as fast as octachannel memory...


----------



## gnome_mo

betam4x said:


> I do as well, (TN), but I just run a portable A/C unit in my home office


What is TN? Tennessee? 
I'm in Mostar, B&H, july ambient temperature in home office is 29°C. I can make it 24 with AC , but then I'm freezing 

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> Are you talking about NUMA vs UMA? In order to go dual channel in my machine I have to physically remove 2 DIMMs. Otherwise, setting memory to 'channel' mode in BIOS or choosing 'local' mode will give you those results, but with all the bandwidth of quad channel. That's why 'distributed' mode is nearly useless. I have yet to see an application that runs slower in 'local' mode.
> 
> EDIT: and local mode gave pretty decent speedups for most of the games I play. Also, I pulled 2 dimms, set things to 'channel' mode, verified in CPU-Z I was in dual channel mode, disabled 8 cores, and OCed to 4.3 GHz and I was dead on with the 2700X and even beat it in some cases. The only cases where I was slower was the Civ6 AI test for whatever reason. I expect that's due to my memory being Hynix MFR CL16, but cannot confirm. That's why I think that the 2700X are just better quality cores (read: threadripper cores) with a software upgrade and the lower end offerings are regular 'Ryzen' cores with a software upgrade. They didn't even go full on 12nm according to Anandtech's article.
> 
> EDIT: Not to say that a 2950X wouldn't be an improvement. Some have already reported getting DDR 4000 to work on the 2700X. Can you imagine having DDR4 4000 @ CL12 for Threadripper? Holy balls....that'd be as fast as octachannel memory...


Yes, that's what I did -- ran DIMMs in A2+B2 for dual-channel. Tried A1+A2+B1+B2 and it wouldn't completely boot. Though I set the memory interleaving in the BIOS to Die and I left it that way. Forgot about that -- going to have to try Channel now. And I had the Downcore Control at FOUR (4+0). Or maybe that's the problem -- does Downcore FOUR run four cores on each die?

I also noticed some anomalous behavior with all-core boost. Some all-core loads don't activate the full 37x multiplier when different numbers of cores are activated in the BIOS.

[email protected] ranges from 33.5x-36.5x when in 16-core mode, but works at 37x when in 12-core mode.
Prime95 v29.4b8 works at 37x in both modes.
Cinebench works at 34.5x-35x when in 16-core mode. Haven't tried 12-core mode yet. In 12-core mode some runs are at 37x the whole time while other runs have drops to 36.75x on some cores.
Y-Cruncher works at 34.75x-35.25x when in 16-core mode. Haven't tried 12-core mode yet. Works at 37x in 12-core mode.
AIDA64 CPU/FPU/Cache works at 33.5x-35x when in 16-core mode. Haven't tried 12-core mode yet. CPU/FPU/Cache does the same thing in 12-core mode, though the average multipliers are a bit higher. Just stressing CPU works at 37x. Will re-test 16-core mode.

Note than neither heat nor power are an issue.


----------



## MNMadman

By the way, @betam4x ...

A HUGE thank you for reminding me about the memory interleaving setting. It improved *Heatripper Threadkiller*'s memory performance significantly.

The first image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Die interleaving. The second image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Channel interleaving.

Whether or not that translates into actual performance gains is another story, of course...


----------



## Tamalero

MNMadman said:


> By the way, @betam4x ...
> 
> A HUGE thank you for reminding me about the memory interleaving setting. It improved *Heatripper Threadkiller*'s memory performance significantly.
> 
> The first image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Die interleaving. The second image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Channel interleaving.
> 
> Whether or not that translates into actual performance gains is another story, of course...


You know, I tried to find some information about the channel and die interleaving in the BIOS. The Prime doesn't seem to have anything related to that!

Would have loved to see a bit of reduction from my very high latency.

https://i.imgur.com/znDjyI1.jpg


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> By the way, @betam4x ...
> 
> A HUGE thank you for reminding me about the memory interleaving setting. It improved *Heatripper Threadkiller*'s memory performance significantly.
> 
> The first image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Die interleaving. The second image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Channel interleaving.
> 
> Whether or not that translates into actual performance gains is another story, of course...


To be cautious, i'd say it depends on the workload, however, when gaming I notice a SIGNIFICANT improvement. Most synthetics as well.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> By the way, @betam4x ...
> 
> A HUGE thank you for reminding me about the memory interleaving setting. It improved *Heatripper Threadkiller*'s memory performance significantly.
> 
> The first image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Die interleaving. The second image is 3939MHz CPU, 3232MHz RAM, quad-channel, Channel interleaving.
> 
> Whether or not that translates into actual performance gains is another story, of course...


You were running the same AsRock X399 Taichi board as me right... Where are those options in the BIOS and how should they be set?

Thanks!


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> You were running the same AsRock X399 Taichi board as me right... Where are those options in the BIOS and how should they be set?
> 
> Thanks!


1. Advanced > AMD CBS > DF Common Options
2. Set Memory Interleaving to Channel
3. ????
4. Profit


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> 1. Advanced > AMD CBS > DF Common Options
> 2. Set Memory Interleaving to Channel
> 3. ????
> 4. Profit


Was playing around with timings today on my board (tried tightening them a bit). Suddenly my system now won't boot and pops up error code 15. Cleared CMOS and everything with no luck. Trying BIOS flashback, and if that doesn't work I am RMAing the board and the RAM. I blame MSI, though Corsair is just as bad. MSI's version of 'clear CMOS' isn't actually clearing CMOS, and the past 5 Corsair products I purchased were defective. The only reason I bought Corsair RAM in the first place was insane RAM prices.

There is a Chinese plant rumored to be getting ready for direct to retailer 32 gb DDR4 3200CL12 kits for $199 USD MSRP. If that rumor plays out, God help Samsung and Hynix. Probably just another damn rumor though. 

Either way, I am RMAing these sticks and the board, selling them+the 1950x on eBay, and buying a 2700X until the 2950X comes out. Nothing but Taichi from now on. Nothing but Samsung b-die chips from now on.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> Was playing around with timings today on my board (tried tightening them a bit). Suddenly my system now won't boot and pops up error code 15. Cleared CMOS and everything with no luck. Trying BIOS flashback, and if that doesn't work I am RMAing the board and the RAM. I blame MSI, though Corsair is just as bad. MSI's version of 'clear CMOS' isn't actually clearing CMOS, and the past 5 Corsair products I purchased were defective. The only reason I bought Corsair RAM in the first place was insane RAM prices.
> 
> There is a Chinese plant rumored to be getting ready for direct to retailer 32 gb DDR4 3200CL12 kits for $199 USD MSRP. If that rumor plays out, God help Samsung and Hynix. Probably just another damn rumor though.
> 
> Either way, I am RMAing these sticks and the board, selling them+the 1950x on eBay, and buying a 2700X until the 2950X comes out. Nothing but Taichi from now on. Nothing but Samsung b-die chips from now on.


Threadripper motherboards seem to have a tendency of keeping the "charge" even when you bridge.

I usually had to wait 10 seconds bridging the CMOS reset jumpers until the information cleared up.

Btw, if you cant boot.. try removing all memory slots, it also happened to me once. Leave only 1 dimm in the first slot of each die.
Then try to boot.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Threadripper motherboards seem to have a tendency of keeping the "charge" even when you bridge.
> 
> I usually had to wait 10 seconds bridging the CMOS reset jumpers until the information cleared up.
> 
> Btw, if you cant boot.. try removing all memory slots, it also happened to me once. Leave only 1 dimm in the first slot of each die.
> Then try to boot.


I pulled all the memory, put the jumper in for about an hour, pulled the jumper, waited an hour, randomly pushed the power/reset button a few times, all with the power cord unplugged. I also pulled the BATT1 cable and did everything I could to kill all the juice going to the board, including unplugging the power supply, etc. Same error.

3 hours of troubleshooting later after total failure, I open up my macbook pro, download the exact same BIOS version and renamed it to MSI.ROM, push the BIOS flashback button, wait for it to do it's thing....and BINGO! suddenly the system is working again (hint: CMOS reset isn't resetting CMOS). I get what you say, but I've owned a ton of MSI boards in the past and they've been great. Took a step away and got an ASUS board for my last build (2600K @ 5 GHz, still running great to this day, it's teaching my nephew game programming). I come back to MSI and suddenly they can't even get the simple stuff right? Clear CMOS should mean Clear CMOS. I left that jumper there an hour. After that I even bent the pins so that they touched....all of this while being disconnected from the PSU. It booted up like CMOS was cleared, but then rebooted with error 15. The memory is fine, running HCI memtest as we speak, but the changes I made were minimal and likely did not damage the RAM. I swear to god if I had the financial backing, I'd put all these board manufacturers out of business. They all get their components from the same dealers, they just don't know how to build a decent platform. I'm a software developer, if my platform was that bad, I'd be fired in a heartbeat. Clear CMOS should um...I don't know clear CMOS? restore default settings?

Anyway, sorry for the rant. was in a debate with someone (which I won) regarding Pinnacle Ridge. Attempted to one up them, but fat fingered a single timing issue. I'm sure other manufacturers have their own issues. At this point, I am half tempted to crowdfund a new brand just to slap a few manufacturers (including MSI) in the face. I probably won't, but don't count it out. If these guys don't step up their game....there are HUGE profits to be had for a platform done right. Thank god I'm too lazy to do it, but if I keep seeing trash like this, I might change my mind. I studied electrical engineering, but ended up doing software development. I've been talking to a buddy of mine who IS an electrical engineer (he makes custom stuff similar to the raspberry pi). The majority of this issues stem from paying bottom dollar for engineers. It's just like the whole security thing in the US with the quote unquote 'internet of things' or Intel's 'meltdown' issues. If you don't invest in your product, it's going to suck. Oh and by profits I don't mean expensive motherboards, I mean affordable motherboards with quality components and a UEFI done right.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> 1. Advanced > AMD CBS > DF Common Options
> 2. Set Memory Interleaving to Channel
> 3. ????
> 4. Profit


Thanks! I'll test it later.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> I pulled all the memory, put the jumper in for about an hour, pulled the jumper, waited an hour, randomly pushed the power/reset button a few times, all with the power cord unplugged. I also pulled the BATT1 cable and did everything I could to kill all the juice going to the board, including unplugging the power supply, etc. Same error.


How the hell is this even possible?


----------



## OrionBG

Here are some results with Memory Interleaving set to "Auto" and then set to "Channel"

Beteen 25GB/s and 10GB/s gain is quite a nice gain... however you look at it  ... and 24ns less latency...
Cinebench went about 50 points up.

Thanks guys for the tip!


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> How the hell is this even possible?


I'm uncertain. All I know is I hope there aren't any MSI components in use in the US nuclear program lol. Maybe somehow the BIOS got corrupt? Who knows. All is well now though. I DID have to reactivate Windows.


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> Here are some results with Memory Interleaving set to "Auto" and then set to "Channel"
> 
> Beteen 25GB/s and 10GB/s gain is quite a nice gain... however you look at it  ... and 24ns less latency...
> Cinebench went about 50 points up.
> 
> Thanks guys for the tip!


Welcome to the club my friend. If you game, you'll definitely appreciate the performance uplift and latency improvements. Many other applications run faster as well.


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> Here are some results with Memory Interleaving set to "Auto" and then set to "Channel"
> 
> Beteen 25GB/s and 10GB/s gain is quite a nice gain... however you look at it  ... and 24ns less latency...
> Cinebench went about 50 points up.
> 
> Thanks guys for the tip!


Weird that the Chipset line in the AIDA64 cache & memory benchmark shows "AMD X399, *AMD Taishan*, AMD K17 IMC" while yours and others show "AMD X399, *AMD K17 SCH*, AMD K17 IMC". We have the same board and the same BIOS version.

Maybe I should install the BIOS again or something...

Edit: I suppose it could be the different versions of AIDA64 -- mine is newer. Will investigate when I get home in eight hours.


----------



## Sphere07

That's weird. I cmos my MSI board just fine, and that was after it boot looped because of a stupid setting I put in with the memory. Something sounds wrong there @betam4x. At least you got it working, and I will keep this in mind for future reference.


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> Here are some results with Memory Interleaving set to "Auto" and then set to "Channel"
> 
> Beteen 25GB/s and 10GB/s gain is quite a nice gain... however you look at it  ... and 24ns less latency...
> Cinebench went about 50 points up.
> 
> Thanks guys for the tip!


Welcome to the club my friend. If you game, you'll definitely appreciate the performance uplift and latency improvements. Many other applications run faster as well.


----------



## Tamalero

Can't believe it, I finally found the settings for memory interleave. They were pretty buried inside the Prime.

But crazy improvement!!!


After setting it to CHANNEL interleave











Before.. Channel interleave to AUTO (probably was set to "PER SOCKET" or PER DIE).










thats a -24.8 latency drop and a beefy increase in Mbps transfer wise.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Weird that the Chipset line in the AIDA64 cache & memory benchmark shows "AMD X399, *AMD Taishan*, AMD K17 IMC" while yours and others show "AMD X399, *AMD K17 SCH*, AMD K17 IMC". We have the same board and the same BIOS version.
> 
> Maybe I should install the BIOS again or something...
> 
> Edit: I suppose it could be the different versions of AIDA64 -- mine is newer. Will investigate when I get home in eight hours.


Yep, it is AIDA version change. I just updated to the latest one and the line did also change for me to "AMD X399, AMD Taishan, AMD K17 IMC".


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Yep, it is AIDA version change. I just updated to the latest one and the line did also change for me to "AMD X399, AMD Taishan, AMD K17 IMC".


Just updated AIDA, Says TAISHAN in my version as well.


----------



## x7007

Use Aida64 for testing stability, prime95 always crashes and needed reset when overclock is not stable. Aida64 just saying failed hardware and you can reboot without any data loss or software corruption


----------



## Ithanul

Just noticed the 1950X drop down to 719 on Amazon and one of the motherboards as well did a price drop.

Is that ASUS ROG STRIX X399-E a good board? (It is the board that is knocked down in price - it is down to 279)

I am super tempted to pull the trigger and buy the 1950X and that board. Me wants some 16c/32t goodness for crunching.


----------



## Tamalero

Ithanul said:


> Just noticed the 1950X drop down to 719 on Amazon and one of the motherboards as well did a price drop.
> 
> Is that ASUS ROG STRIX X399-E a good board? (It is the board that is knocked down in price - it is down to 279)
> 
> I am super tempted to pull the trigger and buy the 1950X and that board. Me wants some 16c/32t goodness for crunching.


It all depends if its worth it for you.

Its a nice price, but the 1950 has been bouncing of prices constantly, going as low as 600 USD in combination with other promos.


----------



## Ithanul

Tamalero said:


> It all depends if its worth it for you.
> 
> Its a nice price, but the 1950 has been bouncing of prices constantly, going as low as 600 USD in combination with other promos.


Well, I could not resist and went for it. Plus, I will just sell off my X99 boards and Intel water blocks to recoup some money back. Now, to get a water block later. No hell in way am I going to go full out BOINC crunching during the Pent on an air cooler.

Debating now to sell off my 32GB 3200MHz sticks that where running on the X99 board or just keep them to run on the TR. Any thoughts? Not sure if these F4-3200C14Q-32GTZ sticks are B-die.

I keep seeing the F4-3200C14Q-32GFX is B-die, so maybe my GTZ ones are.
Ooooo, finally found a good list (had to go snooping around a German tech forum). Sweet, they are!


----------



## betam4x

It's been a while since I tinkered with my machine. Every since that BIOS flashback issue I've been busy dealing with other stuff and haven't had time to play with things to figure out what went wrong. Well, I'm on an extended (paid) leave of absence from work, so I decided to play with things today. First stop was CPU overclocking. My CPU appeared to degrade suddenly a while back, which left me rather confused. I rarely push the voltages, but I have pushed them pretty high. For a CPU to go from 1.2V to 1.3V for 4 GHz is rather odd for me. So I wanted to look into it a bit more. Thus far I've noticed that the overall system has been behaving differently since the flashback. At a fixed 4 GHz I'm seeing anywhere from 3994.4 MHz to 4063.2 MHz. Also, required voltages appeared to have dropped at least a bit (haven't bottomed out yet, so I can't say how much...) VCore in HWInfo is 1.288, but is set at 1.275 in BIOS. stable as hell and temps are well below 68C. I'm wondering if my BIOS might have been corrupt. Not sure. More to come? Still lowering voltages, but Prime95 is passing all the tests thus far. Before the flashback issue, I was up to needing 1.3V to have a stable 4.0 GHz OC. When I originally purchased this chip, it could do something like 1.2V @ 4.0 GHz. Still testing, but the clock speed range is interesting. I've never noticed that before.

EDIT: The pic illustrates the oddities. Multiplier set to 40x, CPB disabled, etc.


----------



## betam4x

Oh, out of curiousity, for those of you that are unable to get your Threadripper to go below 1.3V @ 4.0 GHz at a mid to upper level LLC, can you open an admin command prompt, type bcdedit, and paste these settings?

tscsyncpolicy Enhanced
bootmenupolicy Standard
useplatformclock Yes
disabledynamictick Yes

They will be at the end. Anandtech's article has me thinking...

EDIT: Also note your VCORE at both idle and under load.


----------



## Tamalero

Ithanul said:


> Well, I could not resist and went for it. Plus, I will just sell off my X99 boards and Intel water blocks to recoup some money back. Now, to get a water block later. No hell in way am I going to go full out BOINC crunching during the Pent on an air cooler.
> 
> Debating now to sell off my 32GB 3200MHz sticks that where running on the X99 board or just keep them to run on the TR. Any thoughts? Not sure if these F4-3200C14Q-32GTZ sticks are B-die.
> 
> I keep seeing the F4-3200C14Q-32GFX is B-die, so maybe my GTZ ones are.
> Ooooo, finally found a good list (had to go snooping around a German tech forum). Sweet, they are!


https://www.hardwareluxx.de/communi...liste-alle-hersteller-18-04-18-a-1161530.html

You mean this link? definitively worth it for finding the best ram.




betam4x said:


> Oh, out of curiousity, for those of you that are unable to get your Threadripper to go below 1.3V @ 4.0 GHz at a mid to upper level LLC, can you open an admin command prompt, type bcdedit, and paste these settings?
> 
> tscsyncpolicy Enhanced
> bootmenupolicy Standard
> useplatformclock Yes
> disabledynamictick Yes
> 
> They will be at the end. Anandtech's article has me thinking...
> 
> EDIT: Also note your VCORE at both idle and under load.


You're enabling HPET with that right?

I get horrible stuttering even on windows when enabling HPET, had to disable it completely.
I also had stuttering on my old 6600k but nothing as bad as what I had with my threadripper.

I wonder if some of the software I use causes a flood of HPET requests thus slowing down the entire system.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> https://www.hardwareluxx.de/communi...liste-alle-hersteller-18-04-18-a-1161530.html
> 
> You mean this link? definitively worth it for finding the best ram.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're enabling HPET with that right?
> 
> I get horrible stuttering even on windows when enabling HPET, had to disable it completely.
> I also had stuttering on my old 6600k but nothing as bad as what I had with my threadripper.
> 
> I wonder if some of the software I use causes a flood of HPET requests thus slowing down the entire system.


My board didn't have an option for HPET, windows did, but I disabled it, along with the settings mentioned I got a slight performance boost. My thought is that that board manufacturers aren't putting enough effort into things. From what I've read, HPET is a mess for all platforms right now.


----------



## x7007

betam4x said:


> It's been a while since I tinkered with my machine. Every since that BIOS flashback issue I've been busy dealing with other stuff and haven't had time to play with things to figure out what went wrong. Well, I'm on an extended (paid) leave of absence from work, so I decided to play with things today. First stop was CPU overclocking. My CPU appeared to degrade suddenly a while back, which left me rather confused. I rarely push the voltages, but I have pushed them pretty high. For a CPU to go from 1.2V to 1.3V for 4 GHz is rather odd for me. So I wanted to look into it a bit more. Thus far I've noticed that the overall system has been behaving differently since the flashback. At a fixed 4 GHz I'm seeing anywhere from 3994.4 MHz to 4063.2 MHz. Also, required voltages appeared to have dropped at least a bit (haven't bottomed out yet, so I can't say how much...) VCore in HWInfo is 1.288, but is set at 1.275 in BIOS. stable as hell and temps are well below 68C. I'm wondering if my BIOS might have been corrupt. Not sure. More to come? Still lowering voltages, but Prime95 is passing all the tests thus far. Before the flashback issue, I was up to needing 1.3V to have a stable 4.0 GHz OC. When I originally purchased this chip, it could do something like 1.2V @ 4.0 GHz. Still testing, but the clock speed range is interesting. I've never noticed that before.
> 
> EDIT: The pic illustrates the oddities. Multiplier set to 40x, CPB disabled, etc.


I also was able to do 4.0 at 1.280 or so, after the try to go 4.2 I gave it too much voltage like 1.570 and it can only do 4.0 at 1.380 now


----------



## Ithanul

Tamalero said:


> https://www.hardwareluxx.de/communi...liste-alle-hersteller-18-04-18-a-1161530.html
> 
> You mean this link? definitively worth it for finding the best ram.


Yep, I found that while hunting for a good list.
Definitely got that now saved in my bookmarks.


----------



## OrionBG

Guys I have a strange issue...
I was playing with overclocking my 1080ti today and I came upon a strange problem.
I can run Heaven without any issues, 3DMark Time Spy also but Fire strike kills the PC?!?!
The first Fire Strike Graphical test(just Fire Strike, not Extreme even) is running ok, the second one starts and every time on the exact same place of the test the PC Shuts-down but not a normal shutdown. The system will not start again until I remove AC power for 10 secs. After that I can start the PC without any issues and everything works again (except FireStrike) All temperatures are OK during the tests, latest nVidia and AMD Drivers, 1KW PSU...


----------



## adam3234

OrionBG said:


> Guys I have a strange issue...
> I was playing with overclocking my 1080ti today and I came upon a strange problem.
> I can run Heaven without any issues, 3DMark Time Spy also but Fire strike kills the PC?!?!
> The first Fire Strike Graphical test(just Fire Strike, not Extreme even) is running ok, the second one starts and every time on the exact same place of the test the PC Shuts-down but not a normal shutdown. The system will not start again until I remove AC power for 10 secs. After that I can start the PC without any issues and everything works again (except FireStrike) All temperatures are OK during the tests, latest nVidia and AMD Drivers, 1KW PSU...


I've never had that problem with Time Spy before. If everything works excepted Time Spy then maybe there's something wrong with the installation. Try uninstalling and then reinstalling Time Spy, when you do the uninstall and reinstall make sure you use bios settings that you know are absolutely stable.


----------



## OrionBG

adam3234 said:


> I've never had that problem with Time Spy before. If everything works excepted Time Spy then maybe there's something wrong with the installation. Try uninstalling and then reinstalling Time Spy, when you do the uninstall and reinstall make sure you use bios settings that you know are absolutely stable.


Time Spy works without any issues. Fire Strike is the one that is messing up wit me.

On another note, Using memory interleaving set to "Channel" I get quite lower CPU score in Time Spy, about 8100 points. If I change the setting back to "Die or Auto" the CPU score goes up to 11xxx Which when calculated into the final score is more than 600 points difference...


----------



## adam3234

OrionBG said:


> Time Spy works without any issues. Fire Strike is the one that is messing up wit me.
> 
> On another note, Using memory interleaving set to "Channel" I get quite lower CPU score in Time Spy, about 8100 points. If I change the setting back to "Die or Auto" the CPU score goes up to 11xxx Which when calculated into the final score is more than 600 points difference...


Oops sorry I got Time Spy and Fire Strike mixed up but the idea of uninstalling then reinstalling still applies.

That's an interesting note about changing memory interleaving to channel. When I tried it I don't remember any noticeable difference. Maybe Time Spy prefers more memory throughput over lower memory latency. I'll test that tomorrow, right now it's 3:00 am where I live so time for bed. I'm curious to know what other people are getting in Time Spy with their threadrippers set to NUMA (i.e. memory interleaving set to channel).


----------



## adam3234

@OrionBG yep you are right. I just tested Time Spy (CPU=4075 Mhz, RAM=2933 Mhz 15-15-15-36 rTC=51 CR=2T) and got CPU score of 9614, GPU score of 9623 and overall score of 9621 in NUMA mode and memory latency was 69.2 ns. With memory interleaving set to auto the CPU score was 11164, GPU score was 9616, overall score was 9820.


----------



## OrionBG

adam3234 said:


> @OrionBG yep you are right. I just tested Time Spy (CPU=4075 Mhz, RAM=2933 Mhz 15-15-15-36 rTC=51 CR=2T) and got CPU score of 9614, GPU score of 9623 and overall score of 9621 in NUMA mode and memory latency was 69.2 ns. With memory interleaving set to auto the CPU score was 11164, GPU score was 9616, overall score was 9820.


Yep... Oh well, I guess I'll stick to UMA for the time being... I like my 11046 Time Spy score 
It is a lot better than the 10650 I got in NUMA mode.


----------



## betam4x

x7007 said:


> I also was able to do 4.0 at 1.280 or so, after the try to go 4.2 I gave it too much voltage like 1.570 and it can only do 4.0 at 1.380 now


Note that doing BIOS flashback to the same version reversed things for me significantly, still not down to the levels I had when I reversed the chip, but I'm down to 1.25V @ 4.0, which is fine for me.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> I've never had that problem with Time Spy before. If everything works excepted Time Spy then maybe there's something wrong with the installation. Try uninstalling and then reinstalling Time Spy, when you do the uninstall and reinstall make sure you use bios settings that you know are absolutely stable.


Are you running multiple monitors by chance? If so, disable the secondary before the run. I had issues until I did that.


----------



## x7007

betam4x said:


> Note that doing BIOS flashback to the same version reversed things for me significantly, still not down to the levels I had when I reversed the chip, but I'm down to 1.25V @ 4.0, which is fine for me.



Did you test it with Aida64 CPU FPU ?


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> Are you running multiple monitors by chance? If so, disable the secondary before the run. I had issues until I did that.


Nope. Single one. I'm beginning to think my PSU may be the issue but I'll test this soon when I rebuild my PC.

UPDATE:

I run one command that shows the GPU Power draw and run FurMark for several seconds...

9.57 W
10.16 W
9.67 W
9.77 W
9.57 W
11.04 W
10.06 W
10.45 W
11.14 W
564.81 W
585.20 W
580.99 W
575.30 W
582.58 W
579.05 W
587.68 W
578.63 W
581.84 W
582.36 W
586.29 W
591.47 W
584.89 W
587.74 W
576.09 W
579.73 W
579.13 W
590.50 W
589.19 W
592.28 W
529.52 W
90.42 W
13.68 W
11.14 W
10.94 W
10.65 W
10.16 W
9.77 W
11.43 W
10.25 W
10.06 W
9.96 W

I think you can guess where the test starts and where it ends...
So if the card can suck up to 600W of power and the overclocked Threadripper 1950x can do above 300W OCed and under load I might be tripping some overload protection on my PSU (current one is 1000W but not some well-known brand) I'll redo my testing with the Corsair HX1000i soon...

So guys, just to recap, if somebody tells you that 1000W PSU will be enough for even two 1080ti cards, just lough!  If stock, maybe but we all know the name of this forum and why we are here


----------



## MNMadman

Wow.

The maximum my system has ever pulled was about 660W from the wall. And that was fully overclocked on CPU and GPU while running RealBench v2.56. I'll have to try FurMark.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Nope. Single one. I'm beginning to think my PSU may be the issue but I'll test this soon when I rebuild my PC.
> 
> UPDATE:
> 
> I run one command that shows the GPU Power draw and run FurMark for several seconds...
> 
> 9.57 W
> 10.16 W
> 9.67 W
> 9.77 W
> 9.57 W
> 11.04 W
> 10.06 W
> 10.45 W
> 11.14 W
> 564.81 W
> 585.20 W
> 580.99 W
> 575.30 W
> 582.58 W
> 579.05 W
> 587.68 W
> 578.63 W
> 581.84 W
> 582.36 W
> 586.29 W
> 591.47 W
> 584.89 W
> 587.74 W
> 576.09 W
> 579.73 W
> 579.13 W
> 590.50 W
> 589.19 W
> 592.28 W
> 529.52 W
> 90.42 W
> 13.68 W
> 11.14 W
> 10.94 W
> 10.65 W
> 10.16 W
> 9.77 W
> 11.43 W
> 10.25 W
> 10.06 W
> 9.96 W
> 
> I think you can guess where the test starts and where it ends...
> So if the card can suck up to 600W of power and the overclocked Threadripper 1950x can do above 300W OCed and under load I might be tripping some overload protection on my PSU (current one is 1000W but not some well-known brand) I'll redo my testing with the Corsair HX1000i soon...
> 
> So guys, just to recap, if somebody tells you that 1000W PSU will be enough for even two 1080ti cards, just lough!  If stock, maybe but we all know the name of this forum and why we are here


Sounds like the "off brand" PSU is not juicing the 12V rail in the way it should.

I've seen so many crappy off brand PSUs that gives like.. less than 50% of their power on the 12V rail, And giving a ton of power on the not so useful 3.3V and 5V rails. And the 12V as everyone knows.. is the one that shoulders the weight of the entire system.

Perhaps your power supply has the same issue. Not so much power on the 12V rail and way too much on the 3.3V and 5V ones.


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> Sounds like the "off brand" PSU is not juicing the 12V rail in the way it should.
> 
> I've seen so many crappy off brand PSUs that gives like.. less than 50% of their power on the 12V rail, And giving a ton of power on the not so useful 3.3V and 5V rails. And the 12V as everyone knows.. is the one that shoulders the weight of the entire system.
> 
> Perhaps your power supply has the same issue. Not so much power on the 12V rail and way too much on the 3.3V and 5V ones.


I read one review from JohnyGuru about that model and according to it, this was Andison's first really good PSU line since ever... (and it was about 40 Euro less than other brands sold here) Maybe I've just gotten a potato... Never mind... Will see what will happen with the HX1000i in hopefully several days...


----------



## KaneTW

I can't seem to get 128GB of ECC DDR4-2667 to be stable. Running 8 Kingston KVR24E17D8/16MA sticks (16GB Micron A-Die DDR4-2400), and at 2400 all works fine. At 2667 it freezes (took a long time, but I managed to reproduce it by restoring a 32GB RAM VM from disk). 

Tried 1.1V SOC (auto was 1.05V) but that doesn't seem to help.

RAM itself doesn't report any ECC errors -- CPU just halts, no bluescreen, nothing. At some point I thought my overclock was unstable, but that doesn't seem to be it. Currently running [email protected] LLC3 (although I'm not sure how much of my stability testing crashes were caused by the -2667)

Any ideas? I'm keeping it at -2400 for now.


----------



## MNMadman

KaneTW said:


> Any ideas? I'm keeping it at -2400 for now.


ECC RAM is one strike against overclocking.
Populating all eight slots is another strike against overclocking.

You could always try extra RAM voltage and 1.2v SOC.


----------



## KaneTW

Yeah, ECC + 128GB is more important to me than fast RAM speeds, but I figured there has to be a way to get at least 2667. I *think* the issue is with the SOC, so I'll try 1.2V when I try again, then up the RAM voltage.


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> Sounds like the "off brand" PSU is not juicing the 12V rail in the way it should.
> 
> I've seen so many crappy off brand PSUs that gives like.. less than 50% of their power on the 12V rail, And giving a ton of power on the not so useful 3.3V and 5V rails. And the 12V as everyone knows.. is the one that shoulders the weight of the entire system.
> 
> Perhaps your power supply has the same issue. Not so much power on the 12V rail and way too much on the 3.3V and 5V ones.



I will never buy anything but FSP or SeaSonic and ThermalTake specific ones.


----------



## ajc9988

OrionBG said:


> Nope. Single one. I'm beginning to think my PSU may be the issue but I'll test this soon when I rebuild my PC.
> 
> UPDATE:
> 
> I run one command that shows the GPU Power draw and run FurMark for several seconds...
> 
> 9.57 W
> 10.16 W
> 9.67 W
> 9.77 W
> 9.57 W
> 11.04 W
> 10.06 W
> 10.45 W
> 11.14 W
> 564.81 W
> 585.20 W
> 580.99 W
> 575.30 W
> 582.58 W
> 579.05 W
> 587.68 W
> 578.63 W
> 581.84 W
> 582.36 W
> 586.29 W
> 591.47 W
> 584.89 W
> 587.74 W
> 576.09 W
> 579.73 W
> 579.13 W
> 590.50 W
> 589.19 W
> 592.28 W
> 529.52 W
> 90.42 W
> 13.68 W
> 11.14 W
> 10.94 W
> 10.65 W
> 10.16 W
> 9.77 W
> 11.43 W
> 10.25 W
> 10.06 W
> 9.96 W
> 
> I think you can guess where the test starts and where it ends...
> So if the card can suck up to 600W of power and the overclocked Threadripper 1950x can do above 300W OCed and under load I might be tripping some overload protection on my PSU (current one is 1000W but not some well-known brand) I'll redo my testing with the Corsair HX1000i soon...
> 
> So guys, just to recap, if somebody tells you that 1000W PSU will be enough for even two 1080ti cards, just lough!  If stock, maybe but we all know the name of this forum and why we are here


That pull on the card seems high, tbh. Also, my TR pulls over [email protected]@1.2875V....

Did you mod the card?

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


----------



## KaneTW

400W? What is your LLC setting? That seems absurdly high. My [email protected]/LLC3 (1.33V real vcore) draws 265W package, and [email protected]/LLC3 (like 1.36 real vcore?) stays slightly below 300W (although I don't keep that overclock because it's too power inefficient and pushes me at 71c)

E: that's under AVX linpack with 30k equations, which I found has the highest possible power draw and crashes the easiest, higher than prime95 small FFT


----------



## adam3234

KaneTW said:


> 400W? What is your LLC setting? That seems absurdly high. My [email protected]/LLC3 (1.33V real vcore) draws 265W package, and [email protected]/LLC3 (like 1.36 real vcore?) stays slightly below 300W (although I don't keep that overclock because it's too power inefficient and pushes me at 71c)
> 
> E: that's under AVX linpack with 30k equations, which I found has the highest possible power draw and crashes the easiest, higher than prime95 small FFT


400 watt...wonder what temperatures that generates? I'm currently doing Prime95(version 29.3) stability testing. Right now I'm on the Small FFT test and it's highest tempt is 86 C consuming 335 watts. Cooler is Noctua nh-u14s tr4-sp3 with 2 fans. Ambient tempt is 22 C. CPU is 1950x @ 3950 Mhz vcore is set to 1.375 volt(auto LLC) but has dropped down to 1.313 volts under heavy load. My CPU has already been stability tested (24 hours each for Prime95 Blend, Large FFT and Small FFT) but that was with RAM at 2133 Mhz. I'm doing the stability testing again because I want to set the RAM to 2800 Mhz 14-14-14-34 tRC=48, CR=1T. I've previously got the CPU 24 hours stable at that RAM with CPU at 4 Ghz for Blend and Large FFT but was too concerned about the heat generated to test it at Small FFT. I'm more comfortable with testing it at Small FFT at that RAM, CPU 3950 Mhz today because the temperature is about 4 C less then when I previously tested...although seeing 86 C is a bit of a concern.

What temperature was threadripper suppose to thermal throttle at? I haven't see my threadripper thermal throttle yet.


----------



## OrionBG

ajc9988 said:


> That pull on the card seems high, tbh. Also, my TR pulls over [email protected]@1.2875V....
> 
> Did you mod the card?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


I flashed the XOC BIOS on my FE 1080ti so no limits at all... that wattage was achieved at 2100MHz Core and 1.2V GPU VCORE... It is probably too high but I was just testing...
Also how did you get your CPU to consume 400W??? At max load with Prime95 and Small FTTs I get around 312W to 325W (according to HWInfo64)


----------



## ajc9988

I played with a couple settings, including the TDP limiter.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


----------



## adam3234

adam3234 said:


> Ambient temperature has increased by 2 C since this morning and so has the CPU which reached 88 C and all cores have thermal throttled to 550 Mhz. Good to know that the CPU actually does thermal throttle


I just took off the case's front panel and put a fan in front of it and temperature decrease by 6 C.


----------



## Tamalero

adam3234 said:


> I just took off the case's front panel and put a fan in front of it and temperature decrease by 6 C.


It helps a lot if you put also a fan blowing air straight into the VRMs.


----------



## adam3234

Tamalero said:


> It helps a lot if you put also a fan blowing air straight into the VRMs.


Yeah, I agree. It's the VRMs I'm concerned about right now. I'm going to put a fan over the VRMs when this test is over. My motherboard is a Zenith Extreme which has active VRM cooling so I shouldn't be too concerned, still wish they had put a proper heatsink with fins instead a block of aluminium over the VRMs though.


----------



## Tamalero

Speaking of updates guys, have you all noticed something different since the latest update from Windows?


I used to render on VEGAS, and utilization easily would hover at 99 and to 100%, rendering at full speed.

Now, it doesn't go above 89%. NO matter what settings, changes, etc.. still 89% at most.

*edit*

When I mean 89% I mean that every thread is AT MOST loaded to 89%, it never goes past 89%. not even to 90%.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> I just took off the case's front panel and put a fan in front of it and temperature decrease by 6 C.


I pointed my portable A/C unit at my rad and got a 20C decrease. It also lowered VRMs by more than 30 degrees lol.

EDIT: It's too bad somebody doesn't make a mini fridge (like an ACTUAL mini fridge with a built in freezer component that runs water through a coil to quickly chill it before sending it back to cool the CPU or something odd like that. Maybe even a mini fridge case. I'm aware of condensation issues, but I mean hell,a 2 in one mini fridge PC combo that gives bonus overclocking potential would be pretty cool. Tempted to drill a couple holes in the side of my mini fridge freezer section, insulate and then put the rad inside lol. A better solution would obviously be to get refrigeration tech shrunken down so it can replace a rad/fans.

Edit: So a freezer is supposed to get down to -18 degrees C. My PC is now currently right next to my mini fridge, and I believe I can put the AiO rad in the mini fridge (with fans of course). I may experiment with this tomorrow and see how low I can get temps/how high i can push overclocks. It's just the rad and piping, so condensation should not be an issue, except maybe with the fans. I might have to disconnect the fans or use extension cables, but it would be interesting to see what kind of results I get. Has anyone tried this with threadripper?


----------



## MNMadman

Tamalero said:


> Speaking of updates guys, have you all noticed something different since the latest update from Windows?
> 
> 
> I used to render on VEGAS, and utilization easily would hover at 99 and to 100%, rendering at full speed.
> 
> Now, it doesn't go above 89%. NO matter what settings, changes, etc.. still 89% at most.
> 
> *edit*
> 
> When I mean 89% I mean that every thread is AT MOST loaded to 89%, it never goes past 89%. not even to 90%.


Is that only when rendering, or is it all CPU loads?

Currently doing the Linux thing, but probably going to transition back to Windows this weekend. Will be doing a clean install of the newest version on *Heatripper Threadkiller*.


----------



## Tamalero

MNMadman said:


> Is that only when rendering, or is it all CPU loads?
> 
> Currently doing the Linux thing, but probably going to transition back to Windows this weekend. Will be doing a clean install of the newest version on *Heatripper Threadkiller*.


So far it seems only on normal tasks and not benchmarks. It goes to 100% with cinebench.


----------



## mmonnin

betam4x said:


> I pointed my portable A/C unit at my rad and got a 20C decrease. It also lowered VRMs by more than 30 degrees lol.
> 
> EDIT: It's too bad somebody doesn't make a mini fridge (like an ACTUAL mini fridge with a built in freezer component that runs water through a coil to quickly chill it before sending it back to cool the CPU or something odd like that. Maybe even a mini fridge case. I'm aware of condensation issues, but I mean hell,a 2 in one mini fridge PC combo that gives bonus overclocking potential would be pretty cool. Tempted to drill a couple holes in the side of my mini fridge freezer section, insulate and then put the rad inside lol. A better solution would obviously be to get refrigeration tech shrunken down so it can replace a rad/fans.
> 
> Edit: So a freezer is supposed to get down to -18 degrees C. My PC is now currently right next to my mini fridge, and I believe I can put the AiO rad in the mini fridge (with fans of course). I may experiment with this tomorrow and see how low I can get temps/how high i can push overclocks. It's just the rad and piping, so condensation should not be an issue, except maybe with the fans. I might have to disconnect the fans or use extension cables, but it would be interesting to see what kind of results I get. Has anyone tried this with threadripper?


Fridges and freezers are not meant to handle a constant heat load like a computer. They have passive coils in low ventilated areas between it and the wall while a computer has active fans blowing across many fins with more surface area. They only remove heat from food and the little bit of heat that enters the fridge/freezer.


----------



## betam4x

mmonnin said:


> Fridges and freezers are not meant to handle a constant heat load like a computer. They have passive coils in low ventilated areas between it and the wall while a computer has active fans blowing across many fins with more surface area. They only remove heat from food and the little bit of heat that enters the fridge/freezer.


Oh I know, I would be doing it as a fun experiment. I love tinkering with ****. We do need a better way to cool CPUs though, beyond watercooling. We are going to hit a wall with node shrinks, and I expect we'll need to find better ways to boost clocks (which involves better cooling/higher voltages.) What happens when we hit 5nm? We can scale out to many CPUs, however, only so much can be done in that regard. If you look at the LN2 guys hitting 5 GHz with our current processes, it just makes me wonder if there are better ways to cool CPUs to subzero temps and therefore increase voltages/clocks.

Edit, does anyone remember the peltier coolers way back in the day? I think they died due to high failure rates. I'm talking something along those lines.


----------



## RoBiK

betam4x said:


> It's too bad somebody doesn't make a mini fridge (like an ACTUAL mini fridge with a built in freezer component that runs water through a coil to quickly chill it before sending it back to cool the CPU or something odd like that.


You mean something like this? http://koolance.com/exc-800-portable-800W-recirculating-chiller


----------



## betam4x

Killed my board yesterday. I was cleaning/reapplying thermal paste and when I went to reinstall the CPU, it fell out of the tray and bent a ton of pins and may have broken some as well. Going to attempt to fix it today, but I already have another on the way and it will be here tonight. It is NOT an MSI.

If I get the old board fixed, I will eBay it.

EDIT: Looks like pins broke on the MSI board. Sucks having to spend another $400 on a motherboard (we don't have income tax here in TN, just a 10% sales tax).


----------



## Minotaurtoo

betam4x said:


> Killed my board yesterday. I was cleaning/reapplying thermal paste and when I went to reinstall the CPU, it fell out of the tray and bent a ton of pins and may have broken some as well. Going to attempt to fix it today, but I already have another on the way and it will be here tonight. It is NOT an MSI.
> 
> If I get the old board fixed, I will eBay it.
> 
> EDIT: Looks like pins broke on the MSI board. Sucks having to spend another $400 on a motherboard (*we don't have income tax here in TN, just a 10% sales tax)*.


If I had known that about 15 years ago I'd moved 5 miles north... I live just on the Alabama side of the line near St. Joseph... would save nearly a grand a year : )


----------



## mmonnin

betam4x said:


> Oh I know, I would be doing it as a fun experiment. I love tinkering with ****. We do need a better way to cool CPUs though, beyond watercooling. We are going to hit a wall with node shrinks, and I expect we'll need to find better ways to boost clocks (which involves better cooling/higher voltages.) What happens when we hit 5nm? We can scale out to many CPUs, however, only so much can be done in that regard. If you look at the LN2 guys hitting 5 GHz with our current processes, it just makes me wonder if there are better ways to cool CPUs to subzero temps and therefore increase voltages/clocks.
> 
> Edit, does anyone remember the peltier coolers way back in the day? I think they died due to high failure rates. I'm talking something along those lines.


Its why Intel has policies along the lines that require a 1% wattage increase to be like 2% performance increase. Gone are the days of just freely adding performance w/o power considerations. The heat density is going to make it harder to cool CPUs as you've mentioned. The generations of 5% gaming performance increases from Intel often come with frustrated users on forums but its no free lunch after low hanging fruit has already been plucked. Performance often just isn't in games but in efficiency.


----------



## betam4x

Minotaurtoo said:


> If I had known that about 15 years ago I'd moved 5 miles north... I live just on the Alabama side of the line near St. Joseph... would save nearly a grand a year : )


You also get to deduct sales taxes off your tax return, which is awesome.


----------



## betam4x

betam4x said:


> Killed my board yesterday. I was cleaning/reapplying thermal paste and when I went to reinstall the CPU, it fell out of the tray and bent a ton of pins and may have broken some as well. Going to attempt to fix it today, but I already have another on the way and it will be here tonight. It is NOT an MSI.
> 
> If I get the old board fixed, I will eBay it.
> 
> EDIT: Looks like pins broke on the MSI board. Sucks having to spend another $400 on a motherboard (we don't have income tax here in TN, just a 10% sales tax).


My new board is...quite simply AMAZING. ROG STRIX X399-E Gaming motherboard. While I don't like the fact that I basically destroyed my MSI, this board is a much better over all board. Probably the best Threadripper board out there at the moment. Oh sure, others have more features, etc. However it turbos much better than my old board, runs cooler as well.


----------



## ITAngel

betam4x said:


> My new board is...quite simply AMAZING. ROG STRIX X399-E Gaming motherboard. While I don't like the fact that I basically destroyed my MSI, this board is a much better over all board. Probably the best Threadripper board out there at the moment. Oh sure, others have more features, etc. However it turbos much better than my old board, runs cooler as well.


That is a good board, I have the AsRock Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming and seems to be doing great.


----------



## Ithanul

betam4x said:


> My new board is...quite simply AMAZING. ROG STRIX X399-E Gaming motherboard. While I don't like the fact that I basically destroyed my MSI, this board is a much better over all board. Probably the best Threadripper board out there at the moment. Oh sure, others have more features, etc. However it turbos much better than my old board, runs cooler as well.


That is good to hear. I nabbed that board when it was on sale when I nabbed a 1950X on sale. Just picked both up Sat. Now, to get the chip up and running.


----------



## x7007

Can someone check with windows 10 1803 spring update if all the Ryzen Timing Checker including ProcODT is displayed ? if not for us or only for me, what could be the issue ? I tried to update to the new Gigabyte Aorus 7 X399 F3J bios and it made my computer slow to crawl lowering my Quad channel in Channel mode to 78K MB instead 94K MB Write. F3G works just fine with all on 100%


----------



## gupsterg

Working here.


----------



## x7007

gupsterg said:


> Working here.
> 
> View attachment 181201



But did you update to Windows 10 Spring update ? 1803 ? 

if you didn't then that's the cause.

check using Start > Winver


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> But did you update to Windows 10 Spring update ? 1803 ?
> 
> if you didn't then that's the cause.
> 
> check using Start > Winver


I've been on the "Spring Chickens Update"  for a while now (Windows Insider Program) and have no issues with both memory speed and missing data in "Ryzen Timing Checker"


----------



## gupsterg

x7007 said:


> But did you update to Windows 10 Spring update ? 1803 ?
> 
> if you didn't then that's the cause.
> 
> check using Start > Winver


Re-check above screenie, below the CPU-Z screenie is same info as using winver.


----------



## Hurtman

Guys, has anyone tried a new bios yet?

Zenith Extreme BIOS 1003


----------



## x7007

So why Ryzen Timing checker can't detect the timings ?? if so it's only the gigabyte firmware update.. what caused it ....
it was working before just before couple days ago
even though I'm getting good benchmark

What could cause the Ryzen Timing not to work ?? I think it's something with the Pref or WMI issues I had...

This on Auto or Creator mode













This is with Channel - Local mode


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> So why Ryzen Timing checker can't detect the timings ?? if so it's only the gigabyte firmware update.. what caused it ....
> it was working before just before couple days ago
> even though I'm getting good benchmark
> 
> What could cause the Ryzen Timing not to work ?? I think it's something with the Pref or WMI issues I had...
> 
> ...


Maybe it is the AGESA update in the BIOS and "Ryzen Timings Checker" needs an update to read the data correctly...

Actually... wait a minute... According to your screenshots the AGESA version in your BIOS is 1.0.0.3A 
Isn't that actually an old one? The new one should be 1.0.0.5


----------



## x7007

OrionBG said:


> Maybe it is the AGESA update in the BIOS and "Ryzen Timings Checker" needs an update to read the data correctly...
> 
> Actually... wait a minute... According to your screenshots the AGESA version in your BIOS is 1.0.0.3A
> Isn't that actually an old one? The new one should be 1.0.0.5


Yes that's the thing, I updated the firmware to F3J and it is 1.0.0.5 but it makes my computer slow to crawl and my benchmark are all down . like nothing works properly . I can't understand why windows is so slow.

With F3G everything works properly with the same settings. and there are so many missing settings in the new firmware . but why downgrading back to 1.0.0.3 doesn't bring back the Ryzen Timing checker to work properly ? I mean it shows info and shows some of the timings . but some timings are off or blanked out.


----------



## adam3234

Hurtman said:


> Guys, has anyone tried a new bios yet?
> 
> Zenith Extreme BIOS 1003


All ASUS has said was that this bios updates to AGESA 1.0.0.5 but doesn't list any benefits so I'm reluctant to update. What does AGESA 1.0.0.5 have over the previous AGESA version that makes it worth updating to?


----------



## Hurtman

adam3234 said:


> All ASUS has said was that this bios updates to AGESA 1.0.0.5 but doesn't list any benefits so I'm reluctant to update. What does AGESA 1.0.0.5 have over the previous AGESA version that makes it worth updating to?


Too sharp a jump from 0.0.6.0 to 1.0.0.5
But on АМ4 AGESA 1.0.0.2а and it's strange


----------



## adam3234

x7007 said:


> Yes that's the thing, I updated the firmware to F3J and it is 1.0.0.5 but it makes my computer slow to crawl and my benchmark are all down . like nothing works properly . I can't understand why windows is so slow.
> 
> With F3G everything works properly with the same settings. and there are so many missing settings in the new firmware . but why downgrading back to 1.0.0.3 doesn't bring back the Ryzen Timing checker to work properly ? I mean it shows info and shows some of the timings . but some timings are off or blanked out.


It's anyone else having problems like this with AGESA 1.0.0.5? I'm going to stick with the previous Zenith Extreme BIOS version (i.e. 902) for now because it's very stable plus I've recently finished Prime 95 
(version 29.3) stability testing with it (24 hours each of Prime 95 Small FFT, Large FFT and Blend. CPU = 3950 Mhz, RAM = 2800 Mhz 14-14-14-34 tRC=48, CR=1T)


----------



## betam4x

I believe the latest AGESA verson on Threadripper is 1.0.0.6. I believe my motherboard is running it. Don't know for sure though. At the hospital and won't be discharged for a few days. 

Edit:. Also, my new board hit max turbo far more often than my old one.


----------



## Hurtman

1.0.0.6 ? О_о


----------



## x7007

adam3234 said:


> It's anyone else having problems like this with AGESA 1.0.0.5? I'm going to stick with the previous Zenith Extreme BIOS version (i.e. 902) for now because it's very stable plus I've recently finished Prime 95
> (version 29.3) stability testing with it (24 hours each of Prime 95 Small FFT, Large FFT and Blend. CPU = 3950 Mhz, RAM = 2800 Mhz 14-14-14-34 tRC=48, CR=1T)


Someone else said he has issue, 10 others said they don't ... I can't complete the culprit or find it


----------



## MNMadman

Still on AGESA 1.0.0.4 on my ASRock X399 Taichi, because they haven't given me the choice to upgrade. The newest BIOS is from November 2017.


----------



## gupsterg

Hurtman said:


> Too sharp a jump from 0.0.6.0 to 1.0.0.5
> But on АМ4 AGESA 1.0.0.2а and it's strange


Dunno if you have ASUS board. Most of the UEFIs have not had the version string for AGESA updated. So many show 0.0.6.0.

UEFI 1003 on ZE was sound for me. Latest for ZE is 9952 (9950 had non functioning USB headers off board, rear IO ok). 995x have AGESA 1.0.0.7.


----------



## Hurtman

gupsterg said:


> Dunno if you have ASUS board. Most of the UEFIs have not had the version string for AGESA updated. So many show 0.0.6.0.
> 
> UEFI 1003 on ZE was sound for me. Latest for ZE is 9952 (9950 had non functioning USB headers off board, rear IO ok). 995x have AGESA 1.0.0.7.


995x its is not official?
0902 last in official site


----------



## gupsterg

Check spoiler  .



Spoiler



https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-ZENITH-EXTREME/HelpDesk_BIOS/











995x is beta  . Some of the betas we get on OCN via Elmor in the 2 ZE threads turn official  . Even official releases have bugs, it just depends if it affects you or not.


----------



## Hurtman

gupsterg said:


> Check spoiler  .
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-ZENITH-EXTREME/HelpDesk_BIOS/
> 
> View attachment 181761
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 995x is beta  . Some of the betas we get on OCN via Elmor in the 2 ZE threads turn official  . Even official releases have bugs, it just depends if it affects you or not.


I'm not talking about 1003 because I do not know anything about it, for me the last stable official version 0902 =)
But I'm still waiting for a new stable version to try to overclock memory above 3200 cl14 (Flare X) and my cpu can work only on 3975 MHz (Stable in LinX) =)


----------



## gupsterg

Hurtman said:


> I'm not talking about 1003 because I do not know anything about it, for me the last stable official version 0902 =)
> But I'm still waiting for a new stable version to try to overclock memory above 3200 cl14 (Flare X) and my cpu can work only on 3975 MHz (Stable in LinX) =)


Please read below how it went in thread.



Hurtman said:


> Guys, has anyone tried a new bios yet?
> 
> Zenith Extreme BIOS 1003
> 
> 
> 
> 
> adam3234 said:
> 
> 
> 
> All ASUS has said was that this bios updates to AGESA 1.0.0.5 but doesn't list any benefits so I'm reluctant to update. What does AGESA 1.0.0.5 have over the previous AGESA version that makes it worth updating to?
> 
> 
> 
> Hurtman said:
> 
> 
> 
> Too sharp a jump from 0.0.6.0 to 1.0.0.5
> But on АМ4 AGESA 1.0.0.2а and it's strange
> 
> 
> 
> betam4x said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe the latest AGESA verson on Threadripper is 1.0.0.6. I believe my motherboard is running it. Don't know for sure though. At the hospital and won't be discharged for a few days.
> 
> Edit:. Also, my new board hit max turbo far more often than my old one.
> 
> 
> 
> Hurtman said:
> 
> 
> 
> 1.0.0.6 ? О_о
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

To your post of AGESA versions I replied below and I also replied to your original post stated I have tried 1003.



gupsterg said:


> Dunno if you have ASUS board. Most of the UEFIs have not had the version string for AGESA updated. So many show 0.0.6.0.
> 
> UEFI 1003 on ZE was sound for me. Latest for ZE is 9952 (9950 had non functioning USB headers off board, rear IO ok). 995x have AGESA 1.0.0.7.


Your next post below and I reply.



Hurtman said:


> 995x its is not official?
> 0902 last in official site
> 
> 
> 
> gupsterg said:
> 
> 
> 
> Check spoiler  .
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-ZENITH-EXTREME/HelpDesk_BIOS/
> 
> View attachment 181761
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 995x is beta  . Some of the betas we get on OCN via Elmor in the 2 ZE threads turn official  . Even official releases have bugs, it just depends if it affects you or not.
Click to expand...

If 0902 is stable for you it's cool.


----------



## Hurtman

At us, unfortunately, in Russian community only 2 owners Threadripper.
And mostly people own other Ryzen.
And I see how the results of overclocking both memory and processor at higher frequencies with each new version of AGESA improve.
So I'm hoping for an improvement from new versions =)


----------



## gupsterg

@Hurtman

Below thread may be of use to you :grouphug: .

http://www.overclock.net/forum/11-a...e-x399-threadripper-overclocking-support.html


----------



## Hurtman

gupsterg said:


> @Hurtman
> 
> Below thread may be of use to you :grouphug: .
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/forum/11-a...e-x399-threadripper-overclocking-support.html


Thank you, now and for this topic, too, I will follow through Google translate


----------



## gupsterg

Hurtman said:


> Thank you, now and for this topic, too, I will follow through Google translate


No problem  .

I just took the time to read your past posts and see you posed this:-



Hurtman said:


> Guys, at somebody it turned out to receive stability on higher frequencies (3466,3600) with a set of G.Skill Flare X 3200 cl14 (4x8)?
> My system 1950x ROG Zenith Extreme



The G.Skill Flare X 3200MHz C14 4x8GB is essentially same as 3200MHz C14 Trident Z and Ripjaw V I have used on ZE.

Below is:-

ASUS ZE UEFI 1003
TR 1950X (Stock)
F4-3200C14Q-32GVK @ 3466MHz The Stilt timings preset in UEFI



Spoiler


----------



## Minotaurtoo

@gupsterg why are you still rocking the "new to overclock.net" I assume they are still allowing custom titles for all : )


----------



## gupsterg

Still in training  .


----------



## OrionBG

gupsterg said:


> Still in training  .


Since Jan 2015 ?!?


----------



## Hurtman

*gupsterg* Thanks,I try it =)


----------



## Z-O-M-B-I-E

x7007 said:


> Yes that's the thing, I updated the firmware to F3J and it is 1.0.0.5 but it makes my computer slow to crawl and my benchmark are all down . like nothing works properly . I can't understand why windows is so slow.
> 
> With F3G everything works properly with the same settings. and there are so many missing settings in the new firmware . but why downgrading back to 1.0.0.3 doesn't bring back the Ryzen Timing checker to work properly ? I mean it shows info and shows some of the timings . but some timings are off or blanked out.


Yes, the same problem. If return the standard multiplier (from 40 to 38), the problem goes away. Have fix?


----------



## Kriant

Members of this epic community, I need some help. I have been fighting this for almost a week now to no avail.

Every time I test Prime95 Blend with 75%/80%/90% ram (custom setting, which is basically blend setting but with more ram allocated) I get DRIVER OVERRAN STACK BUFFER Blue Screen Error within 1 hour. 

OCCT Linpack with 90% ram just freezes.

I ran HCI memtest at two separate occasions for 24h period each time from a bootable dvd - no errors.

I ran P95 small FFT - no issues.

Realbench 8h - no issues.

Tried stock settings and ran P95 custom blend with 80% ram used - DRIVER OVERRAN STACK BUFFER.

Double checked page file size - 30gb on boot drive and 100gb on storage hdd for a cumulative 130 gb for page-file.

I have tried: upping vcore, playing with vsoc range from .9 to 1.19; upping ram voltage; playing with load line calibration; tightening timings; loosening timings considerably. Nothing works.

Am I missing something? 

P.S. with the revamp of the forum idk if my system is still visible in my profile, if not I will re-post my system specs.

Just in case:
1950X @ 3.975ghz @ 1.395 - 1.417v under full load and around 1.33 - 1.35 under light load or idle. 
Zenith x399
64gb DDR4 Gskill ripjaws V F4-3200C14Q-64GVK 14-14-14-34-2T or 14-14-13-22-1T with manual timings on. 
1600W EVGA SuperNova G2
256gb boot ssd two nvme drives, 512gb ssd and two hdd's 1tb each.
1080ti (Asus Poseidon)
1080ti FTW3 Hybrid
Cooling: Phobya Nova 1080 with Noctua fans + 360 ex xcps rad.
CPU block: XSPC Raystorm for Threadripper.

the Asus 1080ti Poseidon and 1950x are in the same loop, but 1080 rad and 360 rad seem like overkill for heat dissipation.


P.S. I have posted the same post in the X399 Zenith thread, but I wholeheartedly believe that it's not due to the motherboard, so I am extending my shout for help here as well. Thank you for understanding.


----------



## adam3234

"BSOD Error DRIVER_OVERRAN_STACK_BUFFER indicates that a driver has overrun a stack-based buffer." See https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us...n/32ec682b-2f7b-4084-8f8c-672890ca7eb1?auth=1 for more info


----------



## nycgtr

EK has a new TR block out with a dramatically changed design. Will let you peeps know how it goes.

https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-str4-rgb-nickel


----------



## MNMadman

nycgtr said:


> EK has a new TR block out with a dramatically changed design. Will let you peeps know how it goes.
> 
> https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-str4-rgb-nickel


Looks impressive. The plate covers the entire IHS and the fin array covers all of the die area. Might actually be competitive.

In other words ... like it should have been in the first place.


----------



## nycgtr

MNMadman said:


> Looks impressive. The plate covers the entire IHS and the fin array covers all of the die area. Might actually be competitive.
> 
> In other words ... like it should have been in the first place.


I was sent one and it arrives next week, it will be on the bench/box first thing lol.


----------



## ht_addict

Kriant said:


> Members of this epic community, I need some help. I have been fighting this for almost a week now to no avail.
> 
> Every time I test Prime95 Blend with 75%/80%/90% ram (custom setting, which is basically blend setting but with more ram allocated) I get DRIVER OVERRAN STACK BUFFER Blue Screen Error within 1 hour.
> 
> OCCT Linpack with 90% ram just freezes.
> 
> I ran HCI memtest at two separate occasions for 24h period each time from a bootable dvd - no errors.
> 
> I ran P95 small FFT - no issues.
> 
> Realbench 8h - no issues.
> 
> Tried stock settings and ran P95 custom blend with 80% ram used - DRIVER OVERRAN STACK BUFFER.
> 
> Double checked page file size - 30gb on boot drive and 100gb on storage hdd for a cumulative 130 gb for page-file.
> 
> I have tried: upping vcore, playing with vsoc range from .9 to 1.19; upping ram voltage; playing with load line calibration; tightening timings; loosening timings considerably. Nothing works.
> 
> Am I missing something?
> 
> P.S. with the revamp of the forum idk if my system is still visible in my profile, if not I will re-post my system specs.
> 
> Just in case:
> 1950X @ 3.975ghz @ 1.395 - 1.417v under full load and around 1.33 - 1.35 under light load or idle.
> Zenith x399
> 64gb DDR4 Gskill ripjaws V F4-3200C14Q-64GVK 14-14-14-34-2T or 14-14-13-22-1T with manual timings on.
> 1600W EVGA SuperNova G2
> 256gb boot ssd two nvme drives, 512gb ssd and two hdd's 1tb each.
> 1080ti (Asus Poseidon)
> 1080ti FTW3 Hybrid
> Cooling: Phobya Nova 1080 with Noctua fans + 360 ex xcps rad.
> CPU block: XSPC Raystorm for Threadripper.
> 
> the Asus 1080ti Poseidon and 1950x are in the same loop, but 1080 rad and 360 rad seem like overkill for heat dissipation.
> 
> 
> P.S. I have posted the same post in the X399 Zenith thread, but I wholeheartedly believe that it's not due to the motherboard, so I am extending my shout for help here as well. Thank you for understanding.


Trying backing your RAM speed to under 3000mhz. 3200mgx is pushing it when you have memory slots filled.


----------



## x7007

Z-O-M-B-I-E said:


> Yes, the same problem. If return the standard multiplier (from 40 to 38), the problem goes away. Have fix?



If you go back to 38 then it doesn't slow anymore ? What about the Ryzen Timing Checker ? is that works for you ? do you know what could be the problem ?


----------



## Z-O-M-B-I-E

x7007 said:


> If you go back to 38 then it doesn't slow anymore ? What about the Ryzen Timing Checker ? is that works for you ? do you know what could be the problem ?


Yes, on 38 (default) not slow. But when I raise to 40, windows start slowly. I did not check the RTC, it's already visually noticeable.


----------



## betam4x

My surgery on Monday was a success. I am still in the hospital, but I can't wait to start digging into my new board. Glad to see it has P-State overclocking. It may have been a costly mistake, but my 1950X murdering my MSI board may have also been a blessing.

Should be back home in a few days...couldn't convince the wifey to bring the desktop up! Edit:. At least I have something to look forward to.


----------



## Tamalero

Just got Samsung B die on Corsair (finally available in amazon of my country.. and they were flying off the shelves.. 2 days ago.. 10 units available, yesterday when I bought.. 2 units available, today sold out) set at the stilt's 3600.. zero memory loops, instant boot.

The improvement is heavily noticeable.


before:










now..










I wonder if I can push a bit harder by setting the command rate to 1T.
Or maybe go CL14 at 3466.


----------



## lowdog

Tamalero said:


> Just got Samsung B die on Corsair (finally available in amazon of my country.. and they were flying off the shelves.. 2 days ago.. 10 units available, yesterday when I bought.. 2 units available, today sold out) set at the stilt's 3600.. zero memory loops, instant boot.
> 
> The improvement is heavily noticeable.
> 
> 
> before:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if I can push a bit harder by setting the command rate to 1T.
> Or maybe go CL14 at 3466.



Got a screen shot of RTC v 1.03.1, would like to see all timings and settings etc


----------



## Yamie

I just orderd my 1950x, so count me in 
Pictures of the build will follow!

With a Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7, G.Skill Trident Z RGB memory and an Enermax LiqTech TR4 360 AiO


Overclocking?
What to know, what to expect?

Please share your experience


----------



## Tamalero

lowdog said:


> Got a screen shot of RTC v 1.03.1, would like to see all timings and settings etc


Not sure what do you mean with RTC.

Anyway heres some of the basic timings.


----------



## lowdog

RTC = Ryzen Timing Checker by the Stilt;


----------



## adam3234

Yamie said:


> I just orderd my 1950x, so count me in
> Pictures of the build will follow!
> 
> With a Gigabyte Aorus X399 Gaming 7, G.Skill Trident Z RGB memory and an Enermax LiqTech TR4 360 AiO
> 
> 
> Overclocking?
> What to know, what to expect?
> 
> Please share your experience


How much memory did you order? The higher the memory density the harder it is to over clock. I'm using 128 GB (8x16 GB) and I never managed to achieve 3200 Mhz or above. I haven't tried 3066 Mhz but 2933 Mhz succeeded 4 passes of Memtest86 and Prime 95 Blend but failed on the Large FFT test. I think I could have gotten it stable with more tweaking but decided it'll take too long so I just lowered the frequency down to 2800 Mhz with tighter timings. Tbh I'm drooling over Tamalero's memory benchmarks that were posted today but since I haven't seen any reports of 128 GB Threadripper systems with RAM > 2933 Mhz stable, there's no hope for my system plus with the settings I've use for my system, my system has reached it's thermal limits. Memory that uses Samsung b-die chips work best for Threadripper see https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/62vp2g/clearing_up_any_samsung_bdie_confusion_eg_on/ to confirm what memory you have. If speed is top priority to you then use lower density b-die modules like the 8 GB ones that are listed and buy 4 to set them up in quad channel mode...or do whatever Tamalero advices because damn those benchmarks look good.


----------



## Tamalero

lowdog said:


> RTC = Ryzen Timing Checker by the Stilt;


aaah ok!

here you go!










I swear there are so many similar names of different programs its not even funny.

*edit*
Backed down to 2T as 1T was making me crash on Vermintide (my videocard stalled).
I will run tomorrow a full stability test and see how it goes, if not, I will back to the XMP settings and re test.


----------



## Bamfhammer

Tamalero, what model of Corsair ram did you buy?


----------



## adam3234

@Tamalero what voltages are you using for VSOC and DRAM?


----------



## Yamie

adam3234 said:


> How much memory did you order? The higher the memory density the harder it is to over clock. I'm using 128 GB (8x16 GB) and I never managed to achieve 3200 Mhz or above. I haven't tried 3066 Mhz but 2933 Mhz succeeded 4 passes of Memtest86 and Prime 95 Blend but failed on the Large FFT test. I think I could have gotten it stable with more tweaking but decided it'll take too long so I just lowered the frequency down to 2800 Mhz with tighter timings. Tbh I'm drooling over Tamalero's memory benchmarks that were posted today but since I haven't seen any reports of 128 GB Threadripper systems with RAM > 2933 Mhz stable, there's no hope for my system plus with the settings I've use for my system, my system has reached it's thermal limits. Memory that uses Samsung b-die chips work best for Threadripper see https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/62vp2g/clearing_up_any_samsung_bdie_confusion_eg_on/ to confirm what memory you have. If speed is top priority to you then use lower density b-die modules like the 8 GB ones that are listed and buy 4 to set them up in quad channel mode...or do whatever Tamalero advices because damn those benchmarks look good.


Up to now I ordered 4x 8GB Trident Z RGB for AMD 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35V F4-3200C14Q-32GTZRX

But I plan on buying up to 64GB later if needed


----------



## Tamalero

Bamfhammer said:


> Tamalero, what model of Corsair ram did you buy?


Corsair Domminator Platinum 32GB kit 3600CL16 as I stated before. (4x8 single side Bdie samsung ram) XMP settings are 16-18-18-18 if I remember correctly. (the reason I bought Corsair is that gskill is not available, and the only stores that have gskill.. they are 4x the normal american price, aka 1000 USD per 16Gb of ram for the 3200 CL14 kits.. which is ridiculous.

Anyway, this Corsair Platinum kit Its the one with the giant platinum heatsink and fan kit.
https://www.corsair.com/uk/en/Categ...M-3600MHz-C16-Memory-Kit/p/CMD32GX4M4B3600C16





adam3234 said:


> @Tamalero what voltages are you using for VSOC and DRAM?



The Stilt's default for 3600. aka 1.4V for each module pair.
VSOC is on AUTO, but its on 1.1V

I also had to turn GEARDOWN off and also POWER DOWN to off.
If I had any of these settings turned on, the ram would go into training mode and most likely fail.


----------



## adam3234

Yamie said:


> Up to now I ordered 4x 8GB Trident Z RGB for AMD 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35V F4-3200C14Q-32GTZRX
> 
> But I plan on buying up to 64GB later if needed


I think you'll have no problems overclocking your Threadripper memory up to 3200 Mhz (and maybe more) with that RAM kit since G.Skill specifically design the GTZRX kits Ryzen/Threadripper.


----------



## MNMadman

GTZRX is the kit I have and it does XMP timings with no issues. Currently testing what kind of improved timings and speed I can get out of it.


----------



## adam3234

MNMadman said:


> GTZRX is the kit I have and it does XMP timings with no issues. Currently testing what kind of improved timings and speed I can get out of it.


Does the GTZRX modules use pre-existing Samsung ICs (e.g. b-die) and are they just higher binned versions of GTZR for Ryzen/Threadripper or did Samsung create new ICs specifically to work for Ryzen/Threadripper memory?


----------



## MNMadman

adam3234 said:


> Does the GTZRX modules use pre-existing Samsung ICs (e.g. b-die) and are they just higher binned versions of GTZR for Ryzen/Threadripper or did Samsung create new ICs specifically to work for Ryzen/Threadripper memory?


They are B-die. They probably just have different XMP timings or something. XMP worked right out of the box and G.Skill's RGB control software detected it with no issues (which didn't happen for a different GTZR kit I had, and lots of Taichi users have issues). Might be marketing hype but they work better for me.


----------



## Tamalero

Hey guys.

I'm baffled now..

I now am pretty sure that something is wrong either with the mobo's bios, or my cpu itself.

Because of the following:

Get B die 3600 Cl16 memory. Install the modules. Put big fan blowing at the modules that are in the "outake" side of my Noctua(It throws a LOT of hot air)
Load Stilt's 3600 CL16 1.4V profile. Set memory to 3600, disable any auto OC by mobo. Leave turbo and SMT.
Load windows, runs everything perfectly, run memtest.. 2 hours of hot test (ambient temp of 35C) and 4 hours of cold test (27C ambient with AC on) while I was out in a party. Run perfect, 0 errors. Shut down computer. Take nap.
Wake up, Turn on computer.. memory training.. 3 times.. boots to window. Play games.. Game crash after 30 or 40 minutes every time (Vermintide 2) on graphics error, the videocard driver stalls.
Get suspicious.. run memtest.. windows becomes a rainbow of artifacts as the video card driver stalls nonstop and recovers. memtest finds errors after barely 5 minutes.. WHAT?
Shut down. restart, 2 memory training loops this time. get to bios.. Change to XMP settings. (same settings but lower voltage and looser timings). Get to windows.. so far so good, 1 hour of memtest no problem. Boot cinebench, etc.. no issues. 
Reboot.. 3 memory training loops. Same, Vermintide starts to crash, same graphical errors later. Memtest finds error.
Get to bios, change to 3466 Stilt's settings. Forgot to change the memory speed to 3466.. running at 3600 (idiot me). Get to windows.. see insanely good latencies.. boot memtest.. 0 errors after 2 hours?????????? shut down, forget about it as it was insanely late.
Next day, boot computer, memory training.. 3 times again.. boot into windows. memtest again just in case errors after merely 5 minutes.

Now, just did: rebooted, get to bios, change speed to 3466. Using stilt's 3466 profile (CL15 one). run memtest 1 hour.. no errors. so far so good.

So now thinking these scenarios:

SCENARIO A) The bios update from 503 to 601 started all this **** (and I'm tempted to roll back. Since for me, I almost every single time I install a new bios.. I get issues. So I have to install, then roll back to the older one, then install the new bios again. Then IT WILL BE STABLE. Had to do it with the updates 503 and 506 and also with 406. Which I'm probably going to do this week.
SCENARIO B) One of my Threadripper MCMs is extremely picky, problem is which one decides to "set" the timings of the memory. So any deviation of the settings that are stable, will cause total havok (hence why I could even boot at 3600 CL14, and do everything with no issue ,but after the first reboot with memory training.. the setting changed and everything went to ****)
SCENARIO C) The module slots are damaged or the motherboard as imperfections. As the issues with memory even happens at low speeds (2933, 3066) using very loose timings (Cl16 CL18) during certain reboots.


Current Settings :


----------



## OrionBG

adam3234 said:


> Does the GTZRX modules use pre-existing Samsung ICs (e.g. b-die) and are they just higher binned versions of GTZR for Ryzen/Threadripper or did Samsung create new ICs specifically to work for Ryzen/Threadripper memory?


The GTZR and the GTZRX are identical in hardware. The only difference I found after comparing the SPD of both is one bit of data. One more thing is set for the GTZRX while that exact bit is unused on the GTZR. Everything else is bit by bit the same.
You can easily flash the GTZRX SPD data on a GTZR module and voila you have a "Ryzen Optimized" RAM...


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> Hey guys.
> 
> I'm baffled now..


Do you by any chance use a vertically mounted GPU with a riser cable? I had similar issues with my first riser cable and replacing it fixed everything...

Just a thought,,,


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> The GTZR and the GTZRX are identical in hardware. The only difference I found after comparing the SPD of both is one bit of data. One more thing is set for the GTZRX while that exact bit is unused on the GTZR. Everything else is bit by bit the same.
> You can easily flash the GTZRX SPD data on a GTZR module and voila you have a "Ryzen Optimized" RAM...


Sometimes that's all it takes. One bit to take it from great to SUPERFRICKINAWESOME!


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Do you by any chance use a vertically mounted GPU with a riser cable? I had similar issues with my first riser cable and replacing it fixed everything...
> 
> Just a thought,,,


Nope. No riser.
Using a Thermaltake X9 (flat surface).

The only thing that could potentially affect the video card; is the new fan (which sits almost touching the videocard in an angle, throwing air towards the VRMS and second module slots.
I have my videocard in the last X16 slot of my X399 PRIME, to avoid contact with my huge Noctua U14S SP3 TR4.

I'm going to keep running my current settings and see if a reboot causes again the memory training and the memory to get offed. If that happens, I'm going to rollback to the prior Bios.. even if it means having to use the older AGESA.


----------



## Bamfhammer

Tamalero said:


> Corsair Domminator Platinum 32GB kit 3600CL16 as I stated before. (4x8 single side Bdie samsung ram) XMP settings are 16-18-18-18 if I remember correctly. (the reason I bought Corsair is that gskill is not available, and the only stores that have gskill.. they are 4x the normal american price, aka 1000 USD per 16Gb of ram for the 3200 CL14 kits.. which is ridiculous.
> 
> Anyway, this Corsair Platinum kit Its the one with the giant platinum heatsink and fan kit.
> https://www.corsair.com/uk/en/Categ...M-3600MHz-C16-Memory-Kit/p/CMD32GX4M4B3600C16
> 
> 
> 
> I see the model number in the link: CMD32GX4M4B3600C16
> 
> And I have seen these broken down before. Other than the super tight timings, can you tell if it is B-die by the B that comes right after the 4M4 B 3600C16... ? Does anybody know?


----------



## x7007

Did anyone enable the Core Isolation in Windows 10 Spring ?

For me it crashes after couple of restart making BSOD . but I want to know if it's stability issue or just something with this setting.

Because it seems to already hardware support it.

https://ebrary.net/24869/computer_science/secure_technology

The AMD Secure Processor™ (formerly known as the Platform Security Processor [PSP]) is a dedicated hardware security subsystem that runs independently from the platform's main core processors and is integrated into the SoC. It provides an isolated environment in which security-sensitive components can run without being affected by the software running as the main system workload. The PSP can execute system workloads as well as workloads provided by trusted third parties. Although system workloads are preinstalled and provide SoC-specific security services, the system administrator has complete control over whether and which third-party workloads are installed on the PSP. The PSP is made up of the following components:


----------



## Tamalero

Bamfhammer said:


> I see the model number in the link: CMD32GX4M4B3600C16
> 
> And I have seen these broken down before. Other than the super tight timings, can you tell if it is B-die by the B that comes right after the 4M4 B 3600C16... ? Does anybody know?


I'm going to be honest. I have no idea what do you mean with the "can you tell if its b-die by the B that comes right after.."


The B list list in the german forum that has all the bdie modules analyzed.. says yes, this is B Die.


----------



## Kriant

ht_addict said:


> Trying backing your RAM speed to under 3000mhz. 3200mgx is pushing it when you have memory slots filled.


I ended up doing a 100% clean install (of Windows 10) twice. It's driver related, but I am having a hard time isolating what driver it is and it seems to be a combination of latest windows update and a specific driver, but driver verifier doesn't seem to help. Right now I am running clean windows with older chipset drivers and no GPU drivers and every stress test (xcept for realbench...because I haven't installed drivers) runs like butter).


----------



## Bamfhammer

Tamalero said:


> The B list list in the german forum that has all the bdie modules analyzed.. says yes, this is B Die.


I finally located this massive list. Very helpful!

The B i was referring to was just the RAM revision in this case.


----------



## Tamalero

Bamfhammer said:


> I finally located this massive list. Very helpful!
> 
> The B i was referring to was just the RAM revision in this case.


3600CL16 is B die regardless of revision.. (like the cases of 3200 CL14 and 3466 CL15, as Hynix only has higher timings ones, like CL15, CL16 and CL18.) others definitively have different chips based on revision. Anyway.. there is no "ver" in these modules like they do in the binder of my 3000CL15 ones..


----------



## e7balt

x7007 said:


> Did anyone enable the Core Isolation in Windows 10 Spring ?
> 
> For me it crashes after couple of restart making BSOD . but I want to know if it's stability issue or just something with this setting.
> 
> Because it seems to already hardware support it.
> 
> https://ebrary.net/24869/computer_science/secure_technology
> 
> The AMD Secure Processor™ (formerly known as the Platform Security Processor [PSP]) is a dedicated hardware security subsystem that runs independently from the platform's main core processors and is integrated into the SoC. It provides an isolated environment in which security-sensitive components can run without being affected by the software running as the main system workload. The PSP can execute system workloads as well as workloads provided by trusted third parties. Although system workloads are preinstalled and provide SoC-specific security services, the system administrator has complete control over whether and which third-party workloads are installed on the PSP. The PSP is made up of the following components:


Yeah, I tried enabling the "Memory integrity" option under Core isolation. I did not have any stability issues with it turned on. But it did seem to adversely affect performance. With "Memory integrity" turned on my CineBench R15 score seemed to average 30 to 50 points less. I'd have to spend more time running benchmarks to really confirm the difference. For now I went ahead and turned the "memory integrity" option back off (I had to turn it off via the registry, the GUI would not allow me to disable it). Maybe later I'll revisit this.

Specifically the registry key setting to turn it back off:
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\DeviceGuard\Scenarios\HypervisorEnforcedCodeIntegrity]
"Enabled"=dword:00000000

As a side note, I have the AMD hardware virtualization extensions enabled in the BIOS, the fTPM turned on. Also running Windows in UEFI with secure boot.

I'm glad Microsoft decided to extend at least some of the Virtualization Based Security features to users running Windows 10 Pro (before the feature was only available in Enterprise Edition). Definitely very cool capabilities from a security perspective.

One other thing I was able to confirm that now works in Windows 10 Pro is "Windows Defender Application Guard" (https://techcommunity.microsoft.com...-Application-Guard-Standalone-mode/td-p/66903) for the Edge browser. Basically it can create a separate hardened instance of the Microsoft Edge browser running in a separate virtual instance that is separate from your main OS but runs in a window. Windows Group Policy can be set by the administrator in order to force non-trusted sites to run in the Windows Defender Application guard instance. This limits the risk to the main OS if the user gets hit with malware while browsing. In theory the malware would not be able to spread to the "main OS" instance because of the use of the virtualization based security features (or at least it would be a lot more difficult for it to do so). For example, a company's intranet sites or other trusted internet sites could be allowed to run in the normal instance of Edge while everything else would be forced to run in the isolated Windows Defender Application guard instance of Edge.


----------



## x7007

I don't understand why my Enermax 360mm can't cool 4.0 @ 1.360-380 anymore . I am reaching beyond 86c and it throttling to 550mhz .
The pump works full 3000 rpm .


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> I don't understand why my Enermax 360mm can't cool 4.0 @ 1.360-380 anymore . I am reaching beyond 86c and it throttling to 550mhz .
> The pump works full 3000 rpm .


Maybe the pump failed?
Or perhaps your motherboard is affected by the fan control problem? (aka pumps and fans stops spinning) ?


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> I don't understand why my Enermax 360mm can't cool 4.0 @ 1.360-380 anymore . I am reaching beyond 86c and it throttling to 550mhz .
> The pump works full 3000 rpm .


What about ambient temperature? If it is getting hotter where you live, your CPU temps will be affected also.


----------



## Yamie

x7007 said:


> I don't understand why my Enermax 360mm can't cool 4.0 @ 1.360-380 anymore . I am reaching beyond 86c and it throttling to 550mhz .
> The pump works full 3000 rpm .


What thermal compound are you using?

I experienced this once after I switched to liquid metal, because it wasn't enough


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> Maybe the pump failed?
> Or perhaps your motherboard is affected by the fan control problem? (aka pumps and fans stops spinning) ?


The pump shows 3000 rpm so it's working but not cooling like before. if to take it to compare I have noctua D14 TR4 which cool almost the same so it's something with the pump because I also replaced fans to the EK 120mm EVO 3000 rpm and I let them even run FULL RPM and the temp is exactly the same



OrionBG said:


> What about ambient temperature? If it is getting hotter where you live, your CPU temps will be affected also.


it's between 24-27c sometimes it was 36c but still , going from 67c-73c with prime95+AVX stress test @ 4.0 @ 1.360 that's something else to more than 86c because it thorrlling at that speed so it doesn't matter 



Yamie said:


> What thermal compound are you using?
> 
> I experienced this once after I switched to liquid metal, because it wasn't enough


I tried the enermax that comes with it, I tried the noctua thermal paste , I also tried the Gelid Solutions GC-Extreme Thermal Compound TC-GC-03-A . didn't change much

I think the pump once again failed for the 2nd time... I don't trust this enermax anymore.


----------



## ozlay

I was wondering what clocks people getting on air? Looks like most people are running water.


----------



## x7007

ozlay said:


> I was wondering what clocks people getting on air? Looks like most people are running water.



With the noctua I can do 3.8 @ 1.340 at 80c with Aida CPU FPU stress test for more than 40 min.

Again I'm sad because the last time amazon helped , but now amazon won't help and I need to talk with enremax support which only have warranty for U.S.A and canada which I can't use because I live in Israel . the cost of sending them the broken one and getting the new one will cost me like new one !
because I know, I already sent a broken one to Amazon once


----------



## Tamalero

ozlay said:


> I was wondering what clocks people getting on air? Looks like most people are running water.


3.95Ghz @ 1.237V (used to be 1.20V with Bios 503)USED to be stable in PRIME, cinebench loop and OCCT torture test. Havent tested with my new mems fully (only ran memtest)
Average temps used to be 68C-72C with the big noctua with the additional fan installed.

Hopefully this weekend will have time and re-test for stability with my new memories.


----------



## Yamie

x7007 said:


> With the noctua I can do 3.8 @ 1.340 at 80c with Aida CPU FPU stress test for more than 40 min.
> 
> Again I'm sad because the last time amazon helped , but now amazon won't help and I need to talk with enremax support which only have warranty for U.S.A and canada which I can't use because I live in Israel . the cost of sending them the broken one and getting the new one will cost me like new one !
> because I know, I already sent a broken one to Amazon once


I have no experience with enermax yet but I ordered an Enermax LiqTech TR4 360 from caseking : /

What are the temps of your radiator?


My first choice was a Corsair Cooling Hydro Series H150i PRO but it's neither available nor compatible : (
If this enermax fails will try to make the H150i compatible


----------



## Ithanul

ozlay said:


> I was wondering what clocks people getting on air? Looks like most people are running water.


I have mine on air, but Mint being a b and not playing ball with the sensor software atm. Otherwise, I could report my temps while pushing the 1900X full out on 24/7 BOINC crunching.

Woops, update, seems the kernel update fixed that issue. Mine reporting around 68C with PSensor under Mint Mate. No OC set yet though.


----------



## adam3234

ozlay said:


> I was wondering what clocks people getting on air? Looks like most people are running water.


My 1950x is being cooled using a Noctua nh-u14s tr4-sp3 with 2 fans. CPU is running at 3950 Mhz, RAM at 2800 Mhz. Stress testing with Prime 95 (version 29.3) Small FFT for 24 hours pushes the CPU to 88 C with ambient tempt of 24 C. At 88 C sometimes some of the cores would drop down to 550 Mhz which means that pass 88 C the CPU thermal throttles and I needed to take off the computer case's front panel and put a fan in front of the computer to drop them temperature down by 6 C for me to continue doing the Prime 95 stability tests. VCORE is set to 1.375 volts (using auto LLC) but drops to 1.313 volts under Prime 95 stability testing. SOC set to 1.1 volts and DRAM 1.35 volts.


----------



## Yamie

adam3234 said:


> My 1950x is being cooled using a Noctua nh-u14s tr4-sp3 with 2 fans. CPU is running at 3950 Mhz, RAM at 2800 Mhz. Stress testing with Prime 95 (version 29.3) Small FFT for 24 hours pushes the CPU to 88 C with ambient tempt of 24 C. At 88 C sometimes some of the cores would drop down to 550 Mhz which means that pass 88 C the CPU thermal throttles and I needed to take off the computer case's front panel and put a fan in front of the computer to drop them temperature down by 6 C for me to continue doing the Prime 95 stability tests. VCORE is set to 1.375 volts (using auto LLC) but drops to 1.313 volts under Prime 95 stability testing. SOC set to 1.1 volts and DRAM 1.35 volts.


88°C with or without the 27°C offset?


----------



## OrionBG

x7007 said:


> ...
> 
> it's between 24-27c sometimes it was 36c but still , going from 67c-73c with prime95+AVX stress test @ 4.0 @ 1.360 that's something else to more than 86c because it thorrlling at that speed so it doesn't matter
> ...


67C - 73C with a 360 AIO at 4GHz and that voltage, and 27C ambient while running Prime95 with AVX is just impossible! You were not getting correct temps before or something else was a miss... My system at 4GHz with 1.35xxV, 22C ambient and a custom Loop with a 360 and a 240 rads, 9fans at max RPM is getting 8xC after a while under Prime95.
It is just not possible for an AIO to give you such temps. 86C is a more realistic temp with your setup and your ambient temps.


----------



## adam3234

Yamie said:


> 88°C with or without the 27°C offset?


I was using HWMonitor and the temperature display from the Zenith Extreme to monitor the CPU temperature and from my memory (someone correct me if I'm wrong) HWMonitor and Zenith Extreme display has the same value as the tdie reading on HWiFO so I think 88 C is the temp without the 27 C offset.


----------



## Tamalero

adam3234 said:


> I was using HWMonitor and the temperature display from the Zenith Extreme to monitor the CPU temperature and from my memory (someone correct me if I'm wrong) HWMonitor and Zenith Extreme display has the same value as the tdie reading on HWiFO so I think 88 C is the temp without the 27 C offset.


Hwinfo for me always displays the Tdie with the offset reduced. (for the real temp).
the tjunc is the one with the offset.

As for overclocks and voltages.. Despite my troubles it seems I really got a golden chip compared to you guys.. 1.38V to just reach 3.95Ghz?


----------



## adam3234

Tamalero said:


> Hwinfo for me always displays the Tdie with the offset reduced. (for the real temp).
> the tjunc is the one with the offset.
> 
> As for overclocks and voltages.. Despite my troubles it seems I really got a golden chip compared to you guys.. 1.38V to just reach 3.95Ghz?


Your chip was initially able to do 3.95 Ghz @ 1.2 volts stable but later required 1.237 volts when you updated your bios. I think the reason for this might be because the LLC graph changed from one bios to the other at the LLC that you've set for your chip. My chip is also able to do 3.95 Ghz at 1.2 Volts VCore but there's no way that's stable under Prime 95 Small FFT because I know that it'll take about 1.313 volts for my chip to pass Prime 95 version 29.3 Small FFT. I probably can get my chip Prime 95 stable from 1.2V VCORE using a LLC that'll ensure the chip gets 1.313 VOCRE under extreme loads but that's very time consuming so for now I've been taking the easy route and just set LLC to auto and increase VCORE to find a stable OC. Also, stability is a subjective term in this overclocking community, different people consider their rigs stable after passing different tests with different duration. In my case, I'll only consider a system stable if it passes 4 passes of Memtest86 and 24 hours each of Prime 95(with AVX) Blend, Large FFT and Small FFT.


----------



## Yamie

adam3234 said:


> In my case, I'll only consider a system stable if it passes 4 passes of Memtest86 and 24 hours each of Prime 95(with AVX) Blend, Large FFT and Small FFT.


Sounds stable to me 
I only do ~ 8 hours prime, but I start with ~ 24 hours OCCT

I haven't started with the 1950x yet but I am free for the next week building the system and ocing  can't wait for it


----------



## gnome_mo

I'm happy to report that after chipset update my hynix RAM runs happily @3200. No freezes anymore 
About temps, what is max recommended temp (as measured with hwmonitor)?


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> I'm happy to report that after chipset update my hynix RAM runs happily @3200. No freezes anymore
> About temps, what is max recommended temp (as measured with hwmonitor)?


On AMD's site it says 68 C https://www.amd.com/en/products/cpu/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1950x but trying to figure out whether this is 68 C tdie or 68 C tctrl (i.e. includes 27 C offset) online is confusing but what I found out was that Threadripper will thermal throttle when temperatures passes 88 C (as measured with hwmonitor) that means you should aim to get your threadripper cores below 88 C. I've never seen my Theadripper thermal shut down before and I hope I never do but I imagine whatever that is would be the absolute max temp.


----------



## gnome_mo

I'm not overclocking but I do leave it rendering for days, wondering if my Noctua 14s is enough. It runs about 86-88 as far as I can remember (when under load)


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> I'm not overclocking but I do leave it rendering for days, wondering if my Noctua 14s is enough. It runs about 86-88 as far as I can remember (when under load)


What is the ambient temperature? That kind of workload looks like Prime 95 (with avx) done with 24 C ambient tempt with an overclocked threadripper i.e. it looks very much like the temps I get when I'm stability testing my overclocking...but you're not overclocking. Also, I'm using the same cooler as you (with 2 fans). I hope someone here can replicate your workload to see what temps they get because those temps don't look right to me. I actually recommend that people try to run their threadripper 68 C or below because that's want AMD says is max but I've done several weeks of stability testing with many tests that are done back to back leaving my 1950x on for 92+ hours for many times ( temperatures maxing out at 94 C tdie ) and I haven't seen any sign of CPU degradation although it may still happen later (hopefully not, I want my 1950x to last for at least 5 years). During the last set of stability tests I did, the temps reached 88 C (that's how I found out when threadripper actually thermal throttles) and I had to take off the front panel and put a fan in front of the computer to cool it down by 6 C. I also got a fan to blow onto the VRMs as well. You can try the stuff I did to cool down the CPU and I also recommend you add another fan to your cooler if it doesn't have 2 already....probably a good idea would be to contact AMD and asked them whether those temperature are safe and whether it is normal for your workload to reach those temps without overclocking.


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> What is the ambient temperature? That kind of workload looks like Prime 95 (with avx) done with 24 C ambient tempt with an overclocked threadripper i.e. it looks very much like the temps I get when I'm stability testing my overclocking...but you're not overclocking. Also, I'm using the same cooler as you (with 2 fans). I hope someone here can replicate your workload to see what temps they get because those temps don't look right to me. I actually recommend that people try to run their threadripper 68 C or below because that's want AMD says is max but I've done several weeks of stability testing with many tests that are done back to back leaving my 1950x on for 92+ hours for many times ( temperatures maxing out at 94 C tdie ) and I haven't seen any sign of CPU degradation although it may still happen later (hopefully not, I want my 1950x to last for at least 5 years). During the last set of stability tests I did, the temps reached 88 C (that's how I found out when threadripper actually thermal throttles) and I had to take off the front panel and put a fan in front of the computer to cool it down by 6 C. I also got a fan to blow onto the VRMs as well. You can try the stuff I did to cool down the CPU and I also recommend you add another fan to your cooler if it doesn't have 2 already....probably a good idea would be to contact AMD and asked them whether those temperature are safe and whether it is normal for your workload to reach those temps without overclocking.


I think I was wrong. Speccy shows some wild temperatures but both HW and Ryzen Master show peak at 69 (ambient is 21°C). When idle, both vary between 49-53 so I guess this is with temp offset. 
My case has 2x 12cm fans and noctua has one. 

But I will test some more.


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> I think I was wrong. Speccy shows some wild temperatures but both HW and Ryzen Master show peak at 69 (ambient is 21°C). When idle, both vary between 49-53 so I guess this is with temp offset.
> My case has 2x 12cm fans and noctua has one.
> 
> But I will test some more.


Peak of 69 C sound reasonable for rendering although idle temperature is strange. With my 1950x OCed to 3.95 Ghz (VCORE=1.375, LCC=auto) the idle temperature is about 32 C with ambient temp of 24 C. Was the idle temperature measured with Ryzen Master and HWMonitor? Doesn't Ryzen Master show the same value as HWMonitor (but Ryzen master has decimal places so is more precise)? Tonight I've confirmed that the HWMonitor temp is same as the HWiNFO Tdie temp.


----------



## gnome_mo

Yes, both Idle and rendering temps are measured with ryzen master and HWmonitor, and they both show same temps. I guessed that it shows 49 WITH offset (49-28 is 21)


----------



## OrionBG

gnome_mo said:


> Yes, both Idle and rendering temps are measured with ryzen master and HWmonitor, and they both show same temps. I guessed that it shows 49 WITH offset (49-28 is 21)


-27C actually. The offset is 27C


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> Yes, both Idle and rendering temps are measured with ryzen master and HWmonitor, and they both show same temps. I guessed that it shows 49 WITH offset (49-28 is 21)


hmm...I remember that Ryzen Master and HWMonitor shows temperatures without the 27 C offset. I'm in bed right now so I won't be turning on my Threadripper to test it out right now, I'll do it tomorrow, until then can someone else please test it?


----------



## Bamfhammer

x7007 said:


> I don't understand why my Enermax 360mm can't cool 4.0 @ 1.360-380 anymore . I am reaching beyond 86c and it throttling to 550mhz .
> The pump works full 3000 rpm .


I had a very very similar problem with a completely different AIO on a different setup. 

Pump was reporting as spinning, and due to the temperature sensor, the fans and pump were at maximum speed, but still the temps got really high.

Turns out the liquid in the AIO leaked out. Hopefully this did not happen to you, but I would look for a leak. Chances are by this time, it has evaporated, but many AIO's leave a residue you can spot on components.


----------



## adam3234

I've confirmed with HWiNFO that Ryzen Master and HWMonitor shows temperatures without the 27 C offset. Here's some tests that I've done with room temp of 21 C.

Turning on my Threadripper and leaving it on for 5 minutes, the idle temp settled at 30 C but went up to 39 C. Makes me wonder what Windows is doing in the background. These initial readings are done using the Zenith Extreme's temperature display.

Opening HWiNFO doesn't increase the temp. At the time of writing this, 

CPU Node #0:
- Tctrl: 57.5 C
- Tdie: 30.5 C

CPU Node #1:
- Tctrl: 57 C
- Tdie: 30 C

Closing HWiNFO and opening Ryzen Master causes temperatures to jumps to 46 C. Temperature now settled at 38 C (read from Zenith Extreme's temp dislay). On Ryzen Master it read 38.38.

Closing Ryzen Master the temperature drops down to 30 C.

Opening HWMonitor causes temp to spike briefly up to 40 C but remained stable at 31 C for rest of the test.

Closed HWMonitor and waited for a minute and the temperature (read from Zenith Extreme) remained at 31 C.

The conlcusion to this would be don't use Ryzen master for temperature monitoring.


----------



## OrionBG

adam3234 said:


> I've confirmed with HWiNFO that Ryzen Master and HWMonitor shows temperatures without the 27 C offset. Here's some tests that I've done with room temp of 21 C.
> 
> Turning on my Threadripper and leaving it on for 5 minutes, the idle temp settled at 30 C but went up to 39 C. Makes me wonder what Windows is doing in the background. These initial readings are done using the Zenith Extreme's temperature display.
> 
> Opening HWiNFO doesn't increase the temp. At the time of writing this,
> 
> CPU Node #0:
> - Tctrl: 57.5 C
> - Tdie: 30.5 C
> 
> CPU Node #1:
> - Tctrl: 57 C
> - Tdie: 30 C
> 
> Closing HWiNFO and opening Ryzen Master causes temperatures to jumps to 46 C. Temperature now settled at 38 C (read from Zenith Extreme's temp dislay). On Ryzen Master it read 38.38.
> 
> Closing Ryzen Master the temperature drops down to 30 C.
> 
> Opening HWMonitor causes temp to spike briefly up to 40 C but remained stable at 31 C for rest of the test.
> 
> Closed HWMonitor and waited for a minute and the temperature (read from Zenith Extreme) remained at 31 C.
> 
> The conlcusion to this would be don't use Ryzen master for temperature monitoring.


The main conclusion is "do no use Ryzen Master AT ALL" This is the most useless app in the universe! ... Actually, correction, the third most useless! G.Skill's Trident Z RGB software holds the crown followed by AsRock's A-Tuning software...


----------



## adam3234

OrionBG said:


> The main conclusion is "do no use Ryzen Master AT ALL" This is the most useless app in the universe! ... Actually, correction, the third most useless! G.Skill's Trident Z RGB software holds the crown followed by AsRock's A-Tuning software...


I agree, I've only ever used Ryzen Master to compare temperatures readings with other tools, I haven't used it for overclocking yet nor do I ever intend to.


----------



## mmonnin

Bamfhammer said:


> I had a very very similar problem with a completely different AIO on a different setup.
> 
> Pump was reporting as spinning, and due to the temperature sensor, the fans and pump were at maximum speed, but still the temps got really high.
> 
> Turns out the liquid in the AIO leaked out. Hopefully this did not happen to you, but I would look for a leak. Chances are by this time, it has evaporated, but many AIO's leave a residue you can spot on components.


I believe that was the point of the offset. So fan control systems would see a higher temp and run fans at a higher speed to keep all these cores cooler.


----------



## adam3234

@Tamalero I checked the notes that I took from my previous set of stability tests and it turns out that I remembered the VCORE under Prime 95 Small FFT wrong. I've been saying it was 1.313 volts but it was actually 1.373 volts. It turns out that LLC doesn't get me very far from 1.2 volt VCORE on the Zenith Extreme. When I used Level 8 (highest LLC setting on Zenith Extreme) it raised the VCORE by 0.04 volts when I tried testing it with Intel Burn test.


----------



## stefxyz

OrionBG said:


> Nope. Single one. I'm beginning to think my PSU may be the issue but I'll test this soon when I rebuild my PC.
> 
> UPDATE:
> 
> I run one command that shows the GPU Power draw and run FurMark for several seconds...
> 
> 9.57 W
> 10.16 W
> 9.67 W
> 9.77 W
> 9.57 W
> 11.04 W
> 10.06 W
> 10.45 W
> 11.14 W
> 564.81 W
> 585.20 W
> 580.99 W
> 575.30 W
> 582.58 W
> 579.05 W
> 587.68 W
> 578.63 W
> 581.84 W
> 582.36 W
> 586.29 W
> 591.47 W
> 584.89 W
> 587.74 W
> 576.09 W
> 579.73 W
> 579.13 W
> 590.50 W
> 589.19 W
> 592.28 W
> 529.52 W
> 90.42 W
> 13.68 W
> 11.14 W
> 10.94 W
> 10.65 W
> 10.16 W
> 9.77 W
> 11.43 W
> 10.25 W
> 10.06 W
> 9.96 W
> 
> I think you can guess where the test starts and where it ends...
> So if the card can suck up to 600W of power and the overclocked Threadripper 1950x can do above 300W OCed and under load I might be tripping some overload protection on my PSU (current one is 1000W but not some well-known brand) I'll redo my testing with the Corsair HX1000i soon...
> 
> So guys, just to recap, if somebody tells you that 1000W PSU will be enough for even two 1080ti cards, just lough!  If stock, maybe but we all know the name of this forum and why we are here



Impossible Pascal will consume this much power. The card is heavily power restricted. I doubt you could get that much wattage out of it even with Shunt Mod before it crashes waaay before.


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> ...G.Skill's Trident Z RGB software holds the crown...


Maybe that's the difference between GTZR and GTZRX RAM ... the G.Skill software works perfectly with my GTZRX and Taichi board.


----------



## OrionBG

stefxyz said:


> Impossible Pascal will consume this much power. The card is heavily power restricted. I doubt you could get that much wattage out of it even with Shunt Mod before it crashes waaay before.


My card has no restrictions! 
I've flashed the XOC BIOS and there are no limits of any kind. The shunts are ignored completely!


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Maybe that's the difference between GTZR and GTZRX RAM ... the G.Skill software works perfectly with my GTZRX and Taichi board.


It also works on mine but this is not stopping it from being a ****ty software! more than 6 months already and no new version to fix the Rainbow bug! And they know about it and have acknowledged the issue months ago.
Also, user friendliness of the app is "-"infinity...


----------



## Tamalero

adam3234 said:


> @Tamalero I checked the notes that I took from my previous set of stability tests and it turns out that I remembered the VCORE under Prime 95 Small FFT wrong. I've been saying it was 1.313 volts but it was actually 1.373 volts. It turns out that LLC doesn't get me very far from 1.2 volt VCORE on the Zenith Extreme. When I used Level 8 (highest LLC setting on Zenith Extreme) it raised the VCORE by 0.04 volts when I tried testing it with Intel Burn test.


I see..

Still, how do you see when the LLC is giving more voltage?
I have been checking HWinfo and it doesnt show any difference from what I put on despite the load.

Vcore stays at max of 1.24375V for example.. and Vpackage is the only one that has a tiny bit of extra voltage (at 1.25V )

I've reviewed before.. and I didn't even used LLC settings other than auto prior to 407. I started to use Power level 3 (as recommended) on 503 and onwards.

Note that I also had severe instability, settings not saving, strange phenomena, etc.. every time I moved to a new bios. from 403 to 407 then to 503. My solution was to flashback then to flash the new bios (3 flashings, example 407 to 503, 503 to 407, 407 to 503.. stability archieved) before working good on my ASUS X399 PRIME.


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> It also works on mine but this is not stopping it from being a ****ty software! more than 6 months already and no new version to fix the Rainbow bug! And they know about it and have acknowledged the issue months ago.
> Also, user friendliness of the app is "-"infinity...


Okay. Wasn't aware of any bugs, other than not working for some people with X399 Taichi boards.

I have used several software packages for controlling RGB (Aura, CUE, Logitech) and I don't consider the G.Skill any more difficult than them. But then again I just do a fixed color -- maybe it's harder with patterns or something.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Okay. Wasn't aware of any bugs, other than not working for some people with X399 Taichi boards.
> 
> I have used several software packages for controlling RGB (Aura, CUE, Logitech) and I don't consider the G.Skill any more difficult than them. But then again I just do a fixed color -- maybe it's harder with patterns or something.


Initially my sticks didn't work... G.Skill sent me firmware updates for all of my 4 sticks (every stick has its own file) and after that o miracle!! TridentZ RGB RAM found 

Most probably the GTZRX RAM sticks already have that new firmware as they went on the market a lot later than the GTZR.


----------



## adam3234

Tamalero said:


> I see..
> 
> Still, how do you see when the LLC is giving more voltage?
> I have been checking HWinfo and it doesnt show any difference from what I put on despite the load.
> 
> Vcore stays at max of 1.24375V for example.. and Vpackage is the only one that has a tiny bit of extra voltage (at 1.25V )
> 
> I've reviewed before.. and I didn't even used LLC settings other than auto prior to 407. I started to use Power level 3 (as recommended) on 503 and onwards.
> 
> Note that I also had severe instability, settings not saving, strange phenomena, etc.. every time I moved to a new bios. from 403 to 407 then to 503. My solution was to flashback then to flash the new bios (3 flashings, example 407 to 503, 503 to 407, 407 to 503.. stability archieved) before working good on my ASUS X399 PRIME.


I was using HWMonitor when I was doing the testing. I can see the LCC giving more voltage from the HWMonitor vcore reading. 

LLC varies from motherboard to motherboard and I guess it's really the vcore reading that's important. If your chip can handle Prime 95 AVX Small FFT using 1.2 volts or 1.24375 volts vcore then I think you've definitely won the silicon lottery.

Hmm...maybe your overclocking is causing the strange phenomena. Have you tried flashing the bios when your CPU is using default settings e.g. CPU=3400 Mhz, RAM=2133 Mhz CL15? If you can't flash the new bios properly with default settings than I think there's something wrong with your motherboard.


----------



## Tamalero

adam3234 said:


> I was using HWMonitor when I was doing the testing. I can see the LCC giving more voltage from the HWMonitor vcore reading.
> 
> LLC varies from motherboard to motherboard and I guess it's really the vcore reading that's important. If your chip can handle Prime 95 AVX Small FFT using 1.2 volts or 1.24375 volts vcore then I think you've definitely won the silicon lottery.
> 
> Hmm...maybe your overclocking is causing the strange phenomena. Have you tried flashing the bios when your CPU is using default settings e.g. CPU=3400 Mhz, RAM=2133 Mhz CL15? If you can't flash the new bios properly with default settings than I think there's something wrong with your motherboard.


I'm probably going to try that(bios reset first, before flashing) or using my technique again (Ie, flashing back then flashing forward). Because I had exactly this kind of instability when I upgraded to 503 before settling finally.

Also, it is a very well known phenomena on ASUS boards and some Gigabyte if I remember correctly. Even if youd cross the clean bios jumper for 10 20 30 seconds.... some settings still somehow reappear. Like it is not discharging correctly. Some even mentioning having to remove the battery for up to a minute.


As for stability, yeah.. I could go up to 4.1Ghz with 1.35V with Ram at 3066 with loose timings (CL16/18) on PRIME and on OCCTP BIG with no pauses. or 3.925Ghz at 1.22V hard as a rock.


----------



## OrionBG

Hey guys,

So... my re-build is complete... 

Bad news... The EK AsRock X399 Monoblock seems even worse than expected...
With my old build with an XSPC Raystorm Neo CPU Block, I was getting to 78C at most in Prime95 and it was getting there after at least 20 minutes. 1x 360 Radiator + 1x 240 Rad. Now with 3x 360 rads and the monoblock... 87C and throttling cores no more than 1 minute after prime starts... Same room temp same BIOS settings, same CPU, same MB.

BTW this is my build log if somebody's interested: Link


----------



## ssateneth

the EK blocks for TR are garbage. All of them. Except for maybe the new one that isn't released yet (completely re-engineered cold plate with 2 separate jet paths due to MCM nature of TR).


----------



## OrionBG

ssateneth said:


> the EK blocks for TR are garbage. All of them. Except for maybe the new one that isn't released yet (completely re-engineered cold plate with 2 separate jet paths due to MCM nature of TR).


The Supremacy Evo was a complete fail, yes, but I at least thought that the supposedly redesigned monoblocks will be a little better... After all they delayed them for so long (after the first ASUS monoblock failed miserably) that they should have made them properly!
And it is so much worse...


----------



## RoBiK

OrionBG said:


> but I at least thought that the supposedly redesigned monoblocks will be a little better


well they are little better, emphasis on little. In my case it was about 1 to 2 degrees. Still pretty horrible.


----------



## Tamalero

Just updating guys.. the Bdie saga is going well, NOT A SINGLE MEMORY TRAINING ERROR in a full week.

Nothing on cold boot, hot reboot, etc.. all good. No crashes in games or apps. I still need to do full blown stability test (when I have time.. christ so much work to do atm)



ssateneth said:


> the EK blocks for TR are garbage. All of them. Except for maybe the new one that isn't released yet (completely re-engineered cold plate with 2 separate jet paths due to MCM nature of TR).



Wow, looks like awful performance.

Does this block have less performance than some AIOs too?


----------



## Yamie

I am done building my TR system, pictures and story will follow

RAM works, RAM OC starts later

CPU OC starts now


What temps am I aiming for?

Start with 20 min OCCT and after this I used prime95 (custom 96/96 FFT 15)

CPU temp looks fine? ~80°C
But VRM looks hot? ~100°C


edit: vcore is set to 1.35V with Turbo LLC what peaks up to 1.47V


----------



## adam3234

Yamie said:


> I am done building my TR system, pictures and story will follow
> 
> RAM works, RAM OC starts later
> 
> CPU OC starts now
> 
> 
> What temps am I aiming for?
> 
> Start with 20 min OCCT and after this I used prime95 (custom 96/96 FFT 15)
> 
> CPU temp looks fine? ~80°C
> But VRM looks hot? ~100°C
> 
> 
> edit: vcore is set to 1.35V with Turbo LLC what peaks up to 1.47V


For extreme stress testing I suggest you aim for temps below thermal throttling point. I noticed thermal throttling at 88 C tdie but I'm comfortable (so far) with running my 1950x at 84-85 C tdie for 92+ consecutive hours for stress testing. 

Try getting more airflow over the VRMs. That's pretty hot. 

That is a dangerous LLC. In response to an AMD statement. Kitguru suggested 1.35-1.45 volts vcore depending on the cooler.

What CPU speed are you aiming for?

Edit: I remember Gamers Nexus Steve saying VRM thermal trottles at 105 C but the MOSFETs can acttually take 150 C although at 105 C the life span quickly shortens. Don't quote me on that, I don't actually remember it very well and forgot which video it was. The VRM temperature on my CPU gets to 69 C with 21 C ambient temperature when doing Prime 95 version 29.3 Small FFT testing and CPU=3950 Mhz, RAM=2800 Mhz, VCORE=1.375(LLC auto) SOC=1.1, DRAM=1.35.


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> So... my re-build is complete...
> 
> Bad news... The EK AsRock X399 Monoblock seems even worse than expected...
> With my old build with an XSPC Raystorm Neo CPU Block, I was getting to 78C at most in Prime95 and it was getting there after at least 20 minutes. 1x 360 Radiator + 1x 240 Rad. Now with 3x 360 rads and the monoblock... 87C and throttling cores no more than 1 minute after prime starts... Same room temp same BIOS settings, same CPU, same MB.


What speed and volts are you using? Mine will only throttle with excessive voltage (1.424v+) and only after more than an hour of Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFTs. And it took a deliberate attempt to throttle it.

If you're is getting to throttle point that soon, there is a mounting issue.


----------



## MNMadman

Double post.


----------



## Yamie

adam3234 said:


> For extreme stress testing I suggest you aim for temps below thermal throttling point. I noticed thermal throttling at 88 C tdie but I'm comfortable (so far) with running my 1950x at 84-85 C tdie for 92+ consecutive hours for stress testing.
> 
> Try getting more airflow over the VRMs. That's pretty hot.
> 
> That is a dangerous LLC. In response to an AMD statement. Kitguru suggested 1.35-1.45 volts vcore depending on the cooler.
> 
> What CPU speed are you aiming for?
> 
> Edit: I remember Gamers Nexus Steve saying VRM thermal trottles at 105 C but the MOSFETs can acttually take 150 C although at 105 C the life span quickly shortens. Don't quote me on that, I don't actually remember it very well and forgot which video it was. The VRM temperature on my CPU gets to 69 C with 21 C ambient temperature when doing Prime 95 version 29.3 Small FFT testing and CPU=3950 Mhz, RAM=2800 Mhz, VCORE=1.375(LLC auto) SOC=1.1, DRAM=1.35.



I saw thermal throttle at > 103°C on VRM
But not from the cpu now
I need a lower LLC ^^

I build in a 40mm fan for vrm cooling but it's not enough, and for testing I placed 2x 80mm fans ontop and it did nothing : /

Maybe an AiO won't work with this vrm and I need a custom loop with monoblock, but I need to move the pc from time to time
Or I rebuild the vrm coolers

But first lower LLC 


I aim for the best possible below the maximal 24/7 stable temp


----------



## Yamie

I think I am done with the ram now, works fine with 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35V and I think I won't OC
Passed a night of memtest

CPU is something else

With standard settings @3.4Ghz temps are 62°C CPU and 72°C VRM


----------



## adam3234

Yamie said:


> I think I am done with the ram now, works fine with 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35V and I think I won't OC
> Passed a night of memtest
> 
> CPU is something else
> 
> With standard settings @3.4Ghz temps are 62°C CPU and 72°C VRM


What test are you running for the CPU to get 62 C and 72 C for VRM. Also what is the ambient temperature. 72 C VRM seems pretty high for the CPU at that speed but that is still well below thermal throttling so I guess that is fine? I wonder what temps other people are getting for CPU and VRM at default settings. I'll test it tomorrow with Prime 95 Small FFT.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> What speed and volts are you using? Mine will only throttle with excessive voltage (1.424v+) and only after more than an hour of Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFTs. And it took a deliberate attempt to throttle it.
> 
> If you're is getting to throttle point that soon, there is a mounting issue.


I have not changed my settings from before the rebuild. 4.0GHz at 1.35V
Supposedly the block is mounted correctly. I've been building computers since the 80286 era so supposedly I should know what I'm doing.
The thought of having to disassemble the PC to recheck is horrifying! Drain the loop, disassemble part of the loop, remove the GPU, disconnect all the cables from the motherboard, remove the motherboard... The only thing I did out of the ordinary was to use Liquid metal but according to some people that have done it already on the 1950x, this should have given me some degrees down! Not many degrees up... The only thing I can think of is that I have not put enough Liquid metal but supposedly I covered the entire IHS... The GPU feels quite good with it...


----------



## MNMadman

I've got the same basic setup as you...

Watercool GPU block, EK monoblock, Watercool D5 Vario pump, XSPC temp sensor, flex tubing, Barrow compression fittings, Koolance QD3 quick disconnects, Watrercool MO-RA3 1080 rad, nine Be Quiet SW3 120mm HS fans, Gelid GC-Extreme TIM on both CPU and GPU. I can only make it throttle by deliberately using too much voltage and lowering the fan curve so they don't reach their normal speed. Even then, it takes over an hour of Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFTs preset to reach throttle temps. I don't think I could make mine throttle in one minute, even if I turned the fans off.

BRB ... going to unplug the fans and see how long it takes to throttle the CPU.


----------



## MNMadman

@OrionBG
Okay, testing done.

With the fans completely off, it took 2:12.39 from start of Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset to throttle the first core. That was a fresh boot, waited one minute after getting to desktop, and then starting HWiNFO64 and Prime95. Started the stopwatch right when I hit OK to start the torture test. Fixed 4.040GHz (40 x 101) on 16C/32T with 1.424v fixed Vcore according to the Nuvoton section of HWiNFO64.

Going by that performance, it's likely I could get by with the fans off for my everyday gaming and such using those settings (which I would never do, as my CPU requires 1.35v for 4.040GHz). The CPU is currently idling at 39C with the fans off under the same over-volted settings. Might have to try with my normal settings...


----------



## xkm1948

TR owners, would you upgrade to TR2 in August if AMD's TR2 comes out with 32C64T version?


----------



## MNMadman

xkm1948 said:


> TR owners, would you upgrade to TR2 in August if AMD's TR2 comes out with 32C64T version?


Hell no. I just build this HEDT system for the experience of working with that level of hardware. I don't even need the 32 threads I have -- I run the 1950X with SMT off.

I don't foresee them bringing full-fledged EPYC to the consumer desktop anyway.

@OrionBG

Update: Running at fixed 4.141GHz with 1.36875v fixed Vcore, 16C/16T. Coolant has stabilized at 41.5C and CPU at 48C doing basic browsing and streaming TV. Even at previous settings, the coolant and CPU temps gradually rose to about the same level. Going to try an extended gaming session to see if it's feasible to do with no fans.


----------



## Yamie

adam3234 said:


> What test are you running for the CPU to get 62 C and 72 C for VRM. Also what is the ambient temperature. 72 C VRM seems pretty high for the CPU at that speed but that is still well below thermal throttling so I guess that is fine? I wonder what temps other people are getting for CPU and VRM at default settings. I'll test it tomorrow with Prime 95 Small FFT.


A mix of occt and prime 95 small fft


----------



## ozlay

xkm1948 said:


> TR owners, would you upgrade to TR2 in August if AMD's TR2 comes out with 32C64T version?



No TR+ is coming in August. TR2 is next year. And i don't think there will be a 32c/64t TR2. Maybe a 24c/48t?


----------



## MNMadman

MNMadman said:


> Running at fixed 4.141GHz with 1.36875v fixed Vcore, 16C/16T. Coolant has stabilized at 41.5C and CPU at 48C doing basic browsing and streaming TV. Even at previous settings, the coolant and CPU temps gradually rose to about the same level. Going to try an extended gaming session to see if it's feasible to do with no fans.


Another update: Experiment terminated, at least at that speed and voltage. CPU and GPU were handling it fine, but coolant got up to 49C. That's too close to the failure temp for loop components for my comfort.

Might try 3.939GHz at 1.21250v, as that's the highest speed my CPU can get before it hits the voltage wall.


----------



## Dotachin

xkm1948 said:


> TR owners, would you upgrade to TR2 in August if AMD's TR2 comes out with 32C64T version?


2019 TR2 aka 7nm Rome is the reason I went with just a 1900X for now. You can bet I'm getting the biggest one of those (which I hope will be a 5 die 32core as described by adoredTV).

edit: video url seems to be over the top imo, leaving a blank link:
/watch?v=ucMQermB9wQ&list=LLA1Dbv2hT_DBc2I2qeGrKqA&index=51&t=0s


----------



## MNMadman

Five-die? Why the hell would it need five dies? Four would give the full 32 cores.


----------



## Dotachin

MNMadman said:


> Five-die? Why the hell would it need five dies?



Just a theory of the guy, 4 core-only dies annd a fifth in the center with the memory controller etc


----------



## MNMadman

Dotachin said:


> Just a theory of the guy, 4 core-only dies annd a fifth in the center with the memory controller etc


Ah, I see ... for yield purposes.

Of course, that would be the worst-case scenario for performance. Threadripper and Epyc already have crappy memory latency even with each die having a local memory controller. Move the memory controllers so that none of the core-dies have a local one, and memory latency goes directly down the toilet. Not good at all ... unless they seriously speed up the Infinity Fabric. Make the IF clock speed twice the memory clock speed instead of equal like it is now, and it might work.

Personally, I hope they save major change crap like that for the 4000-series Threadrippers.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

MNMadman said:


> Five-die? Why the hell would it need five dies? Four would give the full 32 cores.


its in the video he linked... 4 core holding dies and one holding cache and such


----------



## MNMadman

MNMadman said:


> Another update: Experiment terminated, at least at that speed and voltage. CPU and GPU were handling it fine, but coolant got up to 49C. That's too close to the failure temp for loop components for my comfort.
> 
> Might try 3.939GHz at 1.21250v, as that's the highest speed my CPU can get before it hits the voltage wall.


Tried passive cooling at 3.939GHz as well ... that too failed. Once again the coolant temp got to 49C. Oh well, it was worth a shot.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Tried passive cooling at 3.939GHz as well ... that too failed. Once again the coolant temp got to 49C. Oh well, it was worth a shot.


Thanks for your efforts! I'm afraid that I'm going to have to disassemble my rig again... at least to check what the f**k is going on between the CPU and the block...
Oh f**k... drain, pipes, MB, GPU... Everything looks so nice now... I finally did what I wanted all along, to create a show floor ready system and now I have to disassemble it... :sad-smile:sad-smile:sad-smile:madsmiley


----------



## adam3234

After 10 minutes of Prime 95 version 29.3 my CPU temp went up to 57 C and VRM temp went up to 51 C. Mother board is Zenith Extreme with active VRM cooling and VRM also has 140mm fan blowing on it from above. My 1950x is set with default settings.



xkm1948 said:


> TR owners, wo'uld you upgrade to TR2 in August if AMD's TR2 comes out with 32C64T version?


Nope, I'm quite happy with my 16C/32T Threadripper for now. What AMD needs is to keep focusing on is improving IPC, clock speed, the IMC and power consumption not more cores.


----------



## ht_addict

I'll just stick with my TR 1950x. With the new Bios for my board, I'm at 4Ghz/3600mhz. Ran AIDA64 stress test for almost 2hrs.


----------



## Yamie

I am almost done 

First of all the OC stuff build follows

For testing I use Prime95 with custom settings (96/96 FFTs in place 15 min), OCCT AVX Linpack and OCCT CPU big, HWMonitor, CorsairLink and Ryzen Master to set NUMA

Everything else is done in the BIOS

I started exploring the gigabyte bios, them I updated the bios to the newest version F3j	2018.04.12
I wasn't aiming for a specific speed, just the best reasonable speed

As always it's temps that are limiting me, not cpu but vrm
I read that the gigabyte vrms hold up to 150°C but starts throttling around 105°C
CPU throttling should be around 88°C
AMD says save temp is 68°C so that is were I am aiming for a 24/7 and VRM below 100°C

I set all fanspeed in the bios to a very quiet setting
The fan I placed at the VRM runs all the time at 100% ~ 4200 rmp but it doesn't make a noise (Noctua NF-A4x10 FLX Lüfter - 40mm)
Pump is also set to 100% all the time


*Hardware:*
CPU: Threadripper 1950x
RAM: 4x8 GB G.SKILL Trident Z RGB
MB: Gigabyte x399 Aorus Gaming 7
GPU: Gigabyte 1080ti Aorus Extreme
PSU: Corsair AX860i
AiO: Enermax LiqTech TR4 360
Case: Cooermaster Cosmos C700p

Tons of fans, 8x120mm Cooler Master SickleFlow and 4x140mm Cooler Master MasterFan Pro 140 Air Flow RGB
Some RGB stuff
2 SATA SSDs, an Intel S750 400GB and HGST HDD
An AuzenTech X-Fi HomeTheater HD and an additional PCIe USB 3.0 adapter because the MB only has 1 header but the case needs 2 and an internal USB2 hub


*My settings are:*
Cache: NUMA
UMA (Distributed)
NUMA (Local)

Core Performance Boost: Enable
AMD C&Q: Enabled
SVM Mode: Enabled
Global C-State: Auto
Opchache: Auto
Downcore: Auto
SMT Mode: Auto

*Overclocking:*
RAM runs fine on it's settings 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.355V
I increased the voltage by 0.005 and entered all settings manually not using xmp

CPU is at 3.95 Ghz
VCORE: 1.2625 V
CPU LLC: Auto

I tried LLC from Turbo, High, Normal, Low and everytime the voltage was to high so I left it on Auto
CPU VCORE is now from 1.248 min to 1.308 max and usually stable at 1.272/1.284


*Stabilitytesting:*
For stability I started with memtest86+ and the ram passed over 16 hours without any error

2 hours prime95 (custom 96/96 FFTs in place 15min)
2 hours AVX LINPACK 90% RAM
12 hours OCCT big

Everything passed


*Temps and power consumption:*
Ambient: 26 °C

IDLE: 
CPU 30°C / VRM 40°C
170 W in / 155 W out

2 h Prime 96/96 FFTs in place 15 min
CPU 70°C / VRM 100°C
500 W in / 470 W out

2 h AVX LINPACK 90% RAM
CPU 72°C / VRM 103°C
570 W in / 530 W out

12 h OCCT big
CPU 63°C / VRM 81°C
420 W in / 390 W out


When doing a very heavy stresstest and combining 100% CPU and 100% GPU my psu reaches it's limit with over 900W power in
I know this isn't a realistic case but it's heavy


*Benchmarking:*
Cinebench: ~3300
460 W in / 425 W out

Superposition stress 1080 high:
46°C / 54°C
540 W in / 510 W out


*Performance:*
Not optimized and no OC on GPU yet just power and voltage maxed out

Superposition 720 low: 18433
https://benchmark.unigine.com/results/rid_e323de7ef55149d1b6e921dc5a418787

Superposition 1080 extreme: 5964
https://benchmark.unigine.com/results/rid_2f83df1e04ff40ca8bae2f1beb1ce71b

Superposition 4K optimized: 9808
https://benchmark.unigine.com/results/rid_031fd47f5a54446899ea3803f2a56fa6

Superposition 8K Optimized: 4470
https://benchmark.unigine.com/results/rid_572055e180374a37825436725e97e982

3D Mark Timespy: 10067
https://www.3dmark.com/spy/3801943


*OC Conclusion:*
I am pleased with the results and my OC, the gaming performance is compareable to my older FX9590 and might be higher
But for gaming at 2k both CPUs are enough and I don't care this much
I should be able to score much higher after GPU oc and finetuning the cpu, right now it's in its normal state but NUMA
So SMT, NUMA, all cores active


*The build:*
I tried to do a RGB build and immediately ran into problems, because 4 PIN RGB != 4 PIN RGB
But now everything is synced and can be controlled by the MB or case
https://i.imgur.com/XbuvZxD.jpg

I placed a small 40mm fan beside the VRM for better cooling
https://i.imgur.com/FXIcgG5.jpg

A lot of cable managment was necessary to hide all the mess and CorsariLink
https://i.imgur.com/TEdecIn.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sD1tdLi.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/plWMRl7.jpg

Because the case only had 2 HDD cages and 2 FAN brackets I ordered some more from Coolermaster to be able to install all my HDDs and 2 additional fan at the bottom
https://i.imgur.com/XAqXJb4.jpg

I installed 3 fans in the top and one in the back
https://i.imgur.com/Etjymia.jpg

The 360 Aio got a 6 fan push/pull and was placed in the front
https://i.imgur.com/gYnpGtz.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/QWuJSqh.jpg

Installing the cpu was a mess, I ****ed up and while the mb detected all 4 ram modules the cpu only saw 2-3 and sometimes lost the gpu = so I had to reseat the cpu
Worked out well in the second try
https://i.imgur.com/nc1riAZ.jpg

Installing the Aio to the cpu
https://i.imgur.com/A5ssIFv.jpg

Adding GPU to the system
https://i.imgur.com/EcLvGsZ.jpg

And finally some RGB
https://i.imgur.com/9Xy9I2P.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/doXFIVr.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/MUzooxv.jpg


*Final words:*
I am very satisfied with this build
It's quiet hot, it uses a lot of power, but it is quiet and looks amazing
And I am going to install all my tools, docker etc tomorrow and I expect a great performance increase over my old system
Gaming never was an issue and this cpu won't work much better at 2K gaming because this 1080ti is still the bottleneck


Thanks for the help and the input, if there are any questions just ask for it 


Edit: some pictures of my station will follow after I am back there, right now I am at my partens home because of holiday and my pc workshop is still here


----------



## xkm1948

Upgraded the 1950X build to 128GB today. And some mild overclocking.

http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=196297&thumb=1

http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=196305&thumb=1

http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=196313&thumb=1

http://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=196321&thumb=1


----------



## Yamie

I am having a problem with any oc when using hyperv, windows just won't boot?
Works when cpu clock is on auto. Maybe cbs would work?


----------



## Yamie

Yamie said:


> I am having a problem with any oc when using hyperv, windows just won't boot?
> Works when cpu clock is on auto. Maybe cbs would work?


It really only is the cpu clock ratio, if on auto or 34 windows boots with svm and hyperv

If the clock is any higher windows won't boot as long as hyperv is installed or svm is enabled

When hyperv and svm are enabled:
Ryzen Master 1.3 stops working because of a vbs error
But Ryzen Master 1.2 works
https://community.amd.com/thread/227946


When I use 1.2 I am able to oc the cpu from windows and it works
But it doesn't work from the bios

I can set everything in bios without the cpu clock ratio

This is a workaround, but I don't know what is causing this error
I already removed almost all hardware and testet everything : /


----------



## KaneTW

ssateneth said:


> the EK blocks for TR are garbage. All of them. Except for maybe the new one that isn't released yet (completely re-engineered cold plate with 2 separate jet paths due to MCM nature of TR).


Yeah, the monoblock is only around Apogee/Koolance's level. Sucks, but I can't be bothered to drain my loop until I do some upgrades.

Unrelated, I noticed two issues:
* Reservoir levels dropping steadily (~0.5cm/month i'd guess?) but no leaks in sight. Any ideas?
* Temperatures went up nonlinearly with summer, with a coolant ΔT of about 8C while ambient changed from ~20 to ~24. That makes sense, though, as thermal transfer is nonlinear and there's less air flow by convection.


----------



## x7007

OrionBG said:


> 67C - 73C with a 360 AIO at 4GHz and that voltage, and 27C ambient while running Prime95 with AVX is just impossible! You were not getting correct temps before or something else was a miss... My system at 4GHz with 1.35xxV, 22C ambient and a custom Loop with a 360 and a 240 rads, 9fans at max RPM is getting 8xC after a while under Prime95.
> It is just not possible for an AIO to give you such temps. 86C is a more realistic temp with your setup and your ambient temps.


Well , it was . Didn't take screenshots, but it was . it cooled really good. then when the pump breaks , it can't, it then reaches to 86c and higher. so if it was working before, and when it breaks you can see the differences.

Also you really have to cool down those VRM's on the motherboards, they are so hot I couldn't touch them. then I've decided to put a fan on top to push air down EK 120mm 3000 rpm and they are not hot anymore.

by the way , my ambient now is almost 38c so it's so hot.


----------



## mmonnin

Yamie said:


> It really only is the cpu clock ratio, if on auto or 34 windows boots with svm and hyperv
> 
> If the clock is any higher windows won't boot as long as hyperv is installed or svm is enabled
> 
> When hyperv and svm are enabled:
> Ryzen Master 1.3 stops working because of a vbs error
> But Ryzen Master 1.2 works
> https://community.amd.com/thread/227946
> 
> 
> When I use 1.2 I am able to oc the cpu from windows and it works
> But it doesn't work from the bios
> 
> I can set everything in bios without the cpu clock ratio
> 
> This is a workaround, but I don't know what is causing this error
> I already removed almost all hardware and testet everything : /


I'm guessing its a Windows and/or HyperV issue as Linux and VBox work with an OC for me. I am running some BOINC projects atm that utilize VBox. My OC is in the Bios. Doesn't fix any issue but narrows the issue down a bit. Maybe try a VBox install of something to see if also has any errors.


----------



## MNMadman

It's not that the monoblock is bad ... it's that we're adding more heat to the loop, and adding more heat to the same piece of metal that's trying to cool the CPU. Expecting the same temps or better is unrealistic. A Heatkiller monoblock would have a similar increase in CPU temp. We just don't know the base performance for a redesigned EK TR4 block because they haven't given us one yet.

der8auer did a video where he compared the performance of a block versus monoblock on a 7900X/X299 system. The tradeoff for the huge decrease in VRM temp was an increase of about 5C in CPU temp IIRC.


----------



## OrionBG

After 4 hours of swears, being peed on by the loop while disassembling it, and what not, I finally found the reason why my temps are so bad!
And no, it is not the cold plate of the monoblock...
It appears that while I was mounting the monoblock initially, one of those things (random photo of such thing)(don't know the name in English)
View attachment 198193

fell from one of the mounting bolts while I was screwing them and lodged itself in such a position that the block was not completely pressing on the CPU. Removing this thing and reapplying my liquid metal (just in case) and now the CPU stays at 80C under load, 28C at idle, 4GHz at 1.35v. Prime95 has been running for almost an hour and the highest the CPU got was 82C. The VRMs are at 82C and holding. Water temp is at 34C, Intake Air Temp is 24C, Exhaust Air Temp 35C (I've put a lot of sensors  )


----------



## MNMadman

Mount issue caused by material interference (an E-clip got in the way). Glad it was an easy fix.

I switched SMT back on yesterday. Now running at 4.040GHz using 1.35v. Going to put my BCLK back to 100MHz and compare my temps to yours. I don't have all of the air sensors, but it'll be interesting to compare since we have similar cooling.

I would expect your temps to beat mine as you are using liquid metal and three separate 360 radiators. Though my system is in the basement and my ambient might be lower than yours (I have no idea what it is as there is no thermometer down there). Coolant temp likely be a good indicator.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Mount issue caused by material interference (an E-clip got in the way). Glad it was an easy fix.
> 
> I switched SMT back on yesterday. Now running at 4.040GHz using 1.35v. Going to put my BCLK back to 100MHz and compare my temps to yours. I don't have all of the air sensors, but it'll be interesting to compare since we have similar cooling.
> 
> I would expect your temps to beat mine as you are using liquid metal and three separate 360 radiators. Though my system is in the basement and my ambient might be lower than yours (I have no idea what it is as there is no thermometer down there). Coolant temp likely be a good indicator.


So this little thing is called e-clip... I hate e-clips 

It will be an interesting comparison! Go for it!


----------



## Yamie

mmonnin said:


> I'm guessing its a Windows and/or HyperV issue as Linux and VBox work with an OC for me. I am running some BOINC projects atm that utilize VBox. My OC is in the Bios. Doesn't fix any issue but narrows the issue down a bit. Maybe try a VBox install of something to see if also has any errors.


I posted my question in the AMD forum, but I don't think someone knows what to do^^



*Threadripper + Hyper-V + SVM + changed CPU clock ratio won't boot into Windows*

As my title says, if I change the CPU clock ratio inside the BIOS and SVM + Hyper-V are enabled my Threadripper 1950x system won't boot into windows, instead it get's stuck while doing so (maybe USB initialisation problems).
If I disable SVM or change the CPU clock ratio to Auto or 34 it works.

Inside Windows, the Ryzen Master software 1.3 doen't work with Hyper-V but version 1.2 does.
See here: https://community.amd.com/thread/227946

After booting into Windows with Auto CPU clock ratio + SVM + Hyper-V I am able to change the CPU clock ratio inside the Ryzen Master Software 1.2 and it works just fine.

Is this a bug, a feature, or just a problem I have?


I am using a Threadripper 1950x on a Gigabyte x399 Gaming 7 with 4x 8GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB for AMD Threadripper at 3200CL14.


----------



## mmonnin

Yamie said:


> I posted my question in the AMD forum, but I don't think someone knows what to do^^
> 
> 
> 
> *Threadripper + Hyper-V + SVM + changed CPU clock ratio won't boot into Windows*
> 
> As my title says, if I change the CPU clock ratio inside the BIOS and SVM + Hyper-V are enabled my Threadripper 1950x system won't boot into windows, instead it get's stuck while doing so (maybe USB initialisation problems).
> If I disable SVM or change the CPU clock ratio to Auto or 34 it works.
> 
> Inside Windows, the Ryzen Master software 1.3 doen't work with Hyper-V but version 1.2 does.
> See here: https://community.amd.com/thread/227946
> 
> After booting into Windows with Auto CPU clock ratio + SVM + Hyper-V I am able to change the CPU clock ratio inside the Ryzen Master Software 1.2 and it works just fine.
> 
> Is this a bug, a feature, or just a problem I have?
> 
> 
> I am using a Threadripper 1950x on a Gigabyte x399 Gaming 7 with 4x 8GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB for AMD Threadripper at 3200CL14.


So you want answers but won't do any testing to narrow down what the real problem is...don't point at me, I gave you several things to test.


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> It will be an interesting comparison! Go for it!


Made the change and booted into Windows.

After 15 minutes of idling...
Coolant temp: 21.8C
GPU temp: 23C
CPU temp: 25.5C (Node 0) / 25.3C (Node 1)
VRM temp: 25C

Peak temps after 60 minutes of Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset...
Coolant temp: 24.0C
GPU temp: 26C
CPU temp: 75.8C (Node 0) / 71.5C (Node 1)
VRM temp: 79C

15 minutes after the Prime95 test finished...
Coolant temp: 22.0C
GPU temp: 23C
CPU temp: 26.0C (Node 0) / 25.8C (Node 1)
VRM temp: 26C


----------



## Yamie

mmonnin said:


> So you want answers but won't do any testing to narrow down what the real problem is...don't point at me, I gave you several things to test.


Sorry, did I annoy you?
That wasn't my intention

You suggested to try VirtualBox instead of a hyper-v docker and I will try so on saturday when I am back home

I just wanted to inform you that I also posted this in the AMD forum, and that there is already a known problem with the newer ryzen master software
I think it's an initialization problem with my mb on windows because it looks like it stops before or while usb is initialized, but I do not see the connection


Thank you for your help


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Made the change and booted into Windows.
> 
> After 15 minutes of idling...
> Coolant temp: 21.8C
> GPU temp: 23C
> CPU temp: 25.5C (Node 0) / 25.3C (Node 1)
> VRM temp: 25C
> 
> Peak temps after 60 minutes of Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset...
> Coolant temp: 24.0C
> GPU temp: 26C
> CPU temp: 75.8C (Node 0) / 71.5C (Node 1)
> VRM temp: 79C
> 
> 15 minutes after the Prime95 test finished...
> Coolant temp: 22.0C
> GPU temp: 23C
> CPU temp: 26.0C (Node 0) / 25.8C (Node 1)
> VRM temp: 26C


That is one COLD basement


----------



## MNMadman

MNMadman said:


> Made the change and booted into Windows.
> 
> After 15 minutes of idling...
> Coolant temp: 21.8C
> GPU temp: 23C
> CPU temp: 25.5C (Node 0) / 25.3C (Node 1)
> VRM temp: 25C
> 
> Peak temps after 60 minutes of Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset...
> Coolant temp: 24.0C
> GPU temp: 26C
> CPU temp: 75.8C (Node 0) / 71.5C (Node 1)
> VRM temp: 79C
> 
> 15 minutes after the Prime95 test finished...
> Coolant temp: 22.0C
> GPU temp: 23C
> CPU temp: 26.0C (Node 0) / 25.8C (Node 1)
> VRM temp: 26C





OrionBG said:


> That is one COLD basement


Forgot to mention my fan RPMs...
Idle: ~580
Peak: ~1112

...and yeah, it's a bit cool. The central air is on due to summer-like temps finally showing up.


----------



## OrionBG

MNMadman said:


> Forgot to mention my fan RPMs...
> Idle: ~580
> Peak: ~1112
> 
> ...and yeah, it's a bit cool. The central air is on due to summer-like temps finally showing up.


What fans are you using? The Corsair HD120 ones that I'm using although pretty, are not the best solution for a radiator, but I guess they are ok...
Also your radiator is quite a monster if I remember correctly...


----------



## MNMadman

OrionBG said:


> What fans are you using? The Corsair HD120 ones that I'm using although pretty, are not the best solution for a radiator, but I guess they are ok...
> Also your radiator is quite a monster if I remember correctly...


Nine Be Quiet Silent Wings 3 120mm PWM High Speed fans in pull config (I always do my fans in pull) on a Watercool MO-RA3 1080 radiator. Same fan area as your three 360s, just in one big package.

The idle fan speed above is 25% and the peak fan speed is 50%. If the CPU temp had gone a bit higher the fans would have sped up to 75%.


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> Peak of 69 C sound reasonable for rendering although idle temperature is strange. With my 1950x OCed to 3.95 Ghz (VCORE=1.375, LCC=auto) the idle temperature is about 32 C with ambient temp of 24 C. Was the idle temperature measured with Ryzen Master and HWMonitor? Doesn't Ryzen Master show the same value as HWMonitor (but Ryzen master has decimal places so is more precise)? Tonight I've confirmed that the HWMonitor temp is same as the HWiNFO Tdie temp.


I wasn't writing anything because i wanted to do further testing, and I did log temps with HWInfo64, and over 12 hours while working in Sketchup (minimal workload really) it showed min Tdie temp at 40°C, but while rendering Tdie peaked at 72,5°C, all while front panel was completely off. Ambient was 24-26°, no overclock, case with 2x12cm fans and Noctua 14s for TR. 
Everything stock except RAM OC-ed with D.O.C.P. to 3200 mHz.

Unless HWinfo is wrong by 10° margin, I would say that this is too much. Sometimes I need to render for days at a time, and very hot summer is coming, I need to do something.


----------



## Tamalero

gnome_mo said:


> I wasn't writing anything because i wanted to do further testing, and I did log temps with HWInfo64, and over 12 hours while working in Sketchup (minimal workload really) it showed min Tdie temp at 40°C, but while rendering Tdie peaked at 72,5°C, all while front panel was completely off. Ambient was 24-26°, no overclock, case with 2x12cm fans and Noctua 14s for TR.
> Everything stock except RAM OC-ed with D.O.C.P. to 3200 mHz.
> 
> Unless HWinfo is wrong by 10° margin, I would say that this is too much. Sometimes I need to render for days at a time, and very hot summer is coming, I need to do something.


Have you tried using a custom fan speed and double fans for your noctua?


----------



## Yamie

mmonnin said:


> I'm guessing its a Windows and/or HyperV issue as Linux and VBox work with an OC for me. I am running some BOINC projects atm that utilize VBox. My OC is in the Bios. Doesn't fix any issue but narrows the issue down a bit. Maybe try a VBox install of something to see if also has any errors.


I was able to test it today

VBox works fine, but it doesn't need HyperV

I can narrow the issue down to HyperV + SVM + CPU clock ratio > 34 causes windows not to boot
And this seems to be the only combination causing this issue

But I need it to run xD

My workaround works fine now, since Ryzen Master 1.2 works (applying core clock ratio later in windows)
Enabling HyperV also causes an error with Ryzen Master 1.3


----------



## Tamalero

Yamie said:


> I was able to test it today
> 
> VBox works fine, but it doesn't need HyperV
> 
> I can narrow the issue down to HyperV + SVM + CPU clock ratio > 34 causes windows not to boot
> And this seems to be the only combination causing this issue
> 
> But I need it to run xD
> 
> My workaround works fine now, since Ryzen Master 1.2 works (applying core clock ratio later in windows)
> Enabling HyperV also causes an error with Ryzen Master 1.3


Have you tried using ZenStates? (if you have an ASUS mobo) ?


----------



## Yamie

Tamalero said:


> Have you tried using ZenStates? (if you have an ASUS mobo) ?


Yes Zenstates are available under cbs on my gigabyte board, same result
I made a very simple pstate oc just for testing and even 3.45 Ghz doesn't work

I am pretty sure that is an windows issue, but I thought in this case someone else should have the same problem


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> I wasn't writing anything because i wanted to do further testing, and I did log temps with HWInfo64, and over 12 hours while working in Sketchup (minimal workload really) it showed min Tdie temp at 40°C, but while rendering Tdie peaked at 72,5°C, all while front panel was completely off. Ambient was 24-26°, no overclock, case with 2x12cm fans and Noctua 14s for TR.
> Everything stock except RAM OC-ed with D.O.C.P. to 3200 mHz.
> 
> Unless HWinfo is wrong by 10° margin, I would say that this is too much. Sometimes I need to render for days at a time, and very hot summer is coming, I need to do something.


Tamalero's suggestion of adding another fan to your Noctua cooler is a good idea. All those temps I reported were done with same cooler as you've got but with 2 fans. 

What idle temperatures(min and max) do you get if you only open HWInfo64 and let it run, maybe when you let Sketchup idle, it is doing something in the background causing temps to go to 40 C?


----------



## betam4x

*ROG Strix X399-E*

So I've been playing with my new ASUS ROG Strix X399-E, and I have a few questions. The BIOS should be similar to the Zenith Extreme, so maybe those owners can help me out.

1) Setting the CPU Core Voltage does not appear to set the VCore, unlike the MSI board I previously had. Instead, it sets the CPU VID. Do you know how to set the VCore or is that just not possible?
2) Overclocking is quite a bit more finicky on this board. On my MSI board I could change 3 settings and get a stable 1.35V 4.1 GHz overclock, and 1.4375V would get me a stable 4.2 GHz (though it would throttle if too much power was used, for example, in Prime95...passed IBT though without issue and can encode h.265 videos just fine). Any advice on overclocking on this board? I haven't been able to get a stable overclock beyond the automatic 4 GHz profile thus far. I suspect that is due to me not understanding voltage control on this board.
3) LLC settings, which one is highest, and which one is lowest? Anyone know how many much power is added for each level?


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> So I've been playing with my new ASUS ROG Strix X399-E, and I have a few questions. The BIOS should be similar to the Zenith Extreme, so maybe those owners can help me out.
> 
> 1) Setting the CPU Core Voltage does not appear to set the VCore, unlike the MSI board I previously had. Instead, it sets the CPU VID. Do you know how to set the VCore or is that just not possible?
> 2) Overclocking is quite a bit more finicky on this board. On my MSI board I could change 3 settings and get a stable 1.35V 4.1 GHz overclock, and 1.4375V would get me a stable 4.2 GHz (though it would throttle if too much power was used, for example, in Prime95...passed IBT though without issue and can encode h.265 videos just fine). Any advice on overclocking on this board? I haven't been able to get a stable overclock beyond the automatic 4 GHz profile thus far. I suspect that is due to me not understanding voltage control on this board.
> 3) LLC settings, which one is highest, and which one is lowest? Anyone know how many much power is added for each level?


1) VID is a reference voltage that the motherboard applies the LLC to give the CPU the VCORE, this is the case for all motherboards. On your MSI board it is likely that what ever LLC was set, the LLC set the VCORE to the value of what you set for the core voltage in your bios(for the load the CPU had when it was monitored) to be. On my Zenith Extreme with LLC set to auto and core voltage set to 1.375, the VID will be 1.375 and VCORE will be 1.330 volts when the computer is idling/under very low load. On Prime 95 Small FFT when it gets extremely intense the LLC will set the VCORE to 1.373 volts using a VID of 1.313 volts. For the case of the Zenith Extreme and I think it's the case for your board as well, whatever value you set in the bios for core voltage to be the initial value for the VID voltage. I don't think it is possible to directly set the VCORE, in the past I've tried looking for a LLC level that'll maintain the VCORE voltage at the level I set the core voltage to in the bios but there was none was when I was testing it.

2) I'm guessing overclocking on your board and the Zenith Extreme is basically the same as other threadripper board but something you should consider is that different motherboards report voltages differently and not always accurately, this was confirmed in a Gamers Nexus video. It's possible that core frequency maybe reported differently and/or not accurately amongst the different boards as well so the 4 Ghz on your new board might be the same as your 4.1 Ghz stable OC on your MSI board or maybe your new board isn't as good for overclocking as the MSI one.

3) On the Zenith Extreme Level 1 is the lowest and Level 8 is the highest. No idea how much power each level adds. Wish ASUS would release some graphs which shows how all the LLC levels behaves for different voltages settings under different loads.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> 1) VID is a reference voltage that the motherboard applies the LLC to give the CPU the VCORE, this is the case for all motherboards. On your MSI board it is likely that what ever LLC was set, the LLC set the VCORE to the value of what you set for the core voltage in your bios(for the load the CPU had when it was monitored) to be. On my Zenith Extreme with LLC set to auto and core voltage set to 1.375, the VID will be 1.375 and VCORE will be 1.330 volts when the computer is idling/under very low load. On Prime 95 Small FFT when it gets extremely intense the LLC will set the VCORE to 1.373 volts using a VID of 1.313 volts. For the case of the Zenith Extreme and I think it's the case for your board as well, whatever value you set in the bios for core voltage to be the initial value for the VID voltage. I don't think it is possible to directly set the VCORE, in the past I've tried looking for a LLC level that'll maintain the VCORE voltage at the level I set the core voltage to in the bios but there was none was when I was testing it.
> 
> 2) I'm guessing overclocking on your board and the Zenith Extreme is basically the same as other threadripper board but something you should consider is that different motherboards report voltages differently and not always accurately, this was confirmed in a Gamers Nexus video. It's possible that core frequency maybe reported differently and/or not accurately amongst the different boards as well so the 4 Ghz on your new board might be the same as your 4.1 Ghz stable OC on your MSI board or maybe your new board isn't as good for overclocking as the MSI one.
> 
> 3) On the Zenith Extreme Level 1 is the lowest and Level 8 is the highest. No idea how much power each level adds. Wish ASUS would release some graphs which shows how all the LLC levels behaves for different voltages settings under different loads.


Thanks, even when LLC on auto, the VCORE ended up being a lot lower.


----------



## gnome_mo

adam3234 said:


> Tamalero's suggestion of adding another fan to your Noctua cooler is a good idea. All those temps I reported were done with same cooler as you've got but with 2 fans.
> 
> What idle temperatures(min and max) do you get if you only open HWInfo64 and let it run, maybe when you let Sketchup idle, it is doing something in the background causing temps to go to 40 C?



I've just turned on my PC after being away for 2 days and it shows 40. Right away. I'll leave it idling for some time, but... 40 is +14°C difference from ambient. 

Tamalero, that's great suggestion! Didn't know that I can put 2 fans on Noctua, I thought of putting 2x14 more fans in6to chassis. 
What do I need to order for that Noctua setup??


----------



## gnome_mo

Also, I've booted into BIOS, it shows Temp realtime, and it haS this wave-like diagram that shows Temp cycling between 48-38. It counts down degree by degree to 38 and from 38 peaks at 48, then again in regular intervals. 
Fan spins @800-1000 rpm.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> Thanks, even when LLC on auto, the VCORE ended up being a lot lower.


What load were you testing the auto LLC under? My suggestion for you to try and get your OC stable is to set RAM to 2133 Mhz(i.e. default) and continue to leave LLC on auto and just up the core voltage in the bios until you get a stable overclock or to try and shortcuts things maybe you should just jump straight to 1.375 volts for the core voltage and if it is stable maybe try lowing it to see if you can get it stable with less power or increase voltage until you get it stable. As I mentioned before, keep in mind that these software voltage reading could be inaccurate so you might not want to overclock your CPU up to the limit of what has been suggested safe.


----------



## adam3234

gnome_mo said:


> I've just turned on my PC after being away for 2 days and it shows 40. Right away. I'll leave it idling for some time, but... 40 is +14°C difference from ambient.
> 
> Tamalero, that's great suggestion! Didn't know that I can put 2 fans on Noctua, I thought of putting 2x14 more fans in6to chassis.
> What do I need to order for that Noctua setup??


You need to buy another NF-A15 140mm fan. Your Noctua nh-u14s tr4-sp3 should already come with an extra set of fan clips used for mounting an extra fan to the cooler. When you mount the extra fan to the cooler make sure that the extra fan is blowing in same direction as the other fan.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> What load were you testing the auto LLC under? My suggestion for you to try and get your OC stable is to set RAM to 2133 Mhz(i.e. default) and continue to leave LLC on auto and just up the core voltage in the bios until you get a stable overclock or to try and shortcuts things maybe you should just jump straight to 1.375 volts for the core voltage and if it is stable maybe try lowing it to see if you can get it stable with less power or increase voltage until you get it stable. As I mentioned before, keep in mind that these software voltage reading could be inaccurate so you might not want to overclock your CPU up to the limit of what has been suggested safe.


The issue is that what you enter for CPU core voltage is not what the VCORE ends up being. I still have not been able to get stable 4.1 GHz under Prime95, despite it being Rock solid stable on the MSI board. The auto 4 GHz mode works beautifully though. The idle voltages are a bit higher than my MSI if HWInfo is to be believed, but just being able to set it and forget it is awesome. I will probably give up for now. 100-200Mhz extra isn't worth hours of trying to figure out the bios and how the board works.

I wonder if the next Threadripper chip will be 12nm or 7nm. Rumor is that Epyc 2xxx will be 7nm TSMC and it will be released later this year. It would make sense for them to give HEDT the same treatment, as the higher margins could cover development costs for 7nm desktop parts next year.

EDIT: Was tired of typing on mobile. I was going to say that I am considering purchasing the next Threadripper chip when it comes out, even if it were 12nm. However if they managed to shrink it down to 7nm this year (and get the clock speeds up/power usage down), I would be throwing my money at them day 1.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> The issue is that what you enter for CPU core voltage is not what the VCORE ends up being. I still have not been able to get stable 4.1 GHz under Prime95, despite it being Rock solid stable on the MSI board. The auto 4 GHz mode works beautifully though. The idle voltages are a bit higher than my MSI if HWInfo is to be believed, but just being able to set it and forget it is awesome. I will probably give up for now. 100-200Mhz extra isn't worth hours of trying to figure out the bios and how the board works.
> 
> I wonder if the next Threadripper chip will be 12nm or 7nm. Rumor is that Epyc 2xxx will be 7nm TSMC and it will be released later this year. It would make sense for them to give HEDT the same treatment, as the higher margins could cover development costs for 7nm desktop parts next year.
> 
> EDIT: Was tired of typing on mobile. I was going to say that I am considering purchasing the next Threadripper chip when it comes out, even if it were 12nm. However if they managed to shrink it down to 7nm this year (and get the clock speeds up/power usage down), I would be throwing my money at them day 1.


I believe that Threadripper 2 will be better 2700X binned cores of 12nm. Hence why there are no 2800X parts.

Depending on 7nm yields, they might need ALL their cores for EPYC.


----------



## nycgtr

Just a heads up. I got the new EK STR4 block and it performs near identical to the heatkiller and XSPC neo.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> I believe that Threadripper 2 will be better 2700X binned cores of 12nm. Hence why there are no 2800X parts.
> 
> Depending on 7nm yields, they might need ALL their cores for EPYC.


I initially though this as well, but from a financial standpoint, it would make perfect sense for AMD to move to 7nm for Threadripper with this refresh. Think about it. The 2950X would cost $999 at launch, estimated cost to produce the chip would be well under $150/chip. That leaves a pretty hefty profit margin that helps pay for the early move to 7nm. AMD could also claim to have the fastest desktop chip in the world. They would then be ahead by Intel by at least a year. Even those of us like me would shell out another grand or two to get our hands on a 4.5-5.0 GHz 16 core part. The 2800X is MIA. Who is to say that later on AMD won't release an early AM4 7nm part as the flagship?

I am just thinking about the possibilities here. I mentioned the possibility elsewhere on the internet of AMD utilizing TSMC as their sole CPU fab for Ryzen. GloFo would be reserved for GPUs and older APUs. Changing up the strategy a bit and using high end Epyc, Threadripper, and a Flagship Ryzen chip to lead into a process would help offset the increased cost of lower yields.


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> I initially though this as well, but from a financial standpoint, it would make perfect sense for AMD to move to 7nm for Threadripper with this refresh. Think about it. The 2950X would cost $999 at launch, estimated cost to produce the chip would be well under $150/chip. That leaves a pretty hefty profit margin that helps pay for the early move to 7nm. AMD could also claim to have the fastest desktop chip in the world. They would then be ahead by Intel by at least a year. Even those of us like me would shell out another grand or two to get our hands on a 4.5-5.0 GHz 16 core part. The 2800X is MIA. Who is to say that later on AMD won't release an early AM4 7nm part as the flagship?
> 
> I am just thinking about the possibilities here. I mentioned the possibility elsewhere on the internet of AMD utilizing TSMC as their sole CPU fab for Ryzen. GloFo would be reserved for GPUs and older APUs. Changing up the strategy a bit and using high end Epyc, Threadripper, and a Flagship Ryzen chip to lead into a process would help offset the increased cost of lower yields.


Having in mind that AMD will be sampling Zen2 CPUs somewhere near the end of this year, I highly doubt that they will have such cores for Threadripper 2xxx in August 2018... I'm sure that all those vulnerabilities that were found the last 12 months or so, will play some role in delaying the Zen2 a month or two at least...


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> Having in mind that AMD will be sampling Zen2 CPUs somewhere near the end of this year, I highly doubt that they will have such cores for Threadripper 2xxx in August 2018... I'm sure that all those vulnerabilities that were found the last 12 months or so, will play some role in delaying the Zen2 a month or two at least...


There are rumors that EPYC 2 will be released later this year, and they will be 7nm. It wouldn't be much of a stretch to see a TR release as well.

Anyways, just a theory. On to something more important: On my old MSI board, LLC changed the CPU VID for each of the cores. It also stabilized the Vcore for the CPU. On my new ASUS X399-E board LLC does nothing at all. Could LLC be broken in this BIOS release or am I missing something? There is also a VDDSOC LLC option which I also played with. My main issue right now is vdroop. 

Also, because this board only has an 8+4 CPU connector (my MSI had 8+8), 16 cores @ 4.2 GHz overloads the board, which immediately kills the system (the board powers off and the power button stops responding, I have to turn the PS off and back on to get things functioning again).

EDIT: I've also been playing with Asus Zen States (the software version). The Perf. Enhancer getting set to level 3 does appear to improve performance a bit. I find that the system shoots up to 4.1 GHz on any number of cores, not just 2/4/8. For example, AoTS benchmark was using 9 cores @ 4.1 GHz with the rest hovering at 2.2 GHz. However, the performance was still lower than if I just overclocked all the cores to begin with...possibly due to AoTS not fully utilizing all the cores.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> I initially though this as well, but from a financial standpoint, it would make perfect sense for AMD to move to 7nm for Threadripper with this refresh. Think about it. The 2950X would cost $999 at launch, estimated cost to produce the chip would be well under $150/chip. That leaves a pretty hefty profit margin that helps pay for the early move to 7nm. AMD could also claim to have the fastest desktop chip in the world. They would then be ahead by Intel by at least a year. Even those of us like me would shell out another grand or two to get our hands on a 4.5-5.0 GHz 16 core part. The 2800X is MIA. Who is to say that later on AMD won't release an early AM4 7nm part as the flagship?
> 
> I am just thinking about the possibilities here. I mentioned the possibility elsewhere on the internet of AMD utilizing TSMC as their sole CPU fab for Ryzen. GloFo would be reserved for GPUs and older APUs. Changing up the strategy a bit and using high end Epyc, Threadripper, and a Flagship Ryzen chip to lead into a process would help offset the increased cost of lower yields.


That is like implying that 7nm will grant the same gorgeous yields that AMD is getting right now.

As I said before, Threadripper as always been about scavenging the best chips of the CURRENT generation. It would be silly to starve epyc 7nm just to fill a niche.

So I disagree. Threadripper 2XXX will be using the same dye shrink of the 2000X series of Zen+ by using the best cores of the 2000X generation and leave the lower binned ones for the normal Ryzen 2000 series.

This technique worked fine for AMD so they won't risk it.


----------



## MNMadman

nycgtr said:


> Just a heads up. I got the new EK STR4 block and it performs near identical to the heatkiller and XSPC neo.


Too late really, but good on them for finally doing what they should have done in the first place. What they should do now is offer a straight trade or a minimal upgrade cost to those who purchased the original TR4 block.

You going to keep it, or is it a sample you have to send back?

Edit: I'd get one but I still have the Heatkiller block if I ever want to move away from the EK monoblock.


----------



## nycgtr

MNMadman said:


> Too late really, but good on them for finally doing what they should have done in the first place. What they should do now is offer a straight trade or a minimal upgrade cost to those who purchased the original TR4 block.
> 
> You going to keep it, or is it a sample you have to send back?
> 
> Edit: I'd get one but I still have the Heatkiller block if I ever want to move away from the EK monoblock.


It was a sample and I dont have to send it back.


----------



## mmonnin

Tamalero said:


> That is like implying that 7nm will grant the same gorgeous yields that AMD is getting right now.
> 
> As I said before, Threadripper as always been about scavenging the best chips of the CURRENT generation. It would be silly to starve epyc 7nm just to fill a niche.
> 
> So I disagree. Threadripper 2XXX will be using the same dye shrink of the 2000X series of Zen+ by using the best cores of the 2000X generation and leave the lower binned ones for the normal Ryzen 2000 series.
> 
> This technique worked fine for AMD so they won't risk it.


Based on 1xxx series, I agree with you. Something like a TR 2950x name with 2x 2700x live chips on package with 2 dead ones at slightly higher clocks. A new generation of manufacturing is not the place for servers for many reasons.


----------



## betam4x

mmonnin said:


> Based on 1xxx series, I agree with you. Something like a TR 2950x name with 2x 2700x live chips on package with 2 dead ones at slightly higher clocks. A new generation of manufacturing is not the place for servers for many reasons.


Threadripper has no place in a server, it is a workstation chip. EPYC is the server variant and EPYC 2 is rumored to be manufactured at TSMC 7nm and sampled and/or released later this year.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> Threadripper has no place in a server, it is a workstation chip. EPYC is the server variant and EPYC 2 is rumored to be manufactured at TSMC 7nm and sampled and/or released later this year.


Which again means they will depend on yields. So I dont think they will use 7nm for a niche market like threadripper. They will most probably focus on EPYC on 7nm for months until they get good yields then move their consumer market to 7nm as well.

alternatively, if their yields are very good. No surprise if threadripper 2XXX ends being just EPYC2 with 2 defused or defective modules switched off.

But for now, its more probably to use harvested 2000 series chips.


----------



## mmonnin

betam4x said:


> Threadripper has no place in a server, it is a workstation chip. EPYC is the server variant and EPYC 2 is rumored to be manufactured at TSMC 7nm and sampled and/or released later this year.


TR 1xxx chips vs Ryzen were still the better binned chips, just like any chip that goes into a server. What I said is still correct and you're talking about rumors. TR/Epyc won't get the 1st chips from a new gen manufacturing process.


----------



## Courvoisier

I have put my post on the main forum (http://www.overclock.net/forum/10-amd-cpus/1699314-threadripper-1920x-temperatures.html) but I think here is a better place:

Hi guys,
I would like some advice about my build and the temperatures.
I currently upgraded my FX 8350 to the following: 


Threadripper 1920X
ASROCK Taichi X399
4x8GB G. Skill F4 3000 °C15Q 32GRBB
Noctua NH U14s TR4 SP3

Other components in the system that were not changed:


850W Coolermaster PSU which is a few years old
Zotak GTX 970
500GB Samsung SSD 850 EVO
250GB Samsung SSD 840 EVO
3 WD HDDs
1 SATA DVDRW

This is mostly a workstation and I intend to use it for optimisations and data crunching. I do a bit of gaming as well. I am not interested in overclocking (well except the RAM, which I am technically overclocking).
I set the RAM frequency in the BIOS to 3033 and the system was ok for normal work. But I want to make sure it's stable. I dont want to launch an optimization on 24 threads only to find the PC rebooted 1 hour into that. So I used AIDA64 and Prime95. I got BSD 15 minutes into both. So I reduced the RAM frequency in the bios to 2966 and ran AIDA64 for 3.5h and the system was stable. I looged the data using HWiNFO64. The file is here https://drive.google.com/file/d/1__y8s9zG1rkIYfSBUHFIUZn3xP0rcaz_/view?usp=sharing.

Now, I recorded the temperatures and plotted them:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1my3HMxqimUNyUm1sdroNRbVjpiV6EmDv/view?usp=sharing

As you can see. the Tctl temperatures are around 93 degres and can reach more than 100 at times, whereas the Tdie temps are around 68 and can reach 78 at times. Also you can see that once the test stopped, the temperatures immediately went down to 45/65.

I was happy that the system ran for 3.5h, but I am wondering if these are ok temperatures? From what I am reading I am running 10 degrees too hot. What do you recommend I do to reduce this? Is it possible I missinstalled or didn't apply the thermal paste correctly?

Furthermore, the I also looked at power data from HWiNFO64. and I get something like 170W on CPU package power and between 75 and 180 for the CPU Core power. It does not go above. the SMU actually starts at 180 and decreases slightly with time. Is this normal?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JfF_qy7jfC2Qoty-Iqm26aJKBjNjqmB8/view?usp=sharing

Thank you for your feedback


----------



## Dotachin

Courvoisier said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I have put my post on the main forum (http://www.overclock.net/forum/10-amd-cpus/1699314-threadripper-1920x-temperatures.html) but I think here is a better place:
> 
> Hi guys,
> I would like some advice about my build and the temperatures.
> I currently upgraded my FX 8350 to the following:
> 
> 
> Threadripper 1920X
> ASROCK Taichi
> 4x8GB G. Skill F4 3000 °C15Q 32GRBB
> Noctua NH U14s TR4 SP3
> 
> Other components in the system that were not changed:
> 
> 
> 850W Coolermaster PSU which is a few years old
> Zotak GTX 970
> 500GB Samsung SSD 850 EVO
> 250GB Samsung SSD 840 EVO
> 3 WD HDDs
> 1 SATA DVDRW
> 
> This is mostly a workstation and I intend to use it for optimisations and data crunching. I do a bit of gaming as well. I am not interested in overclocking (well except the RAM, which I am technically overclocking).
> I set the RAM frequency in the BIOS to 3033 and the system was ok for normal work. But I want to make sure it's stable. I dont want to launch an optimization on 24 threads only to find the PC rebooted 1 hour into that. So I used AIDA64 and Prime95. I got BSD 15 minutes into both. So I reduced the RAM frequency in the bios to 2966 and ran AIDA64 for 3.5h and the system was stable. I looged the data using HWiNFO64. The file is attached.
> 
> Now, I recorded the temperatures and plotted them:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see. the Tctl temperatures are around 93 degres and can reach more than 100 at times, whereas the Tdie temps are around 68 and can reach 78 at times. Also you can see that once the test stopped, the temperatures immediately went down to 45/65.
> 
> I was happy that the system ran for 3.5h, but I am wondering if these are ok temperatures? From what I am reading I am running 10 degrees too hot. What do you recommend I do to reduce this? Is it possible I missinstalled or didn't apply the thermal paste correctly?
> 
> Thank you for your feedback


It may be your case/fans, which one are you using? If a re seat doesn't work, addding an extra fan to push/pull your noctua could help quite a bit.

edit: also as nycgtr told you, you could get away with setting a fixed volt under 1.30 (try and find the lowest stable one).
Also on a taichi you should set the llc to 2 or 3

edit 2: and update your bios for better ram overclocks. You should be able to get 3200


----------



## Courvoisier

I have the BIOS updated. In the case I have a large fan that is pulling the air away and is only a few cm from the heatsink. It's not perfect, but I thin it helps.
My case is an old (2007) mid tower Steel case (this one https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811144151), It could be it, but I have a couple of fans one large pulling air out and is in front of heat sink and the other pull air in from above.
about the RAM, I dont think I'd like to go above. the system was not stable at 3033.

for the LLC, is this the case still on the X399?

thanks


----------



## Dotachin

Courvoisier said:


> I have the BIOS updated. In the case I have a large fan that is pulling the air away and is only a few cm from the heatsink. It's not perfect, but I thin it helps.
> My case is an old (2007) mid tower Steel case (this one https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811144151), It could be it, but I have a couple of fans one large pulling air out and is in front of heat sink and the other pull air in from above.
> about the RAM, I dont think I'd like to go above. the system was not stable at 3033.
> 
> for the LLC, is this the case still on the X399?
> 
> thanks


Surprised the Noctua even fits in there. Try to stress it with the side panel removed to see if it's a case issue.

Yes, I use LLC 2 on my x399 taichi.
You can use this tool for adjusting your ram

edit: or try your case fan in push instead of pull

edit 2: a case suggestion on the cheap (under $70) based on your specs would be the MasterBox5, it claims support for 167mm tall heatsinks so it should fit the Noctua, and the meshed front will provide adecuate airflow for it.


----------



## Yamie

Courvoisier said:


> I have the BIOS updated. In the case I have a large fan that is pulling the air away and is only a few cm from the heatsink. It's not perfect, but I thin it helps.
> My case is an old (2007) mid tower Steel case (this one https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811144151), It could be it, but I have a couple of fans one large pulling air out and is in front of heat sink and the other pull air in from above.
> about the RAM, I dont think I'd like to go above. the system was not stable at 3033.
> 
> for the LLC, is this the case still on the X399?
> 
> thanks


I think it is quite possile that your airflow is limited by your case to an extent that you won't be able to keep your cpu cool, even if you install more fans to the cpucooler

Have you tried it with an open pc and a big external fan pointed at the cpu?


----------



## Tamalero

Yamie said:


> I think it is quite possile that your airflow is limited by your case to an extent that you won't be able to keep your cpu cool, even if you install more fans to the cpucooler
> 
> Have you tried it with an open pc and a big external fan pointed at the cpu?


Or modify the window so theres another big fan blowing air directly into the front part of the noctua cooler.


----------



## Offler

Looking for opinion:

Threadripper 1900x
Asrock x399M Taichi
Ram @ 3200Mhz minimum, CAS 14 or less

I want to move there my current FuryX and LSI 9211 Raid without any limitations to PCI-E lanes and to keep all running at PCI-E 3.0 16x capable and not switch to 8x (not the case of my current raid controller, but maybe in the future, or when replaced with some NVMe/M2).

Anything above 8 Cores is an overkill for me atm (gaming rig).

Is it worth to build it now, or wait and see EPYC2 platform?


----------



## Yamie

Offler said:


> Looking for opinion:
> 
> Threadripper 1900x
> Asrock x399M Taichi
> Ram @ 3200Mhz minimum, CAS 14 or less
> 
> I want to move there my current FuryX and LSI 9211 Raid without any limitations to PCI-E lanes and to keep all running at PCI-E 3.0 16x capable and not switch to 8x (not the case of my current raid controller, but maybe in the future, or when replaced with some NVMe/M2).
> 
> Anything above 8 Cores is an overkill for me atm (gaming rig).
> 
> Is it worth to build it now, or wait and see EPYC2 platform?


Depends on how fast you need it
I wouldn't expect it until end 2018, and availability will be another issue
I just build my 1950x system because I couldn't wait any longer

From what I read the 2950x will also be a 14nm cpu with higher turbo, but I don't think there will be much of a difference when oced, I could be wrong 
If there will be x499 there will also be new updates to x399


----------



## Offler

Yamie said:


> Depends on how fast you need it
> I wouldn't expect it until end 2018, and availability will be another issue
> I just build my 1950x system because I couldn't wait any longer
> 
> From what I read the 2950x will also be a 14nm cpu with higher turbo, but I don't think there will be much of a difference when oced, I could be wrong
> If there will be x499 there will also be new updates to x399


I was looking for Ryzen 7 2xxx series and I hoped for better PCI-E lane configuration. Even when the chips were upgraded a lot, i am disappointed at limited PCI-E 3.0...

So when comparing Ryzen 7 1700x or 2700x, on Threadripper 1900x i can get much more PCI-E lanes and 2x more memory bandwidth - an overkill which would be able to saturate some crazy SSD raid i might get in the future.

Just to note... My current raid has reads up to 2500Mb/s, writes up to 2000mb/s, however IOPS are quite low. Anyway M2 or NVMe started to catch up only a year ago, while i have that raid over 5 years, and it shows little to no signs of aging.

The mainboard x399M has only 3 PCI-E 3.0 slots, but each of them is capable to run at full 16x speed, regardless how are occupied.


----------



## adam3234

@Courvoisier curious to know what was the ambient temp when your 1920x was running with those temps. AMD states that 68 C is the max temp of the 1920x on their official 1920x page but they don't speciffy whether this is Tctrl or Tdie. I'm guessing Tdie temps of around 68 C with peaks 78 C are within the specs i.e this is assuming AMD is specifying 68 C max Tdie but to be sure you should really ask AMD.
I don't want to give you any false impressions but I run my 1950x at about 95 C Tdie for 92+ continuous hours during stress testing on multiple occasions but it hasn't shown any signed of degradation YET. I'm not suggesting anybody run their systems as hot as I do when stress testing, I recommend that you contact AMD. 

You also need to run a memory test to ensure the RAM modules themselves are fine. Prime 95 is a CPU stress testing tool. Running Prime 95 Large FFT( or a custom FFT larger than the CPU cache) is good for stress testing the CPU's IMC but you should still run a memory stress testing tool. For memory stability testing I run 4 passes of MemTest86 follow by 24 hours of Prime 95 Large FFT.

Edit: ignore previous paragraph, I just remembered that you listed AIDA64 as another memory stress testing tool you use. I don't know about the reliability of AIDA64, I like to use MemTest86 because it doesn't run in Windows. I don't like memory stress testing tools that run in Windows because Windows takes up a lot of RAM that can't be tested.


----------



## Dotachin

Offler said:


> Looking for opinion:
> 
> Threadripper 1900x
> Asrock x399M Taichi
> Ram @ 3200Mhz minimum, CAS 14 or less
> 
> I want to move there my current FuryX and LSI 9211 Raid without any limitations to PCI-E lanes and to keep all running at PCI-E 3.0 16x capable and not switch to 8x (not the case of my current raid controller, but maybe in the future, or when replaced with some NVMe/M2).
> 
> Anything above 8 Cores is an overkill for me atm (gaming rig).
> 
> Is it worth to build it now, or wait and see EPYC2 platform?


You can get a 1900X for $350 at micro center right now so I would totally do it. Zen+ isn't that much better anyway. Zen 2 (2H 2019) will likely give you better memory clocks and x2 cores (which you don't care about).

edit: "without any limitations to PCI-E lanes" =/= x399M, get the atx taichi


----------



## Offler

Dotachin said:


> You can get a 1900X for $350 at micro center right now so I would totally do it. Zen+ isn't that much better anyway. Zen 2 (2H 2019) will likely give you better memory clocks and x2 cores (which you don't care about).
> 
> edit: "without any limitations to PCI-E lanes" =/= x399M, get the atx taichi


I was checking Asrock x399 Taichi and Asrock x399M Taichi. Mostly identical boards, but...

X399 has 4x PCI-E slots which with 16x form factor, however two of them appear to have 8x wiring. I have to find a photo of the backplate.
X399M has 3x PCI-E slots which appear to be 16x, with 16x wiring on all of them. So all slots available on the board (including M2s) can be occupied, without disabling half of bandwidth on any of them. But thats just my personal preference.


----------



## Dotachin

Offler said:


> I was checking Asrock x399 Taichi and Asrock x399M Taichi. Mostly identical boards, but...
> 
> X399 has 4x PCI-E slots which with 16x form factor, however two of them appear to have 8x wiring. I have to find a photo of the backplate.
> X399M has 3x PCI-E slots which appear to be 16x, with 16x wiring on all of them. So all slots available on the board (including M2s) can be occupied, without disabling half of bandwidth on any of them. But thats just my personal preference.


I thought x399M only had 1 m.2?
Imo 2x16+2x8 offers more flexibility (never needed 3 things at x16) but to each their own


----------



## Offler

Dotachin said:


> I thought x399M only had 1 m.2?
> Imo 2x16+2x8 offers more flexibility (never needed 3 things at x16) but to each their own


Both have three M 2 slots.

Since both mainboards have soundcard which is not terrible, and NIC card which is actually very good (i have its standalone version) the third slot would be occupied with a TV tuner, but ... i dont think for too long (not using it much anyway). So plan for the future is to keep one decent GPU, and add some storage into PCI-E 3.0 16x which would have up to 12000mb read/write. Still one PCI-E slot free. It would still allow dual graphics in Crossfire and this crazy storage card which is not yet manufactured...

The larger board would be more interesting in case I would keep the tv tuner, and all the PCI-E stuff i have now.

Anyway, how to recognize faulty Threadrippers which failed torture tests in Linux (fft test? forgot which one)...


----------



## MNMadman

Offler said:


> Anyway, how to recognize faulty Threadrippers which failed torture tests in Linux (fft test? forgot which one)...


If you're talking about the segmentation fault errors when compiling kernels, Threadripper CPUs aren't affected by that. Only regular Ryzen CPUs with a manufacturing date before week 25 2017 are affected.


----------



## Offler

Dotachin said:


> I thought x399M only had 1 m.2?
> Imo 2x16+2x8 offers more flexibility (never needed 3 things at x16) but to each their own


Well. I should not have seen this





If I am not mistaken each of the PCI-E 3.0 8x on x399 Taichi belongs to a different "half" of Threadripper. So getting a card which has 2 M.2 slots and its PCI-E 3.0 8x can allow to create raid out of 4x M2 drives while getting 12gb reads, 7.5gb writes and probably incredible high value of IOPS.

Now... As we all know Windows 10, one bad update which will touch Raid Controller will erase whole system.

What i found little bit disapointing is the bottleneck inside the Threadripper up to 12gb/s betweek the cores...


----------



## Tamalero

Yamie said:


> Depends on how fast you need it
> I wouldn't expect it until end 2018, and availability will be another issue
> I just build my 1950x system because I couldn't wait any longer
> 
> From what I read the 2950x will also be a 14nm cpu with higher turbo, but I don't think there will be much of a difference when oced, I could be wrong
> If there will be x499 there will also be new updates to x399



It will be using the new 2000X series node. Which is 12nm.

So expect higher frequencies.

Considering how much power the 1950X needs to get to 4.1Ghz, ID say the new series will be better in this aspect but only that.



Offler said:


> Well. I should not have seen this
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzzavO5a4OQ
> 
> If I am not mistaken each of the PCI-E 3.0 8x on x399 Taichi belongs to a different "half" of Threadripper. So getting a card which has 2 M.2 slots and its PCI-E 3.0 8x can allow to create raid out of 4x M2 drives while getting 12gb reads, 7.5gb writes and probably incredible high value of IOPS.
> 
> Now... As we all know Windows 10, one bad update which will touch Raid Controller will erase whole system.
> 
> What i found little bit disapointing is the bottleneck inside the Threadripper up to 12gb/s betweek the cores...




This limit is dictated by the memory speed right?(infinity fabric) or is it hardcoded?


----------



## gnome_mo

Tamalero said:


> Have you tried using a custom fan speed and double fans for your noctua?


Managed to get temp down to peak 57° with turbo fan setting and taking off front panel ( and turning the AC on )
Still ordered second fan for noctua and two more 140 mm fans for chassis, i'm not comfortable with panel off because of the dust etc.


----------



## Offler

Tamalero said:


> This limit is dictated by the memory speed right?(infinity fabric) or is it hardcoded?


Infinity fabric, therefore its a hardware limitation +- frequency of the bus.

Memory speed for a single channel is at 3200Mhz 25,6gigabyte per second, and threadripper has 4 channels so its 104,2 gigabytes per second in total.

I would guess that each CPU can use up to 11gb/s towards memory or other processor on the other die, and the rest of channel bandwidht - 14gb/s is dedicated to PCI-E line(s). Its not bad, but its less of a progress I expected since Phenom II 

To compare it with phenomII - L3 cache/PCI-E 2.0 x16 allows up to 5300mb/s, which is very limited by more than one factor, as Hypertransport is already shared between PCI-E bus and 6 Cores. Ryzens definitely doubled transfer rates between cores, while there is abundance of bandwidht for PCI-E lanes. I expected 10x improvement, which is when you combine 4 Ryzen dies...


----------



## MNMadman

Offler said:


> What i found little bit disapointing is the bottleneck inside the Threadripper up to 12gb/s betweek the cores...


Weird that der8auer was able to get 27Gbps with NVMe RAID...






Seems like Linus' results might be a setup limitation rather than a CPU limitation. I wonder what he would have gotten if he hadn't worried about being balanced between the dies?


----------



## Tamalero

gnome_mo said:


> Managed to get temp down to peak 57° with turbo fan setting and taking off front panel ( and turning the AC on )
> Still ordered second fan for noctua and two more 140 mm fans for chassis, i'm not comfortable with panel off because of the dust etc.


That seems like your case has very poor airflow.



MNMadman said:


> Weird that der8auer was able to get 27Gbps with NVMe RAID...
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CoAyjzJWfw
> 
> Seems like Linus' results might be a setup limitation rather than a CPU limitation. I wonder what he would have gotten if he hadn't worried about being balanced between the dies?


I remember linus actually had to contact an ASUS rep, who informed him about the per Die limitation.
As half the PCI-E lanes are on the other "die". so the 2 top PCI-E x8/x16 are on the first die and the second row is on the second die. Thus he got way better speeds once he balanced the load.


----------



## MNMadman

Tamalero said:


> I remember linus actually had to contact an ASUS rep, who informed him about the per Die limitation.
> As half the PCI-E lanes are on the other "die". so the 2 top PCI-E x8/x16 are on the first die and the second row is on the second die. Thus he got way better speeds once he balanced the load.


I got the impression that Linus was blaming the RAID array's performance on the die-to-die bandwidth limitation. If a 4-drive array can do 12Gbps and an 8-drive array can do 27Gbps, then that limitation wasn't the limit after all.

Maybe I misinterpreted Linus' video...


----------



## Offler

MNMadman said:


> Weird that der8auer was able to get 27Gbps with NVMe RAID...
> 
> Seems like Linus' results might be a setup limitation rather than a CPU limitation. I wonder what he would have gotten if he hadn't worried about being balanced between the dies?


Linus did his tests much earlier, and in my opinion he did not balanced it properly. There could be various factors, but to me seems important that he could use "only" 4 NVMe drives, Der Bauer used 8.

He really saturated two full PCI-E 3.0 slots, however... the costs are quite high. Just plain existence of such raid and managed by CPU will kick the processors everytime it transfers data. My current solution uses processor of its own, which is good if the system should be used for gaming, even when nowadays same and better performance can be attained using single NVMe drive.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> It will be using the new 2000X series node. Which is 12nm.
> 
> So expect higher frequencies.
> 
> Considering how much power the 1950X needs to get to 4.1Ghz, ID say the new series will be better in this aspect but only that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This limit is dictated by the memory speed right?(infinity fabric) or is it hardcoded?


Do you have an ASUS board? My MSI board needed 1.35V to be rock solid stable @ 4.1 GHz. My ASUS board has a buggy BIOS (ROG Strix X399-E) and I can't seem to get things stable. LLC does nothing Even LLC level 8 leads to massive Vdroop. That's even after pulling the battery for a good hour and a half. Maybe one day I'll have the patience to fix the MSI board...and I HATED that board (look at my previous posts.)


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> Do you have an ASUS board? My MSI board needed 1.35V to be rock solid stable @ 4.1 GHz. My ASUS board has a buggy BIOS (ROG Strix X399-E) and I can't seem to get things stable. LLC does nothing Even LLC level 8 leads to massive Vdroop. That's even after pulling the battery for a good hour and a half. Maybe one day I'll have the patience to fix the MSI board...and I HATED that board (look at my previous posts.)


I'm on a X399 Prime.

My bios 503 and 506 were rock solid at 3.95Ghz @ 1.20V, now I need higher. And I needed 1.35V for 4.1Ghz as well with LLC on auto, but havent gone that high because I'm not on water. (just to clarify, with bios 601 I can no longer reach such speeds with that voltage. I need 1.23+V to get stable speeds at 3.95Ghz)


Also depending on your motherboard/brand, it seems that LLC value and output can be inverted.

Example, LLC3 in ASUS could mean LLC8 in other brands.
Thats what I've read on reddit.


----------



## gnome_mo

Tamalero said:


> That seems like your case has very poor airflow.


Yeah, it's CoolerMaster Masterbox 5t. Wouldn't recommend it to anyone. I'm thinking of a way to cut out front panel glass and replacing it with mesh.
It's either the case airflow or they didn't put cooler properly/bad thermal paste or something like that. 

https://www.google.ba/search?safe=a...k1j0i67k1.0.x3CfsJPQW0M#imgrc=uM-hcmNs2jKh4M:


----------



## betam4x

*ROG Strix X-399E*

I FINALLY have this board figured out, but not mastered. You have to go into AMD CBS and set OC mode to customized, then set P-State 0 with correct voltages/frequency. Then you go back to extreme tweaker, and set the core voltage. Finally, you can change the LLC level.

On one hand it offers finer grain control over the VCore over the VID, on the other hand, it is harder to obtain optimal settings. Also, the 8+4 power input vs the 8+8 of the MSI board means I can't boost clocks as high. I haven't compared the VRM differences, but I suspect the MSI had better VRMs.

For the next gen Threadripper I will be paying very close attention to the motherboard specs.

EDIT: leaving the rest of the P-States on auto and modifying the power plan still let's the CPU downclock to as low as 1.8 GHz if not under load.

EDIT #2: The MSI does indeed have a stronger VRM setup. I hope next gen Threadripper boards feature even better VRMs.


----------



## xkm1948

https://www.techpowerup.com/244806/...trageous-threadripper-motherboard-you-can-buy


See these crazy VRMs? Yep. Threadripper 2 is definitely gonna have 32 core 64 threads.


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> https://www.techpowerup.com/244806/...trageous-threadripper-motherboard-you-can-buy
> 
> 
> See these crazy VRMs? Yep. Threadripper 2 is definitely gonna have 32 core 64 threads.


Disagree with that statement. Lets remember that the 2000X series also consume more power (the 2700X is a fine example of this) when reaching higher XFR speeds.

So no surprise that this threadripper mobo was exclusively designed to either be record breaking overclocking motherboard or to fuel the more power hungry threadripper 2000X


----------



## xkm1948

Tamalero said:


> Disagree with that statement. Lets remember that the 2000X series also consume more power (the 2700X is a fine example of this) when reaching higher XFR speeds.
> 
> So no surprise that this threadripper mobo was exclusively designed to either be record breaking overclocking motherboard or to fuel the more power hungry threadripper 2000X



18 phase VRM. Unless a 16 core 32 thread 2950X is overclocked to the moon(5GHz) I see no reason to use 18 phase VRM. 32 core 64 threads on the other hand will eat up 18 phase VRM just fine.

We shall see in 2 days. Marking your words now.


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> 18 phase VRM. Unless a 16 core 32 thread 2950X is overclocked to the moon(5GHz) I see no reason to use 18 phase VRM. 32 core 64 threads on the other hand will eat up 18 phase VRM just fine.
> 
> We shall see in 2 days. Marking your words now.


We shall see then.. because the power increase from the 1700X to 2700X was like 10% if I remember correctly.

Threadripper 2000X might be using 25% more power to reach XFR default speeds. Overclocking would increase that even more.

(additional dies might require more memory channels, which they might need to change things to the threadripper mobo layout)


----------



## xkm1948

Tamalero said:


> We shall see then.. because the power increase from the 1700X to 2700X was like 10% if I remember correctly.
> 
> Threadripper 2000X might be using 25% more power to reach XFR default speeds. Overclocking would increase that even more.
> 
> (additional dies might require more memory channels, which they might need to change things to the threadripper mobo layout)




additional dies might require more memory channels, which they might need to change things to the threadripper mobo layout

Not necessarily. They can make the two additional dies only communicating to the dies connected with IMC. Thus every two dies share 2 channels of memory controller. Infinite fabric is pretty programmable and getting 32C work with quad channel is totally doable.


----------



## MNMadman

xkm1948 said:


> https://www.techpowerup.com/244806/...trageous-threadripper-motherboard-you-can-buy
> 
> 
> See these crazy VRMs? Yep. Threadripper 2 is definitely gonna have 32 core 64 threads.


That board is *very* disappointing.

The 19-phase VRM is impressive. The VRM cooling is most definitely *not*. I would much rather have a real finned heat sink on the VRM. And the heat pipe connecting to the heat sink on the left -- all that does is heat up that side of the board (the RAM specifically). My Taichi board did the same before I put the monoblock on it -- the left-side RAM got more than 20C hotter than the right-side RAM.

Also, the board is just fugly.

Hopefully, they make some changes before they release the board.


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> additional dies might require more memory channels, which they might need to change things to the threadripper mobo layout
> 
> Not necessarily. They can make the two additional dies only communicating to the dies connected with IMC. Thus every two dies share 2 channels of memory controller. Infinite fabric is pretty programmable and getting 32C work with quad channel is totally doable.


You know that sharing memory channels with a third die will affect its performance by.. like a lot?

So EVEN if threadripper manages to come and they come with more cores.. then they most probably will be using the 7nm EPYC. (and probably having 6 core or 8 core per module instead of the 4 core one)

thus 12 cores per Die.


----------



## mmonnin

TR 19xx chips were just 2x Ryzen 18xx chips on one package. I would expect the same for a 2950x CPU. And I still wouldn't buy an MSI board. I've read the entire thread and most of the complaints/returns were from MSI buyers.


----------



## SavantStrike

mmonnin said:


> TR 19xx chips were just 2x Ryzen 18xx chips on one package. I would expect the same for a 2950x CPU. And I still wouldn't buy an MSI board. I've read the entire thread and most of the complaints/returns were from MSI buyers.


I bought the gaming pro carbon x399 board and it convinced me I'm going to wait another 10 years before I try another MSI board.

The 2950X is also only going to be 16 cores, and will probably be on an x499 chipset with XFR2, unless AMD adds XFR2 to x399.


----------



## Tamalero

mmonnin said:


> TR 19xx chips were just 2x Ryzen 18xx chips on one package. I would expect the same for a 2950x CPU. And I still wouldn't buy an MSI board. I've read the entire thread and most of the complaints/returns were from MSI buyers.


Exactly, hence why there is like zero chance to see a 32core threadripper for now.
Unless of course.. if they end using EPYC 7nm chips.

They will most probably have the same config and sport 2800X binned chips.


----------



## betam4x

mmonnin said:


> TR 19xx chips were just 2x Ryzen 18xx chips on one package. I would expect the same for a 2950x CPU. And I still wouldn't buy an MSI board. I've read the entire thread and most of the complaints/returns were from MSI buyers.


Not quite, the 1950X (and presumably the 1920x and 1900x) all had lower memory and cache latencies, which is why they tend to perform better at gaming (when set up correctly via BIOS options).


----------



## Roaches

Well new X399 motherboards today are looking rather beefy compared to yesteryear. I wonder if Threadripper 2 isn't just a incremental improvement as we're expecting like the Ryzen 2000 series. Rumors are looming with more than 16 cores in other forums otherwise if not then these high phase count boards are just a marketing stunt to make you feel you're getting a high end product vs the actual needed functionality.






Gigabyte's new board is probably the closest thing they have that is comparable to ASUS's WS series board and its looking pretty good as shown in the video. Looking forward to what ASUS and ASRock has in their deck in the X399 refresh.


----------



## xkm1948

Roaches said:


> Well new X399 motherboards today are looking rather beefy compared to yesteryear. I wonder if Threadripper 2 isn't just a incremental improvement as we're expecting like the Ryzen 2000 series. Rumors are looming with more than 16 cores in other forums otherwise if not then these high phase count boards are just a marketing stunt to make you feel you're getting a high end product vs the actual needed functionality.
> 
> 
> 
> Gigabyte's new board is probably the closest thing they have that is comparable to ASUS's WS series board and its looking pretty good as shown in the video. Looking forward to what ASUS and ASRock has in their deck in the X399 refresh.



Yep. Now both MSI and Gigabyte has come out with crazy VRM X399 boards. Even Steve in that GN video said rumors are there will be 24core TR2 or even 32core TR2.

We shall see indeed.


----------



## Roaches

Gigabyte board doesn't look over-engineered in comparison to MSI's MEG Creation board. It looks very similar to their Aorus Gaming 7 with proper heatsinking to compensate load from next gen chips if clockspeed or core count increases while keeping the same amount of Vcore phases.
Only thing MSI got going for them right now is the incredible amount of marketing [email protected] they've done on that board if we're not seeing more than 16 cores in second gen. I mean compare to EPYC which 6 phases is pretty standard in server Vcore layouts. Tweaktown did a review of one board from Supermicro and the mosfets are beefy enough in 6 phases to handle current output of a 32 core package.

Well Jokes on me for getting an X399-A Prime early. Oh well I really don't need more than 16 cores on a single socket but hopefully Threadripper 2 will make 1st gen Threadripper drop in price.
Speculating on increased core count from AMD on the HEDT front would mean Intel would have come up with something very convincing otherwise their habbit of selling LLC Xeons as HEDT chips is coming to a close if not already. I don't think they can't even fit anything bigger than their 18 core HCC SKL-P die on an existing LGA 2066 package. LGA 3647 was made for that in addition to I/O features exclusive to such chips.
Meaning if the core bump is true in response to Intel 7980XE. We won't be seeing anything from Intel for a while unless if they plan to bring their monster LGA-3647 socket to superseed LGA-2066 X299 series. Intel's monolithic approach is already looking very expensive for them which is reflected on their server parts and high end HCC based HEDT parts .


----------



## Kana Chan

TDA21470 or ISL99227 for those 18+ phase vrms?


----------



## xkm1948

Intel just announced their new 28 core 56 threads HEDT CPU. Check TPU for news. Told ya Threadripper 2 would be 32 core 64 threads! Otherwise Intel would never go max out to 28 core


----------



## Roaches

Well well. Seems like my speculation isn't far off. As for X299 and Skylake-E its gonna have a fairly short life just like Broadwell-E now that this confirms LGA-3647 and 6 channels memory is coming to HEDT. This could mean Intel does know something we don't on Threadripper 2. Ain't competition amazing? It's incredible the amount of market correction we're witnessing in such a short mount of time since Ryzen's inception. 8 cores quickly became mainstream. 16 and 18 cores offerings from both sides and now a we're seeing fully fledged server parts into the HEDT scene. What a great time in the CPU space.


----------



## xkm1948

24 more hours and Tamalero will have to eat his words. Or I will have to eat my word. We shall see indeed. Now you just wish RTG is competing at the same level as Nvidia.

Question though. 28core56Threads at 5GHz or 32Core64Threads at 4GHz. Which one would you pick?


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> 24 more hours and Tamalero will have to eat his words. Or I will have to eat my word. We shall see indeed. Now you just wish RTG is competing at the same level as Nvidia.
> 
> Question though. 28core56Threads at 5GHz or 32Core64Threads at 4GHz. Which one would you pick?


I did not know this was a competition lol.

Id take the 32 core than 28 core at 5Ghz. If you'er talking about intel.. that thing will require insane cooling.


----------



## xkm1948

Most of the 1st gen X399 probably won’t be able to handle High Core Count TR2 due to lacking in VRM. At least not able to overclock much.


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> Most of the 1st gen X399 probably won’t be able to handle High Core Count TR2 due to lacking in VRM. At least not able to overclock much.


Meh, I still say its going to be a 16 core 4.6Ghz binned ryzen chips. Hence the huge VRM requirements (if each 2700X has a higher 10% power requirements than the 1700, this means each die will need 10% more, thats 20% for the 2, and lets say 5% more for the "package" ).
And there you go, 25% higher power requirements.

*edit*

Unless they really surprise us and give us EPYC style chips in a 6 + 6 + 6 + 6 configuration with a single channel each die..


----------



## Dotachin

xkm1948 said:


> Most of the 1st gen X399 probably won’t be able to handle High Core Count TR2 due to lacking in VRM. At least not able to overclock much.


A 8+4 pin can push 300W with ease. Just put a fan over the vrm.


----------



## MNMadman

*Heatripper Threadkiller*'s 1950X pulls 441W peak, with an average of around 400W according to HWiNFO64 while folding.

Apparently, the Taichi VRM can only handle 272 amps (I think that's the number). I've seen it pegged at that maximum amp value for minutes at a time, but it's never gone above that with any kind of stress test or real-world use.

It will be interesting to see what the current boards can do with Gen2 Threadripper chips. I won't be getting anything with more cores than my 1950X. I might wait for Threadripper Gen3 before upgrading.


----------



## Dotachin

MNMadman said:


> *Heatripper Threadkiller*'s 1950X pulls 441W peak, with an average of around 400W according to HWiNFO64 while folding.
> 
> Apparently, the Taichi VRM can only handle 272 amps (I think that's the number). I've seen it pegged at that maximum amp value for minutes at a time, but it's never gone above that with any kind of stress test or real-world use.
> 
> It will be interesting to see what the current boards can do with Gen2 Threadripper chips. I won't be getting anything with more cores than my 1950X. I might wait for Threadripper Gen3 before upgrading.


afaik the taichi has 8 vrms rated at 60A
8*60= 480A at 1.35V =648W absolute max but 8+4 pins would melt at that wattage (again afaik the 4 pin supplies 155 watts, and the 8 pin supplies 235 continuous watts = 390 watts)
never heard of a 1950X under air/water pulling 400+W


----------



## Roaches

xkm1948 said:


> 24 more hours and Tamalero will have to eat his words. Or I will have to eat my word. We shall see indeed. Now you just wish RTG is competing at the same level as Nvidia.
> 
> Question though. 28core56Threads at 5GHz or 32Core64Threads at 4GHz. Which one would you pick?


32 cores MCM one of course, likely will have a huge cost advantage vs Intel's Monolithic solution. I bet ya that 28 core Cascade Lake-E is gonna be around 5000 dollars best seeing where the 7980XE is currently positioned.

If AMD plays it right we could see Threadripper 2 topping around $1500 which is a pretty normal pricing we've seen on their past high end graphics products like the Radeon Pro Duo and 290X2 cards that peaked at that price.
Look in comparison to EPYC 7551P which is a little over 2000 dollars already if you can find one.


----------



## phas3d

mmonnin said:


> TR 19xx chips were just 2x Ryzen 18xx chips on one package. I would expect the same for a 2950x CPU. And I still wouldn't buy an MSI board. I've read the entire thread and most of the complaints/returns were from MSI buyers.


I have two MSI Carbon x399 boards and have no issues with them. One runs a 1920x and the other a 1950x and both are running stable at 4ghz with FlareX RAM at 3466mhz (or sometimes back down to 3200mhz and 14-14-14-34 timings). Just FYI


----------



## MNMadman

phas3d said:


> I have two MSI Carbon x399 boards and have no issues with them. One runs a 1920x and the other a 1950x and both are running stable at 4ghz with FlareX RAM at 3466mhz (or sometimes back down to 3200mhz and 14-14-14-34 timings). Just FYI


Not all of them are bad or have problems. But you are in the minority. Most of the owners here switched to other brands and were much happier.


----------



## mmonnin

phas3d said:


> I have two MSI Carbon x399 boards and have no issues with them. One runs a 1920x and the other a 1950x and both are running stable at 4ghz with FlareX RAM at 3466mhz (or sometimes back down to 3200mhz and 14-14-14-34 timings). Just FYI


Welcome to OCN.

Sure, they aren't all defective. There were just more complaints about the MSI TR board than other manufactures. Good to see a success esp with some higher memory clocks.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> *Heatripper Threadkiller*'s 1950X pulls 441W peak, with an average of around 400W according to HWiNFO64 while folding.
> 
> Apparently, the Taichi VRM can only handle 272 amps (I think that's the number). I've seen it pegged at that maximum amp value for minutes at a time, but it's never gone above that with any kind of stress test or real-world use.
> 
> It will be interesting to see what the current boards can do with Gen2 Threadripper chips. I won't be getting anything with more cores than my 1950X. I might wait for Threadripper Gen3 before upgrading.


That's all I've seen any board pull, including my old MSI.

We need better boards with better VRMs, and yes, Gen2 Threadripper chips would be great. I will probably build a Gen2 system with better memory, a better board, etc. and ebay this one.


----------



## betam4x

mmonnin said:


> Welcome to OCN.
> 
> Sure, they aren't all defective. There were just more complaints about the MSI TR board than other manufactures. Good to see a success esp with some higher memory clocks.


The MSI boards overclock great. I've been able to get stable results at much lower clocks then other boards. This board, for instance (ASUS ROG Strix X399-E) requires 1.3875V to be stable. The MSI board could go as low as 1.275.

The big issue with the MSI board is the buggy BIOS implementations throughout releases. I find ASUS's BIOS to be a mess though, and limited to say the least. For example, you can set the VID of the cores, but you can't control VID vdroop, only the total Vcore vdroop.

With the MSI, setting LLC to level 3 resulted in no vdroop at all on my system.

By the way, if anyone is interested in how messed up my MSI board's socket is, take a look at this pic.


----------



## adam3234

xkm1948 said:


> Question though. 28core56Threads at 5GHz or 32Core64Threads at 4GHz. Which one would you pick?


If that 28core56Threads at 5GHz can be properly air cooled and does not have spectre and meltdown vulnerabilities and is reasonably priced then I'm going with the 28core56Threads at 5GHz.


----------



## mmonnin

adam3234 said:


> If that 28core56Threads at 5GHz can be properly air cooled and does not have spectre and meltdown vulnerabilities and is reasonably priced then I'm going with the 28core56Threads at 5GHz.


Maybe with a jet engine's worth of CFM. But no. TDP at half the clock speed is 205W. At least double the wattage for double the frequency and I doubt they did it at stock voltage. So multiply the voltage increase and the current losses at the higher speeds/temps and it'll be well out of air cooling range. Some have pushed lower core counts to 1kW. Now add in more cores.

https://www.intel.com/content/www/u...alable/platinum-processors/platinum-8180.html

At $10.5k for stock CPU only, might as well go Epyc.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> If that 28core56Threads at 5GHz can be properly air cooled and does not have spectre and meltdown vulnerabilities and is reasonably priced then I'm going with the 28core56Threads at 5GHz.


Doubt we will see 28 cores at all.


----------



## OrionBG

Dotachin said:


> afaik the taichi has 8 vrms rated at 60A
> 8*60= 480A at 1.35V =648W absolute max but 8+4 pins would melt at that wattage (again afaik the 4 pin supplies 155 watts, and the 8 pin supplies 235 continuous watts = 390 watts)
> never heard of a 1950X under air/water pulling 400+W


You are forgetting something maybe?  Some 24pin cable for instance? It supplies a lot of power too! Add about 150W to 200w more to the total.
Also, nowadays everything is drawing more than spec so those numbers are just on paper. For instance my 1080ti with the XOC BIOS is drawing up to 600W from a 6 pin and 8 pin connectors and the PCI-E slot. None of the cables is getting hot. And Yes, it is drawing that much as my HX1000i PSU is confirming the load.


----------



## Dotachin

OrionBG said:


> You are forgetting something maybe?  Some 24pin cable for instance? It supplies a lot of power too! Add about 150W to 200w more to the total.
> Also, nowadays everything is drawing more than spec so those numbers are just on paper. For instance my 1080ti with the XOC BIOS is drawing up to 600W from a 6 pin and 8 pin connectors and the PCI-E slot. None of the cables is getting hot. And Yes, it is drawing that much as my HX1000i PSU is confirming the load.


TIL
Thanks.
I thought the vrms needed a completely separate power source. Otherwise the locked dual cores needing a 4pin didn't make any sense.


----------



## Roaches

32 Cores its official!


----------



## xkm1948

Roaches said:


> 32 Cores its official!


EAT YOUR WORDS Tamalero!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



OHHHH MAN THIS FEELS SO GOOD. Where are the doubters now huh?


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> EAT YOUR WORDS Tamalero!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> OHHHH MAN THIS FEELS SO GOOD. Where are the doubters now huh?


I am eating my words. I'm surprised they went all out.

Now to wonder how the hell they will arrange the memory channels to allow 4 dies.

I guess they will split the memory lanes into 2/2/2/2 configuration (2 modules per die for dual channel for each die)

*edit*

Nevermind. Anandtech claims that 2 dies will not have direct memory access and that AMD tweaked infinity fabric to avoid heavy impacts in latency to these 2 dies.

What is surprising is the BIG jump from TDP from 180W to 250W. Makes me wonder how fast the cores will be.


----------



## xkm1948

Tamalero said:


> I am eating my words. I'm surprised they went all out.
> 
> Now to wonder how the hell they will arrange the memory channels to allow 4 dies.
> 
> I guess they will split the memory lanes into 2/2/2/2 configuration (2 modules per die for dual channel for each die)
> 
> *edit*
> 
> Nevermind. Anandtech claims that 2 dies will not have direct memory access and that AMD tweaked infinity fabric to avoid heavy impacts in latency to these 2 dies.
> 
> What is surprising is the BIG jump from TDP from 180W to 250W. Makes me wonder how fast the cores will be.



I say 4.3~4.4GHz max single core boost. All core max turbo at 3.6~3.7GHz probably. The super beefy 18 phase VRM on these crazy 2nd gen X399 should allow overlocking of a 32core64threads to a full 4GHz all core OC.


----------



## adam3234

xkm1948 said:


> I say 4.3~4.4GHz max single core boost. All core max turbo at 3.6~3.7GHz probably. The super beefy 18 phase VRM on these crazy 2nd gen X399 should allow overlocking of a 32core64threads to a full 4GHz all core OC.


That sounds about right.

@0:27... so Samsung b-die ICs can handle 1.6 volts?


----------



## Yamie

betam4x said:


> By the way, if anyone is interested in how messed up my MSI board's socket is, take a look at this pic.



****, this looks like 1-3 hours of work >.<


----------



## phas3d

mmonnin said:


> Welcome to OCN.
> 
> Sure, they aren't all defective. There were just more complaints about the MSI TR board than other manufactures. Good to see a success esp with some higher memory clocks.


I get that but when I went to purchase a board most of the other boards had worse ratings than the MSI board and the MSI was cheaper. Maybe I did luck out.


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> I say 4.3~4.4GHz max single core boost. All core max turbo at 3.6~3.7GHz probably. The super beefy 18 phase VRM on these crazy 2nd gen X399 should allow overlocking of a 32core64threads to a full 4GHz all core OC.


Anandtech speculates, but the demo versions supposedly only have a base clock of 3Ghz and a turbo of 3.4Ghz all core (which is consistent with the 1950X )


----------



## xkm1948

The demonstration 32c64t monster is only an engineering sample. I am fairly certain retail TR2 will have better frequency.


----------



## ssateneth

adam3234 said:


> That sounds about right.
> 
> @0:27... so Samsung b-die ICs can handle 1.6 volts? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6MWXtmcO5I


they can handle 1.9v (yes 1.9v) just fine. just keep them close to ambient. RAM does not take a lot of power by any means. I have single sided b die @ 4000MT/sec 1.5v (1.53v sensor) and they're only about 17c above ambient with almost no airflow. power sensors only show 6.5 watts peak between both DIMMs. that's nothing.


----------



## betam4x

Can anyone explain to me just what the heck this means? This is a reply I got from MSI support:

"bent pins are not covered under warranty it is considered physical damage. we can process a rma and when it come in they can offer you a replacement recertified board for a charge of 45.00. but we will not be able to exchange a board with bent pins but you can pay $45 for a replacement recertified board"

Are they saying I can pay $45 for a replacement recertified board or that I can't? 

EDIT: If they will allow me to replace my board for $45 with a re-certified board for $45, I'm all over that. MSI might just get off my **** list...


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Anandtech speculates, but the demo versions supposedly only have a base clock of 3Ghz and a turbo of 3.4Ghz all core (which is consistent with the 1950X )


The 1950X has a BASE of 3.4 and a BOOST of 4.0. XFR brings it up to 4.2.


----------



## OrionBG

Soo... It seems that there wont be an X499 chipset (at least not for TR 2xxx) this year...
All those new TR4 boards at Computex are still on X399


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> Can anyone explain to me just what the heck this means? This is a reply I got from MSI support:
> 
> "bent pins are not covered under warranty it is considered physical damage. we can process a rma and when it come in they can offer you a replacement recertified board for a charge of 45.00. but we will not be able to exchange a board with bent pins but you can pay $45 for a replacement recertified board"
> 
> Are they saying I can pay $45 for a replacement recertified board or that I can't?
> 
> EDIT: If they will allow me to replace my board for $45 with a re-certified board for $45, I'm all over that. MSI might just get off my **** list...


They're saying they can't do an RMA and give you a free replacement board (you know, like an RMA is supposed to be). They CAN do the RMA and have you pay an extra $45 to get a refurbished replacement board.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> They're saying they can't do an RMA and give you a free replacement board (you know, like an RMA is supposed to be). They CAN do the RMA and have you pay an extra $45 to get a refurbished replacement board.


Thanks! That is fine by me. This ASUS board has barely managed a stable 4 GHz overclock. The MSI board could hit 4.2 or 4.3. I suspect this is partially due to a stronger VRM implementation and partially due to the MSI board not allowing the CPU VID to drop as much. This may also explain why so many are claiming to need absurdly high voltages to hit 4.0Ghz. Regardless I will RMA it, pay the $45, and do a side by side comparison.

EDIT: To those wondering why such a comparison is needed, it is to prove that the motherboard BIOS/UEFI can make a world of difference for overclocking and ASUS boards aren't the greatest at it.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> Thanks! That is fine by me. This ASUS board has barely managed a stable 4 GHz overclock. The MSI board could hit 4.2 or 4.3. I suspect this is partially due to a stronger VRM implementation and partially due to the MSI board not allowing the CPU VID to drop as much. This may also explain why so many are claiming to need absurdly high voltages to hit 4.0Ghz. Regardless I will RMA it, pay the $45, and do a side by side comparison.
> 
> EDIT: To those wondering why such a comparison is needed, it is to prove that the motherboard BIOS/UEFI can make a world of difference for overclocking and ASUS boards aren't the greatest at it.


Can you please do this test if you have time. Overclock the CPU and RAM on both boards so they are Cinebench stable on both boards. Run Cinebench 100 times (or however amount of time is available to you ) with 32 threads on both boards and record the min, max and average scores use Ryzen Timing Checker and take a screen shot of it for both boards. This test will reveal if one of the boards is incorrectly reporting CPU speeds e.g. if on the ASUS board you have CPU running at 4 Ghz and on the MSI board you have the CPU running at 4.3 Ghz but their Cinebench scores are very similar then you can be very sure that one of the boards is reporting the CPU speed wrong. If one of the boards is reporting the speeds wrong, to figure out which board is wrong we need someone with a different motherboard (i.e. not ASUS or MSI) and do 2 test running Cinebench 100 times per test (or however amount of time is available to that person ), one test will replicate the CPU speed and memory configuration from ASUS board setup and the other test will replicate the CPU speed and memory configuration from MSI board setup. If the other person's ASUS configuration Cinebench scores are similar to your ASUS board's scored then it is likely the ASUS board is reporting the CPU speed correctly and if the other person's MSI configuration Cinebench scores are similar to your MSI board's score then it is likely the MSI board is reporting the CPU speed correctly. If the other person's CPU scores is very different to both the ASUS and MSI board then it could be that all boards are reporting the speeds wrong or all boards are reporting the speeds right or something in between i.e. result is inconclusive and need more participants to get conclusive results.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> Can you please do this test if you have time. Overclock the CPU and RAM on both boards so they are Cinebench stable on both boards. Run Cinebench 100 times (or however amount of time is available to you ) with 32 threads on both boards and record the min, max and average scores use Ryzen Timing Checker and take a screen shot of it for both boards. This test will reveal if one of the boards is incorrectly reporting CPU speeds e.g. if on the ASUS board you have CPU running at 4 Ghz and on the MSI board you have the CPU running at 4.3 Ghz but their Cinebench scores are very similar then you can be very sure that one of the boards is reporting the CPU speed wrong. If one of the boards is reporting the speeds wrong, to figure out which board is wrong we need someone with a different motherboard (i.e. not ASUS or MSI) and do 2 test running Cinebench 100 times per test (or however amount of time is available to that person ), one test will replicate the CPU speed and memory configuration from ASUS board setup and the other test will replicate the CPU speed and memory configuration from MSI board setup. If the other person's ASUS configuration Cinebench scores are similar to your ASUS board's scored then it is likely the ASUS board is reporting the CPU speed correctly and if the other person's MSI configuration Cinebench scores are similar to your MSI board's score then it is likely the MSI board is reporting the CPU speed correctly. If the other person's CPU scores is very different to both the ASUS and MSI board then it could be that all boards are reporting the speeds wrong or all boards are reporting the speeds right or something in between i.e. result is inconclusive and need more participants to get conclusive results.


I've already done something similar, the ASUS board scored significantly LOWER cinebench scores. I will post a side by side comparison when I get my replacement board back (or if I can dig up old pics, I can use those). I do recall that my CPU VID voltages were much better under the MSI board. Setting an LLC of level 3 I believe left both VCore and CPU VID close together. I will try to dig up some pics demonstrating the behavior.


----------



## betam4x

betam4x said:


> I've already done something similar, the ASUS board scored significantly LOWER cinebench scores. I will post a side by side comparison when I get my replacement board back (or if I can dig up old pics, I can use those). I do recall that my CPU VID voltages were much better under the MSI board. Setting an LLC of level 3 I believe left both VCore and CPU VID close together. I will try to dig up some pics demonstrating the behavior.


It looks like it has to do with the way setting CPU Core Voltage works on the MSI vs the ASUS boards. Setting the core voltage on the MSI board ends up setting the core voltage close to whatever you set. For example, depending on LLC (let's say auto, to leave LLC out of it), setting a voltage to 1.25 might result in a 1.242 or 1.262 core voltage. In addition, LLC on the MSI boards also increases CPU VID when under load. This does NOT behave the same way under the ASUS board. I will edit this post with results from my ASUS board shortly.


----------



## betam4x

The MSI LLC setting does not let the CPU VIDs drop below the VCore by much if at all. When you set the VCore on the MSI board, LLC will allow some vdroop depending on on the setting, but the VIDs of the individual cores will always stay close to what the VCore droops to. On the ASUS board, the VIDs will still drastically drop below their original values when under load. This is despite the fact that you can attempt to override the via P-State overclocking. This makes pretty much any ASUS board a poor candidate for overclocking. Many people think that the VIDs are simply there to 'fool' the CPU into thinking what it needs. This is not the case. I can provide some photographic evidence of this, but I will be RMAing my MSI board tomorrow and would rather test the two side by side. Also note that any other board that does not use MSI's method for overclocking will suffer from this issue. This explains why so many people think that their chips require ridiculously high voltages to achieve stable overclocks.

If anyone has any further input to share on this, I'd love to hear. I'm one of the unique few that has owned more than one Threadripper board, much less an MSI (least popular brand?) and an ASUS (most popular brand?). This is exactly why I'm starting a hardware site. Issues like these need to be rooted out by reviewers. Very few people actually dive beyond shell deep these days.

EDIT: It is currently unknown whether or not this is an issue on Gen2 Ryzen/Threadripper boards. I have not picked up a 2700X due to being out of work due to surgery, but DUE plan on picking up a 2nd gen Threadripper. I also hope on picking up an MSI board and an ASUS board for comparison. I will use these along with a comparable Intel set of boards/CPUs to launch my site. The site in question will be entirely self funded and will rely on premium users, ads, and Patreon users to stay afloat. Like previous sites I've started, the goal is non-profit. Hosting + Domain + etc. costs, and a bit of salary for myself for the trouble.


----------



## MNMadman

So, if the Asus boards are so poor for overclocking due to their "inferiority" with the VID, why aren't MSI boards being used to get overclocking world records left and right? If nobody else has this, then MSI should be able to win with one hand tied behind its back, right?

I don't think the VID has the effect you are attributing to it. My CPU's VID hasn't gone above 1.125v since I set it to do P-State overclocking, which was yesterday for another poster on another forum. Yet it's still perfectly stable at 4GHz with 1.35v actual Vcore. And yes I have applied full load with several gaming sessions and CPU stress programs. I don't recall ever seeing VID match Vcore on any board I've ever owned. I might be wrong though.

Edit: And when I set a fixed voltage with a fixed overclock (40 x 101 at 1.35v or 41 x 101 at 1.36875v with SMT disabled), the VID still isn't anywhere close. I think it was at 1.544v the last time I paid attention.


----------



## Eusbwoa18

*Thought on upgrade*

So I'm beginning to consider upgrading my Intel 5820K/Asus x99 package. Would a threadripper 1920X be a worthy upgrade? If so, who has the best motherboard for threadripper right now?

I have heard so many horror stories about ram compatibility and overclocking I wanted to reach out to the folks that have already been down the road and hopefully avoid problems that others have already had.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions/advice.


----------



## Dotachin

pgdeaner said:


> So I'm beginning to consider upgrading my Intel 5820K/Asus x99 package. Would a threadripper 1920X be a worthy upgrade? If so, who has the best motherboard for threadripper right now?
> 
> I have heard so many horror stories about ram compatibility and overclocking I wanted to reach out to the folks that have already been down the road and hopefully avoid problems that others have already had.
> 
> Thanks in advance for any suggestions/advice.


I'd wait 3 more months for the 2000 series and a lower price per core :thumb:


----------



## SavantStrike

pgdeaner said:


> So I'm beginning to consider upgrading my Intel 5820K/Asus x99 package. Would a threadripper 1920X be a worthy upgrade? If so, who has the best motherboard for threadripper right now?
> 
> I have heard so many horror stories about ram compatibility and overclocking I wanted to reach out to the folks that have already been down the road and hopefully avoid problems that others have already had.
> 
> Thanks in advance for any suggestions/advice.


Best board?

X399 Taichi or X399 Fatal1ty have had excellent bios support and excellent VRMs. The Apex has had some rougher starts on the BIOS front but is also a good choice (for considerably more money and similar performance).

As for if it's worth it, what clock speed is your 5820K running at, and do you have applications that will consistently scale beyond 6C/12t to 12C/24T that wouldn't scale to 16C/32T. The 1950X regularly goes on sale for the release price of the 1920X and has 33 percent more threads and clocks almost identically.

Also keep in mind that Threadripper 2 comes out in Q3, so if you can hold out, expect more cores and a 5 percent boost in clock speed for the same or less money.


----------



## Eusbwoa18

*Thanks! VMware anyone?*

I appreciate the suggestions. 

I use VMWare workstation quite a bit and run multiple VMs so the extra cores would be nice. Anyone have experience with threadripper and VMware workstation?


----------



## Dotachin

pgdeaner said:


> I appreciate the suggestions.
> 
> I use VMWare workstation quite a bit and run multiple VMs so the extra cores would be nice. Anyone have experience with threadripper and VMware workstation?


I've got only the free player version I use for one VM, to share linux distros :h34r-smi It works fine.


----------



## Eusbwoa18

*Cool*

It should work then. I have a linux box that streams some discord services and some test VMs. Nothing too crazy.

Thanks!



Dotachin said:


> I've got only the free player version I use for one VM, to share linux distros :h34r-smi It works fine.


----------



## nycgtr

pgdeaner said:


> I appreciate the suggestions.
> 
> I use VMWare workstation quite a bit and run multiple VMs so the extra cores would be nice. Anyone have experience with threadripper and VMware workstation?


Haven't had any issues with vmware workstation, esxi can require a work around for pass thrus but I think theres a newer patch or something now. Hyper-v enhanced session use to bug out. Not sure about now.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> So, if the Asus boards are so poor for overclocking due to their "inferiority" with the VID, why aren't MSI boards being used to get overclocking world records left and right? If nobody else has this, then MSI should be able to win with one hand tied behind its back, right?
> 
> I don't think the VID has the effect you are attributing to it. My CPU's VID hasn't gone above 1.125v since I set it to do P-State overclocking, which was yesterday for another poster on another forum. Yet it's still perfectly stable at 4GHz with 1.35v actual Vcore. And yes I have applied full load with several gaming sessions and CPU stress programs. I don't recall ever seeing VID match Vcore on any board I've ever owned. I might be wrong though.
> 
> Edit: And when I set a fixed voltage with a fixed overclock (40 x 101 at 1.35v or 41 x 101 at 1.36875v with SMT disabled), the VID still isn't anywhere close. I think it was at 1.544v the last time I paid attention.


I seem to recall an MSI being used on the LN2 demos. Which board do you have? The Zenith Extreme? Does it have an 8+8 power connector? What is the VRM configuration (if you know what it is off hand).

I've never had over 1.425 on my VIDs. I am genuinely trying to get to the bottom of this. My MSI could do 4.15 in it's sleep, 4.2 would throttle under 16 cores running prime95, but it was stable otherwise, and I could get to 4.3 or 4.4 by cranking the voltage...but it was missing P-State overclocking. This board can't get a stable 4.1 without excessive voltages. I am going to RMA my MSI as soon as I find the cap for the pins. I'll use the same CPU for each. However, my CPU could do 1.25 or 1.275 on my MSI...due to the vdroop on the VIDs (it drops to 1.xxx the ASUS) crashes/locks hard under prime95. The MSI stabilizes everything to a similar voltage. I'll post some stats soon.

EDIT: Or maybe I'm just doing something wrong? I'm willing to consider that possibility. However, LLC3 (70% LLC) @ 1.275 gave me absolute solid stability. VCore was slightly different (1.275 would be 1.288, but would be static under load for instance). On this board, setting VCore to 1.275 results in a vcore of 1.213.


----------



## phas3d

pgdeaner said:


> So I'm beginning to consider upgrading my Intel 5820K/Asus x99 package. Would a threadripper 1920X be a worthy upgrade? If so, who has the best motherboard for threadripper right now?
> 
> I have heard so many horror stories about ram compatibility and overclocking I wanted to reach out to the folks that have already been down the road and hopefully avoid problems that others have already had.
> 
> Thanks in advance for any suggestions/advice.


I have a 5820k/Asus x99 and two Threadripper systems running at home. Multi-threaded is obviously much much better on the Threadripper. Single proc performance? Not sure but SuperPi scores are about the same. All systems currently running at 4ghz. Just FYI. I can run a particular test if you want me to.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> I seem to recall an MSI being used on the LN2 demos. Which board do you have? The Zenith Extreme? Does it have an 8+8 power connector? What is the VRM configuration (if you know what it is off hand).
> 
> I've never had over 1.425 on my VIDs. I am genuinely trying to get to the bottom of this. My MSI could do 4.15 in it's sleep, 4.2 would throttle under 16 cores running prime95, but it was stable otherwise, and I could get to 4.3 or 4.4 by cranking the voltage...but it was missing P-State overclocking. This board can't get a stable 4.1 without excessive voltages. I am going to RMA my MSI as soon as I find the cap for the pins. I'll use the same CPU for each. However, my CPU could do 1.25 or 1.275 on my MSI...due to the vdroop on the VIDs (it drops to 1.xxx the ASUS) crashes/locks hard under prime95. The MSI stabilizes everything to a similar voltage. I'll post some stats soon.
> 
> EDIT: Or maybe I'm just doing something wrong? I'm willing to consider that possibility. However, LLC3 (70% LLC) @ 1.275 gave me absolute solid stability. VCore was slightly different (1.275 would be 1.288, but would be static under load for instance). On this board, setting VCore to 1.275 results in a vcore of 1.213.


*Heatripper Threadkiller* has the ASRock Taichi board. 8+4 power connectors, 8 CPU VRM + 3 SOC VRM phases (IR35201 controller and IR3555 60A power stages for CPU and same for SOC).


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> *Heatripper Threadkiller* has the ASRock Taichi board. 8+4 power connectors, 8 CPU VRM + 3 SOC VRM phases (IR35201 controller and IR3555 60A power stages for CPU and same for SOC).


Well that's why, you have an ASROCK board. 

This is an ASUS board and I suspect the the BIOS is (once again) buggy. Setting the VCore to 1.275 results in a 1.213 VCore. I might try to downgrade the BIOS if I can find another floating around.


----------



## betam4x

nycgtr said:


> Haven't had any issues with vmware workstation, esxi can require a work around for pass thrus but I think theres a newer patch or something now. Hyper-v enhanced session use to bug out. Not sure about now.


You can also use unRAID.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> Well that's why, you have an ASROCK board.
> 
> This is an ASUS board and I suspect the the BIOS is (once again) buggy. Setting the VCore to 1.275 results in a 1.213 VCore. I might try to downgrade the BIOS if I can find another floating around.




All of my voltages read a little bit higher than they are set in the BIOS. 1.35v gets 1.36v Vcore, 1.00v gets 1.025v SOC, the 1.8v (I forget what it's called) gets 1.84v, 1.35v RAM gets 1.352v, etc. The Vcore and SOC do droop a bit under load (Vcore goes down to 1.344v and SOC goes down to 1.012v)


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> ...The Zenith Extreme? Does it have an 8+8 power connector? What is the VRM configuration (if you know what it is off hand).


I'm using the Zenith Extreme. It has two 8 pin EPS power connectors, 8 phase VCORE VRM using IR3555 60A power stages with an ASP1405 controller and a 3 phase SOC VRM using CSD9737 25A power stages with an ASP1405 controller.

EDIT: I just found a thread about X399 VRMs. This looks interesting http://www.overclock.net/forum/11-amd-motherboards/1635296-amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread.html


----------



## gupsterg

betam4x said:


> Well that's why, you have an ASROCK board.
> 
> This is an ASUS board and I suspect the the BIOS is (once again) buggy. Setting the VCore to 1.275 results in a 1.213 VCore. I might try to downgrade the BIOS if I can find another floating around.


LLC is loose on this platform. ASUS boards [Auto] is AMD stock spec. Own C6H, C7H and ZE, wouldn't change them for another board at all. All are launch boards.

C6H on best sample of Ryzen 7 gen 1 gets me 4.0GHz on air, stock LLC. I set a VID of 1.387V in UEFI for PState 0 and based on what is loading CPU, VCORE will vary, which is what load line effect is/does.

https://i.imgur.com/pjjGeCk.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/ZmkMU5W.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/2th7yLk.jpg

C7H again LLC: [Auto], ie MEGA VDROOP, which is technically how AMD spec is/want to counteract overshoot. 4.1GHz 1.318V VID in UEFI for PState 0.

https://i.imgur.com/PRSywGp.jpg

On ZE I usually don't do a CPU OC, only RAM. Again luv the UEFI layout, options, etc. Recently bought another set of G.Skill RAM, reckon it's my best sample of Samsung B die so far. It needs the least VDIMM compared with my other sets for 3466MHz. Initial testing was SOC: 1.062V VDIMM: 1.37V VTT: 0.687V, been able to shave VDIMM to 1.365V in UEFI.

https://i.imgur.com/kp3E7Bn.jpg

An Image below I placed regarding load line in another thread.



Spoiler


----------



## betam4x

gupsterg said:


> LLC is loose on this platform. ASUS boards [Auto] is AMD stock spec. Own C6H, C7H and ZE, wouldn't change them for another board at all. All are launch boards.
> 
> C6H on best sample of Ryzen 7 gen 1 gets me 4.0GHz on air, stock LLC. I set a VID of 1.387V in UEFI for PState 0 and based on what is loading CPU, VCORE will vary, which is what load line effect is/does.
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/pjjGeCk.jpg
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/ZmkMU5W.jpg
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/2th7yLk.jpg
> 
> C7H again LLC: [Auto], ie MEGA VDROOP, which is technically how AMD spec is/want to counteract overshoot. 4.1GHz 1.318V VID in UEFI for PState 0.
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/PRSywGp.jpg
> 
> On ZE I usually don't do a CPU OC, only RAM. Again luv the UEFI layout, options, etc. Recently bought another set of G.Skill RAM, reckon it's my best sample of Samsung B die so far. It needs the least VDIMM compared with my other sets for 3466MHz. Initial testing was SOC: 1.062V VDIMM: 1.37V VTT: 0.687V, been able to shave VDIMM to 1.365V in UEFI.
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/kp3E7Bn.jpg
> 
> An Image below I placed regarding load line in another thread.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler


Yes, it's AMAZING how much droop this board has. No wonder people claim they can't get 4.0 GHz at decent voltages. As we all know, voltage and load/frequencies = heat. on my MSI board I could get away with 1.25 (and eventually 1.275 after abusing the hell out of the chip with high voltages) which allowed me to get away with Prime95 128 ffts or small settings and not even come close to 68 degrees on my enermax360 AiO. All of the options are nice, but what good are the options if they can't match a competitors board. I bet nearly every Threadripper 1950X can do 4.2 GHz at or below 1.475V and 4.1 at 1.35V given a decent board.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> I'm using the Zenith Extreme. It has two 8 pin EPS power connectors, 8 phase VCORE VRM using IR3555 60A power stages with an ASP1405 controller and a 3 phase SOC VRM using CSD9737 25A power stages with an ASP1405 controller.
> 
> EDIT: I just found a thread about X399 VRMs. This looks interesting http://www.overclock.net/forum/11-amd-motherboards/1635296-amd-x399-socket-tr4-vrm-thread.html


The MSI has 10, I'm definitely going to work on the RMA process. I am unsure of what to do with this board. I may ebay it, or I may build another system depending on the requirements for the 2xxx series.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> The MSI has 10, I'm definitely going to work on the RMA process. I am unsure of what to do with this board. I may ebay it, or I may build another system depending on the requirements for the 2xxx series.


The reason why I bought the Zenith Extreme was because it looked like the best option for upgrading to a later Threadripper model (I'm planning on buying Zen 2+ 4950x, as long as it can be air cooled). For this reason I choose the Zenith Extreme mainly for its two 8 pin EPS power connectors and the active VRM cooling. Not sure whether 8 phase VRM+active cooling is the better idea compared to 10 phase VRM with no active cooling but I really want the two 8 pin power connectors.


----------



## Mara25x

Anyone know if the Zenith Extreme will support TR2 to it's full potential?

I want to keep my existing water cool configuration and just upgrade the cpu.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


----------



## adam3234

Mara25x said:


> Anyone know if the Zenith Extreme will support TR2 to it's full potential?
> 
> I want to keep my existing water cool configuration and just upgrade the cpu.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Until they release the 2950x we won't know what it can overclock to and what power is needed for those over clocks. As the Zenith Extreme is right now it is more than capable of accommodating the 2950x at default speeds using 250 watts(which is what is was reported to run at non overclocked). From my research one 8 pin EPS power connector is capable of handling 336 watts (see http://www.playtool.com/pages/psuconnectors/connectors.html#eps8 for more info). Since the Zenith Extreme has two 8 pin EPS connect it should in theory be able to handle 672 watts. The VCORE VRMs use eight 60A MOSFETs for CPU power distribution so assuming that the 2950x takes 1.425 volts(max recommended Threadripper VCORE) then in theory the the Zenith Extreme's VCORE VRM should be able to handle 684 watts (if that can bee cooled). So in theory the Zenith Extreme should be able to handle an overclocking from the 2950x if it doesn't take more than 672 watts but in practice energy is loss through heat so that would bring down that 672 watt figure depending on the cooling. I have a feeling that VRM thermals might be the biggest limiting factor to overclocking the 2950x on the Zenith Extreme. Hope that ASUS release a replacement for the Zenith Extreme's VRM cooling solution. I want one that actually has aluminium fins.

Edit: Is there an Electrical/Computer Engineer here that can verify those figures?
Edit: here's the datasheet for the Zenith Extreme's MOSFETs https://www.infineon.com/dgdl/pb-ir3555.pdf?fileId=5546d462533600a40153567fd3ac28d3 "Output voltage range from 0.25V up to 5.5V and Output current capability of 60A" so each MOSFETs can handle between 15 watts to 330 watts.


----------



## gupsterg

betam4x said:


> Yes, it's AMAZING how much droop this board has. No wonder people claim they can't get 4.0 GHz at decent voltages. As we all know, voltage and load/frequencies = heat. on my MSI board I could get away with 1.25 (and eventually 1.275 after abusing the hell out of the chip with high voltages) which allowed me to get away with Prime95 128 ffts or small settings and not even come close to 68 degrees on my enermax360 AiO. All of the options are nice, but what good are the options if they can't match a competitors board. I bet nearly every Threadripper 1950X can do 4.2 GHz at or below 1.475V and 4.1 at 1.35V given a decent board.


I think my post was not understood as I meant it to be.

AMD specify load line.

ASUS board LLC is as AMD specify.

You can change LLC, so set voltage is what is given, but then you will create overshoot (which all boards will have). This overshoot occurs very fast, software monitoring and digital multimeter may not capture it.

You may find these links helpful:-

http://www.overclock.net/forum/25934493-post88.html
http://www.overclock.net/forum/25949959-post4110.html
http://www.overclock.net/forum/25974018-post6010.html

Using higher values of LLC or not as AMD specify gives people the "idea" they are using lower voltage, when in reality they are not.

As said before I have no issue with how LLC is on ASUS boards. I have had 4.0GHz on 1800X with stock LLC using C6H. I have had 4.1GHz on 2700X with stock LLC using C7H. 3.9GHz is about where my TR tops out with 1.325V IIRC, again stock LLC, I just find TR is better for at stock, but RAM OC'd.


----------



## betam4x

gupsterg said:


> I think my post was not understood as I meant it to be.
> 
> AMD specify load line.
> 
> ASUS board LLC is as AMD specify.
> 
> You can change LLC, so set voltage is what is given, but then you will create overshoot (which all boards will have). This overshoot occurs very fast, software monitoring and digital multimeter may not capture it.
> 
> You may find these links helpful:-
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/forum/25934493-post88.html
> http://www.overclock.net/forum/25949959-post4110.html
> http://www.overclock.net/forum/25974018-post6010.html
> 
> Using higher values of LLC or not as AMD specify gives people the "idea" they are using lower voltage, when in reality they are not.
> 
> As said before I have no issue with how LLC is on ASUS boards. I have had 4.0GHz on 1800X with stock LLC using C6H. I have had 4.1GHz on 2700X with stock LLC using C7H. 3.9GHz is about where my TR tops out with 1.325V IIRC, again stock LLC, I just find TR is better for at stock, but RAM OC'd.


IIRC modern day CPUs are designed to deal with overshoot unless you crank up the voltage super high. 4.0 @ 1.25V at LLC3 should not create a high enough of a spike to matter. (LLC is inverse on the MSI, so Level 3 is like level 6 on other boards.)

On this ASUS board (ROG X399-E) LLC does not appear to play any significant role anyway. This brings me back to my original point. Some brands handle LLC better than others. I bet if half the people who claim their Threadripper needs 1.3+V for 4.0 GHz on an ASUS board tried it on an MSI, they would discover that they could hit 4.0 at a much lower voltage (or 4.1 at 1.35V). This is because the MSI board appears to handle power delivery much better than the ASUS board I have now. I was originally not happy at the MSI board, but now that I've had a taste of the quality of this board, I am going back to the MSI.

EDIT: Correction.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

betam4x said:


> IIRC modern day CPUs are designed to deal with overshoot unless you crank up the voltage super high. 4.0 @ 1.25V at LLC3 should not create a high enough of a spike to matter. (LLC is inverse on the MSI, so Level 3 is like level 6 on other boards.)
> 
> On this ASUS board (ROG X399-E) LLC does not appear to play any significant role anyway. This brings me back to my original point. Some brands handle LLC better than others. I bet if half the people who claim their Threadripper needs 1.3+V for 4.0 GHz on an ASUS board tried it on an MSI, they would discover that they could hit 4.0 at a much lower voltage (or 4.1 at 1.35V). This is because the MSI board appears to handle power delivery much better than the ASUS board I have now. I was originally not happy at the MSI board, but now that I've had a taste of the quality of this board, I am going back to the MSI.
> 
> EDIT: Correction.


some boards lie like crazy on what voltage they are actually delivering... I forget who it was, but one of the tech press (gamers nexus I think) showed with a multimeter how bad certain boards overshot the stated voltage... one board was an enter .1 over what was showing via board sensors... don't know if that is the case here or not, but food for thought.


edit: found it... 



 don't know if this is applicable here or not...but maybe?


----------



## adam3234

Minotaurtoo said:


> some boards lie like crazy on what voltage they are actually delivering... I forget who it was, but one of the tech press (gamers nexus I think) showed with a multimeter how bad certain boards overshot the stated voltage... one board was an enter .1 over what was showing via board sensors... don't know if that is the case here or not, but food for thought.


I've already mentioned this to @betam4x and I also added that if they are reporting the voltages incorrectly, they could also be reporting the CPU speeds incorrectly. That's why I suggested doing that big test to figure out whether the mother boards are reporting the CPU speeds incorrectly and if they are which motherboards are reporting them incorrectly.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

adam3234 said:


> I've already mentioned this to @*betam4x* and I also added that if they are reporting the voltages incorrectly, they could also be reporting the CPU speeds incorrectly. That's why I suggested doing that big test to figure out whether the mother boards are reporting the CPU speeds incorrectly and if they are which motherboards are reporting them incorrectly.


 my bad, didn't know you had already addressed it... been busy as heck at work this week... failed to keep up as well as normal... for some reason they decided to try to kill us by working too many hours.


----------



## adam3234

Minotaurtoo said:


> my bad, didn't know you had already addressed it... been busy as heck at work this week... failed to keep up as well as normal... for some reason they decided to try to kill us by working too many hours.


Your bad? I wasn't implying you did anything wrong, just notifying you that I agree with you that incorrect voltage readings is a factor that needs to be taken into consideration plus there was other stuff I had added concerning the subject that I wanted you and others (that hadn't read some of the previous posts) to be aware of and hopefully will help in participating in the test.


----------



## gupsterg

betam4x said:


> IIRC modern day CPUs are designed to deal with overshoot unless you crank up the voltage super high. 4.0 @ 1.25V at LLC3 should not create a high enough of a spike to matter. (LLC is inverse on the MSI, so Level 3 is like level 6 on other boards.)
> 
> On this ASUS board (ROG X399-E) LLC does not appear to play any significant role anyway. This brings me back to my original point. Some brands handle LLC better than others. I bet if half the people who claim their Threadripper needs 1.3+V for 4.0 GHz on an ASUS board tried it on an MSI, they would discover that they could hit 4.0 at a much lower voltage (or 4.1 at 1.35V). This is because the MSI board appears to handle power delivery much better than the ASUS board I have now. I was originally not happy at the MSI board, but now that I've had a taste of the quality of this board, I am going back to the MSI.
> 
> EDIT: Correction.


I have not seen information from a valid source stating modern CPU can deal with overshoot better. TBH all I have seen is that as "we" get smaller process silicon, that tends to use lower voltage (note I state "tends"), it is more likely to be affected by voltages out of spec.

Anyhow I am glad you are happy with your setup, as I am with mine  .


----------



## adam3234

gupsterg said:


> I have not seen information from a valid source stating modern CPU can deal with overshoot better. TBH all I have seen is that as "we" get smaller process silicon, that tends to use lower voltage (note I state "tends"), it is more likely to be affected by voltages out of spec.
> 
> Anyhow I am glad you are happy with your setup, as I am with mine  .


The VRM's chokes and capacitors are meant to handle those overshoots (and undershoots) and stabilize the power going to the CPU. The VRMs should provide a clean/stable power to the CPU if implemented properly so I thought there shouldn't be any issue with over shoots. I wish the Youtube tech channels will look into this when they review the motherboards. I know Gamers Nexus has an oscilloscope so it's something they can definitely do.


----------



## gupsterg

adam3234 said:


> The VRM's chokes and capacitors are meant to handle those overshoots (and undershoots) and stabilize the power going to the CPU. The VRMs should provide a clean/stable power to the CPU if implemented properly so I thought there shouldn't be any issue with over shoots. I wish the Youtube tech channels will look into this when they review the motherboards. I know Gamers Nexus has an oscilloscope so it's something they can definitely do.


It occurs.

In OP here, section LLC settings on C6H see [email protected]'s share.

I agree it would be nice if more data as such was shared/included in reviews, etc  .


----------



## adam3234

gupsterg said:


> It occurs.
> 
> In OP here, section LLC settings on C6H see [email protected]'s share.
> 
> I agree it would be nice if more data as such was shared/included in reviews, etc  .


I know that voltage spikes do still happen but what I'm trying to say is that if the VRMs are engineered properly they shouldn't be an issue. The issue that [email protected] shows is not the voltage spikes. The voltage spikes add to it but only about 20mv. The real issue is the higher LLC levels on the C6H where setting 1.4 volts in the bios gives the CPU an extra 50mv under load making the voltage beyond what is recommended for Ryzen chips. When the load drops the voltage spikes up to 20mv more (for about 50uS) making an already bad situation even worst. Discussions like what Raja did for the C6H is what would be the most helpful from motherboard reviews besides talking about the VRM thermals although I would like to see Raja do it for all the other LLC level instead of just 2.

Has anyone address the issue of where if you leave the Zenith Extreme on optimized defaults the voltages get really high. I've seen the vcore voltage reach into the 1.5x volts and most the time it is above my over clock voltage?


----------



## gupsterg

From what I understand the VRM components can't predict what will happen in the future. So they supply at x level, then as CPU/we decide to do something else and loading changes it can't respond as quick as the CPU state change, hence the overshoot.

The increased voltage when PB/XFR occurs is normal. As it will be low core count, etc it will be within spec.

*** edit ***

Recently seen this being shared around, link. Some of it agree with and some not.

As I don't do much core OC'ing on TR here is a recent compare of 2700X stock left sides and 4.1GHz ACB right sides, link. Peak temps improved a lot and this is not a one off, average between each is closer. A reasonable differential on average CPU voltage as well.

When I do load 2 threads per CPU node on TR on average core clock is 4.0GHz, so perhaps anyone with a 4.0GHz core OC isn't really losing any/much lower thread count performance, but gains multithread performance.


----------



## Rebellion88

Hope you don't mind me posting in here, I'm curious to know why you choose a TR over a Ryzen 7? I know there is more cores and I gues for workstations you would probably see a difference but for everyday use? Also do these give off a lot more heat?


----------



## eduncan911

Anyone running Linux day-to-day on these X399 motherboards? 

What motherboard and what's your OS and compatibility? Anything not working?

I'm mostly interested out-of-box Linux installs with little to no interaction. In my day-to-day, I format and install multiple different versions of Linux several times a month. I don't want to go find the kernel modules to disable nor what special kernel params to pass into each distro. 

/TL;DR

I am eye-balling that new MSI X399 refresh board shown at the recent tech demo. I can wait a few months for it and the newer TR2 CPUs to come out.

I ask because my last big investment left me extremely disappointed with Linux functionality (Asus Rampage IV Extreme Black Edition, X79). Previous Asus extreme high-end Intel builds didn't work well with Linux either, without disabling all sorts of kernel modules and spending hours figuring out kernel boot options to hack it to work. Asrock has been making a name in recent news with Linux, but mostly on the Intel side.

I no longer have the time to frack with all that. Linux needs to install out-of-the-box and support most devices.

That X79 system has been sitting turned off for the past two years since I've back to Linux for development (and a tad of gaming). 

The announcement of the Threadripper 2 32C/64T made my jaw drop. I must have been in a hole the last few years and missed all of AMDs advancements. I'm done with Intel and Asus.

I'm also interested in M.2 slots and USB3 onboard connectors and external ones, as this will be a new workstation of video encoding multiple 4k streams and Kubernetes software development stacks of dozens of containers. 

I don't really care about all the custom add-on chips (Marvel SATA ports, etc) - I'll just disable them all, except the sound that is. Just looking to use one or two M.2 drives, and 1 SATA drive (like an 8 TB from my existing server). Nothing fancy.

Also don't really care about overclocking ability as I value extreme stability over overclocking.

I do plan on upgrading to the 24C or 32C Threadripper 2 when they come out.

Mostly installing/switching between:
* Qubes OS (4.0 now, with EFI)
* Arch Linux
* Ubuntu 16.10+

AMD, I'm baaa-aaack! Just need to figure out which motherboard is the most compatible with Linux.


----------



## Dotachin

eduncan911 said:


> Anyone running Linux day-to-day on these X399 motherboards?
> 
> What motherboard and what's your OS and compatibility? Anything not working?
> 
> I'm mostly interested out-of-box Linux installs with little to no interaction. In my day-to-day, I format and install multiple different versions of Linux several times a month. I don't want to go find the kernel modules to disable nor what special kernel params to pass into each distro.
> 
> /TL;DR
> 
> I am eye-balling that new MSI X399 refresh board shown at the recent tech demo. I can wait a few months for it and the newer TR2 CPUs to come out.
> 
> I ask because my last big investment left me extremely disappointed with Linux functionality (Asus Rampage IV Extreme Black Edition, X79). Previous Asus extreme high-end Intel builds didn't work well with Linux either, without disabling all sorts of kernel modules and spending hours figuring out kernel boot options to hack it to work. Asrock has been making a name in recent news with Linux, but mostly on the Intel side.
> 
> I no longer have the time to frack with all that. Linux needs to install out-of-the-box and support most devices.
> 
> That X79 system has been sitting turned off for the past two years since I've back to Linux for development (and a tad of gaming).
> 
> The announcement of the Threadripper 2 32C/64T made my jaw drop. I must have been in a hole the last few years and missed all of AMDs advancements. I'm done with Intel and Asus.
> 
> I'm also interested in M.2 slots and USB3 onboard connectors and external ones, as this will be a new workstation of video encoding multiple 4k streams and Kubernetes software development stacks of dozens of containers.
> 
> I don't really care about all the custom add-on chips (Marvel SATA ports, etc) - I'll just disable them all, except the sound that is. Just looking to use one or two M.2 drives, and 1 SATA drive (like an 8 TB from my existing server). Nothing fancy.
> 
> Also don't really care about overclocking ability as I value extreme stability over overclocking.
> 
> I do plan on upgrading to the 24C or 32C Threadripper 2 when they come out.
> 
> Mostly installing/switching between:
> * Qubes OS (4.0 now, with EFI)
> * Arch Linux
> * Ubuntu 16.10+
> 
> AMD, I'm baaa-aaack! Just need to figure out which motherboard is the most compatible with Linux.


You can check mobo reviews with linux on this channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOWcZ6Wicl-1N34H0zZe38w


----------



## MNMadman

eduncan911 said:


> Anyone running Linux day-to-day on these X399 motherboards?
> 
> What motherboard and what's your OS and compatibility? Anything not working?
> 
> I'm mostly interested out-of-box Linux installs with little to no interaction. In my day-to-day, I format and install multiple different versions of Linux several times a month. I don't want to go find the kernel modules to disable nor what special kernel params to pass into each distro.
> 
> /TL;DR
> 
> I am eye-balling that new MSI X399 refresh board shown at the recent tech demo. I can wait a few months for it and the newer TR2 CPUs to come out.
> 
> I ask because my last big investment left me extremely disappointed with Linux functionality (Asus Rampage IV Extreme Black Edition, X79). Previous Asus extreme high-end Intel builds didn't work well with Linux either, without disabling all sorts of kernel modules and spending hours figuring out kernel boot options to hack it to work. Asrock has been making a name in recent news with Linux, but mostly on the Intel side.
> 
> I no longer have the time to frack with all that. Linux needs to install out-of-the-box and support most devices.
> 
> That X79 system has been sitting turned off for the past two years since I've back to Linux for development (and a tad of gaming).
> 
> The announcement of the Threadripper 2 32C/64T made my jaw drop. I must have been in a hole the last few years and missed all of AMDs advancements. I'm done with Intel and Asus.
> 
> I'm also interested in M.2 slots and USB3 onboard connectors and external ones, as this will be a new workstation of video encoding multiple 4k streams and Kubernetes software development stacks of dozens of containers.
> 
> I don't really care about all the custom add-on chips (Marvel SATA ports, etc) - I'll just disable them all, except the sound that is. Just looking to use one or two M.2 drives, and 1 SATA drive (like an 8 TB from my existing server). Nothing fancy.
> 
> Also don't really care about overclocking ability as I value extreme stability over overclocking.
> 
> I do plan on upgrading to the 24C or 32C Threadripper 2 when they come out.
> 
> Mostly installing/switching between:
> * Qubes OS (4.0 now, with EFI)
> * Arch Linux
> * Ubuntu 16.10+
> 
> AMD, I'm baaa-aaack! Just need to figure out which motherboard is the most compatible with Linux.


Ran Linux for a bit on *Heatripper Threadkiller*. 1950X CPU on ASRock X399 Taichi board. Used newest Mint and Kubuntu 18.04. Had no problems at all with the CPU or mainboard - it was the Titan Xp that caused boot issues. Had to run the nomodeset parameter to install and for the first full boot so I could then activate the proprietary Nvidia drivers. After that, no issues whatsoever.


----------



## adam3234

Rebellion88 said:


> Hope you don't mind me posting in here, I'm curious to know why you choose a TR over a Ryzen 7? I know there is more cores and I gues for workstations you would probably see a difference but for everyday use? Also do these give off a lot more heat?


I choose a Threadripper because all those threads are need for running lots of virtual machines. For everyday use (e.g. web browsing, word processing) you wouldn't see a noticeable difference. For everyday use they don't give of much heat I think it was 30 C to 35 C (Tdie) average doing normal everyday task with about 22 C ambient.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> I choose a Threadripper because all those threads are need for running lots of virtual machines. For everyday use (e.g. web browsing, word processing) you wouldn't see a noticeable difference. For everyday use they don't give of much heat I think it was 30 C to 35 C (Tdie) average doing normal everyday task with about 22 C ambient.


I do development, which includes a few VMs running different operating systems and web browsers. I also occasionally do content generation. Threadripper, contrary to popular believe, is also better for gaming than Ryzen 1xxx when configured correctly. It has a higher XFR (4.2 GHz), along with quad channel memory, and it has many of the improvements of Ryzen 2xxx, including lower cache latencies and potentially lower memory latency (once again, depends on the BIOS options). It's also binned for overclocking better, however, now that I've discovered Sense Mi in ASUS's BIOS, I've found little need to overclock, since Sense Mi fools the CPU into thinking it's running cooler, it hits XFR much more often.

It does generate a LOT of heat though, however you can tweak the Windows Power Plan to lower things somewhat. My cores throttle down to 2200 MHz and up to 4.2 GHz as needed, at 2200 MHz the entire PC + cable modem + router consumes 180 watts at idle. That's 100 watts higher than my i7 2600k, but what do you get for 4X as many cores, twice as much RAM, and an M.2 SSD?


----------



## betam4x

gupsterg said:


> I have not seen information from a valid source stating modern CPU can deal with overshoot better. TBH all I have seen is that as "we" get smaller process silicon, that tends to use lower voltage (note I state "tends"), it is more likely to be affected by voltages out of spec.
> 
> Anyhow I am glad you are happy with your setup, as I am with mine  .


I found out LLC is broken on this board altogether. Changing it appears to do nothing. However, I found another solution: Sense MI. It appears to make the CPU perform much better. I have had all 16 cores hit 4.2 GHz at times during certain workloads. 

EDIT: Oh and AMD CBS? You can overclock the CPU that way and it does not have vdroop interestingly enough (on this board)


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> I do development, which includes a few VMs running different operating systems and web browsers. I also occasionally do content generation. Threadripper, contrary to popular believe, is also better for gaming than Ryzen 1xxx when configured correctly. It has a higher XFR (4.2 GHz), along with quad channel memory, and it has many of the improvements of Ryzen 2xxx, including lower cache latencies and potentially lower memory latency (once again, depends on the BIOS options). It's also binned for overclocking better, however, now that I've discovered Sense Mi in ASUS's BIOS, I've found little need to overclock, since Sense Mi fools the CPU into thinking it's running cooler, it hits XFR much more often.
> 
> It does generate a LOT of heat though, however you can tweak the Windows Power Plan to lower things somewhat. My cores throttle down to 2200 MHz and up to 4.2 GHz as needed, at 2200 MHz the entire PC + cable modem + router consumes 180 watts at idle. That's 100 watts higher than my i7 2600k, but what do you get for 4X as many cores, twice as much RAM, and an M.2 SSD?


I'm also going to use it for development work as well when I'm done setting it up (which won't be until quite a while). 

Threadripper can generate a lot of heat but that depends on what you are doing, for example I was just watching 



 on 4k and the temperature peaked at 39 C Tdie and would initially fluctuate a lot during the start of the video but for the majority of the video the temperature was at 27 C. It's a pretty cold day though (12 C) but normally at warmer temperature (about 22-24 C), web browsing would only heat up the CPU to somewhere bewtween 30 C to 35 C). I only see a LOT of heat generated when I'm stress testing the CPU with Prime 95.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> I'm also going to use it for development work as well when I'm done setting it up (which won't be until quite a while).
> 
> Threadripper can generate a lot of heat but that depends on what you are doing, for example I was just watching https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcL47Kiyuj0 on 4k and the temperature peaked at 39 C Tdie and would initially fluctuate a lot during the start of the video but for the majority of the video the temperature was at 27 C. It's a pretty cold day though (12 C) but normally at warmer temperature (about 22-24 C), web browsing would only heat up the CPU to somewhere bewtween 30 C to 35 C). I only see a LOT of heat generated when I'm stress testing the CPU with Prime 95.


It does generate a lot of heat, but the Enermax 360 handles it fine. I've been able to do 4.1 GHz and stick to under 68C with prime95 small FFTs. I'm definitely getting addicted to this SenseMi thing though. Also, set the Windows Power Plan Minimum processor state to 1% and the max to 100% and it drastically cuts power and heat. Sense Mi will still fire up the cores up to 4.2 GHz as needed. I was playing a game today and it had 8 cores pegged at 4.2 GHz.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> It does generate a lot of heat, but the Enermax 360 handles it fine. I've been able to do 4.1 GHz and stick to under 68C with prime95 small FFTs. I'm definitely getting addicted to this SenseMi thing though. Also, set the Windows Power Plan Minimum processor state to 1% and the max to 100% and it drastically cuts power and heat. Sense Mi will still fire up the cores up to 4.2 GHz as needed. I was playing a game today and it had 8 cores pegged at 4.2 GHz.


What score do you get in Cinebench R15 (set to run with only 1 thread) when you use Sense MI?


----------



## Rebellion88

Thanks for your answers guys, I did guess VM's would be involved. Would love to get some at work but we always use Xeons at the moment.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> The 1950X has a BASE of 3.4 and a BOOST of 4.0. XFR brings it up to 4.2.


I'm talking about the graphs Anantech did.


----------



## Tamalero

pgdeaner said:


> So I'm beginning to consider upgrading my Intel 5820K/Asus x99 package. Would a threadripper 1920X be a worthy upgrade? If so, who has the best motherboard for threadripper right now?
> 
> I have heard so many horror stories about ram compatibility and overclocking I wanted to reach out to the folks that have already been down the road and hopefully avoid problems that others have already had.
> 
> Thanks in advance for any suggestions/advice.


You could just get a replacement 2920 or similar.
Should be more than enough.. as for nightmare. Just buy Bdie Ram. No problems with these rams.

almost all the incompatibility issues has been with non samsung memory, aka hynix or micron.


----------



## Tamalero

pgdeaner said:


> I appreciate the suggestions.
> 
> I use VMWare workstation quite a bit and run multiple VMs so the extra cores would be nice. Anyone have experience with threadripper and VMware workstation?


I use the VMWARE workstation (old version, I think Its version 14). Works fine on my 1950X, no crashes whatsoever.



adam3234 said:


> I choose a Threadripper because all those threads are need for running lots of virtual machines. For everyday use (e.g. web browsing, word processing) you wouldn't see a noticeable difference. For everyday use they don't give of much heat I think it was 30 C to 35 C (Tdie) average doing normal everyday task with about 22 C ambient.



Agree, unless you try to browse while you process a ton of videos or photos.

My 6600k simply hanged my browser for way too long while doing these processes. Hence why i moved to threadripper.


----------



## springs113

It's not just TR...I can tell the difference between my 2700x and 5930k just in everyday task. There is a level of snappiness so to speak. I can also tell the difference between my 1950x and 2700x in the same regards. Other than maybe money I don't see how someone can stay on an architecture 5 generations ago(generally speaking).


----------



## phas3d

Think i'm going to be selling one of my MSI Carbon Pro AC motherboards (the one currently with the 1920x) as I prepare for the 2950x release. This board runs at 4ghz with around 1.35v. Stress tested using several iterations of RealBench and Prime95 v26.6. Firm $235 with free shipping, payment via PayPal. Will come with box, instructions, peripherals, etc.

Going to keep the other MSI and 1950x and move it to my HTPC, replacing the Intel 5820K. Just purchased the ThermalTake View 91 case, which is UNBELIEVABLY big and will be doing a custom cooling loop including CPU block, block for my NVidia Titan and dual 560mm Radiator setup, similar to this setup:







but with a 4 fan radiator for the second radiator. Thinking this would be fine for cooling and overclocking the 2950x regardless of its TDP.


----------



## gupsterg

betam4x said:


> It has a higher XFR (4.2 GHz), along with quad channel memory, and it has many of the improvements of Ryzen 2xxx, including lower cache latencies and potentially lower memory latency (once again, depends on the BIOS options).


Threadripper gen 1 has same IMC setup as Ryzen gen 1. Again I have seen no valid source with information stating otherwise.

Regardless of UEFI options setup, my 1950X can not match my 2700X for RAM/Cache latencies for me.



betam4x said:


> I found out LLC is broken on this board altogether. Changing it appears to do nothing. However, I found another solution: Sense MI. It appears to make the CPU perform much better. I have had all 16 cores hit 4.2 GHz at times during certain workloads.
> 
> EDIT: Oh and AMD CBS? You can overclock the CPU that way and it does not have vdroop interestingly enough (on this board)


LLC is not broken for me, even on later or older UEFIs.

I have used AMD CBS to OC CPU and again I have VDROOP and if I were to change LLC it does apply.


----------



## pmc25

gupsterg said:


> Threadripper gen 1 has same IMC setup as Ryzen gen 1. Again I have seen no valid source with information stating otherwise.
> 
> Regardless of UEFI options setup, my 1950X can not match my 2700X for RAM/Cache latencies for me.


Indeed. 

TR gen1 and Ryzen gen1 are identical.

Cache and memory latencies, and any other IMC / IF / general IPC improvements are reserved for TR gen2 and Ryzen gen2.

Will likely be selling my unused 1920X shortly (never got round to building it) and buying a 2920X (or equivalent) to replace and build a system.


----------



## Tamalero

pmc25 said:


> Indeed.
> 
> TR gen1 and Ryzen gen1 are identical.
> 
> Cache and memory latencies, and any other IMC / IF / general IPC improvements are reserved for TR gen2 and Ryzen gen2.
> 
> Will likely be selling my unused 1920X shortly (never got round to building it) and buying a 2920X (or equivalent) to replace and build a system.


I actually had this conversation before, and I agreed that what you say is.. sadly, untrue.

Normal Ryzen had a staggering high latency of 90ns to memory and around 21+ns to cache.
Threadripper and Raven Ridge reduced this to 70ns on average and around 14 ns to cache. (in some examples with very good memory speeds, the rates go from 12ns latency to 9ns on L3 cache.

Pinnacle Ridge improves it a bit more on IMC, Turbo, etc..


But yes, Threadripper and Raven Ridge had improvements ABOVE the original Ryzen. Specially on latency.


----------



## gupsterg

Tamalero said:


> I actually had this conversation before, and I agreed that what you say is.. sadly, untrue.
> 
> Normal Ryzen had a staggering high latency of 90ns to memory and around 21+ns to cache.
> Threadripper and Raven Ridge reduced this to 70ns on average and around 14 ns to cache. (in some examples with very good memory speeds, the rates go from 12ns latency to 9ns on L3 cache.
> 
> Pinnacle Ridge improves it a bit more on IMC, Turbo, etc..
> 
> 
> But yes, Threadripper and Raven Ridge had improvements ABOVE the original Ryzen. Specially on latency.


This post is from April 2017, link. Prior to AGESA SummitPI 1.0.0.6 which allowed greater than 3200MHz RAM MHz without BCLK tweak.

Here is something more recent from my kit, left side is all 1800X+C6H and right is 1950X+ZE, link. No special OS/UEFI PB tweaks, just pure and simple RAM MHz and timings, etc.


----------



## Tamalero

gupsterg said:


> This post is from April 2017, link. Prior to AGESA SummitPI 1.0.0.6 which allowed greater than 3200MHz RAM MHz without BCLK tweak.
> 
> Here is something more recent from my kit, left side is all 1800X+C6H and right is 1950X+ZE, link. No special OS/UEFI PB tweaks, just pure and simple RAM MHz and timings, etc.


In every single if your screenshots, the 1800 still had higher (albeit minimal) difference in L3 and L2 cache. Still lower in the theradrippers.
The difference in Memory was still higher.

I now wonder how much improvements can threadripper get via AGESA.
Since as far I know, we're still very outdated compared to Ryzen or Rizen+


----------



## gupsterg

Tamalero said:


> In every single if your screenshots, the 1800 still had higher (albeit minimal) difference in L3 and L2 cache. Still lower in the theradrippers.
> The difference in Memory was still higher.
> 
> I now wonder how much improvements can threadripper get via AGESA.
> Since as far I know, we're still very outdated compared to Ryzen or Rizen+


Threadripper at launch had more than what Ryzen had concerning options from AGESA. Trust me I had both at launch. Threadripper AGESA was more developed and benefited from later release/Ryzen early launch. 

I forgot to mention the 1800X+C6H setup is at 3400MHz using The Stilt 3466MHz timings, where as 1950X+ZE is 3466MHz using The Stilt 3466MHz timings. Even then the RAM portion of AIDA64 is very comparable when the 1800X+C6H is lacking some MEMCLK  . 

As for cache bench difference, do a test for me.

As I have done it in the past.

CPU speed affects cache bench.



> The core, L1 and L2 cache speed is permanently linked together as usual, however unlike with the previous designs the L3 cache now operates at core speed as well (i.e. full speed).


Quote source link (see under heading The frequency relations of the CCX).

As stated before Threadripper gen 1 uses Ryzen gen 1 dies, it has no improved latencies, etc like Ryzen gen 2. I have seen no valid source state otherwise. I do rest my case now  .


----------



## Tamalero

gupsterg said:


> Threadripper at launch had more than what Ryzen had concerning options from AGESA. Trust me I had both at launch. Threadripper AGESA was more developed and benefited from later release/Ryzen early launch.
> 
> I forgot to mention the 1800X+C6H setup is at 3400MHz using The Stilt 3466MHz timings, where as 1950X+ZE is 3466MHz using The Stilt 3466MHz timings. Even then the RAM portion of AIDA64 is very comparable when the 1800X+C6H is lacking some MEMCLK  .
> 
> As for cache bench difference, do a test for me.
> 
> As I have done it in the past.
> 
> CPU speed affects cache bench.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote source link (see under heading The frequency relations of the CCX).
> 
> As stated before Threadripper gen 1 uses Ryzen gen 1 dies, it has no improved latencies, etc like Ryzen gen 2. I have seen no valid source state otherwise. I do rest my case now  .


Thanks for clarifying gupsterg, Its annoying to have someone claim something and then see someone counter an argument, both with screenshots and such. You do not know who says the truth at the time.


----------



## gupsterg

It's not a problem  .

I have been living breathing Ryzen since launch. I really don't use it for gaming, etc much if I compare it to the time spent tinkering, trying UEFIs, etc, etc.

As stated above, Threadripper had a lot of options in UEFI which "we" at Ryzen gen 1 launch did not have until ~2-4mths down the line. Ryzen at launch only allowed 3200MHz max without BCLK tweak. No access to beyond primary timings. There was no tweaks like ProcODT/CLDO_VDDP for a while. It really was "bare bones" at the time .

Even when you have a Summit Ridge CPU (ie Ryzen gen 1) with Pinnacle Ridge AGESA UEFI it will perform as it did on Summit Ridge AGESA. Only thing extra "we" gained was more RAM MHz without BCLK tweaks. For example I have 3400MHz, 3533MHz and others on 1800X+C6H or C7H, you do not need gen 2 CPU to have the vastly more RAM MHz setups. So yeah in time TR AGESA should come some more along even if it did benefit from later release, etc vs Ryzen gen 1.


----------



## betam4x

gupsterg said:


> Threadripper gen 1 has same IMC setup as Ryzen gen 1. Again I have seen no valid source with information stating otherwise.
> 
> Regardless of UEFI options setup, my 1950X can not match my 2700X for RAM/Cache latencies for me.
> 
> 
> 
> LLC is not broken for me, even on later or older UEFIs.
> 
> I have used AMD CBS to OC CPU and again I have VDROOP and if I were to change LLC it does apply.


Attached is an aida64 screenshot of my 1950X. Note that my RAM is CL16 and not tuned at all. I've seen users get RAM all the way down in the low 50s on Threadripper with well binned b-die (I have Hynix MFR and it won't overclock or even let me tighten timings in the slightest bit). You can compare that with the 1800X and you'll discover that Threadripper does indeed have much lower latencies. These latencies line up exactly with the 2700X. The only thing that helps the 2700X is a better boosting algorithm. However, I've enabled sense mi, so I often get a boost of 4.2 GHz for many tasks.

EDIT: L3 Latency would be a bit lower, but at the time I had a billion programs open.
EDIT #2: I attempted to find screenshots of Aida64 latencies for the 1800x and 2700x. Most of the screenshots for the 1800x had L2 latencies of 4.0-6.0ns and L3 latencies of 15+ns. The screenshots for the 2700x closely match Threadripper.


----------



## MNMadman

Well ****.

I just realized that I've been pumping around 1.64v through my 1950X. I switched the clocks back to Auto, but forgot to remove the 0.225v offset I had been running with my P-State overclock. It wasn't running that high all the time, but it would have been while I was gaming (which I've been doing a lot of lately).

I don't remember exactly what day I did the switch, but it's close to a week ago.

I wonder how much time that ripped off the CPU's life span...


----------



## gupsterg

betam4x said:


> Attached is an aida64 screenshot of my 1950X. Note that my RAM is CL16 and not tuned at all. I've seen users get RAM all the way down in the low 50s on Threadripper with well binned b-die (I have Hynix MFR and it won't overclock or even let me tighten timings in the slightest bit). You can compare that with the 1800X and you'll discover that Threadripper does indeed have much lower latencies. These latencies line up exactly with the 2700X. The only thing that helps the 2700X is a better boosting algorithm. However, I've enabled sense mi, so I often get a boost of 4.2 GHz for many tasks.
> 
> EDIT: L3 Latency would be a bit lower, but at the time I had a billion programs open.
> EDIT #2: I attempted to find screenshots of Aida64 latencies for the 1800x and 2700x. Most of the screenshots for the 1800x had L2 latencies of 4.0-6.0ns and L3 latencies of 15+ns. The screenshots for the 2700x closely match Threadripper.


_Billion programs?_

_RAM latency of low 50ns on TR?_ I did check HWBOT. No AIDA64 in 1900X section or 1920X section, but 1950X there is, result by a OCN member. So 3600MHz CL14 Quad Channel still 57ns!?

I really do rest my case and don't wish to burst your bubble. Please do enjoy your HW and I will continue to do so with mine.

TTFN :thumb: .


----------



## Minotaurtoo

I've been entertained by this discussion ... but one way I had managed to get 2700x like latency on my 1700 was using performance bias set to cinebench R15... maybe whatever that setting changed was just built into threadripper some other way by default? I noticed that the cinebench R15 bias has much less effect on 2700x than it did on the 1700 I had.... on the 1700 I would gain over 50cb points when enabled.


----------



## gupsterg

Minotaurtoo said:


> I've been entertained by this discussion lol... but one way I had managed to get 2700x like latency on my 1700 was using performance bias set to cinebench R15... maybe whatever that setting changed was just built into threadripper some other way by default? I noticed that the cinebench R15 bias has much less effect on 2700x than it did on the 1700 I had.... on the 1700 I would gain over 50cb points when enabled.


PB settings change cache setup, Elmor posted about it in C6H thread.

I too find PB changes have less of an effect on 2700X vs Ryzen/Threadripper gen 1.

I'm assuming as gen 2 is already tight it has less effect. Perhaps there maybe a lower limit as to firmware will allow cache to be set up for timings, etc.


----------



## txenakis

I'm planning an air cooled (I know, I know...) 1950X build very soon. Just wanted to check as of this time what are considered the most popular air coolers and motherboards for this chip. Not planning to overclock.

Thanks!


----------



## Tamalero

txenakis said:


> I'm planning an air cooled (I know, I know...) 1950X build very soon. Just wanted to check as of this time what are considered the most popular air coolers and motherboards for this chip. Not planning to overclock.
> 
> Thanks!


Cooler? You cant go wrong with the big Noctua one.

Motherboard, it all depends on your budget and what you want.

I am on the PRIME X399. Other swears by the Zenith. Others go to other brands..like the Taichi. It all depends.


----------



## txenakis

Tamalero said:


> Cooler? You cant go wrong with the big Noctua one.
> 
> Motherboard, it all depends on your budget and what you want.
> 
> I am on the PRIME X399. Other swears by the Zenith. Others go to other brands..like the Taichi. It all depends.


Thanks! Planning to get the ASRock - Fatal1ty X399 as I need the 10G NIC. 

The big Noctua cooler is the NH-U14S TR4-SP3 correct?


----------



## Tamalero

txenakis said:


> Thanks! Planning to get the ASRock - Fatal1ty X399 as I need the 10G NIC.
> 
> The big Noctua cooler is the NH-U14S TR4-SP3 correct?



Yes


----------



## txenakis

Tamalero said:


> Yes


Thanks!


----------



## betam4x

gupsterg said:


> _Billion programs?_
> 
> _RAM latency of low 50ns on TR?_ I did check HWBOT. No AIDA64 in 1900X section or 1920X section, but 1950X there is, result by a OCN member. So 3600MHz CL14 Quad Channel still 57ns!?
> 
> I really do rest my case and don't wish to burst your bubble. Please do enjoy your HW and I will continue to do so with mine.
> 
> TTFN :thumb: .


I really wish I could find the result. I'm not kidding you, this kid got latencies down to something like 53 or 54 ms. At any rate, look at the L1/L2/L3 latencies for the Ryzen 1 series vs Threadripper and you'll find that Threadripper compares with Ryzen 2. I've slowly fallen in love with this board. I will probably RMA my MSI board, test it, and sell it. Sense MI is AMAZING. It makes it so much easier to get the chip to 4.2 GHz. This has helped drastically in games that use up to 8 cores. 

Oh, and I was mistaken about overclocking my RAM. On my MSI board I couldn't overclock at all, but this board I've been able to tighten timings a bit. I ran the built in Windows memory checker, is this sufficient? I also have the pro version of HCI memtest that I can use.

A few other notes that may interest people:

Under AMD CBS on the x399-e, if you set the clock that way, it appears that the VID remains constant or near that voltage if LLC is on auto (haven't tried tweaking the LLC yet...no need if the VIDs of the CPU are that stable). This allowed me to overclock with my previous voltages, but I find that the Sense Mi route often provides better performance (unless your 1950X can get beyond 4.2 GHz at a reasonable voltage, which I haven't seen many that can.) For example, my PC can boot at 4.2 GHz and pass Prime95 at very high temps at 1.475 voltage, however, that voltage is well in excess of what AMD recommends. Sense Mi will boost to 4.2 GHz as much as possible without killing the chip with too much voltage. You must also not forget that the voltages shown by HWInfo and other programs are not the voltages that are actually being used. The SMU on the chip uses the appropriate voltages, which are much lower than what is shown in software. What is reported is the maximum allowed by the chip.

This board I noticed appears to generate more heat than my other, despite having less VRMs and having them run cooler. On my Enermax 360 with the MSI I could keep it at 4.1GHz / 1.35V and in Prime95 it would top out at around 58C. With this board it exceeds the recommended 68C barrier. I will try re-applying thermal compound (I used 3rd party last time, and then the enermax compound this time, so maybe the enermax compound is cheap or there isn't enough? All I have is some Thermaltake TG-7 on hand, should I use that or order something better from Amazon, recommendations? Absent that, I will switch back to the enermax fans from the Noctua 3k RPM fans and see if that helps. I don't believe it is a pump failure since idle temps are fine and most tasks keep the CPU nice and cool. It's only the hardcore stuff like prime95, etc. that drive up temps. Once I get back to work and rebuild savings, I will be doing my first ever custom loop build. I will be waiting for the 29xx series to come out however.


----------



## pmc25

betam4x said:


> I really wish I could find the result. I'm not kidding you, this kid got latencies down to something like 53 or 54 ms. At any rate, look at the L1/L2/L3 latencies for the Ryzen 1 series vs Threadripper and you'll find that Threadripper compares with Ryzen 2. I've slowly fallen in love with this board. I will probably RMA my MSI board, test it, and sell it. Sense MI is AMAZING. It makes it so much easier to get the chip to 4.2 GHz. This has helped drastically in games that use up to 8 cores.


Dude, there's a reason there's no evidence for your position in the argument and a mountain for gupster's.

It's because Ryzen and TR are essentially identical. Indeed, they're the same chips in different bins. Just more of them fused together with IF and bigger heatspreader on TR.

IPC / IMC / Cache ... they're the same. The difference is bios, and then that doesn't make much difference one way or the other to latency.


----------



## MNMadman

pmc25 said:


> Dude, there's a reason there's no evidence for your position in the argument and a mountain for gupster's.
> 
> It's because Ryzen and TR are essentially identical. Indeed, they're the same chips in different bins. Just more of them fused together with IF and bigger heatspreader on TR.
> 
> IPC / IMC / Cache ... they're the same. The difference is bios, and then that doesn't make much difference one way or the other to latency.


Some evidence for @betam4x...

Linky

A specific quote from the link -- "_Threadripper 1950X features better L2 and L3 latency than the Ryzen 7 1800X with every type of access pattern_."

Edit: And I know that I've heard/seen multiple sources state that Threadripper has latency improvements over Ryzen. Might have been in video reviews or something.


----------



## gupsterg

MNMadman said:


> Some evidence for @betam4x...
> 
> Linky
> 
> A specific quote from the link -- "_Threadripper 1950X features better L2 and L3 latency than the Ryzen 7 1800X with every type of access pattern_."
> 
> Edit: And I know that I've heard/seen multiple sources state that Threadripper has latency improvements over Ryzen. Might have been in video reviews or something.


As stated before core clock affects cache latency. Any how I think I'm gonna stop posting TBH, just gonna enjoy my own HW, etc  .

@pmc25

PB enhances cache latency (link), which is no surprise. Out of 7 CPUs I have experienced none pass stability tests with PB. The 7 CPUs are not all TR, 5x were Ryzen gen 1 and 1x gen 2.


----------



## pmc25

MNMadman said:


> Some evidence for @betam4x...
> 
> Linky
> 
> A specific quote from the link -- "_Threadripper 1950X features better L2 and L3 latency than the Ryzen 7 1800X with every type of access pattern_."
> 
> Edit: And I know that I've heard/seen multiple sources state that Threadripper has latency improvements over Ryzen. Might have been in video reviews or something.


Did you actually look at the graph? Everything was within the margin of error, at stock frequencies, except cross CCX ... which was slower on the 1950X.


----------



## MNMadman

pmc25 said:


> Did you actually look at the graph? Everything was within the margin of error, at stock frequencies, except cross CCX ... which was slower on the 1950X.


Did _you_ look at the rest of the page? The first graph is for Infinity Fabric and that's not what I was referring to. The rest was for the cache latencies and bandwidth, and that is where the quote I put in my last post came from.


----------



## betam4x

pmc25 said:


> Dude, there's a reason there's no evidence for your position in the argument and a mountain for gupster's.
> 
> It's because Ryzen and TR are essentially identical. Indeed, they're the same chips in different bins. Just more of them fused together with IF and bigger heatspreader on TR.
> 
> IPC / IMC / Cache ... they're the same. The difference is bios, and then that doesn't make much difference one way or the other to latency.


I posted an image of my own machine that should provide sufficient evidence, at this point, your *LACK* of evidence in the other direction, however is astounding. P.S. I was mistaken, while my MSI board does not tolerate timing changes or overclocking, the ASUS board I have works great, I've already gotten memory latencies down to 65 ms, and this is on *Hynix MFR CL16 DDR4 32000*. Once I dial in timings a bit more, I'll show you my timings...b-die will do much better. I opted for Hynix because it was much cheaper. However I was able to disable geardown and get the memory down to CL14 (just to start) among other things...just adds to my theory that 12nm is actually 14++ with the improvements that were originally included in threadripper. You are welcome to dispute this, but I can tell you how to tweak your own board to match the 2700X when it comes to latencies....so why fight?


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Some evidence for @betam4x...
> 
> Linky
> 
> A specific quote from the link -- "_Threadripper 1950X features better L2 and L3 latency than the Ryzen 7 1800X with every type of access pattern_."
> 
> Edit: And I know that I've heard/seen multiple sources state that Threadripper has latency improvements over Ryzen. Might have been in video reviews or something.


Thanks, somehow I wonder if Intel trolls attempt to find their way into the thread to undermine AMD's efforts. I can give exact BIOS and/or Ryzen Master settings for any board to reproduce my settings. Threadripper is an amazing chip. That is why I paid $999 for the 1950X. It is actually the best chip you can purchase under $1,000. I'm not claiming that the 2700X is somehow inferior (outside of having half the cores), but most of AMD's efforts for 12nm were focused on the boost algorithm. This algorithm I suspect could be ported (to a lesser extent) to the Ryzen 1xxx series. However, AMD needed a new chip to fill in the gap to 7nm. As I've stated on other forums, Ryzen, along with Vega, are designed for 7nm. While we can dispute this all we want...well you'll see. In the meantime, we get a 32 core threadripper, etc. Despite AMD being behind in manufacturing process, the LPP process they are using is actually making Ryzen (and by comparison, threadripper) more efficient than Intel at similar clockspeeds. While thestilt over @ anandtech threw out raw numbers, the chips themselves speak for themselves. When it takes an overclocked 8700k or 8086k 5 GHz (along with a ton of power) to overtake a 4 GHz Ryzen chip....hell that's a statement right there...and I say that not as an Intel fanboy. My household has far more Intel chips than AMD....the only AMD chip in my household in active use (I own an Athlon X2, but it's not in use) is my 1950X. I do gaming, development (with multiple VMs), media encoding, etc. and you'll often find me somewhere towards the top of the leaderboards, despite having a 1950X only clocking 4.2GHz - 4.3GHz. I can provide links if necessary. AMD has a 10% IPC disadvantage, but when you include stuff like power, etc. you realize that AMD is the clear winner. 4.2 GHz vs 5 GHz 8700k...wow, I can't even believe people even buy Intel these days, though I try not to judge


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Well ****.
> 
> I just realized that I've been pumping around 1.64v through my 1950X. I switched the clocks back to Auto, but forgot to remove the 0.225v offset I had been running with my P-State overclock. It wasn't running that high all the time, but it would have been while I was gaming (which I've been doing a lot of lately).
> 
> I don't remember exactly what day I did the switch, but it's close to a week ago.
> 
> I wonder how much time that ripped off the CPU's life span...


Well, with me playing around with 1.675-1.7V (I ran Cinebench at 4.5 GHz....the results would make Intel senior management cream their pants...4k multicore and note I'm not anti Intel at all...I own more Intel than AMD systems and I recently sold my AMD stock due to hardship...still own the intel stock) I degraded my chip by 25% over a period of 24 hours or so. However, initially it was all benchmarks so I didn't care much. my chip used to do 1.225 @ 4.0 GHz and 1.325 @ 4.1 GHz. Since beating the hell out of it, it now requires 1.275V for 4.0 and 1.35V @ 4.1. Fine with me, even if I had to buy another chip I wouldn't complain. My chip paid for itself with the articles I've written regarding overclocking performance...I just wish there was a cooler on this planet that could cool these chips outside of LN2. These days it's up to 1.28875 for 4.0 GHz. I plan to ebay both boards and the chip when the new gen Threadripper chips come out and go from there.


----------



## Offler

Some info on Infinity fabric:
https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/amd/infinity_fabric

It seems to me that cores in Threadripper 1900x have definitely higher frequency compared to Ryzen 1x00 series, however full 1950x need to use lower frequencies...

But I definitely see a reason to go with as high RAM frequency with those chips as possible - to have highest possible frequency at CAKE/IFOP.


----------



## betam4x

I still have yet to figure out this heat problem. This chip runs warmer on this ASUS board than it did on the MSI. My MSI stayed well below 68C @ 4.0 GHz with small FFTs. With the same version of Prime95, it runs into the mid 70s. It used to get into the low-mid 70s @ 4.1. Idle temps are in the 30s, even so, I'm beginning to suspect a faulty pump or something. Unfortunately, due to an employer misbehaving (breaking the law) I will have to seek new employment and my small business income is not enough to cover living expenses, but once I do (Interview next week, wish me luck ) I will be planning out a new Threadripper build with full custom loop, Samsung B-die, etc. I will likely wait for the 29xx series to roll out before making any final purchasing decisions (If there is no 16 core for instance, I'll stick with my 1950X unless their higher core count chips can match the clockspeeds of the 1950X). However, I've never gone custom loop before and I want to go with something flashy, so I will need to figure all of that out.


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> I still have yet to figure out this heat problem. This chip runs warmer on this ASUS board than it did on the MSI. My MSI stayed well below 68C @ 4.0 GHz with small FFTs. With the same version of Prime95, it runs into the mid 70s. It used to get into the low-mid 70s @ 4.1. Idle temps are in the 30s, even so, I'm beginning to suspect a faulty pump or something. Unfortunately, due to an employer misbehaving (breaking the law) I will have to seek new employment and my small business income is not enough to cover living expenses, but once I do (Interview next week, wish me luck ) I will be planning out a new Threadripper build with full custom loop, Samsung B-die, etc. I will likely wait for the 29xx series to roll out before making any final purchasing decisions (If there is no 16 core for instance, I'll stick with my 1950X unless their higher core count chips can match the clockspeeds of the 1950X). However, I've never gone custom loop before and I want to go with something flashy, so I will need to figure all of that out.


Have you ever considered that the reported temperatures may not be quite correct? Different manufacturers use different Hardware monitoring ICs and they are calibrated differently. It may just be that the MSI board was reporting lower temps (on purpose or not...) than the ASUS one.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Have you ever considered that the reported temperatures may not be quite correct? Different manufacturers use different Hardware monitoring ICs and they are calibrated differently. It may just be that the MSI board was reporting lower temps (on purpose or not...) than the ASUS one.


Or as others have confirmed, the voltage deliveries, LCC , etc.. are different between brands.


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> Or as others have confirmed, the voltage deliveries, LCC , etc.. are different between brands.


Also that!


----------



## betam4x

I have managed to (finally) dial in similar voltages and similar frequencies. I know the ICs are different, and software monitoring can also be off, but by 10-15+ degrees? I am going to have to find a way to measure the IHS itself. The Enermax TR4 is rated for 500+ watts of TDP. I DO have the Noctua 3k fans installed instead of the built in Enermax ones. The Enermax fans spin at a max of 2350 and the Noctuas spin at 3k, maybe it may be best to switch them back?


----------



## xkm1948

xkm1948 said:


> I say 4.3~4.4GHz max single core boost. All core max turbo at 3.6~3.7GHz probably. The super beefy 18 phase VRM on these crazy 2nd gen X399 should allow overlocking of a 32core64threads to a full 4GHz all core OC.


https://www.techpowerup.com/245301/...of-amd-ryzen-threadripper-32-core-cpu-surface


2990X, 3.4GHz base, 4.0GHz All core turbo.

Freaking hell!


----------



## Tamalero

xkm1948 said:


> https://www.techpowerup.com/245301/...of-amd-ryzen-threadripper-32-core-cpu-surface
> 
> 
> 2990X, 3.4GHz base, 4.0GHz All core turbo.
> 
> Freaking hell!


32 damn cores.. all 4Ghz turbo.. insane!!!


I now wonder how beefy your cooler will be for that monster..
Will noctua have to make an even bigger and denser heatsink?

*edit*

Apparently, that screenshot is supposedly fake according to Anandtech.


----------



## betam4x

xkm1948 said:


> https://www.techpowerup.com/245301/...of-amd-ryzen-threadripper-32-core-cpu-surface
> 
> 
> 2990X, 3.4GHz base, 4.0GHz All core turbo.
> 
> Freaking hell!


It's fake. It was confirmed. Besides, 32 cores @ 4 GHz would require Intel's chiller setup, and regular household breakers would trip, so you'd need a 220 outlet or something with a heavy duty breaker to run it lol.

EDIT: To be clear, many houses have breakers that are rated for 15 amps and those breakers usually power multiple outlets, lights, etc. While newer houses (and some older houses) have 20 amp breakers, they are still shared.


----------



## KyadCK

betam4x said:


> It's fake. It was confirmed. Besides, 32 cores @ 4 GHz would require Intel's chiller setup, and regular household breakers would trip, so you'd need a 220 outlet or something with a heavy duty breaker to run it lol.
> 
> EDIT: To be clear, many houses have breakers that are rated for 15 amps and those breakers usually power multiple outlets, lights, etc. While newer houses (and some older houses) have 20 amp breakers, they are still shared.


4Ghz will not require a chiller. Your math is abysmal.


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> It's fake. It was confirmed. Besides, 32 cores @ 4 GHz would require Intel's chiller setup, and regular household breakers would trip, so you'd need a 220 outlet or something with a heavy duty breaker to run it lol.
> 
> EDIT: To be clear, many houses have breakers that are rated for 15 amps and those breakers usually power multiple outlets, lights, etc. While newer houses (and some older houses) have 20 amp breakers, they are still shared.


It is good that here in Europe we have 220V by default


----------



## Minotaurtoo

betam4x said:


> It's fake. It was confirmed. Besides, 32 cores @ 4 GHz would require Intel's chiller setup, and regular household breakers would trip, so you'd need a 220 outlet or something with a heavy duty breaker to run it lol.
> 
> EDIT: To be clear, many houses have breakers that are rated for 15 amps and those breakers usually power multiple outlets, lights, etc. While newer houses (and some older houses) have 20 amp breakers, they are still shared.


based on what I know of the 2700x I really don't think it will... mines no lottery winner and at 4 ghz it only pulls just over 100 watts... now having been an extreme overclocker of the old FX series I can say that a good water loop can easily dissipate 400 watts of heat with no chiller.... now take into account that threadripper is more efficient per core per clock and surely it'll not take 400 watts.... just remembering the relationship between the 1800x and 1950x.... best approach is let's just wait : ) but I admit that I'm as guilty as anyone on speculating.


----------



## betam4x

KyadCK said:


> 4Ghz will not require a chiller. Your math is abysmal.


Do you even have a Threadripper? Do you know how much power it consumes at 4.0 GHz, even at 1.288V? If not, you have no business in this thread.


----------



## betam4x

KyadCK said:


> 4Ghz will not require a chiller. Your math is abysmal.


32 cores at 4.0 GHz would require a cooler capable of dispersing almost 700 watts of TDP. There currently is no cooler that can cool that high of a TDP outside of LN2 or a chiller. Even the Enermax 360 can only disperse 500 watts or so of heat. for a custom loop, you'd need multiple rads, tons of fans, etc. and even then, you probably wouldn't be able to reach 4.0 GHz due to all the juice you are using to power that gear. In addition, the power requirements from the CPU alone would consume 11-12 amps. Most standard breakers in many homes are 15 amps and are shared between multiple outlets. Have the GPU active? Your breaker will blow. My math was dead on. These readings were based off of readings of my 1950X and slightly reduced in an unscientific manner to account for 12 nm.

EDIT: I should also add that is assuming 1.225V under load. One interesting thing about Threadripper is that power consumption goes up based on the number of cores enabled. This is likely due to the memory controller, etc. So, 700 watts might be a conservative. We could be looking at as possibly as high as 1000 watts of TDP.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

betam4x said:


> 32 cores at 4.0 GHz would require a cooler capable of dispersing almost 700 watts of TDP. There currently is no cooler that can cool that high of a TDP outside of LN2 or a chiller. Even the Enermax 360 can only disperse 500 watts or so of heat. for a custom loop, you'd need multiple rads, tons of fans, etc. and even then, you probably wouldn't be able to reach 4.0 GHz due to all the juice you are using to power that gear. In addition, the power requirements from the CPU alone would consume 11-12 amps. Most standard breakers in many homes are 15 amps and are shared between multiple outlets. Have the GPU active? Your breaker will blow. My math was dead on. These readings were based off of readings of my 1950X and slightly reduced in an unscientific manner to account for 12 nm.
> 
> EDIT: I should also add that is assuming 1.225V under load. One interesting thing about Threadripper is that power consumption goes up based on the number of cores enabled. This is likely due to the memory controller, etc. So, 700 watts might be a conservative. We could be looking at as possibly as high as 1000 watts of TDP.


 ok... 1800x = 95w tdp 1950x=180 tdp with similar boost clocks.... 2700x = 105 with all core boost right at 4ghz.... since 1950x is slightly less than double the tdp of the 1800x with slightly lower base clocks... one can easily assume then that the 32core 2nd gen would be appx 4x 105w at 4ghz give or take a few watts... given that threadripper is the top binned chip I'd say it be right at 400 watts draw at 4ghz under load give or a take a few depending on just well the binning actually is. 



Just doing a quick test on my 2700x at 4ghz with 1.25vcore (more than I need) I was able to determine that under IBT it pulled just over 100 watts over idle power draw... cpu package power was listed as 125 by Hwinfo... cpu+soc listed as 131.... now keep in mind that my 2700x is mediocrity at its finest so even if that was best AMD could do then under worst load possible the 32core chip should be around 540 watts, but that's and extreme case... using amd's own stress test it only hit 85 watts usage... and prime hit just over 100watts both listed as cpu+ soc in Hwinfo. 



Not really buying your math here because in my experience with the 1700 I had before the threadripper chips were well under double the power draw I had clock for clock... trying for 4ghz on that chip I hit nearly 180watts myself (it was a bit of a potato)


Now a word about power dissipation... There are many watercoolers on this site and I've seen them having 2 1080ti's and a 8700K OC'd to 4.9+ ghz before with no issues dissipating that heat... I watched Jay'z two cents hit 600 watt power draw overclocking a 7980xe on water... I would invite some of the water cooling experts here to chime in on this, but I do believe that one 120x480 rad would be adequate based on what I've seen done in other rigs... but I can speak from experience that one 120x360 is overkill for a 9590fx OC'd to 5.2ghz because I did that one... didn't even warm up the fluid too much...think it hit 45C fluid temp with fans on lowest possible speed and was pulling over 400watts... and that chip can't even run stock speeds on a 120x120 aio also I know this because it's running on one now and I had to underclock it to get it to work.


Not trying to pick on you by any means, just not really seeing the math working out there.


----------



## betam4x

Yeah, but we don't know how he had his setup. Sorry I was a little snarky at first, we don't even know how much more efficient Threadripper 2 will be at this point.

At any rate, my ASUS board died last night out of nowhere. Kept saying VGA was bad with a 0C error code and a white light after making BIOS changes last night).

Tried: 

1) Using a different graphics card, as well as testing my existing graphics card in a different machine.
2) Removing battery for 20 minutes and using the reset CMOS jumper (as well as a metal object)
3) BIOS flashback with 3 different drives. Failed all 3 times with a solid light.
4) re-seating the CPU and double checking for bent pins, etc.

Finally, as I was getting ready to RMA I decided to clean the thermal goop off the outside of the socket (the silver part surrounding the socket. In the process, thermal goop fell on to the pins from the rag I was using. I was not happy. My wife had these braces cleaner brushes, real fine comb. Worked great until the very end, then I think I bent a couple pins. I doubt ASUS will let me RMA it now unless I can fix the pins. However, the pins on that socket are so damn small it is practically impossible to fix. They need to make a tool for that, and AMD or board manufacturers need to figure out a better socket mechanism (or a mechanism to have the socket repaired cheaply)

Setting up my old 2600k for right now, RMAing my MSI, MSI actually allows you to get a re-certified board as a replacement in the event of bent pins for $45, and I'll take another look at the asus when I have a chance. I need to get better equipment before I can operate. My current magnifying glass is not strong enough, and I need one of those grip holder things I saw on Linus Tech Tips.

The other thing AMD needs to fix is that plastic tray. It only lasted for 1 good insertion. After that, the CPU keeps falling out, which is dangerous when reseating CPU.


----------



## betam4x

betam4x said:


> Yeah, but we don't know how he had his setup. Sorry I was a little snarky at first, we don't even know how much more efficient Threadripper 2 will be at this point.
> 
> At any rate, my ASUS board died last night out of nowhere. Kept saying VGA was bad with a 0C error code and a white light after making BIOS changes last night).
> 
> Tried:
> 
> 1) Using a different graphics card, as well as testing my existing graphics card in a different machine.
> 2) Removing battery for 20 minutes and using the reset CMOS jumper (as well as a metal object)
> 3) BIOS flashback with 3 different drives. Failed all 3 times with a solid light.
> 4) re-seating the CPU and double checking for bent pins, etc.
> 
> Finally, as I was getting ready to RMA I decided to clean the thermal goop off the outside of the socket (the silver part surrounding the socket. In the process, thermal goop fell on to the pins from the rag I was using. I was not happy. My wife had these braces cleaner brushes, real fine comb. Worked great until the very end, then I think I bent a couple pins. I doubt ASUS will let me RMA it now unless I can fix the pins. However, the pins on that socket are so damn small it is practically impossible to fix. They need to make a tool for that, and AMD or board manufacturers need to figure out a better socket mechanism (or a mechanism to have the socket repaired cheaply)
> 
> Setting up my old 2600k for right now, RMAing my MSI, MSI actually allows you to get a re-certified board as a replacement in the event of bent pins for $45, and I'll take another look at the asus when I have a chance. I need to get better equipment before I can operate. My current magnifying glass is not strong enough, and I need one of those grip holder things I saw on Linus Tech Tips.
> 
> The other thing AMD needs to fix is that plastic tray. It only lasted for 1 good insertion. After that, the CPU keeps falling out, which is dangerous when reseating CPU.



Oh uh IBT doesn't stress the CPU all that much (on my CPU it consumed half the power of prime 95). Try prime 95 with small FFTs at DDR4 3200. You will see power sky rocket. You also need an external device to measure power, since the power used by your CPU has been converted from AC to DC and stepped up/down in voltage. If you do this, you will notice the system is pulling more power than you realize.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

betam4x said:


> Oh uh IBT doesn't stress the CPU all that much (on my CPU it consumed half the power of prime 95). Try prime 95 with small FFTs at DDR4 3200. You will see power sky rocket. You also need an external device to measure power, since the power used by your CPU has been converted from AC to DC and stepped up/down in voltage. If you do this, you will notice the system is pulling more power than you realize.


I do, but I also use hwinfo because it gives little more details than I can with my meter... but I have a wall meter... and prime, even small fft's never pulled much if any more than IBT using avx does... maybe for whatever reason the avx isn't working on your ibt version, I know there is two releases of the same version number out there from the FX days one would barely load up an FX the other would beat it to death... the wall meter actually suggests that power usage is less than Hwinfo does... only climbing 100 watts above idle on the wall meter at 4ghz... using stock settings with overdrive enabled it climbs 130 watts and hits near 4.1ghz all core boost... still just not buying your math.. .yeah peak power under some situations may push beyond what I'm seeing but I haven't seen it and really expect TR2 to be similar to TR1 in that it uses less watts per core per clock than the lower sku's... Just going on what I can see and history there.


----------



## OrionBG

Guys, I don't want to spoil anybody's LN2 dreams but there is an air cooler that is desigled especially for the new Threadrippers from the 16 cores to the 32 cores version.
It is called the Wraith Ripper and is made by Cooler Master. That same cooler was used for the 32 core demo AMD did at Computex...

LINK

Also, currently at full stress of my 1950x (OCed to 4GHz on all cores) the real power consumption is almost about 2x the TDP, so if we put the 250W TDP of the 32 Core TR2xxx in that formula, we get about 450W to 500W...
I guess that it will not go that high but this is a fair estimate. Most good 360mm water coolers should be able to take it.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Guys, I don't want to spoil anybody's LN2 dreams but there is an air cooler that is desigled especially for the new Threadrippers from the 16 cores to the 32 cores version.
> It is called the Wraith Ripper and is made by Cooler Master. That same cooler was used for the 32 core demo AMD did at Computex...
> 
> LINK
> 
> Also, currently at full stress of my 1950x (OCed to 4GHz on all cores) the real power consumption is almost about 2x the TDP, so if we put the 250W TDP of the 32 Core TR2xxx in that formula, we get about 450W to 500W...
> I guess that it will not go that high but this is a fair estimate. Most good 360mm water coolers should be able to take it.


I wonder if Noctua will import the giant triple fan all cooper tower to Threadripper..


----------



## xkm1948

Not a fan of Cooler Master. For air cooler I only trust Noctua.

They did have improved D15 in the pipeline. More heat pipes, higher fin density and of course new fans.






However I do feel like if one is to overclock the 32core beast a custom loop along with a monoblock is required.


----------



## betam4x

Reposting this here:


FINALLY found a drive that worked with BIOS flashback. I was able to flash back to BIOS 0503, which reset CMOS settings to defaults. Once that happened, the system booted. This indicates to me that ASUS has the same problem as MSI when it comes to threadripper. They don't zero out CMOS, but rather do a dirty clear that leaves data left over.

Note that previously I used FAT32 + default selections for formatting the drive prior to this. This time I made sure to format through computer management and made sure 'use default cluster allocation' was selected. whether or not that helped I have no idea. Regardless. These board manufacturers need to step up there game. That is now 2 different manufacturers with the same issue (CMOS only truly cleared on BIOS flashback). I am in the process of putting my system back together.


----------



## Bradwell

Currently I have the MSI Pro Carbon and i was wondering if you guys think i should stink with this mobo for 32 core threadripper or get the new Creation Mobo.


----------



## Tamalero

Bradwell said:


> Currently I have the MSI Pro Carbon and i was wondering if you guys think i should stink with this mobo for 32 core threadripper or get the new Creation Mobo.


Seems all the X399 current motherboards are 8+additional vRMS, the new Creation supposedly will have 8 with load balancing, right?


----------



## Bradwell

will the x399 pro carbon be able to handle the 32 core threadripper at high overclocks?


----------



## dejanh

OrionBG said:


> Guys, I don't want to spoil anybody's LN2 dreams but there is an air cooler that is desigled especially for the new Threadrippers from the 16 cores to the 32 cores version.
> It is called the Wraith Ripper and is made by Cooler Master. That same cooler was used for the 32 core demo AMD did at Computex...
> 
> LINK
> 
> Also, currently at full stress of my 1950x (OCed to 4GHz on all cores) the real power consumption is almost about 2x the TDP, so if we put the 250W TDP of the 32 Core TR2xxx in that formula, we get about 450W to 500W...
> I guess that it will not go that high but this is a fair estimate. Most good 360mm water coolers should be able to take it.


For high TDP chips the issue isn't only about "can the radiator" dissipate the heat, but also about the ability of the CPU water block itself to efficiently transfer heat to water. The current designs and surface area of water blocks may start to run up against some issues with such high TDP chips. There may even be issues with efficient heat transfer from die > IHS > water block itself, then compounded with the design of the block. I personally can't recall any chip that I water-cooled that was pushing the TDP so high. I guess we will find out once the chip launches, but I just don't expect much in the overclocking front.


----------



## dejanh

Duplicate post.


----------



## MNMadman

Bradwell said:


> will the x399 pro carbon be able to handle the 32 core threadripper at high overclocks?


Theoretically, yes. In reality, we have no idea. My Taichi board has limits built in where it won't go over 272 amps despite the VRM theoretically being able to handle 480 amps. I have seen other members here saying the same about other X399 boards. Might be some future BIOS updates increasing those limits.

My 1950X already draws 395W average at 4GHz/1.35v while folding, with peaks at 415W. Going to be a lot of heat coming from the 2990X and the VRM. I already liquid cool my CPU and VRM. I personally wouldn't run a 2990X and the VRM on anything but custom liquid cooling.


----------



## Bradwell

MNMadman said:


> Theoretically, yes. In reality, we have no idea. My Taichi board has limits built in where it won't go over 272 amps despite the VRM theoretically being able to handle 480 amps. I have seen other members here saying the same about other X399 boards. Might be some future BIOS updates increasing those limits.
> 
> My 1950X already draws 395W average at 4GHz/1.35v while folding, with peaks at 415W. Going to be a lot of heat coming from the 2990X and the VRM. I already liquid cool my CPU and VRM. I personally wouldn't run a 2990X and the VRM on anything but custom liquid cooling.


Will it be possible for Ek to make a monoblock for the MSI Creation motherboard? If not, should i just get a waterblock from heatkiller?


----------



## OrionBG

Bradwell said:


> Will it be possible for Ek to make a monoblock for the MSI Creation motherboard? If not, should i just get a waterblock from heatkiller?


EK tried three times until they finally just copied the existing designs from others to get their TR CPU Block right...
The only reason I'm using them is because I wanted a monoblock (to cool also the VRMs) and EK is the only one manufacturer to make monoblocks for the AsRock X399 Taichi...


----------



## Bradwell

OrionBG said:


> EK tried three times until they finally just copied the existing designs from others to get their TR CPU Block right...
> The only reason I'm using them is because I wanted a monoblock (to cool also the VRMs) and EK is the only one manufacturer to make monoblocks for the AsRock X399 Taichi...


I'm just wondering if they'll make a monoblock for the MSI Creation mobo since the vrm is so big on it.


----------



## OrionBG

Bradwell said:


> Will it be possible for Ek to make a monoblock for the MSI Creation motherboard? If not, should i just get a waterblock from heatkiller?


If you are OK with just a CPU block, the one that have shown best results is the XSPC Raystorm NEO TR4 followed closely by the Heatkiller 4. The new EK design should also be OK as it is almost identical to the Heatkiller and the Raystorm. All the monoblocks EK has are using the old coldplate design and although they are passable, the temps will be higher for sure.
I'm using liquid metal between the CPU and the monoblock and this helps me negate a lot of the difference but it is a risky venture to use liquid metal on the outside of any CPU...


----------



## OrionBG

Bradwell said:


> I'm just wondering if they'll make a monoblock for the MSI Creation mobo since the vrm is so big on it.


It's possible... It it proves to be a popular choice for overclockers, they will surely make one.


----------



## Bradwell

OrionBG said:


> It's possible... It it proves to be a popular choice for overclockers, they will surely make one.


How beneficial would it be to get a monoblock for the Creation mobo compared to a heatkiller 4 and sticking with the stock "cooler"


----------



## OrionBG

Bradwell said:


> How beneficial would it be to get a monoblock for the Creation mobo compared to a heatkiller 4 and sticking with the stock "cooler"


For instance I lowered the temperature of my VRMs with 30C with the monoblock vs the CPU block. This translate to cooler Motherboard and less stress on the components. The MSI monster of a board will surely be happy to run cooler especially with the 32 core Threadripper on it.


----------



## Bradwell

OrionBG said:


> For instance I lowered the temperature of my VRMs with 30C with the monoblock vs the CPU block. This translate to cooler Motherboard and less stress on the components. The MSI monster of a board will surely be happy to run cooler especially with the 32 core Threadripper on it.


would you reccomend biting the bullet and buying a waterblock now or try and wait for a monoblock that may never even come out


----------



## OrionBG

Bradwell said:


> would you reccomend biting the bullet and buying a waterblock now or try and wait for a monoblock that may never even come out


Do you have the MSI motherboard already?


----------



## Bradwell

Which waterblock should i go with? The XSPC Raystorm or the Heatkiller IV?


----------



## SavantStrike

Bradwell said:


> Which waterblock should i go with? The XSPC Raystorm or the Heatkiller IV?


Both are excellent choices - it comes down mostly to aesthetics.


----------



## ht_addict

Bradwell said:


> Which waterblock should i go with? The XSPC Raystorm or the Heatkiller IV?


Heatkiller is an assume unit. Used it briefly until i got a monoblock


----------



## MNMadman

Still have the Watercool Heatkiller IV Pro block for TR4 new in box. Didn't like the high VRM temps at all when I tested with an AIO (Enermax LiqTech 280), so I went directly to a monoblock.

If I ever install a CPU block on Threadripper, it will be a Heatkiller.


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> It's possible... It it proves to be a popular choice for overclockers, they will surely make one.


MSI would need to actually offer better overclocking options for that to happen. 

For example, AMD CBS isn't available on the MSI X399 Carbon, any microcode updates to address Spectre, etc aren't either. The last BIOS update was last year. I believe a lot of these guys get the same BIOS code and then customize it to their liking. However, this is likely all done to the lowest bidder.

EDIT: One of these days I might provide a mockup of a concept UEFI interface of how, in my opinion things should look like.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Still have the Watercool Heatkiller IV Pro block for TR4 new in box. Didn't like the high VRM temps at all when I tested with an AIO (Enermax LiqTech 280), so I went directly to a monoblock.
> 
> If I ever install a CPU block on Threadripper, it will be a Heatkiller.


How does the heatkiller perform with the 1950X? Any idea? My Enermax 360 is not working as well as it used to. I'm not sure if it's defective or what. I used to be able to do up to 1.35V at 4.1 GHz and stay at around 67-68C at max load, with 4.0 GHz and lower voltages staying well under that, now, even at 4.0 GHz it's poking into the mid 70s. I might try and RMA the thing, but I have no idea if it's actually malfunctioning or not.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> How does the heatkiller perform with the 1950X? Any idea? My Enermax 360 is not working as well as it used to. I'm not sure if it's defective or what. I used to be able to do up to 1.35V at 4.1 GHz and stay at around 67-68C at max load, with 4.0 GHz and lower voltages staying well under that, now, even at 4.0 GHz it's poking into the mid 70s. I might try and RMA the thing, but I have no idea if it's actually malfunctioning or not.


Never used the Heatkiller - went directly from LiqTech 280 to EK monoblock.

From reviews, it's the best or tied for the best of the TR4 blocks.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Never used the Heatkiller - went directly from LiqTech 280 to EK monoblock.
> 
> From reviews, it's the best or tied for the best of the TR4 blocks.


Which, the heatkiller or the EK? I assume you mean heatkiller, I will keep that in mind.

EDIT: and I wonder if the same will hold true for the 2990X or whatever it will be called.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> Which, the heatkiller or the EK? I assume you mean heatkiller, I will keep that in mind.


Yes, I meant the Heatkiller. Sorry I was unclear.


----------



## gupsterg

Bradwell said:


> Which waterblock should i go with? The XSPC Raystorm or the Heatkiller IV?


The other one to consider is the Bykski offering, rev 1 was tested by HardOCP and within a degree of Raystorm. You'll see it mentioned in the roundup besides a separate review they did.



Spoiler



https://youtu.be/jjvqPT2CmqI?t=5m30s



I'm using rev 2 which has also AM3/AM4 support. They have also done a new iteration where it has OLED screen, shows company logo/water temp. Rev 2 I bought from Aliexpress, ~£40 delivered, pretty much more than half the price of Raystorm, etc. Latest Bkyski is a bit more but cheaper than other offerings when I looked. Only snag I don't like on new version is separate cables for RGB/OLED.


----------



## betam4x

gupsterg said:


> The other one to consider is the Bykski offering, rev 1 was tested by HardOCP and within a degree of Raystorm. You'll see it mentioned in the roundup besides a separate review they did.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> https://youtu.be/jjvqPT2CmqI?t=5m30s
> 
> 
> 
> I'm using rev 2 which has also AM3/AM4 support. They have also done a new iteration where it has OLED screen, shows company logo/water temp. Rev 2 I bought from Aliexpress, ~£40 delivered, pretty much more than half the price of Raystorm, etc. Latest Bkyski is a bit more but cheaper than other offerings when I looked. Only snag I don't like on new version is separate cables for RGB/OLED.


I'm going to be waiting for Threadripper 2 to drop. Depending on turbo frequencies and clock scaling, I'll either get the 32 core version or the 16 core version. I game and also do video encoding and software development, so I will have to take a trade-off if they can't make the 32 core version perform similarly to the 2700x at 8 cores.

EDIT: I also want to see some cooler reviews with the much higher 250 watt TDP. I may also wait a bit for the dust to settle.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> I also want to see some cooler reviews with the much higher 250 watt TDP. I may also wait a bit for the dust to settle.


Why? TDP only matters at stock. I was running my 1950X at 4GHz/1.35v with an Enermax LiqTech 280.

I think custom loops will handle Gen2 fine. Some people might have to increase their rad space though. I don't foresee an issue with my loop -- the only issue I may have is being able to afford the new CPU.


----------



## MNMadman

Anybody else noticing a pattern in the XFR speeds of their CPU?

On mine:
Cores 8-15 get higher speeds first always. Haven't been able to tell so far whether 8-11 or 12-15 is actually first to get 42x multipliers.
Cores 0-3 all get 42x, but later than cores 8-15.
Cores 4-7 don't seem to boosting or XFR as much. After eight hours of monitoring, 4 has 42x, 5 has 41.75x, 6 has 41.25x, and 7 has 37x as the maximum multipliers.

I'm assuming this would be unique to each CPU due to quality and such.


----------



## airisom2

Not sure if this was posted:






Lots of good info there regarding speculative current draw figures of the 32 core. 

I'm horribly paraphrasing here, but basically the only motherboard that can handle an overclocked 32 core and stay within the VRM's efficiency range is the MSI Creation. The other flagship boards can barely manage it due to low phase count. 8 phase designs with 50-60A VRMs is okay for a 16 core, but you basically need double for 32 cores. The low leakage nature of the top 5% chips won't help much either. 

Also, no motherboard out there will be able to handle an LN2 overclock without an external power board as it will pull more power than the 5GHz 28 core Intel showcased. That was a custom board with 4 EPS connectors, and pulling more power through 2 EPS connectors isn't going to cut it. I think he said the 32 core would pull around 1600W for an LN2 run.


----------



## Tamalero

MNMadman said:


> Anybody else noticing a pattern in the XFR speeds of their CPU?
> 
> On mine:
> Cores 8-15 get higher speeds first always. Haven't been able to tell so far whether 8-11 or 12-15 is actually first to get 42x multipliers.
> Cores 0-3 all get 42x, but later than cores 8-15.
> Cores 4-7 don't seem to boosting or XFR as much. After eight hours of monitoring, 4 has 42x, 5 has 41.75x, 6 has 41.25x, and 7 has 37x as the maximum multipliers.
> 
> I'm assuming this would be unique to each CPU due to quality and such.



Cores 4-7 might be the center ones that get higher temps perhaps?


----------



## MNMadman

Tamalero said:


> Cores 4-7 might be the center ones that get higher temps perhaps?


High enough to prevent XFR, on *Heatripper Threadkiller*'s overkill liquid cooling setup? At Auto/stock settings? I highly doubt it.

I'm thinking it's a die quality difference.

The arrangement is likely:
Cores 0-3 are CCX0 on die0
Cores 4-7 are CCX1 on die0
Cores 8-11 are CCX0 on die1
Cores 12-15 are CCX1 on die1

On a fresh boot, by the time the cores have throttled down to 2200MHz, cores 0 and 8-15 have already hit 42x max multiplier. Cores 1-7 hit 37x max multiplier. I've been doing a lot of rebooting due to testing various RAM overclocks, and this pattern happens on _every_ boot.

Edit: I think I'm going to test whether or not there's a pattern in 12-core (and maybe 8-core) mode as well.


----------



## betam4x

airisom2 said:


> Not sure if this was posted:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKe7CnZT9ZE
> 
> Lots of good info there regarding speculative current draw figures of the 32 core.
> 
> I'm horribly paraphrasing here, but basically the only motherboard that can handle an overclocked 32 core and stay within the VRM's efficiency range is the MSI Creation. The other flagship boards can barely manage it due to low phase count. 8 phase designs with 50-60A VRMs is okay for a 16 core, but you basically need double for 32 cores. The low leakage nature of the top 5% chips won't help much either.
> 
> Also, no motherboard out there will be able to handle an LN2 overclock without an external power board as it will pull more power than the 5GHz 28 core Intel showcased. That was a custom board with 4 EPS connectors, and pulling more power through 2 EPS connectors isn't going to cut it. I think he said the 32 core would pull around 1600W for an LN2 run.


Still watching the video, but I think he's going to be wrong about the price points. I think AMD is going to price the 32 core version at $1499 or $1599 and the 24 core version at $1299 or $1399. There have been a view pricing leaks that have them in this ballpark, and realistically it probably only costs AMD around $350 for the 32 core version, so quite honestly they can charge whatever they think it's worth. 

EDIT: Do you mean the 4 pin or 8 pin EPS connectors? My MSI board has 2 8-pin EPS connectors.


----------



## airisom2

Price point not a big deal really. People who want a 32 core are already lined up. But yeah, I meant 2x 8pin EPS connectors. LN2 will melt those wires with all of the current going through them.


----------



## betam4x

airisom2 said:


> Price point not a big deal really. People who want a 32 core are already lined up. But yeah, I meant 2x 8pin EPS connectors. LN2 will melt those wires with all of the current going through them.


I'm actually rather curious as to how the MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon would fair. It has beefier VRMs and 2X8 EPS Connectors. Still have yet to be able to RMA mine due to work issues.


----------



## phas3d

betam4x said:


> I'm actually rather curious as to how the MSI X399 Pro Gaming Carbon would fair. It has beefier VRMs and 2X8 EPS Connectors. Still have yet to be able to RMA mine due to work issues.


I will be testing the 32 core 2990x on the MSI Carbon Pro when it comes available for sale. I'll post my results.


----------



## betam4x

phas3d said:


> I will be testing the 32 core 2990x on the MSI Carbon Pro when it comes available for sale. I'll post my results.


Let us know.  As soon as I get my job situation straightened out, I'll be RMAing mine and I might switch back to it.


----------



## OrionBG

airisom2 said:


> Price point not a big deal really. People who want a 32 core are already lined up. But yeah, I meant 2x 8pin EPS connectors. LN2 will melt those wires with all of the current going through them.


My 1080ti sucks more than 500W from a single six pin and a single 8 pin connectors (XOC BIOS) and the cables don't even get hot! So two 8 pin EPS connectors that have the same or thicker wires, should not have any issues. Will the power draw be out of spec for those connectors/cables... most probably, but this does not mean that they will not be able to handle it just fine.


----------



## airisom2

Now triple that for LN2. Regular OCs for the 32 core will be okay with 2x EPS, but LN2 runs will be a challenge.


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> My 1080ti sucks more than 500W from a single six pin and a single 8 pin connectors (XOC BIOS) and the cables don't even get hot! So two 8 pin EPS connectors that have the same or thicker wires, should not have any issues. Will the power draw be out of spec for those connectors/cables... most probably, but this does not mean that they will not be able to handle it just fine.


That's not how things work. You have to factor in both amps and volts.


----------



## betam4x

airisom2 said:


> Now triple that for LN2. Regular OCs for the 32 core will be okay with 2x EPS, but LN2 runs will be a challenge.


It's all going to come down to the VRMs. Any of the X399 boards will be fine for stock, nearly all of them might overclock a bit, likely none of them will overclock to 4+ GHz. The only reason I am curious about the MSI is due to it's 10+3 setup. I can't find any specs on the VRM setup of the Zenith Extreme, so I don't know if the MSI is unique in this or if the Zenith Extreme has a similar setup. Either way, as I believe I've stated before, overclocking a Zen+ chip is nearly pointless unless doing it under LN2 for demonstration purposes. XFR + PB is reported so aggressive that overclocking to a fixed frequency will actually HURT performance. For instance, in single threaded workloads the 2700X can reach up to 4.3 GHz under the right conditions, while very few 2700X chips can maintain a 24/7 OC at this frequency on all cores (at low voltages). The same will likely be true for the 32 core Threadripper chip.


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> That's not how things work. You have to factor in both amps and volts.


The last time I checked, both EPS 12V and PCI-E GPU connectors are supplying 12V so 500W at 12V for instance, will in both cases be 41.66 Amps


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> The last time I checked, both EPS 12V and PCI-E GPU connectors are supplying 12V so 500W at 12V for instance, will in both cases be 41.66 Amps


That's at 12V, voltages are stepped down for GPUs, CPUs, etc. That's why the Threadripper 1950X, running at stock, can consume 140-180 amps. It gets a bit more technical, and I'm by no means an expert when it comes to the way things work nowadays, but that sums it up. An overclocked Threadripper 1950X at 1.425V on my old board at 4.2 GHz (note that frequency doesn't matter much here, it's all about the voltage) consumes 272 amps under Prime95...well I should say it caps out at 272 amps, there it throttles. There are formulas to calculate this, but I'm way too tired to google them. Buildzoid probably has a video explaining this stuff, I'd recommend checking out his youtube channel.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> That's at 12V, voltages are stepped down for GPUs, CPUs, etc. That's why the Threadripper 1950X, running at stock, can consume 140-180 amps. It gets a bit more technical, and I'm by no means an expert when it comes to the way things work nowadays, but that sums it up. An overclocked Threadripper 1950X at 1.425V on my old board at 4.2 GHz (note that frequency doesn't matter much here, it's all about the voltage) consumes 272 amps under Prime95...well I should say it caps out at 272 amps, there it throttles. There are formulas to calculate this, but I'm way too tired to google them. Buildzoid probably has a video explaining this stuff, I'd recommend checking out his youtube channel.


180 amps? what?
You mean watts?


----------



## OrionBG

betam4x said:


> That's at 12V, voltages are stepped down for GPUs, CPUs, etc. That's why the Threadripper 1950X, running at stock, can consume 140-180 amps. It gets a bit more technical, and I'm by no means an expert when it comes to the way things work nowadays, but that sums it up. An overclocked Threadripper 1950X at 1.425V on my old board at 4.2 GHz (note that frequency doesn't matter much here, it's all about the voltage) consumes 272 amps under Prime95...well I should say it caps out at 272 amps, there it throttles. There are formulas to calculate this, but I'm way too tired to google them. Buildzoid probably has a video explaining this stuff, I'd recommend checking out his youtube channel.


Weren't we talking about cables? What comes through those EPS cables is 12V DC. What the mainboard is converting it to in the VRMs is entirely different conversation (that does not affect the cables at all).
My point was that my GPU can (and does) suck more than 500W/12V (in certain loads) from the two PCI-E power cables (6 + 8 pin) and the cables are quite OK, so with the TR2 sucking about 500W give or take (while OCed) will be quite OK for two 8 pin EPS cables/connectors. Eventually, people like me may have issues, as the Asrock Taichi is with 4 + 8 pin EPS connectors, but we will see.


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> 180 amps? what?
> You mean watts?


Actually I'm almost sure he meant Amps!
I've seen my 1950X going to almost 280A during stress tests. After all P=I.U or in our case I=P/U -> if consumed power P=320W and we are supplying voltage U=1.3V, the electric current I will be 246.15A


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> 180 amps? what?
> You mean watts?


No, amps, remember, voltage is stepped down to 1.2 or 1.3 volts. Take a look at HWinfo, it lists the amps drawn by the CPU on most motherboards. In plain English (and not with total accuracy) VRMs take the 12 V line and downsteps it to 1.2V, amps are measured by taking the voltage and multiplying it by the number of watts. So at 1.2V and 180 watts you are looking at 216 amps.


----------



## RoBiK

betam4x said:


> amps are measured by taking the voltage and multiplying it by the number of watts. So at 1.2V and 180 watts you are looking at 216 amps.


No, you have to divide the power by the voltage. 180 W/1.2 V = 150 A.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Actually I'm almost sure he meant Amps!
> I've seen my 1950X going to almost 280A during stress tests. After all P=I.U or in our case I=P/U -> if consumed power P=320W and we are supplying voltage U=1.3V, the electric current I will be 246.15A


Dear god, then at 3.95Ghz 1.25V consuming 380W on cinebench... thats.. 304 amps??? D:


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> Dear god, then at 3.95Ghz 1.25V consuming 380W on cinebench... thats.. 304 amps??? D:


Yep! Why do you think there are 8 phases x 60A each in the VRM only for the CPU part...  (at least on the Taichi) and also this is why the VRMs get above 100C without good cooling...


----------



## dygkset

hi i have some question

is there any way to unlock 180w power limit not in overclock situation?

i have 1950x and i think i pick very bad die..

in case whit 3000Mhz ram it can get only 3.34Ghz when allcore load
and whit 2400Mhze Ram it reached 3.53Ghz

both case 'CPU Packge power' 180w

is there any why to feed more power to get more clock? whit out set bypass mode?


----------



## MNMadman

dygkset said:


> hi i have some question
> 
> is there any way to unlock 180w power limit not in overclock situation?
> 
> i have 1950x and i think i pick very bad die..
> 
> in case whit 3000Mhz ram it can get only 3.34Ghz when allcore load
> and whit 2400Mhze Ram it reached 3.53Ghz
> 
> both case 'CPU Packge power' 180w
> 
> is there any why to feed more power to get more clock? whit out set bypass mode?


You cannot change the Precision Boost or XFR behavior when using Auto settings. The CPU decides for itself what it does in those instances.

The all-core speed will depend entirely on the load. On mine, doing [email protected] on 32 threads will make most of the cores stay around 3.3-3.5GHz. The all-core speed is supposed to be 3.7GHz, but the load brings the power draw past 180W so it goes below the normal all-core speed.

If I run the CPU in 12C/24T mode, the all-core speed will stay at 3.7GHz when doing [email protected] The power draw is less than 180W in that instance, so it can use the full all-core speed. The same goes for 16C/16T mode (SMT off).


----------



## dygkset

MNMadman said:


> You cannot change the Precision Boost or XFR behavior when using Auto settings. The CPU decides for itself what it does in those instances.
> 
> The all-core speed will depend entirely on the load. On mine, doing [email protected] on 32 threads will make most of the cores stay around 3.3-3.5GHz. The all-core speed is supposed to be 3.7GHz, but the load brings the power draw past 180W so it goes below the normal all-core speed.
> 
> If I run the CPU in 12C/24T mode, the all-core speed will stay at 3.7GHz when doing [email protected] The power draw is less than 180W in that instance, so it can use the full all-core speed. The same goes for 16C/16T mode (SMT off).



thanks a lot....


----------



## betam4x

dygkset said:


> hi i have some question
> 
> is there any way to unlock 180w power limit not in overclock situation?
> 
> i have 1950x and i think i pick very bad die..
> 
> in case whit 3000Mhz ram it can get only 3.34Ghz when allcore load
> and whit 2400Mhze Ram it reached 3.53Ghz
> 
> both case 'CPU Packge power' 180w
> 
> is there any why to feed more power to get more clock? whit out set bypass mode?


Try these steps, stopping if/when the problem goes away:

1) Download HWinfo64 and verify that your clocks are indeed running at that speed. Task Manager can sometimes report inaccurate clocks, (Task manager averages the clock speed between all cores I believe, if min processor state is set to something like 1%, your cores will idle at 2.2 GHz, the active ones will boost up as needed, causing odd clock speeds to appear). Also, I've noticed that HPET can affect task manager.
2) after booting up and logging in, push hold down the windows key and push R, then type 'powercfg.cpl' and push OK. Choose either Ryzen Balanced or High Performance.
3) Go into UEFI -> On the Save and Exit screen, choose 'Load Optimized Defaults' and then save an exit.
4) Boot up, make sure to install the AMD chipset drivers.
5) Is your your RAM on the manufactuer's QVL? Did you follow the motherboard's user guide for placement? Did you use the correct number of sticks according to the QVL?

To further diagnose, you need to provide your specific RAM and motherboard model.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> You cannot change the Precision Boost or XFR behavior when using Auto settings. The CPU decides for itself what it does in those instances.
> 
> The all-core speed will depend entirely on the load. On mine, doing [email protected] on 32 threads will make most of the cores stay around 3.3-3.5GHz. The all-core speed is supposed to be 3.7GHz, but the load brings the power draw past 180W so it goes below the normal all-core speed.
> 
> If I run the CPU in 12C/24T mode, the all-core speed will stay at 3.7GHz when doing [email protected] The power draw is less than 180W in that instance, so it can use the full all-core speed. The same goes for 16C/16T mode (SMT off).


He stated his CPU was dropping BELOW the 3.4 GHz threshold. I've never had my 1950X do that, even under the heaviest of loads. Have you? If so that would seem to be a bug that AMD needs to fix.

Edit: I recommended to him to follow the steps above. I suspect he is using the task manager to monitor clock speeds. I have a custom power plan on my system, so any cores that aren't in use idle down to 2.2 GHz (I wish you could make them idle lower).


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> He stated his CPU was dropping BELOW the 3.4 GHz threshold. I've never had my 1950X do that, even under the heaviest of loads. Have you? If so that would seem to be a bug that AMD needs to fix.
> 
> Edit: I recommended to him to follow the steps above. I suspect he is using the task manager to monitor clock speeds. I have a custom power plan on my system, so any cores that aren't in use idle down to 2.2 GHz (I wish you could make them idle lower).


Yes, mine do go below the 3.4GHz base clock when loaded with [email protected] I'm sure that's not the only thing that does it, but it is the one I first noticed it happening. I figure CPU stress programs do it too (will confirm tonight after work). I have cores doing 32xxMHz and 33xxMHz fairly often under those loads.

If I disable SMT or cores, it will stay at the 3.7GHz all-core speed in [email protected]

I run the High Performance profile, modified to have the cores down-clock at idle. The primary idle clock is 2200MHz, but I do see cores go down to 2000MHz (usually just one at a time).


----------



## dygkset

betam4x said:


> Try these steps, stopping if/when the problem goes away:
> 
> 1) Download HWinfo64 and verify that your clocks are indeed running at that speed. Task Manager can sometimes report inaccurate clocks, (Task manager averages the clock speed between all cores I believe, if min processor state is set to something like 1%, your cores will idle at 2.2 GHz, the active ones will boost up as needed, causing odd clock speeds to appear). Also, I've noticed that HPET can affect task manager.
> 2) after booting up and logging in, push hold down the windows key and push R, then type 'powercfg.cpl' and push OK. Choose either Ryzen Balanced or High Performance.
> 3) Go into UEFI -> On the Save and Exit screen, choose 'Load Optimized Defaults' and then save an exit.
> 4) Boot up, make sure to install the AMD chipset drivers.
> 5) Is your your RAM on the manufactuer's QVL? Did you follow the motherboard's user guide for placement? Did you use the correct number of sticks according to the QVL?
> 
> To further diagnose, you need to provide your specific RAM and motherboard model.


 yes i allready use HWinfo64 and Ryzen balanced setting, and latist driver..
and use SAMSUNG 8G ram X 4

i already found key point is Power Usage, in default mod.. there is 180w limit...
and my 1950 reached that point in 3.3Ghz when doing cinebench whit overclocked(3000mhz) ram
whit stock clock memory then it reached 3.5 Ghz


----------



## MNMadman

MNMadman said:


> Yes, mine do go below the 3.4GHz base clock when loaded with [email protected] I'm sure that's not the only thing that does it, but it is the one I first noticed it happening. I figure CPU stress programs do it too (will confirm tonight after work). I have cores doing 32xxMHz and 33xxMHz fairly often under those loads.
> 
> If I disable SMT or cores, it will stay at the 3.7GHz all-core speed in [email protected]
> 
> I run the High Performance profile, modified to have the cores down-clock at idle. The primary idle clock is 2200MHz, but I do see cores go down to 2000MHz (usually just one at a time).


Okay, I did some more testing.

With RAM at 3200 and 16C/32T...
Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset: Multipliers ranged from 33.5x to 34.25x.
[email protected]: Frequently saw multipliers down to 32x with max multiplier being 36.5x.
Y-Cruncher: Multipliers ranged from 34.5x to 35.25x.
Cinebench R15: Multipliers ranged from 34.5x to 37x.
RealBench: Multipliers ranged from 34.25x to 37x.

I don't know what it is about [email protected] that makes the multipliers go below the base speed on many cores, but it does frequently. Prime95 also does it, but to a much lesser extent.


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Okay, I did some more testing.
> 
> With RAM at 3200 and 16C/32T...
> Prime95 v29.4b8 Small FFT preset: Multipliers ranged from 33.5x to 34.25x.
> [email protected]: Frequently saw multipliers down to 32x with max multiplier being 36.5x.
> Y-Cruncher: Multipliers ranged from 34.5x to 35.25x.
> Cinebench R15: Multipliers ranged from 34.5x to 37x.
> RealBench: Multipliers ranged from 34.25x to 37x.
> 
> I don't know what it is about [email protected] that makes the multipliers go below the base speed on many cores, but it does frequently. Prime95 also does it, but to a much lesser extent.


I will have to try out [email protected] at some point to see if it happens to me. I wonder if it's only for certain boards.
EDIT: Prime95 drops down to 3.4 GHz for me with Small FFT preset. It might be that I have the latest Threadripper AGESA, or maybe the ASROCK VRMs aren't up to spec.


----------



## MNMadman

betam4x said:


> I will have to try out [email protected] at some point to see if it happens to me. I wonder if it's only for certain boards.
> EDIT: Prime95 drops down to 3.4 GHz for me with Small FFT preset. It might be that I have the latest Threadripper AGESA, or maybe the ASROCK VRMs aren't up to spec.


Could also be because my board didn't have a full-length thermal pad on the MOSFETs. Two of them were completely uncovered and therefore received no cooling whatsoever from the heat sink. It was that way for a whole week of stressing the system to the max before I got the EK monoblock and discovered the problem.

And yes, I'm using the P2.00 BIOS which has AGESA 1.0.0.4. The L1.91E beta BIOS with AGESA 1.0.0.6 gives me low performance when overclocking, even when doing basic Windows tasks (higher voltages didn't help this).


----------



## betam4x

MNMadman said:


> Could also be because my board didn't have a full-length thermal pad on the MOSFETs. Two of them were completely uncovered and therefore received no cooling whatsoever from the heat sink. It was that way for a whole week of stressing the system to the max before I got the EK monoblock and discovered the problem.
> 
> And yes, I'm using the P2.00 BIOS which has AGESA 1.0.0.4. The L1.91E beta BIOS with AGESA 1.0.0.6 gives me low performance when overclocking, even when doing basic Windows tasks (higher voltages didn't help this).


Except you aren't the only one who has claimed this has happened. TheStilt has stated as such as well.


----------



## Tamalero

MNMadman said:


> Could also be because my board didn't have a full-length thermal pad on the MOSFETs. Two of them were completely uncovered and therefore received no cooling whatsoever from the heat sink. It was that way for a whole week of stressing the system to the max before I got the EK monoblock and discovered the problem.
> 
> And yes, I'm using the P2.00 BIOS which has AGESA 1.0.0.4. The L1.91E beta BIOS with AGESA 1.0.0.6 gives me low performance when overclocking, even when doing basic Windows tasks (higher voltages didn't help this).


It seems that they went too far to try to achieve memory compatibility that they left the overclocking and XFR side in a very bad spot.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> It seems that they went too far to try to achieve memory compatibility that they left the overclocking and XFR side in a very bad spot.


I've always had bad luck with XFR anyways, despite temps being well under control (under 50C), I rarely hit 4.2 GHz on my other board. On this board if I enable Sense Mi Skew I get XFR to function properly.

Current X399 boards IMO are just too buggy/immature. An example with ASUS boards is having the AMD CBS menu duplicate many of the settings that ASUS already allows you to set elsewhere. Which one overrides which? Why doesn't ASUS clean things up?


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> I've always had bad luck with XFR anyways, despite temps being well under control (under 50C), I rarely hit 4.2 GHz on my other board. On this board if I enable Sense Mi Skew I get XFR to function properly.
> 
> Current X399 boards IMO are just too buggy/immature. An example with ASUS boards is having the AMD CBS menu duplicate many of the settings that ASUS already allows you to set elsewhere. Which one overrides which? Why doesn't ASUS clean things up?


I think I was lucky in this aspect as XFR always went to 4.2Ghz on 2 cores at least in my system.. and sustained 3.7Ghz on all core boost under "standard" default settings for my ASUS board.

Regarding the bioses.. the newest bios and new agesa definitively lowered my OC and did not help my memory compatibility at all ( had to switch to B Die Samsung memory).


----------



## ssateneth

MNMadman said:


> Could also be because my board didn't have a full-length thermal pad on the MOSFETs. Two of them were completely uncovered and therefore received no cooling whatsoever from the heat sink. It was that way for a whole week of stressing the system to the max before I got the EK monoblock and discovered the problem.
> 
> And yes, I'm using the P2.00 BIOS which has AGESA 1.0.0.4. The L1.91E beta BIOS with AGESA 1.0.0.6 gives me low performance when overclocking, even when doing basic Windows tasks (higher voltages didn't help this).


L1.91E has a bug when overclocking that it makes the clock tick faster, which affects some scores (a benchmark that doesnt have good scaling with increasing CPU speed will appear to have worse score overclocked than when stock)


----------



## jepz

Hi there,

Very happy with TR4/X399 platform until now, before Threadripper I had a X99/[email protected] that died because of an old PSU (CPU and MOBO died together) 

The rig:

 



Just got some numbers with 1920x + Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7 board + 32GB AFR [email protected]:

website to upload photos and get url

Temps doing fine at 70ºC maximum (Amb. Temp about 25ºC) with a Corsair H115i.


Also, I have some questions:

1) Memory speed seems to have 3733/3866 and 4000MHz support in BIOS, does it worth a try? Is Threadripper limited somehow to 3600 memory OC?

2) WinRAR benchmark tool gives a very poor result with AMD Ryzen CPUs, just to exemplify, I could get 33000 score with the mentioned 5960x and now I just hit 13-16000 score, is there some CPU instruction that favors the Intel in this particular case?


Tks!


----------



## betam4x

I think I'm going to RMA my Enermax. 4 cores enabled, still spiking into 70+ degrees.


----------



## MNMadman

jepz said:


> 1) Memory speed seems to have 3733/3866 and 4000MHz support in BIOS, does it worth a try? Is Threadripper limited somehow to 3600 memory OC?


You're lucky if you get RAM to work at 3600 on any Zen/Zen+ CPU. You can try for higher, but the chances get lower the higher you go.



jepz said:


> 2) WinRAR benchmark tool gives a very poor result with AMD Ryzen CPUs, just to exemplify, I could get 33000 score with the mentioned 5960x and now I just hit 13-16000 score, is there some CPU instruction that favors the Intel in this particular case?


My 1950X does the same thing with the WinRAR bench. I noticed the overall CPU usage topped out at around 52% or so in HWiNFO64, and all of the cores were clocked at 3700MHz for the duration (currently using Auto clocks). So yeah, there must be some advantage for Intel architectures.


----------



## Tamalero

MNMadman said:


> You're lucky if you get RAM to work at 3600 on any Zen/Zen+ CPU. You can try for higher, but the chances get lower the higher you go.
> 
> 
> My 1950X does the same thing with the WinRAR bench. I noticed the overall CPU usage topped out at around 52% or so in HWiNFO64, and all of the cores were clocked at 3700MHz for the duration (currently using Auto clocks). So yeah, there must be some advantage for Intel architectures.


What about the 7zip bench? you see this similar behavior?


----------



## MNMadman

Tamalero said:


> What about the 7zip bench? you see this similar behavior?


Clock speed yes. Usage no -- it ranged from 6.6% to 100% with an average of 80.4% after 16 passes.


----------



## 4Strings

betam4x said:


> I think I'm going to RMA my Enermax. 4 cores enabled, still spiking into 70+ degrees.


Might have to do the same. On a 360mm rad in push-pull, I'm sitting at ~40-45C _at idle_ with all stock settings... Might just wait for the Be Quiet Dark Rock Pro TR4 to come out in august and ditch water cooling until I have the time and patience to go full custom...

And all this is before going into all the problems I'm having with the f-ed up BIOS on my Asus Prime X399...


----------



## Gilles3000

If you don't want to wait, the Thermalright Silver Arrow TR4 just released, its already available for about €80.

Its not as pretty as the Dark Rock Pro TR4, but knowing Thermalright, it should perform really well.

http://thermalright.com/product/silver-arrow-tr4/


----------



## Tamalero

Gilles3000 said:


> If you don't want to wait, the Thermalright Silver Arrow TR4 just released, its already available for about €80.
> 
> Its not as pretty as the Dark Rock Pro TR4, but knowing Thermalright, it should perform really well.
> 
> http://thermalright.com/product/silver-arrow-tr4/


I'm still wondering how it compares to the big Noctua. Id love an improvement in thermals as well, specially under heavy load.
70C feels a bit too high for me.


----------



## Lemon Wolf

betam4x said:


> I think I'm going to RMA my Enermax. 4 cores enabled, still spiking into 70+ degrees.


Same here, temperatures started to rise and rise a while ago. I cant even overclock anymore as temperatures go up to almost 90C.


----------



## Tamalero

Lemon Wolf said:


> Same here, temperatures started to rise and rise a while ago. I cant even overclock anymore as temperatures go up to almost 90C.


Did you guys check if your pump is working and the fans are working?
Remember some X399 boards have a faulty sensor that when you query too many times.. It will freeze the fans and the fans will stop working (in watercooling cases.. the pump will stop)


----------



## betam4x

Fans or pump never stop for me on my AIO. It just seems like the pump does't work as well as it used to. Not getting close to what reviewers got or what I used to get. At stock it hovers in the mid 30s and gets up to around 60C under Prime95 or IBT.


----------



## OsmiumOC

Hello ppl, I just got my Threadripper build finished.
A bit late to the party, but the current pricing is very convenient.

Just got everything set up and running for now, final OC results will have to follow later. I have it running under a custom loop with the Heatkiller IV full copper block. MB is the Asus ROG Strix X399 with some street mods to the VRM-cooling (e.g. removing the plastic shroud and replacing the useless noise generator on it with a bigger and actually useful fan)
My baseline with 3000MHz RAM and all cores at a modest 3825MHz:




Since it´s summer, ambient temps are at 24-27°C. Under full load for 30 minutes the package temp settles at ~57°C. I´ll see now where I can get from here. 
A bit more LLC would be nice, I´m already at the 3rd highest setting and still go down to 1.25V from 1.3V. 
I´m happy that the weeks and months that went into preparing this build finally paid off. Even if it meant my 1800X system had to go (didn´t hurt to bad, that 1800X needed 1.375V for 3.9GHz and didn´t want 4GHz no matter what. Before anyone gets mad at me, I did not run it like that 24/7 and sold it a year later, I ran it at 1.2V and 3.8GHz 24/7).


----------



## josephimports

Thank you Asus for including the Stilt's b-die memory profiles in the bios of the X399 Prime. Scored 1900 points in cb15 with his 3466 memory profile and 4175mhz on the 1900X without much effort.


----------



## Turikxc

Hi all,

I have a question, I would like to overclock my 1950x to 3.9.
I have difficulty finding CPU voltage, basically my system unstable. Temperature is good.

Do you have any suggestions or recommendations?

Thanks!


----------



## Ithanul

josephimports said:


> 1900x for $275 newegg/ebay. Open box X399 Prime from MC for $175. No hiccups thus far. Thank you Asus for including the Stilt's b-die memory profiles in the bios. I set the 3200 safe profile on my 3733mhz sticks and off it went.


Nice. That one sweet deal for a TR.


Myself though, I think I will be selling one of my TRs off. Not bad chips, but found out ESXi support is kind of hit and miss on them (by what I read around on some forums). Along with Civ 5 giving headaches running on it (it will run alright for a bit then crash with no errors).


----------



## MNMadman

Turikxc said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I have a question, I would like to overclock my 1950x to 3.9.
> I have difficulty finding CPU voltage, basically my system unstable. Temperature is good.
> 
> Do you have any suggestions or recommendations?
> 
> Thanks!


A list of your system's hardware would be helpful.

As a general guideline, an all-core overclock on Threadripper will only benefit you if you run software that uses all cores. Precision Boost and XFR will get you better performance if you are using less than all the cores.

If you want to do the manual overclock, my 1950X required 1.35000v for 4.0GHz but only 1.21250v for 3.9GHz. You can use those as baselines and adjust from there. Note that your CPU might be better or worse than mine due to the silicon lottery.


----------



## Tamalero

Turikxc said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I have a question, I would like to overclock my 1950x to 3.9.
> I have difficulty finding CPU voltage, basically my system unstable. Temperature is good.
> 
> Do you have any suggestions or recommendations?
> 
> Thanks!


How much voltage are you pumping right now for 3.9Ghz?
Start with 1.25V and then go slowly higher until you hit stability.

Remember its a game of balance between the VCORE and the MEMORY side (Vram and Vsoc). Your processor might look like its unstable but could be the VSOC or the RAM that is unstable.


And in my experience. Threadripper suffers of "thresholds" of stability based on Temperature.
I Can do 1.28V @ 4Ghz if my temps REMAIN below 50C.
But as soon I hit 60C.. my processor will crash and require 1.30V to regain stability above 60C.

Then it reaches ANOTHER threshold at 72C. Its stable at 1.30V while BELOW 60C (my AC cranked to max allows me to see this behavior of thresholds ). Once I hit 73C.. my cpu will crash and require 1.35V to maintain stability at 4.Ghz (I cant pump anything more than 1.35V without overwhelming my NOCTUA TR4SP3. As anything above 1.32V will easily make the Tcore reach 80+C on Prime..


----------



## Heidi

I have tried to source any experience on the following...
Since TR is basically 2 complete CPU in one package, and, consists of two separate memory controllers..what's the point having quad channel RAM?
I am thinking to obtain two dual channels and insert them in slots on each side...coz...I understand Intel quad..but this one is essentially two dual channel by two...
Am I missing anything?


----------



## Offler

Heidi said:


> I have tried to source any experience on the following...
> Since TR is basically 2 complete CPU in one package, and, consists of two separate memory controllers..what's the point having quad channel RAM?
> I am thinking to obtain two dual channels and insert them in slots on each side...coz...I understand Intel quad..but this one is essentially two dual channel by two...
> Am I missing anything?


Well. threadripper has 4 separate silicon dies... and each die has 2 memory controllers... So basically... it could be 8 channels, but they kept "just" 4.


----------



## OrionBG

Heidi said:


> I have tried to source any experience on the following...
> Since TR is basically 2 complete CPU in one package, and, consists of two separate memory controllers..what's the point having quad channel RAM?
> I am thinking to obtain two dual channels and insert them in slots on each side...coz...I understand Intel quad..but this one is essentially two dual channel by two...
> Am I missing anything?


There is NO such thing as Dual Channel memory or Quad Channel memory when you are purchasing RAM. It is all marketing and nothing more. There is ABSOLUTELY NO difference if you are going to by 4 DIMMs of the same model separately or buy two Dual Channel Kits or one Quad Channel kit. They are just putting two or four DIMMs in one box for convenience.
The only "benefit" that you might get is sequential serial numbers which may (or may not) mean that the modules are from the same manufacturing batch and have mostly identical manufacturing tolerances, but with modern factories and processes everything mostly identically manufactured so it doesn't matter anyway.
For instance I'm using two "Dual Channel"kits of G.Skill TridentZ RGB 3200MHz CAS14 RAM and The CPU can't care less that they are not one "Quad Channel" kit


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> There is NO such thing as Dual Channel memory or Quad Channel memory when you are purchasing RAM. It is all marketing and nothing more. There is ABSOLUTELY NO difference if you are going to by 4 DIMMs of the same model separately or buy two Dual Channel Kits or one Quad Channel kit. They are just putting two or four DIMMs in one box for convenience.
> The only "benefit" that you might get is sequential serial numbers which may (or may not) mean that the modules are from the same manufacturing batch and have mostly identical manufacturing tolerances, but with modern factories and processes everything mostly identically manufactured so it doesn't matter anyway.
> For instance I'm using two "Dual Channel"kits of G.Skill TridentZ RGB 3200MHz CAS14 RAM and The CPU can't care less that they are not one "Quad Channel" kit


Somebody is confusing something. Dual/quad channel RAM has nothing to do with the kits of DIMMs per say. However, you DO need 2 DIMMs for dual channel and 4 DIMMs for quad channel. I don't expect there to be much of an issue with the 32 core version of Threadripper. Despite what sources say, I expect all memory controllers to be enabled, but with only 4 at a time active, with which 4 being dependent on NUMA/UMA mode.


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> There is NO such thing as Dual Channel memory or Quad Channel memory when you are purchasing RAM. It is all marketing and nothing more. There is ABSOLUTELY NO difference if you are going to by 4 DIMMs of the same model separately or buy two Dual Channel Kits or one Quad Channel kit. They are just putting two or four DIMMs in one box for convenience.
> The only "benefit" that you might get is sequential serial numbers which may (or may not) mean that the modules are from the same manufacturing batch and have mostly identical manufacturing tolerances, but with modern factories and processes everything mostly identically manufactured so it doesn't matter anyway.
> For instance I'm using two "Dual Channel"kits of G.Skill TridentZ RGB 3200MHz CAS14 RAM and The CPU can't care less that they are not one "Quad Channel" kit


Price wise, some of these kits are cheaper than buying individual sticks.
Apart from that you're completely right.

Unless you buy corsair and you have the bad luck to get hit by different versions.
Which can vary of the memory modules used (Hynix, E die, B die and Micron mixed up in some of their platinum series for example)


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Price wise, some of these kits are cheaper than buying individual sticks.
> Apart from that you're completely right.
> 
> Unless you buy corsair and you have the bad luck to get hit by different versions.
> Which can vary of the memory modules used (Hynix, E die, B die and Micron mixed up in some of their platinum series for example)


Yes, corsair drives me nuts with this. There should be a class action lawsuit against some of these folks. Different memory, same model, different timings (which leads to different latencies which translates indirectly to different speeds).


----------



## OsmiumOC

OrionBG said:


> [...] The only "benefit" that you might get is sequential serial numbers which may (or may not) mean that the modules are from the same manufacturing batch and have mostly identical manufacturing tolerances, but with modern factories and processes everything mostly identically manufactured so it doesn't matter anyway.
> For instance I'm using two "Dual Channel"kits of G.Skill TridentZ RGB 3200MHz CAS14 RAM and The CPU can't care less that they are not one "Quad Channel" kit


Yes I did the same with G.Skill kits, it doesn´t matter. For serial numbers, I bought 2 separate kits and got nearly matching sticks with endings 51/52 and 57/58, so there is a high chance you even get the same batch when ordering the 2 kits at once. 





Tamalero said:


> Price wise, some of these kits are cheaper than buying individual sticks.
> Apart from that you're completely right.
> 
> Unless you buy corsair and you have the bad luck to get hit by different versions.
> Which can vary of the memory modules used (Hynix, E die, B die and Micron mixed up in some of their platinum series for example)


Just want to add, the other side of pricing can be true too. For example my 2x G.Skill dual kits were cheaper then the same model quad kit. A substantial amount even, ~30$. 
Maybe that is the same with corsair, and they try to force consumers into buying more expensive quad kits with their different memory modules.


----------



## Yamie

Turikxc said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I have a question, I would like to overclock my 1950x to 3.9.
> I have difficulty finding CPU voltage, basically my system unstable. Temperature is good.
> 
> Do you have any suggestions or recommendations?
> 
> Thanks!


I am stable at 4.0 Ghz with just 1.3 V with LLC set to LOW
But as long as temps are good you can go higher

Usually 4.1 Ghz needs 1.35 V and anything above isn't recommended because 4.2 Ghz could take up to 1.5 V to be stable

To be stable at 3.9 Ghz I needed 1.28V


edit: btw I only use a 360AiO for cooling [Enermax LiqTech TR4]


All on a x399 Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7 with now 64GB DDR4 @ 3200 14-14-14-34 @1.35V [F4-3200C14Q-32GTZRX]


----------



## Tamalero

OsmiumOC said:


> Yes I did the same with G.Skill kits, it doesn´t matter. For serial numbers, I bought 2 separate kits and got nearly matching sticks with endings 51/52 and 57/58, so there is a high chance you even get the same batch when ordering the 2 kits at once.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just want to add, the other side of pricing can be true too. For example my 2x G.Skill dual kits were cheaper then the same model quad kit. A substantial amount even, ~30$.
> Maybe that is the same with corsair, and they try to force consumers into buying more expensive quad kits with their different memory modules.


The corsair 4x kits usually have Ram active coolers that the dual kits do not have.
Hence the price hike.
For Gskill no idea.


----------



## Heidi

Thanks on asnwers...and I do know that in digital tech we have no such a thing as a dual or quad, unless manufacturers explicitly program SPD to tell the CPU that it is talking to the stick 1 of 4 in the system, as I have found in my X99 systems to be the case...
Reason why I asked the question is, that same capacity, like, 64Gb consists of 4 DIMMs usually dictate premium in price, so quad Trident Z 3200 64Gb will cost U$971.95 at Amazon...while two sets of same (32+32) will $438.95+$438.95...therefore cheaper...so premium is charged over the dual channel!
My question remain the same...will TR be able to use dual (marketing, agree) channel stable, efficiently and reliable or I really must shell out for a more expensive quad marketed ones!
Did anyone even tried to test that?
All I have found was single vs dual vs quad...but that do not answer my question...I want quad channel but build of two dual channel kits...
p.s.
And coolers on DDR4 DIMMs are gimmick...had HyperX Predator with HUUUGEEE block of aluminum which obstruct any decent cooler to be attached while RAM temp rarely raised ambient temps...I am also looking for advice of really low profile Sammy B die at 3200 C14 variant...any hints?


----------



## OrionBG

Heidi said:


> Thanks on asnwers...and I do know that in digital tech we have no such a thing as a dual or quad, unless manufacturers explicitly program SPD to tell the CPU that it is talking to the stick 1 of 4 in the system, as I have found in my X99 systems to be the case...
> Reason why I asked the question is, that same capacity, like, 64Gb consists of 4 DIMMs usually dictate premium in price, so quad Trident Z 3200 64Gb will cost U$971.95 at Amazon...while two sets of same (32+32) will $438.95+$438.95...therefore cheaper...so premium is charged over the dual channel!
> My question remain the same...will TR be able to use dual (marketing, agree) channel stable, efficiently and reliable or I really must shell out for a more expensive quad marketed ones!
> Did anyone even tried to test that?
> All I have found was single vs dual vs quad...but that do not answer my question...I want quad channel but build of two dual channel kits...
> p.s.
> And coolers on DDR4 DIMMs are gimmick...had HyperX Predator with HUUUGEEE block of aluminum which obstruct any decent cooler to be attached while RAM temp rarely raised ambient temps...I am also looking for advice of really low profile Sammy B die at 3200 C14 variant...any hints?


Me and several other people already mentioned that we are using 2x "Dual Channel" kits with our Threadrippers.
Also during my 20 years of experience working in PC building and repair shops, I've never worked on a system that *Required* "Dual Channel" or "Quad Channel" memory kits including X99. There is no such thing of numbering of RAM modules (for specific RAM Channel) inside the SPD.


----------



## Heidi

I am also in this business for a long time...and I had shocking experience running my X79 with 2 dual kits...regardless of boards, Asus, MSI or Giga...all gave me a lots of trouble until I replaced with the same set but of four G.Skills...all trouble was simple gone...
But this is entirely different...it is basically 2+2 channels and therefore by my opinion doesn't need any sort or form of quad "matched" sticks...matched is a gimmick, it is a digital stuff so no matching at all here...it is eaither 1 or 0...the only thing that thing does is some bit turned on to tell memory controller that the sticks belong to the one set...this is all!
Can't prove it, but regardless I asked just to see if anyone got any issue with!
I did search for weeks on such subject, but really couldn't source any word on it...it was single vs dual vs quad...in that order, but no mention of running "quad" with two dual sets...
Glad you guys helped me!


----------



## betam4x

Heidi said:


> Thanks on asnwers...and I do know that in digital tech we have no such a thing as a dual or quad, unless manufacturers explicitly program SPD to tell the CPU that it is talking to the stick 1 of 4 in the system, as I have found in my X99 systems to be the case...
> Reason why I asked the question is, that same capacity, like, 64Gb consists of 4 DIMMs usually dictate premium in price, so quad Trident Z 3200 64Gb will cost U$971.95 at Amazon...while two sets of same (32+32) will $438.95+$438.95...therefore cheaper...so premium is charged over the dual channel!
> My question remain the same...will TR be able to use dual (marketing, agree) channel stable, efficiently and reliable or I really must shell out for a more expensive quad marketed ones!
> Did anyone even tried to test that?
> All I have found was single vs dual vs quad...but that do not answer my question...I want quad channel but build of two dual channel kits...
> p.s.
> And coolers on DDR4 DIMMs are gimmick...had HyperX Predator with HUUUGEEE block of aluminum which obstruct any decent cooler to be attached while RAM temp rarely raised ambient temps...I am also looking for advice of really low profile Sammy B die at 3200 C14 variant...any hints?


If you are asking whether you can run Threadripper in dual channel mode...absolutely. However, you will SEVERELY hurt system performance, as die1 now must talk to die0 in order to get the information it needs. by running quad channel, there is lower probability of this happening. In short, you want 4 sticks of RAM and not 2.


----------



## OsmiumOC

Does anyone here have experience with the AGESA 1.0.0.5 update for X399?
And in general about stability with newer bios versions... I have the Asus ROG Strix X399-E and encountered some very random freezes. Rolled back all OC, set ram back to basic 2400 specs and ran prime95, 14 memtest passes on the modules. No crash/freeze and no error. GPU is back to stock either, switched back to the stock bios on the card. Ran several CPU and GPU benchmarks, I just can´t reproduce the freezes but they still happen out of the blue.
New Windows install, new chipset drivers, everything new. No result 

I checked the bios version of my board and saw I´m still on the very first version 0304. New one 0601 brings the mentioned AGESA 1.0.0.5 update, while the 0503 is being discussed to deliver more stable ram OC while missing the AGESA update. Is there any hope at all that my system will be more stable with the new bios or should I just try to RMA the board at this point and don´t risk bricking it myself with an unlucky bios flash?


----------



## Tamalero

OsmiumOC said:


> Does anyone here have experience with the AGESA 1.0.0.5 update for X399?
> And in general about stability with newer bios versions... I have the Asus ROG Strix X399-E and encountered some very random freezes. Rolled back all OC, set ram back to basic 2400 specs and ran prime95, 14 memtest passes on the modules. No crash/freeze and no error. GPU is back to stock either, switched back to the stock bios on the card. Ran several CPU and GPU benchmarks, I just can´t reproduce the freezes but they still happen out of the blue.
> New Windows install, new chipset drivers, everything new. No result
> 
> I checked the bios version of my board and saw I´m still on the very first version 0304. New one 0601 brings the mentioned AGESA 1.0.0.5 update, while the 0503 is being discussed to deliver more stable ram OC while missing the AGESA update. Is there any hope at all that my system will be more stable with the new bios or should I just try to RMA the board at this point and don´t risk bricking it myself with an unlucky bios flash?


AGESA 1.0.0.5 has been a bad update for me. I also cant overclock as high as before and didn't see much memory compatibility improvements.


----------



## Turikxc

Tamalero said:


> The corsair 4x kits usually have Ram active coolers that the dual kits do not have.
> Hence the price hike.
> For Gskill no idea.


Thanks! I'll try.


----------



## Heidi

betam4x said:


> If you are asking whether you can run Threadripper in dual channel mode...absolutely. However, you will SEVERELY hurt system performance, as die1 now must talk to die0 in order to get the information it needs. by running quad channel, there is lower probability of this happening. In short, you want 4 sticks of RAM and not 2.


No, I did not ask that...I know that 2 DIMMs will kill the performance...
I asked explicit;y...
Is there any stability issue if I use 2 by 2 DIMMs..ie 2 individual dual channel kits...one dual channel for one side of the CPU, and other one for the other side ot he CPU...4 in total, just not being one of these Quad Channel kits...
And yes, this is common misconception about this question...when mention dual...ppl always think 2 DIMMs only..no, I am talking about 4 DIMMs but not 4 DIMMs kit rather 2 x 2 DIMMs kits...


----------



## MNMadman

Heidi said:


> No, I did not ask that...I know that 2 DIMMs will kill the performance...
> I asked explicit;y...
> Is there any stability issue if I use 2 by 2 DIMMs..ie 2 individual dual channel kits...one dual channel for one side of the CPU, and other one for the other side ot he CPU...4 in total, just not being one of these Quad Channel kits...
> And yes, this is common misconception about this question...when mention dual...ppl always think 2 DIMMs only..no, I am talking about 4 DIMMs but not 4 DIMMs kit rather 2 x 2 DIMMs kits...


And the answer to that is "it depends".

For G.Skill, where all of the kits with the same model number have the same chips on them, the answer is "there should not be a problem".

For Corsair, where the kits with the same model number can have different version numbers and therefore different chips on them, the answer is "there could be a problem". Even ordering two identical kits at the same time doesn't guarantee that both will be the same version number -- you have no idea what the retailer's stock looks like.

Don't know for sure about the other manufacturers, but I'd imagine they are more like G.Skill than Corsair.

I would have no issues with ordering two dual-channel G.Skill kits for Threadripper.
I would not do the same for Corsair kits. But if I already had the two kits and knew they were both the same version number, I would run them on Threadripper no problem.


----------



## betam4x

Heidi said:


> No, I did not ask that...I know that 2 DIMMs will kill the performance...
> I asked explicit;y...
> Is there any stability issue if I use 2 by 2 DIMMs..ie 2 individual dual channel kits...one dual channel for one side of the CPU, and other one for the other side ot he CPU...4 in total, just not being one of these Quad Channel kits...
> And yes, this is common misconception about this question...when mention dual...ppl always think 2 DIMMs only..no, I am talking about 4 DIMMs but not 4 DIMMs kit rather 2 x 2 DIMMs kits...


You would need to ensure that the timings, speeds, etc. are the same. I'd go so far as to ensure that the dies are all from the same manufacturer and same process (Hynix MFR, Samsung B-Die, etc.) otherwise you could possibly end up with some instability.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> AGESA 1.0.0.5 has been a bad update for me. I also cant overclock as high as before and didn't see much memory compatibility improvements.


I can't say I've had good or bad experiences with 1.0.0.5. However, My MSI board was locked to a much older version (x399 Pro Gaming Carbon? hasn't been updated since last year. Stay away from MSI.), which wasn't tolerant to Hynix MFR timing changes or overclocking. This ASUS board is on 1.0.0.5 and I've been able to tighten the timings. Haven't tried memory overclocking yet. I don't know if that is an AGESA difference or board different though.


----------



## RyanRC

In regards to the adding more memory topic being discussed.

My biggest concern would be that by what ever odd chance it might be, if you are doing anything memory wise that does not fall under the specific guide lines of either the motherboard maker, or even more the memory maker...that if it turns out that it does not work you do not have much of a leg to stand on to ask if the retail seller or the memory maker will take what you bought back.

If this stuff was priced as it should be that would be one thing, but at the psycho numbers we are seeing now I would just be to scared to have spent $500.00+ dollars on a few sticks of silicon only to just sit and stare at them as I have no other use for them.

Perhaps for some they build enough things they could use them on something else, but for me this would just be $500.00+ down the drain.


----------



## Tamalero

RyanRC said:


> In regards to the adding more memory topic being discussed.
> 
> My biggest concern would be that by what ever odd chance it might be, if you are doing anything memory wise that does not fall under the specific guide lines of either the motherboard maker, or even more the memory maker...that if it turns out that it does not work you do not have much of a leg to stand on to ask if the retail seller or the memory maker will take what you bought back.
> 
> If this stuff was priced as it should be that would be one thing, but at the psycho numbers we are seeing now I would just be to scared to have spent $500.00+ dollars on a few sticks of silicon only to just sit and stare at them as I have no other use for them.
> 
> Perhaps for some they build enough things they could use them on something else, but for me this would just be $500.00+ down the drain.


Even if they claim compatibility there might be issues. 

For example.. My Hynix Kit was in the tested and approved list. And I had problems after problems, memory training issues..etc..
But it was UNTIL I searched at what timings and speeds they were tested. Found that a lot of the approved list... weren't even tested at the stock speed (rated memory speed) or at their "maximum" rated timings.

They were tested at much conservative speeds (Ie, most high speed kits tested at 2966 speeds or lower).


----------



## OsmiumOC

Tamalero said:


> AGESA 1.0.0.5 has been a bad update for me. I also cant overclock as high as before and didn't see much memory compatibility improvements.


I just gave it a try and so far I agree with you on the overclock. I tried just a tiny bit above rated speed and it throws BSODs left and right. Was more stable before. But! So far I had none of these random freezes *fingers crossed*. And it does run fine with rated XMP timings and speed. Just can´t go any higher like before or try any tighter timings.


----------



## Heidi

MNMadman said:


> And the answer to that is "it depends".
> 
> For G.Skill...


It will be G.Skill, no other option ever...I burned myself with corsair so many times that this brand is explicitly banned even be on banners in my browser...
So, most likely X G.Skill 3600 DIMMs in B die flavor...


----------



## betam4x

Heidi said:


> It will be G.Skill, no other option ever...I burned myself with corsair so many times that this brand is explicitly banned even be on banners in my browser...
> So, most likely X G.Skill 3600 DIMMs in B die flavor...


Hah! I only have a problem with certain Corsair products, RAM being one of them.

At any rate. Giving up on the Enermax. Don't have the money for a full custom loop due to being out on disability temporarily, so I bought a Noctua cooler instead. Hopefully it works out better then the Enermax. Idle temps have been steadily rising since I purchased this thing...and it's definitely the cooler. I did a clean install of Windows in case there was a bad process somewhere. It's now up to 40C idle with nothing but chrome open, and 4 GHz overclock puts it up to 100C. By comparison, when I purchased it, the machine idled at 23-24C and at 4 GHz I saw a max of around 60C, and at 4.1 GHz I saw around 63-65C. After reading horror stories of exploding radiators, poor reviews, etc. I figured it might be a good idea to bail on Enermax. I'll RMA it of course...and then eBay the replacement.


----------



## OsmiumOC

Today I had to enable the HPET for GPUPI testing and I scratched my head as to what happened to the frequency on my threadripper: 










Now this looks like stock, or some very aggressive spread spectrum but no. This is my low OC setting at 39.00 or 3900MHz fixed, every power state or spreadspectrum or cool´n-quiet or whatever disabled. Is this a simple readout thing with the change to HPET? Or does my clock really bounce around like that? Cause I don´t know how stable 4071MHz are when I want to lower voltage


----------



## mmonnin

Anyone else having issues with their Enermax Liqtech TR4 cooler? The 1st one is making a lot of noise and the CPU is constantly throttling. I ordered a 2nd from Amazon and it came busted with water all over the inside packaging and rusting. Ordering a Noctua instead of this crap.


----------



## x7007

mmonnin said:


> Anyone else having issues with their Enermax Liqtech TR4 cooler? The 1st one is making a lot of noise and the CPU is constantly throttling. I ordered a 2nd from Amazon and it came busted with water all over the inside packaging and rusting. Ordering a Noctua instead of this crap.


 well it about time someone else happen.. for me it happened 3 times. bloody pump died 3 t using nocuta now waiting for thermalright arrow support 320 watt


----------



## MNMadman

mmonnin said:


> Anyone else having issues with their Enermax Liqtech TR4 cooler? The 1st one is making a lot of noise and the CPU is constantly throttling. I ordered a 2nd from Amazon and it came busted with water all over the inside packaging and rusting. Ordering a Noctua instead of this crap.


Several others have posted that their systems with LiqTech coolers have suddenly started overheating.

I had a LiqTech 280 to test my Threadripper system before I got my custom loop up and running. Glad I only needed to use it for a week.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

I have the Liqtech 360 and I have had it since roughly TR release and so far so good. Will keep an eye out though.


----------



## mmonnin

MNMadman said:


> Several others have posted that their systems with LiqTech coolers have suddenly started overheating.
> 
> I had a LiqTech 280 to test my Threadripper system before I got my custom loop up and running. Glad I only needed to use it for a week.


Mine is pretty much a only BOINC machine so I didn't notice it right away. Just crunch times increased. I thought it was a fan rattling at 1st. I want a custom loop but haven't gotten around to it so it stings to invest more in a TR4 only socket cooler.


----------



## betam4x

ENTERPRISE said:


> I have the Liqtech 360 and I have had it since roughly TR release and so far so good. Will keep an eye out though.


Watch your temps. If you aren't idling in the 20s, yours is probably starting to gunk up. When I purchased mine, it could easily cool 1.35V and 4.1 GHz. No longer. This Noctua air cooler I installed definitely cools better, and it is quieter as well.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> Hah! I only have a problem with certain Corsair products, RAM being one of them.
> 
> At any rate. Giving up on the Enermax. Don't have the money for a full custom loop due to being out on disability temporarily, so I bought a Noctua cooler instead. Hopefully it works out better then the Enermax. Idle temps have been steadily rising since I purchased this thing...and it's definitely the cooler. I did a clean install of Windows in case there was a bad process somewhere. It's now up to 40C idle with nothing but chrome open, and 4 GHz overclock puts it up to 100C. By comparison, when I purchased it, the machine idled at 23-24C and at 4 GHz I saw a max of around 60C, and at 4.1 GHz I saw around 63-65C. After reading horror stories of exploding radiators, poor reviews, etc. I figured it might be a good idea to bail on Enermax. I'll RMA it of course...and then eBay the replacement.


What Noctua cooler are you using and how many fans? I'm using the nh-u14s with 2 fans and I've left chrome on idle for 10 minutes and the temperature settled at 30 C with ambient temp of 19 C. When stress testing my over clocking (CPU 3950 Mhz, RAM 2800 Mhz, VCOE 1.375 volts, ambient 22 C) with Prime 95 29.3 the temperature peaked at 88C and thermal throttled and I had to take the front panel off and put a fan in from of the computer to bring down the temp by about 5 C to stop the thermal throttling.


----------



## betam4x

ENTERPRISE said:


> I have the Liqtech 360 and I have had it since roughly TR release and so far so good. Will keep an eye out though.


I would keep a close eye on it. I've read where multiple people have their equipment ruined when the rad or pump exploded or started leaking.

EDIT: One guy had 2 1080tis and a motherboard die supposedly.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> What Noctua cooler are you using and how many fans? I'm using the nh-u14s with 2 fans and I've left chrome on idle for 10 minutes and the temperature settled at 30 C with ambient temp of 19 C. When stress testing my over clocking (CPU 3950 Mhz, RAM 2800 Mhz, VCOE 1.375 volts, ambient 22 C) with Prime 95 29.3 the temperature peaked at 88C and thermal throttled and I had to take the front panel off and put a fan in from of the computer to bring down the temp by about 5 C to stop the thermal throttling.


Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3, I get similar temps to you. I haven't been able to hit 4 GHz/1.35V, at least not on this board (despite reviews claiming otherwise). MY CPU can actually do 4GHz at much lower voltages, but it still overheats. However, it is still doing better then my Enermax was.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3, I get similar temps to you. I haven't been able to hit 4 GHz/1.35V, at least not on this board (despite reviews claiming otherwise). MY CPU can actually do 4GHz at much lower voltages, but it still overheats. However, it is still doing better then my Enermax was.


I just did a stress test on Prime 95 29.3 Small FFT with my 1950x on a ASUS Zenith Extreme. The CPU was set to 4Ghz at 1.35 volts but under extreme loads it dropped down to 1.294 volts with LLC set to auto. The CPU temp peaked at 82 C with ambient temp of 19 C. VRM temps peaked at 70 C. The CPU froze after about 3 hours of testing. In the past I've had the CPU Prime 95 29.3 Small FFT stable for over 10 hours with 1.375 volts and decided that was as far as I was willing to push the voltage so I gave up on 4Ghz and tried 3950Mhz. The CPU passed the Prime 95 29.3 Small FFT 24 hour stability test at 3950Mhz with 1.375 volts so that's what I've settled with.


----------



## mmonnin

I pulled off the busted Liqtech 360 from my 1950x since I got the Noctua last night. The top of the block (non contact side) was 108-112F or 42-44C. The contact side was a couple of degrees cooler maybe 105-108. It seems completely heat soaked and that warm on all sides including the strews. I would have expected the contact side to be the hottest part of the block.


----------



## Tamalero

mmonnin said:


> I pulled off the busted Liqtech 360 from my 1950x since I got the Noctua last night. The top of the block (non contact side) was 108-112F or 42-44C. The contact side was a couple of degrees cooler maybe 105-108. It seems completely heat soaked and that warm on all sides including the strews. I would have expected the contact side to be the hottest part of the block.


The heatpipe design is very well done on the Noctua. They know their ****.


----------



## josephimports

MSI users, they've released a new bios for the Pro Carbon and SLI Plus. Updates Agesa code to 1.1.0.0B which includes but not limited to improved memory support. 

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X399-GAMING-PRO-CARBON-AC

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X399-SLI-PLUS


----------



## adam3234

ASUS is offering free (on request) VRM cooling kits for their current x399 motherboards to better support overclocking for their 2nd gen Threadrippers. See 6:55 



 I've asked for this in the past but I wanted a heat sink with actual fins not a block of aluminium with slits cut into it. Why is it so hard for them to make a proper heat sink like the one on the x299 Dark? Maybe the engineers at ASUS has tested this kit with overclocking the 32 core Threadripper and found it to be sufficient?


----------



## Bradwell

threadripper II is ordered and ready to go!


----------



## ajc9988

Bradwell said:


> threadripper II is ordered and ready to go!


Was that the MSI MEG X399 Creation board? At the moment, that is the main one I'd get for OCing due to power delivery. The new giga and the others just have less on VRM and can be used with a proper cooling solution, but....

(Note, my 1950X only raises the temps on my VRM to 40C with koolance VRM blocks, so I am an exception to the rule and really could throw one in with little worry on my custom loop)


----------



## ITAngel

Tamalero said:


> The heatpipe design is very well done on the Noctua. They know their ****.


I agree I am running one on my 1920X just fine and I have both water cooling blocks that I have done testing with the EK one and Bykski A-Ryzen-Th-X X399 one. So far I am very impress with Noctua and that is running a single fan not even dual. XD


----------



## jepz

Bradwell said:


> threadripper II is ordered and ready to go!


Awesome! 

I can't wait for the review.


----------



## Ithanul

adam3234 said:


> ASUS is offering free (on request) VRM cooling kits for their current x399 motherboards to better support overclocking for their 2nd gen Threadrippers. See 6:55


Interesting, both my x399 are ASUS boards. I don't plan to drop any TR2s in them, but that cooling for the VRMs is something I would not mind to have.


----------



## Ithanul

Bradwell said:


> threadripper II is ordered and ready to go!





jepz said:


> Awesome!
> 
> I can't wait for the review.


No doubt. I like to see one as well.
Curious, @Bradwell, what you plan to run on that chip?


Whoops, double posted. Darn it.


----------



## Bradwell

Ithanul said:


> No doubt. I like to see one as well.
> Curious, @*Bradwell* , what you plan to run on that chip?
> 
> 
> Whoops, double posted. Darn it.


As bad as it is, I got it for gaming and "ripping" up benchmarks. Hope it performs better than the 7980XE in the cpu portions of benchmarks


----------



## betam4x

mmonnin said:


> I pulled off the busted Liqtech 360 from my 1950x since I got the Noctua last night. The top of the block (non contact side) was 108-112F or 42-44C. The contact side was a couple of degrees cooler maybe 105-108. It seems completely heat soaked and that warm on all sides including the strews. I would have expected the contact side to be the hottest part of the block.


They claim it was a QC issue, they've been pretty responsive via support. I have to take a pic of the serial number and unit, then they will send me a replacement.


----------



## betam4x

josephimports said:


> MSI users, they've released a new bios for the Pro Carbon and SLI Plus. Updates Agesa code to 1.1.0.0B which includes but not limited to improved memory support.
> 
> https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X399-GAMING-PRO-CARBON-AC
> 
> https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X399-SLI-PLUS


I've GOT to RMA that board.


----------



## betam4x

betam4x said:


> I've GOT to RMA that board.


Actually, the MSI X399 Gaming Carbon Pro was supposedly supposed to have 10 power phases, are they using doublers? Is it really 5+3? What is the deal with this board? I've found little information about the VRMs. It also requires 2 8 pin EPS connectors and it appears to run much cooler than this ASUS.


----------



## josephimports

betam4x said:


> Actually, the MSI X399 Gaming Carbon Pro was supposedly supposed to have 10 power phases, are they using doublers? Is it really 5+3? What is the deal with this board? I've found little information about the VRMs. It also requires 2 8 pin EPS connectors and it appears to run much cooler than this ASUS.


Interesting. I find the VRM's to be much warmer on the MSI than on my Prime. Over 20c+ warmer running Realbench 2.56, 4.15ghz @ 1.40v, 1900x. Why the RMA?

https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/8...-carbon-ac-tr4-motherboard-review/index3.html


----------



## betam4x

josephimports said:


> Interesting. I find the VRM's to be much warmer on the MSI than on my Prime. Over 20c+ warmer running Realbench 2.56, 4.15ghz @ 1.40v, 1900x. Why the RMA?
> 
> https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/8...-carbon-ac-tr4-motherboard-review/index3.html


Oh, don't get me wrong, the VRMs were warmer, but the CPU was WAY cooler. Makes me wonder how it will handle the 2950X will work on that board. I can get an RMA for $45, but I've been out of work 6 months and I've depleted all my savings, running on fumes right now.


----------



## mmonnin

betam4x said:


> They claim it was a QC issue, they've been pretty responsive via support. I have to take a pic of the serial number and unit, then they will send me a replacement.


They replied daily to my RMA at 1st. The 1st response was asking for all the same info that was required to complete the RMA form which puzzled me. Why have the form at all. I attached the images of the device then radio silence since August 1st. Thing is I don't want a 3rd junky cooler. Amazon was much quicker about refunding the 2nd and I had the refund before I got back from the UPS store but the 1st one was past their return window.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> They claim it was a QC issue, they've been pretty responsive via support. I have to take a pic of the serial number and unit, then they will send me a replacement.


Better sell the replacement. Many people have mentioned that the quality issue is more like a DESIGN issue.
They used copper AND aluminium in the same water contact loop area. Thus causing build up residue and algae.
They are not using the correct anti corrosion too. Leading the pump and liquid filled areas to clog badly or even break.

The worst? the second edition has the same glaring issues.
It seems they did it on purpose to keep selling replacements.


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> Better sell the replacement. Many people have mentioned that the quality issue is more like a DESIGN issue.
> They used copper AND aluminium in the same water contact loop area. Thus causing build up residue and algae.
> They are not using the correct anti corrosion too. Leading the pump and liquid filled areas to clog badly or even break.
> 
> The worst? the second edition has the same glaring issues.
> It seems they did it on purpose to keep selling replacements.


Yep , crap , had 3 of them dead after 4-5 months , and they just want to keep sending replacement and I don't live in USA / CANADA and they only send free delivery there, I need to pay to get it .. screw that, I paid once , not anymore after 3 times.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Better sell the replacement. Many people have mentioned that the quality issue is more like a DESIGN issue.
> They used copper AND aluminium in the same water contact loop area. Thus causing build up residue and algae.
> They are not using the correct anti corrosion too. Leading the pump and liquid filled areas to clog badly or even break.
> 
> The worst? the second edition has the same glaring issues.
> It seems they did it on purpose to keep selling replacements.


You can easily empty and refill the unit with the right stuff. you just need to take the 2 screws off the end of the pump. However, I'm not sure that will fix the issue or not, I'm not an expert in water cooling. IMO only the fins should be aluminum. Water does not flow through the fins. Water flows around the outside. That is my understanding how all radiators work. I haven't found any information that aluminum was used in the outside of the radiator.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Quote:Originally Posted by *JUANNY*
> 
> Is not just the cpu temp that has to be monitored when testing the stability or lack thereof. If your MB has the supported sensors then you also have to see what the cpu voltage regulator modules (VRM) temps are at especially when youre applying a decent level of cpu load line calibration. When those temps get close to or exceed 100c-125c stabilty and motherboard reliabilty suffer. In my case since I have a decent memory OC I also monitor DIMM temps since I experienced memory stabilty issues once memory temps exceeded bout 52c. Since I invested in memory cooling fans from gskill it has not been an issue for me.
> 
> 
> Will have to check the memories because the VRMS never went past 80C in my 1.35V tests.


As long as you have an active fan blowing on the VRMs of the MSI, they stay around 70-80C. The VRMs of this ASUS are even cooler, but it doesn't have the tolerance that the MSI did when it comes to overclocking. The MSI was a rather unique board. I am now wanting to replace it.


----------



## betam4x

You know what I would love to see? P-State overclocking with the ability to set a thermal limit. i.e. if the CPU hits 68 degrees, change the P-State to a lower one (downclock from 4.1 GHz to 3.9 GHz, 3.7 GHz, 3.5 GHz, and 3.4 GHz) as necessary to keep the CPU cool. There is a Ryzen SDK, but no documentation that I am aware of. There are open source tools out there that show how to read sensors, but not set the multiplier/voltage. I'd write something if I had adequate knowledge of how to this. However, I haven't written C/C++ or assembly since a kid, so I'd even have a learning curve there (but provided the documentation I'd be willing to try). My threadripper can actually run just fine at 4.2 GHz at acceptable voltages, it's only when it's under super high load that it can't maintain that. For gaming purposes, it works fine and I've never had crashes, etc. It also passes other tests like blender, etc. It actually did GREAT on my MSI, except the MSI throttled at 4.2 GHz due to too much power required (1.45V resulted in high amperage). 

I suspect that's why MSI created a new board...to solve that issue. This chip could probably make it to 4.4 GHz with the right VRM setup. I can definitely get it to boot at 4.4 GHz, at least on the MSI. I even did a CPU-Z screenshot + validation at one point, but the validation didn't show up (CPU-Z's website has an odd bug where all validations don't show up). That was at a high voltage of course, but I suspect a lower voltage and more watts could have handled the chip. I am thinking about picking up that MEG creation board just to see if this is the case.


----------



## betam4x

By the way, here are some screenshots of my 1950X on the X399 Carbon @ 4.25 GHz:

EDIT: There was likely throttling going on. At 4.25 GHz+ the power limit maxed out at 272 amps to the CPU. It would go no higher. Thermals were not an issue.


----------



## betam4x

Also, for those curious, MSI has a copy of a supposed 'Ryzen Master SDK'. Here are some exports from a DLL for it:

EDIT: Oh crap, the full SDK was embedded in MSI command center.


----------



## betam4x

Last post about this, actually onto something now. AMD has a full API for this stuff. See below:

IsSMTEnabled ...................................... Yes
GetCurrentPState Core : 0 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 1 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 2 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 3 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 4 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 5 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 6 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 7 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 8 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 9 ......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 10......................... 1
GetCurrentPState Core : 11......................... 1
GetCurrentPState Core : 12......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 13......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 14......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 15......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 16......................... 1
GetCurrentPState Core : 17......................... 1
GetCurrentPState Core : 18......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 19......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 20......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 21......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 22......................... 1
GetCurrentPState Core : 23......................... 1
GetCurrentPState Core : 24......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 25......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 26......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 27......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 28......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 29......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 30......................... 2
GetCurrentPState Core : 31......................... 2

EDIT: Oh and I stumbled across this little gem, but haven't tried it yet: SetOverclockFreqPerCore()


----------



## betam4x

So, I believe that I can write a program that runs in the background and actively monitors temps and adjusts frequencies accordingly. You would need to set up manual configuration first (Frequency, voltage, temp of CPU) since that varies from chip to chip. However, it would work a lot like new generation chips in that it would dynamically scale clocks based on thermal headroom. If you are feeling lucky enough, you could even add a setting to go above and beyond 1.45V which would allow your chip to clock higher than 4.2V. I can even eventually get the CPU load and add that into the equation. For instance, if your CPU is loaded at 40% for gaming and works fine at 1.35V/4.3 GHz, but Prime95 overheats it, you could set a load setting of 30%/4.3GHz and another of 100%/3.4 GHz. Just a few thoughts. Anyone have any interest in this type of project? It would emulate a lot of the gap between the 2950X and the 1950X. The only thing is the PerCore functions are unsupported unfortunately. I tried it, but it didn't work. It may work on other boards, however. There is an easy way to test functionality on a given board.


----------



## mmonnin

I'm guessing this is what Ryzen Master is using?


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> Last post about this, actually onto something now. AMD has a full API for this stuff. See below:
> 
> IsSMTEnabled ...................................... Yes
> GetCurrentPState Core : 0 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 1 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 2 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 3 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 4 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 5 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 6 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 7 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 8 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 9 ......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 10......................... 1
> GetCurrentPState Core : 11......................... 1
> GetCurrentPState Core : 12......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 13......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 14......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 15......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 16......................... 1
> GetCurrentPState Core : 17......................... 1
> GetCurrentPState Core : 18......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 19......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 20......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 21......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 22......................... 1
> GetCurrentPState Core : 23......................... 1
> GetCurrentPState Core : 24......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 25......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 26......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 27......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 28......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 29......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 30......................... 2
> GetCurrentPState Core : 31......................... 2
> 
> EDIT: Oh and I stumbled across this little gem, but haven't tried it yet: SetOverclockFreqPerCore()


Not need to multipost this much bro.

Anyway if I remember, these were added for XFR2 and precision boost v2.

As for SDK and programming, you can ask ELMOR as he is doing ZENSTATES for ASUS. Which is a P state overclocker.


----------



## betam4x

Tamalero said:


> Not need to multipost this much bro.
> 
> Anyway if I remember, these were added for XFR2 and precision boost v2.
> 
> As for SDK and programming, you can ask ELMOR as he is doing ZENSTATES for ASUS. Which is a P state overclocker.


I didn't multipost? I am aware of zenstates, what I am creating is a tool that mimics xfr2 and pb2 by setting a target temp and defining voltages and multiplier combos. For instance, my machine spins up to 4.2 GHz and if you run prime95, it throttles down to the maximum frequency while maintaining the set temp (68C for example). If the load drops causing temps to fall, clocks spin back up to 4.2 GHz. It works much better than the built in boosting algorithm on threadripper/Zen 1xxx because it is very aggressive about maintaining high clock speeds. 

In prime95 for example, the clocks drop down to 3.75 GHz instead of 3.35 Ghz. There are a few bugs to fix, and I have to overhaul the back end to use the API instead of spawning an extra process. It boosts cinebench scores far higher than stock without pushing the chip beyond the recommended max temp. This means the only bottleneck is your cooler. 
It does all this with p-state 0, so the system can still throttle when idle.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> I didn't multipost? I am aware of zenstates, what I am creating is a tool that mimics xfr2 and pb2 by setting a target temp and defining voltages and multiplier combos. For instance, my machine spins up to 4.2 GHz and if you run prime95, it throttles down to the maximum frequency while maintaining the set temp (68C for example). If the load drops causing temps to fall, clocks spin back up to 4.2 GHz. It works much better than the built in boosting algorithm on threadripper/Zen 1xxx because it is very aggressive about maintaining high clock speeds.
> 
> In prime95 for example, the clocks drop down to 3.75 GHz instead of 3.35 Ghz. There are a few bugs to fix, and I have to overhaul the back end to use the API instead of spawning an extra process. It boosts cinebench scores far higher than stock without pushing the chip beyond the recommended max temp. This means the only bottleneck is your cooler.
> It does all this with p-state 0, so the system can still throttle when idle.


You posted 4 times in a row, that is multipost.


----------



## 4Strings

betam4x said:


> So, I believe that I can write a program that runs in the background and actively monitors temps and adjusts frequencies accordingly. You would need to set up manual configuration first (Frequency, voltage, temp of CPU) since that varies from chip to chip. However, it would work a lot like new generation chips in that it would dynamically scale clocks based on thermal headroom. If you are feeling lucky enough, you could even add a setting to go above and beyond 1.45V which would allow your chip to clock higher than 4.2V. I can even eventually get the CPU load and add that into the equation. For instance, if your CPU is loaded at 40% for gaming and works fine at 1.35V/4.3 GHz, but Prime95 overheats it, you could set a load setting of 30%/4.3GHz and another of 100%/3.4 GHz. Just a few thoughts. Anyone have any interest in this type of project? It would emulate a lot of the gap between the 2950X and the 1950X. The only thing is the PerCore functions are unsupported unfortunately. I tried it, but it didn't work. It may work on other boards, however. There is an easy way to test functionality on a given board.


I'm down with testing on my 1900X if you end up making something like this!


----------



## dsmwookie

Will this ram: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/qz...-4-x-16gb-ddr4-3200-memory-f4-3200c14q-64gtzr work with this board: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/X2kj4D/asrock-x399m-taichi-micro-atx-tr4-motherboard-x399m-taichi and can it reach 3200mhz?


----------



## MNMadman

dsmwookie said:


> Will this ram: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/qz...-4-x-16gb-ddr4-3200-memory-f4-3200c14q-64gtzr work with this board: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/X2kj4D/asrock-x399m-taichi-micro-atx-tr4-motherboard-x399m-taichi and can it reach 3200mhz?


Theoretically, yes.

However, nobody can tell you what the RAM will do for sure. It depends on the memory controllers in your CPU -- there are two in Threadripper. They have to work together at the same speed, so if you have a weaker one the RAM will only be able to work at the speed the weaker one will handle.


----------



## gtz

Just snagged a new 1920X for for 360. Can't wait to test this monster. I am ready to leave Intel and my 6950X.


----------



## dsmwookie

MNMadman said:


> dsmwookie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Will this ram: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/qz...-4-x-16gb-ddr4-3200-memory-f4-3200c14q-64gtzr work with this board: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/X2kj4D/asrock-x399m-taichi-micro-atx-tr4-motherboard-x399m-taichi and can it reach 3200mhz?
> 
> 
> 
> Theoretically, yes.
> 
> However, nobody can tell you what the RAM will do for sure. It depends on the memory controllers in your CPU -- there are two in Threadripper. They have to work together at the same speed, so if you have a weaker one the RAM will only be able to work at the speed the weaker one will handle.
Click to expand...

Is it the Samsung b die that everyone talks about? I know their are no guarantees, just confirming it's the least hassle.


----------



## RoBiK

dsmwookie said:


> Is it the Samsung b die that everyone talks about?


Yes, it is.


----------



## Tamalero

gtz said:


> Just snagged a new 1920X for for 360. Can't wait to test this monster. I am ready to leave Intel and my 6950X.


Sounds like a good deal!


----------



## adam3234

Hardware Unboxed just released a very good 40 minute review of the 2950X and 32 core 2990WX CPUs. If it's too long for you to watch then here's a summary.

The 2990WX 32 core monster has very bad memory bandwidth because 2 of its dies are not connected to any memory channels which means while it performs fantastic in workloads that are not memory sensitive (e.g. Cinebench, rendering work, 7 Zip Decompression), in workloads that are memory sensitive (e.g. 7 Zip compression, gaming) it performs really bad. Turning off the 2 dies that have no memory channels fixes the memory bandwidth issues but at the same time you also loss performance in workloads that aren't memory sensitive.

The 2950X provides a 5% to 8% performance increase from the 1950X.

MSI Meg x399 Creation OC vs ASUS Zenith Extreme OC showed that the motherboards provided very similar multi threaded performance with the Meg x399 Creation only very slightly ahead of the Zenith Extreme but the single core performance of the Zenith Extreme was "significantly" better than the Meg x399 Creation although the overclocking methods using for the 2 boards were different. The Meg x399 Creation was OCed using fixed core ratios while the Zenith Extreme was OCed using ASUS Precision Boost Override and the Zenith Extreme used less power.


----------



## Aby67

adam3234 said:


> Hardware Unboxed just released a very good 40 minute review of the 2950X and 32 core 2990WX CPUs. If it's too long for you to watch then here's a summary.
> 
> The 2990WX 32 core monster has very bad memory bandwidth because 2 of its dies are not connected to any memory channels which means while it performs fantastic in workloads that are not memory sensitive (e.g. Cinebench, rendering work, 7 Zip Decompression), in workloads that are memory sensitive (e.g. 7 Zip compression, gaming) it performs really bad. Turning off the 2 dies that have no memory channels fixes the memory bandwidth issues but at the same time you also loss performance in workloads that aren't memory sensitive.
> 
> The 2950X provides a 5% to 8% performance increase from the 1950X.
> 
> MSI Meg x399 Creation OC vs ASUS Zenith Extreme OC showed that the motherboards provided very similar multi threaded performance with the Meg x399 Creation only very slightly ahead of the Zenith Extreme but the single core performance of the Zenith Extreme was "significantly" better than the Meg x399 Creation although the overclocking methods using for the 2 boards were different. The Meg x399 Creation was OCed using fixed core ratios while the Zenith Extreme was OCed using ASUS Precision Boost Override and the Zenith Extreme used less power.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QI9sMfWmCsk



This Review only reveals that You cannot cool that CPu with air,and that the MSI motherboard mosfets cant handle the heat nor the memory properly..when and of there will be a decent motherboard for this cpu with decent cooling 7000 and up cinebench will be feasible for almost anyone...there is also to notice that he is using slow memory at 3200MHZ, while 3466 and 3600 with tight timings can be pretty likely easy to achieve with this CPU....all this being said the ideal would be an ASUS WS class motherboard for EPYC that allows overlcocking with a 24 faze power delivery...so it canbe used on teh 64 core PCUs next year as well


----------



## Bradwell

My main question is will the performance get closer or better than the 2950x when playing games at 4k with the 2990wx or will the gap become even larger, and will the 2990wx outperform the 7980xe in benchmarks


----------



## Tamalero

gtz said:


> Just snagged a new 1920X for for 360. Can't wait to test this monster. I am ready to leave Intel and my 6950X.





Aby67 said:


> This Review only reveals that You cannot cool that CPu with air,and that the MSI motherboard mosfets cant handle the heat nor the memory properly..when and of there will be a decent motherboard for this cpu with decent cooling 7000 and up cinebench will be feasible for almost anyone...there is also to notice that he is using slow memory at 3200MHZ, while 3466 and 3600 with tight timings can be pretty likely easy to achieve with this CPU....all this being said the ideal would be an ASUS WS class motherboard for EPYC that allows overlcocking with a 24 faze power delivery...so it canbe used on teh 64 core PCUs next year as well


Phoronix actually tested a lot of air coolers.. the difference between AIOs and the CoolerMaster Threadripper cooler is like 2C of difference.. 3 or 4C below the big Noctua.


----------



## jepz

Bradwell said:


> My main question is will the performance get closer or better than the 2950x when playing games at 4k with the 2990wx or will the gap become even larger, and will the 2990wx outperform the 7980xe in benchmarks


I would go for the higher clocked 2950x for games, also I wouldn't use PBO to overclock it, IMHO the best way is to set all cores to max frequency yet, 2nd gen Precision Boost is more consistent than TR 1st gen, but it does not clock all time high as the 1st gen do.

Also, buying a 2990WX and disabling half the cores for max performance is nonsense, 2950X is the clear choice for gaming in X399 platform.

For benchmarks, the 2990WX will have a huge advantage in some cases (workloads), but if you look for 3DMark Hall of Fame, I would stay away:


Linus test
take screen shot

Guru3d



I just couldn't understand Wccftech 3DMark Time Spy results... (faked???) Someone can explain why their scores are huge in compare to Linus and Guru3D with the 2990WX?????


----------



## ANAFREE

Hi, firstly sorry for my bad english but i will try my best,,,
i build my new pc last week ago and i have absolutely no experience with overclocking, 
this is my pc specs & benchmark test

http://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/10200278

+ arctic freezer 33 air cooler

I've noted when i use auto oc mode/xfr in bios that set my Memory to stander 2133Mhz why ? i know i can set it manually but why i got 2133mhz at by auto oc mode ?
and i noted CPU Vcore going high 1.400v+ !!! and the cpu temp just fine.... how ? 



I tried to overclock manually 3.8Ghz/1.23125 
and
3.4Ghz/1.22500
but the cpu teno goes +70C if i run CINEBENCH several times in a row.... i think this temp will kill my cpu 








auto oc mode = good temp but high Vcore voltage +1.400v
manual oc = good voltage but high temp

i'm 3d designer 
please can you give me advice,,, what's the best OC setting for my pc to use it daily as 3D workstation/ render machine ?


----------



## gtz

The 1920X arrived!!!!

Pairing it with a ASUS X399 Prime and a 16GB (4X4) Team T Force Extreeme 3600 CL17 RAM. Let see how much I will be able to overclock this kit with this motherboard/CPU combo.

I still can't believe I was able to snag a new 1920X for 360. Prob has to do with this particular retailer clearing out for gen 2 threadripper.


----------



## betam4x

A new BIOS dropped for the X399-E today with full Threadripper 2xxx support. That's not the only thing it added though, several new options, including official (!!!) support for ECC memory.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> A new BIOS dropped for the X399-E today with full Threadripper 2xxx support. That's not the only thing it added though, several new options, including official (!!!) support for ECC memory.


ASUS prime also got a new bios 5 days ago.
Including new AGESA.


----------



## 4Strings

Yeah. @gtz If you've gotten a Prime board, make sure to flash BIOS 807, as all the previous versions, especially 601, were complete and utter s----. 807 seems very stably based on my initial testing so far.


----------



## lowdog

Aby67 said:


> This Review only reveals that You cannot cool that CPu with air,and that the MSI motherboard mosfets cant handle the heat nor the memory properly..when and of there will be a decent motherboard for this cpu with decent cooling 7000 and up cinebench will be feasible for almost anyone...there is also to notice that he is using slow memory at 3200MHZ, while 3466 and 3600 with tight timings can be pretty likely easy to achieve with this CPU....all this being said the ideal would be an ASUS WS class motherboard for EPYC that allows overlcocking with a 24 faze power delivery...so it canbe used on teh 64 core PCUs next year as well



Think you got it wrong! The MSI could handle the load and heat when overclocked and the ASUS failed miserably.


----------



## gtz

4Strings said:


> Yeah. @gtz If you've gotten a Prime board, make sure to flash BIOS 807, as all the previous versions, especially 601, were complete and utter s----. 807 seems very stably based on my initial testing so far.


I flashed it to the latest one, 807.

I am having a problem with the build, it will not run in quad channel. When install all for memory modules it will either boot loop indefinitely with post code d0 being the last one or boots and stops at post code 0d. 2 sticks run fine. I read online maybe the CPU is not seated correctly. Will reseat the CPU and maybe that will fix it.

Update 

Reseating the CPU worked!!!!!! And the kit runs at 3600CL18 1T!!!! I am going to try to tighten timings, but for now extremely happy!!!


----------



## gtz

4Strings said:


> Yeah. @gtz If you've gotten a Prime board, make sure to flash BIOS 807, as all the previous versions, especially 601, were complete and utter s----. 807 seems very stably based on my initial testing so far.


We have a very similar system, what kind of timespy and firestrike scores do you get with it?

Thanks


----------



## Tamalero

gtz said:


> I flashed it to the latest one, 807.
> 
> I am having a problem with the build, it will not run in quad channel. When install all for memory modules it will either boot loop indefinitely with post code d0 being the last one or boots and stops at post code 0d. 2 sticks run fine. I read online maybe the CPU is not seated correctly. Will reseat the CPU and maybe that will fix it.
> 
> Update
> 
> Reseating the CPU worked!!!!!! And the kit runs at 3600CL18 1T!!!! I am going to try to tighten timings, but for now extremely happy!!!


HAH, thats exactly what happened with my build as well.

I also had to "train" the cpu by inserting one stick every boot until It detected all 4 sticks correctly


----------



## Offler

Got myself 1900x. Any referenes about thermals and power drain?

a) I want to put a Noctua cooler on it.

b) I am looking for lower power drain.

I could go for Ryzen 7 1800x instead for same money, and lower power drain at 95 watts, yet 1900x has same amount of cores - so i dont expect the CPU run on 180watts all the time, more like 100w +- depending on the frequency and load.

How this fits compared to 1920x and 1950x?


----------



## Tamalero

Offler said:


> Got myself 1900x. Any referenes about thermals and power drain?
> 
> a) I want to put a Noctua cooler on it.
> 
> b) I am looking for lower power drain.
> 
> I could go for Ryzen 7 1800x instead for same money, and lower power drain at 95 watts, yet 1900x has same amount of cores - so i dont expect the CPU run on 180watts all the time, more like 100w +- depending on the frequency and load.
> 
> How this fits compared to 1920x and 1950x?


the 1900X honestly makes very little sense except maybe for a bridge for the 2000 series.
these cores use more energy, are less efficient than the 1800X in some loads, has latency issues (since its a 4/4 build than a 8/0 ).

You could get one of the lower end to high end Noctua TR coolers (TR12 TR13 or TR14 SP3).As the 1900X has way less heat and load than 1920X and 1950X.


----------



## Ithanul

Tamalero said:


> the 1900X honestly makes very little sense except maybe for a bridge for the 2000 series.
> these cores use more energy, are less efficient than the 1800X in some loads, has latency issues (since its a 4/4 build than a 8/0 ).
> 
> You could get one of the lower end to high end Noctua TR coolers (TR12 TR13 or TR14 SP3).As the 1900X has way less heat and load than 1920X and 1950X.


Yep, I have a 1900X under a noctua cooler. The cooler handles the chip very well.



4Strings said:


> Yeah. @gtz If you've gotten a Prime board, make sure to flash BIOS 807, as all the previous versions, especially 601, were complete and utter s----. 807 seems very stably based on my initial testing so far.


I need to get around to flashing my two boards. Thanks for the info. +rep



gtz said:


> Just snagged a new 1920X for for 360. Can't wait to test this monster. I am ready to leave Intel and my 6950X.


You planning to sell the 6950X?
Sorry, I bugging the crap out people for x99 chips lately. I got a lonely x99 board that needs a chip since my 5960X died a while back.


----------



## Offler

Tamalero said:


> the 1900X honestly makes very little sense except maybe for a bridge for the 2000 series.
> these cores use more energy, are less efficient than the 1800X in some loads, has latency issues (since its a 4/4 build than a 8/0 ).
> 
> You could get one of the lower end to high end Noctua TR coolers (TR12 TR13 or TR14 SP3).As the 1900X has way less heat and load than 1920X and 1950X.


I was considering large sockets by intel for years, and my answer was "no" because of price for both boards and processors, and of course because of how often the sockets changed.

On Ryzen 7 2700x I was hoping for more PCI-E links, which are my primary concern (at least 2 full slots). Quad memory channel was another concern, because of effective bandwidth. I was about to get one 2700x - mainly because it was single chip, with even better latency.

What I am looking ATM for are 8 physical cores, on higher frequency, but I would like to see lower power consumption. If something change, or I will be motivated to go for more cores, there is plenty of space for an upgrade.



Ithanul said:


> Yep, I have a 1900X under a noctua cooler. The cooler handles the chip very well.


Can you specify which one?


----------



## gtz

Ithanul said:


> You planning to sell the 6950X?
> Sorry, I bugging the crap out people for x99 chips lately. I got a lonely x99 board that needs a chip since my 5960X died a while back.


Already sold, as soon as I got the 1920X I posted it on eBay. Also sold the Godlike. All have left from X99, is a EVGA X99 Micro motherboard. 

Back on the 1920X. 

Is 1.4V vcore 24/7 safe? I can get 4.1Ghz stable with that vcore.


----------



## Ithanul

gtz said:


> Already sold, as soon as I got the 1920X I posted it on eBay. Also sold the Godlike. All have left from X99, is a EVGA X99 Micro motherboard.


Darn. O well.



Offler said:


> Can you specify which one?


I have the Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3


----------



## jepz

gtz said:


> Already sold, as soon as I got the 1920X I posted it on eBay. Also sold the Godlike. All have left from X99, is a EVGA X99 Micro motherboard.
> 
> Back on the 1920X.
> 
> Is 1.4V vcore 24/7 safe? I can get 4.1Ghz stable with that vcore.


1,4v it's fine.

Here is the same, but I do prefer to use 1,3v at 4GHz with my 1920X.


----------



## gtz

jepz said:


> 1,4v it's fine.
> 
> Here is the same, but I do prefer to use 1,3v at 4GHz with my 1920X.


Sounds good, I will keep it at 4.1.


----------



## adam3234

Offler said:


> I was considering large sockets by intel for years, and my answer was "no" because of price for both boards and processors, and of course because of how often the sockets changed.
> 
> On Ryzen 7 2700x I was hoping for more PCI-E links, which are my primary concern (at least 2 full slots). Quad memory channel was another concern, because of effective bandwidth. I was about to get one 2700x - mainly because it was single chip, with even better latency.
> 
> What I am looking ATM for are 8 physical cores, on higher frequency, but I would like to see lower power consumption. If something change, or I will be motivated to go for more cores, there is plenty of space for an upgrade.
> 
> 
> 
> Can you specify which one?


I've been using my 1950x with 4 browser windows opened plus HWiNFO64 for 1:45 hours and I'm watching Youtube videos while down downloading shows and the average power consumption is about 27 watts, the peak is 93 watts and currently it is at 23 watts with all those browser windows opened and watching 



 in 1080p60 but I keep seeing the power jump between 23 watts and 33 watts but mostly at 27 watts.

For normal everyday activities my 1950x doesn't take much power.


----------



## Bradwell

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u2l9ZlaOmvk
Is it time to switch?


----------



## Offler

Ithanul said:


> I have the Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3


Thanks.

Due my specific requirements I decided to get as a case Fractal Design Node 804. However NH-U14S TR4-SP3 is probably 5mm taller as will fit into the case. So I will either ge NH-U12 or Enermax watercooler 240x120 for TR4



adam3234 said:


> I've been using my 1950x with 4 browser windows opened plus HWiNFO64 for 1:45 hours and I'm watching Youtube videos while down downloading shows and the average power consumption is about 27 watts, the peak is 93 watts and currently it is at 23 watts with all those browser windows opened and watching ... in 1080p60 but I keep seeing the power jump between 23 watts and 33 watts but mostly at 27 watts.
> 
> For normal everyday activities my 1950x doesn't take much power.


I am "oldschool"and used to run CPU on fixed frequency (turbo and a bit more) while power saving features are disabled. Threadripper will be huge leap in terms of CPU generation for me, so I will be probably forced to keep it enabled.


----------



## 4Strings

gtz said:


> We have a very similar system, what kind of timespy and firestrike scores do you get with it?
> 
> Thanks


I haven't run any recent benchmarks since updating my BIOS (last round of serious benchmarking was around end of December/start of January after finishing my build), but the scores I got at the time were:
- 9439 on Time Spy https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2963416
- 21274 on Fire Strike https://www.3dmark.com/fs/14658174
- 13709 on FS Extreme https://www.3dmark.com/fs/14658296
- 7476 on FS Ultra https://www.3dmark.com/fs/14658531

These probably aren't the most accurate scores since I was running at rather unsustainable voltages to reach 4,125 MHz, so I should probably run the tests again with more reasonable settings.

I could run them tonight and post them.

-4


----------



## Tamalero

Offler said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Due my specific requirements I decided to get as a case Fractal Design Node 804. However NH-U14S TR4-SP3 is probably 5mm taller as will fit into the case. So I will either ge NH-U12 or Enermax watercooler 240x120 for TR4
> 
> 
> 
> I am "oldschool"and used to run CPU on fixed frequency (turbo and a bit more) while power saving features are disabled. Threadripper will be huge leap in terms of CPU generation for me, so I will be probably forced to keep it enabled.


You could just use ZENSTATES to have P state overclocking via software for very easy configuration.


----------



## gtz

4Strings said:


> I haven't run any recent benchmarks since updating my BIOS (last round of serious benchmarking was around end of December/start of January after finishing my build), but the scores I got at the time were:
> - 9439 on Time Spy https://www.3dmark.com/spy/2963416
> - 21274 on Fire Strike https://www.3dmark.com/fs/14658174
> - 13709 on FS Extreme https://www.3dmark.com/fs/14658296
> - 7476 on FS Ultra https://www.3dmark.com/fs/14658531
> 
> These probably aren't the most accurate scores since I was running at rather unsustainable voltages to reach 4,125 MHz, so I should probably run the tests again with more reasonable settings.
> 
> I could run them tonight and post them.
> 
> -4


You don't have to re run (unless you want to). I just wanted to get a baseline score, my scores are below.

Timespy - 10500
Firestrike - 19800

You have a really good firestrike score, almost 1500 points higher than mine. But your timespy score is lower. Our rigs are opposites. 

Thank you for posting


----------



## Yamie

I just installed 2 new 40mm fans directly to the vrm cooler
These fans are scythe mini kaze

I already installed a fan at the cooler on the right under the io shield, but it wasn't able to cool the top vrm as well
Now my vrm temps dropt another 10°C

I also switched the noctua nt h1 with thermal grizzly kryonaut, because I got it new, but it made no difference as expected



@gtz not sure if it helps you, because I got a 1950x

Timespy - 10600 - https://www.3dmark.com/spy/4259561
Firestrike - 24900 - https://www.3dmark.com/fs/15627460




gtz said:


> Reseating the CPU worked!!!!!! And the kit runs at 3600CL18 1T!!!! I am going to try to tighten timings, but for now extremely happy!!!


This took me 3 tries to get it working : /
And now I need to upgrade to 128gb, just send back the newer 32gb kit, it was still returnable, but I need to sell my 32GB kit and buy a 128gb kit new 
Doing some heavy orthophotogeneration that just can't get enough ram xD


----------



## gtz

Yamie said:


> I just installed 2 new 40mm fans directly to the vrm cooler
> These fans are scythe mini kaze
> 
> I already installed a fan at the cooler on the right under the io shield, but it wasn't able to cool the top vrm as well
> Now my vrm temps dropt another 10°C
> 
> I also switched the noctua nt h1 with thermal grizzly kryonaut, because I got it new, but it made no difference as expected
> 
> 
> 
> @gtz not sure if it helps you, because I got a 1950x
> 
> Timespy - 10600 - https://www.3dmark.com/spy/4259561
> Firestrike - 24900 - https://www.3dmark.com/fs/15627460
> 
> 
> 
> This took me 3 tries to get it working : /
> And now I need to upgrade to 128gb, just send back the newer 32gb kit, it was still returnable, but I need to sell my 32GB kit and buy a 128gb kit new
> Doing some heavy orthophotogeneration that just can't get enough ram xD


We get the same timespy score but I fall extremely short on Firestrike. You get around 25000, the other member got around 22000, and I get right under 20000.


----------



## Yamie

gtz said:


> We get the same timespy score but I fall extremely short on Firestrike. You get around 25000, the other member got around 22000, and I get right under 20000.



It's just the physics score, and in a benchmark the 1950 is superior to the 1900
If you care for real gaming performance try Superposition benchmark

There my old 9590 still beats the 1950 xD 
in 1080 and 8k


----------



## gtz

Yamie said:


> It's just the physics score, and in a benchmark the 1950 is superior to the 1900
> If you care for real gaming performance try Superposition benchmark
> 
> There my old 9590 still beats the 1950 xD
> in 1080 and 8k


I will try the benchmark you mentioned.

But we get similar score on GPU and physics. Combined however is half, I get around 5000. I also have a 1920x.


----------



## betam4x

Does anyone have the new Enermax cooler yet? Also the new MSI board, I'm kind of curious how it fairs with the 1950x. It doesn't look like AMD added much reason to upgrade except for the boost algorithm. If the MEG creation has all the same BIOS controls as the carbon, it'll actually be better at overclocking the 1950x. Going back to work next week and once I get a few paychecks I may pick one up and try to overclock my 1950x just for kicks. Also plan on switching out to some Samsung B-Die and I want to add another m.2 SSD for my steam library and video storage. Hell I might go ham and get 2x2 tb m.2 SSDs or something.


----------



## Yamie

betam4x said:


> Does anyone have the new Enermax cooler yet?


The new one?

I got the Liqtech TR4 360, but it's not new
The Liqtech is a very solid and well working AiO so far

Still not powerfull enough beyond 1.4V (~300W) on a 1950x 


Prime custom 32 Threads
FFT min/max 96/96 in-place 15min


----------



## Offler

betam4x said:


> Does anyone have the new Enermax cooler yet? Also the new MSI board, I'm kind of curious how it fairs with the 1950x. It doesn't look like AMD added much reason to upgrade except for the boost algorithm. If the MEG creation has all the same BIOS controls as the carbon, it'll actually be better at overclocking the 1950x. Going back to work next week and once I get a few paychecks I may pick one up and try to overclock my 1950x just for kicks. Also plan on switching out to some Samsung B-Die and I want to add another m.2 SSD for my steam library and video storage. Hell I might go ham and get 2x2 tb m.2 SSDs or something.


I was about to buy 240 version, but found reports that pumps were dying, and one case of radiator leakage. So after shopping around NZXT Krakens ... i found out that retailer cant get me TR4 brackets so I was forced to get Air cooler for my upcoming Threadripper 1900x build. Will test noctuas 14 and 12 - mainly if they will fit the case.


Also some retrospective:






Can you confirm the effect with memory he described - 8 dimms = 2666Mhz. Because i went for Asrock x399M Taichi which has just 4 slots, and my goal is 32gig, 3200 cl 14 with Gskill Xflares (Samsung B dies).


----------



## betam4x

Offler said:


> I was about to buy 240 version, but found reports that pumps were dying, and one case of radiator leakage. So after shopping around NZXT Krakens ... i found out that retailer cant get me TR4 brackets so I was forced to get Air cooler for my upcoming Threadripper 1900x build. Will test noctuas 14 and 12 - mainly if they will fit the case.
> 
> 
> Also some retrospective:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UC67mFBuM8Q
> 
> 
> Can you confirm the effect with memory he described - 8 dimms = 2666Mhz. Because i went for Asrock x399M Taichi which has just 4 slots, and my goal is 32gig, 3200 cl 14 with Gskill Xflares (Samsung B dies).


For the NEW Enermax one designed for Threadripper 2?


----------



## betam4x

Yamie said:


> The new one?
> 
> I got the Liqtech TR4 360, but it's not new
> The Liqtech is a very solid and well working AiO so far
> 
> Still not powerfull enough beyond 1.4V (~300W) on a 1950x
> 
> 
> Prime custom 32 Threads
> FFT min/max 96/96 in-place 15min


I was referring the updated version designed for Threadripper 2. Has RGB and all that. My original Enermax 360 could easily cool up to 1.45V if you put it in push/pull before corrosion set in.


----------



## Offler

betam4x said:


> For the NEW Enermax one designed for Threadripper 2?


Nope. Reports were for older models, purchased and operating since year ago.

This one:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/13212/enermax-unveils-liqtech-tr4-ii-lcs

Is out for like two weeks.


----------



## betam4x

gtz said:


> You don't have to re run (unless you want to). I just wanted to get a baseline score, my scores are below.
> 
> Timespy - 10500
> Firestrike - 19800
> 
> You have a really good firestrike score, almost 1500 points higher than mine. But your timespy score is lower. Our rigs are opposites.
> 
> Thank you for posting


Are you guys overclocked? What graphics card do you have? Here is my FS result: https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/28179180

GTX 1080ti, stock clocks, air cooled.


----------



## Yamie

betam4x said:


> I was referring the updated version designed for Threadripper 2. Has RGB and all that. My original Enermax 360 could easily cool up to 1.45V if you put it in push/pull before corrosion set in.


Ah ok, I didn't know that there was a newer RGB version 
Sounds good to me

1.45V isn't working for me : /
Ambient is around ~24°C

And with my custom prime bench it is up to 87°C @ >1.4V what causes throttling


From what I see on the new RGB pictures, they just changed the acrylic top and replaced the with LED with an RGB one ^^






betam4x said:


> Are you guys overclocked? What graphics card do you have? Here is my FS result: https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/28179180
> 
> GTX 1080ti, stock clocks, air cooled.


Sure oced 

I got a Aorus Xtreme; 
TDP 150% 
Core Voltage +100
Core Clock +0
Memory Clock +400

The 1950x runs at 4.2Ghz @1.4125V for games, when I do longer work sessioins or rendering it's 3.9Ghz @ 1.3V
On my x399 Aorus Gaming 7 LLC is set to Low


----------



## Offler

I put into the new build temporary PSU Corsair 650w, temporary GPU R9-290x ...

AsRock x399M bios reports my 1900x properly (Bios version is 1.0, updates are obviously needed) but it shows temperatures on 70 degrees of celsius. I dont have OS yet, so there is no other measurement to compare it with, but the value seems to be dead wrong. VRM reports 33 degrees, and nothing nearby the socket is getting hot yet.

Isnt the measuring in Bios wrong?


----------



## ssateneth

Offler said:


> I put into the new build temporary PSU Corsair 650w, temporary GPU R9-290x ...
> 
> AsRock x399M bios reports my 1900x properly (Bios version is 1.0, updates are obviously needed) but it shows temperatures on 70 degrees of celsius. I dont have OS yet, so there is no other measurement to compare it with, but the value seems to be dead wrong. VRM reports 33 degrees, and nothing nearby the socket is getting hot yet.
> 
> Isnt the measuring in Bios wrong?


nope, this is correct, as intended by AMD. this is not a bug, its a feature. tr reports 27C higher than actual for faster fan profile. this is already extremely well known and proveable. so no, your tr is not overheating.


----------



## tarot

betam4x said:


> Are you guys overclocked? What graphics card do you have? Here is my FS result: https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/28179180
> 
> GTX 1080ti, stock clocks, air cooled.


https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/16189770/fs/16073896#

there you go for reference mine is running at 4050 and pretty much has been since day one


----------



## MNMadman

Offler said:


> I put into the new build temporary PSU Corsair 650w, temporary GPU R9-290x ...
> 
> AsRock x399M bios reports my 1900x properly (Bios version is 1.0, updates are obviously needed) but it shows temperatures on 70 degrees of celsius. I dont have OS yet, so there is no other measurement to compare it with, but the value seems to be dead wrong. VRM reports 33 degrees, and nothing nearby the socket is getting hot yet.
> 
> Isnt the measuring in Bios wrong?


Confirming what @ssateneth said -- AMD added an offset of 27C to Threadripper's temps. This is called Tctl. You will want to pay attention to Tdie in HWiNFO (once you get into Windows) as that is the real temp.

They did the same thing for regular Ryzen processors, but that offset is only 10C.


----------



## Offler

MNMadman said:


> Confirming what @ssateneth said -- AMD added an offset of 27C to Threadripper's temps. This is called Tctl. You will want to pay attention to Tdie in HWiNFO (once you get into Windows) as that is the real temp.
> 
> They did the same thing for regular Ryzen processors, but that offset is only 10C.


Well the report from Bios isnt really comforting, but before i install OS later today... There is nothing I can do.



By the way, whats the real TDP and power consumption of Threadripper 1900x?

I was looking for those data, but it appears that AMD distributed testing packages with 1950x and 1920x, so getting tests on 1900x is bit harder. I would not expect more than 110 watts on stock.


----------



## Particle

It seems I can no longer edit the first post. I can't add you to the list at the moment.


----------



## lowdog

Offler said:


> Well the report from Bios isnt really comforting, but before i install OS later today... There is nothing I can do.
> 
> 
> 
> By the way, whats the real TDP and power consumption of Threadripper 1900x?
> 
> I was looking for those data, but it appears that AMD distributed testing packages with 1950x and 1920x, so getting tests on 1900x is bit harder. I would not expect more than 110 watts on stock.




LOL 1900X will pull 180W stock when running prime95 or at least mine does, 3.9GHz with 1.3625v so stock is blah. I can run it at 4.125GHz with similar volts 1.375V with low LLC so it droops to 1.35volts load stable or 4.1Ghz with 1.35V for a load voltage of 1.331V. 4Ghz requires 1.25v with load volrage 1.231 but still has 160W cpu package power draw under prime95.


----------



## ITAngel

I enjoy the 1920X is fun to run it on Air with Noctua or under water which I have both CPU blocks for it EK and BYKSKI. Now I just need the HeatKiller block to compare them all.


----------



## x7007

When the ThermalTake pure arrow tr4 releasing? I want to change the noctua its not enough for 4.0 1.35


----------



## Offler

lowdog said:


> LOL 1900X will pull 180W stock when running prime95 or at least mine does, 3.9GHz with 1.3625v so stock is blah. I can run it at 4.125GHz with similar volts 1.375V with low LLC so it droops to 1.35volts load stable or 4.1Ghz with 1.35V for a load voltage of 1.331V. 4Ghz requires 1.25v with load volrage 1.231 but still has 160W cpu package power draw under prime95.


After few tests, HWmonitor indicated 150w on whole package, so you would be probably right.

1900x... cores/nodes go from 37-47 degrees in an instant, even when system should be idle (its new Win 10 installation, its always doing something). So far is everything stock (except RAM has XMP profile enabled), and i even let PWM deal with the cooling.

However, i cannot compare CPU performance with Phenom... LinX is not working on Ryzens...

I wonder if I should re-adjust CPU cooler.


----------



## betam4x

lowdog said:


> LOL 1900X will pull 180W stock when running prime95 or at least mine does, 3.9GHz with 1.3625v so stock is blah. I can run it at 4.125GHz with similar volts 1.375V with low LLC so it droops to 1.35volts load stable or 4.1Ghz with 1.35V for a load voltage of 1.331V. 4Ghz requires 1.25v with load volrage 1.231 but still has 160W cpu package power draw under prime95.


At stock, what speeds do you get on Prime95. The CPU SHOULD pull 180 watts, but you should also get slightly higher MHz. For instance, I get 3,450 MHz at small finfets and 180 watts.


----------



## Offler

Finally got to some stress tests.

OCCT, and its LINX test...

Both nodes can go from 33°C to 63 within few seconds if everything is on stock. Strangely CPU Vcore is indicated well over 1,4v in HWmonitor. So i went to bios, set offset to -0,1v and the thermal jump isnt that bad, and Package power consumption went to 178W.

This is kinda insane... Why "stock" means so bad overvolting? In such case, thermal throttling will kick in almost immediatelly when running stress test + i noticed some temporal lockups when Vcore was way too high.


----------



## lowdog

betam4x said:


> At stock, what speeds do you get on Prime95. The CPU SHOULD pull 180 watts, but you should also get slightly higher MHz. For instance, I get 3,450 MHz at small finfets and 180 watts.



Stock and prime95 smallFFT core speed is 3850 - 3900MHz


----------



## Offler

I would like to ask owners of AsRock x399 Taichi...

If the mainboard is set to "Auto" to all the settings, does it attempt to run on stock, or does it attempt to do mild overclocking on its own?

I expected CPUs to run 3800-4000MHz, yet it runs on 3600-4200MHz, I expected Vcore to be 1,35v, but it ran over 1.42v (causing some unnecessary heat) until i set offset -0.1v...


----------



## MNMadman

Offler said:


> I would like to ask owners of AsRock x399 Taichi...
> 
> If the mainboard is set to "Auto" to all the settings, does it attempt to run on stock, or does it attempt to do mild overclocking on its own?
> 
> I expected CPUs to run 3800-4000MHz, yet it runs on 3600-4200MHz, I expected Vcore to be 1,35v, but it ran over 1.42v (causing some unnecessary heat) until i set offset -0.1v...


That is normal Precision Boost and Extended Frequency Range behavior. That includes the voltage.


----------



## Offler

MNMadman said:


> That is normal Precision Boost and Extended Frequency Range behavior. That includes the voltage.


Thanks. On X399M Taichi BIOS v1.0 its called "Core Performance boost". I disabled it and the cores hold frequency as expected.

So far...

4000Mhz @ 1.3125 with Offset -0.05v
Thats way less as recommended OC profiles stored in the BIOS, and expected values are 1.36875v for all 8 cores at 3,8Ghz.


OCCT LinX stressed it out, no crash no lockup, yet the Node 1/2 reported up to 78°C after few minutes. This time no thermal throttling and package went to 198W power.
Thats on other hand way more than expected, and I way more than TMax of 68°C.

However I cant tell how much is the HwMonitor correct or wrong on values... but they seem to be correct.


----------



## lowdog

Try lower vcore for your 1900X...….mine will do 4GHz with 1.25 vcore and LLC auot/5 which gives 1.233V when loaded under prime95


----------



## Gilles3000

x7007 said:


> When the ThermalTake pure arrow tr4 releasing? I want to change the noctua its not enough for 4.0 1.35


I assume you mean the Thermal*right* *Silver* Arrow TR4?

If that's what you mean, its already released and available over here. No idea whether its available where you are, as you didn't mention in what country you live, nor have it on your profile.


----------



## lowdog

try lower vcore for your 1900X, mine will do 4GHz with 1.25V and LLC Auto/5 which is 1.23V load under prime95.

Forget using the Offset -0.05V as I have found it just increases the chance of instability.


----------



## Offler

lowdog said:


> try lower vcore for your 1900X, mine will do 4GHz with 1.25V and LLC Auto/5 which is 1.23V load under prime95.
> 
> Forget using the Offset -0.05V as I have found it just increases the chance of instability.


Will get to it tomorrow. Anyway... overclocking and undervolting at once... THATS NEW


----------



## 1usmus

Guys, advise please what water-block to buy for 2990WX+MSI CREATION X399? EK or BYKSKI A-RYZEN-THV2-X? 
What radiators do you use?

I will be very grateful for the advice


----------



## Dotachin

1usmus said:


> Guys, advise please what water-block to buy for 2990WX+MSI CREATION X399? EK or BYKSKI A-RYZEN-THV2-X?
> What radiators do you use?
> 
> I will be very grateful for the advice











https://www.hardocp.com/article/2018/02/22/heatkiller_iv_pro_threadripper_water_block_review

I use a MORA


----------



## Offler

lowdog said:


> try lower vcore for your 1900X, mine will do 4GHz with 1.25V and LLC Auto/5 which is 1.23V load under prime95.
> 
> Forget using the Offset -0.05V as I have found it just increases the chance of instability.


Vcore 1,2125v @ 4000MHz LLC is Level 5.

However 72°C under Prime95 Small FFTs, but ambient is 28°C. I still have to work on airflows within the case - 2nd fan on CPU cooler for example.

I would say that the CPU can go way up, but there is not much temperature headroom. Like right now I am on +4 over limit...

Edit: Added one more fan, also I attached one more to the CPU cooler. Now its 70. Looking forward how it will change as the thermal compound settles. In total the temps went down from 77+ degrees under load, mainly due overlotages.


----------



## MNMadman

1usmus said:


> Guys, advise please what water-block to buy for 2990WX+MSI CREATION X399? EK or BYKSKI A-RYZEN-THV2-X?
> What radiators do you use?
> 
> I will be very grateful for the advice


I highly recommend the Watercool Heatkiller block. EK would be last on my list.

The only reason I went with EK for *Heatripper Threadkiller* was because they were the only manufacturer that had a monoblock for my X399 Taichi and I really wanted the VRM liquid-cooled. You don't need that on the MEG.

I used the Watercool MO-RA3 1080 (120x9) rad and I do recommend it. If you need in-case rads, I recommend Hardware Labs Black Ice Nemesis GTX (or GTS if you need slim). If I was trying to cool an overclocked 2990WX, I would use 720mm of rad space just for the CPU. If cooling a GPU too, I'd add even more rad space.


----------



## lowdog

XSPC Raystorm is what I am using with Alphacool 1 x 480 - 60mm and 1 x 360 - 45mm rads + vega 64 in the loop.....but NOT a 2990WX and never will have, but I plan on dropping a 2950X in once they are available.


----------



## Bradwell

I would definitely recommend the Heatkiller and Black ice watercooling stuff. Im running a 2990wx and Titan V both overclocked and under load they hit 35C max. I have 1 360 thick rad and a 240 thick rad. Cant argue with those results


----------



## betam4x

Bradwell said:


> I would definitely recommend the Heatkiller and Black ice watercooling stuff. Im running a 2990wx and Titan V both overclocked and under load they hit 35C max. I have 1 360 thick rad and a 240 thick rad. Cant argue with those results


Yes I can. I just won't win.  Actually, I can if you are talking stock clocks.


----------



## Particle

Good news. I've regained access to editing the original post in this thread.


----------



## lowdog

A 2990WX overclocked and fully loaded hitting 35C.....pfffffffffffffffft!! I call BS!


----------



## Offler

Particle said:


> Good news. I've regained access to editing the original post in this thread.


I was wondering if you even update the club thread  Kinda surprised that nobody else picked x399M Taichi. So far, its a great board.


----------



## Tamalero

lowdog said:


> A 2990WX overclocked and fully loaded hitting 35C.....pfffffffffffffffft!! I call BS!


Must be one hell of a liquid metal water system with a chiller


----------



## betam4x

Enermax Customer Support for RMA:

"Unfortunately the Liqtech TR4 is temporarily out of stock this time. We will have new shipment ETA ~mid-September. Please check with us later.

Again, thanks for your patience.


Regards,
Enermax Support F"

Edit: Hopefully when they DO get the new batch in stock it won't have the issues the last one had.


----------



## <sigh>

betam4x said:


> Enermax Customer Support for RMA:
> 
> "Unfortunately the Liqtech TR4 is temporarily out of stock this time. We will have new shipment ETA ~mid-September. Please check with us later.
> 
> Again, thanks for your patience.
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Enermax Support F"
> 
> Edit: Hopefully when they DO get the new batch in stock it won't have the issues the last one had.


Yeah, I had to return the original to Amazon after it got gunked up, the new one just seems to be the same + RGB, I'm not sur I wanna risk I....


----------



## Offler

On Enermax...





That cooler was brand new and dissassembled as new. You can already see the copper oxide on some parts.

Instead I made an aircooled system with... quite a lot of Noctuas. I have to make photos and screenshots.


----------



## Kana Chan

https://i1.wp.com/www.xtremerigs.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/w10dt.png

The 2990WX uses 855 watts when overclocked to 4ghz though. And he has a Titan V in the loop at max OC? ( 500+ watts ). What's his flow rate? Is it above 1.5gpm? Fan speeds?


----------



## adam3234

The Zenith Extreme overclocks the 2950x better than the Meg x399 Creation but the VRM temps are 10 C higher (67 C vs 57 C) on the Zenith Extreme when the 2950x is overclocked to 4.1 Ghz @ 1.35 volts.


----------



## Offler

There has been a debate whether to Enable or Disable HPET setting in bios and in windows.

Maybe i am bringing old news...

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/16285602/fs/16264280

ENABLED HPET in BIOS
usedplatformclock=true in bcdedit
(to make it work properly, both have to be enabled or both have to be disabled)


means +8,8 percent increase in combined test - visibly higher.

Overall score + 1,2 percent, graphic scores -1,2 percents - these are within margin of error. Also keep in mind that HPET/platformclock is intended to be more precise system clock, therefore its expected shift in various results.


----------



## sblantipodi

Guys can I buy the 2950x with the zenith extreme or will I regret?


----------



## unityofsaints

sblantipodi said:


> Guys can I buy the 2950x with the zenith extreme or will I regret?


No reason to regret it. Power consumption will be very close to the 1950X and that works fine on that board.


----------



## ridn3y

Late to the party but better late than never 

Still building my rig but it's almost there. Maybe two weeks more before final version but for now i am quite happy with it.

1950x, X399 Gigabyte Aorus G7, Corsair Vengeance RGB 3200


----------



## Tamalero

Offler said:


> There has been a debate whether to Enable or Disable HPET setting in bios and in windows.
> 
> Maybe i am bringing old news...
> 
> https://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/16285602/fs/16264280
> 
> ENABLED HPET in BIOS
> usedplatformclock=true in bcdedit
> (to make it work properly, both have to be enabled or both have to be disabled)
> 
> 
> means +8,8 percent increase in combined test - visibly higher.
> 
> Overall score + 1,2 percent, graphic scores -1,2 percents - these are within margin of error. Also keep in mind that HPET/platformclock is intended to be more precise system clock, therefore its expected shift in various results.


My experience with HPET has been the opposite.
It visibly stutters.. badly for me.. (I have a 1950X)
horrible performance in games. even moving the mouse feels sluggy.


----------



## Offler

Tamalero said:


> My experience with HPET has been the opposite.
> It visibly stutters.. badly for me.. (I have a 1950X)
> horrible performance in games. even moving the mouse feels sluggy.


However using of this feature is still kinda strange - results are highly individual, but mostly it remains enabled either only in BIOS or only in OS.

Correct way how to set it up is:
1. Enable HPET in bios.
2. Check whether "high performance event timer" is present in device manager.
3. Open cmd with admin rights, type in "bcdedit /set useplatformclock true", reboot and then check/measure.

People usually enable it either in BIOS or in OS, while the other one is disabled. They have to be either BOTH ENABLED or BOTH DISABLED. From my experience both settings work, but if one is enabled and other is disabled, the problems will surface.

On other hand even when scored in 3d mark got better - values measured in LatencyMON went much higher. The question is whether its due really more sluggish performance, or because of more precise time measurement. Yet the behavior of the mouse driver got better...


----------



## sblantipodi

Is the fan on the zenith extreme noisy or audible?


----------



## ENTERPRISE

sblantipodi said:


> Is the fan on the zenith extreme noisy or audible?


No, I never heard mine.


----------



## mmonnin

<sigh> said:


> Yeah, I had to return the original to Amazon after it got gunked up, the new one just seems to be the same + RGB, I'm not sur I wanna risk I....


My 2nd one was leaking straight out of the box. The box was soggy on the bottom. Right back to Amazon. The 1st one was shipped back to Enermax the other week. I asked for a refund. Lets see if I get a refund or another POS replacement.


----------



## sblantipodi

ENTERPRISE said:


> No, I never heard mine.


thanks for the answer, I have a very silent PC and the case is near my hear on the desk.
can I manage the fan speed via aisuite and make it spin when VRM is at 60°C ?


----------



## betam4x

I'm debating on getting that MSI board and seeing how it does with the 1950X...the problem is I need decent cooling.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> The Zenith Extreme overclocks the 2950x better than the Meg x399 Creation but the VRM temps are 10 C higher (67 C vs 57 C) on the Zenith Extreme when the 2950x is overclocked to 4.1 Ghz @ 1.35 volts.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCeO8_6eJ04


I kind of feel like you'd get better every day usage not overclocked. If single core clocks are 4.5 GHz, by setting an all core clock of 4.1 GHz you now have 400 MHz slower single core performance...


----------



## sblantipodi

adam3234 said:


> The Zenith Extreme overclocks the 2950x better than the Meg x399 Creation but the VRM temps are 10 C higher (67 C vs 57 C) on the Zenith Extreme when the 2950x is overclocked to 4.1 Ghz @ 1.35 volts.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCeO8_6eJ04


if the zenith overclocks the 2950X better, and it's stable, it's better.
who cares if the VRM reaches 67C, that VRM are meant for way higher temperature.


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> I kind of feel like you'd get better every day usage not overclocked. If single core clocks are 4.5 GHz, by setting an all core clock of 4.1 GHz you now have 400 MHz slower single core performance...


From the video's I've seen, overclocking the 2nd gens using ASUS' precision boost override is the best way to go because you can reach the full single thread speeds for single threaded workloads while multi thread speeds are very close to that of manual overclocking. See @27:22 https://youtu.be/QI9sMfWmCsk?t=1642


----------



## sblantipodi

adam3234 said:


> From the video's I've seen, overclocking the 2nd gens using ASUS' precision boost override is the best way to go because you can reach the full single thread speeds for single threaded workloads while multi thread speeds are very close to that of manual overclocking. See @27:22 https://youtu.be/QI9sMfWmCsk?t=1642


ok thanks


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> From the video's I've seen, overclocking the 2nd gens using ASUS' precision boost override is the best way to go because you can reach the full single thread speeds for single threaded workloads while multi thread speeds are very close to that of manual overclocking. See @27:22 https://youtu.be/QI9sMfWmCsk?t=1642


I feel like we don't have the proper cooling capacity for the Threadripper 2xxx series yet.


----------



## Offler

I like decent aircooling solutions, as they do require little bit less experience in maintenance and construction. Basically you need to clean the fans, coolers or filters from time to time, but there is no corrosion. For some time i am also using Fury X with its AIO cooler - I have the one with more noisier pumps but it seems to perform well.

The case is Fractal Design Node 804
http://www.fractal-design.com/home/product/cases/node-series/node-804

Asrock X399M Taichi fits there like this:
http://slayershrine.wz.cz/tr2.jpg

Both board and case therefore allow dual GPU configuration (if the cables are properly set, and PSU will allow that).

*CPU, RAM and VRMs*

If you check the TOP screenshot, you are looking at LEFT chamber.

Lets start with case fans. 4x NF-P12 PWM. These are older fans (were bit cheaper) 
https://noctua.at/en/products/discontinued-products/nf-p12-pwm

Front fans are set to intake, top front fan is intake, top rear fan is exhaust. Each intake fan (and one exhaust fan) here has a dust filter.

On CPU is mounted cooler NH U12S TR4-SP3
https://noctua.at/en/nh-u12s-tr4-sp3

Its intake fan is NF-F12 PWM, exhaust is A12x25 PWM. On the back exhaust is mounted NF-S12 PWM. I would recommend to check the specs of these three fans. Short to say... F12 has high static pressure on low airflow, A12 has higher static pressure on medium and high airflow, and S12 has low static pressure and highest airflow. This ensures that air fed to CPU gets throught the cooler as fast as possible, and then out of the case.

Before i mounted S12 to the back of the case, the RAM modules on the left side reported 4-6 more degrees compared to those on the right. Once i fixed that, RAM on the "hot side" are reporting only up to 2 degrees more.

Zone to the right from the processor should have positive air pressure, GPU acts as a tunnel and everything to the left from the CPU should have negative air pressure.


*GPU Cooling*
If you want to mount the Fury X into this case, you can mount the Radiator on the exhaust in the right chamber, them pull the card throught cut-out in the center.
On rear.jpg you can check how its mounted and that the tubes are not stretching too much. (hm. i need to clear the dust out of radiator fan).

The thing is that GPU runs hotter by 10 degrees (in average tasks) than CPU, VRMs and other. This positioning keeps the heat out of reach of CPU. In order to compensate the exhaust, there is 12cm fan by Fractal design on the front-bottom.

Also you can see Corsair HX650w, taking air from the bottom, through air filter.

*Powering the fans*
In some cases I used Y-splitter cable to couple those fans, which are expecteted to perform at same performance level.

CPU intake and CPU exhaust fans are connected to mainboard independently.
Exhaust fans (S-12 and, top P-12) share Y-splitter.
Intake fans (top and upper front P-12) share Y-splitter.
Bottom intake fans (bottom P-12 and FD fan) are also coupled via Y-splitter.


*Results*
As the thermal paste cured a bit (after week or so)...

Ambient temperature was 26°C at the time of measuring.
CPU @ 4000MHz
Vcore 1,225v

Prime 95 Small FFTs gets CPU to 68°C, RAMs to 38-40°C, VRM up to 50°C.
On Idle CPU can get as low to 29°C, RAMs to 28°C, VRM to 30°C

This was measured when case was closed. Fans were set to full speed in BIOS so the PC is not perfectly silent. However when i set it to be managed by CPU sensor, the noise of old Fury X pump becomes noticeable


----------



## betam4x

So I made mention of working on a utility to emulate the turbo boost functionality of Zen+, but with user defined clock speeds/voltages. I've been kind of stumped because after about 10 minutes of system idle, the CPU starts throttling to 550 MHz for no apparent reason. Voltages are fine, temps are in the upper 20s, VRM temps are fine. It just throttles to 550 MHz. It's not the utility itself, the utility only makes an API call when the temps get too warm, and even closing the utility doesn't stop the throttling. Until I get this figured out I can't release it. There might be a newer version of the Ryzen Master SDK out there though, so I'll try that out next.

EDIT: By the way, I opened up my Enermax 360 and you would not believe the gunk that has built up in the copper block and around it. No wonder the damn thing doesn't cool any more.

At any rate. Should I pull the trigger on the 2950X and the MSI board? Just got paid and my trigger finger is itchy...but I kinda wanna wait to see what AMD does for 7nm.


----------



## adam3234

Offler said:


> I like decent aircooling solutions, as they do require little bit less experience in maintenance and construction. Basically you need to clean the fans, coolers or filters from time to time, but there is no corrosion. For some time i am also using Fury X with its AIO cooler - I have the one with more noisier pumps but it seems to perform well.
> 
> The case is Fractal Design Node 804
> http://www.fractal-design.com/home/product/cases/node-series/node-804
> 
> Asrock X399M Taichi fits there like this:
> http://slayershrine.wz.cz/tr2.jpg
> 
> Both board and case therefore allow dual GPU configuration (if the cables are properly set, and PSU will allow that).
> 
> *CPU, RAM and VRMs*
> 
> If you check the TOP screenshot, you are looking at LEFT chamber.
> 
> Lets start with case fans. 4x NF-P12 PWM. These are older fans (were bit cheaper)
> https://noctua.at/en/products/discontinued-products/nf-p12-pwm
> 
> Front fans are set to intake, top front fan is intake, top rear fan is exhaust. Each intake fan (and one exhaust fan) here has a dust filter.
> 
> On CPU is mounted cooler NH U12S TR4-SP3
> https://noctua.at/en/nh-u12s-tr4-sp3
> 
> Its intake fan is NF-F12 PWM, exhaust is A12x25 PWM. On the back exhaust is mounted NF-S12 PWM. I would recommend to check the specs of these three fans. Short to say... F12 has high static pressure on low airflow, A12 has higher static pressure on medium and high airflow, and S12 has low static pressure and highest airflow. This ensures that air fed to CPU gets throught the cooler as fast as possible, and then out of the case.
> 
> Before i mounted S12 to the back of the case, the RAM modules on the left side reported 4-6 more degrees compared to those on the right. Once i fixed that, RAM on the "hot side" are reporting only up to 2 degrees more.
> 
> Zone to the right from the processor should have positive air pressure, GPU acts as a tunnel and everything to the left from the CPU should have negative air pressure.
> 
> 
> *GPU Cooling*
> If you want to mount the Fury X into this case, you can mount the Radiator on the exhaust in the right chamber, them pull the card throught cut-out in the center.
> On rear.jpg you can check how its mounted and that the tubes are not stretching too much. (hm. i need to clear the dust out of radiator fan).
> 
> The thing is that GPU runs hotter by 10 degrees (in average tasks) than CPU, VRMs and other. This positioning keeps the heat out of reach of CPU. In order to compensate the exhaust, there is 12cm fan by Fractal design on the front-bottom.
> 
> Also you can see Corsair HX650w, taking air from the bottom, through air filter.
> 
> *Powering the fans*
> In some cases I used Y-splitter cable to couple those fans, which are expecteted to perform at same performance level.
> 
> CPU intake and CPU exhaust fans are connected to mainboard independently.
> Exhaust fans (S-12 and, top P-12) share Y-splitter.
> Intake fans (top and upper front P-12) share Y-splitter.
> Bottom intake fans (bottom P-12 and FD fan) are also coupled via Y-splitter.
> 
> 
> *Results*
> As the thermal paste cured a bit (after week or so)...
> 
> Ambient temperature was 26°C at the time of measuring.
> CPU @ 4000MHz
> Vcore 1,225v
> 
> Prime 95 Small FFTs gets CPU to 68°C, RAMs to 38-40°C, VRM up to 50°C.
> On Idle CPU can get as low to 29°C, RAMs to 28°C, VRM to 30°C
> 
> This was measured when case was closed. Fans were set to full speed in BIOS so the PC is not perfectly silent. However when i set it to be managed by CPU sensor, the noise of old Fury X pump becomes noticeable


Nice! That's an impressive setup. My 1950x @4 Ghz gets to 86 C on Prime 95 (version 29.3) Small FFT with ambient temp of about 22 C but I need about 1.38 volts vcore to be 27/4 stable @4 Ghz. I can't wait for Noctua to release their new 120mm cooler that's suppose to come out this or next year. That cooler together with those new NF-A12x25 fans are rated for 220W heat dissipation.


----------



## ITAngel

Hey Offler, That thing is small and pretty bad a$$ looking. Nice work!


----------



## adam3234

betam4x said:


> So I made mention of working on a utility to emulate the turbo boost functionality of Zen+, but with user defined clock speeds/voltages. I've been kind of stumped because after about 10 minutes of system idle, the CPU starts throttling to 550 MHz for no apparent reason. Voltages are fine, temps are in the upper 20s, VRM temps are fine. It just throttles to 550 MHz. It's not the utility itself, the utility only makes an API call when the temps get too warm, and even closing the utility doesn't stop the throttling. Until I get this figured out I can't release it. There might be a newer version of the Ryzen Master SDK out there though, so I'll try that out next.
> 
> EDIT: By the way, I opened up my Enermax 360 and you would not believe the gunk that has built up in the copper block and around it. No wonder the damn thing doesn't cool any more.
> 
> At any rate. Should I pull the trigger on the 2950X and the MSI board? Just got paid and my trigger finger is itchy...but I kinda wanna wait to see what AMD does for 7nm.


 @betam4x that's a really neat utility although I don't have a need for it, Lately I've OCed my 1950x to 4 Ghz and I'm quite happy with it...unless I'm running virtual machines. The guest machines get 133 cb points and the hoest machine gets 166 cb point on single thread runs. That's a difference of about 20% which is a lot more than the 5% percent performance loss the guest machines have running on intel chips. Kvm is poorly optimised for Threadripper and I it can't pass threads (for Threadripper) to the guests, only cpus.

If you have lots of money that you can't find a better use for than got for it otherwise that's a lots of money for very little performance improvement over the 1950x and the MSI Meg x399 Creation is really only needed for over clocking the WX series Threadrippers.


----------



## Offler

adam3234 said:


> Nice! That's an impressive setup. My 1950x @4 Ghz gets to 86 C on Prime 95 (version 29.3) Small FFT with ambient temp of about 22 C but I need about 1.38 volts vcore to be 27/4 stable @4 Ghz. I can't wait for Noctua to release their new 120mm cooler that's suppose to come out this or next year. That cooler together with those new NF-A12x25 fans are rated for 220W heat dissipation.





ITAngel said:


> Hey Offler, That thing is small and pretty bad a$$ looking. Nice work!


Thanks guys. Flight tests are being already performed .

So far it even seems that smaller case works better for airflow.


----------



## XiCynx

I'm not 100% sure if this is allowed, if so please feel free to remove this or I can edit it. But I'm wanting to become a part of this group, so if anyone here is going to be moving up to the 2950x group, hit me up and I'll take that 1950x off your hands! :3


----------



## adam3234

The new cooling kit fan ASUS released for the Zenith Extreme is pretty useless and the Zenith Extreme is still the overall best non 16 phase VRM x399 motherboard for overclocking the 2990WX.


----------



## sblantipodi

adam3234 said:


> The new cooling kit fan ASUS released for the Zenith Extreme is pretty useless and the Zenith Extreme is still the overall best non 16 phase VRM x399 motherboard for overclocking the 2990WX.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MRAOzQI4t0


really in doubt if buy now or wait X499... mmm...


----------



## webhito

Hello fellas, 

A few months back I picked up a 1900x and a designare x399, so far it has proven to work great, however I just noticed that my idle vcore is not dropping as it seems 1 core is always pegged at its max speed. 
I have tried resetting bios, flashing to older versions, latest version as well, leaving everything on stock, undervolting, etc. Still does the same regardless.
While my vcore is only 1.2v its annoying as its not downclocking properly.

Has anyone here ran into this issue?

Nvm, third flash was a charm... Stubborn board.


----------



## Offler

1900x 4000Mhz
1,25v
1 hour of Small FFTs in Prime95

Stable, no errors. CPU temps are slightly above the spec, package power consumption is slightly under the spec (partially due slight undervoltage). I can even lower Vcore to 1,225v.
68°C on CPU was achieved after 15 minutes, 70 took another 30 minutes and 71 another 15.

The test ran in ambient temperature of 26°C. I might try different thermal paste (so far used Noctua) and use Arctic Silver 5. Still best paste in my experience, but needs 1-2 weeks curing time. 

Motherboard and SYSIN delta from 34 to 37°C indicates good airflow inside the case. CPU on idle sits on 29°C. What concerns me is that CPU vs Motherboard delta goes from -5 to +34. Air inside the case gets warmer only by 3 degrees, CPU gets warmer by 42... It looks like there is a problem with something which is insulating the CPU, but once the stress test is stopped, temps go down 4 degrees per HWMonitor refresh cycle.


----------



## adam3234

@Offler Those are impressive looking numbers. My 1950x was only 24 hours Prime 95 (version 29.3) stable when I set the core voltage to 1.381x volts and it reaches about 86 C tdie.

Hardware Unboxed did VRM temperature testing on flagship x399 moherboards to see how well they handle the 2990WX over clocked to 4 Ghz with 1.25V and 1.4V and the Zenith Extreme beat the Meg x399 Creation very slightly in a majority on the tests by a small margin. The workload was Blender rendering for about an hour per test.


----------



## Offler

adam3234 said:


> @Offler Those are impressive looking numbers. My 1950x was only 24 hours Prime 95 (version 29.3) stable when I set the core voltage to 1.381x volts and it reaches about 86 C tdie.
> 
> Hardware Unboxed did VRM temperature testing on flagship x399 moherboards to see how well they handle the 2990WX over clocked to 4 Ghz with 1.25V and 1.4V and the Zenith Extreme beat the Meg x399 Creation very slightly in a majority on the tests by a small margin. The workload was Blender rendering for about an hour per test.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxX-1e-n0Mk


Well, I have just Threadripper 1900x, and it has stock frequency at 3800Mhz. Chips are probably a win in chip lottery, but still I found the results good, but slightly below expectations - mainly when it comes to huge CPU temperature jump when under load - thats a concern regarding cooling solution. There is basically no way how to compare this to a full populated 1950x.

BTW the test Hardware Unboxed did is great, but they apparently missed few details on Asrock Fatality. It has "just" 8+4 power plugs. With certain PSUs it can deliver "only" 390 watts (some PSUs have hard limit of 130w per 4 pin 12v connector). Also there is the Prochot switch, which is related to VRM...


----------



## Tamalero

webhito said:


> Hello fellas,
> 
> A few months back I picked up a 1900x and a designare x399, so far it has proven to work great, however I just noticed that my idle vcore is not dropping as it seems 1 core is always pegged at its max speed.
> I have tried resetting bios, flashing to older versions, latest version as well, leaving everything on stock, undervolting, etc. Still does the same regardless.
> While my vcore is only 1.2v its annoying as its not downclocking properly.
> 
> Has anyone here ran into this issue?
> 
> Nvm, third flash was a charm... Stubborn board.


If I remember correctly.. If you have OC mode enabled.. Your cpu will not drop down on voltages or frequency. It will stay fixed to certain fixed level you set it up.

Thats why many look for the Cstates overclocking.


----------



## Tamalero

Offler said:


> Well, I have just Threadripper 1900x, and it has stock frequency at 3800Mhz. Chips are probably a win in chip lottery, but still I found the results good, but slightly below expectations - mainly when it comes to huge CPU temperature jump when under load - thats a concern regarding cooling solution. There is basically no way how to compare this to a full populated 1950x.
> 
> BTW the test Hardware Unboxed did is great, but they apparently missed few details on Asrock Fatality. It has "just" 8+4 power plugs. With certain PSUs it can deliver "only" 390 watts (some PSUs have hard limit of 130w per 4 pin 12v connector). Also there is the Prochot switch, which is related to VRM...


Some people mentioned I had a golden chip for being hable to get 3.95Ghz on 1.25V (currently at 1.268V because my current version of Zenstates does not allow Vdropdown control).
But if my chip is golden, then yours is diamond.
1.25V for 4Ghz? I need 1.35V in the minimum for that!


----------



## Offler

Tamalero said:


> Some people mentioned I had a golden chip for being hable to get 3.95Ghz on 1.25V (currently at 1.268V because my current version of Zenstates does not allow Vdropdown control).
> But if my chip is golden, then yours is diamond.
> 1.25V for 4Ghz? I need 1.35V in the minimum for that!


I knew it was very good CPU when it ran 4000MHz and i could undervolt it below 1,35v. It actually can go down to 1.225v @ 4000MHz, but its way too close to unstable 1,2125v. That was the only reason to voltage adjustment upward.

Can you link me a screenshot of a stress test of your 1900x, with CPU-Z and HWMonitor and photo of that system? Mainly interested in board, memory and cooling solution. I might have hit gold due particular combination of components - PSU is kinda special - no other i previously had reported 3,4v on 3,3v lanes. Usually was 3,2v and less.

Also i am an oldschool overclocker. All changes done in bios only, preferably air cooling with performance/fullspeed settings, static values of Vcore.

Edit: Added screenshot. 1,225v @ 4000MHz, prime95 for 15 minutes 67°C. But its night and bit colder here.


----------



## lowdog

Nah it's not a golden or diamond cpu, all 1900X can usually do that. Here is mine on Asrock Fat Pro @ 4GHz with 1.25V with LLC 5/auto which is 1.225V load and DMM at socket reading is .03 below that so under 1.2V real at load;


Also 4.1Ghz @ 1.35V = 1.313V and minus the .03 DMM at core it's below 1.3V real at load;


----------



## Offler

Except my configuration isnt allow to underclock at all (always same multiplier), but thats just a detail. Rest of the settings seems similar.

We both have AsRock board/VRM and Gskill FlareX (except i have 3200MHz Ram, again just a minor difference). Both have 8 layer PCB, 2oz copper. From my previous experience with DDR3 it helps a lot to memory and indirectly to CPU stability and power consumption.


----------



## josephimports

-.0750 (1.225v load) was a no go for me. Bumped it up two notches to -.0500 (1.250v load). Testing out the new Sniper 3600c19 quad kit (Hynix CJR).


----------



## ajc9988

Tamalero said:


> Some people mentioned I had a golden chip for being hable to get 3.95Ghz on 1.25V (currently at 1.268V because my current version of Zenstates does not allow Vdropdown control).
> But if my chip is golden, then yours is diamond.
> 1.25V for 4Ghz? I need 1.35V in the minimum for that!


Dude, I have 1.225V on 4GHz, and 1.2875 on 4.05GHz here. 

Also, @Offler, instead, try monitoring with hwinfo. Gives a lot more info.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


----------



## Tamalero

ajc9988 said:


> Dude, I have 1.225V on 4GHz, and 1.2875 on 4.05GHz here.
> 
> Also, @Offler, instead, try monitoring with hwinfo. Gives a lot more info.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


I just noticed that you guys have the 1900X as lowdog mentioned. I'm on a 1950X boo. 

In my defense, I'm still recovering from one hell of a cold.


----------



## betam4x

Enermax is sending me a Liqtech 360 II apparently for my RMA. Definitely surprised at how smooth everything went AND the fact they are sending me their new model.


----------



## Offler

betam4x said:


> Enermax is sending me a Liqtech 360 II apparently for my RMA. Definitely surprised at how smooth everything went AND the fact they are sending me their new model.


Have seen about 5 different Enermax Liqtech for TR4 of first generation. Every single of them had problem with galvanic corrosion. Copper was corroding and creating copper oxide gunk at the pump. It was obvious and very common manufacturing issue.

At the surface the 2. gen has some RGBs, hope someone (like GamerNexus) will make tear-down video of this one. Until then I am keeping air cooled system.


----------



## mmonnin

betam4x said:


> Enermax is sending me a Liqtech 360 II apparently for my RMA. Definitely surprised at how smooth everything went AND the fact they are sending me their new model.


I was disappointed I wasn't getting a refund and I didn't even open the package for 2 days. I also received the new model. Are there reviews/tear downs/comparison between the old/new version? Or is just the channel that's different. I think I'm just going to let this sit in the box for awhile.

Edit: I was looking around and saw this comment on reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/commen...ech_360_tr4_ii_upgrade_from_version_i/e5bpwgz



> Oh good, looks like yours poked through the box in shipping too.


Upon opening the shipping box the top of the box looks like it had been poked from the inside. The block's mounting holes line up with the cover. There is a thin piece of foam that was under the cover as well but that's not going to keep a metal block from moving around.


----------



## betam4x

mmonnin said:


> I was disappointed I wasn't getting a refund and I didn't even open the package for 2 days. I also received the new model. Are there reviews/tear downs/comparison between the old/new version? Or is just the channel that's different. I think I'm just going to let this sit in the box for awhile.
> 
> Edit: I was looking around and saw this comment on reddit:
> https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/commen...ech_360_tr4_ii_upgrade_from_version_i/e5bpwgz
> 
> 
> 
> Upon opening the shipping box the top of the box looks like it had been poked from the inside. The block's mounting holes line up with the cover. There is a thin piece of foam that was under the cover as well but that's not going to keep a metal block from moving around.


Why does it matter what shape the box is in? I installed mine last night. It was an RMA, they shipped it with an apology letter and (in my eyes) a pair of fantastic headphones. It's extremely quiet and keeps the CPU very cool. If you knew how the pump worked, you wouldn't worry too much about it getting banged around (unless your unit was damaged visibly). As long as they fixed the corrosion issue I don't care.

EDIT: and if the LLC settings actually worked on my board (ASUS X-399E - they do not appear to, I set it to level 6 and the voltage still dropped to 1.325V under load from 1.3875 during a test, this caused a prime95 error) I imagine I could push my 1950X pretty hard. As it is, XFR has been doing a good job. Definitely beats out the review samples.)


----------



## x7007

betam4x said:


> Why does it matter what shape the box is in? I installed mine last night. It was an RMA, they shipped it with an apology letter and (in my eyes) a pair of fantastic headphones. It's extremely quiet and keeps the CPU very cool. If you knew how the pump worked, you wouldn't worry too much about it getting banged around (unless your unit was damaged visibly). As long as they fixed the corrosion issue I don't care.
> 
> EDIT: and if the LLC settings actually worked on my board (ASUS X-399E - they do not appear to, I set it to level 6 and the voltage still dropped to 1.325V under load from 1.3875 during a test, this caused a prime95 error) I imagine I could push my 1950X pretty hard. As it is, XFR has been doing a good job. Definitely beats out the review samples.)



I also got the new model ,, would you say they fixed it ?? it's my 4th unit from the 3 others but old version. now it's RGB compare to all others . it still not arrived but I hope it will just freaking work.............. more than 2 months.


----------



## mmonnin

betam4x said:


> Why does it matter what shape the box is in? I installed mine last night. It was an RMA, they shipped it with an apology letter and (in my eyes) a pair of fantastic headphones. It's extremely quiet and keeps the CPU very cool. If you knew how the pump worked, you wouldn't worry too much about it getting banged around (unless your unit was damaged visibly). As long as they fixed the corrosion issue I don't care.
> 
> EDIT: and if the LLC settings actually worked on my board (ASUS X-399E - they do not appear to, I set it to level 6 and the voltage still dropped to 1.325V under load from 1.3875 during a test, this caused a prime95 error) I imagine I could push my 1950X pretty hard. As it is, XFR has been doing a good job. Definitely beats out the review samples.)


If you've read my previous posts where I've said I've received a unit leaking straight out of the box, how it is packaged completely does matter. It was leaking from the block, the part being banged around. I doubt those headphones covered the cost of shipping back a unit for RMA. A busted package is a testimony for poor quality control and design. Areas that cause corrosion in the pumps. A company that sells products of that quality doesn't just have poor quality in one department.


----------



## betam4x

mmonnin said:


> If you've read my previous posts where I've said I've received a unit leaking straight out of the box, how it is packaged completely does matter. It was leaking from the block, the part being banged around. I doubt those headphones covered the cost of shipping back a unit for RMA. A busted package is a testimony for poor quality control and design. Areas that cause corrosion in the pumps. A company that sells products of that quality doesn't just have poor quality in one department.


Yes, but did you get the version 2? I also did not have to ship back mine for RMA. They just asked for the serial number. Thus far the new unit is much better behaved than the old one.


----------



## Tamalero

So.. Asus new AIO is going to be released soon.. the Ryujin ..
They look awesome.
I wonder if I would just forget about Enermax and go for a Ryujin .


----------



## Offler

So the cooling system is finished, summer in Europe is over as well, so i conducted set of short 15 test.

Stress 3: 15 minutes of Prime95 Small FFTs.
If you check GPU temperature at this point its at 26°C so ... almost no heat gets from CPU to GPU. Temperature at Samsung 970 is at 32°C.

Then Idle1 shows temperatures after few minutes of cooldown.
GPU is at 26°C, Samsung 970 at 30°C. So it indicates that heat from CPU travelled a bit to the drive.

Stress 4:
MSI Kombustor is heating up the GPU. Compared to IDLE on VRM, Mainboard and CPU increased some degrees, however CPU had to perform some tasks for the Kombustor, so the values are affected primarily by this. GPU is at 61°C. Samsung 970 is at 31°C so some heat is getting into the system from it.

And a side note - PSU is taking air from outside of the case (bottom).


----------



## ewitte

Taking a chance on version II are these leaking from the CPU block or the radiator? I put my radiator at the front if the leak is there it will drain out of the case onto the floor. If it lasts 6 months I'm fine I just can't afford a full custom loop righter after springing for the TR2950x. If it works and doesn't give me problems 6+ months from now even better.


----------



## Offler

How much watts are your Threadrippers chewing up? Wattmeter arrived yesterday and the results are much better than i anticipated.

This is a 1900x, with average 95% effective PSU, and how much watts it draws from the wall:

Idle 77w
browser 89w (Overclock page)
youtube 114w (fullHd video)
Occt CPU Linpack 255w
3dmark firestrike 350w
MSI Kombustor 430w
(100% TDP - 150% TDP
tuned power for max FPS -19%: 377w)

Max power draw: 550w
(2 threads for kombustor, rest for Prime95)


----------



## ewitte

Offler said:


> How much watts are your Threadrippers chewing up? Wattmeter arrived yesterday and the results are much better than i anticipated.


I have to struggle to go hit 500W even with 250W socket power and 1080ti. Usually games don't push the CPU it's closer to 300-350 total with that kind of load. I'm usually stressing either the CPU or GPU rarely both.


----------



## OrionBG

Hey guys,
I have an issue which is kinda off-topic kinda related...
I was trying to flash my phone today with fastboot (Android phone) and the stupid thing would not flash anything properly...
Either the command will just hang indefinitely or I'll get some random errors.
It appears that the issue is with USB 3.0 controllers... Unfortunately my MB, the AsRock X399 Taichi does not have any USB 2.0 ports on the back, only 3.0 and 3.1
I'm using the latest Android support tools so latest versions of ADB and Fastboot, all MB drivers are updated (unfortunately there are no separate drivers for USB 3.0 and Win10 is using the Microsoft ones).
Phone's bootloader is unlocked and I've flashed it many times before on an older system at work (Intel based with USB 2.0 ports). I've tested different cables and ports...
I've been doing such thing for years and supposedly I know what I'm doing...
Have any of you had a similar issue and were you able to resolve it?


----------



## Tamalero

OrionBG said:


> Hey guys,
> I have an issue which is kinda off-topic kinda related...
> I was trying to flash my phone today with fastboot (Android phone) and the stupid thing would not flash anything properly...
> Either the command will just hang indefinitely or I'll get some random errors.
> It appears that the issue is with USB 3.0 controllers... Unfortunately my MB, the AsRock X399 Taichi does not have any USB 2.0 ports on the back, only 3.0 and 3.1
> I'm using the latest Android support tools so latest versions of ADB and Fastboot, all MB drivers are updated (unfortunately there are no separate drivers for USB 3.0 and Win10 is using the Microsoft ones).
> Phone's bootloader is unlocked and I've flashed it many times before on an older system at work (Intel based with USB 2.0 ports). I've tested different cables and ports...
> I've been doing such thing for years and supposedly I know what I'm doing...
> Have any of you had a similar issue and were you able to resolve it?


I've had similar issues happening, but it was actually the ports dying or the case's usb ports not being very good. plugging a short usb cable and then directly to the phone worked for me.


----------



## rdr09

Offler said:


> How much watts are your Threadrippers chewing up? Wattmeter arrived yesterday and the results are much better than i anticipated.
> 
> This is a 1900x, with average 95% effective PSU, and how much watts it draws from the wall:
> 
> Idle 77w
> browser 89w (Overclock page)
> youtube 114w (fullHd video)
> Occt CPU Linpack 255w
> 3dmark firestrike 350w
> MSI Kombustor 430w
> (100% TDP - 150% TDP
> tuned power for max FPS -19%: 377w)
> 
> Max power draw: 550w
> (2 threads for kombustor, rest for Prime95)


The Taichi board, how much pcie lanes its got? Will TR have a 7nm coming, too? And will your board take it?


----------



## OrionBG

Tamalero said:


> I've had similar issues happening, but it was actually the ports dying or the case's usb ports not being very good. plugging a short usb cable and then directly to the phone worked for me.


Unfortunately I've already tried different USB ports and cables...


----------



## Offler

rdr09 said:


> The Taichi board, how much pcie lanes its got? Will TR have a 7nm coming, too? And will your board take it?


I have AsRock x399M Taichi, which is mATX version.

VRM is identical to ATX version (a clone to Asus VRM), it has 4 DIMM slots - one for each memory channel. It has 3 full PCI-E 3.0 16x slot (the ATX version has two 16x and two 8x), and 3x Ultra M.2. A picture of it when I was fitting it into chassis:
http://slayershrine.wz.cz/tr2.jpg

1900x has 64 pci lines, minus 4 for Southbridge. The board offers access to all of them. 2 of the cards can have 2x thickness (usually graphics) one has to be 1x size. M.2 slots do not turn off any of the main PCI-E slot, nor each other. The only restriction is on M.2 under top PCI-E slot and U.2 port - those cant be used both at the same time. Giving the price of Intel Optane disks using U.2 i wont have any trouble with it, also Ultra M.2 is much more convenient to install.
(16x3) + (4x3) = 60

I planned to go for either 2 graphic cards + 16x storage device (maybe a NVMe Raid over Asrock 16x to 4x Ultra M.2) or some crazy networking device in scale of 100gbit.

It does support Threadripper 2, i am not sure about future support.


----------



## rdr09

Offler said:


> I have AsRock x399M Taichi, which is mATX version.
> 
> VRM is identical to ATX version (a clone to Asus VRM), it has 4 DIMM slots - one for each memory channel. It has 3 full PCI-E 3.0 16x slot (the ATX version has two 16x and two 8x), and 3x Ultra M.2. A picture of it when I was fitting it into chassis:
> http://slayershrine.wz.cz/tr2.jpg
> 
> 1900x has 64 pci lines, minus 4 for Southbridge. The board offers access to all of them. 2 of the cards can have 2x thickness (usually graphics) one has to be 1x size. M.2 slots do not turn off any of the main PCI-E slot, nor each other. The only restriction is on M.2 under top PCI-E slot and U.2 port - those cant be used both at the same time. Giving the price of Intel Optane disks using U.2 i wont have any trouble with it, also Ultra M.2 is much more convenient to install.
> (16x3) + (4x3) = 60
> 
> I planned to go for either 2 graphic cards + 16x storage device (maybe a NVMe Raid over Asrock 16x to 4x Ultra M.2) or some crazy networking device in scale of 100gbit.
> 
> It does support Threadripper 2, i am not sure about future support.


Thanks for all the info. The price of the 1st gen has really dropped and will still be relevant for quite some time. Heck, the thuban is still running. With the prices of GPUs dropping, might be a best time to go multi. At least some of us don't whine much about them, do you? Love my 2 290s. Need more info on the 7nm node.


----------



## Offler

rdr09 said:


> Thanks for all the info. The price of the 1st gen has really dropped and will still be relevant for quite some time. Heck, the thuban is still running. With the prices of GPUs dropping, might be a best time to go multi. At least some of us don't whine much about them, do you? Love my 2 290s. Need more info on the 7nm node.


Well. I clearly see how my FuryX runs out of VRAM when running KC in 4k mode, so 8gb VRAM is the first goal to achieve. Roughly 2x the performance of the GPU on top of that, so it would handle 4k.

The thing is, that the cooling solution on the FuryX fits perfectly to the rest of the system (i was able to place the radiator to the 2nd chamber). Vega 64 Liquid would probably not fit in that way, so I am curious about Navi. But even now I spent much more on the system I originally intended to.


----------



## ajc9988

rdr09 said:


> Thanks for all the info. The price of the 1st gen has really dropped and will still be relevant for quite some time. Heck, the thuban is still running. With the prices of GPUs dropping, might be a best time to go multi. At least some of us don't whine much about them, do you? Love my 2 290s. Need more info on the 7nm node.


So, what is it about 7nm that you want to know. The best time to buy an Nvidia GPU was used 1080 Tis leading up to the release of the 2080 Ti, when you could find them from $400-500 regularly on ebay. Picking up two of those for the price of a 2080 or a brand new 1080 Ti, after buying a hybrid block for it, was a no brainer. On AMD side for cards, prices keep coming down, but Vega costs too much atm, IMO.

But let's get back to the 7nm node, generally. AMD will be going with the TSMC 7nm node and 7nm+ node, as GF has bowed out from the 7nm horse race. Qualcomm seems to have contracted with Samsung, Apple with TSMC, and Nvidia is rumored to have designed Turing on 10nm Samsung but went with 12nm TSMC due to delays, but also means Nvidia could do the optical shrink from 10nm to 8nm at Samsung and release another card next year.

TSMC 7nm is comparable to 10nm Intel process. Just because they have the smaller number means nothing. Densities are roughly the same, depending on how they are calculated. It should be noted Intel did not achieve the maximum state of theoretical limit for them, which was 106 MTx/mm2, rather they reported 100.8 MTx/mm2, IIRC. That was from 2017 March press release. Since then, they had to gut a feature of 10nm responsible for a large portion of the die shrink, but rumors have since come back suggesting mitigations are in place, so it won't be so drastic a hit. When looking at Intel's 10nm dual core mobile chip available to Lenovo, it was really unimpressive, had lower boost than the chip it replaced, etc. 

Meanwhile, the theoretical max on the TSMC 7nm was 96.49 MTx/mm2. https://www.semiwiki.com/forum/content/7544-7nm-5nm-3nm-logic-current-projected-processes.html. These numbers are relative and based on SRAM cells. On the Apple chip, TSMC achieved 83.3 MTx/mm2. That isn't theory, that is production silicon in the market. Because Intel keeps certain info close, we cannot calculate the 10nm cannon lake mobile chip with that much certainty. So, AMD will be using this process for 7nm and is meeting their timelines. Intel, on the other hand, bowed out of EUV until 7nm Intel process, estimated for 2021, comparable to industry 3nm or 5nm processes. That means TSMC going volume production with EUV in 2019 and Samsung currently using EUV on the bottom most layers of their production already exceeds what Intel is doing, that TSMC currently is in the lead on process node development, and that both TSMC and Samsung will have used EUV for at minimum of two years before Intel's adoption of the new lithography. Also, after 7nm, the industry is losing the ability to go finFET, instead looking at Gate All Around solutions, some of which use nanowire or nanosheets. But that is a peak into the future.

So, now that density has been discussed, let's talk about the rumors surrounding AMD's 7nm process specifically. These include 5GHz CPUs, 10-15% IPC jump, changes to the interconnect (2 rumors here, one involving interposers, the other as refinement of IF for the interconnect), an uncore chip containing the IMC and I/O, etc. First, recently, a fairly trustworthy source posted in a forum about the early silicon being 4GHz base, 4.5GHz boost, using 3600MT ram, and on a nondescript internal AMD branded board. If we look to the first Zen release, we saw those chips arrive in March and April, and the refreshed mainstream chips arriving in April of 2018. Following this pattern, we will likely see an April release next year, which puts the release 6-7 months out. The rumor was posted on Sept. 13, meaning that two weeks have passed, so considering it may be the second week in April for the release, following the past two releases as examples, that means from the time of the rumor, they had 7 solid months to get the chips ready. That means the part about it crashing a lot means nothing. In December of 2016 and January of 2017, the first Zen processors early silicon clocked to 3.1 with a boost to 3.4GHz. We all know the final silicon clocked higher. As such, we could see increases making the speed comparable to the new Intel chips being released this month (if it isn't a paper release due to supply issues again). In that same thread, the reason RTG got the CPU sample was to work on graphics driver support related to the interconnect changes on the chip.

So let's talk interconnects. It seems like the current interconnect levels off around 1.55GHz, according to what is read on Sisoft Sandra. It is tied to memory speed, which is why 3200MHz ram seems to be a sweet spot considering price. There could just be tweaked enhancements that go with it to help speed it up, including allowing for faster transfer on IF. Then, there is AdoredTV's take. He dug through papers researched by AMD in 2014 and 2015 about using an active interposer of 1-10% active components which showed a drastic reduction in latency. AMD followed this with a cost analysis for implementation in 2017. This leans toward AMD exploring putting the chips on an interposer with a custom topology at some point when the cost benefits shift in favor of adoption. If this is adopted, then the rumor on an uncore makes sense, as having the IMC and I/O on a separate chip has many benefits, like not having to shrink the hard to shrink CPU components, being able to bin IMCs so that higher ram speeds can be achieved, lower production costs by producing uncore chips on the more mature node, thereby helping with yields, etc. Also, instead of using an interposer or IF, they could also use a tech like AIB or EMIB, to note known Intel techs in this. Although those solutions are not as elegant as IF or an interposer, it gets the job done. I find that the least likely possibility, but it is out there considering Intel gave AIB patents to DARPA to try to force that as an interconnect standard in order to undercut AMD using the custom topology interposer in the future. Instead, AMD has more of a protocol based approach to control data movements which is design agnostic, thereby allowing it to be used across multiple design implementations. I know which I would prefer (it isn't Intel's solution which stifles innovation).

But, either way, Zen 2 was a larger redesign. If the I/O and IMC are moved off die, then the dies would be smaller, which would increase yields for AMD considering the normal defect densities of new nodes. This is why that rumor could have legs. It also would have other changes which could increase IPC a fair amount after learning the issues from Zen and Zen+. Even changes to the interconnect can reduce latency or increase speed potentially fixing bottlenecks on data delivery to caches and cores, which could increase IPC. That means the 10-15% improvement is quite possible. With that said, Zen+ was around 4% slower IPC than Intel's current offerings (including coffee lake), and Zen was around 7%. So, depending on starting point, that could be as little as 3% IPC over Intel's current offerings up to 11% IPC over Intel's current offerings (the 9900K and 9000 series generally are Coffee Lake refreshes on 14nm++ node. There is no reason to expect much change in IPC, rather the large boost will come from better heat dissipation through using solder between the die and IHS which allows for the increased speeds (note- AMD uses Intel's patent to solder all of their chips except for the APUs, IIRC). Also, AMD still enjoys their SMT being better implemented than Intel's HT, and does not have the same security issues that Intel chips do with HT and memory vulnerabilities. 

Putting this all together, AMD will be using an equally dense, but arguably better, node from TSMC as compared to Intel's 10nm (although more dense absolutely than Intel's 14nm), is looking at an IPC increase that should exceed Intel's offerings, may reach speeds in the mid to high 4GHz range on all cores (early silicon so hard to tell, but compelling reasons to think this, stopping short of saying the 5GHz number) all at a lower price point and without supply concerns. That makes AMD 7nm really compelling from both a performance standpoint and a price to performance standpoint. Also, if the uncore rumor is true, it could also mean that an uncore chip has to be used with mainstream chips, which means that the CCX and Zepplin complex can remain otherwise unchanged with 4 cores per CCX and 8 cores per die (2 CCX complexes). Instead, the rumor started by or around the time of MSI's ad piece saying supports over 8 cores could have referenced a mainstream configuration of two 7nm dies with an uncore chip for mainstream CPUs. That would comply with the rumors without having to do the odd BS of making it 6 cores per CCX or dropping in another CCX to make three CCX per die. At worst, AMD would design 2-3 uncore chip designs to be produced on 12nm/14nm GF while the cores die is on 7nm TSMC, which may have costed less than fully shrinking the I/O and IMC, allows potentially hiding NUMA altogether since the IMCs are all on the uncore chip together, etc. I find that to be the most compelling explanation considering the rumors currently in the wild. 

Now, with all this comes the rumors surrounding the motherboards for the server and HEDT market. Let's start with the Server platform. First is that PCIe 4.0 will be supported by Epyc 2. That is pretty likely and Epyc 2 support for PCIe 4.0 is confirmed. With that, IF will also be used to connect the PCIe slots for a bridgeless multi-card solution (crossfire with IF connecting PCIe). Now for the rumor side. Supposedly, with the uncore chip, the support for DIMMs will increase drastically on Epyc 2, with AdoredTV mentioning him hearing a rumor for 32 dimms supported on a 1P unit. That is a bold rumor, but if true, is phenomenal. 

The rumors surrounding HEDT is that X499 boards are in development and may be ready for CES. Considering MSI is the only board with the VRM built for the 32 core behemoth, it isn't hard to imagine the other manufacturers are busy at work making their own boards, just that they are waiting for the new chipset and 7nm to release. 

Now, Asrock Taichi uses the same exact VRM as the Zenith Extreme from Asus, just with a worse VRM cooling solution (literally, same design down to the chips used). So, if you cannot wait for the new X499 boards, I would recommend the MSI MEG Creation X399 board, followed by either the ZE or Taichi (Fatality is the same, just with the 10Gbps port integrated) but with active VRM cooling. I currently use Koolance universal VRM blocks and have temps under load in the 40C range. But, no one knows what, if any, new features may be supported with X499, so....

I hope this helps.


----------



## x7007

Guys, with the new windows 10 update 1809 October , if I try to uninstall AMD PSP driver and Reinstall it which is the case I get BSOD every time with AMDPSP.SYS file... do you guys even install this ? do we need it ? it worked fine without uninstalling it after updating , but then I saw there is AMD 18.10.30 driver so uninstalled old , installed new and it started BSOD with the sys file.


Gigabyte X399 Aurous Gaming 7 F3g CPU fTPM disabled in bios, doesn't matter if enabled.

Does anyone uses F11e without any issue with 1950x series ? I have all kind of weird issues and many missing bios settings.


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> Guys, with the new windows 10 update 1809 October , if I try to uninstall AMD PSP driver and Reinstall it which is the case I get BSOD every time with AMDPSP.SYS file... do you guys even install this ? do we need it ? it worked fine without uninstalling it after updating , but then I saw there is AMD 18.10.30 driver so uninstalled old , installed new and it started BSOD with the sys file.
> 
> 
> Gigabyte X399 Aurous Gaming 7 F3g CPU fTPM disabled in bios, doesn't matter if enabled.
> 
> Does anyone uses F11e without any issue with 1950x series ? I have all kind of weird issues and many missing bios settings.



Just upgraded and had the same crash as you X399 Asus Prime but I didnt uninstall or anything.. I think the latest version is the problem.


----------



## ajc9988

Tamalero said:


> Just upgraded and had the same crash as you X399 Asus Prime but I didnt uninstall or anything.. I think the latest version is the problem.





x7007 said:


> Guys, with the new windows 10 update 1809 October , if I try to uninstall AMD PSP driver and Reinstall it which is the case I get BSOD every time with AMDPSP.SYS file... do you guys even install this ? do we need it ? it worked fine without uninstalling it after updating , but then I saw there is AMD 18.10.30 driver so uninstalled old , installed new and it started BSOD with the sys file.
> 
> 
> Gigabyte X399 Aurous Gaming 7 F3g CPU fTPM disabled in bios, doesn't matter if enabled.
> 
> Does anyone uses F11e without any issue with 1950x series ? I have all kind of weird issues and many missing bios settings.


This is the same problem Linux has. If you try to install the latest kernel without a patch, as of a couple weeks ago, the PSP would cause the conflict and a kernel panic. You will need to stick with stock in windows until they get it sorted out then, most likely. PSP is a security feature on these chips. 

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


----------



## x7007

ajc9988 said:


> This is the same problem Linux has. If you try to install the latest kernel without a patch, as of a couple weeks ago, the PSP would cause the conflict and a kernel panic. You will need to stick with stock in windows until they get it sorted out then, most likely. PSP is a security feature on these chips.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


But what does the AMDPSP actually does ? do we really need it for gaming ? Application ? normal use ? I can't understand what we needed it for . I understand it's the same as Intel IME . 

So AMD would know it BSOD or we need to tell them ?


----------



## ajc9988

x7007 said:


> But what does the AMDPSP actually does ? do we really need it for gaming ? Application ? normal use ? I can't understand what we needed it for . I understand it's the same as Intel IME .
> 
> So AMD would know it BSOD or we need to tell them ?


PSP stands for platform security processor. It is something on the system, so you need the drivers. Turns out the one you are trying to install doesn't work with the windows build/windows kernel and is causing the issue. Since windows build 1809 is new, you can/should drop a message to either Microsoft or AMD or both just in case they do not know (although they probably do know). 

It does many functions, including keeping memory safe with virtualized environments. If you are asking about gaming, you may not be the target audience of some of the feature sets it possesses. 

Either way, even if it doesn't benefit your needs, it is still integrated and you have to have it. I'd recommend just dealing with the older driver until others get the all clear.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


----------



## Tamalero

ajc9988 said:


> PSP stands for platform security processor. It is something on the system, so you need the drivers. Turns out the one you are trying to install doesn't work with the windows build/windows kernel and is causing the issue. Since windows build 1809 is new, you can/should drop a message to either Microsoft or AMD or both just in case they do not know (although they probably do know).
> 
> It does many functions, including keeping memory safe with virtualized environments. If you are asking about gaming, you may not be the target audience of some of the feature sets it possesses.
> 
> Either way, even if it doesn't benefit your needs, it is still integrated and you have to have it. I'd recommend just dealing with the older driver until others get the all clear.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


Well. I'm running the latest version of Windows without the PSP program or driver.

I got a BSOD, rebooted.. windows said it was restoring.. then autodetected my hardware and stuff like every big patch Microsoft sends.
Then managed to get to desktop with no issue.

This is my second boot, no issues.

Could they have fixed this?
I did not move anything.


----------



## ajc9988

Tamalero said:


> Well. I'm running the latest version of Windows without the PSP program or driver.
> 
> I got a BSOD, rebooted.. windows said it was restoring.. then autodetected my hardware and stuff like every big patch Microsoft sends.
> Then managed to get to desktop with no issue.
> 
> This is my second boot, no issues.
> 
> Could they have fixed this?
> I did not move anything.


They very well could have pushed a fix. And there is a chance ms have a driver version already compiled with the kernel.

Another consideration is AGESA interplay with the PSP issue. At least on Linux, the AGESA version would effect which kernel had the PSP support for that AGESA.

Now, personally, I'm waiting for the tools I like to be finished for modifying build 1809 before I install it (I use enterprise edition, so enjoy the benefits). MSMG is working on updating the tool, ntlite is already updated, and you can download the new apk for build 1809 of you need to DISM components and features right now.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


----------



## Offler

Downloading 1809 now. Will report what it will do. For me the update was postponed by at least a week.

Edit: 3-4 reboots, no bluescreen.


----------



## Offler

ajc9988 said:


> They very well could have pushed a fix. And there is a chance ms have a driver version already compiled with the kernel.
> 
> Another consideration is AGESA interplay with the PSP issue. At least on Linux, the AGESA version would effect which kernel had the PSP support for that AGESA.
> 
> Now, personally, I'm waiting for the tools I like to be finished for modifying build 1809 before I install it (I use enterprise edition, so enjoy the benefits). MSMG is working on updating the tool, ntlite is already updated, and you can download the new apk for build 1809 of you need to DISM components and features right now.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk


It might be not AGESA or PSP issue. I did some measurings with LatencyMON, noticed something is different from report i did earlier today. Apparenly the system timer is not running on 3,14MHz as before patch, but on 10Mhz. It did not changed when i disabled usedplatformclock, nor usedplatformtick, but its also not running on 14Mhz which is HPET.

Considering how PSP should work (and some weakspots for it) it might be an attempt to prevent attack on it. Basically it all looks like a Specter/Meltdown mitigation.


----------



## ssateneth

i also got BSOD during 1809 upgrade process, it recovered, then it installed the rest of the way ran fine, was running 4.4 version of PSP driver, manually upgraded 4.5, no problem.

also PSP should be thought of the equivalent of Intel ME. You can choose to not install and you wont have problems either, but you cannot remove the device.


----------



## OrionBG

Same here. I got a BSOD during the update but the process continued after rebooting and all went well... The funny part is that on a virtual machine at the office where I was using the insider builds, there were BSODs almost every time there was a new build installing but if I waited several days and try again, the build was installing OK... Microsoft...


----------



## x7007

more people with the same issue. I will wait till it safe to install it.

https://community.amd.com/thread/232651


I also noticed the Latencymon different timing and it show Unkonwn 10.0 mhz instead of Invariant TSC 3.xx Mhz.

So what does it say ?


----------



## Offler

x7007 said:


> more people with the same issue. I will wait till it safe to install it.
> 
> https://community.amd.com/thread/232651
> 
> 
> I also noticed the Latencymon different timing and it show Unkonwn 10.0 mhz instead of Invariant TSC 3.xx Mhz.
> 
> So what does it say ?


Probably an attempt to skew spectre/meltdown based attacks which require very precise timings. It appears that @microsoft they believe that TSC 3.xx is too easy to guess, while typical HPET 14.xxMhz is also well known standard. So they either set it to 10MHz which is quite atypical value, or its in fact masking the real value.

Performance wise...
a) There is an overhead compared to TSC.
b) Its not that bad as on 14.xxMhz
c) Few apps show sings of bugs which may be attributed to this setting.

Edit:

Guys do you have HPET enabled or disabled in bios? I cannot disable it...

10MHz is not a typical HPET value, but AFAIK its the lowest HPET standard.


----------



## x7007

Offler said:


> Probably an attempt to skew spectre/meltdown based attacks which require very precise timings. It appears that @microsoft they believe that TSC 3.xx is too easy to guess, while typical HPET 14.xxMhz is also well known standard. So they either set it to 10MHz which is quite atypical value, or its in fact masking the real value.
> 
> Performance wise...
> a) There is an overhead compared to TSC.
> b) Its not that bad as on 14.xxMhz
> c) Few apps show sings of bugs which may be attributed to this setting.
> 
> Edit:
> 
> Guys do you have HPET enabled or disabled in bios? I cannot disable it...
> 
> 10MHz is not a typical HPET value, but AFAIK its the lowest HPET standard.


So what are we going to do ?

I have HPET enabled on the bios . Bcdedit /set useplatformclock true makes it to use HPET 14.xx I our CPU is crap with HPET , at least with my Gigabyte x399 I get lower performance


----------



## Offler

x7007 said:


> So what are we going to do ?
> 
> I have HPET enabled on the bios . Bcdedit /set useplatformclock true makes it to use HPET 14.xx I our CPU is crap with HPET , at least with my Gigabyte x399 I get lower performance


I tested it. its better to keep HPET enabled in BIOS, but either set useplatformclock and useplatformtick off, or remove those values from boot completely.

10MHz timer seems to be inbetween 3.xx and 14.xx Mhz when it comes to performance (eg. my Samsung NVMe driver isnt impacted, but there might be few slight performance issues and bugs associated with it). Also the timer skew between HPET and System timer increased significantly...

If you disabled HPET in bios or in Device manger, i would expect BSODs. IF there is another source for the 10MHz timer, and its not HPET i am not yet aware what else it could be.


----------



## betam4x

You guys realize that the latest Windows update is botched, right? There is a chance you can lose your data.


----------



## Offler

betam4x said:


> You guys realize that the latest Windows update is botched, right? There is a chance you can lose your data.


In my case its a month-old installation without any important files whatsoever.


----------



## Tamalero

betam4x said:


> You guys realize that the latest Windows update is botched, right? There is a chance you can lose your data.


Pretty sure that the majority of power users wouldn't be that stupid to put all their files in Windows directories.


----------



## Minotaurtoo

Tamalero said:


> Pretty sure that the majority of power users wouldn't be that stupid to put all their files in Windows directories.


no but I was dumb enough to change the default folder locations to where I store all my stuff without thinking about windows might one day decided to start deleting... but from what I've read it's not actually deleted, just the default directories changed or something like that.


----------



## betam4x

An update on the Enermax 360 v2, still going strong. I don't find a need for overclocking much anymore. I don't know, just too lazy I guess. I bought a new case (NZXT H700i...amazing case), and the machine is practically silent. My central A/C vent makes more noise than the PC. I have decided to skip out on the 2950X and wait for 7nm Threadripper instead. 1950X, tight timings on 32 GB of RAM, 1TB 960 evo, GTX 1080ti, it does EVERYTHING. I even had some Forza 4 4k60 going the other day on my 4k HDR TV. The EVGA SC2 1080ti was able to keep up surprisingly.


----------



## ITAngel

Question about Monoblocks for X399. Are Monoblocks useful or needed for an X399 ASRock Fatal1ty Professional Gamer motherboard? I have two coolers at the moment the EK first model and the BYKSKI non-rgb one which is what I run currently right now.

Thanks!


----------



## heavyarms1912

Completed my TR build last Sunday

1920X on X399 Taichi
Crucial Ballistix DDR4 8gbx2 2666 Mhz (OC to 3000)
Corsair H110i GTX cooler (glad this one is by aestek and I didn't need a new cooler/brackets)
Corsair Air 740

Was trying to undervolt. Does 3.6 Ghz at 0.975v sounds like a good undervolt/clock setting?
Normal desktop workloads + browsers + mining + VMs seems to be working fine. I haven't stress tested for stability yet. HWInfo64 reports power consumption at 108w


----------



## Offler

heavyarms1912 said:


> Completed my TR build last Sunday
> 
> 1920X on X399 Taichi
> Crucial Ballistix DDR4 8gbx2 2666 Mhz (OC to 3000)
> Corsair H110i GTX cooler (glad this one is by aestek and I didn't need a new cooler/brackets)
> Corsair Air 740
> 
> Was trying to undervolt. Does 3.6 Ghz at 0.975v sounds like a good undervolt/clock setting?
> Normal desktop workloads + browsers + mining + VMs seems to be working fine. I haven't stress tested for stability yet. HWInfo64 reports power consumption at 108w


Looks good, how much volts on 4000Mhz?


----------



## heavyarms1912

Offler said:


> Looks good, how much volts on 4000Mhz?


I haven't tried that lately. Got failures on 1.1v. Will venture into that some other day. I disabled HPET as of now.

I observed 2-3 stutters on every restart when windows loads. Not sure what's the cause. I did a dirty hardware swap from skylake platform though.


----------



## Offler

heavyarms1912 said:


> I haven't tried that lately. Got failures on 1.1v. Will venture into that some other day. I disabled HPET as of now.
> 
> I observed 2-3 stutters on every restart when windows loads. Not sure what's the cause. I did a dirty hardware swap from skylake platform though.


Open device manager and remove all hardware drivers which are not associated with your current hardware. Its even easier to do a reinstall (speaking of Win 10).


----------



## Tamalero

heavyarms1912 said:


> I haven't tried that lately. Got failures on 1.1v. Will venture into that some other day. I disabled HPET as of now.
> 
> I observed 2-3 stutters on every restart when windows loads. Not sure what's the cause. I did a dirty hardware swap from skylake platform though.


I recommend that you use the SYSPREP command to clean the windows installation and to make windows properly redetect everything.


----------



## heavyarms1912

Tamalero said:


> I recommend that you use the SYSPREP command to clean the windows installation and to make windows properly redetect everything.


from an existing installation that I already swapped?


----------



## Tamalero

heavyarms1912 said:


> from an existing installation that I already swapped?


BEFORE swapping. 

But if you do now, you can do it to clean Windows from Driver information. Just careful as you will have to reactivate your windows (its like it reboots Windows and cleans drivers, that tool is used for imaging and deployment)


----------



## heavyarms1912

Tamalero said:


> BEFORE swapping.
> 
> But if you do now, you can do it to clean Windows from Driver information. Just careful as you will have to reactivate your windows (its like it reboots Windows and cleans drivers, that tool is used for imaging and deployment)


Yea i associated my window to an MS account and hence should be able to register it again. Thanks.


----------



## heavyarms1912

Offler said:


> Looks good, how much volts on 4000Mhz?


1.194 v

CPUID HW monitor shows VID#x at 1.162V while CPU VDD shows 1.194V at 4000 Mhz. Had run prime95 for a minute or so but Cinbench crashed at 1.1875V. Bumped to 1.194 and Cinbench worked fine.
Cinbench score was ~2600.


----------



## x7007

Did anyone find the fix to install the amdpsp drivers with 1809? if it does work for you for some reason try to unistall the driver and reinstall and tell me if it still works. b


----------



## Offler

heavyarms1912 said:


> 1.194 v
> 
> CPUID HW monitor shows VID#x at 1.162V while CPU VDD shows 1.194V at 4000 Mhz. Had run prime95 for a minute or so but Cinbench crashed at 1.1875V. Bumped to 1.194 and Cinbench worked fine.
> Cinbench score was ~2600.


I use Prime95 SmallFFTs test over at least 10 minutes or 1 hour so system heats up and it will behave typically for the settings. If it will stay stable <1.22v its really good.



x7007 said:


> Did anyone find the fix to install the amdpsp drivers with 1809? if it does work for you for some reason try to unistall the driver and reinstall and tell me if it still works. b


So far I dont have any issue with it, but because (both) PSP(s) has crucial funcion in how CPU cache and RAM works, i would NOT perform simple manual uninstallation. Most likely you would end up with BSOD...


----------



## heavyarms1912

Offler said:


> I use Prime95 SmallFFTs test over at least 10 minutes or 1 hour so system heats up and it will behave typically for the settings. If it will stay stable <1.22v its really good.


Thanks for the input. Will run it for an hour someday and test stability. As of now I am back to 3.6 Ghz 24x7 0.975v.
Next stop would be to overclock these Micron B-die. At the moment I have them at 3000 CL 16-18-18-36 1T. 

They did 18-22-22-42 on Skylake. But I read that Ryzen doesn't like higher speed over compromised latencies.
https://i.imgur.com/lVMEGdV.jpg


----------



## Offler

heavyarms1912 said:


> Thanks for the input. Will run it for an hour someday and test stability. As of now I am back to 3.6 Ghz 24x7 0.975v.
> Next stop would be to overclock these Micron B-die. At the moment I have them at 3000 CL 16-18-18-36 1T.
> 
> They did 18-22-22-42 on Skylake. But I read that Ryzen doesn't like higher speed over compromised latencies.
> https://i.imgur.com/lVMEGdV.jpg


I guess you know that Threadripper has 4 memory channels so you can use 4 dimms to get up to 100gb/s in total. I run my ram at 3200Mhz cl 14-14-14-32. Its worth to check XMP profile.


----------



## Tamalero

heavyarms1912 said:


> Thanks for the input. Will run it for an hour someday and test stability. As of now I am back to 3.6 Ghz 24x7 0.975v.
> Next stop would be to overclock these Micron B-die. At the moment I have them at 3000 CL 16-18-18-36 1T.
> 
> They did 18-22-22-42 on Skylake. But I read that Ryzen doesn't like higher speed over compromised latencies.
> https://i.imgur.com/lVMEGdV.jpg


Good luck with these memories. I had nightmares with my Microm based Corsair chips. only problems, bsods, memory unstable even at 2933 with super long timings and voltages..
I had to switch to Bdie and problems all gone.


----------



## x7007

Offler said:


> heavyarms1912 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 1.194 v
> 
> CPUID HW monitor shows VID#x at 1.162V while CPU VDD shows 1.194V at 4000 Mhz. Had run prime95 for a minute or so but Cinbench crashed at 1.1875V. Bumped to 1.194 and Cinbench worked fine.
> Cinbench score was ~2600.
> 
> 
> 
> I use Prime95 SmallFFTs test over at least 10 minutes or 1 hour so system heats up and it will behave typically for the settings. If it will stay stable <1.22v its really good.
> 
> 
> 
> x7007 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did anyone find the fix to install the amdpsp drivers with 1809? if it does work for you for some reason try to unistall the driver and reinstall and tell me if it still works. b
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So far I dont have any issue with it, but because (both) PSP(s) has crucial funcion in how CPU cache and RAM works, i would NOT perform simple manual uninstallation. Most likely you would end up with BSOD...
Click to expand...

what manually? I used the amd uninstaller and reinstall.


----------



## heavyarms1912

Tamalero said:


> Good luck with these memories. I had nightmares with my Microm based Corsair chips. only problems, bsods, memory unstable even at 2933 with super long timings and voltages..
> I had to switch to Bdie and problems all gone.


Ouch. Yea i had tough times getting to at 3200+ stable and gave up for initial dirty oc. This was fairly straightforward on the Skylake platform.  
Well, at least the 3000 works alright.


----------



## x7007

No one who had the bsod after installing the AmdPSP didn't try to install it again ? can anyone try ? maybe the windows update they released last time fixed something ?


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> No one who had the bsod after installing the AmdPSP didn't try to install it again ? can anyone try ? maybe the windows update they released last time fixed something ?


Reinstalled Windows clean today, updated to 8003 and then 8009, and then installed the drivers. NO BSOD.


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> Reinstalled Windows clean today, updated to 8003 and then 8009, and then installed the drivers. NO BSOD.


Ye didn't need to reinstall windows , I just installed manually just incase and it installed properly no BSOD.

I guess they fixed something in the latest KB they released with the Documents deleting and some Security for all windows software.

but somehow the mouse is screwed after installing the PSP for some reason dunno will check.


----------



## Offler

No problem with PSP. The driver is dated on April 2018, but in general no issues indicated on the driver.


----------



## heavyarms1912

Offler said:


> I guess you know that Threadripper has 4 memory channels so you can use 4 dimms to get up to 100gb/s in total. I run my ram at 3200Mhz cl 14-14-14-32. Its worth to check XMP profile.


Yes I am aware. XMP is 2666 16-18-18-38 on mine.


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> Ye didn't need to reinstall windows , I just installed manually just incase and it installed properly no BSOD.
> 
> I guess they fixed something in the latest KB they released with the Documents deleting and some Security for all windows software.
> 
> but somehow the mouse is screwed after installing the PSP for some reason dunno will check.


Just to clarify, I didnt reinstall for you lol.

Patch 8003 and 8009 corrupted core windows files (probably NET framework again..)

I started to get errors in a lot of applications (like critical errors trying to run vmware, zenstates suddenly didnt boost and only worked partially, other application phenomena)

SFC and other self repair and diagnostic tools said "all right" (as usual, they are pretty worthless to detect some core file corruption).

So, reinstalled, all working perfectly again.


----------



## x7007

Tamalero said:


> Just to clarify, I didnt reinstall for you lol.
> 
> Patch 8003 and 8009 corrupted core windows files (probably NET framework again..)
> 
> I started to get errors in a lot of applications (like critical errors trying to run vmware, zenstates suddenly didnt boost and only worked partially, other application phenomena)
> 
> SFC and other self repair and diagnostic tools said "all right" (as usual, they are pretty worthless to detect some core file corruption).
> 
> So, reinstalled, all working perfectly again.


No worry , I know you haven't 

Anyway , did anyone had their new Enermax RGB 360m and the pump still working ? I should be getting the RMA soon which is this and I want to know if it's even worth the pain of replacing the cooling again. I have Noctua NH14 or ND14 and it can't cool enough 4.0Ghz 1.3200 when full cores + HT it just fail ... the enermax could sustain that but only for 2-3 months .. lol

Need to hear some confirmation that it won't die after 1-3 months.


----------



## mmonnin

x7007 said:


> No worry , I know you haven't
> 
> Anyway , did anyone had their new Enermax RGB 360m and the pump still working ? I should be getting the RMA soon which is this and I want to know if it's even worth the pain of replacing the cooling again. I have Noctua NH14 or ND14 and it can't cool enough 4.0Ghz 1.3200 when full cores + HT it just fail ... the enermax could sustain that but only for 2-3 months .. lol
> 
> Need to hear some confirmation that it won't die after 1-3 months.


A couple posts back
https://www.overclock.net/forum/27660508-post4057.html

It hasn't been out long enough to confirm long term usefulness. I never put my RMA'd unit on.


----------



## Tamalero

x7007 said:


> No worry , I know you haven't
> 
> Anyway , did anyone had their new Enermax RGB 360m and the pump still working ? I should be getting the RMA soon which is this and I want to know if it's even worth the pain of replacing the cooling again. I have Noctua NH14 or ND14 and it can't cool enough 4.0Ghz 1.3200 when full cores + HT it just fail ... the enermax could sustain that but only for 2-3 months .. lol
> 
> Need to hear some confirmation that it won't die after 1-3 months.


It helps if you set double fans and put a very aggressive fan curve.
But It can only handle 1.3V at most in my side (with a 25C ambient)
Will reach 70C for sure in my case.
When I'm not using AC (30C ambient) its too hot for anything past 3.95Ghz 1.26V in my case.

I'm also looking at AIOs or maybe the Thermalright Arrow.


----------



## Tamalero

Heads up guys.. most X399 motherboards are getting BIOS updates..

Asrock Taichi and Asus X399 PRIME just released.


----------



## XiCynx

Hi all!

Just finished my Threadripper build and had a few questions as this is my first AMD build since the... Athlon 64 X2 back in 2006.

Here's my build:
*Motherboard:* ASRock - X399M
*CPU:* AMD - Threadripper 1950X
*CPU Cooler:* Enermax Liqtech TR4 II 240CPU 
*CPU Thermal Paste:* Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
*Memory:* G.Skill - Trident Z RGB 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 (TIMING: 14-14-14-34)
*Video Card:* Gigabyte - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB AORUS
*Storage:* Samsung - 960 EVO 500GB M.2-2280
*Secondary Storage:* Crucial - MX500 1TB M.2-2280
*Power Supply:* Silverstone - SFX 800W-LTI
*Case:* Cerberus 18L Mic​roATX PC C​ase



What a standard idle tempurature for the 1950 under a 240 rad cooling system? Right now I'm sitting at 63C in the BIOS and I'm not entirely sure if that is correct, seems high...
I don't plan on overclocking, is it safe to undervolt and if so by how much? Right now it looks like stock voltage is 1.4v
Any tips and tricks that I can do in the BIOS or registry to allow better performance?
The Thermal Paste seemed overly thick and extremely difficult to spread (took me like 10 minutes to fully spread it over the CPU). I had to use the whole tube and it seemed like JUST enough to cover the CPU with a thin layer. Is this normal or did I get an old batch of paste and should use something different? I'm open to anything.
Thanks everyone in advance for your responses!


----------



## XiCynx

boop, for some reason it isn't showing my response in this thread so I'm replying again to see if it bumps it and doesn't show Tamalero as the last replier.


----------



## Tamalero

XiCynx said:


> Hi all!
> 
> Just finished my Threadripper build and had a few questions as this is my first AMD build since the... Athlon 64 X2 back in 2006.
> 
> Here's my build:
> *Motherboard:* ASRock - X399M
> *CPU:* AMD - Threadripper 1950X
> *CPU Cooler:* Enermax Liqtech TR4 II 240CPU
> *CPU Thermal Paste:* Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> *Memory:* G.Skill - Trident Z RGB 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 (TIMING: 14-14-14-34)
> *Video Card:* Gigabyte - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB AORUaS
> *Storage:* Samsung - 960 EVO 500GB M.2-2280
> *Secondary Storage:* Crucial - MX500 1TB M.2-2280
> *Power Supply:* Silverstone - SFX 800W-LTI
> *Case:* Cerberus 18L Mic​roATX PC C​ase
> 
> 
> 
> What a standard idle tempurature for the 1950 under a 240 rad cooling system? Right now I'm sitting at 63C in the BIOS and I'm not entirely sure if that is correct, seems high...
> I don't plan on overclocking, is it safe to undervolt and if so by how much? Right now it looks like stock voltage is 1.4v
> Any tips and tricks that I can do in the BIOS or registry to allow better performance?
> The Thermal Paste seemed overly thick and extremely difficult to spread (took me like 10 minutes to fully spread it over the CPU). I had to use the whole tube and it seemed like JUST enough to cover the CPU with a thin layer. Is this normal or did I get an old batch of paste and should use something different? I'm open to anything.
> Thanks everyone in advance for your responses!


Download AMD's overclocking program, or something like HWinfo64.
Probably that 63C is actually the tlc temp and not the tdie temp (tlc -27 C), which gets your temps to 36C seem more reasonable.

If the temps really are 63C, then something is either wrong with your enermax (as in not pumping water correctly), is defective (a batch was defective and leaked fluid) or your motherboard isnt telling the enermax to ramp the pump/fans correctly.

Also, it sounds like you used way too much paste..
What kind of paste you used?


----------



## Offler

XiCynx said:


> Hi all!
> 
> Just finished my Threadripper build and had a few questions as this is my first AMD build since the... Athlon 64 X2 back in 2006.
> 
> Here's my build:
> *Motherboard:* ASRock - X399M
> *CPU:* AMD - Threadripper 1950X
> *CPU Cooler:* Enermax Liqtech TR4 II 240CPU
> *CPU Thermal Paste:* Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> *Memory:* G.Skill - Trident Z RGB 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 (TIMING: 14-14-14-34)
> *Video Card:* Gigabyte - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB AORUS
> *Storage:* Samsung - 960 EVO 500GB M.2-2280
> *Secondary Storage:* Crucial - MX500 1TB M.2-2280
> *Power Supply:* Silverstone - SFX 800W-LTI
> *Case:* Cerberus 18L Mic​roATX PC C​ase
> 
> 
> 
> What a standard idle tempurature for the 1950 under a 240 rad cooling system? Right now I'm sitting at 63C in the BIOS and I'm not entirely sure if that is correct, seems high...
> I don't plan on overclocking, is it safe to undervolt and if so by how much? Right now it looks like stock voltage is 1.4v
> Any tips and tricks that I can do in the BIOS or registry to allow better performance?
> The Thermal Paste seemed overly thick and extremely difficult to spread (took me like 10 minutes to fully spread it over the CPU). I had to use the whole tube and it seemed like JUST enough to cover the CPU with a thin layer. Is this normal or did I get an old batch of paste and should use something different? I'm open to anything.
> Thanks everyone in advance for your responses!


Just yesterday i ran stress test of my 1900x, same board, while rest of the build is almost identical..
https://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=227686&d=1540750261
More details are in "Build Log" in my signature.

Keep an eye on that AIO Enermax Liqtech II TR4. This is the best cooler for TR4 platform, however gen1 was having serious trouble. Within 3-12 months it was reaching 60°C on idle, as the coolingplate got covered by gunk.


----------



## XiCynx

Tamalero said:


> Also, it sounds like you used way too much paste..
> What kind of paste you used?


Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut, without the whole 1 gram of paste I don't think I would've been able to cover the CPU with a thin layer... it was too thick to spread any thinner than I did without it "ripping" apart and pulling up from the cpu. I honestly might go home and replace it with the thermal compound that came with the radiator from Enermax as it seems to perform fairly well based on a couple shootouts I looked at.


----------



## XiCynx

Tamalero said:


> Download AMD's overclocking program, or something like HWinfo64.
> Probably that 63C is actually the tlc temp and not the tdie temp (tlc -27 C), which gets your temps to 36C seem more reasonable.


Just booted into windows and it looks like the temps are quite frosty at idle! time for some benchmarks!


----------



## Tamalero

XiCynx said:


> Just booted into windows and it looks like the temps are quite frosty at idle! time for some benchmarks!


just fyi. I've heard that coretemp is not very reliable with Threadripper or Ryzen.


----------



## PriestOfSin

Picked up a Threadripper 1950X, an Asrock X399 Taichi, and a Wraith Ripper at Microcenter over the weekend, gonna give the 2700X to the wife.

So far the wraith ripper seems to do well, haven't had a whole lot of time to play with it though. Looks fantastic, that's for sure.

EDIT: At stock settings, it holds the 1950X at 3.5GHz after three hours of aida64 extreme. Temps are 60C according to Ryzen Master. This is in a Meshify C with 4x 140mm fans, and 1x 120mm fan. Fan speed is kept mostly quiet, so it could feasibly do better for people with a higher noise tolerance than I.

Haven't overclocked yet, but here's the stock score. I was not prepared for how fast cinebench finished, lol


----------



## bigjdubb

Congratulations. I went to Microcenter this weekend to pick up a 1950x and mobo but ended up going home empty handed because they didn't have anything to cool it with.


----------



## Tamalero

bigjdubb said:


> Congratulations. I went to Microcenter this weekend to pick up a 1950x and mobo but ended up going home empty handed because they didn't have anything to cool it with.


You do not have amazon or any online retailer where you can get the cooling systems you need?


----------



## bigjdubb

I do, but it was a spur of the moment thing and not having the cooler was just enough to stop me. I am a little surprised that it is so difficult to get your hands on that wraith ripper cooler. I looked around to try and find it online and couldn't find it in stock anywhere, at least no where with a reasonable price (I'm not going to pay $300 for an air cooler).


----------



## Tamalero

bigjdubb said:


> I do, but it was a spur of the moment thing and not having the cooler was just enough to stop me. I am a little surprised that it is so difficult to get your hands on that wraith ripper cooler. I looked around to try and find it online and couldn't find it in stock anywhere, at least no where with a reasonable price (I'm not going to pay $300 for an air cooler).


I actually found the same difficulty finding the SILVER ARROW for the TR4 as well..

It seems your best bet is the NOCTUA one.


----------



## Undermoose

*All the EK Fans Died!*



Undermoose said:


> Mayhem UV Blue added & run overnight, fluid topped off today, hoses arranged for pictures and she's done! (for now).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot to turn on the memory LEDs
> 
> 
> 
> And with White LEDs
> 
> 
> 
> EK SBAY dual Pump/Reservoir
> EK Fittings
> EK GPU Blocks
> EK Vardar 140ER case fans
> Watercool.de CPU block
> Hardwarelabs Black Ice Nemesis 560 GTR
> Primochill crystal clear tubing.
> 
> Happy New Year everyone!


FYI, all the EK fans started dying over the course of the following year.

Kudo's to EK and Performance-PCs. EK Authorized a complete refund (I believe their fans were recalled) and Performance-PCs gave me a store credit to replace all the fans.

I replaced them all with Corsair ML140 140mm PWM Premium Magnetic Levitation Fans which are working great.


----------



## Causality1978

PRIME X399-A and asus "best" ..IN sleep mode again ... https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/a2o3t1/does_the_agesa_1102_really_make_the_threadripper/

msi have best mobos for X399 also support


----------



## Causality1978

Undermoose said:


> FYI, all the EK fans started dying over the course of the following year.
> 
> Kudo's to EK and Performance-PCs. EK Authorized a complete refund (I believe their fans were recalled) and Performance-PCs gave me a store credit to replace all the fans.
> 
> I replaced them all with Corsair ML140 140mm PWM Premium Magnetic Levitation Fans which are working great.
> 
> using mobile phone to make "nice photos for whole world here" is fail ,. last ones in dark are like puke
> try ask some friend about full frame dslr camera for nice photos


----------



## Tamalero

Hey guys, just got an Enermax Liqtech 360 II.

Just wondering, how tight you think I need to press the heatink/pump ?
I'm not getting exactly amazing temps but its a reduction of 6/10 celsius lower than with my Noctua.

I suspect the enermax fans (like a lot of buyers in newegg) are total ****. and I'm unsure if I should press harder the heatsink pump for better contact.. or replace the fans...


----------



## Offler

Tamalero said:


> Hey guys, just got an Enermax Liqtech 360 II.
> 
> Just wondering, how tight you think I need to press the heatink/pump ?
> I'm not getting exactly amazing temps but its a reduction of 6/10 celsius lower than with my Noctua.
> 
> I suspect the enermax fans (like a lot of buyers in newegg) are total ****. and I'm unsure if I should press harder the heatsink pump for better contact.. or replace the fans...


If possible compare low and max RPM on the fans. If the temps get radically better with high RPM look for fans with good high-pressure.

Also i am not sure... how big is the "jump" between idle and 100%? I would expect it to be much lower when compared to Noctua cooling. Waterblocks dont need the heatpipes on working temperatures.


----------



## glnn_23

Just put together a 1950x in a msi creation and running a few benches


----------



## jepz

glnn_23 said:


> Just put together a 1950x in a msi creation and running a few benches



Amazing results, very good voltage and clock.


----------



## adam3234

glnn_23 said:


> Just put together a 1950x in a msi creation and running a few benches


Nice looking stats. Looks like you've won the silicon lottery with that 1950x. Can you please run AIDA64 set to UMA (memory interleave set to die) then NUMA (memory interleave set to channel) please. I'm curious to know what the memory latency figures look like.


----------



## glnn_23

adam3234 said:


> Nice looking stats. Looks like you've won the silicon lottery with that 1950x. Can you please run AIDA64 set to UMA (memory interleave set to die) then NUMA (memory interleave set to channel) please. I'm curious to know what the memory latency figures look like.


Aida64


----------



## Maxikas

Hi

Recently i've made decision about building new rig. I used Intel since Pentium 4 and s478 platform, so this time i want to try something new - AMD. 
As the prices went down during "black friday" i became owner of Asrock X399 Taichi and Threadripper 1920X. Now it's time for the last piece - memory kit.

I'm hitting Quad Channel and 4x8GB modules. I've read QVL and got some types but i'll be appreciated if you can give me some advice based on real experience.

The HyperX Predator RGB DDR4, 4x8GB, 3600MHz, CL17 (HX436C17PB3AK4/32) caught my attention. They're listed in QVL as Samsung B-Die and tested on 3466 MHz. Not much information about them to find. There is one comment on amazon that they work on 3466 MHz with 2950X but board is unknown.

Other, more classic but slightly expensive option: G.Skill Flare X DDR4, 4x8GB, 3200MHz, CL14 (F4-3200C14Q-32GFX).

What do You think about that ?


----------



## Dotachin

Maxikas said:


> Hi
> 
> Recently i've made decision about building new rig. I used Intel since Pentium 4 and s478 platform, so this time i want to try something new - AMD.
> As the prices went down during "black friday" i became owner of Asrock X399 Taichi and Threadripper 1920X. Now it's time for the last piece - memory kit.
> 
> I'm hitting Quad Channel and 4x8GB modules. I've read QVL and got some types but i'll be appreciated if you can give me some advice based on real experience.
> 
> The HyperX Predator RGB DDR4, 4x8GB, 3600MHz, CL17 (HX436C17PB3AK4/32) caught my attention. They're listed in QVL as Samsung B-Die and tested on 3466 MHz. Not much information about them to find. There is one comment on amazon that they work on 3466 MHz with 2950X but board is unknown.
> 
> Other, more classic but slightly expensive option: G.Skill Flare X DDR4, 4x8GB, 3200MHz, CL14 (F4-3200C14Q-32GFX).
> 
> What do You think about that ?


Congrats on your purchase!
Personally, I would go safe and choose 3200c14, they will overclock just fine to 3600 if that is what you want. Also, you can use this: 
https://benzhaomin.github.io/bdiefinder/

edit your HyperX kit seems not B-die, closest one being HX436C17PB3K4/32 (note no "A" like yours)


----------



## Resistance

I just got my 1950x build together Friday and overall it went smoothly. However, I am a little concerned with temps/cooling. Idle seems fine around low to mid 30C, but at load it's gotten to 67-69C then appears to downclock. This at 100% load doing a Keyshot render and it seems to downclock to about 2500-2700mhz. I've also noticed in Ryzen Master, the default clock is 3325mhz, not 3400mhz, is that normal?

My OC'ed i5 6600k only ever sees around 55C max at 4.2ghz in a Corsair Air 540 and h110 cooler. I realize it's 1/4 the cores, but I'm not used to seeing a cpu with a closed loop water cooler and large radiator hit near 70C. If the temps aren't a problem, I care more the fact that it's downclocking. My old i7 920 OC'ed to 4ghz would hit 75-80C, but I was fine with that since it was on air (Noctua D14) in a hot room, and didn't downclock. 

If I force an OC on the 1950x to maintain clock speed, I'm worried the temps wouldn't be acceptable. 

I'm running:
Asus Prime X399-a mobo
EVGA CLC 280 cpu cooler
Thermaltake View 71 Case (plenty of room for breathing) 
EVGA Supernova G3 850W
EVGA GTX 1070 SC

The temps on the 1070 are the lowest I've ever had on an air cooled card during benchmarks. That impressed me at least, but the case and ambient temp have helped I'm sure.


----------



## RoBiK

Resistance said:


> I just got my 1950x build together Friday and overall it went smoothly. However, I am a little concerned with temps/cooling. Idle seems fine around low to mid 30C, but at load it's gotten to 67-69C then appears to downclock. This at 100% load doing a Keyshot render and it seems to downclock to about 2500-2700mhz. I've also noticed in Ryzen Master, the default clock is 3325mhz, not 3400mhz, is that normal?
> 
> My OC'ed i5 6600k only ever sees around 55C max at 4.2ghz in a Corsair Air 540 and h110 cooler. I realize it's 1/4 the cores, but I'm not used to seeing a cpu with a closed loop water cooler and large radiator hit near 70C. If the temps aren't a problem, I care more the fact that it's downclocking. My old i7 920 OC'ed to 4ghz would hit 75-80C, but I was fine with that since it was on air (Noctua D14) in a hot room, and didn't downclock.
> 
> If I force an OC on the 1950x to maintain clock speed, I'm worried the temps wouldn't be acceptable.
> 
> I'm running:
> Asus Prime X399-a mobo
> EVGA CLC 280 cpu cooler
> Thermaltake View 71 Case (plenty of room for breathing)
> EVGA Supernova G3 850W
> EVGA GTX 1070 SC
> 
> The temps on the 1070 are the lowest I've ever had on an air cooled card during benchmarks. That impressed me at least, but the case and ambient temp have helped I'm sure.


Looking at the backplate of that CPU cooler, it should be immediately obvious that you are not going to get good cooling for a threadripper.


----------



## Resistance

RoBiK said:


> Resistance said:
> 
> 
> 
> I just got my 1950x build together Friday and overall it went smoothly. However, I am a little concerned with temps/cooling. Idle seems fine around low to mid 30C, but at load it's gotten to 67-69C then appears to downclock. This at 100% load doing a Keyshot render and it seems to downclock to about 2500-2700mhz. I've also noticed in Ryzen Master, the default clock is 3325mhz, not 3400mhz, is that normal?
> 
> My OC'ed i5 6600k only ever sees around 55C max at 4.2ghz in a Corsair Air 540 and h110 cooler. I realize it's 1/4 the cores, but I'm not used to seeing a cpu with a closed loop water cooler and large radiator hit near 70C. If the temps aren't a problem, I care more the fact that it's downclocking. My old i7 920 OC'ed to 4ghz would hit 75-80C, but I was fine with that since it was on air (Noctua D14) in a hot room, and didn't downclock.
> 
> If I force an OC on the 1950x to maintain clock speed, I'm worried the temps wouldn't be acceptable.
> 
> I'm running:
> Asus Prime X399-a mobo
> EVGA CLC 280 cpu cooler
> Thermaltake View 71 Case (plenty of room for breathing)
> EVGA Supernova G3 850W
> EVGA GTX 1070 SC
> 
> The temps on the 1070 are the lowest I've ever had on an air cooled card during benchmarks. That impressed me at least, but the case and ambient temp have helped I'm sure.
> 
> 
> 
> Looking at the backplate of that CPU cooler, it should be immediately obvious that you are not going to get good cooling for a threadripper.
Click to expand...

I thought the surface area was quite small for the chip, but it still says "TR4 compatible" if that's actually the issue and the contact surface is not appropriately large enough, they should not be able to spec it as compatible in my opinion. Guess that means an Enermax TR4 360.

Are there any other/better options for TR4 coolers with 100% spreader coverage? Enermax looks good on paper, but user reviews various places suggest lots of QC issues.

After doing more research, it seems options for good TR4 coolers are pretty awful. Wraith Ripper is huge and fans may be oriented incorrectly, the Cooler Master AiO used plastic mounting brackets (***?), Enermax has pump, liquid, and fan issues... It's looking like the best option is a Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 until something better comes out.


----------



## Maxikas

Dotachin said:


> Congrats on your purchase!
> Personally, I would go safe and choose 3200c14, they will overclock just fine to 3600 if that is what you want. Also, you can use this:
> https://benzhaomin.github.io/bdiefinder/
> 
> edit your HyperX kit seems not B-die, closest one being HX436C17PB3K4/32 (note no "A" like yours)


Thanks for link. I did some digging but this is the classic situation when the more i read the less i know  

As for 4 x 8 GB modules, i'll stick to FlareX for now... these are most reliable for me even if they are not listed on QVL.
It's not a rush - i'm still waiting for bykski water block delivery because without it i'm unable to test the whole system - no other cooling solution 
Next thing to do is making a solid D5/res holder. Something tells me that first test-run will be after new year. 



Resistance said:


> After doing more research, it seems options for good TR4 coolers are pretty awful. Wraith Ripper is huge and fans may be oriented incorrectly, the Cooler Master AiO used plastic mounting brackets (***?), Enermax has pump, liquid, and fan issues... It's looking like the best option is a Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 until something better comes out.


Did You saw Dark Rock Pro TR4 ?


----------



## Resistance

I hadn't, that's definitely better looking than the Noctua, but I do prefer AiO liquid coolers when there are decent options. I'm thinking now a big part of my problem may be motherboard header/PWM/BIOS fan/pump control settings. Getting that taken care of should keep me in spec at stock speeds and 100% load, then I'll wait until there's an AiO cooler I'm confident in getting for TR4.


----------



## Tamalero

Resistance said:


> I thought the surface area was quite small for the chip, but it still says "TR4 compatible" if that's actually the issue and the contact surface is not appropriately large enough, they should not be able to spec it as compatible in my opinion. Guess that means an Enermax TR4 360.
> 
> Are there any other/better options for TR4 coolers with 100% spreader coverage? Enermax looks good on paper, but user reviews various places suggest lots of QC issues.
> 
> After doing more research, it seems options for good TR4 coolers are pretty awful. Wraith Ripper is huge and fans may be oriented incorrectly, the Cooler Master AiO used plastic mounting brackets (***?), Enermax has pump, liquid, and fan issues... It's looking like the best option is a Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 until something better comes out.


Theres actually a few more TR4 coolers now.
Including the new overpriced Asus AIO.

As for compatibility.. compatibility != full coverage. It WORKS but is not optimal.
Most blocks and AIOs that are not full TR4 coverage.. usually perform WORSE Than the Noctua air coolers with TR4 full coverage blocks..

Also... supposedly the Liqtech II version of the TR4 series fixes all the corrosion issues they had with the AIO.


----------



## Resistance

Tamalero said:


> Resistance said:
> 
> 
> 
> I thought the surface area was quite small for the chip, but it still says "TR4 compatible" if that's actually the issue and the contact surface is not appropriately large enough, they should not be able to spec it as compatible in my opinion. Guess that means an Enermax TR4 360.
> 
> Are there any other/better options for TR4 coolers with 100% spreader coverage? Enermax looks good on paper, but user reviews various places suggest lots of QC issues.
> 
> After doing more research, it seems options for good TR4 coolers are pretty awful. Wraith Ripper is huge and fans may be oriented incorrectly, the Cooler Master AiO used plastic mounting brackets (***?), Enermax has pump, liquid, and fan issues... It's looking like the best option is a Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 until something better comes out.
> 
> 
> 
> Theres actually a few more TR4 coolers now.
> Including the new overpriced Asus AIO.
> 
> As for compatibility.. compatibility != full coverage. It WORKS but is not optimal.
> Most blocks and AIOs that are not full TR4 coverage.. usually perform WORSE Than the Noctua air coolers with TR4 full coverage blocks..
> 
> Also... supposedly the Liqtech II version of the TR4 series fixes all the corrosion issues they had with the AIO.
Click to expand...

Right, but "not optimal" still shouldn't perform poorly enough you're going to get thermal throttling under load, at least in my opinion. It kind of defeats the purpose of having and using a Threadripper. A few more than a year ago, sure, but the AiO options still do not look anywhere near something I'd purchase. 

Maybe the V2 Liqtech fixes the corrosion issues, but customer reviews still indicate many other issues such as pump failures after very little time, dead fans on arrival, degrading performance after just a few months of ownership, etc. It still looks like a TR4 designed air cooler is the only reliable purchase at the moment. Unfortunately it looks like the Dark Rock Pro TR4 isn't available here in the US either.


----------



## TrixX

TBH the Noctua NH-U14S is as good if not better than most of the AIO's and apparently Enermax were a bit silly and didn't spec theirs to combat Galvanic Corrosion. So in essence avoid the AIO with the best TR4 supporting block...

Oddly a custom loop is not that much more than the Enermax 360 so that's always an option. The Bykski blocks (very cheap) have shown to be very good for cooling, personally I got a Swiftech and it's damn good too.


----------



## Ithanul

TrixX said:


> TBH the Noctua NH-U14S is as good if not better than most of the AIO's and apparently Enermax were a bit silly and didn't spec theirs to combat Galvanic Corrosion. So in essence avoid the AIO with the best TR4 supporting block...
> 
> Oddly a custom loop is not that much more than the Enermax 360 so that's always an option. The Bykski blocks (very cheap) have shown to be very good for cooling, personally I got a Swiftech and it's damn good too.


Yep, the Noctuas I have on my TRs do pretty darn well. Keeps the 1950X happy (still at stock settings - need to get around to fiddling with it). Though, the plan is to switch to the Heatkiller TR4 block I nabbed 2nd hand.


----------



## Dominican

Please Help....

1950X is overloading when streaming with SLOW OR Medium on OBS with dual pc dont get it why lag......


----------



## Resistance

TrixX said:


> TBH the Noctua NH-U14S is as good if not better than most of the AIO's and apparently Enermax were a bit silly and didn't spec theirs to combat Galvanic Corrosion. So in essence avoid the AIO with the best TR4 supporting block...
> 
> Oddly a custom loop is not that much more than the Enermax 360 so that's always an option. The Bykski blocks (very cheap) have shown to be very good for cooling, personally I got a Swiftech and it's damn good too.


Are the Noctua and Wraith Ripper pretty similar performance wise? I'm pretty sure I'm going to go with one or the other until a good AiO is available for TR4. I have no custom loop experience and just getting into it for a rendering/productivity PC isn't a risk I'd really want to take if I made an error.


----------



## Tamalero

Resistance said:


> Right, but "not optimal" still shouldn't perform poorly enough you're going to get thermal throttling under load, at least in my opinion. It kind of defeats the purpose of having and using a Threadripper. A few more than a year ago, sure, but the AiO options still do not look anywhere near something I'd purchase.
> 
> Maybe the V2 Liqtech fixes the corrosion issues, but customer reviews still indicate many other issues such as pump failures after very little time, dead fans on arrival, degrading performance after just a few months of ownership, etc. It still looks like a TR4 designed air cooler is the only reliable purchase at the moment. Unfortunately it looks like the Dark Rock Pro TR4 isn't available here in the US either.


If you overclock they definitively will throttle. They cant handle it. The Noctuas barely can cool down the threadripper 1950X at 4Ghz on temp limits. The non full sized coolers will throttle or freeze earlier.

Just google and you will see plenty of reviews that confirm this.



TrixX said:


> TBH the Noctua NH-U14S is as good if not better than most of the AIO's and apparently Enermax were a bit silly and didn't spec theirs to combat Galvanic Corrosion. So in essence avoid the AIO with the best TR4 supporting block...
> 
> Oddly a custom loop is not that much more than the Enermax 360 so that's always an option. The Bykski blocks (very cheap) have shown to be very good for cooling, personally I got a Swiftech and it's damn good too.



This.. agree on the noctuas.. , also I disagree in prices of waterblocks.

A full Swiftech package (rad, fans, tubing, waterblock for TR4, pump and reservoir) is easily above 300 USD. The TR4 waterblock is 120 USD alone. The reservoir is another 40 to 150 USD depending on the model, the pump is between 40 and 80 USD as well plus taxes.

The Liqtech is 140-170 USD depending on discount (the 360).

But then you have to deal with cutting, setting up, test for leaks..



Resistance said:


> Are the Noctua and Wraith Ripper pretty similar performance wise? I'm pretty sure I'm going to go with one or the other until a good AiO is available for TR4. I have no custom loop experience and just getting into it for a rendering/productivity PC isn't a risk I'd really want to take if I made an error.



Wraith ripper is like 2C-4C better with the single fan on the Noctua. I think the best so far that I know is the Silver Arrow TR4. But they are nowhere to be seen. They sell them in europe and australia but not in north america.


----------



## Tamalero

Dominican said:


> Please Help....
> 
> 1950X is overloading when streaming with SLOW OR Medium on OBS with dual pc dont get it why lag......


Can you expand further? how many ram you have? what are you using to stream? are you on stock speeds? what is your motherboard? what is your settings? What do you mean "dual pc? ?


----------



## miklkit

"Wraith ripper is like 2C-4C better with the single fan on the Noctua. I think the best so far that I know is the Silver Arrow TR4. But they are nowhere to be seen. They sell them in europe and australia but not in north america."


That looks like the same Silver Arrow I've been using for years except for a different mounting system and with one fan removed. It cooled my 5 ghz FX 24/7 for years and is doing fine on my 1700. It's a shame Thermalright got pushed out of North America.


----------



## Tamalero

miklkit said:


> "Wraith ripper is like 2C-4C better with the single fan on the Noctua. I think the best so far that I know is the Silver Arrow TR4. But they are nowhere to be seen. They sell them in europe and australia but not in north america."
> 
> 
> That looks like the same Silver Arrow I've been using for years except for a different mounting system and with one fan removed. It cooled my 5 ghz FX 24/7 for years and is doing fine on my 1700. It's a shame Thermalright got pushed out of North America.


if I remember correctly, it had additional heatpipes. Like the prototype new Noctua for the 2990WX, which is an enlarged 14HS TR4.


----------



## miklkit

Nope. Eight heat pipes, offset heat sink, the same fin design. The only difference is the base and one less fan.


----------



## Tamalero

miklkit said:


> Nope. Eight heat pipes, offset heat sink, the same fin design. The only difference is the base and one less fan.


Wow, those rumors about it having more heatsinks are a lie then. Also I wonder.. why one fan less?

I remember it has a 3000RPM fan. are the older ones slower RPM?


----------



## miklkit

If I remember correctly these fans are TY143. If plugged into the motherboard they might hit 2400rpm but when powered from the psu they go over 2500rpm and move a lot of air. In fact I get better air flow through the case by removing the rear case exhaust fan and cutting a big hole there as that rear fan is just a bottleneck and blocks air flow. The only fans I've used that can compare to them are the Silverstone FHP141, but it is thicker so has limited utility.


----------



## Jspinks020

Nothing real crazy man..some arctic fans I like nice and quiet..and would like some more led fans. and yeah should get some die for the loop. should make rgb die lol


----------



## Tamalero

Welp.. pasted my Liqtech 360 II TR4 with kryonaut..
And nope, temps are still the same if not worse.
Noticed that only the first fan area of my block gets hot. This crap came defective and clogged I guess.
The tubes also gets VERY HOT. While the rest of the radiator is cold.

Good thing newegg has good RMA policy.
After the nightmares of Enermax asking you to fork the money for each shipping.. It isnt amusing.


----------



## Offler

Tamalero said:


> Welp.. pasted my Liqtech 360 II TR4 with kryonaut..
> And nope, temps are still the same if not worse.
> Noticed that only the first fan area of my block gets hot. This crap came defective and clogged I guess.
> The tubes also gets VERY HOT. While the rest of the radiator is cold.
> 
> Good thing newegg has good RMA policy.
> After the nightmares of Enermax asking you to fork the money for each shipping.. It isnt amusing.


When it comes to TR4, it seems that people who compared air cooling by Noctua and watercooling by literally anyone were not much impressed by the water.


----------



## Jspinks020

Offler said:


> When it comes to TR4, it seems that people who compared air cooling by Noctua and watercooling by literally anyone were not much impressed by the water.


Well they made some Decent and Nice Blocks for it at least.


----------



## betam4x

adam3234 said:


> @betam4x that's a really neat utility although I don't have a need for it, Lately I've OCed my 1950x to 4 Ghz and I'm quite happy with it...unless I'm running virtual machines. The guest machines get 133 cb points and the hoest machine gets 166 cb point on single thread runs. That's a difference of about 20% which is a lot more than the 5% percent performance loss the guest machines have running on intel chips. Kvm is poorly optimised for Threadripper and I it can't pass threads (for Threadripper) to the guests, only cpus.
> 
> If you have lots of money that you can't find a better use for than got for it otherwise that's a lots of money for very little performance improvement over the 1950x and the MSI Meg x399 Creation is really only needed for over clocking the WX series Threadrippers.


It doesn't work anyway, I was never able to make it work for more than an hour. After that it would throttle to 550 MHz for no reason. I even measured (manually) thermals and power limits.

What people don't know about the MSI Meg is it's actually just an x399 carbon with a new design. The carbon was actually the most powerful board of the bunch.


----------



## betam4x

OrionBG said:


> Hey guys,
> I have an issue which is kinda off-topic kinda related...
> I was trying to flash my phone today with fastboot (Android phone) and the stupid thing would not flash anything properly...
> Either the command will just hang indefinitely or I'll get some random errors.
> It appears that the issue is with USB 3.0 controllers... Unfortunately my MB, the AsRock X399 Taichi does not have any USB 2.0 ports on the back, only 3.0 and 3.1
> I'm using the latest Android support tools so latest versions of ADB and Fastboot, all MB drivers are updated (unfortunately there are no separate drivers for USB 3.0 and Win10 is using the Microsoft ones).
> Phone's bootloader is unlocked and I've flashed it many times before on an older system at work (Intel based with USB 2.0 ports). I've tested different cables and ports...
> I've been doing such thing for years and supposedly I know what I'm doing...
> Have any of you had a similar issue and were you able to resolve it?


Did you try using a USB 1.1 hub? I've used that to overcome compatibility issues. Also, this is the Threadripper 1xxx owners club. IMHO anything goes.


----------



## betam4x

Offler said:


> When it comes to TR4, it seems that people who compared air cooling by Noctua and watercooling by literally anyone were not much impressed by the water.


I have both, the TR4v2 and the Noctua. The TR4v2 is quieter and gets around 15 degree lower temps. This is especially apparent when overclocking. However, at stock, the TR4v2 is damn near silent. The only thing I hear from my machine is my power supply fan. Of course I have a great quality case that not only filters air, but has side/bottom vents instead of an open top vent in the front. The left side is glass and the rest is steal. It also has a basement and other features to keep the noise down. There are no top vents. My rad is mounted in the front and my temps at stock range from 27-38 degrees dependent on ambient air. 

Also for the record, the TR4v2 is still working just fine for me. Not like the last version. Enermax did me right by sending a new, updated model, including the headphones, and an apology letter as well. That's the way ALL companies should treat their customers.

Finally, I like the RGB enermax logo. I do not recall if there is a way to control it, I BELIEVE it came with a controller unit, but I don't use it. It defaults to a rainbow style change of color.

EDIT: I should add I tried adding a second Noctua fan or the same type along with replacing them both with noctua industria 3k rpm fans. Couldn't get any better performance from the noctua. Regarding the enermax fans, I never had any issues with those, so I can't speak to that. I am using the ones that came with the v2, but I have the v1 fans as backup along with about 50 other PC fans (no joke, I have a tote full of PC fans from both over the years and from build tweaks recently.)

Edit #2: I do not work for Noctua, and I was one of those pissed off customers who's v1 went bad. I took it apart and the buildup was terrible. I have not taken the v2 apart. Haven't had the need and I don't have the money right now as I'm going on disability as septic shock has destroyed my life and ability to work. Luckily I have private disability though, so I will be able to afford the 7nm Threadripper 16 core when it comes out.


----------



## Tamalero

Offler said:


> When it comes to TR4, it seems that people who compared air cooling by Noctua and watercooling by literally anyone were not much impressed by the water.


Every review I've seen says the Liqtech 360 had a difference of at least 5 C better than the Noctua.

But yeah, my Rad is damaged.. heat was not spreading correctly and both in and out tubes were hot. Which means the liquid was not flowing..

Changed back to my noctua with the new Kryonaut paste.. my temps went down by 2C.. Just by paste alone.

I wonder if I change to the 3000 RPM industrial Noctua fans would drop my temps even further. 
I will probably buy when I get my money back from Newegg.


As for the "not impressed". Noctua always sets the bar, both in cooling and silence.
the TR4 series are truly impressive. Only bested by newer way beefier cooling solutions (like the AMD's own version for threadripper, and the Silver Arrow for TR)



betam4x said:


> I have both, the TR4v2 and the Noctua. The TR4v2 is quieter and gets around 15 degree lower temps. This is especially apparent when overclocking. However, at stock, the TR4v2 is damn near silent. The only thing I hear from my machine is my power supply fan. Of course I have a great quality case that not only filters air, but has side/bottom vents instead of an open top vent in the front. The left side is glass and the rest is steal. It also has a basement and other features to keep the noise down. There are no top vents. My rad is mounted in the front and my temps at stock range from 27-38 degrees dependent on ambient air.
> 
> Also for the record, the TR4v2 is still working just fine for me. Not like the last version. Enermax did me right by sending a new, updated model, including the headphones, and an apology letter as well. That's the way ALL companies should treat their customers.
> 
> Finally, I like the RGB enermax logo. I do not recall if there is a way to control it, I BELIEVE it came with a controller unit, but I don't use it. It defaults to a rainbow style change of color.
> 
> EDIT: I should add I tried adding a second Noctua fan or the same type along with replacing them both with noctua industria 3k rpm fans. Couldn't get any better performance from the noctua. Regarding the enermax fans, I never had any issues with those, so I can't speak to that. I am using the ones that came with the v2, but I have the v1 fans as backup along with about 50 other PC fans (no joke, I have a tote full of PC fans from both over the years and from build tweaks recently.)
> 
> Edit #2: I do not work for Noctua, and I was one of those pissed off customers who's v1 went bad. I took it apart and the buildup was terrible. I have not taken the v2 apart. Haven't had the need and I don't have the money right now as I'm going on disability as septic shock has destroyed my life and ability to work. Luckily I have private disability though, so I will be able to afford the 7nm Threadripper 16 core when it comes out.



Enermax seems to have still problems in product quality. I presume because Enermax does NOT make their AIOs. They paid a third party company to design and use.
The fans are the most problematic part of the new LIQTECH II.
See amazon and newegg and everyone complaining about those ultra cheap and loud fans that end breaking in the first weeks or months.


----------



## Offler

betam4x said:


> I have both, the TR4v2 and the Noctua. The TR4v2 is quieter and gets around 15 degree lower temps. This is especially apparent when overclocking. However, at stock, the TR4v2 is damn near silent. The only thing I hear from my machine is my power supply fan. Of course I have a great quality case that not only filters air, but has side/bottom vents instead of an open top vent in the front. The left side is glass and the rest is steal. It also has a basement and other features to keep the noise down. There are no top vents. My rad is mounted in the front and my temps at stock range from 27-38 degrees dependent on ambient air.
> 
> Also for the record, the TR4v2 is still working just fine for me. Not like the last version. Enermax did me right by sending a new, updated model, including the headphones, and an apology letter as well. That's the way ALL companies should treat their customers.
> 
> Finally, I like the RGB enermax logo. I do not recall if there is a way to control it, I BELIEVE it came with a controller unit, but I don't use it. It defaults to a rainbow style change of color.
> 
> EDIT: I should add I tried adding a second Noctua fan or the same type along with replacing them both with noctua industria 3k rpm fans. Couldn't get any better performance from the noctua. Regarding the enermax fans, I never had any issues with those, so I can't speak to that. I am using the ones that came with the v2, but I have the v1 fans as backup along with about 50 other PC fans (no joke, I have a tote full of PC fans from both over the years and from build tweaks recently.)
> 
> Edit #2: I do not work for Noctua, and I was one of those pissed off customers who's v1 went bad. I took it apart and the buildup was terrible. I have not taken the v2 apart. Haven't had the need and I don't have the money right now as I'm going on disability as septic shock has destroyed my life and ability to work. Luckily I have private disability though, so I will be able to afford the 7nm Threadripper 16 core when it comes out.





Tamalero said:


> Every review I've seen says the Liqtech 360 had a difference of at least 5 C better than the Noctua.
> 
> But yeah, my Rad is damaged.. heat was not spreading correctly and both in and out tubes were hot. Which means the liquid was not flowing..
> 
> Changed back to my noctua with the new Kryonaut paste.. my temps went down by 2C.. Just by paste alone.
> 
> I wonder if I change to the 3000 RPM industrial Noctua fans would drop my temps even further.
> I will probably buy when I get my money back from Newegg.
> 
> 
> As for the "not impressed". Noctua always sets the bar, both in cooling and silence.
> the TR4 series are truly impressive. Only bested by newer way beefier cooling solutions (like the AMD's own version for threadripper, and the Silver Arrow for TR)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enermax seems to have still problems in product quality. I presume because Enermax does NOT make their AIOs. They paid a third party company to design and use.
> The fans are the most problematic part of the new LIQTECH II.
> See amazon and newegg and everyone complaining about those ultra cheap and loud fans that end breaking in the first weeks or months.



The block on Enermax Liqtech is the best one (among other AIOs), and using better thermalpaste will be cumulative to it.They should go full copper in my opinion, but the radiator would be extremeny expensive in that case. Using proper coolant (lets say glycol based, and not water) will solve the problem.

Just two days ago I have seen what can a single Noctua (the one designed for CPU coolers) do with Vega 64 Liquid (push-pull config). GPU under stress went from 45 to 50 and that was it. Graph was then flat.

Using same fans in sandwich on CPU rad (i would say that 240 or 280 would be sufficient) at 800 rpm would have similar impact.

Noctua coolers benefit from large bottom plate same as Enermax, but also they can (and they do) place the coolers in the most convenient direction of aiflow - from front to back.


----------



## Resistance

My CM Wraith Ripper came in the mail today. Install was fairly easy and it cleared my RAM and other component, but there's not much room between the cooler and my GPU, especially since they routed the cables on the underside of the cooler. The hardest part was just getting it situation on the screw threads of the motherboard since it's so large it obstructs a lot of your view.

Overall, it is cooling much better than the EVGA CLC 280 on my 1950X, however in prolonged loads of 100% doing rendering in Keyshot, it will still hit 67-68C. It did a much better job regarding downclocking though, it hit 68C and downclocked to 3000-3200mhz briefly, stabilized then was able to maintain 67C and not downclock. That's still cutting it was closer than I'd like (these are the temps from HW Monitor, so I believe the actual die temps might be ~95C?).

I did notice, and reviews on Newegg mentioned the same thing, the fan in the Wraith Ripper seems oriented incorrectly. It's moving air out the ride side of the heat sink. I'm wondering how much better it may cool if it move it out to the left. My side in intake on the right (front) and exhaust on the left (rear) as are the most common setups. I'm not sure if this was a QC flaw, or by design or what. If I can take the shroud off to get to the fan and re-orient it, I may. I'd prefer to do so without taking the cooler back out, but that may not be possible. I was also debating zip-tying an addition fan or two on the left and right of it if I can.


----------



## ssateneth

Resistance said:


> My CM Wraith Ripper came in the mail today. Install was fairly easy and it cleared my RAM and other component, but there's not much room between the cooler and my GPU, especially since they routed the cables on the underside of the cooler. The hardest part was just getting it situation on the screw threads of the motherboard since it's so large it obstructs a lot of your view.
> 
> Overall, it is cooling much better than the EVGA CLC 280 on my 1950X, however in prolonged loads of 100% doing rendering in Keyshot, it will still hit 67-68C. It did a much better job regarding downclocking though, it hit 68C and downclocked to 3000-3200mhz briefly, stabilized then was able to maintain 67C and not downclock. That's still cutting it was closer than I'd like (these are the temps from HW Monitor, so I believe the actual die temps might be ~95C?).
> 
> I did notice, and reviews on Newegg mentioned the same thing, the fan in the Wraith Ripper seems oriented incorrectly. It's moving air out the ride side of the heat sink. I'm wondering how much better it may cool if it move it out to the left. My side in intake on the right (front) and exhaust on the left (rear) as are the most common setups. I'm not sure if this was a QC flaw, or by design or what. If I can take the shroud off to get to the fan and re-orient it, I may. I'd prefer to do so without taking the cooler back out, but that may not be possible. I was also debating zip-tying an addition fan or two on the left and right of it if I can.


No. Die temperature = die temperature. Your die is actually 67-68C. The 95C you are thinking is fake. It's just some artificial number put in by AMD to make more aggressive fan curve.


----------



## Resistance

ssateneth said:


> No. Die temperature = die temperature. Your die is actually 67-68C. The 95C you are thinking is fake. It's just some artificial number put in by AMD to make more aggressive fan curve.


Gotcha, though I believe the 95C is supposed to be a Delta ambient temp. Die temp + an arbitrary room temperature. Having a fake, artificial number to control that doesn't really make sense. The BIOS of the motherboard, and/or AMD's Ryzen Master software can easily be set up for a fan curve for the die temp itself, there's no reason they'd have to "fake" that number for a fan curve, especially when they have their own dedicated chipset platform for Threadripper vs Ryzen with different temp thresholds.


----------



## ssateneth

Resistance said:


> Gotcha, though I believe the 95C is supposed to be a Delta ambient temp. Die temp + an arbitrary room temperature. Having a fake, artificial number to control that doesn't really make sense. The BIOS of the motherboard, and/or AMD's Ryzen Master software can easily be set up for a fan curve for the die temp itself, there's no reason they'd have to "fake" that number for a fan curve, especially when they have their own dedicated chipset platform for Threadripper vs Ryzen with different temp thresholds.


that doesnt make sense, because ryzen am4 chips with X suffix have +17C offset vs +27c for threadripper. pretty sure non-x chips dont have that offset. so im expected to run a threadripper system in an 81F degree room and ryzen X chip in a 63F room? and non-X chips in a freezing room? wutttttt


----------



## Resistance

ssateneth said:


> that doesnt make sense, because ryzen am4 chips with X suffix have +17C offset vs +27c for threadripper. pretty sure non-x chips dont have that offset. so im expected to run a threadripper system in an 81F degree room and ryzen X chip in a 63F room? and non-X chips in a freezing room? wutttttt


Makes as much sense as faking a number for a fan curve when there's no reason to. That'd honestly take more effort than just configuring it for the actual die temp.


----------



## ckoons1

any one ever replace a threadripper processor with the motherboard in the case vertically?

thank you


----------



## glnn_23

Pushing the 1950x a little more here


----------



## TrixX

That's some serious voltage there, just wondering what people are considering safe voltage for TR these days? I'm still going off 1.35v as max target...


----------



## jepz

glnn_23 said:


> Pushing the 1950x a little more here



I envy you, this MEG board seems to be amazing, you also have an awesome processor and probably Samsung B-Die memory chips.


----------



## Maxikas

Just before Christmas i finally received Bykski CPU block. For testing purpose i made CPU only custom cooling setup and put together all the parts. 
First observations... it boots a while... i've loaded bios and... unpleasant surprise with RAM.

It seems that 1 of 4x8GB RAM (32GB FlareX F4-3200C14Q-32GFX) module is broken - it's not being seen. Tried to switch this module with another to exclude mainboard or CPU issue and wherever i'm putting it, it still doesn't work. :thumbsdow

EDIT:
Did some more tests and only with that suspicious module plugged in, MB shows error code "16" and not booting up.
Things just can't be to easy...


----------



## Tamalero

Maxikas said:


> Just before Christmas i finally received Bykski CPU block. For testing purpose i made CPU only custom cooling setup and put together all the parts.
> First observations... it boots a while... i've loaded bios and... unpleasant surprise with RAM.
> 
> It seems that 1 of 4x8GB RAM (32GB FlareX F4-3200C14Q-32GFX) module is broken - it's not being seen. Tried to switch this module with another to exclude mainboard or CPU issue and wherever i'm putting it, it still doesn't work. :thumbsdow
> 
> EDIT:
> Did some more tests and only with that suspicious module plugged in, MB shows error code "16" and not booting up.
> Things just can't be to easy...


Def something is wrong with the memory.

the Error 16 always was there when my cpu refused to accept my timings and or ocnfig.


----------



## Maxikas

Tomorrow i'll try to RMA them. It has not been more than a week since the purchase so maybe they can be replaced immediately by shop - without sending to manufacturer. 
If not... Christmas time and end of the year... RMA will take at least a month. :thumbsdow

After ~15min prime95 In-Place Large FFTs test: 
23 *C ambient temp.
63 *C CPU temp. (taken from Ryzen Master) 
~270W pulled from the wall (with Nvidia 9600GT used for test bench)

AIDA64: stock setting test with 3 modules and working XMP.


----------



## betam4x

TrixX said:


> That's some serious voltage there, just wondering what people are considering safe voltage for TR these days? I'm still going off 1.35v as max target...


I believe either AMD or some other vendor mentioned that anything below 1.45V will not impact the performance of your chip. I've had my chip up to 1.7V without frying it. That doesn't mean you should do so. 1.45-1.5V will likely cause degradation over time, but likely years, not weeks or months. There was a guy on reddit a while back who posted his 'overclock' and didn't realize that higher voltages can kill a chip. He had a Ryzen 1700 running at 1.512V (or at least that is what CPU-Z validated with) for several months and it did not degrade. Ryzen is still a young platform, so who knows what the max safe voltage is? To this day my 2600k hits a solid 5 GHz at close to 1.4V under load. It passes prime95 easily without the AiO even breaking a sweat.


----------



## betam4x

jepz said:


> I envy you, this MEG board seems to be amazing, you also have an awesome processor and probably Samsung B-Die memory chips.


The original x399 carbon is more than capable of this as well. It is my opinion without doing much research that the MEG is simply a rebranded x399 carbon with different looks. The carbon had a beefy 10 phase VRM setup.


----------



## betam4x

TrixX said:


> That's some serious voltage there, just wondering what people are considering safe voltage for TR these days? I'm still going off 1.35v as max target...


Depends on LLC. If you are aggressive with LLC, lower the voltage slightly. The trick is to find the right balance. On my MSI board I ran 1.45V @ LLC3, which kept voltages around 1.45V. This allowed me to maintain a 4.2 GHz overclock. Pushing it to 1.475-1.5 would probably lead to long term degradation, but if you only needed your chip to last a year and had the money to upgrade, it's probably not worth worrying about. I've had this chip up to 1.6V, and people claimed I had a golden chip because I could push 4.45GHz, however, for fun I tried another 1950X and wouldn't you know it? Same clockspeed, slightly better voltages (1.55V). I've had my chip as high as 1.7V for over a week in the past, and no degradation. This chip can do 1.225V on an MSI board at 4.0 GHz, but it can't even maintain a stable 4.0 at 1.4 GHz on an ASUS. No wonder the haters are hating. I was able to try the chip again recently on an x399 carbon, and still 1.225 passing prime95. Pop it in the ASUS and no go. I can only imagine what the MEG can do with this chip. Set an LLC of 3, back the voltage down to 1.175, up the clocks to 4.0, and lets see what happens. However, I'm waiting on 7nm :/. I WILL try to fry my 1950X with whatever comes out then though. I may even do a livestream or something. I just need to install a capture card in my other PC.

EDIT: A lot of people focus on voltage, very few people focus on wattage. I'm not going to say much more on THAT subject, but think about it for a bit. Especially all you electrical engineer wannabes.


----------



## TrixX

betam4x said:


> I believe either AMD or some other vendor mentioned that anything below 1.45V will not impact the performance of your chip. I've had my chip up to 1.7V without frying it. That doesn't mean you should do so. 1.45-1.5V will likely cause degradation over time, but likely years, not weeks or months. There was a guy on reddit a while back who posted his 'overclock' and didn't realize that higher voltages can kill a chip. He had a Ryzen 1700 running at 1.512V (or at least that is what CPU-Z validated with) for several months and it did not degrade. Ryzen is still a young platform, so who knows what the max safe voltage is? To this day my 2600k hits a solid 5 GHz at close to 1.4V under load. It passes prime95 easily without the AiO even breaking a sweat.


Good to know. My cooling needs a bit of work as it doesn't like much above 1.32v currently. Need to have more rad space as currently not enough, well not enough for Vega64 and ThreadRipper in high Ambient Temps...


----------



## bbowseroctacore

recently purchased ze and 1950x - steep learning curve - pretty stoked with my first bash at it - hopefully more to come - oh and checkout the voltage glitch....


----------



## betam4x

I might be noticing some temperature creep on my Enermax 360 TR4 II. Not sure as of yet. First, a fan somehow became unplugged, second, I'm running process lasso and coreprio. Process lasso adds a new performance profile that actually boosts performance by a small amount. Finally, I haven't cleaned out the radiator in a while, so once I have a chance to test with a clean radiator and those tools disabled I will let you know for sure.

Edit #1: Something is definitely up. Overclocked to 4.0 GHz and starting prime95 instantly resulted in a temp spike. CPU is now hovering at 60 degrees idle.
Edit #2: Loaded optimized defaults, CPU average idle temp (TDIE) is 53.9C

Final Edit: False Alarm. Apparently the top fan had been unplugged for quite a while and I didn't notice. The dust filter was caked with dust so the bottom 2 fans couldn't breathe. The dust also was caked to the bottom part of the rad. Average temps are now back in the 30s.


----------



## Resistance

I ended up getting a Cooler Master Wraith Ripper for my 1950x. In stock form, it still hit 68C though it took longer and didn't throttle as much compared to the CLC 280.

The fan in the Wraith Ripper is oriented incorrectly, airflow going from rear to front instead of how 99% of case air flow is. What brilliant engineers decided on that, I have no idea. Go on Newegg and many reviews echo this. You either need back to front airflow in your case, or be willing to take it apart and reorient the fan. 

I opted for the latter and took it apart. I also bought 3x BeQuiet! PMW RGB 120mm fans, zip-tied one to the front of the Wraith Ripper for a 2nd fan and put the other two on the top of my case as additional exhausts. Also applied MX-4 thermal compound after cleaning the stock application off. 

Now my 1950x hits a max of 58C at 100% load and settles at 56C after fans adjust. I'm pretty damn happy with that on air. I might not even go liquid even if/when a real quality cooler does come out at this point, but the Enermax and CM liquid options don't look to be quality from what I've read.


----------



## MacMus

bbowseroctacore said:


> recently purchased ze and 1950x - steep learning curve - pretty stoked with my first bash at it - hopefully more to come - oh and checkout the voltage glitch....


2V ? :O

That's too much normally 1.35 should be sufficient for 4Ghz


----------



## speed_demon

Just passing through to say I am jealous of all the cores you guys get to work with. 

Man if I hadn't just bought a ryzen myself... 

But the 1950x is super affordable these days...


----------



## MacMus

speed_demon said:


> Just passing through to say I am jealous of all the cores you guys get to work with.
> 
> Man if I hadn't just bought a ryzen myself...
> 
> But the 1950x is super affordable these days...


You could snatch one <400 bucks on Black Friday promos last year. That's just insane bargain.


----------



## strap624

So I have the possibility of getting a 1950x and a asrock x399 fatality mobo for $600... I don't even need a 16 core CPU but it sounds fun. Should I go for it? I would be upgrading the rig in my Sig.


----------



## speed_demon

Oh wow I would jump on that in a heartbeat if I were you.


----------



## strap624

I don't even know what I would do with it, I wanted a 2700x but this is just a tad more so it seems great. I don't know much about threadripper though. Would I need 4 sticks of ram?


----------



## speed_demon

Works great with two or even just one stick.


----------



## strap624

I have the CLC 280 cooler, would it be sufficient for now?


----------



## speed_demon

CLC 280 looks like it would work quite nicely.


----------



## strap624

Well I'm not sure on memory for the 1950x, It seems alot of the 3000/3200/3400 memory kits listed on the QVL are unavailable or discontinued. I found a few kits on the QVL that were upwards of $400-550 for a kit. I know that it needs a quad channel kit but I've seen many people say a dual channel kit is fine, even the dual channel kits listed on the QVL are hard to find.

I'm kind of getting cold feet on moving to a x399 platform, I wasn't counting on $400 worth of memory. Does the high speed stuff matter or are kits under 3000mhz just fine, does the quad channel even matter?


----------



## mistershan

Hey guys I can get the 1950x for pretty cheap now at micro center. Is it worth it or should I wait for gen 3? Also how much better would this chip be than my i7 5820k? I game but also am a pro editor using the Adobe CC suite and DaVinci Resolve. 

https://www.microcenter.com/product...pper-1950x-34-ghz-16-core-tr4-boxed-processor


----------



## betam4x

Either the Enermax or this board is on the fritz, clock speeds and temps while doing a handbrake run:


















EDIT: This is at maximum fan settings. I even tried opening the case up for additional ventilation. Pump feels warm. Might reinstall my noctua later.

EDIT #2: Success! Installed the noctua, temps dropped a considerable amount, causing much higher clock speeds. I might try re-applying thermal paste down the road and reinstalling the enermax. You could actually read the 'Ryzen' logo. Much of the thermal paste worked it's way out towards the edges, giving very little coverage for the dies. I'm averaging 3.5-3.6 GHz encoding now, with maximums of 3.7 GHz.


----------



## Quadrixx

*65C° idle temp with TR 1950X ( cooled by enermax liqtech 360 TR4 II )*

Hi !

i could use some advice here :

my TR 1950X is sitting in my Aorus 399X extreme mainboard and idling at 65 C° and higher
it is cooled by an enermax liqtech 360 TR4 II ( should be more then enough i'd think )

my memory kit is a 4 x 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 2666
supported by an RTX 2080 Aorus Extreme

my mainboard is stuffed with 3 x M.2 SSD Samsung 970 EVO

i'm running the cpu at default settings , not overclocking yet !

i am getting extreme bad results in Cinebench , going as low as 500 and 600 cb in multithreading ( while temp of 65C° is not really rising during these tests )
if i check Core Temp 1.13 , my multiplier is dropping as low as 10 ( instead of 37 ) during these tests ???


----------



## jepz

Quadrixx said:


> Hi !
> 
> i could use some advice here :
> 
> my TR 1950X is sitting in my Aorus 399X extreme mainboard and idling at 65 C° and higher
> it is cooled by an enermax liqtech 360 TR4 II ( should be more then enough i'd think )
> 
> my memory kit is a 4 x 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 2666
> supported by an RTX 2080 Aorus Extreme
> 
> my mainboard is stuffed with 3 x M.2 SSD Samsung 970 EVO
> 
> i'm running the cpu at default settings , not overclocking yet !
> 
> i am getting extreme bad results in Cinebench , going as low as 500 and 600 cb in multithreading ( while temp of 65C° is not really rising during these tests )
> if i check Core Temp 1.13 , my multiplier is dropping as low as 10 ( instead of 37 ) during these tests ???


Check the cooler installation or your Enermax is a bad unit, generally the pump is dead and you need to call RMA, this CPU idle temps sits around 30-40ºC, your 1950x is throttling hard because of the high temps, be aware!


----------



## jepz

mistershan said:


> Hey guys I can get the 1950x for pretty cheap now at micro center. Is it worth it or should I wait for gen 3? Also how much better would this chip be than my i7 5820k? I game but also am a pro editor using the Adobe CC suite and DaVinci Resolve.
> 
> https://www.microcenter.com/product...pper-1950x-34-ghz-16-core-tr4-boxed-processor



If you can wait 6 months for 3rd gen Ryzen, I would wait.

It also depends in how much you will spend on the 1st gen TR4 combo.


----------



## jepz

strap624 said:


> Well I'm not sure on memory for the 1950x, It seems alot of the 3000/3200/3400 memory kits listed on the QVL are unavailable or discontinued. I found a few kits on the QVL that were upwards of $400-550 for a kit. I know that it needs a quad channel kit but I've seen many people say a dual channel kit is fine, even the dual channel kits listed on the QVL are hard to find.
> 
> I'm kind of getting cold feet on moving to a x399 platform, I wasn't counting on $400 worth of memory. Does the high speed stuff matter or are kits under 3000mhz just fine, does the quad channel even matter?



Quad Channel is pratically mandatory to get good performance with Threadripper, get dual channel and you'll get crappy performance.

A 3200MHz kit w/ low latency (usually samsung b-die memory chip - CAS 14) is also a must have if you want performance, 3600MHz is generally the max overclocking speed for TR4 1st gen DDR4 mems.

I went from DDR4 [email protected] to DDR4 [email protected] in TR4 and there is a world of improvement in performance.


----------



## Resistance

jepz said:


> mistershan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey guys I can get the 1950x for pretty cheap now at micro center. Is it worth it or should I wait for gen 3? Also how much better would this chip be than my i7 5820k? I game but also am a pro editor using the Adobe CC suite and DaVinci Resolve.
> 
> https://www.microcenter.com/product...pper-1950x-34-ghz-16-core-tr4-boxed-processor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you can wait 6 months for 3rd gen Ryzen, I would wait.
> 
> It also depends in how much you will spend on the 1st gen TR4 combo.
Click to expand...

This. 3rd gen Ryzen will have 2 different 16 cores CPUs, both at higher clocks than the 1950x. Had I known, I may have waited. 

As for the question above regarding a CLC 280, it will work, but it will throttle at 100% load and hit about 68C maintaining around 2600mhz. 

If you're planning to use it for sustained workloads of 70% load or higher, a true TR4 cooler with 100% IHS coverage is highly advisable. 

Also, if you're not going to be using it where you'll really see an advantage in multicore CPU intensive tasks, it is a bit pointless.


----------



## pastor

*1950X cooling advice in a micro ATX case*

Hello guys,

I'm an a Threadripper owner since 1 month , I replaced my dead Asus X99-M WS and I7 6950x with an Asrock x399M-TR4 Taichi and a Threadripper 1950x so I used all the "old" parts I had for the new workstation
including 

G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 cl 16 (working @ XMP) 
Phantek evolv enthoo micro atx case 
Corsair H115i pro RGB (with a special bracket) cooler

but I'm facing cooling issue. I'm a bit disapointed with my results, I cannot really overclock :/
and unfortunatly I feel this workstation a bit slow for reactivness (single core performance), for the 3D renderings I admit it rocks !!!
I planned to get a TR4 socket and a 1950x first and upgrade as soon as Threadripper Zen2 will be available ( in a 24-32-48 cores flavor depending of the single core performance) and I will upgrade my cooler at this time

My temperatures and overclocks result are following (I didn't do so much tries) when rendering with 3dsmax VRAY ( 23°C ambiant temperature )

3.40 Ghz tension 1.125v 67.50°C max
3.73 Ghz tension 1.18 v 78°C max
3.83 Ghz tension 1.25 v 87°c max

I tried With and without Turbo but I didn't change the results so much
I checked the thermal paste and I saw nothing wrong

I didn't monitor with other softwares or benchmarks (which could give lower temperature results because Vray is using AVX I think witch is power intensive) but it's what count with my utilisation

So you can see I get extremely high temperatures considering Tmax is 91°C 

I don't know if you can confirm me there is something wrong ?

My guess is that my cooler waterblock is not fit for the job (too small for this huge heatspeader), my ambiant temperature and probably a bad batch of the CPU are giving those results

In any way, could you give me advices for an efficient cooler that fit in my Micro ATX case (could be a custom noctua with 120mm fans for instance ?


----------



## ssateneth

pastor said:


> Hello guys,
> 
> I'm an a Threadripper owner since 1 month , I replaced my dead Asus X99-M WS and I7 6950x with an Asrock x399M-TR4 Taichi and a Threadripper 1950x so I used all the "old" parts I had for the new workstation
> including
> 
> G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 cl 16 (working @ XMP)
> Phantek evolv enthoo micro atx case
> Corsair H115i pro RGB (with a special bracket) cooler
> 
> but I'm facing cooling issue. I'm a bit disapointed with my results, I cannot really overclock :/
> and unfortunatly I feel this workstation a bit slow for reactivness (single core performance), for the 3D renderings I admit it rocks !!!
> I planned to get a TR4 socket and a 1950x first and upgrade as soon as Threadripper Zen2 will be available ( in a 24-32-48 cores flavor depending of the single core performance) and I will upgrade my cooler at this time
> 
> My temperatures and overclocks result are following (I didn't do so much tries) when rendering with 3dsmax VRAY ( 23°C ambiant temperature )
> 
> 3.40 Ghz tension 1.125v 67.50°C max
> 3.73 Ghz tension 1.18 v 78°C max
> 3.83 Ghz tension 1.25 v 87°c max
> 
> I tried With and without Turbo but I didn't change the results so much
> I checked the thermal paste and I saw nothing wrong
> 
> I didn't monitor with other softwares or benchmarks (which could give lower temperature results because Vray is using AVX I think witch is power intensive) but it's what count with my utilisation
> 
> So you can see I get extremely high temperatures considering Tmax is 91°C
> 
> I don't know if you can confirm me there is something wrong ?
> 
> My guess is that my cooler waterblock is not fit for the job (too small for this huge heatspeader), my ambiant temperature and probably a bad batch of the CPU are giving those results
> 
> In any way, could you give me advices for an efficient cooler that fit in my Micro ATX case (could be a custom noctua with 120mm fans for instance ?


are those tdie temperatures or tctl temperatures? I run 4275MHz @ 1.45v on custom loop, tdie is about 27c idle, maximum 75c tdie on load.

i heard the Be Quiet! DARK ROCK PRO TR4 rivals high end AIO's in noise and temperature.


----------



## pastor

those are tdie temperatures monitored with ryzen master.
I checked out my corsair h115i pro monitoring software and, I don't know why but the settings were on silent (fans @ 600 Tr/m pump at 1200 Tr/m)
I setted back the fans to max 1200 tr/min and the pump to max 2800 tr/m ...... but well ... it's not really better

I did some little changes on cpu values to 3.8 Ghz and 1.256 V 

I get:

IDLE temps: 46°C ( it can be 36-39 °c if there is nothing running, no backup software or no antivirus working in the background) ambiant temp = 24°C

Full load VRAY rendering after 4 minutes : 78°C

It's damn hot, I think it's not good for long term using :/

I add I've checked the thermal paste on the heatspreader and it looked fine


----------



## TheMadHerbalist

My old x79 rig finally crapped out last October. I finally go to building a my new system. Picked up the CPU and motherboard on sale last black Friday, and I finally had time to build this monstrosity. Have been doing some testing on it seeing what i can get.


*Edit to add picture.


----------



## Resistance

It looks like the Dark Rock Pro TR4 is finally available in the US on Newegg. That's probably the best overall air cooling option now (and maybe best overall outside of a custom water loop).


----------



## x7007

What do I need to do for XFR to work for 1950x ?

Bios Settings

Make sure in bios it set to Auto Default CPU multiplier ?

X.M.P Enabled

Voltage can be still offset Manual or needs to be Auto ?


Windows Settings

Use Ryzen Balance Power Plan ? can I change the PCIE Link State to Off ? and all the AHCI Link power Management ? cause I need it Active and not HIPM ,and just keep using 90% on the Minimum Processor state ?

Do I need to enable Core Parking ? cause AMD Disabled them with the new Ryzen Balance profile .


----------



## ssateneth

x7007 said:


> What do I need to do for XFR to work for 1950x ?
> 
> Bios Settings
> 
> Make sure in bios it set to Auto Default CPU multiplier ?
> 
> X.M.P Enabled
> 
> Voltage can be still offset Manual or needs to be Auto ?
> 
> 
> Windows Settings
> 
> Use Ryzen Balance Power Plan ? can I change the PCIE Link State to Off ? and all the AHCI Link power Management ? cause I need it Active and not HIPM ,and just keep using 90% on the Minimum Processor state ?
> 
> Do I need to enable Core Parking ? cause AMD Disabled them with the new Ryzen Balance profile .


XFR = auto volts, auto multiplier. exceeding stock multiplier or stock voltage will turn off XFR.
You can do whatever you want for RAM settings/frequency/volts.


----------



## SlantS

I have a quick question that I am not able to find much information on.

I just picked up a 1950x and a Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7 Motherboard. Not my first choice, but I got them for 40% less than newegg's current prices.

Trying to find 8x16 compatible memory for this board has been a nightmare.
I saw a set of G.SKILL TridentZ RGB 128GB (8 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZR

It was $899 on ebay with only a few hours left. It seemed like a killer deal, so I went with it.

The memory is on the gigabyte QVL, but is listed as only 4 socket support. I'm just wondering what my chances are of getting this up and running with all 8 installed
I'm not opposed to switching the motherboard if there is one known to work.


----------



## Dotachin

SlantS said:


> I have a quick question that I am not able to find much information on.
> 
> I just picked up a 1950x and a Gigabyte X399 AORUS Gaming 7 Motherboard. Not my first choice, but I got them for 40% less than newegg's current prices.
> 
> Trying to find 8x16 compatible memory for this board has been a nightmare.
> I saw a set of G.SKILL TridentZ RGB 128GB (8 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 F4-3200C14Q2-128GTZR
> 
> It was $899 on ebay with only a few hours left. It seemed like a killer deal, so I went with it.
> 
> The memory is on the gigabyte QVL, but is listed as only 4 socket support. I'm just wondering what my chances are of getting this up and running with all 8 installed
> I'm not opposed to switching the motherboard if there is one known to work.


Depends on your 1950x imc. Try 2933 first. Use 1usmus's calculator and ask for advice here
You may need a 2950 in the end idk


----------



## IImkK

Hi, need help
Decided to upgrade my old build and bought MSI x399 SLI plus with TR 1920X, and 2x16 hyperX fury CL18 3200mhz
The pc wont post. Code 00, and cpu led is red. I have only 600w psu and dont have any more cables to power up both CPUPWRs or PCIe.
My question is do i need to power up CPUPWR to even run threadripper? or the problem is somewhere else
thanks


----------



## Roaches

I managed to snag one 1950X passing by Microcenter Tustin earlier this week for half the MSRP. Looking forward to retiring my 2P system sometime this year.



IImkK said:


> Hi, need help
> Decided to upgrade my old build and bought MSI x399 SLI plus with TR 1920X, and 2x16 hyperX fury CL18 3200mhz
> The pc wont post. Code 00, and cpu led is red. I have only 600w psu and dont have any more cables to power up both CPUPWRs or PCIe.
> My question is do i need to power up CPUPWR to even run threadripper? or the problem is somewhere else
> thanks


Usually on most motherboards you can get away with plugging in one EPS12V wire to get the CPU to power up but sometimes this isn't the case on some motherboards. Your motherboard has 2 EPS12V sockets, check the manual to see if it has to be plugged in by a certain order otherwise you may need a PSU that has 2 EPS12V wires which are common in high wattage PSUs.


----------



## x7007

Anyone with Motherboard that has Spectre protection ? because it says mine doesn't . I am using Gigabyte X399 F3G old firmware but that's the best one and the other only give issues and support for x2xxx series .

https://www.grc.com/inspectre.htm

I don't know what to do.


----------



## ssateneth

From least work to most work:

Probably is not your PSU, though make sure all the required cables are plugged in. Reset CMON/load UEFI defaults. Make sure ram is seated correctly and in the correct slots. Otherwise you may need to reseat your CPU. Some specific TR4 socket screws don't latch easily into the socket because the screws are about /14mm too short and require a LOT of force to latch into the holes. If your screws arent fully screwed in (your screwdriver supplied by CPU package) will "click" when its done being screwed.

Here is a video documenting the fault with short screws in TR4 socket

hardocp showing foxconn socket screwing difficulty 



jayztwocents havign problems too. https://youtu.be/Oe99_lsBTqo?t=309
video showing person no issues screing in LOTES branded socket, but FOXCONN socket almost impossible to screw https://youtu.be/U92ekiLjLng?t=168


----------



## MacMus

hello,

I got a 1950X with a Asus Zenith Extreme Alpha board and a custom loop with 2 rads and i'm running it 1.4V 4.0 GHz.
I see temperatures ~30 on idle and cool loop, sometimes spiking to 40-50.
When i run a cinebench in loop it slowly gets 70-75 o tdie.
When i run small tft test on prime95 i am getting to 80-85 degree.

I belive those all temps are tdie not tctl, as i see my tctl in last case goving over 100.

Are those temperatures normal ?


----------



## ssateneth

Seems about right to me. Owned a 1950x @ 4GHz 1.35v and 2950x @ 4.275Ghz 1.45v. Ryzen doesn't have terribly good AVX performance so heat output for P95 won't be as extreme as Intel.

Are your pump speeds maxxed? Do you have a means of measuring coolant temperature? I'd be more interested in how much coolant temperature is increasing as a measure of how efficient your radiators are removing heat.


MacMus said:


> hello,
> 
> I got a 1950X with a Asus Zenith Extreme Alpha board and a custom loop with 2 rads and i'm running it 1.4V 4.0 GHz.
> I see temperatures ~30 on idle and cool loop, sometimes spiking to 40-50.
> When i run a cinebench in loop it slowly gets 70-75 o tdie.
> When i run small tft test on prime95 i am getting to 80-85 degree.
> 
> I belive those all temps are tdie not tctl, as i see my tctl in last case goving over 100.
> 
> Are those temperatures normal ?


----------



## MacMus

ssateneth said:


> Seems about right to me. Owned a 1950x @ 4GHz 1.35v and 2950x @ 4.275Ghz 1.45v. Ryzen doesn't have terribly good AVX performance so heat output for P95 won't be as extreme as Intel.
> 
> Are your pump speeds maxxed? Do you have a means of measuring coolant temperature? I'd be more interested in how much coolant temperature is increasing as a measure of how efficient your radiators are removing heat.


PUMP is maxed it's a d5. 
I have a tmp diode pushed into the fitting it is showing 29 degree on idle and it goes to 35-36 when temps are going into 70-80.


----------



## ssateneth

All seems in line with my experience to me. All core high load at 1.4v is going to push a chunky amount of heat into the system, but 80C die temperature is not -terrible-. You won't hurt the silicon at those temperatures, but if you want better higher clocks, you'll have to find a way to push the temperature lower (something sub-ambient). High airflow (uncomfortably loud) 560 x 140 x 80 radiator + D5, coolant raised 3-4C for me.


MacMus said:


> PUMP is maxed it's a d5.
> I have a tmp diode pushed into the fitting it is showing 29 degree on idle and it goes to 35-36 when temps are going into 70-80.


----------



## MacMus

ssateneth said:


> High airflow (uncomfortably loud) 560 x 140 x 80 radiator + D5, coolant raised 3-4C for me.


I don't get that .. what is coolant raised?

Also i am planning to put on same loop 2080ti as well. I have 2x360 rads .. one PE one slim.

also do you know any options to stablize voltage in bios ?


----------



## ssateneth

raised means it went up. it increased.

I don't have a TR system actively running anymore.


----------



## MacMus

i lowered to 1.375 and it's stable for some reason!

temps dropped 5-10 degree... 

How people are pushing 1.5V on 1950X ? Do you guys live in North Pole ?


----------



## MacMus

jepz said:


> If you can wait 6 months for 3rd gen Ryzen, I would wait.
> 
> It also depends in how much you will spend on the 1st gen TR4 combo.


TR4 gen 1 combo was 700-800 during black friday last year with Asrock X399

If you get it in this bracket this is still competitive purchase... You can later move to 3950X probably won't need extra juice from better VRMs of 2nd gen boards.


----------



## ssateneth

It's possible they don't fully stress the system. It'll run on 1.5 volts, but temperatures become a problem at anything higher than medium loads. TR just doesn't like high die temperatures. Intel coffee lake is about the same. You can shove a lot of voltage (1.5, 1.6, etc) into a 9900k and the CPU won't mind, but as soon as you load it up, it'll become uncoolable and you will run into temperature issues first before issues that require more voltage first.



MacMus said:


> i lowered to 1.375 and it's stable for some reason!
> 
> temps dropped 5-10 degree...
> 
> How people are pushing 1.5V on 1950X ? Do you guys live in North Pole ?


----------



## MacMus

ssateneth said:


> It's possible they don't fully stress the system. It'll run on 1.5 volts, but temperatures become a problem at anything higher than medium loads. TR just doesn't like high die temperatures. Intel coffee lake is about the same. You can shove a lot of voltage (1.5, 1.6, etc) into a 9900k and the CPU won't mind, but as soon as you load it up, it'll become uncoolable and you will run into temperature issues first before issues that require more voltage first.


1.45 Produce 90degree tmps on prime95 with double 360 d5 and fans maxed out with latest velocity blocks from EK on 1950X... this is where watercooling hits the ceiling.


----------



## MacMus

Hello,

I have a question about load line calibration. 

I notice that eventhough i set my CPU to 1.375 it becomes unstable with high temps and i notice that voltage drop on the core to 1.325 according to HWmonitor and it's still stable.

I have read that that is something to do with LLC.

My LLC is set to auto. I assume that with high temps this voltage will be less and less to keep TPD and eventually it will crash or BSOD. 

What is default setting or rather (Auto) and how should i set it up to avoid voltage drops ?


----------



## x7007

MacMus said:


> Hello,
> 
> I have a question about load line calibration.
> 
> I notice that eventhough i set my CPU to 1.375 it becomes unstable with high temps and i notice that voltage drop on the core to 1.325 according to HWmonitor and it's still stable.
> 
> I have read that that is something to do with LLC.
> 
> My LLC is set to auto. I assume that with high temps this voltage will be less and less to keep TPD and eventually it will crash or BSOD.
> 
> What is default setting or rather (Auto) and how should i set it up to avoid voltage drops ?


 use the turbo or high
auto when overclocking manually I think it's disabled


----------



## MacMus

x7007 said:


> use the turbo or high
> auto when overclocking manually I think it's disabled


why then i see voltage drop from 1.375 to 1.325 if it was disabled ? 

turbo or high can fry it ... i want to have a steady voltage.

i have settings -1 -2 0 1 2 3 4 etc


----------



## x7007

MacMus said:


> why then i see voltage drop from 1.375 to 1.325 if it was disabled ?
> 
> turbo or high can fry it ... i want to have a steady voltage.
> 
> i have settings -1 -2 0 1 2 3 4 etc



u see the drop. cause it's not working. 
I am using high and I used turbo, I get 1.355 at max and 1.320 normal.
u can do medium then
Asus says to use 2 or 3. try 2


----------



## MacMus

x7007 said:


> u see the drop. cause it's not working.
> I am using high and I used turbo, I get 1.355 at max and 1.320 normal.
> u can do medium then
> Asus says to use 2 or 3. try 2


i tested 1 and 5 and i still see drop to 1.275 from 1.325 same way in HW monitor?

what about -1 ?


----------



## MacMus

i was able to get stable 4 Ghz with 1.3V with LLC5... is that good result ? i have 1950X


----------



## x7007

MacMus said:


> i was able to get stable 4 Ghz with 1.3V with LLC5... is that good result ? i have 1950X


yes very good, what tests did you make ? and what is the temp full load 5 min ?


----------



## MacMus

x7007 said:


> yes very good, what tests did you make ? and what is the temp full load 5 min ?


I test stability:

- cinebench for 100 tries in loop script
- realbench stress test
- pubg numa 0 gaming, xsplit slow preset twitch streaming on numa 1

I have custom loop with 2080ti and my loop is getting hot up with liquid stuck ~40-41 with max fan speeds on that last case.
CPU temps Tdie are rumping up to 75-80 degree in that last scenario, but it's were everything in the loop is working on max speeds!

If single CPU load first case with 100 looped cinebench, CPU is going up to 70 degree tdie but liquid never gets hot enough.


----------



## 42parsec

*Thermal throttling on stock*

So, i have a TR 1920 with a Corsair H150i Pro AIO Watercooling and my CPU does a thermalthrottle on me for reaching more then 90° on stock settings when i do a prime95 small FFT test.


This shouldnt be the case and im wondering where the heck i messed up. Maybe someone over here can point me in the right direction.
Im using Arctic MX-2 paste.


----------



## MacMus

42parsec said:


> So, i have a TR 1920 with a Corsair H150i Pro AIO Watercooling and my CPU does a thermalthrottle on me for reaching more then 90° on stock settings when i do a prime95 small FFT test.
> 
> 
> This shouldnt be the case and im wondering where the heck i messed up. Maybe someone over here can point me in the right direction.
> Im using Arctic MX-2 paste.


Lool don't do that... that unrealistic load for threadripper unless your PC purpose is to run prime95!

Check what temps you are getting with your current workload and take it from there.

Look at your TR as a BMW that gives your 300km/h on a clock but do one expect you to drive with that speed for hours .. you can burn your tired and other mechanical parts.
It's ok to do it sometimes but contrast usage will results in issues.


----------



## ssateneth

42parsec said:


> So, i have a TR 1920 with a Corsair H150i Pro AIO Watercooling and my CPU does a thermalthrottle on me for reaching more then 90° on stock settings when i do a prime95 small FFT test.
> 
> 
> This shouldnt be the case and im wondering where the heck i messed up. Maybe someone over here can point me in the right direction.
> Im using Arctic MX-2 paste.


tCTL 90 degrees, or tDIE 90 degrees? In any case, P95 is nowhere near as punishing on AMD compared to Intel (I'm pretty sure FMA operations run at half speed on AMD Ryzen, which is why it doesn't go crazy heat on FMA operations, but I could be wrong)


----------



## MacMus

what kind of nonesense that is ? 

This is how they fixed scheduler in new update?


----------



## romeozor

Hey everyone,


I have a TR1920X and in an ASRock x399m Taichi, cooled by a Corsair H100i RGB Platinum. Summer is knocking on the door here, ambient temps over 25C which is affecting my cooling quite a bit, the fans spin around 1700RPM now while idle, coolant temps are just below 36C.


Since I'm sitting right next to the case, the constant fan noise unpleasant. Tried to remedy the situation by going to the Power Options and lowering the allowed minimum processor state to 60% (from 70%) which allowed the cpu multiplier to go as low as x21, but it didn't affect the temps.


The pc is used as a dev desktop, and for the occasional game, no hard loads. I'm looking for other means of keeping things just a few degrees cooler so the fans stay around 1500rpm.


The radiator is currently mounted to the top, I could maybe move it to the front so it gets the fresh air directly; right now 2 front intakes deal with that. There's also a GTX 1080FE with an Accelero Xtreme 4 cooler the front mounted radiator would blow onto if I were to move it, but I'm sure it would be fine. The AX4 does an amazing job compared to the stock FE cooler.



I also did some memory OC (just to see if I could), xmp 3200 to manual 3333, however I suspect that also contributes to the excess heat with the increased voltages and whatnot.


As you can probably tell, I'm quite inexperienced. It's a learning process. Any suggestions?


----------



## Keith Myers

Get a bigger case for better airflow. If you have graphics cards that dump hot air into the case, double the case fans up. With a bigger case, remove the AIO and put in custom loop cpu cooling. I run two separate 360mm radiator loops on my 2920X. One for the cpu and one for the RTX2080 and GTX1080Ti. Also run two more GTX 1070FE cards. I had issues controlling the cpu temp when everything was on the single loop. Currently run around 4150Mhz on Level 2 PBO with 3400 Fast memory timings. Constant cpu and gpu loads with distributed computing. The cpu keeps under the 68°C. Tdie thermal reductions.


----------



## HBizzle

Hello Threadripper owners,

Intel refugee coming over hot and heavy from a 4790K build. I am streaming on Twitch regularly now, and have been using my old 4790k box as a stream rig, but it is just not able to keep up with the games I play. Did some research and bit the bullet on a 1920x, Asrock x399m, a Kingston/HyperX 3200MHz DDR4 CL18 DIMM Memory HX432C18FBK2/8 kit thats on the Asrock QVL list (grabbed 2 to run quad channel, and cooling it with a Noctua NH-U9 TR4-SP3. 

This is all going in an old Corsair Obsidian 350D case, MATX, that I have two fans running right now in, but can add an additional 2-3 if folks think I will need it. Bringing over a few SSDs, WD Blue 7200RPM, gtx 1080, and an Avermedia Live Gamer 4k over from my old build, and powered by a 750 watt PSU. 

I am intending to run this at stock clocks as the benefits of OCing it for encoding purposes seem pretty limited. Wondering what I should look out for in regards to that, whether heat, throttling, or voltage issues? Gaming rig feeding into it is a 9900K+2080ti rig (dont hate me).


----------



## MacMus

Good news TR4 64 thread officially confirmed by lisa 🙂. If all cores will have memory access this will be insane 🙂 .. Do you know the details? ... anyone ?


----------



## sblantipodi

guys when will we see Threadripper based on Zen 2?


----------



## MacMus

sblantipodi said:


> guys when will we see Threadripper based on Zen 2?


q4 rumos has it.

but it will be costly... more then zen1 on lunch


----------



## HBizzle

Is there a link to understanding this 27c temperature offset? Finished my build last night and it posts and starts, went into bios and it had an idle temp of 69c. Was shocked. Hoping thats only 42C with the -27c formula.


----------



## ssateneth

HBizzle said:


> Is there a link to understanding this 27c temperature offset? Finished my build last night and it posts and starts, went into bios and it had an idle temp of 69c. Was shocked. Hoping thats only 42C with the -27c formula.


it's only 42c. i don't have a link to the 27c offset. it's just generally well known about threadripper by now. you can use google to find the original reason why. imo, it's just for more aggressive fan curve since tr puts out more heat.


----------



## ssateneth

doanhanam said:


> removed as spam


Not entirely sure what you said in your post, maybe lost in translation. Anyways, the CPU only respects the 68C Tdie target with respect to stock clocks and XFR behavior. Once you overclock the CPU, the CPU ignores 68C limit and will happily go past that mark if you shove enough current into the CPU. I've seen screenshots up 117 Tctl (90C Tdie) on a OC'd threadripper and it runs fine. Sure, it's hot, but it's running fine, no errors. I don't have a threadripper PC anymore so I can't personally make a screenshot myself. You just have to trust me or look through forums to find the screenshots.


----------



## MacMus

doanhanam said:


> removed as spam



Nonesense!

OC fix at freq, adjust LLC and pump enough Voltage. If the temps go to high and your cooling is unsufficient there maybe BSOD, Freez etc. 85-90 tdie is a freez teritory, so i would try to keep it below that range.


----------



## HBizzle

Anyone have recommendations on what to use to stress test this thing? 

Also what are ball park voltage ranges for the 1920x at certain Overclocks? Like 1.3v I can expect what exactly? 

In HWInfo If I am looking at Node 1 and Node 0 it shows two CPU temps, tctl and tdie. It looks like tdie is that magic 27 degrees less number. Which of these does the chip decide it should throttle on?

Well ran Cinebench r15 and the whole CPU throttled. This is with a Noctua NH-U9 TR4-SP3 so full die coverage. Was only in the 2100 MHZ range. What could be wrong with this thing? Do I need to re-seat the cooler?


----------



## x7007

What can I do when using 1950x with NUMA mode / Channel . and it picks in games NODE1 -Core 16-32 instead NODE0 -Core0-15 . Changing Cores from Affinity is not good when using NUMA . and when using UMA and doing the changing reduce the performance in many games. so I can't really control it when maximum performance .

Some games it always pick NODE1 , and some other games it randomly picks when launching or closing or restarting windows, I am not sure what cause that.

What can we do ?


----------



## RoBiK

x7007 said:


> What can I do when using 1950x with NUMA mode / Channel . and it picks in games NODE1 -Core 16-32 instead NODE0 -Core0-15 . Changing Cores from Affinity is not good when using NUMA . and when using UMA and doing the changing reduce the performance in many games. so I can't really control it when maximum performance .
> 
> Some games it always pick NODE1 , and some other games it randomly picks when launching or closing or restarting windows, I am not sure what cause that.
> 
> What can we do ?


You could try Process Lasso


----------



## x7007

RoBiK said:


> You could try Process Lasso


I use program called Process Hacker 3.x which is free

Like I said , changing the cores has no effect or has bad effect, for example Far Cry 5 , if you use NUMA and change the Cores to only 0-15 you will have massive Stuttering every 2 sec . using all 0-32 cores has no issue. I didn't test UMA , but we are talking at the moment on NUMA . Maybe it uses Cores 16-32 without any performance effect ? as long as it using only one NODE no matter which node ? because I tried switching now at real time and I still got the same FPS in WildLands Ghost Recon.

Also after switching to 0-15 and back to 0-32 it still switching to 0-15 and not going back to 16-32 .


----------



## ckoons1

Anyone looking for a new AMD 1900x


----------



## p0opstlnksal0t

Anyone in New England... southern maine, NH, northeast Mass that can pop in my (possibly blown) 1950x to see if it posts? trying to see if i burned up my chip from OC. 20 bucks to anyone who can help me. Think i might have torched my 500 dollar chip lol. https://www.overclock.net/forum/11-...hours-then-i-boot-back-up-into-bios-boom.html


----------



## ssateneth

p0opstlnksal0t said:


> Anyone in New England... southern maine, NH, northeast Mass that can pop in my (possibly blown) 1950x to see if it posts? trying to see if i burned up my chip from OC. 20 bucks to anyone who can help me. Think i might have torched my 500 dollar chip lol. https://www.overclock.net/forum/11-...hours-then-i-boot-back-up-into-bios-boom.html


Only if you are willing to put up a $1000 deposit in case your chip fries the rest of my computer (board, ram, psu, video card)


----------



## x7007

Which temps do I look for the CPU? why they are different temps/ two Tdie


----------



## adam3234

x7007 said:


> Which temps do I look for the CPU? why they are different temps/ two Tdie


There are 2 CPU(Tdie) because the 1950x contains 2 dies...well it actually has 4 dies but 2 of them are non-operational dummy dies. I think it is important to look at all the temperatures...hang on why is one die about 20 C hotter than the other die?...that doesn't seem normal unless you've deliberately set cores on one die to do a lot more work than the other die.


p.s. I think the CPU temperature shown in the motherboard section is the temperature the mother board detecting from the overall CPU package.


EDIT: I've just check your screen shot again and cores 0 to 7 are consuming about 5 watts while cores 8 to 15 are consuming between 0 to 2.5 so it would appear that one die is doing more work than the other die.


----------



## smke

I could use some help with a question I have. I have a asrock x399 taichi and 1900x cpu and to cool it I have the ENERMAX LIQTECH TR4 II ver and what I am trying to figure out why at stock I was getting wen I first got is temps were mid 60's and low 70's and now I am luckey to get mid 90's and another thing is the two times I have took the unit off to check and clean the thermal paste it has ben pushed to all sides with very little left on cpu and cold plate


----------



## x7007

smke said:


> I could use some help with a question I have. I have an ASRock x399 taichi and 1900x CPU and to cool it I have the ENERMAX LIQTECH TR4 II ver and what I am trying to figure out why at stock I was getting when I first got is temps were mid 60's and low 70's and now I am lucky to get mid 90's and another thing is the two times I have taken the unit off to check and clean the thermal paste it has been pushed to all sides with very little left on CPU and cold plate


I think as same as me, your cooler is dead or it has a clog somewhere in the heatsink. I RMA it and they send me a new one, they say this revision has no issue with the coolant, leaking or Pump. as for the part of the Pump and leaking, I am pretty sure they are right, but as for the coolant I hope they are right. it took them 4 revisions to fix all the issues. one was the pump, then on the same revision was also the coolant. they fix the pump on the RGB and also the leaking. then second revision of the RGB they said they fixed the coolant.


----------



## smke

x7007 said:


> I think as same as me, your cooler is dead or it has a clog somewhere in the heatsink. I RMA it and they send me a new one, they say this revision has no issue with the coolant, leaking or Pump. as for the part of the Pump and leaking, I am pretty sure they are right, but as for the coolant I hope they are right. it took them 4 revisions to fix all the issues. one was the pump, then on the same revision was also the coolant. they fix the pump on the RGB and also the leaking. then second revision of the RGB they said they fixed the coolant.


 I came up with a better cooler then that enermax thing I took my old EK preditor 240
and put a EK Supremacy sTR4 RGB block and my ideal temps are 55-60c and did a cyne r20 run and it went to 90c


----------



## x7007

smke said:


> I came up with a better cooler then that enermax thing I took my old EK preditor 240
> and put a EK Supremacy sTR4 RGB block and my ideal temps are 55-60c and did a cyne r20 run and it went to 90c


I don't think 55-60c idle is any good, you meant this as a good thing? I am a big confused, on what you are using now compare to before?

I got my new Enermax but I am not sure if to use it now or to replace the coolant with the ek coolant. I don't want it to be clogged cause then it's harder to clean it. but I don't know if it will be clogged. it's bloody hard decision. they said I got the newest Rev with all the fixes from the answer I got from their support.


----------



## smke

x7007 said:


> I don't think 55-60c idle is any good, you meant this as a good thing? I am a big confused, on what you are using now compare to before?
> 
> I got my new Enermax but I am not sure if to use it now or to replace the coolant with the ek coolant. I don't want it to be clogged cause then it's harder to clean it. but I don't know if it will be clogged. it's bloody hard decision. they said I got the newest Rev with all the fixes from the answer I got from their support.


 my orgnal temps were 75 -80c at idel


----------



## x7007

smke said:


> my orgnal temps were 75 -80c at idel


still Enermax and even noctua idle I get 35c. I had 55c idle when Enermax was broke.
when above 68c you are getting throttled.... not good at all.


----------



## smke

x7007 said:


> still Enermax and even noctua idle I get 35c. I had 55c idle when Enermax was broke.
> when above 68c you are getting throttled.... not good at all.


 i am at 4ghrz


----------



## x7007

smke said:


> i am at 4ghrz


so am I


----------



## sblantipodi

is it possible to see a 16 core zen 2 threadripper clocked a lot higher than 3950X due to higher tdp and better package?
do you think that we will see a new 16 core threadripper?


----------



## jepz

sblantipodi said:


> is it possible to see a 16 core zen 2 threadripper clocked a lot higher than 3950X due to higher tdp and better package?
> do you think that we will see a new 16 core threadripper?


Impossible to predict such a thing.

We don't even know if will be released a TR4 3rd gen, if so I would be very happy if actual X399 boards show some compatibility 

I just can imagine ridiculous number of cores for this upcoming gen, starting at least around 24 cores / 48 threads, less than this it would be pointless due to 3950X 16/32 at mainstream market...only Quad Channel claim for TR4 and extra PCI-E lanes is not enough to the HEDT user, also many TR4 users may get a X570 + 3950X instead.

I do think TR4 chips are more binned than AM4 ones, I think they are cherry picked by AMD focusing the HEDT user who wants the best of the best.


----------



## ajc9988

jepz said:


> Impossible to predict such a thing.
> 
> We don't even know if will be released a TR4 3rd gen, if so I would be very happy if actual X399 boards show some compatibility
> 
> I just can imagine ridiculous number of cores for this upcoming gen, starting at least around 24 cores / 48 threads, less than this it would be pointless due to 3950X 16/32 at mainstream market...only Quad Channel claim for TR4 and extra PCI-E lanes is not enough to the HEDT user, also many TR4 users may get a X570 + 3950X instead.
> 
> I do think TR4 chips are more binned than AM4 ones, I think they are cherry picked by AMD focusing the HEDT user who wants the best of the best.


This is ABSURD!

On memory channels, you have double the bandwidth, almost. Maybe you have no idea how to use that memory bandwidth, but let me tell you, there are many that DO know how to saturate that bandwidth in their jobs while also not needing more cores.

Then, we are talking a HUGE leap in number of PCIe lanes. If you use cryptographic accelerators, multi-GPU (non-sli or crossfire) for production, do major networking or need extraordinarily fast storage or large amounts of storage, then mainstream does NOT cut it!

If you look back through the generations, as of Zen 1, AMD put a $150 premium on the two extra memory channels and the PCIe. Considering that the 16-core AM4 chip is at $750, that places a Threadripper equivalent at $900, which is in-line with launch pricing for the Zen+ second gen Threadripper.

So, what I am saying is speak for yourself in what is worth it or not. You evidently do not need it. Others do need it.

Aside from that, I do not see AMD doing 4 chiplets to give extra cache to the 16-core if there is a 16-core like they are doing on the highest priced 16-core Epyc. Just makes little sense. 

Also, Lisa Su said directly in response to the rumor that TR was axed that NO, THREADRIPPER IS NOT DEAD! That means there will be a new generation of TR. You can argue they will use Zen 3 on it, etc. Sure. Or argue on release date. But the existence of the next generation TR is NOT in question. It is when and components used to make it.


----------



## sblantipodi

jepz said:


> Impossible to predict such a thing.
> 
> We don't even know if will be released a TR4 3rd gen, if so I would be very happy if actual X399 boards show some compatibility
> 
> I just can imagine ridiculous number of cores for this upcoming gen, starting at least around 24 cores / 48 threads, less than this it would be pointless due to 3950X 16/32 at mainstream market...only Quad Channel claim for TR4 and extra PCI-E lanes is not enough to the HEDT user, also many TR4 users may get a X570 + 3950X instead.
> 
> I do think TR4 chips are more binned than AM4 ones, I think they are cherry picked by AMD focusing the HEDT user who wants the best of the best.


I really hope that TR4 will not be "only more cores" but even more performance on ST thanks to a big jump in frequencies on few threads.


----------



## Keith Myers

*TR Castle Peak leaked results*



sblantipodi said:


> is it possible to see a 16 core zen 2 threadripper clocked a lot higher than 3950X due to higher tdp and better package?
> do you think that we will see a new 16 core threadripper?


Leaked result of the upcoming Castle Peak Threadripper 3000 parts.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-threadripper-3000-castle-peak-16-core-cpu,40011.html

Up to 13% faster overall in benchmark tests against an equivalent 16C/32T 2950X part.

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Ryzen-TR-2950X-vs-AMD-100-000000011-12/m569025vsm858271


----------



## sblantipodi

Keith Myers said:


> sblantipodi said:
> 
> 
> 
> is it possible to see a 16 core zen 2 threadripper clocked a lot higher than 3950X due to higher tdp and better package?
> do you think that we will see a new 16 core threadripper?
> 
> 
> 
> Leaked result of the upcoming Castle Peak Threadripper 3000 parts.
> 
> https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-threadripper-3000-castle-peak-16-core-cpu,40011.html
> 
> Up to 13% faster overall in benchmark tests against an equivalent 16C/32T 2950X part.
> 
> https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Ryzen-TR-2950X-vs-AMD-100-000000011-12/m569025vsm858271
Click to expand...

So is the new threadripper a mere ryzen 3950X clone on the hedt platform?


----------



## Keith Myers

sblantipodi said:


> So is the new threadripper a mere ryzen 3950X clone on the hedt platform?


No, not really, though the similarity between the two products grows closer. TR will still be a 4 channel memory HEDT platform. And TR will have higher cpu core counts. I expect a 4 CCD product equivalent to the old 2990WX.


----------



## jepz

Keith Myers said:


> No, not really, though the similarity between the two products grows closer. TR will still be a 4 channel memory HEDT platform. And TR will have higher cpu core counts. I expect a 4 CCD product equivalent to the old 2990WX.


Yep, now we have some news about it.

Now I can imagine a 32 core / 64 threads without the 2nd gen IF limitations, oh boy, that's gonna be awesome.

Also appears the X399 sucessor (X599 chipset) is on the way to go live.


----------



## ajc9988

jepz said:


> Yep, now we have some news about it.
> 
> Now I can imagine a 32 core / 64 threads without the 2nd gen IF limitations, oh boy, that's gonna be awesome.
> 
> Also appears the X399 sucessor (X599 chipset) is on the way to go live.


Can you clarify your statement? Zen 2 CPUs are using a second generation IF, so although I think you mean the second generation TR IF implementation limitations, your statement does not read as such.

But, yes, there is a chance for the 32-core 3000 series TR to be batting against the 28-core Intel Xeon W-3175, which would be phenomenal power for the price!


----------



## jepz

ajc9988 said:


> Can you clarify your statement? Zen 2 CPUs are using a second generation IF, so although I think you mean the second generation TR IF implementation limitations, your statement does not read as such.
> 
> But, yes, there is a chance for the 32-core 3000 series TR to be batting against the 28-core Intel Xeon W-3175, which would be phenomenal power for the price!



Yep, Second Gen TR IF.

It'll be hard to do not upgrade to these new TR CPUs.


----------



## jepz

ajc9988 said:


> This is ABSURD!
> 
> On memory channels, you have double the bandwidth, almost. Maybe you have no idea how to use that memory bandwidth, but let me tell you, there are many that DO know how to saturate that bandwidth in their jobs while also not needing more cores.
> 
> Then, we are talking a HUGE leap in number of PCIe lanes. If you use cryptographic accelerators, multi-GPU (non-sli or crossfire) for production, do major networking or need extraordinarily fast storage or large amounts of storage, then mainstream does NOT cut it!
> 
> If you look back through the generations, as of Zen 1, AMD put a $150 premium on the two extra memory channels and the PCIe. Considering that the 16-core AM4 chip is at $750, that places a Threadripper equivalent at $900, which is in-line with launch pricing for the Zen+ second gen Threadripper.
> 
> So, what I am saying is speak for yourself in what is worth it or not. You evidently do not need it. Others do need it.
> 
> Aside from that, I do not see AMD doing 4 chiplets to give extra cache to the 16-core if there is a 16-core like they are doing on the highest priced 16-core Epyc. Just makes little sense.
> 
> Also, Lisa Su said directly in response to the rumor that TR was axed that NO, THREADRIPPER IS NOT DEAD! That means there will be a new generation of TR. You can argue they will use Zen 3 on it, etc. Sure. Or argue on release date. But the existence of the next generation TR is NOT in question. It is when and components used to make it.



Basically TR is better for people who really needs to deal with some workloads related to memory bandwidth and/or have the need for lots of PCI-e lanes/devices , but depending on the new price range for 3rd gen TRs, it's impossible to denial and to do not be "seduced" for a top mainstream CPU as the upcoming 3950X.

About your example, those in need of such high processing power may think in buying an EPYC instead if they can afford it...TR is right in the middle of mainstream mkt and server mkt.

I have one question: Do you own a TR system?


----------



## sblantipodi

ajc9988 said:


> This is ABSURD!
> 
> On memory channels, you have double the bandwidth, almost. Maybe you have no idea how to use that memory bandwidth, but let me tell you, there are many that DO know how to saturate that bandwidth in their jobs while also not needing more cores.
> 
> Then, we are talking a HUGE leap in number of PCIe lanes. If you use cryptographic accelerators, multi-GPU (non-sli or crossfire) for production, do major networking or need extraordinarily fast storage or large amounts of storage, then mainstream does NOT cut it!
> 
> If you look back through the generations, as of Zen 1, AMD put a $150 premium on the two extra memory channels and the PCIe. Considering that the 16-core AM4 chip is at $750, that places a Threadripper equivalent at $900, which is in-line with launch pricing for the Zen+ second gen Threadripper.
> 
> So, what I am saying is speak for yourself in what is worth it or not. You evidently do not need it. Others do need it.
> 
> Aside from that, I do not see AMD doing 4 chiplets to give extra cache to the 16-core if there is a 16-core like they are doing on the highest priced 16-core Epyc. Just makes little sense.
> 
> Also, Lisa Su said directly in response to the rumor that TR was axed that NO, THREADRIPPER IS NOT DEAD! That means there will be a new generation of TR. You can argue they will use Zen 3 on it, etc. Sure. Or argue on release date. But the existence of the next generation TR is NOT in question. It is when and components used to make it.


can you give us some examples of applications where memory bandwidth is so crucial?


----------



## Keith Myers

sblantipodi said:


> can you give us some examples of applications where memory bandwidth is so crucial?


Just take a look at any of the application charts over at Phoronix.com for Threadripper. Compiling, compression, encoding, all depend crucially on bandwidth and memory clocks. Lots of charts comparing 2 two channel versus 4 channel for a simple bird's-eye view of the differences.


----------



## Dero79

Hi guys, I wanted to upgrade from a i7 6850K to a new ryzen 9 3900X but I noted that the 1920X is on sale in Europe at 260 euros. Considering that the cost or a good X570 motherboard is comparable to a X399 one, could it be a good deal? 
I would use that PC for gaming at 4K and 3D modeling. 

Inviato dal mio SM-G975F utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## ajc9988

jepz said:


> Basically TR is better for people who really needs to deal with some workloads related to memory bandwidth and/or have the need for lots of PCI-e lanes/devices , but depending on the new price range for 3rd gen TRs, it's impossible to denial and to do not be "seduced" for a top mainstream CPU as the upcoming 3950X.
> 
> About your example, those in need of such high processing power may think in buying an EPYC instead if they can afford it...TR is right in the middle of mainstream mkt and server mkt.
> 
> I have one question: Do you own a TR system?


Yes, I do own a 1950X. I'm debating going to an Epyc 1P system or upgrading to the new 16 or 32 core TR this fall, budget allowing at the time. 

There are those that have tasks where the mainstream platform may lure them back, although the cost of the MB is no price saving this round. As such, you pay $150 more for the CPU, the MB will be, likely, roughly the same between the two platforms, plus you have more mem capacity and bandwidth along with the extra slots. 

So, although some may consider stepping down, especially those without the need, I see many waiting a couple months and getting the TR, especially if already on the X399 platform.



Dero79 said:


> Hi guys, I wanted to upgrade from a i7 6850K to a new ryzen 9 3900X but I noted that the 1920X is on sale in Europe at 260 euros. Considering that the cost or a good X570 motherboard is comparable to a X399 one, could it be a good deal?
> I would use that PC for gaming at 4K and 3D modeling.
> 
> Inviato dal mio SM-G975F utilizzando Tapatalk


That is a tough one. Although the 1920X is cheap, unless you plan on upgrading the chip next year when prices fall on Zen 2 TR, I wouldn't do it. Also, you may want to see if newer boards are coming.

Putting that aside, if you cannot wait, then it will be an upgrade in heavily multi-threaded workloads. Depending on how much speed you got out of your 6850K if overclocked, you may have better single thread performance from the Intel CPU.

Now, if you can wait, the new TR should help dive the price of the 2000 series TR. That would be an alright step up. 

If that is your need, 4K gaming (which the CPU will not be the bottleneck) and 3D modeling, the more cores the better, depending on the modeling program. In that way, the 1920X will be a step up and could hold you over, all while having better memory bandwidth than your current platform or the 3900X. 

Then, next year, upgrade the CPU to a 16-core (likely lowest sku next year) at a lower platform cost (since you already have the MB and RAM) for that upgrade, while getting a massive performance jump (33% more cores + 20.5% performance uplift due to generational improvements at least). Granted, reselling the chip will be a chore, but you could always consider grabbing a cheap board and creating a home server, etc. with it, or try to get $100+ from it next year.

With how far the value of the 1950X has fallen since I bought it, it is getting to a point I might as well repurpose it then try to recoup (I purchased at launch).


----------



## Keith Myers

Dero79 said:


> Hi guys, I wanted to upgrade from a i7 6850K to a new ryzen 9 3900X but I noted that the 1920X is on sale in Europe at 260 euros. Considering that the cost or a good X570 motherboard is comparable to a X399 one, could it be a good deal?
> I would use that PC for gaming at 4K and 3D modeling.
> 
> Inviato dal mio SM-G975F utilizzando Tapatalk


Why do you feel that you need a new X570 motherboard? Do you have large storage requirements that could use PCI Gen.4? The X370/X470 boards can all run Ryzen 3000 for the most part. Currently running the 3900X on my old Crosshair VII Hero X470 motherboard.


----------



## adam3234

What do you guys think are the chances that the next Threadripper generation(s) and their mother boards will support 16 ram slots and octo channel memory? I would like an extra 128 GB of RAM. I heard there was going to be a big drops in RAM prices (something like up to 42.1%) and was thinking it'll be a good time to buy more RAM if future Threadrippers motherboards will support more RAM slots...hmm...will those mother boards even have the room for the extra RAM slots?


----------



## ajc9988

adam3234 said:


> What do you guys think are the chances that the next Threadripper generation(s) and their mother boards will support 16 ram slots and octo channel memory? I would like an extra 128 GB of RAM. I heard there was going to be a big drops in RAM prices (something like up to 42.1%) and was thinking it'll be a good time to buy more RAM if future Threadrippers motherboards will support more RAM slots...hmm...will those mother boards even have the room for the extra RAM slots?


Simple answer is not likely.

Complex answer: Cascade-X seems like it will use the same X299 boards. Since Intel isn't moving 6-channel memory to the HEDT, Keeping it for the servers and the Xeon overclockable chips, there is little reason for AMD to move the 8-channel to HEDT at this moment.

Further, unless they planned on the forced upgrade of the socket, I don't really see this happening. The old X399 boards are not laid out for 8-channel, to my knowledge. So, if they wanted backwards compatibility, that would be out of the question.

There are a couple other reasons, but that should be enough for now.


----------



## Keith Myers

adam3234 said:


> What do you guys think are the chances that the next Threadripper generation(s) and their mother boards will support 16 ram slots and octo channel memory? I would like an extra 128 GB of RAM. I heard there was going to be a big drops in RAM prices (something like up to 42.1%) and was thinking it'll be a good time to buy more RAM if future Threadrippers motherboards will support more RAM slots...hmm...will those mother boards even have the room for the extra RAM slots?


Better buy your RAM now. Prices are going back up since all the manufacturers are reducing wafer starts to reduce the glut of memory in the distribution channel so that they can recover average selling prices for dies.


----------



## ajc9988

Keith Myers said:


> Better buy your RAM now. Prices are going back up since all the manufacturers are reducing wafer starts to reduce the glut of memory in the distribution channel so that they can recover average selling prices for dies.


Not only that, chemicals used to make the wafers are going up in cost due to a trade fight between Japan and S. Korea. So even if they reduced production, there is also the cost of manufacturing that is rising.


----------



## adam3234

ajc9988 said:


> ... there is little reason for AMD to move the 8-channel to HEDT at this moment...


I was hoping new 4 die Threadripper CPUs will encourage AMD to upgrade the tr4 socket to support 8 channels because without 8 channels 2 of the 4 dies that don't have direct RAM access will take a massive latency hit from having to request for RAM data from the other 2 dies with direct access to RAM...although that is with the Zen 1 architecture, I'm not sure how the Zen 2 architecture with it's chiplets and IO die architecture will handle memory requests from 4 dies.





ajc9988 said:


> ...Further, unless they planned on the forced upgrade of the socket, I don't really see this happening. The old X399 boards are not laid out for 8-channel, to my knowledge. So, if they wanted backwards compatibility, that would be out of the question....


 I was hoping future boards like x699 or x799 etc will support 8 channels not AMD upgrading x399 boards to support 8 channels...although if AMD can do that then that will be pretty cool...although what I want is 16 slots and 8 channel support.


----------



## ajc9988

adam3234 said:


> I was hoping new 4 die Threadripper CPUs will encourage AMD to upgrade the tr4 socket to support 8 channels because without 8 channels 2 of the 4 dies that don't have direct RAM access will take a massive latency hit from having to request for RAM data from the other 2 dies with direct access to RAM...although that is with the Zen 1 architecture, I'm not sure how the Zen 2 architecture with it's chiplets and IO die architecture will handle memory requests from 4 dies.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was hoping future boards like x699 or x799 etc will support 8 channels not AMD upgrading x399 boards to support 8 channels...although if AMD can do that then that will be pretty cool...although what I want is 16 slots and 8 channel support.


The I/O die centralizes ALL memory channels. All traffic going from one CCX to another, or to memory, goes to the I/O die. All latency was equalized in this way to address the issue of stale data. Windows also changed the scheduler so that the thread assigned is used and other threads are spawned on the same CCX until the CCX is full, then it goes to another CCX. Because the memory channels are centralized, it is the same latency to go the memory REGARDLESS of which core is requesting the information.

Further, your statement is predicated under the argument that the problem was memory bandwidth to the cores and NOT the latency causing stale data. Sure, memory bandwidth per core is going to be stretched a bit, except that all cores have equal access through a two hop solution, 1 hop to the I/O and 1 hop to the memory.

Now, AMD did this because the MS NUMA awareness was shiite. Meaning whenever it was in a NUMA situation, it allowed spawning to ONLY 1 extra node, meaning two of the four dies on the 2990WX. With a centralized I/O, the system recognizes the entire CPU as UMA, meaning one mem controller and die, roughly, rather than each die being a separate NUMA node, for simplicity sake. That means that the problem with NUMA has been resolved. And by standardizing all latency, even though it increased latency in some cases, it lowers the amount of stale data and other issues, thereby overall making the CPU faster. Efficiency through inefficiency. 

So the problems of TR and TR second gen are gone. That also means that the new 32 cores will likely smash the crap out of the 18-core Intel CPUs and go toe to toe with the 28-core in many cases. Meanwhile, the 64-core variant, expected to be priced at $3000-3400, will be in the price category of the 28-core OC Xeon, while also beating it badly. 

AMD is already said to be keeping backwards compatibility on the new third gen chips. Making those chips shut down two mem controllers with 2 channels per controller would be a PITA! I suppose it is possible, just very unlikely.

Instead, the new MBs will support PCIe 4.0. No new socket is likely until 2021 with DDR5 introduction. So chances of adding those memory lanes until then is small. Before they mentioned possible X399 compatibility, I was hoping, since we got two generations on the platform, for a potential new socket and additional lanes. But not happening is the most likely outcome.

As I believe I said, Intel isn't increasing their mem channels either. So that leaves little reason for complaint.

Finally, if you are going off of people saying their isn't enough bandwidth to run 32 cores on 4 channels of memory, that is FALSE. It was disproved when the scheduler part was shown. I, on my own, suspected a stale data problem for the cores without mem channels, as they were ALWAYS with the largest latency possible (there are 4 different latencies for core to core comms and two on memory, 1)same CCX, 2) different CCX on the same die, 3) mirrored CCX on a different die, and 4) different CCX on a different die; memory - 1) local memory controller, 2) memory controller on other die). So, you would wind up with the two dies without memory controllers always having to go off die for memory calls, while also having very long latencies on die to die comms, resulting in a lot of latency. Combine that with a scheduler acting opportunistically causing thread thrashing by moving apps to and from core 0 regularly, and you result in a system that is FUBARed in many use cases.

So, with Zen 2, you have two CPU comm latencies: 1) on same CCX, and 2) CCX to CCX. Further, you only have 1 memory latency, going to I/O, then going to memory. In addition, by centralizing the mem controller, the OS reads it as a single memory node, or Unified Memory Architecture, so does NOT treat it as NUMA when scheduling. On top of that, MS changed the scheduler performance to keep it on the same CCX as much as possible before spawning to another CCX, thereby trying to keep latency in the lowest CPU core to core comm latency at all times. 

If you understand what was done, you should not fear the new gen at all, instead you should really welcome it. AMD will be discussing this more at the AMD server event on Aug. 7th, followed by Hot Chips the week after where they are headlining. 

Now, if your workload needs the mem bandwidth, it may be time to step up to the Epyc Rome platform anyways.


----------



## adam3234

ajc9988 said:


> Further, your statement is predicated under the argument that the problem was memory bandwidth to the cores and NOT the latency causing stale data.


Actually, my concern was memory latency not memory bandwidth. 






ajc9988 said:


> Finally, if you are going off of people saying their isn't enough bandwidth to run 32 cores on 4 channels of memory, that is FALSE.


Nope I was going off the results from tech reviewers...apparently Wendell from Level1Techs investigated the thread scheduling problem.





ajc9988 said:


> If you understand what was done, you should not fear the new gen at all, instead you should really welcome it.


I was hoping for memory latency improvements from the 3 gen but it looks like is has gotten a little worst than the 1st gen.





ajc9988 said:


> Now, if your workload needs the mem bandwidth, it may be time to step up to the Epyc Rome platform anyways.


 No, my work load doesn't need extra bandwidth. It needs move memory capacity. I don't need lower latency either but I just don't want higher latency from future generations. I don't want to step up to the Epyc platform because of the lower CPU frequencies.


----------



## Keith Myers

I've seen screenshots of Threadripper systems running 256GB using the double height 32GB modules. Now that Samsung is producing 256GB modules you shouldn't have a problem with building a TR system which can recognize 2TB of memory.


----------



## ajc9988

adam3234 said:


> Actually, my concern was memory latency not memory bandwidth.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nope I was going off the results from tech reviewers...apparently Wendell from Level1Techs investigated the thread scheduling problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was hoping for memory latency improvements from the 3 gen but it looks like is has gotten a little worst than the 1st gen.
> 
> 
> 
> No, my work load doesn't need extra bandwidth. It needs move memory capacity. I don't need lower latency either but I just don't want higher latency from future generations. I don't want to step up to the Epyc platform because of the lower CPU frequencies.


If you are complaining about "more latency," then you have no CLUE what the new architecture and dies bring.

So, first, every time you leave the CCX, you now have to go through the I/O die. This is to try to standardize the latency for every time it goes off CCX, even to the other CCX on the same die. This simplifies scheduling and helps with stale data.

Now, let me explain what is going on a bit more. AMD has, by default, the memory controllers set to Unified Memory Architecture, with the system seeing all controllers as 1. But, there is the ability, at least for Epyc, to break that UMA into four NUMA nodes, with them seeing each controller as its own node (with the two closest chiplets being part of one node).

There is still variable latencies for each of the four controllers. But with them all centralized, and since doing a memory call, regardless which CCX is doing the memory call, requires the same latency to go to the I/O die for each CCX, then the latency variance, depending on which memory controller must be accessed, is reduced to 25ns for travel on the I/O die at the most, and 6ns at the least. This greatly reduces the overall latency to do a memory call for the farthest latencies seen on the WX processors, while increasing the smallest latencies on the WX processors. What that means is, under my theory of stale data being a huge part of the problem on TR 2970WX and 2990WX, that the memory calls will be, for the most part, standardized moving forward.

Now, because of the added latency for the smallest memory latencies, they doubled the L3 cache. That actually slowed down L3 cache calls. But, it also reduced the number of memory calls. Because it reduced the number of memory calls, it overall enhances the performance of the CPU, which is efficiency through inefficiency. 

Here are pics and links to the sources on what you need to know for the changes made for the memory. And please stop thinking that increasing the lowest mem latency is a problem. It is called efficiency through inefficiency. It greatly reduced the highest latency while increasing a little on the lowest latency, while having all latency fairly standardized which helps prevent stale data.

https://www.servethehome.com/amd-epyc-7002-series-rome-delivers-a-knockout/4/

https://www.anandtech.com/show/14694/amd-rome-epyc-2nd-gen/2

https://www.anandtech.com/show/14694/amd-rome-epyc-2nd-gen/7

https://www.servethehome.com/amd-epyc-7002-series-rome-delivers-a-knockout/6/

https://www.anandtech.com/show/14694/amd-rome-epyc-2nd-gen/8


----------



## Mektor

Late to the party/site. This build has been through many changes over the last couple years.

Started off with a noctua cooler on it..stepped up to enermax #1...it died after 6 months...then replaced for free with enermax #2...again it died after about 5 or 6 months with the same issue of the pump clogging up the fins with biological growth and corrosion because enermax uses soiled dishwater for coolant and mixed metals in their system. You can rebuild them but it wasn't worth the hassle for me. after #2 died I went custom loop and never looked back. Though because the system was already built and I just didn't care about it being a clean build anymore: it's a bit messy lol. Video card was also added to this loop after the loop was originally done because I originally had a RTX 2080 TI in there, but that card got transferred to my new gaming rig, and my old GTX 1080 got upgraded with a waterblock and put back into the threadripper rig as the threadripper was retired from gaming. 

Build specs:
ASRock x399 Taichi
Ryzen TR 1950x + Koolance TR4 waterblock ver 2.0
32GB (8GBx4) G.Skill Ripjaws DDR4 3600 (running at 3200)
GeForce GTX 1080 + Koolance full cover waterblock
Samsung 960 Evo 500GB NVMe SSD M.2
Intel Optane 900p 280GB NVMe SSD U.2
Crucial M4 240GB SATA SSD
WD VelociRaptor 600GB 10,000RPM SATA HDD
Seagate Barracuda 4TB 7,200RPM SATA HDD
LG BD-RE SATA optical drive
Koolance 280MM radiator
Koolance 240MM radiator
Koolance DDC pump x2 in series
Koolance drive bay reservoir (fits twin DDC pumps in series)
kingwin fan controller
Corsair Vengeance C70 Military Green case
Corsair SP120mm RGB x5
Corsair ML140mm x2
Koolance 140mm x2
Silverstone Strider Plus 1000w 80+ silver (have used this PSU for about 9 nears now and it's still going strong and working flawlessly)


CPU idles at ~26-28c depending on ambient room temp. usually stays about 3c warmer than ambient room temp. loads at ~63c (8c/8t) ~85c (16c/32t) under prime95 smallFFT 100% load. all cores clocked @ 4.05GHz prime95 stable and daily use stable.


----------



## Mektor

Had also played with the above rig a bit for giggles after I had custom loop cooled it just to see how far I could push it for gaming performance. It wasn't prime95 stable at this point but it was stable enough for some shorter tests that didn't hold it at 100% indefinitely. heat was just too much to contain at that point without refrigeration for long test (prime95) stability. 

But I managed to pull off 4.3GHz with SMT disabled and 4+0 die settings. memory interleaving set to channel. Managed to catch up to a 7700k for single thread performance! Killed it in multi-thread performance 8 threads vs 8 threads. Not bad for a first gen ryzen on ambient temp cooling!

I highly recommend against trying to push one this far though without a serious custom loop or exotic cooling.


----------



## HuggyBear

Another TR owner late to the party. Here are the particulars:

Threadripper 1950x @4050
MSI MEG X399 Creation (MS-7B92) BIOS 7B92v13
Corsair Vengeance LPX 128GB 2666 C16 @2667 14-16-16-34
eVGA RTX 2070 XC Black Gaming
eVGA Hybrid Kit GPU Water Cooling
Samsung SSD 970 PRO 512GB NVMe x2
Samsung SSD 970 EVO Plus 1TB NVMe x2
Samsung SSD 970 EVO Plus 500GB NVMe x1
Corsair H150i Platinum Pro 360 CPU Water Cooling
Corsair AX1200i Platinum Certified
Corsair ML120 Pro RGB x9 (3x Radiator exhaust, 6x case intake)
CableMod C-Series PRO ModMesh Cable Kit For AX PSU
Lian Li Bauhaus-O11 Dynamic Case (DER8AUER Design)


----------



## HuggyBear

Mektor said:


> CPU idles at ~26-28c depending on ambient room temp. usually stays about 3c warmer than ambient room temp. loads at ~63c under prime95 smallFFT 100% load. all cores clocked @ 4.05GHz prime95 stable and daily use stable.


I'd really like to know a little bit more about how you hit 4.05 stable. IE: Core speed adjustment via ratio or base clock, voltages, manual or auto ram voltages, Mode Line changes, etc. Any details you'd care to share I'd love to hear.


----------



## Mektor

HuggyBear said:


> I'd really like to know a little bit more about how you hit 4.05 stable. IE: Core speed adjustment via ratio or base clock, voltages, manual or auto ram voltages, Mode Line changes, etc. Any details you'd care to share I'd love to hear.


Settings in ASRock Taichi OC Tweaker menu in BIOS:

Overclock Mode: Manual
APU/PCIE Frequency (MHz): 100

CPU Frequency and Voltage Change: Manual
CPU Frequency (MHz): 4050
CPU Voltage(V): 1.38750
SMT Mode: Auto

XMP settings: XMP 2.0 Profile 1
DRAM Frequency: DDR4-3200 (I have DDR4 3600 RAM but it's not 100% stable with a 1950x threadripper at 3600 speed. I have found it behaves and boots consistently at 3200 speed without the frequent power cycle loops during bootup trying to hold 3600)


Voltage configuration

Voltage Mode: OC Mode
CPU Vcore Voltage: Fixed Mode
Fixed Voltage(V): 1.3875
CPU Load-Line Calibration: Level 1
VDDCR_SOC Voltage: Auto
VDDR_SOC Load-Line Calibration: Level 1

The rest of the settings are defaults.


For gaming I change SMT to disabled, set cores to 4+0, and set memory interleaving to channel. (8 core 8 thread mode with local memory access) gives a significant improvement in framerate for games like Star Citizen.


----------



## HuggyBear

Mektor said:


> Settings in ASRock Taichi OC Tweaker menu in BIOS:
> 
> Overclock Mode: Manual
> APU/PCIE Frequency (MHz): 100
> 
> CPU Frequency and Voltage Change: Manual
> CPU Frequency (MHz): 4050
> CPU Voltage(V): 1.38750
> SMT Mode: Auto
> 
> XMP settings: XMP 2.0 Profile 1
> DRAM Frequency: DDR4-3200 (I have DDR4 3600 RAM but it's not 100% stable with a 1950x threadripper at 3600 speed. I have found it behaves and boots consistently at 3200 speed without the frequent power cycle loops during bootup trying to hold 3600)
> 
> 
> Voltage configuration
> 
> Voltage Mode: OC Mode
> CPU Vcore Voltage: Fixed Mode
> Fixed Voltage(V): 1.3875
> CPU Load-Line Calibration: Level 1
> VDDCR_SOC Voltage: Auto
> VDDR_SOC Load-Line Calibration: Level 1
> 
> The rest of the settings are defaults.
> 
> 
> For gaming I change SMT to disabled, set cores to 4+0, and set memory interleaving to channel. (8 core 8 thread mode with local memory access) gives a significant improvement in framerate for games like Star Citizen.



Awesome! Thanks for the quick reply and details. I've been able to push mine up around the 4.2 mark, but not anything you would call stable. I really don't expect to hit big numbers stable due to the amount of ram I have. But I think I should be able to see 4.0 out if it. 

Do you recall if you left Cool and Quiet and Spread Spectrum settings disabled or enabled/auto? I remember back in the day those 2 were things that you automatically disabled as soon as you started overclocking. Last time I did any OC'ing was right around the last time I posted here and that would be going on 15yrs ago now. Not a completely different world today, but close.

Thanks again!


----------



## Mektor

HuggyBear said:


> Awesome! Thanks for the quick reply and details. I've been able to push mine up around the 4.2 mark, but not anything you would call stable. I really don't expect to hit big numbers stable due to the amount of ram I have. But I think I should be able to see 4.0 out if it.
> 
> Do you recall if you left Cool and Quiet and Spread Spectrum settings disabled or enabled/auto? I remember back in the day those 2 were things that you automatically disabled as soon as you started overclocking. Last time I did any OC'ing was right around the last time I posted here and that would be going on 15yrs ago now. Not a completely different world today, but close.
> 
> Thanks again!


Those must be settings for a board from long ago? lol no such settings that I know of on this board. My fans are manually controlled via fan controller, and my pumps run at 60-75% throttle controlled by motherboard.

Those sounds like the old intel speed step settings though I vaguely remember...

threadrippers don't have those settings..If you leave it on auto OC mode it will allow speed stepping based on load, but manual mode locks the frequency and voltage in so it runs that frequency even if it is doing absolutely nothing.

My advice is if you plan on running those settings: test it thoroughly with prime95 smallFFT test and make sure your cooler can handle it. Those settings don't allow the CPU to throttle back for temp. It will hold speed till it crashes. keep HWinfo64 up while testing and watch that tdie temp closely. if it climbs too high too quickly you need to kill the test and dial back settings till you can run prime95 without burning down your home/office  

I was only able to get 3.8GHz prime95 stable on an AIO cooler. custom loop gave the extra cooling capacity to hit 4.05GHz prime95 stable. could never get 4.1+ prime stable. just too much heat. radiators and pumps are up to the task, but just not able to pull heat away from those dies fast enough. at this point delid or exotic cooling is required for my rig to push any more out of it with stability and I'm not taking it that far lol.


----------



## Keith Myers

I have a 2920X so have those improvements over Gen. 1 TR. I have the Asrock Fatality Pro Gaming mobo. Pretty happy with it. I run a PBO Level 2 on it and can get it to hold my normal 65% BOINC crunching load on all cores around 4050 - 4150Mhz with the Vcore on Auto with LLC2. The load temps stay right under the 68° C Tjmax setting, normally around 67.5°C. and the load voltage around 1.35 - 1.39V. I have a custom 360mm rad cooling loop for the cpu. I have the memory running at 3400CL14 Fast timings with 16GB. Host runs 4 gpus on their own loop and I crunch both cpu and gpu tasks. My highest production host in my farm.


----------



## PriestOfSin

Fun fact: The stock fan in the Wraith Ripper is backwards... dunno if mine is an isolated incident, but I had to open the cooler and re-orient it a few days ago. Temps have improved by about 10C on idle and load, boosts seem slightly higher but it could be placebo.


----------



## HuggyBear

Mektor said:


> Those must be settings for a board from long ago? lol no such settings that I know of on this board. My fans are manually controlled via fan controller, and my pumps run at 60-75% throttle controlled by motherboard.
> 
> Those sounds like the old intel speed step settings though I vaguely remember...
> 
> threadrippers don't have those settings..If you leave it on auto OC mode it will allow speed stepping based on load, but manual mode locks the frequency and voltage in so it runs that frequency even if it is doing absolutely nothing.
> 
> My advice is if you plan on running those settings: test it thoroughly with prime95 smallFFT test and make sure your cooler can handle it. Those settings don't allow the CPU to throttle back for temp. It will hold speed till it crashes. keep HWinfo64 up while testing and watch that tdie temp closely. if it climbs too high too quickly you need to kill the test and dial back settings till you can run prime95 without burning down your home/office
> 
> I was only able to get 3.8GHz prime95 stable on an AIO cooler. custom loop gave the extra cooling capacity to hit 4.05GHz prime95 stable. could never get 4.1+ prime stable. just too much heat. radiators and pumps are up to the task, but just not able to pull heat away from those dies fast enough. at this point delid or exotic cooling is required for my rig to push any more out of it with stability and I'm not taking it that far lol.


Those settings are there on my board under CPU features and I thought that all AMD boards had the 'Cool and Quiet' feature/setting. I could be wrong about that though.

After a bit of messing around today I think that I've hit the limit due to my cooling. The AIO just isn't enough to handle the temperature increases at the pace that it needs to. I'm going to look at this on the bright side though, gives me a reason (excuse) to do a custom water cooling mod. For now I'm going to leave it backed down to the last stable (Prime95 stable) 3.7. The whole thing is for the fun of it anyway since this rig at defaults is a beast anyway.


----------



## Keith Myers

> I thought that all AMD boards had the 'Cool and Quiet' feature/setting. I could be wrong about that though.


They do. AMD changed the name that "Cool n' Quiet" goes by in the BIOS. It is now called PSS Support and is found in the CPU section of the BIOS.

Fun fact. Geekbench4 results for engineering samples of the next generation of Threadripper called Castle Peak have been logged.

Looks like the first sample was running all 64 cores between 4150 - 4200 Mhz. The second sample logged clocks between 4150 - 4350 Mhz.
https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/14281644.gb4
https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/14281648.gb4


----------



## adam3234

Keith Myers said:


> They do. AMD changed the name that "Cool n' Quiet" goes by in the BIOS. It is now called PSS Support and is found in the CPU section of the BIOS.
> 
> Fun fact. Geekbench4 results for engineering samples of the next generation of Threadripper called Castle Peak have been logged.
> 
> Looks like the first sample was running all 64 cores between 4150 - 4200 Mhz. The second sample logged clocks between 4150 - 4350 Mhz.
> https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/14281644.gb4
> https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/14281648.gb4


The memory latency looks very concerning. The first sample logged single thread memory latency of 105.4 ns and multi thread latency of 160.3 ns. The second sample logged single thread memory latency of 111.4 ns and multi thread latency of 105.4 ns. My threadripper 1950x memory latency is about 90 something ns in UMA mode and about 68 ns in NUMA mode(which is how I normally run the 1950x). The CPU is running at stock settings and the RAM is set to 2733 Mhz 12-12-12-32-44. The memory latency in the virtual machines running on my 1950x is about 71 ns to 73 ns. The all core speeds look promising but memory latency looks very disappointing.


----------



## Keith Myers

adam3234 said:


> The memory latency looks very concerning. The first sample logged single thread memory latency of 105.4 ns and multi thread latency of 160.3 ns. The second sample logged single thread memory latency of 111.4 ns and multi thread latency of 105.4 ns. My threadripper 1950x memory latency is about 90 something ns in UMA mode and about 68 ns in NUMA mode(which is how I normally run the 1950x). The CPU is running at stock settings and the RAM is set to 2733 Mhz 12-12-12-32-44. The memory latency in the virtual machines running on my 1950x is about 71 ns to 73 ns. The all core speeds look promising but memory latency looks very disappointing.


You have no idea from the results what memory speeds they were running. That is not logged. And the tryout version does not allow comments for one to input the system configuration that is missed by the automatic hardware sniffing. They could very well have been running JEDEC 2133 for all we know.


----------



## adam3234

Keith Myers said:


> You have no idea from the results what memory speeds they were running. That is not logged. And the tryout version does not allow comments for one to input the system configuration that is missed by the automatic hardware sniffing. They could very well have been running JEDEC 2133 for all we know.


True, so there is hope for improved memory latency.


----------



## Keith Myers

*Bad news. Won't be any Threadripper Zen 2 cpus compatible with X399*

Bad news. Won't be any Threadripper Zen 2 cpus compatible with X399. See 1usmus's post.
https://www.overclock.net/forum/10-amd-cpus/1705286-ryzen-threadripper-2990wx-2970wx-2950x-2920x-owners-club-94.html#post28115794


----------



## Dotachin

Keith Myers said:


> Bad news. Won't be any Threadripper Zen 2 cpus compatible with X399. See 1usmus's post.
> https://www.overclock.net/forum/10-amd-cpus/1705286-ryzen-threadripper-2990wx-2970wx-2950x-2920x-owners-club-94.html#post28115794


I hope they do give us one even with a pcie 3.0 only i/o die.


----------



## Keith Myers

Dotachin said:


> I hope they do give us one even with a pcie 3.0 only i/o die.


Rumors so far is that is unlikely. There are three new chipset variants showing up in databases. TRX40, TRX80 and WRX80. All require new motherboard designs.


----------



## sblantipodi

Keith Myers said:


> Rumors so far is that is unlikely. There are three new chipset variants showing up in databases. TRX40, TRX80 and WRX80. All require new motherboard designs.


I would really like to know why new TR needs three different chipset.
I can understand two, one for WX ultra high end and one for base TR, but why three?


----------



## Keith Myers

sblantipodi said:


> I would really like to know why new TR needs three different chipset.
> I can understand two, one for WX ultra high end and one for base TR, but why three?


----------



## sblantipodi

Keith Myers said:


> This why.


I still don't see the difference between TRX80 and WRX80.
Does it have sense to use octa channel for a 16 cores threadripper?


----------



## keeph8n

Looks like 12-32 cores will stick to quad channel and remain as normal.

TRX80 I can see being 32/48 core setups at 8 channel memory. WRX80 possibly 64 core? 

I do look forward to testing of the new chips. Will be interesting to see how the new chips fair on LN2


----------



## Keith Myers

keeph8n said:


> Looks like 12-32 cores will stick to quad channel and remain as normal.
> 
> TRX80 I can see being 32/48 core setups at 8 channel memory. WRX80 possibly 64 core?
> 
> I do look forward to testing of the new chips. Will be interesting to see how the new chips fair on LN2


Also WRX80 is SSI CEB workstation motherboard form factor with two sockets likely.


----------



## sblantipodi

keeph8n said:


> Looks like 12-32 cores will stick to quad channel and remain as normal.
> 
> TRX80 I can see being 32/48 core setups at 8 channel memory. WRX80 possibly 64 core?
> 
> I do look forward to testing of the new chips. Will be interesting to see how the new chips fair on LN2


Why someone should buy a 12 cores threadripper when there is 16 cores mainstream 3950X?


----------



## keeph8n

sblantipodi said:


> keeph8n said:
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like 12-32 cores will stick to quad channel and remain as normal.
> 
> TRX80 I can see being 32/48 core setups at 8 channel memory. WRX80 possibly 64 core?
> 
> I do look forward to testing of the new chips. Will be interesting to see how the new chips fair on LN2
> 
> 
> 
> Why someone should buy a 12 cores threadripper when there is 16 cores mainstream 3950X?
Click to expand...

Quad channel memory, pcie lanes, etc


----------



## keeph8n

so coming from using 2950X, 2970WX, and 2990WX, using a 1st gen chip was interesting to say the least. 

The memory clocking is very very different comparatively to 2nd series. Core Frequency was fairly straight forward, but slightly unstable a bit after 5GHz. 

I probably will procure the rest of the 1st gen chips to have them in my collection and possibly do light testing with them, but I'm in NO hurry at this point. I'll stick to 2nd series and beyond at this point.


----------



## sblantipodi

keeph8n said:


> sblantipodi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> keeph8n said:
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like 12-32 cores will stick to quad channel and remain as normal.
> 
> TRX80 I can see being 32/48 core setups at 8 channel memory. WRX80 possibly 64 core?
> 
> I do look forward to testing of the new chips. Will be interesting to see how the new chips fair on LN2
> 
> 
> 
> Why someone should buy a 12 cores threadripper when there is 16 cores mainstream 3950X?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Quad channel memory, pcie lanes, etc
Click to expand...

Is quad Channel and PCI lanes enough to justify the price difference between a mainstream and a hedt system?

I hope that threadripper will give us more than only quad channel and lanes.


----------



## Keith Myers

sblantipodi said:


> Is quad Channel and PCI lanes enough to justify the price difference between a mainstream and a hedt system?
> 
> I hope that threadripper will give us more than only quad channel and lanes.


Don't hold your breath. Look at what has been announced. Only 24 core parts are going to be available. Go look at the recent AdoredTV video on why there is no availability of R9 parts. One word reason - - - - Epyc.


----------



## PriestOfSin

Possibly stupid question incoming:

I was able to snag a 2950X from a friend for stupid cheap. No reason to say no cheap. So now I have a perfectly good 1950X, and I wanted to save it for a rainy day project, maybe buy some parts for it in a year or something. Would it be prudent to purchase an X399 motherboard for it now? Being somewhat of an X58 enthusiast, I am acutely aware of how rare X58 boards got, while X58 chips were plentiful.


----------



## Keith Myers

PriestOfSin said:


> Possibly stupid question incoming:
> 
> I was able to snag a 2950X from a friend for stupid cheap. No reason to say no cheap. So now I have a perfectly good 1950X, and I wanted to save it for a rainy day project, maybe buy some parts for it in a year or something. Would it be prudent to purchase an X399 motherboard for it now? Being somewhat of an X58 enthusiast, I am acutely aware of how rare X58 boards got, while X58 chips were plentiful.


We still are in the dark whether TR3 is going to be socket TR4 pin compatible with the existing X399 boards. Doesn't sound likely with the new chipsets announced for TR3.

It might be a smart idea to stockpile an X399 board now if they become rare in the future.


----------



## PriestOfSin

Keith Myers said:


> We still are in the dark whether TR3 is going to be socket TR4 pin compatible with the existing X399 boards. Doesn't sound likely with the new chipsets announced for TR3.
> 
> It might be a smart idea to stockpile an X399 board now if they become rare in the future.


I think I will do that. Since it's just going to house a 1950X (and won't be upgraded in the future 99% chance), I'll probably just get an Asrock X399 Phantom Gaming 6 since they're super cheap. Gracias for the advice amigo!


----------



## man114

PriestOfSin said:


> I think I will do that. Since it's just going to house a 1950X (and won't be upgraded in the future 99% chance), I'll probably just get an Asrock X399 Phantom Gaming 6 since they're super cheap. Gracias for the advice amigo!


I just got one of these boards though I’ve yet to fire up the system since I’m still waiting on the SSD to arrive.

I’m building a 1920X system mainly because I had the RAM and a gtx1080 from my 1950X system when I upgraded it and the 1920X got down to $190. 

You don’t see too many people that have used one of these so there isn’t a lot out there from end users like the Taichi. The board is pretty basic looking and doesn’t include wifi if you intend on using that. It doesn’t have the most robust VRMs and the cooling is weird in that the fins of the top heatsink point downwards towards the CPU. I’m not sure how well this will cool unless you’re using an air cooler or an odd fan configuration (in my case I’m using a side panel mounted AIO since I’m using a $20 case with an odd setup). 

I should get a good idea how well the ram overclocks on it since the ram I’m using ran fine at 3466 on my 1950X in a Gigabyte gaming 7 board.


----------



## PriestOfSin

man114 said:


> I just got one of these boards though I’ve yet to fire up the system since I’m still waiting on the SSD to arrive.
> 
> I’m building a 1920X system mainly because I had the RAM and a gtx1080 from my 1950X system when I upgraded it and the 1920X got down to $190.
> 
> You don’t see too many people that have used one of these so there isn’t a lot out there from end users like the Taichi. The board is pretty basic looking and doesn’t include wifi if you intend on using that. It doesn’t have the most robust VRMs and the cooling is weird in that the fins of the top heatsink point downwards towards the CPU. I’m not sure how well this will cool unless you’re using an air cooler or an odd fan configuration (in my case I’m using a side panel mounted AIO since I’m using a $20 case with an odd setup).
> 
> I should get a good idea how well the ram overclocks on it since the ram I’m using ran fine at 3466 on my 1950X in a Gigabyte gaming 7 board.


I was planning on using the Fryzen cooler. I bought a Maingear Vybe case, so there will be triple 120mm fans on top, hopefully will create enough airflow over the board.


----------



## man114

PriestOfSin said:


> I was planning on using the Fryzen cooler. I bought a Maingear Vybe case, so there will be triple 120mm fans on top, hopefully will create enough airflow over the board.


It probably will be fine with an air cooler and top mounted fans. I posted a pic I dunno if you can see how weird the VRM heatsink orientation is for allowing air flow. The design really isn’t great for airflow in a conventional setup. It’s weirder they used the design with a less robust VRM to make a budget board. Now my $20 case mounts the PSU directly over the top old fashioned style and has dual 120mms on the side panel which will be fairly atypical for cooling. Since the gtx1080 I’m using is a blower I think it should get decent ventilation even if I have to add a fan to the back. I’m not putting the fans or anything in yet until the hard drive gets here, then I’ll start fooling around. 

I’m only using the thing as an upstairs media server when it’s done so it’s not likely to be overclocked much if at all depending on what the temps are.


----------



## cybrnook

I am sure everyone already knows, but 1920x is $200 free shipping from Amazon. Killer deal for a great CPU!

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B074CBJHCT/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Doing my third TR4 build with this around the Taichi M.


----------



## man114

cybrnook said:


> I am sure everyone already knows, but 1920x is $200 free shipping from Amazon. Killer deal for a great CPU!
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B074CBJHCT/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> 
> Doing my third TR4 build with this around the Taichi M.


The other day they went as low as $190. I’ve been watching because I’d probably do a 3rd myself and replace one more old computer if I get a good enough deal. I just want to see how the Asrock phantom gaming 6 works as a board though first.


----------



## cybrnook

I think even at $200 that, to me, is already the "good enough deal"  Especially when you compare it to the current gen 3900X for example, also a 12 core, but priced at $500+. Just do it, before they are gone !!! Buy now, regret later......


----------



## KyadCK

cybrnook said:


> I think even at $200 that, to me, is already the "good enough deal"  Especially when you compare it to the current gen 3900X for example, also a 12 core, but priced at $500+. Just do it, before they are gone !!! Buy now, regret later......


Keep in mind the cost of a total platform and improvements made over time.

$200 for the CPU, yes, but unless you are replacing a 1900X, then you'll need a new motherboard, and if you want the best out of your new chip then you'll need to get some expensive RAM as the 3200 c14 kits do not come cheap. You will also have NUMA issues, as well as higher power consumption, and a heavy limitation on coolers available.

The 3900X may be $500, but a 3*7*00x is a 1920X's equal in a lot of multi-threaded tasks. A 3900X will slot into most cheaper X470 or even B450 boards, are much less picky about RAM, and will certainly be better at single threaded tasks and power consumption.

Need to take everything into consideration, not just the cost of a CPU.


----------



## cybrnook

KyadCK said:


> Keep in mind the cost of a total platform and improvements made over time.
> 
> $200 for the CPU, yes, but unless you are replacing a 1900X, then you'll need a new motherboard, and if you want the best out of your new chip then you'll need to get some expensive RAM as the 3200 c14 kits do not come cheap. You will also have NUMA issues, as well as higher power consumption, and a heavy limitation on coolers available.
> 
> The 3900X may be $500, but a 3*7*00x is a 1920X's equal in a lot of multi-threaded tasks. A 3900X will slot into most cheaper X470 or even B450 boards, are much less picky about RAM, and will certainly be better at single threaded tasks and power consumption.
> 
> Need to take everything into consideration, not just the cost of a CPU.


Not trying to start a debate, just pointing out the price of the 1920x. With that said, there are some things in your statements that are slightly misleading, at least to me, but this is all with community love so I mean it all in a non offending way.

1. X399 MB's like the mentioned Asrock Gaming 6 are in ~$250 range, that's par for a Motherboard that's worth it's weight, not breaking the bank there. $200 CPU + $250 MB = $450, that's NOT bad for 60 PCIe lanes, 12 core/ 24 thread, bifurcation support, IOMMU grouping support for virtualization...
2. 3200 C14 Kits (and all RAM) prices are not sky high anymore. As well, B-Die is not even the "in" thing anymore, it's D and E die, and kits going up to 4000+, which is the big range about the latest Zen anyways, right? So buying a B-Die kit vs a newer 4000+ Kit is really tit for tat.
3. NUMA and Power (do these together), this argument you should really reserve for the 2nd Gen (not first) TR4, and really it's only 2 x chips, the 2970WX (which I own) and the 2990WX. All chips prior to that have no "NUMA" issues as the chiplets are on dedicated memory controllers, and that was the big argument with Wendell and the Windows scheduler, was when the cores on the non-dedicated memory controller chiplet had to traverse. As well, the "power" argument really goes along with the same two chips, 2970 and 2990. My 2950X and 2970X have been more than efficient with my manual OC, and running sub 1.3 volts.

And who's going to spend $500+ on the 3900X and slap it into a $80 - $100 MB? That just seems a bit unbalanced and no pcie 4, and you still end up more in the 3900X setup vs the $450 above. Either setup needs memory, so.....

Plus, X399 is a pretty mature platform at this point, non of the boosting issues like with the latest release. C'mon mang, it's AMD fine wine, haha.


----------



## KyadCK

cybrnook said:


> Not trying to start a debate, just pointing out the price of the 1920x. With that said, there are some things in your statements that are slightly misleading, at least to me, but this is all with community love so I mean it all in a non offending way.
> 
> 1. X399 MB's like the mentioned Asrock Gaming 6 are in ~$250 range, that's par for a Motherboard that's worth it's weight, not breaking the bank there. $200 CPU + $250 MB = $450, that's NOT bad for 60 PCIe lanes, 12 core/ 24 thread, bifurcation support, IOMMU grouping support for virtualization...
> 2. 3200 C14 Kits (and all RAM) prices are not sky high anymore. As well, B-Die is not even the "in" thing anymore, it's D and E die, and kits going up to 4000+, which is the big range about the latest Zen anyways, right? So buying a B-Die kit vs a newer 4000+ Kit is really tit for tat.
> 3. NUMA and Power (do these together), this argument you should really reserve for the 2nd Gen (not first) TR4, and really it's only 2 x chips, the 2970WX (which I own) and the 2990WX. All chips prior to that have no "NUMA" issues as the chiplets are on dedicated memory controllers, and that was the big argument with Wendell and the Windows scheduler, was when the cores on the non-dedicated memory controller chiplet had to traverse. As well, the "power" argument really goes along with the same two chips, 2970 and 2990. My 2950X and 2970X have been more than efficient with my manual OC, and running sub 1.3 volts.
> 
> And who's going to spend $500+ on the 3900X and slap it into a $80 - $100 MB? That just seems a bit unbalanced and no pcie 4, and you still end up more in the 3900X setup vs the $450 above. Either setup needs memory, so.....
> 
> Plus, X399 is a pretty mature platform at this point, non of the boosting issues like with the latest release. C'mon mang, it's AMD fine wine, haha.


$250 is a lot for a X470/B450 motherboard which price under half of that. While I make use of nearly every lane on my board, even your average OCNer only has one GPU and one NVMe drive, IF they have an NVMe drive.

4000 kits are great... but not what you use with Ryzen 1st gen. The specific kits best used with 1st gen are now rare unless you want to manually set every timing.

A 19*0X is two chips, and two NUMA domains. 1st gen EPYC is 4 NUMAs per chip. The 2990WX has the additional problem of having two dies that do not have direct memory access, but that is not what a NUMA domain is. This will explain.

Power is power. A 1920X has a much higher TDP, load power, and idle power as compared to a Ryzen 3 chip, and a large part of that is 14nm.









Plenty of people on OCN if you have been paying attention. Unbalanced has nothing to do with it, it works or it doesn't. Ram is also not an equal cost, because you can not get 3200 14-14-14 in 4GB sticks. Are we assuming 32GB even for the smaller platform?

FineWine only applies to things that get updates. Ryzen 3 is getting updates. Ryzen 1 is not. 

------------------

I own a 1950X, one of the most expensive X399 boards, two 1080tis, a 900p, and the internal network for my desktops are 10gbps and for my server 80gbps. My next chip will be a 16c or 24c TR3 chip if it fits in X399. 

I am aware of the benefits of the larger platform, and that includes virtualization. That does not change my argument that the whole picture is needed before someone can say a CPU is a good deal because that one part is cheap, nor does it make what I said misleading.


----------



## man114

I’m not actually sure how this Phantom Gaming 6 actually is. It’ll be a few more days before I get the hard drive and WiFi card and put it together once and for all. Once I run some temps I’ll know better. 

How much you want to cut costs probably depends on your purposes. I’m using an Asetek cooler in the current build, IBuypower occasionally sells them dirt cheap on eBay (I dunno if they have any currently I bought it several months ago). It’s not my preferred cooling solution but it’s cheap (well I paid less than most air coolers). Of course if I’m using a $20 case my primary concern is cost. 

I am using 16gb of Team Vulcan ram which was b die 3000. I tested it stable to 3466 in the gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7. I mean I’ve used non QVL ram in my Gigabyte 1950X with success (I currently have 32gb of Adata spectrix running at 3333). In this case though I know the team Vulcan ram is good for the platform. 

Ultimately you can build a 1920X for less than the 3700X or 3900X if you use the Asrock Gaming 6. 

The phantom Gaming 6 board is really going to be the possible issue of future upgrades since it’s really only designed for 180w CPUs. Sure it may run a 2970 or 2990 but for how long or reliably? Even if the new TRs work on existing boards who knows if it’ll even have enough in the VRMs for them. You’d have to spend another $50 to get another non used board. I think the Aorus pro is the next cheapest and that’s an led stripped gaming 7 combined with the networking from the designare and no WiFi.

If you’re gonna be fine with a 1920X for a long while it’s a good deal. For me it’s for a bedroom and providing media to 2-3 TVs and possibly some gaming before bed, more than enough for what I plan on doing with it.


----------



## PriestOfSin

man114 said:


> It probably will be fine with an air cooler and top mounted fans. I posted a pic I dunno if you can see how weird the VRM heatsink orientation is for allowing air flow. The design really isn’t great for airflow in a conventional setup. It’s weirder they used the design with a less robust VRM to make a budget board. Now my $20 case mounts the PSU directly over the top old fashioned style and has dual 120mms on the side panel which will be fairly atypical for cooling. Since the gtx1080 I’m using is a blower I think it should get decent ventilation even if I have to add a fan to the back. I’m not putting the fans or anything in yet until the hard drive gets here, then I’ll start fooling around.
> 
> I’m only using the thing as an upstairs media server when it’s done so it’s not likely to be overclocked much if at all depending on what the temps are.


hmm. Well, I don't think I'm going to get mine finished until the holidays, but I will definitely let you know how the VRM temps are. Honestly I was thinking about just ripping off the stock """heatsink""" on the VRMs and adding my own- seeing as how a motherboard """heatsink""" these days is basically a decorative hunk of aluminium.

I've got my fans coming next week, so I'll install all of them and post a pic of how she looks.


----------



## Keith Myers

*Monolithic heatsinks bad - finned heatsinks good*

Most consumer boards are designed for "bling" and not functionality. All the latest boards from the past several years have these monolithic chunks of metal on the VRM's simply to look chic and have actual very poor surface area for their supposed job of heat dissipation. The one series of boards that eschews the monolithic metalwork lately has been Gigabyte Aorus. Their VRM heatsinks are actual finned heat sinks with large amount of radiative area. I applaud that design decision. I wish more board manufacturers returned to the "form follows function" ethic.


----------



## man114

Keith Myers said:


> Most consumer boards are designed for "bling" and not functionality. All the latest boards from the past several years have these monolithic chunks of metal on the VRM's simply to look chic and have actual very poor surface area for their supposed job of heat dissipation. The one series of boards that eschews the monolithic metalwork lately has been Gigabyte Aorus. Their VRM heatsinks are actual finned heat sinks with large amount of radiative area. I applaud that design decision. I wish more board manufacturers returned to the "form follows function" ethic.


There is no reason you can’t make an interesting looking heatsink like the Aorus X399 gaming 7 board that in at least some fashion allows airflow. The ones like the Asrock Phantom Gaming 6 though could use a look at. Considering it has the weakest VRM over the x399 boards it’s heatsink isn’t exactly well designed at least in terms of airflow. While connected via a heatpipe the side by the IO is pretty big probably enough so that the mass is helpful the top part is finned downward. It would clearly cool best with an air cooler (maybe Asrock bets on this in the budget range of things?).

It applies to more than VRMs, ram heat spreaders, m.2 heatsinks, more and more of it is designed more for the aesthetics these days. It’s like RGB on everything. There is no reason you can’t have both. I think the Gigabyte gaming 7 was a good example of it, aside from the Foxconn socket issues and their lousy BIOS support the board itself is not actually badly designed. If you had a BIOS that worked well with your RAM and other hardware it runs at good temps and is very stable in spite of RGB on everything.

My stuff to finish the Phantom Gaming 6 system should all be in this week so I’ll know better how the temps hold up. I’m hopefully optimistic it isn’t too bad and the board is decent, I have one other system that needs to run roughly 14 hard drives and I’d possibly build another while the CPU prices are low.


----------



## man114

Ok I finished (mostly) the Phantom Gaming 6 1920X build. Board interface is quite basic. The VRMs keep decent temp (but cramming into a small case with a top mount PSU probably helps). Team Vulcan B die 3000 ram went to 3333 without issue just as it did in the Gigabyte gaming 7. Seems like a serviceable if basic board. Benchmarked quite well. Went and bought another got one more old computer I’m gonna retire.


----------



## xkm1948

TR3 CPU will not come to X399

https://www.techpowerup.com/259993/...compatible-with-1st-and-2nd-gen-threadrippers


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## man114

xkm1948 said:


> TR3 CPU will not come to X399
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/259993/...compatible-with-1st-and-2nd-gen-threadrippers


If they’re pin compatible like the Epyc the new chipset may just because they have New PCIe 4.0 or the chips require more power than the current VRMs can handle, however if that’s the case there’s no proof the mobo vendors won’t push out a BIOS update anyway. That’s like the cheap Asrock systems I’m building (that I really have no intent of upgrading even to the 2nd gen chips, I just want them to function for a long period of time doing their duty as small media servers so I don’t have to mess with them) it hasn’t stopped people from putting 2990s in them even though the VRM really isn’t designed for it, and despite that I haven’t seen anyone complaining they burned one out doing it anywhere. It may mean you can pick up a cheap mobo, I mean an X399 will be fine for a lot of tasks for quite a while.


----------



## PriestOfSin

man114 said:


> Ok I finished (mostly) the Phantom Gaming 6 1920X build. Board interface is quite basic. The VRMs keep decent temp (but cramming into a small case with a top mount PSU probably helps). Team Vulcan B die 3000 ram went to 3333 without issue just as it did in the Gigabyte gaming 7. Seems like a serviceable if basic board. Benchmarked quite well. Went and bought another got one more old computer I’m gonna retire.


Same. I went cheap on my RAM, just got a basic Corsair 3000MHz CL15 kit, not able to get past 2666, but it's not a huge deal. Overall I think the board is pretty OK, but a stock 1950X won't stress these VRMs much. I don't really like the way the Fryzen looks, but performance is OK.


----------



## Offler

cybrnook said:


> I am sure everyone already knows, but 1920x is $200 free shipping from Amazon. Killer deal for a great CPU!
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B074CBJHCT/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> 
> Doing my third TR4 build with this around the Taichi M.


I can only recommend Taichi X399M for "little big build".

http://slayershrine.wz.cz/zoom.jpg
http://slayershrine.wz.cz/top.jpg
http://slayershrine.wz.cz/rear.jpg

I picked the smallest TR4 - 1900x because i am fine with 8 physical cores, but i wanted 4 memory channels for some time. Board itself offers 3 full PCI-E 3.0 16x slots and 3 full NVMe 3.0 x4 slots without any need to turn any of them off. Onboard Intel NICs and Wifi are also really good, and quality of basic onboard Realtek is actually stunning.

If you pick Fractal Design Node 804, you would be able to use any PCI-E slot for GPU (two at a time, 3 if you get a riser and a spot where to mount it). On screenshots is AMD FuryX with watercooler. GPU itself is on mainboard while its radiator is in the second chamber - really great for low temperatures. In time I replaced it with AMD Radeon VII which is overall better card, yet i messed airflow a lot and temps on CPU, RAM and VRMs went up.


----------



## x7007

Did anyone notice Sluggish and slowdowns even on desktop explorer since 1803-1903? I fixed it by disabling Spectre protection using Inspectre program.


----------



## Offler

x7007 said:


> Did anyone notice Sluggish and slowdowns even on desktop explorer since 1803-1903? I fixed it by disabling Spectre protection using Inspectre program.


Not in relation towards any Ryzen cores, but those were related to Nvidia drivers. Spectre protection since 1803 or Retpoline may cause driver to run out of sync with CPUs. If there is a way how to safely disable this feature it would fix the issue.


----------



## x7007

Offler said:


> Not in relation towards any Ryzen cores, but those were related to Nvidia drivers. Spectre protection since 1803 or Retpoline may cause driver to run out of sync with CPUs. If there is a way how to safely disable this feature it would fix the issue.




I disabled Spectre so Retpoline doesn't work. but this fixed my issue, also had Windows Sandbox slowing my computer to crawl.. don't understand why.


----------



## man114

I’m currently trying to do a 1900x since the CPU hit $150 but the second Phantom Gaming was DOA (had a lotes socket, first one was Foxconn so definitely different batches). Just waiting for the replacement. Basically just replacing an old i7-2600 rig. Main reason for the 1900x is I need to run 14 (and possibly more) hard drives on top of the video card. The i7-2600 was fast enough for the work but putting more hard drives online wouldn’t have worked. Should be more than a tad faster too.

Back to my earlier point, seeing as they made enough boards to use both lotes and Foxconn sockets so there probably are quite a few of these budget boards floating around if future availability is a concern.

Build is almost identical to the 1920x build, same $20 case, only differences are ram (really really cheap Casper “electronchn” 2666 from aliexpress), a 980ti, and a 1000w PSU. Both PSUs were from a dirt cheap evga b stock sale months ago initially bought as spares, and I used the 850 instead of the 1000 in the 1920 because the 980ti is much more power hungry. Ultimately 90% of the time it’s going to be a media server, maybe some casual evening games, fancy isn’t really required.


----------



## johnadams2

*1950X + ASRock X399 Taichi + H105 + G.Skill FlareX320014D Temps*

Could someone verify my temps and let me know if those temps look good?


----------



## josephimports

johnadams2 said:


> Could someone verify my temps and let me know if those temps look good?


Yep, everything looking nice. Are those temperatures from stress testing?


----------



## johnadams2

josephimports said:


> Yep, everything looking nice. Are those temperatures from stress testing?


Thanks! 

No just normal operation with 60% cpu utilization.


----------



## kairi_zeroblade

I would like to ask everyone's opinion whether its still significant to own a TR 1920x at this point in time?? or should I just build a new setup?? I can get 2nd hand for cheaps/on par to a new Ryzen 7 setup but welp the 1920x still got more cores and more power compared to a 3700x probably..


----------



## Offler

kairi_zeroblade said:


> I would like to ask everyone's opinion whether its still significant to own a TR 1920x at this point in time?? or should I just build a new setup?? I can get 2nd hand for cheaps/on par to a new Ryzen 7 setup but welp the 1920x still got more cores and more power compared to a 3700x probably..


Zen2 were actually much better in single core performance compared to 1st gen. Question is whether you value single or multicore performance and memory bandwidth. My personal reason to go for 1900x (smallest TR) was to have 4 memory channels, while TR4 at that time offered highest boost on low CPU count.

I would build another system based on 19X0 without any hesitation because the last one turned out to be really good, but because there were few issues on microcode level of 1st gen Ryzens i would try 2XX0 or 3XX0 series, if there would be cheap low-core count CPU (8) with 4 memory channels.


----------



## newls1

any "clue" when the zen3 based threadripper cpu's might come out? is it possible this year like the zen3 based am4 cpus? Only curious cause im eyeing a 3960x at microcenter for 1169$ but didnt want to buy it yet "IF" the new threadrippers will be out within years end. Thanks for any info.


----------



## kairi_zeroblade

Offler said:


> Zen2 were actually much better in single core performance compared to 1st gen. Question is whether you value single or multicore performance and memory bandwidth. My personal reason to go for 1900x (smallest TR) was to have 4 memory channels, while TR4 at that time offered highest boost on low CPU count.
> 
> I would build another system based on 19X0 without any hesitation because the last one turned out to be really good, but because there were few issues on microcode level of 1st gen Ryzens i would try 2XX0 or 3XX0 series, if there would be cheap low-core count CPU (8) with 4 memory channels.


well most likelihood use will be code compilation and a gaming PC at the same time (when I get bored) the reason too I was so enticed on TR was the quad channel memory..well unfortunately the 2nd gen TR's are still sky high from where I am at..


----------



## newls1

newls1 said:


> any "clue" when the zen3 based threadripper cpu's might come out? is it possible this year like the zen3 based am4 cpus? Only curious cause im eyeing a 3960x at microcenter for 1169$ but didnt want to buy it yet "IF" the new threadrippers will be out within years end. Thanks for any info.


anyone shed some light on this?


----------



## Offler

kairi_zeroblade said:


> well most likelihood use will be code compilation and a gaming PC at the same time (when I get bored) the reason too I was so enticed on TR was the quad channel memory..well unfortunately the 2nd gen TR's are still sky high from where I am at..


1900X is dirt cheap near me. 133 Euro.


----------



## Brutalist_Shak

*1950x too slow*

Greetings everyone

I long suspected there was something off with my 1950x but when I saw corona benchmark results people get with the exact same systems the difference is undeniably too high.
I've never done any overclocking before but apparently some tweaking needs to be done since I freeze after just a couple of seconds of Prime95 on stock settings. The temperatures under load are around 60C.

CPU: AMD YD195XA8AEWOF Ryzen Threadripper 1950X (16-core/32-thread) Desktop Processor
Motherboards: ASRock Socket TR4/ AMD X399/ DDR4 Wi-Fi/A&2GbE/ MicroATX Motherboard (X399M Taichi)
RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 DRAM 2400MHz (PC4-19200) C14 memory kit for DDR4 Systems
PSU: CORSAIR RMi Series, RM1000i, 1000 Watt, 80+ Gold Certified, Fully Modular - Digital Power Supply
Cooler: Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3, Premium-Grade CPU Cooler for AMD sTRX4/TR4/SP3 (140mm, Brown)
NVMe2: Samsung (MZ-V7E500BW) 970 EVO SSD 500GB - M.2 NVMe Interface Internal Solid State Drive with V-NAND Technology, Black/Red
GPU: Strix 1080ti

Bench results: https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/1...DO7vdFwq_2jG6Biylfb=w1598-h1009-no?authuser=0

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/d...sPCT3hpe-E1yFsC-hC_2=w1655-h613-no?authuser=0

Please give me your suggestions on how to optimize performance if it's at all possible.
Thanks, Shak


----------



## TheSocialHermit

johnadams2 said:


> Thanks!
> 
> No just normal operation with 60% cpu utilization.


Those temps are a little on the high-side then. The Corsair AIO coolers tend to not cover the entire IHS and this can lead to some less-tan-desired temps but only at 60% with normal use, those are a little high.

It may be worth it to try to re-paste the cooler and try a reseat to see if that would help but I use an Enermax Liqtech TR4 II 360 on a 1920X currently and a 1950X previously, which tend to keep my temps under 60C at stress-tested loads. There have been some reports of issues with the Enermax Liqtech coolers gumming up due to quality issues and leading to terrible performance after a year or two of usage but mine has been working fine for about 2 years now.


----------



## ironcurtain

I have an old, still kicking system, running a 1920x, a CMW64GX4M4C3000C15 kit (Corsair VENGEANCE® RGB PRO 64GB (4 x 16GB) DDR4 DRAM 3000MHz C15), a HX850i PSU and the M/B is the ASRock x399 Fatal1ty.

The village idiot is the cooler, an AIO I got when I did not know better... Hydro Series _H110i. _I know it does not cover the entire surface of the package, and so on. Unfortunately with the current situation my plans to either move to a 5950x system are up in the air due to pricing nonsense and stock problems. I am trying to get more juice out of the system.

XMP profile selected and 1.35v with DDR4-3000 is seemingly OK, settles at C17 timings all across.

So far, I have not had luck with 4000/4Ghz using 1.31875V and the temps ramped up to 100C during a Prime95 test, and then locked up.
I'm now looking for options that do not break the bank too much, possibly replacing the cooler. But if any other users here have a similar system and want to share their data/configs, I am all ears and it will be much appreciated.


----------



## Offler

I went for 1900x which has less cores and aircooling by Noctua. After clocking to 4000 and proper tuning (enabling few things in bios add up to 20 percent) it goes up to 76°C. Does not lock up but still way too hot. NH-U14S TR4-SP3


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## OrionBG

Offler said:


> I went for 1900x which has less cores and aircooling by Noctua. After clocking to 4000 and proper tuning (enabling few things in bios add up to 20 percent) it goes up to 76°C. Does not lock up but still way too hot. NH-U14S TR4-SP3


Actually, for an air-cooled overclocked Threadripper 19xx, this temperature is quite good!


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## Offler

OrionBG said:


> Actually, for an air-cooled overclocked Threadripper 19xx, this temperature is quite good!


Actually i took this cooler:








NH-U12S TR4-SP3


Continuing the legacy of Noctua’s classic NH-U-series, which has received more than a thousand awards and recommendations from international hardware websites and magazines, the NH-U12S has become a benchmark for slim, highly compatible 120mm single tower coolers. The TR4-SP3 version is a...




noctua.at





Then its on mATX board, in a dual-chambered case, while GPU radiator is in second chamber. First chamber has 7x 120mm fans in total (3 intake front and top, 2 exhaust top and back, 2 on the cooler itself).

Its completely bonkers for an air cooling solution, and the cooler is literally fed fresh air.


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## twobombs

Came here to look for OCL levels achieved. got a Chinese Openbox 1920x clocked at [email protected] on an Arctic cooler tested and advised by Craft Computing






Package power according to HW info approaches 240W. Powersocket System Idle vs CPU Load is 120w vs 380W

As this is an experimental quantum computing build not a lot of costs were made:
[euros] 150 on the board, 240 on the CPU, 60 on the memory and 50 on the storage ( NVMe and SSD ) 45 on the cooler.

Oh, almost forgot. The little geen monster in there is a K80, that should do all the heavy lifting. I like this processor, want more. Next one just might be an EPYC.


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## Prophet4NO1

Quantum computing build? Ummm... What? Quantum computers are not normal computers. In fact they run at crazy cold temps and on specialized chips custom made for the task. So, not really sure what you are trying to do with this machine.


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## elefantopia

Hello everyone.
I am building a Threadripper system as a NAS.
Having no limit of pcie x16 is nice.
And there ends my haiku.
The system is a 1920x on a X399M Taichi with 2x quad m.2 cards in bufurcation mode and a 455A 100Gbe mellanox.
I was wondering if anyone else had built a fast NAS with these chips.
Cheers.


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## Prophet4NO1

I have been looking at upgrading my TrueNAS server. One of the things I was looking at was Threadripper, just for tall the PCIe for expansion cards. 

What are you doing where you need and can take advantage of 100Gb on a NAS?


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## elefantopia

Prophet4NO1 said:


> I have been looking at upgrading my TrueNAS server. One of the things I was looking at was Threadripper, just for tall the PCIe for expansion cards.


I'm benchmarking mvme striping and running into odd results that indicate there is a bottleneck in that orgy of pcie. You can fill x16 lanes with drives but past that it starts dropping. Could be a windows thing though. 


Prophet4NO1 said:


> What are you doing where you need and can take advantage of 100Gb on a NAS?


Video editing.


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## Prophet4NO1

My use case is a bit less intense. I just need lanes for LSI cards for spinning rust and another with a couple NVMe drives for caching. Lots of video storage, not so much on the editing side.


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## elefantopia

Prophet4NO1 said:


> My use case is a bit less intense. I just need lanes for LSI cards for spinning rust and another with a couple NVMe drives for caching. Lots of video storage, not so much on the editing side.


Makes your life a whole lot easier. I discovered that no desktop motherboard can do 100+gpu so i settled for 50. Really, this whole NAS thing is ridiculously overcomplicating in my case: I should just add gen4 m.2 sticks and be merry with my 6GBs. I just love building.
LSI better than cpu Raid?


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## Prophet4NO1

Generally, yes. Especially if you plan to run anything more complicated like RAID5. In my case they are just fancy expander boards. I flash them to IT mode since I am using TrueNAS. TrueNAS uses ZFS for the file system and that wants direct HDD access for all of it's fancy voodoo. The LSI cards are just a relatively cheap way to add lots of SATA/SAS to a server since you can get older ones on the cheap from used servers.


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