# Razer BlackWidow vs. BlackWidow Ultimate



## the.FBI

So I'm looking to get a new keyboard around Thanksgiving and I'm looking for a mechanical keyboard for under $100. The Razer BlackWidow fits into that price range but the Ultimate does not. I was wondering if any1 knew of any differences between the two besides audio in/out, usb connectors, and led backlighting.


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## Phaedrus2129

Standard has lasered+white filled keycaps instead of the dyesub+rubberized+lasered keycaps of hte Ultimate.


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## ghettogeddy

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the.FBI* 
So I'm looking to get a new keyboard around Thanksgiving and I'm looking for a mechanical keyboard for under $100. The Razer BlackWidow fits into that price range but the Ultimate does not. I was wondering if any1 knew of any differences between the two besides audio in/out, usb connectors, and led backlighting.

I think you got it all covered there

besides the 3 things there isent much difference

oh the ultimate is .1 gram heavier lol


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## TwoCables

Quote:


Originally Posted by *the.FBI* 
So I'm looking to get a new keyboard around Thanksgiving and I'm looking for a mechanical keyboard for under $100. The Razer BlackWidow fits into that price range but the Ultimate does not. I was wondering if any1 knew of any differences between the two besides audio in/out, usb connectors, and led backlighting.

Here are the differences:


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## EmMure

honestly i would stay away from razer,if u want the best gaming bang for the buck steelseries 6gv2.


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## muchadoaboutnothing

I'd still trust SteelSeries over Razer, but making such a judgment may be hasty because I have yet to see a disassembled BlackWidow.


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## Fantasysage

If you want no frills and better build quality look into the Rosewill board. It is pretty sweet.


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## muchadoaboutnothing

Quote:


Originally Posted by *Skylit* 
If they're bashing rosewell, they're bashing Newegg (house brand) for selling a rebranded costar (makes Filco/DAS) board with cherry blues luls.

That wasn't the reason. GH had reason, some other forums went on about how my keyboard was going to explode (a joke on the very poor quality PSUs Rosewill has rebranded; although I've heard that they've rebranded SeaSonic at points, but haven't seen any evidence of this). Others just had a generally dismal view of Rosewill as a house brand.

A lot of people give house brands too much flak. I'm not saying that House brands are always great, but they often are better or comparable to brand products. Rosewill's external hard drive enclosures are fairly good, for instance. With the price they're fantastic.


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## thisispatrick

Well my point was basically too many people would bash for no apparent reason before they have even seen a decent review on the product. Oh well haters going to chug that haterade anyways.


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## EmMure

Quote:


Originally Posted by *thisispatrick* 
Seriously all you've done is bash Razer in almost every keyboard thread I've seen you in and recommend the Steelseries.

Stop judging before its even out. Haters gona hate.

im sorry im aware of razer's quality track history with keyboards.and i have seen the black widow in person already(best friend is distract manager for best buy)and it feels just like every other razer keyboard just has mech switchs and feels and looks like a gimmick.as far as me recommending steelseries im not the only one,and theirs a reason for it..they make amazing quality products


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## fssbzz

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EmMure* 
im sorry im aware of razer's quality track history with keyboards.and i have seen the black widow in person already(best friend is distract manager for best buy)and it feels just like every other razer keyboard just has mech switchs and feels and looks like a gimmick.as far as me recommending steelseries im not the only one,and theirs a reason for it..they make amazing quality products

not really..their headphone suck lol. quality suck too. compare to razer headphone..i prefer razer over steelseries headphone


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## EmMure

LOL,im sorry you ended up with a bad headset but ive owned 3 of theres so far and i love them and most of mmy friends own them also and love them.and this discussion isnt about headsets its about keyboards


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## muchadoaboutnothing

I'm going to be "that guy" and say I haven't found a headset that will match a separate headphone + a $5 clip on mic in quality.

Sadly, this applies to both the mic and the headphones.

The exception to that rule is a foldable Logitech Headset I have with fantastic noise canceling on the mic. Headphones are loud and good for voice but suck for everything else.


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## BlahBlahBlah

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EmMure* 
LOL,im sorry you ended up with a bad headset but ive owned 3 of theres so far and i love them and most of mmy friends own them also and love them.and this discussion isnt about headsets its about keyboards

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sample_size

You need to brush up on this concept.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy

This one too while you're at it


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## fssbzz

yup i know is not about headphone. just to say that not ALL Steelseries product are amazing. and not ALL Razer's product are as bad quality as what u stated.


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## ripster

Distract Manager at Best Buy sounds about right.


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## admflameberg

I had this keyboard in my sights as well because of it being a cheaper mechincal keyboard without key pressing limited, for when your playing a game and have other keys press down and be able to hit another key without it not doing any thing.

If another company had a mechincal keyboard with that feature and was cheap and not 100+ dollars then I wouldnt mind using another keyboard.

@EmMure the thing is your post and your avator makes your look like a pr rep for the company,if you do run around the forums into the different keyboard threads and bash any thing that isnt steel series.

Did you type on the keyboard your self? or just talk to your friend about it like you mention.


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## EmMure

district*w.e its spelled,no im not a rep for steelseries lol i wish i was they do have their NA office here thou hha


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## TwoCables

Quote:


Originally Posted by *admflameberg* 
I had this keyboard in my sights as well because of it being a cheaper mechincal keyboard without key pressing limited, for when your playing a game and have other keys press down and be able to hit another key without it not doing any thing.

If another company had a mechincal keyboard with that feature and was cheap and not 100+ dollars then I wouldnt mind using another keyboard.

@EmMure the thing is your post and your avator makes your look like a pr rep for the company,if you do run around the forums into the different keyboard threads and bash any thing that isnt steel series.

Did you type on the keyboard your self? or just talk to your friend about it like you mention.

The Das Model S comes in 4 different flavors and can sometimes be purchased brand new for like $99.99. I recommend asking in the Mechanical Keyboard Guide to see if anyone knows of any deals on the Das Model S series. It is a superior product to the Razer BlackWidows because Razer used iOne as their OEM and the Das Model S uses Costar who also manufactures the CST-104 which is the foundation for keyboards like the Filco Majestouch boards as well as that new Rosewill RK-9000.

Quote:


Originally Posted by *EmMure* 
district*w.e its spelled,no im not a rep for steelseries lol i wish i was they do have their NA office here thou hha

He's making fun of anyone who is a District Manager at Best Buy by calling them a "Distract" Manager. I don't know what he's trying to say by it, but meh - he's just another person making fun of Best Buy (but I don't blame him).


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## manu97416

im going to get my blackwidow ultimate today!


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## Quccu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manu97416;12913253*
> im going to get my blackwidow ultimate today!


I've been really keen on getting one of these, not sure if I should go the mile for ultimate over normal version as I'm a bit strapped for cash atm =(

Anyway let us know what you think of it, I may get one too.


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## The Solutor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwoCables;11052432*
> The Das Model S comes in 4 different flavors and can sometimes be purchased brand new for like $99.99. I recommend asking in the Mechanical Keyboard Guide to see if anyone knows of any deals on the Das Model S series. It is a superior product to the Razer BlackWidows because Razer used iOne as their OEM and the Das Model S uses Costar who also manufactures the CST-104 which is the foundation for keyboards like the Filco Majestouch boards as well as that new Rosewill RK-9000.
> 
> He's making fun of anyone who is a District Manager at Best Buy by calling them a "Distract" Manager. I don't know what he's trying to say by it, but meh - he's just another person making fun of Best Buy (but I don't blame him).


My black widow is new and has a partly stuck key (I mean mechanically), I'm still waiting for the RMA authorization.

But other than that I found incredibly misleading the inverted lower/upper case stamps on the keys, I can live with the stupid fonts printed on the keys but not with the inverted symbols (I haven't noticed that before buying).

I thing that a keyboard has to be comfortable, and conformable doesn't mean just the tactile feeling...


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## Quccu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Solutor;12913438*
> My black widow is new and has a partly stuck key (I mean mechanically), I'm still waiting for the RMA authorization.
> 
> But other than that I found incredibly misleading the inverted lower/upper case stamps on the keys, I can live with the stupid fonts printed on the keys but not with the inverted symbols (I haven't noticed that before buying).
> 
> I thing that a keyboard has to be comfortable, and conformable doesn't mean just the tactile feeling...


I can live with inverted symbols as I touch type so I never look at the keyboard.

But how do you find the button pressing and speed of typing in general? Is it good? worth purchasing?


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## The Solutor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quccu;12913664*
> ...I never look at the keyboard.


So why buy a backlit keyboard









Quote:


> But how do you find the button pressing and speed of typing in general? Is it good? worth purchasing?


http://www.overclock.net/12913507-post4.html


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## BeerPowered

Don't buy razer the build quality is poor. The keyboard will wear out, within the year you will start having issues with it.


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## HaiiYaa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Solutor;12913438*
> My black widow is new and has a partly stuck key (I mean mechanically), I'm still waiting for the RMA authorization.


Well if its the space key and and ALT keys a new keyboard is not going to fix that


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## The Solutor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HaiiYaa;12913710*
> Well if its the space key and and ALT keys a new keyboard is not going to fix that


Actually is the *T* key.

BTW i'll just return it, I bought it because the ISO layout unavailable on most mechas, but this feature is not enough to balance the drawbacks.


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## TwoCables

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BeerPowered;12913708*
> Don't buy razer the build quality is poor. The keyboard will wear out, within the year you will start having issues with it.


The BlackWidow is not like the rest of their keyboards; this keyboard will actually last a long time. Unfortunately, when it's compared to other mechanical keyboards, it's just a mediocre one. However, when it's compared to the rest of Razer's rubber dome lineup, it's certainly a superior product (and it's a bit unusual for Razer).

Besides, we don't know how long this keyboard will really last because it hasn't been _out_ long enough!


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## The Solutor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwoCables;12913856*
> The BlackWidow is not like the rest of their keyboards; this keyboard will actually last a long time. Unfortunately, when it's compared to other mechanical keyboards, it's just a mediocre one. However, when it's compared to the rest of Razer's rubber dome lineup, it's certainly a superior product (and it's a bit unusual for Razer).
> 
> Besides, we don't know how long this keyboard will really last because it hasn't been _out_ long enough!


Never tried any other Razer keyboard other than the MS branded "Reclusa".

It was a bit bulky but was a really good keyboard, I have heavily used it for more than a year w/o any sign of wear and w/o loosing its initial tactile felling which was very good.

I sold it for a Sidewinder X6 (I was attracted by the handy form factor) and was really a stupid move.


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## killeraxemannic

I have the standard blackwiddow and I like it a lot!


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## ch_123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwoCables;12913856*
> The BlackWidow is not like the rest of their keyboards; this keyboard will actually last a long time.


*coughs*


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## TwoCables

Oh what now, ch_123? What are you coughing for?


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## ch_123

I dunno. All those reports of Blackwidows dying...


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## Tralala

99% is the backlighting, which I personally find worth it.
Also the keys are laser something something'd so they shouldn't
fade with use like non laser etched keys

I got the ult and I love it so far


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## H3XUS

I would stay away from razer if I were you.. It garbage to be honest.. It's poor quality, and engineering.

I've come across countless numbers of people complaining about their broken razer products, and their hell of a time trying to get a replacement with their customer service.

It's times like that when I thank god I went down the steelseries path. I have a merc stealth board, HD4 mousepad, and Ikari mouse. They're like my family now. (and the Ikari is arguably the most comfortable mouse in existence)


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## Dyslexyc

My biggest gripe with the Blackwidow is the fact that it has a glossy finish. Say what you want about the board, but anything that comes into contact with my hands constantly that has a glossy finish is a dealbreaker. Looks dirty as hell the moment you take it out and start using it.







My vote goes to the 6gv2.


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## Levesque

I just returned mine to Newegg for a full refund.










Start getting ''No keyboard detected'' randomly when booting, and more and more often now, after only 3 weeks of using it. Sigh. Latest firmware and drivers.

All my other keyboards are working fine...


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## ch_123

A keyboard that requires firmware updates to work properly can never be a good idea.


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## H3XUS

>Keyboard
>Firmware
LOL. This keeps getting better and better.

You know what.. Go ahead and buy your damn Razer keyboard..

Just expect a big "told ya so" when something happens.


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## EarlZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ch_123;12914955*
> I dunno. All those reports of Blackwidows dying...


Id love to see a link about that. Some may choose to opt for the Razer keyboard due to availability or pricing, on my end the Steelseries keyboards like the 6V2 or the 7G costs about 2.3~2.9x the razer black widow.


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## ch_123

There's one report on this page alone. If you look back through pages on the keyboard forum, you'll see more reports elsewhere.

Given that Costar boards (i.e. Filco, Das, Steelseries, Ducky 9008 etc) have been selling in substantial numbers for longer than the Blackwidow has been on the market, I'm unconvinced that the number of problems reported is somehow relative. The Costar boards are certainly better in regards to construction quality and keycaps by all accounts.


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## H3XUS

Here..
1 of 8,000,000

http://www.overclock.net/keyboards/936831-cry-my-razer-black-widow-died.html


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## jgweb2000

So much hate lol. I love my blackwidow ultimate. It has a sturdy build, I find the usb pass through to be infinitely useful (broke my front usb..) and the build feels solid.

I will be getting an OCN ducky board when they are back in stock, but I reccomend the blackwidow.

I have never owned any other razer products, but my opinion of razer is pretty good right now.

Jgweb2000


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## The Solutor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jgweb2000;12918960*
> 
> I have never owned any other razer products, but my opinion of razer is pretty good right now.
> 
> Jgweb2000


My " " key hinks i isn' rue :


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## H3XUS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jgweb2000;12918960*
> So much hate lol. I love my blackwidow ultimate. It has a sturdy build, I find the usb pass through to be infinitely useful (broke my front usb..) and the build feels solid.
> 
> I will be getting an OCN ducky board when they are back in stock, but I reccomend the blackwidow.
> 
> I have never owned any other razer products, but my opinion of razer is pretty good right now.
> 
> Jgweb2000


Well.. You either lucked out with a blackwidow that is okay..

Or, its going to break some time soon.

Razer is known for their horrible quality. I used to work in technical repair, and people would come to me with a) their broken hp pc garbage, and b) their broken razer garbage. I have only ever had ONE person come to me with a broken steelseries mouse.. And that's because he whipped it at his concrete wall out of frustration, because he had lost a "tense hardcore S&D match in cod4".

By the way, just about any keyboard these days come with integrated USB ports.


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## TwoCables

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ch_123;12917018*
> There's one report on this page alone. If you look back through pages on the keyboard forum, you'll see more reports elsewhere.
> 
> Given that Costar boards (i.e. Filco, Das, Steelseries, Ducky 9008 etc) have been selling in substantial numbers for longer than the Blackwidow has been on the market, I'm unconvinced that the number of problems reported is somehow relative. The Costar boards are certainly better in regards to construction quality and keycaps by all accounts.


I did not say that the BlackWidows are on par with Costar boards and other boards that are similar or better. As I said before, I recognize the BlackWidows as "mediocre" mechanical keyboards. However, they're still better than rubber dome keyboards, and their most *certainly* better than those stupid Arctosa/Lycosa keyboards.

Now, would I buy the BlackWidow? No, because I already have a Filco Majestouch which means I feel that a BlackWidow would be a noticeable downgrade for me. However, the BlackWidow is still a fairly decent entry-level mechanical keyboard.

So, I'm not saying that the BlackWidow keyboards are good mechanical keyboards. Instead, I'm saying that they're not the usual garbage that Razer makes when it comes to keyboards.


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## H3XUS

Yeah, but it's still garbage. The only entry level quality product razer makes are their headsets.. And even then, you can find a better headset for the same price.


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## DuckieHo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12920033*
> Yeah, but it's still garbage. The only entry level quality product razer makes are their headsets.. And even then, you can find a better headset for the same price.


You do realize that the way you present your opinions is detrimental in supporting your statements?


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## strap624

I like my black widow, good board for the price.


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## TwoCables

See, that's all I'm saying: it's a good value (it's certainly better than a rubber dome keyboard).


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## ch_123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwoCables;12919892*
> I did not say that the BlackWidows are on par with Costar boards and other boards that are similar or better. As I said before, I recognize the BlackWidows as "mediocre" mechanical keyboards. However, they're still better than rubber dome keyboards, and their most *certainly* better than those stupid Arctosa/Lycosa keyboards.
> 
> Now, would I buy the BlackWidow? No, because I already have a Filco Majestouch which means I feel that a BlackWidow would be a noticeable downgrade for me. However, the BlackWidow is still a fairly decent entry-level mechanical keyboard.
> 
> So, I'm not saying that the BlackWidow keyboards are good mechanical keyboards. Instead, I'm saying that they're not the usual garbage that Razer makes when it comes to keyboards.


That point wasn't addressed at you in particular. I was just commenting on the reports I've seen in general, and some people who have justified them in terms of being relative to the amount sold.

The problem is that there are reports of multiple Blackwidows failing completely after a very short period of time. If a keyboard dies on you after 2 months, then it most definitely is garbage. I've seen rubber dome keyboards that still works after years, I'd rather have one of those because it will let me send scancodes to my computer, which is what I generally use my keyboards for.


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## DuckieHo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ch_123;12920565*
> That point wasn't addressed at you in particular. I was just commenting on the reports I've seen in general, and some people who have justified them in terms of being relative to the amount sold.
> 
> The problem is that there are reports of multiple Blackwidows failing completely after a very short period of time. If a keyboard dies on you after 2 months, then it most definitely is garbage. I've seen rubber dome keyboards that still works after years, I'd rather have one of those because it will let me send scancodes to my computer, which is what I generally use my keyboards for.


Then again... early failures may be attributed to a new product line and new supply chain.


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## ch_123

There is that aspect of it, yes. At the same time, they come from an OEM who are not known for their spectacular QA, to put it mildly.

Personally, if I'm going to spend that much money on a keyboard, I'd go the little extra and get something like the Rosewill RK9000 which at least has a reputation for quality by virtue of being a rebranded Filco.


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## veuxtres

don't you guys think the topic should end from here ? just smell like a war lol relax guys.







we should share like buddies !









by the way, im using ultimate, so far im very happy with it, is not the best quality mechanical keyboard but is good for the value for me, i've been using it quite sometimes 0 problem


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## H3XUS

"Quite sometime" being how long?


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## TwoCables

Well we can be certain that he hasn't had it longer than approximately 5-6 months.


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## H3XUS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwoCables;12923532*
> Well we can be certain that he hasn't had it longer than approximately 5-6 months.


Yeah, I say the keyboard won't make a year without dying.


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## ripster

Haters Gonna Hate on Razer









Given the Razer ships 10 times what the Xarmor and Deck does of COURSE you see failure reports periodically.


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## H3XUS

There's a reason WHY the Razer ships get 10x the bashing.


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## ripster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12926739*
> There's a reason WHY the Razer ships get 10x the bashing.


Somehow the metaphor got shipwrecked.


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## HaiiYaa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;12926316*
> Haters Gonna Hate on Razer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Given the Razer ships 10 times what the Xarmor and Deck does of COURSE you see failure reports periodically.


Says the person who always hate on steelseries


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## Doogiehouser

I have to say, I enjoy my blackwidow ultimate. No problems, no stuck keys, etc. I've put a good deal of use into it and I see no wear issues, keys are still acting as responsive as the day I bought it. With that said, I've had the same Razer DA mouse for a couple years now and again it's keeps performing the same as when I bought it. People may have different experiences, but mine have been all positive.


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## ch_123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;12926316*
> Given the Razer ships 10 times what the Xarmor and Deck does of COURSE you see failure reports periodically.


Can we see some sales figures for the Blackwidow, Xarmor and Deck to back that claim up?


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## snoogins

It appears this was a necro thread.. but...

I would love to buy a steelseries, but for a mechanical keyboard on a budget the blackwidow seems to do the trick. I had a stuck spacebar but fixed it (after voiding the warranty -bleh) by taking it apart and re-attaching it properly.

Razer has some issues (RMA for one and support) but that doesn't stop them from producing a good product every now and again !


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## EarlZ

While you guys are at it, can we see some proof that the black widow/ultimate really has more returns compared to the other brands.


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## Qazme

And can someone make me a sandwich, all this hating is making me hungry!


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## ripster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HaiiYaa;12927243*
> Says the person who always hate on steelseries


That's different. Those keyboards suck.


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## TwoCables

Dude, H3XUS: can you be any more negative?


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## H3XUS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwoCables;12932217*
> Dude, H3XUS: can you be any more negative?


Sure, I can if you really want me to..

I'm trying to help people not get ripped of by Razer's horrible products, and spend the same amount of money on something that is much better.

The only Razer products that are worth the money are their headsets, and the Naga mouse. Anything else is garbage. If Razer were to reduce the price on all of their products by 50%, then I amongst most gamers would not have an issue with them.

It's purely the fact that they price their products WELL above what their actually worth, and advertise useless features that don't even work properly to try and look "Pro Gamer Tier". It's not only that, but they REALLY need to work on their customer service.


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## ripster

Razer probably brought more people into the Mechanical keyboard fold than anybody since the Model M. Sure generated more press than Xarmor and Deck ever did. Those guys must have learned Marketing from an Online Internet College.

Plus I appreciate their booth presence at trade shows.


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## gordesky1

Still enjoying my black widow ultimate sense i preordered.

Not one problem and the keys still look good and i game heavy on it too.

It replaced my xarmor u9bl because i like the feel and the sound the black widow makes more, And also too me more solid.

But my xarmor is still getting use on my server pc

But for razer stuff i never had a problem with there products and im not a fanboy either of them, Sense i also own the razer mamba but that got replaced with a xai


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## H3XUS

The mamba isn't a bad mouse either. You got lucky with your Black Widow though.


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## gordesky1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12936206*
> The mamba isn't a bad mouse either. You got lucky with your Black Widow though.


Ya maybe i did but it did seem like the first batch widows was the best batch out of them all it seems like the problems started in the later dated ones.

Pretty much like any other product there's always bad batch's out there.

Ya the mamba is still great but i just prefer the xai over it now because it doesn't have those sensor problems that the mamba have like the cursor will move with my speakers depends on how loud it is, And the lift off is much better on the xai, But ya none of thoes problems really bother me but i do miss the wireless that the mamba has... But the xai is just a better mouse for me.


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## Doogiehouser

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12935133*
> Sure, I can if you really want me to..
> 
> I'm trying to help people not get ripped of by Razer's horrible products, and spend the same amount of money on something that is much better.
> 
> The only Razer products that are worth the money are their headsets, and the Naga mouse. Anything else is garbage. If Razer were to reduce the price on all of their products by 50%, then I amongst most gamers would not have an issue with them.
> 
> It's purely the fact that they price their products WELL above what their actually worth, and advertise useless features that don't even work properly to try and look "Pro Gamer Tier". It's not only that, but they REALLY need to work on their customer service.


Their headsets?... I stopped reading at that. Sennheiser, etc just blows the typical "gaming" headset out of the water.


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## H3XUS

Yes, the xai is amazing. I love most of Steelseries' products. I have, and use their Merc Steath keyboard (which I am currently typing on), their HD4 mousepad, and Ikari mouse (SOOO Comfortable).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Doogiehouser;12936503*
> Their headsets?... I stopped reading at that. Sennheiser, etc just blows the typical "gaming" headset out of the water.


I wasn't talking about "Sennheiser, etc" now was I. I was talking about Razer products. I'm a huge Sennheiser fan, I have 3 of their cans, and use my PC350's while gaming. *In relation to Razer products*, the only thing they can seem to make right are their headsets (which aren't _too_ expensive either).

*@Ripster

The thing is...

Logitech has cheaper products than Razer, that work better, AND...










...they have better booth babes. Try harder Razer.


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## Doogiehouser

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12936931*
> I wasn't talking about "Sennheiser, etc" now was I. I was talking about Razer products. I'm a huge Sennheiser fan, I have 3 of their cans, and use my PC350's while gaming. *In relation to Razer products*, the only thing they can seem to make right are their headsets (which aren't _too_ expensive either).


No, but you are talking about the relation of other products vs. Razer. Or have I completely misinterpreted you're posts in this thread? You mentioned that Razer had good headphones, well... in relation to Sennheiser at the same price point I would have to disagree. Now with everything else, I have experienced nothing but good things from my DeathAdder and BWU from them.


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## H3XUS

Where in those two of my recent large posts, do you see anything other than "Razer" mentioned?

I said for the same price, you can buy something better. Did I mention brands? No.

When I said their headphones were good. I mean good... _for a Razer product_. Would I buy it myself? Never.

Razer is garbage. Is EVERYONE going to experience issues? No, they won't. However, a majority do, and they shouldn't have to.

There are many factors implemented with a broken product. These implications with other quality brands result in a significantly lower amount of broken products, opposed to Razer with a much higher amount of broken products.


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## Swift Castiel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12937309*
> Razer is garbage. Is EVERYONE going to experience issues? No, they won't. However, a majority do, and they shouldn't have to.


On that quote there;
Prove that majority of people who have bought Razer products have had issues with what they bought.

Yes, I own a lot of Razer gear, and no I'm not going to comment about whether it's good or not. Just show us in a pie graph (I like pies) about the percentage of people who have bought Razer hardware and had issues compared to those who have bought it but have not had issues.

Then do the same for every other company you can think of.


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## EarlZ

There seems to be a lot of Razer hate on this forum, I guess its different every where coz on the other forum its Steelseries hate or Logitech hate.

Has anyone ever modded the blue LED on the BWU, I kinda fancy white colors


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## ripster

I like my Senny HD595s paired with a Gilmore lite and a Squeezebox









However Sennheiser doesn't make a open ear keyboard and the Logitech G series sucks worse than Razer.


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## EarlZ

Open ear keyboard?


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## ripster

Illustrating the point that judging a keyboard based on headphones doesn't make much sense to me.


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## Gilgamesh9

Duh I am lucky that my first and for now only Razer product is NAGA








i am very happy with the naga most comfortable mouse ever (Is the red glowing one) highly recomend it

only issues i have is on a xp pc everytime i reboot the pc
so have to unplug and plug in the mouse for it to recognize, any way to fix ?
but i am soon moving over to my new pc that runs windows 7 64bit pro so maybe i dont have the problem then.

As for keyboard goes to my new Pc i bought a Saitek cyborg 7 keyboard
mostly for the design i just love it, best design ever
I then got a Logitech G510 but was disapointed with the lighting and all running in background
on my pc because of the Lcd screen...also the keys are somewhat smaler than the saitek
i type very fast on pc and made a lot of mistake typing on the G510.
I am going to return the G510 and get another but which one?

Saitek eclipse Litetouch:
http://www.madcatz.com/cebit/images/hires/eclipse/lite_touch/PK39.jpg

The numpad look kind of like startrek being touch panel...
yea i know is harder to type and that but i can live with it just for the design
there is 2 version a wireless (not recomended it disconect a lot) and a standard
the standard i think the light are white and the wireless is blue

But right now i am looking into Steelseries Merc stealth
it look so good and has an option for Red lights
all my gaming rig is red lights so will fit perfect when playing in dark.

Anyone that have tried both Logitech G510 and Steelseries Merc stealth
can say if the lighting on Merc is stronger than G510?
cause i realy hated how dimm the lighting on G510 was.

I also though about Razer Blackwiddow ultimate or Razer Tron (just for the lighting efect)...
but hate its no Red lighting, why cant razer release a Naga molten keyboard red light efects
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12935133*
> The only Razer products that are worth the money are their headsets, and the Naga mouse. Anything else is garbage.


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## turbonerds

eh i got the blackwidow, i could care less about the extra useless features that the ultimate has.

Been two days already and i'm already noticing my D and W is fading away.
So far its a good first mech keyboard that i owned, but i would prob go for the steelseries 6vg2 if you got da moonies

I notice people are talking about Problems in the later batch of BWU? is it only the ultimate or both?
What problems are we talking here? =X just got my two days ago...


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## Gilgamesh9

Well i getting the G510 returned so plenty money to take from there
anyway right now i am looking mostly between Saitek Eclipse II and Steelseries Merc stealth, the saitek elipse litetouch look cool but maybe not so usefull

Razer tron is hard to get (is it even released?)
and yea considering how so many people have problem with razer keyboards and that they dont light up red (which i want) make me not want so much buy a razer keyboard.

so i probaly go for another saitek (lol then i have 2 with my already saitek cyborg7)
or steelseries.
here is the eclipse 2:
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keCOljm5r4A[/ame]

i realize this thread is mostly about blackwidow
but since people was comenting on steelseries too i guess i could find some useful answers


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## Gilgamesh9

OMG i found something now That match my monitor
Link

Problem is i cant find it anywhere where i live


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## EarlZ

Id like to add that the glossy parts on the Ultimate is easy to clean but also very easy to scratch up even with a micro-fiber cloth.. its probably the dust on the cloth scrathcing it up.


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## ripster

That's why the Das supplies a micofiber cloth with every keyboard.

It is a good keyboard for certain people.









I'm more Dexter.









Hey, that's my photo rig!


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## EarlZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;13123913*
> That's why the Das supplies a micofiber cloth with every keyboard.
> 
> It is a good keyboard for certain people.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm more Dexter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, that's my photo rig!


LOL,wut?


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## ripster

The microfiber cloth prevents scratching.

I sure have to explain myself a lot in this thread.


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## EarlZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;13125274*
> The microfiber cloth prevents scratching.
> 
> I sure have to explain myself a lot in this thread.


So... How does that help to what I just posted. Im using a micro fiber cloth ( optical lens grade ) to clean off the bottom rest and it gets a hairline scratch.. not from the cloth but probably from the dust that gathered on the cloth..

Im a bit OC into these things when my stuff is new but after like a couple if months I tend to live with it.. Its not that I stare at my keyboard 24/7


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## ablearcher

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EmMure;11045552*
> im sorry im aware of razer's quality track history with keyboards.and i have seen the black widow in person already(best friend is distract manager for best buy)and it feels just like every other razer keyboard just has mech switchs and feels and looks like a gimmick.as far as me recommending steelseries im not the only one,and theirs a reason for it..they make amazing quality products


the blackwidow is the only razer kb not made by razer, lol.

And seriously, noone knows of Geekhacks? There are already two dissamblies there and the actual manuf....


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## ripster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EarlZ;13125523*
> So... How does that help to what I just posted. Im using a micro fiber cloth ( optical lens grade ) to clean off the bottom rest and it gets a hairline scratch.. not from the cloth but probably from the dust that gathered on the cloth..
> 
> Im a bit OC into these things when my stuff is new but after like a couple if months I tend to live with it.. Its not that I stare at my keyboard 24/7


Other trick is to use Novus polish.

Details here.








Hey - it's the DAS baby blue cloth!


----------



## EarlZ

Do those things really work ?


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## ripster

Why would I recommend something that doesn't work?


----------



## HaiiYaa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;13136955*
> Why would I recommend something that doesn't work?


Because you said all on overclock.net are douchebags


----------



## ripster

Huh?

I have over 120 rep here. I should report you but I'm no douchebag.


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## HaiiYaa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;13138938*
> Huh?
> 
> I have over 120 rep here. I should report you but I'm no douchebag.


Oops I mean we are all ducky lovers


----------



## ripster




----------



## sLowEnd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS;12925940*
> Yeah, I say the keyboard won't make a year without dying.











I've had cheapo $4 keyboards from a flea market last for over a year.
Your skepticism astounds me.


----------



## ripster

Somebody once claimed these were made by iOne.

Anybody ever open one to check that rumor?


----------



## n19htmare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ch_123;12927661*
> Can we see some sales figures for the Blackwidow, Xarmor and Deck to back that claim up?


Common sense would overrule the need of sales figure but I'll give it a shot.

How many retailer outlets have Razer products? I live in a large city in southern California and I can drive to a few places and pick up a Razer Blackwidow. Know how many places I can drive to get an Xarmor, Deck, Filco, Ducky? Practically, None.

Marketing and Distribution are key ingredients in sales.

I went to my local Fry's electronics and they had Both Blackwidows in stock (Thought I just want to try it, not buy it).

The more product you push out, the more people you'll have complaining, and you'll have even more people who like the product hopefully (but fail to voice their opinion because they are content).

Two products have a failure rate of 1%. One product has sold 100,000 units while the other sold 1,000. One product has 1,000 people complaining while the other have 10.
Even though both have 1% failure rate (No one looks at this), the 1000 will have a much stronger voice/opinions (What people will listen to).
Of the 1,000 maybe 10% will come complain. That's 100 people.
Of the 10, maybe 10% will come complain. That's 1 person.

You gonna listen to the 100 people complaining or the 1 person? Even though Failure rate never changed (both products still have 1% failure rate).

I'm guilty of this myself, because I read what people are saying but more I read, the more I realize some poeple are just bitter from past experiences.

I personally optioned for the Filco. I wanted the smal form factor and they do infact have great quality.
I also opted for the DAS for work because I need something a bit silent end.

Just because razer made a few poor products or some people got a bad apple and they decided to voice their opinions, doesn't mean the product will most definitely fail.

Comments like "it'll fail in the first year" are silly. No company will continue production/distribution/market with 100% failure in 1st year.

Yes People probably have had some issue with the Blackwidows and these people are the ones who tend to voice their opinions.

http://www.amazon.com/Razer-BlackWidow-Ultimate-Mechanical-Keyboard/dp/B003ZJ5B4I/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1302902839&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: Razer BlackWidow Ultimate Mechanical Gaming Keyboard: Electronics[/URL]
78 reviews with average 4 star rating. 65/78 people gave (normal users) 4 and 5 stars.

I didn't go with it because of reasons I mentioned above, I was also put off by what people were saying, but reading further into it, I just blew it off as hot air.

I may pick up the regular in the near future to test it out... Can't beat it for $75.


----------



## ripster

Is there this much Razer Hate in the mouse subforum?


----------



## The Solutor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;13140080*
> Somebody once claimed these were made by iOne.
> 
> Anybody ever open one to check that rumor?


My idea is that the keys are *surely* built by the same company, the keyboard itself likely not. the razer feels way cheaper and the PCB doesn't look so similar.

They looks definitely what they are.

Razer is a relatively large scale product, cheap and more refined in some details.

Xarmor looks as a less industrialized product, that sounds solid and well built but lacks some refinements due to the large scale production, like the backlit level not maintained trough reboots.

BTW just the solid tock emitted when bottoming out the keys on the Xarmor should be sufficient to prefer it instead the BW.


----------



## jwhyrock

hey guys thx for the discussion and the heapings of hate. I loved it. My first post here btw. I actually registered just because you guys made me re-evaluate my pre-made decision to buy the ultimate and then ultimately decide to buy it in the end. I had already done some research on keyboards and ultimately wanted a good "typing" keyboard that looked cool. I'm a Tron nerd, but sadly the Tron keyboard is ******* expensive and worthless *sob*. I was actually originally just going to grab the Illuminated Logitech with the rechargeable batteries, but decided I should get something I truly love typing on.

I realize there has been mention of other pure keyboards for typing with good switches (rosewill or something?) but nothing I found in my digging online had good typing with cool lighting. If I missed it I guess it's too late because I'm pulling the trigger on the Ultimate. Done. Kinda expensive but based on reviews I've read all over the place it is very consistently highly rated so I realize a bunch of people in this thread hate on Razer, but I go by 1st, 2nd & 3rd opinions plus a combination of reviews I take from all over. The Ultimate appears to be a very good keyboard.

Now if there's a $200 keyboard that is better build quality with no lighting... well it's $90 more than I paid and no lighting so at the end of the day you have to meet as many of the criteria you are looking for you can and not spend more than you need to. I realize the standard blackwidow was quite a bit cheaper, but then it didn't have the lighting and if I didn't give a **** about the lighting then I could've gone for a pure typing keyboard that had better build quality like a Rose... nm

I think I'll be happy. I'm typing on a decade+ old cheap microsoft keyboard I have to pound on and I still am making typos. **** this keyboard. I like hearing the clackity clack of a good keyboard though. A lot of people were put off by the blackwidow's noisy keys but that's right up my alley. I have air filters all over the house going 24/7, music playing, birds shrieking so it's all good.

Again thanks everyone for the entertaining thread and thx to the original poster. You guys made me feel good about my purchase.

I'm "jwhyrock" on PSN if you have PS3 on a random note. I hate Sony by the way. Just had to get that off my chest, but PS3 is still my console of choice even if the company is a douche. And I'm out.


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## jummies

I haven't had any issues with my blackwidow ultimate so far. For those assessing whether or not to get one based on the negative comments on this thread, keep in mind that razer likely sells a lot more in terms of volume. So of course we'll hear more about malfunctioning KBs


----------



## Wr3ckin_Cr3w

Had my regular Blackwidow for a couple months now and I'm absolutely loving it. Its my first mech keyboard and it responds well to games and I get a good feedback when i'm coding. Only con is the glossy look that captures every fingerprint.


----------



## ripster

Better than Xarmor is what I always say.


----------



## The Solutor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster;13573593*
> Better than Xarmor is what I always say.


If you are happy being always wrong....


----------



## donnybrook

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *H3XUS*
> 
> Yes, the xai is amazing. I love most of Steelseries' products. I have, and use their Merc Steath keyboard (which I am currently typing on), their HD4 mousepad, and Ikari mouse (SOOO Comfortable).
> I wasn't talking about "Sennheiser, etc" now was I. I was talking about Razer products. I'm a huge Sennheiser fan, I have 3 of their cans, and use my PC350's while gaming. *In relation to Razer products*, the only thing they can seem to make right are their headsets (which aren't _too_ expensive either).
> *@Ripster
> The thing is...
> Logitech has cheaper products than Razer, that work better, AND...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...they have better booth babes. Try harder Razer.


hate to bring up old hate threads, but I've been in the market for my first mech, I dont want to spend over 100 bucks out the door, I dont care about back lighting, the usb port is nice, but not necessary, and i love having macro keys which many mechs do not have. with that being said, what alternatives are there for under 100 bucks? not much. the steel series line up has no macro keys, so that is out for me. I've handled and typed on the new corsair boards. suck. where does that leave me?

haha and this guy... are you REALLY going to try and tell us that that oafy amazon ginger is anywhere near as hot as either of those Razer chicks? you're on drugs, only possible explanation.

Also, why would you try to compare logitech and razer in THIS forum post? as logitech, as far as I know, has no mechanical keyboard offerings? I've had logitech gaming mice that I've hated, and a non gaming, non mechanical keyboard that has lasted me since around 2006 or 2007. the buttons are mushy, some are missing, and a portion sticks, but it works? I would NEVER spend money on logitech "gaming" gear, aside from the top end headset they make. I've yet to have issues with either of the razer mice i've owned, aside from not being comfortable in my hands (i have very wide hands lol)


----------



## General Crumples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripster*
> 
> Somebody once claimed these were made by iOne.
> Anybody ever open one to check that rumor?


I believe it's the same factory that produces them

I personally own a Blackwidow Elite and I really love it. This IS my first mech keyboard and I've only owned it about two months so I can't say much not having any experience with other brands. It feels very solid. My friend also got one and the only issues he had is that one key did not click (cherry blues).

I dislike the Gloss. It's horrible. You clean it and it looks nice and shiny but then five minutes later its almost how it was before you cleaned it. But Das have this issue too apparently.

I don't see why people complain about the BWU being priced too high. A regular Ducky is about $100 with shipping and tax (roughly where I live). And a regular Blackwidow is about the same.
The Ducky Shine is $145 without shipping at tankguys and I've found Blackwidows Ultimate. from $100 to $145 (I can't tell if some were on sale or not so $140 sounds safe)

I don't think Razer is the best but they aren't the worst either.

P.S. I hope I'm not making myself look like a Razer fanboy (which I'm not)


----------



## KieranStephen

Hello, Reading over this and this photo does not make sence to me I have the expert blackwidow and I have the Audio and Mike Jack in the side of it and I also have a USB port in the side but this photo shows that I shouldn't have it?


----------

