# A mini fridge CAN cool a PC



## Pooping^fish

Inb4 industrial fridge loads.


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## JDMfanatic

Why did you have to put it into vegetable oil?


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## Tristanguy1224

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Pooping^fish* 
Inb4 industrial fridge loads.

What......?


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## tylerand

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JDMfanatic* 
Why did you have to put it into vegetable oil?

I'm assuming because vegetable oil is non-conductive and it diluted any condensation / eliminated it.


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## Tristanguy1224

Quote:


Originally Posted by *JDMfanatic* 
Why did you have to put it into vegetable oil?

Well my first mini fridge experiment ended in disaster when I didn't properly condensation proof my E8400/P5Q-E... I knew vegetable oil to be non-conductive.... so I though hey... "why not" it did work great though
I know it's ******ed now.... but I should at least get points for creativity..... I'm just grasping for reasons not to call myself an idiot

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=551413


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## eclipseaudio4

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Tristanguy1224* 
Well my first mini fridge experiment ended in disaster when I didn't properly condensation proof my E8400/P5Q-E... I knew vegetable oil to be non-conductive.... so I though hey... "why not" it did work great though
I know it's ******ed now.... *but I should at least get points for creativity*..... I'm just grasping for reasons not to call myself an idiot

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=551413

I give 2 points

ROFLMAO It did work great tho!


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## k4m1k4z3

so the oil did keep the condensation off? This idea could be expanded to much colder fluids cooling the CPU...

There are people that do submerged computers in mineral oil, and there are people who do phase change cooling... what if they combined methods? Extreme cooling without the condensation problem? Someone do it.


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## l4n b0y

haha.. inb4 *duckiho.


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## G|F.E.A.D|Killa

Quote:


Originally Posted by *l4n b0y* 
haha.. inb4 duckyho.

you mean duckieho


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## Shane1244

The compressor will blow soon.


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## l4n b0y

Quote:



Originally Posted by *G|F.E.A.D|Killa*


you mean duckiho


..its the thought that counts.


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## A-E-I-Owned-You

OMG THIS IS AMAZING. Except the opposite of that.


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## epitek

If you do plan on keep it in oil for any period of time I'd suggest you use mineral oil as vegi oil will build up residue around fans and some components. Mineral oil can be found at most pharmacies or stores even. Also I believe mineral oil is lighter in weight than vegi oil but I may be wrong about that :\\


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## eclipseaudio4

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Shane1244* 
The compressor will blow soon.

no they last longer when they stay running. it's the cycling on and off that is hard on the compressors.


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## PhaedraCorruption

I spy with my little eye, the ThermalFake Bigwater 745. Yeah, I had one too. It leaked. Oh god.


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## eclipseaudio4

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PhaedraCorruption* 
I spy with my little eye, the ThermalFake Bigwater 745. Yeah, I had one too. It leaked. Oh god.

Yeah they are crap, but a good way to get into WC and learn the basics!


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## PhaedraCorruption

Quote:



Originally Posted by *eclipseaudio4*


Yeah they are crap, but a good way to get into WC and learn the basics!


Yeah, after a bit of modding and high CFM fans and a couple of Laps, I was able to idle at 35 and load at 48.


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## forgot_to_order_a_quad

Quote:



Originally Posted by *l4n b0y*


haha.. inb4 *duckiho.


Actually, I do wonder what he will say about this...


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## ShamrockMan

Quote:



Originally Posted by *eclipseaudio4*


no they last longer when they stay running. it's the cycling on and off that is hard on the compressors.


Its not the cycling that kills mini-fridge compressors when used to cool computers, its the fact that the compressor does not have enough cooling to run for more than a few minutes at a time.


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## DuckieHo

Quote:



Originally Posted by *forgot_to_order_a_quad*


Actually, I do wonder what he will say about this...


How long did he run it for? A few hours?

Try it again and run it loaded for a day.


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## justarealguy

Quote:



Originally Posted by *G|F.E.A.D|Killa*


you mean duckiho


You mean Duckieho.

And duckie responds!


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## Shrimpykins

Quote:



Originally Posted by *DuckieHo*


How long did he run it for? A few hours?

Try it again and run it loaded for a day.


Pretty much 100%... Anyone who thinks this works didn't take the time to actually consider the reasons why it won't work... It is great... for short periods of time. But I don't think anyone in the history of this idea has had the intent of using it for short periods of time. The overall goal every single time someone has this idea or does this is to create a prolonged sub-ambient cooling system. I've yet to see someone accomplish this with *simple* use of the fridge and it's *original* components.

Every single time the answer to a cheaper and more productive solution is phase change cooling. Hate to burst bubbles but that is the truth.


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## redsox83381

Say goodbye to that mini fridge. I give it a few hours to a day before it blows.


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## hak8or

Run it for more than like 5 hours, something such as a week on load, and then come back and show us how it handled it. I say, 12 hours and then it turns into a oven and compressor shuts down.


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## Grim

OP
Im lost as to whats happening in the pictures!
WHAT is submerged in mineral oil?
And - how long have you been running this?

Quote:



Originally Posted by *Tristanguy1224*


Well my first mini fridge experiment ended in disaster when I didn't properly condensation proof my E8400/P5Q-E... I knew vegetable oil to be non-conductive.... so I though hey... "why not" it did work great though
I know it's ******ed now.... but I should at least get points for creativity..... I'm just grasping for reasons not to call myself an idiot

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=551413


Nice Clock.
What temps did this run at?


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## Tristanguy1224

Quote:



Originally Posted by *Grim*


OP
Im lost as to whats happening in the pictures!
WHAT is submerged in mineral oil?
And - how long have you been running this?

Nice Clock.
What temps did this run at?


Ok my mobo was in oil (for condensation) and the rads of my WC setup were in the fridge it ran for about 6 weeks before I got a new board (not because of malfunction) then another month or so before I took it apart because I had an oil leak.... oh and it was stupid I know but I used vegetable oil instead of mineral oil and it was with a q9550 @ 3825 load temps were around 25-30c idle around 16c that was with 1.36vcore 1.32vtt (yeah way high) and I couldn't leave it off with the fridge on or it'd freeze the coolant so I kept it on 24/7..... I may set it up again but not with oil this time actually do the condensation proofing right.....


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## Grim

NIICE.








What I'm interested in - is HOW long it will run.
We all know the physics behind why it is PROJECTED to fail.
It seems compound - but lets see it in a real life scenario.

I'd like to encourage you to do this - and set it up with a more permanent, Stable setup.

ON TOP OF THIS.
Its essential I think, for you to stick a thermometer in the fridge during the setup's normal operation, and see what temps the fridge function at.

Question - can you remember? - How long/often the fridge "RAN" (that is - its compressor) ?


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## Tristanguy1224

Quote:



Originally Posted by *Grim*


NIICE.








What I'm interested in - is HOW long it will run.
We all know the physics behind why it is PROJECTED to fail.
It seems compound - but lets see it in a real life scenario.

I'd like to encourage you to do this - and set it up with a more permanent, Stable setup.

ON TOP OF THIS.
Its essential I think, for you to stick a thermometer in the fridge during the setup's normal operation, and see what temps the fridge function at.

Question - can you remember? - How long/often the fridge "RAN" (that is - its compressor) ?


The compressor didn't run constantly I do remember that also in my attempt to make it as efficient as possible I put 2 80mm fans on the back of the fridge which made it run less often


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## Grim

hah.
Whats that - it didNT run CONSTANTLY...

heh







- My friend - there are so many people on this forum that wish to see such a setup in action.
A few better pictures would do quite well.

This setup is now no longer in place I understand?


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## willis888

Quote:


Originally Posted by *tristanguy1224* 
i put 2 80mm fans on the back of the fridge . . .

lol!


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## Volvo

huge fail.


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## CorporalAris

It's never been a question of CAN IT COOL, but for HOW LONG. Refrigerators are NOT meant to cool a PC, they are meant to keep cool stuff cool. A normal cycle is a few minutes every hour, not constant. It will kill the fridge soon enough.


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## Cepheus

I'd like to stick in my warning here.

Oil is non-conductive, yes.

Does it damage capacitors? It certainly can

Non-Conductive =/= Safe.

3M makes a fluid that is safe, non-conductive, etc. It's called fluorinert. Costs $150/gallon cheapest.


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## k4m1k4z3

Hate to bring this up








I still ponder from time to time if it really is impossible to use a mini fridge to cool a pc or at least one or two parts of it...

But what is it that kills the compressor? Is it from overheating the unit?

My mini fridge used to run constantly and did a poor job at keeping the food cool, and I pulled the thing out to look at it. First observation was no radiator... is that normal?









But much more importantly was the HEAT!!! I was afraid that if a wire touched that compressor, I would have melted plastic and fire! I burned my hand touching it. And this is how the thing had been running. The fridge is old and probably has insulation problems... so it just keeps running.

Being creative, I decided to pull an old CPU heatsink of mine out of a box of parts, put some thermal paste and a bit of super glue on it, and stick it to the top of the compressor. I then cut up an old 12v wall transformer and wired up the fan on the HS.

Now, it has amazing cool temperatures. At first the heatsink was immediately burning hot, but eventually cooled down the compressor, and then the compressor stopped running all the time. The thing is cool to the touch at any time now.

So, if overheating the compressor is the issue with a mini fridge cooled pc, what if you were to add a heatsink+fan to it?

My fridge was overheating from running most of the day, and adding a HS to it fixed the problem. It has been running fine now for a few weeks... not dead.


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## xxbassplayerxx

Quote:


Originally Posted by *k4m1k4z3* 
Hate to bring this up








I still ponder from time to time if it really is impossible to use a mini fridge to cool a pc or at least one or two parts of it...

But what is it that kills the compressor? Is it from overheating the unit?

My mini fridge used to run constantly and did a poor job at keeping the food cool, and I pulled the thing out to look at it. First observation was no radiator... is that normal?









But much more importantly was the HEAT!!! I was afraid that if a wire touched that compressor, I would have melted plastic and fire! I burned my hand touching it. And this is how the thing had been running. The fridge is old and probably has insulation problems... so it just keeps running.

Being creative, I decided to pull an old CPU heatsink of mine out of a box of parts, put some thermal paste and a bit of super glue on it, and stick it to the top of the compressor. I then cut up an old 12v wall transformer and wired up the fan on the HS.

Now, it has amazing cool temperatures. At first the heatsink was immediately burning hot, but eventually cooled down the compressor, and then the compressor stopped running all the time. The thing is cool to the touch at any time now.

So, if overheating the compressor is the issue with a mini fridge cooled pc, what if you were to add a heatsink+fan to it?

My fridge was overheating from running most of the day, and adding a HS to it fixed the problem. It has been running fine now for a few weeks... not dead.

Do a quick search. We've discussed this topic on many occasions.


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## NidStyles

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cepheus* 
I'd like to stick in my warning here.

Oil is non-conductive, yes.

Does it damage capacitors? It certainly can

Non-Conductive =/= Safe.

3M makes a fluid that is safe, non-conductive, etc. It's called fluorinert. Costs $150/gallon cheapest.

I really wish this myth would die.

Cap's will not die if used in oil. If that were true none of us would have electricity in our homes. What do you think cool's those massive cap's sitting outside on the pole that supplies electricity to your home's? We call them transformers, but they are really just extremely massive AC cap's.

Any decent mobo will have solid cap's now a day's anyways, which make's that myth of oil seeping into them even more of a lie.

Please stop spreading misinformation as if it were fact.


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## Cepheus

Quote:


Originally Posted by *NidStyles* 
I really wish this myth would die.

Cap's will not die if used in oil. If that were true none of us would have electricity in our homes. What do you think cool's those massive cap's sitting outside on the pole that supplies electricity to your home's? We call them transformers, but they are really just extremely massive AC cap's.

Any decent mobo will have solid cap's now a day's anyways, which make's that myth of oil seeping into them even more of a lie.

Please stop spreading misinformation as if it were fact.

You obviously don't know much about electronics.

Capacitors store charge, and are usually made of (unless they are solid capacitors) oiled paper sandwiched between sheets of metal foil, and packaged up. On the other hand, a transformer works by winding two coils of wire around a magnetic core. This is not a capacitor. Capacitors store charge, transformers merely step the voltage up and down on a circuit.
So you're wrong there.

If by saying 'any decent motherboard' you mean 'any recent motherboard' (because many excellent older motherboards, such as the p5b deluxe do not have solid capacitors) you should define it as such. Most people who try a cooling experiment tend to try it with older rigs. You also fail to remember about addon cards.

Most addon cards, especially sound cards do not use solid capacitors.

Firstly, if oil gets into the capacitor in your motherboard or sound card, which, depending on the capacitor, it might, the mineral oil and the dielectric (usually oiled paper) will mix and combine due to diffusion. I'm not sure what the effect of this would be, because unlike you I'm not a trained and qualified electrical engineer, but I would imagine that the capacitor would stop working as intended, due to the intermingling of the two oils, and the removal of a lot of the electrolyte.

Before you start trumpeting things as an out-right lie, please research your information, and make sure that you're right. Definitely won't =/= Probably won't.


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## k4m1k4z3

Quote:


Originally Posted by *xxbassplayerxx* 
Do a quick search. We've discussed this topic on many occasions.

thanks for coming out.

But

I have read plenty of threads where it is discussed that the compressor will die.

What I am saying is, is it the overheating that kills the compressor?
I have read through the discussions from the past year. All people say is that the compressor will die... not what condition besides running too much. Is it due to overheating?
Nobody that I have seen has said how long it takes for it to die or has any records posted from their personal experience.

Mine was running most of the time due to the fridge insulation being crappy. And it was very much overheated. Adding a CPU HSF to it keeps it cooled off just like it would keep a CPU from overheating and wearing out. Wouldn't this idea be useful in a fridge cooled pc setup?


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## Andr3az

Quote:


Originally Posted by *k4m1k4z3* 
thanks for coming out.

But

I have read plenty of threads where it is discussed that the compressor will die.

What I am saying is, is it the overheating that kills the compressor?
I have read through the discussions from the past year. All people say is that the compressor will die... not what condition besides running too much. Is it due to overheating?
Nobody that I have seen has said how long it takes for it to die or has any records posted from their personal experience.

Mine was running most of the time due to the fridge insulation being crappy. And it was very much overheated. Adding a CPU HSF to it keeps it cooled off just like it would keep a CPU from overheating and wearing out. Wouldn't this idea be useful in a fridge cooled pc setup?

They die because they are not meant to work on all the time.
Fridges aren't supposed to cool active heatsource.


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## DuckieHo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *k4m1k4z3* 
My mini fridge used to run constantly and did a poor job at keeping the food cool, and I pulled the thing out to look at it. First observation was no radiator... is that normal?









Your mini-fridge is TEC/Peltier based then. There's a whole section on those as well. I won't get into it since it's "complicated".


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## walker450

Most mini-fridges have condensers that are under the sheet metal, so you cannot see them.

k4m1k4z3, I am assuming that when you say "radiator" you are actually referring to the condenser that on some fridges is exposed on the back.

Here are some pics of my mini-fridge in pieces (condenser tubing clearly visible in the fourth pic down):










And its cut...:









The sides had to come off too:









This is how most models are, the condenser is under the side panels:









And there are wires for the thermostat that must be dug from the insulation:









Aaaahhh the chaos!!:









Must cut the back out to pull the ice tray (evaporator):









And then demolish the rest of the back to get everything to come out together:

















And finally, about 30 minutes later, seperation!!:


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## walker450

Almost forgot... If you want to run a mini-fridge continuously, you will need to provide forced air circulation for the condenser. Otherwise, it will get too hot and it won't hardly cool things down, and I imagine death to the compressor is the next thing that happens.

When a mini-fridge is in normal operation with food in it, it doesn't run long enough to overheat the condenser. It gets hot, but then has time to dissipate the heat to the case once the compressor shuts off.


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## k4m1k4z3

Quote:


Originally Posted by *walker450* 
Almost forgot... If you want to run a mini-fridge continuously, you will need to provide forced air circulation for the condenser. Otherwise, it will get too hot and it won't hardly cool things down, and I imagine death to the compressor is the next thing that happens.

When a mini-fridge is in normal operation with food in it, it doesn't run long enough to overheat the condenser. It gets hot, but then has time to dissipate the heat to the case once the compressor shuts off.

exactly what I am getting at. I was assuming the compressor overheating was what caused its death. If installing a big ole' CPU heatsink and fan on it was effectively cooling it, imagine what a few more could do for a fridge that was being used to cool a PC.

now, for the people that just read only the last few words of the previous sentence; YES, I under stand that if you try to cool a pc with a fridge, the fridge will die.
But what about modifying it slightly so that the compressor does not get hot at all?

So the condenser is in the sides... that might be a little tricky to keep them cool...


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## Cepheus

Cascade phase change builds on this principle.


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## DuckieHo

Quote:


Originally Posted by *k4m1k4z3* 
exactly what I am getting at. I was assuming the compressor overheating was what caused its death. If installing a big ole' CPU heatsink and fan on it was effectively cooling it, imagine what a few more could do for a fridge that was being used to cool a PC.

now, for the people that just read only the last few words of the previous sentence; YES, I under stand that if you try to cool a pc with a fridge, the fridge will die.
But what about modifying it slightly so that the compressor does not get hot at all?

So the condenser is in the sides... that might be a little tricky to keep them cool...

A phase change unit is exactly this.... A condensor and evaporator tuned to PC loads and designed to run 24/7. Rather than trying hard to adapt/mod a fridge.... just grab a AC unit!


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## RGB_RO

i have been reading this topic from the beginning and i must say i encourage your work. You all said about cooling the fridge more eficient with a cpu cooler+radiator combo, but i sugest major modifying for the freon cooling system of the fridge. All you need is a larger heat disipation area without adding any vent to it.

you should weld a coper car radiator (instead of that tiny short tubing called radiator), and after that, fill the instalation with freon.

my english is bad and i'm sorry for that (still improving), i'm from Romania.
i googled these days in searching for a complete sustainable diy method of cooling computers and i ran into this.

keep up the good work !


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## Cepheus

That would probably not work, and could be extremely damaging.

I am not an HVAC engineer, but I know that phase change systems can be extremely dangerous, it's not just a water cooling loop with freon in.

The whole loop has to be pressurized and braized together properly so that it does not explode and no harmful CFCs are released into the atmosphere, and when testing, even the pros test behind a brick wall, and likely under water as well, so any flying strips of metal are slowed down enough before they tear apart your body.

Essentially, you want the strongest loop you can get, and for the beginner, making your own condenser could be a fairly tricky proposal, because of the physics involved. If it is too long, you will have trouble, if it is too short, likewise. Suitable parts for phase change can be purchased if you can find the right websites, and I would recommend them over what you are proposing, merely because a beginner such as yourself would likely not do the proper testing proceedures etc.

I'm not sure about in Romania, but certainly in most western countries you need to be a qualified HVAC engineer to buy/handle the refrigerants in most cases.


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## graphicsman

that poor mini fridge would have made a great kegerator


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## RGB_RO

Quote:

A vapor compression cycle is used in most household refrigerators, refrigerator-freezers and freezers. In this cycle, a circulating refrigerant such as R134a enters a compressor as low-pressure vapor at or slightly above room temperature. The vapor is then compressed and exits the compressor as high-pressure superheated vapor. The superheated vapor travels under pressure through coils or tubes comprising "the condenser", which are passively cooled by exposure to air in the room. (In hot weather, the room or "ambient" air may itself have been cooled by an air conditioner. A cooler ambient temperature demands less work from the refrigerator.) The condenser cools the vapor, and it eventually liquefies. It is then still under pressure. By the time the refrigerant leaves the condenser it is only slightly above room temperature. This warm liquid refrigerant is forced by its pressure through a metering or throttling device, also known as an expansion valve (essentially a constriction) to an area of much lower pressure. The sudden decrease in pressure results in explosive-like flash evaporation of a portion (typically about half) of the liquid. The latent heat absorbed by this flash evaporation is drawn mostly from adjacent still-liquid refrigerant, a phenomenon known as "auto-refrigeration". The cold and partially vaporized refrigerant continues through coils or tubes of the evaporator unit. A fan blows air from the refrigerator or freezer compartment ("box air") across these coils or tubes and the refrigerant completely vaporizes, drawing further latent heat from the box air, and so keeps the box air cold. This cooled air is returned to the refrigerator or freezer compartment. The cool air in the refrigerator or freezer is still warmer than the refrigerant in the evaporator. Refrigerant leaves the evaporator, now fully vaporized and slightly heated, and returns to the compressor inlet to continue the cycle.
the only problem in expanding the disipation area is the welding so this part has to be made by a professional welder.

i'm sure you cand find guidence at a workshop who repairs refrigerators.
all you need is a good weld and the gas coolant inside at a proper presure (in fact, the same presure like it was before modifications)
there is nothing to explode there, the only thing might hapen is burning the electrical pump.

le : if you rely on the base that only engineers can do the mods, then i think this is not the right place for you... in fact all the discussion/topic/efforts presented here would be worthless (anywhere in the world, not only in us or romania)


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## Cepheus

Refrigeration components are actually produced by brazing, not by welding, and the person doesn't have to be a professional. The trouble is making sure that the system is sturdy enough, and making sure that it is leak and pressure tested properly.

As a simple analogy, if you blow up a balloon too much, it pops, because it can't handle the pressure. If you stick a pin in it, it bursts, because it cannot handle the impact.

Even if you are learning, you are wrong. For example, in a car refrigeration unit, the PSI of r410a is 57psi low pressure and 245psi high pressure. On the other hand, air has a PSI of 14.69, a huge drop. The pressure of your refrigerant will be over 10 times as high as the air around it, so you will need a very strong piece of metal. Solid copper is usually used for the high pressure parts, whilst tubing can be used for the lower pressure areas. When purging and leak testing, I believe propane is used, which is highly flammable.

If your home welded structure cannot support the high pressure, it will likely explode during leak testing.

To counter your final point, if you rely on your own brain rather than the brains of others, you will likely end up with a piece of metal stuck in your brain, and you won't be around to collect your darwin award.
If you don't want to take heed of valuable advice, then this is likely not the place for you, because all the discussion/topics/efforts presented here would be worthless.

If you are making your first ever phase change system, it is safer and easier to buy parts and braize them together, instead of just trying to botch one together with plumbing materials.

Phase change is NOT the same as water cooling with a different pump.


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## PeaceMaker

how do you clean off the vegetable oil when you're done with the experiment?


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## USFORCES

Quote:


Originally Posted by *PeaceMaker* 
how do you clean off the vegetable oil when you're done with the experiment?

National pride?

That's a good question, I guess if you don't do it to begin with you don't have to worrie about it, LOL

And be careful what you buy on Ebay


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## jck

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Cepheus* 
To counter your final point, if you rely on your own brain rather than the brains of others, you will likely end up with a piece of metal stuck in your brain, and you won't be around to collect your darwin award.
If you don't want to take heed of valuable advice, then this is likely not the place for you, because all the discussion/topics/efforts presented here would be worthless.

I gotta keep an eye on the Darwin Awards now for that


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## walker450

Quote:


Originally Posted by *graphicsman* 
that poor mini fridge would have made a great kegerator









You are sooooooo right. I decided to sacrifice my mini fridge just to prove a point. See my thread "A Cooling Experiment" for all of the details.

I told myself I wasn't going to get into this.... A lot of people say that the compressors mini fridges use do not have enough horsepower to cool a PC..... Mine is a 1/12th HP unit and provides about 135W of cooling capability when using it as a chiller. This was more than enough to cool my 95W Q9550 CPU. I would let the water temp get to about 10C then turn off the compressor to let the temp come back up to around 15C. This way I didn't have to worry about condensation.

So I believe most mini fridges, properly modified, can cool PC components. Don't be stupid and try to put your whole computer inside one...


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