# [VC] MSI Teasing GeForce GTX 780 Lightning at Computex/Announce Twin Frozr V



## jomama22

Didnt see this posted yet





















(unconfirmed pcb image (99.99% chance it is)

There will be a waterblock made by EK for this GPU and will be released in the first half of May: http://www.ekwb.com/news/385/19/Two-new-custom-PCB-GeForce-GTX-780-water-blocks-in-the-works/

August the 28th will be a HARD LAUNCH with units available on that day. Cards are in distributor channels/retail locations ATM.
Quote:


> It's hard to say if there's a real card hidden there, and the translation isn't really much helpful either. Apparently, MSI is about to announce a new Twin Frozr V cooler at Computex, but it's unknown if the card will be introduced as well.
> 
> According to Barry Chang, a product marketing manager at MSI, the box contains a cooling mechanism for the card, but the card itself is not yet ready (apparently not in the box). However, I would not be surprised if they would show the whole card already (at least a prototype).]


Source: http://videocardz.com/42549/msi-teasing-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-at-computex
Original with translation: http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gdm.or.jp%2Fcrew%2F2013%2F0605%2F32712&act=url
Quote:


> GTX 780 for mounting the cooling mechanism of the new


from translation, seems to mean the twin frozr V will debut on the 780.

OOOOOOO GOODIEGOODIEGOODIE!

will update with more info when time comes.

UPDATE: So Msi has decided to push the launch date to August 28th. Pictures.
UPDATE 2:


----------



## Seid Dark

This will be too damn expensive but I still very much want one


----------



## Star Forge

You know if someone had a normal screwdriver, they can see it already by now.


----------



## Scorpion667

I knew it. My wallet is almost ready


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## hammerforged

Nice. Thanks for posting!


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## navit

Can't wait love the lightning's !!!


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## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> Can't wait love the lightning's !!!


dude...i am so tempted to trade in the 3 7970 lightnings for 3 780 lightnings....


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> dude...i am so tempted to trade in the 3 7970 lightnings for 3 780 lightnings....


Was just sitting here thinking the same thing, although just one, lol.


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## xoleras

OH MY. Please say it's true.

I loved my former Lightning 680s, they were easily among my favorite personally owned GPUs of all time. Very anxious for more news on the lightning 780!


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## navit

Interesting that they are doing both 770 and 780 lightning's this series.


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## Cryosis00

I thought the draw of cards like the Lightning series was the crazy overclocks you could achieve, but with the voltage control/locks Nvidia has on cards now, is there still a point to something like this?


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> Interesting that they are doing both 770 and 780 lightning's this series.


Well, it's not all that surprising when you consider that the 770 lightning is basically a 680 lightning with a different BIOS







Forum posts elsewhere also indicate that you can transform a 680 lightning to a 770 lightning as well - although, it isn't really necessary; the performance will be the same (assuming similar clockspeeds). It seems that the 770 lightning uses the 680 LN2 clockspeeds by default.

It was probably a relative easy business decision for MSI, given that nvidia allowed non reference 770s on day one.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> Interesting that they are doing both 770 and 780 lightning's this series.


I think the reason is because the 780 lightning will be the new twin frozr 5, and maybe some other differences here and there. And since the 770 is a 680, they already had the pcb ready.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cryosis00*
> 
> I thought the draw of cards like the Lightning series was the crazy overclocks you could achieve, but with the voltage control/locks Nvidia has on cards now, is there still a point to something like this?


Sure there is. With GPU Boost 2.0 you can get more power delivery to the card with an approved aftermarket cooler through the nvidia green-light program; Nvidia will allow MSI to have higher boost clockspeeds out of the box in addition to *higher overall power % available for use*. What this means is that when you're overclocking, you will not hit the TDP or temperature ceiling nearly as much as you would with say, a reference card.

Of particular importance is the power TDP ceiling - MSI will have more "wiggle room" so to speak in terms of having higher overall TDP available for overclocking the card.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Sure there is. With GPU Boost 2.0 you can get more power delivery to the card with an approved aftermarket cooler through the nvidia green-light program; Nvidia will allow MSI to have higher boost clockspeeds out of the box in addition to *higher overall power % available for use*. What this means is that when you're overclocking, you will not hit the TDP or temperature ceiling nearly as much as you would with say, a reference card.
> 
> Of particular importance is the power TDP ceiling - MSI will have more "wiggle room" so to speak in terms of having higher overall TDP available for overclocking the card.


Yeah this and the EVGA Classified Hydro will be the beasts to beat for 780s. Though there are unlocked bios' anyway lol


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## zeiferlance

this is just the card that I've been waiting for.
thanks for the info. will just wait for the specs and reviews then I'm sold.


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## driftingforlife

I know when it is coming, all i can say is its not a very long wait


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## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Sure there is. With GPU Boost 2.0 you can get more power delivery to the card with an approved aftermarket cooler through the nvidia green-light program; Nvidia will allow MSI to have higher boost clockspeeds out of the box in addition to *higher overall power % available for use*. What this means is that when you're overclocking, you will not hit the TDP or temperature ceiling nearly as much as you would with say, a reference card.
> 
> Of particular importance is the power TDP ceiling - MSI will have more "wiggle room" so to speak in terms of having higher overall TDP available for overclocking the card.


yea one of my 670 ftw hits the TDP with modded bios causing it to throttle down and that sucks because i can oc it to 1398mhz on the core but i hit the TDP.


----------



## hammerforged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I know when it is coming, all i can say is its not a long a very wait


How dare you tease us even more!


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## Eduardv

The King has arrived. yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I know when it is coming, all i can say is its not a very long wait


How long? Tell us ninja!!!!


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## Killa Cam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I know when it is coming, all i can say is its not a very long wait


. i just saw the newegg vid where they were at the msi booth talking about the card. rep said 2-3 months, is he wrong? can u at least let us know that it will be earlier than that? cmon bruh!


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## Killa Cam

ugh


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## driftingforlife

2-3 months is longer to what I know, but I might have been told when the samples are coming, not the sale date.


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## Killa Cam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> 2-3 months is longer to what I know, but I might have been told when the samples are coming, not the sale date.


i see. i hope u let us know how those samples go


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## mav1178

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> 2-3 months is longer to what I know, but I might have been told when the samples are coming, not the sale date.


Have to look at MSI's historical track record for Lightning Series:

GTX770 - same as launch due to identical GPU vs GTX680
GTX680: ~3 months post-launch (March > June 2012)
HD7970: ~3 months post-launch (Jan > March/April 2012)
GTX580: ~5 months post-launch (Nov 2010 > March 2011)
HD6970: ~5 months post-launch (Dec 2010 > April 2011)

So 2-3 months is not out of line given the Lightning series.
Trust me, I know... I launched this stuff for the last 3 years of my life.

-alex


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mav1178*
> 
> Have to look at MSI's historical track record for Lightning Series:
> 
> GTX770 - same as launch due to identical GPU vs GTX680
> GTX680: ~3 months post-launch (March > June 2012)
> HD7970: ~3 months post-launch (Jan > March/April 2012)
> GTX580: ~5 months post-launch (Nov 2010 > March 2011)
> HD6970: ~5 months post-launch (Dec 2010 > April 2011)
> 
> So 2-3 months is not out of line given the Lightning series.
> Trust me, I know... I launched this stuff for the last 3 years of my life.
> 
> -alex


Are you still at MSI? If not, why the change?


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## zulk

Will these cards have the ln2 bios and will they be able to clock high like the GTX 680 lightnings


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## mav1178

There is no "change"...

GTX770 = GTX680
So... since the 680 Lightning was already designed, and VRAM/GPU pinouts are the same, you just take PCB and slap on newer GPU (GK104-425 vs -400 I think for the 680) and new memory chips, and you can have a 770 Lightning with minimal R&D.

This reduces lead time.

Vendors sell reference PCB cards for a reason: there's ***zero*** validation needed since the GPU vendor already did all that. All they have to do is calibrate the manufacturing line properly for the design, and spot check for irregularities.

-alex


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seid Dark*
> 
> This will be too damn expensive but I still very much want one


Still be cheaper than the Titan. I want one!


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## PureBlackFire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mav1178*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> There is no "change"...
> 
> GTX770 = GTX680
> So... since the 680 Lightning was already designed, and VRAM/GPU pinouts are the same, you just take PCB and slap on newer GPU (GK104-425 vs -400 I think for the 680) and new memory chips, and you can have a 770 Lightning with minimal R&D.
> 
> This reduces lead time.
> 
> Vendors sell reference PCB cards for a reason: there's ***zero*** validation needed since the GPU vendor already did all that. All they have to do is calibrate the manufacturing line properly for the design, and spot check for irregularities.
> 
> -alex


I think he was talking about your possible career change Alex.


----------



## mav1178

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PureBlackFire*
> 
> I think he was talking about your possible career change Alex.


Why would I blab about my employment to people on the web? I left voluntarily, that's all that matters.

Plus, he quotes my entire post... and I reply accordingly.

For the record (and completely OT), I'm not at MSI anymore.

-alex


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mav1178*
> 
> Why would I blab about my employment to people on the web? I left voluntarily, that's all that matters.
> 
> Plus, he quotes my entire post... and I reply accordingly.
> 
> For the record (and completely OT), I'm not at MSI anymore.
> 
> -alex


Sorry, was easier to just quote the whole thing on my phone.

Didn't mean to come off asking anything deeper then job status. Just curious because you state how well you know the VGA food chain so to speak.


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## xoleras

Yeah, his employment is his personal business and thus not up for public discussion







I would expect the same level of discretion for anyone here - personal information is private information.

IMHO, it is nice to get insight from someone who has worked in the industry now and then.


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## ethan319

^

Let Twin Frozr V cools this hot summer!


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> . i just saw the newegg vid where they were at the msi booth talking about the card. rep said 2-3 months, is he wrong? can u at least let us know that it will be earlier than that? cmon bruh!


You bet I said 2 to 3 months!


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## navit

Tease!!


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## GenoOCAU

Will this be voltage unlocked.


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## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> Tease!!


No, teasing you would be saying that I just spent 45 minutes with the card in hand








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Will this be voltage unlocked.


We have to adhere to the same rules as everyone else

Will it allow you get more out of the GPU with the right knowledge and tools? Absolutely! It's a F'ing BEAST!


----------



## Killa Cam

will it still be yellow? i like yellow







. will it have blue leds? i hope not because it would conflict with the theme of my build







. is it possible for me to get an early review sample?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> will it still be yellow? i like yellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . will it have blue leds? i hope not because it would conflict with the theme of my build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . is it possible for me to get an early review sample?


I love Black and Yellow man







Don't worry there







This thing will still adhere to our color/segmentation:



And samples? they're mine! ... ALL MINE! hahah... ahem..


----------



## WhyCry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I love Black and Yellow man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't worry there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This thing will still adhere to our color/segmentation:
> 
> And samples? their mine! ... ALL MINE! hahah... ahem..


Nice avatar. When are you launching the GTX 780 Gaming?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WhyCry*
> 
> Nice avatar.


Thanks.. that's after a couple of beers at our Gaming party together with Steelseries at CeBIT when we launched our Z77 Gaming boards









Quote:


> When are you launching the GTX 780 Gaming?


This month







(soon(tm))


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> And samples? they're mine! ... ALL MINE! hahah... ahem..


To bad, im nicking one







maybe 2 if I can get away with it


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> To bad, im nicking one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maybe 2 if I can get away with it


Yeah, it actually helps us if not all of the samples are stacked on my desk


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## driftingforlife

I can't wait to get my sample


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I can't wait to get my sample


I'm pretty sure you can wait.. because you'll HAVE to wait









But don't worry, not even 8 Pack saw the card in real life when he was at the office here in Taiwan.... ... oh wait......


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## driftingforlife

Dammmmm youuuuuuuuuuuuuu


----------



## navit

Serious tease!!!

A little off topic but is Msi still making 7970 lightning's other than be editions.


----------



## Killa Cam

yall bringing back the hawks?


----------



## GenoOCAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> No, teasing you would be saying that I just spent 45 minutes with the card in hand
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We have to adhere to the same rules as everyone else
> 
> Will it allow you get more out of the GPU with the right knowledge and tools? Absolutely! It's a F'ing BEAST!


I remain skeptical regarding the likelyhood of a 680 Lightning-like voltage control on a GK110 die.

Though I do remain hopeful. Though your beating around the bush it would be nice for a Yes/no answer !


----------



## Stay Puft

GTX 760 Hawk would be very nice


----------



## StreekG

If they stick to black and yellow for the Lightning, it would be great if they at least make the PCB LEDs white instead of blue.

White LEDs would be more neutral and go with a lot more builds.

I had to run black electrical tape over the holes on the backplate where the LEDS shine through on my 680 Lightnings so it wouldn't conflict with G1 Assassin theme


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> A little off topic but is Msi still making 7970 lightning's other than be editions.


Not that I know of.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> yall bringing back the hawks?


Hawk is coming, I just can't say which models for this year.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Though your beating around the bush it would be nice for a Yes/no answer !


I'm not beating around the bush, I'm just saying that we officially have to stick to the same rules and regulations as everyone else.







But what is a Lightning without obscene amounts of potential?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StreekG*
> 
> If they stick to black and yellow for the Lightning, it would be great if they at least make the PCB LEDs white instead of blue.
> 
> White LEDs would be more neutral and go with a lot more builds.


I'll check what I can do.. though I must admit it fits soooo well in my NZXT Phantom White (where all LEDs are blue) .. previous Lightning cards had Red/Green LEDs and that conflicted a lot too ;p


----------



## Antistatic12

I wonder if there will be a Gamer series GTX780 as my build is red and black and a yellow and black Lightning would be out of place.
My other issue is a backplate. No backplate no deal, aesthetically for me it is a deal breaker. I know the Lightning would and looking at the gamer GTX770 it doesn't have one, so I am a bit worried.
Who ever comes out first will get my cash, either the Asus(DirectCU) or a MSI card.


----------



## GenoOCAU

Lmao. Evasive marketing! But I'm going to prevail, yes I acknowledge MSI have to adhere with the same restrictions as other partners - you won't need to mention this for my follow up question.

Question: Will the MSI GTX 780 Lightning have a voltage +mV slider in MSI Afterburner. A yes or no answer would be more then satisfactory, no further explanation needed.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Lmao. Evasive marketing! But I'm going to prevail, yes I acknowledge MSI have to adhere with the same restrictions as other partners - you won't need to mention this for my follow up question.
> 
> Question: Will the MSI GTX 780 Lightning have a voltage +mV slider in MSI Afterburner. A yes or no answer would be more then satisfactory, no further explanation needed.


It'll behave exactly the same as the regular GTX 780 which has +38mv.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Lmao. Evasive marketing! But I'm going to prevail, yes I acknowledge MSI have to adhere with the same restrictions as other partners - you won't need to mention this for my follow up question.


Lol, I just don't want to upset the green team








Quote:


> Question: Will the MSI GTX 780 Lightning have a voltage +mV slider in MSI Afterburner. A yes or no answer would be more then satisfactory, no further explanation needed.


Yes


----------



## GenoOCAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Lol, I just don't want to upset the green team
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes


Lol, thanks for being a good sport









Is there any way you can confirm/deny a +38mV limitation? Will the 780 lightning be able to offer more then +38mV?


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## GenoOCAU

This silence is incriminating!


----------



## zulk

wonder how these will overclock. If they do overclock anything like the other lightnings do this will be a better buy than the titans considering that it would be hitting 1300+


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zulk*
> 
> wonder how these will overclock. If they do overclock anything like the other lightnings do this will be a better buy than the titans considering that it would be hitting 1300+


The reference GTX 780 is a better buy than the GTX Titan for single screen users already... VRAM. You buy based on VRAM.


----------



## damnwebsite

looks like someone stole it


----------



## douglatins

If they take any longer i won't care anymore


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *douglatins*
> 
> If they take any longer i won't care anymore


LoL. Lightning has never been about first to the market, but best on the market. We are working on this card for over a year and if it doesn't meet your expected arrival date by a few weeks you "stop caring"?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> This silence is incriminating!


Yeah sorry, that was because I had a dinner and beer drinking contest after work.
Became the proud owner of a kick-ass Gaming notebook after that contest


----------



## GoldenTiger

Hey neilz.... does the gamer and/or lightning 780 have a different voltage controller than the reference one?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoldenTiger*
> 
> Hey neilz.... does the gamer and/or lightning 780 have a different voltage controller than the reference one?


The lightning has, for sure


----------



## Kitler

When is this coming out?

I need to replace my 7950


----------



## GenoOCAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Yeah sorry, that was because I had a dinner and beer drinking contest after work.
> Became the proud owner of a kick-ass Gaming notebook after that contest


You were eating dinner and drinking beer for 3 days?

Again youre being evasive, trying to throw me off by gloating over a notebook.

*Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*

I own two lightnings and loved MSI prior to my involvement with your evasive tactics and sheer word foreplay.

Going to ask the same question again with-in the same post so you dont miss it.

*Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*

Mandatory off topic statement: My cat has a fascination for plasic.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> You were eating dinner and drinking beer for 3 days?
> 
> Again youre being evasive, trying to throw me off by gloating over a notebook.
> 
> *Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*
> 
> I own two lightnings and loved MSI prior to my involvement with your evasive tactics and sheer word foreplay.
> 
> Going to ask the same question again with-in the same post so you dont miss it.
> 
> *Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*
> 
> Mandatory off topic statement: My cat has a fascination for plasic.


You won't see a higher voltage limit, but you will see a higher power limit.

Though since the evga classy 780 seems to have a plug for an evbot, who knows.


----------



## GenoOCAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> You won't see a higher voltage limit, but you will see a higher power limit.
> 
> Though since the evga classy 780 seems to have a plug for an evbot, who knows.


Given my limited understanding of Boost 2.0 doesn't raising the power limit directly effect voltage ceiling? Therefore meaning higher then reference limited power target = higher then reference voltage limit?


----------



## Faithh

Neliz aren't you agreeing it's taking way too long before we see a picture? Tell your bosses that it would be too late because everyone would buy the 780 dc2t.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Given my limited understanding of Boost 2.0 doesn't raising the power limit directly effect voltage ceiling? Therefore meaning higher then reference limited power target = higher then reference voltage limit?


Not exactly. Raising the power limit only allows a higher peak wattage. So what it does do is reduced power throttling allowing you to stay at the max overclock longer. It will allow cards to PC higher if they are hitting the max wattage and can clock higher at the same voltage.

It does not raise the voltage limit what so ever.


----------



## Bruennis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> *Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*


I'm pretty sure the 780 Lightning will be limited to Green Light's specifications BUT there are ways around this just as there are ways around it with the 770 Lightning and 680 Lightning


----------



## GenoOCAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bruennis*
> 
> I'm pretty sure the 780 Lightning will be limited to Green Light's specifications BUT there are ways around this just as there are ways around it with the 770 Lightning and 680 Lightning


People will have to Artmoney hack their 780 Lightnings?

Thanks for the explanation jomama.


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bruennis*
> 
> I'm pretty sure the 780 Lightning will be limited to Green Light's specifications BUT there are ways around this just as there are ways around it with the 770 Lightning and 680 Lightning


Exactly what I would assume as a VERY safe bet. I'm hoping the Gaming Edition will be like that too since the 770 one reportedly is







.


----------



## xoleras

IMHO, you all are thinking in the wrong terms. What differentiates aftermarket 780s is the ability to prevent throttling and to feed more power to the GPU - this is why the current aftermarket cards, despite being reference PCB, tend to overclock better. They are far better at throttle prevention. Also, GPU boost 2.0 is far better than GPU boost 1.0 in terms of converting available power / TDP headroom into performance and clockspeed stability - this is one behavior i've noticed going from 600 to 700 series GPUs. GPU Boost 2.0 converts power into performance/clockspeeds.

Presumably, the lightning will allow more power delivery and that translates into higher clockspeeds and no throttle, thus higher framerates. The old school way was over voltage, but it seems that all cards are limited to +37mV and that will not change. Again - the variables are different with GPU boost 2.0 Over-voltage is not one of those variables that can be tweaked - what CAN be tweaked through custom PCBs - Higher power delivery. More power phases for stability. Lower temperatures. No throttling. And FYI, the reference 780 does throttle quite incessantly when overclocked and will hit the power limit frequently. Heck, with ACX 780s you will be pegged near the 106% power limit if you over-clock the cards hard - This is not the case when a card has more breathing room in terms of power availability and lower temps. That is what the lightning will do. If you're expecting old school over-voltage ala the Fermi days, you'll probably be disappointed - I don't see that happening on any 780 card (aside from +37mV).


----------



## StreekG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> You were eating dinner and drinking beer for 3 days?
> 
> Again youre being evasive, trying to throw me off by gloating over a notebook.
> 
> *Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*
> 
> I own two lightnings and loved MSI prior to my involvement with your evasive tactics and sheer word foreplay.


Hey Geno,

It's probably not so much as playing with words, but more along the lines of not being allowed to talk too much about the card right now. Seeing as we haven't even seen pics of this yet. Just that we know one is in the works









I really want to know about this card too but I respect that we just have to wait.


----------



## xoleras

Also, what he just said, GENO. I'm not trying to be rude, but in my opinion you should really respect the fact that he probably is not allowed to do a full disclosure at this point, and not incessantly ask him questions that he cannot answer yet - the product isn't released yet. You know, NDAs exist and i'm sure there are repercussions for him if he spells out too much. Disclosing too much information would also presumably give competitors information that MSI would not want them to have - this is why specs are not released until very close to product release. When a competitor gets inside information that they shouldn't necessarily have, they definitely will react with their own unreleased product. Let's say that one upcoming card is binned at 1202MHz. What if EVGA finds out? They will find a way to out-do it prior to their release. This is why NDAs exist - which is why you should show more discretion with the questions. Everything in good time.


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> IMHO, you all are thinking in the wrong terms. What differentiates aftermarket 780s is the ability to prevent throttling and to feed more power to the GPU - this is why the current aftermarket cards, despite being reference PCB, tend to overclock better. They are far better at throttle prevention. Also, GPU boost 2.0 is far better than GPU boost 1.0 in terms of converting available power / TDP headroom into performance and clockspeed stability - this is one behavior i've noticed going from 600 to 700 series GPUs. GPU Boost 2.0 converts power into performance/clockspeeds.
> 
> Presumably, the lightning will allow more power delivery and that translates into higher clockspeeds and no throttle, thus higher framerates. The old school way was over voltage, but it seems that all cards are limited to +37mV and that will not change. Again - the variables are different with GPU boost 2.0 Over-voltage is not one of those variables that can be tweaked - what CAN be tweaked through custom PCBs - Higher power delivery. More power phases for stability. Lower temperatures. No throttling. And FYI, the reference 780 does throttle quite incessantly when overclocked and will hit the power limit frequently. Heck, with ACX 780s you will be pegged near the 106% power limit if you over-clock the cards hard - This is not the case when a card has more breathing room in terms of power availability and lower temps. That is what the lightning will do. If you're expecting old school over-voltage ala the Fermi days, you'll probably be disappointed - I don't see that happening on any 780 card (aside from +37mV).


Yeah, I think you're right to an extent actually, I've noticed that with my ACX higher fan is affecting things clock/stability-wise, presumably by bumping the power draw down thanks to lower temps etc. Seeing great performance with a moderate fan speed and 1.162v + 1176mhz core for example even. I'd be surprised if we don't see an ArtMoney-style hack for the 780 lightning, given that we have for the 770 already, though. That said, all going from 1.162v ---> 1.2125v does for me is add a TON of heat and get me to 1202mhz 24/7 stable, instead of 1176. So I'm not sure voltage is really going to be what affects much unless you're hardmodding, right now, and using higher-end cooling than just the non-ref air coolers.

Frankly I was pretty much set to sell off my 780 ACX (with the TI bios it isn't hitting power limit at all and never throttling) and had my eyes set on high volts, but without going water/better I'd just add a ton of noise which I don't want, if I were to get much better of a 24/7 oc. And that's assuming we could even add enough volts to make it stable. Overall I'd say power phases + quality is what will result in a better OC with these cards for people, but only with water for anything appreciable.

And your note about not pushing for info that can't be given is definitely correct... let's not bleed the rock dry guys, nor make it unpleasant for people under NDA to give us small hints that they can.







It's not nice to read a million requests for detailed info when under an NDA, I know that personally







.


----------



## GTR Mclaren

teased or stolen xD


----------



## hammerforged

Yeah I would hate to see this thread go down the road that the 680 lightning went with all the haggling Msi-Alex had to put up with.

It will be here when its ready


----------



## jomama22

You guys are making this way more complicated then it needs to be.

You get throttled because:A: you hit a temp limit; B:you hit a power limit.

There is no raising voltage beyond .37v without hard mod (though evbot may change this on the classy)

Raising power limit allows more sustained max clock and MAY allow more oc if the chip can still get some hz at the same max voltage.

Temp limit can be helped with water or max fan. Will help throttling if temp throttling is what is occurring.

That's boost 2.0 in a nutshell.


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> You were eating dinner and drinking beer for 3 days?
> 
> Again youre being evasive, trying to throw me off by gloating over a notebook.
> 
> *Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*
> 
> I own two lightnings and loved MSI prior to my involvement with your evasive tactics and sheer word foreplay.
> 
> Going to ask the same question again with-in the same post so you dont miss it.
> 
> *Will the 780 Lightning be limited to Green Light's +38mV OR will it be able to offer a full +100mV on top of reference 780's?*
> 
> Mandatory off topic statement: My cat has a fascination for plasic.


He is not allowed to say, so stop.


----------



## Magnum26

So how long do I have to wait till I can get a GTX 780 Gaming? Will it be this month?


----------



## navit

My guess is July sometime.


----------



## GenoOCAU

To everyone defending him, why couldn't he stop beating around the bush and directly say, 'I actually can't say for sure due to NDA'. I would have more respect for truth over, 'Beer, chics and notebooks - what was your question again?'

Also cheers Dad err I mean drifting, point wasn't taken from the previous posts telling me to back off.

/pointtaken.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> To everyone defending him, why couldn't he stop beating around the bush and directly say, 'I actually can't say for sure due to NDA'. I would have more respect for truth over, 'Beer, chics and notebooks - what was your question again?'
> 
> Also cheers Dad err I mean drifting, point wasn't taken from the previous posts telling me to back off.
> 
> /pointtaken.


As a rule of thumb... Launch is at launch.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Going to ask the same question again with-in the same post so you dont miss it.


So, regarding me being evasive:

Read my first response to your question if this is voltage unlocked and check the link, install that version of Afterburner and see if you're getting more mV on your slider.

Regarding GreenLight, yes, all our cards will be verified by the GL program (like the 670 PE last year







)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> To everyone defending him, why couldn't he stop beating around the bush .


Because me pointing you to that link is already more than I actually SHOULD do. There are things I can tell you face to face, but not when the whole world is watching.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magnum26*
> 
> So how long do I have to wait till I can get a GTX 780 Gaming? Will it be this month?


I said before "later this month" .. and that day is.. TODAY








http://www.techpowerup.com/185899/msi-unveils-geforce-gtx-780-gaming.html

And yes, it is pretty pointless to ask exact information regarding unreleased/unannounced products. We are not at liberty to tell, we can only drop hints we hope you can pick up.

And as much as I wish, I am also not able to browse forums 24/7, This has everything to do with spending the past few months working 16 hours/day on our Z87 boards and when it is weekend, I like to spend that with my wife and kids (or girlfriend!







) since I'm not a "com
munity manager".. I'm just a guy _from_ the community working at MSI.

If I do have time besides Drinking beer and eating after work, you can find me on the NA LOL servers as "ILoveBlurrz" or on the EUW server as "Fleischbaum" when I'm back in Europe in July.


----------



## zed1

TODAY??


----------



## Tippy

Hmmm this or Asus DCII....


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I said before "later this month" .. and that day is.. TODAY
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.techpowerup.com/185899/msi-unveils-geforce-gtx-780-gaming.html


I can understand that







, I can't wait for these to hit the online shops so I can order 2 for my new setup! As they have been released today will they be in the shops from today or sometime later on in the next two weeks?


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tippy*
> 
> Hmmm this or Asus DCII....


Two of these clearly looks a lot nicer than the Asus ones and probably runs cooler.


----------



## zed1

Ah,i was thinking it was today for the "Lightning" one,but now i see the link from neliz,and realise it's just the "Gaming" one.
Ok,i'll wait ,maybe it'll be for august or september,time to save money for 2,and october for a more powerful psu than my 850w,i can imagine 850w is just short for 2 high end GPUs,but without overclocking(CPU+GPU).


----------



## Killa Cam

im hoping for august. any later just aint meant to be


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> install that version of Afterburner and see if you're getting more mV on your slider.


Interesting.


----------



## MerkageTurk

there is nothing in the white box lol


----------



## Mongol

My body is ready.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MerkageTurk*
> 
> there is nothing in the white box lol


There actually was, but only a hand-full of people have seen the final PCB and even less our new thermal design








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> im hoping for august. any later just aint meant to be


I'm doing better than hoping


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> There actually was, but only a hand-full of people have seen the final PCB *and even less our new thermal design*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm doing better than hoping


Will 3-Way SLI get decent temps with the Twin Frozr V ( with good airflow and assuming they're not sandwiched together ) ? Not keen on spending an extra 350 € on water blocks right away.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Interesting.


Erm what? What version are we speaking of!


----------



## zed1

@TormenteD
i really like your avatar.


----------



## Magnum26

Do the Gaming edition MSI cards blow air into the case? So if in SLI wouldn't the bottom card get a lot hotter than the other? To me this would cause a heat issue....


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magnum26*
> 
> Do the Gaming edition MSI cards blow air into the case? So if in SLI wouldn't the bottom card get a lot hotter than the other? To me this would cause a heat issue....


Some air does circulate in the case, but about 50% is still exhausted from the rear (unlike windforce or DCU.)

On the other hand, if you DO have an SLI setup, but you have no airflow in your case because you skimped on a $10 intake/exhaust fan, I think there are other worries as well.

Additionally, heat rises up, a bottom card would always run cooler than a top card because of basic physics.


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Some air does circulate in the case, but about 50% is still exhausted from the rear (unlike windforce or DCU.)
> 
> On the other hand, if you DO have an SLI setup, but you have no airflow in your case because you skimped on a $10 intake/exhaust fan, I think there are other worries as well.
> 
> Additionally, heat rises up, a bottom card would always run cooler than a top card because of basic physics.


Good point. Would I be better off with the stock MSI cards instead then if I plan to SLI or would the gaming 780s be better even though they part exhaust into the case. I plan on going with a Define R4 case. 2 x 140mm in front, 1 x 140mm on back and a H100I in the roof (2x 120mm), maybe a 140mm in the bottom if I have room once I install my H1000W psu.

I'd love to get the gaming cards to match the GD65 motherboard I'm planning on getting, but only if heat isn't a major issue.

Thoughts?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magnum26*
> 
> Thoughts?


I think the temperature headroom on the card is large enough to not run into throttling issues and since there is enough spacing between the cards (3 slots between 1st and 2nd PEGx16) it shouldn't be an issue, especially with plenty of airflow from your fans.


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I think the temperature headroom on the card is large enough to not run into throttling issues and since there is enough spacing between the cards (3 slots between 1st and 2nd PEGx16) it shouldn't be an issue, especially with plenty of airflow from your fans.


Thanks very much for your input. 2 gaming GTX 780s it is then.

Any idea when we can expect these to hit the shelves?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magnum26*
> 
> Thanks very much for your input. 2 gaming GTX 780s it is then.
> 
> Any idea when we can expect these to hit the shelves?


Kindly check with your local retailler, they should be available (and shipping) in Europe this week.


----------



## kzinti1

MSI just released this: http://www.guru3d.com/news_story/msi_geforce_gtx_780_gaming_edition_released.html
I wonder if this isn't what's mistaken for an MSI GTX780 Lightning?
Why is MSI always so late with new cards built with their own special touches?
If they came out at a reasonable time their brand would always be my top choice in videocards.


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Kindly check with your local retailler, they should be available (and shipping) in Europe:


That link is for the 770 gaming I'm after the 780 gaming


----------



## svenge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Kindly check with your local retailler, they should be available (and shipping) in Europe:


That link you posted is for their *770 Gaming Series*, not the 780. I don't think that the 780 Gaming Series (N780 TF 3GD5/OC) has hit stores yet.


----------



## neliz

Yeah sorry, bad link, this is for the Netherlands:

http://nl.hardware.info/productinfo/192888/msi-n780-tf-3gd5oc


----------



## flotrollet

How large will the cooler for the 780 Lightning be?
I'm planning on SLI in a mATX build (Maximus V Gene, Fractal Define Mini) so smaller would obviously be better.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flotrollet*
> 
> How large will the cooler for the 780 Lightning be?
> I'm planning on SLI in a mATX build (Maximus V Gene, Fractal Define Mini) so smaller would obviously be better.


If only I could tell you that


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Yeah sorry, bad link, this is for the Netherlands:
> 
> http://nl.hardware.info/productinfo/192888/msi-n780-tf-3gd5oc


Thanks, but when clicking through none of the retailers actually have the correct card. Lol.

Guess I'll have to keep waiting for the UK to actually get some.


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flotrollet*
> 
> How large will the cooler for the 780 Lightning be?
> I'm planning on SLI in a mATX build (Maximus V Gene, Fractal Define Mini) so smaller would obviously be better.


I would put a guess as the same as the Gaming edition cards but in yellow with maybe some extra heatpipes and some nice yellow leds or something.


----------



## svenge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flotrollet*
> 
> How large will the cooler for the 780 Lightning be?
> I'm planning on SLI in a mATX build (Maximus V Gene, Fractal Define Mini) so smaller would obviously be better.


Hard to say for certain. I do have the sizes of other similar MSI models, and from there some generalizations can be made:

770 Lightning: 280mm (L) x 129mm (H) x 49mm (D) [depth includes "GPU Reactor"]
770 Gaming: 260 x 126 x 38
780 Gaming: 266 x 129 x 38

Based on the other cards I listed, a reasonable estimate would be 290mm (L) x 130mm (H) x 49mm (D)


----------



## Rei86

Subbed for more info and launch [email protected]@! ARAGEHAIEFWAIKJFEWIKJFAW GIB 780 LIGHTNING x3 NOW!


----------



## zealord

Any new pieces of information out yet?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> Any new pieces of information out yet?


Not much









Maybe there are some indirect questions I can answer?


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Not much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe there are some indirect questions I can answer?


Release date or even when you will have an annoucment for the the GTX 780 Lightning would be nice

Chomping at the bits here for some info as I'm ready to purchase either three EVGA GTX 780 Classified or MSI GTX 780 Lightnings.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Release date or even when you will have an annoucment for the the GTX 780 Lightning would be nice
> 
> Chomping at the bits here for some info as I'm ready to purchase either three EVGA GTX 780 Classified or MSI GTX 780 Lightnings.


You know I can't give a release date, but early next month you will see the first official tidbits and the launch is most likely in August (notwithstanding any last-minute changes to the PCB as a result from the LN2 tests)

but I've seen the 780 classified ... and honestly, Lightning is in a completely different league.


----------



## driftingforlife

^where is my invite for the LN2 testing?


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You know I can't give a release date, but early next month you will see the first official tidbits and the launch is most likely in August (notwithstanding any last-minute changes to the PCB as a result from the LN2 tests)
> 
> but I've seen the 780 classified ... and honestly, Lightning is in a completely different league.


Any news on the GTX 780 gaming yet as to when the UK can expect to get it?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magnum26*
> 
> Any news on the GTX 780 gaming yet as to when the UK can expect to get it?


That question is still best answered by your local retailer.


----------



## StreekG

First question "RELEASE DATE PLZ"









This will tie in to about a year exactly from when i bought my 2 680 Lightnings


----------



## zed1

Time for me to change my GTX 580 Lightning Extreme Edition 3GB,i'm curious to know the performance difference between the 580 (lightning) and the 780 (lightning),and between the 580 (lightning) and the 780 lightning (SLI).
For now i think the most powerfull 780 is the EVGA SC ACX,but i believe in the Lightning series.That's why i'm still waiting,i almost got all the money,and the more i wait ,more i save money.
One question for neliz:
How much power supply for 2 MSI GTX 780 Lightning (SLI)?


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ladcrooks*
> 
> Was thinking about one of these myself
> 
> But then I saw this
> http://s1234.photobucket.com/user/ladcrooks/media/LL_zps8dc9438b.jpg.html
> 
> What do you think?


If you compare the picture from the post#1 with this one (open 2 tabs on your screen ),you can see it's the same picture,only the letters are differents.


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You know I can't give a release date, but early next month you will see the first official tidbits and the launch is most likely in August (notwithstanding any last-minute changes to the PCB as a result from the LN2 tests)
> 
> but I've seen the 780 classified ... and honestly, Lightning is in a completely different league.


Well, then it looks like EVGA is getting my money. A completely different league? Yeah, maybe for overclockers who are using LN2 cooling and other shenanigans. The Lightning would have to be the greatest custom card ever to make it worth the super long wait. Not to mention the additional wait since America always gets everything first..


----------



## Magnum26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> That question is still best answered by your local retailer.


Which are as helpful as having no hands. Google searching turns up ZERO results for the UK.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magnum26*
> 
> Which are as helpful as having no hands. Google searching turns up ZERO results for the UK.


I'd say by the end of the first week of July. They were just "released" 6 days ago. Its up to the retailers to have them in stock and list them. I don't see a hard release date for these for any part of the world.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You know I can't give a release date, but early next month you will see the first official tidbits and the launch is most likely in August (notwithstanding any last-minute changes to the PCB as a result from the LN2 tests)
> 
> but I've seen the 780 classified ... and honestly, Lightning is in a completely different league.


Not a LN2 OCer so that part doesn't matter to me, but I know it does for extreme OCers.

If the 780L is anything like the 680L where they could hit 1300Mhzish...on air alone your company has my money. But a wait till August....damn.... I'm unloading the Titan's this week and I'll be with only a single 780


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> The Lightning would have to be the greatest custom card ever to make it worth the super long wait.


For sure
Quote:


> Not to mention the additional wait since America always gets everything first..


That's not really the case








First shipments leave our factory in China by Airplane and should arrive in both US and EU hub at about the same time. largest part of the shipment goes to the EU though.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> Well, then it looks like EVGA is getting my money. A completely different league? Yeah, maybe for overclockers who are using LN2 cooling and other shenanigans. The Lightning would have to be the greatest custom card ever to make it worth the super long wait. Not to mention the additional wait since America always gets everything first..


That's exactly what the Lightning is designed for, and in that respect it has always been better than the classified (IMO) unless you wanted a reference shroud. Well, the classified 780 will not be using the reference shroud this time around so even that advantage (if you consider it one, I don't...) is gone.

The lightning line has always been designed for world records and extreme options for extreme overclockers. This also translates to excellent air overclocking as well - which is why I have always loved the Lightning line. As far as being worth the wait...well, that's a personal decision.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> A completely different league? Yeah, maybe for overclockers who are using LN2 cooling and other shenanigans.


I just re-read that line again "Overclockers who are using LN2 cooling and other shenanigans" May I remind you that the sole purpose of the inception of Lighting *IS* those overclockers?


----------



## Alatar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I just re-read that line again "Overclockers who are using LN2 cooling and other shenanigans" May I remind you that the sole purpose of the inception of Lighting *IS* those overclockers?










Good to see you guys still have your priorities in check


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Alatar*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good to see you guys still have your priorities in check


It's the simple reason we have different segments









The amount of WORK that goes into a Lightning card (perceived as a _delay_) is to get those extra MHz out of a card, to make sure it's Voltage to the GPU stays rock stable, to make an overclocker smile when he boots the card for the first time and realizes he has the fastest 780 on the planet (yes, this just happened







)

All that work that goes into it, is basically "wasted" if you just use it with the stock cooler. Yes, a Lightning will still be a fast (the fastest?) air-cooled card as well. but are those MHz difference worth it stepping up from, say, the 780 GAMING?

It's not that I want to discourage people from buying a Lightning, far from it, having one is an awesome experience.. but these cards just BEG for cold..


----------



## TormenteD

neliz, you do however realise that the majority of people interested in buying a Lightning are gamers (or enthusiasts, really)? The sole purpose of getting a Lightning is because it's faster than other cards and overclocks better.. it's simple.. why buy one card when another is faster. There are people who play at 2560x1440 or higher resolutions and those are the areas where you really need to squeeze the last MHz out of your card. It's pointless to market something as a product targeted at people who don't even pay for their hardware in the first place (since you're talking fastest 780 on the planet). In that respect it's actually very much like ROG..


----------



## Alatar

I assure you a lot of benchers pay for their own hardware.

As proof I have an empty wallet.

The thing however is that if you're a gamer who overclocks his cards on air you don't need the extreme power delivery systems etc. to reach the max clocks of the GPU found in your card. Of course everyone can buy these cards but there's no point in making them for gaming purpose as gamers wont see the benefit. The card is aimed at the people who will actually benefit from the added features and all that. If MSI aimed this card at gamers it wouldn't be the same lightning anymore.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> neliz, you do however realise that the majority of people interested in buying a Lightning are gamers (or enthusiasts, really)?


Yes, I like to see myself as one of them. I had a 580 Lightning and it was honestly a freaking waste of the card since all it did in my PC was play Company of Heroes or Bad Company 2 at that time.
I sold it to.. an overclocker









I absolutely loved that card, but seeing what other people can do with it I realized that I'd just need a "good enough" card.
Quote:


> The sole purpose of getting a Lightning is because it's faster than other cards and overclocks better.. it's simple.. why buy one card when another is faster.


Yes, I also confirmed that previously, the extremely good air-cooled performance is another benefit of that card. But we have other products that can run in that race as well, cost less and are available earlier. If you simply want the best of the best, you will wait until that card is there (or upgrade, once it becomes available) otherwise it comes down to personal choice out of the usual suspects.
Quote:


> There are people who play at 2560x1440 or higher resolutions and those are the areas where you really need to squeeze the last MHz out of your card.


Be honest with me here, on a card that clocks way over 1 GHz, even 50MHz is not going to a dealbreaker when it comes to playable FPS, right? (at least not for me at that resolution.) More is generally better, but sometimes just _more_ isn't enough. Now these LN2 overclockers on the other hand, they'll give their left nut for a card that clocks 50 MHz higher than the rest








Quote:


> It's pointless to market something as a product targeted at people who don't even pay for their hardware in the first place (since you're talking fastest 780 on the planet).


Uhm, who ever told you that overclockers never pay for their hardware? These overclockers are the guys that make other people go insane when the card is not in stock, because they buy them *in multitudes* at a distributor!
Quote:


> In that respect it's actually very much like ROG..


You'd have to elaborate on that, please.


----------



## MrMarauder

All this talk about the Lightning series being for extreme overclockers is valid, but there is a market out there for users who want a healthy overclock with superb factory cooling, and are willing to pay a little extra for it.

Case in point, after I bought two 680 Lightnings and put them underwater for my main rig, I wanted a card for my portable gaming computer. Given the 680 Lightning was just about the only 680 on the market that allowed overvolting and the Twin Frozr IV is an excellent cooler, I bought one, left it stock, overclocked it to ~1400 Mhz, and now have a stock 680 that can reach clocks most only dream of. Still had the best 680 on the market, without the need to put it on LN2 or water.


----------



## navit

^^^^ This


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> All this talk about the Lightning series being for extreme overclockers is valid, but there is a market out there for users who want a healthy overclock with superb factory cooling, and are willing to pay a little extra for it.
> 
> Case in point, after I bought two 680 Lightnings and put them underwater for my main rig, I wanted a card for my portable gaming computer. Given the 680 Lightning was just about the only 680 on the market that allowed overvolting and the Twin Frozr IV is an excellent cooler, I bought one, left it stock, overclocked it to ~1400 Mhz, and now have a stock 680 that can reach clocks most only dream of. Still had the best 680 on the market, without the need to put it on LN2 or water.


Which was the only point I was trying to make.

Anyway, if it's gonna be early August then I'm sold. Not gonna lie, this is shaping up to be an epic card. Hopefully there'll be water blocks for it. Sadly, Aqua Computer have told me they will not be making any.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> Which was the only point I was trying to make.
> 
> Anyway, if it's gonna be early August then I'm sold. Not gonna lie, this is shaping up to be an epic card. Hopefully there'll be water blocks for it. Sadly, Aqua Computer have told me they will not be making any.


Why? So is EK the only ones?


----------



## TormenteD

^ No idea. Probably due to lack of demand or other economic reasons. Yeah, EK is most likely the only company. I can't think of anyone else who made blocks for the 680 Lightning besides EK and Aqua Computer. I've heard they're quite popular in the US but personally I have no experience with their products. The cooler is supposedly very good but I'm not sure how far you could push a Lightning on air compared to a reference card under water.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> ^ No idea. Probably due to lack of demand or other economic reasons. Yeah, EK is most likely the only company. I can't think of anyone else who made blocks for the 680 Lightning besides EK and Aqua Computer. I've heard they're quite popular in the US but personally I have no experience with their products. The cooler is supposedly very good but I'm not sure how far you could push a Lightning on air compared to a reference card under water.


EK's a good company and usually the 1st out of the gates with GPU water blocks vs others.


----------



## Frankzro

I wonder if the 780GTX is faster than my MSI Lightning GTX 580s in SLi


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> EK's a good company and usually the 1st out of the gates with GPU water blocks vs others.


I checked out their website and they seem to have a pretty wide product range. Fairly certain they'll make a block for the Lightning, I might ask to make sure.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> I checked out their website and they seem to have a pretty wide product range. Fairly certain they'll make a block for the Lightning, I might ask to make sure.


Email them about a block as it is a popularity contests for what they make. I emailed them in march 2012 about a 7970 LNG block and it was being drawn out so to speak....block came out July/Aug 2012, about 3-4 months after the card. The 680 LNG blocks were ready pretty soon after probably because the two PCBs were very similar.


----------



## TormenteD

^ Good to know, ty. I just sent them a product proposal. Hopefully they'll make it happen.


----------



## stilllogicz

The question for me remains, 780 Classy or 780 lightning for watercooling, no LN2. Strictly for gaming, no benching.


----------



## zealord

how about you MSI guys start early with the GTX 880 Lightning. As soon as you can I mean. Eager to buy that one next year


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> The question for me remains, 780 Classy or 780 lightning for watercooling, no LN2. Strictly for gaming, no benching.


Likely pretty comparable. Both cards have the beefed up power delivery, the main advantages of Lightnings are software voltage instead of evbot voltage (no need to solder a port on the lightning or buy the evbot), & for competition. MSI sponsors several competitions every year, Evga doesn't, so a lot of benchers prefer the Lightnings.


----------



## Alatar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> The question for me remains, 780 Classy or 780 lightning for watercooling, no LN2. Strictly for gaming, no benching.


Save money and don't get either as you wont be seeing a difference unless you bench. Just get a normal 780 with good aftermarket cooling.


----------



## FtW 420

^ This too. For air & water cooling, it is more about luck in the silicon lottery than the ability to push more juice through the core.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ^ This too. For air & water cooling, it is more about luck in the silicon lottery than the ability to push more juice through the core.


Yup. Unless you plan to actually use the unlocked features and push current/voltage at higher levels, you will still be dependent on this. But it is none the less a sweet PCB to own lol. I love mine, never been under ln2 (maybe once I get my next series) but I still love them and push them pretty hard (thanks art money).


----------



## TormenteD




----------



## StreekG

I wonder how much quieter TF-V will be then TF-IV
2 GTX 680 + H100 + Haf X

Surprised the case doesn't lift off the ground while i'm gaming.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*


The more people to email the better chance you have. Its what happened with the 7970 LNG as well.

I doubt it will be quieter tbh.


----------



## TormenteD

^ Apparently there's some kind of platform as well where you can vote for new products.
http://thinkcell.ekwb.com/idea/msi-780-lighting-water-blocks

I imagine it'll take at least a hundred votes for them to even consider it. Then another few months to make the block. At this point the Classy HC seems like the best alternative.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> ^ Apparently there's some kind of platform as well where you can vote for new products.
> http://thinkcell.ekwb.com/idea/msi-780-lighting-water-blocks
> 
> I imagine it'll take at least a hundred votes for them to even consider it. Then another few months to make the block. At this point the Classy HC seems like the best alternative.


But if the rumors are true about the EVGA 780 Classified, the EVBot only allowing for upping the power target is true...than forget it.


----------



## TormenteD

If that's true, then essentially the two best 780's are useless for enthusiasts lol. Obviously it's not MSI's fault that no one is making a water block this time around but it greatly limits the potential of the card.


----------



## EVGA-JacobF

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> But if the rumors are true about the EVGA 780 Classified, the EVBot only allowing for upping the power target is true...than forget it.


Not true.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EVGA-JacobF*
> 
> Not true.


I like this response.


----------



## TormenteD

Well, that's a load off my mind.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EVGA-JacobF*
> 
> Not true.


Wish you would answered this on the actually thread on the EVGA forum >.>

+1 rep


----------



## HHawk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Wish you would answered this on the actually thread on the EVGA forum.


Well EVGA seems to answer hardly any questions on their own forums nowadays...
However if something "bad" is said about EVGA on a different forum, they will act immediately. Strange and disappointing.


----------



## TormenteD

An EK official stated they will not decide on making a block for the Lightning before 6-8 weeks. Seems they're too busy making blocks for all the Asus boards and inferior 700 series cards.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> how about you MSI guys start early with the GTX 880 Lightning. As soon as you can I mean. Eager to buy that one next year


We've been busy with the 780 Design for over a year, I'm not even sure how we could start earlier than actually designing the board for NVIDIA.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StreekG*
> 
> I wonder how much quieter TF-V will be then TF-IV


Quieter and cooler, much, much cooler.


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> We've been busy with the 780 Design for over a year, I'm not even sure how we could start earlier than actually designing the board for NVIDIA.


So you are soon going to start for the GTX 880? Nice one mate


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zealord*
> 
> So you are soon going to start for the GTX 880? Nice one mate


"going to start" ?


----------



## AJR1775

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> We've been busy with the 780 Design for over a year, I'm not even sure how we could start earlier than actually designing the board for NVIDIA.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quieter and cooler, much, much cooler.


Damn. I'm about to pull the trigger on the MSI TF4 GTX 780.....do you think the TF5 is worth the wait?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AJR1775*
> 
> Damn. I'm about to pull the trigger on the MSI TF4 GTX 780.....do you think the TF5 is worth the wait?


We won't have "normal" cards with the new cooler, heck even the new Hawk will still be with the current Twin Frozr. I think for everyday use, you'd just be happy with the GTX 780 Gaming.

When the time is there, you can always sell and get a new card, right? I need to find something clever in the Batman line that it's not the Graphics Card that you need, but it's the card that you deserve. or want.. yes... combine it with Star Trek.

The needs of the many outweigh the hero Gotham deserves.


----------



## lroy

hey neliz can you please tell me whats going on here,
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/708/qth4.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/41/3rb.png/
top one is from guru3d review, bottom one is from msi website,notice pcb at rear on top one is different looks like a titan pcb. they are both gtx 780's.cheers.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lroy*
> 
> hey neliz can you please tell me whats going on here,
> they are both gtx 780's.cheers


No, they're not both 780's, check the pictures for the 760, 770 and 780 Gaming on our website and let me know if you can differences.

The pic on the website are shared because of the cooler design and the web team not having updated the pics yet.


----------



## James296

nevermind, was ninja'd


----------



## lroy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> No, they're not both 780's, check the pictures for the 760, 770 and 780 Gaming on our website and let me know if you can differences.
> 
> The pic on the website are shared because of the cooler design and the web team not having updated the pics yet.


understood thanks for clearing that up, pick of 780 on web site is a gtx 760. is it a titan pcb on the 780.


----------



## StreekG

Awesome knowing the TF-5 will be for the lightning only







well for now anyway


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> Well, then it looks like EVGA is getting my money. A completely different league? Yeah, maybe for overclockers who are using LN2 cooling and other shenanigans. The Lightning would have to be the greatest custom card ever to make it worth the super long wait. Not to mention the additional wait since America always gets everything first..


To be fair, the 680 Lightning was the "greatest custom card ever" of the 680s. There were 1300-1400+ MHz clocks pretty often.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CrazyElf*
> 
> To be fair, the 680 Lightning was the "greatest custom card ever" of the 680s. There were 1300-1400+ MHz clocks pretty often.


If artmoney/voltage control worked on every card, it would of pretty much been even across the board. Thats the only reason you see 680 lngs consistently higher then most. The OG classy 680 with evbot control did the exact same clocks. The gigabyte SOC 680 with the ln2 button could also be used with artmoney, and achieved similar clocks as well.


----------



## MrMarauder

Not all of the success of the Lightning can be attributed to the Art money hack. I achieved nearly 1400 MHz without it. Excellent and stable voltage delivery really helped for pushing those high clocks/voltage. Not to mention, there was no thermal throttling on the Lightning as found on other 680 cards.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> If artmoney/voltage control worked on every card, it would of pretty much been even across the board. Thats the only reason you see 680 lngs consistently higher then most. The OG classy 680 with evbot control did the exact same clocks. The gigabyte SOC 680 with the ln2 button could also be used with artmoney, and achieved similar clocks as well.


the thing is that a Lightning card does clock faster, on average. HWBOT stats are a good way to go buy. Even in the hands of skilled overclockers, nothing beats a good designed card.

Using things like an external PWM will give you more noisy power and bigger vdroop meaning less stability when you start benching on high clocks (1800+MHz currently)


----------



## Jared Pace

Hello Neliz, When are you guys going to do a full GK110 'Titan Ultra' with fully unlocked Kepler cores on a MSI Lightning designed PCB?


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jared Pace*
> 
> Hello Neliz, When are you guys going to do a full GK110 'Titan Ultra' with fully unlocked Kepler cores on a MSI Lightning designed PCB?


I'd imagine he's forbidden from releasing details about upcoming products/services.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> If artmoney/voltage control worked on every card, it would of pretty much been even across the board. Thats the only reason you see 680 lngs consistently higher then most. The OG classy 680 with evbot control did the exact same clocks. The gigabyte SOC 680 with the ln2 button could also be used with artmoney, and achieved similar clocks as well.


I'm not so sure about that. The PCB of the reference cards, I suspect would strain under the very high voltages. We're talking ~1,400 MHz on a day to day use card, perhaps even in SLI as well. As has been pointed out, MSI's advantage is the power delivery to the physical chip. If you tried to do that type of overclocking on a reference card, I suspect that there would be the danger that the VRMs might blow up. Power consumption goes up very quickly when you're talking about these types of overclocks. Furthermore, you'd have the issue of throttling, which the Lightnings did not do.

That said, I am not surprised that other well made custom PCBs could achieve good results as well. It's just that I doubt that the reference board can do it for a 24-7 overclock.


----------



## zed1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=INy7m0nhb8A


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jared Pace*
> 
> Hello Neliz, When are you guys going to do a full GK110 'Titan Ultra' with fully unlocked Kepler cores on a MSI Lightning designed PCB?


No, its not allowed.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> No, its not allowed.


Yes, these cards will not see retail.


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=INy7m0nhb8A


wat.. if it's month first for US that means something is gonna happen today, right? Surely it's not the release date, that would be crazy.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> wat.. if it's month first for US that means something is gonna happen today, right? Surely it's not the release date, that would be crazy.


The YouTube video doesn't contain the whole message:

"Dark clouds are gathering, we can hear a thunderous rumble here at the office, can you guess what we'll be announcing soon?"


----------



## Lukas026

stop teasing...give us the card already









nah just kidding take your time MSI and make some great card(s) - again !

btw I am from europe so I will get my Lightning later than ppl in US I guess


----------



## StreekG

So when i get to work tomorrow morning, i should hopefully see what this baby looks like


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lukas026*
> 
> btw I am from europe so I will get my Lightning later than ppl in US I guess


That's the second time I read this, who's making these BS rumors up?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StreekG*
> 
> So when i get to work tomorrow morning, i should hopefully see what this baby looks like


Let me know if you do


----------



## Lukas026

sorry I didnt mean to offend but understand I live in czech republic (middle of europe) and its almost everytime when companies like evga, asus, gigabyte or msi presents new product, it takes twice the time than in us shops like newegg and amazon. but again its an offtopic. i will be happy to wait some little more time


----------



## StreekG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> That's the second time I read this, who's making these BS rumors up?
> Let me know if you do


Because when i get to work, the first thing i do instead of work is make breakfast, then check what's news in the industry


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lukas026*
> 
> sorry I didnt mean to offend but understand I live in czech republic (middle of europe) and its almost everytime when companies like evga, asus, gigabyte or msi presents new product, it takes twice the time than in us shops like newegg and amazon. but again its an offtopic. i will be happy to wait some little more time


The cards land in the Netherlands (our EU distribution is there) at the same time as in the US. transport to Czech is going by Truck mostly so that takes another week or so before it shows up at retailers.


----------



## Lukas026

ok fine I will be ofc happier when it arrives earlier. anyway thanks for clarification









now: where is card my master ?


----------



## Nemessss

so the card is coming the 7st august


----------



## StreekG

I was hoping it would be on the 7rd.


----------



## Lukas026

well i dont know how to understand the video. as tormented said: is it 7th august or 8th july ?

please be it july









oh and just a little offtopic: evga 780 classy will be up this week (confirmed on their forum) so I think MSI dont want leave them top spot in PRO league...


----------



## cowie

^ its august not july.
http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=380252


----------



## Phenomanator53

Sorry if im being rude, but what is the difference between the last few generations of Twin Frozr coolers and what is so special about them? to me its just the exact same cooler on different generations of GPUs, well maybe a little difference. their fans are pretty cheap sleeve bearing models. I just don't see why this series of coolers are so good. Also after a quick google search they seem to have a pretty high RMA rate compared to the rest of the competition.

Please correct me if im stating something wrong.


----------



## driftingforlife

For the RMA rate.

More lighting sold and they get pushed harder than all the other cards do.


----------



## ahnafakeef

*@neliz*: Pardon me if you're prohibited from answering this sort of questions, but will these cards overclock to levels where it can beat a 1200MHz Titan by a noteworthy margin?

If you're not allowed to answer that, please drop a few hints on the matter (and make them as crystal clear as possible







) so that I can pick up the answer from there. Thanks a lot!


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phenomanator53*
> 
> Also after a quick google search they seem to have a pretty high RMA rate compared to the rest of the competition.


Please share your RMA data with me please, if you check actual figures, you see that the return rate of Twin Frozr enabled cards is actually much lower than those with reference coolers or other popular brands.

Also, if you don't know what's so special about a Twin Frozr, you've probably never owned one. Class leading low temperatures, low fan noise and return to idle temperatures are just a few of the key benefits. I for one would never touch a reference design again, especially with NVIDIA's new Turbo Boost 2.0 and their reference cooler is simply incapable of keeping the card below 80 Degrees Celcius.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ahnafakeef*
> 
> *@neliz*: Pardon me if you're prohibited from answering this sort of questions, but will these cards overclock to levels where it can beat a 1200MHz Titan by a noteworthy margin?
> 
> If you're not allowed to answer that, please drop a few hints on the matter (and make them as crystal clear as possible
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) so that I can pick up the answer from there. Thanks a lot!


I haven't really paid attention to any air OC numbers, sorry.


----------



## Phenomanator53

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Please share your RMA data with me please, if you check actual figures, you see that the return rate of Twin Frozr enabled cards is actually much lower than those with reference coolers or other popular brands.
> 
> Also, if you don't know what's so special about a Twin Frozr, you've probably never owned one. Class leading low temperatures, low fan noise and return to idle temperatures are just a few of the key benefits. I for one would never touch a reference design again, especially with NVIDIA's new Turbo Boost 2.0 and their reference cooler is simply incapable of keeping the card below 80 Degrees Celcius.


http://www.behardware.com/articles/881-5/components-returns-rates-7.html

http://news.softpedia.com/newsImage/French-Website-Publishes-HDD-SSD-and-Motherboard-RMA-Statistics-6.png/

The main reason i dont buy MSI TF cards is that they use cheap fans and i dont want cheap fans.


----------



## ahnafakeef

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I haven't really paid attention to any air OC numbers, sorry.


Oh I see. Thanks anyways!


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phenomanator53*
> 
> http://www.behardware.com/articles/881-5/components-returns-rates-7.html
> 
> http://news.softpedia.com/newsImage/French-Website-Publishes-HDD-SSD-and-Motherboard-RMA-Statistics-6.png/


Yeah, funny how all of those reports don't mention Twin Frozr, now do they? (also, 2 years ago is a hell of a long time)
Quote:


> - 15.76% Sapphire Radeon HD 7870 OC Edition 2GB
> - 14.29% Sapphire Radeon HD 7970 OC Edition 3GB
> - 11.88% Sapphire Radeon HD 6770 1GB
> - 11.82% Sapphire Radeon HD 7870 GHz Edition 2GB
> - 7.07% ASUS ENGT520 SL/DI/1GD3/V2 (LP)
> - 6.98% ASUS GTX680-DC2O-2GD5 2GB
> - 5.80% Sapphire Radeon HD 7970 3GB
> - 5.32% Gigabyte GeForce GTX 560 Ti OC 1024 MB


Quote:


> The main reason i dont buy MSI TF cards is that they use cheap fans and i dont want cheap fans.


So, which brand do you use then? surely not reference design!


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CrazyElf*
> 
> I'm not so sure about that. The PCB of the reference cards, I suspect would strain under the very high voltages. We're talking ~1,400 MHz on a day to day use card, perhaps even in SLI as well. As has been pointed out, MSI's advantage is the power delivery to the physical chip. If you tried to do that type of overclocking on a reference card, I suspect that there would be the danger that the VRMs might blow up. Power consumption goes up very quickly when you're talking about these types of overclocks. Furthermore, you'd have the issue of throttling, which the Lightnings did not do.
> 
> That said, I am not surprised that other well made custom PCBs could achieve good results as well. It's just that I doubt that the reference board can do it for a 24-7 overclock.


At a voltage of 1.3-1.4 could be handled by most reference designs. I am not taking credit away from the LNG, but its a fact that at these speeds/power levels, the power delivery delivery on 99% of reference based card (excluding the cheaped out xfx style) is just fine for our need.

Once we get into 1.5-1.7v then yes, a LNG style PCB helps.

And if Neilz would like to correct me, LNG chips are binned by their ability to hit x voltage at y clock. You do not bin with overclockablity or headroom at all. So the binning will only help you so much in terms of finding that golden chip. That is why most who want the best chip bin a bunch of reference cards:Cheaper and more available.

I have three lightning's, I am not dissing them. But have a look at the 7970 side of things and understand that the reference design has all the highest scores for non ln2. Why? Because the reference is enough to handle the current load and can change voltage. Getting a good overclocker is just part of the silicon lottery. No way around it.


----------



## xoleras

This thread is just being trolled right now.







Dont entertain the trolls, neliz.

Responding to garbage is what MSI Alex did, which i'm sure was an exercise in frustration.


----------



## SonyHD

In MSI, can hear thunder

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INy7m0nhb8A&feature=player_embedded

7/8/2013


----------



## cowie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> At a voltage of 1.3-1.4 could be handled by most reference designs. I am not taking credit away from the LNG, but its a fact that at these speeds/power levels, the power delivery delivery on 99% of reference based card (excluding the cheaped out xfx style) is just fine for our need.
> 
> Once we get into 1.5-1.7v then yes, a LNG style PCB helps.
> 
> And if Neilz would like to correct me, LNG chips are binned by their ability to hit x voltage at y clock. You do not bin with overclockablity or headroom at all. So the binning will only help you so much in terms of finding that golden chip. That is why most who want the best chip bin a bunch of reference cards:Cheaper and more available.
> 
> I have three lightning's, I am not dissing them. But have a look at the 7970 side of things and understand that the reference design has all the highest scores for non ln2. Why? Because the reference is enough to handle the current load and can change voltage. Getting a good overclocker is just part of the silicon lottery. No way around it.


1.3ish yes 1.40 your taking chances








Ref is good enough for most sure but was a good thing nv locked voltage for noobs on the last few top end ref boards.

I dont think you can find any 1 golden chip for air/water/sub zero all will behave different depending on conditions.
I had a 680 dcII that ran 1480 with just water for benches,1450 24/7 gaming on just 1.43v but was behind when -40c or so to my other card.

Since you brought up amd
The pbc is okish but i cant get the cores to stay alive under -0c for long it seems they just dont take it well?...just the opposite of nv...just my observations only


----------



## jomama22

I mmean ofcourse a chip will clock differently on air/water/phase/ln2. Never said they were the same. I was talking about those who purchase for air/water which most buyers of the LNG are.

We all know nv skimmped in their components. That's why I was referencing AMDs side.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> This thread is just being trolled right now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dont entertain the trolls, neliz.
> 
> Responding to garbage is what MSI Alex did, which i'm sure was an exercise in frustration.


I'll tread lightly


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I'll tread lightly


It looks like wisdom.


----------



## neliz

First peak at the card:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=605151799524435&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


----------



## King4x4

Unless it doesn't have the 1.21v limit I won't touch it.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> First peak at the card:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=605151799524435&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*


I asked for the box in that picture, you know, for the haters


----------



## Phenomanator53

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Yeah, funny how all of those reports don't mention Twin Frozr, now do they? (also, 2 years ago is a hell of a long time)
> 
> So, which brand do you use then? surely not reference design!


Since you can't read my sig, I'll just say it here, I use a reference nvidia cooler with the central fan similar to the 560ti. It is pretty quite under furmark load while the fan is at 42%@[email protected]
The fan used is a High quality Dual Ball bearing fan made by AVC ( which is one of the biggest OEM fan companies out there) MUCH better than that cheapo "long life bearing" which is nothing else but a sleeve bearing. if u need any proof just ask.


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> First peak at the card:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=605151799524435&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


Oh such a tease!!


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phenomanator53*
> 
> The fan used is a High quality Dual Ball bearing fan made by AVC ( which is one of the biggest OEM fan companies out there) MUCH better than that cheapo "long life bearing" which is nothing else but a sleeve bearing. if u need any proof just ask.


You'd be happy to know that Lightning fans are ball bearing then








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> Oh such a tease!!


Can you spot any differences with the layout of the 680/770?
http://media.msi.com/main.php?g2_itemId=78892&g2_imageViewsIndex=1


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Can you spot any differences with the layout of the 680/770?
> http://media.msi.com/main.php?g2_itemId=78892&g2_imageViewsIndex=1


As compared to what I am wondering?

From the card in the Facebook post I do see several differences compared to the 680 Lightning, that is of course assuming that the card in the FB post is the 780 lightning


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> As compared to what I am wondering?
> 
> From the card in the Facebook post I do see several differences compared to the 680 Lightning, that is of course assuming that the card in the FB post is the 780 lightning


Why wouldn't it be the 780 Lightning?


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Why wouldn't it be the 780 Lightning?


Lol, I think you enjoy this !


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *navit*
> 
> Lol, I think you enjoy this !


Nah, trust me man, it's the Lightning, it would be a bit of a waste of Jon and the LN2 to have him waste time benching on "crappy cards" right?


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Nah, trust me man, it's the Lightning, it would be a bit of a waste of Jon and the LN2 to have him waste time benching on "crappy cards" right?


True that!!
Looking forward to seeing more of it.


----------



## Phenomanator53

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You'd be happy to know that Lightning fans are ball bearing then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can you spot any differences with the layout of the 680/770?
> http://media.msi.com/main.php?g2_itemId=78892&g2_imageViewsIndex=1


It is nice to know that these lightnings use better fans then standard TF coolers. I thought all TF use the same fan! Guess I was wrong. If that's the case, I might consider the next Lightning card based on an AMD chip.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phenomanator53*
> 
> It is nice to know that these lightnings use better fans then standard TF coolers.I


Actually most Twin Frozr fans use Ball Bearing fans, especially on cards like Hawk/Lightning


----------



## nagle3092

http://www.techpowerup.com/186897/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-release-date-surfaces.html


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> http://www.techpowerup.com/186897/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-release-date-surfaces.html


Can't wait to see this Titan-killer


----------



## SonyHD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> http://www.techpowerup.com/186897/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-release-date-surfaces.html


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonyHD*
> 
> In MSI, can hear thunder
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INy7m0nhb8A&feature=player_embedded
> 
> 7/8/2013


MSI first published here
Read carefully prior posts


----------



## Pr0xy

LOL gtx Titan.


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pr0xy*
> 
> LOL gtx Titan.


That's been since the GTX 780 released







. The Lightning 780 should beat the Titan outright in every conceivable way, though.


----------



## zed1

Now my only concern,is about the price,because i already have the money for one,but i want two,








i can get two next month,only if the price don't exceed 715 euros(for one),if it's more i'll have to wait september for the second one.
Waa ,i feel like this month ,will be very very long.


----------



## StreekG

I'm really curious how the Lightning will perform when overclocked, and how high it will, seeing how nicely the GK110 performance scales when overclocked, having one Overclocked 780 Lightning makes me think my 2 680L will be put to the test.


----------



## DADDYDC650

2 x 780 Lightning's or 2 x 9970's. Which to choose.....


----------



## Dyaems

sooooooo when is my Titan Lightning? Pretty sure there will be one, right? The name even sounds great!


----------



## AJR1775

I'd rather an OC'd 780 than an OC'd Titan; I don't think the difference in performance would justify the difference in cost which is what, 70% to 80% higher?


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> At a voltage of 1.3-1.4 could be handled by most reference designs. I am not taking credit away from the LNG, but its a fact that at these speeds/power levels, the power delivery delivery on 99% of reference based card (excluding the cheaped out xfx style) is just fine for our need.
> 
> Once we get into 1.5-1.7v then yes, a LNG style PCB helps.


It's not just the voltage. At ~1.4V ~1,400 MHz, the power draw is also very high. GK104 may be a very efficient chip, but at the speeds we are talking, we are looking at as much as 400W peak (on things like OCCT or Furmark) per card. I seriously doubt that any reference board could handle that for an extended period of time, hence my suggestion earlier that the VRMs could blow. There are 4+2 phases on the reference design, 4 for the core, which given the power draw we are talking about, could be a huge issue.

You are right though that ~1,400 MHz+ has been done before on stock:
http://videocardz.com/32592/kingpin-reaches-1442-mhz-with-geforce-gtx-680-on-air

But for a 24-7 OC as many of the people in the 680 Lightning thread are doing? That will need an upgraded PCB. Again, it's not that MSI has a monopoly on this, it's that they have one of the best custom PCBs out on the market. Is it overkill and overengineered for just air? Indeed so. Is that a bad thing? So long as people are willing to pay for it and MSI makes a profit off of it, and it does help get a better OC (along with MSI's other tools, like Afterburner), it seems like a win-win to me.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> And if Neilz would like to correct me, LNG chips are binned by their ability to hit x voltage at y clock. You do not bin with overclockablity or headroom at all. So the binning will only help you so much in terms of finding that golden chip. That is why most who want the best chip bin a bunch of reference cards:Cheaper and more available.
> 
> I have three lightning's, I am not dissing them. But have a look at the 7970 side of things and understand that the reference design has all the highest scores for non ln2. Why? Because the reference is enough to handle the current load and can change voltage. Getting a good overclocker is just part of the silicon lottery. No way around it.


Actually, I've even gone to the extent of creating a thread just to investigate.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1405642/why-are-the-diamond-reference-7970s-overclocking-well-compared-to-the-other-brands-cards/0_100#post_20347371

You are right in that the custom PCB 7970s did not do well on air. However, there have been a few 7970s, such as the ones that won the silicon lottery that have been able to do 1,300 MHz+ on air, including a handful of reference cards, the Asus Matrix 7970 (although that card had a ton of other issues), and a handful of 7970 Lightnings (and the newer BEs). Air is always very heavily reliant on silicon lottery (and so is water). But that does not mean that having a good PCB does not help (as does MSI's TF series of coolers).

Edit:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Actually most Twin Frozr fans use Ball Bearing fans, especially on cards like Hawk/Lightning


Thanks for the tip. I did not know that.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AJR1775*
> 
> I'd rather an OC'd 780 than an OC'd Titan; I don't think the difference in performance would justify the difference in cost which is what, 70% to 80% higher?


The Titan's if there is a Titan Lightning might be more future-proof in a sense. Games today do not need 3gb+ of VRAM. But there are some games, like Skyrim with the texture mods, and with the expected proliferation of 4K displays in the coming years, 6gb of VRAM might be more valuable.

I mean the Titan's 6gb was intended for GPGPU uses, but that also may make it useful for other things, like if you plan on using 3x 2560x1600/1440 screens as well. And if 3x 2560 or a 4K screen is in the budget, then perhaps so is a Titan.


----------



## driftingforlife

There will never be a TITAN Lightning!


----------



## Lukas026

If MSI lightning can do at least things like that, I think we may have found even 2 TITAN killers









http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2347

hype up !


----------



## USFORCES

For all you guys wanting water blocks from the get go why don't you go with universal? Actually it's kind of nice no more waiting for blocks and no more loosing money selling them at half price.

I went through 5 pairs of full blocks before I switched and so far universal has worked just as good.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> For all you guys wanting water blocks from the get go why don't you go with universal? Actually it's kind of nice no more waiting for blocks and no more loosing money selling them at half price.
> 
> I went through 5 pairs of full blocks before I switched and so far universal has worked just as good.


I considered this but I like the full cover too much! Lol.


----------



## TormenteD

^ Yes, I'd say this is mostly because of the looks. And to be honest I don't see the point about resale value. I very much doubt anyone would want to buy any used water blocks at all (at least where I live). Ebay maaaaaybe but you hardly get anything for used stuff nowadays unless it's some kind of rare item and VGA water blocks are a bit of a niche product really.


----------



## neliz

Here's a little something new.


----------



## Macho Man

AAAAHHHHHH I can't wait any longer!!! I feel like Cartman from the wii episode. What website do you think will get it on release date?


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Here's a little something new.


Ah more teasing


----------



## zealord

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Here's a little something new.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Here's a little something new.


That's cool, here's something new too, wonder if the Lightning will be capable of these clock speeds on air as well...


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That's cool, here's something new too, wonder if the Lightning will be capable of these clock speeds on air as well...


If it allows voltage adjustment to 1.35v (what this is running) then I'm sure we will see it. Come to think of it, many 780s with an extra .14v would probably be able to clock this high.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> If it allows voltage adjustment to 1.35v (what this is running) then I'm sure we will see it. Come to think of it, many 780s with an extra .14v would probably be able to clock this high.


That is the question.









Does the Lightning allow up to 1.35v like the classy?

Or is MSI gonna allow the Classy to have all its thunder?


----------



## MoBeeJ

There cant be thunder without lightning. ..


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That is the question.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does the Lightning allow up to 1.35v like the classy?
> 
> Or is MSI gonna allow the Classy to have all its thunder?


Debating between the classy and Lightning myself. Would be great to find an answer to this!


----------



## szeged

Inc mad classified fanboys when the lightning shocks them back to reality.

Theresa storm comin august 7th. Be ready for the lightning.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That is the question.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does the Lightning allow up to 1.35v like the classy?
> 
> Or is MSI gonna allow the Classy to have all its thunder?


I guess it depends on what they are actually allowed to do. Either eVGA bit the bullet on RMAs for the classy and decided to just absorb what will come, or Nvidia has offered some sort of compromise. If its the latter, I would see the lightning having the same ability. Would msi be willing to absord RMA/warranty claims? I dunno. But, If I had to guess, the volume of sales for a $700+ card isn't much in comparison to the rest of their lineup which gives a bit more leeway in just flipping greenlight the bird and taking the risk. Those buying these types of card are probably a bit more educated about the product itself and the "dangers" of overclocking as well.

My question is, will we start to see different procedures in determining the cause of an RMA. Will we see some sort of voltage hardward on the pcb that alerts when a voltage threshold has been crossed? No one is stopping some goof from furmarking a gpu at max volatge for hours, burning the chip, and getting a replacement through warranty and creating this whole mess in the first place. I personally would just love to see the option of writing away your warranty and in return, be given the full rains on the gpu. MSI does this with their MOA AB software but there are the obvious hurdles of ln2 experience/proof.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> I guess it depends on what they are actually allowed to do. Either eVGA bit the bullet on RMAs for the classy and decided to just absorb what will come, or Nvidia has offered some sort of compromise. If its the latter, I would see the lightning having the same ability. Would msi be willing to absord RMA/warranty claims? I dunno. But, If I had to guess, the volume of sales for a $700+ card isn't much in comparison to the rest of their lineup which gives a bit more leeway in just flipping greenlight the bird and taking the risk. Those buying these types of card are probably a bit more educated about the product itself and the "dangers" of overclocking as well.
> 
> My question is, will we start to see different procedures in determining the cause of an RMA. Will we see some sort of voltage hardward on the pcb that alerts when a voltage threshold has been crossed? No one is stopping some goof from furmarking a gpu at max volatge for hours, burning the chip, and getting a replacement through warranty and creating this whole mess in the first place. I personally would just love to see the option of writing away your warranty and in return, be given the full rains on the gpu. MSI does this with their MOA AB software but there are the obvious hurdles of ln2 experience/proof.


its a shame that this greenlight stuff or Nvidia compromise was not extended to the Titan. or, may be they are saving it for Titan Ultra. But highly unlikely given the cost of such a card to purchase. sorry for off topic, but still mystified by Nvidia's thought process here.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *provost*
> 
> its a shame that this greenlight stuff or Nvidia compromise was not extended to the Titan. or, may be they are saving it for Titan Ultra. But highly unlikely given the cost of such a card to purchase. sorry for off topic, but still mystified by Nvidia's thought process here.


As am I. I will never again buy a "halo" product from Nvidia. The Titan was never a good value and I knew that going in. But why compromise with EVGA and MSI so much on the second tier card and not the top dog? Seems a bit stupid on Nvidia's part, because both the Classified and Lightning 780 should eat into any OC headroom the Titan had.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> As am I. I will never again buy a "halo" product from Nvidia. The Titan was never a good value and I knew that going in. But why compromise with EVGA and MSI so much on the second tier card and not the top dog? Seems a bit stupid on Nvidia's part, because both the Classified and Lightning 780 should eat into any OC headroom the Titan had.


Agreed and + rep


----------



## malmental

do I sell or return my WF3 for the Lightning.?


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> do I sell or return my WF3 for the Lightning.?


I am not selling mine. Its a great card.








But, I am doing an Nvidia build in my proposed rig , probably with a 780 lightning








I try not to become beholden to anyone company as the last time I checked both of them were trying take money from my pocket








edit : sorry, malmental I misread your post, I was referring to my 7950


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That's cool, here's something new too, wonder if the Lightning will be capable of these clock speeds on air as well...


Will largely depend on luck of the draw, just like it did for this classy reaching over 1400MHz.


----------



## xoleras

MSI afterburner 3.0 beta 11 was released today. Even more interesting, is that the owner of guru3d mentioned that there will be a "special" edition of MSI afterburner called the "SE" edition for the lightning 780 card. It will be released with the lightning 780 card apparently.

Hmm? Wonder what this is all about? Software voltage control maybe?


----------



## malmental

flip the switch and the 780 Lightning is wide open without restrictions..


----------



## Cial00

any hints on price? right around $700 or we talking higher?


----------



## Pr0xy

^no word yet but seeing how MSI's "gaming series" 780 is over $700usd, it's safe to say the Lightning will cost even more


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pr0xy*
> 
> ^no word yet but seeing how MSI's "gaming series" 780 is over $700usd, it's safe to say the Lightning will cost even more


Where do they cost over $700?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127746

I can't see them costing more than the Classy. I say $709 at the most.


----------



## Pr0xy

wth..I swear, before I replied, I rechecked just to make sure and I saw the gaming 780's listed at 736.99....

EDIT:


Ahh I guess someone at Newegg made a typo or they recently lowered the price because when you click on the product, it reverts to $669, weird.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pr0xy*
> 
> wth..I swear, before I replied, I rechecked just to make sure and I saw the gaming 780's listed at 736.99....


That was some pricing error on Newegg. All the 780's jumped over $700.


----------



## Takla

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pr0xy*
> 
> ^no word yet but seeing how MSI's "gaming series" 780 is over $700usd, it's safe to say the Lightning will cost even more


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127746

$669,99


----------



## Pr0xy

Go back a page


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> flip the switch and the 780 Lightning is wide open without restrictions..


...for those with ab MOA 2013. They will use bios one for extended limits and bios 2 for the unlocked protections as long as you have ab moa 2013.

Voltage control and power slider will not be unlimited, likely close if not the same as the classy (1.35v 200% power?). Think of it like needing the evbot for full unlocked.


----------



## xoleras

Lightning 780, my body is ready.

I owned the 580 lightning, 680 lightning, I guess i'll have to do the inevitable. Neliz, you better give me a product that is all that and more!


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Lightning 780, my body is ready.
> 
> I owned the 580 lightning, 680 lightning, I guess i'll have to do the inevitable. Neliz, you better give me a product that is all that and more!


same. I have the 770 lightning and thinking about upgrading to this bad boy


----------



## Nitrogannex

Going to be either this or the Zotac AMP! when it comes out.

Just wait and see


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> do I sell or return my WF3 for the Lightning.?


I considered selling my ACX 780 SC to go to a lightning, but with the nice 24/7 OC at low noise level I have, I decided not to bother. I might get 10-12% more performance, but I'd take a hit switching cost-wise after the sale, and have to hope for a 1400mhz+ OC to get a nice boost over my current one. With the new Radeon series coming, I don't think nVidia will be too far behind with Maxwell, so... I'll wait for a Lightning Maxwell or somesuch and jump on that when the time comes.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I may go with Lightning 780's even though I doubt that they'd be a significant performance upgrade over my Titans even with additional voltage. It would be fun to have some new toys to play around with but it depends on how long its going to take for blocks to become available for them....


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I may go with Lightning 780's even though I doubt that they'd be a significant performance upgrade over my Titans even with additional voltage. It would be fun to have some new toys to play around with but it depends on how long its going to take for blocks to become available for them....


That is why I sold my Titan. Had my Titan for 4 months and really enjoyed it, but I need something I can tweak a little more.







Classified or Lightning for me.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoldenTiger*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> do I sell or return my WF3 for the Lightning.?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I considered selling my ACX 780 SC to go to a lightning, but with the nice 24/7 OC at low noise level I have, I decided not to bother. I might get 10-12% more performance, but I'd take a hit switching cost-wise after the sale, and have to hope for a 1400mhz+ OC to get a nice boost over my current one. With the new Radeon series coming, I don't think nVidia will be too far behind with Maxwell, so... I'll wait for a Lightning Maxwell or somesuch and jump on that when the time comes.
Click to expand...

like the way you think...


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Lightning 780, my body is ready.
> 
> I owned the 580 lightning, 680 lightning, I guess i'll have to do the inevitable. Neliz, you better give me a product that is all that and more!


We'll have some performance numbers this week, it does not disappoint.


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> ...for those with ab MOA 2013. They will use bios one for extended limits and bios 2 for the unlocked protections as long as you have ab moa 2013.
> 
> Voltage control and power slider will not be unlimited, likely close if not the same as the classy (1.35v 200% power?). Think of it like needing the evbot for full unlocked.


If what you're saying is true wouldn't that make the Classy the "better" choice? I very much doubt your average enthusiast can get his hands on the MOA version of AB while the EVBot can be purchased for 89,90 euros (availability is another story but still).


----------



## xoleras

Either card is unlimited technically speaking if you mod them for LN2. EV Bot was limited on the classified 680, and had other limitations such as removing all idle states from the 680, I don't think it's an ideal solution. But go to the classified thread if you want to talk about it.


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> We'll have some performance numbers this week, it does not disappoint.


Look forward to seeing them.


----------



## kzinti1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> It's the simple reason we have different segments
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The amount of WORK that goes into a Lightning card (perceived as a _delay_) is to get those extra MHz out of a card, to make sure it's Voltage to the GPU stays rock stable, to make an overclocker smile when he boots the card for the first time and realizes he has the fastest 780 on the planet (yes, this just happened
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> All that work that goes into it, is basically "wasted" if you just use it with the stock cooler. Yes, a Lightning will still be a fast (the fastest?) air-cooled card as well. but are those MHz difference worth it stepping up from, say, the 780 GAMING?
> 
> It's not that I want to discourage people from buying a Lightning, far from it, having one is an awesome experience.. but these cards just BEG for cold..


If you're so hell bent on these cards just being used for LN2, DICE or whatever, then why not just leave the damned fans off to begin with?
Maybe just sell them with your own pots pre-mounted on them and the condensation material already in place?
A lot of people, myself included, don't appreciate being told what we should do with these cards.
If you want to exclusively build and sell cards for extreme cooling, then make them so they can't be used any other way, ever.
You apparently have a very condescending, snotty attitude that isn't doing MSI any favors at all and at best is just plain galling and off-putting to the MSI brand.
It would also be quite nice of MSI if they did the same as EVGA and offered a line of Lightning cards with waterblocks already installed.
Watercooling blocks for Lightnings are almost impossible to find. Bitspower makes a few but they aren't available in the US.
Being so tight lipped about when these cards will be available is just plain stupid. MSI can sell a lot more cards if potential customers are kept apprised on a best guess estimate as to when these cards will be available where they buy them.
Exact details aren't necessary since most of us know exactly what MSI GTX Lightning video cards are, so you won't be spilling any corporate secrets at to what the improvements entail.
Leave the teasing to teenaged girls and treat your paying customers as adults with a pocket full of money to invest in high performing video cards and motherboards.


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Get outta here with the classified trolling, post in the classified thread. Either card is unlimited technically speaking if you mod them for LN2. EV Bot was limited on the classified 680, and had other limitations such as removing all idle states from the 680, I don't think it's an ideal solution. But go to the classified thread if you want to talk about it.


What trolling? I never said I favored the Classy. Naturally a card like the Lightning will always be compared to its competitors. If you're so sensitive about other cards being mentioned in this thread it seems to me like you're a fanboy.


----------



## Skrillex

Love the Lightning cards can't wait for this!


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> What trolling? I never said I favored the Classy. Naturally a card like the Lightning will always be compared to its competitors. If you're so sensitive about other cards being mentioned in this thread it seems to me like you're a fanboy.


I guess if it is any consolation, he did edit his post lol. Though back to what you said, I mean if you intend to go over those limits, the classy makes it a bit easier and available so to speak. Especially to those who don't do hwbot or ln2 very much.


----------



## fateswarm

I wonder if any of those cards will fair well when AMD brings its own refresh..

I suspect it might be less of a game changer than we might assume since they're both on the same manufacturer.

Hrm.. maybe the best strategy would be a chip that goes between the 770 and 780.. since a lot of people give 400 but rarely people find it sane to go above 600.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I wonder if any of those cards will fair well when AMD brings its own refresh..
> 
> I suspect it might be less of a game changer than we might assume since they're both on the same manufacturer.
> 
> Hrm.. maybe the best strategy would be a chip that goes between the 770 and 780.. since a lot of people give 400 but rarely people find it sane to go above 600.


I would like to read what ur posting, and respond coherently, but that Avatar is very distracting.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzinti1*
> 
> If you're so hell bent on these cards just being used for LN2, DICE or whatever, then why not just leave the damned fans off to begin with?
> Maybe just sell them with your own pots pre-mounted on them and the condensation material already in place?
> A lot of people, myself included, don't appreciate being told what we should do with these cards.
> If you want to exclusively build and sell cards for extreme cooling, then make them so they can't be used any other way, ever.
> You apparently have a very condescending, snotty attitude that isn't doing MSI any favors at all and at best is just plain galling and off-putting to the MSI brand.


I'm sorry if this comes over as condescending and snotty, but you do also realize that I'm open in telling WHY we're making these products. LN2 performance is our prime interest with these cards, the awesome air-cooled performance is an added benefit, but honestly, the air-cooling is one of the last things we work on.

Quote:


> It would also be quite nice of MSI if they did the same as EVGA and offered a line of Lightning cards with waterblocks already installed.


We already had cards with waterblocks installed on them, the Hydrogen series, but sales of those cards are simply not good and a lot of people return them, yes, they RMA them because they don't know they actually need their own reservoir, radiator and pumps to go with it.

[quopte]Watercooling blocks for Lightnings are almost impossible to find. Bitspower makes a few but they aren't available in the US.[/quote]
EK makes blocks and generic GPU blocks always fit of course.
Quote:


> Being so tight lipped about when these cards will be available is just plain stupid. MSI can sell a lot more cards if potential customers are kept apprised on a best guess estimate as to when these cards will be available where they buy them.


And we will be burned just as hard if we can't make the launch. We're a publicly trading company and we have a responsibility to shareholders that goes beyond guesses and estimates.
Also, telling you guys a release date that is too early and we can't make it hurts everyone.
Quote:


> Exact details aren't necessary since most of us know exactly what MSI GTX Lightning video cards are, so you won't be spilling any corporate secrets at to what the improvements entail.
> Leave the teasing to teenaged girls and treat your paying customers as adults with a pocket full of money to invest in high performing video cards and motherboards.


I'm sorry but on an engineering side, it IS serious. the longer we wait with showing what we have, the less time others have to respond both on Engineering AND Marketing. I think a good example is Xbone vs PS4 recently. where M$ is the first to detail their product and plans and Sony has all the time in the world to have a response to each and every feature.

I know you guys want to see everything, a year before launch (trust me, I'm the same) but the new cooler was just finished yesterday and can only now start all verification testing. Let's suppose that something is wrong with it, what good would it be to show it at COMPUTEX and never put it on the market?


----------



## xoleras

For the naysayers, I'm an air overclocker, but don't read into the LN2-oriented design of the lightning too much. Every lightning was designed with this in mind and *that design translates into better air/water overclocks* in addition to better extreme overclocks - keep in mind that the Lightning is one of two SKUs with this design. Those two being the classified and lightning. My personal subjective opinion is that the Lightning has always been better (at least the 580 and 680 lightnings) and that is why I have always bought them.

Additionally, the benefits of the LN2 oriented design of the lightning also translates VERY well for water cooling -. I would further state that the Lightning line of cards were by far the best for water cooled GPUs for at least the past 3 generations....better than the classified IMO, because only swiftech made classified blocks. And frankly, the flow in swiftech GPU blocks is very restrictive in comparison to other brands. Also i've always found the PCB quality of the Lightning SKUs to be higher than classified. Don't get me wrong, the classys are great cards...but...I just wasn't as impressed with them as compared to the lightning series, at least with the GTX 580 and 680.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I know you guys want to see everything, a year before launch (trust me, I'm the same) *but the new cooler was just finished yesterday* and can only now start all verification testing. Let's suppose that something is wrong with it, what good would it be to show it at COMPUTEX and never put it on the market?


can we get a teaser pic?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Good lord they literally just finished the design of the cooler yesterday and the card is going to hit the market on 8/7??? Wow...


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Good lord they literally just finished the design of the cooler yesterday and the card is going to hit the market on 8/7??? Wow...


Lol, that's a nice way to troll, Finished as in, first risk run came of the MP line.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Not trolling at all (I'm a huge Lightning fanboy as anybody could tell you). I just misunderstood what you meant when you said the cooler was just finished. Can't wait to see how awesome its going to be (then again, if it sucks I wouldn't have to go through the hassle of selling off my Titans and buying two)...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> can we get a teaser pic?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Here's a little something new.


I was guessing it was a teaser pic of the cooler in this ^ post.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzinti1*
> 
> If you're so hell bent on these cards just being used for LN2, DICE or whatever, then why not just leave the damned fans off to begin with?
> Maybe just sell them with your own pots pre-mounted on them and the condensation material already in place?
> A lot of people, myself included, don't appreciate being told what we should do with these cards.
> If you want to exclusively build and sell cards for extreme cooling, then make them so they can't be used any other way, ever.


You do realize that there are a great number of people who do want the card available on air. They would need to release the card in several formats if they followed your suggestions for each type of cooling. Considering this is a niche product, that would not work out.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzinti1*
> 
> You apparently have a very condescending, snotty attitude that isn't doing MSI any favors at all and at best is just plain galling and off-putting to the MSI brand.


Look, neliz is not trying to upset anybody. I for one, have found him to be reasonably accommodating, especially given your attitude. Remember, he's under NDA as well.

At this point, there's nothing to do but to wait. Wait and see how this card will overclock, and how the 9970 will perform relative to the 780. That said, if the 9970 becomes a winner, it's very likely that we'll see a 9970 Lightning by early 2014.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Lol, that's a nice way to troll, Finished as in, first risk run came of the MP line.


So is the estimated release date still the August 7th date we saw in the teaser video?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> So is the estimated release date still the August 7th date we saw in the teaser video?


August 7th is still a launch date, yeah.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> August 7th is still a launch date, yeah.


Very nice. I am using a GTX470 to hold me over. That is if I can resist the urge to buy another recently released 780.









I really want to try this 780 though. I think it is going to be something special.


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> August 7th is still a launch date, yeah.


I love it......A....... launch date!!!


----------



## neliz

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=612716515434630&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=612716515434630&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


Nice


----------



## MrMarauder

These teasers are killing me. August 7th needs to get here now.


----------



## StreekG

Launch date doesn't mean we won't see a full picture of the product til then though right?

Launch and reveal are not the same


----------



## navit

One can only hope.


----------



## stilllogicz

If only we could get a confirmation that there will be waterblocks for these cards. I'm pretty sure aquacomputer ruled it out and EK is still on the fence since they have a high amount of different blocks to produce.

Sigh.

Also neliz, will these cards have dual link dvi output? Or will it be single link like the lightning 7970?


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> If only we could get a confirmation that there will be waterblocks for these cards. I'm pretty sure aquacomputer ruled it out and EK is still on the fence since they have a high amount of different blocks to produce.
> 
> Sigh.
> 
> Also neliz, will these cards have dual link dvi output? Or will it be single link like the lightning 7970?


the two most important questions right here.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> If only we could get a confirmation that there will be waterblocks for these cards. I'm pretty sure aquacomputer ruled it out and EK is still on the fence since they have a high amount of different blocks to produce.


I can't comment on the availability of water blocks as we don't make them and I'm in no position to announce such products from a third party.
Quote:


> Sigh.
> 
> Also neliz, will these cards have dual link dvi output? Or will it be single link like the lightning 7970?


There is not a single reason to assume that a NVIDIA card would have the same video output restrictions as an AMD based card. It's a GTX 780, that should tell you enough.


----------



## Scorpion667

@neliz

TAKE MYYYYYYYYYY MONEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEY!!!!

[acronym for sexual intercourse] LOVE Lightning cards, so stoked for this!

I also liked how when I called your marketing dept at MSI (when the 780 first released) the guy told me there will be a 780gtx lightning... without really telling me, you know? I knew. I waited. And FUAAAA I'm so stoked!

Brilliant, brilliant cards...


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> There is not a single reason to assume that a NVIDIA card would have the same video output restrictions as an AMD based card. It's a GTX 780, that should tell you enough.


Well said. The 680 Lightning had Dual Link DVI, and I can't imagine it wouldn't follow that or be up to 780 spec.


----------



## IAmDay

If only I could spawn money.


----------



## Rei86

Well the GTX 780 Classified is out and I'm impressed with it.

Can't wait for the GTX 780 Lightning is released because its showing a lot of promise.

But with it launching in 7-8-2013 its very close to the release date of the AMD R9-x970 GPU which from speculation looks to be mighty impressive.

I have the money for three of either cards so bring on the numberS!


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Well the GTX 780 Classified is out and I'm impressed with it.
> 
> Can't wait for the GTX 780 Lightning is released because its showing a lot of promise.
> 
> But with it launching in 7-8-2013 its very close to the release date of the AMD R9-x970 GPU which from speculation looks to be mighty impressive.
> 
> I have the money for three of either cards so bring on the numberS!


Yeah, I've decided to stay with my SC ACX 780 @ 1202mhz core/6400mhz mem 24/7 whisper-quiet until nVidia's Maxwell and the new radeon cards hit... I've had mine since the end of May, so I'll save my pennies towards those instead of switching to a Lightning due to the small gains I'd see, with how late in the Kepler generation it is by now.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Well the GTX 780 Classified is out and I'm impressed with it.
> 
> Can't wait for the GTX 780 Lightning is released because its showing a lot of promise.
> 
> But with it launching in 7-8-2013 its very close to the release date of the AMD R9-x970 GPU which from speculation looks to be mighty impressive.
> 
> I have the money for three of either cards so bring on the numberS!


I don't believe the next gen AMD cards will be hitting until late Q4. I surmise there will be a gap between both release dates, but again, this is nothing but conjecture.


----------



## OptimusPrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> @neliz
> 
> TAKE MYYYYYYYYYY MONEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEY!!!!
> 
> [acronym for sexual intercourse] LOVE Lightning cards, so stoked for this!


[acronym for sexual intercourse] LOVE Lightning cards, so *"stroked"* for this!

this is how i read that


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OptimusPrime*
> 
> this is how i read that


"Stop Lubricating the man" - Optimus Prime


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> "Stop Lubricating the man" - Optimus Prime


Mirin' lubrication
Mirin' Lightning teasers
strong everything


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=612716515434630&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


does this one glow white/black?


----------



## OverclockerFox

So, with how expensive GTX 780's are already, how much more might this thing be? If it was much more, then wouldn't it just be worth it to eat badly for a month and put the extra money towards a Titan? The way I see it, if MSI charges much more than an extra $100 for this card over the regular 780, they'll be losing customers to the Titan.


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OverclockerFox*
> 
> So, with how expensive GTX 780's are already, how much more might this thing be? If it was much more, then wouldn't it just be worth it to eat badly for a month and put the extra money towards a Titan? The way I see it, if MSI charges much more than an extra $100 for this card over the regular 780, they'll be losing customers to the Titan.


The Classy is $700, so I'd be surprised if this was much of anything more than that ($700-730 is my guess).


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoldenTiger*
> 
> The Classy is $700, so I'd be surprised if this was much of anything more than that ($700-730 is my guess).


my guess is $710-720 (~$50ish more than the Gaming)


----------



## Dyaems

i wonder if the LEDs can now be switched on and off


----------



## StreekG

Or make them white LEDs


----------



## stilllogicz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I can't comment on the availability of water blocks as we don't make them and I'm in no position to announce such products from a third party.
> There is not a single reason to assume that a NVIDIA card would have the same video output restrictions as an AMD based card. It's a GTX 780, that should tell you enough.


Considering the fact that stock 7970's had DL DVI and yet the Lightning version did not, I wanted to make sure. It really didn't have anything to do with me assuming anything about NVIDA or ATI. I'm very well aware that the stock 780's have DL DVI.

I'm really excited about these cards now even more than before. Just wish some 3rd party would confirm waterblocks, cough EK cough.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> I don't believe the next gen AMD cards will be hitting until late Q4. I surmise there will be a gap between both release dates, but again, this is nothing but conjecture.


It'll be out around Oct which is close enough to the launch of the Lightning.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> i wonder if the LEDs can now be switched on and off


god i hope so.....that alone will make me pass on a Lightning....wont get a Lightning 770 for my MATX back and yellow build because of the blue LED's


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> It'll be out around Oct which is close enough to the launch of the Lightning.


Link with this info?


----------



## ethan319

It's so hard to wait until 8/7.
15 days from today.
15 days...

I bet it's going to be sold out very quickly as soon as newegg starts to sell it.
I even sold my 680 Lightning like a month ago in order to be prepared for this beast.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> Considering the fact that stock 7970's had DL DVI and yet the Lightning version did not, I wanted to make sure. It really didn't have anything to do with me assuming anything about NVIDA or ATI. I'm very well aware that the stock 780's have DL DVI.


That was a concession to running Eyefinity6 on the card, you've already had a peak at the rear of the card so it should be easy to distinguish the display configuration.
Quote:


> I'm really excited about these cards now even more than before. Just wish some 3rd party would confirm waterblocks, cough EK cough.


I can't confirm anything except that we're in contact with them.


----------



## stilllogicz

http://thinkcell.ekwb.com/idea/msi-780-lighting-water-blocks

Like the idea to let EK know we want blocks!


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> That was a concession to running Eyefinity6 on the card, you've already had a peak at the rear of the card so it should be easy to distinguish the display configuration.
> I can't confirm anything except that we're in contact with them.


Screw eyefinity 6 lol. Seriously though, the lightning 9970 better have a dl-dvi.
Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm really excited about these cards now even more than before. Just wish some 3rd party would confirm waterblocks, cough EK cough.
> 
> 
> 
> I can't confirm anything except that we're in contact with them.
Click to expand...

I approve of this response.


----------



## .theMetal

Can't wait to see the new Twin Frozr, I've liked each one more than the last.

I just hope it stays with 2 slots, I'm not a fan of anything bigger than that.


----------



## SeekerZA

Where can MSI products be bought that offers international shipping? Specifically to South Africa . . . in AFRICA


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SeekerZA*
> 
> Where can MSI products be bought that offers international shipping? Specifically to South Africa . . . in AFRICA


http://www.rebeltech.co.za/index.php?keyword=lightning&x=-949&y=-174&main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&zenid=os851ekohr37aso5e6ul026bv3

Check out Rebeltech

http://mygaming.co.za/news/hardware/56202-msi-gtx780-lightning-confirmed-for-sa-launch-date-revealed.html


----------



## Dyaems

i noticed that the twin frozr 3 (and below?) uses 80mm fans, TF4 uses 100mm fans, so that means that the TF5 uses 120mm fans?


----------



## neliz

Some first benchmark runs, over P20K in 3DMark 11, previously the fastest 780 did 18K.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=614108375295444&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Obviously that must be on extreme cooling and with crazy voltage. Do you have any air bench numbers? Still mighty impressive!


----------



## USFORCES

Lightning vs Classified, What's better, Probably comes down to which is easier to RMA right? Evga wins...


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Some first benchmark runs, over P20K in 3DMark 11, previously the fastest 780 did 18K.
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=614108375295444&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


Waaw waaw waaw!!! that is crasy! i think Titan was around 20k,
What about the core voltage used for this benchmark?Maybe you can not talk about it,but i just want to know if it's default core voltage,or with "a little" more voltage.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> Waaw waaw waaw!!! that is crasy! i think Titan was around 20k,
> What about the core voltage used for this benchmark?Maybe you can not talk about it,but i just want to know if it's default core voltage,or with "a little" more voltage.


Let's say a "weeeeee bit" more. Afterburner powertune graphs where off the scale


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Let's say a "weeeeee bit" more. Afterburner powertune graphs where off the scale


how does it perform on stock w/ the new TF?


----------



## Nemessss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Some first benchmark runs, over P20K in 3DMark 11, previously the fastest 780 did 18K.
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=614108375295444&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


is it better than 780 Classified OC?


----------



## MoBeeJ

Previouse EVGA gtx 780 records: - 3DMark 11 Performance (Single Card) - P17,047
- 3DMark 11 Performance (2-Way SLI) - P25,380

Single lightning scoring 20k is amazing!


----------



## dizzyscure1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Lightning vs Classified, What's better, Probably comes down to which is easier to RMA right? Evga wins...


\

I wanna know this also and whos putting out WB's for these suckers!!


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dizzyscure1*
> 
> \
> 
> I wanna know this also and whos putting out WB's for these suckers!!


Let's hope EK has an announcement soon


----------



## villain

So tempted to get one, but a part of me says wait for Maxwell.

I can't wait to see how this card overclocks on air.


----------



## ethan319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Lightning vs Classified, What's better, Probably comes down to which is easier to RMA right? Evga wins...


I'm not a big fan of MSI, but I have to agree that Lightnings are better than Classifieds in performance wise.
Also, MSI has way much better cooling solution.
MSI provides decent rma services, although it's not as great as EVGA.
Plus MSI's warranty goes under serial number so is easier to trade or sell in future.
Besides, EVGA's warranty is stuck to original owner.
Do you still think that EVGA wins?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ethan319*
> 
> I'm not a big fan of MSI, but I have to agree that Lightnings are better than Classifieds in performance wise.
> Also, MSI has way much better cooling solution.
> MSI provides decent rma services, although it's not as great as EVGA.
> Plus MSI's warranty goes under serial number so is easier to trade or sell in future.
> Besides, EVGA's warranty is stuck to original owner.
> Do you still think that EVGA wins?


EVGA is always the winner when it comes to Nvidia cards.


----------



## malmental

MSI...
only thing eVGA has is the 'step up program' but if your over #200 on the waiting list, do not bother..


----------



## Scorpion667

neliz I like your style.

Strong score, strong everything.

To all those prancercising about the Classified, you're forgetting a few things:

1. Lightning with software hack provides up to +200mv above stock volts, unmatched by any other vendor without hardware mod. If you are in to "bleeding edge" performance without hardware mods this has been the best card historically. If you wanna hard mod it doesn't really matter what card you buy anyway, it's more so lotto with how good your chip sample is.

2. The Lightning cooler is an excellent cooling solution which has seen quote a few advancements over the years. It's usually in the number 1 or 2 spot for best air cooling performance every generation, often beating even some triple slot cards (Lightning cooler is dual slot). They have had time to refine it and get it to a level where I can honestly say it's outstanding, and I'm one of the most critical people you'll ever meet. My 680 lightning on stock, never exceeds 47c. On the more extreme side of the spectrum I can keep it under 77c at 1.47v during benchmarks (1.47v is a REDICULOUS ammount of voltage for a kepler, and I did it all from software). Pls don't void my warranty neliz =(

3. The classified looks ugly. It's a fat stubby card. Lightning on the other hand looks like the Ferrari of video cards, with it's aluminum accents and aggressive styling/paintjob. The Classy on the other hand is a plastic box with stickers.

4. The classified requires you to buy yet ANOTHER device (EVBOT) for $50 + tax + shipping on top of an already expensive video card, in order to tweak voltage. The lightning does it all from FREE software.

5. *On a lightning you can DISABLE the nerfing mechanisms that Nvidia put in place on the stock cards such as thermal throttling and power target throttling! The 680 classified, before they removed EVbot port to meet Nvidia's demands, those cards throttled hardcore as soon as they hit 70c with no way to remove this limit. On the lightning, removing this limit is as easy as flipping a switch.*

Damn straight I'm a Lightning fanboy, it's the best card I have ever used. I will say that EVGA's customer service and RMA speed/ease of use is unmatched however. Both teams are great but my vote goes to the Lightning this round.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> neliz I like your style.
> 
> Strong score, strong everything.
> 
> To all those prancercising about the Classified, you're forgetting a few things:
> 
> 1. Lightning with software hack provides up to +200mv above stock, unmatched by any other vendor without hardware mod. If you are in to "bleeding edge" performance without hardware mods this has been the best card historically.
> 
> 2. The Lightning cooler is an excellent cooling solution which has seen quote a few advancements over the generations. It's usually in the number 1 or 2 spot for best air cooling performance every generation.
> 
> 2. The classified looks ugly. It's a fat stubby card. Lightning on the other hand looks like the Ferrari of video cards, with it's aluminum accents and aggressive styling. The Classy on the other hand is a plastic box with stickers.
> 
> 4. The classified requires you to buy yet ANOTHER device (EVBOT) for $50 + tax + shipping on top of an already expensive video card, in order to tweak voltage. The lightning does it all from software.
> 
> Damn straight I'm a Lightning fanboy, it's the best card I have ever used. I will say that EVGA's customer service and RMA speed/ease of use is unmatched however. They are great guys.


It is funny, because although I do prefer EVGA cards, come August 7 if I can't find a classified and the Lightnings are available, I will be ordering one of these.


----------



## Eggy88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> neliz I like your style.
> 
> Strong score, strong everything.
> 
> To all those prancercising about the Classified, you're forgetting a few things:


I'm in no way a Classified fanboy, and have actually never owned a Nvidia card since the 4XX gen, but a few things are worth mentioning.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> 1. Lightning with software hack provides up to +200mv above stock volts, unmatched by any other vendor without hardware mod. If you are in to "bleeding edge" performance without hardware mods this has been the best card historically. If you wanna hard mod it doesn't really matter what card you buy anyway, it's more so lotto with how good your chip sample is.


Has anyone actually confirmed this (voltage control) by software? I could be mistaken but AFAIK no one has actually said anything about that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> 3. The classified looks ugly. It's a fat stubby card. Lightning on the other hand looks like the Ferrari of video cards, with it's aluminum accents and aggressive styling/paintjob. The Classy on the other hand is a plastic box with stickers.


Looks are up to each individual person, some may prefer the Classy over the Lightning others the other way around (even though i tend to stick with the later)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> 4. The classified requires you to buy yet ANOTHER device (EVBOT) for $50 + tax + shipping on top of an already expensive video card, in order to tweak voltage. The lightning does it all from FREE software.


First of the Classy can do 1.35v without the EVGA bot via software, the bot allows for up to 1.85v and control of some other voltages.
and secondly no one has said anything about the price of the Lightning, so for all we know it could be 50$ on top of the Classy again.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> 5. *On a lightning you can DISABLE the nerfing mechanisms that Nvidia put in place on the stock cards such as thermal throttling and power target throttling! On the lightning, removing this limit is as easy as flipping a switch.*


Again has anyone confirmed this on the GTX 780?


----------



## MakubeX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Lightning vs Classified, What's better, Probably comes down to which is easier to RMA right? Evga wins...


Evga? Have you ever RMAed an MSI card? It's as easy as it gets. Return time is pretty fast too as far as RMAs go.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MakubeX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Lightning vs Classified, What's better, Probably comes down to which is easier to RMA right? Evga wins...
> 
> 
> 
> Evga? Have you ever RMAed an MSI card? It's as easy as it gets. Return time is pretty fast too as far as RMAs go.
Click to expand...

THIS...
all they require is the serial number off the card.


----------



## TormenteD

Warranty is warranty. In the end the customer always wins. Customer service is a different thing entirely.


----------



## supermi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> THIS...
> all they require is the serial number off the card.


Same for EVGA, 3 year warranty attached to serial number for all EVGA cards has been standard for a few years now.


----------



## malmental

eVAGA doesn't require proof of purchase as in receipt from newegg or tiger with same name and address of RMA.?


----------



## Cial00

i'd be curious to know what the RMA numbers even are on the Lightnings. Probably pretty low because the card is built like a brick-**** house and made to handle a ton of stress


----------



## GTR Mclaren

So if the EVGA C can reach 1.4Ghz......this one will be "stock" clocked at 1.3Ghz maybe ??


----------



## Scorpion667

"Has anyone actually confirmed this (voltage control) by software? I could be mistaken but AFAIK no one has actually said anything about that."

Why would MSI downgrade? Nothing changed with regards to the vendor regulations Nvidia imposed back during Kepler (680gtx), an environment in which MSI did offer software voltage control on the 680L.
There would be no logic in releasing a card with beefed up phases that can't overvolt. Why would they spend money on a custom PCB design if it is functionally the exact same as the reference card?

"Looks are up to each individual person, some may prefer the Classy over the Lightning others the other way around (even though i tend to stick with the later)"

If you're reading this you are in the market for an $800 video card. Considering plastic + stickers is the most cheapest, unattractive, least durable solution for a shroud, would you choose it over aircraft grade aluminum painted to perfection with a proper paint job? Think about that for a minute. I've had both plastic shrouds and aluminum. Plastic scratches easily, creaks, warps over time... To me it's an obvious choice but not for all I guess. This becomes completely irrelevant when watercooling anyway haha

"First of the Classy can do 1.35v without the EVGA bot via software, the bot allows for up to 1.85v and control of some other voltages."

I thought 1.35v was the hard limit with EVbot. You can confirm with a source that the hard voltage limit is 1.85v with EVbot and no hard mods, I will buy it immediately. No joke. Performance > everything. I wonder what Nvidia has to say about this though? They told EVGA last generation to remove EVBot from the 680 classy or else they will refuse to do any warranty work for their GPU's. And EVGA complied, they removed the EVbot port completely from the card.

"and secondly no one has said anything about the price of the Lightning, so for all we know it could be 50$ on top of the Classy again."

Could be. Only time will tell.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eggy88*
> 
> I'm in no way a Classified fanboy, and have actually never owned a Nvidia card since the 4XX gen, but a few things are worth mentioning.
> Has anyone actually confirmed this (voltage control) by software? I could be mistaken but AFAIK no one has actually said anything about that.


This has been discussed previously and again, while I can't confirm or deny it, think for yourself if you can reach these kinds of scores with the regular limitations in place.
Quote:


> Looks are up to each individual person, some may prefer the Classy over the Lightning others the other way around (even though i tend to stick with the later)


There is a nice story about this, I can't completely detail right now.. but over the last two-three years, there's been a big change in GPU land, the way coolers look and work etc.

Regarding the color, when we introduced the R7970 Lightning at CeBIT last year, I was very proud and we got loads of positive comments about this change in color, though some people still preferred the old "metallic grey" look.
Being one of the protagonists of the Black and Yellow for our OC stuff, I personally like it better then the metallic look our Twin Frozr II and III had. this is my personal taste.. I've seen the cooler in many different shapes and colors, but I think black just fits better with everything (as you might've noticed, we've kind of synergized our product lineups completely in this regard.)
But also the way NVIDIA handled their coolers on Titan ... I think a lot of people will agree this more, industrial, design is inspiring. So we got a lot of feedback on that as well, people don't like the NV reference cooler because of its performance compared to our Twin Frozr, but it just looks hella cool. So, once you'll see the new TF next week, I hope you can appreciate what we've done with regards to the looks, bigger, tougher.. I promise you when you put the new Lightning next to anything on the market right now, it will scream MURDER!
Quote:


> First of the Classy can do 1.35v without the EVGA bot via software, the bot allows for up to 1.85v and control of some other voltages.


and secondly no one has said anything about the price of the Lightning, so for all we know it could be 50$ on top of the Classy again.
Again has anyone confirmed this on the GTX 780?[/quote]

I can't confirm the price of the new Lightning, but the the EVBot is a $50 investment for this right? essentially an extra piece of control that is already in the hardware and software (Afterburner / Afterburner App.) So you're comparing capabilities without the actual costs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTR Mclaren*
> 
> So if the EVGA C can reach 1.4Ghz......this one will be "stock" clocked at 1.3Ghz maybe ??


FYI, reasons why we don't release "crazy" clocked cards to the mass market:

Testing and Validation costs
Increased Power Consumption
Increased Thermal load and as such, reduced lifetime -> higher RMA rates
The last one is probably the most important one. Overclocking WILL reduce the lifetime of your product so, even though we could theoretically produce cards that run at 1350 MHz out of the box, it would only spell trouble. Not only for the higher failure rate once the card is in your PC, it also means we need to keep extra stock of spare cards for warrantyservice.

And who is paying for those cards that we have to keep in stock for warranty replacements? exactly!








In reality this comes down to tuning to a couple of MHz as to keep expected failure rates within certain limits as to keep the cost for warranty replacement low and a competitive market price for the product.

So what good is it for us to produce a product that is the fastest out of the box, but will only damage our reputation because it has an insanely high RMA rate?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> "Has anyone actually confirmed this (voltage control) by software? I could be mistaken but AFAIK no one has actually said anything about that."
> 
> Why would MSI downgrade? Nothing changed with regards to the vendor regulations Nvidia imposed back during Kepler (680gtx), an environment in which MSI did offer software voltage control on the 680L.
> There would be no logic in releasing a card with beefed up phases that can't overvolt. Why would they spend money on a custom PCB design if it is functionally the exact same as the reference card?
> 
> "Looks are up to each individual person, some may prefer the Classy over the Lightning others the other way around (even though i tend to stick with the later)"
> 
> If you're reading this you are in the market for an $800 video card. Considering plastic + stickers is the most cheapest, unattractive, least durable solution for a shroud, would you choose it over aircraft grade aluminum painted to perfection with a proper paint job? Think about that for a minute. I've had both plastic shrouds and aluminum. Plastic scratches easily, creaks, warps over time... To me it's an obvious choice but not for all I guess. This becomes completely irrelevant when watercooling anyway haha
> 
> *"First of the Classy can do 1.35v without the EVGA bot via software, the bot allows for up to 1.85v and control of some other voltages."
> 
> I thought 1.35v was the hard limit with EVbot. You can confirm with a source that the hard voltage limit is 1.85v with EVbot and no hard mods, I will buy it immediately. No joke. Performance > everything. I wonder what Nvidia has to say about this though? They told EVGA last generation to remove EVBot from the 680 classy or else they will refuse to do any warranty work for their GPU's. And EVGA complied, they removed the EVbot port completely from the card.*
> 
> "and secondly no one has said anything about the price of the Lightning, so for all we know it could be 50$ on top of the Classy again."
> 
> Could be. Only time will tell.


One of the classified owners has confirmed up to 1.35V in software with the voltage tool, & his evbot allows voltage up to 1.8V, although on air he hasn't tried clicking the 'apply voltage' button at 1.8V.

I would expect the 780 lightning to have similar limits, like the other lightnings have done before.


----------



## fateswarm

What kind of warranty do you offer for someone that does highly overclock such a card?


----------



## jomama22

I'll say that the evbot is practical for those who don't have/can't get Afterburner MOA. As someone getting into ln2, it puts me in a position that if I want the extra volts to really push the card, I need the evbot as the MOA AB isn't very easy to get a hold of without good amounts of previous experience. Obviously, we don't know how far the limit will be in AB without MOA, but I would guess 1.35v as well.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> What kind of warranty do you offer for someone that does highly overclock such a card?


EVGA and MSI ALLOW overclocking and still provide warranty, the catch being if the card is damaged or becomes defective directly from overclocking/overvolting then the warranty it void.

Now, understand that there is no way for them to tell overclocking/volting is what caused the card to blow, so it is an honor system, so to speak, on RMAing your card or not. Most people frown upon (as they should) sending back a fried card because of a problem you created.

This is a huge part of nvidias greenlight program and why you have seen hard limits on their most recent products. The last time we had a true, unlocked, nvidia GPU were the 680 LNG and 680 classy. Both of those only stayed unlocked for ~a month before nvidia put the hammer down.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ethan319*
> 
> I'm not a big fan of MSI, but I have to agree that Lightnings are better than Classifieds in performance wise.
> Also, MSI has way much better cooling solution.
> MSI provides decent rma services, although it's not as great as EVGA.
> Plus MSI's warranty goes under serial number so is easier to trade or sell in future.
> Besides, EVGA's warranty is stuck to original owner.
> Do you still think that EVGA wins?


Wait wut?

EVGA's warranty is by serial number....


----------



## neliz

and the HWBOT submission, for those interested:
http://hwbot.org/submission/2406887_elmor_3dmark11___performance_geforce_gtx_780_20195_marks


----------



## Snuckie7

lol 1800MHz


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> and the HWBOT submission, for those interested:
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2406887_elmor_3dmark11___performance_geforce_gtx_780_20195_marks


You've been talking about how great the cooler is, looks pretty ugly to me.











Interesting that we have Extreme clock for clock comparisons now.













Congrats on this great achievement, would love to see some Max on Air OC's next.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> You've been talking about how great the cooler is, looks pretty ugly to me.


At least Dyaems was right about the 12cm fan!


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> You've been talking about how great the cooler is, looks pretty ugly to me.


Lol, comes with the first potful of LN2 from MSI!


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Lol, comes with the first potful of LN2 from MSI!


That would be painful to ship safely!


----------



## neliz

This one slipped past me before, 7K in Firestrike extreme:
http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2406917_elmor_3dmark___fire_strike_extreme_geforce_gtx_780_7028_marks


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> This one slipped past me before, 7K in Firestrike extreme:
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2406917_elmor_3dmark___fire_strike_extreme_geforce_gtx_780_7028_marks


Damn... just release the card already!


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Damn... just release the card already!


Second that, wow!!!


----------



## TormenteD

And of course I got myself two reference 780's.. I wish I was more patient. Won't let it happen again when Maxwell gets released. I'm assuming there will be thunder once more..?!


----------



## malmental

I'm probably going to skip the first Maxwell release if it is indeed GTX 8 series.
After going from GTX 5 to GTX 6, and now finally on GTX 7, I'm not going GTX 8 and then wait for the refresh GTX 9..


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I'm probably going to skip the first Maxwell release if it is indeed GTX 8 series.
> After going from GTX 5 to GTX 6, and now finally on GTX 7, I'm not going GTX 8 and then wait for the refresh GTX 9..


Will you also draw the Tarot?


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I'm probably going to skip the first Maxwell release if it is indeed GTX 8 series.
> After going from GTX 5 to GTX 6, and now finally on GTX 7, I'm not going GTX 8 and then wait for the refresh GTX 9..
> 
> 
> 
> Will you also draw the Tarot?
Click to expand...

if it leads me to or brings me some CUDA....


----------



## villain

Will we see 5 functional GPCs on the Lightnings?



Spoiler: Background information



A full GK110 chip has 5 graphics processing clusters (GPCs), each of them contain 3 SMX units and a rasterizer engine. 3 SMX units are disabled on a GTX 780. If they're all in the same GPC, the GPC count goes down to 4 and a rasterizer engine is lost.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

No. Even Titan has a disabled SMX...


----------



## malmental

Titans and 780's are bad Tesla cards.?


----------



## villain

Not fully functional indeed. But if the 3 disabled SMX units are spread across different GPCs, you can still have a total of 5 graphics processing clusters.


----------



## TormenteD

Get a Quadro K6000 if you want a fully enabled GK110. You have to be realistic. It's not going to happen with their consumer grade video cards. Try to think of it as the two disabled cores in Sandy Bridge-E. The Titan is a binned workstation card that didn't "make the grade".


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> Get a Quadro K6000 if you want a fully enabled GK110. You have to be realistic. It's not going to happen with their consumer grade video cards. Try to think of it as the two disabled cores in Sandy Bridge-E. *The Titan is a binned workstation card that didn't "make the grade*".


that's exactly is what I read and was my understanding as well.


----------



## General123

Man I can't wait. Defiantly staying up for it.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> The Titan is a binned workstation card that didn't "make the grade".


Or nVidia didn't want to release a full workstation card for a fraction of the price.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Or nVidia didn't want to release a full workstation card for a fraction of the price.


Not when the chip is qualified to be sold as a full workstation card, now if it couldn't pass the leakage binning for a workstation card it would be different.


----------



## malmental

and this is part of the reason I stated that Titans and 780's *in general* will have lower ASIC scores
with 780's on average a little worse than Titans..
I've done the knowledge and I can't remember who still refutes me.

not usually the one to say 'I told you so' but damn...


----------



## villain

When I asked about 5 functional GPCs, I didn't mean fully functional. Just to clarify:

Quote:


> Depending on the card you get, *GeForce GTX 780's 12 SMX blocks are either spread between four or five Graphics Processing Clusters*. Composed of 7.1 billion transistors, GK110 is a massive chip. Manufacturing it isn't easy. And along the way, different parts of it show up with defects. So, *Nvidia can't guarantee the exact configuration of each GeForce GTX 780's GK110*. It'll only say that, across the GPU, 12 SMXes are enabled.


Source

Quote:


>


Source

According to this 5 GPCs provide a higher pixel fill rate than 4 GPCs.


----------



## malmental

http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=1987313


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> neliz I like your style.
> 
> Strong score, strong everything.
> 
> To all those prancercising about the Classified, you're forgetting a few things:
> 
> 1. Lightning with software hack provides up to +200mv above stock volts, unmatched by any other vendor without hardware mod. If you are in to "bleeding edge" performance without hardware mods this has been the best card historically. If you wanna hard mod it doesn't really matter what card you buy anyway, it's more so lotto with how good your chip sample is.
> 
> 2. The Lightning cooler is an excellent cooling solution which has seen quote a few advancements over the years. It's usually in the number 1 or 2 spot for best air cooling performance every generation, often beating even some triple slot cards (Lightning cooler is dual slot). They have had time to refine it and get it to a level where I can honestly say it's outstanding, and I'm one of the most critical people you'll ever meet. My 680 lightning on stock, never exceeds 47c. On the more extreme side of the spectrum I can keep it under 77c at 1.47v during benchmarks (1.47v is a REDICULOUS ammount of voltage for a kepler, and I did it all from software). Pls don't void my warranty neliz =(
> 
> 3. The classified looks ugly. It's a fat stubby card. Lightning on the other hand looks like the Ferrari of video cards, with it's aluminum accents and aggressive styling/paintjob. The Classy on the other hand is a plastic box with stickers.
> 
> 4. The classified requires you to buy yet ANOTHER device (EVBOT) for $50 + tax + shipping on top of an already expensive video card, in order to tweak voltage. The lightning does it all from FREE software.
> 
> 5. *On a lightning you can DISABLE the nerfing mechanisms that Nvidia put in place on the stock cards such as thermal throttling and power target throttling! The 680 classified, before they removed EVbot port to meet Nvidia's demands, those cards throttled hardcore as soon as they hit 70c with no way to remove this limit. On the lightning, removing this limit is as easy as flipping a switch.*
> 
> Damn straight I'm a Lightning fanboy, it's the best card I have ever used. I will say that EVGA's customer service and RMA speed/ease of use is unmatched however. Both teams are great but my vote goes to the Lightning this round.


Actually the classified allows removal of the thermal limitations and power limitations the same way, with the flip of a switch also. The LN2 bios switch removes a lot of the thermal constraints and limitations. I was able to do 1.35v without throttling on the stock LN2 bios. If you go any higher you need a custom bios. I do agree it sucks you have to buy the evbot to go above 1.35v but it's a really cool device. You can change voltages on the fly during benchmarks. You can control up to 4 gpu's at once. It also works with evga motherboards to oc the cpu. So it is a device that you can use for other things. I don't mean to post about the classified in here but I had to respond to your post. The evbot does show 1.8v as selectable but I would never apply that much volts unless I eventually get an LN2 pot so I can't confirm if 1.8v is really doable.

That being said I am sure the lightning is going to be absolutely amazing also.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> This one slipped past me before, 7K in Firestrike extreme:
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2406917_elmor_3dmark___fire_strike_extreme_geforce_gtx_780_7028_marks


It's strange that on the GPU-Z the defaut core clock,it's only 863 MHz,like the GTX 780 (reference one).


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> It's strange that on the GPU-Z the defaut core clock,it's only 863 MHz,like the GTX 780 (reference one).


2 reasons:
1: With the BIOS switch set to LN2 mode, the clock speeds return to reference (all Lightnings do this, or _should_ do this
2: It's not time yet to unveil the flcock speeds the Lightning ends up with in retail.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> It'll only say that, across the GPU, 12 SMXes are enabled.
> 
> 
> 
> Source
Click to expand...

That sounds extremely funny and impressive but I wonder: What's the source of the source? Did he just assume it? They may have had great success in manufacturing and explicitly disabled them. They may have discarded all dies that have anomalies beyond a certain standard and may haven't even made it into a 780.

I even suspect that if the consistency of 780 or Titans is so wreckless then their benchmarks might deviate a lot between same models or SLI performance may suffer significantly. It might be the case of course.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> 2 reasons:
> 1: With the BIOS switch set to LN2 mode, the clock speeds return to reference (all Lightnings do this, or _should_ do this
> 2: It's not time yet to unveil the flcock speeds the Lightning ends up with in retail.


Ok, thanks.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> Actually the classified allows removal of the thermal limitations and power limitations the same way, with the flip of a switch also. The LN2 bios switch removes a lot of the thermal constraints and limitations. I was able to do 1.35v without throttling on the stock LN2 bios. If you go any higher you need a custom bios. I do agree it sucks you have to buy the evbot to go above 1.35v but it's a really cool device. You can change voltages on the fly during benchmarks. You can control up to 4 gpu's at once. It also works with evga motherboards to oc the cpu. So it is a device that you can use for other things. I don't mean to post about the classified in here but I had to respond to your post. The evbot does show 1.8v as selectable but I would never apply that much volts unless I eventually get an LN2 pot so I can't confirm if 1.8v is really doable.
> 
> That being said I am sure the lightning is going to be absolutely amazing also.


At this point, we really have nothing but speculation on how the cards are going to perform. I think that right now, we're all waiting for data. It could be that we have a situation like the 7970 Lightning which had the flaw of not having Dual Link DVI and did not overclock that much better than their other counterparts (although a few did make 1,300 MHz+), but did well on LN2. We could also have a card plagued with issues, like the Asus 7970 Matrix Platinum which had quite a few problems associated with it. Finally, (and I hope) we end up with a situation like the 680 Lightning.

Historically though, it seems things favor MSI Nvidia cards. The past couple of generations (680 Lightning, 580 Lighting Xtreme Edition) have been outstanding cards, while EVGA's 680 Classified did not end up as good.

But yeah, what we really need is data. The only thing I expect right now is that MSI's Twin Frozr to outperform EVGA's ACX.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

This card will use two 8-pin PCI-E connectors, right? Planning on getting some sleeving so it would be nice to confirm. I believe the 680 Lightning was the same and the 780 Classified also has two 8-pin connectors so I'm leaning towards a yes.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> This card will use two 8-pin PCI-E connectors, right? Planning on getting some sleeving so it would be nice to confirm. I believe the 680 Lightning was the same and the 780 Classified also has two 8-pin connectors so I'm leaning towards a yes.


http://videocardz.com/44899/msi-shows-off-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-performance-with-ln2-cooling



Dual 8pin.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> This card will use two 8-pin PCI-E connectors, right? Planning on getting some sleeving so it would be nice to confirm. I believe the 680 Lightning was the same and the 780 Classified also has two 8-pin connectors so I'm leaning towards a yes.


Looks like Dual 8-pin to me.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrTOOSHORT*
> 
> http://videocardz.com/44899/msi-shows-off-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-performance-with-ln2-cooling
> 
> Dual 8pin.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Looks like Dual 8-pin to me.


Just didn't want to be wrong and waste the effort. Thank you both.


----------



## stilllogicz

So, I just received a reply from EK.

Dear Customer,

Thank you for contacting EK Support.

Due to recent amount of work with several other blocks and items, we are not planning to make a fullcoverd waterblock for this videocard in near future.
However if we change our plans we will publish that under news section.

If you need any further information, please do not hesitate to contact me.

Doesn't seem like a bright future for us water coolers. Maybe months down the road there might be one? Who knows, but I have a one month deadline to buy two 780's and put them under water.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> So, I just received a reply from EK.
> 
> Dear Customer,
> 
> Thank you for contacting EK Support.
> 
> Due to recent amount of work with several other blocks and items, we are not planning to make a fullcoverd waterblock for this videocard in near future.
> However if we change our plans we will publish that under news section.
> 
> If you need any further information, please do not hesitate to contact me.
> 
> Doesn't seem like a bright future for us water coolers. Maybe months down the road there might be one? Who knows, but I have a one month deadline to buy two 780's and put them under water.


That's a shame. Will stop a lot of guys buying them then, me included. They will do one eventually...


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> That's a shame. Will stop a lot of guys buying them then, me included. They will do one eventually...


Aquacomputer has also made Lightning blocks, don't lose hope yet! (They also look better IMHO)


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> So, I just received a reply from EK.
> 
> Dear Customer,
> 
> Thank you for contacting EK Support.
> 
> Due to recent amount of work with several other blocks and items, we are not planning to make a fullcoverd waterblock for this videocard in near future.
> However if we change our plans we will publish that under news section.
> 
> If you need any further information, please do not hesitate to contact me.
> 
> Doesn't seem like a bright future for us water coolers. Maybe months down the road there might be one? Who knows, but I have a one month deadline to buy two 780's and put them under water.


Ya I got the same exact reply for the classifed. Sucks. I really love EK blocks. The titan xxl block was really nice.


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> Ya I got the same exact reply for the classifed. Sucks. I really love EK blocks. The titan xxl block was really nice.


As far as I know they said the same about the 680 Lightning block at first. They will make it eventually, it's just that reference cards take priority for obvious reasons.


----------



## jomama22

The 7970 lng block didnt come out until augest, that 5 months after the launch in march....just to give you an idea.


----------



## dizzyscure1

Yeah, this sucks, no one wants WB's for a high end card when new higher end cards are coming out in a few months. Just saying.


----------



## Eastrider

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dizzyscure1*
> 
> Yeah, this sucks, no one wants WB's for a high end card when new higher end cards are coming out in a few months. Just saying.


Graphics
Titan


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Aquacomputer has also made Lightning blocks, don't lose hope yet! (They also look better IMHO)


Hate to break it to you but I asked Aqua Computer when they released their aquagraFX block for the 770 Lightning and they said they didn't have any plans to offer one for the 780. EK is the most likely to do it. However, as jomama22 said long waiting periods are to be expected. They're focusing on other products that sell better. The amount of people who will buy LNG blocks make up less than 1% of their customers. Just keep bugging them about it.

Also y'all need to give up on the idea that anyone will make water blocks for the Classy ever except Swiftech. EVGA has a partnership with them which is why they won't allow any other company to make blocks for the Classy. Both EVGA and Swiftech make much more money this way since you're limited to the HC if you want a water cooled Classy. This is both a blessing and a curse for customers. On one hand, it ensures there will always be a water block available for the Classy, on the other hand the Komodo blocks are known to be very restrictive and are generally not of the highest quality. Many people (including myself) dislike them and would rather use alternative options (Aqua Computer, Watercool, EK.. you name it).


----------



## stilllogicz

Oh man... so I just take the plunge and wait half a year to watercool. Or go classifieds and have crappy waterblocks.

Why do we as consumers have these problems with such high end cards?

The world may never know.

http://thinkcell.ekwb.com/idea/msi-780-lighting-water-blocks

Just keep bugging them!!


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dizzyscure1*
> 
> Yeah, this sucks, no one wants WB's for a high end card when new higher end cards are coming out in a few months. Just saying.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/quote
> 
> AMD cards will not be better than 780 Lightning and a "9970" Lightning will take forever to come out. And Maxwell is not coming any time soon. Earliest Date is June 2014 for 880.


----------



## 404Error

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> Dear Customer,
> 
> Thank you for contacting EK Support.
> 
> Due to recent amount of work with several other blocks and items, we are not planning to make a fullcoverd waterblock for this videocard in near future.
> However if we change our plans we will publish that under news section.
> 
> If you need any further information, please do not hesitate to contact me.


Yea ew. I guess classy it is.


----------



## neliz

Don't worry guys, we're working on it with EK.


----------



## stilllogicz

<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3

PLEASE NELIZ


----------



## 404Error

Come on the internet to make hasty and irrational decisions, why do you take this away from me neliz


----------



## Killa Cam

have my samples been shipped?


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> and this is part of the reason I stated that Titans and 780's *in general* will have lower ASIC scores
> with 780's on average a little worse than Titans..
> I've done the knowledge and I can't remember who still refutes me.
> 
> not usually the one to say 'I told you so' but damn...


That's such an off blanket statment.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> and this is part of the reason I stated that Titans and 780's *in general* will have lower ASIC scores
> with 780's on average a little worse than Titans..
> I've done the knowledge and I can't remember who still refutes me.
> 
> not usually the one to say 'I told you so' but damn...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's such an off blanket statment.
Click to expand...

it's really not and I have done the knowledge, maybe you should do the same..
just saying.

edit:
do you even know what the terms 'on average or in general' mean..?


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> it's really not and I have done the knowledge, maybe you should do the same..
> just saying.
> 
> edit:
> do you even know what the terms 'on average or in general' mean..?


Actually I have being an owner of both the Titan and 780, following what little percentage of people that actually post on the forums about their ASIC quality. The GTX 780s don't fair any worse than a Titan in terms of ASIC score And hell since the launch of the Classified most of them are reporting in the high 70s and 80s.


----------



## TormenteD

Rei86 is actually right. All the Classy owners have so far reported high 70's to low 80's as average ASIC scores which isn't shabby at all (ALL of them being able to reach at least the 1200MHz mark without a massive increase in voltage). They might not be extraordinary but you have to remember even with the OC cards the silicon lottery still applies. The $50 premium you spend simply increases the chance of your card overclocking well. Hell, you could get a reference card that overclocks better than a Classy/Lightning but then you'd have to resort to a custom BIOS/hard modding since they're lacking the overvolting/power target features of said cards.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> Rei86 is actually right. All the Classy owners have so far reported high 70's to low 80's as average ASIC scores which isn't shabby at all (ALL of them being able to reach at least the 1200MHz mark without a massive increase in voltage). They might not be extraordinary but you have to remember even with the OC cards the silicon lottery still applies. The $50 premium you spend simply increases the chance of your card overclocking well. Hell, you could get a reference card that overclocks better than a Classy/Lightning but then you'd have to resort to a custom BIOS/hard modding since they're lacking the overvolting/power target features of said cards.


We have a member here on OCN that has a Classy in the 60's.


----------



## neliz

A little something something for you guys.. built to impress.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> A little something something for you guys.. built to impress.


moaarrrrr

need specs!







<3


----------



## AlphaBravo

That looks AWESOME!


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> A little something something for you guys.. built to impress.


You dirty, dirty tease


----------



## neliz

And those who think "It's just Twin Frozr IV with a new shroud" ... you couldn't be more wrong


----------



## MrMarauder

So...one can postulate this might not be a Twin Frozr card, given the placement of the fan. After all, no confirmation on a new Twin Frozr revision.


----------



## General123

Well, all I can say is take my money.


----------



## criminal

My money is ready!


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Look's like a quality fan, but personally I kind of don't care about the air cooler. I'll be getting an EK block with it if I decide to buy the Lightning.

There is no doubt in my mind EK will release one.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> Rei86 is actually right. All the Classy owners have so far reported high 70's to low 80's as average ASIC scores which isn't shabby at all (ALL of them being able to reach at least the 1200MHz mark without a massive increase in voltage). They might not be extraordinary but you have to remember even with the OC cards the silicon lottery still applies. The $50 premium you spend simply increases the chance of your card overclocking well. Hell, you could get a reference card that overclocks better than a Classy/Lightning but then you'd have to resort to a custom BIOS/hard modding since they're lacking the overvolting/power target features of said cards.
> 
> 
> 
> We have a member here on OCN that has a Classy in the 60's.
Click to expand...


----------



## DADDYDC650

It's getting to be really difficult waiting on the Radeon 9970. I might have to snag 2 x MSI 780 Lightnings at launch. ...


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> A little something something for you guys.. built to impress.


I'd be seriously thinking about sending back my reference 780's if the rest of the card looked like that.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Hmm, well if EK doesn't announce a block soon for the 780 Lightning I will definitely just stick with my Titans. I mean, I can't go back to air cooled (even though I'm sure the new MSI cooler will be the sex) and waiting around 5 months for a Lightning block will not happen. I guess its wait and see...


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> A little something something for you guys.. built to impress.


Beautiful.

MSI upped their game after seeing the ACX cooler did they? Lol.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Beautiful.
> 
> *MSI upped their game after seeing the ACX cooler did they*? Lol.


I'd wager the reference cooler made all the AIB's up their game with their own coolers....


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Beautiful.
> 
> MSI upped their game after seeing the ACX cooler did they? Lol.


That's not exactly what I'd call stiff competition aesthetics-wise. But to each their own.


----------



## MrMarauder

I really hope there is a full reveal this week. These teaser pics are tantamount to torture.


----------



## jomama22

All black theme? Kinda reminds me of the ps4 styling lol

And when you say its not just a fan change...maybe the heatsink has a vapor chamber now....hmmmmmm....mmmmmm...mmmm


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I'd wager the reference cooler made all the AIB's up their game with their own coolers....


Looks wise that's a good point.


----------



## Wooojciech1983

@MSI, can You please say a bit more about the lightning of the logo, will it be still blue or yellow to match the new MPower?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wooojciech1983*
> 
> @MSI, can You please say a bit more about the lightning of the logo, will it be still blue or yellow to match the new MPower?


I am hoping it will be either white or adjustable.


----------



## StreekG

I suggested white lighting at some stage I think it would be great.


----------



## szeged

I hope the leds on the shroud and (if there are any on the pcb) are easily modded. Having an all red build then blue pcb leds that's are a pain to change would suck.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> I hope the leds on the shroud and (if there are any on the pcb) are easily modded. Having an all red build then blue pcb leds that's are a pain to change would suck.


Or at least have the option to be turned off.









Are you trying to get a Classified or a Lightning? I was leaning towards the Classified, but the Lightning looks like MSI is taking a little more time with their design. And it probably includes a back plate too.

Edit: A bit of a rant, but any card that retails for more than $400 should include a back plate.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Or at least have the option to be turned off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you trying to get a Classified or a Lightning? I was leaning towards the Classified, but the Lightning looks like MSI is taking a little more time with their design. And it probably includes a back plate too.
> 
> Edit: A bit of a rant, but any card that retails for more than $400 should include a back plate.


I might get two of each and test them for myself lol.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Are you trying to get a Classified or a Lightning? I was leaning towards the Classified, but the Lightning looks like MSI is taking a little more time with their design. And it probably includes a back plate too.
> .


The blackplate was already exposed










for reference, the old backplate of the 680:


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> The blackplate was already exposed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> for reference, the old backplate of the 680:


Oh yeah!


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Okay. This is pure torture, especially after knowing that you are working with EK to make a full cover block for it.

Any idea what the expected price is for the card?


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Or at least have the option to be turned off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you trying to get a Classified or a Lightning? I was leaning towards the Classified, but the Lightning looks like MSI is taking a little more time with their design. And it probably includes a back plate too.
> 
> Edit: A bit of a rant, but any card that retails for more than $400 should include a back plate.


The funny thing is EVGA are including backplates with their 770's.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Don't worry guys, we're working on it with EK.


YES! As long as this card performs, it's a must buy for me now. All I can ask is to make sure there are clean plexi versions of the blocks.

The picture of the cooler looks amazing as well. Not seeing much yellow, but I'm not complaining.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> The funny thing is EVGA are including backplates with their 770's.


I know right!


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> The picture of the cooler looks amazing as well. Not seeing much yellow, but I'm not complaining.


Don't worry, it's there


----------



## Scorpion667

So what are you guys waiting for? It looks like the card is finished since you're taking pictures of it. Why is it not up for sale? Do you have a design flaw that you need to revise or?


----------



## Snuckie7

I didn't realize having one finished product means that it's market ready…


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> So what are you guys waiting for? It looks like the card is finished since you're taking pictures of it. Why is it not up for sale? Do you have a design flaw that you need to revise or?


The cards still have to be mass produced, packaged and shipped to sellers.

I am assuming the 7th is hard launch and will allow us to purchase?


----------



## flotrollet

Are you allowed to give info about if the lightning going to launch globally the 7th (stock 780 were avaible in Norway on release day, which doesn't always happen) or if we have to wait some weeks for it?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flotrollet*
> 
> Are you allowed to give info about if the lightning going to launch globally the 7th (stock 780 were avaible in Norway on release day, which doesn't always happen) or if we have to wait some weeks for it?


nope, I can't say anything like that, pricing, accessories etc.

You can ask, or guess things, but besides what info is public, I'm actually not even allowed to say what we will launch on the 7th.

Heck.. what am I doing here?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> nope, I can't say anything like that, pricing, accessories etc.
> 
> You can ask, or guess things, but besides what info is public, I'm actually not even allowed to say what we will launch on the 7th.
> 
> Heck.. what am I doing here?


I am going to take your







as a yes to hard launch next Wednesday.


----------



## Wooojciech1983

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> nope, I can't say anything like that, pricing, accessories etc.
> 
> You can ask, or guess things, but besides what info is public, I'm actually not even allowed to say what we will launch on the 7th.
> 
> Heck.. what am I doing here?


Just say about the LED please  Blue, yellow or different color?


----------



## szeged

Or let us know how easily modded the leds will be


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> nope, I can't say anything like that, pricing, accessories etc.
> 
> You can ask, or guess things, but besides what info is public, I'm actually not even allowed to say what we will launch on the 7th.
> 
> Heck.. what am I doing here?


Will it be the fastest 780 out of the box (let's say faster than a Classified)?


----------



## Takla

Twin Frozr V Propeller Blades


----------



## serothis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Takla*
> 
> ...
> 
> Twin Frozr V Propeller Blades


if batman designed a gpu...


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> Will it be the fastest 780 out of the box (let's say faster than a Classified)?


Can't comment on the clockspeed, but what's the fastest right now, Zotac?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serothis*
> 
> if batman designed a gpu...


I'm going to use THAT quote in my powerpoints


----------



## neliz

double


----------



## ZBoneCapone

I know previously Lightning versions had yellow in them, any chance this one won't? I really want this card for my red and black build, but I'm also a bit OCD when it comes to color matching my parts! White LEDs or markings would be AWESOME!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I know previously Lightning versions had yellow in them, any chance this one won't? I really want this card for my red and black build, but I'm also a bit OCD when it comes to color matching my parts! White LEDs or markings would be AWESOME!


Cut up some sticker of the right color to cover, or model paint. A few guys have changed the yellow highlights on their mpower boards to other colors, or removed them for all black.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I know previously Lightning versions had yellow in them, any chance this one won't? I really want this card for my red and black build, but I'm also a bit OCD when it comes to color matching my parts! White LEDs or markings would be AWESOME!


There's definitely yellow in there, you'll see tomorrow.(my time)


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Can't comment on the clockspeed, but what's the fastest right now, Zotac?


I just realized the Galaxy HOF comes with a 1006 MHz base clock/1058 MHz boost clock, making it slightly faster than the Classified out of the box. But it is probably safe to assume that the Lightning is close to these 2 cards in terms of stock clocks.


----------



## amstech

Sorry I haven't read the entire thread but, is there a pic of this GPU yet?


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amstech*
> 
> Sorry I haven't read the entire thread but, is there a pic of this GPU yet?


There are some pics of the cooler/backplate/reactor. You can find them here.


----------



## motherpuncher

I've never had a lightning before, so I don't know but are these a limited run card? Am I going to miss out on this goodness if I have to wait a few months to get one? I had a few MSI 560ti Golden edition cards and I know they were very hard to find after a few months.


----------



## StreekG

Wow, that picture of the cooler so far, drooling. Will this be the first cooler that matches the quality look and feel of the 690 and Titan coolers.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *motherpuncher*
> 
> I've never had a lightning before, so I don't know but are these a limited run card? Am I going to miss out on this goodness if I have to wait a few months to get one? I had a few MSI 560ti Golden edition cards and I know they were very hard to find after a few months.


We keep making the card as long as there is demand AND GPU supply.


----------



## stilllogicz

Got me thinking, tri SLI 780 lightnings fully decked out in EK blocks..... a man can dream can't he?


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> There's definitely yellow in there, you'll see tomorrow.(my time)


Will we get some updated specs too?!


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Will we get some updated specs too?!


this. <3


----------



## CapnCrunch10

C'mon guys. Neilz can only say what he can say. On the bright side, only about a week to go (hopefully) before we find out everything we want to know about this card.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> C'mon guys. Neilz can only say what he can say. On the bright side, only about a week to go (hopefully) before we find out everything we want to know about this card.


It doesn't hurt to ask! We're not attacking him or demanding specs, just wanting more info on a card we can't wait to get!


----------



## TormenteD

Well, 7 days until I can correct my GPU purchase mistake.


----------



## thebski

It looks like the theme this time around is black? If so, I love it. Not going to lie, I've never seriously considered the Lightning simply because the whole blue/yellow theme matches nothing in my case and really doesn't match much in general. The teaser pics so far look really awesome on this new design. Can't wait to see the whole thing. I may consider Lightning when the 880's come around if it looks as good as the teasers make it.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> It looks like the theme this time around is black? If so, I love it. Not going to lie, I've never seriously considered the Lightning simply because the whole blue/yellow theme matches nothing in my case and really doesn't match much in general. The teaser pics so far look really awesome on this new design. Can't wait to see the whole thing. I may consider Lightning when the 880's come around if it looks as good as the teasers make it.


There is yellow in it. Just nothing yellow in the teaser pics.


----------



## Cial00

anything new for us today Neliz?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> It looks like the theme this time around is black? If so, I love it. Not going to lie, I've never seriously considered the Lightning simply because the whole blue/yellow theme matches nothing in my case and really doesn't match much in general. The teaser pics so far look really awesome on this new design. Can't wait to see the whole thing. I may consider Lightning when the 880's come around if it looks as good as the teasers make it.


The 680s, 7970s & 770s are the only ones that have had yellow, all my other lightnings have been gray or black/red heatsink (480 Lightning).

One more week, still hoping I can have my homemade Titan Lightning done before the 780s are available!


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The 680s, 7970s & 770s are the only ones that have had yellow, all my other lightnings have been gray or black/red heatsink (480 Lightning).
> 
> One more week, still hoping I can have my homemade Titan Lightning done before the 780s are available!


Interesting. I would love red and black. To be honest I wouldn't have considered a card in the class of the Lightning back in the 400 series and before, so I wasn't really paying attention to them then. I've started making a little more money since then, and now these cards aren't so out of my range.









I already bought 780 Classy's for this round, but I'll definitely look hard at the Lightning when 880's come around especially if these 780's turn out to be all they appear.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> anything new for us today Neliz?


You rang, sir?


----------



## GenoOCAU

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


Oh no


----------



## ethan319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


you're totally breaking my heart


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ethan319*
> 
> you're totally breaking my heart


Yeah, that is kind of... bad.

Why not white or even silver like you know, lightning?


----------



## stilllogicz

Well you know, for those of us who're gonna watercool it's no biggie. C'MON EK!!!


----------



## PureBlackFire

white or silver would be perfect.


----------



## StreekG

I like it, won't fit my build but if you just remember guys that you won't see the yellow fan, just a nice sexy back plate, unless your computer is positioned substantially higher than your seating position.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Don't say anything bad about those colors, otherwise there will be a month delay for more fine tuning/changing colors.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Oh no


Unfortunately, my sentiments exactly. My OCD would never allow me to have mismatched fans on a card (of course an EK block would fix this right up). You listening Eddy??


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Oh boy... That's a stark contrast... Eh, if this card lives up to the hype I'll be getting it and WCing it anyway. Please EK make some clear plexi blocks for the card.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?
























This makes me so sad. Was really hoping for less yellow. Now I really need to get an EK waterblock.


----------



## dawn1980

I hate the color of this card!!! I will be getting the evga classy 780.....I wish msi would use black and silver colors like the reference 780....so damn sexy....but if the msi overclocks higher than the classy on air i might make the move since won't see the ugly yellow once installed in my case....just the badass reactor....


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


Y u do dis msi









I was hoping for two of the sexy black fans.


----------



## motherpuncher

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StreekG*
> 
> I like it, won't fit my build but if you just remember guys that you won't see the yellow fan, just a nice sexy back plate, unless your computer is positioned substantially higher than your seating position.


Actually I will, as I really enjoy my open case, so now I'll have to pass on this card, at least with the previous cooler I could cover the yellow, but this is too much.


----------



## thebski

I do like the look of cooler better than EVGA's, mainly the fact that it just appears to be much better build quality as opposed to simply a plastic shroud. That said, yea, you gotta ditch the Yellow. Nobody builds anything with Yellow in it.


----------



## jomama22

Lol @ spending $700 on a card and not buying because of color. We are talking about a GPU correct? Guess more for those who will push them as intended.

All dat horse powers from dem racing stripes.


----------



## navit

Well I for one like that and the fact that they are trying a 3 fan setup.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Lol @ spending $700 on a card and not buying because of color. We are talking about a GPU correct? Guess more for those who will push them as intended.
> 
> All dat horse powers from dem racing stripes.


That is probably the reason! If this was a $200 card, I am sure it would not be that much of a concern. Also, not everyone plans to water cool.


----------



## tx-jose

cant say im liking the lightning this time around.


----------



## dawn1980

Yea well I like my hardware to look good! These msi colors are just plain ugly when compared to evga acx classy....but if the msi clocks higher than the classy I'll take a paint brush to the yellow...I mean how builds a pc with yellow in it anyway...big bird!!! lmao


----------



## motherpuncher

Well there are others to choose from, I was just waiting to see what this one ended up like. I never once said the color would effect performance, but insults make you feel better, fine. Yes we are talking about a GPU, and all I did was express my disappointment at its looks because obviously with my case I take it into consideration.You use it as intended and I'll do what I wish as well. Not sure why you would take offense to it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


thats guna look nice in my asrock oc formula


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Unfortunately, my sentiments exactly. My OCD would never allow me to have mismatched fans on a card (of course an EK block would fix this right up). You listening Eddy??


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This makes me so sad. Was really hoping for less yellow. Now I really need to get an EK waterblock.


This is MSI's way of *ensuring* waterblocks get made for the Lightning.









Can't say I'm a fan of the current color scheme either.


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Lol @ spending $700 on a card and not buying because of color. We are talking about a GPU correct? Guess more for those who will push them as intended.
> 
> All dat horse powers from dem racing stripes.


That would be fine and dandy if it was the only card in it's class, but it's not.


----------



## Reslivo

Twin Frozr V = Triple Frozr I?

I know it doesn't have the same ring to it, but it wouldn't feel right calling it "Twin" anymore.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> That would be fine and dandy if it was the only card in it's class, but it's not.


This.

Also, I find it funny people making comments about using the card as intended, so the air cooler does not matter. Guess what, if the card was never intended to be using with the installed air cooler, then the card should be shipped bare.









Don't be water cooling snobs. The world does not revolve around you and your choices. These cards were designed with air cooling in mind otherwise they would ship with a water block!


----------



## TormenteD

That's bad. It was to be expected to have some yellow in it because of the whole MPower theme going on but goddamn. Why all top of the line products always gotta be so ugly. Water blocks aside, I wouldn't want my 700€ card looking like a taxi. I wish all custom coolers looked as good as the Asus ones.


----------



## dawn1980

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> This.
> 
> Also, I find it funny people making comments about using the card as intended, so the air cooler does not matter. Guess what, if the card was never intended to be using with the installed air cooler, then the card should be shipped bare.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't be water cooling snobs. The world does not revolve around you and your choices. These cards were designed with air cooling in mind otherwise they would ship with a water block!


Agree!!! I prefer air over water


----------



## thebski

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> It was to be expected to have some yellow in it because of the whole MPower theme going on but goddamn.


I forgot about the new MPower theme. They would look beastly on one of those.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> This.
> 
> Also, I find it funny people making comments about using the card as intended, so the air cooler does not matter. Guess what, if the card was never intended to be using with the installed air cooler, then the card should be shipped bare.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't be water cooling snobs. The world does not revolve around you and your choices. These cards were designed with air cooling in mind otherwise they would ship with a water block!


Meh, probably gonna take a paintbrush and paint the yellow stripes black if I get the Lightning.


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thebski*
> 
> I forgot about the new MPower theme. They would look beastly on one of those.


That's if you dig the black and yellow in the first place. And are willing to limit yourself to Z87 as a platform and MSI as a brand.


----------



## lilchronic

ps. ok the only reason i like the yellow is because it will match my mobo but for only about 20-30 min


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Lol @ spending $700 on a card and not buying because of color. We are talking about a GPU correct? Guess more for those who will push them as intended.
> 
> All dat horse powers from dem racing stripes.


You have to understand that some of us care just as much about aesthetics as about performance. Hard as that may be for someone like you to believe, it is neither wrong or incorrect. I like to think of my box as a work of art as much as it is a computer so its not "silly" for me to want my components to look as good as they perform....


----------



## jomama22

OK OK I apologize. My bad.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


Love the new look. Keen to see how the new cooler performs.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Does anybody have a comprehensive list of all the non-reference 780s? Would love to get a list together with all of their specs and benchmarks before they reveal the Lightning specs. I might just do it myself....


----------



## strong island 1

I know the shroud matters but a card like this is made to overvolt, if you always plan on using it with the air cooler you might as well step down and get a gaming edition. I really don't think this card was intended to be used with the air cooler. I'm not saying it doesn't matter if it's ugly, I'm just responding to previous comments. I actually think it looks pretty cool. The build quality is really nice looking.

If it clocks higher than any other 780 I would get it no matter what the shroud looked like.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> I know the shroud matters but a card like this is made to overvolt, if you always plan on using it with the air cooler you might as well step down and get a gaming edition. I really don't think this card was intended to be used with the air cooler. I'm not saying it doesn't matter if it's ugly, I'm just responding to previous comments. I actually think it looks pretty cool. The build quality is really nice looking.
> 
> If it clocks higher than any other 780 I would get it no matter what the shroud looked like.


Pretty much, you don't want to be running 1.35v 24/7 on air and if it was a beast card I'd still buy it if the PCB was pink.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Pretty much, you don't want to be running 1.35v 24/7 on air *and if it was a beast card I'd still buy it if the PCB was pink.*


I most certainly would not...


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

My wife would like a pink pcb video card, then she'll approve no problem!


----------



## StreekG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> I know the shroud matters but a card like this is made to overvolt, if you always plan on using it with the air cooler you might as well step down and get a gaming edition. I really don't think this card was intended to be used with the air cooler. I'm not saying it doesn't matter if it's ugly, I'm just responding to previous comments. I actually think it looks pretty cool. The build quality is really nice looking.
> 
> If it clocks higher than any other 780 I would get it no matter what the shroud looked like.


I don't agree about the gaming edition comment. Mainly because this new Twin Frozr V is unique to the Lightning as they have mentioned already. This will cool better than the gaming edition Twin frozr IV cooler therefore they can ship us an air card that has a higher base clock than a gaming edition and overclock higher than one too, and still perform great without getting too hot/needing water cooling


----------



## szeged

and boom goes the yellow dynamite all over the fan, must paint the shroud until ek gets their game on.


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StreekG*
> 
> I don't agree about the gaming edition comment. Mainly because this new Twin Frozr V is unique to the Lightning as they have mentioned already. This will cool better than the gaming edition Twin frozr IV cooler therefore they can ship us an air card that has a higher base clock than a gaming edition and overclock higher than one too, and still perform great without getting too hot/needing water cooling


Someone said the card was made with air cooling in mind first. i was just saying that planning to always stick with the air shroud defeats the whole purpose of buying this card in the first place. I was just gaming at 1.35v and hit 83c with the air cooler on the classified. All I would ever see of the shroud is however long it took for EK to release a block or myself to save up for exotic cooling. Otherwise I think this card would be a waste of money. To not want a beast card like this just because it has yellow on it is crazy. I'm sure the gaming edition would give you high enough clocks to be happy and still keep temperatures inline with the aircooler.

For me at least while I wait for a block my rig isn't complete anyway so I think the card would look really cool for a little while until I got a block and fully completed the look I was going for.


----------



## StreekG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> Someone said the card was made with air cooling in mind first. i was just saying that planning to always stick with the air shroud defeats the whole purpose of buying this card in the first place. I was just gaming at 1.35v and hit 83c with the air cooler on the classified. All I would ever see of the shroud is however long it took for EK to release a block or myself to save up for exotic cooling. Otherwise I think this card would be a waste of money. To not want a beast card like this just because it has yellow on it is crazy. I'm sure the gaming edition would give you high enough clocks to be happy and still keep temperatures inline with the aircooler.


Yeah that's fair enough. I don't care much for watercooling personally but i do like to have the best hardware that i can play around with so the Lightning suits my purpose, i currently run 2 x 680 Lightnings on air and couldn't be happier, that is until the 780L comes out









The yellow doesn't suit me but i can always change that, won't stop me from getting one.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> and boom goes the yellow dynamite all over the fan, must paint the shroud until ek gets their game on.


You can go to EK's site and suggest products that you want water blocks from. I already did, and suggest that everyone that wants an EK block for this card go ahead and do that


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> You can go to EK's site and suggest products that you want water blocks from. I already did, and suggest that everyone that wants an EK block for this card go ahead and do that


i hope msi designers dont get a say in the waterblocks appearance or else well get a can of spilled yellow paint on the blocks also


----------



## stilllogicz

If you want a waterblock for this beast then voice your opinion and hit the like button.

http://thinkcell.ekwb.com/idea/msi-780-lighting-water-blocks

That's what this is there for. Speak up!


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

I voted just now, it's at 24 now.


----------



## strong island 1

even though I have classified's i voted to help you guys out. it's at 26 already.


----------



## StreekG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> even though I have classified's i voted to help you guys out. it's at 26 already.


That's good community love. Nice work


----------



## Gallien

Paint the shroud and fan, problem solved.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Painting fans can be problematic due to balance issues...


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Painting fans can be problematic due to balance issues...


I really think that's just a myth. If you have common sense you can spray and even coat and the fans don't spin fast enough to make it that critical.


----------



## StreekG

I heard that instead of spraying fans, dying them is the better option.


----------



## 2010rig

Instead of having to spray fans, they shouldn't come in such an ugly yellow color to begin with.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Instead of having to spray fans, they shouldn't come in such an ugly yellow color to begin with.


Your avatar is exactly how I feel about everyone being upset over the fans/aesthetics. Lol.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Your avatar is exactly how I feel about everyone being upset over the fans/aesthetics. Lol.


Touché, just personal preference I guess.

This pic was pure awesomeness:



This one just killed the awesomeness vibe. I find that yellow fan very tacky.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


Why? The yellow fan looks tacked on and cheap. I'm sorry, but it doesn't look right.


----------



## Dyaems

its you guys fault that neliz doesnt post anymore j/k

so it has 3 fans, 2x 120mm and 1x 100mm. hmmmm







the color scheme is OK but i think its better to have the fan painted it black, just like the 680/770/7970 lightnings


----------



## Scorpion667

I can't say I like the asymmetrical coloured fans either, but I'll probably buy the card anyway. I'm all for performance, and I bet that cooler should handle some great OC's until full cover blocks come out =)

Hoping for the same feature set as the 680L like voltage read points, dual BIOS, custom power limit 300% and plenty of voltage to play around with nom sayin'?


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> If you want a waterblock for this beast then voice your opinion and hit the like button.
> 
> http://thinkcell.ekwb.com/idea/msi-780-lighting-water-blocks
> 
> That's what this is there for. Speak up!


I don't need a waterblock,i even don't know so much about watercooling in my real life,(for sure "virtually" everyday i read things about it on hardwares sites and forums).But i just registered on EK Think Cell and voted,now it's at 28 votes.
I can understand peoples,give priority at what their pc looks like,but for me the yellow fans it's not a problem,i just want a powerful graphic card,i'm still using my MSI GTX 580 Lightning Extrem Edition,but now i finally saved some money,i'll get this GPU.
What i ask myself everyday it's:
what about the price?
The clock speed ?(i know neliz can't talk about it,but now only 6 days to wait)..
And with my little money,i really hope Maxwell will not come out before june 2014,just because for sure next GPU generation will be more powerful,but now i can't wait anymore and i really need something else than my 580 lightning to play BF4 (frostbite 3!) on my 120 Hz monitor and my 1440p one too.

neliz thanks for all the informations you give us,since the beginning of this thread.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> I really think that's just a myth. If you have common sense you can spray and even coat and the fans don't spin fast enough to make it that critical.


Not really. Even with a thin coat of paint, you can affect the performance of your fan.

I'm not crazy about the color myself, but when it comes down to it, performance >>>> aesthetics. Buy your cards based on performance, the manufacturers history of honoring warranties, and if you water cool, the availability of blocks.


----------



## ethan319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Reslivo*
> 
> Twin Frozr V = Triple Frozr I?
> 
> I know it doesn't have the same ring to it, but it wouldn't feel right calling it "Twin" anymore.


^ Good eye.
It looks like there's another fan next to those two.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ethan319*
> 
> ^ Good eye.
> It looks like there's another fan next to those two.


Those are pictures of all three fans . The yellow fan is in the middle. The MSI logo is facing right side up with the PCB.

You can tell by the screws. The screws to the right on the yellow fan are the same placement as the stand alone fan pic.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


I like it.

Honestly let's wait to see full pics of the product before making any snap judgments about aesthetics.

And comeon, it still looks better than the Classy


----------



## villain

It wouldn't look as bad if the pic showed all 3 fans. But it looks like they sacrificed performance for looks by building the cooler out of many separate parts.


----------



## Wooojciech1983

@MSI, are there two black fans and the midlle is yellow? Can You please show the backplate or just say the color of the LED.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> It wouldn't look as bad if the pic showed all 3 fans. But it looks like they sacrificed performance for looks by building the cooler out of many separate parts.


lol @sacrificed performance... hahahaha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wooojciech1983*
> 
> @MSI, are there two black fans and the midlle is yellow? Can Yoy please show the backplate or just say the color of the LED.


Yes, no
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> The clock speed ?(i know neliz can't talk about it,but now only 6 days to wait)..
> neliz thanks for all the informations you give us,since the beginning of this thread.


I gave a small hint before when discussing other clockspeeds and a certain card that might be a target for this


----------



## villain

Then let's hope it won't blow a lot of the heat back into the case, it sure looks like it









You asked for the fastest card here, but it seems the Classy is card you're trying to beat in terms of stock clocks.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> You asked for the fastest card here, but it seems the Classy is card you're trying to beat in terms of stock clocks.


there are cards out there with plenty higher stock clocks


----------



## fateswarm

I'm actually susprised at how many men care about the color of a fan inside a computer.


----------



## dawn1980

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> even though I have classified's i voted to help you guys out. it's at 26 already.


Hey can you comment on your classifieds performance on air? I recently got 2 evga 780 acx model and both oc to around 1225 on air....I returned them to bestbuy when I found out evga was releasing the classy! I just wanted some info on how the card performs with the precision x tool on air overlocked....think it will go up to 1400mhz long as stays cool inside my case? thanks in advance


----------



## GenoOCAU

I had to find a suitable youtube vid for this on-going yellow colour scheme...

The clip's commentary is as follows:

Man: No I DON'T WANT YELLOW.
Monkey MSI designer: You want the yellow.
Man: Please no, no, no, please.... no more yellow.
Monkey MSI designer: Im telling you, you want yellow. Have the yellow.

Repeat the above 3-4 times.


----------



## motherpuncher

F- it, I'm going with a McDonald's theme!


----------



## Kaapstad

I must be in the minority but I thought the fan pic looked ok.

I also think we need a pic of the whole card before we pass judgement on it.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> I had to find a suitable youtube vid for this on-going yellow colour scheme...
> 
> The clip's commentary is as follows:
> 
> Man: No I DON'T WANT YELLOW.
> Monkey MSI designer: You want the yellow.
> Man: Please no, no, no, please.... no more yellow.
> Monkey MSI designer: Im telling you, you want yellow. Have the yellow.
> 
> Repeat the above 3-4 times.


That's funny as.


----------



## revro

hmm nice yellow but too yellow even for my akasa venom toxic case with 8 viper fans, gonna stay with my gb 780oc

best
revro


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm actually susprised at how many men care about the color of a fan inside a computer.


It probably has something to do with the site you are on. Another name for OCN could be Obsessive Compulsive.net. People spend hundreds of extra dollars sometimes just to keep a common color scheme in their build.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm actually susprised at how many men care about the color of a fan inside a computer.
> 
> 
> 
> It probably has something to do with the site you are on. Another name for OCN could be Obsessive Compulsive.net. People spend hundreds of extra dollars sometimes just to keep a common color scheme in their build.
Click to expand...

so true....
all six rigs in my house color coordinate as well as the ones I build for people..


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> It probably has something to do with the site you are on. Another name for OCN could be Obsessive Compulsive.net. People spend hundreds of extra dollars sometimes just to keep a common color scheme in their build.


This....so much this.

Corsair so120 fans are more expensive than the better performing scythe ap-15s but people get them anyways for the splash of color.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> so true....
> all six rigs in my house color coordinate as well as the ones I build for people..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> This....so much this.
> 
> Corsair so120 fans are more expensive than the better performing scythe ap-15s but people get them anyways for the splash of color.


And there is certainly nothing wrong with that. I mean as a company, I think MSi would love to here criticism as well as praise. Besides, for a $600+ dollar card, color options shouldn't be out of the question. Like those color snap rings on the Corsair fans. Just have different color options that can be purchased for cheap that allows different color schemes.


----------



## provost

If the performance surpasses the classifieds, I will be very forgiving of this color scheme







if not, oh well, then there are other options


----------



## revro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> This....so much this.
> 
> Corsair so120 fans are more expensive than the better performing scythe ap-15s but people get them anyways for the splash of color.


just tell me







i bought for my 133eur case 7 akasa viper fans for 13eur each = 91eur extra







so its all yellow

best
revro


----------



## whyscotty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kaapstad*
> 
> I also think we need a pic of the whole card before we pass judgement on it.


^^^
This

Also how many on here will buy the card and as soon as blocks become available,

will take great pleasure in ripping the cooler off


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Sorry but this thing looks like a cheap Zotac with the yellow fan. I've always preferred the aesthetics of the Lightning cards but sadly that looks to be over with.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Sorry but this thing looks like a cheap Zotac with the yellow fan. I've always preferred the aesthetics of the Lightning cards but sadly that looks to be over with.


In b4 the 680s and 770s fly off the shelfs

We should hold judgment until the card is released. This is what happens when a company strays for the norm and trys something new. People usually react negatively because they are afraid of change lol


----------



## Chomuco




----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*


That looks sexy, however, all I can see is a bright yellow fan in my nightmares!


----------



## wot

Ah so many yellow hater... Guys at first I didn't like the new MSI Mpower Max/Xpower boards because of the yellow but in person they look very nice.


----------



## revro

my gb 780oc in a yellow hell cage / den of vipers









best
revro


----------



## Takla

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*


white case, red tubing, red ram, blue lightning, brown-ish exhaust-fan and you have a problem with a yellow fan?


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *revro*
> 
> my gb 780oc in a yellow hell cage / den of vipers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> best
> revro


That Lightning cad was made just for you!


----------



## Pr0xy

I'll only buy one if there's a waterblock available for it.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pr0xy*
> 
> I'll only buy one if there's a waterblock available for it.


Make sure to vote:

http://thinkcell.ekwb.com/idea/msi-780-lighting-water-blocks


----------



## Pr0xy

Damn, I'll set up a profile with them when I get home. On my phone right now.


----------



## Blackops_2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> dude...i am so tempted to trade in the 3 7970 lightnings for 3 780 lightnings....


Selling my 7970s to fund a 780 and then save up for another down the road. I wonder how much more the lightning will cost? Also wouldn't it piss Nvidia off that MSI is unlocking everything?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blackops_2*
> 
> Selling my 7970s to fund a 780 and then save up for another down the road. I wonder how much more the lightning will cost? Also wouldn't it piss Nvidia off that MSI is unlocking everything?


Since the Classified is $699 (another unlocked card) I can't see how MSI could justify much more than that. So I would say around the $700 mark. And Nvidia does not care, because MSI will be responsible for any gpus damaged by the unlocked voltage.


----------



## MoBeeJ

So "tripple frozer 1" ? Windforc-zer V? I dont care much about color scheme, rather originality...

I know this card will rock, so we should wait.


----------



## Kimir

Eh, all the debate about color reminds me of the launch of the new Mavic crossmax enduro lineup (mountain bike equipment). All in yellow, the new wheels set, shirt, gloves, helmet, shoes. Mavic already had yellow rim, the downhill ones, since, well I don't remember exactly but in 1999, those were already yellow, the top of the line shoes too.
Personally, yellow I my fav color, so I'm ok with it, but haters gonna hate.

Isn't that beautiful?!

Image courtesy of whyex, Anne Caroline-Chausson, Megavalanche-2013

Sorry for the HS

ps: If only MSI France HQ had a pair, I'd love to try them. It's only at 5 min of my working place.


----------



## ethan319

no more twin frozr


----------



## Scorpion667

@Kimir

No bash plate and tensioner? Yikes


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ethan319*
> 
> no more twin frozr


Good riddance, twin frozr isn't exactly the quietest solution available and the "propeller blade" fans have an annoying sound to them that other fans don't have.


----------



## theonedub

^ Yeah, they were great at keeping things cool, but the fans on every TFII and TFIII equipped card I have owned have all been unusually loud.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theonedub*
> 
> ^ Yeah, they were great at keeping things cool, but the fans on every TFII and TFIII equipped card I have owned have all been unusually loud.


It's not that they're particularly loud, but they do make a weird noise that isn't easily drowned out. The fans make a whirring noise instead of a whooshing sound.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kimir*
> 
> ps: If only MSI France HQ had a pair, I'd love to try them. It's only at 5 min of my working place.


Ask Pepi if you can bench at the office


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jack Mac*
> 
> Good riddance, twin frozr isn't exactly the quietest solution available and the "propeller blade" fans have an annoying sound to them that other fans don't have.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theonedub*
> 
> ^ Yeah, they were great at keeping things cool, but the fans on every TFII and TFIII equipped card I have owned have all been unusually loud.


I can honestly say I have no idea what you guys are talking about, my TF2 card is really quiet, and keeps the "Hot" Fermi chip cool below 70C at full load, even in the summer time.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theonedub*
> 
> ...the fans on every TFII and TFIII equipped card I have owned have all been unusually loud.


Yes, this was my experience with a 560ti. After everyone was raving over how marvelous and quiet the 'twin frozr' was (what the hell is "frozr" supposed to mean by the way - Engrish gone wild?).

I'd be interested to see a three slot deep EE blower cooler.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> Yes, this was my experience with a 560ti. After everyone was raving over how marvelous and quiet the 'twin frozr' was (what the hell is "frozr" supposed to mean by the way - Engrish gone wild?).
> 
> I'd be interested to see a three slot deep EE blower cooler.


Usually you have to try a reference cooler first, every twin frozr I've had is pretty quiet compared to reference.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Usually you have to try a reference cooler first, every twin frozr I've had is pretty quiet compared to reference.


I confess I never had any experience with the reference 560Ti cooler, but compared to other Nvidia reference coolers I had, I still didn't find it particularly impressive. It certainly wasn't quiet enough to warrant the total mess it made of my case's airflow. Any audible gains from the card itself were lost because of the increased case fan RPMs required to move air being dumped on other components. I'm very disappointed that EVGA has pulled an MSI and moved away from it's EE classified coolers.


----------



## theonedub

Depends on what reference you compare it to. The reference cooler on my 780 is much quieter than the 580L and 6970L I used before.

I suppose maybe I just don't remember how loud reference coolers were on the older cards like the 470, 6870, etc. Maybe this three fan setup from MSI can deliver on all fronts. I would love to see temps and sound on par with something like the Accelero Xtreme Plus. I'd be up for a 780L that could do that.


----------



## Dyaems

My R7970 Lightning BE is quiet at 40% fan, when it goes 42% onwards, it starts to give that whirring noise








Cant complain with the temps and performance im getting though! And there is always fan control in MSI afterburner anyways.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I can honestly say I have no idea what you guys are talking about, my TF2 card is really quiet, and keeps the "Hot" Fermi chip cool below 70C at full load, even in the summer time.


My problem isn't so much the noise level, but rather the peculiar sound the fans make. That and my card is a crap OCer (Not MSI's fault). I don't think I've ever won the silicon lottery.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I can honestly say I have no idea what you guys are talking about, my TF2 card is really quiet, and keeps the "Hot" Fermi chip cool below 70C at full load, even in the summer time.


Who is that in your avatar, 2010rig? Just curious.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jack Mac*
> 
> My problem isn't so much the noise level, but rather the peculiar sound the fans make. That and my card is a crap OCer (Not MSI's fault). I don't think I've ever won the silicon lottery.


You know what, I just remembered that a while back, I think I know exactly the annoying noise you are referring to *my bad*. I cleaned out the fans and it seemed to stop. Try it and see if that helps.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Who is that in your avatar, 2010rig? Just curious.


Cheryl Cole


----------



## Oubadah

Next time just drag it into Google image search.


----------



## xoleras

Oh yeah, I forgot about google image. I was momentarily mesmerized by 2010's avatar....


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Yeah he has the best avatar on OCN. I asked him about the lovely Ms. Cole months ago...


----------



## ZBoneCapone

So I definitely can't figure out how to get a GIF in my avatar....


----------



## Dyaems

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> So I definitely can't figure out how to get a GIF in my avatar....


you need to buy a 780 lightning first, before you can


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> you need to buy a 780 lightning first, before you can


According to his sig, he already has one. So why can't he upload .gif's?

I'm not sure what the limit is, but it's either 1MB or 2MB, and you upload the same way as uploading an avatar.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> According to his sig, he already has one.


Proposed build.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Proposed build.


Thank you. Some forget to read the fine print


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> So I definitely can't figure out how to get a GIF in my avatar....


Works fine for me (ignoring corruption).


----------



## Kimir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> @Kimir
> 
> No bash plate and tensioner? Yikes


That's not me but yeah, with XX1 most users including me aren't using anything anymore. 30T ring, plenty of space.

you know, overclocking and stuff







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Ask Pepi if you can bench at the office


Wait wait, you are actually saying it is possible for a consumer to take an appointment and test out the beast? And they already got them! awww


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kimir*
> 
> Wait wait, you are actually saying it is possible for a consumer to take an appointment and test out the beast? And they already got them! awww


hi : ) ,i asked myself the same question,you are lucky to work not so far from this place..but i realised something,maybe neliz was talking about pepinorang from Cowcotland


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> hi : ) ,i asked myself the same question,you are lucky to work not so far from this place..but i realised something,maybe neliz was talking about pepinorang from Cowcotland


Pepi works at MSI.









I'm not saying you CAN, but as he's a bad-ass overclocker he might play with them at some time. if you never ask, you'll never know.. also ... me saying it doesn't add ANY weight to that proposal.. it's just what I would do.


----------



## Kimir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> hi : ) ,i asked myself the same question,you are lucky to work not so far from this place..but i realised something,maybe neliz was talking about pepinorang from Cowcotland


Hi, yeah I literally drive in front of the them every day ahah.
I believe it's indeed him.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Proposed build.


Sarcasm isn't obvious sometimes huh?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Sarcasm isn't obvious sometimes huh?


I love that comment next to your avatar


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I love that comment next to your avatar


I think he has the best Avatar on OCN.


----------



## malmental

thank-you...


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Sarcasm isn't obvious sometimes huh?


How is that sarcasm? It would imply that you said he claimed he had that card. But if you click on the sig it explicitly says it's proposed. So he did not claim he has it and the sarcasm is misplaced.

Check + Mate.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I think he has the best Avatar on OCN.


Nope, that would've been Majin SSJ Eric's avatar before he changed it to its most recent incarnation


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> How is that sarcasm? It would imply that you said he claimed he had that card. But if you click on the sig it explicitly says it's proposed. So he did not claim he has it and the sarcasm is misplaced.
> 
> Check + Mate.


<== See Avatar.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I love that comment next to your avatar


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> <== See Avatar.


The only thing that would make your Avatar better would be if she were you.

Did that make sense?


----------



## malmental

unfortunately it did..


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> How is that sarcasm? It would imply that you said he claimed he had that card. But if you click on the sig it explicitly says it's proposed. So he did not claim he has it and the sarcasm is misplaced.
> 
> *Check + Mate.*


Just stop dude.. you're embarrassing yourself in almost every thread.







You were even hating on those who dislike the color scheme of the LNG a few pages back lol


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> The only thing that would make your Avatar better would be if she were you.
> 
> Did that make sense?


Makes perfect sense.

I only started using it temp as a response to a hilarious post, but now it's hard to replace.

We should prolly go back to discussing the Lightning.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> How is that sarcasm? It would imply that you said he claimed he had that card. But if you click on the sig it explicitly says it's proposed. So he did not claim he has it and the sarcasm is misplaced.
> 
> *Check + Mate.*
> 
> 
> 
> Just stop dude.. you're embarrassing yourself in almost every thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You were even hating on those who dislike the color scheme of the LNG a few pages back lol
Click to expand...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I have no idea whats going on in here anymore...


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I have no idea whats going on in here anymore...


'Cause it's a circlejerk. I was perfectly right but they can't admit it.

Check and Mate X 2.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> 'Cause it's a circlejerk. I was perfectly right but they can't admit it.
> 
> Check and Mate X 2.


lol


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> 'Cause it's a circlejerk. I was perfectly right but they can't admit it.
> 
> Check and Mate X 2.


LOL, Lighting release date is *7*/*8*/2*0*13, I'm perfectly aware that he didn't have one.









You came along telling me it was a proposed build, I thank you Captain Obvious.


----------



## ethan319

lol

5days left


----------



## Cial00

Neliz: any tasty tidbits we can munch on over the weekend?


----------



## stilllogicz

Let's go back to nagging ek for waterblocks. I support that move.


----------



## xoleras

I wouldn't worry about WB's. Every Lightning SKU has had a water block , and every time MSI worked with EK to ensure that it happened - i'm confident that WB's will be a non issue. Also, EK water blocks are superior to the restrictive-flow swiftech blocks that EVGA uses with their HC models. (IMO)

It won't arrive for probably 2-3 months afterwards, though, if the 580 and 680 lightnings were indications.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I wouldn't worry about WB's. Every Lightning SKU has had a water block , and every time MSI worked with EK to ensure that it happened - i'm confident that WB's will be a non issue. Also, EK water blocks are superior to the restrictive-flow swiftech blocks that EVGA uses with their HC models. (IMO)
> 
> It won't arrive for probably 2-3 months afterwards, though, if the 580 and 680 lightnings were indications.


Anyhow, Neliz already said they are working with EK for waterblocks for the Lightning 780 a few pages back. So there really isn't any reason to worry about it not happening.


----------



## stilllogicz

Yea I'm just hoping it's gonna be a few weeks and not a few months, that'll really set back my build. But atleast, in either case, it's gonna happen.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> Yea I'm just hoping it's gonna be a few weeks and not a few months, that'll really set back my build. But atleast, in either case, it's gonna happen.


Same. I'm banking on the fact it will be out in about a month's time (hopefully sooner). My WCing parts won't be used to their potential otherwise. Hopefully EK is quick.


----------



## zed1

...hum...sunday afternoon..
....monday...
....tuesday....
....wednesday...


----------



## MoBeeJ

Looks like evga had two up their sleeves. They regained 3dmark and firestrike WR, will msi retaliate?


----------



## ethan319

Is it possible that custom air cooled GTX 780 can outperform the overclocked GTX Titan in ref. cooler?

What do you guys think ?


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ethan319*
> 
> Is it possible that custom air cooled GTX 780 can outperform the overclocked GTX Titan in ref. cooler?
> 
> What do you guys think ?


Already happens with the 780 Classifieds.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Already happens with the 780 Classifieds.


And even the Asus DCUII


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> ...hum...sunday afternoon..
> ....monday...
> ....tuesday....
> ....wednesday...


Happy Days!


----------



## ALEXH-

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> And even the Asus DCUII


What are the max stable in-game clocks for DCUII? With 780 ACX I can't get higher than 1202mhz stable for heavy taxing games like Metro LL/FC3, C3. In benchmarks however I can sometimes finish with 1228 but usually crashes so 1215 is max for me. Kind of disappointed. I'll see how Lightening performs so I might sell this ACX and get the lightening.


----------



## TormenteD

^ Can't remember his name, but a user on here got his to over 1300 with a neat little voltage mod and an unlocked BIOS. Said he'd push for 1400+ once he gets water blocks.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> ^ Can't remember his name, but a user on here got his to over 1300 with a neat little voltage mod and an unlocked BIOS. Said he'd push for 1400+ once he gets water blocks.


Guru3d got about 1175-1200 with +37mv on the volts

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_geforce_gtx_780_directcu_ii_review,26.html


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ethan319*
> 
> Is it possible that custom air cooled GTX 780 can outperform the overclocked GTX Titan in ref. cooler?
> 
> What do you guys think ?


Certainly its possible but still fairly difficult. There's not many 780's that can match a 1241MHz Titan and pretty much all of them need more voltage than Titan is allowed...


----------



## jomama22

If you own a titan, the only reason to get any 780 is have fun with a wider array of tweaking limits. Beyond that, you are just producing more heat and burning more coal to achieve very similar results.


----------



## TormenteD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Certainly its possible but still fairly difficult. There's not many 780's that can match a 1241MHz Titan and pretty much all of them need more voltage than Titan is allowed...


That's because the Titan is clearly the superior video card (not facturing in cost). I don't understand why so many 780 owners simply cannot accept this fact. The Titan may lose to the likes of the Classy/LNG but by an unfair disadvantage (that disadvantage being Nvidia not tolerating any custom Titans). That's not to say the 780 is a bad card. Far from it. I own two myself and I'm very grateful to get performance close to the Titan without the ridiculous price tag.


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> That's because the Titan is clearly the superior video card (not facturing in cost). I don't understand why so many 780 owners simply cannot accept this fact. The Titan may lose to the likes of the Classy/LNG but by an unfair disadvantage (that disadvantage being Nvidia not tolerating any custom Titans). That's not to say the 780 is a bad card. Far from it. I own two myself and I'm very grateful to get performance close to the Titan without the ridiculous price tag.


Not sure about that myself, I feel the GTX780 is the superior card.

Still kind of baffled as to why Nvidia restricted the Titan so much, but left so much customisation to the GTX780.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Certainly its possible but still fairly difficult. There's not many 780's that can match a 1241MHz Titan and pretty much all of them need more voltage than Titan is allowed...


Not many Titans hit 1241MHz either, while most unlocked 780's can hit 1300MHz.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> Not sure about that myself, I feel the GTX780 is the superior card.


It just depends on your perspective. It's superior in price to performance ratio but no matter what way you look at it the titan is superior to the 780 in almost every way.

6Gb of VRAM
grater compute performance
more SMX units enabled
native 4way support for extreme benchmarks

we can go on and yes its $1000 but the 780 isn't that far off.


----------



## fateswarm

Don't go into price/performance much because essentially, everything above a GTX 760 is a "rip off". You got a 770? It's a "rip off". You got a 780, even more! A titan. Poor guy..


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> It just depends on your perspective. It's superior in price to performance ratio but no matter what way you look at it the titan is superior to the 780 in almost every way.
> 
> 6Gb of VRAM
> grater compute performance
> more SMX units enabled
> native 4way support for extreme benchmarks
> 
> we can go on and yes its $1000 but the 780 isn't that far off.


You forgot
-Reference design only with weak power delivery
-Locked voltage

So Titans are inferior to a few non reference 780's in a number of ways.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Don't go into price/performance much because essentially, everything above a GTX 760 is a "rip off". You got a 770? It's a "rip off". You got a 780, even more! A titan. Poor guy..


not for everyone.

Just because you mention "price to performance" doesn't mean that you want to pay no more then $300.

can your 760 play @ 5760X1080 with the settings cranked? no it cant..not even 3 in SLI will do what 2 780s or 2 titans can do at those resolutions because of VRAM and the bandwidth.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> You forgot
> -Reference design only with weak power delivery
> -Locked voltage
> 
> So Titans are inferior to a few non reference 780's in a number of ways.


Is that the board partners faults? I wouldn't blame Asus/EVGA/MSI/Galaxy for their beast 780s because we all know they would have done the same with the Titans if Nvidia would have let them make aftermarket PCBs

sorry for the double post


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> not for everyone.
> 
> Just because you mention "price to performance" doesn't mean that you want to pay no more then $300.
> 
> can your 760 play @ 5760X1080 with the settings cranked? no it cant..not even 3 in SLI will do what 2 780s or 2 titans can do at those resolutions because of VRAM and the bandwidth.


You didn't get it. I didn't mean "get 760". I meant it's pointless to talk about price over performance if your needs aren't met.

If your needs are only met with a Titan, fine, get it.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> Is that the board partners faults? I wouldn't blame Asus/EVGA/MSI/Galaxy for their beast 780s because we all know they would have done the same with the Titans if Nvidia would have let them make aftermarket PCBs
> 
> sorry for the double post


I didn't say it was anyone's fault (that's irrelevant to this discussion really). I was responding to
Quote:


> no matter what way you look at it the titan is superior to the 780 in almost every way.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I didn't say it was anyone's fault (that's irrelevant to this discussion really). I was responding to


i do see what you mean but that is why this debate will never end


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> Is that the board partners faults? I wouldn't blame Asus/EVGA/MSI/Galaxy for their beast 780s because we all know they would have done the same with the Titans if Nvidia would have let them make aftermarket PCBs


It's nVidia's restrictions on them... since you can't buy a theoretical product, it's kind of silly of people to say it's an "unfair advantage" for the 780 vs. the Titan's restricted designs. The whole world could be changed with what-ifs







.


----------



## malmental

GoldenTiger Style.....!


----------



## fateswarm

I hope someone with a Quadro comes in to dismiss all the petty Titan and 780 users.


----------



## TormenteD

GoldenTiger, there is absolutely no need for you to respond in that way when there is a civil discussion going on. You're just making yourself look immature in front of everyone else. "Real world" performance in games when comparing the two cards is negligible, we get it. Surely there are different ways to look at it but if we're to view this debate completely objectively the Titan is the superior card. Just like there is a reason the 3930K is priced considerably lower than the 3960X there is a reason the 780 is priced lower than the Titan. Just think economically for a moment. Do you really believe Intel or Nvidia would release a superior product at a lower price? Custom designs are not made by Nvidia but they allow it so that more people will buy their lower end cards rather than their flagship ones that most people can't afford.


----------



## xoleras

Paying 55% more is stupid when a factory overclocked GTX 780 passes a stock Titan easily, a fact verified by benchmarks at TPU. The Titan doesn't have customized PCB's with voltage control as select 780s do - the Titan has the potential to perform maybe 5% better if that, but it is again - stupid - to pay 55% more for that. The card is designed for surround and pretty much only surround, hence the 6GB of VRAM. 6GB is a waste for 99% of users.

Oh, but you can overclock the Titan you say. Yeah, maybe, then that puts the Titan 5% higher than the 780. You don't get voltage control, you don't get a better cooler, and you don't get a custom PCB. You're still paying 55% more for 3-5% more performance, if that - and then when you consider some 780s hitting near 1300 with voltage, the performance increase with the Titan is probably non-existent.

With the Titan you're paying for the flagship and VRAM, which is useful for surround, if you're doing 3x 2560x1600 screens. For everyone else, it isn't superior. Just like the 3960X really isn't superior to the 3930k - they both overclock and perform the same. The Titan and 780 perform the same unless you're using surround and go nuts with AA. I would hardly call it "superior". If it performed 20% faster at normal settings (say, 2560x1600) that would be superior. The situation now is that factory overclocked 780s outperform the Titan or perform very closely to OC'ed Titans. That is not "superior".

TL'DR:

Using triple 2560x1600 in surround? Go Titan

Everyone else? 780.


----------



## malmental

^
perfectly stated...
+rep


----------



## fateswarm

Dismissing the Titan with such arguments is like any 780 user dismissing 2 X GTX 760 on sub-1440p. After all, it is "useless" to have than much VRAM there and you "waste" money on performance you may not need.

Get over it, everything above the mid ends is a "rip off". You just got ripped off less than others. Let them have their fun, most of the time they just consciously sink money.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Dismissing the Titan with such arguments is like any 780 user dismissing 2 X GTX 760 on sub-1440p. After all, it is "useless" to have than much VRAM there and you "waste" money on performance you may not need.
> 
> Get over it, everything above the mid ends is a "rip off". You just got ripped off less than others. Let them have their fun, most of the time they just consciously sink money.


Plenty of cons to having two cards vs. one. Doesn't apply to 780/Titan debates.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Plenty of cons to having two cards vs. one. Doesn't apply to 780/Titan debates.


You don't get it. The point is not about that particular solution, it's about the silliness of going on about performance over cost.

The example could have been say.. GTX 770 on 1080p on normal graphics settings. It would be a "rip off" to go to 780. Hell, it's a rip off to go above GTX 760.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> You don't get it. The point is not about that particular solution, it's about the silliness of going on about performance over cost.
> 
> The example could have been say.. GTX 770 on 1080p on normal graphics settings. It would be a "rip off" to go to 780. Hell, it's a rip off to go above GTX 760.


1080p 60Hz? Yeah. Probably overkill with even the GTX 770. Rip-off? No.

1080p 120/144Hz? No. Not even close to overkill.

1440p+ (60 or 120Hz)? No. Not even remotely close to a rip-off.

And also, the GTX 760 isn't even powerful enough sometimes to run everything @ 1080p maxed out 60Hz. Think about that for a second.

There is a use for every card. However, high end cards aren't a "rip-off" unless you fall under the demographic that has no use for it. No card on the market is remotely a rip-off.


----------



## MrMarauder

One might expect discussion about the 780 Lightning in a 780 Lightning discussion thread instead of the rhetoric found in a dozen other forums.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> You don't get it. The point is not about that particular solution, it's about the silliness of going on about performance over cost.
> 
> The example could have been say.. GTX 770 on 1080p on normal graphics settings. It would be a "rip off" to go to 780. Hell, it's a rip off to go above GTX 760.


Someone said this in another thread, but you need to buy hardware that that gives you the performance you need. Price is quite irrelevant if a cheaper solution simply isn't fast enough, so no, most of those higher end cards are not "rip offs"


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TormenteD*
> 
> GoldenTiger, there is absolutely no need for you to respond in that way when there is a civil discussion going on. You're just making yourself look immature in front of everyone else. "Real world" performance in games when comparing the two cards is negligible, we get it. Surely there are different ways to look at it but if we're to view this debate completely objectively the Titan is the superior card. Just like there is a reason the 3930K is priced considerably lower than the 3960X there is a reason the 780 is priced lower than the Titan. Just think economically for a moment. Do you really believe Intel or Nvidia would release a superior product at a lower price? Custom designs are not made by Nvidia but they allow it so that more people will buy their lower end cards rather than their flagship ones that most people can't afford.


Respond in what way exactly? I am being quite polite if you look at the trolling and insults thrown around for me saying what xoleras just said pretty much. So forgive me for getting even the slightest amount testy, while these guys run around like hooligans..... Heck where is youre outrage about this response just now that was far worse by Kinasthetic?


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> ^
> perfectly stated...
> +rep


I have said the exact same thing many times yet you guys flame like mad.... What is with all the selective reading? Not even you personally but mostly forum wide....


----------



## Snuckie7

Even though I agree with your point, you don't have you preach your sermon in _every single Titan/780 thread_.

It gets old, and annoying.

Your garbage opinions about AMD don't help your forum reputation much either.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Good damn, you shame us GTX 780 owners because you refuse to realize that the GTX 780 is inferior to the GTX Titan. Who gives a flying whoop about price. You are comparing an expensive as heck card to an expensive(r) card.
> 
> And your pitiful argument about VRAM is sad. Lovely Swolern over in a thread he made (*Link*) has already proven that at extreme resolutions, there is a very real need for both the Titan's performance and VRAM.
> 
> Lay it to rest. We already know any card that you own personally you think is the greatest gift on earth. You are hitting troll level on par with Vampirr right now.


Lol. Well said.

Regardless of what the GTX 780 fan boys think, no GTX 780 without +1.212v can come close to a GTX Titan at 1202mhz. To equal the performance of a GTX Titan at those speeds you need an additional 150mhz at least on the core and a lot more voltage. Which is huge.

People really need to stop kidding themselves thinking they are identical in performance because at the same clocks speeds they most certainly are not, not to mention memory plays a large part in overclocking a GPU also, which people seem to completely dismiss. Some people need to educate themselves in the valley thread.


----------



## GoldenTiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Lol. Well said.
> 
> Regardless of what the GTX 780 fan boys think, no GTX 780 without +1.212v can come close to a GTX Titan at 1202mhz. To equal the performance of a GTX Titan at those speeds you need an additional 150mhz at least on the core and a lot more voltage. Which is huge.
> 
> People really need to stop kidding themselves thinking they are identical in performance because at the same clocks speeds they most certainly are not, not to mention memory plays a large part in overclocking a GPU also, which people seem to completely dismiss. Some people need to educate themselves in the valley thread.


That is interesting a Stance considering the top bunch of titan results barring a pair of outliers and one on ln2 are within 5pct in the very thread you quote, and titan/780 have the same mem bandwidth that you tout as so vital.


----------



## HeadlessKnight

GTX Titan <-- Better at extreme resolutions due to higher VRAM and extreme overclockers, also has a tad more compute performance than GTX 780.

GTX 780 <-- Better at everything else especially the Lightnings/ Classifieds and can beat Titans max OC on air and some bad clocking water-cooled ones.


----------



## Creator

I can only just picture some of you hitting F5 non-stop anticipating the next post to respond to, in yet another GTX 780 vs GTX Titan debate.


----------



## Dyaems

so, when is the next 780 lightning discussion?


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> so, when is the next 780 lightning discussion?


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> so, when is the next 780 lightning discussion?


When Neliz gives us another sneak peek photo


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> When Neliz gives us another sneak peek photo


We have serious ADD lol..... random tangent until relivant on topic post/pic appears then we discuss and repeat lol


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> We have serious ADD lol..... random tangent until relivant on topic post/pic appears then we discuss and repeat lol


'Tis how OCN works







. Goes fine on topic until someone trolls the thread and then all hell breaks lose until the thread dies down enough for someone to get it back on topic.


----------



## ethan319

It will be awesome if we have an option to change the yellow fan and decoration to other color scheme.








Just because... I don't want to paint the fan to get voided the precious warranty.
It's so hard to match yellow in my orange case... T_T


----------



## TormenteD

Thanks Kinaesthetic. Some people just can't accept the truth. I, for one, certainly can. To be perfectly honest 780 owners shouldn't have anything to complain about.


----------



## szeged

780 is a great card that excels at a lot of things, titan is a great card that excels at a lot of things. they both excel in different areas the other does not. Can we talk about how awesome the lightning is going to be now instead of bickering about which card we have and why its better than the other persons? we all love our own cards...we get it









4 more days....whos ready to get thunderstruck.


----------



## GenoOCAU

Im going to go EVGA Classified when I retire my 2x 680 lightnings. I've had enough funding MSI and their quest to make people like yellow.

ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN MSI, CHANGE YOUR COLOUR-SCHEME!!!!!! WTH....


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

My enthusiasm for the Lightning has been dampened by the fact that blocks won't probably be available for a few months. I can't convert my rig to air for a few months so I'll be sticking with my Titans (which most definitely are superior cards to the 780's even if only by a small amount)....


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> s (which most definitely are superior cards to the 780's even if only by a small amount)....


It doesn't matter if you win by an inch or a mile...winning is winning.


----------



## malmental

GTX Titans are only worth the price over GTX 780's for resolutions of 7680 x 1440p (or such crazy high res..)
but if your running a resolution such as that you already know this.
yes GTX 780's can run 7680 x 1440p but not as smooth as Titans do.


----------



## revro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Im going to go EVGA Classified when I retire my 2x 680 lightnings. I've had enough funding MSI and their quest to make people like yellow.
> 
> ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN MSI, CHANGE YOUR COLOUR-SCHEME!!!!!! WTH....


got a problem with yellow, i dont xD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> GTX Titans are only worth the price over GTX 780's for resolutions of 7680 x 1440p (or such crazy high res..)
> but if your running a resolution such as that you already know this.
> yes GTX 780's can run 7680 x 1440p but not as smooth as Titans do.


i had in metro last light 2798mb allocated vram usage and 2721 dedicated vram usage on a single 1440p without SSAA, only using FXAA from NCP

best
revro


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Top 25 single cards for Unigine Valley 1.0.
> 
> I see 4 GTX 780s, and 21 Titans.
> 
> The GTX 780s in the top 25 either are: Classifieds with 1.35v, or golden GTX 780s.
> 
> Most GTX 780s are hovering around the 75-76 fps mark (including yours at 76.2 fps). These are the majority (not Classified users). And I'm assuming you tweaked yours to hell and back. That would put the greatest majority of GTX 780s running at around 10-12% slower than the average OC'd Titans.
> 
> Average Valley 1.0 scores for GTX 780s based on the area most clustered with GTX 780s:
> 
> Seriously, cut it out. Your GTX 780 is good, but good damn you need to stop thinking its the end all be all of everything, and even spouting the crap you are spouting in a thread that isn't even a GTX 780 vs Titan thread.
> 
> This is the GTX 780 Lightning thread.
> 
> The GTX 780 isn't as good as the GTX Titan. End of story.


The GTX 780s in the top 10 are both classifieds and good benched runs of them, those guys worked hard on those scores. No golden GTX 780 can touch the decent overclocking GTX Titans as shown by that single GTX 780 in the top 20 that isn't +1.212v. Before those classifieds came out there was a single GTX 780 in the top 20. Sorry not equal, not even close.

Regardless these new classified's and lightning's will be beast cards and provided you have cooling to run them at 1.35v then people should choose them over the GTX Titans everyday if they don't need the VRAM. They will be very fun cards to own that will trade blows with/beat GTX Titans in benchmarks, but reference GTX 780s no, no they do not. Be interesting to see what max stable game clocks for them are.


----------



## zed1

About the region time where i live(Somewhere in Europe),when i wake up i saw 45 more posts...
Even if it was not about the *MSI GTX 780 LIGHTNING*,all that 780/Titan talk gave me a good reading and during about 20 min,i almost forgot i was wating so bad that wednesday arrive.
Or maybe thursday for the first review,but i really hope i can get it less than one week after in some hardwares/computers shop.i can not spend more than 300 euros on internet with my bank card in one time,and i don't want to give my 700 (or more) euros to my girlfriend,just because i don't want she realise what we could do with this money in this hot summer.
So, September i go buy the second one.
Ok,today is monday,neliz i think they finished with all their 780/Titan stuffs..so give us some more food about the 780 Lightning please..


----------



## revro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> About the region time where i live(Somewhere in Europe),when i wake up i saw 45 more posts...
> Even if it was not about the *MSI GTX 780 LIGHTNING*,all that 780/Titan talk gave me a good reading and during about 20 min,i almost forgot i was wating so bad that wednesday arrive.
> Or maybe thursday for the first review,but i really hope i can get it less than one week after in some hardwares/computers shop.i can not spend more than 300 euros on internet with my bank card in one time,and i don't want to give my 700 (or more) euros to my girlfriend,just because i don't want she realise what we could do with this money in this hot summer.
> So, September i go buy the second one.
> Ok,today is monday,neliz i think they finished with all their 780/Titan stuffs..so give us some more food about the 780 Lightning please..


call bank, increase the limit on card, and bum its done







then you later decrease the limit on card









best
revro


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> There is a use for every card. However, high end cards aren't a "rip-off" unless you fall under the demographic that has no use for it. No card on the market is remotely a rip-off.


That's what I was saying. Getting my examples and finding loopholes they don't apply is pointless. The particular examples were not important because everyone has their needs and the irony is that anything above the GTX 760 is "theoretically a rip-off" because it is the point performance over price diminishes. But if your needs aren't met then it might not be a rip off to go above it.

Also people have to realize Titan is not the end of it. It is way beyond regular gaming cards so the Quadros should also be discussed to see the full picture. In fact, it even inherits more FP features that are utterly useless to regular gaming.

So, think of the GK110 chip with 12GB VRAM on it. It costs around $4000. A rip-off? Hell yeah. That thing won't even need more than 1GB 90% of the time for most gamers. One could even get 4 Titans for 4-Way SLI compared to it. But.. someone may need it or even want to throw away the money for it. Some are genuinely doing it for the 'the best' status.

So.. There will always be a point that "ripping off" starts in terms of performance over price (that's around going above GTX 760 here), but.. people may not be able to do their job at all with it, or they may want to waste money. Some are even foolish and just want to go 'for the best'. It will be shown on the market price. It will reflect it. So, yes, Titan users are ripped off even more (let alone Quadro users! they are the "stupidest" of all!) but the market allows it or they may need it.


----------



## Mhill2029

I'll say it again....

Why did Nvidia restrict the Titan and not the GTX780? I find that a little baffling.....


----------



## illuz

Possibly to allow for a full fat GK110 2800 core chip?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> I'll say it again....
> 
> Why did Nvidia restrict the Titan and not the GTX780? I find that a little baffling.....


I suspect it's "marketing bureaucracy". Titan was supposed to be the "golden child" (even if the Quadro would be better, those are under the gamers' radar) that is a "shining star" that everyone will worship, mainly useful for advertising the company (it easily explains how they were surprised it even had any sales at all).

Then, when a boards' assembler goes to them and says "please let me unlock it" they say no, it's our golden child, our shining star of efficiency, do not bastardize them.

But then they allow 780 to do it because it's more "petty".

It doesn't appear techies were fully consulted.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mhill2029*
> 
> I'll say it again....
> 
> Why did Nvidia restrict the Titan and not the GTX780? I find that a little baffling.....


(skyn3t) already worked out the Quad-SLI with the GTX 780...
though I have a hard time seeing myself ever do that...


----------



## Mhill2029

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> (skyn3t) already worked out the Quad-SLI with the GTX 780...
> though I have a hard time seeing myself ever do that...


Yeah I know that mate I posted the article, it's more about why they let vendors have so much free reign on the GTX780 but not the Titan. Although fateswarm seems to be on the money with an explanation.


----------



## malmental

understood ol' wise one...









good explanation by him as well.
(though I have said the same thing on another thread..)


----------



## szeged

Normal 780 vs a titan, yeah titan will 99.99% of the time win except in some extreme cases of a good clocking 780 or garbage clocking titan.

Add in the lightnings and classifieds things change. These cards were designed to be top performance cards and so far they prove to do just that. Does that mean they make the titan obsolete? No I personally think not because there are some of us who easily use more vram or need the extra compute power.

On average right now the titan has higher performance, but when we see more classifieds and lightnings getting benched we will probably see a shift in power on the top of the charts. But until that happens the titan will generally be the better performing card. This is all leaving price to performance out of the discussion.

We could argue until the day we die on what we think is a better price to performance card. I own two titans, and personally think the 780s are a better price to performnce card, but that does not make them better overall performers, which is why I got the titans over the 780s (i also got my titans for 800 each and they cake with waterblocks.) But I built my rig with no specific budget In mind and already knew I wanted titans new or used.

So yes, the 780 is most likely the better price to performance card while the titan is the better performing card(for now) until we see more of these custom cards. Even if the titan is ahead by 100% 10% or even 1% it is still ahead.

Now lets get back to how awesome the lightning is going to be, instead of trying to turn each other's posts into a flame war. I lo e a good flame war every now and then, but I also don't want this thread to get locked









Any spelling errors or completely wrong words I blame completely on my phone


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That's what I was saying. Getting my examples and finding loopholes they don't apply is pointless. The particular examples were not important because everyone has their needs and the irony is that *anything above the GTX 760 is "theoretically a rip-off"* because it is the point performance over price diminishes. *But if your needs aren't met then it might not be a rip off to go above it.*


I think you just contradicted yourself there mate. Anything above a GTX 760 is clearly not "theoretically a ripoff" because it gives you the performance you want/need that the GTX 760 cannot.


----------



## malmental

no offense to anyone but that GTX 780 vs GTX Titan is getting really old and this is not even the thread for that going all into it...
someone needs to do a 780 vs Titan thread AGAIN for all that.
so both parties involved that got it escalated to this point need to be 'handled moderator style' as far as I'm concerned.
because when it got to be all about the 780 vs Titan is when it technically went off topic..
just saying.

now can we finally get some Lightnings around here.?


----------



## 2010rig

I would like to nominate Neliz as Hardware Rep of the year, for letting this discussion go on.

Please keep this thread for Lightning discussions GT, your redundant point has been made on many, many, and I mean MANY threads before. Honestly, it's getting old.

Maybe you should open up a thread in the NVIDIA forum called "780 vs Titan Golden Tiger style". There you can quote everything you have ever posted about the 780 vs Titan.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> no offense to anyone but that GTX 780 vs GTX Titan is getting really old and this is not even the thread for that going all into it...
> someone needs to do a 780 vs Titan thread AGAIN for all that.
> so both parties involved that got it escalated to this point need to be 'handled moderator style' as far as I'm concerned.
> because when it got to be all about the 780 vs Titan is when it technically went off topic..
> just saying.
> 
> now can we finally get some Lightnings around here.?


whoa, freaky, great minds think alike.


----------



## stilllogicz

Bank account locked and loaded. Ready to buy 2 Lightning 780's. Take my money Neliz. Kthnxbye.


----------



## stl drifter

when are the lightnings supposed to go on sale ?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I guess we will find out on Wednesday...


----------



## xoleras

Woohoo, is the Titan tangent done. Thank goodness.


----------



## MeanBruce

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GenoOCAU*
> 
> Im going to go EVGA Classified when I retire my 2x 680 lightnings. I've had enough funding MSI and their quest to make people like yellow.
> 
> ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN MSI, CHANGE YOUR COLOUR-SCHEME!!!!!! WTH....


Yea, I really don't get the whole yellow theme either, guess I'm just way too conservative.









http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/MeanBruce/media/IMG_1530_zps04b12ba5.png.html

Found this discussion/debating pyramid and thought you guys here at OCN might enjoy it. At least it will make you smile.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MeanBruce*
> 
> Yea, I really don't get the whole yellow theme either, guess I'm just way too conservative.


The 680 lightnings were yellow themed too, and I thought they were awesome.

Bring on the yellow themed 780 lightnings IMO


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> The 680 lightnings were yellow themed too, and I thought they were awesome.
> 
> Bring on the yellow themed 780 lightnings IMO


Are you replacing your 780 with a Lightning?


----------



## ZBoneCapone

I like the yellow theme of the lightning, just not with my case and build







It would be awesome if they allowed for customization of the fan and shroud. Hell, I'm okay with everything on this card except the yellow fan, as it pertains to my build. IMHO, a card that costs $700 should be somewhat customizable









With all that being said, bring on the EK full water block!


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Are you replacing your 780 with a Lightning?


I'm not getting a Lightning 780, no, at least not for a while (personal reasons). Mainly interested to see how it turns out. Hoping it is as good as the 680/580 lightnings were.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I'm not getting a Lightning 780, no, at least not for a while (personal reasons). Mainly interested to see how it turns out. Hoping it is as good as the 680/580 lightnings were.


Even though I already got the Classified, I am curious myself.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I would like to nominate Neliz as Hardware Rep of the year, for letting this discussion go on.


I enjoy reading a discussion as much as the next guy I guess








Quote:


> ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN MSI, CHANGE YOUR COLOUR-SCHEME!!!!!! WTH....


Not a big fan of Gold myself, because that's only restricted to the low-end and mid-range asus boards and.. ECS, but if that's your choice...

this however:


Also, for those in the UK:

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=24720119&postcount=202
Quote:


> I spoke with Gibbo he has no concrete facts guys!! Nothing confirmed about stocks, price or even spec to him officially
> 
> All I know is I am ragging these cards LN2 this weekend!! Anyone wanna bench??


----------



## zed1

Few months ago,i was thinking to start with watercooling for CPU,my general theme color is Black/red (HAF-X/Maximus V Formula) i was thinking to go with orange color for the watercooling,after in my imagination,that remind me some fire colors (red/orange/yellow)..but it was just in my imagination,i never bought the watercooling,i took others things..
But the true is that the color for me is not important at this time,maybe later ,but now i'm only interesting in *POWER*, i understand all the peoples who like to customize every littles colors,and i find most of their works verry nice.Ok but if someone have already seen a "fire color" theme (red/orange/yellow) show me the link,i would like to see that.

neliz can you tell us if some people (hardwares sites..) have already the 780 Lightning, and if yes do you think they got enough time to prepare some reviews/test for wednesday/thursday?
thank you.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> neliz can you tell us if some people (hardwares sites..) have already the 780 Lightning, and if yes do you think they got enough time to prepare some reviews/test for wednesday/thursday?
> thank you.


As above, 8 Pack has his cards, but I honestly can't tell anything else... sorry bro.


----------



## Kimir

Yeah, the 680 has a little of yellow, but let's tell the truth, what I see is more like this:

DEM blue leds, even in bright daylight, can you see the red RAM stick, barely, all you see is BLUE!

I'm curious about the presence of those leds on the GTX 780 Lightning, neliz?


----------



## driftingforlife

And where is my sample..................


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> And where is my sample..................


^^ I second this, need to get myself on this list of people to get samples...


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ^^ I second this, need to get myself on this list of people to get samples...


........so he can secretly pass some to me


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> As above, 8 Pack has his cards, but I honestly can't tell anything else... sorry bro.


Ok,no problem, it'll come .


----------



## StreekG

A review isn't a review unless it's TTL.
But i'll read them all.


----------



## Lu(ky

Hey NELIZ how close will be the pricing compared to the Classified at $699.99? Same or higher just curious. Thanks


----------



## Rei86

Catching up with the past three or so odd pages and nothing new yet, but one more day!


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Catching up with the past three or so odd pages and nothing new yet, but one more day!


How could you miss the awesome flame war between the 780 and Titan


----------



## MrMarauder

I suppose awesome is subjective...


----------



## Dyaems

or a sarcastic comment


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> How could you miss the awesome flame war between the 780 and Titan


Meh, don't care about it. In the lightning forum to learn more info about the lightning but the newest bits are the fan blades are yellow..


----------



## WhyCry

New picture


----------



## Wooojciech1983

My rig is waiting for the new Lightning, but please make a blue logo LED. Pics, pics, MSI give us more pics of 780


----------



## Kranik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WhyCry*
> 
> New picture


----------



## Baghi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wooojciech1983*
> 
> 
> 
> My rig is waiting for the new Lightning, but please make a blue logo LED


Beautiful. A motherboard from MSI's power series would look great in there but then, that TUF logo won't remain relevant.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wooojciech1983*
> 
> 
> 
> My rig is waiting for the new Lightning, but please make a blue logo LED


Your rig is perfect for a lighting. Looks really good.


----------



## villain

According to this tomorrow is just a paper launch?


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> According to this tomorrow is just a paper launch?


I hope not.


----------



## ethan319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> According to this tomorrow is just a paper launch?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> I hope not.


^


----------



## Kimir

New MSI afterburner beta 12 popped up in auto update, I suspect the "Add new graphics card support" is including the 780 Lightning.


----------



## Alienware69

Is the 780 lightning going to be better than the Classifed?


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Alienware69*
> 
> Is the 780 lightning going to be better than the Classifed?


Seeing as how reviews for the Classified do not exist, and the 780gtx [edit: Lightning] is not released, what do you think? Nobody knows yet.


----------



## Alienware69

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Seeing as how reviews for the Classified do not exist, and the 780gtx is not released, what do you think? Nobody knows yet.


The 780gtx is not released? Where u been for the last 3 months?


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> According to this tomorrow is just a paper launch?


...

REALLY hope that's not true. If actual sales date is delayed for 3+ weeks, I'll probably just buy the Classy.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Seeing as how reviews for the Classified do not exist, and the 780gtx is not released, what do you think? Nobody knows yet.


I think you mean 780 Lightning...? The reference cards were released back in May/June. AFAIK, the 780 Lightning is the last non-reference card to be released.

Hoping its the best too...


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I think you mean 780 Lightning...? The reference cards were released back in May/June. AFAIK, the 780 Lightning is the last non-reference card to be released.
> 
> Hoping its the best too...


yea meant Lightning


----------



## stilllogicz

Neliz, you've been awfully quiet....


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> Neliz, you've been awfully quiet....


Probably preparing for the launch tomorrow, hopefully they will be available very soon after.


----------



## zealord

What about the new keyboard from MSI. The MSI GK-601. It looks beautiful and I probably want to buy one depending on the price. But I cant find it nowhere and there are already a few reviews out.


----------



## stilllogicz

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823167010


----------



## zealord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823167010


Thanks, probably no European layouts finished yet :<


----------



## StreekG

It's the 7th in Australia right now, give us the Lightning first damn it!







lol


----------



## MrMarauder

As much as it pains me to write this, it would not surprise me if tomorrow is just the paper launch of it. August 7th was never confirmed as the official launch date.


----------



## Dyaems

im not buying it, but i just want to see the whole thing


----------



## Humafold

I've gone from GTS250 SLI to GTX570 to GTX570 SLI to GTX 680 to GTX680 SLI to GTX 670 4GB to HD7970 ... and the whole time all I really wanted to was a Lightning Edition of some card; any card. However, I am never able to wait.

It's either GTX 780 Lightning or HD7970 Vapor-x Crossfire. I think the wife has had enough for awhile.


----------



## MrMarauder

I've been with the Lightnings since the GTX 480. They've consistently been the top performing cards of their respective generations. The nVidia ones at least. I've been nothing but happy with them.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823167010


Thought this was the link for the card. Greatly disappointed.


----------



## stilllogicz

Whoops my bad bro =/

I'm eagerly awaiting like the rest of us.....


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> I've been with the Lightnings since the GTX 480. They've consistently been the top performing cards of their respective generations. The nVidia ones at least. I've been nothing but happy with them.


Me too. I have no doubt that this thing will be a total beast but the lack of a block anytime soon is kind of ruining it for me. That and the fact that I don't like the look of the card that much (which is a first for me and a Lightning card)...


----------



## MrMarauder

The red accents of the 480 were nice. The gun metal of the 580 looked awesome. Wasn't thrilled with the yellow of the 680, but it wasn't overbearing. Not crazy about the yellow fan of the 780. Given that the Lightning is a premium, top-end card, the yellow fan makes it look cheap, and not fitting of a card of that caliber. That said, it won't deter me from buying it.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Its *7*/*8*/2*0*13. Now we wait for a full view of the card and hopefully a price and launch window. And if we're lucky an EK waterblock!!


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

If EK launches a block within the next couple of weeks (totally unlikely) I will probably pick up two for kicks. Will be sure to do an in-depth comparison with my Titans if that happens. Hell, I may do this anyway with the Classifieds as they are out already and blocks should be out soon...


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Its *7*/*8*/2*0*13. Now we wait for a full view of the card and hopefully a price and launch window. And if we're lucky an EK waterblock!!


http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_msi_hawk_review,1.html ?


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_msi_hawk_review,1.html ?


And the Lightning?


----------



## Lukas026

hmm from quick look HAWK seems like a very nice card but:

give us the Lightning already !


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_msi_hawk_review,1.html ?


This post is off topic Mister, we want GTX 780 Lightning reviews.


----------



## Lu(ky

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> This post is off topic Mister, we want GTX 780 Lightning reviews.


Is it just me but almost everywhere I look MSI is just flooding the market in the past couple days of products, from thin gaming laptops to 760, 770 cards using the GTX 780 Lightning as free advertising














.If this card does not come out this week I'll be getting the Classy kinda of tired of the long wait already.









This card better be a Monster compared to the Classy or MSI is going to look real stupid.


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_msi_hawk_review,1.html ?


Quote:


> what we noticed with this HAWK is that the default GPU voltage is higher then reference


I'm sure Nvidia liked that after what happened with the GTX 660 Ti/670 PE


----------



## neliz

I guess this explains it all:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZ_J8K3mvKA


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I guess this explains it all:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZ_J8K3mvKA


I was afraid of that happening.


----------



## MrMarauder

All this cloak and dagger is really unnecessary, and I'd imagine no one finds the video funny.


----------



## WhyCry

Well at least they made a cool video


----------



## malmental

08/28....!
man I got time to 'grow old' waiting on this....
this marketing build up crap is working for them and most of you guys are all caught up.

this card better deliver.


----------



## Lukas026

sorry but this is just bad

if its realy 28 / 8 / 2013 for the lightning, than I am off to Classified...

I love MSI and Lightning series but it is just too much time









See ya maybe in 880 LNG


----------



## malmental

IKR...
Glad I got my WF3 about a month ago.


----------



## villain

What a waste of everyone's time. MSI shot themselves in the foot with this.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> 08/28....!
> man I got time to 'grow old' waiting on this....
> this marketing build up crap is working for them and most of you guys are all caught up.
> 
> this card better deliver.


Yep, because the Classy is already [email protected]@$$!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lukas026*
> 
> sorry but this is just bad
> 
> if its realy 28 / 8 / 2013 for the lightning, than I am off to Classified...
> 
> I love MSI and Lightning series but it is just too much time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See ya maybe in 880 LNG


I see alot of people getting a Classy now instead of waiting.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Look's like the EK block will release before the Lightning 780.


----------



## Seid Dark

Seems that MSI was just trolling with launch date. We got 760 Hawk instead of 780 Lightning









I feel bad for people who have to wait another month.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seid Dark*
> We got 760 Hawk instead of 780 Lightning
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I feel bad for people who have to wait another month.


Is this official?

We are not getting 780 Lightning launch anymore?


----------



## Lukas026

look at the video. its right in the end...

trully bad story MSI...such a shame !


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> Is this official?
> 
> We are not getting 780 Lightning launch anymore?


Nope, not even a paper launch it looks like.


----------



## revro

lol msi 780 lightning is the nvidias version of 9970. dear customers, please wait for when we decide to unveil our product. ou actually we wont tell you anything, so just wait. glad i went with my gb 780oc. will grab another for sli a year later. and msi can sell their card to those few who had not already bought one from other vendors

best
revro


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lukas026*
> 
> look at the video. its right in the end...
> 
> trully bad story MSI...such a shame !


Is that the official video from MSI ?

If so, that's fvcked. How can they troll their customers like that?


----------



## Lukas026

yes it is offical


----------



## SmokinWaffle

MSI is hyping this up so much, I just hope it lives up to the hype they've built. Could easily backfire if it's not as good as it should be.


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokinWaffle*
> 
> MSI is hyping this up so much, I just hope it lives up to the hype they've built. Could easily backfire if it's not as good as it should be.


Their delaying tactics are the problem. People held off and waited for this supposed product launch, now they're told to wait another 3 weeks. If the card hits the stores in September, people might as well wait for the 9970.


----------



## ethan319

Totally disappointed period.

I don't understand why they trolled with Lightning enthusiasts.

They didn't even mention which one would actually be released on 8/28 in the video.

What were those tiny pictures that they intentionally leaked for in the first place?

I can't think of any reason other than they were trying to make fun of people who were waiting for the Lightning.


----------



## Lukas026

yes exactly what I am thinking about

it may be (and should be







) the best card (PCB / VRM / other stuff wise) created but if it will be released right before the next gen GPUs (either AMD or NVIDIA), than there is little point to buy it...

maybe for something like: buy it / bench the hell out of it / sell it / next









I am not saying there are not ppl like this but certailny its not the majority of high end buyers who was waiting for card like LNG / Classy / HOF


----------



## szeged

Hahaha pushing it back even more? Nope no ty is rather wait for 9970s then. I already got two titans and two classified 780s and just bought two devil 13 7990s today. I think ill skip the lightnings because I have enough gpu power to last a few years as it is. That and I think in done buying any msi products for good after this garbage. Bring onthe 9970s.


----------



## ethan319

This also reminds me the time when they released the NGTX680 Lightning on the market.

Because they didn't update the afterburner, people who purchase the card had to wait for another month to utilize the triple over-voltage function that they advertised.


----------



## illuz

MSI...


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> Hahaha pushing it back even more? Nope no ty is rather wait for 9970s then. I already got two titans and two classified 780s and just bought two devil 13 7990s today. I think ill skip the lightnings because I have enough gpu power to last a few years as it is. That and I think in done buying any msi products for good after this garbage. Bring onthe 9970s.


While marketing for an August 7th launch/reveal and then pushing it back with a cheesy video is shady and really not a justice to their customers, MSI really hasn't wronged anyone with this. Sure, we have to wait a few more weeks and some will move onto other cards, but this is far from a crime.

Hopefully, this will allow EK to bring out a full cover waterblock and then everyone can be happy.


----------



## zealord

ugh. trolling like that is bad marketing imho. It is disrespectful towards the end customer. I was honestly considering buying one, because the high temperature and noise level of my reference 680 is a tad annoying. But now this. I am actually highly disappointed :<


----------



## Lu(ky

Well I guess I am done with this thread now..







My 2 x GTX 780 Classifieds will be in route and I should get them on Thursday I only live 10 minutes from Newegg.. Everyone have fun waiting for the next month tell they push it back some more..







I am officially unsubscribed after this last message..


----------



## fateswarm

Lesson for overclock.net users: You can't expect hype to be created in a few days. They have to cook their propaganda for much more. You just happen to be a minority that notices the marketing sooner. Most gamers have no idea about it yet. Publicity takes time.

Lesson for MSI: Do not hype it to overclockers, hard core gamers and utter geeks so soon anymore.


----------



## Wooojciech1983

This is a really a bad joke. @MSI Give us at least some more pics of the card.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Welp, MSI just lost about $1000 worth of sales from me. Off to EVGA now. Guess it was fun while it lasted.


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Lesson for overclock.net users: You can't expect hype to be created in a few days. They have to cook their propaganda for much more. You just happen to be a minority that notices the marketing sooner. Most gamers have no idea about it yet. Publicity takes time.
> 
> Lesson for MSI: Do not hype it to overclockers, hard core gamers and utter geeks so soon anymore.


Watch this first and then tell me if this is what you expected to see today.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> Watch this first and then tell if this is what you expected to see today.


They meant 760. As I said, the geeks and overclockers are only a minority, they do not affect marketing strategies that much.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I guess this explains it all:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZ_J8K3mvKA











FAIL...


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> They meant 760. As I said, the geeks and overclockers are only a minority, they do not affect marketing strategies that much.


I think you're wrong.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> They meant 760. As I said, the geeks and overclockers are only a minority, they do not affect marketing strategies that much.


And yet, they flashed the 780 on the screen, indicating something 780 was supposed to happen today. 780 and thunder allude to one thing; the Lightning.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> They meant 760. As I said, the geeks and overclockers are only a minority, they do not affect marketing strategies that much.


How on earth do you think a glowing 7, 8, and a 0 in the 7/8/2013 date would mean a 760? ./facepalm

They very much meant the GTX 780 Lightning.

MSI Hawk cards were never marketed as "thunder". That's a reference to the Lightning.

And this card is TARGETED towards those "geeks and overclockers". Not the average user. If the demographic that this card is aimed towards gets pissed, then yes, that demographic WILL affect their marketing strategy.

At this point, they flat out lied/baited&switch'd their target demographic. Yeah, there will be people who will buy the Lightning after waiting for it because they are brand fanboys. However, when the EVGA Classified is already out and shown to be a ridiculous beast of a card that will almost guaranteed rival the MSI Lightning, you don't want to piss off your target demographic with something like what they just pulled today.

They lost a sale from me, and probably a lot of other people. That is the definition of garbage marketing at its best. Rule #1: You don't lie to your customers.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> How on earth do you think a glowing 7, 8, and a 0 in the 7/8/2013 date would mean a 760?


That's what they led you to believe. Sorry you were misled.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> How on earth do you think a glowing 7, 8, and a 0 in the 7/8/2013 date would mean a 760? ./facepalm
> 
> They very much meant the GTX 780 Lightning.
> 
> MSI Hawk cards were never marketed as "thunder". That's a reference to the Lightning.
> 
> And this card is TARGETED towards those "geeks and overclockers". Not the average user. If the demographic that this card is aimed towards gets pissed, then yes, that demographic WILL affect their marketing strategy.
> 
> At this point, they flat out lied/baited&switch'd their target demographic. Yeah, there will be people who will buy the Lightning after waiting for it because they are brand fanboys. However, when the EVGA Classified is already out and shown to be a ridiculous beast of a card that will almost guaranteed rival the MSI Lightning, you don't want to piss off your target demographic with something like what they just pulled today.
> 
> They lost a sale from me, and probably a lot of other people. That is the definition of garbage marketing at its best. Rule #1: You don't lie to your customers.


Yep and yep.


----------



## whyscotty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> MSI...


^^^
This

How to loose potential customers


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> How on earth do you think a glowing 7, 8, and a 0 in the 7/8/2013 date would mean a 760? ./facepalm
> 
> They very much meant the GTX 780 Lightning.
> 
> MSI Hawk cards were never marketed as "thunder". That's a reference to the Lightning.
> 
> And this card is TARGETED towards those "geeks and overclockers". Not the average user. If the demographic that this card is aimed towards gets pissed, then yes, that demographic WILL affect their marketing strategy.
> 
> At this point, they flat out lied/baited&switch'd their target demographic. Yeah, there will be people who will buy the Lightning after waiting for it because they are brand fanboys. However, when the EVGA Classified is already out and shown to be a ridiculous beast of a card that will almost guaranteed rival the MSI Lightning, you don't want to piss off your target demographic with something like what they just pulled today.
> 
> They lost a sale from me, and probably a lot of other people. That is the definition of garbage marketing at its best. Rule #1: You don't lie to your customers.


Was originally not all that upset but when you put it that way, now I'm pissed. Boo, MSI


----------



## fateswarm

They screwed marketing for the high end. Answer to it with your wallet. No reason raving about it here.


----------



## jomama22

Well if its any consolation,maybe they just saw everyone grobble about the color scheme so severely they decided to go back to the drawing board one last time.

But I doubt it.


----------



## Seid Dark

What a marketing fail. Lightning is already a niche product and this will hurt sales. It's like they are saying: GO BUY CLASSIFIED.


----------



## villain

For those who missed the last month and wonder what's going on, here's a compilation of the related posts.



Spoiler: Warning: Huge list



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> First peak at the card:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=605151799524435&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Nah, trust me man, *it's the Lightning*, it would be a bit of a waste of Jon and the LN2 to have him waste time benching on "crappy cards" right?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Here's a little something new.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> *August 7th is still a launch date*, yeah.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=612716515434630&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Some first benchmark runs, over P20K in 3DMark 11, previously the fastest 780 did 18K.
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=614108375295444&set=a.129731527066467.11729.111253142247639&type=1


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> This one slipped past me before, 7K in Firestrike extreme:
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2406917_elmor_3dmark___fire_strike_extreme_geforce_gtx_780_7028_marks


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> A little something something for you guys.. built to impress.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> nope, I can't say anything like that, pricing, accessories etc.
> 
> You can ask, or guess things, but besides what info is public, *I'm actually not even allowed to say what we will launch on the 7th*.
> 
> Heck.. what am I doing here?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> You rang, sir?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> As above, 8 Pack has his cards, but I honestly can't tell anything else... sorry bro.


----------



## revro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Lesson for overclock.net users: You can't expect hype to be created in a few days. They have to cook their propaganda for much more. You just happen to be a minority that notices the marketing sooner. Most gamers have no idea about it yet. Publicity takes time.
> 
> Lesson for MSI: Do not hype it to overclockers, hard core gamers and utter geeks so soon anymore.


overclockers are those who actually buy 780 lightning. or do you expect joe 6pack to buy 780 for 650 bucks? no way

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> They meant 760. As I said, the geeks and overclockers are only a minority, they do not affect marketing strategies that much.


no they are not, see above. overclockers are the customers for this product and they released a 760 for general population

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> They screwed marketing for the high end. Answer to it with your wallet. No reason raving about it here.


we rave here because this is topic about 780 lightning and people were misled and are actually angry. i might have been fooled into going a lightning sli just for yellow colour schema in my case, and sell my 780 gigabyte but i think i stay with gb and save money

best
revro


----------



## stilllogicz

Well this was my last shot, I have a deadline I have to keep and just can't wait another 3 weeks. I went ahead and ordered 2 classifieds. Good luck to everyone who's able to wait, I'm sure you'll end up with a beast of a card as a reward for your patience and ultimately a better waterblock and fittings.

Sorely disappointed to say the least.


----------



## Jack Mac

There might have been a legitimate reason for the delay but instead of just announcing the delay they decide to troll potential customers. Not cool MSI.


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stilllogicz*
> 
> Well this was my last shot, I have a deadline I have to keep and just can't wait another 3 weeks. I went ahead and ordered 2 classifieds. Good luck to everyone who's able to wait, I'm sure you'll end up with a beast of a card as a reward for your patience and ultimately a better waterblock and fittings.
> 
> Sorely disappointed to say the least.


I think I'm with you bro. That was a sleazy move MSI.


----------



## Lukas026

well even if many ppl here say, we (overclockers / hc gamers / benchers) are minority, still think about it:

imagine how many ppl only on this forum thread was willing to pay for 1x - 2x or even 3x 780 Lightnings ?

Even if it is priced same as EVGA Classy (699 bucks), still its a ton of money and I dont think its so minor for this company at all...

and this ridiculous video ?

I would feel much better if MSI just wrote, that for some reason (new color scheme / last layout uprgade / new component / etc.), they are delaying it...

yeah I would still be unhappy but NOT angry for trolling us


----------



## Kimir

They could at least show some photographs of the entire card and tell us the spec.
The card should be in production by now (right?), a sneak peek wouldn't hurt...


----------



## Scorpion667

MSI trolled all of us =/


----------



## 2010rig

What is going on here? is the 760 Hawk really what MSI is releasing today, and that's what they've been building up the hype for?









This could not have been a teaser for a 760.



http://www.tomshardware.com/news/GTX-780-Lightning-Teaser-GeForce,23786.html


----------



## h2spartan

Are there any MSI reps on this site? Hope they see the disappointment. There is no way that teaser video was not for the 780 lightning.


----------



## h2spartan

I CANT HEAR IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## CapnCrunch10

I'm still in disbelief. Even the music for the video is extremely trollish.


----------



## 2010rig

Just found this:


----------



## villain

A change of plans?


----------



## malmental

there's this and then the recent threads about MSI RMA service going downhill, like on the verge of being a real disappointment.
this was my first time going with GiggleByte for GPU's ever and all of my WF3's do not disappoint.
I hope I have no reason to test another RMA process..


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Just found this:


Ninja'd by 9 seconds


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Friday Release: Lightning... Keyboards!


----------



## Lukas026

even if it would be friday I am still mad at MSI at this point...

treating customers like this is just silly and to be honest I am not counting on friday so much









maybe it is just paper launch and 28/8 is release date...


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> Ninja'd by 9 seconds


ha ha.









I wonder why MSI went with yellow for their highend.









No offense to MSI, but most people have this stigma against buying MSI motherboards.... Wish they stuck with a more neutral color scheme for the highend.



btw - anybody else think that 780's are going to drop down in price?

AMD just knocked one out of the park with the 7990 at $699.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131493


----------



## fateswarm

Ah, I get it now.

7/8/13, the date the announcement of the real date is set.


----------



## h2spartan

The yellow scheme is so....Meh!


----------



## h2spartan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Ah, I get it now.
> 
> 7/8/13, the date the announcement of the real date is set.


Could be the date of the date for the release date, no?


----------



## Killa Cam

seriously, this is total bullcrap to the point of irresponsibility. i was never in line to buy the lightnings as im satisfied with my evga references. but the teaser showed in july was a strong indication of a 780 release. i get it, things happen and have to be pushed back. but my god have some decency and send out a press if u can't make the deadline. stay classy msi


----------



## EFD307

Yea MSI really screwed the pooch on this one, as soon as i watched that video i got pissed and bought a classy....


----------



## SuprUsrStan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> I guess this explains it all:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZ_J8K3mvKA


I'm not in the market for any more 780's as I already got my reference ones on day 1, but this is just amazing. To think they have the nerve to post that kind of video after all this time. So much time has past now that it's almost time to look out for the 9970.


----------



## h2spartan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> I'm not in the market for any more 780's as I already got my reference ones on day 1, but this is just amazing. To think they have the nerve to post that kind of video after all this time. So much time has past now that it's almost time to look out for the 9970.


Who the hell in their marketing department made that decision? Poor form!

Then again, I've always liked EVGA better.


----------



## Zackotsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2spartan*
> 
> Could be the date of the date for the release date, no?


Dateception..msi are trolling us..


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syan48306*
> 
> I'm not in the market for any more 780's as I already got my reference ones on day 1, but this is just amazing. To think they have the nerve to post that kind of video after all this time. So much time has past now that it's almost time to look out for the 9970.


I skipped that video originally, thought that it was a fake troll video judging by the cover.

Now I realize that MSI posted that video, and Lightning is coming 8/28, damn. If there's anything that enthusiasts detest is bait and switch tactics.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2spartan*
> 
> Who the hell in their marketing department made that decision? Poor form!


I doubt they decided it. I suspect someone in the supply chain screwed up and now they may be trying to attribute blame.

e.g. the PCB missing their shipping of VRs or whatever.


----------



## h2spartan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I doubt they decided it. I suspect someone in the supply chain screwed up and now they may be trying to attribute blame.
> 
> e.g. the PCB missing their shipping of VRs or whatever.


You are probably right but the HAWK announcement video just adds salt on the wound. I mean, even the music sounds so trollish.


----------



## MattGordon

I wasn't even in the market for a 780, but I've been watching this thread for a while now.

You guys got screwed over pretty hard. Good job MSI with the bait and switch ad.


----------



## Cial00

Omg...

We got trolled so hard.

Disregarding the 3 additional weeks, I'm probably gonna buy a Classy out of spite now


----------



## Scorpion667

Screw it, I'm buying a classy. Later


----------



## criminal

Newegg and EVGA just wondered what happened! Classy orders shot through the roof!

Who knew MSI could market so well for EVGA.


----------



## ethan319

I just decided to get a Titan Superclocked one instead.

Wasted my time and patient.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Newegg and EVGA just wondered what happened! Classy orders shot through the roof!
> 
> Who knew MSI could market so well for EVGA.


You went with a Classy as well?


----------



## MattGordon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Newegg and EVGA just wondered what happened! Classy orders shot through the roof!
> 
> Who knew MSI could market so well for EVGA.


Somebody's probably not going to have a job by the end of the day.

Stay _classy_ MSI


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> You went with a Classy as well?


Yeah, decided to last week when they showed up on Newegg. I had a feeling that the Lightnings were going to be late. Glad I trusted my gut.









I got a 1395 core clock run in Valley with this beast. The Lightning delay by MSI better not disappoint!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> Somebody's probably not going to have a job by the end of the day.
> 
> Stay classy MSI


Yep.

I love the stay classy.


----------



## fateswarm

They may fire nobody if those to blame are out of their control and need them. e.g. a big supplier of a PCB component.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> ha ha.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder why MSI went with yellow for their highend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No offense to MSI, but most people have this stigma against buying MSI motherboards.... Wish they stuck with a more neutral color scheme for the highend.
> 
> 
> 
> btw - anybody else think that 780's are going to drop down in price?
> 
> AMD just knocked one out of the park with the 7990 at $699.
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131493


I emailed my rep the idea of including a few colors in a sticker set with the board & cards for easy color coordinating or just basic black, wonder if they will use the idea one day...

It would have been a good troll to have the Hawk launch, & follow it right up with the bird getting struck by lightning.

But more wait....









At least lightnings are usually worth the wait.


----------



## theonedub

I would have rather them paper launched 780L today.


----------



## MattGordon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theonedub*
> 
> I would have rather them paper launched 780L today.


Exactly. Instead you guys got a 760. (albeit a very nice 760)


----------



## tx-jose

Actually.....not bad MSI....this is the final piece of the puzzle for a budget build that I have black and gold themed. Ill take 1 for my asrock OC formula MATX build


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Can't think of a single reason for everyone NOT to go with the Classy at this point. They are already beating up on Titan in the benches, offer software voltage of 1.35V and most importantly are available right now! This is a major disappointment from MSI...


----------



## Scorpion667

MSI better pepper your angus for dat dere damage control.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I emailed my rep the idea of including a few colors in a sticker set with the board & cards for easy color coordinating or just basic black, wonder if they will use the idea one day...
> 
> It would have been a good troll to have the Hawk launch, & follow it right up with the bird getting struck by lightning.
> 
> But more wait....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least lightnings are usually worth the wait.


That would be a good compromise.









I get what MSI is trying to do with the color scheme and all, doesn't mean I like their choice in colors.









I see a lot of people going Classy's now, they've been hyping up and teasing this launch date for a while now, and all we've gotten so far are pictures of fans, and someone running one on LN2.


----------



## Scorpion667

Wow the youtube video has the best comments ever.


----------



## szeged

In related news - evga hires msi to help improve sales

Update - evga sales skyrocket, msi to thank? More at 11:00


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Wow the youtube video has the best comments ever.


rofl omg...if they're smart they will disable comments quick


----------



## flotrollet

So, I've been waiting for the Lightning since my birthday, the 6th of June, so almost exactly for two months. I'm going to wait until Friday, because that was hinted, but I am seriously considering the Classy. I am just so ******* dissapointed because I was waiting for this day like it was Christmas. Should I just do it? Should I wait until 9970? Until that time comes I guess I could afford a 9990... But I don't know what to do really. Man did I get ****ed over this time


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flotrollet*
> 
> So, I've been waiting for the Lightning since my birthday, the 6th of June, so almost exactly for two months. I'm going to wait until Friday, because that was hinted, but I am seriously considering the Classy. I am just so ******* dissapointed because I was waiting for this day like it was Christmas. Should I just do it? Should I wait until 9970? Until that time comes I guess I could afford a 9990... But I don't know what to do really. Man did I get ****ed over this time


The one thing you can plan on for sure is to not wait for a lightning 9970.


----------



## 404Error

Can you hear the ****storm rolling in? I can hear the ****storm. 08/07/2013.


----------



## flotrollet

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> The one thing you can plan on for sure is to not wait for a lightning 9970.


Thanks, good Idea. Is the classy cooler exactly the same as the normal ACX? I heard it was whisper quiet and I want a GPU for a VERY, VERY quet build, and I mean noiseblocker multiframes on 500rpm quiet. Whining and such would instantly be a deal breaker.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flotrollet*
> 
> Thanks, good Idea. Is the classy cooler exactly the same as the normal ACX? I heard it was whisper quiet and I want a GPU for a VERY, VERY quet build, and I mean noiseblocker multiframes on 500rpm quiet. Whining and such would instantly be a deal breaker.


It appears to be built the same, but a lot bigger.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> It appears to be built the same, but a lot bigger.


It just looks like the shroud is bigger, not necessarily the fans themselves. The Classy is probably better at dissipating the heat than the little brother.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> It just looks like the shroud is bigger, not necessarily the fans themselves. The Classy is probably better at dissipating the heat than the little brother.


Yeah, fans look the same but the heat sink is larger as well as the shroud.


----------



## Cial00

Neliz: Any info at all about Friday? Will we at least see specs?


----------



## Scorpion667

Classy throttles hard at 115% power target... Compared to 300% on the lightning 680, that's weak as fuu
Given, it was a 1371Mhz overclock

review here: http://www.ninjalane.com/reviews/video/evga_gtx780_classified/page12.aspx


----------



## rossb

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flotrollet*
> 
> Thanks, good Idea. Is the classy cooler exactly the same as the normal ACX? I heard it was whisper quiet and I want a GPU for a VERY, VERY quet build, and I mean noiseblocker multiframes on 500rpm quiet. Whining and such would instantly be a deal breaker.


If it uses the same fans it won't be that quiet. I have the ACX 780 and it is still noisy once the fans go above 60%, and is audible above my case fans at its minimum of 39%. I use the TI bios to reduce minimum fan speed to 25% and an Arctic Extreme cooler to bring the noise down to acceptable levels (ie a notch above silence).


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Classy throttles hard at 115% power target... Compared to 300% on the lightning 680, that's weak as fuu
> Given, it was a 1371Mhz overclock
> 
> review here: http://www.ninjalane.com/reviews/video/evga_gtx780_classified/page12.aspx


We already have a way around that 115% power target.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Classy throttles hard at 115% power target... Compared to 300% on the lightning 680, that's weak as fuu
> Given, it was a 1371Mhz overclock
> 
> review here: http://www.ninjalane.com/reviews/video/evga_gtx780_classified/page12.aspx
> 
> 
> 
> We already have a way around that 115% power target.
Click to expand...

where's your wink...?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> where's your wink...?


----------



## MrMarauder

On the Classified review...
Quote:


> As it would turn out the power used to drive the fans is part of the Power Target calculation. Removing the fans by either using an external power source or switching to watercooling will give you more headroom and likely provide better performance.


----------



## Wooojciech1983

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Just found this:


Wow, they answered my post  Hopefully this will not be another bull**** MSI or I will also switch to Evga.


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Classy throttles hard at 115% power target... Compared to 300% on the lightning 680, that's weak as fuu
> Given, it was a 1371Mhz overclock
> 
> review here: http://www.ninjalane.com/reviews/video/evga_gtx780_classified/page12.aspx


ya there already is a TI Classified bios. Even at 1.35v I am still not throttling even a little bit. Anybody who is going to overvolt this card and use it like it's supposed to be used is not going to mind flashing a bios. Plus with the dual bios switch it makes it a little bit safer. I'm sure the lightning can do all these things also but throttling is not an issue for classified owners.


----------



## strong island 1

.


----------



## Gabenyamata

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wooojciech1983*
> 
> Wow, they answered my post  Hopefully this will not be another bull**** MSI or I will also switch to Evga.


I sense another bull****, I talked to some MSI rep over the phone and they said the lightning version isn't coming out until


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



*SEPTEMBER*


.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gabenyamata*
> 
> I sense another bull****, I talked to some MSI rep over the phone and they said the lightning version isn't coming out until September.


Was the 780 Lightning due today?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gabenyamata*
> 
> I sense another bull****, I talked to some MSI rep over the phone and they said the lightning version isn't coming out until
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> *SEPTEMBER*
> 
> 
> .


Tech support? You can't actually expect any info from tech support, if it isn't in a brochure or easily found online, they can't really help with much.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Was the 780 Lightning due today?


Seemed that way, but instead of lightning striking, we got the bird (760 Hawk launched







).


----------



## Gabenyamata

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Was the 780 Lightning due today?


They hinted at it being released today exactly a month ago, so it was pretty dickish for them to release something totally different.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gabenyamata*
> 
> They hinted at it being released today exactly a month ago, so it was pretty dickish for them to release something totally different.


By the time it comes out, new GPUs next gen gpus will be released lol


----------



## Gabenyamata

.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Tech support? You can't actually expect any info from tech support, if it isn't in a brochure or easily found online, they can't really help with much.
> Seemed that way, but instead of lightning striking, we got the bird (760 Hawk launched
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ).


Well considering Aug 28th is only a few days away from September 1st, the info might not be that inaccurate :/


----------



## Dyaems

chillax guys, msi is changing the yellow fan at the middle of the 780 lightning!


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> chillax guys, msi is changing the yellow fan at the middle of the 780 lightning!


Doubt it.


----------



## MattGordon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> chillax guys, msi is changing the yellow fan at the middle of the 780 lightning!


I hope not, I really dig the yellow look to them.

Even more of a reason I can't wait for the 760 Hawk to launch. My wallet is ready...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Yeah, how does the 760 Hawk have a SINGLE thing to do with lightning striking???? It was a pure troll by MSI, plain and simple...


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Yeah, how does the 760 Hawk have a SINGLE thing to do with lightning striking???? It was a pure troll by MSI, plain and simple...


Not to mention highlighting 7 8 0, which has nothing to do with a 760 Hawk again.


----------



## fateswarm

Rejoice. AMD 9000 soon anyway.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

I would love to hear from Neliz. He's the hardware rep on this forum and should give a statement regarding the lack of any information about the Lightning. I think it would go a long way with customers to get some insight as to why we were lied to...


----------



## thestache

MSI just sold a lot of classifieds. EVGA has got to be cacking themselves in the office reading these threads.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Not to mention highlighting 7 8 0, which has nothing to do with a 760 Hawk again.


it actually ends in a 3...HALF LIFE 3 CONFIRMED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lol


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I would love to hear from Neliz. He's the hardware rep on this forum and should give a statement regarding the lack of any information about the Lightning. I think it would go a long way with customers to get some insight as to why we were lied to...


neliz probably killed his OCN account after this massive shi* storm


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Yeah, we won't be hearing from him again for a while. I wonder if there was enough negative reaction to the yellow fan that they are doing a quick redesign. That would explain the troll video that clearly had nothing to do with the Lightning while almost explicitly describing the Lightning...


----------



## tx-jose

the video is not available anymore lol


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> it actually ends in a 3...HALF LIFE 3 CONFIRMED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> lol












Looking at the image again, 8 - 2 = 6 --> 7 6 0, duh.

Using the 2013 numbers.... 2 x 1 x 3 = 6 again, everything points to a 760.

How did we not see it before?

I'm confused by "I Can Hear Thunder" in the video and how it relates to a Hawk though, any guesses?


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looking at the image again, 8 - 2 = 6 --> 7 6 0, duh.
> 
> Using the 2013 numbers.... 2 x 1 x 3 = 6 again, everything points to a 760.
> 
> How did we not see it before?
> 
> I'm confused by "I Can Hear Thunder" in the video and how it relates to a Hawk though, any guesses?


they were going to kill the "Hawk" Branding and call then Thunders and Lghtnings??

Though IDK why they did the "I can hear thunder"...because you SEE the Lightning before you can hear the Thunder.....


----------



## malmental

notice how 'neliz' hasn't been around today....
just sayin'...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

It must suck for those waiting on the MSI Lightning.

If it was me, I'd just order a Classified with a Hydro Copper block.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

That's what I plan on doing (if anything at all). There's just no reason to wait on MSI when EVGA is already offering a GTX 780 with a very decent software voltage increase and should also have blocks available for it soon as well....


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Classified Blocks are already on sale and in stock on EVGA website.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Classified Blocks are already on sale and in stock on EVGA website.


thats for the GTX 770 unless I am missing something...

dont play with me!!!


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> thats for the GTX 770 unless I am missing something...
> 
> dont play with me!!!


You're right.
I just went full ****** lol


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Jacob said mid-August for the 780 Classy block which is pretty awesome news. Sure wish MSI had their crap together as well as EVGA does...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Jacob said mid-August for the 780 Classy block which is pretty awesome news. Sure wish MSI had their crap together as well as EVGA does...


Any word on when the Dark X79 board is going to be out?


----------



## PureBlackFire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> notice how 'neliz' hasn't been around today....
> just sayin'...


if I were him I wouldn't bother posting anything right now either.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> notice how 'neliz' hasn't been around today....
> just sayin'...


After all the teasers he's been posting the past couple weeks, I'm not surprised he hasn't dropped by today. ( I still like him though )

Want to know who's been popping by today?


----------



## PureBlackFire

lol.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> After all the teasers he's been posting the past couple weeks, I'm not surprised he hasn't dropped by today. ( I still like him though )
> 
> Want to know who's been popping by today?


probably to come thank MSI for the increase in classified sales.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> You're right.
> I just went full ****** lol


i just about lost my shat and got 2!!!! Glad I double checked!!! hahaha

tho that's a no brainier since its the same as the 680 Clasy


----------



## Killa Cam

this is easily the biggest failure ive seen on this forum - which is rare cuz this place is full of win. neliz, pls come back and talk to the community. people are upset, but we would like to know your side on all of this.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> this is easily the biggest failure ive seen on this forum - which is rare cuz this place is full of win. neliz, pls come back and talk to the community. people are upset, but we would like to know your side on all of this.


You must not have been around during the Bulldozer launch.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> You must not have been around during the Bulldozer launch.


oh my god that was hilarious xD beats this fail by a trillion miles.

but this fail is a big one also imo.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> oh my god that was hilarious xD beats this fail by a trillion miles.
> 
> but this fail is a big one also imo.


Lately, this one takes the cake that's for sure.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Lately, this one takes the cake that's for sure.


Lol


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> You must not have been around during the Bulldozer launch.


Please do elaborate about the Bulldozer launch...you've piqued my curiosity


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Please do elaborate about the Bulldozer launch...you've piqued my curiosity


oh man, we could be here for days, lol.

How about I point you in the right direction...

Bulldozer Pre-Launch FAQ:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1107646/bulldozer-pre-launch-faq/

Bulldozer Blog is Live:
http://www.overclock.net/t/791495/the-bulldozer-blog-is-live

My old sig that summed up some of the classic things JF-AMD said to the community:
Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JF-AMD*
> IPC & Single threaded performance will be higher. Anyone saying otherwise is uninformed, or has an agenda.
> I am not saying that everything is fake, the Intel fanboys are touting the numbers that make it look bad.
> Why is everyone obessing about benchmarks, I think people just like to argue.
> Is somebody being paid by intel to continually post these statements? *I have never lied*
> The crazy rumors end up with corporate customers. I have to debunk them. There is a selfish self-interest here.
Click to expand...

The aftermath:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1142751/jf-amd-addresses-the-ipc-claim/

That's all I'm willing to get into, don't want to drag this thread off topic.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> oh man, we could be here for days, lol.
> 
> How about I point you in the right direction...
> 
> Bulldozer Pre-Launch FAQ:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1107646/bulldozer-pre-launch-faq/
> 
> Bulldozer Blog is Live:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/791495/the-bulldozer-blog-is-live
> 
> My old sig that summed up some of the classic things JF-AMD said to the community:
> The aftermath:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1142751/jf-amd-addresses-the-ipc-claim/
> 
> That's all I'm willing to get into, don't want to drag this thread off topic.


That's all I was looking for, thanks









Edit: From the Pre-launch FAQ, the dude seems like a complete ass. My first impression of him was not positive. After reading some of the BD blog and getting the general gist, I can see why people were upset. No reason to send hate mail IMHO, but I would have certainly voiced my frustrations. Hopefully it won't come to that with Neliz


----------



## Cial00

I think we'll probably hear something tomorrow or Friday. I'm really hoping they will drop some of the mystery and maybe we'll get full pics and specs. They kind of owe it to the fans at this point ... Personally, I need incentive to wait additional 3 weeks over just buying the Classy right now.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> After all the teasers he's been posting the past couple weeks, I'm not surprised he hasn't dropped by today. ( I still like him though )
> 
> Want to know who's been popping by today?


Lol. They should send MSI a cake.


----------



## Linde

Oh well seems like they aren't done.. :/

Maybe it's just a new picture or something.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Lol. They should send MSI a cake.


Absolutely hilarious.

Maybe the lightning was getting no where near close Classified performance, so they went back to the drawing board. And released hawk to kill time


----------



## HHawk

Ugh... Still no MSI GTX 780 Lightning.
And on the other side, also still no EVGA GTX 780 Classified in Europe.

*TWO THUMBS DOWN FOR BOTH COMPANIES!*


----------



## Furlans

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HHawk*
> 
> Ugh... Still no MSI GTX 780 Lightning.
> And on the other side, also still no EVGA GTX 780 Classified in Europe.
> 
> *TWO THUMBS DOWN FOR BOTH COMPANIES!*


I'm writing from Italy and the only gtx 780 classified that i can find online is on drako.it and it costs 709EURO.


----------



## Kimir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Absolutely hilarious.
> 
> Maybe the lightning was getting no where near close Classified performance, so they went back to the drawing board. And released hawk to kill time


Well, sure thing is EVGA with k|ngp|n are fighting with MSI:
GTX 780 classy by kingpin : 7505
GTX 780 lightning by elmor: 7028

Kingpin also submitted a non extreme score of 15331
those are his most recent submission.
There is no non extreme score by Elmor, only a 3D11 of P20195, which is in second position after Kingpin's P21000.

Pretty close to me, don't you think?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kimir*
> 
> Well, sure thing is EVGA with k|ngp|n are fighting with MSI:
> GTX 780 classy by kingpin : 7505
> GTX 780 lightning by elmor: 7028
> 
> Kingpin also submitted a non extreme score of 15331
> those are his most recent submission.
> There is no non extreme score by Elmor, only a 3D11 of P20195, which is in second position after Kingpin's P21000.
> 
> Pretty close to me, don't you think?


Pretty Close behind.......I think MSI wants to beat the Classified, not trail behind it.


----------



## Kimir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Pretty Close behind.......I think MSI wants to beat the Classified, not trail behind it.


Yeah behind, but Elmor wrote had no mod at all and was "No, just plug and play







" (see comment in his FS extreme submission) while the EVGA was certainly with the EPower+EVBot module (I'm absolutely not sure about that tho).
Being behind with a non-production card is not a valid reason to delay the launch date anyway (from my pov).


----------



## Baghi

They can have Classified-like components and performance, but they don't have Kingpin.


----------



## SuprUsrStan

AMD Hawaii is going to be announced just a month after the lightning is announced. Seriously, en epic fail by MSI. For everyone who's waiting for the best, they might want to just stick around for another month and see how the 9970 performs.


----------



## Baghi

I don't believe how biased people are (or can be). Prior to 7/8/0 everybody was praising Lightings and MSI for being so good and now all of the sudden, Classifieds looking much better? Those submissions at HWBot already existed, but no body was bothered with them until now. lol


----------



## malmental

after this tease and marketing FAIL, I've come to the realization that I'm good with my WF3's...


----------



## Ghost Lightning

I made this account to keep tabs on this hread. MSI did pull a stunt here, but I'll still wait for the Lightning. If any new info drops be sure to post it guys, since this seems to be the only place updating about this situation.


----------



## Kimir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baghi*
> 
> I don't believe how biased people are (or can be). Prior to 7/8/0 everybody was praising Lightings and MSI for being so good and now all of the sudden, Classifieds looking much better? Those submissions at HWBot already existed, but no body was bothered with them until now. lol


I don't think the average overclocker here care much about what can be done by Pro OC on LN2, we have expectation that's all. We know that the classy can do almost 1400 on air and so we hope the MSI will do better.
We know nothing about the lightning, except the yellow color that does all the fuss.


----------



## villain

Another update on FB.










Edit: Why does it upscale pictures in posts? It looks awful.


----------



## SmokinWaffle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> Edit: Why does it upscale pictures in posts? It looks awful.


Click the image. What you are seeing is a thumbnail of sorts. If you don't want to do this, just untick the "Import Images" button at the bottom of the reply box before you hit 'Submit' and it'll stay as an external image link, instead of importing it.


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokinWaffle*
> 
> Click the image. What you are seeing is a thumbnail of sorts. If you don't want to do this, just untick the "Import Images" button at the bottom of the reply box before you hit 'Submit' and it'll stay as an external image link, instead of importing it.


I just replaced it with an external image and it's still upscaled. The imported image looked fine, as long as it was not displayed in a post.

When I click on an imported picture in a post I see the same upscaled image/thumbnail. Here is a pic from an earlier post with the original picture on top of the upscaled one.


----------



## Baghi

Just use


----------



## 2010rig

I bet that tomorrow they will say that the Lightning will be out 8/28, as seen in their video.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I bet that tomorrow they will say that the Lightning will be out 8/28, as seen in their video.


Maybe some bs explanation and/or clock speeds and such. But neilz even said 2 weeks ago that final clocks hadn't been finalized. I feel like they started their ad campaign a bit too soon, thought they could squeeze under a tight timeline from computex to aug 8th. I know communication between engineers and marketing can be difficult, but timelines are universal. I highly doubt they are happy about it either and marketing probably didnt even know until Tuesday that it would be pushed.

Could also be a supply constraint of some sort making supply atm impossible. Most lightnings have been paper launched a few weeks prior to release. In my eyes, 8/28 has to be a hard launch or it will be tough to convince many not to at least wait and see the 9970.


----------



## Kaapstad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Maybe some bs explanation and/or clock speeds and such. But neilz even said 2 weeks ago that final clocks hadn't been finalized. I feel like they started their ad campaign a bit too soon, thought they could squeeze under a tight timeline from computex to aug 8th. I know communication between engineers and marketing can be difficult, but timelines are universal. I highly doubt they are happy about it either and marketing probably didnt even know until Tuesday that it would be pushed.
> 
> Could also be a supply constraint of some sort making supply atm impossible. Most lightnings have been paper launched a few weeks prior to release. In my eyes, 8/28 has to be a hard launch or it will be tough to convince many not to at least wait and see the 9970.


If MSI don't get their fingers out they will be launching the HD 9970 lightning at the same time as the 780 lol.


----------



## Scorpion667

See the issue is not that the 780 Lightning got delayed, I mean things happen. It's the WAY MSI chose to covey that information to us that pissed off a lot of people. That was literally the most troll announcement I have ever seen.

You know what happens when you hear Thunder? The hawk is taking shelter somewhere and you see Lightning. Neither of those things happened.


----------



## tx-jose

All speculation leads me to point out a cooler redesigne and change the color of the middle fan


----------



## h2spartan

The "Can you here the thunder" video was a long awaited release date for....a date that may or may not be the release for the actual card? Thanks for the clarification on what trolls you are MSI.

"Trolololol," laughs MSI.

"Screw you," says OCN community, "Off to EVGA, buh-bye."

"Oh no, wait wait wait, " pleads MSI, "but I have this shiny new 760 HAWK for you though......tr....tro....TROLololOLOLOLLloLL!"


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I wish...


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I bet that tomorrow they will say that the Lightning will be out 8/28, as seen in their video.


Would not be surprised at all if this happened. I feel like tech companies are some of the worst to give their customers the runaround for stuff like this.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> Would not be surprised at all if this happened. I feel like tech companies are some of the worst to give their customers the runaround for stuff like this.


It will definitely be a confirmation of 8/28. Maybe some more pictures and specs.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> It will definitely be a confirmation of 8/28. Maybe some more pictures and specs.


Ir maybe..its a confirmation date to confirm the release of the Lightning lol


----------



## Gamtu

From watching that video announcing the 760 Hawk, I get the feeling that the MSI marketing people were not told there would be a delay and were allowed to blindly release the 7/8/2013 video. It almost looks as if the marketing people got annoyed and made that 760 Hawk video to snub who ever it was that should've let them know a delay was eminent. However, the 760 hawk video could easily be interpreted as a troll by MSI on the customer base. This is the effect I think marketing didn't expect and as professionals they should have seen that coming. Whoever is in charge of approving these videos for marketing IMO should be canned. If your going to delay a much anticipated product, the last thing you want is to appear to poke fun at your customers in light of the delay. That said, I think MSI puts out decent stuff. I'm planning on getting the 780 lighting and so I'll just wait.


----------



## malmental

in the meantime...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814162142


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> in the meantime...
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814162142


whyd you have to go and do that.

now i might have to buy one!


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> in the meantime...
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814162142


That's one good looking cooler. I usually don't like these weird coolers with goofy color schemes, like MSI and Asus.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> in the meantime...
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814162142
> 
> 
> 
> whyd you have to go and do that.
> 
> now i might have to buy one!
Click to expand...

reviews say it's stellar and might be the fastest...
just saying..


----------



## malmental

http://wccftech.com/galaxy-geforce-gtx-780-reaches-hall-fame-1900-mhz-core-clock-74-ghz-memory/
Galaxy GeForce GTX 780 Reaches The Hall of Fame With a 1900 MHz Core Clock and 7.4 GHz Memory


----------



## strong island 1

if it's voltage locked it won't be anything compared to the Lightning. maybe it's the fastest stock card but if it's voltage locked it won't come close to lightning or classified.


----------



## driftingforlife

But does it have voltage control and can you remove the limits? not that I know.


----------



## malmental

http://www.extrahardware.com/news/galaxy-unveils-geforce-gtx-780-hof-comes-external-power-supply-module

Galaxy Unveils GeForce GTX 780 HOF, Comes With External Power Supply Module
Quote:


> Many manufacturers are experimenting with their products, especially with motherboards and graphics cards. However, Galaxy is taking another step into a new area with their HOF card which is utilizing NVIDIA's latest GTX 780 chip. Featuring custom design white PCB, it also comes with external power supply module that is a must have for LN2 overclockers.
> 
> Galaxy GeForce GTX 780 Hall Of Fame is the best from Galaxy's GPU lineup. To create the best graphics card on the market, Galaxy followed six main principles - frequency, power, materials, PCB, cooling and overclocking. The card comes with the GK110-300-A2 and a 3 GB GDDR5 memory from Elpida running along a 384-bit interface. The core is running at 1,006 MHz with a GPU Boost clock of 1,058 MHz, while the memory runs at the reference 6,008 MHz.
> 
> Galaxy is the only manufacturer that uses white PCB design and it just looks impressive. It features 8+2 Phase PWM design that is powered through dual 8-Pin connectors. To improve stability, the company also equipped it with the industry's high-end Panasonic tantalum capacitors. To cool down a beast, Galaxy used their flagship HOF series dual fan cooler which offers a much beefier heatsink design. All crucial components have their heatsink, including memory and PWM.
> 
> The most interesting part is a separate external power supply module that ships with the GeForce GTX 780 HOF. Apparently it will be possible to buy it separately, offering an 8 Phase PWM module that has its own set of voltage adjustment and tuning points and is powered via three 8-Pin connectors.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> if it's voltage locked it won't be anything compared to the Lightning. maybe it's the fastest stock card but if it's voltage locked it won't come close to lightning or classified.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> But does it have voltage control and can you remove the limits? not that I know.


You can't achieve 1900mhz on stock voltage. It's safe to say its unlocked.


----------



## malmental

ninja'd...


----------



## Snuckie7

Elpida memory fail


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> You can't achieve 1900mhz on stock voltage. It's safe to say its unlocked.


No, it was Hardmodded. You can see in the pic the wires on the back of the card.


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> You can't achieve 1900mhz on stock voltage. It's safe to say its unlocked.


I understand 1900 isn't possible on stock voltage. Of course all these LN2 runs use higher than stock voltage but I wonder if there will be some sort of software voltage control. Just because this bencher was using 1.55v doesn't mean it will work that way out of the box. At least with lightning and classified it's very easy to up the volts. I wonder if it's that easy with this card. if so it's probably a beast.


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> No, it was Hardmodded. You can see in the pic the wires on the back of the card.


That's what I was trying to say. Every card can use higher than stock voltage, but right now it seems only the lightning and classified can just up the volts with software. We found out from Jacob that classified voltage cap is 1.5v. That means any average person can raise classified voltage to 1.5v. I'm not sure that it's possible with this card. Maybe with that external module they are talking about but I have no clue.


----------



## malmental

what's Galaxy's reputation, I personally do not know much about them..?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> I understand 1900 isn't possible on stock voltage. Of course all these LN2 runs use higher than stock voltage but I wonder if there will be some sort of software voltage control. Just because this bencher was using 1.55v doesn't mean it will work that way out of the box. At least with lightning and classified it's very easy to up the volts. I wonder if it's that easy with this card. if so it's probably a beast.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> That's what I was trying to say. Every card can use higher than stock voltage, but right now it seems only the lightning and classified can just up the volts with software. We found out from Jacob that classified voltage cap is 1.5v. That means any average person can raise classified voltage to 1.5v. I'm not sure that it's possible with this card. Maybe with that external module they are talking about but I have no clue.


Ships with an external power supply module for a reason. Voltage has gotta be unlocked. Based on design and specs of the PCB.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> what's Galaxy's reputation, I personally do not know much about them..?


All I want to know is what happened to their fixed clock Titan?


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Ships with an external power supply module for a reason. Voltage has gotta be unlocked. Based on design and specs of the PCB.


Where is this listed, nothing is listed on the newegg page about a module?


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> what's Galaxy's reputation, I personally do not know much about them..?
> 
> 
> 
> All I want to know is what happened to their fixed clock Titan?
Click to expand...

link it so I can know what you know...


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Ships with an external power supply module for a reason. Voltage has gotta be unlocked. Based on design and specs of the PCB.
> 
> 
> 
> Where is this listed, nothing is listed on the newegg page about a module?
Click to expand...

it's in the retail packaging, I linked a review..
now if newegg changed the retail packaging or something then ????


----------



## driftingforlife

Right, I just had a look, the "module" is basically the same as EVGA Epower board, you have to cut and solder your card, it bypass's everything on the cards PCB. Im right in saying by default the card does not have voltage control or the removed limits of the lightning or classy and there for is useless.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Where is this listed, nothing is listed on the newegg page about a module?


Source 1.
http://www.extrahardware.com/news/galaxy-unveils-geforce-gtx-780-hof-comes-external-power-supply-module

Source 2. http://wccftech.com/galaxy-geforce-gtx-780-hof-edition-gpu/


----------



## driftingforlife

See my above post.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

I would still buy a Classified over a Lightning or HoF if I was in the market for one.


----------



## driftingforlife

The HoF is not in the same league as the classy and the Lightning.

Can't wait for my Lightning to come, need to get a KP Tek-9 FAT ready for it


----------



## szeged

The HOF is far from useless lol. Msi fanboy blinders ready to go captain.


----------



## malmental

I just thought it would be kinda a kick in the arse to MSI and 'neliz'...


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> what's Galaxy's reputation, I personally do not know much about them..?


My friend had two reference 670s from them, and although he did have bad luck and have to RMA a few times he didn't seem to have too much of an issue with their customer support and I believe they cross-shipped him a 670 overnight. He didn't ever really have to be without the 670s for too long. I'd be willing to buy from Galaxy, they seem good enough.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> The HOF is far from useless lol. Msi fanboy blinders ready to go captain.


Good cards, just that when looking through the ranks of gpu records the list is generally dominated by MSI, Asus & Evga.

I do have to hand it to Galaxy that they appear to be the first to include an epower type board with the card if that comes retail. You could blow the mosfets & the zombie board is right there to get it up & running again after a bit of time with the soldering iron.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> The HOF is far from useless lol. Msi fanboy blinders ready to go captain.


Yeah, when I hear those kind of words. I just...


----------



## sticks435

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Elpida memory fail


Yeah, sucks Evga switched all the Classifies to it after the first batch went out. :/


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Yeah, when I hear those kind of words. I just...


Unless your willing to solder on the power board I feel like it is kind of useless to pay that much for a custom card that I would probably never be able to fully enjoy. I would much rather get a reference 780 and a waterblock.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> link it so I can know what you know...


http://wccftech.com/galaxy-launch-geforce-gtx-titan-boost-reference-clocked-875-mhz/

Never materialized.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> link it so I can know what you know...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://wccftech.com/galaxy-launch-geforce-gtx-titan-boost-reference-clocked-875-mhz/
> 
> Never materialized.
Click to expand...

don't think I would have went for that anyways...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> http://wccftech.com/galaxy-launch-geforce-gtx-titan-boost-reference-clocked-875-mhz/
> 
> Never materialized.


Will a bios Flash enable gpu boost?
If so, that's a good option for a Lower cost Titan.


----------



## 2010rig

How will the Lightning compete with this?








http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131479

$629 AR + 8 games. This is a crazy good deal right now.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> How will the Lightning compete with this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131479
> 
> $629 AR + 8 games. This is a crazy good deal right now.


AMD's driver didn't cure microstutter, it only brought it down to a degree that's closer to Nvidia's multi-GPU cards (where it's always been and still is a problem). It's still a multi-GPU card with inherent multi-GPU flaws and I'd recommend a single GPU any day. Coming from someone who just sold his second GTX 780.

Can't polish a turd with 8 games.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> How will the Lightning compete with this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131479
> 
> $629 AR + 8 games. This is a crazy good deal right now.


Amazing deal. Too bad AMD hasn't found a cure for their micro stutter, and other crossfire problems.


----------



## szeged

got two of the devil 13s after they went on sale, gonna compare em to my titans and classifieds when i get them up and running under water, hope they are pretty good







come on msi stop trollin us man i wanna see lightning benchs under water and air, ill probably never get into ln2 so those benchs dont matter to me that much


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> got two of the devil 13s after they went on sale, gonna compare em to my titans and classifieds when i get them up and running under water, hope they are pretty good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> come on msi stop trollin us man i wanna see lightning benchs under water and air, ill probably never get into ln2 so those benchs dont matter to me that much


Two titans will Rip em apart. Two titans even beat 2 690.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> AMD's driver didn't cure microstutter, it only brought it down to a degree that's closer to Nvidia's multi-GPU cards (where it's always been and still is a problem). It's still a multi-GPU card with inherent multi-GPU flaws and I'd recommend a single GPU any day. Coming from someone who just sold his second GTX 780.
> 
> Can't polish a turd with 8 games.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Amazing deal. Too bad AMD hasn't found a cure for their micro stutter, and other crossfire problems.


shhhh you 2, the Lightning needs to drop at $500 to compete.









For real though, I know MS isn't fully fixed yet, but it's a great improvement compared to where it was.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> shhhh you 2, the Lightning needs to drop at $500 to compete.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For real though, I know MS isn't fully fixed yet, but it's a great improvement compared to where it was.


Yes, with their latest drivers, improvements have been made indeed.


----------



## Oubadah

Half full: Great improvement catching up to Nvidia considering their massive disadvantage.
Half empty: About time, why were they so far behind in the first place?


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> Half full: Great improvement catching up to Nvidia considering their massive disadvantage.
> Half empty: About time, why were they so far behind in the first place?


Because they're AMD.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> got two of the devil 13s after they went on sale, gonna compare em to my titans and classifieds when i get them up and running under water, hope they are pretty good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> come on msi stop trollin us man i wanna see lightning benchs under water and air, ill probably never get into ln2 so those benchs dont matter to me that much


You'll love the Devils they are really nice cards, big suckers though, pretty quiet from what I remember for such a huge and hot card when running big overclocks and a lot of volts. Let us know how 4-Way crossfire with them goes.

They are a great alternative for the GK110 now the frame metering drivers are out.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Those 7990's are a hell of a steal at that price. Loved my 7970's for well over a year before going back to Team Green...


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Two titans will Rip em apart. Two titans even beat 2 690.


If only CF scaled as poorly as SLI after two cards.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> If only CF scaled as poorly as SLI after two cards.


3 Titans scale pretty good, nothing can touch em. Down side is price, many argue that 780, 7970, even 7950 are better simply because they cost way less.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> 3 Titans scale pretty good, nothing can touch em. Down side is price, many argue that 780, 7970, even 7950 are better simply because they cost way less.


My post wasn't directed at Titan scaling, but 3 Titans certainly do not scale well at all. tsm has a TriFire 7970 3DMark run that's beating a lot of TriSLI Titans.


----------



## Baghi

I had this exact same misconception until I read this thread over here and Vega's replies in that thread and then again his and Baasha's posts here as well.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> My post wasn't directed at Titan scaling, but 3 Titans certainly do not scale well at all. tsm has a TriFire 7970 3DMark run that's beating a lot of TriSLI Titans.


You're right, they don't scale as well as they should. But they are as good as it gets as far as performance, regardless of cost.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> My post wasn't directed at Titan scaling, but 3 Titans certainly do not scale well at all. tsm has a TriFire 7970 3DMark run that's beating a lot of TriSLI Titans.


That's interesting, I see QUAD fire on par with Tri-Sli

That's *4* cards vs *3*.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That's interesting, I see QUAD fire on par with Tri-Sli
> 
> That's *4* cards vs *3*.


Quad crossfire may have high fps, but poor playability. Many will agree nvidia takes it as far far as smoothness goes.

On firestrike, its nothing but Titans on top.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That's interesting, I see QUAD fire on par with Tri-Sli
> 
> That's *4* cards vs *3*.


And the fact that Tahiti, a much slower GPU, is able to best GK110's with 1.33x the number of GPUs (keep in mind a single GK110 is 35-40% faster than a single Tahiti), I'd say that proves my point pretty well. Quad CF is scaling much better than Tri SLI in that example.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> And the fact that Tahiti, a much slower GPU, is able to best GK110's with 1.33x the number of GPUs (keep in mind a single GK110 is 35-40% faster than a single Tahiti), I'd say that prove my point pretty well. Quad CF is scaling much better than Tri SLI in that example.


TSM has golden 7970's everybody knows that.

You claimed 3 7970's were beating 3 Titans, where would that proof be?

Besides, that's a 1080p bench, increase the res and you'll see Titans shine.

Take a look at this thread:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1415441/7680x1440-benchmarks-plus-2-3-4-way-sli-gk110-scaling/0_50

Here's the quad fire scaling, notice the 3rd and 4th card.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> TSM has golden 7970's everybody knows that.
> 
> You claimed 3 7970's were beating 3 Titans, where would that proof be?


That was an extreme example, but go check the top 3x scores in FireStrike (I forget performance or extreme).

Golden cards or not, no (unmodified) 7970's should ever be beating the same number of Titans.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> That was an extreme example, but go check the top 3x scores in FireStrike (I forget performance or extreme).
> 
> Golden cards or not, no (unmodified) 7970's should ever be beating the same number of Titans.


They're not, it was 4 vs 3.

3 vs 3 it's no contest. You know it.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> That was an extreme example, but go check the top 3x scores in FireStrike (I forget performance or extreme).
> 
> Golden cards or not, no (unmodified) 7970's should ever be beating the same number of Titans.


Never seen 2 7970 beat 2 titans.

I have seen 2 Titans beat quad 7970 or 2 7990.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Anyhow. The 7990 for 629 is a tremendous deal, and it those not loyal to Nvidia and who are upset with MSI lol


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> They're not, it was 4 vs 3.
> 
> 3 vs 3 it's no contest. You know it.


*Sigh* Guess you gotta do everything yourself nowadays.

http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/fire+strike+3dmark+score+performance+preset/version+1.1/3+gpu

What's tsm doing in spot 23 ahead of all those Titans and 780's?


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> *Sigh* Guess you gotta do everything yourself nowadays.
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/fire+strike+3dmark+score+performance+preset/version+1.1/3+gpu
> 
> What's tsm doing in spot 23 ahead of all those Titans and 780's?


What are 22 Titans and 780's doing ahead of TSM?

After TSM the next best scores for Radeons are #44, 53...

2 scores in the top 50, and only 10 in the top 100, amazing.

Am I supposed to be impressed?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> *Sigh* Guess you gotta do everything yourself nowadays.
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/fire+strike+3dmark+score+performance+preset/version+1.1/3+gpu
> 
> What's tsm doing in spot 23 ahead of all those Titans and 780's?


I'm laughing at this. The next xfire set up comes in at spot 78.

One lucky guy made spot 23 and you're bringing it up as if its common for 7970 to do this good.


----------



## Snuckie7

Sure, because let's see:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Golden cards or not, no (unmodified) 7970's should ever be beating the same number of Titans.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> They're not, it was 4 vs 3.
> 
> 3 vs 3 it's no contest. You know it.


Did someone say "no contest"?


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I'm laughing at this. The next xfire set up comes in at spot 78.
> 
> One lucky guy made spot 23 and you're bringing it up as if its common for 7970 to do this good.


*Pro Tip:* You have to use Ctrl+F to find the CrossFire scores. You can't just glance through it, you'll miss them.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Sure, because let's see:
> 
> Did someone say "no contest"?


Let's see, *2* Radeons in the top 50, 1 of them being golden. Titans and 780's are dominating are they not?

Yes, it really is no contest.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Sure, because let's see:
> 
> Did someone say "no contest"?


I'm impressed with the 780 HOF.

And no, it's a no contest titan > 7970 lol


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> *Pro Tip:* You have to use Ctrl+F to find the CrossFire scores. You can't just glance through it, you'll miss them.


I was just exaggerating, there are so many Titans/780s that there's no way xfire 7970 beat sli Titans.

But thanks for the heads up.


----------



## Snuckie7

Anyways I think I've made my point. Titans and 780's are usually about 35-40% faster than 7970's. The fact that this gap closes so significantly in tri GPU setups should tell you what's happening with the scaling.

The reason why you don't see many other trifire setups in the top, is because I doubt many people bin 7970's to get 3 golden ones like tsm did. That's irrelevant however, as no golden 7970 should ever match a Titan, which is what happens in a tri GPU setup.

Also, it seemed you were quite skeptical of any tri fire 7970 setup beating any tri Titan setup.
Quote:


> You claimed 3 7970's were beating 3 Titans, where would that proof be?


And lo and behold, I provided the exact proof you asked for.

I certainly don't recall saying the majority of tri 7970's are faster than tri Titans, just that tri Titans scale poorly enough that it becomes possible for 3 7970s to overtake them, something not possible with 2 way SLI.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Anyways I think I've made my point. Titans and 780's are usually about 35-40% faster than 7970's. The fact that this gap closes so significantly in tri GPU setups should tell you what's happening with the scaling.
> 
> The reason why you don't see many other trifire setups in the top, is because I doubt many people bin 7970's to get 3 golden ones like tsm did. That's irrelevant however, as no golden 7970 should ever match a Titan, which is what happens in a tri GPU setup.
> 
> Also, it seemed you were quite skeptical of any tri fire 7970 setup beating any tri Titan setup.
> And lo and behold, I provided the exact proof you asked for.
> 
> I certainly don't recall saying the majority of tri 7970's are faster than tri Titans, just that tri Titans scale poorly enough that it becomes possible for 3 7970s to overtake them, something not possible with 2 way SLI.


Reason u don't see many trifire set ups on top is not because people can't find binned cards. Is because like you say, they aren't in the same league as Titans/780.

Crossfire is by no means better than SLI, at least until drivers get properly fixed. I really don't know what your point is or was.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Anyways I think I've made my point. Titans and 780's are usually about 35-40% faster than 7970's. The fact that this gap closes so significantly in tri GPU setups should tell you what's happening with the scaling.
> 
> *The reason why you don't see many other trifire setups in the top, is because I doubt many people bin 7970's to get 3 golden ones like tsm did.* That's irrelevant however, as no golden 7970 should ever match a Titan, which is what happens in a tri GPU setup.
> 
> Also, it seemed you were quite skeptical of any tri fire 7970 setup beating any tri Titan setup.
> And lo and behold, I provided the exact proof you asked for.
> 
> I certainly don't recall saying the majority of tri 7970's are faster than tri Titans, just that tri Titans scale poorly enough that it becomes possible for 3 7970s to overtake them, something not possible with 2 way SLI.


Congratulations, you've proven me wrong.

In the top *50* we found *2* Radeon scores, that is very impressive indeed.

Let me ask you a serious question. If someone were to buy 3 random 7970's right now, benched them, what are the odds of them making it into the top 50?


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Reason u don't see many trifire set ups on top is not because people can't find binned cards. Is because like you say, they aren't in the same league as Titans/780.


Uh, do you know what "binning" cards means? Any random guy can buy a bunch of 7970's and bin them if he wants. tsm's setup isn't anything special. If you have three 1350MHz 7970's, they'll be beating the majority of tri SLI Titans/780s.
Quote:


> Crossfire is by no means better than SLI, at least until drivers get properly fixed. I really don't know what your point is it was.


You seem to have completely lost track of where this discussion went, because it was about multi GPU scaling. Your post is completely irrelevant. No wonder why you don't see my point.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Uh, do you know what "binning" cards means? Any random guy can buy a bunch of 7970's and bin them if he wants. tsm's setup isn't anything special. If you have three 1350MHz 7970's, they'll be beating the majority of tri SLI Titans/780s.
> You seem to have completely lost track of where this discussion went, because it was about multi GPU scaling. Your post is completely irrelevant. No wonder why you don't see my point.


Yeah, I lost track. In the middle of a game. I'll catch up with you later.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Congratulations, you've proven me wrong.
> 
> In the top *50* we found *2* Radeon scores, that is very impressive indeed.
> 
> Let me ask you a serious question. If someone were to buy 3 random 7970's right now, benched them, what are the odds of them making it into the top 50?


Not very high, although that, and your other points are hardly relevant to CF vs SLI scaling.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Not very high, although that, and your other points are hardly relevant to CF vs SLI scaling.


Let's go back to your original post.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> My post wasn't directed at Titan scaling, but 3 Titans certainly do not scale well at all. tsm has a TriFire 7970 3DMark run that's beating a lot of TriSLI Titans.


You're saying 3 Titans do not scale well at all. To prove your point you select a user who has highly binned and golden cards. We go over the scoreboard where it is dominated by Titans & 780's.

Had he been #1, you would have a case. His scores are not typical, nor average by any means. That's why the next best score is 44.

If you don't think Titans scale well, you need to familiarize yourself with this thread, which I linked you to already.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1415441/7680x1440-benchmarks-plus-2-3-4-way-sli-gk110-scaling/0_50

No one is buying 3 Titans to play on 1080p.

That's if for me, this is a Lightning thread afterall.


----------



## malmental

what 's so funny is that now Radeon owner's even with the latest drivers (that almost fix the framing issue but not in CF-X but not in Tri-CFX)
they still want to complain about nVidia...
I think they need to get over it and move on, the 9970 will be here soon.


----------



## Kaapstad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Two titans will Rip em apart. Two titans even beat 2 690.


Two Titans don't come close to beating two GTX 690s.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kaapstad*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Two titans will Rip em apart. Two titans even beat 2 690.
> 
> 
> 
> Two Titans don't come close to beating two GTX 690s.
Click to expand...

whoa....
depends on resolution and a few other variables.
GTX 690 is one big JOKE with it's 2GB of VRAM.
so yes, it can..


----------



## Kaapstad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That's interesting, I see QUAD fire on par with Tri-Sli
> 
> That's *4* cards vs *3*.


With valley if you raise the resolution to 1600p maxed the scaling on 4 Titans is incredible and 4 HD 7970s would not even get close to them


----------



## Kaapstad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> whoa....
> depends on resolution and a few other variables.
> GTX 690 is one big JOKE with it's 2GB of VRAM.
> so yes, it can..


Being the owner of two GTX 690s and 4 Titans I think I know what they can do.

Yes the GTX 690s do have a weakness over 1600p but it is often not as bad as people make out.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kaapstad*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> whoa....
> depends on resolution and a few other variables.
> GTX 690 is one big JOKE with it's 2GB of VRAM.
> so yes, it can..
> 
> 
> 
> Being the owner of two GTX 690s and 4 Titans I think I know what they can do.
> 
> Yes the GTX 690s do have a weakness over 1600p but it is often not as bad as people make out.
Click to expand...

sell the GTX 690's and let's move on....


----------



## Kaapstad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> sell the GTX 690's and let's move on....


The GTX 690s are nice cards, they are staying.


----------



## criminal

Stay on track people!










It is Friday, more lightning news perhaps?


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Stay on track people!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is Friday, more lightning news perhaps?


trying to get him to sell his 690's for Lightnings....









j/k'n


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> trying to get him to sell his 690's for Lightnings....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> j/k'n


That would be a no brainer for me. I don't care for dual gpu cards.


----------



## malmental

same here..


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kaapstad*
> 
> Two Titans don't come close to beating two GTX 690s.


Even though I am more in AMD camp now as a personal preference, I would agree with this wholeheartedly.









For the sake comparison, 690 on a 1440p does a whole lot better than a Titan. Not sure how Nvidia engineered the 690, but it is a much better card than a Titan. No sli issues that I can think of. I have seen some 690s going for pretty good prices in resale. Not sure why anyone would choose a Titan or 780 especially for a single screen over a 690. But then again stranger things have happened when hype of newness comes in. Most people who complain about 690 have never owned one. Ones who upgraded toTitan from 690 can tell you the difference. Better yet, anyone who still has a 690 and Titan is in the best position to make a judgement as they can compare both with driver updates, etc. But, i assume there are very few people around with both cards.

Ok. enough with the praising..now I am gonna go back to thinking about the 9000 series which is rumored to launch in Oct


----------



## malmental

provost - it's a generalized statement and like I stated it depends on the environment.
I'll go with SLI Titans..


----------



## WhyCry

Quote:


> MSI EUROPE:
> There seems to be some confusion about when our new Lightning will hit the market. Sorry for this, we hope below video will make the launch date clear. Stay tuned because Lightning will continue to dominate...
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yZ_J8K3mvKA


It's the same video we've already seen. So much for Friday news


----------



## villain

So instead of giving us actual information they thought it would be a good idea to promote their troll video again.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> So instead of giving us actual information they thought it would be a good idea to promote their troll video again.


Exactly.

Good luck to those waiting for the Lightning 780. If August 28th is set in stone, the Lightning seems like a waste. Buy the Classy or HOF now or just wait for 9000 series from Nvidia. What a bad move by MSI.


----------



## fateswarm

Word on the street was that EVGA has shortage of VRAM supply from Samsung. It may have happened the same here.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Word on the street was that EVGA has shortage of VRAM supply from Samsung. It may have happened the same here.


This is in fact true, as I have the Elpida chips on my card. I would have thought they would have had a supply of that reserved for the Lightnings though.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Uh, do you know what "binning" cards means? Any random guy can buy a bunch of 7970's and bin them if he wants. tsm's setup isn't anything special. If you have three 1350MHz 7970's, they'll be beating the majority of tri SLI Titans/780s.
> *You seem to have completely lost track of where this discussion went, because it was about multi GPU scaling. Your post is completely irrelevant.* No wonder why you don't see my point.


What? This thread is about 780 Lightnings. You all have lost track of where this discussion was.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> That's interesting, I see QUAD fire on par with Tri-Sli
> 
> That's *4* cards vs *3*.


If you scroll down one more rank what does it say? #11 that is. And then what is #12..? 13 is just sad panda out there.
11 jomama22 i7 3960x HD 7970 TriFire 144.7 6054 3413

12 M3T4LH34D i7 3770k GTX Titan Tri-SLI 144.6 6050 3020

13 flinty2000 i7 3770k HD 7970 QuadFire 143.6 6007 5831








. (On the phone so copy pasta was easier).


----------



## ignotus

from MSI Europe facebook site.

some confusion my arse.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ignotus*
> 
> 
> 
> from MSI Europe facebook site.
> 
> some confusion my arse.


If they would just say "the lightning has been pushed until the end of august" instead of using these videos that clearly cause "confusion", I would have way more respect for the situation. Would I still be a bit upset? Sure, but dealing with it would be easier and would cause such a backlash.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Let's go back to your original post.
> You're saying 3 Titans do not scale well at all. To prove your point you select a user who has highly binned and golden cards. We go over the scoreboard where it is dominated by Titans & 780's.
> 
> Had he been #1, you would have a case. His scores are not typical, nor average by any means. That's why the next best score is 44.
> 
> If you don't think Titans scale well, you need to familiarize yourself with this thread, which I linked you to already.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1415441/7680x1440-benchmarks-plus-2-3-4-way-sli-gk110-scaling/0_50
> 
> No one is buying 3 Titans to play on 1080p.
> 
> That's if for me, this is a Lightning thread afterall.


You still don't get it do you? 3 7970's should _never_ even get close to three Titans, and that's exactly what you thought. Now that you've been proven wrong, you're backpeddling and suggesting that they need to be #1, which is completely besides the point. 3x Titans don't scale well at anything besides the most extreme resolutions. The end. Get over it.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Re-releasing the same video is the worst form of marketing possible. The video gives us no information about why there was a delay, or even a teaser of things they are changing (if that's the case). If I wasn't waiting to build my rig until Thanksgiving, I'd buy a classy right now. MSI screwed the pooch with this marketing stunt.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Oh dear... I agree. That was pretty much the dumbest thing they could say. "Hey guys! Wait until Friday for us to show you a video you've already seen and are quite angry over!"


----------



## Kaapstad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> You still don't get it do you? 3 7970's should _never_ even get close to three Titans, and that's exactly what you thought. Now that you've been proven wrong, you're backpeddling and suggesting that they need to be #1, which is completely besides the point. 3x Titans don't scale well at anything besides the most extreme resolutions. The end. Get over it.


If we are still talking about the Unigine Valley bench, turn the resolution up to 1600p and 3 Titans will beat 3 HD 7970s with ease.

The Titans do scale well, the problem is getting the CPU to run high enough to avoid a bottleneck.

Now can we get this thread back on track please.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kaapstad*
> 
> If we are still talking about the Unigine Valley bench, turn the resolution up to 1600p and 3 Titans will beat 3 HD 7970s with ease.
> 
> The Titans do scale well, the problem is getting the CPU to run high enough to avoid a bottleneck.
> 
> Now can we get this thread back on track please.


We were talking about 3DMark Firestrike, and Valley 1600p + 8x MSAA is exactly like an extreme resolution.

Now yes, let's get back on track. No use arguing about the facts.


----------



## serothis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> If they would just say "the lightning has been pushed until the end of august" instead of using these videos that clearly cause "confusion", I would have way more respect for the situation. Would I still be a bit upset? Sure, but dealing with it would be easier and would cause such a backlash.


Yeah I would have to agree with this. If they said "sorry but due to supply shortages (or whatever the reason) we've had to delay the launch to such and such date" that would have been irritating but understandable.

what really angers me is that a week ago there's absolutely no way they could have not known a delay was coming, save for some major incident. And yet they still had their reps posting teaser pictures. THEN they rickroll us with this crap. After which they say "wait for news on friday". THEN DO TROLL US AGAIN! The amount of contempt and utter disrespect that msi is showing us is is inexcusable.

I love my 580 lightning but it's showing its age and I really want to upgrade. However at this point, even if the 780 lightning is a beast and lives up the hype. i'm going to pass on it. I'll wait to see what the 9970 has to offer and if that doesn't beat the 780 then i'll wait for maxwell. the old man 580 will have to soldier on.


----------



## fateswarm

This could use a 'Hitler gets informed' video parody. But I don't know how..


----------



## CrazyElf

Well it looks like this card just got pushed back. I think that at this rate, the competition is not just going to be EVGA, it's going to be the 9970 as well. There's a ton of hype with this product right now ... let's hope that it delivers.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> got two of the devil 13s after they went on sale, gonna compare em to my titans and classifieds when i get them up and running under water, hope they are pretty good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> come on msi stop trollin us man i wanna see lightning benchs under water and air, ill probably never get into ln2 so those benchs dont matter to me that much


Some what OT, but where are they on sale?


----------



## MattGordon

So first they tease the 780 with 780 being highlighted and everything... Just to throw the 760 HAWK. THEN they say "wait till later on, more info on Friday" and now they say it's the consumer who's confused?



MSIpls


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> So first they tease the 780 with 780 being highlighted and everything... Just to throw the 760 HAWK. THEN they say "wait till later on, more info on Friday" and now they say it's the consumer who's confused?
> 
> 
> 
> MSIpls


Just about sums it up perfectly.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> http://wccftech.com/galaxy-geforce-gtx-780-reaches-hall-fame-1900-mhz-core-clock-74-ghz-memory/
> Galaxy GeForce GTX 780 Reaches The Hall of Fame With a 1900 MHz Core Clock and 7.4 GHz Memory


Look at their 3DMarks score, nuff said.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> So instead of giving us actual information they thought it would be a good idea to promote their troll video again.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *WhyCry*
> 
> It's the same video we've already seen. So much for Friday news
Click to expand...

wow, just wow. This guy must be an OCN'er, I wonder why they didn't address his question?










Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> If you scroll down one more rank what does it say? #11 that is. And then what is #12..? 13 is just sad panda out there.
> 11 jomama22 i7 3960x HD 7970 TriFire 144.7 6054 3413
> 
> 12 M3T4LH34D i7 3770k GTX Titan Tri-SLI 144.6 6050 3020
> 
> 13 flinty2000 i7 3770k HD 7970 QuadFire 143.6 6007 5831
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . (On the phone so copy pasta was easier).


You did well, congrats.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> So first they tease the 780 with 780 being highlighted and everything... Just to throw the 760 HAWK. THEN they say "wait till later on, more info on Friday" and now they say it's the consumer who's confused?
> 
> 
> 
> MSIpls


Oh MSI, I just don't even....


----------



## Gnrl Kitty

This reminds me of Infestation: Survivor Stories (The War Z)...


----------



## djriful

Just pour water over the box. Then you can see it thru.


----------



## MattGordon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djriful*
> 
> Just pour water over the box. Then you can see it thru.


At this point I wouldn't be surprised if they took the cover off and it just a 760 HAWK


----------



## Rei86

BTW I enjoyed pages 8~10 of this thread, great read.

And yes that's awfully foul of MSI to troll their potential customers. Was gonna get Classifieds but thought better of it and go with MSI for once, but with the Lightning coming out so close to (what I hope the paper launch and oct being the actual street date?) of the AMD R9-X970, might just wait it out and go team red.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> BTW I enjoyed pages 8~10 of this thread, great read.
> 
> And yes that's awfully foul of MSI to troll their potential customers. Was gonna get Classifieds but thought better of it and go with MSI for once, but with the Lightning coming out so close to (what I hope the paper launch and oct being the actual street date?) of the AMD R9-X970, might just wait it out and go team red.


Yes, that's the smart thing to do. I mean if you got 800 dollars handy for a video card, and you're waiting for releases that are 1 month apart from each other, the wait might actually be worth it.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Yes, that's the smart thing to do. I mean if you got 800 dollars handy for a video card, and you're waiting for releases that are 1 month apart from each other, the wait might actually be worth it.


I have a single GTX 780 SC ACX and was gonna get three 780 Lightning or Classified but I minds well wait it out now for the R9-X970. The way AMD is talking it'll be something to watch out for.


----------



## fateswarm

Wait a second. Samsung got an import ban in the US:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/09/us-apple-samsung-patent-idUSBRE9780QP20130809

Related?


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Wait a second. Samsung got an import ban in the US:
> 
> http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/09/us-apple-samsung-patent-idUSBRE9780QP20130809
> 
> Related?


Its not in effect yet and its for phones, because their headphone jacks infringe on a patent...so ridiculous.

God I hope people smell the Apple BS soon and they plummet. Their mobile market is shrinking and hope it dies out in the next few years


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Its not in effect yet and its for phones, because their headphone jacks infringe on a patent...so ridiculous.
> 
> God I hope people smell the Apple BS soon and they plummet. Their mobile market is shrinking and hope it dies out in the next few years


I just imagined Samsung whining in a corner "NO PHONE STUFF? FINE. NO LIGHTNING VRAM".


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I just imagined Samsung whining in a corner "NO PHONE STUFF? FINE. NO LIGHTNING VRAM".


I wouldn't blame them. A lot of the tech used in Apple crap is Samsung.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Its not in effect yet and its for phones, because their headphone jacks infringe on a patent...so ridiculous.
> 
> God I hope people smell the Apple BS soon and they plummet. Their mobile market is shrinking and hope it dies out in the next few years


dont think most people(hipsters) who buy the apple products know about or care about all the patent trolling they are doing, they just buy it because of the apple logo so they can tell their friends about how they had it before it was cool etc etc. Hopefully apple crashes and burns with all these patent trolls.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> dont think most people(hipsters) who buy the apple products know about or care about all the patent trolling they are doing, they just buy it because of the apple logo so they can tell their friends about how they had it before it was cool etc etc. Hopefully apple crashes and burns with all these patent trolls.


You have to realize that there are two demographics that buy Apple.

Hipsters, who just don't care unless it says Apple.

And then there are those who realize that their Macbook Pros pretty much have no equal in terms of quality/display/trackpad. Nor are there really any other solid alternatives to the iPod. Apple does make some good products that don't have a peer in the PC market at all.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> they had it before it was cool


The irony is that almost everything it has ever done has been done before their own marketing tried to make it cool.

It's probably the most facepalmable company in the history of facepalm.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Macbook Pros pretty much have no equal in terms of quality/display/trackpad.


I'm sorry to inform you but you suffer from a common case of you believed Apple's propaganda.


----------



## szeged

idk maybe im just biased because i hate all the hipster kids in my college town.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Wait a second. Samsung got an import ban in the US:
> 
> http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/09/us-apple-samsung-patent-idUSBRE9780QP20130809
> 
> Related?


I'm sure Obama will veto this as well.









That import ban would have nothing to do with Memory.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> dont think most people(hipsters) who buy the apple products know about or care about all the patent trolling they are doing, they just buy it because of the apple logo so they can tell their friends about how they had it before it was cool etc etc. Hopefully apple crashes and burns with all these patent trolls.


This is so true. I've talk to buddies who own iPhones about all the patent trolling, they literally had no idea what I was talking about. They even said, who cares, it doesn't effect me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I just imagined Samsung whining in a corner "NO PHONE STUFF? FINE. NO LIGHTNING VRAM".


lol, should've read the rest of replies.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

I love Apple computers and OS X. I also love the iPhone.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm sorry to inform you but you suffer from a common case of you believed Apple's propaganda.


That's not propaganda.

There isn't a peer in terms of the display. There are no other 1800p displays currently on the market. Nor does Windows scale at higher resolutions nearly as well as OSX. Hate to break it to you, but that is a fact. Not to mention its an IPS panel, on a laptop. That is properly factory color calibrated, which almost all other Windows laptops don't come with (talking about calibration & IPS).

And the closest Windows laptop in terms of design (unibody aluminium) would be the Lenovo IdeaPad U410. And it still doesn't come with specs that are at the level of the Macbook Pro Retina.

And I'm sorry, but there isn't a damn Windows laptop on the market that has been able to properly re-create the glass track-pad on the Macbook/Macbook Pro. It literally has no peer on the market.

That's not propaganda. Those are facts. And I personally find it quite asinine to have so much hate for a company. Yeah, Apple puts out some bad products. Just like every other vendor on the market. But they have some pretty high quality stuff too.

Same thing with your beloved Samsung. They put out some high quality products, but they also put out some very garbage products.

If that seems to push your buttons? Well, that's up to you. But I do find it quite sad and laughable. They are like any other company. All companies are after your wallet, and nothing else


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> If that seems to push your buttons?


Have you pushed any buttons to search if what you say is true?


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> That's not propaganda.
> 
> There isn't a peer in terms of the display. There are no other 1800p displays currently on the market. Nor does Windows scale at higher resolutions nearly as well as OSX. Hate to break it to you, but that is a fact. Not to mention its an IPS panel, on a laptop. That is properly factory color calibrated, which almost all other Windows laptops don't come with (talking about calibration & IPS).
> 
> And the closest Windows laptop in terms of design (unibody aluminium) would be the Lenovo IdeaPad U410. And it still doesn't come with specs that are at the level of the Macbook Pro Retina.
> 
> And I'm sorry, but there isn't a damn Windows laptop on the market that has been able to properly re-create the glass track-pad on the Macbook/Macbook Pro. It literally has no peer on the market.
> 
> That's not propaganda. Those are facts. And I personally find it quite asinine to have so much hate for a company. Yeah, Apple puts out some bad products. Just like every other vendor on the market. But they have some pretty high quality stuff too.
> 
> Same thing with your beloved Samsung. They put out some high quality products, but they also put out some very garbage products.
> 
> If that seems to push your buttons? Well, that's up to you. But I do find it quite sad and laughable. They are like any other company. All companies are after your wallet, and nothing else


Asus Zen books.

I have to admit I love Apples laptops but all the trolling their doing with mobile market is just disgusting as a tech lover.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> That's not propaganda.
> 
> There isn't a peer in terms of the display. There are no other 1800p displays currently on the market. Nor does Windows scale at higher resolutions nearly as well as OSX. Hate to break it to you, but that is a fact. Not to mention its an IPS panel, on a laptop. That is properly factory color calibrated, which almost all other Windows laptops don't come with (talking about calibration & IPS).
> 
> And the closest Windows laptop in terms of design (unibody aluminium) would be the Lenovo IdeaPad U410. And it still doesn't come with specs that are at the level of the Macbook Pro Retina.
> 
> And I'm sorry, but there isn't a damn Windows laptop on the market that has been able to properly re-create the glass track-pad on the Macbook/Macbook Pro. It literally has no peer on the market.
> 
> That's not propaganda. Those are facts. And I personally find it quite asinine to have so much hate for a company. Yeah, Apple puts out some bad products. Just like every other vendor on the market. But they have some pretty high quality stuff too.
> 
> Same thing with your beloved Samsung. They put out some high quality products, but they also put out some very garbage products.
> 
> If that seems to push your buttons? Well, that's up to you. But I do find it quite sad and laughable. They are like any other company. All companies are after your wallet, and nothing else


Of all dell and Asus laptops I've owned. Nothing was as good as my MacBook Pro. The retina displays on the MacBooks are just jaw dropping.

I love computers and technology, when I need work done, I can get it done through either windows or Mac.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Apple makes a few products that are outstanding, (MBP, iPhone, iPod). Sure, they're patent trolls and have a generally negative perception from tech lovers, but they do make great products. I also think their customer service from the Apple store is fantastic. Took my MBP in because my hard drive was dying, replaced it same day with an upgrade, free of charge.

They have their faults, but so does every other company.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Asus Zen books.
> 
> I have to admit I love Apples laptops but all the trolling their doing with mobile market is just disgusting as a tech lover.


Zenbooks aren't even close to the Macbook Pro Retina in terms of specs and quality. Its in a completely different category that competes with the MBA. Which if that is what you are comparing with, then yeah, it is a viable alternative.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> That's not propaganda.
> 
> There isn't a peer in terms of the display. There are no other 1800p displays currently on the market. Nor does Windows scale at higher resolutions nearly as well as OSX. Hate to break it to you, but that is a fact. Not to mention its an IPS panel, on a laptop. That is properly factory color calibrated, which almost all other Windows laptops don't come with (talking about calibration & IPS).
> 
> And the closest Windows laptop in terms of design (unibody aluminium) would be the Lenovo IdeaPad U410. And it still doesn't come with specs that are at the level of the Macbook Pro Retina.
> 
> And I'm sorry, but there isn't a damn Windows laptop on the market that has been able to properly re-create the glass track-pad on the Macbook/Macbook Pro. It literally has no peer on the market.
> 
> That's not propaganda. Those are facts. And I personally find it quite asinine to have so much hate for a company. Yeah, Apple puts out some bad products. Just like every other vendor on the market. But they have some pretty high quality stuff too.
> 
> Same thing with your beloved Samsung. They put out some high quality products, but they also put out some very garbage products.
> 
> If that seems to push your buttons? Well, that's up to you. But I do find it quite sad and laughable. They are like any other company. All companies are after your wallet, and nothing else


Sadly I can't really disagree with anything you said even though I really want to. I mean, I hate Apple but they are a major driver of the US economy right now and it would be very bad for us if they did go in the tank as so many here wish they would. And even I have to grudgingly admit that their laptop hardware is very high end stuff but I'd still rather have a Windows machine personally....


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Apple makes a few products that are outstanding, (MBP, iPhone, iPod). Sure, they're patent trolls and have a generally negative perception from tech lovers, but they do make great products. I also think their customer service from the Apple store is fantastic. Took my MBP in because my hard drive was dying, replaced it same day with an upgrade, free of charge.
> 
> They have their faults, but so does every other company.


The 27 inch iMac is elegant and suitable for most work applications. The thing with Apple computers is that they are not the best machines for gaming, but other than that. They get the job done, they are elegant and have great warranty and support.

I know a lot of people who hate Apple and hate me for owning and liking apple products, but whatever At least I'm enjoying myself lol


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I am still very impressed with the iMac. If you forget the fact that they are Apple you can really appreciate the beauty and precision of their machines. I'd still never buy one though (but then again, I like to build my own systems)...


----------



## CapnCrunch10

We might as well rename this thread as "780 vs Titan, Getting Trolled by MSI, Imma go buy me some classy, Memory Chips, and Samsung and Apple Opinions". I can't believe there's been 100+ pages of comments (albeit a lot off topic) and still no card. At least jomama is doing an awesome job of keeping the first post of this thread relevant.


----------



## Nomoregoodnames

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> There are no other 1800p displays currently on the market.


Although I do agree with the others on Apple making some nice devices, I will just leave this here (no, it's not out yet).








http://www.anandtech.com/show/7097/samsungs-ativ-book-9-plus-3200-x-1800-display-in-an-ultrabook


----------



## tx-jose

can we stay on track people?? lol


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> We might as well rename this thread as "780 vs Titan, Getting Trolled by MSI, Imma go buy me some classy, Memory Chips, and Samsung and Apple Opinions". I can't believe there's been 100+ pages of comments (albeit a lot off topic) and still no card. At least jomama is doing an awesome job of keeping the first post of this thread relevant.


So true, I can't believe how many people have gone off topic in this thread.










Spoiler: Spoiler!



That includes me.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

That's what happens when you get trolled for a month by a manufacturer. We should've been discussing our new Lightning overclocks and bench scores by now...


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> That's what happens when you get trolled for a month by a manufacturer. We should've been discussing our new Lightning overclocks and bench scores by now...


I hear Neliz has some new fan pics to share.

Couldn't resist.









The icing on the cake was, "wait 'till Friday for some new info". Friday comes along and they post a video they released on Wednesday.









A simple explanation would have gone a long way.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I hear Neliz has some new fan pics to share.
> 
> Couldn't resist.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The icing on the cake was, "wait 'till Friday for some new info". Friday comes along and they post a video they released on Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A simple explanation would have gone a long way.


With a said (







) local store having open boxed 7970s for sub $350 a piece, I'm just about to go over there, pick up to, and call it a day until Maxwell comes out. Given every rumor of Hawaii, its still not going to compete with the performance offered by two HD 7970s. And two GTX 780s is a tad out of my reach.

But I'm still pissed that I sold my GTX 780, waited 2 1/2 weeks for this Lightning, and jack all has come out of it. Tired of waiting. And even the Classified is a no-go considering that they neutered the VRAM on it after the first batch.

Oh well.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> We might as well rename this thread as "780 vs Titan, Getting Trolled by MSI, Imma go buy me some classy, Memory Chips, and Samsung and Apple Opinions". I can't believe there's been 100+ pages of comments (albeit a lot off topic) and still no card. At least jomama is doing an awesome job of keeping the first post of this thread relevant.


i was thinking the same,like i'm so sad(not angry,not disappointed...)but sad about the lightning,i start to read the off topics,then i think,why no one stop them in their talks..ppff
i have nothing against no one.
i'm just sad,it was the first time i really saved the entire money before a product i want come out,thinking about this card every ... days.even in the beginning of september i could buy a second one for SLI,now i'm asking myself if i should buy this card when it come?and still asking myself if i buy it,how long time i'll keep it before a more powerful one arrive?
i'm still thinking neliz was nice with us,we were like lucky to get all this little informations before most of the people.Now some of us are disappointed,some are really angry,talking about so many "things"(like going to others companys..).
The only thing i can do is to wait if i want one of the best 780,wait and compare.if it wasn't for BF4 i think i could wait until Maxwell,with my 580 lightning XE(my VG278H can wait but not my other 1440p monitor).


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Zenbooks aren't even close to the Macbook Pro Retina in terms of specs and quality. Its in a completely different category that competes with the MBA. Which if that is what you are comparing with, then yeah, it is a viable alternative.


/Derail

The only thing Apple has going from them is the nice chassis and IPS display. After that everything else is mediocre and overly priced. I love how Apple is biting one of their biggest suppliers, but to damn bad for Samsung ATM still needs apple to buy their chips. But I can't wait for **** to backfire.

/Derail

Well like I said already the release date is far to close to when AMD will probably launch paper specs of the R9-X970. Oh well this single GTX 780 SC ACX is doing me fine...for now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> We might as well rename this thread as "780 vs Titan, Getting Trolled by MSI, Imma go buy me some classy, Memory Chips, and Samsung and Apple Opinions". I can't believe there's been 100+ pages of comments (albeit a lot off topic) and still no card. At least jomama is doing an awesome job of keeping the first post of this thread relevant.


11 pages dude...11 pages.


----------



## xoleras

I'm going to say this and then state that all of this garbage is completely off topic in the lightning thread.

Apple makes great products. Period. And they sell a ton of product. How mad does that make you? I don't have a brand loyalty, but the ipad and rMBP are in their own league - there is no ultrabook that is nearly as good as the rMBP. Ultrabook manufacturers are still churning out bottom dollar junk while ignoring the fact that some people will pay for quality. Sorry, nobody has stepped up with a product comparable to the rMBP yet. Every ultrabook i've used has terrible trackpads, flimsy keyboards, HDMI out that doesn't support greater than 1080p (mDP on the rMBP supports all resolutions to external monitors), and horrible screens with 1366p resolution. That is bottom dollar junk. I want a quality machine and ultrabook makers can't seem to do it - and that is unfortunate because i've tried to find a comparable Windows machine, as I prefer Windows over OSX. But it just doesn't exist - Apple's rMBP is just higher quality than everything else. Also here we are 1.5 years later and nobody has produced an ultrabook with a screen even remotely comparable to the rMBP.

Anyway, this is all off topic. Take it to a different thread. Christ. Every time apple is mentioned the haters come out in droves







This is getting old man. Just make a thread in the off topic forum because it certainly does not belong here.


----------



## malmental

Apple sux....
Let's move on.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> they are a major driver of the US economy right now and it would be very bad for us if they did go in the tank


That's the operating phrase right here. It's US nationalism and protectionism that drives not just those short term news about being biased against South Korea's Samsung, but also the general bias of Americans for the Apple.

For a long long time, I've been flabbergasted about how Americans are so biased for this company. I didn't get it. I actually had convinced myself after a point that that country has indeed tons of hipsters. But then I realized wait a second, the whole bunch of their nationalists/right wing/patriots (and it's apparently half of their government being elected in that venue) would support it anyway.

So.. yeah.. screw Apple.


----------



## driftingforlife

Surprised this hasn't been locked yet.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That's the operating phrase right here. It's US nationalism and protectionism that drives not just those short term news about being biased against South Korea's Samsung, but also the general bias of Americans for the Apple.
> 
> For a long long time, I've been flabbergasted about how Americans are so biased for this company. I didn't get it. I actually had convinced myself after a point that that country has indeed tons of hipsters. But then I realized wait a second, the whole bunch of their nationalists/right wing/patriots (and it's apparently half of their government being elected in that venue) would support it anyway.
> 
> So.. yeah.. screw Apple.


So, what does this have to with the Lightning? This thread should be closed or be kept on topic. I keep checking it to see if there are lightning updates and the discussion is Apple.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Surprised this hasn't been locked yet.


well technically the 'subject matter' GTX 780 Lightning hasn't been released yet.
but since this thread turned out to be one big troll and 'neliz' to shaky to come around and face the music.
maybe it should be closed..


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> So, what does this have to with the Lightning?


Ah, let me explain. As you had confirmed yourself, Samsung may be unable to provide VRAM to some companies, and it went on from there.

i.e. you are also part of the chain reaction. hehe


----------



## malmental

if they do not get Samsung RAM then they will use Elpida.?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> if they do not get Samsung RAM then they will use Elpida.?


I've no idea.

I don't think anyone has an idea what their deals are.

Though EVGA had mentioned their strategy is to have a backup plan for each provider of a component.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> if they do not get Samsung RAM then they will use Elpida.?
> 
> 
> 
> I've no idea.
> 
> I don't think anyone has an idea what their deals are.
> 
> Though EVGA had mentioned their strategy is to have a backup plan for each provider of a component.
Click to expand...

keep up the informative post..


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> keep up the informative post..


If you're being sarcastic, explain how mentioning that EVGA mentioned those types of companies have backup plans is not information.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> keep up the informative post..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you're being sarcastic, explain how mentioning that EVGA mentioned those types of companies have backup plans is not information.
Click to expand...

in a general sense, not specifically that post...
(take compliments well do you...)


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> in a general sense, not specifically that post...
> (take compliments well do you...)


I''m still not sure what's going on, but sorry, here is a rep.

To stay on topic:

*MSI GIVE A RESPONSE!*


----------



## driftingforlife

No answer to my emails as of yet.


----------



## szeged

Neliz is probably over at evga hq celebrating the increase of classified sales atm. That or too scared to come back after the failed troll attempts.


----------



## PureBlackFire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> Neliz is probably over at evga hq celebrating the increase of classified sales atm. That or too scared to come back after the failed troll attempts.


maybe he's just being quiet until he has some quality info he can give us. there's no point in him coming back to this thread to be bashed on for how this 780 lightning debacle (at this point it's a debacle) went so far. maybe they're changing the yellow to white or silver. gotta remain optimistic you know.


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I hear Neliz has some new fan pics to share.


You rang sir?


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> if they do not get Samsung RAM then they will use Elpida.?


You have Samsung, Hynix and Elpida during the GTX 600 and HD7000.

I'm sure AMD is buying up Hynix ram like crazy and their partners might be buying up Samsung/Hynix.

Either ways with EVGA out and now putting Elpida on their Classified, it stands to reason one of the delays for the Lightning might be a supply issue.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> if they do not get Samsung RAM then they will use Elpida.?
> 
> 
> 
> You have Samsung, Hynix and Elpida during the GTX 600 and HD7000.
> 
> I'm sure AMD is buying up Hynix ram like crazy and their partners might be buying up Samsung/Hynix.
> 
> Either ways with EVGA out and now putting Elpida on their Classified, it stands to reason one of the delays for the Lightning might be a supply issue.
Click to expand...

good insight, +rep..


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> You have Samsung, Hynix and Elpida during the GTX 600 and HD7000.
> 
> I'm sure AMD is buying up Hynix ram like crazy and their partners might be buying up Samsung/Hynix.
> 
> Either ways with EVGA out and now putting Elpida on their Classified, it stands to reason one of the delays for the Lightning might be a supply issue.


Ya it's probably why the classified was out of stock for so long after the first batch went out. Maybe they were ready to release the lightning and then had supply issues with the vram. It sucks that reps were around the entire time and now something goes wrong and they disappear without an explanation. If they came on here and said they had supply issues out of there control I would understand that more than confusing videos. I'm really interested to see how this card performs. But this whole ram thing changes things a lot. I mean a lot of people bought classified's to benchmark and get onto leaderboards and stuff like that. With samsung ram overclocking to 7000mhz and beyond and with elpida most people can't get past like 6500-6600, That makes a huge difference in benchmark scores. Maybe not gaming so much but I definitely bought these cards to do a lot of benchmarking.


----------



## malmental

I just realized the title of this thread is indeed the 'Teasing'...
they have teased and oh how many of you got your feelings hurt.
(and it's not cool either on MSI part..)

just saying.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I just realized the title of this thread is indeed the 'Teasing'...
> they have teased and oh how many of you got your feelings hurt.
> (and it's not cool either on MSI part..)
> 
> just saying.


When the time comes, it will be changed to launch. I'm glad someone noticed my reasoning for leaving it lol. Ill say, this thread has been linked to a lot as we have a rep who was posting some juicy information. Seems why we have a massive view count.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I just realized the title of this thread is indeed the 'Teasing'...
> they have teased and oh how many of you got your feelings hurt.
> (and it's not cool either on MSI part..)
> 
> just saying.
> 
> 
> 
> When the time comes, it will be changed to launch. I'm glad someone noticed my reasoning for leaving it lol. Ill say, this thread has been linked to a lot as we have a rep who was posting some juicy information. Seems why we have a massive view count.
Click to expand...

definitely entertaining to say the least..


----------



## MrMarauder

A new thread needs to be made when the 780 Lightning eventually hits market as this one has way too much crap to wade through. Not content with just a 780 vs Titan argument, let's migrate to an Apple vs PC.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> A new thread needs to be made when the 780 Lightning eventually hits market as this one has way too much crap to wade through. Not content with just a 780 vs Titan argument, let's migrate to an Apple vs PC.


Next month expect a new Lightning thread...and four pages later it'll turn into Lightning vs Classified vs AMD GPU thread!

And soon after that Titan vs Lightning!

And soon after that no one will care about it anymore as everyone would have moved on into the Lightning owners club thread.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> You rang sir?


Upvoted.


----------



## 2010rig

I just received some insider info for the cause of the delay. After receiving feedback on how the majority feels on the yellow fans, MSI went back to the drawing board and is making ALL fans yellow now. They feel this will boost sales for their Z87 MPOWER mobo.

Stay tuned for new fan pic teasers to follow.


----------



## xoleras

Also, the backplate will have pictures of Cheryl Cole laminated on them.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I just received some insider info for the cause of the delay. After receiving feedback on how the majority feels on the yellow fans, MSI went back to the drawing board and is making ALL fans yellow now. They feel this will boost sales for their Z87 MPOWER mobo.
> 
> Stay tuned for new fan pic teasers to follow.


Yuck. Yellow fans? Are these import tuners now?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Leaked image of the 780 Lightning.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Also, the backplate will have pictures of *Cheryl Cole* laminated on them.


FTFY.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Yuck. Yellow fans? Are these import tuners now?


Sneak peak.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

H
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> FTFY.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sneak peak.


hmm, it actually looks good. Hopefully they keep it black and yellow. The blue accents might kill it.


----------



## fateswarm

You'll all be sad when they'll release it and it will only be $200.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> You'll all be sad when they'll release it and it will only be $200.


Wait, what?

You lost me .... Are You saying a 780Lightning for 200?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Wait, what?
> 
> You lost me .... Are You saying a 780Lightning for 200?


Yes. This rumour started here. You saw it first.


----------



## serothis

What if they actually are redesigning the fans? The center yellow fan wasn't received very well here or on other sites what if they decided on a last minute color change?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

I
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Yes. This rumour started here. You saw it first.


I wonder what the actual cost to make these is.


----------



## Harry604

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I
> I wonder what the actual cost to make these is.


More than you can afford Pal.... Ferrari


----------



## Draygonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Sneak peak.


----------



## szeged

oh neliz, where are you, we want to see whats up with msi(hides the pitchforks and torches)


----------



## xoleras

I don't think there's anything he can say without getting flamed, really, so the best course of action is to avoid it. IMO, MSI probably intended to launch the Lightning on the 8th, and for whatever reason they had a complication and were forced to delay the release.

Trust me - i'm sure they want to get it on the shelves ASAP - a delayed launch means less sales in the long run. So he probably honestly thought that it was being released on the 8th, and then at the last minute it was delayed. It sucks, but that's probably what happened - and no matter what he says, he will still be flamed here if he tries to explain it.

Just my theory.


----------



## zakelwe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I don't think there's anything he can say without getting flamed, really, so the best course of action is to avoid it. IMO, MSI probably intended to launch the Lightning on the 8th, and for whatever reason they had a complication and were forced to delay the release.
> 
> Trust me - i'm sure they want to get it on the shelves ASAP - a delayed launch means less sales in the long run. So he probably honestly thought that it was being released on the 8th, and then at the last minute it was delayed. It sucks, but that's probably what happened - and no matter what he says, he will still be flamed here if he tries to explain it.
> 
> Just my theory.


A good summation.

Sh it happens, better to hold off rather than release something that doesn't work as required. Of course they have raised expectations and then not delivered, reminds me of this

"With a near perfect record of execution, NVIDIA inspired great expectations when details first started leaking out about their next-generation GPU: NV30. But when ATI's Radeon 9700 was announced, launched and released to the public and we had still not seen as much as a demo of NV30 from NVIDIA, everyone began to worry. Rumors ran rampant (as they always do)" ....

(Anandtech)

That's 10 years ago now so things do not change. Of course this is nowhere near that level of balls up, now that was a big problem for the hardware this is just a hiccup.

Perhaps have some patience? That's the problem now, everyone wants instant gratification, so much so they go out and buy another card either out of spite or out of tantrums maximus (sounds like a good name for a mobo). It's not as if you cannot play the latest game without one of these cards so are suffering in a world of pain and suffering until you get one?

Having said all that, they have to now deliver of course when it does finally turn up. My Geforce 5800 Ultra is getting rather long in the tooth.









Nice to meet you all by the way.

Andy


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I don't think there's anything he can say without getting flamed, really, so the best course of action is to avoid it. IMO, MSI probably intended to launch the Lightning on the 8th, and for whatever reason they had a complication and were forced to delay the release.
> 
> Trust me - i'm sure they want to get it on the shelves ASAP - a delayed launch means less sales in the long run. So he probably honestly thought that it was being released on the 8th, and then at the last minute it was delayed. It sucks, but that's probably what happened - and no matter what he says, he will still be flamed here if he tries to explain it.
> 
> Just my theory.


Pretty sure it is this, neliz doesn't set the dates & is passing along the info that comes from MSI HQ, the situation is probably as annoying to him as it is to OCN.

I'm sure he'll be back when there is some solid news to report.


----------



## serothis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zakelwe*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I don't think there's anything he can say without getting flamed, really, so the best course of action is to avoid it. IMO, MSI probably intended to launch the Lightning on the 8th, and for whatever reason they had a complication and were forced to delay the release.
> 
> Trust me - i'm sure they want to get it on the shelves ASAP - a delayed launch means less sales in the long run. So he probably honestly thought that it was being released on the 8th, and then at the last minute it was delayed. It sucks, but that's probably what happened - and no matter what he says, he will still be flamed here if he tries to explain it.
> 
> Just my theory.
> 
> 
> 
> A good summation.
> 
> Sh it happens, better to hold off rather than release something that doesn't work as required. Of course they have raised expectations and then not delivered, reminds me of this
> 
> "With a near perfect record of execution, NVIDIA inspired great expectations when details first started leaking out about their next-generation GPU: NV30. But when ATI's Radeon 9700 was announced, launched and released to the public and we had still not seen as much as a demo of NV30 from NVIDIA, everyone began to worry. Rumors ran rampant (as they always do)" ....
> 
> (Anandtech)
> 
> That's 10 years ago now so things do not change. Of course this is nowhere near that level of balls up, now that was a big problem for the hardware this is just a hiccup.
> 
> Perhaps have some patience? That's the problem now, everyone wants instant gratification, so much so they go out and buy another card either out of spite or out of tantrums maximus (sounds like a good name for a mobo). It's not as if you cannot play the latest game without one of these cards so are suffering in a world of pain and suffering until you get one?
> 
> Having said all that, they have to now deliver of course when it does finally turn up. My Geforce 5800 Ultra is getting rather long in the tooth.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice to meet you all by the way.
> 
> Andy
Click to expand...

I know this was said a few pages back but I think it bares repeating. The problem isn't the delay. I think everyone here understands that alot if things have to happen before a product can be released. I believe that the reason everyone is PO'd is how MSI handled the news.

If they simply said "hey we're having supply issues and that has forced us to delay the launch" then most everyone would have been ok with the news. Instead MSI decided to troll is with a video. Twice actually. And that's why people are so angry.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I don't think there's anything he can say without getting flamed, really, so the best course of action is to avoid it. IMO, MSI probably intended to launch the Lightning on the 8th, and for whatever reason they had a complication and were forced to delay the release.
> 
> Trust me - i'm sure they want to get it on the shelves ASAP - a delayed launch means less sales in the long run. So he probably honestly thought that it was being released on the 8th, and then at the last minute it was delayed. It sucks, but that's probably what happened - and no matter what he says, he will still be flamed here if he tries to explain it.
> 
> Just my theory.


I agree with you 100%. It's just that the way MSI handled it wasn't exactly stellar.

Coming clean and saying, we intended to launch on the 7th but there's been a change of plans due to _________ reasons we had to move the launch back to August 28. We are working hard to resolve the issues, and we appreciate your patience with us.

Instead we get silence ( from Neliz ), along with some silly video, and this:



"There seems to be some confusion", where did the confusion come from?









How can the Lightning *continue* to dominate, if it's currently not dominating *now*?


----------



## alancsalt

So were we supposed to be expecting the 760 Hawk on the seventh, and the lightning isn't coming till the 28th or more? Clear as mud really....


----------



## Cial00

I check this thread a couple times a day and it just depresses me more and more :/


----------



## fateswarm

I know we closed this subject a while ago but I still suspect the supply chain was disrupted by Samsung VRAM.

Thank you Obama.


----------



## szeged

its obamas fault samsung has a shortage of vram modules?


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> its obamas fault samsung has a shortage of vram modules?


----------



## fateswarm

Didn't you year of the Samsung VS Apple Obama ban? The Samsung VRAM supply chain theory pans out!


----------



## szeged

brb, gotta dig out my tinfoil armor!


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I know we closed this subject a while ago but I still suspect the supply chain was disrupted by Samsung VRAM.
> 
> Thank you Obama.


There are conspiracy theories, and then there's this.









EVGA-Jacob's explanation makes far more sense.

Think about this, Apple has been suing Samsung for a couple years now ongoing. iPhone's still carry a lot of Samsung made parts *today*.

Heck, Samsung is rumored to be making Apple's A9 processor on 14nm.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-57593692-37/apple-reportedly-signs-samsung-for-next-gen-iphone-chips/

The only plausible explanation that makes sense is that Samsung's RAM is in such high demand, and therefore there is a shortage.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> brb, gotta dig out my tinfoil armor!


----------



## szeged

while it is all totally possible, i just thought the wording was funny thats all







made it sound like obama dikembe mutombo blocked some vram modules out of the air from half court with msi on the other side trying to catch them


----------



## malmental

conspiracy theories..
though anything is possible.


----------



## Rei86

no theory... Samsung memory chips are in high demand. Think of all the OEM's using them for RAM, VRAM, and SSD.

Hell Samsung probably had to shift a lot of gear for their 840 EVO launch also.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> no theory... Samsung memory chips are in high demand. Think of all the OEM's using them for RAM, VRAM, and SSD.
> 
> Hell Samsung probably had to shift a lot of gear for their 840 EVO launch also.


I like the way you think man....


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*




MSI.. Why not an all black lightning?


----------



## fateswarm

Evo launch + Obamaban. The Samsung VRAM supply chain being disrupted theory is getting more confirmed by the minute.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> 
> 
> MSI.. Why not an all black lightning?


Because of this.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I like the way you think man....


You want yellow fan blades...


----------



## MeanBruce

Sorry to burst in, who doesn't love Alex and the gravity gun.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yCGRy_dR30

enjoy 2010rig you're amazing, so buy some new gear, geez eloweez.


----------



## dph314

Would that really be an issue though that would cause almost a month delay? I mean...the Classifieds didn't really lose too much steam when having to make the switch to Elpida. Wouldn't it be safe to assume that MSI would have had a similar 'back-up' as well? I know the shelves weren't exactly full of Classifieds right off the bat, but they'd still jump in and out of stock constantly. Would a hiccup in Samsung chips really be responsible for this long of a delay? Wouldn't stock just be spotty for a bit? Unless of course MSI _doesn't_ have as flexible of a back-up deal as EVGA does. Who knows. Maybe it really was the reaction to that yellow fan.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dph314*
> 
> Would that really be an issue though that would cause almost a month delay? I mean...the Classifieds didn't really lose too much steam when having to make the switch to Elpida. Wouldn't it be safe to assume that MSI would have had a similar 'back-up' as well? I know the shelves weren't exactly full of Classifieds right off the bat, but they'd still jump in and out of stock constantly. Would a hiccup in Samsung chips really be responsible for this long of a delay? Wouldn't stock just be spotty for a bit? Unless of course MSI _doesn't_ have as flexible of a back-up deal as EVGA does. Who knows. Maybe it really was the reaction to that yellow fan.


Well they might have another big issue also, but its not like any of us work for the R&D/Engineering team of MSI that knows why the delay.


----------



## MrMarauder

If it's a sudden shortage of component(s), why no further reveal on the day it was set to? We get reactor, then backplate, then one fan, then two, and on the alleged scheduled launch, nothing else? Perhaps a last second aesthetic change?


----------



## Draygonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Evo launch + Obamaban. The Samsung VRAM supply chain being disrupted theory is getting more confirmed by the minute.


Obama has stock in EVGA, it all makes sense now...


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I'll laugh myself silly if they release it and it has three black fans!


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I'll laugh myself silly if they release it and it has three black fans!


We would have shown power unknown to mortal man!


----------



## MoBeeJ

If this is the final color, I wish the yellow fan turns white when heated. Remember the 580 extreme's blue fans?


----------



## jincuteguy

So did they release any teaser regarding the GTX 780 Lightning? The August 7 was wrong.


----------



## fateswarm

The fact EVGA reported they have back-up plans, it doesn't mean others have. Others might do from now on though. hehe

PS. If it turns out that the delay is because some of you didn't like to have yellow fans inside a computer case nobody ever sees anyway, it will be hilaaaaaarious.


----------



## szeged

i waiting for them to release the card and it has an all yellow shroud, all yellow components, yellow i/o shield, yellow pcb.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I don't think there's anything he can say without getting flamed, really


He can say that the Lightnings will have good vram chips. That would make a lot of people wait for MSI cards and not buy other makes.


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoBeeJ*
> 
> If this is the final color, I wish the yellow fan turns white when heated. Remember the 580 extreme's blue fans?


You rang, sir?


----------



## driftingforlife

White/black Lightning


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serothis*
> 
> I know this was said a few pages back but I think it bares repeating. The problem isn't the delay. I think everyone here understands that alot if things have to happen before a product can be released. I believe that the reason everyone is PO'd is how MSI handled the news.
> 
> If they simply said "hey we're having supply issues and that has forced us to delay the launch" then most everyone would have been ok with the news. Instead MSI decided to troll is with a video. Twice actually. And that's why people are so angry.


Good post.

This is basically a spit in the face from MSI. Blatant disregard for their customers.

Why on earth would they behave in such a manner is unfathomable to me.


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The fact EVGA reported they have back-up plans, it doesn't mean others have. Others might do from now on though. hehe
> 
> PS. If it turns out that the delay is because some of you didn't like to have yellow fans inside a computer case nobody ever sees anyway, it will be hilaaaaaarious.


Mind you EVGA's "backup plan" was Elpida Vram that couldn't OC much if at all. Do you Lightning buyers really want that for something you want to OC as far as it can go?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> Good post.
> 
> This is basically a spit in the face from MSI. Blatant disregard for their customers.
> 
> Why on earth would they behave in such a manner is unfathomable to me.


People should spit right back by buying the classified. Classified will most likely beat the lightning anyways.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> Good post.
> 
> This is basically a spit in the face from MSI. Blatant disregard for their customers.
> 
> Why on earth would they behave in such a manner is unfathomable to me.
> 
> 
> 
> People should spit right back by buying the classified. *Classified will most likely beat the lightning anyways*.
Click to expand...

wait and see about that..


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> People should spit right back by buying the classified. *Classified will most likely beat the lightning anyways.*


And you know this how?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

J
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> And you know this how?


I didn't say I knew this. I said most likely, just because last year kingpin and his 4 classified 680 destroyed everything including lightnings.


----------



## driftingforlife

Not this time, i think a UK bencher with lightning's with take it this time.

Also come's down to hardware, kingpin has EVGA at his disposal. Apart from Elmor they is no MSI bencher. I would have a go at it if MSI gave me 4 680's.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> People should spit right back by buying the classified. Classified will most likely beat the lightning anyways.


not now that EVGA pulled bait and switch with the sheetty Elpida ram

i was planing to grab Classified SLI but then i read about the ram at the last minute


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Not this time, i think a UK bencher with lightning's with take it this time.


What makes you so sure?

Lets face it, getting 1410 on air is gonna be pretty tough tough to beat.

Kingpin already set some high scores on Firestrike. HOF also achieved some killer scores. I mean I just don't see the lightnings beating classifieds. We would have to wait and see.


----------



## driftingforlife

From the info I have.

That 1410 would have been a cherry card, no matter what they say.

the Lightning we be as good as if not better. but yes, we will have to wait and see.


----------



## xoleras

LOL @ anyone thinking that a Kingpin overclock is anything a regular user would get....Kingpin mods all of his cards and gets free gear from EVGA, he probably went through 40 cards to find the one that happened to overclock the best, and then modded it.

I've been reading messages at the EVGA board from classified users complaining about not being able to pass the lower 1200s with their classifieds. Bottom line is that unless you're Kingpin and get paid to overclock with free gear, overclocking is still subject to the silicon lottery. If you think you'll just buy a classified and happen to get 1400, well I say good luck with that.


----------



## serothis

With the later launch and now the delay (and the botched handling at that) I don't think MSI can afford to lose to the classified. Imagine the bad press they would get after ALL of the bragging about how awesome the lightning is going to be, not to mention the reputation of past lightnings, but then come out months after the classy and then lose. I'm starting to think that they're making sure they have golden card that can be on top.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> LOL @ anyone thinking that a Kingpin overclock is anything a regular user would get....Kingpin mods all of his cards and gets free gear from EVGA, he probably went through 40 cards to find the one that happened to overclock the best, and then modded it.
> 
> I've been reading messages at the EVGA board from classified users complaining about not being able to pass the lower 1200s with their classifieds. Bottom line is that unless you're Kingpin and get paid to overclock with free gear, overclocking is still subject to the silicon lottery. If you think you'll just buy a classified and happen to get 1400, well I say good luck with that.


I never implied that regular users can achieve kingpins overclocks. But looking at last years best scores and oc. They belong to 680 classifieds.

No, most people won't buy a classified and get 1410 on air, but just saying that that has already been done with a classified.

Going through the classy thread people are struggling to get 1300 stable.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *serothis*
> 
> With the later launch and now the delay (and the botched handling at that) I don't think MSI can afford to lose to the classified. Imagine the bad press they would get after ALL of the bragging about how awesome the lightning is going to be, not to mention the reputation of past lightnings, but then come out months after the classy and then lose. I'm starting to think that they're making sure they have golden card that can be on top.


I wouldn't be surprised the reason it's being delayed is because its getting owned by the classy. Only MSI knows.
But yeah, it would be another slap on the face for people waiting on lightnings.


----------



## driftingforlife

I can tell you the lightning getting owned by the classy is rubbish. I have seen the scores they get. Performance is not a problem.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

I
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I can tell you the lightning getting owned by the classy is rubbish. I have seen the scores they get. Performance is not a problem.


Classy owning lightning again is a possibility. That's for sure.


----------



## driftingforlife

What do you mean again? Lighting 680s where better than the classy 680s.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> What do you mean again? Lighting 680s where better than the classy 680s.


No they weren't.


----------



## xxbassplayerxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I
> Classy owning lightning again is a possibility. That's for sure.


It's very unlikely, though. Unless MSI made a huge mistake with the design of the card, the overall performance is down to the chips they get from Nvidia. If MSI and EVGA are buying the same batches of chips, the two cards will likely overclock the same. All of these extra phases will barely make a difference for air/water coolers... What really gives these cards overhead is the available voltage.

Basically, at 1.35V, the cards should be almost identical in overclocking unless one manufacturer did more rigorous binning than the other. In fact, whether these cards are even binned is often up for debate.


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> No they weren't.


Apart from voltage control, better cooler etc.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxbassplayerxx*
> 
> It's very unlikely, though. Unless MSI made a huge mistake with the design of the card, the overall performance is down to the chips they get from Nvidia. If MSI and EVGA are buying the same batches of chips, the two cards will likely overclock the same. All of these extra phases will barely make a difference for air/water coolers... What really gives these cards overhead is the available voltage.
> 
> Basically, at 1.35V, the cards should be almost identical in overclocking unless one manufacturer did more rigorous binning than the other. In fact, whether these cards are even binned is often up for debate.


I agree, they should overclock roughly the same on average. At the end of the day, my card won't OC as good as Kingpins anyways, so it will come down to preference.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Apart from voltage control, better cooler etc.


That's it really. A better cooler


----------



## driftingforlife

And voltage control.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

T
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> And voltage control.


that feature didn't better the lightning. You could still overvolt the classy. The cooler on the other hand did operate much quieter and kept the card cooler.

So, yeah. Just the cooler.


----------



## driftingforlife

Right so the one thing that means it can OC further. Only the first batch had voltage control by buying the extra EVbot.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Right so the one thing that means it can OC further. Only the first batch had voltage control by buying the extra EVbot.


For the 680, but you could still mod the 680C BIOS with the 200% PT version.

As for the GTX 780C this time around has software 1.35v control and the EVBot will let you further push the limits.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Right so the one thing that means it can OC further. Only the first batch had voltage control by buying the extra EVbot.


Isn't that why people buy classified and Lightning cards?
To push them to their limits and beat other people's scores when not gaming?


----------



## Kaapstad

I don't know why people are debating which is better the 780 classified or lightning.

It should be which one is the biggest let down

The classified with poor vram

or

The lightning with, actually where is it ?


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> People should spit right back by buying the classified. Classified will most likely beat the lightning anyways.


What makes you think that at this point? We have so little information to draw upon.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxbassplayerxx*
> 
> It's very unlikely, though. Unless MSI made a huge mistake with the design of the card, the overall performance is down to the chips they get from Nvidia. If MSI and EVGA are buying the same batches of chips, the two cards will likely overclock the same. All of these extra phases will barely make a difference for air/water coolers... What really gives these cards overhead is the available voltage.
> 
> Basically, at 1.35V, the cards should be almost identical in overclocking unless one manufacturer did more rigorous binning than the other. In fact, whether these cards are even binned is often up for debate.


I think the real question is how well they do at the 1.4-1.45V range. The other thing to remember is that MSI might have a better air cooler (which for those using air will be a huge plus in MSI's favor). Finally, a lot of people here are expecting MSI to have better VRAM, so VRAM OCs may favor MSI.

But yeah for air or water they are otherwise likely comparable.


----------



## fateswarm

Oh yeah, definitely, someone being better with *Liquid Nitrogen* cooling proves who is the better brand. /sarcasm in case it wasn't clear. Grats. You fell for the propaganda those "tests" are aiming for.

And by the way, settle down with the VRAM. I brought it up and others confirmed it as a good possibility. But it doesn't mean it's confirmed. For all we (don't) know, they may have a mountain of VRAM chips and just miss VRs or whatever.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> T
> that feature didn't better the lightning. You could still overvolt the classy. The cooler on the other hand did operate much quieter and kept the card cooler.
> 
> So, yeah. Just the cooler.


Right&#8230;so if software voltage without the need for an EVBOT and a better cooler apparently doesn't matter, what apparently makes the Classified better? That Kingpin was able to achieve a slightly higher overclock under LN2? You got your priorities all mixed up, because despite what these cards were designed for, the majority of users will be cooling them with air/water.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Right&#8230;so if software voltage without the need for an EVBOT and a better cooler apparently doesn't matter, what apparently makes the Classified better? That Kingpin was able to achieve a slightly higher overclock under LN2? You got your priorities all mixed up, because despite what these cards were designed for, the majority of users will be cooling them with air/water.


Exactly. I would be basing my decision on waterblocks and availability, actual final performance is such a wash. You might as well bin them yourselves as that will provide the best card anyway.

For air....i guess whichever looks better to you. Unless the twin(tri?) frozr beats the acx by 5-10* while being quieter, this is also a wash.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Right&#8230;so if software voltage without the need for an EVBOT and a better cooler apparently doesn't matter, what apparently makes the Classified better? That Kingpin was able to achieve a slightly higher overclock under LN2? You got your priorities all mixed up, because despite what these cards were designed for, the majority of users will be cooling them with air/water.


Msi could have someone bin their cards and get em to beat classifieds. You all are acting like only EVGA was capable of doing this.
I mean HOF 780 has already being pushed to beat Kingpins classified scores on firestrike.

680 classified was just better than lightning. It overclocked better even with a cheaper cooler.

Classified water blocks for 780 are due mid August.


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Msi could have someone bin their cards and get em to beat classifieds. You all are acting like only EVGA was capable of doing this.
> I mean HOF 780 has already being pushed to beat Kingpins classified scores on firestrike.
> 
> *680 classified was just better than lightning. It overclocked better even with a cheaper cooler.*
> 
> Classified water blocks for 780 are due mid August.


And where have you seen this?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Exactly. I would be basing my decision on waterblocks and availability, actual final performance is such a wash. You might as well bin them yourselves as that will provide the best card anyway.
> 
> For air....i guess whichever looks better to you. Unless the twin(tri?) frozr beats the acx by 5-10* while being quieter, this is also a wash.


Classified 780 hydro copper blocks are due in a couple of days.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> And where have you seen this?


Magazine reviews, online scores.

You seem really upset about Classy being better than a Lightning despite its beefier cooler. At the end of the day, they are the same cards, performing almost identical in every game. I say we wait and see.


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Magazine reviews, online scores.
> 
> *You seem really upset about Classy being better than a Lightning despite its beefier cooler.* At the end of the day, they are the same cards, performing almost identical in every game. I say we wait and see.


I'm the one upset one







, lol

http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_vantage_-_performance/rankings?start=0&hardwareTypeId=videocard_1913&cores=1#start=0#interval=20

yeap, classy is the best


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Magazine reviews, online scores.
> 
> You seem really upset about Classy being better than a Lightning despite its beefier cooler. *At the end of the day, they are the same cards, performing almost identical* in every game. I say we wait and see.


It seems like you're already aware of the facts, so why do you continue to insist that the Classifieds are better? How well a chip overclocks under LN2 is almost completely dependent on the silicon. For us regular users, unlocked voltage and the cooler also affects the overclock, and the Lightning has the edge in both those respects.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> It seems like you're already aware of the facts, so why do you continue to insist that the Classifieds are better? How well a chip overclocks under LN2 is almost completely dependent on the silicon. For us regular users, unlocked voltage and the cooler also affects the overclock, and the Lightning has the edge in both those respects.


Wait weren't you the one claiming that trifire 7970 beat 3 titans in SLI based an TSM score, which was destroyed by 23 people with titans/780? And still kept on insisting on proving a point" lol wow

Like you said, I'm just pointing things out.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I'm the one upset one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , lol
> 
> http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_vantage_-_performance/rankings?start=0&hardwareTypeId=videocard_1913&cores=1#start=0#interval=20
> 
> yeap, classy is the best


You act as if the world you live in just got shattered. Just relax let, whenever MSI feels like releasing its lightning, then we will be able to compare.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Wait weren't you the one claiming that trifire 7970 beat 3 titans in SLI based an TSM score, which was destroyed by 23 people with titans/780? And still kept on insisting on proving a point" lol wow


I said it happened and I gave a link.

Are you mad that you were wrong about that too?

Quote:


> Like you said, I'm just pointing things out.


Funny, because you haven't made any valid points yet to back up your claim.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I said it happened and I gave a link.
> 
> Are you mad that you were wrong about that too?
> 
> Funny, because you haven't made any valid points yet to back up your claim.


I wasn't wrong. 3titans beat 3 7970.

How am I wrong?


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> You act as if the world you live in just got shattered. Just relax let, whenever MSI feels like releasing its lightning, then we will be able to compare.


Seriously, fvck off already.

Go troll some other board or ask mom to put in another Spongebob DVD for you, so you quit posting stupid sheet.


----------



## ethan319

Original picture Neliz uploaded


Odd looking places


Now it looks natural


----------



## fateswarm

I'd rather it have the color of donkey poo if it's faster.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I wasn't wrong. 3titans beat 3 7970.
> 
> How am I wrong?


This again? I thought we were past this.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I wasn't wrong. 3titans beat 3 7970.
> 
> How am I wrong?


I said tsm's setup beat many, or even the majority of 3x Titan/780 setups. If you disagree with that, then you are incorrect.


----------



## fateswarm

the e-peen war is strong with these past few pages.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'd rather it have the color of donkey poo if it's faster.


Like Noctua fans on video cards?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Like Noctua fans on video cards?


You know what's ironic? There are people that genuinely love brown. e.g. women trying to look "mature" wear brown all the time. Bright colors are considered childish by many people in fashion.

That's right, you heard it here first. Your fashion sense is not mature enough.


----------



## Jack Mac

Fateswarm is trolling too hard.
That's right, you heard it here first. Fateswarm is trolling.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I said tsm's setup beat many, or even the majority of 3x Titan/780 setups. If you disagree with that, then you are incorrect.


Not what u said at all. You just kept going in circles after being proved wrong.

Funny thing is when I mentioned kingpin. You right out said not everyone can oc like him.....

But you wanted to make it seem as if TSM scores with his golden 7970 was common. Way to contradict yourself.

The reason I mentioned Kingpin is because he already set some pretty high scores with the classified. We already say someone Beat some if his scores with an HOF, and now we all wanna see what MSI can do with binned its best 780. I'm not saying everyone can achieve these scores, but I would like to see MSIs best against EVGA a best. That's all.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> You know what's ironic? There are people that genuinely love brown. e.g. women trying to look "mature" wear brown all the time. Bright colors are considered childish by many people in fashion.
> 
> That's right, you heard it here first. Your fashion sense is not mature enough.


I love Noctua Fans, I'm gonna replace all my fans with Noctuas. I'm currently working on my water cooling project.

Lets face it Noctuas are anything but pretty.


----------



## Pr0xy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> You know what's ironic? There are people that genuinely love brown. e.g. women trying to look "mature" wear brown all the time. Bright colors are considered childish by many people in fashion.
> 
> That's right, you heard it here first. Your fashion sense is not mature enough.


I loled pretty hard at this


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Not what u said at all. You just kept going in circles after being proved wrong.
> 
> Funny thing is when I mentioned kingpin. You right out said not everyone can oc like him.....
> 
> But you wanted to make it seem as if TSM scores with his golden 7970 was common. Way to contradict yourself.
> 
> The reason I mentioned Kingpin is because he already set some pretty high scores with the classified. We already say someone Beat some if his scores with an HOF, and now we all wanna see what MSI can do with binned its best 780. I'm not saying everyone can achieve these scores, but I would like to see MSIs best against EVGA a best. That's all.


That's exactly what I said actually. If you have any evidence to the contrary, feel free to post it.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jack Mac*
> 
> Fateswarm is trolling too hard.
> That's right, you heard it here first. Fateswarm is trolling.


----------



## Rei86

I'm just gonna get this out there that I'm a EVGA fanboi.

1. Galaxy hasn't broken any record but their 1900mhz clocked GTX 780 HOF
2. Kingpin is holding down with his single GTX 780C run and GTX Titan run
3. His run so far that he's put on his website that I know of as been with a air cooled, BIOS modded (200pt), 1.35v software voltage modded card
4. MSI has only shown us two runs that they have already subbed to HWBot with the GTX 780 L

As far as we can tell we have no way to know if the GTX 780 L will come with the Samsung chips or Hynix or Elpida as NONE of them are on the market for the public. Not only that its hard to call that the Classified is the better card at this point as we don't have the Lightnings on the market, but I guess because of this you could say the Classified is better.

Some of you calling the Classified the performance winner needs to hold off till we actually have the damn cards on the shelves. With this said...keep rolling...trolalalalalala.


----------



## thestache

Wow this thread blew up. I'm surprised EVGA isn't sold out of classifieds yet.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> You know what's ironic? There are people that genuinely love brown. e.g. women trying to look "mature" wear brown all the time. Bright colors are considered childish by many people in fashion.
> 
> That's right, you heard it here first. Your fashion sense is not mature enough.


The lightning coolers look stupid regardless of colour. They just try too hard to make them look futuristic and 'cool' (same as Asus et al.).

If you want to use the clothing analogy: You can compare a fine suit in traditional colours to a fine suit in bright yellow and say the latter looks ridiculous. But the lightning will be more like this:



Doesn't matter what colour, it'll still look daft.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> The lightning coolers look stupid regardless of colour. They just try too hard to make them look futuristic and 'cool' (same as Asus et al.).
> 
> If you want to use the clothing analogy: You can compare a fine suit in traditional colours to a fine suit in bright yellow and say the latter looks ridiculous. But the lightning will be more like this:
> 
> Doesn't matter what colour, it'll still look daft.


You forgot to preface with, "In my opinion..."


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> 680 classified was just better than lightning. It overclocked better even with a cheaper cooler.


In terms of overclockability, the 680 Lightnings were usually getting over 1,300 MHz and many were able to pull 1,400MHz+ on air - and that was not with Kingpin, that was with people here at OCN. The 680 Classifieds were not in the same ballpark - usually in the 1,200s (and sometimes less). In terms of LN2 performance, I believe the HWBot scores have been linked to you already.

Exactly how was the 680 Classified the faster card?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> 
> 
> Doesn't matter what colour, it'll still look daft.


That escalated quickly to social profiling.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That escalated quickly to social profiling.


If you wear your pants like that, you deserve to be profiled. As an idiot!


----------



## malmental

since were off topic and about sagging pants, allow me to explain the origin of the sagging pants.
maybe you can explain to someone you see, possibly making them pull them up some.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



It started in prison.
the 'female' / male inmates... (you know what I mean...)
advertized their goods in an attempt to attract and lure other 'male' / male inmates for sex.
so basically sagging pants meant you were looking for a boyfriend for some action
and the sagging pants makes it easier for access because of course relations in prison are forbidden
and needed to be done quickly so they do not get caught...



I haven't told me 7 year old son that but he's not sagging his pants either..
just saying...


----------



## gdubc

In prison you get jumpsuits though, not pants....umm...err....I have been told.


----------



## Pr0xy

I always thought sagging pants was to tell everyone be it in prison or the outside world that you were someones *****. *shrugs*

On topic, I really like the idea of all the yellow bits being white. MSI failed in the design this time around, imo of course.


----------



## tx-jose

This is thread of the year....how do we go from lightnings and classifieds to saggin pants and talking about prison??


----------



## driftingforlife

Back to lightning's, the performance is awesome ( i am privy to non-public results), so thats not the cause of the delay.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Back to lightning's, the performance is awesome ( i am privy to non-public results), so thats not the cause of the delay.


Performance is good using samsung or Epilda?


----------



## driftingforlife

Can't say, not replied to my email yet.


----------



## PureBlackFire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> This is thread of the year....how do we go from lightnings and classifieds to saggin pants and talking about prison??


surprised nobody posted that video of the "booty warrior".

on topic, they say lightning never strikes the same place twice. has this card's potential success been compromised?


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Back to lightning's, the performance is awesome ( i am privy to non-public results), so thats not the cause of the delay.


Anything in terms of benchmarks for us, sir? Unlocked voltage? We need details!!


----------



## driftingforlife

Lets just say they have no problem doing 1800+ on the core. (I know that means nothing to people on air/water)


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Lets just say they have no problem doing 1800+ on the core. (I know that means nothing to people on air/water)


Hate to break it to ya, but that isn't news.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> and the HWBOT submission, for those interested:
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2406887_elmor_3dmark11___performance_geforce_gtx_780_20195_marks
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Interesting that we have Extreme clock for clock comparisons now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats on this great achievement, would love to see some Max on Air OC's next.
Click to expand...


----------



## Cial00

Yeah... Its cool and all for bragging rights but at the end of the day LN2 results are just kinda dumb imho :/


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> Yeah... Its cool and all for bragging rights but at the end of the day LN2 results are just kinda dumb imho :/


LN2 is not for the average consumer which is why it really means nothing in terms of performance for the majority of people who will purchase this card. I do think LN2 has its place though, in terms of benchmarking.


----------



## xxbassplayerxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> LN2 is not for the average consumer which is why it really means nothing in terms of performance for the majority of people who will purchase this card. I do think LN2 has its place though, in terms of benchmarking.


It's fun!


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> LN2 is not for the average consumer which is why it really means nothing in terms of performance for the majority of people who will purchase this card. I do think LN2 has its place though, in terms of benchmarking.


Fair enough


----------



## Draygonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PureBlackFire*
> 
> surprised nobody posted that video of the "booty warrior".


Looks like MSI wants to do things the hard way
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PureBlackFire*
> 
> on topic, they say lightning never strikes the same place twice. has this card's potential success been compromised?


Taking their time is par for the course. 480 Lightning was released just weeks before the 580s came out.


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> since were off topic and about sagging pants, allow me to explain the origin of the sagging pants.
> maybe you can explain to someone you see, possibly making them pull them up some.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> It started in prison.
> the 'female' / male inmates... (you know what I mean...)
> advertized their goods in an attempt to attract and lure other 'male' / male inmates for sex.
> so basically sagging pants meant you were looking for a boyfriend for some action
> and the sagging pants makes it easier for access because of course relations in prison are forbidden
> and needed to be done quickly so they do not get caught...
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't told me 7 year old son that but he's not sagging his pants either..
> just saying...


I think it mainly started because gangsters started wearing baggy pants to hide guns. When you wear pants that huge they tend to sag.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> since were off topic and about sagging pants, allow me to explain the origin of the sagging pants.
> maybe you can explain to someone you see, possibly making them pull them up some.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> It started in prison.
> the 'female' / male inmates... (you know what I mean...)
> advertized their goods in an attempt to attract and lure other 'male' / male inmates for sex.
> so basically sagging pants meant you were looking for a boyfriend for some action
> and the sagging pants makes it easier for access because of course relations in prison are forbidden
> and needed to be done quickly so they do not get caught...
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't told me 7 year old son that but he's not sagging his pants either..
> just saying...
> 
> 
> 
> I think it mainly started because gangsters started wearing baggy pants to hide guns. When you wear pants that huge they tend to sag.
Click to expand...

http://www.cladwell.com/blog/pull-your-pants-up-a-brief-history-of-saggy-pants/


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> http://www.cladwell.com/blog/pull-your-pants-up-a-brief-history-of-saggy-pants/


If this thread gets locked because of a "saggy pants" debate....


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> http://www.cladwell.com/blog/pull-your-pants-up-a-brief-history-of-saggy-pants/
> 
> 
> 
> If this thread gets locked because of a "saggy pants" debate....
Click to expand...

I didn't start it, just brought facts...
and how many times has this thread been derailed and then back on track..?


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I didn't start it, just brought facts...
> and how many times has this thread been derailed and then back on track..?


Apple vs Samsung
780 vs Titan

Both are a stretch but you could definitely tie them back to the original thread.

Saggy pants debate...not so much.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I didn't start it, just brought facts...
> and how many times has this thread been derailed and then back on track..?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Apple vs Samsung
> 780 vs Titan
> 
> Both are a stretch but you could definitely tie them back to the original thread.
> 
> Saggy pants debate...not so much.
Click to expand...

so why keep replying back and just let it die...?









I have..


----------



## Cial00

What about Pants + Lightning + Hot girl?


----------



## malmental

+rep...


----------



## Baghi

^ it's not "saggy".







For a saggy GPU there are lifters available in the market (hell one or two vendors even include in their bundle), not sure if there are for the pants though.


----------



## malmental

well if you take a few GK110 chips hot off the presses from TSMC and stick them in your pants
you might have some Lightning..
(Lightning in bottle might still be better though.)

but will the pants sag from the weight of all those chips.?


----------



## Kuat

re the saggy pants


----------



## malmental

I remember that...!


----------



## fateswarm

I suspect whoever makes a card that is all white, white fans, white cover, white PCB, white covers of chips will be a winner.

It's like going to the first Beatle after decades of boring cars.

Darn, I should be charging for those ideas.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I suspect whoever makes a card that is all white, white fans, white cover, white PCB, white covers of chips will be a winner.
> 
> It's like going to the first Beatle after decades of boring cars.
> 
> Darn, I should be charging for those ideas.


um...sounds like the HOF









http://www.amazon.com/Galaxy-GeForce-Express-Graphics-78XNH5DV8PXV/dp/B00DZIFN4M

edit: no white fans but the 770 does









http://www.amazon.com/Galaxy-GeForce-Mini-HDMI-Graphics-77NPH6DT8KXZ/dp/B00DJ3GHUC


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> LN2 is not for the average consumer


It's for no one. Who is actually going to use a card on liquid nitrogen?

The very benchmarkers will use it on regular clocks when gaming.

Hell, many overclockers in this domain admit to being on stock.


----------



## driftingforlife

LN2 is for people that love it as a hobby.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CrazyElf*
> 
> In terms of overclockability, the 680 Lightnings were usually getting over 1,300 MHz and many were able to pull 1,400MHz+ on air - and that was not with Kingpin, that was with people here at OCN. The 680 Classifieds were not in the same ballpark - usually in the 1,200s (and sometimes less). In terms of LN2 performance, I believe the HWBot scores have been linked to you already.
> 
> Exactly how was the 680 Classified the faster card?


It was probably being that the card was a 4GB vs being only 2GB effected its ability to oc well, unless it had an EVBot port. But yup 680L for the normal and above normal user was the better OCing card.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baghi*
> 
> ^ it's not "saggy".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For a saggy GPU there are lifters available in the market (hell one or two vendors even include in their bundle), not sure if there are for the pants though.


The powercolor GPU jack sucks, wish AC would make a jack seeing how all of their coolers would sag the PCB.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> It's for no one. Who is actually going to use a card on liquid nitrogen?
> 
> The very benchmarkers will use it on regular clocks when gaming.
> 
> Hell, many overclockers in this domain admit to being on stock.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> LN2 is for people that love it as a hobby.


^ This!
People do use cards on liquid nitrogen, just not for real world or gaming use. It's pretty much a benching only thing, & it can be fun.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ^ This!
> People do use cards on liquid nitrogen, just not for real world or gaming use. It's pretty much a benching only thing, & it can be fun.


to toss my hat in. Some, though very few, do use phase change/cascading to cool their cpu/gpus 24/7 below > -30 during full usage. So ln2 #s can be useful to an extent.


----------



## AbidingDude

Of course I totally just bought two lightning 770's...


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> People do use cards on liquid nitrogen, just not for real world or gaming use. It's pretty much a benching only thing, & it can be fun.


Another thing that makes it pointless in the real world is that *benchmarking itself* on those technologies is done by very few and very rarely. i.e. EVGA having a good overclocker guy means little about their card. i.e. that some guy may have overclocked MSI similarly.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Another thing that makes it pointless in the real world is that *benchmarking itself* on those technologies is done by very few and very rarely. i.e. EVGA having a good overclocker guy means little about their card. i.e. that some guy may have overclocked MSI similarly.


Here's the thing. If you are looking to purchase this card, you most likely know what benchmarking and overclocking are and what they represent. LN2 being the pinnacle of just that. 24/7 or not, those scores do mean something and are a great achievement for more than just the clocker i.e. the engineers. And real world use? Advertising. That's a great use of an accomplishment from that product. Do you get much real world use? Well, does Toyota racing on a closed circuit mean anything in relation to the Toyota I own? No, it does not, but it's great to have that in your pocket. Racing is also fun to watch and participate in, just like ln2.

There does not have to be any relation between what performance you get with a product and what means someone uses to achieve a higher performance with that same item. the mere idea that the card can handle sub zero conditions, be voltage unlocked, has a great power delivery and is higher binned is awesome for average consumers and us a real world benefit directly related to being "ln2 ready" so to speak.

LN2 is also more competitive then you think with big sponsorship opportunities and bigger install base then you think.


----------



## zed1

It's really hard to wait,i'm getting mad:

_google:
_______

_GTX 780
_best GTX 780
_GTX 780 review
_GTX 780 SLI
_GTX 770 2 way & 3 way SLI
no.. no..
_Asus GeForce GTX 780 DirectCU II OC
_eVGA GeForce GTX 780 SC ACX Cooler
_MSI GeForce GTX 780 Twin Frozr GAMING
_EVGA GeForce GTX 780 Classified w/ ACX Cooler

...no no no..wait...wait...

but if i took something else than the lightning,when the 780 lightning will come,i'll think i'm weak because i could not wait,..aarrgghhh..
ok, i must wait just for see the Twin Froz V performance..

i already got the money,but if i'm not wise ,it take me less than 2 and half hours to go buy one card (for start..) and come back at home.
this long wait take me a lot of energy..
...

Sorry guys,i could keep this for me,but i want to share my madness time..maybe someone here can understand that.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Here's the thing. If you are looking to purchase this card, you most likely know what benchmarking and overclocking are and what they represent. LN2 being the pinnacle of just that. 24/7 or not, those scores do mean something and are a great achievement for more than just the clocker i.e. the engineers. And real world use? Advertising. That's a great use of an accomplishment from that product. Do you get much real world use? Well, does Toyota racing on a closed circuit mean anything in relation to the Toyota I own? No, it does not, but it's great to have that in your pocket. Racing is also fun to watch and participate in, just like ln2.
> 
> There does not have to be any relation between what performance you get with a product and what means someone uses to achieve a higher performance with that same item. the mere idea that the card can handle sub zero conditions, be voltage unlocked, has a great power delivery and is higher binned is awesome for average consumers and us a real world benefit directly related to being "ln2 ready" so to speak.
> 
> LN2 is also more competitive then you think with big sponsorship opportunities and bigger install base then you think.


The point there was irrelevant to LN2 itself in isolation. It was specific to the *small sample* of cases. i.e. MSI's guy or EVGA's guy (or guys) are just a few guys. Would the result be the same if the sample of testers was huge?

Because some may say "It's the only sample I got!" but there is a point that that sample becomes completely pointless.

e.g. Would you consider reliable the statistics of tossing a coin twice? Would 2 heads means tails has 0%?


----------



## serothis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> It's really hard to wait,i'm getting mad:
> 
> _google:
> _______
> 
> _GTX 780
> _best GTX 780
> _GTX 780 review
> _GTX 780 SLI
> _GTX 770 2 way & 3 way SLI
> no.. no..
> _Asus GeForce GTX 780 DirectCU II OC
> _eVGA GeForce GTX 780 SC ACX Cooler
> _MSI GeForce GTX 780 Twin Frozr GAMING
> _EVGA GeForce GTX 780 Classified w/ ACX Cooler
> 
> ...no no no..wait...wait...
> 
> but if i took something else than the lightning,when the 780 lightning will come,i'll think i'm weak because i could not wait,..aarrgghhh..
> ok, i must wait just for see the Twin Froz V performance..
> 
> i already got the money,but if i'm not wise ,it take me less than 2 and half hours to go buy one card (for start..) and come back at home.
> this long wait take me a lot of energy..
> ...
> 
> Sorry guys,i could keep this for me,but i want to share my madness time..maybe someone here can understand that.


I know your pain and dilemma. I got my 580l only to read like a week late about the rumored LE. I've been kicking myself ever since. I won't make that mistake again. Only this time i'm waiting to see what the 9970(or whatever amds new naming scheme will call it) has to offer.


----------



## xoleras

Well, one thing is for sure, I don't think MSI planned for a release being this late. I think it is safe to say that there was an unforeseen delay with the card for whatever reason, and that will cost them a few sales. I feel like neliz is more annoyed about this than anyone else, I think he genuinely believed the release to be on the 8th.

It's unfortunate really - I remember the 580 and 680 lightnings were released prior to the classified versions. I also considered both of those cards to be better than the classifieds.


----------



## Kuat

How does MSI sell their cards? Do they have their own store?

What's the best place to check when Lightnings are released? (i don't want to miss out)


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> How does MSI sell their cards? Do they have their own store?
> 
> What's the best place to check when Lightnings are released? (i don't want to miss out)


F5 Newegg with "GTX 780 Lightning" in the search. That's pretty much your best choice. Occasionally they'll pop up on Amazon first, though. And sometimes, if the item hasn't been released, but has a release date and price, then Amazon will post the card on their website as a pre-order. And if you choose to pre-order it, as soon as it is released its first come first serve for those that pre-ordered it. And its quite the easy way of snagging a new release.

And they don't charge you until the product has shipped


----------



## Kuat

Thank you for the info.


----------



## malmental

GTX 780 AMP! Edition



Triple Silencer Advanced Cooling
Next-Generation Gaming Experience
Unmatched Visual Realism and Performance
Dynamic overclocking intelligence

Engine Clock:
1006 MHz (base)
1059 MHz (boost)

Memory Clock:
6208 MHz


----------



## malmental

nothing else to talk about...
thanks MSI..


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> GTX 780 AMP! Edition
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Triple Silencer Advanced Cooling
> Next-Generation Gaming Experience
> Unmatched Visual Realism and Performance
> Dynamic overclocking intelligence
> 
> Engine Clock:
> 1006 MHz (base)
> 1059 MHz (boost)
> 
> Memory Clock:
> 6208 MHz


Halloween comes early...


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Well, one thing is for sure, I don't think MSI planned for a release being this late. I think it is safe to say that there was an unforeseen delay with the card for whatever reason, and that will cost them a few sales. I feel like neliz is more annoyed about this than anyone else, I think he genuinely believed the release to be on the 8th.
> 
> It's unfortunate really - I remember the 580 and 680 lightnings were released prior to the classified versions. I also considered both of those cards to be better than the classifieds.


Yeah I'm guessing something unexpected happened. There was all that hype and marketing material released about how this card was going to be out by now. At this rate, the 9970s will be out in a couple of months and will be ample competition too from the others. The Galaxy 780 HOF is worth checking out as well. I too imagine that this is frustrating for Neliz and the team at MSI.

I'm still optimistic about this card when it comes out though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> It was probably being that the card was a 4GB vs being only 2GB effected its ability to oc well, unless it had an EVBot port. But yup 680L for the normal and above normal user was the better OCing card.
> The powercolor GPU jack sucks, wish AC would make a jack seeing how all of their coolers would sag the PCB.


Yeah I agree - whenever you add extra VRAM, the whole thing does slow down. Pity the 680 couldn't really benefit much from the 4GB frame buffers either (there were situations where the 3GB versions of the 580 could come in handy), seeing that it only had a 256 bus. It was being bandwidth starved as is and often VRAM OCs could offer better performance than core OCs.

I don't know what you're talking about for the Jack (this? http://www.powercolor.com/global/product_Accessories.asp?SeriesID=59), but I know Powercolor is going AMD exclusive in the future it seems.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The point there was irrelevant to LN2 itself in isolation. It was specific to the *small sample* of cases. i.e. MSI's guy or EVGA's guy (or guys) are just a few guys. Would the result be the same if the sample of testers was huge?
> 
> Because some may say "It's the only sample I got!" but there is a point that that sample becomes completely pointless.
> 
> e.g. Would you consider reliable the statistics of tossing a coin twice? Would 2 heads means tails has 0%?


You're really not giving credit to the difficulty or the actual means to do what these guys do. Small sample size or not, the point is if you are interested in overclocking at all, its nice to know the cards you have can handle the absolute extreme limits of what overclocking is. That in itself is a huge draw for the card that adds final, really world improvement over a "just good enough" pcb. You can't quantify what the PCB itself did on a specific chip or what it would have done on any other.

Back to the racing analogy. If I buy a 3" downpipe that is used in racing And is advertised as such, will I ever see the max performance the racing teams do? No way, I do not have the means to do it(ln2) nor is it practical for 24/7 use. Should they not advertise nor should I see any value in the fact that it is a racing part? No way. It adds value to many people to have a product used by the best to achieve something you wish you could do.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The point there was irrelevant to LN2 itself in isolation. It was specific to the *small sample* of cases. i.e. MSI's guy or EVGA's guy (or guys) are just a few guys. Would the result be the same if the sample of testers was huge?
> 
> Because some may say "It's the only sample I got!" but there is a point that that sample becomes completely pointless.
> 
> e.g. Would you consider reliable the statistics of tossing a coin twice? Would 2 heads means tails has 0%?


The number of extreme coolers out there is fairly small, but not like just a couple guys. There are a couple thousand, some are more active than others but there will be hundred of different guys freezing things this month.
Extreme cooled benching is sort of isolated, the records are still the overall records, but it is mainly a competition to do better than the other extreme coolers out there.

The results from people using extreme cooling that you have no plans to use yourself may not be interesting to you, but as jomama pointed out seeing that a card has run 1.7V without blowing up & can set record breaking scores can give a sense of comfort & pride to more conventional overclockers who have the same card.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Back to the racing analogy. If I buy a 3" downpipe that is used in racing And is advertised as such, will I ever see the max performance the racing teams do? No way, I do not have the means to do it(ln2) nor is it practical for 24/7 use. Should they not advertise nor should I see any value in the fact that it is a racing part? No way. It adds value to many people to have a product used by the best to achieve something you wish you could do.


I think that's a perfect analogy. I will never be able to get 1600hz or 1800hz but I still want the card with a higher OC. I think that companies use ln2 results as marketing as much as they do for performance.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The number of extreme coolers out there is fairly small, but not like just a couple guys. There are a couple thousand, some are more active than others but there will be hundred of different guys freezing things this month.
> Extreme cooled benching is sort of isolated, the records are still the overall records, but it is mainly a competition to do better than the other extreme coolers out there.
> 
> The results from people using extreme cooling that you have no plans to use yourself may not be interesting to you, *but as jomama pointed out* seeing that a card has run 1.7V without blowing up & can set record breaking scores can give a sense of comfort & pride to more conventional overclockers who have the same card.


Now, there was no reason to insult that guys mama.


----------



## Kimir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I think that's a perfect analogy. I will never be able to get 1600hz or 1800hz but I still want the card with a higher OC. I think that companies use ln2 results as marketing as much as they do for performance.


Indeed, they do the same on Asus facebook (and rog website), showing of Asus board and G.Skill RAM @ 4400Mhz.


----------



## Kaapstad

MSI PR Team relocate to new premises.


----------



## szeged

so its been how many days without neliz now ?


----------



## tx-jose

Good lord....this thread guys lol

On topic:

.........

Oh the heck with it lol


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Now, there was no reason to insult that guys mama.


Mwahahaha the double entendre strikes again.


----------



## Cial00

Dropping off the bandwagon, decided to pick up the Classified HC while it was in stock today. Hope the Lightning still impresses for those waiting..


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The number of extreme coolers out there is fairly small, but not like just a couple guys. There are a couple thousand, some are more active than others but there will be hundred of different guys freezing things this month.


How many freeze each chip by each brand?

Without a sample of at least 40 for each card, it's meaningless. Sorry, but that's how statistics work. Small samples are just increasingly meaningless.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> How many freeze each chip by each brand?
> 
> Without a sample of at least 40 for each card, it's meaningless. Sorry, but that's how statistics work. Small samples are just increasingly meaningless.


Lol considering you already called the ln2 user sample size small, a smaller sample size for testing is appropriate. But I don't really see what your getting at. What do you mean they would need 40 for each card? Last I checked, most cards produced are only reviewed by a handful of websites or magazines, and that's not even for ln2, that is for cards that will sell 10x as many as the lightning or classy. I still fail to see what your saying.

Remember, these companies aren't binning chips based on max overclock potential, they are binning them by base and boost clock. That's the reason why you see zombified reference cards just as high as these "ln2 ready" cards. Overclocking in its nature is unpredictable, that's half the point. If we all got the same clocks and could all achieve the same performance, we wouldn't be here right now posting on this forum.

If you are looking for a guaranteed clock speed, then just stick to stock if that's what gives you the most satisfaction. For those who like a challenge, like to push hardware to its limits, like to take risks and compete to be the best, then over clocking is where we will be regardless if we can hit 1900 MHz or not.

P.S. Statistics are more then happy to take a small sample size. That's how it works when you don't need or want to deal with asking every person for their scores. How do you think TV ratings work? Do you think they call everyone in the USA and ask what shows we watched? No, they call ~ 1,000 people (out of the 150,000,000 cable subscribers) and baseing their ratings on that. And these TV channels are making multi million dollar decisions on what you deem as a poor statistical data set.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Lol considering you already called the ln2 user sample size small, a smaller sample size for testing is appropriate. But I don't really see what your getting at. What do you mean they would need 40 for each card? Last I checked, most cards produced are only reviewed by a handful of websites or magazines, and that's not even for ln2, that is for cards that will sell 10x as many as the lightning or classy. I still fail to see what your saying.
> 
> Remember, these companies aren't binning chips based on max overclock potential, they are binning them by base and boost clock. That's the reason why you see zombified reference cards just as high as these "ln2 ready" cards. Overclocking in its nature is unpredictable, that's half the point. If we all got the same clocks and could all achieve the same performance, we wouldn't be here right now posting on this forum.
> 
> If you are looking for a guaranteed clock speed, then just stick to stock if that's what gives you the most satisfaction. For those who like a challenge, like to push hardware to its limits, like to take risks and compete to be the best, then over clocking is where we will be regardless if we can hit 1900 MHz or not.
> 
> P.S. Statistics are more then happy to take a small sample size. That's how it works when you don't need or want to deal with asking every person for their scores. How do you think TV ratings work? Do you think they call everyone in the USA and ask what shows we watched? No, they call ~ 1,000 people (out of the 150,000,000 cable subscribers) and baseing their ratings on that. And these TV channels are making multi million dollar decisions on what you deem as a poor statistical data set.


It's basically a law of statistics that to get reliable results, you should have a sample size of at least 40. I won't go into any more details because this isn't a lesson in statistics (and its been over a year since I took Stat







) This basically ensures that you're results aren't due to "randomness". He has a point though that small samples sizes can skew data, but I don't think the size is as small as he makes it out to be. There are well over 40 ln2 overclockers per card.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> It's basically a law of statistics that to get reliable results, you should have a sample size of at least 40. I won't go into any more details because this isn't a lesson in statistics (and its been over a year since I took Stat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) This basically ensures that you're results aren't due to "randomness". He has a point though that small samples sizes can skew data, but I don't think the size is as small as he makes it out to be. There are well over 40 ln2 overclockers per card.


This is just wrong. Sample size depends on what answer we are looking for, what available resources we have and what confidence we find acceptable. What you are thinking about is the threshold of student-t distribution and normal distribution, which is 30. Randomness has more to do with clt (central limit theorem) and the idea that recalculation continually with more random data each time will change the average over and over. Those averages are plotted along normal distribution in a bell curve. (As a note, i find it funny that the "law of averages" is seeping its way in here)

There is no "minimum sample size". The confidence in the data/average/opinion depends on the population, sample size and interval allowed. Would 40 per card be better then 10? sure would, but we aren't in the scientific community so a 95%+ confidence level is not needed. We are overclockers looking for the best product for our wants and needs. If you want to go get hard statistical analysis of what every new gpu produced averages out to overclock to on every cooling level, be my guest. Ill be over here enjoying finding out what my gpu can do on my own and not shoot for an average.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> This is just wrong. Sample size depends on what answer we are looking for, what available resources we have and what confidence we find acceptable. What you are thinking about is the threshold of student-t distribution and normal distribution, which is 30. Randomness has more to do with clt (central limit theorem) and the idea that recalculation continually with more random data each time will change the average over and over. Those averages are plotted along normal distribution in a bell curve. (As a note, i find it funny that the "law of averages" is seeping its way in here)
> 
> There is no "minimum sample size". The confidence in the data/average/opinion depends on the population, sample size and interval allowed. Would 40 per card be better then 10? sure would, but we aren't in the scientific community so a 95%+ confidence level is not needed. We are overclockers looking for the best product for our wants and needs. If you want to go get hard statistical analysis of what every new gpu produced averages out to overclock to on every cooling level, be my guest. Ill be over here enjoying finding out what my gpu can do on my own and not shoot for an average.


Are you implying that 10 dudes playing with overclocking provide 95% confidence? Prove it.


----------



## xoleras

Yeah, cards that OC better under extreme conditions also OC better on air, that is a fact. If you go back in history and look at the records set by the 580 and 680 lightning and classified SKUs, and they held most of the records on HWBOT even on air - that is anecdotal evidence that everyone benefits regardless of whether they want to dabble with LN2 or not.

Overclocking is also a hobby. Some people enjoy doing it as a form of competition, and that's fine with me even though I don't. I personally have no desire to mess with LN2 overclocking, but if someone else finds that that fun, good for them! It's a hobby. As I said - even if you're not using LN2, the premium components on the Lightning and classified PCBs also translate into higher air overclocks. Pretty much with the GTX 680, the lightning 680 reached air overclocks which were unfathomable with other cards. The same principle applied to the GTX 580 lightning, which held a TON of records on HWBot. Better LN2 overclocks = better air overclocks, period.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> This is just wrong. Sample size depends on what answer we are looking for, what available resources we have and what confidence we find acceptable. What you are thinking about is the threshold of student-t distribution and normal distribution, which is 30. Randomness has more to do with clt (central limit theorem) and the idea that recalculation continually with more random data each time will change the average over and over. Those averages are plotted along normal distribution in a bell curve. (As a note, i find it funny that the "law of averages" is seeping its way in here)
> 
> There is no "minimum sample size". The confidence in the data/average/opinion depends on the population, sample size and interval allowed. Would 40 per card be better then 10? sure would, but we aren't in the scientific community so a 95%+ confidence level is not needed. We are overclockers looking for the best product for our wants and needs. If you want to go get hard statistical analysis of what every new gpu produced averages out to overclock to on every cooling level, be my guest. Ill be over here enjoying finding out what my gpu can do on my own and not shoot for an average.


So I got schooled in a statistics lesson, and everything you said is correct







I was thinking of 30 for the studen-t distribution. Regardless, a higher sample size does give us better confidence in the results of that sample. I wasn't disagreeing with you, just saying that a larger sample size allows for a more reliable (confidence interval) result. Normal distribution does have its place here as 67% of GPUs will be within one standard deviation of the mean. I think the point FateSwarm was trying to make was that these GPUs that the extreme overclockers are getting are outside of maybe even two standard deviations which means they have the top 5% of cards, which is unrealistic for almost everyone else, even if they were on ln2.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Are you implying that 10 dudes playing with overclocking provide 95% confidence? Prove it.


No. He's saying that because we're not a scientific community, we don't need 95%+ confidence in the results. In the end, what these guys do with overclocking is a hobby and they enjoy it. It's not for everyone but its fun to see how far a card/processor can be pushed at the extreme levels.


----------



## MrMarauder

It's a shame we don't have anything new to discuss about the Lightning...


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> So I got schooled in a statistics lesson, and everything you said is correct
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was thinking of 30 for the studen-t distribution. Regardless, a higher sample size does give us better confidence in the results of that sample. I wasn't disagreeing with you, just saying that a larger sample size allows for a more reliable (confidence interval) result. Normal distribution does have its place here as 67% of GPUs will be within one standard deviation of the mean. I think the point FateSwarm was trying to make was that these GPUs that the extreme overclockers are getting are outside of maybe even two standard deviations which means they have the top 5% of cards, which is unrealistic for almost everyone else, even if they were on ln2.
> No. He's saying that because we're not a scientific community, we don't need 95%+ confidence in the results. In the end, what these guys do with overclocking is a hobby and they enjoy it. It's not for everyone but its fun to see how far a card/processor can be pushed at the extreme levels.


Sorry for coming off brash lol. Wasn't aimed at you really. I understand his point and have agreed multiple times that no one should expect 1900 MHz, even ln2 benchers. My posts a few pages back sum up my points and feelings on the subject. I also agree with the second part of your post.

Back to the lightning, hopefully We get some tid bits before the 28th, though it is only 2 weeks away


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Sorry for coming off brash lol. Wasn't aimed at you really. I understand his point and have agreed multiple times that no one should expect 1900 MHz, even ln2 benchers. My posts a few pages back sum up my points and feelings on the subject. I also agree with the second part of your post.
> 
> Back to the lightning, hopefully We get some tid bits before the 28th, though it is only 2 weeks away


No worries







Yes, I'm hoping we didn't scare off Neliz and he can provide some info for us. A full view of the card would be a good start....


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Sorry for coming off brash lol. Wasn't aimed at you really. I understand his point and have agreed multiple times that no one should expect 1900 MHz, even ln2 benchers. My posts a few pages back sum up my points and feelings on the subject. I also agree with the second part of your post.
> 
> Back to the lightning, hopefully We get some tid bits before the 28th, though it is only 2 weeks away
> 
> 
> 
> No worries
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I'm hoping we didn't scare off Neliz and he can provide some info for us. A full view of the card would be a good start....
Click to expand...

he's not quite to the level of JF-AMD (having us fall for the hype) but right now Neliz is close to it.
I think he needs to do some explaining or just close his account..
see ya later.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I don't think we'll be seeing Neliz back around here I'm afraid. MSI really botched this thing badly...


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I don't think we'll be seeing Neliz back around here I'm afraid. MSI really botched this thing badly...


I think it would go a long way with everyone here if Neliz did come back and do some explaining. Even something as vague as "we had production delays" would be much better than a 30 sec video essentially trolling everyone.

Bottom line, MSI botched their pre-launch hype, it came back to bite them, and they should do something to get back on the good side of consumers. Not to mention, as others have stated, they have lost sales to the EVGA classy and will continue to do so until the launch or they release something juicy to get the focus back on Lightning, and off of other cards.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Don't get me wrong, I don't really blame Neliz for any of this stuff personally and would love for him to continue to represent MSI here on OCN. I think he just got put in a bad spot by his employer...


----------



## Killa Cam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I don't really blame Neliz for any of this stuff personally and would love for him to continue to represent MSI here on OCN. I think he just got put in a bad spot by his employer...


i understand. but he could of at least said something - anything really. we just want a response, and the way he just disappeared made me question


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I don't really blame Neliz for any of this stuff personally and would love for him to continue to represent MSI here on OCN. I think he just got put in a bad spot by his employer...


This, but his company is such a donkey for doing what they did.


----------



## Kuat

MSI needs to hire a PR manager.

What they are doing now is corporate suicide.


----------



## revro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I don't really blame Neliz for any of this stuff personally and would love for him to continue to represent MSI here on OCN. I think he just got put in a bad spot by his employer...


well for sure his bossess told him not to come here anymore ... or until they release it

best
revro


----------



## zed1

Everybody are wating for neliz explanations like he is guilty,if we don't see him it's maybe because he is not stupid,
Maybe he realised he already told us too much,because all that is playing against him now.
I can imagine people charging him,..just because they can not buy their fetish card....
Let's wait ,it's hard but things will come in their time.


----------



## Booj

How about this:

The original teaser trailer had this reference: *7*/*8*/2*0*13. This trailer was released on 7/8/2013.. or the 8th of July... or July the 8th depending on what part of the world you are from.

Then there was the 780 Hawk launch last week on 8/7/2013, as highlighted in the later video.. the 7th of August.

That would mean that the date for 780 Lightning release was never the 7th of August.


----------



## Baghi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> How about this:
> 
> The original teaser trailer had this reference: *7*/*8*/2*0*13. This trailer was released on 7/8/2013.. or the 8th of July... or July the 8th depending on what part of the world you are from.
> 
> Then there was the 780 Hawk launch last week on 8/7/2013, as highlighted in the later video.. the 7th of August.
> 
> That would mean that the date for 780 Lightning release was never the 7th of August.


Hi Neliz. Did you just joined to point out this?







Just curious. Also, MSI released 7*6*0 Hawk on 7/8/2013, just sayin'.


----------



## Booj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baghi*
> 
> Hi Neliz. Did you just joined to point out this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just curious. Also, MSI released 7*6*0 Hawk on 7/8/2013, just sayin'.


Not Neliz.

But check the video of the 760 release
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZ_J8K3mvKA&feature=share&list=UU9j-aEJL75uRFbLxx0_NsTA

see the date format.. it is 8/7... not 7/8


----------



## RoBiK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> How about this:
> 
> The original teaser trailer had this reference: *7*/*8*/2*0*13. This trailer was released on 7/8/2013.. or the 8th of July... or July the 8th depending on what part of the world you are from.
> 
> Then there was the 780 Hawk launch last week on 8/7/2013, as highlighted in the later video.. the 7th of August.
> 
> That would mean that the date for 780 Lightning release was never the 7th of August.


It is "GTX 760 Hawk" not "780 Hawk". I do not see how highlighting the numbers 7, 8 and 0 and asking "can you hear the thunder?" could point to anything else than "GTX 780 Lightning".


----------



## Booj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RoBiK*
> 
> It is "GTX 760 Hawk" not "780 Hawk". I do not see how highlighting the numbers 7, 8 and 0 and asking "can you hear the thunder?" could point to anything else than "GTX 780 Lightning".


No doubt it points to the 780 Lightning but the point is the date format.

7/8/2013 is not the same as 8/7/2013.


----------



## Kaapstad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> No doubt it points to the 780 Lightning but the point is the date format.
> 
> 7/8/2013 is not the same as 8/7/2013.


All we need now is someone to try and explain how the Aussies keep score in Cricket and we will all be in trouble.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> No doubt it points to the 780 Lightning but the point is the date format.
> 
> 7/8/2013 is not the same as 8/7/2013.


Does it matter?

The Lightning was neither released on July 8'th nor on August 7'th.

Your point is moot.


----------



## Baghi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kaapstad*
> 
> All we need now is someone to try and explain how the Aussies keep score in Cricket and we will all be in trouble.


Because they've Michael Clarke, Michael Hussey and Shane Watson, they can do it.


----------



## Booj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kaapstad*
> 
> All we need now is someone to try and explain how the Aussies keep score in Cricket and we will all be in trouble.


2/222
















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> Does it matter?
> 
> The Lightning was neither released on July 8'th nor on August 7'th.
> 
> Your point is moot.


My point is that most people here are spewing that MSI didn't release the Lightning on August 7th, and I believe that the card was never intended to launch on the August 7th.

What evidence is there that it was going to launch on the August 7th? 7/8/2013?
But that is 8th of July.. not coincidentally the date the original teaser was released... I believe purely to highlight "780"

This is backed up by the dates and format MSI use in the later 'Dish is ready to be served" video, which is written as 8/7 with 8/28 given as the presumable 780 Lightning launch.

My theory is that the rumor sites went into overdrive and said MSI would release the 780 Lightning on August 7th when in fact 7/8 (from the teaser) doesn't mean 8/7.


----------



## revro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> No doubt it points to the 780 Lightning but the point is the date format.
> 
> 7/8/2013 is not the same as 8/7/2013.


it was tweeted by MSI Europe and Europe has other date format with day and month switched, so bad argument here
anyway i am totally confused, so job well done









best
revro


----------



## Baghi

Now I'm sure Neliz or MSI has sent him to confuse everyone.







no offence.


----------



## villain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> No doubt it points to the 780 Lightning but the point is the date format.
> 
> 7/8/2013 is not the same as 8/7/2013.


There are different formats. DMY is the most common date format in the world. It's the only way they could highlight parts of it and come up with the number 780.

I think Neliz knew about the real launch date all along. But I don't blame him, since he probably told us more than we were supposed to know.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> August 7th is still *a* launch date, yeah.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> nope, I can't say anything like that, pricing, accessories etc.
> 
> You can ask, or guess things, but besides what info is public, *I'm actually not even allowed to say what we will launch on the 7th*.
> 
> Heck.. what am I doing here?


----------



## szeged

Who's excited to see the 9970 lightning before the 780 lightning even shows up?


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> There are different formats. DMY is the most common date format in the world. It's the only way they could highlight parts of it and come up with the number 780.
> 
> I think Neliz knew about the real launch date all along. But I don't blame him, since he probably told us more than we were supposed to know.


You are a good investigator.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> My point is that most people here are spewing that MSI didn't release the Lightning on August 7th, and I believe that the card was never intended to launch on the August 7th.
> 
> What evidence is there that it was going to launch on the August 7th? 7/8/2013?


Right, so they never intended to release it on August 7'th, but it's just a coincidence that they released a troll video on that same day?

Conveniently, Neliz has also disappeared and hasn't been heard from since.


----------



## serothis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Booj*
> 
> What evidence is there that it was going to launch on the August 7th? 7/8/2013?
> But that is 8th of July.. not coincidentally the date the original teaser was released... I believe purely to highlight "780"


I'm not sure I follow your logic. Why would msi (or any company) put in the release date of the teaser video in the teaser video? that doesn't make any sense.

Why would you put in a date (any date) hinting at highly anticipated product but have no intention of releasing it on that date?

Either MSI wanted to release it then but couldn't for some reason and made a boneheaded move with the follow up video. OR you're right and MSI didn't have any intention of releasing the card and it was a premeditated troll, in which case MSI deserves even more flak then they're currently getting.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *villain*
> 
> There are different formats. DMY is the most common date format in the world. It's the only way they could highlight parts of it and come up with the number 780.
> 
> I think Neliz knew about the real launch date all along. But I don't blame him, since he probably told us more than we were supposed to know.


God damnit Dr. Cox, I just wanted a hug


----------



## provost

It does not matter about the date format, what matters is setting expectations, either intentionally or unintentionally. neliz knew what people were expecting, and if he is on this thread then he should have tried to manage these expectations which would have had less of a blowback than letting everyone down. Now, no one trusts anything MSI has to say about the lightnings. the only way to remedy it is for them to stop talking and start delivering.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> Who's excited to see the 9970 lightning before the 780 lightning even shows up?


You know, this could very well be possible if the Samsung memory shortage is causing the delay. The 9970 series cards will more than likely use Hynix memory and I don't believe there is a shortage there.

Edit: You said 9970 Lightning. Yeah not going to happen.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> You know, this could very well be possible if the Samsung memory shortage is causing the delay. The 9970 series cards will more than likely use Hynix memory and I don't believe there is a shortage there.
> 
> Edit: You said 9970 Lightning. Yeah not going to happen.


Yeah, but the thing is Hynix and Samsung are the two better VRAM, so its odd that most nVidia partners switched to Elpida.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Yeah, but the thing is Hynix and Samsung are the two better VRAM, so its odd that most nVidia partners switched to Elpida.


My thoughts too. Is it possible that AMD has a lock down on Hynix?


----------



## jomama22

Elpida seems to be more readily available and most likely cheaper because of this. Doesn't mean all aibs are using it for the price cut as with the classifieds who were forced to find a quick supply.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> My thoughts too. Is it possible that AMD has a lock down on Hynix?


My guess was for the R9-X970 (god I hate typing that out) that AMD is buying up supply of Hynix and Samsung (guessing) like crazy and so are their partners.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> he's not quite to the level of JF-AMD (having us fall for the hype) but right now Neliz is close to it.
> I think he needs to do some explaining or just close his account..
> see ya later.


Yeah, just gotta chase away all the reps so they don't try giving any early info at OCN, should help keep potentially wrong info from getting out again!


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> My guess was for the R9-X970 (god I hate typing that out) that AMD is buying up supply of Hynix and Samsung (guessing) like crazy and so are their partners.


Yeah, very possible.

And yes, the new naming scheme is going to be a pain typing out.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> No. He's saying that because we're not a scientific community, we don't need 95%+ confidence in the results. In the end, what these guys do with overclocking is a hobby and they enjoy it. It's not for everyone but its fun to see how far a card/processor can be pushed at the extreme levels.


I'm sorry, but I don't know what kind of results you need, but I'd personally dismiss as nonsense anything below 70 or 60% probability of being right.

If it's just 2 or 3 guys doing it for the first few days when people do the first purchases, it's obviously a nonsensical 'statistic'.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm sorry, but I don't know what kind of results you need, but I'd personally dismiss as nonsense anything below 70 or 60% probability of being right.
> 
> If it's just 2 or 3 guys doing it for the first few days when people do the first purchases, it's obviously a nonsensical 'statistic'.


It does start off slow, more people would be freezing 780 classies if they could be found outside the US.
Not all cards get benched subzero very much as well, Titans are just expensive & they aren't really worth freezing without extensive modding so not too many results. 680s (& 770s) were pretty limited compared to the 7970s so they didn't get a lot of action, etc.

ln2 benching does get used for marketing, but at the end of the day it is mainly competition against other ln2 benchers.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm sorry, but I don't know what kind of results you need, but I'd personally dismiss as nonsense anything below 70 or 60% probability of being right.
> 
> If it's just 2 or 3 guys doing it for the first few days when people do the first purchases, it's obviously a nonsensical 'statistic'.


If you're so worried about statistics being reliable and accurate, maybe you should get into ln2 benching. If not, then take the results for what they are and leave it at that.


----------



## driftingforlife

Must be the 780. its not the 770 or 760 PCB. Check the memory.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Must be the 780. its not the 770 or 760 PCB. Check the memory.


Elpida memory


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> If you're so worried about statistics being reliable and accurate, maybe you should get into ln2 benching. If not, then take the results for what they are and leave it at that.


That wouldn't solve it. I'd be just one more sample. The statistical problem will remain.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *provost*
> 
> Elpida memory


----------



## fateswarm

When I'm saying make graphics boards where people can stick their own VRAM sticks on them, I know what I'm talking about.


----------



## illuz

I'm going to be HEAVILY gutted if the Lightning also comes with Elpida memory. I'm paying top money for this card, I want damn top components.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That wouldn't solve it. I'd be just one more sample. The statistical problem will remain.


its a statistical problem only to you. No one else, so drop it. 1900mhz was hit, thats a fact and a true statistic that it is possible and has happened. You're just complaining about the same thing over and over and no one cares.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *provost*
> 
> Elpida memory


If this is another PR pic, waiting for Samsung RAM wasn't the cause of the delay.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> I'm going to be HEAVILY gutted if the Lightning also comes with Elpida memory. I'm paying top money for this card, I want damn top components.


Looks like at least some will.


----------



## sticks435

Yeah, look at the top left of the pic. "By MSI in Taiwan" it's def the Lighting and not the 780.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sticks435*
> 
> Yeah, look at the top left of the pic. "By MSI in Taiwan" it's def the Lighting and not the 780.


Yup, that PCB is nowhere near reference. Wonder what the delay was than?


----------



## driftingforlife

There was no delay.


----------



## Lukas026

well what was than the release of the HAWK card instead of lightning 780 ? Dont get me wrong, I like MSI and Hawk / Lng editions, but the video was clear. Lightning 780 should be realeased on 7th August...

Can you hear the thunder ?


----------



## driftingforlife

I know, it was a major PR balls up.


----------



## Lukas026

ok fair enough...

at least we know what happened









anyway can you clarify if its true, that there will be also Elpida memory chips on Lightning 780 ?


----------



## driftingforlife

I do not know my self as of yet, should get my sample soon, will let you know then.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

So, what exactly is wrong with Elpidia memory? I hear people complaining without giving any reason or explanation for those who don't know.

New MSI troll video suggests August, 28 for the release of the Lightning.


----------



## driftingforlife

Yeap, the 28th.


----------



## xxbassplayerxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> So, what exactly is wrong with Elpidia memory? I hear people complaining without giving any reason or explanation for those who don't know.
> 
> New MSI troll video suggests August, 28 for the release of the Lightning.


It doesn't clock nearly as high, apparently.


----------



## driftingforlife

Well if the one elmor used was using them it should still be ok, he got 1900 with the first sample card.


----------



## FtW 420

pharma57 also hit 1900mhz memory on his 780 classy with elpida http://www.overclock.net/t/872945/top-30-3d-mark-13-fire-strike-scores/2300_50#post_20589690

Some cards with elpida memory are doing well, but others not so much, in the 780 classy thread some have pretty low-looking max mem clocks..


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> pharma57 also hit 1900mhz memory on his 780 classy with elpida http://www.overclock.net/t/872945/top-30-3d-mark-13-fire-strike-scores/2300_50#post_20589690
> 
> Some cards with elpida memory are doing well, but others not so much, in the 780 classy thread some have pretty low-looking max mem clocks..


Exactly, Pharma7 is a wizard








But, I have not seen this wizardly play out uniformly for all classy owners , based on the results in the classy owner's club or HOF ...granted its still early yet


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> pharma57 also hit 1900mhz memory on his 780 classy with elpida http://www.overclock.net/t/872945/top-30-3d-mark-13-fire-strike-scores/2300_50#post_20589690
> 
> Some cards with elpida memory are doing well, but others not so much, in the 780 classy thread some have pretty low-looking max mem clocks..


A bit off topic but...did you notice the 7970/680 lng having lower scores on the ln2 bios vs stock bios? I ask because using the ln2 bios on the 7970 gives me a lower score at identical clocks and i would think it would factor into ln2 as well. I believe its to get a bit higher clock speed but cant know for sure.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> pharma57 also hit 1900mhz memory on his 780 classy with elpida http://www.overclock.net/t/872945/top-30-3d-mark-13-fire-strike-scores/2300_50#post_20589690
> 
> Some cards with elpida memory are doing well, but others not so much, in the 780 classy thread some have pretty low-looking max mem clocks..


Yeah hacks don't count.









I don't know how he lucked out, but I wish I could get so lucky. I have a great core and my memory tanks!


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> So, what exactly is wrong with Elpidia memory? I hear people complaining without giving any reason or explanation for those who don't know.
> 
> New MSI troll video suggests August, 28 for the release of the Lightning.


It runs hot and doesn't overclock half as good as Samsungs.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> A bit off topic but...did you notice the 7970/680 lng having lower scores on the ln2 bios vs stock bios? I ask because using the ln2 bios on the 7970 gives me a lower score at identical clocks and i would think it would factor into ln2 as well. I believe its to get a bit higher clock speed but cant know for sure.


I'd never actually noticed. For the 680 I had the F8 & 3A ln2 bios' flashed to the cards so didn't really use the normal bios, & generally run the ln2 bios on the 7970.

I'll have to check it out.


----------



## zed1

I'm thinking about this 780 and waiting for it so strong,it's remind me the way we are when we are in love with a woman..at the begining..
Maybe i should go buy a titan today,like that i'll stop to ask myself if i should go with a classy or wait this "BIG" 12 days for the lightning,or maybe one week more,time to find it in store near my place.
My only problem is for 1440p i need a SLI for the big games(Metro last light,crisis 3,BF4..and all games maxed out..).
Right now i can get any 780,any Titan!
for 780 SLI i have to wait untill begining of september!
for Titan SLi i have to wait untill begining of october! .....perfect for BF4.

GTX 780 prices at the nearest place:

http://img545.imageshack.us/img545/1032/48p8.png

GTx Titan prices :

http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/8576/hsww.png

Titan or 780??
...or wait??

Edit : All this prices come from a place (Paris) where there is around 25-30 hardwares shops in the same area, at less than 1 hour from my place.


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> I'm thinking about this 780 and waiting for it so strong,it's remind me the way we are when we are in love with a woman..at the beginning...


Wut?


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> Wut?


I mean,always thinking about it all day long..
anyways,this part of my message is not important..
i was just waiting for a good advice .
780 or Titan?


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oubadah*
> 
> Wut?


I believe he's from another country and his English is bad. Many of his posts are near impossible to understand...but he does ask a good question so I'll answer it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> Titan or 780??
> ...or wait??


If you want 1440p surround (not sure if that's even a thing yet. 1080p definitely is) then you need to go Titan. The 780 just won't cut it in that case. Because of the 6GB of RAM, the Titan is a beast for surround gaming. If you're concerned about price than obviously you should go with 780s. It's more about what you want/need for your system, than price/performance.

Edit: thought you mentioned surround gaming but it looks like you didn't. If you're worried about price and can wait, the new AMD GPUs should be out in a month or so and you can check those out. If not, than I think SLI 780 should suit your needs.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I believe he's from another country and his English is bad. Many of his posts are near impossible to understand...but he does ask a good question so I'll answer it.
> If you want 1440p surround (not sure if that's even a thing yet. 1080p definitely is) then you need to go Titan. The 780 just won't cut it in that case. Because of the 6GB of RAM, the Titan is a beast for surround gaming. If you're concerned about price than obviously you should go with 780s. It's more about what you want/need for your system, than price/performance.
> 
> Edit: thought you mentioned surround gaming but it looks like you didn't. If you're worried about price and can wait, the new AMD GPUs should be out in a month or so and you can check those out. If not, than I think SLI 780 should suit your needs.


sorry for my bad english
i'm not playing in surround,i have one 1440p monitor and want to play all my games at max settings
and i have one 120 Hz monitor too,i play on one or on the other because of the response time.
The 1440p is very nice,but when i need to be in the best killers exemple in BF3,i play with the 120 Hz in 2D.
i'm not worried about price,i'll have to wait one more month for the 780 SLI or two months if i go for Titan SLI.


----------



## zed1

Edit: i found this:

http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/gpu_displays/gigabyte_nvidia_gtx780_sli_vs_gtx_titan_sli_comparison/1


----------



## yoi

im debating ether the Classy or the lightning , i hope it rules and the PCB doesnt look fatter like the Classy


----------



## Newbie2009

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> I mean,always thinking about it all day long..
> anyways,this part of my message is not important..
> i was just waiting for a good advice .
> 780 or Titan?


Lol, you have the bug. Won't rest until you purchase. 2 780s instead of a titan.


----------



## Baghi

Most HD 7800 cards I've seen with Elpida memory overclock really high, not sure how it'll do to GeForces though.


----------



## Kimir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baghi*
> 
> Most HD 7800 cards I've seen with Elpida memory overclock really high, not sure how it'll do to GeForces though.


Because they loosen the timings, so you can increase the frequency.








I remember when I had the Asus GTX580 Matrix, with the crap of GPU tweak software, you could change the mem timings and there even was few presets (the gaming one was with loosen up timings, go figure).


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baghi*
> 
> Most HD 7800 cards I've seen with Elpida memory overclock really high, not sure how it'll do to GeForces though.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kimir*
> 
> Because they loosen the timings, so you can increase the frequency.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I remember when I had the Asus GTX580 Matrix, with the crap of GPU tweak software, you could change the mem timings and there even was few presets (the gaming one was with loosen up timings, go figure).


Someone actually said that may be the issue with the Elpida memory on the Classy. That the timings were tighter on the Elpida than the Samsung, so it would not clock as high.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> its a statistical problem only to you. No one else, so drop it. 1900mhz was hit, thats a fact and a true statistic that it is possible and has happened. You're just complaining about the same thing over and over and no one cares.


What are you on about? I changed the subject to slots there.

Someone is mad and doesn't know what he's reading.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That wouldn't solve it. I'd be just one more sample. The statistical problem will remain.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> When I'm saying make graphics boards where people can stick their own VRAM sticks on them, I know what I'm talking about.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> What are you on about? I changed the subject to slots there.
> 
> Someone is mad and doesn't know what he's reading.


....errrr what? You said a statistical problem and were replying to someone who you were talking to about it...

Your other post, that I did not reply to, concerned removeable vram.

No response? Great, glad I wasn't the one "mad" and just seeing things.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> No worries
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I'm hoping we didn't scare off Neliz and he can provide some info for us. A full view of the card would be a good start....


Yeah, same. I really would like to see MSI appoint a hardware rep officially, even if it was only on a part-time basis.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Yeah, cards that OC better under extreme conditions also OC better on air, that is a fact. If you go back in history and look at the records set by the 580 and 680 lightning and classified SKUs, and they held most of the records on HWBOT even on air - that is anecdotal evidence that everyone benefits regardless of whether they want to dabble with LN2 or not.


That's not always the case.

The 7970 Lightning did very well under LN2 but many of the cards were just average on air. By contrast the Asus Matrix 7970 did well on air (at least when it worked properly), and had issues with LN2.


----------



## Rei86

Well EK is making a block for the Lightning

http://www.ekwb.com/news/385/19/Two-new-custom-PCB-GeForce-GTX-780-water-blocks-in-the-works/


----------



## MrMarauder

This is good news indeed.


----------



## KakaoDj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Well EK is making a block for the Lightning
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/news/385/19/Two-new-custom-PCB-GeForce-GTX-780-water-blocks-in-the-works/


OOoo, hope they look as sexy as the 680 and the 7970 ones


----------



## tx-jose

Surprised that EK is making a WB for the classified. They also have one in the works for the 780 DCUII


----------



## illuz

Decisions Decisions... What to get?! Classy or lightning..


----------



## tx-jose

Looks like the Lightning wb will be out about the same time as the card. EK says early Sept release for the WB


----------



## Haebyun

http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/78852101-post6287.html

Just hit my local stores

Retailing for SGD1079


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Haebyun*
> 
> http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/78852101-post6287.html
> 
> Just hit my local stores
> 
> Retailing for SGD1079










Finally..FINALLY, we get to see what it looks like.


----------



## Pr0xy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Well EK is making a block for the Lightning
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/news/385/19/Two-new-custom-PCB-GeForce-GTX-780-water-blocks-in-the-works/


Good...good

Ew this card has 3 fans; 2 black and one fugly yellow in the center? Thank god EK is making a WB. MSI definitely effed up the design this time around....

imo of course.


----------



## driftingforlife

9 days till launch.

The samples have only just been sent out.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Haebyun*
> 
> http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/78852101-post6287.html
> 
> Just hit my local stores
> 
> Retailing for SGD1079


----------



## MrMarauder

For those curious about the LED's, the box states the LEDs will change color dependent upon load.

Heavy Load - Red
Medium Load - Blue
Light Load - Green


----------



## aesthetics1

Ugh, yellow.

Any idea how easy it will be to paint that fan? =/ haha.

Might have to go WC just so I don't have to screw up my colors.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Images from that website, Hardwarezone (Spoilered the majority): Apparently, they didn't change a damn thing. Thank, goodness I didn't wait. They didn't change the fan, etc.. Card looks ugly as heck imo.




Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Also, with the new Afterburner allowing unlocked voltage on the GTX 770/780/Titan cards, the Lightning and Classy are slightly useless to common enthusiasts right now.


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Also, with the new Afterburner allowing unlocked voltage on the GTX 770/780/Titan cards, the Lightning and Classy are slightly useless to common enthusiasts right now.


Over 1350 and the Titan PCB will catch fire.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Over 1350 and the Titan PCB will catch fire.


Oh, I know. But at least the option is there if you want. And with some of these card's max overclock, an ever so slight bump in voltage (and I mean slight) could help stabilize and overclock. And I only mean slight since reference card VRMs on the 780/Titan aren't meant to be highly overvolted.


----------



## BigMack70

That card looks really sexy... gonna have to resist the urge to sell my ACX 780s for a pair of Lightnings... I know it's not worth it at all, yet I'm still super tempted to do it.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Haebyun*
> 
> http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/78852101-post6287.html
> 
> Just hit my local stores
> 
> Retailing for SGD1079


That's one ugly looking card.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Images from that website, Hardwarezone (Spoilered the majority): Apparently, they didn't change a damn thing. Thank, goodness I didn't wait. They didn't change the fan, etc.. Card looks ugly as heck imo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, with the new Afterburner allowing unlocked voltage on the GTX 770/780/Titan cards, the Lightning and Classy are slightly useless to common enthusiasts right now.


Ew. That's hideous.


----------



## Rei86

God that cooler color design is awful.


----------



## Pr0xy

Go home MSI, you're drunk.


----------



## BigMack70

Haha I must be in the minority then... I like it. Would look pretty nice with their yellow mobos.


----------



## revro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> That's one ugly looking card.


it is, even my akasa vipers in my toxic venom case dont wanna play with it







its too yellow even for me xD staying with my black gigabyte 780 oc

best
revro


----------



## dubldwn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *revro*
> 
> it is, even my akasa vipers in my toxic venom case dont wanna play with it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its too yellow even for me xD staying with my black gigabyte 780 oc
> 
> best
> revro


The silver lining with the classy and L being so hideous is you won't mind taking off the cooler and putting on a block. Performance be damned I am not taking off my reference cooler it's sexy as hell.


----------



## tx-jose

To be fair we wont see the cards cooler only from the side in about 90% of cases.

Thats what I pictured it would look like......and Ewwww


----------



## illuz

Aesthetics mean nothing, it's the benchmarks I'm after


----------



## xoleras

I like it. It's not dissimilar to the GTX 680 lightning which was also yellow, you're all nuts!









Also, I echo the sentiment that the *benchmarks/overclocking are more important.* Can't wait to see what folks get.


----------



## Kuat

The real question is: how does it perform ?

(also, please take it apart and check the memory modules








)


----------



## Gallien

No, just no. Looks horrible.


----------



## Cial00

Wait retailing for SGD $1079? That's $850 in USD. $150 more than the Classy. No thanks

After California tax and the EK wb it's close to $1100.


----------



## anticommon

Waiting to see how much this will cost. My 780hof was malfunctioning and so I sent it back, now to get either a classy or the lightning when that comes out. Decisions decisions... Surely they won't price it over $700?


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> Wait retailing for SGD $1079? That's $850 in USD. $150 more than the Classy. No thanks
> 
> After California tax and the EK wb it's close to $1100.


Prices outside the US tend to be more expensive. I don't expect the Lightning to be that much.


----------



## serothis

The fact that the center fan is noticeably smaller kind of makes it works. OoO - That's what I see. My ocd isn't happy.


----------



## tx-jose

Lightnings and classys should be the same price, give it take a few nickels.

Now the performance and cooling are going to be interesting to say the least!!


----------



## Kuat

to be honest, Classified design does look more "classy"


----------



## szeged

Wow I hope ek releases the block as soon as this comes out cuz I'm scrapping that heatsink so fast.


----------



## Furlans




----------



## zealord

looks Okay and effective, but nothing I would get wet in me pants


----------



## fateswarm

All cards look like the exhausts of a refrigerator anyway.

I'm interesting in specs and a low price.

Gogo AMD pressure them down.


----------



## 2010rig

Meanwhile, on MSI Europe


----------



## criminal

Not the prettiest design, but the cooler looks like it will be more effective than the Classy.

Excited to see what this card can do here on OCN.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Not the prettiest design, but the cooler looks like it will be more effective than the Classy.
> 
> Excited to see what this card can do here on OCN.


Likely will be since the Lightning is triple fan and the classified is double.....


----------



## Snuckie7

Eh, more fans isn't always better. The only thing that's guaranteed is more noise (e.g. Windforce X3).


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Aesthetics mean nothing, it's the benchmarks I'm after


Aesthetics are just as important as Benchmarks to some of us.


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Eh, more fans isn't always better. The only thing that's guaranteed is more noise (e.g. Windforce X3).


Well the dual fan design on my 7970 Lightnings was stupidly noisy, so I sure hope this one isn't louder...


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Meanwhile, on MSI Europe


what's that?


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> To be fair we wont see the cards cooler only from the side in about 90% of cases.
> 
> Thats what I pictured it would look like......and Ewwww


I guess I'm one of the 10% then. I can clearly see my video card in my case (FT02), most likely due to the 90 degree rotation. That makes the fugly lightning a no go.


----------



## Gamtu

I've always found it interesting how one person can look at a thing and think " ugly" and someone else can look at the same thing and think "AWSOME". All I can say is I'll take two!! Come On Release Day!!


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gamtu*
> 
> I've always found it interesting how one person can look at a thing and think " ugly" and someone else can look at the same thing and think "AWSOME". All I can say is I'll take two!! Come On Release Day!!


+1


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gamtu*
> 
> I've always found it interesting how one person can look at a thing and think " ugly" and someone else can look at the same thing and think "AWSOME". All I can say is I'll take two!! Come On Release Day!!


Different tastes I guess. I like good color coordination and plain and simple designs. The lightning is far too gaudy for me, but I can't say I expected more from MSI...


----------



## Killa Cam

i love yellow, but that middle fan totally ruins the aesthetics. yellow is best when used in moderation like the accent stripes. if they had replaced the color of the middle fan to a white or grey, then it would look a lot better. regardless, i wanna see how it performs, and i wonder if this will be the same design used for amds flagship lightning


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> i wonder if this will be the same design used for amds flagship lightning


I hope not. Plain black please.


----------



## wermad

I love the colors


----------



## Gamtu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jack Mac*
> 
> Different tastes I guess. I like good color coordination and plain and simple designs. The lightning is far too gaudy for me, but I can't say I expected more from MSI...


It is Flashy

It looks, Sporty to me. Never thought I could think of computer hardware as sporty but, it is.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> what's that?


MSI's latest Lightning teaser.
Quote:


> DrMOS 4 is the next-gen Mosfet which is used to deliver the power for the CPU. MSI DrMOS 4 does not waste much power, stays cool and is more power efficient than other powersaving solutions. Because DrMOS 4 is a 3-in-1 chip it delivers much more power with less components needed. This solution gives you the power to break world records.


----------



## Dyaems

it looks like a palit jetstream lol... i'd still buy it if i have the moolah but thats not going to happen.

oh yeah those left/right fans are 120mm


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> I love the colors


it would fit your 900D build perfectly


----------



## malmental

still no 'neliz' huh.?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> still no 'neliz' huh.?


And back from holiday.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> And back from holiday.


our savior has returned

so, whens this baby comin out


----------



## TheBenson

Really not a fan of the new design at all. It's too bad because the previous lightning design was so terrific.


----------



## Nexo

I like the MSI Hawk better.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> still no 'neliz' huh.?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And back from holiday.
Click to expand...

holiday huh, that's what you call it...?
or perfectly placed absence when we all found out MSI trolled us.?









and now to sell my WF3 780 and grab a Lightning..


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> our savior has returned
> 
> so, whens this baby comin out


Next week


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Next week


my wallet is ready

my body is not.


----------



## gdubc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> I love the colors


This would look good in your setup, Wermad.

EDIT: DOH! Just read more posts and saw szeged already said that!


----------



## Gamtu

Will the 780 Lightning be available for sale on the 28th or just announced?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gamtu*
> 
> Will the 780 Lightning be available for sale on the 28th or just announced?


The leaked pictures come from a distributor, so they are already in the distribution channel. local availability is of course always dependent on other factors.


----------



## szeged

will they be available only from msi website at first, like the classified was? or will newegg/amazon etc be opening with them as well? i need to know which website to spam refresh


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> will they be available only from msi website at first, like the classified was? or will newegg/amazon etc be opening with them as well? i need to know which website to spam refresh


MSI doesn't sell directly, so just bug your favorite store.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> MSI doesn't sell directly, so just bug your favorite store.


ah thanks, sorry i havent bought msi products except from newegg so i just assumed your site was like evga









time to spam refresh amazon and newegg on release day, paypal is ready to go


----------



## Gamtu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> will they be available only from msi website at first, like the classified was? or will newegg/amazon etc be opening with them as well? i need to know which website to spam refresh


I was thinking this same question.

The XPower motherboard was available right away on newegg. I think I was the first one to buy one


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gamtu*
> 
> I was thinking this same question.
> 
> The XPower motherboard was available right away on newegg. I think I was the first one to buy one


i was spam refreshing newegg when the classifieds were about to show up on there lol, time to do the same with the lightning


----------



## MattGordon

Good luck getting your hands on one. I tried getting a 760 HAWK and they've been sold out for a while now... Imagine the 780 lighting


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> Good luck getting your hands on one. I tried getting a 760 HAWK and they've been sold out for a while now... Imagine the 780 lighting


i spam refresh like a superspeed paratrooper on meth


----------



## MattGordon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> i spam refresh like a superspeed paratrooper on meth


And than there's that one guy who's even faster haha. Best of luck! I see them selling out _lightning_ fast.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> Good luck getting your hands on one. I tried getting a 760 HAWK and they've been sold out for a while now... Imagine the 780 lighting


The Lightning will cost much more, and therefore, reduce the number of interested buyers.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Well the looks are terrible compared to the classic 580 Lightning and even the 680/7970 Lightnings but that's not all that big a deal considering this puppy would just go straight onto a block in my case. The real reason I'm not buying these is that I simply am sick of spending all of my disposable income on computer parts.







I think my Titans will last me a while...


----------



## Nexo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> And than there's that one guy who's even faster haha. Best of luck! I see them selling out _lightning_ fast.


Probably its going to sell out within a day.


----------



## Nexo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> And than there's that one guy who's even faster haha. Best of luck! I see them selling out _lightning_ fast.


Probably its going to sell out within a day.


----------



## szeged

probably gonna be sold out the first hour, depending on the size of the shipment newegg gets.


----------



## jomama22

Get it early and when you can. I got 3 7970 lng on launch day from the egg, were on there for about 2 hours then sold out. Then they had them again the next few days, sellouts each time. Then, no one had the card for a solid month and a half, from early april until mid may 2012.


----------



## friskiest

I posted this over in the 780 thread..

Lightning has struck in Singapore



Prices are in SGD.

1079 SGD = 843 USD

I paid the equivalent of 749USD for my ref MSI 780 at launch


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Get it early and when you can. I got 3 7970 lng on launch day from the egg, were on there for about 2 hours then sold out. Then they had them again the next few days, sellouts each time. *Then, no one had the card for a solid month and a half, from early april until mid may 2012.*


Ugh don't remind me... had to import my second 7970 Lightning from OCUK. Wound up only paying a $15 premium for it though, which was pretty sweet ($615 vs $600).


----------



## szeged

$850 for it huh, it better blow the classified out of the water if thats the asking price.


----------



## friskiest

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> $850 for it huh, it better blow the classified out of the water if thats the asking price.


There is a severe markup on them over here.

I wouldn't expect it to cost 850 in the US.

But you never know..


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Let's not forget that pricing isn't as simple as converting currency exchange rates. If it were, hardware would be much cheaper than it is in the UK...


----------



## friskiest

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Let's not forget that pricing isn't as simple as converting currency exchange rates. If it were, hardware would be much cheaper than it is in the UK...


Exactly.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> $850 for it huh, it better blow the classified out of the water if thats the asking price.


Notice he paid $750 for a card that costs $650.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

x
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Notice he paid $750 for a card that costs $650.


an Xbox 360 in Mexico is 500 usd. Some countries charge an extra premium for some reason.


----------



## jomama22

OP updated with all new info/pics


----------



## theonedub

That shroud looks to extend enough outside of a traditional dual slot card to cause problems for those with either restrictive PCIe/SLI spacing, or who can't have a card block the slot right below the GPU.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *friskiest*
> 
> There is a severe markup on them over here.
> 
> I wouldn't expect it to cost 850 in the US.
> 
> But you never know..


I was told that my English is very bad, I apologize in advance

...

i went on the singapore Hardware zone on the price guide list ,to have an idea about general price on products we already know:

Price Guide / Product Categories :

http://www.hardwarezone.com.sg/price-guide

Price guide / Graphics Cards :

http://www.hardwarezone.com.sg/price-guide/196-graphics-cards/list


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gamtu*
> 
> I've always found it interesting how one person can look at a thing and think " ugly" and someone else can look at the same thing and think "AWSOME". All I can say is I'll take two!! Come On Release Day!!


Aesthetics such as this is a subjective discussion.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> it looks like a palit jetstream lol... i'd still buy it if i have the moolah but thats not going to happen.
> 
> oh yeah those left/right fans are 120mm


You rang?


----------



## friskiest

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> I was told that my English is very bad, I apologize in advance
> 
> ...
> 
> i went on the singapore Hardware zone on the price guide list ,to have an idea about general price on products we already know:
> 
> Price Guide / Product Categories :
> 
> http://www.hardwarezone.com.sg/price-guide
> 
> Price guide / Graphics Cards :
> 
> http://www.hardwarezone.com.sg/price-guide/196-graphics-cards/list


Your english is fine man, no need to apologize for anything!

In Singapore, components are brought in by big distributors and then channeled to individual stores.

Some of these stores have their own pricelists, which is where I captured the price of SGD 1079 from.

I then contacted the guy I usually buy my gear from and he told me it was the SRP. Generally, we can go to the store and if we pay cash we get can get a discount.

My guess is that I could go down on the 28th and pick it up for SGD 1040-1050. I am not Singaporean, so it has taken a while for me to gain a good relationship with some of the locals in the scene.

But what you posted serves as a good indication for everyone who is not familiar with how it works here.

You could also have a look at this for a larger overview of pricing of components here.

http://www.cybermind.com.sg/pdf-upload/pricelists/cybermind.pdf

Do note that prices are once again in SGD.


----------



## zed1

@ friskiest

Thank you


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dyaems*
> 
> oh yeah those left/right fans are 120mm


is that a bad thing?

Neliz: can you reveal what brand of VRAM is used in these cards?


----------



## Kuat

LOL


----------



## MattGordon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> LOL


Looks like someone may loose their distributer license







. I thought these kind of things were under NDA till launch or something. Better safe than sorry, right?


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> is that a bad thing?
> 
> Neliz: can you reveal what brand of VRAM is used in these cards?


Samsung and Elpida. basically because there's a shortage on one of the two and you always want to have a vendor split for your components.


----------



## friskiest

The posts from HWZ have been edited, photos are no longer available.
That guy is in for it.

I managed to pull this though, in case it is of interest


----------



## illuz

Oh man this card is gonna rock.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattGordon*
> 
> Looks like someone may loose their distributer license
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I thought these kind of things were under NDA till launch or something. Better safe than sorry, right?


They won't lose their license (that quickly) but actions have been taken.


----------



## devilhead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *friskiest*
> 
> The posts from HWZ have been edited, photos are no longer available.
> That guy is in for it.
> 
> I managed to pull this though, in case it is of interest


it looks like ELPIDIA memory will be on Lightning


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devilhead*
> 
> it looks like ELPIDIA memory will be on Lightning


Check posts above you.


----------



## devilhead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> Check posts above you.


heh, my bad







just looked at picture







so if it will be and samsung, then -


----------



## criminal

Some guys who got Elpida memory on their Classifieds have actually gotten decent speeds out of them. So this news is not all bad for the Lightning.


----------



## Ribozyme

Can someone confirm that the fans are 120mm? If so would that allow for extremely low idle noise?


----------



## MoBeeJ

Neliz, does the fan in the middle change color to white like the 580 extreme?


----------



## xoleras

The Elpida stuff is a big deal over nothing. Many folks have overclocked it to 7ghz+ just fine on the classified........


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ribozyme*
> 
> Can someone confirm that the fans are 120mm? If so would that allow for extremely low idle noise?


12cm fans would make the card ridiculously long, right?
Quote:


> Neliz, does the fan in the middle change color to white like the 580 extreme?


nope


----------



## BigMack70

I'm guessing two 10cm fans and one 8cm fan... there's no way that card is big enough for those to be 12cm fans.


----------



## fateswarm

Business opportunity: Alternative color covers and fan.

Like mobile phone covers.


----------



## MrMarauder

So this has 3 BIOS?


----------



## GTX670

not so much beautiful as the others lightning series like the 7970 and 680 ones...
they had a minimalist design


----------



## Oubadah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTX670*
> 
> not so much beautiful as the others lightning series like the 7970 and 680 ones...
> they had a minimalist design


That's "_minimalist_"?


----------



## Furlans

That's not minimalist but if compared to 7970/680 lightning design 780 lightning design really sucks


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> The Elpida stuff is a big deal over nothing. Many folks have overclocked it to 7ghz+ just fine on the classified........


link ?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> link ?


Here is one: http://www.overclock.net/t/1360884/official-top-30-unigine-valley-benchmark-1-0/7300#post_20612047

pharma57 has Elpida memory on his card.

There are others in the Classified thread: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411500/official-evga-classified-owners-club


----------



## Ribozyme

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neliz*
> 
> 12cm fans would make the card ridiculously long, right?
> nope


I read in the comments 120mm, good that I checked though. Why don't you guys try a design with 2 x 120mm fans? And what do you personally think of the design, seeing that not too many people like it. Do you think it will hurt sales of the card or will enthousiasts only care for performance?


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Here is one: http://www.overclock.net/t/1360884/official-top-30-unigine-valley-benchmark-1-0/7300#post_20612047
> 
> pharma57 has Elpida memory on his card.
> 
> There are others in the Classified thread: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411500/official-evga-classified-owners-club


Yep, and blkout was able to get 7ghz with his Elpida as well.

The whole nonsense about Elpida is pretty over-reactionary.


----------



## Killa Cam

msi, are yall really gonna charge $800 at launch? cmon son


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Yep, and blkout was able to get 7ghz with his Elpida as well.
> 
> The whole nonsense about Elpida is pretty over-reactionary.


Yeah, I was pretty pissed at first, but it is just the luck of the draw.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> msi, are yall really gonna charge $800 at launch? cmon son


I'm sure it wont' be. It will be competitive with the classified in terms of price; people are trying to apples to apples price comparisons based on currency conversions and you just *cannot* do that. Different countries charge different prices, and few countries aside from the US and UK actually charge close to MSRP. For instance, prices in AU are outrageous. If you did any type of currency conversion based on their prices to USD, it would never be correct.

I imagine the Lightning will be close to 700$ in order to be competitive with other comparable products - MSI pricing at 800$ would eliminate 95% of potential buyers. I just can't see why MSI would want to alienate potential buyers with an exorbitant price....that doesn't make sense and I don't think it will happen. Prior Lightning SKUs were comparable to the competition in terms of price; in fact the Lightning has been better performance per dollar in comparison to the classified for several generations now. (the classified 580/680 were very expensive, and more so than the lightning versions..) I hope that remains the case.


----------



## Baghi

So, MSI still did not wanted to disclose the pictures: http://www.legitreviews.com/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-video-card-pictures-posted-by-accident_121657 - it says pictures posted by an "accident" and someone at other site broke the NDA.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baghi*
> 
> So, MSI still did not wanted to disclose the pictures: http://www.legitreviews.com/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-video-card-pictures-posted-by-accident_121657 - it says pictures posted by an "accident" and someone at other site broke the NDA.


The original of the pics, posted a few pages back has since been changed to a "I'm screwed" type post lol. Neilz also said "action" has been taken.


----------



## MoBeeJ

So an extra fan, extra heatpipe, all are 8mm... cooling is gna be great, so low noise is a must. Few more days


----------



## MrMarauder

I foresee me turning down the middle fan's rpms, and keeping the 100mm fans low. I suspect the 70mm fan will be the loudest. All of this of course is moot when the block gets popped on.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> I foresee me turning down the middle fan's rpms, and keeping the 100mm fans low. I suspect the 70mm fan will be the loudest. All of this of course is moot when the block gets popped on.


It is still pretty cool that there is independent control of the fans


----------



## NateST

Honestly I feel the leak at this point might have helped. Anyway I'm not sure I would stomach an $800 dollar launch unless this pushes into the 1500mhz on air territory, I've seen the few odd Classifieds get ~1430 ish. I like the aesthetics on the Classified better and 70mhz sure isn't a deal breaker for $100.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> I foresee me turning down the middle fan's rpms, and keeping the 100mm fans low. I suspect the 70mm fan will be the loudest. All of this of course is moot when the block gets popped on.


The entire point of having 3 fans is that you potentially get the same cooling performance at a lower RPM as compared to double fans with higher RPM for the same cooling. I have no doubt that it will be a silent cooler at stock profiles - and if you want to crank up the juice with overclocking, you can use high manual fans which will perform really well.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> The entire point of having 3 fans is that you potentially get the same cooling performance at a lower RPM as compared to double fans with higher RPM for the same cooling. I have no doubt that it will be a silent cooler at stock profiles - and if you want to crank up the juice with overclocking, you can use high manual fans which will perform really well.


The point I was trying to make is that the 70mm will be noisier than the 100mm fans, and given the independent fan control, I will make an effort to keep the 70mm fan at lower RPMs than the others.


----------



## Scorpion667

Is there any way to get rid of the blue LED's without killing your warranty? I'm doing the cookie cutter red and black theme, the blue looks like horse poop in my rig. Like I know you can remove the reactor pcb but I'm talking about the LED's that line the VRM beneath the backplate.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Is there any way to get rid of the blue LED's without killing your warranty? I'm doing the cookie cutter red and black theme, the blue looks like horse poop in my rig. Like I know you can remove the reactor pcb but I'm talking about the LED's that line the VRM beneath the backplate.


probably just solder them off, if you ever have problems with the card and have to rma it then just resolder the blue on.


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> probably just solder them off, if you ever have problems with the card and have to rma it then just resolder the blue on.


Soldering them off is the easy part, but I'm pretty sure that screws with your warranty.
Besides, are blue LED's suppose to match yellow and black? That's like a terrible color combination. Maybe if the lights were yellow or white it would look hella cool.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Soldering them off is the easy part, but I'm pretty sure that screws with your warranty.
> Besides, are blue LED's suppose to match yellow and black? That's like a terrible color combination. Maybe if the lights were yellow or white it would look hella cool.


i guess if you really mess up the soldering job to the point where theyll notice you did some solder work then it would ruin the warranty lol.


----------



## jomama22

The LEDs change in color from blue to green to red. In order from low to high usage. So as long ad you have that thing cranking it will look good lol


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> The LEDs change in color from blue to green to red. In order from low to high usage. So as long ad you have that thing cranking it will look good lol


stress test it while taking pictures for red leds


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> The LEDs change in color from blue to green to red. In order from low to high usage. So as long ad you have that thing cranking it will look good lol


Good point, lol


----------



## Scorpion667

What serious? on the 780 lightning?

They have always been blue on my 680 lightning, even when cranking 1.5v through the GPU at 1400Mhz
You're trolling?


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> What serious? on the 780 lightning?
> 
> They have always been blue on my 680 lightning, even when cranking 1.5v through the GPU at 1400Mhz
> You're trolling?


on the 780 lightning they change, 680 is all blue all the time


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> What serious? on the 780 lightning?
> 
> They have always been blue on my 680 lightning, even when cranking 1.5v through the GPU at 1400Mhz
> You're trolling?


No troll, the 780 lightning will have that color pattern. The 7970/680 lightning's are indeed only blue.

Ninja'd up there, the bastard!


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> on the 780 lightning they change, 680 is all blue all the time


Oh cool, I like what I'm hearing =)


----------



## MrMarauder

Getting conflicting information about the size of the middle fan. One site mentions 70mm, the other, 92mm. I wonder which is correct.


----------



## neliz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Getting conflicting information about the size of the middle fan. One site mentions 70mm, the other, 92mm. I wonder which is correct.


The ones that say 80!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Is there any way to get rid of the blue LED's without killing your warranty? I'm doing the cookie cutter red and black theme, the blue looks like horse poop in my rig. Like I know you can remove the reactor pcb but I'm talking about the LED's that line the VRM beneath the backplate.


Same way you fix the seat belt or warning lights in the dash of your car when you want to ignore them would be easiest.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Same way you fix the seat belt or warning lights in the dash of your car when you want to ignore them would be easiest.


i use that stuff all over my dashboard in my car, that way when cops pull me over and ask " do you know how fast you were going" i can just point at the taped over speedometer.


----------



## Scorpion667

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Same way you fix the seat belt or warning lights in the dash of your car when you want to ignore them would be easiest.


That's a great idea actually. I'm gonna try with painter's tape first, as it doesn't leave any residue.

Cheers


----------



## Nemessss

do you know if this card will beat easily the evga 780 classified acx,? i hope 1400mhz++ on air


----------



## StreekG

I used black electrical tape on my 680L ages ago to cover up LEDS. Works good


----------



## Jack Mac

I used electrical tape to cover up the annoying lights on my Gigabyte motherboard (power LED, red post codes, and some light on the chipset heatsink because they didn't match my blue theme)

Look under the ram lol...


----------



## Gamtu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> probably just solder them off, if you ever have problems with the card and have to rma it then just resolder the blue on.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scorpion667*
> 
> Is there any way to get rid of the blue LED's without killing your warranty? I'm doing the cookie cutter red and black theme, the blue looks like horse poop in my rig. Like I know you can remove the reactor pcb but I'm talking about the LED's that line the VRM beneath the backplate.


No one will be allowed to take my GTX 780 Lightnings apart OR put tape on them!


----------



## serothis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gamtu*
> 
> No one will be allowed to take my GTX 780 Lightnings apart OR put tape on them!


----------



## deafboy

Meh


----------



## StreekG

Should look nicer when he peels off the transparent wrap on the cooler.


----------



## Rei86

Wayward upwards?


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Wayward upwards?


Just the backplate, was the same way on the 7970 lightning's.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Wayward upwards?


this is painful to watch


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> this is painful to watch


A bit of a concave bow to help a bit with sagging the other direction. Same thing on the 7970 ligtnings.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> A bit of a concave bow to help a bit with sagging the other direction. Same thing on the 7970 ligtnings.


But this one is missing the metal part that goes between the cooler and PCB that the 7970/680 Lightnings had. And I'm guessing that's why its happening? Because that visible cap looks like its touching the fins on the cooler itself in this picture because its missing that extra part.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> But this one is missing the metal part that goes between the cooler and PCB that the 7970/680 Lightnings had. And I'm guessing that's why its happening? Because that visible cap looks like its touching the fins on the cooler itself in this picture because its missing that extra part.


Its above the fins, just looks closer because of the angle. That black on the left and right of the bios switch is the heat spreader you are referring too. Looks to be implemented the same way to me.

It's also to the left of the pcie power connectors.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Its above the fins, just looks closer because of the angle. That black on the left and right of the bios switch is the heat spreader you are referring too. Looks to be implemented the same way to me.
> 
> It's also to the left of the pcie power connectors.


nah I'm talking about the large heat spreader that goes between the PCB and the heatsink seems to be missing in this picture?

Either ways I'm not to worried about it.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> nah I'm talking about the large heat spreader that goes between the PCB and the heatsink seems to be missing in this picture?
> 
> Either ways I'm not to worried about it.


the first part of my post was concerning the cap close to the fins. I was saying its not, just the angle of the pic makes look as such.

The heat spreader is there. That is it. The black ~4mm thick heat spreader to the left of the pcie power conn. (where the mosfets are) and to either side of the BIOS switch, between the "lightning" shroud and the PCB.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> the first part of my post was concerning the cap close to the fins. I was saying its not, just the angle of the pic makes look as such.
> 
> The heat spreader is there. That is it. The black ~4mm thick heat spreader to the left of the pcie power conn. (where the mosfets are) and to either side of the BIOS switch, between the "lightning" shroud and the PCB.


hmm I see.


----------



## Lead'

I don't get all the negativity. I think it looks fantastic, I'm hoping there is a version just like it for the new amd top card. And not just because it'd match my mpower. The yellow swoosh, the center fan, the shade of yellow they chose. I just don't get the hate, it's awesome.


----------



## MeanBruce

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lead'*
> 
> I don't get all the negativity. I think it looks fantastic, I'm hoping there is a version just like it for the new amd top card. And not just because it'd match my mpower. The yellow swoosh, the center fan, the shade of yellow they chose. I just don't get the hate, it's awesome.


The yellow fan is fine won't show at all, but the yellow swooshes up the front with a Red build, nope. Yellow and Red, just Nope.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I guess I'm most disappointed because I'm such a fanboy for the TFIII and TFIV coolers and this new one is totally different. So far I don't think ANY of the aftermarket coolers holds a candle to the reference design in terms of aesthetics. Luckily the blocks available for Titan and the 780's look really good (EK, Aquacomputer, and XSPC)...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lead'*
> 
> I don't get all the negativity. I think it looks fantastic, I'm hoping there is a version just like it for the new amd top card. And not just because it'd match my mpower. The yellow swoosh, the center fan, the shade of yellow they chose. I just don't get the hate, it's awesome.


Some like it some don't. To me the cooler looks awful, but others may say it's the best looking cooler there is.


----------



## friskiest

A little more lightning


----------



## 6steven9

man this is going to be over $800 i can feel it..............not even worth it if it is, classys and dcuii would be better


----------



## friskiest

My guy just CONFIRMED local price here.

I can pick it up on the 27th.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



SGD $1070
This is equivalent to 834 USD. But that is based on a simple currency conversion.
I bet you guys in the states will get it cheaper.





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Gutted that I will be away on business until the 29th


----------



## Gamtu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lead'*
> 
> I don't get all the negativity. I think it looks fantastic, I'm hoping there is a version just like it for the new amd top card. And not just because it'd match my mpower. The yellow swoosh, the center fan, the shade of yellow they chose. I just don't get the hate, it's awesome.


Agree 100% AND it'll match my Z87 XPower!


----------



## MrMarauder

At least this time we actually have a confirmation of the release date, and no more "confusion".


----------



## taafe

[/quote]
Its not thunder that, its your customers. .


----------



## SeekerZA

Will EK be releasing blocks for the Lightning 780?


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SeekerZA*
> 
> Will EK be releasing blocks for the Lightning 780?


Yep. EK Waterblocks.
Interestingly enough, EK has decided to release blocks for the Lightning before the Classified.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least this time we actually have a confirmation of the release date, and no more "confusion".


hmm my birthday... Think I'm still gonna pass now. Something about the lightning is underwhelming me


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Yep. EK Waterblocks.
> *Interestingly enough, EK has decided to release blocks for the Lightning before the Classified.*


Makes sense to me considering EVGA has a deal with Swiftech to make Hydrocopper blocks...


----------



## jomama22

I'm surprised they are making a block at all as they never have for the classy.


----------



## Rei86

Thought EK made WB for the GTX 200 series Classified card?

Either ways Jacob posted on the EVGA forums that he's all up for EK doing a block on the 780 Classified.

http://www.evga.com/forums/fb.ashx?m=2005378


----------



## 404Error

Though I'll be getting a waterblock anyways, I for one think the new cooler looks nice.


----------



## SeekerZA

Good to know blocks are coming for both cards!


----------



## dph314

Might sell my Classified for one of these. Would love to play around with a Lightning, but don't have the money to keep both. Just got the Classified because it was released first.

And yes, there's nothing wrong with Elpida memory. I have it and have ran more than one bench with it at 7Ghz on the stock voltage. Haven't even began to play around with the memory voltage yet









Any word on software overvoltage on these things yet? Hoping it'll be as easy as with the Classified.


----------



## driftingforlife




----------



## SeekerZA

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*















How soon?


----------



## Kuat

please post a review once you get it


----------



## driftingforlife

Will do


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

So you going with 780 Lightnings Xoleras?


----------



## Penryn

Guess I am gonna have to keep an eye on this thread...


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Penryn*
> 
> Guess I am gonna have to keep an eye on this thread...


Glad you showed up. There have been quite a few different flame wars going on since this started 156 pages ago...


----------



## driftingforlife

I just got a package.

1. The yellow works
2. The packageing is AWSOME.
3. Its a heavy card.


----------



## navit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I just got a package.
> 
> 1. The yellow works
> 2. The packageing is AWSOME.
> 3. Its a heavy card.


Now pics, clocks,and benchies please!!!!!


----------



## driftingforlife

On the 28th.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> On the 28th.


NEED. BENCHES. NOW!!!


----------



## SeekerZA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I just got a package.
> 
> 1. The yellow works
> 2. The packageing is AWSOME.
> 3. Its a heavy card.


Atleast someone gets to have fun









Cant wait for your feedback







Just 2days to go. I'm really interested in voltages Lightning has to work with, and Overclocking ofcourse


----------



## Degree

Can't wait to pick one up, I love my 670 PE
the Twin Frozrs are the best coolers IMO


----------



## MrMarauder

I know packaging may be irrelevant for some, but for the 780 Lightning, it looks top notch.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I just got a package.
> 
> 1. The yellow works
> 2. The packageing is AWSOME.
> 3. Its a heavy card.


Did you get it for free?


----------



## driftingforlife

Its a benching sample.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Its a benching sample.


ill sample it when you're done







need my address


----------



## anticommon

Is there any news as to which retailers will be selling these? And if its going to be like a midnight release...? I need one of these at mi casa by friday.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Is there any news as to which retailers will be selling these? And if its going to be like a midnight release...? I need one of these at mi casa by friday.


I would assume Newegg here in the states. They seem to always be the first when the manufacturer does not sell stuff on their site.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Is there any news as to which retailers will be selling these? And if its going to be like a midnight release...? I need one of these at mi casa by friday.


They should be available retail with most of their partners (NCIX, Newegg, etc.).
The stores that normally sell MSI products should have them or be able to get them.

I don't know about full availability or anything, but the stores selling then should have some stock there or on the way, & be sellable as soon as officially launched.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Its a benching sample.


What kind of memory on it ?


----------



## 6steven9

I just spoke with my local retailer they said pricing is 839.99 cdn when it releases that's a bust for me


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> What kind of memory on it ?


----------



## USFORCES

..dp


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *6steven9*
> 
> I just spoke with my local retailer they said pricing is 839.99 cdn when it releases that's a bust for me


Wow, I'd honestly consider a Titan compared to that. It seems there is a profit party going on until AMD (or NVIDIA) make better offerings.

Inb4: "How dare you use this Advertisement thread for on topic critique". You just wait.


----------



## anticommon

$840 CDN is crazy, but there are a couple of other factors to consider.

1. Canada. Things tend to be a bit more expensive there, in this case 20% more?
2. Local retailers (and even NCIX I've found) tend to also be a bit pricier

I think for the US at least, we'll be looking at between $699.99 and $719.99. With EVGA shoveling out their classified cards for $699.99 I don't know how MSI could expect to charge much more.

But, stranger things have happened, and from what I gather this is supposed to be *THE* 780 to get.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*


Neilz said both elpida and Samsung will be used depending on what available.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Apart from the horrible looking fans on this Lightning, the MSI reactor thing at the back really turns me off.

I want the back of my GPU to be flat, and I really dislike how the circular bump glows in blue, yuk


----------



## 6steven9

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Apart from the horrible looking fans on this Lightning, the MSI reactor thing at the back really turns me off.
> 
> I want the back of my GPU to be flat, and I really dislike how the circular bump glows in blue, yuk


Are you serious it's called an "ARC Reactor" I have a reliable source that said tony stark himself helped design this card.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *6steven9*
> 
> Are you serious it's called an "ARC Reactor" I have a reliable source that said tony stark himself helped design this card.


Umm, not sure if you are serious.

Anyways, IMO it looks terrible, and I heard the reactor doesn't even help OCing from reviews.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Apart from the horrible looking fans on this Lightning, the MSI reactor thing at the back really turns me off.
> 
> I want the back of my GPU to be flat, and I really dislike how the circular bump glows in blue, yuk


Exactly my thoughts. No one with early benchmark results?


----------



## aesthetics1

If this is a penny over $699 I will pick up the classified, no contest. It's ugly, delayed, PR nightmare, and doesn't deserve a premium price point any higher than a classified - even if it can pick up a few mhz lead when overclocking.


----------



## Cial00

Have the Lightnings had the option to over volt memory and PCIE with software in the past? If not, I honestly don't see how it could possibly compete with a Classified + EVBot.


----------



## Snuckie7

No idea about the PCI-E, but even MSI's Twin Frozr lineup supports memory overvolting.


----------



## driftingforlife

You can adjust Core, MEM and PLL.


----------



## 404Error

8 Pack been doing some work with a pair of 780s at 3dmark for about a week now. And I bet those aren't stock 780s ;]


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *404Error*
> 
> 8 Pack been doing some work with a pair of 780s at 3dmark for about a week now. And I bet those aren't stock 780s ;]


They are Lightnings and there is plenty more to come yet.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> You can adjust Core, MEM and PLL.


Ok good to know. Interested to see what the limits are.


----------



## mav1178

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Apart from the horrible looking fans on this Lightning, the MSI reactor thing at the back really turns me off.
> 
> I want the back of my GPU to be flat, and I really dislike how the circular bump glows in blue, yuk


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Anyways, IMO it looks terrible, and I heard the reactor doesn't even help OCing from reviews.


1) the GPU reactor can be removed if you don't like it. It has a cover because the PCB is not permanently attached to the card.

2) The OC on air isn't going to be hugely affected by this... I feel the point of the GPU reactor is lost among reviewers, and this was something I emphasized to them when I seeded samples before. The main reason for this are:
- added power filtration so current going into GPU is much cleaner and stable (see "power conditioner" in home audio for frame of reference)
- removable PCB so you can keep 2-slot cooling solution for Lightning
- plastic cover for looks, and to protect PCB from accidental damage

The power filtration part isn't going to help your max OC under air. It's to help you get an extra 10-20MHz under LN2 which can mean the difference between you getting top honors, and you falling outside the top 10 worldwide.

-alex


----------



## Flynn

Will they be available from the big uk online retailers (at least for pre-order) on aug 28th?


----------



## rationalthinking

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *6steven9*
> 
> I just spoke with my local retailer they said pricing is 839.99 cdn when it releases that's a bust for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, I'd honestly consider a Titan compared to that. It seems there is a profit party going on until AMD (or NVIDIA) make better offerings.
Click to expand...

IDK, with that custom PCB I would rather 2 x Lightnings in SLi over my 2 x Titans. If you are not into hard-modding nVidia really tied the hands of Titan owners and crippled the full potential of GK110-400. The only thing that seems like nVidia really planned well is if the "Titan Ultra" rumors are true and they always planned to release when AMD launched their next gen cards.


----------



## tx-jose

Since EK released the blocks for the Asus card that's what I'm going with.....Samsung memory and a sexy ass card!!!


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rationalthinking*
> 
> IDK, with that custom PCB I would rather 2 x Lightnings in SLi over my 2 x Titans. If you are not into hard-modding nVidia really tied the hands of Titan owners and crippled the full potential of GK110-400. The only thing that seems like nVidia really planned well is if the "Titan Ultra" rumors are true and they always planned to release when AMD launched their next gen cards.


Not me. My 2 Titans are absolutely amazing, even with the stock cooler. 2 780 have to be modded and OC like there's no tomorrow to Beat a Pair of Heavily OC Titans. People over bolting their Titans to 1.3v are getting some ridiculous benchmark scores that would require 780s to be under ln2.


----------



## rationalthinking

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *rationalthinking*
> 
> IDK, with that custom PCB I would rather 2 x Lightnings in SLi over my 2 x Titans. If you are not into hard-modding nVidia really tied the hands of Titan owners and crippled the full potential of GK110-400. The only thing that seems like nVidia really planned well is if the "Titan Ultra" rumors are true and they always planned to release when AMD launched their next gen cards.
> 
> 
> 
> Not me. My 2 Titans are absolutely amazing, even with the stock cooler. 2 780 have to be modded and OC like there's no tomorrow to Beat a Pair of Heavily OC Titans. People over bolting their Titans to 1.3v are getting some ridiculous benchmark scores that would require 780s to be under ln2.
Click to expand...

I don't remember off hand but after flashing TI BIOS the max voltage control via software is capped at around 1.212 right? The only way to pass that limitation is hard-modding, no?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rationalthinking*
> 
> I don't remember off hand but after flashing TI BIOS the max voltage control via software is capped at around 1.212 right? The only way to pass that limitation is hard-modding, no?


Not anymore, the afterburner beta bypasses that 1.2 cap. I'm not really sure how to do it, but that's been the hot topic on the Titan Owners thread. 1.3v Titans running 1300+ MHz.


----------



## rationalthinking

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *rationalthinking*
> 
> I don't remember off hand but after flashing TI BIOS the max voltage control via software is capped at around 1.212 right? The only way to pass that limitation is hard-modding, no?
> 
> 
> 
> Not anymore, the afterburner beta bypasses that 1.2 cap. I'm not really sure how to do it, but that's been the hot topic on the Titan Owners thread. 1.3v Titans running 1300+ MHz.
Click to expand...

Wow.. did not know this. Thanks for passing this along!


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rationalthinking*
> 
> Wow.. did not know this. Thanks for passing this along!


No prob.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rationalthinking*
> 
> IDK, with that custom PCB I would rather 2 x Lightnings in SLi over my 2 x Titans. If you are not into hard-modding nVidia really tied the hands of Titan owners and crippled the full potential of GK110-400. The only thing that seems like nVidia really planned well is if the "Titan Ultra" rumors are true and they always planned to release when AMD launched their next gen cards.


Understandable but remember that even the "handcuffed" Titans still usually beat even very highly OC'd 780's in benches. Now that people are unlocking 1.3V on their Titans we can really see just how much more raw power the Titan GK110 has over the 780....


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Understandable but remember that even the "handcuffed" Titans still usually beat even very highly OC'd 780's in benches. Now that people are unlocking 1.3V on their Titans we can really see just how much more raw power the Titan GK110 has over the 780....


That is until you blow a VRM


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

It is one of the great mysteries in computing why on earth Nvidia allows for custom PCB's on the 780 but not the flagship Titan. That said, blowing a VRM at 1.3V is highly unlikely, especially if properly cooled. Possible, yes, but unlikely...


----------



## Cial00

To be fair the 780 can come incredibly close to 1.3 Titans. Right now on the Valley bench thread I hold the 2nd spot for a single gpu (top being an Ln2 Titan) and only Vega has beaten my score with a 1.3 Titan. Even still our scores are incredibly close.

Unless you buy a Titan second hand, there's still absolutely no reason to buy a retail Titan over a Classy or Lightning atm. Even with the 1.3 mod.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> To be fair the 780 can come incredibly close to 1.3 Titans. Right now on the Valley bench thread I hold the 2nd spot for a single gpu (top being an Ln2 Titan) and only Vega has beaten my score with a 1.3 Titan. Even still our scores are incredibly close.
> 
> Unless you buy a Titan second hand, there's still absolutely no reason to buy a retail Titan over a Classy or Lightning atm. Even with the 1.3 mod.


I would figure that be the case, but Titans are still selling, people are also adding 1 or 2 titans more.

Sure there are people with golden cards, but lets face it the average oc Titan beats the average oc 780. Some members here with both cards also say that a 780 needs to run 170-200mhz above the titans clock speed in order to keep up.

Titan is not for people on a budget, for the slight performance increase over the 780, one must really want a Titan.

I have 2 Titans and many people with 780 have destroyed my bench scores, but If I had two 780 my scores will be lower than my Titan scores, so My Titans are here to stay.

I do wanna buy a 780 classified for the game capture pc, but waiting to see how well these ugly lightnings do, and waiting on AMD to announce the next gen radeon cards.


----------



## USFORCES

Only thing I see that would beat out the classified is if they allow 1.5v without needing a EVbot.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> Since EK released the blocks for the Asus card that's what I'm going with.....Samsung memory and a sexy ass card!!!


So far the photos I've seen don't have the samsung memory on them.


----------



## MrMarauder

http://wccftech.com/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-final-performance-pictures-exposed-beats-geforce-gtx-titan/
Quote:


> The MSI GeForce 780 LIGHTNING is expected to launch tomorrow for a hefty price of around $749.99 US.


----------



## Nemessss

will it be available in Europ tomorrow?


----------



## BigMack70

$750? Ouch...

With the Galaxy HOF and EVGA Classified sitting at $700 or less, no way the Lightning is worth it.


----------



## wstanci3

$750 is quite steep. I will wait for the benching numbers to see if that will sway me to pay the hefty premium.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> $750? Ouch...
> 
> With the Galaxy HOF and EVGA Classified sitting at $700 or less, no way the Lightning is worth it.


Yeah, hardly worth it with it being late and the Classified being only $699

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wstanci3*
> 
> $750 is quite steep. I will wait for the benching numbers to see if that will sway me to pay the hefty premium.


It will have to be absolutely amazing to be worth $50 premium over the Classified. The Classified is a beast and is the only card giving Titan's a run for their money since the 1.3v hack.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> The card is clocked at factory overclocked specs of *980 MHz stock and 1033 MHz boost*
> 
> Read more: http://wccftech.com/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-final-performance-pictures-exposed-beats-geforce-gtx-titan/#ixzz2dAvGVfH6


Lame.


----------



## driftingforlife

To hell with it.

My card does 1306mhz core, 1650mhz mem.

That is with:

+100 core
+100 mem
+20 AUX

LN2 BIOS and AB beta 14

109% max power limit
+100 core = 1.27ish volts. Just like the 680 AB voltage DOES NOT read correctly.

Will be trying rbby258 tool later when I get home.

Performance numbers tomoz.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> http://wccftech.com/msi-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-final-performance-pictures-exposed-beats-geforce-gtx-titan/


WOW, god..


----------



## SeekerZA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> To hell with it.
> 
> My card does 1306mhz core, 1650mhz mem.
> 
> That is with:
> 
> +100 core
> +100 mem
> +20 AUX
> 
> LN2 BIOS and AB beta 14
> 
> 109% max power limit
> +100 core = 1.27ish volts. Just like the 680 AB voltage DOES NOT read correctly.
> 
> Will be trying rbby258 tool later when I get home.
> 
> Performance numbers tomoz.


Interesting, it's in the 1300's territory which is Really Really good!

Thanks for your feedback, looking forward to rest


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> To hell with it.
> 
> My card does 1306mhz core, 1650mhz mem.
> 
> That is with:
> 
> +100 core
> +100 mem
> +20 AUX
> 
> LN2 BIOS and AB beta 14
> 
> 109% max power limit
> +100 core = 1.27ish volts. Just like the 680 AB voltage DOES NOT read correctly.
> 
> Will be trying rbby258 tool later when I get home.
> 
> Performance numbers tomoz.


On air and game stable?


----------



## anticommon

So.... $750 is very steep. At this point this vs. a classified? Is this even justifiable?


----------



## driftingforlife

on air.

I just put it in my rig to do game testing.

just noticed, its a 2.5 slot.


----------



## Zero_

Just saw one in IRL, and it doesn't look as bad as it does in the pictures. It's also massive.

The MSI rep I spoke to confirmed that it'll be launched worldwide tomorrow.


----------



## driftingforlife

Also due to the weight it sag's a LOT.


----------



## SeekerZA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Also due to the weight it sag's a LOT.


that Doesnt sound too good for alot of people's setup who will be keeping it stock air.

On that note, few hours to go


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Also due to the weight it sag's a LOT.


I was really hoping that they would have added some sort of structural support to compensate for the weight. This card started off looking fantastic but it seems to be taking quite a few wrong turns so far


----------



## driftingforlife

Rbby258 tool does work. +150 = 1.32volts.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Rbby258 tool does work. +150 = 1.32volts.


Just a simplified artmoney it seems? Had artmoney working on the 7970 lightning's as well.

Very much dislike the +xxx concept here.


----------



## driftingforlife




----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*


The yellow is kinda meh but the rest of the card looks very nice.


----------



## dph314

I think it looks awesome. Going to have to be something pretty spectacular to get me to sell my Classified and pay the extra $50 premium though. I can run 1333mhz/7000mhz in all the games I tried so far and it barely breaks 70C. But I really wanted a Lightning though, just didn't have the patience to wait for one









If the new cooler ends up performing a lot better than the Classified's then, meh, maybe I'll have to cave and get one. Looking forward to everyone's results









@Drifting- can you give any info on the temps at 1.3v+?


----------



## Kuat

How are the temps?


----------



## aesthetics1

Yes, please share the temps so we can make an informed decision for air only. Thanks!


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dph314*
> 
> I think it looks awesome. Going to have to be something pretty spectacular to get me to sell my Classified and pay the extra $50 premium though. I can run 1333mhz/7000mhz in all the games I tried so far and it barely breaks 70C. But I really wanted a Lightning though, just didn't have the patience to wait for one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If the new cooler ends up performing a lot better than the Classified's then, meh, maybe I'll have to cave and get one. Looking forward to everyone's results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Drifting- can you give any info on the temps at 1.3v+?


Wait what the. Did you go from Titans to the classified 780?


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> just noticed, its a 2.5 slot.


With or without GPU reactor?


----------



## driftingforlife

playing hit man now.

Won't do 1300 for some reason even though it did in my test bench.

Max with AB is 1.27v.


----------



## USFORCES

They will probably release the first 50 with Samsung memory like evga did


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dph314*
> 
> I think it looks awesome. Going to have to be something pretty spectacular to get me to sell my Classified and pay the extra $50 premium though. I can run 1333mhz/7000mhz in all the games I tried so far and it barely breaks 70C. But I really wanted a Lightning though, just didn't have the patience to wait for one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If the new cooler ends up performing a lot better than the Classified's then, meh, maybe I'll have to cave and get one. Looking forward to everyone's results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Drifting- can you give any info on the temps at 1.3v+?
> 
> 
> 
> Wait what the. Did you go from Titans to the classified 780?
Click to expand...

Yes sir. I just got Titan at release because it was the best. Once the 780 came out, I went with it because I obviously wasn't using the extra VRAM at 1080p, and needed the money I'd get back more than that little extra horsepower. Then I was going to get a Lightning but the Classified came out first and I just didn't have the patience to wait for the Lightning.

I'm happy with the Classified though. For the extra price premium over my ACX 780 it's blowing it away, and it's still cheaper than my Titan, which I ended up selling for I believe around $950 shipped.

I can pass benches higher, but game stable is a cool 1333mhz/7000mhz @ 1.27v and memory voltage at 1.61v. My 780 ACX was stable in _most_ games at 1163-1176mhz and the memory was horrible.

I loved my Titan, but once there was another option for so much less, I couldn't resist. Then I wanted a Lightning but didn't have the patience. Still want one though, but this Classified is going to be hard to get rid of.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dph314*
> 
> I can pass benches higher, but game stable is a cool 1333mhz/7000mhz @ 1.27v and memory voltage at 1.61v.


These are very good numbers.
Did you check what kind of VRAM brand u got on your Classy?


----------



## 6steven9

Is that litte yellow part, a seperate piece in teh vid it looks like it's under that black part and not attached can it be removed??


----------



## Cial00

Lower out of box boost than Classy and a lower stock power target. Save the $50 and pick up an Evbot with your Classy and get true unlocked power potential.

Classy wins this round imo.


----------



## MrMarauder

Boost is negligible between the two and irrelevant when you're overclocking. That said, not sure what MSI's plan was releasing a card at such a price. $750 is an expensive pill to swallow for many.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> Lower out of box boost than Classy and a lower stock power target. Save the $50 and pick up an Evbot with your Classy and get true unlocked power potential.
> 
> Classy wins this round imo.


Yeah, Classified + Evbot for the same price as the Lightning is a no-brainer. Or just a Classified with 1.35v through software @ $699 still makes the Classified the better choice IMHO.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Yeah, Classified + Evbot for the same price as the Lightning is a no-brainer. Or just a Classified with 1.35v through software @ $699 still makes the Classified the better choice IMHO.


Pretty much!

I only see hardcore Lightning fans getting this, just because of all the Hype. 750 is not that bad Considering is a premium card with added bells and whistles.


----------



## Kuat

Well, maybe Lightning gets some crazzy cooling on Air so it might be worth it for some.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> Well, maybe Lightning gets some crazzy cooling on Air so it might be worth it for some.


It will definitely be worth it for some, but it probably won't be cause of the cooler.


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dph314*
> 
> I can pass benches higher, but game stable is a cool 1333mhz/7000mhz @ 1.27v and memory voltage at 1.61v.
> 
> 
> 
> These are very good numbers.
> Did you check what kind of VRAM brand u got on your Classy?
Click to expand...

Elpida.


----------



## dubldwn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> To hell with it.
> 
> My card does 1306mhz core, 1650mhz mem.
> 
> That is with:
> 
> +100 core
> +100 mem
> +20 AUX
> 
> LN2 BIOS and AB beta 14
> 
> *109% max power limit*
> +100 core = 1.27ish volts. Just like the 680 AB voltage DOES NOT read correctly.
> 
> Will be trying rbby258 tool later when I get home.
> 
> Performance numbers tomoz.


Wait why is your power target only 109%?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dubldwn*
> 
> Wait why is your power target only 109%?


It says max, so I am guessing it maxes out at 109%.


----------



## xoleras

I don't see this on newegg. How does drifting own one already?


----------



## dubldwn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I don't see this on newegg. How does drifting own one already?


He has a benching sample. Maybe he can put a bios on his without a power limit so we can see what it can do. 109% doesn't make sense here.


----------



## NateST

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> I don't see this on newegg. How does drifting own one already?


Bench sample.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dph314*
> 
> Elpida.


damn, 1333mhz/7000mhz is pretty good.

on air ? i'm jelly


----------



## driftingforlife

Yeap, 109% is the max on AB beta 14. 1.27v is the max though AB as well. Still yet to test rbby258 tool.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Yeap, 109% is the max on AB beta 14. 1.27v is the max though AB as well. Still yet to test rbby258 tool.


Good stuff, looking forward to the screens tomorrow!


----------



## aesthetics1

Temps? Any data? Idle/load vs your ambient? Thanks for the info so far.


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dph314*
> 
> Elpida.
> 
> 
> 
> damn, 1333mhz/7000mhz is pretty good.
> 
> on air ? i'm jelly
Click to expand...

Yep. Stock cooler. On a side note...Splinter Cell Blacklist just destroyed that overclock. Down to 1306/6800 at that voltage for Blacklist. Oh well.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Yeap, 109% is the max on AB beta 14. 1.27v is the max though AB as well. Still yet to test rbby258 tool.


Let's hope it works. I want a Lightning, but not if I'm not going to get to push that new cooler. I'm hoping for at least 1.3v through software, considering the Classified's 1.35v I don't think that's unrealistic for MSI to allow.

What are temps like at 1.27v? Is it hitting 1.27v on the DMM? Does it throttle / hit 109% at 1.27v?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

What's Rbby258 tool?


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> What's Rbby258 tool?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1398725/unlock-afterburner-limits-on-all-cards-and-gtx-770-lightning-tweak


----------



## driftingforlife

With auto fan, 1.27v runs at 77c-80c.

but the clocks and voltage go up and down like a yoyo and mine still can't do 1300mhz. I think it is just throttling.

Also the side LED that changes with load goes past red (heavy load) to purple, no idea what that means


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> With auto fan, 1.27v runs at 77c-80c.
> 
> but the clocks and voltage go up and down like a yoyo and mine still can't do 1300mhz. I think it is just throttling.
> 
> Also the side LED that changes with load goes past red (heavy load) to purple, no idea what that means


Did you edit the afterburner CFG files? I think I recall that being required with most Lightning cards to unlock full voltage functionality....


----------



## driftingforlife

nope, im using the SE version.

just did a hitman bench. 1306 core with +125 = 1.295v. With 100% fan it was 53c at the end of the bench. this my problem is thermal throttling.


----------



## MerkageTurk

Tiny Tom Logan had an unboxing on "rush kit" channel


----------



## driftingforlife

Well just did a FSE run at 1306. 52c at 100% fan. i think it is a mixture of thermal and power throtteling as the power is at 100% constant.


----------



## HiTechPixel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Well just did a FSE run at 1306. 52c at 100% fan. i think it is a mixture of thermal and power throtteling as the power is at 100% constant.


Am I missing something? Isn't 52c, albeit at 100% fan, good? Doesn't that mean it isn't thermally throttling?

Edit: Also, how loud are the fans at 100%?


----------



## deafboy




----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> nope, im using the SE version.
> 
> just did a hitman bench. 1306 core with +125 = 1.295v. With 100% fan it was 53c at the end of the bench. this my problem is thermal throttling.


Sounds like it. With the 680 lightning, when I used over-voltage I had to use manual fan to achieve stability. I could go beyond 1400 with manual fan, but couldn't with auto...


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HiTechPixel*
> 
> Am I missing something? Isn't 52c, albeit at 100% fan, good? Doesn't that mean it isn't thermally throttling?
> 
> Edit: Also, how loud are the fans at 100%?


yes it is good. You get throtteling if you leave it on auto.

At 100% they are not that loud, you can hear them alright but I have have worse.

Uploading my overview video now, will take a long time.


----------



## StreekG

I thought that with LN2 BIOS, thermal throttling is disabled... Well at least that's the case on the 680L


----------



## driftingforlife

Right, as of the moment I can't draw a conclusion due to the 109% power limit, that is what is holding the card back. I will wait to see for any updates to AB or a new BIOS for the time being.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> Right, as of the moment I can't draw a conclusion due to the 109% power limit, that is what is holding the card back. I will wait to see for any updates to AB or a new BIOS for the time being.


Can you enable the GPU Boost 2.0 flags in Precision X to see what's causing the throttling?


----------



## driftingforlife

It will not do above 1300, it just hovers under it while maxing out the power limit.


----------



## milkychipz

What time does Newegg usually stock new products scheduled to be released? I need to spam refresh.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Thanks for the video deafboy! The card looks nice. I can get used to the yellow plus my level 10 GT case doesn't allow me to view my cards anyway. Hope the 9970 doesn't bite me in my @ss though...


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> It will not do above 1300, it just hovers under it while maxing out the power limit.


According to PCPer, MSI is going to be releasing a BIOS for a 112% Power Limit for the Lightning in the near future.


----------



## driftingforlife

112% is just as usless as 109%. it wants 200%+


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> It will not do above 1300, it just hovers under it while maxing out the power limit.


Sounds about even with the Classified's unmodded BIOS. It'll start to throttle right around 1.3v.

So you measured 1.29v with a DMM? Is that with rbby's tool? Cooler seems pretty decent. I'm thinking it's going to be a few degrees better than the Classified at similar voltages. I may have to get one if rbby's tool works. Looking forward to another unlocked Lightning.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> 112% is just as usless as 109%. it wants 200%+


Once a modded BIOS comes out it'll be fine


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> 112% is just as usless as 109%. it wants 200%+


Oh, I know. Its just something I noticed from the PCPer review







.

Just curious though, does the Lightning logo light up?


----------



## driftingforlife

All useing a DMM. With Rbby tool i have seen 1.34v but it throttles.


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> All useing a DMM. With Rbby tool i have seen 1.34v but it throttles.


Awesome. All I needed to know







Throttling will be taken care of in a day or two. Software voltage control is the only thing I was worried about. Looks like I might end up selling this Classified after all. I just have to play around with another Lightning.


----------



## driftingforlife

As soon as we sort the power target this card will bloody fly.


----------



## dph314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> As soon as we sort the power target this card will bloody fly.


How's the memory? I forgot if you already said whether you got Samsung or Elpida. But regardless, what kind of clocks is it hitting? There's nothing wrong with my Classified's Elpida memory, so I hope people don't get all pissed right away when they see they have it in theirs (not directed towards you, just a general statement that fit along with my question for you).


----------



## driftingforlife

Not looked yet. mine so far has done 1650mhz.


----------



## NateST

I wonder if any of the BIOS listed in the GTX 780 thread would work...


----------



## driftingforlife

Would not think so, new voltage control chip and the fan control is differant. Not even going to risk flashing mine now.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

As someone else already asked, does the "Lightning" logo light up? Doesn't look like it but wanted to be sure...


----------



## MrMarauder

It does. Lights up green for light load, blue for medium load, red for heavy load, and according to driftingforlife, purple if your lights are flickering.


----------



## 6steven9

i'm going to assume you can change the lightening to whatever you want as well or at least i hope so don't need a xmas tree in my case........


----------



## jomama22

Sounds like we will need abx to really stretch this bad boy out.

Can you do me a favor drift? Can you run the same clocks/setting on the stock and ln2 bios and run fse on both? My 7970 LNG had ******ed (slowed) timings on the ln2 bios and would score lower at then same clocks. I'm interested to see if the same applies here.


----------



## 404Error

Seems pretty mediocre if it has a lower voltage than the classy and a normal power limit. Makes me wonder why they even bothered with the fancy vrm's.


----------



## deafboy




----------



## NateST

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *404Error*
> 
> Seems pretty mediocre if it has a lower voltage than the classy and a normal power limit. Makes me wonder why they even bothered with the fancy vrm's.


When custom BIOSs are created we'll really see who wins between the two. To be honest if he was on a 109% PT limit and depending on what the voltage was pushed to, it could be quite an impressive card.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *404Error*
> 
> Seems pretty mediocre if it has a lower voltage than the classy and a normal power limit. Makes me wonder why they even bothered with the fancy vrm's.


All the hype, delays and MSI trolling for it not to meet expectations. Classified set the bar high, lets see how this plays out in the next couple of days. I say the classified will win, but lets see what happens.


----------



## CapnCrunch10

Looks like the $750 price tag is confirmed. Disappointing.


----------



## zed1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deafboy*


http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/MSI-GeForce-GTX-780-3GB-Lightning-Graphics-Card-Review


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CapnCrunch10*
> 
> Looks like the $750 price tag is confirmed. Disappointing.


I think what is more dissappointing is that the classifieds have just gone out of stock on newegg. Probably plenty of people hearing about the $750 price tag and saying a big *NOPE*, then moving on to the classified.


----------



## USFORCES

MSI is going to have a tuff time out doing the classified this time around, making it through a bench test is one thing but try playing BF3 at 1410MHz in SLI without crashing. The classifieds I have do it on water cooling no problem.


----------



## driftingforlife

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> It does. Lights up green for light load, blue for medium load, red for heavy load, and according to driftingforlife, purple if your lights are flickering.


I got this wrong, its not purple its blue. The is some sort of problem getting the card to use full power.


----------



## Rei86

Great thread, loved the info in the last two pages. thanks drifitingforlife and I hope you don't get in trouble for blabbing about your card a bit early.

Anyways for me personally, pass. Disappointed.


----------



## zed1

From Guru3D:

" we just learned that there will become a firmware update available soon that will allow a 300% power limiter. We'll keep you posted and also will host that Firmware here on Guru3D.com when available."

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/msi_geforce_gtx_780_lightning_review,29.html


----------



## driftingforlife

That will make this card a monster.


----------



## StreekG

So tempted, it seems like just one of these would be a better option that my 2 x 680 L.
Would i trade 2 680L for a single 780L then get a a second 780L in the future when they become cheaper? Or there is the potential of the 880L with the next release of Nvidia cards in 2014...


----------



## mphfrom77

Amazon is out of stock at $765...http://www.amazon.com/MSI-N780-Lightning-Graphics-Cards/dp/B00ER8HDME/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1377679545&sr=8-2&keywords=msi+780+lightning

I am up building my first ever pc, and since the gpu is the only thing I still need to purchase I have been eyeballing this thread. I was going to order this or the Classified I think, but now the Classified is out of stock, and the $765 Lightning is out of my price range.


----------



## driftingforlife

I have 2 680L, let me do some tests.


----------



## StreekG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I have 2 680L, let me do some tests.


Thanks, i just bought a house so i really don't need to be buying new gfx cards, but this is OCN... No excuses are legit.


----------



## Wooojciech1983

@driftingforlife, Can You please check if there is a way to turn off those stupid load led on the side (green-blue-red). This is the worst thing that MSI has done with this card, such a fail :-( I don't want a Christmas tree in my pretty build.


----------



## driftingforlife

I have not seen a way yet. Could just unplug it.


----------



## milkychipz

Better than the classified do you think? How does power target affect OC performance?


----------



## driftingforlife

The power target is what is holding the card back.

I would say it is better than the classy once the power limit is increased.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mphfrom77*
> 
> Amazon is out of stock at $765...http://www.amazon.com/MSI-N780-Lightning-Graphics-Cards/dp/B00ER8HDME/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1377679545&sr=8-2&keywords=msi+780+lightning
> 
> I am up building my first ever pc, and since the gpu is the only thing I still need to purchase I have been eyeballing this thread. I was going to order this or the Classified I think, but now the Classified is out of stock, and the $765 Lightning is out of my price range.


This card has a $65 premium over the classified which to me seems like just plain extortion. Not that that will stop many people.


----------



## Eggy88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> This card has a $65 premium over the classified which to me seems like just plain extortion. Not that that will stop many people.


Given that you can set voltages all the way up to 1.9v via software on the lighting it's not that bad. The Classy needs the EvBot to go over 1.35v and thats another 50$ on top of the 699$.


----------



## driftingforlife

Made this yesterday, took all night to upload


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eggy88*
> 
> Given that you can set voltages all the way up to 1.9v via software on the lighting it's not that bad. The Classy needs the EvBot to go over 1.35v and thats another 50$ on top of the 699$.


I can imagine 1.9v is going to fry quite a few cards. Didn't most people say that anything above 1.3v especially without extra cooling was frying chips? I'd imagine they would make the cards more capable but apart from LN what is the use?


----------



## Eggy88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> I can imagine 1.9v is going to fry quite a few cards. Didn't most people say that anything above 1.3v especially without extra cooling was frying chips? I'd imagine they would make the cards more capable but apart from LN what is the use?


On air yes, with a good waterblock i would go a bit higher then 1.35v, and these cards are mainly focused on the Ln2 users so that sort of justifies the price difference IMO.


----------



## MoBeeJ

Quote:


> we just learned that there will become a firmware update available soon that will allow a 300% power limiter. We'll keep you posted and also will host that Firmware here on Guru3D.com when available.


Guru3d


----------



## milkychipz

Sounds awesome, do you think they'll be competing with the vdroop modded Titans and stuff?


----------



## anticommon

I have been up all night thinking about ordering one of these and I just don't know. at 750 I might have bit but I don't know the story with Newegg yet because they haven't released. Surely I will go to bed and miss the release only to end up seeing both this and the classy OOS. Oh well.









Edit: maybe it's a sign I should wait for amd to make their move


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> The power target is what is holding the card back.
> 
> I would say it is better than the classy once the power limit is increased.


Well it better be if it's $65 more dollars right and we've yet to see it. What I don't understand is why would they only release it with a 109% pwr target to begin with they could of at least gave it 150% if they are now talking 300% with a new bios update. And really you should only need about 1.34-1.36v with a power target of 120-130% to go a little over 1400MHz stable enough to game or bench and you defiantly have to have water cooling if your going to be gaming overclocked that high otherwise forget it. Anyhow that's what it takes with the cards I got , you would think going much past 1.35v you might want to consider something colder than water even though they only get up to 43c I'm not willing to risk RMAing cards for a good spot on the OCN top 30 list quite yet.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wooojciech1983*
> 
> @driftingforlife, Can You please check if there is a way to turn off those stupid load led on the side (green-blue-red). This is the worst thing that MSI has done with this card, such a fail :-( I don't want a Christmas tree in my pretty build.


I'd probably respect a maker going "We are absolutely devoted to the ugliest card possible, with the best performance". Well, not trying to be ugly, only not caring what it looks like. "It looks horrendous, you will never want to look at it, but 0.0001% performance boost with this monstrous addition". Something like Noctua. It literally has the color of crap. Well, some people do like it, but I like it that I don't like it but I like its performance.


----------



## Cial00

300 percent power target is for ln2 only. No way the average person can run that stable even on water.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> 300 percent power target is for ln2 only. No way the average person can run that stable even on water.


You're confused. The LN2 BIOS is not only for actual LN2. I had a Lightning 680 and I used the LN2 BIOS 24/7 - the increased power limit helps a TON even with air overclocking.

And yes, you can run with a 300% power limit on air AND water. I did with the 680L. The entire point of a 300% power limit is merely to push past the 109% limit enforced by nvidia's green light program - once you get beyond the 109% threshold, you have much breathing room to overclock.

I dare say that everyone who used the Lightning series of GPUs have always used the LN2 BIOS. I expect the same with the 780L. Your impression that an LN2 BIOS is only for LN2 is entirely incorrect. It is only about removing bottlenecks and passing nvidia's power % limitation - and it works (as I mentioned) on both air and water.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> You're confused. The LN2 BIOS is not only for actual LN2. I had a Lightning 680 and I used the LN2 BIOS 24/7 - the increased power limit helps a TON even with air overclocking.


I think what he meant was that only ln2 users could utilize the full 300% power target. For the rest of us, the new BIOS would only be useful for going beyond the 109% that is currently set. There is no way, even with water cooling, you could hope to reach even 200% without frying the card.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I think what he meant was that only ln2 users could utilize the full 300% power target. For the rest of us, the new BIOS would only be useful for going beyond the 109% that is currently set. There is no way, even with water cooling, you could hope to reach even 200% without frying the card.


As I said the only point is to bypass nvidia's 109% limit. Where you go from there is up to you. The point remains that EVERYONE uses the LN2 BIOS for better overclocks.

Also, unless you hard mod the card, you cannot fry a GTX 780 card, the thermal throttle prevents that, and the same was true of the GTX 680.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> You're confused. The LN2 BIOS is not only for actual LN2. I had a Lightning 680 and I used the LN2 BIOS 24/7 - the increased power limit helps a TON even with air overclocking.
> 
> And yes, you can run with a 300% power limit on air AND water. I did with the 680L. The entire point of a 300% power limit is merely to push past the 109% limit enforced by nvidia's green light program - once you get beyond the 109% threshold, you have much breathing room to overclock.
> 
> I dare say that everyone who used the Lightning series of GPUs have always used the LN2 BIOS. I expect the same with the 780L. Your impression that an LN2 BIOS is only for LN2 is entirely incorrect. It is only about removing bottlenecks and passing nvidia's power % limitation - and it works (as I mentioned) on both air and water.


I am still running my Classified on LN2 bios, as well as most of us with a Classified. I think what he means is that 300% is pretty pointless when using air or water. 200% would have been plenty.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I think what he meant was that only ln2 users could utilize the full 300% power target. For the rest of us, the new BIOS would only be useful for going beyond the 109% that is currently set. There is no way, even with water cooling, you could hope to reach even 200% without frying the card.


Exactly.


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> As I said the only point is to bypass nvidia's 109% limit. Where you go from there is up to you. The point remains that EVERYONE uses the LN2 BIOS for better overclocks.
> 
> Also, unless you hard mod the card, you cannot fry a GTX 780 card, the thermal throttle prevents that, and the same was true of the GTX 680.


Yes, you are correct, I should have said that you couldn't get a stable card at 200% under air or water.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> I think what he meant was that only ln2 users could utilize the full 300% power target. For the rest of us, the new BIOS would only be useful for going beyond the 109% that is currently set. There is no way, even with water cooling, you could hope to reach even 200% without frying the card.


This.

The amount of voltage you would need to go past even 130-150 is insane. For example my Classy gets close to 70c when I'm benching at 1.5V. That is just not feasible long term for water.


----------



## xentrox

This card + Water block = My next upgrade. Just really hope the 300% power limit news are true.


----------



## aesthetics1

So, where the heck is it? NCIX Has it at a ridiculous price back-ordered, Amazon higher than it should be out of stock, nothing on the egg yet.


----------



## Rakunvar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aesthetics1*
> 
> So, where the heck is it? NCIX Has it at a ridiculous price back-ordered, Amazon higher than it should be out of stock, nothing on the egg yet.


Yea same thing... even ordered one from Amazon to see if they gave me more info and NADA.. Been up all night lol.. pretty sure I wore down my refresh abit...


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakunvar*
> 
> Yea same thing... even ordered one from Amazon to see if they gave me more info and NADA.. Been up all night lol.. pretty sure I wore down my refresh abit...


MSI made a big stink about the release and then seems to have pretty much released nothing because there is no stock. And where is EVGA to compete? OOS everywhere as well.


----------



## Rakunvar

Yea really not understanding the method they're trying to use atm... With so much ahead of time knowledge of release dates, etc, you would think they would've had made sure retailers were stocked up..


----------



## illuz

I'll hold out and see what happens with the new bios etc. I may just have to get this card and stick it under water... Will the EK blocks cool the VRM too?


----------



## MrMarauder

Now available on Newegg.

28 in stock.


----------



## Rakunvar

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127754 IN STOCK


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> MSI made a big stink about the release and then seems to have pretty much released nothing because there is no stock. And where is EVGA to compete? OOS everywhere as well.


Everyone found out the price and bought Classifieds instead!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Now available on Newegg.
> 
> 28 in stock.


Holy crap! $770!


----------



## aesthetics1

Ordered.. Should be here tomorrow. Let's see what happens.


----------



## Rakunvar

Is there a way to actually 100% tell how many they have in stock like you mentioned? Would be awesome to know ahead of time next time

Ordererd 2 overnight even... YOLO!


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakunvar*
> 
> Is there a way to actually 100% tell how many they have in stock like you mentioned? Would be awesome to know ahead of time next time
> 
> Ordererd 2 overnight even... YOLO!


What you do is put in an order for 1000 and you will see on the next page how many they actually have.


----------



## anticommon

$750 with v.me.... holy ****.

Anyone know if the amazon chase card offers a price guarantee? like if the price drops you can recoup some losses?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> What you do is put in an order for 1000 and you will see on the next page how many they actually have.


$14k


----------



## Rakunvar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sherlock*
> 
> What you do is put in an order for 1000 and you will see on the next page how many they actually have.


Dang thats nice lol, so simple, didnt even think about it. Thanks!


----------



## anticommon

19 left in stock. $750 shipped to my door. AHHHHHHHH!!!


----------



## Rakunvar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> 19 left in stock. $750 shipped to my door. AHHHHHHHH!!!


YOLO! DO IT! haha


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> 19 left in stock. $750 shipped to my door. AHHHHHHHH!!!


You better do it if you plan on getting one. You waited this long, might as well go with the Lightning. Classified is old news now.


----------



## Rakunvar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> You better do it if you plan on getting one. You waited this long, might as well go with the Lightning. Classified is old news now.


Thats THE ONLY reason I went for it lolol..


----------



## Chomuco




----------



## anticommon

Now I don't even have enough spending money to get BF4. I'm ruined.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> You better do it if you plan on getting one. You waited this long, might as well go with the Lightning. Classified is old news now.


Pretty much that's just what happened with me. That cooler grew on me a little, and Drift's review on it made me like it a bit more. And when you are spending this much on a card, whats the difference of $50







.

BRB. sobbing that I'm now broke.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> $750 with v.me.... holy ****.
> 
> Anyone know if the amazon chase card offers a price guarantee? like if the price drops you can recoup some losses?


If it is a visa preferred it should.


----------



## Lukas026

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*


ok now we know why it is +50$ over classy. you know this video costs a lot of money and need to get it back somehow









true story


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*


This video made me feel even worse for some reason lol. I feel like an addict just trying to get his fix.

Lets see what I could have bought with that money:

PS4 + 6 copies of GTAV

53 handles of our local vodka (to drown my sorrows)
or 19 handles of Jack Daniels (to drown my sorrows in _style_)

300 lbs of harribo gummy bears

1592 gallons of styrofoam peanuts

2 college courses at my university

GTX 780 HOF + BF4

50" Samsung smart TV + BF4

12 1/2 coppies of BF4

375,000 sheets of staples copy paper

1410 cans of Rolling Rock

205.5 gallons of gas

3 New sets of tires for my car (+ installation)

Not working for 80 hours

cell phone for a year and a half


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> $750 with v.me.... holy ****.
> 
> Anyone know if the amazon chase card offers a price guarantee? like if the price drops you can recoup some losses?


I believe that if Newegg drops the price within something like a week or two, you can call their customer service center up and ask them if they will refund you the difference. Its worked for me every time, although I always ended up price matching within a week or two, so I don't know if you can do it with a longer time period than that.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> I believe that if Newegg drops the price within something like a week or two, you can call their customer service center up and ask them if they will refund you the difference. Its worked for me every time, although I always ended up price matching within a week or two, so I don't know if you can do it with a longer time period than that.


They blatantly refused to do that when the 680 Lightning dropped from $600 to $575.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*


so European


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> They blatantly refused to do that when the 680 Lightning dropped from $600 to $575.


Weird. You must've not gotten nice CS reps there. I've gotten a refund for the difference on my NAS for my old man (went down $25 a week and a half after buying it), and when I had the 7970s, they went down $10 a piece 5 days after buying, and they refunded the difference, and that's just to name a couple. I guess its a YMMV situation.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> They blatantly refused to do that when the 680 Lightning dropped from $600 to $575.


You could also threaten to return the item, especially if it falls within the 30 day period and you have shoprunner (which means free returns anyways). Might give them some incentive to keep the product in your hands.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Weird. You must've not gotten nice CS reps there. I've gotten a refund for the difference on my NAS for my old man (went down $25 a week and a half after buying it), and when I had the 7970s, they went down $10 a piece 5 days after buying, and they refunded the difference, and that's just to name a couple. I guess its a YMMV situation.


With all the other Geforce cards getting Splinter Cell Blacklist, with the exception of the 780 Lightning, I wonder if it'll get updated.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*


Sorry, not a fan of corny acting. Not to mention this makes the card look even more like an overpriced plastic paperweight.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> With all the other Geforce cards getting Splinter Cell Blacklist, with the exception of the 780 Lightning, I wonder if it'll get updated.


Probably. When I ordered my Classy from Newegg, I did not get a copy, but the very next day it was added on the Classifieds page. I contacted Newegg about it, but they said I did not purchase the card while the promotion was active (it was indeed active on the other 780s, just not the Classified at the time I bought it.) and refused to give me a copy.

Bright side is that they gave me a $20 Newegg gift card for my troubles, so not a total loss.


----------



## szeged

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127754

its up on newegg for 769.00 rofl yeah right msi, i can buy another used titan for that much. was super excited for this, then after all the drops of the ball, and then the price.....nope.


----------



## fateswarm

An unlocked Zotac is 650. Is it worse than this deal?


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Nine left on Newegg.


----------



## provost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Nine left on Newegg.


Not sure who is buying it at this price...may be MSI is buying it back


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *provost*
> 
> Not sure who is buying it at this price...may be MSI is buying it back


id rather buy a used titan for 750 lol seriously, the month delay, and increased price. good one msi, april 1st isnt here yet.


----------



## 2010rig

With new cards being announced from AMD next month, might as well wait it out. Best case scenario they will match the 780 at a lower price, which should force a price drop on 780's ( ideally )


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> With new cards being announced from AMD next month, might as well wait it out. Best case scenario they will match the 780 at a lower price, which should force a price drop on 780's ( ideally )


I'm not expecting miracles since they are forced to stay on 28nm so I don't blame people here going for 780s still.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm not expecting miracles since they are forced to stay on 28nm so I don't blame people here going for 780s still.


Who knows...they had from Dec 2011/Jan 2012 (7970 launch) to work on something, I'm not expecting miracles, just a worthy competitor for GK110.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm not expecting miracles since they are forced to stay on 28nm so I don't blame people here going for 780s still.


Oh it is you! Threw me off because I did not recognize your avatar.









I think it is a fair assumption though that AMD's new offerings will get very close to matching/surpassing a 780.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm not expecting miracles since they are forced to stay on 28nm so I don't blame people here going for 780s still.


Whether they stay at 28 or move to 20 would have minimal impact on performance as the first 20nm nodes are all low power. Look at Intel 32 to 22 to see how performance did not increase much but power draw dropped.

We are looking at a revamped arch, bigger die and less bottlenecks. I don't think 780 performance would be hard to produce.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Whether they stay at 28 or move to 20 would have minimal impact on performance as the first 20nm nodes are all low power. Look at Intel 32 to 22 to see how performance did not increase much but power draw dropped.
> 
> We are looking at a revamped arch, bigger die and less bottlenecks. I don't think 780 performance would be hard to produce.


Next cards will definitely be 28nm. 20nm cards won't be available 'till Q2 next year at the earliest.

If the 9970 matches the 780 performance wise, for say $550. That should shake things up a bit.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Next cards will definitely be 28nm. 20nm cards won't be available 'till Q2 next year at the earliest.
> 
> If the 9970 matches the 780 performance wise, for say $550. That should shake things up a bit.


Was gonna add that at the end of the post but didn't lol. Q2 is when we will most likely see them, absolutely.

I'm more interested in this titan ultra talk as I wouldnt put it out of nvidias grasp to release a full gk110 in december-january and thus, dropped the 780/titan prices.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

I wonder which 780 Lightning they are talking about? So Far, I havnt seen anything that destroys a TITAN.


----------



## szeged

newegg has evga classified hydro coppers for 819.99 usd, how much are EK blocks for the lightning? like 134.99 usd if theyre anything like the 7970 lightning blocks? so, 769.99 + 134.99 or....819.99

or used titan D: oh god the options!

anyways, cant wait to see some actual results from this card using the proper 300% power target bios instead of that garbage 109% lol, still not buying one until msi pulls head from arse and realizes they shouldnt be asking this price premium over a classified especially with all the PR disaster.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder which 780 Lightning they are talking about? So Far, I havnt seen anything that destroys a TITAN.


they were talking about theyre high overclocked 780 vs a stock titan, like most reviewers do. Its just a dumb ploy to get people to be like " wow beats a titan! must buy"


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

H
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> newegg has evga classified hydro coppers for 819.99 usd, how much are EK blocks for the lightning? like 134.99 usd if theyre anything like the 7970 lightning blocks? so, 769.99 + 134.99 or....819.99
> 
> or used titan D: oh god the options!
> 
> anyways, cant wait to see some actual results from this card using the proper 300% power target bios instead of that garbage 109% lol, still not buying one until msi pulls head from arse and realizes they shouldnt be asking this price premium over a classified especially with all the PR disaster.


Hydro Copper Classy unless you're planning on LN2


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> newegg has evga classified hydro coppers for 819.99 usd, how much are EK blocks for the lightning? like 134.99 usd if theyre anything like the 7970 lightning blocks? so, 769.99 + 134.99 or....819.99 904.99
> 
> or used titan D: oh god the options!
> 
> anyways, cant wait to see some actual results from this card using the proper 300% power target bios instead of that garbage 109% lol, still not buying one until msi pulls head from arse and realizes they shouldnt be asking this price premium over a classified especially with all the PR disaster.


Fixed


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Fixed


shows as 819.99 for me, where are you seeing 919?


----------



## BigMack70

Lightning @ $770 on newegg... ridiculously overpriced IMO. My ACX cards do 1160 MHz and I got them for $660, so that basically means that the price premium of the Lightning is just around $1/MHz going by reviews' reports of the max OC on air.

Absurd. Still, no doubt they'll be sold out within 24-48 hours.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Fixed


904 for the lightning with EK block or 819 for the Hydro Copper Classy.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> shows as 819.99 for me, where are you seeing 919?


770+135 = $905. Almost $100 more than a HC Classified at $819


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> 770+135 = $905. Almost $100 more than a HC Classified at $819


oh sorry, lol i think i misread, i thought you were saying the classified HC was 919 over 819 lol


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Lightning @ $770 on newegg... ridiculously overpriced IMO. My ACX cards do 1160 MHz and I got them for $660, so that basically means that the price premium of the Lightning is just around $1/MHz going by reviews' reports of the max OC on air.
> 
> Absurd. Still, no doubt they'll be sold out within 24-48 hours.


The only thing that sold me so far is the fact that the power draw can be increased well past the 109% it is at right now. This could end up pushing many air cooled lightnings into 1350mhz terretory, and maybe even 1400mhz territory. Now, I'm not saying this as a fact, but merely speculation. Well see though I guess. 1400mhz 780 would be extremely hard for even a 9970 to beat if the expected performance jump between 7970 ghz and 9970 is about 30%. And even if we are talking about OCing 9970's who is to say they will have incredible overclocking headroom. I'd venture to say the average overclock on the 9970's when they come out will be around 10-15% with 20-25% being for the water-coolers and extrem overclockers. It'll probably be a while (like we've seen with the 780) for nvidia to have true performance 9970's come out (lightning/class) which can push that card even farther. By that time Titan Ultra should be right around the corner and the whole process starts over again.

This is purely speculation though.


----------



## dawn1980

I just orderd two classifieds....im not paying this ridiculous price msi pulled out there ass...evga all the way!!! plus i hate the yellow and the price was icing on the cake for me to go classy..


----------



## aesthetics1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dawn1980*
> 
> *I just orderd two classifieds*....im not paying this ridiculous price msi pulled out there ass...evga all the way!!! plus i hate the yellow and the price was icing on the cake for me to go classy..


Errm, from where?


----------



## BigMack70

Meh... I wouldn't hold your breath for 1350+ MHz as the norm for these cards on air given what clocks reviewers are getting.

I just see a card that underdelivers for its price point unless you are at LEAST going to put it under H2O.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aesthetics1*
> 
> Errm, from where?


maybe he got two HC classifieds from the evga site? theyre in stock there.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Meh... I wouldn't hold your breath for 1350+ MHz as the norm for these cards on air given what clocks reviewers are getting.


1241Mhz is what they achieved on the Pcper review, with a 109% power target BIOS. I'm pretty sure you could easily see higher than 1350+ once they get that stupid power target limit sorted out. Especially when you start to put these things under water.


----------



## Snuckie7

Guru got 1333MHz so who knows?


----------



## Kuat

people who are snatching these lighting are like little kids with no impulse control

performance-wise, these cards are no better than Classified or even HOF, plus it's ugly and costs $65 more

i'd like to know the reasoning why people are buying them up


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> people who are snatching these lighting are like little kids with no impulse control
> 
> performance-wise, these cards are no better than Classified or even HOF, plus it's ugly and costs $65 more
> 
> i'd like to know the reasoning why people are buying them up


One word, potential.


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> people who are snatching these lighting are like little kids with no impulse control
> 
> performance-wise, these cards are no better than Classified or even HOF, plus it's ugly and costs $65 more
> 
> i'd like to know the reasoning why people are buying them up


The Lightning is the best marketed card, and because it's always the best under LN2 people assume it will be better on air/h2o as well even when there's little evidence for that. Plus, some folks will always assume that more expensive = better.

I agree with you, though. If I didn't already have my 780s, I'd go for the Classy/HOF.


----------



## Thunderclap

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> people who are snatching these lighting are like little kids with no impulse control
> 
> performance-wise, these cards are no better than Classified or even HOF, plus it's ugly and costs $65 more
> 
> i'd like to know the reasoning why people are buying them up


Most likely because some people tend to spend top dollar for things that aren't even worth top dollar or performing top dollar and they do that without any rational reason behind it whatsoever too, so yeah. Essentially they are paying solid extra just for the "shiny" name and for that legendary e-peen of theirs...







Sigh.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> people who are snatching these lighting are like little kids with no impulse control
> 
> performance-wise, these cards are no better than Classified or even HOF, plus it's ugly and costs $65 more
> 
> i'd like to know the reasoning why people are buying them up


I've been waiting to see what these lightnings were going to bring to the table for the last two weeks. Then the classifieds go OOS as soon as the lightning comes out and now I'm stuck either getting this or waiting (for who knows how long) for classifieds to come back in stock. Amazon has been out of classifieds for some time now, and it seems that there is some sort of shortage of cards going around. All the while I'm stuck using my backup GTX260 trying to play civ 5 with 20fps.

As far as impulse goes, with the v.me discount and free shoprunner shipping it was a $50 premium over either the classy or $54 premium over the HOF I had before (but returned due to malfunction). Not saying this is a great price, not by a long shot, but here I am waiting for my card to arrive now.


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> The Lightning is the best marketed card, and because it's always the best under LN2 people assume it will be better on air/h2o as well even when there's little evidence for that. Plus, some folks will always assume that more expensive = better.
> 
> I agree with you, though. If I didn't already have my 780s, I'd go for the Classy/HOF.


How is it the best marketed card?

Have you not kept up with what has gone on in this thread in the last month?

btw - to those who bought on NE, the Splinter Cell coupon is on there now.


----------



## anticommon

Update: Splinter cell now included with purchase of GTX780 lightning. Time to chat with newegg support.... FFS.


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> I've been waiting to see what these lightnings were going to bring to the table for the last two weeks. *Then the classifieds go OOS* as soon as the lightning comes out and now I'm stuck either getting this or waiting (for who knows how long) for classifieds to come back in stock. Amazon has been out of classifieds for some time now, and it seems that there is some sort of shortage of cards going around. All the while I'm stuck using my backup GTX260 trying to play civ 5 with 20fps.
> 
> As far as impulse goes, with the v.me discount and free shoprunner shipping it was a $50 premium over either the classy or $54 premium over the HOF I had before (but returned due to malfunction). Not saying this is a great price, not by a long shot, but here I am waiting for my card to arrive now.


Everyone found out the price of the Lightning and ran away to EVGA.... lol

I'm not patient enough to wait for cards to come back in stock either, so if I were in your shoes I would have done the same thing. I wasn't patient enough to last past the first week of 780 launch, actually...


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Then the classifieds go OOS as soon as the lightning comes out


This should tell you something.


----------



## Thunderclap

Both the GTX 780 Classified and GTX 780 HOF are already out of stock... Wonder why, I really do...


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> How is it the best marketed card?


Well, for starters, notice the number of review samples out there for the classified compared to the lightning... I see one on Ninja lane and that's it - compared to multiple reviews from much larger sites for the lightning.

There's a lot more people paying attention to what gets reviewed than those who read through dozens of pages of forum discussion on particular cards...


----------



## Thunderclap

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Well, for starters, notice the number of review samples out there fore the classified compared to the lightning... I see one on Ninja lane and that's it compared to multiple reviews from much larger sites for the lightning.
> 
> There's a lot more people paying attention to what gets reviewed than those who read through dozens of pages of forum discussion on particular cards...


Commersialism sells, so what else is new...


----------



## anticommon

on hold for 15 minutes waiting to hear back about the free blacklist. hrmmmmmmmm

edit: newegg rep hooked me up


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Well, for starters, notice the number of review samples out there fore the classified compared to the lightning... I see one on Ninja lane and that's it compared to multiple reviews from much larger sites for the lightning.
> 
> There's a lot more people paying attention to what gets reviewed than those who read through dozens of pages of forum discussion on particular cards...


none of the current reviews are of any merit

they feel pressed to put out a good review so they just state in general terms things like "definitely one of the best cards" "has potential" "has a lot of features" "great packing" "military grade components" - it's laughable

but nothing on actual performance - because there is nothing to write about


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> none of the current reviews are of any merit
> 
> they fell pressed to put out a good review so they just state in general terms things like "definitely one of the best cards" "has potential" "has a lot of features" "great packing" "military grade components" - it's laughable
> 
> but nothing on actual performance - because there is nothing to write about


Your post more or less proves my point. I was just explaining my claim that the Lightning is more well *marketed* than the Classified or HOF.

Read folks, read.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Wow, $770 is getting mighty close to Titan pricing...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

But this absolutely crushes the Titan, with military grade components. It has the potential to be the greatest, most powerful card in the world. (Being sarcastic).

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Wow, $770 is getting mighty close to Titan pricing...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Y
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Your post more or less proves my point. I was just explaining my claim that the Lightning is more well *marketed* than the Classified or HOF.
> 
> Read folks, read.


yep, this card got hyped even by people who never owned a lightning.

Not saying this is a bad card, just saying it got hyped beyond what the card is able to do in real life scenarios.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> none of the current reviews are of any merit
> 
> they feel pressed to put out a good review so they just state in general terms things like "definitely one of the best cards" "has potential" "has a lot of features" "great packing" "military grade components" - it's laughable
> 
> but nothing on actual performance - because there is nothing to write about


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> But this absolutely crushes the Titan, with military grade components. It has the potential to be the greatest, most powerful card in the world. (Being sarcastic).


This is why I look at reviews for the specs & pics, I usually do look at some of the performance numbers but most reviewers can make any card look mediocre, almost always have to wait until cards are in the hands of users to see what they are capable of.

it would be funny to see both cards reviewed at the same time by the same guy, so the 780 can crush & destroy the Titan, & 5 minutes later the Titan can crush & destroy the 780.


----------



## aesthetics1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> But this absolutely crushes the Titan, with military grade components. It has the potential to be the greatest, most powerful card in the world. (Being sarcastic).


Dude just sold 2 titans for $750 a piece in classifieds


----------



## ethan319

I bought a Titan right after MSI trolled people in this thread, but I wasn't fully satisfied with the performance.
I didn't want to bother flashing bios or anything to void warranty.

And here I am...

It totally stimulated my curiosity.


----------



## MrMarauder

Was really hoping I could've gone with Amazon, instead of Newegg, as Amazon's shipping is superior to that of Newegg's. Unfortunately, it was not meant to be, and I am not about to pay an additional $40. $800 for one graphic card that's not even the flagship from nVidia....


----------



## ethan319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aesthetics1*
> 
> Dude just sold 2 titans for $750 a piece in classifieds


Wasn't it two for $1400? I guess I saw it then I said, wow.


----------



## ethan319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Was really hoping I could've gone with Amazon, instead of Newegg, as Amazon's shipping is superior to that of Newegg's. Unfortunately, it was not meant to be, and I am not about to pay an additional $40. $800 for one graphic card that's not even the flagship from nVidia....


True, but it might still perform better than Titan and is a flagship effort from MSI...


----------



## MrMarauder

Was able to get Splintercell Blacklist added on without too much hassle. For those that ordered before the game was added, you can still get it with a simple chat with Newegg customer service. And once the RMA with Newegg is over, you can sell it to recoup some of that money back.


----------



## Killa Cam

pfft... u can easily get a used titan for that price. msi, child please!


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> pfft... u can easily get a used titan for that price. msi, child please!


To be fair, used Titans are going more along the lines of $850-900, rather than $750. With the sole exception of that one guy in the OCN Marketplace that sold his super cheap. Getting a new GTX 780 Lightning is quite a bit easier than buying the very few and far between equally priced used GTX Titans.


----------



## szeged

so does the "military grade" marketing thing have any merit to it? are their components any better than say, evga or asus on their boards or gpus? or is it just marketing?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> To be fair, used Titans are going more along the lines of $850-900, rather than $750. With the sole exception of that one guy in the OCN Marketplace that sold his super cheap. Getting a new GTX 780 Lightning is quite a bit easier than buying the very few and far between equally priced used GTX Titans.


Used titans get advertised for 900, but few will turn down a 800 dollar offer from someone with cash in hand. I bought one of my Titans for 700 back in April, do deals are out there.


----------



## wstanci3

Bought this for my first build. I've got a lot to learn...


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> so does the "military grade" marketing thing have any merit to it? are their components any better than say, evga or asus on their boards or gpus? or is it just marketing?


Well they obviously have better VRs etc. though I'd like to see something like Sin's list for main boards for graphics boards.

I suspect a ton of considered "bad" cards have excellent components on them. If only they are unlockable ofcourse.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> so does the "military grade" marketing thing have any merit to it? are their components any better than say, evga or asus on their boards or gpus? or is it just marketing?


Yes, the components handle more current, but that doesn't transalate into stability at higher overclocks. So for now, you get a card that lasts 12 years vs a card that lasts 8


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Well, for starters, notice the number of review samples out there for the classified compared to the lightning... I see one on Ninja lane and that's it - compared to multiple reviews from much larger sites for the lightning.
> 
> There's a lot more people paying attention to what gets reviewed than those who read through dozens of pages of forum discussion on particular cards...


So just because they sent this card out to more reviewers means it's better marketed? Ok then.

MSI trolled everyone with the release date, and acted like the users were the ones who misunderstood.

EVGA didn't need to send out Classifieds to reviewers, MSI single-handedly sold more Classifieds than any type of marketing efforts EVGA has done.

MSI's marketing of the Lightning to this point has been lame, to say the least. Now we have reviewers who are comparing OC'ed Lightnings to Stock Titans and acting like it's so superior.


----------



## anticommon

Two left... Tic toc tic toc


----------



## Draygonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## goirish2469

I bought a 780 Lightning, but I'm now realizing that it was a pretty dumb choice. I'm thinking of switching to the 780 HOF, but can it's voltage be unlocked? That's my only concern.


----------



## pantsonnos

looks like it will just fit in the Silverstone FT02 (Card is 295mm, case supports 304mm)


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Why was it a dumb choice? I mean its a bit on the expensive side but the 780 Lightning is still one of the best 780's made...


----------



## sherlock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Why was it a dumb choice? I mean its a bit on the expensive side but the 780 Lightning is still one of the best 780's made...


Similiar products($690 HOF & $700 Classified) costs significantly less($70-$80).


----------



## goirish2469

Well I think it's overkill for my purposes. I won't be putting it underwater, so I won't even be able to take advantage of most of it's potential. It seems like it makes more sense to buy a card that would serve me just as well for $60 less.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> So just because they sent this card out to more reviewers means it's better marketed? Ok then.
> 
> MSI trolled everyone with the release date, and acted like the users were the ones who misunderstood.
> 
> EVGA didn't need to send out Classifieds to reviewers, MSI single-handedly sold more Classifieds than any type of marketing efforts EVGA has done.
> 
> MSI's marketing of the Lightning to this point has been lame, to say the least. Now we have reviewers who are comparing OC'ed Lightnings to Stock Titans and acting like it's so superior.


I was surprised TinyTomLogan also compared OC Windforce 780 against stock Titans and made it seem as if both cards were stock reference cards. Even in his written review A single stock Titan was beating OC windforce 780, which he doesn't mention in his video.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Eh, when we're getting near $1k what does $60 really matter at that point anyway?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

I
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *goirish2469*
> 
> I bought a 780 Lightning, but I'm now realizing that it was a pretty dumb choice. I'm thinking of switching to the 780 HOF, but can it's voltage be unlocked? That's my only concern.


If you already bought it, stick with it. It's a rock solid card.


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Draygonn*


----------



## goirish2469

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I
> If you already bought it, stick with it. It's a rock solid card.


Hmm, maybe. Do you know what Newegg's return policy is though? Do they have a restocking fee for opened video cards?


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> Eh, when we're getting near $1k what does $60 really matter at that point anyway?


Sometime even 5 bucks is a lot of money when were low on cash. Many of us can go a long way with 60 bucks.


----------



## goirish2469

It's not so much that it'll kill me to not have that extra $60, it's just that I feel like I just bought into the hype. Then again, it will look pretty damn nice with my Z87 Mpower.


----------



## StreekG

Well i think when they unlock the power limit to 300 this is what will really separate the Lightning from the Classy.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *goirish2469*
> 
> Hmm, maybe. Do you know what Newegg's return policy is though? Do they have a restocking fee for opened video cards?


I've yet to send something back to newegg. When my 900D arrived damaged, they offered to pick up shipping costs for an exchange, while Corsair just sent me replacement parts.

If you're not happy, I can suggest waiting a few days or weeks when they are no longer in stock. Then try selling it and make you some profit. Do it before the return policy expires, that way if you don't sell it, you can send it back.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Sometime even 5 bucks is a lot of money when were low on cash. Many of us can go a long way with 60 bucks.


I think you're missing his point, that being that somebody dumping close to $1k on a luxury item probably isn't going to care about another $60.


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> So just because they sent this card out to more reviewers means it's better marketed? Ok then.
> 
> MSI trolled everyone with the release date, and acted like the users were the ones who misunderstood.
> 
> EVGA didn't need to send out Classifieds to reviewers, MSI single-handedly sold more Classifieds than any type of marketing efforts EVGA has done.
> 
> MSI's marketing of the Lightning to this point has been lame, to say the least. Now we have reviewers who are comparing OC'ed Lightnings to Stock Titans and acting like it's so superior.


Care to offer any evidence other than OCN discussion that the EVGA classified is more successfully marketed than the Lightning? Because I guarantee you that those Lightning reviews lavishing praise on the card - rather they are lousy or not - are getting more page hits than this thread.


----------



## goirish2469

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I've yet to send something back to newegg. When my 900D arrived damaged, they offered to pick up shipping costs for an exchange, while Corsair just sent me replacement parts.
> 
> If you're not happy, I can suggest waiting a few days or weeks when they are no longer in stock. Then try selling it and make you some profit. Do it before the return policy expires, that way if you don't sell it, you can send it back.


That actually sounds like a pretty damn good idea.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

If you bought the Lightning then just be happy with it and load that sucker up! It'll be a beast for sure!


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I think you're missing his point, that being that somebody dumping close to $1k on a luxury item probably isn't going to care about another $60.


I perfectly understood his point, but there are many angles you can look at this from. I just pointed out a different point if view. ;-)

We're all in the same page!!!


----------



## Chomuco




----------



## NateST

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Sometime even 5 bucks is a lot of money when were low on cash. Many of us can go a long way with 60 bucks.


If we're talking within the context of that expensive of video cards, you probably shouldn't buying a 600+ dollar card if you're needing to stretch $60.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

I know what you're saying but if $60 is a big deal to you then you shouldn't be spending this kind of money on graphics cards IMO. Now that being said, I'd definitely choose a Classy over this Lightning since it doesn't seem like you really get anything for your extra money in this case. But I wouldn't go to the trouble to return the Lightning if I already bought it just to get $60 back...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NateST*
> 
> If we're talking within the context of that expensive of video cards, you probably shouldn't buying a 600+ dollar card if you're needing to stretch $60.


I completely agree, yet there are people who will go spend 800 for this, while skipping on more important things. This just doesn't happen with video cards, I see a ton of people with old Cadillacs but the cards are loaded with premium sound systems and expensive (really expensive wheels) at the same time they are asking their siblings for 5 bucks worth of gas. Lol. Happens all the time


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Care to offer any evidence other than OCN discussion that the EVGA classified is more successfully marketed than the Lightning? Because I guarantee you that those Lightning reviews lavishing praise on the card - rather they are lousy or not - are getting more page hits than this thread.


I didn't say the Classified was better marketed, but that MSI sold more Classifieds than EVGA's efforts did. Perhaps you should learn to read.









This thread has 120,000 views, most Enthusiasts wanting a Lightning have most likely come across this thread at one point or another.


----------



## goirish2469

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Majin SSJ Eric*
> 
> I know what you're saying but if $60 is a big deal to you then you shouldn't be spending this kind of money on graphics cards IMO. Now that being said, I'd definitely choose a Classy over this Lightning since it doesn't seem like you really get anything for your extra money in this case. But I wouldn't go to the trouble to return the Lightning if I already bought it just to get $60 back...


Yes, I understand. That extra $60 is not a big deal. I simply wanted to know if the 780 HOF is a good alternative. From what I've heard, it can't be overvolted, so I was wondering if anyone knew for sure. If it can be overvolted, then I might just refuse the package for my 780 Lightning and buy the 780 HOF. Then again, maybe the hassle of doing that isn't worth it like you said. But really, I would just like some info on the 780 HOF.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I think you're missing his point, that being that somebody dumping close to $1k on a luxury item probably isn't going to care about another $60.


Not necessarily. Consider this, I had already jumped into a $700 GPU and was budgeted with that in mind. I returned that one and held on to the $700 knowing that it'd go straight back into either the classy or the lightning, but with all but the classy OOS I ended up going with the lightning and spending $750. BAM! $50 of my spending money gone, which is a lot when I usually try to keep luxury spending at under $100 a week, and I was nice all summer so I could afford this nice GPU.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *goirish2469*
> 
> Yes, I understand. That extra $60 is not a big deal. I simply wanted to know if the 780 HOF is a good alternative. From what I've heard, it can't be overvolted, so I was wondering if anyone knew for sure. If it can be overvolted, then I might just refuse the package for my 780 Lightning and buy the 780 HOF. Then again, maybe the hassle of doing that isn't worth it like you said. But really, I would just like some info on the 780 HOF.


I had a 780 HOF and it could not be overvolted. The card performed well but not spectacularly (1242mhz with 1.187v and 126% power limit). I even tried the afterburner mod but to no avail. In all honesty the classy is the better pick out of the two.

However, I am very suspect that the lightning will indeed be (on average at least) even better than the classy or the HOF.


----------



## lang33

So i found two reviews that might help a bit in figuring out Classified vs Lightning.
Tom Logan's review on the Lightning: http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/gpu_displays/msi_gtx780_lightning_review/10
Overclockers' review on the Classified: http://www.overclockers.com/evga-gtx-780-classified-acx-graphics-card-review/

Lightning OC to 1267 MHz (boost) scores 10453 on 3D Mark Firestrike.
Classified OC to 1345 MHz scores 10403 on 3D Mark Firestrike.

Although Lightning had a i7-3960X @ 4.6GHz while Classified was with a i7 4770K Haswell.
How relevant are these results?


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

Not very relevant considering Firestrike heavily weights the CPU results and the 3960X will score much higher than the 4770k. You should only compare GPU score in this instance...


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *goirish2469*
> 
> Yes, I understand. That extra $60 is not a big deal. I simply wanted to know if the 780 HOF is a good alternative. From what I've heard, it can't be overvolted, so I was wondering if anyone knew for sure. If it can be overvolted, then I might just refuse the package for my 780 Lightning and buy the 780 HOF. Then again, maybe the hassle of doing that isn't worth it like you said. But really, I would just like some info on the 780 HOF.


I think the Lightning is a better card than the HOF easily - the Lightning allows overvolting and has more power phases, and will have a custom BIOS for a 300% power limit. I just don't think it's worth 80$ more than that or the classified. Really - I'm pretty disappointed; i'm a LONG time Lightning fan - the lightning series in the past have historically been better performers *and* better values than equivalent classified cards (eg. GTX580 and 680). Sadly that doesn't seem to be the case this time around.

If the choice boils down to the HOF or the classifed, the classified wins hands down. If the choice is between the HOF and the Lightning, HOF wins on cost but Lightning is a better card IMO. The fact of the matter is that both classified and the lightning support high overvoltage while the HOF doesn't - as mentioned on HardOCP the limit for the HOF is 1.2V. That is no better than a reference card. That said, the cost is still an issue and I have a really hard time recommending the Lightning despite how good it may be; I'm still in disbelief that this card is selling for 770$ on newegg. If the cost is a non issue to you, the Lightning should on average be better than the HOF due to what I mentioned above.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Not necessarily. Consider this, I had already jumped into a $700 GPU and was budgeted with that in mind. I returned that one and held on to the $700 knowing that it'd go straight back into either the classy or the lightning, but with all but the classy OOS I ended up going with the lightning and spending $750. BAM! $50 of my spending money gone, which is a lot when I usually try to keep luxury spending at under $100 a week, and I was nice all summer so I could afford this nice GPU.


I think you made a fine choice considering you had a HOF and the Classifieds were OOS.









Kidding aside, I don't think you will regret the Lightning. It is a bit overpriced, but if I had waited this long for it, I would probably have dropped the $ too.









Can't wait for these to show on OCN and see what true overclockers can get out of them with an uncapped bios.


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> I didn't say the Classified was better marketed, but that MSI sold more Classifieds than EVGA's efforts did. Perhaps you should learn to read.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This thread has 120,000 views, most Enthusiasts wanting a Lightning have most likely come across this thread at one point or another.


Whatever you say dude... you challenged my claim of the Lightning being the best marketed of these cards (based solely on this thread), which clearly implies you think one of these is marketed more successfully.

But move the goalposts if you like.


----------



## lang33

I see. Wish someone just do a review with these two directly already.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lang33*
> 
> So i found two reviews that might help a bit in figuring out Classified vs Lightning.
> Tom Logan's review on the Lightning: http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/gpu_displays/msi_gtx780_lightning_review/10
> Overclockers' review on the Classified: http://www.overclockers.com/evga-gtx-780-classified-acx-graphics-card-review/
> 
> Lightning OC to 1267 MHz (boost) scores 10453 on 3D Mark Firestrike.
> Classified OC to 1345 MHz scores 10403 on 3D Mark Firestrike.
> 
> Although Lightning had a i7-3960X @ 4.6GHz while Classified was with a i7 4770K Haswell.
> How relevant are these results?


It's a no contest since the 3960x will get a much higher physics score than a 4770k assuming each are overclocked to average numbers.

A golden 4770k chip might beat a stock 3960x, so yeah.

Kingpin destroyed everybody on Firestrike with the classified.


----------



## Killa Cam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> To be fair, used Titans are going more along the lines of $850-900, rather than $750. With the sole exception of that one guy in the OCN Marketplace that sold his super cheap. Getting a new GTX 780 Lightning is quite a bit easier than buying the very few and far between equally priced used GTX Titans.


dude, i live in alaska. and there was a person selling their titans on craigslist for $750. there are alot of people who have bought titans south of $800 on fleabay.


----------



## Killa Cam

just wait it out. by christmas, the price should come down to $700 or sooner


----------



## ZBoneCapone

Now that the Lightning has released, can we move onto Titan Ultra rumors?


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZBoneCapone*
> 
> Now that the Lightning has released, can we move onto Titan Ultra rumors?


I'd rather talk about AMD's new series. I'm tired of overpriced cards from Nvidia. We need some competition.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hannan688*
> 
> Oakley Sunglasses


I have a ton of Oakley sunglasses. Pit Boss and X Squared are in my collection ;-)


----------



## 2010rig

Still one Lightning on NE left, the best marketed card in the world is taking a while to sell out.









They started with under 50 as well. I wonder if the fact that people bought a Classified instead has anything to do with it.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Still one Lightning on NE left, the best marketed card in the world is taking a while to sell out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They started with under 50 as well. I wonder if the fact that people bought a Classified instead has anything to do with it.


probably that ******ed price along with the month delay.


----------



## BigMack70

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> Still one Lightning on NE left, the best marketed card in the world is taking a while to sell out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They started with under 50 as well. I wonder if the fact that people bought a Classified instead has anything to do with it.


Classified took weeks to sell out for the first time.

But I have some great reading to recommend to you that you may find helpful:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non_sequitur_(logic)


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> probably that ******ed price along with the month delay.


but, but, it's the best marketed EVAH.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BigMack70*
> 
> Classified took weeks to sell out for the first time.
> 
> But I have some great reading to recommend to you that you may find helpful:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non_sequitur_(logic)


Are you kidding? I was on the mailing wait for the Classified and it sold out in mere minutes, and when it went back up two or so days later it sold out again in mere minutes.

And who cares how long a product takes to sell out.

And another thing when comparing value the Classified at 50~70 dollars less than the Lightning makes it far more attractive buy to even thos with "unlimited" spending budget.


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> Are you kidding? I was on the mailing wait for the Classified and it sold out in mere minutes, and when it went back up two or so days later it sold out again in mere minutes.
> 
> And who cares how long a product takes to sell out.
> 
> And another thing when comparing value the Classified at 50~70 dollars less than the Lightning makes it far more attractive buy to even thos with "unlimited" spending budget.


I was gonna say...

The Classy was sold out for almost a month, and then when the second batch arrived it was sold out off and on for like 2 weeks. And now it's sold out again...


----------



## milkychipz

I woke up after oversleeping and ordered it along with a nVidia shield, get an email a few minutes later saying "Sorry, it might've said in stock on the website but it's actually out of stock." Maybe Newegg thought it was in stock or maybe someone checked out faster than I did.


----------



## naved777

WHOA !
it's beating the TITAN OCed dat easily ?
sound like a great upgrade from my 580 lightning xtreme
kudos to MSI


----------



## tin0

All that talk of which card was out of stock sooner than the other is ridicoulous. I don't care which card sells faster, all I care is that I get the best card! Just put em head to head!

Having owned a ref. GTX780 which did 1267mhz and currently owning a fully watercooled GTX690 which puts out nearly 22k graphics score, makes me want to stick with the GTX690. Especially since it has voltage control now and does 1202mhz on stock volts.


----------



## driftingforlife

I am testing a modified BIOS with boost disabled at the moment.


----------



## zed1

MSI GeForce GTX 780 Lightning PLIMIT BIOS download V29611L1

http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/msi_geforce_gtx_780_lightning_plimit_bios_download.html


----------



## StreekG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> MSI GeForce GTX 780 Lightning PLIMIT BIOS download V29611L1
> 
> http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/msi_geforce_gtx_780_lightning_plimit_bios_download.html


Yes! Great post! Now we can see what this card can really do.


----------



## whyscotty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> MSI GeForce GTX 780 Lightning PLIMIT BIOS download V29611L1
> 
> http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/msi_geforce_gtx_780_lightning_plimit_bios_download.html


Things just got interesting


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> WHOA !
> it's beating the TITAN OCed dat easily ?
> sound like a great upgrade from my 580 lightning xtreme
> kudos to MSI


it beats a stock titan yes.


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> I was gonna say...
> 
> The Classy was sold out for almost a month, and then when the second batch arrived it was sold out off and on for like 2 weeks. And now it's sold out again...


This isn't correct. The classified has mostly always been at stock at newegg, it has only been out of stock at the EVGA store. I browse the 780 selection at newegg fairly regularly and the classified has largely always been in stock, except for maybe 1-2 days.

That said, who the hell cares? Does it give someone pride to have a card that is "out" of stock? Give me a break. People should just buy the card they want, nobody cares what is in stock or isn't. I'm not disputing that the Lightning is overpriced, *it definitely is overpriced IMO.* But this talk is nonsense, and it is also not correct - the classified has mostly been instock at newegg at all times.

*Anyone whose self-esteem is based on what other people feel about their hardware and how fast it is selling, is a sad, sad person*. Nobody cares about what is in stock or isn't in stock. If someone doesn't care about the money and wants to buy a Lightning, good for them. When I personally buy hardware, I give zero cares about what someone else on the internet thinks about it and I *really* don't care about how fast it is selling. All of this talk about what is in stock or out of stock is quite frankly, stupidity.


----------



## MoBeeJ

Drift is your modified bios any different from the 300% power limit bios? Cause there is a big difference between the 2, as function goes...


----------



## famich

+1 agree 100%- it looks that this BIOS might be what Lightning needs .. pitty, that it will not work on Classified, though.

It looks that EVGA is as always very obedient towards Nvidia. Guess they got their reasons for it as well as MSI s got theirs.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *famich*
> 
> +1 agree 100%- it looks that this BIOS might be what Lightning needs .. pitty, that it will not work on Classified, though.
> 
> It looks that EVGA is as always very obedient towards Nvidia. Guess they got their reasons for it as well as MSI s got theirs.


Not a problem because we already have a great bios from skyn3t that is more than enough to max out the classy.


----------



## famich

Hey, where can I find it , please ? As the one on the first page just unlocks the voltage up to 1,21 V , at least on mine


----------



## MoBeeJ

I know with the 300w power limit its useless, but anyone of you guys tried to remove the 3 fans and connect them to the motherboard/psu directly? 3 PWM fans could give a few 10s of watts free...


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoBeeJ*
> 
> I know with the 300w power limit its useless, but anyone of you guys tried to remove the 3 fans and connect them to the motherboard/psu directly? 3 PWM fans could give a few 10s of watts free...


The entire point is merely to bypass nvidia's 109% limit. I can't see anyone approaching 300%, but I can easily see how the range between 109-150% can help push an air overclock higher while preventing throttling. I used the LN2 BIOS on the Lightning 680 (which also had a 300% limit) for this very reason - when I used the factory BIOS, my card would throttle at high overclocks. Yet with the LN2 BIOS, there was never throttling - that is what the LN2 300% BIOS is all about. No throttling and better overclocks.

So you can buy another card that is stuck at 109%, yet a custom BIOS will let you pass this - where you go from there is all up to you and what type of cooling you're using.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *famich*
> 
> Hey, where can I find it , please ? As the one on the first page just unlocks the voltage up to 1,21 V , at least on mine


Pm'd


----------



## TheMasterNoob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Probably. When I ordered my Classy from Newegg, I did not get a copy, but the very next day it was added on the Classifieds page. I contacted Newegg about it, but they said I did not purchase the card while the promotion was active (it was indeed active on the other 780s, just not the Classified at the time I bought it.) and refused to give me a copy.
> 
> Bright side is that they gave me a $20 Newegg gift card for my troubles, so not a total loss.


LOL. I bought my HOF without it either but they said the same thing and said they would make an "exception." They sent the code to me (by mail) for free.


----------



## anticommon

Silly question, but is anyone else stuck on order verification? They haven't charged me for the damn thing yet and its just sitting there waiting to be paid for. Looks like I wont have it until next week because I have to go back to school this weekend... dang


----------



## aesthetics1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Silly question, but is anyone else stuck on order verification? They haven't charged me for the damn thing yet and its just sitting there waiting to be paid for. Looks like I wont have it until next week because I have to go back to school this weekend... dang


Sounds like maybe you didn't get one. Happened to another guy, and he received an email recently that it "showed it was in stock, and really wasn't" and they apologized.

Mine took a while to receive shipping confirmation (12:11am PST, ordered 12 hours earlier) but it's actually out for delivery already. Should have in in a few hours..


----------



## Cial00

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> This isn't correct. The classified has mostly always been at stock at newegg, it has only been out of stock at the EVGA store. I browse the 780 selection at newegg fairly regularly and the classified has largely always been in stock, except for maybe 1-2 days.
> 
> That said, who the hell cares? Does it give someone pride to have a card that is "out" of stock? Give me a break. People should just buy the card they want, nobody cares what is in stock or isn't. I'm not disputing that the Lightning is overpriced, *it definitely is overpriced IMO.* But this talk is nonsense, and it is also not correct - the classified has mostly been instock at newegg at all times.
> 
> *Anyone whose self-esteem is based on what other people feel about their hardware and how fast it is selling, is a sad, sad person*. Nobody cares about what is in stock or isn't in stock. If someone doesn't care about the money and wants to buy a Lightning, good for them. When I personally buy hardware, I give zero cares about what someone else on the internet thinks about it and I *really* don't care about how fast it is selling. All of this talk about what is in stock or out of stock is quite frankly, stupidity.


/shrug

I was just responding to erroneous info. And yes the Classy was sold out almost all of July on both sites







That's cool tho, like you said it doesn't really matter.

Did Newegg raise the price to $800 overnight on the Lightning? Saw a screenshot of it at $800 in stock this morning


----------



## TheMasterNoob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cial00*
> 
> /shrug
> 
> I was just responding to erroneous info. And yes the Classy was sold out almost all of July on both sites
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's cool tho, like you said it doesn't really matter.
> 
> Did Newegg raise the price to $800 overnight on the Lightning? Saw a screenshot of it at $800 in stock this morning


That was my screenshot. It was from the cruddy Canadian site, where for 40 more, we can get a Classified HC.

I paid 720 for my HOF plus an @55load of taxes and 30 for shipping...I ended up paying 826 for it. If I lived in the US, I could have bought a Classy HC since they have no tax apparently (only if you live in a state where EVGA has no location/office/warehouse)


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2010rig*
> 
> MSI's marketing of the Lightning to this point has been lame, to say the least. Now we have reviewers who are comparing OC'ed Lightnings to Stock Titans and acting like it's so superior.


Do not underestimate the level of human stupidity though.

Or its short-term memory.


----------



## undeadhunter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Do not underestimate the level of human stupidity though.
> 
> Or its short-term memory.


Best post of the day lol


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aesthetics1*
> 
> Sounds like maybe you didn't get one. Happened to another guy, and he received an email recently that it "showed it was in stock, and really wasn't" and they apologized.
> 
> Mine took a while to receive shipping confirmation (12:11am PST, ordered 12 hours earlier) but it's actually out for delivery already. Should have in in a few hours..


Except I ordered when there were 22 left still.


----------



## TheMasterNoob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Except I ordered when there were 22 left still.


Newegg took over 24 hours to get my order verified...Apparently they take precautions and what not with larger purchases. Only difference is, my account was charged within the minute of pressing "Buy." It took a while to get out of Order Verification. Then again I used my weird Debit-With-Visa-Integrated card so IDK if that sped up the payment process and made it instant.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Except I ordered when there were 22 left still.


You did not buy overnight shipping did you? I would be requesting a refund on that shipping right now if you did.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> You did not buy overnight shipping did you? I would be requesting a refund on that shipping right now if you did.


Exactly why people should use Amazon. Better support and much cheaper, especially with Prime. I mistakenly entered in my old address (moved recently) when I ordered my XL2420T from Amazon and I called them as soon as I realized my mistake, which was when I noticed the tracking said it was delivered and I noticed it was delivered to my old address. I spend 10 minutes on the phone with Amazon and I received the XL2420T the next day and $20 off my next Amazon purchase. I'm done with Newegg and their ridiculous restocking fees.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheMasterNoob*
> 
> Newegg took over 24 hours to get my order verified...Apparently they take precautions and what not with larger purchases. Only difference is, my account was charged within the minute of pressing "Buy." It took a while to get out of Order Verification. Then again I used my weird Debit-With-Visa-Integrated card so IDK if that sped up the payment process and made it instant.


Well, neither v.me nor my CC have been charged yet. It's very strange... I've been stuck like this before with rakuten when they needed me to verify my license and whatnot to approve a purchase, but here I'm stuck in _'order verification'_ on newegg and after calling my CC company they said they haven't received anything charges yet. Newegg just told me the regular _'it can take 24 to 48 hours blah blah blah'_ And now I can't log into v.me to check again or to call them because they use a password and a verification question... which changes randomly and I accidentally entered the wrong verification twice in a row so I'm locked out for an hour.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> You did not buy overnight shipping did you? I would be requesting a refund on that shipping right now if you did.


No, shipping was actually free with shoprunner. Was hoping it would have shipped yesterday and gotten to my house by tomorrow. But the chances of that were slim.... Now I am just hopping it will ship period.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jack Mac*
> 
> Exactly why people should use Amazon. Better support and much cheaper, especially with Prime. I mistakenly entered in my old address (moved recently) when I ordered my XL2420T from Amazon and I called them as soon as I realized my mistake, which was when I noticed the tracking said it was delivered and I noticed it was delivered to my old address. I spend 10 minutes on the phone with Amazon and I received the XL2420T the next day and $20 off my next Amazon purchase. I'm done with Newegg and their ridiculous restocking fees.


Shipping to and from (if refund) is free when your item is purchased with Shoprunner (or you get a nice CS rep), and they generally waive the 15% restocking fee. And Amazon has many warehouses across the USA, unfortunately including my state, whereas Newegg does not. That means I'd have to pay 8.5% sales tax on purchases from Amazon, whereas I have to pay none with Newegg. And 8.5% sales tax can EASILY mean $80+ extra on purchases, which makes Newegg with free Shoprunner a no brainer. And their CS has been solid lately. On par with Amazon tbh (I have both Prime & Shoprunner).

Oh, and generally their prices are the same. So yeah.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Shipping to and from (if refund) is free when your item is purchased with Shoprunner (or you get a nice CS rep), and they generally waive the 15% restocking fee. And Amazon has many warehouses across the USA, unfortunately including my state, whereas Newegg does not. That means I'd have to pay 8.5% sales tax on purchases from Amazon, whereas I have to pay none with Newegg. And 8.5% sales tax can EASILY mean $80+ extra on purchases, which makes Newegg with free Shoprunner a no brainer. And their CS has been solid lately. On par with Amazon tbh (I have both Prime & Shoprunner).
> 
> Oh, and generally their prices are the same. So yeah.


I've had good experiences with Amazon and poor ones with Newegg. Amazon sorted out my XL240T shipping issue quickly and I got the monitor for $269, it's $300+ on the Egg last time I checked. I also swore to myself not to ever use Newegg after they shipped me a defective open box 7950 for $300 in December 2012 and charged some ridiculous restocking fee for a refund. Lost $105 to them for no reason.


----------



## szeged

ive had good experiences with both really, amazon overnight shipped me a PSU when i ordered late in the day, and only charged me for basic shipping because of some confusion on their end.

on newegg i accidentally ordered two asus maximus vi hero boards, gave them a ring a ding ding, told them whats up, the shipped one and took the other off my bill









hope everything works out for you


----------



## Kuat

can we please get some benches with the new bios?

post them up guys


----------



## szeged

i wanna see some OCN users do a max overclocked lightning vs a 1150/1202/1.3v titan instead of just stock titans


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> can we please get some benches with the new bios?
> 
> post them up guys


I was just thinking the same thing. A little voltage here, a little TDP there, I wanna see some 1400mhz clocks on air


----------



## aesthetics1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> can we please get some benches with the new bios?
> 
> post them up guys


My card is on my doorstep. 5'o'clock can't come soon enough. Haha. (PST!)


----------



## fateswarm

Have you noticed how the 'Overviews' of those unlocked high end cards are identical or almost identical to the other cards? The buyer have to know beforehand that it is special, there is little indication they are different by just randomly noticing it in a shop's overview page. I wonder if the unlocked situation is partly under the table and it's not totally 'market legit' (if that makes sense) in a legal or safety sense or another. Though there is an another possibility. They may be protecting children that if they hear "300%" they may just kill the card within a day.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Have you noticed how the 'Overviews' of those unlocked high end cards are identical or almost identical to the other cards? The buyer have to know beforehand that it is special, there is little indication they are different by just randomly noticing it in a shop's overview page. I wonder if the unlocked situation is partly under the table and it's not totally 'market legit' (if that makes sense) in a legal or safety sense or another. Though there is an another possibility. They may be protecting children that if they hear "300%" they may just kill the card within a day.


It's going to be exceedingly hard to kill the card with temperature caps. If you turn the frequency up as well it will either throttle or crash which is a good sign something is up.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> can we please get some benches with the new bios?
> 
> post them up guys


Mine should arrive tomorrow, and I might have time over the weekend to bench it. I'll see about posting them in here or a new thread. My weekend is kinda full though.


----------



## Rakunvar

SOOOO ANGRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Paid for Rush processing, overnight delivery, and ordered 2 of them as SOON as they were listed.... UPS goes OPPS we "sorted" it wrong OUR BAD!. We dont know where it really is aside from in our facilty in CA, and have no idea when this will start getting sorted out SORRY!........ Talk about wanting to k*** people...

UPS deliver's me like 20-30k$ every month or bi-weekly worth of medications...Makes me REALLY reconsider that...


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> I was just thinking the same thing. A little voltage here, a little TDP there, I wanna see some 1400mhz clocks on air


Well if it can do 1400MHz on air which is yet to be seen it won't be for long unless your water cooling or it's zero Celsius in your computer room.
What kind of voltage did they give the lighting?
Anyhow the 300% pwr target is useless unless you have the voltage and cooling to go with it. Just an example the classified can do over 1400MHz with a 120% pwr target but it needs 1.34v-1.36v and water cooling or maybe a third fan


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Well if it can do 1400MHz on air which is yet to be seen it won't be for long unless your water cooling or it's zero Celsius in your computer room, lol
> What kind of voltage did they give the lighting?
> Anyhow the 300% pwr target is useless unless you have the voltage and cooling to go with it. Just an example the classified can do over 1400MHz with a 120% pwr target but it needs 1.34v-1.36v and water cooling or maybe a third fan


weve seen some users hit 1400+ on stock air i believe, i dont know if they had their rig set up in their fridge or not though lol.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> weve seen some users hit 1400+ on stock air i believe, i dont know if they had their rig set up in their fridge or not though lol.


I got 1390 with a box fan... lol


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I got 1390 with a box fan... lol


if i was into air benching i would take one of the 6 foot tall shop fans from work home with me for a weekend , put it in front of my opened freezer, and let em rip.

thankfully i prefer water and can just put a rad in an ice bucket lol.


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> weve seen some users hit 1400+ on stock air i believe, i dont know if they had their rig set up in their fridge or not though lol.


MSI users?

Yeah, maybe a quick bench test on air but that's about it, I posted this yesterday,

here's the classifieds playing BF3 at 1410MHz in SLI on water cooling, if the 780 lighting can do this on air I will be shocked


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Yeah, maybe a quick bench test on air but that's about it, I posted this yesterday,
> 
> here's the classifieds playing BF3 at 1410MHz in SLI on water cooling, if the 780 lighting can do this on air I will be shocked


most of those clocks are just a quick bench test, i highly doubt youll see any 1400+ cards from any vendor doing that for extended periods of time.


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I got 1390 with a box fan... lol


I remember someone saying they benched at 1400MHz, I thought it was you









If the lighting can do that on air it's is one hell of a card and worth the extra $70 bucks, for an extra $70 it better do something special.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> I remember someone saying they benched at 1400MHz, I thought it was you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If the lighting can do that on air it's is one hell of a card and worth the extra $70 bucks, for an extra $70 it better do something special.


if it they both do 1400+ why is the lightning worth $70 more over the classified? maybe if the lightning hits 1500+ on air i would pay it, but if theyre about even with the classified, i know which choice is obvious.

the titan


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> I remember someone saying they benched at 1400MHz, I thought it was you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If the lighting can do that on air it's is one hell of a card and worth the extra $70 bucks, for an extra $70 it better do something special.


For 70 bucks the lightning led changes color ;-)


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> For 70 bucks the lightning led changes color ;-)


step 1 : buy a roll of christmas tree lights

step 2 : insert into case

step 3 : throw computer outside because it is now hideous

step 4: die

i hate color changing leds btw


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> step 1 : buy a roll of christmas tree lights
> 
> step 2 : insert into case
> 
> step 3 : throw computer outside because it is now hideous
> 
> step 4: die
> 
> i hate color changing leds btw


I hate computers that look like import tuners.

I like a clean industrial look.


----------



## USFORCES

What kind of voltage did they give the 780 lighting?


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> I hate computers that look like import tuners.
> 
> I like a clean industrial look.


agreed, when i see a computer just stuffed with bare leds that are visible in every spot imaginable i cringe like i just chopped a leg off.

dont get me wrong, leds can look good if used correctly, unfortunately most people just throw a blinding amount of leds into a case until astronauts can see it


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

E
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> agreed, when i see a computer just stuffed with bare leds that are visible in every spot imaginable i cringe like i just chopped a leg off.
> 
> dont get me wrong, leds can look good if used correctly, unfortunately most people just throw a blinding amount of leds into a case until astronauts can see it


Exactly.

I would also try to keep two colors, if more than that, they would need to be black, white, or chrome.

Green LEDs, blue memory modules, red led fans, yellow accents On the msi card, and Orange up7 board.

How would that look? Lol


----------



## goirish2469

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> if it they both do 1400+ why is the lightning worth $70 more over the classified? maybe if the lightning hits 1500+ on air i would pay it, but if theyre about even with the classified, i know which choice is obvious.
> 
> Wait, why do you even give a **** about this? You have titans. Stop *****ing about the 780 Lightning.
> 
> the titan


----------



## USFORCES

^ Really? it's your 6th post and your mad that someone is posting in here because they have titans, LMAO!!

Oh and learn how to quote ******* ****!


----------



## 404Error

I like how many people are comparing the best of the best classifieds to a card that hasn't even hit the door step and was only reviewed with subpar drivers.


----------



## anticommon

wat


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *404Error*
> 
> I like how many people are comparing the best of the best classifieds to a card that hasn't even hit the door step and was only reviewed with subpar drivers.


Just like people comparing the best 780 to stock titans.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *goirish2469*


Dontforget the fact that i have two 780 classifieds and two 780 reference cards.

Nice research though captain. Maybe your 8th post won't be so stupid.


----------



## StreekG

Damn people sure are taking their time to OC and bench these cards, the updated bios with 300% power limit was out a day ago. Cmon guys, really eager to see how much destruction the new Lightning can do.


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *404Error*
> 
> I like how many people are comparing the best of the best classifieds to a card that hasn't even hit the door step and was only reviewed with subpar drivers.


Well what else would you compare it to then 780 HOF Edition? For 769.99 I'm sure it's better than all the 780's anyhow I hope it is for the guys spending the extra money on this card.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StreekG*
> 
> Damn people sure are taking their time to OC and bench these cards, the updated bios with 300% power limit was out a day ago. Cmon guys, really eager to see how much destruction the new Lightning can do.


driftingforlife Posted this 17hrs ago and never came back?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *driftingforlife*
> 
> I am testing a modified BIOS with boost disabled at the moment.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1397633/vc-msi-teasing-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-at-computex-announce-twin-frozr-v/1870#post_20703155

.
.


----------



## 404Error

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Just like people comparing the best 780 to stock titans.


Those were reviewers who have to make the products look good if they want to continue to receiving products. Comparing oc'd/best configuration products to other stock products isn't new. Obviously it doesn't mean much. Pointing out when a reviewer does this doesn't mean much either. But right now forum users are comparing apples to oranges in the same way and expect a cookie for it.

On a side note I like how the last worthwhile comments are 5+ pages back.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> driftingforlife Posted this 17hrs ago and never came back?
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1397633/vc-msi-teasing-geforce-gtx-780-lightning-at-computex-announce-twin-frozr-v/1870#post_20703155
> 
> .
> .


Maybe driftingforlife ended up getting clocks so good he just couldn't walk away from his benchmark and then his PSU melted from all the glory and nuked everyone in a 5-mile radius.

Classys back in stock...


----------



## USFORCES

Bench test's should be rolling in anytime now and I hope it was worth the wait. From what I've seen so far the classy can do around 1400MHz on air and 1500MHz on water. If the lighting can't do or beat that then MSI's lighting failed this time around.


----------



## Awsan

Doesn't look that cool :/


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> From what I've seen so far the classy can do around 1400MHz on air


where have you seen this?


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Bench test's should be rolling in anytime now and I hope it was worth the wait. From what I've seen so far the classy can do around 1400MHz on air and 1500MHz on water. If the lighting can't do or beat that then MSI's lighting failed this time around.


yeah thats what im hoping also lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> where have you seen this?


classified owners thread...

kingpin...

maybe if you took an entire 3 seconds to look you could also easily find it


----------



## xoleras

1400 on air definitely isn't typical of the classified, and we all know that a kingpin overclock isn't going to be achievable by a real person.

There are folks at the EVGA forum complaining of mid 1200 overclocks on their classifieds. In reality, they shouldn't complain - Stating that 1400 is to be expected is a downright deceptive statement, the silicon lottery still applies. And a lot of owners aren't hitting higher than the mid 1200s.

This guy has a classified stuck at 1150mhz for a max OC:

http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=2012911

More classified owners who can't go past 1150:

http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=1988872&mpage=25

Let's not kid ourselves. You're trying to make it sound like 1400 is typical. That just isn't going to be the case, MAYBE for a 2 minute benchmark run but most owners will not achieve that.


----------



## 404Error

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Bench test's should be rolling in anytime now and I hope it was worth the wait. From what I've seen so far the classy can do around 1400MHz on air and 1500MHz on water. If the lighting can't do or beat that then MSI's lighting failed this time around.


Yea had a good laugh at that myself.


----------



## Eggy88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> bullsheet
> LOL
> Maybe I should slap you in your stupid face?


How is that BS? IIRC there is at least 3 users that are hitting the 1400s on air in the classy thread (Mydog, strong island and a third user that i cant recall ATM) strong island is ATM benching on 1502 on water and a another with a 24/7 clock on 1410 on SLI with water (not going to quote them all now cause im on the phone). Not saying it's common, but possible with a decent card.


----------



## Kuat

i wasn't able to find their posts where they get stable 1400mhz on air

people do get this on water though


----------



## 2010rig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> 1400 on air definitely isn't typical of the classified, and we all know that a kingpin overclock isn't going to be achievable by a real person.
> 
> There are folks at the EVGA forum complaining of mid 1200 overclocks on their classifieds. In reality, they shouldn't complain - Stating that 1400 is to be expected is a downright deceptive statement, the silicon lottery still applies. And a lot of owners aren't hitting higher than the mid 1200s.
> 
> This guy has a classified stuck at 1150mhz for a max OC:
> 
> http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=2012911
> 
> More classified owners who can't go past 1150:
> 
> http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=1988872&mpage=25
> 
> Let's not kid ourselves. You're trying to make it sound like 1400 is typical. That just isn't going to be the case, MAYBE for a 2 minute benchmark run but most owners will not achieve that.


I agree with what you're saying, but keep in mind, what people were led to believe.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EVGA-JacobF*
> 
> Average seems to be around 1350MHz or so.


In response to the Kingpin overclock, someone asked if it was a cherry picked card....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EVGA-JacobF*
> 
> Actually it was not a cherry picked card at all.
> 
> Doesn't mean that the card wasn't a good clocker, it could of been, *but I would guess that it is more along the lines of average*. Obviously there were a few things to note in here, the ambient temperature was probably lower than what it would be inside a chassis (since its on a testbed in an AC cooled room), the fanspeed was cranked to the absolute max, and this was done in 3DMark, results may vary in a game or other application.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> bullsheet
> LOL
> Maybe I should slap you in your stupid face?


Just because you're too dumb or blind to find them doesn't mean they don't exist. Maybe you should slap yourself.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> i wasn't able to find their posts where they get stable 1400mhz on air
> 
> people do get this on water though


I got 1390 on air, but temps became an issue. I think there was one person that was benching at 1403 or 1406 on air, but he had lower ambient temps then me. Most people getting the great clocks are on water though. The GK110 starts putting out massive heat with voltage at 1.35, so I think the Lightning cooler will have to be quite exceptional for 1400 clocks day to day. Not saying it can't be done. The premium over the Classy should bring something.

Strong Island 1 and shremi both are benching at over 1500 on water. Check out the Valley thread. They just posted last night.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> It's going to be exceedingly hard to kill the card with temperature caps. If you turn the frequency up as well it will either throttle or crash which is a good sign something is up.


Well I'm not sure about the particular card but I've come to realize that a throttle may only protect what it protects, meaning it might not protect the whole of the board. And not everyone knows how to repair exploded arbitrary parts of a board, if it's even possible.


----------



## xoleras

As a preface, i'm not saying the classified is a bad card. I think it's an awesome card. That being said, let's discuss the reality of overclocking for a minute.

This is all about "VERY LUCKY" versus what is normal for the classified. Many users can't pass the mid 1200s on air at the EVGA forum. There are other classified owners stuck at 1150mhz on air. There's also a BIG DIFFERENCE between 24/7 stability versus stable for a 30 second benchmark run. Period. Anyone stating that 1400mhz is "common" with air cooling and 24/7 stability on the classified is just lying. That would be completely and 100% luck based, and PROBABLY not tenable because temperatures become a big issue on air at 1.35V.

Note that i'm not saying the lightning is better in this respect - once again, it is luck based. Some cards will hit 1400, some will hit 1300, some will be stuck in the mid 1200s just like the classified. I just have an issue with stating 1400mhz is "common". Give me a break. Also stating that Kingpin is representative of a typical user overclock? Don't make me laugh please.

Yes, the lightning is overpriced and this all applies to the lightning as well. I agree with all of that. 770$ is way too much for that card, and I would probably pick the classified over it. But let's not distort reality over "real world" 24/7 stable air overclocks. I'd almost be willing to bet that 95% of benchmark runs aren't stable 24/7 - it's the nature of the beast. You can go all out for 2 minutes in a benchmark run with a crazy overclock, but that same overclock won't be usable 24/7 most of the time unless you're using water - I know this because I was big into benchmarking in the past. What I could do in a benchmark didn't match the reality of what I could do 24/7.

So with all of that stated, i'm 100% sure the Lightning is equal or as good as the classified in terms of "real world" overclocking. The only REAL ISSUE is the cost. The lightning IN MY OPINION should in no way cost 770$. At 770$ i'd have a hard time thinking about one, let alone recommending it. But in terms of overclocking i'm sure it is just as good as the classified, even though the classified is a way better buy at the moment.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> As a preface, i'm not saying the classified is a bad card. I think it's an awesome card. That being said, let's discuss the reality of overclocking for a minute.
> 
> This is all about "VERY LUCKY" versus what is normal for the classified. Many users can't pass the mid 1200s on air at the EVGA forum. There are other classified owners stuck at 1150mhz on air. There's also a BIG DIFFERENCE between 24/7 stability versus stable for a 30 second benchmark run. Period. Anyone stating that 1400mhz is "common" with air cooling and 24/7 stability on the classified is just lying. That would be completely and 100% luck based, and PROBABLY not tenable because temperatures become a big issue on air at 1.35V.
> 
> Note that i'm not saying the lightning is better in this respect - once again, it is luck based. Some cards will hit 1400, some will hit 1300, some will be stuck in the mid 1200s just like the classified. I just have an issue with stating 1400mhz is "common". Give me a break. Also stating that Kingpin is representative of a typical user overclock? Don't make me laugh please.
> 
> Yes, the lightning is overpriced and this all applies to the lightning as well. I agree with all of that. 770$ is way too much for that card, and I would probably pick the classified over it. But let's not distort reality over "real world" 24/7 stable air overclocks. I'd almost be willing to bet that 95% of benchmark runs aren't stable 24/7 - it's the nature of the beast. You can go all out for 2 minutes in a benchmark run with a crazy overclock, but that same overclock won't be usable 24/7 most of the time unless you're using water - I know this because I was big into benchmarking in the past. What I could do in a benchmark didn't match the reality of what I could do 24/7.
> 
> So with all of that stated, i'm 100% sure the Lightning is equal or as good as the classified in terms of "real world" overclocking. The only REAL ISSUE is the cost. The lightning IN MY OPINION should in no way cost 770$. At 770$ i'd have a hard time thinking about one, let alone recommending it. But in terms of overclocking i'm sure it is just as good as the classified, even though the classified is a way better buy at the moment.


No doubt. Anybody expecting 1400 core clocks 24/7 is dreaming no matter if it is a HOF, Classified or Lightning.


----------



## szeged

No where did anyone state kingpins results are typical nor are the 1400 mhz results from ocn. The question was have people done 1400 on air with the classified. The answer is yes. Just because someone is a well known bencher doesn't mean the result is now invalid. If king pins result is invalid because he's evga sponsored then any msi sponsored benchers result is invalid too right? Or any extreme high end bencher is invalid leaving only ocn member results.

1400 won't be cmmon on either card is my guess.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Bench test's should be rolling in anytime now and I hope it was worth the wait. *From what I've seen so far the classy can do around 1400MHz on air* and 1500MHz on water. If the lighting can't do or beat that then MSI's lighting failed this time around.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> where have you seen this?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> classified owners thread...
> 
> kingpin...
> 
> maybe if you took an entire 3 seconds to look you could also easily find it


Nowhere?


----------



## MrMarauder

Seeing as how this thread has devolved into silly off topic discussions, flame wars, and containing massive amounts of unnecessary information, would it not be beneficial to start a 780 Lightning Owner's thread? Since those of us who purchased it, would like a meat and potatoes discussion about it, and those interested in the Lightning can come to a thread where they find information about it without having to wade through volumes of junk?


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Seeing as how this thread has devolved into silly off topic discussions, flame wars, and containing massive amounts of unnecessary information, would it not be beneficial to start a 780 Lightning Owner's thread? Since those of us who purchased it, would like a meat and potatoes discussion about it, and those interested in the Lightning can come to a thread where they find information about it without having to wade through volumes of junk?


Yeah, that would be great. Curious why no one has posted up lightning results yet.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> No where did anyone state kingpins results are typical nor are the 1400 mhz results from ocn. The question was have people done 1400 on air with the classified. The answer is yes. Just because someone is a well known bencher doesn't mean the result is now invalid. If king pins result is invalid because he's evga sponsored then any msi sponsored benchers result is invalid too right? Or any extreme high end bencher is invalid leaving only ocn member results.
> 
> 1400 won't be cmmon on either card is my guess.


Jacob did, kinda, in a way "...but I would guess that it is more along the lines of average." That's him referring to kingpins air overclock of 1410.

As I have said a bunch of times, these chips are only binned for the numbers on the box. Overclocking potential/headroom is a crap shoot. If every card could do 1.35v, the average classy overclock wouldn't be much higher or wouldnt look as nice. Now that 780s can go up to 1.3v (higher if you use artmoney/cool program from that one guy) you are seeing clocks of 1300+ on reference cards. Lets not even get to titans hitting 1300+ now as well.

Honestly, its more a problem with timing then anything. With the 9xxx series coming in less then two months and the 780 only launched 3 months ago, we should of seen this crap storm coming. The 6xx series was unique in that there was no new competition after its release and because of the voltage nonsense, the classy and lightning were king of the hill.


----------



## szeged

I was wondering why haven't seen a lightning owners club yet lol


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Yeah, that would be great. Curious why no one has posted up lightning results yet.


Just got mine within the last hour. Card was released for sale not even 48 hours ago. I'm sure results will come.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Just got mine within the last hour. Card was released for sale not even 48 hours ago. I'm sure results will come.


My results won't be in for a while given that Newegg hasn't even charged me for the card yet and I ordered one within the first half hour!


----------



## gdubc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Seeing as how this thread has devolved into silly off topic discussions, flame wars, and containing massive amounts of unnecessary information, would it not be beneficial to start a 780 Lightning Owner's thread? Since those of us who purchased it, would like a meat and potatoes discussion about it, and those interested in the Lightning can come to a thread where they find information about it without having to wade through volumes of junk?


Hahaha ...I just speed skipped a couple pages and didn't miss anything really.


----------



## malmental

slightly off topic...

Nvidia May Pull Two More Graphics Cards From Its Hat in 2013
Quote:


> Add "GeForce GTX Titan Ultra" to your holiday wish list (just in case)
> 
> Nvidia hasn't said whether or not more video cards are on tap for 2013, but would anyone really be surprised if there were? You shouldn't be. The holiday shopping season is still several months away and rumor has it Nvidia may end the year with a bang by launching a high-end model such as the GeForce GTX 790. The GTX 790 could end up being a Titan Ultra card or it could be a graphics card with dual GK110 GPUs.
> 
> If it's a dual-GPU, expect a price tag in the neighborhood of $1,000, which is about par for course when dealing with these ultra-high end parts. Obviously not everyone has that kind of money to throw around on a single component, so it's also possible Nvidia will launch some lower end models, including rebranded GK104/106 parts and GK208 entry-level cards, Videocardz.com surmises.
> 
> As we head into 2014, Videocardz.com claims it was told by a manufacturer that Nvidia will release its Maxwell Series early in the year, which is sooner than expected.
> 
> "It is expected that GeForce 800 series will arrive in the first quarter of 2014, somewhere between February and March. What it basically means is that the chances for 20nm process are low," Videocardz.com says. "Of course Nvidia could already have first 20nm samples sooner than that, but TSMC will not be ready for mass production till June 2014."
> 
> Should Maxwell be based on a 20nm process, there would likely be a shortage of cards.


----------



## MoBeeJ

Gt 640 version 2.0 is quite faster than 640 normal. So possible tweaks can be made.

As for dual titans or 2x 780 on 1 pcb is doable, cost would be 1500 ish.

On topic though anyone realised that guru3d removed both updates and posts about the new bios???


----------



## strong island 1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoBeeJ*
> 
> Gt 640 version 2.0 is quite faster than 640 normal. So possible tweaks can be made.
> 
> As for dual titans or 2x 780 on 1 pcb is doable, cost would be 1500 ish.
> 
> On topic though anyone realised that guru3d removed both updates and posts about the new bios???


Why does everyone think it will be $1500. 780's only cost $650 so even if they double that it would be $1300. If AMD hits it out of the park with there next release I bet we could see a 790 at around $1100. After buying 2 titans that doesn't seem so bad to me. Maybe I am crazy.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Just got mine within the last hour. Card was released for sale not even 48 hours ago. I'm sure results will come.


I understand that, but I know some people got overnight shipping. That means they have had their card in their possession to at least snap a picture and start a thread, no?


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strong island 1*
> 
> Why does everyone think it will be $1500. 780's only cost $650 so even if they double that it would be $1300. If AMD hits it out of the park with there next release I bet we could see a 790 at around $1100. After buying 2 titans that doesn't seem so bad to me. Maybe I am crazy.


There is no way nvidia will release a 790 which costs less than two 780's. The cheapest I can see it is if nvidia lowers the cost for 780s to 550 or 600 and then you see a 790 for 1100 or 1200.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> There is no way nvidia will release a 790 which costs less than two 780's. The cheapest I can see it is if nvidia lowers the cost for 780s to 550 or 600 and then you see a 790 for 1100 or 1200.


He was saying if the new AMD compete at a lower price point, then Nvidia could/would potential drop 780 prices and thus the 790 could be sold at $1100.


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> 1400 on air definitely isn't typical of the classified, and we all know that a kingpin overclock isn't going to be achievable by a real person.
> 
> There are folks at the EVGA forum complaining of mid 1200 overclocks on their classifieds. In reality, they shouldn't complain - Stating that 1400 is to be expected is a downright deceptive statement, the silicon lottery still applies. And a lot of owners aren't hitting higher than the mid 1200s.
> 
> This guy has a classified stuck at 1150mhz for a max OC:
> 
> http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=2012911
> 
> More classified owners who can't go past 1150:
> 
> http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=1988872&mpage=25
> 
> Let's not kid ourselves. You're trying to make it sound like 1400 is typical. That just isn't going to be the case, MAYBE for a 2 minute benchmark run but most owners will not achieve that.


Yeah half those guys at evga don't know how to overclock either, most of them didn't or don't know there is a over voltage tool for the card, they were overclocking with stock voltage









Here is just one thread I showed them the over voltage tool, lol
*Lemon Classified 780 Cant Stable OC past +140mhz
*http://www.evga.com/forums/fb.ashx?m=1998835


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Yeah half those guys at evga don't know how to overclock either, most of them didn't or don't know there is a over voltage tool for the card, they were overclocking with stock voltage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is just one thread I showed them the over voltage tool, lol
> *Lemon Classified 780 Cant Stable OC past +140mhz
> *http://www.evga.com/forums/fb.ashx?m=1998835


It so hard to believe there are noobs on EVGA forums that bought a classified and know nothing about it... lol


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> I understand that, but I know some people got overnight shipping. That means they have had their card in their possession to at least snap a picture and start a thread, no?


Cooler size comparison between 680 Lightning and 780 Lightning.


----------



## TheMasterNoob

I don't know what to make of this dual gpu gk110 stuff. I have one eason (beside price, which can change at a moments notice). Power consumption and heat. GK110 is a big chip, a single 780 can take over 300w if it is overclocked. Putting 2 on one board will be creating more problems with heat and power consumption than nvidia has the time and money to deal with. A single reference 780 can reach 80 degrees at full load. Now you have 2 on one board sucking up 500w+. Temps probably won't be pretty. Plus the titan outsold the 690s total sales within a couple of months (or was it one?). This seems to indicate that the market wants more powerful single gpus, and not dual gpus.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Cooler size comparison between 680 Lightning and 780 Lightning.


Superb!


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Trying to make the club. Anyone possibly happen to have the download of the 300% PLimit BIOS that they could upload to something like Drop-box, etc.?

PM me if you don't mind.


----------



## xoleras

lol

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130943

Classified is now 730$ on newegg


----------



## TheMasterNoob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> lol
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130943
> 
> Classified is now 730$ on newegg


Wellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll...At least I can afford a 2nd HOF


----------



## MrMarauder

Running through some testing/benchmarks. Completely stock, non-LN2 BIOS, non 300% BIOS, the card is boosting to 1097 MHz. I suspect I'll have some headroom to work with.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> Running through some testing/benchmarks. Completely stock, non-LN2 BIOS, non 300% BIOS, the card is boosting to 1097 MHz. I suspect I'll have some headroom to work with.


Get your stock bios to Skyn3t. He can hook you up!


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> lol
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130943
> 
> Classified is now 730$ on newegg


Rofl newegg has been price gouging like crazy lately. Gonna go with amazon from now on becausethat iis just bs.


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Get your stock bios to Skyn3t. He can hook you up!


I will be flashing the LN2 to 300% BIOS, but before that, I'll be running tests on stock, then OCed, etc, to get a general overall idea of what it's capable of.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrMarauder*
> 
> I will be flashing the LN2 to 300% BIOS, but before that, I'll be running tests on stock, then OCed, etc, to get a general overall idea of what it's capable of.


Sorry, I actually quoted the wrong person. Awaiting numbers.


----------



## MrMarauder

Also, this was with driver 320.49. I'm going to install MSI's 320.63 driver, retest and see what, if anything, is different.


----------



## Kinaesthetic

Club is up: http://www.overclock.net/t/1422953/official-msi-gtx-780-lightning-owners-club


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Nowhere?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1411500/lightbox/post/20712043/id/1636023

Most recent one.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1411500/lightbox/post/20712043/id/1636023
> 
> Most recent one.


dont you know? OCN users and kingpin at 1400mhz dont count apparently!


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> dont you know? OCN users and kingpin at 1400mhz dont count apparently!


Oh yeah...









Ignorance is bliss they say...


----------



## Snuckie7

I think you fellas missed the bolded part of my post, which coincidentally, is the part that is being disputed


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I think you fellas missed the bolded part of my post, which coincidentally, is the part that is being disputed


i got your post









my last post was a reference to the guy who refused to believe anyone got 1400+, and those that did are for some reason invalid benchs.

its like saying, ive never been to the moon, therefore it doesnt exist.


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I think you fellas missed the bolded part of my post, which coincidentally, is the part that is being disputed


Sorry. I thought you were saying different.

Still applies to other that can't be bothered to look.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> i got your post
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my last post was a reference to the guy who refused to believe anyone got 1400+, and those that did are for some reason invalid benchs.
> 
> its like saying, ive never been to the moon, therefore it doesnt exist.


Ah now I can fully agree with that. It's hard to argue against plain and obvious facts


----------



## zed1

I want to join the MSi 780 Lightning owner club,but right now i'm trying the card, waouw so strong compared to my 580 Lightning,
i just saw guru3D removed the link for the MSI GeForce GTX 780 Lightning PLIMIT BIOS download V29611L1

http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/msi_geforce_gtx_780_lightning_plimit_bios_download,2.html

anyways..

http://img823.imageshack.us/i/uwap.jpg/

http://img163.imageshack.us/i/1jnc.jpg/

http://img163.imageshack.us/i/lusg.jpg/

i got it in the afternoon,in one hardware shop,(in Paris) i call them yesterday ,i already called them last week..so yesterday they told me,maybe they 'll receive one card, only one,i reserved it,then they call me back today,it was ok.

plus 2 games :Splinter Cell:Blacklist & Batman Arkham Origin.

the only one in Paris


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zed1*
> 
> I want to join the MSi 780 Lightning owner club,but right now i'm trying the card, waouw so strong compared to my 580 Lightning,
> i just saw guru3D removed the link for the MSI GeForce GTX 780 Lightning PLIMIT BIOS download V29611L1
> 
> http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/msi_geforce_gtx_780_lightning_plimit_bios_download,2.html
> 
> anyways..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://img823.imageshack.us/i/uwap.jpg/
> 
> http://img163.imageshack.us/i/1jnc.jpg/
> 
> http://img163.imageshack.us/i/lusg.jpg/
> 
> 
> 
> i got it in the afternoon,in one hardware shop,(in Paris) i call them yesterday ,i already called them last week..so yesterday they told me,maybe they 'll receive one card, only one,i reserved it,then they call me back today,it was ok.
> 
> plus 2 games :Splinter Cell:Blacklist & Batman Arkham Origin.
> 
> the only one in Paris


grats


----------



## fateswarm

Good thing it has a club. I was about to mention it yesterday before others but I found it disrespectful if I didn't own one. But since it happened I'll just be open and say thank the gods because this thread had a very "how dare you badmouth our king of cards" vibe at times and that should only belong in clubs. Otherwise, even if it hurts some feelings, open critique is the only way to not devolve into lies and delusions.


----------



## anticommon

So, I contacted newegg and v.me and chase about why my order hasn't gone through, and apparently the long story short is that they tried to charge me $769.99 and $14,629.81. Why on earth they would try to charge me over 15k for one order is beyond me. I did, however, get everything sorted out and ended up with a $749.99 charge, $25 newegg giftcard, and copy of splinter cell blacklist. Not too shabby. As for the wait... well at least it gave me time to complain.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> So, I contacted newegg and v.me and chase about why my order hasn't gone through, and apparently the long story short is that they tried to charge me $769.99 and $14,629.81. Why on earth they would try to charge me over 15k for one order is beyond me. I did, however, get everything sorted out and ended up with a $749.99 charge, $25 newegg giftcard, and copy of splinter cell blacklist. Not too shabby. As for the wait... well at least it gave me time to complain.


nice deal you got







25 gift card, 60 dollar game to put the lightning to use









what the hell would they be charing you 15k for? did they think your ordered all the lightnings?


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> nice deal you got
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 25 gift card, 60 dollar game to put the lightning to use
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what the hell would they be charing you 15k for? did they think your ordered all the lightnings?


I think they might have tried charging me for all the ones they had left when I placed my order lol


----------



## criminal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> I think they might have tried charging me for all the ones they had left when I placed my order lol


Were you checking stock and forget to change quantity before ordering?


----------



## anticommon

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127754

Lightning back in stock! 1 left...


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *criminal*
> 
> Were you checking stock and forget to change quantity before ordering?


No I definitely only ordered one, my invoice from newegg even showed up as $749.99.


----------



## szeged

just one left...who returned theirs?


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> just one left...who returned theirs?


Hopefully they aren't trying to sell the one that I just made sure was ordered. If I come to find out they went and re sold it to someone else I... I will rage. So lets hope for the best


----------



## szeged

well, that 1 that was in stock is now gone







hopefully someone got a good clocker lol still waiting to see how these cards are on 300% power limit before i drop any money on them, hell i still have two classifieds i need to get up and running.


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> well, that 1 that was in stock is now gone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hopefully someone got a good clocker lol still waiting to see how these cards are on 300% power limit before i drop any money on them, hell i still have two classifieds i need to get up and running.


If you have two classys why are you wasting time with a lightning?!?!?


----------



## xoleras

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> If you have two classys why are you wasting time with a lightning?!?!?


For the ladies, obviously.


----------



## jomama22

7th all time viewed page in hardware news history! Bravo and your welcome for the page clicks hahah. See we hit 200 pages as well.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> If you have two classys why are you wasting time with a lightning?!?!?


I have a graphics card addiction







. Lets see...

8 evga sc hydro copper titans
2 evga hydro copper classifieds
3 HIS 7970 ghz
2 powercolor devil 13 7990s
1 msi twin frozr 7950
And 1 zotac 9800 ft lol

The cards in my house atm. I might have a problem


----------



## illuz




----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> I have a graphics card addiction
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Lets see...
> 
> 8 evga sc hydro copper titans
> 2 evga hydro copper classifieds
> 3 HIS 7970 ghz
> 2 powercolor devil 13 7990s
> 1 msi twin frozr 7950
> And 1 zotac 9800 ft lol
> 
> The cards in my house atm. I might have a problem


What... do you do with them all? That's over 10 grand in graphics cards... USED!

Surely you would like to sell some of them? no???


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> What... do you do with them all? That's over 10 grand in graphics cards... USED!
> 
> Surely you would like to sell some of them? no???


I already sold one 7970, two 680s a 7950 and one 690 lol.

I have 4 rigs in my house and a new upcoming dual system project featuring the 8 titans in one case:thumb:


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xoleras*
> 
> lol
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130943
> 
> Classified is now 730$ on newegg


I bet they did that because of the lightings price tag and people are paying it this is the first time my cards are worth more that what I paid.


----------



## Majin SSJ Eric

You have more $ in Titans than I do in my entire rig. And my rig ain't exactly an El Cheapo either...


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> I already sold one 7970, two 680s a 7950 and one 690 lol.
> 
> I have 4 rigs in my house and a new upcoming dual system project featuring the 8 titans in one case:thumb:


A true collector never sells his stuff. Keep them on a nice display. ;-)


----------



## TheMasterNoob

I placed my ft03 over an ac vent and I am idling at 16.c right now. Is this safe in the long run? Is this safe at all? Should I worry about condensation?


----------



## anticommon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheMasterNoob*
> 
> I placed my ft03 over an ac vent and I am idling at 16.c right now. Is this safe in the long run? Is this safe at all? Should I worry about condensation?


Condensation is a very valid concern. If humidity is high or it rains out that could spell disaster, but if you are talking about just having an ac in the room then it shouldn't be a problem.


----------



## Killa Cam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> I already sold one 7970, two 680s a 7950 and one 690 lol.
> 
> I have 4 rigs in my house and a new upcoming dual system project featuring the 8 titans in one case:thumb:


hey man, i was just wondering if we could be best friends. if u ever need someone to talk to or loan graphics cards, then im here for u


----------



## MrMarauder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anticommon*
> 
> Condensation is a very valid concern. If humidity is high or it rains out that could spell disaster, but if you are talking about just having an ac in the room then it shouldn't be a problem.


I've had an AC vent near my rig cool 4 generations of video cards and not one problem. I don't believe there's enough condensation to make it's way up the vent, and through the tower's filters. That said, different folks, different strokes.


----------



## Kuat

TechPowerUp review of 780 Lightning (they too claim that the card beats Titan):
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/GTX_780_Lightning/
Quote:


> Maximum overclock on our card is 1120 MHz GPU base clock (14% overclocking) and +208 MHz memory (14% overclock).


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> project featuring the 8 titans in one case


Are you building a multi-projector system to have a 16K image on a movie theater?

That project sounds more interesting than the topic of this thread.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> slightly off topic...
> 
> Nvidia May Pull Two More Graphics Cards From Its Hat in 2013


They'll do it if the AMD 9000 series proves to be more than a match for the Titans.

I still want to wait and see the numbers on this chip before judging.

Realistically, the EVGA Classified 780s are pulling anywhere from 1130s to 1300. Let's call it say, 1,215 average for 24-7 for the Classified. If this card can pull more than that on average among all the chips, then it's the better card. For that to happen, the majority have to be over 1,200, with most in the 1,250-1,300 range, and a handful over 1,300.

Edit:
Memory OC will most likely be comparable as both cards are using the Elpida chips, unless one side has a stronger power delivery and cooling for the VRAM.


----------



## Kuat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Classified reached 1400 on air immediately after release.


1400Mhz is not a normal (every day) operating frequency for the card.

Kingpin managed to achieve it for bench purposes only under special test conditions.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> 1400Mhz is not a normal (every day) operating frequency for the card.
> 
> Kingpin managed to achieve it for bench purposes only under special test conditions.


It doesnt matter. I would still like to see something crazy from the lightning on air.


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kuat*
> 
> 1400Mhz is not a normal (every day) operating frequency for the card.
> 
> Kingpin managed to achieve it for bench purposes only under special test conditions.


of course its not, no one ever suggested 1400+ was a normal every day thing, if anyone ever got 1400 24/7 stable id be very surprised. i didnt realize we were talking about average every day use overclocks, if we were, i apologize, if we were talking about the maximum of a cards potential, then multiple people(read - not everyone) has gotten 1400+ on air a few times during bench runs.

i expect the same to happen with the lightning.


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> It doesnt matter. I would still like to see something crazy from the lightning on air.


Once the 300% power bios gets put on I'm sure it will just be a matter of time. Surprised MSI didn't go with straight voltage control like evga. Something is fishy as evga is the only company seemingly allowed to do it.


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> of course its not, no one ever suggested 1400+ was a normal every day thing, if anyone ever got 1400 24/7 stable id be very surprised. i didnt realize we were talking about average every day use overclocks, if we were, i apologize, if we were talking about the maximum of a cards potential, then multiple people(read - not everyone) has gotten 1400+ on air a few times during bench runs.
> 
> i expect the same to happen with the lightning.


That's what I'm trying to say.

Lets say some crazy bencher manages to pull 1500mhz on air on the lightning. That would at least justify the beefy cooler, all the bells and whistles and the higher price tag. But that is yet to be seen.

Now Kuat is getting mixed up or something.
We know average lightnings are struggling and many acx users claim to achieve the same overclocks than lightning users, but we are not talking about that.

Last year Kingpin And his 680 classifieds destroyed everything that came out if Europe. That didn't mean that normal 680 classy users could achieve those scores, but the fastest benched 680s were classified not lightnings.

That being said, sure there are classifieds that can barely run at 1200mhz. WE ARE AWARE OF THAT!


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jomama22*
> 
> Once the 300% power bios gets put on I'm sure it will just be a matter of time. Surprised MSI didn't go with straight voltage control like evga. Something is fishy as evga is the only company seemingly allowed to do it.


Yep, I'm also waiting in that 300BIOS.
After all the delays, you would expect all this would be ready and available upon release day.

Something is fishy.


----------



## szeged

300% bios will be tasty for lightning owners, weird msi didnt have it ready at launch, oh well lol.


----------



## Jack Mac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> 300% bios will be tasty for lightning owners, weird msi didnt have it ready at launch, oh well lol.


Especially after the launch was delayed almost a month. The fact that they didn't have something as simple as a bios ready on release should tell you something about MSI.


----------



## whyscotty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> 300% bios will be tasty for lightning owners, weird msi didnt have it ready at launch, oh well lol.


Do we know why the 300% bios was pulled?


----------



## jomama22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> 300% bios will be tasty for lightning owners, weird msi didnt have it ready at launch, oh well lol.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> Yep, I'm also waiting in that 300BIOS.
> After all the delays, you would expect all this would be ready and available upon release day.
> 
> Something is fishy.


They did release it. Guru3d had it up for a bit, then nvidia contacted them and had them pull it.

http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/msi_geforce_gtx_780_lightning_plimit_bios_download.html


----------



## szeged

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *whyscotty*
> 
> Do we know why the 300% bios was pulled?


msi hasnt released an official statement on it i dont think. It probably was either a. not completed, or b. had a bug and was causing cards to explode


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *whyscotty*
> 
> Do we know why the 300% bios was pulled?


It wasnt working. Some speculated that it was to protect the cards from noobs. Lol


----------



## whyscotty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *szeged*
> 
> msi hasnt released an official statement on it i dont think. It probably was either a. not completed, or b. had a bug and was causing cards to explode


As long as it's not Nvidia spoiling the fun again

Edit - Just seen it was Nvidia









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LaBestiaHumana*
> 
> It wasnt working. Some speculated that it was to protect the cards from noobs. Lol


----------



## LaBestiaHumana

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kinaesthetic*
> 
> Its working for one user in the Lightning owner's thread, with evidence to back it up. I'm personally gonna flash it in a bit and test. I do know that Rbby's tool (as far as I can tell since I haven't pulled out the DMM to check if the actual voltages being pushed through Rbby's tool are real, or just a number change in AB.


Yeah, I saw someone got it to work, but many where having trouble. Who knows??
The question is why was this not ready by Aug 28?

To many people, it seems as if the card hasn't fully being released. Imagine buying a new car, that requires hi octane fuel and all that's available when you drive it home is 87 octane( bad example) but Something needs to happen quick.


----------



## Alatar

After doing some extensive cleaning here I think this thread has ran its course. The discussion was largely off topic, the subject isn't really news anymore and apparently people can't keep the discussion civil.

To all Lightning owners and people interested in the card, please discuss the card here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1422953/official-msi-gtx-780-lightning-owners-club


----------

