# [Engadget] Kiss Aero goodbye: Latest Windows 8 build reveals minimalistic desktop UI



## funfortehfun

RIP Windows Start Button, 1995-2012
RIP Windows Aero, 2006-2012
What's next on the RIP list, W8 and Microsoft?


----------



## Ch13f121

The ribbon in explorer is somewhat useful. And it disappears when you don't need it if I recall.

Honestly I'm OK with Aero going away or changing styles, the glass look is old.


----------



## noak

Why do companies insist on "fixing" things that aren't broken or need fixing...


----------



## jjsoviet

Actually, Aero is something that doesn't mix well with Metro. Its faux-glass UI doesn't correspond to this newer, more minimalist flat panel interface introduced with Metro, so Aero has to go and MS did a great job doing so. If I recall, the Ribbon UI is minimized on the windows by default but can be toggled if you so desire. I know, it's rather a cumbersome thing to see it on every open window but at least there's an option to hide it.


----------



## The_0ctogon

I agree completely and welcome the change


----------



## cavallino

Doesn't sound like that big of a deal to me, I don't know.

Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Xenthos

I turned off aero glass on Windows 7 anyway... it was cool at first but now it's just meh.

Not sure if I like that implementation though... it is supposed to be minimalistic but it looks kinda crowded and a lot like the High Contrast theme in Win 7


----------



## Dronac

Looks very OSX-ish, which isn't bad in my book in and of itself, but I use both windows and OS X for a reason. They are different OS's for different purposes. It seems though that Windows it trying to go the simplified way of OS X, which creates a gap in the market. I wonder what will replace the start button as a primary launcher though. In OSX, it's already a app-like environment with the applications directory separate from the actual program files in the library directory. Window's typical Program Files directory won't work well on it's own, so I wonder if there will be an applications library added under the user's directory.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Well with Metro UI you cant really Call Windows, Windows any more. They are trying to get away from Windows name and these are just some steps.


----------



## greenPlastic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noak*
> 
> Why do companies insist on "fixing" things that aren't broken or need fixing...


Because if they didn't fix what wasn't broken, there would be no new stuff. Just the same stuff you've always had.

I don't think they would change it if they didn't think it would make users more productive.


----------



## Disturbed117

The new UI looks like trash imo.


----------



## Blaze0303

I used W8 CP for about 2 hours. Hated it, back to windows 7.


----------



## dioxholster

Let me just say, I love the aero glass look, I can't use windows without it being transparent thats just the way its supposed to be. It gives a comforting and lofty appearance that isn't overly imposing.


----------



## dragneel

I tried to like Windows 8, but I just couldn't. The start menu is the most awful start menu I've ever seen on anything and the whole OS is ugly and cluttered. It did seem a little more responsive though.

-Finally make a good UI
-Replace it with trash in the next OS
Microsoft logic.

Oh, Gates where art thou.


----------



## dmasteR

I still use Windows Classic. lol


----------



## MaxFTW

Hopefully linux will take over before win8 is released.


----------



## snoball

Am I the only person still running the Classic theme in Windows?


----------



## lostmage

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> Let me just say, I love the aero glass look, I can't use windows without it being transparent thats just the way its supposed to be. It gives a comforting and lofty appearance that isn't overly imposing.


^this, and the "new look" seems a lot like XP to me for some reason. Honestly, Aero looks a lot more modern than that, and certainly not cheesy.


----------



## Milestailsprowe

I'm cool with it


----------



## dioxholster

this is their way of phasing out the normal windows and having you slip into metro as it will happen once people get sick of these annoyances with the new UI.


----------



## Darren9

As graphics power increases we move to flat color and solid square boxes. Win8 doesn't seem to have anything I need or want yet.


----------



## dioxholster

once you try and have different windows on top of each other you will begin to miss aero then.


----------



## skullking17

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darren9*
> 
> As graphics power increases we move to flat color and solid square boxes. Win8 doesn't seem to have anything I need or want yet.


Yeah with the average computers graphics getting better and better Microsoft could do something really cool and flashy, but instead they make it look duller than XP. I hope they at least put aero in and let the user choose, however I know that's pretty unlikely.


----------



## Disturbed117

The interface does not look clean to me.


----------



## SpankyMcFlych

Another classic user here. If windows 8 doesn't let me setup the UI to my own preference I simply won't be using it. The UI is something the user should control. Not microsoft.


----------



## Speced

Kay... I'm just wondering how we launch programs.

Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk


----------



## xJavontax

I've been thinking of switching away from Aero to a more graphite OS X type of thing anyway. Just not really feeling it anymore.


----------



## Scuba Steve in VA

I love Windows 7 and love Aero. I have tried several versions of Windows 8 and it seems like a huge step backwards. Microsoft just doesn't get it. For years they tried to put a desktop OS on phones...and now they are trying to put a phone/tablet OS on the desktop.

I suppose that I can see what they are doing. They know that mobile is dominating and is a major growth area...and they also know that they are losing in that space. Heck, forget losing. They aren't even on the playing field. Windows 8 seems like some sort of strategy to cram Metro in front of everyone on the desktop so it gets a leg up in the mobile market.

Yeah, I get it...and I think that it is going to blow up on them. I forecast bad times for Windows 8. I suspect that Windows 8 is about to become their next Vista...or, perhaps even worse, their next ME.

cheers,
Scuba


----------



## Zero4549

Obviously, this is to reduce graphical strain on tablets and netbooks. Anyone who games knows that areo can chew through vram and anyone who folds or under clocks knows what happens when you try moving around areo windows.

Win 8 is windows for idiots. Take away nice features because the average user is too stupid to know when not to use them.


----------



## Forty2

Windows 8 Windows ME 2


----------



## -iceblade^

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jjsoviet*
> 
> Actually, Aero is something that doesn't mix well with Metro. Its faux-glass UI doesn't correspond to this newer, more minimalist flat panel interface introduced with Metro, so Aero has to go and MS did a great job doing so. If I recall, the Ribbon UI is minimized on the windows by default but can be toggled if you so desire. I know, it's rather a cumbersome thing to see it on every open window but at least there's an option to hide it.


true.

this minimalism is disgusting though. absolutely disgusting. the more i see of this OS and the more i play with it the more i dislike it.


----------



## Disturbed117

All i want to know is why would they remove the start menu and/or replace it with what they have now?

That's one my major issues with it.


----------



## jjsoviet

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *-iceblade^*
> 
> true.
> this minimalism is disgusting though. absolutely disgusting. the more i see of this OS and the more i play with it the more i dislike it.


Yeah, I feel that way too. Though I like the basic premise of a simple, flat-panel look currently sported by WP7 I don't see it working on the desktop environment.


----------



## Segovax

I for one welcome our new minimalist UI overlord.


----------



## Scuba Steve in VA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Segovax*
> 
> I for one welcome our new minimalist UI overlord.


In Soviet Union, Aero turns YOU off.


----------



## Lettuceman

I seriously think you guys are really taking this a bit far








Just hating for the sake of hating.

Sent from my Incredible 2 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## rocstar96

I weep for the start button.


----------



## Piegoodman

What's next, no windows?

Maybe they should just go back to DOS for simplicity.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

No aero, no thanks. At least as far as I am concerned....


----------



## PiOfPie

The Applefication of Windows continues. Sadly.


----------



## Scuba Steve in VA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speced*
> 
> Kay... I'm just wondering how we launch programs.
> Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk


So is he: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4boTbv9_nU


----------



## Slayem

Not liking this haha!


----------



## robwadeson

give me a new design that's fine... but don't give me something that takes a normal user days to get used to.


----------



## Riou

Microsoft is dumping Aero because it wastes battery life on a tablet/phone. Theme is still ugly as sin though.


----------



## sloppyjoe123

^this @ robwadeson

I went from XP to Windows 7, and adapted within an hour. And the improvements were felt instantly, with the snapping of windows, to full screen/half-screen, the transclucent window bars, the much better looking / yet recognisable icons.

Windows 8 looks like a step backwards from Win7. I loved what they said they were doing with the BSOD, but apart from that...


----------



## Licht

It's Windows Media Player all over again.


----------



## Miki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Milestailsprowe*
> 
> I'm cool with it


So am I. ^______^

Sent from my SGH-I777


----------



## djriful

Square corners, well that's okay... not too fond of it. But the ribbon is really I don't like. I've been using my Outlook 2010, shuffling through the ribbon tabs and looking for the function I wanted is just plain awful already.


----------



## BizzareRide

It takes longer to access core services in Windows 7 than it does Windows 8. The ribbon is an amazing addition where most people that are familiar with it from other Microsoft products, have loved it in Windows 8.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riou*
> 
> Microsoft is dumping Aero because it wastes battery life on a tablet/phone. Theme is still ugly as sin though.


Maybe because it doesn't fit with the design direction? Why would they remove it completely if all it did was 'drain battery for tablets and phones' when all they had to do was disable it like they've already done with certain tablet features or disable it like you can with Vista and 7?

Oh, right! This is Overconspiracy.net. Technology companies are out to ruin the way of life of a niche group that doesn't matter.


----------



## Disturbed117

Windows 7 will work fine for me a bit longer.


----------



## NateN34

Ah, Microsoft you guys are boneheads.

Take out everything that makes Windows 7 good. Why don't you just take out Windows 8 all together.


----------



## Blameless

Aero was one of the most annoying, least useful additions to the Windows GUI. I think I've used Aero for maybe two hours total since it first showed up.

Transparency is it's only redeeming quality, but even that isn't worth the increased resource demands or the space wasted by rounded corners and thick boarders on all the windows.

That said, I do not think Metro is an improvement.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snoball*
> 
> Am I the only person still running the Classic theme in Windows?


Nope.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Piegoodman*
> 
> Maybe they should just go back to DOS for simplicity.


One could only hope.


----------



## dklimitless

man, this is making it harder for me to see myself adapting windows 8 anytime soon.
I love win7 to the death, but i'm already considering switching to Mint for a while as my primary OS (on the laptop anyway). Was hoping win8 will bring me back to the windows world but at this rate, i doubt it :/.


----------



## JedixJarf

I only use classic anyway.


----------



## jprovido

windows 8 = dumbed down version of windows 7


----------



## Fr0sty

microsoft will never r.i.p they are the only one offering os to the masses

so they can still shove anything down our throat and we are forced to take it

that is if we want to play games and do other obvious task that requires a win pc

or we stick with win 7 for a few more years like we did with win xp


----------



## sLowEnd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snoball*
> 
> Am I the only person still running the Classic theme in Windows?


I run classic theme on all my computers too. (Win7 Desktop, Win7 Laptop, WinXP Desktop)


----------



## Disturbed117

I run classic on my 9750.


----------



## jellis142

Not as angry about Aero as I was with the Start button... I'd rather them leave it on by default and offer an option to hide it, not the other way around.


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jellis142*
> 
> Not as angry about Aero as I was with the Start button... I'd rather them leave it on by default and offer an option to hide it, not the other way around.


stupid people dunno how to disable stuff. stupid people also expect old and low powered hardware to perform great in all conditions. same people happen to be the majority of users.

because of this, it makes some sense to restrict people to the most basic options unless they are smart enough to go add/hack in/unlock the more advanced features manually. sad but true.


----------



## admflameberg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The_0ctogon*
> 
> I agree completely and welcome the change


I also agree, No one is forcing those who do not like it to upgrade. But sooner or later they will.


----------



## pygarastas

Looks good, haters gonna hate


----------



## PrimeBurn

Looks like XFCE.


----------



## Despair

Windows Vista #2? Their strategy the past few years has reminded me of tick tock. But instead of every Tock being awesome...the Ticks are.. However, i don't think Windows 8 will be as bad as Vista was to be honest..... my only objections really are the non optional metro ui and start button... The new theme doesn't really look all that bad, i kinda like it because whenever i turned off aero ...what remained was so ugly i just switched to classic instead, so this is welcome in my opinion. In all reality this is gonna be aimed @ tablets mostly... i understand they're trying to aim for a fully functional version of Windows on a portable device but i think they should've just developed on the Windows Phone instead..But it's probably 10x more easier and cost effective to just do it where everything is already layed out..

All in all i think it'll be ok but it'll just take a little while to get used to not having the start button and the metro-faili. But i personally probably won't even touch this unless they add the feature to turn on the start button and turn off the metro ui.


----------



## Shadowness

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> Let me just say, I love the aero glass look, I can't use windows without it being transparent thats just the way its supposed to be. It gives a comforting and lofty appearance that isn't overly imposing.


This. Next OS, Windows 7 Ultimate. Lets see how Windows 9 will look like


----------



## theloneplant

I don't see how any of this would be an upgrade from Windows 7. Last time I checked people want new things because it's an upgrade from the old and I see no reason for me to even consider learning this new clunky UI. Also from what I've read the people who are fine with it are just fine with it, no one really sounds enthusiastic about it.

Maybe MS is getting a trend going. XP rocked Vista sucked, Win7 rocked and now Win8 will suck. Maybe Win9 will be worth using


----------



## Soggy_Popcorn

If there was one thing OSX had over Windows, it was looks. The whole "everything must be glossy, glassy, and transparent!" thing is really counter-productive and aesthetically confusing. As is the strange insistence on wasting valuable screen real estate on messily designed window borders and toolbars. That said, Metro and Ribbon are not how you fix those things.


----------



## Warmonger

Bout time Microsoft did away with that "Aero" glass. People fail to realize Aero is a huge counter productive feature due to the time it takes to do the window transitions. A prime example would be open chrome with Aero and close it, now try doing it under the basic theme which launches near instantly due to no slowing window effects. Microsoft wants to make Windows 8 fast and productive for the mobile market. Aero was one of them things that had to go to boost productivity. Keep in mind Aero also impacts battery life.


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Bout time Microsoft did away with that "Aero" glass. People fail to realize Aero is a huge counter productive feature due to the time it takes to do the window transitions. A prime example would be open chrome with Aero and close it, now try doing it under the basic theme which launches near instantly due to no slowing window effects. Microsoft wants to make Windows 8 fast and productive for the mobile market. Aero was one of them things that had to go to boost productivity.


Erm.. yes and no.

Yes - it was removed because it makes things slow on low powered hardware which is found on tablets, which this is geared towards.

No - aero does not have any substantial slowing effect on opening Chrome (or anything else) on any kind of decent hardware. It takes less than half a second from when I click the icon to when aero is finished with it's opening window animation. I challenge you to do anything useful in chrome within the first .2 seconds after you click the icon. Most likely, you're using that time just to move the mouse to the appropriate area.


----------



## Domino

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steelbom*
> 
> It's almost as if they're trying to make it worse. They've added the ribbon in Windows Explorer (I think?), removed the start button, and now they're removing Aero? I'm sure there's plenty I've missed too, but what on earth are they doing?!


Stop being a windows hater.

I'm all for AREO going. I've always thought that the transparency was yucky to begin with. As for ribbon, actually use it before trying to belittle it. Apple people these days.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero4549*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Bout time Microsoft did away with that "Aero" glass. People fail to realize Aero is a huge counter productive feature due to the time it takes to do the window transitions. A prime example would be open chrome with Aero and close it, now try doing it under the basic theme which launches near instantly due to no slowing window effects. Microsoft wants to make Windows 8 fast and productive for the mobile market. Aero was one of them things that had to go to boost productivity.
> 
> 
> 
> Erm.. yes and no.
> 
> Yes - it was removed because it makes things slow on low powered hardware which is found on tablets, which this is geared towards.
> 
> No - aero does not have any substantial slowing effect on opening Chrome (or anything else) on any kind of decent hardware. It takes less than half a second from when I click the icon to when aero is finished with it's opening window animation. I challenge you to do anything useful in chrome within the first .2 seconds after you click the icon. Most likely, you're using that time just to move the mouse to the appropriate area.
Click to expand...

Some people, like myself, notice the delay. Some people like how responsive XP was.


----------



## {Unregistered}

I really like Aero because it just seems cooler to look at but that being said, I wouldn't mind this either.

And all you guys bashing the Win 8 UI, you can't really give a good opinion without actually using it.

This is turning out to be quite similar to the user response to the Facebook UI changes.


----------



## NastyFish

"OH NO! CHANGE!"


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NastyFish*
> 
> "OH NO! CHANGE!"


I know the poster child for that









:barack.jpg:


----------



## Xenthos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Domino*
> 
> Some people, like myself, notice the delay. Some people like how responsive XP was.


Oh man I would love to get Windows XP back with all the fixes from Win 7.

I installed it on my other computer not too long ago and it booted just as fast on a HDD as Windows 7 on an SSD.









So snappy, I like it, but I love the features and improved functionality win 7 has.


----------



## Domino

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Domino*
> 
> Some people, like myself, notice the delay. Some people like how responsive XP was.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh man I would love to get Windows XP back with all the fixes from Win 7.
> 
> I installed it on my other computer not too long ago and it booted just as fast on a HDD as Windows 7 on an SSD.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So snappy, I like it, but I love the features and improved functionality win 7 has.
Click to expand...

Yeah. I formatted a lab mate's laptop as the OS was corrupted. It was a Intel Centrino with some GMA card. It felt more snappy the my desktop. My desktop probably has well over 50x the processing power too.


----------



## windowszp

I don't care about areo. I welcome change...


----------



## p00ter71

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Domino*
> 
> Yeah. I formatted a lab mate's laptop as the OS was corrupted. It was a Intel Centrino with some GMA card. It felt more snappy the my desktop. My desktop probably has well over 50x the processing power too.


The worst part about XP was that you had to reformat every so often.I've never had to reformat Vista or Win7.I'll prolly pass on Win8 though.


----------



## AnonUser

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Bout time Microsoft did away with that "Aero" glass. People fail to realize Aero is a huge counter productive feature due to the time it takes to do the window transitions. A prime example would be open chrome with Aero and close it, now try doing it under the basic theme which launches near instantly due to no slowing window effects. Microsoft wants to make Windows 8 fast and productive for the mobile market. Aero was one of them things that had to go to boost productivity. Keep in mind Aero also impacts battery life.


As a helpful hint: It is possible to turn off all those stupid transition effects and fade in crap. Good looking windows + responsive windows = profit? I think so. Was one of the first things i did when i installed Win 7 the first time.

Edit: Control panel -> system -> advanced system settings (on the left side) -> performance -> untick animate windows when minimizing and maximizing. You can also untick other stuff you don't like if you want.


----------



## andrews2547

This is just getting worse lol if MS forces us to use Metro (and by the looks of things they are going to) They can not only say goodbye to Aero (which honestly doesn't bother me) and the start button they can also say goodbye to the money they would have got from me.

I can tell that Windows 8 is going to the next ME/Vista. Also in the wise words of Chris Pirillos dad "Are they trying to make me move to Mac?"


----------



## adridu59

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ch13f121*
> 
> The ribbon in explorer is somewhat useful. And it disappears when you don't need it if I recall.
> Honestly I'm OK with Aero going away or changing styles, the glass look is old.


^ Pretty much this. Not to mention Aero is resource hungry...


----------



## Juganot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adridu59*
> 
> ^ Pretty much this. Not to mention Aero is resource hungry...


I don't know about you but I have a few resources to spare.

On topic, I think it's clear some wont be going to windows 8 (including myself). I am just hoping they fix up their act on windows 9 or whatever it will be called.


----------



## thegreatsquare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steelbom*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> While we're still curious to see if Microsoft can better integrate the desktop and Metro environments of its latest operating system, the company has now revealed a significant change to the desktop portion of Windows 8 -- a completely restyled visual appearance. As you might remember from the Consumer Preview, window borders and widgets featured a simplified and subdued look in comparison to the glass-like materials of Aero, which Microsoft now calls "dated and cheesy." With the latest refresh, however, the company has pushed its modernistic philosophy even further to reveal a spartan (yet functional) interface that draws less attention to the chrome elements and allows the user to focus more on content.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Source
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is meme worthy fail.
Click to expand...

So much so, that the lack of a meme in this topic is practically off-topic posting.

I loathe using Office '07 at work and I'd imagine the same feeling using W8.


----------



## Rubers

The ribbon on Explorer I can see as being good. I know my GF would find that useful. But the start button and Aero? Come on









If I can find a way of getting the start menu back and disabling Metro then I think my WindowBlinds 7 purchase (a couple of years back) will come in super useful and that sector of customising and design will pick up again. But, this blows as is. Windows 8 is a no no for me. If MS try to force it on people it's going to have dire conseqiences for them. They'd best not try any of that Vista DX10 forcing on us (though XP WAS incapable of running it)


----------



## Sevada88

I was very skeptical about Win8, but after using it for a while, I got used to it. Frankly I like it. Win7 seems old now. I welcome any changes to the old Win7 style.


----------



## kikkO

I could care less about Windows Aero, never use it. I use alt+tab over aero flip. Aero theme itself is a strain on system resources.

Apple's Expose is easier to use.


----------



## xeekei

I like the look, but I'm one of those "Classic theme users," and my favourite GUI right now is Xfce, which is similar. (Not similar enough, though.)


----------



## Artikbot

I like it.

To be honest, I do.

I'm currently running the small icons/small taskbar variant of Aero, placed on top, with small function icons.

I'm all in for minimalistic UIs.


----------



## randomizer

Thank you Microsoft for finally realising that faux glass is cheesy. I could have told you that in 2006. Unfortunately you've gone from dated and cheesy to just dated.


----------



## CBZ323

im gonna stick to W7 for a loooong time


----------



## Zantrill

Is not this thread old? This is 95 all over again. Hate not me, hate MS. Stay away!


----------



## RobotDevil666

As much as i understand people liking/not liking Areo what i completely don't understand is why not leave both options available for users to chose ?
If Areo is causing battery drain on tablets disable it for the tablet version , i see no reason why MS couldn't leave both Start Button and Areo as an option for users that want to use them.
I understand that they want to push out Windows to tablets but why disable those features on desktop ?
I for one completely hated Win 8 and if MS won't give me option to keep the features i like I'm sticking with Win7


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AnonUser*
> 
> As a helpful hint: It is possible to turn off all those stupid transition effects and fade in crap. Good looking windows + responsive windows = profit? I think so. Was one of the first things i did when i installed Win 7 the first time.
> Edit: Control panel -> system -> advanced system settings (on the left side) -> performance -> untick animate windows when minimizing and maximizing. You can also untick other stuff you don't like if you want.


Why include it when 90% of the people wont even be using it. Like said it kills battery life, as Aero is drawn from GPU power. Each time you open a window, move a window, etc it costs precious milliseconds of battery life. Besides how productive is Aero on a touch screen machine? You would be sitting there with your finger waiting for the window to actually appear before you can make your next move. I rather see them re-do the design of the UI and make it snappier, and resource friendly. We are edging that Era of technology where we are tackling efficiency. Aero was just a publicity stunt that caught on "look see through windows..." when really all it does is tax your machines performance by slow window transitions. I'm curious as how well will this conserve on battery life in mobile machines. Seems like Microsoft is targeting power consumption big time with Windows 8.


----------



## randomizer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RobotDevil666*
> 
> As much as i understand people liking/not liking Areo what i completely don't understand is why not leave both options available for users to chose ?


Microsoft is not trying to improve choice, but to make as seamless a product as possible. That's a big task since Windows 8 is essentially two working environments bolted together, so making the visual styles more similar will help to make transitioning between each of them less painful.


----------



## Brutuz

Eh, I like Aero as resource intensive as it is but I wouldn't say no to the original XP UI and lightness. I still think Microsoft would release a minimalist version of Windows that still contains/can get all of the updates their current main OS has and the like.


----------



## Mr.Eiht

Hmm, maybe some take that way too serious. Windows 8 is a joke from MS. Just like Vista was never a serious attempt for an OS.
It was a test if user are really that unwise to jump it.








And 8 might work for tables and the like but not even close to an OS for PCs.


----------



## ajslay

you all do realize that there is no "classic" theme in windows 8 right? LOL


----------



## Crooksy

I have aero switched off anyway. With my particular graphics card set up and 3 monitors, I had a stuttering issue with it being switched on. I think it looks cool so far, but just not sure about the start button being removed. I use the taskbar on 7 for my 4 most used programs but use the start button to go to my computer, control panel etc...


----------



## Lifeshield

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steelbom*
> 
> They've removed the start button, what on earth are they doing?!


What's so hard about pressing the Windows key on your Keyboard?


----------



## RobotDevil666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *randomizer*
> 
> Microsoft is not trying to improve choice, but to make as seamless a product as possible. That's a big task since Windows 8 is essentially two working environments bolted together, so making the visual styles more similar will help to make transitioning between each of them less painful.


And that's where they're making a big mistake , this attempt to kill two birds with one stone is going to blow up right at MS face.
Mobile and desktop are completely different things and they don't mix well, Alppe got it right with 2 types of OS each designed for specific platform.
Why do users have to suffer because MS want's to force their way into the mobile OS market ?
Give me a mobile Metro style OS on tablets and i will decide if i like it or not but don't cannibalize desktop OS like that.
People do not like to be force fed , one would think MS has learned that the hard way before , apparently they didn't.

P.S The whole Windows 8 charade looks more and more like experiment rather than a serious attempt at making Win7 successor.
MS is probing around checking how big of a gerbil they can ram up desktop user butt before he notices he's being royally screwed.


----------



## For_the_moves

Doesn't matter much to me, but the lack of a start button just feels so off. I wonder what other surprises they have in store.


----------



## Xenthos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> What's so hard about pressing the Windows key on your Keyboard?


You do realize that most people don't have a clue about these features and changes right ? And that these people are like 97% of the user base of an OS right ? So if some of us "informed" lot are having trouble, what on earth do you think these people will be doing ?


----------



## Orici

What is this Aero?


----------



## sixor

maybe they will remove directx

so opengl comes back, and we could game in linux


----------



## Alex132

Looks like OS 9


----------



## guyladouche

Never used Win 8 yet, but as far as windows 7 went, I personally never found the advantage or use/appeal of Aero. Never considered it to seem "cheesy," and on the contrary, it gives a feeling of refinement to be able to implement something like it, but on the other hand, not all that useful aside from the "ooooooh" factor when you see it for the first time.


----------



## andrews2547

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sixor*
> 
> maybe they will remove directx
> so opengl comes back, and we could game in linux


I hope that does happen, I don't like Windows but I'm forced to use it so I can play games without having any problems.


----------



## mingqi53

Quote:


> http://www.theverge.com/2012/2/24/2822891/windows-desktop-ui-concept




^--what Windows 8 should look like!

I'm glad they got rid of Aero for Windows, and revised the buttons, but they still need to go a few steps further.


----------



## kiwiasian

Does Microsoft think society has gotten stupider or something. All I've seen of W8 is an extreme dumbing-down of W7. Seriously, a BSOD that has a sad face and says "Something went wrong"?


----------



## F1Seb

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> What's so hard about pressing the Windows key on your Keyboard?


You never worked in a tech support job is my guess here. This is how the conversation about the Windows key usually goes:

Me: "Ok Sir/Maam, now please hold down the windows key and press....
Dumbass: "Wait wait, slow down, what's a windows key?"
Me: "It's a key with the small windows logo on your keyboard"
Dumbass: "I don't have one!!"
Me: "Please look carefully it's definitely there.."
....
....
.....
......
......
........
Dumbass: "Got it!!!! WHOOO!!!"
Dumbass "OH NO!!!"
Me: "What happened?"
Dumbass: "There's 2 of them!?? Which one do i press!?"

Insert loaded gun in mouth....


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I dunno, I think Win7 is about perfect so I don't think I'll be changing for a while...


----------



## steelbom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Domino*
> 
> Stop being a windows hater.
> 
> I'm all for AREO going. I've always thought that the transparency was yucky to begin with. As for ribbon, actually use it before trying to belittle it. Apple people these days.


Do explain exactly how I'm a Windows hater and an "Apple person" because I'm complaining about Microsoft removing the parts of the OS I like? I've always liked Aero, and I like the start button too. Assume much? I have used the ribbon in Office before and I don't like it and I think it looks horrible and messy.

And I'm not the only one who hates these changes either.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> What's so hard about pressing the Windows key on your Keyboard?


It's an Apple









But seriously though what's the point of removing it? I don't think I've ever used the Windows key to open the start menu intentionally, I always just click.


----------



## Lifeshield

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> You do realize that most people don't have a clue about these features and changes right ? And that these people are like 97% of the user base of an OS right ? So if some of us "informed" lot are having trouble, what on earth do you think these people will be doing ?


Because they're not capable of reading the little "Getting Started" guide that comes with a Windows OS? Or even read up on what they are buying?

Right?

Stupid argument, based on throwing a PC in front of someone without any type of guide and just saying get on with it.

RTFM!

People will adapt, it's hardly a massive inconvenience pressing a key instead of clicking an icon with your mouse.


----------



## steelbom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> You do realize that most people don't have a clue about these features and changes right ? And that these people are like 97% of the user base of an OS right ? So if some of us "informed" lot are having trouble, what on earth do you think these people will be doing ?
> 
> 
> 
> Because they're not capable of reading the little "Getting Started" guide that comes with a Windows OS? Or even read up on what they are buying?
> 
> Right?
> 
> Stupid argument, based on throwing a PC in front of someone without any type of guide and just saying get on with it.
> 
> RTFM!
> 
> People will adapt, it's hardly a massive inconvenience pressing a key instead of clicking an icon with your mouse.
Click to expand...


----------



## Brutuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> Because they're not capable of reading the little "Getting Started" guide that comes with a Windows OS? Or even read up on what they are buying?
> 
> Right?
> 
> Stupid argument, based on throwing a PC in front of someone without any type of guide and just saying get on with it.
> 
> RTFM!
> 
> People will adapt, it's hardly a massive inconvenience pressing a key instead of clicking an icon with your mouse.


That's the theoretical side.

The real side is people don't want to read, they want their computer to work.


----------



## RobotDevil666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> Because they're not capable of reading the little "Getting Started" guide that comes with a Windows OS? Or even read up on what they are buying?
> 
> Right?
> 
> Stupid argument, based on throwing a PC in front of someone without any type of guide and just saying get on with it.
> 
> RTFM!
> 
> People will adapt, it's hardly a massive inconvenience pressing a key instead of clicking an icon with your mouse.


What is a massive inconvenience though is that this button completely takes you away from the desktop , why would you want that.
I want to press the win key or button type the name of the program while still having my desktop in front of me.
It looks more like they're trying to make away with the whole desktop/taskbar rather than start button and this is just a first step.


----------



## Lifeshield

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steelbom*


You do realise that the link posted in the post I replied to links to the exact same video, don't you?

A real person will have a guide in front of them and learn how to use it.

It's not really rocket science.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brutuz*
> 
> The real side is people don't want to read.


Then they should stop being lazy and start learning how to use what they paid for properly.


----------



## andrews2547

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> Then they should stop being lazy and start learning how to use what they paid for properly.


Most people don't spend £100 on software so that can spend a few hours learning how to use it. They want it to work how they want it to work out of the box without learning anything. Removing the start button is one of the worst things MS could do. Like in the end of that video (with Chris's dad who is an average user) "Are they trying to drive me to Mac?" If MS don't put the start button back then they will lose a lot of their customers and the ones they don't lose a majority of them will still be on Windows 7 or XP.


----------



## dioxholster

Aero is useful, if im gonna be looking at something for the better half of my day it better look pleasant and not this flat noxiously dull OS.


----------



## born2bwild

I find Aero very useful when multitasking, so unless MS adds an option to turn it back on, this is another big negative for W8.


----------



## dioxholster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mingqi53*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.theverge.com/2012/2/24/2822891/windows-desktop-ui-concept
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^--what Windows 8 should look like!
> I'm glad they got rid of Aero for Windows, and revised the buttons, but they still need to go a few steps further.
Click to expand...

Thats google, windows 7 was original at least, but doing that would be just copying what google is doing with google plus and alike


----------



## 161029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funfortehfun*
> 
> RIP Windows Start Button, 1995-2012
> RIP Windows Aero, 2006-2012
> What's next on the RIP list, W8 and Microsoft?


We'd better hope it's something that we don't want, but what would that be?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jjsoviet*
> 
> Actually, Aero is something that doesn't mix well with Metro. Its faux-glass UI doesn't correspond to this newer, more minimalist flat panel interface introduced with Metro, so Aero has to go and MS did a great job doing so. If I recall, the Ribbon UI is minimized on the windows by default but can be toggled if you so desire. I know, it's rather a cumbersome thing to see it on every open window but at least there's an option to hide it.


Agreed.


----------



## jeffblute

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riou*
> 
> Microsoft is dumping Aero because it wastes battery life on a tablet/phone. Theme is still ugly as sin though.


This is fine and dandy but for us PC users this seems very boring and I think they are going in the wrong direction. If Windows 8 does not have any major benefits over 7 I will stick with what I got.


----------



## jrbroad77

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmasteR*
> 
> I still use Windows Classic. lol


I used to do that, but then I realized that I couldn't play ANY 720p or 1080p youtube videos smoothly, and oddly enough, the fix was to enable Aero glass -.-. Hate it, Classic benches about 3% faster and gives a little more battery life.


----------



## Alex132

Windows 8: Pay us to remove things that you need! Don't worry we won't replace them with utter crap, pffffff loljokes we just did.


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *{Unregistered}*
> 
> And all you guys bashing the Win 8 UI, you can't really give a good opinion without actually using it.


I've used Metro quite heavily.

Obviously there will be some changes before final release, but I am not pleased with what I have experienced so far.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ajslay*
> 
> you all do realize that there is no "classic" theme in windows 8 right? LOL


Yes, and regard it as a much bigger loss than Aero.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jrbroad77*
> 
> I used to do that, but then I realized that I couldn't play ANY 720p or 1080p youtube videos smoothly, and oddly enough, the fix was to enable Aero glass -.-.


I've never seen this behavior on any system. It's downright bizarre.


----------



## Rookie1337

Wow...with all this win8 hate you'd think there'd be more Linux or OSX users on here. Speak louder by jumping ship people. Don't just sit on Win7 (which I agree is probably MS's best effort) as you're not going to get MS to change their minds that way. Sadly, this is starting to look more and more like what the computer illiterate are looking for so the fact that they outnumber us will likely make it where we wouldn't matter to MS.


----------



## WakaFlockaFlam2

somebody will probs make an aero theme for windows 8 so idc


----------



## gsa700

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PiOfPie*
> 
> The Applefication of Windows continues. Sadly.


It has been so since 1984. ( Poorly done may I add )
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *robwadeson*
> 
> give me a new design that's fine... but don't give me something that takes a normal user days to get used to.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riou*
> 
> Microsoft is dumping Aero because it wastes battery life on a tablet/phone. Theme is still ugly as sin though.


I remember when Windows XP was in Beta, yes I'm old, and they had a nice basic blue them that this reminds me of. If you go search, you should be able to find it.

Aero is gimmicky and only slightly nicer than the utterly child like XP themes. Windows XP was like the UI was made with color crayons. Seriously.

Aqua on OS X has been better from the start, though it to was a little bit much initially, it has now matured to a really elegant and SIMPLE UI that does what it should: gets out of the users way so they can do what they want.

I wish XP would have stuck with it's original theme from the beta's, and honestly I praise this move by MS and hope they do it right this time.

But MS, do bring back a start menu and let the users disable METRO if we'd like too? Thanks.

Edit: found a few screenies....


----------



## Xenthos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> Then they should stop being lazy and start learning how to use what they paid for properly.


The point is, that no-one had to read a guide on how to use the Windows start menu when going from XP to vista / vista to 7. The menu was there, simple.


----------



## My Desired Display Name

Looks ugly.


----------



## dioxholster

The Fox News tech guy said he liked everything about windows 8 except for its "old desktop" which he thought were dregs of the old windows.


----------



## dioxholster

The people who hate Aero here are the same people who find windows classic appealing, in other words, they have awful taste. Let me have my crystal palace desktop and you can have your plastic shack if you want.


----------



## gsa700

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> The people who hate Aero here are the same people who find windows classic appealing, in other words, they have awful taste. Let me have my crystal palace desktop and you can have your plastic shack if you want.


Your a Mac user too?


----------



## andrews2547

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> *The Fox News* tech guy said he liked everything about windows 8 except for its "old desktop" which he thought were dregs of the old windows.


Your argument is invalid.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> The people who hate Aero here are the same people who find windows classic appealing, in other words, they have awful taste. Let me have my crystal palace desktop and you can have your plastic shack if you want.


I run with Aero off but Themes on, so it's still the Aero look but there is no transparency, no little Window popups in the taskbar, etc.

I just don't like the fact that Aero requires a lot of resources. The improved aesthetics don't warrant it IMHO. I would not want to run with a Windows 2000 looking desktop however.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaxFTW*
> 
> Hopefully linux will take over before win8 is released.


The first time I heard that one was right before Windows 95 was released. Keep on waiting...


----------



## jrbroad77

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jrbroad77*
> 
> I used to do that, but then I realized that I couldn't play ANY 720p or 1080p youtube videos smoothly, and oddly enough, the fix was to enable Aero glass -.-. Hate it, Classic benches about 3% faster and gives a little more battery life.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> I've used Metro quite heavily.
> Obviously there will be some changes before final release, but I am not pleased with what I have experienced so far.
> Yes, and regard it as a much bigger loss than Aero.
> I've never seen this behavior on any system. It's downright bizarre.


This video is pretty pointless, just skip to ~3:00 for the full text. And skim through some of the comments. I can't tell if this only affects systems with Intel HD 3000, or what. I was completely boggled as well, because it was a clean install, chipset and graphics drivers etc. installed, classic theme on. It doesn't make any sense that turning on 3D glass would make video playback smooth, but I digress. Oh, and everything else worked fine without Aero glass (even 3D CAD programs using OpenGL).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oA9neReFnU


----------



## Brutuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> Then they should stop being lazy and start learning how to use what they paid for properly.


Just like how criminals should just stop breaking the law and learn how to use legal methods to earn money/whatever they broke the law for.
Doesn't mean it'll happen...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> I've never seen this behavior on any system. It's downright bizarre.


I can't say I've gotten that, but [email protected] GPU folding lags like crazy in classic versus Aero for me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> The people who hate Aero here are the same people who find windows classic appealing, in other words, they have awful taste. Let me have my crystal palace desktop and you can have your plastic shack if you want.


I'm glad they're removing Aero, as the whole Windows GUI area is..well, crap. It's copied some features but not enough from OS X, the various Linux GUIs, etc. My favorite is still gnome2 simply because it's not heavy on resources, near infinitely customizable and ridiculously easy to use from my perspective. It's entirely personal and not a world-wide belief when you talk about GUIs, some people will love Metro and some will hate it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> The first time I heard that one was right before Windows 95 was released. Keep on waiting...


Right, because Linux in 1995 was as ready for the desktop as it is now.

You're talking major kernel changes since then (1.2 in early 1995, 3.2 now. To be fair, 3.0 wasn't a major change) along with massive changes to the GUI area (Out of the major GUIs, KDE was annoucned in 1996 and xfce came out in 1996...). Not even including any other programs or drivers (Among the many other things) Linux now is *much* more suited to the average user as opposed to a hobbyist or enthusiast.
Do I think Win8 will be the rise of Linux? No. Not unless massive amounts of people hate Metro and refuse to upgrade, Microsoft doesn't get rid of Metro as the default in Win9 *and* Ubuntu or the like starts a massive marketing campaign to capitalize on the hate. So yeah, not very likely at all.


----------



## dioxholster

linux will never get traction simply because just like windows it doesn't know what it wants to be.


----------



## joshd

To be honest I didn't really like "aero" and when ever I use Windows 7 I change it to the classic look so this is a step in the right direction I think.


----------



## Artikbot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mingqi53*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.theverge.com/2012/2/24/2822891/windows-desktop-ui-concept
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^--what Windows 8 should look like!
> I'm glad they got rid of Aero for Windows, and revised the buttons, but they still need to go a few steps further.
Click to expand...

YES!! HELL YES!!!


----------



## Boyboyd

I didn't buy windows 7 for aero, but I think it looks much better than what i'm seeing in W8 so far.


----------



## Artikbot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> linux will never get traction simply because just like windows it doesn't know what it wants to be.


Go back to your basement.


----------



## Malcolm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *joshd*
> 
> To be honest I didn't really like "aero" and when ever I use Windows 7 I change it to the classic look so this is a step in the right direction I think.


What's wrong with it? I'll take GPU-accelerated Aero over Classic any day.


----------



## Deacon

Well W8 will bring changes behind the scenes, but nothing interesting in terms of UI, at least this is my opinion, not one bit trilled about the Metro Interface, I actually don't like it, its nice on touch devices, but on desktops i fail to see the usefulness, also I think it looks to retro to my taste, don't really like it, I'm sticking with W7 since I don't see the point in changing, since theres nothing exciting or useful for me on W8, I will wait to see what W9 brings.


----------



## joshd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malcolm*
> 
> What's wrong with it? I'll take GPU-accelerated Aero over Classic any day.


*I*. Not you. Me.


----------



## james8

wut
i'm among the few people that actually like the look of Aero. it brings windows the quality GUI that other OS have for quite a few years now.
Microsoft probably trying to be a mobile-GUI fanboy again. and they probably want less graphics stress on intel graphics since that crap never ran aero accurately


----------



## Skylit

Aero contributed to slight input lag anyway.


----------



## Spritanium

So Microsoft's new strategy is to make their OS look as boring and business-like as possible while at the same time making it extremely cumbersome to use in business situations?

Herp derp


----------



## Malcolm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *joshd*
> 
> *I*. Not you. Me.


I got that. I was just curious...


----------



## joshd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malcolm*
> 
> I got that. I was just curious...


Ah right. Well, for me, coming from Linux, I naturally like minimalist. I just think that using resources on making something look slightly pretty is a waste... I mean I use Linux terminal to listen to songs for god sake!


----------



## marbleduck

That ribbon... cluttered and ugly. I actually stopped using MS word because that ribbon pissed me off so much.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dioxholster*
> 
> The people who hate Aero here are the same people who find windows classic appealing, in other words, *they have awful taste.* Let me have my crystal palace desktop and you can have your plastic shack if you want.


+100000

Classic is tacky and terrible while Aero is classy and gorgeous...


----------



## joshd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> +100000
> Classic is tacky and terrible while Aero is classy and gorgeous...


All a matter of opinion.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Taste has always been a matter of opinion. Yours is just bad.


----------



## joshd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Taste has always been a matter of opinion. Yours is just bad.












lol


----------



## dmasteR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malcolm*
> 
> What's wrong with it? I'll take GPU-accelerated Aero over Classic any day.


Input lag, no thanks.

Using classic reduces the input lag back to how it was in XP.


----------



## PrimeBurn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *joshd*
> 
> Ah right. Well, for me, coming from Linux, I naturally like minimalist. I just think that using resources on making something look slightly pretty is a waste... I mean I use Linux terminal to listen to songs for god sake!


Funny, for me, coming from Linux, I like lots of junk.

I liked my fancy E17 desktop in my minimal Ubuntu install.

I liked my Compiz Cube, RSS-GLX screensavers, and Audacious using Panflute and Devilspie with my Gnome desktop.

I like glitz and gimmicks. But, I've always used the classic desktop in Windows. For some reason the Aero theme and the non-classic interface feel slow, kind of like driving sedan after driving a sports car. And the gadgets always seemed kind of "meh" to me...

Regardless, I can't get too worked up about it. I'm pretty much resigned to the idea that interfaces are going to get more and more restrictive.


----------



## vikingsteve

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noak*
> 
> Why do companies insist on "fixing" things that aren't broken or need fixing...


Profit.


----------



## Thingamajig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Taste has always been a matter of opinion. Yours is just bad.


Made me laugh.

I like Aero, but i dislike the resource hog it is. They shouldv'e just optimized it.

I can safely say Windows 8 will be one OS i'll be skipping. As someone else stated, it looks too cumbersome and cluttered to use.


----------



## Malcolm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmasteR*
> 
> Input lag, no thanks.
> Using classic reduces the input lag back to how it was in XP.


I used to have input lag like you, then I took an SSD to the...yeah.

But seriously, it's like 100ms at the very most?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Yeah, I have to lol at the "input lag" argument against aero. Don't notice any of that on my rig.

Also, if aero is really taxing your resources then chances are you need an upgrade. Just sayin'...


----------



## joshd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Yeah, I have to lol at the "input lag" argument against aero. Don't notice any of that on my rig.
> Also, if aero is really taxing your resources then chances are you need an upgrade. Just sayin'...


I don't. Got a FX 4100 @ stock, 4 GB of RAM, what else can I need? I don't game so..


----------



## Malcolm

Has a multi-core CPU, 8GB+ of RAM and a video card from the last 5 years, complains about resources wasted. I don't understand why people do this. It's like Bill Gates complaining about a 10-cent sales tax on a bag of M&Ms.


----------



## joshd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malcolm*
> 
> Has a multi-core CPU, 8GB+ of RAM and a video card from the last 5 years, complains about resources wasted. I don't understand why people do this. It's like Bill Gates complaining about a 10-cent sales tax on a bag of M&Ms.


You don't understand about me moaning about wasted resources?


----------



## dmasteR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malcolm*
> 
> I used to have input lag like you, then I took an SSD to the...yeah.
> But seriously, it's like 100ms at the very most?


I have a SSD, that has nothing to do with the input lag though. 100MS makes a huge difference in gaming.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Yeah, I have to lol at the "input lag" argument against aero. Don't notice any of that on my rig.
> Also, if aero is really taxing your resources then chances are you need an upgrade. Just sayin'...


My computer is fine. The input lag is annoying.


----------



## jacobrjett

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Well with Metro UI you cant really Call Windows, Windows any more. They are trying to get away from Windows name and these are just some steps.


if that turns out to be true then in the future we can be those nerdy "windows" guys









also,

...theres input lag on windows aero?


----------



## tpi2007

They partially addressed one of my criticisms which was the completely incoherent gluing together of Metro and Windows 7, now it looks a bit better, but my main criticism still stands, this is a mistake.

A modern OS should be about options, you should be able to customize the OS to make it look like you want it to. Heck, now we have GPU accelerated rendering and they are taking away Aero ? Sure, take it away as the main theme, but leave it there for who wants it. It's this lack of customization that always annoyed me with Windows. Windows XP also didn't have many official themes available because Microsoft had to sign evey one of them. If you wanted customization you had to replace .dlls and be at your own risk. At least Aero takes some of that problem away because it doesnt really stand in the way and adapts to whatever the background is.

Did Microsoft actually call the Windows 7 Aero interface "dated and cheesy." ? It's quoted in the article, so I presume yes. I would understand if they said that about Windows XP (and coincidentally, about Metro LOL), whose original theme has been said to look like a Fisher Price toy, but Aero ? Aero is timeless, it looks elegant, without getting in the way.

It's even more baffling they say that, not only about one of their OSes, but about their best-selling OS of all time, which is not even threee years old! I could understand if they said it about Windows XP which is more than 10 years old, but ironically, perhaps people would make the comparison between Windows XP and Windows 8 - no Aero, cheesy colors.

In all honesty I have to reiterate the question, are they mad ?

They are sacrificing their most loyal customers, the desktop and laptop users, to some mobile trend, and everybody knows that people are a lot more mobile (pun intended) when it's about mobile devices.

I sense Steve Ballmer, who was called the worst CEO again a few days ago, needs Bill Gates looking over him.


----------



## Iroh

I was wondering when MS would make a 64-bit Windows 3.1.

First thought in my head when I saw that screenshot.


----------



## cavallino

I've been using the windows 8 consumer preview here and there and I actually really like the interface...go figure.


----------



## Tunechi

I'd hate that for Win 7, aero glass gives it the modern and sleek look.


----------



## joshd

There will be a work around anyway, even if MS don't provide it. So this doesn't really matter.


----------



## Rubers

12GB RAM... Not bothered about Aero resource usage.

They should give users the option. ALWAYS give users an option.


----------



## Mr.Eiht

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *joshd*
> 
> *I mean I use Linux terminal to listen to songs for god sake!*


^This! From NY to Cali and back! Give me a root shell and I am







.
BUT when you are on Windows (you know you shouldn`t be there )
then it should at least look good. A prison cell looks much nicer with curtains.
And every Linux lover has to admit that they try strange things nowadays. Strange GUI things


----------



## Cyrilmak

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forty2*
> 
> Windows 8 Windows ME 2


This. I refuse to support Windows 8, period. We need Bill back.


----------



## Xenthos

Lots of tinfoil hats here, I actually installed Windows 8 unlike most critics here and tried it, "got used to it" and I like it, metro isn't that useful on a desktop/laptop (for now, maybe that'll change) and yeah it has a few Beta bugs but it's fine.

Also, all my drivers are supported out of the box, it recognizes and optimizes the OS for my SSD and gives the option to TRIM instead of Defrag in the Windows Defrag menu. It looks slick and smooth, yeah I'm good for now.


----------



## Brutuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> Lots of tinfoil hats here, I actually installed Windows 8 unlike most critics here and tried it, "got used to it" and I like it, metro isn't that useful on a desktop/laptop (for now, maybe that'll change) and yeah it has a few Beta bugs but it's fine.
> Also, all my drivers are supported out of the box, it recognizes and optimizes the OS for my SSD and gives the option to TRIM instead of Defrag in the Windows Defrag menu. It looks slick and smooth, yeah I'm good for now.


I got used to the extra input lag in Win7 compared to XP (A new XP install just feels more fluid than Win7 ever does to me, it's weird...) but that sure as hell doesn't mean I wouldn't take XP over 7 if it wasn't for features in 7 I actually use. Same thing with Unity in Ubuntu, I got used to it as part of using 12.04 LTS for my University assignment (Answering questions using the terminal and trying it out at the same time) but that doesn't mean I wasn't relieved when I went back to Win7/MATE in Arch.


----------



## tpi2007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> Lots of tinfoil hats here, I actually installed Windows 8 unlike most critics here and tried it, "got used to it" and I like it, metro isn't that useful on a desktop/laptop (for now, maybe that'll change) and yeah it has a few Beta bugs but it's fine.
> Also, all my drivers are supported out of the box, it recognizes and optimizes the OS for my SSD and gives the option to TRIM instead of Defrag in the Windows Defrag menu. It looks slick and smooth, yeah I'm good for now.


Your comment doesn't make much sense. You admit yourself that Metro is nothing you'll really like, rather live with it. Do you think that is a good thing or a sucessful strategy for Micrsoft ?

Oh, by the way, I did install Windows 8 Developer Preview and the Consumer Preview. I have been using the Developer Preview on a desktop for months and have rarely used the laptop where I installed Windows 8 Consumer Preview. Why ? I disabled Metro on the Developer Preview.

Also, Windows 7 already disables defrag for SSD's and already and has support for TRIM, so that is not something Windows 8 will improve upon.


----------



## tpi2007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brutuz*
> 
> I got used to the extra input lag in Win7 compared to XP (A new XP install just feels more fluid than Win7 ever does to me, it's weird...) but that sure as hell doesn't mean I wouldn't take XP over 7 if it wasn't for features in 7 I actually use. Same thing with Unity in Ubuntu, I got used to it as part of using 12.04 LTS for my University assignment (Answering questions using the terminal and trying it out at the same time) but that doesn't mean I wasn't relieved when I went back to Win7/MATE in Arch.


If I remeber correclty, there is no imput lag between Windows XP and newer versions of Windows as a result of Aero, what Microsoft did was add a little extra transition time between a key press / mouse click and the menu fully appearing in order to give a more sleek working appearance. I think you can change that by configuring Windows's advanced parameters.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> Your comment doesn't make much sense. You admit yourself that Metro is nothing you'll really like, rather live with it. Do you think that is a good thing or a sucessful strategy for Micrsoft ?
> Oh, by the way, I did install Windows 8 Developer Preview and the Consumer Preview. *I'm have been using the Developer Preview on a desktop for months and have rarey used the laptop where I installed Windows 8 Consumer Preview*. Why ? I disabled Metro on the Developer Preview.
> Also, Windows 7 already disables defrag for SSD's already and has support for TRIM, so that is not something Windows 8 will improve upon.


You know the outcome of the OS, yet still continue to use it anyways? Me thinks someone is just a hater, and will end up using Windows 8 anyways.


----------



## Xenthos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> Your comment doesn't make much sense. You admit yourself that Metro is nothing you'll really like, rather live with it. Do you think that is a good thing or a sucessful strategy for Micrsoft ?


- Yep, its useful in its own right, which is tablets.
- Nope and never did I claim such a thing either.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> Oh, by the way, I did install Windows 8 Developer Preview and the Consumer Preview. I'm have been using the Developer Preview on a desktop for months and have rarey used the laptop where I installed Windows 8 Consumer Preview. Why ? I disabled Metro on the Developer Preview.


Surely you're smart enough to realize that I am not talking about the few exceptions on here (like you) and instead am talking about the people who don't care to look for themselves but instead judge the OS on the things some people say.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> Also, Windows 7 already disables defrag for SSD's already and has support for TRIM, so that is not something Windows 8 will improve upon.


Never does for me, I can defrag my SSD on Win 7 all day long, the OS doesn't stop me and there is no way I can actually execute TRIM like in Win 8.

EDIT: the reason I'm so confident Windows 8 will be fine is that this is still beta with specific features disabled so you're kinda forced to test the tablet features. I'm sure the desktop / laptop version of Windows 8 will allow more customization to create your own Windows 7/8 kind of thing.


----------



## tpi2007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> You know the outcome of the OS, yet still continue to use it anyways? Me thinks someone is just a hater, and will end up using Windows 8 anyways.


Your comment doesn't make any sense, and my behaviour just proves I'm not a hater, I'm acting rationally, Windows 8 Developer Preview expires in January of next year, so why wouldn't I use an operating system for free, especially if I can disable Metro and make it work like Windows 7 ? If you had read my review you would know I think there are good things in Windows 8.


----------



## joshd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> Your comment doesn't make any sense, and my behaviour just proves I'm not a hater, I'm acting rationally, Windows 8 Developer Preview expires in January of next year, so why wouldn't I use an operating system for free, especially if I can disable Metro and make it work like Windows 7 ? If you had read my review you would know I think there are good things in Windows 8.


Linux is free... forever.


----------



## BenRK

WELL! Looks like I'll be making a redundant comment about Windows 7 being my last Windows OS or something...

Seriously though, it's not a HUGE deal that the glass is going away. Those bars on the tops of windows kind of just took up space. A negligible amount, but still. It is a change, but one I can get over.

That said, why did Microsoft get rid of the start button!?!?!? Old argument I know, but that was super useful! Unless it can be turned back on for home users and such, I don't see my self getting this OS, but that's because of a general loss of interest in Windows as a whole. Sadly, I can't move over to another OS till a specific programming tool and gaming moves over to Linux.


----------



## Megaman_90

Yay Windows 3.1 V2?


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Megaman_90*
> 
> Yay Windows 3.1 V2?


*runs out to buy 131383732 floppy disks* Nah but really I think Microsoft is trying to bring back the Windows XP feel to the newer OS base they have built off Vista. I just cant wait the 15 more days until Release Preview releases so I can try it out on my old computer. I'm tired of being stuck on XP because Vista/7 is too heavy for a single core machine. With Aero gone and what not it should free up lots of resources and feel much snappier for old machines (deemed official XP killer?).


----------



## Mygaffer

I love Aero and I use the start button all the time. Windows 8, eat a ... well, you know.


----------



## tpi2007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> - Yep, its useful in its own right, which is tablets.
> - Nope and never did I claim such a thing either.
> Surely you're smart enough to realize that I am not talking about the few exceptions on here (like you) and instead am talking about the people who don't care to look for themselves but instead judge the OS on the things some people say.
> Never does for me, I can defrag my SSD on Win 7 all day long, the OS doesn't stop me and there is no way I can actually execute TRIM like in Win 8.
> EDIT: the reason I'm so confident Windows 8 will be fine is that this is still beta with specific features disabled so you're kinda forced to test the tablet features. I'm sure the desktop / laptop version of Windows 8 will allow more customization to create your own Windows 7/8 kind of thing.


You don't know if all or the majority of people didn't use Windows 8, and in any case, even if they didn't, they might very well have read dozens of articles, looked at screenshots and watch it work in videos, so you can't just say people are criticizing just because.

I sure hope Microsoft brings back the features, but if that is the strategy, to force people to use the tablet features, I think this is the wrong way to do it. Just look at all the comments all over the Internet.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *joshd*
> 
> Linux is free... forever.


Indeed!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenRK*
> 
> WELL! Looks like I'll be making a redundant comment about Windows 7 being my last Windows OS or something...
> Seriously though, it's not a HUGE deal that the glass is going away. Those bars on the tops of windows kind of just took up space. A negligible amount, but still. It is a change, but one I can get over.
> That said, why did Microsoft get rid of the start button!?!?!? Old argument I know, but that was super useful! Unless it can be turned back on for home users and such, I don't see my self getting this OS, but that's because of a general loss of interest in Windows as a whole. Sadly, I can't move over to another OS till a specific programming tool and gaming moves over to Linux.


What bars are you talking about on the tops of windows ?

I also can't move to another platform that easily, but Windows is a paid product, why can't I, as you, as customers, give constructive criticism for a product a company wants to sell and I eventually want to buy ?

I don't understand those who say for the people who don't like Windows 8 as it is to start their own thread, people have every right to give feedback, and only a company who is foolish will not listen. And in this case, Microsoft listened to some of the criticism. Heck, in my case, I even started my first post in this thread by saying that! These Windows 8 news threads are not "Windows 8 praise" threads the last time I checked. They have been listening to criticism, but not enough, but given that the product is yet to be released, and they keep changing things, only people who are here just to criticize others and not talk about the product itself, will not admit that even Microsoft thinks the whole concept needs a lot of polishing, which is what they have been doing since the Developer Preview. Even the Consumer Preview looks a lot different in some respects compared to the Developer Preview.


----------



## tombom

Thank you based god. Initially I was like "you windows 8 beta users should quit crying because people always cry about new OS's" but then I tried windows 8 and by god is it an awful feeling OS on a desktop. The idea of windows as being your primary interface is the best way we've got for managing an OS so far and my idea is: if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Keep trying to think of new and innovative features that you think NEED to be incorporated (who needs a mobile interface for a desktop computer? Seriously.) and go with the flow.


----------



## Xenthos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> You don't know if all or the majority of people didn't use Windows 8, and in any case, even if they didn't, they might very well have read dozens of articles, looked at screenshots and watch it work in videos, so you can't just say people are criticizing just because.
> I sure hope Microsoft brings back the features, but if that is the strategy, to force people to use the tablet features, I think this is the wrong way to do it. Just look at all the comments all over the Internet.


Going to the dentist does not make me a dentist, it does however give me the ability to criticize his work on my teeth.
Reading about someone going to the dentist might give that person a vague idea based on common issues / feelings or values related to dentists, but that does not mean they can judge this specific dentist I went to.

The dentist is Win 8.

Also, I'm not gonna make a thread to poll it but I'm willing to bet not even 9 out of 10 people, who commented, tried Win 8 for at-least a few hours.


----------



## jrbroad77

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> Lots of tinfoil hats here, I actually installed Windows 8 unlike most critics here and tried it, "got used to it" and I like it, metro isn't that useful on a desktop/laptop (for now, maybe that'll change) and yeah it has a few Beta bugs but it's fine.
> Also, all my drivers are supported out of the box, it recognizes and optimizes the OS for my SSD and gives the option to TRIM instead of Defrag in the Windows Defrag menu. It looks slick and smooth, yeah I'm good for now.


SOLD! Its mediocre, I must upgrade from Windows 7.


----------



## tpi2007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> Going to the dentist does not make me a dentist, it does however give me the ability to criticize his work on my teeth.
> Reading about someone going to the dentist might give that person a vague idea based on common issues / feelings or values related to dentists, but that does not mean they can judge this specific dentist I went to.
> The dentist is Win 8.
> Also, I'm not gonna make a thread to poll it but I'm willing to bet not even 9 out of 10 people, who commented, tried Win 8 for at-least a few hours.


Your comparison does not make sense as you put it. You are comparing your description of going to a specific dentist compared to other people's descriptions of going to other dentists. How does that apply here ? People are all talking about Windows 8, so you and others in your example should be talking about the same dentist.

And in that case it would depend on how accurate the description of the dentist's work you make. It can be better or just as good or worse than a third party review of that dentist.

It's ironic you chose the dentist to be Windows 8. People generally don't like going to the dentist.


----------



## Xenthos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> That depends on how accurate the description of the dentist's work you make. It can be better or just as good or worse than a third party review of that dentist.
> It's ironic you chose the dentist to be Windows 8. People generally don't like going to the dentist.


That's the reason I picked it, people judge before actually going there or based on a bad experience, meanwhile, if he/she brushed their teeth properly, he/she would have nothing to worry about.

Brushed their teeth = get to know metro.

I might be taking this a bit far


----------



## tpi2007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xenthos*
> 
> That's the reason I picked it, people judge before actually going there or based on a bad experience, meanwhile, if he/she brushed their teeth properly, he/she would have nothing to worry about.
> Brushed their teeth = get to know metro.
> I might be taking this a bit far


Lol, you do have a point there! But I would say you have a point in the general example.

I just edited my previous post because I noticed you were talking about different dentists in your example, which doesn't make sense. And it's the same thing here, if people have not only heard from others about Windows 8, but also read reviews on sites, and even watched a video of it in action, they might be on to something.


----------



## DesertRat

IDK why, but when I saw the screenshot I immediately was reminded of Windows 3.1. Microsoft, making leaps and bounds..... backwards.


----------



## BenRK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpi2007*
> 
> What bars are you talking about on the tops of windows ?




What I'm talking about is that blue bar with the title of the window (My Computer), the little icon, the minimize/window/close buttons. As I don't actually work on the software it self, I have no clue what the technical term is.


----------



## Disturbed117

I can understand them wanting to boost performance on mobile devices, But don't ruin windows for desktop users who have Much powerful machines.

Windows 8 as is = No for me.


----------



## Riou

There is input lag on Aero and Windows Basic theme. Only classic removes the input lag. If you play windowed or borderless games, Aero adds 50-75 ms of display/input lag. If you play FPS games where reaction time matters, it can matter. Aero is disabled in full screen mode, however.


----------



## Disturbed117

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riou*
> 
> There is input lag on Aero and Windows Basic theme. Only classic removes the input lag. If you play windowed or borderless games, Aero adds 50-75 ms of display/input lag. If you play FPS games where reaction time matters, it can matter. Aero is disabled in full screen mode, however.


Most gamers should know to kill Aero when gaming though.


----------



## Darren9

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riou*
> 
> There is input lag on Aero and Windows Basic theme. Only classic removes the input lag. If you play windowed or borderless games, Aero adds 50-75 ms of display/input lag. If you play FPS games where reaction time matters, it can matter. Aero is disabled in full screen mode, however.


Isn't the desktop with aero on sync'd to monitor refresh (I can only get a window to tear when dragged fast with it off)? I'm just supposing it's a similar thing to the "Vsync effect".


----------



## Warmonger

Seems like Microsoft is going to use the same marketing technique they used with Windows 7 to help sell Windows 8.
Quote:


> According to "contacts," after the Release Preview arrives, customers who buy Windows 7 or a Windows 7 PC will be able to upgrade to Windows 8 when it's released in the fall for just $14.99


----------



## malikq86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Disturbed117*
> 
> Most gamers should know to kill Aero when gaming though.


Does Aero really make that much of a difference when gaming...if you have 8 GB RAM? I've never turned it off.....maybe I should.


----------



## Ksireaper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malikq86*
> 
> Does Aero really make that much of a difference when gaming...if you have 8 GB RAM? I've never turned it off.....maybe I should.


Ya i was gonna say that i have never had an issue.

Maybe i should turn it off and see whats up.


----------



## Disturbed117

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malikq86*
> 
> Does Aero really make that much of a difference when gaming...if you have 8 GB RAM? I've never turned it off.....maybe I should.


Its your Vram Aero hurts. And it can hurt performance some. Not any major hits though, Maybe a 1-3% hit.


----------



## malikq86

hmmm...1 - 3% isn't a big deal...but maybe ill look into turning it off..idk...


----------



## strap624

looks like something from the 90's


----------



## dioxholster

Its imperative to us that windows 8 fails, otherwise the direction they are taking might be irreversible and like it or not we all will be forced into using it as windows 7 ages.


----------



## tpi2007

Microsoft owns a search engine, and is pretty much capable of using everybody else's search engine to know what people are saying about Windows 8, be it in forums, blogs, tech sites, general news sites, facebook or tweeter. Anybody who says Microsoft does not read these forums or any other forums or sites but their own is really, well, wrong. It would be against their interests to confine themselves to their own discussion forums. They don't have a company rep here, but other companies do (AMD does), and even Intel is a sponsor on this site, even though they don't have a company rep here, but they sure do read what is said about their products.


----------



## Z Overlord

Sensation OP, they are replacing Aero


----------



## Stealth Pyros

Do not want. I like my Aero.


----------



## Clovertail100

So bulky, fat, and ugly. I don't need a big clunky bar at the top of every damn window; give me an edit dropdown box like before. Get rid of that ugly useless customizable side bar too.


----------



## Agenesis

Don't really care for decorations. All of my computers have the classic theme with a solid background.


----------



## USFORCES

Isn't Aero a choice to use or not?


----------



## Z Overlord

Aero is ugly as hell, especially compared to allot of Linux Distros


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riou*
> 
> There is input lag on Aero and Windows Basic theme. Only classic removes the input lag. If you play windowed or borderless games, Aero adds 50-75 ms of display/input lag. If you play FPS games where reaction time matters, it can matter. Aero is disabled in full screen mode, however.


Who plays in windowed mode???


----------



## BlackVenom

I like Aero... Are they trying to turn Windows into some half-assed mobile OS?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaxFTW*
> 
> Hopefully linux will take over before win8 is released.


This, but quite a looooooooooooooong shot.


----------



## Jixr

and this is why I switched to a Hackintosh. Only reason why I use windows now is for Gaming.

and I highly doubt I will upgrade to win8


----------



## ilhe4e12345

i like the change...Aero was pretty at first, but in the end I just disabled it becuase i didnt find it useful at all....i welcome this change, as I personally am really liking Windows 8


----------



## d3310n

this is good, looks nice and clean! aero is just a unnecessary mem hog.


----------



## steelbom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lifeshield*
> 
> You do realise that the link posted in the post I replied to links to the exact same video, don't you?
> 
> A real person will have a guide in front of them and learn how to use it.
> 
> It's not really rocket science.
> 
> Then they should stop being lazy and start learning how to use what they paid for properly.


I thought you needed another one lol jk. I thought I did see one but I wasn't sure lol.

I suppose they won't have a choice, so yeah they'll probably read the guide.


----------



## nathris

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Who plays in windowed mode???


Anybody that wants proper alt-tab support.


----------



## HowHardCanItBe

Alright could we please lay off the personal attacks and name calling?


----------



## Rookie1337

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nathris*
> 
> Anybody that wants proper alt-tab support.


Who needs to alt-tab in the middle of a game? Seriously...there's something wrong when you're multi-tasking while multi-tasking.


----------



## nathris

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rookie1337*
> 
> Who needs to alt-tab in the middle of a game? Seriously...there's something wrong when you're multi-tasking while multi-tasking.


You're right. Its a useless feature that nobody wants. That's why Blizzard included it as a direct menu option in Diablo 3. You know what's also useless? The Steamworks overlay. Why on earth would I want to talk to friends or use the browser to quickly check something in game? Its almost as bad as alt-tabbing!


----------



## 222Panther222

I like the border white clean square but i dont like the kind of menu that there is under it, anyway gonna keep windows 7 a long time.


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

I think it looks like windows 3.1 done in HD.

Do not want, and Aero is not a big mem hog...I haven't had any issues with it ever. Windows 8 is day by day looking worse and worse to me. I won't be a buyer.


----------



## quietpressure

With this 2D makeup, I'm sure mainstream computers will be blazing fast!

I'm glad I love what Microsoft's doing, otherwise I would be putting my flamesuit on and a megaphone in hand.


----------



## TFL Replica

Change the default, don't remove features and functionality.


----------



## steelbom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TFL Replica*
> 
> Change the default, don't remove features and functionality.


Exactly this.Then everyone is happy.


----------



## Rookie1337

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nathris*
> 
> You're right. Its a useless feature that nobody wants. That's why Blizzard included it as a direct menu option in Diablo 3. You know what's also useless? The Steamworks overlay. Why on earth would I want to talk to friends or use the browser to quickly check something in game? Its almost as bad as alt-tabbing!


My bad...forgot to add the /sarcasm.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zrlan7710*
> 
> With this 2D makeup, I'm sure mainstream computers will be blazing fast!
> I'm glad I love what Microsoft's doing, otherwise I would be putting my flamesuit on and a megaphone in hand.


Im waiting to try it out on my old single core.


----------



## steelbom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *zrlan7710*
> 
> With this 2D makeup, I'm sure mainstream computers will be blazing fast!
> I'm glad I love what Microsoft's doing, otherwise I would be putting my flamesuit on and a megaphone in hand.
> 
> 
> 
> Im waiting to try it out on my old single core.
Click to expand...

Try running it in a virtual machine with 1 core and 2 MB of RAM. I did that with Windows 7 once... it took about forty five minutes to boot and all the graphics were... I don't even know what to call it. But it worked xD


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steelbom*
> 
> Try running it in a virtual machine with 1 core and 2 MB of RAM. I did that with Windows 7 once... it took about forty five minutes to boot and all the graphics were... I don't even know what to call it. But it worked xD


I'm running Consumer Preview atm. I'm just curious of how more responsive the desktop environment will be with more core fixes and Aero removed.


----------



## UltraVolta425

MS is sooooo not gonna get a penny from me for Windows 8.
And I hope by the time they start developping Windows 9, they have a new CEO. The current one's vision SUCKS.


----------



## Shadowness

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riou*
> 
> There is input lag on Aero and Windows Basic theme. Only classic removes the input lag. If you play windowed or borderless games, Aero adds 50-75 ms of display/input lag. If you play FPS games where reaction time matters, it can matter. Aero is disabled in full screen mode, however.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *User on Youtube*
> Vega, just what config trick are you talking about that saved you﻿ 400MB of VRAM?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> Right click on applicable game.exe, properties, compatibility tab, check disable visual themes and desktop composition. This disables Aero during game play and saves 300-500 MB VRAM depending on your Surround resolution. I do this to all of my games, and the best part is it's free as Aero turns﻿ back on when the game closes.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Source*
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvShhfWpk2M


Thought i'd point this out. Next ?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nathris*
> 
> Anybody that wants proper alt-tab support.


Is it really that big of an issue to alt-tab from fullscreen mode ? Take a fraction of a second on my laptop, let alone the desktop i am building this summer....


----------



## Blameless

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malcolm*
> 
> Has a multi-core CPU, 8GB+ of RAM and a video card from the last 5 years, complains about resources wasted. I don't understand why people do this. It's like Bill Gates complaining about a 10-cent sales tax on a bag of M&Ms.


An abundance of resources isn't an excuse to waste them.

If I had a billion dollars, I wouldn't go around lighting cigars with 100 dollar bills...because I can do something more useful with that 100 dollars.

Same goes for my system memory, CPU cycles, GPU, and electricity.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> 12GB RAM... Not bothered about Aero resource usage.
> They should give users the option. ALWAYS give users an option.


I agree.

However, I would also like the option for certain components to not be included in the install at all, rather than simply being disabled.


----------



## USFORCES

So there selling us windows starter and calling it the new windows 8


----------



## TFL Replica

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> So there selling us windows starter and calling it the new windows 8


Funny and sad at the same time. Even with this change they will never drive me to use Metro.


----------



## UltraVolta425

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> An abundance of resources isn't an excuse to waste them.
> If I had a billion dollars, I wouldn't go around lighting cigars with 100 dollar bills...because I can do something more useful with that 100 dollars.
> Same goes for my system memory, CPU cycles, GPU, and electricity.
> I agree.
> However, I would also like the option for certain components to not be included in the install at all, rather than simply being disabled.


I couldn't agree more. On top of that I believe that with graphics cards processing power rising and rising, they should also have made an even nicer graphical UI for Windows, aside from their new spartan look and their glass look.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> I agree.
> However, I would also like the option for certain components to not be included in the install at all, rather than simply being disabled.


Sure enough. I'm all for choice and getting to choose what you want. I personally don't like all the things MS are doing with Windows 8 right now. I can understand why they're making some changes but I just don't get why some of them are being forced on desktop users. :-(


----------



## RedCloudFuneral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> I think it looks like windows 3.1 done in HD.
> Do not want, and Aero is not a big mem hog...I haven't had any issues with it ever. Windows 8 is day by day looking worse and worse to me. I won't be a buyer.


I just switched to the Windows Classic theme after seeing this thread. I saw a 20C idle temp drop(passive 6850 that may have a loose heatsink) and idle VRAM usuage went from 130mb idle/260mb with firefox and youtube to 23mb idle/51mb with firefox and youtube.
It may not be demanding really but turning it off gave me a massive temperature drop and is most likely saving power(would be useful for laptops?)
Most likely it won't affect game performance as Aero is disabled when running games fullscreen.
Also keep in mind, I wasn't using the semi-transparent windows for Aero, I turned that off a while ago because it started to get a little cheesy. The difference may be even larger for anyone using that.

Still, I'm not buying Windows 8. The lack of the start menu is annoying, and the Metro thing is way too gimmicky, but most important; Windows 7 does everything I need it to and I see no reason to upgrade.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RedCloudFuneral*
> 
> I just switched to the Windows Classic theme after seeing this thread. I saw a 20C idle temp drop(passive 6850 that may have a loose heatsink) and idle VRAM usuage went from 130mb idle/260mb with firefox and youtube to 23mb idle/51mb with firefox and youtube.
> It may not be demanding really but turning it off gave me a massive temperature drop and is most likely saving power(would be useful for laptops?)
> Most likely it won't affect game performance as Aero is disabled when running games fullscreen.
> Also keep in mind, I wasn't using the semi-transparent windows for Aero, I turned that off a while ago because it started to get a little cheesy. The difference may be even larger for anyone using that.
> Still, I'm not buying Windows 8. The lack of the start menu is annoying, and the Metro thing is way too gimmicky, but most important; Windows 7 does everything I need it to and I see no reason to upgrade.


20c idle temps drop seems like it may be the heatsink thing to be honest. With Aero enabled my GPU idles at 30-34C...


----------



## NrGx

Love it. Flat panel, minimalistic, let the content talk. Metro philosophy is awesome.


----------



## Chobbit

Meh I only use Aero too add videos to my desktop background but usually disable it as it actually causes bad microstuttering which I don't get when its turned off.

Do remember this is all trying too bridge the gap between computers, tablets & mobiles so aero isnt needed.


----------



## Aeru

Hmm, interesting. I wonder how Windows 8 is going to be like in the end?
Is there any point in still using Windows except for gaming?

PS: Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers...


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chobbit*
> 
> Meh I only use Aero too add videos to my desktop background but usually disable it as it actually causes bad microstuttering which I don't get when its turned off.
> Do remember this is all trying too bridge the gap between computers, tablets & mobiles *so aero isnt needed*.


In your opinion, no...


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Sure enough. I'm all for choice and getting to choose what you want. I personally don't like all the things MS are doing with Windows 8 right now. I can understand why they're making some changes but I just don't get why some of them are being forced on desktop users. :-(


Desktop users aren't being forced to use Windows 8. Tho OS is shortly released after Windows 7 and people are claiming they have no choice but to upgrade to it? Windows 8 is Microsoft's take on a mobile platform, nothing more, nothing less. And they will score a bunch of sales from people who do like using it on their desktops.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NrGx*
> 
> Love it. Flat panel, minimalistic, let the content talk. Metro philosophy is awesome.


Agree, its about the 1's and 0's who cares how fancy the IDE, I mean.. Windows looks.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aeru*
> 
> Hmm, interesting. I wonder how Windows 8 is going to be like in the end?
> Is there any point in still using Windows except for gaming?
> PS: Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, Developers, ...


Windows 8 will be a huge gateway for developers old and new. A new API, new Visual Studio functions, and a entirely new way of deploying software. So yea, im sure there will be *lots* of developers such as myself.


----------



## Djankie

I don't understand the problem, I mean frankly I like the minimal design.

Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9000 met Tapatalk


----------



## andrews2547

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BlackVenom*
> 
> I like Aero... Are they trying to turn Windows into some half-assed mobile OS?


Yes they are actually, Windows 8 is designed primarily for phones and tablets.


----------



## randomizer

If removing the start button is as disastrous as people say then MS wouldn't do it. They do focus groups for this sort of thing. Besides, throwing your mouse into the bottom left corner the moment you see the desktop is basically a reflex action, and guess what, that's what you need to do!

For completely new users it won't be quite as easy, since there are no visual cues. However, an orb with a colourful flag on it does not really provide any meaningful visual clues either unless you already know what it's for.


----------



## SirDrexl

I haven't read all of the thread, but why is everyone assuming this won't have the resource usage of Aero? It may look different, but if it draws windows the same underlying way, it will be just as "heavy" on resource use. I see that there's no transparency in the title bar, but the taskbar still has it.

Personally I like Aero, once you give it a color instead of the default theme. I don't care much for this flat, blander look, but I guess I'll get used to it. I hope there's some decent customization. But, things I like about Aero (besides the look) are how it eliminated image tearing and those "trails" when dragging windows. I hope this new scheme is the same way, although I suspect it would have to draw windows like Aero did.


----------



## randomizer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SirDrexl*
> 
> But, things I like about Aero (besides the look) are how it eliminated image tearing and those "trails" when dragging windows.


I highly doubt that Microsoft will go back to using a stacking window manager after having used a compositing window manager for 6 years.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Desktop users aren't being forced to use Windows 8. Tho OS is shortly released after Windows 7 and people are claiming they have no choice but to upgrade to it? Windows 8 is Microsoft's take on a mobile platform, nothing more, nothing less. And they will score a bunch of sales from people who do like using it on their desktops.


I plan on using it on my HTPC (+Kinect) and I've been waiting for a tablet running Windows OS for some time. I've refused to buy a tablet until it has Windows on it.

You don't know about the forcing, yet, though. If Microsoft want this to be popular they're going to need to force people to use it like they did with Vista (which I personally loved right until the day Windows 7 landed). I'm a tech enthusiast and I like having the latest and greatest, but without the *choice* to remove Metro, have Aero and all the other things MS are intent on removing I don't want the latest and greatest OS. And being honest it is a nice OS under the hood but Metro, the "app store" and the start menu stuff blows it for me on my desktop right now. there's no way on this earth I'll be using it there.


----------



## dantoddd

I like the new UI. It'd be better if the big E goes away too


----------



## ressurrectin

I like it.


----------



## Schoat333

I see no problem with this. I'm a huge fan of the minimalist design. I honestly don't think I ever use the start button anymore. Not at work on my XP laptop, and not in boot camped W7 on my Mac.


----------



## steelbom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> I'm running Consumer Preview atm. I'm just curious of how more responsive the desktop environment will be with more core fixes and Aero removed.


Eh yeah well that's probably going to be pretty important on slates.


----------



## Onex

I ve never had any lag while using aero, i even have the aero theme runnning on my netbook and there isnt a noticable performance difference between non aero and aero. Whelp just another reason to add to the list not to buy.


----------



## Jixr

its obvious why they are doing it this way, remember that whole windows 8 tablet thing, they gotta keep it simple looking for tablet use, and they are really aming to make tablet and desktop use as similar as possible.


----------



## preachp

Hi All,
I have heard of no compelling reason for me to upgrade. I like Windows 7 and I have had no problems with it that couldn't be easily fixed. If I buy an OS I certainly expect it to natively support current hardware, and not have it as an option I have to buy seperately. This and the "new look" would definitely stop me from even wanting to "upgrade"........and I use the term loosly.
Have a great day!


----------



## james_ant

Well, I won't be in any rush to upgrade to Windows 8. I don't want a desktop OS tailored to a tablet. Really don't like how metro forces you to scroll around with your mouse on a desktop.


----------



## PackaBowl09

Nooo! Bad move Microsoft, I love aero. I love being able to tweek it and make it mine, plus its useful for looking through windows at documents/wallpapers behind them. And plus its a cool effect. Look:


----------



## Harbinger

This time around, I think history is repeating itself. When Aero first came out, people were moaning about how much of a bloat it was. And now that it's been replaced by some white-bird-poo + MS ribbon combo people are moaning about losing Aero.

Now I know why historians like history. It's all in the pattern.


----------



## Malcolm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Harbinger*
> 
> This time around, I think history is repeating itself. When Aero first came out, people were moaning about how much of a bloat it was. And now that it's been replaced by some white-bird-poo + MS ribbon combo people are moaning about losing Aero.
> Now I know why historians like history. It's all in the pattern.


I loved Aero from day 1. This Metro garbage is...well...garbage.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malcolm*
> 
> I loved Aero from day 1. This Metro garbage is...well...garbage.


Yeah, me too. Loved Aero and thought it was a huge update to the Windows UI. This feels like we're going backwards. As when Aero came out I was actively voicing for people to have a choice between the XP look, classical look and such, whihc they almost did (just missed the XP look)


----------



## M3T4LM4N222

We can all complain about the UI configuration but we'll all get used to it anyways... I was using the Windows 8 Beta and I didn't think it was all that bad, although I did get random white screens several times.


----------



## InfernoReaper

I can see the board meeting:
Herp - "Let's get rid of Aero for a minimalistic approach."
Derp - "Great! Let's improve that performance by adding a giant ribbon toolbar to make every single window look more cluttered than an episode of Hoarders."

Ugly. Crowded. Do not want.


----------



## TheBlindDeafMute

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *noak*
> 
> Why do companies insist on "fixing" things that aren't broken or need fixing...


I agree. Lol I liked the aero look. Glass is still cool


----------



## Faster_is_better

I don't use the glass feature of Aero, but I do like the Aero peek feature very much. Not sure if they are doing away with all Aero aspects or just the glassy part, that wouldn't bother me much.

If they are truly going to a ribbon style for IE, they are in for some headaches. They had plenty of lash back when switching to that for Office.. Typical users probably only use about 4 or 5 buttons on the Browser, forward, back, refresh, maybe the file > print menu or bookmarks. The ribbon is really bloated and wastes a lot of space (unless you absolutely use everything on it).


----------



## Nivacs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UltraVolta425*
> 
> Meh I disagree. When you're using a mouse and an ordinary LCD monitor (read: no touchscreen), METRO is about as useful as having the only telephone in the world. What good is all that tablet stuff if you're on a desktop?
> Before Windows 8 (read: in Windows 7) you just press the Start button and you could access almost everything from there. Now you have to move your mouse to the edge of the screen and still do a thorough search for where that thing you're looking for is located...
> I admit: very handy on a Windows 8 tablet (are there any out yet, even?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) but in my way when I'm on a desktop.


windows 8 hit the windows button and start typing the program name, it auto-searches for you. The tile interface for Metro would be much better if we had the option for much smaller tiles and nested groups
But i don't really hate it


----------



## SIDWULF

AWESOME! Down with the stylistic UI.

Windows classic is now default.









The best approach i have see with a UI is EVE online. It's clean, simple, square and everything is aligned perfectly. I also like small text.


----------



## adamkatt

What the Fffffffffff-front lawn...

Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RedCloudFuneral*
> 
> I just switched to the Windows Classic theme after seeing this thread. I saw a 20C idle temp drop(passive 6850 that may have a loose heatsink) and idle VRAM usuage went from 130mb idle/260mb with firefox and youtube to 23mb idle/51mb with firefox and youtube.
> It may not be demanding really but turning it off gave me a massive temperature drop and is most likely saving power(would be useful for laptops?)
> Most likely it won't affect game performance as Aero is disabled when running games fullscreen.
> Also keep in mind, I wasn't using the semi-transparent windows for Aero, I turned that off a while ago because it started to get a little cheesy. The difference may be even larger for anyone using that.
> Still, I'm not buying Windows 8. The lack of the start menu is annoying, and the Metro thing is way too gimmicky, but most important; Windows 7 does everything I need it to and I see no reason to upgrade.


I think your temps have to do with the heatsink. The mem is true though. And for laptops the basic theme is fine if you don't want Aero for them. I think some aspects of it are cheesy, but I like the glass features, keep those, but the animations are kinda cheesy. Not as cheesy as some animations on OSX though.


----------



## Clovertail100

Turn this:


Into this:


And I might feel okay about it.


----------



## kweechy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steelbom*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> While we're still curious to see if Microsoft can better integrate the desktop and Metro environments of its latest operating system, the company has now revealed a significant change to the desktop portion of Windows 8 -- a completely restyled visual appearance. As you might remember from the Consumer Preview, window borders and widgets featured a simplified and subdued look in comparison to the glass-like materials of Aero, which Microsoft now calls "dated and cheesy." With the latest refresh, however, the company has pushed its modernistic philosophy even further to reveal a spartan (yet functional) interface that draws less attention to the chrome elements and allows the user to focus more on content.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Source
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is meme worthy fail.
> It's almost as if they're trying to make it worse. They've added the ribbon in Windows Explorer (I think?), removed the start button, and now they're removing Aero? I'm sure there's plenty I've missed too, but what on earth are they doing?!
Click to expand...

How is this "meme worthy fail"? Apple ditched their isometric look a long time ago, was that a fail? Ubuntu/Gnome3 ditch the crappy looking old Linux design, was that a fail?

What was Aero really doing for anyone anyway? It eats up resources and doesn't really offer much, and I agree with them...it's an old look now back from the days of "look we have GPU power, let's throw in some stuff!"


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kweechy*
> 
> How is this "meme worthy fail"? Apple ditched their isometric look a long time ago, was that a fail? Ubuntu/Gnome3 ditch the crappy looking old Linux design, was that a fail?
> 
> What was Aero really doing for anyone anyway? It eats up resources and doesn't really offer much, and I agree with them...it's an old look now back from the days of "look we have GPU power, let's throw in some stuff!"


Meh, it doesn't use that much of my resources and it looks nicer than Basic.


----------



## Xeio

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mookster*
> 
> Turn this:
> 
> Into this:
> 
> And I might feel okay about it.


Uh, you know that ribbon is collapsible and is by default collapsed, right? So that it will look exactly like the second screen you posted?


----------



## bencher

I have no problem with this. Aero is a waste of processing power.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steelbom*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is meme worthy fail.
> It's almost as if they're trying to make it worse. They've added the ribbon in Windows Explorer (I think?), removed the start button, and now they're removing Aero? I'm sure there's plenty I've missed too, but what on earth are they doing?!


How do you feel now that the thread is not going how you want it to go?









Hate some more.


----------



## Assirra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nivacs*
> 
> windows 8 hit the windows button and start typing the program name, it auto-searches for you. The tile interface for Metro would be much better if we had the option for much smaller tiles and nested groups
> But i don't really hate it


I just played around with it today and have to say the way that works is really so slow compared to windows 7.
In windows 7 i can type lets say "device manager" and hit enter and it instantly starts it.
In windows 8 i type "device manager" and it doesn't instantly pops up since its in another tab, so you have to go to that tab and then click on device manager.
It may not see much but it will really stack if you use it often (like me)


----------



## RonindeBeatrice

I will have to try windows 8 again when it's a little further along. I had no success getting the Netflix Windows Media Center app to work, so I threw it out after a single day of use. Metro crashed all the time too, often leaving me with no recourse (why does Ctrl+alt+delete not seem to work when in metro??!!) other than to turn the damn machine off via the power button.

I tend to agree that the glassy panes are a little cheesy. They're not doing much for me these days.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RonindeBeatrice*
> 
> I will have to try windows 8 again when it's a little further along. I had no success getting the Netflix Windows Media Center app to work, so I threw it out after a single day of use. Metro crashed all the time too, often leaving me with no recourse (why does Ctrl+alt+delete not seem to work when in metro??!!) other than to turn the damn machine off via the power button.
> I tend to agree that the glassy panes are a little cheesy. They're not doing much for me these days.


I use it for a month solid to force myself to get used to it. In the end I just hated it.


----------



## Outlawed

LMAO!!!! Seriously??!!

So you have all this crap getting taken out of windows over the years and yet they still produce internet explorer?

God Microsoft...How am I supposed to argue for Windows anymore?


----------



## RonindeBeatrice

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> I use it for a month solid to force myself to get used to it. In the end I just hated it.


I was trying for the same thing, but you undoubtedly have more patience than I do. My mouse speed was completely random, some bizarre conflict between Logitech's Setpoint and windows I guess; in addition to the aforementioned issues, I'm sure the list I forgot is longer than the one I've provided.

It has to get better as it matures. It's possible too that, the early builds aren't so rubbish on tablets and the like, but the hoops you have to go through on the desktop simply complicate *everything*.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RonindeBeatrice*
> 
> I was trying for the same thing, but you undoubtedly have more patience than I do. My mouse speed was completely random, some bizarre conflict between Logitech's Setpoint and windows I guess; in addition to the aforementioned issues, I'm sure the list I forgot is longer than the one I've provided.
> It has to get better as it matures. It's possible too that, the early builds aren't so rubbish on tablets and the like, but the hoops you have to go through on the desktop simply complicate *everything*.


Thing is I'm really looking forward to getting my hands on a tablet running it. I've held off tablets completely because I'm simply not interested in Android tablets. I want a full OS. And I'm eager to get a Kinect + Windows 8 on my HTPC because that's going to be great fun. Who needs a mouse and keyboard for that any more? Also on the tablet front I'm now eyeing up the Asus Padfone and wonder if I can throw Windows 8 onto that because that would be absolutely great (Windows 8 phone? =D)

But for my desktop I found it obtuse and annoying. It got in the way of what I wanted to do because it wanted me to do things this new way that didn't work for me. I ended up having my entire taskbar full of apps pinned because I refused ot use the metro start bar and metro kept popping up and very inopportune times. I seriously hate metro on my desktop.

I gave it a fair go but by the gods I didn't enjoy it


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kweechy*
> 
> How is this "meme worthy fail"? Apple ditched their isometric look a long time ago, was that a fail? Ubuntu/Gnome3 ditch the crappy looking old Linux design, was that a fail?
> 
> What was Aero really doing for anyone anyway? It eats up resources and doesn't really offer much, and I agree with them...it's an old look now back from the days of "look we have GPU power, let's throw in some stuff!"


Doesn't matter. The point is that they should not be eliminating features but rather giving users the option to turn them on or off. Same thing with the ribbon; let those who like it turn it on and those who don't turn it off. And I still don't get what so offensive about aero? Who doesn't want their user interface to look good?


----------



## malikq86

An OS MADE for tablets and than exported to PCs...in its foundation sounds bad...the initial intent is not focused for PCs...but instead the after thought/merger...I think many people will skip Windows 8 and wait for Windows 9...imho. I feel like it would have extra "stuff" (ie: code) that is just not optimal/optimized for PC usage. Though who knows...we will wait and see how this all turns out.

*A Theory:* Microsoft dumbed down Windows 8 (calling it "cleaner" , "simpler" , "minimalistic" etc.) with less graphic usage, so that it could work better with tablets...hence...PC users will sacrifice multiple aspects of this OS (not just Aero)..just so it works well with weak tablets...basically. I just wondering what else PC users are sacrificing due to the tablet focus....


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

OH GOD ITS UGLY! KILL IT, BEOFORE IT LAYS EGGS!


----------



## Canadarocker

I like the look of the windows, but drop the ugly ribbon that is wasting screen real estate and bring back start button


----------



## Brutuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *randomizer*
> 
> If removing the start button is as disastrous as people say then MS wouldn't do it. They do focus groups for this sort of thing. Besides, throwing your mouse into the bottom left corner the moment you see the desktop is basically a reflex action, and guess what, that's what you need to do!
> For completely new users it won't be quite as easy, since there are no visual cues. However, an orb with a colourful flag on it does not really provide any meaningful visual clues either unless you already know what it's for.


It's not removing the start button that's the bad part, it's what they've put in as its replacement.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nivacs*
> 
> windows 8 hit the windows button and start typing the program name, it auto-searches for you. The tile interface for Metro would be much better if we had the option for much smaller tiles and nested groups
> But i don't really hate it


So does Windows 7's start menu.

And what you're asking for is practically a full screen start menu...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mookster*
> 
> Turn this:
> [\URL=http://www.overclock.net/image/id/2381764/width/600/height/375][\IMG]http://www.overclock.net/image/id/2381764/width/600/height/375[/IMG][/URL]
> Into this:
> [\URL=http://www.overclock.net/image/id/2381763/width/600/height/375][\IMG]http://www.overclock.net/image/id/2381763/width/600/height/375[/IMG][/URL]
> And I might feel okay about it.


Ribbon lets you do that? Not 100% sure on Windows 8 (never tried doing that in my VM install and I'm not at home, so I can't check now) but in Office it does at least.

And how the hell can you stand not having the tree view of folders?!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kweechy*
> 
> How is this "meme worthy fail"? Apple ditched their isometric look a long time ago, was that a fail? Ubuntu/Gnome3 ditch the crappy looking old Linux design, was that a fail?
> 
> What was Aero really doing for anyone anyway? It eats up resources and doesn't really offer much, and I agree with them...it's an old look now back from the days of "look we have GPU power, let's throw in some stuff!"


I agree with Aero, but the "crappy looking old Linux design" obviously means gnome2, right? Sure, it looked fairly meh when it was at its default but when you fixed it up it could be stunning..And at least it wasn't a piece of crap to use like gnome3 and unity are IMO.

And everyone else is right, they should give us the option for an older way if we so wish.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malikq86*
> 
> An OS MADE for tablets and than exported to PCs...in its foundation sounds bad...the initial intent is not focused for PCs...but instead the after thought/merger...I think many people will skip Windows 8 and wait for Windows 9...imho. I feel like it would have extra "stuff" (ie: code) that is just not optimal/optimized for PC usage. Though who knows...we will wait and see how this all turns out.
> *A Theory:* Microsoft dumbed down Windows 8 (calling it "cleaner" , "simpler" , "minimalistic" etc.) with less graphic usage, so that it could work better with tablets...hence...PC users will sacrifice multiple aspects of this OS (not just Aero)..just so it works well with weak tablets...basically. I just wondering what else PC users are sacrificing due to the tablet focus....


With WinMo, Microsoft tried to force PC interfaces on Smartphones. They realized it doesn't work and made a great phone GUI in WP7...Then some brainiac decided that they should put that on the desktop OS too.


----------



## SwitchFX

What are the GUI developers at M$ smoking? Can I have some of that special stuff?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I remember the very first time I saw aero on Vista back in 2007. I thought it was the coolest thing I had ever seen and it immediately dated my then new XP laptop back to the stone age. I definitely don't want to go back to "minimalist" crap that makes the OS far less interesting to use day in and day out...


----------



## Brutuz

I remember the first time I saw W7s taskbar, I hated it.

After using Win7 since 2009, I still change it to be more like Vista's whenever it's not like that. (ie. Uni PCs that restore themselves to an image every boot)
This is why MS should just make it an option...I don't want that extra fluff, I want a start bar and start menu. it works best for me.


----------



## steelbom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kweechy*
> 
> How is this "meme worthy fail"? Apple ditched their isometric look a long time ago, was that a fail? Ubuntu/Gnome3 ditch the crappy looking old Linux design, was that a fail?
> 
> What was Aero really doing for anyone anyway? It eats up resources and doesn't really offer much, and I agree with them...it's an old look now back from the days of "look we have GPU power, let's throw in some stuff!"


Why? Aero's cool, it's one of the things I like about Windows 7 and now they're taking it away. If they want to give people the choice, that's fine... but I like and want Aero, it looks good.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bencher*
> 
> I have no problem with this. Aero is a waste of processing power.
> 
> How do you feel now that the thread is not going how you want it to go?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hate some more.


What do you mean "how I want it to go"? I think it's a massive fail and so do a lot of other members here.

Are you that biased? How is this hate? I'm annoyed that they're removing features I like...?!

At the very least they could have made their new look the default and left Aero as an option.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bencher*
> 
> I have no problem with this. Aero is a waste of processing power.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *steelbom*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is meme worthy fail.
> It's almost as if they're trying to make it worse. They've added the ribbon in Windows Explorer (I think?), removed the start button, and now they're removing Aero? I'm sure there's plenty I've missed too, but what on earth are they doing?!
> 
> 
> 
> How do you feel now that the thread is not going how you want it to go?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hate some more.
Click to expand...

Lets be honest here how much processing power does aero even require, with all the $1000+ rigs I see around here aero is least of the worries. I run the aero theme on my little netbook without a hitch. if a $1000 desktop heck even if a $500 budget prebuilt dellp has problem with aero taking up processing power but a $150 netbook has no problem there are some ignorant issues at hand.


----------



## quietpressure

For those who know nothing but rant, I'm sure there are applications that let you enable the start button (and the original start menu), also to enable Aero.

Heck, there's already a program that let's you get back the start button right now: http://www.door2windows.com/get-start-button-menu-windows-8/


----------



## UltraVolta425

I think this is turning into a pointless discussion.

Those who like the functionalities of Windows 7 - myself included - stay with Windows 7. There is nothing or nobody forcing you to go to Windows 8 and since Windows 8 doesn't - as far as I know at least - bring any big new features for desktop users to the table, it won't be like Windows 7 won't be good enough anymore.

Those who love Windows 8, go for it. Enjoy it.


----------



## Warmonger

Release Preview is compiled and ready to go 8400.0.winmain_win8rc.120518-142







Should be seeing it soon as Microsoft most likely will debut it at E3.


----------



## Yuki457

I will be sticking with Windows 8 for Winkey+ X, it lets me do my tasks much faster than win 7.









I never go into the Metro bit much though







just winkey + *type name of program*. For everything else, that's what Winkey + i is for









I don't really care about Aero, though I am very glad the put the "UP" button back into explorer









they added so many new shortcuts in Win 8 when you look at the docs, wonder how the functionality will move to tablets etc... will probs be discarded.


----------



## SirDrexl

Even if this new theme is less resource intensive than Aero (which I'm not just assuming), I wonder if any savings is negated by having to have the Metro stuff loaded in RAM.


----------



## kweechy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Doesn't matter. The point is that they should not be eliminating features but rather giving users the option to turn them on or off. Same thing with the ribbon; let those who like it turn it on and those who don't turn it off. And I still don't get what so offensive about aero? Who doesn't want their user interface to look good?


I've seen what happens to software when you start leaving in everything you ever did so that someone out there isn't peeved to have lost the feature...and honestly it becomes bloatware, gets sluggish and begs for a rewrite. You end up with code that has been patched over more times than a Canadian highway and it's just bad news.

The interface picture leaked in the OP is really beautiful looking imo, nice and clean and simple...people will get used to it, and I'm sure it can be customized anyway with plugins, addons and new skins being made available by the public. That to me, is a far better way to go about it than installing bloated stuff off the bat. If people want more, let them download it rather than simply including every little thing in the original install.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kweechy*
> 
> I've seen what happens to software when you start leaving in everything you ever did so that someone out there isn't peeved to have lost the feature...and honestly it becomes bloatware, gets sluggish and begs for a rewrite. You end up with code that has been patched over more times than a Canadian highway and it's just bad news.
> 
> The interface picture leaked in the OP is really beautiful looking imo, nice and clean and simple...people will get used to it, and I'm sure it can be customized anyway with plugins, addons and new skins being made available by the public. That to me, is a far better way to go about it than installing bloated stuff off the bat. If people want more, let them download it rather than simply including every little thing in the original install.


It's not that old and it's not that hard to include it like they did Basic and Classic in Windows 7.


----------



## Killam0n

so if windows 3.1 had a baby with a linux distro it would look like windows 8?


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killam0n*
> 
> so if windows 3.1 had a baby with a linux distro it would look like windows 8?


It looks more like Windows 3.1 had an incestuous baby and this is the deformed outcome.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> It looks more like Windows 3.1 had an incestuous baby and this is the deformed outcome.


Who you kidding, Windows 8 is sure sexy.







If the Release Preview has what I think it will then the removed Aero will be something even Aero lovers wont mind. People think the visual style will be just white? Wrong. The window borders, task bar, and all that should match the color scheme you picked for the metro interface. So the transition from metro to the desktop feels virtually the same. Of course Microsoft could of screwed up and never thought of this. But I highly doubt that (fingers crossed).


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Who you kidding, Windows 8 is sure sexy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If the Release Preview has what I think it will then the removed Aero will be something even Aero lovers wont mind. People think the visual style will be just white? Wrong. The window borders, task bar, and all that should match the color scheme you picked for the metro interface. So the transition from metro to the desktop feels virtually the same. Of course Microsoft could of screwed up and never thought of this. But I highly doubt that (fingers crossed).


I'm not kidding anyone. Metro is horrendous on Desktop's too. The only way I, and many like me, will be buying Windows 8 is if it's basically Windows 7 with an updated Kernel. People shouldn't ahve to be downloading third party programs to retrieve a UI and features


----------



## UltraVolta425

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Who you kidding, Windows 8 is sure sexy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If the Release Preview has what I think it will then the removed Aero will be something even Aero lovers wont mind. People think the visual style will be just white? Wrong. The window borders, task bar, and all that should match the color scheme you picked for the metro interface. So the transition from metro to the desktop feels virtually the same. Of course Microsoft could of screwed up and never thought of this. But I highly doubt that (fingers crossed).


Says the one from the Windows 8 Fan Club...

Anyway, you appear to contradict yourself:
Quote:


> If the Release Preview has what I think it will then the removed Aero will be something even Aero lovers wont mind.


So, people who love to have Aero will - in your opinion - not mind the removal of Aero?


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UltraVolta425*
> 
> Says the one from the Windows 8 Fan Club...
> Anyway, you appear to contradict yourself:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Release Preview has what I think it will then the removed Aero will be something even Aero lovers wont mind.
> 
> 
> 
> So, people who love to have Aero will - in your opinion - not mind the removal of Aero?
Click to expand...

^ he made a point earlier the thread that quite a lot of people don't mind Aero's removal. I didn't realise so many people would be behind it. But there';s still just as many people who want to keep it.

I'm thinking Stardock's Windowblinds software may pick up again after Windows 8, but again, they shouldn't just remove something that requires people to download software to get back. If people like it just let them choose to keep it.

Windows 8 is going the wrong way in terms of respecting users.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UltraVolta425*
> 
> Says the one from the Windows 8 Fan Club...
> Anyway, you appear to contradict yourself:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Release Preview has what I think it will then the removed Aero will be something even Aero lovers wont mind.
> 
> 
> 
> So, people who love to have Aero will - in your opinion - not mind the removal of Aero?
Click to expand...

Its not a contradiction, learn english.


----------



## Zero4549

You know why I like windows 7?

It requires the least hacking, registry editing, software enhancement, and otherwise system-bogging, time-and-effort-consuming work to get into a state that is fast, usable, pretty, and doesn't get in my damn way.

XP would be the runner up, followed by 98SE, but both are incredibly lacking by modern standards.

The sad part is, behind the hood, Win 8 is the most perfect system out of the box so far, but the tablet-oriented UI makes it all worthless. By the time I finish getting Windows 8 the way I want it, it will have taken twice the time and effort, and have twice as many background software running at all times, than it takes to the VISTA to the same state. Think about that.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero4549*
> 
> You know why I like windows 7?
> It requires the least hacking, registry editing, software enhancement, and otherwise system-bogging, time-and-effort-consuming work to get into a state that is fast, usable, pretty, and doesn't get in my damn way.
> XP would be the runner up, followed by 98SE, but both are incredibly lacking by modern standards.
> The sad part is, behind the hood, Win 8 is the most perfect system out of the box so far, but the tablet-oriented UI makes it all worthless. By the time I finish getting Windows 8 the way I want it, it will have taken twice the time and effort, and have twice as many background software running at all times, than it takes to the VISTA to the same state. Think about that.


You know why I like Windows 8? It requires the least hacking, registry editing, software enhancement, and otherwise system-bogging, time-and-effort-consuming work to get into a state that is fast, usable, pretty, and doesn't get in my damn way. Not only that but its much faster then any previous generation of windows, multi-tasking is a breeze, system security is greatly improved, Metro adds in a new, fun, and exciting way to explore your operating system. On top of all that I can access hundreds of different services from mail, messenger, facebook, games, stocks, anything I desire at a click of a button. I mean really Metro is different then your typical Windows GUI, but Windows 8 was not designed for desktop in mind. I can't believe how many people are still complaining about it. Windows 8 wasn't made for you, it was made so Microsoft doesn't lose out on the mobile market. I mean really Microsoft purposely globalized on calling it Windows 8, because it attracts more of a crowd. If they called it Windows Mobile, they would lose millions of dollars on sales to desktop users.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> You know why I like Windows 8? It requires the least hacking, registry editing, software enhancement, and otherwise system-bogging, time-and-effort-consuming work to get into a state that is fast, usable, pretty, and doesn't get in my damn way. Not only that but its much faster then any previous generation of windows, multi-tasking is a breeze, system security is greatly improved, Metro adds in a new, fun, and exciting way to explore your operating system. On top of all that I can access hundreds of different services from mail, messenger, facebook, games, stocks, anything I desire at a click of a button. I mean really Metro is different then your typical Windows GUI, but Windows 8 was not designed for desktop in mind. I can't believe how many people are still complaining about it. Windows 8 wasn't made for you, it was made so Microsoft doesn't lose out on the mobile market. I mean really Microsoft purposely globalized on calling it Windows 8, because it attracts more of a crowd. If they called it Windows Mobile, they would lose millions of dollars on sales to desktop users.


Right so there's no harm in allowing Desktop users the choice to remove the tablet optimisations then and have the OS how they want it, huh?


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Right so there's no harm in allowing Desktop users the choice to remove the tablet optimisations then and have the OS how they want it, huh?


Did you have a choice in OS's before? No. They are headed for pushing this to ARM devices the more they cut out from it the better. Which really doesn't bother me one bit, the more they strip the faster and lighter the OS will be.


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Did you have a choice in OS's before? No. They are headed for pushing this to ARM devices the more they cut out from it the better. Which really doesn't bother me one bit, the more they strip the faster and lighter the OS will be.


So why not just use DOS?

I'm all with you in the fact that improved code efficiency and great. None of that matters if the UI hinders the single slowest element in a computer system - the user itself.


----------



## raiderxx

I feel like there will be a patch or a mod on the day of release that will add aero. I'm not worried..

Off Topic: There were rumors a while ago about Windows 8 being able to play Xbox 360 games. Has this been confirmed/denied yet?


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero4549*
> 
> So why not just use DOS?
> I'm all with you in the fact that improved code efficiency and great. None of that matters if the UI hinders the single slowest element in a computer system - the user itself.


I would have to argue the fact of the new GUI being a slow element. I would blame the end user for the slowness of the persons tasks. I personally can do everything on 8 faster then most people been doing for years on 7. Sure its a learning curve, but a very tiny one at that. The first time you learn how to ride a bike you don't go popping wheelies and stuff do ya? No. Your stuck with the training wheels until you can learn to keep your balance. Even then after the training wheels come off your still not ready to be popping any wheelies, you'll land flat on your face. Same thing with Windows 8, you need to spend time with it to understand how it all works. Once you get the flow down to where your brain already knows where everything is without thinking about it. Then you will understand how not so bad the Metro design is. Its not slower then Windows 7 at any tasks. The fault lies at the person sitting in the chair behind the screen going "omg this is slow! how do i do this!". Life is change, people complaining about Windows 8 only shows how many people are afraid of change. Especially when there is no concrete evidence that the change will be permanent.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Did you have a choice in OS's before? No. They are headed for pushing this to ARM devices the more they cut out from it the better. Which really doesn't bother me one bit, the more they strip the faster and lighter the OS will be.


You have had the choice of UI in OS's before. Windows98 included the older Windows 95 look, Windows XP included the older Windows 98 look (Classic), Windows 7 adn Vista included the Classic look also.

It's perfectly fine and acceptable to strip out the OS for ARM based devices. But why does that have to be necessary for x86 devices? It's not.


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> I would have to argue the fact of the new GUI being a slow element. I would blame the end user for the slowness of the persons tasks. I personally can do everything on 8 faster then most people been doing for years on 7. Sure its a learning curve, but a very tiny one at that. The first time you learn how to ride a bike you don't go popping wheelies and stuff do ya? No. Your stuck with the training wheels until you can learn to keep your balance. Even then after the training wheels come off your still not ready to be popping any wheelies, you'll land flat on your face. Same thing with Windows 8, you need to spend time with it to understand how it all works. Once you get the flow down to where your brain already knows where everything is without thinking about it. Then you will understand how not so bad the Metro design is. Its not slower then Windows 7 at any tasks. The fault lies at the person sitting in the chair behind the screen going "omg this is slow! how do i do this!". Life is change, people complaining about Windows 8 only shows how many people are afraid of change. Especially when there is no concrete evidence that the change will be permanent.


Do you actually use windows? I've used every version from 3.1 straight through 8 beta and unless you think you're highly overrating your productivity in W8, or just plain sucked at using 7, you are NOT getting as much done with 8 in a desktop environment. There is simply no way around that fact.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> You have had the choice of UI in OS's before. Windows98 included the older Windows 95 look, Windows XP included the older Windows 98 look (Classic), Windows 7 adn Vista included the Classic look also.
> It's perfectly fine and acceptable to strip out the OS for ARM based devices. But why does that have to be necessary for x86 devices? It's not.


Them visual options were not there as an alternative option. They were there for compatibility reasons. Just like Windows 7 has a basic theme, for people who have machines Aero runs slow on. There wasn't really ever an option to change the windows GUI. Its not like linux where you got your choice of KDE, Gnome, etc.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero4549*
> 
> Do you actually use windows? I've used every version from 3.1 straight through 8 beta and unless you think you're highly overrating your productivity in W8, or just plain sucked at using 7, you are NOT getting as much done with 8 in a desktop environment. There is simply no way around that fact.


I own every Windows OS ever made. I love the fact you ultimately put the blame on me for your incompetence at using Windows 8. If you suck at using Windows 8 then don't use it. I have ran XP, Vista, 7, and 8 long enough to know there is a upper hand to using 8. There is no reason for me to lie about how well Metro works for me. The removal of the old traditional start menu was a god send from heaven. That was one of the major reasons for slowing Windows Vista/7 productivity down.


----------



## Zero4549

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Them visual options were not there as an alternative option. They were there for compatibility reasons. Just like Windows 7 has a basic theme, for people who have machines Aero runs slow on. There wasn't really ever an option to change the windows GUI. Its not like linux where you got your choice of KDE, Gnome, etc.
> I own every Windows OS ever made. I love the fact you ultimately put the blame on me for your incompetence at using Windows 8. If you suck at using Windows 8 then don't use it. I have ran XP, Vista, 7, and 8 long enough to know there is a upper hand to using 8. There is no reason for me to lie about how well Metro works for me. The removal of the old traditional start menu was a god send from heaven. That was one of the major reasons for slowing Windows Vista/7 productivity down.


You're trying to tell me you operate entirely out of the start menu embedded lists, and think you are effencient at using the windows GUI?









Lets move back to reality here. Windows 8 requires more clicks, more transitions, more swiping around your mouse like a cow trying to swat away flys with it's tail, just to do what takes 1-2 clicks in a properly set up windows 7, Vista, or even XP desktop. I'm sorry you never realized the potential you had in previous versions of windows, but you have no one to blame but yourself.

Like it or not, Windows 3.1 through 7 were designed with a mouse and keyboard in mind. Windows 8 was designed for a touch screen device being operated by one of the idiots who actually thought ribbon in MS office was an improvement. It shows.


----------



## Awieos

Just wondering how u shut down laptop/desktop with this os?


----------



## Onex

It still boggles my mind that they decided to implement a TABLET interface on a DESKTOP. what where they thinking?


----------



## Rowey

Not really bothered, change is change, Like someone said before the glass look is knocking on a bit now. They could have done a bit better though, now it feels like going back to xp


----------



## Partol

Can Windows 8 be fully utilized on a PC without a keyboard?

I sometimes wash my keyboard (liquid spills,dust, dead skin,etc..) and while it dries, I use the on-screen keyboard in windows 7 (or win xp) while my hardware keyboard dries out.

How do you open the "On-Screen Keyboard" in windows 8, without a keyboard?


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Zero4549*
> 
> You're trying to tell me you operate entirely out of the start menu embedded lists, and think you are effencient at using the windows GUI?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lets move back to reality here. Windows 8 requires more clicks, more transitions, more swiping around your mouse like a cow trying to swat away flys with it's tail, just to do what takes 1-2 clicks in a properly set up windows 7, Vista, or even XP desktop. I'm sorry you never realized the potential you had in previous versions of windows, but you have no one to blame but yourself.
> Like it or not, Windows 3.1 through 7 were designed with a mouse and keyboard in mind. Windows 8 was designed for a touch screen device being operated by one of the idiots who actually thought ribbon in MS office was an improvement. It shows.
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously, your just making an ass of yourself now. I can promise you this I have spent more time with each OS then you have with a single one. Vista and 7's traditional start menu takes so much more time clicking and scrolling to find an application, then it takes me to click my start menu, and click the application I want. Again your blaming your own incompetence on others. You seem like the type who thinks hes always right, especially when you are very wrong. You keep contradiction yourself and falling face first over your own posts. Also don't be calling me an idiot, reported.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> It still boggles my mind that they decided to implement a TABLET interface on a DESKTOP. what where they thinking?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *It still boggles my mind that people don't realize that Windows 8 is a mobile platform.*
Click to expand...

Thats exactly why it shouldnt be on a desktop, if you read my post right.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Thats exactly why it shouldnt be on a desktop, if you read my post right.


You don't get it, Windows 8 isn't made to be installed on a Desktop. Tho im sure you will see dozens of them with it pre-installed. Why should Microsoft lose out on the millions of dollars due to a handful of people complaining?


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Them visual options were not there as an alternative option. They were there for compatibility reasons. Just like Windows 7 has a basic theme, for people who have machines Aero runs slow on. There wasn't really ever an option to change the windows GUI. Its not like linux where you got your choice of KDE, Gnome, etc.
> I own every Windows OS ever made. I love the fact you ultimately put the blame on me for your incompetence at using Windows 8. If you suck at using Windows 8 then don't use it. I have ran XP, Vista, 7, and 8 long enough to know there is a upper hand to using 8. There is no reason for me to lie about how well Metro works for me. The removal of the old traditional start menu was a god send from heaven. That was one of the major reasons for slowing Windows Vista/7 productivity down.


Wrong. Windows Classic is not there for compatibility reasons it's an option.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Wrong. Windows Classic is not there for compatibility reasons it's an option.


Wrong.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> You don't get it, Windows 8 isn't made to be installed on a Desktop. Tho im sure you will see dozens of them with it pre-installed. Why should Microsoft lose out on the millions of dollars due to a handful of people complaining?


Lol, why would MS lose out if they kept Aero, start menu and allowed the removal of Metro on desktops? Surely making those "handful (







, it's more than that) of people to be happy would increase sales.

And also, since when did Windows 7 become free? Supplying any Windows OS to OEM's nets them money.

Honestly, you are fighting a losing battle here and completely clutching at straws.

Windows 8 is NOT a mobile-only OS, which is why it comes in an x86 variation despite there being an extremely thin number of x86 tablets available. Which is why the consumer previews and sucha re all x86 previews. Everyone I've spoken to understands the reasons for Metro but doesn't want it on a Desktop.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Lol, why would MS lose out if they kept AEro, start menu and allowed the removal of Metro on desktops? Surely making those "handful lachen, it's more than that) of people to be happy would increase sales.
> And also, since when did Windows 7 become free? Supplying any Windows OS to OEM's nets them money.
> Honestly, you are fighting a losing battle here and completely clutching at straws.
> 
> 
> 
> Because its useless bulk added to the operating system that kills battery life. And yes there is only a handful of people complaining (I call them whine _ _ _ 's). No one said Windows was free, Windows supply's the OS to OEM's because it reals in Microsoft more money, how do you not understand this? Your fighting on the losing side of the battle, clutching at straws (notice how much you complained in the past few pages).
Click to expand...









Oh man thats hilarious. I run windows 7 with an aero theme on my netbook with no difference in performance or battery life. Im very certain that if my petty netbook can run aero without having it bulked up and drained battery life, im sure a laptop will have no problem running it. Unless of course theres a problem on my user end.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh man thats hilarious. I run windows 7 with an aero theme on my netbook with no difference in performance or battery life. Im very certain that if my petty netbook can run aero without having it bulked up and drained battery life, im sure a laptop will have no problem running it. Unless of course theres a problem on my user end.


Your missing the point, useless visual effect, plus useless wasted cycles. I mean what part is not understandable? I drive a 1984 Chevy with 350 rocket in it, and you know what? The things darn ugly. But It will pull any car off the lot without thinking twice. Sure it drinks more fuel, but it does so for good reason. Aero isn't a good reason.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh man thats hilarious. I run windows 7 with an aero theme on my netbook with no difference in performance or battery life. Im very certain that if my petty netbook can run aero without having it bulked up and drained battery life, im sure a laptop will have no problem running it. Unless of course theres a problem on my user end.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your missing the point, useless visual effect, plus useless wasted cycles. I mean what part is not understandable? I drive a 1984 Chevy with 350 rocket in it, and you know what? The things darn ugly. But It will pull any car off the lot without thinking twice. Sure it drinks more fuel, but it does so for good reason. Aero isn't a good reason.
Click to expand...

ok so now your saying that aero is ugly after i called you out that aero doesnt drain batteries and bloat a computer like you exagerated.


----------



## Rubers

Haha!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Because its useless bulk added to the operating system that kills battery life.


Sorry, how many desktops run on batteries? ZERO!







"useless" is subjectively _your opinion_. Your opinion != everyone's opinion. Keeping Aero and all the other stuff people complain about as an OPTION for users hurts nothing and satisfies everyone.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> And yes there is only a handful of people complaining (I call them whine _ _ _ 's). No one said Windows was free,


You implied Microsoft would somehow lose money or has something to gain by forcing DESKTOP users to use this ugly new interface.here:
Quote:


> Why should Microsoft lose out on the millions of dollars due to a handful of people complaining?


Is what you said.

I won't even comment on the offensive stuff you posted








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Windows supply's the OS to OEM's because it reals in Microsoft more money, how do you not understand this?


I'm I understand how it's real and I also understand how it _reels_ in the money for MS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Your fighting on the losing side of the battle, clutching at straws, notice how much you complained in the past few pages over losing Aero. Seriously learn to let go of things lol.


I'm not fighting, but you're fighting anyone who doesn't agree it's a super spanking awesome OS interface. Clutching at straws means you are finding any reason, whether it works or not, to justify what you're saying. Like you keep ignoring people talking about desktops. You either state it as an outright fact that Win8 is a mobile OS (which is categoritically false) or you forget they ever specifically talked about Desktop OS's.

As I've said many times before over the last few months. I can't wait to get Windows 8 on my HTPC with a Kinect device and I've been waiting and waiting for the day that Windows tablets become available en masse since I don't like Android or iOS. But on my DESKTOP machine this is a horrible UI.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> ok so now your saying that aero is ugly after i called you out that aero doesnt drain batteries and bloat a computer like you exagerated.
> 
> 
> 
> Are you serious? Go back and re-read my post, it says nothing about Aero being ugly. God spoon feeding you guys is getting annoying.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh man thats hilarious. I run windows 7 with an aero theme on my netbook with no difference in performance or battery life. Im very certain that if my petty netbook can run aero without having it bulked up and drained battery life, im sure a laptop will have no problem running it. Unless of course theres a problem on my user end.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your missing the point, useless visual effect, plus useless wasted cycles. *I mean what part is not understandable? I drive a 1984 Chevy with 350 rocket in it, and you know what? The things darn ugly.* But It will pull any car off the lot without thinking twice. Sure it drinks more fuel, but it does so for good reason. Aero isn't a good reason.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> God spoon feeding you guys is getting annoying.


I might suggest you take a break from the thread.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Haha!
> Sorry, how many desktops run on batteries? ZERO!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "useless" is subjectively _your opinion_. Your opinion != everyone's opinion. Keeping Aero and all the other stuff people complain about as an OPTION for users hurts nothing and satisfies everyone.
> You implied Microsoft would somehow lose money or has something to gain by forcing DESKTOP users to use this ugly new interface.here:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Why should Microsoft lose out on the millions of dollars due to a handful of people complaining?
> 
> 
> 
> Is what you said.
> I won't even comment on the offensive stuff you posted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm I understand how it's real and I also understand how it _reels_ in the money for MS.
> I'm not fighting, but you're fighting anyone who doesn't agree it's a super spanking awesome OS interface. Clutching at straws means you are finding any reason, whether it works or not, to justify what you're saying. Like you keep ignoring people talking about desktops. You either state it as an outright fact that Win8 is a mobile OS (which is categoritically false) or you forget they ever specifically talked about Desktop OS's.
> As I've said many times before over the last few months. I can't wait to get Windows 8 on my HTPC with a Kinect device and I've been waiting and waiting for the day that Windows tablets become available en masse since I don't like Android or iOS. But on my DESKTOP machine this is a horrible UI.
Click to expand...

Try re-typing your post, it is terribly written I cant even comprehend what your trying to get at with it. Windows 8 is a great desktop OS. I have a entire thread devoted to proving it, check my signature.

Edit: I kind of comprehended it after reading it 3 times. I am not claiming Metro to be the ultimate desktop Interface. Each person has their own taste, this is why Linux has over 5+ different desktop environments. Tho I am saying Windows 8 can do Windows 7 tasks at a much faster rate, regardless of user. Simply because of the mechanics behind it. Opening Windows Defrag takes at least a minute on Windows 7 using just the mouse, takes only 30 seconds on Windows 8. It's just how the content is laid out that makes it a faster multi tasker then Windows 7. Like I and dozens of others have said a million times before, if you don't like 8, don't use it. It wasn't built for Desktops in mind, even if it does increase workflow on them. You guys are the ones being suckered in my Microsoft globalizing on using the title Windows 8.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*


Yea, that clearly says Windows 8 might be ugly without Aero, but it does a better job at saving battery life. *Below you can see actual Aero cycles!* Don't tell me Aero doesn't consume extra power on your laptop, because im 100% sure you never even bothered to run it with it off (Aero addict).

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> I might suggest you take a break from the thread.


I'm having to much fun proving people wrong, so is the mod's.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Try re-typing your post, it is terribly written I cant even comprehend what your trying to get at with it. Windows 8 is a great desktop OS. I have a entire thread devoted to proving it, check my signature.
> Edit: I kind of comprehended it after reading it 3 times. I am not claiming Metro to be the ultimate desktop Interface. Each person has their own taste, this is why Linux has over 5+ different desktop environments. Tho I am saying Windows 8 can do Windows 7 tasks at a much faster rate, regardless of user. Simply because of the mechanics behind it. Opening Windows Defrag takes at least a minute on Windows 7 using just the mouse, takes only 30 seconds on Windows 8. It's just how the content is laid out that makes it a faster multi tasker then Windows 7. Like I and dozens of others have said a million times before, if you don't like 8, don't use it. It wasn't built for Desktops in mind, even if it does increase workflow on them. You guys are the ones being suckered in my Microsoft globalizing on using the title Windows 8.
> Yea, that clearly says Windows 8 might be ugly without Aero, but it does a better job at saving battery life. *Below you can see actual Aero cycles!*
> 
> I'm having to much fun proving people wrong, so is the mod's.


1. My ability to write is just fine. "so is the mods" Perhaps you mean "So are the mods"? I re-read my post and all I can see wrong with it is a simple type "I'm I" where I'd clearly written "I'm" first and changed my mind to "I".

2. Your GPU draws whatever is on the screen regardless of which UI you're using.

3. You're not proving anyone wrong. All you're doing is insulting people and posting inflammatory statements. With muddled facts and interpretations.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> 1. My ability to write is just fine. "so is the mods" Perhaps you mean "So are the mods"? I re-read my post and all I can see wrong with it is a simple type "I'm I" where I'd clearly written "I'm" first and changed my mind to "I".
> 2. Your GPU draws whatever is on the screen regardless of which UI you're using.
> 3. You're not proving anyone wrong. All you're doing is insulting people and posting inflammatory statements. With muddled facts and interpretations.


1. Your ability to type coherent sentences were lacking majorly in that last post, sorry to say.
2. Correct, but for Aero rich machines. Aero itself consumes many more cycles. Below is a quick test of how much GPU cycles are consumed with Aero off. As you can see, far less as many, which results in lots of saved energy.

3. Sure I did, even this post proves the post im replying to wrong. You guys need to stop getting so hot headed when a single guy takes three guys to the cleaners in a single thread.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Haha!
> Sorry, how many desktops run on batteries? ZERO!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "useless" is subjectively _your opinion_. Your opinion != everyone's opinion. Keeping Aero and all the other stuff people complain about as an OPTION for users hurts nothing and satisfies everyone.
> You implied Microsoft would somehow lose money or has something to gain by forcing DESKTOP users to use this ugly new interface.here:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Why should Microsoft lose out on the millions of dollars due to a handful of people complaining?
> 
> 
> 
> Is what you said.
> I won't even comment on the offensive stuff you posted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm I understand how it's real and I also understand how it _reels_ in the money for MS.
> I'm not fighting, but you're fighting anyone who doesn't agree it's a super spanking awesome OS interface. Clutching at straws means you are finding any reason, whether it works or not, to justify what you're saying. Like you keep ignoring people talking about desktops. You either state it as an outright fact that Win8 is a mobile OS (which is categoritically false) or you forget they ever specifically talked about Desktop OS's.
> As I've said many times before over the last few months. I can't wait to get Windows 8 on my HTPC with a Kinect device and I've been waiting and waiting for the day that Windows tablets become available en masse since I don't like Android or iOS. But on my DESKTOP machine this is a horrible UI.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Try re-typing your post, it is terribly written I cant even comprehend what your trying to get at with it. Windows 8 is a great desktop OS. I have a entire thread devoted to proving it, check my signature.
> 
> Edit: I kind of comprehended it after reading it 3 times. I am not claiming Metro to be the ultimate desktop Interface. Each person has their own taste, this is why Linux has over 5+ different desktop environments. Tho I am saying Windows 8 can do Windows 7 tasks at a much faster rate, regardless of user. Simply because of the mechanics behind it. Opening Windows Defrag takes at least a minute on Windows 7 using just the mouse, takes only 30 seconds on Windows 8. It's just how the content is laid out that makes it a faster multi tasker then Windows 7. Like I and dozens of others have said a million times before, if you don't like 8, don't use it. It wasn't built for Desktops in mind, even if it does increase workflow on them. You guys are the ones being suckered in my Microsoft globalizing on using the title Windows 8.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yea, that clearly says Windows 8 might be ugly without Aero, but it does a better job at saving battery life. *Below you can see actual Aero cycles!* Don't tell me Aero doesn't consume extra power on your laptop, because im 100% sure you never even bothered to run it with it off (Aero addict).
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> I might suggest you take a break from the thread.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'm having to much fun proving people wrong, so is the mod's.
Click to expand...

Really aero-addict? I had windows 7 starter edition on my netbook and that doesnt have aero enabled in case you didnt know. After putting ultimate on it with aero battery life is the same with probably a 5 minute difference in favour of the aero themed upgrade. I didnt say that you claimed windows 8 was ugly without aero, you said in that quote that aero is ugly and useless. Windows 8 is ugly on its own accord/


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Really aero-addict? I had windows 7 starter edition on my netbook and that doesnt have aero enabled in case you didnt know. After putting ultimate on it with aero battery life is the same with probably a 5 minute difference in favour of the aero themed upgrade. I didnt say that you claimed windows 8 was ugly without aero, you said in that quote that aero is ugly and useless. Windows 8 is ugly on its own accord/


I never said Aero was ugly. I said it was useless as it consumes twice as many cycles then normal window rendering. The power consumption far outweighs the visually appeasing design. A quick mockup would look something like this (based off my previous test). As you can see there is a substantial jump in power consumption between having Aero on vs off on my machine.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Really aero-addict? I had windows 7 starter edition on my netbook and that doesnt have aero enabled in case you didnt know. After putting ultimate on it with aero battery life is the same with probably a 5 minute difference in favour of the aero themed upgrade. I didnt say that you claimed windows 8 was ugly without aero, you said in that quote that aero is ugly and useless. Windows 8 is ugly on its own accord/
> 
> 
> 
> I never said Aero was ugly. I said it was useless as it consumes twice as many cycles then normal window rendering. The power consumption far outweighs the visually appeasing design. A quick mockup would look something like this (based off my previous test). As you can see there is a substantial jump in power consumption between having Aero on vs off on my machine.
Click to expand...

Oh my god a full 14% load and a full 2.8w of draw that is surely detrimental to my netbook.


----------



## divide_by_zero

I'm definitely a creature of habit, but I'm not ashamed to say I've set Windows to "peformance" since XP. This is going to be an annoying release.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Oh my god a full 14% load and a full 2.8w of draw that is surely detrimental to my netbook.


Add it up over time, your argument would be just as concrete as how the IPC improvement on Ivy Bridge saves a few seconds in applications vs Sandy Bridge. Each watt counts and eventually you will have saved loads of time on your battery, and loads on your electrical bill recharging the machine.


----------



## Onex

Edit
2.8 watts = 0.0028 kilo watts at peak hours here its 0.11/kw less then a penny in savings holly cheescakes batman im saving soo much cash.


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*


Yea







, getting several more minutes out of battery life doesn't seem so bad now does it? You have to remember no one cares about how flashy and shiny things look anymore, they care more about efficiency. All hardware manufactures have been trying to accomplish this since they started, now we got APU's that consume as little as 17w. But that's not going to help if your running a big bulky OS that's going to stress that chip so it just continues to eat resources.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , getting several more minutes out of battery life doesn't seem so bad now does it? You have to remember no one cares about how flashy and shiny things look anymore, they care more about efficiency. All hardware manufactures have been trying to accomplish this since they started, now we got APU's that consume as little as 17w. But that's not going to help if your running a big bulky OS that's going to stress that chip so it just continues to eat resources.
Click to expand...

you missed my edit
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit
> 2.8 watts = 0.0028 kilo watts at peak hours here its 0.11/kw less then a penny in savings holly cheescakes batman im saving soo much cash.


Quote:


> you have to remember no one cares about how flashy and shiny things look anymore,


This is wrong beyond words. It must be apples efficiency rating that brought them over the top in desktops not their original idea of an OS or their flashy new ipods and iphones, nope must be their efficiency.


----------



## Methos07

Talk about splitting hairs...


----------



## Rubers

Wow this is just pure astounding arrogance.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> 1. Your ability to type coherent sentences were lacking majorly in that last post, sorry to say.
> 2. Correct, but for Aero rich machines. Aero itself consumes many more cycles. Below is a quick test of how much GPU cycles are consumed with Aero off. As you can see, far less as many, which results in lots of saved energy.
> 
> 3. Sure I did, even this post proves the post im replying to wrong. You guys need to stop getting so hot headed when a single guy takes three guys to the cleaners in a single thread.


1. I think you should concentrate on *replying correctly to people's points* rather than picking up on typo's and claiming a spelling victory. Because typo's aren't as important as correctly recognising what someone is talking about. For instance many people have mentioned their gripes with this are for DESKTOP machines and it appears you have a blindspot towards the word Desktop.

2. People aren't too worried about power savings on their desktop where there are no batteries.

3. You're the only person getting hot headed here. You're worried about "spoon feeding people" and such. And, no, you haven't taken anyone to the cleaners. You're cleaning yourself out with these arrogant posts that miss the point entirely.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Yea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , getting several more minutes out of battery life doesn't seem so bad now does it? You have to remember no one cares about how flashy and shiny things look anymore, they care more about efficiency. All hardware manufactures have been trying to accomplish this since they started, now we got APU's that consume as little as 17w. But that's not going to help if your running a big bulky OS that's going to stress that chip so it just continues to eat resources.


Right, and, once again. what about desktop users who don't ahve a battery and WANT Aero?

What harm is there letting these people have a choice in the matter?


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> you missed my edit
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> you have to remember no one cares about how flashy and shiny things look anymore,
> 
> 
> 
> This is wrong beyond words. It must be apples efficiency rating that brought them over the top in desktops not their original idea of an OS or their flashy new ipods and iphones, nope must be their efficiency.
Click to expand...

When your on a ARM device, let me know how much battery that is.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Wow this is just pure astounding arrogance.
> 1. I think you should concentrate on *replying correctly to people's points* rather than picking up on typo's and claiming a spelling victory. Because typo's aren't as important as correctly recognising what someone is talking about. For instance many people have mentioned their gripes with this are for DESKTOP machines and it appears you have a blindspot towards the word Desktop.
> 2. People aren't too worried about power savings on their desktop where there are no batteries.
> 3. You're the only person getting hot headed here. You're worried about "spoon feeding people" and such. And, no, you haven't taken anyone to the cleaners. You're cleaning yourself out with these arrogant posts that miss the point entirely.
> Right, and, once again. what about desktop users who don't ahve a battery and WANT Aero?
> What harm is there letting these people have a choice in the matter?


1. No one was targeting type-o's, the sentences themselves didn't make sense to me (my fault?).
2. Quite frankly no one cares about desktops, when Windows 8 is brought up, the word Desktop is the last to exist. Windows 7 is for Desktops.
3. Im not hot headed, I like stating the obvious and watching others blow up. Either that or they try changing the questions/responses around to target something else. I have been stating cold hard facts in my posts that is clearly resulting in the obvious now. Yet it took 30 posts for people to finally start to get it, and probably will take 30 more.

There is no harm in choice, just Microsoft doesn't want to implement it. So really you don't have a choice? That would be like people complaining that they want Aero removed from Windows Vista before it came out. But it was a new technology then, and people liked it. Now its just drug out, and is not worth its keep. There is two Windows builds on the market for people who want Aero, isn't that enough?


----------



## Black Magix

Not going to read 36 pages of posts to see what was said but does anyone think this looks strangely like windows 3.1 on the titlebar portion?


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> you missed my edit
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> you have to remember no one cares about how flashy and shiny things look anymore,
> 
> 
> 
> This is wrong beyond words. It must be apples efficiency rating that brought them over the top in desktops not their original idea of an OS or their flashy new ipods and iphones, nope must be their efficiency.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> When your on a ARM device, let me know how much battery that is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Wow this is just pure astounding arrogance.
> 1. I think you should concentrate on *replying correctly to people's points* rather than picking up on typo's and claiming a spelling victory. Because typo's aren't as important as correctly recognising what someone is talking about. For instance many people have mentioned their gripes with this are for DESKTOP machines and it appears you have a blindspot towards the word Desktop.
> 2. People aren't too worried about power savings on their desktop where there are no batteries.
> 3. You're the only person getting hot headed here. You're worried about "spoon feeding people" and such. And, no, you haven't taken anyone to the cleaners. You're cleaning yourself out with these arrogant posts that miss the point entirely.
> Right, and, once again. what about desktop users who don't ahve a battery and WANT Aero?
> What harm is there letting these people have a choice in the matter?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 1. No one was targeting type-o's, the sentences themselves didn't make sense to me (my fault?).
> 2. Quite frankly no one cares about desktops, when Windows 8 is brought up, the word Desktop is the last to exist. Windows 7 is for Desktops.
> 3. Im not hot headed, I like stating the obvious and watching others blow up. Either that or they try changing the questions/responses around to target something else. I have been stating cold hard facts in my posts that is clearly resulting in the obvious now. Yet it took 30 posts for people to finally start to get it, and probably will take 30 more.
> 
> There is no harm in choice, just Microsoft doesn't want to implement it. So really you don't have a choice? That would be like people complaining that they want Aero removed from Windows Vista before it came out. But it was a new technology then, and people liked it. Now its just drug out, and is not worth its keep. There is two Windows builds on the market for people who want Aero, isn't that enough?
Click to expand...

Are you dense? We are trying to talk about desktops I can give a rats behind about ARM devices. OS' for ARM devices have no place on desktops.


----------



## lin2dev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funfortehfun*
> 
> RIP Windows Start Button, 1995-2012
> RIP Windows Aero, 2006-2012
> What's next on the RIP list, *W8* and *Microsoft*?


I wouldn't mind....


----------



## Warmonger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Are you dense? We are trying to talk about desktops I can give a rats behind about ARM devices. OS' for ARM devices have no place on desktops.


So why are you wasting your time with a Laptop/Notebook/ARM OS? I think I established my point in that single line.


----------



## Onex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Onex*
> 
> Are you dense? We are trying to talk about desktops I can give a rats behind about ARM devices. OS' for ARM devices have no place on desktops.
> 
> 
> 
> So why are you wasting your time with a Laptop/Notebook/ARM OS? I think I established my point in that single line.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Rubers*
> 
> Lol, why would MS lose out if they kept AEro, start menu and allowed the removal of Metro on desktops? Surely making those "handful lachen, it's more than that) of people to be happy would increase sales.
> And also, since when did Windows 7 become free? Supplying any Windows OS to OEM's nets them money.
> Honestly, you are fighting a losing battle here and completely clutching at straws.
> 
> 
> 
> *Because its useless bulk added to the operating system that kills battery life.* And yes there is only a handful of people complaining (I call them whine _ _ _ 's). No one said Windows was free, Windows supply's the OS to OEM's because it reals in Microsoft more money, how do you not understand this? Your fighting on the losing side of the battle, clutching at straws, notice how much you complained in the past few pages over losing Aero. Seriously learn to let go of things lol.
Click to expand...

This is why we started to talk about Laptops, i never mentioned ARM devices at all you just threw it out there to save the pathetic excuse of a windows Operating system.


----------



## Rubers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warmonger*
> 
> So why are you wasting your time with a Laptop/Notebook/ARM OS? I think I established my point in that single line.










Windows 8 isn't a Laptop OS.


----------



## wierdo124

That's enough of this. Closed.


----------

