# [Twitter] Jen-Hsun introduces the new NVIDIA TITAN X



## WaXmAn

See it HERE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y02kptTItj8&feature=share


----------



## seabiscuit68

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *970Rules*
> 
> https://twitter.com/nvidia/status/756312110590820353
> 
> More info is coming soon!
> 
> Will post all incoming specs as we get it.


Interesting choice of name. Let's see how it plays out for them, Cotton.

GDDR5X.....


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Titan X? Really?


----------



## Yuhfhrh

I can't believe they're going to call it Titan X again, at least add a 2 or something.


----------



## NuclearPeace

Bad name. This is going to get confused a lot with the old Titan X. Just name it Titan P and the next one Titan V.

Anyway, I hope that AMD hits back hard because NVIDIA charging $1,000 for a single GPU is a trend that needs to die.


----------



## SlackerITGuy

So no HBM2?


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Personally waiting for HBM2 cards.


----------



## CallsignVega

Holy crap, already? I wonder how close release is, definitely going to get one of these bad boys.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

I somewhat regret getting a lot of RX 480s.

Should've jumped on the nVidia bandwagon and saved up for the Titan


----------



## GorillaSceptre

I think they're dropping the Ti branding and are going to be doing what AMD did with the Fury.. Titan X is the big one, and regular Titan later on.









Makes far more sense separating their price tiers that way.

Nvidia are really twisting the knife on AMD..


----------



## NuclearPeace

Unfortunately no. It seems like NVIDIA doesn't think its worth using HBM yet.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NuclearPeace*
> 
> Unfortunately no. It seems like NVIDIA doesn't think its worth using HBM yet.


G5X is more then enough but I wanted to see what they can go with HBM2 especially on the very high end. They can get away with G5X for another generation because they currently only use 10GHz and G5X can do 14GHz.


----------



## yesitsmario

Titan X 2016..


----------



## ZealotKi11er

We shall call it *Titan XP*.


----------



## sammkv

HOLY green balls of fire!


----------



## Profiled

Beats Titan X SLI?


----------



## twitchyzero

*sigh* where dat HBM2?!

really dont want to wait until late 2017/2018 because by then Volta will surely be around the corner.


----------



## 12Cores

I guess they could not wait for HBM2, minimum price $1,299. I think we all need to be pulling for AMD to release a high end part soon, no competition is never a good thing for consumers.


----------



## FattysGoneWild

Herp Derp in for 4 to raise my e-peen status!














To be serious though. Pricing is out of control and Nvidia has no limit!


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Titan X G5X Xtra [email protected]


----------



## CallsignVega

I've got dibs on $1,199 at launch.


----------



## twitchyzero

oh well...2GB VRAM trying to run 6000x1080 for another year or two it seems


----------



## ZealotKi11er

The nice thing is this card will have huge OC headroom. ~ 15XXMHz Stock.


----------



## CallsignVega




----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> The nice thing is this card will have huge OC headroom. ~ 15XXMHz Stock.


I doubt voltage will be unlocked.

Should still be faster than 1070 SLi.


----------



## CallsignVega

Launches August 2nd! It's almost here...


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> The nice thing is this card will have huge OC headroom. ~ 15XXMHz Stock.


Not if they don't sell custom designs.

Also, August 2 release date?


----------



## CallsignVega

http://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2016/7/21/12254488/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-gpu-announced


----------



## Slomo4shO

Only 3584 cuda cores. It is a cut down GP100. Will likely see a fully unlocked Titan X Black.



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> The nice thing is this card will have huge OC headroom. ~ 15XXMHz Stock.


Will likely be power or thermally capped.


----------



## looniam

on the nvidia site:

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal


----------



## 12Cores

Looks like amd will announce something on Monday at the Capsaicin event, it will probably just be 390x replacement mid-range part. I am happy that we will get our first [email protected] gpu, all be it for a kings ransom.

AMD Capsaicin Event to be held monday

http://radeon.com/Siggraph/?webSyncID=7924c179-d9c3-92e9-c970-648eeb130cb4&sessionGUID=51e817ae-a30d-1ce2-a133-687de9aab974


----------



## Jared Pace

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Only 3584 cuda cores. It is a cut down GP100. Will likely see a fully unlocked Titan X Black.
> 
> 
> Will likely be power capped.


gp100 is hbm

so this is gp102?


----------



## CaliLife17

So does this mean we will have the whole Titan/Titan Black strategy again. First Titan X is a cut down model, then the will release a Titan X Black edition, with the full 3,840 Cuda cores, and HBM2 next year?

Still.... Probably will upgrade to 2 of these anyways. But sucks we don't get full chip right off the bat.


----------



## NuclearPeace

$1,200 on something that will have a throttling reference cooler, a barebones VRM, and isn't even fully enabled? The real cherry on top is that NVIDIA will probably voltage or power lock it and keep preventing board partners from creating a superior cooler.

The Titan series sums up everything that I hate about modern hardware.


----------



## 970Rules

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jared Pace*
> 
> so this is gp102?


Yea it's GP102. Keep the links coming guys. I'm updating the OP thread.


----------



## 8472

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Only 3584 cuda cores. It is a cut down GP100. Will likely see a fully unlocked Titan X Black.
> 
> 
> Will likely be power or thermally capped.


How many cores does full Pascal have?

edit

I see that it's 3840


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jared Pace*
> 
> gp100 is hbm
> 
> so this is gp102?


Most likely. There should still be a GP102 variant that has 3840 cuda cores.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> How many cores does full Pascal have?


Fully unlocked Pascal should have 3840 cuda cores.


----------



## Pragmatist

Everyone on the rumors thread saying it wouldn't be released early because "reasons" got told... lol









JHH going full steam ahead.

Jokes aside, I'm looking forward to benchmarks.


----------



## looniam

https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/07/21/titan-x/
Quote:


> It began with a bet.
> 
> Brian Kelleher, our top hardware engineer, bet our CEO, Jen-Hsun Huang, we could get more than 10 teraflops of computing performance from a single chip. Jen-Hsun thought that was crazy.
> 
> Well, we did it. The result is crazy. And, as of today, Jen-Hsun now owes Brian a dollar.
> 
> The new NVIDIA TITAN X, introduced today, based on our new Pascal GPU architecture, is the biggest GPU ever built. It has a record-breaking 3,584 CUDA cores.
> 
> We said our GTX 1080 delivers an "irresponsible amount of performance." It was a bit reckless. But this is even more reckless.
> 
> So forget words. Here are its numbers:
> 
> 11 TFLOPS FP32
> 44 TOPS INT8 (new deep learning inferencing instruction)
> 12B transistors
> 3,584 CUDA cores at 1.53GHz (versus 3,072 cores at 1.08GHz in previous TITAN X)
> Up to 60% faster performance than previous TITAN X
> High performance engineering for maximum overclocking
> 12 GB of GDDR5X memory (480 GB/s)
> Did we go too far? Your call. Just don't call us crazy, or you might owe Brian a dollar, too.
> 
> TITAN X will be available Aug. 2 for $1,200 direct from nvidia.com in North America and Europe, and select system builders. It is coming soon to Asia.


----------



## 8472

What kind of warranty does nvidia.com have? I'll be taking the cooler off and slapping on an AIO.


----------



## CaliLife17

Hopefully we have some Waterblocks from EKWB shortly after release. How long did it take them to get them out for the 1080 launch?


----------



## FattysGoneWild

$1,200 you bet your arse Nvidia is testing this to see if they can get away with it. The black edition is even going to be more. $1,500 maybe?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Wow... that was quick. I think something may have Nvidia spooked if they are releasing their full gamut of GPUs this early on.

That being said... I will not be dumping my dual 1070's. Not a chance in hell.


----------



## Yvese

What a ridiculous price. Sad thing is people will buy it all up.

I blame AMD for being just all around terrible at competing in the high-end. Last time they were able to compete was when they released the 290 series all those years ago..


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/07/21/titan-x/
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Brian Kelleher, our top hardware engineer, bet our CEO, Jen-Hsun Huang, we could get more than 10 teraflops of computing performance from a single chip. Jen-Hsun thought that was crazy.
Click to expand...

They released said chip back in April:


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FattysGoneWild*
> 
> $1,200 you bet your arse Nvidia is testing this to see if they can get away with it. The black edition is even going to be more. $1,500 maybe?


Meh, I think the original Titan was somewhere around $1300 and the Titan X was like $1199 right? Pricing seems typical for what your getting....effectively the power of almost two 1080s without the headache of SLI.


----------



## crazysoccerman

A nice break from unexpected news that's mostly been terrorist attacks and a failed coup.


----------



## 12Cores

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> Everyone on the rumors thread saying it wouldn't be released early because "reasons" got told... lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JHH going full steam ahead.
> 
> Jokes aside, I'm looking forward to benchmarks.


Benchmarks will be nuts for this card, it will do [email protected] on a lot of games the 1080 was already very close, man amd is so far behind in this round. Nvidia has released their full stack of pascal gpu's in the space of two months, HM2 will not be in production for a few months, so Vega is possibly months away.


----------



## Jared Pace

240 texture mapping units


----------



## Star Forge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Meh, I think the original Titan was somewhere around $1300 and the Titan X was like $1199 right? Pricing seems typical for what your getting....effectively the power of almost two 1080s without the headache of SLI.


No the OG Titan was released for $999. The only consumer-grade nVidia GPU that surpassed $999 at launch was the multi-GPU Titan Z. This is the most expensive nVidia consumer-grade GPU ever released that is not a multi-GPU setup and I don't say that in a good way...

Well I am waiting for EVGA to release a Hybrid Edition of the 1070 anytime now...


----------



## clipse84

So is this not the full TITAN X?


----------



## clipse84

time to get of my old titans x


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/07/21/titan-x/
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Brian Kelleher, our top hardware engineer, bet our CEO, Jen-Hsun Huang, we could get more than 10 teraflops of computing performance from a single chip. Jen-Hsun thought that was crazy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They released said chip back in April:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...

and?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *clipse84*
> 
> So is this not the full TITAN X?


Full GP102 has over 3800 cores supposedly.


----------



## Star Forge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *clipse84*
> 
> So is this not the full TITAN X?


I think this is the full Titan X. I don't think they could pull of HBM 2 to consumers ha!


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Personally waiting for HBM2 cards.


Heck, I am about to just straight up wait for Volta. Pascal has not been impressive at all. I'm just worry they going to jack up the prices again though.

Only one I may get is the 1060, and that just be to replace my 960 FTW in TC. If I manage to nab one without crazy nut buggers pricing them high.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> and?


That "story" is just a marketing ploy...


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> and?
> 
> 
> 
> That "story" is just a marketing ploy...
Click to expand...

nor did the story say *when* the bet was made.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ithanul*
> 
> Heck, I am about to just straight up wait for Volta. Pascal has not been impressive at all. I'm just worry they going to jack up the prices again though.
> 
> Only one I may get is the 1060, and that just be to replace my 960 FTW in TC. If I manage to nab one without crazy nut buggers pricing them high.


With a 980 Ti, there's no reason to move up to the new Titan X. Volta should be your earliest upgrade for that card.


----------



## Serandur

My thoughts:

1. $1200?!?!?!?!







Where does the price rising end?

2. GP102 pretty much confirmed, GP100 has 15 billion transistors and not the stated 12 billion in this. Remember, Nvidia have never cited functional transistor count after considering disabled shaders in cut-down parts. They always cite the full transistor count of the full chip (ex. both the 980 Ti and Titan X are cited as having 8 billion transistors even though the former has some disabled). This is almost certainly a different chip from GP100, especially considering the 384-bit bus compatible with GDDR5X which should require separate memory controllers.

3. 12 billion transistors is 67% more than the GTX 1080's 7.2 billion, even though the shader count on this Titan is only 40% higher and the memory bus only 50% larger. I think this chip is either strongly cut-down and/or GP102 has some extra double-precision hardware that the lower gaming chips don't.

4. Getting the chip out this early into 16nm's lifespan as a gaming product is fairly impressive, but $1200 for what may very well be a cut-down chip at this point is just ludicrous, imo. Just reiterating, not happy with this one-sided market domination, but Nvidia are really flexing their figurative muscles by releasing this already. A full 16nm lineup completely announced and launched within the summer of 2016 is just insane relative to the competition's... lack of competition.

5. 12 GBs of GDDR5X on this thing instead of 24 (given that past Titans have had 3x the amount of memory as the Gxxx4 X80 parts whereas this one only has 1.5x the GP104 1080's memory; this is where a theoretical 1080 Ti following in the 980 Ti's footsteps should have been) has me worrying Nvidia's long-term strategy is to eliminate the need for a value-oriented big die part (like the 980 Ti) in the future and just focus on $1000 minimum pricing for high-end chips from now on. Could be wrong, but the 1080's already positioned at $700 and the Titan part with only 40% more shaders is already at $1200 (leaving a gap for, say, a cut-down 3072-3200 shader plain Titan at $1000 with no room for a "1080 Ti").

We might be lucky to ever get a ~$700-$800 big die part (that isn't massively cut-down) from Nvidia without any provocation from AMD again, and who knows if AMD even will be able to challenge them again or how high this price-raising trend may go. There's certainly room for a 2017 GP102-based "GTX 2080" or whatever, but given the 1080's prices, I doubt it would be cheap and I expect it to be heavily cut-down unless Vega is actually competitive.


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Titan X for $1200 with GDDR5X?


----------



## ivymaxwell




----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> Titan X for $1200 with GDDR5X?


You laugh... people on this forum will probably eat it up.


----------



## FLCLimax

Can't compete without R & D. Fanboys act like an army ensuring new gamers only buy Nvidia, don't complain at the price now.


----------



## Bauxno

So this is the cutdown titan wich should be name 1080ti? And at $1200? soon people buying this will say **** this the tesla is only $300 more expensive we go for that


----------



## fewness

what? gtx 1080 is yesterday already?
And does this support 3/4 way SLI?


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> nor did the story say *when* the bet was made.


This is what I got out of the marketing rhetoric:
Quote:


> We said our GTX 1080 delivers an "irresponsible amount of performance." It was a bit reckless. *But this is even more reckless*.
> 
> So forget words. Here are its numbers:
> 
> TITAN X will be available Aug. 2 for *$1,200* direct from nvidia.com


----------



## 970Rules

Funny thing about this is I was watching my twitter feed out of nowhere Nvidia twitter account which I also follow like Surprise! The new TitanX is here!


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> You laugh... people on this forum will probably eat it up.


Which is so sad.

Nvidia is shipping an HBM2 card, yet won't put it on their Titan class card that is based off it?

No way HMB2 doesn't help at 4K+ resolutions.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> With a 980 Ti, there's no reason to move up to the new Titan X. Volta should be your earliest upgrade for that card.


This.


----------



## Ithanul

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> With a 980 Ti, there's no reason to move up to the new Titan X. Volta should be your earliest upgrade for that card.


I don't really base on gaming. Pascal has not been impressive at all in folding. Really shows that they are just refine Maxwells clocked high.

My darn 980Tis hang with 1080s while folding.....on good day the 1080 may do a extra 100k PPD than one of my Tis.

At best, the big die may have some serious DP. But if so, I will do the waiting game like I did for all these Maxwells I have.







No way will I ever drop over 700+ for a single GPU.


----------



## looniam

seriously AMD - get vega out so i can upgrade my GPU and get a sweet enough free sync screen for ~$1200.


----------



## FLCLimax

1080 Ti costs double what a 980 Ti did, the real Titan may cost $2400.


----------



## keikei

Well, people have been clamoring for significant perfomance. Here it is folks. Slop it up.


----------



## jakethesnake438

Only 12GB? Lame

Lets have some 1080Ti news


----------



## Mad Pistol

I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.

$1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.

If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.

$1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> 1080 Ti costs double what a 980 Ti did, the real Titan may cost $2400.


Yup, this should have been the 1080 Ti.


----------



## HackHeaven

mean while aibs and RX 460/70 are not even out yet lol and you think vega will come


----------



## rv8000

This is bad for everyone but Nvidia. That's a lotta dollars.

Surprised they're releasing this so quickly, I wonder what gives.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.


Can't stop them. Many people simply want the best.


----------



## fewness

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.


How about just ban anyone who gets it?


----------



## rcfc89

Where are all the people arguing against me saying we wouldn't see the Titan this year? Come eat your Crow,


----------



## Kpjoslee

SO who is going to sell their Titan X for......Titan X? lol.


----------



## twitchyzero

nVidia doesn't even try to hide their green in their eyes at this point.

I'm hoping people will realize 20% price jump for locked die and not even the best memory standard means poor sales

please, green camp fanboys, please prove me right.

and AMD is equally to blame for this...let's get competitive at this segment already.

My wallet is safe until HBM2 and unlocked die


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't stop them. Many people simply want the best *to pay the most.*
Click to expand...

FTFY


----------



## 12Cores

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Pleas don't buy one.


This, remember a few weeks back amd was celebrating a Vega milestone, maybe they will release a biggish die with G5X. $1,200 is a crap ton of money for a graphics card, but what do I know.


----------



## Toology

Well this is one Titan i am skipping, maybe AMD can deliver something like a super Fury X lol


----------



## Mad Pistol

Also, this is not the HBM2 Titan that people wanted. Keep that in mind... this card is NOT worth $1200.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

This looks like 1080 Ti should have been really. So they just doubled the price.


----------



## ivymaxwell

and then watch scalpers charge 1700+


----------



## hiarc

Well it looks like I probably am skipping this generation. Definitely not paying that much for G5X, let alone a cut-down die.

I guess this is the 1080Ti in disguise.


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jakethesnake438*
> 
> Only 12GB? Lame
> 
> Lets have some 1080Ti news


this IS the 1080Ti...


----------



## NYU87

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.


If folks have the money, why not? You shouldn't dictate how others spend their money.


----------



## Serandur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Pleas don't buy one.


+ 1 to this

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Also, this is not the HBM2 Titan that people wanted. Keep that in mind... this card is NOT worth $1200.


If it really is just a cut-down GP102 as well, it's even more not worth the money. A full GP102 chip could release and obsolete it within 6 months. For all we know, Volta may actually even be on schedule for 2017 or no later than very early 2018 and big-daddy Volta will almost certainly crush this thing. That'll be the real HBM2 monster everyone wants, but if people buy this one... who knows how expensive Volta will be.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> Yup, this should have been the 1080 Ti.


It really is, a cut down GP102 is either a 1080 Ti or following in the footsteps of the original Titan.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivymaxwell*
> 
> and then watch scalpers charge 1700+


Let the scalpers buy this for $1200... then don't buy it from them, so they are stuck with them. Seriously, that's how you end that mess.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

The performance will be there. Nvidia probably did not sell that many Titan X as they wanted. They probably want to give Titan X user/buyer more of a reason to buy one.


----------



## clipse84

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> SO who is going to sell their Titan X for......Titan X? lol.


I Am Bought to sell all 3 of my titans x with waterblocks on ebay


----------



## comagnum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HackHeaven*
> 
> mean while aibs and RX 460/70 are not even out yet lol and you think vega will come


What do you mean, "and you think vega will come"? Of course it's coming. What do you think they would do, just up and cancel the entire product line?


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

I don't take kindly to folks telling me how to spend my money


----------



## CallsignVega

What name do you think will catch on. Titan-PX? Titan-XP?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NYU87*
> 
> If folks have the money, why not? You shouldn't dictate how others spend their money.


I am not trying to dictate how others spend their money, but $1200 for a video card WITHOUT HBM2 is a travesty of the highest order... there are even telltale signs that this is a cut-down GP102, which makes this even more of a travesty.

You want to spend $1200 on a video card, go ahead... but make sure it's a damn good video card... not this crap.


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> this IS the 1080Ti...


I get it now. Its Titan in name only to 'jusitfy' the $1000+ price tag. Nvidia are marketing genuises. Well, for those waiting for the Ti, it wont be too long after. Assuming there is one ofc.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> What name do you think will catch on. Titan-PX? Titan-XP?


XP for sure. What is what I am calling it.


----------



## NYU87

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> I don't take kindly to folks telling me how to spend my money


Didn't you get the message? Even if you have the money, you shouldn't spend it. You have to buy what everyone else is buying or you're a moron. /sarcasm
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I am not trying to dictate how others spend their money, but $1200 for a video card WITHOUT HBM2 is a travesty of the highest order... there are even telltale signs that this is a cut-down GP102, which makes this even more of a travesty.
> 
> You want to spend $1200 on a video card, go ahead... but make sure it's a damn good video card... not this crap.


I don't disagree with you but if people want to spend/waste their money, it's their prerogative.


----------



## ssgwright

why Titan X we already had a Titan X come on....


----------



## twitchyzero

vote with ya wallet

has there ever been single GPU flagships from same company that was released this close together?

gtx 280 to 285?


----------



## clipse84

you know what i change my mind not until they release the full gp100 HBM2 Titan x will i purchase my tri sli old titan x should suffice


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> this IS the 1080Ti...
> 
> 
> 
> I get it now. Its Titan in name only to 'jusitfy' the $1000+ price tag. Nvidia are marketing genuises. Well, for those waiting for the Ti, it wont be too long after. Assuming there is one ofc.
Click to expand...

Yes. Instead of dropping the 1080 to the 500 tier where it should be, instead of pricing the Ti at 650 - 700, they use Titan name and charge titan price for the Ti.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> I get it now. Its Titan in name only to 'jusitfy' the $1000+ price tag. Nvidia are marketing genuises. Well, for those waiting for the Ti, it wont be too long after. Assuming there is one ofc.


1080 Ti has no room to reason to come out. This Titan XP price made sure of that. If this Titan XP was $1000 it would have been a better buy then curren 1080. AMD got nothing. 1080 Ti will only come as a response to AMD.


----------



## CaliLife17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.


It wouldn't be a titan Thread without people telling people how to spend their money. Yes I agree it is a lot of money for a GPU, but no one is saying you need to buy it. both AMD and Nvidia have other GPUs at different price points for people who want to spend different amounts of money on items.

I make enough money to spend the money to buy 2 of these, so I mean, why not.


----------



## Mad Pistol

That's right... wait for an HBM2 card to drop a Grand+ on a video card. $1200 for a card with GDDR5x is... lunacy.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NYU87*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If folks have the money, why not? You shouldn't dictate how others spend their money.
Click to expand...

and what do stock analysts do?

tell/suggest people how to spend(invest) their money. and also, it's very short sighted to not look how one's spending habits will affect the market for ALL consumers.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *clipse84*
> 
> you know what i change my mind not until they release the full gp100 HBM2 Titan x will i purchase my tri sli old titan x should suffice


Probably it will b Volta. Pascal it's all G5X for customers.


----------



## twitchyzero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> I make enough money to spend the money to buy 2 of these, so I mean, why not.


thanks for sharing and sorry that we peasants offended you, big boss


----------



## jakethesnake438

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> Yes. Instead of dropping the 1080 to the 500 tier where it should be, instead of pricing the Ti at 650 - 700, they use Titan name and charge titan price for the Ti.


Is this officially confirmed?
Gamers don't need Double Precision but we DO need better 4k performance


----------



## Kpjoslee

Well, Tbh, first Kepler Titan was cut down version also so I am not really surprised first Titan from 16nm is cut down version. It would be funny if 1080Ti is full die just like what 780Ti was.

So big Vega would be next 290X?


----------



## D749

I sold my two EVGA Titan X SC when the selling was good and picked up two EVGA GTX 1080 FE. Now I'm thinking of selling the 1080s for one or two of the new Titan X cards.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> It wouldn't be a titan Thread without people telling people how to spend their money. Yes I agree it is a lot of money for a GPU, but no one is saying you need to buy it. both AMD and Nvidia have other GPUs at different price points for people who want to spend different amounts of money on items.
> 
> I make enough money to spend the money to buy 2 of these, so I mean, why not.


It is your money, and you are entitled to spend it how ever you wish... but you are enabling this market to continue to stifle innovation in favor of price hikes. Again, if this card had HBM2, I wouldn't be saying any of this. HBM2 is what should be on the next Titan. Not this junk.


----------



## CaliLife17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> thanks for sharing and sorry that we peasants offended you, big boss


LOL get back to you peasant









But I do think we can all agre that $1,200 for the Titan is high. No reason it shouldn't be at the normal 1k range.

Also don't think AMD wouldn't love to have a card they could sell in this price range if they could.


----------



## NYU87

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> and what do stock analysts do?
> 
> tell/suggest people how to spend(invest) their money. and also, it's very short sighted to not look how one's spending habits will affect the market for ALL consumers.


I don't agree with that.

Equity analysts are paid to recommend stocks to investors. This is a tech forum. If you have the money, you should spend it however you want it.

Are you going to tell me not go out and buy a fancy car because some smuck next door can only afford a Honda?


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it.


GTX 780 dropped 3 months after Titan. Slightly lower performance for 65% of the price.

This formula is now backwards. 3 months later you can get slightly higher performance for double the price









I expected a Titan branded Pascal to meet or exceed the gross margins of the 1080 for it to be a beneficial release.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> That's right... wait for an HBM2 card to drop a Grand+ on a video card. $1200 for a card with GDDR5x is... lunacy.


You wen't from saying $1200 is too much for a card to 1k+ is worth the buy if it has HBM2


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> It wouldn't be a titan Thread without people telling people how to spend their money. Yes I agree it is a lot of money for a GPU, but no one is saying you need to buy it. both AMD and Nvidia have other GPUs at different price points for people who want to spend different amounts of money on items.
> 
> I make enough money to spend the money to buy 2 of these, so I mean, why not.
> 
> 
> 
> It is your money, and you are entitled to spend it how ever you wish... but you are enabling this market to continue to stifle innovation in favor of price hikes. Again, if this card had HBM2, I wouldn't be saying any of this. HBM2 is what should be on the next Titan. Not this junk.
Click to expand...

Cry us a river.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> You wen't from saying $1200 is too much for a card to 1k+ is worth the buy if it has HBM2


In its current state, $1k+ is too much for a traditional GPU. Let's face it.. HBM2 is a new technology, so I think $1k+ for a Flagship card w/ HBM2 is an appropriate price of entry.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NYU87*
> 
> Equity analysts are paid to recommend stocks to investors. This is a tech forum. If you have the money, you should spend it however you want it.


You can spend it however you want, just don't ask me to pay for your retirement and medical


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NYU87*
> 
> *Are you going to tell me not go out and buy a fancy car because some smuck next door can only afford a Honda?*


Your high horse mentality is alarming. Why is someone a smuck because of what they can afford? Poisonous train of thought.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> But I do think we can all agre that $1,200 for the Titan is high. *No reason it shouldn't be at the normal 1k range.*


This is literally just as many of us predicted would happen with the initial launch of the Titan. How is 1k 'normal' for a cut down gpu? Nvidia's marketing really does wonders and unfortunately hurts the market at the same time.


----------



## Malinkadink

So 60% faster than previous Titan X means its about 45% faster than a gtx 1080? It is indeed strange to get a Titan like this just 2 months after the other pascal cards launching. I'm not the target for this card anyway as enticing as it may be, i find my 1070 adequate for now, 1170 will be Titan X2 performance for $400 anyway, then i'll upgrade


----------



## NYU87

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> You can spend it however you want, just don't ask me to pay for your retirement and medical


I said "if you have the money". Obviously a person should plan ahead and use their money wisely according to their disposable income.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> Your high horse mentality is alarming. Why is someone a smuck because of what they can afford? Poisonous train of thought.
> This is literally just as many of us predicted would happen with the initial launch of the Titan. How is 1k 'normal' for a cut down gpu?


I was just making a point. Not making fun of the person who can only afford a Honda.

I'm not rich but I'm not going to chastise someone who has the income and can afford video cards like Titan X (like the majority on this forum tends to do),.


----------



## CaliLife17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> It is your money, and you are entitled to spend it how ever you wish... but you are enabling this market to continue to stifle innovation in favor of price hikes. Again, if this card had HBM2, I wouldn't be saying any of this. HBM2 is what should be on the next Titan. Not this junk.


HBM2 would be great, but I have no idea if the inventory is high enough for them to sell both Gp100 Tesla Units AND consumer TItan's with HBM2. If they had to pick only 1 to get the inventory it's going to be the Tesla Cards, because they can get WAY more money for them.

The consumer isn't the only person here driving up the price. Lack of competition is also leading to the rise of prices. So no one party is fully at fault


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *12Cores*
> 
> Benchmarks will be nuts for this card, it will do [email protected] on a lot of games the 1080 was already very close, man amd is so far behind in this round. Nvidia has released their full stack of pascal gpu's in the space of two months, HM2 will not be in production for a few months, so Vega is possibly months away.


Yup..









There's definitely a reason to upgrade the 980 Ti and the previous Titan now, mainly because it'll probably perform 50+% better than them.So, 4K 60fps seems to finally been nailed indeed.


----------



## Seyumi

Guys come on this is a bargain since now you only need to buy 2 GPUs for max gaming performance instead of 4 haha. I'm buying 2 but I will wait for an All-In-One Liquid cooled version most likely from EVGA first.


----------



## HackHeaven

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *comagnum*
> 
> What do you mean, "and you think vega will come"? Of course it's coming. What do you think they would do, just up and cancel the entire product line?


That isnt what i meant... this card will most likely be out before RX 460 and 470 come out... maybe before aibs from the looks of things so vega still has a long way to go if its even rdy since nothing else is it seems


----------



## CallsignVega

Good thing I am off work on August 2 so that I can F5 two Titan-XP for SLI. $2400 for two GPU's is a little steep.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> Guys come on this is a bargain since now you only need to buy 2 GPUs for max gaming performance instead of 4 haha. I'm buying 2 but I will wait for an All-In-One Liquid cooled version most likely from EVGA first.


I'm maxing out a 3440x1440 monitor with two 1070s without even breaking a sweat. Dual Pascal Titan X's will probably be double that.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

People payed $350 more for Titan X for 2 months of exclusivity. Would they not pay $500+ for 6 months or more?


----------



## twitchyzero

i see your sig already changed callsign

too bad that dell 120hz oled isn't happening for ya


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> i see your sig already changed callsign
> 
> too bad that dell 120hz oled isn't happening for ya


lol ya, silly choice to put only Thunderbolt 3 on there for 120 Hz.


----------



## bonami2

Funny thing about gpu is...

Example..

Someone is looking to buy a used car with lot of HP

Find a used 80 honda civic with a bad swap and a turbo doing 300 hp for 2000$..

No one will ever buy this garbage.

Now nvidia release a gpu with lot of horsepower... No hbm No Direct x 12 true support..

Everyone will buy it..

Because they put a ferrari body on a civic of 300hp









Everyone buy brand name.. And Performance...

And no one care about what is under the hood.. People are just too dumb it seem.

* only reason im considering this card is im bored of waiting for performance. Spending 1k + on garbage is not wise either.


----------



## NuclearPeace

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> But I do think we can all agre that $1,200 for the Titan is high. No reason it shouldn't be at the normal 1k range.


Why not? People have proven to NVIDIA that they will pretty much buy a Titan regardless of the price.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> lol ya, silly choice to put only Thunderbolt 3 on there for 120 Hz.


"ONLY" Thunderbolt 3 on a monitor.


----------



## SoloCamo

I'll wait for Vega as it is the proper replacement for the 290x/390x.... Can't wait to see how the Titan X fairs in the near future against the cheaper card. Hello OG titan's, how'd that 1k work out for you? Feeling a bit sluggish lately?


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> "ONLY" Thunderbolt 3 on a monitor.


Thunderbolt 3 is good but not so good when no GPU's outside laptop's run it!


----------



## twitchyzero

i dont know...OG Titan as ridiculously priced as it was I recall trumped everything else for a solid year? 18 months..? someone correct me here


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Good thing I am off work on August 2 so that I can F5 two Titan-XP for SLI. $2400 for two GPU's is a little steep.


That's around what I paid a night for the last resort I took my wife to for 9 nights. At least this was last longer than 9 nights.







Bring on the new Titans!


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> I'll wait for Vega as it is the proper replacement for the 290x/390x.... Can't wait to see how the Titan X fairs in the near future against the cheaper card. Hello OG titan's, how'd that 1k work out for you? Feeling a bit sluggish lately?


I am afraid Nvidia just opened a door for $999 Vega and 1080Ti.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> Guys come on this is a bargain since now you only need to buy 2 GPUs for max gaming performance instead of 4 haha. I'm buying 2 but I will wait for an All-In-One Liquid cooled version most likely from EVGA first.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm maxing out a 3440x1440 monitor with two 1070s without even breaking a sweat. Dual Pascal Titan X's will probably be double that.
Click to expand...

The Titan will match or exceed the GTX 1070 2 way SLI and only cost 3 times more than a single GTX 1070.

Not that bad of a deal.


----------



## NuclearPeace

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> I am afraid Nvidia just opened a door for $999 Vega and 1080Ti.


NVIDIA at this point can really do as they please. 1080s already effectively cost $700. AMD is too slow to respond to NVIDIA and when they do it isn't a doorbusting 290x like card anymore, its just something like the Fury X.

I'm so glad that i'm not in the high end GPU market because this is madness.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NYU87*
> 
> I said "if you have the money". Obviously a person should plan ahead and use their money wisely according to their disposable income.


What percent of the population pays themselves first? The disposable income you speak of tends to be money that should have been saved.



Quite a few of the Titan owners on these forums are college students


----------



## twitchyzero

meh SLI comparing value with a single GPU, a titan at that seems silly. but single gpus for me going forward i think


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> I am afraid Nvidia just opened a door for $999 Vega and 1080Ti.


AMD will not dare price a card of theirs at $999 unless its a dual chip. I reckon a $650 vega that will exceed the 1080 and compete with the Titan X if not beating it easily in vulkan/dx12 titles, only to get stronger with age.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> AMD will not dare price a card of theirs at $999 unless its a dual chip. I reckon a $650 vega that will exceed the 1080 and compete with the Titan X if not beating it easily in vulkan/dx12 titles, only to get stronger with age.


And Vega will have HBM2... something to think about.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> In its current state, $1k+ is too much for a traditional GPU. Let's face it.. HBM2 is a new technology, so I think $1k+ for a Flagship card w/ HBM2 is an appropriate price of entry.


This is an interesting way of rationalizing and justifying price hikes


----------



## bonami2

Error of my part


----------



## paskowitz

Welp, looks like I'm waiting for the 1180 Ti. Pascal has been a let down so far.


----------



## keikei

Why do some people expect there to be a faster card then the Titan X?


----------



## SoloCamo

And with the obvious incoming 1080ti... is anyone seriously going to buy this? If not a 1080ti you know there will be a Titan Black edition for it at the least.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> Why do some people expect there to be a faster card then the Titan X?


Because there will always be a faster card around a corner...?


----------



## CallsignVega

And now the 100 pages of "what's the value of the card" back and forth begins.


----------



## Noufel

puling out the pascal titan so early ....... i think that nvidia knows something about AMD and the upcoming Vega arch .
Ps: 1200$ and the legendary pascal aviability i think that nvidia will sell 4 or 5 of them


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Welp, looks like I'm waiting for the 1180 Ti. Pascal has been a let down so far.


There will probably never be 80Ti's again.. Same with AMD.. It's from now on going to be Titan's Vs Fury's (if they directly compete). But either way both will have tiers above what we used to call flagships..


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> And now the 100 pages of "what's the value of the card" back and forth begins.


It was just a matter of time. Heh.


----------



## DADDYDC650

I'm not falling for this crap again! Cooler sucks and $1200? HAHAHAHAHA! I'm not supporting this crap buy paying $200 more than the last couple of Titan's. 1080 will hold me over until Vega or the 1080 Ti. I always get burned when the custom Ti's come out with custom PCB's and coolers that look oh so cool.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noufel*
> 
> puling out the pascal titan so early ....... i think that nvidia knows something about AMD and the upcoming Vega arch .
> Ps: 1200$ and the legendary pascal aviability i think that nvidia will sell 4 or 5 of them


August 2nd, they go up on Newegg as "Sold Out," and Nvidia claims the Titan XP to be the fastest selling card of all time.


----------



## junkman

People can and should spend their money how they wish.. but the entitlement level of people in some of these threads can be pretty astounding. We're all enthusiasts of our own ilk here. You'd be the only one ending up looking stupid for spending extra money on something when you really didn't need to. No one is impressed by how much money you make. Plenty of us are engineers, doctors, and are pretty well off - you're not special for buying a 1200 dollar GPU.

Sometimes, it's more fun to see how much performance you can squeeze out of a system with barely any money put into it. It's optimization. Doesn't anyone remember the 9700 PRO powerstrip days, when you got performance for years out of that thing?

It will probably be a good GPU, but it would be wise to wait and see what happens with prices.

In other words, cheap GTX 1080's for everyone, and maybe a Fury successor announcement? ~1200USD seems steep considering no interposer challenges with HBM2.


----------



## geort45

That bad madafaka should be named Titan XXL


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Welp, looks like I'm waiting for the 1180 Ti. Pascal has been a let down so far.


Could you perhaps explain how the fastest single card on the market (1080) is a let down? Assuming you're not referring to the price alone of course.


----------



## TopicClocker

Wow big die GPUs already? I'm a little surprised, I never expected to see a big die GPU available to purchase by August 2nd.

The performance of this GPU is going to be really good, but they could have at-least changed the name, people are going to get confused between the original Titan X and the Pascal Titan X.

How exactly are there going to be YouTube videos of this card? "Overwatch - Titan X (2016)?" "Grand Theft Auto V - Titan X (2016)?"


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> And now the 100 pages of "what's the value of the card" back and forth begins.


Well the truth is a valid discussion. There comes a point where the price hikes are just getting ridiculous. 1k already was absolutely ridiculous for the OG Titan, especially when you look at where it stands now. Now they raise the price even further? This is not even a full gpu, there is nothing special about it at all, no breakthrough tech, no nothing to warrant such a price hike.


----------



## speedyeggtart

A lot of people on OCN were saying Pascal will be using HBM2 - now almost the whole Pascal line is out and not HBM or HBM2....


----------



## NuclearPeace

This whole graphics generation has been disappointing for me so far. The only thing I am looking forward to is to see custom 480s and 1060s duke it out but other than that its been pretty bad. NVIDIA is still hiking prices through MSRP and through the whole Founders Edition tactic. AMD again remains absent on the high end. ATM im just glad that I grabbed the 380x so I'm not finding myself needing to participate in this messed up graphics card market.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> August 2nd, they go up on Newegg as "Sold Out," and Nvidia claims the Titan XP to be the fastest selling card of all time.


It is NVIDIA store exclusive.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noufel*
> 
> puling out the pascal titan so early ....... i think that nvidia knows something about AMD and the upcoming Vega arch .
> Ps: 1200$ and the legendary pascal aviability i think that nvidia will sell 4 or 5 of them


Only if Vega is releasing in a month and is much faster than the 1080.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> It is NVIDIA store exclusive.


That's going to make a lot of retailers really angry.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> Well the truth is a valid discussion. There comes a point where the price hikes are just getting ridiculous. 1k already was absolutely ridiculous for the OG Titan, especially when you look at where it stands now. Now they raise the price even further? This is not even a full gpu, there is nothing special about it at all, no breakthrough tech, no nothing to warrant such a price hike.


I think NVIDIA realizes that with DX12 and beyond, SLI is on life support. Single GPU is where it's at. Everyone wants the fastest single GPU and NVIDIA can charge more.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *970Rules*
> 
> https://twitter.com/nvidia/status/756312110590820353
> 
> Will post all incoming specs as we get it.
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y02kptTItj8&feature=share
> 
> https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/07/21/titan-x-deep-learning/
> 
> Donning the leather jacket he goes very few places without, NVIDIA CEO showed up at AI meet-up at Stanford this evening to show, for the very first time, a graphics card based on a brand new Pascal GP102 GPU.
> 
> We packed the most raw horsepower we possibly could into this GPU. Driven by 3584 NVIDIA CUDA® cores running at 1.5GHz, TITAN X packs 11 TFLOPs of brute force. Plus it's armed with 12 GB of GDDR5X memory - one of the fastest memory technologies in the world.
> 
> Up to 60% faster performance than previous TITAN X
> 
> 12B Transistors
> GP102 will feature 40% more CUDA cores than the GP104
> Memory Bandwidth 480 GB/s
> 250 Walts. 1 8-pin and 1 6-pin
> Price $1,200 USD
> 
> The card will be available on August 2nd in the US and Europe.


























Looks like I'm sitting tight till 2018 at the very very earliest


----------



## GorillaSceptre

AMD announcing something on Monday apparently..

What the hell is going on? Nvidia coming out of nowhere like this at the end of the week smells a bit... off.

Then again.. Last time i thought Nvidia were rushing the 980Ti to market out of desperation, and that didn't go so well for the Fury X..


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I think NVIDIA realizes that *withDX12* and beyond, SLI is on life support. *Single GPU is where it's at*.


Here I thought DX12 improved multi GPU support, not the other way around...


----------



## magnek

Also "up to 60% faster than Titan X"?

Yeah maybe a max OC Pascal Titan vs bone stock Titan X that's throttling


----------



## SoloCamo

I'm really curious as to why this was suddenly pushed out like this so soon after the 1080. The 1080 is leaps and bounds over the competition as is. When they launched the 780ti it was immediately after the 290x hit - not before it.


----------



## iluvkfc

Lmao at people who bought SLI 1080 to be the fastest on the block... for 2 months I guess. Also lmao at the people who will buy this for $1200 or SLI for $2400 (and that's the best case scenario, for other regions it will be even worse). This is probably the ****tiest deal possible: $200 increase over previous generations, can't possibly be 50% better than 1080 at double the price, no compute, no HBM, only 12GB...

At least the fact that Nvidia's rushing this means Vega is coming out in October.


----------



## mouacyk

raj and jen are chess buddies, you didn't know


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Here I thought DX12 improved multi GPU support, not the other way around...


DX12 removed the onus of SLI support from NVIDIA and put it on the game developers. Do you think these console game developers are going to care about a tiny percentage of PC SLI users and go out of their way to make SLI work? I don't.

We are heading into a world of a ton of CPU cores and a single GPU chip, both of which can overclock less and less...


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> I'm really curious as to why this was suddenly pushed out like this so soon after the 1080. The 1080 is leaps and bounds over the competition as is. When they launched the 780ti it was immediately after the 290x hit - not before it.


$1200 says that is not the case, unless AMD surprises with October Vega launch.


----------



## Noufel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> It is NVIDIA store exclusive.


ah ok thnx for the info


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Isn't Vega on TSMC's process? If that's the case Vega might be getting clocks similar to Pascal, that might make Nvidia a bit worried..

Dammit, there i go with the hype again..









Don't judge me, I've been abused by sky-high GPU prices.. Just looking for a bit of hope.


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iluvkfc*
> 
> ***** at people who bought SLI 1080 to be the fastest on the block... for 2 months I guess. Also ***** at the people who will buy this for $1200 or SLI for $2400 (and that's the best case scenario, for other regions it will be even worse). This is probably the ****tiest deal possible: $200 increase over previous generations, can't possibly be 50% better than 1080 at double the price, no compute, no HBM, only 12GB...
> 
> *At least the fact that Nvidia's rushing this means Vega is coming out in October*.


A lot of us are thinking the samething....


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> We are heading into a world of a ton of CPU cores and a single GPU chip, both of which can overclock less and less...


The hardware in this hobby are getting more boring, more locked down and yet more expensive with each generation.


----------



## saintruski

Why?


----------



## Marc79

Isn't it just a bit too soon though? 1070/1080's just dropped not too long ago. 1080's reign will be short lived.


----------



## CallsignVega

I honestly haven't even read up on HBM. If you take the same GPU and one has GDDR5X and the other HBM, how much faster would the HBM ran GPU be? Is the GPU really waiting for data that much with 480 GBit/sec GDDR5X?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> AMD announcing something on Monday apparently..
> 
> What the hell is going on? Nvidia coming out of nowhere like this at the end of the week smells a bit... off.
> 
> Then again.. Last time i thought Nvidia were rushing the 980Ti to market out of desperation, and that didn't go so well for the Fury X..


Monday's event is Polaris based FirePro.
Quote:


> AMD to Showcase New Professional-Class Radeon Products


http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/siggraph-webcast-2016jul13.aspx


----------



## Noufel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Isn't Vega on TSMC's process? If that's the case Vega might be getting clocks similar to Pascal, that might make Nvidia a bit worried..
> 
> Dammit, there i go with the hype again..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't judge me, I've been abused by sky-high GPU prices.. Just looking for a bit of hope.


that exactly what i'm thinking right now


----------



## Mad Pistol

I decided to search "Titan X" on youtube just now...

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Titan+X

I think Nvidia may be shooting themselves in the foot by naming the card Titan X again. It's going to be difficult for video card reviewers to differentiate the Titan X from the Titan XP.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Isn't Vega on TSMC's process? If that's the case Vega might be getting clocks similar to Pascal, that might make Nvidia a bit worried..


4608 steam processors, 16GB HBM2, and 128 ROPs clcked at 2 GHz... Say it ain't so


----------



## geort45

Does anyone REALLY think that AMD is gonna come up with something faster than the 1080? Come on guys, 1080 is CRAZY FAST and at a really good pricepoint, can't afford it? Get a 1070 still crazy fast. nVidia can reléase a Titan X and charge all they want, the GTX 1080 is plenty, it's like protesting because Ferrari launches an affordable car but you still cry like a boy because you can't buy the highest end car. Stop whining, get on the Pascal bandwagon if you can. I hope nVidia releases Titan XXX which is a doublé GPU Titan X at $2000... just to show off


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> 4608 steam processors, 16GB HBM2, and 128 ROPs clcked at 2 GHz... Say it ain't so


uh-oh


----------



## Jared Pace

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> So 60% faster than previous Titan X means its about 45% faster than a gtx 1080?


GTX1080 ~9 Tflops
Titan XP ~11 Tflops
(Cores*SIMDs*(mul-add*2+mul*1)*clock speed)
384bit + 12GB ram, 240 tmu
gtx 1080 = 9 Tflops,
2560sm x ~ 1733mhz x 2 = 8.874 Teraflops compute power
2560sm x ~ 1800mhz x 2 = 9.216 Teraflops
2560sm x ~ 1900mhz x 2 = 9.728 Teraflops
2560sm x ~ 2000mhz x 2 = 10.246 Teraflops
Titan XP = 11 Tflops,
3584sm x 1531mhz x 2 = 10.972 Teraflops computer power
3584sm x 1600mhz x 2 = 11.468 Teraflops
3584sm x 1700mhz x 2 = 12.185 Teraflops
3584sm x 1800mhz x 2 = 12.902 Teraflops
3584sm x 1900mhz x 2 = 13.619 Teraflops
8.8 Tflop vs. 13.6 Tflop
80 fps versus 130 fps


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iluvkfc*
> 
> Lmao at people who bought SLI 1080 to be the fastest on the block... for 2 months I guess. Also lmao at the people who will buy this for $1200 or SLI for $2400 (and that's the best case scenario, for other regions it will be even worse). This is probably the ****tiest deal possible: $200 increase over previous generations, can't possibly be 50% better than 1080 at double the price, no compute, no HBM, only 12GB...
> 
> At least the fact that Nvidia's rushing this means Vega is coming out in October.


I'm thinking that they will release a full Pascal Titan X with HBM early next year or so. Whoever buys this card will be in deep doo doo. My 1080 will do just fine until the real big boys are unleashed!


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Does anyone REALLY think that AMD is gonna come up with something faster than the 1080? Come on guys, 1080 is CRAZY FAST and at a really good pricepoint, can't afford it? Get a 1070 still crazy fast. nVidia can reléase a Titan X and charge all they want, the GTX 1080 is plenty, it's like protesting because Ferrari launches an affordable car but you still cry like a boy because you can't buy the highest end car. Stop whining, get on the Pascal bandwagon if you can. I hope nVidia releases Titan XXX which is a doublé GPU Titan X at $2000... just to show off


Does anyone really think you have been around the pc market for more than a few days? That's the real question. Of course a faster card will be released... This isn't exactly hard to grasp. People like you said the same crap when the Titan was around. I can sit here and point and laugh now with my 290x. Saved 500 bucks and ended up with a good deal better performance.

And no, 1080 is not CRAZY FAST. OC for OC 980ti is pretty comparable.


----------



## ref

Wow, way earlier than I expected.

Will be getting two of these!


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noufel*
> 
> that exactly what i'm thinking right now


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> 4608 steam processors, 16GB HBM2, and 128 ROPs clcked at 2 GHz... Say it ain't so


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Monday's event is Polaris based FirePro.
> 
> http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/siggraph-webcast-2016jul13.aspx


Dreams... shattered.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> 1080 is CRAZY FAST and at a really good pricepoint, can't afford it? Get a 1070 still crazy fast. nVidia can reléase a Titan X and charge all they want, the GTX 1080 is plenty, it's like protesting because Ferrari launches an affordable car but you still cry like a boy because you can't buy the highest end car. Stop whining, get on the Pascal bandwagon if you can.


There is so much fail in this statement I don't even know where to begin









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I hope nVidia releases Titan XXX which is a doublé GPU Titan X at $2000... just to show off


Since you are so willing to bend over and take it, it should be fitting for Nvidia to provide lube with the XXX hardcore anal rapage edition


----------



## n4p0l3onic

Lmao august 2 release date? Anyone getting both titanxp and galaxy note7? Lol


----------



## magnek

Honestly, did anybody expect the new Titan to stay at the same $999 price point especially when 1080 is priced the way it is and hasn't even been on the market for 2 months?

Yes I was one of those swearing up and down that Titan P wouldn't release in August UNLESS
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> The only other scenario that makes sense is if nVidia is only releasing a Titan this year with the Ti variant at least 6 months away, and the Titan costs *at least* $1200+ to avoid cannibalizing 1080 sales.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Sure they can as long as Titan P is sufficiently more expensive than the 1080, which means >$1200 at a minimum.


I was even spot on with regards to the price LOL


----------



## Noufel

Or nvidia is afraid of the custum 480rx that are coming out august 4th


----------



## Mad Pistol

I think this video is the perfect summation of this thread. (make sure to hit play in order to get the joke)


----------



## Marios145

There goes radeon....


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> Could you perhaps explain how the fastest single card on the market (1080) is a let down? Assuming you're not referring to the price alone of course.


First, the newest card X80 is always "the single fastest card on the market".

For me it's really the combination of not quite hitting 4K60, very minimal OC headroom, price increase vs previous gen, price increase relative to performance increase vs previous gen, vast majority of aib cards look like riced up Honda Civics, and architecture improvements/features don't affect me specifically.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> Does anyone really think you have been around the pc market for more than a few days? That's the real question. Of course a faster card will be released... This isn't exactly hard to grasp. People like you said the same crap when the Titan was around. I can sit here and point and laugh now with my 290x. Saved 500 bucks and ended up with a good deal better performance.
> 
> And no, 1080 is not CRAZY FAST. OC for OC 980ti is pretty comparable.


I have been an enthusiast for decades, however it's true that I don't have enough time today as before to research all the options SPECIALLY when AMD has been an underdog for so long, I read more about nV and Intel nowadays. I bought AMD and ATI in the old days when there was competition for pure performance, but sadly AMD has been left in the shadows and has to fight back with PRICE only.

I'm open to learning however, so if you show me references for specs on the highest-end of Vegas tech, I'll gladly check it out


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> There goes radeon....


reaching new 52-week highs...


----------



## Seeing Red

This would we awesome in an ITX build. Too bad this being a titan you are limited to the stock cooler or watercooling it.

As far as I see it, inflation for enthusiast hardware seems to be contagious: $150 mice, $1700 CPUs, $120 lap pads, $200 keyboards, and several >$1K 'gaming' monitors. If it's labeled as 'enthusiast' or 'the best' you should stay away unless the financial burden and value volatility is worth it for whatever benefit you reap.


----------



## Marios145

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> reaching new 52-week highs...


I mean PR-Marketing wise...unless rumours about high-end in october are true(i doubt it at this point), this is very bad for their image


----------



## Eorzean

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> Yes. Instead of dropping the 1080 to the 500 tier where it should be, instead of pricing the Ti at 650 - 700, they use Titan name and charge titan price for the Ti.


All in the name of zero competition. They can name these and price them however they want. The 1080 is a cut down chip and it's selling at $950 CAD. If that wasn't already an indicator that we're being taken advantage of, then I have to say that humanity is doomed.

Anyway, I highly doubt they are releasing this in preparation of anything, other than to continue milking the market. The gap between the high end continues to increase. Maybe Vega will offer us tech we already have for marginally lower next year... Sad part is, AMD will most likely continue taking advantage of the higher GPU prices and maybe sell whatever they are releasing at the time for 50 bucks cheaper than its Nvidia counterpart as an incentive to actually buy their product. Truth is, we're pretty much ****ed and we should now be looking to the game industry and its devs for better optimization than any hope of decreasing GPU prices. Intel stagnated for 6 years+ now, but since no competition, prices actually increased. So even when that day comes, performance gains will be even lower and prices will most likely still be growing. Maybe by then, AMD will have caught up (and can offer us some extra beer money for the weekend if we were to go with them instead).


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm not falling for this crap again! Cooler sucks and $1200? HAHAHAHAHA! I'm not supporting this crap buy paying $200 more than the last couple of Titan's. 1080 will hold me over until Vega or the 1080 Ti. I always get burned when the custom Ti's come out with custom PCB's and coolers that look oh so cool.


Or you do the sensible thing when buying a $1200 gpu, you water cool it and remove that awful cooler.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> this is very bad for their image


From your prospective. The company, on the other hand, is finally moving in the right direction financially. Remember that the goal was to reduce CPU and GPU segments to be less than 50% of all revenues.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Or you do the sensible thing when buying a $1200 gpu


The sensible thing would be to forego buying a gpu for $1200


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> There is so much fail in this statement I don't even know where to begin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since you are so willing to bend over and take it, it should be fitting for Nvidia to provide lube with the XXX hardcore anal rapage edition


That's exactly why I called it the Titan XXX. I don't give a crap if they reléase Titan Lex-Steele versión with 12 inches of RAM at $4000, I wouldn't buy it, what I will buy instead is the best Price/performance card that I can afford, and you should too (any Brand you like). If AMD releases a GTX 1080 killer at a better Price so be it, I would get that instead. I'm not married with Intel, I don't suck nVidias green polygonal cawk, but to whine as what Price the highest card costs... jeez... it's the bleeding edge of Pascal lineup, what did you expect? Instead of whining you should just quietly and proudly sit on your couch and wait for AMD's reléase, sunglasses on, and watch the nVidia fanboys jaws drop to the floor and see nVidia drop prices. But right now AMD is still in their mom's basement concocting its GPU magic, still leaving AMD fanboys jacking off with spec charts while nVidia seizes the moment and charges $1200 to their own fanboys.


----------



## jprovido

i want 1080 Ti


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> i want 1080 Ti


Not getting one, this is the 1080Ti..


----------



## CluckyTaco

Okay, is there any evidence that we may see a 1080ti since I'm running a 780ti sli and they're not cutting for ultrawide gaming


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> First, the newest card X80 is always "the single fastest card on the market".
> 
> For me it's really the combination of not quite hitting 4K60, very minimal OC headroom, price increase vs previous gen, price increase relative to performance increase vs previous gen, vast majority of aib cards look like riced up Honda Civics, and architecture improvements/features don't affect me specifically.


780 was not "the single fastest card on the market", there was the Titan. Also 980 was dead even with Titan Black AFAIK and only 5-7% faster than 780Ti.


----------



## Marios145

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chaitu87*
> 
> Okay, is there any evidence that we may see a 1080ti since I'm running a 780ti sli and they're not cutting for ultrawide gaming


Welcome to nvidia's world, your choices are:
450$
700$
1200$
Please choose unwisely


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> 780 was not "the single fastest card on the market", there was the Titan. Also 980 was slower on release than Titan Black AFAIK


Titans are a weird specimen, specially last Gen Titan X, Titan Z, Titan Black... ***. But the X80 rule applies to the rest of the models, though


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> i want 1080 Ti


This new Titan X _IS_ the 1080 Ti.

I'm gonna echo a few others here: without adequate and timely competition, be prepared to pay >$1000 for the big die cards from here on out.


----------



## prjindigo

And I am vindicated.

LOL'S ON YOU!


----------



## i7monkey

This is literally a GTX 570 (cut-down big die flagship) that's selling for $1200. Yikes!


----------



## Seyumi

I wonder if Nvidia will actually make this a Nvidia store exclusive item this time and block out and 3rd party or custom solutions. Notice it says "NVIDIA Titan X" and not "GeForce GTX ........." like the rest of the 10 series.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> Welcome to nvidia's world, your choices are:
> 450$
> 700$
> 1200$
> Please choose unwisely


He could always go with AMD..

The choices are:

Underwhelming.
Late and underwhelming.
Good try.


----------



## CluckyTaco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> Welcome to nvidia's world, your choices are:
> 450$
> 700$
> 1200$
> Please choose unwisely


Damn dude. Nvidia really did it this time. What would you suggest I do?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> Welcome to nvidia's world, your choices are:
> 450$
> 700$
> 1200$
> Please choose unwisely


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> He could always go with AMD..
> 
> The choices are:
> 
> Underwhelming.
> Late and underwhelming.
> Good try.


Those Intel Iris Pros are suddenly looking _very_ appealing right now


----------



## Omicron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> This new Titan X _IS_ the 1080 Ti.
> 
> I'm gonna echo a few others here: without adequate and timely competition, be prepared to pay >$1000 for the big die cards from here on out.


It honestly is. While not 100% sure, the core count on it does look like a cut GP100 or GP102 from speculation. Imho, this card is basically just a GTX 570 (partially cut down big die GF110 core.) If I recall, price on that was... $350-400ish at the most?









This will be 3x that, honestly a bit sad.


----------



## Rich84

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> Welcome to nvidia's world, your choices are:
> 450$
> 700$
> 1200$
> Please choose unwisely


Seems like room for a 1080ti at say $900?


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> First, the newest card X80 is always "the single fastest card on the market".
> 
> For me it's really the combination of not quite hitting 4K60, very minimal OC headroom, price increase vs previous gen, price increase relative to performance increase vs previous gen, vast majority of aib cards look like riced up Honda Civics, and architecture improvements/features don't affect me specifically.


I know, I was simply asking you why you were let down and it isn't because of the performance as you've now stated. The 1080 can push 60 fps at 4K, but it depends on what games you're playing. Also, many reviewers crank up AA etc when it isn't needed at 4K IMO.

I don't like the prices as well even though I afford it, but we're in this situation because there aren't any competitors. Nvidia can literally set prices as they see fit, but it also has to be within reason though.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Those Intel Iris Pros are suddenly looking _very[/i[ appealing right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _












I had dreams of 4k/60 single cards while still being able to afford a 4k monitor..


----------



## KyadCK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I honestly haven't even read up on HBM. If you take the same GPU and one has GDDR5X and the other HBM, how much faster would the HBM ran GPU be? Is the GPU really waiting for data that much with 480 GBit/sec GDDR5X?


HBM's benefits are not that direct. Yes HBM is much faster (12GB of HBM2 being 750GB/s) and have much lower latency by being far closer to the die, and with everything on the transposer it's easier to cool and the card can be much smaller... But none of that makes the GPU faster unless nVidia put GP102 in a VRAM choke hold. (Probably not)

HBM is simply far more power efficient. You can pack the same performance into less power, and on top of that the Memory controller for the GPU is massively simplified, reducing power cost even more. On it's own, this does nothing. They could continue to pair it with ~3500 cores and see no change at all except the PCB would be Fury size and they power costs would go down maybe 30-40w.

To those of us with cheap power, that means little compared to the added cost of the card, but AMD and nVidia have typically limited themselves to 300w maximum... What it does do is allow the designer to reallocate that power into other things, such as a more god-like die (Ala FuryX). If the Titan XP is a 250w card, they could have said cost be damned, gone 16GB HBM2 clocked at 600Mhz (600GB/s), and crammed another 750 or so shaders and the appropriate front/back end in there for another 20%. If they went full HAM they could probably have gotten 40% more if they also chose to go 300w. FuryX vs 290X in pure compute specs is a fair comparison of GDDR5 vs HBM at the same node and power limits, and HBM gets stuff done.









But that would make the GPU cost *a lot* more to design and make. The FuryX is not a cheap card for AMD, and nor is GP100 for nVidia. You need to design it from the ground up to take advantage, you can't simply slap some HBM on there instead and call it good. And HBM2 is more expensive that GDD5X per GB to boot.

TL;DR, it's too late, people can hope for Volta or Vega to have it. It will not and can not make a difference for GP102.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chaitu87*
> 
> Damn dude. Nvidia really did it this time. What would you suggest I do?


Buy what you can afford, either nVidia or AMD, or have patience for the Vegas reléase and see what happens. This market moves fast, you can't expect to have the best product at a fantastic Price and don't see a better product come up in less than a year.


----------



## i7monkey

And thus, another tier scam was created: 1080Ti name gets scrapped, gets called Titan, price goes way up!

A bunch of us predicted this the past few months.

We'll be getting another tier soon too: Titan *Ultra*. And for $1500.


----------



## CluckyTaco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had dreams of 4k/60 single cards while still being able to afford a 4k monitor..


Yeah a whole bunch of us are all in the same boat, waiting for cheaper monitors to upgrade bu the at the same time suckerpucnched by ridiculous pricing


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> I'm really curious as to why this was suddenly pushed out like this so soon after the 1080. The 1080 is leaps and bounds over the competition as is. When they launched the 780ti it was immediately after the 290x hit - not before it.


Titan X was released when 980 was the fastest and 390X/FuryX still a quarter away. Titan was released when 680 had no problem with 7970Ghz, Titan waits on nobody because they aren't meant to counter a AMD product but instead used to collect $$s for the "Enthusiasts" who must have the fastest card avaliable and is willing to pay $1-1.2K

What would be waiting to either preempt(980Ti) or followup(780Ti) the launch of AMD's flagship product is the 1080Ti which would have no place on the market without Vega.


----------



## Eorzean

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chaitu87*
> 
> Damn dude. Nvidia really did it this time. What would you suggest I do?


I'd just stick to 1080p right now and pick up a RX 480, if I were you. If you want to play maxed out on 1440p, your next choice is the GTX 1080. Though, I guess the 1070 is a good middle ground route, but I'd take higher quality textures over resolution any day.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Those Intel Iris Pros are suddenly looking _very_ appealing right now


Speaking of integrated graphics:
Quote:


> *Jaguar Bajwa - Arete Research Services LLP*
> Okay, well maybe just one final one then. When we get into the server CPU cycle with Zen, should we expect any kind of contribution from an APU format with CPU plus Vega, because we are seeing a lot of acceleration now in the data center? Do you think that could be a key product for you guys, which maybe your competitors may not have, bringing an AP into the server market for high performance servers?
> *Lisa T. Su:*
> Yeah, I think it's fair to say that we do believe we can combine a high performance CPU with the high performance GPU. As we look at our GPU compute in general, both professional graphics and server markets for GPU, I think that will increasingly become an area of focus for us, as we continue to grow the graphics business. So I think the answer is yes. I mean, obviously it will come in time, but it's an area where combining the two technologies makes a lot of sense.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> i dont know...OG Titan as ridiculously priced as it was I recall trumped everything else for a solid year? 18 months..? someone correct me here


780 Ti was as fast as Titans AFAIK, and that's only 9 month. After Nvidia released 780Ti, they had to release the Titan Black so that the Titan card would be faster than the X80Ti card.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> I know, I was simply asking you why you were let down and it isn't because of the performance as you've now stated. The 1080 can push 60 fps at 4K, but it depends on what games you're playing. Also, many reviewers crank up AA etc when it isn't needed at 4K IMO.
> 
> *I don't like the prices as well even though I afford it, but we're in this situation because there aren't any competitors.* Nvidia can literally set prices as they see fit, but it also has to be within reason though.


plus one more very important factor:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> Titan X was released when 980 was the fastest and 390X/FuryX still a quarter away. Titan was released when 680 had no problem with 7970Ghz, Titan waits on nobody because they aren't meant to counter a AMD product but instead used to collect $$s for *the "Enthusiasts" who must have the fastest card avaliable and is willing to pay $1-1.2K*
> 
> What would be waiting to either preempt(980Ti) or followup(780Ti) the launch of AMD's flagship product is the 1080Ti which would have no place on the market without Vega.


I'd say the enablers should share 50% of the blame also.

Case in point: Titan Z @ $3K was an epic fail, but sold out the day it got a 50% price cut.


----------



## Marios145

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chaitu87*
> 
> Damn dude. Nvidia really did it this time. What would you suggest I do?


You could always buy 20-30 AAA games instead, so you will have something to kill your time while waiting for Volta/Vega


----------



## Gunderman456

With this new generation NVIDIA is reaching an all time low while being spurred by the impressionable.









First NVIDIA releases the Founders Edition which is basically the reference card with an extra $100 price tag, take a mid range 1080 and price that at $700 and now they rename the 1080Ti to Titan X and charge over a $1000.

Super


----------



## Fancykiller65

May I ask and get an answer to a question? Nvidia released a 1080, 1070, 1060 and this Titan X in the span of a year, against AMD's 480 and thats all. I figure it's lack of money to compete, or is it something else?


----------



## CluckyTaco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> You could always buy 20-30 AAA games instead, so you will have something to kill your time while waiting for Volta/Vega


Good point. I guess its only stockpiling games till better price/perfomance.


----------



## renx

edit: I haven't say anything.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Marios145*
> 
> You could always buy 20-30 AAA games instead, so you will have something to kill your time while waiting for Volta/Vega


Wait for Steam sales and you could get up to 50 even.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Or you do the sensible thing when buying a $1200 gpu, you water cool it and remove that awful cooler.


Point is that for $1200 that cooler blows. Most sensible thing would be to buy a custom 1080 Ti.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Point is that for $1200 that cooler blows. Most sensible thing would be to buy a custom 1080 Ti.


This IS the 1080 Ti.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Is this really going to be an Nvidia.com exclusive?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> This IS the 1080 Ti.


No, it's the Titan X.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> This IS the 1080 Ti.


This should be added to the OP in size 7 font.


----------



## Marios145

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fancykiller65*
> 
> May I ask and get an answer to a question? Nvidia released a 1080, 1070, 1060 and this Titan X in the span of a year, against AMD's 480 and thats all. I figure it's lack of money to compete, or is it something else?


I think that whatever money amd has, are spent on zen, then leftovers on GPU.
Server cpus is where the real money is, amd could beat nvidia down for 2-3 generations and only barely make profits, but even getting even 10% server market share from intel would bring enough money to pay their debt and bring huge profits.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> No, it's the Titan X.


The rumored full GP102 core has around 3800 cores... this does not. It also has 12GB of VRam, where s Titans of past generations have traditionally had double the memory of their "Ti" siblings. If this was a true Titan, it should have 24GB of Vram, not 12.

Everything points to this Titan XP being the 1080 Ti.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> The rumored full GP102 core has around 3800 cores... this does not. It also has 12GB of VRam, where as Titans of past generations have traditionally had double the memory of their "Ti" compatriots.
> 
> Everything points to this Titan XP being the 1080 Ti.


I think of it as the original Titan and the Titan Black will be out next year.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> I sold my two EVGA Titan X SC when the selling was good and picked up two EVGA GTX 1080 FE. Now I'm thinking of selling the 1080s for one or two of the new Titan X cards.


Do it while you can still make you money back on Inflated Ebay prices, make sure you offer International shipping through Ebay will really bring you a lot of bidders.


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I think of it as the original Titan and the Titan Black will be out next year.


Except they are using the X.


----------



## Somasonic

I really want to upgrade my 980 Ti but this? This will cost $2500 where I live and I doubt I can stomach that. I was really holding out for the 1080 Ti but sadly I think people have it right; there either won't be one or it will be horribly cut down.


----------



## saintruski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Omicron*
> 
> It honestly is. While not 100% sure, the core count on it does look like a cut GP100 or GP102 from speculation. Imho, this card is basically just a GTX 570 (partially cut down big die GF110 core.) If I recall, price on that was... $350-400ish at the most?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This will be 3x that, honestly a bit sad.


GP100 has the same core count, same specs in every area other than GP100 has HBM2, i think GP100 is just given to Tesla.

https://images.nvidia.com/content/pdf/tesla/whitepaper/pascal-architecture-whitepaper.pdf

I think this is indeed full pascal for consumer market.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> Except they are using the X.


X is just a letter. They can add a P to it for all we know. There's no way they would make a "1080 Ti" as an Nvidia store exclusive. I stand by my theory. Ti and new Titan first quarter next year or so.


----------



## Seyumi

Guys there's a serious chance is a Nvidia.com only card. Notice the name is "NVIDIA Titan X" and not a "GeForce ......." card. If this happens then I'm sure the AIO kits from Evga or waterblocks will work since it's probably identical to a 1080. Remember Nvidia tried pulling this BS off with the original Titan by not allowing any custom coolers or PCBs.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> X is just a letter. They can add a P to it for all we know. There's no way they would make a "1080 Ti" as an Nvidia store exclusive. I stand by my theory. Ti and new Titan first quarter next year or so.


Or they continue to tout the 1080 as their Flagship and position the Titan XP as a Halo card. That could happen, too.

I will tell you one thing. Nvidia isn't going to release a 1080 Ti with 6GB of VRAM, and it would be a first for Nvidia to release a "Ti" counterpart with the same memory as their current Titan.

I stand by my theory that the Titan XP is the 1080 Ti.


----------



## Omicron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saintruski*
> 
> GP100 has the same core count, same specs in every area other than GP100 has HBM2, i think GP100 is just given to Tesla.
> 
> https://images.nvidia.com/content/pdf/tesla/whitepaper/pascal-architecture-whitepaper.pdf
> 
> I think this is indeed full pascal for consumer market.


Those papers generally are accurate, but we'll just see how this plays out. The core count just seems odd for a fully enabled GPU.

Hold up, I'm reading through this. Page 10 is suggesting it isn't a full GP100... 60 vs 56 enabled SM units. This Titan is resembling the 56 unit part.

Yeah, review pages 10 and 11 on that document. This is indeed the consumer version of the Tesla P100 which has 56 enabled SM units for 3584 FP32 CUDA cores (what we are looking at here.)

The die diagram above on page 10 notes 60 of these SM clusters while the Tesla has 56 of them (paraphrased quote at the end of the last sentence on the page.)

This is a 570...

Even if this is GP102 and not GP100 (and GP102 natively has 56 SM clusters,) this is still a tad cheesy.


----------



## i7monkey

Midrange:

GF104 = $229

GK104 = $499

GM204 = $549

GP104 = $699

Highend:

GT200 = $499

GF100 = $499

GF110 = $499

GK110 = $699, $999

GM200 = $649, $999

GP102 = $1200

LMAAAAAAAAAOOOOOO


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Or they continue to tout the 1080 as their Flagship and position the Titan XP as a Halo card. That could happen, too.
> 
> I will tell you one thing. Nvidia isn't going to release a 1080 Ti with 6GB of VRAM, and it would be a first for Nvidia to release a "Ti" counterpart with the same memory as their current Titan.
> 
> I stand by my theory that the Titan XP is the 1080 Ti.


I think the Ti will come with 8GB of HBM2.


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> plus one more very important factor:
> I'd say the enablers should share 50% of the blame also.
> 
> Case in point: Titan Z @ $3K was an epic fail, but sold out the day it got a 50% price cut.


True, I guess. But I'd say the lack of option is more to blame, 90% IMHO. :/


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I think the Ti will come with 8GB of HBM2.


Please tell me you're joking. HBM2 is more expensive than GDDR5x. Why would Nvidia release a lower-tier card with better tech for less money?


----------



## emett

So many salty tears today.


----------



## zipper17

I would prefer to wait for the next generation GTX 1270 as fast as Titan XP, less cost XD


----------



## saintruski

Quote:


> Hold up, I'm reading through this. Page 10 is suggesting it isn't a full GP100... 60 vs 56 enabled SM units. This Titan is resembling the 56 unit part.


what? let me look at that i didnt know those details were released


----------



## HeadlessKnight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I want to make an impassioned plea to the members of this forum.
> 
> $1200 for a video card is simply too much. It really is. You know it... I know it... everyone knows it.
> 
> If you're thinking about getting this card, please... don't. Just let it go and wait. If no one buys this card, the price will drop, and when it does, the market will stabilize and become less one-sided. The fact that Nvidia has dropped this card so close to the launch of the GTX 1080 means something is up. I'm not sure what, but lets face it. The GTX 1080 is a stupidly fast card for what it does. There is no reason to go ahead and dethrone it unless AMD or even Nvidia does not have another move coming very soon.
> 
> $1200 is too much. Please don't buy the Pascal Titan X.


This market target that Nvidia and Intel are targeting don't care how much they pay. Nvidia can get away and sell those cards $10,000 a piece and those people will still buy it. The only way to make Nvidia lower prices is competition from AMD and unfortunately there is no competition to force them to lower the price.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Or they continue to tout the 1080 as their Flagship and position the Titan XP as a Halo card. That could happen, too.
> 
> I will tell you one thing. Nvidia isn't going to release a 1080 Ti with 6GB of VRAM, and it would be a first for Nvidia to release a "Ti" counterpart with the same memory as their current Titan.
> 
> I stand by my theory that the Titan XP is the 1080 Ti.


I think pretty much everyone that understands nVidia's GPU history has agreed that Titan XP is indeed the 1080 Ti in disguise.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HeadlessKnight*
> 
> This market target that Nvidia and Intel are targeting don't care how much they pay. Nvidia can get away and sell those cards $10,000 a piece and those people will still buy it. The only way to make Nvidia lower prices is competition from AMD and unfortunately there is no competition to force them to lower the price.


I'd wager the ceiling for a single GPU card is somewhere around $2000. Remember Titan Z at $3000 was a huge fail, so there IS a ceiling, we just haven't hit it yet.


----------



## i7monkey

The 680 is where the scam started. 680 kept the name but lost the big die and cost full flagship prices ($499).

Titan took it way further. Cut-down flagship, new name, significant price increase.

The scam then spread to the 780. An even more cut-down version of a 570 for $659.

Then to the 980. Same garbage as the 680 but $50 more.

Then to the 2015 Titan X. Titan price tag but missing Titan features (no compute).

1080. Same garbage as the 680 but now costs $699!

Titan X 2016. Exact equivalent of a GTX 570 but for $1200.

Every release we keep getting less and less but pay more and more. All they're doing is _*shifting a few names*_.

This isn't the end. Expect a Titan Ultra in the near future and they will officially push the Titan envelope even further by giving us Titan features at a much higher price. Don't be surprised if Titan X Ultra costs $1399-$1499.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Please tell me you're joking. HBM2 is more expensive than GDDR5x. Why would Nvidia release a lower-tier card with better tech for less money?


Are you considering buying this Titan X?


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I think the Ti will come with 8GB of HBM2.


Then Ti can't be on the GP102 chip, you can't design a chip to both accept HBM2 and GDDR5X, hence why GP102(GDDR5X) vs GP100(HBM2)


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Are you considering buying this Titan X?


I have dual 1070's at the moment, so you tell me.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> The 680 is where the scam started. 680 kept the name but lost the big die and cost full flagship prices ($499).
> 
> Titan took it way further. Cut-down flagship, new name, significant price increase.
> 
> The scam then spread to the 780. An even more cut-down version of a 570 for $659.
> 
> Then to the 980. Same garbage as the 680 but $50 more.
> 
> Then to the 2015 Titan X. Titan price tag but missing Titan features (no compute).
> 
> 1080. Same garbage as the 680 but now costs $699!
> 
> Titan X 2016. Exact equivalent of a GTX 570 but for $1200.
> 
> Every release we keep getting less and less but pay more and more. All they're doing is _*shifting a few names*_.
> 
> This isn't the end. Expect a Titan Ultra in the near future and they will officially push the Titan envelope even further by giving us Titan features at a much higher price. Don't be surprised if Titan X Ultra costs $1399-$1499.


They have no reason to stop when people still buy it. Simply math of supply and demand.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I have dual 1070's at the moment, so you tell me.


I'm not a psychic.


----------



## Omicron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saintruski*
> 
> what? let me look at that i didnt know those details were released


Yeah, that's what I am reading on page 10 of the document. They mention the fully enabled GP100 being 3840, while our Titan and Tesla friend here has less than that (page 11 even admits to this.)

I'm willing to bet this is indeed that same style of die salvaged from the Tesla (you're totally right on that,) and either GP100 has GDDR5X support, or this is some new GP102 die with the same core count and GDDR5X support. It would be a little odd for GP100 to do both HBM and GDDR5X...

Given the core diagram, I don't think Nvidia would cook up a new 56 SM die just for the Titan when they have a perfectly good 56 cut down 60 SM pattern to use.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm not a psychic.


And I'm not a fool.

No, I'm not planning on purchasing a Titan XP.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> And I'm not a fool *an enthusiast*.
> 
> No, I'm not planning on purchasing a Titan XP.


FTFY


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> The 680 is where the scam started. 680 kept the name but lost the big die and cost full flagship prices ($499).
> 
> Titan took it way further. Cut-down flagship, new name, significant price increase.
> 
> The scam then spread to the 780. An even more cut-down version of a 570 for $659.
> 
> Then to the 980. Same garbage as the 680 but $50 more.
> 
> Then to the 2015 Titan X. Titan price tag but missing Titan features (no compute).
> 
> 1080. Same garbage as the 680 but now costs $699!
> 
> Titan X 2016. Exact equivalent of a GTX 570 but for $1200.
> 
> Every release we keep getting less and less but pay more and more. All they're doing is _*shifting a few names*_.
> 
> This isn't the end. Expect a Titan Ultra in the near future and they will officially push the Titan envelope even further by giving us Titan features at a much higher price. Don't be surprised if Titan X Ultra costs $1399-$1499.


And AMD enabled them all the way

680 got away with being a Mid size chip because it was faster than the 7970
780 got away with the $659 price because 290X was 5 month late
980 got away with $550 because it was faster than 780Ti and 290X
1080 got away with $650 avg price because Vega is no where to be found.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> FTFY


Oh you cheeky little...


----------



## ikjadoon

Hmm..will they actually sell for $1200, though? Maybe $1500 if supply is low?

It seems awfully closely priced to some of the GTX 1080s from like two weeks ago.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Oh you cheeky little...











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> Hmm..will they actually sell for $1200, though? Maybe $1500 if supply is low?
> 
> It seems awfully closely priced to some of the GTX 1080s from like two weeks ago.


lol nVidia won't stoop to the level of scalpers (I can only hope)

On some level it's actually a good thing this is an nVidia shop exclusive, because it would really help to clamp down on the amount of scalping.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> And I'm not a fool.
> 
> No, I'm not planning on purchasing a Titan XP.


So Ur calling people that buy this card fools? Wasn't your cards almost $900?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So Ur calling people that buy this card fools? Wasn't your cards almost $900?


I'm saying that I just spent $940 for literally the Nvidia fangurl edition of GTX 1070 SLI (including their HB SLI bridge), and it would be insanity to turn around and buy a $1200 video card as well.

I just played a round of BF4 @ 5160x2160, maxed settings, and got an average of 80 FPS. 1070 SLI is beyond overkill already for any game that I can throw at it.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Where are all the people arguing against me saying we wouldn't see the Titan this year? Come eat your Crow,


I've known since May but you don't see me being a tit about it









Price is yikes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I'm saying that I just spent $940 for literally the Nvidia fangurl edition of GTX 1070 SLI (including their HB SLI bridge), and it would be insanity to turn around and buy a $1200 video card as well.
> 
> I just played a round of BF4 @ 5160x2160, maxed settings, and got an average of 80 FPS. 1070 SLI is beyond overkill already.


So you didn't buy the flagship cards anyway? Was the 1080 too rich for your blood also? Where does it stop?


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'd wager the ceiling for a single GPU card is somewhere around $2000. Remember Titan Z at $3000 was a huge fail, so there IS a ceiling, we just haven't hit it yet.


Well the consumers weren't lubed up enough yet. As long as nvidia keeps inching it in a couple hundred dollars at a time they will get back up there eventually. Just need to take it slow.


----------



## th3illusiveman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *970Rules*
> 
> https://twitter.com/nvidia/status/756312110590820353
> 
> Will post all incoming specs as we get it.
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y02kptTItj8&feature=share
> 
> https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/07/21/titan-x-deep-learning/
> 
> Donning the leather jacket he goes very few places without, NVIDIA CEO showed up at AI meet-up at Stanford this evening to show, for the very first time, a graphics card based on a brand new Pascal GP102 GPU.
> 
> We packed the most raw horsepower we possibly could into this GPU. Driven by 3584 NVIDIA CUDA® cores running at 1.5GHz, TITAN X packs 11 TFLOPs of brute force. Plus it's armed with 12 GB of GDDR5X memory - one of the fastest memory technologies in the world.
> 
> Up to 60% faster performance than previous TITAN X
> 
> 12B Transistors
> GP102 will feature 40% more CUDA cores than the GP104
> Memory Bandwidth 480 GB/s
> 250 Walts. 1 8-pin and 1 6-pin
> *Price $1,200 USD
> *
> 
> The card will be available on August 2nd in the US and Europe.

















hahaha, All those years ago when the original titan launched, I argued for many days about the implications about people running out and throwing down $1000 on a single GPU card. I told them, that when Nvidia realizes they can get away with severely overpricing hardware, they will overprice it again. They all argued that would not happen, That Nvidia wouldn't go higher.

Here we are with a $1200 single GPU card. Good job.

GPU's getting faster is nothing new, it's the way of the world. New more efficient hardware comes in to replace old obsolete hardware. You can't just increase the price because the technology advances. By that logic, a new Honda civic should be $100,000 compared to the older ones since it's more efficient and has new technology. But that doesn't happen. So why are gamers so easily tricked by this greedy corporation?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> So you didn't buy the flagship cards anyway? Was the 1080 too rich for your blood also? Where does it stop?


So we're clear, I never planned on purchasing 1070 SLI. However, I fell into some money (new job), and decided to take the plunge.


----------



## bmgjet

Hmmm, Wonder if I RMA a old Titan X if ill get the new TitanX


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> I'm saying that I just spent $940 for literally the Nvidia fangurl edition of GTX 1070 SLI (including their HB SLI bridge), and it would be insanity to turn around and buy a $1200 video card as well.
> 
> I just played a round of BF4 @ 5160x2160, maxed settings, and got an average of 80 FPS. 1070 SLI is beyond overkill already for any game that I can throw at it.


Meh, Battlefield is no Crysis. I get your point though.


----------



## i7monkey

Don't get it twisted.

GTX 570 (cut-down flagship) = OG Titan (cut-down flagship) = 980Ti (cut-down flagship) = Titan X 2016 (cut-down flagship)

$349 --> $1200

Same hardware segment, almost 4x the price. Completely ******ed.


----------



## BrotherBeast

Nvidia....Titan X @ $1200


----------



## saintruski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Omicron*
> 
> Yeah, that's what I am reading on page 10 of the document. They mention the fully enabled GP100 being 3840, while our Titan and Tesla friend here has less than that (page 11 even admits to this.)
> 
> I'm willing to bet this is indeed that same style of die salvaged from the Tesla (you're totally right on that,) and either GP100 has GDDR5X support, or this is some new GP102 die with the same core count and GDDR5X support. It would be a little odd for GP100 to do both HBM and GDDR5X...
> 
> Given the core diagram, I don't think Nvidia would cook up a new 56 SM die just for the Titan when they have a perfectly good 56 cut down 60 SM pattern to use.


So what this titan x here is, is a GP100 dubbed GP102...but not a FULL GP100 as the current Tesla GP100 isnt even a full GP100 (i assumed it was as it was GP100) as i failed to notice its 56SMs (thanks for spotting that) and will actually be 3840 on 60 (and for spotting that)

Whatever Nvidia is doing for design to accommodate both HBM2 and GDDR5X on essentially the same die is interesting


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hahaha, All those years ago when the original titan launched, I argued for many days about the implications about people running out and throwing down $1000 on a single GPU card. I told them, that when Nvidia realizes they can get away with severely overpricing hardware, they will do it again. They all argued that would not happen, That Nvidia wouldn't go higher.
> 
> Here we are with a $1200 single GPU card. Good job.


But, you realize...for NVIDIA as a company, it would be asinine to avoid this market, right? They would be shooting themselves in the foot. If you were a stockholder, today is a great day.









"overpricing hardware" - well, sure.







It might take 4 months or 4 years for AMD to be competitive again. We'll all still be around, just waiting...


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Don't get it twisted.
> 
> GTX 570 (cut-down flagship) = OG Titan (cut-down flagship) = 980Ti (cut-down flagship) = Titan X 2016 (cut-down flagship)
> 
> $349 --> $1200
> 
> Same hardware segment, almost 4x the price. Completely ******ed.


And Intel flagship is $1700. Welcome to the new Era. We are all screwed


----------



## Nickyvida

Good job titan owners. $1'200 for a titan now.

Thanks for giving nvidia breaking an already astronomical price bubble for minimal actual performance gains.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> And Intel flagship is $1700. Welcome to the new Era. We are all screwed


Hahah, is this the gentrification of PC components?

You all realize...game developers know few people will buy these. Games won't require a Titan X at 1080p. You can just keep on buying GTX 1060s and they'll be just fine.


----------



## i7monkey

Seriously guys, don't get it twisted, this hunk of junk they're selling for $1200 is the hardware equivalent of a GTX 570. Both are cut-down versions of the flagship GPU.

Would you buy a 570 for $1200?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Well the consumers weren't lubed up enough yet. As long as nvidia keeps inching it in a couple hundred dollars at a time they will get back up there eventually. Just need to take it slow.


I'm not cynical enough (yet) to think that people need instant gratification so badly that they'd be willing to pay >$2000 for a single GPU.

Then again just like human stupidity, the need for instant gratification knows no bounds.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> But, you realize...for NVIDIA as a company, it would be asinine to avoid this market, right? They would be shooting themselves in the foot. If you were a stockholder, today is a great day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "overpricing hardware" - well, sure.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It might take 4 months or 4 years for AMD to be competitive again. We'll all still be around, just waiting...


Mark my words, when Titan VX comes out with HBM2, it will cost $1500 minimum.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Would you buy a 570 for $1200?


I dunno... I heard Nvidia's next GPU to be released will be called the Nvidia 570 X. It will also be sold exclusively on Nvidia's website.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Seriously guys, don't get it twisted, this hunk of junk they're selling for $1200 is the hardware equivalent of a GTX 570. Both are cut-down versions of the flagship GPU.
> 
> Would you buy a 570 for $1200?


Since when are we buying "architectures"? I buy frames, mate. If you bring the frames, I'll bring the cash. I don't care what black magic you need to give me those frames.

But, do I need this many frames? Doubtful, haha.


----------



## bossie2000

Quote:


> Also don't think AMD wouldn't love to have a card they could sell in this price range if they could.


I think they can if they want to.But seems like their effort is more to the way of the 1080p gamer,which is by far the most gamers out their and to bring it to a good prise aka RX 480 !


----------



## iLeakStuff

Told you it had GDDR5X. And would cost $1200....

I soooo want one. But that price though...
This is a true 4K card for sure


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Seriously guys, don't get it twisted, this hunk of junk they're selling for $1200 is the hardware equivalent of a GTX 570. Both are cut-down versions of the flagship GPU.
> 
> Would you buy a 570 for $1200?


I wouldn't(not this card either, as my OCed 1080 magically pulls 4K60FPS on my games with FXAA or no AA), but if 570 was the *fastest card in the market by 45%* and sold dutch auction style, there would be people willing to pay $1200 or more for it.

People don't pay for video card by silicon sizes or disabled core counts, they buy it to trade $$ for performance and epeen and Titans given them just that.


----------



## Zero4549

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-titan-x/specifications

Weak card Nvidia. What is this, 2015? I'm starting to see why VR is "20 years off"


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> So we're clear, I never planned on purchasing 1070 SLI. However, I fell into some money (new job), and decided to take the plunge.


What if you ran into even more money?

See my point? I do get what you're saying, but without competition this won't change.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> I wouldn't(not this card either, as 1080 magically pulls 4K60FPS on my games with FXAA or no AA), but if 570 was the fastest card in the market by 45% and sold dutch auction style, there will be people willing to pay $1200 or more for it.
> 
> People don't pay for video card by silicon sizes or disabled core counts, they buy it to trade $$ for performance and epeen and Titans given them just that.


Thank you. This community has gone insane over "full-fat" and "cut down" and "Titan!!111 The Ti!".

How about you just buy the performance you want? Is OCN the Pursuit of Performance...or the Pursuit of Specification Sheets.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Mark my words, when Titan VX comes out with HBM2, it will cost $1500 minimum.


And if people buy it, then NVIDIA has made a good marketing decision.

I mean, would we be angry if McDonalds started offering a $15 burger?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> What if you ran into even more money?
> 
> See my point? I do get what you're saying, but without competition this won't change.


Good point.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> I wouldn't(not this card either, as my OCed 1080 magically pulls 4K60FPS on my games with FXAA or no AA), but if 570 was the *fastest card in the market by 45%* and sold dutch auction style, there would be people willing to pay $1200 or more for it.
> 
> People don't pay for video card by silicon sizes or disabled core counts, they buy it to trade $$ for performance and *epeen* and Titans given them just that.


Truth be told, I think this is the biggest factor actually.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> Thank you. This community has gone insane over "full-fat" and "cut down" and "Titan!!111 The Ti!".
> 
> How about you just buy the performance you want? Is OCN the Pursuit of Performance...or the Pursuit of Specification Sheets.
> And if people buy it, then NVIDIA has made a good marketing decision.
> 
> I mean, would we be angry if McDonalds started offering a $15 burger?


But... but... but...

*TYTAHN EXPEE!!!!*

(It's past my bed time. Ya'll have fun!)


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nickyvida*
> 
> Good job titan owners. $1'200 for a titan now.
> Thanks for giving nvidia breaking an already astronomical price bubble for *minimal* actual performance gains.


Minimal? "cough cough" Arguing against the performance gains with this card is quite frankly impossible. Just saying....


----------



## Pyrotagonist

How far can NVIDIA go? Upon the reveal of the Founders brand, who could have imagined that it was synonymous with reference? Who could have imagined that NV would sell a Funders edition of a mainstream card? Maybe a few of us, but no one could have predicted a $1200 1080 Ti.

NV just keeps crushing our expectations, and us along with them.









Personally, I hope they don't ship a single unit of this turd, but I have a feeling I'll be seeing it above the Titan X in the Steam hardware survey by next January. With the OG Titan X, at least you got all the VRAM and cores.


----------



## guttheslayer

Where is majin?!! Where is chev?! Where is our prophet who predict titan wont be out on q3.

Are they digging a hole to hide?


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> But... but... but...
> 
> *TYTAHN EXPEE!!!!*
> 
> (It's past my bed time. Ya'll have fun!)


bahahaha. I'd love to see OCN members try to buy graphic cards blind. You don't know the core count, the frequency, the brand, etc. Nothing. Just performance.

Then....let's see what cards people buy,


----------



## nyxagamemnon

Given this Titan only has 12gb we won't see a 1080ti. This is the 1080ti named Titan..

They wouldn't release a 6gb 1080ti lol...


----------



## Vesku

Oct/Nov we will probably see GDDR5X Vega and some sort of further cut down GP102 to fill in below Titan X2.


----------



## n4p0l3onic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> And thus, another tier scam was created: 1080Ti name gets scrapped, gets called Titan, price goes way up!
> 
> A bunch of us predicted this the past few months.
> 
> We'll be getting another tier soon too: Titan *Ultra*. And for $1500.


Nah Hsun Huang is still a bit too late, Intel already done it yet again with usd 1500 i7 6950x just like they did on the original lga 2011 platform

I fully expect Hsun Huang trying to outpace intel, usd 2000 it is then for next gen nvidia Geforce JHH edition.


----------



## HMBR

kind of disappointing that is not GP100, only the pros get the real deal with HBM2 and such

still, that's a lot stronger than the 1080, and the 1080 OC already destroys everything else by a decent margin

I wonder if they are going to follow the past generations and release a cheaper 1080 ti soon enough, or if they are going to wait forever since there is 0 competition for anything higher than the 1060.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> Since when are we buying "architectures"? *I buy frames, mate.* If you bring the frames, I'll bring the cash. I don't care what black magic you need to give me those frames.


You used to get an x% increase in frames between releases and *prices stayed the same*.

Since the GTX 680, you've been incrementally paying more and more for the *same* improvement except it's now reached almost 4 times the price.

A GTX 570 shouldn't cost $1200, they used to cost $329.


----------



## Nickyvida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> Minimal? "cough cough" Arguing against the performance gains with this card is quite frankly impossible. Just saying....


There could have been more gains. Not very impressive tbh. But there isnt any competition from amd so they are content to milk gullible titan buyers until the next HBM Titan where they will slap another price premium on top of it for the omg hbmzorz and inevitable FE crap.

Before y know it it will be 2k for a titan. And mainstream prices will go up as well. Look at 1080 for exampke


----------



## hollowtek

I'd be dying if AMD named a flagship "iceberg" (as long as they could back up that claim lol)


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hollowtek*
> 
> I'd be dying if AMD named a flagship "iceberg" (as long as they could back up that claim lol)


Teehee, and the slightly cut down "xx80TI style" variant could be "just the tip" *dies*


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> Thank you. This community has gone insane over "full-fat" and "cut down" and "Titan!!111 The Ti!".
> 
> How about you just buy the performance you want? Is OCN the Pursuit of Performance...or the Pursuit of Specification Sheets.
> And if people buy it, then NVIDIA has made a good marketing decision.
> 
> I mean, would we be angry if McDonalds started offering a $15 burger?


Oh I have no doubt it will be sold out everywhere on launch day, thus prompting further price increases until the price ceiling is finally reached at some point (the point at which even 95% of the rick enthusiasts find the price distasteful).

As for the $15 MacDee burger, that would just be business suicide, because nobody would pay for that overpriced, diabetes inducing, liver destroying, blood vessel clogging garbage lol.


----------



## Wishmaker

Oh look! Another NVIDIA product and another OCN cuddle thread where we all say 'oh boy let's hope AMD has some competition at the top. Prices are ridiculous'. Saw the same attitude last generation, and the generation before that. I think we need some DX12 and how good it runs on AMD cards to make this NVIDIA launch look bad.

You know what they say, when in doubt, take out the DX12 card and tell people to wait 6-7 months for the AMD high end which will need 3 years to be as good as what NVIDIA releases today.


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Oh I have no doubt it will be sold out everywhere on launch day, thus prompting further price increases until the price ceiling is finally reached at some point (the point at which even 95% of the rick enthusiasts find the price distasteful).
> 
> *As for the $15 MacDee burger, that would just be business suicide, because nobody would pay for that overpriced, diabetes inducing, liver destroying, blood vessel clogging garbage lol*.


Well.. you say that, but I happen to know of some people who almost exclusively eat at big chain fast food, and would throw any ammount of money requested at their drive threw windows for a cleverly named limited time special.

Upon completion of that statement, I now believe I might need some new friends...


----------



## twitchyzero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *speedyeggtart*
> 
> A lot of people on OCN were saying Pascal will be using HBM2 - now almost the whole Pascal line is out and not HBM or HBM2....


i dont think ANYONE was expecting it 2 months after the midrange chip from GTX 1080


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero4549*
> 
> Well.. you say that, but I happen to know of some people who almost exclusively eat at big chain fast food, and would throw any ammount of money requested at their drive threw windows for a cleverly named limited time special.
> 
> Upon completion of that statement, I now believe I might need some new friends...


I've been visiting at least one fast food chain every weekend since about 2 years ago, but I'd never imagine spending >$15 there, let alone on a single item.

Incidentally, I also need some new friends, wanna hang out?


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I've been visiting at least one fast food chain every weekend since about 2 years ago, but I'd never imagine spending >$15 there, let alone on a single item.
> 
> Incidentally, I also need some new friends, wanna hang out?


Deal


----------



## Kriant

Ehhhhhh I'll pass. This price is ridiculous, given that this is just a 1 chip card, and not a full Pascal at that. I hope it will repeat the fate of titan z.


----------



## n4p0l3onic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> The 680 is where the scam started. 680 kept the name but lost the big die and cost full flagship prices ($499).


I'm pretty sure JHH took inspiration from the original lga 1366 x58 platform by intel, that was when intel introduced the special ultra high end platform, then they fully committed to it later with when they started labelling mid end cpu as i7


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero4549*
> 
> Deal


cool brb stalking searching you on twitter/fb
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kriant*
> 
> Ehhhhhh I'll pass. This price is ridiculous, given that this is just a 1 chip card, and not a full Pascal at that. I hope it will repeat the fate of titan z.





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



It won't.


----------



## Xuvial

Now THIS is what will truly satisfy a [email protected] or [email protected] monitor with demanding games.

But $1200 USD...in NZ that price is going to be around $2200









Guys...I think I still might buy this anyway. I don't know anymore.

help me


----------



## magnek

btw I believe it's official now: nVidia is the new Apple


----------



## saintruski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> btw I believe it's official now: nVidia is the new Apple


But i dont think Apple holds the majority of any market its in does it? Thats the key difference.


----------



## guttheslayer

Anyone know if this new titan x have DP compute?
How about flop for DP?

Anyway its all thanks to AMD . Their incompetent encourage both intel and nvidia to destroy the PC community. Good job AMD. Hope someone buy u over.


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Anyone know if this new titan x have DP compute?
> How about flop for DP?
> 
> Anyway its all thanks to AMD . Their incompetent encourage both intel and nvidia to destroy the PC community. Good job AMD. Hope someone buy u over.


The only DP happening here is with JH and the Titan with our wallets and butts.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saintruski*
> 
> But i dont think Apple holds the majority of any market its in does it? Thats the key difference.


Nvidia would be Apple If it sold no card below X80, Apple hold majority of phones above $600 and Tablet above $500 I believe.


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nickyvida*
> 
> There could have been more gains. Not very impressive tbh. But there isnt any competition from amd so they are content to milk gullible titan buyers until the next HBM Titan where they will slap another price premium on top of it for the omg hbmzorz and inevitable FE crap.
> 
> Before y know it it will be 2k for a titan. And mainstream prices will go up as well. Look at 1080 for exampke


I said it previously that I don't like the price, (who does?) but arguing against the Titan Pascal's performance will get you nowhere. The performance is uncontested. The only complaint that makes sense at this point is the pricing.


----------



## JakdMan

Well, here we are. Now to see if the rumors were right about there being 2 Titans since this is clearly the baby titan.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> I said it previously that I don't like the price, (who does?) but arguing against the Titan Pascal's performance will get you nowhere. The performance is uncontested. The only complaint that makes sense at this point is the pricing.


Guess my mentality now?

Better buy it before it inflate further.

having such thought means its bad time for pc community. Big bad time.


----------



## Xuvial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saintruski*
> 
> But i dont think Apple holds the majority of any market its in does it? Thats the key difference.


Well no, the key difference is that Apple isn't destroying performance charts and pushing to the top with insane TFLOPS. That's what nVidia is doing and they have put an extremely high premium on obtaining that performance.

Meanwhile Apple mainly holds it's market share by making a fashion statement, having reliable/durable products, and providing exceptional customer service.

Two very different ways of establishing a sizeable market presence.


----------



## Mech0z

So now even Titan is not full fat core :S (GP102 vs GP100) guess HBM based cards will be a new series


----------



## th3illusiveman

There are people out there defending the pricing







. Guess some people just love being lubed up... Lets be real here, the vast majority of people on OCN can't afford this card. Gone are the days of $550 Flagships... and that's pretty sad.


----------



## guttheslayer

Does this titan have backplate btw?


----------



## i7monkey

and all they're doing is shifting their names









same hardware, different names, more money

so sad


----------



## saintruski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> There are people out there defending the pricing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Guess some people just love being lubed up... Lets be real here, the vast majority of people on OCN can't afford this card. Gone are the days of $550 Flagships... and that's pretty sad.


You can still get AMD flagships


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Guess my mentality now?
> 
> Better buy it before it inflate further.
> 
> having such thought means its bad time for pc community. Big bad time.


That'll hopefully never happen... haha
But yeah, the PC community keeps getting shafted.
PostalTwinkie's comment was funny too.









We picked the wrong hobby boys.


----------



## twitchyzero

specs DO matter...you're getting LESS/INFERIOR goods for a higher price. Suppose an econobox has similar or better 0-60 spec of a high-end sports car built the same year. Does that automatically mean the econobox can suddenly charge exorbitant amount?

Tech advances...so does inflation, but these are NOT inflation.

Titan is supposed to be a halo product, with the most advanced tech on board. nV started screwing with that when they took out compute last year.

I don't care if HBM gains over 5X are minimal in current gaming tests. They want $1K+ then they better give the best they've got at the time, no holding back.

If HBM is not ready yet...don't release the Titan...who knows maybe AMD has a trump card on monday if recent history is anything to go by...they're dead to me in the upper GPU segment.

i paid $300ish for a cut-down midrange (670) and I felt like a chump then but I can't believe they've taken the milking to the next level.

Whenever the full unlocked die with HBM2 comes out, that will be my next and likely my last video card because this hardware game is getting ridiculous. I'd rather put my funds into other hobbies.

My gaming 'career' can semi-retire as a console peasant...i'll deal with inferior textures but at least I know my wallet is not getting bent over nV and Intel


----------



## n4p0l3onic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> There are people out there defending the pricing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Guess some people just love being lubed up... Lets be real here, the vast majority of people on OCN can't afford this card. Gone are the days of $550 Flagships... and that's pretty sad.


Well I have to argue that all intel cpu owners post the original i7 and it's little siblings are also the cause

When intel started to differentiate their products with x series motherboard, that was the real start of this madness

Your i5 is like what celeron was 10 years ago, your z motherboard i7 is the same, the equivalent to 10 years ago pentium is the i7 on the x series motherboard...

So in a way us, gamers, enthusiasts are all guilty, unless perhaps if you use amd all this time...

Lmao.


----------



## Nestala

No HBM2 is disappointing. Also the name is stupid. Should've just called it Titan P or at least Titan X2 or something.

And let me guess, August 2 will only be a paper launch or a real "launch" but there will be nearly no stock.

Yeah, no, gonna wait for some real cards with HBM2 to come out.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> specs DO matter...you're getting LESS/INFERIOR goods for a higher price. Suppose an econobox has similar or better 0-60 spec of a high-end sports car built the same year. Does that automatically mean the econobox can suddenly charge exorbitant amount?
> 
> Tech advances...so does inflation, but these are NOT inflation.
> 
> Titan is supposed to be a halo product, with the most advanced tech on board. nV started screwing with that when they took out compute last year.
> 
> *I don't care if HBM gains over 5X are minimal in current gaming tests. They want $1K+ then they better give the best they've got at the time, no holding back.*
> 
> If HBM is not ready yet...don't release the Titan...who knows maybe AMD has a trump card on monday if recent history is anything to go by...they're dead to me in the upper GPU segment.
> 
> i paid $300ish for a cut-down midrange (670) and I felt like a chump then but I can't believe they've taken the milking to the next level.


Pretty much this.

Titan is supposed to represent the pinnacle of the product stack. This Titan XP is anything but.


----------



## Nickyvida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> I said it previously that I don't like the price, (who does?) but arguing against the Titan Pascal's performance will get you nowhere. The performance is uncontested. The only complaint that makes sense at this point is the pricing.


40% improvement over 1080 is meh for that ridiculous price. No competition so Nvidia is content to milk more while sitting on faster cards.

Just cause it is 40% over the fastest card doesnt make it all impressive.


----------



## saintruski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nestala*
> 
> No HBM2 is disappointing. Also the name is stupid. Should've just called it Titan P or at least Titan X2 or something.
> 
> And let me guess, August 2 will only be a paper launch or a real "launch" but there will be nearly no stock.
> 
> Yeah, no, gonna wait for some real cards with HBM2 to come out.


Should have just changed it to a god like Chaos which was a primordial deity...Chaos X


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nickyvida*
> 
> 40% improvement over 1080 is meh for that price. No competition so Nvidia is content to milk more while sitting on faster cards.
> 
> Just cause it is 40% over the fastest card doesmt make it all impressive.


I can pretty much guarantee right now it won't be 40% improvement. We'd be lucky if it hits 30% improvement.

Just look at Titan X vs 980: Titan X was exactly 1.5x of 980 in terms of chip specs, but in actual gaming it was anywhere from 25-35% faster. If we assume similar scaling with Pascal, Titan XP will probably be around 25% faster than 1080 on average.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saintruski*
> 
> Should have just changed it to a different god like Chaos which was a primordial deity...Chaos X


Titanic X


----------



## saintruski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Titanic X


every card comes with jen tastefully posing on a couch etched into your cards backplate.

Cuz lets face it this isnt sinking anytime soon, this card will sell well. and always will unless they pull a titan z price.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I can pretty much guarantee right now it won't be 40% improvement. We'd be lucky if it hits 30% improvement.
> 
> Just look at Titan X vs 980: Titan X was exactly 1.5x of 980 in terms of chip specs, but in actual gaming it was anywhere from 25-35% faster. If we assume similar scaling with Pascal, Titan XP will probably be around 25% faster than 1080 on average.
> Titanic X


Meanwhile og titan x selling for 300.

Ppl get con and pay for 1200 and sue nvidia.









Anyway... So do they have backplate?


----------



## magnek

Also, Titan XP probably won't even reach 2 GHz, if GP104 is any indication.

Generally, the big chips overclock slightly worse than their smaller counterparts, as we saw for GM200 vs GM204. nVidia's officially listed boost for 1080 is 1733 MHz, and the usable ceiling seems to be around 2100, so that's 21% headroom. Titan XP's officially listed boost is 1531 MHz, and a 21% headroom means a usable ceiling of around 1850 MHz.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Titan is supposed to represent the pinnacle of the product stack.


except that it doesn't. titan doesn't mean anything. it's a worthless name, a gimmick.

specs are specs. they can call it a Titan Thor Ultra, if it falls in the same product segment as a GTX 570 but costs $1200, they can go to hell.

specs are everything, marketing isn't.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Never thought Pascal Titan would arrive before AIB 480s, just saying lol


----------



## DADDYDC650

I was considering selling my 1080 FTW until I saw the price and specs. Disappointed in you Jen/Nvidia.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> except that it doesn't. titan doesn't mean anything. it's a worthless name, a gimmick.
> 
> specs are specs. they can call it a Titan Thor Ultra, if it falls in the same product segment as a GTX 570 but costs $1200, they can go to hell.
> 
> specs are everything, marketing isn't.


I didnt said that, why quote me.


----------



## magnek

*I* said that, so quote system messed up lol. In any case, that was my point basically. This card is no Titan, it's just a 1080 Ti in disguise with Titan pricing.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> *I* said that, so quote system messed up lol. In any case, that was my point basically. This card is no Titan, it's just a 1080 Ti in disguise with Titan pricing.


It is just like original Titan though, which was cut down version.


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I can pretty much guarantee right now it won't be 40% improvement. We'd be lucky if it hits 30% improvement.
> 
> Just look at Titan X vs 980: Titan X was exactly 1.5x of 980 in terms of chip specs, but in actual gaming it was anywhere from 25-35% faster. If we assume similar scaling with Pascal, Titan XP will probably be around 25% faster than 1080 on average.
> Titanic X


That'd give no room for the Ti variant. I don't buy that this Titan Pascal is the Ti replacement. However, it is most likely the baby Titan, hence why it didn't get a new name, or so I believe for now until we get more information.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> *I* said that, so quote system messed up lol. In any case, that was my point basically. This card is no Titan, it's just a 1080 Ti in disguise with Titan pricing.


and the 1080ti is a 570 in disguise.

they keep shifting the specs downwards while retaining higher end names.

in 3 years a Gx104 with a 332nm die will be called Titan and cost $1000


----------



## Mhill2029

I was spot on, I said all along it'll be released this year.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> and the 1080ti is a 570 in disguise.
> 
> they keep shifting the specs downwards and while keeping names.
> 
> in 3 years a Gx104 with a 332nm die will be called Titan and cost $1000


There is nothing we can do when there is no competing parts from red side. Sad reality.


----------



## i7monkey




----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> It is just like original Titan though, which was cut down version.


Sure but even the best Tesla card you could buy at the time was the cut down K20X, which shared the same specs with the original Titan.

We know that GP100 with HBM2 exists, and this Titan X doesn't use that chip. Hence me saying this Titan X isn't the pinnacle of the product stack.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> That'd give no room for the Ti variant. I don't buy that this Titan Pascal is the Ti replacement. However, it is most likely the baby Titan, hence why it didn't get a new name, or so I believe for now until we get more information.


Well Baby Titan really is just another fancy name for 1080 Ti isn't it.









I mean the 980 Ti was a baby Titan X, and the 780 was a baby Titan if you really think about it.


----------



## blue1512

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> That'd give no room for the Ti variant. I don't buy that this Titan Pascal is the Ti replacement. However, it is most likely the baby Titan, hence why it didn't get a new name, or so I believe for now until we get more information.


780Ti was a full chip, while the original Titan was not. Nothing they can't do with their products.


----------



## Mhill2029

When's the 16GB Version with HBM2 coming is what I want to know?

I'm guessing March 2017.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> When's the 16GB Version with HBM2 coming is what I want to know?
> 
> I'm guessing March 2017.


Unless AMD forces their hand I just don't see them releasing an HBM2 card for Pascal. So maybe never.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Sure but even the best Tesla card you could buy at the time was the cut down K20X, which shared the same specs with the original Titan.
> 
> We know that GP100 with HBM2 exists, and this Titan X doesn't use that chip. Hence me saying this Titan X isn't the pinnacle of the product stack.
> Well Baby Titan really is just another fancy name for 1080 Ti isn't it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean the 980 Ti was a baby Titan X, and the 780 was a baby Titan if you really think about it.


We might get a full chip but even that might not feature HBM2. since they actually made a new chip with different memory interface.


----------



## Ha-Nocri

$1000 mark broken and still w/o HBM2. That happened fast. But even if they priced it 2k some ppl would buy it


----------



## Whach

I think this pretty much all but confirms that if there is a Ti, it will not have HBM2.....


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> We might get a full chip but even that might not feature HBM2. since they actually made a new chip with different memory interface.


Hence undeserving of the Titan moniker.

But yes it's just a name and they've played the name game for 4 years now.


----------



## xioros

Whahahahahaaaaaaa!

Big news: Nvidia now changed the name of the GTX X80 into "Titan" and sells it for 1.2 grand.
In other news: no real Titan is coming this generation (unless they postpone it as Titan Ultra, for 2 grand














)

I saw this coming and no one believed me.

Oh well, #PrayForVega


----------



## Baasha

hmm.. interesting.. the question is.. can this do 4-Way SLI in games or is it the same fate as the 1080s?


----------



## Pragmatist

@magnek & blue1512

Fair enough....
It might be a *teenage* Titan


----------



## Liranan

Fools and their money.


----------



## skypine27

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> Guys there's a serious chance is a Nvidia.com only card. Notice the name is "NVIDIA Titan X" and not a "GeForce ......." card. If this happens then I'm sure the AIO kits from Evga or waterblocks will work since it's probably identical to a 1080..


I dont think so about the blocks.

This card is going to come with 2 x power plugs:
"Meanwhile like the past Titans, the new Titan X is a 250W card, putting it 70W (39%) above GTX 1080. In pictures released by NVIDIA and confirmed by their spec sheet, this will be powered by the typical 8-pin + 6-pin power connector setup."

The factory 1080s only come with the 1 x 8 pin. If you look at all the EK blocks, they extend all the way "back" to the end of the card, and are shaped very tight around the power plug area. So you are going to need block that is specifically "cut" out in that area to make room for the 2 x Titan X(P) plugs.

Im willing to bet EK will have full cover blocks VERY quickly for this card though.


----------



## LancerVI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> Fools and their money.


It's really unbelievable what nVidia has done here.

No way in hell am I spending that kind of scratch on what, by all rights, should be a Ti @ $650-699 tops and the 1080 a $550-599 card.

Yes....I'm serious. nVidia have become quite the swindlers.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

If it can clock to 1800MHz then it should have around 30% over a 1080 at 2000MHz. That's of course theoretical, and we know that it never applies to real-world scenarios.. Stock vs stock will be around 20%, again... theoretically.

Stock vs stock if it doesn't match the theory will be pretty poor considering that price hike.. Over an already very expensive card.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pragmatist*
> 
> @magnek & blue1512
> 
> Fair enough....
> It might be a *teenage* Titan


LOL

You know what bothers me the most though is that all these cards will use nVidia's reference design, which means "just good enough" VRMs for power delivery. Sure not like additional voltage does any good for Pascal right now it seems, but it's still a very unpleasant thought, especially for the kind of price nVidia is asking. :/


----------



## Cyro999

When is the real titan/ti coming, Nvidia?

1180ti / TItanX3?


----------



## Glottis

if this could clock to 2100 or 2200 Mhz like lesser Pascal chips, and I suspect it's very possible with custom cooling, performance would be just mind blowing. dat price though


----------



## Seyumi

The good news is that 2 of these cards should be able to maintain 4k 60 FPS minimums with max settings which was always my criteria (or the 100hz 1440p widescreens). I had to go 4x Titan X's last generation to pull this off on a select few demanding titles. 2x 1080's with the new SLI limitations wasn't quite there from what I saw in the reviews and appeared to be equivalent to 3x Titan X's. 2x of these should now be equivalent to 4-5x last generation Titan X's in SLI.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> if this could clock to 2100 or 2200 Mhz like lesser Pascal chips, and I suspect it's very possible with custom cooling, performance would be just mind blowing. dat price though


vvv
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Also, Titan XP probably won't even reach 2 GHz, if GP104 is any indication.
> 
> Generally, the big chips overclock slightly worse than their smaller counterparts, as we saw for GM200 vs GM204. nVidia's officially listed boost for 1080 is 1733 MHz, and the usable ceiling seems to be around 2100, so that's 21% headroom. Titan XP's officially listed boost is 1531 MHz, and a 21% headroom means a usable ceiling of around 1850 MHz.


Even if we use 2200 as the ceiling for GP104, that's still just a 27% headroom, which translates to a ceiling of around 1950 MHz.


----------



## tajoh111

Predicted this thing would happen.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1596682/various-nvidia-announces-tesla-p100-pascal-with-15-billion-transistors-and-hbm2/10#post_25052298


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



This won't be Nvidia's first 16nm card released and won't be release for close to a year. This is just a tech unveiling to get big buyers that want to build super computers interested in Pascal and big businesses.

It will be their 3rd or 4th chip considering this is a 2017 product. The inclusion of HBM2 is an indication of this as well. In addition, this is likely a pure compute chip. Nothing about it is consumer, as it is is missing ROPs. And as a result, these chips are more likely to sell in the 8k to 10k range. A 8 gp100 cluster costs 130,000 dollars after all. This means two things, it won't run into supply issue and yields don't matter as much. Yields can be in the single digit range and Nvidia would still make money on each wafer.

This project is more about securing Nvidia professional and hpc market which generates more revenue than AMD entire GPU unit of the company and fighting Intel's next HPC chip which will come at potentially 10nm.

This has nothing to do with getting a flagship gaming card out to peacock it's gaming image. It's all business and Nvidia likely has secured big super computing contracts in place already to make this no compromises GPU compute card feasible and profitable.

*This chip indicates that a GP102 should be coming but not anytime soon though. Something more gaming focused and smaller.

What Nvidia is doing is segmenting their large chip into two different markets.*


A gaming focused large part and a pure professional even larger part.

What this means is AMD is going to have a seriously hard time competing at the top.

This is because Nvidia is specializing their product range and not compromising by making two specialized products.

This means an individual pure gaming chip and an individual pure compute chip. Earlier Nvidia did a monolithic chip that did both. And as a result, performance and efficiency was compromised. Chips like this were gtx 780 ti, gtx 480/580, gtx 280 etc.

What Nvidia high end marketshare allows is there is enough of a market for high end cards, that they can dedicate a single large gaming GPU to target this market along with the semiprofessional market that desire single precision performance.

Seperately, Nvidia can create a chip that targets purely the professional market which doesn't have to compromise and is a pure compute chip.

Because AMD doesn't have the marketshare, money or the leverage in the professional market, AMD can't do this. They have to make a compromised chip. And if they do this, they will lose on both markets. Instead AMD is going to have to make a choice. Do they go after the professional market or they go exclusively after the semipro market and the gaming market.

GCN isn't flexible enough to do a single chip that does both and can compete with two specialized chips from Nvidia. AMD is going to have to pick one because making a compromised chip that does both like hawaii isn't going to get them anywhere. Which one AMD picks I am not sure.

Nvidia R and D advantage is beginning to show from the sheer number of individual finfet chips designs they have.

Most of these chips will overclock to 1950mhz if the cooling is good enough and the better samples will do 2000mhz. There is almost no clock degradation from largers chips similar to maxwell as seen in the gtx 980 to gtx 980 ti/titanx. Probably just 100mhz at most. The primary reason for this, is this card will be missing double precision which does effect clocks. As a result, it will clock fairly high like titan x/gtx 980 ti.

Why Nvidia is clocking it so low is for performance per watt reasons and for pcie certifications. Since they want to stay in a 250watt envelope, they have only 70 more watts to work with. Add the 384 bit bus and your probably only have 50 watts to work with for the chip itself.

180watt budget from the 1080, 20 watts for addition memory and additional 128bit bus + 50 watts = 250.

Since the gtx 1080 really only gets to 1700-1680 once clocks are stabilized, it's a 8.6-8.7 teraflop card. 50 watts is only a 27.77% increase over the 180 once we subtract the clocks of the new bus and memory. So 1.27777 *8.6-8.7 tflops equals 10.98-11.2tflops, hence the 1531mhz boost clocks. 1531* 3584 * 2 = 10.97 tflops.

It is not the architecture that his holding the clocks back, its the fact that Nvidia wants to stay in a 250 watt profile.


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Even if we use 2200 as the ceiling for GP104, that's still just a 27% headroom, which translates to a ceiling of around 1950 MHz.


not sure what you mean, maxwell 980 vs 980ti/titan X can reach pretty much identical clocks. maybe 980ti/TX can reach few percent lower on avarage, but it's very very close, definitely won't be a massive difference like you try to paint here.


----------



## magnek

I assumed no difference in my calculations lol.

The key difference is Titan X's listed boost clock is 1513 MHz, which is a good 220 MHz lower than 1080's listed boost clock of 1733 MHz.. So to get to the same ceiling that 1080 did, the Titan X will basically have to OC an extra 220 MHz.


----------



## Ha-Nocri

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> The good news is that 2 of these cards should be able to maintain 4k 60 FPS minimums with max settings which was always my criteria (or the 100hz 1440p widescreens). I had to go 4x Titan X's last generation to pull this off on a select few demanding titles. 2x 1080's with the new SLI limitations wasn't quite there from what I saw in the reviews and appeared to be equivalent to 3x Titan X's. 2x of these should now be equivalent to 4-5x last generation Titan X's in SLI.


Yep, b/c visual difference between ultra and ultra/high is so huge


----------



## ChevChelios

so how big will this die be ? ~440-450 mm2 ? or 470-480mm2 ?

stock vs stock we can expect this to be ~30% faster than a 1080 in games ? maybe 35% ..


----------



## magnek

Probably ~450mm² and not more than 30%. I'd say closer to 25% on average.


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> so how big will this die be ? ~440-450 mm2 ? or 470-480mm2 ?


312 x 1.5 = 468mm^2

so around 460-80 yes.

this isn't fully enabled GP102 though. so expect another card with full die later.


----------



## th3illusiveman

Love how people blame AMD. Like getting angry with the police and not the criminal who stabbed you in the gut.

Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check, but Nvidia are the ones who raise the prices. Aim your anger at them.


----------



## sugarhell

Can i sli this titan x with my titan x ?


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> Love how people blame AMD. Like getting angry with the police and not the criminal who stabbed you in the gut.
> 
> Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check, but Nvidia are the ones who raise the prices. Aim your anger at them.


Amd is the reason for everything bad in this world. period.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> Can i sli this titan x with my titan x ?


Only if you do 3 way SLI for some Titan XXX action.


----------



## ChevChelios

its as black as Huangs jacket


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> Amd is the reason for everything bad in this world. period.


I blame AMD for terrible lunch I had today.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check


that's a good one









wonder if I could buy thatsexy ass black cooler off sb who goes on water and slap it on 1080


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> that's a good one


So AMD isn't to blame for the price hikes then?









anyways I gotta head to bed, have fun y'all lol


----------



## tajoh111

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> so how big will this die be ? ~440-450 mm2 ? or 470-480mm2 ?
> 
> stock vs stock we can expect this to be ~30% faster than a 1080 in games ? maybe 35% ..


Probably 490-510mm2.

314mm2 = 7.2 billion transistors.

12/7.2 = 1.666

1.666* 314 = 523mm2.

Larger dies have higher transistor density so 490 to 510mm2.


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *seabiscuit68*
> 
> GDDR5X.....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Personally waiting for HBM2 cards.


I expect HBM2 is likely reserved for the GP100 Tesla parts for some time, possibly until next generation.

GP102 may not even have HBM2 controllers/PHYs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> 1. $1200?!?!?!?!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Where does the price rising end?


When they reach a price where they don't sell.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> 3. 12 billion transistors is 67% more than the GTX 1080's 7.2 billion, even though the shader count on this Titan is only 40% higher and the memory bus only 50% larger. I think this chip is either strongly cut-down and/or GP102 has some extra double-precision hardware that the lower gaming chips don't.


If GP102 is a different die than GP100, there isn't much reason to include extra PF64 hardware, so probably disabled SMs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> that's a good one


In the segments where they have competition, both companies do keep the pricing of the other in check.

However, there won't be competition in this segment for a while, so NVIDIA can price the 1080 and Titan X wherever they feel like and people will buy them.


----------



## mohit9206

1200 pounds UK ,$2000 australia


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> In the segment where they have competition, both companies do keep the pricing of the other in check.


ftfy

1060/1070/1080/TX, only the 1060 has competition
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> Amd is the reason for everything bad in this world. period.


well technically they didn't do anything wrong.
they didn't do anything good either.
they didn't do anything at all actually.


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> ftfy
> 
> 1060/1070/1080/TX, only the 1060 has competition


Out of the Pascal parts, which aren't the only GPUs NVIDIA sells, or remotely the biggest market, either in units or revenue.

NVIDIA is probably moving more 960s than the entire Pascal line up combined.


----------



## Noufel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> The only DP happening here is with JH and the Titan with our wallets and butts.


----------



## Oj010

The price isn't surprising when you consider the people buying one of these will probably be pairing it up with a $ 1,700 CPU, $ 600 PSU, $ 600 motherboard, $ 600 case, etc.

I doubt the Ti will use HMB2, it'll probably be GDDR5X again. At 14 GHz on a 384-bit you're looking at 672 GB/s bandwidth, 40 % more than the new Titan offers.

This will sell - not only will it sell, it'll sell out. NVIDIA sucks at one thing - making poor business choices. Bad for the consumer? Probably. Good for NVIDIA? Always.


----------



## Noufel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> The price isn't surprising when you consider the people buying one of these will probably be pairing it up with a $ 1,700 CPU, $ 600 PSU, $ 600 motherboard, $ 600 case, etc.
> 
> I doubt the Ti will use HMB2, it'll probably be GDDR5X again. At 14 GHz on a 384-bit you're looking at 672 GB/s bandwidth, 40 % more than the new Titan offers.
> 
> This will sell - not only will it sell, it'll sell out. NVIDIA sucks at one thing - making poor business choices. Bad for the consumer? Probably. Good for NVIDIA? Always.


It sure will sell especialy if they are making 5 of them


----------



## l88bastar

Titan XXX


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> 
> 
> its as black as Huangs jacket


As black as his jacket? More like as black as his heart! How could he do this to us!!!


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> As black as his jacket? More like as black as his heart! How could he do this to us!!!


Darker than Black


----------



## Noufel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> As black as his jacket? More like as black as his heart! How could he do this to us!!!


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Darker than Black


So Wesley Snipes black? Titan X Black confirmed!!!


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> Fools Rich people with disposable income and no regrets and their money.


FTFY.

People who can afford spending this kind of money on graphics cards frequently have no trouble sleeping well at night and no qualms with your frustration.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> FTFY.
> 
> People who can afford spending this kind of money on graphics cards frequently have no trouble sleeping well at night and no qualms with your frustration.


lol ppl like that are so pathetic
I don't get mad when I see a Titan X Quad SLI rig powering a 144Hz surround setup. I say "that's a boss setup, you're lucky to have one". I don't bash people who can afford something fancy while I can't. But sadly Iranian is incapable of that as every second of his posts is that spiteful.
I've been hearing around that AMD cards get better with age, why the frustration then.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> but I have a feeling I'll be seeing it above the Titan X in the Steam hardware survey by next January


but how will you tell the difference if they are both Titan X ?


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> The price isn't surprising when you consider the people buying one of these will probably be pairing it up with a $ 1,700 CPU, $ 600 PSU, $ 600 motherboard, $ 600 case, etc.
> 
> I doubt the Ti will use HMB2, it'll probably be GDDR5X again. At 14 GHz on a 384-bit you're looking at 672 GB/s bandwidth, 40 % more than the new Titan offers.
> 
> This will sell - not only will it sell, it'll sell out. NVIDIA sucks at one thing - making poor business choices. Bad for the consumer? Probably. Good for NVIDIA? Always.


Heh, unfortunately being one of those people with a $1,700 CPU I'm struggling to justify this card so soon after purchasing a 1080. It's barely been out 3 months.


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> Love how people blame AMD. Like getting angry with the police and not the criminal who stabbed you in the gut.
> 
> Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check, but Nvidia are the ones who raise the prices. Aim your anger at them.


More like blame the people for still buying this "junk" at that price. If nobody is gonna buy cards at that price, Nvidia will adjust. But people still buy cards like this at this high of a price, so why should they go down in price? Can't really blame Nvidia nor AMD here.

Don't get me wrong, it might be a nice card, but not for this price.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> Heh, unfortunately being one of those people with a $1,700 CPU I'm struggling to justify this card so soon after purchasing a 1080. It's barely been out 3 months.


I'm sure you'll find a way to justify upgrading.


----------



## Klocek001

pick up a used titan x $500, get the new tx cooler off sb who runs wc $100, sell, count profit,go to jail,repeat.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> Heh, unfortunately being one of those people with a $1,700 CPU I'm struggling to justify this card so soon after purchasing a 1080. It's barely been out 3 months.


I find it odd you would spend $1700 on a CPU and run a midrange GPU anyway lol jk









I upgraded my 5960X to the 6950X in preparation for the Big Pascal, but unfortunately this isn't the Big Chip. What I predict is what happened with the Original Titan and they'll release the Full Core on the 1080Ti. So it looks like, i'll be back to the waiting game yet again.

What is bizarre is why Nvidia chose to release this now? Does Nvidia know something about AMD we don't?


----------



## szeged

$1200 and they didnt even change the name...


----------



## Oj010

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> Heh, unfortunately being one of those people with a $1,700 CPU I'm struggling to justify this card so soon after purchasing a 1080. It's barely been out 3 months.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> I find it odd you would spend $1700 on a CPU and run a midrange GPU anyway lol jk


You may be joking, but that's exactly what I meant. So many people moaned that they're not buying a "mid-range" GTX 1080 and that they would hold off for the GTX Titan - that's the market I'm talking about.


----------



## criminal




----------



## hokk

NO HBM2
Same name as old one
"available" aug2

yeah ok.


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kylzer*
> 
> NO HBM2
> Same name as old one
> "available" aug2
> 
> yeah ok.


My reaction exactly.
Don't forget 1200$ pricetag though.


----------



## ChevChelios

its surreal that they dont even bother changing the name for a brand new flagship


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyxagamemnon*
> 
> Given this Titan only has 12gb we won't see a 1080ti. This is the 1080ti named Titan..
> 
> They wouldn't release a 6gb 1080ti lol...


There will be a 1080Ti based on GP102 too, but it should be pretty far away since the Titan will be here to milk the professional market and the uber gamers for more money. And it will sell like crazy. That is why 1080Ti will be far away.

Nvidia is out with high end, server high end, midrange and low end midrange.
Nvidia have taken a knockout on AMD thats only out with low end midrange.
Two different worlds completely.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> You may be joking, but that's exactly what I meant. So many people moaned that they're not buying a "mid-range" GTX 1080 and that they would hold off for the GTX Titan - that's the market I'm talking about.


I didn't have a GPU. Period. So I bought the best one on the market for gaming at-that time. It's only been three months. NVIDIA are doing this because they can, and because they want it to hurt AMD.


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> its surreal that they dont even bother changing the name for a brand new flagship


It doesn't stay as long as older flagships like the 980ti usually did, so it's not as big of a deal I guess? If it's the same with the stock of the Titan X like with 1070/1080, than by the time most people have their cards, the next gpu by Nvidia will already be announced







.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> There will be a 1080Ti based on GP102 too, but it should be pretty far away since the Titan will be here to milk the professional market and the uber gamers for more money. And it will sell like crazy. That is why 1080Ti will be far away.
> 
> Nvidia is out with high end, server high end, midrange and low end midrange.
> Nvidia have taken a knockout on AMD thats only out with low end midrange.
> Two different worlds completely.


1080Ti $1k then?


----------



## szeged

so if its not hbm2.....current TX waterblocks will fit maybe?


----------



## sugarhell

Should i buy the titan x or this titan x ?

By the way they cant release this as a 1080ti. The 1080 is simply to expensive and they cant drop the prices just yet so they can create space for a 600- 650 1080ti. It would be a bad marketing to release a 1080ti with only g5x at 800-900 bucks. So they just use the titan name but this card shouldnt be a titan . its just a geforce card . Also with this they kinda hurt 1080 owners that paid close to 800 bucks for a custom one. Probably a lot of people would have wait for this card instead.

So lets start speculating about the next titan x with hbm2 . 1500? 1600?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> so if its not hbm2.....current TX waterblocks will fit maybe?


Should. The name didn't change.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> There will be a 1080Ti based on GP102 too, but it should be pretty far away since the Titan will be here to milk the professional market and the uber gamers for more money. And it will sell like crazy. That is why 1080Ti will be far away.
> 
> Nvidia is out with high end, server high end, midrange and low end midrange.
> Nvidia have taken a knockout on AMD thats only out with low end midrange.
> Two different worlds completely.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> 1080Ti $1k then?


Yes, i'm sure a 1080ti will happen around March 2017 with the full cuda count and 16Gb for $1000. So you get screwed over if you bought the GTX 1080, and you'll get massively screwed over again if you buy into the new Titan X. Sigh...


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Should. The name didn't change.


exactly what i was thinking, the name is the same so theres no reason the blocks shouldnt fit even if the components are all differently placed, you just gotta force the block on and clamp it down with some C-clamps. nothing should go wrong.....


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Yes, i'm sure a 1080ti will happen around March 2017 with the full cuda count and 16Gb for $1000. So you get screwed over if you bought the GTX 1080, and you'll get massively screwed over again if you buy into the new Titan X. Sigh...











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> exactly what i was thinking, the name is the same so theres no reason the blocks shouldnt fit even if the components are all differently placed, you just gotta force the block on and clamp it down with some C-clamps. nothing should go wrong.....


----------



## Oj010

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> I didn't have a GPU. Period. So I bought the best one on the market for gaming at-that time. It's only been three months. NVIDIA are doing this because they can, and because they want it to hurt AMD.


Hey, to each their own, but if I were in your position I would probably have grabbed a second hand GTX 980 or something to tide me over. We knew the new Titan was coming soon and would be significantly faster than the GTX 1080.


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Yes, i'm sure a 1080ti will happen around March 2017 with the full cuda count and 16Gb for $1000. So you get screwed over if you bought the GTX 1080, and you'll get massively screwed over again if you buy into the new Titan X. Sigh...


Nonsense. Ti was never faster or had better specs than Titan.


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> Nonsense. Ti was never faster or had better specs than Titan.


780ti was faster, although it had lower vram.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> Hey, to each their own, but if I were in your position I would probably have grabbed a second hand GTX 980 or something to tide me over. We knew the new Titan was coming soon and would be significantly faster than the GTX 1080.


People generally don't do that. If they are building a system up and want the best, they will purchase the best they can afford that is available to them at that time. Outside of these bubbles, people don't do that type of thing. There is always something better not that far off, that is simply how the industry works and has always been - just this time it's incredibly soon after lol.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> Nonsense. Ti was never faster or had better specs than Titan.


Go back to school mate









*Geforce Titan*

6GB Vram
2688 Cuda Cores
Core Clock 837Mhz
Boost Clock 876Mhz

*780Ti*

3GB Vram
2880 Cuda Cores
Core Clock 875Mhz
Boost Clock 928Mhz

*Geforce Titan Black*

6GB Vram
2880 Cuda Cores
Core Clock 889Mhz
Boost Clock 980Mhz


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> 780ti was faster, although it had lower vram.


you are right but that was when nvidia was still new to Titan idea, maybe there weren't exactly sure where to fit it in, i don't think it's ever happening again, as evident with later Titan releases.


----------



## andrews2547

I look forward to seeing retailers selling the old Titan X at the same price as the new one.


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Go back to school mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Geforce Titan*
> 
> 6GB Vram
> 2688 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 837Mhz
> Boost Clock 876Mhz
> 
> *780Ti*
> 
> 3GB Vram
> 2880 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 1020
> Boost Clock 1085
> 
> *Geforce Titan Black*
> 
> 6GB Vram
> 2880 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 889Mhz
> Boost Clock 980Mhz


and why didn't you add maxwell titan in your comparison? oh right because that's when nvidia learned how to value titan and won't make same mistake they did with og Titan and 780Ti. keep dreaming, "mate".


----------



## mcg75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Go back to school mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Geforce Titan*
> 
> 6GB Vram
> 2688 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 837Mhz
> Boost Clock 876Mhz
> 
> *780Ti*
> 
> 3GB Vram
> 2880 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 1020
> Boost Clock 1085
> 
> *Geforce Titan Black*
> 
> 6GB Vram
> 2880 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 889Mhz
> Boost Clock 980Mhz


Better double check your 780 Ti clocks.


----------



## Unkzilla

I'm getting by pretty well @ 4k resolution with a 1080 (some games maxed @ 60fps, some games with high / ultra settings combo and 50fps), but safe to say this new Titan will be maxing everything out at this resolution... crazy


----------



## ChevChelios

if a cheaper 1080Ti does happen in early 2017 to better beat Vega then it will be with ~3328 cores

(hypothetical) 1080Ti - 3328
___________ Titan X2 - 3584
(hypothetical) big Titan X2 - 3840


----------



## saeedkunna

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> $1200 and they didnt even change the name...


changing the name mean the card will coast more, meetings+thousand engineers


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> and why didn't you add maxwell titan in your comparison? oh right because that's when nvidia learned how to value titan and won't make same mistake they did with og Titan and 780Ti. keep dreaming, "mate".


I was correcting you on your mistake, which was during the Kepler generation. Not Maxwell.


----------



## besthijacker

Any words on custom versions with water maybe?


----------



## Nestala

Guys, should I get the Titan X now or wait for the Titan X?

> smh, should've gotten a Titan X.


----------



## TranquilTempest

What, they couldn't enough HBM2?


----------



## drufause

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> This IS the 1080 Ti.


Nah the 1080 Ti will be out in 4th week of November, the performance will be between this card and the 1080. it will have 12 GB ddr5x, and be $800 founders MSRP (in time for holidays) with AIB in january for MSRP of $700 but will not ever price point there until the GTX 1180 comes out with HBM2 next summer. Oh they were really talking about the GTX 1080 Ti getting an actual Direct X 12 ascync compute driver and no we will not be providing older cards with support for those feature sets. So go ahead and replace your old GTX 1080 with the 1080 Ti. Were sorry it seems like we lied.


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TranquilTempest*
> 
> What, they couldn't enough HBM2?


Yep, they couldn't even.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mcg75*
> 
> Better double check your 780 Ti clocks.


Corrected









*Geforce Titan*

6GB Vram
2688 Cuda Cores
Core Clock 837Mhz
Boost Clock 876Mhz

*780Ti (reference clocks)*

3GB Vram
2880 Cuda Cores
Core Clock 875Mhz
Boost Clock 928Mhz

*Geforce Titan Black*

6GB Vram
2880 Cuda Cores
Core Clock 889Mhz
Boost Clock 980Mhz


----------



## L36

At least they should of named it Titan P or something. Apple has clearer naming schemes...

On another note, AMD is literally getting hammered from almost each direction on the GPU space in terms of price. They better do something quick, a midrange part with a direct competitor already on sale can only do so much.


----------



## Oj010

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> People generally don't do that. If they are building a system up and want the best, they will purchase the best they can afford that is available to them at that time. Outside of these bubbles, people don't do that type of thing. There is always something better not that far off, that is simply how the industry works and has always been - just this time it's incredibly soon after lol.


There are plenty of people who skipped the 780 non-Ti and 980 non-Ti knowing that they were not the big Kepler/Maxwell cards. Those same people made a lot of noise here about skipping the GTX 1080 for the same reason. You were obviously not one of them.


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> At least they should of named it Titan P or something. Apple has clearer naming schemes...
> 
> On another note, AMD is literally getting hammered from almost each direction on the GPU space in terms of price. They better do something quick, a midrange part with a direct competitor already on sale can only do so much.


heavy price for ignoring DX11 driver overhead. All the review sites are pinning them down on DX11.

Still think Nvidia should pick another TITAN name to prevent confusing. btw, didnt Nvidia own Voodoo name, why cant they re-introduce those epic brand name?


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> There are plenty of people who skipped the 780 non-Ti and 980 non-Ti knowing that they were not the big Kepler/Maxwell cards. Those same people made a lot of noise here about skipping the GTX 1080 for the same reason. You were obviously not one of them.


I made more noise than most, I was telling everyone that had a 980Ti/Titan X not to buy into the GTX 1080. Did they listen? Nope.

Now look what happened. You people should trust Mhill and his infinite wisdom


----------



## ChevChelios

the only thing higher than _Titan_ is _God_

GTX God X in 2018


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clocknut*
> 
> heavy price for ignoring DX11 driver overhead. All the review sites are pinning them down on DX11.
> 
> Still think Nvidia should pick another TITAN name to prevent confusing. btw, didnt Nvidia own Voodoo name, why cant they re-introduce those epic brand name?


With limited resources, they put all their eggs in one basket which is vulcan/dx12. It will pay off later, just not now when they need it most.


----------



## CalinTM

Ok, so titan pascal 3.5k cores ? Where are the 3.8k cores that pascal can offer ?

So strange...


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clocknut*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> At least they should of named it Titan P or something. Apple has clearer naming schemes...
> 
> On another note, AMD is literally getting hammered from almost each direction on the GPU space in terms of price. They better do something quick, a midrange part with a direct competitor already on sale can only do so much.
> 
> 
> 
> heavy price for ignoring DX11 driver overhead. All the review sites are pinning them down on DX11.
> 
> Still think Nvidia should pick another TITAN name to prevent confusing. btw, didnt Nvidia own Voodoo name, why cant they re-introduce those epic brand name?
Click to expand...

A new Voodoo card would be amazing, what a throw back!








IIRC 3dfx got bought up by Nvidia back then. So they should be able to name it like that.

AMD should name their big flagship RAGE too, like way back in the days







.


----------



## mcg75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> There are plenty of people who skipped the 780 non-Ti and 980 non-Ti knowing that they were not the big Kepler/Maxwell cards. Those same people made a lot of noise here about skipping the GTX 1080 for the same reason. You were obviously not one of them.


I can't say it was worth waiting.

The new TitanX is going to be about 30% faster than a 1080 for $500 more.


----------



## provost

I agree. Well, this is one way to push to the hold over 980ti and TitanX Maxwell owners to upgrade to either a $700 1080 or $1,200 Pascal Titan. Given the lack of async (don't think Nvidia will ever enable it or can for that matter) for Maxwell and relative async capability of Pascal (notwithstanding software load balancing/preemption), either these Maxwell owners upgrade now, or see further degradation of performance as more dx12/vulkan games become prominent with some async compute.
Seems like a push a for quarter end..lol


----------



## sugalumps

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> Love how people blame AMD. Like getting angry with the police and not the criminal who stabbed you in the gut.
> 
> Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check, but Nvidia are the ones who raise the prices. Aim your anger at them.


Your previous comparison with the honda civic not rising in price was flawed as it has competition. That is the main point, nvidia has barely any competition now. Yes nvidia are completely greedy and have taken it way to far but they have zero competition, look at amd when they released the 7970 first it had no competition and the price of it was higher than we had seen yet for gpu's because of that. Every company will do what they can get away with.

edit - I dont blame amd, just trying to point out companies will push as far as the market allows, i.e what people are willing to accept and the lack of competition. If amd did manage to compete on a 1:1 level however we would see price drops on nvidias side.


----------



## Oj010

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mcg75*
> 
> I can't say it was worth waiting.
> 
> The new TitanX is going to be about 30% faster than a 1080 for $500 more.


People buying $ 1,700 CPUs and $ 600 motherboards certainly don't have value for money anywhere near the forefront of their priorities.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Wait a minute let me get this stuff right

GP102 <=== what??
Price $1,200 USD <== 102 chip for 1,200? double what?

30% faster gp102 + 1,200??

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> 1080Ti $1k then?


Probably $899-$999 for the GTX 1080Ti yes.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Yes, i'm sure a 1080ti will happen around March 2017 with the full cuda count and 16Gb for $1000. So you get screwed over if you bought the GTX 1080, and you'll get massively screwed over again if you buy into the new Titan X. Sigh...


Who said Titan X doesnt use a full GP102?
Remember this isnt GP100 which we know have more cores because of Tesla P100


----------



## doza

nvidia is showing it's true colors (green) bring it on!!! next is titan x2 (nah just call it a titan so that we have 10 titans to buy) for 9999$


----------



## Clockster

First time I won't be buying a high end (Titan/Ti) card at launch.


----------



## mcg75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> People buying $ 1,700 CPUs and $ 600 motherboards certainly don't have value for money anywhere near the forefront of their priorities.


True. But unlike Maxwell where you could overclock a Titan and catch 980 SLI, you won't be doing that with Pascal.

Of course, some will be buying a pair of Titan Pascals.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> so how big will this die be ? ~440-450 mm2 ? or 470-480mm2 ?
> 
> stock vs stock we can expect this to be ~30% faster than a 1080 in games ? maybe 35% ..


Are you being "overly optimistic" this time?









Now i wonder where is our great o majin..


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clockster*
> 
> First time I won't be buying a high end (Titan/Ti) card at launch.


Yep waiting for the full chip


----------



## n4p0l3onic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> the only thing higher than _Titan_ is _God_
> 
> GTX God X in 2018


introducing 2018 Nvidia Geforce Jen Hsun Huang Founders Edition, complete with JHH photo on the cooler and box.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Probably $899-$999 for the GTX 1080Ti yes.
> Who said Titan X doesnt use a full GP102?
> Remember this isnt GP100 which we know have more cores because of Tesla P100


Do u even know GPC work?

This is a 6GPC block of 640 for 3840. 3584 is not a full chip. I am willing to bet my life on this.

Its all about die area utilisation.


----------



## tajoh111

99% percent of the reason this is priced so high is to not only not cannibalized 1080 sales, it's also price conditioning so that when the 1180 edition of this card comes, people will think its a good deal.

By itself, even those the profit and margins on the titan pascal are good, the volume isn't enough to pay for the R and D. What is likely going to happen is an even further cut down variant of this card will come. Perhaps 3328 cores and with a $799 price tag(maybe a 899 founders edition). Normally $799 is an outrageous price to pay for a card with 15% of the card disabled. It also 150 dollar price increase over previous cards in a similar die class range. However...

Because of initial high price of the titan pascal, 1200, 799 is mostly okay now and mostly acceptable because compared to the 1200 titan pascal, it seems like a good deal because they will have near the same performance. This will be because it will have higher clocks and thus, be 5% slower than a titan pascal.

The release date if titan is anything to go by should be between 5 and 6 months from now. Just in time to marginalize vega release.


----------



## carlhil2

I regretted surrendering my OG Titan X, will stick with this one THIS time.....


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> So didnt u say there will be no titan?


you win this battle


----------



## Lass3

So I guess some people will be upgrading from Titan X to Titan X..

AMD Vega where are you..


----------



## Nestala

Oh yea I forgot, will there be a higher priced founders edition for this?


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nestala*
> 
> Oh yea I forgot, will there be a higher priced founders edition for this?


It would be only founders edition.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> you win this battle


What we all learn is nvidia can pull stunt. The g5x was a very very good eg. Even before micron could churn out full g5x production they alr have it selling in their 1080.

So never assume until we are jhh himself.

Now lets us all sponsor more jacket for him.


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> What we all learn is nvidia can pull stunt. The g5x was a very very good eg. Even before micron could churn out full g5x production they alr have it selling in their 1080.
> 
> So never assume until we are jhh himself.
> 
> Now lets us all sponsor more jacket for him.


I'll pass







Not really enough for me for gpu upgrade for now is pascal.








It's getting closer though, maybe the full chip will be ok.


----------



## Power Drill

So, price has gone up for 20% and while buying premium, you don't even get all premium parts(where is the HBM2?)? Well, this turned out to be massive disappointment.







Hopefully people will vote with their wallets and let these things rot in shelves.


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Power Drill*
> 
> So, price has gone up for 20% and while buying premium, you don't even get all premium parts(where is the HBM2?)? Well, this turned out to be massive disappointment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully people will vote with their wallets and let these things rot in shelves.


it will be out of stock for weeks


----------



## ChevChelios

the 980Ti/Titan X owners waiting to upgrade, having passed the 1080, will stampede over each other to get this

cant really blame them, cut down or not, $1200 or not, this is their next/closest significant upgrade, its here now and its a [email protected] card

HBM2 by itself is just fancy new tech, it doesnt give more fps unless the card was bandwidth-starved before

of course some will still hold out for 1080Ti/big Titan/Vega/Volta, but many wont


----------



## szeged

I wonder if it will sli with a Titan x


----------



## WorldExclusive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Personally waiting for HBM2 cards.


This Async Compute is really tripping them up. Release it early before AMD releases anything high end. We could possibility see an early release of Volta next year now with true AC.
I would say skip this card for Volta and HBM2. Pricing should comeback into alignment when AMD becomes competitive with Vega in DX12.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Profiled*
> 
> Beats Titan X SLI?


I don't think so, but if you planning to go Maxwell Titan X SLI, I would just buy the new TX instead. Otherwise, get two 980Ti's on sale and skip Pascal until Volta.


----------



## Clockster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> the 980Ti/Titan X owners waiting to upgrade, having passed the 1080, will stampede over each other to get this
> 
> cant really blame them, cut down or not, this is their next/closest upgrade, its here now and its a [email protected] card
> 
> HBM2 by itself is just fancy new tech, it doesnt give more fps unless the card was bandwidth-starved before
> 
> of course some will still hold out for 1080Ti/big Titan/Vega/Volta, but many wont


I won't. In fact I think I'll wait for Vega.and if that's a disappointment I'll just take up fishing.


----------



## lutjens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NuclearPeace*
> 
> Bad name. This is going to get confused a lot with the old Titan X. Just name it Titan P and the next one Titan V.
> 
> Anyway, I hope that AMD hits back hard because NVIDIA charging $1,000 for a single GPU is a trend that needs to die.


It never ceases to amaze me how some people want the best for nothing. Nice things cost money. There are SKUs in NVidia's product stack for all budgets, but if you want the best, expect to pay for it.


----------



## lutjens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> the 980Ti/Titan X owners waiting to upgrade, having passed the 1080, will stampede over each other to get this
> 
> cant really blame them, cut down or not, $1200 or not, this is their next/closest significant upgrade, its here now and its a [email protected] card
> 
> HBM2 by itself is just fancy new tech, it doesnt give more fps unless the card was bandwidth-starved before
> 
> of course some will still hold out for 1080Ti/big Titan/Vega/Volta, but many wont


You're right...I'm chomping at the bit to sink my teeth into this behemoth...and I'll definitely be getting more than one of them...


----------



## Sleazybigfoot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yvese*
> 
> What a ridiculous price. Sad thing is people will buy it all up.
> 
> I blame AMD for being just all around terrible at competing in the high-end. Last time they were able to compete was when they released the 290 series all those years ago..


Except this type of mentality by Nvidia (trying to increase the price year by year) didn't just start... It started, as far as I know, around the 5xx / 6xx series.... When AMD *was* competing with Nvidia...
I still think they are, they just haven't released their High end cards yet because they switched up their strategy...


----------



## Blze001

My first car was $1,200...


----------



## rx7racer

I'm rather unimpressed for the price and not surprised about no HBM2 on this one.

Go sheep go, flock to your green pockets as NV enjoys these staggered releases watching everyone drop their 1080's now also saying, " oh but new shiny"

hahahaha

I do love NV though, I enjoy the excitement they bring with their innovations. This is a very innovative card and totally worth the price. I wonder why they didn't charge $2k for it though, I think they should have especially for the one's that feel the more it costs the better it is, and after all Titan is a Halo product.

I'm hoping next year will be the year of worthiness from both camps though.


----------



## Power Drill

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> the 980Ti/Titan X owners waiting to upgrade, having passed the 1080, will stampede over each other to get this
> 
> cant really blame them, cut down or not, $1200 or not, this is their next/closest significant upgrade, its here now and its a [email protected] card
> 
> HBM2 by itself is just fancy new tech, it doesnt give more fps unless the card was bandwidth-starved before
> 
> of course some will still hold out for 1080Ti/big Titan/Vega/Volta, but many wont


Yes yes, we all know the same old bandwidth this bandwidth that song, there is no use for it.

But what about the significantly lowered power consumption of the HBM2 memory? *I want MOAR MHz* on top of the obvious more bandwidth.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rx7racer*
> 
> I'm rather unimpressed for the price and not surprised about no HBM2 on this one.
> 
> Go sheep go, flock to your green pockets as NV enjoys these staggered releases watching everyone drop their 1080's now also saying, " oh but new shiny"
> 
> hahahaha
> 
> I do love NV though, I enjoy the excitement they bring with their innovations. This is a very innovative card and totally worth the price. I wonder why they didn't charge $2k for it though, I think they should have especially for the one's that feel the more it costs the better it is, and after all Titan is a Halo product.
> 
> I'm hoping next year will be the year of worthiness from both camps though.


Is nvidia even planning anything new for 2017 or are they gonna sell 1060/1070/1080/Titan X ?

I mean we'll certainly see 1050 but not much else.


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blze001*
> 
> My first car was $1,200...


silly comparison. your car was a piece of junk, and TitanX 2016 is a Ferrari of GPUs.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Power Drill*
> 
> Yes yes, we all know the same old bandwidth this bandwidth that song, there is no use for it.
> 
> But what about the significantly lowered power consumption of the HBM2 memory? *I want MOAR MHz*.


thanks to no HBM2, you get the card now, on the 2-nd of August (which is frankly insane) instead of ~early 2017

thats can be a good a trade-off for the impatient ones who have been moaning for a [email protected] card for more than a year now

and with HBM2 now it would probably have been $1400 or $1500


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> btw I believe it's official now: nVidia is the new Apple


Apple doesn't raise prices each generation. It isn't a monopoly.

Nvidia and intel on the other hand...


----------



## Devnant

This reminds me of TITAN OG all over again. Been there, done that. No thanks. Too much of a price for too short of a crown life.


----------



## Oj010

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Devnant*
> 
> This reminds me of TITAN OG all over again. Been there, done that. No thanks. Too much of a price for too short of a crown life.


I love mine, thanks


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> What name do you think will catch on. Titan-PX? Titan-XP?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> XP for sure. What is what I am calling it.


Titan-X$









as in excess


----------



## motherpuncher

ummm, so.. how well does gsync hide microstutter? I may want to just pick up a second 980ti at this point.


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> vote with ya wallet
> 
> has there ever been single GPU flagships from same company that was released this close together?
> 
> gtx 280 to 285?


Huh? The point is the 1080 isn't a flagship. The people making that argument previously were right. It may have been Nvidia's fastest new card, but it doesn't make it the flagship. Their last flagship was the original TitanX in Q1 2015.


----------



## maltamonk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> silly comparison. your car was a piece of junk, and TitanX 2016 is a Ferrari of GPUs.


To be fair that $1200 car most likely stayed relevant for much longer than this gpu will.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *motherpuncher*
> 
> ummm, so.. how well does gsync hide microstutter? I may want to just pick up a second 980ti at this point.


it does not hide microstutter. if anything, microstutter will be more apparent when running higher fps/hz
if that is really *mico*stutter we're talking about, you might not pick it up at 60fps/60hz but you'll definitely see it at 120fps/120hz although the experience will be better at 120/120.

If you wonder if sli is for you, run a game like Far Cry 3. You'll see some microstutter even if running a single gpu. try that at 120fps/120hz, then compar it to a game that doesn't have microstutter and run it at let's say 70fps/70hz cap. I'd take the 120fps in FC3 over that but your perspective might differ.


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NuclearPeace*
> 
> Why not? People have proven to NVIDIA that they will pretty much buy a Titan regardless of the price.


Unless you count the Titan-Z


----------



## Gilles3000

So... No GP100, no HBM2 and lower clocks for at least $1200?
Sounds like a great deal to me. /s

Can't wait to see how many inpatient ones will get these terrible value cards.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *motherpuncher*
> 
> ummm, so.. how well does gsync hide microstutter? I may want to just pick up a second 980ti at this point.


nothing hides microstutter except if you are simply not sensitive to it or dont feel it

it likely depends on game engine as well, but SLI has more of it than any single GPU (which ideally should not have any at all .. and both Maxwell and Pascal have good FCAT results)


----------



## motherpuncher

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> it does not hide microstutter. if anything, microstutter will be more apparent when running higher fps/hz
> if that is really *mico*stutter we're talking about, you might not pick it up at 60fps/60hz but you'll definitely see it at 120fps/120hz although the experience will be better at 120/120.


Thanks for the reply. I just remember the microstutter bothering me. Even though I was getting real high fps, it just wasn't as fluid. I was hoping maybe gsync would fix that.


----------



## BigMack70

$1200 for a card that doesn't even have HBM2... interesting. Wonder why they didn't change the name?

I'm guessing we'll get a ~$800 1080 Ti following. Not sure if I'll upgrade or not... I'm pretty done with multi-GPU and I kind of doubt a single one of these will be much faster than two old Titan X cards.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> Love how people blame AMD. Like getting angry with the police and not the criminal who stabbed you in the gut.
> 
> Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check, but Nvidia are the ones who raise the prices. Aim your anger at them.


*Nvidia have no obligation to you to keep price acceptable, they have a obligation to increase value for their shareholders* hence they raise the price when lack of competition from AMD allows them to. You seem to misunderstand how a for-profit company works.


----------



## Edge0fsanity

hmm, was waiting for the P titan to release but i'm not impressed by this at $1200. This is more along the lines of what i expected for a 980ti replacement. I usually upgrade when a single gpu is >= my current gpus. Will have to wait and see what the benches show.


----------



## zealord

So it's a cut card for 1200$? The full card would have 3840 if I am correct?

damn ...


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> you are right but that was when nvidia was still new to Titan idea, maybe there weren't exactly sure where to fit it in, i don't think it's ever happening again, as evident with later Titan releases.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Go back to school mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Geforce Titan*
> 
> 6GB Vram
> 2688 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 837Mhz
> Boost Clock 876Mhz
> 
> *780Ti*
> 
> 3GB Vram
> 2880 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 875Mhz
> Boost Clock 928Mhz
> 
> *Geforce Titan Black*
> 
> 6GB Vram
> 2880 Cuda Cores
> Core Clock 889Mhz
> Boost Clock 980Mhz


*780Ti was faster than Titan because 290X was faster than the Titan*, It(a Ti that is faster than a same gen Titan) will happen again if Vega beats Titan X 2016, but I doubt that will happen(though I hope it does).


----------



## zealord

And this is exactly why we need AMD to release high end cards.

Completely honest this new Titan X could've very well been the GTX 1080 for half that money if AMD had something to compete.

If this card was full fat 3840 cuda cores and 16GB of HBM2 or something I could understand 999$ for it and a Titan name, but a cut card with GDDR5X for 1200$ ... nah come on


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> the 980Ti/Titan X owners waiting to upgrade, having passed the 1080, will stampede over each other to get this


Nope
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> of course some will still hold out for 1080Ti/big Titan/Vega/Volta


Yep

edit: Separately I already thought the Pascal cooler looked like the Tumbler, but now it is in black too


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> but I doubt that will happen(though I hope it does).


Vega would need to be ~x2,2 times faster than 480 8GB just to match this new Titan X and more than that to beat it (if my rough math is correct)

the 6144 shaders Vega _could_ certainly be up to that task .. but that large a card might be too much to ask for from AMD and its 14nm FinFET (im still not clear if Vega uses 14nm GloFo or not)


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> And this is exactly why we need AMD to release high end cards.
> 
> Completely honest this new Titan X could've very well been the GTX 1080 for half that money if AMD had something to compete.
> 
> If this card was full fat 3840 cuda cores and 16GB of HBM2 or something I could understand 999$ for it and a Titan name, but a cut card with GDDR5X for 1200$ ... nah come on


I think that's kind of the point. nVidia has been able to release a much faster product over their previous generation, WITHOUT having to resort to HMB2. They didn't neeed it. They released a good product at very competitive prices (except for Titan X price). While AMD is still trying to figure out HMB2, nV is reaping the most benefits it has with better GPUs and existing memory interfaces. Everybody's whining about why it doesn't have HMB2 like the new Teslas (I just read about it) when they didn't frankly needed it. They're gonna milk the GDDR5/X cow as much as they can, sell some Titan X to bleeding edge lovers with a lot of money while AMD takes the hit and hopes HMB2 will make up for their slow releases. They're probably letting the tech mature, the manufacturing become cheaper, and then adopt it. The HMB2 only seems to make sense to nVidia in the highest segment with Teslas where people don't see the pricetag.

It may be something similar to x64 in the old days. Intel said "meh" while AMD came up with the tech and soon catched up and surpassed Intel. Intel then adopted the tech and eventually wiped the floor from AMD again...


----------



## andrews2547

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> *Nvidia have no obligation to you to keep price acceptable, they have a obligation to increase value for their shareholders* hence they raise the price when lack of competition from AMD allows them to. You seem to misunderstand how a for-profit company works.


Without going too far off topic, I'll just say this.

There is a reason why Toyota shares are $54.86 and Ferrari shares are $42.89.

If they lower the price to something a bit more affordable, they will make less profit per card, but they will also sell more cards which in some cases gives them more profit.

Obviously I'm not saying they should sell the new Titan X for $200, but $1200 is ridiculous.


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *andrews2547*
> 
> Without going too far off topic, I'll just say this.
> 
> There is a reason why Toyota shares are $54.86 and Ferrari shares are $42.89.
> 
> If they lower the price to something a bit more affordable, they will make less profit per card, but they will also sell more cards which in some cases gives them more profit.
> 
> Obviously I'm not saying they should sell the new Titan X for $200, but $1200 is ridiculous.


And Nvidia is still closer to Toyota than Ferrari (I hate car analogies in computers...) as they have a range of products from ultra high end/high end (Lexus ) to mid/low end (Toyota ).


----------



## Drewminus

This card seems pointless if you arn't putting it under water, cause the pascal cooler struggles with the 1080, it's got no hope with this card.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *andrews2547*
> 
> Without going too far off topic, I'll just say this.
> 
> There is a reason why Toyota shares are $54.86 and Ferrari shares are $42.89.
> 
> If they lower the price to something a bit more affordable, they will make less profit per card, but they will also sell more cards which in some cases gives them more profit.
> 
> Obviously I'm not saying they should sell the new Titan X for $200, but $1200 is ridiculous.


Nvidia don't just sells high end cards though, thus the Ferrari comp is invalid, the X60 and X50 line are competitive products that do much to increase Nvidia market share like the Corolla line does for Toyota (a large part of it is currently proppred up by 960, 950 and 750Ti, with 1060 joining the party and 1050 to come)


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *andrews2547*
> 
> Without going too far off topic, I'll just say this.
> 
> There is a reason why Toyota shares are $54.86 and Ferrari shares are $42.89.
> 
> If they lower the price to something a bit more affordable, they will make less profit per card, but they will also sell more cards which in some cases gives them more profit.
> 
> Obviously I'm not saying they should sell the new Titan X for $200, but $1200 is ridiculous.


Yes but nVidia sells both low end and high end, which Ferrari doesn't. They have a large base to sell low end to mid end, and now they're offering a "mid end" card like the 1070 which is very fast, a 1080 still faster and they're releasing a gold-plated Titan X for those that can afford it, they don't care if they sell few cards to gamers because they will sell more to datacenters or sciencie applications, still Titan X won't be the base of their profit, Titan X will be the "special edition" of Pascal GDDR5, it's a niche product


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NikolayNeykov*
> 
> It would be only founders edition.


So really, this is actually a good deal considering the cooler is worth $150 minimum.

I kid of course.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Bummer. Even under water these things are going to be quite power limited on overclock.

Average overclocked 1080's draw about 200W to 210W, with the theroretical maximim of 225W.

The Titan XP is rated at 250W with a theoretical maximum of 300W. More likely than not, it'll have a power cutoff around 275W. 275W is only 30% more power than 210W. This card appears to have it's power consumption linearly scaled up from the 1080. Considering it's running at a base and boost clock of 1417Mhz/1531Mhz, you'll probably hit a power limit wall at 1700Mhz or 1800Mhz. Even if the chip was capable of doing 2000Mhz under water, you wont have the power unless you go to a custom bios.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Drewminus*
> 
> This card seems pointless if you arn't putting it under water, cause the pascal cooler struggles with the 1080, it's got no hope with this card.


It's all a bout the water cooling man. These babies will have to learn to swim in my rig


----------



## ZealotKi11er

The only game I wanted to play under 4K was Witcher 3 and managed to do it with 290X. There is no game that is coming out in the next 1 year that I even remotely need better hardware to play.


----------



## y2kcamaross

Extremely odd way to announce a card, via twitter out of nowhere on a thursday night at an AI meetup


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Feeding the beast that is GP102 is a 384-bit GDDR5X memory bus. NVIDIA will be running Titan X's GDDR5X at the same 10Gbps as on GTX 1080, so we're looking at a straight-up 50% increase in memory bus size and resulting memory bandwidth, bringing Titan X to 480GB/sec.


The Titan XP has 50% more memory bandwidth than the GTX 1080. The Titan XP only has 40% more cores than the GTX 1080. Comparatively, the Titan XP will have more memory bandwidth per core than the GTX 1080.

*If the 1080 didn't need HBM, the Titan doesn't need it either.*


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I think that's kind of the point. nVidia has been able to release a much faster product over their previous generation, WITHOUT having to resort to HMB2. They didn't neeed it. They released a good product at very competitive prices (except for Titan X price). While AMD is still trying to figure out HMB2, nV is reaping the most benefits it has with better GPUs and existing memory interfaces. Everybody's whining about why it doesn't have HMB2 like the new Teslas (I just read about it) when they didn't frankly needed it. They're gonna milk the GDDR5/X cow as much as they can, sell some Titan X to bleeding edge lovers with a lot of money while AMD takes the hit and hopes HMB2 will make up for their slow releases. They're probably letting the tech mature, the manufacturing become cheaper, and then adopt it. The HMB2 only seems to make sense to nVidia in the highest segment with Teslas where people don't see the pricetag.
> 
> It may be something similar to x64 in the old days. Intel said "meh" while AMD came up with the tech and soon catched up and surpassed Intel. Intel then adopted the tech and eventually wiped the floor from AMD again...


now that I think about it.

Nvidia not allowing more than 2 SLI with Pascal is pretty smart considering HBM shows its true benefits in a scenario with more than 2 GPUs.









Gotta be honest though. I didn't expect the new Titan to be out in August. I thought Nov/Dec. Price is about what I expected considering there is zero competition, but I also expected it to have more cuda cores.

Nvidia cards are great if you have money, not so much if you'd don't. I would love to have a new Titan, but I'd hate myself if I paid 1200$ for it.

What do Nvidia enthusiast early adopters think about it releasing so shortly after the GTX 1080 ? Are you mad that you bought a GTX 1080 and 2 months later the new Titan comes out? Do you don't care and buy everything Nvidia brings out? Are you okay with it and selling your GTX 1080? Do you think the price is "fair"?


----------



## CynicalUnicorn

Okay. This is awful. This is so many forms of awful that I need to use bullet points:


The name. It has already been used. This would be like saying every series is the 700 series or whatever.
MSRP. It is now 20% higher than it has been in the past.
The GPU itself. I can all but guarantee those 3584 CUDA cores aren't all of them and that it has 3840 in total like GP100.
If it's missing CUDAs, we'll probably see a second Titan Black-like release for another $1200 to get the full GPU.
(Probably) no FP16, FP64, or HBM. I can all but guarantee that this is GP100 with all of those goodies stripped out. Why?
It's all about profit margins. This is a gaming GPU, no more, no less, and cutting out fancy features makes a cheaper die.

The original Titan was marketed as (and gained some popularity) as a kind of Quadro-lite workstation GPU with GK110's full FP64 capabilities. The Titan X (the first one) didn't have FP64, but then again neither did GM200 in general. So what about the new Titan X?

It's a gaming GPU. We know this because Nvidia made an entirely new die, GP102, for it. It's not a workstation card. It's retaining the four-figure price tag. And it's the same "tier" of GPU as, say, a GTX 280. Or 480. Or 580. It's the highest end gaming GPU in a given series, something that has traditionally been $650 at an absolute maximum (and even then only the Fury X and 280 have been that expensive in a long time).

And above all, they didn't even have the decency to wait. We're getting this three months after the 1080 launched (for $700) rather than six months for the Titan X after the 980 and nearly a full _year_ for the OG Titan after the 680. Nvidia, apparently, wants their customers to double-dip and spend _$1900_ ($3800 for SLI) on flagships this generation. I wonder when we'll start seeing the aftermarket 1080Tis that outperform this thing?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Are you mad that you bought a GTX 1080 and 2 months later the new Titan comes out?


no because that Titan is $500 / 500-550+ EUR more

1080 p/p is much better and thats saying something


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CynicalUnicorn*
> 
> Okay. This is awful. This is so many forms of awful that I need to use bullet points:
> 
> 
> MSRP. It is now 20% higher than it has been in the past.
> The GPU itself. I can all but guarantee those 3584 CUDA cores aren't all of them and that it has 3840 in total like GP100.
> If it's missing CUDAs, we'll probably see a second Titan Black-like release for another $1200 to get the full GPU.
> (Probably) no FP16, FP64, or HBM. I can all but guarantee that this is GP100 with all of those goodies stripped out. Why?
> It's all about profit margins. This is a gaming GPU, no more, no less, and cutting out fancy features makes a cheaper die.
> 
> The original Titan was marketed as (and gained some popularity) as a kind of Quadro-lite workstation GPU with GK110's full FP64 capabilities. The Titan X (the first one) didn't have FP64, but then again neither did GM200 in general. So what about the new Titan X?
> 
> It's a gaming GPU. We know this because Nvidia made an entirely new die, GP102, for it. It's not a workstation card. It's retaining the four-figure price tag. And it's the same "tier" of GPU as, say, a GTX 280. Or 480. Or 580. It's the highest end gaming GPU in a given series, something that has traditionally been $650 at an absolute maximum (and even then only the Fury X and 280 have been that expensive in a long time).
> 
> And above all, they didn't even have the decency to wait. We're getting this three months after the 1080 launched (for $700) rather than six months for the Titan X after the 980 and nearly a full _year_ for the OG Titan after the 680. Nvidia, apparently, wants their customers to double-dip and spend _$1900_ ($3800 for SLI) on flagships this generation. I wonder when we'll start seeing the aftermarket 1080Tis that outperform this thing?


Good post









Sadly I can't rep you








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> no because that Titan is $500 / 500-550+ EUR more
> 
> 1080 p/p is much better and thats saying something


Interesting. Thanks for the answer. Are you honest with yourself? I mean you of all people love Nvidia more than your own mother









Not interested in the new Titan at all? Maybe the new Titan that comes probably within 9 months and features the full 3840 cuda cores?


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CynicalUnicorn*
> 
> Okay. This is awful.
> 
> And above all, they didn't even have the decency to wait. We're getting this three months after the 1080 launched (for $700) rather than six months for the Titan X after the 980 and nearly a full _year_ for the OG Titan after the 680. Nvidia, apparently, wants their customers to double-dip and spend _$1900_ ($3800 for SLI) on flagships this generation. I wonder when we'll start seeing the aftermarket 1080Tis that outperform this thing?


The GTX 780Ti came out 3 months after the Titan OG right? It's just the other way around this time









In any case. My biggest gripe isn't the lack of HBM or the price as I'm already mentally committed to buying two titans @ 1k each and then slapping water blocks on them. _My biggest gripe is the naming. Couldn't they come up with a better name?_


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> The GTX 780Ti came out 3 months after the Titan OG right? It's just the other way around this time


8 9 months

Feb 2013 and Nov 2013


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> The GTX 780Ti came out 3 months after the Titan OG right? It's just the other way around this time


GTX 780 did. 780 Ti came after 290X.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Interesting. Thanks for the answer. Are you honest with yourself? I mean you of all people love Nvidia more than your own mother wink.gif
> 
> Not interested in the new Titan at all? Maybe the new Titan that comes probably within 9 months and features the full 3840 cuda cores?


"1080 p/p is much better"


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> The GTX 780Ti came out 3 months after the Titan OG right? It's just the other way around this time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GTX 780 did. 780 Ti came after 290X.
Click to expand...









Sorry, thanks.


----------



## lutjens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> now that I think about it.
> 
> Nvidia not allowing more than 2 SLI with Pascal is pretty smart considering HBM shows its true benefits in a scenario with more than 2 GPUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gotta be honest though. I didn't expect the new Titan to be out in August. I thought Nov/Dec. Price is about what I expected considering there is zero competition, but I also expected it to have more cuda cores.
> 
> Nvidia cards are great if you have money, not so much if you'd don't. I would love to have a new Titan, but I'd hate myself if I paid 1200$ for it.
> 
> What do Nvidia enthusiast early adopters think about it releasing so shortly after the GTX 1080 ? Are you mad that you bought a GTX 1080 and 2 months later the new Titan comes out? Do you don't care and buy everything Nvidia brings out? Are you okay with it and selling your GTX 1080? Do you think the price is "fair"?


It was fairly common knowledge that the Titan version of Pascal was incoming. Performance-hungry folks who were smart sat on their wallets and waited patiently for the Titan rather than jump on the mainstream 1080.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> "1080 p/p is much better"


but then why don't go with the 1070? the P/P IS EVEN BETTERERERER


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CynicalUnicorn*
> 
> Okay. This is awful. This is so many forms of awful that I need to use bullet points:
> 
> 
> The name. It has already been used. This would be like saying every series is the 700 series or whatever.
> MSRP. It is now 20% higher than it has been in the past.
> The GPU itself. I can all but guarantee those 3584 CUDA cores aren't all of them and that it has 3840 in total like GP100.
> If it's missing CUDAs, we'll probably see a second Titan Black-like release for another $1200 to get the full GPU.
> (Probably) no FP16, FP64, or HBM. I can all but guarantee that this is GP100 with all of those goodies stripped out. Why?
> It's all about profit margins. This is a gaming GPU, no more, no less, and cutting out fancy features makes a cheaper die.
> 
> The original Titan was marketed as (and gained some popularity) as a kind of Quadro-lite workstation GPU with GK110's full FP64 capabilities. The Titan X (the first one) didn't have FP64, but then again neither did GM200 in general. So what about the new Titan X?
> 
> It's a gaming GPU. We know this because Nvidia made an entirely new die, GP102, for it. It's not a workstation card. It's retaining the four-figure price tag. And it's the same "tier" of GPU as, say, a GTX 280. Or 480. Or 580. It's the highest end gaming GPU in a given series, something that has traditionally been $650 at an absolute maximum (and even then only the Fury X and 280 have been that expensive in a long time).
> 
> And above all, they didn't even have the decency to wait. We're getting this three months after the 1080 launched (for $700) rather than six months for the Titan X after the 980 and nearly a full _year_ for the OG Titan after the 680. Nvidia, apparently, wants their customers to double-dip and spend _$1900_ ($3800 for SLI) on flagships this generation. I wonder when we'll start seeing the aftermarket 1080Tis that outperform this thing?


What decency are you talking about man? The price of the Titan X is way higher, it's not like you get a $650 1080 and 3 months later a $700 Titan X comes out. It's only on the same price level if you have a lot of cash, then yes you want to get the best card... but if you have a lot of cash you buy it anyway. You can't expect to have the fasttest card in this market for more than a few months!!! Stop with the e-peen self-shaming


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CynicalUnicorn*
> 
> Okay. This is awful. This is so many forms of awful that I need to use bullet points:
> 
> 
> The name. It has already been used. This would be like saying every series is the 700 series or whatever.
> MSRP. It is now 20% higher than it has been in the past.
> The GPU itself. I can all but guarantee those 3584 CUDA cores aren't all of them and that it has 3840 in total like GP100.
> If it's missing CUDAs, we'll probably see a second Titan Black-like release for another $1200 to get the full GPU.
> (Probably) no FP16, FP64, or HBM. I can all but guarantee that this is GP100 with all of those goodies stripped out. Why?
> It's all about profit margins. This is a gaming GPU, no more, no less, and cutting out fancy features makes a cheaper die.
> 
> The original Titan was marketed as (and gained some popularity) as a kind of Quadro-lite workstation GPU with GK110's full FP64 capabilities. The Titan X (the first one) didn't have FP64, but then again neither did GM200 in general. So what about the new Titan X?
> 
> It's a gaming GPU. We know this because Nvidia made an entirely new die, GP102, for it. It's not a workstation card. It's retaining the four-figure price tag. And it's the same "tier" of GPU as, say, a GTX 280. Or 480. Or 580. It's the highest end gaming GPU in a given series, something that has traditionally been $650 at an absolute maximum (and even then only the Fury X and 280 have been that expensive in a long time).
> 
> And above all, they didn't even have the decency to wait. We're getting this three months after the 1080 launched (for $700) rather than six months for the Titan X after the 980 and nearly a full _year_ for the OG Titan after the 680. Nvidia, apparently, wants their customers to double-dip and spend _$1900_ ($3800 for SLI) on flagships this generation. I wonder when we'll start seeing the aftermarket 1080Tis that outperform this thing?


The 1080 was the feeler. NVIDIA must have met an internal sales quota. There is so much money in the world based on 1080 sales... why not grab it all and quickly?


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugalumps*
> 
> look at amd when they released the 7970 first it had no competition and *the price of it was higher than we had seen yet for gpu's because of that.*


Where does this nonsense come from? Years before that and obviously many generations before that there were very expensive cards... yet somehow AMD always get's blamed for a fairly typical market price of $550 for the 7970, their top end gpu.

8800 GTX $599-649...

8800 Ultra you ask?

*$830 - In the beginning of 2007*

That was about a decade ago at this point. Stop blaming AMD for all of Nvidia's pricing. At the end of the day competition matters, but Nvidia sets the price. If they know people will pay for it, they will charge it.

Again, I will wait for a card at the $500 range that will beat a $1200 card shortly there after. I don't mind waiting 6 months to a year if it means saving $700 and getting better performance.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> but then why don't go with the 1070? the P/P IS EVEN BETTERERERER


not enough to run the monitor in my sig as I would like it to be run (1080 fits the middle between the 1070 and the Titan here .. and the golden middle is always the best







)


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> The 1080 was the feeler. NVIDIA must have met an internal sales quota. There is so much money in the world based on 1080 sales... why not grab it all and quickly?


Yes, as I mentioned nVidia is gonna milk this as much as they can until AMD releases something of worthy performance. If ever


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> not enough to run the monitor in my sig as I would like it to be run (1080 fits the middle between the 1070 and the Titan here .. and the golden middle is always the best
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


the new Titan would be even better ^^

but sure whatever you like mate


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> the new Titan would be even better ^^
> 
> but sure whatever you like mate


no it wouldnt because it has horrible p/p like all Titans always did

but thx mate


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> no it wouldnt because it has horrible p/p like all Titans always did
> 
> but thx mate


I think you should really get a new Titan or two.

People who really like Nvidia buy Titans.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

$1650 CAD + 13% TAX here I come. Oh wait probably another $200 CAD for the WB. Forget it I think I can use my money for better things to play Pokemon GO.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I think you should really get a new Titan or two.


only if Huang personally gifts me one


----------



## Liranan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LancerVI*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> Fools and their money.
> 
> 
> 
> It's really unbelievable what nVidia has done here.
> 
> No way in hell am I spending that kind of scratch on what, by all rights, should be a Ti @ $650-699 tops and the 1080 a $550-599 card.
> 
> Yes....I'm serious. nVidia have become quite the swindlers.
Click to expand...

What's unbelievable is that people will rush out and buy these overpriced cards. It's these people who can't think beyond their own selfish epeen and cause both Nvidia and AMD to raise prices because they know these people will throw their money at anything.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> only if Huang personally gifts me one


think of all the amazing things you get when you buy an Nvidia card, especially the new Titan X :

- PhysX
- you can make fun of people having Kepler cards
- the best AMD card is not even half as good as your new Titan X
- G-Sync
- Futuristic Razer-like design for the sophisticated gentleman
- it looks pretty good in a forum signature
- you can go into the official Titan X owner club and claim to have a better Titan X than they have, because they have the old Maxwell card!

I mean the 1080 feels pretty old now. It's old news compared to the new X


----------



## SuprUsrStan

My god. Why are there so many salty people in this thread.









It's not like all those people complaining would have picked up a Titan even if it were only $1000, comes with HBM2, and is a full fat version.


----------



## JackCY

At half the MSRP I'm sure it would be a hit, at $1200 it's going to be a rarity just like top Intel CPUs. Nice GPU for the 0.01%.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> At half the MSRP I'm sure it would be a hit, at $1200 it's going to be a rarity just like top Intel CPUs. Nice GPU for the 0.01%.


Clearly, they would't release a 1080Ti at $750 just three months after releasing the 1080. For those people who aren't looking to pick up a titan, you guys need to wait for Q2 2017.


----------



## Mhill2029

I'm still trying to get my head round the "Titan X" name being used again. It's quite plausible they ditched the Ti thing altogether with Pascal and may do a Titan X Ultra instead. It's very strange, since benchmarking results are going to confusing with cards using the same naming scheme. *head scratch*


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> My god. Why are there so many salty people in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not like all those people complaining would have picked up a Titan even if it were only $1000, comes with HBM2, and is a full fat version.


because someone has to fight the good fight.

The new Titan X at 1200$ is basically what the GTX 570/470 was at 349$ (if you look at it from the technical standpoint of specifications etc.). If you can't see that you are part of the problem.

Granted the situation changed. I understand that a new Titan X would never cost 350$, but a more than 300% price increase in 5 years is brutal.

Things get more expensive all the time, but Nvidia GPUs much much more so than everything else.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> because someone has to fight the good fight.


challenge Jen-Hsun to a pokemon fight online


----------



## CynicalUnicorn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> The GTX 780Ti came out 3 months after the Titan OG right? It's just the other way around this time


Kind of? The Titan has, since Kepler, been the first release of the highest-end chip (GK110, GM200, and now GP102), after the mid-range chip (GK104, GM204, and now GP104) had launched between 3 and 11 months earlier. The cut-down, cheaper-but-95%-as-good "Titan-lite" like the 780 and 980Ti is to be expected at this point, of course, but it's using the same chip as the Titan.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> What decency are you talking about man? The price of the Titan X is way higher, it's not like you get a $650 1080 and 3 months later a $700 Titan X comes out. It's only on the same price level if you have a lot of cash, then yes you want to get the best card... but if you have a lot of cash you buy it anyway. You can't expect to have the fasttest card in this market for more than a few months!!! Stop with the e-peen self-shaming


No, of course not. I don't expect sudden price cuts and the Titan to assume that price. What I was expecting was more of a gap between those releases, and time for some price drops on the existing GPUs as well as the stock to stabilize enough for the actual MSRP of $600 to be common. A cursory glance of Newegg shows that the 1080 is still $650 minimum - 980Ti and Fury X territory - and the 1070 is $410.

The thing is, the gap between the 680 and OG Titan had a reason. Yields were _terrible._ Apparently Nvidia tried to launch the 680 as GK100, but they couldn't get enough of them in time for launch. It took a year before we saw GK110, a revised version that still had yield issues, at all and even then it had an SMX unit disabled. As for the 980 to the Titan X, I'm not really sure why we had the wait, but a 601mm2 die can't have good yields and they probably needed all the time they could get.

And now, with the Titan X 2.0? Three months. That's not enough to work out any major kinks. This should have launched with the rest of the 1000 series in the first place, just like GF100 launched with the 480 and 400 series, and GF110 with the 580 and the 500 series, G80 with the 8800GTX and the 8 series, and GT200 with the 280 and 200 series.


----------



## Ghoxt

Wait, does this beat 1080 SLI? trying to get my head around the pricing...being that it's almost double. I guess we don't know yet...


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> Wait, does this beat 1080 SLI? trying to get my head around the pricing...being that it's almost double.


of course not. It's maybe 30% faster. Probably less.

My bet is on 25% faster than GTX 1080
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> challenge Jen-Hsun to a pokemon fight online


Have you seen Jhen Sung. He is ripped. I better avoid fighting him. If he is as ruthless in combat as he is in pricing GPUs then he would rip The Rock apart before breakfast.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> Wait, does this beat 1080 SLI? trying to get my head around the pricing...being that it's almost double. I guess we don't know yet...


Not likely


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CynicalUnicorn*
> 
> Kind of? The Titan has, since Kepler, been the first release of the highest-end chip (GK110, GM200, and now GP102), after the mid-range chip (GK104, GM204, and now GP104) had launched between 3 and 11 months earlier. The cut-down, cheaper-but-95%-as-good "Titan-lite" like the 780 and 980Ti is to be expected at this point, of course, but it's using the same chip as the Titan.
> No, of course not. I don't expect sudden price cuts and the Titan to assume that price. What I was expecting was more of a gap between those releases, and time for some price drops on the existing GPUs as well as the stock to stabilize enough for the actual MSRP of $600 to be common. A cursory glance of Newegg shows that the 1080 is still $650 minimum - 980Ti and Fury X territory - and the 1070 is $410.
> 
> The thing is, the gap between the 680 and OG Titan had a reason. Yields were _terrible._ Apparently Nvidia tried to launch the 680 as GK100, but they couldn't get enough of them in time for launch. It took a year before we saw GK110, a revised version that still had yield issues, at all and even then it had an SMX unit disabled. As for the 980 to the Titan X, I'm not really sure why we had the wait, but a 601mm2 die can't have good yields and they probably needed all the time they could get.
> 
> And now, with the Titan X 2.0? Three months. That's not enough to work out any major kinks. This should have launched with the rest of the 1000 series in the first place, just like GF100 launched with the 480 and 400 series, and GF110 with the 580 and the 500 series, G80 with the 8800GTX and the 8 series, and GT200 with the 280 and 200 series.


Maybe Huang forgot to release it 3 months ago, now he shows up in a small classroom and pulls it out of his pocket like "hey, what we got here... ahhh it's Titan X, you KNOW Titan X right? "


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> What's unbelievable is that people will rush out and buy these overpriced cards. It's these people who can't think beyond their own selfish epeen and cause both Nvidia and AMD to raise prices because they know these people will throw their money at anything.


I don't think your complaints are warranted. The issue isn't price as much as competition. Why complain about 200K$ Lamborghinis being sold as long as there are affordable mustangs and BMWs that do the trick? the real complaint is that we have no alternative beyond the 1060 GTX.

The way I see it AMD is currently catering to the sub $300 mass market, which forces nVidia to release its 1060/1050 GTX quickly and at a lower price point. On the flip nVidia is charging record highs for its 300 mm^2 1080 GTX since AMD isn't competing with it.

These are the same market forces at play since the early 2000s (when I became an engineer and could afford this hobby). Nothing really changed. If you don't have any competition in your segment you raise the price since you have a monopoly anyway. Right now 1080 GTX and its larger variant (now branded) the Titan X are uncontested and so they'll be expensive. When the 7970 first launched it was uncontested, and it was priced accordingly.

If we should complain, it should be about blind brand loyalty. Even if Vega was 15% faster and 15% cooler and consumed 15% less power than the 1080 GTX and had the same price tag, people would still buy the nvidia card. Even when AMD creamed nvidia's offering it still barely reached 50% market share. We're the ones creating a monopoly.. and we're the ones driving the insane preorder then fail launches by the big publishers.

For the past 4 years we've seen the beginnings of nVidia's monopoly.. and it stinks as much as intels.


----------



## CynicalUnicorn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> Wait, does this beat 1080 SLI? trying to get my head around the pricing...being that it's almost double. I guess we don't know yet...


2560*2 > 3584*1









Based on the cores, it should be 40% faster than a 1080, which is just stupidly good. Based on scaling with more cores, it will be a bit less but roughly 35%. And based on clockspeed, it can go either way - I have no idea how many more of less jiggahertz this will have than the 1080, though my gut feeling is a bit less.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> What's unbelievable is that people will rush out and buy these overpriced cards. It's these people who can't think beyond their own selfish epeen and cause both Nvidia and AMD to raise prices because they know these people will throw their money at anything.


lol on what other enthusiast forum are just registered just to tell people "I'm sorry I don't have that kind of money to spend so I'm gonna call you morons for buying it"
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CynicalUnicorn*
> 
> 2560*2 > 3584*1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Based on the cores, it should be 40% faster than a 1080, which is just stupidly good. Based on scaling with more cores, it will be a bit less but roughly 35%. And based on clockspeed, it can go either way - I have no idea how many more of less jiggahertz this will have than the 1080, though my gut feeling is a bit less.


being that it's 17% more cores than Titan XM and 40% faster core clock, only 25% more memory bandwidth might hold it back.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> only if Huang personally gifts me one


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> only if Huang personally gifts me one


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> of course not. It's maybe 30% faster. Probably less.
> 
> My bet is on 25% faster than GTX 1080
> Have you seen Jhen Sung. He is ripped. I better avoid fighting him. If he is as ruthless in combat as he is in pricing GPUs then he would rip The Rock apart before breakfast.


Huang... Jen Hsun... Jhen Sung... I love how we all mispell his name or put his name incompletely hahahaha


----------



## zealord

People please stop comparing videos cards to cars.

You CAN'T do that. Cars have much more "variables" that make them good/bad than video cards. The main indicator for a good GPU is performance (in relation to price and power usage).
That doesn't go for cars that much. Sure more horse power is great, but there is much more to cars than that. You can't define a car by horse power. If horse power alone would be the most important factor than Porsche wouldn't be the greatest car manufacturer in the world


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> People please stop comparing videos cards to cars.
> 
> You CAN'T do that. Cars have much more "variables" that make them good/bad than video cards. The main indicator for a good GPU is performance (in relation to price and power usage).
> That doesn't go for cars that much. Sure more horse power is great, but there is much more to cars than that. You can't define a car by horse power. If horse power alone would be the most important factor than Porsche wouldn't be the greatest car manufacturer in the world


Porsche? Aren't Veyrons much more powerful? Pfffft


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Porsche? Aren't Veyrons much more powerful? Pfffft


yeah bugattis have like 1200-1500 horse power, but they can't match a GT3 RS on track that is like 1/10th of a bugattis price


----------



## Liranan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> What's unbelievable is that people will rush out and buy these overpriced cards. It's these people who can't think beyond their own selfish epeen and cause both Nvidia and AMD to raise prices because they know these people will throw their money at anything.
> 
> 
> 
> lol on what other enthusiast forum are just registered just to tell people "I'm sorry I don't have that kind of money to spend so I'm gonna call you morons for buying it"
Click to expand...

That's right, I registered on these boards four years before you just to call people moron for buying an overpriced video card









Edit: I've been poasting here for six years already? Unbelievable how fast time flies.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

I hope it's another Titan Z for Nvidia.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> yeah bugattis have like 1200-1500 horse power, but they can't match a GT3 RS on track that is like 1/10th of a bugattis price


I'll log into Bugatti's forums and call everyone an idiot cause they don't buy a pimped out Nissan GTR with Dual Turbos


----------



## bl4ckdot

After reading most of the comments, I feel bad to want this new Titan X to replace my 980 Ti


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> After reading most of the comments, I feel bad to want this new Titan X to replace my 980 Ti


I'll get your 980Ti for $201 so you only have to pay the magical $999 for the Titan X


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> After reading most of the comments, I feel bad to want this new Titan X to replace my 980 Ti


nah mate it's allright. If you have the money and don't have to lose out on anything go for it.

it's okay to buy stuff you want.

I'd buy that too if I had like 6 digits in my bank, which I don't








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I'll log into Bugatti's forums and call everyone an idiot cause they don't buy a pimped out Nissan GTR with Dual Turbos


bugattis are expensive and limited boulevard cars. Arabs and show offs buy them. They are idiots, but they can afford to be idiots because they are billionaires probably


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> That's right, I registered on these boards four years before you just to call people moron for buying an overpriced video card
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I've been poasting here for six years already? Unbelievable how fast time flies.


lol that's just sad.
Instead of saying to sb they have a rad setup with a 1080/TX you'd rather throw out spite cause you think they're too pricey.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> nah mate it's allright. If you have the money and don't have to lose out on anything go for it.
> 
> it's okay to buy stuff you want.
> 
> I'd buy that too if I had like 6 digits in my bank, which I don't
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bugattis are expensive and limited boulevard cars. Arabs and show offs buy them. They are idiots, but they can afford to be idiots because they are billionaires probably


Tell me you wouldn't buy one if you had the money and a track to max that beast in? There are Bugatti owners that are showoffs and will paint them with gold, but others just want to feel the power. Same with Titan X, some just want a 12" e-peen to brag while others sit quietly in their rooms and enjoy the experience


----------



## GHADthc

Far out, its Keplar allll over again! Nvidia will be laughing all the way to the bank with this playbook rehash.

I'm scared to see how many dollarydoo's one of these will cost down here...


----------



## Liranan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> That's right, I registered on these boards four years before you just to call people moron for buying an overpriced video card
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I've been poasting here for six years already? Unbelievable how fast time flies.
> 
> 
> 
> lol that's just sad.
> Instead of saying to sb they have a rad setup with a 1080/TX you'd rather throw out spite cause you think they're too pricey.
Click to expand...

What I care about is that Nvidia will price gouge and then AMD might do it too. Look at how Intel price gouge. It affects us all whether you like it or not. While it's easy to say people should spend their money on whatever they feel like, which is entirely true, those very same people will complain when Nvidia continuously raise prices, despite their own guilt.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I'll log into Bugatti's forums and call everyone an idiot cause they don't buy a pimped out Nissan GTR with Dual Turbos


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Tell me you wouldn't buy one if you had the money and a track to max that beast in? There are Bugatti owners that are showoffs and will paint them with gold, but others just want to feel the power. Same with Titan X, some just want a 12" e-peen to brag while others sit quietly in their rooms and enjoy the experience


I would maybe buy a couple of cars as an investment, but I am full blood Porsche fanboy and would try to get a 918 Spyder.

911.2 Carrera 4S for everyday use. It's pretty cheap though, about 100 new Titan X


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Tell me you wouldn't buy one if you had the money and a track to max that beast in?


a Bugatti Veyron/Chiron ? nope

a McLaren P1 or a Koenigsegg - yup


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> a Bugatti Veyron/Chiron ? nope
> 
> a McLaren P1 or a Koenigsegg - yup


Yeah any of those too. Even a McLaren F1


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> What I care about is that Nvidia will price gouge and then AMD might do it too. Look at how Intel price gouge. It affects us all whether you like it or not. While it's easy to say people should spend their money on whatever they feel like, which is entirely true, those very same people will complain when Nvidia continuously raise prices, despite their own guilt.


the only thing one would be guilty of if they take your advice is giving up something they want because of you lol
this isn't price gouging, price gouging is overcharging for things that are essential for you to live cretin. if you can't afford a high end gpu then don't buy it instead of telling enthusiast that they're responsible for the fact you can't.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> And this is exactly why we need AMD to release high end cards.
> 
> Completely honest this new Titan X could've very well been the GTX 1080 for half that money if AMD had something to compete.
> 
> If this card was full fat 3840 cuda cores and 16GB of HBM2 or something I could understand 999$ for it and a Titan name, but a cut card with GDDR5X for 1200$ ... nah come on


Amd is dead. Unless amd flagship has been 2.2 times the performance of their mid range. They are dead.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Tell me you wouldn't buy one if you had the money and a track to max that beast in? There are Bugatti owners that are showoffs and will paint them with gold, but others just want to feel the power. Same with Titan X, some just want a 12" e-peen to brag while others sit quietly in their rooms and enjoy the experience


Nope. Bugatti Veyron's are such a waste. I would rather have a Ferrari or Lambo. Cheaper and probably more fun to drive. Sadly I can't afford any of them.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> a Bugatti Veyron/Chiron ? nope
> 
> a McLaren P1 or a Koenigsegg - yup


I like your thinking.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

So Titan X... Pretty cool. A little surprising that they decided to go with GDDR5x but that's cool. I'm sure HBM2 wasn't ready yet plus with Pascal I guess its not really needed at this point. I'm sure in the next 2-3 years when GDDR5x and HBM2 becomes mainstream we'll see a big jump in performance even if they keep Pascal architecture going for 2-3 generations.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> After reading most of the comments, I feel bad to want this new Titan X to replace my 980 Ti


Yeah... 1200 for perhaps 50% perf increase compared to a decently clocked 980 ti. The 50% is awesome... the cost to upgrade is disproportionately insane.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Amd is dead. Unless amd flagship has been 2.2 times the performance of their mid range. They are dead.


they are fine.

It is benefitial for them if Nvidia releases 1200$ cards because AMD doesn't really care how much the ultra enthusiasts fanboys pay for high end cards.

AMD has to have good GPUs in markets most people buy them. That is their strategy. It looks like it is working with the RX480.

I don't like it that AMD doesn't have ultra high end cards, but maybe they have something nice with great p/p in 2017.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> People please stop comparing videos cards to cars


Actually you can. At this point its no longer about performance, or horse power. The price / performance of the new TItan X is so whack that you can afford two 1080 GTXs in its place and game comfortably in 4K

People don't buy a Lamborghini because they need more horsepower.. they buy one for the sake of owning one. That's the idea of "luxury items". The same can be said about intel's monstrously overpriced i7-6950X. If you really need a lot of cores you're better served in the Xeon lineup. The same can be said about the new Titan X. Only enthusiasts will be buying it for the sake of owning it, not those who simply want to game with good graphics. Its like Quad-SLI setups.. the scaling is so bad you own one for the sake of owning one, not because you need it to game.


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Amd is dead. Unless amd flagship has been 2.2 times the performance of their mid range. They are dead.


no they aren't

you're talking from the rectum file.

and if they were, say hello to a 700 dollar "budget" gpu from nvidia.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> That's exactly why I called it the Titan XXX. I don't give a crap if they reléase Titan Lex-Steele versión with 12 inches of RAM at $4000, I wouldn't buy it, what I will buy instead is the best Price/performance card that I can afford, and you should too (any Brand you like). If AMD releases a GTX 1080 killer at a better Price so be it, I would get that instead. I'm not married with Intel, I don't suck nVidias green polygonal cawk, but to whine as what Price the highest card costs... jeez... it's the bleeding edge of Pascal lineup, what did you expect? Instead of whining you should just quietly and proudly sit on your couch and wait for AMD's reléase, sunglasses on, and watch the nVidia fanboys jaws drop to the floor and see nVidia drop prices. But right now AMD is still in their mom's basement concocting its GPU magic, still leaving AMD fanboys jacking off with spec charts while nVidia seizes the moment and charges $1200 to their own fanboys.


Didn't take long for you to 180 from your original position


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> they are fine.
> 
> AMD has to have good GPUs in markets most people buy them. That is their strategy. It looks like it is working with the RX480.


seems like they're doing the most sensible thing, rebuilding from the ground up.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Nope. Bugatti Veyron's are such a waste. I would rather have a Ferrari or Lambo. Cheaper and probably more fun to drive. Sadly I can't afford any of them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like your thinking.


I just continued the Bugatti argument because he talked about pure horsepower as an insufficient analogy.I visually like Lambos the most though


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Not getting one, this is the 1080Ti..


Maybe not...

We may be heading down a path similar to Titan > 780 Ti / Titan Black. Time will tell.









No doubt that we desperately need some competition. Nvidia is starting to remind me of Microsoft in the good old days, before Google Apps were around.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> Actually you can. At this point its no longer about performance, or horse power. The price / performance of the new TItan X is so whack that you can afford two 1080 GTXs in its place and game comfortably in 4K
> 
> People don't buy a Lamborghini because they need more horsepower.. they buy one for the sake of owning one. That's the idea of "luxury items". The same can be said about intel's monstrously overpriced i7-6950X. If you really need a lot of cores you're better served in the Xeon lineup. The same can be said about the new Titan X. Only enthusiasts will be buying it for the sake of owning it, not those who simply want to game with good graphics. Its like Quad-SLI setups.. the scaling is so bad you own one for the sake of owning one, not because you need it to game.


I don't like how you're defining enthusiasts.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> The price / performance of the new TItan X is so whack that you can afford two 1080 GTXs in its place and game comfortably in 4K


comfortably with awesome SLI scaling/support issues and microstutter

TItans are not just for epeen, people actually do want a single GPU [email protected]


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> *Nvidia have no obligation to you to keep price acceptable, they have a obligation to increase value for their shareholders* hence they raise the price when lack of competition from AMD allows them to. You seem to misunderstand how a for-profit company works.


wonder why AMD still have 20% share in GPU? Nvidia price gauge too hard. They could have bring it down to 5% and maintain that monopoly for many generations like Intel. Intel didnt price gauge as hard when they were in Core 2 duo/Nehelem/Sandy bridge era, they simply wanted to take AMD share down to bare minimum to almost none.

if I am share holder nvidia, I love the short term return but I would hate Nvidia didnt take this opportunity to completely drop AMD like Intel did.


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> After reading most of the comments, I feel bad to want this new Titan X to replace my 980 Ti


That is some of these people's intent. If you want it and can afford it, don't feel bad, buy it. It is your decision no matter how much salt they pile into this thread.


----------



## bigjdubb

Well color me unimpressed, no HBM2 means I don't want it. It wouldn't matter if it was 160% faster than the current TX, without HBM2 it is a letdown.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> People please stop comparing videos cards to cars.
> 
> You CAN'T do that. Cars have much more "variables" that make them good/bad than video cards. The main indicator for a good GPU is performance (in relation to price and power usage).
> That doesn't go for cars that much. Sure more horse power is great, but there is much more to cars than that. You can't define a car by horse power. If horse power alone would be the most important factor than Porsche wouldn't be the greatest car manufacturer in the world


Uh 98% of people think more horsepower is better.

98% of people think that nvidia titan x is the best new gpu in the world and dream about it..

2% of people have a brain and know what they are buying.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clocknut*
> 
> wonder why AMD still have 20% share in GPU? Nvidia price gauge too hard. They could have bring it down to 5% and maintain that monopoly for many generations like Intel. Intel didnt price gauge as hard when they were in Core 2 duo/Nehelem/Sandy bridge era, they simply wanted to take AMD share down to bare minimum to almost none.
> 
> if I am share holder nvidia, I love the short term return but I would hate Nvidia didnt take this opportunity to completely drop AMD like Intel did.


Actually intel did in a way..

http://www.overclock.net/t/1604953/various-pascal-titan-could-be-50-faster-than-the-geforce-gtx-1080-rumoured-to-launch-in-august/930#post_25367894


----------



## boredgunner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Maybe not...
> 
> We may be heading down a path similar to Titan > 780 Ti / Titan Black. Time will tell.


Seems this way. And I expect the 1080 Ti to be better because this card is a gimped GP100 is it not? But anyway I'm holding out until an HBM 2 non-Titan flagship.


----------



## gooface

This means something bigger is just around the corner, and a year before we expected... I honestly did not expect this card to drop for another 6 months, at least... (Feb 17) I wonder how far back and how expensive the 1080ti is going to be... that was going to be my next card... but this is way too soon, I have been upgrading cards every two years... I cant do this every year thing.. I am definitely upgrading my monitor before I get anything more powerful than what I have now


----------



## Slomo4shO

Just going to leave this here since some people seem to think that more performance should equal more $$$...


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigjdubb*
> 
> It wouldn't matter if it was 160% faster than the current TX, without HBM2 it is a letdown.


you cant mean that









HBM2 is just 3 letters and a number, end performance is the most important thing, at 160% you would be drooling over it


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> After reading most of the comments, I feel bad to want this new Titan X to replace my 980 Ti


lol you mean people who use the term price gouging in relation to a GPU ? don't even pay attention to them. They need that Titan X to feed them and take care of their offspring but can't afford to because nvidia is merciless.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Didn't take long for you to 180 from your original position


180°? I maintain my position. nVidia can do whatever they want because they have no true competition. AMD hasn't come up with anything to give the 1080/1070 a fight. nVidia has the right to release an even higher specced Pascal, even with GDDR5X memory they kick AMD out of the boat right now. They will milk this as long as AMD is still sweating in their labs. Titan X is for either pure fanboys, people with enough cash to buy anything or people that REALLY need them for non-gaming purpouses. I'm neither of them, I can quietly buy the 1070 which is very good p/p, I won't whine because a Titan X exists because I can't afford it. If I had $1200 to spare (and enough time to game) I'd get that chit. If I had enough money to buy a Tesla or something for 3d rendering, I'd get it too. But I don't, so I will get what's best value for me and won't whine because they release a Titan Xstasy with 12.1 GB at $3000. nVidia has released good value cards in all segments, why would I care?

I don't care either if it's GDDR5 or even if it runs on an overclocked 486, what you're buying is performance and *maybe* power consumption. HMB2 is all dreams and clouds until AMD lands it and shoves it in nVidia's face ONLY by winning benchmarks. If that's the case and it has good price, I'd get that instead. I don't really care if the best p/p card is nVidia or AMD, but RIGHT NOW nVidia has the upper hand and will pocket all they can.


----------



## fat4l

Well looking at the TFlops ...I can say that a *2000MHz TItan X will have 14.3TFlops*.
*A 2100MHz 1080 has 10.8TFlops.*

That's a 32% difference...


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fat4l*
> 
> Well looking at the TFlops ...I can say that a *2000MHz TItan X will have 14.3TFlops*.
> *A 2100MHz 1080 has 10.8TFlops.*
> 
> That's a 32% difference...


lol good luck doing that on the reference cooler with no custom boards and coolers available.you'll see even a 180W 1080 has problems with temperature throttling, let alone a 250W beast


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> lol good luck doing that on the reference cooler with no custom boards and coolers available.


I am sure anyone with a brain will get a WB.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> People don't buy a Lamborghini because they need more horsepower.. they buy one for the sake of owning one. That's the idea of "luxury items".


You're fooling yourself. This Titan X isn't a luxury item. It is not best of class, it is a cut-down gaming card. A luxury item would have HBM2 for ML/DNN applications.

If you buy this card because you want to buy the best, you've been conned. There's a much more expensive GP out there.

On the other hand, it is somewhat in line with what they have previously offered in GK.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> [quote name="bigjdubb" url="/t/1606550/twitter-jen-hsun-introduces-the-new-nvidia-titan-x/600#post_25370737" It wouldn't matter if it was 160% faster than the current TX, without HBM2 it is a letdown.


you cant mean that









HBM2 is just 3 letters and a number, end performance is the most important thing, at 160% you would be drooling over it







[/quote]

true 160% would be pretty strong.

the new Titan X is 25-35% faster than GTX 1080. Even with HBM2 it would only be 30-38% faster.

A 160% faster new Titan X with GDDR5X over a GTX 1080 definitively sounds better than a 30-38% faster Titan X with HBM2.

But the reality is that the card is not 60% faster than a GTX 1080.

People have to decide for themselves, but I genuinely think that the card is way overprice, even for Nvidias standards.

1200$ for a cut card that is probably "just" 25-35% faster than a GTX 1080.

It doesn't sound right. If you have more brass than brains go for it, but if you need to take a credit/loan that money from someone I know I wouldn't do it. Turning settings a tad higher is not worth it to pay 1200$ for a product that might be bettered pretty fast.

But the card is going to sell well and sell out in the US like all Nvidia cards do.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigjdubb*
> 
> Well color me unimpressed, no HBM2 means I don't want it. It wouldn't matter if it was 160% faster than the current TX, without HBM2 it is a letdown.


Why are people so obsessed about HBM2? It doesn't matter if it's HBM2 or GDDR5 or running mice on steroids. What ends up mattering is the performance and features, It's not like the damn cards are upgradeable and by having GDDR5X you're gonna bottleneck a future GPU chip, so yeah you have to think of better memory for the long run. This ain't the case. Would you buy the card if it used quantum computing but yielded 10% of the performance?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> People have to decide for themselves, but I genuinely think that the card is way overprice, even for Nvidias standards.
> 
> 1200$ for a cut card that is probably "just" 25-35% faster than a GTX 1080.
> 
> It doesn't sound right. If you have more brass than brains go for it, but if you need to take a credit/loan that money from someone I know I wouldn't do it. Turning settings a tad higher is not worth it to pay 1200$ for a product that might be bettered pretty fast.
> 
> But the card is going to sell well and sell out in the US like all Nvidia cards do.


all true, bad p/p, so why were you trying to make get one then ?


----------



## Ghoxt

So 16 months after the last Titan-X we are introduced to the Titan-XP

New Architecture

New Die Shrink

New Memory

New Price hike @ 20% higher

So why am I not falling all over this? History, plain and simple. Nvidia's own historical cleverness has my feet in concrete on this reveal.

My question not answered as there are no Official Reviews of this card as of yet. (correct me if wrong) Did any of the usual suspect reviewer sites get cards under NDA? When is NDA up if it exists?

Also Bottlenecking a CPU? and (SLI > 2 demise)....is this related. Did Nvidia hit the CPU wall under testing with 3 of these cards and realize no one could benefit from cards 3 and 4 for games anyway? These are the questions I am fielding.

I need to change my signature to Nvidia - "One drop of Milk at a Time".


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> all true, bad p/p, so why were you trying to make get one then ?


I thought you were rich mate


----------



## boredgunner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> If you buy this card because you want to buy the best, you've been conned. There's a much more expensive GP out there.


There is no better graphics card for gaming.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I thought you were rich mate


nah I half-starved for years to get this 1080 and this Gsync monitor









such is the hypnotic power of Jen-Hsuns leather jacket


----------



## Dotachin

yey for small volta with stackable hbm2 in 2017


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I am sure anyone with a brain will get a WB.


that's another story. modded bios with wc and I'm sure 1080 will look like it's dated back to middle ages in performance comparison. now back to your turnips 1080 owners


----------



## ChevChelios

1080 owners can beat Titan X owners in a zerg rush via numbers


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> nah I half-starved for years to get this 1080 and this Gsync monitor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> such is the hypnotic power of Jen-Hsuns leather jacket


don't do that mate. it's just a GPU. Use that money for something you will cherish longer than just a year or two


----------



## Rei86

OMG wru AMD! Gonna pretty much let nVidia run a monopoly on high end segment are we?

And with the price of 1199.99 I'm out again. Gonna wait and see if we actually get a 1080Ti or that AMD Vega thingy


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boredgunner*
> 
> There is no better graphics card for gaming.


So is the GTX 1080 a luxury card, too? Or did it just lose its status based on the release a cut-down GP die with the same memory architecture?

And, actually, you could use the GP100 for gaming, but I guess now common sense applies to being a super enthusiast?









It is 2nd tier, at best.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boredgunner*
> 
> There is no better graphics card for gaming.


If I was buying today I'd get two 1080 GTX instead. But I can wait until AMD competes with Vega. Anyway, its summer.. I'm hardly gaming.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> don't do that mate. it's just a GPU. Use that money for something you will cherish longer than just a year or two


Thats why he is full on attack mode because of how much effort he put to buy that GPU.


----------



## Klocek001

lol Nvidia selling a cut chip with ddr5 for $1200 while amd will soon have to distribute cups with a ball on a string to get back on its feet. and all cause of dx11 overhead.


----------



## Ghoxt

Comparing to the recent 1080, Did we ever get Custom Bios for it? Or were we largely locked out? And asking the same looking towards Titan-XP will it be hamstrung if we cannot alter the Bios?


----------



## GraveDigger7878

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> don't do that mate. it's just a GPU. Use that money for something you will cherish longer than just a year or two


Like the original Titans, I have SLI Titans since February 2013 and I love them still


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraveDigger7878*
> 
> Like the original Titans, I have SLI Titans since February 2013 and I love them still


look at the post I was quoting


----------



## denman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *andrews2547*
> 
> Without going too far off topic, I'll just say this.
> 
> There is a reason why Toyota shares are $54.86 and Ferrari shares are $42.89.
> 
> If they lower the price to something a bit more affordable, they will make less profit per card, but they will also sell more cards which in some cases gives them more profit.
> 
> Obviously I'm not saying they should sell the new Titan X for $200, but $1200 is ridiculous.


Read your post and then like three pages after it :/ Seems like everyone just wants to defend a $1200 card and not understand what you are saying. If all Nvidia cards were priced lower (hell, compariable to previous years same tier cards), then they would sell more, which would be more profits generated by moving greater volume.

The problem with analogies on the internet is people ignore the point you were making and start coming back with "Well, nvidia stock is better than Ferrari and almost at Toyota level, so you don't know what you're talking about". The 'ole pick something from their response that doesn't have to do with the topic and bash it to the ground to somehow make your argument valid. 60% of the time, it works _everytime._


----------



## rcfc89

So where are all the people saying "I was living in a dreamland" and we wouldn't see another high-end gpu from Nvidia until next year? Come eat your Crow.


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *denman*
> 
> The problem with analogies on the internet is people ignore the point you were making and start coming back with "Well, nvidia stock is better than Ferrari and almost at Toyota level, so you don't know what you're talking about". The 'ole pick something from their response that doesn't have to do with the topic and bash it to the ground to somehow make your argument valid. 60% of the time, it works _everytime._


Except that is not what people were saying at all. The point is Nvidia like Toyota offers a wide range of products from inexpensive to luxury. Ferrari only offers a luxury product. He was saying Nvidia should be more like Toyota, and the point is they already are...

They have and continue to have products for mass market appeal as does AMD. Today's high end product becomes tomorrow's mainstream product in the GPU space. I don't think $1200 is a good price, but it is the price they set. I do think the Toyota/Ferrari analogy was terrible though.

In fact the first three responses to that quote said absolutely nothing about the stock price...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *andrews2547*
> 
> Without going too far off topic, I'll just say this.
> 
> There is a reason why Toyota shares are $54.86 and Ferrari shares are $42.89.
> 
> If they lower the price to something a bit more affordable, they will make less profit per card, but they will also sell more cards which in some cases gives them more profit.
> 
> Obviously I'm not saying they should sell the new Titan X for $200, but $1200 is ridiculous.


responded to with these:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> And Nvidia is still closer to Toyota than Ferrari (I hate car analogies in computers...) as they have a range of products from ultra high end/high end (Lexus ) to mid/low end (Toyota ).


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> Nvidia don't just sells high end cards though, thus the Ferrari comp is invalid, the X60 and X50 line are competitive products that do much to increase Nvidia market share like the Corolla line does for Toyota (a large part of it is currently proppred up by 960, 950 and 750Ti, with 1060 joining the party and 1050 to come)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Yes but nVidia sells both low end and high end, which Ferrari doesn't. They have a large base to sell low end to mid end, and now they're offering a "mid end" card like the 1070 which is very fast, a 1080 still faster and they're releasing a gold-plated Titan X for those that can afford it, they don't care if they sell few cards to gamers because they will sell more to datacenters or sciencie applications, still Titan X won't be the base of their profit, Titan X will be the "special edition" of Pascal GDDR5, it's a niche product


To which you respond with this????
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *denman*
> 
> Read your post and then like three pages after it :/ Seems like everyone just wants to defend a $1200 card and not understand what you are saying. If all Nvidia cards were priced lower (hell, compariable to previous years same tier cards), then they would sell more, which would be more profits generated by moving greater volume.
> 
> *The problem with analogies on the internet is people ignore the point you were making and start coming back with "Well, nvidia stock is better than Ferrari and almost at Toyota level, so you don't know what you're talking about". The 'ole pick something from their response that doesn't have to do with the topic and bash it to the ground to somehow make your argument valid.* 60% of the time, it works _everytime._


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *denman*
> 
> Read your post and then like three pages after it :/ Seems like everyone just wants to defend a $1200 card and not understand what you are saying. If all Nvidia cards were priced lower (hell, compariable to previous years same tier cards), then they would sell more, which would be more profits generated by moving greater volume.
> 
> The problem with analogies on the internet is people ignore the point you were making and start coming back with "Well, nvidia stock is better than Ferrari and almost at Toyota level, so you don't know what you're talking about". The 'ole pick something from their response that doesn't have to do with the topic and bash it to the ground to somehow make your argument valid. 60% of the time, it works _everytime._


Why would you produce more to get more when you can already get more when producing less. Economics has its quirks too.


----------



## Murlocke

Does it say anywhere when this is releasing? I don't really care about priceerformance ratio. I just know that my Titan X isn't handling 4K very well, and I don't want to go SLI nor go back to 1440p.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> So where are all the people saying "I was living in a dreamland" and we wouldn't see another high-end gpu from Nvidia until next year? Come eat your Crow.


Everyone is still right about an HBM product not being available for quite a while.

It is actually not surprising they release a downclocked, cut-down, GDDR5X version of GP100.

But the surprise comes that likely no one would have expected a "Titan" branded GDDR5X part 2-3 months after the GTX 1080 launch and release.


----------



## boredgunner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Does it say anywhere when this is releasing? I don't really care about priceerformance ratio. I just know that my Titan X isn't handling 4K very well, and I don't want to go SLI nor go back to 1440p.


August 2.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boredgunner*
> 
> August 2.


Great, will be picking one up. Now to debate if I should buy a 6700k now or wait for the 7700k. My 3770k is still a champ in most games.

At this price range, doubting they sell off the shelves like the 1080.


----------



## SoloCamo

The people here saying others are salty or jealous and blasting the pricing because "they can't afford it" are beyond ignorant. Tons of people on this very thread could get one if they wanted on launch, myself included. However, after two Titan models and seeing history repeat itself, some of us are a bit wiser than to rush and pay 1k, let alone 1.2k for a card that will outclassed in less than a year by something likely half it's price. Especially now that this isn't even really a chip worthy of the Titan name as far as specs go - let alone looking at how the OG titan is performing these days.

It's like some people literally just don't care about the market going further out of control each year. New tech is supposed to replace old tech at similar prices or reasonable price increases (if justified with enough of a performance advantage over the competion - $600gpu vs $500 for example). Yet many here see advances as technology as synonymous with faster = more expensive because it's faster. This is not how a market like this, or for that matter any market works.


----------



## bigjdubb

Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> you cant mean that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HBM2 is just 3 letters and a number, end performance is the most important thing, at 160% you would be drooling over it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> true 160% would be pretty strong.
> 
> the new Titan X is 25-35% faster than GTX 1080. Even with HBM2 it would only be 30-38% faster.
> 
> A 160% faster new Titan X with GDDR5X over a GTX 1080 definitively sounds better than a 30-38% faster Titan X with HBM2.
> 
> But the reality is that the card is not 60% faster than a GTX 1080.
> 
> People have to decide for themselves, but I genuinely think that the card is way overprice, even for Nvidias standards.
> 
> 1200$ for a cut card that is probably "just" 25-35% faster than a GTX 1080.
> 
> It doesn't sound right. If you have more brass than brains go for it, but if you need to take a credit/loan that money from someone I know I wouldn't do it. Turning settings a tad higher is not worth it to pay 1200$ for a product that might be bettered pretty fast.
> 
> But the card is going to sell well and sell out in the US like all Nvidia cards do.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Why are people so obsessed about HBM2? It doesn't matter if it's HBM2 or GDDR5 or running mice on steroids. What ends up mattering is the performance and features, It's not like the damn cards are upgradeable and by having GDDR5X you're gonna bottleneck a future GPU chip, so yeah you have to think of better memory for the long run. This ain't the case. Would you buy the card if it used quantum computing but yielded 10% of the performance?


My reasoning is that at this price point you expect the best of the best. Lots of us were expecting the 1080 series of cards to have HMB2, when it was leaked/announced that they would have GDDR5x most of us thought "well the titan/X80ti will have HBM2". Now the titan is being announced with GDDR5x, and yes, I am disappointed. I will not buy a Titan/x80ti without HBM2, it SHOULD have HBM2 on board and the price would allow for it.


----------



## CasualCat

snip


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> The people here saying others are salty or jealous and blasting the pricing because "they can't afford it" are beyond ignorant. Tons of people on this very thread could get one if they wanted on launch, myself included. However, after two Titan models and seeing history repeat itself, some of us are a bit wiser than to rush and pay 1k, let alone 1.2k for a card that will outclassed in less than a year by something likely half it's price. Especially now that this isn't even really a chip worthy of the Titan name as far as specs go - let alone looking at how the OG titan is performing these days.
> 
> It's like some people literally just don't care about the market going further out of control each year. New tech is supposed to replace old tech at similar prices or reasonable price increases (if justified with enough of a performance advantage over the competion - $600gpu vs $500 for example). Yet many here see advances as technology as synonymous with faster = more expensive because it's faster. This is not how a market like this, or for that matter any market works.


Agreed.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> Everyone is still right about an HBM product not being available for quite a while.
> 
> It is actually not surprising they release a downclocked, cut-down, GDDR5X version of GP100.
> 
> But the surprise comes that likely no one would have expected a "Titan" branded GDDR5X part 2-3 months after the GTX 1080 launch and release.


GDDR5X is fine. HBM2 is still in the trial stages. FuryX could only pull off 4gb which is a problem and will continue to be a problem on upcoming demanding games in higher resolutions. Nvidia wants to give the Titan 12gb. I don't think we are quite there giving a gpu 12gb of HBM2 without the price being through the roof. Nvidia took the safe road and went with something that has stood the test of time GDDR5X. I'm cool with that. 90% of the people in here complaining weren't buying the Titan even if it came with HBM2. You guys just have something new to complain about. Carry on.


----------



## Insan1tyOne

Man, this sucks. I want the _best_ GPU I can get my hands on to replace the R9 295x2 in my mITX rig, and I would be willing to pay $1200 for a GPU this powerful that only takes up 2-slots, but only if they release a "Titan X Hybrid" edition or anything else besides the stock jet-engine cooler.

I am just torn though, this new Titan X is a cut-down GP102 and it doesn't have HBM2, but how much longer will we have to wait to see the "big GP100 w/HMB2" if it even does exist? I have already been waiting 1 year+ for the "next big thing" to release and this new Titan X just doesn't seem to be it...

Sigh, what is a man to do these days when waiting to buy the strongest single-GPU on the market?

- Insan1tyOne


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> GDDR5X is fine. HBM2 is still in the trial stages. FuryX could only pull off 4gb which is a problem and will continue to be a problem on upcoming demanding games in higher resolutions. Nvidia wants to give the Titan 12gb. I don't think we are quite there giving a gpu 12gb of HBM2 without the price being through the roof. Nvidia took the safe road and went with something that has stood the test of time GDDR5X. I'm cool with that.


The problem is, they are still holding out on a better card. HBM2 does not have 3GB stacks, so it will have to be an 8GB or 16GB card. They can't release a 6 or 9GB(impossible, actually) cut-down version of this card. With the Titan branding, you're supposed to get the best. I assume that stopped when they took the compute features off of the original Titan X.

Mind you, I am not arguing that the safe road was the wrong choice - but at this price, they could have done better. It's low volume, anyway.

This card is without a doubt a 1080 Ti, which is fine if you are willing to accept it.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> The problem is, they are still holding out on a better card. HBM2 does not have 3GB stacks, so it will have to be an 8GB or 16GB card. They can't release a 6 or 9GB(impossible, actually) cut-down version of this card. With the Titan branding, you're supposed to get the best. I assume that stopped when they took the compute features off of the original Titan X.
> 
> Mind you, I am not arguing that the safe road was the wrong choice - *but at this price, they could have done better*. It's low volume, anyway.


Blame Amd. They continue to drag their feet. I've been saying it for years. As soon as they got heavily involved with the Console market they would lose touch with the PC gaming market. Nvidia is just wiping the floor with them and its getting embarrassing.


----------



## Ghoxt

If this had HBM2 and higher performance I'm almost sure many on the fence would go for it. After NVidia's own Spring announcements at GDC or another conference I cant remember, they touted the 5 advances of their new architecture's spectrum.

So to sit here and get this new reveal without some of the the afformentioned technologies is a letdown as it would have shot GPU's cpability through the roof.

*NVlink* - I wanted the best SLI GPU-GPU communications scaling Nvidia could offer. Instead Nvidia caved and has it only for Scientific class of cards.

*GP102* - Is this card Cut? It certainly looks like it...We need more facts on this one.

*Tri/Quad* SLI effectively killed.

*Async?* Ha!

Am I the only one that thinks that without the high end competition, Everything seems Limited and stop-gap about this Titan-XP release compared to technologies they already have in house. They released only what they had to. For 20% more lol.









Quote:
Originally Posted by *rcfc89* 


> 90% of the people in here complaining weren't buying the Titan even if it came with HBM2. You guys just have something new to complain about. Carry on.
> 
> with 2 Titan-X SLI, I must be the 10%. Without HBM2 with the 20% bump in price, no deal.


----------



## sugarhell

Oh well i will rant a bit.

This card is for us the ultra high hardware enthusiast. Still it is a big insult towards us.

Why nvidia couldnt announce this card with 1080 as 1080ti?
Why they released it 3 months after 1080 when all the people believed that the 1080 is the flagship for the next months?
Still they cant deal with the stock issues with 1080/1070/1060 (like AMD) but they will release a super high end gpu? Good luck getting one
Why do they use the same name?
And why this gpu use the titan name?

I think it's a big insult again from nvidia. They did it with the whole OG titan -> 780 -> 780ti -> titan black and they will do it again and again.

I understand why they did it. This way they could set the msrp of the 1080 so high let the fans believe that this is the flagship then release the 1080ti using the name titan-x and increase the prices of a gpu that should be 700 bucks like the previous 980ti. Still the screw up all the people that bought the 1080 because they couldnt wait until 2017 for the next titan.

Well whatever the OG Titan was a good movement actually it offered features that couldnt get with the Geforce . Now the titan name is a joke and it is only a way to increase the prices.

The only gpu that can be a titan for me is a gp100 with dp and hbm2. Nothing else. I would buy this


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Blame Amd. They continue to drag their feet. I've been saying it for years. As soon as they got heavily involved with the Console market they would lose touch with the PC gaming market. Nvidia is just wiping the floor with them and its getting embarrassing.


AMD has had troubles, but the issues go much deeper than that. I can guarantee you that every high performance semiconductor product is having major yield issues with these new processes. These prices are also to accomodate yield loss on the fabrication end and initial new process costs. If you should blame anyone, the foundry is more to blame for the prices.


----------



## Mhill2029

Anyone that thought the GTX 1080 was flagship is not the smartest person in the world.


----------



## jprovido

I'm still buying it I don't care. I don't have to defend my purchase to anyone. I WANT MOARRR CORE ERR FPS. I'll just give my 1080 to my brother like always


----------



## sugarhell

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Anyone that thought the GTX 1080 was flagship was a 24carat tit.


You know how marketing works. People even "upgraded" from 780ti to a 980.


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> The people here saying others are salty or jealous and blasting the pricing because "they can't afford it" are beyond ignorant. Tons of people on this very thread could get one if they wanted on launch, myself included. However, after two Titan models and seeing history repeat itself, some of us are a bit wiser than to rush and pay 1k, let alone 1.2k for a card that will outclassed in less than a year by something likely half it's price. Especially now that this isn't even really a chip worthy of the Titan name as far as specs go - let alone looking at how the OG titan is performing these days.
> 
> It's like some people literally just don't care about the market going further out of control each year. New tech is supposed to replace old tech at similar prices or reasonable price increases (if justified with enough of a performance advantage over the competion - $600gpu vs $500 for example). Yet many here see advances as technology as synonymous with faster = more expensive because it's faster. This is not how a market like this, or for that matter any market works.


There is also a difference between saying you don't like the price/value and deriding others who want to or are willing to pay that price. They don't owe you or anyone else in this thread or every other Titan thread where this whole discussion always comes up anything. If you don't like it don't buy it and get that performance in a year or two for reduced price.


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> There is also a difference between saying you don't like the price/value and deriding others who want to or are willing to pay that price. They don't owe you or anyone else in this thread or every other Titan thread where this whole discussion always comes up anything. If you don't like it don't buy it and get that performance in a year or two for reduced price.


That would be a fair argument IF this card didn't effect the entire market's pricing. But it does.


----------



## Ghoxt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> The only gpu that can be a titan for me is a gp100 with dp and hbm2. Nothing else. I would buy this


That's the one I would want to spend some coin on, however with the current trend, there would be several iterations of cards between what we have now 1070/1080/Titan XP and that card. And the price would be $2000 US. Those in CAD and AUS would feint from extra price hike.


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> That would be a fair argument IF this card didn't effect the entire market's pricing. But it does.


I dont hate anyone who buys this card, but this is the reality. Their purchases effect the entire market. Top tier from now on ( at least on the green side) will be above $1000).


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> That would be a fair argument IF this card didn't effect the entire market's pricing. But it does.


The mainstream cards GTX X60, Radeon X80 (including the 480 for which reviewers have been singing its p/p praises) are still in the same ballpark they have been for years. So no I don't believe it affects the entire market. Even if it did they still owe you nothing. If it is too expensive the market will correct like it did with the Titan Z. I suspect Nvidia is still feeling out what the market will bear.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Oh I have no doubt it will be sold out everywhere on launch day, thus prompting further price increases until the price ceiling is finally reached at some point (the point at which even 95% of the rick enthusiasts find the price distasteful).
> 
> As for the $15 MacDee burger, that would just be business suicide, because nobody would pay for that overpriced, diabetes inducing, liver destroying, blood vessel clogging garbage lol.


But, see... "business suicide". I think people would've said that about a $1200 consumer GPU in 2010. "Nobody would buy that." Maybe NVIDIA understands the market more than we do. That's all I'm suggesting.

And...then...would we be "upset" at McDonalds that they even dared to offer the $15 burger? Would people be saying, "Wow, see. You could get a good burger from McDonalds for $4 back in the day. Don't buy the $15 burger; you'll only encourage McDonalds!!!111oneone"


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> I dont hate anyone who buys this card, but this is the reality. Their purchases effect the entire market. Top tier from now on ( at least on the green side) will be above $1000).


Until Monday.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> There is also a difference between saying you don't like the price/value and deriding others who want to or are willing to pay that price. They don't owe you or anyone else in this thread or every other Titan thread where this whole discussion always comes up anything. If you don't like it don't buy it and get that performance in a year or two for reduced price.


It's not about being owed anything. It's about the issues with the market and trying to be a wise consumer. You can spend your money however you want, which is your right. But he, and anyone else who thinks there are price issues also have the right to protest price hikes. When the Titan XP goes out of stock because it is likely to be low volume, and the only ones available go up on fleabay for $2000 we'll see if people are still inclined to believe no one should protest if they don't want to buy. "Gotta pay to play" is only valid when you can actually buy one.

I mean, look at the prices on ebay when you can get cheaper GTX 1080's on newegg. Something is clearly wrong, but you are inclined to pay that price if you wish.


----------



## Firann

Pricing aside what I would love for Nvidia to do is streamline their series structure more and better clarify the position.

For example taking the 10XX series of cards, and assuming that each model in the series is 30% faster than its small brother in the series, I would do the following:

1050, 1060, 1070, 1080, Titan. 1060 is 30% faster than 1050, 1070 30% faster than 1060, 1080 30% faster than 1070.

Now this is the new "architecture". Now assuming a year letter they refine the architecture, then we would get the TI models, which would be 30% faster than their replacing card, i.e a 1050ti would be equivalent in power to a 1060.

So the TI series would be:

1050ti, 1060ti, 1070ti, 1080ti, Titan X.

Lets overlap the series with a potential 11XX series:

Prices as follows: 250, 350, 500, 700, 1000 (if we assume titan is 1000 and doing a 30% cut per each step)

1050...1060.......1070........1080......Titan
..........1050ti....1060ti......1070ti...1080ti......Titan X
.......................1150........1160.....1170........1180......Titan 11

Much more clear and we know what to expect unless the new architecture (i.e. 11XX) is so much better that isnt only 30% faster than previous gen Ti.

[edit] added potential prices


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> It's not about being owed anything. It's about the issues with the market and trying to be a wise consumer. You can spend your money however you want, which is your right. But he, and anyone else who thinks there are price issues also have the right to protest price hikes. When the Titan XP goes out of stock because it is likely to be low volume, and the only ones available go up on fleabay for $2000 we'll see if people are still inclined to believe no one should protest if they don't want to buy. "Gotta pay to play" is only valid when you can actually buy one.
> 
> I mean, look at the prices on ebay when you can get cheaper GTX 1080's on newegg. Something is clearly wrong, but you are inclined to pay that price if you wish.


I'm not even buying this card, but I get tired of the "omg you guys are terrible and ruining the market" attitude like the inability to have the halo product of an enthusiast hobby is like kicking a puppy. I think the price is high, so I won't buy it... If you don't like the price, then don't buy it. If enough people feel the same way Nvidia will adjust accordingly, but you or I don't get to decide value for others.


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> I'm not even buying this card, but I get tired of the "omg you guys are terrible and ruining the market" attitude like the inability to have the halo product of an enthusiast hobby is like kicking a puppy. I think the price is high, so I won't buy it... If you don't like the price, then don't buy it. If enough people feel the same way Nvidia will adjust accordingly, but you or I don't get to decide value for others.


Unfortunately in a monopoly (which is what we have here because AMD is no competitor) that's not exactly how it works. Price elasticity changes to almost 0 when you have a monopoly for a product.

Basically no matter how much the price changes demand will stay the same, because we HAVE NO OTHER CHOICE. In the High end market there is no other choice and you can tell by the price changes over the last 3 generations of cards. I have 3 systems in my room alone. I can AFFORD a 1080, 1070, and a Titan, but I won't dare give them a penny at this point. They're doing exactly what a monopoly does and raising prices to increase profits to the maximum potential. It is awful for a consumer.

For the love of God Samsung or IBM buy AMD already. Consumers are getting REAMED!


----------



## Omicron

I'm not saying the Titan shouldn't exist (as there actually was a legitimate purpose originally, beyond milking customers,) but this card seems pointless. The Titan's original draw was the unnerfed double precision compute on it (and this carried over to the Titan Black as well.) Titan X totally derped this trend as GM200 (to my knowledge) didn't have a lot of double precision units, and really was nothing more than a glorified 980 (what it should have been called.) Ideally, the lineup should be:


GTX 1040 - $125 - Nerfed or Full GP106
GTX 1050 - $175 - Full GP106, or Nerfed GP104
GTX 1060 - $250 - Full GP104
GTX 1070 - $350 - Nerfed GP100, GDDR5X
GTX 1080 - $550 - Full GP100, GDDR5X or HBM2
GTX Titan - $850 - Full GP100, HBM2, Full Half and Double Precision Compute, 2 x Memory of GTX1080
From there, you'd also have variations of the Quadro with the top end having similar specs to the GTX Titan (possibly 4 x Memory of GTX 1080,) with ECC memory support with the parity chip, and the "special drivers." The Tesla would also be similar, except no video output and slightly cheaper than the Quadro.

This was their trend for the longest time honestly, except the Titan didn't exist. The Titan makes sense honestly, but only if it is the un-ecc version of the Quadro/Tesla with similar memory amount, and unnerfed compute functions. Oh, and cap it at $1000 at the most.

Look, a Titan should *not* be trying to sneak up into the Quadro price territory. $1,200 is not $4,000 yet, but just you wait... if I spent that much, I'd buy a frigging Quadro.


----------



## sugarhell

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> I'm not even buying this card, but I get tired of the "omg you guys are terrible and ruining the market" attitude like the inability to have the halo product of an enthusiast hobby is like kicking a puppy. I think the price is high, so I won't buy it... If you don't like the price, then don't buy it. If enough people feel the same way Nvidia will adjust accordingly, but you or I don't get to decide value for others.


But this is not a halo product.

It is a gpu that should be a 1080ti with the proper price.

I wouldnt even care about a halo product at 1200 bucks but this is nvidia using the name scheme just to increase the prices.

This card shouldnt be a titan. What is the difference of this card vs a geforce one? Why they even call it a titan?


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> I'm not even buying this card, but I get tired of the "omg you guys are terrible and ruining the market" attitude like the inability to have the halo product of an enthusiast hobby is like kicking a puppy. I think the price is high, so I won't buy it... If you don't like the price, then don't buy it. If enough people feel the same way Nvidia will adjust accordingly, but you or I don't get to decide value for others.
> 
> 
> 
> But this is not a halo product.
> 
> It is a gpu that should be a 1080ti with the proper price.
> 
> I wouldnt even care about a halo product at 1200 bucks but this is nvidia using the name scheme just to increase the prices.
> 
> This card shouldnt be a titan. What is the difference of this card vs a geforce one? Why they even call it a titan?
Click to expand...

This card is not marketed to gamers, or even your average enthusiast. If gamers or overclockers buy it, that's their problem. I would say, it's kind of obvious they didn't make a big show out of this at a press event, rather, showing up at an AI user group at a university.


----------



## rx7racer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> But this is not a halo product.
> 
> It is a gpu that should be a 1080ti with the proper price.
> 
> I wouldnt even care about a halo product at 1200 bucks but this is nvidia using the name scheme just to increase the prices.
> 
> This card shouldnt be a titan. What is the difference of this card vs a geforce one? Why they even call it a titan?


A Halo product is anything a company wants it to be. This is NV's pinnacle card in teh market, at this price it is a Halo product, NV giving it the Titan name backs that up.

Remember, it's all about what people are willing to pay and the past few years has showed NV they can price almost to the moon and guess what, people are still willing to pay.

I mean who can blame NV for what they are doing, I can't, they'd be stupid not to do what they are doing.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> Love how people blame AMD. Like getting angry with the police and not the criminal who stabbed you in the gut.
> 
> Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check, but Nvidia are the ones who raise the prices. Aim your anger at them.


Nvidia has the market to themselves and can charge whatever they want.

watch from 31:12





From the man himself:

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jen Hsun Huang*
> *The economics of building anything ultimately comes down to the amount of competition you have. You don't set the price the competition sets the price. The market doesn't set the price the competition does.*


----------



## sugarhell

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rx7racer*
> 
> A Halo product is anything a company wants it to be. This is NV's pinnacle card in teh market, at this price it is a Halo product, NV giving it the Titan name backs that up.
> 
> Remember, it's all about what people are willing to pay and the past few years has showed NV they can price almost to the moon and guess what, people are still willing to pay.
> 
> I mean who can blame NV for what they are doing, I can't, they'd be stupid not to do what they are doing.


Corporates can do what they want.

I am thinking by my perspective. If they want to make more money they can do it. It doesnt mean that i like it. And we are talking about people's money here.

They can do it but i will never support it. At least OG titan gave you back something different vs the other geforce products. Now it is just a premium name for a regular gpu.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> So where are all the people saying "I was living in a dreamland" and we wouldn't see another high-end gpu from Nvidia until next year? Come eat your Crow.


there's only one slight problem. you said it's gonna be a $750 1080Ti.

anyways, seems like we have a group of people on OCN who think they are somehow in position to judge those who buy pricey GPUs just because they picked up some cheap ass 290s off miner's rigs back in 2014 and have been afraid to drop a penny on a card ever since, making their reputation points on OCN solely by repeating populistic slogans.

remember, more miners' 290s = more knowledge.


----------



## guttheslayer

Actually if you guys try to OCed a Maxwell TX to 1513MHz (Which can be achieved rarely easily), you have the same TX except pascal only have 512 more cores or just 16.7%. Maybe if you do a test between them its probably ~10-15% delta performance.

So much for charging 1.2K when TX now is probably worth <$500


----------



## SoloCamo

I'm just glad that 1080's are going to be hitting the used market for hopefully decent pricing. Really can't justify upgrading to anything less coming from a 290x. Still have to tell myself to wait for Vega though just to see...


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> there's only one slight problem. you said it's gonna be a $750 1080Ti.


I have a bigger problem for you.

Titan X is the new 1080 Ti, and there wont be a 1080 Ti unless AMD pull out smth.

The Ti didnt exist because Nvidia just want to release them (I mentioned this many time)


----------



## kingduqc

TIme to replace my 980ti and but that baby under water? It's not like a better gpu is going to be released in 3 months right...

I wish Nvidia would just tell us about those things before. I have no clue if Im getting ****ed buying their gpu because a better one is right around the corner..


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> I'm just glad that 1080's are going to be hitting the used market for hopefully decent pricing. Really can't justify upgrading to anything less coming from a 290x. Still have to tell myself to wait for Vega though just to see...


TX being 25% percent faster for 100% the price will force 1080 price to drop further?

That is like saying 6900K will drop in price becz the 6950K is selling for 75% more lol.


----------



## i7monkey




----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Anyone that thought the GTX 1080 was flagship is not the smartest person in the world.


What about the people that have built a system on the premise that they expected to have the best for at least 6 months?

What's more titish, that or buying a 1,200 dollar GPU in the first place.

Hate the game...


----------



## zGunBLADEz

I call it when the first OG TITAN got released.. People went crazy "goo goo da dada" for it. and look where we standing at..


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> TX being 25% percent faster for 100% the price will force 1080 price to drop further?
> 
> That is like saying 6900K will drop in price becz the 6950K is selling for 75% more lol.


Well just to clarify, there will be a larger amount of 1080's on the used market which should *hopefully* bring the used market to more reasonable pricing. Hopefully.


----------



## Seyumi

Um Evga Jacob just confirmed this card is NVIDIA STORE EXCUSIVE ONLY on the announcement thread in EVGA. There goes any overclocking, custom PCBs or cooling solutions right out the box. This is NOT cool. My entire computer was built around a 2x SLI AIO setup. Now I need a bigger case & ATX motherboard to allow some breathing room. No thx on custom water cooling


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> The Ti didnt exist because Nvidia just want to release them (I mentioned this many time)


I'm not following you on this site so pardon my ignorance.


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> The price isn't surprising when you consider the people buying one of these will probably be pairing it up with a $ 1,700 CPU, $ 600 PSU, $ 600 motherboard, $ 600 case, etc.


I'd consider a GP102 Titan X, assuming there isn't another single GPU card of near enough performance out by the time I'm ready to buy, and I would never spend anywhere near $600 dollars on any single socket motherboard, any non-redundant PSU, or any case.

Typically, when I buy a top tier card, it's half the budget of my entire build.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> so if its not hbm2.....current TX waterblocks will fit maybe?


I wouldn't count on it, but I'd definitely like to see some images of the PCB.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> People generally don't do that. If they are building a system up and want the best, they will purchase the best they can afford that is available to them at that time. Outside of these bubbles, people don't do that type of thing. There is always something better not that far off, that is simply how the industry works and has always been - just this time it's incredibly soon after lol.


I'll wait a month or so if a release is imminent, but beyond that I don't fuss over timing overly much, and buy what I need to get the performance I need when I need it.

I want to move back to a single GPU setup, but I've ruled out the 1080 and everything below it because the most demanding game I currently play works well with CFX and my 290Xes more or less match a single 1080. More VRAM would be nice, but I'm not going to spend 600-700 dollars so I can run higher texture quality.

Unless there is a 1080Ti on the horizon the Pascal Titan X may be the only card that may fill all my check boxes in the immediate future...just need to decide if it's worth what they're asking.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> There are plenty of people who skipped the 780 non-Ti and 980 non-Ti knowing that they were not the big Kepler/Maxwell cards.


GTX 780 is big Kepler. Same GK110 GPU as in the 780 Ti and original Titan.

The 680 was the GK104 part.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CynicalUnicorn*
> 
> [*] The name. It has already been used. This would be like saying every series is the 700 series or whatever.


Intel did the same thing with the Pentium. They needed a catchy name for their fith generation x86 part and Pentium fit the bill. They then used it for the next four generations of high end consumer parts, and still use it for lower end parts. Pentium implies five/fifth, but we have the name attached to 11th generation CPUs because of brand recognition.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> People even "upgraded" from 780ti to a 980.


Well, the 980 is faster in quite a few areas and by the time the 980 was released 4GiB of VRAM was tangibly better than 3GiB, all other things being equal.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> I wouldnt even care about a halo product at 1200 bucks but this is nvidia using the name scheme just to increase the prices.


Yes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> What about the people that have built a system on the premise that they expected to have the best for at least 6 months?


I find this to be a silly premise.

You have the performance you have, no matter how it compares to the best. If that performance is not enough, then one should have waited, if it is enough, then something better showing up is not of great concern.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> What about the people that have built a system on the premise that they expected to have the best for at least 6 months?


those people only payed $700+ instead of $1200 for a ~30% increase

they got a good deal


----------



## SoloCamo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> a Bugatti Veyron/Chiron ? nope
> 
> a McLaren P1 or a Koenigsegg - yup


This may be a first, at least in recent threads, but I agree.


----------



## sugarhell

It's easy to explain it because i understand what silent scone wants to say.

You have up to 1200 bucks budget for a gpu.

Nvidia releases the A product with price 700 bucks . None expects a bigger gpu at least for 6 months. It seems like a good deal. You buy it

Nvidia after 3 months releases a product that cost 1200 bucks that you could buy if you have waited because you could afford to wait. Now instead you have a gpu that will have a lower price on the used market because of the halo product.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> a Bugatti Veyron/Chiron ? nope
> 
> a McLaren P1 or a Koenigsegg - yup


This guy gets it!


----------



## CasualCat

:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> This guy gets it!


Bugattis are ugly


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> It's easy to explain it because i understand what silent scone wants to say.
> 
> You have up to 1200 bucks budget for a gpu.
> 
> Nvidia releases the A product with price 700 bucks . None expects a bigger gpu at least for 6 months. It seems like a good deal. You buy it
> 
> Nvidia after 3 months releases a product that cost 1200 bucks that you could buy if you have waited because you could afford to wait. Now instead you have a gpu that will have a lower price on the used market because of the halo product.


Doubt a $1200 TX will lower the price on used 1080's.


----------



## Baasha

CAN THIS DO 4-WAY SLI IN GAMES?!??!


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Doubt a $1200 TX will lower the price on used 1080's.


That is the point I am emphasizing alot. lol.

SLI 1080 is an extremely good deal when TX is just 25% faster yet cost the same as a pair


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Doubt a $1200 TX will lower the price on used 1080's.


I guess they're thinking there will be more used 1080's on the market than you'd normally have at this point. Guess it depends though how many people go from a 1080->TitanX$

edit: I suspect it'll be a really small number of an already small market.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> That is the point I am emphasizing alot. lol.
> 
> SLI 1080 is an extremely good deal when TX is just 25% faster yet cost the same as a pair


But SLI is a nightmare at times, very rarely gets close to 100% scaling, sometimes doesn't work at all, etc.

If someone sat there and had 2 1080s in one hand, and the new titan in the other, I'd choose the titan everytime. Nothing beats the "smoothness" and stability of a single GPU.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> I guess they're thinking there will be more used 1080's on the market than you'd normally have at this point. Guess it depends though how many people go from a 1080->TitanX$
> 
> edit: I suspect it'll be a really small number of an already small market.


Probably so. A very small percentage of folks will sell their 1080's for the TX. I could sell my 1080 FTW but I have a feeling that Nvidia will release a Ti and or another TItan early next year. Be a lot easier to sell the 1080 than a TX.


----------



## ILoveHighDPI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> I'm not even buying this card, but I get tired of the "omg you guys are terrible and ruining the market" attitude like the inability to have the halo product of an enthusiast hobby is like kicking a puppy. I think the price is high, so I won't buy it... If you don't like the price, then don't buy it. If enough people feel the same way Nvidia will adjust accordingly, but you or I don't get to decide value for others.
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunately in a monopoly (which is what we have here because AMD is no competitor) that's not exactly how it works. Price elasticity changes to almost 0 when you have a monopoly for a product.
> 
> Basically no matter how much the price changes demand will stay the same, because we HAVE NO OTHER CHOICE. In the High end market there is no other choice and you can tell by the price changes over the last 3 generations of cards. I have 3 systems in my room alone. I can AFFORD a 1080, 1070, and a Titan, but I won't dare give them a penny at this point. They're doing exactly what a monopoly does and raising prices to increase profits to the maximum potential. It is awful for a consumer.
> 
> For the love of God Samsung or IBM buy AMD already. Consumers are getting REAMED!
Click to expand...

The worst part is with all the price gouging on "Founders Edition" etc. stuff, the price to performance ratio basically hasn't changed, it's all just in line with the 970 now.

The 1080 costs twice as much, and usually performs twice as well.
The 1070 costs 50% more, and usually performs 50% better.
If you bought a 970 for more than MSRP then these will be very slight upgrades, but until the cards drop to MSRP they're basically not an upgrade in performance per dollar. Anyone with a 970 has utterly no reason to buy anything new, unless they just have money to burn.

I'm most eagerly waiting to see the AMD 470 launch, if it really does cost $150 and it really is within 15% of the performance of the 480, that's basically in line with what you would have got if the 1070 were $300.


----------



## GraveDigger7878

As with every launch, apparently everyone is a marketing expert trying to tell Nvidia why they are wrong or dumb or otherwise unpleasant to their perspective buyers


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Omicron*
> 
> This was their trend for the longest time honestly, except the Titan didn't exist. The Titan makes sense honestly, but only if it is the un-ecc version of the Quadro/Tesla with similar memory amount, and unnerfed compute functions. Oh, and cap it at $1000 at the most.
> 
> Look, a Titan should *not* be trying to sneak up into the Quadro price territory. $1,200 is not $4,000 yet, but just you wait... if I spent that much, I'd buy a frigging Quadro.


You say that but in reality, you're not going to just buy a Quadro unless you need one. You either need Quadro features or you don't. No one in their right mind would spend $4000 and buy a quadro just because it's oh just "a little" more expensive than a titan. $1200 is easily still out of range of a $4000 quadro.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> I'd consider a GP102 Titan X, assuming there isn't another single GPU card of near enough performance out by the time I'm ready to buy, and I would never spend anywhere near $600 dollars on any single socket motherboard, any non-redundant PSU, or any case.
> 
> Typically, when I buy a top tier card, it's half the budget of my entire build.
> I wouldn't count on it, but I'd definitely like to see some images of the PCB.
> I'll wait a month or so if a release is imminent, but beyond that I don't fuss over timing overly much, and buy what I need to get the performance I need when I need it.
> 
> I want to move back to a single GPU setup, but I've ruled out the 1080 and everything below it because the most demanding game I currently play works well with CFX and my 290Xes more or less match a single 1080. More VRAM would be nice, but I'm not going to spend 600-700 dollars so I can run higher texture quality.
> 
> Unless there is a 1080Ti on the horizon the Pascal Titan X may be the only card that may fill all my check boxes in the immediate future...just need to decide if it's worth what they're asking.
> GTX 780 is big Kepler. Same GK110 GPU as in the 780 Ti and original Titan.
> 
> The 680 was the GK104 part.
> Intel did the same thing with the Pentium. They needed a catchy name for their fith generation x86 part and Pentium fit the bill. They then used it for the next four generations of high end consumer parts, and still use it for lower end parts. Pentium implies five/fifth, but we have the name attached to 11th generation CPUs because of brand recognition.
> Well, the 980 is faster in quite a few areas and by the time the 980 was released 4GiB of VRAM was tangibly better than 3GiB, all other things being equal.
> Yes.
> I find this to be a silly premise.
> 
> You have the performance you have, no matter how it compares to the best. If that performance is not enough, then one should have waited, if it is enough, then something better showing up is not of great concern.


Not silly at all. People don't wait, you've said this in the same post I'm quoting lol.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> But SLI is a nightmare at times, very rarely gets close to 100% scaling, sometimes doesn't work at all, etc.
> 
> If someone sat there and had 2 1080s in one hand, and the new titan in the other, I'd choose the titan everytime. Nothing beats the "smoothness" and stability of a single GPU.


They need to redefine this damn SLI tech from the ground up IMO. It should work transparently to the system. There must be a way the system detects the paired GPUs as a single one, having a higher bandwidth communication between GPUs. PCI 3.0 bandwidth isn't saturated I think so a single 16X slot should be able to drive two damn cards. I dunno, I haven't had SLI in the past because all the trouble it seems to be, I always end up upgrading to a newer card instead of finding a cheap one to make a pair.


----------



## mouacyk

"You poor Stanford students..." on OCN


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> Not silly at all. People don't wait, you've said this in the same post I'm quoting lol.


I said I don't wait if I need and if what I need is available.

If I need something that isn't available, I _must_ wait. I didn't seriously consider getting a GTX 1080 because it would not have filled my need for a decisive single card upgrade.

If I don't need, I am free to wait until I do. If I had a Pascal Titan, it would fill my needs, and a better GPU showing up five minutes later would do nothing to change that.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CasualCat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SoloCamo*
> 
> That would be a fair argument IF this card didn't effect the entire market's pricing. But it does.
> 
> 
> 
> The mainstream cards GTX X60, Radeon X80 (including the 480 for which reviewers have been singing its p/p praises) are still in the same ballpark they have been for years. So no I don't believe it affects the entire market. Even if it did they still owe you nothing. If it is too expensive the market will correct like it did with the Titan Z. I suspect Nvidia is still feeling out what the market .will bear.
Click to expand...

you don't seem to realize the bait and switch nvida has done. though the naming scheme/pricing is the same for the cards, the chip in the X60 to X80 cards are of a lesser tier. what cards would have a GX 100/110 chips now have GX104 (that use to be in the GTX X60 cards) and the GTX X60 cards now have GX106 chips.

this is why it's advantageous for those that "know" to inform those that don't not make a bad purchase.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> there's only one slight problem. you said it's gonna be a $750 1080Ti.
> 
> anyways, seems like we have a group of people on OCN who think they are somehow in position to judge those who buy pricey GPUs just because they picked up some cheap ass 290s off miner's rigs back in 2014 and have been afraid to drop a penny on a card ever since, making their reputation points on OCN solely by repeating populistic slogans.
> 
> remember, more miners' 290s = more knowledge.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> I have a bigger problem for you.
> 
> Titan X is the new 1080 Ti, and there wont be a 1080 Ti unless AMD pull out smth.
> 
> The Ti didnt exist because Nvidia just want to release them (I mentioned this many time)


Lol you guys never give up. Just admit you were dead wrong. I argued that we would see a Titan in the next month. Most argued that I was way off and wrong. I never said we would see a Ti before the Titan. I said we would see a Ti before the end of the year and that I hope it would be $750-800. It still very well could be. But now like anyone in denial you have now shifted your argument to that again a 1080Ti will never exist. Just give up already. We still have 1080Ti coming which will offer aftermarket PCB's and lastly we'll have something similar to Titan Black which will be full Pascal with 16xhbm and likely cost over $1500.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Lol you guys never give up. Just admit you were dead wrong. I argued that we would see a Titan in the next month. Most argued that I was way off and wrong. I never said we would see a Ti before the Titan. I said we would see a Ti before the end of the year and that I hope it would be $750-800. It still very well could be. But now like anyone in denial you have now shifted your argument to that again a 1080Ti will never exist. Just give up already. We still have 1080Ti coming which will offer aftermarket PCB's and lastly we'll have something similar to Titan Black which will be full Pascal with 16xhbm and likely cost over $1500.


An 1080Ti makes sense, there's a very wide gap between 1080 and Titan X. As why they released the Titan X first... I think some guys are mentioning AMD is releasing something on Monday, so nVidia has released their TOPMOST model first, then AMD will release their product at certain price and then nVidia can counter with a same-price Ti with better performance (hopefully) and still have the TX as King. If they released the Ti first, AMD would then counter with price, and nVidia couldn't really counter with the TX because it would be higher priced.


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> But SLI is a nightmare at times, very rarely gets close to 100% scaling, sometimes doesn't work at all, etc.
> 
> If someone sat there and had 2 1080s in one hand, and the new titan in the other, I'd choose the titan everytime. Nothing beats the "smoothness" and stability of a single GPU.


+1 I don't need 2 gpus, i have 1 pci-e slot x16


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> An 1080Ti makes sense, there's a very wide gap between 1080 and Titan X. As why they released the Titan X first... I think some guys are mentioning AMD is releasing something on Monday, so nVidia has released their TOPMOST model first, then AMD will release their product at certain price and then nVidia can counter with a same-price Ti with better performance (hopefully) and still have the TX as King. If they released the Ti first, AMD would then counter with price, and nVidia couldn't really counter with the TX because it would be higher priced.


Titan always comes out before the Ti. Seeing that this is not full blown gp100 basically gives us a reliable road map of whats to come. TitanXP-1080Ti-Big Pascal. I expect both the new Titan and the Big Titan to be limited to Nvidia's design. 1080Ti will be the only one offering aftermarket designs. The 1080Ti in a Lightning design will be the one I'll be waiting for in a pair obviously. I have zero issues with SLI and haven't for many years.


----------



## NikolayNeykov

The next card to be released is Titan X Ultra and the next will be 1080 ti.
It is too obvious and simple. There will be no HBM2 since Pascal is just inbetween generation, made because of monopoly.
Expect that HBM2 in the next one


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Lol you guys never give up. Just admit you were dead wrong. I argued that we would see a Titan in the next month. Most argued that I was way off and wrong. I never said we would see a Ti before the Titan. I said we would see a Ti before the end of the year and that I hope it would be $750-800. It still very well could be. But now like anyone in denial you have now shifted your argument to that again a 1080Ti will never exist. Just give up already. We still have 1080Ti coming which will offer aftermarket PCB's and lastly we'll have something similar to Titan Black which will be full Pascal with 16xhbm and likely cost over $1500.


are you Parker Lewis ?


----------



## mouacyk

The doom vulkan patch must have pre-empted this launch before Pascal loses its edge and appeal completely. Time Spy is buying NVIDIA some time now but how long can that last?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> The doom vulkan patch must have pre-empted this launch before Pascal loses its edge and appeal completely. Time Spy is buying NVIDIA some time now but how long can that last?


yes Doom Vulkan, singlehandedely, will be the end of nvidia

definitely


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> I said I don't wait if I need and if what I need is available.
> 
> If I need something that isn't available, I _must_ wait. I didn't seriously consider getting a GTX 1080 because it would not have filled my need for a decisive single card upgrade.
> 
> If I don't need, I am free to wait until I do. If I had a Pascal Titan, it would fill my needs, and a better GPU showing up five minutes later would do nothing to change that.


I understood what you meant. Some people "feel" they always need the best even though what they have is sufficient.


----------



## DADDYDC650

A 1080 can run BF1, DooM and the new COD at 4K. I'll be waiting for dat Ti tho...


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> the new COD


eewww


----------



## boredgunner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> A 1080 can run BF1


It only averaged 50 FPS in that gamegpu.ru benchmark though, dropping to the 40s as well. Not ideal and also both BF1 and Doom run better than practically every other mainstream game within the last 3 years. The GTX 1080 will still struggle in most games at 4k.

Can't wait to see 4k results with this card, not that I'm buying it.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> yes Doom Vulkan, singlehandedely, will be the end of nvidia
> 
> definitely


What you fail to understand is that DX12 and Vulkan will force developers to optimize games. The arch with more to give will now receive more performance by way of its IHV code path. DX11 was yesterday and it didn't allow the amount of hardware exploitation possible with the new 3D apis. Accept it. Pascal is not an investment for tomorrow. NVIDIA is clearing stock before they become irrelevant.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> The doom vulkan patch must have pre-empted this launch before Pascal loses its edge and appeal completely. Time Spy is buying NVIDIA some time now but how long can that last?


lol Jen Hsun said he snagged that Titan from the production line. Must've seen the Vulkan DOOM.


----------



## bfedorov11

I wonder how it will hold up against a 2200mhz 1080. I'm betting a golden card on water will top out at 1800mhz. I can't see a chip that dense hitting 2100 with ambient cooling considering how the 1080 acts. I'm calling 20% faster than 1080, max oc vs max oc.

I had 2 TX and I'm passing on this one. 1080 is gets the job done.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> What you fail to understand is that DX12 and Vulkan will force developers to optimize games. The arch with more to give will now receive more performance by way of its IHV code path. DX11 was yesterday and it didn't allow the amount of hardware exploitation possible with the new 3D apis. Accept it. Pascal is not an investment for tomorrow. NVIDIA is clearing stock before they become irrelevant.


DX12 is the future, but we will not see a majority of DX12 games that cripple Nvidia performance for a few years yet.

Either way, $1200 for a gpu seems a little nuts. Let's hope Vega is a home run.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boredgunner*
> 
> It only averaged 50 FPS in that gamegpu.ru benchmark though, dropping to the 40s as well. Not ideal and also both BF1 and Doom run better than practically every other mainstream game within the last 3 years. The GTX 1080 will still struggle in most games at 4k.
> 
> Can't wait to see 4k results with this card, not that I'm buying it.


40fps with AA maxed out? Performance will be improved in the final version.


----------



## boredgunner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> 40fps with AA maxed out? Performance will be improved in the final version.


True but will it improve to the point where it doesn't go below 60 FPS on a GTX 1080? Not to mention for games like that so many of us demand 100+ FPS.


----------



## ChevChelios

if you read the 1060 vs 480 tests - only *2* games where 1060 definitely loses to 480 by a notable margin - Doom Vulkan and Hitman DX12

other DX12 games 480 either only slightly wins or its equal, and it RotR DX12 it loses by 15%+

so I wouldnt worry about Pascals DX12 future too much

in fact if more DX12 games like RotR it can even kick GCNs ass from time to time


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Monday's event is Polaris based FirePro.
> 
> http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/siggraph-webcast-2016jul13.aspx


Hopefully it is a bigger Polaris card though, and then we can have some better guesses at performance of the top consumer GPUs from them. But in reality, it will probably just end up a 2x 480 chip in single card FirePro.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boredgunner*
> 
> True but will it improve to the point where it doesn't go below 60 FPS on a GTX 1080? Not to mention for games like that so many of us demand 100+ FPS.


Well those that demand 100fps at 4K best be ready to spend $2400.


----------



## fallenmazuko

Can't wait to get one!


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> What you fail to understand is that DX12 and Vulkan will force developers to optimize games. The arch with more to give will now receive more performance by way of its IHV code path. DX11 was yesterday and it didn't allow the amount of hardware exploitation possible with the new 3D apis. Accept it. Pascal is not an investment for tomorrow. NVIDIA is clearing stock before they become irrelevant.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bfedorov11*
> 
> I wonder how it will hold up against a 2200mhz 1080. I'm betting a golden card on water will top out at 1800mhz. I can't see a chip that dense hitting 2100 with ambient cooling considering how the 1080 acts. I'm calling 20% faster than 1080, max oc vs max oc.
> 
> I had 2 TX and I'm passing on this one. 1080 is gets the job done.


Looks like the comedians are out in full force today.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fallenmazuko*
> 
> Can't wait to get one!


You mean you can't wait for Nvidia to get YOU!


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> You mean you can't wait for Nvidia to get YOU!


Coming from someone who dropped 7 bills on baby Pascal. Ohh the irony.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> if you read the 1060 vs 480 tests - only *2* games where 1060 definitely loses to 480 by a notable margin - Doom Vulkan and Hitman DX12
> 
> other DX12 games 480 either only slightly wins or its equal, and it RotR DX12 it loses by 15%+
> 
> so I wouldnt worry about Pascals DX12 future too much
> 
> in fact if more DX12 games like RotR it can even kick GCNs ass from time to time


We aren't exactly discussing a $250 1060 here. That's clearly an easy throw-away. Not so much though with a $1200 GPU that seems aged and incredibly salvaged - no hbm1/2 and lack luster async compute. In the analogy of cars, luxury cars retain their value for much of their lifetime.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Coming from someone who dropped 7 bills on baby Pascal. Ohh the irony.


$620 after using gift cards and Ebates. Plus I didn't spend$1200.


----------



## boredgunner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Well those that demand 100fps at 4K best be ready to spend $2400.


And I'm sure they are ready, lol. Not counting the price of that ASUS 4k 144 Hz monitor coming out.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boredgunner*
> 
> And I'm sure they are ready, lol. Not counting the price of that ASUS 4k 144 Hz monitor coming out.


I thought I was spending way too much on my rig.... That's just insane!


----------



## jincuteguy

New Titan X but with GDDR5 memory? comon...where is the HBM2 memory from all of the rumors????


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Most everyone in here is complaining on how much this card costs, while anyone into machine learning is salivating right now at this card. Some people have different priorities in how they use their GPUs you know....


----------



## Ramzinho

Nvidia pricing is getting out of control imo. like although Intel dominates the market they are keeping their prices within consumer's grasp. like intel adds 10-30$ a year for each cpu except of course the -E lineup which are epeen dedicated. but nvidia throwing 100$ to 150$ raise on each gpu every generation is just absurd. of course they provide great products and performance but the pricing is just plain abusive to consumers.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boredgunner*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Well those that demand 100fps at 4K best be ready to spend $2400.
> 
> 
> 
> And I'm sure they are ready, lol. Not counting the price of that ASUS 4k 144 Hz monitor coming out.
Click to expand...

I certainly am ready to get above 60 fps on 4k on max settings.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ramzinho*
> 
> Nvidia pricing is getting out of control imo. like although Intel dominates the market they are keeping their prices within consumer's grasp. like intel adds 10-30$ a year for each cpu except of course the -E lineup which are epeen dedicated. but nvidia throwing 100$ to 150$ raise on each gpu every generation is just absurd. of course they provide great products and performance but the pricing is just plain abusive to consumers.


What are you talking about? The GTX 1070 is like a GTX 980 only for $300.


----------



## sugarhell

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Most everyone in here is complaining on how much this card costs, while anyone into machine learning is salivating right now at this card. Some people have different priorities in how they use their GPUs you know....


If it had dp too i would be all over it


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ramzinho*
> 
> Nvidia pricing is getting out of control imo. like although Intel dominates the market they are keeping their prices within consumer's grasp. like intel adds 10-30$ a year for each cpu except of course the -E lineup which are epeen dedicated. but nvidia throwing 100$ to 150$ raise on each gpu every generation is just absurd. of course they provide great products and performance but the pricing is just plain abusive to consumers.


While i agree that prices are pretty obscene, you made an invalid comparison.

Intel releases a new CPU with around 5-10% perf increase in *gaming scenarios*, and they apply a $10-30 cost increase.
Nvidia releases the 1070, with around 5-10% perf increase (in relation to 980ti) in *gaming scenarios*, and they apply a cost DEcrease.


----------



## ENTERPRISE

Wow a terrible name. Why would you use an existing product name for a different product...odd.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> While i agree that prices are pretty obscene, you made an invalid comparison.
> 
> Intel releases a new CPU with around 5-10% perf increase in *gaming scenarios*, and they apply a $10-30 cost increase.
> Nvidia releases the 1070, with around 5-10% perf increase (in relation to 980ti) in *gaming scenarios*, and they apply a cost DEcrease.


That's only because AMD is still breathing, imagine what would happen if they went away *shrugs".

These prices are absolutely disgusting, 312mm2 die sizes used to cost less than 250$ not 1200$.

FinFet is a bit more expensive to fabricate than what GF104 was, but 30% more expensive not 500%.

I'm up for everyone burning their money if hey so desire, but don't come here crying when the Titans reach 5000$ 5 generations down the line because you couldn't keep it reasonable, and instead decided to enable these prices. (Not taking about you especifically)


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Noway in hell am i buying this, not that i dont want extra performance but enabling nvidia to act like tards is not my cup of tea.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Most everyone in here is complaining on how much this card costs, while anyone into machine learning is salivating right now at this card. Some people have different priorities in how they use their GPUs you know....


I would agree with you, it is being marketed in one of the original posts by Andrew Ng's comments, the Baidu/Google Brain guy.

Though, I think for training in DNN/CNN, we've used Titans before in research. I'm not sure about buying this, though.

Might be persuaded to just get the full GP100 with HBM2.

So, in a lot of cases, Titans are not _just_ gaming cards. People love CUDA and the library support is pretty great.


----------



## Ramzinho

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> While i agree that prices are pretty obscene, you made an invalid comparison.
> 
> Intel releases a new CPU with around 5-10% perf increase in *gaming scenarios*, and they apply a $10-30 cost increase.
> Nvidia releases the 1070, with around 5-10% perf increase (in relation to 980ti) in *gaming scenarios*, and they apply a cost DEcrease.


you are absolutely right but that's because of the advance in the tech. like i mean relatively to models the 1080 is more expensive than the 980 iirc. right? the 1070 is more expensive than the 970. if i recall 970 msrp was 299 while the 1070 msrp is 439$ which is what? 46% in price, of course the performance is doubled. but relative to the previous model the price is absurd.

they can do much better in pricing. just the lack of competition is giving them the power to price as much as they want, they can adjust the naming scheme too. in the end the users who buy the products empower the companies. Nvidia has a huge user and fan base that i feel they are abusing and they can just readjust pricing a little bit to even gain more crowd.

One last thing, Intel actually controls pricing across world wide sales. like a CPU in egypt is at max like 5% more than it's price in USD if i bought it with local currency. while Any other component is really left to the sellers to tear us apart with pricing. a 1080 in egypt is literally 1150$ USD


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> These prices are absolutely disgusting, 312mm2 die sizes used to cost less than 250$ not 1200$.


Although I agree with your point, this is hyperbole. They are selling the 300 mm^2 die for 600-700$, not 1200$. They used to sell the 500+ mm^2 die for 700-800$ (and brand it a x80) and now its 1200$ with the Titan brand.


----------



## Ramzinho

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> I would agree with you, it is being marketed in one of the original posts by Andrew Ng's comments, the Baidu/Google Brain guy.
> 
> Though, I think for training in DNN/CNN, we've used Titans before in research. I'm not sure about buying this, though.
> 
> Might be persuaded to just get the full GP100 with HBM2.
> 
> So, in a lot of cases, Titans are not _just_ gaming cards. People love CUDA and the library support is pretty great.


i 100% agree that if this card is directed towards productivity it's decent priced. but for games. man this is too much money


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Coming from someone who dropped 7 bills on baby Pascal. Ohh the irony.


Fanboys fighting fanboys... this is madness!


----------



## sugarhell

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Fanboys fighting fanboys... this is madness!


Nvidia fanboys are fighting people with 1080. THIS is madness


----------



## Eorzean

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Fanboys fighting fanboys... this is entertaining!


FTFY.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Fanboys fighting fanboys... this is madness!


I wouldn't consider myself a fanboy. I actually own high-end gear and speak on actual real life experience. The fanboys on here are the guys with a $500 computer spouting nonsense about equipment they can't afford and have zero experience with. Although anyone who can do a "google search" over the internet is considered an expert by today's standards.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Fanboys fighting fanboys... this is madness!


United they stand. Divided, they...

1. Sell their cards to get said new shiny cards
2. Used market gets flooded
3. ???
4. PROFIT

Sounds good to me.

cant count..


----------



## GraveDigger7878

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> Noway in hell am i buying this, not that i dont want extra performance but enabling nvidia to act like tards is not my cup of tea.


Come on now. Nvidia doesn't owe us anything. Why are so many people posting like it is some type of deep personal insult that the price is higher.
Like we deserve a lower price like some irrational consumer entitlement. I guess I don't understand.
Do I want a Pascal Titan: yes
Can I afford it: no
Do I flame nvidia because of it: no


----------



## Bauxno

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraveDigger7878*
> 
> Come on now. Nvidia doesn't owe us anything. Why are so many people posting like it is some type of deep personal insult that the price is higher.
> Like we deserve a lower price like some irrational consumer entitlement. I guess I don't understand.
> Do I want a Pascal Titan: yes
> Can I afford it: no
> Do I flame nvidia because of it: no


If this card was like $600-700 would you buy it?


----------



## GraveDigger7878

If it was $600 I could then afford it and yes probably buy it.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraveDigger7878*
> 
> Come on now. Nvidia doesn't owe us anything. Why are so many people posting like it is some type of deep personal insult that the price is higher.
> Like we deserve a lower price like some irrational consumer entitlement. I guess I don't understand.
> Do I want a Pascal Titan: yes
> Can I afford it: no
> Do I flame nvidia because of it: no


Nvidia is a corporation. They are It is driven by profits, and it is not a person, although a corporation is practically defined as one.

It does them well to owe their customers something. It is different when the entitlement is between individuals, and an individual with a corporation.

How would a company keep a loyal customer base if it owed its own customers nothing?


----------



## Omicron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> You say that but in reality, you're not going to just buy a Quadro unless you need one. You either need Quadro features or you don't. No one in their right mind would spend $4000 and buy a quadro just because it's oh just "a little" more expensive than a titan. $1200 is easily still out of range of a $4000 quadro.


But the trend is headed that direction. That's the issue. Perhaps a slippery slope, but watch as they eventually nudge it to half the Quadro cost? Quadros are only so expensive to begin with because Nvidia has corporate customers that find the price reasonable. The ratio between "gaming card" and Quadro is just getting a bit too narrow for my tastes.


----------



## GraveDigger7878

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> Nvidia is a corporation. They are It is driven by profits, and it is not a person, although a corporation is practically defined as one.
> 
> It does them well to owe their customers something. It is different when the entitlement is between individuals, and an individual with a corporation.
> 
> How would a company keep a loyal customer base if it owed its own customers nothing?


I agree, it would do them well to cater to the people who most purchase their stuff.
If they don't want to it does me no good it stomp my feet about it, or more appropriately rant and rage on OCN about it.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> My god. Why are there so many salty people in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not like all those people complaining would have picked up a Titan even if it were only $1000, comes with HBM2, and is a full fat version.


I know this post is a while back, but if the Titan XP was the full fat 3840 shader version with HBM2 at $999, it would actually be "understandable" and not a bad proposition because you'd basically be set for 2 years before even having to think about upgrading.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> lol you mean people who use the term price gouging in relation to a GPU ? don't even pay attention to them. They need that Titan X to feed them and take care of their offspring but can't afford to because nvidia is merciless.


Maybe it's just the US, but you'd be surprised how many people have their priorities completely jumbled up.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Great, will be picking one up. Now to debate if I should buy a 6700k now or wait for the 7700k. My 3770k is still a champ in most games.
> 
> At this price range, doubting they sell off the shelves like the 1080.


People said the same about Titan X, remember how that one sold?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> But, see... "business suicide". I think people would've said that about a $1200 consumer GPU in 2010. "Nobody would buy that." Maybe NVIDIA understands the market more than we do. That's all I'm suggesting.
> 
> And...then...would we be "upset" at McDonalds that they even dared to offer the $15 burger? Would people be saying, "Wow, see. You could get a good burger from McDonalds for $4 back in the day. Don't buy the $15 burger; you'll only encourage McDonalds!!!111oneone"


But there's no market for a $15 burger is there? Or at least, I can't see it being profitable.

I mean, $15 burgers at a fancy posh restaurant is one thing, $15 burgers at McDonalds is a whole other story.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> Unfortunately in a monopoly (which is what we have here because AMD is no competitor) that's not exactly how it works. Price elasticity changes to almost 0 when you have a monopoly for a product.
> 
> Basically no matter how much the price changes demand will stay the same, because we HAVE NO OTHER CHOICE. In the High end market there is no other choice and you can tell by the price changes over the last 3 generations of cards. I have 3 systems in my room alone. I can AFFORD a 1080, 1070, and a Titan, but I won't dare give them a penny at this point. They're doing exactly what a monopoly does and raising prices to increase profits to the maximum potential. It is awful for a consumer.
> 
> For the love of God Samsung or IBM buy AMD already. Consumers are getting REAMED!


It seems GPUs have become Veblen goods these days.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> I wouldn't consider myself a fanboy. I actually own high-end gear and speak on actual real life experience. The fanboys on here are the guys with a $500 computer spouting nonsense about equipment they can't afford and have zero experience with. Although anyone who can do a "google search" over the internet is considered an expert by today's standards.


There's a difference between not being able to afford something, and not buying something because to that person the price is stupid. I really don't think there are that many OCN members who actually, literally, can't afford a $1200 GPU.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraveDigger7878*
> 
> I agree, it would do them well to cater to the people who most purchase their stuff.
> If they don't want to it does me no good it stomp my feet about it, or more appropriately rant and rage on OCN about it.


Well, I would agree with you if it was just about a person-to-person situation. But, I would think that NV has people who either read or are involved in the community, and if we complain, they will change their ways because we are their potential customers.

Its actually our duty to complain and call foul when we don't like something about a corporation, because it holds them to a higher standard.

Which, they must reach if they want to please shareholders.









Now, needlessly fanboying is another story...


----------



## Murlocke

So what the heck is the official name of this card. "Titan X The Ultimate", "Titan X Pascal"?

There's no way there are calling it Titan X, that'd be so confusing.


----------



## GraveDigger7878

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> So what the heck is the official name of this card. "Titan X The Ultimate", "Titan X Pascal"?
> 
> There's no way there are calling it Titan X, that'd be so confusing.


It looks like JHH showed a retail box just calling it Titan X at that AI thing


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> So what the heck is the official name of this card. "Titan X The Ultimate", "Titan X Pascal"?
> 
> There's no way there are calling it Titan X, that'd be so confusing.


Everything they've shown so far is simply just "Titan X."


----------



## Murlocke

That's... crazy.

How on earth are people going to know who is talking about which card.


----------



## CallsignVega

I vote for Titan-XP and be done with it.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> That's... crazy.
> 
> How on earth are people going to know who is talking about which card.


People? Those that buy this card most likely know what they are getting.


----------



## orlfman

nvidia must be uneasy about amd with vega, which amd stated will be utilizing hbm2, to push out the titan so soon. they forwent hbm2 and instead using the cheaper gddr5x. release it now to soak in the profits from those who want the fastest card now with no competition.

yields must be low though to be nvidia exclusive. either that or they REALLY want to soak in the profits.

all that's missing is a "ti" variant. they're probably reserving that for the holiday season.

if the new titan is $1,200, i feel like the ti will probably be in the $700 - $800 range. keeping the 1080 in its current $600 price range.


----------



## CaliLife17

It also Dropped the Geforce and GTX monikor as well. So it just Nvidia Titan X.


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> While i agree that prices are pretty obscene, you made an invalid comparison.
> 
> Intel releases a new CPU with around 5-10% perf increase in *gaming scenarios*, and they apply a $10-30 cost increase.
> Nvidia releases the 10*8*0, with around 5-10% perf increase (in relation to 980ti) in *gaming scenarios*.


Please man, don't make such mistakes... You can only complare 1080 to 980 ti


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Titan X would have been a lot more compelling if it came out right after GTX 980 launch and not 7 months after.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orlfman*
> 
> nvidia must be uneasy about amd with vega, which amd stated will be utilizing hbm2, to push out the titan so soon. they forwent hbm2 and instead using the cheaper gddr5x. release it now to soak in the profits from those who want the fastest card now with no competition.
> 
> yields must be low though to be nvidia exclusive. either that or they REALLY want to soak in the profits.


Hate to say it, but I am starting to wonder if HBM2 can be delivered cost effectively for AMD this year.

We may see only a GDDR5X fight considering NV have decided to adopt it for such a high end part.


----------



## Sprkd1

To everyone confused by the name:

Maxwell: NVIDIA GeForce GTX TITAN X
Pascal: NVIDIA TITAN X

That's the difference.


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liranan*
> 
> Fools and their money.


Like to enjoy their money and don't care about those who write about them?


----------



## bucdan

MSRP: $1200

street price after 2 weeks: $1600

Then if there is a gp100 with HBM 2, MSRP: $1600

Street price: $2000

lol.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> Hate to say it, but I am starting to wonder if HBM2 can be delivered cost effectively for AMD this year.
> 
> We may see only a GDDR5X fight considering NV have decided to adopt it for such a high end part.


It's probably more important that NVidia not combine HBM with an aging arch. They are saving HBM2 for Volta which should be way more robust for longevity. I would jump at that for 1500. A GPU to endure 5 years!


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> It's probably more important that NVidia not combine HBM with an aging arch. They are saving HBM2 for Volta which should be way more robust for longevity. I would jump at that for 1500. A GPU to endure 5 years!


Finaly someone with common sence, ofc HBM2 is for next generation, as i said Pascal is inbetween generation, which doesn't need that, since there is monopoly.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> It's probably more important that NVidia not combine HBM with an aging arch. They are saving HBM2 for Volta which should be way more robust for longevity. I would jump at that for 1500. A GPU to endure 5 years!


That is probably at least some of the truth of the matter. I would say, though, that the probability of killing a good die with HBM is pretty high - if you have a great yielding part you can kill it at the interposer process. If you already have low yields, which I think it is common knowledge that FF is especially lower yielding at higher density and clocks, I'm sure they saw no reason to potentially kill good die with the increase in performance and improved thermal envelope.

I played around with a GTX 1080 for a week or so and GDDR5X was fast enough to give me 75 FPS in Doom @ 4K, so I was happy. The TXP (new moniker?) will do well.

Might need to pick up an +100Hz 4K display when they are available.

thenIsoldthe1080becauseIgotboredwithit


----------



## Benny89

WOW!! Already?? August?

Guess we have a chance for 1080Ti before 2017 if things will go like that. 1080, 1070, 1060 is here, TITAN X basicelly in next two weeks.

Gimme that 1080Ti already










But really, there must be something going on if TITAN X is already here.


----------



## Ha-Nocri

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benny89*
> 
> WOW!! Already?? August?
> 
> Guess we have a chance for 1080Ti before 2017 if things will go like that. 1080, 1070, 1060 is here, TITAN X basicelly in next two weeks.
> 
> Gimme that 1080Ti already
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *But really, there must be something going on if TITAN X is already here*.


Maybe Vega is closer than we think, so they can't afford to milk ppl with midrange chip in 1070/80 for long. Or maybe they will get the Titan out now to milk ppl until Vega is released, when they will introduce 1080ti.


----------



## Shatun-Bear

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> It's probably more important that NVidia not combine HBM with an aging arch. They are saving HBM2 for Volta which should be way more robust for longevity. I would jump at that for 1500. A GPU to endure 5 years!


Wouldn't last 5 years. After 2.5 years it'll be run of the mill. After 4 years it will be slow. And by 5 years, graphics cards built around single powerful GPUs will be things of the past as cards with multiple, smaller GPUs working as one will offer the top performance.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> Wouldn't last 5 years. After 2.5 years it'll be run of the mill. After 4 years it will be slow. And by 5 years, graphics cards built around single powerful GPUs will be things of the past as cards with multiple, smaller GPUs working as one will offer the top performance.


Well, with the way semiconductors are going, the best optimizations we will see will probably be software driven to take more advantage of the hardware we have. I mean, we just got off of the 28nm train just this year.. we have been riding it for a while because we thought we would move to 20nm. We only just cheated 20nm planar by using 20nm FinFET (which is what 16 and 14nm really are, just re-measured).

I think with the hope for 4K and VR driven consoles, we might be able to see a greater longevity from even our current architectures with these new processes. Don't trust the slides when they say 10nm is on the way... they said the same thing about 20nm many years ago and it never came.

But it is true, multi-, low-latency, interconnected GPUs are the future for PC and consoles alike. We should no longer be concerned with SLI/CFX because we won't need the technologies anymore.

Yay for perfect scaling.


----------



## Noufel

So can we expect reviews of the Titan XP in the next two weeks ?


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noufel*
> 
> So can we expect reviews of the Titan XP in the next two weeks ?


Calling Firestrike at 31,250.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noufel*
> 
> So can we expect reviews of the Titan XP in the next two weeks ?


It would be nice if we could see some benchmarks run by the students that got free ones at Stanford..

Unfortunately, they are probably too busy being enslaved to their research advisors to play any games.

There's really not any good precedent for when the benchmarks will release at this point. If it launches on the 2nd, what you say might be true.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> It would be nice if we could see some benchmarks run by the students that got free ones at Stanford..
> 
> Unfortunately, they are probably too busy being enslaved to their research advisors to play any games.
> 
> There's really not any good precedent for when the benchmarks will release at this point. If it launches on the 2nd, what you say might be true.


Not sure I want to see gaming benchmarks ran on 2.39GHz 20-core Xeon.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> So what the heck is the official name of this card. "Titan X The Ultimate", "Titan X Pascal"?
> 
> There's no way there are calling it Titan X, that'd be so confusing.


http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal

I say call it Titan XP as others have said. You get to level up with fanboy experience points in real life!


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal
> 
> I say call it Titan XP as others have said. You get to level up with fanboy experience points in real life!


careful now, you're going to offend some fanboy customer.

one a side note:
i wonder if NV just didn't start having resupply issues with the 1080 . . .


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ha-Nocri*
> 
> Maybe Vega is closer than we think, so they can't afford to milk ppl with midrange chip in 1070/80 for long. Or maybe they will get the Titan out now to milk ppl until Vega is released, when they will introduce 1080ti.


So all we need is Amd to release a Vega card that is between 1080 and Titan XP in performance with 9gb HBM2 for $800. I'd be game if it didn't have a hideous AIO cooler. Problem is AMD will either release something that's on par with a 1080 or it will take too long and I'll end up buying something else. Typical Amd.


----------



## Sean W.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> Calling Firestrike at 31,250.


I bet higher than that, at least P score.

My sli 980s hit 29,000


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sean W.*
> 
> I bet higher than that, at least P score.
> 
> My sli 980s hit 29,000


Clocks are not that great.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> one a side note:
> i wonder if NV just didn't start having resupply issues with the 1080 . . .


Well isn't that convenient?


----------



## Sean W.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> Clocks are not that great.
> Well isn't that convenient?


I bet P firestrike score will be over 35,000


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sean W.*
> 
> I bet P firestrike score will be over 35,000


This is good. You're thinking 1.5x top Titan X score (1650/2020)? TXP only has 16% more shaders on top of shrink for most significant changes.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Titan X1.2


----------



## iLeakStuff

Firestrike should be around 27-28000

Think this card will perform like Titan X/980Ti in SLI


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> That's... crazy.
> 
> How on earth are people going to know who is talking about which card.


They saw all the car analogies people are always using and decided to go with car nomenclature so now you need a model year. "Introducing the all new 2016 Titan X."







Maybe we'll get a commercial with a Sam Elliot voice over.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> But there's no market for a $15 burger is there? Or at least, I can't see it being profitable.
> 
> I mean, $15 burgers at a fancy posh restaurant is one thing, $15 burgers at McDonalds is a whole other story.
> It seems GPUs have become Veblen goods these days.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's a difference between not being able to afford something, and not buying something because to that person the price is stupid. I really don't think there are that many OCN members who actually, literally, can't afford a $1200 GPU.


Err, the example isn't perfect, haha, but that's what I'm thinking: _if_ McDonald's came out with a $10 burger a few years ago and it sold well, so this year they sold a $15 burger...I think that's reasonable.

You can do the same imagining when BMW rolls out their $150,000 cars. M3 owners are maybe a little antsy, haha.

They surely are Veblen goods. That's what happens when reviewers talk more about GPUs internal specifications and fabrication than they do about final performance and, my favorite metric, frames / $. It's like reading a Bentley review and the first 10 pages are about the quality of the metal used in the engine. Uh...what exactly are you selling me? Oh, right, _the brand_.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I vote for Titan-XP and be done with it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal
> 
> I say call it Titan XP as others have said. You get to level up with fanboy experience points in real life!


Yup. Titan XP is what I'm calling it now and I don't care if anybody compares it to Windows XP. Who would've thought? In 2016, 1080 and XP came back into high-end gaming vocabulary,


----------



## Silent Scone

This thread is heaving lol.


----------



## tpi2007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> So what the heck is the official name of this card. "Titan X The Ultimate", "Titan X Pascal"?
> 
> There's no way there are calling it Titan X, that'd be so confusing.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal
> 
> I say call it Titan XP as others have said. You get to level up with fanboy experience points in real life!
Click to expand...

I came up with the same idea, but then I thought, no, we should all be glad and thankful that they saved on the marketing department, otherwise the card would cost $1400.









Seriously now, Jen just saw what Intel is charging for their top of the line Broadwell-E 10 core CPU. Trust me, Nvidia will try to get there sooner or later. $1700 for a GPU. The next Titan X (after this and the other one) will probably cost $1400. Reason: HBM2 is expensive.


----------



## jincuteguy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bucdan*
> 
> MSRP: $1200
> 
> street price after 2 weeks: $1600
> 
> Then if there is a gp100 with HBM 2, MSRP: $1600
> 
> Street price: $2000
> 
> lol.


Why would the street price after 2 weeks be $1600? i thought it supposed to be lower since it came out? Why would the price gets higher?


----------



## Yttrium

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> Love how people blame AMD. Like getting angry with the police and not the criminal who stabbed you in the gut.
> 
> Yes AMD helps keep Nvidia pricing in check, but Nvidia are the ones who raise the prices. Aim your anger at them.
> 
> 
> 
> *Nvidia have no obligation to you to keep price acceptable, they have a obligation to increase value for their shareholders* hence they raise the price when lack of competition from AMD allows them to. You seem to misunderstand how a for-profit company works.
Click to expand...

Reminds me of some aids medicine that got its price raised by a mere 5000%. Free market only moves the money in a more unbalanced way to those who have aquired a monopoly. This is also why I like to root for the underdog as they, like AMD, have to price competitive and give technology away for free/better prices (like freesync) to stay in the game.

And red suits me better...

Source: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3246093/Drugs-boss-hiked-price-life-saving-AIDS-treatment-5-000-cent-tried-kidney-pills-vows-reduce-price-refuses-say-much.html


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> Why would the street price after 2 weeks be $1600? i thought it supposed to be lower since it came out? Why would the price gets higher?


Because unless you spend the entire day running scripts, refreshing sites, etc and getting the first stock within seconds... they will be bought up and resold at higher prices by....... jerks. Happens every GPU release, happening with the 1080 right now.

I don't think the Titan lineup is affected by it as much, simply due to the fact it's a huge initial investment to buy something for $1200 than resell it for $1400ish. That and the fact the cards won't fly off the shelves at that price.


----------



## Andeus

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> Why would the street price after 2 weeks be $1600? i thought it supposed to be lower since it came out? Why would the price gets higher?


He assumes that the card will have limited availability, at least not enough to meet demand. And, frankly, given how the launch of all the 10X0 cards have been up to now, he's probably right. After all the Titan should be harder to manufacture.

So, in a Free Market if product demand is higher than product availability, it's price goes up. That's how it works and it's kinda common sense.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> I came up with the same idea, but then I thought, no, we should all be glad and thankful that they saved on the marketing department, otherwise the card would cost $1400.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously now, Jen just saw what Intel is charging for their top of the line Broadwell-E 10 core CPU. Trust me, Nvidia will try to get there sooner or later. $1700 for a GPU. The next Titan X (after this and the other one) will probably cost $1400. Reason: HBM2 is expensive.


I think Titan VX will cost $1700.

Reasons:

1. 10nm is super expensive
2. HBM2 is expensive
3. Not enough leather jackets


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I think Titan VX will cost $1700.
> 
> Reasons:
> 
> 1. 10nm is super expensive
> 2. HBM2 is expensive
> 3. Not enough leather jackets


Mainly #3. He likes the good stuff.


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Mainly #3. He likes the good stuff.


Who wouldn't like in that position? lol
Cash flows from every direction







tables full of money.


----------



## The-Real-Link

Darn, thought I'd be ready to sell my Titan for a Titan but if this Titan is really just a slightly chopped down Tesla then that's too bad. But still if it's 45-60% gain on the old X, that's tempting. $1200 is a bit ouch, though...


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The-Real-Link*
> 
> Darn, thought I'd be ready to sell my Titan for a Titan but if this Titan is really just a slightly chopped down Tesla then that's too bad. But still if it's 45-60% gain on the old X, that's tempting. $1200 is a bit ouch, though...


If you don't mind me asking, what games and at what resolution are you playing to justify the purchase? Or is it other reasons?

I'm curious.


----------



## Shatun-Bear

Can someone explain to me how AMD's Vega is going to get anywhere near this? I don't expect that to be faster than a 1080 in some DX11 games let alone this beast.

I know Vega is a different arch and is meant to be on a different manufacturing process to Polaris, but Polaris shows in some ways that GCN 4 scaled up might not be very close to Pascal at all. So what is the thinking in how Vega gets anywhere near this?


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> Can someone explain to me how AMD's Vega is going to get anywhere near this? I don't expect that to be faster than a 1080 in some DX11 games let alone this beast.
> 
> I know Vega is a different arch and is meant to be on a different manufacturing process to Polaris, but Polaris shows in some ways that GCN 4 scaled up might not be very close to Pascal at all. So what is the thinking in how Vega gets anywhere near this?


That depends on Vega's die size really. If its a 450+ mm^2 chip it should land somewhere between the 1080 GTX and the new titan. Exactly where would depend on clocks.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Titan XP at 1K really does not make any sense considering GTX1080 FE @ $700. That would mean Titan XP has better P/P which should never be the case.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *clipse84*
> 
> time to get of my old titans x


I'd gladly take them from you


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> That depends on Vega's die size really. If its a 450+ mm^2 chip it should land somewhere between the 1080 GTX and the new titan. Exactly where would depend on clocks.


I think the more important thing will be how they scale rops, rbes and shaders at this point. Judging by memory overclocking on Polaris it seems faster memory will definitely help, and Vega will be entirely different due to arch tweaks, memory interface, and hopefully a different node.

A similar hardware spec'd part of GCN 1.4 in comparison to the 290X/390X would likely be around Fury X performance with slightly higher clocks ~ 1200mhz. If Vega 11 ends up being essentially 2xp10 in terms of shaders but with more rbes and rops (96 hopefully), it will definitely be somewhere in between the 1080 and new Titan X. Meanwhile a smaller Vega 10 will probably end up being in between the 1070 and 1080. If all goes well I'm expecting the AMD counterparts for the 1070, 1080, and Titan will all be around -5 to -10% performance in DX11, and end up surpassing them by the same amount in DX12/Vulkan titles. AMD simply doesn't have the budget or means to go for an entirely new architecture at this point; primarily budget and relying on GCN for consoles.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> Can someone explain to me how AMD's Vega is going to get anywhere near this? I don't expect that to be faster than a 1080 in some DX11 games let alone this beast.
> 
> I know Vega is a different arch and is meant to be on a different manufacturing process to Polaris, but Polaris shows in some ways that GCN 4 scaled up might not be very close to Pascal at all. So what is the thinking in how Vega gets anywhere near this?


If upcoming Vega only has 4096 stream processors as rumored, it would compete against 1080, not Titan.


----------



## Shatun-Bear

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> If upcoming Vega only has 4096 stream processors as rumored, it would compete against 1080, not Titan.


AMD are so incompetent with strategy that somehow their first Vega card will release and the Titan P and 1080 Ti, both faster, will be already available on the market.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> AMD are so incompetent with strategy that somehow their first Vega card will release and the Titan P and 1080 Ti, both faster, will be already available on the market.


Pretty sad really.









Or maybe Nvidia knows what's up and Vega is scary fast, so they had to get a Titan out asap.


----------



## stryker7314

Really wanted this beast, but nVidia made a mistake by cutting down the full core. Fool me once with the OG Titan nvidia. Now I will wait them out and get the 1080ti full core at 2/3 the price.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stryker7314*
> 
> Really wanted this beast, but nVidia made a mistake by cutting down the full core. Fool me once with the OG Titan nvidia. Now I will wait them out and get the 1080ti full core at 2/3 the price.


you think the 1080 Ti will have all 3840 cores when the 1200$ new Titan X doesn't?


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Pretty sad really.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or maybe Nvidia knows what's up and Vega is scary fast, so they had to get a Titan out asap.


I don't think it hardly matters how Vega performs when it doesn't come out until next year.


----------



## carlhil2

All of these financial advisors in here, some with $200 keyboards and $1000 water loops, etc., etc. lol


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Pretty sad really.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or maybe Nvidia knows what's up and _Vega is scary fast_, so they had to get a Titan out asap.


That may be true, and if so, it may also match the price.


----------



## stryker7314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> you think the 1080 Ti will have all 3840 cores when the 1200$ new Titan X doesn't?


http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-titan/specifications

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-780-ti/specifications

Let's just say I wouldn't put it past them.


----------



## Pyrotagonist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> you think the 1080 Ti will have all 3840 cores when the 1200$ new Titan X doesn't?


No. The 1080 Ti will have 3200 cores with 12GB vanilla GDDR5, priced at $750/$900. A few months after that, we'll get the Titan XXX Black with the full 3840 and 24GB GDDR5X for $1723. There will be a new cooler, but in reality it's just a rebranded OG Titan cooler with an engraving of JHH's signature. You'll get a complimentary faux leather jacket in the box (retail value $10). There will be no 780 Ti analog - only 780, Titan and Titan Black.


----------



## Celcius

Even though it doesn't have HBM2, this is the card that I've been waiting for. The jump from my GTX 780 Ti will be huge. Day one.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> you think the 1080 Ti will have all 3840 cores when the 1200$ new Titan X doesn't?


Why not? They did that with Kepler...

First Titan was cut down, then 780 Ti = full chip

Then at the same time they quietly refreshed the Titan with the Titan Black

It's a good strategy. People that absolutely need to have the best will double dip, and those who waited will think it's an amazing deal (I.e. faster than Titan X but only $900!!)


----------



## Randomdude

Hmm, on the site it says that this Titan has 12 API with feature level 12_1 support, it also runs Time Spy which is FL 12_0. Full DX12! Dat marketing.


----------



## emett

It went 680 - Titan - 780 - Titan Black -780ti


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> one a side note:
> i wonder if NV just didn't start having resupply issues with the 1080 . . .
> 
> 
> 
> Well isn't that convenient?
Click to expand...

you know since i replied to your reply, it is now confirmed; GP106 supply issues!.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> All of these financial advisors in here, some with $200 keyboards and $1000 water loops, etc., etc. lol


which ALL last longer than 6-18 months.


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> Can someone explain to me how AMD's Vega is going to get anywhere near this? I don't expect that to be faster than a 1080 in some DX11 games let alone this beast.
> 
> I know Vega is a different arch and is meant to be on a different manufacturing process to Polaris, but Polaris shows in some ways that GCN 4 scaled up might not be very close to Pascal at all. So what is the thinking in how Vega gets anywhere near this?


no where. Why would you design 2 very "different" arch within 6 months? Vega is nothing more than a enhance polaris manufactured in TSMC. it will probably have some higher clock speed that AMD couldnt get it from GF Fab. And I hope they wont come with the rumored 4096 cores, because that will only be completing against 1080.


----------



## Randomdude

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> It went 680 - Titan - 780 - Titan Black -780ti


So we can expect the Ti to release within a similar time frame as Titan > 780 > Titan Black > Ti? The node is here to stay I imagine.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Pretty sad really.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or maybe Nvidia knows what's up and Vega is scary fast, so they had to get a Titan out asap.


lol this is exactly what we said when the 980 Ti came out only 2 months after Titan X.

I'm not holding my breath or getting myself hyped for ANYTHING this time.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Lol you guys never give up. Just admit you were dead wrong. I argued that we would see a Titan in the next month. Most argued that I was way off and wrong. I never said we would see a Ti before the Titan. I said we would see a Ti before the end of the year and that I hope it would be $750-800. It still very well could be. But now like anyone in denial you have now shifted your argument to that again a 1080Ti will never exist. Just give up already. We still have 1080Ti coming which will offer aftermarket PCB's and lastly we'll have something similar to Titan Black which will be full Pascal with 16xhbm and likely cost over $1500.


First I was the one who argue believe that we will see the Titan as early as Q3.

Next, I believe there is no Ti becz the 1080 has 9 FLOP while the TX has 11 FLOP. How they going to slot it in?

2) The 1080 has 8GB and the TX has 12GB, so where you want to slot the 1080 Ti?
3) The new TX is already on G5X and is not even full blown, where you want to slot the 1080 Ti?

So no. Unless AMD comes out with smth that force Nvidia to rebrand the new Titan X, which is a very very fatal mistake. If not you wont see a Ti.

Compare the specs of 980 Ti vs 980 and you will realised *the new TX is the 1080 Ti*. 980 Ti uses same memory standard as 980, so is TX from 1080. 980 Ti have 50% more memory and 40% more shader than 980, so is TX to 1080.

Titan X is THE NEW 1080 TI.


----------



## Celcius

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> It went 680 - Titan - 780 - Titan Black -780ti


This isn't correct, the 780 Ti came out before the Titan black. I know because I bought my GTX 780 Ti on launch day lol.


----------



## Noufel

why nvidia didn't make a huge show for the Titan XP launch, it seems like a rushed announcement, i think that nvidia knows something about the VEGA arch and i hope that it will be at least faster than the 1080 ( the 1080 that disapointed me a little compared to the 980ti btw )


----------



## Randomdude

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> Can someone explain to me how AMD's Vega is going to get anywhere near this? I don't expect that to be faster than a 1080 in some DX11 games let alone this beast.
> 
> I know Vega is a different arch and is meant to be on a different manufacturing process to Polaris, but Polaris shows in some ways that GCN 4 scaled up might not be very close to Pascal at all. So what is the thinking in how Vega gets anywhere near this?


Well, assuming that Fury X had no bottlenecks anywhere, given its increased core count, it should've been roughly 45% faster than a 390x (4096/2816), however that difference in real world is more like 19-20% at 4K as per TPU charts


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






. If Vega removes said bottlenecks from the architecture, and has the same specs without any other changes, it would be 45% faster than a 390x, they are both running at the exact same frequencies - 1050 MHz on the core. So that's 145% 390x from removing architecture bottlenecks on the same clock speeds. Now, If they manage to improve the performance per clock by, say, 20% on top of that, and another 30% from additional clock speed increases coming from 16nm FINFET (although they state 65% if they went for clock speed alone), that would put a 4096 core Vega at roughly 227% of 390x's performance. That would put it at about 42% faster than a reference 1080 on 4k.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pyrotagonist*
> 
> No. The 1080 Ti will have 3200 cores with 12GB vanilla GDDR5, priced at $750/$900. A few months after that, we'll get the Titan XXX Black with the full 3840 and 24GB GDDR5X for $1723. There will be a new cooler, but in reality it's just a rebranded OG Titan cooler with an engraving of JHH's signature. You'll get a complimentary faux leather jacket in the box (retail value $10). There will be no 780 Ti analog - only 780, Titan and Titan Black.


1080 8GB GDDR5X and 1080 Ti only vanilla GDDR5? that doesn't sound right.


----------



## BillOhio

1080's are $1,000 Canadian and will be knocked off the throne before many stores up here even have them in stock. Screw GPUs. I'm not spending $1,000-$1500 on something that'll be considered out of date in under a year. For the money some of you guys are spending on cards that are current for months at a time you could be putting together audio systems that'd be awesome for Decades. I'm not saying that that's how you Should spend your disposable cash, I'm just saying that at these prices and with such quick turnarounds between gens, I'm losing interest in getting any of the high end cards. There seem to be better 'investments' even in a conversation about blowing money.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BillOhio*
> 
> 1080's are $1,000 Canadian and will be knocked off the throne before many stores up here even have them in stock. Screw GPUs. I'm not spending $1,000-$1500 on something that'll be considered out of date in under a year. For the money some of you guys are spending on cards that are current for months at a time you could be putting together audio systems that'd be awesome for Decades. I'm not saying that that's how you Should spend your disposable cash, I'm just saying that at these prices and with such quick turnarounds between gens, I'm losing interest in getting any of the high end cards. There seem to be better 'investments' even in a conversation about blowing money.


While I understand the thinking behind this it is embarrassing when I catch myself thinking this way. This is nothing but worrying about E-peen. Why does a better one coming out make your current one worthless?

Never buy any technology with the idea of "investment", if you do not need the performance now do not buy it now. Only if you need the performance now, and can afford it, should you buy it. If you wait three months there will be a better option available, always.

The rate of GPU releases is not speeding up, the turnaround between gens has been a similarly rapid upgrade cycle since I got my first Voodoo 1, with only small pauses once in a while.


----------



## kyrie74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> So all we need is Amd to release a Vega card that is between 1080 and Titan XP in performance with 9gb HBM2 for $800. I'd be game if it didn't have a hideous AIO cooler. Problem is AMD will either release something that's on par with a 1080 or it will take too long and I'll end up buying something else. Typical Amd.


HBM2 comes in 8GB configurations, 9GB would be impossible.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Randomdude*
> 
> Well, assuming that Fury X had no bottlenecks anywhere, given its increased core count, it should've been roughly 45% faster than a 390x (4096/2816), however that difference in real world is more like 19-20% at 4K as per TPU charts
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . If Vega removes said bottlenecks from the architecture, and has the same specs without any other changes, it would be 45% faster than a 390x, they are both running at the exact same frequencies - 1050 MHz on the core. So that's 145% 390x from removing architecture bottlenecks on the same clock speeds. *Now, If they manage to improve the performance per clock by, say, 20% on top of that*, and another 30% from additional clock speed increases coming from 16nm FINFET (although they state 65% if they went for clock speed alone), that would put a 4096 core Vega at roughly 227% of 390x's performance. That would put it at about 42% faster than a reference 1080 on 4k.


Given what we've seen from the GCN iterations so far, even 10% would be a very optimistic estimate, and 20% is just unrealistic.

As far as clocks go, they might get higher if they switch to TSMC's process, but if they use GF's 14nm LPP for Vega, then once again I don't think Vega will clock very high, if Polaris is any indication.

Overall, my projection for Vega is still around 1080 level, until I see further evidence otherwise.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Randomdude*
> 
> Well, assuming that Fury X had no bottlenecks anywhere, given its increased core count, it should've been roughly 45% faster than a 390x (4096/2816), however that difference in real world is more like 19-20% at 4K as per TPU charts
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . If Vega removes said bottlenecks from the architecture, and has the same specs without any other changes, it would be 45% faster than a 390x, they are both running at the exact same frequencies - 1050 MHz on the core. So that's 145% 390x from removing architecture bottlenecks on the same clock speeds. Now, If they manage to improve the performance per clock by, say, 20% on top of that, and another 30% from additional clock speed increases coming from 16nm FINFET (although they state 65% if they went for clock speed alone), that would put a 4096 core Vega at roughly 227% of 390x's performance. That would put it at about 42% faster than a reference 1080 on 4k.


Theoretical performance =/= real life performance.

Fury X wont be 45% faster than 390X.

4096 cores wont be 227% faster than 390X. I think we all should *stop hyping* AMD unrelease product. For once.


----------



## CBZ323

Pass. I was looking forward to switching to a single card that could support 3440x1440 maxing out my games, but the price tag and no HBM2 memory are not worth it. I'll save some money and wait another year.


----------



## guttheslayer

As a Titan its suppose to:

1) Comes with HBM, and has 12 GB at least
2) If it comes with G5X, should have 24 GB
3) Should be full blown 3840 cores if it doesnt have DP compute
4) If it has none of the 3 above it only worth less than $999 and not $1200

Yet we see none of these 4 happening. Sad time for PC community because AMD fails. Why the F AMD need to take on both GPU/CPU!


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> As a Titan its suppose to:
> 
> 1) Comes with HBM, and has 12 GB at least
> 2) If it comes with G5X, should have 24 GB
> 3) Should be full blown 3840 cores if it doesnt have DP compute
> 4) If it has none of the 3 above it only worth less than $999 and yet we see $1200
> 
> And we see none of this. Sad time for PC community becz AMD fails. Why the F AMD need to take on both GPU/CPU!


It used to be Titan meant it was the pinnacle of the consumer stack, and bridged that awkward price gap between the consumer and professional segments with some prosumer capabilities.

Then along came Titan X which was a 100% gaming card, but at least it had the highest amount of vram and was a full GM200 chip. This new Titan X is none of those, and it's a Titan in name and price only (could even argue the Titan name is used to justify what would otherwise really just be a 1080 Ti card) and an all around fail of a Titan in specs.


----------



## Pyrotagonist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> 1080 8GB GDDR5X and 1080 Ti only vanilla GDDR5? that doesn't sound right.


I'm half kidding, but with a 384-bit bus and 8GHz GDDR5, it's still more bandwidth than a 1080. Would probably be fine to pair 3200 cores.


----------



## warm

it's over 9000 ! (gigaflops)


----------



## meson1

I have a theory.

Volta has been pushed back to 2018 (see the news, see the roadmaps). Because it's been pushed back to 2018, I think they are stretching out Pascal over two years. So we see GP104 and GP102 both with GDDR5X this year. And they hold back GP100 until 2017.

That way they can release further products next year based on GP100 with HBM2 memory in order to achieve a step up in performance.

My guess is that we'll get another GP100 / HBM2 based Titan next year and a slightly cut down version of same branded as GTX 1080 Ti. This plan also has the advantage that it gives them extra time to get enough yields of GP100 and enough HBM2 memory.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I have a theory.
> 
> Volta has been pushed back to 2018 (see the news, see the roadmaps). Because it's been pushed back to 2018, I think they are stretching out Pascal over two years. So we see GP104 and GP102 both with GDDR5X this year. And they hold back GP100 until 2017.
> 
> That way they can release further products next year based on GP100 with HBM2 memory in order to achieve a step up in performance.
> 
> My guess is that we'll get another GP100 / HBM2 based Titan next year and a slightly cut down version of same branded as GTX 1080 Ti. This plan also has the advantage that it gives them extra time to get enough yields of GP100 and enough HBM2 memory.


Most likely there wont be 1080 ti. The entire pascal is rebrand and refresh with gtx 1100 series.

Gtx 1180 - gp102 with 3200 cores
Gtx 1170 - refined 1080
Etc

The new titan in 2017 will be finally hbm based. But with even more crazy price.


----------



## BillOhio

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> Why does a better one coming out make your current one worthless?.


Well, I guess I'd kick myself for spending $1K on a card only to see a better one come out 90 days later, which isn't completely a matter of e-peen. But e-peen or not, expensive GPU's are showing their age after a few years where as other pursuits like good audio will maintain. It's true that a top card from 2012 will max a 2012 game just as well now (maybe even better) as it did back then but will a top 2012 card max a 2016 game on a 2016 monitor? Vintage audio can be awesome, vintage gpu's not so much is all I'm sayin'. My next $600-$1,000 indulgence will be good speakers to pair with my 1983 Yamaha Receiver. I may not be able to max the graphics on BF1 but I bet it will sound amazing


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Where is majin?!! Where is chev?! Where is our prophet who predict titan wont be out on q3.
> 
> Are they digging a hole to hide?


Gotta admit I was totally wrong about this I suppose and you were absolutely right. Congratulations! Looks like Nvidia is needlessly doubling down on performance at a time that makes no sense for them to do so. Perhaps I was totally wrong about how long they intend to remain on 16nm? Certainly possible that they have future projections that go from 7nm and beyond and aren't worried about running out of node shrinks in the short term? They could be thinking along the same lines as AMD with more cores/multi GPU via NVLink (?) or some other way of getting beyond the limits of silicon in the next 5-10 years, I don't know. It just seems to me that they have AMD basically dead in the water already with the 1080 so there is no reason to cannablize 1080 sales so soon after launch other than for a shameless short-term money grab.

*But again, I admit to everyone, you were right, I was wrong and I stand corrected sir!*


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> It used to be Titan meant it was the pinnacle of the consumer stack, and bridged that awkward price gap between the consumer and professional segments with some prosumer capabilities.
> 
> Then along came Titan X which was a 100% gaming card, but at least it had the highest amount of vram and was a full GM200 chip. This new Titan X is none of those, and it's a Titan in name and price only (could even argue the Titan name is used to justify what would otherwise really just be a 1080 Ti card) and an all around fail of a Titan in specs.


I have been saying it for a while, but this is just Nvidia continuing to advance their consumer conditioning and marketing strategy. Before the Titan, there was the GTX 580. It was the same to its architecture and process as Titan Black was to Kepler and Titan X was to Maxwell. It was a $500 card.

Then they released the Titan, marketed their butts off and gave it exclusive DP in a GeForce card, and they sold way better than I'm sure even Nvidia could have projected. This got people conditioned on paying $1000 for a GeForce card. The next step was Titan X. They didn't need exclusive DP anymore (for one Maxwell had no DP to speak of), it just needed to be the flagship card. They already got consumers used to a $1000 flagship the round before.

Now they are just taking the next step. The first Titan experiment worked pretty well. Why not try another? This will be a cut down chip that, instead of selling for $1000, will sell for $1200. I bet it will sell pretty well. The fact is Nvidia is the only player in the high end GPU market. It won't end until there is competition or consumers stop buying. I don't have a lot of confidence that either will happen any time soon, so it's hard to say where it will end up.

It's pretty disappointing, for sure. The future of technology has always been something to be excited about, but anymore, it's a little depressing to think about what it might be like in a few years. This all began with Kepler, which was released 4 pretty short years ago. It's gotten pretty out of hand in a short amount of time. Pretty scary to think about what you'll have to pay for the top end GeForce card in another 4 years considering we're already at $1200 for what is a cut chip.


----------



## Mad Pistol

BTW, I figured out Nvidia's game with naming.

Titan X = Titan 10.

Next generation will either be Titan XI or Titan II


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Gotta admit I was totally wrong about this I suppose and you were absolutely right. Congratulations! Looks like Nvidia is needlessly doubling down on performance at a time that makes no sense for them to do so. Perhaps I was totally wrong about how long they intend to remain on 16nm? Certainly possible that they have future projections that go from 7nm and beyond and aren't worried about running out of node shrinks in the short term? They could be thinking along the same lines as AMD with more cores/multi GPU via NVLink (?) or some other way of getting beyond the limits of silicon in the next 5-10 years, I don't know. It just seems to me that they have AMD basically dead in the water already with the 1080 so there is no reason to cannablize 1080 sales so soon after launch other than for a shameless short-term money grab.
> 
> *But again, I admit to everyone, you were right, I was wrong and I stand corrected sir!*


Maybe they looked at demand for the 1080 and said why are we taking $700 when we could be taking $1200. There will still be plenty of buyers for the 1080 even if they cream off the highest spenders for the Titan.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> BTW, I figured out Nvidia's game with naming.
> 
> Titan X = Titan 10.
> 
> Next generation will either be Titan XI or Titan II


Maybe. Or perhaps the naming convention is Titan {whatever-they-feel-like}


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Maybe they looked at demand for the 1080 and said why are we taking $700 when we could be taking $1200. There will still be plenty of buyers for the 1080 even if they cream off the highest spenders for the Titan.


DING DING DING!

i mentioned before of 1080 supply issues - they can't keep them on the shelves. so now nvidia has found a way to get that money plus 58% more.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Maybe they looked at demand for the 1080 and said why are we taking $700 when we could be taking $1200. There will still be plenty of buyers for the 1080 even if they cream off the highest spenders for the Titan.


You really think so? I mean, $700 is already really expensive for a flagship card and I would guess that the majority of those that would spring for it over a 1070 are the same type of buyers that would have no issues with paying $1200 for the fastest card ever made. The 1080 is simply priced too high for the casual gamer to pay for it and the type of enthusiast that would drop $700 for epeen wouldn't think too hard about spending more (however much more really) for, again, the fastest card made so they can post up all their shiny new bench,arks and lord it over all of the "plebs" who can't afford such an extravagant expense. I know because I used to be one of those guys when I bought my Titans. I predict that 1070 sales will go through the roof once this new Titan releases with the 1080 kind of twisting in the breeze. Really, why spend so much money on a card that no longer can claim to be the fastest?


----------



## umeng2002

I'll wait for the Titan X Ti with HBM2... and a spare $1500

I have a feeling they think AMD can compete on the high-end with Vega this fall.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *umeng2002*
> 
> I'll wait for the Titan X Ti with HBM2... and a spare $1500
> 
> I have a feeling they think AMD can compete on the high-end with Vega this fall.


I WANT to see AMD competing at the high end. It would keep prices in check and encourage faster development.

I'm still on a 780Ti on air. Waiting to decide what to buy from the Pascal generation for my new WC build. Will it be a 1080? Will it be a Titan X (Pascal)? I'll wait until I see some benchmarks from the Titan before deciding.


----------



## Xuper

Here 1060 with 2050Mhz is almost 10% faster than RX 480 with 1350Mhz ( This Link ) , So Can AMD bring Vega with 4096 Core running at 1350Mhz ? and can it compete again GTX 1080 or even Pascal Titan X ? The thing is that Nvidia is playing with People's Mind with Overclocking.AMD should bring crazy OC into Vega but i think it's not possible.


----------



## umeng2002

I think Polaris had silicon issues, and that it should have had much higher clocks near than Pascal.

I would assume AMD fixes this for Vega.


----------



## DETERMINOLOGY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> This thread is heaving lol.


People overcook theads...Overall titan x overpriced...people writing serveys and what not


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> You really think so? I mean, $700 is already really expensive for a flagship card and I would guess that the majority of those that would spring for it over a 1070 are the same type of buyers that would have no issues with paying $1200 for the fastest card ever made. The 1080 is simply priced too high for the casual gamer to pay for it and the type of enthusiast that would drop $700 for epeen wouldn't think too hard about spending more (however much more really) for, again, the fastest card made so they can post up all their shiny new bench,arks and lord it over all of the "plebs" who can't afford such an extravagant expense. I know because I used to be one of those guys when I bought my Titans. I predict that 1070 sales will go through the roof once this new Titan releases with the 1080 kind of twisting in the breeze. Really, why spend so much money on a card that no longer can claim to be the fastest?


I'd say if there's one thing you have to give Nvidia credit for, it's their ability to read the market. With the exception of the Titan Z, they seem to have done a pretty good job of pricing cards as high as they can while still selling a good number of them. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on the market for both a $1200 and a $700 card. But considering the new Titan is Nvidia store only, maybe they don't really expect to sell that many of them (while still taking the retailers cut also).


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BillOhio*
> 
> Well, I guess I'd kick myself for spending $1K on a card only to see a better one come out 90 days later, which isn't completely a matter of e-peen. But e-peen or not, expensive GPU's are showing their age after a few years where as other pursuits like good audio will maintain. It's true that a top card from 2012 will max a 2012 game just as well now (maybe even better) as it did back then but will a top 2012 card max a 2016 game on a 2016 monitor? Vintage audio can be awesome, vintage gpu's not so much is all I'm sayin'. My next $600-$1,000 indulgence will be good speakers to pair with my 1983 Yamaha Receiver. I may not be able to max the graphics on BF1 but I bet it will sound amazing


Oh I see, yes I do try to buy the 'right' card for me in each generation, generally that is the best one but I don't want to buy too often so I wait for the big die. Still, in some ways only GPUs are still like this in computers. When I started hobbyist computer building I had a 486. Nothing had any relevancy three years later. Now, even for video cards, a top of the line from three years ago is still pretty good. New games are completely playable at 2560x1440 with reasonable settings, not max but not minimum either.

For CPUs at three years old they are still pretty much top of the line.









I suppose my point is that this is computers for you, it is actually about the same as it has always been or slowing down. I do have to agree though, if you don't have great audio equipment already it is a longer term purchase, skip one generation of GPUs and have great audio for the next 20 years.









Though they are trying for planned obsolescence there too, we up to 7.1 now. Nothing from 10 years ago supports any of the new audio formats. I think the next (UHD TV) will be 22.2 or something?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> You really think so? I mean, $700 is already really expensive for a flagship card and I would guess that the majority of those that would spring for it over a 1070 are the same type of buyers that would have no issues with paying $1200 for the fastest card ever made. The 1080 is simply priced too high for the casual gamer to pay for it and the type of enthusiast that would drop $700 for epeen wouldn't think too hard about spending more (however much more really) for, again, the fastest card made so they can post up all their shiny new bench,arks and lord it over all of the "plebs" who can't afford such an extravagant expense. I know because I used to be one of those guys when I bought my Titans. I predict that 1070 sales will go through the roof once this new Titan releases with the 1080 kind of twisting in the breeze. Really, why spend so much money on a card that no longer can claim to be the fastest?


You know, I'd bet you a round of beer that the number of OCN members who literally can't afford a $1200 GPU (afford as in can't buy with either cash or credit) are probably quite small. As I mentioned to someone else there's a difference between not being able to (literally) afford something, versus somebody not buying something because the price is ******ed to them.

Also those who would drop $700 for epeen would trample over each other to buy the $1200 card, so those are pretty much guaranteed sales. The Titan XP at $1200 also is priced sufficiently above the 1080 that it doesn't really affect it much at all. For a 71% to 100% increase in price you get a paltry 25-30% increase in performance, so Titan XP only appeals to those who want the absolute best regardless of cost.


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> Oh I see, yes I do try to buy the 'right' card for me in each generation, generally that is the best one but I don't want to buy too often so I wait for the big die.


This is where I'm at. I generally try to buy the best card in each gen, but the lines have become so blurred its hard to know when to buy. Sure we have this new Titan X, but there will be a 3840 core 16 GB card sometime down the line. Probably after AMD releases something. It will also probably be $1500, which is more than a bit absurd. It's hard to say anymore. I'd like a card that matches my 980 Ti SLI in a single GPU, which this one will probably do or get close. However it sucks to spend $1200 to have a better one come out in 90 days.


----------



## magnek

My prediction is that OC vs OC, Titan XP will likely only end up ~40-45% faster than a single 980 Ti, so you're gonna have to wait for Volta for a single card that will truly match your 980 Ti SLI setup, assuming typical 70-80% SLI scaling.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I'd say if there's one thing you have to give Nvidia credit for, it's their ability to read the market. With the exception of the Titan Z, they seem to have done a pretty good job of pricing cards as high as they can while still selling a good number of them. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on the market for both a $1200 and a $700 card. But considering the new Titan is Nvidia store only, maybe they don't really expect to sell that many of them (while still taking the retailers cut also).


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> You know, I'd bet you a round of beer that the number of OCN members who literally can't afford a $1200 GPU (afford as in can't buy with either cash or credit) are probably quite small. As I mentioned to someone else there's a difference between not being able to (literally) afford something, versus somebody not buying something because the price is ******ed to them.
> 
> Also those who would drop $700 for epeen would trample over each other to buy the $1200 card, so those are pretty much guaranteed sales. The Titan XP at $1200 also is priced sufficiently above the 1080 that it doesn't really affect it much at all. For a 71% to 100% increase in price you get a paltry 25-30% increase in performance, so Titan XP only appeals to those who want the absolute best regardless of cost.


You guys may well be completely right and given my abysmal prediction record as of late I wouldn't believe myself if I said water was wet at this point! Oh well, win some, lose some...


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> My prediction is that OC vs OC, Titan XP will likely only end up ~40% faster than a single 980 Ti, so you're gonna have to wait for Volta for a single card that will truly match your 980 Ti SLI setup, assuming typical 70-80% SLI scaling.


Well that would certainly be disappointing. No question they could pull it off with Pascal and 16 nm. If they don't it's because they choose not to. This card may not do it, but there will almost certainly be better 16 nm Pascal based cards following this Titan XP.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> This is where I'm at. I generally try to buy the best card in each gen, but the lines have become so blurred its hard to know when to buy. Sure we have this new Titan X, but there will be a 3840 core 16 GB card sometime down the line. Probably after AMD releases something. It will also probably be $1500, which is more than a bit absurd. It's hard to say anymore. I'd like a card that matches my 980 Ti SLI in a single GPU, which this one will probably do or get close. However it sucks to spend $1200 to have a better one come out in 90 days.


I think I will probably get this one, that card will be the "real Titan" but it won't really be much faster. I try for the best performance I can get but at 5% below the top I can be ok, not worth the extra $. I do wish this was a full die though.









You also have to consider release dates, if the next generation is 15 months away getting it now instead of in 3 months is an extra 25% time using the GPU.


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I think I will probably get this one, that card will be the "real Titan" but it won't really be much faster. I try for the best performance I can get but at 5% below the top I can be ok, not worth the extra $. I do wish this was a full die though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You also have to consider release dates, if the next generation is 15 months away getting it now instead of in 3 months is an extra 25% time using the GPU.


I agree on all accounts. That was the big bonus to getting an OG Titan vs a 780 Ti for example. You got that performance 6 or 7 months early. I also don't always buy the biggest. I did buy Titans but did not buy Titan X. Wasn't worth the extra cash over 980 Ti. I'm gonna wait this out for a while and see what happens. I'm too busy with work the next 2 or 3 months to spend that kind of cash on something I won't have the time to use anyways.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

For me it looks like my upgrade path from OG Titans will probably be far cheaper as I no longer have the interest in paying such amounts for video cards when $400 cards like the 980Ti and 1070 easily fit the bill for everything I want to do on a PC right now. Might pick up a couple of 980Ti Classy's for less than $900 and call it a day. Won't be at the top of the bench charts anymore but will certainly be able to play everything maxed out at 1440p for the foreseeable future...


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> For me it looks like my upgrade path from OG Titans will probably be far cheaper as I no longer have the interest in paying such amounts for video cards when $400 cards like the 980Ti and 1070 easily fit the bill for everything I want to do on a PC right now. Might pick up a couple of 980Ti Classy's for less than $900 and call it a day. Won't be at the top of the bench charts anymore but will certainly be able to play everything maxed out at 1440p for the foreseeable future...


dude even a single 980ti has no problems maxing out 1440. jpmboy just put his poseidon on the market for 399 and you know he takes care of his gear. plus being a poseidon its already water friendly.

i was looking at it myself but then . .well would be time to invest in a good water kit . . another~$300 and $150+ for a case - too much just to "replace" my crappy card.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> dude even a single 980ti has no problems maxing out 1440. jpmboy just put his poseidon on the market for 399 and you know he takes care of his gear. plus being a poseidon its already water friendly.
> 
> i was looking at it myself but then . .well would be time to invest in a good water kit . . another~$300 - too much just to "replace" my crappy card.


I know one would be enough but it would be a downgrade from two OG Titans and i always run two cards anyway because of my TJ11 (which looks ridiculous with only a single card in it)...


----------



## renejr902

I will probably buy this new titan x , im playing at 4k, i could buy the 1080 instead but im in fear to be disappointed, i really want most games at 4k 60fps .

About HBM2 vs GDDR5X. Will it be a real significative world performance difference in gaming between this titan with gddr5x at 480gb/s and hbm2 at 540gb/s for 12gb with bus at 3084 bit? Except the increase in price, i dont think 60gb/s difference could make a real difference. I dont talk about 16gb at 4096bit, because before this announcement i was targeting a titan with 12gb hbm2 at 3084bit. Why pay 1500$ for a hbm2 titan at 12gb and 540gb/s? Its not worth it, maybe thats the reason why nvidia release it with gddr5x instead

Thanks for your opinion


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I think I will probably get this one, that card will be the "real Titan" but it won't really be much faster. I try for the best performance I can get but at 5% below the top I can be ok, not worth the extra $. I do wish this was a full die though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You also have to consider release dates, if the next generation is 15 months away getting it now instead of in 3 months is an extra 25% time using the GPU.


Honestly if this Titan came with HBM2 the $1200 price would be somewhat more bearable, but of course that would only happen in dreamland.

I guess my simple rule of thumb for upgrading is that whatever I upgrade to needs to be _at least_ 50% than what I own currently, and I do mean OC vs OC of course since I watercool. Ignoring the lack of HBM2 and the price for a second, I would actually be pretty surprised if this new Titan X could consistently deliver 50% over a 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 across all games. (keeping in mind that a 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 is pretty much on par with a stock 1080)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> For me it looks like my upgrade path from OG Titans will probably be far cheaper as I no longer have the interest in paying such amounts for video cards when $400 cards like the 980Ti and 1070 easily fit the bill for everything I want to do on a PC right now. Might pick up a couple of 980Ti Classy's for less than $900 and call it a day. Won't be at the top of the bench charts anymore but will certainly be able to play everything maxed out at 1440p for the foreseeable future...


Maxwell doesn't voltage scale worth a damn on air/water, I'd just buy the cheapest 980 Ti's (used for new) you can find and call it a day. No point paying the Classy or Lightning premium.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know one would be enough but it would be a downgrade from two OG Titans and i always run two cards anyway because of my TJ11 (which looks ridiculous with only a single card in it)...


I had SLI Titans before this 980Ti, they were a bit faster but I got fed up with SLI (being a Fallout fan) so I was happy to give it up. However, at this point I am a very ready for more performance since I have had about the same performance (assuming SLI was working) since April 2013.


----------



## thebski

I don't really have an upgrade rule of thumb. I just go by what I think I need at the time. When I was trying to run 5760x1080 at 144 Hz in the Kepler days, I needed all I could get. Then I started to prefer a single monitor and went to 1440p 144 Hz. My two 980 Ti's are more than enough for that, but I like having headroom. I'm not so much interested in going up in overall performance as I am getting back to a single card. Spending money, especially a lot, on something that isn't as fast as what I have just feels wrong, even if I am comparing two cards to one. Also, at $1200, I feel like this better be close to two 980 Ti's. I had that performance a year ago for $1300.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know one would be enough but it would be a downgrade from two OG Titans and i always run two cards anyway because of my TJ11 (which looks ridiculous with only a single card in it)...


ok, i got ya.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Maxwell doesn't voltage scale worth a damn on air/water, I'd just buy the cheapest 980 Ti's (used for new) you can find and call it a day. No point paying the Classy or Lightning premium.


pretty much that - if anything newegg has sales on the FTW quite often; ~$420 new and the only thing they don't have are evbot and probe it connections.

oops forgetting water block compatability . .no idea.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

No point on getting 980 Tis considering DX12/Vulkan.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know one would be enough but it would be a downgrade from two OG Titans and i always run two cards anyway because of my TJ11 (which looks ridiculous with only a single card in it)...


http://www.3dmark.com/fs/8618775

Here's a run in FSE with my 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 (a very attainable OC with a good custom loop)

21159 graphics score. Maybe you can use this as a starting point to see how much ahead your Titan SLI @ 1340 would end up being.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> I don't really have an upgrade rule of thumb. I just go by what I think I need at the time. When I was trying to run 5760x1080 at 144 Hz in the Kepler days, I needed all I could get. Then I started to prefer a single monitor and went to 1440p 144 Hz. My two 980 Ti's are more than enough for that, but I like having headroom. I'm not so much interested in going up in overall performance as I am getting back to a single card. Spending money, especially a lot, on something that isn't as fast as what I have just feels wrong, even if I am comparing two cards to one. Also, at $1200, I feel like this better be close to two 980 Ti's. I had that performance a year ago for $1300.


The 50% rule of thumb is because a 50% increase over 40 FPS is 60 FPS, and that's a pretty perceptible difference in terms of fluidity.

I freely admit I'm not overly anal about maintaining 60 FPS minimum at all times, so the occasional dips into the low 40s don't really ruin the immersion for me.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> if anything newegg has sales on the FTW quite often; ~$420 new and the only thing they don't have are evbot and probe it connections.


At that price wouldn't you go for a 1070? Right now they are close but I do like simultaneous multi-projection and better preemption, both will probably be useful in the future, no?


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> No point on getting 980 Tis considering DX12/Vulkan.


don't be silly. both DX12 and vulkan are miles away.

plus there still is a performance increase w/vulkan and DOOM for me. (after i stopped the crashing by lowering my OC)


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> ok, i got ya.
> pretty much that - if anything newegg has sales on the FTW quite often; ~$420 new and the only thing they don't have are evbot and probe it connections.
> 
> oops forgetting water block compatability . .no idea.


FTW doesn't have a waterblock AFAIK.

To be honest though, unless you can find a new 980 Ti for <$350 (ideally <$300), a 1070 would be the better buy at this point -- more vram, half the TDP, and at least positive increase with async compute.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> No point on getting 980 Tis considering DX12/Vulkan.


Well it's not like 980Tis don't work in DX12. Two would still provide plenty for 1440p at 60Hz in BF1 for instance.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well it's not like 980Tis don't work in DX12. Two would still provide plenty for 1440p at 60Hz in BF1 for instance.


There is no reason to get 980 Ti over 1070s.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> ok, i got ya.
> pretty much that - if anything newegg has sales on the FTW quite often; ~$420 new and the only thing they don't have are evbot and probe it connections.
> 
> oops forgetting water block compatability . .no idea.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FTW doesn't have a waterblock AFAIK.
> 
> To be honest though, unless you can find a new 980 Ti for <$350 (ideally <$300), a 1070 would be the better buy at this point -- more vram, half the TDP, and at least positive increase with async compute.
Click to expand...

[insert pascal hating comment here due to lack of "enthusiast" OCing]


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/8618775
> 
> The 50% rule of thumb is because a 50% increase over 40 FPS is 60 FPS, and that's a pretty perceptible difference in terms of fluidity.
> 
> I freely admit I'm not overly anal about maintaining 60 FPS minimum at all times, so the occasional dips into the low 40s don't really ruin the immersion for me.


I don't think that's a bad rule by any means. I have never had a specific number, but I always considered it kind of "classes" of power. For example, 980 Ti and old Titan X are the same class of GPU. Yes, TX will be a little faster all the time, but it's not like you're going to go from high to ultra on a game. A TX will run all the same settings as a 980 Ti, it will just do it a little bit better. 980 to 980 Ti/TX on the other hand, I would consider that another class. I think that is basically what you are saying as well.

I will admit I am a bit anal about maintaining 120 or 144. That's why I like headroom. For the first time I am satisfied with my performance level, I just wish it didn't take two cards to do it. When 4K and 144 hz is a thing, I'll be back to chasing overall performance.


----------



## Pyrotagonist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> There is no reason to get 980 Ti over 1070s.


Only one of them can be had for $380 ($370 AR actually) tho.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> There is no reason to get 980 Ti over 1070s.


That would really depends on price. I wouldn't say there is no reason lol.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> There is no reason to get 980 Ti over 1070s.


I believe under water they would be faster, though it'd probably be a toss up. I also expect 980Ti prices to continue to fall but 1070's are definitely a good option for me as well.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> I don't think that's a bad rule by any means. I have never had a specific number, but I always considered it kind of "classes" of power. For example, 980 Ti and old Titan X are the same class of GPU. Yes, TX will be a little faster all the time, but it's not like you're going to go from high to ultra on a game. A TX will run all the same settings as a 980 Ti, it will just do it a little bit better. 980 to 980 Ti/TX on the other hand, I would consider that another class. I think that is basically what you are saying as well.
> 
> I will admit I am a bit anal about maintaining 120 or 144. That's why I like headroom. For the first time I am satisfied with my performance level, I just wish it didn't take two cards to do it. When 4K and 144 hz is a thing, I'll be back to chasing overall performance.


4K @ 144 is probably Volta Titan territory. Plus I don't think there'll be many 4K @ 144 panels out even in 2018/2019, so they'll fetch a hefty premium as well.

I like headroom too but, as I've come to find out after 700+ hours with my 980 Ti (don't judge >_>), if I can average around 60 FPS (meaning min FPS i probably low 40s or worse), then the overall experience is still pretty decent.

There are some notable exceptions of course like _certain Ubisoft games_, and Borderlands 2 that for whatever reason feels stuttery even when I running well above 80 FPS. But the former is Ubisoft meaning you can throw 4 Titan XPs at it and it'll still run like ass even though you're shooting over 200 FPS, and the latter is more an outlier than the norm.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I believe under water they would be faster, though it'd probably be a toss up. I also expect 980Ti prices to continue to fall but 1070's are definitely a good option for me as well.


http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/8908433/fs/8618775

My 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 vs criminal's 1070 @ 2088/9316.

Do note that criminal mentioned his 1070 was constantly bouncing off the power limit even though he maxed it out, so I'd say under DX11 max OC vs max OC they'd be about equal.

Don't need to tell you how much Maxwell does(n't) DX12.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I had SLI Titans before this 980Ti, they were a bit faster but I got fed up with SLI (being a Fallout fan) so I was happy to give it up. However, at this point I am a very ready for more performance since I have had about the same performance (assuming SLI was working) since April 2013.


Do people not know how to disable SLI in the Nvidia control panel. It's pretty simple, when you're playing a game that doesn't support SLI like Fallout or Doom simply disable SLI in the cp and enjoy smooth trouble free gameplay on that particular game. It takes literally 30 seconds to disable.


----------



## Juub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> 4K @ 144 is probably Volta Titan territory. Plus I don't think there'll be many 4K @ 144 panels out even in 2018/2019, so they'll fetch a hefty premium as well.
> 
> I like headroom too but, as I've come to find out after 700+ hours with my 980 Ti (don't judge >_>), if I can average around 60 FPS (meaning min FPS i probably low 40s or worse), then the overall experience is still pretty decent.
> 
> There are some notable exceptions of course like _certain Ubisoft games_, and Borderlands 2 that for whatever reason feels stuttery even when I running well above 80 FPS. But the former is Ubisoft meaning you can throw 4 Titan XPs at it and it'll still run like ass even though you're shooting over 200 FPS, and the latter is more an outlier than the norm.


Probably PhysX in Borderlands 2. Even with a pair of 980's my fps still dips to the 40's at 1440p.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/8618775
> 
> Here's a run in FSE with my 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 (a very attainable OC with a good custom loop)
> 
> 21159 graphics score. Maybe you can use this as a starting point to see how much ahead your Titan SLI @ 1340 would end up being.
> The 50% rule of thumb is because a 50% increase over 40 FPS is 60 FPS, and that's a pretty perceptible difference in terms of fluidity.
> 
> I freely admit I'm not overly anal about maintaining 60 FPS minimum at all times, so the occasional dips into the low 40s don't really ruin the immersion for me.


I actually agree with your rule of thumb, 50% or better is what I use too, but this new Titan X will hopefully be close enough. My 980Ti doesn't like over 1481 MHz at any volts, and an unrelated increase in my income means it still feels cheaper than a single Titan did. I am resolved to avoid SLI at least through Pascal though.









I like very high frame rates for the motion clarity... I also have a Vive.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Do people not know how to disable SLI in the Nvidia control panel. It's pretty simple, when you're playing a game that doesn't support SLI like Fallout or Doom simply disable SLI in the cp and enjoy smooth trouble free gameplay on that particular game. It takes literally 30 seconds to disable.


And get 1/2 2/3 the frame rates you are used to and spend $1000 for nothing? Not again, thanks.

edit: The 980Ti was a big upgrade compared to my SLI Titans with SLI disabled.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I actually agree with your rule of thumb, 50% or better is what I use too, but this new Titan X will hopefully be close enough. My 980Ti doesn't like over 1481 MHz at any volts, and an unrelated increase in my income means it still feels cheaper than a single Titan did. I am resolved to avoid SLI at least through Pascal though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like very high frame rates for the motion clarity... I also have a Vive.


_unrelated increase_ in income? Please tell me it's all legit.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Juub*
> 
> Probably PhysX in Borderlands 2. Even with a pair of 980's my fps still dips to the 40's at 1440p.


Yeah probably, since it only occurs in certain areas (Bloodshots Stronghold is a notorious example). But man when the particles start flying it simply kills the card. Actually Pre-sequel is even worse -- I can't get above 40-45 FPS if I crank PhysX to ultra and start killing kraggons, because somebody thought it'd be funny to have them break into a thousand tiny pieces upon death on Ultra PhysX.









But I love BL2 and TPS for stability testing though, because there are certain areas where PhysX goes to 12 and the slightest instability in your OC results in an inevitable crash down the road. Quite literally every single time and without fail, if my OC was unstable, I couldn't play the Bloodshots Stronghold area fore more than 15 minutes without crashing.


----------



## Papadope

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NuclearPeace*
> 
> $1,200 on something that will have a throttling reference cooler, a barebones VRM, and isn't even fully enabled? The real cherry on top is that NVIDIA will probably voltage or power lock it and keep preventing board partners from creating a superior cooler.
> 
> The Titan series sums up everything that I hate about modern hardware.


Nvidia, The way it's meant to be *payed*


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> And get 1/2 the frame rates you are used to and spend $1000 for nothing? Not again, thanks.


That's because your OG Titans were outdated and not up to par. That's why I upgrade every year to 16 months tops and always have powerful cards so they can get the job done if they have to run solo. I'm a fan of overkill when it comes to available gpu power. But what was overkill 12 months ago is now just enough to get the job done in most cases. That's ultra enthusiast PC gaming in a nutshell. There is no such thing as future proofing. There is only settling with lowering the settings as time goes by and your gpu's begin to show there age. Money wise upgrading each generation is not that bad. I'm usually able to sell my current gpu's for half the price of the cost of there replacement.


----------



## bonami2

Im the only one who realised it gonna be sold only on nvidia website.

Clearly hiding overpriced price.

Since selling to example newegg. They need to make profit.

Now it all in their pocket...


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> That's because your OG Titans were outdated and not up to par. That's why I upgrade every year to 16 months tops and always have powerful cards so they can get the job done if they have to run solo. I'm a fan of overkill when it comes to available gpu power. But what was overkill 12 months ago is now just enough to get the job done in most cases. That's ultra enthusiast PC gaming in a nutshell. There is no such thing as future proofing. There is only settling with lowering the settings as time goes by and your gpu's begin to show there age. Money wise upgrading each generation is not that bad. I'm usually able to sell my current gpu's for half the price of the cost of there replacement.


I have always handed down old parts to friends and family at no charge so I never think of resale values.









I have basically the same hardware target, computers as a hobby with an income such that it isn't a major burden and I can get the best every generation if I want. I simply didn't think SLI Titans was worth it, and it was the best dual GPU experiance I have had so far, still not really worth it. SLI is for pushing the max frame rates where it works but I tend to play lots of random games, and at the time most of the games I played a lot either didn't support SLI or had minor glitchiness with it enabled.

madVR also doesn't like SLI so I had to turn it off and on all the time.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Im the only one who realised it gonna be sold only on nvidia website.
> 
> Clearly hiding overpriced price.
> 
> Since selling to example newegg. They need to make profit.
> 
> Now it all in their pocket...


Brilliant isn't it? I wonder why Intel hasn't done it yet. Does Nvidia or Intel need the likes of Amazon to promote their product? A few google ads and they are good, I would think.


----------



## Asmodian

double post


----------



## renejr902

Any advantage hbm2 vs gddr5x if the bandwith is nearly the same ?
I think nvidia could not get enough performance difference and instead stay with gddr5x for titan. Is it possible ? I know the price is too much high, but i still doubt hbm2 will make a real difference vs gddr5x. In future when gddr5x will work at 14 instead of 10, difference with hbm2 will be minimal.

Am i wrong ? Thanks for opinion, im still not sure if i buy the titan x or not, and i try to figure some spec. Overclocked memory will be higher than 500gb/s , do we really need more bandwith than that even while pkaying in 4k? Does faster memory bandwith give any interesting performance advantage?

About 3584 vs 3840 cores, i think the difference is minimal in performance. Am i wrong? I know the price asking by nvidia is too much, BUT is this card so bad really ? 3584 cores and 480gb/s is not enough ? Not future proof enough?

Thanks for your opinion about all of that. It will be really appreciated


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Any advantage hbm2 vs gddr5x if the bandwith is nearly the same ?
> I think nvidia could not get enough performance difference and instead stay with gddr5x for titan. Is it possible ? I know the price is too much high, but i still doubt hbm2 will make a real difference vs gddr5x. In future when gddr5x will work at 14 instead of 10, difference with hbm2 will be minimal.
> 
> Am i wrong ? Thanks for opinion, im still not sure if i buy the titan x or not, and i try to figure some spec. Overclocked memory will be higher than 500gb/s , do we really need more than that even while pkaying in 4k? Does faster memory bandwith give any interesting performance advantage?
> 
> About 3584 vs 3840 cores, i think the difference is minimal in performance. Am i wrong? I know the price asking by nvidia is too much, BUT is this card so bad really ? 3584 cores and 480gb/s is not enough ? Not future proof enough?
> 
> Thanks for your opinion about all of that. It will be really appreciated


Not very different for gaming. HBM2 is lower latency so it is much better for some scientific applications, also a bit better everywhere to be honest. However, HBM2 would be higher bandwidth, even the 12GB 3-stack Tesla has 540GB/sec instead of the Titan XP's 480GB/sec.

No, not so bad really, I will buy one.


----------



## jincuteguy

Do you guys think this new Titan X will be sold out faster than the 1080?


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Any advantage hbm2 vs gddr5x if the bandwith is nearly the same ?
> I think nvidia could not get enough performance difference and instead stay with gddr5x for titan. Is it possible ? I know the price is too much high, but i still doubt hbm2 will make a real difference vs gddr5x. In future when gddr5x will work at 14 instead of 10, difference with hbm2 will be minimal.
> 
> Am i wrong ? Thanks for opinion, im still not sure if i buy the titan x or not, and i try to figure some spec. Overclocked memory will be higher than 500gb/s , do we really need more than that even while pkaying in 4k? Does faster memory bandwith give any interesting performance advantage?
> 
> About 3584 vs 3840 cores, i think the difference is minimal in performance. Am i wrong? I know the price asking by nvidia is too much, BUT is this card so bad really ? 3584 cores and 480gb/s is not enough ? Not future proof enough?
> 
> Thanks for your opinion about all of that. It will be really appreciated


HBM2 is actually up to two times faster (more bandwidth) than HBM1, which is roughly equal (HBM1 that is) to the GDDR5X on a 384bit bus. Without the same arch and and chip using both memory technologies there's no good way to actually compare what the differences could be. Unless the new Titan sees massive performance gains from large memory oc's (and tbh my 1080 does see a rather huge gain from just clocking my memory alone), again it's hard to tell.

In the end there would likely be performance to gain from using HBM, but how much and at what cost (to performance, to power savings, to design cost, to availability)? I'm sure Nvidia weighed a lot of different things in the decision to go with GDDR5X, the number one reason in my book being to get the card out asap. As always the best way to look at any give GPU, in my opinion, is what games you want to play at what res/settings, and picking which card does it best. If it meets your needs, can run the games you're going to play, and you have the money to buy it, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.


----------



## SuperZan

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> Do you guys think this new Titan X will be sold out faster than the 1080?


Given the volume with which it's likely to be launched, I'd say yes.

It shouldn't take long to sell a couple hundred cards.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> Do you guys think this new Titan X will be sold out faster than the 1080?


There's only one place that sell this card. You tell me.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> There's only one place that sell this card. You tell me.


But that one place has them all. It will probably still sell out fast though, at least at first, I think retail consultants suggest an initial sellout for things like this because it adds apparent value for very little cost.


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> There is no reason to get 980 Ti over 1070s.


I would if a new 980Ti is price @ $300.


----------



## jincuteguy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> There's only one place that sell this card. You tell me.


What 1 place? I thought Newegg, amazon, evga will be selling them? What 1 place are u talking about?


----------



## SuperZan

You've got to buy them from JHH's personal larder. Also known as Nvidia's webstore.


----------



## i7monkey

Funny how people give competitive-market buying advice in this monopolistic industry, as if boycotting or buying lesser cards will do anything to the price.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ENTERPRISE*
> 
> Wow a terrible name. Why would you use an existing product name for a different product...odd.


I think it's purely because Pascal is the 10 Series, and X being 10 in roman numerals.


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> I think it's purely because Pascal is the 10 Series, and X being 10 in roman numerals.


Makes perfect sense. Not


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> But that one place has them all. It will probably still sell out fast though, at least at first, I think retail consultants suggest an initial sellout for things like this because it adds apparent value for very little cost.


True, but that supply could also be extremely limited, hence why they're cutting out the middleman and taking all the profits themselves.

Also their webstore is gonna be DDoS'd hard on launch day lol.


----------



## l88bastar

Titan Double X marks the spot


----------



## FattysGoneWild

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> I sold my two EVGA Titan X SC when the selling was good and picked up two EVGA GTX 1080 FE. Now I'm thinking of selling the 1080s for one or two of the new Titan X cards.


Talk about hard to please. Wow.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> Do you guys think this new Titan X will be sold out faster than the 1080?


It will sell out fast. I see people trying to unload 1080's right now. Many FE's going for $599. People are willing to take $100 hit on those already. Prime example is that dingleberry above you.


----------



## hokk

I'm going to wait for the titan XX


----------



## DADDYDC650

I'm usually pumped when a Titan comes out but this Titan sucks for $1200. Feels like a rushed product.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm usually pumped when a Titan comes out but this Titan sucks for $1200. Feels like a rushed product.


ha...Ill see you in the que to buy it new!!


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> ha...Ill see you in the que to buy it new!!


How do you know me so well?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> How do you know me so well?


Cause I was like you once, full of purpose and principle....Now I am just a shell of a man, broken and addicted to highend hardware spewing high FPS in Ultra OLED. Nvidia has me by the balls.......and I kinda like it









Lets be real....a $1200 price point is not going to stop these babies from selling out in the first five minutes.....may the F5 Gods have mercy on us all!


----------



## Ghoxt

Are reviewers held hostage on this launch from speaking anything? Anyone else find it odd that there's also no Benchmarks in the wild (3DMark etc), synthetic or otherwise for an Nvidia website only Sales launch that's supposed to occur in 10 days? No one yet to validate that this card should be worth 1200 lol?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> Are reviewers held hostage on this launch from speaking anything? Anyone else find it odd that there's also no Benchmarks in the wild (3DMark etc), synthetic or otherwise for an Nvidia website only Sales launch that's supposed to occur in 10 days? No one yet to validate that this card should be worth 1200 lol?


Your hunch is right! I took the launch photo and made a custom GUI interface using visual basic to expose the double negative and this is what we found!

https://postimg.org/image/di9q99oe9/free upload image


----------



## Noufel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xuper*
> 
> Here 1060 with 2050Mhz is almost 10% faster than RX 480 with 1350Mhz ( This Link ) , So Can AMD bring Vega with 4096 Core running at 1350Mhz ? and can it compete again GTX 1080 or even Pascal Titan X ? The thing is that Nvidia is playing with People's Mind with Overclocking.AMD should bring crazy OC into Vega but i think it's not possible.


The vega arch should be on TSMC process, 1600 or 1700 on a 4096 Sp gpu shouldn't be a problem .
The think that bothers me is the prices they are going skyhigh and i hope that AMD won't put a 1200$ price tag on their vega flagship


----------



## DesmoLocke

What Linus thinks about the new Titan X name...
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/4u7df1/what_linus_thinks_about_new_titan_x_name_lol/

Trying to get the media to band together to call it the Titan XP
https://twitter.com/LinusTech/status/756706943629221888


----------



## magnek

I hope they keep calling it the Titan X, so then we can name the Volta version Titan VX.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I have a theory.
> 
> Volta has been pushed back to 2018 (see the news, see the roadmaps). Because it's been pushed back to 2018, I think they are stretching out Pascal over two years. So we see GP104 and GP102 both with GDDR5X this year. And they hold back GP100 until 2017.
> 
> That way they can release further products next year based on GP100 with HBM2 memory in order to achieve a step up in performance.
> 
> My guess is that we'll get another GP100 / HBM2 based Titan next year and a slightly cut down version of same branded as GTX 1080 Ti. This plan also has the advantage that it gives them extra time to get enough yields of GP100 and enough HBM2 memory.


More like they are ahead of schedule with Volta and have now moved up the release of Pascal cards. Which is why the big chip Titan came only a couple of months after GTX 1080.

This could be Nvidia knowing that HBM2 is getting closer and closer and getting GDDR5X cards aka Geforce Pascal cards out faster than planned is important to get Volta (16nm too) ready.

Wouldnt surprise me that Nvidia release the first Volta card in autumn 2017


----------



## Benny89

Dissapointed as hell it is not HBM2









I hope 1080Ti will be or I won't upgrade...


----------



## Defoler

Name issue or not, if it is 60% faster than the last titan, it will be about 30-40% faster than the 1080?
Kinda similar with the extra core counts, but I have a feeling it will not really be 40% faster.
I guess they will do like maxwell? Bring a new series in 2017 until volta is ready?

Maybe with all the async compute, they decided to take the volta a step back and make sure a big increase in performance for next iteration, since pascal seems to not gain as people are hoping for.


----------



## Randomdude

Is a 6144 core Vega possible on 16nm FINFET? Seeing as how it's my only upgrade path other than Volta, which I believe will be amazing but will come no sooner than 2018.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> More like they are ahead of schedule with Volta and have now moved up the release of Pascal cards. Which is why the big chip Titan came only a couple of months after GTX 1080.
> 
> This could be Nvidia knowing that HBM2 is getting closer and closer and getting GDDR5X cards aka Geforce Pascal cards out faster than planned is important to get Volta (16nm too) ready.
> 
> Wouldn't surprise me that Nvidia release the first Volta card in autumn 2017


At the present moment in time, there is no news or roadmap that indicates that Volta will be any earlier than 2018. But they've taken us by surprise already. Why not again?


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Randomdude*
> 
> Is a 6144 core Vega possible on 16nm FINFET? Seeing as how it's my only upgrade path other than Volta, which I believe will be amazing but will come no sooner than 2018.


That seems possible in 2017 tbh


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benny89*
> 
> Dissapointed as hell it is not HBM2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope 1080Ti will be or I won't upgrade...


you need stop with delusions that 1080Ti will have better specs than Titan X Pascal. it was a one time thing and it's not happening again.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Defoler*
> 
> Name issue or not, if it is 60% faster than the last titan, it will be about 30-40% faster than the 1080?
> Kinda similar with the extra core counts, but I have a feeling it will not really be 40% faster.
> I guess they will do like maxwell? Bring a new series in 2017 until volta is ready?
> 
> Maybe with all the async compute, they decided to take the volta a step back and make sure a big increase in performance for next iteration, since pascal seems to not gain as people are hoping for.


Titan X = 1.5x 980 in terms of chip spec, but in actual games only ended up being 25-35% faster. And this with only a 6.7% boost deficit relative to the 980 on average. (1119 MHz vs 1194 across 9 games) If you look through that Anandtech review, in the two games with the smallest boost clock difference (Crysis 3 and GRID Autosport), Titan X ends up being only ~35% faster even at 4K.

Titan XP = 1.4x 1080 in terms of chip spec (well shader count really since we know nothing about number of TMUs and ROPs), but the official listed boost clock at 1513 MHz is already 12.7% slower than 1080's official boost of 1733 MHz. So there's just no way stock vs stock the Titan XP will end up being 40% faster. As I've said previously, stock vs stock I expect Titan XP to be ~25% faster.


----------



## meson1

I think we should all join in with Linus and start referring to the new Pascal based Titan X as Titan XP. Let's see if we can get everyone calling it that.


----------



## 2002dunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> What percent of the population pays themselves first? The disposable income you speak of tends to be money that should have been saved.
> 
> 
> 
> Quite a few of the Titan owners on these forums are college students


As one of the UK residents on here, I can only observe that saving is pointless when interest rates are 0.5%.

The money I owe is at 0% so why would I pay it off sooner ?

When I can haemorrhage $2000 for one of these instead









dunx

P.S. Given that a Tesla P100 is four times more expensive, don't get too excited about HBM this year....


----------



## magnek

The money you owe is at 0%?!

Damn if I could get loans like that I'd probably be buying up the entire block already.









Or is that a coy way of referring to revolving debt? If so that's cheating dammit.


----------



## bmgjet

This should of really been the 1080ti while the new titan had some where around 3840 cores


----------



## 2002dunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> The money you owe is at 0%?!
> 
> Damn if I could get loans like that I'd probably be buying up the entire block already.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or is that a coy way of referring to revolving debt? If so that's cheating dammit.


No, here in the UK the economy crashed, and if you ask for help..... they help you out, ( too many just quit trying and get bankrupt in the process)
I'm just taking longer to pay off the debt, and in return they charge 0% !

It's a great deal, I can still eat and dream of a new GTX 970...... whilst feeding my bank and its demands for money !

dunx


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bmgjet*
> 
> This should have really been the 1080ti while the new titan had some where around 3840 cores


I'm sure Nvidia have carefully devised a cunning plan to try to double dip everyone that buys a 1080 or Titan XP. You should trust them. They know what they're doing.


----------



## Silent Scone

Hitachi finance ftw.


----------



## JambonJovi

Quote:


> 12B Transistors
> GP102 will feature 40% more CUDA cores than the GP104
> Memory Bandwidth 480 GB/s
> 250 Walts. 1 8-pin and 1 6-pin
> *Price $1,200 USD*


Nvidia fans need to stop complaining about the price. What do ye expect ?!
Somebody needs to pay for Jen-Hsun's leather jackets. They don't come cheap y'know haha


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> you need stop with delusions that 1080Ti will have better specs than Titan X Pascal. it was a one time thing and it's not happening again.


There is no way anyone can be that certain.

Truth is this "Titan X" isn't the full die, so I can see them doing it again for sure. I can't see them releasing a 2nd Titan, as that would be weird. But with the Titan Black during the Kepler generation who knows what Nvidia will do. Still I find it unlikely, since there was far more pressure from AMD back then to warrant a Titan Black.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> Not very different for gaming. HBM2 is lower latency so it is much better for some scientific applications, also a bit better everywhere to be honest. However, HBM2 would be higher bandwidth, even the 12GB 3-stack Tesla has 540GB/sec instead of the Titan XP's 480GB/sec.
> 
> No, not so bad really, I will buy one.


Its only about 25% faster, that is the same gap between 980 and 980 Ti.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noufel*
> 
> The vega arch should be on TSMC process,


should be you mean you want it to be on TSMC or it was confirmed to be on TSMC ? if the latter - source ?


----------



## SirWaWa

is this still a cut down card or fully unlocked?
I miss the days of fully unlocked cards


----------



## Asus11

does this have double precision like the old titans?


----------



## Juub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SirWaWa*
> 
> is this still a cut down card or fully unlocked?
> I miss the days of fully unlocked cards


Cut down.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> does this have double precision like the old titans?


Nope.


----------



## sepiashimmer

Why did they release this at Stanford?


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sepiashimmer*
> 
> Why did they release this at Stanford?


because apparently you'll make your money back on the titan in a evening, well thats what Jen said in the first Titan X release lol


----------



## Noufel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> should be you mean you want it to be on TSMC or it was confirmed to be on TSMC ? if the latter - source ?


nah it isn't confirmed GloFo neither TsMC, but i hope it will be on TSMC


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Hope to get this day one.

Was content on the GTX 1080, but this release is way too soon to keep it.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> Unfortunately in a monopoly (which is what we have here because AMD is no competitor) that's not exactly how it works. Price elasticity changes to almost 0 when you have a monopoly for a product.
> 
> Basically no matter how much the price changes demand will stay the same, because we HAVE NO OTHER CHOICE. In the High end market there is no other choice and you can tell by the price changes over the last 3 generations of cards. I have 3 systems in my room alone. I can AFFORD a 1080, 1070, and a Titan, but I won't dare give them a penny at this point. They're doing exactly what a monopoly does and raising prices to increase profits to the maximum potential. It is awful for a consumer.


I agree and my position/attitude is similar to yours.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Omicron*
> 
> 
> GTX 1040 - $125 - Nerfed or Full GP106
> GTX 1050 - $175 - Full GP106, or Nerfed GP104
> GTX 1060 - $250 - Full GP104
> GTX 1070 - $350 - Nerfed GP100, GDDR5X
> GTX 1080 - $550 - Full GP100, GDDR5X or HBM2
> GTX Titan - $850 - Full GP100, HBM2, Full Half and Double Precision Compute, 2 x Memory of GTX1080


Come back to realty.







GTX 1080 Full GP100 for $550... Alrighty then...


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ramzinho*
> 
> Nvidia pricing is getting out of control imo. like although Intel dominates the market they are keeping their prices within consumer's grasp. like intel adds 10-30$ a year for each cpu except of course the -E lineup which are epeen dedicated. but nvidia throwing 100$ to 150$ raise on each gpu every generation is just absurd. of course they provide great products and performance but the pricing is just plain abusive to consumers.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> Why would the street price after 2 weeks be $1600? i thought it supposed to be lower since it came out? Why would the price gets higher?
> 
> 
> 
> Because unless you spend the entire day running scripts, refreshing sites, etc and getting the first stock within seconds... they will be bought up and resold at higher prices by....... jerks. Happens every GPU release, happening with the 1080 right now.
> 
> I don't think the Titan lineup is affected by it as much, simply due to the fact it's a huge initial investment to buy something for $1200 than resell it for $1400ish. That and the fact the cards won't fly off the shelves at that price.
Click to expand...

Maybe, maybe not?

This time around, it's all sold by Nvidia's online shop and perhaps they'll allow you to backorder the item since they've got 100% control of distribution, they're the only ones to eventually have product anyway.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

So the last Titan X was named like that for "Titan MaXwell", could the new Titan X suggest "Titan 10", or Titan 10 series? Next generation will be Titan XI?


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> So the last Titan X was named like that for "Titan MaXwell", could the new Titan X suggest "Titan 10", or Titan 10 series? Next generation will be Titan XI?


It could be or it could be not.

Either way we are on a path on out of control pricing for high end segment.


----------



## jezzer

Guess its time to sell your old Titan X for the jackpot on ebay when this comes out.


----------



## Sheyster

I've been re-thinking the purchase of this card. If they can OC to 2000 MHz, I'm probably in for one. I would prefer that over 2 x 1080 to be honest. Just sayin'...









Not losing MFAA capability (which you do in SLI) is a factor in the decision for me.


----------



## SamuraiGuns

They (nVidia) were going to back themselves in a branding corner with the Titan line eventually because they never used proper subnames like nVidia Titan Eos or Titan Gaia. I have a thing for consistent naming schemes and this isn't it.

Also, on the pricing bit, luxury items are priced according to what the mass consumer market are willing to pay according to the rise in their discretionary income. Gaming as a business has seen a Y-o-Y profit increase and nVidia is pricing themselves to take advantage of ALL tiers.

I do not have a problem if they make the Titan line really expensive because it is a product meant to serve those who have the money and seek the performance at any and every cost. My issue with nVidia's pricing is that the Titan line has the effect of raising prices of the cards below it since Kepler (this could be on purpose it or could be coincidental).

In any way gaming is a luxury and I buy what I can afford and the GTX 1060 (non-founders) and RX 480 (non-reference) are absolutely amazing value for money.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SamuraiGuns*
> 
> They (nVidia) were going to back themselves in a branding corner with the Titan line eventually because they never used proper subnames like nVidia Titan Eos or Titan Gaia. I have a thing for consistent naming schemes and this isn't it.
> 
> Also, on the pricing bit, luxury items are priced according to what the mass consumer market are willing to pay according to the rise in their discretionary income. Gaming as a business has seen a Y-o-Y profit increase and nVidia is pricing themselves to take advantage of ALL tiers.
> 
> I do not have a problem if they make the Titan line really expensive because it is a product meant to serve those who have the money and seek the performance at any and every cost. My issue with nVidia's pricing is that the Titan line has the effect of raising prices of the cards below it since Kepler (this could be on purpose it or could be coincidental).
> 
> In any way gaming is a luxury and I buy what I can afford and the GTX 1060 (non-founders) and RX 480 (non-reference) are absolutely amazing value for money.


Agreed. Good post. I think that is one of the main concerns with the Titan pricing. The Titan pricing will always be steep, it is a subset of a subset, quite a niche market. The real issue is when mid-range and other products below that niche increase in price as well.

Hopefully, some value remains at that end. For myself, and some other enthusiasts, it is more fun to buy value cards and extract performance/$ than to just buy a niche product. It's not that I don't have the means, it is just a different preference of fun.


----------



## jezzer

Sooooo 1080 Ti will be 999 this time? LoL


----------



## keikei

Nvidia aint playing anymore. You want the king prince of perfomance every gpu cylce, well, they're asking for the equivalent ransom. Full/near full chip is now over $1000. #PCMASTERRACE.


----------



## Cyclops

As long as *suckers* are willing to pay 1200 dollars for a desktop graphics card, Nvidia will keep raising prices. The consumers are feeding this habit, synergizing Nvidias marketing strategy.


----------



## fat4l

For the same price of 1200$ you can get 2x 1080, giving you 50% more performance over 1 Titan Xp. ^^


----------



## szeged

when is titan vista coming out?


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fat4l*
> 
> For the same price of 1200$ you can get 2x 1080, giving you 50% more performance over 1 Titan Xp. ^^


And like I said, you lose MFAA support with SLI. With the current state of SLI and DX12, one card is the smarter choice, and is cheaper and more power efficient than 2 x 1080. If you can't see that, then do some research and come back to comment.

The big question now is how well will the Titan XP OC?


----------



## szeged

i just want to know if the OG titan x waterblocks will fit the new titan x


----------



## BillOhio

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> No point on getting 980 Tis considering DX12/Vulkan.


Win 10 screwed up the drivers on my Cintiq. Maybe/probably(?) somebody more savvy could have resolved my issue but I never got it figured out. I expect that I'll be on Win 8 and DX11 for a while. :shrugz:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> when is titan vista coming out?


...probably a week after Titan XP :/


----------



## TheBlindDeafMute

Must mean the 1080ti is going to be expensive. They will now release the 1080ti and it will look like a bargain.


----------



## Omicron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> I agree and my position/attitude is similar to yours.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Come back to realty.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GTX 1080 Full GP100 for $550... Alrighty then...


Yeah, just like GF110, the GTX 580. The way it should be.

I'll accept a partial core cut down first generation with this process though for a few reasons.

The first is that this is a new process, and they need to mature it. GF100 was a cut core and was totally to be expected as a first major launch 40nm product. This "Titan" would make a good GTX 1080 for the $550 range, and I would also expect a fully enabled GP100 GTX 1180 to come some time afterwards.

The second is that engineering and ensuring more cores on dies is indeed getting more complex. I'm completely sure that with the same die size, a fully enabled 40nm part is significantly less hard to make compared to a fully enabled 16nm part.

However, these factors do not a $1200 Titan make. And while idealistic, I'm still sticking to the chart I made earlier


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BillOhio*
> 
> Win 10 screwed up the drivers on my Cintiq. Maybe/probably(?) somebody more savvy could have resolved my issue but I never got it figured out. I expect that I'll be on Win 8 and DX11 for a while. :shrugz:
> ...probably a week after Titan XP :/


Vulkan doesn't need Win10.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Omicron*
> 
> And while idealistic, I'm still sticking to the chart I made earlier


That's not idealism, it's straight-up FantasyLand!


----------



## renejr902

Thanks guys for previous answers its so much appreciated.

People will be confuse, Titan XP.. Is it for Windows XP ?


----------



## renejr902

To be honest i think i will buy the Titan XP, but nvidia dont deserve it, 1200$ is too much for that.. But 1080 is not enough for me at 4k, and i dont want to wait for a better card.

Seriously how much time i will be waiting if i wait for a FASTER card than Titan XP with hbm2 ??? And i dont want to pay more than 1200$ , thats already enough. My limit was 1100$ for a gpu , but i will make a exception at 1200$, but not more. Like i said this card dont worth 1200$ , nvidia are unfair with their customers, but i have no other option, i dont want to go sli


----------



## provost

I am just entertaining myself by watching how Nvidia's approach to building a mousetrap works out this time around... please carry on.. Lol


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *provost*
> 
> I am just entertaining myself by watching how Nvidia's approach to building a mousetrap works out this time around... please carry on.. Lol


LOL, dat cheese smell is just too strong!







Someone should come up with a Titan XP mousetrap meme.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *provost*
> 
> I am just entertaining myself by watching how Nvidia's approach to building a mousetrap works out this time around... please carry on.. Lol


I quite love my 1070 SLI mousetrap.


----------



## Asus11




----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Hope to get this day one.
> 
> Was content on the GTX 1080, but this release is way too soon to keep it.


Good move, it will be Titan PX or bust for benching til MAYBE a "Ti"/Vega comes along....


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> All of these financial advisors in here, some with $200 keyboards and $1000 water loops, etc., etc. lol


I hear keyboards and water loops depreciate substantially over time. In fact, they become irrelevant every few years and need to be replaced :rolleyes :


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> I hear keyboards and water loops depreciate substantially over time. In fact, they become irrelevant every few years and need to be replaced :rolleyes :


Lol, you are late to lunch...







they have cards from both AMD and nVIDIA at every price range, pick one and have fun..


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Lol, you are late to lunch...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> they have cards from both AMD and nVIDIA at every price range, pick one and have fun..


nah I rather I argue with you online about what I might buy in the future.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> nah I rather I argue with you online about what I might buy in the future.


If the Titan was the ONLY chip that nVIDIA released every Year, at these prices, I could understand the price argument, but, since there are so many choices/prices...I couldn't afford to pay $1700 for the 6950x, I wanted it bad, but, I would have had to make some sacrifices..I am not even upset at anyone...even though I am jelly of those who do have them...


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> nah I rather I argue with you online about what I might buy in the future.
> 
> 
> 
> If the Titan was the ONLY chip that nVIDIA released every Year, at these prices, I could understand the price argument, but, since there are so many choices/prices...I couldn't afford to pay $1700 for the 6950x, I wanted it bad, but, I would have had to make some sacrifices..I am not even upset at anyone...even though I am jelly of those who do have them...
Click to expand...

oh rly? choices?

$200 (480), $250 (480w/8Gb 1060 w/3Gb) $300 (1060 w/6Gb) $450 (1070) $700 (1080) or $1,200

well 6 is more than a handful. however, looking at maxwell and prior for both nvidia and AMD, these releases are anemic by comparison.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> If the Titan was the ONLY chip that nVIDIA released every Year, at these prices, I could understand the price argument, but, since there are so many choices/prices...I couldn't afford to pay $1700 for the 6950x, I wanted it bad, but, I would have had to make some sacrifices..I am not even upset at anyone...


Wanting competition and speaking out against monopolistic price hikes is now akin to being upset? AMD isn't competing against Nvidia and Intel on the high end. In fact, less than half of AMDs revenue now comes from their computer and graphics division. This means that the high end enthusiast niche is free for Nvidia and Intel to milk as they please. Hence the 70% premium on the flagship Extreme Edition processor compared the generation prior and a 20% price premium on Titan from the previous generation.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> oh rly? choices?
> 
> $200 (480), $250 (480w/8Gb 1060 w/3Gb) $300 (1060 w/6Gb) $450 (1070) $700 (1080) or $1,200
> 
> well 6 is more than a handful. however, looking at maxwell and prior for both nvidia and AMD, these releases are anemic by comparison.


Does this actually reflect real world market prices?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Wanting competition and speaking out against monopolistic price hikes is now akin to being upset? AMD isn't competing against Nvidia and Intel on the high end. In fact, less than half of AMDs revenue now comes from their computer and graphics division. This means that the high end enthusiast niche is free for Nvidia and Intel to milk as they please. Hence the 70% premium on the flagship Extreme Edition processor compared the generation prior and a 20% price premium on Titan from the previous generation.


Actually, yes. And you and others on the forums are very aggressive about it.


----------



## keikei

I dont understand how some members are OK with this price gouging. Even if I were able to afford this and held Nvidia stock, its not ethical to charge these prices. Business is business right? So, eithics dont matter. We can charge the plebs whatever we want.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> oh rly? choices?
> 
> $200 (480), $250 (480w/8Gb 1060 w/3Gb) $300 (1060 w/6Gb) $450 (1070) $700 (1080) or $1,200
> 
> well 6 is more than a handful. however, looking at maxwell and prior for both nvidia and AMD, _these releases are anemic by comparison_.


Its a different game now. The stakes greed are so high for both companies that every single card has to make the most profit possible and the only way to do this is to portion them out.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> I dont understand how some members are OK with this price gouging. Even if I were able to afford this and held Nvidia stock, its not ethical to charge these prices. Business is business right? So, eithics dont matter. We can charge the plebs whatever we want.
> Its a different game now. The stakes greed are so high for both companies that every single card has to make the most profit possible and the only way to do this is to portion them out.


I won't be buying one, I don't think. Even the 1080GTX is sat here in the UK with some stockists at £679. Doubt enough people will ever put a foot down, though. This will be a limited run, and they will all sell. No question.


----------



## ChevChelios

Lirik is upgrading to 2 of these in August









he is preparing for the (eventual) release of that 4K @ 144 Hz Asus monitor though .. plus he's made of money


----------



## mypickaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> I dont understand how some members are OK with this price gouging. Even if I were able to afford this and held Nvidia stock, its not ethical to charge these prices. Business is business right? So, eithics dont matter. We can charge the plebs whatever we want.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> oh rly? choices?
> 
> $200 (480), $250 (480w/8Gb 1060 w/3Gb) $300 (1060 w/6Gb) $450 (1070) $700 (1080) or $1,200
> 
> well 6 is more than a handful. however, looking at maxwell and prior for both nvidia and AMD, _these releases are anemic by comparison_.
> 
> 
> 
> Its a different game now. The stakes greed are so high for both companies that every single card has to make the most profit possible and the only way to do this is to portion them out.
Click to expand...

Again, no one is making any customer purchase this GPU. If you want the best, this is it. It's not being marketed to gamers or even enthusiasts.

There won't be *any* in the channel (at least not as far as we know,) Nvidia isn't sending these out to the typical review sites in advance (at least not yet, as far as we know) and they are basically "refreshing" their line and making up for what they view as "lost revenue" after taking so long to transition from 28nm to 16nm (considering 20nm was a complete flop - but *not* a "free" event.)

This is what I consider "passing the cost onto the consumer."

Demand is up, therefore price goes up. It is quite a bit of supply and demand economics at play here, as well as a lack of competitive products at the high-end from AMD.

Enthusiasts buying these cards does nothing to lower the price. It only raises it, as they are competing with prosumers and professionals looking to use these for compute versus just a bit of willy-waving on the forums and LAN events.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> Demand is up, therefore price goes up.


Seriously?











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mypickaxe*
> 
> It is quite a bit of supply and demand economics at play here, as well as a lack of competitive products at the high-end from AMD.


You don't seem to have a very good grasp on economics so refrain from explaining to others


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> oh rly? choices?
> 
> $200 (480), $250 (480w/8Gb 1060 w/3Gb) $300 (1060 w/6Gb) $450 (1070) $700 (1080) or $1,200
> 
> well 6 is more than a handful. however, looking at maxwell and prior for both nvidia and AMD, these releases are anemic by comparison.
> 
> 
> 
> Does this actually reflect real world market prices?
Click to expand...

i just used what available prices i've seen off the top of my head.

and after posting that i considered resolutions:

1080p would be either a $200 480 w/small chance a AAA game will max the vram buffer (but tbh, probably won't happen) or $250 and get the 8Gb. one could also look at the $250 1060 but take a slightly larger chance on the vram buffer or spend $300 on a 1060 6Gb and be GTG.

so taking no chances either $250 for a 480 8Gb or $300 for a 6Gb 1060.

1440p is either the $450 1070 or $700 1080. the 1070 is a great 1440p card but will it max out ALL AAA games in the near (~year) future? probably but if one wants to be sure . .well the $700 1080 is the choice, unless one would 480 CF (in supported games) for $500.

so taking no chance _for future gaming_ you're looking at $700

4k is either SLI the 1070 for $900 (cheapest but taking a chance at game support/scaling) or going for the titanXP @ $1,200

so taking no chances . .$1,200

*granted the conditions i laid out are for maximum IQ for those that want it*


----------



## l88bastar

$1,200 is cheap. Very cheap!


----------



## degenn

Well that was an entertaining, if not entirely predictable, 100 pages....

I would have no problem with the $1200 price if the PC gaming industry wasn't such a joke. $1200 to play a bunch of console ports @ 4k60... sigh, gamers...


----------



## Benny89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> you need stop with delusions that 1080Ti will have better specs than Titan X Pascal. it was a one time thing and it's not happening again.


If it happened once, it can happen again. You you have no idea as much as I don't. We will wait and see.

Besides, NVIDIA can do ANYTHING. They own market now.

And what ever BS they do, whatever hight price will call- there will be always those who can't resist hype. Sadly- but true.


----------



## Celcius

Just found this out, maybe it should be added to the OP:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd

"Meanwhile for distribution, making a departure from previous generations, the card is only being sold directly by NVIDIA through their website. The company's board partners will not be distributing it, though system builders will still be able to include it."

This time around EVGA, ASUS, and others won't be selling it at all.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fat4l*
> 
> For the same price of 1200$ you can get 2x 1080, giving you 50% more performance over 1 Titan Xp. ^^


SLI is not working in VR, so for those of us with Vives or Rifts it's useless.

Unfortunately, Nvidia knows this, and I'm convinced it's something that's being overlooked in this thread as a means for them driving the price up on the Titan like they are.

At this moment, the Titan X is really the only choice for VR users who want to downsample their games to get a clearer picture. It's the only card out that will have enough muscle for it. My 1080 is getting killed in VR at the moment, because to minimize the blur or fog in VR games, especially for distance objects, you really need to be pushing 4500x or more at all times.


----------



## Defoler

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Juub*
> 
> Cut down.
> Nope.


It is not a cut down. It is a different GPU from the GP100.
The GP100 has 3584 cores, the same as the GP102. So you can basically say it is the full pascal, if GP100 is the full one as well.

The difference is that the GP100 cores are set in TPC groups, which is meant for texture/processing, while the GP102 are set for ROP groups.


----------



## inedenimadam

Boy I hope AMD smashes back before the end of the year, I just dont know if i can stomach the price tag on Nvidia cards, but AMD has not given me an upgrade path at all.

If AMD doesnt step up to the plate by xmas I will probably re-evaluate my need for IQ, sell my 4k TV, go back to 1080p gaming, and keep my 980s. Heck, I cant tell the difference with my glasses off anyway.

Dang it NVidia..your cards are great but your price sucks!

Dang it AMD..your prices are great, but your cards are NOT enthusiast grade.

I am not a fanboi, I hate both sides equally right now.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't seem to have a very good grasp on economics so refrain from explaining to others


mypickaxe is right, though: monopolies drive higher prices. That's exactly what your chart shows, haha. What exactly are you disagreeing with?

Why don't you share the next slide...which is a lot easier to understand than that graph which most students passing Econ 101 won't be able to explain well enough to anybody.


----------



## Defoler

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> SLI is not working in VR, so for those of us with VIves or Rifts it's useless.
> 
> Unfortunately, Nvidia knows this, and I'm convinced it's something that's being overlooked in this thread as a means for them driving the price up on the Titan like they are.
> 
> At this moment, the Titan X is really the only choice for VR users who want to downsample their games to get a clearer picture. It's the only card out that will have enough muscle for it. My 1080 is getting killed in VR at the moment.


SLI (and crossfire for that matter), requires specific coding. VR-SLI has been out since almost day one since the API came out, as well as the Liquid VR API, requires that game engines develop in a specific way in order to allow SLI or CFX for VR, because that the copy of frames from one GPU to the other adds latency, which causes a lot of issues with current VR headsets.

This is not something that nvidia can magically fix. Game engine developers actually have to fix it by themselves. The API is already out, but most just don't use it. So for that reason, SLI is disabled using VR, and if I'm not mistaken so with AMD (you can force it, but it can cause latency issues).


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Defoler*
> 
> SLI (and crossfire for that matter), requires specific coding. VR-SLI has been out since almost day one since the API came out, as well as the Liquid VR API, requires that game engines develop in a specific way in order to allow SLI or CFX for VR, because that the copy of frames from one GPU to the other adds latency, which causes a lot of issues with current VR headsets.
> 
> This is not something that nvidia can magically fix. Game engine developers actually have to fix it by themselves. The API is already out, but most just don't use it. So for that reason, SLI is disabled using VR, and if I'm not mistaken so with AMD (you can force it, but it can cause latency issues).


Yes, I understand all that. My point wasn't to denigrate Nvidia for the SLI issue; I really couldn't care less why it isn't working. The only concern I have is that it's not and is not an option for me or other VR users right now.

And my conclusion is -- since Nvidia knows it's not working, then the demand follows for the strongest single GPU available to VR users ==> thus the price hike.

I also realize that more outside of just VR users will fall into that category of wanting the 'single strongest GPU available', but it's absolutely critical to the VR market right now since all hardware is severely underpowered for VR's graphical requirements.

I can't see the majority of game developers implementing SLI in the future, either, since the minority will own 2 or more GPUs. Its outlook looks bleak to me at the moment.


----------



## sage101

Beastly card @ a beastly price. I think people who don't want to spend $1200 on a card right now should just wait a couple months, most likely nvidia would release the 1080Ti @ a price range of $799.99 to $899.99 and should perform very close to the new titan x.


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Boy I hope AMD smashes back before the end of the year, I just dont know if i can stomach the price tag on Nvidia cards, but AMD has not given me an upgrade path at all.
> 
> If AMD doesnt step up to the plate by xmas I will probably re-evaluate my need for IQ, sell my 4k TV, go back to 1080p gaming, and keep my 980s. Heck, I cant tell the difference with my glasses off anyway.
> 
> Dang it NVidia..your cards are great but your price sucks!
> 
> Dang it AMD..your prices are great, but your cards are NOT enthusiast grade.
> 
> I am not a fanboi, I hate both sides equally right now.


You know... you can't order a soup and would want to eat a steaks... You get what your paying for.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> If the Titan was the ONLY chip that nVIDIA released every Year, at these prices, I could understand the price argument, but, since there are so many choices/prices...I couldn't afford to pay $1700 for the 6950x, I wanted it bad, but, I would have had to make some sacrifices..I am not even upset at anyone...even though I am jelly of those who do have them...


Dude you have a 5960X @ 4.7. The 6950X will be a sidegrade at best, and if you get unlucky and get one that overclocks poorly (BW-E isn't exactly the best overclocker), it might even end up being a marginal downgrade.

Much better off waiting for Skylake-E. At least there'll be some semi-meaningful IPC gains.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NikolayNeykov*
> 
> You know... you can't order a soup and would want to eat a steaks... You get what your paying for.


But if I order a steak from a 3 Michelin star restaurant, I would expect it to come with all the usual sides and garnishes and beyond, not just a barebones steak where they charge extra for the steak sauce.


----------



## Silent Scone

If I had a penny every time I read a post telling someone to wait for the next-best thing.


----------



## zealord

https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/07/21/titan-x/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+nvidiablog+%28The+NVIDIA+Blog%29
Quote:


> It began with a bet.
> 
> Brian Kelleher, our top hardware engineer, bet our CEO, Jen-Hsun Huang, we could get more than 10 teraflops of computing performance from a single chip. Jen-Hsun thought that was crazy.
> 
> Well, we did it. The result is crazy. And, as of today, Jen-Hsun now owes Brian a dollar.
> 
> The new NVIDIA TITAN X, introduced today, based on our new Pascal GPU architecture, is the biggest GPU ever built. It has a record-breaking 3,584 CUDA cores.
> 
> We said our GTX 1080 delivers an "irresponsible amount of performance." It was a bit reckless. But this is even more reckless.


Oh god that self-adulation is so pathetic and cringe worthy.

Nvidia is surprised they managed to get more performance. ..


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> If I had a penny every time I read a post telling someone to wait for the next-best thing.












He already said he's skipping the 6950X, and I'm simply reaffirming that IMO is not a bad decision, and laid out my reasoning for it. I didn't simply go "hurr durr wayt fur Skylake-E durr".

A 6950X @ 4.2 will certainly lose to a 5960X @ 4.7 in single threaded applications. Probably will still beat it in a multi-threaded scenario but then that's not a clear win is it. Hence "marginal downgrade" comment.


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NikolayNeykov*
> 
> You know... you can't order a soup and would want to eat a steaks... _You get what your paying for_.


Actually, we're not. The RX 480 cost $200. Assume that this Titan is 3x (highly unlikely) the performance of the 480, it should be $600 by your logic. Nvidia is asking $1200 (6x) the value of the 480.


----------



## Defoler

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> And my conclusion is -- since Nvidia knows it's not working, then the demand follows for the strongest single GPU available to VR users ==> thus the price hike.


Even outside of VR there is always demand for more graphics power. It will never stop.
Monitors get higher resolution, or higher hz, games requirement sky rocket to get more realism, things always progress, so there need for the best if you are unwilling to compromise, will never change.
Even if the gtx 1080 was enough for VR at 90hz, tomorrow a game will bring so much more graphics quality for ultra realism rendering, that it will require twice the power of the 1080, and the next one will make you feel like that is the real world with twice the resolution and higher hz and higher IQ, and again, stronger GPU.

Who remembers now that to play crysis at 60fps at max details even at 1080p, took almost 3 years until graphics wise the top GPU was strong enough?

I don't see it as a major bit problem. Early adapters will always have to pay the higher price. Early 4K monitor adapters were willing to pay 3000$ for what you can buy for under 500$ now. People used to be willing to pay 2000$ for 4-way SLI too run 1080p surround/eyefinity, when today they can get two GPUs and a 21:9 wide screen monitor and have some spare change.

I don't see it as a bit major problem. Prices go up for the top requirement. That market space is well, small, very small, in comparison to the majority of the market. And for the majority of the market, the price is much more sane.
While the original titan came out 3 years ago at 1000$ and people rushed to get it so they can play their games at max settings and all, now you get a better performing card for 200$.

Just like TV market. It takes years for technology to catch up to its previous top. It cost more to produce the first high end items, and over time the price reduced as they move all manufacturing to it, so the previous top end becomes the norm, and new top ends comes around.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Defoler*
> 
> Even outside of VR there is always demand for more graphics power. It will never stop.
> Monitors get higher resolution, or higher hz, games requirement sky rocket to get more realism, things always progress, so there need for the best if you are unwilling to compromise, will never change.
> Even if the gtx 1080 was enough for VR at 90hz, tomorrow a game will bring so much more graphics quality for ultra realism rendering, that it will require twice the power of the 1080, and the next one will make you feel like that is the real world with twice the resolution and higher hz and higher IQ, and again, stronger GPU.
> 
> Who remembers now that to play crysis at 60fps at max details even at 1080p, took almost 3 years until graphics wise the top GPU was strong enough?
> 
> I don't see it as a major bit problem. Early adapters will always have to pay the higher price. Early 4K monitor adapters were willing to pay 3000$ for what you can buy for under 500$ now. People used to be willing to pay 2000$ for 4-way SLI too run 1080p surround/eyefinity, when today they can get two GPUs and a 21:9 wide screen monitor and have some spare change.
> 
> I don't see it as a bit major problem. Prices go up for the top requirement. That market space is well, small, very small, in comparison to the majority of the market. And for the majority of the market, the price is much more sane.
> While the original titan came out 3 years ago at 1000$ and people rushed to get it so they can play their games at max settings and all, now you get a better performing card for 200$.
> 
> Just like TV market. It takes years for technology to catch up to its previous top. It cost more to produce the first high end items, and over time the price reduced as they move all manufacturing to it, so the previous top end becomes the norm, and new top ends comes around.


I'm not talking about 'max details'. Some games on the VR market right now (Raw Data comes to mind) are _unplayable_ with current hardware at low settings. I think you're underestimating the leap forward in graphics power that is required for it as compared to 4k televisions or other stuff that's out there right now.

I went through the whole Crysis thing. From the start, I was able to play it with current-gen hardware though I had to turn the settings way down.

VR is different. If you cannot see 5 feet in front of you due to blur from low resolution settings, then you cannot play some of the games that are out there. Especially FPSs which require you to be able to see off into the distance.

If images are ghosting due to reprojection from not being able to hold 90Hz, and you get noticeable lag when turning, even at low settings, then the game becomes unplayable due to motion sickness and loss of control optimization.

Yes, there will always be a need for stronger hardware. The issue right now is that there is hardware that can run most 2D games just fine, including the option of SLI, at all 2D resolutions. That is not the case w/ VR right now, and I see this sudden price hike at the high end as too coincidental given the inability of VR to leverage SLI properly and its current state with underpowered hardware.. along with the forementioned release of consumer devices for VR just a few months ago.


----------



## Tideman

So is it true that this will only be available on the nvidia store at launch? They don't ship to my country but if EVGA get them in then I'll be good.

Sold my 1080s. Don't want another disaster like the 1080 launch here in europe..


----------



## iLeakStuff

The problem is guys, that the professional market completely overshadow the gamers willing to dish out $999 max for a GPU. So Nvidia of course sell the card at $1200.

Its so funny watching people write "just wait til Vega". Thats the whole issue. Waiting. For something that incompetent AMD company cant deliver at this time. So Nvidia runs the ship. No competition. Charge whatever people are willing to pay. Same about the GTX 1080. You can bet that Nvidia knew AMD have fallen behind with high end. So they made plan accordingly

You can bet your house that Nvidia is holding 1080Ti back until Vega is getting close. And thats not happening until 2017 sometime...


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sage101*
> 
> Beastly card @ a beastly price. I think people who don't want to spend $1200 on a card right now should just wait a couple months, most likely nvidia would release the 1080Ti @ a price range of $799.99 to $899.99 and should perform very close to the new titan x.


sad thing is as much as i am complaining about the price and people throwing money at it; yeah a nice AIB 1080TI for ~$825 and i am grabbing one.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> I can't believe they're going to call it Titan X again, at least add a 2 or something.


it seems like they take the speculation article and just dont change the name of the card to keep the free marketing.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SlackerITGuy*
> 
> So no HBM2?


it even isnt the full GPU Die with 3840SP, not even the flagship GP100
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Personally waiting for HBM2 cards.


then AMD card


----------



## Assirra

Why would you name your new product exactly the same as your old?
Have we not seen time and time again that is a really dumb idea?


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Defoler*
> 
> It is not a cut down. It is a different GPU from the GP100.
> The GP100 has 3584 cores, the same as the GP102. So you can basically say it is the full pascal, if GP100 is the full one as well.
> 
> The difference is that the GP100 cores are set in TPC groups, which is meant for texture/processing, while the GP102 are set for ROP groups.


This is true.

https://images.nvidia.com/content/pdf/tesla/whitepaper/pascal-architecture-whitepaper.pdf

If that is the case, the only measure by which this is "cut-down" is through the use of GDDR5X, which is fine for the purpose of gaming.

The problem is that, because there is no HBM-on-die manufacturing, there is no need for excess charge.

The explanation for the price is not the process, because it is a cheap manufacturing process with relation to the HBM process - it is the "halo" product.

Suffice to say, regardless of the choices they made, you are not getting the "top notch" total product, just a "Big Pascal" die saved from the hells of HBM manufacturing.

And, on a limited PCB and power delivery vehicle at that.


----------



## joll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tideman*
> 
> So is it true that this will only be available on the nvidia store at launch? They don't ship to my country but if EVGA get them in then I'll be good.
> 
> Sold my 1080s. Don't want another disaster like the 1080 launch here in europe..


I don't think EVGA will be selling them immediately. Scroll through this thread to see EVGA's reponse: http://forums.evga.com/JenHsun-introduces-the-new-NVIDIA-TITANX-Pascal-m2517857-p3.aspx


----------



## xioros

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> The problem is guys, that the professional market completely overshadow the gamers willing to dish out $999 max for a GPU. So Nvidia of course sell the card at $1200.
> 
> Its so funny watching people write "just wait til Vega". Thats the whole issue. Waiting. For something that incompetent AMD company cant deliver at this time. So Nvidia runs the ship. No competition. Charge whatever people are willing to pay. Same about the GTX 1080. You can bet that Nvidia knew AMD have fallen behind with high end. So they made plan accordingly
> 
> You can bet your house that Nvidia is holding 1080Ti back until Vega is getting close. And thats not happening until 2017 sometime...


So the wisest thing would to hold your cash and not give into Nvidia and just be patient for Vega?


----------



## dmasteR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *joll*
> 
> I don't think EVGA will be selling them immediately. Scroll through this thread to see EVGA's reponse: http://forums.evga.com/JenHsun-introduces-the-new-NVIDIA-TITANX-Pascal-m2517857-p3.aspx


Quote:


> 1. The new TITAN X will only be NVIDIA only and only available from NVIDIA.com.


For those that were too lazy to find it.


----------



## jezzer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NikolayNeykov*
> 
> You know... you can't order a soup and would want to eat a steaks... You get what your paying for.


what about sellings steaks for the price of the whole cow lol


----------



## xentrox

Not hell bent over getting this at the moment, still think there will be a 1080Ti before we see Vega. With my current 980Ti, sure @ 1440p I could use more horsepower, but I think we can do better


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> Actually, we're not. The RX 480 cost $200. Assume that this Titan is 3x (highly unlikely) the performance of the 480, it should be $600 by your logic. Nvidia is asking $1200 (6x) the value of the 480.


And who is saying that nvidia is the cheap restoraunt? When there is no alternative and people enjoy it you don't really have any word on it... no one cares, that's the problem.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xioros*
> 
> So the wisest thing would to hold your cash and not give into Nvidia and just be patient for Vega?


Yes. If you have the patience and can wait out, that will be the best option. A problem could be that if the 1080Ti and Vega competitor launch around summer, you might as well wait til Volta in 2018....


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He already said he's skipping the 6950X, and I'm simply reaffirming that IMO is not a bad decision, and laid out my reasoning for it. I didn't simply go "hurr durr wayt fur Skylake-E durr".
> 
> A 6950X @ 4.2 will certainly lose to a 5960X @ 4.7 in single threaded applications. Probably will still beat it in a multi-threaded scenario but then that's not a clear win is it. Hence "marginal downgrade" comment.


Lol, you must be confused, the 6950x is a 10 core chip. it is definitely an upgrade, if you need the cores.....i only "skipped it.." because I couldn't come up with the loot. my old 5960x did 4.5 @1.30 volts, my new one does 4.7 @1.30 volts....I can most likely bring those voltages down, once I really start messing with it.. my single core score in Cinebench is 192.. .


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Yes. If you have the patience and can wait out, that will be the best option. A problem could be that if the 1080Ti and Vega competitor launch around summer, you might as well wait til Volta in 2018....


Ofc that is what i am going to do my 980 ti G1 1500 / 8000 mhz is enough for me. In the end of 2017 or in the beginning of 2018 i might look what cards are out then


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Defoler*
> 
> It is not a cut down. It is a different GPU from the GP100.
> The GP100 has 3584 cores, the same as the GP102. So you can basically say it is the full pascal, if GP100 is the full one as well.
> 
> The difference is that the GP100 cores are set in TPC groups, which is meant for texture/processing, while the GP102 are set for ROP groups.


Is it possible for nvidia to do a 5376 core video card with die at 610mm.
If they exchange all 1792 core dp for sp , so 1792+3584 = 5376. Is it possible to see in future a full die at 610mm with 5376 Single precision core units ?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Is it possible to see in future a full die at 610mm with 5376 Single precision core units ?


nope

and I dont think its possible to see a 6144 shaders 600+ mm2 Vega either


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NikolayNeykov*
> 
> Ofc that is what i am going to do my 980 ti G1 1500 / 8000 mhz is enough for me. In the end of 2017 or in the beginning of 2018 i might look what cards are out then


Not a bad choice if that 980Ti provide enoughperformance for your resolution. Atleast you can think back about how great value the 980Ti delivered if it survives til 2018.


----------



## NikolayNeykov

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Not a bad choice if that 980Ti provide enoughperformance for your resolution. Atleast you can think back about how great value the 980Ti delivered if it survives til 2018.


Yep, it was expensive card and i will use it worthly, untill there is a real GPU upgrade choices, i am not a boy that can't live without 1 or 2 year of serious gaming, hell there is no new worthy games, let them come out and i will see them after some time out, untill then dota 2 works flawless, and i don't really have time for anything else atm.







I need money, not GPU'S


----------



## stangflyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xioros*
> 
> So the wisest thing would to hold your cash and not give into Nvidia and just be patient for Vega?


The wise thing would of been for people not to have paid $700 for a midrange GPU like the 1080. Card should of been $500 max. The 980 should have been $450. Entirely too many people buying based on performance and not even considering where in the product stack this comes in at.

Yea Yea I know that it is the flagship at "that point in time"

Nvidia is not stupid, but in a way the customers are setting the prices or at least not helping themselves. The 1080 is still sold out most of the time. We had people selling 980ti's for $350-$450 on Ebay and Craigslist to pay $675-$700 for a 15-20% improvement on the 1080. Nvidia sees this and realizes that they can price where they want. Does not help with no competition from AMD in this segment. I kept my 980ti hybrid because it clocks to 1550 and there was no way I was going to pay almost $700 for a midsize chip card. I understand that performance should not be the only criteria for the pricing of the GPU.

Now the problem is if Vega does not hit a homerun I worry that the 1080ti will be priced at $850-$900. This new card might be the actual TI in itself. (







pricing wise).Hopefully Vega does well and it forces the 1080 to drop to $500-525 which is where it should be now. Then the 1080ti can be priced at $725-$750.

I myself will not pay more than $750 for a GPU because I look at history of the GPU and then add for inflation etc. Look at the prices of the big boy GPU prices - 8800gtx- Ultra to today. $650 or less to $650 to $700 for a 980ti Then look at the initial prices of the midsize chips. $250 for a 8800gt and now we are scaling all the way to $700 for a 1080.

You see that the high end (excluding TItan) has held prices within 20% for the last 10 years. Hell even the 7800GTX was $649 way back when. I personally am ok with a 20% increase over 10 years for inflation, wages etc. I am NOT ok with the huge increase in the midrange prices.

Just go back in time to when the 8800gt came out in 2007. It was $250 at launch. The card it replaced; the 7950gt was released the year before at $299-$349. I had both cards. The 8800gt almost DOUBLED the 7950gt in performance but was less money. The 8800gt has to be one of the most sold cards of all time along with the 9700pro, ti4200 and the 970gtx.

I know I jumped around a lot here but I just wanted to show that since the 680gtx, Nvidia is killing us in the pricing of the midrange size chip. We should not be paying 300% more for these chips then 7-8 years ago. I am ok with TI pricing but not at over $750-$800 tops. The problem I see is that now the large increase in the mid chip card is going to push the TI price point to an extreme level.

Please don't be to hard on me!


----------



## BillOhio

I'm expecting that by Christmas Nvidia will be dropping a $950 1080Ti which will have 99% of the performance of the Titan XP at which point there will be a thread where Ti buyers troll XP buyers for overspending and XP buyers troll Ti buyers because they didn't have to wait those 4 extra months to get XP/Ti performance.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BillOhio*
> 
> I'm expecting that by Christmas Nvidia will be dropping a $950 1080Ti which will have 99% of the performance of the Titan XP at which point there will be a thread where Ti buyers troll XP buyers for overspending and XP buyers troll Ti buyers because they didn't have to wait those 4 extra months to get XP/Ti performance.


The Titan XP might be the 1080 Ti. I would not be surprised if the XP is a cut down core, and Nvidia will release a newer, faster Titan 6 months down the road.

@ $950 for a 1080 Ti, Nvidia would have to drop the 1080 FE to $600 for it to remain a viable option. I don't think they wish to do that.


----------



## renejr902

I made several calculations, i will resume shortly.. anandtech tested the 1080gtx with only memory overclocked, 6-7 games were tested at ultra at 4k. Gddr5x Memory overclocked from 10gbps to 11gbps.
With memory bandwith going from 320gb/s to 352gb/s (32gb/s difference)only gain from 0,6fps to 1,3fps was possible. So if titan x has 16gb hbm2 at 720gb/s instead, i calculate the difference.
I will be fair i know titan x will overclock his gddr5x memory to at least 11gbps too. So i will begin from 528gb/s memory bandwith. So make the calcul 720gb/s - 528gb/s = 192gb/s difference. 192gb/s divide by 32gb/s = 6

6 * 0,6 = 3,6fps to 6 *1,3 = 7,8fps

If i understand correctly comeone guys 16gb hbm2 at 720gb/s can only bring 3,6fps to 7,8fps more to the titan x in gaming at ultra at 4k, ITS VERY NEGLIGIBLE, i think its not even worth the price difference for hbm2.

What do think of my calcul logic ? Thanks for your opinion, i can be wrong, i just told you what i think.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10325/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-and-1070-founders-edition-review/31 ( july 23 )


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> The Titan XP might be the 1080 Ti. I would not be surprised if the XP is a cut down core, and Nvidia will release a newer, faster Titan 6 months down the road.
> 
> @ $950 for a 1080 Ti, Nvidia would have to drop the 1080 FE to $600 for it to remain a viable option. I don't think they wish to do that.


I do not sea a 1080 Ti coming out anytime soon. Reason is Titan X had 12GB while 980 Ti had 6GB. There is no room for 1080 Ti with 6GB. This Titan XP should have been 24GB to have space for 1080 Ti. What I think is going to happen is 1080 Ti will come 6-7 months after and still have 12GB but at that point Titan XP would have had enough time to sell. Most people that buy Titan cards buy it relatively early.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I do not sea a 1080 Ti coming out anytime soon. Reason is Titan X had 12GB while 980 Ti had 6GB. There is no room for 1080 Ti with 6GB. *This Titan XP should have been 24GB to have space for 1080 Ti.* What I think is going to happen is 1080 Ti will come 6-7 months after and still have 12GB but at that point Titan XP would have had enough time to sell. Most people that buy Titan cards buy it relatively early.


That was my thought as well. 12GB of memory at that price for a Titan is a major oversight by Nvidia. This is why I think the 1080 Ti is the Titan XP.

We might see a Titan XP Ultra, or something, with 24GB Vram and a fully enabled GP102 core down the road. This is part of the reason why I don't think the Titan XP is worth the $1200 asking price. It just doesn't measure up to its predecessors.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> That was my thought as well. 12GB of memory at that price for a Titan is a major oversight by Nvidia. This is why I think the 1080 Ti is the Titan XP.
> 
> We might see a Titan XP Ultra, or something, with 24GB Vram and a fully enabled GP102 core down the road. This is part of the reason why I don't think the Titan XP is worth the $1200 asking price. It just doesn't measure up to its predecessors.


As much as Nvidia wants to put 24GB I do not think they can. Thats more same vRAM as 3 x 1080s. That's $2100 of GPU. Also G5X is not same as G5. Probably more expensive and harder to make right now. Really hooped for 16GB HMB2 Titan XP and 8GB HBM2 1080 Ti but it did not happen. I know people that got the money will love this card because it will be crazy fast but that what they said for Titan OG and 780 and 290 brought it down. $1200 is just too much not because it's not worth that much but the principle itself. At some point even those with a lot of money will draw a line. This really has nothing to do with AMD. I do not want AMD to build a $1000 Titan XP killer. There should be no competition for Titan XP unless it's half price like 295X2 was to Titan Z.


----------



## Maintenance Bot

24Gb of G5X is house fire.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> The problem is guys, that the professional market completely overshadow the gamers willing to dish out $999 max for a GPU. So Nvidia of course sell the card at $1200.
> 
> Its so funny watching people write "just wait til Vega". Thats the whole issue. Waiting. For something that incompetent AMD company cant deliver at this time. So Nvidia runs the ship. No competition. Charge whatever people are willing to pay. Same about the GTX 1080. You can bet that Nvidia knew AMD have fallen behind with high end. So they made plan accordingly
> 
> You can bet your house that Nvidia is holding 1080Ti back until Vega is getting close. And thats not happening until 2017 sometime...


Is there any indication GP102 retains all the DP units GP100 had? If not then it wouldn't be much of a professional card.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Lol, you must be confused, the 6950x is a 10 core chip. it is definitely an upgrade, if you need the cores.....i only "skipped it.." because I couldn't come up with the loot. my old 5960x did 4.5 @1.30 volts, my new one does 4.7 @1.30 volts....I can most likely bring those voltages down, once I really start messing with it.. my single core score in Cinebench is 192.. .


Ummm I did say it would depend entirely on how well your 6950X clocks. You have a very good 5960X that clocks to 4.7 @ 1.3, and if you end up with a below average 6950X that can't get past 4.2, then that's still not much of an upgrade.. Plus when it comes to single threaded performance you can throw all the cores at it and it wouldn't matter one bit, and a 5960X @ 4.7 would still beat a 6950X @ 4.2.

Btw with that Cinebench score, you're already beating a 6700K @ 4.4, so pretty good.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Maintenance Bot*
> 
> 24Gb of G5X is house fire.


Campfire, but yea, it would probably run pretty hot.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Campfire, but yea, it would probably run pretty hot.


Also use a ton of power. Can they even place 24GB of G5X.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Is there any indication GP102 retains all the DP units GP100 had? If not then it wouldn't be much of a professional card.
> Ummm I did say it would depend entirely on how well your 6950X clocks. You have a very good 5960X that clocks to 4.7 @ 1.3, and if you end up with a below average 6950X that can't get past 4.2, then that's still not much of an upgrade.. Plus when it comes to single threaded performance you can throw all the cores at it and it wouldn't matter one bit, and a 5960X @ 4.7 would still beat a 6950X @ 4.2.
> 
> Btw with that Cinebench score, you're already beating a 6700K @ 4.4, so pretty good.


Tesla P100 aka GP100
3584 cores. 15.3 billion transistors

Titan X aka GP102
3584 cores. 12 billion transistors

Something have been cut off...


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Tesla P100 aka GP100:
> 3584 cores. 15.3 billion transistors
> 
> Titan X aka GP102
> 3584 cores. 12billion transistors
> 
> Something have been cut off...


Could HBM2 have anything to do with it? I mean just look at Fury X. 8.9B


----------



## Omicron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Tesla P100 aka GP100:
> 3584 cores. 15.3 billion transistors
> 
> Titan X aka GP102
> 3584 cores. 12billion transistors
> 
> Something have been cut off...


This actually is an interesting note. There does have to be a new core versus GP100 for this card as Nvidia usually announces all transistors on a die, even if they are in shaders that are not enabled. Now, this might just mean that GP102 omits the HBM memory controller and uses GDDR5X, or if it is indeed natively with 3584 cores and it is a fully enabled product.

The whitepaper linked to earlier does indeed mention a fully enabled GP100 die having 3840 CUDA cores, so at the least, we know that the Tesla P100 product *does* have disabled shaders. Pages 10 and 11 in this document are really interesting and are worth a read for this topic for those who haven't touched it: https://images.nvidia.com/content/pdf/tesla/whitepaper/pascal-architecture-whitepaper.pdf. The user saintruski brought this one to my attention.

The removed transistors could even be the mythical double precision equipment for a more "gaming" oriented GP102 product...


----------



## renejr902

Nobody want to comment about my gddr5x vs hbm2 theory i posted earlier... ?


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Not really.

Either your memory is bottle necking the core or it isn't. GDDR5X doesn't seem to bottleneck the gtx 1080 and with a 384bit bus on the titan x, gddr5x wont bottleneck the titan x either. HBM2 is unnecessary in this application.


----------



## bmgjet

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Nobody want to comment about my gddr5x vs hbm2 theory i posted earlier... ?


That would be with perfect scaling. im sure people would be willing the pay the difference for even half of that scaling.
The bigger advantage of the HBM2 would be reduced power, Reduced need for VRAM powering circuits and reduced PCB size.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Nobody want to comment about my gddr5x vs hbm2 theory i posted earlier... ?


Yeah HBM2 is not going to bring massive gains right now but the faster HBM2 is out the better for the future. Faster cards will need HBM2 for sure. Right now Nvidia supported Pascal with G5X and Compression. Next gen Compression will not be a factor. They cant do much more then what Pascal does so they have to use HMB2. Another thing to note is G5X is only 10GHz with potential for 14GHz which in reality will push another generation. I suspect GTX1180 will use 256-Bit 14GHz RAM.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Tesla P100 aka GP100
> 3584 cores. 15.3 billion transistors
> 
> Titan X aka GP102
> 3584 cores. 12 billion transistors
> 
> Something have been cut off...


I bet it's all the DP units.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Also use a ton of power. Can they even place 24GB of G5X.


It would be just like every other Titan before; there would be memory on both sides of the PCB.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> It would be just like every other Titan before; there would be memory on both sides of the PCB.


Does the current Titan X have memory in the back if yes then this need 2GB dense G5X.

Edit: It looks like its very possible with 1GB dense.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Does the current Titan X have memory in the back if yes then this need 2GB dense G5X.
> 
> Edit: It looks like its very possible with 1GB dense.


Here's a pic of the OG GTX Titan back.



And the OG Titan X.



Nvidia could have easily stuck 12 1GB modules of GDDR5x on the back of the new Titan X... but they didn't.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I bet it's all the DP units.


Seems most likely, since NVidia only lists the FP32 cores in their core count.


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> It would be just like every other Titan before; there would be memory on both sides of the PCB.


the new one is only 50% more Vram than 1080. It should have been 24GB. lol


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clocknut*
> 
> the new one is only 50% more Vram than 1080. It should have been 24GB. lol


I couldn't agree more.


----------



## carlhil2

nVIDIA is about to pull a stunt. they gave the 1080 the Ti price point. no room for the Ti now. they release the GP102 Titan X for $1200. expect to see the $1500 Titan PX with the full GP100 and 16+ gigs of HBM2 when Vega drops.......,I mean, they couldn't sell a $1200 1080Ti, could they?


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> Thank you. This community has gone insane over "full-fat" and "cut down" and "Titan!!111 The Ti!".
> 
> How about you just buy the performance you want? Is OCN the Pursuit of Performance...or the Pursuit of Specification Sheets.
> And if people buy it, then NVIDIA has made a good marketing decision.
> 
> I mean, would we be angry if McDonalds started offering a $15 burger?


OCN used to be about buying modest hardware and eeking out the max performance per dollar, not about paying crazy prices for instant max performance.

The term enthusiast does not equal paying max dollar for instant max performance. Where is the thrill in that?

People keep confusing "Enthusiast" with max amount of dollars for hardware, which is wrong.


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> If I had a penny every time I read a post telling someone to wait for the next-best thing.


So true.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> OCN used to be about buying modest hardware and eeking out the max performance per dollar, not about paying crazy prices for instant max performance.
> 
> The term enthusiast does not equal paying max dollar for instant max performance. Where is the thrill in that?
> 
> People keep confusing "Enthusiast" with max amount of dollars for hardware, which is wrong.


That's before 8800 Ultra, before X58, before Gulftown, before ROG Rampage, before 3960X, before Titan, before 6950X and before Titan X 2016, when AMD/ATI was actually competitive.

6950X and Titan X 2016, monuments of AMD's incompetence and Bench warriors' willingness to pay any price just to have the Performance epeen.

p.s I don't recall the forum wide uproar when people bought the first gen 32" 4K monitor from ASUS/Dell 3 years ago for $3K+, instead the hate was all on the OG Titan buyers spending $1-2K.


----------



## magnek

^8800 Ultra wasn't that successful IIRC, since it literally was just a factory OC'd version of 8800 GTX (well ok it was binned better so OC vs OC it still got higher clocks, but the premium was ridiculous for the paltry performance increase)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> nVIDIA is about to pull a stunt. they gave the 1080 the Ti price point. no room for the Ti now. they release the GP102 Titan X for $1200. expect to see the $1500 Titan PX with the full GP100 and 16+ gigs of HBM2 when Vega drops.......,I mean, they couldn't sell a $1200 1080Ti, could they?


Vega would have to blow away the Titan X for them to release a Titan PX like that.

My prediction is Titan X is all we're gonna get for 2016. 2017 who knows, maybe if Vega threatens 1080 enough they might release a "1080 Ti", but if Vega is simply around 1080 level, then we may not see anything.


----------



## 12Cores

I did not expect [email protected] this year, cudos to Nvidia. I am curious to see it can truly run the Witcher 3 with everything on at 4k, that game is a monster.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> OCN used to be about buying modest hardware and eeking out the max performance per dollar, not about paying crazy prices for instant max performance.
> 
> The term enthusiast does not equal paying max dollar for instant max performance. Where is the thrill in that?
> 
> People keep confusing "Enthusiast" with max amount of dollars for hardware, which is wrong.


Pretty much this. This is why I joined OCN. Not to buy Intel EE but buy CPU that can OC with not very expensive MB. I have tried to keep the same mentality. Buying stuff like 290 and unlocking it to 290X. Refusing to pay $650 for GPUs.


----------



## NYSE

Perhaps discussed previously ( I looked but couldn't find the answer )









Will this new Titan X fit the existing EK block and back plate of its predecessor?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NYSE*
> 
> Perhaps discussed previously ( I looked but couldn't find the answer )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will this new Titan X fit the existing EK block and back plate of its predecessor?


Since we don't currently have any pictures of the PCB, it's too early to call. However, I will pose these questions to you.

1. Was an EK waterblock for the OG Titan also compatible with the OG Titan X?
2. Is an EK waterblock for the GTX 980 compatible with the GTX 1080 as well?

A quick google search reveals that the answer to both 1 and 2 is no.

Because of this, it would be safe to theorize that the new Titan X will not be compatible with the old Titan X EK waterblock.


----------



## NYSE

Makes sense thank you for the fast reply.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clocknut*
> 
> the new one is only 50% more Vram than 1080. It should have been 24GB. lol


The problem here is the same one AMD had with the FuryX and the 390X, but at the very high end where it hurts even more:

The top end Tesla P100 has 16GB of HBM2, a Titan with 24GB of GDDR5X for 1/4 the price would not be good.


----------



## i7monkey

The price ceiling for these dumb cards haven't been reached. A fully unlocked GP100 with HBM2 will sell well even at $1500. We haven't seen nothing yet.

Nvidia is officially the Apple of the graphics industry and they can charge whatever they want. Bad news for us is this isn't the laptop industry where competition is fierce. We're stuck in monopoly and AMD is our only hope for sane pricing.


----------



## Ascii Aficionado

The question is how long before a future 1180 Ti beats it for half the price ?


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> The price ceiling for these dumb cards haven't been reached. A fully unlocked GP100 with HBM2 will sell well even at $1500. We haven't seen nothing yet.
> 
> Nvidia is officially the Apple of the graphics industry and they can charge whatever they want. Bad news for us is this isn't the laptop industry where competition is fierce. We're stuck in monopoly and AMD is our only hope for sane pricing.


Competition is fierce in laptop Industry? Its even worse down there lol.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Competition is fierce in laptop Industry? Its even worse down there lol.


Tons of companies make laptops, no?

We're stuck with 2 in the GPU industry and one's half-asleep.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> The price ceiling for these dumb cards haven't been reached. A fully unlocked GP100 with HBM2 will sell well even at $1500. We haven't seen nothing yet.
> 
> Nvidia is officially the Apple of the graphics industry and they can charge whatever they want. Bad news for us is this isn't the laptop industry where competition is fierce. We're stuck in monopoly and AMD is our only hope for sane pricing.


Uhhh you have it the other way around. It's way way way worse over on the laptop side where AMD is pretty much completely dead and hasn't done much beyond releasing Pitcairn and Tonga rebrands that run way too hot and consume way too much power.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ascii Aficionado*
> 
> The question is how long before a future 1180 Ti beats it for half the price ?


I give it 2 years.


----------



## Fiercy

I think the main problem in selling new Titan X is the fact thare aren't many games coming that are going to requrie so much horse power. I dont think people will get new Titan to go replay 100 hours of witcher 3 just to see 30 fps more..

We have No Man's Sky and Deus Ex coming soon and my Titan X Gen 1 will be more then enough. so I don't know 1200$ also seems greedy but that's my opinion.


----------



## xzamples

people are willing to pay $1200, which makes me think... are people also willing to pay $1500, perhaps $2000?


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Tons of companies make laptops, no?
> 
> We're stuck with 2 in the GPU industry and one's half-asleep.


would be better to talk about what is inside those laptops as AMD is providing absolutely no competition on that regard.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Uhhh you have it the other way around. It's way way way worse over on the laptop side where AMD is pretty much completely dead and hasn't done much beyond releasing Pitcairn and Tonga rebrands that run way too hot and consume way too much power.


Not talking about AMD vs Intel/Nvidia in the laptop scene, I'm talking about laptop companies themselves (Lenovo, HP, Acer, Dell, Apple, etc...). Many options there.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xzamples*
> 
> people are willing to pay $1200, which makes me think... are people also willing to pay $1500, perhaps $2000?


$2000 is probably the ceiling for a single GPU card, and $3000 the ceiling for a dual GPU card, if Titan Z was any indication.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> $2000 is probably the ceiling for a single GPU card, and $3000 the ceiling for a dual GPU card, if Titan Z was any indication.


No it's not. $650 is the ceiling. Anything more does not warrant any card out there games required to play. If they made 10 Witcher 3 like games every year then yes.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Not talking about AMD vs Intel/Nvidia in the laptop scene, I'm talking about laptop companies themselves (Lenovo, HP, Acer, Dell, Apple, etc...). Many options there.


Many options there, it is all Intel on the ultrabook side, and all Nvidia on gaming laptops. go figure.


----------



## l88bastar

lol we go through this EVERY TIME Nvidia raises the bar with a flagship card.

If people set aside a measily $50 a month, they would be able to buy the latest and greatest GPU from Nvidia each and every year if you factored in the resale value of their prior latest and greatest card. I just got $600 for one of my Titan Xs and $700 for the other, so factor in another $600 (12 months x $50) boom there is the $$$ for the new Titan XP.

So really.....are you people really crying over the fact that you CAN'T save a measily FIFTY DOLLARS a month????


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> No it's not. $650 is the ceiling. Anything more does not warrant any card out there games required to play. If they made 10 Witcher 3 like games every year then yes.


Well, your ceiling lol. I thought that was the ceiling yet Titan proved it wasn't. Unfortunate, but it is the reality.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> No it's not. $650 is the ceiling. Anything more does not warrant any card out there games required to play. If they made 10 Witcher 3 like games every year then yes.


lol given that the $999 Titan X sold out for the first few weeks, I'm gonna say $650 is what you _want_ the ceiling to be, but the actual ceiling is much, MUCH higher.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> lol we go through this EVERY TIME Nvidia raises the bar with a flagship card.
> 
> If people set aside a measily $50 a month, they would be able to buy the latest and greatest GPU from Nvidia each and every year if you factored in the resale value of their prior latest and greatest card. I just got $600 for one of my Titan Xs and $700 for the other, so factor in another $600 (12 months x $50) boom there is the $$$ for the new Titan XP.
> 
> So really.....are you people really crying over the fact that you CAN'T save a measily FIFTY DOLLARS a month????


Ugh as I've said at least three times in this thread already, there's a fine difference between someone literally not being able to afford to $1200 (likely a minority here on OCN), vs someone who doesn't want to spend $1200 on a GPU because to said person the price is ******ed. I'd wager pretty much everyone falls into the latter category here.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> lol we go through this EVERY TIME Nvidia raises the bar with a flagship card.
> 
> If people set aside a measily $50 a month, they would be able to buy the latest and greatest GPU from Nvidia each and every year if you factored in the resale value of their prior latest and greatest card. I just got $600 for one of my Titan Xs and $700 for the other, so factor in another $600 (12 months x $50) boom there is the $$$ for the new Titan XP.
> 
> So really.....are you people really crying over the fact that you CAN'T save a measily FIFTY DOLLARS a month????


By that same logic, practically anything should be affordable just because you can save a little every month for it.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> lol given that the $999 Titan X sold out for the first few weeks, I'm gonna say $650 is what you _want_ the ceiling to be, but the actual ceiling is much, MUCH higher.
> Ugh as I've said at least three times in this thread already, there's a fine difference between someone literally not being able to afford to $1200 (likely a minority here on OCN), vs someone who doesn't want to spend $1200 on a GPU because to said person the price is ******ed. I'd wager pretty much everyone falls into the latter category here.


With all due respect, it seems as if you have the reasoning of a child. Nvidia is not holding a gun to anybodies head and forcing them to pay or buy anything. If you can afford to pay but won't then that is your perogative. If you find the pricing un-acceptable then perhaps you should downgrade yourself to purchasing the prior generation of GPUS from early adopters of the new generation.....IE the guy that just bought my Titan X maxwell only paid $600 - $700 instead of $1,000


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> lol we go through this EVERY TIME Nvidia raises the bar with a flagship card.
> 
> If people set aside a measily $50 a month, they would be able to buy the latest and greatest GPU from Nvidia each and every year if you factored in the resale value of their prior latest and greatest card. I just got $600 for one of my Titan Xs and $700 for the other, so factor in another $600 (12 months x $50) boom there is the $$$ for the new Titan XP.
> 
> So really.....are you people really crying over the fact that you CAN'T save a measily FIFTY DOLLARS a month????


Saving a messily $50 a month for Nvidia? Pfft , that's not even a real test of being an Nvidia enthusiast. Step it up to $150/$200/$300 successfully every year, so that Nvidia can sell for $1,800/$2,400/$3600 and bring even better gpus.. Nobody said this was a cheap hobby. Go play consoles, if you can't even support the company by saving for it.. shame on you...

Jk...lol


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> lol given that the $999 Titan X sold out for the first few weeks, I'm gonna say $650 is what you _want_ the ceiling to be, but the actual ceiling is much, MUCH higher.
> Ugh as I've said at least three times in this thread already, there's a fine difference between someone literally not being able to afford to $1200 (likely a minority here on OCN), vs someone who doesn't want to spend $1200 on a GPU because to said person the price is ******ed. I'd wager pretty much everyone falls into the latter category here.


Does not mean a thing. All I am saying is that there come a price where a GPU extends the purpose that it is indented to do. For example similar to Intel EE 10 Core. They could release 24 Core for 5K too. Games today do not warrant spending $1K+ for a GPU. People that buy Titan cards have other reasons to buy these cards. 1K, 1.5K, 2K will have little effect for them. Some will stop buying because they are too poor for "the way it's meant to be played". Nvidia is just testing how much their fans are willing to spend. 3K is the upper limit which they tested with Titan Z. Something has to give. Someone will crash and burn. That or they will pull a 970 and people will forget about all the overpricing they do.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> With all due respect, it seems as if you have the reasoning of a child. Nvidia is not holding a gun to anybodies head and forcing them to pay or buy anything. If you can afford to pay but won't then that is your perogative. If you find the pricing un-acceptable then perhaps you should downgrade yourself to purchasing the prior generation of GPUS from early adopters of the new generation.....IE the guy that just bought my Titan X maxwell only paid $600 - $700 instead of $1,000


As a consumer, i think we have every right to complain about its price lol.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> As a consumer, i think we have every right to complain about its price lol.


The Titan effect is not really a problem for us. The problem is how it effects the lower stack of products. Suddenly $700 GP104 is a good deal


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> By that same logic, practically anything should be affordable just because you can save a little every month for it.


Dude.....uhhh....its called budgeting....and the answer to your question is. Yes.


----------



## i7monkey

guise u only have to save $150 a month that way u can buy a $1800 GP100 Titan come next year. HBM is not cheap!

/


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> As a consumer, i think we have every right to complain about its price lol.


Then vote with your wallet, like a consumer should.


----------



## i7monkey

y u guys so stingy? save $250 a month and that dual gp102 titan will be yours after a year of saving.

#itscalledbudgeting


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> The Titan effect is not really a problem for us. The problem is how it effects the lower stack of products. Suddenly $700 GP104 is a good deal


Pretty clever marketing. Even I paused and briefly thought those 1080s look pretty good lol. But I think it should settle down when Vega launches, just um, it will be a while.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> y u guys so stingy? save $250 a month and that dual gp102 titan will be yours after a year of saving.
> 
> #itscalledbudgeting


Well if budgeting isn't your thing, there are other ways for you to raise quick cash down by the boulevard if your "cute enough"

And yes....setting aside $$$ every month for a big ticket purchase is pretty easy, especially if its something like a high end GPU which predictably only releases once a year....so plenty of time to save. No excuses. I think some people just love to whine.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> With all due respect, it seems as if you have the reasoning of a child. Nvidia is not holding a gun to anybodies head and forcing them to pay or buy anything. If you can afford to pay but won't then that is your perogative. If you find the pricing un-acceptable then perhaps you should downgrade yourself to purchasing the prior generation of GPUS from early adopters of the new generation.....IE the guy that just bought my Titan X maxwell only paid $600 - $700 instead of $1,000


I have the reasoning of a child because...? Didn't say nVidia was holding a gun to anybody's head either.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Dude.....uhhh....its called budgeting....and the answer to your question is. Yes.


I'm pretty sure 95% of the US population couldn't afford a Veyron regardless of how hard they budgeted.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> And yes....setting aside $$$ every month for a big ticket purchase is pretty easy, especially if its something like a high end GPU which predictably only releases once a year....so plenty of time to save. No excuses. I think some people just love to whine.


Probably shouldn't be buying a GPU that requires you to save for a year...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> mypickaxe is right, though: monopolies drive higher prices. That's exactly what your chart shows, haha. What exactly are you disagreeing with?


I would go into why both of you are wrong but the post will probably also get deleted by a mod like my last reply to you...


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Probably shouldn't be buying a GPU that requires you to save for a year...


They are complaining about cost. The cost breaks down to a measily $50 a month when you do the math on a product that only releases once a year. So there is no excuse to whine over affordability. Would I love for this to cost less. Of course. But Nvidia is not a Charity, demand is high and competition is weak....what did you all expect to happen









I want a fully automatic Transferable M16, but those run about $25,000. I could buy one if I sold my full auto Mac 10 (worth $8k), Mac11 (worth $9k), and a few other rifles like my Scar17s (worth $3.5k) and Tavor (worth $2k)......or if I budgeted for a while. But do you know what would not get me the M16? Whining!


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> They are complaining about cost. The cost breaks down to a measily $50 a month when you do the math on a product that only releases once a year. So there is no excuse to whine over affordability.


How exactly does a $1200 card turn out to be $50 a month? Resale value of your existing card should play a roll here?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Would I love for this to cost less. Of course. But Nvidia is not a Charity, demand is high and competition is weak....


Nvidia is no charity. It is, however, a monopoly. Nvidia has no competition currently and can raise prices at will. As far as "high demand" goes, artificial shortages are pivotal in helping consumers rationalizing higher prices.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> what did you all expect to happen


Well, expecting the FTC to do their job is asking too much. They have been anti-consumer for the last few decades...


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> How exactly does a $1200 card turn out to be $50 a month? Resale value of your existing card should play a roll here?
> Nvidia is no charity. It is, however, a monopoly. Nvidia has no competition currently and can raise prices at will. As far as "high demand" goes, artificial shortages are pivotal in helping consumers rationalizing higher prices.


With the hopes to Sell Titan X for $600.


----------



## dagget3450

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> How exactly does a $1200 card turn out to be $50 a month? Resale value of your existing card should play a roll here?
> Nvidia is no charity. It is, however, a monopoly. Nvidia has no competition currently and can raise prices at will. As far as "high demand" goes, artificial shortages are pivotal in helping consumers rationalizing higher prices.


1200$ a year or 100$ is more than i pay for car insurance on 2 vehicles. Lets see how much the next top of the line(retail desktop) gpu from nvidia costs. As you pointed out we can expect it to rise if there is no competition then. So i guess eventually buying a new nvidia card will eventually outpace a car payment.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> With the hopes to Sell Titan X for $600.


But but... "Titan X performance for only $450!!!"









Wasn't that the mantra of every GTX 1070 review?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> How exactly does a $1200 card turn out to be $50 a month? Resale value of your existing card should play a roll here?
> Nvidia is no charity. It is, however, a monopoly. Nvidia has no competition currently and can raise prices at will. As far as "high demand" goes, artificial shortages are pivotal in helping consumers rationalizing higher prices.


I already broke the math down. I just sold two TItan X for an average of $650, so if you add in $50 x 12 you have your $1,250 for Titan XP with next day air shipping.

Nvidia has a monopoly on the high end GPU market. So what. They earned it. Oh wait, please spare me with that brain dead anti-capitalism drivel agenda.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> They are complaining about cost. The cost breaks down to a measily $50 a month when you do the math on a product that only releases once a year. So there is no excuse to whine over affordability. Would I love for this to cost less. Of course. But Nvidia is not a Charity, demand is high and competition is weak....what did you all expect to happen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want a fully automatic Transferable M16, but those run about $25,000. I could buy one if I sold my full auto Mac 10 (worth $8k), Mac11 (worth $9k), and a few other rifles like my Scar17s (worth $3.5k) and Tavor (worth $2k)......or if I budgeted for a while. But do you know what would not get me the M16? Whining!


$50 a month is assuming a $600 resale value on your Titan X, which isn't guaranteed.

And it's not like we're whining about the cost while simultaneously expecting the product to be handed over to us on a silver platter.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Nvidia has a monopoly. So what. They have earned it. Oh wait, please spare me with that brain dead anti-capitalism drivel the universities churn out with useless business degree majors.





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> $50 a month is assuming a $600 resale value on your Titan X, which isn't guaranteed.
> 
> And it's not like we're whining about the cost while simultaneously expecting the product to be handed over to us on a silver platter.


From my experience in the enthusiast hardware game. Resale value of high end cards has been very steady and predictable all the way back to the 8800gtx days.


----------



## renejr902

Thanks so much guys for answers and comment, thanks to the 3 persons that comments, it helps me a lot to understand the logic behind memory. So finally, so even the pascal titan xp wont be bottleneck by gddr5x at 480gb/s or 528gb/s, RIGHT? Thanks to confirm me this if you are sure about that. Otherwise i would wait for a hbm2 card, thanks again

About the titan xp price, to be honest my MAX is really 1200$, not even 1300$. I would not buy it at 1300$. Before it was announced, the max i was willing to pay was 1100$, for 100$ more i will do it, but it was really my max limit, not because i dont have the money, but because it will be seriously a joke more money than that. Even at 1200$ its a joke too. If the card was released at 1300$+ i would i bought already the gtx 1080 instead and wait for next generation or a 1080ti if happen, or anything similar or stronger than titan xp at a better price. They really tested me this time at 1200$, to be honest , they tested us to the limit, i lost a lot of respect for nvidia because this 1200$ without hbm2 memory. And no aib partners ?? I didnt like that either, man i begin to hate them







and i will still buy this 1200$ card, it better be fast like hell







otherwise next time is from amd i buy, if price are always like that for enthousiast. Nvidia are lucky this time that i really want to play somes games at 4k 60fps, otherwise i would have wait and buy 1080 and vega hbm2 when released instead of that titan xp


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Monopolies are not always automatically bad. TPTB want you to think they are bad so that they have free reign to control up and comer entrepreneurs like they did to Bill Gates in the late 90s, TPTB brain wash the masses to believe Monopolies are ALWAYS bad....meanwhle the elites run monopolies and oligopolies ALL THE TIME....don't believe me, why don't you shop around for another power service provider.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> From my experience in the enthusiast hardware game. Resale value of high end cards has been very steady and predictable all the way back to the 8800gtx days.


The point being that resale value is variable and should be excluded from the equation. Plus your model only works if you buy, sell, and upgrade every year, otherwise the flagship products simply plunge in value. So you're basically budgeting out $50/mo for the foreseeable future if you play that game.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ascii Aficionado*
> 
> The question is how long before a future 1180 Ti beats it for half the price ?


That's entirely up to AMD, (560Ti 448, 660Ti, 750Ti, 780Ti, 980Ti) Ti card are only made if the existing cards aren't good enough to beat AMD at the desired price point.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> The point being that resale value is variable and should be excluded from the equation. Plus your model only works if you buy, sell, and upgrade every year, otherwise the flagship products simply plunge in value. So you're basically budgeting out $50/mo for the foreseeable future if you play that game.


Which is not inclusing other system parts. Would be easy if you only had to upgrade GPU. Another thing is USD price. I have to save $100 CAD a month lol to pay for $1700 + 200 TAX Titan XP. On top of that I would want to WC it. It just does not make any logical sense.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> The point being that resale value is variable and should be excluded from the equation. Plus your model only works if you buy, sell, and upgrade every year, otherwise the flagship products simply plunge in value. So you're basically budgeting out $50/mo for the foreseeable future if you play that game.


OK so remove the resale of the old card from the equation......then your left having to budget a measily $100 a month. If $100 a month is too much, then you should not be looking at high level GPUs, because the cost of the GPU is only the beginning of your problem. Your gonna want a good display for that high end gpu, a beefy processor, etc, etc.

I have a $2500 4k OLED, an $800 Vive and a $1000 X34. I wish $1200 was all I had to worry about lmao.....but Nvidia knows their market, they know if you'r gonna play the game.....your gonna pay.


----------



## CallsignVega

GPU news threads should be split into two threads:

1. Talk about release dates, hardware capabilities, technology etc.
2. Inane chatter back and forth about pricing.

These threads turn into wastelands as they currently are.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Yeah HBM2 is not going to bring massive gains right now but the faster HBM2 is out the better for the future. Faster cards will need HBM2 for sure. Right now Nvidia supported Pascal with G5X and Compression. Next gen Compression will not be a factor. They cant do much more then what Pascal does so they have to use HMB2. Another thing to note is G5X is only 10GHz with potential for 14GHz which in reality will push another generation. I suspect GTX1180 will use 256-Bit 14GHz RAM.


So if titan pascal wont benefit from hbm2, do you think volta titan will be ? Why did you say that compression wont matter next gen ? So for now i will buy this titan xp because all of you say that gddr5x wont bottleneck this pascal titan xp. Otherwise i would have wait for a hbm2 card


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> OK so remove the resale of the old card from the equation......then your left having to budget a measily $100 a month. If $100 a month is too much, then you should not be looking at high level GPUs.


equivalent high level gpus used to cost $329. therefore, the customer is losing out.

"stick to your lane"

sorry, GX104's used to cost $229, now they're $700.

prices in all lanes have skyrocketed.

what's your solution? stay quiet and quit gaming? never post on this board? never criticize this monopolistic industry?


----------



## SuperZan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Monopolies are not always automatically bad. TPTB want you to think they are bad so that they have free reign to control up and comer entrepreneurs like they did to Bill Gates in the late 90s, TPTB brain wash the masses to believe Monopolies are ALWAYS bad....meanwhle the elites run monopolies and oligopolies ALL THE TIME....don't believe me, why don't you shop around for another power service provider.


That's besides the point. You're arguing that people shouldn't discuss the price of a product.. which taken alone is such an asinine train of thought it really doesn't warrant discussion. But, acquiescence to price escalation without further discussion of the merits of the product does bear a few more words. That line of thought is what is wrong with the GPU market. People that will pay anything for the biggest numbers regardless of their relevance to content or in comparison to preceding products have arsed up the relationship that should exist between producer and consumer. Enough consumers allying and, in a sense, colluding with the producer undermines the bargaining power of other consumers.

And let's all stop playing the Yolo Swaggins game. I, and many others here, could build a pillow-fort made of Titans if I wanted to, but that would be both pointless and an expression of acceptance towards the price of the Titan series.


----------



## renejr902

Another question, we know that titan xp will have 3584 core unit. I know gp100 have 56 sm working of 60 otherwise it would habe been 3840.

But how many core unit can they put with a full die pascal or volta if it still 16nm WITHOUT DP. Im curious about that, only SP UNIT. Is 3840 really the max ? Could it be 4096, 4500, 5000+ ??? Thanks for your opinions guys , you are always kind with me and so much expert, i want to learn from the best people


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> OK so remove the resale of the old card from the equation......then your left having to budget a measily $100 a month. If $100 a month is too much, then you should not be looking at high level GPUs, because the cost of the GPU is only the beginning of your problem. Your gonna want a good display for that high end gpu, a beefy processor, etc, etc.
> 
> I have a $2500 4k OLED, an $800 Vive and a $1000 X34. I wish $1200 was all I had to worry about lmao.....but Nvidia knows there market, they know if you'r gonna play the game.....your gonna pay.


I feel like this just gets back to my point about not able to vs not wanting to, and thus we've gone full circle lol.

So we if add the numbers up, that's $2500+$800+$1000+$1200 = $5500, which could get you a used car just to put that in perspective.

And $5500 would come out to $458.33 per month, which I'd wager probably half the US population couldn't muster that kind of budget per month at least on a consistent basis lol.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> From my experience in the enthusiast hardware game. Resale value of high end cards has been very steady and predictable all the way back to the 8800gtx days.


Sheeple pay a premium for inferior performance because of branding? You don't say...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Monopolies are not always automatically bad. TPTB want you to think they are bad so that they have free reign to control up and comer entrepreneurs like they did to Bill Gates in the late 90s, TPTB brain wash the masses to believe Monopolies are ALWAYS bad....meanwhle the elites run monopolies and oligopolies ALL THE TIME....don't believe me, why don't you shop around for another power service provider.


When did I say that all monopolies are bad? The CPU and GPU monopolies clearly eat away at consumer surplus and are economically inefficient when compared to free market competition.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> OK so remove the resale of the old card from the equation......then your left having to budget a measily $100 a month. If $100 a month is too much, then you should not be looking at high level GPUs.


Isn't that what I said earlier?


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Dude.....uhhh....its called budgeting....and the answer to your question is. Yes.


It's not that I don't know the term... I'm actually pretty frugal.

The point is that Titan X =/= budget card, at least by the miraculous works of NV marketing.

By your own admission, you need an old Titan X to use its salvage value to pay for a TXP after budgeting.

Not sure one who is "budgeting" just so happens to have another Titan X lying around.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Another question, we know that titan xp will have 3584 core unit. I know gp100 have 56 sm working of 60 otherwise it would habe been 3840.
> 
> But how many core unit can they put with a full die pascal or volta if it still 16nm WITHOUT DP. Im curious about that, only SP UNIT. Is 3840 really the max ? Could it be 4096, 4500, 5000+ ??? Thanks for your opinions guys , you are always kind with me and so much expert, i want to learn from the best people


16nm with no DP cores would handle 5000+


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> That's besides the point. You're arguing that people shouldn't discuss the price of a product.. which taken alone is such an asinine train of thought it really doesn't warrant discussion. But, acquiescence to price escalation without further discussion of the merits of the product _does_ bear a few more words. That line of thought is what is wrong with the GPU market. People that will pay _anything_ for the biggest numbers regardless of their relevance to content or in comparison to preceding products have arsed up the relationship that should exist between producer and consumer. Enough consumers allying and, in a sense, colluding with the producer undermines the bargaining power of other consumers.
> 
> And let's all stop playing the Yolo Swaggins game. I, and many others here, could build a pillow-fort made of Titans if I wanted to, but that would be both pointless and an expression of acceptance towards the price of the Titan series.


Well a pillow fort of Titans doesn't sound very comfortable, plus it'd be the textbook perfect example of the narcissistic display of the excesses of a capitalistic society gone wrong according to Soviet propaganda.


----------



## SuperZan

In Soviet Russia, Titan buys you?









It does seem that way sometimes..


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> it'd be the textbook perfect example of the narcissistic display of the excesses of a capitalistic society gone


And here I thought the plethora of college undergraduates willing to spend 1200 on a GPU was the perfect textbook example of narcissistic display of the excesses


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Well a pillow fort of Titans doesn't sound very comfortable, plus it'd be the textbook perfect example of the narcissistic display of the excesses of a capitalistic society gone wrong according to Soviet propaganda.


Some deep learning researcher is probably very pleased with the idea of a Titan pillow fort.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> In Soviet Russia, Titan buys you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It does seem that way sometimes..


If Titans = oligarchs then absolutely.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> And here I thought the plethora of college undergraduates willing to spend 1200 on a GPU was the perfect textbook example of narcissistic display of the excesses


I doubt college undergraduates would have that much disposable income, so they're probably leeching off of their parents. Same effect either way lol.

Actually if you really wanted to drive the point home, you should've said graduate students. They're even more broke than undergrads.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> you should've said graduate students. They're even more broke than undergrads.


There are quite a few of them on these boards. I am sure it would have offended someone and the post would be deleted.

It appears that I have been offending a lot of people lately as my posts keep getting deleted by mods


----------



## magnek

And undergrads wouldn't be offended by what you said?
















But seriously, as a once completely broke grad student who went through the days of living on instant noddles and seminar food (albeit only for a short period of time, but still), I can attest that grad students are very much broke, unless you're one of the lucky few who manage to snag a snazzy fellowship. And I was in a relatively well funded field/department. Those in the faculty of arts had it even worse.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Which is not inclusing other system parts. Would be easy if you only had to upgrade GPU. Another thing is USD price. I have to save $100 CAD a month lol to pay for $1700 + 200 TAX Titan XP. On top of that I would want to WC it. It just does not make any logical sense.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> equivalent high level gpus used to cost $329. therefore, the customer is losing out.
> 
> "stick to your lane"
> 
> sorry, GX104's used to cost $229, now they're $700.
> 
> prices in all lanes have skyrocketed.
> 
> what's your solution? stay quiet and quit gaming? never post on this board? never criticize this monopolistic industry?


You sound like one of those old timers yammering about how coke used to cost a nickle lol

My solution is you can game just fine on a 980gtx....you dont NEED a Titan XP unless you have a very demanding & expensive gaming display to run it on and if you do have an expensive display then you can afford to pay the premium for the TItan XP.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Another question, we know that titan xp will have 3584 core unit. I know gp100 have 56 sm working of 60 otherwise it would habe been 3840.
> 
> But how many core unit can they put with a full die pascal or volta if it still 16nm WITHOUT DP. Im curious about that, only SP UNIT. Is 3840 really the max ? Could it be 4096, 4500, 5000+ ??? Thanks for your opinions guys , you are always kind with me and so much expert, i want to learn from the best people


GP100 has 60 SM, each containing 64 FP32 cores and 32 FP64 cores. So if they were to convert them all to FP32 cores you would be looking at 5760 total. How feasible that is from a production standpoint is a different issue, but it would be an impressive GPU.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> That's besides the point. You're arguing that people shouldn't discuss the price of a product.. which taken alone is such an asinine train of thought it really doesn't warrant discussion. But, acquiescence to price escalation without further discussion of the merits of the product _does_ bear a few more words. That line of thought is what is wrong with the GPU market. People that will pay _anything_ for the biggest numbers regardless of their relevance to content or in comparison to preceding products have arsed up the relationship that should exist between producer and consumer. Enough consumers allying and, in a sense, colluding with the producer undermines the bargaining power of other consumers.
> 
> And let's all stop playing the Yolo Swaggins game. I, and many others here, could build a pillow-fort made of Titans if I wanted to, but that would be both pointless and an expression of acceptance towards the price of the Titan series.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I feel like this just gets back to my point about not able to vs not wanting to, and thus we've gone full circle lol.
> 
> So we if add the numbers up, that's $2500+$800+$1000+$1200 = $5500, which could get you a used car just to put that in perspective.
> 
> And $5500 would come out to $458.33 per month, which I'd wager probably half the US population couldn't muster that kind of budget per month at least on a consistent basis lol.


Oh spare me. Half the working US population spends four times that amount a month on alcohol and dining out....not to mention their Brodozer lease payment is triple that cost.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Sheeple pay a premium for inferior performance because of branding? You don't say...
> When did I say that all monopolies are bad? The CPU and GPU monopolies clearly eat away at consumer surplus and are economically inefficient when compared to free market competition.
> Isn't that what I said earlier?


I hold patents, copyrights and trademarks which all grant me monopolies. However, if I don't produce a quality product with them, those monopolies are useless as the consumer has the choice NOT to support me.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> 16nm with no DP cores would handle 5000+


So can we dream for a volta titan xv at 16nm or better with 5000+ SP ? Is it really possible to dream about that in volta gen ? i Dont think its possible for pascal so soon. This card should be able to drive a 4k monitor at 144hz very well, i suppose


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> GP100 has 60 SM, each containing 64 FP32 cores and 32 FP64 cores. So if they were to convert them all to FP32 cores you would be looking at 5760 total. How feasible that is from a production standpoint is a different issue, but it would be an impressive GPU.


I don't know if SP and DP units take up the same die area, but if yes, such a theoretical 5760 SP core GPU would still be a 610mm² behemoth, and would be prohibitively expensive to produce. And for the first time ever, nVidia might actually be justified in charging $1500+ for such a GPU if it existed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Oh spare me. Half the working US population spends four times that amount a month on alcohol and dining out....not to mention their Brodozer lease payment is triple that cost.


Well, half of America has more debt than savings, which means they're living beyond their means. Which in turns means they either don't care for budgeting or simply can't.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> GP100 has 60 SM, each containing 64 FP32 cores and 32 FP64 cores. So if they were to convert them all to FP32 cores you would be looking at 5760 total. How feasible that is from a production standpoint is a different issue, but it would be an impressive GPU.


Im ready to buy it now, even on my credit card







lol


----------



## rx7racer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Oh spare me. Half the working US population spends four times that amount a month on alcohol and dining out....not to mention their Brodozer lease payment is triple that cost.
> I hold patents, copyrights and trademarks which all grant me monopolies.


Wow, that says a lot about your perspective.

Nv can price it how they want, I'll continue to vote with my wallet. Yes NV creates great performance parts, no they don't make and sell them at a great value as often anymore.

It's pretty much that simple, seems to be a lot of yammering about how each perspective is different. Remember it's all about what someone is willing to pay and how much it's valued to them. Really doesn't have to be 100% just about the market. Nv knows it's numbers, they know their demographic and it's obvious by this thread there are still many more that feel NV has great value products. I just don't happen to be one of them, but I don't mind one bit the one's that do see the value and need at NV's prices.

Once again with this launch NV has increased the price on each segment, the proof is in the numbers, the cold hard $$ amounts. And look how over priced they all are even above MSRP. And yes, AMD is no better in that regard. The two companies have kept the consumer so starved many will pay handsomely above MSRP just to get their hands on a current gpu.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I don't know if SP and DP units take up the same die area, but if yes, such a theoretical 5760 SP core GPU would still be a 610mm² behemoth, and would be prohibitively expensive to produce. And for the first time ever, nVidia might actually be justified in charging $1500+ for such a GPU if it existed.


$1500+ for it , i would buy it, that worth it even at 1500$ !! But i want hbm2 included, even hbm3 , because before it happen i suppose memory should have progressed


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Then vote with your wallet, like a consumer should.


You have no grasp of price elasticity or monopolies. If you did you never would have made the three previous posts. I have children students that blow you away in comprehension and critical thinking. Using the word "child" as an insult is ageist and ignorant. Sit down and let the professionals talk.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> You sound like one of those old timers yammering about how coke used to cost a nickle lol


Inflation is the reason coke cost a nickel in the 1950s and $1 these days.

Inflation doesn't explain why a $329 GTX 570 now costs $1200.


----------



## i7monkey

There is no "vote with your wallet" in a non-competitive market. It's either buy what they sell or quit altogether.


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Monopolies are not always automatically bad. TPTB want you to think they are bad so that they have free reign to control up and comer entrepreneurs like they did to Bill Gates in the late 90s, TPTB brain wash the masses to believe Monopolies are ALWAYS bad....meanwhle the elites run monopolies and oligopolies ALL THE TIME....don't believe me, why don't you shop around for another power service provider.


Come to North Texas. I have 6 choices for energy service providers. It's amazing how much cheaper my power bill is than those who do not.

ISPs are the same way.. Anywhere Google has shown up and started competing suddenly, as if it is by miracle, service gets cheaper and the speeds get better and data caps vanish.

Are you sure you understand how oligopolies and monopolies work? It sure seems like you do not.


----------



## rx7racer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> There is no "vote with your wallet" in a non-competitive market. It's either buy what they sell or quit altogether.


No, you have the option to overpay or overpay for inferior performance. I choose to overpay for inferior performance so I know at least my $$'s aren't funding the giant.


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Inflation is the reason coke cost a nickel in the 1950s and $1 these days.
> 
> Inflation doesn't explain why a $329 GTX 570 now costs $1200.


CPI inflation would have had to go up by several hundred percent in the past 4 years. I believe it's been hovering around 2.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> You have no grasp of price elasticity or monopolies. If you did you never would have made the three previous posts. I have children students that blow you away in comprehension and critical thinking. Using the word "child" as an insult is ageist and ignorant. Sit down and let the professionals talk.


Quick question for you: are natural monopolies usually government regulated?

(I'd ask more intelligent questions but I've given up most of what I learned in micro and 99% of what i learned in macro







)


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> You have no grasp of price elasticity or monopolies. If you did you never would have made the three previous posts. I have children students that blow you away in comprehension and critical thinking. Using the word "child" as an insult is ageist and ignorant. Sit down and let the professionals talk.


Im happy, i have 2 childs , money ,and even some free time







im lucky . But to be honest i love technology stuff but children is the best thing that happen in my life, two sweat girls that i love so much







... I will let them play with my rig and my titan xp anytime







but they mostly prefer do others things.. i can understand









Be happy people stop insulting others, and do and buy what you believe that worth it in your life, for you , you are not obligated to do what others think or tell you.

I will buy this titan xp to help nvidia to survive, nvidia is so poor, they need your money, try to understand them ... Im joking about that last one LOL
They dont deserve my money but i need this card for 4k purpose, i like people opinions and i respect them, but finally i do what i think is the best for me or my family


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Quick question for you: are natural monopolies usually government regulated?
> 
> (I'd ask more intelligent questions but I've given up most of what I learned in micro and 99% of what i learned in macro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


It depends on what country and it depends on the monopoly. Most natural monopolies have high barriers to entry and therefor require government regulation. For instance.. .Utilities like electricity and water tend to be natural monopolies. The government strictly regulates regions that have only one service provider for those services because if they didn't your water bill in certain regions of the country would be 600 a month.

the Semiconductor and GPU industries are natural oligopolies.. the barrier to entry is extremely high now and they require government regulation. This is the reason I have advocated for Samsung or IBM to buy AMD for 6 years... because AMD CANNOT... compete with INTEL.. or Nvidia.


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> It depends on what country and it depends on the monopoly. Most natural monopolies have high barriers to entry and therefor require government regulation. For instance.. .Utilities like electricity and water tend to be natural monopolies. The government strictly regulates regions that have only one service provider for those services because if they didn't your water bill in certain regions of the country would be 600 a month.
> 
> the Semiconductor and GPU industries are natural oligopolies.. the barrier to entry is extremely high now and they require _*government regulation*_. This is the reason I have advocated for Samsung or IBM to buy AMD for 6 years... because AMD CANNOT... compete with INTEL.. or Nvidia.


Are you able to explain why Nvidia can charge $1200 for a gpu and the government isnt down their throat for doing so?


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rx7racer*
> 
> *Once again with this launch NV has increased the price on each segment, the proof is in the numbers, the cold hard $$ amounts.* And look how over priced they all are even above MSRP. And yes, AMD is no better in that regard. The two companies have kept the consumer so starved many will pay handsomely above MSRP just to get their hands on a current gpu.


Things like that will happen with first(couple) run of new node(16nm, last time 28nm), let me rewind you back to 2012:

X80: $500, but you could argue it is a price increase because a GX104 Chip is used for 680
X70: $330->$400 but hardly anybody complained because 670 was within 10% of 680
X60Ti: $250/290(560Ti 448)->$300 , don't recall people screaming about 660Ti either
X60: $200->$230 , no complaints here either.

Oh and the 7970 for $550 and out of stock

How about 2014-15( Same node, matured process, release MSRP)

X80Ti: $700 -> $ 650
X80: $650-> $ 550
X70: $400 -> $ 330
X60: $250 -> $200

The pattern is quite simple, when producing on a new node, yield is down and cost per chip is up, resulting in MSRP increase across the board and availability issues.

When producing on a matured node, yield is up and cost per chip is down(even if the chips are now larger), resulting in MSRP decrease across the board and less availability issue.


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> Are you able to explain why Nvidia can charge $1200 for a gpu and the government isnt down their throat for doing so?


Because there aren't people rioting in the street about it... if your water bill was 1000 dollars next month .. I guarantee you'd contact your representative..


----------



## renejr902

I want intel to buy radeon from amd, intel radeon cards will let nvidia in fear and price will become more interesting after some war between them







who need amd cpu anyway ? LoL , im sorry, i didnt like my amd 6 cores last year lol, still amd cpu could be buy by nvidia.







i would like these two giants fighting each others for cpu and gpu


----------



## renejr902

To be honest i wont do it, but in reality we should not buy this titan xp at that price, even the gtx 1080 is way too much expensive. Nvidia are not honest and fair with their customers.


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> Because there aren't people rioting in the street about it... if your water bill was 1000 dollars next month .. I guarantee you'd contact your representative..


Point taken. I dont see people marching the streets protesting about absurdly high gpu prices. I guess the hope lies with AMD if they ever decide to enter the enthusiast level market. I dont expect the government to fix anything honestly. Look at the state of our national healthcare system. Nothing gets fixed because all the key players are in bed with each other.


----------



## l88bastar

.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Inflation is the reason coke cost a nickel in the 1950s and $1 these days.
> 
> Inflation doesn't explain why a $329 GTX 570 now costs $1200.


Video games went mainstream. They are no longer the realm of fat nerds in basements hunched over a PC or kids playing NES on a 19" craptastic basic CRT color TV and no it has not necessarily been for the better as I don't take delight in cringe worthy marketing showcasing clueless celebs playing the latest and greatest blockbuster FPS. But that is what has happened. Its no longer the pristine best kept secret niche hobby. Same thing happened to the firearms market....two years ago my Mac 11a1 cost three grand, now they run eight to nine.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> It depends on what country and it depends on the monopoly. Most natural monopolies have high barriers to entry and therefor require government regulation. For instance.. .Utilities like electricity and water tend to be natural monopolies. The government strictly regulates regions that have only one service provider for those services because if they didn't your water bill in certain regions of the country would be 600 a month.
> 
> the Semiconductor and GPU industries are natural oligopolies.. the barrier to entry is extremely high now and they require government regulation. This is the reason I have advocated for Samsung or IBM to buy AMD for 6 years... because AMD CANNOT... compete with INTEL.. or Nvidia.


I'd rather see Intel buyout RTG tbh. RTG's talent backed by Intel's R&D budget and the world's most advanced fabs would make JHH sweat 24/7 even without that leather jacket lol.

I mean, just imagine what Raja Koduri and his team could accomplish if they weren't hamstrung by budget or fab concerns.

Incidentally, I get the feeling Intel would be a lot less opposed to keeping the Radeon branding than nVidia.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> I hold patents, copyrights and trademarks which all grant me monopolies. However, if I don't produce a quality product with them, those monopolies are useless as the consumer has the choice NOT to support me.





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Sorry, not going to argue with someone who has no understanding of economics. Good day, Sir!

"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference." -Mark Twain


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He already said he's skipping the 6950X, and I'm simply reaffirming that IMO is not a bad decision, and laid out my reasoning for it. I didn't simply go "hurr durr wayt fur Skylake-E durr".
> 
> A 6950X @ 4.2 will certainly lose to a 5960X @ 4.7 in single threaded applications. Probably will still beat it in a multi-threaded scenario but then that's not a clear win is it. Hence "marginal downgrade" comment.


Who buys an 8 or 10 core for single threaded applications? The 6950 is a beast. Unless all you do is game in which case a 6700k will suffice.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> No it's not. $650 is the ceiling. Anything more does not warrant any card out there games required to play. If they made 10 Witcher 3 like games every year then yes.


It's easy to put 150 hours into that game. Times that by ten, that's sixty two days. If you have that much time on your hands in general to play games, then you probably don't work. Thus unable to afford 1,200 dollars on a video card.

Myth busted.

On a more serious note, NV agrees 1,000 is not a consumer price point. It is however quite clearly a enthusiast price point.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> Who buys an 8 or 10 core for single threaded applications? The 6950 is a beast. Unless all you do is game in which case a 6700k will suffice.


Isn't the whole point of dishing out that kind of money on an 8 or 10 core chip is it's supposed to be the be all and end all, and cover all your bases?

Actually forget that for a second. My comment was very specific to his situation. Dude has a 5960X @ 4.7 which is faster than even a stock 6700K @ 4.4, so it'll churn through single threaded applications without breaking a sweat. And by virtue of its core count, multi-threaded performance is top notch as well. If he then "upgrades" to a 6950X @ 4.2 or 4.3, then he's actually regressing in single threaded performance. Ok yeah sure if the majority of his CPU time is spent with multi-threaded applications, then the 6950X might be worth it if he could get decent resale value on his 5960X.


----------



## magnek

I hate being pedantic, plus it's the internet, so as long as I can comprehend the post I don't really care.

Plus I just realized I made an error myself lol


----------



## one-shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I hate being pedantic, plus it's the internet, so as long as I can comprehend the post I don't really care.
> 
> Plus I just realized I made an error myself lol


I have a fragment in my post. lol

On Topic!

This card isn't too bad at $1200 if the performance is much greater than a single GTX 1080. I think we'll see mid-range AIBs for $750, putting SLI at $1500. If this card performs a bit less for $1200, without SLI issues, it's not that bad of a price. The key to this is to first accept the outrageous GTX 1080 price.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Every year, these Titan threads never disappoints lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'd rather see Intel buyout RTG tbh. RTG's talent backed by Intel's R&D budget and the world's most advanced fabs would make JHH sweat 24/7 even without that leather jacket lol.
> 
> I mean, just imagine what Raja Koduri and his team could accomplish if they weren't hamstrung by budget or fab concerns.
> 
> Incidentally, I get the feeling Intel would be a lot less opposed to keeping the Radeon branding than nVidia.


So would that make Nvidia lesser of two evils?


----------



## hokk

Got to say pretty tempeted on this when building my next rig but damn

$1200 is just too much i maybe could of accepted $999

also where is amd still nothing better than there 3 year old days :|


----------



## one-shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kylzer*
> 
> Got to say pretty tempeted on this when building my next rig but damn
> 
> $1200 is just too much i maybe could of accepted $999
> 
> also where is amd still nothing better than there 3 year old days :|


I have hopes for Vega to be around GTX 1070 performance, but not exceeding 1080 performance.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *one-shot*
> 
> I have hopes for Vega to be around GTX 1070 performance, but not exceeding 1080 performance.


That is really low expectation lol. Fury X is already around 1070 level.


----------



## Seyumi

Geeze people can you take this somewhere else. The last 20 pages were the same 6-12 people bickering back and forth about pricing. Just officially wasted 30 minutes of my life browsing through nothing but ranting. Yes pricing sucks but unless you have billions to fab your own GPUs there's nothing you can do except lower your expectations by buying something more affordable or quit the hobby all together. End of story.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> So would that make Nvidia lesser of two evils?


Umm what? I'm simply saying in the dreamland where we had a choice on the buyout of AMD's graphics division, I'd much rather see Intel buy them out than anybody else.


----------



## skypine27

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> Geeze people can you take this somewhere else. The last 20 pages were the same 6-12 people bickering back and forth about pricing. Just officially wasted 30 minutes of my life browsing through nothing but ranting. Yes pricing sucks but unless you have billions to fab your own GPUs there's nothing you can do except lower your expectations by buying something more affordable or quit the hobby all together. End of story.


Yup, no **** bro.

I once had to say to a guy (think it was about the upcoming Battle Field 1):
"You don't have to consume things you don't want to."

Seems people have lost the basic building blocks of common sense. Don't buy something you don't want to.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Umm what? I'm simply saying in the dreamland where we had a choice on the buyout of AMD's graphics division, I'd much rather see Intel buy them out than anybody else.


My joke post failed............


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> Geeze people can you take this somewhere else. The last 20 pages were the same 6-12 people bickering back and forth about pricing. Just officially wasted 30 minutes of my life browsing through nothing but ranting. Yes pricing sucks but unless you have billions to fab your own GPUs there's nothing you can do except lower your expectations by buying something more affordable or quit the hobby all together. End of story.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skypine27*
> 
> Yup, no **** bro.
> 
> I once had to say to a guy (think it was about the upcoming Battle Field 1):
> "You don't have to consume things you don't want to."
> 
> Seems people have lost the basic building blocks of common sense. Don't buy something you don't want to.


In all fairness, _what_ is there left to talk about, given the scarce details nVidia has revealed thus far?

We _have_ discussed specs, performance estimates, GDDR5X vs HBM2, and other technical stuff. I don't see why outcry at the price is a problem. If you want a sanitized "praise the lord JHH for such an impressive product" thread you won't find it here. If the thread has run its course then perhaps we should ask the mods to close it.

And no offense l88bastar, but the thread only took a turn for the worse after a certain post you made.

With that out of the way, please carry on with your non-price related discussions now.


----------



## renejr902

Can we talk about JHH jacket now ! I like his jeans too

Enough jokes









Whats the die size, what do you think?


----------



## magnek

aaaaaaand we talked about that too!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> so how big will this die be ? ~440-450 mm2 ? or 470-480mm2 ?
> 
> stock vs stock we can expect this to be ~30% faster than a 1080 in games ? maybe 35% ..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> 312 x 1.5 = 468mm^2
> 
> so around 460-80 yes.
> 
> this isn't fully enabled GP102 though. so expect another card with full die later.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tajoh111*
> 
> Probably 490-510mm2.
> 
> 314mm2 = 7.2 billion transistors.
> 
> 12/7.2 = 1.666
> 
> 1.666* 314 = 523mm2.
> 
> Larger dies have higher transistor density so 490 to 510mm2.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> That is really low expectation lol. Fury X is already around 1070 level.


I expect vega hbm2 to be half way between gtx 1080 and titan xp


----------



## magnek

Historically, neither company has ever succeeded in getting 1:1 scaling when doubling up on a chip. 290 (non-X) was basically a doubled up 270X and had 1.6x the performance. Fury X was a doubled up 280X (itself a rebranded 7970 GE) and had 1.7-1.9x the performance depending on resolution. So, if we literally double up the P10 chip used in RX 480 (double everything, from shaders to ROPs to TMUs etc), a low estimate would put it around 1070 performance, and a high estimate would put it pretty much equal to 1080 performance. And this is assuming the big chips can maintain the same clocks as the smaller chips.

So a hypothetical Vega with 4608 shaders would be around 1080 performance.. Suppose we can get another 20% performance out of it through OCing. Assuming the most optimistic 1:1 scaling, that means we need it running around 1520 MHz. So this Vega chip with 4608 shaders overclocked to 1520 MHz would be 20% ahead of a stock 1080. But we know that Polaris struggles to even reach 1400+ game stable clocks, and scaling is never 1:1.

Also, current rumors say Vega will only have 4096 shaders, which means there's a chance it may not even reach stock 1080 performance. Obviously there are still a lot of unknowns, and HBM2 remains a big wild card. But working with what data we have at the moment, I'm gonna say within 10% of 1080; + if you're optimistic, - if you're pessimistic.


----------



## renejr902

I expect 500mm2-520mm2 too, but im really not sure

About performance i expect 30%-35% faster than gtx 1080 too. And add another 10-15% after overclocking, just enough for a average of 65-70fps in 4k and no hairwork for witcher3 and 65-70fps average for rise of tomb raider. Crysis 3 and far cry primal will have a hard time to get 60fps at 4k, maybe 55fps average, but i really hope for 60+


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Titan X = 1.5x 980 in terms of chip spec, but in actual games only ended up being 25-35% faster. And this with only a 6.7% boost deficit relative to the 980 on average. (1119 MHz vs 1194 across 9 games) If you look through that Anandtech review, in the two games with the smallest boost clock difference (Crysis 3 and GRID Autosport), Titan X ends up being only ~35% faster even at 4K.
> 
> Titan XP = 1.4x 1080 in terms of chip spec (well shader count really since we know nothing about number of TMUs and ROPs), but the official listed boost clock at 1513 MHz is already 12.7% slower than 1080's official boost of 1733 MHz. So there's just no way stock vs stock the Titan XP will end up being 40% faster. As I've said previously, stock vs stock I expect Titan XP to be ~25% faster.


lol maybe we're arguing over price because we truly have run out of things to discuss







:/


----------



## Exilon

Welp, I guess we're done then. See you guys in a week when the reviews come out so I can read people bickering about a card I have no intention of buying.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Historically, neither company has ever succeeded in getting 1:1 scaling when doubling up on a chip. 290 (non-X) was basically a doubled up 270X and had 1.6x the performance. Fury X was a doubled up 280X (itself a rebranded 7970 GE) and had 1.7-1.9x the performance depending on resolution. So, if we literally double up the P10 chip used in RX 480 (double everything, from shaders to ROPs to TMUs etc), a low estimate would put it around 1070 performance, and a high estimate would put it pretty much equal to 1080 performance. And this is assuming the big chips can maintain the same clocks as the smaller chips.
> 
> So a hypothetical Vega with 4608 shaders would be around 1080 performance.. Suppose we can get another 20% performance out of it through OCing. Assuming the most optimistic 1:1 scaling, that means we need it running around 1520 MHz. So this Vega chip with 4608 shaders overclocked to 1520 MHz would be 20% ahead of a stock 1080. But we know that Polaris struggles to even reach 1400+ game stable clocks, and scaling is never 1:1.
> 
> Also, current rumors say Vega will only have 4096 shaders, which means there's a chance it may not even reach stock 1080 performance. Obviously there are still a lot of unknowns, and HBM2 remains a big wild card. But working with what data we have at the moment, I'm gonna say within 10% of 1080; + if you're optimistic, - if you're pessimistic.


I never understand why radeon cards has more cores unit and tflops than nvidia cards and never perform like them. Can someone here explain me that shortly ? Thanks

( about memory bandwith i know they dont compress memory like nvidia can do, but about core units and tflops i dont understand they cant perform better than nvidia)


----------



## magnek

lol you might want to PM Mahigan or sugarhell and ask them for a nice, long, detailed technical explanation. I don't know enough of the technical details, much less be able to do a tl;dr version of it.

also inb4 "because AMD drivers suck"


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> lol so your a teacher huh..... that explains a lot. So you just kinda sit there in your ivory tower and collect a check for dictating your superiority complex to the young?
> 
> Well I am a self made, self employed businessman / inventor with an accredited MBA in finance, who holds copyrights, patents and trademarks......but please get back to me when you actually run your own business, dictate hiring and firing, budget for R&D, innovate against competitors, etc, etc.
> 
> Oh and that slam accusing me of being an Ageist, while insulting me with an ageist comment was pure gold


Hey you jerk, I worked in the private sector for 15 years. I didn't just sit in an ivory tower. I gave up a 6 figure salary to CHOOSE to teach in a school that was underserved. I'm sorry you care about money more than society. That's not a problem I can fix, nor a therapist unfortunately.

How you got an MBA with that grammar scares the hell out of me. You don't understand natural monopolies, the need for regulation, OR grammar. Whatever school gave you a MBA failed you not in grade, but in quality. I apologize on behalf of the entire education system.


----------



## Silent Scone

Give him a break, he just told you he's an inventor. It's obvious he invented his own dialect/language.


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> Give him a break, he just told you he's an inventor. It's obvious he invented his own dialect/language.


He should patent it.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Historically, neither company has ever succeeded in getting 1:1 scaling when doubling up on a chip. 290 (non-X) was basically a doubled up 270X and had 1.6x the performance. Fury X was a doubled up 280X (itself a rebranded 7970 GE) and had 1.7-1.9x the performance depending on resolution. So, if we literally double up the P10 chip used in RX 480 (double everything, from shaders to ROPs to TMUs etc), a low estimate would put it around 1070 performance, and a high estimate would put it pretty much equal to 1080 performance. And this is assuming the big chips can maintain the same clocks as the smaller chips.
> 
> So a hypothetical Vega with 4608 shaders would be around 1080 performance.. Suppose we can get another 20% performance out of it through OCing. Assuming the most optimistic 1:1 scaling, that means we need it running around 1520 MHz. So this Vega chip with 4608 shaders overclocked to 1520 MHz would be 20% ahead of a stock 1080. But we know that Polaris struggles to even reach 1400+ game stable clocks, and scaling is never 1:1.
> 
> Also, current rumors say Vega will only have 4096 shaders, which means there's a chance it may not even reach stock 1080 performance. Obviously there are still a lot of unknowns, and HBM2 remains a big wild card. But working with what data we have at the moment, I'm gonna say within 10% of 1080; + if you're optimistic, - if you're pessimistic.


^ something like this

though with 4096 I absolutely cannot see it beating a stock 1080 (except the usual - in Hitman & Doom Vulkan), at best equaling it

with significantly more than 4096 yeah, but thats gonna be so hard to reach


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> He should patent it.


And I'll make sure it gets invalidated it for "prior art".


----------



## Cybertox

The GPU itself and its specifications are great but that price tag...

I am still looking for an upgrade, while my 290X did a great job serving me, its time for it to go. The Titan X could have been a plausible replacement if it wasnt for that $1200 price tag, god I dont want to even know how much it is going to cost in Switzerland. Probably like 1700 franks. I just hope that by Winter time either the price will fall or there will be a better alternative.


----------



## guttheslayer

The $1200 ruined it especially it only comes with that crappy over-gaming design cooler.

And they only allow it to be purchased under Nvidia directly, making it almost impossible for any non-ref option.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> And they only allow it to be purchased under Nvidia directly, making it almost impossible for any non-ref option.


It's a _Titan_. Even if Nvidia weren't selling it directly, the add-in board partners would be prevented from selling it with a non-reference cooler anyway. That's the way it's been with every _Titan_ there's been. It comes with Nvidia's blower cooler or it doesn't come at all.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> The $1200 ruined it especially it only comes with that crappy over-gaming design cooler.
> 
> And they only allow it to be purchased under Nvidia directly, making it almost impossible for any non-ref option.


Is the nvidia cooler quality lower than aib partner like asus,msi,gigabyte..? I always buy a 2 or 3 fans cooler videocard, so im in fear buying that titan xp with only one fan and specially overclocking it with one fan only







But my rig has a great airflow

I suppose EKWB will release a water cooling option...


----------



## meson1

Well whatever board I end up buying, be it a Titan or a 1080, it'll be going under water. EKWB ftw.


----------



## Ascii Aficionado

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I give it 2 years.


I was thinking we'd have something like an 1180 Ti by very late December 2017 seeing as how all of the 10** GPU's are out and that it would be slightly faster than the new Titan.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ascii Aficionado*
> 
> I was thinking we'd have something like an 1180 Ti by very late December 2017 seeing as how all of the 10** GPU's are out and that it would be slightly faster than the new Titan.


We haven't seen the GP100 yet. I think they're holding that back until next year. Use it as the basis for another tier of cards before they get to Volta in 2018.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> It's a _Titan_. Even if Nvidia weren't selling it directly, the add-in board partners would be prevented from selling it with a non-reference cooler anyway. That's the way it's been with every _Titan_ there's been. It comes with Nvidia's blower cooler or it doesn't come at all.


Gigabyte has a Titan X variant with AIO and also a Windforce edition (Extreme Gaming).

I rmb another TX with artic cooler AIO too, as well as titan Hydro copper from EVGA.

Yes they do come with non-ref option, limted but not completely nil. This time round. Pascal one is nil and that is awful big time. And no, not everyone is a fan of custom loop.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> ^ something like this
> 
> though with 4096 I absolutely cannot see it beating a stock 1080 (except the usual - in Hitman & Doom Vulkan), at best equaling it
> 
> with significantly more than 4096 yeah, but thats gonna be so hard to reach


AMD will disappoint as it always been. To add on what Magnek said. *Doubling the core will almost certainly double the TDP.*

A 4608 cores Vega will consume 300W of TDP. So AMD how much higher do you want to go? A nuclear furnace?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> It's a _Titan_. Even if Nvidia weren't selling it directly, the add-in board partners would be prevented from selling it with a non-reference cooler anyway. That's the way it's been with every _Titan_ there's been. It comes with Nvidia's blower cooler or it doesn't come at all.


Forget non-reference cooler, the bigger problem is no non-reference _board_. Dunno about you but I really do not like how nVidia does the "just good enough" bit for their VRMs. Sure we're long past the days of Fermi where VRMs popped left right and center, but a halo product like Titan is supposed to be crafted from the best components possible, not "we're gonna cut every corner possible to squeeze the most margins out of it".

Really, nVidia could learn a thing or two from AMD when it comes to building reference boards.


----------



## Slaughtahouse

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Forget non-reference cooler, the bigger problem is no non-reference _board_. Dunno about you but I really do not like how nVidia does the "just good enough" bit for their VRMs. Sure we're long past the days of Fermi where VRMs popped left right and center, but a halo product like Titan is supposed to be crafted from the best components possible, not "we're gonna cut every corner possible to squeeze the most margins out of it".
> 
> Really, nVidia could learn a thing or two from AMD when it comes to building reference boards.


Until AMD rival Nvidia in the high end, Nvidia is free to do as they please. Price tags, vrm's, basic cooling etc.


----------



## magnek

Ummm, AMD gave nVidia plenty of competition during the Fermi era, and Fermi's still had absolute dog turd VRMs.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> We haven't seen the GP100 yet. I think they're holding that back until next year. Use it as the basis for another tier of cards before they get to Volta in 2018.


GP100 has too much double precision hardware weighing it down. It's >600mm and not that much faster in FP32 compared to GP104.

GP102 is almost certainly a bigger GP104 with bare minimum FP64. Considering how GP106, GP104, and GP102 are laid out, I wouldn't be surprised to see a GP112 Titan next year with 8 GPCs + HBM coming in at ~600mm.


----------



## magnek

Why would there be a GP112? If they really wanted to release an HBM2 based GeForce card they could just re-purpose the existing GP100 parts after 16nm FF matures and 610mm² dies have yields above single digits (I'm just pulling this number out of my ass).

Also given that HBM2 and GDDR5X would require radically different memory controllers, I'm starting to doubt there will even be an HBM2 GeForce card for Pascal. Maybe late 2017 when the node matures and HBM2 costs go down, but certainly not the near future.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Why would there be a GP112? If they really wanted to release an HBM2 based GeForce card they could just re-purpose the existing GP100 parts after 16nm FF matures and 610mm² dies have yields above single digits (I'm just pulling this number out of my ass).
> 
> Also given that HBM2 and GDDR5X would require radically different memory controllers, I'm starting to doubt there will even be an HBM2 GeForce card for Pascal. Maybe late 2017 when 16nm FF matures and HBM2 costs go down, but certainly not the near future.


I don't think GP100 will be faster than GP102 for gaming and FP32.

Pascal is basically two different architectures under one name, one has lots of hardware for supporting FP64 and the other for gaming. GP100 is also at the limits of fabrication due to the FP64 hardware and larger registers, so there's no more opportunity to scale up. The new Titan only has 1 disabled SM... the only way up without a 8 GPC consumer card would be to pull a Titan Black round 2, with 7% more shaders and slightly faster GDDR5X, which would be pretty pathetic if it were all Nvidia had until 2018.

Unless Nvidia really screwed the pooch, their GP100 HBM controller IP should be usable by a hypothetical FP32 focused 8 GPC part. The question would be whether they could charge >$1200 for it and still have enough volume to make it worth while.


----------



## emett

So anyone getting one?


----------



## Benny89

I wonder if Volta will be end of 2017 or more likely 2018.

The only good thing is- being 1440p fanboy whatever upgrade I will make from 980Ti (Titan X Black or 1080Ti or whatever) It will serve me well in quite long time









I love how Nvidia is chasing that 60 fps in 4k, meaning people with high-refresh rates 1440p monitor will have a lot of GPU power for hight FPS gameplay







. Hell 125 fps on average on DOOM 4 on 1440p Ultra on my 980Ti is already sufficient!


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> So anyone getting one?


No. I'm waiting for the 8 GPC monster with 5120 CUDA cores and 4096-bit HBM2

Ok, that's unrealistic. I'll allow them to disable 1 SM for 4864 cores, but no less









Seriously though, I'm waiting to see if AMD can pull their efficiency out of the gutter so they can scale GCN up to combat big Pascal. Nvidia can only charge a Titanic price when there's no competition.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Gigabyte has a Titan X variant with AIO and also a Windforce edition (Extreme Gaming).
> 
> I rmb another TX with artic cooler AIO too, as well as titan Hydro copper from EVGA.
> 
> Yes they do come with non-ref option, limted but not completely nil. This time round. Pascal one is nil and that is awful big time. And no, not everyone is a fan of custom loop.


Gigabyte don't sell Titans fitted with their non-reference coolers. They got round it by selling the regular Titan bundled with one of their own coolers for the user to fit.

I've not heard of Arctic before, but looking at their website, they don't sell graphics cards. They just sell aftermarket coolers.

As for the EVGA Hydros, Nvidia clearly agreed to let them release watercooled variants.


----------



## JambonJovi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xzamples*
> 
> people are willing to pay $1200, which makes me think... are people also willing to pay $1500, perhaps $2000?


Ofc they are. You're always going to find people that have more money
than sense and get it purely because they can and because it's a _Tiituuurrrn_.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Faster Nvidia GPU coming out late this year or early next like I thought? Seems like others share the same thoughts.


----------



## Thetbrett

all I want to know if is a 3770k @4.4 will bottleneck this.


----------



## The-Real-Link

Hi
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The-Real-Link*
> 
> Darn, thought I'd be ready to sell my Titan for a Titan but if this Titan is really just a slightly chopped down Tesla then that's too bad. But still if it's 45-60% gain on the old X, that's tempting. $1200 is a bit ouch, though...


Well, for games, mostly WoW and FFXIV / some shooters here and there but wanting to do 4K60 max. I have a UHD screen show and still love my 60 + eye candy haha. That and some photo and video editing at 1080p60 and 4K60 rates too.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Thetbrett*
> 
> all I want to know if is a 3770k @4.4 will bottleneck this.


I was bottlenecked in a few games at 4.7Ghz and 980 TI SLI. New Tomb Raider for example (GeoThermal Valley).


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Faster Nvidia GPU coming out late this year or early next like I thought? Seems like others share the same thoughts.


It all depends on when Volta hits the market. If volta hits the market in 2018, then you can expect a refresh to pascal early 2017 in the form of 1080Ti or 1180 whatever they call it.1080Ti being a GP102 further cut down chip perhaps with a 320 bit bus and 10gb ram instead of a the 384 and 12gb of the titan. The 1180 perhaps being a HBM2 version of GP102.

The latest roadmap shows volta hitting the market towards the end of 2017 so that would suggest a Q2 2017 1180 is probably off the tables since it'd have too short of a product life. So if we get another card, it'd be in 2016. Such a card would almost definitely be a cut down version of the new Titan X. As suggested earlier, 320bit 10gb with a few SM disabled. If we get it in time for the holidays, it'd carry us 12 months into the 2017 holidays for a volta release.

EDIT: Either that or nothing at all, depending on AMD of course


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benny89*
> 
> I wonder if Volta will be end of 2017 or more likely 2018.


*GTC 2016
*


----------



## Thetbrett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I was bottlenecked in a few games at 4.7Ghz and 980 TI SLI. New Tomb Raider for example (GeoThermal Valley).


thanks. I held off the 1080 knowing a new card was ot far off, didn't expect it this quick though. I will also wait for reviews of course, but perhaps the 1080 would be a better buy for me because if I get this, and I start bottlenecking, I will go the inevitable "it's time to get a new chip", which I really don't want to do just yet. I've got the X34, and I find I get 60-80 fps most games I play already maxed on 1 980ti. A 1080 would probably push that close to 100. Do i need a card that can push past 100 fps on a 100hz panel? I think I just answered my own question. I'm going to wait for these to filter through and get a 1080 second hand or wait a bit longer to see what the new card price does.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Thetbrett*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I was bottlenecked in a few games at 4.7Ghz and 980 TI SLI. New Tomb Raider for example (GeoThermal Valley).
> 
> 
> 
> thanks. I held off the 1080 knowing a new card was ot far off, didn't expect it this quick though. I will also wait for reviews of course, but perhaps the 1080 would be a better buy for me because if I get this, and I start bottlenecking, I will go the inevitable "it's time to get a new chip", which I really don't want to do just yet. I've got the X34, and I find I get 60-80 fps most games I play already maxed on 1 980ti. A 1080 would probably push that close to 100. Do i need a card that can push past 100 fps on a 100hz panel? I think I just answered my own question. I'm going to wait for these to filter through and get a 1080 second hand or wait a bit longer to see what the new card price does.
Click to expand...

You won't bottleneck this card with a 4K or a 34" ultra wide monitor.


----------



## Clocknut

I think Nvidia well know where the limit their customer budget is, considering the TITAN Z is a failure. I guess thats where the limit is lol


----------



## Defoler

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Tesla P100 aka GP100
> 3584 cores. 15.3 billion transistors
> 
> Titan X aka GP102
> 3584 cores. 12 billion transistors
> 
> Something have been cut off...


Most likely the nvlink hardware connection parts and specific calculation cores, which you can not turn into a normal cuda core.


----------



## Glottis

Where did the rumor that it will only be sold on Nvidia website came from? And if that's true, is that only for North America? I highly doubt it will be the same to rest of the world as Nvidia website probably doesn't even ship to every country worldwide, leaving rest of the world potential customers screwed.


----------



## JackCY

Will it run Crysis?







You know, 4K 120fps minimum.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> You won't bottleneck this card with a 4K or a 34" ultra wide monitor.


I was running at 1440p so I'm guessing it's a little less bottleneck @3440x1440p and probably not at 4k.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> Where did the rumor that it will only be sold on Nvidia website came from? And if that's true, is that only for North America? I highly doubt it will be the same to rest of the world as Nvidia website probably doesn't even ship to every country worldwide, leaving rest of the world potential customers screwed.


It's not a rumor. That is straight from Nvidia themselves. Check out Nvidia's own news article > Link to article on Nvidia UK where they say "*NVIDIA TITAN X will be available August 2nd, exclusively from the NVIDIA TITAN X product page.*"

I'm guessing they have the capability to sell the Titan X direct worldwide.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> Where did the rumor that it will only be sold on Nvidia website came from? And if that's true, is that only for North America? I highly doubt it will be the same to rest of the world as Nvidia website probably doesn't even ship to every country worldwide, leaving rest of the world potential customers screwed.


Quote:


> TITAN X will be available Aug. 2 for $1,200 direct from nvidia.com in North America and Europe, and select system builders. It is coming soon to Asia.


*https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/07/21/titan-x/*


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> It's not a rumor. That is straight from Nvidia themselves. Check out Nvidia's own news article > Link to article on Nvidia UK where they say "*NVIDIA TITAN X will be available August 2nd, exclusively from the NVIDIA TITAN X product page.*"
> 
> I'm guessing they have the capability to sell the Titan X direct worldwide.


well that sucks, so it's official, people who live outside 20 or so countries that Nvidia officially ship to from their online store won't be able to buy Titan X.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> well that sucks, so it's official, people who live outside 20 or so countries that Nvidia officially ship to from their online store won't be able to buy Titan X.


It is annoying for sure. I usually pick up gear at a local computer store here. Now I have to pay shipping and customs to get a Titan-X.


----------



## Olivon

Shipping is free on the nVidia store but I don't like this kind of exclusivity too.


----------



## KarathKasun

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Celcius*
> 
> Just found this out, maybe it should be added to the OP:
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd
> 
> "Meanwhile for distribution, making a departure from previous generations, the card is only being sold directly by NVIDIA through their website. The company's board partners will not be distributing it, though system builders will still be able to include it."
> 
> This time around EVGA, ASUS, and others won't be selling it at all.


This is REALLY scary. The last time this happened, 3DFX went out of business.

Looks like NV is burning a bridge with AIB partners if this is even slightly true. They are telling them "We are going to take 100% of the profits of the most profitable product we have, in return we are throwing you a bone on MSRP for other products (in the form of inflated FE prices)."

The FE bull makes much more sense now.


----------



## SirWaWa

should have named it titan x squared


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I don't think GP100 will be faster than GP102 for gaming and FP32.
> 
> Pascal is basically two different architectures under one name, one has lots of hardware for supporting FP64 and the other for gaming. GP100 is also at the limits of fabrication due to the FP64 hardware and larger registers, so there's no more opportunity to scale up. The new Titan only has 1 disabled SM... the only way up without a 8 GPC consumer card would be to pull a Titan Black round 2, with 7% more shaders and slightly faster GDDR5X, which would be pretty pathetic if it were all Nvidia had until 2018.
> 
> Unless Nvidia really screwed the pooch, their GP100 HBM controller IP should be usable by a hypothetical FP32 focused 8 GPC part. The question would be whether they could charge >$1200 for it and still have enough volume to make it worth while.


I don't know if Nvidia ever explicitly said it, but I remember some discussion last year about how in the future Nvidia was going to split the compute and gaming market and have chips more specifically designed for each. Which is what it looks like is happening, with GP100 for the compute market only and GP102 for gaming. It makes sense, since then you can better design the chop for the particular market, getting rid of FP64 cores in gaming chips and adding things like NVLink to the compute ones. Just requires a big enough R&D budget, which it seems they have.


----------



## d3v0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> Yes. Instead of dropping the 1080 to the 500 tier where it should be, instead of pricing the Ti at 650 - 700, they use Titan name and charge titan price for the Ti.


Please enlighten us as to why they should price the 1080, which is considerably faster than the GTX 980Ti, for *less than the GTX 980Ti was selling for at the 1080 launch?* Perhaps your inability to understand simple business economics is why you constantly complain about any card that costs more than $200.

Save up some money, stop complaining.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Faster Nvidia GPU coming out late this year or early next like I thought? Seems like others share the same thoughts.


If you think about it, they cannot release a higher end Titan-XP "black edition". This Titan-XP is already black.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I don't know if Nvidia ever explicitly said it, but I remember some discussion last year about how in the future Nvidia was going to split the compute and gaming market and have chips more specifically designed for each. Which is what it looks like is happening, with GP100 for the compute market only and GP102 for gaming. It makes sense, since then you can better design the chop for the particular market, getting rid of FP64 cores in gaming chips and adding things like NVLink to the compute ones. Just requires a big enough R&D budget, which it seems they have.


So that confirm that Pascal wont get HBM on their Geforce counterpart nor Titan series. At least for this year.

Titan for 2017 might get HBM variant for out-of-the-world pricing, follow by a refresh of 1100 series all the way till 1180 Ti (with full blown 3840 on G5X)

Volta will be the true Geforce chip that comes with HBM and is only exclusive to the flagship geforce (GTX 1280/70), and it wont come till mid 2018, where it will be long enough for HBM2 to drop price sufficiently to be on par with current G5X.

Full pascal lineup 2017 edition (# denote variant)

Titan #1 - 3840, GP100 16GB HBM2
Titan #2 - 3584, GP100 12GB HBM2

GTX 1180 Ti - 3840 GP102 12GB G5X
GTX 1180 - 3200 GP102 12GB G5X
GTX 1170 - 2560 GP104 8GB G5X
GTX 1160 Ti - 1920 GP104 8GB G5X
GTX 1160 - 1536 GP104 8GB G5X
GTX 1150 Ti - 1280 GP104 6GB G5X
GTX 1150 - 1280 GP106 4GB G5X

As for why GP100 contain 15.3 Bil transistor while GP102 only has 12 bil, is becz it is stripped completely of DP compute, GP104 has 7.2 billion transistor, so 7.2 x 1.5 = 10.8 billion, plus some deep learning function ~ 12 billion. Or maybe, just maybe there is some ACE inside?


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> well that sucks, so it's official, people who live outside 20 or so countries that Nvidia officially ship to from their online store won't be able to buy Titan X.


Indeed, which means I won't be buying any. And I'm glad, because there is another card to come, I'm not spending £1200 per GPU for it to be superseded in 2months again like what happened to the GTX 1080. Nvidia can go jump this time around...


----------



## Badexample

Where can I pre-order the new Titan X in Canada? Anybody knows?


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> It's not a rumor. That is straight from Nvidia themselves. Check out Nvidia's own news article > Link to article on Nvidia UK where they say "*NVIDIA TITAN X will be available August 2nd, exclusively from the NVIDIA TITAN X product page.*"
> 
> I'm guessing they have the capability to sell the Titan X direct worldwide.


I think NVIDIA will start selling them from their website first then go the normal distribution route. Probably have a small available quantity available due to production.


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> It is annoying for sure. I usually pick up gear at a local computer store here. Now I have to pay shipping and customs to get a Titan-X.


Same here, Shipping, customs and B.C. taxes! LOL


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> So anyone getting one?


Since I don't play the hardware buy and sell trading game every few months, my issue with Nvidia is its approach to planned feature/driver based planned obsolescence. If the card doesn't come with an explicit guarantee of a period of optimization support, I am not interested in dishing out big bucks just to be able to play current DX 11 games at 60 fps at 4K for a few months, before any games start to utilize some DX 12 features that card may or may not be capable of playing at the desired performance level. Every time I think about going high end Nvidia, I am reminded of the limited optimization support period (for new games) for Titan Black and Titan Z before Maxwell dropped within 5-7 after the release of these "high end" cards at the time.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d3v0*
> 
> Please enlighten us as to why they should price the 1080, which is considerably faster than the GTX 980Ti, for *less than the GTX 980Ti was selling for at the 1080 launch?* Perhaps your inability to understand simple business economics is why you constantly complain about any card that costs more than $200.
> 
> Save up some money, stop complaining.


Just.... lol


----------



## TUFinside

1200 dollars for 25% more performance and 4 more gigs over GTX 1080, is it a joke ? (1080FE is 700 dollars)


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> 1200 dollars for 25% more performance and 4 more gigs over GTX 1080, is it a joke ? (1080FE is 700 dollars)


It's irresponsible performance.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> 1200 dollars for 25% more performance and 4 more gigs over GTX 1080, is it a joke ? (1080FE is 700 dollars)


To be fair this is nothing new to any of us, top tier flagships have always been priced sky high.

Price vs Performance is irrelevant at this level. You want the fastest thing on the planet? You better pay for it.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> To be fair this is nothing new to any of us, top tier flagships have always been priced sky high.
> 
> Price vs Performance is irrelevant at this level. You want the fastest thing on the planet? You better pay for it.


Will there be a 1080Ti or not ? The quick releases of the 1080/1070/1060 and now Titan X confuses me. I understand the price of this Titan X is to avoid to make competition against the 1080, and we can blame AMD for this.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> It's irresponsible performance.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> Will there be a 1080Ti or not ? The quick releases of the 1080/1070/1060 and now Titan X confuses me. I understand the price of this Titan X is to avoid to make competition against the 1080, and we can blame AMD for this.


Probably not. There is no room or reason for 1080 Ti. Titan XP is a lot more expensive and 1080 is in 980 Ti price point.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Probably not. There is no room or reason for 1080 Ti. Titan XP is a lot more expensive and 1080 is in 980 Ti price point.


That seem to be the case. No Ti except GTX 1180 followed by its 1180 Ti variant which is full blown GP102.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d3v0*
> 
> Please enlighten us as to why they should price the 1080, which is considerably faster than the GTX 980Ti, for *less than the GTX 980Ti was selling for at the 1080 launch?* Perhaps your inability to understand simple business economics is why you constantly complain about any card that costs more than $200.
> 
> Save up some money, stop complaining.


The paycheck just got 50 dollars higher









Why should consumers even care about business? You're clearly on the businessman side instead of being on the consumer side,even though you don't see a single cent from the price increase,or do you?









Just keep thinking like that,and enjoy your overpriced 314 mm2 GPU. It won't be long enough until Gx106 will cost 400 USD or more.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> The paycheck just got 50 dollars higher


Ppl like him explain why the price is always inflating...

8800 Ultra was selling for 830 USD yet the TX is >10x faster at least why not price it at 8300 USD. It make perfect sense!


----------



## Sheyster

It's really not that hard to figure out the timing of this release. Look who the target audience is: Folks who bought the original Titan X. It was launched in mid-March of last year. nVidia figures these folks are ready (and can afford) to upgrade after 16 months, and they're probably right! I predict the Titan XP will sell out within 30 minutes or less once they turn on the "Add to cart" button.


----------



## TUFinside

Looking for an utterly rich PC hardware enthusiast to send me 1200 USD to help a poor GPUless PC hardware enthusiast.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> Looking for an utterly rich PC hardware enthusiast to send me 1200 USD to help a poor GPUless PC hardware enthusiast.


In the meantime, the CEO of Baidu Andrew Ng got it for free, so is 4 other lucky draw contestant.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> In the meantime, the CEO of Baidu Andrew Ng got it for free, so is 4 other lucky draw contestant.


Yes, but i'm not "a pioneer, an amazing scientist, and a hero to us all."


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> Looking for an utterly rich PC hardware enthusiast to send me 1200 USD to help a poor GPUless PC hardware enthusiast.


Save up for a used 980 Ti or Titan X. Much more affordable and still plenty of power even for an "enthusiast".









What is the definition of "enthusiast" exactly? According to Merriam-Webster:

_Full Definition of enthusiast. : a person filled with enthusiasm: as a : one who is ardently attached to a cause, object, or pursuit. One who tends to become ardently absorbed in an interest._

It does not mention anything about having lots of money to be able to buy the best-in-class CPU/GPU, etc.









I always go all out with GPUs, but I'm much more conservative with CPUs. My PC is for gaming use only and I cut corners all the time, even though I don't really need to. My advice is to always take a common sense approach to PC building. Don't buy what you don't need, and keep your focus on what makes the most impact to your use of said PC.


----------



## carlhil2

What is needed to keep cpu/gpu prices down is simple:we need more than TWO companies competing for our loot....


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> What is needed to keep cpu/gpu prices down is simple:we need more than TWO companies competing for our loot....


The whole issue here is that the other company, AMD, is incapable of competing and keeping prices in check.
Not only have they screwed up CPUs and are about to come back after years and years of pushing out products based on a crappy CPU architecture, but they are simultaniously starting to fall behind with GPUs now...

Great job AMD


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> The whole issue here is that the other company, AMD, is incapable of competing and keeping prices in check.
> Not only have they screwed up CPUs and are about to come back after years and years of pushing out products based on a crappy CPU architecture, but they are simultaniously starting to fall behind with GPUs now...
> 
> Great job AMD


I think that Polaris is a good gpu for the price. they just need Vega to compete, possibly beat the 1080. AMD shouldn't even try to compete with nVIDIA's $1000+ gpu. if Vega can OC well, and, priced right, AMD will get some sales....AMD cpu? no comment....


----------



## DarkIdeals

@Magnek


----------



## Benny89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> @Magnek
> 
> http://imgur.com/a/M0GLy


Savage


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> The whole issue here is that the other company, AMD, is incapable of competing and keeping prices in check.
> Not only have they screwed up CPUs and are about to come back after years and years of pushing out products based on a crappy CPU architecture, but they are simultaniously starting to fall behind with GPUs now...
> 
> Great job AMD


Bingo! Jen-Hsun said in the video for this Titan that the market doesn't set the price for this gpu. The competition does. Until Amd starts to focus on PC gaming again we're all screwed on getting reasonable prices. Remember the days of getting a flagship single gpu at $500. Hard to imagine within 3 years we're sitting at $1200. Amd has screwed us all. I saw it coming years ago. Call me a fanboy but that's why I refuse to put their product into my rig. They're a train wreck and have been for many years.


----------



## keikei

Whos to blame for Nvidia charging $1200 for this card? Look in the mirror.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> I think that Polaris is a good gpu for the price. they just need Vega to compete, possibly beat the 1080. AMD shouldn't even try to compete with nVIDIA's $1000+ gpu. if Vega can OC well, and, priced right, AMD will get some sales....AMD cpu? no comment....


RX 480 is a good GPU, right there along with GTX 1060.
That was not my point. My point is that Nvidia is out with GTX 1080, 1070, 1060, Titan, Tesla P100. GP100, GP102, GP104, GP106.
AMD is out with RX 480. Polaris 10. Obviously they want the money from all tier groups as well, but for some reason cant and are nowhere to be seen.

Vega is a product way ahead of us in the future. Sometime during 2018. Thats all we know. People say "wait for Vega", but how does that help someone that have other potential products from Nvidia hanging in front of them, ready to be purchased right now? Nobody doesnt even know what Vega will do in terms of performance. Thats a crappy situation for many people. Disregard something powerful now, and possibly be stuck with a worse performing card in 2018 because AMD wasnt able to deliver quite as good performance. Time wasted.
Ive followed the AMD reddit forum for a while and there are countless of posts from loyal AMD buyers that have gotten cards from AMD for many years, that have found nothing that AMD offer to be enough today, so they jumped ship and got the GTX 1070.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Probably not. There is no room or reason for 1080 Ti. Titan XP is a lot more expensive and 1080 is in 980 Ti price point.


Technically there's no reason for this Titan X, since AMD has nothing to compete with the GTX 1080 as it is.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Save up for a used 980 Ti or Titan X. Much more affordable and still plenty of power even for an "enthusiast".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What is the definition of "enthusiast" exactly? According to Merriam-Webster:
> 
> _Full Definition of enthusiast. : a person filled with enthusiasm: as a : one who is ardently attached to a cause, object, or pursuit. One who tends to become ardently absorbed in an interest._
> 
> It does not mention anything about having lots of money to be able to buy the best-in-class CPU/GPU, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I always go all out with GPUs, but I'm much more conservative with CPUs. My PC is for gaming use only and I cut corners all the time, even though I don't really need to. My advice is to always take a common sense approach to PC building. Don't buy what you don't need, and keep your focus on what makes the most impact to your use of said PC.


I have a nagging feeling that if you stuck "ardently attached to an object" and "absorbed in something" into a Thesaurus it would come up with "Obsessed/Obsession" or a few -philia suffix'd words









In other words, "Peeshee Enthoosiest is teh Stalker of GPUs" always hiding in the bushes at Nvidia Co. headquarters. The mere mention of the word TITAN is enough to make him shudder, causing the crumpled up restraining orders for being within 1000 yards of an AMD facility fall out of his pocketed trackpants...(green and black with silver stripes of course







)


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Technically there's no reason for this Titan X, since AMD has nothing to compete with the GTX 1080 as it is.


Obviously Nvidia want the professional users to upgrade their workbenches.
60% over Maxwell Titan X. Thats a lot of time saved for computation work.

There was a reason why Nvidia announced Pascal Titan X at a university and not a game convention. The target buyers here are professional users. And gamers that bleed for the best. But the professional users completely overshadow the gamers. And since AMD is nowhere to be seen with FirePro, they charge whatever price they desire.
Universities and employers will still buy it regardless.


----------



## carlhil2

People are forgetting about 4k. as of now, you need 2 gpus to push it. the majority would prefer to have just one gpu to push it. hopefully, that's where the Titan XP comes in....and, that's why it will sell out in no time...


----------



## czin125

This thing should be able to use image doubling (4x) in madvr.at 256 neurons for 1080p content or still nope?


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Bingo! Jen-Hsun said in the video for this Titan that the market doesn't set the price for this gpu. The competition does. Until Amd starts to focus on PC gaming again we're all screwed on getting reasonable prices. Remember the days of getting a flagship single gpu at $500. Hard to imagine within 3 years we're sitting at $1200. Amd has screwed us all. I saw it coming years ago. Call me a fanboy but that's why I refuse to put their product into my rig. They're a train wreck and have been for many years.


Its like they cant do one product properly.
Thats why AMD formed RTG group to focus more solely on GPU development.

We have seen the fruit from that. AMD is in a lot worse shape now than they were in 2012 when they released GCN vs Kepler. That was two companies battling it out, both doing really great.
Now RTG group have managed to screw it all up. Polaris 10. Thats all we got.

Great job Raja. Not only did the RX 480 CF = GTX 1080 +10% fall flat because it ended up equal with a 1070, but being so damn crappy at your job and only engineering one product and think people would even get two 480s in CF to get the performance they need because a single 480 wasnt good enough and most gamers know how many games have poor CF scaling or none at all....thats just stupid to rely on a strategy like that

/rant


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Its like they cant do one product properly.
> Thats why AMD formed RTG group to focus more solely on GPU development.
> 
> We have seen the fruit from that. AMD is in a lot worse shape now than they were in 2012 when they released GCN vs Kepler. That was two companies battling it out, both doing really great.
> Now RTG group have managed to screw it all up. Polaris 10. Thats all we got.
> 
> Great job Raja.


I agree, AMD should just stick to graphics, sell the cpu division to someone else. it will be then that they put nVIDIA on their heels...


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Save up for a used 980 Ti or Titan X. Much more affordable and still plenty of power even for an "enthusiast".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What is the definition of "enthusiast" exactly? According to Merriam-Webster:
> 
> _Full Definition of enthusiast. : a person filled with enthusiasm: as a : one who is ardently attached to a cause, object, or pursuit. One who tends to become ardently absorbed in an interest._
> 
> It does not mention anything about having lots of money to be able to buy the best-in-class CPU/GPU, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I always go all out with GPUs, but I'm much more conservative with CPUs. My PC is for gaming use only and I cut corners all the time, even though I don't really need to. My advice is to always take a common sense approach to PC building. *Don't buy what you don't need, and keep your focus on what makes the most impact to your use of said PC*.


I'm the guy who sells used GPUs, not buy, haha ! Agreed on bold text







I never owned a Titan GPU though, i would be so happy to add that baby to my build


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> I agree, AMD should just stick to graphics, sell the cpu division to someone else. it will be then that they put nVIDIA on their heels...


Are you for real?

CPUs is where the money's at. Nvidia doesn't make a fraction of what Intel makes, not even a tiny fraction even with their inflated prices.

If anything they should sell their GPU Division and focus solely on processors, that's where the real revenue is, not gamers and basement dwellers.

Even the Quadro, FirePro, GeForce and Radeon lines combined can't compete with the server market, at all.

This is without counting the mainstream market, OEMs and mobiles.

If anything, AMD should try to exchange their GPU division for an ARM División and try to take on Snapdragon, although Intel and Nvidia both failed on this.


----------



## wooshna

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Its like they cant do one product properly.
> Thats why AMD formed RTG group to focus more solely on GPU development.
> 
> We have seen the fruit from that. AMD is in a lot worse shape now than they were in 2012 when they released GCN vs Kepler. That was two companies battling it out, both doing really great.
> Now RTG group have managed to screw it all up. Polaris 10. Thats all we got.
> 
> Great job Raja. Not only did the RX 480 CF = GTX 1080 +10% fall flat because it ended up equal with a 1070, but being so damn crappy at your job and only engineering one product and think people would even get two 480s in CF to get the performance they need because a single 480 wasnt good enough and most gamers know how many games have poor CF scaling or none at all....thats just stupid to rely on a strategy like that
> 
> /rant


FYI

480 was never ment to compete with the 1080....... $250 gpu vs. $600 gpu comparision please......
why don't you compare the 2 newest gpus from both sides as well while your at it, titan XP vs. 480 OMG AMD failed again.....

AMD did great with this card. What they said they wanted to do with this card they achieved.

AMD in worse shape?? man you must not believe in financial reports or not have any stocks. Let me enlighten you a bit.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1606644/oc3d-amd-sees-huge-improvements-in-their-q2-2016-financial-results

Also for all those smart enough to buy AMD stock last year or even earlier this year AMD is now sitting at $5.84/share and still rising compared to 7 months ago when it was at an avg of $2/share. Near triple its stock price i'd say is a pretty good indication that the company is doing well.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Are you for real?
> 
> CPUs is where the money's at. Nvidia doesn't make a fraction of what Intel makes, not even a tiny fraction even with their inflated prices.
> 
> If anything they should sell their GPU Division and focus solely on processors, that's where the real revenue is, not gamers and basement dwellers.
> 
> Even the Quadro, FirePro, GeForce and Radeon lines combined can't compete with the server market, at all.
> 
> This is without counting the mainstream market, OEMs and mobiles.
> 
> If anything, AMD should try to exchange their GPU division for an ARM División and try to take on Snapdragon, although Intel and Nvidia both failed on this.


True, but, I wasn't referring to intel though....AMD has a better chance competing against nVIDIA than intel.., just my opinion...


----------



## wooshna

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Are you for real?
> 
> CPUs is where the money's at. Nvidia doesn't make a fraction of what Intel makes, not even a tiny fraction even with their inflated prices.
> 
> If anything they should sell their GPU Division and focus solely on processors, that's where the real revenue is, not gamers and basement dwellers.
> 
> Even the Quadro, FirePro, GeForce and Radeon lines combined can't compete with the server market, at all.
> 
> This is without counting the mainstream market, OEMs and mobiles.
> 
> If anything, AMD should try to exchange their GPU division for an ARM División and try to take on Snapdragon, although Intel and Nvidia both failed on this.


+1

some people here think a $2000 gpu is making bank for nvidia. the titan XP probably only targets .5% of the actual market.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wooshna*
> 
> FYI
> 
> 480 was never ment to compete with the 1080....... $250 gpu vs. $600 gpu comparision please......
> why don't you compare the 2 newest gpus from both sides as well while your at it, titan XP vs. 480 OMG AMD failed again.....
> 
> AMD did great with this card. What they said they wanted to do with this card they achieved.
> 
> AMD in worse shape?? man you must not believe in financial reports or not have any stocks. Let me enlighten you a bit.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1606644/oc3d-amd-sees-huge-improvements-in-their-q2-2016-financial-results
> 
> Also for all those smart enough to buy AMD stock last year or even earlier this year AMD is now sitting at $5.84/share and still rising compared to 7 months ago when it was at an avg of $2/share. Near triple its stock price i'd say is a pretty good indication that the company is doing well.


Try to read what I write instead of making me repeat the same posts again. Go back 2-3 posts then come back. Im not comparing Titan against a RX 480. That was not my point at all. Not even close.

You enlighten me that AMD is still losing money? "Ok"
Its getting better? Perhaps. But they are still losing money. From $60M to profit, thats still a way.
Especially when they only have a couple of Polaris products. Mainly from the cheap tiers.
AMD need to get products out now. Not wait until 2018 when most have already gotten their high end from Nvidia.
Thats a recipe for still losing money or not recapturing the market share they should have


----------



## zGunBLADEz

I just laugh when ppl mention 4k ready/60fps

Then they release a crap port or new game and we go back to square 1 1080P / 60fps lol

Nvidia wants $1200 for a cut chip like this one pfffffff

If i didnt approve the price of the OG titans neither this one..


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Technically there's no reason for this Titan X, since AMD has nothing to compete with the GTX 1080 as it is.


There are a lot more people who own old model Nvidia cards buying new top end Nvidia cards, they are not competing with AMD, they are competing with their old models. The target market for top end GPUs already has nice GPUs. Very few sales are to people without a GPU, most of these sales are upgrades so they need to offer something interesting enough people upgrade. Me holding onto my 980TI doesn't make Nvidia any more money.

The argument against the 1080Ti coming out soon, now that we know about the Titan XP, is much better than the argument against a big die at all. Now that they have something that is a significant upgrade from any of their old products they can keep margins up and wait for AMD.

Also, what would a 1080Ti be? GP102 with an entire GPC disabled, like the 1070 compared to the 1080? 50 SM, 3200 cores. Maybe even 10GB of 320-bit GDDR5X and less cache than the Titan XP? Hmm..


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Just.... lol


980Ti price on May 27th

https://pcpartpicker.com/trends/price/video-card/#gpu.chipset.geforce-gtx-980-ti

is above $500, he is not wrong


----------



## renejr902

Wccftech just released that article, very interesting :
http://wccftech.com/nvidia-roadmap-2017-volta-gpu/


----------



## carlhil2

If true, it would explain a lot.....don't get stuck too long with those TitanXP's...


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Wccftech just released that article, very interesting :
> http://wccftech.com/nvidia-roadmap-2017-volta-gpu/


Volta 2-4 month after Vega according to that, AMD would be in a lot of trouble(as Navi is roadmapped to 2018) and price might not come down.

Although Nvidia have a tendency to lower MSRP in their version of Tick-Tock iteration( Maxwell MSRP lower than Kepler from X80Ti down,etc) so there is still hope.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Wccftech just released that article, very interesting :
> http://wccftech.com/nvidia-roadmap-2017-volta-gpu/


It is interesting but one paragraph stuck out to me:
Quote:


> In fact one additional argument in the favor of Volta in 2017 is the fact that the Pascal big chip has been designed for double precision as well as single precision unlike Maxwell, which was designed from the ground up for single precision. While this is invaluable for Nvidia's other ventures, the double precision units are a waste of space on the P100 die as far as gaming is concerned. This is also why the Geforce TITAN X only has 3584 cores even though the die itself is pretty large.
> 
> Read more: http://wccftech.com/nvidia-roadmap-2017-volta-gpu/#ixzz4FLlFzNIO


They mention GP102 later as well, so I have no idea how this point counts as an additional argument.

I could believe Volta will be early, if the designs are ready and working running worse chips in your fabs is pointless, but still not a lot of evidence for it. A 16nm Volta does sound like a good idea to me.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> If you think about it, they cannot release a higher end Titan-XP "black edition". This Titan-XP is already black.


LoL, I'm thinking the next Titan will be white because of all the milking.


----------



## Klocek001

Volta in time for summer holidays 2017, that'd be perfect. Maybe we'll see no GP100 Titan with HBM2, but GV100 and GV104 lauched simultaneously in Q2-Q3 17.


----------



## carlhil2

Still buying me a TXP though. will just have to resell it sooner than planned, if rumors have any truth to them..


----------



## ChevChelios

Im ready for Volta HBM2 1180 in 2017 even if it means updating my GPU after just 1 year









hell yeah .. and only with Twin Frozr cooler, Ive learned my lesson

a 4500 3770K will probably bottleneck it @ 1440p, but only a bit hopefully


----------



## iARDAs

I can smell the 1080ti...


----------



## ChevChelios

if they really release Volta on refined 16nm TSMC with HBM2 and async and the works in May 2017 then I dont envy Vegas position


----------



## zealord

The bad news is : Gaming oriented GPUs, that used to cost 350$, now cost 1200$.

The good news is : Next to no PC games are graphically worth it to buy a 1200$ GPU.

I am really curious as to what AMD has planned next. RX490? VEGA? when?


----------



## Woundingchaney

Has there been any indication when we will start seeing benchmarks/reviews of this new gpu?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> @Magnek
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Well played.









I _did_ say this much earlier as well (and even got the price right







):



But I fully admit I most definitely did not expect a hard launch in August. Btw you should try some of this crow, it's actually pretty delish.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> The bad news is : Gaming oriented GPUs, that used to cost 350$, now cost 1200$.
> 
> The good news is : Next to no PC games are graphically worth it to buy a 1200$ GPU.
> 
> I am really curious as to what AMD has planned next. RX490? VEGA? when?


Really slim chance but AMD might try to push Vega for this year. Polaris is already a full chip and Vega releasing next year would mean AMD has nothing to compete against 1070/1080 for 6-7 months at least.


----------



## magnek

I have a feeling that AMD is pretty much out of the game in the high end GPU market, much like with their CPUs.

If they play the mainstream game right and keep increasing revenue y-o-y, perhaps they'll make a comeback a few years later. But for now I'm not holding my breath.


----------



## TUFinside

A Ferrari is hand made for example, a titan X is made by a chinese paid 2 dollars per hour, Blaise Pascal said : *comparison is not reason*







yes the same Pascal which the GPU was named after







Irony ?


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> We can both have our opinions but the fact remains the same. Nvidia loves you!


Yes they do, Nvidia actually provides products for people looking for performance advancement. Last I checked that regardless of how anyone feels about them as a company they are actually moving the performance bar forward with regularity. When you occupy a market with no competition then you can dictate entry cost into that market, while I'm not pleased about the increase in prices, I am pleased that the performance market exists.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Yes they do, Nvidia actually provides products for people looking for performance advancement. Last I checked that regardless of how anyone feels about them as a company they are actually moving the performance bar forward with regularity. When you occupy a market with no competition then you can dictate entry cost into that market, while I'm not pleased about the increase in prices, I am pleased that the performance market exists.


I understand what you are saying but these prices are ridiculous and will only get worse. Jen-Hsun, is that you? I can smell the leather...


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Perhaps I should simply hold off on my hobby for a couple years and wait to upgrade so I can better pacify the belly aching that has become redundant in this forum. Bottom line is that this is the hands down first single card solution for 4K @60hz and that will interest a number of people. *Perhaps you should realize that higher end early adopters such as myself also have contributed to technology reaching more affordable levels quicker in comparison years past.
> *


This, I don't see forum wide outrage 3 year ago when first adopters started buying up the first round of 32" 4K monitors for $3K or 1 TB SSDs for $800-1K, Now that the price of such monitors have dropped below $1K(such as the Benq I have) and <$250(the Muskin I got), I really appreciate those early adopters.


----------



## ChevChelios

the fact that they are releasing so many GPUs of all kinds and segments in short timespans is only a good thing as far as tech and increasing our fps and resolutions goes

you already have choice fo 1070, 1080, Titan X2, in 2017 possibly 1080Ti and/or big Titan and maybe even Volta now

prices though







oh well


----------



## Bugzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> the fact that they are releasing so many GPUs of all kinds and segments in short timespans is only a good thing as far as tech and increasing our fps and resolutions goes
> 
> you already have choice fo 1070, 1080, Titan X2, in 2017 possibly 1080Ti and/or big Titan and maybe even Volta now
> 
> prices though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh well


reminded me of one family guy episode where there's a sign at the entrance of some "elite" club/hotel/restaurant/something saying along the lines "We're not racist. We don't discriminate, our prices do it for us."


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I do not bealive you buying Titan X is doing any good to mainstream users. It's not like Titan X has features not found on $250 cards. All it has is more speed. Cars are so different it's not even the same thing. The biggest difference is completion of 100s of brands.


What about those who are pushing pixels, they supposed to buy $250 gpu, just because? there are some who buy these Titan cards just for benching purposes, you know, like, it's a hobby....


----------



## 12Cores

I think the reviewers should only run games at 4k in their reviews, if you are spending $1,200 and the card cannot run all games at that resolution on ultra its not worth it. But then again what do I know.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Wccftech just released that article, very interesting :
> http://wccftech.com/nvidia-roadmap-2017-volta-gpu/


The same said I yesterday.
There is a reason why Nvidia is launching the big chip only a month after 1080. That have never happened before.

My guess its because Volta is for HBM and HBM2 is getting so close they rather get Pascal out and done.
Just think about it. Pascal is technically Maxwell 2.0. Its offering refinements of Maxwell. Volta is the true new architecture. Plus Volta is 16nm too.

The good news about this is that 1080Ti may be closer than we think too, if true. They cant release 1080Ti in 2017 if GV104 comes out and beats it in the same year


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> The same said I yesterday.
> There is a reason why Nvidia is launching the big chip only a month after 1080. That have never happened before.
> 
> My guess its because Volta is for HBM and HBM2 is getting so close they rather get Pascal out and done.
> Just think about it. Pascal is technically Maxwell 2.0. Its offering refinements of Maxwell. Plus Volta is 16nm too.
> 
> The good news about this is that 1080Ti may be closer than we think too, if true. They cant release 1080Ti in 2017 if GV104 comes out and beats it in the same year


So if it's true, no point on buying a 1200 dollars GPU now, just get a 1070 or 1080.


----------



## i7monkey

low low price

$329

$1200! very cheap!


----------



## carlhil2

For those that need 2 cards, but, only want one, this next several months is going to be a blessing...I am done with SLI, hate it with a passion. every time that I go SLI, I end up breaking them up...


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> low low price
> 
> $329
> 
> $1200! very cheap!


Did you get your 1060 yet? seems to be the perfect gpu for you, while not being expensive, a perfect match. you see, nVIDIA DID look out for you....








better yet, cop a 480 4GB, even CHEAPER..


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> So if it's true, no point on buying a 1200 dollars GPU now, just get a 1070 or 1080.


Depends. If you are wealthy and can afford ot, by all means get the Titan. But one should go back and think how close GTX 980Ti was to the Titan X. 2 months.
If Nvidia is dumping the 1080Ti out to make room for Volta in 2017, this might happen again with Pascal.

The points that backs that up is the following;
Titan X features 1/3 FP64 cores. That will never happen with a 1080Ti. Titan is for professional that needs these compute cores. Gamers dont. So there are room and plans for a GP102 GPU with less compute cores which most importantly make room for a cheaper 1080Ti on the market simultaniously with the Titan.
1080Ti will not compete withTitan X because of that.

Another reason why I suspect a 1080Ti soon, is because Titan is solely sold by Nvidia themselves. No AIBs are allowed to sell the cards. Which is basiclly spitting in their face. UNLESS Nvidia is launching another card which AiBs are allowed to make custon cards out of.
Yep you guessed it, 1080Ti.

Long story short:
Wait. Cheaper 1080Ti might be right around the corner. With custom boards etc.


----------



## supermi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> lol we go through this EVERY TIME Nvidia raises the bar with a flagship card.
> 
> If people set aside a measily $50 a month, they would be able to buy the latest and greatest GPU from Nvidia each and every year if you factored in the resale value of their prior latest and greatest card. I just got $600 for one of my Titan Xs and $700 for the other, so factor in another $600 (12 months x $50) boom there is the $$$ for the new Titan XP.
> 
> So really.....are you people really crying over the fact that you CAN'T save a measily FIFTY DOLLARS a month????


Many here or some could put aside $50k a month bud. That is irrelevant to escalating overpricing "and a chump consumer mindset".

#1 buy it if you can/want
#2 use any legal means you want to get a good deal, including social discussion to limit the potential future price increases and maybe signalnanprice decrease. This is PART OF negotiations between consumer and company, heck they DO THE SAME in trolling high priced cards and naming rebrands 680 to 1080 now that us jumping a price bracket again.

Negotiate for the best deal you can then speak with your wallet and if you are a boss work with a team to strengthen your position.

Or well you present a more feminine, milking kinda approach that dominant companies like ?


----------



## i7monkey

u come i give you gould discount

very chip

$499

$1499!


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> low low price
> 
> $329
> 
> $1200! very cheap!


you cant afford it, we got it 100 pages ago


----------



## Mad Pistol

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> u come i give you gould discount
> 
> very chip
> 
> $499
> 
> $1499!






Here... have a snickers.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> you cant afford it, we got it 100 pages ago


Didn't you hear, $250.00 should be the absolute maximum that one pays for a gpu, regardless of one's needs...you missed the memo buddy..


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Depends. If you are wealthy and can afford ot, by all means get the Titan. But one should go back and think how close GTX 980Ti was to the Titan X. 2 months.
> If Nvidia is dumping the 1080Ti out to make room for Volta in 2017, this might happen again with Pascal.
> 
> The points that backs that up is the following;
> Titan X features 1/3 FP64 cores. That will never happen with a 1080Ti. Titan is for professional that needs these compute cores. Gamers dont. So there are room and plans for a GP102 GPU with less compute cores which most importantly make room for a cheaper 1080Ti on the market simultaniously with the Titan.
> 1080Ti will not compete withTitan X because of that.
> 
> Another reason why I suspect a 1080Ti soon, is because Titan is solely sold by Nvidia themselves. No AIBs are allowed to sell the cards. Which is basiclly spitting in their face. UNLESS Nvidia is launching another card which AiBs are allowed to make custon cards out of.
> Yep you guessed it, 1080Ti.
> 
> Long story short:
> Wait. Cheaper 1080Ti might be right around the corner. With custom boards etc.


Source on the new titan x pascal having 1/3 DP?


----------



## Mad Pistol

The great thing about this market is that you don't have to but a Titan XP if you don't want to... in fact, I highly discourage it.

However, I highly doubt cluttering this thread with insults to owners is the answer.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

So if those news are true.. what the hell i even going to bother to buy a castrated version 102 chip for $1200?


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> let him fight agaisnt the green oppression
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enough is enough !


He is free to do as he choose, I am just calling it what it is...


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Source on the new titan x pascal having 1/3 DP?


Crap, I read the specs of the original Titan. Too many damn Titans lol.
So nothing confirmed yet. Sorry

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd


----------



## supermi

My issue is if the Titan X sli #'s are good enough, dreams of putting them in a sub zero loop might make me do funny $$$ things.

On a side note any body run their 1080/1070 in a water chiller , ideally sub zero, do they scale well in that 0c to -15 gpu core range?(a bit different than full LN2, ha-ha)

I am out of principle sitting out this $1200 Titan, but I have owned Titan OG Dino (4 of them) and a single Titan X , really like being in the member forum. A test of will and principle! Iron man Iron


----------



## carlhil2

That story is just rumor for now. the big chip Volta may not see the light of day til next summer....that's a year away..


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> low low price
> 
> $329
> 
> $1200! very cheap!


just shut up and buy it.

jen needs a new ferrari.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Source on the new titan x pascal having 1/3 DP?
> 
> 
> 
> Crap, I read the specs of the original Titan. Too many damn Titans lol.
> So nothing confirmed yet. Sorry
> 
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd
Click to expand...

If GP102 has good DP Nvidia has gone completely crazy.









I thought it was completely assumed we do not have DP on this Titan X, now that we know it is GP102 with GDDR5X?


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Master__Shake*
> 
> just shut up and buy it.
> 
> jen needs a new ferrari. *black leather jacket.*


FTFY


----------



## Eorzean

With no competition in sight, why rush Volta out in 2017?

Wait... WCCFtech stirring the pot, like usual. Need them big grains of salt.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> u very chip
> 
> be a man do the right thing


Im not paying that much money for a damn gpu that was a joke man lol..

I can buy 2 gpus with that money down the road and test 2 different brand new gpus even 3 if the price is right... Been doing this too long for epeen where nobody gives two craps about lol.....

Titans are a waste of money....
OG TITAN first
titan x second
and this one will follow


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eorzean*
> 
> With no competition in sight, why rush Volta out in 2017?
> 
> Wait... WCCFtech stirring the pot, like usual. Need them big grains of salt.


LOL, that was already the argument against this Titan X. I agree on the salt, WCCFtech and everything, but the "no competition means Nvidia will not release anything better" has already been debunked, at least for the short term.

If AMD keeps being unable to compete Nvidia might relax their product pipeline but that is a five to ten year change, not something you do in one generation.


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Well, he does sort of own a really large, successful company. Pretty sure he deserves that Ferrari.


never said he didn't


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> If GP102 has good DP Nvidia has gone completely crazy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought it was completely assumed we do not have DP on this Titan X, now that we know it is GP102 with GDDR5X?


The original Titan had 1/3. Dont know why we should rule it out just because it have GDR5X. The card have 480GB/s bandwidth which is pretty good


----------



## Yttrium

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> if they really release Volta on refined 16nm TSMC with HBM2 and async and the works in May 2017 then I dont envy Vegas position


Vegas position? you mean las vegas? it has been in the same place for years! (sorry, had to take the cheap shot)

but for real, vega is PROBALY going to be manufactured by TSMC. AMD supposedly gave GLOFO the lesser important products namely the APU and smaller GPU's (as in RX480) while the high end zen and vega would be produced by TSMC.

Source: http://vrworld.com/2016/01/19/amd-to-offer-finfet-chips-with-both-tsmc-and-globalfoundries/

* I dont know if vrworld is reputable seen the recent development in news media inaccuracies but its not wccf so that says something.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *supermi*
> 
> Many here or some could put aside $50k a month bud. That is irrelevant to escalating overpricing "and a chump consumer mindset".
> 
> #1 buy it if you can/want
> #2 use any legal means you want to get a good deal, including social discussion to limit the potential future price increases and maybe signalnanprice decrease. This is PART OF negotiations between consumer and company, heck they DO THE SAME in trolling high priced cards and naming rebrands 680 to 1080 now that us jumping a price bracket again.
> 
> Negotiate for the best deal you can then speak with your wallet and if you are a boss work with a team to strengthen your position.
> 
> Or well you present a more feminine, milking kinda approach that dominant companies like ?


























This dude gets it.


----------



## Eorzean

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> LOL, that was already the argument against this Titan X. I agree on the salt, WCCFtech and everything, but the "no competition means Nvidia will not release anything better" has already been debunked, at least for the short term.
> 
> If AMD keeps being unable to compete Nvidia might relax their product pipeline but that is a five to ten year change, not something you do in one generation.


They released a neutered Pascal Titan, milking has already been initiated. There's still room for the full fat version, the 1080 Ti, and everything they can fit in-between... If Volta actually releases in 2017, maybe the 1160 will put the final nail in AMD's coffin, I guess... which is kinda scary to think about.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> The original Titan had 1/3. Dont know why we should rule it out just because it have GDR5X. The card have 480GB/s bandwidth which is pretty good


Well for starters it's lost 20% of the transistors relative to GP100, and since they both have the same SP unit count, this means they must have chopped off _something_ significant.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> The original Titan had 1/3. Dont know why we should rule it out just because it have GDR5X. The card have 480GB/s bandwidth which is pretty good


Why design the new die then!? Only to support GDDR5X instead of HBM2?

I would be absolutely shocked if it has DP above 1/32, they are advertising 11 TFLOPS 32-bit float and 44 TIOPS INT8 but say nothing about DP performance.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Depends. If you are wealthy and can afford ot, by all means get the Titan. But one should go back and think how close GTX 980Ti was to the Titan X. 2 months.
> If Nvidia is dumping the 1080Ti out to make room for Volta in 2017, this might happen again with Pascal.
> 
> The points that backs that up is the following;
> Titan X features 1/3 FP64 cores. That will never happen with a 1080Ti. Titan is for professional that needs these compute cores. Gamers dont. So there are room and plans for a GP102 GPU with less compute cores which most importantly make room for a cheaper 1080Ti on the market simultaniously with the Titan.
> 1080Ti will not compete withTitan X because of that.
> 
> Another reason why I suspect a 1080Ti soon, is because Titan is solely sold by Nvidia themselves. No AIBs are allowed to sell the cards. Which is basiclly spitting in their face. UNLESS Nvidia is launching another card which AiBs are allowed to make custon cards out of.
> Yep you guessed it, 1080Ti.
> 
> *Long story short:
> Wait. Cheaper 1080Ti might be right around the corner. With custom boards etc.*


I hope you are right, i start saving bucks now !







Nvidia deserves it


----------



## jakethesnake438

How the hell else are we going to push 4k with a single gpu?


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jakethesnake438*
> 
> How the hell else are we going to push 4k with a single gpu?


they don't want you to.

They want you to buy more GPUs and they want you to buy a new one next year too


----------



## sammkv

Nvidia just don't give a damn lol. With no competition they are just firing away with all these new cards. If they wanted to they could release a 1060Ti, 1070Ti and a 1080Ti at this rate


----------



## DADDYDC650

So who's buying this $1200 mid-range Titan?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So who's buying this $1200 mid-range Titan?


onlu buying the X80 Volta for another $600-700 in 2017


----------



## jincuteguy

So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need to be looking at? Newegg? EVGA? or Nvida store?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So who's buying this $1200 mid-range Titan?


I am because if you think they are going to release better in the next 8+ months than you are lying to yourself. 8+ months is a super long time in the hardware market, and if you base your purchase on that then you'd never buy anything.

I want to run 4K 60hz in newer games now, and on a single card. This is the only card on the market that has a chance at doing that, so price doesn't really matter to me.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I am because if you think they are going to release better in the next 8+ months than you are lying to yourself. 8+ months is a super long time in the hardware market, and if you base your purchase on that then you'd never buy anything.
> 
> I want to run 4K 60hz in newer games now, and on a single card. This is the only card on the market that has a chance at doing that, so price doesn't really matter to me.


buy me one too?


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need to be looking at? Newegg? EVGA? or *Nvida store*?


Exclusive to the product page. Click the notify button: http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal


----------



## jincuteguy

So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> Exclusive to the product page. Click the notify button: http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal


What do you mean Exclusive? Only Nvidia will be selling it? that's weird


----------



## Murlocke

After reading through this thread.. There's a very common pattern.

Most of the complainers are:
1) 1080 owners that likely wished they waited, so they troll the thread and lie to themselves about wanting the card.
2) People who can't afford the card at all, so they decided to troll the thread about how the product isn't worth the money.

Yes you can argue that this card is poor priceerformance, but so is the 1080. No one buying high end cards cares about that, especially something in the Titan lineup. The previous titans were very successful, and this one will be too.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need
> What do you mean Exclusive? Only Nvidia will be selling it? that's weird


Yep, you can only buy the Titan XP on geforce.com, nowhere else.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need
> What do you mean Exclusive? Only Nvidia will be selling it? that's weird


Sorry for double post but site is currently broke and not allowing editing.

NVIDIA tends to sell Titan products exclusively for the first week or so. Same thing happened with the last Titan.


----------



## jincuteguy

So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keikei*
> 
> Exclusive to the product page. Click the notify button: http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal


What do you mean Exclusive? Only Nvidia will be selling it? that's weird
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Yep, you can only buy the Titan XP on geforce.com, nowhere else.


And is there a reason why? they were selling the old Titan X everywhere like EVGA, Newegg, why not this time?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need
> What do you mean Exclusive? Only Nvidia will be selling it? that's weird


Sorry for double post but site is currently broke and not allowing editing.

NVIDIA tends to sell Titan products exclusively for the first week or so. Same thing happened with the last Titan.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need
> What do you mean Exclusive? Only Nvidia will be selling it? that's weird
> And is there a reason why? they were selling the old Titan X everywhere like EVGA, Newegg, why not this time?


It was a timed exclusive with the previous Titan, so I assume it'll be the same case here.

It's likely because these cards are very low yield so they don't want to spread stock out at first. That and they make more money selling directly.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So If i want to buy the new Titan X
> NVIDIA tends to sell Titan products exclusively for the first week or so. Same thing happened with the last Titan.


They're not co-branding the card this time. Titan XP will only come in an nVidia box and will be available ONLY on geforce.com, nowhere else will sell it. AIBs are SOL this time.


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> After reading through this thread.. There's a very common pattern.
> 
> Most of the complainers are:
> 1) 1080 owners that likely wished they waited, so they troll the thread and lie to themselves about wanting the card.


Yeah a lot of tears here. Not me though, perfectly happy with my 1080s. No way I could afford 2 Titan XPs.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> Yeah a lot of tears here. Not me though, perfectly happy with my 1080s. No way I could afford 2 Titan XPs.


Same. Very happy with my 1070s.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

I feel fine too. Returned the 1080 and going for the Titan-X. I don't mind the $1200 price. A lot of money, but I'm fine with it. Got to pay to play I guess.

Should be the top dog until next spring at least. Thought the 1080 would have been, but obviously not. Now I hope I can get one in my card long enough to pay for it August 2nd!


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> I feel fine too. Returned the 1080 and going for the Titan-X. I don't mind the $1200 price. A lot of money, but I'm fine with it. Got to pay to play I guess.
> 
> Should be the top dog until next spring at least. Thought the 1080 would have been, but obviously not. Now I hope I can get one in my card long enough to pay for it August 2nd!


9 days...

I'm brimming with excitement. My 6700k comes tomorrow so hopefully OCing that will tide me over.


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I'm brimming with excitement. My 6700k comes tomorrow so hopefully OCing that will tide me over.


It's always good fun getting new GPU.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> After reading through this thread.. There's a very common pattern.
> 
> Most of the complainers are:
> 1) 1080 owners that likely wished they waited, so they troll the thread and lie to themselves about wanting the card.
> *2) People who can't afford the card at all, so they decided to troll the thread about how the product isn't worth the money.*
> 
> Yes you can argue that this card is poor priceerformance, but so is the 1080. No one buying high end cards cares about that, especially something in the Titan lineup. The previous titans were very successful, and this one will be too.


Given the rigs I see people running here, I highly doubt anyone complaining in this thread is literally incapable of affording the $1200 card.


----------



## magnek

Damn forum acting up not allowing post editing.

Should also add, there's really no reason for 1080 owners to be salty. If they're still within the 14/30 day return window they could do just that. And if not, because the 1080 is in such high demand they could easily flip it on eBay and recoup all their costs.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Damn forum acting up not allowing post editing.
> 
> Should also add, there's really no reason for 1080 owners to be salty. If they're still within the 14/30 day return window they could do just that. And if not, because the 1080 is in such high demand they could easily flip it on eBay and recoup all their costs.


[shamelessplug]

My 1080 FTW is listed in the OCN market BTW.









[/shamelessplug]


----------



## DADDYDC650

So who's buying this $1200 mid-range Titan?







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I am because if you think they are going to release better in the next 8+ months than you are lying to yourself. 8+ months is a super long time in the hardware market, and if you base your purchase on that then you'd never buy anything.
> 
> I want to run 4K 60hz in newer games now, and on a single card. This is the only card on the market that has a chance at doing that, so price doesn't really matter to me.


Nothing wrong with buying what you want with your cash and I respect that. I don't think it'll be king for 8+ months though.


----------



## magnek

Holy cow the forum is _really_ borken. (yes borken)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> [shamelessplug]
> 
> My 1080 FTW is listed in the OCN market BTW.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/shamelessplug]










Salty 1080 owner detected


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Salty 1080 owner detected


Can I be a salty 1070 owner?


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So who's buying this $1200 mid-range Titan?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nothing wrong with buying what you want with your cash and I respect that. I don't think it'll be king for 8+ months though.


It might as well be for 1 year+ if Vega doesn't come out and beat it.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> I feel fine too. Returned the 1080 and going for the Titan-X. I don't mind the $1200 price. A lot of money, but I'm fine with it. Got to pay to play I guess.
> 
> Should be the top dog until next spring at least. Thought the 1080 would have been, but obviously not. Now I hope I can get one in my card long enough to pay for it August 2nd!


9 days...

I'm brimming with excitement. M
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So who's buying this $1200 mid-range Titan?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nothing wrong with buying what you want with your cash and I respect that. I don't think it'll be king for 8+ months though.


The best your going to see in 8+ months is a possibly a 1080Ti that is roughly the same performance, less VRAM, and cheaper.


----------



## zealord

Honestly I absolutely loath the name. Like it's all wrong. Even Titan C would be better than Titan X again


----------



## Murlocke

Man the site is really screwed up right now.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Can I be a salty 1070 owner?











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> Honestly I absolutely loath the name. Like it's all wrong. Even Titan C would be better than Titan X again


Yeah they really should've named it anything BUT Titan X.

I still vote for Titan Y to complete the collection. Or Titan P so we know which generation the Titan is from (Titan X = MaXwell, Titan P = Pascal obviously)


----------



## DarkBlade6

Omg this is Kepler all over again XD

680
Titan

.............

680 = 770
780 = castrated GK100
780 Ti = Full fat GK100 with less VRAM
Titan Black = Full fat GK100 with more VRAM

1080
Titan XP

..............

1080 = 1170
1180 = castrated GP100 (3000ish cores)
1180 Ti = Full fat GP100 with 12GB GDDR5X
Titan Black XP = Full fat GP100 with 16GB HBM2


----------



## TUFinside

oh well, they're all selling their 15 days new 1070/1080 to buy a Titan X







, you don't deserve to be part of the PC community


----------



## TheBloodEagle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> We shall call it *Titan XP*.


As long as a Titan ME doesn't come out, it's fine.


----------



## Swolern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Can I be a salty 1070 owner?


No, your price/performance doesn't qualify.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Again, as recently as a few months ago, we see Volta lined up for the end of 2017. That could mean we might see a volta Tesla in Q4 2017 with a launch of GeForce in Q1 2018.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkBlade6*
> 
> Omg this is Kepler all over again XD
> 
> 680
> Titan
> 
> .............
> 
> 680 = 770
> 780 = castrated GK100
> 780 Ti = Full fat GK100 with less VRAM
> Titan Black = Full fat GK100 with more VRAM
> 
> 1080
> Titan XP
> 
> ..............
> 
> 1080 = 1170
> 1180 = castrated GP100 (3000ish cores)
> 1180 Ti = Full fat GP100 with 12GB GDDR5X
> Titan Black XP = Full fat GP100 with 16GB HBM2


nah it's completely different this time.

Because they increased the prices

680 -> 1080 (40% price increase Reference Design)
Titan -> Titan X pascal (20% price increase Reference Design)


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Man the site is really screwed up right now.


tell me about it. people think $1200 is a good deal


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Holy cow the forum is _really_ borken. (yes borken)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Salty 1080 owner detected


Not at all! I'm still within the Amazon return period. I just figured maybe an OCN bro might want it since they're hard to get. It goes back to Amazon in the morning if no one wants it.


----------



## zealord

I wonder what the most commonly used name for the new Titan X is going to be.

Titan X Pascal
Maxwell bois get rekt a new sheriff is in town Titan
Titan 1200$
new Titan X
I'd pay anything Titan
My wife left me Titan


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> After reading through this thread.. There's a very common pattern.
> 
> Most of the complainers are:
> 1) 1080 owners that likely wished they waited, so they troll the thread and lie to themselves about wanting the card.
> 2) People who can't afford the card at all, so they decided to troll the thread about how the product isn't worth the money.
> 
> Yes you can argue that this card is poor priceerformance, but so is the 1080. No one buying high end cards cares about that, especially something in the Titan lineup. The previous titans were very successful, and this one will be too.


Did you not get bored of gaming? What are you playing to play with this new Titan X that would spout a new life for you? I do not think money is a problem for a lot of member here. We just like to get good deals. There are people that buy the best for their need and those that get the joy of getting the same thing down the line for less money. I calculate the price of the card based on the time it comes out and the games I must play. Titan XP has come out faster then any Titan ever and the price tag reflects that. Titan OG and Titan X would have cost more if they came 4-6 moths from their original date.


----------



## Maintenance Bot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I wonder what the most commonly used name for the new Titan X is going to be.
> 
> Maxwell bois get rekt a new sheriff is in town Titan


Lol, I like this one the best.

Nvidia named it Nvidia Titan X so NTX maybe?


----------



## i7monkey

T800 model 101
T1000
T-X


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> 9 days...
> 
> I'm brimming with excitement. M


Jen-Hsun Huang is brimming with excitement.
[Pic failure]


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> I would go into why both of you are wrong but the post will probably also get deleted by a mod like my last reply to you...


Hey! I tried replying to that post, but it said post unavailable.







Why are we stopping rational discussion, mods?









You honestly don't understand that a monopoly increases prices, relative to a competitive market? What economics did you study? You realize...the very link you posted states that a monopoly increases prices. I literally posted the next slide, which clearly showed that a monopoly allows a business to charge higher prices.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> I would go into why both of you are wrong but the post will probably also get deleted by a mod like my last reply to you...


Hey! I tried replying to that post, but it said post unavailable.







Why are we stopping rational discussion, mods?









You honestly don't understand that a monopoly increases prices, relative to a competitive market? What economics did you study? You realize...the very link you posted states that a monopoly increases prices. I literally posted the next slide, which clearly showed that a monopoly allows a business to charge higher prices.


----------



## stangflyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d3v0*
> 
> Please enlighten us as to why they should price the 1080, which is considerably faster than the GTX 980Ti, for *less than the GTX 980Ti was selling for at the 1080 launch?* Perhaps your inability to understand simple business economics is why you constantly complain about any card that costs more than $200.
> 
> Save up some money, stop complaining.


I will try to keep this short.

The wise thing would of been for people not to have paid $700 for a midrange GPU like the 1080. Card should of been $500 max. The 980 should have been $450. Entirely too many people buying based on performance and not even considering where in the product stack this comes in at.

Yea Yea I know that it is the flagship at "that point in time" and it is "15% faster then the 980ti so it should cost 15% more!"

Nvidia is not stupid, but in a way the customers are setting the prices or at least not helping themselves. The 1080 is still sold out most of the time. We had people selling 980ti's for $350-$450 on Ebay and Craigslist to pay $675-$700 for a 15-20% improvement on the 1080. Nvidia sees this and realizes that they can price where they want. Does not help with no competition from AMD in this segment. I kept my 980ti hybrid because it clocks to 1550 and there was no way I was going to pay almost $700 for a midsize chip card. I understand that performance should not be the only criteria for the pricing of the GPU.

Now the problem is if Vega does not hit a homerun I worry that the 1080ti will be priced at $850-$900. In fact this new card might be the actual TI in itself. ( mad.gif pricing wise).Hopefully Vega does well and it forces the 1080 to drop to $500-525 which is where it should be now. Then the 1080ti can be priced at $725-$750 but I doubt it..

I myself will not pay more than $750 for a GPU because I look at history of the GPU and then add for inflation etc. Look at the prices of the big boy GPU prices - 8800gtx- not including the Ultra's stupid price for 5-7 % performance increase to today. $650 or less to $650 to $700 for a 980ti Then look at the initial prices of the midsize chips. $250 for a 8800gt and now we are scaling all the way to $700 for a 1080.

You see that the high end (excluding TItan) has held prices within 20% for the last 10 years. Hell even the 7800GTX was $649 way back when. I personally am ok with a 20% increase over 10 years for inflation, wages etc. I am NOT ok with the huge increase in the midrange prices.

Just go back in time to when the 8800gt came out in 2007. It was $250 at launch. The card it replaced; the 7950gt was released the year before at $299-$349. I had both cards. The 8800gt almost DOUBLED the 7950gt in performance but was less money. The 8800gt has to be one of the most sold cards of all time along with the 9700pro, ti4200 and the 970gtx.

I know I jumped around a lot here but I just wanted to show that since the 680gtx, Nvidia is killing us in the pricing of the midrange size chip. We should not be paying 300% more for these chips then 7-8 years ago. I am ok with a 20% big chip TI pricing but not over $750-$800.

If pricing was based just on performance like some of you think we would be paying $3000 for a gpu right now. Think about it starting from the ti 4200 days. And go thru each generation and take benchmarks and see what the performance increase was for the midrange. . Now take that % and do the same for the prices. We would be at $3000 or so for a gpu by now.

If we continue buying at these prices we will be paying huge prices all the time like we are now. We need AMD to come out with a winner.


----------



## stangflyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d3v0*
> 
> Please enlighten us as to why they should price the 1080, which is considerably faster than the GTX 980Ti, for *less than the GTX 980Ti was selling for at the 1080 launch?* Perhaps your inability to understand simple business economics is why you constantly complain about any card that costs more than $200.
> 
> Save up some money, stop complaining.


I will try to keep this short.

The wise thing would of been for people not to have paid $700 for a midrange GPU like the 1080. Card should of been $500 max. The 980 should have been $450. Entirely too many people buying based on performance and not even considering where in the product stack this comes in at.

Yea Yea I know that it is the flagship at "that point in time" and it is "15% faster then the 980ti so it should cost 15% more!"

Nvidia is not stupid, but in a way the customers are setting the prices or at least not helping themselves. The 1080 is still sold out most of the time. We had people selling 980ti's for $350-$450 on Ebay and Craigslist to pay $675-$700 for a 15-20% improvement on the 1080. Nvidia sees this and realizes that they can price where they want. Does not help with no competition from AMD in this segment. I kept my 980ti hybrid because it clocks to 1550 and there was no way I was going to pay almost $700 for a midsize chip card. I understand that performance should not be the only criteria for the pricing of the GPU.

Now the problem is if Vega does not hit a homerun I worry that the 1080ti will be priced at $850-$900. In fact this new card might be the actual TI in itself. ( mad.gif pricing wise).Hopefully Vega does well and it forces the 1080 to drop to $500-525 which is where it should be now. Then the 1080ti can be priced at $725-$750 but I doubt it..

I myself will not pay more than $750 for a GPU because I look at history of the GPU and then add for inflation etc. Look at the prices of the big boy GPU prices - 8800gtx- not including the Ultra's stupid price for 5-7 % performance increase to today. $650 or less to $650 to $700 for a 980ti Then look at the initial prices of the midsize chips. $250 for a 8800gt and now we are scaling all the way to $700 for a 1080.

You see that the high end (excluding TItan) has held prices within 20% for the last 10 years. Hell even the 7800GTX was $649 way back when. I personally am ok with a 20% increase over 10 years for inflation, wages etc. I am NOT ok with the huge increase in the midrange prices.

Just go back in time to when the 8800gt came out in 2007. It was $250 at launch. The card it replaced; the 7950gt was released the year before at $299-$349. I had both cards. The 8800gt almost DOUBLED the 7950gt in performance but was less money. The 8800gt has to be one of the most sold cards of all time along with the 9700pro, ti4200 and the 970gtx.

I know I jumped around a lot here but I just wanted to show that since the 680gtx, Nvidia is killing us in the pricing of the midrange size chip. We should not be paying 300% more for these chips then 7-8 years ago. I am ok with a 20% big chip TI pricing but not over $750-$800.

If pricing was based just on performance like some of you think we would be paying $3000 for a gpu right now. Think about it starting from the ti 4200 days. And go thru each generation and take benchmarks and see what the performance increase was for the midrange. . Now take that % and do the same for the prices. We would be at $3000 or so for a gpu by now.

If we continue buying at these prices we will be paying huge prices all the time like we are now. We need AMD to come out with a winner.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> OCN used to be about buying modest hardware and eeking out the max performance per dollar, not about paying crazy prices for instant max performance.
> 
> The term enthusiast does not equal paying max dollar for instant max performance. Where is the thrill in that?
> 
> People keep confusing "Enthusiast" with max amount of dollars for hardware, which is wrong.


True. I think that's not exactly an enthusiast from when I learned the definition. It's a surprising change.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> True. I think that's not exactly an enthusiast from when I learned the definition. It's a surprising change.


OCN used to be about putting Truck Turbos on a STI. Most people think it's about buying a Lambo and Turbo charging that.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stangflyer*
> 
> I will try to keep this short.
> 
> The wise thing would of been for people not to have paid $700 for a midrange GPU like the 1080. Card should of been $500 max. The 980 should have been $450. Entirely too many people buying based on performance and not even considering where in the product stack this comes in at.
> 
> Yea Yea I know that it is the flagship at "that point in time" and it is "15% faster then the 980ti so it should cost 15% more!"
> 
> Nvidia is not stupid, but in a way the customers are setting the prices or at least not helping themselves. The 1080 is still sold out most of the time. We had people selling 980ti's for $350-$450 on Ebay and Craigslist to pay $675-$700 for a 15-20% improvement on the 1080. Nvidia sees this and realizes that they can price where they want. Does not help with no competition from AMD in this segment. I kept my 980ti hybrid because it clocks to 1550 and there was no way I was going to pay almost $700 for a midsize chip card. I understand that performance should not be the only criteria for the pricing of the GPU.
> 
> Now the problem is if Vega does not hit a homerun I worry that the 1080ti will be priced at $850-$900. In fact this new card might be the actual TI in itself. ( mad.gif pricing wise).Hopefully Vega does well and it forces the 1080 to drop to $500-525 which is where it should be now. Then the 1080ti can be priced at $725-$750 but I doubt it..
> 
> I myself will not pay more than $750 for a GPU because I look at history of the GPU and then add for inflation etc. Look at the prices of the big boy GPU prices - 8800gtx- not including the Ultra's stupid price for 5-7 % performance increase to today. $650 or less to $650 to $700 for a 980ti Then look at the initial prices of the midsize chips. $250 for a 8800gt and now we are scaling all the way to $700 for a 1080.
> 
> You see that the high end (excluding TItan) has held prices within 20% for the last 10 years. Hell even the 7800GTX was $649 way back when. I personally am ok with a 20% increase over 10 years for inflation, wages etc. I am NOT ok with the huge increase in the midrange prices.
> 
> Just go back in time to when the 8800gt came out in 2007. It was $250 at launch. The card it replaced; the 7950gt was released the year before at $299-$349. I had both cards. The 8800gt almost DOUBLED the 7950gt in performance but was less money. The 8800gt has to be one of the most sold cards of all time along with the 9700pro, ti4200 and the 970gtx.
> 
> I know I jumped around a lot here but I just wanted to show that since the 680gtx, Nvidia is killing us in the pricing of the midrange size chip. We should not be paying 300% more for these chips then 7-8 years ago. I am ok with a 20% big chip TI pricing but not over $750-$800.
> 
> If pricing was based just on performance like some of you think we would be paying $3000 for a gpu right now. Think about it starting from the ti 4200 days. And go thru each generation and take benchmarks and see what the performance increase was for the midrange. . Now take that % and do the same for the prices. We would be at $3000 or so for a gpu by now.
> 
> If we continue buying at these prices we will be paying huge prices all the time like we are now. We need AMD to come out with a winner.


TL;DR

Pricing is based on competition and what the market will bear. Everything else you said is moot.


----------



## stangflyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d3v0*
> 
> Please enlighten us as to why they should price the 1080, which is considerably faster than the GTX 980Ti, for *less than the GTX 980Ti was selling for at the 1080 launch?* Perhaps your inability to understand simple business economics is why you constantly complain about any card that costs more than $200.
> 
> Save up some money, stop complaining.


I will try to keep this short.

The wise thing would of been for people not to have paid $700 for a midrange GPU like the 1080. Card should of been $500 max. The 980 should have been $450. Entirely too many people buying based on performance and not even considering where in the product stack this comes in at.

Yea Yea I know that it is the flagship at "that point in time" and it is "15% faster then the 980ti so it should cost 15% more!"

Nvidia is not stupid, but in a way the customers are setting the prices or at least not helping themselves. The 1080 is still sold out most of the time. We had people selling 980ti's for $350-$450 on Ebay and Craigslist to pay $675-$700 for a 15-20% improvement on the 1080. Nvidia sees this and realizes that they can price where they want. Does not help with no competition from AMD in this segment. I kept my 980ti hybrid because it clocks to 1550 and there was no way I was going to pay almost $700 for a midsize chip card. I understand that performance should not be the only criteria for the pricing of the GPU.

Now the problem is if Vega does not hit a homerun I worry that the 1080ti will be priced at $850-$900. In fact this new card might be the actual TI in itself. ( mad.gif pricing wise).Hopefully Vega does well and it forces the 1080 to drop to $500-525 which is where it should be now. Then the 1080ti can be priced at $725-$750 but I doubt it..

I myself will not pay more than $750 for a GPU because I look at history of the GPU and then add for inflation etc. Look at the prices of the big boy GPU prices - 8800gtx- not including the Ultra's stupid price for 5-7 % performance increase to today. $650 or less to $650 to $700 for a 980ti Then look at the initial prices of the midsize chips. $250 for a 8800gt and now we are scaling all the way to $700 for a 1080.

You see that the high end (excluding TItan) has held prices within 20% for the last 10 years. Hell even the 7800GTX was $649 way back when. I personally am ok with a 20% increase over 10 years for inflation, wages etc. I am NOT ok with the huge increase in the midrange prices.

Just go back in time to when the 8800gt came out in 2007. It was $250 at launch. The card it replaced; the 7950gt was released the year before at $299-$349. I had both cards. The 8800gt almost DOUBLED the 7950gt in performance but was less money. The 8800gt has to be one of the most sold cards of all time along with the 9700pro, ti4200 and the 970gtx.

I know I jumped around a lot here but I just wanted to show that since the 680gtx, Nvidia is killing us in the pricing of the midrange size chip. We should not be paying 300% more for these chips then 7-8 years ago. I am ok with a 20% big chip TI pricing but not over $750-$800.

If pricing was based just on performance like some of you think we would be paying $3000 for a gpu right now. Think about it starting from the ti 4200 days. And go thru each generation and take benchmarks and see what the performance increase was for the midrange. . Now take that % and do the same for the prices. We would be at $3000 or so for a gpu by now.

If we continue buying at these prices we will be paying huge prices all the time like we are now. We need AMD to come out with a winner.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Not at all! I'm still within the Amazon return period. I just figured maybe an OCN bro might want it since they're hard to get. It goes back to Amazon in the morning if no one wants it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TL;DR
> 
> Pricing is based on competition and what the market will bear. Everything else you said is moot.


I am glad you highness thinks so!


----------



## DADDYDC650

^Thanks for keeping it short...


----------



## hokk

Ok but will this be a paper launch or can i actually order the card and it will be with me in a reasonable timescale?


----------



## dmasteR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kylzer*
> 
> Ok but will this be a paper launch or can i actually order the card and it will be with me in a reasonable timescale?


It's being sold on NVIDIA.com exclusively. No aftermarket cards like all the other Titans. With a price tag of $1200, I'm going to assume it will still sell out.


----------



## i7monkey

I just want to know at what price point will Nvidia shillers stop defending Nvidia. How much will it have to cost before we no longer get any "stop whining" posts from these guys.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> I just want to know at what price point will Nvidia shillers stop defending Nvidia. How much will it have to cost before we no longer get any "stop whining" posts from these guys.


I do not think people that buy Titan cards are Nvidia shills. They just want to buy the best. If it was AMD they would get AMD.


----------



## jincuteguy

So does anyone remember when the old Titan X was selling on Nvidia website, how fast did it get sold out? couple hours? or minutes?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *supermi*
> 
> Many here or some could put aside $50k a month bud. That is irrelevant to escalating overpricing "and a chump consumer mindset".
> 
> #1 buy it if you can/want
> #2 use any legal means you want to get a good deal, including social discussion to limit the potential future price increases and maybe signalnanprice decrease. This is PART OF negotiations between consumer and company, heck they DO THE SAME in trolling high priced cards and naming rebrands 680 to 1080 now that us jumping a price bracket again.
> 
> Negotiate for the best deal you can then speak with your wallet and if you are a boss work with a team to strengthen your position.
> 
> Or well you present a more feminine, milking kinda approach that dominant companies like ?


Well lets face it, a high end GPU is a luxury item. Its a luxury item in a market dominated by one player, what did you think was gonna happen? Nvidia could charge two grand for these and I am positive they would all sell out....three thousand not so much, but I think two thousand is the threshold that they could get away with. So you have to decide, is Nvidia Evil and milking us? Or do they love us and willing to sacrifice a bit of raw profit to try and keep the luxury good attainable to the common man?


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> After reading through this thread.. There's a very common pattern.
> 
> Most of the complainers are:
> 1) 1080 owners that likely wished they waited, so they troll the thread and lie to themselves about wanting the card.
> 2) People who can't afford the card at all, so they decided to troll the thread about how the product isn't worth the money.
> 
> Yes you can argue that this card is poor priceerformance, but so is the 1080. No one buying high end cards cares about that, especially something in the Titan lineup. The previous titans were very successful, and this one will be too.


Bingo! Haters are gonna hate. They want to have the best on a budget. Not going to happen no matter what the hobby. Good thing for these whiners my Lightnings will be on Ebay here soon for a bargain price haha.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Most of the complainers are:
> 1) 1080 owners that likely wished they waited, so they troll the thread and lie to themselves about wanting the card.
> 2) People who can't afford the card at all, so they decided to troll the thread about how the product isn't worth the money.


I don't own a 1080 so does that mean I can't afford the card?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ikjadoon*
> 
> You honestly don't understand that a monopoly increases prices, relative to a competitive market? What economics did you study? You realize...the very link you posted states that a monopoly increases prices. I literally posted the next slide, which clearly showed that a monopoly allows a business to charge higher prices.





Spoiler: Reading comprehension






Spoiler: required










Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Holy cow the forum is _really_ *borken*. (yes *borken*)


----------



## Viveacious

Not easy to 'recoup' cost when ebay charges you a 10% seller fee and you have to pay for shipping.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I do not think people that buy Titan cards are Nvidia shills. They just want to buy the best. If it was AMD they would get AMD.


I'd still buy NVIDIA. Not because I am an NVIDIA fanboy, but because AMD has been terrible to me. I buy from companies that give me good experiences, but I am definitely not loyal to a brand. When I start having issues, I look elsewhere.

Every single AMD card I have bought has been loud, overheated, had serious driver issues, and/or needed multiple RMAs. I just gave up on them. Granted I haven't tried AMD for about 4 years now, and I have heard drivers have improved, but they still lost me for life. Maybe that will change if I ever buy a NVIDIA card i'm not completely satisfied with.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> I don't own a 1080 so does that mean I can't afford the card? [


Yes, that is exactly what I said.







The key word here is "most". Ironic considering your trolling someone about reading comprehensions in the same post.

If neither of those scenarios apply to you, then you really shouldn't care because you know i'm not talking about you. The people who want to get defensive, are the ones I find funny because I think deep down they know it DOES apply to them.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Bingo! Haters are gonna hate. They want to have the best on a budget. Not going to happen no matter what the hobby. Good thing for these whiners my Lightnings will be on Ebay here soon for a bargain price haha.


Exactly...I have a 4k OLED and a VIVE to feed.......Fast sync only works with one gpu and VR only works with one GPU.....so I need the very best...if AMD had a comparable solution I would be buying from them like I did back in the 7970 days when I ran four Lightnings to power my beastly 5x1 setup

RIP AMD

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/l88bastard/media/blocks.jpg.html

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/l88bastard/media/5x1club5.jpg.html

*THIS IS ALL JUST A STOP GAP THOUGH...WHAT WE ALL ARE WAITING FOR IS*


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I'd still buy NVIDIA. Not because I am an NVIDIA fanboy, but because AMD has been terrible to me.
> 
> Every single AMD card I have bought has been loud, overheated, had serious driver issues, and/or needed multiple RMAs. I just gave up on them. Granted I haven't tried AMD for about 4 years now, and I have heard drivers have improved, but they still lost me for life. Maybe that will change if I ever buy a NVIDIA card i'm not completely satisfied with.


Well as long as you buy $1000+ GPU you will never have to buy a AMD GPU.


----------



## Espen83

How much faster? Way faster (shows graph of power consumption).


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Exactly...I have a 4k OLED and a VIVE to feed.......


Hey me too!

I wouldn't trade my 65" LG E6 for anything in the world. RIP monitors until we start seeing OLED monitors.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Well as long as you buy $1000+ GPU you will never have to buy a AMD GPU.


Indeed, that's one of my problems with AMD. They never really aim for the #1 spot, they aim for what the typical consumer wants. SLI/CF has been terrible experiences for me, so I avoid them. For 4K, this card is really the only single GPU solution that makes sense on the current market.


----------



## CallsignVega

I'm considering just getting one Titan-XP now instead of two. But 4K @ 120 Hz is still nagging at me that it may hit before the end of the year and one card won't be enough.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Just sold my 1080 FTW. Bought the new Titan X on ebay for $550. Not sure if the seller knows the card is worth $1200+. Sucker!


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I'm considering just getting one Titan-XP now instead of two. But 4K @ 120 Hz is still nagging at me that it may hit before the end of the year and one card won't be enough.


I would play it safe then and buy three XPs


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Exactly...I have a 4k OLED and a *VIVE* to feed.......Fast sync only works with one gpu and VR only works with one GPU.....so I need the very best...


You do realize that the VIVE only has a 90Hz refresh rate and only a 25% greater pixel count than 1080P and 30% fewer than 1440P? Not exactly a strain on mid-grade GPUs...


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Just sold my 1080 FTW. Bought the new Titan X on ebay for $550. Not sure if the seller knows the card is worth $1200+. Sucker!


lol you gott a really great deal cause they are going for $1,799 on Newegg
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0AJ43Y3485&cm_re=titan_x-_-9SIA0AJ43Y3485-_-Product


----------



## jincuteguy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Just sold my 1080 FTW. Bought the new Titan X on ebay for $550. Not sure if the seller knows the card is worth $1200+. Sucker!


*** are u talking about? The new Titan X is not even out yet LOL.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> You do realize that the VIVE only has a 90Hz refresh rate and only a 25% greater pixel count than 1080P and 30% fewer than 1440P? Not exactly a strain on mid-grade GPUs...


You do realize that, the best way to enjoy VR on these lowly resolution screens is to double and quadruple up on the supersampling right?


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> You do realize that the VIVE only has a 90Hz refresh rate and only a 25% greater pixel count than 1080P and 30% fewer than 1440P? Not exactly a strain on mid-grade GPUs...


Well, when more graphically demanding VR games come out, maintaining 90hz could be a challenge though.


----------



## jincuteguy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Well, when more graphically demanding VR games come out, maintaining 90hz could be a challenge though.


What is a VIVE?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> *** are u talking about? The new Titan X is not even out yet LOL.


Haters gon' hate.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Hey me too!
> 
> I wouldn't trade my 65" LG E6 for anything in the world. RIP monitors until we start seeing OLED monitors.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeed, that's one of my problems with AMD. They never really aim for the #1 spot, they aim for what the typical consumer wants. SLI/CF has been terrible experiences for me, so I avoid them. For 4K, this card is really the only single GPU solution that makes sense on the current market.


oooooohhhh I only have the 55" the 65 must be glorious









Yea, I like how we always hear the "I can just get two xxxx cards for better performance....." uuuuuggghhhhhh I have tried ever SLI, TRISLI, Quadsli, Crossfire, Trifire, Quadfire solution and they all gave me terrible trouble. I would spend 90% of my time troubleshooting and only 10% gaming......one card is the way to go. I only want two, cause I got two rigs








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> What is a VIVE?


HTC VIVE = Virtual Reality Headset


----------



## Ghoxt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> The GPU Architectural Milking strategy is to simply represent each GPU release as "The best single GPU ever" spaced half a year or more apart. This way there is always a "Sliding Midrange" designation. In this case the 1070 is midrange. The 1080 is *"Now"* marketed as the high end. Suggested prices reflect this Now. Only enthusiasts designate a single card as forevermore a Midrange / high end. The GPU vendors seem to be marching to their own drum...and it's called money...your money
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then groundhogs day / timewarp occurs, in Q3 2016 to Q1 2017 (definitely sooner depending on if AMD drops something competitive) Nvidia Marketing strikes up and now declares new Best GPU's and the Midrange changes again. Fans go into a tizzy and get taken, hook like and sinker. Rinse Repeat.


I posted this on 5/22 - Seems highly relevant lol though i missed on the price, and the AMD part, as of course Nvidia is just running away now all on their own... It's obvious Nvidia lives here, as $1200 was floated by one of our guys some time ago to get us lubed for it....


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Well lets face it, a high end GPU is a luxury item. Its a luxury item in a market dominated by one player, what did you think was gonna happen? Nvidia could charge two grand for these and I am positive they would all sell out....three thousand not so much, but I think two thousand is the threshold that they could get away with. So you have to decide, is Nvidia Evil and milking us? *Or do they love us and willing to sacrifice a bit of raw profit to try and keep the luxury good attainable to the common man?*


If you truly believe this then your MBA has failed you.


----------



## i7monkey

I miss the days where a fully unlocked high end chip cost $499. No nonsense, no BS, no gimmicks, no hidden garbage, no surprises. They released a chip up front and you knew you'd have the best single gpu for a year.



Right now, the marketing geniuses at Nvidia have us so tight by the balls that they can simply _CHANGE THE NAME_ of a product line and charge almost 4 times the price without anyone saying anything.

It's insanity.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> You do realize that, the best way to enjoy VR on these lowly resolution screens is to double and quadruple up on the supersampling right?


Since you brought up resolution scaling on VR...


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> I miss the days where a fully unlocked high end chip cost $499. No nonsense, no BS, no gimmicks, no hidden garbage, no surprises. They released a chip up front and you knew you'd have the best single gpu for a year.
> 
> 
> 
> Right now, the marketing geniuses at Nvidia have us so tight by the balls that they can simply _CHANGE THE NAME_ of a product line and charge almost 4 times the price without anyone saying anything.
> 
> It's insanity.


Combination of shrinking discrete GPU market and a lack of competition on high end.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> You do realize that the VIVE only has a 90Hz refresh rate and only a 25% greater pixel count than 1080P and 30% fewer than 1440P? Not exactly a strain on mid-grade GPUs...


No sorry, it's not the same. You must absolutely keep your minimum FPS at 90FPS and not a single FPS lower or you will get motion sickness and weird jerkiness. You need lots of overkill to achieve that, which is why at the bare minimum they recommend a 970.

Due to the low resolution, the picture looks pixelated which means some people like to render the screen higher and downsample it. This requires absurd GPU power on the vive.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> You must absolutely keep your minimum FPS at 90FPS and not a single FPS lower or you will get motion sickness and weird jerkiness.


The perils of early adoption. Thanks for volunteering to be the guinea pig for the betterment of the rest of us


----------



## supermi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Well lets face it, a high end GPU is a luxury item. Its a luxury item in a market dominated by one player, what did you think was gonna happen? Nvidia could charge two grand for these and I am positive they would all sell out....three thousand not so much, but I think two thousand is the threshold that they could get away with. So you have to decide, is Nvidia Evil and milking us? Or do they love us and willing to sacrifice a bit of raw profit to try and keep the luxury good attainable to the common man?


Sorry none of what you said has much directly to do what I said. The fact it is a monopoly of makes what I said MORE pertinent.

Regardless of market health we the consumer are looking for our best deals, if there are no other companies that do so adequately we can and should (if we value our $$ as much as NVIDIA and we should).

What NVIDIA does with pricing has no direct relevance to me, I will buy , not buy or post comments etc bases on the percieved value and my interest in the sector. In this case I am interested enough beyond my current video card to get into talks and hope to direct the discussion towards concepts that "help the consumer".

Let them price it at $10k $20k or $200 they are going for maximum profit and they should.

Other than a lack of education, mentorship or a simple lack of desire to better ones position why defend the people taking more of your $$ than perhaps we like or than industry norms has seemed to indicate is fair.

Are there other reasons to talk ourselves and each other into paying a company which WILL sell at $600 if they cant at a higher price ($600 is a random # choosen)?

We are talking about entirely new pricing segments and structures in place over the course of a few years and it seems thay NVIDIA and INTEL are in a cash grab while they can, and they should. We should look out for consumer #1 as well ?

ESIT: Mobile, apologies for typos !

EDIT: EVEN got typos on the edit attempt (fail) hahaha


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Well lets face it, a high end GPU is a luxury item. Its a luxury item in a market dominated by one player, what did you think was gonna happen? Nvidia could charge two grand for these and I am positive they would all sell out....three thousand not so much, but I think two thousand is the threshold that they could get away with. *So you have to decide, is Nvidia Evil and milking us? Or do they love us and willing to sacrifice a bit of raw profit to try and keep the luxury good attainable to the common man?*


Not interested in whining about Titan price for every 5 min but I hope that is not the mindset of most people who buys those Titans.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> I miss the days where a fully unlocked high end chip cost $499. No nonsense, no BS, no gimmicks, no hidden garbage, no surprises.


I miss the 99 cent Whopper and Big Mac days, but they're never coming back... Get over it!


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> I miss the 99 cent Whopper and Big Mac days, but they're never coming back... Get over it!


My local McDonald's usually has a get two big macs for $4 promo. Titan XP Black for $499 confirmed?!?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So If i want to buy the new Titan X on Aug 2nd, where would I need to be looking at? Newegg? EVGA? or Nvida store?


It's 25th of july and the 1080 was teleased on 27th of may if I remember right and availability is still sketchy if u want a certain model so I quess u can buy one in november :-D


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> I miss the 99 cent Whopper and Big Mac days, but they're never coming back... Get over it!


i was about go to BK because of your post but decided to get macaroni from the fridge


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> I miss the 99 cent Whopper and Big Mac days, but they're never coming back... Get over it!


Inflation ≠price gouging


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> I just want to know at what price point will Nvidia shillers stop defending Nvidia. How much will it have to cost before we no longer get any "stop whining" posts from these guys.


Throwing a tantrum isn't going to get you that $1200.00 TXP, but, studying hard in school and getting a decent paying job will....


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> The perils of early adoption. Thanks for volunteering to be the guinea pig for the betterment of the rest of us


Going to be the case with all VR. Our brains are way more sensitive with actual head tracking than moving a cursor around.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Throwing a tantrum isn't going to get you that $1200.00 TXP, but, studying hard in school and getting a decent paying job will....


Exactly, $1200 is less than one paycheck for some people.

I probably wouldn't buy it if it was $1400 or so. I can spend about $600/m on toys, so with saving it only takes ~2 months to afford this. That's worth it to me. The trick is don't have kids, they eat your funds.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Throwing a tantrum isn't going to get you that $1200.00 TXP, but, studying hard in school and getting a decent paying job will....


It'll also depend heavily on where you live. Here in Taxifornia (well the Bay Area to be more precise), you pretty much have to be in at least the 80th percentile of your income group if you want to have anything resembling moderate comfort.

I mean, you know something's _completely whack_ when a freaking *garage* goes for $1,000/mo.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> *Exactly, what some people don't realize is that $1200 is less than one paycheck for many people on here.* $1200 is nearing the limit for me personally. I probably wouldn't buy it if it was $1400 or so.


Doesn't mean much if it's a monthly paycheck.







I kid I kid.

But yeah, wouldn't be surprised if many (most?) on here are fairly well-off bourgeois types.


----------



## 970Rules

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkBlade6*
> 
> Omg this is Kepler all over again XD
> 
> 680
> Titan
> 
> .............
> 
> 680 = 770
> 780 = castrated GK100
> 780 Ti = Full fat GK100 with less VRAM
> Titan Black = Full fat GK100 with more VRAM
> 
> 1080
> Titan XP
> 
> ..............
> 
> 1080 = 1170
> 1180 = castrated GP100 (3000ish cores)
> 1180 Ti = Full fat GP100 with 12GB GDDR5X
> Titan Black XP = Full fat GP100 with 16GB HBM2


This road map 100%

Then it is Maxwell all over again with the then more mature 16nm FinFET Volta.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Maintenance Bot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I wonder what the most commonly used name for the new Titan X is going to be.
> 
> Titan X Pascal
> Maxwell bois get rekt a new sheriff is in town Titan
> Titan 1200$
> new Titan X
> I'd pay anything Titan
> My wife left me Titan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol, I like this one the best.
> 
> Nvidia named it Nvidia Titan X so NTX maybe?
Click to expand...

Many people are already referring to it as the Titan XP. So shorthand for same ought to be TXP.

Gets my vote.


----------



## blue1512

One thing for sure they will recyle the 1080 PCB with the addition of four mem chips, one VRM phase and (maybe not) one 6 pin.



Easy leather jackets for JHH


----------



## renejr902

I cant find these answers...
1. If i buy the titan xp on nvidia website, how many years nvidia will guarantee the videocard ? 2. Does the videocard be guaranteed if i overclock it and the card broke or stop working normally ? (i always overclock without adding voltage, i never add voltage)
3. Is the card still guarantee if i change the stock cooler with a thurd oarty one , like water cooling ?
Thanks for answers , i cant find answers to my 3 questions


----------



## FattysGoneWild

I don't blame or hate Nvidia at all for this madness. I blame YOU the consumers. You have a choice to buy or not to buy. You choose to buy and these are the results. Deal with it. Don't like it? Don't buy it.







Like that is ever going to happen. Oh lack of competition blah blah BLAH! That never has or will be a valid argument. In the end. It all falls on the consumer and how they choose to spend. You make the decisions. Not Nvidia.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Oh lack of competition blah blah BLAH! *That never has or will be a valid argument.*


----------



## mohit9206

According to my calculations Pascal Titan X is as fast as quad sli 780Tis. Which means you're getting $2800 worth of performance for only $1200. If that doesn't scream value for money,i don't know how else to convince you guys.


----------



## skypine27

My wallet is ready for 2 x of them:
http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I am because if you think they are going to release better in the next 8+ months than you are lying to yourself. 8+ months is a super long time in the hardware market, and if you base your purchase on that then you'd never buy anything.
> 
> I want to run 4K 60hz in newer games now, and on a single card. This is the only card on the market that has a chance at doing that, *so price doesn't really matter to me*.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Going to be the case with all VR. Our brains are way more sensitive with actual head tracking than moving a cursor around.
> Exactly, $1200 is less than one paycheck for some people.
> 
> *I probably wouldn't buy it if it was $1400 or so*. I can spend about $600/m on toys, so with saving it only takes ~2 months to afford this. That's worth it to me. The trick is don't have kids, they eat your funds.


You've gone from not caring about the price to not spending more than $1400. Nvidia has you hook, line, and sinker!


----------



## blue1512

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mohit9206*
> 
> According to my calculations Pascal Titan X is as fast as quad sli 780Tis. Which means you're getting $2800 worth of performance for only $1200. If that doesn't scream value for money,i don't know how else to convince you guys.


SLI doesn't scale well above 2 cards though, especially in games.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Going to be the case with all VR. Our brains are way more sensitive with actual head tracking than moving a cursor around.
> Exactly, $1200 is less than one paycheck for some people.
> 
> I probably wouldn't buy it if it was $1400 or so. I can spend about $600/m on toys, so with saving it only takes ~2 months to afford this. That's worth it to me. The trick is don't have kids, they eat your funds.


Uhm, you will love your kids when you have them.


----------



## barsh90

Whats better, 2 1080s in SLi or a TITAN XP? They say the new titan has about 50% increase over the 1080, and usually sli does not give you more than 50% increase in games.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *barsh90*
> 
> Whats better, 2 1080s in SLi or a TITAN XP? They say the new titan has about 50% increase over the 1080, and usually sli does not give you more than 50% increase in games.


Well, this question won't be answered properly until we get some reviews of the Titan XP and see some benchmarks. If release happens a week Tuesday, when should we expect the NDA to lift on reviews?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *barsh90*
> 
> Whats better, 2 1080s in SLi or a TITAN XP? They say the new titan has about 50% increase over the 1080, and usually sli does not give you more than 50% increase in games.


Titan XP is projected to be about 20-30 percent faster than a 1080.


----------



## barsh90

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Titan XP is projected to be about 20-30 percent faster than a 1080.


ah i see. Any news on the TI, or they will be skipping the Ti this time around?


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *barsh90*
> 
> Whats better, 2 1080s in SLi or a TITAN XP? They say the new titan has about 50% increase over the 1080, and usually sli does not give you more than 50% increase in games.


60% over Titan X is definitely not 50% over 1080. According to nvidia TX=1070, so 20-30% over 1080 I suppose.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I cant find these answers...
> Does the videocard be guaranteed if i overclock it and the card broke or stop working normally ?


yes. you just don't say you did.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *barsh90*
> 
> ah i see. Any news on the TI, or they will be skipping the Ti this time around?


Nobody knows if a Ti exists. I'm guessing they'll release a Ti at the end of this year.


----------



## JackCY

I suppose there will be no Titan X giveaways? lol

Someone gotta do something irresponsible with that irresponsible performance.


----------



## DADDYDC650

As the launch looms closer, the upgrade itch attacks my brain relentlessly!!! Should I???


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> As the launch looms closer, the upgrade itch attacks my brain relentlessly!!! Should I???


I think the question is, dual 1080s or a single Titan?








In other words, both require you to sell both kidneys.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> I think the question is, dual 1080s or a single Titan?


Meh, I'd rather go 1 Titan XP over 1080 SLI. Cheaper to go 1 Titan XP as well and cooler.


----------



## xioros

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> I think the question is, dual 1080s or a single Titan?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Meh, I'd rather go 1 Titan XP over 1080 SLI. Cheaper to go 1 Titan XP as well and cooler.
Click to expand...

And a lot slower. Small detail.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xioros*
> 
> And a lot slower. Small detail.


Not always slower but waaayyy cooler.


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So who's buying this $1200 mid-range Titan?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> As the launch looms closer, the upgrade itch attacks my brain relentlessly!!! Should I???


looks like you are buying this $1200 mid-range Titan


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> looks like you are buying this $1200 mid-range Titan


You got me!


----------



## mcg75

I really have a strange feeling about this Titan X.

No big press conference, no AIB vendors etc only sold through Nvidia.

It's very obviously not meant to be any sort of a big seller.

I get the feeling Nvidia is sitting on something waiting to see what Vega becomes and this is just something to plug the gap until then.


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Just sold my 1080 FTW. Bought the new Titan X on ebay for $550. Not sure if the seller knows the card is worth $1200+. Sucker!


uhh.... Are you sure it's a TXP and not a TX?


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Technically there's no reason for this Titan X, since AMD has nothing to compete with the GTX 1080 as it is.


Wait there is, if there is original a roadmap for 1080 ti but decided to set it at double price cos there is no competition.

Why not earn 100% more.


----------



## meson1

Well I find myself in a quandry. My choices are One 1080 FE, Two 1080 FEs or Titan XP. I'm coming from a 780TI and my choice will be going under water in a new rig and will be overclocked. I want 4K in GTA:V and Rise of the Tomb Raider, with the eye candy turned up. I'm also considering VR in the future with a Vive.


*One 1080*
Pros
Cheapest option
Single card most likely to be compatible with most AAA titles
Can get one 1080 and opt to buy another later
Cons
Probably can't get 60fps @ 4K in GTA:V with graphics settings turned up

*Two 1080s*
Pros
Will definitely achieve more than 60fps @ 4K in GTA:V
GPU per eye rendering for VR - will help in more demanding titles.
Cons
More expensive than a single Titan XP
SLI going forward with DX12 onwards is completely reliant on game publishers writing for it. If they don't the extra card is a dead duck.

*Titan XP*
Pros
Single card most likely to be compatible with most AAA titles
Cons
Expensive for a single card ... stupidly so.
Performance in target titles unknown - waiting for reviews and game benchmarks - but may well achieve required performance in target titles.

*Two Titan XP's*
Cons
Dude! Do you think I'm MADE of money?

*1080 Ti*
Pros
Single card most likely to be compatible with most AAA titles
Cons
Total vaporware. Doesn't exist. No evidence this is even in Nvidia's plans and if it is there is no way of knowing when they'll drop it..
Performance in target titles unknown - But Titan XP benchmarks likely to be good indicator of expected performance of Ti.


----------



## Klocek001

1080 SLI, should do v.well @4K given the more GPU intensive the scenario, the better the scaling. I have many doubts wheter Titan X is the actual 4K 60 fps card we've been waiting for. It'd have to be 40-50% faster than 1080, but I doubt it will.


----------



## jbmayes2000

Quick noob question. How come for the Titan line of cards there are no AIB versions? I know that MSI,ASUS, etc.. sell them but they never slap on their cooling solutions to them. Why is that?


----------



## CallsignVega

No one knows how well the Titan-XP will overclock yet. The last Titan-X could overclock over 400 MHz with a simple BIOS mod. If the new one could get up to 1900 MHz, it's going to be a beast. I'd say +40% faster than a 1080.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> No one knows how well the Titan-XP will overclock yet. The last Titan-X could overclock over 400 MHz with a simple BIOS mod. If the new one could get up to 1900 MHz, it's going to be a beast. I'd say +40% faster than a 1080.


+40% faster only in synthetic benchmarks if clocked same as 1080.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jbmayes2000*
> 
> Quick noob question. How come for the Titan line of cards there are no AIB versions? I know that MSI,ASUS, etc.. sell them but they never slap on their cooling solutions to them. Why is that?


It's part of the restrictions Nvidia impose on AIB partners for the Titan line. They can't sell custom PCBs for Titan. They can't sell Titans fitted with non-reference air cooling solutions.

Gigabyte got round the restriction by bundling their Windforce cooler with the regular Titan X. They supplied instructions describing how to remove the reference cooler and fit the Windforce unit.

The only non-reference cooling solutions AIB partners are allowed to sell pre-fitted on Titans are waterblocks, such as EVGA with their Hydro product.


----------



## jbmayes2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> It's part of the restrictions Nvidia impose on AIB partners for the Titan line.


Have they ever said in the past why the restrictions?


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> +40% faster only in synthetic benchmarks if clocked same as 1080.


How about to 2ghz and beyond


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jbmayes2000*
> 
> Have they ever said in the past why the restrictions?


It's a branding thing.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> How about to 2ghz and beyond


Just look at the specs. Titan has 40-50% more. It should not scale 1:1 so ~ 40% is about right at best. Most likely ~ 35% with same OC in most games. I am sure Titan XP will hit 2GHz if it's not power limited under water. With Stock cooler it might be hard.


----------



## CallsignVega

Ya that's why I ordered two of these:

https://www.amazon.com/EVGA-Hybrid-GeForce-Cooling-400-HY-0996-B1/dp/B00ZQ4PFX2/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1469451434&sr=8-2&keywords=evga+980ti+hybrid

Should be easy to make fit the Titan-XP and are almost half price.


----------



## emett

haha, nice, albeit a bit ghetto.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Just shipped my 1080 FTW back. Nvidia, save me a plate of crow with ranch on August 2nd please!


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Exactly, $1200 is less than one paycheck for some people.
> 
> I probably wouldn't buy it if it was $1400 or so. I can spend about $600/m on toys, so with saving it only takes ~2 months to afford this. That's worth it to me. The trick is don't have kids, they eat your funds.


It is not about if one can afford it or not. It is more about smart money here. I definitely not foolish enough to buy things like this, there are better ways to spend that $1200







Different people have different priorities.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Nvidia, save me a plate of crow with ranch on August 2nd please!


I hear Titan XP's are crunchy.


----------



## ChevChelios

Titan XP is already obsolete in the face of the almighty Volta !

dont buy it and just wait for GV102 or at least GV104


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Titan XP is already obsolete in the face of the almighty Volta !
> 
> dont buy it and just wait for GV102 or at least GV104


By your logic, Volta is already obsolete because of whatever comes after it.


----------



## XxOsurfer3xX

Damn, I want a new graphics card for my 4K monitor, I have used the Fury for a while now and it is not enough. The titan XP would be perfect for my needs, but I already think the 1080 is overpriced, so this is totally ridiculous... The wait for Vega is going to be a nightmare!!


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> By your logic, Volta is already obsolete because of whatever comes after it.


nah we dont even know what that something is called yet

meanwhile Volta could _possibly_ be here in ~10+ months

and GV104 wont cost you $1000+

if you dont wanna spend $1200 and need reasons not to buy Titan XP - Volta or at least a possible 1080Ti are those reasons


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> nah we dont even know what that something is called yet
> 
> meanwhile Volta could _possibly_ be here in ~10+ months
> 
> and GV104 wont cost you $1000+
> 
> if you dont wanna spend $1200 and need reasons not to buy Titan XP - Volta or at least a possible 1080Ti are those reasons


Point is, Volta isn't out yet and the only info that's available are based off rumors.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FattysGoneWild*
> 
> I don't blame or hate Nvidia at all for this madness. I blame YOU the consumers. You have a choice to buy or not to buy. You choose to buy and these are the results. Deal with it. Don't like it? Don't buy it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like that is ever going to happen. Oh lack of competition blah blah BLAH! That never has or will be a valid argument. In the end. It all falls on the consumer and how they choose to spend. You make the decisions. Not Nvidia.


Don't tell us how to spend (or not spend) our money. KTHX BYE. Like someone else already said, if AMD was making the best card, the folks who can afford it would buy that instead.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Just shipped my 1080 FTW back. Nvidia, save me a plate of crow with ranch on August 2nd please!


Everything tastes better with ranch!!!


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Point is, Volta isn't out yet and the only info that's available are based off rumors.


Im trying to get people to NOT buy a $1200 TItan

dont stop me


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> I just want to know at what price point will Nvidia shillers stop defending Nvidia. How much will it have to cost before we no longer get any "stop whining" posts from these guys.


It's not about accusing or defending. If it's too much for you, then just don't buy it. Why does people have to whine about how expensive something costs? It's the same as people with no money whining about how expensive a Ferrari or yachts costs. If you don't have the money or you're not willing to pay for the premium, then quit complaining and just move along.

This has nothing to do with Nvidia. It'd be the same with AMD if they were to release a halo card at $1500. Hell, look at intel's 6950X. I don't see the value in the $1700 10 core chip, but do you see me bashing intel or people who buy it? No of course not.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> It's not about accusing or defending. If it's too much for you, then just don't buy it. Why does people have to whine about how expensive something costs? It's the same as people with no money whining about how expensive a Ferrari or yachts costs. If you don't have the money or you're not willing to pay for the premium, then quit complaining and just move along.
> 
> This has nothing to do with Nvidia. It'd be the same with AMD if they were to release a halo card at $1500. Hell, look at intel's 6950X. I don't see the value in the $1700 10 core chip, but do you see me bashing intel or people who buy it? No of course not.


Cheap talk, expensive hardware, and please don't compare a Ferrari or a yacht to a product for a large consumer base,even it is prosumer. If you have the money to buy this, good for you, but don't tell us not to buy something we could have afford if the market was not that dumb. Geez


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> It's not about accusing or defending. If it's too much for you, then just don't buy it. Why does people have to whine about how expensive something costs? It's the same as people with no money whining about how expensive a Ferrari or yachts costs. If you don't have the money or you're not willing to pay for the premium, then quit complaining and just move along.
> 
> This has nothing to do with Nvidia. It'd be the same with AMD if they were to release a halo card at $1500. Hell, look at intel's 6950X. I don't see the value in the $1700 10 core chip, but do you see me bashing intel or people who buy it? No of course not.
> 
> 
> 
> Cheap talk, expensive hardware, and please don't compare a Ferrari or a yacht to a product for a large consumer base,even it is prosumer. If you have the money to buy this, good for you, but don't tell us not to buy something we could have afford if the market was not that dumb. Geez
Click to expand...

Did you ever watch the Pascal Titan X reveal? Even Jen Hsun quite literally said "we wont sell many of these"

Yes, I'm planning on picking up two. I've already sold my 980ti's.


----------



## Fiercy

I am going to get two cards two. I wonder what time will it go on sale midnight?


----------



## jarble

I intend to hold out till the "TI" cards. Nvidia and Intel are really pushing the price envelope this year. I will still eat up the reviews like a mad man when they come out


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Im trying to get people to NOT buy a $1200 TItan
> 
> dont stop me


If anything, you've changed my mind about buying the Titan XP. I now want to buy two!!!


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Since you brought up resolution scaling on VR...


Multi-GPU is not working for VR. Technically it's there, but it's up to game developers to implement it.

None have to this point, and considering the minority own multi-GPU there aren't likely to be an abundant library of titles in the future that do. It'll be a 'hit or miss' thing, at best, leaving VR users to go with the single strongest GPU available.

Thus, Titan X at 1200$.

Also, VR is only visually appealing once you supersample. It defaults to 3160x, and you really only start to pull the fog/blur back at 4500x and up. Holding that kind of res at 90hz without turning other settings way down is crazy demanding.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> If anything, you've changed my mind about buying the Titan XP. I now want to buy two!!!


reverse psychology working wonders, Lord Huang will be pleased with me

if you can afford it - go for it


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> reverse psychology working wonders, Lord Huang will be pleased with me
> 
> if you can afford it - go for it


So I DON'T want to buy two? I'm confused!!!


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> The perils of early adoption [VR]. Thanks for volunteering to be the guinea pig for the betterment of the rest of us


It's worth every penny, and more.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So I DON'T want to buy two? I'm confused!!!


you want to buy 2 Titans now and then 2 Volta Titans ($1500 each) later !


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Ya that's why I ordered two of these:
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/EVGA-Hybrid-GeForce-Cooling-400-HY-0996-B1/dp/B00ZQ4PFX2/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1469451434&sr=8-2&keywords=evga+980ti+hybrid
> 
> Should be easy to make fit the Titan-XP and are almost half price.


Whatever happened to your elaborate cooling methods? Boy I miss your Geothermal craziness.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Im trying to get people to NOT buy a $1200 TItan
> 
> dont stop me


Waste of time, I did the same with the GTX 1080 and everyone and their wife got one. Now look what's happened, everyone is sending GTX 1080's back or selling them on eBay only after have them in their system for less than 2months. In some cases people have had them a matter of weeks, due to continued stock issues.

And just a few weeks ago, everyone was saying how bloody fabulous the card is and you couldn't get people to shut up about it...

Now nobody cares....

Same things going to happen with this Titan XP, Nvidia are too unpredictable to warrant risking $1200 a card for it to be stomped a few months later. I seriously doubt i'll be jumping on it, unless I know for 100% certainty I can get a year out of it before being superseded.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> I am going to get two cards two. I wonder what time will it go on sale midnight?


You'll be lucky to get hold of one at all, since it's all direct from Nvidia. It's going to be a card that very few people will be able to get even if they can afford one or two.

I think the only people that are laughing right now, are those that bought up cheap 980Ti's and Titan X's. While everyone else is falling over themselves for a silly $700 midrange gpu that's already been superseded in the fastest time ever!


----------



## CasualCat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Multi-GPU is not working for VR. Technically it's there, but it's up to game developers to implement it.
> 
> None have to this point, and considering the minority own multi-GPU there aren't likely to be an abundant library of titles in the future that do. It'll be a 'hit or miss' thing, at best, leaving VR users to go with the single strongest GPU available.
> 
> Thus, Titan X at 1200$.
> 
> Also, VR is only visually appealing once you supersample. It defaults to 3160x, and you really only start to pull the fog/blur back at 4500x and up. Holding that kind of res at 90hz without turning other settings way down is crazy demanding.


I was wondering about that, and it came up a few days ago in another thread. IF multigpu were to be actually utilized frequently for VR I'd probably be willing to go back to a SLI/CF setup.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Well I find myself in a quandry. My choices are One 1080 FE, *Two 1080 FEs* or Titan XP. I'm coming from a 780TI and my choice will be going under water in a new rig and will be overclocked. I want 4K in GTA:V and Rise of the Tomb Raider, with the eye candy turned up. *I'm also considering VR in the future with a Vive.*


If you're considering VR, then do not go SLI, because it doesn't work.

Nvidia has turned over implementation to game developers, so it will be even more 'hit or miss' in the future than it's been in the past considering that game developers would need to allocate additional resources to something that benefits the minority.

That hasn't worked out too well in the past considering they're already stretched thin as-is.

You're best off having the strongest single GPU available.

I'm running a Vive on a 1080 and can tell you that higher resolutions will cripple it in certain games (I'm looking at you, Raw Data). It does fine at the default res of 3160x, but if I were to show you a VR title at 3160x and then DSR it to 4500x you would buy the Titan without thinking twice. There is a huge difference in clarity and immersion. It's like going from a 1280x res monitor with no AA to 1920x and adding AA.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Im trying to get people to NOT buy a $1200 TItan
> 
> dont stop me


This time though I am not believe a Volta 2017 launch. There is too much GP100/102 to be release in the next 18 months. Even Maxwell with 2 GM200 variant lasted 21 months.

Btw the EVGA hybrid, will it really work on Titan XP? Seem like fit for 980 Ti.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mohit9206*
> 
> According to my calculations Pascal Titan X is as fast as quad sli 780Tis. Which means you're getting $2800 worth of performance for only $1200. If that doesn't scream value for money,i don't know how else to convince you guys.


According to my calculations Pascal Titan X is as fast as 600 Geforce 2 Ultras, which means you're getting $300 000 worth of performance for only $1200.

#logic


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> Why does people have to whine about how expensive something costs? It's the same as people with no money whining about how expensive a Ferrari or yachts costs.


People can voice their opinion all they want. It's no longer called whining when a significant portion of the gaming community can no longer purchase a high end card like they used to.

Titan is nothing special. It's not prosumer, it's not ultra high end, it's not a boutique card, it's not a halo card, nor is it like a Ferrari or a Yacht. It's the same old plastic crap pasted together and for some god damn reason they've fooled you guys into thinking it's worth 4x times as much as it used to cost ($329 GTX 570).

It's sickening how far people have fallen for this marketing. It's literally just a name.


----------



## criminal

And to think I feel kinda bad buying a 1070 FE at a premium instead of waiting for a cheaper AIB card. $1200... yikes. I just don't have the mentality to be a Titan purchaser. Been there, done that with the OG Titan. Won't be happening again.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> People can voice their opinion all they want. It's no longer called whining when a significant portion of the gaming community can no longer purchase a high end card like they used to.
> 
> Titan is nothing special. It's not prosumer, it's not ultra high end, it's not a boutique card, it's not a halo card, nor is it like a Ferrari or a Yacht. It's the same old plastic crap pasted together and for some god damn reason they've fooled you guys into thinking it's worth 4x times as much as it used to cost ($329 GTX 570).
> 
> It's sickening how far people have fallen for this marketing. It's literally just a name.


Plus this is an open forum. People can whine about or praise something all they like.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> Why does people have to whine about how expensive something costs? It's the same as people with no money whining about how expensive a Ferrari or yachts costs.
> 
> 
> 
> People can voice their opinion all they want. It's no longer called whining when a significant portion of the gaming community can no longer purchase a high end card like they used to.
> 
> Titan is nothing special. It's not prosumer, it's not ultra high end, it's not a boutique card, it's not a halo card, nor is it like a Ferrari or a Yacht. It's the same old plastic crap pasted together and for some god damn reason they've fooled you guys into thinking it's worth 4x times as much as it used to cost ($329 GTX 570).
> 
> It's sickening how far people have fallen for this marketing. It's literally just a name.
Click to expand...

Just go ask mom and dad for more money. That's what most of the "Gaming" community does to fund their GPU purchases anyway. At least that's the people who can't stop complaining about GPU prices.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> And to think I feel kinda bad buying a 1070 FE at a premium instead of waiting for a cheaper AIB card. $1200... yikes. I just don't have the mentality to be a Titan purchaser. Been there, done that with the OG Titan. Won't be happening again.
> Plus this is an open forum. People can whine about or praise something all they like.


But people work hard and Titan is their consolation prize.


----------



## ikjadoon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> OCN used to be about buying modest hardware and eeking out the max performance per dollar, not about paying crazy prices for instant max performance.
> 
> The term enthusiast does not equal paying max dollar for instant max performance. Where is the thrill in that?
> 
> People keep confusing "Enthusiast" with max amount of dollars for hardware, which is wrong.


True. I think that's not exactly an enthusiast overclocker. It's a surprising change.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> I don't own a 1080 so does that mean I can't afford the card?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Reading comprehension
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: required


LOL, maybe that's why it got deleted, mate.







You actually aren't interested in the conversation. My fault.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Wait there is, if there is original a roadmap for 1080 ti but decided to set it at double price cos there is no competition.
> 
> Why not earn 100% more.


This is exactly what i think that happen. This card was a 1080ti and they release it now, because titan hmb2 not ready or not worth it without amd competition, its so sad to think about it, they got us and they got me , i will pay the premium price for that 1080ti named titan x ultimate, its so sad really.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> yes. you just don't say you did.


Thanks for info, i really appreciated it very much.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> 1080 SLI, should do v.well @4K given the more GPU intensive the scenario, the better the scaling. I have many doubts wheter Titan X is the actual 4K 60 fps card we've been waiting for. It'd have to be 40-50% faster than 1080, but I doubt it will.


With overcloking we will be ok, im sure of it. Overclock it and you will have your 4k 60fps for most games, you can just turn off AA , i always do that in 4k.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> By your logic, Volta is already obsolete because of whatever comes after it.


When volta will be released, im sure we will heard about the next gen that will be much better, it always like that. If you want to wait until volta please at least buy a jhh jacket to encourage them







. For 1200$ they could at least give us a jhh free jacket.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> According to my calculations Pascal Titan X is as fast as 600 Geforce 2 Ultras, which means you're getting $300 000 worth of performance for only $1200.
> 
> #logic


I had the geforce 2 ultra and i loved it so much in that time, i love your logic, +1


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> But people work hard and Titan is their consolation prize.


Well, when you put it like that.... nah, still not buying one.


----------



## junkman

Those saying that people should stop complaining about GPU prices and shaming those who have money to do so are doing the corporation's bidding. It is the consumer's right and duty to say whatever they want about a product in order to hold companies to better standards. You are fortunate enough to live in a country where you have the _*choice*_ to disagree with a corporation.

You are free to do what you want with your money, but you can't tell people to shut up just because they don't agree with you. That's not how it works. It is in *your own* best interest to call foul with a company. They will do whatever you want, because you are their customer.

If anything, you should be thanking those around you because you don't have to pay $3000 for another Titan Z.

If everyone is calling you a sheep, and you have money to pay for something, buy it, that is your prerogative. If you have money, it should not bother you anyway. Buy your video cards, plug them in, enjoy the frames, and move on.

The second people stop yelling, even those claiming to have the funds won't be able to afford the prices. Want to buy a $4000 Quadro for a few extra FPS? Didn't think so.

- And no, just because there are plenty of other options available, that does not change the tune of the discussion. It's your job to tell corporations when to stop when you disagree.

Enjoy your Titan XP's, but everyone has their own right to complain. I promise, its in your best interest.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Little updated info from Anandtech.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd
Quote:


> Update 07/25: NVIDIA has given us a few answers to the question above. We have confirmation that the FP64 and FP16 rates are identical to GP104, which is to say very slow, and primarily there for compatibility/debug purposes. With the exception of INT8 support, this is a bigger GP104 throughout.
> 
> Meanwhile we have a die size for GP102: 471mm2, which is 139mm2 smaller than GP100. Given that both (presumably) have the same number of FP32 cores, the die space savings and implications are significant. This is as best of an example as we're ever going to get on the die space cost of the HPC features limited to GP100: NVLInk, fast FP64/FP16 support, larger register files, etc. By splitting HPC and graphics/inference into two GPUs, NVIDIA can produce GP102 at what should be a significantly lower price (and higher yield), something they couldn't do until the market for compute products based on GP100 was self-sustaining.
> 
> Finally, NVIDIA has clarified the branding a bit. Despite GeForce.com labeling it "the world's ultimate graphics card," NVIDIA this morning has stated that the primary market is FP32 and INT8 compute, not gaming. Though gaming is certainly possible - and I fully expect they'll be happy to sell you $1200 gaming cards - the tables have essentially been flipped from the past Titan cards, where they were treated as gaming first and compute second. This of course opens the door to a proper GeForce branded GP102 card later on, possibly with neutered INT8 support to enforce the market segmentation.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> This time though I am not believe a Volta 2017 launch. There is too much GP100/102 to be release in the next 18 months. Even Maxwell with 2 GM200 variant lasted 21 months.
> 
> Btw the EVGA hybrid, will it really work on Titan XP? Seem like fit for 980 Ti.


I think you might've mixed up GM200 with GM204. Titan X was launched in March 2015 and 980 Ti May 2015. So that puts GM200 at 17 months for the Titan X, and 15 months for the 980 Ti.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Same things going to happen with this Titan XP, Nvidia are too unpredictable to warrant risking $1200 a card for it to be stomped a few months later. I seriously doubt i'll be jumping on it, unless I know for 100% certainty I can get a year out of it before being superseded.


I can completely relate to this. The OG Titan had an incredibly long lifespan, and it wasn't until Titan X got released that it decisively took a backseat (a heavily OC'd Titan gets close to stock 980). Doubt we'll ever get anything like that again if nVidia could help it.


----------



## renejr902

Im thinking about something, im ok buying this too much expensixe titanx, but is it possible nvidia release something stronger like a titan x black hbm2 within the next 8-10 months ???
I WONT BE HAPPY ! I want at least near a full year to be the best nvidia card for gaming available ? What do you think ?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Im thinking about something, im ok buying this too much expensixe titanx, but is it possible nvidia release something stronger like a titan x black hbm2 within the next 8-10 months ???
> I WONT BE HAPPY ! I want at least near a full year to be the best nvidia card for gaming available ? What do you think ?


LOL... a full year? I wouldn't bet $1200 on it. Only buy a Titan if you are okay with the possibility that it won't be top dog for very long.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Im thinking about something, im ok buying this too much expensixe titanx, but is it possible nvidia release something stronger like a titan x black hbm2 within the next 8-10 months ???
> I WONT BE HAPPY ! I want at least near a full year to be the best nvidia card for gaming available ? What do you think ?


Nobody knows, but Titans are never a good buy if you won't be happy not getting a full year out of it.


----------



## kingduqc

It's quite sad that there is no other close option for the consumer at this performance range. There is no AMD card that touch a 1080, yet alone a titan XP... I dont see vega even beating a 1080 with only 4k SP on the chip with the 480's 2.3k SP not matching a 1280 Core 1060..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> People can voice their opinion all they want. It's no longer called whining when a significant portion of the gaming community can no longer purchase a high end card like they used to.
> 
> Titan is nothing special. It's not prosumer, it's not ultra high end, it's not a boutique card, it's not a halo card, nor is it like a Ferrari or a Yacht. It's the same old plastic crap pasted together and for some god damn reason they've fooled you guys into thinking it's worth 4x times as much as it used to cost ($329 GTX 570).
> 
> It's sickening how far people have fallen for this marketing. It's literally just a name.


AMD's new offer right now is a 200$ gpu that is at least half as powerful.... Don't blame the consumer for buying what's best, blame the competition for offering nothing of value these said consumer. Nvidia released the whole lineup before we even hear about the "high end" card they will offer and I'm pretty sure vega won't compete with the titan XP.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Im thinking about something, im ok buying this too much expensixe titanx, but is it possible nvidia release something stronger like a titan x black hbm2 within the next 8-10 months ???
> I WONT BE HAPPY ! I want at least near a full year to be the best nvidia card for gaming available ? What do you think ?


There is no strong answer to this question. You can buy what is available now, but unfortunately there is really no such thing as "future proof", especially for the high end. Future proofing requires the sacrifice of giving up the top end percent of performance to extend the value of the purchase you have. By buying a Titan XP, you are forfeiting that performance outright.

Sadly, your options are:

1. Buy one now and buy another one later at a lower cost, for marginal SLI performance increases
2. Wait for Vega and lower prices market-wide
3. Buy one now, sell it when Volta or the next Pascal card releases.

There is no sense of value, or performance/$ buying a video card with early adopters fees.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Im thinking about something, im ok buying this too much expensixe titanx, but is it possible nvidia release something stronger like a titan x black hbm2 within the next 8-10 months ???
> I WONT BE HAPPY ! I want at least near a full year to be the best nvidia card for gaming available ? What do you think ?
> 
> 
> 
> LOL... a full year? I wouldn't bet $1200 on it. Only buy a Titan if you are okay with the possibility that it won't be top dog for very long.
Click to expand...

I agree, if there is anything to this Volta rumor this Titan will probably be dethroned in 6-9 months.


----------



## magnek

I'm gonna be blunt and say if you're going to worry about not getting enough mileage out of your Titan before it expires, it's probably not for you.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Little updated info from Anandtech.
> 
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd


Oh man ! That is not a gaming card ?!#/@+ what they want us to think about that ?????

471mm2 , its not a full die at all????? Does this means a Pascal or Volta Geforce Titan with (25% more die space)588mm2 with 4480 cores or ( 33% more die space) 628mm2 with 4800 cores is coming in a FEW MONTHS !!!!

AAAhhh Does this means that ???? Thanks for your opinion guys







im confuse right now, is it a good idea to buy that titan x not gaming edition ????


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Little updated info from Anandtech.
> 
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd


Hmm hold on... So they made a completely new chip that goes between the GP100 and the GP104? I thought the GP102 was the same chip as the GP100 in the Tesla P100 but with even more disabled. The older Titan's always used the biggest physical chips right?

That to me is a strong sign that they're going to release another Titan at one point when GP100 yields improve.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'm gonna be blunt and say if you're going to worry about not getting enough mileage out of your Titan before it expires, it's probably not for you.


This card should be able to achieve 60fps 4K gaming and that's all that really matters to me. If it get's dethroned a few months later, I should still be getting 60FPS hopefully so it won't matter much to me.

I do think if NVIDIA releases a $1200 card, and dethrones it within 6 months, then they really don't give a crap about their customer base though.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I know it will never happen but it would be nice if people would actually sit on their hands this time and not by this new titan just to make a point to Nvidia about all of these pricing shenanigans. I mean most of the guys in this thread already have very powerful video cards, is there really a need for you to rush out and spend $1200 on a Titan XP ? Also blaming AMD for this whole mess is really not fair if you think about it. Don't you think the AMD would love to provide a powerful video card that could rival the 1080 or the new titan XP if they could? It's not like they're intentionally falling behind, they just don't have the resources to keep up apparently.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> If anything, you've changed my mind about buying the Titan XP. I now want to buy two!!!


Here's what i read : blah blah , i have a bunch of money, not you peasant , blah blah..


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> This card should be able to achieve 60fps 4K gaming and that's all that really matters to me. If it get's dethroned a few months later, I should still be getting 60FPS hopefully so it won't matter much to me.
> 
> *I do think if NVIDIA releases a $1200 card, and dethrones it within 6 months, then they really don't give a crap about their customer base though.*


They released the 980Ti for $650 2 months after the $1000 Titan X last year, is there really anyone who doesn't think they would do the same this time if they could?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know it will never happen but it would be nice if people would actually sit on their hands this time and not by this new titan just to make a point to Nvidia about all of these pricing shenanigans. I mean most of the guys in this thread already have very powerful video cards, is there really a need for you to rush out and spend $1200 on a Titan XP ? Also blaming AMD for this whole mess is really not fair if you think about it. Don't you think the AMD would love to provide a powerful video card that could rival the 1080 or the new titan XP if they could? It's not like they're intentionally falling behind, they just don't have the resources to keep up apparently.


You have two titans for 1440p. Try taking one of those titans out and then upgrading to 4K.

You'll immediately see why people want this card so badly. My Titan X gets literally stomped in some titles.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> They released the 980Ti for $650 2 months after the $1000 Titan X last year, is there really anyone who doesn't think they would do the same this time if they could?


But the 980Ti didn't dethrone the Titan. It was at best equal, but generally very slightly slower with less VRAM. If they released a 1080Ti in 2 months for $900-1000, I'd be fine with that, if it was basically the same as this card with less VRAM.

It's not the same as releasing a 1080Ti/TItan 4 in two months with a full die and 25% faster. That's gonna piss off a lot of people.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> You have two titans for 1440p. Try taking one of those titans out and then upgrading to 4K.
> 
> You'll immediately see why people want this card so badly. My Titan X gets literally stomped in some titles.


Try that with 290X. Been trying to get 4K 60 fps but also doing so with ~ 600 not 1200.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know it will never happen but it would be nice if people would actually sit on their hands this time and not by this new titan just to make a point to Nvidia about all of these pricing shenanigans. I mean most of the guys in this thread already have very powerful video cards, is there really a need for you to rush out and spend $1200 on a Titan XP ? Also blaming AMD for this whole mess is really not fair if you think about it. Don't you think the AMD would love to provide a powerful video card that could rival the 1080 or the new titan XP if they could? It's not like they're intentionally falling behind, they just don't have the resources to keep up apparently.


While I appreciate your point you do have to blame AMD, you still get the blame even if it is unintentional. There are obviously mitigating circumstances, and I do not hate them for it, but their lack of competition is allowing Nvidia to price through the roof for performance unobtainable anywhere else.

I suppose we could blame Nvidia for building such fast cards too... but we all want them to do that.

You can blame human nature too... but expecting that to change at this point is very naive.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know it will never happen but it would be nice if people would actually sit on their hands this time and not by this new titan just to make a point to Nvidia about all of these pricing shenanigans. I mean most of the guys in this thread already have very powerful video cards, is there really a need for you to rush out and spend $1200 on a Titan XP ? Also blaming AMD for this whole mess is really not fair if you think about it. Don't you think the AMD would love to provide a powerful video card that could rival the 1080 or the new titan XP if they could? It's not like they're intentionally falling behind, they just don't have the resources to keep up apparently.


Oh, that's rich, coming from a guy with two Titans


----------



## DNMock

As an owner of a pair of Maxwell Titan X cards, is there literally any reason to bite the bullet and get a pair of these?

Like is there a 4k 120hz, 4k curved 21:9 100hz, or 8k 60hz monitor that is available or will be available in the next 6 months or so to warrant buying this?

As it stands the only "upgrade" this would really offer as far as I'm aware is the ability to unnecessarily add some AA @ 4k and/or turn on some terrible Trashworks settings to ultra and still be able to maintain 60 fps.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> Oh, that's rich, coming from a guy with two Titans


He is probably the only one in this forum that has really used the Titans properly. He has had them for over 3 years and still serve him well. He has gotten the moneys work by now.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> As an owner of a pair of Maxwell Titan X cards, is there literally any reason to bite the bullet and get a pair of these?
> 
> Like is there a 4k 120hz, 4k curved 21:9 100hz, or 8k 60hz monitor that is available or will be available in the next 6 months or so to warrant buying this?
> 
> As it stands the only "upgrade" this would really offer as far as I'm aware is the ability to unnecessarily add some AA @ 4k and/or turn on some terrible Trashworks settings to ultra and still be able to maintain 60 fps.


Could help if SLI does not work. If you can hold a better upgrade will be the next Titans for you or if you want to lower power the 1180s.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> As an owner of a pair of Maxwell Titan X cards, is there literally any reason to bite the bullet and get a pair of these?
> 
> Like is there a 4k 120hz, 4k curved 21:9 100hz, or 8k 60hz monitor that is available or will be available in the next 6 months or so to warrant buying this?
> 
> As it stands the only "upgrade" this would really offer as far as I'm aware is the ability to unnecessarily add some AA @ 4k and/or turn on some terrible Trashworks settings to ultra and still be able to maintain 60 fps.


Not really. I'd bet even 1 card is capable of running 2-4x MSAA at 4K in most titles, that'll get rid of virtually all jaggies but honestly AA isn't all that important at 4K to begin with.

If anything if I had 2x Titan X Maxwell, I'd consider going to 1x Titan X Pascal. Less heat, less power, less noise, better reliability, and way better FPS in those games that don't properly support SLI.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> As an owner of a pair of Maxwell Titan X cards, is there literally any reason to bite the bullet and get a pair of these?
> 
> Like is there a 4k 120hz, 4k curved 21:9 100hz, or 8k 60hz monitor that is available or will be available in the next 6 months or so to warrant buying this?
> 
> As it stands the only "upgrade" this would really offer as far as I'm aware is the ability to unnecessarily add some AA @ 4k and/or turn on some terrible Trashworks settings to ultra and still be able to maintain 60 fps.


Helps in cases where SLI scales poorly or outright fails. [email protected] would also require DP 1.4 I believe since DP currently just doesn't have enough bandwidth for that.

Also trashworks


----------



## Seyumi

2x SLI of these new Titan X's are needed to maintain 4k 60fps minimum with max settings. If you watch 2x SLI 1080 4k game bechmark vids, you'll notice most games do a great job at maintaining 60fps+ but some do drop below 60FPS even with no AA on. Until 120hz 4k monitors or the next gen consoles (games) come out, 2x of these new Titan's should actually get some good mileage out of them.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> They released the 980Ti for $650 2 months after the $1000 Titan X last year, is there really anyone who doesn't think they would do the same this time if they could?


If and only if Vega is releasing in October. If not, no Ti release for this year.


----------



## mouacyk

Regarding Anandtech update...

So what is this card useful for in the professional world with its neutered FP64 capabilites? Is it targeted at deep learning neural networks processing images?


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> They released the 980Ti for $650 2 months after the $1000 Titan X last year, is there really anyone who doesn't think they would do the same this time if they could?
> 
> 
> 
> If and only if Vega is releasing in October. If not, no Ti release for this year.
Click to expand...

Why you think that?


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> Regarding Anandtech update...
> 
> So what is this card useful for in the professional world with its neutered FP64 capabilites? Is it targeted at deep learning neural networks processing images?


AI work with INT-8


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> Why you think that?


I don't think Nvidia would have released 980ti in last June if there was no Fury X release around same timeframe, simple as that.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> Why you think that?
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think Nvidia would have released 980ti in last June if there was no Fury X release around same timeframe, simple as that.
Click to expand...

I disagree but in any case, isn't Vega slated for Q4 2016?



EDIT: Guess not. Probably Q1 2017 for HBM2.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> 2x SLI of these new Titan X's are needed to maintain 4k 60fps minimum with max settings. If you watch 2x SLI 1080 4k game bechmark vids, you'll notice most games do a great job at maintaining 60fps+ but some do drop below 60FPS even with no AA on. Until 120hz 4k monitors or the next gen consoles (games) come out, 2x of these new Titan's should actually get some good mileage out of them.


SLI scaling can be extremely poor for min FPS. I expect 2x 1080 to easily beat it for avg/max, but I'm guessing minimums will be similar.

I think 1 Titan will be fine unless you absolutely need 4x MSAA or something.


----------



## x3sphere

Seeing as there was a bigger gap between the x70 and x80 part with Pascal, there may be a bigger gap between the Titan and Ti.

But IMO it will heavily depend on Vega... I think Nvidia tends of know how the AMD parts will perform far in advance, and with no competition this time, that's why the 1070 isn't as close to the x80 as it usually is.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> Regarding Anandtech update...
> 
> So what is this card useful for in the professional world with its neutered FP64 capabilites? Is it targeted at deep learning neural networks processing images?


Exactly, deep learning doesn't use FP64, they often use the very low precision INT8 which this card can apparently churn through at an unbelievable rate (44 TOPS).

Edit: Unlike GP104, which isn't that good at INT8, apparently.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> I disagree but in any case, isn't Vega slated for Q4 2016?


Q1 2017 is more likely.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

I dont know why most people have not mention the main reason to own a Titan : *e-peen*


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Not really. I'd bet even 1 card is capable of running 2-4x MSAA at 4K in most titles, that'll get rid of virtually all jaggies but honestly AA isn't all that important at 4K to begin with.
> 
> If anything if I had 2x Titan X Maxwell, I'd consider going to 1x Titan X Pascal. Less heat, less power, less noise, better reliability, and way better FPS in those games that don't properly support SLI.


Yeah that's what I was thinking, since mine are under water in a custom loop the heat and noise are non-issues and as for power, that's really a non-issue as well.

The steady 60 fps isn't even an issue since I have a g-sync monitor, the dips aren't very noticeable....

/sigh guess I just have so save my money or waste it on some other stupid garbage.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> Yeah that's what I was thinking, since mine are under water in a custom loop the heat and noise are non-issues and as for power, that's really a non-issue as well.
> 
> The steady 60 fps isn't even an issue since I have a g-sync monitor, the dips aren't very noticeable....
> 
> /sigh guess I just have so save my money or waste it on some other stupid garbage.


I did some more digging.

A single 1080 managed 55fps avg and 40FPS min at 4K across 15 demanding titles according to PCGamer. So the majority of the time, a single Titan X Pascal should be above 60, with min dips still in the 50+ ranges. This is at stock, so considering that I think two would be overkill even for 4K. http://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/vfSzfuFSQ2hCkzi3VcmwYh-650-80.jpg


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Not really. I'd bet even 1 card is capable of running 2-4x MSAA at 4K in most titles, that'll get rid of virtually all jaggies but honestly AA isn't all that important at 4K to begin with.
> 
> If anything if I had 2x Titan X Maxwell, I'd consider going to 1x Titan X Pascal. Less heat, less power, less noise, better reliability, and way better FPS in those games that don't properly support SLI.


Say what. So the fps it hits in maybe 2 or 3 instances during gaming is more important then the frames it averages or is at 97% of the time? Even if those minimal instances bother you then its called "Gsync." SLI is fine and works better then ever. Those who keep bashing it are stuck back in 2010. Also who would upgrade from 980ti or Titan X Sli for a single TitanXP? No one with a brain. It's almost identical performance. That's not a upgrade. The only 2 games that are AAA that don't support SLI are Doom and Fallout and one of my 980Ti's max them out anyways. A second card isn't even needed.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Plus this is an open forum. People can whine about or praise something all they like.


yeah but usually a few posts is enough

not a few hundred long continuous tantrum like i7monkey


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Say what. So the fps it hits in maybe 2 or 3 instances during gaming is more important then the frames it averages or is at 97% of the time? Even if those minimal instances bother you then its called "Gsync." SLI is fine and works better then ever. Those who keep bashing it are stuck back in 2010.


He shouldn't really need two for 4K, that's my point. If he wants the latest and greatest, selling his 2 maxwell titans and getting 1 pascal titan would likely still achieve 60fps at 4K in titles regardless of how well they scale with SLI - while his current setup won't achieve 60fps in titles that don't scale with SLI.

If the card is indeed 60% faster, it will be trading blows with 2x maxwell Titan X based on how well the game is optimized for SLI. Yet, the single pascal setup will put off significantly less heat, noise, and power draw and gives the option to add a 2nd pascal Titan X down the road if needed.

Plus, I'll take my 4K OLED over GSYNC any day of the week.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Little updated info from Anandtech.
> 
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd


soo this is non gaming Titan ? lol

> 1080
> GP100 Tesla
> non-gaming Titan XP
> gaming small Titan
> gaming big Titan
> 1080Ti
> Volta


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> soo this is non gaming Titan ? lol
> 
> > 1080
> > GP100 Tesla
> > non-gaming Titan XP
> > gaming small Titan
> > gaming big Titan
> > 1080Ti
> > Volta


The first Titan wasn't advertised as a gaming GPU either, only the second Titan was after the demand for the first far exceeded what NVIDIA was expecting for a $1000 GPU. Now that they increased the price to $1200, it seems they don't want to call it a "gaming GPU" until they know there's demand for a $1200 gaming card. They don't think there will be, which is probably why they are only selling directly and not to gaming brand vendors yet. If there is demand, you can bet they will ship these exact cards out to gaming vendors.

There's literally no difference between a "gaming" titan and "non-gaming" titan other than marketing and labels.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The first Titan wasn't advertised as a gaming GPU either, only the second Titan was after the demand for the first far exceeded what NVIDIA was expecting for a $1000 GPU. Now that they increased the price to $1200, it seems they don't want to call it a "gaming GPU" until they know there's demand for a $1200 gaming card. They don't think there will be, which is why they are only selling directly and not to gaming brand vendors.
> 
> There's literally no difference between a "gaming" titan and "non-gaming" titan other than marketing and labels.


I will be looking at the overclocking results before making a decision, the lack of FP64 is a bit disappointing but half expected.


----------



## Kpjoslee

http://www.bitsandchips.it/9-hardware/7284-nvidia-quadro-p600o-full-gp102-3840cc-e-24gb-di-gddr5x

Quadro P6000

3840 Cuda cores
24GB GDDR5X

So that is where full GP102 core went.


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> He shouldn't really need two for 4K, that's my point. If he wants the latest and greatest, selling his 2 maxwell titans and getting 1 pascal titan would likely still achieve 60fps at 4K in titles regardless of how well they scale with SLI - while his current setup won't achieve 60fps in titles that don't scale with SLI.
> 
> If the card is indeed 60% faster, it will be trading blows with 2x maxwell Titan X based on how well the game is optimized for SLI. Yet, the single pascal setup will put off significantly less heat, noise, and power draw and gives the option to add a 2nd pascal Titan X down the road if needed.
> 
> Plus, I'll take my 4K OLED over GSYNC any day of the week.


OLED monitor? What sorcery is this? I thought the only one that existed was that Dell monitor that only connected via thunderbolt


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> OLED monitor? What sorcery is this? I thought the only one that existed was that Dell monitor that only connected via thunderbolt


You can use 4k TVs as monitors, most have a PC mode which basically turns them into a monitor. There's about 4 people on these forums running LG OLED TVs as their primary display, but they cost about 4-6 grand depending on which model you get.


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> You can use 4k TVs as monitors.


oh







I thought there was a legit 4k OLED monitor I missed.

I know it's a bit off topic but how is the response time on them?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> oh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought there was a legit 4k OLED monitor I missed.
> 
> I know it's a bit off topic but how is the response time on them?


The newest 2016 E6 lineup is 32ms for input lag, which is on par with high quality IPS monitors that many people game on. Last years models were about 55ms, so it's likely only going to improve more. The pixel refresh time is .1ms though, far faster than IPS.

I have zero problems with input lag on mine, it feels exactly the same as the 34UM95 ultrawide it replaced.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I dont know why most people have not mention the main reason to own a Titan : *e-peen*


I think that's kind of an implicit assumption.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> yeah but usually a few posts is enough
> 
> not a few hundred long continuous tantrum like i7monkey


i7monkey is special.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The first Titan wasn't advertised as a gaming GPU either, only the second Titan was after the demand for the first far exceeded what NVIDIA was expecting for a $1000 GPU. Now that they increased the price to $1200, it seems they don't want to call it a "gaming GPU" until they know there's demand for a $1200 gaming card. They don't think there will be, which is probably why they are only selling directly and not to gaming brand vendors yet. If there is demand, you can bet they will ship these exact cards out to gaming vendors.
> 
> There's literally no difference between a "gaming" titan and "non-gaming" titan other than marketing and labels.


Titan has support for INT8 compute, which based on my very cursory glance is a low-precision code used in deep learning. So just like the OG Titan was great for those who wanted FP64 on the cheap, this will probably be a dream to those who want INT8 on the cheap, assuming anything with comparable INT8 crunching power costs a few fold more of course.
Quote:


> Finally, NVIDIA has clarified the branding a bit. Despite GeForce.com labeling it "the world's ultimate graphics card," NVIDIA this morning has stated that the primary market is FP32 and INT8 compute, not gaming. Though gaming is certainly possible - and I fully expect they'll be happy to sell you $1200 gaming cards - the tables have essentially been flipped from the past Titan cards, where they were treated as gaming first and compute second. This of course opens the door to a proper GeForce branded GP102 card later on, possibly with neutered INT8 support to enforce the market segmentation.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> This card should be able to achieve 60fps 4K gaming and that's all that really matters to me. If it get's dethroned a few months later, I should still be getting 60FPS hopefully so it won't matter much to me.
> 
> I do think if NVIDIA releases a $1200 card, and dethrones it within 6 months, then they really don't give a crap about their customer base though.


If you honestly need all the gpu power that the Titan XP provides, then I say go for one since it won't matter if a better Titan comes along soon after anyway. But if one is buying solely for the epeen... well the upgrade game never ends.

Regarding Nvidia giving a crap, they haven't for a long time. They aren't "giving" us anything that they can't profit from. That's why i find it so ironic when people argue for Nvidia regarding their overpricing. They are essentially arguing against their own wallet.


----------



## Pyrotagonist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> yeah but usually a few posts is enough
> 
> not a few hundred long continuous tantrum like i7monkey


Pot, kettle, etc.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Considering 3840 24GB G5X Quadro is out there I just can never buy a cut down half memory Titan X for $1200.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> If you honestly need all the gpu power that the Titan XP provides, then I say go for one since it won't matter if a better Titan comes along soon after anyway. But if one is buying solely for the epeen... well the upgrade game never ends.
> 
> Regarding Nvidia giving a crap, they haven't for a long time. They aren't "giving" us anything that they can't profit from. That's why i find it so ironic when people argue for Nvidia regarding their overpricing. They are essentially arguing against their own wallet.


If you're doing it for the epeen then all you care about is having the latest and greatest without regard to anything else. so it still doesn't matter. And yeah the upgrade game never ends


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Regarding Nvidia giving a crap, they haven't for a long time. They aren't "giving" us anything that they can't profit from. That's why i find it so ironic when people argue for Nvidia regarding their overpricing. They are essentially arguing against their own wallet.


I am never arguing _for_ Nvidia regarding their overpricing. I am arguing that this is like saying the sky should be a nice yellowish orange.

This is how our socity works, this is what we teach in school. This is what "running a business properly" means. This is free market capitalism with a government enforced patent system designed for the late 1700s. Nothing unique to Nvidia is going on here. Criticism is healthy, but we need to understand that the problem is never going to be fixed by fixing the people ("consumers"). Fixing the people doesn't work, it never has.

Once you accept the fact that fixing the people is not an option you can start to look for solutions that have a chance of working.


----------



## magnek

Fixing the people _could_ be an option if we fixed the education system. But I'm not even going to attempt to go there.









Well that and heavy government intervention, but I think you can see where I'm going with this so I'll just stop.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Fixing the people _could_ be an option if we fixed the education system. But I'm not even going to attempt to go there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well that and heavy government intervention, but I think you can see where I'm going with this so I'll just stop.


Communist tried that.. it worked out so well for them. You can't change human instinct nor can you dictate reason. The consumer will act in their own selfish self interest every time.

I wonder if we'd be in a better place today had AMD not bought ATI


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Considering 3840 24GB G5X Quadro is out there I just can never buy a cut down half memory Titan X for $1200.


Quadro always had double memory of geforce counterparts though. GK110 Quadro had full 2880 cores with 12GB of memory.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I am never arguing _for_ Nvidia regarding their overpricing. I am arguing that this is like saying the sky should be a nice yellowish orange.
> 
> This is how our socity works, this is what we teach in school. This is what "running a business properly" means. This is free market capitalism with a government enforced patent system designed for the late 1700s. Nothing unique to Nvidia is going on here. Criticism is healthy, but we need to understand that the problem is never going to be fixed by fixing the people ("consumers"). Fixing the people doesn't work, it never has.
> 
> Once you accept the fact that fixing the people is not an option you can start to look for solutions that have a chance of working.


Nvidia gets a A+ for running a business, I will give them that. But regarding them "caring" for their customer base (which was the context of my earlier reply), they do not. Neither does AMD for that matter before some claims that is what I am saying. So since they don't really care about me, why should I care about them?


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> Quadro always had double memory of geforce counterparts though. GK110 Quadro had full 2880 cores with 12GB of memory.


At least 3840 core part. I cant sleep at night knowing my Titan is a cut down core.


----------



## dmasteR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Considering 3840 24GB G5X Quadro is out there I just can never buy a cut down half memory Titan X for $1200.


Haven't you said multiple times that you weren't interested in paying more than $650~ anyways for a GPU?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Fixing the people _could_ be an option if we fixed the education system. But I'm not even going to attempt to go there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well that and heavy government intervention, but I think you can see where I'm going with this so I'll just stop.


Are you saying that people buy $1200 cards because they are uneducated? I hope I am reading that wrong. If anything it's the other way around, people buy $1200 cards BECAUSE they are educated and have money.

There's no "fixing" people because what's a lot of money to someone is nothing to another person. This is why there are multiple tiers of every item, if everyone could afford the best, then there'd be better out there.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> At least 3840 core part. I cant sleep at night knowing my Titan is a cut down core.


Original Titan was cut down core, I don't think people who purchased Titan cared about that. I would be more disappointed about it not having HBM2.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Are you saying that people buy $1200 cards because they are uneducated? I hope I am reading that wrong. If anything it's the other way around, people buy $1200 cards because $1200 BECAUSE they are educated and have money.
> 
> There's no "fixing" people because what's a lot of money to someone is nothing to another person. This is why there are multiple tiers of every item, if everyone could afford the best, then there'd be better out there.


It was a joke that we should just become a communist society.

And the "education" I referred to would simply be state propaganda.







Well maybe not propaganda so much as indoctrination from a young age.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> Communist tried that.. it worked out so well for them. You can't change human instinct nor can you dictate reason. The consumer will act in their own selfish self interest every time.
> 
> I wonder if we'd be in a better place today had AMD not bought ATI


Well forced "equality" is one way to ensure prices don't increase to insane levels. But yeah that was basically the joke.









Though I was more thinking about the instant gratification part of human nature. Surprisingly grad school is a pretty good cure for that.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Are you saying that people buy $1200 cards because they are uneducated? I hope I am reading that wrong. If anything it's the other way around, people buy $1200 cards because $1200 isn't a lot of money to them BECAUSE they are educated.
> 
> There's no "fixing" people because what's a lot of money to someone is nothing to another person. This is why there are multiple tiers of every item, if everyone could afford the best, then there'd be better out there.


I don't think he meant it that way.

Also, in today's society you don't have to be educated to have lots of money... lol

Our screwed up society pays some of the stupidest and most immoral people tons of money for simply being on TV.


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> At least 3840 core part. I cant sleep at night knowing my Titan is a cut down core.


My thoughts as well. The original Titan has the same thing if I recall correctly? When the 780 Ti came with the same chip but fully enabled I immediately jumped on that.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> At least 3840 core part. I cant sleep at night knowing my Titan is a cut down core.


Agreed, and that bothers me too. If it had been a GP100, I would have accepted 3584.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Nvidia gets a A+ for running a business, I will give them that. But regarding them "caring" for their customer base (which was the context of my earlier reply), they do not. Neither does AMD for that matter before some claims that is what I am saying. So since they don't really care about me, why should I care about them?


You shouldn't.. and I'm not sure how people don't understand this yet.

Consider me baffled.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmasteR*
> 
> Haven't you said multiple times that you weren't interested in paying more than $650~ anyways for a GPU?


Does not matter.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> At least 3840 core part. I cant sleep at night knowing my Titan is a cut down core.


I'd prefer waiting for a Maxwell-like large die.. one without any double precision that optimizes space for single precision logic instead.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> You shouldn't.. and I'm not sure how people don't understand this yet.
> 
> Call me baffled.


I really hope Nvidia keeps raising prices until Titan is a $2k minimum purchase.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> I'd prefer waiting for a Maxwell-like large die.. one without any double precision that optimizes space for single precision logic instead.


Yeah. If they remove DP cores you can fit more then 5000 CUDA cores.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I really hope Nvidia keeps raising prices until Titan is a $2k minimum purchase.


We will have another Titan Z.

Don't people remember they chopped the price in half out of the goodness of their hearts?

I mean, afterall, a corporation is a person.


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The newest 2016 E6 lineup is 32ms for input lag, which is on par with high quality IPS monitors that many people game on. Last years models were about 55ms, so it's likely only going to improve more. The pixel refresh time is .1ms though, far faster than IPS.
> 
> I have zero problems with input lag on mine, it feels exactly the same as the 34UM95 ultrawide it replaced.


Sweet, just gotta find one with DP 1.4 support now. Thanks


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> But the 980Ti didn't dethrone the Titan. It was at best equal, but generally very slightly slower with less VRAM. If they released a 1080Ti in 2 months for $900-1000, I'd be fine with that, if it was basically the same as this card with less VRAM.
> 
> It's not the same as releasing a 1080Ti/TItan 4 in two months with a full die and 25% faster. That's gonna piss off a lot of people.


Maybe in some edge cases you could say the titan X was just plain superior, Vram and 4k i guess? But for the most part the 980Ti made it irrelevant. It could usually clock higher under water, and had custom cards with far better power delivery/coolers on air, all for $350 less..

But i get what you're saying.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> If and only if Vega is releasing in October. If not, no Ti release for this year.


If Nvidia want to move more product then they'll release a cheaper card regardless of whether or not AMD release a competitor.

They don't release Titans at those prices because they're worth it, or cost that much to make, they release them because there's a group of super-enthusiasts that are willing to pay those prices.

So why not make massive margins on those consumers while they wind up for higher volume Ti cards?


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> If Nvidia want to move more product then they'll release a cheaper card regardless of whether or not AMD release a competitor.
> 
> They don't release Titans at those prices because they're worth it, or cost that much to make, they release them because there's a group of super-enthusiasts that are willing to pay those prices.
> 
> So why not make massive margins on those consumers while they wind up for higher volume Ti cards?


They did release a cheaper card to increase volume, the 1060 GTX.

They are currently selling a 300mm^2 die like hotcakes for 600-700 a pop. Its cheaper to produce than a larger die (like the Titan) and its currently the king of the hill. So why on earth would they lower the price on that moneymaker by selling a larger die (that costs more to produce) for 700-800$? Its wishful thinking on your part.

If you want a 1080 TI you'd better pray Vega beats the 1080 GTX. Then you'll see how quickly nVidia launches a 1080 TI to stay king of the hill. But without AMD we'll see the same scenario we saw with the 680 GTX.


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> I'd prefer waiting for a Maxwell-like large die.. one without any double precision that optimizes space for single precision logic instead.


That may well be what GP102 is.
Quote:


> Update 07/25: NVIDIA has given us a few answers to the question above. We have confirmation that the FP64 and FP16 rates are identical to GP104, which is to say very slow, and primarily there for compatibility/debug purposes. With the exception of INT8 support, this is a bigger GP104 throughout.
> 
> *Meanwhile we have a die size for GP102: 471mm2, which is 139mm2 smaller than GP100.* Given that both (presumably) have the same number of FP32 cores, the die space savings and implications are significant. This is as best of an example as we're ever going to get on the die space cost of the HPC features limited to GP100: NVLInk, fast FP64/FP16 support, larger register files, etc. By splitting HPC and graphics/inference into two GPUs, NVIDIA can produce GP102 at what should be a significantly lower price (and higher yield), something they couldn't do until the market for compute products based on GP100 was self-sustaining.
> 
> Finally, NVIDIA has clarified the branding a bit. Despite GeForce.com labeling it "the world's ultimate graphics card," NVIDIA this morning has stated that the primary market is FP32 and INT8 compute, not gaming. Though gaming is certainly possible - and I fully expect they'll be happy to sell you $1200 gaming cards - the tables have essentially been flipped from the past Titan cards, where they were treated as gaming first and compute second. This of course opens the door to a proper GeForce branded GP102 card later on, possibly with neutered INT8 support to enforce the market segmentation.


http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Yeah. If they remove DP cores you can fit more then 5000 CUDA cores.


Not at GP102's die-size.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> That may well be what GP102 is.
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd


Nice! Just need Vega to hit so this bad boy descends in price. :^)


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> But the 980Ti didn't dethrone the Titan. It was at best equal, but generally very slightly slower with less VRAM. If they released a 1080Ti in 2 months for $900-1000, I'd be fine with that, if it was basically the same as this card with less VRAM.
> 
> It's not the same as releasing a 1080Ti/TItan 4 in two months with a full die and 25% faster. That's gonna piss off a lot of people.
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe in some edge cases you could say the titan X was just plain superior, Vram and 4k i guess? But for the most part the 980Ti made it irrelevant. It could usually clock higher under water, and had custom cards with far better power delivery/coolers on air, all for $350 less..
> 
> But i get what you're saying.
Click to expand...

I purchased SLI Titan's in April 2013, and I will admit I was annoyed when the 780Ti came out with both a full die and cheaper. At the time the extra memory didn't help much. The Titan Black alone wouldn't have annoyed me (and that would have been a pointless release at the time).

At this point I doubt Nvidia will come out with a 1080Ti with full GP102 12GB of GDDR5X (and there aren't any 512MB GDDR5X chips). There will be Volta too soon for that.









But if they did it would annoy me again. It is very odd how releasing a full die GP102 would annoy me (maybe ~7% faster) but a Volta that was 45% faster wouldn't, geeks are weird.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> But if they did it would annoy me again. It is very odd how releasing a full die GP102 would annoy me (maybe ~7% faster) but a Volta that was 45% faster wouldn't, geeks are weird.


That's understandable. In case 1, they choose to cut down a $1200 card to release a better card shortly after, when they can make a full die titan right now. In case 2, with the volta, it simply is not ready.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> They did release a cheaper card to increase volume, the 1060 GTX.


Yeah, but the 1060 doesn't have anywhere near the margins the "enthusiast" market does. I meant higher volume compared to the Titans.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> They are currently selling a 300mm^2 die like hotcakes for 600-700 a pop. Its cheaper to produce than a larger die (like the Titan) and its currently the king of the hill. So why on earth would they lower the price on that moneymaker by selling a larger die (that costs more to produce) for 700-800$? Its wishful thinking on your part.
> 
> If you want a 1080 TI you'd better pray Vega beats the 1080 GTX. Then you'll see how quickly nVidia launches a 1080 TI to stay king of the hill. But without AMD we'll see the same scenario we saw with the 680 GTX.


I never said they'd be selling the 1080Ti for $700.. That ship has sailed, it's not far fetched to think they'll release a GP102 1080Ti for around $850 though. They left a $5-600 gap between the 1080 and Titan XP, you think that was by accident?

Also no, not wishful thinking.. I wouldn't buy any of Nvidia's rip-off edition cards, even the 1080 is pushing the limits of what I'd pay, and that would only be for a true top-tier GPU like the 980Ti.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Yeah, but the 1060 doesn't have anywhere near the margins the "enthusiast" market does. I meant higher volume compared to the Titans.
> I never said they'd be selling the 1080Ti for $700.. That ship has sailed, it's not far fetched to think they'll release a cut-down GP102 for around $850 though.
> 
> Also no, not wishful thinking.. I wouldn't buy any of Nvidia's rip-off edition cards, even the 1080 is pushing the limits of what I'd pay, and that would only be for a true top-tier GPU like the 980Ti.


If the current Titan is a cut version of a Quadro workstation card then I doubt we'll see a cut of the Titan any time soon without a nudge from AMD. If you make a high volume part from a very high margins chip like GP102, you'll need to cannibalize fully working GP102s to fill that need. Why do that if you can sell Quadros for a pretty penny and recycle the failed chips as pricey Titans?

If AMD went bankrupt tomorrow we may only see xx80s at the high end and a titan as the ultimate with the current price scheme.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> That may well be what GP102 is.
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd
> Not at GP102's die-size.


Well at GP102 stand between 100 and 104 so it's not a true high end card. Even at 102 size they can get close to 5K Cuda cores.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I dont know why most people have not mention the main reason to own a Titan : *e-peen*


What's e-peen? I don't care what anyone thinks and I never try and show off new and expensive hardware. That's just dumb... ?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> What is a VIVE?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> If you truly believe this then your MBA has failed you.


Really.....I'm rich...self made....but thanks for playin lol


----------



## Benny89

I don't see any reason for Nvidia to do different strategy than with 900 series. TITAN X is for those richest impatient enthusiats who will buy it for its riddiculous price. While Nvidia knows that there are Enthusiast out there (like me) who are willing to spend money but not so much but expect power. This is where Ti comes out. Apart from extreme circumstances (graphic, rendering I guess and 4K) Ti performes the same as TITAN in games, but it has lower price and no e-peen factor "Biggest, CAPSLOCK, strongest, Black edition" etc.

I tworked wonder for them with 700 series, it worked wonder with 900 series, I don't see reason for 1000 series to be different.

TITAN X owners will be annoyed? Gimme a break Like Nivida cares if each year those "annoyed" guys spends more and more on TITAN despite being annoyed by 100% sure launch of Ti card after that.

And after we will see Ti with full dice and lower price, guess what next? TITAN X BLACK of course







. Same story guys.

Nvidia knows what its doing to get money, sadly. Belive me.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> If the current Titan is a cut version of a Quadro workstation card then I doubt we'll see a cut of the Titan any time soon without a nudge from AMD. If you make a high volume part from a very high margins chip like GP102, you'll need to cannibalize fully working GP102s to fill that need. Why do that if you can sell Quadros for a pretty penny and recycle the failed chips as pricey Titans?
> 
> If AMD went bankrupt tomorrow we may only see xx80s at the high end and a titan as the ultimate with the current price scheme.


Where's the info that makes you think Titan XP is a cut Quadro? Even if it is, Nvidia could just release even further cut GP102's as 1080Ti's. The price hiking is at an all time high, so why not squeeze every drop out of consumers they can..

I've had this conversation more than once.









Titan thread - "Titan will be king for a couple years at least"

Titan X thread - "They'll never release a 980Ti so close to the Titan X".

1080 thread - " Pascal Titan is 2017 at the earliest".

Nvidia is good at making money, and their consumers are more than willing to hand it over. We'll see soon enough i guess. Most of the people who buy Titans aren't the types to weep when a new card drops, they just buy whatever is the best and move on. But some of them think they're buying an "investment', or get upset every time someone calls them a rip-off, they have a need to tell the world how successful they are, and will never accept Nvidia may just cast them aside for more profits. Those are the ones who loose sleep.









As i said, lucky for the rest of us that most Titan owners are like "yeah, they're a rip-off, but i can afford it and i want the best". Imagine we had a bunch of whiners who spend their time calling others whiners for not admitting Titan's are investments and can be used for "professional work", and daring to voice their own opinion on the price of them.

The last parts aren't directed at you, just an upset Titan owner who enjoys PM's.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> I never said they'd be selling the 1080Ti for $700.. That ship has sailed, it's not far fetched to think they'll release a GP102 1080Ti for around $850 though. They left a $5-600 gap between the 1080 and Titan XP, you think that was by accident?
> 
> Also no, not wishful thinking.. I wouldn't buy any of Nvidia's rip-off edition cards, even the 1080 is pushing the limits of what I'd pay, and that would only be for a true top-tier GPU like the 980Ti.


No it's not by accident, but simply to avoid cannibalizing 1080 sales. By pricing Titan X at basically 2x 1080, they've essentially enforced complete separation of the two target markets.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Really.....I'm rich...self made....but thanks for playin lol


What does you being rich have anything to do with what I said? Here let me refresh your memory:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Well lets face it, a high end GPU is a luxury item. Its a luxury item in a market dominated by one player, what did you think was gonna happen? Nvidia could charge two grand for these and I am positive they would all sell out....three thousand not so much, but I think two thousand is the threshold that they could get away with. So you have to decide, is Nvidia Evil and milking us? *Or do they love us and willing to sacrifice a bit of raw profit to try and keep the luxury good attainable to the common man?*
> 
> 
> 
> If you truly believe this then your MBA has failed you.
Click to expand...

Then again your post was a complete non-sequitur so I'll just assume you quoted the wrong people for now.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> No it's not by accident, but simply to avoid cannibalizing 1080 sales. By pricing Titan X at basically 2x 1080, they've essentially enforced complete separation of the two target markets.
> What does you being rich have anything to do with what I said?


Yup, could definitely be as simple as that.









I'm just speculating. If there is a 1080Ti at least it will be a _bit_ more gentle on the wallet..


----------



## magnek

If they really wanted to maximize profits, NOT releasing a 1080 Ti ever would be the smart thing to do. This way if 980 Ti and Titan X owners feel the 1080 isn't enough of an upgrade, then they can step right up to the $1200 card.


----------



## iLeakStuff

First Titan with GP102, then Quadro GP102.

Is it too much to ask that you just release the god damn Geforce GP102 at the same time you ****ers?!


----------



## buttface420

it was cooler the first time we heard about it like 2 years ago bros.

we all know that next year the 1170 will outperform it for 1/4 of the price.

and i will still end up upgrading every new cycle like the mindless sheep i am


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> What does you being rich have anything to do with what I said? Here let me refresh your memory:
> Then again your post was a complete non-sequitur so I'll just assume you quoted the wrong people for now.


His comment shows me exactly what I think some people who buy Titans believe. Basically that Nvidia is being very generous by selling a gpu as powerful as the Titan XP for $1200, when they are willing to pay so much more. That freaking blows my mind.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> First Titan with GP102, then Quadro GP102.
> 
> Is it too much to ask that you just release the god damn Geforce GP102 at the same time you ****ers?!


How long before the smaller Quadros ? Funny, you can buy 4 or 5 Titan XP with the price of one Quadro P6000, wanna be snob ? get a P6000


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Where's the info that makes you think Titan XP is a cut Quadro? Even if it is, Nvidia could just release even further cut GP102's as 1080Ti's. The price hiking is at an all time high, so why not squeeze every drop out of consumers they can..


It is likely to be a cut Quadro because it is easy to bin failed Quadros, reclaim them at product engineering, and fuse them as Titans with a fuse recipe.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> What does you being rich have anything to do with what I said?


I've had the feeling for some time threads like these just boil down to how rich people claim to be.


----------



## Lee Patekar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Where's the info that makes you think Titan XP is a cut Quadro?


Just my unmitigated speculation spurred from this article: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd

Especially this part "NVIDIA this morning has stated that the primary market is FP32 and INT8 compute, not gaming. Though gaming is certainly possible - and I fully expect they'll be happy to sell you $1200 gaming cards - the tables have essentially been flipped from the past Titan cards, where they were treated as gaming first and compute second. This of course opens the door to a proper GeForce branded GP102 card later on, possibly with neutered INT8 support to enforce the market segmentation."
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> I've had this conversation more than once.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Titan thread - "Titan will be king for a couple years at least"
> 
> Titan X thread - "They'll never release a 980Ti so close to the Titan X".
> 
> 1080 thread - " Pascal Titan is 2017 at the earliest".


I would have disagreed with all the statements above. The way I see things is this. Traditionally nVidia would release their 300 mm^2 die as a xx70 part, and once AMD beat it they'd release a cut from their Quadro lineup as an x80 part. This changed when AMD was first to market with the 7970. nVidia realized their GK104 beat it hands down, and so they branded the 300 mm^2 part the 680 GTX instead of the 670 GTX. That's when the current strategy came into effect.. or so I believe. (obviously I don't have access to insider info)

So the 680 GTX beat the 7970.. and the excess Quadro dies that would have been release were branded Titan and sold for a premium!
Time passed and they re-released the cut Quadro cards as the 780 GTX, re-branded GK104 as the 770 GTX.
AMD released the R9-290X which beat the 780 GTX, so they released the uncut GK100 as the 780 TI.
Time passed and they release Maxwell since 20 nm failed.. they follow the previous strategy releasing GM104 as the 980 GTX followed by a Titan based on GM100
AMD releases the Fury line which beat the 980 GTX, so they released GM100 as the 980 TI to beat it.

I see a pattern. That's why I'm saying Vega will dictate when the 1080 TI is released.. or even if it gets released.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> The last parts aren't directed at you, just an upset Titan owner who enjoys PM's.


I don't understand the Titan hate really.. If there's no competition in a segment prices will go sky high. Its that simple.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> It is likely to be a cut Quadro because it is easy to bin failed Quadros, reclaim them at product engineering, and fuse them as Titans with a fuse recipe.
> I've had the feeling for some time threads like these just boil down to how rich people claim to be.


Being rich voids all other arguments... lol


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> If they really wanted to maximize profits, NOT releasing a 1080 Ti ever would be the smart thing to do. This way if 980 Ti and Titan X owners feel the 1080 isn't enough of an upgrade, then they can step right up to the $1200 card.


Nvidia probably have an entire team dedicated to market research, if they don't release a 1080Ti we'll know which option would of made them the most cash. But based on the past, releasing a Titan followed by a Ti seems like their M.O.

What's better, selling 10 000 Titan's with $800 profits, or 30 000 1080Ti's with $450 profits?

Depends what type of demands they can meet, if they can't meet that 30 000 then they won't bother with a Ti.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lee Patekar*
> 
> Just my unmitigated speculation spurred from this article: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10510/nvidia-announces-nvidia-titan-x-video-card-1200-available-august-2nd
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Especially this part "NVIDIA this morning has stated that the primary market is FP32 and INT8 compute, not gaming. Though gaming is certainly possible - and I fully expect they'll be happy to sell you $1200 gaming cards - the tables have essentially been flipped from the past Titan cards, where they were treated as gaming first and compute second. This of course opens the door to a proper GeForce branded GP102 card later on, possibly with neutered INT8 support to enforce the market segmentation."
> I would have disagreed with all the statements above. The way I see things is this. Traditionally nVidia would release their 300 mm^2 die as a xx70 part, and once AMD beat it they'd release a cut from their Quadro lineup as an x80 part. This changed when AMD was first to market with the 7970. nVidia realized their GK104 beat it hands down, and so they branded the 300 mm^2 part the 680 GTX instead of the 670 GTX. That's when the current strategy came into effect.. or so I believe. (obviously I don't have access to insider info)
> 
> So the 680 GTX beat the 7970.. and the excess Quadro dies that would have been release were branded Titan and sold for a premium!
> Time passed and they re-released the cut Quadro cards as the 780 GTX, re-branded GK104 as the 770 GTX.
> AMD released the R9-290X which beat the 780 GTX, so they released the uncut GK100 as the 780 TI.
> Time passed and they release Maxwell since 20 nm failed.. they follow the previous strategy releasing GM104 as the 980 GTX followed by a Titan based on GM100
> AMD releases the Fury line which beat the 980 GTX, so they released GM100 as the 980 TI to beat it.
> 
> I see a pattern. That's why I'm saying Vega will dictate when the 1080 TI is released.. or even if it gets released.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't understand the Titan hate really.. If there's no competition in a segment prices will go sky high. Its that simple.


Some good points. We'll find out in a few months.









I'm not hating on the Titan, nor do i have an issue with the people who buy them. They have the money so go ahead and enjoy it.









Expressing frustration or even disdain that chips most of us used to be able to afford (afford is the wrong word, more like what we are willing to spend on this one hobby) isn't hating on the card itself or the people who buy them. If some expect everyone to say they're a good investment, a great deal, or that people should feel lucky Nvidia is offering us this marvel, or else they're just hating well... they may as well leave the thread cus it aint happening.. Not from me anyway.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Being rich voids all other arguments... lol












No denying that. But, how does one verify such a claim?

Number of Titan XPs directly proportional to wealth -or- we're all just house poor and rig rich?

---

I've been looking for review updates, have there been any leaks?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Being rich voids all other arguments... lol


OH _that_ was his point. Yeah can't argue against someone who's rich and has an accredited MBA in finance.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Nvidia probably have an entire team dedicated to market research, if they don't release a 1080Ti we'll know which option would of made them the most cash. But based on the past, releasing a Titan followed by a Ti seems like their M.O.
> 
> What's better, selling 10 000 Titan's with $800 profits, or 30 000 1080Ti's with $450 profits?
> 
> Depends what type of demands they can meet, if they can't meet that 30 000 then they won't bother with a Ti.


Well, what would 980 Ti and Titan X owners if they wanted an upgrade and the only two choices were:

1080 @ $609-$700
Titan X @ $1200?

The ones that don't care they're only getting a 20% upgrade bought the 1080 already. The ones that want more performance will either have to buy the Titan X or keep waiting. And I promise you the patient ones are in the minority.

Also at least at the high end, every time a Ti was released it was in response to AMD. 780 Ti was intended to claw back the performance crown from 290X, and 980 Ti was basically to kill Fury X sales. If Vega doesn't exceed 1080 by at least 10-15%, I honestly don't have high hopes for a 1080 Ti.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> OH _that_ was his point. Yeah can't argue against someone who's rich and has an accredited MBA in finance.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, what would 980 Ti and Titan X owners if they wanted an upgrade and the only two choices were:
> 
> 1080 @ $609-$700
> Titan X @ $1200?
> 
> The ones that don't care they're only getting a 20% upgrade bought the 1080 already. The ones that want more performance will either have to buy the Titan X or keep waiting. And I promise you the patient ones are in the minority.
> 
> Also at least at the high end, every time a Ti was released it was in response to AMD. 780 Ti was intended to claw back the performance crown from 290X, and 980 Ti was basically to kill Fury X sales. If Vega doesn't exceed 1080 by at least 10-15%, I honestly don't have high hopes for a 1080 Ti.


Well, glad i'm sitting this year out then, because i doubt AMD are going to beat the 1080 by that much, if at all. At this point I'll be amazed if they beat the 1070.. Which wouldn't be to bad depending on the price. Not that i would buy a 1080Ti at these prices anyway..

2017 better be a better showing than this year.. Until then this hot pig is good enough for 1080p.


----------



## magnek

I'm sitting tight until there's something that's at least 50% faster than a stock 1080 aka 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 AND has HBM2.

So yeah, gonna be waiting till Q4 2017 at least if not longer.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'm sitting tight until there's something that's at least 50% faster than a stock 1080 aka 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 AND has HBM2.
> 
> So yeah, gonna be waiting till Q4 2017 at least if not longer.


HBM snob.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> If they really wanted to maximize profits, NOT releasing a 1080 Ti ever would be the smart thing to do. This way if 980 Ti and Titan X owners feel the 1080 isn't enough of an upgrade, then they can step right up to the $1200 card.


I disagree. Maxwell owners wanting better performance would buy the 1080. But some wouldn't be satisfied. So, they'd have to shell it out for the Titan XP. Some wouldn't, of course, as it would be out of their budget. Then, the 1080ti is released, for a slightly lower price, edging over the remaining customers for whom the Titan XP was a bit of an overreach.

Calculations made, EVERYONE upgraded. Nvidia runs this mother.


----------



## DNMock

What's probably the top line from a marketing standpoint is "how much will upper-middle class enthusiasts pay?"

The ultra rich don't care, 1,000 or 5,000 those number don't mean a thing.

From what it seems like, Intel has found that $1,750 prices out the upper middle class enthusiasts, so Nvidia is setting the bar just a hair lower at $1,200.

As someone who considers themselves to be an upper-middle class enthusiast, I waiver at the 1,200 dollar figure. If I had a need for it, I.E. a monitor that could put out the benefits of such a powerful card, I would probably pull the trigger, but there isn't really anything that would allow such a card to shine compared to the previous generation.

Now if you are doing a new build and going 4k or 3440 x 1440 100hz for the first time, getting this GPU would be the smart choice in my opinion as it's the only single GPU solution that can steadily cap those numbers and leaves room for a future upgrade to SLI if/when upgrade their monitor.

Unfortunately, those of us who represent a large portion of the new buys, the enthusiasts who upgrade constantly, who already have 4k monitors and the GPU power to push it, be that CF Fury X, SLI 980ti/Titan-X, I just don't see any reason to spend that money with nothing to show for it, just like us Haswell-E owners opting out of buying a new Broadwell-E CPU.

TLDR: Folks with powerful rigs and set-ups will probably skip out on this, while it makes perfect sense for those who want to build a powerful rig now.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'm sitting tight until there's something that's at least 50% faster than a stock 1080 aka 980 Ti @ 1500/8000 AND has HBM2.
> 
> *So yeah, gonna be waiting till Q4 2017 at least if not longer*.












Better not be that long.







I'm sick of 1080p..

That's the most annoying part of this Titan, people can say what they want about the Fury X (and there's not much to say next to a 980Ti







), but at least it had HBM to redeem it. You sort of expect the cutting edge on flagships, particularly one that costs $1200..

They want to charge obscene amounts of money? fine.. But you'd think they'd make it something special, a unique cooler, etc. Heck, maybe a damn backplate.. Instead it's nothing but an empty name built with "just good enough" power delivery and the same cooler as their $400 card.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> If they really wanted to maximize profits, NOT releasing a 1080 Ti ever would be the smart thing to do. This way if 980 Ti and Titan X owners feel the 1080 isn't enough of an upgrade, then they can step right up to the $1200 card.


Excuse me, what qualifications do you have to make such a bold comment? Because from where I am sitting, it looks patently incorrect.

They will release a Titan XP for $1,200 and sell out....then several months down the line they will release the 1080TI for $1,000 and sell out.....then they may do a run of Titan Blacks for $1,500 and sell out. This is pretty much how Nivida has operated for quite some time.


----------



## Baasha

This w/ 4-Way SLI and 4K Surround using the Dell OLED 120Hz monitors would be ... epic.


----------



## supermi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> If anything, you've changed my mind about buying the Titan XP. I now want to buy two!!!


Funny enough, 2 would be the only way I will go if I were to get some TITAN action this round.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> HBM snob.


Haters gon gate.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> I disagree. Maxwell owners wanting better performance would buy the 1080. But some wouldn't be satisfied. So, they'd have to shell it out for the Titan XP. Some wouldn't, of course, as it would be out of their budget. Then, the 1080ti is released, for a slightly lower price, edging over the remaining customers for whom the Titan XP was a bit of an overreach.
> 
> Calculations made, EVERYONE upgraded. Nvidia runs this mother.


This was my reasoning:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Well, what would 980 Ti and Titan X owners if they wanted an upgrade and the only two choices were:
> 
> 1080 @ $609-$700
> Titan X @ $1200?
> 
> The ones that don't care they're only getting a 20% upgrade bought the 1080 already. The ones that want more performance will either have to buy the Titan X or keep waiting. And I promise you the patient ones are in the minority.
> 
> Also at least at the high end, every time a Ti was released it was in response to AMD. 780 Ti was intended to claw back the performance crown from 290X, and 980 Ti was basically to kill Fury X sales. If Vega doesn't exceed 1080 by at least 10-15%, I honestly don't have high hopes for a 1080 Ti.


Basically my point was in the absence of a 1080 Ti, the only alternative to not paying $1200 is to wait. And sooner or later people (or at least those in the ultra high end segment) will cave.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Better not be that long.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sick of 1080p..
> 
> That's the most annoying part of this Titan, people can say what they want about the Fury X (and there's not much to say next to a 980Ti
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), but at least it had HBM to redeem it. You sort of expect the cutting edge on flagships, particularly one that costs $1200..
> 
> They want to charge obscene amounts of money? fine.. But you'd think they'd make it something special, a unique cooler, etc. Heck, maybe a damn backplate.. Instead it's nothing but an empty name built with "just good enough" power delivery and the same cooler as their $400 card.


HBM2? Yeah I don't see that coming anytime before Volta Titan, hence Q42017 or later.

Well the OG Titan at least had the same FP64 (DP) capability as the Tesla cards, so there's that (lol can't believe I'm defending the OG Titan







). Titan X was just a pimped up 980 Ti but at least had more vram. This Titan XP is a mockery of the Titan moniker.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Excuse me, what qualifications do you have to make such a bold comment? Because from where I am sitting, it looks patently incorrect.
> 
> They will release a Titan XP for $1,200 and sell out....then several months down the line they will release the 1080TI for $1,000 and sell out.....then they may do a run of Titan Blacks for $1,500 and sell out. This is pretty much how Nivida has operated for quite some time.


Well, change that 1080 Ti for $1000 in your post to Titan XP for $1200 and what do you get?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> This w/ 4-Way SLI and 4K Surround using the Dell OLED 120Hz monitors would be ... epic.


Haha Baasha and his over the top builds.....would like to see that one for sure! I am hoping for a DP 1.3 adapter.....or a special edition Titan XP that has a USBC out connection, that way we can get full 120hz support.....but as is 4K 30" OLED @ 60hz is till worth the $5,000 cost of entry for me! The 120hz potential is just the icing on top


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Haters gon gate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This was my reasoning:
> Basically my point was in the absence of a 1080 Ti, the only alternative to not paying $1200 is to wait. And sooner or later people (or at least those in the ultra high end segment) will cave.
> HBM2? Yeah I don't see that coming anytime before Volta Titan, hence Q42017 or later.
> 
> Well the OG Titan at least had the same FP64 (DP) capability as the Tesla cards, so there's that (lol can't believe I'm defending the OG Titan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). Titan X was just a pimped up 980 Ti but at least had more vram. This Titan XP is a mockery of the Titan moniker.
> Well, change that 1080 Ti for $1000 in your post to Titan XP for $1200 and what do you get?


I think we can find some middle ground here to agree on Magnek.....you state Nvidia is milking the enthusiasts with a $1,200 card......I agree with that, but I think they could have gotten away with charging $1500 but they didn't. This is a temporary situation, an early adopter fee, because I feel in several months......particularly when BF1 comes out, we will see a 1080ti with similar specs as the TitanXP for a more palpable $999 price tag.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Excuse me, what qualifications do you have to make such a bold comment? Because from where I am sitting, it looks patently incorrect.
> 
> They will release a Titan XP for $1,200 and sell out....then several months down the line they will release the 1080TI for $1,000 and sell out.....then they may do a run of Titan Blacks for $1,500 and sell out. This is pretty much how Nivida has operated for quite some time.


Regardless of what looks correct or not, the Titan X is already the GTX 1080Ti but with a different name.

All Titan Xs always had double the VRAM compared to their x80Ti counterpart, unless the GTX 1080Ti have 6GB of VRAM then this doesn't make sense.

Titan Xs also came with extra computing, this one offer the same Double Precision performance as a GTX 570, ridiculous!

Also, this is the most disappointing Titan ever released regarding die size, with a 310mm2 size this is underwhelming at best, all Titan X had been 600mm2, those 600mm2 old Titans cost twice as much to produce than this one and yet for some reason this cost more to buy.

This is the Ti, the real Titan will be called Titan Ultra or some other BS and will sell for 1500$ with a 400 to 420mm2, and it will be a Bang 4 the buck regarding performance per dollar compared to this current Titan X, not because it is a bargain but because it can only be compared against this current Titan and we have been mislead to think these prices are "OK", it's like believing I have a bigl dong because I can only be compared to Japanesse men.

This is why Nvidia called it Titan X and not Titan P, it's just not a Titan Card, it's the x80Ti with a different name, expect the real Titan to release at least 5 months before Volta with a price so high it'll hurt your wallet by just mentioning it.


----------



## keikei

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> This w/ 4-Way SLI and 4K Surround using the Dell OLED 120Hz monitors would be ... epic.


If its anything like the 1080, 2 cards are max for SLI unfortunately.


----------



## l88bastar

On another note, this was posted on the other forums......shows how Nvidia makes new GPUS....really cool stuff! I want that CADENCE so I can emulate TITAN XYZ!!!!!


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> I think we can find some middle ground here to agree on Magnek.....you state Nvidia is milking the enthusiasts with a $1,200 card......I agree with that, but I think they could have gotten away with charging $1500 but they didn't. This is a temporary situation, an early adopter fee, because I feel in several months......particularly when BF1 comes out, we will see a 1080ti with similar specs as the TitanXP for a more palpable $999 price tag.


$1200 and $999 isn't that much of a difference. It would have to be $850 or something for the price to be a selling point. But that's really not the main point.

Let's say you have a 980 Ti and you found the 1080 underwhelming, so you wait for something better. Titan XP releases at $1200, and you find the price hard to swallow, so you wait. 3 months go by and no 1080 Ti. BF1 releases and you suddenly find yourself needing more performance. What do you do? You can either buy a 1080 for less money and also substantially less performance increase, or you can buy the $1200 Titan XP. You could of course grab another 980 Ti on the cheap for SLI assuming that's your thing. Or you could wait some more for that mythical 1080 Ti I guess. But at some point, and especially if you actually needed more performance, you're just going to cave, unless you buy a second 980 Ti and go SLI instead.

That's the angle I'm coming from.

Btw I don't think $999 and "palpable" belong in the same sentence.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> HBM2? Yeah I don't see that coming anytime before Volta Titan, hence Q42017 or later.
> 
> Well the OG Titan at least had the same FP64 (DP) capability as the Tesla cards, so there's that (lol can't believe I'm defending the OG Titan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). Titan X was just a pimped up 980 Ti but at least had more vram. This Titan XP is a mockery of the Titan moniker.


Samsung and SK Hynix went into mass production over 6 months ago, TitanXP could of had it. I bet AMD's Fury replacements (not the 490) have it, you know, for their flagship products.









http://wccftech.com/samsung-hbm2-dram/

http://wccftech.com/sk-hynix-hbm2-mass-production-q3-2016/

OG Titan was a sort of cheap mans "pro" card, so yeah, at least it was unique compared to the rest of their lineup. I hope you're wrong and we don't have to wait until the end of next year.. At that rate the console kiddies will make me look like a pauper, my 390X would of consumed nearly 50MW of power and may burn out before then, and your 980Ti...



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






(j/k for anyone who thinks i'm serious.)

Not to mention the next Titan will be $2k..


----------



## DADDYDC650

Folks need to get over the price. If you can't afford it or simply don't want to pay then this GPU is not for you. Get over it! There's PLENTY of GPU options out there at different price brackets. Let's talk about how this card is a beast instead shall we?


----------



## mcg75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Also, this is the most disappointing Titan ever released regarding die size, with a 310mm2 size this is underwhelming at best, all Titan X had been 600mm2, those 600mm2 old Titans cost twice as much to produce than this one and yet for some reason this cost more to buy.


While I agree that this is some sort of stop gap Titan, the die size is 471mm2 not 310mm2.


----------



## magnek

Btw don't know if anybody noticed, but Quadro P6000 was just announced, and surprise surprise, it's the *full GP102 chip with 3840 cores.*

So this Titan XP is already a salvage part that didn't make the Quadro cut.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorillaSceptre*
> 
> Samsung and SK Hynix went into mass production over 6 months ago, TitanXP could of had it. I bet AMD's Fury replacements (not the 490) have it, you know, for their flagship products.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://wccftech.com/samsung-hbm2-dram/
> 
> http://wccftech.com/sk-hynix-hbm2-mass-production-q3-2016/
> 
> OG Titan was a sort of cheap mans "pro" card, so yeah, at least it was unique compared to the rest of their lineup. I hope you're wrong and we don't have to wait until the end of next year.. At that rate the console kiddies will make me look like a pauper, my 390X would of consumed nearly 50MW of power and may burn out before then, and your 980Ti...
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (j/k for anyone who thinks i'm serious.)
> 
> Not to mention the next Titan will be $2k..


Mass production for nVidia's Tesla P100 GPU.
















AMD had a roadmap where they said Vega would have HBM2, so there's that. HBM2 for nVidia is gonna be Volta Titan I expect. As for DX12 and Maxwell, well that's a foregone conclusion.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> $1200 and $999 isn't that much of a difference. It would have to be $850 or something for the price to be a selling point. But that's really not the main point.
> 
> Let's say you have a 980 Ti and you found the 1080 underwhelming, so you wait for something better. Titan XP releases at $1200, and you find the price hard to swallow, so you wait. 3 months go by and no 1080 Ti. BF1 releases and you suddenly find yourself needing more performance. What do you do? You can either buy a 1080 for less money and also substantially less performance increase, or you can buy the $1200 Titan XP. You could of course grab another 980 Ti on the cheap for SLI assuming that's your thing. Or you could wait some more for that mythical 1080 Ti I guess. But at some point, and especially if you actually needed more performance, you're just going to cave, unless you buy a second 980 Ti and go SLI instead.
> 
> That's the angle I'm coming from.
> 
> Btw I don't think $999 and "palpable" belong in the same sentence.


Well then you are living in denial. I can't recall anything being at the $800 ish price point really. They like to go $500-$700 for upper end mainstream like the 1080 and $999+ for the really high performers. If you include x2 cards you could say they have been at the $1,000+ price point for quite some time for the highest end cards and AMD was playin that expensive game too...I recall paying an arm and a leg for the AMD 6990!

Ahh wait, the 6990 was "only" $699 back in 2011....well Its all relative really as ALOT of mainstream appeal has happened in the industry within the last 5 years.

I use the full auto machine gun market as an example as it too has gone more mainstream.
Ten years ago you could have purchased a transferable Colt M16 for around $10,000 - $12,000. Now they are $25,000 - $40,000.
Ten years ago you could have purchased a Mac11 for $1,500. Now they are $7,500 - $10,000


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Well then you are living in denial. I can't recall anything being at the $800 ish price point really. They like to go $500-$700 for upper end mainstream like the 1080 and $999+ for the really high performers. If you include x2 cards you could say they have been at the $1,000+ price point for quite some time for the highest end cards and AMD was playin that expensive game too...I recall paying an arm and a leg for the AMD 6990!


Living in denial?

OG Titan: $999
GTX 780: $649

Titan X: $999
980 Ti: $649

The cut down part has historically been $350 less (granted it's only two data points). $1200 - $350 = $850. I didn't pull that number out of my ass you know.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Btw don't know if anybody noticed, but Quadro P6000 was just announced, and surprise surprise, it's the *full GP102 chip with 3840 cores.*
> 
> So this Titan XP is already a salvage part that didn't make the Quadro cut.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mass production for nVidia's Tesla P100 GPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AMD had a roadmap where they said Vega would have HBM2, so there's that. HBM2 for nVidia is gonna be Volta Titan I expect. As for DX12 and Maxwell, well that's a foregone conclusion.


Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the GP102 with 3840 cores wasn't a rumor? Pretty obvious Nvidia will eventually release a Titan XP Black. Well, obvious in my mind at least.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> .


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Living in denial?
> 
> OG Titan: $999
> GTX 780: $649
> 
> Titan X: $999
> 980 Ti: $649
> 
> The cut down part has historically been $350 less (granted it's only two data points). $1200 - $350 = $850. I didn't pull that number out of my ass you know.


Its because there are more consumers in the industry, not necessary because there are more people with disposable income, because there are not. The world economy is pretty weak right now, but there are more consumers and enough demand for them to sell @1200. Do you disagree with that? Do you deny that these will sell out at at that price point?

I keep using the full auto machine gun market as an example because it too has gone more mainstream.
Ten years ago you could have purchased a transferable Colt M16 for around $10,000 - $12,000. Now they are $25,000 - $40,000.
Ten years ago you could have purchased a Mac11 for $1,500. Now they are $7,500 - $10,000

Unlike GPUS, these are the same exact items...these transferable full auto machine guns. So what happened to drive up the price? Supply and demand, ownership of F/A used to be considered taboo.....but then it went mainstream and demand cause prices to climb......and there is no end in sight. I predict in ten years Colt M16s will be worth $100,000


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Given what we've seen from the GCN iterations so far, even 10% would be a very optimistic estimate, and 20% is just unrealistic.
> 
> As far as clocks go, they might get higher if they switch to TSMC's process, but if they use GF's 14nm LPP for Vega, then once again I don't think Vega will clock very high, if Polaris is any indication.
> 
> Overall, my projection for Vega is still around 1080 level, until I see further evidence otherwise.


I thought everyone was talking about last year how GF 14nm is actually superior to TSMC 16nm in that it has faster switching speeds and a bit less leakage? So GF node should clock better than TSMC. Id put the lack of clocking down to the architecture itself, not the node it is on. I really think the GPUs would clock even worse if AMD went over to TSMC.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Its because there are more consumers in the industry, not necessary because there are more people with disposable income, because there are not. *The world economy is pretty weak right now, but there are more consumers and enough demand for them to sell @1200. Do you disagree with that? Do you deny that these will sell out at at that price point?*
> 
> I keep using the full auto machine gun market as an example because it too has gone more mainstream.
> Ten years ago you could have purchased a transferable Colt M16 for around $10,000 - $12,000. Now they are $25,000 - $40,000.
> Ten years ago you could have purchased a Mac11 for $1,500. Now they are $7,500 - $10,000
> 
> Unlike GPUS, these are the same exact items...these transferable full auto machine guns. So what happened to drive up the price? Supply and demand, ownership of F/A used to be considered taboo.....but then it went mainstream and demand cause prices to climb......and there is no end in sight. I predict in ten years Colt M16s will be worth $100,000












Are you sure you're not quoting the wrong person? I never disputed any of that. Hell if anything the part in bold just reinforces what I said about a cheaper 1080 Ti not being unnecessary, especially if AMD doesn't come up with anything competitive.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the GP102 with 3840 cores wasn't a rumor? Pretty obvious Nvidia will eventually release a Titan XP Black. Well, obvious in my mind at least.


Was expected but not confirmed till now. Makes the Titan X a harder sell knowing it's not the full chip imo. Even though the perf difference would be small it's annoying


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> It'll also depend heavily on where you live. Here in Taxifornia (well the Bay Area to be more precise), you pretty much have to be in at least the 80th percentile of your income group if you want to have anything resembling moderate comfort.
> 
> I mean, you know something's _completely whack_ when a freaking *garage* goes for $1,000/mo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Doesn't mean much if it's a monthly paycheck.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I kid I kid.
> 
> But yeah, wouldn't be surprised if many (most?) on here are fairly well-off bourgeois types.


Lol, you must have never been through Boston, in the Back bay/South End section alone, a parking spot costs as much as a condo. .....I didn't dare own a car while living there...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Jayz posted a video and mentioned that the 1080 Ti will come out eventually. Could be guessing or he knows something we don't. 13:40 mark.


----------



## i7monkey

he's guessing like anyone else


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> he's guessing like anyone else


Not everyone gets free cards from Nvidia though.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Not everyone gets free cards from Nvidia though.


He says in the video, that he's guessing...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> He says in the video, that he's guessing...


He never said he was guessing. He said that the TI's will inevitably be out and that he didn't know when. I'm just grasping at straws and he's probably guessing but I figure he should know a little more than us.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Im trying to get people to NOT buy a $1200 TItan
> 
> dont stop me


If someone needs someones else advice on how to spend $1200, then, they shouldn't be spending $1200 to begin with. time to find a new hobby...


----------



## bonami2

Did i really read it only 25% faster than a 1080 ref ?

So like 35-40% faster than a rog 1070 overclocked to 2000-2100 + mem ?

I was thinking it was 60% faster than the 1080


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Did i really read it only 25% faster than a 1080 ref ?
> 
> So like 35-40% faster than a rog 1070 overclocked to 2000-2100 + mem ?
> 
> I was thinking it was 60% faster than the 1080


It was announced as 60% faster than Maxwell Titan X, not 1080.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> It was announced as 60% faster than Maxwell Titan X, not 1080.


Well gonna get a rog 1070.









Uh Amd we are waiting!


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Did i really read it only 25% faster than a 1080 ref ?
> 
> So like 35-40% faster than a rog 1070 overclocked to 2000-2100 + mem ?
> 
> I was thinking it was 60% faster than the 1080


it's a cut card. it has a rather low clock compared to GTX 1080.

So yeah "only" 25% faster than GTX 1080 sounds about right.

definitively atrocious when it comes to price/performance, but some people, especially in the US, can afford it.

maybe it does overclock aswell as the GTX 1080 so once both are overclocked the difference will be 30-35%. No idea


----------



## emett

Wonder how temps are.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> it's a cut card. it has a rather low clock compared to GTX 1080.
> 
> So yeah "only" 25% faster than GTX 1080 sounds about right.
> 
> definitively atrocious when it comes to price/performance, but some people, especially in the US, can afford it.
> 
> maybe it does overclock aswell as the GTX 1080 so once both are overclocked the difference will be 30-35%. No idea


Yea just the 1070 here in my cart it 653$ canadian shipped. That from newegg so i save 10% of quebec tax i think.

The 1200 titan will probably be 1400-1800$ cad


----------



## DADDYDC650

Heard the 1080 Classified comes with an EV Bot. Interesting...


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Lol, you must have never been through Boston, in the Back bay/South End section alone, a parking spot costs as much as a condo. .....I didn't dare own a car while living there...


I lived in Quincy from 95-96, does that count?









Btw it's just as bad in downtown SF, except you get hills too.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kpjoslee*
> 
> http://www.bitsandchips.it/9-hardware/7284-nvidia-quadro-p600o-full-gp102-3840cc-e-24gb-di-gddr5x
> 
> Quadro P6000
> 
> 3840 Cuda cores
> 24GB GDDR5X
> 
> So that is where full GP102 core went.


AKA Titan XP Ti......


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I lived in Quincy from 95-96, does that count?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Btw it's just as bad in downtown SF, except you get hills too.


Bay Area here as well.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> AKA Titan XP Ti......


I'm guessing the Ti will have the same amount of cores as the XP and the Titan XP Black will feature the full 3800+.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> AKA Titan XP Ti......


Titan X JHH Edition

Or they could just not release a full chip into the GeForce lineup.


----------



## DADDYDC650

AMD might have something for Nvidia and the Titan XP this Christmas, https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/4u1yir/amds_roy_taylor_possibly_hinting_at_a_competing/


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Heard the 1080 Classified comes with an EV Bot. Interesting...


If my local MC get these in stock before the TXP drop, I will jump on it. hopefully, OC'ed, it can handle GTAV, Star Citizen and the various Race Sims that I play at 4K to a decent degree til Volta........


----------



## magnek

I don't think voltage will do much if anything for Pascal, if derBauer's findings are anything to go by.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> AMD might have something for Nvidia and the Titan XP this Christmas, https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/4u1yir/amds_roy_taylor_possibly_hinting_at_a_competing/


Roy Taylor
















Plus all he said was:
Quote:


> I can't wait for Christmas


Sounds more like he wants a Titan X as a Christmas present


----------



## besthijacker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> AMD might have something for Nvidia and the Titan XP this Christmas, https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/4u1yir/amds_roy_taylor_possibly_hinting_at_a_competing/


Uhh okay. I'm totally shocked that AMD still hasn't fired him. Guy is first class tool.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> If my local MC get these in stock before the TXP drop, I will jump on it. hopefully, OC'ed, it can handle GTAV, Star Citizen and the various Race Sims that I play at 4K to a decent degree til Volta........


Lucky that you have a Micro Center near you. It's criminal that the Bay Area doesn't. Anyway, I'd be pumped with either of these bad boys.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *besthijacker*
> 
> Uhh okay. I'm totally shocked that AMD still hasn't fired him. Guy is first class tool.


Care to explain why?


----------



## magnek

Just google "roy taylor gameworks".


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> On another note, this was posted on the other forums......shows how Nvidia makes new GPUS....really cool stuff! I want that CADENCE so I can emulate TITAN XYZ!!!!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Thank you, didn't know that, and the guy who made the tour is pretty cool.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Lucky that you have a Micro Center near you. It's criminal that the Bay Area doesn't. Anyway, I'd be pumped with either of these bad boys.


This is the testbench from Jayztwocents


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> This is the testbench from Jayztwocents


Of course he already owns one...


----------



## dVeLoPe

if i have 1x 1080 and was planning on going sli why should i sell my card and buy this instead?

according to money wise i can get 600 for my card to a friend and was gonna spend 600 on another...

would it be stupid? smart? the same? discuss! thax


----------



## emett

SLI 1080s will be much faster than a new Titan X is supported games.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dVeLoPe*
> 
> if i have 1x 1080 and was planning on going sli why should i sell my card and buy this instead?
> 
> according to money wise i can get 600 for my card to a friend and was gonna spend 600 on another...
> 
> would it be stupid? smart? the same? discuss! thax


You obviously want a Titan XP and it's always best to run a more powerful single card. Can't lose either way.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Just google "roy taylor gameworks".


When you see how Gameworks titles gimped performance on Kepler compared to Maxwell just like it did to AMD I kind of agree with him.

Fallout 4 was a rest example of this


----------



## magnek

*How* he says things rather than *what* he says is the far bigger problem. He basically comes across as loud, boisterous, unprofessional buffoon baboon. And when you're as senior as he is and basically represent the face of a company, you really shouldn't be acting like that.


----------



## Ghoxt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Btw don't know if anybody noticed, but Quadro P6000 was just announced, and surprise surprise, it's the *full GP102 chip with 3840 cores.*
> So this Titan XP is already a salvage part that didn't make the Quadro cut.


You are correct. Well at least everyone will know that their Titan-XP GPU is Gimped from day one at a premium of $1200 lol.

I just don't feel right paying a premium for a cut chip any more. Basically it's not the best Nvidia could offer on that die and not worthy of the Titan name regardless of the performance. With Die Shrink, new Architecture, and GDDR5X memory it's supposed to surpass the last generation so this is no surprise.

This is not the droid I was looking for. I have SLI Titan-X @1500 Mhz, custom bios on water, and was looking forward to going back to one GPU. Guess I'll be waiting once again. I've bought every Titan except the Z of course







, so this is a huge letdown.

Truth be told I'm considering going AMD on principle alone once they release their next Gen. Tired of Nvidia's second hand garbage games.


----------



## i7monkey

AMD might have something for Christmas? WHY ARE U 5 MONTHS LATE?!

The only way Nvidia is kept in check is if AMD releases competing products at the same time. What's the point if they're always late and a much faster product from Nvidia is right around the corner?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> You are correct. Well at least everyone will know that their Titan-XP GPU is Gimped from day one at a premium of $1200 lol.
> 
> I just don't feel right paying a premium for a cut chip any more. Basically it's not the best Nvidia could offer on that die and not worthy of the Titan name regardless of the performance. With Die Shrink, new Architecture, and GDDR5X memory it's supposed to surpass the last generation so this is no surprise.
> 
> This is not the droid I was looking for. I have SLI Titan-X @1500 Mhz, custom bios on water, and was looking forward to going back to one GPU. Guess I'll be waiting once again. I've bought every Titan except the Z of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , so this is a huge letdown.
> 
> *Truth be told I'm considering going AMD on principle alone once they release their next Gen. Tired of Nvidia's second hand garbage games.*


I know how you feel. if Vega can offer 15%+ performance over an OC 1080 I might just end up buying that. At least it'll have HBM2 so that's a start.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> This card should be able to achieve 60fps 4K gaming and that's all that really matters to me. If it get's dethroned a few months later, I should still be getting 60FPS hopefully so it won't matter much to me.
> 
> I do think if NVIDIA releases a $1200 card, and dethrones it within 6 months, then they really don't give a crap about their customer base though.


Yeah im in fear for that a little. I dont care about 1080ti, but i dont a titan black at 588mm2 4500cores and hbm2 in 6 months. Anyway i think this kind of card will be release in end 2017 or q1 2018 with volta titan ? Right ? If they release in 6 months a titan black with 3840 core and gddr5x memoty i wont be disappointed, but if its hbm2 i will be a little disapppointed, but i dont want a titan full die 588-620mm2 in next 6 months.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The first Titan wasn't advertised as a gaming GPU either, only the second Titan was after the demand for the first far exceeded what NVIDIA was expecting for a $1000 GPU. Now that they increased the price to $1200, it seems they don't want to call it a "gaming GPU" until they know there's demand for a $1200 gaming card. They don't think there will be, which is probably why they are only selling directly and not to gaming brand vendors yet. If there is demand, you can bet they will ship these exact cards out to gaming vendors.
> 
> There's literally no difference between a "gaming" titan and "non-gaming" titan other than marketing and labels.


Ok thanks to clarify that, i didnt understand the meaning correctly
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the GP102 with 3840 cores wasn't a rumor? Pretty obvious Nvidia will eventually release a Titan XP Black. Well, obvious in my mind at least.


No problem with me if its without hbm2
Anyway 3584 vs 3840 is not much stronger. But if they realease hbm2 with it in next 6 months, i will be a little disappointed to have not wait for it. Im upgrading every 2 years
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm guessing the Ti will have the same amount of cores as the XP and the Titan XP Black will feature the full 3800+.


I hope they dont go full die at 4500-5000 core in next 6 months

Guys, do you think the volta titan will feature 4500+(or 5000+) cores with hbm2 ? If yes would they release it in end 2017 or q1 2018 ? If yes, I will begin saving for that too


----------



## Seyumi

EVGA Jacob just confirmed they're making Pascal Titan X Hybrid upgrade kits. No need to buy those gold 980Ti ones now or hack up a 1080 one.

http://forums.evga.com/FindPost/2520221


----------



## tweezlednutball

sweet jacket


----------



## supermi

Sorry post mistep, will sort out and repost....

Summary, If AMD can make a good card I may buy 2 but that is a tall order for them, haha


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The first Titan wasn't advertised as a gaming GPU either, only the second Titan was after the demand for the first far exceeded what NVIDIA was expecting for a $1000 GPU. Now that they increased the price to $1200, it seems they don't want to call it a "gaming GPU" until they know there's demand for a $1200 gaming card. They don't think there will be, which is probably why they are only selling directly and not to gaming brand vendors yet. If there is demand, you can bet they will ship these exact cards out to gaming vendors.
> 
> There's literally no difference between a "gaming" titan and "non-gaming" titan other than marketing and labels.


Well you can make bank on this new Titan being an overwhelming success especially since this time there is nothing even remotely close to what you could call "competition" from AMD. People will throw money at their screens for borderline side-grade 1080 so what do you think they will do with a proper new big-die Titan? The sales strategy is interesting though and silly IMO. They'd make a ton of money if they opened it up to AIB sales and non-reference designs but its not like money is something Nvidia has in short supply anyway...


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *supermi*
> 
> Sorry post mistep, will sort out and repost....
> 
> Summary, If AMD can make a good card I may buy 2 but that is a tall order for them, haha


Sadly yes. 480's showing makes me really concerned whether Vega would even match a 1080. If it's indeed a process issue with GloFo's 14nm LPP, then I can only pray they make the switch to TSMC 16nm FF for Vega.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well you can make bank on this new Titan being an overwhelming success especially since this time there is nothing even remotely close to what you could call "competition" from AMD. People will throw money at their screens for borderline side-grade 1080 so what do you think they will do with a *proper new big-die Titan*? The sales strategy is interesting though and silly IMO. They'd make a ton of money if they opened it up to AIB sales and non-reference designs but its not like money is something Nvidia has in short supply anyway...


*cough cough*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Btw don't know if anybody noticed, but Quadro P6000 was just announced, and surprise surprise, it's the *full GP102 chip with 3840 cores.*
> 
> So this Titan XP is already a salvage part that didn't make the Quadro cut.


This Titan XP is a mockery of the Titan branding, because it's a Titan that uses a castrated chip, AND doesn't come with twice the memory.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> AMD might have something for Christmas? WHY ARE U 5 MONTHS LATE?!
> 
> The only way Nvidia is kept in check is if AMD releases competing products at the same time. What's the point if they're always late and a much faster product from Nvidia is right around the corner?


Nvidia just has superior R&D, engineers, designs, facilities, foundry, you name it. They are able to do this because they have near unlimited resources while AMD is just trying to keep the lights on, getting crushed by Intel on the one side and Nvidia on the other. If AMD had the resources Nvidia or Intel has you might see some actual competition in both CPU's and GPU's but as it is they have to scrape by with whatever they can come up with and hope to stay afloat with all their exclusive deals like the new consoles. Ironically the console deal that is keeping their heads above water is also tying their hands by forcing them to stick with GCN, an architecture that is 5 years old at its core and badly outclassed by Nvidia's latest and greatest.

The funny thing about all of this is there are so many Nvidia fanboys in this thread whining about pricing and how they wish AMD would compete to bring prices down yet they have spent every single post they make here on OCN trashing AMD and saying how much they suck for how long??? Well you guys finally have gotten your wish as AMD clearly cannot compete at this level and now we have a $1200 cut down of a cut down Titan as a result. You guys should all be throwing Team Green parties congratulating Nvidia for being so awesome that they can get away with this while burning Red Radeon flags in JHH approved cultist ceremonies in your back yards...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> *cough cough*


Well, you know what I meant. Its a cut down of a cut down but its at least a big die Pascal and not an X60 card masquerading as an X80 like GP104...


----------



## Mad Pistol

Has anyone noticed that none of the pics/videos so far show the green "Geforce GTX" logo on the Titan XP?

I can't believe I am saying this... but I am officially intrigued.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Has anyone noticed that none of the pics/videos so far show the green "Geforce GTX" logo on the Titan XP?
> 
> I can't believe I am saying this... but I am officially intrigued.


Because NVIDIA stated it is not a gaming card fiorst and foremost, but can be used as such. Geforce is a gaming lineup. The name is simply "Titan X", while the previous titan was called "GTX Geforce Titan X"

The first titan also did not have geforce in it's title, which is weird because it shared the same drives as geforce gaming cards.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well, you know what I meant. Its a cut down of a cut down but its at least a big die Pascal and not an X60 card masquerading as an X80 like GP104...


Actually it's not even a proper big die.

GP104 = 312 mm²
GP102 = 471 mm²
GP100 = 610 mm²

The proper big die would be GP100, so I guess that makes GP102 an improper big die.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Because NVIDIA stated it is not a gaming card fiorst and foremost, but can be used as such. Geforce is a gaming lineup. The name is simply "Titan X", while the previous titan was called "GTX Geforce Titan X"
> 
> The first titan also did not have geforce in it's title, which is weird because it shared the same drives as geforce gaming cards.


Whaaa? OG Titan did have GeForce in its title: http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-titan

Which is extremely ironic, because OG Titan was much less GeForce-y than this Titan X is.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Because NVIDIA stated it is not a gaming card first and foremost, but can be used as such if desired. Geforce is a gaming lineup. The name is simply "Titan X", while the previous titan was called "GTX Geforce Titan X".
> 
> *The first titan also did not have geforce in it's title*, which is weird because it shared the same drives as geforce gaming cards. I'd assume this card will also share the same drives as gaming cards.


Looking at a couple of OG Titan coolers on my wall right now and they say "GEFORCE GTX" right on the side...


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Because NVIDIA stated it is not a gaming card fiorst and foremost, but can be used as such. Geforce is a gaming lineup. The name is simply "Titan X", while the previous titan was called "GTX Geforce Titan X"
> 
> The first titan also did not have geforce in it's title, which is weird because it shared the same drives as geforce gaming cards.


Nah it did actually, http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-titan

This is the first time they've dropped the GeForce GTX naming completely from Titan.


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Nvidia just has superior R&D, engineers, designs, facilities, foundry, you name it. They are able to do this because they have near unlimited resources while AMD is just trying to keep the lights on, getting crushed by Intel on the one side and Nvidia on the other. If AMD had the resources Nvidia or Intel has you might see some actual competition in both CPU's and GPU's but as it is they have to scrape by with whatever they can come up with and hope to stay afloat with all their exclusive deals like the new consoles. Ironically the console deal that is keeping their heads above water is also tying their hands by forcing them to stick with GCN, an architecture that is 5 years old at its core and badly outclassed by Nvidia's latest and greatest.
> 
> The funny thing about all of this is there are so many Nvidia fanboys in this thread whining about pricing and how they wish AMD would compete to bring prices down yet they have spent every single post they make here on OCN trashing AMD and saying how much they suck for how long??? Well you guys finally have gotten your wish as AMD clearly cannot compete at this level and now we have a $1200 cut down of a cut down Titan as a result. You guys should all be throwing Team Green parties congratulating Nvidia for being so awesome that they can get away with this while burning Red Radeon flags in JHH approved cultist ceremonies in your back yards...


funny thing is back when 5870 is trashing Fermi, they still buy Fermi even tho it is a trash chip compared to Cypress. ughhh


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Actually it's not even a proper big die.
> 
> GP104 = 312 mm²
> GP102 = 471 mm²
> GP100 = 610 mm²
> 
> The proper big die would be GP100, so I guess that makes GP102 an improper big die.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whaaa? OG Titan did have GeForce in its title: http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-titan
> 
> Which is extremely ironic, because OG Titan was much less GeForce-y than this Titan X is.


Well we have been told so far that they are not making a GP100 GeForce card at all so we get GP102 instead. Of course who really believes that?

Then again, they are saying this new Titan will not be a GeForce card but its certainly not a Quadro so what the hell is it exactly? With gimped DP performance its not a professional level card so its absolutely a gaming card in my opinion. Claims by Nvidia to the contrary are just marketing noise it would seem...


----------



## Murlocke

I could have swore my original titan I bought from nvidia.com (Day 1 purchase) did not have geforce written anywhere on it. Perhaps the ones shipped directly from NVIDIA were different?

Looking at my maxwell Titan X box (also shipped from NVIDIA as a Day 1 purchase) no where does it say geforce on the box or card - simply "Titan X".

This whole thing couldn't be more confusing...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I could have swore my original titan I bought from nvidia.com (Day 1 purchase) did not have geforce written anywhere on it. Perhaps the ones shipped directly from NVIDIA were different?
> 
> Looking at my maxwell Titan X box (also shipped from NVIDIA as a Day 1 purchase) no where does it say geforce on the box or card - simply "Titan X".
> 
> This whole thing couldn't be more confusing...


My OG Titans are EVGA SC models but all Titans were the same so I'd assume they all said GEFORCE GTX on the side like mine do.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> My OG Titans are EVGA SC models but all Titans were the same so I'd assume they all said GEFORCE GTX on the side like mine do.


Let's say you guys are right.

What does this mean for drivers? If the previous titans were still part of the Geforce lineup, and this new titan isn't...Doesn't that mean actual gaming drivers for it could be rather lacking? It'd be the same thing as buying a Quadro for gaming, sure it's technically more powerful but it's going to suck if gaming drivers suck.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mad Pistol*
> 
> Has anyone noticed that none of the pics/videos so far show the green "Geforce GTX" logo on the Titan XP?
> 
> I can't believe I am saying this... but I am officially intrigued.


I haven't even noticed! I hated that damn green logo. Throws off my rigs looks.


----------



## dVeLoPe

so this thing drops in august?

i havent recieved my card yet waitign on evga stepup for 2 months and it will probably be another month or two before i get my hands on it..

what yall think sell and get titanxp or whatever its gonna be called or keep and run sli 1080s till march 2017 when volta drops


----------



## x3sphere

I found an actual pic of the new card



So, it still does have the GEFORCE GTX logo on the side.

https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well, you know what I meant. Its a cut down of a cut down but its at least a big die Pascal and not an X60 card masquerading as an X80 like GP104...


I thought big die is around 600mm2. This one has 471mm2. Is it still a big die ? Thanks i try to understand


----------



## geort45

Damn Quadro with 24GB has been released :O


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Let's say you guys are right.
> 
> What does this mean for drivers? If the previous titans were still part of the Geforce lineup, and this new titan isn't...Doesn't that mean actual gaming drivers for it could be rather lacking? It'd be the same thing as buying a Quadro for gaming, sure it's technically more powerful but it's going to suck if gaming drivers suck.


lol relax

The true professionals (ie ones whose livelihood actually depended on their GPUs crunching accurate numbers) will always buy a Quadro or Tesla and won't bat an eyelash at any of the GeForce cards. nVidia can name strip the GeForce name all they want from this Titan X but it's still very much a consumer card, meaning gaming on it will be just fine.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Let's say you guys are right.
> 
> What does this mean for drivers? If the previous titans were still part of the Geforce lineup, and this new titan isn't...Doesn't that mean actual gaming drivers for it could be rather lacking? It'd be the same thing as buying a Quadro for gaming, sure it's technically more powerful but it's going to suck if gaming drivers suck.


I expect it would get same support as any other Pascal based Geforce GPUs lol. I think it is just marketing strategy seperating Titan as premium brand by itself.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> I found an actual pic of the new card
> 
> 
> 
> So, it still does have the GEFORCE GTX logo on the side.
> 
> https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


pass.....


----------



## Omicron

Yep, just like the document said, there was a 3840 shader core enabled version somewhere. The shader numbers on this "Titan" looked a bit off from the get go to be a full card.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> I found an actual pic of the new card
> 
> 
> 
> So, it still does have the GEFORCE GTX logo on the side.
> 
> https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


I didn't know Jürgen Klopp was a PC guy.


----------



## sepiashimmer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> I found an actual pic of the new card
> 
> 
> 
> So, it still does have the GEFORCE GTX logo on the side.
> 
> https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


Is that Mr. Jen-Hsun Huang's signature?


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> I found an actual pic of the new card
> 
> 
> 
> So, it still does have the GEFORCE GTX logo on the side.
> 
> https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


PS, drivers sold separately...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> I found an actual pic of the new card
> 
> 
> 
> So, it still does have the GEFORCE GTX logo on the side.
> 
> https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


If this guys so smart then why can't he figure out cable management? Hideous!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> If this guys so smart then why can't he figure out cable management? Hideous!


Probably is a bit more in-tune with the time spent/money spent/performance gained pyramid.
cable management is worthless unless you are trying to make your two friends that come over a year that actually know the difference between a dell bought from best buy and your computer happy...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Probably is a bit more in-tune with the time spent/money spent/performance gained pyramid.
> cable management is worthless unless you are trying to make your two friends that come over a year that actually know the difference between a dell bought from best buy and your computer happy...


Cable management is worthless? GET OUT!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Cable management is worthless? GET OUT!


YES, people spend all this $$$$ on fancy sleeving, matching fans and acrylic watercooling... Guess what... I have a second GTX 1080... end of story


----------



## chronicfx

Pretty vs. Performance


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Pretty vs. Performance


How about both?


----------



## skypine27

I like a little chaos with my cable management:


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Probably is a bit more in-tune with the time spent/money spent/performance gained pyramid.
> cable management is worthless unless you are trying to make your two friends that come over a year that actually know the difference between a dell bought from best buy and your computer happy...


Well cable management is probably not time/money efficient for that guy because he has much better things to do. This I can agree.

But cable management in general is NOT worthless.


----------



## Seyumi

You eventually grow out of the side window, cable management, and LED's everywhere phase just as kids did when they try to rice out their Hondas with chrome rims, stickers, and giant wings. I know I did, on both.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> You eventually grow out of the side window, cable management, and LED's everywhere phase just as kids did when they try to rice out their Hondas with chrome rims, stickers, and giant wings. I know I did, on both.


I always have to have a nice looking rig. Going on 20 years and counting.


----------



## Seyumi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I always have to have a nice looking rig. Going on 20 years and counting.


You must be young at heart







A spouse and 2 kids takes up enough of my time to worry about spending hours on cable management for <1% thermal performance. I upgrade my system constantly and found out I was spending more time tinkering with my computer instead of playing on it. Same goes with modding games. Spent more time debugging, troubleshooting, figuring out compatibility issues, etc. than playing the damn game itself. I gave that up too. Vanilla game & official DLC's only for me now.


----------



## looniam




----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> You must be young at heart
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A spouse and 2 kids takes up enough of my time to worry about spending hours on cable management for <1% thermal performance. I upgrade my system constantly and found out I was spending more time tinkering with my computer instead of playing on it. Same goes with modding games. Spent more time debugging, troubleshooting, figuring out compatibility issues, etc. than playing the damn game itself. I gave that up too. Vanilla game & official DLC's only for me now.


To be honest I spend more time window shopping instead of buying and building.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*


Ugh, that must belong to a hobo for sure.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*


damn son gun burn off dat sleeving on the CPU 8 pin


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skypine27*
> 
> I like a little chaos with my cable management:


That is a 7K RIG HOMEBOY! did not even check your profile.. Gorgeous! Not saying I don't respect it but I just cut it off at a certain point


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well we have been told so far that they are not making a GP100 GeForce card at all so we get GP102 instead. Of course who really believes that?


Isn't GP100 missing ROPs entirely?


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> EVGA Jacob just confirmed they're making Pascal Titan X Hybrid upgrade kits. No need to buy those gold 980Ti ones now or hack up a 1080 one.
> 
> http://forums.evga.com/FindPost/2520221


Very good. Cant help but wonder if these kits are required.
Not trusting Nvidias reference cooling for such a big chip


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> Isn't GP100 missing ROPs entirely?


I think so yeah. Plus as you pointed out the FP64 units would be utterly useless as well. But I'm not convinced they couldn't repurpose GP100 into a pure gaming GPU if they really wanted to.


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I think so yeah. Plus as you pointed out the FP64 units would be utterly useless as well. But I'm not convinced they couldn't repurpose GP100 into a pure gaming GPU if they really wanted to.


That's exactly what GP102 is Pure Gaming GPU striped down GP100 for gaming aka GP102


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> That's exactly what GP102 is Pure Gaming GPU striped down GP100 for gaming aka GP102***


*with the HBM memory controller swapped for a GDDR5X controller.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> That's exactly what GP102 is Pure Gaming GPU striped down GP100 for gaming aka GP102


I should've been more clear.

GP102 = 471 mm²
GP100 = 610 mm²

They lopped off the FP64 units but didn't add back anything. I'm talking about a theoretical 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 cores. _That_ would be worthy of the Titan name.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I should've been more clear.
> 
> GP102 = 471 mm²
> GP100 = 610 mm²
> 
> They lopped off the FP64 units but didn't add back anything. I'm talking about a theoretical 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 cores. _That_ would be worthy of the Titan name.


Yup, and an even MORE Titan price, which 90% of the people would complain about, while trying to figure which arm to sell in order to buy one...


----------



## magnek

AND not even a full chip, PLUS doesn't have 2x the vram.

Man this Titan XP just has fail written all over it (from the perspective of what one expects from a Titan product).


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I should've been more clear.
> 
> GP102 = 471 mm²
> GP100 = 610 mm²
> 
> They lopped off the FP64 units but didn't add back anything. I'm talking about a theoretical 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 cores. _That_ would be worthy of the Titan name.
> 
> 
> 
> Yup, and an even MORE Titan price, which 90% of the people would complain about, while trying to figure which arm to sell in order to buy one...
Click to expand...

I am sure they would still make money selling a 610mm² GP102+ for $1200, but even Pascal would go way over 250W with 5760 cores at 1700+ MHz.









I would really want one anyway!


----------



## magnek

As I stated in another thread, I wouldn't even _think_ twice about dishing about $2000 for a 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 shaders and 16GB HBM2. Like I would trample over you guys just so I could get the card 10 minutes earlier kind of want.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I should've been more clear.
> 
> GP102 = 471 mm²
> GP100 = 610 mm²
> 
> They lopped off the FP64 units but didn't add back anything. I'm talking about a theoretical 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 cores. _That_ would be worthy of the Titan name.


5760 would need 9 GPC which would be weird. 5120 cores is the max from a die size standpoint, IMO. Even 5120 cores would smash into the TDP limit pretty hard and require an AIO cooler for significant gains against GP102.

The 2nd part makes me think we just wont see 5120 cores happen until Volta. They need another efficiency boost first.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I am sure they would still make money selling a 610mm² GP102+ for $1200, but even Pascal would go way over 250W with 5760 cores at 1700+ MHz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would really want one anyway!


It could have a TDP of 500W and I wouldn't bat an eyelash. My body wallet loop is ready.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> 5760 would need 9 GPC which would be weird. 5120 cores is the max from a die size standpoint, IMO. Even 5120 cores would smash into the TDP limit pretty hard and require an AIO cooler for significant gains against GP102.
> 
> The 2nd part makes me think we just wont see 5120 cores happen until Volta. They need another efficiency boost first.


Yeah, they almost never make GPUs that require custom loops to properly cool.


----------



## magnek

Console Air cooling peasants.









I kid I kid


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> *with the HBM memory controller swapped for a GDDR5X controller.


How does the GTX 1080 scale with memory overclocks?


----------



## magnek

Memory OC barely does anything apparently according to Anandtech:



*SAUCE*


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> *with the HBM memory controller swapped for a GDDR5X controller.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How does the GTX 1080 scale with memory overclocks?
Click to expand...

I suppose swapping HBM for GDDR5X could be thought of as part of stripping down for gaming? I don't think this Titan will be bottlenecked in games by its 480 GB/s.


----------



## renejr902

If they release a 5120 cores and hbm2 titan in the next 6-12 months , i will regret to have bought this 3584 cores titan x for 1200$. I want and need this titan x but its not worth his money.

the next titan if it has 5120 cores and hbm2 , i guess the price will be at least 1500$? Right ? 2000$+?


----------



## magnek

Don't hold your breath for a 5120 core Titan with HBM2, that would be giving away way too much performance way too early, and it'd be hard to get these buyers to upgrade again. And of course as mentioned, probably not possible to fit within 250W TDP without severely reducing clockspeeds. We were all talking in theoreticals, this 5120 Titan will not be a thing.


----------



## JakdMan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I should've been more clear.
> 
> GP102 = 471 mm²
> GP100 = 610 mm²
> 
> They lopped off the FP64 units but didn't add back anything. I'm talking about a theoretical 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 cores. _That_ would be worthy of the Titan name.


BUMP THAT! Keep the FP64 units and there's our theoretical Pacal Titan Black. A real Titan successor and not just this money grab of the gamers they've started.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well we have been told so far that they are not making a GP100 GeForce card at all so we get GP102 instead. Of course who really believes that?
> 
> Then again, they are saying this new Titan will not be a GeForce card but its certainly not a Quadro so what the hell is it exactly? *With gimped DP performance its not a professional level card so its absolutely a gaming card in my opinion.* Claims by Nvidia to the contrary are just marketing noise it would seem...


To be fair the Quadros they just released use this chip and their stated FP64 performance is only 1/32,just as the maxwell Quadros. If that doesn't show what kind of reshuffling Nvidia are going for IDK. Even the 'light-core' professionals that used to rely on the quadros DP are forced into thr more expensive Tessla territory.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Memory OC barely does anything apparently according to Anandtech:
> 
> 
> 
> *SAUCE*


Not that much point in HBM then. Consumer Pascal isn't benefiting from the lower latency or higher bandwidth from overclocking, and the FLOPS to bandwidth ratio isn't going to change with GP102.

Maybe HBM will free up enough power to make a 300W 5120 core Titan XXX. One X for each 1.2K USD


----------



## Clocknut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I should've been more clear.
> 
> GP102 = 471 mm²
> GP100 = 610 mm²
> 
> They lopped off the FP64 units but didn't add back anything. I'm talking about a theoretical 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 cores. _That_ would be worthy of the Titan name.


you get one if AMD ......ever release a Radeon that beat GP102 b4 volta come.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Don't hold your breath for a 5120 core Titan with HBM2, that would be giving away way too much performance way too early, and it'd be hard to get these buyers to upgrade again. And of course as mentioned, probably not possible to fit within 250W TDP without severely reducing clockspeeds. We were all talking in theoreticals, this 5120 Titan will not be a thing.


thanks to let me know


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Not that much point in HBM then. Consumer Pascal isn't benefiting from the lower latency or higher bandwidth from overclocking, and the FLOPS to bandwidth ratio isn't going to change with GP102.
> 
> Maybe HBM will free up enough power to make a 300W 5120 core Titan XXX. One X for each 1.2K USD


Me too i think hbm2 could be useless with gp102. Volta should benefit from hbm2


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Not that much point in HBM then. Consumer Pascal isn't benefiting from the lower latency or higher bandwidth from overclocking, and the FLOPS to bandwidth ratio isn't going to change with GP102.
> 
> Maybe HBM will free up enough power to make a 300W 5120 core Titan XXX. One X for each 1.2K USD


This is why pascal didn't get HBM2 I think. It would have drastically increased prices for minor <10% overall improvements.


----------



## Defoler

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> This is why pascal didn't get HBM2 I think. It would have drastically increased prices for minor <10% overall improvements.


Well the teslas pascal do have HBM2. Maybe you mean anything but the server hardware.

But most likely yeah price has a factor here. And the workstations would benefit more from the extra memory over the extra bandwidth (I'm sure it is easier to stick 24GB of GDDR5X for a movie compiling with extreme textures and get more benefit than 16GB of HBM2).
It could also be that not enough yield for HBM2 is available yet, which is the reason only the teslas are getting it for now, which cause the GDDR5X price to be more affordable as well, especially if AMD are also pushing demand for their next cards.


----------



## guttheslayer

I cannot believe how much revenue nvidia is earning and milking right now...

A 470mm chip that can goes as high as $5000 for professional segment while the failed part with neutered cores are selling for $1200 as a gaming card.

Wow. They sure can go to saturn moon, titan this time!


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> They sure can go to saturn moon, titan this time!


Huang will wear his leather jacket over the space suit


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Huang will wear his leather jacket over the space suit


For those fear mongers who are afraid titan x might get bottleneck by bandwidth. It wont happen. In fact tx is fed with 50% more bandwidth despite being only 25% faster as compared to 1080. In contrast overclocking the 3584 cores to 2ghz at stock memory bandwith you are still fed almost the same as 1080 with 10% memory oc on 2ghz core


----------



## ChevChelios

yeah Pascal doesnt need more bandwidth

HBM2 would only serve to save power, but at the cost of increasing price


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> If this guys so smart then why can't he figure out cable management? Hideous!


This guy is working not playing like you do, his PC is fine. Your remark is dumb and makes no sense, are you jelly or what ?


----------



## Ghoxt

While looking at this youtube vid on the Pascal Titan X the author makes a point that the new Titan XP in his Logarithmetic projections would do approx 24059 in Firestrike.

[Youtube] Titan X Preview source



I took this one step further using nearly the same methods and asked what if we got the Full chip of 3840 cuda cores. And this is where I need your help as the figure seems low initially but i'm not sure. You guys are better at log math than i am, even with google search on excel functions









My graph looked like this: Titan X Black 3840 Cuda Cores using *"only a Trendline in Excel". * Help



I ask does this make any sense at all for a guess of a guess lol? Also if the full unblemished chip would only provide a marginal increase would it even be worth it to provide the full 3840 cores, for gamers...


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> ... would it even be worth it to provide the full 3840 cores, for gamers...


Either not featuring the full number of cores is so they can hold something in their back pocket to release at a later date as a more powerful product.

... or ...

Their yields of GP102 are such that they cannot generate sufficient quantities with all 3840 cores operational to make supply of such a product viable. So they chose to reduce the requirement slightly so that the number of chips they yield with 3584 working Cuda cores give sufficient supply for the number products they expect to sell.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> This guy is working not playing like you do, his PC is fine. Your remark is dumb and makes no sense, are you jelly or what ?


Your sarcasm detector needs serious fixing....


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Well at GP102 stand between 100 and 104 so it's not a true high end card. Even at 102 size they can get close to 5K Cuda cores.


There is no where to put any more cores, past 3840, on the GP102 die. It's FP64 capabilities are already nearly completely stripped, along with virtually all of GP100's professional/HPC features.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well we have been told so far that they are not making a GP100 GeForce card at all so we get GP102 instead. Of course who really believes that?


The only thing a GP100 GeForce would offer over a GP102 is better FP64 and HBM2. It would probably cost a lot more, and not offer much in the way of improved gaming performance. A GeForce card for just FP64 would be an extremely niche product, far more so than past Titans.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Let's say you guys are right.
> 
> What does this mean for drivers? If the previous titans were still part of the Geforce lineup, and this new titan isn't...Doesn't that mean actual gaming drivers for it could be rather lacking? It'd be the same thing as buying a Quadro for gaming, sure it's technically more powerful but it's going to suck if gaming drivers suck.


Architecture is the same, all they'd need to do is stick the GP100 hardware IDs in the GeForce drivers. Zero reason why the current core GTX 1080 drivers couldn't be used with any hypothetical Pascal part.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> Isn't GP100 missing ROPs entirely?


I doubt it. It's possible if it's only a Tesla compute part, but there will almost certainly be GP100 Quadros at some point.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I think so yeah. Plus as you pointed out the FP64 units would be utterly useless as well. But I'm not convinced they couldn't repurpose GP100 into a pure gaming GPU if they really wanted to.


You can't repurpose a part that lacks ROPs as a gaming part without a significant redesign. They aren't going to make yet another Pascal design for the 0.001% of the market that wants a 2500 dollar GeForce.

Either GP100 has all it needs to be an actual GPU and not just a compute accelerator, or GP102 is the biggest Pascal part that will ever be put on something with display outputs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'm talking about a theoretical 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 cores. _That_ would be worthy of the Titan name.


That would be another major redesign and isn't going to happen to Pascal.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Memory OC barely does anything apparently according to Anandtech


More than I was expecting.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Me too i think hbm2 could be useless with gp102.


I doubt they even left HBM support (PHYs/controllers) in GP102.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Your sarcasm detector needs serious fixing....


Oops, sarcasm detector fixing in progress...please wait


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Their yields of GP102 are such that they cannot generate sufficient quantities with all 3840 cores operational to make supply of such a product viable. So they chose to reduce the requirement slightly so that the number of chips they yield with 3584 working Cuda cores give sufficient supply for the number products they expect to sell.


It's for sure this.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> You are correct. Well at least everyone will know that their Titan-XP GPU is Gimped from day one at a premium of $1200 lol.
> 
> I just don't feel right paying a premium for a cut chip any more. Basically it's not the best Nvidia could offer on that die and not worthy of the Titan name regardless of the performance. With Die Shrink, new Architecture, and GDDR5X memory it's supposed to surpass the last generation so this is no surprise.


This right here. This is why people should be upset. I mean $1200 is worth being upset over, but the fact that this is nothing but a 1080Ti(basically) being a called a Titan should piss everyone off.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Either not featuring the full number of cores is so they can hold something in their back pocket to release at a later date as a more powerful product.


They're simply maximizing profits given the current market conditions (lack of competition). Use the Quadro rejects for this card. These are practically "free" GPUs; they would be written off otherwise.

I think we will see a big Pascal Titan (full GP102) and I also think we'll see a 1080 Ti. Give it some time.







One caveat though; if AMD steps up this may change. If that happens it's possible we'll see a full GP102 1080 Ti just like the quick 780 Ti intro when AMD stepped up last time.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> I ask does this make any sense at all for a guess of a guess lol? Also if the full unblemished chip would only provide a marginal increase would it even be worth it to provide the full 3840 cores, for gamers...


Your math is fine. Another issue comes with power consumption, which I think something we also forget - with HBM2, you can push the envelope of the thermal budget. A good reason this Titan XP is cut down is because of margin removed without the efficiency of HBM2. You can't maintain 3840 core part, with FP64, on such a strict budget with a stock cooler. This thing will run warm, like the Maxwell Titan X even with a cut down core because of the margin removed without HBM2.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> They're simply maximizing profits given the current market conditions (lack of competition). Use the Quadro rejects for this card. These are practically "free" GPUs; they would be written off otherwise.
> 
> I think we will see a big Pascal Titan (full GP102) and I also think we'll see a 1080 Ti. Give it some time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One caveat though; if AMD steps up this may change. If that happens it's possible we'll see a full GP102 1080 Ti just like the quick 780 Ti intro when AMD stepped up last time.


I don't think we'll see a full GP102 - I mean, would an extra 256 Cuda cores really make that big a difference?. It's only an extra 7% A 1080 Ti is more of a possibility, because they'll go for the consumer double dip. If AMD steps up, that might change a little. Nvidia's possible ace-in-the-hole which I think they'll only produce if AMD put up a big enough challenge is GP100, but I recognise this might be a stretch. Otherwise, I think they'll be content to concentrate on Volta on 16nm for mid 2017.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> You are correct. Well at least everyone will know that their Titan-XP GPU is Gimped from day one at a premium of $1200 lol.
> 
> I just don't feel right paying a premium for a cut chip any more. Basically it's not the best Nvidia could offer on that die and not worthy of the Titan name regardless of the performance. With Die Shrink, new Architecture, and GDDR5X memory it's supposed to surpass the last generation so this is no surprise.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This right here. This is why people should be upset. I mean $1200 is worth being upset over, but the fact that this is nothing but a 1080Ti(basically) being a called a Titan should piss everyone off.
Click to expand...

yep. was ready to hit that notify me button until i compared specs and then recalling how GP104 is still w/o bios modding; sanity was restored. last year i was playing TW3 and was ready to dump ~$1000 on card but this year w/DOOM . . i can wait.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I don't think we'll see a full GP102 - I mean, would an extra 256 Cuda cores really make that big a difference?. It's only an extra 7% A 1080 Ti is more of a possibility, because they'll go for the consumer double dip. If AMD steps up, that might change a little. Nvidia's possible ace-in-the-hole which I think they'll only produce if AMD put up a big enough challenge is GP100, but I recognise this might be a stretch. Otherwise, I think they'll be content to concentrate on Volta on 16nm for mid 2017.


I agree. I still feel this Titan will be the top dog until Volta.

With some sites reporting Volta coming in ~May 2017, that's only 10 months. I doubt they try to squeeze a full chip in there. At most we'll probably see a 1080Ti with roughly the same performance in 3-6 months.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I don't think we'll see a full GP102 - I mean, would an extra 256 Cuda cores really make that big a difference?. It's only an extra 7% A 1080 Ti is more of a possibility, because they'll go for the consumer double dip. If AMD steps up, that might change a little. Nvidia's possible ace-in-the-hole which I think they'll only produce if AMD put up a big enough challenge is GP100, but I recognise this might be a stretch. Otherwise, I think they'll be content to concentrate on Volta on 16nm for mid 2017.


Agree with this.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I agree. I still feel this Titan will be the top dog until Volta.
> 
> With some sites reporting Volta coming in ~May 2017, that's only 10 months. I doubt they try to squeeze a full chip in there. At most we'll probably see a 1080Ti with roughly the same performance in 3-6 months.


I agree. Going to get two also?


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I don't think we'll see a full GP102 - I mean, would an extra 256 Cuda cores really make that big a difference?. It's only an extra 7% A 1080 Ti is more of a possibility, because they'll go for the consumer double dip. If AMD steps up, that might change a little. Nvidia's possible ace-in-the-hole which I think they'll only produce if AMD put up a big enough challenge is GP100, but I recognise this might be a stretch. Otherwise, I think they'll be content to concentrate on Volta on 16nm for mid 2017.


Performance difference really depends on if there is more cut out than just 256 cuda cores. Im with you that if it is only those small number of cores then performance wont be much different, 1-2fps tops. But if the Titan X is also missing a section of say 8 ROPs and a small bit of TMUs then performance could be as much as 15% higher. Still not huge, but something more than "insignificant".


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EniGma1987*
> 
> Performance difference really depends on if there is more cut out than just 256 cuda cores. Im with you that if it is only those small number of cores then performance wont be much different, 1-2fps tops. But if the Titan X is also missing a section of say 8 ROPs and a small bit of TMUs then performance could be as much as 15% higher. Still not huge, but something more than "insignificant".


Yes. Number of Cuda cores is not a direct measure of performance because there are other factors that are needed to tell the whole story. But I still don't think we'll see another GPU product above the Titan XP unless AMD comes out with something in that performance bracket in such as way that it endangers Nvidia's market share.


----------



## geort45

I'm making some graphs comparing the nVidia series, release price vs relative performance, for the moment I have the release price chart:


----------



## Eorzean

^Thanks for posting this. Honestly, anyone buying Nvidia cards since the 780 are to blame (myself included). Though, some people with too much money to burn didn't really help with setting the Titan precedent. If you were ever buying that tier, I'm surprised that you *weren't* expecting even higher prices this time around. With zero competition, Nvidia has a license to kill, so either nut up (and vote with your wallets), or shaddup.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I'm making some graphs comparing the nVidia series, release price vs relative performance, for the moment I have the release price chart:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Geort45's Exciting Graph


Any reason why your Series 10 datapoints aren't joined up on that graph? Actually there are a few data series missing the odd line here and there.

That aside. I get the jist. Well done and thanks.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Any reason why your Series 10 datapoints aren't joined up on that graph? Actually there are a few data series missing the odd line here and there.
> 
> That aside. I get the jist.


Anytime there is a gap in the lineup there isn't a line, Nvidia skips/adds random models sometimes.


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Bingo! Jen-Hsun said in the video for this Titan that the market doesn't set the price for this gpu. The competition does. Until Amd starts to focus on PC gaming again we're all screwed on getting reasonable prices. Remember the days of getting a flagship single gpu at $500. Hard to imagine within 3 years we're sitting at $1200. Amd has screwed us all. I saw it coming years ago. Call me a fanboy but that's why I refuse to put their product into my rig. They're a train wreck and have been for many years.


Jen-Hsun is a liar. It has nothing to do with the lack of competition from AMD.

The consumer has the power especially in this case as this commodity is not necessary for life.

We have the power, but we give it away. Don't be fooled with what they teach you in school about monopolies or duopolies.

We have the power and we always will. It's just about using that power to bring corporations to their knees. If only everyone had the will and impulse control to do so. They know we are weak minded and we prove it to them everyday.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I'm making some graphs comparing the nVidia series, release price vs relative performance, for the moment I have the release price chart:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


How will you be calculating relative performance?


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I'm making some graphs comparing the nVidia series, release price vs relative performance, for the moment I have the release price chart:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Geort45's Exciting Graph
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any reason why your Series 10 datapoints aren't joined up on that graph? Actually there are a few data series missing the odd line here and there.
> 
> That aside. I get the jist. Well done and thanks.
Click to expand...

They dont connect cause theres no data in between example no 770Ti to connect 780 to 770. But I could connect it if its clearer

For the moment it seems series 10 aint the more expensive, there are spikes before that.

Im filling out benchmarks for all the cards, its very rough of course, I cant fill out 20 benchs for each card, Im picking 3 benchs for each series with at least 1 in common with the previous series


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> I'm making some graphs comparing the nVidia series, release price vs relative performance, for the moment I have the release price chart:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How will you be calculating relative performance?
Click to expand...

It will be just estimates, as I just posted (didnt see your post before) I pick 3 benchs for each series and make them relative to the X80 of that series, which will be 100%, and average for each card. Then I do the same for the NEXT series but carrying the x80 of the previous generation which review sites always put in for comparison, because there could be CPU upgrades in the test bench, then I repeat the same process as previously described.

I hope I made myself more and less clear


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> It will be just estimates, as I just posted (didnt see your post before) I pick 3 benchs for each series and make them relative to the X80 of that series, which will be 100%, and average for each card. Then I do the same for the NEXT series but carrying the x80 of the previous generation which review sites always put in for comparison, because there could be CPU upgrades in the test bench, then I repeat the same process as previously described.
> 
> I hope I made myself more and less clear


How are you accounting for the shift up in the naming scheme over generations? For example, GTX 560 Ti --> GTX 680 or GTX 580 --> GTX 780 Ti


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Bingo! Jen-Hsun said in the video for this Titan that the market doesn't set the price for this gpu. The competition does. Until Amd starts to focus on PC gaming again we're all screwed on getting reasonable prices. Remember the days of getting a flagship single gpu at $500. Hard to imagine within 3 years we're sitting at $1200. Amd has screwed us all. I saw it coming years ago. Call me a fanboy but that's why I refuse to put their product into my rig. They're a train wreck and have been for many years.
> 
> 
> 
> Jen-Hsun is a liar. It has nothing to do with the lack of competition from AMD.
> 
> The consumer has the power especially in this case as this commodity is not necessary for life.
> 
> We have the power, but we give it away. Don't be fooled with what they teach you in school about monopolies or duopolies.
> 
> We have the power and we always will. It's just about using that power to bring corporations to their knees. If only everyone had the will and impulse control to do so. They know we are weak minded and we prove it to them everyday.
Click to expand...

I was previously mocking in this thread cause my intuition told me if it aint worth for me, people with common sense will not buy it if it aint worth to them, and if they got the money they will buy it and I wouldnt care either way

However the problem is that maybe there are many people willing to buy because they have too much money to burn and others could bend over a little and take it... but maybe they arent as few people as I thought so theyre driving the market at least a little

Im doing the graphs to have a clearer vision on what were being offered, so we don't bend over as a whole


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> It will be just estimates, as I just posted (didnt see your post before) I pick 3 benchs for each series and make them relative to the X80 of that series, which will be 100%, and average for each card. Then I do the same for the NEXT series but carrying the x80 of the previous generation which review sites always put in for comparison, because there could be CPU upgrades in the test bench, then I repeat the same process as previously described.
> 
> I hope I made myself more and less clear
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How are you accounting for the shift up in the naming scheme over generations? For example, GTX 560 Ti --> GTX 680 or GTX 580 --> GTX 780 Ti
Click to expand...

Name shifting? Do you mean like 480 is as fast as 570 for example?

My sheet is in fact ordered by name models, but what will end driving the charts will be the price/performance so IMO it will not matter much hmmm let me meditate


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> How are you accounting for the shift up in the naming scheme over generations? For example, GTX 560 Ti --> GTX 680 or GTX 580 --> GTX 780 Ti












Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Name shifting? Do you mean like 480 is as fast as 570 for example?
> 
> My sheet is in fact ordered by name models, but what will end driving the charts will be the price/performance so IMO it will not matter much hmmm let me meditate


Basically the x60/x70/x80 cards we have now are not the true x60/x70/x80 cards of years ago. For instance today's Titan would have been the x80 of the 5 series. Nvidia added two sku's at the bottom of the stack and moved everything up two tiers. (570 = 1080Ti , GTX 580 = Titan XP)


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Name shifting? Do you mean like 480 is as fast as 570 for example?
> 
> My sheet is in fact ordered by name models, but what will end driving the charts will be the price/performance so IMO it will not matter much hmmm let me meditate


You will not have accurate reading across the generations if you set the 100% as the X80 of each series. X80 used to be the top of the line. It is no longer the case. X80 is now the mid-grade chips. If you want a fair assessment of relative performance per generation you can either compare it to the flagship of said generation or the flagship of the previous generation.

Also, the 6 and 7 series cards are the same generation. The GTX 770 is just a rebranded GTX 680 and so forth. The high end chips were released in the 7 series but not in the 6 series.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Name shifting? Do you mean like 480 is as fast as 570 for example?
> 
> My sheet is in fact ordered by name models, but what will end driving the charts will be the price/performance so IMO it will not matter much hmmm let me meditate
> 
> 
> 
> You will not have accurate reading across the generations if you set the 100% as the X80 of each series. X80 used to be the top of the line. It is no longer the case. X80 is now the mid-grade chips. If you want a fair assessment of relative performance per generation you can either compare it to the flagship of said generation or the flagship of the previous generation.
Click to expand...

So you suggest I compare against x80 ti as soon as it exists and titans as soon as they appear?

I just finished series 4 and 5, but I dont know how to include the Titan and Titan black, is the black just a faster clocked titan1?


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> So you suggest I compare against x80 ti as soon as it exists and titans as soon as they appear?
> 
> I just finished series 4 and 5, but I dont know how to include the Titan and Titan black, is the black just a faster clocked titan1?


Titan Black is the full chip. Titan was partially cut down.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically the x60/x70/x80 cards we have now are not the true x60/x70/x80 cards of years ago. For instance today's Titan would have been the x80 of the 5 series. Nvidia added two sku's at the bottom of the stack and moved everything up two tiers. (570 = 1080Ti , *GTX 580 = Titan XP*)


The Titan X Pascal skew is now equivalent to a GTX 570. It's a cut-down flagship like the 570 was.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Name shifting? Do you mean like 480 is as fast as 570 for example?
> 
> My sheet is in fact ordered by name models, but what will end driving the charts will be the price/performance so IMO it will not matter much hmmm let me meditate
> 
> 
> 
> You will not have accurate reading across the generations if you set the 100% as the X80 of each series. X80 used to be the top of the line. It is no longer the case. X80 is now the mid-grade chips. If you want a fair assessment of relative performance per generation you can either compare it to the flagship of said generation or the flagship of the previous generation.
> 
> Also, the 6 and 7 series cards are the same generation. The GTX 770 is just a rebranded GTX 680 and so forth. The high end chips were released in the 7 series but not in the 6 series.
Click to expand...

Interesting

i have to find way to lets say stablish that from one generation to the next has to be a 20% perf increase for SAME price, regardless of model name. Like stablishing an overall score that carries across al generations. A 770 shouldnt cost more at release than a 680 for example


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> So you suggest I compare against x80 ti as soon as it exists and titans as soon as they appear?
> 
> I just finished series 4 and 5, but I dont know how to include the Titan and Titan black, is the black just a faster clocked titan1?
> 
> 
> 
> Titan Black is the full chip. Titan was partially cut down.
Click to expand...

Arent the new quadros basically the full chips of this gen? P6000


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Arent the new quadros basically the full chips of this gen? P6000


The P6000 is a full chip. Titan XP is not. As i7monkey stated, the Titan XP is akin to a GTX 570.

I would still suggest comparing each card in a generation to the previous generation flagship and then divide that value by price.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Well guys, if 1080Ti is full GP102 like P6000, prepare to wait for a very VERY long time for the 1080Ti.
Maxwell was probably a one time episode. Look at GTX Titan and GTX 780Ti and how long they were apart


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> The Titan X Pascal skew is now equivalent to a GTX 570. It's a cut-down flagship like the 570 was.


True, but he/she was already confused I am sure.









It was close enough for the point I was trying to make.


----------



## Seyumi

I think it's safe to say we're reaching the max consumer price for Titan cards the middle class is willing to spend. I've owned all the Titan cards except the Black and I've seen more outcry on the pricing for this card more than all the other Titan series combined. I'd say $1500 is the point where Nvidia might start seeing a massive drop in sales and may have to price cut. It's inevitable going to be the next Titan price most likely.

The first Titan got a free pass since they legitimately made it a professional / workstation GPU as well. I guess it was all smoke & mirrors since they haven't done that ever since.

The only reason why this Titan pricing is acceptable for me is because I only need 2 GPU's now for *my* minimum requirements (4k 60 FPS minimum on max settings) which previously took 3-4 GPU's prior that inturn cost even more. This is of course until next gen games and/or 4k 120hz monitors come out though which we may see by 2017~2018.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Well guys, if 1080Ti is full GP102 like P6000, prepare to wait for a very VERY long time for the 1080Ti.
> Maxwell was probably a one time episode. Look at GTX Titan and GTX 780Ti and how long they were apart


780 Ti only existed because 290X took the performance crown from OG Titan, and JHH would rather die from hyperthermia due to wearing a leather jacket in a 100F/37.8C environment than let AMD take the performance crown.

I *guaran-damn-tee* you that if Vega doesn't smash Titan XP to bits, there will NOT be a "full 1080 Ti". Ever. (they may still release a full GP102 and call it Titan X Black and charge $1500 for it though)


----------



## zGunBLADEz

so in the end theres no point on getting this card...

So we already established this is a cut chip TI for $1200???

So nvidia can spin XD

But you know its ok to give nvidia our monies XD


----------



## stryker7314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> so in the end theres no point on getting this card...
> 
> So we already established this is a cut chip TI for $1200???
> 
> So nvidia can spin XD
> 
> But you know its ok to give nvidia our monies XD


Exactly. Not getting my dinero, OG Titan X will be in my sig rig for another year.

Tsk, Tsk, if Nvidia had just made it a full chip I woulda been all in, their loss.


----------



## geort45

I'm continuing the analysis, but it's subjective. We can analyze benchmarks as pure numbers, however the model scheme of nvidia and consumer expectations introduce subjectiveness.

For example, a 980 costed $549. A 1080 is $599. Do you expect a 10% increase in performance because that's the ratio of the prices? If the 1080 was named 980 Ti, you'd be happy maybe, but because the naming is 1080 you expect much more. Of course it's not a matter of just naming, but since it's a new architecture you increase your expectations.

I'm comparing 570 vs 470 for example. Around 30% faster. Are you willing to pay 30% more for it? You rationalize that about a year has passed, so it has to be the same price because they're both X70. What if the 570 was 70% faster than the 470? Do you still expect the same price? How much % increase in performance do you expect at the same price, from one year to the other? Let's assume 570 is 70% faster and 70% more expensive than the 470, but a 560 Ti is introduced which is 30% faster and 30% more expensive than the 470. Do you still feel ripped off? I mean, you kind of want the same-level card, you want a 570 but feel nVidia is bending you over because it costs so much more, although it's considerably faster too.

Now suppose that imaginary 570 is just 40% faster but 70% more expensive than the 470. And the aforementioned imaginary 560 Ti doesn't exist. So you're stuck in your decision Let's change those percentages to 40% and 50% respectively. It starts to make sense, but it's all relative from one person to another. And you still will have to pay more.

What are we expecting? That every year the top-end GPU costs $699? That there's at least a 25% increase in performance at the same price? What if superior models are introduced that surpass that 25%? It's a well know fact that the speed and sales price don't go linearly, top CPUs cost much more than a little slower ones. Are we pissed that the $1200 TitanXP is not 100% faster than the 1080? The Quadro P6000 it's gonna cost how much, $1600? $1800? Would it triple performance compared to 1080, even with its 24GB? Of course we don't expect 200% performance out of double price, but a more consumer-friendly ratio. What ratio is that?

It's all relative, I ain't defending nVidia, I'm just trying to anchor my analysis in something. Still filling out this spreadsheet....


----------



## DADDYDC650

^Point me to a $599 GTX 1080.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> The Titan X Pascal skew is now equivalent to a GTX 570. It's a cut-down flagship like the 570 was.


It's not the same thing. Titan X and GTX 570 have nothing in common. GTX480 probably. GTX570 Reference had power delivery problems and only 320-Bit.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> ^Point me to a $599 GTX 1080.


LOL That is what you took away from that post?!

Replace $599 with whatever you think a GTX 1080 costs and reread it.


----------



## geort45

LOL at the "exciting graph" quote BTW hahahha


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> As I stated in another thread, I wouldn't even _think_ twice about dishing about $2000 for a 610mm² pure gaming GPU with 5760 shaders and 16GB HBM2. Like I would trample over you guys just so I could get the card 10 minutes earlier kind of want.


Ironically, in 12 months when such a card comes out for $1,200.....you will be complaining that its overpriced


----------



## magnek

I'm just gonna quote myself here:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Because
> a) it's the beginning of the product cycle and
> b) the beginning of a new node as well (the most important part)
> 
> Kepler sucked because OG Titan took 11 months to release after 680, and 780 Ti took another 9 months after that (so 20 months after 680). Likewise with Maxwell nVidia sandbagged Titan X for 6 months and 980 Ti for 8 after 980.
> 
> *Being able to tap the full potential of a chip design from the get go means you get more time to enjoy your product.* And if 28nm has taught us anything, it's that 16nm is likely here to stay for a while. *So a chip that pushes the node to its limit from the outset means you can pretty much just sit back and enjoy the fireworks.* It's basically like buying the 2600K of GPUs.
> 
> But obviously this would be much less preferable than if you could get people to upgrade every cycle, so you drip-feed performance instead of going all-out from the get go. Hence my comments.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> LOL That is what you took away from that post?!
> 
> Replace $599 with whatever you think a GTX 1080 costs and reread it.


Just pointing out a very big flaw in your statement.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Just pointing out a very big flaw in your statement.


My statement?

It wasn't a big flaw in geort45's statment, the exact price the 1080 sells for is not important and does not change the point being made. Your correction was completely irrelevant to the point being made by geort45.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> My statement?
> 
> It wasn't a big flaw in geort45's statment, the exact price the 1080 sells for is not important and does not change the point being made. Your correction was completely irrelevant to the point being made by geort45.


Correction's are always welcome. Sorry if that upsets you bud.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Correction's are always welcome. Sorry if that upsets you bud.


Sorry, it just seemed so pointless and irrelevant given the point being made.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> Sorry, it just seemed so pointless and irrelevant given the point being made.


Didn't mean to sound like a jerk.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> so in the end theres no point on getting this card...
> 
> So we already established this is a cut chip TI for $1200???
> 
> So nvidia can spin XD
> 
> But you know its ok to give nvidia our monies XD


Not necessarily. 980ti did not trump Titan X until it hit LN2 and even then, you had to have a very nice chip( 2000mhz). 1550mhz Titan X still beat 1800mhz 980ti.
Most went to 980ti only because of AIB cards. Vanilla 980ti still couldn't touch Titan X without heavy mods. Guarantee Titan XP will set world records.


----------



## carlhil2

Once TXP hit, in about a months time, there will be no 1080s in the HOF top 100......I am talking single gpu..


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Not necessarily. 980ti did not trump Titan X until it hit LN2 and even then, you had to have a very nice chip( 2000mhz). 1550mhz Titan X still beat 1800mhz 980ti.
> Most went to 980ti only because of AIB cards. Vanilla 980ti still couldn't touch Titan X without heavy mods. Guarantee Titan XP will set world records.


What in the hell? Clock for clock Titan X could be theoretically up to 9% faster, but in actuality you never see that much gain, typically 5-7% at best.

Here's a Fire Strike run with a Titan X @ 1500/8200 vs my 980 Ti @ 1500/8000

http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/5160196/fs/8618775#

Even with a +200 advantage on memory the Titan X only has a 4.5% higher graphics score. Not sure where you got 1550 MHz Titan X = 1800 MHz 980 Ti from.


----------



## SuperZan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> What in the hell? Clock for clock Titan X could be theoretically up to 9% faster, but in actuality you never see that much gain, typically 5-7% at best.
> 
> Here's a Fire Strike run with a Titan X @ 1500/8200 vs my 980 Ti @ 1500/8000
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/5160196/fs/8618775#
> 
> Even with a +200 advantage on memory the Titan X only has a 4.5% higher graphics score. Not sure where you got 1550 MHz Titan X = 1800 MHz 980 Ti from.


I believe that would be the expected result if using leather-jacket maths.


----------



## looniam

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_-_fire_strike_ultra/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20









http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/6491528/fs/7514867#


----------



## roberta507

Guess I'll stick with my 980Ti
http://s1273.photobucket.com/user/roberta507/media/Firestrike 18341_zpsymuu4ztl.png.html


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Let's say you guys are right.
> 
> What does this mean for drivers? If the previous titans were still part of the Geforce lineup, and this new titan isn't...Doesn't that mean actual gaming drivers for it could be rather lacking? It'd be the same thing as buying a Quadro for gaming, sure it's technically more powerful but it's going to suck if gaming drivers suck.


The "Titan XP is not a GeForce card and is intended for professional use" line from Nvidia is simply marketing. This card IS a GeForce product and will get GeForce drivers...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eorzean*
> 
> ^Thanks for posting this. Honestly, anyone buying Nvidia cards since the 780 are to blame (myself included). Though, some people with too much money to burn didn't really help with setting the Titan precedent. If you were ever buying that tier, I'm surprised that you *weren't* expecting even higher prices this time around. With zero competition, Nvidia has a license to kill, so either nut up (and vote with your wallets), or shaddup.


I agree and I am totally complicit in this with my purchase of two Titans back in March 2013. At the time I figured I'd use the cards for years to justify the cost (which I have done) but it still sent way the wrong message to Nvidia. Of course now everybody constantly calls me out as a hypocrite when I complain about their current pricing even though I have admitted countless times that I am guilty of having bought OG Titans but oh well...


----------



## guttheslayer

How about doing a chart with die size vs price? Now that will be very very interesting!


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I agree and I am totally complicit in this with my purchase of two Titans back in March 2013. At the time I figured I'd use the cards for years to justify the cost (which I have done) but it still sent way the wrong message to Nvidia. Of course now everybody constantly calls me out as a hypocrite when I complain about their current pricing even though I have admitted countless times that I am guilty of having bought OG Titans but oh well...


*puts hand up*

Haha, me too. Guilty as charged.


----------



## BrotherBeast

Just bought a EVGA FTW 1080.Probably gonna be my last Nvidia card I buy.The debacle that is the Titan XXX is the final straw for me.Nvidia has the fastest cards without a doubt and they know this and they're literally asking customers to swallow buckets of bull crap for them.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> 780 Ti only existed because 290X took the performance crown from OG Titan, and JHH would rather die from hyperthermia due to wearing a leather jacket in a 100F/37.8C environment than let AMD take the performance crown.
> 
> I *guaran-damn-tee* you that if Vega doesn't smash Titan XP to bits, there will NOT be a "full 1080 Ti". Ever. (they may still release a full GP102 and call it Titan X Black and charge $1500 for it though)


If the titan x that release the august 2, was 3840 cores and 1500$, i dont think i would have buy it. They really tested me at 1200$, i wont spend 1$ more for a titan with gddr5x. I think 1200$ is my max limit even with hbm2.
1500$ is too much for me to accept. All people here agree that titan xp should be 999$ not more, at 1200$ nvidia will lose some titan customers. They are lucky that i want a 4k 60fps otherwise, NEVER, i would have bought it at 1200$ .
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> I think it's safe to say we're reaching the max consumer price for Titan cards the middle class is willing to spend. I've owned all the Titan cards except the Black and I've seen more outcry on the pricing for this card more than all the other Titan series combined. I'd say $1500 is the point where Nvidia might start seeing a massive drop in sales and may have to price cut. It's inevitable going to be the next Titan price most likely.
> 
> The first Titan got a free pass since they legitimately made it a professional / workstation GPU as well. I guess it was all smoke & mirrors since they haven't done that ever since.
> 
> The only reason why this Titan pricing is acceptable for me is because I only need 2 GPU's now for *my* minimum requirements (4k 60 FPS minimum on max settings) which previously took 3-4 GPU's prior that inturn cost even more. This is of course until next gen games and/or 4k 120hz monitors come out though which we may see by 2017~2018.


Man , you will buy two of them, youre rich lol even one is killing me, but 4k 60 fps minimum all time at max setting is tempting.







but i have to keep some moneys for my kids too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> so in the end theres no point on getting this card...
> 
> So we already established this is a cut chip TI for $1200???
> 
> So nvidia can spin XD
> 
> But you know its ok to give nvidia our monies XD


They know this is the first 4k 60fps card and even at 1200$ it will sell. Unfortunately They have no respect for their customers


----------



## renejr902

I just think about it. They could have release 2 titan x versions. One with 3840 and 16gb gddr5x at 1200$ and another one at 3584 with 12gb gddr5x at 999$, this way its more fair for their customers


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I just think about it. They could have release 2 titan x versions. One with 3840 and 16gb gddr5x at 1200$ and another one at 3584 with 12gb gddr5x at 999$, this way its more fair for their customers


Who wants a half baked halo product. The 1080 will do for almost everything in SLI and be quicker, if that's the mentality. For instance _two_ half baked halo products in a system. Sounds...dirty


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I just think about it. They could have release 2 titan x versions. One with 3840 and 16gb gddr5x at 1200$ and another one at 3584 with 12gb gddr5x at 999$, this way its more fair for their customers


The only other practical option is 24GB of memory, or something like 10GB with a 320-bit bus by disabling two memory controllers.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> The only other practical option is 24GB of memory, or something like 10GB with a 320-bit bus by disabling two memory controllers.


Hmmm ok! I see why they dont do that, i think its not a good idea.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> Who wants a half baked halo product. The 1080 will do for almost everything in SLI and be quicker, if that's the mentality. For instance _two_ half baked halo products in a system. Sounds...dirty


Im not interested in sli and i still play games from 5 to 15 years ago too not only recent games, i dont want compatibility trouble or glitch...


----------



## renejr902

I did a calcul.the titan x at 1631 boost clock give the same tflops and performance than titan x at 1531 boost clock and 3840 core instead of 3584.

So i will at least overclock it +100 mhz to get the boost clock at 1631 to have the same petformance than quadro 6000 at 3840 cores the full gp102 die. I think i calculated 11.7 tflops. For 1733 boost clock (same than gtx 1080) you got 12.4 tflops, it should be 40% faster than gtx 1080 not overclocked

If we can get the max boost clock at 2088 in some situations like gtx 1080, we got nearly 15 tflops of performance, that would be nice


----------



## th3illusiveman

We've been down the road before, People will complain about the price and yet will still buy it thus sending Nvidia the message that it's okay to price their next card at $1500, because why not







Whats sad, is that for $1200 you're still getting a cut down chip. They've grown so brazen it's disgusting.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *th3illusiveman*
> 
> We've been down the road before, People will complain about the price and yet will still buy it thus sending Nvidia the message that it's okay to price their next card at $1500, because why not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whats sad, is that for $1200 you're still getting a cut down chip. They've grown so brazen it's disgusting.


Its true, i agree. But at 1500$ they wont get me next time, thats sure !
At 1200$ i wont still agree with their pricing, but its my max budget limit to get that first 4k 60fps card, but at 1200$ they could at least give everyone a jhh signature on the box , not only for scientist guys


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Yeah, after 780Ti I learned my lesson and will never spend $1k or more on a single video card. Even the cheaper ones have gotten fast enough these days to cover 1440p/60Hz which is what I run at. I could get a 1070 realistically for $450 that would be fast enough, though it'd be a downgrade in performance from my two Titans. Thus is my dilemma and why I'll probably just hang onto these things til they die!


----------



## meson1

Nvidia have already conditioned us to expect the next Titan (Volta) to be $1500.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Yeah, after 780Ti I learned my lesson and will never spend $1k or more on a single video card. Even the cheaper ones have gotten fast enough these days to cover 1440p/60Hz which is what I run at. I could get a 1070 realistically for $450 that would be fast enough, though it'd be a downgrade in performance from my two Titans. Thus is my dilemma and why I'll probably just hang onto these things til they die!


Imposter!!!


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Nvidia have already conditioned us to expect the next Titan (Volta) to be $1500.


Yeah surely, but im 100% sure i wont buy the next titan at 1500$ even with hbm2


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Yeah, after 780Ti I learned my lesson and will never spend $1k or more on a single video card. Even the cheaper ones have gotten fast enough these days to cover 1440p/60Hz which is what I run at. I could get a 1070 realistically for $450 that would be fast enough, though it'd be a downgrade in performance from my two Titans. Thus is my dilemma and why I'll probably just hang onto these things til they die!


Youre ok at 1440p/60 but im playing at 4k for get near 60fps , i need this titan x, i didnt get the 1080 gtx because it was not able to do it. I dont want to wait until next titan, it could take 6 to 18 months and cost 1500+ and nothing is sure about a ti.
Youre ok at 1440p/60 , stay like that


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Imposter!!!


I know, I know! I ain't a balla any more, got too many bills!







Still, if I could get my hands on a pair of reference 980 TI's for around 700 bucks I'd probably jump on them! Would still need water blocks though, sigh.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know, I know! I ain't a balla any more, got too many bills!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still, if I could get my hands on a pair of reference 980 TI's for around 700 bucks I'd probably jump on them! Would still need water blocks though, sigh.


Won't be long before you see reference 980 Ti's for $350. I've seen 1070's for $380.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Yeah surely, but im 100% sure i wont buy the next titan at 1500$ even with hbm2


They are insidious. They have already put the idea in your head. Your mind will happily spend the next year getting used to the notion and you will end up buying a more expensive card than you otherwise might ... wallet permitting.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

1070's would work too but they're scarce and still over $400 when available.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> 1070's would work too but they're scarce and still over $400 when available.


Keep an eye over @ jet.com. They usually have $30-50 off coupon codes and they will be having a 1 year anniversary electronics sale on the 29th. Not many know of jet.com so the cards don't go too fast.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> They are insidious. They have already put the idea in your head. Your mind will happily spend the next year getting used to the notion and you will end up buying a more expensive card than you otherwise might ... wallet permitting.


seriously i dont think so ! Otherwise next upgrade will be a x80, so it can take several months, im not sure volta 1180 will beat titan x by a large margin. With the titan x i have a 4k 60fps card, i will be more patient for the next upgrade and i dont want to pay more than 1200$ at any case. I would have buy the 1080 at 599$ but it really cant do 4k at 60fps in any recent games since 12 months, except a very few ones. At least my 980ti and my 1070 while waiting got me 4k60fps in dirt rally. I just sold my gigabyes windforce oc gtx 1070 to someone and i only lost 8$ , its a good deal for me.
Im ready to abuse F5 key








But when is it possible to buy it? August 2 midnight ? If not when ? Thanks for answer , if you know the answer









Cant wait to play nfs underground 2 and morrowind with it ! LOL i can play witcher 3 or dragonage inquisition again instead


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> seriously i dont think so ! Otherwise next upgrade will be a x80, so it can take several months, im not sure volta 1180 will beat titan x by a large margin. With the titan x i have a 4k 60fps card, i will be more patient for the next upgrade and i dont want to pay more than 1200$ at any case. I would have buy the 1080 at 599$ but it really cant do 4k at 60fps in any recent games since 12 months, except a very few ones. At least my 980ti and my 1070 while waiting got me 4k60fps in dirt rally. I just sold my gigabyes windforce oc gtx 1070 to someone and i only lost 8$ , its a good deal for me.
> Im ready to abuse F5 key
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But when is it possible to buy it? August 2 midnight ? If not when ? Thanks for answer , if you know the answer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cant wait to play nfs underground 2 and morrowind with it ! LOL i can play witcher 3 or dragonage inquisition again instead


I was only joshing.







Though that _is_ how the mind works.

Like you I will be buying a Pascal card for my new build. My current Sandybridge-E rig uses a 780 Ti, so I will be jumping two generations. I don't know what Pascal card it will be yet, 1080? Dual 1080s? Titan XP? But whatever I choose, I will not be buying 16nm Volta (unless a _really_ good exceptional reason arises).

I buy to fulfill requirements; not just to have the latest and fastest. My requirement right now is genuine 4K performance in silence, hence it's going under water.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Won't be long before you see reference 980 Ti's for $350. I've seen 1070's for $380.


You're behind the times man.







You've already been able to get an EVGA FTW 980 TI for $339 ($389 + $50 rebate) direct from EVGA site, since last week iirc. Hell they had Classified 980 TI's for $409 + $50 rebate too.

Edit:

Nvidia is offering to pay back their AIB partners for partial cost for each 970 980 and 980 TI sold, in order to clear stock for Pascal. iirc they give the AIB back $50 for each 970 sold, $100 for each 980 sold, and $150 for each 980 TI sold; thus the $50 rebates on everything on EVGA.com


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> You're behind the times man.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You've already been able to get an EVGA FTW 980 TI for $339 ($389 + $50 rebate) direct from EVGA site, since last week iirc. Hell they had Classified 980 TI's for $409 + $50 rebate too.


Rebates + Cali tax = #Fail


----------



## zGunBLADEz

The 980TI was a good card for the price. That price would be my limit right there... If i didnt sold my 980TI on a reasonable price i would have never get the 1080..

If i decide to do a new build my choice would still be a 980TI no questions asked XD.. Specially for the price.

I only got 10% increase in performance in my oced 980TI (1560) vs oced (2126) 1080 in synthetic benchmarks.. Well in reality is 12.5% but you round that to 10% for the error margin...

I would never spend that much on a gpu knowing for sure a yr from now its going to be obsolete in this hobby.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Rebates + Cali tax = #Fail


Not everyone lives in Cali lol. And it literally has nothing to do with what i said. $50 rebate is still $50 off the cost; you would've payed the Cali tax whether you got the rebate or not; and would've still payed the tax if you got a 1070 or a 1060 or an RX 480 etc..etc..etc.. tax is tax, it's unavoidable sadly.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Not everyone lives in Cali lol. And it literally has nothing to do with what i said. $50 rebate is still $50 off the cost; you would've payed the Cali tax whether you got the rebate or not; and would've still payed the tax if you got a 1070 or a 1060 or an RX 480 etc..etc..etc.. tax is tax, it's unavoidable sadly.


There's a couple of places that don't charge Cali tax and since you responded to me I figured I'd share my thoughts.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> *The P6000 is a full chip.* Titan XP is not. As i7monkey stated, the Titan XP is akin to a GTX 570.
> 
> I would still suggest comparing each card in a generation to the previous generation flagship and then divide that value by price.


Not true, the P6000 is only using GP102 just like the TITAN XP, just with 24GB G5X VRAM http://www.anandtech.com/show/10516/nvidia-announces-quadro-pascal-family-quadro-p6000-p5000

You guys are getting all in a tizzy fit for nothing here. Literally the ONLY thing GP100 has over GP102 is double/mixed precision capability (FP64 and FP16) even the Tesla P100 which uses GP100 STILL only has 3,584 FP32 active cuda cores on it.

The fact of the matter is, there was bad yields this time. 16nm wasn't really ready for use yet; but Nvidia couldn't dare release yet another 28nm gen when we were supposed to be moving to 10nm by 2018. These bad yields are FAR worse the larger the chip is; GP100 ended up with only 3,584 FP32 cores, and double precision capability went down from expected 1,920 to 1,792. This means that even a full GP102 die would simply give you basically the exact same (within a couple percent) single precision gaming, rendering etc.. performance as this GP102 TITAN X, just with scientific/physics etc.. double/mixed precision added on which is useless to 99% of us.

But that's not possible to just re-design like that as this TITAN and the Quadro P6000 are literally coming from bad yield silicon from the wafer originally designed to make the Tesla P100. The silicon that is on the edge of the wafer often ends up with some transistor and cores not functioning 100%, so rather than trashing them and losing money they cut them a bit and resell as cheaper product. The fact of the matter is, these rumors of "volta" in 2017 summer are literally just going to be GP100 after they finally figure out how to get better yield on 16nm; i'm not even sure that it'll be CALLED Volta, more than likely it'll just follow the same pattern the 600/700 series did.

The original 600 series TITAN had 2,688 cuda cores, and ran on "GK110", but even the magical "GK210" only produced 2,880 cuda cores on the 780 TI and the TITAN BLACK. See what i'm getting at here? The "1180 TI" will likely only have a couple hundred more cores than this TITAN X Pascal chip, and HBM probably...that's it. So hate to break the bubble, but we're not getting anything significantly better than TITAN XP until 2018 or so.

*TLR = TITAN XP has same FP32 performance as GP100. "16nm Volta in 2017" will only provide ~200-300 cuda core increase on nearly identical architecture, just with HBM; i.e. nothing special over GP102. In summary, this chip isn't as bad as people think.*


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> There's a couple of places that don't charge Cali tax and since you responded to me I figured I'd share my thoughts.


Huh, well i still don't see what tax has to do with rebates; but ok.


----------



## guttheslayer

I might be getting this becz the next flagship will cost more than this.

Now you are paying every dollar for a single % of performance, and that price per ratio wont drop for years till AMD get bought over or some miracle happens where they catch up. If Titan XXX is 20% faster, u will pay $1500 in future, not $1200.

Dont believe, take a look and compare it with 980. At best case senarios, the new TX-P is 2.2x the performance of 980, but you pay 2.2x more literally. Just compare their MSRP, its the same ratio. lol.

Can you believe pascal titan performance per dollar is same as the flagship geforce card 2 years ago?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Huh, well i still don't see what tax has to do with rebates; but ok.


Point is that it's not $350 and rebates suck otherwise I'd buy two myself. Don't they also charge $15 for shipping?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> "16nm Volta in 2017" will only provide ~200-300 cuda core increase on nearly identical architecture, just with HBM; i.e. nothing special over GP102.


Volta might give Nvidia that holy grail - hardware async/ACEs etc.









that would be the biggest increase (expect more DX12 in 2017/2018 than in 2016), not HBM2 bandwidth and not even the little bit of extra cores that using HBM2 can allow

of course Im talking the "real" Volta, not a refined Pascal v2

but if the only difference will be HBM2 then I agree thats not really worth it for waiting for Pascal, it doesnt need HBM2 nearly as much as GCN seems to need it


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Volta might give Nvidia that holy grail - hardware async/ACEs etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that would be the biggest increase (expect more DX12 in 2017/2018 than in 2016), not HBM2 bandwidth and not even the little bit of extra cores that using HBM2 can allow
> 
> of course Im talking the "real" Volta, not a refined Pascal v2
> 
> but if the only difference will be HBM2 then I agree thats not really worth it for waiting for Pascal, it doesnt need HBM2 nearly as much as GCN seems to need it


you overhype what ACE can do, at most it boost DX12 title by another 10%, nothing more.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> you overhype what ACE can do, at most it boost DX12 title by another 10%, nothing more.


maybe, but 10% its still 10%

for a 10% increase via raw power you would need ~15%+ more cores, right ? as well as some extra bandwidth


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> maybe, but 10% its still 10%
> 
> for a 10% increase via raw power you would need ~15%+ more cores, right ? as well as some extra bandwidth


10% + HBM + some small cores = +25% as we have seen in each generational leap

I dont find anything surprising.


----------



## guttheslayer

The moment Nvidia comes out with a GPU with a true hardware based ACE, it will spell the end of AMD RTG and all the fanboy will be put to rest for good.

That is also the moment when your Geforce 1X80 graphic went over the roof to $999 and JHH still tells u you get more performance than a Titan XXX at half the price. It mark the end for PC community tbh.

Anyway I am still stunned TXP has the same per per dollar as a GTX 980 2 years ago when it was release.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> . It mark the end for PC community tbh.


PC community has been dying since the 90s or 80s, I think we'll be fine

Quote:


> it will spell the end of AMD RTG and all the fanboy will be put to rest for good.


AMD will still be the "cheap budget brand"







.. thats not bad, ppl like cheap


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Volta might give Nvidia that holy grail - hardware async/ACEs etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that would be the biggest increase (expect more DX12 in 2017/2018 than in 2016), not HBM2 bandwidth and not even the little bit of extra cores that using HBM2 can allow
> 
> of course Im talking the "real" Volta, not a refined Pascal v2
> 
> but if the only difference will be HBM2 then I agree thats not really worth it for waiting for Pascal, it doesnt need HBM2 nearly as much as GCN seems to need it


That's assuming that we get Async Compute on a hardware level in 2017. I can ALMOST guarantee you that we are just getting Pascal V2 in 2017 and not "true" Volta architecture. Yes, Nvidia is in an awfully big hurry releasing GPUs so quickly, but all in all this is just 100% repeating the 600/700 series. We get the very first card on a new node, both of which are x80 cards (680 was first 28nm card, 1080 is first 16nm card) along with an x70 to go with it (670 and 1070); then a few months later you get the TITAN on a larger but not "full" die (GK110 original TITAN for 600 series, and this TITAN X GP102 for the 1000 series); then the 600 series saw the 780 and 780 TI come out 9-10 months later in 2013 and there was barely any increase in performance over the TITAN despite 780/780 TI being on "GK210" instead of GK110. This means that in all likelihood, just like how 700 series was still Keplar, we will see GP100 (or GP202 perhaps?) become the new "GK210" becoming identical comparitive to GP102 as the GK210 was to GK110.

The GTX 780 only had 2,304 cuda cores and 3GB 384 bit GDDR5, whereas the TITAN X had 2,688 cuda cores and 6GB 384 bit GDDR5; and the 780 TI by comparison (almost a year after TITAN release) only had 2,880 cuda cores and still 3GB of 384 bit GDDR5.

Think about that for a minute. Everyone here and on all other tech forums was all in a roar in 2015 about how the TITAN X was SUCH a bad deal when the 980 TI was literally 3-5% slower in real world performance for games, video rendering via GPU accel. etc..etc... and that was a 256 cuda core difference! (3,072 on TITAN X vs 2,816 on 980 TI). The difference between the original TITAN and 780 TI was only a measly 128 cuda cores!! Go look at benchmarks, they literally performed IDENTICAL to each other once you raised the TITAN clockspeed to match the slightly higher stock clock speed on the 780 TI. Both cards overclocked the same, both performed the same when overclocked etc..etc.. but the TITAN had more VRAM so it had an advantage.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> maybe, but 10% its still 10%
> 
> for a 10% increase via raw power you would need ~15%+ more cores, right ? as well as some extra bandwidth


I really doubt that even Hardware Async will give 10% real world performance boost. More like 6-7% at most honestly.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> 10% + HBM + some small cores = +25% as we have seen in each generational leap
> 
> I dont find anything surprising.


Yeah no. That's absurdly bloated. If Async gives 10%, (which is still a VERY liberal estimate and probably a few percent over what it'll actually give) you are definitely still not seeing 25% increase over TITAN XP. 256 core increase gives like 3-4% increase historically like with the 980 TI vs TITAN X Maxwell etc.. so i can't see the core difference giving more than 5% real world performance at most.

And we are at a point where memory bandwidth is getting SERIOUS diminishing returns here. The 384 bit GDDR5X on this TITAN XP gives it 480 GB/s bandwidth; that's nearly exactly what HBM1 gave on the Fury-X!! The Fury-X with its HBM got 512 GB/s bandwidth; and once you overclock the GDDR5X on this TITAN XP to 11,000mhz like you can also easily do to the GTX 1080 (my MSI Gaming X 1080 hits 11,300mhz no problem with a core clock of 2,138mhz too) this increases bandwidth to 530 GB/s.

HBM2 would only give just over 700 GB/s or so, which isn't THAT much more than 530 GB/s of this TITAN. And like i said, we're hitting diminishing returns HARD here. It's basically turning into the same thing as 16x vs 8x PCi-e slot bandwidth. dozens of tests have shown that moving from 16x to 8x on your GPU pci slot gives like half a frame per second difference if that. This is because the bandwidth is exceeding the memory requirement of the games.

Think about bandwidth like the SIZE of the "pipe" that water is travelling through. The GPU is the pump pushing the water, and the water itself is the data travelling through the memory "pipe". If you have two square inch of "water" diameter moving through the pipe and a 1 inch pipe, you will see definite benefit from increasing the pipe size to 2 inch pipe width because more water can flow through at once increase the speed of water reaching the destination. however, if you then increase the pipe size to THREE inches with still only two square inches of water travelling through; you find that its just wasteful and provides nearly no benefit as the extra pipe space is just empty. See what i mean?

Overall even if Async gives 10%, you're looking at roughly ~15-16% at BEST over this current TITAN XP. And in all likelihood it'll be more like 11-12% as Async isn't as important as people think outside of Ashes of the Singularity.


----------



## axiumone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Not true, the P6000 is only using GP102 just like the TITAN XP, just with 24GB G5X VRAM http://www.anandtech.com/show/10516/nvidia-announces-quadro-pascal-family-quadro-p6000-p5000
> 
> You guys are getting all in a tizzy fit for nothing here. Literally the ONLY thing GP100 has over GP102 is double/mixed precision capability (FP64 and FP16) even the Tesla P100 which uses GP100 STILL only has 3,584 FP32 active cuda cores on it.
> 
> The fact of the matter is, there was bad yields this time. 16nm wasn't really ready for use yet; but Nvidia couldn't dare release yet another 28nm gen when we were supposed to be moving to 10nm by 2018. These bad yields are FAR worse the larger the chip is; GP100 ended up with only 3,584 FP32 cores, and double precision capability went down from expected 1,920 to 1,792. This means that even a full GP102 die would simply give you basically the exact same (within a couple percent) single precision gaming, rendering etc.. performance as this GP102 TITAN X, just with scientific/physics etc.. double/mixed precision added on which is useless to 99% of us.
> 
> But that's not possible to just re-design like that as this TITAN and the Quadro P6000 are literally coming from bad yield silicon from the wafer originally designed to make the Tesla P100. The silicon that is on the edge of the wafer often ends up with some transistor and cores not functioning 100%, so rather than trashing them and losing money they cut them a bit and resell as cheaper product. The fact of the matter is, these rumors of "volta" in 2017 summer are literally just going to be GP100 after they finally figure out how to get better yield on 16nm; i'm not even sure that it'll be CALLED Volta, more than likely it'll just follow the same pattern the 600/700 series did.
> 
> The original 600 series TITAN had 2,688 cuda cores, and ran on "GK110", but even the magical "GK210" only produced 2,880 cuda cores on the 780 TI and the TITAN BLACK. See what i'm getting at here? The "1180 TI" will likely only have a couple hundred more cores than this TITAN X Pascal chip, and HBM probably...that's it. So hate to break the bubble, but we're not getting anything significantly better than TITAN XP until 2018 or so.
> 
> *TLR = TITAN XP has same FP32 performance as GP100. "16nm Volta in 2017" will only provide ~200-300 cuda core increase on nearly identical architecture, just with HBM; i.e. nothing special over GP102. In summary, this chip isn't as bad as people think.*


P6000 has 3840 cuda cores. It's the full chip.

http://www.nvidia.com/object/quadro-graphics-with-pascal.html


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *axiumone*
> 
> P6000 has 3840 cuda cores. It's the full chip.
> 
> http://www.nvidia.com/object/quadro-graphics-with-pascal.html


No, It's still GP102, not GP100 like he was claiming. He was saying that this TITAN was a fully cut down chip akin to a "GTX 570" instead of a 580. Which is nonsense, as even the full GP100 only has 3,584 active FP32 cuda cores; and this P6000 simply gains a few more FP32 cores by dropping all of the extra FP64 and FP16 capability that GP100 had in exchange for increasing to 3,840 FP32 cores. It's literally the EXACT same die as the TITAN XP, so it doesn't even really qualify as "full" in comparison to the TITAN.

Both are full GP102, but the Quadro sacrifices some things that the TITAN keeps in order to get its 3,840 FP32 core count. Not to mention the Quadro P6000 only has 9000mhz memory and a lower 432 GB/s bandwidth compared to the 10000mhz + 480 GB/s bandwidth on the TITAN X.

Don't be surprised if this Quadro turns out to have 256 cores (1 SM unit) disabled just like the Tesla P100 had; tech news is SERIOUSLY sloppy this generation, you can look at five different sites and get three different spec readouts for the same card. Nobody is reporting info correct lately.

The difference between 3,584 cores and 3,840 cores is literally next to nothing though. The larger the core count the less percent difference a small increase in cores gives (i.e. diminishing returns). For example, the 980 TI had 256 cores less than the original TITAN X maxwell card; (3072 on TITAN X and 2816 on 980 TI) but you saw a 3-5% difference at most. With a core count significantly larger of 3,584 vs 3,840 you will see even LESS difference between the two numbers. You're looking at maybe 2 - 2.5% or so...FAR from the difference between a GTX 570 and 580 lol. Not to mention Quadro's don't do nearly as well in, say Gaming and such.


----------



## ChevChelios

meh I just enjoy speculating on the new GPUs

IMHO if you actually *need* Titan XP level power right now and can afford $1200 - no reason not to buy it now in August .. waiting for something hypothetical faster later seems poinltess to me when you can enjoy [email protected] on 1 GPU in a few weeks .. waiting just for sake of HBM2 alone for Pascal is certainly not worth it

if you're in no hurry though then waiting till Q1/Q2 2017 can be good

me personally Im waiting Volta X70/X80 no matter what (real Volta, not Pascal v2) and until it drops - the 1080 will serve me perfectly fine whether its for 1 year or 2 years


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> meh I just enjoy speculating on the new GPUs
> 
> IMHO if you actually *need* Titan XP level power right now and can afford $1200 - no reason not to buy it now in August .. waiting for something hypothetical faster later seems poinltess to me when you can enjoy [email protected] on 1 GPU in a few weeks .. waiting just for sake of HBM2 alone for Pascal is certainly not worth it
> 
> if you're in no hurry though then waiting till Q1/Q2 2017 can be good
> 
> me personally Im waiting Volta X70/X80 no matter what (real Volta, not Pascal v2) and until it drops - the 1080 will serve me perfectly fine whether its for 1 year or 2 years


im calling it this card


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



cant


run witcher 3 full @60fps on 4k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAeUvZ5FcKU

Not with 20-30% increase over 1080....

Gains are even worst on 4k


----------



## ChevChelios

well thats a bummer

guess [email protected] people will need to shell out $2400 then


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> No, It's still GP102, not GP100 like he was claiming.


When did I claim that it was GP100? P6000 is full GP102 and Titan XP is cut down GP102. GP102 is the current flagship product for the consumer lineup...


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I was only joshing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Though that _is_ how the mind works.
> 
> Like you I will be buying a Pascal card for my new build. My current Sandybridge-E rig uses a 780 Ti, so I will be jumping two generations. I don't know what Pascal card it will be yet, 1080? Dual 1080s? Titan XP? But whatever I choose, I will not be buying 16nm Volta (unless a _really_ good exceptional reason arises).
> 
> I buy to fulfill requirements; not just to have the latest and fastest. My requirement right now is genuine 4K performance in silence, hence it's going under water.


I will maybe going water too. Me too i buy to fulfill requirement, not to get the fastest, i waited 16 months already for 4k60fps, im tired of waiting. I have a 4k monitor and a 4k samsung uhd js8500 waiting to play 4k60fps.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> 1070's would work too but they're scarce and still over $400 when available.


If you are going to change from those Titans you are going to need Titan XP level of performance to even bother. We just have to wait for a card to come out and dethrone the Titan X for much less. HD 290 did it back in the day for $400. I can wait 6-8 months for 2-3x cheaper card.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> im calling it this card
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> cant
> 
> 
> run witcher 3 full @60fps on 4k
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAeUvZ5FcKU
> 
> Not with 20-30% increase over 1080....
> 
> Gains are even worst on 4k


I didnt check the entire video, but i dont play with AA and i disabled hairworks. With that i got the same fps than 1080 with my 980ti, so i dont stress. Titan xp in witcher3 with no AA and no hairworks will be 60fps in 4k, im sure of it


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> No, It's still GP102, not GP100 like he was claiming. He was saying that this TITAN was a fully cut down chip akin to a "GTX 570" instead of a 580. Which is nonsense, as even the full GP100 only has 3,584 active FP32 cuda cores; and this P6000 simply gains a few more FP32 cores by dropping all of the extra FP64 and FP16 capability that GP100 had in exchange for increasing to 3,840 FP32 cores. It's literally the EXACT same die as the TITAN XP, so it doesn't even really qualify as "full" in comparison to the TITAN.
> 
> Both are full GP102, but the Quadro sacrifices some things that the TITAN keeps in order to get its 3,840 FP32 core count. Not to mention the Quadro P6000 only has 9000mhz memory and a lower 432 GB/s bandwidth compared to the 10000mhz + 480 GB/s bandwidth on the TITAN X.


I don't quite understand your usage of the word "full chip."

Unquestionably, the full (as in fully functional) GP100 has 3,840 cores. The Tesla P100 uses a cut down GP100 chip with 56 out of 60 SM's active (making for 3,584 cores).

Unquestionably, the full GP102 has 3,840 cores as well. Titan X uses a cut down GP102 also featuring 56 out of 60 SM's active. Edit: I am probably wrong on that. The GP102 is mostly likely a +50% GP104, making it have 30 SM's with 128 FP32 units, 28 of them being active on Titan X.

The only cards that use a fully functional GPU are the P6000 and the GTX 1080. All other cards released or announced so far are cut down cards in one way or another.


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> I don't quite understand your usage of the word "full chip."
> 
> Unquestionably, the full (as in fully functional) GP100 has 3,840 cores. The Tesla P100 uses a cut down GP100 chip with 56 out of 60 SM's active (making for 3,584 cores).
> 
> Unquestionably, the full GP102 has 3,840 cores as well. Titan X uses a cut down GP102 also featuring 56 out of 60 SM's active.
> 
> The only cards that use a fully functional GPU are the P6000 and the GTX 1080. All other cards released or announced so far are cut down cards in one way or another.


Pretty much my thoughts as well while reading DarkIdeals's posts.

Personally am waiting (hoping) for a 1080 Ti with a fully enabled GP102, because for 1200 USD I'd at least want a full chip. I know the performance difference of an extra 256 cuda cores isn't going to be massive but it's principle. If I really am going to spend 1200 USD I want the best gaming chip out there, not a cut down version of it.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> No, It's still GP102, not GP100 like he was claiming. He was saying that this TITAN was a fully cut down chip akin to a "GTX 570" instead of a 580. Which is nonsense, as even the full GP100 only has 3,584 active FP32 cuda cores; and this P6000 simply gains a few more FP32 cores by dropping all of the extra FP64 and FP16 capability that GP100 had in exchange for increasing to 3,840 FP32 cores. It's literally the EXACT same die as the TITAN XP, so it doesn't even really qualify as "full" in comparison to the TITAN.
> 
> Both are full GP102, but the Quadro sacrifices some things that the TITAN keeps in order to get its 3,840 FP32 core count. Not to mention the Quadro P6000 only has 9000mhz memory and a lower 432 GB/s bandwidth compared to the 10000mhz + 480 GB/s bandwidth on the TITAN X.
> 
> Don't be surprised if this Quadro turns out to have 256 cores (1 SM unit) disabled just like the Tesla P100 had; tech news is SERIOUSLY sloppy this generation, you can look at five different sites and get three different spec readouts for the same card. Nobody is reporting info correct lately.
> 
> The difference between 3,584 cores and 3,840 cores is literally next to nothing though. The larger the core count the less percent difference a small increase in cores gives (i.e. diminishing returns). For example, the 980 TI had 256 cores less than the original TITAN X maxwell card; (3072 on TITAN X and 2816 on 980 TI) but you saw a 3-5% difference at most. With a core count significantly larger of 3,584 vs 3,840 you will see even LESS difference between the two numbers. You're looking at maybe 2 - 2.5% or so...FAR from the difference between a GTX 570 and 580 lol. Not to mention Quadro's don't do nearly as well in, say Gaming and such.


GP100 was designed to have a fully functional 60 SMs with 3840 cores, so the current version used in Tesla P100 still isn't the full chip.

https://devblogs.nvidia.com/parallelforall/inside-pascal/

The only thing that Quadro P6000 seems to sacrifice so far is some memory speed, most likely to accommodate ECC. Btw except for GP100 where each SM only has 64 shaders, everything else in the lineup has 128 shaders per SM, not 256. Anandtech has a fairly good record of not reporting rubbish/fake information, so I'll take their word for it until I have reason to doubt otherwise.


----------



## i7monkey

Full _GP100_ chip
16GB HBM2

$549-$599 since HBM is costly


----------



## DNMock

Any word on the outputs on this card yet? Is it using DP 1.4 and HDMI 2.1 outputs?

I saw it has a dual-dvi output which is kind of silly. If you are rocking a monitor with it's best input being a dual-DVI, this is not the GPU you are looking for.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> Any word on the outputs on this card yet? Is it using DP 1.4 and HDMI 2.1 outputs?
> 
> I saw it has a dual-dvi output which is kind of silly. If you are rocking a monitor with it's best input being a dual-DVI, this is not the GPU you are looking for.


http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal


Nice, didn't know they already put that info out yet. So in theory getting a pair of them would leave you in position to support a 120hz 4k monitor if/when they ever come out.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Full _GP100_ chip
> 16GB HBM2
> 
> $549-$599 since HBM is costly


son its time to return from lala land

unless you meant $1549-1599 and jsut forgot to type 1


----------



## geort45

It's not that I can afford a P6000, nor a Titan XP, but it as always it seems the Quadros aren't configured for gaming on the SOFTWARE side. Can't this be hacked? I remember long time ago the reverse was possible, to make a GTX identify as a Quadro

I felt out my spreadsheet BTW, trying to come up with some illustrative graphs and data


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> son its time to return from lala land
> 
> unless you meant $1549-1599 and jsut forgot to type 1


Honestly a full GP100 with 1/2 FP64 capability and 16GB HBM2 for $1549 would be tolerable.


----------



## Baasha

Well, I was really hoping Dell would release the 120Hz OLED 4K UHD display by now (in time for the new Pascal Titan X) but that is not the case.

Here's an 'update' on the Dell monitor: http://www.pcper.com/news/Displays/Dells-New-30-4K-120Hz-UP3017Q-OLED-Monitor-Coming-Soon

It is highly unfortunate that the monitor supposedly uses USB Type-C and has no DP 1.3 or DP 1.4 connections!









I sure hope Dell is changing it to DP 1.4 or at least DP 1.3 so that we can run 120Hz 4K UHD with just one cable.

A dual Titan X (Pascal) should technically run 4K UHD @ 120Hz quite well.

Only time will tell.

Some pics of the monitor (so sexy):


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Honestly a full GP100 with 1/2 FP64 capability and 16GB HBM2 for *$1549 would be tolerable*.


stop

you are already thinking like JHH wants you to think


----------



## magnek

I would *like* to only pay <$650 for this hypothetical GP100, but that's beyond fantasy at this point.

We're never going to see the days of $500 for a full big die ever again, (unless AMDs pull another HD 5870 and way undercharges) that ship set sail with Kepler. Then with 16nm FF still being new, yields for a 610mm² chip can't be pretty, and nVidia is not interested in taking the hit themselves. Then throw in the cost of HBM2 and the added cost of having to junk a working die because some of the stacks were faulty. And consider they're "giving away" FP64 performance for a fraction of the cost of Teslas... Well you get the idea.

Maybe it's because I'd expect them to price such a card >$2000, so $1549 would be "tolerable".


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> stop
> 
> you are already thinking like JHH wants you to think


I don't think the mindset is uncommon. Thinking relatively with respect to a short term span of time, it does not seem so bad.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I would *like* to only pay <$650 for this hypothetical GP100, but that's beyond fantasy at this point.
> 
> We're never going to see the days of $500 for a full big die ever again, (unless AMDs pull another HD 5870 and way undercharges) that ship set sail with Kepler. Then with 16nm FF still being new, yields for a 610mm² chip can't be pretty, and nVidia is not interested in taking the hit themselves. Then throw in the cost of HBM2 and the added cost of having to junk a working die because some of the stacks were faulty. And consider they're "giving away" FP64 performance for a fraction of the cost of Teslas... Well you get the idea.
> 
> Maybe it's because I'd expect them to price such a card >$2000, so $1549 would be "tolerable".


I agree with your analysis, but there is another element.

Realistically, we set the price, though. It has nothing to do with competition under normal distributions of products. I have seen many a person complain about NV pricing, then only to say "If AMD were competitive, then I would get a lower price on the next NV product." Then, said person goes out and buys the product they complained about, and justifies the price to themselves and the people on the forums. In the next release, the process continues.

This is the underlying element that defines how we got to where we are. If it were only process changes, we would have seen a cheaper Titan X on super mature 28nm.

I'm not sure how we believe the market owes us a disruptor to keep pricing down. It actually bothers me that someone linked to JHH telling us that "competition sets the price for TXP" and believed that he was being "helpful" as the CEO of the corporation selling the product.

What right does he have to tell us what his price will be and stand on it?

We, the gaming community built his company.. without us where would he be?


----------



## DIYDeath

$1200 is waaaaay too much.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Honestly a full GP100 with 1/2 FP64 capability and 16GB HBM2 for $1549 would be tolerable.


Huh? You fall and hit your head or something?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> I agree with your analysis, but there is another element.
> 
> Realistically, we set the price, though. It has nothing to do with competition under normal distributions of products. I have seen many a person complain about NV pricing, then only to say "If AMD were competitive, then I would get a lower price on the next NV product." Then, said person goes out and buys the product they complained about, and justifies the price to themselves and the people on the forums. In the next release, the process continues.
> 
> This is the underlying element that defines how we got to where we are. If it were only process changes, we would have seen a cheaper Titan X on super mature 28nm.
> 
> I'm not sure how we believe the market owes us a disruptor to keep pricing down. It actually bothers me that someone linked to JHH telling us that "competition sets the price for TXP" and believed that he was being "helpful" as the CEO of the corporation selling the product.
> 
> What right does he have to tell us what his price will be and stand on it?
> 
> We, the gaming community built his company.. without us where would he be?


Yeah good luck with that, it's a never-ending vicious cycle:
Quote:


> A: "Stop buying these overpriced cut down cards, you're telling nVidia it's ok to keep charging more, and YOU'RE the problem."
> B: "How DARE YOU tell me how to spend MY MONEY, I'll do whatever I damn please. If you can't afford it or don't like it then don't buy it. Or get a better education and a better job."


Realistically, market demand sets the price. In a duopoly, if one company doesn't perform, what do you think happens to the demand for the other company's products?

I said as much that if we were to blame AMD, then the consumers share at least half the blame. But that's just not how real life works. Plus the "don't like it don't buy it" approach only works if the majority is on board. Not happening any time soon.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Huh? You fall and hit your head or something?


More like depressed because the high end GPU segment is just totally screwed up right now.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> Some pics of the monitor (so sexy):
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


$5000 for an 120Hz OLED 4K UHD 30" display or just pick up a OLED Curved 4K 55" TV for half the price...


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Yeah good luck with that, it's a never-ending vicious cycle:
> Realistically, market demand sets the price. In a duopoly, if one company doesn't perform, what do you think happens to the demand for the other company's products?
> 
> I said as much that if we were to blame AMD, then the consumers share at least half the blame. But that's just not how real life works. Plus the "don't like it don't buy it" approach only works if the majority is on board. Not happening any time soon.


Note that I did not say "Don't like it, don't buy it".. I am simply stating it is a problem when people just take it lying down. People don't express their discontent with their purchases, but instead, justify them and in that, justify the company's pricing position.

No, market demand can only play a small element. If the demand were high for %5 of the product market, is the supply-demand argument justified? No, it can not be because it would take a perfect distribution of similar products in a said market to meet supply-demand. This a niche item, in a niche market. Being in a duopoly is their own reasoning for explaining the pricing of their own products.

Think about all the refunds and returns of unhappy customers for the GTX 970. If people took it lying down, and justified their purchases after learning of the 3.5GB scandal, as small or large of an issue as it may have been, NV would have not have said or done anything.

I'll bet you the same thing happened with the GTX 1060, they were probably going to release a 1060 3GB card for 249, but decided to change their tune based on the noise.

We have all of the rights. We tell NV what to do, which is why it is good that we say "1200 is too much".. the only outcomes will be:

1. They ignore us until we are mad about the price.
2. They change their price after ignoring us and making us discontent, or without ignoring us.

The power is with us, not them.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Honestly a full GP100 with 1/2 FP64 capability and 16GB HBM2 for $1549 would be tolerable.


Lol, NO....


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> Note that I did not say "Don't like it, don't buy it".. I am simply stating it is a problem when people just take it lying down. People don't express their discontent with their purchases, but instead, justify them and in that, justify the company's pricing position.
> 
> No, market demand can only play a small element. If the demand were high for %5 of the product market, is the supply-demand argument justified? No, it can not be because it would take a perfect distribution of similar products in a said market to meet supply-demand. This a niche item, in a niche market. Being in a duopoly is their own reasoning for explaining the pricing of their own products.
> 
> Think about all the refunds and returns of unhappy customers for the GTX 970. If people took it lying down, and justified their purchases after learning of the 3.5GB scandal, as small or large of an issue as it may have been, NV would have not have said or done anything.
> 
> I'll bet you the same thing happened with the GTX 1060, they were probably going to release a 1060 3GB card for 249, but decided to change their tune based on the noise.
> 
> We have all of the rights. We tell NV what to do, which is why it is good that we say "1200 is too much".. the only outcomes will be:
> 
> 1. They ignore us until we are mad about the price.
> 2. They change their price after ignoring us and making us discontent, or without ignoring us.
> 
> The power is with us, not them.


We do have the power, we just have to find a way to stand together. Proof being the Titan Z. That crap didn't sell well and Nvidia dropped the price.

There are still some though that think price is justified because they think they need the best. And those that think Nvidia is being generous by not charging more. Those are the people that really blow my mind!


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> son its time to return from lala land
> 
> unless you meant $1549-1599 and jsut forgot to type 1


just came back from the future. midrange gpus now cost $1500 and flagship's cost $3000. we should thank our lucky stars we're getting high end for $1200 heh


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> Note that I did not say "Don't like it, don't buy it".. I am simply stating it is a problem when people just take it lying down. People don't express their discontent with their purchases, but instead, justify them and in that, justify the company's pricing position.
> 
> No, market demand can only play a small element. If the demand were high for %5 of the product market, is the supply-demand argument justified? No, it can not be because it would take a perfect distribution of similar products in a said market to meet supply-demand. his a niche item, in a niche market. Being in a duopoly is their own reasoning for explaining the pricing of their own products.


A niche item in a niche market would be extremely price inelastic, and would explain the current situation actually.
Quote:


> Think about all the refunds and returns of unhappy customers for the GTX 970. If people took it lying down, and justified their purchases after learning of the 3.5GB scandal, as small or large of an issue as it may have been, NV would have not have said or done anything.


Actually nVidia denied refunds, and only the lucky ones who bought from Amazon or fought tooth and nail with Newegg got a refund. Neither nVidia nor Gigabyte even bothered replying to my emails.
Quote:


> I'll bet you the same thing happened with the GTX 1060, they were probably going to release a 1060 3GB card for 249, but decided to change their tune based on the noise.


I'm more inclined to believe that idea was canned because the RX 480 4GB @ $200, even with 10% less performance would just absolutely kill it. (or there really never was a 1060 3GB planned in the first place)

Given that nVidia barely gave a crap about the whole 970 issue beyond doing PR damage control, I highly doubt "we" made them change their minds.
Quote:


> We have all of the rights. We tell NV what to do, which is why it is good that we say "1200 is too much".. the only outcomes will be:
> 
> 1. They ignore us until we are mad about the price.
> 2. They change their price with, or without ignoring us.
> 
> The power is with us, not them.


Well once again, this approach only works if the majority is on board. Basically what I'm getting at is, the vocal minority will not have an impact on the price, unless said vocal minority manages to create long lasting bad PR for nVidia.

And judging by the responses in this thread, that ain't happening anytime soon because "there's too many people that will pay the "small" price hikes each generation to have the latest and greatest", to quote one of my PMs. (it's funny because I had this exact conversation in a string of PMs, only I was the one saying we all needed to boycott the card)

Edit: Thinking a bit more about it, I think the problem boils down to this:

*The majority of those who have the disposable income to spare simply don't care*, and to them we're simply annoying, entitled whiners.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Lol, NO....


But you would buy a 10 core 6950X for $1700 if you didn't have to make sacrifices?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> just came back from the future. midrange gpus now cost $1500 and flagship's cost $3000. we should thank our lucky stars we're getting high end for $1200 heh


I'd personally peg it at $1000 and $2000, because $1500 for an x80 card means the x60 would still cost >$500, and I think most people would just move back to consoles if that was the case.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> And those that think Nvidia is being generous by not charging more. Those are the people that really blow my mind!


It's like they're thankful for JenHsun _allowing_ them the _opportunity_ to be a gamer and it _only_ costs them $1200.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> $5000 for an 120Hz OLED 4K UHD 30" display or just pick up a OLED *Curved 4K 55" TV[*/URL] for half the price...


And its 50ms response time? No thanks Jeff. PC Gaming (Monitor>TV) and its not even close.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> It's like they're thankful for JenHsun _allowing_ them the _opportunity_ to be a gamer and it _only_ costs them $1200.


Lord Gaben Huang is love, Gaben Huang is life.

And you _better not_ let me catch you owning a Titan XP.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> $5000 for an 120Hz OLED 4K UHD 30" display or just pick up a OLED Curved 4K 55" TV for half the price...


55 doesnt fit on my desk .. and it doesnt look like its 120 hz ?

+this
Quote:


> And its 50ms response time


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> A niche item in a niche market would be extremely price inelastic, and would explain the current situation actually.
> Actually nVidia denied refunds, and only the lucky ones who bought from Amazon or fought tooth and nail with Newegg got a refund. Neither nVidia nor Gigabyte even bothered replying to my emails.
> I'm more inclined to believe that idea was canned because the RX 480 4GB @ $200, even with 10% less performance would just absolutely kill it. (or there really never was a 1060 3GB planned in the first place)
> 
> Given that nVidia barely gave a crap about the whole 970 issue beyond doing PR damage control, I highly doubt "we" made them change their minds.
> Well once again, this approach only works if the majority is on board. Basically what I'm getting at is, the vocal minority will not have an impact on the price, unless said vocal minority manages to create long lasting bad PR for nVidia.
> 
> And judging by the responses in this thread, that ain't happening anytime soon because "there's too many people that will pay the "small" price hikes each generation to have the latest and greatest", to quote one of my PMs. (it's funny because I had this exact conversation in a string of PMs, only I was the one saying we all needed to boycott the card)
> But you would buy a 10 core 6950X for $1700 if you didn't have to make sacrifices?
> I'd personally peg it at $1000 and $2000, because $1500 for an x80 card means the x60 would still cost >$500, and I think most people would just move back to consoles if that was the case.


True, but only because a cpu is more important to me, and, I can keep it a lot longer,like 2-3 years, not so with a gpu, which I try to "upgrade" on every new release. all in the effort to find that one gpu solution that gives me the best frames at 4k. so far, the OG Titan X has done it the best for me...


----------



## magnek

You can keep a GPU for 2-3 years too if you turn down settings/resolution.









But yes I can agree that GPUs do age much faster than CPUs.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> You can keep a GPU for 2-3 years too if you turn down settings/resolution.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But yes I can agree that GPUs do age much faster than CPUs.


I am tired of the X79 platform. I have been on it since the 3820 was released(going on 5 years!). That's the only reason I have a desire to upgrade my cpu/motherboard. I wish gpus lasted like cpus.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> A niche item in a niche market would be extremely price inelastic, and would explain the current situation actually.
> Actually nVidia denied refunds, and only the lucky ones who bought from Amazon or fought tooth and nail with Newegg got a refund. Neither nVidia nor Gigabyte even bothered replying to my emails.
> I'm more likely to believe that idea was canned because the RX 480 4GB @ $200, even with 10% less performance would just absolutely kill it. (or there really never was a 1060 3GB planned in the first place)
> 
> Given that nVidia barely gave a crap about the whole 970 issue beyond doing PR damage control, I highly doubt "we" made them change their minds.
> Well once again, this approach only works if the majority is on board. Basically what I'm getting at is, the vocal minority will not have an impact on the price, unless said vocal minority manages to create long lasting bad PR for nVidia.
> 
> And judging by the responses in this thread, that ain't happening anytime soon because "there's too many people that will pay the "small" price hikes each generation to have the latest and greatest", to quote one of my PMs. (it's funny because I had this exact conversation in a string of PMs, only I was the one saying we all needed to boycott the card)


You can't have supply-demand concerns the same way in a niche market, when the price is already marked up for niche value. The supply is low and the demand is low, which is why it is a challenge to breach said markets.

The fact that they had a PR campaign was a huge success for the consumer. No corporation will outwardly claim fault because of legal reasons, but ask any GTX 970 owner whether or not they've been burned. They're exercising their discontent by being more watchful, even if they didn't get a refund. NV has been warned.

Bad PR goes a long way, especially when you're a marketshare majority. Being in marketshare majority is dangerous place to be, because any small failure can cause long lasting customer loss of trust. Just look at what happened with Bulldozer. (Not a majority, but PR was quite bad and look at all of the marketshare lost, even among budget buyers)

They would never tell us that they had a GTX 1060 3GB card planned in the first place. That would look bad, wouldn't it?

I have to say, I am pretty cynical about the present state of this kind of consumerism, especially in PC gaming today. But, you have to believe you can do some good first to be able to do it. This isn't just some silly boycott, its how free market capitalism should work.

By defending the corporation in any way, shape, or form, you are doing the PR campaign for them. And, they don't even pay you. If anything, they just keep pushing.

Defense can even be saying "because it's a duopoly, there needs to be better competition to have better prices". That's exactly what JHH said in defense of his company's pricing.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I am tired of the X79 platform. I have been on it since the 3820 was released(going on 5 years!). That's the only reason I have a desire to upgrade my cpu/motherboard. I wish gpus lasted like cpus.


You would upgrade CPUs if they where better. Look at the failure Broadwell-E are in terms of overclocking.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> By defending the corporation in any way, shape, or form, you are doing the PR campaign for them. And, they don't even pay you. If anything, they just keep pushing.


We talked about some of this the other day, I think earlier in this thread. It is one thing to support the company by purchasing their product. It is entirely another to argue in favor of everything the company does. Like you know the people that justify (FOR THE COMPANY) the raising of prices. I have to question if those people are shills or have some stock in said company.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> You would upgrade CPUs if they where better. Look at the failure Broadwell-E are in terms of overclocking.


This is true as well. That's why everyone with any common sense better be in favor of a AMD always being at least a little competitive on the gpu side. Otherwise we will start seeing the same performance increases from Nvidia gpus from generation to generation that we see from Intel with their cpus.


----------



## Olivon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> Jen-Hsun is a liar. It has nothing to do with the lack of competition from AMD.


Are u serious ?
If nv cardz was bad compared to AMD ones, they will cheaper than AMD ones.
AMD allow nVidia to out Titan brands and 1000$+ cardz. Every time there's no opponent.
With this new 14nm node, AMD only offer a 232mm² when nVidia already have 610mm² (PRO) , 471mm², 314mm² and 200mm², all with better performance and efficiency.
Really easy to understand why AMD is struggling hard and can only play the "for the mass", "We're the 99%" "Join the rebellion"... themes.
nVidia advantage is really massive now. More than never.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I am tired of the X79 platform. I have been on it since the 3820 was released(going on 5 years!). That's the only reason I have a desire to upgrade my cpu/motherboard. I wish gpus lasted like cpus.


Well, if GPUs also only improved 5-10% per year, then they'd have a much longer shelf life.

I remember saying given a choice between 20-30% improvement each generation but with rising prices or 5-10% improvement but with constant prices, I'd much prefer the latter option, and was promptly told to hand over my enthusiast card.









But at the end of the day, if I really could choose, I'd still pick the second option.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> You can't have supply-demand concerns the same way in a niche market, when the price is already marked up for niche value. The supply is low and the demand is low, which is why it is a challenge to breach said markets.
> 
> The fact that they had a PR campaign was a huge success for the consumer. No corporation will outwardly claim fault because of legal reasons, but ask any GTX 970 owner whether or not they've been burned. They're exercising their discontent by being more watchful, even if they didn't get a refund. NV has been warned.
> 
> Bad PR goes a long way, especially when you're a marketshare majority. Being in marketshare majority is dangerous place to be, because any small failure can cause long lasting customer loss of trust. Just look at what happened with Bulldozer. (Not a majority, but PR was quite bad and look at all of the marketshare lost, even among budget buyers)
> 
> They would never tell us that they had a GTX 1060 3GB card planned in the first place. That would look bad, wouldn't it?
> 
> I have to say, I am pretty cynical about the present state of this kind of consumerism, especially in PC gaming today. But, you have to believe you can do some good first to be able to do it. This isn't just some silly boycott, its how free market capitalism should work.
> 
> By defending the corporation in any way, shape, or form, you are doing the PR campaign for them. And, they don't even pay you. If anything, they just keep pushing.
> 
> Defense can even be saying "because it's a duopoly, there needs to be better competition to have better prices". That's exactly what JHH said in defense of his company's pricing.


There was clearly sufficient demand for a $999 card that nVidia kept selling it and people kept buying it.

Unfortunately, nVidia has gotten to the point where nothing short of a Bulldozer style disaster would have any impact whatsoever. Remember Bumpgate from 8-9 years ago? That was a much, much worse issue than the 970 vram fiasco, and nVidia barely had 50% of the market back then, and still it had minimal impact on nVidia.

The point about the 1060 3GB is that we would never know if it was even a thing to begin with. Them not telling us about it =/= they designed it, then recanted due to the backlash. I mean really this is nVidia we're talking about here. They tried to sell Titan Z for $3K, and when that failed, they _quietly_ slashed prices by 50% _6 months later_.

I'm not defending anybody, simply being realistic about the situation. I mean I get it, we as consumers _should_ boycott the card and tell JHH to go sniff a dog's ass, but that's simply too idealistic for more reasons than one. I mean, half the thread is people trying to reason with others on why they should hold off on buying such a card, and you can see how that all went.


----------



## i7monkey

It was better when they gave us real flagships under the X80 moniker.

GTX 480 (GF100, $499)

year later

GTX 580 (GF110 revision of GF100, $499)

It did only come with a 15-20% improvement but that's to be expected since we went from GF100-->GF110

Titan only seemed like a good improvement because we went from midrange (GK104) to high end (GK110) instead of high end to high end like Fermi.

I'd rather have true flagships with a minor improvement with the revision than the crap we have going on now.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I will maybe going water too. Me too i buy to fulfill requirement, not to get the fastest, i waited 16 months already for 4k60fps, im tired of waiting. I have a 4k monitor and a 4k samsung uhd js8500 waiting to play 4k60fps.


Not the fastest but only requirements... lol I like the twist on perspective. Artificially chasing such requirements is setting one up to need the fastest. For example my requirements of [email protected] are modest and frees me from such chases. Next step up will be VR 2.0 because everything today still sucks.


----------



## carlhil2

Just did some deep thinking,(ouch), and I have decided to buy the 1080Classified ot the MSI Seahawk EK edition. why? since nVIDIA is claiming that this gpu isn't "aimed.." at gamers, you KNOW that their WILL be a GTX 102 chip released, sooner or later....hopefully, a grand or less..


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> That's why everyone with any common sense better be in favor of a AMD always being at least a little competitive on the gpu side. Otherwise we will start seeing the same performance increases from Nvidia gpus from generation to generation that we see from Intel with their cpus.


I am still not worried about GPU advancement when more cores still guarantees better performance unlike CPU side where you have to have fine balance between good IPC n number of cores depending on applications.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Just did some deep thinking,(ouch), and I have decided to buy the 1080Classified ot the MSI Seahawk EK edition. why? since nVIDIA is claiming that this gpu isn't "aimed.." at gamers, you KNOW that their WILL be a GTX 102 chip released, sooner or later....hopefully, a grand or less..


you very chip. you buy nao! twelve hunded good price fo you.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> What in the hell? Clock for clock Titan X could be theoretically up to 9% faster, but in actuality you never see that much gain, typically 5-7% at best.
> 
> Here's a Fire Strike run with a Titan X @ 1500/8200 vs my 980 Ti @ 1500/8000
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/5160196/fs/8618775#
> 
> Even with a +200 advantage on memory the Titan X only has a 4.5% higher graphics score. Not sure where you got 1550 MHz Titan X = 1800 MHz 980 Ti from.


Because I've ran at the numbers I posted and still Titan X is still top scoring card. I'm not typical. Hit the little robot under my avatar. As carhil said "Once TXP hit, in about a months time, there will be no 1080s in the HOF top 100......I am talking single gpu.."


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Well, if GPUs also only improved 5-10% per year, then they'd have a much longer shelf life.
> 
> There was clearly sufficient demand for a $999 card that nVidia kept selling it and people kept buying it.
> 
> Unfortunately, nVidia has gotten to the point where nothing short of a Bulldozer style disaster would have any impact whatsoever. Remember Bumpgate from 8-9 years ago? That was a much, much worse issue than the 970 vram fiasco, and nVidia barely had 50% of the market back then, and still it had minimal impact on nVidia.
> 
> The point about the 1060 3GB is that we would never know if it was even a thing to begin with. Them not telling us about it =/= they designed it, then recanted due to the backlash. I mean really this is nVidia we're talking about here. They tried to sell Titan Z for $3K, and when that failed, they _quietly_ slashed prices by 50% _6 months later_.
> 
> I'm not defending anybody, simply being realistic about the situation. I mean I get it, we as consumers _should_ boycott the card and tell JHH to go sniff a dog's ass, but that's simply too idealistic for more reasons than one. I mean, half the thread is people trying to reason with others on why they should hold off on buying such a card, and you can see how that all went.


I'm not arguing that there was not a relative demand for the video card, but that the supply made it unjustifiable at that price. Unless one should believe JHH's words when he says "there will only be a few made" - same thing they say in those silly as seen on TV adverts. On a 28nm mature process, I would be hard pressed to believe that the quantity justified the price of 999. As a consumer, we could have demanded that we receive more. Even from the end user experience, it was a so-so product. It ran warm, it was overclocking limited (compared to the 980 ti), and was touted as the premium product? The GTX 580 was a better product at a better price. We can demand that. They are telling us "You've got to pay to play".. how does that benefit anyone but them, and how is repeating it of benefit?

Had reviewers and owners complained instead of justified the purchase to themselves and their peers, they would have done a better job on the price of the TXP. Even now, people somehow feel as though they are being attacked for buying the product of questionable the value, and their reason for the purchasing of the card. If any, I am fighting for them by telling NV that it was not that great, because the other owners themselves won't do it for themselves.

How can you not feel bad about losing ~500 dollars in a year on a video card, only to have it be surpassed next year at a 700 dollar premium again? Why are we fighting amongst ourselves about value when we should blame NV?

I disagree, about the impact of bumpgate being minor. Do you realize how much it costs to spin things after losing 200 million as a small company, like NV after bumpgate? That is not minor. It's consumers and reviewers at work. Look at the products they released afterward, and how much of a rough patch it was for the next two GPU generations.

*We can do that again*, but we actively need to be holding NV to greater standards by scrutinizing their methods.

Your point about the GTX 1060 is the same as mine. It is NV we are talking about here, a corporation, that will only give minimal benefits unless pushed. Are we to believe they were going to give us 3GB out of good graces? Let's say we agree.

I would hate to say it, but I think you are being cynical, rather than realistic. I am not an optimist, but we can not afford to give up ground by repeating JHH's words about how being in a duopoly justifies prices. As I have said, it is doing their PR work for them, and it is defending their position without any foreseeable benefit to the consumer.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> you very chip. you buy nao! twelve hunded good price fo you.


Lol, you are a funny dude...


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> you very chip. you buy nao! twelve hunded good price fo you.












1700USD for a "high end" CPU, 1200USD for a "high end" GPU, 600USD for a "high end" motherboard. Sacrifice 10 or 20% performance and buy the hardware just below this, so you can buy a monitor, a case, a mouse, a keyboard, a SSD and a box of candy.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> im calling it this card
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> cant
> 
> 
> run witcher 3 full @60fps on 4k
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAeUvZ5FcKU
> 
> Not with 20-30% increase over 1080....
> 
> Gains are even worst on 4k


Anyone who says 20% over 1080 has NO clue what they are talking about. This will be ~35% over 1080 at stock pretty much guaranteed, and just like the 980 TI will get a MUCH larger boost from overclocking than the cut-down card gets. Remember when the TITAN X maxwell card came out? Even though the Maxwell TITAN X only started at 1000mhz base clock it could go all the way to 1,500mhz in many cases; nearly matching the average ~1,550mhz that the 980 usually reaches via overclocking. And it's basic math that the lower your STARTING clock speed the bigger the percentage you gain from each mhz you can overclock it. (i.e. going from 1000mhz to 1500mhz is a massive 50% boost! But going from 1,600mhz to 2,100mhz like the 1080 does is only 31% despite still being a 500mhz increase. This means that you are gonna see damn close to TWICE the overclocking benefit on this TITAN X than on the 1080. And the 1080 already got ~8-9fps increase even at 4K when overclocked to ~2,050 - 2,100mhz or so; so you're easily looking at ~14-16fps increase when overclocking this TITAN)

So if we take say 35% over 1080 which is a fair real world 4K increase especially due to the much larger 480 GB/s bandwidth on the 384 bit bus the TITAN has which is more beneficial at the larger resolution like 4K; and then add in an overclock from 1,400mhz where it starts to 1,900mhz where Nvidia has claimed it can hit; we are looking at a 36% higher clock speed, meaning likely around 28-30% performance gain.

That puts it at roughly 65% faster than 1080; and remember Tech of Tomorrow did those Witcher 3 tests at stock speeds, no overclock. So if we take the ~40fps average the 1080 got and factor in the 65% increase of an overclocked TITAN X we get 40 * 1.65 = 66fps. So no, it CAN do >60fps at 4K with all settings maxed when you overclock it. Even non overclocked you're looking at roughly 54fps average even with max hairworks etc..etc.. and Witcher 3 is basically the most graphically demanding game out there for GPUs so anything else will perform even better.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> When did I claim that it was GP100? P6000 is full GP102 and Titan XP is cut down GP102. GP102 is the current flagship product for the consumer lineup...


You specifically said that it was "like a GTX 570" with the full 3,840 card being like a 580. You were acting like it was a drastically cut down chip or something. I'm simply pointing out that even the full GP100 only uses 3584 cuda cores due to bad yields, so that's not a fair comparison to make. Especially with how we've already seen with like the 980 TI vs Maxwell TITAN X that a 256 core difference makes next to NO difference really; maybe a couple percent at most. And with a larger core count of 3584 vs 3840 instead of 2816 vs 3072 you see even LESS percent difference between the two than we did between the 980 TI and Maxwell TITAN X.

Plus the die sizes make the "570 vs 580" comparison even more wrong. The 570 and 580 didn't even use a full 600mm2 die either! They used a 520mm2 die size! The GTX 480 used a 529mm2 die and the tweaked for better heat/power consumption 580 that was more of an "efficiency enhanced 480" used a slightly shrunk down 520mm2 die size.

Hell, lets go even FARTHER back! Even the Nvidia 9800 GTX flagship only had a 324mm2 die size! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_9_series

This is why i'm saying that people complaining about the 478mm2 die size of the GP102 being "a ripoff cut-down chip" and saying that "in the past we would've gotten an x70 card with that kinda die size with the x80 being even bigger!" but that's simply not the case as even going back 10 years Nvidia NEVER made a 600mm2 die. The closest they've ever gotten in the past 10 years was the GTX 480 with 529mm2, which is still MUCH closer to the 478mm2 size of GP102 TITAN X than it is to the 601mm2 size of GP200/GK210 etc.. on the 780 TI and 980 TI. People are just trying to find any excuse to complain about a card they can't afford. (not talking about you in this last part for the record. Talking about others who commented back pages back near where you commented)


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> I'm not arguing that there was not a relative demand for the video card, but that the supply made it unjustifiable at that price. Unless one should believe JHH's words when he says "there will only be a few made" - same thing they say in those silly as seen on TV adverts. On a 28nm mature process, I would be hard pressed to believe that the quantity justified the price of 999. As a consumer, we could have demanded that we receive more. Even from the end user experience, it was a so-so product. It ran warm, it was overclocking limited, and was touted as the premium product? The GTX 580 was a better product at a better price. We can demand that. They are telling us "You've got to pay to play".. how does that benefit anyone but them, and how is repeating it of benefit?
> 
> Had reviewers and owners complained instead of justified the purchase to themselves and their peers, they would have done a better job on the price of the TXP. Even now, people somehow feel as though they are being attacked for buying the product of questionable the value, and their reason for the purchasing of the card. If any, I am fighting for them by telling NV that it was not that great, because the other owners themselves won't do it for themselves.
> 
> How can you not feel bad about losing ~500 dollars in a year on a video card, only to have it be surpassed next year at a 700 dollar premium again? Why are we fighting amongst ourselves about value when we should blame NV?


As I pointed out earlier, it's because *those with the disposable income to spare simply don't care*. And they'll continue to not care for as long as nVidia can provide them with the latest and greatest.
Quote:


> I disagree, about the impact of bumpgate being minor. Do you realize how much it costs to spin things after losing 200 million as a small company, like NV after bumpgate? That is not minor. It's consumers and reviewers at work. Look at the products they released afterward, and how much of a rough patch it was for the next two GPU generations.
> 
> *We can do that again*, but we actively need to be holding NV to greater standards by scrutinizing their methods.


The impact of Bumpgate to nVidia's reputation and market share was relatively minor:



Yes nVidia lost 13% market share between Q1 and Q3 of 2009. But how much of that was due to the success of HD 4000 and 5000 series GPUs, 4870 and 5870/5850 in particular?
Quote:


> Your point about the GTX 1060 is the same as mine. It is NV we are talking about here, a corporation, that will only give minimal benefits unless pushed. Are we to believe they were going to give us 3GB out of good graces? Let's say we agree.
> 
> I would hate to say it, but I think you are being cynical, rather than realistic. I am not an optimist, but we can not afford to give up ground by repeating JHH's words about how being in a duopoly justifies prices. As I have said, it is doing their PR work for them, and it is defending their position without any foreseeable benefit to the consumer.


So, what is it that you propose we do? Start a petition, take to the streets? If it's as simple as not buying the card, well then you can relax, because I have no plans of buying one. If it's about "speaking up" and not "being a silent victim", well half the thread is about the price, and plenty of people have spoke their mind already.

But I really need to get one thing clear: I am NOT and have NOT been defending the price hikes. But I do want to ask you, what is your opinion on AMD pricing 7970 @ $550, almost a 50% increase from 6970's $370? Should we too have started a riot about that?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Anyone who says 20% over 1080 has NO clue what they are talking about. This will be ~35% over 1080 at stock pretty much guaranteed, and just like the 980 TI will get a MUCH larger boost from overclocking than the cut-down card gets. Remember when the TITAN X maxwell card came out? Even though the Maxwell TITAN X only started at 1000mhz base clock it could go all the way to 1,500mhz in many cases; nearly matching the average ~1,550mhz that the 980 usually reaches via overclocking. And it's basic math that the lower your STARTING clock speed the bigger the percentage you gain from each mhz you can overclock it. (i.e. going from 1000mhz to 1500mhz is a massive 50% boost! But going from 1,600mhz to 2,100mhz like the 1080 does is only 31% despite still being a 500mhz increase. This means that you are gonna see damn close to TWICE the overclocking benefit on this TITAN X than on the 1080. And the 1080 already got ~8-9fps increase even at 4K when overclocked to ~2,050 - 2,100mhz or so; so you're easily looking at ~14-16fps increase when overclocking this TITAN)
> 
> So if we take say 35% over 1080 which is a fair real world 4K increase especially due to the much larger 480 GB/s bandwidth on the 384 bit bus the TITAN has which is more beneficial at the larger resolution like 4K; and then add in an overclock from 1,400mhz where it starts to 1,900mhz where Nvidia has claimed it can hit; we are looking at a 36% higher clock speed, meaning likely around 28-30% performance gain.
> 
> That puts it at roughly 65% faster than 1080; and remember Tech of Tomorrow did those Witcher 3 tests at stock speeds, no overclock. So if we take the ~40fps average the 1080 got and factor in the 65% increase of an overclocked TITAN X we get 40 * 1.65 = 66fps. So no, it CAN do >60fps at 4K with all settings maxed when you overclock it. Even non overclocked you're looking at roughly 54fps average even with max hairworks etc..etc.. and Witcher 3 is basically the most graphically demanding game out there for GPUs so anything else will perform even better.


Not this again. See below:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Titan X = 1.5x 980 in terms of chip spec, but in actual games only ended up being 25-35% faster. And this with only a 6.7% boost deficit relative to the 980 on average. (1119 MHz vs 1194 across 9 games) If you look through that Anandtech review, in the two games with the smallest boost clock difference (Crysis 3 and GRID Autosport), Titan X ends up being only ~35% faster even at 4K.
> 
> Titan XP = 1.4x 1080 in terms of chip spec (well shader count really since we know nothing about number of TMUs and ROPs), but the official listed boost clock at 1513 MHz is already 12.7% slower than 1080's official boost of 1733 MHz. So there's just no way stock vs stock the Titan XP will end up being 40% faster. As I've said previously, stock vs stock I expect Titan XP to be ~25% faster.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> This is why i'm saying that people complaining about the 478mm2 die size of the GP102 being "a ripoff cut-down chip" and saying that "in the past we would've gotten an x70 card with that kinda die size with the x80 being even bigger!" but that's simply not the case as even going back 10 years Nvidia NEVER made a 600mm2 die. The closest they've ever gotten in the past 10 years was the GTX 480 with 529mm2, which is still MUCH closer to the 478mm2 size of GP102 TITAN X than it is to the 601mm2 size of GP200/GK210 etc.. on the 780 TI and 980 TI. People are just trying to find any excuse to complain about a card they can't afford. (not talking about you in this last part for the record. Talking about others who commented back pages back near where you commented)


People are allowed to complain about anything they want to complain about. At $1200, you can should be able to complain about the color if you want to.

If we were concerned about diminishing returns, we'd get a 1080 Ti instead of the Titan XP anyway.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> As I pointed out earlier, it's because *those with the disposable income to spare simply don't care*. And they'll continue to not care for as long as nVidia can provide them with the latest and greatest.
> The impact of Bumpgate to nVidia's reputation and market share was relatively minor:
> 
> Yes nVidia lost 13% market share between Q1 and Q3 of 2009. But how much of that was due to the success of HD 4000 and 5000 series GPUs, 4870 and 5870/5850 in particular?
> So, what is it that you propose we do? Start a petition, take to the streets? If it's as simple as not buying the card, well then you can relax, because I have no plans of buying one. If it's about "speaking up" and not "being a silent victim", well half the thread is about the price, and plenty of people have spoke their mind already.
> 
> But I really need to get one thing clear: I am NOT and have NOT been defending the price hikes. But I do want to ask you, what is your opinion on AMD pricing 7970 @ $550, almost a 50% increase from 6970's $370? Should we too have started a riot about that?


Those people are the minority, we can still complain about the price. What harm does it do, like you said, if people will buy it anyway?

NV's revenue from 2007-2009:

April 30, 2009 664.23M
Jan. 31, 2009 481.14M
Oct. 31, 2008 897.66M
July 31, 2008 892.68M
April 30, 2008 1.153B
Jan. 31, 2008 1.203B
Oct. 31, 2007 1.116B

To top that off, as a solely GPU company, their market share decreased %13, and were required to pay $200M in damages.. that is not minor, especially for a small company. Sure causality matters, but are we to say it was just a minor infraction and small consequences on their part? Most definitely not.

Your tone suggests you believe that we can't do anything about these problems, as if some sort of AMD revolution is the only play left. You simply voice your concerns as a consumer loudly, clearly, and firmly. If others echo those same concerns, that is better than admitting you can do nothing and echoing JHH's love for our wallets by telling us what he price he will set.

Simply chalking price hikes up to a duopoly and lack of competition is giving in to the marketing and PR strategy they are campaigning, tell us who it benefits?

Unfair on my part.


----------



## carlhil2

Clock for clock, this gpu is going to put a whooping on the 1080, I mean, it should easily hit 2000+. it should OC just as well as the 1080/1070/1060, only, because of it's lower stock clocks, people will be fooled into thinking that it is the better OC'er......


----------



## Viveacious

Unsure why we're arguing about Titan X vs 1080 stock for stock when few here will keep them that way.

With the wider bus and higher core count Titan X will benefit more from an OC.

Is it worth 1200$? No, but it'll be a significantly better card (around 35%-40% faster.. just like has been said) once you overclock it.

This _is_ *Overclock.*net, right?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Clock for clock, this gpu is going to put a whooping on the 1080, I mean, it should easily hit 2000+. it should OC just as well as the 1080/1070/1060, only, because of it's lower stock clocks, people will be fooled into thinking that it is the better OC'er......


I'm not so sure about that. GP104 has a maximum ceiling of around 2200, and with an official boost of 1733, that's a 27% headroom.

A 27% headroom over a 1513 boost clock is 1920 MHz, which stills falls short of 2000 MHz.


----------



## Somasonic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> People are allowed to complain about anything they want to complain about. At $1200, you can should be able to complain about the color if you want to.
> 
> If we were concerned about diminishing returns, we'd get a 1080 Ti instead of the Titan XP anyway.


Does anyone think there will be a Ti this time around? What would they base it on and what would the likely specs be?

I'd love one of these Titans (it's the 1080 Ti I was waiting on/expecting) but at this point I can't afford it. Time to start saving I guess and see where the market goes because as I see it there's no realistic upgrade for my 980 Ti in sight.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Unsure why we're arguing about Titan X vs 1080 stock for stock when few here will keep them that way.
> 
> With the wider bus and higher core count Titan X will benefit more from an OC.
> 
> Is it worth 1200$? No, but it'll be a significantly better card (around 35%-40% faster.. just like has been said) once you overclock it.
> 
> This _is_ *Overclock.*net, right?


True. the OG Titan X, even though a great OC'er, would have been even better if, say, their were a Titan X "Classified".....


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'm not so sure about that. GP104 has a maximum ceiling of around 2200, and with an official boost of 1733, that's a 27% headroom.
> 
> A 27% headroom over a 1513 boost clock is 1920 MHz, which stills falls short of 2000 MHz.


So, if, for some reason, nVIDIA decided to release the 1080 with a boost clock of 1513, it wouldn't be able to hit that SAME OC of 2200? how does that work? and, excuse my ignorance..I would buy this gpu, but, since nVIDIA is only letting it be sold on it's site, I pass. when spending that kind of loot, I value an Insurance/Replacement Plan.....


----------



## SuperZan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Somasonic*
> 
> Does anyone think there will be a Ti this time around? What would they base it on and what would the likely specs be?
> 
> I'd love one of these Titans (it's the 1080 Ti I was waiting on/expecting) but at this point I can't afford it. Time to start saving I guess and see where the market goes because as I see it there's no realistic upgrade for my 980 Ti in sight.


I don't think that we'll see one unless Vega punches well above its projected weight. If it's at or slightly above 1080 performance, Nvidia has the market/mind-share to hold fast with the 1080 and Titan, perhaps dropping the price on the 1080 just a touch. If Vega were to somehow legitimately broach the Titan's 'performance sphere', as it were, we'd see a 1080 Ti, I've no doubt.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> So, if, for some reason, nVIDIA decided to release the 1080 with a boost clock of 1513, it wouldn't be able to hit that SAME OC of 2200? how does that work? and, excuse my ignorance..


I'm simply looking at how much OC headroom they left on the table for GP104, and using that headroom to estimate a ceiling for GP102.

But yes they could've deliberately underclocked Titan XP to make it look more impressive in terms of OC. But 2200 is 45% over 1513, and that's leaving way too much performance on the table. Even a 1550 MHz 980 Ti is "only" 34% over its average stock boost of 1156 MHz (average over 10 games from Anandtech).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> I don't think that we'll see one unless Vega punches well above its projected weight. If it's at or slightly above 1080 performance, Nvidia has the market/mind-share to hold fast with the 1080 and Titan, perhaps dropping the price on the 1080 just a touch. If Vega were to somehow legitimately broach the Titan's 'performance sphere', as it were, we'd see a 1080 Ti, I've no doubt.


Seconded.

If Vega comes in around 10% of 1080, nVidia would just cut the price to $500 (or less depending on how Vega is priced) and it'll look like a "good deal" again.

If Vega comes within 5% of Titan XP, then yes we a 1080 Ti would be conceivable.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'm simply looking at how much OC headroom they left on the table for GP104, and using that headroom to estimate a ceiling for GP102.
> 
> But yes they could've deliberately underclocked Titan XP to make it look more impressive in terms of OC. But 2200 is 45% over 1513, and that's leaving way too much performance on the table. Even a 1550 MHz 980 Ti is "only" 34% over its average stock boost of 1156 MHz (average over 10 games from Anandtech).
> Seconded.
> 
> If Vega comes in around 10% of 1080, nVidia would just cut the price to $500 (or less depending on how Vega is priced) and it'll look like a "good deal" again.
> 
> If Vega comes within 5% of Titan XP, then yes we a 1080 Ti would be conceivable.


True, but, the reason for the low clocks could be to keep the power in check, and, because they are claiming that it is geared to pros, not gaming. yeah, I know, but, it's what they are saying...the 5960x has a lower base clock than the 4790k, but, they could OC about the same..


----------



## magnek

Well, looking at the results on HWBot, it seems 5960X overclocks about 200 MHz worse than 4790K on air (4430 vs 4651) and water (4589 vs 4816).

My guess is the ceiling is closer to 2000 than 2200 on GP102, but we'll see in due time.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> I don't think that we'll see one unless Vega punches well above its projected weight. If it's at or slightly above 1080 performance, Nvidia has the market/mind-share to hold fast with the 1080 and Titan, perhaps dropping the price on the 1080 just a touch. If Vega were to somehow legitimately broach the Titan's 'performance sphere', as it were, we'd see a 1080 Ti, I've no doubt.


Agree, we may not see a 1080 Ti.

Those interested in getting better value may use history as a precedent and wait or buy a 1080.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Well, looking at the results on HWBot, it seems 5960X overclocks about 200 MHz worse than 4790K on air (4430 vs 4651) and water (4589 vs 4816).
> 
> My guess is the ceiling is closer to 2000 than 2200 on GP102, but we'll see in due time.


Could be right. my first chip hit 4.5 stable @1.30, my second does 4.7 at those voltages. both of my Devil Canyon chips did 4.7+, just that one did with less voltages...


----------



## meowth2

for the ultimate milking


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> Well, I was really hoping Dell would release the 120Hz OLED 4K UHD display by now (in time for the new Pascal Titan X) but that is not the case.
> 
> Here's an 'update' on the Dell monitor: http://www.pcper.com/news/Displays/Dells-New-30-4K-120Hz-UP3017Q-OLED-Monitor-Coming-Soon
> 
> It is highly unfortunate that the monitor supposedly uses USB Type-C and has no DP 1.3 or DP 1.4 connections!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure hope Dell is changing it to DP 1.4 or at least DP 1.3 so that we can run 120Hz 4K UHD with just one cable.
> 
> A dual Titan X (Pascal) should technically run 4K UHD @ 120Hz quite well.
> 
> Only time will tell.
> 
> Some pics of the monitor (so sexy):
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


$4999. Just let that sink in for a minute! *$4999!!!* I'm sorry but I would go get an LG OLED 65" TV for less money every day of the week before I'd spend even MORE money on this 30" monitor, 120Hz be damned! Still a beautiful monitor though...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> More like depressed because the high end GPU segment is just totally screwed up right now.


Hey, look at the bright side. The performance of cheaper alternatives has gotten so good (or gaming has become so stagnant maybe) that you no longer NEED to get the high end stuff anymore. I mean, unless you are trying to run 4K there's really little need for anything more than a $400 1070, and really even a 1060 or 480 will suffice for 1440p/60Hz or less no problem. Only those with super expensive monitors even need look to high end stuff these days so its not as much of a loss as it used to be when you HAD to buy the fastest GPU made just to properly run 1080p/120Hz...


----------



## magnek

That's true, but keep in mind that even the x60 cards basically cost twice the amount these days.







(and 1060 FE is just complete equine excrement. really an FE for a 1060? That's just preposterous)

In some ways I wish I'd stayed with 1080p/120Hz because even a 980 Ti (especially if overclocked to 1080 level) basically means you won't have to worry about upgrading for a few years.

1440p is another story though, and I sometimes have to choose between accepting dips into the 40 FPS or turning down a few settings, though for the most part I haven't had any problems with my 980 Ti (knock on wood).

But yeah 4K you have no choice but to chase the latest and greatest. And it's an endless chase too because after [email protected] is reached with Titan XP, you'll want [email protected] Then it's [email protected] (already a thing), [email protected], and it just never ends.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> 55 doesnt fit on my desk .. and it doesnt look like its 120 hz ?
> 
> +this


Somebody here uses a 65" LG OLED TV as his daily driver gaming monitor (former mod I think) and loves it. I personally don't give a flip about 120Hz or response time and would much rather put the money saved into my rig. For the $2200+ I could save on a 55" OLED TV over that Dell 30" monitor I could get a 6950X and the mobo/memory to go with it!

Edit - Its Murlocke. He could tell you a few things about using a TV for a monitor...


----------



## 12Cores

I really hope none of the reviewers bench this card at 1440p, at $1,200 its 4k 60fps or bust, just saying.

This card is going to be an absolute monster, cannot wait for the reviews, jaws a going to drop.


----------



## Rav3n07

I agree if this card has 1080P benchmarks I will cry.


----------



## DADDYDC650

My 1080 refund was just processed. Titan X, here I come!


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I am tired of the X79 platform. I have been on it since the 3820 was released(going on 5 years!). That's the only reason I have a desire to upgrade my cpu/motherboard. I wish gpus lasted like cpus.


Agreed. Hard to believe that my 3 year Intel Tuning Plan on my 4930K is soon to expire and I still haven't upgraded yet! Looking into getting a 5960X (don't need 10 cores) and a new Rampage/DDR4 memory myself. My rig is long past due for a total rebuild and I'll need to replace all my block anyway as corrosion has ruined them.

Considering my 1440p/60Hz monitors (that I have no interest in replacing considering the $800+ pricing on all of the "better" monitors out now) I think I will actually go with dual 1070's which would certainly be overkill for my setup. Still also considering 980Ti's (can get new ones for under $400 now) but as I said earlier you just don't need even 1080's for my resolution...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *12Cores*
> 
> I really hope none of the reviewers bench this card at 1440p, at $1,200 its 4k 60fps or bust, just saying.
> 
> This card is going to be an absolute monster, cannot wait for the reviews, jaws a going to drop.


I'd like to see 1440p benches... I plan on buying a x34p come this Christmas.


----------



## Somasonic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *12Cores*
> 
> I really hope none of the reviewers bench this card at 1440p, at $1,200 its 4k 60fps or bust, just saying.
> 
> This card is going to be an absolute monster, cannot wait for the reviews, jaws a going to drop.


I'd like to see 1440p results to see what the min frames are like as that's what I'm running now and love ultra settings + AA. I want to go ultrawide eventually though so that's what I'd really like to see, I think this would be _the_ card for 3440x1440








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rav3n07*
> 
> I agree if this card has 1080P benchmarks I will cry.


This I can agree with!


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *12Cores*
> 
> I really hope none of the reviewers bench this card at 1440p, at $1,200 its 4k 60fps or bust, just saying.
> 
> This card is going to be an absolute monster, cannot wait for the reviews, jaws a going to drop.


My predictions:

~25% faster than 1080 stock vs stock, up to 40% faster with max OC vs stock 1080. Maybe 50% faster with extreme OC under water with unlocked power limit vs stock 1080.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I am tired of the X79 platform. I have been on it since the 3820 was released(going on 5 years!). That's the only reason I have a desire to upgrade my cpu/motherboard. I wish gpus lasted like cpus.


Was the 3820 unlocked or not? Really can't remember. But it was only a quad core right? Did you get the 3820 or the hex cores?

I actually didn't even get my 4930K until August 2014, but it's held up really well. Apart from the lack of native USB3.0 and official NVMe support, there's nothing that's really enticing about any of the platforms available right now:

Z97: Go back to quad core? Ha no.
X99: 5960X is nice but that's really it. Also $$$
Z170: Skylake's improved IMC meaning 3200 MHz DDR4 is common is great, but again have to go back to quad core

But I think the next iteration of HEDT is when I'll finally upgrade, because Skylake IMC goodness + NVMe + MOAR COARZ = finally something worthwhile. That and I'll be stuck on Win 7 for a while (don't judge, don't argue), so Skylake is the last train I'll be able to catch.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Agreed. Hard to believe that my 3 year Intel Tuning Plan on my 4930K is soon to expire and I still haven't upgraded yet! Looking into getting a 5960X (don't need 10 cores) and a new Rampage/DDR4 memory myself. My rig is long past due for a total rebuild and I'll need to replace all my block anyway as corrosion has ruined them.


Make sure you use it even if just to get a brand new chip that you can sell later.







Seriously that $25 is sunk cost if you just let it expire.


----------



## 12Cores

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> .
> ~25% faster than 1080 stock vs stock, up to 40% faster with max OC vs stock 1080. Maybe 50% faster with extreme OC and on water with unlocked power limit vs stock 1080.


Right, just enough to get it to 4k 60fps with most modern AAA games, will be interesting to see what it can with the likes of the Division, Witcher 3, Crysis 3 and Rise of the tomb raider at 4k.


----------



## carlhil2

Majin SSJ Eric, The current batches of 5960x chips seem to OC better than the Day one chips. 4.7 seem the norm. $900 at MC isn't too bad a deal...


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> But yes they could've deliberately underclocked Titan XP to make it look more impressive in terms of OC. But 2200 is 45% over 1513, and that's leaving way too much performance on the table. Even a 1550 MHz 980 Ti is "only" 34% over its average stock boost of 1156 MHz


The lower stock clock speed is simply to keep it under its 250W TDP.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> My predictions:
> 
> ~25% faster than 1080 stock vs stock, up to 40% faster with max OC vs stock 1080. Maybe 50% faster with extreme OC under water with unlocked power limit vs stock 1080.
> Was the 3820 unlocked or not? Really can't remember. But it was only a quad core right? Did you get the 3820 or the hex cores?
> 
> I actually didn't even get my 4930K until August 2014, but it's held up really well. Apart from the lack of native USB3.0 and official NVMe support, there's nothing that's really enticing about any of the platforms available right now:
> 
> Z97: Go back to quad core? Ha no.
> X99: 5960X is nice but that's really it. Also $$$
> Z170: Skylake's improved IMC meaning 3200 MHz DDR4 is common is great, but again have to go back to quad core
> 
> But I think the next iteration of HEDT is when I'll finally upgrade, because Skylake IMC goodness + NVMe + MOAR COARZ = finally something worthwhile. That and I'll be stuck on Win 7 for a while (don't judge, don't argue), so Skylake is the last train I'll be able to catch.
> Make sure you use it even if just to get a brand new chip that you can sell later.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously that $25 is sunk cost if you just let it expire.


Agreed. I've got til November til it expires so I will part out the rig before then, send the old one in to Intel and have them send me a new one to sell BNIB. Just now I've made two NE Wishlists:

Intel 6700K
Asus Maximus VII Formula
4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
Samsung 850 Evo 1TB

Total - $2044

Or:

Intel 5960X
Asus Rampage V Extreme
4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
Samsung 850 Evo 1TB

Total - $2895

I figure I should be able to get around $800-$1000 back in parting out my rig ($250 per OG Titan, $150 for RIVE, $400 for 4930K; sound about right to you???) so I'm wondering which way to go? Only $850 more for an Octo-core setup, though slower single core speeds. What you think?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> The lower stock clock speed is simply to keep it under its 250W TDP.


Sorry should've made it clearer it was a joke in response to carl's question.







I mean in the next sentence I did say that'd be kinda ridiculous but yeah definitely wasn't obvious.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Agreed. I've got til November til it expires so I will part out the rig before then, send the old one in to Intel and have them send me a new one to sell BNIB. Just now I've made two NE Wishlists:
> 
> Intel 6700K
> Asus Maximus VII Formula
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2044
> 
> Or:
> 
> Intel 5960X
> Asus Rampage V Extreme
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2895
> 
> I figure I should be able to get around $800-$1000 back in parting out my rig ($250 per OG Titan, $150 for RIVE, $400 for 4930K; sound about right to you???) so I'm wondering which way to go? Only $850 more for an Octo-core setup, though slower single core speeds. What you think?


I think you could probably get more for your OG Titan, especially if you put them up on eBay. With some luck/patience should be able to fetch around $350. 4930K I don't think you'd get $400, even if BNIB, especially since 5820K is a thing. I'd say plan for around $300.

As for 5960X vs 6700K, I think it really depends on how you're gonna be using the system. If gaming is #1 priority then 6700K would still provide a better experience, especially in CPU intensive titles. But if you do a lot of multi-threaded stuff then 5960X would just blow 6700K away. Btw if you're gonna go with 6700K I'd stick with 2x8GB instead of 4x4GB. Reason being 6700K is dual channel only, so having 2 dimms/channel means more strain on the IMC = slightly worse OC on ram.

If you're still set on 980 Ti then make sure you can get them for less than 1070. I know this sounds obvious but BNIB 980 Ti still seems to go for >$350 these days (pre-rebate), and that's just not a good deal.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Silly I know but I like the aesthetic of four dimms over two, but thanks for the heads up. Been a while since I was on anything less than X79. Also going with 980Tis simply so I can get those sweet Aquacomputer blocks for them. Not much available for the 1070's right now...

About my usage, I do render a lot a video in adobe premiere so do you think the 6700 K would be at least as fast as my 4930 K or should I just go ahead and go with the 5960 X?


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Get a 1680 V2 and stay x79!


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Silly I know but I like the aesthetic of four dimms over two, but thanks for the heads up. Been a while since I was on anything less than X79. Also going with 980Tis simply so I can get those sweet Aquacomputer blocks for them. Not much available for the 1070's right now...
> 
> About my usage, I do render a lot a video in adobe premiere so do you think the 6700 K would be at least as fast as my 4930 K or should I just go ahead and go with the 5960 X?


Those sweet Aquacomputer blocks for 1070 are on sale already.









But yeah, max OC vs max OC 1070 and 980 Ti is basically identical under DX11, and DX12/VR 1070 wins of course. 2GB extra vram is also nice and would help futureproof against terribad console ports














But yeah like I said I personally wouldn't jump on a 980 Ti until it hits the $300 mark (with rebates is fine), but that's just me.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> You specifically said that it was "like a GTX 570" with the full 3,840 card being like a 580. You were acting like it was a drastically cut down chip or something. I'm simply pointing out that even the full GP100 only uses 3584 cuda cores due to bad yields, so that's not a fair comparison to make. Especially with how we've already seen with like the 980 TI vs Maxwell TITAN X that a 256 core difference makes next to NO difference really; maybe a couple percent at most. And with a larger core count of 3584 vs 3840 instead of 2816 vs 3072 you see even LESS percent difference between the two than we did between the 980 TI and Maxwell TITAN X.
> 
> Plus the die sizes make the "570 vs 580" comparison even more wrong. The 570 and 580 didn't even use a full 600mm2 die either! They used a 520mm2 die size! The GTX 480 used a 529mm2 die and the tweaked for better heat/power consumption 580 that was more of an "efficiency enhanced 480" used a slightly shrunk down 520mm2 die size.
> 
> Hell, lets go even FARTHER back! Even the Nvidia 9800 GTX flagship only had a 324mm2 die size! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_9_series
> 
> This is why i'm saying that people complaining about the 478mm2 die size of the GP102 being "a ripoff cut-down chip" and saying that "in the past we would've gotten an x70 card with that kinda die size with the x80 being even bigger!" but that's simply not the case as even going back 10 years Nvidia NEVER made a 600mm2 die. The closest they've ever gotten in the past 10 years was the GTX 480 with 529mm2, which is still MUCH closer to the 478mm2 size of GP102 TITAN X than it is to the 601mm2 size of GP200/GK210 etc.. on the 780 TI and 980 TI. People are just trying to find any excuse to complain about a card they can't afford. (not talking about you in this last part for the record. Talking about others who commented back pages back near where you commented)


You are the only one arguing about die size. Inaccurately to top it off. You can't seem to figure out that the Titan XP is a cutdown version of GP102 and that GP100 is going to be larger due to HBM2 integration. Think back to Titan and Titan Black or GTX 780 and GTX 780 Ti. If you still can't comprehend the argument...

Also, the Nvidia 9800 GTX launched at $299


----------



## Swolern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Silly I know but I like the aesthetic of four dimms over two, but thanks for the heads up. Been a while since I was on anything less than X79. Also going with 980Tis simply so I can get those sweet Aquacomputer blocks for them. Not much available for the 1070's right now...
> 
> About my usage, I do render a lot a video in adobe premiere so do you think the 6700 K would be at least as fast as my 4930 K or should I just go ahead and go with the 5960 X?


Just get alerted by nowinstock.net if you want 1070s, you can get them in no time. I got my 2 1070s STRIXs at an amazing price and loving them. If the Titan XP is stated by Nvidia to be 60% faster than the Titan X than 1070 SLI will easily beat the XP when SLI scaling is good. When good scaling I calculate the 1070s could be as much as 40% faster than the Titan XP, but you need a high res to take advantage of them. http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_1070_2_way_sli_review,24.html


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Agreed. I've got til November til it expires so I will part out the rig before then, send the old one in to Intel and have them send me a new one to sell BNIB. Just now I've made two NE Wishlists:
> 
> Intel 6700K
> Asus Maximus VII Formula
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2044
> 
> Or:
> 
> Intel 5960X
> Asus Rampage V Extreme
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2895
> 
> I figure I should be able to get around $800-$1000 back in parting out my rig ($250 per OG Titan, $150 for RIVE, $400 for 4930K; sound about right to you???) so I'm wondering which way to go? Only $850 more for an Octo-core setup, though slower single core speeds. What you think?


I downsized in a major way. From a Corsair 900D with 29 fans to Silverstone SG05BB-LITE. Consider an ITX build









I don't video edit so I don't see any practical use beyond 4 cores currently. Kaby lake should be out around November... Was thinking of delidding this 6700K but now I think it will be replaced in December with Kaby Lake or Zen...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Agreed. I've got til November til it expires so I will part out the rig before then, send the old one in to Intel and have them send me a new one to sell BNIB. Just now I've made two NE Wishlists:
> 
> Intel 6700K
> Asus Maximus VII Formula
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2044
> 
> Or:
> 
> Intel 5960X
> Asus Rampage V Extreme
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2895
> 
> I figure I should be able to get around $800-$1000 back in parting out my rig ($250 per OG Titan, $150 for RIVE, $400 for 4930K; sound about right to you???) so I'm wondering which way to go? Only $850 more for an Octo-core setup, though slower single core speeds. What you think?


I thought Intel shipped replacement CPU's without the retail box?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I thought Intel shipped replacement CPU's without the retail box?


Not when I got my 3960X replaced. Came with full retail packaging brand new. Sold on eBay and installed new 4930k I bought out of pocket.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Not when I got my 3960X replaced. Came with full retail packaging brand new. Sold on eBay and installed new 4930k I bought out of pocket.


Hope that's still true when I decide to do the same thing 2-3 years from now. Also, why are you so interested in 980 Ti reference cards?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> You are the only one arguing about die size. Inaccurately to top it off. You can't seem to figure out that the Titan XP is a cutdown version of GP102 and that GP100 is going to be larger due to HBM2 integration. Think back to Titan and Titan Black or GTX 780 and GTX 780 Ti. If you still can't comprehend the argument...
> 
> Also, the Nvidia 9800 GTX launched at $299


I forgot to point out to him, but prior to GM200, GT200 (used on the GTX 280) was also a monolith at 576mm². In fact, it's the second largest die in nVidia's history, right after GM200 @ 601mm². (well 3rd largest now that GP100 is 610mm² I suppose)

Not to mention GK110 itself was pretty beastly at 561mm². So:

GP100 = 610mm²
GM200 = 601mm²
GK110 = 561mm²
GF110 = 520mm²
GT200 = 576mm²

So if anything, Fermi was the odd one out at <550mm² die size. And if one wants to go REALLY far back, then the first big die nVidia made was G80, and it was still pretty massive for its time at 484mm². But yeah in any case he definitely remembered wrong.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I thought Intel shipped replacement CPU's without the retail box?


I got my replacement 4930K in a full retail box. There was a label that covered the entire front side with what appears to be internal transfer details, but nothing a little elbow grease couldn't get rid of.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Hope that's still true when I decide to do the same thing 2-3 years from now. Also, why are you so interested in 980 Ti reference cards?


These:


----------



## DADDYDC650

Ooooh, I see now.


----------



## Mad Pistol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> These:


Dude... pass me some of that kool-aid.


----------



## Bloodbath

I'm going to get one of these to replace my aging OG Titans. This will be the last card I buy for another 2-3 years.


----------



## DADDYDC650

So will Titan Xp have that ugly green LED on it's side like previous Titan's? Not seeing it in the pic below.


----------



## one-shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Agreed. I've got til November til it expires so I will part out the rig before then, send the old one in to Intel and have them send me a new one to sell BNIB. Just now I've made two NE Wishlists:
> 
> Intel 6700K
> Asus Maximus VII Formula
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2044
> 
> Or:
> 
> Intel 5960X
> Asus Rampage V Extreme
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2895
> 
> I figure I should be able to get around $800-$1000 back in parting out my rig ($250 per OG Titan, $150 for RIVE, $400 for 4930K; sound about right to you???) so I'm wondering which way to go? Only $850 more for an Octo-core setup, though slower single core speeds. What you think?


Is something wrong with BDW-E? Why are you suggesting a 5960x? I had to look to see if this post was made last year.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Somebody here uses a 65" LG OLED TV as his daily driver gaming monitor (former mod I think) and loves it. *I personally don't give a flip about 120Hz or response time* and would much rather put the money saved into my rig. For the $2200+ I could save on a 55" OLED TV over that Dell 30" monitor I could get a 6950X and the mobo/memory to go with it!
> 
> Edit - Its Murlocke. He could tell you a few things about using a TV for a monitor...


well, I very much do, I chose a 1440p 144Hz over 4K 60Hz after all

I wouldnt buy either of these things at those prices, but given free choice - as a desktop gaming monitor I would use a 30" 120Hz over 55" TV any day .. more manageable size, better dpi and 120Hz sweetness + much lower response time

so no need to try and educate me


----------



## Pragmatist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> well, I very much do, I chose a 1440p 144Hz over 4K 60Hz after all
> 
> I wouldnt buy either of these things at those prices, but given free choice - as a desktop gaming monitor I would use a 30" 120Hz over 55" TV any day .. more manageable size, better dpi and 120Hz sweetness + much lower response time
> 
> so no need to try and educate me


He doesn't seem to be into playing shooters, because even casuals understands why 144hz/120hz is superior. However, if you're into MMO's and locked 60 fps console ports, then it's probably worth getting a 4K 60hz instead. If you're competitive you'll most likely buy a 144hz+ monitor, or if you're sensitive to the unsmooth mouse cursor movement in comparison to 144hz.

All and all, it depends what you plan to use your monitor for, but with D.P 1.4 we should start seeing 120hz @4K monitors by next year and that's something I'm looking forward to.


----------



## Frosted racquet

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> So will Titan Xp have that ugly green LED on it's side like previous Titan's? Not seeing it in the pic below.


Yes, it will

CoQC--xVYAAue7Q.jpg 227k .jpg file


https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Was the 3820 unlocked or not? Really can't remember. But it was only a quad core right? Did you get the 3820 or the hex cores?
> 
> I actually didn't even get my 4930K until August 2014, but it's held up really well. Apart from the lack of native USB3.0 and official NVMe support, there's nothing that's really enticing about any of the platforms available right now:
> 
> Z97: Go back to quad core? Ha no.
> X99: 5960X is nice but that's really it. Also $$$
> Z170: Skylake's improved IMC meaning 3200 MHz DDR4 is common is great, but again have to go back to quad core
> 
> But I think the next iteration of HEDT is when I'll finally upgrade, because Skylake IMC goodness + NVMe + MOAR COARZ = finally something worthwhile. That and I'll be stuck on Win 7 for a while (don't judge, don't argue), so Skylake is the last train I'll be able to catch.
> Make sure you use it even if just to get a brand new chip that you can sell later.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously that $25 is sunk cost if you just let it expire.


3820 was only partially unlocked. Still overclockable to 4.8-5 if you got lucky. Mine did 4.8. I got it initially with the intent to go hex core later. Which I finally did late 2014. Got this 4930k used for $350 and it has served me well. I dont think I could go back to quadcore based off principal alone... lol

Really hope Zen is something special.


----------



## Klocek001

how much difference between the fastest amd card and fastest nvida card will there be when this launches in aug ? 1.8x stock, more than 2.0x oc vs oc ?
that's gonna be really weird looking at the charts seeing Titan X,1080,1070,Titan X,980Ti and Fury X in the middle, then again 980 and 1060.....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frosted racquet*
> 
> Yes, it will
> 
> CoQC--xVYAAue7Q.jpg 227k .jpg file
> 
> 
> https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


lol remember him from the pascal launch

http://www.overclock.net/t/1596635/gputechconf-nvidia-gtc-live-webcast-9am-pt/280#post_25051465


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frosted racquet*
> 
> Yes, it will
> 
> CoQC--xVYAAue7Q.jpg 227k .jpg file
> 
> 
> https://twitter.com/AndrewYNg/status/757734438436343808


Even marketing photos from Nvidia are full of lies!


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Dunno if I should feel bad for buying a 1080 or not? I did sell 2x 980s and make up 80% of the money I needed for a 1080. (If you don't take the 1080 WB in account, which still is not here yet). I can return my 1080 within 40 days.

Only reason would be if the 1080 would receive a price drop. The Titan XP is the new Ti sadly and I'm not gonna spend that kind of money on it. Going from a 980TI even the 1080 is stupid. But I had to get one card since I did sell 2x 980s I used for folding.. And going for a 1070 when only a couple of hundred more (which I can afford right now) for a 1080 is a better deal.

Do you think the 1080 will get a drop in price?

EDIT: Sorry for my grammars, this is esp. bad. Too tired to correct.


----------



## GraveDigger7878

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Dunno if I should feel bad for buying a 1080 or not? I did sell 2x 980s and make up 80% of the money I needed for a 1080. (If you don't take the 1080 WB in account, which still is not here yet). I can return my 1080 within 40 days.
> 
> Only reason would be if the 1080 would receive a price drop. The Titan XP is the new Ti sadly and I'm not gonna spend that kind of money on it. Going from a 980TI even the 1080 is stupid. But I had to get one card since I did sell 2x 980s I used for folding.. And going for a 1070 when only a couple of hundred more (which I can afford right now) for a 1080 is a better deal.
> 
> Do you think the 1080 will get a drop in price?
> 
> EDIT: Sorry for my grammars, this is esp. bad. Too tired to correct.


No I don't think there will be a price drop because the new Titan XP is not the Ti


----------



## meson1

I'm waiting for more information on TXP. It releases next week on the 2nd. So I expect the NDA will lift and everyone will be reviewing it. Once there are some benchmarks out there, I can compare my shortlist of products and weigh it up against my wallet. Titan XP is expensive for sure, but if the real world performance is comparable with 1080 SLI, it may well be a better and cheaper choice than a pair of 1080s.

But an objective decision cannot be made without Titan XP reviews.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I'm waiting for more information on TXP. It releases next week on the 2nd. So I expect the NDA will lift and everyone will be reviewing it. Once there are some benchmarks out there, I can compare my shortlist of products and weigh it up against my wallet. Titan XP is expensive for sure, but if the real world performance is comparable with 1080 SLI, it may well be a better and cheaper choice than a pair of 1080s.
> 
> But an objective decision cannot be made without Titan XP reviews.


Even if the card has impressive headroom for OCing, its very doubtful it will be comparable to 1080 SLI.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Even if the card has impressive headroom for OCing, its very doubtful it will be comparable to 1080 SLI.


The next generation flagship never beat a previous flagship SLI, I assume this will apply the same.

Even under the best clock plus 40% shader, it will perform 50% faster at best case scenarios against a stock 1080. And that is not sufficient to beat a SLI 1080 at stock clock which net around 60-75% at least.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Even if the card has impressive headroom for OCing, its very doubtful it will be comparable to 1080 SLI.


That may well be so. My point is I want to see the numbers. Then I can base a decision on empirical data, not suppositions.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> That may well be so. My point is I want to see the numbers. Then I can base a decision on empirical data, not suppositions.


Just compare

GTX 690 vs GTX 780
GTX 590 vs GTX 680
GTX 480 SLI vs GTX 580 and so on.

Titan is not even a full generational jump. I dont expect miracles.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Just compare
> 
> GTX 690 vs GTX 780
> GTX 590 vs GTX 680
> GTX 480 SLI vs GTX 580 and so on.
> 
> Titan is not even a full generational jump. I don't expect miracles.


Once again, you may well turn out to be perfectly correct. But none of those cards are a 1080 or a Titan XP. I am patient enough to wait a week to see actual real data.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Not this again. See below:


Even your own cherry picked review doesn't agree with those numbers...sigh.

 Dragon Age Inquisition 39% increase with TITAN X over 980

 Shadow of Mordor ~37% increase with TITAN X over 980

 GRID Auto 36% increase with TITAN X over 980

 Far Cry 4 35% increase with TITAN X over 980

And in other reviews you'll see it floating much more towards 40% and often close to 43-45% in some games. On average the TITAN X maxwell is close to 40% over the 980. You're trying to claim that this new TITAN won't be nearly as big of a difference simply due to a slight change in cuda-core percentage which is ludicrous. That "10%" is only 256 cuda cores, which we should ALL be well aware of the fact that "when on the same die" a difference of 256 is exactly the difference between the Maxwell TITAN X and 980 TI! And EVERYONE and their mom was saying "TITAN X isn't worth anything, 980 TI made it UTTERLY redundant" because there was literally like 3-4% difference AT MOST between the two. And using your same argument of "percentages" i can point out that 3,840 (50% over 1080 core-wise) vs 3,584 (40%) is even SMALLER of a real world difference than it was in the 980 TI vs Maxwell TITAN X comparison due to the larger starting numbers. 3072 vs 2816 (TITAN X vs 980 TI) was only a ~9% difference if you divide larger by smaller; do the same for 3840 vs 3584 and you get 7%. This means that the ~3-4% real world difference between TITAN X and 980 TI will actually be LARGER than the difference between THIS card and the theoretical "full GP102 3840 core" meaning only ~2% difference!

This means you are going to see AT MOST a ~2-3% lower difference between 1080 and this TITAN than we saw from 980 to Maxwell TITAN X! That is just pure math.

The fact of the matter is, this TITAN X is STILL 1024 cores more than the x80 model; which is the EXACT same as the 1024 cores that the 3072 core Maxwell TITAN X had over the 2048 core 980. That is why it will perform very close to identical to how the TITAN X did over the 980 in this comparison of 1080 vs TITAN XP.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> *People are allowed to complain about anything they want to complain about. At $1200, you can should be able to complain about the color if you want to.*


Oh of course! I didn't mean to infer that i was calling out people who are complaining about PRICE! Please don't misunderstand, even "I" am complaining about the price. It is 100% true that Nvidia has us almost conditioned to expect price hikes on flagship parts and we have just gotten used to it over time like a lobster slowly boiling in a pot that thinks it's a hot spring until he suddently starts burning to death; whereas if they raised the temps/price at once we would jump out of the pot so to speak.

I'm talking about people who are complaining about the PERFORMANCE, not people complaining about PRICE. Some people are saying this card is so much worse than previous TITAN cards and that it isn't even worth $999 or even $899 etc.. and such; even people comparing this card to an x70 card performance wise lol. Mostly it's due to the die size not being the magical 600mm2 that people expect from TITANs (even though the ONLY ~600mm2 dies Nvidia has EVER made were the original Keplar GK110/210 TITAN/780 TI etc.. and the Maxwell GM200 980 TI/TITAN X. They claim that past x80 flagships have been just as big; but fail to see that the vast majority of past flagships are between 350mm2 and ~425mm2 or so. The 9800 GTX was just a TINY bit bigger than the GTX 1080 die size. The only flagship that ever got even close to 600mm2 was the GTX 480/580 with their 520mm2 size that is alot closer to the 475mm2 size of this TITAN XP than it is to the massive 600mm2 of the GK210/GM200.)

People forget that the ONLY reason that Nvidia was ever making 600mm2 die's for consumer parts was that they were stuck at 28nm for longer than anticipated due to the fact that someone apparently forgot to mention how insanely difficult putting transistors 20nm, 16nm, and 10nm apart is lol. They NEEDED extra performance to keep people happy, so their flagship ~350mm2 GTX 680 ended up being superseded by the ~599mm2 OG TITAN; which was TOTALLY unheard of and is why people originally jumped all over the TITAN (the ones that could afford it of course). Nvidia had originally planned to go straight from the 600 series to 20nm Maxwell but had trouble; thus the 780 TI just re-used the TITAN die and the 780 caught the bad yield. We may NEVER see a 600mm2 die again due to the massive difficulty of 16nm and 10nm tech; who knows!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Clock for clock, this gpu is going to put a whooping on the 1080, I mean, it should easily hit 2000+. it should OC just as well as the 1080/1070/1060, only, because of it's lower stock clocks, people will be fooled into thinking that it is the better OC'er......


Nobody is being fooled. It technically IS the better overclocker if it has the same mhz increase. Going from 1000mhz to 1500mhz like the 980 TI etc.. does is a flat 50% increase. Whereas the 980 going from ~1250mhz to 1,550mhz is still 500mhz yes, but is only a 24% increase!! Yes they both OC the same "number" but the one that has the lower numbers will get a MUCH larger PERFORMANCE increase. THAT is why they call it "the better overclocker" if you see what i mean.


----------



## guttheslayer

It especially interesting to compare 980 Ti to 980 and scale it with pascal.

While the 1080 is simply 980 with pascal makeover. Titan X is the same 980 Ti pascal makeover, but rebranded as Titan and cost 80%-100% more.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> It especially interesting to compare 980 Ti to 980 and scale it with pascal.
> 
> While the 1080 is simply 980 with pascal makeover. Titan X is the same 980 Ti pascal makeover, but rebranded as Titan and cost 80%-100% more.


now it has just come to me, why is he comparing a full chip monster like 980Ti with a 1080. They're not the same tier. High-end vs "mid-range +" class. It's like measuring rx480 vs 390X for IPC, 390X is gonna win clock for clock, with a huge lead.

I think TXM vs 980 is gonna be better than TXP vs 1080. TXP is cut down, TXM is a full die. Additionally, I think 1080 is pretty fast for x80 card. For example, let's see 380X CF vs 980 and RX480 CF vs 1080.





It took a 980Ti for Maxwell generation to beat two R9 380X cards, now 1080 is beating CF RX480.


----------



## guttheslayer

The performance gap between TXP and GTX 1080 is the same as GTX 980 to 980 Ti.

Therefore the gap between TXM vs 980 is definitely bigger than 1080 to TXP.


----------



## FLCLimax

I don't get how people don't see this is a marked up 1080Ti.


----------



## sourplumps

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Somasonic*
> 
> Does anyone think there will be a Ti this time around? What would they base it on and what would the likely specs be?
> 
> I'd love one of these Titans (it's the 1080 Ti I was waiting on/expecting) but at this point I can't afford it. Time to start saving I guess and see where the market goes because as I see it there's no realistic upgrade for my 980 Ti in sight.


There will definitely be a 1080ti, or whatever they call it, meaning a GTX branded card using GP102. Every time nvidia has launched a Titan, Kepler and Maxwell based versions, end users have made the same mistaken prediction that there will not be a cheaper GTX based card. That Titan will be some sort of exclusive, and every time they've been wrong. I've bought all the Titan cards and made the same mistaken thought. I'll be buying one of these new ones, but won't kid myself there won't be a cheaper and just as fast GP102 GTX card in AIB form before the holidays of this year.

This Titan isn't even the full GP102. Some of the shaders are disabled. We know nvidia has fully working dies, but right now they are reserving them for their Tesla card that they've already announced. Just like there are dies that came off the assembly line not completely functional that will have to go in the new Titan X, there are going to be dies that are not even functional enough for the Titan X, that will go in a GTX GP102 card. This is exactly what happened with Kepler Titan to 780. Then later fully functional 780ti and Titan Black. It's going to happen again. Nvidia has been competing against themselves for a while now and the market for a $1200 gaming card is extremely small, but the market for the GP102 1080ti for hundreds of dollars less will be much, much larger.

Buying one of these new Titans under the assumption this is the only entry to GP102 is setting yourself up for disappointment, history says this is not how Nvidia will be handling their product stack. By the holidays of this year a GP102 GTX card will be on the market. I doubt it will even be that long. I expect it will release in October, probably for $800 MSRP and once again be just as fast with overclocking as the Titan X because you can get it in AIB non reference form.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> The fact of the matter is, this TITAN X is STILL 1024 cores more than the x80 model; which is the EXACT same as the 1024 cores that the 3072 core Maxwell TITAN X had over the 2048 core 980. That is why it will perform very close to identical to how the TITAN X did over the 980 in this comparison of 1080 vs TITAN XP.


https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GeForce_GTX_1060/26.html
^ Titan X is only ~25-30% over 980 stock vs stock .. 30%+ at best

3072 / 2048 = x*1.5* more cores = 30% more perf
3584 / 2560 = x*1.4* more cores = ~25% more perf

Math never lies


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sourplumps*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Somasonic*
> 
> Does anyone think there will be a Ti this time around? What would they base it on and what would the likely specs be?
> 
> I'd love one of these Titans (it's the 1080 Ti I was waiting on/expecting) but at this point I can't afford it. Time to start saving I guess and see where the market goes because as I see it there's no realistic upgrade for my 980 Ti in sight.
> 
> 
> 
> There will definitely be a 1080ti, or whatever they call it, meaning a GTX branded card using GP102. Every time nvidia has launched a Titan, Kepler and Maxwell based versions, end users have made the same mistaken prediction that there will not be a cheaper GTX based card. That Titan will be some sort of exclusive, and every time they've been wrong. I've bought all the Titan cards and made the same mistaken thought. I'll be buying one of these new ones, but won't kid myself there won't be a cheaper and just as fast GP102 GTX card in AIB form before the holidays of this year.
> 
> This Titan isn't even the full GP102. Some of the shaders are disabled. We know nvidia has fully working dies, but right now they are reserving them for their Tesla card that they've already announced. Just like there are dies that came off the assembly line not completely functional that will have to go in the new Titan X, there are going to be dies that are not even functional enough for the Titan X, that will go in a GTX GP102 card. This is exactly what happened with Kepler Titan to 780. Then later fully functional 780ti and Titan Black. It's going to happen again. Nvidia has been competing against themselves for a while now and the market for a $1200 gaming card is extremely small, but the market for the GP102 1080ti for hundreds of dollars less will be much, much larger.
> 
> Buying one of these new Titans under the assumption this is the only entry to GP102 is setting yourself up for disappointment, history says this is not how Nvidia will be handling their product stack. By the holidays of this year a GP102 GTX card will be on the market. I doubt it will even be that long. I expect it will release in October, probably for $800 MSRP and once again be just as fast with overclocking as the Titan X because you can get it in AIB non reference form.
Click to expand...

There is more likely to be a TITAN BLACK following this than a Ti. A Ti would be what, 15% over the 1080? at any price between the 1080 and Titan it'd be underwhelming and make both cards better choices.


----------



## sourplumps

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> There is more likely to be a TITAN BLACK following this than a Ti. A Ti would be what, 15% over the 1080? at any price between the 1080 and Titan it'd be underwhelming and make both cards better choices.


That's not how they do things. They don't slot the ti in the middle. Look at 980ti vs Titan X Maxwell. TX Maxwell was only 5% faster than 980ti, reference vs reference card. AIB 980ti was faster than Titan X. The same performance hierarchy was seen with Titan, 780 and 680. The 1080ti will be just a little behind Titan X Pascal. There is no real doubt on this. 1080ti will be out this year and will be barely slower than Titan X Pascal. This is how nvidia has been doing things for 2 generations now and will do the same thing now in this 3rd one. The competitive climate has been the same this entire time with nvidia solidly in the lead.

Anyone balking at TX Pascal's price should just wait a few months. There will be a cheaper GP102 this year.

Sure there will be a full chip card at some point, they already have them and will be selling them in Teslas. Once the process matures they'll release gaming cards using them. It could be Titan Black, or just like Kepler, they just release it straight to GTX and then do a Titan later. The market is far too large for GTX cards to ignore it. The market on Titan cards is too small to only sell GP102 there.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sourplumps*
> 
> *There will definitely be a 1080ti, or whatever they call it, meaning a GTX branded card using GP102. Every time nvidia has launched a Titan, Kepler and Maxwell based versions, end users have made the same mistaken prediction that there will not be a cheaper GTX based card.* That Titan will be some sort of exclusive, and every time they've been wrong. I've bought all the Titan cards and made the same mistaken thought. I'll be buying one of these new ones, but won't kid myself there won't be a cheaper and just as fast GP102 GTX card in AIB form before the holidays of this year.
> 
> This Titan isn't even the full GP102. Some of the shaders are disabled. *We know nvidia has fully working dies, but right now they are reserving them for their Tesla card that they've already announced.* *Just like there are dies that came off the assembly line not completely functional that will have to go in the new Titan X, there are going to be dies that are not even functional enough for the Titan X, that will go in a GTX GP102 card.* This is exactly what happened with Kepler Titan to 780. Then later fully functional 780ti and Titan Black. It's going to happen again. Nvidia has been competing against themselves for a while now and the market for a $1200 gaming card is extremely small, but the market for the GP102 1080ti for hundreds of dollars less will be much, much larger.
> 
> Buying one of these new Titans under the assumption this is the only entry to GP102 is setting yourself up for disappointment, history says this is not how Nvidia will be handling their product stack. By the holidays of this year a GP102 GTX card will be on the market. I doubt it will even be that long. I expect it will release in October, probably for $800 MSRP and once again be just as fast with overclocking as the Titan X because you can get it in AIB non reference form.


You make some good points here above, but I think that you're leaving something out. Competition. You have to consider what the market was like at the time it launched. For example - did AMD have a competitor out at the time that forced Nvidia's hand to bring something new to the market?

Right now AMD has no competitor to 1080. That may change with Vega, but it may not. And if it doesn't, what reason would Nvidia, a company who's out to make money, have to bring a cheaper card to the market when they can keep selling both Titan X and 1080 at a premium?

You mentioned there will inevitably be some that fall below the Titan X threshold and have to be re-branded as a Ti, but I think it also depends on just how many fall into that bucket. Re-branding a card adds marketing costs, and if the supply doesn't justify it, and the competition in the market doesn't justify it, then I'm not sure it necessarily follows that there will be a Ti.

I could certainly be wrong, but I don't think any of us know for sure at this point.


----------



## Kielon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sourplumps*
> 
> That's not how they do things. They don't slot the ti in the middle. Look at 980ti vs Titan X Maxwell. TX Maxwell was only 5% faster than 980ti, reference vs reference card. AIB 980ti was faster than Titan X. The same performance hierarchy was seen with Titan, 780 and 680. The 1080ti will be just a little behind Titan X Pascal. There is no real doubt on this. 1080ti will be out this year and will be barely slower than Titan X Pascal. This is how nvidia has been doing things for 2 generations now and will do the same thing now in this 3rd one. The competitive climate has been the same this entire time with nvidia solidly in the lead.
> 
> Anyone balking at TX Pascal's price should just wait a few months. There will be a cheaper GP102 this year.
> 
> Sure there will be a full chip card at some point, they already have them and will be selling them in Teslas. Once the process matures they'll release gaming cards using them. It could be Titan Black, or just like Kepler, they just release it straight to GTX and then do a Titan later. The market is far too large for GTX cards to ignore it. The market on Titan cards is too small to only sell GP102 there.


780Ti countered 290X while 980Ti countered FuryX...what kind of AMD product is 1080Ti supposed to counter then?


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kielon*
> 
> 780Ti countered 290X while 980Ti countered FuryX...what kind of AMD product is 1080Ti supposed to counter then?


There are ppl who dont understand Ti will never exist without a competitive product from AMD.

Nvidia is not going to do extra work of re-calibrate a new chip for gaming with no compete, especially if they have to price it lower.

No Ti, only next generation GTX 1180 which is suppose to be 1080 Ti if AMD has been more competitive.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Agreed. I've got til November til it expires so I will part out the rig before then, send the old one in to Intel and have them send me a new one to sell BNIB. Just now I've made two NE Wishlists:
> 
> Intel 6700K
> Asus Maximus VII Formula
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2044
> 
> Or:
> 
> Intel 5960X
> Asus Rampage V Extreme
> 4 x 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR4 3000MHz
> 2 x GTX 980Ti (reference)
> Samsung 850 Evo 1TB
> 
> Total - $2895
> 
> I figure I should be able to get around $800-$1000 back in parting out my rig ($250 per OG Titan, $150 for RIVE, $400 for 4930K; sound about right to you???) so I'm wondering which way to go? Only $850 more for an Octo-core setup, though slower single core speeds. What you think?


I wouldn't do sli, if I were you. I know you have been running sli for a long time, and as did I, for the most part ( and never again, if I can help it..lol ), but I have little confidence in Nvidia's willingness to provide adequate sli optimizations for any arch, given the underlying current of changes brought on by further DX 12 /vulkan utilization in games. Speaking of DX 12 and optimizations, why would you want to go from one obsolete arch to another, as neither architecture offers any meaningful dx12 feature set compliance?
At the end of the day, it's your call, but if you are a type of person that doesn't change gpus often, buying Nvidia's obsolete arch may not provide you the performance benefits that you expect , as more DX 12/vulkan based games become common.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *provost*
> 
> ... but I have little confidence in Nvidia's willingness to provide adequate sli optimizations for any arch, given the underlying current of changes brought on by further DX 12 /vulkan utilization in games ...


Nvidia aren't doing any SLI optimizations any more from DX12 onwards. The only SLI mode available is Explicit Mode. That means they are making game developers write for SLI. So that will go one of two ways.

Game developers code for Explicit SLI (like benchmarks do now) and you ought to end up with excellent scaling as a result.
Game developers don't write for SLI at all and you end up with nothing.
There is no middle ground.

What you won't get is the flakey situation we've had before (DX11 and earlier), which is developers write something that may or may not compatible with Implicit SLI and you end up with games that scale to varying degrees if they don't fall over or glitch.

Nvidia are trying to make SLI better both in terms of performance and reliability, but to do it, they are gambling that developers will code for two way SLI.

For us, it makes it a big gamble to buy that extra GPU as to whether or not DX12 games will be written for Explicit SLI.


----------



## ChevChelios

Is Ashes still the only dx12 game that supports multi gpu atm?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sourplumps*
> 
> There will definitely be a 1080ti, or whatever they call it, meaning a GTX branded card using GP102. Every time nvidia has launched a Titan, Kepler and Maxwell based versions, end users have made the same mistaken prediction that there will not be a cheaper GTX based card. That Titan will be some sort of exclusive, and every time they've been wrong. I've bought all the Titan cards and made the same mistaken thought. I'll be buying one of these new ones, but won't kid myself there won't be a cheaper and just as fast GP102 GTX card in AIB form before the holidays of this year.
> 
> This Titan isn't even the full GP102. Some of the shaders are disabled. We know nvidia has fully working dies, but right now they are reserving them for their Tesla card that they've already announced. Just like there are dies that came off the assembly line not completely functional that will have to go in the new Titan X, there are going to be dies that are not even functional enough for the Titan X, that will go in a GTX GP102 card. This is exactly what happened with Kepler Titan to 780. Then later fully functional 780ti and Titan Black. It's going to happen again. Nvidia has been competing against themselves for a while now and the market for a $1200 gaming card is extremely small, but the market for the GP102 1080ti for hundreds of dollars less will be much, much larger.
> 
> Buying one of these new Titans under the assumption this is the only entry to GP102 is setting yourself up for disappointment, history says this is not how Nvidia will be handling their product stack. By the holidays of this year a GP102 GTX card will be on the market. I doubt it will even be that long. I expect it will release in October, probably for $800 MSRP and once again be just as fast with overclocking as the Titan X because you can get it in AIB non reference form.


I agree with the others, this cut-down Titan IS the 1080Ti but with a $450-$500 price increase and a Titan name slapped on the box. Simple as that...


----------



## meson1

The 'cut down' Titan XP is not the 1080 Ti with a Titan name.

The reason we have the Titan XP with 3584 cores is GP102 yield and binning. They didn't get a sufficient yield of GP102 chips with all 3840 cuda cores working. So to produce their Titan XP, they reduced their required number of working cores to 3584.

Competition from AMD is not the factor that will give us the 1080Ti. Yield and binning is. If they are getting large quantities of GP102 chips with more than 2560 operational cuda cores, but less than the 3584 the Titan XP has, than rather than have them sitting there going to waste, they'll package them up into a new GPU and call it the 1080TI. They'll drop the price of the regular 1080 by $50 to $100 and slot the 1080Ti in at around the $800 price point.

This is a somewhat simplistic explanation to the binning process, because it's more than just about the number of working cores. It has to hold a certain clock speed and they need minimum number of other units on the chip to come out viable. But you get the idea.

They may possibly be getting some perfect GP102's with all 3840 cores working. If there are sufficient numbers, we could see a limited edition Titan XP Black or something down the line. But I wouldn't bank on it.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Even your own cherry picked review doesn't agree with those numbers...sigh.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Dragon Age Inquisition 39% increase with TITAN X over 980
> 
> Shadow of Mordor ~37% increase with TITAN X over 980
> 
> GRID Auto 36% increase with TITAN X over 980
> 
> Far Cry 4 35% increase with TITAN X over 980
> 
> 
> 
> And in other reviews you'll see it floating much more towards 40% and often close to 43-45% in some games. On average the TITAN X maxwell is close to 40% over the 980. You're trying to claim that this new TITAN won't be nearly as big of a difference simply due to a slight change in cuda-core percentage which is ludicrous. That "10%" is only 256 cuda cores, which we should ALL be well aware of the fact that "when on the same die" a difference of 256 is exactly the difference between the Maxwell TITAN X and 980 TI! And EVERYONE and their mom was saying "TITAN X isn't worth anything, 980 TI made it UTTERLY redundant" because there was literally like 3-4% difference AT MOST between the two. And using your same argument of "percentages" i can point out that 3,840 (50% over 1080 core-wise) vs 3,584 (40%) is even SMALLER of a real world difference than it was in the 980 TI vs Maxwell TITAN X comparison due to the larger starting numbers. 3072 vs 2816 (TITAN X vs 980 TI) was only a ~9% difference if you divide larger by smaller; do the same for 3840 vs 3584 and you get 7%. This means that the ~3-4% real world difference between TITAN X and 980 TI will actually be LARGER than the difference between THIS card and the theoretical "full GP102 3840 core" meaning only ~2% difference!
> 
> This means you are going to see AT MOST a ~2-3% lower difference between 1080 and this TITAN than we saw from 980 to Maxwell TITAN X! That is just pure math.
> 
> The fact of the matter is, this TITAN X is STILL 1024 cores more than the x80 model; which is the EXACT same as the 1024 cores that the 3072 core Maxwell TITAN X had over the 2048 core 980. That is why it will perform very close to identical to how the TITAN X did over the 980 in this comparison of 1080 vs TITAN XP.


Cherry picked? Oh right because 39%, 36.6% is sooooooooooo different from 35%.







Seriously who's the one doing the cherry picking now? Btw go back and check your math with GRID, it's only 34%, not 37% like you're trying to claim.

What "other reviews" are you referring to? Because TechPowerUp found even at 4K, the average difference between a Titan X and 980 is 31.6%.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







And in Guru3D's review, the absolute best it does @4K is 39.3% over 980 in Hitman Absolution, and that's just one game. The average is still around 35%. HardOCP didn't test 4K, but the absolute best they got was still 35.6% over 980 in Dying LIght a 1440p.

If I really wanted to cherry pick, I could've picked Hexus's review, because literally every single game they tested the Titan X fell short of 35% over 980 at 4K -- the best they got was 34% in Tomb Raider, and the worst they got was only 23.8% in Shadow of Mordor. If anything I "cherry picked" one of the most favorable reviews, and I'm supposed to be the one doing the cherry picking.

And you COMPLETELY missed my point. Titan X had 50% more of everything than 980, and while yes there was on average a 6-7% deficit in boost speed compared to 980, the average improvement still ended up being around 35%, _even at 4K_. Even if we add back that 7% to 35% (and that's assuming perfect 1:1 scaling), with 50% more of everything, clock for clock Titan X would still be 42% faster than 980 on average, using unrealistic math.

Titan XP only has 40% more shaders than 980, and the listed boost clock of Titan XP is only 1513 MHz, which is already 12.7% lower than 1080's listed boost of 1733 MHz. And you somehow expect Titan XP to be 35% faster than 1080, stock vs stock.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> now it has just come to me, why is he comparing a full chip monster like 980Ti with a 1080. They're not the same tier. High-end vs "mid-range +" class. It's like measuring rx480 vs 390X for IPC, 390X is gonna win clock for clock, with a huge lead.
> 
> I think TXM vs 980 is gonna be better than TXP vs 1080. TXP is cut down, TXM is a full die. Additionally, I think 1080 is pretty fast for x80 card. For example, let's see 380X CF vs 980 and RX480 CF vs 1080.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It took a 980Ti for Maxwell generation to beat two R9 380X cards, now 1080 is beating CF RX480.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> The performance gap between TXP and GTX 1080 is the same as GTX 980 to 980 Ti.
> 
> Therefore the gap between TXM vs 980 is definitely bigger than 1080 to TXP.


Yeah well tell it to the guy I'm responding to.


----------



## stangflyer

I think Nvidia will do a TI. Nvidia knows that there are lots of people that will NOT pay $1200 for this titan. They also know that the market is already starting to shrink for SLI. You see all the time in various tech forums that somebody just wants to "get one fast card" and get rid of SLI and Crossfire. Nvidia sees this also. They also know that there are tons of people still on 970 sli, 980sli and especially single 980ti's that did not see enough gain in 1070's or 1080's to upgrade yet. Many SLI users want to go single card but they need a card that will not lose frames. They will see enough gain in a proper 1080ti.

If a 1080ti comes out with the same cores as the new Titan X but with or without the artificial intelligence stuff on it and a price point around $ 800-$850 it would sell very well. Nvidia will not miss that part of the market share because it is profitable for them.

I hope they do because I went from 970's in SLI to a single 980ti Hybrid at 1500/7800 stock bios. Gaming on the TI is a better experience then the 970 sli without a doubt even if sometimes I have a few less frames. I will not SLI anymore even though I started way back with the 7950gx2. And yes $1200 is more than I will spend even though I can afford it. I will not give in to Nvidia's crap pricing. But I will pay $800-850 for 50% more frames than my 980ti. I play on 7680x1440 and that extra 50% would put me in a very good position game wise.

My 2 cents worth.


----------



## meson1

My prediction for a possible 1080 Ti is GP102 chip with 3072 Cuda cores, 384bit memory bus and 10GB GDDR5X memory.


----------



## stangflyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> My prediction for a possible 1080 Ti is GP102 chip with 3072 Cuda cores, 384bit memory bus and 10GB GDDR5X memory.


That may happen but I would not be interested in it. I would wait for Volta in that case. But I do agree with you that Nvidia may do that. I just hope not!


----------



## ChevChelios

3072 is too small of an increase over 1080 ...

IMO 1080Ti is either 3328, 3584 or 3840 ...


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> 3072 is too small of an increase over 1080 ...
> 
> IMO 1080Ti is either 3328, 3584 or 3840 ...


Here's my reasoning.

GTX 1080 has 2560 Cuda cores.
Titan XP has 3584 Cuda cores.
3072 Cuda cores is bang in the middle of those two.
But also remember that GP102 has a 384 bit memory bus as compared to the 256 bit bus of the GP104 of the GTX 1080. So there's a bit extra performance there too.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Is Ashes still the only dx12 game that supports multi gpu atm?


RoTR DX12 is. It works very well for me with CFX compare to DX11 CFX. I get same average fps but it's a lot smoother.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Nvidia aren't doing any SLI optimizations any more from DX12 onwards. The only SLI mode available is Explicit Mode. That means they are making game developers write for SLI. So that will go one of two ways.
> 
> Game developers code for Explicit SLI (like benchmarks do now) and you ought to end up with excellent scaling as a result.
> Game developers don't write for SLI at all and you end up with nothing.
> There is no middle ground.
> 
> What you won't get is the flakey situation we've had before (DX11 and earlier), which is developers write something that may or may not compatible with Implicit SLI and you end up with games that scale to varying degrees if they don't fall over or glitch.
> 
> Nvidia are trying to make SLI better both in terms of performance and reliability, but to do it, they are gambling that developers will code for two way SLI.
> 
> For us, it makes it a big gamble to buy that extra GPU as to whether or not DX12 games will be written for Explicit SLI.


If that ends up being the case then expect Titan sells to go through the roof. Without SLI everyone will be forced to buy crazy expensive single gpu's if they wan't to max out games in higher resolutions. I personally don't think they will ever make a single gpu powerful enough to satisfy everyone.


----------



## Lex Luger

No one should buy a gpu with close to a third of chip disabled. Nvidia tried to do this once and made one of the worst cards of all time, the GTX 465. It makes for a very inefficient chip.

As long as the new titan is selling out, nvidia has no reason to release a gtx 1080 ti and my guess is they wont. So either you pay 700 for the 1080 or 1200 for new titan. If you don't like it, then dont buy it or support whatever amd is releasing.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> If that ends up being the case then expect Titan sells to go through the roof. *Without SLI everyone will be forced to buy crazy expensive single gpu's if they wan't to max out games in higher resolutions.* I personally don't think they will ever make a single gpu powerful enough to satisfy everyone.


Ladies and gentlemen... Titan X!

I don't believe in coincidence. SLI is not working in VR, and soon it won't be working for the majority of 2D games, either. Game developers are not going to spend time optimizing for multiple GPUs when they already have to worry about multiple platforms already (PS4, XBOne, PC, tablet, etc). They are stretched thin as-is.

Couple this with the fact that Nvidia, since they won't be selling as many cards with SLI faltering, figures they need to make up that lost cash.. and I give you... Titan X!


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Ladies and gentlemen... Titan X!
> 
> I don't believe in coincidence. SLI is not working in VR, and soon it won't be working for the majority of 2D games, either. Game developers are not going to spend time optimizing for multiple GPUs when they already have to worry about multiple platforms already (PS4, XBOne, PC, tablet, etc). They are stretched thin as-is.
> 
> Couple this with the fact that Nvidia, since they won't be selling as many cards with SLI faltering, figures they need to make up that lost cash.. and I give you... Titan X!


They need to start calling cards for what they are then. GTX1060 1080P 60hz, GTX1070 1080P 144hz/ 1440P 60hz, GTX1080 1440P 120-144hz/ Ultra-Wide 60HZ, TITAN-XP Ultra-Wide 100hz/ 4k 60hz.

If you like AMD you're screwed past 1440p 60hz.


----------



## renejr902

Is someone here that can call jjh and ask him if a 1080ti or titan black will happen ? LoL. Seriously if they release a 1080ti or a titan black soon enough, people like me could be a little angry or disappointed to have bought a titan x. I think Nvidia wont do that now.
Honestly a titan black could get me very angry at them if released before end of this year... I wont be really angry at a 3072cores ti and 10gb , but a 3328 cores with still 12gb ram at same speed could get me a little angry if happen before end of year because i prefer a 1080ti aib edition at 3328 and 12gb, 3072 is too low. Aib is so much better than founders edition, i will take 3328 with 12gb instead for aib, i prefer a 3 fans edition or watercooled ed and save 400$

Still i believe nothing wont happen before fev-march , nvidia will wait vega from amd to make a decision. And i would not wait that much time i prefer the titan x at 1200 than wait next march


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Is someone here that can call jjh and ask him if a 1080ti or titan black will happen ? LoL. Seriously if they release a 1080ti or a titan black soon enough, people like me will be a little angry or disappointed to have bought a titan x. I think Nvidia wont do that now
> Honestly a titan black could get me very angry at them if released before end of this year... I wont be really angry at a 3072cores ti and 10gb , but a 3328 cores with still 12gb ram at same speed could get me a little angry if happen before end of year because i prefer a 1080ti aib edition at 3328 and 12gb, 3072 is too low. Aib is so much better than founders edition, i will take 3328 with 12gb instead for aib, i prefer a 3 fans edition or watercooled ed.
> 
> Still i believe nothing wont happen before fev-march , nvidia will wait vega from amd to make a decision. And i would not wait that much time i prefer the titan x at 1200 than wait next march


I've mentioned this in another thread but Msi has yet to release a Lightning 1080. With no apparent plans to do so. Last time this happen we got a 980Ti Lightning instead. If this no more SLI thing comes true I really don't have much of a choice. It's Titan-XP or Titan Black or better for me in the resolutions I play at.


----------



## mouacyk

With the voltage lock downs and diminishing scaling in recent generation, the Lighting has been losing appeal. Even the HOF doesn't have that great of an advantage in oc headroom.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> With the voltage lock downs and diminishing scaling in recent generation, the Lighting has been losing appeal. Even the HOF doesn't have that great of an advantage in oc headroom.


You may be surprised but I'd say 70% or more of the higher clocked AIB gpu's are never touched by the consumer as far as overclocking. The LIGHTNING is MSI's premier gpu and has been for many years. Offering superior build,near silent operation, better cooling and higher clocks then most of its competitors. I doubt the 30% of consumers who actually overclock their gpu's even further will be enough to sway MSI to discontinue their product.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GeForce_GTX_1060/26.html
> ^ Titan X is only ~25-30% over 980 stock vs stock .. 30%+ at best
> 
> 3072 / 2048 = x*1.5* more cores = 30% more perf
> 3584 / 2560 = x*1.4* more cores = ~25% more perf
> 
> Math never lies


Jesus you need to go back to school lol. I just showed all kinds of proof that the TITAN X maxwell was 35-40% faster than the 980 on average. And of course you ignore it. You also ignore the fact that there's an identical core difference and try the nonsense percentage based math as others are trying to use. You lost an argument online, get over it; it's not the end of the world lol.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Jesus you need to go back to school lol. I just showed all kinds of proof that the TITAN X maxwell was 35-40% faster than the 980 on average. And of course you ignore it. You also ignore the fact that there's an identical core difference and try the nonsense percentage based math as others are trying to use. You lost an argument online, get over it; it's not the end of the world lol.


Like you saying GPU Boost 3.0 can be disabled?









But yeah, ChevChelios is a hardcore NVidia fanboy, losing an argument online isn't the end of the world for him, NVidia is.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Nvidia aren't doing any SLI optimizations any more from DX12 onwards. The only SLI mode available is Explicit Mode. That means they are making game developers write for SLI. So that will go one of two ways.
> 
> Game developers code for Explicit SLI (like benchmarks do now) and you ought to end up with excellent scaling as a result.
> Game developers don't write for SLI at all and you end up with nothing.
> There is no middle ground.
> 
> What you won't get is the flakey situation we've had before (DX11 and earlier), which is developers write something that may or may not compatible with Implicit SLI and you end up with games that scale to varying degrees if they don't fall over or glitch.
> 
> Nvidia are trying to make SLI better both in terms of performance and reliability, but to do it, they are gambling that developers will code for two way SLI.
> 
> For us, it makes it a big gamble to buy that extra GPU as to whether or not DX12 games will be written for Explicit SLI.


That's only for 3 and 4 way. Nvidia is still doing full support for 2 way SLI even in DX12.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Like you saying GPU Boost 3.0 can be disabled?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But yeah, ChevChelios is a hardcore NVidia fanboy, losing an argument online isn't the end of the world for him, NVidia is.


Like how it CAN be disabled? lol. Seriously people, get some more knowledge. It's not that hard, software can do wonders i promise.

That's strange calling him a fanboy with the nonsensical math he's using right now. Perhaps he's just defending his 1080 purchase or something? But he's clearly biased against GP102 for some odd reason.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> The fact of the matter is, this TITAN X is STILL *1024 cores more* than the x80 model; which is the EXACT same as the 1024 cores that the 3072 core Maxwell TITAN X had over the 2048 core 980.





Spoiler: 56/40 < 48/32






Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Jesus you need to go back to school lol.


Please follow your own advice


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> That's only for 3 and 4 way. Nvidia is still doing full support for 2 way SLI even in DX12.
> Like how it CAN be disabled? lol. Seriously people, get some more knowledge. It's not that hard, software can do wonders i promise.
> 
> That's strange calling him a fanboy with the nonsensical math he's using right now. Perhaps he's just defending his 1080 purchase or something? But he's clearly biased against GP102 for some odd reason.


You are as clueless as anyone can get, you don't even know what GPU 3.0 is, let me begin by telling you something it isn't, it's not a software solution, it's a hardware implementation deeply embedded into Pascal.

talks about knowledge while demonstrating sublime ignorance, can't expect more from someone who babbles around driven by brand rooted emotions mixed with ignorance, love it!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: 56/40 < 48/32


That Facepalm is not enough for this guy, you need something stronger.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Anyone who says 20% over 1080 has NO clue what they are talking about. This will be ~35% over 1080 at stock pretty much guaranteed, and just like the 980 TI will get a MUCH larger boost from overclocking than the cut-down card gets. Remember when the TITAN X maxwell card came out? Even though the Maxwell TITAN X only started at 1000mhz base clock it could go all the way to 1,500mhz in many cases; nearly matching the average ~1,550mhz that the 980 usually reaches via overclocking. And it's basic math that the lower your STARTING clock speed the bigger the percentage you gain from each mhz you can overclock it. (i.e. going from 1000mhz to 1500mhz is a massive 50% boost! But going from 1,600mhz to 2,100mhz like the 1080 does is only 31% despite still being a 500mhz increase. This means that you are gonna see damn close to TWICE the overclocking benefit on this TITAN X than on the 1080. And the 1080 already got ~8-9fps increase even at 4K when overclocked to ~2,050 - 2,100mhz or so; so you're easily looking at ~14-16fps increase when overclocking this TITAN)
> 
> So if we take say 35% over 1080 which is a fair real world 4K increase especially due to the much larger 480 GB/s bandwidth on the 384 bit bus the TITAN has which is more beneficial at the larger resolution like 4K; and then add in an overclock from 1,400mhz where it starts to 1,900mhz where Nvidia has claimed it can hit; we are looking at a 36% higher clock speed, meaning likely around 28-30% performance gain.
> 
> That puts it at roughly 65% faster than 1080; and remember Tech of Tomorrow did those Witcher 3 tests at stock speeds, no overclock. So if we take the ~40fps average the 1080 got and factor in the 65% increase of an overclocked TITAN X we get 40 * 1.65 = 66fps. So no, it CAN do >60fps at 4K with all settings maxed when you overclock it. Even non overclocked you're looking at roughly 54fps average even with max hairworks etc..etc.. and Witcher 3 is basically the most graphically demanding game out there for GPUs so anything else will perform even better.
> You specifically said that it was "like a GTX 570" with the full 3,840 card being like a 580. You were acting like it was a drastically cut down chip or something. I'm simply pointing out that even the full GP100 only uses 3584 cuda cores due to bad yields, so that's not a fair comparison to make. Especially with how we've already seen with like the 980 TI vs Maxwell TITAN X that a 256 core difference makes next to NO difference really; maybe a couple percent at most. And with a larger core count of 3584 vs 3840 instead of 2816 vs 3072 you see even LESS percent difference between the two than we did between the 980 TI and Maxwell TITAN X.
> 
> Plus the die sizes make the "570 vs 580" comparison even more wrong. The 570 and 580 didn't even use a full 600mm2 die either! They used a 520mm2 die size! The GTX 480 used a 529mm2 die and the tweaked for better heat/power consumption 580 that was more of an "efficiency enhanced 480" used a slightly shrunk down 520mm2 die size.
> 
> Hell, lets go even FARTHER back! Even the Nvidia 9800 GTX flagship only had a 324mm2 die size! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_9_series
> 
> This is why i'm saying that people complaining about the 478mm2 die size of the GP102 being "a ripoff cut-down chip" and saying that "in the past we would've gotten an x70 card with that kinda die size with the x80 being even bigger!" but that's simply not the case as even going back 10 years Nvidia NEVER made a 600mm2 die. The closest they've ever gotten in the past 10 years was the GTX 480 with 529mm2, which is still MUCH closer to the 478mm2 size of GP102 TITAN X than it is to the 601mm2 size of GP200/GK210 etc.. on the 780 TI and 980 TI. People are just trying to find any excuse to complain about a card they can't afford. (not talking about you in this last part for the record. Talking about others who commented back pages back near where you commented)


lol make my day

funny tho oced vs oced my 1080 @ 2126 is only 12.5% (ROUND DOWN to 10% for margin of error) faster than my 980 ti @ 1560 and thats on SYNTHETIC BENCHMARKS


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Jesus you need to go back to school lol. I just showed all kinds of proof that the TITAN X maxwell was 35-40% faster than the 980 on average. And of course you ignore it. You also ignore the fact that there's an identical core difference and try the nonsense percentage based math as others are trying to use. You lost an argument online, get over it; it's not the end of the world lol.


I linked to FIVE different reviews (Anandtech, TPU, Guru3D, HardOCP, Hexus), and in each, only in a few (or ONE) best case scenario(s) was the Titan X 40%+ faster than 980. The average was much closer to 35% than 40%. And no you've shown nothing besides blabbing about "proof".

As for your comment about percentages, let's say there's 4 GPUs with the following specs:

A: 11000 cores
B: 10000 cores
C: 2000 cores
D: 1000 cores

Between A and B vs C and D, in each the difference is only 1000 cores. But because C has twice the number of cores as D, it'll end up 2x faster, assuming perfect scaling.

Now are you going to sit here and tell me that GPU A will also be twice as fast as GPU B, simply because "there's an identical core difference"?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> just showed all kinds of proof that the TITAN X maxwell was 35-40% faster than the 980 on average.


TPU disagrees

Quote:


> *nonsense percentage based math* as others are trying to use.


seriously ?


----------



## iLeakStuff

Should be about 30% faster than 1080. The chip got more ROPs and higher bandwidth but the cores are clocked low.
Shouldnt stop anyone from overclocking though


----------



## Baasha

Aah.. nothing like 200 pages of arguments about a product that is yet to be released and has no real reviews out.


----------



## Lex Luger

The clocks are low for power consumption reasons. Im fairly certain this will clock similar to the 1080, but expect it to draw over 300 watts when doing so.


----------



## BoredErica

Lol @ the math fail.

Anyways, I was thinking we'd see like 50% improvement over 1080 with the Titan... Guess not.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> Aah.. nothing like 200 pages of arguments about a product that is yet to be released and has no real reviews out.


What's even better is the one's who are mostly involved in arguing in this thread couldn't even afford a 1070 let alone a TitanX. But lets continue on how they aren't buying based off logic not price. Right.........

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> You are as clueless as anyone can get, you don't even know what GPU 3.0 is, let me begin by telling you something it isn't, it's not a software solution, it's a hardware implementation deeply embedded into Pascal.
> 
> talks about knowledge while demonstrating sublime ignorance, can't expect more from someone who babbles around driven by brand rooted emotions mixed with ignorance, love it!
> That Facepalm is not enough for this guy, you need something stronger.


Which one is it? Please share a link that shows Nvidia is no longer supporting SLI in DX12 and forward.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Which one is it? Please share a link that shows Nvidia is no longer supporting SLI in DX12 and forward.












I'm going to assume that you misquoted me, but I will also answer your question.

No, Nvidia and AMD are both dropping SLI and Crossfire for DX12... Kind of.

See, DX12 is all about developers having more control over our hardware and how it is being used, DX12 comes with great features like Explicit and Implicit Multi Adapter technology, this allow the developer to make use of several GPUs in their game, even GPUs from different brands and not just architectures.

Implicit Multi Adapter technology have the potential to be more efficient than Crossfire or SLI will ever be, therefore it makes no sense to keep CF/SLI technologies alive when DirectX 12 and Vulkan become mainstream and DX11 is long forgotten.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> See, DX12 is all about developers having more control over our hardware and how it is being used, DX12 comes with great features like Explicit and Implicit Multi Adapter technology, this allow the developer to make use of several GPUs in their game, even GPUs from different brands and not just architectures.
> 
> Implicit Multi Adapter technology have the potential to be more efficient than Crossfire or SLI will ever be, therefore it makes no sense to keep CF/SLI technologies alive when DirectX 12 and Vulkan become mainstream and DX11 is long forgotten.


this is terrible

most of them will ignore or butcher it horribly, making multi-GPU under DX12 worse then it was on average under DX11

I barely have faith in devs making well running single GPU PC games, much less with full multi-GPU support

and they barely have a reason to care, since SLI and CF are niche


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> this is terrible
> 
> most of them will ignore or butcher it horribly, making multi-GPU under DX12 worse then it was on average under DX11
> 
> I barely have faith in devs making well running single GPU PC games, much less with full multi-GPU support
> 
> and they barely have a reason to care, since SLI and CF are niche


They already barely have a reason to care. At least going forward, you will know game developers are either truly targeting multi-gpu setups and that said setups will work well, or that they are actually targeting single gpu setups without the lazy excuse of "buy more gpus if it doesn't run fast enough".


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> What's even better is the one's who are mostly involved in arguing in this thread couldn't even afford a 1070 let alone a TitanX. But lets continue on how they aren't buying based off logic not price. Right.........


Are you honestly saying that the people who are involved in arguing in this thread can't spare $400 for a 1070?

If so,







. And no your gut feeling doesn't count.


----------



## mouacyk

So now we know why Nvidia marked up the Titan XP and 1080 so much. Of course they'll never take the hit.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> this is terrible
> 
> most of them will ignore or butcher it horribly, making multi-GPU under DX12 worse then it was on average under DX11
> 
> I barely have faith in devs making well running single GPU PC games, much less with full multi-GPU support
> 
> and they barely have a reason to care, since SLI and CF are niche


If SLI dies then one of two things will happen. Option one is they start making games less demanding. Second is these price hikes continue because in order to play games at max in higher resolution and frames will take one hell of a single gpu. Either option is bad for the consumer. Even the Titan XP will not be able to run every game at Ultra settings 1440p(144hz) / Ultra-Wide(100hz)/4K(60hz) I guarantee it.
So where does that lead us for newer title's without SLI support in Dx12? Most of us with 2x gpu's don't run it because we wan't to but because we have no choice if we wan't to see games at maximum potential.


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> this is terrible
> 
> most of them will ignore or butcher it horribly, making multi-GPU under DX12 worse then it was on average under DX11
> 
> I barely have faith in devs making well running single GPU PC games, much less with full multi-GPU support
> 
> and they barely have a reason to care, since SLI and CF are niche


I don't think you understand multi adapter technology.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> I don't think you understand multi adapter technology.


i dont think you understood my post


----------



## SuperZan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Are you honestly saying that the people who are involved in arguing in this thread can't spare $400 for a 1070?
> 
> If so,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . And no your gut feeling doesn't count.


*Brandishes her 1070*


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> this is terrible
> 
> most of them will ignore or butcher it horribly, making multi-GPU under DX12 worse then it was on average under DX11
> 
> I barely have faith in devs making well running single GPU PC games, much less with full multi-GPU support
> 
> and they barely have a reason to care, since SLI and CF are niche


You're kidding right?

First of all, you say that like it isn't the case already with current CF/SLI, which is broken, barely working in most cases.

2-) There are two different implementations, Implicit and Explicit multi adapter technologies.

3-) Explicit Multi Adapter technology need no effort from developers to implement, the API takes care of all Multi GPU interactions, this is why you can mix different brands GPUs, the scaling is not as good (40-60%) but it works and it's effortlessly to implement.

4-) Implicit Multi Adapter is the superior technology and does require more effort to implement but it's still less complicated to implement than CF/SLI while being much more efficient, capable of 80-99% scaling and perfect performance/frame times beyond what CF/SLI will ever able to manage.

No, SLI/Crossfire are not good, long live Implicit/Explicit Multi Adapter Technology, and if your next argument is that developers aren't going to bother implementing these guess who also doesn't bother? Nvidia and AMD, and it barely works even when they do.

Plus developers can always choose to use explicit multi adapter which is an almost effortless way to do multi GPUs, just wait for games built from the ground up for DX12 and these will be popping everywhere.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> When do we get benchmarks? I'm ready to buy two on Tues.
> 
> When I told the wife newer cards than my GTX 1080 FEs were coming out she said put the old ones on eBay.


That's a keeper.


----------



## D749

When do we get benchmarks? I'm ready to buy two on Tues.

When I told the wife newer cards than my GTX 1080 FEs were coming out she said put the old ones on eBay.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> 3-) Explicit Multi Adapter technology *need no effort from developers to implement, the API takes care of all Multi GPU interactions*, this is why you can mix different brands GPUs, the scaling is not as good (40-60%) but it works and it's *effortlessly to implement.*
> 
> 4-) Implicit Multi Adapter is the superior technology and does require more effort to implement but it's still less complicated to implement than CF/SLI while being much more efficient, capable of 80-99% scaling and perfect performance/frame times beyond what CF/SLI will ever able to manage.
> 
> No, SLI/Crossfire are not good, long live Implicit/Explicit Multi Adapter Technology, and if your next argument is that developers aren't going to bother implementing these guess who also doesn't bother? Nvidia and AMD, and it barely works even when they do.
> 
> Plus developers can always choose to use explicit multi adapter which is an almost effortless way to do multi GPUs, just wait for games built from the ground up for DX12 and these will be *popping everywhere*.


Ill believe it when I see it everywhere


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> You're kidding right?
> 
> First of all, you say that like it isn't the case already with current CF/SLI, which is broken, barely working in most cases.
> 
> 2-) There are two different implementations, Implicit and Explicit multi adapter technologies.
> 
> 3-) Explicit Multi Adapter technology need no effort from developers to implement, the API takes care of all Multi GPU interactions, this is why you can mix different brands GPUs, the scaling is not as good (40-60%) but it works and it's effortlessly to implement.
> 
> 4-) Implicit Multi Adapter is the superior technology and does require more effort to implement but it's still less complicated to implement than CF/SLI while being much more efficient, capable of 80-99% scaling and perfect performance/frame times beyond what CF/SLI will ever able to manage.
> 
> No, SLI/Crossfire are not good, long live Implicit/Explicit Multi Adapter Technology, and if your next argument is that developers aren't going to bother implementing these guess who also doesn't bother? Nvidia and AMD, and it barely works even when they do.
> 
> Plus developers can always choose to use explicit multi adapter which is an almost effortless way to do multi GPUs, just wait for games built from the ground up for DX12 and these will be popping everywhere.
> That's a keeper.


SLI in the games that have a proper profile and support works awesome. Let me guess your last SLI/Xfire was a pair of 580's or 6970's right? The only current game I play that doesn't support SLI is doom and project cars. Luckily neither game is very demanding and SLI simply isn't needed. In Witcher 3, GTAV, FC series, BF series SLI works like a champ with excellent scaling. Most of you who bash SLI really need to come to grip and give it a try since a majority of the haters haven't tried it in years.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> SLI in the games that have a proper profile and support works awesome. Let me guess your last SLI/Xfire was a pair of 580's or 6970's right? The only current game I play that doesn't support SLI is doom and project cars. Luckily neither game is very demanding and SLI simply isn't needed. In Witcher 3, GTAV, FC series, BF series SLI works like a champ with excellent scaling. Most of you who bash SLI really need to come to grip and give it a try since a majority of the haters haven't tried it in years.


Even then, doesn't change the fact that Explicit Multi Adapter with little work can be as good as SLI/CF, we're talking almost no work at all, and Implicit Multi Adapter is beyond anything CF/SLI will ever achieve even in the best case scenario.

Even if you're right I'd be more willing to try out Multi GPU again in DX12 without SLI or CF, until then I'm staying away from spending huge amounts of money for 50% performance gains in 40% of games.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Ill believe it when I see it everywhere


Funny, you wouldn't need to see it to believe it if we were talking about a product that favors Nvidia


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> *Brandishes her 1070*


People just like taking cheap shots at others who don't share their opinions.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> You would upgrade CPUs if they where better. Look at the failure Broadwell-E are in terms of overclocking.


You say this, but i wonder who's system is faster in games, mine or yours.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> You say this, but i wonder who's system is faster in games, mine or yours.


I would hope yours. Otherwise you should get a refund!


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> The 'cut down' Titan XP is not the 1080 Ti with a Titan name.
> 
> The reason we have the Titan XP with 3584 cores is GP102 yield and binning. They didn't get a sufficient yield of GP102 chips with all 3840 cuda cores working. So to produce their Titan XP, they reduced their required number of working cores to 3584.
> 
> Competition from AMD is not the factor that will give us the 1080Ti. Yield and binning is. If they are getting large quantities of GP102 chips with more than 2560 operational cuda cores, but less than the 3584 the Titan XP has, than rather than have them sitting there going to waste, they'll package them up into a new GPU and call it the 1080TI. They'll drop the price of the regular 1080 by $50 to $100 and slot the 1080Ti in at around the $800 price point.
> 
> This is a somewhat simplistic explanation to the binning process, because it's more than just about the number of working cores. It has to hold a certain clock speed and they need minimum number of other units on the chip to come out viable. But you get the idea.
> 
> They may possibly be getting some perfect GP102's with all 3840 cores working. If there are sufficient numbers, we could see a limited edition Titan XP Black or something down the line. But I wouldn't bank on it.


What nonsense is this? Titan and quadro has been sharing sharing same specs all along since titan existence. This may not apply for first titan but at least they have same amt of memory. Now that the quadro only get 24gb and 3840 cores. Obviously that overprice gpu is the 1080 ti. Go look back in history and stop all these justification for pricing nonsense


----------



## DADDYDC650

4 more days fellas. 4 more long days....


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> 4 more days fellas. 4 more long days....


Is it sure that nvidia wont open titanx sale earlier? Is the sale beginning at midnight august 2 ? How does it work?


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> SLI in the games that have a proper profile and support works awesome. Let me guess your last SLI/Xfire was a pair of 580's or 6970's right? The only current game I play that doesn't support SLI is doom and project cars. Luckily neither game is very demanding and SLI simply isn't needed. In Witcher 3, GTAV, FC series, BF series SLI works like a champ with excellent scaling. Most of you who bash SLI really need to come to grip and give it a try since a majority of the haters haven't tried it in years.


I last used SLI with the 980s and wasn't impressed. At least half the games I play lack SLI support.

With SLI, the frame times can be erratic as well so having high FPS is sometimes misleading. In some games I was averaging 60-70 FPS and it certainly didn't feel like it... more like 50.

I would imagine if you look at the frame times and ignore raw FPS, this Titan X will give you a similar experience to two 1080s in many titles, aside from those where SLI scales really good (80%+). Most of the titles you listed do fall under that category, although the Witcher 3 isn't one of them, SLI scaling is only about 60% in that game.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> With SLI, the frame times can be erratic as well so having high FPS is sometimes misleading. In some games I was averaging 60-70 FPS and it certainly didn't feel like it... more like 50.


Microstutter.


----------



## emett

One of the main series I play is Battlefield and SLI works a treat. So to me the cost is justified right there.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Is it sure that nvidia wont open titanx sale earlier? Is the sale beginning at midnight august 2 ? How does it work?


All I know is that they go on sale August 2nd. More details will emerge soon enough.


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Ill believe it when I see it everywhere


There is not much involved with this tech. (It will be common in 2018.)

Secondly, Windows 10 & DX12 is soon to be everywhere. I don't see your point, what he is speaking about is fact. *What is... in question is how much of a gain does One actually get (%) from a one-off secondary card... & that still remains to be seen.*

But the though of not having to "throw away" or repurpose your current card, when you buy your new one is quite appealing. A 980 & 1080 tag teaming a game (BF1), would be much cheaper, than maintaining two exact same cards, all the time.

Or even, a R9 Nano & a 1070 pushing BF1 ..!

It does even have to match SLI performance, you simply gain 100% of performance of new car + whatever % of your old.

So if you had a 980 and upgraded to a 1080.. you gain a solid 30%+ increase across the board. But with explicit compatible, you could plop the old 980 in the second slot and then gain an additional 15% ~ 40% in performance.

With something like a theoretical +60% increase in performance, with upgrade card & being able to use your old one.

The actually 2nd card scaling is unimportant, because it is free.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> All I know is that they go on sale August 2nd. More details will emerge soon enough.


thanks for answer!


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Even then, doesn't change the fact that Explicit Multi Adapter with little work can be as good as SLI/CF, we're talking almost no work at all, and Implicit Multi Adapter is beyond anything CF/SLI will ever achieve even in the best case scenario.
> 
> Even if you're right I'd be more willing to try out Multi GPU again in DX12 without SLI or CF, until then I'm staying away from spending huge amounts of money for 50% performance gains in 40% of games.
> Funny, you wouldn't need to see it to believe it if we were talking about a product that favors Nvidia


Again when you're playing on higher resolution and frames you don't really have a choice. No single card can pull it off.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> One of the main series I play is Battlefield and SLI works a treat. So to me the cost is justified right there.


Exactly. BF1 will destroy even this upcoming Titan XP. In Ultra-wide 100fps and 4K 60fps I guarantee it struggles. Never have experienced this frame skipping or micro stutter you guys are talking about. Frames are always steady and smooth with very minimal drops. Same as I get on a single gpu. Last time I experienced these type of issues was when I had 6970's. My 690, Titan's. 980Ti's have been perfect. I don't play Indie games mostly AAA. 90% support SLI.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Again when you're playing on higher resolution and frames you don't really have a choice. No single card can pull it off.


At 1440p with a GTX 1080 I don't see why would I need two cards if I can just turn off the MSAA and use TSSAA, TAA or TSAA instead, even if the game doesn't support those then FXAA and SMAA should do.

I'm all for graphics, but there are graphics preset that makes no difference for 1440p like the Nightmare preset on Doom, Gameworks effects on the Witcher ETC...

Then you have adaptive sync that reduces the need for higher than 60 FPS in non competitive games, making everything smoother on lower FPS.

For games where FPS matter like Battlefield 4, Overwatch, Battlefield 1, CS:GO, Smite, HOTs I always tweak the settings for 130+ FPS while still having incredible graphics, for non competitive games 60 is more than enough, and in most of competitive games 200+ FPS is easily achievable with maxed out graphics with a 1070/1080 for a few exceptions (Battlefield 1, because Battlefield 4 already runs beyond 160 FPS 1440p maxed out).

So I don't think I need two GPUs, which would also introduce microstuttering to some degree, especially bad for competitive games where I could disable one GPU to eliminate it, but then again if I have to pay so much money just to have a GPU idling in the background most of the time then id rather just pay more for a single GPU.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Exactly. BF1 will destroy even this upcoming Titan XP. In Ultra-wide 100fps and 4K 60fps I guarantee it struggles. Never have experienced this frame skipping or micro stutter you guys are talking about. Frames are always steady and smooth with very minimal drops. Same as I get on a single gpu. Last time I experienced these type of issues was when I had 6970's. My 690, Titan's. 980Ti's have been perfect. I don't play Indie games mostly AAA. 90% support SLI.


A Titan XP will run BF1 @4K 60 frames without issue.


----------



## x3sphere

Based on the BF1 alpha, this card should handle it at 4K just fine. Of course who knows if the final game will be more demanding - I don't think it will be, though.


----------



## magnek

You may also want to mention they tested 4K *wth 4x MSAA*, which is just dumb. Turn that MSAA off and use SMAA and even a 1080 will do [email protected] min FPS.



Spoiler: GameGPU settings


----------



## Somasonic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> You may also want to mention they tested 4K *wth 4x MSAA*, which is just dumb. Turn that MSAA off and use SMAA and even a 1080 will do [email protected] min FPS.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: GameGPU settings


What's that 'resolution scaling 50%'? Is it running at half res and upscaling or something?


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> You may also want to mention they tested 4K *wth 4x MSAA*, which is just dumb. Turn that MSAA off and use SMAA and even a 1080 will do [email protected] min FPS.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: GameGPU settings


MSAA has always been dumb in BF games. BF4 solved that problem with resolution scaling.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Somasonic*
> 
> What's that 'resolution scaling 50%'? Is it running at half res and upscaling or something?


It's a bug. It does not work on the Alpha.


----------



## Somasonic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> MSAA has always been dumb in BF games. BF4 solved that problem with resolution scaling.
> *It's a bug. It does not work on the Alpha.*


Ah cool. I was going to call shenanigans on the benchmark


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Somasonic*
> 
> What's that 'resolution scaling 50%'? Is it running at half res and upscaling or something?


Just like the DX12 toggle that doesn't work, I suspect they might've just left it at default. Unless they actually only tested at 50% scaling across all 3 resolutions, in which case you better lube up your rig.


----------



## X1XNobleX1X

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Just like the DX12 toggle that doesn't work, I suspect they might've just left it at default. Unless they actually only tested at 50% scaling across all 3 resolutions, in which case you better lube up your rig.


50% scaling is actually 100%. It was a bug in the Alpha.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Ladies and gentlemen... Titan X!
> 
> I don't believe in coincidence. SLI is not working in VR, and soon it won't be working for the majority of 2D games, either. Game developers are not going to spend time optimizing for multiple GPUs when they already have to worry about multiple platforms already (PS4, XBOne, PC, tablet, etc). They are stretched thin as-is.
> 
> Couple this with the fact that Nvidia, since they won't be selling as many cards with SLI faltering, figures they need to make up that lost cash.. and I give you... Titan X!


SLI-haters have been spouting off the same nonsense about SLI for years now yet my SLI Titans are still plugging right along, working in every single game I play (small sample I admit). Perhaps in a few years you might be able to make this claim but as it stands SLI is still very relevant. And I mentioned the SLI-haters but I just can't understand what it is about dual card setups that certain people just find so threatening (I think at least some of it is rooted in dislike for the fact that their $1k GPU's can be beaten by slower, cheaper alternatives in SLI)? Its almost like some kind of obsession with these people to ejaculate bile and venom towards SLI/CF at every single opportunity even if that is not even the subject being discussed. Its almost like vegans or people who vape. Single card users simply can't help but make holier-than-thou comments about how superior single card setups are even if you are in a mobile phone thread, its crazy!


----------



## emett

? single card setup is superior? We can disable SLI and still have 9 FLOPs


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> SLI-haters have been spouting off the same nonsense about SLI for years now yet my SLI Titans are still plugging right along, working in every single game I play (small sample I admit). Perhaps in a few years you might be able to make this claim but as it stands SLI is still very relevant. And I mentioned the SLI-haters but I just can't understand what it is about dual card setups that certain people just find so threatening (I think at least some of it is rooted in dislike for the fact that their $1k GPU's can be beaten by slower, cheaper alternatives in SLI)? Its almost like some kind of obsession with these people to ejaculate bile and venom towards SLI/CF at every single opportunity even if that is not even the subject being discussed. Its almost like vegans or people who vape. Single card users simply can't help but make holier-than-thou comments about how superior single card setups are even if you are in a mobile phone thread, its crazy!


Having used 780M SLI and 970 SLI, I can attest that microstutter is real, and if you can perceive it, it really kills the enjoyment for you. So I'd say that's the #1 reason for most people.

Then there's times when SLI just isn't natively supported, and you feel like literally ripping the second card out of your machine and smashing it with a hammer. I know I ditched SLI and would never go back to multi-GPU again for precisely these two reasons.(well, it's a necessary evil for laptops, but with Pascal that may finally start to change)


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> SLI-haters have been spouting off the same nonsense about SLI for years now yet my SLI Titans are still plugging right along, working in every single game I play (small sample I admit). Perhaps in a few years you might be able to make this claim but as it stands SLI is still very relevant. And I mentioned the SLI-haters but I just can't understand what it is about dual card setups that certain people just find so threatening (I think at least some of it is rooted in dislike for the fact that their $1k GPU's can be beaten by slower, cheaper alternatives in SLI)? Its almost like some kind of obsession with these people to ejaculate bile and venom towards SLI/CF at every single opportunity even if that is not even the subject being discussed. Its almost like vegans or people who vape. Single card users simply can't help but make holier-than-thou comments about how superior single card setups are even if you are in a mobile phone thread, its crazy!


You just said you have a small sample of games that do well with SLI; we don't all play Crisis or Battlefield games. If you are on a 60Hz monitor then I can understand why you think SLI has been an amazing experience.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Nevertheless, to make blanket statements like "SLI is useless and everybody should only use single GPU" is flat out wrong. Microstutter is such an overhyped and trivial issue to start with and there are very few AAA titles (if any?) that don't support multi-GPU either. Neither of those factors makes up for the fact that you can get a couple of 980Ti's that will absolutely wreck a 1080 for less money (and SLI just looks plain sexy in a rig). I won't ever go back to single GPU until Nvidia/AMD flat out stop supporting it...


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> You just said you have a small sample of games that do well with SLI; we don't all play Crisis or Battlefield games. If you are on a 60Hz monitor then I can understand why you think SLI has been an amazing experience.


What games have microstutter that I should check out?

Haven't dropped to a single GPU since the GTX 260 and I can't go back.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> What games have microstutter that I should check out?
> 
> Haven't dropped to a single GPU since the GTX 260 and I can't go back.


The Metro series... beautiful graphics that will eat your multi-GPUs, but the stutter is real. So bad at times, there appears to be time warps.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> What games have microstutter that I should check out?
> 
> Haven't dropped to a single GPU since the GTX 260 and I can't go back.


Any and all Ubisoft games.









But seriously, it's not a game dependent thing. Try running a demanding game in such a way that you're only average 45 FPS. It's already an unpleasant experience with a single GPU, and with SLI, you'll want to punch your screen out.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I can see microstutter but it doesn't even bother me personally (the hyperbole people go into when discussing it like "I can't even physically play a game if there is any microstutter" is silly). When I built my first rig years ago it had a single 560Ti in it and that thing would only get 20-25 FPS in some games yet I was somehow able to use and enjoy it just fine and that was actual stutter, not microstutter. I think people have just gotten a little spoiled these days and act like games are ever going to be 100% fluid like irl. I can notice stutters when I disable SLI to this day in games and benches but its not like I want to run out and kill myself or anything. Jeez...


----------



## magnek

It's subjective to be sure, so what works for one may not work for another.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I can see microstutter but it doesn't even bother me personally (the hyperbole people go into when discussing it like "I can't even physically play a game if there is any microstutter" is silly). When I built my first rig years ago it had a single 560Ti in it and that thing would only get 20-25 FPS in some games yet I was somehow able to use and enjoy it just fine and that was actual stutter, not microstutter. I think people have just gotten a little spoiled these days and act like games are ever going to be 100% fluid like irl. I can notice stutters when I disable SLI to this day in games and benches but its not like I want to run out and kill myself or anything. Jeez...


Well, to be honest, it's the frame pacing that really matters for a tolerable immersive experience. Time warps caused by stutter is like a *** moment... whoa is that a feature? Smooth frame pacing at 25-30fps in story-driven games are a much better experience than one swinging from like 30fps to 60fps.


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> What games have microstutter that I should check out?


Ashes of the Singularity. That is considered a game right? The increase of frames was nice with the addition of another card, but the sluggishness was an unfortunate result that came with it. Probably just my experience though considering the lack of people who play the game.


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> The Metro series... beautiful graphics that will eat your multi-GPUs, but the stutter is real. So bad at times, there appears to be time warps.


No, I played both Metros @ 5760x1080 in 3D and they didn't stutter. Ran fine...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> Ashes of the Singularity.


Not for me, Playing this atm actually.


----------



## emett

Just ran a frametime benchmark on it for you. Frame time are all about 10-15ms


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> Just ran a frametime benchmark on it for you. Frame time are all about 10-15ms


If you are talking about Ashes load up a map and play a match. The benchmark gave me high numbers and looked smooth, but in game was different for me. I should note I used Nvidia+Nvidia (different cards) and Nvidia+AMD configurations. The Nvidia+AMD was the better of the two, but both exhibited noticeable downsides to me.

Also we are pretty OT already. SLI/CF/stutter has nothing to do with this new Titan.


----------



## Rei86

My eyes aren't 20/20 and they tanked on me when I was kid in the 4th grade after putting some pressure on them like an idiot. So somethings are probably lost on me. However I do know what Microstutter is but I really haven't ran into games with such issue. I know the newest game that I might have played would be Dark Souls 3 that had this issue even when locked at 60fps it would show stuttering like if it was actually running on the console going from 30fps to single digits.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Any and all Ubisoft games.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But seriously, it's not a game dependent thing. Try running a demanding game in such a way that you're only average 45 FPS. It's already an unpleasant experience with a single GPU, and with SLI, you'll want to punch your screen out.


Far Cry 3 and ZombiU I have zero issues. Mind you I bought Far Cry 3 a year after it came out and ZombiU is just a Wii U port so....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> The Metro series... beautiful graphics that will eat your multi-GPUs, but the stutter is real. So bad at times, there appears to be time warps.


Played the Metro series way late and I was running GTX 780Ti's in SLI when I 1st played even Metro 2033... I still need to go back and actually finish them up and I'm sure I won't have any issues with the SLI 980s I have now.


----------



## emett

https://postimg.org/image/cgy12wl7b/

Like I said butter smooth for me.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> SLI-haters have been spouting off the same nonsense about SLI for years now yet my SLI Titans are still plugging right along, working in every single game I play (small sample I admit). Perhaps in a few years you might be able to make this claim but as it stands SLI is still very relevant. And I mentioned the SLI-haters but I just can't understand what it is about dual card setups that certain people just find so threatening (I think at least some of it is rooted in dislike for the fact that their $1k GPU's can be beaten by slower, cheaper alternatives in SLI)? Its almost like some kind of obsession with these people to ejaculate bile and venom towards SLI/CF at every single opportunity even if that is not even the subject being discussed. Its almost like vegans or people who vape. Single card users simply can't help but make holier-than-thou comments about how superior single card setups are even if you are in a mobile phone thread, its crazy!


I'm not an 'SLI-Hater' and do not find it 'threatening' in the least. I've owned setups in the past as extreme as Quadfire and Tri-SLI on several occasions. And I can tell you from first-hand experience that they are a lot more troublesome than any single-GPU setup I have ever had. Especially Crossfire.

As far as future implementation and your reference to the vitriol going on 'for years' -- the difference between now and then is Nvidia is no longer doing the implementation for you. Game developers will have to.

Nvidia had plenty of incentive for implementing it because it drove sales. Game developers.. well, it just gives them something else to worry about on what's already a very full plate and does not benefit them much at all to worry about the great minority.

A test case for this is VR. There isn't a thing on the planet right now that would benefit more from multi-GPU setups because of the extremely high resolution demands. With supersampling I have pushed upwards of 6k on a few occasions. Yet, in my library of 25 games not a single one works with SLI, and from those developers I have spoken with there are no plans at all for its implementation. It's not even mentioned.. at all.

That all may change.. in time anything can. But the problem is that game developers are not going to build a game around it because 99% of the population, or greater, will not have it. It would be counter-productive for them to spend much time on something that so few of their customers care about.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> Well, to be honest, it's the frame pacing that really matters for a tolerable immersive experience. Time warps caused by stutter is like a *** moment... whoa is that a feature? Smooth frame pacing at 25-30fps in story-driven games are a much better experience than one swinging from like 30fps to 60fps.


100% this. I had to play Witcher 3 at sub 30 fps at 4K because CFX was not reliable. FPS is just a number when it comes to SLI and CFX until you know sure sure you are not getting terrible frame times. DX12 Multi GPU though could be the saving grace for dual GPUs.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I can see microstutter but it doesn't even bother me personally (the hyperbole people go into when discussing it like "I can't even physically play a game if there is any microstutter" is silly). When I built my first rig years ago it had a single 560Ti in it and that thing would only get 20-25 FPS in some games yet I was somehow able to use and enjoy it just fine and that was actual stutter, not microstutter. I think people have just gotten a little spoiled these days and act like games are ever going to be 100% fluid like irl. I can notice stutters when I disable SLI to this day in games and benches but its not like I want to run out and kill myself or anything. Jeez...


Experiencing stutter due to your GPU not being able to handle the load is one thing, but with microstutter the raw FPS doesn't match the subjective performance you're getting. It's super annoying. It also makes SLI benchmarks somewhat of a sham to me (unless they include frame time graphs).

SLI is manageable, if you are willing to tweak things to avoid the microstutter. Or maybe your FPS is high enough that you'll never notice it. For myself, it's not worth dealing with... I just always get the fastest single card I can afford nowadays. So to me, the Titan looks like a better buy than 2x1080 today.

If Nvidia/AMD can somehow come up with a solution that fixes it completely then I'd be fine with going multi-GPU again. I remember reading that SFR rendering was not prone to microstutter at the cost of scaling. I'd prefer that, but there's probably a reluctance to do so as benchmarks would look less impressive then.


----------



## SpeedyVT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> Experiencing stutter due to your GPU not being able to handle the load is one thing, but with microstutter the raw FPS doesn't match the subjective performance you're getting. It's super annoying. It also makes SLI benchmarks somewhat of a sham to me (unless they include frame time graphs).
> 
> SLI is manageable, if you are willing to tweak things to avoid the microstutter. Or maybe your FPS is high enough that you'll never notice it. For myself, it's not worth dealing with... I just always get the fastest single card I can afford nowadays. So to me, the Titan looks like a better buy than 2x1080 today.
> 
> If Nvidia/AMD can somehow come up with a solution that fixes it completely then I'd be fine with going multi-GPU again. I remember reading that SFR rendering was not prone to microstutter at the cost of scaling. I'd prefer that, but there's probably a reluctance to do so as benchmarks would look less impressive then.


DX12 will address this, the problem is the way DX11 works. Vulkan will fix this too.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SpeedyVT*
> 
> DX12 will address this, the problem is the way DX11 works. Vulkan will fix this too.


Yes, DX12 proper multi-adapter support will probably actually fix micro-stutter. I will be very happy once DX12 multi-GPU support is normal but I will buy the second GPU after it happens.









I had SLI Titans but I swapped to a single 980 Ti as soon as I could, it was a bit slower in raw FPS but it was a better experiance in everything I was playing at the time (Tomb Raider 2013 with G-sync wasn't good with SLI but it was great with a single GPU, I believe this was improved later with some patches/drivers). Fallout's engine always feels bad with SLI too.

I think how well SLI works for you really depends on what games you play but also, if there is increased frame time variation, it bothers some more than others.


----------



## l88bastar

SLI sucks and blows. I have never been satisfied with a multi-gpu solution. Titan X SLI was the last for me, even with high frames and gsync displays it still did not deliver as smooth an experience as one card with the games I like to play.


----------



## i7monkey

I had the unfortunate experience of stutter with a GTX 590 and it was unbearable. I returned it and later bought a 580 and it was a much smoother experience despite being much slower. That was 5 years ago and I'm still surprised they haven't addressed this issue.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> The 'cut down' Titan XP is not the 1080 Ti with a Titan name.
> 
> The reason we have the Titan XP with 3584 cores is GP102 yield and binning. They didn't get a sufficient yield of GP102 chips with all 3840 cuda cores working. So to produce their Titan XP, they reduced their required number of working cores to 3584.
> 
> Competition from AMD is not the factor that will give us the 1080Ti. Yield and binning is. If they are getting large quantities of GP102 chips with more than 2560 operational cuda cores, but less than the 3584 the Titan XP has, than rather than have them sitting there going to waste, they'll package them up into a new GPU and call it the 1080TI. They'll drop the price of the regular 1080 by $50 to $100 and slot the 1080Ti in at around the $800 price point.
> 
> This is a somewhat simplistic explanation to the binning process, because it's more than just about the number of working cores. It has to hold a certain clock speed and they need minimum number of other units on the chip to come out viable. But you get the idea.
> 
> They may possibly be getting some perfect GP102's with all 3840 cores working. If there are sufficient numbers, we could see a limited edition Titan XP Black or something down the line. But I wouldn't bank on it.
> 
> 
> 
> What nonsense is this? Titan and quadro has been sharing sharing same specs all along since titan existence. This may not apply for first titan but at least they have same amt of memory. Now that the quadro only get 24gb and 3840 cores. Obviously that overprice gpu is the 1080 ti. Go look back in history and stop all these justification for pricing nonsense
Click to expand...

Great. Thanks. You've been helpful there. That explains what happens to the perfect GP102's. So to review:

The best GP102s (3840 cuda cores) get used for Quadro P6000.
Second best GP102s (3584 cuda cores) get used for Titan XP.
Third best GP102s (guessing 3072 cuda cores) will eventually be used for the prospective 1080 Ti.
And there WON'T be any kind of limited edition Titan positioned above the XP.

It all fits. Great.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> What games have microstutter that I should check out?
> 
> Haven't dropped to a single GPU since the GTX 260 and I can't go back.


So, with my quad 690s (only have a single 690 now, and I no longer play with it since I have other cards that I can use now), I had fewer issues than with my Tri sli and 4 way sli Titans.
I used to swear by sli at one point in time, but I have had enough stuttering issues with Far cry 3, Far cry 4, Witcher 3, skyrim, for me to discontinue using Sli. I don't know if these issues were only related to Tri and 4 way sli, or game engine related, but all I can say is that my single Fury has been pretty smooth in a number of games, including Witcher 3. I must qualify the above by stating that I have never tried a single desktop Nvidia or two way desktop Nvidia sli set up for gaming (my 780 Ti was purchased for benching, and now serves a different tertiary purpose).

I just take a holistic forward looking approach to sli support by Nvidia; If it was hard for Nvidia to provide optimized sli support for Gameworks sponsored DX 11 games , it would be even more uneconomical to spend developer resources on dx12 based sli configurations .


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Exactly. *BF1 will destroy even this upcoming Titan XP. In Ultra-wide 100fps and 4K 60fps I guarantee it struggles*.




*stock 1080* does 50 fps @ 4K Ultra in *alpha*

edit: looks like I was beaten to the punch


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> Experiencing stutter due to your GPU not being able to handle the load is one thing, but with microstutter the raw FPS doesn't match the subjective performance you're getting. It's super annoying. It also makes SLI benchmarks somewhat of a sham to me (unless they include frame time graphs).
> 
> SLI is manageable, if you are willing to tweak things to avoid the microstutter. Or maybe your FPS is high enough that you'll never notice it. For myself, it's not worth dealing with... I just always get the fastest single card I can afford nowadays. So to me, the Titan looks like a better buy than 2x1080 today.
> 
> If Nvidia/AMD can somehow come up with a solution that fixes it completely then I'd be fine with going multi-GPU again. I remember reading that SFR rendering was not prone to microstutter at the cost of scaling. I'd prefer that, but there's probably a reluctance to do so as benchmarks would look less impressive then.


I've always felt ~40FPS on a single GPU feels about the same as 60FPS on a SLI setup. I'm very sensitive to frame times.

Since I tend to game with VSYNC on, SLI does not feel smooth at 60FPS to me. I feel like I am constantly gaming at 40-50FPS (depending on title) even though my FPS is a steady 60.

Some people claim they don't have that problem, but I think it's more they aren't sensitive to it and/or are use to it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> 
> 
> *stock 1080* does 50 fps @ 4K Ultra in *alpha*
> 
> edit: looks like I was beaten to the punch


Keyword is alpha there. If a 1080 is getting 41 min, I think the Titan X will achieve 60 at max when the game is actually optimized.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> I had the unfortunate experience of stutter with a GTX 590 and it was unbearable. I returned it and later bought a 580 and it was a much smoother experience despite being much slower. That was 5 years ago and I'm still surprised they haven't addressed this issue.


I still believe it is an issue only certain people are sensitive to. I am not sure it can be fixed for those people. The ones that arent sensitive to it should thank their lucky stars.

Can't believe there is so little new info on the Titan XP this thread has turned into a multi-gpu discussion.


----------



## ChevChelios

NDA also lifts on August 2-nd ?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> NDA also lifts on August 2-nd ?


Yes'm.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Just found out why Nvidia is charging so much for the 1080 and Titan XP...








http://www.tweaktown.com/news/53181/nvidia-ordered-pay-each-geforce-gtx-970-30-over-vram-controversy/index.html


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SpeedyVT*
> 
> DX12 will address this, the problem is the way DX11 works. Vulkan will fix this too.


Umm micro-stuttering is an inherent phenomenon of multi-GPU rendering. It gets worse with each additional GPU. This has to do with the additional time variance added by the additional hardware. Improved frame-pacing communications by the GPUs in hardware will minimize and eliminate it. Not sure how DX12 or Vulkan will fix this.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> At 1440p with a GTX 1080 I don't see why would I need two cards if I can just turn off the MSAA and use TSSAA, TAA or TSAA instead, even if the game doesn't support those then FXAA and SMAA should do.
> 
> I'm all for graphics, but there are graphics preset that makes no difference for 1440p like the Nightmare preset on Doom, Gameworks effects on the Witcher ETC...
> 
> Then you have adaptive sync that reduces the need for higher than 60 FPS in non competitive games, making everything smoother on lower FPS.
> 
> For games where FPS matter like Battlefield 4, Overwatch, Battlefield 1, CS:GO, Smite, HOTs I always tweak the settings for 130+ FPS while still having incredible graphics, for non competitive games 60 is more than enough, and in most of competitive games 200+ FPS is easily achievable with maxed out graphics with a 1070/1080 for a few exceptions (Battlefield 1, because Battlefield 4 already runs beyond 160 FPS 1440p maxed out).
> 
> So I don't think I need two GPUs, which would also introduce microstuttering to some degree, especially bad for competitive games where I could disable one GPU to eliminate it, but then again if I have to pay so much money just to have a GPU idling in the background most of the time then id rather just pay more for a single GPU.


Maybe in 4K but anything 1440p is night and day with Msaa. GtaV for example has a monumental visual difference with Msaa 8x vs. none at all. What ever floats your boat I guess. I want to see games at maximum potential. Have no interest in dialing settings back. Not when those settings make the game look considerably better. Not one single gpu available will give me a constant close to 80fps in 3440x1440 max settings Msaa 8x in GtaV. A pair of 980Ti's @ 1500mhz however will. SLI ftw


----------



## ChevChelios

I would turn AA down/off to avoid SLI any day


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> I would turn AA down/off to avoid SLI any day


Agree. Otherwise I might as well download 4k pictures and stare at them all day. Would give me more enjoyment than dealing with microstutter and other issues.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I still believe it is an issue only certain people are sensitive to. I am not sure it can be fixed for those people. The ones that arent sensitive to it should thank their lucky stars.
> 
> Can't believe there is so little new info on the Titan XP this thread has turned into a multi-gpu discussion.


That is not the problem with Dual GPUs lol. The problem I face with CFX is CFX not working at all. Actual stuttering visible by eye, very poor scaling, increased input lag in some games, artifacts like screen flickering etc etc. "Micro Stuttering" is a myth is FCAT shows good frame times.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> That is not the problem with Dual GPUs lol. The problem I face with CFX is CFX not working at all. Actual stuttering visible by eye, very poor scaling, increased input lag in some games, artifacts like screen flickering etc etc. "Micro Stuttering" is a myth is FCAT shows good frame times.


I assume you meant that's not the _*only*_ problem with dual gpus. All those are reasons for me not to deal with dual gpus.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I assume you meant that's not the _*only*_ problem with dual gpus. All those are reasons for me not to deal with dual gpus.


All those problems I have in Witcher 3 and RoTR. They released Dual GPU support for RoTR DX12 and all was fixed. DX11 Dual GPU is dead.


----------



## GorillaSceptre

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> All those problems I have in Witcher 3 and RoTR. They released Dual GPU support for RoTR DX12 and all was fixed. DX11 Dual GPU is dead.


Can't be.. I've been told repeatedly that DX12 and Vulkan multi-GPU can _only_ be worse than DX11..


----------



## rcfc89

All I see is people basically saying they would rather have crappy graphics at lower resolutions then run SLI. Might as well play on a console if cutting edge graphics aren't your thing. I guess in a couple days you guys won't have an excuse for settling with poor graphic settings anymore when Titan XP is released.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> All I see is people basically saying they would rather have crappy graphics at lower resolutions then run SLI. Might as well play on a console if cutting edge graphics aren't your thing. I guess in a couple days you guys won't have an excuse for settling with poor graphic settings anymore when Titan XP is released.


lol

playing with 1x 1080 or 1 Titan XP is still >>>> console, but also without the SLI headaches


----------



## criminal

So playing a game with anything less than SLI and 4K means running crappy graphics? Got it.

I wish you guys with quit quoting that guy. He is en elitist m0r0n.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> So playing a game with anything less than SLI and 4K means running crappy graphics? Got it.
> 
> I wish you guys with quit quoting that guy. He is en elitist m0r0n.


290X 4K master race. If I can play at 4K with since 290X I think anything faster is more then fine.


----------



## meson1

Actually, that's the solution to the SLI issue. We need consoles to be running dual GPU units. Then devs will write for SLI all day long


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> All I see is people basically saying they would rather have crappy graphics at lower resolutions then run SLI. Might as well play on a console if cutting edge graphics aren't your thing. I guess in a couple days you guys won't have an excuse for settling with poor graphic settings anymore when Titan XP is released.


You only have two 980tis and a QHD screen. You might as well play on an abacus because you aren't willing to run 4x Titan Xs at 8k


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Actually, that's the solution to the SLI issue. We need consoles to be running dual GPU units. Then devs will write for SLI all day long


You must be a fan of console split screens. 1280x720 ÷ 2


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> All I see is people basically saying they would rather have crappy graphics at lower resolutions then run SLI. Might as well play on a console if cutting edge graphics aren't your thing. I guess in a couple days you guys won't have an excuse for settling with poor graphic settings anymore when Titan XP is released.


Playing with SLI gives no benefit at all, at 1440p I can play GTA V above 120 FPS all day long, and Post processing AA does an excellent job on making MSAA worthless, even in games where post processing AA isn't supported there are dozens of ways you can enable it.

And even if I use MSAA I can still play above 80 FPS with a single card which thanks to adaptive sync works smooth as butter, making your argument absolutely invalid just like SLI is absolutely worthless for anything other than generating micro stuttering.


----------



## stangflyer

I figured I would get my 100th post out of the way on this subject.

I started using SLI/Crossfire all the way back with the 7950gx2. (Horrible card for SLI) I have had 280gtx, 5970, AIB 7950 boost, and 970's in SLI/Crossfire.

I played on SLI and crossfire for so long I did not realize the micro stutter etc. Then when Crysis one was big my cousin brought his rig which was very similar to mine. (X58 platforms) The only difference was that I have a 5970 and he had a 580gtx. We were each playing Crysis and I was getting about 5-7 more fps than he was but his game was visibly smoother. Tried other games and was very similar.

Fast forward a number of years when I had my two 7950's clocked to 1100 and he came down with his 780gtx. Played Far Cry 3 coop and a number of other games and it was the same thing. More frames but his single card was smoother.

Same thing 1.5 years ago. I had my 970's in sli and he still had his 780. Played games and framerate wise my setup destroyed his obviously. But as long as he got 50 fps his was smoother than mine.

So last October I decided to get a 980ti Hybrid. It was the first time I played on a single card since 2008. It was a night and day difference in game play. I clock mine on games at 1500-1550/7800. In some games the 970's got maybe 10fps higher. 60 versus 50. ( I play at 7680x1140 btw). But the single card was so much better. And it was NOT a vram issue.

End of story- I will NEVER go SLI/crossfire again. Too bad the new Titan X is $1200 - this would really help as I could turn a couple more important graphical settings up and get my fps where I would like with my triple screen. The other thought is to take $1200 bucks and get a 3440x1440 100 hz Gsync monitor.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stangflyer*
> 
> I figured I would get my 100th post out of the way on this subject.
> 
> I started using SLI/Crossfire all the way back with the 7950gx2. (Horrible card for SLI) I have had 280gtx, 5970, AIB 7950 boost, and 970's in SLI/Crossfire.
> 
> I played on SLI and crossfire for so long I did not realize the micro stutter etc. Then when Crysis one was big my cousin brought his rig which was very similar to mine. (X58 platforms) The only difference was that I have a 5970 and he had a 580gtx. We were each playing Crysis and I was getting about 5-7 more fps than he was but his game was visibly smoother. Tried other games and was very similar.
> 
> Fast forward a number of years when I had my two 7950's clocked to 1100 and he came down with his 780gtx. Played Far Cry 3 coop and a number of other games and it was the same thing. More frames but his single card was smoother.
> 
> Same thing 1.5 years ago. I had my 970's in sli and he still had his 780. Played games and framerate wise my setup destroyed his obviously. But as long as he got 50 fps his was smoother than mine.
> 
> So last October I decided to get a 980ti Hybrid. It was the first time I played on a single card since 2008. It was a night and day difference in game play. I clock mine on games at 1500-1550/7800. In some games the 970's got maybe 10fps higher. 60 versus 50. ( I play at 7680x1140 btw). But the single card was so much better. And it was NOT a vram issue.
> 
> End of story- I will NEVER go single card again. Too bad the new Titan X is $1200 - this would really help as I could turn a couple more important graphical settings up and get my fps where I would like with my triple screen. The other thought is to take $1200 bucks and get a 3440x1440 100 hz Gsync monitor.


for some reason Im so happy for you









miscrostutter is awful and noone should have to suffer it


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> Just ran a frametime benchmark on it for you. Frame time are all about 10-15ms
> 
> 
> 
> If you are talking about Ashes load up a map and play a match. The benchmark gave me high numbers and looked smooth, but in game was different for me. I should note I used Nvidia+Nvidia (different cards) and Nvidia+AMD configurations. The Nvidia+AMD was the better of the two, but both exhibited noticeable downsides to me.
> 
> Also we are pretty OT already. SLI/CF/stutter has nothing to do with this new Titan.
Click to expand...

Different cards SLI and different brands SLI?!


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> lol
> 
> playing with 1x 1080 or 1 Titan XP is still >>>> console, but also without the SLI headaches


Yes, not to mention is still 'cutting edge'.

Being able to pile 32xAA (I'm being facetious here) onto something doesn't make it 'cutting-edge'. Single GPU setups (on the high end) are plenty capable of rendering cutting-edge graphics at impressive resolutions.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Actually, that's the solution to the SLI issue. We need consoles to be running dual GPU units. Then devs will write for SLI all day long


Actually, that is probably one of the few things that could get it into the mainstream.

Don't hold your breath, though.


----------



## geort45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Actually, that's the solution to the SLI issue. We need consoles to be running dual GPU units. Then devs will write for SLI all day long
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, that is probably one of the few things that could get it into the mainstream.
> 
> Don't hold your breath, though.
Click to expand...

Pfft, as theyre just gonna release faster ps4 and xOne you cant count on it for other 5 years at least


----------



## Juub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> All those problems I have in Witcher 3 and RoTR. They released Dual GPU support for RoTR DX12 and all was fixed. DX11 Dual GPU is dead.


Wasn't fixed for me. Benchmark in DX12 averages 98fps at 1440p/Max Settings/High Textures/SMAA on two 980's but in-game it sticks to the 40's. Same settings in DX11 averages 85fps in benchmark and in-game mostly sticks to the high 60's low 70's with occasional drops to the 40's in the more demanding sequences.


----------



## kingduqc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Any and all Ubisoft games.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But seriously, it's not a game dependent thing. Try running a demanding game in such a way that you're only average 45 FPS. It's already an unpleasant experience with a single GPU, and with SLI, you'll want to punch your screen out.


I just ordered a second 980ti to see if I like the experience of multiple gpus.. I figured it's better to see now then when I do a complete rebuild around 2018 and see that I hate it. The problem is noise on air cooling, cant stand the noise and if I speed the fan down forget any OC you get get... I have to Watercool em. At that point it's getting expensive to get 150mhz more out of the cards..

Worst case I settle for a single gpu once volta or maybe vega/navi is out.. (By that time I hope titans wont be 1700$...)


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> So playing a game with anything less than SLI and 4K means running crappy graphics? Got it.
> 
> I wish you guys with quit quoting that guy. He is en elitist m0r0n.


May be some people have been used to playing on consoles with only a single card, and now having recently gone sli with some last year's tech, they are too giddy with excitement to defend their purchase here, rather than go and play on their "non consoles" of yesteryear ... End/sarcasm
Lol

In all seriousness, for someone who has always done Tri or quad card set ups, I don't personally know whether two way sli or crossfire are all that bad, or will be once developers get on board with optimizing the games for two way CFX/sli from the ground up. As I said, my "perceptible" stuttering (scaling was always an issue, even with quad 690s, but I didn't have perceptible stuttering issues) problems didn't really start until FC4 and Witcher 3 (some on Fc3, but not too much to complain about). This is when I was using Tri and Quad Titans, after which time I simply quit occasional PC gaming, put away my six or seven cards, and just played around with consoles here and there (it wasn't all that bad, just plug and play... Lol). But, of course visual fidelity of consoles doesn't currently match the PC (I do wonder whether it makes a difference (for occasional gamers...lol).

I never even tried to test a single or two way sli Nvidia set up, I was simply done (and have yet to try it, even if I have all my cards idling around in an unfinished build, or in a drawer) ..lol

So, my data point of a single card is solely related to my only meaningful AMD purchase of a Fury card. And, it has been such non problematic and smooth experience that I haven't looked back, or have had any desire to go to a balls the wall type of multi card set up.

I don't know if this is the case because I only game occasionally and all the games I have been trying recently have been well patched, or whether AMD really does have a secret sauce which I never tasted before because I was subconsciously biased against it without even trying it (even if I rarely vocalized such bias..lol), or my positive AMD bias now is still skewed, since I don't a single or two sli data point for Nvidia cards, or whatever...

But, after my single card "experiment", for better or worse, I have become a convert to single card gaming...lol

Now, if new dx12 games come out with awesome CFX/sli support, I would be the first to jump back on my multi card fetish, but until then, I am happy sticking to a monogamous gpu relationship...lol


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kingduqc*
> 
> I just ordered a second 980ti to see if I like the experience of multiple gpus.. I figured it's better to see now then when I do a complete rebuild around 2018 and see that I hate it. The problem is noise on air cooling, cant stand the noise and if I speed the fan down forget any OC you get get... I have to Watercool em. At that point it's getting expensive to get 150mhz more out of the cards..
> 
> Worst case I settle for a single gpu once volta or maybe vega/navi is out.. (By that time I hope titans wont be 1700$...)


lol yet people still don't understand why sb would trade 980ti for 1070. You can oc air cooled 1070 SLI all you want and still keep the noise at a reasonable level,that's over 100W less power draw/heat for each card in SLI configuration.
980Ti is still better for the money tho, you just need to invest some into a loop,two blocks and a case


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> lol
> 
> playing with 1x 1080 or 1 Titan XP is still >>>> console, but also without the SLI headaches


Maybe comparing your rigs to console's was a bit too harsh. I'll put it this way. If I sat down and played on your Rig I'd be disappointed.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Playing with SLI gives no benefit at all, at *1440p I can play GTA V above 120 FPS* all day long, and Post processing AA does an excellent job on making MSAA worthless, even in games where post processing AA isn't supported there are dozens of ways you can enable it.
> 
> And even if I use MSAA I can still play above 80 FPS with a single card which thanks to adaptive sync works smooth as butter, making your argument absolutely invalid just like SLI is absolutely worthless for anything other than generating micro stuttering.


Sure you could on High settings with no AA. I wouldn't even be able to stomach those low res and blurry texture's regardless of the frames. SLI giving no benefit you say? Yeah there's clearly no difference in 3440x1440 Ultra settings 8xMsaa and 2560x1440 High settings/ No AA. You're hilarious and delusional. Different strokes for different folks I guess.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Maybe comparing your rigs to console's was a bit too harsh. I'll put it this way. If I sat down and played on your Rig I'd be disappointed.
> Sure you could on High settings with no AA. I wouldn't even be able to stomach those low res and blurry texture's regardless of the frames. SLI giving no benefit you say? Yeah there's clearly no difference in 3440x1440 Ultra settings 8xMsaa and 2560x1440 High settings/ No AA. You're hilarious and delusional. Different strokes for different folks I guess.


Damn, you're hurt on spending money in a close to worthless technology so much now that you have to fabricate lies to defend it when the truth isn't good enough?



Seems to me the game is running not just fine but awesome while maxed out, why would I need a 2nd card again? Oh yes, to feel smug about it.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Actually, that is probably one of the few things that could get it into the mainstream.
> 
> Don't hold your breath, though.


That was my point even though that comment was somewhat tongue in cheek.

It would be a fast track way to get consoles to have enough graphical oomph to do 4K and high res VR though. But development times for such a beast of a console would be a couple of years at least. And by then there'd be single chip solutions with enough power for that job anyway. The time to release a dual GPU console would be this year. So, yes, if it's not already happening now (which we know it's not), it's not gonna happen at all.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Damn, you're hurt on spending money in a close to worthless technology so much now that you have to fabricate lies to defend it when the truth isn't good enough?
> 
> 
> 
> Seems to me the game is running not just fine but awesome while maxed out, why would I need a 2nd card again? Oh yes, to feel smug about it.


No AA is not "max quality" Sorry.

If I disable one of my 980Ti's at max settings and 8x Msaa I'm getting around 45fps even at 1500mhz on 2560x1440.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> No AA is not "max quality" Sorry


You sound like the kind of dude who thinks games without motion blur enabled is not "max quality".

We get it, you're a special snowflake.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> You sound like the kind of dude who thinks games without motion blur enabled is not "max quality".
> 
> We get it, you're a special snowflake.


Have you played GTAV maxed out with Msaa 8x. I bet not. Comparing "motion blur" to AA is ignorant at best. The game goes from looking like a PS4 game to having that "wow" factor when Msaa is added. Keep telling yourself that your mediocre system is "good enough." I'm done arguing with you kids. Haters gonna hate.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> No AA is not "max quality" Sorry.
> 
> If I disable one of my 980Ti's at max settings and 8x Msaa I'm getting around 45fps even at 1500mhz on 2560x1440.


So you're saying SLI have such poor scaling that a single GTX 1080 works better on GTA V? Because anyone will get 85 FPS with MSAA maxed out on GTA V with a GTX 1080, anyone without common sense at least.

See, MSAA was created to deal with Aliasing/Jaggies, there are tools out there like SMAA that deals with Jaggies just the same but with nowhere near the performance impact and no side effects like FXAA (Blurryness), so why would I use MSAA instead of SMAA? Because you DESPERATELY need a justification for your SLI setup?

Thank god life is simpler with powerful single GPUs solutions and I don't have to worry finding justifications for my inefficient, over expensive and worthless system in 70% of all games out there.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Thank god life is simpler with powerful single GPUs solutions.


How is life simple without SLI? You can't run *MAX* SETTINGS, man! Doesn't that keep you awake at night?


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> kind of dude who thinks games without motion blur enabled is not "max quality".


If one is comparing "max quality" settings, that would generally include such options, even if they offer no or barely perceptible improvements in subjective IQ.

It's find to acknowledge that there are some settings that are not worthwhile in terms of IQ vs. performance, or some options that may even subjectively lower IQ at the cost of performance, but "max quality" generally means everything is turned on and set to the most demanding option.


----------



## Fiercy

This debate was classic for many years people will always find reason to get SLI even though Nvidia it self already realized how bad it is and useless it is.
Yes some people say they are very happy with SLI but they say it themselves they don't play many games... People that play a large pool of games will not be satisfied. Look we have August: No Man's Sky, Deus EX new WoW expansion none of this games supports SLI.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> So you're saying SLI have such poor scaling that a single GTX 1080 works better on GTA V? Because anyone will get 85 FPS with MSAA maxed out on GTA V with a GTX 1080, anyone without common sense at least.
> 
> See, MSAA was created to deal with Aliasing/Jaggies, there are tools out there like SMAA that deals with Jaggies just the same but with nowhere near the performance impact and no side effects like FXAA (Blurryness), so why would I use MSAA instead of SMAA? Because you DESPERATELY need a justification for your SLI setup?
> 
> Thank god life is simpler with powerful single GPUs solutions and I don't have to worry finding justifications for my inefficient, over expensive and worthless system in 70% of all games out there.


Yet this guy is hovering around 45fps with only 4x Msaa. Anymore bs stories you'd like to share?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4v9-D0k7hBw


----------



## Glottis

Well this thread is annoying. I flick through pages and every time I see performance graphs posted I get excited thinking maybe some early performance info leaked, nope, it's just people reposting old stuff that has nothing whatsoever to do with Titan XP


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Yet this guy is hovering around 45fps with only 4x Msaa. Anymore bs stories you'd like to share?
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4v9-D0k7hBw


The only bullcrap is people using MSAA instead of better more efficient AA alternatives that achieves the same effect while maintaining over 100 FPS.


----------



## kingduqc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> lol yet people still don't understand why sb would trade 980ti for 1070. You can oc air cooled 1070 SLI all you want and still keep the noise at a reasonable level,that's over 100W less power draw/heat for each card in SLI configuration.
> 980Ti is still better for the money tho, you just need to invest some into a loop,two blocks and a case


1450 is still achievable dead quiet, you just have to be okay with high Temps. Most of the time I hear the hard drive over the fans.. But I don't see why you would trade a 980ti for a 1070.. 5% gain isn't even worth the hassle of removing the damn card lol.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> Well this thread is annoying. I flick through pages and every time I see performance graphs posted I get excited thinking maybe some early performance info leaked, nope, it's just people reposting old stuff that has nothing whatsoever to do with Titan XP


Look at 1080 performance graphs and add 25-30%.


----------



## Glottis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Look at 1080 performance graphs and add 25-30%.


we had months to do that, this close to release i no longer care about speculations and just want real numbers.


----------



## SuperZan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Have you played GTAV maxed out with Msaa 8x. I bet not. Comparing "motion blur" to AA is ignorant at best. The game goes from looking like a PS4 game to having that "wow" factor when Msaa is added. *Keep telling yourself that your mediocre system is "good enough."* I'm done arguing with you kids. *Haters gonna hate.*


Really? That made sense to you as you typed it? The only "hater" here is you, telling people their opinions aren't valid because you spent a little bit of money. If you're so pleased with your system you ought to be a bit more secure.


----------



## habu58

Some non gaming benchmarks.

http://videocardz.com/62723/first-synthetic-benchmarks-of-geforce-gtx-titan-x-pascal-hit-the-web


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> Really? That made sense to you as you typed it? The only "hater" here is you, telling people their opinions aren't valid because you spent a little bit of money. If you're so pleased with your system you ought to be a bit more secure.


I don't think (I don't want to anyway) we are allowed to directly talk to that person since we have such inadequate systems.


----------



## geort45

"Performance gains" should be "performance vs prev gen", 120% it's just extra 20% not extra 120%


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SuperZan*
> 
> Really? That made sense to you as you typed it? The only "hater" here is you, telling people their opinions aren't valid because you spent a little bit of money. *If you're so pleased with your system you ought to be a bit more secure*.


_Ding-ding-ding!!!!_


----------



## geort45




----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Well I don't care what any of you guys say I will never go back to single card set up again. I know what my eyes can see better than any of you and I have absolutely no issues with SLI at all, just more performance all the time than even a 1080 with 3.5 year old cards. Good enough for me...


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Have you played GTAV maxed out with Msaa 8x. I bet not. Comparing "motion blur" to AA is ignorant at best. The game goes from looking like a PS4 game to having that "wow" factor when Msaa is added. Keep telling yourself that your *mediocre system* is "good enough." I'm done arguing with you kids. Haters gonna hate.


Says the guy with a 3930K, 1866 ram, and only two 980 Ti's.


----------



## Tobe404

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well I don't care what any of you guys say I will never go back to single card set up again. I know what my eyes can see better than any of you and I have absolutely no issues with SLI at all, just more performance all the time than even a 1080 with 3.5 year old cards. Good enough for me...


I never had issues with CF either. Might get a bit hot at times. But that's about it. Plus it didn't help that one of the cards (280x) died. Ah well.

Hell I still have my 6950 CF cards in the old rig - still kicking along fine.

I was tossing up between a 390x and 480 but now I'm thinking a 1060 (can get brand new 1060 for 400 vs 380 for reference 480 8GB new - [300 for used 390x]) isn't a bad idea. Just wish they let it have SLI support.

The one thing that does worry me though. Is how quick 1060 will be - not obsolete - but gimped.


----------



## Nightingale

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> So you're saying SLI have such poor scaling that a single GTX 1080 works better on GTA V? Because anyone will get 85 FPS with MSAA maxed out on GTA V with a GTX 1080, anyone without common sense at least.
> 
> See, MSAA was created to deal with Aliasing/Jaggies, there are tools out there like SMAA that deals with Jaggies just the same but with nowhere near the performance impact and no side effects like FXAA (Blurryness), so why would I use MSAA instead of SMAA? Because you DESPERATELY need a justification for your SLI setup?
> 
> Thank god life is simpler with powerful single GPUs solutions and I don't have to worry finding justifications for my inefficient, over expensive and worthless system in 70% of all games out there.


SMAA is the best PP AA tool, however it is not equal to real MSAA. Point in case what I usually do is enabled 4xMSAA +SMAA instead of running 8xMSAA to achieve better frames.
Post processing like FXAA for example smears the image quality making everthing look dull. SMAA while good still causes aliasing that only MSAA, SSAA or TXAA(this form does have issues) can remove without without compromising the sharpness and maintaining the best image quality.


----------



## Tobe404

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tobe404*
> 
> I never had issues with CF either. Might get a bit hot at times. But that's about it. Plus it didn't help that one of the cards (280x) died. Ah well.
> 
> Hell I still have my 6950 CF cards in the old rig - still kicking along fine.
> 
> I was tossing up between a 390x and 480 but now I'm thinking a 1060 (can get brand new 1060 AIB for $400 or $380 for reference 480 8GB new - [$300-350 for used 390x]) isn't a bad idea. Just wish they let it have SLI support.
> 
> The one thing that does worry me though. Is how quick 1060 will be - not obsolete - but gimped.


Whoops meant to edit the first post not make a new one...


----------



## Ghoxt

I haven't had problems with normal (2X) SLI in any of the AAA games that support it. I would say it's a L2P issue but many of you might get yer panties in a bunch lol. J/K


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Says the guy with a 3930K, 1866 ram, and only two 980 Ti's.


Savage.


----------



## magnek

The way he's talking you'd figure he's the #yoloswag type with a 6950X, Titan X quad SLI, 64GB 4266 DDR4, Intel 750 in Raid-0 or something like that. But no not even _close_. Hell pretty sure I invested more into my rig than he did. (and this is without counting the custom loop cost







)


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well I don't care what any of you guys say I will never go back to single card set up again. I know what my eyes can see better than any of you and I have absolutely no issues with SLI at all, just more performance all the time than even a 1080 with 3.5 year old cards. Good enough for me...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tobe404*
> 
> I never had issues with CF either. Might get a bit hot at times. But that's about it. Plus it didn't help that one of the cards (280x) died. Ah well.
> 
> Hell I still have my 6950 CF cards in the old rig - still kicking along fine.
> 
> I was tossing up between a 390x and 480 but now I'm thinking a 1060 (can get brand new 1060 for 400 vs 380 for reference 480 8GB new - [300 for used 390x]) isn't a bad idea. Just wish they let it have SLI support.


I've had enough issues with both SLI and Crossfire to always strongly prefer single GPU gaming setups wherever possible. Often I've had surplus cards; pairing them up made sense despite any pitfalls. There have also been times where a second card was so inexpensive, relatively speaking, that it a dual-GPU config was the best upgrade value by far.

Still, the fact remains that support is far less than 100%, and even when it's there, it's often flawed. The extra space and power requirements can also be bothersome. Nothing beats a single fast GPU in compatibility or consistency of performance.

That said, I'll need something faster than a GTX 1080 for me to be eager to replace my CFX 290X setup. The GP102 Titan X would almost certainly qualify, but I'm only going to spend 1200 dollars as a last resort.


----------



## Baasha

So is it true that this card is ONLY going to be an "Nvidia Store" card and no AIBs like EVGA will have them? Really? o_0


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> So is it true that this card is ONLY going to be an "Nvidia Store" card and no AIBs like EVGA will have them? Really? o_0


Seems so, at least for the time being. Will likely have to hope for a 1080 TI at some point for partner cards.


----------



## s1rrah

One guy's take on things ... (not that I necessarily agree, but I like reading his stuff) ...

Quote:


> "Anyway, the point is that at first glance the latest Titan looks like a pure graphics product without any of the compute-centric features of some earlier Titans. However, for the first time, Nvidia is touting this card's INT8 performance, which is a measure of neural network or so-called deep learning performance and thus very much a non-graphics application. The messaging, then, is a little mixed - is this an out and out gaming card or something else?"


*
Source @ Rock, Paper, Shotgun*

...


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> So is it true that this card is ONLY going to be an "Nvidia Store" card and no AIBs like EVGA will have them? Really? o_0


Correct. Don't know if that could change later on but for now they are saying it is exclusive to the Nvidia store.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> The only bullcrap is people using MSAA instead of better more efficient AA alternatives that achieves the same effect while maintaining over 100 FPS.


Not true for GTA V. You either use MSAA or take a visit to aliasing town.


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *geort45*
> 
> Different cards SLI and different brands SLI?!


Yup. One of the nice things DX12 may bring us; unity. I tested it with my Titan X and my OG Titan before I sold it, and then the Titan X + a Nano. The Nano combo worked nicely apart from the stutter; which was also apparent on the twin Titan setup. Could just be my case though as I was mixing GPUs and still running GSync.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9740/directx-12-geforce-plus-radeon-mgpu-preview/3


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> The GP102 Titan X would almost certainly qualify, but I'm only going to spend 1200 dollars as a last resort.


Take it from me and wait a few months before plunging in. I learned my lesson when the 980ti came out not long after the old Titan X. Roughly same performance yet the savings is nice; along with the custom boards AIBs can make.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Not true for GTA V. You either use MSAA or take a visit to aliasing town.


1440p 120FPS SMAA X4 doesn't show any Aliasing for me.


----------



## stefxyz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> Take it from me and wait a few months before plunging in. I learned my lesson when the 980ti came out not long after the old Titan X. Roughly same performance yet the savings is nice; along with the custom boards AIBs can make.


Depends on your financial situation. For me having the performance a couple months earlier is more than worth the couple hundred bucks extra...

We also dont know if we get a Ti or Volta may be launched already next year. If that is a worry may be the 1080 is the better choice anyways.

I am happy for any release that provides added performance.


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Depends on your financial situation. For me having the performance a couple months earlier is more than worth the couple hundred bucks extra...
> 
> We also dont know if we get a Ti or Volta may be launched already next year. If that is a worry may be the 1080 is the better choice anyways.
> 
> I am happy for any release that provides added performance.


True. That is why I went with the Titan X a month after it released. Rumours made it seem like the Ti was far out, and then it surprised us a few months if that later.

If you have the funds and need the power now; then yes this is probably one of the few cards one would desire. I can never go back to SLI, so if I was looking to upgrade right now I'd consider this Titan over 2 1080s.

We just have to sit back and see if history repeats itself with Nvidia releasing a Ti variant in a few months time. Though they'll probably hold off until AMD releases something new to capitalize on Titan sales.


----------



## Ghoxt

With as much confidence that the Sun will come up tomorrow. There will be another Consumer card that will beat the new Titan XP, as you all are right it's only a matter of when.

But we have always known this. Yet I could see some being pissed as it's not a trivial decision buying an expensive GPU, and in some cases it makes you feel the fool if Nvidia put's out a better card before the old one's TIM has even warmed up. And or you buy Watercooling blocks etc...SLI etc..


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I can see microstutter but it doesn't even bother me personally (the hyperbole people go into when discussing it like "I can't even physically play a game if there is any microstutter" is silly). When I built my first rig years ago it had a single 560Ti in it and that thing would only get 20-25 FPS in some games yet I was somehow able to use and enjoy it just fine and that was actual stutter, not microstutter. I think people have just gotten a little spoiled these days and act like games are ever going to be 100% fluid like irl. I can notice stutters when I disable SLI to this day in games and benches but its not like I want to run out and kill myself or anything. Jeez...


Please stop with your SLI lovefest.

Nothing you are saying even makes sense bro. People are not building $4k rigs, to have microstutter in competitive multiplayer action..!

So, if microstutter stutter doesn't matter to you, nor other sli issues, and you like bling.... then ok.

But to pretend single cards don't matter for those who seek it, and whom will pay top dollar to be without dual-card issues..? SLI has never been seamless, or ever work without much difficulty, or end user work.

Titan XP anyone..?


----------



## Creator

I think SLI peaked when FCAT results got big during the Kepler era while Nvidia advertised their hardware frame pacing. I guess that didn't entice people enough to go SLI, and Nvidia and gave up on it, because microstutter these days seems much worse in newer releases than I remember it from new releases back in 2013-2014. It was great back then, but now it's borderline nauseating to me. It could be that G-Sync has a lot to do with it too. In the past you'd have a lot of torn frames that would have hidden some of it, but now you have to wait until the full frame comes in, making it extremely jittery at times.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> Please stop with your SLI lovefest.
> 
> Nothing you are saying even makes sense bro. People are not building $4k rigs, to have microstutter in competitive multiplayer action..!
> 
> So, if microstutter stutter doesn't matter to you, nor other sli issues, and you like bling.... then ok.
> 
> But to pretend single cards don't matter for those who seek it, and whom will pay top dollar to be without dual-card issues..? SLI has never been seamless, or ever work without much difficulty, or end user work.
> 
> Titan XP anyone..?


Single GPU matter but being Single GPU and going after 4K means endless pursuit of performance while killing your wallet.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Single GPU matter but being Single GPU and going after 4K means endless pursuit of performance while killing your wallet.


That is why you wait on 4K.


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> All I see is people basically saying they would rather have crappy graphics at lower resolutions then run SLI. Might as well play on a console if cutting edge graphics aren't your thing. I guess in a couple days you guys won't have an excuse for settling with poor graphic settings anymore when Titan XP is released.


NO, you are hearing consumer who sees a dead technology, that has not done much on 10 years and is shotty at best. The same consumers who would rather spend their money on a costlier single card solution for their gaming needs. Than deal with the inherent troubles of SLI, & Crossfire presents.

Additionally, since SLI has so many issues by 2018, almost all rigs will be capable of implicit multicard adaption. (Virtually eliminating SLI/Xfire.)

Further more, single card's importance is the same reason sooooo many people are waiting to see how well AMD's up-and-coming Vega will do. (Specially using Vulkan & BF1 as a bench.) There is going to be price war if AMD's offerings come in strong on Vulkan and Battlefield. And btw... most are looking to push 4k oleds for BF1, AA is not an issue... FPS is.

We theoretically could be see a 1080ti @ $699.. when Vega releases?


----------



## ratzofftoya

2x Titan X Pascal > 3x 980 Ti, right?


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> That is why you wait on 4K.


It's so boring. If I was still in 1440p who know how long I would be using 2 x 290Xs. Maybe another 2-3 years.


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Single GPU matter but being Single GPU and going after 4K means endless pursuit of performance while killing your wallet.


formula: performance = $$$$


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> NO, you are hearing consumer who sees a dead technology, that has not done much on 10 years and is shotty at best. The same consumers who would rather spend their money on a costlier single card solution for their gaming needs. Than deal with the inherent troubles of SLI, & Crossfire presents.
> 
> Additionally, since SLI has so many issues by 2018, almost all rigs will be capable of implicit multicard adaption. (Virtually eliminating SLI/Xfire.)
> 
> Further more, single card's importance is the same reason sooooo many people are waiting to see how well AMD's up-and-coming Vega will do. (Specially using Vulkan & BF1 as a bench.) There is going to be price war if AMD's offerings come in strong on Vulkan and Battlefield. And btw... most are looking to push 4k oleds for BF1, AA is not an issue... FPS is.
> 
> We theoretically could be see a 1080ti @ $699.. when Vega releases?


Titan XP will certainly change things. As of right now there isn't a single card that will give me the quality and frames that I desire in the resolution I game at. I personally don't have an issue with SLI or experience any of the faults many of you speak of. Either way I'd gladly welcome in a single gpu as a solution for my gaming needs. Problem is it doesn't exist. We'll see if the Titan XP pulls it off in a few days.


----------



## Seyumi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ratzofftoya*
> 
> 2x Titan X Pascal > 3x 980 Ti, right?


More like >4x 980Ti. Even 2x 1080's are >3x 980Ti range.


----------



## formula m

I maintain 3 gaming rigs. Various configs, no bias.

Over the tens, of thousands of dollars I have spent on video cards, I can tell you that I would rather give up visual fidelity, then performance. I have an exceptional imagination and can fill in the missing pixils (Atari adventure anyone?), but ANY bit of stutter, or other glitches just ruins gameplay.

Instead of being in the now and enjoying your gameplay, you become frustrated with hardware and it's interference with your gameplay.

I have had SLI rigs next to single card rigs, sometimes both Crossfire and SLI rigs, etc.. over the so many years. Sli is just poop. IMO... with the adaptation of DisplayPort 1.4, single cards... (even ones with dual GPU's) will be much more common.


----------



## ratzofftoya

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> More like >4x 980Ti. Even 2x 1080's are >3x 980Ti range.


Makes sense...The difference between 3x 980 Tis and 4x 980 Tis is pretty minimal anyway, right?

Last question to drive my purchasing decision on Tuesday: 3x Titan XP makes no sense, right?


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> So is it true that this card is ONLY going to be an "Nvidia Store" card and no AIBs like EVGA will have them? Really? o_0


Since nVIDIA is claiming that this gpu isn't for gaming, or, some nonsense like that, they probably figure, why should they let the AIB partners get paid for simply putting their stickers on it....me thinks that a "gaming.." GP102 chip, without that "other" stuff, will be released in a couple of months. maybe for under a grand? still though, I wish, for example, that they would let MC sell them also, I have $1300+ worth of gift cards to get off...







.. "Nvidia told us the Titan X is being aimed at professional content creators and deep learning researches, ..." --Toms


----------



## l88bastar

Dang....can't wait to order two of these!

And NO I am not SLIng them....going to replace my 1080 FTW GTX in rig one and TitanX-Maxwell in rig two, which should help relieve my wallet a tad


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Dang....can't wait to order two of these!
> 
> And NO I am not SLIng them....going to replace my 1080 FTW GTX in rig one and TitanX-Maxwell in rig two, which should help relieve my wallet a tad


Daaamn baller..


----------



## axiumone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> More like >4x 980Ti. Even 2x 1080's are >3x 980Ti range.


That's not correct. I've directly compared 3xTitan X [email protected] with [email protected] The titans always came out on top, sometimes by a substantial margin. The only upside was the heat generated by the 1080's was substantially lower than the titans.


----------



## ratzofftoya

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *axiumone*
> 
> That's not correct. I've directly compared 3xTitan X [email protected] with [email protected] The titans always came out on top, sometimes by a substantial margin. The only upside was the heat generated by the 1080's was substantially lower than the titans.


How is what he said incorrect?

Do you agree with the conclusion that 2x Titan X Pascal will likely outperform 3x 980Ti?


----------



## axiumone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ratzofftoya*
> 
> How is what he said incorrect?
> 
> Do you agree with the conclusion that 2x Titan X Pascal will likely outperform 3x 980Ti?


Judging by 1080 performance. No, I don't agree. It could be very close, but I don't think 2 Pascal cards will be enough, at least not until we see cards that can reliably clock at 2200mhz or above for daily use.


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ratzofftoya*
> 
> Makes sense...The difference between 3x 980 Tis and 4x 980 Tis is pretty minimal anyway, right?
> 
> Last question to drive my purchasing decision on Tuesday: 3x Titan XP makes no sense, right?


You can't do tri-sli with pascal cards. Folding, yes but no tri-sli.

The new high bandwidth SLI bridge also only supports 2 cards.


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ratzofftoya*
> 
> How is what he said incorrect?
> 
> Do you agree with the conclusion that 2x Titan X Pascal will likely outperform 3x 980Ti?


tri sli scaling is horrible. I'd go with two titan xp over tri 980ti any day.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *axiumone*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ratzofftoya*
> 
> How is what he said incorrect?
> 
> Do you agree with the conclusion that 2x Titan X Pascal will likely outperform 3x 980Ti?
> 
> 
> 
> Judging by 1080 performance. No, I don't agree. It could be very close, but I don't think 2 Pascal cards will be enough, at least not until we see cards that can reliably clock at 2200mhz or above for daily use.
Click to expand...

Is this in 3Dmark or a game? In 3Dmark, sure, but not in most (any?) games.


----------



## x3sphere

Imo, two of these should soundly beat 3x980 Ti in actual games.

As far as overclocking, I would imagine you will see more gains on this card when going to 2 GHz (assuming it can hit that) than you did on the 1080, since it has a lower starting boost clock.


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> Imo, two of these should soundly beat 3x980 Ti in actual games.
> 
> As far as overclocking, I would imagine you will see more gains on this card when going to 2 GHz (assuming it can hit that) than you did on the 1080, since it has a lower starting boost clock.


I'm somewhat skeptical that the TXP can hit 2 GHz though. At least not all samples reliably. More SMs would make it more difficult to overclock I'd assume? More things that can go wrong..


----------



## ratzofftoya

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> I'm somewhat skeptical that the TXP can hit 2 GHz though. At least not all samples reliably. More SMs would make it more difficult to overclock I'd assume? More things that can go wrong..


I'll trust y'all, but the opinion that 2x Titan XP cannot beat 3x 980Tis seems crazy to me. The FPS gain from adding a third 980 Ti is only like 5-10 in most cases, so this is basically like arguing that 2x Titan XP is not better than just TWO 980 Tis.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> I'm somewhat skeptical that the TXP can hit 2 GHz though. At least not all samples reliably. More SMs would make it more difficult to overclock I'd assume? More things that can go wrong..


I imagine you'd probably need a good watercooling setup to run 2GHz as 24/7 clocks, since you're looking at potentially a 350W+ card by that point.


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I imagine you'd probably need a good watercooling setup to run 2GHz as 24/7 clocks, since you're looking at potentially a 350W+ card by that point.


Oh definitely, but this is overclock.net, having a watercooled setup feels mandatory.









I'd love a GP102 at 2GHz though.... *drool*


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ratzofftoya*
> 
> I'll trust y'all, but the opinion that 2x Titan XP cannot beat 3x 980Tis seems crazy to me. The FPS gain from adding a third 980 Ti is only like 5-10 in most cases, so this is basically like arguing that 2x Titan XP is not better than just TWO 980 Tis.


2-way XP would destroy 3-way 980TI.

SLI scaling on a good day looks like this:

Single GPU: 100%

Dual GPU: 180%

Triple GPU: 210%

Basically Titan XP just has to run 30% faster as a single GPU than the 980ti in order for two-way to outshine 3-way since the scaling is such garbage. That is, of course, if you happen to pick the 1 in 10 games (feeling generous), that supports SLI beyond 2-way setups.


----------



## Rei86

Ugh the waiting game.

Buy the TXP and get screwed if they drop a Ti model.... waiting on AMD but everyone points to 2017 for the good stuff.... And hell I don't even need to upgrade, playing MOBA's have zero impact as most of thos games can run on tin cans with strings tied to them. Just want to spend money on new stuff


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Glottis*
> 
> we had months to do that, this close to release i no longer care about speculations and just want real numbers.


Then wait until Tuesday. Or is that too long?


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> . Just want to spend money on new stuff


Do what I did; give your money to Ruger and Leupold.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> Do what I did; give your money to Ruger and Leupold.


LOL nice! Think I'm gonna give in and give it to Honda for a CBR600RR


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> CBR600RR


Why can't motorcycles have better model names?


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Why can't motorcycles have better model names?


/shrug

I mean since you you still have the gixxer's that sounds like a nVidia copied Suzuki naming


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> lol
> 
> playing with 1x 1080 or 1 Titan XP is still >>>> console, but also without the SLI headaches


you seem to pretty well versed in multi-gpu setups.

tell me what are those "sli headaches" you talk of?


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> LOL nice! Think I'm gonna give in and give it to Honda for a CBR600RR


Bikes are nice! Family would NEVER let me get one even if the mileage is amazing. The new Subaru WRX is quite nice, and the RS from Ford is finally coming to America


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> 2-way XP would destroy 3-way 980TI.
> 
> SLI scaling on a good day looks like this:
> 
> Single GPU: 100%
> 
> Dual GPU: 180%
> 
> Triple GPU: 210%
> 
> Basically Titan XP just has to run 30% faster as a single GPU than the 980ti in order for two-way to outshine 3-way since the scaling is such garbage. That is, of course, if you happen to pick the 1 in 10 games (feeling generous), that supports SLI beyond 2-way setups.


There is no doubt 2X TX can crush 3x 980 Ti.

Heck a single decently cooled TXP might match 980 Ti at some point.


----------



## Viveacious

Sooo glad that this has turned into an SLI vs Single GPU pizzing contest.

Hurry up, Titan.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Ugh the waiting game.
> 
> Buy the TXP and get screwed if they drop a Ti model.... waiting on AMD but everyone points to 2017 for the good stuff.... And hell I don't even need to upgrade, playing MOBA's have zero impact as most of thos games can run on tin cans with strings tied to them. *Just want to spend money on new stuff*


Or you could donate your money to a charity case like me for good cause!


----------



## Pyrotagonist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Heck a single decently cooled TXP might match 980 Ti at some point.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I wonder if this Titan XP will finally be the card that is faster than my two OG Titans in SLI? Kind of thought the 1080 might take that honor but the old Titans are still a good bit faster, at least in benches. In all honesty I can't imagine that the new Titan won't beat them but that's still over 3.5 years it took before they got beat by a single card...


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Master__Shake*
> 
> you seem to pretty well versed in multi-gpu setups.
> 
> tell me what are those "sli headaches" you talk of?


IDK, let's ask Nvidia: http://developer.download.nvidia.com/assets/events/GDC15/GEFORCE/SLI_GDC15.pdf

In the best case:

Non-uniform flip intervals (microstutter)
*Interframe dependencies
Input latency does not reduce with increased performance
First one is well known and mitigated by driver applying back pressure.
Second one hurts performance scaling with generic temporal algorithms, like SMAA T2x/4x. Some game engines really go wild with this and AFR doesn't work at all.
Third one means that 2x 980 has same FPS as a single 1080, but has almost twice the input latency.

These problems can be avoided with split frame rendering... but at that point scaling alone would be bad enough that it's better to buy a single large card.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

And yet plenty of people like me swear by SLI/CF and don't have any issues at all (besides the outlier titles that don't support multi-GPU). I am using a 60Hz monitor it must be said and since my FPS is usually above that mark I guess its hard to say how 80-90+ FPS actually feels on my setup but all I do know is that with games like Crysis 3 I can only maintain 60 FPS by using SLI and I can promise you that it feels smoother (regardless of supposed microstutter) than just using a single Titan at 35 FPS...


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> And yet plenty of people like me swear by SLI/CF and don't have any issues at all (besides the outlier titles that don't support multi-GPU). I am using a 60Hz monitor it must be said and since my FPS is usually above that mark I guess its hard to say how 80-90+ FPS actually feels on my setup but all I do know is that with games like Crysis 3 I can only maintain 60 FPS by using SLI and I can promise you that it feels smoother (regardless of supposed microstutter) than just using a single Titan at 35 FPS...


what he said.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I wonder if this Titan XP will finally be the card that is faster than my two OG Titans in SLI? Kind of thought the 1080 might take that honor but the old Titans are still a good bit faster, at least in benches. In all honesty I can't imagine that the new Titan won't beat them but that's still over 3.5 years it took before they got beat by a single card...


They don't call them OG Titans for nothing!







*3.5 years it took before they got beat by a single card*


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> They don't call them OG Titans for nothing!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *3.5 years it took before they got beat by a single card*


Well, GPUs were stuck on 28nm for almost half a decade lol. It is kinda unfortunate rather.


----------



## carlhil2

Some slept on the OG Titan because they see the benches with those low stock clocks, but, OC'ed, with flashed bios, those things were fire.....first gpu that I ever flashed before....a thousand dollar gpu, wasn't even scurred...


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I wonder if this Titan XP will finally be the card that is faster than my two OG Titans in SLI? Kind of thought the 1080 might take that honor but the old Titans are still a good bit faster, at least in benches. In all honesty I can't imagine that the new Titan won't beat them but that's still over 3.5 years it took before they got beat by a single card...


What? No they aren't. The 1080 matches 980 SLI in many cases which is already faster than OG Titans

Performance average across 15 games: http://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/vfSzfuFSQ2hCkzi3VcmwYh-650-80.jpg

http://www.pcgamer.com/gtx-1080-review/


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I wonder if this Titan XP will finally be the card that is faster than my two OG Titans in SLI? Kind of thought the 1080 might take that honor but the old Titans are still a good bit faster, at least in benches. In all honesty I can't imagine that the new Titan won't beat them but that's still over 3.5 years it took before they got beat by a single card...


Thats already been done with 1080, 2ghz 1080 can beat 980 SLi which is faster then original Titan Sli, so TXP will have no problem being 30% faster or more then original Titan SLi not to mention all the benefits of single GPU.
Even 1080 its 10x better option then original Titan SLi


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Some slept on the OG Titan because they see the benches with those low stock clocks, but, OC'ed, with flashed bios, those things were fire.....first gpu that I ever flashed before....a thousand dollar gpu, wasn't even scurred...


I went through bout 8 of them. I believe I was trying to reach 1200Mhz stable on air. Don't think I was able to.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> And yet plenty of people like me swear by SLI/CF and don't have any issues at all (besides the outlier titles that don't support multi-GPU). I am using a 60Hz monitor it must be said and since my FPS is usually above that mark I guess its hard to say how 80-90+ FPS actually feels on my setup but all I do know is that with games like Crysis 3 I can only maintain 60 FPS by using SLI and I can promise you that it feels smoother (regardless of supposed microstutter) than just using a single Titan at 35 FPS...


On a 60 Hz monitor, the juddering from missing scan out is probably way more obnoxious than extra input lag.


----------



## Jared Pace

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> 1440p 120FPS SMAA X4 doesn't show any Aliasing for me.


doubt it.... "smaa x4"

even gta's built in MSAA leaves aliasing, ENB HQ MSAA leaves some still... add smaa & fxaa on top and there is still some

Pascal Titan X SLi should come in handy for getting high fps with hq msaa in GTA at 4k & 8k


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I wonder if this Titan XP will finally be the card that is faster than my two OG Titans in SLI? Kind of thought the 1080 might take that honor but the old Titans are still a good bit faster, at least in benches. In all honesty I can't imagine that the new Titan won't beat them but that's still over 3.5 years it took before they got beat by a single card...


uh, as an owner of 3 og titans a 1080 destroys two of our of titans by 13%.

So that card has already arrived.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> This debate was classic for many years people will always find reason to get SLI even though Nvidia it self already realized how bad it is and useless it is.
> Yes some people say they are very happy with SLI but they say it themselves they don't play many games... People that play a large pool of games will not be satisfied. Look we have August: No Man's Sky, Deus EX new WoW expansion none of this games supports SLI.


You're right, I really lament having GTX 1080 level performance for 2 years now at less cost (than many 1080 guys are paying now). Those twin GTX 970s that I bought for $630 2 years ago were really not worth it. I much prefer to have waited another two years and pay $650 for GTX 1080 for the exact same thing in most games, just to be able to play Just Cause 3 (the only major title not supporting SLI).

You're right, SLI is a scam. Waiting 2 years for the same kind of performance and actually paying more for it is not... *rolls eyes*

To be serious for a bit: SLI is a real bang for buck purchase if one's strategic about it. Quad SLIing Titans is obviously silly unless you really have a need of that performance, but SLI in general is not that bad...


----------



## whyscotty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> uh, as an owner of 3 og titans a 1080 destroys two of our of titans by 13%.
> 
> So that card has already arrived.


Don't think so

Not in Heaven anyway


----------



## whyscotty

Double post sorry


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *whyscotty*
> 
> Don't think so
> 
> Not in Heaven anyway


Nor in Valley, FS or 3dmark11. Source: OCN benching section where my Titans are still faster than any single card score in those tests (including Heaven like whyscotty showed).


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> 4 more days fellas. 4 more long days....


Do we know any reviewer site that got one?
Usually they tease the products on twitter etc


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Do we know any reviewer site that got one?
> Usually they tease the products on twitter etc


World's first Titan XP unboxing.
https://youtu.be/ZCu1kPlibYE


----------



## Snaporz

Would be nice to know a time to stalk the site as well to try and beat all the reseller bots lol


----------



## szeged

im putting my og titan in a rig with windows xp.

gonna beat the lines and not even spend any money to get my titan xp.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> im putting my og titan in a rig with windows xp.
> 
> gonna beat the lines and not even spend any money to get my titan xp.


How do you intend to "beat the lines" and not spend any money on an XP? PM me if you can share some tips.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> World's first Titan XP unboxing.
> https://youtu.be/ZCu1kPlibYE



They start talking about it at around 12m30s.
Actual unboxing is at 15m00s.
They get the model of the chip wrong, they say GP106. We know it's GP102.
They confirm there's an NDA which lifts on August 2nd. They can't talk about performance until then.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> 
> They start talking about it at around 12m30s.
> Actual unboxing is at 15m00s.
> They get the model of the chip wrong, they say GP106. We know it's GP102.
> They confirm there's an NDA which lifts on the August 2nd. They can't talk about performance until then.


Pretty crappy unboxing but it's something.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Pretty crappy unboxing but it's something.


There's not really a lot to unbox though, is there? It's just lift the top half of the box off and TA-DAAAA! Doesn't look like it comes with anything else (leaflets etc), unless that's just because it's a review sample.


----------



## Oubadah

I see the black finish doesn't make that shroud look any less hideous. How many years are we going to be stuck with this new monstrosity on reference Nvidia cards, I wonder... They did such a good job on the 690/original Titan.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> And yet plenty of people like me swear by SLI/CF and don't have any issues at all (besides the outlier titles that don't support multi-GPU). I am using a 60Hz monitor it must be said and since my FPS is usually above that mark I guess its hard to say how 80-90+ FPS actually feels on my setup but all I do know is that with games like Crysis 3 I can only maintain 60 FPS by using SLI and I can promise you that it feels smoother (regardless of supposed microstutter) than just using a single Titan at 35 FPS...


Plenty of people swear that they "don't get any tearing" without any sort of sync, so what's your point. People have different sensitivities to phenomena like microstutter and screen tearing. Some of them are lucky enough not to be bothered by them, but just because *some* people are oblivious to them doesn't mean they don't exist.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> There's not really a lot to unbox though, is there? It's just lift the top half of the box off and TA-DAAAA! Doesn't look like it comes with anything else (leaflets etc), unless that's just because it's a review sample.


I would have liked them to at least zoom in on the card and perhaps a few shots of the backplate. I know it's pretty much the 1080 cooler in black but still. Shots of the PCB would have been awesome as well.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I would have liked them to at least zoom in on the card and perhaps a few shots of the backplate. I know it's pretty much the 1080 cooler in black but still. Shots of the PCB would have been awesome as well.


Yeah. I see what you mean. This is their weekly show though, like _TechTalk_ and _Awesome Hardware_. Adhoc unboxings on shows like that are never as good as a dedicated unboxing vid.


----------



## Swolern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> How do you intend to "beat the lines" and not spend any money on an XP? PM me if you can share some tips.


You must be half asleep bud. Might want to read his post again.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swolern*
> 
> You must be half asleep bud. Might want to read his post again.


Ur right... I haven't slept since 6 am yesterday!


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> im putting my og titan in a rig with windows xp.
> 
> gonna beat the lines and not even spend any money to get my titan xp.


Where have you been?


----------



## Juub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Nor in Valley, FS or 3dmark11. Source: OCN benching section where my Titans are still faster than any single card score in those tests (including Heaven like whyscotty showed).


Yeah but that's only in benchmarks. In-game a 1080 will eat two OG Titans 99% of the time.


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> im putting my og titan in a rig with windows xp.
> 
> gonna beat the lines and not even spend any money to get my titan xp.


The real question is how long are you going to run all 4 of them on air before switching to other cooling methods?


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> And yet plenty of people like me swear by SLI/CF and don't have any issues at all (besides the outlier titles that don't support multi-GPU). I am using a 60Hz monitor it must be said and since my FPS is usually above that mark I guess its hard to say how 80-90+ FPS actually feels on my setup but all I do know is that with games like Crysis 3 I can only maintain 60 FPS by using SLI and I can promise you that it feels smoother (regardless of supposed microstutter) than just using a single Titan at 35 FPS...


lol.. please stop. You are not a competitive gamer bro, that is why you are in love with your situation.

Do understand that "smother" is not what FPS gamers want, they want "unfettered"...! Do you understand? And who gives a damn about Crysis, or 60fps?

Again, lets talk about Battlefield1 in 4k @ 100hz over display port 1.3/4 & *single card performance*... Doom anyone?


----------



## Captivate

Real "competitive" gamers don't play at 4K. Nor do they care about graphics. They tune down their settings to low for maximum visibility/performance. Heck, there's still Quake players playing at 640x480.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> 1440p 120FPS SMAA X4 doesn't show any Aliasing for me.


Get your eyes checked? Even at 4K, I can see a very clear difference between 4x MSAA and 4x SMAA in GTA V. Night and Day. GTA V in general is an aliased mess, and regardless of settings you are still going to see some jaggies. Just fired it up at 8x MSAA with 4K, and still quite a few jaggies in the distance.

I still feel like FXAA/SMAA/etc are all garbage for the most part. Some games have OK results with them, many do not. There are many cases where I prefer no AA over using them.


----------



## Benny89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Get your eyes checked. Even at 4K, I can see a very clear difference between 4x MSAA and 4x SMAA in GTA V. Night and day.
> 
> I still feel like FXAA/SMAA/etc are all garbage for the most part. Some games have OK results with them, many do not.


I may not have as good eyes are some, but for me I have never ever noticed difference in-game betwen FXAA/SMAA/etc. Anyway not in just normal gameplay.

Maybe if I stopped a game, stare at some textures like mad I could notice it, but in games- I never had luck so I just choose whatever boosts my FPS higher.

My conception with playing on Ultra is simple- I crack up everything I can notice and bring down a little things I can't see or notice at all. Not all graphic options really make a difference visually but some really do in terms of performance.


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> Real "competitive" gamers don't play at 4K. Nor do they care about graphics. They tune down their settings to low for maximum visibility/performance. Heck, there's still Quake players playing at 640x480.


Yep, solid fps is the no.1 requirement, with mesh/textures set to high/ultra. and mostly native resolution. all this 4k/2k mumbo jumbo is for *ENTHUSIASTS* .


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> Real "competitive" gamers don't play at 4K. Nor do they care about graphics. They tune down their settings to low for maximum visibility/performance. Heck, there's still Quake players playing at 640x480.


Correct, but your late to the party on that^ notion... (read back on my earlier statements)

And yes, OLED is what real competitive gamers are going after. And given all the platforms that exists... display port 1.4 + 4k @ 100hz is perfect for competitive play.

And FWIW, I lost a part of my soul when I sold my SONY crt.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> OLED is what real competitive gamers are going after.


Why? Even the brand new 2016 OLEDs have ~30ms input lag which would be similiar to something like the LG UltraWide 3440x1440 IPS. While they are plenty for typical FPS gaming, I don't see a competitive FPS gamer ever wanting a monitor with 30ms input lag.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benny89*
> 
> I may not have as good eyes are some, but for me I have never ever noticed difference in-game betwen FXAA/SMAA/etc. Anyway not in just normal gameplay.


In GTA V? It's one of the most aliased games out there.


----------



## Captivate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> Correct, but your late to the party on that^ notion... (read back on my earlier statements)
> 
> And yes, OLED is what real competitive gamers are going after. And given all the platforms that exists... display port 1.4 + 4k @ 100hz is perfect for competitive play.
> 
> And FWIW, I lost a part of my soul when I sold my SONY crt.


I'm not up to date on OLED, but for FPS games nothing beats a TN at 144Hz...Except the old school CRT screens with high refreshrates; they are faster/smoother still. They are a pain to haul around though, I don't miss that at all.


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Why? Even the brand new 2016 OLEDs have ~30ms input lag which would be similiar to something like the LG UltraWide 3440x1440 IPS. While they are plenty for typical FPS gaming, I don't see a competitive FPS gamer ever wanting a monitor with 30ms input lag.
> In GTA V? It's one of the most aliased games out there.


Have you gamed on oled yet?


----------



## jasondub

I just wanna know if this card can run ultra modded (best graphics mods possible + most beautiful enbs) Skyrim smoothly above 3440x1440 or 3840x2160, in terms of stunning graphics, I don't think there is any game can be compared with ultra modded skyrim, right?

I mean after modded, the graphics in game are just insane and that's the only purpose I want to buy this card for. Coz I'm currently running 1070 sli which isn't enough at all. I know modded game isn't fully optimized but still I hope it could be achievable with this Titan X.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> Have you gamed on oled yet?


Everyday, look at my monitor.









I've been using OLED for almost a year now, starting with the EG9600 then the EF9500, now the E6. The EG9600 and EF9500 had around ~55ms input lag which is the reason why I went to the new E6 - which has around 32ms.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jasondub*
> 
> I just wanna know if this card can run ultra modded (best graphics mods possible + most beautiful enbs) Skyrim smoothly above 3440x1440 or 3840x2160


Doubt it. Engine limitations will likely kick in especially if you are using commands to increase the draw distance. I'm guessing even with hardware a few years from now it won't be possible. Last time I tried Oblivion with all the graphic mods, FPS still tanked despite looking pretty awful by today's standards.


----------



## formula m

Great, then you don't see the benefit in doing so youself..?

Why suggest that Gamers are not gravitating towards oled, or 4k..?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> I'm not up to date on OLED, but for FPS games nothing beats a TN at 144Hz...Except the old school CRT screens with high refreshrates; they are faster/smoother still. They are a pain to haul around though, I don't miss that at all.


You clearly have not seen an OLED then...









Yes the motion and responsiveness is about the same as IPS 60hz, but that's acceptable for anything but competitive gaming, and the image quality is about a billion times better and that's not even an exaggeration.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> Great, then you don't see the benefit in doing so youself..?
> 
> Why suggest that Gamers are not gravitating towards oled, or 4k..?


You did not say gamers, you said "real competitive gamers". Competitive gamers are ones who have a main goal of being 1st and/or regularly enter gaming tournaments. These people do not care about image quality, they care about maximum FPS and less input lag as possible.

If you are a typical gamer where fun is your main goal, then OLED is to die for.


----------



## ChevChelios

yeah I bet CS GO pros are scrambling to buy that 4K 120Hz OLED for $5000









/s


----------



## formula m

And yet, those monitors will be out in a years time.


----------



## jasondub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Doubt it. Engine limitations will likely kick in especially if you are using commands to increase the draw distance. I'm guessing even with hardware a few years from now it won't be possible. Last time I tried Oblivion with all the graphic mods, FPS still tanked despite looking pretty awful by today's standards.


You should try Skyrim with all that GFX mods, I can't say about physics part since its mainly about the engine?! But other than that, I'm pretty sure it's a no contest against witcher3+enb or fallout4+enb.
But in the end, I've found myself meddling with these mods instead of playing the actual game LOL, just offering a feast to my eyes I suppose.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> And yet, those monitors will be out in a years time.


And yet, those monitors will still have input lag far above what a "real competitive gamer" would consider acceptable. They will still all be on 144hz TN panels because speed is everything for a competitive FPS gamer. OLED has roughly the same input lag as IPS, and you don't see them touching IPS monitors. We are still not at a point in technology where we can have both speed and quality.

Personally, I really don't see the point of being a competitive gamer and sacrificing image quality. For me, the speed of IPS/OLED is perfectly acceptable for FPS gaming, but I don't go into a FPS gaming thinking "#1 or nothing".


----------



## prjindigo

Two hundred and twenty three pages and STILL the thread is wrong... man.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> OLED has roughly the same input lag as IPS, and you don't see them touching IPS monitors.


Input lag is panel type agnostic.


----------



## formula m

From switching from rig to rig to rig (I have 3 gaming rigs), I can and do notice each's shortcoming and my monitors. I can tell you that "input lag" can be adjusted for when not playing on a Tourney LAN, and over the latency filled internet.

TN circuitry is fast, OLED will get there. The "input lag" puts a gamer at a slight disadvantage in actual tourney play, but not nec at home.


----------



## prjindigo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Historically, neither company has ever succeeded in getting 1:1 scaling when doubling up on a chip. 290 (non-X) was basically a doubled up 270X and had 1.6x the performance. Fury X was a doubled up 280X (itself a rebranded 7970 GE) and had 1.7-1.9x the performance depending on resolution. So, if we literally double up the P10 chip used in RX 480 (double everything, from shaders to ROPs to TMUs etc), a low estimate would put it around 1070 performance, and a high estimate would put it pretty much equal to 1080 performance. And this is assuming the big chips can maintain the same clocks as the smaller chips.
> 
> So a hypothetical Vega with 4608 shaders would be around 1080 performance.. Suppose we can get another 20% performance out of it through OCing. Assuming the most optimistic 1:1 scaling, that means we need it running around 1520 MHz. So this Vega chip with 4608 shaders overclocked to 1520 MHz would be 20% ahead of a stock 1080. But we know that Polaris struggles to even reach 1400+ game stable clocks, and scaling is never 1:1.
> 
> Also, current rumors say Vega will only have 4096 shaders, which means there's a chance it may not even reach stock 1080 performance. Obviously there are still a lot of unknowns, and HBM2 remains a big wild card. But working with what data we have at the moment, I'm gonna say within 10% of 1080; + if you're optimistic, - if you're pessimistic.


A 390X and 980ti in Ashes using ganged mode is so close to linear and easily beats out either a pair of 980ti or a pair of 390X... its freaky how bad the driver loading is for multi-card support on both companies.


----------



## prjindigo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> hmm.. interesting.. the question is.. can this do 4-Way SLI in games or is it the same fate as the 1080s?


Titan P can't even fully utilize it's CUDA without exceeding the spec power draw. I doubt it'll be faster in a pair than a pair of 1080 regulars. The clock is gonna suffer badly.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> From switching from rig to rig to rig (I have 3 gaming rigs), I can and do notice each's shortcoming and my monitors. I can tell you that "input lag" can be adjusted for when not playing on a Tourney LAN, and over the latency filled internet.
> 
> TN circuitry is fast, OLED will get there. The "input lag" puts a gamer at a slight disadvantage in actual tourney play, but not nec at home.


Yes there is a chance OLED will match or come close to matching TN speed with time, but currently the best OLED is 32ms input lag and cost $6000. I own this panel, and I also own a 1080p 144hz. The 1080p 144hz is better for FPS gaming, but I can't look past the image quality difference, so the 1080p 144hz sits in the corner.

You can get use to input lag, but that doesn't mean it's not there. If you are a competitive gamer, playing against other competitive gamers, if they are on 144hz TN and you are not, then you are at a disadvantage. If someone is "OK" with that, then they aren't actually a competitive gamer in my eyes.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prjindigo*
> 
> Two hundred and twenty three pages and STILL the thread is wrong... man.


Care to elaborate?


----------



## prjindigo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oj010*
> 
> The price isn't surprising when you consider the people buying one of these will probably be pairing it up with a $ 1,700 CPU, $ 600 PSU, $ 600 motherboard, $ 600 case, etc.
> 
> I doubt the Ti will use HMB2, it'll probably be GDDR5X again. At 14 GHz on a 384-bit you're looking at 672 GB/s bandwidth, 40 % more than the new Titan offers.
> 
> This will sell - not only will it sell, it'll sell out. NVIDIA sucks at one thing - making poor business choices. Bad for the consumer? Probably. Good for NVIDIA? Always.


Where the flipflops do you buy a $600.00 PSU?!? http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&IsNodeId=1&N=100007657%20600014006 Newegg stops at $440


----------



## formula m

But again.. what latencies do you see over the internet..? I agree for sponsorship and pro gaming... but that is all LAN play.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *formula m*
> 
> But again.. what latencies do you see over the internet..? I agree for sponsorship and pro gaming... but that is all LAN play.


With fiber and a close server, you can get <20ms latency. So on a TN 144hz, your looking at an overall ~21ms while on a 60hz OLED you'd be looking at ~53ms. This won't matter for 99% of cases, but it's that 1% that a competitive gamer will care about.

However, the more important thing is hand/eye coordination difference between 30ms and 1ms input lag. With the cursor always trailing 30ms behind, doing super fast aiming techniques becomes much much harder regardless of ping.

You talking to someone who thinks 144hz isn't worth it over 4K/1440p, so I totally agree that the whole thing is exaggerated... however many competitive FPS gamers will argue up and down that even 1ms is a big deal.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Why? Even the brand new 2016 OLEDs have ~30ms input lag which would be similiar to something like the LG UltraWide 3440x1440 IPS. While they are plenty for typical FPS gaming, I don't see a competitive FPS gamer ever wanting a monitor with 30ms input lag.
> In GTA V? It's one of the most aliased games out there.


Because input lag is not entirely up to the panel which by the way is 10 times faster than LCD at 0.1ms pixel response time.

Input lag is up to the manufacturer reducing signaling and processing time, you're using an OLED TV which is entirely built around its filters thus increasing input lag.

We don't have OLED monitors because of the burning issue yet if we ever get OLED monitors these will have way less input lag than a LCD TN screen.

And no, I don't need my eyes checked m, SMAA X4 is more than enough for me, you're just over reacting, I play in a 27' [email protected] screen at near 2 arms length distance, no wonder you cry out loud about AA if you play in a TV.

EDIT: I'm glad you edited your post blabbing about how people with these cards are on 4K instead of 1440P because that was downright dumb


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> With fiber and a close server, you can get <20ms latency. However, the more important thing is hand/eye coordination difference between 30ms and 1ms input lag. With the cursor always trailing 30ms behind, doing super fast aiming techniques becomes much much harder regardless of ping.


I agree.

I have notices gaming under g-sync & freesync, that at moments, I can not draw a strait line (bead), because the frequency of update on screen is erratic, to the consistent timestamp in my head.

Input latency theoretically puts you at a huge disadvantage, because others are seeing the real world moments before you do. But do understand, the image of the soldier peeking out of the window is already 25ms old... and what he is seeing is already 50ms old from having to move (input lag) to look out the window.

We all miss the CRT days, but when these OLEDs get down to 19 ~20ms, it will set off a mass kraze.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Because input lag is not entirely up to the panel which by the way is 10 times faster than LCD at 0.1ms pixel response time.
> 
> Input lag is up to the manufacturer reducing signaling and processing time, you're using an OLED TV which is entirely built around its filters thus increasing input lag.
> 
> We don't have OLED monitors because of the burning issue yet if we ever get OLED monitors these will have way less input lag than an LCD screen.
> 
> And no, I don't need my eyes checked m, SMAA X4 is more than enough for me, you're just over reacting, I play in a 27' [email protected] screen at near 2 arms length distance, no wonder you cry out loud about AA if you play in a TV.


I'm saying that OLED *RIGHT NOW* is in no way shape or form ready for competitive gaming. The fastest current panel is 32ms. In the future, yes, it likely will be because the technology is capable.









All modern TVs have PC modes that disable those processing filters. OLED burn-in issue is exaggerated. I play WoW for 12-15hr/day on mine sometimes, no issues. A company tested a completely static image for over 24 hours, and got some minor image retention that went away quickly with normal usage.

I had a 34UM95 3440x1440, which is the PPI as your 27" 1440p. I still felt the same on that, sat roughly 1 1/2 feet away. SMAA just isn't that good in my opinion.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I'm saying *RIGHT NOW* that OLED is in no way shape or form ready for competitive gaming. The fastest current panel is 32ms.
> 
> OLED burn-in issue is exaggerated. I play WoW for 12-15hr/day on mine, no issues.


Of course OLED monitors aren't ready for competitive play, for a monitor to be ready it has to exist first.

And btw, I'd recommend playing on private wow servers, I left WoD for WOTLK and never looked back, unless of course you're into garrisons.


----------



## TUFinside

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I'm saying *RIGHT NOW* that OLED is in no way shape or form ready for competitive gaming. The fastest current panel is 32ms. In the future, yes, it likely will be because the technology is capable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OLED burn-in issue is exaggerated. *I play WoW for 12-15hr/day* on mine, no issues. A company tested a completely static image for over 24 hours, and got some minor image retention that went away quickly with normal usage.


So basically, eat/sleep/WoW


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jasondub*
> 
> You should try Skyrim with all that GFX mods, I can't say about physics part since its mainly about the engine?! But other than that, I'm pretty sure it's a no contest against witcher3+enb or fallout4+enb.
> But in the end, I've found myself meddling with these mods instead of playing the actual game LOL, just offering a feast to my eyes I suppose.


If you don't use an intense ENB and/or ReShade, you should get a perfectly smooth 60fps on FO4 and W3 experience at 3440 x 1440 with one of these GPUs even if using multiple mods.

The performance crusher is an SSAO heavy ENB preset from my experience.

That said, if you tweak the .ini files on those games, you can bring your FPS to it's knees running SLI Titan XP at that resolution.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Of course OLED monitors aren't ready for competitive play, for a monitor to be ready it has to exist first.
> 
> And btw, I'd recommend playing on private wow servers, I left WoD for WOTLK and never looked back, unless of course you're into garrisons.


Garrisons are dead since patch 7.0. There's no point in them, and they aren't going to be in Legion. As a beta tester, I can tell you Legion is awesome so far - perhaps even better than WOTLK. Only time will tell.

I don't feel that the first OLED monitors will be competitive gamer approved either, but time will tell. I still expect them to be in the ~30ms input lag range initially.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TUFinside*
> 
> So basically, eat/sleep/WoW


Yea, sometimes. Patch 7.0 just hit so I've been on it a lot.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> And btw, I'd recommend playing on *private wow servers*, I left WoD for *WOTLK*


thats called being stuck in the past









if you dislike WoD then the best thing to do is take a break from WoW until Legion


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> You clearly have not seen an OLED then...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes the motion and responsiveness is about the same as IPS 60hz, but that's acceptable for anything but competitive gaming, and the image quality is about a billion times better and that's not even an exaggeration.
> You did not say gamers, you said "real competitive gamers". Competitive gamers are ones who have a main goal of being 1st and/or regularly enter gaming tournaments. These people do not care about image quality, they care about maximum FPS and less input lag as possible.
> 
> If you are a typical gamer where fun is your main goal, then OLED is to die for.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Garrisons are dead since patch 7.0. There's no point in them, and they aren't going to be in Legion. As a beta tester, I can tell you Legion is awesome so far - perhaps even better than WOTLK. Only time will tell.
> 
> I don't feel that the first OLED monitors will be competitive gamer approved either, but time will tell. I still expect them to be in the ~30ms input lag range initially.
> Yea, sometimes. Patch 7.0 just hit so I've been on it a lot.


No way a monitor is going to be 30ms, there are TVs faster than that. Monitors are made with PC usage in mind, low input lag for smooth work not Dynamic Contrast, Dunamic Colors and, True Motion and the good dozen filters in LG TVs.

The manufacturer is responsible for input lag, but the monitor isn't beyond the pixel response time, which as I said is 10 times faster than a gaming TN of 1ms, it's a matter of time before we see the first 0.1ms response time gaming OLED monitors, hopefully in 2017.

And saying that Legion is better than WOTLK cross me as foolish at best, call me an elitist but with LFR, LFD (LFG is fine I believe for the health of the game) WoW is nothing more than a corridor MMO, casual at its best and auto played at its worst, I could que for LFR and finish the raid while being AFK in every fight... Without dying.

I have a few videos where I fight 15 fully geared hordes 3vs15 and I have 2vs1 arena videos, 1vs8 WPvP (And win) videos, I was rank 98 in the US for 2v2 and rank 130 for 3v3, been gladiator twice and I couldn't avoid to feel and think "Why am I even doing this?" Because the guy who just bought his max level and grinder for a couple days already have the same rewards as me, if he gets late into the season he just needs to play Arenas to have his gear handed to him.

The typical answer to this in the wow forums is "snowflake" but the thing is, if me putting so much effort into something gives me nothing why should I in the first place, especially when pushing the boundaries was what gave me fun? And ganking hordes in the world... Which doesn't happen anymore, I moved to Illidan as an Alliance player, despite being formed by 95% horde players it's still dead for WPvP.

This never happened to me in WOTLK back in the day nor now in Warmane, Legion won't be different to WoD, even the garrison have been recycled into the class hall.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> thats called being stuck in the past
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you dislike WoD then the best thing to do is take a break from WoW until Legion


Better to live in the past than to live in a future where they feed you *human biological wastes* called Garrisons, LFR, LFD and CRZs.

If I wanted my game to play itself I would be better off on twitch.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> No way a monitor is going to be 30ms, there are TVs faster than that. Monitors are made with PC usage in mind, low input lag for smooth work not Dynamic Contrast, Dunamic Colors and, True Motion and the good dozen filters in LG TVs.
> 
> The manufacturer is responsible for input lag, but the monitor isn't beyond the pixel response time, which as I said is 10 times faster than a gaming TN of 1ms, it's a matter of time before we see the first 0.1ms response time gaming OLED monitors, hopefully in 2017.
> 
> And saying that Legion is better than WOTLK cross me as foolish at best, call me an elitist but with LFR, LFD (LFG is fine I believe for the health of the game) WoW is nothing more than a corridor MMO, casual at its best and auto played at its worst, I could que for LFR and finish the raid while being AFK in every fight... Without dying.
> 
> I have a few videos where I fight 15 fully geared hordes 3vs15 and I have 2vs1 arena videos, 1vs8 WPvP videos, I was rank 98 in the US for 2v2 and rank 130 for 3v3, been gladiator twice and I couldn't avoid to feel and think "Why am I even doing this?" Because the guy who just bought his max level and grinder for a couple days already have the same rewards as me, if he gets late into the season he just needs to play Arenas to have his gear handed to him.
> 
> This never happened to me in WOTLK back in the day nor now in Warmane, Legion won't be different to WoD, even the garrison have been recycled into the class hall.


It's a new panel type,...

I have owned many monitors that have been over 30ms. When 1440p was new, my first 1440p monitor was 65ms input lag. Even the new(ish) highly popular 3440x1440 IPS monitors are in the 25-30ms ranges. It's not unheard of, especially for a new panel type. OLED only just this year dropped from 55ms to 32ms and these TVs have PC modes that are optimized for PC usage - disability everything TV-related.

This WoW topic is foolish, your just living in the past. You can't say something isn't better if you haven't even tried it. You know nothing of legion, everyone is basically the same ilevel now in PVP regardless of gear. PVP gear is cosmetic only. If you choose to play on LFR difficulty, that's your choice. You can't complain about difficulty when playing on the easiest setting.


----------



## jasondub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> If you don't use an intense ENB and/or ReShade, you should get a perfectly smooth 60fps on FO4 and W3 experience at 3440 x 1440 with one of these GPUs even if using multiple mods.
> The performance crusher is an SSAO heavy ENB preset from my experience.
> That said, if you tweak the .ini files on those games, you can bring your FPS to it's knees running SLI Titan XP at that resolution.


Yeah, but my whole point is going extreme in modding GFX, only aim for the most GFX demanding mods. And sadly I do only want to purchase one single Nvidia Titan XP.....


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Even the new(ish) highly popular 3440x1440 IPS monitors are in the 25-30ms ranges


well
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/content/acer_predator_x34.htm#response_times
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/content/acer_predator_x34.htm#detailed_response



7.9 avg for X34 Predator

or did you mean something else ?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I'm saying that OLED *RIGHT NOW* is in no way shape or form ready for competitive gaming. The fastest current panel is 32ms. In the future, yes, it likely will be because the technology is capable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All modern TVs have PC modes that disable those processing filters. OLED burn-in issue is exaggerated. I play WoW for 12-15hr/day on mine sometimes, no issues. A company tested a completely static image for over 24 hours, and got some minor image retention that went away quickly with normal usage.
> 
> I had a 34UM95 3440x1440, which is the PPI as your 27" 1440p. I still felt the same on that, sat roughly 1 1/2 feet away. SMAA just isn't that good in my opinion.


I disagree with this completely. I suck at BF4 just the same with my 55" OLED as I do with my X34


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> well
> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/content/acer_predator_x34.htm#response_times
> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/content/acer_predator_x34.htm#detailed_response
> 
> 
> 
> 7.9 avg for X34 Predator
> 
> or did you mean something else ?


That's not input lag, that's pixel response time. OLED's pixel response time is .1ms, yet input lag is 32-55ms.

The LG 34UM95 has 25ms according to Toms, but some reviews claim higher.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/lg-34um95-ultra-wide-monitor,3835-9.html
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> I disagree with this completely. I suck at BF4 just the same with my 55" OLED as I do with my X34


lol

I score about the same regardless too... I am terrible at FPS.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The LG 34UM95 has 25ms according to Toms, but some reviews claim higher.
> http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/lg-34um95-ultra-wide-monitor,3835-9.html


Tom's is one of the worst monitor reviewers ever. TFTC, Prad, and PCM are the only ones with decent methods and equipment. Most 21:9 34'' monitors have much less than 10 ms input lag.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> currently the best OLED is 32ms input lag


Been available since March...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> Tom's is one of the worst monitor reviewers ever. TFTC, Prad, and PCM are the only ones with decent methods and equipment. Most 21:9 34'' monitors have much less than 10 ms input lag.


Proof?

Seems in almost all cases it's people confusing response time with input lag. Pretty hard to get less than 10ms input lag on a 60hz panel, which most 3440x1440 are.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Been available since March...


Cmon, now. Response time is not the same as input lag. All OLEDs have a .1ms response time.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> Tom's is one of the worst monitor reviewers ever. TFTC, Prad, and PCM are the only ones with decent methods and equipment. Most 21:9 34'' monitors have much less than 10 ms input lag.
> 
> 
> 
> Proof?
> 
> Seems in almost all cases it's people confusing response time with input lag. Pretty hard to get less than 10ms input lag on a 60hz panel, which most 3440x1440 are.
Click to expand...

Proof of what? That input lag is panel type agnostic?

Tom's is incredibly inconsistent with their results. They vary wildly, especially when compared to most other reviewers.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> Proof of what? That input lag is panel type agnostic?
> 
> Tom's is incredibly inconsistent with their results. They vary wildly, especially when compared to most other reviewers.


Proof that the reviews were measuring input lag and not pixel response time. Most reviews don't even measure input lag. A monitor with 1ms response time does not mean it has 1ms input lag, and yet most people still seem to think these are the same thing.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> Proof of what? That input lag is panel type agnostic?
> 
> Tom's is incredibly inconsistent with their results. They vary wildly, especially when compared to most other reviewers.
> 
> 
> 
> Proof that the reviews were measuring input lag and not pixel response time. Most reviews don't even measure input lag. A monitor with 1ms response time does not mean it has 1ms input lag, and yet most people still seem to think these are the same thing.
Click to expand...

Here's an input lag measurement made against a CRT (which have virtually no input lag, as it's as low as it can be on displays):



Input lag, then half of average response time. 34'' 21:9 1440p monitor.


----------



## Murlocke

Since you insist on those sites:
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/lg_34um95.htm

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/images/lg_34um95/lag.png

Here's TFTC input lag for a bunch of monitors. Notice quite a few exceed 25ms, with the 34UM95 at 24ms.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Since you insist on those sites:
> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/lg_34um95.htm
> 
> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/images/lg_34um95/lag.png
> 
> Here's TFTC input lag for a bunch of monitors. Notice quite a few exceed 25ms, including the LG 34UM95.


You just proved my point: input lag is panel type agnostic.

That LG monitor is not representative of the panel type, resolution, refresh rate, or aspect ratio. It's simply a monitor with higher than average signal processing time, resulting in high input lag.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> You just proved my point: input lag is panel type agnostic.
> 
> That LG monitor is not representative of the panel type, resolution, refresh rate, or aspect ratio. It's simply a monitor with higher than average signal processing time, resulting in high input lag.


I never disagree with that?

All I said was I expect the first OLED monitors to be in the ~30ms input lag ranges. For crying out loud.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Since you insist on those sites:
> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/lg_34um95.htm
> 
> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/images/lg_34um95/lag.png
> 
> Here's TFTC input lag for a bunch of monitors. Notice quite a few exceed 25ms, with the 34UM95 at 24ms.


some yes

but not the predator X34 as seen in the post above

it has 5.25 + 3.95


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> some yes
> 
> but not the predator X34 as seen in the post above
> 
> it has 5.25 + 3.95


The brand new 3440x1440 monitors are faster, but when 3440x1440 first came out (34UM95, etc) the input lag was much higher. That's my point, the first OLED monitors are going to be on the "slow" side and improve overtime.

I think if people are really expecting 4K 120hz OLED monitors with .1ms input lag in the next year they are going to be disappointed. I think the absolute best we can hope for is about 25ms, which is still too high to be considered a competitive FPS monitor.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Cmon, now. Response time is not the same as input lag. All OLEDs have a .1ms response time.


Input lag isn't even a specification that is usually provided by manufacturers and figures provided by reviews are not very precise as they vary from site to site due to differences in methodology deriving the figures.

You are basing your assertion of OLED refresh rates on OLED TVs without having any concrete data on OLED monitors. I challenge you to find input lag figures on OLED displays...


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The brand new 3440x1440 monitors are faster, but when 3440x1440 first came out (34UM95, etc) the input lag was much higher. That's my point, the first OLED monitors are going to be on the "slow" side and improve overtime.
> 
> I think if people are really expecting 4K 120hz OLED monitors with .1ms input lag in the next year they are going to be disappointed. I think the absolute best we can hope for is about 25ms, which is still too high to be considered a competitive FPS monitor.


I don't think anyone following tech close enough to expect an OLED monitor is really expecting a 0.1ms input lag unit, even the fastest TNs like the BenQ XL2730Z with 1ms pixel time have around 2ms input lag with instant mode.

I do expect the first decent OLED 144Hz panels to be near that number though, maxing out at 4ms.

4K 144Hz OLED HDR can't get here soon enough.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Input lag isn't even a specification that is usually provided by manufacturers and figures provided by reviews are not very precise as they vary from site to site due to differences in methodology deriving the figures.
> 
> You are basing your assertion of OLED refresh rates on OLED TVs without having any concrete data on OLED monitors. I challenge you to find input lag figures on OLED displays...


There are many devices that measure input lag, and most reviews do have the LG E6 at roughly 32ms and the previous EF9500 model at around 53ms. This is while in PC mode with all TV-type processing disabled.

I stated I think the first OLED monitors will still be around ~30ms input lag. Making an educated guess based on the current OLED displays we have is not a crime. You can agree with my assumptions or not, I never stated anything as a fact other than *current* OLEDs are not "competitive gaming" friendly.

This topic has gotten insanely off topic and quite frankly ridiculous that someone can't make a prediction without people jumping down their throats as if they are claiming facts.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> I don't think anyone following tech close enough to expect an OLED monitor is really expecting a 0.1ms input lag unit, even the fastest TNs like the BenQ XL2730Z with 1ms pixel time have around 4ms input lag with instant mode.
> 
> I do expect the first decent OLED 144Hz panels to be near that number though, maxing out at 4ms.
> 
> 4K 144Hz OLED HDR can't get here soon enough.


I'd love to be wrong, but I just don't see a 4ms input lag OLED in the next year or even a <20ms one. Your going to need DP1.4 to get that resolution/refresh rate too, which current GPUs do not have.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> 4K 144Hz OLED *HDR* can't get here soon enough.


Preach. Nothing beats HDR content.

Though i'm a bit wary of the limitations of OLED when it comes to HDR and the UHD standard. A lot of VA TV's already conform, but we've yet to see an OLED display do that. I hope they start producing them soon, so it can become mainstream quickly.

edit: i see now that the newest OLED models achieve peak brightness of 500+ cd/m^2, so nevermind


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I never disagree with that?
> 
> All I said was I expect the first OLED monitors to be in the ~30ms input lag ranges. For crying out loud.


I agree with you completely, the first 4K monitors were in the 30-40ms range as well.

First OLED monitors won't be optimized for competitive gaming and probably around the same as the current OLED TVs we have now.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ToTheSun!*
> 
> Preach. Nothing beats HDR content.
> 
> Though i'm a bit wary of the limitations of OLED when it comes to HDR and the UHD standard. A lot of VA TV's already conform, but we've yet to see an OLED display do that. I hope they start producing them soon, so it can become mainstream quickly.
> 
> edit: i see now that the newest OLED models achieve peak brightness of 500+ cd/m^2, so nevermind


Yeah, the 2016 models can do HDR fine and meet the UHD certification specs. The 2015 OLEDs, not so much.

My E6 measured 650 cd/m2 with my meter, though some sites have claimed up to ~800 or so under certain HDR situations.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> First OLED monitors won't be optimized for competitive gaming and probably around the same as the current OLED TVs we have now.


Exactly!

I'd love to be wrong here, but the first 4K OLEDs monitors are probably not going to be targeting gamers and it won't be until later until companies start optimizing for speed.

It's been the same thing when LCD first came out. Then again with 1440p. Then again with UltraWide monitors & 4K. I don't expect this pattern to change, especially given the fact OLED will still be a very premium and limited market for the next year or two.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Your going to need DP1.4 to get that resolution/refresh rate too, which current GPUs do not have.


What are you talking about? Polaris and Pascal both support DisplayPort 1.4


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Yeah, the 2016 models can do HDR fine and meet the UHD certification specs. The 2015 OLEDs, not so much.


Yeah, i was making an assumption based on the 2015 models.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> There are many devices that measure input lag, and most reviews do have the LG E6 at roughly 32ms and the previous EF9500 model at around 53ms. This is while in PC mode with all TV-type processing disabled.


Like I said, your reference is based around input lag on TVs...

Earlier you were arguing about low input lag and then using a 60 Hz display to validate your point:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> 
> 
> Notice quite a few exceed 25ms, with the 34UM95 at 24ms.


Just about every every high end 120+ Hz display has much tighter input lag compared to TVs in PC mode. In fact, modern IPS displays are very comparable to TN panels. Going TN for lower input lag is a moot point...


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Like I said, your reference is based around input lag on TVs...
> 
> Earlier you were arguing about low input lag and then using a 60 Hz display to validate your point:
> Just about every every high end 120+ Hz display has much tighter input lag compared to TVs in PC mode


He's talking about OLED.


----------



## ChevChelios

hm so 4K OLED/VA HDR TVs are already a thing ..

so what we need now are such monitors, more tuned for gaming, with 120/144+ refresh rates, Gsync/Freesync and a decent price tag ... and much more HDR content of course

I presume OLED is preferabble to VA ?


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> hm so 4K OLED/VA HDR TVs are already a thing ..
> 
> so what we need now are such monitors, more tuned for gaming, with 120/144+ refresh rates, Gsync/Freesync and a decent price tag ... and much more HDR content of course
> 
> I presume OLED is preferabble to VA ?


No it's not just preferable.

I won't even make a comparison between OLED and VA because one is so much better than the other that it is downright insulting, it'd be like comparing Fermi Vs GCN.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> What are you talking about? Polaris and Pascal both support DisplayPort 1.4


Your right, I guess it did release with the 1080.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> Like I said, your reference is based around input lag on TVs...


Again, because that's the only reference we have. I am predicting what input lag the first OLED monitors will have. You do understand this right?

The first OLED monitors will most likely not be optimized for gamers, they will probably not be much faster than the current OLED TVs in PC mode. When we start seeing gaming OLEDs, the technology is capable of matching (or even exceeding) TN speeds.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> hm so 4K OLED/VA HDR TVs are already a thing ..
> 
> so what we need now are such monitors, more tuned for gaming, with 120/144+ refresh rates, Gsync/Freesync and a decent price tag ... and much more HDR content of course
> 
> I presume OLED is preferabble to VA ?


OLED's image quality destroys every other panel technology. Honestly, any VA panel is going to look like a gray washed out mess next to an OLED. 3000-5000:1 contrast ratio means nothing next to infinite contrast ratio with blacks that are actually true black.


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Nor in Valley, FS or 3dmark11. Source: OCN benching section where my Titans are still faster than any single card score in those tests (including Heaven like whyscotty showed).


The picture shows a titan running at 1280. That's a golden sample. I cap out around 1150 on stock cooler


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> The picture shows a titan running at 1280. That's a golden sample. I cap out around 1150 on stock cooler


I run both of mine on 1330MHz in SLI for benching.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I run both of mine on 1330MHz in SLI for benching.


One of mine wouldn't go over 1184 MHz even with the 1.3V hack.









The other did better but I never pushed it too hard to find out exactly what its max was, but it couldn't do 1250MHz with the 1.3V hack either. They were both from the very first run though and maybe I got particularly bad ones.

edit: they were both undewater too (nice full EK blocks).


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> One of mine wouldn't go over 1184 MHz even with the 1.3V hack.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The other did better but I never pushed it too hard to find out exactly what its max was, but it couldn't do 1250MHz with the 1.3V hack either. They were both from the very first run though and maybe I got particularly bad ones.


Both my Titans OCed extremely poorly and were also ordered on Day 1.

I think they just improve with time, as yields increase.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Where have you been?


the manicorn home planet of glittersparklerainbow
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> The real question is how long are you going to run all 4 of them on air before switching to other cooling methods?


----------



## Baasha

So the new card is out on Monday, are there any reviews/benchmarks out for it yet?


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> So the new card is out on Monday, are there any reviews/benchmarks out for it yet?


Card is out August 2nd, Tuesday.

No reviews yet, probably August 2nd for those too.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> So the new card is out on Monday, are there any reviews/benchmarks out for it yet?


Nup.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> the manicorn home planet of glittersparklerainbow


So lots of OT I see...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Card is out August 2nd, Tuesday.
> 
> No reviews yet, probably August 2nd for those too.


Which is odd because don't we normally have a paper launch first? These cards will probably sell out on Day 1, like all previous Titans. Early adopters may have to drop $1200 without even knowing what they are buying or risk having to wait until the second shipment.

I guess nothing is stopping them from refusing the package or sending it back if performance isn't "up to ~60%" faster than the previous Titan like they claimed.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Card is out August 2nd, Tuesday.
> 
> No reviews yet, probably August 2nd for those too.


There is an NDA in place. It lifts on the 2nd.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> These cards will probably sell out on Day 1


Anything will sell out on Day 1 if supply is small enough


----------



## DADDYDC650

Any tips on landing a Titan XP on day 1? I'll be refreshing my browser but there's gotta be an easier way.


----------



## Asus11

Jayz2cent to make the first vid

calling it now

going to claim its the best thing since sliced bread because he gets them free


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Nvidia site will become laggy when the card becomes available. Might be tough to order and pay for a Titan-X.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Nvidia site will become laggy when the card becomes available. Might be tough to order and pay for a Titan-X.


happened with the og titan x, dont doubt it will happen again lol.


----------



## magnek

They're the only one selling it this time lol.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Any tips on landing a Titan XP on day 1? I'll be refreshing my browser but there's gotta be an easier way.


Bot


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Bot


Where can you get a bot to do this?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Bot


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> Where can you get a bot to do this?


Detroit?


----------



## ChevChelios

no wccf leaks for Titan XP benches yet ?

they slipping


----------



## magnek

Just use the formula Titan XP = Titan X * 1.6 or 1080 * 1.25


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> Where can you get a bot to do this?


Finding shopping bots aren't that hard.
I know friends that use them or used to on foot stores, finishline and Nike on drops. Amazon Lighting deal bots are still a thing for black Friday/Cyber Monday.


----------



## st0necold

Well what a bummer.

We get the new 1070/1080 aka 970 and a 980ti...

Now we get the Titan P they name is the same thing as the last overpriced Titan (who's owners got shafted weeks later.) and well

It's $1200 and will do the same thing the 1080 will do plus a few more numbers on Fraps...

WHICH is the same as pretty much a 980ti on roids.

My review : 2/10


----------



## st0necold

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> Where can you get a bot to do this?


You don't need one get a 1080 it's the same thing the vram is marketing crap .


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *st0necold*
> 
> You don't need one get a 1080 it's the same thing the vram is marketing crap .


Nobody needs any of these cards. We WANT it.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> Jayz2cent to make the first vid
> 
> calling it now
> 
> going to claim its the best thing since sliced bread because he gets them free


Get enough subscribers and you magically become a hardware reviewer


----------



## magnek

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.


He probably drilled his other eye out.


----------



## magnek

Now _that's_ savage.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *st0necold*
> 
> Well what a bummer.
> 
> We get the new 1070/1080 aka 970 and a 980ti...
> 
> Now we get the Titan P they name is the same thing as the last overpriced Titan (who's owners got shafted weeks later.) and well
> 
> It's $1200 and will do the same thing the 1080 will do plus a few more numbers on Fraps...
> 
> WHICH is the same as pretty much a 980ti on roids.
> 
> My review : 2/10


yea, yea, yea....Ill see you in the Bot Cue line o'er at Nvida dot commer on Tuesday 12 oh 1.


----------



## opt33

Im just hoping I dont have a boxed up Titan XP sitting beside my computer for several weeks waiting for a waterblock.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> One of mine wouldn't go over 1184 MHz even with the 1.3V hack.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The other did better but I never pushed it too hard to find out exactly what its max was, but it couldn't do 1250MHz with the 1.3V hack either. They were both from the very first run though and maybe I got particularly bad ones.
> 
> edit: they were both undewater too (nice full EK blocks).


I'm using the Zawarudo (RIP) voltage controller allowing over 1.4V on my Titans, though using that much voltage causes some benches to run into the power limit so its tricky to dial it in for the best scores. But yeah, 1330MHz in SLI is the best I've ever done...


----------



## l88bastar

In for TWOuesday


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *st0necold*
> 
> You don't need one get a 1080 it's the same thing the vram is marketing crap .


No one can seriously be in this big of denial that the 1080 is no longer the best card. The 1080 is not 60% faster than the previous Titan X. Even with the VRAM aside, this card will stomp over the 1080 no matter how you look at it - about 30-35% faster.

Also, stop telling people what they need/should do with their money when they never asked.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> No one can seriously be in this big of denial that the 1080 is no longer the best card.


The 1080 will end up going down as one of the most useless flagship purchases in the history of video cards it would seem. $700 and just two months on the market of being on top before being completely shunted down the product stack! Obviously Nvidia really cares about its high end customers! And yet these same clowns will still hit the threads in droves defending every single thing this company does to them (just like Apple fanboys)! Ironically, the fact that it was a total paper launch and nearly vaporware for so long is going to end up working to a lot of people's advantage...


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> The 1080 will end up going down as one of the most useless flagship purchases in the history of video cards it would seem. $700 and just two months on the market of being on top before being completely shunted down the product stack! Obviously Nvidia really cares about its high end customers! And yet these same clowns will still hit the threads in droves defending every single thing this company does to them (just like Apple fanboys)! Ironically, the fact that it was a total paper launch and nearly vaporware for so long is going to end up working to a lot of people's advantage...


The TItanXP price sucks, not much we can do about it except only buy two instead of four









Why did you think the 1080 was a Flagship??? Nvidia Flagships are TI and Titan. The 1080 is upper middle class.

And why should Nvidia care? They are a company, companies don't care. Just like consumers should not care if a cheaper, faster, better alternative crops up from a competitor.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> The 1080 will end up going down as one of the most useless flagship purchases in the history of video cards it would seem. $700 and just two months on the market of being on top before being completely shunted down the product stack! Obviously Nvidia really cares about its high end customers! And yet these same clowns will still hit the threads in droves defending every single thing this company does to them (just like Apple fanboys)! Ironically, the fact that it was a total paper launch and nearly vaporware for so long is going to end up working to a lot of people's advantage...


I think we are past the age where we will ever see a $700 card be considered flagship. I almost bought a 1080, but I couldn't justify that price for only 25-30% improvement, when I knew the next Titan or 1080Ti was likely not that far.

The 1080 is still not ideal for 4K unless you buy two. This card is the first single-setup card that seems acceptable for 4K. However, in the best case scenario they claimed it's 60% faster than a Maxwell Titan X. Running benchmarks on mine, that's still not going to get me 60FPS in games like GTA V, Witcher 3 (even with hairworks off), etc at 4K. It'll be close though.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I think we are past the age where we will ever see a $700 card be considered flagship. I almost bought a 1080, but I couldn't justify that price for only 25-30% improvement, when I knew the next Titan or 1080Ti was likely not that far.
> 
> The 1080 is still not ideal for 4K unless you buy two. This card is the first single-setup card that seems acceptable for 4K. However, in the best case scenario they claimed it's 60% faster than a Maxwell Titan X. Running benchmarks on mine, that's still not going to get me 60FPS in games like GTA V, Witcher 3 (even with hairworks off), etc at 4K. It'll be close though.


The 1080s a nice card....a sidegrade from my TitanX, but I got all the new bells and whistles like Fastsync with it.......and Fastsync is pretty awesome with the 60hz OLED TVs. I don't regret buying my EVGA FTW 1080, but of course I will be selling it in three days


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> The TItanXP price sucks, not much we can do about it except only buy two instead of four
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why did you think the 1080 was a Flagship??? Nvidia Flagships are TI and Titan. The 1080 is upper middle class.


Every X80 card (with the exception of the 780 which released after the OG Titan, not before) has been the flagship for at least a significant amount of time. The 680 was the flagship for almost a whole year, the 980 for half a year for instance. The egregious part of this is that Nvidia was secretive about the Titan XP's existence and almost everybody assumed it wouldn't release until next year so they jumped on 1080's (mistakenly) thinking they would get at least 6 months of owning the fastest video card on the planet only to have JHH pull the rug out from under them two months later. Hell, I bet tons of people are still waiting for their 1080's to even get to them and it will already be relegated to second-best!


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> The 1080s a nice card....a sidegrade from my TitanX, but I got all the new bells and whistles like Fastsync with it.......and Fastsync is pretty awesome with the 60hz OLED TVs


I almost bought the 1080 just for that because I am also running a 60hz OLED via a Denon X7200WA receiver.

Does it work well? I am super sensitive to tearing so I end up having to deal with high input lag and/or low FPS caused by VSYNC. I read that there was a pretty big flaw to it, which ultimately made me decide not to buy the 1080. I forget what it was though...

EDIT: The flaw was it doesn't work well below the monitor's native FPS, only for titles you are far exceeding your monitor's refresh rate - On 4K that is rarely the case. How does it work for <60FPS gaming?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Every X80 card (with the exception of the 780 which released after the OG Titan, not before) has been the flagship for at least a significant amount of time. The 680 was the flagship for almost a whole year, the 980 for half a year for instance. The egregious part of this is that Nvidia was secretive about the Titan XP's existence and almost everybody assumed it wouldn't release until next year so they jumped on 1080's (mistakenly) thinking they would get at least 6 months of owning the fastest video card on the planet only to have JHH pull the rug out from under them two months later. Hell, I bet tons of people are still waiting for their 1080's to even get to them and it will already be relegated to second-best!


I think all companies, Intel/NVIDIA/AMD/etc, need to do a better job at giving time frames on when they expect a product to release. I think it's pretty crazy we usually only have a couple weeks notice for most hardware releases. I've always assumed they do it because it makes people "double dip" more.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Every X80 card (with the exception of the 780 which released after the OG Titan, not before) has been the flagship for at least a significant amount of time. The 680 was the flagship for almost a whole year, the 980 for half a year for instance. The egregious part of this is that Nvidia was secretive about the Titan XP's existence and almost everybody assumed it wouldn't release until next year so they jumped on 1080's (mistakenly) thinking they would get at least 6 months of owning the fastest video card on the planet only to have JHH pull the rug out from under them two months later. Hell, I bet tons of people are still waiting for their 1080's to even get to them and it will already be relegated to second-best!


That is why ppl are pissed 1080 is the mid-range fake flagship, it was never the flagship but have to market as one to slap the flagship price.

now JHH have prove us right, he pull a true cut down chip that is faster than 1080, and that isnt the true flagship but with 256 cores disabled.

Some fanboy here keep defending 1080 are the flagship and deserve the flagship price and it make me laugh. I hope someone here do a chart on DIE SIZE vs PRICE and you will see where I am coming from.


----------



## Oubadah

How long is the 1080Ti going to take to arrive now?

How is the Titan series still a thing? How are they selling any?


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> this card will stomp over the 1080 no matter how you look at it - about 30-35% faster.


is 30% really that good?

50 fps + 30% = 65 fps

30 fps + 30% = 39 fps

26 fps + 30% = 34 fps

actual performance go from decent to barely any better. how much are we really gaining?


----------



## Slomo4shO

This sums up things nicely:


----------



## carlhil2

That "30%" will definitely help push a 4k monitor.....


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I think all companies, Intel/NVIDIA/AMD/etc, need to do a better job at giving time frames on when they expect a product to release. I think it's pretty crazy we usually only have a couple weeks notice for most hardware releases. *I've always assumed they do it because it makes people "double dip" more.*


And you would not be wrong.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> That "30%" will definitely help push a 4k monitor.....


i understand but by how much really? 30% of garbage is still garbage.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> i understand but by how much really? 30% of garbage is still garbage.


You lost me Son.....I am just after the highest performance, can't get into the politics of it all, it's just noise to me...at the end of the day, it's just another gpu being released, that's faster than the previous, that's all...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> is 30% really that good?
> 
> 50 fps + 30% = 65 fps
> 
> 30 fps + 30% = 39 fps
> 
> 26 fps + 30% = 34 fps
> 
> actual performance go from decent to barely any better. how much are we really gaining?


Agree with you. Percentages sound nice and all but if you are just gaming and not competitively benching 35% isn't really that much of a big deal in terms of real world FPS (unless you are right on the cusp for a 60Hz or 120Hz monitor and just need that extra 5-10 FPS to stay in the sweet spot).. As always though, the bulk of buyers for this type of product are all about epeen and this certainly gives you the satisfaction of being able to spend more money than others (I was certainly guilty of this thinking when I spent $2k on these Titans)!


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> i understand but by how much really? 30% of garbage is still garbage.


An extra 10-15fps is nice but not $550 more nice. Won't stop the Titan XP from selling out. People want the best and don't mind paying just for bragging rights.

That being said, In for two!


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> An extra 10-15fps is nice but not $550 more nice. Won't stop the Titan XP from selling out. People want the best and don't mind paying just for bragging rights.
> 
> That being said, In for two!


If you are spending $1200+ for "bragging rights..", you are doing it wrong...


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> An extra 10-15fps is nice but not $550 more nice. Won't stop the Titan XP from selling out. People want the best and don't mind paying just for bragging rights.
> 
> That being said, In for two!


Compare to GTX1080 FE price if Titan X was $1000 it would make it better p/p then the lower end card. That just does not make any sense. If you look back at 980 Ti you know it was not a $650 card because at that price it had better p/p then GTX980 which again should not be the case.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> If you are spending $1200+ for "bragging rights..", you are doing it wrong...


There's no denying epeen is definitely a factor in $1000+ hardware.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Compare to GTX1080 FE price if Titan X was $1000 it would make it better p/p then the lower end card. That just does not make any sense. If you look back at 980 Ti you know it was not a $650 card because at that price it had better p/p then GTX980 which again should not be the case.


Sadly none of Nvidia's prices makes sense from mid-range on. As you know, they could care less and they know we'll pay as long as AMD sits on their butt's.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> *The 1080 will end up going down as one of the most useless flagship purchases in the history of video cards it would seem. $700 and just two months on the market of being on top before being completely shunted down the product stack!* Obviously Nvidia really cares about its high end customers! *And yet these same clowns will still hit the threads in droves defending every single thing this company does to them* (just like Apple fanboys)! Ironically, the fact that it was a total paper launch and nearly vaporware for so long is going to end up working to a lot of people's advantage...


Who cares about any of that? What are we, 12?

If you buy a card just because it's a 'flagship' product and the 'latest and greatest', then you're buying it for a very stupid reason and the wrong reason to begin with. You'll soon find yourself in a vicious, neverending cycle of having to upgrade every time something new comes out.

Buy it because it fulfills your current needs for gaming or whatever else it is that you do. That's what it's made for.

The 1080 is a hell of a card and will remain a hell of a card long after Titan releases because it is a great performer. Period.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> If you are spending $1200+ for "bragging rights..", you are doing it wrong...


Doing it wrong? Isn't that the whole point in buying cards worth over $600? I wish I could hold back and be smarter about my cash but I'm bored and need something to buy.

BTW, I'm not buying a Titan XP to brag because you won't ever find me bragging. I'm simply joking and being sarcastic. I want the best and I'm willing to pay for it. I'm not willing to pay much more unless I'm simply blown away.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Doing it wrong? Isn't that the whole point in buying cards worth over $600? I wish I could hold back and be smarter about my cash but I'm bored and need something to buy.


I think so too. There is no game out there that justifies spending $1200 on a GPU.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> You lost me Son.....I am just after the highest performance, can't get into the politics of it all, it's just noise to me...


there's no politics, just common sense.

if your 1080 can't handle 4k, then neither is a titan xp. if your 1080 gets 30 fps in 4k, then your titan xp isn't doing much better at 39 fps. $500 for 9 fps do much for you?

if your 1080 is getting 70 fps and you're running a 60hz monitor, having a titan run it at 91 won't make a perceptible difference.

if you have a 120hz 1080p monitor and you're getting 80 fps with your 1080, you're still "only" getting 104 fps with your titan.


----------



## carlhil2

People make themselves feel good by tearing others pc gear down , comedy...


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> there's no politics, just common sense.
> 
> if your 1080 can't handle 4k, then neither is a titan xp. if your 1080 gets 30 fps in 4k, then your titan xp isn't doing much better at 39 fps. $500 for 9 fps do much for you?
> 
> if your 1080 is getting 70 fps and you're running a 60hz monitor, having a titan run it at 91 won't make a perceptible difference.
> 
> if you have a 120hz 1080p monitor and you're getting 80 fps with your 1080, you're still "only" getting 104 fps with your titan.


If you are getting 40-50 fps with GTX 1080 then a Titan X will get 55-65 fps. Much better place to be in. Add overclocking and you are golden.


----------



## x3sphere

Plenty of games average around 45 fps on a 1080 at 4K so this card should hit stable 60 in those.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I think so too. There is no game out there that justifies spending $1200 on a GPU.


I think hours spent on using your GPU is probably a better measurement than how many games you use it on.

I spent 700+ hours on my 980 Ti, even though half of that is taken up by just two games, Borderlands 2 (288 hours) and Borderlands TPS (71 hours).


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> People make themselves feel good by tearing others pc gear down , comedy...


Off topic but how do you like your motherboard? Was going to buy it but I hate those blue streaks on the heatsinks. Why do mobo companies feature RGB lighting and then apply certain colors to their boards?


----------



## renejr902

Titan xp will be much better than 30%-35% with overclocking. Fully overclocked i could guess 45-50%, if it need watercooled i will do it

Dont worry most games will do 60fps at 4k, just disable hairwork in witcher, choose very high preset in rise of tomb raider instead of maximum setting , do same thing in some others games, and disable AA in some games, thats it


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Off topic but how do you like your motherboard? Was going to buy it but I hate those blue streaks on the heatsinks. Why do mobo companies feature RGB lighting and then apply certain colors to their boards?


It is an ok mobo, seems just like the first one, just more LIGHTS, which I set mine to red only......


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Titan xp will be much better than 30%-35% with overclocking. Fully overclocked i could guess 45-50%, if it need watercooled i will do it
> 
> Dont worry most games will do 60fps at 4k, just disable hairwork in witcher, choose very high preset in rise of tomb raider instead of maximum setting , do same thing in others games, and disable AA in some games, thats it


I believe the Titan XP is 30 percent faster than a 1080 when both are sitting at stock speeds. 30 percent faster is just a guess though.


----------



## jasondub

Has anyone seen the latest computing benchmark? should be 2 days ago and that guy claims it easily should be 50% faster in game performance, how legit is that?


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I think hours spent on using your GPU is probably a better measurement than how many games you use it on.
> 
> I spent 700+ hours on my 980 Ti, even though half of that is taken up by just two games, Borderlands 2 (288 hours) and Borderlands TPS (71 hours).


Not really. I would only count the hours Titan X would benefit me over the GPU I replace. I spend 90% of my gaming time playing Dota 2 and Overwatch which do not need Titan X even 4K. You would have play all new games that come out to warrant a Titan X and that is until a fast card comes out.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> The 1080s a nice card....a sidegrade from my TitanX, but I got all the new bells and whistles like Fastsync with it.......and Fastsync is pretty awesome with the 60hz OLED TVs


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I almost bought the 1080 just for that because I am also running a 60hz OLED via a Denon X7200WA receiver.
> 
> Does it work well? I am super sensitive to tearing so I end up having to deal with high input lag and/or low FPS caused by VSYNC. I read that there was a pretty big flaw to it, which ultimately made me decide not to buy the 1080. I forget what it was though...
> 
> EDIT: The flaw was it doesn't work well below the monitor's native FPS, only for titles you are far exceeding your monitor's refresh rate - On 4K that is rarely the case. How does it work for <60FPS gaming?
> I think all companies, Intel/NVIDIA/AMD/etc, need to do a better job at giving time frames on when they expect a product to release. I think it's pretty crazy we usually only have a couple weeks notice for most hardware releases. I've always assumed they do it because it makes people "double dip" more.


Yes the flaw with the 1080 and fast sync is its not powerful enough to keep 4k up to 60fps without turning a good deal of eyecandy down......but the TitanXP should do a much better job of it


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> there's no politics, just common sense.
> 
> if your 1080 can't handle 4k, then neither is a titan xp. if your 1080 gets 30 fps in 4k, then your titan xp isn't doing much better at 39 fps. $500 for 9 fps do much for you?
> 
> if your 1080 is getting 70 fps and you're running a 60hz monitor, having a titan run it at 91 won't make a perceptible difference.
> 
> if you have a 120hz 1080p monitor and you're getting 80 fps with your 1080, you're still "only" getting 104 fps with your titan.


Common sense and Titan don't go together lol.


----------



## renejr902

4k and titan xp make common sense, i just explained, you need to overclock your titan xp to get 60fps in 4k with most games, something that 1080 cant do at all, except a few ones. Overclocked 1080 is around 52-55 fps in a lot of 4k games. Dont make mistake to compare performance with price. Titan xp is too much expensive but the job will be done great, performance wont disappoint in 4k, i will disable AA, for me its not worth it in 4k at all and witcher hairwork dont worth it too, rise of tomb raider hairwork do a better job and worth it, if needed use very high settings instead to maximum everything, not a big difference. So i dont see any problem to run games in 4k60 with this card


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> is 30% really that good?
> 
> 50 fps + 30% = 65 fps
> 
> 30 fps + 30% = 39 fps
> 
> 26 fps + 30% = 34 fps
> 
> actual performance go from decent to barely any better. how much are we really gaining?


Yes 30% can make a huge difference, you need all the power you can get for 4K, and I really doubt many people are going from a 1080 to the new Titan. Anyone running a 980Ti or maxwell titan will see a ~60% increase, which is not minor at all.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> There's no denying epeen is definitely a factor in $1000+ hardware.


I'm buying it and really could care less about epeen or bragging rights. Infact, I rarely even post on these forums anymore unless I am actively looking for new hardware or something new is coming out I am buying. I assume this card will be no different, I'll buy it and then fade off to play games and enjoy my purchase.

The fact the 1080 is not fast enough for 4K is enough reason for me to buy this card. You need two, and that doesn't interest me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> there's no politics, just common sense.
> 
> if your 1080 can't handle 4k, then neither is a titan xp. if your 1080 gets 30 fps in 4k, then your titan xp isn't doing much better at 39 fps. $500 for 9 fps do much for you?
> 
> if your 1080 is getting 70 fps and you're running a 60hz monitor, having a titan run it at 91 won't make a perceptible difference.
> 
> if you have a 120hz 1080p monitor and you're getting 80 fps with your 1080, you're still "only" getting 104 fps with your titan.


Uhh, the 1080 gets about 45-50 in most demanding titles at 4K. The Titan X will push that to about 60, which is the refresh rate of most 4K monitors and makes for a much more enjoyable experience. With OC, the Titan X should achieve an almost solid 60 in most titles at 4K. The 1080 won't.

Yes, that is worth $500 to me because 45-50 is not smooth at all. 55+ on the other hand I can tolerate.


----------



## stefxyz

30% is huuuge. With my HTC Vive or Oculus Rift before, if I drop to 70 FPS I would get studder, reprojection or ATW now if I get a 30% boost it stays at the 90 fps required...

Problem is: while 30% is huge its still way too slow for 4k for me. Even 60 fps for me doesnt do it anymore. I rather play 1440p at 100+ FPS. 60 FPS is okayish smooth only but you feel quite a difference to 90 plus...

90 is the new 60... at least for me.

So my reason to buy this is VR plus I like to try out new things and the price doesnt affect my finance too much


----------



## guttheslayer

so here is the trend for gradual price increase vs gpu type / codename.

This die are of similar size for different architecture:

GF116 - GK106 - GM206 - GP106

GF114 - GK104 - GM204 - GP104

GF110 - GK110 - GM200 - GP102

And here is the chart on above similar group vs price. (Reference pricing is used to induce standardization)










Now the price increase trend is much more clear.


----------



## blue1512

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Who cares about any of that? What are we, 12?
> 
> If you buy a card just because it's a 'flagship' product and the 'latest and greatest', then you're buying it for a very stupid reason and the wrong reason to begin with. You'll soon find yourself in a vicious, neverending cycle of having to upgrade every time something new comes out.
> 
> Buy it because it fulfills your current needs for gaming or whatever else it is that you do. That's what it's made for.
> 
> The 1080 is a hell of a card and will remain a hell of a card long after Titan releases because it is a great performer. Period.


1080 is great card, but its price is only justified if it remains the top-dog.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> so here is the trend for gradual price increase vs gpu type / codename.
> 
> This die are of similar size for different architecture:
> 
> GF116 - GK106 - GM206 - GP106
> 
> GF114 - GK104 - GM204 - GP104
> 
> GF110 - GK110 - GM200 - GP102
> 
> And here is the chart on above similar group vs price. (Reference pricing is used to induce standardization)
> 
> 
> 
> Now the price increase trend is much more clear.


We've seen price increases over the years on every single product in existence, why not electronics?

Flagship GPUs have been roughly the same price for around a decade (prior to the first titan), they were bound to see a price increase. It sucks but the value of a dollar is becoming less and less.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> We've seen price increases over the years on every single product in existence, why not electronics?
> 
> Flagship GPUs have been roughly the same price for around a decade, they were bound to see a price increase. It sucks but the value of a dollar is becoming less and less.


Not so when the duration between blue bar to green bar is just 60 months. Market inflation alone isn't this bad from 2011 to 2016.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> We've seen price increases over the years on every single product in existence, why not electronics?


Hard drives have seen a steady and significant drop in $/GB over the last 15+ years.

Same with SSDs as they've gotten bigger and faster.

Same with RAM as they've gotten bigger and faster.

How many PC components have seen a drastic increase in price the way GPU's have?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Not so when the duration between blue bar to green bar is just 60 months. Market inflation alone isn't this bad from 2011 to 2016.


Yes but the prior 120 months had basically no price increases. Instead of doing the price increase gradually like most companies, they did it in two quick jumps.

A soda from a soda machine was 75 cent 10 years ago, now it's 1.75. Over double. A flagship GPU cost about $650 10 years ago, now it costs $1200. Groceries are the same way, they are basically double the price that they were 10 years ago. Many many products have doubled in price over the last 10 years (or decreased in size), it's just the way our economy is.

I don't think it's as bad as some people make it out to be. People make a lot more money on average than they did 10 years ago because the value of a dollar is less. Minimum wage is higher, etc.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Hard drives have seen a steady and significant drop in $/GB over the last 15+ years.
> 
> Same with SSDs as they've gotten bigger and faster.
> 
> Same with RAM as they've gotten bigger and faster.
> 
> How many PC components have seen a drastic increase in price the way GPU's have?


If you want to use $/gig, then you need to compare to $/gflop. You think the 8800GTX had more $/gflop than a Pascal Titan X? No the Pascal Titan X is a far better value when compared like that. We are paying absurdly less for each gflop than we did when the 8800GTX released. By a crazy amount...

That comparison does not work.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Yes but the prior 120 months had basically no price increases. Instead of doing the price increase gradually like most companies, they did it in two quick jumps.


The problem is, they might do that big jump every generation if there is no competition. just saying.

So that 10 years no inflation become invalid for that senarios

Repost for reference:


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I don't think it's as bad as some people make it out to be. People make a lot more money on average than they did 10 years ago because the value of a dollar is less. Minimum wage is higher, etc.


I wish this true. Real income has more or less remained the same since 2000. (if anything it's actually very slightly _decreased_)


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> The problem is, they might do that big jump every generation if there is no competition. just saying.
> 
> So that 10 years no inflation become invalid for that senarios


If the next card is more than $1200, i'll be right there with you. I don't see myself spending more than that on a GPU.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I wish this true. Real income has more or less remained the same since 2000. (if anything it's actually very slightly _decreased_)


That's depressing if true, I guess it doesn't apply to me because I definitely make more than I did 10 years ago.

Prices have almost doubled though, at least around here. I remember when I could fill a grocery cart for $100-$150. Now it's like $400.


----------



## i7monkey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If you want to compare $/gig, then you need to compare $/gflop. You think the 8800GTX had more $/gflop than a Pascal Titan X? No the Pascal Titan X is a far better value when compared like that.


It's easier to churn out gflops now than it was 10-15 years ago, no?


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> That's depressing if true, I guess it doesn't apply to me because I definitely make more than I did 10 years ago.
> 
> Prices have almost doubled though, at least around here. I remember when I could fill a grocery cart for $100-$150. Now it's like $400.


Yeah even according to the CPI inflation calculator, we've experienced 40% inflation since 2000. I honestly was not expecting that, but it certainly explains the prices we see today. That and I'm living in one of the most expensive areas in the country (SF Bay Area).

As far as groceries go. When I first moved here 4 years ago, OJ cost $3 and milk cost $4. Now they're $4 and $5 respectively. And fresh product have gone up 50% as well.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> It's easier to churn out gflops now than it was 10-15 years ago, no?


And it's easier to churn out $/gig than it was 10-15 years ago too. Your comparing apples to oranges by comparing $/gig to the overall price of a GPU. $/gig to $/gflop is a much fairer comparison.

If you want to compare to HDD prices you'd compare the price of a top of the line HDD today versus the price of a top of the line HDD 10 years ago, without factoring in $/gig. A max size HDD cost significantly more than it did 10 years ago. I mean we have $20,000 SSDs if you want to get crazy, but no one seems to complain about these because no one "needs" them. Same with processors, no one complains about $1500 processors because no one "needs" them. People "need" this card to run 4K 60fps off a single card, and that's why there is the hate. Many people want the card, but most people can't afford it and/or can't justify the price they are charging for it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Yeah even according to the CPI inflation calculator, we've experienced 40% inflation since 2000. I honestly was not expecting that, but it certainly explains the prices we see today. That and I'm living in one of the most expensive areas in the country (SF Bay Area).
> 
> As far as groceries go. When I first moved here 4 years ago, OJ cost $3 and milk cost $4. Now they're $4 and $5 respectively. And fresh product have gone up 50% as well.


Exactly, so there's no way to know if NVIDIA is charging increased prices to keep profit ups or due to greed/monopoly. We know the actual product cost pennies on the dollar to make, but R&D is always the most expensive part. Who knows how much they had to spend on the pascal architecture during R&D and how much they've made back.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blue1512*
> 
> 1080 is great card, *but its price is only justified if it remains the top-dog*.


I don't see what that has to do with anything. Being the 'top dog' should have nothing to do with it.. especially when that 'top dog', Titan, will soon be 500$ more.

Its price should be representative of its performance compared to other cards that are on the market. And right now it's much faster than everything but a $1,200 card.

People are whining too much about its price, IMO. I wish it was lower, but the 8800GTX was 650$ when it was released. Times have not changed that much. History has shown us that whenever AMD doesn't have a competitor on the high-end that Nvidia will charge a premium. That's their right as a business. Most of us would be doing the same thing.

I don't like it, but I live with it. That's business. Be mad at AMD, as they're also culpable. They're sitting on a ton of patents that some other potential competitor out there might put to better use to negate this monopoly we currently have.


----------



## carlhil2

Murlocke is correct. going from a 1080 to a TPX isn't too impressive, but, from a 980Ti/ OG Titan X, should be about 60%, a much bigger jump than going 980Ti-1080.....


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> so here is the trend for gradual price increase vs gpu type / codename.
> 
> Now the price increase trend is much more clear.


GPU code name doesn't matter, performance delivered matters. Looking at the transistor count and the fact that cost scaling is nearly flat with 28nm->16nm, I understand why Nvidia only wants to offer a cut down GP102 for $1200. Got to have those >50% margins for the shareholders.



Fermi's special in this analysis because of obvious reasons







.

Maxwell was a nice jump in performance at the same cost level.

Pascal's performance increase fortunately outstrips the lineup's price hike.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> GPU code name doesn't matter, performance delivered matters. Looking at the transistor count and the fact that cost scaling is nearly flat with 28nm->16nm, I understand why Nvidia only wants to offer a cut down GP102 for $1200. Got to have those >50% margins for the shareholders.
> 
> 
> 
> Fermi's special in this analysis because of obvious reasons
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Maxwell was a nice jump in performance at the same cost level.
> 
> Pascal's performance increase fortunately outstrips the lineup's price hike.


If we are going for performance den we should compare to Geforce 2 back in 2000 and Nvidia should be charging us 500-600 times more expensive by your logic.

Performance is not to be factor in unless they are within the same period of timeframe. *It is expected* electronics performance per dollar must increase in each year but Nvidia hasnt been giving us that since the kepler days.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> If we are going for performance den we should compare to Geforce 2 back in 2000 and Nvidia should be charging us 500-600 times more expensive by your logic.


Correct, price/performance would have been way more expensive, and only the richest nations would have been able to purchase this much computing power. Nano-tech has come very very far in 16 years, but all exponential scaling has to come to an end.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Performance is not to be factor in unless they are within the same period of timeframe. *We all know for electronics performance per dollar must decrease in each year* but since Nvidia Kepler that hasnt been a good trend.


Unfortunately the gravy train came to an end several years ago and the only way to go is up in cost. People who expect increasingly larger dies at lower prices on launch will be sorely disappointed in the coming few years.

Edit:
Putting aside the end of silicon scaling within this decade for a second, I don't understand how people are so surprised by the price hike given that we know:

It's going to have a lot more transistors than GM200, because it'll be a big die.
16nm isn't that much cheaper per transistor than 28nm, because scaling has gone down the drain
Nvidia wants to make more money, because it's a publicly traded company
Only way prices are going to come down is if AMD sells something that can compete in performance at lower margins. Nvidia would then be forced to take lower margins or not sell much at all.


----------



## ChevChelios

it s ludicrous how ppl try and persuade others/themselves 1080 was a bad purchase when this is *$500-550 more* for only 25-30% more

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Who cares about any of that? What are we, 12?
> 
> If you buy a card just because it's a 'flagship' product and the 'latest and greatest', then you're buying it for a very stupid reason and the wrong reason to begin with. You'll soon find yourself in a vicious, neverending cycle of having to upgrade every time something new comes out.
> 
> Buy it because it fulfills your current needs for gaming or whatever else it is that you do. That's what it's made for.
> 
> The 1080 is a hell of a card and will remain a hell of a card long after Titan releases because it is a great performer. Period.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> I don't see what that has to do with anything. Being the 'top dog' should have nothing to do with it.. especially when that 'top dog', Titan, will soon be 500$ more.
> 
> Its price should be representative of its performance compared to other cards that are on the market. And right now it's much faster than everything but a $1,200 card.
> 
> People are whining too much about its price, IMO. I wish it was lower, but the 8800GTX was 650$ when it was released. Times have not changed that much. History has shown us that whenever AMD doesn't have a competitor on the high-end that Nvidia will charge a premium. That's their right as a business. Most of us would be doing the same thing.
> 
> I don't like it, but I live with it. That's business. Be mad at AMD, as they're also culpable. They're sitting on a ton of patents that some other potential competitor out there might put to better use to negate this monopoly we currently have.


^ this

top dog or not *only* matters to kids with e-peen problems

you payed for the performance and you still have that performance after Titan XP drops .. while having payed $500-550 less


----------



## Benny89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Why? Even the brand new 2016 OLEDs have ~30ms input lag which would be similiar to something like the LG UltraWide 3440x1440 IPS. While they are plenty for typical FPS gaming, I don't see a competitive FPS gamer ever wanting a monitor with 30ms input lag.
> In GTA V? It's one of the most aliased games out there.


As I said I never saw difference just playing after changing those back and forth. Maybe if I stare at textures instead of playing game I might have seen it.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Hard drives have seen a steady and significant drop in $/GB over the last 15+ years.
> 
> Same with SSDs as they've gotten bigger and faster.
> 
> Same with RAM as they've gotten bigger and faster.
> 
> How many PC components have seen a drastic increase in price the way GPU's have?


DDR3 ran a 7 year cycle before it was replaced by DDR4,which only about doubled the speed. How many new GPUs have we seen in this period ? We went from 8800 GTX to GTX 980. How much improvement is that ? Hard to measure even.


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> it s ludicrous how ppl try and persuade others/themselves 1080 was a bad purchase when this is *$500-550 more* *for only* 25-30% more










caught again.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> I wish it was lower, but the 8800GTX was 650$ when it was released.


The 8800GTX was a truly exceptional card though. You didn't see the Titan performing anywhere close to twice as fast as the GTX 680 (even though the 680 was a glorified mid-ranger). Look at the 8800GTX vs the 7900GTX. In graphically sophisticated games like F.E.A.R it was literally _twice as fast_.

The 8800GTX was worth every cent.

And another thing about the 8800GTX; 8800GTX owners had a year to revel in that glorious card before the 8800GT came along, Nvidia showed it's contempt for Titan owners by over-hyping the Titan and then releasing the 780 in just three months. They even put the Titan cooler on the 780, and denied Titan owners that bit of exclusivity. It was basically a giant middle finger to everyone who purchased that card, and that's precisely the reason why I can't fathom why anyone would be buying subsequent Titan cards.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> caught again.


what are you babbling about now ?


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> what are you babbling about now ?


Nothing, just showing something obvious. you can move on now.









P.S. - something tells me this card isn't gaming oriented this time. that's why launch was pretty low coverage compared to previous titans.


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> The 8800GTX was a truly exceptional card though. You didn't see the Titan performing anywhere close to twice as fast as the GTX 680 (even though the 680 was a glorified mid-ranger). Look at the 8800GTX vs the 7900GTX. In graphically sophisticated games like F.E.A.R it was literally _twice as fast_.
> 
> The 8800GTX was worth every cent.
> 
> And another thing about the 8800GTX; 8800GTX owners had a year to revel in that glorious card before the 8800GT came along, Nvidia showed it's contempt for Titan owners by over-hyping the Titan and then releasing the 780 in just three months. They even put the Titan cooler on the 780, and denied Titan owners that bit of exclusivity. It was basically a giant middle finger to everyone who purchased that card, and that's precisely the reason why I can't fathom why anyone would be buying subsequent Titan cards.


it seems Nvidia are worse than Apple with this at least with Apple you get 1 year out the latest phone hell most of times the phone design stays the same for 2 years so you could say you get almost 2 years

Nvidia are a unpredictable money beast that cannot be controlled at the moment & I don't know where we go from here as since the 1080 im scared of making any purchase from them

think ill only buy used now wait for them to drop alot, cannot expect ppl to drop 1200 then get a faster card 3 months down the line then another in a short amount of time... what a waste of money.. hell.. id rather buy a 6950x and I wont even use it to its full potential but I know its better value for money than this titan & wont get dethroned in a few months


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> That "30%" will definitely help push a 4k monitor.....
> 
> 
> 
> i understand but by how much really? 30% of garbage is still garbage.
Click to expand...

Right now I'm using a 1060 at 2.01Ghz for 4K Need for speed. I get 45fps average on medium with AA off, and I can't decrease the settings furthur without sacraficing a lot of image quality. An extra 30% will give me almost 60fps.

Not that I care I'm at 45fps. If I did I would be using the Gigabyte 1080 Windforce that I just recieved this Friday afternoon.

The fact that a single OCed 1060 matches CF 1.2Ghz R9 290s in NFS is surprising.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> it s ludicrous how ppl try and persuade others/themselves 1080 was a bad purchase when this is *$500-550 more* for only 25-30% more
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Who cares about any of that? What are we, 12?
> 
> If you buy a card just because it's a 'flagship' product and the 'latest and greatest', then you're buying it for a very stupid reason and the wrong reason to begin with. You'll soon find yourself in a vicious, neverending cycle of having to upgrade every time something new comes out.
> 
> Buy it because it fulfills your current needs for gaming or whatever else it is that you do. That's what it's made for.
> 
> The 1080 is a hell of a card and will remain a hell of a card long after Titan releases because it is a great performer. Period.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> I don't see what that has to do with anything. Being the 'top dog' should have nothing to do with it.. especially when that 'top dog', Titan, will soon be 500$ more.
> 
> Its price should be representative of its performance compared to other cards that are on the market. And right now it's much faster than everything but a $1,200 card.
> 
> People are whining too much about its price, IMO. I wish it was lower, but the 8800GTX was 650$ when it was released. Times have not changed that much. History has shown us that whenever AMD doesn't have a competitor on the high-end that Nvidia will charge a premium. That's their right as a business. Most of us would be doing the same thing.
> 
> I don't like it, but I live with it. That's business. Be mad at AMD, as they're also culpable. They're sitting on a ton of patents that some other potential competitor out there might put to better use to negate this monopoly we currently have.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> ^ this
> 
> top dog or not *only* matters to kids with e-peen problems
> 
> you payed for the performance and you still have that performance after Titan XP drops .. while having payed $500-550 less
Click to expand...

I'm salty because the 1080 costed 50% more and I thought it would be 33% faster than the 1070, but in reality it's only 25% faster.







nVidia is such a rip off right


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> I'm salty because the 1080 costed 50% more and I thought it would be 33% faster than the 1070, but in reality it's only 25% faster.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nVidia is such a rip off right


higher segment/priced cards *always* have worse p/p than cheaper ones

welcome to GPU world


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> I'm salty because the 1080 costed 50% more and I thought it would be 33% faster than the 1070, but in reality it's only 25% faster.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nVidia is such a rip off right


imo 1080 is worth the extra compared to the 1070.. the 1070 just feels so compromised compared to the 1080

also the 1070 when overclocking doesnt result in much the 1080 does, its like a win win for the 1080 even though its overpriced .. but meh.


----------



## stefxyz

Last time I checked this was the Titan thread... And here the last thing potential Titan buyer care is price/performance...

Absolute performance is all that matters for the enthusiast.

As long as the Titan has the best single gaming GPU no matter what the price is it cannot be overpriced as it still delivers the best performance...

If its worth for you is on a different letter but it can only be overpriced if at least a competitor has a same performance card...


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If the next card is more than $1200, i'll be right there with you. I don't see myself spending more than that on a GPU.


Nah, I don't believe it. If the next Titan delivers the performance of Titan XP SLI and goes for $2k, I can see you and others justify its price being okay.


----------



## Seyumi

I know people in this thread always mention the Titan Z and how consumers showed there really is a price cap but that card doesn’t count. There was nothing new or fast about that card it was nothing more than 2 Titan blacks on a 3-slot card. You were literally paying a $1000 price premium to save 1-slot in your case and you still had additional handicaps like heat and overclocking potential.


----------



## Fiercy

Any news on any water blocks for the card? I think because of the larger chip and more power phases the 1080 won't be compatible.

Sucks that I have to wait for one, can't even put it in without.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Nah, I don't believe it. If the next Titan delivers the performance of Titan XP SLI and goes for $2k, I can see you and others justify its price being okay.


Haha, well if the next titan is a 100%+ improvement over the current top card at that time, then yes I could justify squeezing a *little* more than $1200 for it. However, $1200 is about my limit for a 60% increase from my current GPU.

I wouldn't spend $2k on a card unless it was almost triple my current cards performance, and it'd have to be a single GPU card (no dual Titan Z nonsense).

Honestly, the only reason I am willing to spend $1200 right now is because there's nothing else out there that can run 4K 60hz on a single GPU. As soon as I achieve that in most titles, I will be a heck of a lot less likely to drop another $1200 on a GPU in the future.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Murlocke is correct. going from a 1080 to a TPX isn't too impressive, but, from a 980Ti/ OG Titan X, should be about 60%, a much bigger jump than going 980Ti-1080.....


Going from a 1080 to a Titan-XP will be much more impressive than my upgrade from 980Ti to 1080 that was only a ~12% increase. With a nicely clocked Titan-XP with a Hybrid cooler I'm expecting about a 35% performance increase over a 1080.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

The problem is there is no reason to upgrade, all we have anyway is crappy console ports


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Going from a 1080 to a Titan-XP will be much more impressive than my upgrade from 980Ti to 1080 that was only a ~12% increase.


If memory serves, many people went from 680 to Titan 1 for $1000 for a 15-20% average increase.

Also, you only saw a 12% upgrade? The reviews claim about 25-30% averaged across a few dozen titles I thought. I assume it's because you had the 980Tis on water and extremely overclocked, while the 1080 is on stock cooling?


----------



## stefxyz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Going from a 1080 to a Titan-XP will be much more impressive than my upgrade from 980Ti to 1080 that was only a ~12% increase. With a nicely clocked Titan-XP with a Hybrid cooler I'm expecting about a 35% performance increase over a 1080.


Just not true its 25% OC to OC


----------



## ChevChelios

Its only 40% more shaders vs 1080 I dont see how that works out to 35% perf _even at_ even clocks (2100) .. and getting 2000-2100 on XP will absolutely require water

30% would be good IMO


----------



## st0necold

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> If you are getting 40-50 fps with GTX 1080 then a Titan X will get 55-65 fps. Much better place to be in. Add overclocking and you are golden.


You've got to be kidding me.

You couldn't call which card is which without fraps in the corner. It is difficult to tell between 100-144fps... 55 to 63 is nothing but a boost in Fraps. If you don't play bf4 all of the time and have an sli setup it's quite possible you'll update drivers and forget to enable SLI and not "realize" this immidetly. Cmon man. OC + what 11fps tops?


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Its only 40% more shaders vs 1080 I dont see how that works out to 35% perf _even at_ even clocks (2100) .. and getting 2000-2100 on XP will absolutely require water
> 
> 30% would be good IMO


A Highly OCed TXP will definitely be >35% faster than a *stock 1080* due to higher clock plus 40% more shader combined. That is what he means


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> A Highly OCed TXP will definitely be >35% faster than a *stock 1080* due to higher clock plus 40% more shader combined. That is what he means


no point comparing OC vs stock though

IMO:
stock vs stock = 30%, maybe even a bit less
OC vs OC, if Titan XP can reach 2000-2050 stable prolonged = same


----------



## stefxyz

The math was already written down on page 10 or somewhere its pretty much a 1080 at 2140 MHZ will have same Tflops as a Titan XP at stock speed. If you get the Titan to 2000 MHZ you have a 35% boost over the 2120 MHZ 1080...

I expect the Titan at ref clocks with the ****ty ref cooler at 8100 GPU Timespy score.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *st0necold*
> 
> You've got to be kidding me.
> 
> You couldn't call which card is which without fraps in the corner. It is difficult to tell between 100-144fps... 55 to 63 is nothing but a boost in Fraps. If you don't play bf4 all of the time and have an sli setup it's quite possible you'll update drivers and forget to enable SLI and not "realize" this immidetly. Cmon man. OC + what 11fps tops?


You trolling right? He's clearly said a "40-50" to "55-65" jump.

If you can't tell the difference between 40fps and 55fps, or 50fps and 65fps, than you'd be in the extreme minority. Every FPS below 60 is pretty noticeable.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> The math was already written down on page 10 or somewhere its pretty much a 1080 at 2140 MHZ will have same Tflops as a Titan XP at stock speed. If you get the Titan to 2000 MHZ you have a 35% boost over the 2120 MHZ 1080...
> 
> I expect the Titan at ref clocks with the ****ty ref cooler at 8100 GPU Timespy score.


I am getting 5300 on my ref maxwell titan X with a +150 OC, and 60% of that would be 8,480.

So that seems about right.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If memory serves, many people went from 680 to Titan 1 for $1000 for a 15-20% average increase.
> 
> Also, you only saw a 12% upgrade? The reviews claim about 25-30% averaged across a few dozen titles I thought. I assume it's because you had the 980Tis on water and extremely overclocked, while the 1080 is on stock cooling?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Just not true its 25% OC to OC


1080's overclock like crap and max out ~2100 MHz no matter the cooling short of LN2. My 2100 MHz 1080 at max overclock is only ~12% faster on average than my 1520 MHz 980Ti.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> 1080's overclock like crap and max out ~2100 MHz no matter the cooling short of LN2. My 2100 MHz 1080 at max overclock is only ~12% faster on average than my 1520 MHz 980Ti.


Or they constantly throttle back when being pushed in a game. Something 980Ti's never do. I'd say around 12% average performance gain OC to OC when they do hold there clocks is very fair and accurate. Simply not that impressive. I expect the TitanXP to be much better suited for stable higher clocks especially under water giving it a 40%+ advantage over the 1080 at peak clocks. Which is the exact number that originally leaked out on the early announcements of the new Titan.


----------



## Shatun-Bear

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> The 1080 will end up going down as one of the most useless flagship purchases in the history of video cards it would seem. $700 and just two months on the market of being on top before being completely shunted down the product stack! Obviously Nvidia really cares about its high end customers! And yet these same clowns will still hit the threads in droves defending every single thing this company does to them (just like Apple fanboys)! Ironically, the fact that it was a total paper launch and nearly vaporware for so long is going to end up working to a lot of people's advantage...


It's true, these people only have themselves to blame.

The same thing happened with the Maxwell Titan X. Droves of enthusiasts got all giddy with the Nvidia marketing Koolaid and snapped them up. Few months later the card was obsoleted by the 980 Ti. Same performance for hundreds of dollars less and those TX owners were in serious denial.

So, fast forward a year and Nvidia hyped up the 1080 with the help of reviewers (nearly all to a man didn't take any serious issue with the massively inflated price. And I'm looking in particular at those reviewers in the UK where the cost of the card is still absurd) and made a huge chunk of profit selling these cards with huge price premiums. A mid-sized chip being priced like anything but. Now, those owners that stumped up the huge sums to buy the 1080s somehow believed their shiny new expensive card would be top of the pile for several months, no doubt some even thinking it wouldn't be superceded until next year. And surprise surprise, Nvidya delivers a smackdown to those hopes, with a more powerful Titan XP arriving sooner than normal, a mere few months after many had just dropped $700 on a Maxwell card on steroids. Que the familiar denial that it won't actually be that fast.

Now here's a tip for you early adopters - don't expect the cut-down Titan XP to be top of the pile for long either. For certain Nvidia will be dropping a 1080 Ti by the end of the year. A full chip Pascal card with more performance and costing an arm and a leg but not an arm and a leg and a kidney like this Pascal Titan. So maybe better to wait for that if you want to spend silly money on graphics cards.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Or they constantly throttle back when being pushed in a game. Something 980Ti's never do. I'd say around 12% average performance gain OC to OC when they do hold there clocks is very fair and accurate. Simply not that impressive. I expect the TitanXP to be much better suited for stable higher clocks especially under water giving it a 40%+ advantage over the 1080 at peak clocks. Which is the exact number that originally leaked out on the early announcements of the new Titan.


The 980Ti have a 8+6 pin, the 1080 do not. One of the many reasons I decided to skip the 1080, knowing it'd OC like crap. It also was a very clear sign that it wasn't close to the best pascal could do, which is why I am surprised so many 1080 owners are surprised at this Titan.

I'd imagine the Titan will get much better OCs than a 1080, furthering the gap between them.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> It's true, these people only have themselves to blame.
> 
> The same thing happened with the Maxwell Titan X. Droves of enthusiasts got all giddy with the Nvidia marketing Koolaid and snapped them up. Few months later the card was obsoleted by the 980 Ti. Same performance for hundreds of dollars less and those TX owners were in serious denial.


I bought the Titan X day 1 and didn't care less about the 980Ti releasing a few months later. I paid ~$200 more for a few months of performance that couldn't be gotten elsewhere. Same thing here, if a 1080Ti comes out in 3 months with roughly the same performance, I won't care.

The only way I'd care is if they release a 1080Ti in a few months that is faster, which would defeat the entire purpose of the Titan lineup. I'd probably never buy a Titan again if they did that, I'd wait for the Ti versions.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> Now here's a tip for you early adopters - don't expect the cut-down Titan XP to be top of the pile for long either. For certain Nvidia will be dropping a 1080 Ti by the end of the year. A full chip Pascal card with more performance and costing an arm and a leg but not an arm and a leg and a kidney like this Pascal Titan. So maybe better to wait for that if you want to spend silly money on graphics cards.


Nope given that this time AMD lackluster performance, there wont be 1080 Ti. The first generation of geforce for GP102 will be even more cut down than this TXP. So no worry about that. And the next to succeed will be another Titan with 3840 cores and definitely not below $1200.

So wait another 9-12 month for another Titan that comes with even more eye-gouging price tag? Nahh... I am sick of waiting to be disappointed again.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Now here's a tip for you early adopters - don't expect the cut-down Titan XP to be top of the pile for long either. For certain Nvidia will be dropping a 1080 Ti by the end of the year. A full chip Pascal card with more performance and costing an arm and a leg but not an arm and a leg and a kidney like this Pascal Titan. So maybe better to wait for that if you want to spend silly money on graphics cards.


waiting is AMD fans prerogative









Nvidia buyers have a choice now between 1080 or Titan XP depending on how much money they have

and in 2017 will have 1 or 2 more high-end options


----------



## Bloodbath

Whilst I completely agree that the price is absolutely too high and I'm pretty disappointed that they held back on HBM2. I want a single card solution that will be able to drive my 3440x1440 X34 at high framerates for the next three years. And my card will absolutely be under water just like my current OG Titans.

In Australia we get gouged on everything we currently pay $1200-$1300 for a 1080 so I can't afford the extra $400-$500 for an SLI setup so single Titan XP it is.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The 980Ti have a 8+6 pin, the 1080 do not. One of the many reasons I decided to skip the 1080, knowing it'd OC like crap. It also was a very clear sign that it wasn't close to the best pascal could do, which is why I am surprised so many 1080 owners are surprised at this Titan.
> 
> I'd imagine the Titan will get much better OCs than a 1080, furthering the gap between them.
> I bought the Titan X day 1 and didn't care less about the 980Ti releasing a few months later. I paid ~$200 more for a few months of performance that couldn't be gotten elsewhere. Same thing here, if a 1080Ti comes out in 3 months with roughly the same performance, I won't care.
> 
> The only way I'd care is if they release a 1080Ti in a few months that is faster, which would defeat the entire purpose of the Titan lineup. I'd probably never buy a Titan again if they did that, I'd wait for the Ti versions.


I think you misunderstand that the OC on 1080 is not due to the power pin configuration. There are many custom AIB card with even 8+8 pins yet it cannot break through the 2.1GHz barrier that a single 8 pins reference model are capable of.

OC above 2.1GHz seem to be impossible due to voltage locked or something inherently comes with the new FF, which I believe Titan X will encounter too.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The only way I'd care is if they release a 1080Ti in a few months that is faster, which would defeat the entire purpose of the Titan lineup. I'd probably never buy a Titan again if they did that, I'd wait for the Ti versions.


What exactly is the purpose of the Titan lineup?


----------



## ChevChelios

there is no reason really to think Titan XP will be a better OCer than 1080

at best the same and it will require more effort/cooling to get 3500+ cores to 2100Mhz than getting 2500+ cores to that same frequency

and yes 8 or 8+8 pins have nothing to do with that


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> What exactly is the purpose of the Titan lineup?


- A card for the select few that need the VRAM (non-gaming purposes)
- A card to get early performance of a fully (or almost fully unlocked) chip without having to wait for the "mainstream" Ti versions.

The titan lineup has always been about getting full performance out of an architecture earlier, at a premium price. Anyone that's not OK with that premium is expect to wait for the Ti versions which will be more aimed towards gamers with a cut down price but roughly the same performance. When yields increase on full pascal chips, then that's when we'll see cheaper full pascal cards such as the 1080Ti, until then, you pay a premium.


----------



## CallsignVega

A lot of people forget that a properly setup old Titan-X was still faster than 980Ti's.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> - A card for the select few that need the VRAM (non-gaming purposes)
> - A card to get early performance of a fully (or almost fully unlocked) chip without having to wait for the "mainstream" Ti versions.
> 
> The titan lineup has always been about getting full performance out of an architecture earlier, at a premium price. Anyone that's not OK with that premium is expect to wait for the Ti versions which will be more aimed towards gamers with a cut down price but roughly the same performance. When yields increase on full pascal chips, then that's when we'll see cheaper full pascal cards such as the 1080Ti, until then, you pay a premium.


I'm sorry but this new Titan X don't have the VRAM nor it has a full Chip, so what was it again?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> I'm sorry but this new Titan X don't have the VRAM nor it has a full Chip, so what was it again?


Huh?

1080 = 8GB
This card = 12GB

And I said fully or almost fully unlocked.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> so what was it again?


performance greater than 1080 available mid-2016


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Nope given that this time AMD lackluster performance, there wont be 1080 Ti. The first generation of geforce for GP102 will be even more cut down than this TXP. So no worry about that. And the next to succeed will be another Titan with 3840 cores and definitely not below $1200.
> 
> So wait another 9-12 month for another Titan that comes with even more eye-gouging price tag? Nahh... I am sick of waiting to be disappointed again.


Sigh how many times do you have to be wrong? You say "Nope" like you actually know something. Just like you told me we wouldn't see a new Titan in 2016. After the 1080Ti drops you'll be spouting some bs about something else not happening.


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> What exactly is the purpose of the Titan lineup?


Making people turn sour on the internet from what I've seen.


----------



## Klocek001

it's a fully unlocked version of a cut down chip
1080ti will be a cut down version of a cut down chip


----------



## Burke888

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet. Something I have noticed is that Nvidia has been extremely low key in media for this card. Typical mainstream Nvidia releases are fairly lavish events, with the journalists well pampered and fed.

For this release I haven't noticed nearly anything like that. There's a few scattered forum threads throughout the internet, some YouTube vidoes, but beyond that Nvidia hasn't taken any measures to market or promote this card.

In my opinion they may be doing this so they do not anger the customer's that purchase this, when a newer product needs to be released sooner than expected.
Nvidia may need to release a better product, at a lower price point in reponse to AMD. And when they do, they don't want their enthusiasts upset. By keeping the release low key, they can ensure that anyone who buys this is doing it completely on their own. They aren't being marketed to. You're buying this because you want it and it's not our fault when we release a new product in 3 months in response to AMD.
They have even thrown out the "It's not a gaming card" line as well.

Just my opinion. I expect this card to sell well, but I'm sure Nvidia doesn't have a whole lot of stock to go around.
I'm looking forward to the benches and the unboxing videos







.


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If memory serves, many people went from 680 to Titan 1 for $1000 for a 15-20% average increase.
> 
> Also, you only saw a 12% upgrade? The reviews claim about 25-30% averaged across a few dozen titles I thought. I assume it's because you had the 980Tis on water and extremely overclocked, while the 1080 is on stock cooling?


if I recall closely a nicely overclocked OG titan was close to 680 sli

the first titan was and will always be the best titan because of how long it stayed relevant and even still today its still a great card, now days Nvidia release gaming cards with extra memory and call them titan even though theyre not even like the OG titans which was a steal because of compute power it had, even still it held its value very well just because of this.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> it's a fully unlocked version of a cut down chip
> 1080ti will be a cut down version of a cut down chip


No it isn't, the full GP102 has 3840 CUDA cores, as found on the Quadro P6000 (which also has 24GB of RAM).

This Titan XP really is exactly what the 1080 Ti would have been if Nvidia had followed the same pattern as Maxwell. I still want one but it isn't the full chip or double the memory. 12GB is the smallest amount of RAM Nvidia could have put on the card, no one has made 512MB GDDR5X chips and for 384-bit you need at least 12 of them.

They could still release a 1080Ti that is even more cut down, or one that is cut the same, or one that isn't cut at all and has 24GB of RAM. Guessing what Nvidia will do based on the past architectures is not reliable.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> Any news on any water blocks for the card? I think because of the larger chip and more power phases the 1080 won't be compatible.
> 
> Sucks that I have to wait for one, can't even put it in without.


Get a EK Universal block. use one on my 980Ti Classified, does a great job...you may need different screws to keep the backplate though..


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> Any news on any water blocks for the card? I think because of the larger chip and more power phases the 1080 won't be compatible.
> 
> Sucks that I have to wait for one, can't even put it in without.
> 
> 
> 
> Get a EK Universal block. use one on my 980Ti Classified, does a great job...you may need different screws to keep the backplate though..
Click to expand...

I have heard EK will have a block out for the new Titan X around the end of August.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Huh?
> 
> 1080 = 8GB
> This card = 12GB
> 
> And I said fully or almost fully unlocked.


All Titans have had double the VRAM than the x80Tis counterparts, that's what made your point valid.

Titan OG had double the VRAM than the x80Ti flagship, same for Titan Black, same for Maxwell Titan X, Titan Pascal have have the same amount of VRAM as the old Titan X, 12GB, and Pascal x80Ti will probably have 12GB, where's the 24GB Titan Pascal? Unless the x80Ti releases with 6GB of VRAM it makes no sense.

Also a cut down chip is a cut down chip, Pascal Titan X is nowhere near a full fat chip.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> Making people turn sour on the internet from what I've seen.


Touché....


----------



## Testier

Honestly, I dont feel like there would be a large performance gap between the 3584 CUDA core version vs a potential 3840 core version.....

As for the GDDR5x, is 1080 memory bottlenecked? It doesnt seems like in overclocking benchmarks I believe. Well, GP102 is essentially 1.5x GP104. Lets look on the memory bandwidth of GTX 1080, which is at 320GB/s. GP102, which is 1.5 x GP104, have exactly 50% more memory bandwidth. Adding HBM2 would probably increase the cost too much and wont give enough performance to justify it.

I am probably buying one to run my ultrawide monitor. Would be nice one day to get higher resolution ultrawides...


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> What exactly is the purpose of the Titan lineup?


To milk the high end market between the 080 line and TI line release. To let the haves, have the performance without having to wait like the have nots. Sad reality.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> All Titans have had double the VRAM than the x80Tis counterparts, that's what made your point valid.
> 
> Titan OG had double the VRAM than the x80Ti flagship, same for Titan Black, same for Maxwell Titan X, Titan Pascal have have the same amount of VRAM as the old Titan X, 12GB, and Pascal x80Ti will probably have 12GB, where's the 24GB Titan Pascal? Unless the x80Ti releases with 6GB of VRAM it makes no sense.
> 
> Also a cut down chip is a cut down chip, Pascal Titan X is nowhere near a full fat chip.


The full chip would be 8-9% faster at most, most likely closer to 5% in real world... "Nowhere near a full chip"?

Some people claiming 1080 > Titan X's ~30% upgrade is small, but some of those same people complaining about it not being a full chip? 30% is small but 35% isn't? Good luck telling the difference during a game. I think some people just complain to complain.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Honestly, I dont feel like there would be a large performance gap between the 3584 CUDA core version vs a potential 3840 core version.....
> 
> As for the GDDR5x, is 1080 memory bottlenecked? It doesnt seems like in overclocking benchmarks I believe. Well, GP102 is essentially 1.5x GP104. Lets look on the memory bandwidth of GTX 1080, which is at 320GB/s. GP102, which is 1.5 x GP104, have exactly 50% more memory bandwidth. Adding HBM2 would probably increase the cost too much and wont give enough performance to justify it.
> 
> I am probably buying one to run my ultrawide monitor. Would be nice one day to get higher resolution ultrawides...


There would not, only a ~7% theoretical difference and in real world, would probably be closer to 3-4%. Nonetheless we still may get a full-uncut Titan refresh at some point, but by then Volta may not be far off.

It makes more sense to me to buy now when Volta is further away. Or ditch the idea of getting Titans and just wait for the Ti. Titan Black was a worse value relative to the original considering how quickly it got superseded by a better chip (980).


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> - A card for the select few that need the VRAM (non-gaming purposes)


It was once branded as a cheaper alternative to Quadro for professionals for CUDA development. But from what I am understanding, the Titan XP will now have cut down compute in line with the rest of the Geforce lineup which, in turn, is also cut down compared to previous generation GeForce cards. Also a 384 bit Ti will also have 12 GB of memory so that becomes a moot point. So what exactly is the differentiating factor?




Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> - A card to get early performance of a fully (or almost fully unlocked) chip without having to wait for the "mainstream" Ti versions.


How do you account for the GTX 780 Ti hitting the market 3 months before the Titan Black?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> It was once branded as a cheaper alternative to Quadro for professionals for CUDA development. But from what I am understanding, the Titan XP will now have cut down compute in line with the rest of the Geforce lineup. Also a 384 bit Ti will also have 12 GB of memory so that becomes a moot point. So what exactly is the differentiating factor?
> 
> 
> 
> How do you account for the GTX 780 Ti hitting the market 3 months before the Titan Black?


It's as simple as this: *It's the best card right now. Nothing else beats it currently. Period.*

We can argue on and on about what's the purpose of a Titan, etc and none of it even matters. If you want it, buy it. If you don't, don't. If you can't afford it, well that's no one else's problem. Simple.

I find it funny that people who claim to have no interest in this card are actively posting in here. You guys either enjoy the drama, enjoy trying to tell people how to spend their money, or are actively lying to yourselves about wanting the card. Take your pick, there's no other reason for someone not interested in the card to be posting here half a dozen times a day.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The full chip would be 8-9% faster at most... "Nowhere near a full chip"?.


Semantics, the fact is people are paying 1200+$ for a Cut Down Chip, besides you think 30% advantage is not small but a third of that is? Because the 10% performance loss thanks to cut down cores would have made of this Titan X less of a joke and more worthy of its price.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> People claiming 1080 > Titan X's ~30% upgrade is small, but some of those same people complaining about 8-9%? It sucks but 8-9% is not a big deal at all.


People are complaining about price, and the fact that following previous generations this Titan X is exactly what the 1080Ti should have been.

Also after watching Jay2cents review this Titan X seems to be 22-25% faster than a GTX 1080, and even if it really ends up being 30% faster than a GTX 1080 then that 10% performance loss because of its stripped down cores in its cutdown chip would make up for a 33.33%, a third of the entire performance advantage of 30% faster than the GTX 1080, I'd say that's reason enough to complain, the fact that this is the saddest Titan ever released.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Because the 10% performance loss thanks to cut down cores


its *not* 10% ...

Quote:


> I'd say that's reason enough to complain


complaining for the sake of complaining


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Semantics, the fact is people are paying 1200+$ for a Cut Down Chip, besides you think 30% advantage is not small but a third of that is? Because the 10% performance loss thanks to cut down cores would have made of this Titan X less of a joke and more worthy of its price.
> People are complaining about price, and the fact that following previous generations this Titan X is exactly what the 1080Ti should have been.
> 
> Also after watching Jay2cents review this Titan X seems to be 22-25% faster than a GTX 1080, and even if it really ends up being 30% faster than a GTX 1080 then that 10% performance loss because of its stripped down cores in its cutdown chip would make up for a 33.33%, a third of the entire performance advantage of 30% faster than the GTX 1080, I'd say that's reason enough to complain, the fact that this is the saddest Titan ever released.


See above. Why are you still posting here if you aren't interested in the card?

Stop clicking the thread just to keep throwing in your 2cent on why this card isn't worth it. Newsflash: No one is forcing you to buy this and it is not your job to tell people what they should or shouldn't spend their money on.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> It is definitely fun to see how quickly your argument changes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You brought it up... Now you are being dismissive because you can't formulate a rebuttal?
> Couldn't the same be argued to anyone in defense of the Titan XP? Let us just eradicate all opinion based discussions
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The rational behind most decisions is emotional in nature. People then try to use logic to justify their stance on an emotional decision. One will often get irritated and defensive when the fallacy is exposed.


I did not bring up the purpose of a Titan. Someone asked. I answered what I feel is the purpose of the Titan lineup.

Perhaps read the thread?


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> See above. Why are you still posting here if you aren't interested in the card?
> 
> Stop clicking the thread just to keep throwing in your 2cent on why this card isn't worth it. Newsflash: No one is forcing you to buy this and it is not your job to tell people what they should or shouldn't spend their money on.


Do you see me telling people "Bro you ain't buying this, you aren't because I say so"?

Anyone can buy whatever they want, I'm all for them burning their money instead of wood for their living room, it's their money and only they can decide what to spend it on, that doesn't change my opinion about the card one bit, nor it changes the fact that it's a cutdown chip and a 1080Ti in disguise.

So what was your point again? If people can't handle opinions and/or facts I don't see how that concerns me.


----------



## EightDee8D

Everyone needs his personal safe space nowadays it seems. on teh internet that is.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Do you see me telling people "Bro you ain't buying this, you aren't because I say so"?
> 
> Anyone can buy whatever they want, I'm all for them burning their money instead of wood for their living room, it's their money and only they can decide what to spend it on, that doesn't change my opinion about the card one bit, nor it changes the fact that it's a cutdown chip and a 1080Ti in disguise.
> 
> So what was your point again? If people can't handle opinions and/or facts I don't see how that concerns me.


There is a difference between stating an opinion, and coming into a thread a dozen times a day to claim that the card is a waste of money. We get it, you don't need to keep coming in here to state why you aren't buying the card.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*
> 
> What exactly is the purpose of the Titan lineup?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - A card for the select few that need the VRAM (non-gaming purposes)
> - A card to get early performance of a fully (or almost fully unlocked) chip without having to wait for the "mainstream" Ti versions.
> 
> The titan lineup has always been about getting full performance out of an architecture earlier, at a premium price. Anyone that's not OK with that premium is expect to wait for the Ti versions which will be more aimed towards gamers with a cut down price but roughly the same performance. When yields increase on full pascal chips, then that's when we'll see cheaper full pascal cards such as the 1080Ti, until then, you pay a premium.
Click to expand...

the first titan (a cut down GK 100) was delayed for months because a few reasons; horrible yields then nvidia filled OEM commitments after the oakridge super computer. then the 780TI with a full GK100 chip released several months afterwards.

the titan X (full GM 200 chip) released much earlier with a cut down GM200 chip (980ti) within months.

since the ONLY TWO times a titan has been released the direct opposite happened; so to say:
Quote:


> The titan lineup *has always been* about getting full performance out of an architecture earlier


is a sweeping generalization w/o any supporting facts.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> the first titan (a cut down GK 100) was delayed for months because a few reasons; horrible yields then nvidia filled OEM commitments after the oakridge super computer. then the 780TI with a full GK100 chip released several months afterwards.
> 
> the titan X (full GM 200 chip) released much earlier with a cut down GM200 chip (980ti) within months.
> 
> since the ONLY TWO times a titan has been released the direct opposite happened; so to say:
> is a sweeping generalization w/o any supporting facts.


That is the closest thing you can say to describe the Titan lineup and it's purpose. If you wish to explain the purpose of a Titan lineup better, be my guest. It's impossible to say what it's target audience is, each generation has been a bit different and no matter how you describe it there is always some oddball situation that doesn't apply.


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I did not bring up the purpose of a Titan. Someone asked. I answered what I feel is the purpose of the Titan lineup.
> 
> Perhaps read the thread?


Please do enlighten me...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Shatun-Bear*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> No one can seriously be in this big of denial that the 1080 is no longer the best card.
> 
> 
> 
> The 1080 will end up going down as one of the most useless flagship purchases in the history of video cards it would seem. $700 and just two months on the market of being on top before being completely shunted down the product stack! Obviously Nvidia really cares about its high end customers! And yet these same clowns will still hit the threads in droves defending every single thing this company does to them (just like Apple fanboys)! Ironically, the fact that it was a total paper launch and nearly vaporware for so long is going to end up working to a lot of people's advantage...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's true, these people only have themselves to blame.
> 
> The same thing happened with the Maxwell Titan X. Droves of enthusiasts got all giddy with the Nvidia marketing Koolaid and snapped them up. Few months later the card was obsoleted by the 980 Ti. Same performance for hundreds of dollars less and those TX owners were in serious denial.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I bought the Titan X day 1 and didn't care less about the 980Ti releasing a few months later. I paid ~$200 more for a few months of performance that couldn't be gotten elsewhere. Same thing here, if a 1080Ti comes out in 3 months with roughly the same performance, I won't care.
> 
> The only way I'd care is if they release a 1080Ti in a few months that is faster, which would defeat the entire purpose of the Titan lineup. I'd probably never buy a Titan again if they did that, I'd wait for the Ti versions.
Click to expand...


----------



## CaliLife17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I have heard EK will have a block out for the new Titan X around the end of August.


Do you have a link for this? Debating if I should buy 2 day one or wait till blocks are available. They way my custom loop is, I cant just put them in running on AIr, so I need blocks on them to run them. Don't know if I want to sit on them for a month until I can do anything with them.


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> The 8800GTX was a truly exceptional card though. You didn't see the Titan performing anywhere close to twice as fast as the GTX 680 (even though the 680 was a glorified mid-ranger). Look at the 8800GTX vs the 7900GTX. In graphically sophisticated games like F.E.A.R it was literally _twice as fast_.
> 
> The 8800GTX was worth every cent.
> 
> And another thing about the 8800GTX; 8800GTX owners had a year to revel in that glorious card before the 8800GT came along, Nvidia showed it's contempt for Titan owners by over-hyping the Titan and then releasing the 780 in just three months. They even put the Titan cooler on the 780, and denied Titan owners that bit of exclusivity. It was basically a giant middle finger to everyone who purchased that card, and that's precisely the reason why I can't fathom why anyone would be buying subsequent Titan cards.


The G80 chip (8800GTX) was probably one of my best pc parts I ever purchased. It lasted me until Bad Company 2. I was planning to replace it with the GTX480 which was released around the time Bad Company 2 came along but that card was far from nvidia's best moment. Ended up waited until the GTX580 and got that instead. Before the 8800GTX I had the 5950Ultra... Waaay too much money for the performance haha


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slomo4shO*


So? I explained what I felt was the purpose of the TItan lineup because he asked. Your the one arguing that my opinion is wrong, when you can't describe the lineup any better than that. There's no pattern with the Titan lineups. Generally speaking for gamers, it's to get the fastest card on the market without having to wait for the Ti version.

Again, this forum has gone extremely down hill over the years. It's sad being here since 2004 and seeing it fall so far. The fact you guys are allowed to sit in here and troll the thread for so many pages, with no interest or intentions to buy the actual product in question, is absurd.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> There is a difference between stating an opinion, and coming into a thread a dozen times a day to claim that the card is a waste of money. We get it, you don't need to keep coming in here to state why you aren't buying the card.


They are just pissed off that they can never afford it.
All their constant whining will never change the fact that the card will sell like crazy despite the price, when it can do a task half the time it took Maxwell Titan X.
Neither can these people understand that most people that are interested in Titan X doesnt give a damn about these peoples constant complaining and/or opinions.

But of course, everyone is entitled to their own thoughts about the card. I think its overpriced too, $999 which was previous Titan price was already pushing it. But I know its useless coming here everyday and fill up the thread with constant complaining like these people do. It becomes noise


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> ... Also after watching Jay2cents review this Titan X ...


Jay hasn't posted a review of the Titan XP. No-one has. No-one can until the NDA lifts on Tuesday.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> It's as simple as this: *It's the best card right now. Nothing else beats it currently. Period.* ... If you want it, buy it. If you don't, don't. If you can't afford it, well that's no one else's problem. Simple.


This. In fact (+rep).


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> the first titan (a cut down GK 100) was delayed for months because a few reasons; horrible yields then nvidia filled OEM commitments after the oakridge super computer. then the 780TI with a full GK100 chip released several months afterwards.
> 
> the titan X (full GM 200 chip) released much earlier with a cut down GM200 chip (980ti) within months.
> 
> since the ONLY TWO times a titan has been released the direct opposite happened; so to say:
> is a sweeping generalization w/o any supporting facts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is the closest thing you can say to describe the Titan lineup and it's purpose. If you wish to explain the purpose of a Titan lineup better, be my guest. It's impossible to say what it's target audience is, each generation has been a bit different and no matter how you describe it there is always some oddball situation that doesn't apply.
Click to expand...

i'm not trying to describe the titan's purpose. the point is when you have two samples to draw from and the exact opposite happen between each sample*; *one cannot draw conclusions.*

* one the only commonality is both had a premium price; any inference would start and end there.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> There is a difference between stating an opinion, and coming into a thread a dozen times a day to claim that the card is a waste of money. We get it, you don't need to keep coming in here to state why you aren't buying the card.


I'm not saying is a waste of money, I'm saying that it is a waste of money for me, there's a difference.

Besides I came here to refute what you said about the Titan X being a full chip and having considerably more VRAM, you're the one who turned this into that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> There is a difference between stating an opinion, and coming into a thread a dozen times a day


The difference is that one just have an opinion and the other have a strong opinion









And btw, I don't think I have a dozen posts in this thread ever since it was made.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> I'm not saying is a waste of money, I'm saying that it is a waste of money for me, there's a difference.
> 
> Besides I came here to refute what you said about the Titan X being a full chip and having considerably more VRAM, you're the one who turned this into that.
> The difference is that one just have an opinion and the other have a strong opinion


Again, we know you feel the card isn't worth it to you.

Again, I never said it was a full chip. I stated: A card to get early performance of a fully *(or almost fully unlocked)*

If you thought I was claiming it was a full chip, you misunderstood me. 4GB more of VRAM is considerably more in my opinion, that's 50% over the 1080.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> And btw, I don't think I have a dozen posts in this thread ever since it was made.


28 posts in the thread.
http://www.overclock.net/newsearch/?search=&resultSortingPreference=recency&byuser=Dargonplay&output=posts&sdate=0&newer=1&type=all&containingthread%5B0%5D=1606550&advanced=1


----------



## EightDee8D

Why do other people care if someone says it doesn't worth it for him. does it makes *epeen* factor less or something ?


----------



## Eorzean

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> Why do other people care if someone says it doesn't worth it for him. does it makes *epeen* factor less or something ?


Lol probably.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> Why do other people care if someone says it doesn't worth it for him. does it makes *epeen* factor less or something ?


Titan owners need all the positive reinforcement they can get this time, considering this is the first Cut Down Titan with the least VRAM in relation to their x80Ti counterpart but with an increasingly higher price tag.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EightDee8D*
> 
> Why do other people care if someone says it doesn't worth it for him. does it makes *epeen* factor less or something ?


I don't think anyone cares if it's stated once or twice, but the same people coming into the thread to state it over and over just gets annoying after awhile.

I come here to see if any new information has been released, but instead I am always greeted with multiple pages of back and forth "this card isn't worth it", "yes it is!", "no!". It's a pointless argument because worth is opinion, and honestly someone who truely is not interested in this card, would state their opinion once (at most) and move on.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Titan owners need all the positive reinforcement they can get this time, considering this is the first Cut Down Titan with the least VRAM in relation to their x80Ti counterpart but with an increasingly higher price tag.


I bet majority of people buying titans don't think $1200 is all that much money, so no we don't need positive reinforcement. I'll buy the card regardless of what others think because it's the only single GPU solution on the market that makes sense for 4K gaming.


----------



## one-shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Jay hasn't posted a review of the Titan XP. No-one has. No-one can until the NDA lifts on Tuesday.
> This. In fact (+rep).


Delete!


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I come here to see if any new information has been released, but instead *I am always greeted with multiple pages of back and forth "this card isn't worth it", "yes it is!", "no!". It's a pointless argument because worth is opinion*, and honestly someone who truely is not interested in this card, would state their opinion once (at most) and move on.
> I bet majority of people buying titans don't think $1200 is all that much money, so no we don't need positive reinforcement. I'll buy the card regardless of what others think because it's the only single GPU solution on the market that makes sense for 4K gaming.


That's what i'm saying, why do other people argue with someone who says it doesn't worth it. it's an opinion anyway. so what's the point arguing.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I bet majority of people buying titans don't think $1200 is all that much money, so no we don't need positive reinforcement. I'll buy the card regardless of what others think because it's the only single GPU solution on the market that makes sense for 4K gaming.


That's great man, I'm sure that 1200$ Titan X is worth it for you, that of course doesn't change the fact that it is the most underwhelming Titan Release ever with the first cut down chip on a Titan, the lowest VRAM in relation to its x80Ti counterpart, with the lowest Double precision performance on a Titan all the while having the highest price tag as well.

And if these facts bother you maybe you do need positive reinforcement, just a thought.


----------



## l88bastar

People, PEOPLE.....THIS IS NOT A $1,200 GPU!

I wish it was.

Are you all forgetting Nvidias crazy price goughing shipping cost? They hammered us with outrageous shipping cost on the last Titan X, I think it was like $100 a card!

And taxes.....Nvidia now charges taxes too!

So realistically we are looking at closer to $1,400 per card









I may only get one now as $2,800 does not sit well with me at all.


----------



## HMoneyGrip

Well, I just want to see some game benchmarks!!! I am really surprised none have leaked thus far...


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> the first titan (a cut down GK 100) was delayed for months because a few reasons; horrible yields then nvidia filled OEM commitments after the oakridge super computer. then the 780TI with a full GK100 chip released several months afterwards.
> 
> the titan X (full GM 200 chip) released much earlier with a cut down GM200 chip (980ti) within months.
> 
> since the ONLY TWO times a titan has been released the direct opposite happened; so to say:
> is a sweeping generalization w/o any supporting facts.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> i'm not trying to describe the titan's purpose. the point is when you have two samples to draw from and the exact opposite happen between each sample*; *one cannot draw conclusions.*
> 
> * one the only commonality is both had a premium price; any inference would start and end there.


I think it's pretty clear from how the Titan lineup evolved over the years the real purpose is getting people to "pay more for less".


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I think it's pretty clear from how the Titan lineup evolved over the years the real purpose is getting people to "pay more for less".


Getting people to pay more for less is how you make money







If there are people could pay 1200 for the fastest card in the world, offering one for 1000 is bad business.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> People, PEOPLE.....THIS IS NOT A $1,200 GPU!
> 
> I wish it was.
> 
> Are you all forgetting Nvidias crazy price goughing shipping cost? They hammered us with outrageous shipping cost on the last Titan X, I think it was like $100 a card!
> 
> And taxes.....Nvidia now charges taxes too!
> 
> So realistically we are looking at closer to $1,400 per card
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may only get one now as $2,800 does not sit well with me at all.


I tried ordering a 1080 founders edition a few days ago as well as a GTX 1070 just now. Free shipping.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> Getting people to pay more for less is how you make money
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If there are people could pay 1200 for the fastest card in the world, offering one for 1000 is bad business.


lol goddamn I guess I have to spell out everything

OG Titan: 1 SMX cut cut same FP64 ability as Tesla K20X. Also 2x vram of any non-Titan cards. $999
Titan X: no FP64 ability, but at least full chip and 2x vram of 980 Ti. Still $999
Titan XP: no FP64, 2 SM cut, doesn't have 2x vram as a hypothetical 1080 Ti, $1200.


----------



## stefxyz

This is not how you calculate price for a monopolistic market.

You see how good are the yields and try to nail the price were customers willing to pay the price meet exactly supply -> you maximize total profit given supply constraint

So if yields are very good you can charge slidely less if yields are bad you charge more, because example: 1200 USD (600 USD margin) * 10000 Customer > 1400 USD (800 margin) * 7000 customers. Simple as that.

At least its very likely they dont get really good yields on the full chip so best chips: Quadro, 2nd best Titan at a price where they expect to meet supply and demand.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> lol goddamn I guess I have to spell out everything
> 
> OG Titan: 1 SMX cut cut same FP64 ability as Tesla K20X. Also 2x vram of any non-Titan cards. $999
> Titan X: no FP64 ability, but at least full chip and 2x vram of 980 Ti. Still $999
> Titan XP: no FP64, 2 SM cut, doesn't have 2x vram as a hypothetical 1080 Ti, $1200.


Preach


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> And if these facts bother you maybe you do need positive reinforcement, just a thought.


*Sigh*

If you look at my sig, I run a $6000 OLED display, a ~$20,000 7.2.4 audio setup, and a 138TB server. Do you _seriously_ think I need positive reinforcement for a $1200 purchase? I don't like rubbing money into people's faces, but you keep insisting that this is somehow a big purchase for me and that I need people to tell me it's worth it.

I know this is an awful value for a card, it just doesn't really bother me because I want to get 60FPS at 4K without SLI. I already sold my previous Titan, so it's closer to $950 anyway. Infact, I would never recommend this card to someone who feels $1200 is a lot of money.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I tried ordering a 1080 founders edition a few days ago as well as a GTX 1070 just now. Free shipping.


I'll definitely be overnighting mine to ensure it gets here before the weekend, I think they charged ~$60 for my previous Titan to do that. Pretty overpriced considering the boxes are tiny now!

I wasn't aware that NVIDIA charges tax now, that's kind of a bummer.

EDIT: Looks like it's only $34 for standard overnight, and $40 for morning delivery overnight for the 1070. Not to bad.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I think it's pretty clear from how the Titan lineup evolved over the years the real purpose is getting people to "pay more for less".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Getting people to pay more for less is how you make money
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If there are people could pay 1200 for the fastest card in the world, offering one for 1000 is bad business.
Click to expand...

unless the 20% price increase resulted in 25% less sales.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> Semantics, *the fact is people are paying 1200+$ for a Cut Down Chip*, besides you think 30% advantage is not small but a third of that is? Because the 10% performance loss *thanks to cut down cores* would have made of this Titan X less of a joke and more worthy of its price.
> People are complaining about price, and the fact that following previous generations this Titan X is exactly what the 1080Ti should have been.
> 
> Also after watching Jay2cents review this Titan X seems to be 22-25% faster than a GTX 1080, and even if it really ends up being 30% faster than a GTX 1080 then that 10% performance loss *because of its stripped down cores in its cutdown chip* would make up for a 33.33%, a third of the entire performance advantage of 30% faster than the GTX 1080, I'd say that's reason enough to complain, the fact that this is the saddest Titan ever released.


"Cut down core" this, "cut down core" that. Who gives a crap?

I couldn't care less if only half of its cores were working as long as it's significantly faster than any other option on the market. And it will be. Slap a good cooler on it and OC it to its max and guaranteed it'll be 35-40% faster than 1080 is. VR will benefit immensely from that kind of increase with the high resolutions that are required.

I'm not happy about the price either, but facts are facts. It'll be significantly faster than anything else out there, and there are certain segments of the market that will benefit from that.

Yields need to be given consideration, too, when it comes to these discussions. If they are not getting high enough yields, which with going to 16nm they might not be, then they would have no choice but to change strategy a bit and offer something to the masses that they could mass produce. There may not *be* a full chip released to the public.

All that should matter is performance compared to the competition and whether it suits your needs -- not whether it's a full chip or whether it has 24GB of VRAM (what in the bloody hell are you going to use that for? Launching rockets?), etc. Unless you're a GPU engineer I don't know why the hell you'd even care about the granular technical details that are at work here.


----------



## stefxyz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> unless the 20% price increase resulted in 25% less sales.


unless you are supply constrained anyways and cant sell 25% more


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> This is not how you calculate price for a monopolistic market.
> 
> You see how good are the yields and try to nail the price were customers willing to pay the price meet exactly supply -> you maximize total profit given supply constraint
> 
> So if yields are very good you can charge slidely less if yields are bad you charge more, because example: 1200 USD (600 USD margin) * 10000 Customer > 1400 USD (800 margin) * 7000 customers. Simple as that.
> 
> At least its very likely they dont get really good yields on the full chip so best chips: Quadro, 2nd best Titan at a price where they expect to meet supply and demand.


My comment was a simple observation that you got less features/vram for your money as the Titan lineup progressed over the years. It was also a tongue-in-cheek response to looniam's question of Titan's purpose.









Maybe next time I should use multiple "







" to signify not to take my post too seriously and get all worked out of shape.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> unless the 20% price increase resulted in 25% less sales.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> unless you are supply constrained anyways and cant sell 25% more
Click to expand...

that is an excellent point.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> *Sigh*
> 
> If you look at my sig, I run a $6000 OLED display, a ~$20,000 7.2.4 audio setup, and a 138TB server. Do you _seriously_ think I need positive reinforcement for a $1200 purchase? I don't like rubbing money into people's faces, but you keep insisting that this is somehow a big purchase for me and that I need people to tell me it's worth it.
> 
> I know this is an awful value for a card, it just doesn't really bother me because I want to get 60FPS at 4K without SLI. I already sold my previous Titan, so it's closer to $950 anyway. Infact, I would never recommend this card to someone who feels $1200 is a lot of money.
> I'll definitely be overnighting mine to ensure it gets here before the weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wasn't aware that NVIDIA charges tax now, that's kind of a bummer.


Didn't they always charge CA tax? How much do they charge for overnight shipping?


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> *Sigh*
> 
> If you look at my sig, I run a $6000 OLED display, a ~$20,000 7.2.4 audio setup, and a 138TB server. Do you _seriously_ think I need positive reinforcement for a $1200 purchase? I don't like rubbing money into people's faces, but you keep insisting that this is somehow a big purchase for me and that I need people to tell me it's worth it.


I never said this was a big purchase for you, I have strictly said that it is my opinion that this card isn't worth it for me while it might be worth it for you, and if it is worth it for you then those facts about the Titan X stripped down performance, VRAM and DP shouldn't bother you.

Now instead of positive reinforcement it seems like you expect an E-Peen massage.


----------



## ChevChelios

@ Murlocke I see you have a wireless Logitech G700

I gotta say if the shape looks ok to you then you gotta try the G900 (its also wireless or wired)

I got one recently and its just _amazing_ all around

keeping in mind I also preferred right handed ergonomic mice to ambidextrous ones my whole life, but fell in love with G900 ambi shape

mouse is expensive, but I see that wouldnt be a problem









sry for o/t


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> That's great man, I'm sure that 1200$ Titan X is worth it for you, that of course doesn't change the fact that it is the most underwhelming Titan Release ever with the first cut down chip on a Titan, the lowest VRAM in relation to its x80Ti counterpart, with the lowest Double precision performance on a Titan all the while having the highest price tag as well.
> 
> *And if these facts bother you maybe you do need positive reinforcement, just a thought*.


If you have to keep repeating this 'cut-down-chip' nonsense every other post, up to 28 times in one thread, then perhaps it's YOU who needs 'positive reinforcement' about your current rig?

Just sayin'.

If you deem the card unworthy of your almighty rig, then why have you posted 28 times in here? There are other threads you could click on.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Didn't they always charge CA tax? How much do they charge for overnight shipping?


Not sure, I just pulled up my old Titan order and there was no tax on it from ~1 year ago. Added a 1070 to checkout and went to paypal, tax is on there.

*So the actual price of a Titan X:
- $1284 with free ground shipping
- $1316 with overnight shipping
- $1322 with overnight morning delivery shipping*

This is assuming the shipping price is the same as a 1070 founders.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> @ Murlocke I see you have a wireless Logitech G700
> 
> I gotta say if the shape looks ok to you then you gotta try the G900 (its also wireless or wired)
> 
> I got one recently and its just _amazing_ all around
> 
> keeping in mind I also preferred right handed ergonomic mice to ambidextrous ones my whole life, but fell in love with G900 ambi shape
> 
> mouse is expensive, but I see that wouldnt be a problem
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sry for o/t


Sig wasn't updated, I use the G502 Proteus now.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> That's great man, I'm sure that 1200$ Titan X is worth it for you, that of course doesn't change the fact that it is the most underwhelming Titan Release ever with the first cut down chip on a Titan, the lowest VRAM in relation to its x80Ti counterpart, with the lowest Double precision performance on a Titan all the while having the highest price tag as well.
> 
> And if these facts bother you maybe you do need positive reinforcement, just a thought.


First titan was not a full die.

I will be curious about the overclocking potential of this card. Also, not sure how well the stock cooler will performance either....


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Sig wasn't updated, I use the G502 Proteus now.


Read my G900 review, you'll pull the trigger


----------



## Baasha

Is there someone who can get four Titan X (Pascal) for me? (preferably in a tax-free state like NV or TX)?? The card is out on Tuesday @ 6am PST.

I will obviously pay you once the purchase is made and pay for shipping to me after the purchase.

If one person can get all 4 (tax-free) for me, I will give you my old Noctua NH-D14 for free (was going to post it for sale).

Please PM me directly if you are willing to help.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Not sure, I just pulled up my old Titan order and there was no tax on it from ~1 year ago. Added a 1070 to checkout and went to paypal, tax is on there.
> 
> *So the actual price of a Titan X:
> - $1284 with free ground shipping
> - $1316 with overnight shipping
> - $1322 with overnight morning delivery shipping*
> 
> This is assuming the shipping price is the same as a 1070 founders.
> Sig wasn't updated, I use the G502 Proteus now.


I'm surprised they didn't charge you shipping since they are in Redwood City. I'll have to pass on overnight shipping. I can wait 3 days.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> First titan was not a full die.
> 
> I will be curious about the overclocking potential of this card. Also, not sure how well the stock cooler will performance either....


FE cooler even at 100% fan was hitting its limits with the 1080 (180W chip) so I expect it's going to really hold back the Titan.


----------



## iLeakStuff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> If you have to keep repeating this 'cut-down-chip' nonsense every other post, up to 28 times in one thread, then perhaps it's YOU who needs 'positive reinforcement' about your current rig?
> 
> Just sayin'.
> 
> If you deem the card unworthy of your almighty rig, then why have you posted 28 times in here? There are other threads you could click on.


Most AMD fanboys live in this world where they think performance/$ is the only thing that counts and once in a while some card like this Titan X comes along that is horrible value for gamers but offer the greatest performance out there, and people want to buy the card, their brain explodes and goes "Does not compute. Error, error". And they go in an endless boot cycle where the same argument is posted over and over again to overcome the logical flaw in the tiny circuitry that makes up their logical thinking.


----------



## formula m

Where did you peeps order your Titan at..?


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> People, PEOPLE.....THIS IS NOT A $1,200 GPU!
> 
> I wish it was.
> 
> Are you all forgetting Nvidias crazy price goughing shipping cost? They hammered us with outrageous shipping cost on the last Titan X, I think it was like $100 a card!
> 
> And taxes.....Nvidia now charges taxes too!
> 
> So realistically we are looking at closer to $1,400 per card
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may only get one now as $2,800 does not sit well with me at all.


True, and, the 980 wasn't a $550 gpu, it cost me $700+,nor was the 980Ti a $650 gpu, I paid $850+ and, the 1080 isn't a $600 gpu, etc., etc., we can go on...and I bought 2 of each...just haven't bought a Pascal chip yet...oh, never mind adding the cost of a water block...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm surprised they didn't charge you shipping since they are in Redwood City. I'll have to pass on overnight shipping. I can wait 3 days.


Tuesday with ground shipping, could mean delivery after the weekend. I'll pay the $32, and instead of going out with friends (Usually ~$50), sit at home with the Titan.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Tuesday with ground shipping, could mean delivery after the weekend. I'll pay the $32, and instead of going out with friends (Usually ~$50), sit at home with the Titan.


Now you have me contemplating spending $32 on overnight shipping. Why must you do this???


----------



## Asus11

based on the price of the gtx 1060 founders

it works out the Titan X will cost £1,100 in the UK im guessing they will price it 1099

dam.. was thinking maybe 1k but 1.1k Im guessing it is because 1060 founders in the uk is £275 in Nvidia store which is $300 in US 275 x 4 = 1100







£500 more than I paid for a founders 1080


----------



## Kielon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Most AMD fanboys live in this world where they think performance/$ is the only thing that counts and once in a while some card like this Titan X comes along that is horrible value for gamers but offer the greatest performance out there, and people want to buy the card, their brain explodes and goes "Does not compute. Error, error". And they go in an endless boot cycle where the same argument is posted over and over again to overcome the logical flaw in the tiny circuitry that makes up their logical thinking.


Fanboyism aside, buying an expensive product with no reviews out yet is like buying a car without a test drive or getting merried without...


----------



## stefxyz

Not really we know the Pascal architecture by now and the specs are there the rest is basic math...


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Not really we know the Pascal architecture by now and the specs are there the rest is basic math...


Lol, +1, you took the words out of my mouth....







. nVIDIA has been close so far in their performance numbers, so, they say 60% faster than OG Titan X, it must be close to that at least...


----------



## Kielon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Not really we know the Pascal architecture by now and the specs are there the rest is basic math...


We know for sure that DP latency fix is not working yet and most probably applies to Titan XP as well.


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kielon*
> 
> We know for sure that DP latency fix is not working yet and most probably applies to Titan XP as well.


it's the worlds fastest card right now.

shut up and pay for it!


----------



## Kielon

My 1080, currently sitting in top 20 Time Spy, feels like old crap when playing Netflix or YT. I won't even consider spending like $1.2k before real DPC fix is in place.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kielon*
> 
> We know for sure that DP latency fix is not working yet .


for many it is


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> for many it is


And that helps those suffering from that issue how?


----------



## renejr902

Finally Titan X is named: Geforce Titan X the ultimate.

Look at this page top right

Finally Its a Geforce card!

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/geforce-store

Note: you have to check the page with a pc, not the mobile web site

NOTE2: i tried to get it again the page dont refresh like i saw 5 minutes ago. give me a few minutes


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Finally Titan X is named: Geforce Titan X the ultimate.
> 
> Look at this page top right
> 
> Finally Its a Geforce card!
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/geforce-store
> 
> Note: you have to check the page with a pc, not the mobile web site


I'm not seeing what you're seeing..

Unrelated to the quote above, what is this DP latency issue? Never heard of it before.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Finally Titan X is named: Geforce Titan X the ultimate.
> 
> Look at this page top right
> 
> Finally Its a Geforce card!
> 
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/geforce-store
> 
> Note: you have to check the page with a pc, not the mobile web site


Says Nvidia Titan X for me (on PC...)

Anyhow I don't really care what they name it. GP102 was clearly designed to be a gaming chip.


----------



## renejr902

ok i got it, i only get it with my CEll phone, a sony xperia z5, it doesnt open the same way with a PC, sorry i was in error, dont use your pc, use your cell phone, for people that doesnt work i upload my cell phone pics

DSC00233.JPG 2948k .JPG file


DSC00232.JPG 3077k .JPG file


DSC00231.JPG 2867k .JPG file


DSC00230.JPG 4074k .JPG file
PG file)

For people that doesnt work, try refresh your page or close the page and click the link again or enter the url manually.

cant get it working with my pc laptop because the url, go to this link instead:

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store


----------



## x3sphere

I'm inclined to say it's a mistake, considering they specifically refer to it as "NVIDIA Titan X" everywhere else on the site, like this page also: http://www.geforce.com/hardware


----------



## renejr902

yeah i think the same thing.


----------



## Somasonic

I think it's just like a sub heading; 'the ultimate in performance' sort of thing rather than part of the name.


----------



## renejr902

i upload the images instead of attachments


----------



## DADDYDC650

Titan X The Ultimate? Seems like that name will add another 2 inches to our epeen's!


----------



## formula m

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kielon*
> 
> My 1080, currently sitting in top 20 Time Spy, feels like old crap when playing Netflix or YT. I won't even consider spending like $1.2k before real DPC fix is in place.


What have you don't to fix this..? Are you sure it is not with other resources, etc.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> lol goddamn I guess I have to spell out everything
> 
> OG Titan: 1 SMX cut cut same FP64 ability as Tesla K20X. Also 2x vram of any non-Titan cards. $999
> Titan X: no FP64 ability, but at least full chip and 2x vram of 980 Ti. Still $999
> Titan XP: no FP64, 2 SM cut, doesn't have 2x vram as a hypothetical 1080 Ti, $1200.


This is a 1080Ti, not a TItan. But who cares, its the fastest and that's all that matters...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> I'm not seeing what you're seeing..
> 
> Unrelated to the quote above, what is this DP latency issue? Never heard of it before.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1605618/ongoing-pascal-latency-problems-hotfix-doesnt-work-for-everyone

I had the issue, but finally got it worked out. Seemed like micro-stutter (to me), so it was really annoying. Definitely would make me rethink a $1200 gpu purchase. Almost returned my 1070 because of it.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> lol goddamn I guess I have to spell out everything
> 
> OG Titan: 1 SMX cut cut same FP64 ability as Tesla K20X. Also 2x vram of any non-Titan cards. $999
> Titan X: no FP64 ability, but at least full chip and 2x vram of 980 Ti. Still $999
> Titan XP: no FP64, 2 SM cut, doesn't have 2x vram as a hypothetical 1080 Ti, $1200.


Jen Hsun currently reading your post :

"We have to cut the 1080 Ti even harder and make the price even higher than previous "Ti" cards. "

3200 Cuda cores same VRAM as Titan X, 899 $


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> Jen Hsun currently reading your post :
> 
> "We have to cut the 1080 Ti even harder and make the price even higher than previous "Ti" cards. "
> 
> 3200 Cuda cores same VRAM as Titan X, 899 $


If we go by past Titans to Ti vram ratio, the 1080Ti will have 6GB of vram... wait


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> If we go by past Titans to Ti vram ratio, the 1080Ti will have 6GB of vram... wait


haha yeah.

I think it has 12gb (if there is a 1080 Ti)

and there will be a new Titan next year with full fat 1500$


----------



## dVeLoPe

so from someone who only has 1x 1080 and doesnt feel its good enough should I go with this card or wait for 1080ti?


----------



## Viveacious

What's this 1080Ti you speak of?


----------



## formula m

Is there any logic, or product stacking that makes for the Titan X, to replace the Ti moniker..? Or are we absolutely sure a 1080ti is coming..?


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dVeLoPe*
> 
> so from someone who only has 1x 1080 and doesnt feel its good enough should I go with this card or wait for 1080ti?


I can feel you mate. The GTX 1080 is really not that great and I can't even remember when it came out. It's simply not cutting it anymore.

Definitively get a new GeForce GTX Nvidia GTX GeForce Titan X The Ultimate. It has more advantages compared to a possible 1080 Ti

1) The 1080 Ti is not even announced.
2) The Titan X looks better in your signature
3) Chances are the 1080 Ti is worse. Maybe less cuda cores
4) We don't know when the 1080 Ti comes out
5) We don't know how expensive the 1080 Ti is going to be

I mean the Titan X has absolutely no downsides besides 1200$, cut card, no HBM, 1200$ and of course the absolutely horrendous horrible horrible price.

Other than that it is a fast card and it can play vidya games


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> If we go by past Titans to Ti vram ratio, the 1080Ti will have 6GB of vram... wait


Might as well just slap on 4GB HBM1 and then go all "b-b-but 4096 bits!!!! more wider is more better than more amount!!!".









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dVeLoPe*
> 
> so from someone who only has 1x 1080 and doesnt feel its good enough should I go with this card or wait for 1080ti?


Easy.

Take your current performance, then slap another 30% on top. Would you be happy with that kind of performance? If yes, would you be willing to pay $1200 for that kind of performance?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I can feel you mate. The GTX 1080 is really not that great and I can't even remember when it came out. It's simply not cutting it anymore.
> 
> Definitively get a new GeForce GTX Nvidia GTX GeForce Titan X The Ultimate. It has more advantages compared to a possible 1080 Ti
> 
> 1) The 1080 Ti is not even announced.
> 2) The Titan X looks better in your signature
> 3) Chances are the 1080 Ti is worse. Maybe less cuda cores
> 4) We don't know when the 1080 Ti comes out
> 5) We don't know how expensive the 1080 Ti is going to be
> *6) It literally adds inches to your epeen, and you get to call everyone else a "filthy casual".*
> 
> I mean the Titan X has absolutely no downsides besides 1200$, cut card, no HBM, 1200$ and of course the absolutely horrendous horrible horrible price.
> 
> Other than that it is a fast card and it can play vidya games


ATFY


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> This is a 1080Ti, not a TItan. But who cares, its the fastest and that's all that matters...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1605618/ongoing-pascal-latency-problems-hotfix-doesnt-work-for-everyone
> 
> I had the issue, but finally got it worked out. Seemed like micro-stutter (to me), so it was really annoying. Definitely would make me rethink a $1200 gpu purchase. Almost returned my 1070 because of it.


Ah thank you


----------



## meson1

I think a Ti will come. It'll have 3072 or 3328 Cuda cores, 192 or 208 Texture mapping units and 96 render output units. VRAM looks like it'll have to be 9GB or 12GB (seeing as 384bit bus memory seems to be based on multiples of 3 generally speaking). Price $800 or $900 and available via AIB partners.

When? If Nvidia continue at this breakneck pace of releases, September? If not the same pace, maybe Q1 2017. But who knows? Nvidia have been surprising us at every turn with the Pascal series.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> I think a Ti will come. It'll have *3072* or 3328 Cuda cores, 192 or 208 Texture mapping units and 96 render output units. VRAM looks like it'll have to be *9GB* or 12GB (seeing as 384bit bus memory seems to be based on multiples of 3 generally speaking). Price $800 or $900 and available via AIB partners.
> 
> When? If Nvidia continue at this breakneck pace of releases, September? If not the same pace, maybe Q1 2017. But who knows? Nvidia have been *surprising* us at every turn with the Pascal series.


I bolded the parts I disagree with.

And instead of "suprising" I'd have used "screwed us over even harder"


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I bolded the parts I disagree with.
> 
> And instead of "surprising" I'd have used "screwed us over even harder"


I had doubts about the specs. That's why put in all those "or"s. Hedge my bets.








But 3328 Cuda cores, 208 texture mapping units and 96 render output units and 12GB GDDR5X would be the best fit spec looking at the recent history of the x80 Ti and the spec of the Titan XP.

I call it surprising because of the breakneck speed. Everyone expected Titan to be another couple of months at least. August 2nd has caught almost everyone on the hop. I'm not surprised with the screwing over though, Nvidia always go for the double dip sales.


----------



## dVeLoPe

well considering 30% extra performance is almost 1/3rd id say yes i rather sell my 1080 and get this

no sli singe card more mem?


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> haha yeah.
> 
> I think it has 12gb (if there is a 1080 Ti)
> 
> and there will be a new Titan next year with full fat 1500$


With, hopefully, Volta coming not much later? who would pay $1500 for 2 months of glory? you just know that the 1180 is going to spank it...all for $700+ for the Founders Milki Edition...it's going to hard enough trying to resell the nVIDIA Titan XP without taking a huge loss. if I cop this card, it would be sold before the year is out. keeping my remaining 980Ti Classy as a backup, goodbye, trusty old 759Ti...


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> With, hopefully, Volta coming not much later? who would pay $1500 for 2 months of glory?


Remember what a lot of people have said in the past. Why wait when you can have performance now? 2 months could be too long for some.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Remember what a lot of people have said in the past. Why wait when you can have performance now? 2 months could be too long for some.


Lol, so true, forgot where I was at for a second...







anyways, I look at Pascal as a stopgap arch...


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CaliLife17*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> I have heard EK will have a block out for the new Titan X around the end of August.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have a link for this? Debating if I should buy 2 day one or wait till blocks are available. They way my custom loop is, I cant just put them in running on AIr, so I need blocks on them to run them. Don't know if I want to sit on them for a month until I can do anything with them.
Click to expand...

Nothing any more reliable than someone saying what I said, sadly.









It might be sooner though.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Lol, so true, forgot where I was at for a second...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways, I look at Pascal as a stopgap arch...


LOL there's nothing wrong with waiting (for a reasonable period that only you can decide is reasonable) for (much) better p/p


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asmodian*
> 
> Nothing any more reliable than someone saying what I said, sadly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It might be sooner though.


EKWB are usually on the ball for waterblocks for products like this.


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bloodbath*
> 
> In Australia we get gouged on everything we currently pay $1200-$1300 for a 1080


PLE has quite a few known brand 1080s for $1139aud. My Gigabytes were $1149 but I think they are also $1139 now.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iLeakStuff*
> 
> Most AMD fanboys live in this world where they think performance/$ is the only thing that counts and once in a while some card like this Titan X comes along that is horrible value for gamers but offer the greatest performance out there, and people want to buy the card, their brain explodes and goes "Does not compute. Error, error". And they go in an endless boot cycle where the same argument is posted over and over again to overcome the logical flaw in the tiny circuitry that makes up their logical thinking.


That's all these threads ever are. The same group of morons spouting and whining about price and why they aren't buying it. Just constant repeated garbage of theories and opinions. Here's an idea. If you have no interest in buying this new Titan. See the door>>>>>>>>>


----------



## Bloodbath

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> PLE has quite a few known brand 1080s for $1139aud. My Gigabytes were $1149 but I think they are also $1139 now.


cheers Emett.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dVeLoPe*
> 
> so from someone who only has 1x 1080 and doesnt feel its good enough should I go with this card or wait for 1080ti?


Keep your 1080 and change your sig to Titan XP SLI. Instant cheap 14 inch epeen FTW edition Super Cocked.


----------



## xTesla1856

Any info on availability in Europe yet? Does nvidia ship to Europe? As a former owner of two Titan X's, this card has my "Add to cart" finger itching again


----------



## Slomo4shO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> i upload the images instead of attachments


Print Screen. Take a minute to fine it on your keyboard...


----------



## renejr902

I cant do print screen , i got these images with my cell phone, it doesnt work on pc


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I cant do print screen , i got these images with my cell phone, it doesnt work on pc


that's Maxwell titan x. Pascal titan x has titan x written on the shroud.


----------



## magnek

The shroud design also isn't flat, and there are no green spinning green lights radiating from the blower.









But yeah that's indeed the Maxwell Titan X.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I don't think anyone cares if it's stated once or twice, but the same people coming into the thread to state it over and over just gets annoying after awhile.
> 
> I come here to see if any new information has been released, *but instead I am always greeted with multiple pages of back and forth "this card isn't worth it", "yes it is!", "no!". It's a pointless argument because worth is opinion, and honestly someone who truely is not interested in this card, would state their opinion once (at most) and move on.*
> I bet majority of people buying titans don't think $1200 is all that much money, so no we don't need positive reinforcement. I'll buy the card regardless of what others think because it's the only single GPU solution on the market that makes sense for 4K gaming.


Well this is, after all, an opinion forum so I don't really get why you are so mad that people are stating their opinions? I mean, you don't have to respond to them if you don't want to yet every time you feel the need to defend the Titan's honor and they respond to you in turn. its not as if these people are just spouting off the same opinions over and over without any back and forth from you and others directly responding to what they are saying. And save this BS about how the forum was so much better years ago as i guarantee you the exact same thing has been going on for as long as OCN has existed. What, nobody on the forum posted opinions and had arguments with other members back in '04 but now they do so "OCN is going downhill"? Come on man, you are too respected and good a regular poster to make silly statements like that...


----------



## bee144

254 pages of people either complaining that they can't afford the card or they can afford it, they just can't justify paying that much for their hobby. No real useful information yet.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well this is, after all, an opinion forum so I don't really get why you are so mad that people are stating their opinions? I mean, you don't have to respond to them if you don't want to yet every time you feel the need to defend the Titan's honor and they respond to you in turn. its not as if these people are just spouting off the same opinions over and over without any back and forth from you and others directly responding to what they are saying. And save this BS about how the forum was so much better years ago as i guarantee you the exact same thing has been going on for as long as OCN has existed. What, nobody on the forum posted opinions and had arguments with other members back in '04 but now they do so "OCN is going downhill"? Come on man, you are too respected and good a regular poster to make silly statements like that...


Back in 2004-2006 we banned people for bad grammar and low effort posts. It was definitely different. Under no case would someone be able to troll, the site was small enough that those type of people were removed very quickly. Everyone was an enthusiast, as no one else had heard of the site - it was purely an overclocking site and back then hardly anyone even knew what that was. But alas, this happens with all forums as they get popular, things become way too much to moderate.

In way, you can say I think most things go downhill as they becomes popular. I like small communities full of like minded individuals versus a bunch of people bickering (myself included) over stupid things like "the purpose of a titan", and "it is/isn't worth X amount". This site use to just be people buying overkill hardware for the sake of overclocking it and/or benching it. Value and purpose meant nothing. When anyone ever asked "Why?" the response was always "Because this is OCN.". I haven't seen that saying in a long long time.

But honestly, why does the Titan get so much crap? Intel could announce a $1500 CPU tomorrow and no one would bat an eye at the price - because no gamer really feels they "need" a better processor than what we can already buy for cheaper. The only difference here is people really want this card, they either can't afford it or don't feel it's worth $1200 so they complain about the price. If we lived in a world where everyone could afford everything, and everyone felt everything was a good value, then companies would release even more expensive products.


----------



## GenoOCAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> 254 pages of people either complaining that they can't afford the card or they can afford it, they just can't justify paying that much for their hobby. No real useful information yet.


Thanks for summarising the 200 pages for me. I'm looking forward to some benchmarks.


----------



## 8472

Something isn't right. How come there haven't been any leaked benches yet? The card comes out in two days.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Well this is, after all, an opinion forum so I don't really get why you are so mad that people are stating their opinions? I mean, you don't have to respond to them if you don't want to yet every time you feel the need to defend the Titan's honor and they respond to you in turn. its not as if these people are just spouting off the same opinions over and over without any back and forth from you and others directly responding to what they are saying. And save this BS about how the forum was so much better years ago as i guarantee you the exact same thing has been going on for as long as OCN has existed. What, nobody on the forum posted opinions and had arguments with other members back in '04 but now they do so "OCN is going downhill"? Come on man, you are too respected and good a regular poster to make silly statements like that...


Well you see the thing is they whine and complain about a GPU that they will never purchase or own.....and then rinse and repeat that for several GPU generations. The same people complaining about GPUs that they will never own or buy, generation after generation after generation due to price..... so what is the point of it?

I hear commie statements like Nvidia is greedy, Nvidia does not love us, Nvidia is turning their backs on us....yadda, yadda, yadda.....really? Nvidia is a billion dollar corporation and its their job to make profit for their shareholders & stake holders. They never loved us, they never will. They never had our backs and they never will. If they went out of business, we would simply purchase GPUs from the next best source and never look back. If you dropped dead, they would simply market their GPUs to the next warm body.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> Something isn't right. How come there haven't been any leaked benches yet? The card comes out in two days.


NDA


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> But honestly, why does the Titan get so much crap? Intel could announce a $1500 CPU tomorrow with and no one would bat an eye at the price - because no gamer really feels they "need" a better processor than what we can already buy for cheaper. The only difference here is people really want this card, they either can't afford it or don't feel it's worth $1200 so they complain about the price. If we lived in a world where everyone could afford everything, and everyone felt everyone was a good value, then companies would release even more expensive products.


Where have you been? That $1700 cpu from Intel gets lots of criticism about its price. But even as bad as it is priced, you will still get more years of service from it than you would from a $1200 gpu.


----------



## 8472

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> NDA


I'm talking about LEAKED benches, not official reviews. When's the last time a worthwhile card came out without some firestrike numbers (valid or not) leaking days before the NDA lifts?


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> Something isn't right. How come there haven't been any leaked benches yet? The card comes out in two days.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> I'm talking about LEAKED benches, not official reviews. When's the last time a worthwhile card came out without some firestrike numbers (valid or not) leaking days before the NDA lifts?


In the haste of Nvidias rush, I would surmise that few XPs got into the hands of those who leaked stats in the past.

That or they are afraid of the door kicking, dog shooting Ngestapo for violating NDA


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> I'm talking about LEAKED benches, not official reviews. When's the last time a worthwhile card came out without some firestrike numbers (valid or not) leaking days before the NDA lifts?


I'd imagine Nvidia is keeping a much tighter lid on this card than others in the past. They are only even selling it themselves so it looks like they are not taking any chances.


----------



## Somasonic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> I'm talking about LEAKED benches, not official reviews. When's the last time a worthwhile card came out without some firestrike numbers (valid or not) leaking days before the NDA lifts?


They aren't marketing this as a gaming card (yeah right) so maybe they haven't sent out many (if any) review samples to mainstream tech sites.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Where have you been? That $1700 cpu from Intel gets lots of criticism about its price. But even as bad as it is priced, you will still get more years of service from it than you would from a $1200 gpu.


True CPUs do last longer nowadays, but I don't feel the criticism is on the same level. You can go to any gaming forums, and whenever the TItan gets mentioned it's just full of people talking crap about it. If you mention you have a Titan, people like to call you out on wasting money, etc. But the guy with the $1500 processor in a gaming machine? No one says a thing. Maybe because processor models are less known amongst gaming communities?

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/2037684-Should-I-buy-the-new-titan
For example, look at this poll on MMOChamp with a guy who recently came into $28k and is getting 4K. Only 8% (4 people, one of which was me) said he should buy the new Titan, ~52% said no, and the ~39% remaining said hookers and drugs are a better value.









If he's getting 4K, the Titan is the only GPU on the market that makes sense unless he's buying two of something, yet only 4 people out of 48 said to get one.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I'd imagine Nvidia is keeping a much tighter lid on this card than others in the past. They are only even selling it themselves so it looks like they are not taking any chances.


I find this very worrying. Everything points to them sweeping this card under the rug very quickly.
- Exclusive to NVIDIA.com, seemingly forever. Has never happened to my knowledge.
- Basically the same title as the past titan, as if they didn't even bother to get a new name.
- Announced at a college, not at some well known event.
- Almost no advertisement, unless you actively follow hardware you would never know this existed - even after it launches. Most people won't know there's two different Titan X, and I bet lots of people will accidentally buy the old Titan X.
- Seems like if you want to get one on Day 1, you are going to need to buy blind if NDA lifts at same time, or risk waiting until next stock. Has this ever been the case?


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> If you dropped dead, they would simply market their GPUs to the next warm body.


That's...cold.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I find this very worrying. Everything points to them sweeping this card under the rug very quickly.
> - Exclusive to NVIDIA.com, seemingly forever. Has never happened to my knowledge.
> - Basically the same title as the past titan, as if they didn't even bother to get a new name.
> - Announced at a college, not at some well known event.
> - Almost no advertisement, unless you actively follow hardware you would never know this existed - even after it launches. Most people won't know there's two different Titan X, and I bet lots of people will accidentally buy the old Titan X.


I'm still just confused as to why they are even releasing this Titan now, so soon after the 1080. I argued there was no way we would see a new Titan in 2016 and was proven wrong but the argument was based on the idea that Nvidia has no reason to do this. Their only competition at the top is themselves so why hurry to rush this thing out the door when they can soak all the enthusiasts with the 1080 for the rest of the year and then turn around and get them again next year with a new Titan? Releasing it now ensures that many customers who would have bought both a 1080 and a new Titan will just skip the 1080 and they will lose out on an easy sale. Its even more curious when you consider the shortages of 1080's and the fact that to this day it can still be a challenge to even get a hold of one. I would almost expect the new Titan to be nearly vaporware considering its limited availability through Nvidia themselves and GP104's scarcity since launch (yields on GP104 are sure to have been much higher than GP102)...


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I find this very worrying. Everything points to them sweeping this card under the rug very quickly.
> - Exclusive to NVIDIA.com, seemingly forever. Has never happened to my knowledge.
> - Basically the same title as the past titan, as if they didn't even bother to get a new name.
> - Announced at a college, not at some well known event.
> - Almost no advertisement, unless you actively follow hardware you would never know this existed - even after it launches. Most people won't know there's two different Titan X, and I bet lots of people will accidentally buy the old Titan X.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm still just confused as to why they are even releasing this Titan now, so soon after the 1080. I argued there was no way we would see a new Titan in 2016 and was proven wrong but the argument was based on the idea that Nvidia has no reason to do this. *Their only competition at the top is themselves so why hurry to rush this thing out the door when they can soak all the enthusiasts with the 1080 for the rest of the year and then turn around and get them again next year with a new Titan? Releasing it now ensures that many customers who would have bought both a 1080 and a new Titan will just skip the 1080 and they will lose out on an easy sale. Its even more curious when you consider the shortages of 1080's and the fact that to this day it can still be a challenge to even get a hold of one.* I would almost expect the new Titan to be nearly vaporware considering its limited availability through Nvidia themselves and GP104's scarcity since launch (yields on GP104 are sure to have been much higher than GP102)...
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Maybe they looked at demand for the 1080 and said why are we taking $700 when we could be taking $1200. There will still be plenty of buyers for the 1080 even if they cream off the highest spenders for the Titan.
> 
> 
> 
> DING DING DING!
> 
> i mentioned before of 1080 supply issues - they can't keep them on the shelves. so now nvidia has found a way to get that money plus 58% more.
Click to expand...


----------



## magnek

$1200 is also sufficiently above $700 that there's no risk of cannibalizing the 1080's market.

Also to make a $850+ 1080 Ti look like a good deal down the road I suppose.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*


That's assuming they can release any more than 1000 Titan XP's. I expect the shortages of the 1080 to pale in comparison to the shortage of these new Titans. Can't make money on something you can't produce any of. And again, why offer potential 1080 buyers a choice? Make them buy 1080's now and then make them buy a new Titan next year. That way they buy everything rather than having the option to skip the 1080 altogether...


----------



## carlhil2

nVIDIA is releasing this card now because they are also going after a different crowd from gaming, killing two birds with one stone so to say....I mean, they have to do something with those failed chips.....hope that I can get one...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I'm still just confused as to why they are even releasing this Titan now, so soon after the 1080. I argued there was no way we would see a new Titan in 2016 and was proven wrong but the argument was based on the idea that Nvidia has no reason to do this. Their only competition at the top is themselves so why hurry to rush this thing out the door when they can soak all the enthusiasts with the 1080 for the rest of the year and then turn around and get them again next year with a new Titan? Releasing it now ensures that many customers who would have bought both a 1080 and a new Titan will just skip the 1080 and they will lose out on an easy sale. Its even more curious when you consider the shortages of 1080's and the fact that to this day it can still be a challenge to even get a hold of one. I would almost expect the new Titan to be nearly vaporware considering its limited availability through Nvidia themselves and GP104's scarcity since launch (yields on GP104 are sure to have been much higher than GP102)...


Honestly, I think they just need to get some patterns in their releases.

If it was my business:
- I would release the Titan first. This makes sense, as it means more people will buy your flagship.
- After a month or so, I would release the "non-Ti" versions for your average gamers.
- After half a year or so, I would release the "Ti" versions with the top end one being similar performance to the Titan at a lower cost.
- After another half a year or so, we'd be back to releasing the next Titan and the cycle would repeat.

To me this fixes many of the problems, people know exactly what the "top" card is for the year. There would be no need to second guess your purchase, as you'd know exactly whats happening in the future. However, I think NVIDIA does this on purpose. No patterns, and complex out of the blue releases means more impulse buys and double dips.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badexample*
> 
> While you guys are speculating about pricing and such .. How is that going to work on the 2nd of August? I will receive an e-mail from Nvidia. I would have to fill up the order straight from their website ASAP?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Titan X is so much better than a SLI setup.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you Nvidia! I returned my 1080 FTW to NCIX!


It's going to sell out before those notifications get sent I bet.


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Honestly, I think they just need to get some patterns in their releases.
> 
> If it was my business:
> - I would release the Titan first. This makes sense, as it means more people will buy your flagship.
> - After a month or so, I would release the "non-Ti" versions for your average gamers.
> - After half a year or so, I would release the "Ti" versions with the top end one being similar performance to the Titan at a lower cost.
> - After another half a year or so, we'd be back to releasing the next Titan and the cycle would repeat.
> 
> To me this fixes many of the problems, people know exactly what the "top" card is for the year. There will be no need to second guess your purchase, as you'd know exactly whats happening in the future.
> It's going to sell out before those notifications get sent I bet.


How do I get on the VIP list? Just refresh their website like a maniac until it is available? lol


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badexample*
> 
> How do I get on the VIP list? Just refresh their website like a maniac until it is available? lol


You download something that refresh a website every few seconds and detects changes. As far as I've heard, the Titan releases 6am PDT on Tuesday but I have no idea where that figure came from.

I expect their site to very slow.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Honestly, I think they just need to get some patterns in their releases.
> 
> If it was my business:
> - I would release the Titan first. This makes sense, as it means more people will buy your flagship.
> - After a month or so, I would release the "non-Ti" versions for your average gamers.
> - After half a year or so, I would release the "Ti" versions with the top end one being similar performance to the Titan at a lower cost.
> - After another half a year or so, we'd be back to releasing the next Titan and the cycle would repeat.
> 
> To me this fixes many of the problems, people know exactly what the "top" card is for the year. There would be no need to second guess your purchase, as you'd know exactly whats happening in the future. *However, I think NVIDIA does this on purpose. No patterns, and complex out of the blue releases means more impulse buys and double dips.*
> It's going to sell out before those notifications get sent I bet.


This is the second time you're saying this, and I still agree with you.


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> You download something that refresh a website every few seconds and detects changes. As far as I've heard, the Titan releases 6am PDT on Tuesday but I have no idea where that figure came from.
> 
> I expect their site to very slow.


Mur.. Thanks man! I'll be ready!


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Might as well just slap on 4GB HBM1 and then go all "b-b-but 4096 bits!!!! more wider is more better than more amount!!!".


But that's exactly what the AMD Diehards where claiming when the Fury and Fury X was coming








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I can feel you mate. The GTX 1080 is really not that great and I can't even remember when it came out. It's simply not cutting it anymore.


LOL dude its the best single GPU solution ATM. I have no idea why people where have such issue with that.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I'm still just confused as to why they are even releasing this Titan now, so soon after the 1080. I argued there was no way we would see a new Titan in 2016 and was proven wrong but the argument was based on the idea that Nvidia has no reason to do this. Their only competition at the top is themselves so why hurry to rush this thing out the door when they can soak all the enthusiasts with the 1080 for the rest of the year and then turn around and get them again next year with a new Titan? Releasing it now ensures that many customers who would have bought both a 1080 and a new Titan will just skip the 1080 and they will lose out on an easy sale. Its even more curious when you consider the shortages of 1080's and the fact that to this day it can still be a challenge to even get a hold of one. I would almost expect the new Titan to be nearly vaporware considering its limited availability through Nvidia themselves and GP104's scarcity since launch (yields on GP104 are sure to have been much higher than GP102)...


Who cares!!! I hope they release a 30% faster card every other month


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> But that's exactly what the AMD Diehards where claiming when the Fury and Fury X was coming
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL dude its the best single GPU solution ATM. I have no idea why people where have such issue with that.


True, in that case, every gpu before it was blah/average...if I have to settle for the 1080 Classified, I won't be mad, not at all, something better is always around the corner, and, I will be waiting....


----------



## jincuteguy

So is the new Titan X co ming out on Tuesday?


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Juub*
> 
> Is this sarcasm?


I run a Micro-ATX board with a single Ultra Wide Screen Monitor. I have the actual Titan X in there right now. Happy that Nvidia is releasing the new X earlier. ! Hoping to get on that list on the 2nd!

All I need is the best single GPU. Cheaper for me than a SLI setup and less problems.









and yeah people complain way too much. R&D is expensive. You have to pay to play!


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Who cares!!! I hope they release a 30% faster card every other month


This! Progress...


----------



## 8472

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Somasonic*
> 
> They aren't marketing this as a gaming card (yeah right) so maybe they haven't sent out many (if any) review samples to mainstream tech sites.


You're right. Listening to the pcper podcast, it sounded like they didn't have one. It looks like this thing might come out with no reviews at all on launch day. Not good......


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> You're right. Listening to the pcper podcast, it sounded like they didn't have one. It looks like this thing might come out with no reviews at all on launch day. Not good......


No reviews, no drivers, as far as I know it's not even in the "geforce" lineup so may have it's own set of drivers too.

I am still ordering because the CEO directly compared it to the previous Titans which are gaming cards. You don't do that unless the card is also for gaming. In the rare case people order it, and it turns out the drivers are crap and/or the 60% faster than previous Titan was far off the mark - then nothing is stopping us from sending it back to them for a refund.

I expect to see official benchmarks on their website today, or possibly an exclusive review somewhere else. If they really plan on lifting the NDA and releasing the card at the exact same time, they better have the stock for people to research before buying.


----------



## emett

It's going to be a toaster with that crappy reference cooler if it's anything like the founders edition 1080.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> It's going to be a toaster with that crappy reference cooler if it's anything like the founders edition 1080.


Mine will be getting the EK treatment ASAP


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> It's going to be a toaster with that crappy reference cooler if it's anything like the founders edition 1080.


Who cares? Most of us with the Titan X go aftermarket cooling.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> True, in that case, every gpu before it was blah/average...


But that actually is the case of almost every top tier GPU drop.
Weather its only better by .05% or xx%, its the better card.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8472*
> 
> You're right. Listening to the pcper podcast, it sounded like they didn't have one. It looks like this thing might come out with no reviews at all on launch day. Not good......


During WAN show they stated they contacted nVidia but no one was answering them back, so Linus was talking bout just going to NCIX and buying one on launch day.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> It's going to be a toaster with that crappy reference cooler if it's anything like the founders edition 1080.


You have to have a uni at times like these...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badexample*
> 
> Who cares? Most of us with the Titan X go aftermarket cooling.


I just put my computer in another room entirely and have it at 100% fan while gaming. It sounds like a jet engine in there.


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I just put my computer in another room entirely and have it at 100% fan while gaming. It sounds like a jet engine in there.










it is all good with headphones on!


----------



## Badexample

All we have so far is the video release from Nvidia for legit info?


----------



## The-Real-Link

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> It's really not that hard to figure out the timing of this release. Look who the target audience is: Folks who bought the original Titan X. It was launched in mid-March of last year. nVidia figures these folks are ready (and can afford) to upgrade after 16 months, and they're probably right! I predict the Titan XP will sell out within 30 minutes or less once they turn on the "Add to cart" button.


Good point. I know this is posted from 150 pages back but this thread is hauling so can't read it all. I wasn't originally intending to get this card but the more I look at it with an X currently, it is tempting.


----------



## Pragmatist

It's going to be even more interesting to find out how the card performs, mainly because no reviewers has it yet so we get to explore it together.








I wouldn't mind a review by Gamers Nexus though.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> True CPUs do last longer nowadays, but I don't feel the criticism is on the same level. You can go to any gaming forums, and whenever the TItan gets mentioned it's just full of people talking crap about it. If you mention you have a Titan, people like to call you out on wasting money, etc. But the guy with the $1500 processor in a gaming machine? No one says a thing. Maybe because processor models are less known amongst gaming communities?


Right now, Nvidia has way too much power and like the stunt that Intel pulled with the $1700 USD 6950X, is taking advantage of its monopoly power.

It was estimated that the original Kepler Titan probably cost Nvidia $150 USD to manufacture in parts, which meant that the profit margins for a $1000 USD GPU were huge. That doesn't take into account labor, distribution costs, R&D, marketing, and other costs, but the profit margins must have been huge. This is coming out of our pockets right now.

If anything, I'd say there is not enough anger at Nvidia. Until it starts costing them sales, we won't see anything change. You can bet that there's a good chance they will push back with a $1500 Titan knowing that there are enough people to buy it. It's all about the profits right now.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I find this very worrying. Everything points to them sweeping this card under the rug very quickly.
> - Exclusive to NVIDIA.com, seemingly forever. Has never happened to my knowledge.
> - Basically the same title as the past titan, as if they didn't even bother to get a new name.
> - Announced at a college, not at some well known event.
> - Almost no advertisement, unless you actively follow hardware you would never know this existed - even after it launches. Most people won't know there's two different Titan X, and I bet lots of people will accidentally buy the old Titan X.
> - Seems like if you want to get one on Day 1, you are going to need to buy blind if NDA lifts at same time, or risk waiting until next stock. Has this ever been the case?


That's because this Titan X Pascal won't have a long shelf life. Think about it - their next GPU, Volta, according to their own roadmap is going to have a GPU that will be a new architecture, perhaps a big a shift from Fermi to Kepler that will be fully asynchronous, like AMD's GPUs.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Honestly, I think they just need to get some patterns in their releases.
> 
> If it was my business:
> - I would release the Titan first. This makes sense, as it means more people will buy your flagship.
> - After a month or so, I would release the "non-Ti" versions for your average gamers.
> - After half a year or so, I would release the "Ti" versions with the top end one being similar performance to the Titan at a lower cost.
> - After another half a year or so, we'd be back to releasing the next Titan and the cycle would repeat.
> 
> To me this fixes many of the problems, people know exactly what the "top" card is for the year. There would be no need to second guess your purchase, as you'd know exactly whats happening in the future. However, I think NVIDIA does this on purpose. No patterns, and complex out of the blue releases means more impulse buys and double dips.
> It's going to sell out before those notifications get sent I bet.


The problem is that they may not be able to get the large flagship die first. With new processes these days, after Fermi, both Nvidia and AMD have been releasing small to medium sized dies first and then larger dies.

Nvidia did so after their Fermi disaster, quietly adopting AMD's strategy. It gives them time to iron out the issues for the big die, which is an engineering challenge.

Another reason may be that die yields simply do not allow this to happen at first. Processes are getting harder.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CrazyElf*
> 
> Right now, Nvidia has way too much power and like the stunt that Intel pulled with the $1700 USD 6950X, is taking advantage of its monopoly power.
> 
> It was estimated that the original Kepler Titan probably cost Nvidia $150 USD to manufacture in parts, which meant that the profit margins for a $1000 USD GPU were huge. That doesn't take into account labor, distribution costs, R&D, marketing, and other costs, but the profit margins must have been huge. This is coming out of our pockets right now.
> 
> If anything, I'd say there is not enough anger at Nvidia. Until it starts costing them sales, we won't see anything change. You can bet that there's a good chance they will push back with a $1500 Titan knowing that there are enough people to buy it. It's all about the profits right now.
> That's because this Titan X Pascal won't have a long shelf life. Think about it - their next GPU, Volta, according to their own roadmap is going to have a GPU that will be a new architecture, perhaps a big a shift from Fermi to Kepler that will be fully asynchronous, like AMD's GPUs.


No way on earth I'd buy a $1500 Titan unless it was at least double my current card, and a huge gap between the second best card on the market. It'd also need a better cooler by default, because the reference cooler seems pretty stupid even at $1200. I could see $1500 happening, especially with HBM2 but I do not think the card will sell very well at all.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> True CPUs do last longer nowadays, but I don't feel the criticism is on the same level. You can go to any gaming forums, and whenever the TItan gets mentioned it's just full of people talking crap about it. If you mention you have a Titan, people like to call you out on wasting money, etc. But the guy with the $1500 processor in a gaming machine? No one says a thing. Maybe because processor models are less known amongst gaming communities?
> 
> http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/2037684-Should-I-buy-the-new-titan
> For example, look at this poll on MMOChamp with a guy who recently came into $28k and is getting 4K. Only 8% (4 people, one of which was me) said he should buy the new Titan, ~52% said no, and the ~39% remaining said hookers and drugs are a better value.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If he's getting 4K, the Titan is the only GPU on the market that makes sense unless he's buying two of something, yet only 4 people out of 48 said to get one.
> I find this very worrying. Everything points to them sweeping this card under the rug very quickly.
> - Exclusive to NVIDIA.com, seemingly forever. Has never happened to my knowledge.
> - Basically the same title as the past titan, as if they didn't even bother to get a new name.
> - Announced at a college, not at some well known event.
> - Almost no advertisement, unless you actively follow hardware you would never know this existed - even after it launches. Most people won't know there's two different Titan X, and I bet lots of people will accidentally buy the old Titan X.
> - Seems like if you want to get one on Day 1, you are going to need to buy blind if NDA lifts at same time, or risk waiting until next stock. Has this ever been the case?


I've been thinking the same thing. There's a reason for everything you pointed out and it's suspicious how it's not labeled a GeForce GPU. They have labeled the XP a prosumer card but we all know they want gamers/enthusiasts to buy a bunch. Maybe they did this to cover their butt's so when they release a Ti for hundreds less or a full chip with 3800+ cores in the next few months we'll have nobody to blame but ourselves for buying a $1200 prosumer card.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I've been thinking the same thing. There's a reason for everything you pointed out and it's suspicious how it's not labeled a GeForce GPU. They have labeled the XP a prosumer card but we all know they want gamers/enthusiasts to buy a bunch. Maybe they did this to cover their butt's so when they release a Ti for hundreds less or a full chip with 3800+ cores in the next few months we'll have nobody to blame but ourselves for buying a $1200 prosumer card.


It's very possible. I brought up that same possibility on another forum, but I can't figure out why they'd bring out a Ti in a few months with no competition from AMD, even at $800-900 I think that would devalue the 1080.

I have no idea what sales are like though, they could be very top heavy for these types of graphics cards. So in a few months the rush for 1080s may have died down significantly and it would make sense to bring out a Ti, milk the $800-900 segment, before AMD releases Vega. Then in Q1 2017 cut the price of all Pascal cards except Titan by $150-200 or so if Vega lineup is strong. We'll see...


----------



## renejr902

Im buying it with some fears like you said... But i will still buy it , its my only option for 4k without sli. I dont want sli. 1080 is not strong enough for me at 4k. I buy it blind







i wont even check the invoice price , i just click accept and enter my credit card number lol

Are you serious we are only 4 to buy it ??? Man !! Then i suppose we are 4 crazy persons, LoL ! Thanks nvidia we love to waste our money for overprice cards, thats our message to them lol
Man for that price i still want a Jen-Hsun signature, a clone jen-hsun jacket, a jen-hsun strand of hair souvenir all in a gold plated box LoL Seriously i dont even know if i like this guy lol







who respect this guy ? Is he really famous for nvidia marketing? I dont know a lot about him

and Who will buy this titan x card? Im in for tomorrow!

I will appreciate if someone here can tell me the watercooled option already know by any brand ? thanks

Otherwise i will keep my pc case open with my air conditioner system directly at front of it while testing overclock lol im serious about that







i dont think it can damage anything right? Thanks


----------



## emett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badexample*
> 
> Who cares? Most of us with the Titan X go aftermarket cooling.


Yes I understand this but I brought it up as a passing comment on why nVidia might not have let reviews out early..
I had SLI Titans for over 3 years on air and they were fine. The 10series Titan X is a different beast though..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> You have to have a uni at times like these...


huh


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Huh?
> 
> 1080 = 8GB
> *This card = 12GB*


Lets compare again

Quadro K6000 = 6GB, TB / OGT = 6GB

Quadro M6000 = 12GB, TXM = 12GB

*Quadro P6000 = 24GB, TXP = 12GB*

So where is the Vram when Titan X suppose to come with 24GB same as Quadro?


----------



## Roadkill95

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Dang....can't wait to order two of these!
> 
> And NO I am not SLIng them....going to replace my 1080 FTW GTX in rig one and TitanX-Maxwell in rig two, which should help relieve my wallet a tad


Man your e-penis must be about 20 feet long by now, gonna need more than 2 hands to handle that badboy on a lonely Friday night now. Maybe JHH can lend a hand?

I kid I kid. Good luck with your cards bro


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> huh


He means a universal block.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Lets compare again
> 
> Quadro K6000 = 6GB, TB / OGT = 6GB
> 
> Quadro M6000 = 12GB, TXM = 12GB
> 
> *Quadro P6000 = 24GB, TXP = 12GB*
> 
> So where is the Vram when Titan X suppose to come with 24GB same as Quadro?


Finally are you buying one ? (titan x)

I think this gp102 was built for a 1080ti and gp100 for a titan x, but for a unknown reason they changed their mind, and they decide to make a titan x with gp102 and dont use gp100 for a titan.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Lets compare again
> 
> Quadro K6000 = 6GB, TB / OGT = 6GB
> 
> Quadro M6000 = 12GB, TXM = 12GB
> 
> *Quadro P6000 = 24GB, TXP = 12GB*
> 
> So where is the Vram when Titan X suppose to come with 24GB same as Quadro?


Who cares about 24GB. What are you going to use that for? Are you rendering medical imagery all day long or something?

There are no gaming tasks that will use 24GB of VRAM before you are already 2-3 generations behind in GPU architectures and have to upgrade anyway.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Who cares about 24GB. What are you going to use that for? Are you rendering medical imagery all day long or something?
> 
> There are no gaming tasks that will use 24GB of VRAM before you are already 2-3 generations behind in GPU architectures and have to upgrade anyway.


Yes we do not need 24gb den but why need to increase $200 and giving us half the memory. Its obviously trying cut cost every possible way but jacking the price up as high as possible.

If you want to charge that premium, make sure u give us the true premium luxury. Just saying.


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Back in 2004-2006 we banned people for bad grammar and low effort posts. It was definitely different. Under no case would someone be able to troll, the site was small enough that those type of people were removed very quickly. Everyone was an enthusiast, as no one else had heard of the site - it was purely an overclocking site and back then hardly anyone even knew what that was. But alas, this happens with all forums as they get popular, things become way too much to moderate.
> 
> In way, you can say I think most things go downhill as they becomes popular. I like small communities full of like minded individuals versus a bunch of people bickering (myself included) over stupid things like "the purpose of a titan", and "it is/isn't worth X amount". This site use to just be people buying overkill hardware for the sake of overclocking it and/or benching it. Value and purpose meant nothing. When anyone ever asked "Why?" the response was always "Because this is OCN.". I haven't seen that saying in a long long time.
> 
> But honestly, why does the Titan get so much crap? Intel could announce a $1500 CPU tomorrow and no one would bat an eye at the price - because no gamer really feels they "need" a better processor than what we can already buy for cheaper. The only difference here is people really want this card, they either can't afford it or don't feel it's worth $1200 so they complain about the price. If we lived in a world where everyone could afford everything, and everyone felt everything was a good value, then companies would release even more expensive products.


You're wrong. I was lurking in the early 2000s I only created an account for bulldozer questions with JF AMD and then I got sucked in. People were not BANNED for bad grammar. That is completely ludicrous you're falling into the nostalgia fallacy.

Second, Intel did release a 1700 dollar processor and everyone here pretty much gave them grief over it. So twice you're wrong in one post.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I think this gp102 was built for a 1080ti and gp100 for a Titan X, but for some unknown reason they changed their mind, and they decide to make a Titan X with gp102 and don't use gp100 for a Titan.


GP100 was built exclusively for compute applications. According to the Wikipedia page about the Pascal microarchitecture, the GP100 has no Render Output units, so it cannot be utilized as a graphics chip.

That's why we are seeing the Titan XP, the Quadro P6000 and the 1080ti (if there is one) being driven by the GP102.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> I find this very worrying. Everything points to them sweeping this card under the rug very quickly.
> - Exclusive to NVIDIA.com, seemingly forever. Has never happened to my knowledge.
> - Basically the same title as the past titan, as if they didn't even bother to get a new name.
> - Announced at a college, not at some well known event.
> - Almost no advertisement, unless you actively follow hardware you would never know this existed - even after it launches. Most people won't know there's two different Titan X, and I bet lots of people will accidentally buy the old Titan X.
> - Seems like if you want to get one on Day 1, you are going to need to buy blind if NDA lifts at same time, or risk waiting until next stock. Has this ever been the case?


good points

Nvidia is releasing high-end GPUs fast these days (Im betting its thanks to those billions of R&D .. despite how certain AMD fans like to joke about it







.. if AMD had billions too - Vega would be out now or in 1 month tops instead of 2017), so TXP may be another "stop-gap" for the second half of 2016

but then again its still the fastest GPU nonetheless, so ppl with loads of cash and 4K rigs that need to be run can benefit from it


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Where have you been? That $1700 cpu from Intel gets lots of criticism about its price. But even as bad as it is priced, *you will still get more years of service from it than you would from a $1200 gpu*.


thats simply the current CPUs vs GPUs situation, its not the Titans or Nvidias fault

and its amplified by:

(1) Intels CPUs stagnating in increases and AMD having 0 to offer for years, while GPUs surge forward
(2) bigger and better monitors, bigger resolutions, bigger refresh rates etc. all increasing and becoming more popular and those need GPU power much more than CPU .. even 4K wont stop it, theres 5K on the horizon for PC enthusiasts and at some point even 8K (not sure how well adopted 8K will get though on monitors)


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I bolded the parts I disagree with.
> 
> And instead of "suprising" I'd have used "screwed us over even harder"


Problem is that nVidia has no cause not to screw us. As long as AMD mounts no defense nVidia will price it as she want.

Having said that 11 TFlops of compute power is probably a bargain. If you buy this card for gaming alone -though- you better have a *good* reason to do so (say gaming on 4K and don't want to buy SLI).

People are complaining about the rising prices since forever. At this point GFX cards (adjusted for inflation) are literally twice as pricy. It seems that -either- the gaming "profession" becomes more of a niche or (more probably) gamers are all grown up now and they can shell their own money instead of asking "mommy and daddy" to do so, hence the insane prices...

Remember it's not just nVidia AMD often had insane prices too lately (may remind you the last twin card of theirs being over twice as pricey as their twin cards of old)...

Price aside, I'm excited about the hardware and so should be the rest of the forum, never before did we have such a rapid development of things...


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> gamers are all grown up now and they can shell their own money instead of asking "mommy and daddy" to do so, hence the insane prices...


You might be onto something there. Although in nvidia's eye this may be part of the solution to Moore's Law slowing down - Making bigger and bigger GPUs that cost a ton. With the GP102 probably not having the greatest of yields and it being a large expensive chip in the first place makes it quite a niche product and sadly prices get exponentially higher the more niche you become.









Having said that, an MSRP of 1200 USD is waaay too high for me. For that price I'd want ~4800 cuda cores and HBM2....


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> You might be onto something there. Although in nvidia's eye this may be part of the solution to Moore's Law slowing down.


Apart from rising prices, I'm not too sure that things are actually slowing down by an appreciable amount. We got a card 60% faster than last year's (equivalent card).

That's very much in-line with Moore's law's effect on performance, in fact it exceeds it by a bit (supposedly we'd get twice the transistor count every 18 months, but performance wise it would translate to -probably- 60% better performance every 18 months, we got that earlier, no real slow down there)...


----------



## Swolern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> Apart from rising prices, I'm not too sure that things are actually slowing down by an appreciable amount. We got a card 60% faster than last year's (equivalent card).
> 
> That's very much in-line with Moore's law's effect on performance, in fact it exceeds it by a bit (supposedly we'd get twice the transistor count every 18 months, but performance wise it would translate to -probably- 60% better performance every 18 months, we got that earlier, no real slow down there)...


The tricky part is Nvidia is not comparing it to their last top GPU released(GTX 1080), they are comparing the top GPU previous to the last one, to make the performance jump look way high. When actually the Titan XP will only be 30-35% faster than the last top car, the GTX 1080. Clever Titan naming scheme by Nvidia, ill give them that.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swolern*
> 
> The tricky part is Nvidia is not comparing it to their last top GPU released(GTX 1080), they are comparing the top GPU previous to the last one, to make the performance jump look way high. When actually the Titan XP will only be 30-35% faster than the last top car, the GTX 1080. Clever Titan naming scheme by Nvidia, ill give them that.


Well, who's going to upgrade from a 1080 to Titan XP? Probably a very small number.

The target gamer market for this card are owners of Maxwell and older cards.

Much bigger than the gaming market will be the large number of organizations working with neural networks. Many of them will be paying top dollar for the Quadro cards, but smaller or economically minded R&D groups will be using this card to run their DNNs.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swolern*
> 
> The tricky part is Nvidia is not comparing it to their last top GPU released(GTX 1080), they are comparing the top GPU previous to the last one, to make the performance jump look way high. When actually the Titan XP will only be 30-35% faster than the last top car, the GTX 1080. Clever Titan naming scheme by Nvidia, ill give them that.


It makes sense, Titans are supposedly a different market than Geforce cards. Still it stands to reason to think as impressive that they got 60% better performance YoY.

Also 30-35% is the difference if you care about TDP. If you don't, with both being of the same architecture, they'll probably clock similarly so you're looking for 40-50% difference (if they're equally clocked), and maybe more if nVidia's adaptive clocks are more lax on the Titan series...


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> If you don't, with both being of the same architecture, they'll probably clock similarly *so you're looking for 40-50% difference (if they're equally clocked*)


HOW ??

40% shaders cannot give more than 40% increase and even 1:1 scaling wont be possible

_30%_ increase from 40% more shaders at equal clocks will be _good_ to have


----------



## Klocek001

it's well possible with 1080- TX running clock for clock, 1.5x ROPs on TX will benefit from a higher clock increase compared to 1080 and 1.5x bandwidth. I wouldn't be very surprised if it indeed amounts to 50%. But it will be achievable under water only.


----------



## ChevChelios

nah 50% is impossible IMO (not with a 3584 card) and I'll believe 40% when I see it


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Lets compare again
> 
> Quadro K6000 = 6GB, TB / OGT = 6GB
> 
> Quadro M6000 = 12GB, TXM = 12GB
> 
> *Quadro P6000 = 24GB, TXP = 12GB*
> 
> So where is the Vram when Titan X suppose to come with 24GB same as Quadro?


I'd rather have 12GB than 24GB and have it be ~$1400. I think every single person here would agree.

I can't think of any situation where a consumer would need 24GB of VRAM.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> You're wrong. I was lurking in the early 2000s I only created an account for bulldozer questions with JF AMD and then I got sucked in. People were not BANNED for bad grammar. That is completely ludicrous you're falling into the nostalgia fallacy.
> 
> Second, Intel did release a 1700 dollar processor and everyone here pretty much gave them grief over it. So twice you're wrong in one post.


Considering the first day I made my account here, and my very first post, I was infracted for posting without punctuation. You are wrong.

*You are EXPECTED to:
Edit your posts for spelling and grammar. Overclock.net's usability depends on this.
Use capitalization
No excessive Internet jargon
Use proper spelling, grammar and punctuation*
http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service

It's right there in the current TOS, it's just not enforced anymore because the site has gotten so big.

I also already explained that I felt the criticism intel got for a $1700 processor was not the same as the hate for the Titan lineup:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1606550/twitter-jen-hsun-introduces-the-new-nvidia-titan-x/2500_50#post_25397111 (Link may not work unless your using 50 posts per page).

No one _really_ cared about Intel's $1700 processor because no one actually needed it for gaming. When I see someone posting on a gaming forum (Steam, etc) with a $1000+ processor, no one ever brings attention to it. However, If anyone claims they have a Titan, chances are he gets called out for wasting money. Amongst normal gamers, the Titan lineup has a very bad reputation much worse than any Intel lineup IMO. Does not make sense to me as a $1200 GPU makes way more sense than a $1200 processor for gamers.


----------



## ChevChelios

yeah I dont know why some are so hard on the 24GB VRAM thing

its pointless for gaming

is it important in compute or deep learning or whatever else Titans can get used in ?


----------



## renejr902

Im pretty sure a fully overclocked titan x will beat a stock clock 1080 by 50%. I expect titan x to overclock a lot.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Im pretty sure a fully overclocked titan x will beat a stock clock 1080 by 50%. I expect titan x to overclock a lot.


which means it beats an OCed 1080 by ~35%

and it wont OC better than 1080/1070


----------



## stefxyz

Of course not. The card will rather OC slightly worse with much more CUDA cores on the chip. Still 25% (assuming TITAN XP clocks at 1900 MHZ under water) more brute force than a 2100 MHZ 1080 is quite significant and I am more than happy to pay for that.

25% on top of a 2100 MHZ 1080 is basically a little 970 at stock on top of the performance...


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> 25% on top of a 2100 MHZ 1080 is basically a little 970 at stock on top of the performance...


1080 2.1Ghz $650 + another $550 for ~GTX 1050 performance


----------



## Swolern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> It makes sense, Titans are supposedly a different market than Geforce cards. Still it stands to reason to think as impressive that they got 60% better performance YoY.
> 
> Also 30-35% is the difference if you care about TDP. If you don't, with both being of the same architecture, they'll probably clock similarly so you're looking for 40-50% difference (if they're equally clocked), and maybe more if nVidia's adaptive clocks are more lax on the Titan series...


So much wrong in this post.

Titans are in a different market? Nvidia is clouding your head. They are GeForce cards = gaming. The Titan X even had gimped DP. At least the new TX has compute.
40-50% > 1080 is a pipe dream. Not sure where you pulled that number from.
No one cares about similar clock performance, only max clock performance.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Im pretty sure a fully overclocked titan x will beat a stock clock 1080 by 50%. I expect titan x to overclock a lot.


Why are you expecting it to OC a lot? I would be pleasantly surprised if it can clock higher than the 1080s.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swolern*
> 
> So much wrong in this post.
> 
> Titans are in a different market? Nvidia is clouding your head. They are GeForce cards = gaming. The Titan X even had gimped DP. At least the new TX has compute.
> 40-50% > 1080 is a pipe dream. Not sure where you pulled that number from.
> No one cares about similar clock performance, only max clock performance.


1) You're misquoting, I wrote "supposededly", be careful next time.
2) Everything apart from clocks are 40-50% higher (bandwidth, ram amount, ROPs, CUDA cores)
3) It's the same arch, it will achieve similar max clocks, in the same way that Titan Maxwell did compared to GTX 980 (I expect 2000-2100 MHz on good ventilation).


----------



## stefxyz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> 1080 2.1Ghz $650 + another $550 for ~GTX 1050 performance


You never get the best price performance ratio on the top of the market. Check the 1070 in that case.


----------



## Swolern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> 1) You're misquoting, I wrote "supposededly", be careful next time.
> 2) Everything apart from clocks are 40-50% higher (bandwidth, ram amount, ROPs, CUDA cores)
> 3) It's the same arch, it will achieve similar max clocks, in the same way that Titan Maxwell did compared to GTX 980 (I expect 2000-2100 MHz on good ventilation).


Sorry didnt mean to gear that towards you. Im just getting tired of the Nvidia fluff and empty marketing promises.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swolern*
> 
> Sorry didnt mean to gear that towards you. Im just getting tired of the Nvidia fluff and empty marketing promises.


No worries.
To be fair it's not fluff, it's the same sort of Titan fair as previous generations. The card itself is very respectable. The pricing policy probably isn't, but hey it's a free market (or semi-free to be fair), each and every vendor can set their prices as long as they find people buying their products.


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> 1080 2.1Ghz $650 + another $550 for ~GTX 1050 performance
> 
> 
> 
> You never get the best price performance ratio on the top of the market. Check the 1070 in that case.
Click to expand...

Even the 1070 is bad price/performance. The 1060/480 is in that spot.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> 2) Everything apart from clocks are 40-50% higher (bandwidth, ram amount, ROPs, CUDA cores)


bandwidth and ram are pretty much irrelevant, both cards have enough to feed themselves and not suffer VRAM shortage, past that there is no gain

it only has 40% more cores and 50% more ROPs, that does *not* translate into 40-50% direct performance increase at equal clocks


----------



## Ha-Nocri

This is the new x80ti for NV and it's only $550 more than before


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ha-Nocri*
> 
> This is the new x80ti for NV and it's only $550 more than before


at least they have one as early as August 2016


----------



## WorldExclusive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> No one _really_ cared about Intel's $1700 processor because no one actually needed it for gaming. When I see someone posting on a gaming forum (Steam, etc) with a $1000+ processor, no one ever brings attention to it. However, If anyone claims they have a Titan, chances are he gets called out for wasting money. Amongst normal gamers, the Titan lineup has a very bad reputation much worse than any Intel lineup IMO. Does not make sense to me as a $1200 GPU makes way more sense than a $1200 processor for gamers.


GPUs decrease in value rapidly and are superseded by another GPU within months. Depending on the games and resolution played, the user will need to upgrade within 2 years.
CPUs can be used up to 5 years before upgrading and higher core CPUs are generally purchased for work applications i.e. digital media and development.

GPUs are seen as play items, while CPUs are seen as work items. Work items make money, play items lose money.
That's why it's not wise to invest a large amount into play items. It's a loser every time. You can buy Nvidia stock for the $500 difference of the Titan X over the 1080, losing and gaining money at the same rate.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> bandwidth and ram are pretty much irrelevant, both cards have enough to feed themselves and not suffer VRAM shortage, past that there is no gain
> 
> it only has 40% more cores and 50% more ROPs, that does *not* translate into 40-50% direct performance increase at equal clocks


Bandwidth is certainly not irrelevant. At highest graphics (and probably 4k) they do scale almost linearly.
Case in point GTX 1070 and GTX 1080: https://tpucdn.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GeForce_GTX_1070/images/perfrel_3840_2160.png

Same amount of ROPs, GTX 1080 has 33% more cores, 25% more bandwidth and 3% better clocks. Those average around 20-25% more theoretical (gaming) performance which is exactly what we get.

I'd very much be surprised if we don't get 40-50% more performance per clock from Titan XP vs GTX 1080...


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ha-Nocri*
> 
> This is the new x80ti for NV and it's only $550 more than before


Why do people keep saying this? No. It's the new Titan. It has "Titan" written right on the product itself, so you can't mis-identify it. It even has a Titan price tag.

I'm reasonably certain that a 1080 Ti will come sooner or later. It'll be based on a GP102 and specced slightly below the Titan X (3328 cores, 208 texture units & 96 render output units - best guess) and probably priced at $800. It'll have "1080 Ti" written on it, so look out for that.


----------



## WorldExclusive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Why do people keep saying this? No. It's the new Titan. It has "Titan" written right on the product itself, so you can't mis-identify it. It even has a Titan price tag.
> 
> I'm reasonably certain that a 1080 Ti will come sooner or later. It'll be based on a GP102 and specced slightly below the Titan X (3328 cores, 208 texture units & 96 render output units - best guess) and probably priced at $800. It'll have "1080 Ti" written on it, so look out for that.


They don't need to cut it. NV only needs to do it disable the deep learning and compute features.
Cutting the card would be cutting their sales, because 980Ti owners will definitely not upgrade until Volta if it happens.


----------



## Klocek001

I just tried 11.5GHz in Witcher 3 and the fps went from 65 to 71 from the stock 10GHz, bandwidth matters a lot ona 64 ROP/2500 sp card. I figure it will matter on a 96 ROP/ 3500sp card too.


----------



## Darkpriest667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I'd rather have 12GB than 24GB and have it be ~$1400. I think every single person here would agree.
> 
> I can't think of any situation where a consumer would need 24GB of VRAM.
> Considering the first day I made my account here, and my very first post, I was infracted for posting without punctuation. You are wrong.
> 
> *You are EXPECTED to:
> Edit your posts for spelling and grammar. Overclock.net's usability depends on this.
> Use capitalization
> No excessive Internet jargon
> Use proper spelling, grammar and punctuation*
> http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service
> 
> It's right there in the current TOS, it's just not enforced anymore because the site has gotten so big.
> 
> I also already explained that I felt the criticism intel got for a $1700 processor was not the same as the hate for the Titan lineup:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1606550/twitter-jen-hsun-introduces-the-new-nvidia-titan-x/2500_50#post_25397111 (Link may not work unless your using 50 posts per page).
> 
> No one _really_ cared about Intel's $1700 processor because no one actually needed it for gaming. When I see someone posting on a gaming forum (Steam, etc) with a $1000+ processor, no one ever brings attention to it. However, If anyone claims they have a Titan, chances are he gets called out for wasting money. Amongst normal gamers, the Titan lineup has a very bad reputation much worse than any Intel lineup IMO. Does not make sense to me as a $1200 GPU makes way more sense than a $1200 processor for gamers.


Name one account that was banned for using incorrect grammar... You can't because it's against the TOS to talk about moderation. As a former staff member you should know better. Shame on you.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WorldExclusive*
> 
> They don't need to cut it. NV only needs to do it disable the deep learning and compute features.
> Cutting the card would be cutting their sales, because 980Ti owners will definitely not upgrade until Volta if it happens.


I'm not sure how viable it is to disable at the feature level, such as INT8. But I'm fairly certain they wouldn't release a GP102 without cutting some cuda cores and texture units. Besides, I think they'll do it because it's a way to use up GP102 chips that don't make the grade for Titan because they don't have 3584 viable cuda cores. Instead they can make money off those that still have 3328 working cores instead of throwing them in the trash.


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> And yet plenty of people like me swear by SLI/CF and don't have any issues at all (besides the outlier titles that don't support multi-GPU). I am using a 60Hz monitor it must be said and since my FPS is usually above that mark I guess its hard to say how 80-90+ FPS actually feels on my setup but all I do know is that with games like Crysis 3 I can only maintain 60 FPS by using SLI and I can promise you that it feels smoother (regardless of supposed microstutter) than just using a single Titan at 35 FPS...


If you are only between the 30-60fps area in SLI then it doesnt make a huge difference and dual card is better you are right. From my own time having SLI since the 6xx series, single card is definitely a far smoother experience than SLI is. Even single 980 felt far better than 2x 980's, but that is when you are up above 60Hz/60fps all the time. I too keep both my cards in for SLI because that is the only way things are playable on this 4K monitor I have now. Really though they are two different kinds of issues. One is straight up low framerate, and that is noticeable in all situations and feels really bad. The other issue is microstutter and such, and that is not really noticeable when you are already in lower framerate situations anyway.

I am going to upgrade to a new Titan X because I do want to go back to single card, and up till now there has been no GPU that could ever do 4K 60fps+ on its own with decent graphics settings. I wish I didnt have to buy such an over priced card, and I also wish the new Titan offered a substantial performance increase over the 1080. But such is life, and this is what we get. I normally dont like upgrading for something that will only get 30-35% more fps than my current setup, but having already switched to a 4k monitor, I just need the performance too much to try and wait a whole nother generation. Extrapolating performance from Polaris, I dont see Vega as being able to offer me the performance I need either in many of the games I still play, so Titan it is


----------



## Murlocke

If it's more than 35% faster than a 1080 (Stock to stock), call me very surprised. 40-50% better on paper rarely translates to 40-50% actual performance.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkpriest667*
> 
> Name one account that was banned for using incorrect grammar... You can't because it's against the TOS to talk about moderation. As a former staff member you should know better. Shame on you.


First of all, you think someone could recall those kind of details from 12 years ago? Poor grammar would result in infractions, if enough infractions pile up that results in a ban. In most case, banned users have multiple issues going on and poor grammar would be one of multiple reasons an account would be terminated.

Second of all, even if I could tell you accounts that would be an abuse of power. The site purposely does not list members as banned for a reason.

Third of all, it's not against the TOS to talk about moderation as long as it remains civil. It's only against the TOS to make threads/posts asking why you or someone else was interacted/banned or with the sole purpose of attacking a staff member.

http://www.overclock.net/a/terms-of-service

Now let's stop this extremely OT conversation.

EDIT: Just for clarity, I am not saying the current staff isn't doing a good job. I am saying the site has gotten so active that it is basically impossible to properly moderate it without things slipping through the cracks. People trolling in threads for products they have no interest in wouldn't fly when the site only had a couple thousand members total because a mod would see each and every post made. Now we have around 3k users on at any given time.


----------



## Ghoxt

So is it too much of a simplification to say that this Pascal Titan X $200 premium price is just for the O.C. from Maxwell's Titan X. I'm guessing what the Cost per FPS increase is. Cannot wait to see factual Benchmarks. Tomorrow i guess.








"But look, It was on Sale", as my significant other would say after coming home with some expensive clothes. I cannot say a word if I know what's good for me and my expenditures.



Of course this was based on the rumored 35% gaming FPS increase. Truly numbers can show all types of things when you bend them to your will right or wrong. It's all perception.


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WorldExclusive*
> 
> They don't need to cut it. NV only needs to do it disable the deep learning and compute features.
> Cutting the card would be cutting their sales, because 980Ti owners will definitely not upgrade until Volta if it happens.


so this new Titan X it has the same capabilities as the OG TITAN TITAN BLACK & TITAN Z? or are they different?

all this compute jargon confuses me lol


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> so this new Titan X it has the same capabilities as the OG TITAN TITAN BLACK & TITAN Z? or are they different?
> 
> all this compute jargon confuses me lol


The card is slightly cut down, so little that it should not matter to any consumer - about 5% real world difference over a full 24GB card with full CUDA cores. It's very likely we will never see a full pascal in the consumer market. It's all blown extremely out of proportion, if you want a very fast single GPU solution than this card is the one to get.

I am still thinking NVIDIA will not release a 1080Ti anytime soon, or at all, because there's no reason to until AMD gets back in the game. They already fill the $700 and $1200 brackets. The 1080Ti would likely sit at around $900-$1000, and if someone is willing to spend that then chances are they are willing to spend $1200 instead of waiting.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The card is slightly cut down, so little that it should not matter to any consumer - about 5% real world difference over a full 24GB card with full CUDA cores. It's very likely we will never see a full pascal in the consumer market. It's all blown extremely out of proportion, if you want a very fast single GPU solution than this card is the one to get.
> 
> I am still thinking NVIDIA will not release a 1080Ti anytime soon, or at all, because there's no reason to until AMD gets back in the game. They already fill the $700 and $1200 brackets. The 1080Ti would likely sit at around $900-$1000, and if someone is willing to spend that then chances are they are willing to spend $1200 instead of waiting.


pretty much

and if the rumors of 2017 Volta are true then there may not be any space ot time left for a 1080Ti


----------



## mcg75

Since these Titans are indeed cut down, maybe we'll be lucky and see a full chip appear as a 1080 Ti in the fall like a 780 Ti was.


----------



## Asus11

wonder what the new titan X wonders would feel like if they released a 1080ti for $849 3 months later? last nail in the coffin for Nvidia?

if they did would be just taking the absolute micky, I know they did it with the OG titan but the 1080 only released 2 months ago .. lol


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> wonder what the new titan X wonders would feel like if they released a 1080ti for $849 3 months later? last nail in the coffin for Nvidia?
> 
> if they did would be just taking the absolute micky, I know they did it with the OG titan but the 1080 only released 2 months ago .. lol


If it was roughly the same performance as the Titan, I don't think many would care. If it was a full pascal chip for $850, then I think many people would be very angry.

Like someone else stated, many people forget that the original Titan X was still slightly faster than the 980Ti. It was the best card for a long time, until the 1080 released.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> So is it too much of a simplification to say that this Pascal Titan X $200 premium price is just for the O.C. from Maxwell's Titan X. I'm guessing what the Cost per FPS increase is. Cannot wait to see factual Benchmarks. Tomorrow i guess.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "But look, It was on Sale", as my significant other would say after coming home with some expensive clothes. I cannot say a word if I know what's good for me and my expenditures.
> 
> 
> Of course this was based on the rumored 35% gaming FPS increase. Truly numbers can show all types of things when you bend them to your will right or wrong. It's all perception.


I would be interested to know where this 35% figure (compared to the last Titan x comes from). The official figure is 60%, while nvidia use tricks (for example they mean that that's the performance difference when everything is cranked up at 4k) they rarely straight up lie on promo stuff. Last time they did, they found trouble (GTX 970).


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> pretty much
> 
> and if the rumors of 2017 Volta are true then there may not be any space ot time left for a 1080Ti


There's always time for more money to be made. Would not surprise me if Nvidia releases another card or two before Volta.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> I would be interested to know where this 35% figure (compared to the last Titan x comes from). The official figure is 60%, while nvidia use tricks (for example they mean that that's the performance difference when everything is cranked up at 4k) they rarely straight up lie on promo stuff. Last time they did, they found trouble (GTX 970).


I think anyone claiming 30-35% increase are talking about 1080 > Titan XP.

If the Titan X was only 30-35% faster than the last Titan, that'd put it right at 1080 performance for $500 more.


----------



## Maintenance Bot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mcg75*
> 
> Since these Titans are indeed cut down, maybe we'll be lucky and see a full chip appear as a 1080 Ti in the fall like a 780 Ti was.


At the rate they have been releasing chips I will not be surprised when this happens.


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> You download something that refresh a website every few seconds and detects changes. As far as I've heard, the Titan releases 6am PDT on Tuesday but I have no idea where that figure came from.
> 
> I expect their site to very slow.


I think people just assume that because typically businesses open 9am, and most international companies that do things off US time use EST. So I guess 9am EST/6amPST is probably the highest likelihood of being true, though we dont know for sure of course.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Maintenance Bot*
> 
> At the rate they have been releasing chips I will not be surprised when this happens.


You live in the same town as me...









EDIT: And you just added that location a couple minutes ago. Creepy!


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> wonder what the new titan X wonders would feel like if they released a 1080ti for $849 3 months later? last nail in the coffin for Nvidia?
> 
> if they did would be just taking the absolute micky, I know they did it with the OG titan but the 1080 only released 2 months ago .. lol


Well, if Nvidia were to say anything under the circumstances you posit, they would point out that their target market for the Titan XP was compute, and not the gaming community. They did make the announcement at some obscure event at a university and not one of the consumer/gaming conferences.

What they won't say is that they've dangled the nice carrot on purpose so that they can also sell to those gamers with suitably deep pockets and if you bought one, it's your own fault and you have no recourse if and when they release 1080 Ti in a couple of month's time.

Besides. We know they do this. We all know they tempt us to double dip. We know to expect certain products. It happened last time with Maxwell. It happened the time before with Kepler. It goes with the territory.

I'm in the market myself. I'm looking for a GPU that will give me genuine 4K performance. I am very tempted by the Titan. If I were to buy one, and the 1080 TI were to come out just a few weeks later, I won't complain, because I knew the risk and went in with my eyes open. And the Titan XP is still an astonishingly fast card that meets my needs.


----------



## ChevChelios

even if 1080Ti releases it likely wont be faster than Titan XP and only in 2017 (I think Fall 2016 is unrealistic), so this Titan buyers will actually get a longer head start with it than the previous Titan X owners had (only a few months until 980Ti hit)

so again - best single GPU performance till 2017

worth $1200 ? you decide


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swolern*
> 
> So much wrong in this post.
> 
> Titans are in a different market? Nvidia is clouding your head. They are GeForce cards = gaming. The Titan X even had gimped DP. At least the new TX has compute.
> 40-50% > 1080 is a pipe dream. Not sure where you pulled that number from.
> No one cares about similar clock performance, only max clock performance.


I disagree with 3rd point. Max clock performance becomes critical when its hampered by a terrible reference cooler, and there is no other 3rd party AIB around.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> even if 1080Ti releases it likely wont be faster than Titan XP and only in 2017 (I think Fall 2016 is unrealistic), so this Titan buyers will actually get a longer head start with it than the previous Titan X owners had (only a few months until 980Ti hit)
> 
> so again - best single GPU performance till 2017
> 
> worth $1200 ? you decide


At this point in time, its not about a faster card that supersede the TX in 6-9 months. The problem with AMD lacking so much in high end performance, even if a faster card appears. it will be a new titan with price >$1400.

At that point, is it worth if you waited another 6-9 months for another major disappointment, or settle with a Ti that is almost definitely slower than TXP for a cost of $800+.

However all the point listed will be invalidate if AMD churn out something powerful in Q1 2017. And I means really smth powerful.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Yes we do not need 24gb den but why need to increase $200 and giving us half the memory. Its obviously trying cut cost every possible way but jacking the price up as high as possible.
> 
> If you want to charge that premium, make sure u give us the true premium luxury. Just saying.


The "true premium luxury" is the Quadro which will cost several thousand dollars. If you want the full 24GB, then feel free to pay the 3k$+ price tag that one will be.

Please note that I do not like the price either, but it's not as if 24GB Quadro will be anything close to Titan X's price. It will more than double it.


----------



## Maintenance Bot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> You live in the same town as me...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: And you just added that location a couple minutes ago. Creepy!


Haha, Yeah I live on the west side of town. Just updating the sig.


----------



## Fiercy

Anyone knows when it's gonna go on sale? I am currently thinking 3:00 am eastern.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swolern*
> 
> So much wrong in this post.
> 
> Titans are in a different market? Nvidia is clouding your head. They are GeForce cards = gaming. The Titan X even had gimped DP. At least the new TX has compute.
> 40-50% > 1080 is a pipe dream. Not sure where you pulled that number from.
> No one cares about similar clock performance, only max clock performance.


40% is possible. More TMUs, more cores, more bandwidth, so even though it probably won't clock as high clock for clock it will scale better as you OC it.


----------



## Silent Scone

So, what with being exceedingly greedy with this launch - what's the betting they haven't done anything to try and ensure the site doesn't go down in under 5 minutes.

Probably quite high.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> So, what with being exceedingly greedy with this launch - what's the betting they haven't done anything to try and ensure the site doesn't go down in under 5 minutes.
> 
> Probably quite high.


Actually a good point, since you only have one source to buy the cards from this could be quite problematic for buyers.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> *bandwidth and ram are pretty much irrelevant*, both cards have enough to feed themselves and not suffer VRAM shortage, past that there is no gain
> 
> it only has 40% more cores and 50% more ROPs, that does *not* translate into 40-50% direct performance increase at equal clocks


This is not always true. Better bandwidth can come into play at extreme resolutions such as 4k and especially VR over 6k with its high refresh rates and AA requirements.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> 40% is possible. More TMUs, more cores, more bandwidth, so even though it probably won't clock as high clock for clock it will scale better as you OC it.


IIRC GTX 1080's voltage is capped in a relative low value. That may be not so for Titan XP, thus actually allowing for even higher clocks given the right cooling.
Also last gen many of Titan Xs could well hit 1500+ clocks which was pretty much the range of the GTX 980/970s as well (very few surpassed the 1600 Mhz) mark.

So it's not impossible to expect this card to be a clocker as well despite the higher Core count...


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> IIRC GTX 1080's voltage is capped in a relative low value. That may be not so for Titan XP, thus actually allowing for even higher clocks given the right cooling.
> Also last gen many of Titan Xs could well hit 1500+ clocks which was pretty much the range of the GTX 980/970s as well (very few surpassed the 1600 Mhz) mark.
> 
> So it's not impossible to expect this card to be a clocker as well despite the higher Core count...


Voltage cap doesnt really mean anything as people are not gaining any clock speed with higher voltage on anything but subzero cooling.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Why are you expecting it to OC a lot? I would be pleasantly surprised if it can clock higher than the 1080s.


I'd be pleasantly surprised if it can manage >2GHz on air.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> I just tried 11.5GHz in Witcher 3 and the fps went from 65 to 71 from the stock 10GHz, bandwidth matters a lot ona 64 ROP/2500 sp card. I figure it will matter on a 96 ROP/ 3500sp card too.


Anandtech seems to have gotten quite different results:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> When you guys say "bandwidth", do you mean "memory bandwidth"? Because Pascal (or GP104 at least) barely responds to memory bandwidth improvements:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10325/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-and-1070-founders-edition-review/31


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EniGma1987*
> 
> Voltage cap doesnt really mean anything as people are not gaining any clock speed with higher voltage on anything but subzero cooling.


I would think water would benefit somewhat too ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I'd be pleasantly surprised if it can manage >2GHz on air.


It was relatively routinE for Titan X to do 1500+ which was close to the limit of maxwell on air/water anyway. What makes you think that Titan XP won't manage equally well? Remember those are binned chips, those not doing too well would probably end up 1080tis


----------



## DADDYDC650

Another lawsuit against Nvidia. This time in regards to the GTX 980/900 series. Like I said before, perhaps this is why they jacked up prices?








https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/4vn1ax/another_class_action_lawsuit_980/


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> It was relatively routinE for Titan X to do 1500+ which was close to the limit of maxwell on air/water anyway. What makes you think that Titan XP won't manage equally well? *Remember those are binned chips,* those not doing too well would probably end up 1080tis


I don't think Titan XP uses binned chips, unless by binned you meant "failed Quadro specs".









The absolute best 1080s top out at around 2200 on air or water, which is 27% OC if we use nVidia's listed boost clock of 1733. Titan XP's listed boost clock is 1513 MHz, and 27% over that is 1922 MHz.

Plus the stock blower isn't exactly breaking any records when it comes to performance.


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Another lawsuit against Nvidia. This time in regards to the GTX 980/900 series. Like I said before, perhaps this is why they jacked up prices?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/4vn1ax/another_class_action_lawsuit_980/


So I'm eligible 3 times for buying a 970, 980 and a 980Ti? Can I claim this as a European, it doesn't mention anywhere.....


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> I would think water would benefit somewhat too ...


All I have seen is people getting the same results as air cooling just at lower temps. All the professional overclockers are saying the same thing, water cooling adds no MHz gain on Pascal. People that have done the hardmod for voltage adjustment aren't getting more than a few MHz extra at best.
But then you have people on LN2 like Kingpin getting 2.8GHz







So the potential is there. Maybe there are just a lot of dud cards out in the wild and that is contributing to the bad clocking on water problems.


----------



## magnek

https://xdevs.com/guide/pascal_oc/
Quote:


> Voltage scaling and "1.25V limit"
> There were some rumors spreading wildly these days regarding "1.25V limitation" or whatever on modified GTX 1080 cards, which requires here few words to explain.
> 
> Hardware itself is well capable of getting to that and above voltage output for GPU core, but GP104 chip itself now more sensitive to voltage, than even previous Maxwell generation. Part of it due to thinner physical process, other part due to challenges removing heat from all those tightly packed 7.2B transistors quick enough from 21% less surface area. Those overclockers who did 2200+ MHz on GTX 980 Ti's are well aware of all things required to achieve those high clocks. Same principle applies to Pascal generation. So if you can manage to keep GPU cooled well and have good voltage delivery to it, you indeed can push higher voltages. Cards cooled by liquid nitrogen during this guide testwork were able to run 1.35-1.4V, reaching speeds over 2500 MHz.
> 
> Fact that GTX 1080's capable of reaching 2.1GHz on aircooling without any modifications confuse lot of people, making them to think that these chips can overclock well past 3GHz on liquid nitrogen cooling. But it's still silicon, with similar architecture, so reality is bit sour. Yes, it allow to get good performance without extreme cooling, but hides the fact that LN2-cooled 980Ti is still much faster than overclocked GTX 1080 due to more shader cores and better CPC performance.
> 
> *This also brings and answer to the question if overvolting can help OC on aircooling or watercooling. It does not help, due to thermal, which get only worse.* Higher temperature render stability and performance decrease. GPU literally overheats and cannot run high frequency anymore, even though temperature is below specified maximum temperature +94°C. Think of it as temperature to frequency dependency, all the way down from +94°C to -196°C, with slope around 100MHz every 50°C. So just like in 980/980Ti/TitanX case, over-voltage on aircooling/watercooling is not recommended, as it gains little if any performance improvement.
> 
> Don't get this message wrong, as GTX 1080/1070 are still great cards for daily gaming/content creation and VR experience. They are fast, not power hungry, moderately cool. The only catch is that overclocking them is not as fun and rewarding as it was on previous generations, even considering all tricks involved to get Maxwell clock high.
> 
> As usual, any feedback and questions are appreciated. Feel free to share link to this guide, but keep links and references intact, as guide likely to be updated in future.


----------



## Ghoxt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> I would be interested to know where this 35% figure (compared to the last Titan x comes from). The official figure is 60%, while nvidia use tricks (for example they mean that that's the performance difference when everything is cranked up at 4k) they rarely straight up lie on promo stuff. Last time they did, they found trouble (GTX 970).


Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I think anyone claiming 30-35% increase are talking about 1080 > Titan XP.
> 
> If the Titan X was only 30-35% faster than the last Titan, that'd put it right at 1080 performance for $500 more.


Correct I completely made a mistake on the comparison. Good catch both of you. when I compare 60% titan X to Titan XP I come up with $7.5 per FPS in the hypothetical scenario. Still fluff tho and doesn't mean anything.


----------



## EniGma1987

edit, nevermind. bad product page


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I don't think Titan XP uses binned chips, unless by binned you meant "failed Quadro specs".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The absolute best 1080s top out at around 2200 on air or water, which is 27% OC if we use nVidia's listed boost clock of 1733. Titan XP's listed boost clock is 1513 MHz, and 27% over that is 1922 MHz.
> 
> Plus the stock blower isn't exactly breaking any records when it comes to performance.


Percentage wise Tis/Titans always overclock better than non Titans. The card you have in your signature is 42% over boost while the best of 980s were around 30% over boost.

So if the 1080s can achieve 27% over boost it's far from a stretch to expect a Titan to achieve 34% over boost (2050Mhz) in fact it's almost expected...


----------



## magnek

Actually in-game boost clocks of 980 Ti and 980 were very comparable. Going by Anandtech's numbers, 980 Ti averaged 1156 across 10 games, while 980 averaged 1190 across 8 games.

It was also easier and more common for 980 to hit 1550 than it was for 980 Ti. So overall OC headroom was a wash.

Besides, I said >2GHz *on air* ie on that underpowered stock blower. I mean sure, if you don't mind running 100% fan 24/7 then it's possible.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Actually in-game boost clocks of 980 Ti and 980 were very comparable. Going by Anandtech's numbers, 980 Ti averaged 1156 across 10 games, while 980 averaged 1190 across 8 games.
> 
> It was also easier and more common for 980 to hit 1550 than it was for 980 Ti. So overall OC headroom was a wash.
> 
> Besides, I said >2GHz *on air* ie on that underpowered stock blower. I mean sure, if you don't mind running 100% fan 24/7 then it's possible.


See? We don't know Titan XP's actual clocks during gaming, but we do know its stated boost clock over which a 33% increase is far from being far fetched even with its ... leaf blower. On water, I'm sure it will hit even the 2100 Mhz mark...

Oh well, it's just a few hours; better wait ... shall we?


----------



## DNMock

Considering the stock cooling solution on the XP is probably the same as the 1080 and will be producing a lot more heat (Don't forget the extra memory modules and VRM's that need to be cooled), I wouldn't be surprised at all if the XP clock and boost speeds out the box have more to do with being thermally limited than anything else.

My bet is on a watercooled XP reaching similar O/C numbers to a 1080 with the fan set at 100% while the air cooled variant of the XP being 200-300 Mhz lower.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> Considering the stock cooling solution on the XP is probably the same as the 1080 and will be producing a lot more heat (Don't forget the extra memory modules and VRM's that need to be cooled), I wouldn't be surprised at all if the XP clock and boost speeds out the box have more to do with being thermally limited than anything else.
> 
> My bet is on a watercooled XP reaching similar O/C numbers to a 1080 with the fan set at 100% while the air cooled variant of the XP being 200-300 Mhz lower.


That would be a first though. I could hit with the 1500 Mhz with Titan X on its tinky cooler. All I had to was to have a well ventilated case.

This will be the first Titan to overclock so far less than a non-Titan on air (if what you say is correct), it would be very surprising indeed, especially it it was meant to happen to the most expensive Titan ever produced...


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> Considering the stock cooling solution on the XP is probably the same as the 1080 and will be producing a lot more heat (Don't forget the extra memory modules and VRM's that need to be cooled), I wouldn't be surprised at all if the XP clock and boost speeds out the box have more to do with being thermally limited than anything else.
> 
> My bet is on a watercooled XP reaching similar O/C numbers to a 1080 with the fan set at 100% while the air cooled variant of the XP being 200-300 Mhz lower.


Or Nvidia trying to keep within 250w TDP.


----------



## Murlocke

Seriously nothing yet? This comes out tomorrow!

What kind of company releases a $1200 product with no advertisement, exclusive to their site, and no reviews on actual performance. You'd think NVIDIA would post some exclusive benchmarks across a few games or something. This smells so fishy.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> See? We don't know Titan XP's actual clocks during gaming, but we do know its stated boost clock over which a 33% increase is far from being far fetched even with its ... leaf blower. On water, I'm sure it will hit even the 2100 Mhz mark...
> 
> Oh well, it's just a few hours; better wait ... shall we?


I'm simply going by the numbers we have atm. If stock Titan XP boosts to the same ~1800-1900 in-game average clocks that 1080 achieves, then yes it will probably end up having the same ceiling. Although I'd like to note that even 1800 is already about 20% over the listed 1513 boost clock. So nVidia is simply listing a nonsense number if that was indeed the case.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Or Nvidia trying to keep within 250w TDP.


Hence my comment that 2GHz on that dinky blower is going to be tough unless 100% fan.


----------



## CallsignVega

I wonder what demand will be like tomorrow morning. Quick poll, who's getting it?

I'm in for two. I know I88Bastard is in for at least one. Reply with how many you plan on getting, if any at all.


----------



## stefxyz

1


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I wonder what demand will be like tomorrow morning. Quick poll, who's getting it?
> 
> I'm in for two. I know I88Bastard is in for at least one. Reply with how many you plan on getting, if any at all.


Probably 2, but no tomorrow. Probably wait til the 2nd batch is out since the EK blocks won't be ready for another few weeks anyway.


----------



## Seyumi

1 now. 2 in a few months once I beat all my games that don't support SLI. Will put on EVGA Hybrid AIO's Evga_Jacob confirmed they're making for the Titan XP's.

Edit: I would buy 2 right away but I have a feeling I'm going to get burned by this generation of Titan more than any other with all this shady stuff going with it already well speculated in this thread. There's a chance they may release a full chip in a few months then I'm at least screwed on 1 card instead of 2.


----------



## Murlocke

I'd be surprised if they sell out Day 1 given the fact it's gonna be a blind buy for $1200, with no advertisement. I bet they sell out Day 2. I'm in for 1 though, overnighting it because what's another $32 on top of $1284.

At this point I wouldn't be surprised if they don't even launch tomorrow.


----------



## Ferreal

I'll be getting one. I will get another one when EK comes out with the waterblocks.

It will be a huge upgrade over my Titan blacks.


----------



## sammkv

where are the reviews for this $1200 beast card


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sammkv*
> 
> where are the reviews for this $1200 beast card


NDA ... which lifts tomorrow whereupon we'll be hip deep in reviews.


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I don't think Titan XP uses binned chips, unless by binned you meant "failed Quadro specs".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The absolute best 1080s top out at around 2200 on air or water, which is 27% OC if we use nVidia's listed boost clock of 1733. Titan XP's listed boost clock is 1513 MHz, and 27% over that is 1922 MHz.
> 
> Plus the stock blower isn't exactly breaking any records when it comes to performance.


I don't think being in the bottom bin was what they meant, it is funny when the $1200 card is the cheap "a way to use failed chips" card.









You know the Titan X is only clocked at 1513 MHz to keep it below the 250W TDP, why do you keep bringing it up it the context of maximum overclock?

I assume the absolute best Titans will top out at around 2150 MHz, a bit below the absolute best 1080s. Their relative boost clocks aren't relevant to this question. These Titan's will need to be underwater or at 100% fan at minimum, of course.


----------



## carlhil2

Benches? we don't need no stinking benches. at $1200 bearing the "Titan" brand, it better be as fast as advertised, or, these cards would be returned as fast as they were bought. so, I am looking around 60% faster than an OG TX in gaming situations....I mean, the 1060/1070 and 1080 has dropped, we should have an idea what to expect as far as performance goes...just saying...


----------



## Yuhfhrh

I'll also be in for one.


----------



## x3sphere

I'm not sure yet but I'll probably cave and get one when orders go up


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I'd be surprised if they sell out Day 1 given the fact it's gonna be a blind buy for $1200, with no advertisement. I bet they sell out Day 2. I'm in for 1 though, overnighting it because what's another $32 on top of $1284.
> 
> At this point I wouldn't be surprised if they don't even launch tomorrow.


I think they'll sell out even if it's only due to artificially limiting availability/stock.


----------



## D749

I was hoping to see some more info on the card prior to release, but if the NDA is the same day as release so much for that.

I'll be picking up at least 1, maybe 2.


----------



## meson1

I'm in no rush for one. I'll wait at least until the EKWB waterblock for it is out. But my build needs a few other components too. So I might as well take my time.


----------



## Maintenance Bot

Plan on getting 1 here.


----------



## Difunto

yea am planning on getting one tomorrow


----------



## renejr902

I will getting 1


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I wonder what demand will be like tomorrow morning. Quick poll, who's getting it?
> 
> I'm in for two. I know I88Bastard is in for at least one. Reply with how many you plan on getting, if any at all.


Tomorrow morning? What time by your count? I was under the impression 9:30 central, which by my clock is 15:30. Would be handy to know lol.


----------



## Nunzi

Going to wait & see what the numbers look like first !


----------



## lyang238

I'll probably get one just to test it out against my 1080. If it's even 30% faster I'll cave and keep it. Have a Hybrid cooler on the way as well that I will see if that works on it to keep temps manageable.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I wonder what demand will be like tomorrow morning. Quick poll, who's getting it?
> 
> I'm in for two. I know I88Bastard is in for at least one. Reply with how many you plan on getting, if any at all.


Not me, i'm not buying them. Not that I need to upgrade to anything anyway....

I just have a bad feeling about all this, and i'm almost convinced something else is coming.


----------



## ChevChelios

lol suddenly everyone here is buying 1 or 2 of these


----------



## bl4ckdot

I should get one. Waiting on the reviews though.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> I should get one. Waiting on the reviews though.


Gotta be honest we pretty much can guess what (we) are getting with the new Titan X.

how much is it gonna be in France? 1200€ or more?


----------



## Falknir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I wonder what demand will be like tomorrow morning. Quick poll, who's getting it?
> 
> I'm in for two. I know I88Bastard is in for at least one. Reply with how many you plan on getting, if any at all.


I might pickup two, but might end up waiting to see some numbers. On that fence knowing i'll probably get them regardless.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

I sold two of my three 980ti so i might get at least one, maybe two. Haven't decided yet honestly.


----------



## xTesla1856

Hope nV will eventually let the retailers sell them. This card is actually impossible to obtain in Switzerland. Oh well, since they don't want my money, might as well wait for Vega


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *meson1*
> 
> Why do people keep saying this? No. It's the new Titan. It has "Titan" written right on the product itself, so you can't mis-identify it. It even has a Titan price tag.
> 
> I'm reasonably certain that a 1080 Ti will come sooner or later. It'll be based on a GP102 and specced slightly below the Titan X (3328 cores, 208 texture units & 96 render output units - best guess) and probably priced at $800. It'll have "1080 Ti" written on it, so look out for that.


Because it is a 1080Ti with the Titan name stamped on it. This Titan only has 50% more ram than the 1080. You know like the previous x80Ti's had over the X80's.

Nvidia now knows what to do next generation. Just drop the x80 card and call it a Titan. You know since it will have the Titan name, it must be a Titan.


----------



## besthijacker

Any idea what time they will go on sale?


----------



## kingduqc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I wonder what demand will be like tomorrow morning. Quick poll, who's getting it?
> 
> I'm in for two. I know I88Bastard is in for at least one. Reply with how many you plan on getting, if any at all.


Bought a classy 980ti to sli with my current G1. Kinda wanted to experience sli. Canadian prices are just out of this world these days. 400$ For a 8gb 480, are you kidding me? 1080s are 1000$ so I expect titans to be around 1500-1600 CAD..


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTesla1856*
> 
> Hope nV will eventually let the retailers sell them. This card is actually impossible to obtain in Switzerland. Oh well, since they don't want my money, might as well wait for Vega


NVIDIA was pretty clear that this would only be sold via their store. Lately they've been pretty upfront with what is exclusive and what isn't. Can you get someone in the US to pick one up for you?


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> NVIDIA was pretty clear that this would only be sold via their store. Lately they've been pretty upfront with what is exclusive and what isn't. Can you get someone in the US to pick one up for you?


I could, but then we delve in to the shadow realm that is international shipping, taxes and custmos duties. So this 1200$ Titan might as well be a 1800$ card for me


----------



## stefxyz

deleted


----------



## bee144

I'm located in the US. Lets say I get my hands on one or two of these cards tomorrow but then reviews come out and show this to be an awful buy.

Can anyone find a section on the geforce store that talks about a return policy? Also a warranty policy? I can't find either of the two.


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> I'm located in the US. Lets say I get my hands on one or two of these cards tomorrow but then reviews come out and show this to be an awful buy.
> 
> Can anyone find a section on the geforce store that talks about a return policy? Also a warranty policy? I can't find either of the two.


http://store.nvidia.com/store?Action=DisplayReturnAndCancellationsPage&Locale=en_US&SiteID=nvidia
Quote:


> We offer a 30-day money back guarantee for all products including Gear Store apparel.
> Refunds are not available for GeForce NOW memberships, but you can cancel your membership at any time. You will continue to have access to GeForce NOW until the end of your current billing cycle. You can cancel your membership on your SHIELD device under GeForce NOW > Settings > Billing.


Seems reasonable enough... don't know about the warranty though.


----------



## DNMock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> I'm located in the US. Lets say I get my hands on one or two of these cards tomorrow but then reviews come out and show this to be an awful buy.
> 
> Can anyone find a section on the geforce store that talks about a return policy? Also a warranty policy? I can't find either of the two.


I believe you have 30 days to return them no questions asked.


----------



## robert0507

Don't get me wrong the card looks like a good card but Nvidia is trying to sell us a gtx 980(in comparison) for gtx titan X prices. I have gtx titan X with the gm200 chip. I'm going to wait for p100 for a real Titan chipset. 1200$ is just to much. When AMD releases vega watch them drop a p100 gpu I can guarantee it. I'll wait for that one.


----------



## bl4ckdot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> Gotta be honest we pretty much can guess what (we) are getting with the new Titan X.
> 
> how much is it gonna be in France? 1200€ or more?


I wish. Would be happy if it is 1300€


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robert0507*
> 
> Don't get me wrong the card looks like a good card but Nvidia is trying to sell us a gtx 980(in comparison) for gtx titan X prices. I have gtx titan X with the gm200 chip. I'm going to wait for p100 for a real Titan chipset. 1200$ is just to much. When AMD releases vega watch them drop a p100 gpu I can guarantee it. I'll wait for that one.


I don't think it'll happen. You do realize the P100 would probably be worse off than a GP102 for gaming? The extra double precision capability wouldn't do anything for gaming and take up more space on the chip, in the end you'd be getting same amount of cores and clocks would probably be lower.

What you might get is a full GP102 but the real word difference from the shaved off cores is only going to be like 4-5%. If you want to wait for that, go ahead, but I think it'll take like 6 months before it comes out and by then Volta will be closer to release.


----------



## Maintenance Bot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> I'm located in the US. Lets say I get my hands on one or two of these cards tomorrow but then reviews come out and show this to be an awful buy.
> 
> Can anyone find a section on the geforce store that talks about a return policy? Also a warranty policy? I can't find either of the two.


Warranty info https://www.nvidia.com/object/manufacturer_warranty.html


----------



## Benny89

I will wait for full chip or 1080Ti. Dissapointed to see Titan at this price point not getting full chip.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> I believe you have 30 days to return them no questions asked.


In4 4 then. Will bench them hard then mine for 20 days before returning them for "coil whine".


----------



## Asmodian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robert0507*
> 
> Don't get me wrong the card looks like a good card but Nvidia is trying to sell us a gtx 980(in comparison) for gtx titan X prices. I have gtx titan X with the gm200 chip. I'm going to wait for p100 for a real Titan chipset. 1200$ is just to much. When AMD releases vega watch them drop a p100 gpu I can guarantee it. I'll wait for that one.


P100 has 0 ROPs, that would be pretty bad as a video card. Nvidia will need to wait for Volta.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Because it is a 1080Ti with the Titan name stamped on it. This Titan only has 50% more ram than the 1080. You know like the previous x80Ti's had over the X80's.
> 
> Nvidia now knows what to do next generation. Just drop the x80 card and call it a Titan. You know since it will have the Titan name, it must be a Titan.


Rinse.............Repeat..............Rinse.............Repeat.........................Thanks for sharing what we've heard from you 100 times in this thread. In other news a guy with a 1070 won't be buying a $1200 flagship gpu. Mind Blown.........


----------



## SuperZan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Rinse.............Repeat..............Rinse.............Repeat.........................Thanks for sharing what we've heard from you 100 times in this thread. In other news a guy with a 1070 won't be buying a $1200 flagship gpu. Mind Blown.........


IIRC, he's owned flagships before. I know that I have. I've got a 1070 right now because it made the most sense for my needs, That doesn't mean a killer flagship won't get my money again. I was keeping an eye on Pascal Titan as it was on my short list along with Vega as my next two cards along with moving towards 120Hz 4k. Unfortunately Titan XP underwhelms a bit IMHO and tacking $200 on top does nothing for my enthusiasm. Still interested in the card, could even pick up a couple if Vega ultimately disappoints. You don't have to be pounding F5 on launch day to be interested in a card.

Also, based on your replies in this thread, I feel you could use this:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Rinse.............Repeat..............Rinse.............Repeat.........................Thanks for sharing what we've heard from you 100 times in this thread. In other news a guy with a 1070 won't be buying a $1200 flagship gpu. Mind Blown.........


Funny you should say that, I have a 1070 in one of my machines currently and a 970 in the other. The system with the 970 has just been upgraded with a 4k TV and now obviously needs a GPU upgrade. My choices are to move that 1070 to the system with the 970 and add a 2nd one or just get a Titan X (or leave the 1070 where it is and replace the 970 with 1080 SLI). I was hoping we would've seen some kind of gaming-related leak by now, hate to buy one tomorrow AM to make sure I get one while they're still available only to find out that it can't OC well due to power limitations, thus rendering this card nowhere near as fast as 1080 for 4k in many games. I can't recall a single launch in GPU history that didn't have any gaming-related leaks this close to D-Day. Very concerning.


----------



## DNMock

Dear AMD:

I am about to do something stupid that I will probably end up regretting. Only you can save me from myself by leaking Vega specs and a surprise early release date.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DNMock*
> 
> Dear AMD:
> 
> I am about to do something stupid that I will probably end up regretting. Only you can save me from myself by leaking Vega specs and a surprise early release date.


Yeah... I stopped saying that so many years ago I lost track. Sad.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Funny you should say that, I have a 1070 in one of my machines currently and a 970 in the other. The system with the 970 has just been upgraded with a 4k TV and now obviously needs a GPU upgrade. My choices are to move that 1070 to the system with the 970 and add a 2nd one or just get a Titan X (or leave the 1070 where it is and replace the 970 with 1080 SLI). I was hoping we would've seen some kind of gaming-related leak by now, hate to buy one tomorrow AM to make sure I get one while they're still available only to find out that it can't OC well due to power limitations, *thus rendering this card nowhere near as fast as 1080 for 4k in many games.* I can't recall a single launch in GPU history that didn't have any gaming-related leaks this close to D-Day. Very concerning.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*


Typo, should read 1080 SLI.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> I wish. Would be happy if it is 1300€


you'd be happy to pay 1300€ for a single GPU?

if you don't mind me asking how much is 1300€ for you and do you use this GPU for anything besides gaming?


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Typo, should read 1080 SLI.


I doubt it will achieve 1080 SLI numbers. Although many SLI haters on this forum will tell you otherwise SLI at least in 2-way is still very strong and provides an excellent gaming experience. I'm personally waiting on real game benchmarks. If this card overclocked can beat my Lightnings at their current clocks in SLI by 20-25% I'm game for at least one. I doubt this happens though. I'll likely be holding out hope for Lightning 1080Ti's around the $750-800 range that will beat my current setup by 40-50%. That's then worth the upgrade.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Rinse.............Repeat..............Rinse.............Repeat.........................Thanks for sharing what we've heard from you 100 times in this thread. In other news a guy with a 1070 won't be buying a $1200 flagship gpu. Mind Blown.........


Does common sense bother you? Because if he's repeating what he said constantly I see nothing wrong with a little common sense around, considering the amount of snowflaking here.

And guess what? He have owned a flagship before, the other guy have owned a flagship before, I'm currently on a previous gen flagship in my main system, what do we have in common? A GTX 1070, the only card with reasonable market position that doesn't insult the people capable of using their brains enough to realize that 2+2= 4 not 4,000.

Besides, this is no place for E-peen massages, go get rank 500 in Overwatch if you want others to behold yours, having a Titan X shows nothing other than an excess of cash, lack of reasoning, or both.


----------



## looniam

i now need to clean diet cola off my screen. .


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Maintenance Bot*
> 
> Warranty info https://www.nvidia.com/object/manufacturer_warranty.html


This sucks for resale: "This warranty applies only to the original purchases of the Warranted Products from a retailer, mail order operation, or on-line retail store; this warranty will not extend to any person that acquires a Warranted Product on a used basis." One reason I generally stick with EVGA.

Two EVGA GTX 1080 FE going up on eBay this week.









My second CL case is going to two freaking 2 months to get to me. I want to start my new build already!!!


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dargonplay*
> 
> And guess what? He have owned a flagship before, the other guy have owned a flagship before, I'm currently on a previous gen flagship in my main system, what do we have in common? A GTX 1070, the only card with reasonable market position that doesn't insult the people capable of using their brains enough to realize that 2+2= 4 not 4,000.


What is so bad about people buying products that would bring them enjoyment? I fail to see how that shows that they are lacking in sense since titan x is the most powerful single gpu. The titan X is not a strictly pointless product, it have advantages other products dont offer.

It is one thing to disagree with their decision, is another to outright insult them. This is overclock.net, not price vs performance.net.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robert0507*
> 
> Don't get me wrong the card looks like a good card but Nvidia is trying to sell us a gtx 980(in comparison) for gtx titan X prices. I have gtx titan X with the gm200 chip. I'm going to wait for p100 for a real Titan chipset. 1200$ is just to much. When AMD releases vega watch them drop a p100 gpu I can guarantee it. I'll wait for that one.


The gp100 does not have any render output units. It is physically impossible to use gp100 for a GPU product. It can only be used for compute and is only available in Nvidia's Tesla line.

Citation: Wikipedia: Pascal (microarchitecture)


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> What is so bad about people buying products that would bring them enjoyment? I fail to see how that shows that they are lacking in sense.....
> 
> It is one thing to disagree with their decision, is another to outright insult them.


Some people like him just have to piss in the punch bowl. Shows an extreme amount of insecurity on his part, not to mention arrogance, to think he knows better than others about what to do with their money. Wonder if he stands on street corners shouting at BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari, etc owners doing the same thing. Or people who buy beachfront property, or those who want to travel the globe, etc.

Maybe one day he'll grow up and move out of mom's basement and figure out there's nothing wrong with living a little and taking some risks.

People have the right to spend their money on whatever the hell it is they want to spend it on. If they want to spend it on a graphics card, that's their business. Not his. And if he can't let it go -- which after 30+ posts on this thread the last couple of days it appears he can't -- then that shows a problem with his own character and not others'. It reaks of insecurity and immaturity.


----------



## Dargonplay

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> What is so bad about people buying products that would bring them enjoyment? I fail to see how that shows that they are lacking in sense since titan x is the most powerful single gpu.
> It is one thing to disagree with their decision, is another to outright insult them.


I think you missed the point.

It was an argument against using the Titan X as an E-Peen enlargement treatment.


----------



## Z0eff

http://videocardz.com/62738/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-3dmark-performance

About as expected?


----------



## besthijacker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> http://videocardz.com/62738/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-3dmark-performance
> 
> About as expected?


lol.


----------



## ChevChelios

40-50% ?


----------



## bl4ckdot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> you'd be happy to pay 1300€ for a single GPU?
> 
> if you don't mind me asking how much is 1300€ for you and do you use this GPU for anything besides gaming?


I meant that I expect the price to be higher than 1300€ sadly. I recently had a nice income of money so it's not that big of a deal.
That doesn't mean I dont have some expectations : at least 30k+ in FS with OC and GeForce to name a few of them. It will be a nice boost coming from 22K.

wait and see as they say

Edit : well RIP 30K FS.


----------



## xTesla1856

About 14% in FS Extreme over an overclocked 1080? Let's hope those graphs are fake


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTesla1856*
> 
> About 14% in FS Extreme over an overclocked 1080? Let's hope those graphs are fake


close to 30% over stock

you compare _stock to stock_

but still pretty meh for $550 extra


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> http://videocardz.com/62738/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-3dmark-performance
> 
> About as expected?


That doesn't seem right to me, something is off. maybe that's why no reviews ?

Edit: was looking at 1080oc. it's okayish then, because low clocks.


----------



## ChevChelios

30% is exactly how it should have been expected just by looking at specs

for more it would need those 3800+ shaders


----------



## Somasonic

So stock vs stock about 50% faster than a 980 Ti?


----------



## x3sphere

FS Ultra results over stock 1080 are nearly 30%, 29.7% to be exact

Dunno why the FS performance results are much lower, CPU bottleneck?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Somasonic*
> 
> So stock vs stock about 50% faster than a 980 Ti?


no, should be 60%+ over a stock 980Ti (stock 1080 is ~25-30% above stock 980Ti and this is 30% faster than 1080 in 4K)

but I mean a real stock 980Ti, that doesnt boost to 1300-1350 by itself

works out to ~55-60% over Titan X 1


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> no, should be 60%+ over a stock 980Ti (stock 1080 is ~25-30% above stock 980Ti and this is 30% faster than 1080 in 4K)
> 
> but I mean a real stock 980Ti, that doesnt boost to 1300-1350 by itself
> 
> works out to ~55-60% over Titan X 1


I get 4421 with a +150mhz core on my Titan X. The new Titan gets 6532 at stock. 60% increase means the card needs to get 7073 when OCed. I think that will be easily achieveable, but due to these low numbers the increase seems pretty MEH.


----------



## nyxagamemnon

Don't forget the Titan XP is running at 1.8ghz in those benchmarks. Not 1500.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyxagamemnon*
> 
> Don't forget the Titan XP is running at 1.8ghz in those benchmarks. Not 1500.


I can't find them claiming that anywhere. Where are you getting that info from?

If that is indeed a +300mhz OC then it explains why NVIDIA is keeping it under wraps, because that means it's barely faster than a 1080. There's no way that's the case given the specs.


----------



## nyxagamemnon

Just read the paragraph under the chart

GeForce GTX 1080, GTX 1070 and GTX 1060 scores are from my existing and upcoming reviews. Of course all values are showing graphics scores. It's also worth noting that core clock of TITAN X boosts up to 1.8 GHz in 3DMark.

So what can we see on this chart? Well, it may now explain why GTX 1060 is lacking SLI finger. Two overclocked GTX 1060 cards would probably be faster than TITAN X in synthetics, while being 2.4 times cheaper.

NVIDIA TITAN X has ~1.3x performance of stock GTX 1080 and 1.13x of overclocked GTX 1080. It's almost 1.5 times faster than GTX 1070 and 1.87x faster than overclocked GTX 1060.

TITAN X goes on sale tomorrow, but no one really knows how fast is it. Does NVIDIA really expect people to pay 1200 USD without knowing what they are paying for?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyxagamemnon*
> 
> Just read the paragraph under the chart
> 
> GeForce GTX 1080, GTX 1070 and GTX 1060 scores are from my existing and upcoming reviews. Of course all values are showing graphics scores. It's also worth noting that core clock of TITAN X boosts up to 1.8 GHz in 3DMark.
> 
> So what can we see on this chart? Well, it may now explain why GTX 1060 is lacking SLI finger. Two overclocked GTX 1060 cards would probably be faster than TITAN X in synthetics, while being 2.4 times cheaper.
> 
> NVIDIA TITAN X has ~1.3x performance of stock GTX 1080 and 1.13x of overclocked GTX 1080. It's almost 1.5 times faster than GTX 1070 and 1.87x faster than overclocked GTX 1060.
> 
> TITAN X goes on sale tomorrow, but no one really knows how fast is it. Does NVIDIA really expect people to pay 1200 USD without knowing what they are paying for?


Boost 1.8 is still stock, and boost is usually just that...a boost. The card probably wasn't running a steady 1.8 during the benchmark. The 1080 boosts too, so it's fair game IMO.

If the Titan boosts to 1.8 at stock, it'll still OC further.


----------



## ChevChelios

stock 1080 also boosts close to ~1800 in FS

so again - its 30% faster at 4K than a 1080 at equal stock 1800 clocks for both .. thats exactly how it should be from the specs

if theres something to be dissapointed at - it would be at only 3500+ cores instead of 3800 or even more

but 30% is in line

Quote:


> If the Titan boosts to 1.8, it likely still more headroom to OC further.


it will go to 2050-2100 under water


----------



## nyxagamemnon

It should be the same deal as the 980 980ti except instead of a $150 price difference now it's more like 500-600. Basically if you can get two evga acx 1080's that are $619 vs 1tx.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> Some people like him just have to piss in the punch bowl. Shows an extreme amount of insecurity on his part, not to mention arrogance, to think he knows better than others about what to do with their money. Wonder if he stands on street corners shouting at BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari, etc owners doing the same thing. Or people who buy beachfront property, or those who want to travel the globe, etc.
> 
> Maybe one day he'll grow up and move out of mom's basement and figure out there's nothing wrong with living a little and taking some risks.
> 
> People have the right to spend their money on whatever the hell it is they want to spend it on. If they want to spend it on a graphics card, that's their business. Not his. And if he can't let it go -- which after 30+ posts on this thread the last couple of days it appears he can't -- then that shows a problem with his own character and not others'. It reaks of insecurity and immaturity.


Nicely put. Repped!


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> FS Ultra results over stock 1080 are nearly 30%, 29.7% to be exact
> 
> Dunno why the FS performance results are much lower, CPU bottleneck?


Cpu bottleneck goes down when resolution goes up. Of course it applies to FS Ultra.


----------



## GosuPl

I'm disappointed. So, in real gaming (not stock vs stock reviews) TX Maxwell with OC vs GTX 1080 with OC, perform about 10% worse than 1080 (depends of OC). So, if new TX is 60% faster than Maxwell TX, in real gaming performance TX M OC vs TX P stock, will be near about 40%. Still nice, but...Better skip Pascal and wait for VOTLA's TITAN's. If anyone have top end Maxwell's adn waiting for good perf jump. Any Maxwell TX or Maxwell TX SLI owners here, want switch for TX P / TX P SLI ?

Btw.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKo131cKVjc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0-u50oVA3c

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mvgt6tvxeXw


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> stock 1080 also boosts close to ~1800 in FS
> 
> so again - its 30% faster at 4K than a 1080 at equal stock 1800 clocks for both .. thats exactly how it should be from the specs
> 
> if theres something to be dissapointed at - it would be at only 3500+ cores instead of 3800 or even more
> 
> but 30% is in line
> it will go to 2050-2100 under water


Simply increasing TDP limit will probably be a decent boost (it certainly does for my current Titan). These 250W TDP cards tend to throttle pretty hard with 100% TDP. I'm hoping I can get about +150 (1950mhz) to +200 (2000mhz) on the reference cooler with 100% fan. My current titan is at +150, and I only need about 80% fan to keep it at ~73C on reference cooler with a 110% TDP limit. I expect this card is going to be insanely hot though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> I'm disappointed. So, in real gaming (not stock vs stock reviews) TX Maxwell with OC vs GTX 1080 with OC, perform about 10% worse than 1080 (depends of OC). So, if new TX is 60% faster than Maxwell TX, in real gaming performance TX M OC vs TX P stock, will be near about 40%. Still nice, but...Better skip Pascal and wait for VOTLA's TITAN's. If anyone have top end Maxwell's adn waiting for good perf jump. Any Maxwell TX or Maxwell TX SLI owners here, want switch for TX P / TX P SLI ?
> 
> Btw.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKo131cKVjc
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0-u50oVA3c
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mvgt6tvxeXw


Comparing OC vs Stock is pointless IMO. Not many people go from OCed to stock, especially with these pascal cards supporting automatic overclocking with a click of the button. There's very little reason why anyone would run a pascal at stock.


----------



## GosuPl

@Murlocke

"Comparing OC vs Stock is pointless IMO." Yes, you have right. But, do you think new TX will be good overclocker?

1.No AIB versions
2.Power limits.
3.Default high clocks, no much room for decent OC.
4.Pascal (even GTX 1070/1080) is not great overclockers.


----------



## carlhil2

Dudes on OCN are funny, now the TXP can't be OC'ed or something? also, compare it to the OG TX and 980Ti...


----------



## Buddaking

I'm definitely going to skip the first shipment and wait for some reviews and benchmark test first.

If all goes well and i like what i see then i'll purchase one when the second unit of the titan xp ship out.

No way in hell i'm taking the risk of spending $1200 without seeing the card in action. Hopefully by then, they will release a asus version to this card.


----------



## GosuPl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Dudes on OCN are funny, now the TXP can't be OC'ed or something? also, compare it to the OG TX and 980Ti...


We shall see







I have hope, they can decent OC, but...


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buddaking*
> 
> I'm definitely going to skip the first shipment and wait for some reviews and benchmark test first.
> 
> If all goes well and i like what i see then i'll purchase one when the second unit of the titan xp ship out.
> 
> No way in hell i'm taking the risk of spending $1200 without seeing the card in action. Hopefully by then, they will release a asus version to this card.


There's a 30 day no-questions-asked return policy. If I were you, I'd buy it on launch day, bench the crap out of it, then mine Ethereum 24/7 for two weeks, and then just return that sucker.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> @Murlocke
> 
> "Comparing OC vs Stock is pointless IMO." Yes, you have right. But, do you think new TX will be good overclocker?
> 
> 1.No AIB versions
> 2.Power limits.
> 3.Default high clocks, no much room for decent OC.
> 4.Pascal (even GTX 1070/1080) is not great overclockers.


I expect these cards will push ~90C with the stock fan profile, and/or throttle given the fact the 1080 already pushes like 83-84C on stock fan curve. I think the #1 problem will be temps when on air.

100% fan will likely be a must when OCing on reference.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Boost 1.8 is still stock, and boost is usually just that...a boost. The card probably wasn't running a steady 1.8 during the benchmark. The 1080 boosts too, so it's fair game IMO.
> 
> If the Titan boosts to 1.8 at stock, it'll still OC further.


It will, but you better get water cooling if you want it to run near 2k all the time. My 1070 will overclock to 2100, but after an hour of game play in a demanding game it levels out at ~1926. My water block will be here Wednesday.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buddaking*
> 
> I'm definitely going to skip the first shipment and wait for some reviews and benchmark test first.
> 
> If all goes well and i like what i see then i'll purchase one when the second unit of the titan xp ship out.
> 
> No way in hell i'm taking the risk of spending $1200 without seeing the card in action. Hopefully by then, they will release a asus version to this card.


Very wise decision.


----------



## GosuPl

Btw anyone known, EVGA HYBRID for 1070/1080 can fit on 980Ti/TX (GM200) ?

I hunt for 2x EVGA Hybrid for TX, but can't buy them anywhere :/


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> There's a 30 day no-questions-asked return policy. If I were you, I'd buy it on launch day, bench the crap out of it, then mine Ethereum 24/7 for two weeks, and then just return that sucker.


Shady company and shady customers= match made in heaven...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> It will, but you better get water cooling if you want it to run near 2k all the time. My 1070 will overclock to 2100, but after an hour of game play in a demanding game it levels out at ~1926. My water block will be here Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very wise decision.


Yeah i've experienced the same with the first and second Titan. Since my computer is in another room I tend to just run 100% fan above ~75C. Helps stop that throttling.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> Btw anyone known, EVGA HYBRID for 1070/1080 can fit on 980Ti/TX (GM200) ?
> 
> I hunt for 2x EVGA Hybrid for TX, but can't buy them anywhere :/


I think you mean the reverse of what you typed and if you did, Yes they will.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Yeah i've experienced the same with the first and second Titan. 100% fan helps, since my computer is in another room I tend to just run 100% fan above ~75C. Helps stop that throttling.


You should probably read about Pascal a little more then. Boost 3.0 is completely different. And there is still no way to increase power target on these cards yet. Pascal starts throttling at like 55C or something crazy. 100% won't get you there.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Shady company and shady customers= match made in heaven...


Glad somebody got the joke and isn't all total srs bsns.


----------



## auraofjason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GosuPl*
> 
> Btw anyone known, EVGA HYBRID for 1070/1080 can fit on 980Ti/TX (GM200) ?
> 
> I hunt for 2x EVGA Hybrid for TX, but can't buy them anywhere :/


They said they will be releasing hybrid kits specifically for the new titan x as well later.


----------



## GosuPl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *auraofjason*
> 
> They said they will be releasing hybrid kits specifically for the new titan x as well later.


I will stay on TX Maxwell SLI, until VOLTA. So need EVGA Hybrid for TX M. Maybe HYBRID for TX P, can fit ;-) TX M and TX P have 6+8 pin, so HYBRID shorud have room.

On HYBRID for 1070/1080 room is for only 8 pin.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Pascal starts throttling at like 55C or something crazy. 100% won't get you there.


82ºC, last time i heard.

While we're at it, what model is your 1070? FE?


----------



## magnek

I think he probably means a "soft throttle" algorithm baked into the bios that starts dropping a boost bin or two once the GPU passes a magical threshold.

On Maxwell, that soft throttle point was 64C, and I always wondered by my 970s would drop a/few boost bins after they passed 64C, even though that temperature was absolutely no cause for concern.


----------



## looniam

*Observations on Clocking with Pascal*


however, not representative of all cards based on the feedback on the 1080 owner's thread.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> I think he probably means a "soft throttle" algorithm baked into the bios that starts dropping a boost bin or two once the GPU passes a magical threshold.
> 
> On Maxwell, that soft throttle point was 64C, and I always wondered by my 970s would drop a/few boost bins after they passed 64C, even though that temperature was absolutely no cause for concern.


Boost bins drop with temperature because maximum frequency at a set voltage drops with temperature (transistor drive strength decreases as temperature increases). The boost tables are programmed such that virtually all GPUs produced can sustain those boost clocks at those temperatures, along with headroom to account for aging over the expected lifespan of the product.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> *Observations on Clocking with Pascal*
> 
> 
> however, not representative of all cards based on the feedback on the 1080 owner's thread.


Pascal bios tweaker can't come soon enough.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Boost bins drop with temperature because maximum frequency at a set voltage drops with temperature (transistor drive strength decreases as temperature increases). The boost tables are programmed such that virtually all GPUs produced can sustain those boost clocks at those temperatures, along with headroom to account for aging over the expected lifespan of the product.


For Maxwell it wasn't a dynamic process. Once it hit 64C it would drop a boost bin or two, but would stay there until it hit the actual thermal throttling point, which was 82 or 83C I believe.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> For Maxwell it wasn't a dynamic process. Once it hit 64C it would drop a boost bin or two, but would stay there until it hit the actual thermal throttling point, which was 82 or 83C I believe.


Maxwell boosts are more conservative, from what I see. I think Pascal went overboard with the boost for a gaming product. Short-term boosts aren't beneficial at all... except in marketing.


----------



## Seyumi

True. I can confirm on my Gigabyte 1080 AIO my 2138mhz overclock would go down like 10mhz twice going from low 30's C idle to mid 50's C load on benchmarks. Maxwell wouldn't start doing that until like 80C (FYI I returned that POS Gigabyte card the pump was horrendously loud and most likely defective).

This generation of GPU is more reliant on AIO or full liquid cooling than ever to maintain highest boost clocks.


----------



## CaliLife17

In for 2. Then have them sit there in a box until the EK blocks also arrive.

Lets be honest though. I think everyone buying these knows what they are getting. Yes they are expensive, but they are also the single fastest GPU that you can buy right now. Some people are okay with the price for that, some are not. The nice thing is everyone has a choice.

I have not kept up with the 1080's though, how did they do with OC when you would put them under water? my current TX's that are getting swapped out held rock solid under water.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Maxwell boosts are more conservative, from what I see. I think Pascal went overboard with the boost for a gaming product. Short-term boosts aren't beneficial at all... except in marketing.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> True. I can confirm on my Gigabyte 1080 AIO my 2138mhz overclock would go down like 10mhz twice going from low 30's C idle to mid 50's C load on benchmarks. Maxwell wouldn't start doing that until like 80C (FYI I returned that POS Gigabyte card the pump was horrendously loud and most likely defective).
> 
> This generation of GPU is more reliant on AIO or full liquid cooling than ever to maintain highest boost clocks.


More to do with GPU Boost 3.0 than anything I bet.

Also why I said Pascal bios tweaker couldn't get here soon enough. If it was up to me, I'd have it running one voltage and one clockspeed all the time until it hit 95C.


----------



## The-Real-Link

Planning on getting one after all. We'll see, but I hope to be pretty happy with the jump from the original Titan X.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I think you mean the reverse of what you typed and if you did, Yes they will.
> You should probably read about Pascal a little more then. Boost 3.0 is completely different. And there is still no way to increase power target on these cards yet. Pascal starts throttling at like 55C or something crazy. 100% won't get you there.


Ah really? That's a bummer.


----------



## Xen0nAU

I've heard that Nvidia wont be providing there partners (Asus, Gigabyte, EVGA etc) access to this card for non-reference models... What do you guys think of this? Good or bad idea?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xen0nAU*
> 
> I've heard that Nvidia wont be providing there partners (Asus, Gigabyte, EVGA etc) access to this card for non-reference models... What do you guys think of this? Good or bad idea?


Exclusivity is always bad for consumers.


----------



## Xen0nAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Exclusivity is always bad for consumers.


I also think that sometimes the non reference designs preform a bit better on the temperature side of things due to the upgraded heat sinks, copper internals and more fans etc. Specs look good for the reference card however.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xen0nAU*
> 
> I've heard that Nvidia wont be providing there partners (Asus, Gigabyte, EVGA etc) access to this card for non-reference models... What do you guys think of this? Good or bad idea?


Titan cards have _never_ had any non-reference designs ever.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Almost time fellas! I hope I land one soon. I'm buying either the Titan XP or 1080 Classified. Whichever I can order first.

Has anyone posted Titan XP leaked 3DMark benches yet?
http://videocardz.com/62738/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-3dmark-performance


----------



## axiumone

Supposed 3dmark scores from videocardzzzzzz.


----------



## formula m

When exactly does the nda drop midnight tonight?


----------



## GenoOCAU

Looks like im holding onto my 980ti.. it does 24k graphics in firestrike no problem.









Im skeptical of what TX can do under water given everything is so locked down with GPU Boost 3.0.


----------



## 12Cores

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *axiumone*
> 
> Supposed 3dmark scores from videocardzzzzzz.


It s going need to get to around ~30K graphics score to run most modern games at [email protected], regardless the performance will be other worldly for the few people who can afford it.

The Bugatti Veyron of GPU's it will be(Yoda Voice)


----------



## zealord

My own point of view regarding the new Titan X and Nvidia pricing structure since March 2012. I try to be objective and not call people stupid for what they might buy. If you are not interested in hearing my opinion (a guy that usually likes to buy a 500$ and be settled) then stop reading here thx









Back before the 7970, GTX 680 and Vanilla Titan we used to get really good cards and big chips for around 500$. Yes there were a few exceptions that is true, but mostly you could get a bangin' GPU for around 500$. Since then money hasn't change much in value. People don't even need to start with "inflation".
R & D costs on the other hand have probably increased. Generally prices always increase. We are aware of that. No one would expect to get a Titan for 350$ - 500$.

The reality is the Titan cards are not really new products. They are basically using a new naming structure to make people associate a higher price with a more premium product, which no card so far truly deserved. I could understand if they came out in May 2016 with a full fat 3840 cuda core Pascal Titan card with 16+GB HBM2 memory that blows everything out of the water and is like 1000$. Completely ahead of its time and bringing the absolute best without any doubt. A card where you know : "This is the best for 1-2 years" and not a card where you say "oh this cut thing is the best for a couple of months then the full fat boy comes out to play".

With Nvidia now you pay a premium on all products. Even on your monitor you pay a premium. Aswell on your HB SLI Bridge. A GTX 1080 is not what previous X80 cards prior to 2012 used to be. It's basically a 700$ GTX 460.

Objectively speaking and going by the specifications the new Titan X Pascal (1200$) is basically the same (in terms of GPU hierachy within their generation based on technical specs) as a GTX 570 (329$) back in 2011. Both are a cut chip. The new Titan X Pascal will be likely bettered soon.
Yes I am fully aware that competition is different and price increase. Nvidia would be stupid to sell a Titan X Pascal at 329$. They would maybe even make a loss although I doubt that. The profit for them would be too small at that price.

What it means for me personally : I am sticking to my 2500K + R9 290X another year. I am not giving my money to the PC market. I feel alienated from PC gaming. The games are mostly badly optimized and 90% of games I play are too old or not graphically intense enough to even benefit from a 1200$ GPU. Of course I play Witcher 3, ROTR and other demanding games aswell, but they are far and few between. I want to buy a new rig (I said it numerous times before, some people are probably tired of hearing me say this). In 2014 I said "yeah 2015 is gonna be the year. 20nm GPUs with HBM lets' rock" and in 2015 I said "2016 is gonna be the year with 14nm and performance increases north of 50% of previous gen". Now we are in 2016 and we have 1200$ GPUs that are not even as good as I hoped 600$ GPUs would be. So for me now it is "wait for 2017 or screw PC gaming and grab a PS4 NEO and Nintendo NX".

I know there are other options beside a Titan X, but are they any better? Is a 500€ GTX 1070 really a good upgrade from a 3 year old 290X ? Is a 700€ GTX 1080 mid-range card really worth the money? You can get a PS4 + Xbox One + 3DS and games for that kinda money you need for 1 GPU.

To be fair it is largely AMDs fault. They basically have nothing to compete and if they do they manage to screw it up somehow. In hindsight all launched were screw-ups in the last 4 years by AMD. The 7970 was underclocked and bad drivers made it look bad against the GTX 680. The reference 290X we don't even need to talk about that. The nice Fury and Nano cards that came too little too late vs the 980 Ti. I know that things are much more complicated, but I don't want to go too much into the details. It would lead nowhere.

Nvidia is doing things right from their perspective. They are basically celebrating a new record profit every quarter now.

And on the other hand what good games are there left? What is coming? The huge good looking blockbuster games are all on PS4 : Uncharted 4, Horizon Zero Dawn, Final Fantasy XV, Gran Turismo Sports, God of War IV, Detroit : Become Human, Final Fantasy VIII Remake, etc.
What do we have coming for PC ? I can't even name 3 PC games that need a monster rig. Star Citizen?

One thing has to be said, which I also said before : If I had money, and I mean like 6 digits on my bank, then I would buy a Titan X aswell, but why do people (directed at those those that aren't well off) do want to purchase GPUs that expesinve?

(This is no post to make you feel bad. Buy what you want. I only know that people like me are alienated from PC gaming by the ever increasing prices of good GPUs. And those increasing GPU prices also lead to me not buying a new CASE, RAM, CPU etc. What good would a Titan X do with a 2500K and 1333mhz DDR3 RAM at 1080p?)


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

There's no question at all that this card will not even come close to being worth $1200 objectively. Hell, the 1080 is in no way worth $700 either but Nvidia is taking full advantage of their position at the top of the market and these prices are the result. Had AMD gone with the traditional top-down release schedule and dropped something like a new Fury X (even if it was still not anymore competitive with Pascal than the original one was with Maxwell) I would guess we would have seen a $550 1080 and a $1000 Titan XP like usual. That said, i don't have anything against those who want to buy this new Titan even at its inflated price as its their money and they can do what they want. There's no question they will be able to brag about having the best card ever made for some time before the HBM2 Titans launch (whenever that is). The real losers in all of this are recent 1080 FE buyers who no doubt expected to be able to make that claim of dominance with their cards for a little longer than 1-2 months! Say what you want, owning the very fastest video card on the market is a big part of the reason a lot of guys were spending $700 for an X80 card and to be undercut so soon after purchase has to sting a bit. And I disagree that this Titan won't cannibalize 1080 sales. As I said, plenty of buyers just get the newest fastest card available to have those bragging rights and anyone who was on the fence with the 1080 for that reason, even if just a little, is going to have no reason to consider a 1080 now, unless they just flat out can't swing $1200 (something that these kind of high end buyers don't seem to care much about anyway in my experience)...


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> There's no question at all that this card will not even come close to being worth $1200 objectively. Hell, the 1080 is in no way worth $700 either but Nvidia is taking full advantage of their position at the top of the market and these prices are the result. Had AMD gone with the traditional top-down release schedule and dropped something like a new Fury X (even if it was still not anymore competitive with Pascal than the original one was with Maxwell) I would guess we would have seen a $550 1080 and a $1000 Titan XP like usual. That said, i don't have anything against those who want to buy this new Titan even at its inflated price as its their money and they can do what they want. There's no question they will be able to brag about having the best card ever made for some time before the HBM2 Titans launch (whenever that is). The real losers in all of this are recent 1080 FE buyers who no doubt expected to be able to make that claim of dominance with their cards for a little longer than 1-2 months! Say what you want, owning the very fastest video card on the market is a big part of the reason a lot of guys were spending $700 for an X80 card and to be undercut so soon after purchase has to sting a bit. And I disagree that this Titan won't cannibalize 1080 sales. As I said, plenty of buyers just get the newest fastest card available to have those bragging rights and anyone who was on the fence with the 1080 for that reason, even if just a little, is going to have no reason to consider a 1080 now, unless they just flat out can't swing $1200 (something that these kind of high end buyers don't seem to care much about anyway in my experience)...


True. Maybe we can get another 290X from AMD this year. Initially the 290(X) looked bad and was bettered by 780 Ti and Titan Black. I think the 290(X) was roughly on par with the vanilla Titan and nowadays the 290X/390X laughs at those cards.

I agree (partly) about the GTX 1080 part. I think noone excepted the new Titan to be out basically 1 month after they bought a GTX 1080. Many are probably selling their GTX 1080 and upgrade to a new Titan X and those that don't are probably scared by the 1200$ price tag. If the new Titan had been 999$ those that bought a GTX 1080 FE would probably be very mad right now.

One thing about the 1200$ price tag. It probably means that each Titan coming forth is going to be 1200$ or even more . Especially as long as AMD has nothing to compete.

My optimistic expectations : AMD has something for 500$ in Q4 2016 that is between the GTX 1080 and Titan X Pascal

My realistic expectations : AMD has something slightly faster than the GTX 1080 faster for 550$ in Q4 2016

My pessimistic expectations : Raja dancing, eating hot wings, praising True Audio 3.0 and releasing a super small niché card that fits into your smartphone and boosts Pokemon GO to 60fps. The AMD Radeon RX PICO.


----------



## Kpjoslee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> There's no question at all that this card will not even come close to being worth $1200 objectively. Hell, the 1080 is in no way worth $700 either but Nvidia is taking full advantage of their position at the top of the market and these prices are the result. Had AMD gone with the traditional top-down release schedule and dropped something like a new Fury X (even if it was still not anymore competitive with Pascal than the original one was with Maxwell) I would guess we would have seen a $550 1080 and a $1000 Titan XP like usual. That said, i don't have anything against those who want to buy this new Titan even at its inflated price as its their money and they can do what they want. There's no question they will be able to brag about having the best card ever made for some time before the HBM2 Titans launch (whenever that is). The real losers in all of this are recent 1080 FE buyers who no doubt expected to be able to make that claim of dominance with their cards for a little longer than 1-2 months! Say what you want, owning the very fastest video card on the market is a big part of the reason a lot of guys were spending $700 for an X80 card and to be undercut so soon after purchase has to sting a bit. And I disagree that this Titan won't cannibalize 1080 sales. As I said, plenty of buyers just get the newest fastest card available to have those bragging rights and anyone who was on the fence with the 1080 for that reason, even if just a little, is going to have no reason to consider a 1080 now, unless they just flat out can't swing $1200 (something that these kind of high end buyers don't seem to care much about anyway in my experience)...


If Titan came at $1000, it may have, but not at $1200. I don't expect Titan to cannibalize 1080 in any significant way when the price difference is $500. Those people who doesn't care about prices for top performances still represent very small minority compared to all the potential 1080 buyers.


----------



## Murlocke

I don't really know what to do. Go to bed, have it launch at midnight, miss the chance to order. Not go to bed, have it not release until late tomorrow and end up passing out.

Why they do this? They like their site being hammered for no reason?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> There's no question at all that this card will not even come close to being worth $1200 objectively.


I agree but still buying one.

30-40FPS is just not cutting it with my current Titan. I'm not even playing games lately because I'd rather just wait until I can get better performance in them on max settings.


----------



## carlhil2

Am I like the only one who doesn't care how others spend their money? I mean, not one iota...I might not be able to get one, not 100% sure yet, but, I am sincerely happy for those who can, I hope to see those benches though..


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I don't really know what to do. Go to bed, have it launch at midnight, miss the chance to order. Not go to bed, have it not release until late tomorrow and end up passing out.
> 
> Why they do this? They like their site being hammered for no reason?


I'll be up all dang night if that's what it takes! Who's with me


----------



## Murlocke

So has eVGA stated when Precision XOC will be updated for this card? It still will only launch if you have a 1070 or 1080.

@EVGA-JacobF you around?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'll be up all dang night if that's what it takes! Who's with me


Didn't the previous Titans launch around midnight on the NVIDIA site? Does anyone remember?


----------



## xTesla1856

Man, the closer we get to launch, the more I want a pair of TX's again







My wallet however is very relieved knowing that there is no way to buy them here. Unless I take a vacation in the US and smuggle these monsters back in my lugagge


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTesla1856*
> 
> Man, the closer we get to launch, the more I want a pair of TX's again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My wallet however is very relieved knowing *that there is no way to buy them here.* Unless I take a vacation in the US and smuggle these monsters back in my lugagge


why can't you buy a Titan X Pascal in switzerland?


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> why can't you buy a Titan X Pascal in switzerland?


While Nvidia does have a "Switzerland" in their location dropdown, they don't ship to Switzerland. Rather, they point to a bunch of retailers carrying the cards. But since the Titan X is now nvidia.com exclusive, that leaves us out of the loop. If I ordered from Germany or the US, I would get monumentally shafted on taxes, shipping and customs duties, which turn this $1200 affair closer to an $1800-$2000 one. Many of my friends here are super angry at Nvidia this time.


----------



## Burke888

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> A GTX 1080 is not what previous X80 cards prior to 2012 used to be. It's basically a 700$ GTX 460.
> 
> Objectively speaking and going by the specifications the new Titan X Pascal (1200$) is basically the same (in terms of GPU hierachy within their generation based on technical specs) as a GTX 570 (329$) back in 2011. Both are a cut chip. The new Titan X Pascal will be likely bettered soon.


Very well said! It's so sad to really know that the new Titan X is the equivalent to a GTX 570 of yesteryear.
I am saddened that AMD has let this happen.

You can't blame the enthusiasts. They don't care what it costs, what brand it is. They just want the best to play with. They will pay perhaps $2,000 to $3,000 for a single GPU. It's not about the cost, it's about getting to play with the latest and greatest. This is entirely AMD's fault.


----------



## carlhil2

Don't understand why people blame AMD, nVIDIA is going to do nVIDIA, regardless....


----------



## The-Real-Link

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I don't really know what to do. Go to bed, have it launch at midnight, miss the chance to order. Not go to bed, have it not release until late tomorrow and end up passing out.


Yep, same boat I'm feeling like, haha. But I'm up working all tonight so hopefully they won't launch it later in the day.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Don't understand why people blame AMD, nVIDIA is going to do nVIDIA, regardless....



Except when Nvidia was running amok with $650 780, AMD stopped them with 290/290X
(without it the 780Ti/Titan Black never gets made and 780 wouldn't have dropped to $500)
when Nvidia tried to charge $3000 for the Titan Z, AMD stomped them with $1500 R9 295X
when Intel was charging $1K for Pentium Extreme, AMD showed up with Athlon 64
If Fury X wasn't imminent, Nvidia would have gladly milked the market with Maxwell Titan X and never bothered to release 980Ti.
1060 was originally rumored for "maybe August", what other than 480 prices & leaked benches do you think prompted Nvidia to push it ahead to Mid July release with an early July announcement?

Intel/Nvidia can't do whatever they please when there is legitimate competition, when there isn't then it is time to engage Milking Mode


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> Except when Nvidia was running amok with $650 780, AMD stopped them with 290/290X
> (without it the 780Ti/Titan Black never gets made and 780 wouldn't have dropped to $500)
> 
> when Nvidia tried to charge $3000 for the Titan Z, AMD stomped them with $1500 R9 295X
> 
> when Intel was charging $1K for Pentium Extreme, AMD showed up with Athlon 64
> 
> If Fury X didn't get made, Nvidia would have gladly milked the market with Maxwell Titan X and never bothered to release 980Ti.
> 
> Intel/Nvidia can't do whatever they please when there is legitimate competition, when there isn't then it is time to engage Milking Mode


True









So let's pray to Lisa that VEGA + ZEN make those people happy that skipped the GTX 1080


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> True
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let's pray to Lisa that VEGA + ZEN make those people happy that skipped the GTX 1080


I'd be down for an all red rig sometime in the future


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> 
> Except when Nvidia was running amok with $650 780, AMD stopped them with 290/290X
> (without it the 780Ti/Titan Black never gets made and 780 wouldn't have dropped to $500)
> when Nvidia tried to charge $3000 for the Titan Z, AMD stomped them with $1500 R9 295X
> when Intel was charging $1K for Pentium Extreme, AMD showed up with Athlon 64
> If Fury X wasn't imminent, Nvidia would have gladly milked the market with Maxwell Titan X and never bothered to release 980Ti.
> 1060 was originally rumored for "maybe August", what other than 480 prices & leaked benches do you think prompted Nvidia to push it ahead to Mid July release with an early July announcement?
> 
> Intel/Nvidia can't do whatever they please when there is legitimate competition, when there isn't then it is time to engage Milking Mode


If ANYTHING, nVIDIA kept AMD in price check by releasing the 980Ti @$650, or, we might have seen a $800 Fury X.....


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTesla1856*
> 
> I'd be down for an all red rig sometime in the future


I take whatever has the better price/performance though I haven't had an AMD CPU since the AMD Athlon 64 3200+ lol

but to be completely honest I'd prefer AMD GPUs since FreeSync is free and I know that AMD GPUs last really well in terms of support. In some recent benchmarks the 7970 was on par with the Vanilla Titan. Something that was unthinkable back in 2013 lol


----------



## fewness

Will Titan X sale be online tonight? or tomorrow morning?


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fewness*
> 
> Will Titan X sale be online tonight? or tomorrow morning?


it seems like no one knows.

is there no official word from Nvidia on twitter or facebook regarding the launch?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> If ANYTHING, nVIDIA kept AMD in price check by releasing the 980Ti @$650, or, we might have seen a $800 Fury X.....


lol.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fewness*
> 
> Will Titan X sale be online tonight? or tomorrow morning?


Nobody knows. Could be midnight pacific time, or 6am tomorrow. Or another time. Sucks not to know.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I take whatever has the better price/performance though I haven't had an AMD CPU since the AMD Athlon 64 3200+ lol
> 
> but to be completely honest I'd prefer AMD GPUs since FreeSync is free and I know that AMD GPUs last really well in terms of support. In some recent benchmarks the 7970 was on par with the Vanilla Titan. Something that was unthinkable back in 2013 lol


Lol, my last AMD cpu was the Athlon 64 4200+, and, last AMD gpu was the HD 4850, it was huge, and, red...


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Nobody knows. Could be midnight pacific time, or 6am tomorrow. Or another time. Sucks not to know.


i don't understand why is it so hard to tell people time... Now it's like stay up and wait or go to bed and wake looking at out of stock message.


----------



## fewness

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Nobody knows. Could be midnight pacific time, or 6am tomorrow. Or another time. Sucks not to know.


I have enough coffee stock at home, I'll stay awake until I get two of them!


----------



## xTesla1856

Aight, I'll join: My last AMD CPU was an FX6300 I got on sale for 85 bucks. After that, it was all Intel for me. As for the GPUs, my Furys are my first AMD cards, coming from SLI TX's. Let's see how long I make it in the red camp before I cave in....Unless of course AMD drops a hammer with Vega


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Yeah I don't work until 6pm tomorrow, so I can wait it out to get one I think.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I've never had an AMD processor...


----------



## zealord

https://twitter.com/NVIDIA_UK/status/760180988240592897

NVIDIA TITAN X. The Ultimate. Launching tomorrow at 2PM. Only available from our store. http://nvda.ws/2aJ7u9v

2PM UK time (it's 4:21 AM in the Uk right now)

no idea if it helps anyone


----------



## fewness

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> https://twitter.com/NVIDIA_UK/status/760180988240592897
> 
> NVIDIA TITAN X. The Ultimate. Launching tomorrow at 2PM. Only available from our store. http://nvda.ws/2aJ7u9v
> 
> 2PM UK time (it's 4:21 AM in the Uk right now)
> 
> no idea if it helps anyone


+rep. I'll sleep now


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> *Only available from our store.*


----------



## Baasha

2PM UK means 6am PST... grr...


----------



## Ghoxt

So 9am East Coast US.

Good luck guys. With SLI Titan X on water, I have absolutely no desire to tear my rig apart for this when I run everything just fine now. Personally I look forward to potentially buying AMD's next single card solution that provides me an upgrade. I'm personally done with Nvidia for a while. So there's two more cards available to you guys to buy on launch


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> 2PM UK means 6am PST... grr...


Figured. Time for bed.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> https://twitter.com/NVIDIA_UK/status/760180988240592897
> 
> NVIDIA TITAN X. The Ultimate. Launching tomorrow at 2PM. Only available from our store. http://nvda.ws/2aJ7u9v
> 
> 2PM UK time (it's 4:21 AM in the Uk right now)
> 
> no idea if it helps anyone


Weird time to launch, hopefully overnight shipping tomorrow means Wednesday delivery with such a late launch.

EDIT: Nevermind that's 8am my time. Bed time...


----------



## CallsignVega

NVIDIA shipping is slow. Took like two days just to ship my 1080 after order.


----------



## n4p0l3onic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> My own point of view regarding the new Titan X and Nvidia pricing structure since March 2012. I try to be objective and not call people stupid for what they might buy. If you are not interested in hearing my opinion (a guy that usually likes to buy a 500$ and be settled) then stop reading here thx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Back before the 7970, GTX 680 and Vanilla Titan we used to get really good cards and big chips for around 500$. Yes there were a few exceptions that is true, but mostly you could get a bangin' GPU for around 500$. Since then money hasn't change much in value. People don't even need to start with "inflation".
> R & D costs on the other hand have probably increased. Generally prices always increase. We are aware of that. No one would expect to get a Titan for 350$ - 500$.
> 
> The reality is the Titan cards are not really new products. They are basically using a new naming structure to make people associate a higher price with a more premium product, which no card so far truly deserved. I could understand if they came out in May 2016 with a full fat 3840 cuda core Pascal Titan card with 16+GB HBM2 memory that blows everything out of the water and is like 1000$. Completely ahead of its time and bringing the absolute best without any doubt. A card where you know : "This is the best for 1-2 years" and not a card where you say "oh this cut thing is the best for a couple of months then the full fat boy comes out to play".
> 
> With Nvidia now you pay a premium on all products. Even on your monitor you pay a premium. Aswell on your HB SLI Bridge. A GTX 1080 is not what previous X80 cards prior to 2012 used to be. It's basically a 700$ GTX 460.
> 
> Objectively speaking and going by the specifications the new Titan X Pascal (1200$) is basically the same (in terms of GPU hierachy within their generation based on technical specs) as a GTX 570 (329$) back in 2011. Both are a cut chip. The new Titan X Pascal will be likely bettered soon.
> Yes I am fully aware that competition is different and price increase. Nvidia would be stupid to sell a Titan X Pascal at 329$. They would maybe even make a loss although I doubt that. The profit for them would be too small at that price.
> 
> What it means for me personally : I am sticking to my 2500K + R9 290X another year. I am not giving my money to the PC market. I feel alienated from PC gaming. The games are mostly badly optimized and 90% of games I play are too old or not graphically intense enough to even benefit from a 1200$ GPU. Of course I play Witcher 3, ROTR and other demanding games aswell, but they are far and few between. I want to buy a new rig (I said it numerous times before, some people are probably tired of hearing me say this). In 2014 I said "yeah 2015 is gonna be the year. 20nm GPUs with HBM lets' rock" and in 2015 I said "2016 is gonna be the year with 14nm and performance increases north of 50% of previous gen". Now we are in 2016 and we have 1200$ GPUs that are not even as good as I hoped 600$ GPUs would be. So for me now it is "wait for 2017 or screw PC gaming and grab a PS4 NEO and Nintendo NX".
> 
> I know there are other options beside a Titan X, but are they any better? Is a 500€ GTX 1070 really a good upgrade from a 3 year old 290X ? Is a 700€ GTX 1080 mid-range card really worth the money? You can get a PS4 + Xbox One + 3DS and games for that kinda money you need for 1 GPU.
> 
> To be fair it is largely AMDs fault. They basically have nothing to compete and if they do they manage to screw it up somehow. In hindsight all launched were screw-ups in the last 4 years by AMD. The 7970 was underclocked and bad drivers made it look bad against the GTX 680. The reference 290X we don't even need to talk about that. The nice Fury and Nano cards that came too little too late vs the 980 Ti. I know that things are much more complicated, but I don't want to go too much into the details. It would lead nowhere.
> 
> Nvidia is doing things right from their perspective. They are basically celebrating a new record profit every quarter now.
> 
> And on the other hand what good games are there left? What is coming? The huge good looking blockbuster games are all on PS4 : Uncharted 4, Horizon Zero Dawn, Final Fantasy XV, Gran Turismo Sports, God of War IV, Detroit : Become Human, Final Fantasy VIII Remake, etc.
> What do we have coming for PC ? I can't even name 3 PC games that need a monster rig. Star Citizen?
> 
> One thing has to be said, which I also said before : If I had money, and I mean like 6 digits on my bank, then I would buy a Titan X aswell, but why do people (directed at those those that aren't well off) do want to purchase GPUs that expesinve?
> 
> (This is no post to make you feel bad. Buy what you want. I only know that people like me are alienated from PC gaming by the ever increasing prices of good GPUs. And those increasing GPU prices also lead to me not buying a new CASE, RAM, CPU etc. What good would a Titan X do with a 2500K and 1333mhz DDR3 RAM at 1080p?)


I agree with your hardware related statement but absolutely not agree with your pc gaming related statement

It's your own fault if you are stuck with that console peasantry minded mentality where all you want is the next flashy console style AAA games and your own fault if you can't stand other far more pc centric titles that don't boast AAA graphics... Because as far as real pc gamers concerned, pc gaming is currently in another golden age.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> If ANYTHING, nVIDIA kept AMD in price check by releasing the 980Ti @$650, or, we might have seen a $800 Fury X.....


Yeah, that's exactly the reason 290X launched at $550 when by all rights it could be priced at $600 or $650 since it was faster than 780. AMD know that they don't have the brand name and even if they tried to milk the advantage they had to control the pricing to account for their weaker brand. Even when AMD jumped Nvidia on the 28nm chip with 7970 3GB, it was only priced $50 more than the 580 1.5 GB that it was 20% faster than.


----------



## Ghoxt

I always laugh when someone says Nvidia or AMD don't include "X" feature like HBM2 or NVlink because it's too expensive on that chip. They make so much profit in their largest revenue segment that I and others would beg to differ. they are just doing what they feel they need to do to carve separate features between professional grade and consumer grade.

So the next big Nvidia Expo when we hear about Volta, take care to wonder what is actually coming to the consumer space compared to the hype.


----------



## Somasonic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *n4p0l3onic*
> 
> I agree with your hardware related statement but absolutely not agree with your pc gaming related statement
> 
> It's your own fault if you are stuck with that console peasantry minded mentality where all you want is the next flashy console style AAA games and your own fault if you can't stand other far more pc centric titles that don't boast AAA graphics... Because as far as real pc gamers concerned, pc gaming is currently in another golden age.


Overreact much? Obviously he's talking about games that require the sort of hardware that is being discussed in this thread. And for a lot of people ultra level graphics aid immersion and enjoyment; who are you to declare who 'real pc gamers' are and judge all others?


----------



## Jared Pace

https://countingdownto.com/countdown/pascal-titan-x-is-available-countdown-clock


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jared Pace*
> 
> https://countingdownto.com/countdown/pascal-titan-x-is-available-countdown-clock


Thanks man!










Need to change the date release though:


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *12Cores*
> 
> It s going need to get to around ~30K graphics score to run most modern games at [email protected], regardless the performance will be other worldly for the few people who can afford it.
> 
> The Bugatti Veyron of GPU's it will be(Yoda Voice)


That's not gonna be a problem. It's at 26,660 at stock GPU boost performance which is likely around ~1,550mhz or so (maybe 1,575 - 1,590mhz at most, and that's pushing it honestly. Assuming no manual OC of course which it highly looks like stock judging from the paper specs compared to 1080)

If you factor in that every big chip TITAN/x80 TI card has always overclocked within 100mhz of the x80 card if not closer (i.e. GTX 980 reference on average hit maybe ~1,550mhz max. Most reference 980 TI could hit 1,500mhz no problem, and even the 256 more core count Maxwell TITAN X could easily do 1,450mhz and 1,475 - 1,500mhz wasn't that rare either especially with some voltage and/or bios tweaking)

I also have spoken to some people in touch with Nvidia and they were told 1,900mhz will be the "easy peasy OC" that everyone can hit basically. So we're looking at ~1,950 - 2,000mhz or so for a max OC most likely. Which makes perfect sense when you compare to the 1080 which has a max common OC of about 2,100mhz (100mhz higher just like when comparing 980 and 980 TI/TITAN X Maxwell).

If you compare that, you get: 2,000mhz = 30.63% more than the GPU boost speed of 1,531mhz. So we're likely looking at something like ~24% performance gain from overclocking, at least around 22% i'd say. (this is based on the fact that the 2,100mhz OC on the 1080 is a 21.17% increase over the 1,733mhz GPU boost speed, and we saw typically around ~15% gains on the 1080 from that kind of OC; this is a pretty comparable estimate for a ~30% clock speed gain.) So 2,660 points in FS multiplied by 1.24 = 33,058.4 points! Which is significantly more than 30,000.

Just to ensure that nobody scoffs at my math, even if a 30.63% gain in clock speed only gives a paltry 20% actual real world gain (this is very unlikely as big die chips almost always get a significantly better raw performance gain from overclocking due to the lower starting frequency making each mhz into a bigger percentage of the whole) we get the following: 26,660 points * 1.20 = 31,992 which is still ~2K more than 30,000.

We can also use comparisons such as the fact that a single founders edition GTX 1080 tends to get roughly ~42fps average in maxed out The Witcher 3 with Hairworks etc.. all on. If we factor in a 30% gain over stock 1080 (which makes sense given we are seeing 29.7% gain at 4K Firestrike Ultra) and then another 20% from the overclock (which again, is being VERY conservative as it's likely much closer to 25% gain from the OC) we get 42fps * 1.5 = 63fps. And this is 63fps at full 4K native resolution on basically THE most demanding game in existance for pure GPU intensivity! This means basically EVERY other game will be getting even higher fps than this. So i have no doubt this card can play any game at 4K 60fps Ultra settings.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Looks like im holding onto my 980ti.. it does 24k graphics in firestrike no problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im skeptical of what TX can do under water given everything is so locked down with GPU Boost 3.0.


No offense, but i don't really believe that. A 980 TI at stock is ~4-5% slower than a stock 1070; and even fully overclocked to ~1,550mhz a 980 TI is still ~10-12% slower than a ~1,800mhz stock GPU boost speed 1080. Perhaps you just got one of the not so uncommon oddball scores that happen fairly often. (i've ended up with my real old i5 3570K + GTX 660 system scoring just as high as a system with an i7 4820K and a Gigabyte G1 GTX 980 before on the same firestrike version and update number etc..etc.. it was crazy. I've seen some people with like R9 280X end up with like 20K scores before for no apparent reason, presumably due to wonky driver detection and whatnot.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> My own point of view regarding the new Titan X and Nvidia pricing structure since March 2012. I try to be objective and not call people stupid for what they might buy. If you are not interested in hearing my opinion (a guy that usually likes to buy a 500$ and be settled) then stop reading here thx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Back before the 7970, GTX 680 and Vanilla Titan we used to get really good cards and big chips for around 500$. Yes there were a few exceptions that is true, but mostly you could get a bangin' GPU for around 500$. Since then money hasn't change much in value. People don't even need to start with "inflation".
> R & D costs on the other hand have probably increased. Generally prices always increase. We are aware of that. No one would expect to get a Titan for 350$ - 500$.
> 
> The reality is the Titan cards are not really new products. They are basically using a new naming structure to make people associate a higher price with a more premium product, which no card so far truly deserved. I could understand if they came out in May 2016 with a full fat 3840 cuda core Pascal Titan card with 16+GB HBM2 memory that blows everything out of the water and is like 1000$. Completely ahead of its time and bringing the absolute best without any doubt. A card where you know : "This is the best for 1-2 years" and not a card where you say "oh this cut thing is the best for a couple of months then the full fat boy comes out to play".
> 
> With Nvidia now you pay a premium on all products. Even on your monitor you pay a premium. Aswell on your HB SLI Bridge. A GTX 1080 is not what previous X80 cards prior to 2012 used to be. It's basically a 700$ GTX 460.
> 
> Objectively speaking and going by the specifications the new Titan X Pascal (1200$) is basically the same (in terms of GPU hierachy within their generation based on technical specs) as a GTX 570 (329$) back in 2011. Both are a cut chip. The new Titan X Pascal will be likely bettered soon.
> Yes I am fully aware that competition is different and price increase. Nvidia would be stupid to sell a Titan X Pascal at 329$. They would maybe even make a loss although I doubt that. The profit for them would be too small at that price.
> 
> What it means for me personally : I am sticking to my 2500K + R9 290X another year. I am not giving my money to the PC market. I feel alienated from PC gaming. The games are mostly badly optimized and 90% of games I play are too old or not graphically intense enough to even benefit from a 1200$ GPU. Of course I play Witcher 3, ROTR and other demanding games aswell, but they are far and few between. I want to buy a new rig (I said it numerous times before, some people are probably tired of hearing me say this). In 2014 I said "yeah 2015 is gonna be the year. 20nm GPUs with HBM lets' rock" and in 2015 I said "2016 is gonna be the year with 14nm and performance increases north of 50% of previous gen". Now we are in 2016 and we have 1200$ GPUs that are not even as good as I hoped 600$ GPUs would be. So for me now it is "wait for 2017 or screw PC gaming and grab a PS4 NEO and Nintendo NX".
> 
> I know there are other options beside a Titan X, but are they any better? Is a 500€ GTX 1070 really a good upgrade from a 3 year old 290X ? Is a 700€ GTX 1080 mid-range card really worth the money? You can get a PS4 + Xbox One + 3DS and games for that kinda money you need for 1 GPU.
> 
> To be fair it is largely AMDs fault. They basically have nothing to compete and if they do they manage to screw it up somehow. In hindsight all launched were screw-ups in the last 4 years by AMD. The 7970 was underclocked and bad drivers made it look bad against the GTX 680. The reference 290X we don't even need to talk about that. The nice Fury and Nano cards that came too little too late vs the 980 Ti. I know that things are much more complicated, but I don't want to go too much into the details. It would lead nowhere.
> 
> Nvidia is doing things right from their perspective. They are basically celebrating a new record profit every quarter now.
> 
> And on the other hand what good games are there left? What is coming? The huge good looking blockbuster games are all on PS4 : Uncharted 4, Horizon Zero Dawn, Final Fantasy XV, Gran Turismo Sports, God of War IV, Detroit : Become Human, Final Fantasy VIII Remake, etc.
> What do we have coming for PC ? I can't even name 3 PC games that need a monster rig. Star Citizen?
> 
> One thing has to be said, which I also said before : If I had money, and I mean like 6 digits on my bank, then I would buy a Titan X aswell, but why do people (directed at those those that aren't well off) do want to purchase GPUs that expesinve?
> 
> (This is no post to make you feel bad. Buy what you want. I only know that people like me are alienated from PC gaming by the ever increasing prices of good GPUs. And those increasing GPU prices also lead to me not buying a new CASE, RAM, CPU etc. What good would a Titan X do with a 2500K and 1333mhz DDR3 RAM at 1080p?)


I'm sorry but that's just not true. You should really go back and check out past flagships. The ONLY past Nvidia flagship that even came close to the size of like the GK110 or GM200 etc.. on the original TITAN, TITAN BLACK, 780, 780 TI, 980 TI, TITAN X etc.. is the GTX 480 with its 529mm2 die size, and the subsequent tweaked GTX 580 which was just a 480 with bug fixes. The 580 shrunk a tad down to 520mm2. And 520mm2 is actually just as close to, say the GTX 980's ~390mm2 die size as it is to the 600mm2 size of the TITAN BLACK or TITAN X Maxwell.

Other than that, EVERY other flagship GPU has been WAY smaller than ANY of the TITAN cards. The GTX 285 was a 470mm2 die size, the Nvidia 9800 GTX was only a measly 324mm2 die size! Even the unprecedented 8800 Ultra was only 480mm2 size and was just as expensive as the TITAN as the time and nearly impossible to get a hold of. The 7900 GTX and co. were only 196mm2 tiny little things!

It's just not true that the TITANs are some new phenomena and that we are now getting x60 series cards labeled as x80 cards. The fact of the matter is it literally wasn't POSSIBLE to make a die that big (~600mm2) until Nvidia moved to the 28nm node and was getting skilled enough to deal with bad yields. The GTX 680 was originally intended to be the literal max full Keplar flagship at the time. The engineering team members have specifically stated that they never thought it was possible to make a card like the OG TITAN when Keplar first launched. Unfortunately things like dark silicon and even worse yields do limit the size of this 14nm TITAN somewhat, but it's still a pretty decent bump especially on a brand new node only a few months into production.


----------



## Z0eff

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> That's not gonna be a problem. It's at 26,660 at stock GPU boost performance which is likely around ~1,550mhz or so (maybe 1,575 - 1,590mhz at most, and that's pushing it honestly. Assuming no manual OC of course which it highly looks like stock judging from the paper specs compared to 1080)


Didn't read the whole post, first line right there made me want to point out that the TXP in that videocardz article was running at 1800mhz apparently, see the text below the chart.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> I'm sorry but that's just not true. You should really go back and check out past flagships. The ONLY past Nvidia flagship that even came close to the size of like the GK110 or GM200 etc.. on the original TITAN, TITAN BLACK, 780, 780 TI, 980 TI, TITAN X etc.. is the GTX 480 with its 529mm2 die size, and the subsequent tweaked GTX 580 which was just a 480 with bug fixes. The 580 shrunk a tad down to 520mm2. And 520mm2 is actually just as close to, say the GTX 980's ~390mm2 die size as it is to the 600mm2 size of the TITAN BLACK or TITAN X Maxwell.
> 
> Other than that, EVERY other flagship GPU has been WAY smaller than ANY of the TITAN cards. The GTX 285 was a 470mm2 die size, the Nvidia 9800 GTX was only a measly 324mm2 die size! Even the unprecedented 8800 Ultra was only 480mm2 size and was just as expensive as the TITAN as the time and nearly impossible to get a hold of. The 7900 GTX and co. were only 196mm2 tiny little things!
> 
> It's just not true that the TITANs are some new phenomena and that we are now getting x60 series cards labeled as x80 cards. The fact of the matter is it literally wasn't POSSIBLE to make a die that big (~600mm2) until Nvidia moved to the 28nm node and was getting skilled enough to deal with bad yields. The GTX 680 was originally intended to be the literal max full Keplar flagship at the time. The engineering team members have specifically stated that they never thought it was possible to make a card like the OG TITAN when Keplar first launched. Unfortunately things like dark silicon and even worse yields do limit the size of this 14nm TITAN somewhat, but it's still a pretty decent bump especially on a brand new node only a few months into production.


No no no no no no just no.

Prior to GM200, GT200 (used on the GTX 280) was also a monolith at 576mm². In fact, it's the second largest die in nVidia's history, right after GM200 @ 601mm². (well 3rd largest now that GP100 is 610mm² I suppose)

Not to mention GK110 itself was pretty beastly at 561mm². So:

GP100 = 610mm²
GM200 = 601mm²
GK110 = 561mm²
GF110 = 520mm²
GT200 = 576mm²
G80 = 484mm²

The GTX 285 you quoted at 470mm² is in fact just the 55nm die shrink of the original GT200 on 65nm. And how exactly is 520mm² numerically or percentage-wise just as close to 398mm² as it is to 601mm²?

As for your comment about dies being small before the G80 era. Well, I hope you realize G80 was nVidia's first big die (>400mm²), so obviously anything that came before G80/8800 GTX would have a die size not exceeding a certain size.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> Didn't read the whole post, first line right there made me want to point out that the TXP in that videocardz article was running at 1800mhz apparently, see the text below the chart.


Boost, not base. And I don't see why we'd assume the 1080 wasn't boosting as well during an intense benchmark. They just didn't point it out.

They also OC'd the 1080 for one baseline while the Titan was never OC'd (at least it was never indicated it was).

They state quite clearly that it's 30% gain over stock 1080 and 13% gain over OC 1080. Don't know for certain, but my guess is they didn't OC it due to cooling concerns.

30% stock/stock is about what most of us have been expecting, I think. Still believe it will scale better when you OC it due to the increased specs, also, but you'll need better cooling for that. Expect 40%, or thereabouts, max OC vs max OC.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Looks like im holding onto my 980ti.. it does 24k graphics in firestrike no problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im skeptical of what TX can do under water given everything is so locked down with GPU Boost 3.0.


That's a nice score, Kingpin edition?


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Z0eff*
> 
> Didn't read the whole post, first line right there made me want to point out that the TXP in that videocardz article was running at 1800mhz apparently, see the text below the chart.


1800 is just stock boost though. No overclock was applied.


----------



## FoamyV

We're getting the full review today right? Still have the strix 1080 oc on backorder (current eta for sept), maybe the Titan will be available sooner but i'm curious if the price difference is worth the perf difference.


----------



## SsXxX

so this is gonna be an nvidia store exclusive and only come in reference?

i mean is there a possibility this could have custom coolers and a evga SC edition like the Maxwell titan x had?


----------



## ChevChelios

so I got ~77% (100/1.3) worth of the new Titan X for ~$550 less (and earlier) by buying a 1080









not bad, not bad









P.S. and the 30% increase is at 4K, at 1440p (where I game at) it might even be closer to only 25%


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> The huge good looking blockbuster games are all on PS4 : Uncharted 4, Horizon Zero Dawn, Final Fantasy XV, Gran Turismo Sports, God of War IV, Detroit : Become Human, Final Fantasy VIII Remake


its not that bad as far as Im concerned

U4 - good game yes, but mostly for a 1 time cinematic story experience
HZD - looks good, but not out yet, maybe its actually a turd with boring repetitive gameplay
FF15 - looks like crap tbh to me .. at least tech-wise on consoles .. and there has been talk of PC version later potentially and Square released virtually all Final Fantasies in Steam, so ...
FF7 Remake - again not confirmed to be a true PS4 exclusive, only coming out their first .. XB1 & Steam versions likely later
GT Sports - I havent been impressed by GT since the 5-th and IMO Forza 6 is just as good at minimum and Forza Horizons are much more fun
GoW 4 - looks good yes
Detroit - looks good

as for PC - the biggest reasons for hardware are running multiplats at Ultra/high res/high refresh rates

and there are impressive looking exclusives like Star Citizen, the new Unreal Tournament, maybe Law Breakers, Escape From Tarkov


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> so I got ~77% (100/1.3) worth of the new Titan X for ~$550 less (and earlier) by buying a 1080
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not bad, not bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S. and the 30% increase is at 4K, at 1440p (where I game at) it might even be closer to only 25%


Given that people in here overclock you actually got 70% of Titan's performance for your money (clock per clock the two seem to be 45% apart). So yeah, you did get yours cheaper but not by a significant amount (you paid 55% of the price for 70% of the performance), top performance is paid dearly this is pretty much known.

Then again you're a 1440p gamer so you did the right choice, many of us are 4K gamers so the GTX 1080 does not cut it even if it was 1/3rd pf the price (less than 60FPS in most games maxed)...


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> clock per clock the two seem to be 45% apart)


where are you getting 45% from ?

according to the leaked bench, clock per clock (both @ 1800), the Titan XP is 29-30% faster than 1080 in FSU and ~23%+ faster in regular Firestrike


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> where are you getting 45% from ?
> 
> according to the leaked bench, clock per clock (both @ 1800), the Titan XP is 29-30% faster than 1080 in FSU and ~23%+ faster in regular Firestrike


It's 30% faster all the while GTX 1080 has 13% higher clocks (it seems like). So clock per clock it's 30% * 13% = 47%, I rounded it down to 45%... again *clock per clock* (I assume the two cards will clocks similarly given good cooling).

Firestrike Ultra is the regular Firestrike as far as Titan buyers are concerned. Most people buying this card game at 4K , no need to buy it if you're on low resolution.


----------



## renejr902

http://videocardz.com/62743/nvidia-driver-adds-nvidia-titan-x-pascal-support


----------



## Kielon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> It's 30% faster all the while GTX 1080 has 13% higher clocks (it seems like). So clock per clock it's 30% * 13% = 47%, I rounded it down to 45%... again *clock per clock* (I assume the two cards will clocks similarly given good cooling).
> 
> Firestrike Ultra is the regular Firestrike as far as Titan buyers are concerned. Most people buying this card game at 4K , no need to buy it if you're on low resolution.


Titan XP @1800 seems roughly 10% faster in FS-U than 1080 @2100 so with a perfect clock scaling can be 25% faster @2100.


----------



## ChevChelios

yeah 25-30% seems to be the increase

doesnt come close to 40%

probably the same in games overall


----------



## DADDYDC650

Everyone asleep? Yes.... my plan is a go! In 4 1!


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kielon*
> 
> Titan XP @1800 seems roughly 10% faster in FS-U than 1080 @2100 so with a perfect clock scaling can be 25% faster @2100.


May I see a link of Titan's performance @ 1800 mhz?
My understanding is that you quote its performance at 15xx mhz...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> yeah 25-30% seems to be the increase
> 
> doesnt come close to 40%
> 
> probably the same in games overall


It's 29% faster all the while running at lower clocks. At the same clocks it will certainly be more than 40%, probably closer to 50%... It makes sense too, every last of Titan XP's specs is 50% higher expect CUDA core count, but even that is at 40% mark. No way it will get less than 40% boost at the same clocks ... similar story happened last year, this situation is not new (at similar clocks Titan X Maxwell obliterated GM204 cards).


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Everyone asleep? Yes.... my plan is a go! In 4 1!


I'm wide awake


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> May I see a link of Titan's performance @ 1800 mhz?
> My understanding is that you quote its performance at 15xx mhz...


stock Titan = auto boosts to ~1800

there is no 1500 Titan

http://videocardz.com/62738/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-3dmark-performance
Quote:


> GeForce GTX 1080, GTX 1070 and GTX 1060 scores are from my existing and upcoming reviews. Of course all values are showing graphics scores. *It's also worth noting that core clock of TITAN X boosts up to 1.8 GHz in 3DMark.
> *
> So what can we see on this chart? Well, it may now explain why GTX 1060 is lacking SLI finger. Two overclocked GTX 1060 cards would probably be faster than TITAN X in synthetics, while being 2.4 times cheaper.
> 
> *NVIDIA TITAN X has ~1.3x performance of stock GTX 1080 and 1.13x of overclocked GTX 1080.* It's almost 1.5 times faster than GTX 1070 and 1.87x faster than overclocked GTX 1060.


----------



## auraofjason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Everyone asleep? Yes.... my plan is a go! In 4 1!


I went to sleep 6 hours early for this, I'm wide awake now









Others on here have said they are doing the same lol


----------



## stefxyz

Up to means boost clock is temp and power limited and varies throughout the benchmark which also means that it will be higher and more stable under water just normal Pascal behaviour under turbo boost 5.0... The 1800 constant would give a better result.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Really guys? Go to bed! It's just a stupid video card. You can buy one at a later date.


----------



## bl4ckdot

Some french websites report a price @1500€. Hope they are wrong


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> stock Titan = auto boosts to ~1800
> 
> there is no 1500 Titan
> 
> http://videocardz.com/62738/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-3dmark-performance


Up to does not meant that it averages there. The official boost clock is 1531 mhz, I expect it to average to less than 1600 mhz.

Edit: Here's a 1531 titan: http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal (read the official specs)


----------



## ChevChelios

no it goes and stays above the stated boost clock, just like all other Pascals

official specs are pretty irrelevant with GPU boost 3.0 around

regardless, as per leak a FSU run at 1800 Mhz gives it 30% over a stock 1080


----------



## Kielon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> Up to does not meant that it averages there. The official boost clock is 1531 mhz, I expect it to average to less than 1600 mhz.
> 
> Edit: Here's a 1531 titan: http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/titan-x-pascal (read the official specs)


1080 boost clock is 1733Mhz with real clocks up to 2000MHZ (+266MHz) so Titan XP with boost clock @1531MHz boosting to 1800Mhz makes perfect sense to me. If average clock is less than 1600Mhz then it would mean serious temp/power throttling going on.


----------



## Murlocke

This is suppose to release in 2 hours, yea?


----------



## auraofjason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> This is suppose to release in 2 hours, yea?


Correct, along with the NDA for reviews.


----------



## carlhil2

New gpu drops, "but, my (enter previous fastest gpu) OC'ed to the moon, is as fast as the new gpu at stock..", rinse, repeat.., Lol, as if, for some strange reason, the new gpu doesn't OC. seems some hate to see others get new stuff.....







the 1080 will not get any slower just because another gpu, that is faster, is released... oh, and, it's 980-1080/980Ti/OG Titan X-Titan XP...or, so I have been hearing around these parts..the release of a new gpu/cpu makes some just lose their minds...


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> yeah 25-30% seems to be the increase
> 
> doesnt come close to 40%
> 
> probably the same in games overall


I keep seeing this "40%" but don't recall many (if any) saying stock/stock that would be the case.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> stock Titan = auto boosts to ~1800
> 
> there is no 1500 Titan
> 
> http://videocardz.com/62738/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-3dmark-performance


Good lord, people...

The 1080 boosts, too. They just didn't say it did. The 1800mhz stated by videocardz was just the Titan's boost clock which kicks in for every card while gaming and basically meant nothing because the 1080 was doing the same thing. We don't know for how long the boost kicked in or whether the card throttled at any point during the bench, or anything. For either the Titan or the 1080 (stock or OC'd). Honestly, they should've just left out that meaningless detail to avoid confusing many people.

The Titan was running at stock clocks.. hinted at by the fact that they didn't list an OC'd baseline for it in their chart (while they did the 1080) and stock for the Titan is ~1500mhz.

Did any of you sleep last night?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> New gpu drops, "but, my (enter previous fastest gpu) OC'ed to the moon, is as fast as the new gpu at stock..", rinse, repeat.., Lol, seems some hate to see others get new stuff.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the 1080 will not get any slower just because another gpu, that is faster, is released... oh, and, it's 980-1080/980Ti/OG Titan X-Titan XP...or, so I have been hearing around these parts..the release of a new gpu/cpu makes some just lose their minds...


They have to make themselves feel better somehow. I love how some folks are chiming in over and over in regards to how it's only a certain percentage faster even though they aren't buying the new GPU. It's almost as if they need to convince themselves of something....


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> no it goes and stays above the stated boost clock, just like all other Pascals
> 
> official specs are pretty irrelevant with GPU boost 3.0 around
> 
> regardless, as per leak a FSU run at 1800 Mhz gives it 30% over a stock 1080


----------



## FoamyV

Just wait for the reviews, so much bickering when the official numbers are coming in less than 2 hours. Have to say, the amount of couch scientists has reached an all new high around here.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FoamyV*
> 
> Just wait for the reviews, so much bickering when the official numbers are coming in less than 2 hours. Have to say, the amount of couch scientists has reached an all new high around here.


I think they are just trying to pass the time because it feels like the last 40 minutes have been 6 hours.

Anyone that's buying one is likely too scared to do anything else but sit there and refresh.


----------



## ChevChelios

some ppl just in denial over the leaked bench numbers


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I think they are just trying to pass the time because it feels like the last 40 minutes have been 6 hours.


Go back to bed folks..... Nothing to see here. Titan XP has been delayed until tomorrow.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> some ppl just in denial over the leaked bench numbers


Heh, not us









...seriously though, the card will be here in a few minutes (by now), better wait it out, shall we?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> some ppl just in denial over the leaked bench numbers


All cards are at stock and all boost. It's 29% faster than a 1080 and based on my own benchmarks roughly 60% faster than the previous Titan.

Overclocking is an entirely different thing, and those numbers are exactly what people were expecting.


----------



## ChevChelios

how many sites can we realistically expect to post full reviews as soon as NDA lifts ?

does computerbase.de have a Titan X ?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> some ppl just in denial over the leaked bench numbers


Or perhaps they already knew what to expect and don't care about spending the money. Others are in denial about how much they want it.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> some ppl just in denial over the leaked bench numbers


Yup, and, you are doing what you claimed the 980Ti owners were doing...the comedy...


----------



## EightDee8D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Yup, and, you are doing what you claimed the 980Ti owners were doing...the comedy...


This


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> how many sites can we realistically expect to post full reviews as soon as NDA lifts ?
> 
> does computerbase.de have a Titan X ?


According to the leaked review source? None. They didn't ship any cards to reviewers.

Would not be surprised if it's a blind buy, possibly with a couple benchmarks released on geforce.com.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Yup, and, you are doing what you claimed the 980Ti owners were doing...the comedy...


glad to see you're entertained by your own fanfiction


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> According to the leaked review source? None. They didn't ship any cards to reviewers.


then what are we waiting for exactly ?









a few Nvidia official slides ?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> then what are we waiting for exactly ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> a few Nvidia official slides ?


NVIDIA will likely post official slides, and there's bound to be 1 or 2 sites that got their hands on them (you'd think).

If NVIDIA plans to launch a $1200 product with nothing to back it up, then they are absolutely crazy. However, it will still sell out because there's a 30 day money back policy.


----------



## Viveacious

PCGamer will have a benchmark up soon. Received one from Falcon Northwest, they said.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> glad to see you're entertained by your own fanfiction


Nah, it's just that I know BS when I see/hear it...


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> and there's bound to be 1 or 2 sites that got their hands on them (you'd think).


hopefully

real life 4K gaming performance is the whole reason ppl want this card after all

I think you can practically skip reading 1440p results with this card ^^


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> hopefully
> 
> real life 4K gaming performance is the whole reason ppl want this card after all


What's funny is I bet there are reviewers that'll review this and don't even test 4K, or focus on 1080p. Anyone buying this card for 1080p, and arguably 1440p =









I could maybe justify it for a 1440p 144hz solution where the owner insists on a single GPU.


----------



## emett

Quote:


> What's funny is I bet there are reviewers that'll review this and don't even test 4K, or focus on 1080p. Anyone buying this card for 1080p, and arguably 1440p =


Trolls like you use to get banned for comments like that here.
?


----------



## stefxyz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> hopefully
> 
> real life 4K gaming performance is the whole reason ppl want this card after all
> 
> I think you can practically skip reading 1440p results with this card ^^


Super Sampling in Virtual Reality, also not everyone is fine with 60 FPS. 1440p still not on 144 fps in every game even with the new Titan... I would rather reduce detail than going below 90 fps...


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> PCGamer will have a benchmark up soon. Received one from Falcon Northwest, they said.


It's PC World
And the author said:
Quote:


> Sadly, Nvidia didn't send us a review unit. But we actually just received a Titan X-based system from Falcon Northwest and hope to post a review of that, including high-end gaming results, soon.


Not exactly confidence-inspiring in terms of getting said review in 1 hour when NDA lifts, given he made that post @ 3:30 AM.


----------



## guttheslayer

The only good thing about the card is...

No amount of OCing 1080 or (any other card) will get you the stock performance of Titan X, save for LN2.

Unlike the 1080 which can be reached by a maxed OCed 980 Ti or Titan X.

That alone I believe is what can justify the incredible price tag. Still for $1200 that is still massively overpriced.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> What's funny is I bet there are reviewers that'll review this and don't even test 4K, or focus on 1080p. Anyone buying this card for 1080p, and arguably 1440p =
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could maybe justify it for a 1440p 144hz solution where the owner insists on a single GPU.


To be fair, anyone that's spending this kind of cash on a video card is a lil loco.


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> What's funny is I bet there are reviewers that'll review this and don't even test 4K, or focus on 1080p. Anyone buying this card for 1080p, and *arguably 1440p =
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> I could *maybe justify it for a 1440p 144hz* solution where the owner insists on a single GPU.


truth be told I can justify TXP>1080 SLI more for a 144p 144hz than 4K 60hz. Microstutter is extremely distracting at +100fps, not as much in the 50-60 range.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> Trolls like you use to get banned for comments like that here.
> ?


That's not a troll, but your comment certainly is.

Also I edited it to say 1440p 144hz is OK, just for you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> To be fair, anyone that's spending this kind of cash on a video card is a lil loco.


Or has a good job and doesn't care about $1200.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> To be fair, anyone that's spending this kind of cash on a video card *is a lil loco*.


or just well off, you know


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> or just well off, you know


Nah, still loco.


----------



## looniam

i have no idea where WCCF got a pcb shot so maybe add salt(?):



http://wccftech.com/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-unleashed/


----------



## carlhil2

Or, know how to budget to invest in ones hobby?


----------



## The-Real-Link

How about both? (loco and well off)


----------



## emett

Quote:


> That's not a troll, but your comment certainly is.


No it was a blatant joke about people getting banned for bad grammar back in the day.


----------



## l88bastar

reporting in for F5 duty on the final leg of the vigil


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Nah, still loco.



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> No it was a blatant joke about people getting banned for bad grammar back in the day.


I'm on 3 hours of sleep and woke up to an alarm less than an hour ago. I'm not exactly following jokes/sarcasms through text at the moment.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Or, know how to budget to invest in ones hobby?


I prefer being called loco. It sounds cooler to me.

53 minutes to go!


----------



## stefxyz

Servers will be so down. They broke at the 1080 launch already and there we had multiple retailers available....


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*


You look cute in that selfie.


----------



## emett

Murlocke you're getting grumpy in you old age. What if someone wants the worlds fastest GPU to bench god forbid?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> Murlocke you're getting grumpy in you old age. What if someone wants the worlds fastest GPU to bench god forbid?


I think a benchmarker that can afford $1200 on a toy, can also afford a 4K monitor to bench it on.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> 
> I'm on 3 hours of sleep and woke up to an alarm less than an hour ago. I'm not exactly following jokes/sarcasms through text at the moment.


You should have popped an ambien and a beer and let the walrus take over


----------



## emett

Yeah sorry that was posted before I had read you were on 3 hour sleep. I'll leave you alone


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Made a comparison pcb pic of the old vs new Titan-X:


----------



## Klocek001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I think a benchmarker that can afford $1200 on a toy, can also afford a 4K monitor to bench it on.


what if all he cares about is +120Hz screens, or worse, he can only afford a 3.9K screen with what is left in his budget after buying TX
lol or maybe he would have that 4K screen if it wasn't a downgrade from his current 1440p 144Hz one


----------



## superkyle1721

Hey guys sorry for the ignorance I've been finishing my dissertation and starting a new job







. Anyways I heard a rumor that the new Titan X pascal is basically the only new GPU planned for launch. Does that mean the 1080TI is not being made anymore? Anyone care to shine a light on this?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Super Sampling in Virtual Reality, also not everyone is fine with 60 FPS. 1440p still not on 144 fps in every game even with the new Titan... I would rather reduce detail than going below 90 fps...


Well it's a good thing you can get steady 90fps minimums even on a 980 TI let alone a 1080, let alone a TITAN XP right









(Seriously, my single MSI Gaming X 1080 never dropped below 90fps in games on an Oculus Rift. Even the Maxwell TITAN X i had at the time i got the rift scored well past their maximum 10/10 "perfect SLI" score category. So an OC'ed TITAN XP will easily be able to push a full 144fps on the 2048x1200p congregate screen the Rift and Vive have. Even in VR with Supersampling at 2x or 3x putting it at 1440p or 2,880 x 1,620 (i.e. "3k"). Plus, once games start taking advantage of the Pascal VR technologies like the simultaneous multiprojection etc.. you'll easily get 90fps minimum fps even with 4x SSAA putting it at 4K 16:10 (3,840 x 2,400)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Klocek001*
> 
> truth be told I can justify TXP>1080 SLI more for a 144p 144hz than 4K 60hz. Microstutter is extremely distracting at +100fps, not as much in the 50-60 range.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> i have no idea where WCCF got a pcb shot so maybe add salt(?):
> 
> 
> 
> http://wccftech.com/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-unleashed/


I gotta say i'm very happy about the power delivery update. Look'a dem phases! Count 'Em! *COUNT 'EM!* SEVEN PLUS TWO!!







 7+2 phases is literally to the point that the card is basically just as good as many aftermarket AIB custom boards. For example, the Strix 1080 had 8+2 phases. I gotta give Nvidia due credit for pimping this card up a little power delivery-wise. Remember the reference 980? Pfft!..4+1 power phase...ugh.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> 
> I'm on 3 hours of sleep and woke up to an alarm less than an hour ago. I'm not exactly following jokes/sarcasms through text at the moment.


Same....ugh....runnin' low on Red Bull....


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Made a comparison pcb pic of the old vs new Titan-X:


What's up Boss. do you know what size screws are needed to install a EK uni block to this while keeping the backplate in place?


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

No clue, I only use full cover blocks, no Universals.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> No clue, I only use full cover blocks, no Universals.


Lol, I hear you. I can't justify buying a new water block for every gpu that I run into. I go through several..and don't keep them long enough..


----------



## Murlocke

30 minutes boys.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Lol, I hear you. I can't justify buying a new water block for every gpu that I run into. I go through several..and don't keep them long enough..


This is why i'm really debating whether to water cool the TITAN X's i get. Picking up one TX today and one when i get payed next week; and i'm hoping that the Maxwell TITAN X backplates and CSQ block i have might actually fit them (prolly not the block, but the plates might work. They still say "TITAN X" afterall lol







)


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *emett*
> 
> Murlocke you're getting grumpy in you old age. What if someone wants the worlds fastest GPU to bench god forbid?
> 
> 
> 
> I think a benchmarker that can afford $1200 on a toy, can also afford a 4K monitor to bench it on.
Click to expand...

when a 4K monitor can increase scores sure, but until then . .*NOPE.*


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> (Seriously, my single MSI Gaming X 1080 never dropped below 90fps in games on an Oculus Rift. Even the Maxwell TITAN X i had at the time i got the rift scored well past their maximum 10/10 "perfect SLI" score category. So an OC'ed TITAN XP will easily be able to push a full 144fps on the 2048x1200p congregate screen the Rift and Vive have. Even in VR with Supersampling at 2x or 3x putting it at 1440p or 2,880 x 1,620 (i.e. "3k"). Plus, once games start taking advantage of the Pascal VR technologies like the simultaneous multiprojection etc.. you'll easily get 90fps minimum fps even with 4x SSAA putting it at 4K 16:10 (3,840 x 2,400)


There are games out now for the Vive that will drop below 90fps on a 1080 frequently.. especially w/ supersampling.

I get ghosting/reprojection on The Gallery at HMD Resolution 2.0, which is equivalent to 6048x3360.

I get the same/worse in Raw Data at just 1.6, which is equivalent to ~5300x2800. Raw Data is, frankly, unplayable unless you enjoy lag/ghosting and a layer of blur 4-5 feet in front of you.

Most games play OK at medium - high settings, but you are unable to apply the kind of supersampling that's needed for a completely clear picture in VR.

I just can't bring myself to say the words 'easily' and 'VR' in the same sentence when it comes to GPU workload. All GPUs are getting killed right now, and so will Titan.


----------



## renejr902

23min


----------



## renejr902

I cant find any reviews ... Hmm


----------



## bl4ckdot

Reviews won't be publish before launch anyway


----------



## renejr902

Thats not fair!


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I cant find any reviews ... Hmm


Don't get your hopes up, it's not going to be like most cards where the second NDA lifts there's 50 reviews up. This is the most exclusive card in NVIDIA history.

I only expect some brief reviews and possibly a couple NVIDIA benchmarks today. Reviews sites will have to buy their own if NVIDIA isn't supplying them, and I doubt many will do that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> when a 4K monitor can increase scores sure, but until then . .*NOPE.*


Is someone honestly dropping $1200 to benchmark 1080p, and no other purpose? I'm sincerely doubting it. A benchmarker willing to drop that kind of cash for simply benchmarkng, is going to have a 4K monitor so they can benchmark all viable resolutions.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> I cant find any reviews ... Hmm


Where we're going, we won't need reviews!


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Don't get your hopes up, it's not going to be like most cards where the second NDA lifts there's 50 reviews up. This is the most exclusive card in NVIDIA history.
> 
> I only expect some brief reviews and possibly a couple NVIDIA benchmarks today. Reviews sites will have to buy their own if NVIDIA isn't supplying them, and I doubt many will do that.


Ok then when i received it i'll make a review for the whole world


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Where we're going, we won't need reviews!


Were buying blind sir!


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Where we're going, we won't need reviews!


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> There are games out now for the Vive that will drop below 90fps on a 1080 frequently.. especially w/ supersampling.
> 
> I get ghosting/reprojection on The Gallery at HMD Resolution 2.0, which is equivalent to 6048x3360.
> 
> I get the same/worse in Raw Data at just 1.6, which is equivalent to ~5300x2800. Raw Data is, frankly, unplayable unless you enjoy lag/ghosting and a layer of blur 4-5 feet in front of you.
> 
> Most games play OK at medium - high settings, but you are unable to apply the kind of supersampling that's needed for a completely clear picture in VR.


Well i never really used my Rift too much so perhaps i'm not the most qualified to judge the modern games. All i know is games like Chronus (FANTASTIC game, the "zelda meets dark souls" claim was dead on, great RPG and VR is actually fun with it. Wonder if it works without VR properly?...hmm), EVE Valkyrie (which was noticeably missing from my Rift package...scumbag oculus...sigh), and the little i've tried of games like Brookhaven Experiment etc.. by tweaking the rift camera to support Room Scale (real easy to do surprisingly); i would never drop below 90fps on a stock speed 1080. In fact i was often pushing nearly twice that framerate if i actually tried to measure it.

Using supersampling is a good idea for VR though, it would somewhat help the issue of still low-res images caused by a combination of the 1024x1200p per eye, Screen Door Effect, the Dual Screen meshing etc..etc..

I'm kinda curious about whether to just get like an Acer X34 ultra-wide 3440x1440 monitor and just use Supersampling or DSR etc.. to get 5120x2880 (4k ultra-wide) crammed into the 3440x1440 screen; so it'll look closer to 4K but still give me 100hz.

I'm really torn between the X34 and the Acer XB321HK, the 4K 60hz, G-Sync, IPS, 4ms one; basically just a 32 inch version of the XB271HK. I REAALLY wanna try 4K but the 60hz really worries me; especially coming from an ROG Swift PG278Q 144hz panel.


----------



## renejr902

Stop posting !!!! Keep pushing F5 at turbo speed !!!


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Well i never really used my Rift too much so perhaps i'm not the most qualified to judge the modern games. All i know is games like Chronus (FANTASTIC game, the "zelda meets dark souls" claim was dead on, great RPG and VR is actually fun with it. Wonder if it works without VR properly?...hmm), EVE Valkyrie (which was noticeably missing from my Rift package...scumbag oculus...sigh), and the little i've tried of games like Brookhaven Experiment etc.. by tweaking the rift camera to support Room Scale (real easy to do surprisingly); i would never drop below 90fps on a stock speed 1080. In fact i was often pushing nearly twice that framerate if i actually tried to measure it.
> 
> Using supersampling is a good idea for VR though, it would somewhat help the issue of still low-res images caused by a combination of the 1024x1200p per eye, Screen Door Effect, the Dual Screen meshing etc..etc..
> 
> I'm kinda curious about whether to just get like an Acer X34 ultra-wide 3440x1440 monitor and just use Supersampling or DSR etc.. to get 5120x2880 (4k ultra-wide) crammed into the 3440x1440 screen; so it'll look closer to 4K but still give me 100hz.
> 
> I'm really torn between the X34 and the Acer XB321HK, the 4K 60hz, G-Sync, IPS, 4ms one; basically just a 32 inch version of the XB271HK. I REAALLY wanna try 4K but the 60hz really worries me; especially coming from an ROG Swift PG278Q 144hz panel.


At this point, if your gonna do 4k....do it with the latest LG OLED........its the only way I can do sub 100hz and its mindblowingtasticatatical


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Stop posting !!!! Keep pushing F5 at turbo speed !!!


Pfft! Get on mah lvl bruh! Turbo speed? No. Just one long constant button press...


----------



## renejr902

Nvidia just announced the first buyer of the titan win a jhh signature jacket, keep F5 pushing


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> At this point, if your gonna do 4k....do it with the latest LG OLED........its the only way I can do sub 100hz and its mindblowingtasticatatical


Yeah, I feel the motion on my 60hz OLED is quite a bit better than it is on a 60Hz LCD/LED. My only complaint is no gsync. I struggle to tell the difference between my friend's 1080p 144hz monitor when panning, it's there, just minor to my eyes. I've never been sensitive to blurring though.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Pfft! Get on mah lvl bruh! Turbo speed? No. Just one long constant button press...


Oh man i just broke my F5 key, i will take my other keyboard


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> At this point, if your gonna do 4k....do it with the latest LG OLED........its the only way I can do sub 100hz and its mindblowingtasticatatical


LG? You mean that $5,000 Dell one? Dude....$5k is too much even for me with my SLI TITAN XP setup i'm getting here lol

Plus....

https://imgflip.com/i/18bofpvia Imgflip Meme Generator


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Yeah, I feel the motion on my 60hz OLED is quite a bit better than it is on a 60Hz LCD/LED.


I don't know if its the motion....or if its the superfast pixels snapping into focus immediately after movement....but either way the picture quality is wonderful


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> LG? You mean that $5,000 Dell one? Dude....$5k is too much even for me with my SLI TITAN XP setup i'm getting here lol
> 
> Plus....
> 
> https://imgflip.com/i/18bofpvia Imgflip Meme Generator


FAST SYNC IS YOUR FRIEND MY FRIEND


----------



## l88bastar

I dont know if its a lack of sleep but the NOTIFY ME button mocks me


----------



## Murlocke

1 minute...

In theory.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> I don't know if its the motion....or if its the superfast pixels snapping into focus immediately after movement....but either way the picture quality is wonderful


Well OLED technically has an average response time of 0.01ms if i recall right. (it's at least 0.1ms, pretty sure 0.01ms) So it basically has the kind of motion blur busting and response time far above even the very best TN panel but with color/image quality better than the greatest IPS panel LED.

I kinda wonder if G-sync is technically even necessary on such a fast panel


----------



## bl4ckdot

Ho god 30sec


----------



## bee144

late


----------



## techguymaxc

IT'S 8AM CENTRAL, WHERE'S THE BUY BUTTON!!!!????!!!!!!1111ONEONEONE


----------



## bl4ckdot

late boys


----------



## DarkIdeals

It's always late, the 1080 didn't go in stock till 9:12 am.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Well OLED technically has an average response time of 0.01ms if i recall right. (it's at least 0.1ms, pretty sure 0.01ms) So it basically has the kind of motion blur busting and response time far above even the very best TN panel but with color/image quality better than the greatest IPS panel LED.
> 
> I kinda wonder if G-sync is technically even necessary on such a fast panel


It's 0.1ms. I wish I had it on mine, soon as FPS goes below 60FPS motion starts to get gradually worse.

"better than the greatest IPS" is the understatement of the year.


----------



## Steven185

...I throw them money and nothing happens...


----------



## Murlocke

It's up but the buy button does nothing. Anyone else?


----------



## techguymaxc

It's up.

And no reviews. Not even a marketing slide from NV. I can't in good conscience pull the trigger without at least that...


----------



## CapnCrunch10

.


----------



## Snaporz

Got mine! Yay next day by 10am


----------



## The-Real-Link

Got one!


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> Got mine! Yay next day by 10am


The buy button works for you?


----------



## cookiesowns

Done!

In for one, tempted to get 2, but $2400 on video cards is just obscene.


----------



## carlhil2

Was able to add to cart. still thinking about it.. lol


----------



## bl4ckdot

Nothing in France yet


----------



## ChevChelios

reviews !!!!

nope


----------



## bee144

Got two. This better be worth it.


----------



## DarkIdeals

IT HAS BEEN DONE!


----------



## pompss

buy now dosnt work


----------



## Maintenance Bot

Got 1.


----------



## ChevChelios

ya'll jokers are crazeh


----------



## Murlocke

Buy button doesn't work for me on Firefox, Chrome, or IE. What the crap?!


----------



## Snaporz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> The buy button works for you?


Yup processed right away thru PayPal.


----------



## carlhil2

My girl is sending me texts, trying to talk me down, she is being real weird right now, hater...


----------



## auraofjason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Buy button doesn't work for me on Firefox, Chrome, or IE. What the crap?!


You're supposed to use this link, not the one on the titan x page http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store

I got myself one


----------



## techguymaxc

Still doesn't work for me.


----------



## ratzofftoya

in w/ 2.


----------



## Murlocke

Buy button works for the 1070 though.

If I seriously don't get one because of this...


----------



## Badexample

lol nothing work!


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Buy button isn't working for me an any browser, VPN, mobile, or iPad.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Buy button doesn't work for me on Firefox, Chrome, or IE. What the crap?!


Use your phone! Just bought 1!


----------



## ChevChelios

was able to easily add one and go to checkout, but Im not buying

just tested


----------



## Baasha

Got 4!









Stay tuned for some 4-Way SLI benchmarks of the Titan X Pascal @ 5K!


----------



## Edge0fsanity

just bought mine


----------



## CapnCrunch10

.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *auraofjason*
> 
> You're supposed to use this link, not the one on the titan x page http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store
> 
> I got myself one


So annoying...


----------



## DADDYDC650

For anyone having trouble buying one, use your smartphone instead! Doesn't work on my desktop and laptop browser.


----------



## x3sphere

Got one


----------



## bl4ckdot

The Buy button isn't even up on the french website


----------



## bee144

Microsoft Edge worked for me.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *auraofjason*
> 
> You're supposed to use this link, not the one on the titan x page http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store
> 
> I got myself one


Thanks, ordered with next day AM. Only $3 more than next day.

Hopefully here tomorrow morning...


----------



## cjp4eva

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *auraofjason*
> 
> You're supposed to use this link, not the one on the titan x page http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store
> 
> I got myself one


Look at this guy trying to sneak in an affiliate link.


----------



## carlhil2

http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html


----------



## renejr902

Buy now button not working on 4 computer and 2 phones


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Buy button works for the 1070 though.
> 
> If I seriously don't get one because of this...


wasn't working for me just go to the main menu of all the card and click buy now there .
worked for me

go to this link it will work

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store#_ga=1.219707729.951695496.1470143165


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *auraofjason*
> 
> You're supposed to use this link, not the one on the titan x page http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store
> 
> I got myself one


This worked.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> It's 0.1ms. I wish I had it on mine, soon as FPS goes below 60FPS motion starts to get gradually worse.
> 
> "better than the greatest IPS" is the understatement of the year.


What do you mean by the motion "getting gradually worse" below 60fps? On an OLED?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> Got 4!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stay tuned for some 4-Way SLI benchmarks of the Titan X Pascal @ 5K!


Ohhh you!









Puts me to shame. I bought one, and will get another when i get paid later next week or so. I still need to decide on an X34 ultra wide of a g-sync 4K anyway; so i gots tonsa stuff ta buy...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> What do you mean by the motion "getting gradually worse" below 60fps? On an OLED?


Motion gets worse on every monitor i've had the lower your FPS is.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> Got 4!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stay tuned for some 4-Way SLI benchmarks of the Titan X Pascal @ 5K!


Waiiiiiit a minute......there's a 2 card limit. Baasha is on some shady stuff here gaiz.


----------



## Badexample

They can't ship to Canada? WOW


----------



## cookiesowns

Crap... I forgot to screenshot the order confirmation page. PayPal was charged, but no email from Digitalriver or Nvidia yet. Normal?


----------



## x3sphere

http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html

Nice jump in Witcher 3, 34 % over stock 1080 at 4K


----------



## techguymaxc

And the only "review" up in the entire world right now ONLY TESTED IN SLI! http://www.pcworld.com/article/3102877/components-graphics/tested-nvidias-new-titan-x-is-absolutely-decadant-in-sli.html Oh, except for Firestrike Extreme (not even Ultra)


----------



## Fiercy

Anyone knows if 1080 Water Blocks support Titan X? I need them now.. can't put it in without


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cookiesowns*
> 
> Crap... I forgot to screenshot the order confirmation page. PayPal was charged, but no email from Digitalriver or Nvidia yet. Normal?


I ordered directly and didn't get an email yet.


----------



## Badexample

CART AND BILLING INFO

The following products are restricted by the shipping country you specified.

You may go back and change your shipping information, or you may continue with your specified shipping country and have the following items removed from your order:


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> ya'll jokers are crazeh


Don't you mean loco?


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badexample*
> 
> They can't ship to Canada? WOW


Yap cant add to the cart it wont ship to Canada for now


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Nice jump in Witcher 3, 34 % over stock 1080 at 4K


20% faster than 1080 @ 4k, 10% faster than OC'd 1080.









And all below 60 FPS average.

Edit: jumped the gun, looks like it's just that POS Tomb Raider game that doesn't scale. Farcry is 30+% faster as is Witcher 3.


----------



## CaliLife17

In for 2. Though I got a payment failed a few times, but finally got through i think.

Mine screen Order processing (I have an order # though) though, and not order complete, and to wait for email for order to complete. Anyone else get this? I see the amount pending on my CC.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Nice jump in Witcher 3, 34 % over stock 1080 at 4K


Wow.

So the current Titan gets about 36fps in Witcher 3, while this card gets 60FPS. Very nice.


----------



## ratzofftoya

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Waiiiiiit a minute......there's a 2 card limit. Baasha is on some shady stuff here gaiz.


It's also not possible to use more than 2, and definitely not with the new bridge (which gives you a couple extra FPS).


----------



## x3sphere

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> 20% faster than 1080 @ 4k, 10% faster than OC'd 1080.


Your math is wrong...

I'm seeing 44.1 FPS for the stock 1080, 59.9 for Titan

The Zotac Is overclocked out of the box


----------



## Sheyster

In for 1! Cali sales tax was just under $100.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badexample*
> 
> They can't ship to Canada? WOW


Now that's some grade A bullspittle there....sorry man...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cookiesowns*
> 
> Crap... I forgot to screenshot the order confirmation page. PayPal was charged, but no email from Digitalriver or Nvidia yet. Normal?


Yes that's normal. You don't get an email till they are done processing it. I ordered mine with overnight shipping and it still hasn't emailed me, so don't worry.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Nice jump in Witcher 3, 34 % over stock 1080 at 4K


Kept telling people. Even the GTX 1080 gets ~40fps average in completely maxed Witcher 3 with hairworks etc..etc.. at 4K resolution, and this card even with only a 34% increase mean ~56fps average at STOCK speed. With an overclock (and this thing will OC very well, Nvidia rep i spoke to that i know as a friend said 1,900mhz is gonna be common) you end up with over 60fps. My exact estimate was ~65fps average or so at 4K.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I ordered directly and didn't get an email yet.


I got the order confirmation email from nVidia in less than a minute after the order was completed online.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> You're math is wrong...
> 
> I'm seeing 44.1 FPS for the stock 1080, 59.9 for Titan
> 
> The Zotac Is overclocked out of the box


Read edit!


----------



## Woundingchaney

Not impressed with the performance over the 1080 honestly. Congratulations on everyone that got the card though Im thinking I will be holding off till spring/summer of next year.


----------



## marc0053

Just bought 1 shipped to Canada for $1,709 CAD with taxes and 1-3 business days


----------



## carlhil2

Regardless what some will say, this is a 4k GPU...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Kept telling people. Even the GTX 1080 got ~40-42fps average in completely maxed Witcher 3 with hairworks etc..etc.. at 4K resolution, and this card even with only a 34% increase mean ~56fps average at STOCK speed. With an overclock (and this thing will OC very well, Nvidia rep i spoke to that i know as a friend said 1,900mhz is gonna be common) you end up with over 60fps. My exact estimate was ~65fps average or so at 4K.


If this card gets anywhere close to 60FPS average with maxed settings including hairworks, I'll be super surprised. I wasn't expecting that considering my current Titan can barely achieve a steady 40FPS in the game with hairworks disabled.









EDIT: At 4K, obviously.


----------



## CallsignVega

NVIDIA web store is such garbage.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Not impressed with the performance over the 1080 honestly. Congratulations on everyone that got the card though Im thinking I will be holding off till spring/summer of next year.


You are doing it wrong, look at the performance over a 980Ti/OG Titan X...


----------



## renejr902

Im screw ! They dont let me buy it in canada.


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marc0053*
> 
> Just bought 1 shipped to Canada for $1,709 CAD with taxes and 1-3 business days


how?
And after taxes and shipping should be more then $1830


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Made a comparison pcb pic of the old vs new Titan-X:


Yeah the names on them really helps differentiating these. Thanks.


----------



## CallsignVega

Oh crap, I just realized I ORDERED THE OLD TITAN X!


----------



## marc0053

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *auraofjason*
> 
> You're supposed to use this link, not the one on the titan x page http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store
> 
> I got myself one


From here


----------



## Cozmos

Nearly 30 min in and still in stock? Looks like they had more than enough to go around.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> In for 1! Cali sales tax was just under $100.


$110 for me. Bay Area rules!


----------



## Woundingchaney

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> You are doing it wrong, look at the performance over a 980Ti/OG Titan X...


I think you are missing my point, the 1080 was my benchmark for performance. While the card does outperform the 1080, it still doesnt warrant a purchase.


----------



## Baasha

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> $110 for me. Bay Area rules!












Yup, almost $450 in taxes for me.









Time to go back to sleep and wake up from this nightmare! LOL


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> I think you are missing my point, the 1080 was my benchmark for performance. While the card does outperform the 1080, it still doesnt not warrant a purchase.


Perhaps it doesn't for you, but 60 FPS (when OC'd) @ 4k on a single card is the Holy Grail.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Woundingchaney*
> 
> Not impressed with the performance over the 1080 honestly. Congratulations on everyone that got the card though Im thinking I will be holding off till spring/summer of next year.


Hey it's your money but are you sure your looking at the right benchmarks? It's getting close to double OG Titan X in some titles. That's super impressive in my opinion. Though, you'd be looking at $2600 after tax to upgrade and that, well, ain't so impressive.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup, almost $450 in taxes for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time to go back to sleep and wake up from this nightmare! LOL


Wow. Only $70 in taxes for me.

My total with overnight AM shipping was $1307.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> NVIDIA web store is such garbage.


True dat. The stoopid Buy Now button refused to work on my Windows laptop, so I switched over to my MacBook, used Safari and it finally worked.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmos*
> 
> Nearly 30 min in and still in stock? Looks like they had more than enough to go around.


Our NVIDIA's horrible web store is broke again.

I bet our orders won't ship until tomorrow or Thursday.


----------



## cookiesowns

I'm hoping this comes within ~10% of SLI 980Ti's at roughly 1480Mhz on Sammy Vmem. ( KPE )


----------



## zealord

1300€ in Germany. In stock.

That is more than my 2500K + GTX 680 + 580W BeQuiet PSU + 8GB RAM + 120GB SSD + Mainboard + CASE + cooler did cost back in 2012


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup, almost $450 in taxes for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time to go back to sleep and wake up from this nightmare! LOL


$450 in taxes? I'm guessing you live in hell?


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> $450 in taxes? I'm guessing you live in hell?


He ordered four I'm assuming on two different accounts.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> 1300€ in Germany. In stock.
> 
> That is more than my 2500K + GTX 680 + 580W BeQuiet PSU + 8GB RAM + 120GB SSD + Mainboard + CASE + cooler did cost back in 2012


None of those are flagship parts, they're quite mainstream in fact. I realize you're saying "this thing costs more than my whole computer" but that's always the case with flagship parts. Look at the 6950X FFS.


----------



## Baasha

what are the chances that most Titan X GPUs will hit ~ 2000mhz OC'd?


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baasha*
> 
> what are the chances that most Titan X GPUs will hit ~ 2000mhz OC'd?


Pretty good, especially if you watercool. Maybe not on air though, at least not sustained.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> None of those are flagship parts, they're quite mainstream in fact. I realize you're saying "this thing costs more than my whole computer" but that's always the case with flagship parts. Look at the 6950X FFS.


Some people would argue that the GTX 680 was the flagship card at that time. It was the best single GPU GPU you could buy at that time for almost a year


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> He ordered four I'm assuming on two different accounts.


That's a real man right there.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Our NVIDIA's horrible web store is broke again.
> 
> I bet our orders won't ship until tomorrow or Thursday.


Be a lot of super pissed off people who paid for overnight. It's 6am there, if they can't ship these orders over an entire business day than... NVIDIA









I haven't received any confirmation on my order yet.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> $110 for me. Bay Area rules!










Damn, you win!


----------



## stulda

I can only dream this release would drop the prices of 1070's a little. Highly unlikely though. Already spent over £2k on my new build currently rocking on HD 530 GPU







upgrading to MSI 1070 in two weeks time. Can't wait my new Acer screen needs a proper feed


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> how?
> And after taxes and shipping should be more then $1830


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> Some people would argue that the GTX 680 was the flagship card at that time. It was the best single GPU GPU you could buy at that time for almost a year


Some people would argue that the GTX 680 was based on a GPU whose size would've positioned it in the 560 Ti price-range in the previous generation but because NV was early and AMD was late (as always) they bumped up the price and gave it a new name.


----------



## Snaporz

Cmon EK release that water block preorder now!


----------



## Testier

is anyone else buy now doesnt working?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Who's going to make the Titan X official owners thread? Be nice to have a list of all the reviews on one page


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> Cmon EK release that water block preorder now!


Tell me about it. I bought a 1070 Gaming X because they said they had waterblocks for it. Nope. Returned it for an FE so I could actually watercool the damn thing.


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> Cmon EK release that water block preorder now!


Amen to that!!!

Also ordered 2 but now i wish i could get that sli bridge...


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Be a lot of super pissed off people who paid for overnight. It's 6am there, if they can't ship these orders over an entire business day than... NVIDIA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't received any confirmation on my order yet.


You must have not seen NVIDIA's warehouse:


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> is anyone else buy now doesnt working?


I used my iPhone's browser.


----------



## superkyle1721

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nestala*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Made a comparison pcb pic of the old vs new Titan-X:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah the names on them really helps differentiating these. Thanks.
Click to expand...

You could just take a look at the die you know...then again if you didn't realize that then most likely looking at the pcb is not that important to you anyways.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> You must have not seen NVIDIA's warehouse:


rofl, is that actually legit? Please tell me it's not!


----------



## Creator

Ordered 2. CA taxes...









Whether or not I keep these... I don't know yet. Two of these cost more than a month of rent here in "top tier LA".


----------



## EniGma1987

On sale


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> True dat. The stoopid Buy Now button refused to work on my Windows laptop, so I switched over to my MacBook, used Safari and it finally worked.


I re-read this and now I'm thinking... First world problems!


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> rofl, is that actually legit? Please tell me it's not!


Dude, you really need to get to sleep...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> is anyone else buy now doesnt working?


A page or two back someone posted a working link.


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> You must have not seen NVIDIA's warehouse:


I pretty sure they already set aside all the boxes with Titan X to be shipped... I don't know how would they not do it. Unlesss they are selling now more then they have.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Some people would argue that the GTX 680 was based on a GPU whose size would've positioned it in the 560 Ti price-range in the previous generation but because NV was early and AMD was late (as always) they bumped up the price and gave it a new name.


I see it like this too and I hate myself for paying so much for the GTX 680


----------



## techguymaxc

Has anyone else gotten an email with order confirmation after some delay? There were people that hit that got them immediately, but I place my order 15-20 minutes ago and haven't gotten an email.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If this card gets anywhere close to 60FPS average with maxed settings including hairworks, I'll be super surprised. I wasn't expecting that considering my current Titan can barely achieve a steady 40FPS in the game with hairworks disabled.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: At 4K, obviously.


Well, my GTX 1080 gets an average of about 40fps on my 1080 with hairworks on at maxed out settings 4K. And we're seeing a 34% increase over 1080 in those benchmarks, so that puts you at 54fps at stock on the card; and since TITAN/x80 TI cards ALWAYS overclock significantly better than x80 cards due to them having lower starting clock speed (1900mhz is only 500mhz over stock 1,400mhz, but it's a quite large ~36% clock speed bump; whereas the 2,100mhz overclock on a GTX 1080 is ALSO the exact same 500mhz over the 1,607mhz base stock speed, but is only a 30% increase.)

You're at least looking at around a ~20% increase from overclocking, minimum. Probably more like ~22-24% since it's a 36% clock speed increase. But you take that 56fps and give it a 20% bump and you're at 67fps! Now, even if my math is off, i'm still at 67fps so there's quite a bit of room for error here. Even if the 1080 only got 35fps at 4K maxed with hairworks, you're still getting 47fps at stock on this TITAN X and with the same very conservative 20% overclock estimate you're still looking at 56.5fps which is quite close to 60; you could literally just go into the settings and move the hairworks tesselation down a bit and increase it by 5fps no problem. (and 4x tesselation on HW is literally identical in most cases to 8x. ESPECIALLY at 4K since you're already getting that "natural AA" effect of high ppi etc.. You could even get away with only 2x tesselation which would GUARANTEE a framerate over 60.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> I see it like this too and I hate myself for paying so much for the GTX 680


Me too







I don't know how I'm going to sleep at night after buying this new Titan X...


----------



## ChevChelios

so its at least a 30% gain over a stock 1080 at 4K in actual games ? sometimes 35% ..

decent


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Dude, you really need to get to sleep...


Huh?

There are sections of Amazon/Newegg's warehouses that are close to that, usually for old/obsolete stuff that didn't sell. Warehouses are very big, and the bigger they get the more chance at certain isles being completely ignored for years. I doubt the photo is legit, but it wouldn't surprise me either way.

There's no way the Titans would be in that isle though.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I used my iPhone's browser.


Apparently the nVidia store likes Apple Browsers. I used my MacBook to make it happen.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Well, looks like ALL orders are officially delayed fellas. Some dumb new Nvidia employee messed up big time just now.....


----------



## D749

Bam!


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Well, my GTX 1080 gets an average of about 40fps on my 1080 with hairworks on at maxed out settings 4K. And we're seeing a 34% increase over 1080 in those benchmarks, so that puts you at 54fps at stock on the card; and since TITAN/x80 TI cards ALWAYS overclock significantly better than x80 cards due to them having lower starting clock speed (1900mhz is only 500mhz over stock 1,400mhz, but it's a quite large ~36% clock speed bump; whereas the 2,100mhz overclock on a GTX 1080 is ALSO the exact same 500mhz over the 1,607mhz base stock speed, but is only a 30% increase.)
> 
> You're at least looking at around a ~20% increase from overclocking, minimum. Probably more like ~22-24% *since it's a 36% clock speed increase*. But you take that 56fps and give it a 20% bump and you're at 67fps! Now, even if my math is off, i'm still at 67fps so there's quite a bit of room for error here. Even if the 1080 only got 35fps at 4K maxed with hairworks, you're still getting 47fps at stock on this TITAN X and with the same very conservative 20% overclock estimate you're still looking at 56.5fps which is quite close to 60; you could literally just go into the settings and move the hairworks tesselation down a bit and increase it by 5fps no problem. (and 4x tesselation on HW is literally identical in most cases to 8x. ESPECIALLY at 4K since you're already getting that "natural AA" effect of high ppi etc.. You could even get away with only 2x tesselation which would GUARANTEE a framerate over 60.


It really won't be, you do realize in those benchmarks the cards still used boost 3.0 and I'd imagine at least boosted to 1600mhz, so if you are saying 1900 for a max overclock then that would only be less than 20% more clock speeds than those charts are showing


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Huh?
> 
> There are sections of Amazon/Newegg's warehouse that are close to that, usually for old/obsolete stuff that didn't sell.


And would the Titan X fall under the same classification "old/obsolete stuff that didn't sell"?


----------



## Testier

Do they not ship to canada? They keep telling me to modify my shipping address....


----------



## carlhil2

Faster than the Radeon Pro Duo for less loot, no?


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Me too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know how I'm going to sleep at night after buying this new Titan X...


if you play at 4K and play a lot of graphically intense games then there is nothing to worry about.

As long as you don't just game 1-2 hour a week and then mostly minecraft it is okay to churn out money for what you like.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> Bam!


Yeah, but do you have an email? I saw the same thing when I submitted my order.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> if you play at 4K and play a lot of graphically intense games then there is nothing to worry about.
> 
> As long as you don't just game 1-2 hour a week and then mostly minecraft it is okay to churn out money for what you like.


I will be gaming at 4k, that's why I went with the Titan X. I didn't want to spend the same amount of money on SLI 1080s and have it run slower in some games (well under 60 FPS 4k) and faster in others.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> so its at least a 30% gain over a stock 1080 at 4K in actual games ? sometimes 35% ..
> 
> decent


Yup. Which is exactly what i kept telling people we would get. But nope, AMD apologists were all over the place screaming "kek! 20-25% over 1080 at best, lawlz".

The thing is once you really study the inner workings of GPUs and how silicon wafer technology is actually created, you learn that Cuda Core count is not everything. How else do you explain the fact that the 980 TI is less than 5% weaker than the Maxwell TITAN X with a 256 cuda core difference between the two; but yet the original GTX TITAN only had 128 cores less than the TITAN BLACK and 780 TI, but the 780 TI and TITAN BLACK was often 10% faster?

The inner workings of the GPU have more effect on the performance than people think. Most people figure that the SOLE performance generating metric for a GPU is the combination of "Cores + Clock Speed + Memory Bandwidth" but that's not the case. General architecture, silicon quality, capacitor/choke etc.. quality, die size and efficiency, yield info from the wafer that particular core came from etc.. also effect things.


----------



## Sheyster

I just received my notification email from nVidia that the card is in stock guise!!!









I ordered the card 30 minutes ago.


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*


They dont let me buy it, im from canada. Quebec, montreal. I tried several times, different adress, different payment method.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> Bam!


My condolences for your loss.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> Bam!


Sending those 1080s back I take it?

Really surprised at how many people are buying two at this price.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> And would the Titan X fall under the same classification "old/obsolete stuff that didn't sell"?


No one ever claimed that's where the Titans would be in the warehouse...

Obviously, they wouldn't be. They probably are sitting right at the front, still on crates for easy access, knowing that they'll all sell out.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Still have not received confirmation from Nvidia... Could this be why?


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> They dont let me buy it, im from canada. Quebec, montreal. I tried several times, different adress, different payment method.


I am in Edmonton and the same thing is happening....


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Yeah, but do you have an email? I saw the same thing when I submitted my order.


Order confirmation arrived via email 10 minutes ago.


----------



## ChevChelios

+30-35% vs stock 1080 is a lil better then what I thought would be 25-30%


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> +30-35% vs stock 1080 is a lil better then what I thought would be 25-30%


Take out your damn wallet already.


----------



## BehindTimes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> I just received my notification email from nVidia that the card is in stock guise!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I ordered the card 30 minutes ago.


I got the order confirmation half an hour ago, pretty much instantly after I placed my order. Unfortunately, in my rush to order these, I forgot to change the shipping to one day, so I'm stuck with the free, 1-2 business month shipping.


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> My condolences for your loss.


I just gained two Titan X Pascal! What loss?


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> I am in Edmonton and the same thing is happening....


Toronto here same...


----------



## junkman

http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html

Some benchmarks. Looks like it hits 59.9 FPS in 4K Witcher. I was pretty disappointed when a 1080 couldn't hit anything more than ~40. That's not so bad.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> I just gained two Titan X Pascal! What loss?


The loss of your peasant status...it's like losing your 4K Virginity.....like a .gif of an 8 million pixel cherry being poked by a needle....


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> +30-35% vs stock 1080 is a lil better then what I thought would be 25-30%


chevyboy you have to buy
or lil Jen Hsun gonna cry
your 1080 is old news
you gotta play the titan blues

There is literrally no reason to NOT buy a Titan X


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Sending those 1080s back I take it?


Sending them back? It's a bit late for that. EBay time.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> Order confirmation arrived via email 10 minutes ago.


Still haven't received mine, ordered 45 minutes ago.

Charge shows on my credit card already.


----------



## carlhil2

For a gpu that is overpriced, and, that nobody was going to buy, everyone across the www seems to be buying one, or two, or...


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> I just gained two Titan X Pascal! What loss?


Of $2600 for overpriced products :/


----------



## stahlhart

Any chance one of these will upgrade 980Ti SLI enough to be worth it (above and beyond getting rid of SLI), or is such an owner better off waiting for Volta?


----------



## D749

People need to remember NVIDIA offers 30 day return. I ordered two Titan XP, but I'm not selling my 1080 FEs until I see benchmarks.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Some benchmarks. Looks like it hits 59.9 FPS in 4K Witcher. I was pretty disappointed when a 1080 couldn't hit anything more than ~40. That's not so bad.


That's a 50% increase in FPS! Not bad??







Any idea if this was average or max FPS?


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Of $2600 for overpriced products :/


Jealous much? It didn't affect me financially and I get to play with the presumably fastest video card. Winning.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Where's my order confirmation email? Getting a lil worried. It's been about 50 minutes since I ordered.


----------



## The-Real-Link

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Still haven't received mine, ordered 45 minutes ago.
> 
> Charge shows on my card already.


Same deal here, Murlocke.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stahlhart*
> 
> Any chance one of these will upgrade 980Ti SLI enough to be worth it (above and beyond getting rid of SLI), or is such an owner better off waiting for Volta?


I think you're always better off waiting, as Pascal was more of a shrink than an uarch change + HBM. If you can't wait, though - it probably provides about the same or within ~10% of what you get on 980 Ti SLI, considering imperfect scaling.

It's always up to you and your wallet.


----------



## rt123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> chevyboy you have to buy
> or lil Jen Hsun gonna cry
> your 1080 is old news
> you gotta play the titan blues
> 
> There is literrally no reason to NOT buy a Titan X


+Rep for the rhymes.


----------



## ChevChelios

*August 2-nd, 2016 - the day the first single [email protected] GPU was born*


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stahlhart*
> 
> Any chance one of these will upgrade 980Ti SLI enough to be worth it (above and beyond getting rid of SLI), or is such an owner better off waiting for Volta?


If you plan to game at 4K, get this card.


----------



## jasondub

SLI review, has anyone seen this?

http://www.pcworld.com/article/3102877/components-graphics/tested-nvidias-new-titan-x-is-absolutely-decadant-in-sli.html

still no overclocking ability review, all these 2 reviews so far (one single card , one sli) all done with stock clock.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> Jealous much? It didn't affect me financially and I get to play with the presumably fastest video card. Winning.


Not really. I haven't played video games in half a year. Just makes me cringe seeing people so happy to be ripped off and posting pictures of it with pride.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> That's a 50% increase in FPS! Not bad??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any idea if this was average or max FPS?


Pricewise relative, it's not great considering you could grab two 1080's and a high bandwidth bridge and get a lot more performance.

Otherwise, for a single card, and those of us who love cuNN/DNN, it's not so bad.


----------



## carlhil2

Man, when some of you fellas get these under water,..OOOHWEE...


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> I think you're always better off waiting, as Pascal was more of a shrink than an uarch change + HBM. If you can't wait, though - it probably provides about the same or within ~10% of what you get on 980 Ti SLI, considering imperfect scaling.
> 
> It's always up to you and your wallet.


Apparently this guy didn't see the review about 50% more FPS in W3 at 4K.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> still no overclocking ability review


there is no real point to truly test this cards OC without a waterblock

those 55+ fps @ 4K at stock will turn into 65-70 @ OCed with water


----------



## HyperMatrix

Contacted Nvidia. They're experiencing problems with their store and are awaiting a hotfix to correct it. Unfortunately, this means I can't buy my 2 cards yet. And the SLI HB bridge has now been sold out as well. Realllly wish AMD had a viable card available. When I'm paying top dollar for a card, I expect proper service along with it.

For those saying they're not impressed by the performance numbers. Keep in mind that these will overclock by 40% or more under water. Possibly with a modified bios.


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> What's funny is I bet there are reviewers that'll review this and don't even test 4K, or focus on 1080p. Anyone buying this card for 1080p, and arguably 1440p =
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could maybe justify it for a 1440p 144hz solution where the owner insists on a single GPU.


Hey, maybe they want to hit 240fps to match that new ASUS 240Hz 1080p monitor coming out


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Not really. I haven't played video games in half a year. Just makes me cringe seeing people so happy to be ripped off and posting pictures of it with pride.


Then you'll be really cringing when you read that I to actually don't have much time for gaming as of late.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Contacted Nvidia. They're experiencing problems with their store and are awaiting a hotfix to correct it. Unfortunately, this means I can't buy my 2 cards yet. And the SLI HB bridge has now been sold out as well. Realllly wish AMD had a viable card available. When I'm paying top dollar for a card, I expect proper service along with it.
> 
> For those saying they're not impressed by the performance numbers. Keep in mind that these will overclock by 40% or more under water. Possibly with a modified bios.


Saying this?


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Contacted Nvidia. They're experiencing problems with their store and are awaiting a hotfix to correct it. Unfortunately, this means I can't buy my 2 cards yet. And the SLI HB bridge has now been sold out as well. Realllly wish AMD had a viable card available. When I'm paying top dollar for a card, I expect proper service along with it.
> 
> For those saying they're not impressed by the performance numbers. Keep in mind that these will overclock by 40% or more under water. Possibly with a modified bios.


I really don't think you will see a 40% increase in performance on these. With that much density, even underclocked, you're going to hit a wall somewhere, just like you see on the 1080. Maybe more on LN2, but I don't know that FF will give you that much more performance.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> What's funny is I bet there are reviewers that'll review this and don't even test 4K, or focus on 1080p. Anyone buying this card for 1080p, and arguably 1440p =
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could maybe justify it for a 1440p 144hz solution where the owner insists on a single GPU.


Oh yeah? Let's see you try powering 1440p at 165Hz with anything less than 2 overclocked Nvidia Titan Xs.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Where's my order confirmation email? Getting a lil worried. It's been about 50 minutes since I ordered.


It's probably how you paid (let me guess, credit card?). I used PayPal linked to a bank account and got the order confirmation within 1 minute.

CC companies often don't release the funds on larger online purchases now right away. They do a "pre-auth", do some fraud checks, then release the funds.


----------



## CallsignVega

I just created this comparison:



So the 980ti EVGA Hybrid coolers I bought should work just fine.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> It's probably how you paid (let me guess, credit card?). I used PayPal linked to a bank account and got the order confirmation within 1 minute.
> 
> CC companies often don't release the funds on larger online purchases now right away. They do a "pre-auth", do some fraud checks, then release the funds.


I used PayPal and checked out as guest in just a few seconds. No hassle.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Oh yeah? Let's see you try powering 1440p at 165Hz with anything less than 2 overclocked Nvidia Titan Xs.


I do it with one 1080 like a pleb


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> It's probably how you paid (let me guess, credit card?). I used PayPal linked to a bank account and got the order confirmation within 1 minute.
> 
> CC companies often don't release the funds on larger online purchases now right away. They do a "pre-auth", do some fraud checks, then release the funds.


I paid with CC and it went through pretty quickly. Ordered in the last 30 minutes.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Not really. I haven't played video games in half a year. Just makes me cringe seeing people so happy to be ripped off and posting pictures of it with pride.


People who care what other people spend their hard earned money on make me cringe. It has no impact on you.

Doors that way.


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Still haven't received mine, ordered 45 minutes ago.
> 
> Charge shows on my credit card already.


you can log in and check your order here

http://store.nvidia.com/sstore?Action=DisplayGlobalSelectPage&SiteID=nvidia

me too. no email form nvidia yet


----------



## NYU87

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Not really. I haven't played video games in half a year. Just makes me cringe seeing people so happy to be ripped off and posting pictures of it with pride.


Oh you're that guy. The guy who gets jealous when he sees his neighbor get a nice car or house because he can't afford it.

If the purchase makes the guy happy, it's not a waste of money.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> I really don't think you will see a 40% increase in performance on these. With that much density, even underclocked, you're going to hit a wall somewhere, just like you see on the 1080. Maybe more on LN2, but I don't know that FF will give you that much more performance.


If you can't hit 2143MHz under water with these cards, I will eat my hat. I don't see any reason why it wouldn't be possible unless you hit a power limit, which can be fixed with a modified bios. 16nm finfet hasn't had the same disastrous issue with density and heat dissipation as Intel has had with their 14nm 6950x.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> It's probably how you paid (let me guess, credit card?). I used PayPal linked to a bank account and got the order confirmation within 1 minute.
> CC companies often don't release the funds on larger online purchases now right away. They do a "pre-auth", do some fraud checks, then release the funds.


I used PayPal and it's linked to my bank account.


----------



## CallsignVega

Still in stock after an hour. Either NVIDIA had a ton in stock or $1200 GPU's aren't flying off the shelf.


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> i have no idea where WCCF got a pcb shot so maybe add salt(?):
> 
> 
> 
> http://wccftech.com/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-unleashed/


So we should be able to solder over R51, R53, and R54 to disable power target limits right?


----------



## skypine27

I just got my auto notify for the purchase, and they are already out of stock.

The buy page loads correctly from the email link, but when I click Buy Now, the link is "inactive" no matter how many times I click it.

And if I just load the nvidia store page normally (Ie not from the link in my email), it is already back to Auto Notify

Damn


----------



## CaliLife17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pompss*
> 
> you can log in and check your order here
> 
> http://store.nvidia.com/sstore?Action=DisplayGlobalSelectPage&SiteID=nvidia
> 
> me too. no email form nvidia yet


My order status shows "order Submitted" on that. Paid by CC, have not received email. Last year with the OG Titan X, I remember ordering in the morning, then didn't get the email confirmation until like 3pm PST. Hopefully I get it sooner this time.


----------



## ChevChelios

someone monitor when it goes out of stock


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> People need to remember NVIDIA offers 30 day return. I ordered two Titan XP, but I'm not selling my 1080 FEs until I see benchmarks.


You mean like these?

http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Where's my order confirmation email? Getting a lil worried. It's been about 50 minutes since I ordered.


I called Nvidia and she said everything is fine with my order; that it charged and went through etc.. (and that reflects on my bank account) She said she would manually send me a confimation email but still haven't got it after ~6 minutes of hanging up. Sounds like the store just had issues, we'll probably receive the confirm emails soon.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The-Real-Link*
> 
> Same deal here, Murlocke.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> *August 2-nd, 2016 - the day the first single [email protected] GPU was born*


THIS ^























Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jasondub*
> 
> SLI review, has anyone seen this?
> 
> http://www.pcworld.com/article/3102877/components-graphics/tested-nvidias-new-titan-x-is-absolutely-decadant-in-sli.html
> 
> still no overclocking ability review, all these 2 reviews so far (one single card , one sli) all done with stock clock.


You can tell that SLI support hasn't yet been coded for these cards. They are basically acting like they would in alternate frame render mode or something; very bad scaling. I guarantee you they will end up with significantly better scaling after a couple driver updates.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> Pricewise relative, it's not great considering you could grab two 1080's and a high bandwidth bridge and get a lot more performance.
> 
> Otherwise, for a single card, and those of us who love cuNN/DNN, it's not so bad.


The flagship card has never been priced well relative to the lesser models. You're also assuming perfect SLI scaling as well, and all I can say about that is:









I would take 1 Titan XP with a 50% increase in FPS ($1200) over two 1080 EVGA FTW (I'll say $1400 for these, prices vary) that might provide a 75% FPS increase in some games with a good SLI implementation. Same 2 card provide 0% increase in games that don't support SLI. Combine this with what is known about DX12 and the future of SLI, well all I can say is deal me out!


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> Toronto here same...


Thanks for let me know. I called nvidia they tried to help and they didnt succeed, but they will try to find a solution with their online store right now, they tell me to continue trying to buy it


----------



## carlhil2

Still have one in my cart, will be giving it the boot in 3, 2...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Still in stock after an hour. Either NVIDIA had a ton in stock or $1200 GPU's aren't flying off the shelf.


- $1200
- No advertisement
- Very little heads up
- Basically a blind buy

They are asking a lot for someone to place an order right now. Most will probably wait for more information.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Still have one in my cart, will be giving it the boot in 3, 2...


YOLO and its only paper.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I used PayPal and it's linked to my bank account.


Well then you got me! Call your bank and make sure they're playing ball with PayPal!


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EniGma1987*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> i have no idea where WCCF got a pcb shot so maybe add salt(?):
> 
> 
> 
> http://wccftech.com/nvidia-titan-x-pascal-unleashed/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So we should be able to solder over R51, R53, and R54 to disable power target limits right?
Click to expand...

i'm sure tin or debauer will have a guide up shortly.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Still have one in my cart, will be giving it the boot in 3, 2...


skate tough or go home.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> - $1200
> - No advertisement
> - Very little heads up
> - Basically a blind buy
> 
> They are asking a lot.


Probably doesn't help that their online shop is broken for a lot of people either. At least for us Canadians.


----------



## skypine27

I still cant order them.

I get the auto notify prompt if I go to the page manually, and if I go to the link in my email, the "buy now" button doesn't actually load anything

I think they are out.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> i'm sure tin or debauer will have a guide up shortly.
> skate tough or go home.


My girl talked me into waiting, we have plans..


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> - $1200
> - No advertisement
> - Very little heads up
> - Basically a blind buy
> 
> They are asking a lot for someone to place an order right now. Most will probably wait for more information.


Meh, easy enough to send it back if it's awful (which it is not).


----------



## guttheslayer

so the only review was a pair of SLI that didnt beat the 1080 SLI on games...

Damnnit did they even OCed the CPU since its obviously bottlenecking at 4K even?


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

So no Canadians can purchase this thing? I get this error I posted a little back:


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Meh, easy enough to send it back if it's awful (which it is not).


For real, benches, we don't need no stinking benches, if the 60% claim fail, return it...


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> i'm sure tin or debauer will have a guide up shortly.
> skate tough or go home.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My girl talked me into waiting, we she have plans..
Click to expand...

FTFY.

its all in good fun.


----------



## marc0053

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> So no Canadians can purchase this thing? I get this error I posted a little back:


I just tried to buy a 2nd card and got the same error as you have.
Also they charged me $1,709 but it should really be $1,830 ish with 13% Ontario tax.
I am sure that Nvidia will cancel my order soon because of this.


----------



## rt123

Sniped.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

A couple of Canadians a few posts back got the same thing.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> So no Canadians can purchase this thing? I get this error I posted a little back:


Saw one guy write that he was able to order one to Toronto. I tried ordering 4 minutes after they went up for sale, and for the past hour and 8 minutes, have had no luck getting it to work. Nvidia customer service said they're working on fixing the problem. But don't get me started on how I feel about outsourced call centers and reps that can barely understand English let alone the problem you're trying to deal with.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> FTFY.
> 
> its all in good fun.


Man, that's harsh..


----------



## Testier

Just got off the phone with support and apparently its restricted. They asked higher department to clarify. What a joke..........

Maybe I should rethink my titan plan.


----------



## looniam

nvidia gimping canada confirmed!


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marc0053*
> 
> I just tried to buy a 2nd card and got the same error as you have.
> Also they charged me $1,709 but it should really be $1,830 ish with 13% Ontario tax.
> I am sure that Nvidia will cancel my order soon because of this.


Any chance you placed the order with the United States selected as your "shipping" country, which oddly is a different field from your billing/shipping country?


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> So no Canadians can purchase this thing? I get this error I posted a little back:


No worries we are all getting the same thing...


----------



## Dr Mad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I just created this comparison:
> 
> 
> 
> So the 980ti EVGA Hybrid coolers I bought should work just fine.


Yes, and maybe the EK Titan X waterblock could also fit (?)


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skypine27*
> 
> I still cant order them.
> 
> I get the auto notify prompt if I go to the page manually, and if I go to the link in my email, the "buy now" button doesn't actually load anything
> 
> I think they are out.


http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store

Click the buy now next to the Titan. Only link that works for me, just tested and it still works.

EDIT: No idea why ublock is claiming that link is bad. It's not.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> nvidia gimping canada confirmed!


As if our currency isnt already destroyed....


----------



## thegreatsquare

http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html

Benchmarks


----------



## Steven185

That's where I'm stuck for over an hour now: http://i.imgur.com/FvHD5WF.png



Any idea why?

IT offers me no button to verify my order...


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skypine27*
> 
> I still cant order them.
> 
> I get the auto notify prompt if I go to the page manually, and if I go to the link in my email, the "buy now" button doesn't actually load anything
> 
> I think they are out.


still in stock use this link and click on buy now

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-store


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Not really. I haven't played video games in half a year. Just makes me cringe seeing people so happy to be ripped off and posting pictures of it with pride.


why are you even here other than to troll people?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Got confirmation! Had an Nvidia rep resend it.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> For real, benches, we don't need no stinking benches, if the 60% claim fail, return it...


It looks like we have (confirmed?) 50% increase in W3 at 4K over the 1080. Good enough for me, for now...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> That's where I'm stuck for over an hour now: http://i.imgur.com/FvHD5WF.png
> 
> 
> 
> Any idea why?
> 
> IT offers me no button to verify my order...


Try a different browser, disabling noscript/adblock/ublock/etc.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> why are you even here other than to troll people?


Wut, I thought that was tech forum protocol?


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> That's where I'm stuck for over an hour now: http://i.imgur.com/FvHD5WF.png
> 
> 
> 
> Any idea why?
> 
> IT offers me no button to verify my order...


try to order again by changing browser and clear cookies


----------



## marc0053

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Any chance you placed the order with the United States selected as your "shipping" country, which oddly is a different field from your billing/shipping country?


Pretty sure I chose Canada and CAD currency with guest checkout through PayPal.
I think the site was simply buggy around 9:20am EST when I ordered.


----------



## guttheslayer

I need a goddamn non-SLI review for real to pull the trigger...

And not 4K. 1440p any review?


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Try a different browser, disabling noscript/adblock/ublock/etc.


Tried all. Chrome, Edge, Firefox, with or without adblock ... still nothing.

Then tried with both my tablet and phone ... still stuck at that screen, never goes further... they don't want my money ... weird.


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> It looks like we have (confirmed?) 50% increase in W3 at 4K over the 1080. Good enough for me, for now...


more like 30% where do you see 50% over 1080?


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> It looks like we have (confirmed?) 50% increase in W3 at 4K over the 1080. Good enough for me, for now...


True, I was talking the "60% over the OG Titan X" claim by nVIDIA..


----------



## Steven185

Tried 3 different browsers, 2 different PCs, mobile and tablet ... always stuck there ... anybody else has the same problem? It seems as if they forgot to put one last button (verify order)


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Got confirmation! Had an Nvidia rep resend it.


Here is DaddyDC before he got the email:


----------



## Snaporz

Hmm had my PayPal receipt sent @ 0903 but no additional confirmation or anything yet *gasp*


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> It looks like we have (confirmed?) 50% increase in W3 at 4K over the 1080. Good enough for me, for now...


I still haven't played Blood and Wine. I may just start an entirely new game, seeing as I clocked 200 hours into that game at about 35-40FPS average using a controller to compensate.









I'm not sure I want to commit again, the story was so good the ending made me feel dead inside for like a week. Amazing game...


----------



## carlhil2

Well, at least those moving up from the 980Ti/OG TX should be happy with the performance gain...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Here is DaddyDC before he got the email:


LoL classic. I was also fearing this at their warehouse soon after I ordered...


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Try a different browser, disabling noscript/adblock/ublock/etc.


Still not working. Nvidia rep on phone said its something they passed to higher departments. Whatever that means unless canadians arent allowed a titan x


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Got confirmation! Had an Nvidia rep resend it.


What contact method did you use to achieve this?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> more like 30% where do you see 50% over 1080?


http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html

44FPS to 60FPS. My math claims that's close to 50% increase, the site claims it a 36% increase. I am terrible at math though.


----------



## carlhil2

From someone on Overclockers UK " a few have got cards, including myself, and we're not under NDA.

My sample hits about 1,950MHz core under OC load, but the cooler holds it back. "


----------



## stryker7314

Waiting for Titan X Black. Would gladly purchase the full chip, not this cut down insult. Nvidia is going full ******; nvidia, never go full ******. tongue.gif


----------



## Vesimas

1340€ here in Italy. I could buy two custom 1080







Btw any review yet?


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Still not working. Nvidia rep on phone said its something they passed to higher departments. Whatever that means unless canadians arent allowed a titan x


If they get sold out today before they fix this problem, I swear to God I'm just going to hang on to my 3 Titan Xs and wait for whatever garbage card Vega 11 from AMD turns out to be. At least that'll have HBM2.


----------



## Fiercy

Anyone else not getting any conformation I made order as soon as it was on sale still no email


----------



## Testier

I will deal with this later..... so disappointed I cant get my card soon because this stupid Canadian shipping issue.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> What contact method did you use to achieve this?


(800) 797-6530


----------



## thwl

Site was a little slow; order went through with confirmation e-mail shortly after on first try.

Chrome/Ad Block


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> From someone on Overclockers UK " a few have got cards, including myself, and we're not under NDA.
> 
> My sample hits about 1,950MHz core under OC load, but the cooler holds it back. "


1950 isn't bad on the stock cooler, now the question is can it push further under water? I'd like to know if the person who said that monitored TDP to arrive at that conclusion, or if they just guessed. Off to OCUK forum to find out.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> 1950 isn't bad on the stock cooler, now the question is can it push further under water? I'd like to know if the person who said that monitored TDP to arrive at that conclusion, or if they just guessed. Off to OCUK forum to find out.


Most definitely will clock higher under water. Not even counting the volt mods that will pop up.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> 1950 isn't bad on the stock cooler, now the question is can it push further under water? I'd like to know if the person who said that monitored TDP to arrive at that conclusion, or if they just guessed. Off to OCUK forum to find out.


https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18741612&page=33


----------



## FLCLimax

http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html

Still no 60fps @ 4K . Guess i'm waiting for Volta/Navi.


----------



## TheDude26

Not sure if this has been posted yet but : http://www.pcworld.com/article/3102877/components-graphics/tested-nvidias-new-titan-x-is-absolutely-decadant-in-sli.html


----------



## SsXxX

stop it people for the sake of humanity just stop it . . . and then u ask why NVidia gets greedy, vote with your wallet, say no to cut chips for more money, do the right thing . . . this is so disrespectful of NVidia at this spec and that price . . . WE DESERVE FULL-FAT PASCAL AT A LOWER PRICE !!!!

seriously please don't give NVidia a reason to stay greedy like they are, VOTE WITH YOUR WALLETS people









#pray_for_vega


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> so the only review was a pair of SLI that didnt beat the 1080 SLI on games...
> 
> Damnnit did they even OCed the CPU since its obviously bottlenecking at 4K even?


Come on, you can't seriously think those are right? It's OBVIOUS that we're seeing the same thing that happened when the 1080 first came out. Remember when the 1080 released and the very first SLI reviews had HORRID scaling? Adding a 2nd card gave like ~30% extra performance. A driver update or so later and we're now getting ~80% scaling with ease on a 2nd 1080. Same will happen for these, they just came out, give it time. And you need to read the whole review, it DID beat teh 1080 SLI in most situations, there was just one or two where it was very close. (again due to nearly no scaling from lack of driver update. I mean hell the card JUST went up for sale an HOUR ago)









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> So no Canadians can purchase this thing? I get this error I posted a little back:


Nvidia "did" say that August 2nd was the US release date, and that Europe etc.. would get their release soon after. So expect maybe a few days or a week maybe till CA release date. It's sad, but it's how things go with impromptu "1 week from paper to product" releases. They likely didn't think they had enough stock to supply all of North America.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> My girl talked me into waiting, we have plans..


Shh! Be vewy qwuiet. Here we see the wild Carlhil2, also known by it's scientific name ( Manicus Whippedicus ) in it's natural habitat. Watch as it engages in social interaction; where the female of another class manages to lure it away from it's favorite predatory meal....making it abandon hunting for Nvidius Titanicus, to engage in the one thing that can make it drop it's quarry....


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Still no 60fps @ 4K . Guess i'm waiting for Volta/Navi.


That's at stock though, it should achieve it easily with an OC - it's basically achieving it with no OC.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheDude26*
> 
> Not sure if this has been posted yet but : http://www.pcworld.com/article/3102877/components-graphics/tested-nvidias-new-titan-x-is-absolutely-decadant-in-sli.html


Honestly it was a total trash article, with half of it just being the author talking about $50,000 worth of computer tech and pretending he's #PCMASTERRACE


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SsXxX*
> 
> stop it people for the sake of humanity just stop it . . . and then u ask why NVidia gets greedy, vote with your wallet, say no to cut chips for more money, do the write thing . . . this is so disrespectful of NVidia at this spec and that price . . . WE DESERVE FULL-FAT PASCAL AT A LOWER PRICE !!!!
> 
> seriously please don't give NVidia a reason to stay greedy like they are, VOTE WITH YOUR WALLETS people
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> #pray_for_vega


Why don't you put your efforts into helping the poor?


----------



## renejr902

Im about to buy a 1080 gtx aib and wait for volta


----------



## Snaporz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SsXxX*
> 
> stop it people for the sake of humanity just stop it . . . and then u ask why NVidia gets greedy, vote with your wallet, say no to cut chips for more money, do the right thing . . . this is so disrespectful of NVidia at this spec and that price . . . WE DESERVE FULL-FAT PASCAL AT A LOWER PRICE !!!!
> 
> seriously please don't give NVidia a reason to stay greedy like they are, VOTE WITH YOUR WALLETS people
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> #pray_for_vega


Nah brah


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *x3sphere*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Nice jump in Witcher 3, 34 % over stock 1080 at 4K


But.. but.... cut-down chip!!!!!!111111


----------



## Fiercy

http://www.geforce.com/drivers/results/105685

Titan X Driver is out to.


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> If you can't hit 2143MHz under water with these cards, I will eat my hat..


That reminds me, did you get that hat shaped cake?


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> The flagship card has never been priced well relative to the lesser models. You're also assuming perfect SLI scaling as well, and all I can say about that is:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would take 1 Titan XP with a 50% increase in FPS ($1200) over two 1080 EVGA FTW (I'll say $1400 for these, prices vary) that might provide a 75% FPS increase in some games with a good SLI implementation. Same 2 card provide 0% increase in games that don't support SLI. Combine this with what is known about DX12 and the future of SLI, well all I can say is deal me out!


Never made the assumption about perfect scaling. I replied to the other guy mentioning lackluster scaling on 980 Ti's.

Even with terrible scaling, you still get a lot of performance out of the 1080 SLI arrangement, particularly when overclocked. I will concede the 50% is great in Witcher, which I why I mentioned it in the first place, because you were interested in seeing 4K @60FPS. But, just like with your argument, you will not see that same gain across every game.

The mean of all of the scores you collect will be centered around ~30% stock clocks. If TXP has more headroom than the 1080, then that alters the tone of the conversation.

Value will always play a role. If it did not, people would buy the TXP for $1200 with only a 1% improvement over the 1080.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> From someone on Overclockers UK " a few have got cards, including myself, and we're not under NDA.
> 
> My sample hits about 1,950MHz core under OC load, but the cooler holds it back. "


Not bad, I was hoping for 1950-2000 on reference cooling.

Wonder if he means that's a viable OC for reference, or if it was just a suicide run.


----------



## criminal

I am still able to add one to cart. Nvidia must have had much stock. Seeing $1200 for one item in my cart made me cringe though.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> But.. but.... cut-down chip!!!!!!111111


And no HBM2 or increase in memory. Just an increase in price and people proudly purchase it. Nvidia is literally the Apple of video cards now. I bet Magnek will be correct and they'll sell a cut-down Titan X as 1080 Ti for $900.


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Still no 60fps @ 4K . Guess i'm waiting for Volta/Navi.
> 
> 
> 
> That's at stock though, it should achieve it easily with an OC - it's basically achieving it with no OC.
Click to expand...

No thanks, i want a high end card exceeding 60fps maxing out(these aren't even max settings) console port/parity jobs from yesteryear. Volta and Navi will be after the NVIDIA stop gap(pascal) and AMD Iron out phase(polaris, vega). I'm certain Volta will be a large performance jump enough for 4K and won't get ebola in new API's either. Just like Navi will probably be able to hold a stable overclock.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> (800) 797-6530


Thanks. So of course I called them and literally the moment she said "I can see the order has been processed and you should've gotten an email" is the moment that email arrived in my inbox. Now it just needs to ship...


----------



## SsXxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> And no HBM2 or increase in memory. Just an increase in price and people proudly purchase it. Nvidia is literally the Apple of video cards now. I bet Magnek will be correct and they'll sell a cut-down Titan X as 1080 Ti for $900.


finally somebody with some sense!!!

#pray_for_vega


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> And no HBM2 or increase in memory. Just an increase in price and people proudly purchase it. Nvidia is literally the Apple of video cards now. I bet Magnek will be correct and they'll sell a cut-down Titan X as 1080 Ti for $900.


If nothing changes Volta Titan is $1400 easily. And its price will be justified by those buying it because it will have HBM2.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Thanks. So of course I called them and literally the moment she said "I can see the order has been processed and you should've gotten an email" is the moment that email arrived in my inbox. Now it just needs to ship...


Was she Asian?


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Was she Asian?


Their call center is in the phillipines.


----------



## DADDYDC650

#Pray for the broke people coming into this thread and trying to bring people down. Pathetic.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SsXxX*
> 
> finally somebody with some sense!!!
> 
> #pray_for_vega


Pray for what, that it will compete with the 1080?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Their call center is in the phillipines.


That explains it.


----------



## Snaporz

Where are our professional investigators to determine what waterblocks are compatible with this bad boy? I already have my 980Ti out as I have my custom loot being built up so I need one ASAP! Lol


----------



## scorch062

Won't be surprised if in the next few days, people would try to resell new Titan X for 1500$ or more, like they did with the 1080.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> But.. but.... cut-down chip!!!!!!111111


It is, though.

Good on you if you can accept it, and buy it.

People can be as critical as they want to be about any component, as long as it is factual.

Shouldn't hold you back from buying it if you were intent on doing it.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorch062*
> 
> Won't be surprised if in the next few days, people would try to resell new Titan X for 1500$ or more, like they did with the 1080.


Lol, only two types of people would pay that, and, I am not going to go vulgar on OCN to say what those people are...I aim to keep it clean on OCN..


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> And no HBM2 or increase in memory. Just an increase in price and people proudly purchase it. Nvidia is literally the Apple of video cards now. I bet Magnek will be correct and they'll sell a cut-down Titan X as 1080 Ti for $900.


There is LITERALLY NO POINT for hbm2 on this card at all besides to lower power consumption at the cost of more cost.

I am tired of hearing this hbm2 arguement. These ards ARENT bandwidth starved.


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Well, looks like ALL orders are officially delayed fellas. Some dumb new Nvidia employee messed up big time just now.....


LOL. Nice.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> If nothing changes Volta Titan is $1400 easily. And its price will be justified by those buying it because it will have HBM2.


I mean, it's just ridiculous. Did they keep the same name so they could reuse the shrouds and backplates too? I honestly have no idea if they're different or the same as the original Titan X.


----------



## marc0053

Just called Nvidia and they said my 1st order didn't go through for $1,709 CAD.
They currently don't have a fix for Canadians so for now we can't buy.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> I mean, it's just ridiculous. Did they keep the same name so they could reuse the shrouds and backplates too? I honestly have no idea if they're different or the same as the original Titan X.


Nah, they just sprinkled pixie dust on a 1080, BAM, magic happened...


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *scorch062*
> 
> Won't be surprised if in the next few days, people would try to resell new Titan X for 1500$ or more, like they did with the 1080.
> 
> 
> 
> Lol, only two types of people would pay that, and, I am not going to go vulgar on OCN to say what those people are...I aim to keep it clean on OCN..
Click to expand...


----------



## Nestala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superkyle1721*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Nestala*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Made a comparison pcb pic of the old vs new Titan-X:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah the names on them really helps differentiating these. Thanks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You could just take a look at the die you know...then again if you didn't realize that then most likely looking at the pcb is not that important to you anyways.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

It was sarcasm meant to make fun of the stupid naming.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> If they get sold out today before they fix this problem, I swear to God I'm just going to hang on to my 3 Titan Xs and wait for whatever garbage card Vega 11 from AMD turns out to be. At least that'll have HBM2.


Maybe. With how bad HBM2 yields are we may just see GDDR5X Vega chip for now with HBM2 limited to the biggest vega that would arrive later; or we would just see Vega in general not arrive till early to mid 2017 due to those yield issues. (remember Nvidia isn't shipping the Tesla P100 with HBM2 till late december for a reason)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> Anyone else not getting any conformation I made order as soon as it was on sale still no email


I had to call Nvidia first, but yeah i got my confirmation email. Hopefully i'll get a shipping invoice soon since i chose overnight shipping by afternoon. I think that means tomorrow delivery? (you never know. Many shipping places will do anything they can to weasel out an extra day on your item. Like the fact that 3 day shipping can actually be 4 or 5 days since they take 1 to 2 days for packaging etc.. on top of not COUNTING the day that it ships out [i.e. if it's ordered monday morning and ships out monday afternoon at ~3pm, then monday SHOULD be the "1st day" in the 3 days meaning a wednesday delivery right? Nope! It doesn't count till tuesday, even though it almost always moves several hundred miles on monday...sometimes in the wrong direction even haha])

Apparently their store is having issues, probably the influx of people F5'ing at once and trying to order these. Although i must say i'm surprised that these cards are still "seemingly" in stock.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Still no 60fps @ 4K . Guess i'm waiting for Volta/Navi.


Have you even been looking at the articles? That card is getting mid to high 50's at STOCK speed on Ultra/Maxed 4K in AAA demanding titles; one of which (witcher 3) is basically THE most GPU demanding game out there! TITAN and x80 TI cards with their massive die size's and low stock clock speed ALWAYS get better performance gain from overclocking too! This is due to percentages.

The big "Gx100/200" etc.. chip almost always overclock nearly identically to their x80 little brothers! For example, a GTX 980 reference card would be lucky to hit ~1,550mhz most of the time. But a 980 TI etc.. GM200 card would easily get to ~1,475 - 1,500mhz or so. Same with how the 780/780 TI etc.. could get quite close to the GTX 680's speed. We're seeing the same thing here. People have already reported hitting 1,950mhz on the stock blower style reference air cooler! With an AIB custom cooler you will definitely be seeing ~2,000mhz on this TITAN X; under water you might even get ~2,050mhz or even more, considering that GTX 1080 under water regularly get to ~2,175 - 2,200mhz+

So if we take that the TITAN X Pascal goes from 1,400mhz at bone stock to 1,950mhz on stock air cooling, we see that is a 550mhz overclock! (very large, even more than the 980 TI usually got) But the GTX 1080 gets nearly the same, going from 1,607mhz stock to ~2,100mhz if you get a decent overclocker; which is a 500mhz overclock. Even if you assume that the TITAN X pascal only hits 1,900mhz so that we have a fair and equal 500mhz increase on both this TITAN and the 1080, you have to factor in the percentage. 1,900mhz is 36% over the ~1,400mhz stock speed of the TITAN X; whereas 2,100mhz (which many 1080 can't even hit! Some stick at 2050mhz as you probably know) is only 30% over the 1,607mhz stock speed. So we're likely looking at this TITAN overclocking at least 5-6% better than a 1080 at minimum. If we factor in that 1,950mhz number that gives the TITAN X Pascal a 39.3% overclock!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> But.. but.... cut-down chip!!!!!!111111


The irony is that even the GP100 only actually has 3,584 cuda cores as well lol. And the only reason that the Quadro P6000 had 3,840 was due to dropping down the memory to 9,000mhz and lower bandwidth etc.. among a few other cuts they made.

I just find it SO ironic that people were mocking the Maxwell TITAN X to death the DAY the 980 TI was released saying "it's only a measly 256 cuda cores lower! It performs identical" and reviews showed it only being like ~4% slower if that. But now everyone is all up in arms saying that the TITAN X pascal having the literal same core difference of 256 makes it "cut down chip! m-muh coars!" tier of saltiness. lol

Not to mention basic math dictates that the higher the base core count you are talking about the LESS that 256 cores matters. For example, on like a GTX 280 or something with only ~500 cores, YEAH of course adding another 256 cores will drastically improve things; as it's a ~50% core increase. But on the maxwell TITAN X the 3072 cores vs 2816 on 980 TI which is still 256 core difference, is only a ~9% difference in core count.

Then if you factor in that the 3,584 on this TITAN X is even MORE than the 3072 you realize it's even LESS of a difference. 3,840 cores is only a measly 7% core difference! Meaning you're looking at maybe ~2.5% difference at best, MAYBE 3%.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marc0053*
> 
> Just called Nvidia and they said my 1st order didn't go through for $1,709 CAD.
> They currently don't have a fix for Canadians so for now we can't buy.


thanks marc.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> There is LITERALLY NO POINT for hbm2 on this card at all besides to lower power consumption at the cost of more cost.
> 
> I am tired of hearing this hbm2 arguement. These ards ARENT bandwidth starved.


Actually they are starved. Especially when you drop a 40% OC on the GPU but can only do a 10-15% OC on the memory. Benchmarks out showing performance gains from overclocked memory.


----------



## spurdomantbh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> Maybe. With how bad HBM2 yields are we may just see GDDR5X Vega chip for now with HBM2 limited to the biggest vega that would arrive later; or we would just see Vega in general not arrive till early to mid 2017 due to those yield issues. (remember Nvidia isn't shipping the Tesla P100 with HBM2 till late december for a reason)


You'd have to redesign the whole memory interface for that, resulting in a huge delay. I doubt that will happen, unless they planned it from the beginning, which I doubt they did, since in the roadmap it just says HBM2 under vega.


----------



## carlhil2




----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Actually they are starved. Especially when you drop a 40% OC on the GPU but can only do a 10-15% OC on the memory. Benchmarks out showing performance gains from overclocked memory.


HBM would have been less than 10% overall increase in performance and made the card cost significantly more. The card likely would have been sold in the $1500+ range. I wouldn't claim there's no point to HBM in this card, but there's not enough point to justify the price increase IMO.

I am happy with the numbers we are seeing from it, I was hoping for a 60% increase over my current Titan, which my gut telling me about 45-50% realistically. However, some titles are showing close to a 100% increase.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*


Basically 2x a stock maxwell Titan, way better results than I was expecting.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> HBM would have been less than 10% overall increase in performance and made the card cost significantly more. The card likely would have been sold in the $1500+ range. I wouldn't claim there's no point to HBM in this card, but there's not enough point to justify the price increase IMO.
> Basically 2x a maxwell Titan, way better results than I was expecting.


The card already costs significantly more. We're paying the HBM premium without actually getting HBM. 10% performance boost, with lower power consumption so higher GPU OC headroom will be huge. Not to mention reduced latency. Just wait until they're ready to release the next version with HBM2. It'll be talked up as the holy grail of holy grails.


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*


Can't argue with that graph. Looks like a great card.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Still no 60fps @ 4K . Guess i'm waiting for Volta/Navi.


its called overclocking your card, try it some time


----------



## HyperMatrix

I just noticed I can't use instant bank transfer to pay anymore. I'm wondering if it's because I logged into my PayPal account 20 times to authorize a payment to see if the transaction would finally go through or not. Only options left are credit cards. This happen to anyone else? Particularly to Canadians? Or is it just me?

edit: Nevermind. Seems to be back when trying to buy 1 card, but not when trying to buy 2. Probably a security flag from large orders going through digital river right now.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Pray for what, that it will compete with the 1080?


Seriously dude give it up. GTX 1080 is as good as useless for 4K. Titan XP is the first card to offer full [email protected] ... it's not a question how much better it is from 1080 (which it is by a healthy amount), but whether it will allow many of us use our monitors... if this is the first card so be it....


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkman*
> 
> It is, though.
> 
> Good on you if you can accept it, and buy it.
> 
> People can be as critical as they want to be about any component, as long as it is factual.
> 
> Shouldn't hold you back from buying it if you were intent on doing it.


Have no qualms with people being critical or factual.

I think you're missing the point (or maybe were not around during the past few days) which was intended for those who felt compelled to post that 30+ times and derail the interest of any potential buyers on the thread.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> The card already costs significantly more. We're paying the HBM premium without actually getting HBM. 10% performance boost, with lower power consumption so higher GPU OC headroom will be huge. Not to mention reduced latency. Just wait until they're ready to release the next version with HBM2. It'll be talked up as the holy grail of holy grails.


If we see HBM2 on a consumer NVIDIA card in 2016, I will be pissed and be right along side you.


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/grafikkarten/nvidia-titan-x/news-artikel/nvidia_titan_x,1010,3276621.html
> 
> Still no 60fps @ 4K . Guess i'm waiting for Volta/Navi.
> 
> 
> 
> its called overclocking your card, try it some time
Click to expand...

LMAO, never bought a card that needed an OC to play an old game @ 60fps...never will. Got a 4K screen now, Volta's Titan or Navi high end will be necessary going forward.


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> Seriously dude give it up. GTX 1080 is as good as useless for 4K. Titan XP is the first card to offer full [email protected] ... it's not a question how much better it is from 1080 (which it is by a healthy amount), but whether it will allow many of us use our monitors... if this is the first card so be it....


Did you read what I was responding to?


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If we see HBM2 on a consumer NVIDIA card in 2016, I will be pissed and be right along side you.


I don't expect it in 2016. But I heard Vega 11 was delayed until Q1 2017, which I assumed was due to HBM2?


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> LMAO, never bought a card that needed an OC to play an old game @ 60fps...never will. Got a 4K screen now, Volta's Titan or Navi high end will be necessary going forward.


"old game." not even sure how to comment...


----------



## FLCLimax

i doubt Vega will do any better.


----------



## Woundingchaney

Spent more time looking at benchmarks and ultimately decided to pull the trigger on the new TX Pascal. Given the 4k 60hz performance from a single card this will be the first time in years that I havent had a SLI configuration.

How does OCing work with the new GPU boost, is it similar to Maxwell?


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> LMAO, never bought a card that needed an OC to play an old game @ 60fps...never will. Got a 4K screen now, Volta's Titan or Navi high end will be necessary going forward.
> 
> 
> 
> "old game." not even sure how to comment...
Click to expand...

you have a probelm with that? the last major PC release, DOOM is old news already but games that are from six months to a year old are not "old"? explain yourself now.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Actually they are starved. Especially when you drop a 40% OC on the GPU but can only do a 10-15% OC on the memory. Benchmarks out showing performance gains from overclocked memory.


Well, this is the scenario of a 1080 overclocked.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10325/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-and-1070-founders-edition-review/31

Given we have an increase of 50% more bandwidth and exactly 2 more GPCs, I think its not an issue.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> i doubt Vega will do any better.


Curious as to why you say that? 14nm vs 16nm. HBM2 so lower latency, and higher bandwidth, with lower heat and power usage. And you know. ACE. All indications are that it will be a great card.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Was she Asian?


Hai!


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> i doubt Vega will do any better.
> 
> 
> 
> Curious as to why you say that? 14nm vs 16nm. HBM2 so lower latency, and higher bandwidth, with lower heat and power usage. And you know. ACE. All indications are that it will be a great card.
Click to expand...

This is a stop gap generation. AMD has bug to iron out and Nvidia just put a turbo in their previous chip. i'll buy a high end next round card and play games at 60fps or more on my moniotr maxed out without having to try and squeeze a high OC as a requirement. Might even pay less than $1k for it so i can get a new Brutale 800 Dragster as well. I'm cool waiting, as everything is inadequate right now. They didn't even enable HBAO and Hairworks, lol. No problem with $1200 necessarily, but wouldn't spring for it just to turn settings down still.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Did you read what I was responding to?


Oops, yeah, just did ... sorry. I think you meant the new Titan (you obviously meant vega)...


----------



## DADDYDC650

I hope Nvidia has enough cards for everyone that has ordered one. Be pissed if there's a queue. I want mine before Friday!


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> Oops, yeah, just did ... sorry. I think you meant the new Titan (you obviously meant vega)...


No problem, it happens...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> LMAO, never bought a card that needed an OC to play an old game @ 60fps...never will. Got a 4K screen now, Volta's Titan or Navi high end will be necessary going forward.


I think your missing an important part. You never had 4K in the past, so you never needed to OC to achieve 60FPS. 4K is massive and you are on the bleeding edge by being on it. When 1440p first came out it was the same thing. I remember having to upgrade to 2 top of the line cards every single year to keep maintaining 60FPS.

You could be waiting over a year, with no idea how they'll actually perform. The first cards will likely not be flagship, so they probably won't be all that much faster than this current Titan. I'd imagine it will be over a year before we see a full volta. That's a super long time in this market place.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> you have a probelm with that? the last major PC release, DOOM is old news already but games that are from six months to a year old are not "old"? explain yourself now.


Game requirements haven't really went up all that much over the last few years. The only reason why we aren't destroying them by now, is because people are going to 4K. 1080p/1440p 60 is a joke to max now, and a few years ago that's what everyone was using.

Witcher 3, GTA V, etc are still some of the hardest titles to max.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> 14nm vs 16nm


looking at Polaris - 14nm (at least the process they use) is a disadvantage rathe than advantage atm .. or parity at best


----------



## l88bastar

What a cluster ****! I only ordered two, but they doubled down and processed three. I was getting checkout issues and looks like that caused the problem.

Just got off the phone with customer service and they said they all may ship before they can cancel the duplicate order......which is good and bad, hey they may ship this fast which is good......but bad is I DONT WANT $4k in GPUS!!!!!


----------



## meson1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If we see HBM2 on a consumer NVIDIA card in 2016, I will be pissed and be right along side you.


I could be wrong, but I think GP102 will only do GDDR5X.

Only GP100 can do HBM2, but GP100 has no ROPs and therefore cannot be used for a GPU.

So unless they fabricate a brand new Pascal variant with an HBM2 memory controller and ROPs, I think it's safe to say we won't see such a beast from Nvidia at all.


----------



## Badexample

Am I the only guy from Canada with this message in the cart??

*The following products are restricted by the shipping country you specified.

You may go back and change your shipping information, or you may continue with your specified shipping country and have the following items removed from your order: 1.NVIDIA TITAN X*

WOW Nvidia.


----------



## pompss

Just called customer support and they resend my order confirmation email

Also they told me that my order will be shipped today since she could see that the fulfillment date is today.
I pay for 1 day shipping 10 am so i should be able to get the card tomorrow morning


----------



## carlhil2

A little advice: if you guys who bought this chip are planning to upgrade to Volta, keep your ears to the pavement and sell those puppies accordingly, like,2 Months before it's release . that's how I do it anyways...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> What a cluster ****! I only ordered two, but they doubled down and processed three. I was getting checkout issues and looks like that caused the problem.
> 
> Just got off the phone with customer service and they said they all may ship before they can cancel the duplicate order......which is good and bad, hey they may ship this fast which is good......but bad is I DONT WANT $4k in GPUS!!!!!


When they ship, note the tracking numbers and refuse the package that has only 1 in it. It will be sent back, free of charge for you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pompss*
> 
> Just called customer support and they resend my order confirmation email
> 
> Also they told me that my order will be shipped today since she could see that the fulfillment date is today.
> I pay for 1 day shipping 10 am so i should be able to get the card tomorrow morning


Same!


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> looking at Polaris - 14nm (at least the process they use) is a disadvantage rathe than advantage atm .. or parity at best


Yeah it definitely does get interesting watching different foundries and how they approach it. Remember the whole issue with the last iPhone? Where some of the CPUs were made on 16nm TSMC and some on 14nm by Samsung/globalfoundries. And depending on the metrics you looked at, each CPU had some advantages and disadvantages, although the overall metric seemed to favour the 16nm TSMC chips. Which is why the majority of the Samsung chips were dumped on Chinese consumers, with only 1/3rd of US iPhones carrying them.

Will be neat to see. I'm hoping AMD can put up a challenge. So maybe it's more hope than fact. Because I am a little sick of a 16 month product cycle with a 20% price increase, especially since I know they'll raise the price again when they launch an HBM2 model. And they can get away with it so long as AMD doesn't pose a real challenge.


----------



## jasondub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*


Which site did you get this graph from? I only found 2 reviews so far, one single, one SLI, none of them are OCed....


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jasondub*
> 
> Which site did you get this graph from? I only found 2 reviews so far, one single, one SLI, none of them are OCed....


https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18741612&page=33


----------



## Creator

4K 60Hz peasants. 1440 144Hz requires more GPU power to max out.


----------



## FLCLimax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Creator*
> 
> 4K 60Hz peasants. 1440 144Hz requires more GPU power to max out.


1440 looks like **** after ten minutes of 4K.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> 1440 looks like **** after ten minutes of 4K.


nope

and 60Hz looks like crap after 10 seconds of 144hz


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Creator*
> 
> 4K 60Hz peasants. 1440 144Hz requires more GPU power to max out.


There's no such thing as a 1440p 144hz OLED.

You LCD peasant.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> nope
> 
> and 60Hz looks like crap after 10 seconds of 144hz


LCD looks like someone put a gray filter over my eyes after 1 second of OLED.









Would not trade 144hz, 300hz, 2000hz for it.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FLCLimax*
> 
> 1440 looks like **** after ten minutes of 4K.


Agreed. But my experience is with a 40" 4K curved TV vs the ROG Swift and the Acer FreeSync one. 144 Hz didn't make a difference to me and 27" was waaaaaaaay too tiny. Might be good for a teenager or midget.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Agreed. But my experience is with a 40" 4K curved TV vs the ROG Swift and the Acer FreeSync one. 144 Hz didn't make a difference to me and 27" was waaaaaaaay too tiny. Might be good for a teenager or midget.


It's all about the GSYNC. I can't even do 120Hz anymore. Too used to 165Hz. Just cap FPS in software 5 points behind max refresh rate, and you're in constant GSYNC mode. No VSYNC On/Off issues at all. Although I'm also reasonably happy anywhere above the 135Hz point.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Can't wait to game on my new 4K 65". ?

Nvidia sent me two email confirmations with the same order number...


----------



## FLCLimax

Any screen below 4K will literally damage my eyes, and those high hz 1440 panels are terrible. How are people talking about the Titan and can't even afford a good display?


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> A little advice: if you guys who bought this chip are planning to upgrade to Volta, keep your ears to the pavement and sell those puppies accordingly, like,2 Months before it's release . that's how I do it anyways...


honestly i just need 4k at 60 fps with my lg oled 55 inch. Volta will not do 120 fps at 4k if a 144 hz 4k monitor will be released next year

So until then i will be good with titan x

I know card its pricey but im tired to wait for amd.


----------



## Badexample

I just called NVIDIA customer service. I want to know why I get this message: The following products are restricted by the shipping country you specified.

You may go back and change your shipping information, or you may continue with your specified shipping country and have the following items removed from your order: 1.NVIDIA TITAN X

They could not answer it lol.. They don't know why. They are totally clueless.


----------



## Testier

Any news for canadian yet? Still unable to check out here.


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Any news for canadian yet? Still unable to check out here.


I called them and are totally clueless. What a bunch of *****


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> nope
> 
> and 60Hz looks like crap after 10 seconds of 144hz


^This. No matter how nice the resolution is 60hz is just garbage. I consider 3440x1440p at 100hz the sweet spot for me. The best of both world's if you will. I'll be all over 4k 120hz when the price isn't ridiculous and we have the gpu to push it. Unfortunately we aren't quite there yet.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> ^This. No matter how nice the resolution is 60hz is just garbage. I consider 3440x1440p at 100hz the sweet spot for me. The best of both world's if you will. I'll be all over 4k 120hz when the price and isn't ridiculous and we have the gpu to push it. Unfortunately we aren't quite there yet.


Once you play 30-40 fps at 4K going to 60 fps is Godlike.


----------



## Testier

They said something about passing it to higher departments or something when I called them. Told me to call later today.


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Once you play 30-40 fps at 4K going to 60 fps is Godlike.


Haha. I had a Acer Predator 4k with gsync for about a week. Had no problem maintaining 60fps with my setup. At the end of the day I just couldn't handle being locked at 60 frames. Games looked great but it just wasn't for me. After being on a higher refresh rate display for so long 60hz gives me motion sickness after about an hour of gameplay. I feel like crap afterwards.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jasondub*
> 
> Which site did you get this graph from? I only found 2 reviews so far, one single, one SLI, none of them are OCed....
> 
> 
> 
> https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18741612&page=33
Click to expand...

huh. totally odd it's on a forum when *hexus hasn't published a review . . .*

but hey! why check sources when it says what one wants it to . . .


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Can't wait to game on my new 4K 65". ?
> 
> Nvidia sent me two email confirmations with the same order number...


Can't wait to game on my new 4k 70"










Also had the same 2 email issue. Though the one that arrived just now said it was sent 2 hours ago.


----------



## jincuteguy

So just woke up and see the new Titan X still avaialble to buy on Nvidia store atm. I thought it would be Sold Out by now????

Should I get it now or do u guys think it will be Sold Out later today?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> huh. totally odd it's on a forum when *hexus hasn't published a review . . .*
> 
> but hey! why check sources when it says what one wants it to . . .


Because it's not done yet?

The gains are more or less the same as the other site. Keep on living in that denial...









Your 980Ti is about half a Titan X Pascal.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> huh. totally odd it's on a forum when *hexus hasn't published a review . . .*
> 
> but hey! why check sources when it says what one wants it to . . .


What, does Hexus have a copyright on that color scheme for their graphs?


----------



## x3sphere

It's legit, editor from the site posted it here https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?p=29858248#post29858248

In another post he said he got a 1950 OC, seems to be limited by cooler as expected


----------



## marc0053

Canadians should call the NVidia support line like I did to report the error when trying to buy the Titan X. Hopefully this will accelerate a fix.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So just woke up and see the new Titan X still avaialble to buy on Nvidia store atm. I thought it would be Sold Out by now????
> 
> Should I get it now or do u guys think it will be Sold Out later today?


Why wait if you have the money?


----------



## Ferreal

Just ordered 2 for next day shipping. HB bridge out of stock









I guess the LED bridge will have to do for now.


----------



## zealord

congrats to all that can afford 1 or even 2 of those cards. I envy you a bit


----------



## DADDYDC650

Something to pass the time


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> congrats to all that can afford 1 or even 2 of those cards. I envy you a bit


I'll tell you the same thing I said to another poster in a different forum:

you won't envy my credit card bill


----------



## skypine27

Ordered two. The link in the email worked from my cell phone. Came to
$2,597.27

Not sure if they even includes shipping or not since the shipping charge isn't in the itemized receipt from PayPal.


----------



## SynchroSCP

Its nice to be able to pass a new card up for once, so far the 1080 is more than enough for my 1440p @ 144hz setup. It will be a while before games get too far advanced that this setup isn't able to keep up so hopefully I can pass up on several iterations.


----------



## dela

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marc0053*
> 
> Just called Nvidia and they said my 1st order didn't go through for $1,709 CAD.
> They currently don't have a fix for Canadians so for now we can't buy.


Looks like they might have fixed it for Canadians. I just got an order through to Toronto with a confirmation email.


----------



## gamingarena

Yes, Canada is a go just got my confirmation Toronto here


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> huh. totally odd it's on a forum when *hexus hasn't published a review . . .*
> 
> but hey! why check sources when it says what one wants it to . . .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because it's not done yet?
> 
> The gains are more or less the same as the other site. Keep on living in that denial...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your 980Ti is about half a Titan X Pascal.
Click to expand...

denial? that's rich. how about skepticism or would that be trolling?

and what does my 980TI have to do with anything? or would _that_ be trolling?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> huh. totally odd it's on a forum when *hexus hasn't published a review . . .*
> 
> but hey! why check sources when it says what one wants it to . . .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What, does Hexus have a copyright on that color scheme for their graphs?
Click to expand...

well, there is *their watermark* in the lower left.


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marc0053*
> 
> Canadians should call the NVidia support line like I did to report the error when trying to buy the Titan X. Hopefully this will accelerate a fix.


I did an didn't get any good answer at all
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dela*
> 
> Looks like they might have fixed it for Canadians. I just got an order through to Toronto with a confirmation email.


Same here! Thanks!

What is up with these taxes? I don't live in USA?









I just paid 1816 CAD for a single GPU.. How ******ed I am?


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badexample*
> 
> I did an didn't get any good answer at all
> Same here! Thanks!
> 
> What is up with these taxes? I don't live in USA?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just paid 1816 CAD for a single GPU.. How ******ed I am?


So you dont pay customs its like buying loccaly her and paying taxes


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> denial? that's rich. how about skepticism or would that be trolling?
> 
> and what does my 980TI have to do with anything? or would _that_ be trolling?
> well, there is *their watermark* in the lower left.


Any non-love regarding the Titan is considered hate. For individuals that say they don't care about others comments about the products they purchase, they sure do get upset easily.


----------



## i7monkey

twice the price of a 1080 for 10 extra frames

heh no thanks


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> So you dont pay customs its like buying loccaly her and paying taxes


Good stuff! I think both countries signed a taxes treaty?









I got raped in the past by the customs. Not cool


----------



## Badexample

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> twice the price of a 1080 for 10 extra frames
> 
> heh no thanks


Just like a SLI setup which is more expensive!


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> denial? that's rich. how about skepticism or would that be trolling?
> 
> and what does my 980TI have to do with anything? or would _that_ be trolling?
> well, there is *their watermark* in the lower left.


Wow, I couldn't even see that on this crappy laptop LCD until you pointed it out.


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> denial? that's rich. how about skepticism or would that be trolling?
> 
> and what does my 980TI have to do with anything? or would _that_ be trolling?
> well, there is *their watermark* in the lower left.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any non-love regarding the Titan is considered hate. For individuals that say they don't care about others comments about the products they purchase, they sure do get upset easily.
Click to expand...

well color me mystified since *i didn't say anything about the card*.

on a side note:

for the sense of etiquette; if one doesn't like the price of the TXP they should ignore it and move on.

however, if one doesn't like critiques of the TXP they ought to also ignore it and move on.

only fair for both but i guess two wrongs make a right . .right?


----------



## bl4ckdot

Just came back from work, got my Titan X boys !


----------



## rcfc89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Because it's not done yet?
> 
> The gains are more or less the same as the other site. Keep on living in that denial...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your 980Ti is about half a Titan X Pascal.


Lol no. I'm getting almost 25-30 more frames in the results I've seen so far with my Lightnings in SLI.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Took a nap and just now tried to buy a Titan-X( take my money NVidia) just now and it finally worked!


----------



## jincuteguy

I'm surprised the new Titan X is still available right now, thought it would be Sold Out by now. Maybe it won't be sold out after all, so for all the ppl that trying to buy them and gouging the price to get profit, you're wrong.


----------



## stryker7314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SsXxX*
> 
> stop it people for the sake of humanity just stop it . . . and then u ask why NVidia gets greedy, vote with your wallet, say no to cut chips for more money, do the right thing . . . this is so disrespectful of NVidia at this spec and that price . . . WE DESERVE FULL-FAT PASCAL AT A LOWER PRICE !!!!
> 
> seriously please don't give NVidia a reason to stay greedy like they are, VOTE WITH YOUR WALLETS people
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> #pray_for_vega


Fully agree. What a rip, a cut down chip is a joke.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> I'm surprised the new Titan X is still available right now, thought it would be Sold Out by now. Maybe it won't be sold out after all, so for all the ppl that trying to buy them and gouging the price to get profit, you're wrong.


Might be why Nvidia wanted to keep them all in house. Harder to sell out and quicker to get it into consumers hands.


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> ^This. No matter how nice the resolution is 60hz is just garbage. I consider 3440x1440p at 100hz the sweet spot for me. The best of both world's if you will. I'll be all over 4k 120hz when the price isn't ridiculous and we have the gpu to push it. Unfortunately we aren't quite there yet.


I go through monitors like crazy and currently settled on the PG348. I just want 4K IPS or better at 100Hz+ or better.


----------



## Shogon

I think after taxes and fees my Ruger M77 was actually cheaper than this card.

Gratz you guys on your new cards! Hopefully you see that Pascal bios tweaker soon so you can fiddle with it like the Titan X of yester year.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Took a nap and just now tried to buy a Titan-X( take my money NVidia) just now and it finally worked!


Mine went through as well!


----------



## stefxyz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stryker7314*
> 
> Fully agree. What a rip, a cut down chip is a joke.


Funny thing is idf tghe full chip would have 200 less CUDA cores than this stripped down version these guys would be happy even tho the performance would be worse. For me its just exkuse to justify not to purchase...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rcfc89*
> 
> Lol no. I'm getting almost 25-30 more frames in the results I've seen so far with my Lightnings in SLI.


I'm talking about stock 980Tis, those cards are far from stock.


----------



## jincuteguy

Would be funny if the 1080Ti will be out a month or 2 after this.


----------



## Ferreal

Microcenter has the HB sli bridge in stock if anyone is looking for them.


----------



## Seyumi

Flop on the new Titan X? I remember the original Titan X being sold out immediately and impossible to get for months. The Maxwell one that was Nvidia store exclusive as well (for a few weeks) sold out in a few hours.


----------



## SeraphX17

Do you guys think the Kraken G10 will be compatible? It's compatible w/ the 1080 so hopefully that means it is right?


----------



## junkman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seyumi*
> 
> Flop on the new Titan X? I remember the original Titan X being sold out immediately and impossible to get for months. The Maxwell one that was Nvidia store exclusive as well (for a few weeks) sold out in a few hours.


I think they either had more in stock prepared or:

1) A lot of people who bought it will get refunded and not get their cards due to being oversold, or..

2) Price being 200 + Maxwell TitanX was too much for some people to stomach for gaming, regardless of performance.

I'm hoping they actually deliver on shipment. Always skeptical about low volume items when they don't declare OOS. We will see.


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> For real, benches, we don't need no stinking benches, if the 60% claim fail, return it...


My standard thinking proves true again: take whatever Nvidia says, cut that in half, and that is probably close to what it will really be. lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dr Mad*
> 
> Yes, and maybe the EK Titan X waterblock could also fit (?)


EK said no, but they are machining blocks for the new Titan X already and it start shipping in a couple weeks. Supposedly pre-orders are up now but I dont know for sure since their web store has been down the two times I checked earlier, probably once again from too much web traffic same as the 1080 launch.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> There's no such thing as a 1440p 144hz OLED.
> 
> You LCD peasant.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LCD looks like someone put a gray filter over my eyes after 1 second of OLED.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would not trade 144hz, 300hz, 2000hz for it.


Disagree.

After getting this LG 144hz monitor as my stepping stone, I can not go back to 60hz. Seeing the slight judder and stops for PC gaming I will not go any lower than 120. Next level for me will a machine that can keep consent frames above 120fps on one of the newer 34" ultra wide.


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *i7monkey*
> 
> twice the price of a 1080 for 10 extra frames
> 
> heh no thanks


I'm almost certain some people are here to troll... On which world is Titan "just 10 fps" faster, everywhere I saw it's 35% faster despite the lower boost clock, imagine what it will do in clocks similar to 1080's


----------



## marc0053

Just got mine as well for $1,833 CAD shipped to Kingston, Ontario with 1-3 business days shipping service.


----------



## dVeLoPe

ok ok so i have the money but not sure its smart to purchase one

was going to go with 1080 sli but with all the 1080ti talk I might just sell the 1080 and buy this

and then regret the purchase in a before end of year cause the Ti is gonna release..


----------



## Zaor

Wish Titan X had a 10% discount if you bought 3 like this bargain here









http://www.ebay.com/itm/Galaxy-GeForce-GTX-670-GC-4-GB-GDDR5-PCI-Express-3-0-DVI-DVI-HDMI-DP-SLI-Ready-/162125010095?hash=item25bf6754af:g:71gAAOSwOVpXeQcL


----------



## looniam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Took a nap and just now tried to buy a Titan-X( take my money NVidia) just now and it finally worked!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marc0053*
> 
> Just got mine as well for $1,833 CAD shipped to Kingston, Ontario with 1-3 business days shipping service.


and w/jpmboy picking two up . . . i suspect OCN's benchmark threads and maybe HWbot will be busy this weekend.


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> My standard thinking proves true again: take whatever Nvidia says, cut that in half, and that is probably close to what it will really be. lol


except the performance they claimed for 1080, 1070 and new Titan is exactly correct


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steven185*
> 
> I'm almost certain some people are here to troll... On which world is Titan "just 10 fps" faster, everywhere I saw it's 35% faster despite the lower boost clock, imagine what it will do in clocks similar to 1080's


If they say it enough times it becomes true in their minds.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Well, this is the scenario of a 1080 overclocked.
> 
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/10325/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-and-1070-founders-edition-review/31
> 
> Given we have an increase of 50% more bandwidth and exactly 2 more GPCs, I think its not an issue.


There just IS no issue, bottom line; like you said. People keep hyping up HBM2 as the holy grail but they dont' realize that it would provide basically ZERO real world benefit here.

The only HBM2 that is feasible currently with such bad yields is 3072 bit HBM2 (which is what these TITANs were "rumored" to have anyway.), and 3072 bit HBM2 only has 540 GB/s of bandwidth! This GDDR5X on the TITAN X has 480 GB/s at stock speed! And you can EASILY overclock GDDR5X to 11,000mhz effective from 10,000mhz base; and that will give you a whopping 528 GB/s of bandwidth!

Anyone who REALLY thinks 540 GB/s will give any actual benefit over the nearly identical 528 GB/s of OC'ed G5X is crazy frankly lol.

Hell, OC'ed G5X in this case is even faster than the 4096 bit HBM1 in the Fury-X that had 512 GB/s.

Even full on 4096 bit HBM2 only gives 720 GB/s, which is less than 200GB/s difference compared to that 528 GB/s figure of the OC G5X. And 4096 bit won't be ready till mid 2017 at earliest most likely.

People need to understand that memory bandwidth is at the point of "16x pci lanes vs 8x lanes" on your GPU. you literally gain like 0.5fps, MAYBE 1fps from DOUBLING the pci bandwidth to 16x. Think of card bandwidth as the "size of a pipe", and your GPU is the water pump, and the data is the water. If you have 2 square inches of water pumping per second, and a 1.5 inch diameter pipe, and then double the size of the pipe to 3 inches; you get a substantial performance gain since you are now getting 2 inches of water per second instead of the pipe being the bottleneck limiting to 1.5 inch per second. HOWEVER, if you double it again to 6 inches wide pipe you gain ZERO benefit as the pump can only push 2 inches per second! So the ONLY way we will benefit from HBM (wider pipe) is when our GPU "pumps" become more powerful!


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> There just IS no issue, bottom line; like you said. People keep hyping up HBM2 as the holy grail but they dont' realize that it would provide basically ZERO real world benefit here.
> 
> The only HBM2 that is feasible currently with such bad yields is 3072 bit HBM2 (which is what these TITANs were "rumored" to have anyway.), and 3072 bit HBM2 only has 540 GB/s of bandwidth! This GDDR5X on the TITAN X has 480 GB/s at stock speed! And you can EASILY overclock GDDR5X to 11,000mhz effective from 10,000mhz base; and that will give you a whopping 528 GB/s of bandwidth!
> 
> Anyone who REALLY thinks 540 GB/s will give any actual benefit over the nearly identical 528 GB/s of OC'ed G5X is crazy frankly lol.
> 
> Hell, OC'ed G5X in this case is even faster than the 4096 bit HBM1 in the Fury-X that had 512 GB/s.
> 
> Even full on 4096 bit HBM2 only gives 720 GB/s, which is less than 200GB/s difference compared to that 528 GB/s figure of the OC G5X. And 4096 bit won't be ready till mid 2017 at earliest most likely.
> 
> People need to understand that memory bandwidth is at the point of "16x pci lanes vs 8x lanes" on your GPU. you literally gain like 0.5fps, MAYBE 1fps from DOUBLING the pci bandwidth to 16x. Think of card bandwidth as the "size of a pipe", and your GPU is the water pump, and the data is the water. If you have 2 square inches of water pumping per second, and a 1.5 inch diameter pipe, and then double the size of the pipe to 3 inches; you get a substantial performance gain since you are now getting 2 inches of water per second instead of the pipe being the bottleneck limiting to 1.5 inch per second. HOWEVER, if you double it again to 6 inches wide pipe you gain ZERO benefit as the pump can only push 2 inches per second! So the ONLY way we will benefit from HBM (wider pipe) is when our GPU "pumps" become more powerful!


You are really hung up on the performance side of HBM2 as the only reason to want it.

Overall smaller package is another major reason for wanting it.


----------



## Fiercy

People just find reason to not like something all the time...No need to explain them anything no one needs HBM in a gaming card and same thing with high speed ram there is no difference between dd3 and dd4 its 0!


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> You are really hung up on the performance side of HBM2 as the only reason to want it.
> 
> Overall smaller package is another major reason for wanting it.


The lower power consumption is useful but HBM2 right now come at a very very high cost. Overall smaller package is useful for SFF cards like the fury nano but I am not sure if the market is big enough to justify 300+ dollars more just for SFF version.

I think maybe we will see a 3/4 stack version on consumer if HBM2 comes to consumer soon. Honestly, you dont need that much bandwidth for just gaming. Other pro applications, maybe.


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> The lower power consumption is useful but HBM2 right now come at a very very high cost. Overall smaller package is useful for SFF cards like the fury nano but I am not sure if the market is big enough to justify 300+ dollars more just for SFF version.
> 
> I think maybe we will see a 3/4 stack version on consumer if HBM2 comes to consumer soon. Honestly, you dont need that much bandwidth for just gaming. Other pro applications, maybe.


You are trying to use cost against the use of HBM2 on a halo product like a Titan class card. The cost difference between it and GDDR5X is negligible at this level of product.


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> except the performance they claimed for 1080, 1070 and new Titan is exactly correct


Nvidia: New Titan X 60% faster in gaming!
reality: 27-30% faster.

How is what they claimed true?


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EniGma1987*
> 
> Nvidia: New Titan X 60% faster in gaming!
> reality: 27-30% faster.
> 
> How is what they claimed true?
> 
> Lot of clains about the GTX 1080 that were complete lies too...


60% faster than the old Titan X. Nvidia never made any claims about the new Titan X's performance compared to GTX 1080.


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EniGma1987*
> 
> Nvidia: New Titan X 60% faster in gaming!
> reality: 27-30% faster.
> 
> How is what they claimed true?
> 
> Lot of clains about the GTX 1080 that were complete lies too...


There is only a handfull of reviews I wouldn't jump to the conclusions so fast... we simply don't know how fast it is yet.

Besides the only true benches I would look at are those made with water cooling.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> You are trying to use cost against the use of HBM2 on a halo product like a Titan class card. The cost difference between it and GDDR5X is negligible at this level of product.


Not really. You need HBM2 controllers and the only card right now that have that is the GP100. You are essentially forced to use a 3584 core version of the GP100 which is probably gonna give it a higher price than currently for very little performance improvement if at all.


----------



## xTesla1856

So mad at Nvidia, there is no physical way to get the card in Switzerland, they only ship to Germany and Austria.


----------



## stefxyz

...


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> ...


What about customs fees?


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *looniam*
> 
> huh. totally odd it's on a forum when *hexus hasn't published a review . . .*
> 
> but hey! why check sources when it says what one wants it to . . .


Oops, my bad, I saw it on my phone...


----------



## dVeLoPe

if i sell my 1080 for what i paid and buy this will i be able to sell this for at least 1k when the Ti comes out?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EniGma1987*
> 
> Nvidia: New Titan X 60% faster in gaming!


yes, 60% faster than the old Titan X at stock

and it is exactly that, even a little over 60%


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChevChelios*
> 
> yes, 60% faster than the old Titan X at stock
> 
> and it is exactly that, even a little over 60%


chevy keep us updated. what is your situation like? You still don't want to own the best of the best GPU that was ever created in the history of mankind? Are you happy with your old GTX 1080







?


----------



## ChevChelios

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> chevy keep us updated. what is your situation like? You still don't want to own the best of the best GPU that was ever created in the history of mankind? Are you happy with your old GTX 1080
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


me and my 1080 talked it out and I said I wont leave her for the new Titan X










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



only for Volta


----------



## Murlocke

Has anyone contacted NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.

Never had a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon. It's 1PM there now so I am starting to get a little worried, as I am showing no labels created yet on my UPS and FedEx accounts.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ghoxt*
> 
> I always laugh when someone says Nvidia or AMD don't include "X" feature like HBM2 or NVlink because it's too expensive on that chip. They make so much profit in their largest revenue segment that I and others would beg to differ. they are just doing what they feel they need to do to carve separate features between professional grade and consumer grade.
> 
> So the next big Nvidia Expo when we hear about Volta, take care to wonder what is actually coming to the consumer space compared to the hype.


It is not that it is too expensive for that chip, it either makes a more expensive current chip less attractive or make selling a future chip for more difficult. As a business decision you should only introduce new features if it helps your bottomline.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Has anyone contact NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.
> 
> Never seen a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon.


the best thing you can do is doing something else. keep your mind off the card.

in a couple of days you will look back and say "hey why did I waste so many hours thinking about a card that eventually comes?"

read a book, watch a movie or do cleaning. That is why I do when I don't know what to do with myself


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Has anyone contacted NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.
> 
> Never had a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon. It's 1PM there now so I am starting to get a little worried, as I am showing no labels even created yet on my UPS and FedEx accounts.


I wasn't given any guarantee when I called, other than that I will get an email notification when it does ship. Now, if their shipping email system is as bad as their purchasing system, I'll probably get that email after the card is delivered.









Funny story, HP has actually done this to me before, notification of shipment after the product had not only shipped but in fact been received.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> the best thing you can do is doing something else. keep your mind off the card.
> 
> in a couple of days you will look back and say "hey why did I waste so many hours thinking about a card that eventually comes?"
> 
> read a book, watch a movie or do cleaning. That is why I do when I don't know what to do with myself


I have a friend from out of town stopping by tomorrow and he really wanted to see the card's performance in person, one of the reasons I decided to pay for overnight AM shipping.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I have a friend from out of town stopping by tomorrow and he really wanted to see the card's performance in person, one of the reasons I decided to pay for overnight AM shipping.


I ordered a bunch of water cooling components a few weeks ago when I got my 1070 and paid like $70 for overnight shipping. Got it like 5 days later thanks to no weekend delivery + 4th of July holiday. Super excited about that.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Has anyone contacted NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.
> 
> Never had a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon. It's 1PM there now so I am starting to get a little worried, as I am showing no labels created yet on my UPS and FedEx accounts.


Didn't you hear? The reason it hasn't gone out of stock is because we're all just placing pre-orders, today was just a paper launch.







/s

(It wouldn't surprise me if this was the case.)


----------



## Snaporz

Oh geez. I had my order at 6:03 and no updates either. I'll be waiting on a waterblock most likely before I even install it but I still paid the $35 for tomorrow morning delivery. I'll be rather disappointed if it doesnt hold true.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> Didn't you hear? The reason it hasn't gone out of stock is because we're all just placing pre-orders, today was just a paper launch.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (It wouldn't surprise me if this was the case.)


If thats the case, I will be seriously considering cancel the order. That would absolutely stupid.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Has anyone contacted NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.
> 
> Never had a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon. It's 1PM there now so I am starting to get a little worried, as I am showing no labels created yet on my UPS and FedEx accounts.


Dude, it's the first day of launch, which means things are going to be just a little bit nuts.


----------



## Snaporz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Dude, it's the first day of launch, which means things are going to be just a little bit nuts.


Shipping isn't hard. Boxes ready to go, 1 product is easy. Amazon deals with 1,000x the scale an hour lol.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magnek*
> 
> Dude, it's the first day of launch, which means things are going to be just a little bit nuts.


Actually their site is pretty clear:
"Orders must be received by 3:00pm EST (noon PST), to be processed the same business day."

Like said above, shipping is not hard. You slap a label on a box and UPS/FedEx comes and picks it up.


----------



## Maintenance Bot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Has anyone contacted NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.
> 
> Never had a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon. It's 1PM there now so I am starting to get a little worried, as I am showing no labels created yet on my UPS and FedEx accounts.


Nvidia store blows.

I have purchased 2 cards from Nvidia store this year at different times. It took them almost 48 hours to process and get tracking info for both cards.


----------



## dmasteR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Has anyone contacted NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.
> 
> Never had a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon. It's 1PM there now so I am starting to get a little worried, as I am showing no labels created yet on my UPS and FedEx accounts.


DigitalRiver does all the shipping from my understanding.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I have a friend from out of town stopping by tomorrow and he really wanted to see the card's performance in person, one of the reasons I decided to pay for overnight AM shipping.


put in an old card. reduce settings to a mix so that games still look good, but run well too.
ask him what he thinks about your new card.
then put on the troll face and make him look like a newb


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> Shipping isn't hard. Boxes ready to go, 1 product is easy. Amazon deals with 1,000x the scale an hour lol.


lol I don't think it's appropriate to compare nVidia's webstore with Amazon
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Actually their site is pretty clear:
> "Orders must be received by 3:00pm EST (noon PST), to be processed the same business day."
> 
> Like said above, shipping is not hard. You slap a label on a box and UPS/FedEx comes and picks it up.


Well it's still 1:19pm PST where I am, so give them a call and ask them if they'll be able to honor the same day shipping guarantee I guess?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> put in an old card. reduce settings to a mix so that games still look good, but run well too.
> ask him what he thinks about your new card.
> then put on the troll face and make him look like a newb


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> put in an old card. reduce settings to a mix so that games still look good, but run well too.
> ask him what he thinks about your new card.
> then put on the troll face and make him look like a newb


Haha.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Has anyone contacted NVIDIA to see if these are going out today? I was told "no guarantees". That's pretty laughable considering I ordered at 6:11AM their time.
> 
> Never had a company not get a product shipped out the same day when ordering before noon. It's 1PM there now so I am starting to get a little worried, as I am showing no labels created yet on my UPS and FedEx accounts.


No but when you order two like I did, but they process three due to a glitch....which they will not be able to catch and cancel it in time before it ships (even though we spoke at 10amEST). So I would imagine these will ship today, since they can't cancel my glitched third order...so Nvidia gets a $1,300 loan until I receive it to then send back.......so they better be shipping today


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Haha.


Actually, nvidia may not even use Fedex or UPS....


----------



## DADDYDC650

If Nvidia doesn't ship our cards out today I say we all riot and burn this thread to the ground!!!!


----------



## Murlocke

Well I called them, could barely understand the phone support guy but he said it's scheduled to go out today. Probably the same case with anyone else who ordered today (minus in the last 1 1/2 hours, those people will likely have to wait).


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Well I called them, could barely understand the phone support guy but he said it's scheduled to go out today. Probably the same case with anyone else who ordered today (minus in the last 1 1/2 hours, those people will likely have to wait).


Ehe, actually the person I talked to say it may not be shipped out today........... I got my confirmation email at 10:29 PST....


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Ehe, actually the person I talked to say it may not be shipped out today........... I got my confirmation email at 10:29 PST....


I got my my order in at 6:09 am. Would have been sooner if it wasn't for that busted buy now button. Hope it ships out today..... GL to us all.


----------



## Murlocke

Mine just shipped via FedEx.

Scheduled delivery:
Wed, 8/3/2016 by 10:30 am

EDIT: My order time was 6:11AM PST for anyone wondering.


----------



## carlhil2

https://twitter.com/hardwarecanucks/status/760242762545565697 haters going to hate, Lol...


----------



## techguymaxc

Just got my shipment confirmation as well. I didn't opt for morning delivery since I'll be at work, but it should be on my doorstep by the time I get home, or shortly thereafter.


----------



## fisher6

Nvidia doesn't ship to Norway or Sweden! Only Finland and Denmark







Gotta stick to my 980 Tis for now I guess.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Mine just shipped via FedEx.
> 
> Scheduled delivery:
> Wed, 8/3/2016 by 10:30 am
> 
> EDIT: My order time was 6:11AM PST for anyone wondering.


My order time was 6:10AM PST, still no shipping confirmation.


----------



## Snaporz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> My order time was 6:10AM PST, still no shipping confirmation.


Same, same... 6:03 and nada yet. Oh well, they are headed out the door so that's good.


----------



## axiumone

Well, its 5pm on the east coast. I'm still able to buy two. Stock hasn't been depleted.


----------



## Snaporz

I was expecting a sell out within an hour of launch.


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Mine just shipped via FedEx.
> 
> Scheduled delivery:
> Wed, 8/3/2016 by 10:30 am
> 
> EDIT: My order time was 6:11AM PST for anyone wondering.


Still waiting for mine... Don't know how to put them inside without water blocks... I wrote to EK about them and they didnt say anything usefull. I mean looking at the pcb of old titan x there is a lot of similaraties could the old block posssibly fit?


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> I was expecting a sell out within an hour of launch.


Either there are massive amounts of stock, or not too many people buying


----------



## techguymaxc

I think I pulled the trigger around 6:20 or so PST (was trying to find something, anything about 4k single card performance) but had it in my cart a bit earlier than that.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> I was expecting a sell out within an hour of launch.


About what I expected as well. Very interesting. I wonder if prior Pascal launch inventory issues were really on the AIB partners/vendors rather than NV? I can't imagine no one is interested in this card, there's plenty of people buying here.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> About what I expected as well. Very interesting. I wonder if prior Pascal launch inventory issues were really on the AIB partners/vendors rather than NV? I can't imagine no one is interested in this card, there's plenty of people buying here.


On the other hand it isn't too surprising. They didn't give out cards to reviewers, so there's very little information about them out there. Only the tech enthusiasts that follow forums like this one are really aware about the launch. Less reviews=Less Views and people that know about the product.

Granted I'm not sure how many people outside of forums like these actually buy the titan line.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> My order time was 6:10AM PST, still no shipping confirmation.


It seems they may be prioritizing overnight (or overnight AM) orders first.

If you ordered before 6:11 and it hasn't shipped, did you overnight?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> I was expecting a sell out within an hour of launch.


$1200 is waaay too much to ask for a blind buy. Even with the return policy, majority of people will wait for reviews. This card also came out of the blue, all my RL friends had never heard about this card until today and they all have pretty high end systems.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> It seems they may be prioritizing overnight (or overnight AM) orders first.
> 
> If you ordered before 6:11 and it hasn't shipped, did you overnight?


I did overnight PM.


----------



## Snaporz

I did overnight AM


----------



## l88bastar

I paid for over night morning shipping as well.....first confirmation came in 9:03 EST, second one came in 9:29am.....and third glittched order came in 11:34am. No shipping notice as of yet.


----------



## jincuteguy

So I just got back from Gym, and it's 2pm in SoCal here. And I still see the Titan X available for Order. Damn, Nvidia must be stocking these new Titan X alot.


----------



## Murlocke

Crossing my fingers for you guys... perhaps it's just another email delay.

More owners we have tomorrow, more OCing results we can share.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> On the other hand it isn't too surprising. They didn't give out cards to reviewers, so there's very little information about them out there. Only the tech enthusiasts that follow forums like this one are really aware about the launch. Less reviews=Less Views and people that know about the product.
> 
> Granted I'm not sure how many people outside of forums like these actually buy the titan line.


This launch was definitely a stealth launch compared to any other launch in recent memory.

On a side-note: your avatar pic is my desktop background on my media server (5820k).


----------



## jincuteguy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> I paid for over night morning shipping as well.....first confirmation came in 9:03 EST, second one came in 9:29am.....and third glittched order came in 11:34am. No shipping notice as of yet.


So did anyone order and got a confirmation for Shipping yet?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So did anyone order and got a confirmation for Shipping yet?


So far techguymaxc and I have tracking numbers.


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jincuteguy*
> 
> So did anyone order and got a confirmation for Shipping yet?


Yes, myself and at least one other back in the last page or two, about half an hour ago.


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Not really. You need HBM2 controllers and the only card right now that have that is the GP100. You are essentially forced to use a 3584 core version of the GP100 which is probably gonna give it a higher price than currently for very little performance improvement if at all.


Let's be real, and go right to the point you are really bringing up (even if you didn't notice).....

The card we have here, it should be the 1080 Ti. The Titan X(P) should be the larger die, but later down the road. Although that doesn't take away from the point that a halo card should have HBM2, because, well...because it is a halo card and it is available. You don't buy the Ferrari and then try to get Pleather, even if it performs/looks/feels the exact same as real leather. You go all the way and get the real leather, even if it might last half as long.

Halo products are just that for a reason, skimping on a halo product makes you look like an ass.

EDIT:

You wouldn't go to a Michelin Star restaurant for their pasta carbonara and be OK with them using Oscar Meyer Bacon instead of the best pancetta available.


----------



## geort45

LOL so after 34 pages of arguing, analysis etc, day arrives and ppl still quietly buy them regardless...


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTesla1856*
> 
> So mad at Nvidia, there is no physical way to get the card in Switzerland, they only ship to Germany and Austria.


http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.A0.H0.Xpascal+titan+.TRS1&_nkw=pascal+titan+x&_sacat=0


----------



## sammkv

The people who ordered post some pics of it inside your sexy cases!


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.A0.H0.Xpascal+titan+.TRS1&_nkw=pascal+titan+x&_sacat=0


LOL, ebay scalpers. Man those guys are the worst. Thankfully NV had enough stock this time around to actually purchase, unlike 1080/1070 for the first couple months.


----------



## pompss

ordered mine at 9.10 am east time which would be 6.10 am pacific, I chose overnight 10.00 am still didn't get the shipping email yet


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sammkv*
> 
> The people who ordered post some pics of it inside your sexy cases!


Not until I can get a waterblock from EK. For now I'll probably stick it in a second PCI-e slot so I don't have to take my 970 out and disassemble my loop, only to temporarily put it back together, then to have to take it down to put the block on the Titan X. After that though, sure!


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> Let's be real, and go right to the point you are really bringing up (even if you didn't notice).....
> 
> The card we have here, it should be the 1080 Ti. The Titan X(P) should be the larger die, but later down the road. Although that doesn't take away from the point that a halo card should have HBM2, because, well...because it is a halo card and it is available. You don't buy the Ferrari and then try to get Pleather, even if it performs/looks/feels the exact same as real leather. You go all the way and get the real leather, even if it might last half as long.
> 
> Halo products are just that for a reason, skimping on a halo product makes you look like an ass.
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> You wouldn't go to a Michelin Star restaurant for their pasta carbonara and be OK with them using Oscar Meyer Bacon instead of the best pancetta available.


With the lack of competition, this type of things are expected. HBM2 is unlikely but I suppose it would be nice to have a 3840 CUDA core version of GP102.

I see your point though and I know what you are talking about regarding the whole 1080 TI thing. However, we may never even get a 1080 TI at this rate. Its clear from Polaris launch, we can see AMD is not ready to compete with GP102 this year at all. Whats preventing nvidia from making a 3328 core 1180 next year for 750-850?

However, it would be really nice if we can get a cut GP100 with 1:2 DP instead of a GP102. Even if that exceed 1200USD.

Edit: Also, still bacon..... I would still eat it because it will still taste amazing.


----------



## Snaporz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> Not until I can get a waterblock from EK. For now I'll probably stick it in a second PCI-e slot so I don't have to take my 970 out and disassemble my loop, only to temporarily put it back together, then to have to take it down to put the block on the Titan X. After that though, sure!


I was being super optimistic that they would release a waterblock sometime this week. 2 weeks of waiting! Damn!


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snaporz*
> 
> I was being super optimistic that they would release a waterblock sometime this week. 2 weeks of waiting! Damn!


An EK rep said it would be available for pre-order today but I can't find it on their site and their support is super slow so I'm not going to bother asking. I thought I saw someone say they ordered one a few pages back as well...


----------



## Snaporz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> An EK rep said it would be available for pre-order today but I can't find it on their site and their support is super slow so I'm not going to bother asking. I thought I saw someone say they ordered one a few pages back as well...


I PM'd a vendor rep earlier. Supposed to be on the site for preorder today. Just hasn't made it up *yet* or maybe will be tomorrow. But that same thread same release on the 16th. I've been checking ekwb all day as well.


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.A0.H0.Xpascal+titan+.TRS1&_nkw=pascal+titan+x&_sacat=0


Holy price gouge batman!


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> LOL, ebay scalpers. Man those guys are the worst. Thankfully NV had enough stock this time around to actually purchase, unlike 1080/1070 for the first couple months.


True, they are scalpers, but since Nvidia's store doesn't ship worldwide it's an option. Maybe he could bargain w/ one of the sellers out there. I've done that plenty of times. And these days buyer protection is pretty good on stuff.


----------



## l88bastar

Or supply will dry up and the scalper option will be the only option for a while...............as soon as more people are aware of these cards existence....that or Magnek is right and Nvidia totally mis-judged the mark with the price / demand...........should be interesting to see.


----------



## magnek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> Let's be real, and go right to the point you are really bringing up (even if you didn't notice).....
> 
> The card we have here, it should be the 1080 Ti. The Titan X(P) should be the larger die, but later down the road. Although that doesn't take away from the point that a halo card should have HBM2, because, well...because it is a halo card and it is available. You don't buy the Ferrari and then try to get Pleather, even if it performs/looks/feels the exact same as real leather. You go all the way and get the real leather, even if it might last half as long.
> 
> Halo products are just that for a reason, skimping on a halo product makes you look like an ass.
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> You wouldn't go to a Michelin Star restaurant for their pasta carbonara and be OK with them using Oscar Meyer Bacon instead of the best pancetta available.


That analogy is priceless.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Mine just shipped via FedEx.
> 
> Scheduled delivery:
> Wed, 8/3/2016 by 10:30 am
> 
> EDIT: My order time was 6:11AM PST for anyone wondering.


My order went through at 6:15AM PST. No shipping email as of yet. Selected overnight AM.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Viveacious*
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.A0.H0.Xpascal+titan+.TRS1&_nkw=pascal+titan+x&_sacat=0


This is one time those scalpers are going to get hosed. NVIDIA still has direct stock for $1200. A few may get bought up at reduced prices for non-NVIDIA ship-to country buyers once the scalpers realise their cards aren't selling.


----------



## CallsignVega

Haha as soon as I post above, NVIDIA goes out of stock on Titan-XP.


----------



## Murlocke

I have a hard time believing if you ordered before 9AM it won't be shipped today.

From my tracking number:
- The package was processed as ready for pickup at 10:23AM (4 hours 12 minutes after I ordered)
- The package was picked up at 2:34PM
- I did not receive email confirmation until 3:41PM

My guess is their email system is just hammered, and that your cards were picked up at the same time.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Haha as soon as I post above, NVIDIA goes out of stock on Titan-XP.


People can call this card a flop all they want, but selling out on a $1200 card that has no "full" reviews on day 1 is an incredible feat. Let's hope it doesn't disappoint.

I predicted it would sell out Day 2 because of this, I wonder how many were sold and how many of those are scalpers.


----------



## pompss

Titan X out of stock guys


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Haha as soon as I post above, NVIDIA goes out of stock on Titan-XP.


And sold out! let price gouging begin









Since 1080 FE is still MIA on nvidia.com im sure this Titan X will be more Halo product and price will jump over $2kUSD easy im sure they sold all 100 Tians they had in stock









Now im pissed i ordered only one and had 2 in my cart


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> My order went through at 6:15AM PST. No shipping email as of yet. Selected overnight AM.
> This is one time those scalpers are going to get hosed. *NVIDIA still has direct stock for $1200*. A few may get bought up at reduced prices for non-NVIDIA ship-to country buyers once the scalpers realise their cards aren't selling.


Not anymore.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I have a hard time believing if you ordered before 9AM it won't be shipped today.
> 
> From my tracking number:
> - The package was processed as ready for pickup at 10:23AM (4 hours 12 minutes after I ordered)
> - The package was picked up at 2:34PM
> - I did not receive email confirmation until 3:41PM
> 
> My guess is their email system is just hammered, and that your cards were picked up at the same time.


Murlocke you have way more trust in the NVIDIA store than I do lol.


----------



## Difunto

order went in at 9:10 AM EST got confirmation at 9:11 AM EST did overnight AM still no shipping email.
last year when i ordered my titan x did it on 3/17/15 got shipping email on 3/18/15 same overnight am delivery...
i guess am gonna get fked again


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> And sold out! let price gouging begin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since 1080 FE is still MIA on nvidia.com im sure this Titan X will be more Halo product and price will jump over $2kUSD easy im sure they sold all 100 Ttians they had in stock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now im pissed i ordered only one and had 2 in my cart


I ordered 2 but they are billing and sending me 3









Perhaps I should take a gander over to ebay with it to find a randy stranger


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Actually, nvidia may not even use Fedex or UPS....


I'd buy this card if JHH personally delivers it to me while driving his Ferrari convoy.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Murlocke you have way more trust in the NVIDIA store than I do lol.


I guess I am always lucky when it comes to things shipping/arriving quickly.

Getting faulty hardware on the other hand? I have around a 25% DOA/faulty rate on every piece of electronic I buy. Just this month a motherboard I bought was DOA.


----------



## gamingarena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> I ordered 2 but they are billing and sending me 3
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps I should take a gander over to ebay with it to find a randy stranger


just admit it you are one of the scalpels


----------



## pompss

Tempted to sell it on ebay for $1700









I also pre-ordered final fantasy XV collector edition and the last time i checked the game on ebay it was sold for $700


----------



## guttheslayer

So does removing the default cooler to replace with waterblock or custom AIO remove the warranty of this card?


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I guess I am always lucky when it comes to things shipping/arriving quickly.
> 
> Getting faulty hardware on the other hand? I have around a 25% DOA/faulty rate on every piece of electronic I buy. Just this month a motherboard I bought was DOA.


Funny, I usually get hosed on shipping since I'm East coast. But I am really lucky on electronics. I cannot even remember the last time I've got a defective component. And I buy a lot of stuff! But I am also really careful when it comes to static electricity etc..


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> So does removing the default cooler to replace with waterblock or custom AIO remove the warranty of this card?


I'd doubt it, as long as you put it back together and there's no physical damage.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Funny, I usually get hosed on shipping since I'm East coast. But I am really lucky on electronics. I cannot even remember the last time I've got a defective component. And I buy a lot of stuff!


I guess that's the good thing about Iowa... smack dab in the middle.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Haha as soon as I post above, NVIDIA goes out of stock on Titan-XP.


Yup, officially out of stock. Time to sell on ebay for max profit!


----------



## DADDYDC650

Anyone know where these are shipping from?


----------



## Viveacious

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Haha as soon as I post above, NVIDIA goes out of stock on Titan-XP.












ebay, anyone?









On a serious note - try bargaining with some of those guys out there, too. I've been able to do that before. Sometimes it's like buying a car. Both sides will give a little and you can come to a compromise on pricing.

Hope those of you in the market for one (especially those in countries that have been excluded from Nvidia's shipping this time around) are able to snag one. Looks like right now they start ~$1500 but that's often w/ no shipping or tax (depending on item location and yours, of course). Couple auctions, too, in their early stages.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=pascal+titan+x&_sop=15


----------



## GoLDii3

eBay and PayPal fees = 14%

JUST LOL if you sell it at 1500 you barely make 100 bucks out of it,not worth the fact that PayPal has a 6 month window where the buyer can open a dispute and get his money back.

Lol at all the suckers selling high value ítems on eBay with anything but wire transfer.


----------



## Silent Scone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Well I called them, could barely understand the phone support guy but he said it's scheduled to go out today. Probably the same case with anyone else who ordered today (minus in the last 1 1/2 hours, those people will likely have to wait).


I'm sure it was you not too long ago telling people _not_ to buy this card, yet here you are. Lol...


----------



## cookiesowns

Didn't get shipping notification yet. I guess me banking on it shipping same day with free shipping is busted. Sucks they don't ship the order it got in. Ordered around 6:02


----------



## FattysGoneWild

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skypine27*
> 
> Ordered two. The link in the email worked from my cell phone. Came to
> $2,597.27
> 
> Not sure if they even includes shipping or not since the shipping charge isn't in the itemized receipt from PayPal.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> eBay and PayPal fees = 14%
> 
> JUST LOL if you sell it at 1500 you barely make 100 bucks out of it,not worth the fact that PayPal has a 6 month window where the buyer can open a dispute and get his money back.
> 
> Lol at all the suckers selling high value ítems on eBay with anything but wire transfer.


You are no better bozo buying these over priced cards. Just to keep e-peen status and say herp derpz guyz! Look at me peasants. Price and bang for the buck is just horrific. Better to go with 2 1080's if one was to go all out. Should be fun seeing all the babies whine when these cards are out dated in less then 6 months.

Here comes the typical poor man haters gonna hate etc response.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> eBay and PayPal fees = 14%
> 
> JUST LOL if you sell it at 1500 you barely make 100 bucks out of it,not worth the fact that PayPal has a 6 month window where the buyer can open a dispute and get his money back.
> 
> Lol at all the suckers selling high value ítems on eBay with anything but wire transfer.


Yup, that 14% really kills the profit margin. I try and use Ebay as a last resort these days for special items I cannot sell on forums or rare items that need a large population to access.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cookiesowns*
> 
> Didn't get shipping notification yet. I guess me banking on it shipping same day with free shipping is busted. Sucks they don't ship the order it got in. Ordered around 6:02


I highly doubt there is any rhyme or reason to NVIDIA's shipping and I fully expect mine to not ship until tomorrow even though I ordered within the first 15 minutes.


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> People can call this card a flop all they want, but selling out on a $1200 card that has no "full" reviews on day 1 is an incredible feat.


The debate over whether or not it's a flop is absolutely dumb. The price of the card presupposes a positive ROI vs stock available. If stock is depleted, by default and according to simple business 101, Nvidia wins.

It's, obviously, a huge success.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> I'm sure it was you not too long ago telling people _not_ to buy this card, yet here you are. Lol...


Um no? I've been saying I am buying once since the day they were announced and I don't recall ever telling someone not to buy the card, quite the opposite. You have confused me with someone else.

1 week, 4 days ago:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Does it say anywhere when this is releasing? I don't really care about priceerformance ratio. I just know that my Titan X isn't handling 4K very well, and I don't want to go SLI nor go back to 1440p.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Great, will be picking one up.


----------



## Fiercy

I don't understand ordered first minute got overnight shipping and still no email about shipping...







I think I am not getting anything tomorrow.


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> I don't understand ordered first minute got overnight shipping and still no email about shipping...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I am not getting anything tomorrow.


----------



## emett

Wow fair bit of Jelly being thrown around!
Kudos to those that got orders in!


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Um no? I've been saying I am buying once since the day they were announced and I don't recall ever telling someone not to buy the card, quite the opposite. You have confused me with someone else.
> 
> 1 week, 4 days ago:


Can you check the tracking number to see if its been shipped from west coast or east coast or what location ?
Normally its California if so there is still time for overnight shipping

I Just called them and mine has not shipped

That info would help a lot thanks


----------



## PostalTwinkie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> I have a hard time believing if you ordered before 9AM it won't be shipped today.
> 
> From my tracking number:
> - The package was processed as ready for pickup at 10:23AM (4 hours 12 minutes after I ordered)
> - The package was picked up at 2:34PM
> - I did not receive email confirmation until 3:41PM
> 
> My guess is their email system is just hammered, and that your cards were picked up at the same time.
> *People can call this card a flop all they want, but selling out on a $1200 card that has no "full" reviews on day 1 is an incredible feat.* Let's hope it doesn't disappoint.
> 
> I predicted it would sell out Day 2 because of this, I wonder how many were sold and how many of those are scalpers.


Not without knowing how many units were available to begin with, for all we know they had 100 units sitting ready to ship. Look at the Fury X, something like 8 review copies went out due to limited availability.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> Not without knowing how many units were available to begin with, for all we know they had 100 units sitting ready to ship. Look at the Fury X, something like 8 review copies went out due to limited availability.


I think this site alone had users that bought more than 100. Considering the stock lasted all business day and a lot of people ordering two, I wouldn't be surprised if they sold over a thousand.


----------



## Fiercy

I mean if they ship it today it dosen't really matter since ek didnt pull the water block out today... So i guess it's all good as long as we get it this week.


----------



## CallsignVega

NVIDIA came through! Both of mine shipped.


----------



## habu58

I just got the tracking number for mine and it was actually shipped earlier today.

Actual pick up :
Tue 8/02/2016 2:34 pm
CIRCLE PINES, MN US


----------



## ToTheSun!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> Not without knowing how many units were available to begin with, for all we know they had 100 units sitting ready to ship. Look at the Fury X, something like 8 review copies went out due to limited availability.


Doesn't matter. These cards were priced against their stock to produce ROI. Stock is depleted. What does that tell you?


----------



## l88bastar

Just got my shipping confirmation

Idiots....I told them specifically which 1 of the 3 cards to cancel. I specifically went over this with the Nvidia CSR three times. So what do I find in my email? They attempted to cancel 2 of my 3 cards, but they had already shipped lmao.


----------



## pompss

just got the tracking number too picked up at 2.34pm :thumb


----------



## Fiercy

Got mine as well!! YaY... now its EK'S turn


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> Got mine as well!! YaY... now its EK'S turn


----------



## l88bastar

ohhh jaaaeeezzzuuuuus

Check that....just got another email.

OK THEY ATTEMPTED TO CANCEL ALL THREE OF MY CARDS ROFL

I ordered two, but a glich added a third. I called CSR to clear it up by cancelling one of the cards.......and the idiots tried to cancel all three of my cards!

I guess its a good thing I went with overnight shipping otherwise I would have been left with NOTHING!

screen capture freeware


----------



## DADDYDC650

My order has shipped! Chose 1-2 day delivery since I figured they were shipping from the Bay Area.

Arriving Thursday. Perfect timing since that's when my new Mastercase Maker 5 arrives.


----------



## pompss

any news of a waterblock ?
I cant use the card without it


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Mine just shipped as well, got the email!


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> ohhh jaaaeeezzzuuuuus
> 
> Check that....just got another email.
> 
> OK THEY ATTEMPTED TO CANCEL ALL THREE OF MY CARDS ROFL
> 
> I ordered two, but a glich added a third. I called CSR to clear it up by cancelling one of the cards.......and the idiots tried to cancel all three of my cards!
> 
> I guess its a good thing I went with overnight shipping otherwise I would have been left with NOTHING!


Gouge the hell out of the 3rd one on Ebay


----------



## cookiesowns

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *habu58*
> 
> I just got the tracking number for mine and it was actually shipped earlier today.
> 
> Actual pick up :
> Tue 8/02/2016 2:34 pm
> CIRCLE PINES, MN US


**** me. I banked on it coming from CA. Should have done overnight shipping. Should I just yolo another one with overnight shipping for SLI?

NVM: out of stock.

Wonder if the uniblocks will fit over the fan + backplate. I guess when I get mine I will let y'all know. Since its shipping from east coast I probably won't get it till next week. RIP


----------



## carlhil2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> Mine just shipped as well, got the email!


Can't WAIT to see what you do with this beast..


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTesla1856*
> 
> Gouge the hell out of the 3rd one on Ebay


YA MY EMAIL LOOKS SCARY!

https://postimg.org/image/tdccvbl4x/screen capture freeware


----------



## CallsignVega

Reminds me never to let I88 order anything for me.


----------



## Ferreal

ordered at 9am pst, got the order confirmation 10mins later. Still no shipping confirmation


----------



## l88bastar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Reminds me never to let I88 order anything for me.


Rofl....I can admit....I had a nerdgasm while ordering....mistakes were made by all parties









Bottom line....NEVER QUESTION THE SOUP NAZI!!!! Just take your soup and move it along, doesn't matter if its exactly what you ordered, cause they will be NO SOUP FOR YOU if you don't keep it moving!


----------



## cookiesowns

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l88bastar*
> 
> Rofl....I can admit....I had a nerdgasm while ordering....mistakes were made by all parties


Sell me your third one? Lol


----------



## Testier

Still not shipped....


----------



## CallsignVega

Anyone else notice they are shipping from Minnesota? What an odd place to ship the world's fastesetest GPU from.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Anyone else notice they are shipping from Minnesota? What an odd place to ship the world's fastesetest GPU from.


Seriously... must be cheap to rent warehouses in MN. Bay Area prices are insane.


----------



## Ferreal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Still not shipped....


When did you order yours?


----------



## D749

Both my cards shipped. Arriving this Thursday!

Tempted to hit up Amazon tonight for the new Rampage V Extreme E10 board, some RAM and a 6900K. I was planning to wait for the Samsung 960 Pro to come out and my new CL case to arrive, but...


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> Both my cards shipped. Arriving this Thursday!
> 
> Tempted to hit up Amazon tonight for the new Rampage V Extreme E10 board, some RAM and a 6900K. I was planning to wait for the Samsung 960 Pro to come out and my new CL case to arrive, but...


That motherboard is amazing. Thing of beauty.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ferreal*
> 
> When did you order yours?


Got my confirmation on 10:29 PST since the Canadian shipping was broken earlier.


----------



## Ferreal

Just called the store, my order is in processing..... Hopefully it ships tomorrow


----------



## Murlocke

Good to hear about the shipped cards.

Anyone want to volunteer to maintain a new owner's club thread and go through the process of getting it [Official]'d? I'm sure we're all tired of the "this card isn't worth it" comments, so we should really just move into our own thread where we can freely discuss our cards tomorrow.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PostalTwinkie*
> 
> Not without knowing how many units were available to begin with, for all we know they had 100 units sitting ready to ship. Look at the Fury X, something like 8 review copies went out due to limited availability.


Sold out is sold out. That means NVIDIA's exceptions were at least met IMO.


----------



## Metros

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D749*
> 
> Both my cards shipped. Arriving this Thursday!
> 
> Tempted to hit up Amazon tonight for the new Rampage V Extreme E10 board, some RAM and a 6900K. I was planning to wait for the Samsung 960 Pro to come out and my new CL case to arrive, but...


The MSI X99 Godlike is great


----------



## HyperMatrix

Other than being upset that I had to pay 3 separate shipping charges because I had to process it all in 3 separate orders due to the whole Canadian ordering bug...I'm happy to say that my 2 cards and sli hb bridge are on their way and should arrive tomorrow morning. #leExcite


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Good to hear about the shipped cards.
> 
> Anyone want to volunteer to maintain a new owner's club thread and go through the process of getting it [Official]'d? I'm sure we're all tired of the "this card isn't worth it" comments, so we should really just move into our own thread where we can freely discuss our cards tomorrow.
> Sold out is sold out. That means NVIDIA's exceptions were at least met IMO.


I agree we need a new thread where we can comment and talk about this card.


----------



## D749

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Metros*
> 
> The MSI X99 Godlike is great


I've also been looking at that board. But I've been using Asus boards for so long I don't know if I'm ready to switch now.


----------



## renejr902

Hi guys, i was at work. THANKS SO MUCH to the canadian guy that said that shipping to canada was now working some hours ago... 10 minutes before going to work i had time to order it. Im very happy. I just checked my email and the card is already shipped to canada montreal and i will receive it tomorrow morning by fedex before 12pm WOW! GREAT! THANKS TO THIS GUY, cant wait to receive that titan x


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Hi guys, i was at work. THANKS SO MUCH to the canadian guy that said that shipping to canada was now working some hours ago... 10 minutes before going to work i had time to order it. Im very happy. I just checked my email and the card is already shipped to canada montreal and i will receive it tomorrow morning by fedex before 12pm WOW! GREAT! THANKS TO THIS GUYS, cant wait to receive that titan x


It's funny to see us Canadians getting our cards faster than some Americans who ordered before us. I will take it. Now to get drunk and pass out so tomorrow comes sooner.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Hi guys, i was at work. THANKS SO MUCH to the canadian guy that said that shipping to canada was now working some hours ago... 10 minutes before going to work i had time to order it. Im very happy. I just checked my email and the card is already shipped to canada montreal and i will receive it tomorrow morning by fedex before 12pm WOW! GREAT! THANKS TO THIS GUY, cant wait to receive that titan x


Wait, you had an option for one day shipping to Canada?


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Wait, you had an option for one day shipping to Canada?


It's fedex. So the 1-3 day shipping option is 1 day to all major cities. Love fedex. Not like that trash ups.


----------



## bee144

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> It's fedex. So the 1-3 day shipping option is 1 day to all major cities. Love fedex. Not like that trash ups.


I have the exact opposite experience. UPS is great where u live and fed ex is crap.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> It's fedex. So the 1-3 day shipping option is 1 day to all major cities. Love fedex. Not like that trash ups.


Nice! Now whether Edmonton can be called a major city is another question.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bee144*
> 
> I have the exact opposite experience. UPS is great where u live and fed ex is crap.


Might be a Canadian problem. UPS is terrible here.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Nice! Now whether Edmonton can be called a major city is another question.


Should be. I'm out in chestermere. 5 minutes east of Calgary. And it's 1 day for me.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Should be. I'm out in chestermere. 5 minutes east of Calgary. And it's 1 day for me.


I havent got my tracking though....... so maybe weds


----------



## pompss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> That motherboard is amazing. Thing of beauty.


Im so close to buy the lian li PC-O7S with the the ASUS RAMPAGE V EDITION 10 + titan x and install the mb and vga waterblock


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> I havent got my tracking though....... so maybe weds


Hmmm. Depends when you ordered I guess. I put mine in at around 11:30am our time. Either way. Just an extra day of waiting at best. And the cards are sold out. So you can still feel good that you got one.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Hmmm. Depends when you ordered I guess. I put mine in at around 11:30am our time. Either way. Just an extra day of waiting at best. And the cards are sold out. So you can still feel good that you got one.


LOL I got my confirmation email at 11:29am our time. and thanks!


----------



## renejr902

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> It's funny to see us Canadians getting our cards faster than some Americans who ordered before us. I will take it. Now to get drunk and pass out so tomorrow comes sooner.


LoL
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Wait, you had an option for one day shipping to Canada?


1-3 days express shipping with fedex. Im from montreal


----------



## renejr902

Finally did you see any new gaming benchmarks except of the two first one of this morning?


----------



## techguymaxc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Anyone else notice they are shipping from Minnesota? What an odd place to ship the world's fastesetest GPU from.


I live in MN so when I saw the shipping location I had to laugh. Overnight shipping from a warehouse on the other side of the metro area from me, maybe 50 miles away. I figured all MN residents were getting their cards from this local distribution center, didn't think anyone else was. That means as of this morning there were maybe 1000 of these things sitting in a building an hour's drive from my house. If I had known that I could've plotted the greatest robbery in PCMR history. I would've been a legend.


----------



## lyang238

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> I live in MN so when I saw the shipping location I had to laugh. Overnight shipping from a warehouse on the other side of the metro area from me, maybe 50 miles away. I figured all MN residents were getting their cards from this local distribution center, didn't think anyone else was. That means as of this morning there were maybe 1000 of these things sitting in a building an hour's drive from my house. If I had known that I could've plotted the greatest robbery in PCMR history. I would've been a legend.


Lol similar thing I found out calling them because I accidentally chose the wrong shipping speed. I am in Milwaukee, WI and realized that it was shipping from MN. Figured I could wait 1 extra day!







I will see how this fairs up against my 2150 GTX 1080 Seahawk.


----------



## guttheslayer

Any idea will warranty be void if we swap the cooler to any aio variant?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Any idea will warranty be void if we swap the cooler to any aio variant?


Just leave the serial number/warranty sticker on the card and don't damage anything while installing the AIO. Should be fine.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Good to hear about the shipped cards.
> 
> Anyone want to volunteer to maintain a new owner's club thread and go through the process of getting it [Official]'d? I'm sure we're all tired of the "this card isn't worth it" comments, so we should really just move into our own thread where we can freely discuss our cards tomorrow.
> .


Sounds like you are the man for the job.


----------



## Badexample

Mine is in the mail. Got the shipping notification already today!


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Sounds like you are the man for the job.


If I made one, there would be no spreadsheet or bells and whistles because I'm generally not very active anymore. I'm sure owners want a spreadsheet and whatnot to compare results.


----------



## Testier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If I made one, there would be no spreadsheet or bells and whistles because I'm generally not very active anymore. I'm sure owners want a spreadsheet and whatnot to compare results.


Ehe, its better than not having a thread.....


----------



## Fiercy

I know a lot of you guys who ordered 2 cards today might be in need of a new SLI bridge and I was very surprised to find the two slot bridge in stock just now.

Ordered it







go go I haven't seen it in stock for a while


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Testier*
> 
> Ehe, its better than not having a thread.....


I just posted this in the other thread:
Quote:


> I will make an half-assed owners thread tomorrow if one doesn't exist by the time my Titan comes in the morning. If someone wants to make a full fledged one with a spreadsheet, please do, because mine will only be to give owners a place to OC and chat about their new purchase without all the drama.


----------



## DarkIdeals

So i can confirm that this TITAN X unlike all the other TITANs ever made, has a BACKPLATE!











Also, interestingly enough; there are no VRAM chips on the back of this board. So the people who are claiming that the thermal imaging on the backside of the PCB being on the hot end are going to cause bad performance are wrong. I assume that the GDDR5X allows for denser memory so they can fit all 12GB on the inner side of the PCB


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> So i can confirm that this TITAN X unlike all the other TITANs ever made, has a BACKPLATE!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, interestingly enough; there are NO VRAM chips on the back of this board. So the people who are claiming that the thermal imaging on the backside of the PCB being on the hot end are going to cause bad performance are wrong. I assume that the GDDR5X allows for denser memory so they can fit all 12GB on the inner side of the PCB


One of the reviews (I forget which) hooked up a thermal camera and claimed that the backplate traps heat really badly. I might remove mine.

EDIT: Whoops didn't see your second line, you already mentioned that. We'll probably get reviews with it on/off and see if there's any truth to that.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> One of the reviews (I forget which) hooked up a thermal camera and claimed that the backplate traps heat really badly. I might remove mine.


Well it doesn't really effect much though since there are basically no IC's on the backside anyway. You can always remove half of the plate too, which would still look better than bare PCB but give more ventilation.

I'm curious if the EK backplate will have any thermal pads etc.. as there appears to be no need of passive cooling this time around...


----------



## stangflyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> One of the reviews (I forget which) hooked up a thermal camera and claimed that the backplate traps heat really badly. I might remove mine.
> 
> EDIT: Whoops didn't see your second line, you already mentioned that. We'll probably get reviews with it on/off and see if there's any truth to that.


I only see a single 8 pin PCIE connector on that pic.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stangflyer*
> 
> I only see a single 8 pin PCIE connector on that pic.


Yeah that was my bad. Accidentally uploaded a GTX 1080 pic that was on my desktop next to the TITAN pics in the middle photo. The other two are from legit Nvidia website photo lineups though.

Here's the actual pic i meant to post in the middle (this is of the actual TITAN X)


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkIdeals*
> 
> So i can confirm that this TITAN X unlike all the other TITANs ever made, has a BACKPLATE!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, interestingly enough; there are no VRAM chips on the back of this board. So the people who are claiming that the thermal imaging on the backside of the PCB being on the hot end are going to cause bad performance are wrong. I assume that the GDDR5X allows for denser memory so they can fit all 12GB on the inner side of the PCB


That backplate costs $200. I will treasure it forever!


----------



## The-Real-Link

Hey @Murlocke, figured this is old by now since I totally crashed out around noon but yeah, finally got shipping confirm here too. A few hours after the order but yay







.


----------



## DarkIdeals

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The-Real-Link*
> 
> Hey @Murlocke, figured this is old by now since I totally crashed out around noon but yeah, finally got shipping confirm here too. A few hours after the order but yay
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Yeah i forgot to mention that i also got shipping confirmation. Something is just wrong with their computer system as both the regular Confirmation Email and the Shipping Email were BOTH not received at all; and only appeared after i called Nvidia and they manually sent it several more times. Had to call Nvidia TWICE before the original confirm email showed up.

I'll be getting my 1st card via Fedex tomorrow


----------



## lyang238

damn ordered at 8.05 am CST and STILL nothing ***!


----------



## HyperMatrix

That backplate does look nice. But I have to say. After using an aquacomputers active cooled backplate on my Titan Xs, and seeing 8000MHz memory never exceed 55C even after hours of gameplay, I'm a total advocate for active cooled back plates.


----------



## cookiesowns

0 shipping notification.

Is there anyone who ordered within the 1st hour without 1-2day shipping, and got it shipped?


----------



## Silent Scone

It says 1 to 3 days. Right there on the product page. Anyone would think you guys had never bought something off the internet before.


----------



## renejr902

Reviews are released everywhere since midnight, wow in 4k at maximum setting average +60 in rise of tomb raider and witcher3 at stock clock. Its really a nice card.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-titan-x-12gb,4700-6.html

http://hothardware.com/reviews/nvidia-titan-x-review

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/NVIDIA-Titan-X-Pascal-12GB-Graphics-Card-Review

Search on google a lot of reviews are released


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silent Scone*
> 
> It says 1 to 3 days. Right there on the product page. Anyone would think you guys had never bought something off the internet before.


It's 1-3 days for the shipping estimate. But the site said orders before 3pm would be shipped out the same day.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *renejr902*
> 
> Reviews are released everywhere since midnight, wow in 4k at maximum setting average +60 in rise of tomb raider and witcher3 at stock clock. Its really a nice card.
> 
> http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-titan-x-12gb,4700-6.html
> 
> Search on google a lot of reviews are released


No solid overclocking attempts in any reviews unfortunately. Though 1950MHz with 50% fan speed gives a lot of hope for 2200MHz under water with modified bios. I'd have stuck an AC unit on the card just to see how well it handles clocks if kept cold. To give a better idea of clocks under water, minus power target throttling issues.


----------



## Ghoxt

Performance wise it looks to be exactly where we thought. OC Benches, once they come in, should be awesomely good but predictable given what we know about (Pascal/1080).

Watching the crazy 3500+ posts on this card reminds me of this scene in the brilliant movie Seven.

- Brad Pitt, "What's in the box?!"

- Morgan Freeman, (to Helicopter in the sky a mile away) "Listen... listen to me. Whatever you do... don't come in here. Stay away. No matter what you hear, do not move in! John Doe has the upper hand.

- Brad Pitt









In this case I see Nvidia as Keven Spacey (John Doe) leading some of us in the GPU enthusiast community right along... You had no choice but to pull the trigger


----------



## lombardsoup

Starting to run out of stock already. Next comes the shortages, and the price gouging!


----------



## renejr902

Several reviews released:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-titan-x-12gb,4700-6.html

http://hothardware.com/reviews/nvidia-titan-x-review

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/NVIDIA-Titan-X-Pascal-12GB-Graphics-Card-Review

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/73148-nvidia-titan-x-12gb-performance-review.html

I will add new ones here


----------



## gamingarena

its a monster OC over 1900mhz approaching 1080 SLi numbers and beating it in some cases, insane

a conclusion from hardwarecanucks:

"this thing isn't a barn burner in terms of achievable framerates, it's a fully-fledged thermonuclear attack. If it wasn't for the heavily overclocked processor beating at the heart of my system I'm positive many of the games would have encountered a CPU bottleneck at 1440P. Let me say that again: the Pascal-based TITAN X has the somewhat unfortunate capability to become processor-limited at 1440P with absolutely maxed-out settings. That's astounding."


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cookiesowns*
> 
> 0 shipping notification.
> 
> Is there anyone who ordered within the 1st hour without 1-2day shipping, and got it shipped?


I did. Card arrives Thursday.


----------



## xarot

Card looks very cool. But...might not go for it this time, my 2400€ Maxwell-Titan Xs SLI in the case give me a sad look. Never say never though...I just fear the release of a "better" 1080TI like last round. Also, just bought the I7-6950X so this hobby is getting a bit expensive.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xarot*
> 
> Card looks very cool. But...might not go for it this time, my 2400€ Maxwell-Titan Xs SLI in the case give me a sad look. Never say never though...I just fear the release of a "better" 1080TI like last round. Also, just bought the I7-6950X so this hobby is getting a bit expensive.


What do you have your 6950x overclocked to? I was considering one but it seemed like a 5960x at 4.7GHz would end up being better for gaming than the average 4.2-4.3GHz reviewers were getting on their chips.

Also. Do it. I was hesitant too. But these cards can OC 40% under water with modified bios. You will get a card that is actually about 2x more powerful than an overclocked maxwell Titan X. I have 3 of those volt-modded running at 1.5GHz an I'm still upgrading.


----------



## xarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> What do you have your 6950x overclocked to? I was considering one but it seemed like a 5960x at 4.7GHz would end up being better for gaming than the average 4.2-4.3GHz reviewers were getting on their chips.
> 
> Also. Do it. I was hesitant too. But these cards can OC 40% under water with modified bios. You will get a card that is actually about 2x more powerful than an overclocked maxwell Titan X. I have 3 of those volt-modded running at 1.5GHz an I'm still upgrading.


6950X not installed yet, occasional work in two shifts brings some limitations.









Maybe I could move the old TX in the HTPC, because I'd need a GPU there and selling the another. Now I am just thinking like doitdoitdoitdoitdoit. Oh man


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xarot*
> 
> 6950X not installed yet, occasional work in two shifts brings some limitations.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe I could move the old TX in the HTPC, because I'd need a GPU there and selling the another. Now I am just thinking like doitdoitdoitdoitdoit. Oh man


A few things to encourage you:

- New NVENC can support 4K 120FPS capture (not through shadowplay yet, however)
- SLI HB increases SLI bandwidth from standard 400MHz to 650MHz, then doubles that again. So 3.25x bandwidth!
- DP 1.3/1.4. Also support for 165Hz+ 21:9 3440x1440 curved displays or 120Hz+ 4K displays.
- Netflix 4K support, and HDR support!
- A single card, overclocked, can maintain average 165fps in Battlefield 4, for use with a 165Hz 1440p display. So even if there is no SLI profile, you'll be able to rock out the performance.
- You'll have girls throwing themselves at you non stop

I'm not sure about that last one but it's why I bought them. So here's hoping.









There's more. But that's a pretty good list. Send me your credit card number and I'll place the order for you. Haha.


----------



## jasondub

Has anyone here use waterblock to overclock pascal 1070 or 1080 above 2200mhz?

I've been searching on 3dmark website, there's no one with above 2200mhz.

Even with air, pascal could achieve 20xxmhz to below 2100mhz, so that makes me wondering what's the point to use waterblock on pascal?


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jasondub*
> 
> Has anyone here use waterblock to overclock pascal 1070 or 1080 above 2200mhz?
> 
> I've been searching on 3dmark website, there's no one with above 2200mhz.
> 
> Even with air, pascal could achieve 20xxmhz to below 2100mhz, so that makes me wondering what's the point to use waterblock on pascal?


Considering Kingpin could only get to around 2.5GHz under LN2 for his benchmarks, I would doubt that the GTX 1080 would be able to clock higher than around 2.3GHz, even if you were lucky enough to see it happen. My ultimate hope is seeing the Titan X at 2.2GHz, but realistically I'm expecting around 2.1GHz without a modified bios.


----------



## jasondub

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Considering Kingpin could only get to around 2.5GHz under LN2 for his benchmarks, I would doubt that the GTX 1080 would be able to clock higher than around 2.3GHz, even if you were lucky enough to see it happen. My ultimate hope is seeing the Titan X at 2.2GHz, but realistically I'm expecting around 2.1GHz without a modified bios.


Any review that I can check for waterblock on 1080? My guess is for pascal, waterblock will hit limit on aircooling +100mhz. So that would be around 2100mhz for Titan X. There is a review using afterburner to OC Titan X to around 1900mhz.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Anyone else surprised at how smooth the launch went today? No issues other than the buy button not working correctly for the first 15 minutes or so.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Anyone else surprised at how smooth the launch went today? No issues other than the buy button not working correctly for the first 15 minutes or so.


What about us Canadians not being able to order for the first 4 hours because of a site error? That was so dumb. But it worked out. Says on tracking I'll get my card tomorrow(today now)Very surprised by that because it's international shipping.

Now I need to preorder the ek block asap.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> What about us Canadians not being able to order for the first 4 hours because of a site error? That was so dumb. But it worked out. Says on tracking I'll get my card tomorrow(today now)Very surprised by that because it's international shipping.
> 
> Now I need to preorder the ek block asap.


Did it "work out?" I disagree. It was disastrous. Here's what happened:

- Tried buying 2 Titan Xs + SLI HB Bridge
- Site didn't work. SLI HB Bridge sold out
- After a few hours, Digital River received too many large payments through PayPal, which triggered an automatic security feature, limiting the maximum you can pay with the instant bank transfer feature
- This resulted in me having to place 2 orders for the 2 cards separately. Paying an extra $53 Canadian for shipping, instead of $5.
- By the time they fixed it so the Titan X could even be ordered, the SLI HB Bridge was still flagged as unavailable for Canadian addresses. So I placed the order for the 2 cards so that I would at least have them
- A few hours later, the SLI HB Bridge was fixed as well. At this point, the Titan Xs had been all sold out. So now I had to pay another $40 Canadian for shipping of the bridge, instead of the $3 extra it would have been on my original purchase

Absolutely terrible experience for me. So now I have 2 cards arriving tomorrow (or...today, I guess? Wednesday). Each shipped separately. And an HB bridge arriving on Thursday. So a ton of hassles, a large waste of my time, and an extra day to wait before SLI Bridge arrives, and cost me an extra $85 for no good reason at all.

Not to mention when I called Customer Service, I realized that it's outsourced so I'm talking to someone in the phillipines about a premium product from an American company, which pisses me right off...because American companies need to start hiring American workers. #Trump2016


----------



## Steven185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamingarena*
> 
> its a monster OC over 1900mhz approaching 1080 SLi numbers and beating it in some cases, insane
> 
> a conclusion from hardwarecanucks:
> 
> "this thing isn't a barn burner in terms of achievable framerates, it's a fully-fledged thermonuclear attack. If it wasn't for the heavily overclocked processor beating at the heart of my system I'm positive many of the games would have encountered a CPU bottleneck at 1440P. Let me say that again: the Pascal-based TITAN X has the somewhat unfortunate capability to become processor-limited at 1440P with absolutely maxed-out settings. That's astounding."


Imagine what it will achieve at those clocks sustained (better cooling), legit SLI performance. This is what I'm saying in this place time and time again, low starting clocks means greater overclockability. People don't get it and keep referencing the 30% figure that bare specs give (which is actually 35% to many/most titles). That's 30-35% better performance than GTX 1080 at *lower* clocks, it boggles my mind how people couldn't get that that actually implies even greater gains that we would initially think. At this point I expect some to post legit 50%+ more performance with their over clocked Titans...

That's huge for the high end, especially since it comes a mere 1 month after GTX 1080's actual availability. I don't think nVidia ever posted such a rapid progress before...

It's a veeery expensive gaming card but it offers veeery expensive performance too..


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> What about us Canadians not being able to order for the first 4 hours because of a site error? That was so dumb. But it worked out. Says on tracking I'll get my card tomorrow(today now)Very surprised by that because it's international shipping.
> 
> Now I need to preorder the ek block asap.


Canadians aren't human so who cares.









Just kidding! I forgot all about that. That sucked badly so I guess the launch wasn't as smooth as I thought. Hopefully folks outside of the states got to order one and for those that couldn't, I hope Nvidia restocks soon.


----------



## fisher6

Seriously thinking to pull the trigger on this titan even though I know I shouldn't. Found a working link with shipment to Norway. Should be a good upgrade from 980 Ti but then I need to get 4K monitor to replace my korean 1440p one and a waterblock. Should I take the plunge


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fisher6*
> 
> Seriously thinking to pull the trigger on this titan even though I know I shouldn't. Found a working link with shipment to Norway. Should be a good upgrade from 980 Ti but then I need to get 4K monitor to replace my korean 1440p one and a waterblock. Should I take the plunge


If you feel like buying one and have the cash to spend, go for it! YOLO!


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fisher6*
> 
> Seriously thinking to pull the trigger on this titan even though I know I shouldn't. Found a working link with shipment to Norway. Should be a good upgrade from 980 Ti but then I need to get 4K monitor to replace my korean 1440p one and a waterblock. Should I take the plunge


Wait for 165Hz 21:9 3440x1440 Gsync monitors. Now that DP1.3 is supported....it's possible. Technology is already there for it. And yes. Do it. Even if only for the DP1.3 port. =D


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Wait for 165Hz 21:9 3440x1440 Gsync monitors. Now that DP1.3 is supported....it's possible. Technology is already there for it. And yes. Do it. Even if only for the DP1.3 port. =D


When are those monitors coming out? I'm planning on buying the Acer X34p when it's out but I'd much rather have a higher refresh rate.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> When are those monitors coming out? I'm planning on buying the Acer X34p when it's out but I'd much rather have a higher refresh rate.


I can't imagine they'd delay them too long. The panel technology is already there. The rest is up to Nvidia's GSYNC module. But from the time of announcement until release...who knows. What I'm really curious about now, is whether that same monitor will include a 10-bit panel, which is supported now, along with HDR. Just imagine....

21:9
3440x1440
165Hz
HDR
GSYNC
10-Bit
Curved

Will definitely buy.

Heck...for all we know, they'll release a 5160x2160 model. But that'll be quite taxing. And might be limited to 100Hz.


----------



## bl4ckdot

EK block preorder : https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc-titan-x-pascal


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> EK block preorder : https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc-titan-x-pascal


I emailed Aquacomputer earlier as well to see if they have any plans/timeline for blocks. I think they're the only ones who did an active cooled backplate on the old Titan X. Would be nice to bump these cards up to 12Gbps.


----------



## Snaporz

Thanks for that link to the block! Pre-ordered. Bah. I hate having to wait 2 more weeks.


----------



## fisher6

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> If you feel like buying one and have the cash to spend, go for it! YOLO!


Cash isn't an issue. I have a great 980 Ti HOF that clocks great. I'm planning the move to 4K when a single card capable of it hits. The question is whether this is it and how soon will it be dethroned.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Wait for 165Hz 21:9 3440x1440 Gsync monitors. Now that DP1.3 is supported....it's possible. Technology is already there for it. And yes. Do it. Even if only for the DP1.3 port. =D


I need to look into this stuff. My korean 1440 monitor is at 96Hz but still uses D-DVI


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fisher6*
> 
> Cash isn't an issue. I have a great 980 Ti HOF that clocks great. I'm planning the move to 4K when a single card capable of it hits. The question is whether this is it and how soon will it be dethroned.
> I need to look into this stuff. My korean 1440 monitor is at 96Hz but still uses D-DVI


The TItan XP is a 4k 60fps card. Disable AA and overclock it some and you are good to go!








Nobody knows when the TItan XP will be dethroned. That's the risk you take when buying a flagship card. If money isn't an issue then you don't have to worry about it anyway right?


----------



## skypine27

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> I emailed Aquacomputer earlier as well to see if they have any plans/timeline for blocks. I think they're the only ones who did an active cooled backplate on the old Titan X. Would be nice to bump these cards up to 12Gbps.


Let me know what you hear from them. I like their active cooled backplates too


----------



## fisher6

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> The TItan XP is a 4k 60fps card. Disable AA and overclock it some and you are good to go!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nobody knows when the TItan XP will be dethroned. That's the risk you take when buying a flagship card. If money isn't an issue then you don't have to worry about it anyway right?


I will be probably be changing to Volta when that hits. 1200$ a year for a GPU is acceptable to me as long as it stays over 60 fps at 4K. Think I will just get it and return it in worst case within 30 days. Now I need to find me a 4k display


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fisher6*
> 
> I will be probably be changing to Volta when that hits. 1200$ a year for a GPU is acceptable to me as long as it stays over 60 fps at 4K. Think I will just get it and return it in worst case within 30 days. Now I need to find me a 4k display


Sell the Titan XP two months before Volta hits to maximize $$$. Also, have a backup GPU ready to go so you won't go crazy waiting.


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Sell the Titan XP two months before Volta hits to maximize $$$. Also, have a backup GPU ready to go so you won't go crazy waiting.


Yeah, something like the GT710. Does that thing even do 144hz @1440P?


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTesla1856*
> 
> Yeah, something like the GT710. Does that thing even do 144hz @1440P?


Perhaps in one's dreams.


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> Perhaps in one's dreams.


Not even on the desktop? lol


----------



## guttheslayer

Any date on when it can be release on Asia or other continent?


----------



## HyperMatrix

"6:28 am At destination sort facility CALGARY, AB"

=D

Also Hexus OC results 2000/11000: http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/95215-nvidia-titan-x-pascal/?page=15


----------



## techguymaxc

EK pre-order link no longer working.


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *techguymaxc*
> 
> EK pre-order link no longer working.


As far as i understood they had some description mess so they pulled it and it will be back shortly.


----------



## Cozmos

Interestingly, people kept making a big fuss over the card not carrying the "Geforce" moniker in all the promo material, but it's still on the actual card itself.


----------



## Snaporz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> "6:28 am At destination sort facility CALGARY, AB"
> 
> =D
> 
> Also Hexus OC results 2000/11000: http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/95215-nvidia-titan-x-pascal/?page=15


8:19 am On FedEx vehicle for delivery

Eastern Time


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmos*
> 
> Interestingly, people kept making a big fuss over the card not carrying the "Geforce" moniker in all the promo material, but it's still on the actual card itself.


They should have made it RGB and saying "GTX TITAN X" rather than Geforce. Not that anyone is gonna keep the stock cooler though


----------



## CallsignVega

Time to find out what these can really do.


----------



## xTesla1856

Congrats, and be sure to report your findings in great detail !


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Time to find out what these can really do.


would like to know realworld difference between 1080 v titan xp, please post single gpu results too









maybe heaven / valley also ?


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Time to find out what these can really do.


:O

Mine should be here soon too. Were they signature required?


----------



## fisher6

@CallsignVega post some benchmarks asap


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Time to find out what these can really do.


----------



## CallsignVega

No signature required, the guy dropped and ran haha.

Mine are boosting to 1853 out of the box.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> At destination sort facility
> 
> EDMONTON INT'L AIRPORT, AB


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> No signature required, the guy dropped and ran haha.
> 
> Mine are boosting to 1853 out of the box.


Everything is pointing to them being limited by the PCI slot when OCing. I don't think water will help much on these, go prove me wrong!

http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/95215-nvidia-titan-x-pascal/?page=15

Hexus got 2000Mhz core and 11Gbps on memory on reference cooler, which is pretty dang good.


----------



## carlhil2

Shops open...


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *carlhil2*
> 
> Shops open...


My guess is they just put up the left over stock from failed/cancelled orders. Lots of banks will decline a $1200 purchase from a site you've never ordered from. I usually call my bank when making a purchase like that.

Possibly why some people's orders didn't go out yesterday?


----------



## Snaporz

Mine just got delivered!!! ...and I am at work for the next 8.5 hours. /tear


----------



## CallsignVega

I'm in 18C ambient, fans are at 100% until I can get my Hybrid coolers on them.

So far stable at 2000 MHz. I think we may have a beast on our hands.


----------



## xTesla1856

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I'm in 18C ambient, fans are at 100% until I can get my Hybrid coolers on them.
> 
> So far stable at 2000 MHz. I think we may have a beast on our hands.


God damn, 2000mhz on the stock cooler


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I'm in 18C ambient, fans are at 100% until I can get my Hybrid coolers on them.
> 
> So far stable at 2000 MHz. I think we may have a beast on our hands.


Both cards are? What are you using to test?

You always seem to get super lucky with overclocking. I'll be surprised when mine can do 1900-1950. Been doing this for ages and I have never gotten a great CPU or GPU. My 3770k maxed out at 4.5GHz and my 6700k maxes out at 4.6GHz. I built two computers for friends, both overclocked great.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> Everything is pointing to them being limited by the PCI slot when OCing. I don't think water will help much on these, go prove me wrong!
> 
> http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/95215-nvidia-titan-x-pascal/?page=15
> 
> Hexus got 2000Mhz core and 11Gbps on memory on reference cooler, which is pretty dang good.


Could you expand on this? Do you mean it's fully saturating PCIE 3.0 x16? Because in Tri-SLI, my Titan Xs were running at x8 and I wasn't aware of any pcie saturation issues. This was with OC to 1500MHz, which is a 40% OC over stock boost clock, taking the card from 6.6 tflops to about 9.2 tflops. So if PCIE 3.0 x8 was enough for 9.2 tflops, why would PCIE 3.0 x16 have trouble with an 11 tflop card that will at most OC about 30-40% above that range, leaving it at no more than about 15 tflops?


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Could you expand on this? Do you mean it's fully saturating PCIE 3.0 x16? Because in Tri-SLI, my Titan Xs were running at x8 and I wasn't aware of any pcie saturation issues. This was with OC to 1500MHz, which is a 40% OC over stock boost clock, taking the card from 6.6 tflops to about 9.2 tflops. So if PCIE 3.0 x8 was enough for 9.2 tflops, why would PCIE 3.0 x16 have trouble with an 11 tflop card that will at most OC about 30-40% above that range, leaving it at no more than about 15 tflops?


It's limited by *Power it can pull from PCIE slot* when you OC, as it only have 6+8 pin(225W) and is already rated at 250W.


----------



## CallsignVega

OK found the wall on mine at stock voltage and stock air cooler, 2038 MHz core.

We could be looking at 2100-2200 with upgraded voltage and cooler.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> Could you expand on this? Do you mean it's fully saturating PCIE 3.0 x16? Because in Tri-SLI, my Titan Xs were running at x8 and I wasn't aware of any pcie saturation issues. This was with OC to 1500MHz, which is a 40% OC over stock boost clock, taking the card from 6.6 tflops to about 9.2 tflops. So if PCIE 3.0 x8 was enough for 9.2 tflops, why would PCIE 3.0 x16 have trouble with an 11 tflop card that will at most OC about 30-40% above that range, leaving it at no more than about 15 tflops?


One of the reviews said they exceed the PCI power draw limit when OCed.

HardwareCanuck's reviewer just posted in the other thread and said the cards are voltage limited, so that's probably not the case.


----------



## stefxyz

Doesant make any sense. PCIE 8x is not even bottlenecking the 1080 so PCIE 16x will now way limit the Titan even at 3000 MHZ... Limit is either Thermals or Power and power goes down with temp...


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> It's limited by Power it can pull from PCIE slot,


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> One of the reviews said they exceed the PCI power draw limit when OCed.
> 
> HardwareCanuck's reviewer just posted in the other thread and said the cards are voltage limited, so probably not true.


It was quoted as pulling under 70w, while pcie spec says 75w, and actual draw can go even higher. I can't see why this card would need more voltage than a similarly configured Maxwell titan x.

I should also mention that a surprising number of these websites are testing this GPU with moderately-overclocked 6700k cpus instead of a 5960x or 6950x.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stefxyz*
> 
> Doesant make any sense. PCIE 8x is not even bottlenecking the 1080 so PCIE 16x will now way limit the Titan even at 3000 MHZ... Limit is either Thermals or Power and power goes down with temp...


PCI Bandwidth != PCI max power draw


----------



## Fiercy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> PCI Bandwidth != PCI max power draw


I don't understand what does PCi power draw do with anything?


----------



## stefxyz

Yes but a 32 degrees card will consume less power than a 80 degree one so we will see some benefits from that for sure...


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> I'm in 18C ambient, fans are at 100% until I can get my Hybrid coolers on them.
> 
> So far stable at 2000 MHz. I think we may have a beast on our hands.


I've ignored all the press reviews because they will never push the cards. You on the other will simulate a water cooling environment where the card won't throttle so we can see more clearly what its capabilities and limitations are. Thanks a lot.


----------



## rt123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> I don't understand what does PCi power draw do with anything?


If the card can't draw the current it needs, it will not overclock as high.


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> I don't understand what does PCi power draw do with anything?


Cards draw power from the 8 pin and 6 pin power plugin, but also directly from the pcie slot itself, which is spec'd at 75w, but from what I recall it's not uncommon for it to operate above 90w.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiercy*
> 
> I don't understand what does PCi power draw do with anything?


If 6+8pin and PCI power draw is not enough to power the card, your not going to be able to OC higher regardless of voltage/unlocked BIOS/water. There was a review claiming it exceeded it when OCed, trying to find it again.


----------



## CallsignVega

Anyone know if this is the same memory type used on the 1080? Just trying to see if the memory overclock has any valleys on the scale like it did with the 1080.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Anyone know if this is the same memory type used on the 1080? Just trying to see if the memory overclock has any valleys on the scale like it did with the 1080.


If it is GDDR5X from Micron then it would probably be the same type of memory used, could you read that from GPU-Z or is it not supported yet?


----------



## HyperMatrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Murlocke*
> 
> If 6+8pin and PCI power draw is not enough to power the card, your not going to be able to OC higher regardless of voltage/unlocked BIOS/water. There was a review claiming it exceeded it when OCed, trying to find it again.


I'm having trouble buying that claim, even if you do find it. I've volt-modded Maxwell Titan X. I've tripped the PSU because I was using a LEPA 1600W with a 6-rail design, where each card is on a 360w max (30A). Along with the 75w from the pcie slot. So that's at least 435W. Let's say because the PSU is a year old there's some loss, and efficiency is never 100%, that would still leave us at about 400W. And I've pulled that. Hence tripping the PSU, and upgrading to the Corsair AX1500i which resolved the problem with its single rail design. From the testing we've seen, the card when overclocked was around 300w, and spiked momentarily to 320w. Which is well below what I've pulled with my Maxwell Titan Xs. So I doubt any air-cooled models have been able to clock high enough to cause a real issue with power draw limitations outside of standard bios problems.


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> If it is GDDR5X from Micron then it would probably be the same type of memory used, could you read that from GPU-Z or is it not supported yet?


Ah yes, it is listed as GDDR5X (Micron).

So far I'm quite impressed with these babies.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> If it is GDDR5X from Micron then it would probably be the same type of memory used, could you read that from GPU-Z or is it not supported yet?


Its same as 1080 except its on 384 bits. Which result in 50% more bandwidth as well as capacity.


----------



## Murlocke

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> I'm having trouble buying that claim, even if you do find it. I've volt-modded Maxwell Titan X. I've tripped the PSU because I was using a LEPA 1600W with a 6-rail design, where each card is on a 350w max. Along with the 75w from the pcie slot. So that's over 400W. And I've pulled that. Hence tripping the PSU, and upgrading to the Corsair AX1500i which resolved the problem with its single rail design. From the testing we've seen, the card when overclocked was around 300w, and spiked momentarily to 320w. Which is well below what I've pulled with my Maxwell Titan Xs. So I doubt any air-cooled models have been able to clock high enough to cause a real issue with power draw limitations outside of standard bios problems.


Yeah it's probably false. The fact Vega is getting 2000 on air and stock BIOS, these things will likely be beasts under water and modded BIOS.

HardwareCanuck's claimed the card is voltage limited, and they are some of the best at testing.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Ah yes, it is listed as GDDR5X (Micron).
> 
> So far I'm quite impressed with these babies.


If we compared to Kepler times, its like Nvidia release the OG Titan 2 months right after GTX 680 and yet the first gen HD7970 (non-GHz) is still 9 months away. Shame on AMD.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guttheslayer*
> 
> Its same as 1080 except its on 384 bits. Which result in 50% more bandwidth as well as capacity.


The question was about whether it is the same GDDR5X from Micron which when OCed above +500(or +400 in some case) on 1080 actually drops benchmark score because it automatically uses a looser timing I think, bandwidth is not part of the question.


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> The question was about whether it is the same GDDR5X from Micron which when OCed above +500(or +400 in some case) on 1080 actually drops benchmark score because it automatically uses a looser timing I think, bandwidth is not part of the question.


https://www.micron.com/products/dram/gddr/gddr5x-part-catalog#/

There is only 3 different G5X available from their catalog, all with different gpbs. There is no doubt its the one uses in 1080. Considering Quadro have to downclock it to 9 gpbs, it doesnt make sense for NV to get a 11 or 12 gbps variant.


----------



## Difunto

Mine just arrived! Time to take the titan x out and in with the titan x-p


----------



## guttheslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Difunto*
> 
> Mine just arrived! Time to take the titan x out and in with the titan x-p


Any picture for us to drool?


----------



## pompss

mine too. I have to wait for waterblock to test it









We need a new thread asap


----------



## Fiercy

Pre-order time for water blocks got this one
https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc-titan-x-pascal-nickel


----------



## EniGma1987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HyperMatrix*
> 
> I emailed Aquacomputer earlier as well to see if they have any plans/timeline for blocks. I think they're the only ones who did an active cooled backplate on the old Titan X. Would be nice to bump these cards up to 12Gbps.


Active cooled backplate? oooo me likey









edit: is this the one you were talking about?
http://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3412

Wasnt exactly what I had pictured when you said active cooled backplate. I was hoping for the backplate to just be about a 1/4" thick instead of 1/8" and to have a bit of water flowing through it just to help pick up some of that extra heat off the back of the card. Just adding a heatpipe over the back of the VRM area is kinda "meh" to me.


----------



## CallsignVega

Guys I suggest we move the discussion from this news thread to the video card section thread:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1606562/titan-x-pascal-thread/0_20


----------



## pompss

preordered mine too


----------



## bl4ckdot

Regarding EK : acetal or acetal+nickel ?


----------



## lombardsoup

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pompss*
> 
> mine too. I have to wait for waterblock to test it


Speaking of that, what block is best to pair with this card assuming an unlimited budget?


----------



## xarot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bl4ckdot*
> 
> Regarding EK : acetal or acetal+nickel ?


With EK, always bare copper. So, acetal.


----------



## superhead91

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Guys I suggest we move the discussion from this news thread to the video card section thread:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1606562/titan-x-pascal-thread/0_20


Please follow this suggestion.

Thread locked.


----------

