# 10,000 RPM & 15,000RPM vs. SSD



## GanjaSMK

SSD is still much faster as the IOPS (input-output operations per/s) are far higher. They may be nearly the same speed in sequential reads and maybe even writes, but often the SSD's still win that out by a margin.


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## SteelTrepid

A SSD or even a hybrid blows them all out of the water! Check this video from Seagate & Tiger Direct:
<<removed link, check my other post below for a better link>>

I watched this when the hybrids first came out. It really shows you how awesome all of them are!


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## ninjaburrito

Quote:


Originally Posted by *GanjaSMK* 
SSD is still much faster as the IOPS (input-output operations per/s) are far higher. They may be nearly the same speed in sequential reads and maybe even writes, but often the SSD's still win that out by a margin.

is this for the 15K or the 10K and by how much is the 15K faster than the 10K by?
sorry for the vague questions


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## SteelTrepid

Sorry I figured out how to just link the video:
http://dai.ly/cEN3AJ

All you have to do is watch the video and you will see it with your own eyes!
With all the recent SSD posts I've been replying to, I really wish I would have remembered this video sooner! Since it is really made to show off their hybrid drive, it still shows all of them side to side!


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## wumpus

Quote:


Originally Posted by *ninjaburrito* 
is this for the 15K or the 10K and by how much is the 15K faster than the 10K by?
sorry for the vague questions

dude, first off, you need an expensive SAS controller to get the most out of them, and they are really only worth it if you have a large RAID array.

the cost per GB is prettyclose to SSD territory as well, and the only reaosn you would buy them anyway is because the space is cheaper.


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## Volvo

SSD wins by a considerably large margin.


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## Marlaman

Are you talking about SCSI drives?
I'm not aware of any SATA drives that are 15,000rpm, but I don't know everything...
Simply put SSD >all else. yeah it costs more but it's freakin fast. period. no waiting for mechanisms to work and stuff. just circuits.


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## GanjaSMK

It'll depend on the drives and the interfaces are different (as far as I know).

For instance the 15k drivers are SCSI drives usually used in enterprise/commercial builds (servers). The 10k's you can find in SATAII (don't know if any are 3.0 yet). I couldn't be specific about the 15k over the 10k. But I'd assume they're probably 10~15% faster (someone else will probably explain this better and know numbers).

But an older 10k drive like the Raptor' from a few years ago are only slightly faster than modern 7200RPM drives. Even the newer Velociraptors aren't exceeding faster than 7200 drives.


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## SteelTrepid

Most SCSI drives are now pretty much SATA but they call them SAS (Serial Attached SCSI). I think most of the time you can actually get away with running these without a fancy controller.


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## SteelTrepid

Man? Did the video kill everyone? I was hoping for a few comments about it.


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## Kramy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SteelTrepid* 
Sorry I figured out how to just link the video:
http://dai.ly/cEN3AJ

All you have to do is watch the video and you will see it with your own eyes!
With all the recent SSD posts I've been replying to, I really wish I would have remembered this video sooner! Since it is really made to show off their hybrid drive, it still shows all of them side to side!


Quote:


Originally Posted by *SteelTrepid* 
Man? Did the video kill everyone? I was hoping for a few comments about it.

I commented on that when I first saw it. It seems like an unfair comparison.

That's a pretty lackluster SSD. Picking a faster one would reveal how not-so-awesome the Momentus XT's performance is.









The Raptor is an older slower generation, beaten by the new 600GB ones, and even the 2TB WD2001FASS. [source]

Despite this, it loses primarily on the boot time. After that it completes the benchmarks in roughly the same time as the Momentus XT.

So when you put it like that... worth the price? (y/n)

Keep in mind the wake issues that have been mentioned, and the increased price for less capacity.

Edit: To shave off the boot time you could buy a $5 USB stick and use ReadyBoost...


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## SteelTrepid

The hybrids look pretty interesting and I've been thinking of getting one for the wife but haven't had the money. I think that video should give everyone a good idea of how SSDs really perform against spinning drives. If they used a better SSD it would probably show how much faster they really are. I don't know if I agree with your one statement though? The video shows pretty kick ass performance for everything, not just boot time? But then I think you may have been comparing the SSD and hybrid so that would make sense.


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## cr1

Any real performance gain would definitely be seen with 2 Rapters in RAID0-

I can't speak on SSD's-


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## DuckieHo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SteelTrepid* 
Most SCSI drives are now pretty much SATA but they call them SAS (Serial Attached SCSI). I think most of the time you can actually get away with running these without a fancy controller.

No... you cannot run a SAS HDD on a SATA controller.

You _can_ run SATA HDD on a SAS controller.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SteelTrepid* 
The hybrids look pretty interesting and I've been thinking of getting one for the wife but haven't had the money. I think that video should give everyone a good idea of how SSDs really perform against spinning drives. If they used a better SSD it would probably show how much faster they really are. I don't know if I agree with your one statement though? The video shows pretty kick ass performance for everything, not just boot time? But then I think you may have been comparing the SSD and hybrid so that would make sense.

Hybrid drives should be compared to fast HDDs. They are still no where near the performance of a SSD. The Momentus XT just provides a 4GB read cache for most commonly used blocks.


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## Ceiron

The 10k/15k RPM drives' biggest advantage over standard 7200RPM drives is their higher access time. The higher spin speed also increases read/write but not substantially.

At most cases, SSDs have a random access time of 2ms or lower.
10k RPM drives have an average access time of 6ms.
That alone severely stacks up SSDs against Mechanical drives already.

As for speed, we all know SSDs are faster than mechanical drives at probably every test.
As proof, here's AnandTech's benchmark of the Vertex 2 that was launched a few months ago. (If you look well enough, the WD Raptor 300GB's constantly at the bottom of the list, next to the 5400RPM drive)


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## DuckieHo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ceiron* 
At most cases, SSDs have a random access time of *0.2ms* or lower.
10k RPM drives have an average access time of 6ms.
That alone severely stacks up SSDs against Mechanical drives already.

fixed.


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## Cata1yst

a quality SSD is faster and quieter. Once i get my mobo i can run you some benchmarks on my raid 0 cheetahs if you want


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## SteelTrepid

Actually Duckie you can sometimes, not often though. I've had a few SAS drives actually work on a regular SATA controller. Maybe the manufacturer mislabeled the drives or something? I like how just because you are a Mod you know everything?

You misunderstood what I was saying or I did not say it clearly enough. I probably wasn't clear enough. I am using that video to show the speed of SSD. The hybrids look cool performance wise and I know what they are, I don't need the explanation.


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## DuckieHo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *SteelTrepid* 
Actually Duckie you can sometimes, not often though. I've had a few SAS drives actually work on a regular SATA controller. Maybe the manufacturer mislabeled the drives or something? I like how just because you are a Mod you know everything?

You misunderstood what I was saying or I did not say it clearly enough. I probably wasn't clear enough. I am using that video to show the speed of SSD. The hybrids look cool performance wise and I know what they are, I don't need the explanation.

No. SATA controllers do not support SAS. SAS controller support the SATA Tunneled Protocol (STP) which allows them compatibility with SATA drivers.

Do you have a link on a SAS HDD that works on a SATA controller? If so, the manufacturer ignored the SATA specifications, spent money/time writing their own protocol, and designed their own controller.... which no one would ever use. Enterprise are the only ones who demand SAS HDDs.

This is in the specifications of SAS.


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## AllenG

tool is probably talking about raptors or VR's.

Bottomline, sas 15k's are fast... but ssd is faster. Take it from someone who owns the SAS drives, in a raid 0 on a good controller at that.

Note: I also have SATA drives on my SAS controller. If i could have run the SAS drives on my sata controller would i have really bought the expensive SAS controller?


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## Kramy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Ceiron* 
The 10k/15k RPM drives' biggest advantage over standard 7200RPM drives is their higher access time. The higher spin speed also increases read/write but not substantially.

At most cases, SSDs have a random access time of 2ms or lower.
10k RPM drives have an average access time of 6ms.
That alone severely stacks up SSDs against Mechanical drives already.

As for speed, we all know SSDs are faster than mechanical drives at probably every test.
As proof, here's AnandTech's benchmark of the Vertex 2 that was launched a few months ago. (If you look well enough, the WD Raptor 300GB's constantly at the bottom of the list, next to the 5400RPM drive)

1) Denser platters increase sequential read/write speeds. Not higher RPM's. 15k drives often score lower on sequential than 7200RPM drives - but they make up for it with roughly triple the IOPS.

2) SSDs usually have random access times of 0.1ms or lower. All the benchmarks I look at measure them between 0.06ms and 0.10ms.


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## SteelTrepid

Actually it was in a HP workstation. I will have to see if I can get my hands on it again. It had a RAID/SAS card in it but my boss had to change something in it and ended up hooking the hard drives up to the onboard Intel RAID controller. The drives were SAS drives.

Also, how is he allowed to call me a tool?? Shouldn't he get some points or something for name calling?


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